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The the the the the the the
the the the the the the the the

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the the how should we say the
status of the evangelical? Sorry for these

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people genuinely do, but they also
are primed for I mean, they're prime

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comedy content and they don't even realize
it. I want to show you the

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comments of the guy because it was
a funny exchange. I gotta say if

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I can find it, because all
of the comments to their comments were making

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fun of them, and in total
delusion land, they thought that they had

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like demolished me. They thought that
they got like the I mean all of

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the comments literally like ninety five percent
of the comments are making fun of them,

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talking about how their video was dumb, and uh they're like just like,

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oh, we own him. Dude
owned the auto bros. Bro let

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me, you gotta see this video, so let me find it first,

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because now I can't even find Method
Method ministries? Are you Methodist? Dude?

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Is your is your pastor? Mom
gonna marry y'all two boys at your

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Methodist church? Method ministries? They
look like like evangelical kind of Now I

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can't find their damn video. Where's
it that? I just can't stand this

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whole like, imagine just talk here
it is. I found it talking a

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bunch of smack. And then when
people just simply asked you if you want

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to come to bait and then you
play this whole You play this piety game

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of like you're not a Christian and
I I would never talk to you because

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you are full of mean spirits.
You've got little tiny mean demons. There's

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mean demons whispering over your shoulder and
you listen to them. All right,

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I might have to switch to the
other We're not going anywhere. Don't worry.

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Okay, I'm gonna pull this up. You're gonna have fun when we

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see this here. I'm gonna play
it for you, and then we're gonna

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look at the comments. And I'm
going to respond to some Rouslan videos people

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sent me Ruslan and they these guys
thought that it would be an own because

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I did a video making fun of
Protestant con Men preachers and because in my

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video I was acting like the Bible
was an idol and I licked it.

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And these guys said, I don't
even think I really did. It just

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looks like I did. But this
was their opportunity to expose me all right,

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you gotta see these guys here.
I think this is it. Yeah,

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this is it. Can we see
this on the screen here? Okay,

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so this is there. They're gonna
expose me, by the way,

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it's nothing gayer than like expose videos
exposed, and they're always out of context.

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It's always, I mean, do
they not know that I do silly

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stuff all the time, Like I
make jokes, and you might hate my

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jokes and think that they're not good
jokes, but they're at least pale attempts

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at jokes. So not everything we
do as serious over here. But these

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people they can't take a joke.
They don't, they can't. They take

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themselves super seriously. So here's their
video, and we're gonna read the comments

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because the comments were all like calling
them out. So the dude on the

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left there, he's I don't know, his head got stretched out coming out

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of his mama's portal canal there,
so he's he's got a long, thin,

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stretched out head, got a nice
quafft hair, though I give him

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props for that hair. The other
dude looks like he need to get need

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to take a nap, so I
don't know why he even he even stayed

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up all night for this podcast.
This podcast put me to sleep. So,

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bro, if you need if you
have in trouble sleeping there, dude

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on the right, just just listen
to y'all's podcast and it will help,

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I promise. Because you got some
bags, it looks like you need to

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you need a nap, bro,
you didn't have nap time today. Method

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ministries. That's not an argument telling
me you need to go read a book.

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It's an answer, right. So
the only thing I ever do is

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tell people go read a book.
I've never made any arguments against any Protestants.

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All I've ever said is go read
a book, dude. Books,

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check them out. Books, check
them out. You could read about stars

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that electric guitars of books. Check
them out, right. I'm just sir,

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mix a lot level over here.
No arguments ever, Never had a

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single argument against a Protestant, even
though we did a three hour debate with

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doctor Branson and dy olda Protestant and
not too long ago, where all we

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did was focus on arguments. But
no, I don't do any arguments,

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never never made one. Just all
I've ever said is read a book.

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And if somebody's coming to me and
you know, they say it was you

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know, read The Church Fathers.
Right, That's all I've ever said to

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when people say how do I get
saved? I say, you have to

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go read Gregornissa's eight hundred page against
you Unumbia's literally that's the only way to

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be saved. And that's all I've
ever said. If you don't get a

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PhD in Cappadocian metaphysics, you're hell
down, bro. You're right, you're

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heading down to I don't know the
ice level of Dante's Inferno, because if

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you know, if you haven't read
it, there's levels. It's like a

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video game, and the last level
is where the devil is and it's frozen.

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So you might think, oh,
that's gonna be hot down there.

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No, it's it's ice cold.
It's like when you go to the gas

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station and they got the beer chest, right, world's cold as beer.

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You walk into the ice chest at
the quickie mart. That's what the last

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level of hell is in Dante's Inferno. And if you don't get your PhD

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in The Church father that's and that's
all that we've always made that. Have

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these dudes ever watched anything from my
channel ever? Like? What are they

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talking about none of this is true. None of this is the case.

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Now, if we're debating the top
topic of the canon of scripture, then

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yes, we're going to not be
appealing to the scriptures because the scriptures don't

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answer the question of the canon,
unless you're a very low tier Protestant who

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thinks that somehow appealing to the thing
in question answers the question, which maybe

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these dudes think this. I don't
know, So this is not a very

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long quip. We're gonna equip.
We're gonna move on to the We're gonna

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look at some of the comments because
they're acting like this with some own right,

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and then we're gonna see that all
the comments are basically calling them out.

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Then we're gonna move on to Ruslan's
videos, which I'm not familiar with

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Ruslwan. Somebody said the other day, hey, will you reply to these

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couple of videos of this guy,
and that'll be a good springboard to then

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open it up to Protestants in the
chat who would like to ask questions,

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offer challenges, make a argument,
et cetera, et cetera. In the

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words of Bernardo et cetera, et
like that is just the stupidest thing you

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really want to beat. Yeah,
so does he think I'm a Roman Catholic.

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You have to read the Church Fathers
in the original Latin, and most

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of the Church Fathers, unless they're
Latin fathers, are writing in the Greek.

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I've never told anyone that you have
to read the Latin church Fathers in

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the Latin. And I guess that
was supposed to be a joke. Is

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it funny? I don't. I
don't think that's This doesn't seem funny to

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me. But he thought that was
like this, like like you know,

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genius level quip there. Yes,
go read this five hundred single states page

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book and then get back to me, and then we'll make you a catechuman

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of our church. And then you
go on Twitter start you know, and

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start fan pointing out out from my
east or yeah, our greatest argument is

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read a five hundred page book.
We will then make you a catechuman,

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and then you fan buoying. Then
you fan He didn't even say it,

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00:10:01,200 --> 00:10:07,399
right, you fan boying out on
Twitter's church. Yeah. So now let's

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look at the comments of this of
these two. By the way, they're

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about they're going to be married in
their their mom I think is the pastor

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who's going to be marrying them in
their Methodist church? So can we not

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see the comments on this? Where's
the comments? I asked him if they

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were going to invite me to the
to the wedding comments, log in.

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I don't want to log in to
see the comments. Crap. Uh So

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I guess we get You can go
read the comments and you'll see that all

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the comments are like calling these dudes
out, like this was domb your clip

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was low in low energy, surely
so so I don't I don't know where

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they think that this was some great
own, But we're in the era of

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like everything is just stupid now.
I mean, nothing is scholarly, nothing

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00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:09,679
is academic, nothing is actually based
in real solid refutation. Like I imagine

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a lot of people think this was
some great own like this, and then

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somebody was like, you got all
but heart over this, dude. The

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comments are literally ninety percent calling them
out. All right, Next, we're

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00:11:20,279 --> 00:11:26,919
gonna move on to Ruse Lawn why
he's not Orthodox and why we should be

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Protestant, and then we're gonna open
it up. He's got two videos,

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let's start with Let's start with a
shorter one and this guy has a pretty

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large channel, large enough that many
people have said, hey, when are

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you gonna respond to his videos?
And shout out to everybody in the chat

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welcome everybody. I didn't realize jim
Bob was streaming. I'm not trying to

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stream over him. I apologize to
Jimbob. Thank you to the mods.

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Jub you need to be a mod
because we had no mods last time.

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I'm not fussing at you, guys. I don't expect mods to be present

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in every live stream, although typically
you guys are you guys? Are you

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guys are the best? I'm the
best to use Toadstool's terminology, real reason

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00:12:22,919 --> 00:12:28,879
I'm not Catholic or Orthodox by ruseln
this question. You seem like you know

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church history. You seem like you
know things about the amazing Apostolic succession.

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You think you seem to know things
about the amazing Apostolic succession things were in

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the first five hundred years as the
church firste und years. Is that you

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do a lot of Protestants know about
the amazing apistoltis. I don't think they

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actually do. But that's not that's
not usually what Protestants are known for.

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But why are you not. Why
are you not Catholic? Why are you

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not Orthodox? Why are you not
coming back to your Oriental Orthodox routs?

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I have individual answers for all of
those different reasons, but the most one

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is because there's a doctrine that I
still hold to and that I'm not convinced

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is wrong. And there's other doctrines
they hold to that I am not convinced.

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So let's just start with the doctrine
I hold to and why I am

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convinced that this doctrine is correct.
This is truth, you knights, my

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00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:30,639
man, Here we go. So
he's relying on Gavin Ortland. Every time

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I see Blessed God, he's got
a he's got a hoodie on this says

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00:13:33,840 --> 00:13:37,360
Blessed God. His channel is called
Blessed God. All I can think of

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00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:50,200
is Kenneth Copeland, because that was
Kenneth Copeland's hold. Did he choose the

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00:13:50,240 --> 00:13:54,120
name of his channel from Kenneth Copeland? I've been We're gonna have him on

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the channel. The thing that the
Singh was is Protestant, which is what

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I am. But I are Oriental
Orthodox, Anal Protestant, Oriental or from

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00:14:03,039 --> 00:14:11,320
all the other faith traditions. What
what ethnicity named Ruse Lawn would be Oriental

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00:14:11,480 --> 00:14:16,200
Orthodox. That's confusing, But anyway, is the doctrine of sola scripture.

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So let's take a look at this
video and I'll give you guys my additional

158
00:14:18,480 --> 00:14:22,480
thoughts as we go. Solo scriptural
means that scripture is the church's own infallible

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00:14:22,639 --> 00:14:26,600
rule. It doesn't mean that Scripture
is the only authority creeds, catechisms,

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00:14:26,639 --> 00:14:31,120
confessions, and Council's function authoritatively.
Okay, So the first thing that's important

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00:14:31,159 --> 00:14:37,480
to note about this video is that
Protestants believe that scripture is the only infallible

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00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:46,679
rule, not the only authority.
And oftentimes solar scripture will get strawman as

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00:14:48,600 --> 00:14:52,480
a you guys believe that scripture is
the only authority. No, we don't

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00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:54,679
believe scripture is the only authority.
Yeah, And I mean this is true,

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00:14:54,679 --> 00:14:58,960
but I mean this doesn't really have
anything to do with proving solo scriptures.

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So I guess it's okay to kind
of clear the way. We get

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00:15:03,799 --> 00:15:09,360
the hoe the weeds out of the
way, and make it clear that if

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we're talking about infallibility, right,
that's not the same thing as authority per

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00:15:13,679 --> 00:15:18,840
se and as Orthodox. Yeah,
I think we would agree that, Yeah,

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exactly, that's why bishops have authority. But they're not infallible, So

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no problem here with this. But
I want to I want you to take

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00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:30,039
note. I've not watched this video, so this is a live riffing and

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00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:31,200
reaction that you're seeing. So I
don't know where he's going to go with

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these arguments. But the first thing
I would say is that while this is

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all true, how do we actually
know that the scriptures themselves are the only

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00:15:41,120 --> 00:15:46,879
infallible rule? When we needed an
external entity, namely the historic church,

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00:15:46,360 --> 00:15:52,159
to determine which books go into that
quote infallible rule. So notice that the

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00:15:52,159 --> 00:15:58,320
infallible rule here is going to include
a specific list of canonical texts. This

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is going to be a problem,
though, addict, because we're not ever

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00:16:00,799 --> 00:16:07,879
going to get anything external to the
text themselves that tells us what the texts

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00:16:08,039 --> 00:16:15,799
themselves are. We believe scripture is
the only infallible authority. This is super

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00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:18,879
duper important, so it's important to
just start with this asset. I believe

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00:16:18,919 --> 00:16:22,600
in other authorities. I believe in
local church authority. I believe in the

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00:16:22,679 --> 00:16:30,679
authority of shake a legg the brain
comes kicking off in the boardroom of the

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Creeds. I believe in Church history
authority. I believe in all kinds of

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00:16:33,799 --> 00:16:38,080
authorities. Now wait a minute,
he believes in the authority of church history

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00:16:38,159 --> 00:16:42,600
and its creeds, which is a
meaningless statement because to say that they have

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00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:49,919
authority doesn't mean anything except that this
specific Protestant picks and chooses which elements of

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00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:56,279
creeds in church father's teachings he thinks
is true and is according to his taste.

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So while I understand that we can
admit that it's a difference between infallibility

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00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:07,559
and authority, I don't think Ruslan
will give us any epistemic principle to actually

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adjudicate between these things. Because remember, most of the time, Protestants confuse

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normative authority with existential certitude, and
Protestants, to be fair to them,

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00:17:19,839 --> 00:17:25,160
do that because a lot of times
Roman Catholics do the exact same thing in

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00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:30,720
their argumentation. Roman Catholics will confuse
having an external office of the papacy with

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00:17:32,039 --> 00:17:37,599
something granting or somehow magically giving you
individual certitude. And it doesn't achieve that

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00:17:37,799 --> 00:17:41,240
it doesn't perform that task. Actually, that's just something that they assume it

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00:17:41,279 --> 00:17:45,319
does, and they often conflate these
two things. So when we talk about

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00:17:45,359 --> 00:17:49,759
normative authority, we're talking about historical
entities that have the ability to enforce rulings

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00:17:49,759 --> 00:17:56,640
and interpretations of texts. Okay,
so think about that's father Deacon and ice

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Offen says, the Supreme Court exists
to the Constitution. Right, We're not

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all running around like non denominational constitutionalists
interpreting the Constitution our own authoritative way.

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Because the spirit of seventeen seventy six
inspires and guides us. The magical powdered

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wigmen of seventeen seventy six and the
powdered wig powder that they sprinkled onto the

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documents inspires us as individuals to be
able to authoritatively interpret the Constitution. So

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they often confuse having a historical book
with interpreting the book. And the question

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is when we get a million different
interpretations from a million different goobers. And

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I'm sorry to say that if you
go to a strip Mall church except for

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the Orthodox ones, because somewhere Orthodox
churches mean striples if you go to it,

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because we're strip Mall in Potentia,
right, getting a temple. A

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lot of Orthodox churches are in Potentia
building their temple, getting out of the

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strip mall because that's all we've got. But non denominationals y'all are like,

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let's move from the strip mall to
a giant strip mall. Right, I

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am all right, but right,
you got Joel Ovaltine over there talking about

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we're gonna build, We're gonna move
from the strip mall to a damn NFL

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stadium. Right, so it's it's
even worse. But I think the only

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infallible authority, the only infallible rule, is scripture. Creeds, catechisms,

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confessions, and councils function authoritatively,
but according to solid scripture, right,

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they are fallible, meaning capable of
error and thus reformable. In scripture,

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fallible entities can still have real authority
like the umpire. All. So notice

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then there's a famous dictum of varsity
sproll. The canon of scripture is a

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fallible list of infallible books. Now, that's obviously to anybody who can see

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with basic reasoning skills a contradiction.
There's an error there, because if the

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compilation, if the totality of this
has infallibility status, then the parts have

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to have infallibility status. Right,
that's not a parts whole fallacy parts sol

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fallacy would be the other way around. What's true the parts has to be

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true the whole. That's why the
deacon says, my room is made up

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of atoms. Atoms are invisible,
so that room is invisible. That would

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be a fallacy. But if I
encompass all of this book, which is

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a bunch of little books, as
infallible, then obviously the individual books are

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also infallible, and that would necessitate
that the collection and decision of what goes

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into this is infallible. This is
so obvious. But notice the problem here

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is that we're not talking about authority
at this point. We're actually talking about

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the infallibility part, which was his
first part. And so as Galvin Ortlund

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said, if everything that's not infallible
is therefore reformable was his terminology, then

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the canon of scripture itself is reformable. This is the logic of the reformed

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and the Protestant position, even according
to people like RC. Sproull. Remember

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Sproll says, it's a fallible collection
of infallible books, So the individual books

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that went into this, that collection
itself is fallible. It might be wrong,

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is it not? Obvious to Protestants
that this is the basis for higher

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criticism. This is the basis,
this is the thinking of Luther. It's

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saying that I'm ready to start challenging
all kinds of texts. Want to doubt

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00:22:00,559 --> 00:22:03,000
James. I want to doubt the
Catholic epistles. I want it out Hebrews.

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I want to doubt all these things. I want to throw out the

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00:22:07,039 --> 00:22:15,759
Dudo Caman. If it's a fallible
collection of infallible books, then this is

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also reformable. By Gavin Ortlund's argumentation
right there, or the US Supreme Court

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or the Jewish sanhedrew most stories in
this world are not infallible, sooscript correct.

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This is not required that every doctrine
must be explicitly topic description. There's

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a problem with that analogy, though, because the Protestant is making the analogy

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to the what did you say,
the Supreme Court, the Sanhedrin and those

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are not infallible. Well, there's
a difference though, because if you look

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at the doctrine of the Church,
is the New Testament Church the equivalent of

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the Sanhedrin or the Supreme Court.
Now I made an analogy on the basis

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of interpreting the text and binding people
to those interpretations. I'm not saying that

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the Supreme Court is infallible. The
analogy is just to show that normative authority

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is different from existential individual certitude,
two different things. However, that doesn't

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mean that there's an equivalence between the
Church as a human organization and other human

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organizations like the Supreme Court or the
Sanhedrin. Those are not divine institutions.

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The Church is a panthropic, divino
human institution, and it's unique because it's

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the Kingdom of God where we will
not have the gates of Hell prevailing.

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So how could it ever officially teach
universally teach error in this position? Not

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only has it, it must it
must fail. It must teach error because

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now every individual protest must reinvent the
wheel and rediscover if in fact any of

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the doctrines of the first thousand years
or the last two thousand years are correct.

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Maybe the Trinity is not right.
So each individual Protestant now has the

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duty to reinvent the wheel to start
over. Every generation has to start over

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and figure out what is Christ the
vine. I guess we got to go

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and have this debate again. What's
the canon? Of scripture. I guess

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we got to redo the first seven
centuries when they come to the canon that

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Trollo and the Seventh Council. So
you see the absurdity of this whole position.

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But the position is not really historical
at all, because if you watch

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the Trent Horn James White debate,
James White eventually admitted that the Church was

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not operating on the base of soul
scripture for many, many centuries, and

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so therefore it's not true for those
centuries. How could it then be the

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cornerstone of the church. It's like
the flip and verse view of the papacy.

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00:25:02,839 --> 00:25:08,880
If the papacy is dogmatized in terms
of infallibility at Vatican One, then

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how could it have been the principle
of certitude for seeing and identifying the church

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in the first few centuries. Likewise, the flip side of that is James

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00:25:18,119 --> 00:25:22,160
White's admission that the Church was not
operating on a sol scripture principle because they

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didn't have a compiled canon yet.
And then his example of what was it

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Meledo? Was it Bledo's canon,
as Sam Munn pointed out, was totally

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dishonest. It included du to econonical
texts. So Melito didn't have the Protestant

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00:25:37,920 --> 00:25:44,279
canon. The strongest articulation of the
only Protestant who has or excuman Church father

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00:25:44,319 --> 00:25:49,359
has the quote Protestant canon is Jerome, and Jerome is alone in that view

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00:25:49,519 --> 00:25:56,400
except for maybe one or two other
people maybe. But why is a Protestant

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00:25:56,440 --> 00:26:02,119
should I accept or we accept Jerome's
view? Well? But the Hebrew canon

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00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:04,839
and the Jews? And why did
Jews decide what the canon of scripture is

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00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:10,359
for the church. We're talking about
post destruction of Jerusalem, post seventy eight,

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right opposed to Christianity. Jews they
decide the canon. Do they also

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determine the doctor of the Trinity,
because I'm pretty sure they would say it's

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00:26:19,799 --> 00:26:22,799
not true. Do they determine the
deed of Christ? Because then we would

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be arian? So the post first
second century Jews determine the canon. Are

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00:26:33,799 --> 00:26:37,519
the Protestants also going to go to
the post second third century Jews for the

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00:26:37,519 --> 00:26:40,359
exegesis of the Old Testament because I'm
pretty sure they're gonna argue that it's not

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Jesus that's the Messiah. Do you
see how silly this is, how arbitrary

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00:26:44,799 --> 00:26:48,640
this is That's why the argument that
we make is no, the Church is

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00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:53,240
the continuation of Israel, and it
has the authority that Christ gave to it.

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Does Jesus say, he who hears
the Sanhedrin hears me? No,

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he says he who hears the Apostles, he hears you. Here's me,

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00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:07,759
the Apostles absolute succession, not the
Sanhedrin stated doctrine, the sufficiency of Scripture

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00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:12,519
allow for doctrines to be deduced from
Scripture by good and necessary consequence. Always.

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00:27:12,519 --> 00:27:17,119
Crituria is often caricatured on those points
and many others. But I've stated

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00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:21,960
responsibly it's a very modest and reasonable
claim. It simply means that popess councils

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00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:27,400
and other post apostolic organs of the
church are okay. So if post apostolic

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00:27:27,599 --> 00:27:33,759
councils, popes, church authorities,
elders, whatever, they're all fallible and

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00:27:33,759 --> 00:27:38,559
therefore reformable, then the canon of
Scripture as a compilation is also reformable.

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00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:42,440
Now you have the open door to
higher criticism and the destruction of the text.

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00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:47,799
And guess what, That's what happened
in history. Shocker for some people,

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00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:52,440
because different strains of the Church are
going to disagree on this specifically,

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00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:57,759
the most obvious one is my Catholic
bids and sisters believe that the wait a

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00:27:57,839 --> 00:28:02,400
minute, I love one. Protestants
do this thing where they call Catholics and

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00:28:02,480 --> 00:28:08,160
Orthodox their brothers and sisters. Historically
Catholics and could you remb water as well?

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00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:12,759
Thank you. Catholics and Protests killed
each other. Protestants killed each other

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00:28:12,799 --> 00:28:21,599
over things like baptism and the Lord's
Supper and church governance, and we're just

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00:28:21,599 --> 00:28:32,839
supposed to ignore all that. These
aren't war worthy disagreements anymore. We're all

316
00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:37,839
just bros and sisters. Brayey,
you're my brother. We're all brothers in

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00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:41,839
Christ. Let's just hold their hands
up and do some praise and worsha.

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00:28:42,119 --> 00:28:45,440
It's not gay, I promise.
Just repeat the same lines over like a

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00:28:45,519 --> 00:28:52,640
mantra, over and over and over
to the same three chords. Uh Jesus,

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00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:57,160
here's my boyfriend right, this awful
praise and worship. Who can stand

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00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:03,559
praise and worship? Even when I
was going to praise and worship Protestant stuff,

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00:29:03,599 --> 00:29:08,759
I mean, I remember thinking,
like, really, you know what

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00:29:08,759 --> 00:29:15,079
I mean. I'm trying to think, what's what's a classic praising worship song?

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00:29:15,119 --> 00:29:18,640
I'm trying to think of one.
How do they go? I'm trying

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00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:30,039
to remember I had an idea for
a gay praising worship leader skit, and

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00:29:30,079 --> 00:29:33,759
then somebody actually made that. They
beat me to the punch a long time

327
00:29:33,799 --> 00:29:41,400
ago. What's one of those praising
worship songs that's super annoying. I'm trying

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00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:48,200
to remember one. Lord, I
left your name on high Lord. I

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00:29:48,319 --> 00:29:53,640
love to seeing your praises from the
ocean to the sea, from the sea

330
00:29:53,880 --> 00:29:59,880
to the valley, to the value
to the shores. I mean, oh,

331
00:30:00,319 --> 00:30:03,640
no, wonder people become atheists.
Praise and worship alone is like the

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00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:07,359
greatest argument for atheism. Atheists,
if you're listening, you want to own

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00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:11,000
the Christians. Uh, You're not
gonna own the Orthodox because our chance are

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00:30:11,079 --> 00:30:17,160
like masculine and babe, right,
But you want to If you want to

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00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:19,079
own the Evangelicals, I'll give you
this little nugget. Just make fun of

336
00:30:19,119 --> 00:30:22,400
their Just play their praise and worship, dude. That's a stronger argument than

337
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:26,599
any of your soy atheist arguments.
Just play praise and worship, dude.

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00:30:26,759 --> 00:30:36,559
That's it. Oh god, it
is an awesome got you rage. I

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00:30:36,559 --> 00:30:41,079
can't even remember these do the people
in the chat are They're they're loving it.

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00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:48,640
They're loving it. Jesus, isn't
your boyfriend, dude? This is

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00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:56,160
all It's all very I mean,
imagine meeting a monarch and then walking up

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00:30:56,160 --> 00:31:00,039
to the monarch and being I mean, obviously the monarchs nowaday are like disgusting

343
00:31:00,079 --> 00:31:04,079
degenerates. But imagine meeting like a
baze tried monarch, you know what I

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00:31:04,079 --> 00:31:10,519
mean, and being walking up and
being like, Emperor Constantine, You're my

345
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:15,839
favorite guy. You're so hot and
cool, and I love you too.

346
00:31:15,599 --> 00:31:22,279
I love you Constantine the best Byzantine
Emperor, and be like constantly like,

347
00:31:22,319 --> 00:31:29,599
get this skittles man out of my
court? What is this nonsense? Right?

348
00:31:30,759 --> 00:31:37,720
But yet you're gonna sing to the
Lord of the universe these horrible three

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00:31:37,799 --> 00:31:44,400
note I don't even know what you
call them. They're like they're like beta

350
00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:51,720
male pop songs, just the worst, just ugh. And his final authority

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00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:57,400
is infallible. And we would point
and say that is very recent. And

352
00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:01,039
then some of the other arms of
the church, the traditions of the church,

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are infallible, the Apostolic succession of
traditions, not all of them people

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00:32:07,519 --> 00:32:12,799
fallible, but the scripture is infallible. I think Lane puts Us stated differently,

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00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:15,880
solo scripture is a statement that the
church can enter the plausthoriety of Soloscricturer

356
00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:21,240
begins with two simple observations, First, what scripture is and second how scripture

357
00:32:21,319 --> 00:32:24,839
functions. First, scripture claims to
be the inspired word of God. Now,

358
00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:29,480
all of our traditions use the phrase
the word of God in various different

359
00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:31,960
ways. When we designate scripture as
the inspired Word of God, we are

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00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:38,359
recognizing that it is ontologically and I'm
trying to find me some good praise and

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00:32:38,440 --> 00:32:42,599
worship as a little bit about sample
for you. The words of Scripture are

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00:32:42,599 --> 00:32:46,519
from God because the Holy Spirit carried
along with the off Yeah. Next fallacy

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00:32:46,880 --> 00:32:54,319
here is the assumption that quote word
of God and quote uh, well,

364
00:32:54,359 --> 00:32:59,720
that word of God only refers to
the written text. Where does the idea

365
00:32:59,759 --> 00:33:04,799
of the Word of God equating to
only written texts? Where is that?

366
00:33:05,519 --> 00:33:09,400
Oh, it's not anywhere. So
the fact that two Peter says that the

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00:33:09,480 --> 00:33:15,839
Old Testament prophets were moved by the
Holy Spirit and spoke not by the will

368
00:33:15,839 --> 00:33:17,359
of man, but according to the
will of God. That doesn't mean that

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00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:22,839
everything that they spoke was only written. You understand, the Old Testament prophets

370
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:30,160
also were preachers, so the preaching
that they did was also authoritative, was

371
00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:36,119
also the word of God. And
we know this because in Paul's letters to

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00:33:36,119 --> 00:33:42,599
Timothy, he says, pass on
to good men after you the word of

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00:33:42,640 --> 00:33:46,559
God which you heard from me in
the presence of many witnesses. He doesn't

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00:33:46,559 --> 00:33:52,279
say, just write another letter,
just copy and paste my letter, Timothy.

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00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:53,960
No, he says, all of
the teaching that you heard from me,

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00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:58,440
because Paul taught for three years.
According to Acts, I think it's

377
00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:01,440
Acts twenty in night emphasis, he
says, pass on that whole body of

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00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:07,359
knowledge. So the assumption that Protestants
always do here and I did I know

379
00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:09,400
because I used to do this when
I was Protestants to assume that when the

380
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:15,360
New Testament texts are talking about the
Word of God, it only refers to

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00:34:15,639 --> 00:34:21,480
written texts. But it doesn't.
The preaching of the apostles was also authoritative.

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00:34:21,480 --> 00:34:24,559
And I think, if I remember, I think James White admitted that

383
00:34:24,599 --> 00:34:30,280
in the Trent Horn debate. If
I recall, I'm trying to do y'all

384
00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:31,559
want to y'all want to pause for
a minute, get a little bit of

385
00:34:31,559 --> 00:34:50,159
praise on worship who And I had
to explain to the California Ortho bros what

386
00:34:50,239 --> 00:34:53,920
a United Pentecostal was when you come
to Tennessee. Okay, it's not like

387
00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:57,400
they're like, oh, you mean
charismatics. No, No, you see

388
00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:00,679
this chick with the bun where the
hair come down. That that's the that's

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00:35:00,719 --> 00:35:06,960
a Pentecostal right there. And the
Pentecostals usually are anti Trinitarian. Okay,

390
00:35:07,000 --> 00:35:12,639
So that's what this is, is
what I talk. By the way,

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00:35:12,639 --> 00:35:15,639
this is better than the praise and
worship stuff. I'd rather go to a

392
00:35:15,679 --> 00:35:23,159
heterodox Unitarian praising worships. I'm joking, but that's actually better than the what

393
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:27,559
is this? Here we go like
Hillsong type of stuff. You know what

394
00:35:27,559 --> 00:35:30,159
I mean? This is the worst. If you're fifties, don't want to

395
00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:36,639
use traditional makeup as I use traditional
makeup. When I was on O a

396
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:39,119
n other day and I look like
a damn diva, I got to hear

397
00:35:39,119 --> 00:35:55,079
some hill song. Let's hear it. Oh this is oh yeah, this

398
00:35:55,159 --> 00:36:00,280
is this is Chris. This is
evangelical creed Man. Look at this dude.

399
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:08,800
I could be this dude. Look
can you cheek me Hi, yeah,

400
00:36:09,400 --> 00:36:19,679
jew a polish We're blind, man. She's no different than the crappy

401
00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:25,320
radio rock, except worse Christian rock. Oh man, look at this dude.

402
00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:34,280
He knows every word. He knows
every word. What's he got a

403
00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:37,599
what's that pink bracelet? All the
conspiracy he will be like, he's got

404
00:36:37,639 --> 00:36:45,239
a caballa bracelet. You've got a
pink caballa bracelet? Eh? Yeah,

405
00:36:51,039 --> 00:37:10,679
he fixed his heart for Oh yeah, oh yeah, I'm a crappy Christian

406
00:37:10,760 --> 00:37:17,239
version of Creed Paul calls scripture god
breathed. John Stott uses words like spiration

407
00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:22,159
and expiration to convey the meaning of
that term. Qut plainly thinking would start

408
00:37:22,159 --> 00:37:34,559
cutting carts. Oh yeah, I'm
unsure of my sexuality and I'm in a

409
00:37:34,599 --> 00:37:42,599
prison worship band or the words of
God. That is exactly how scripture speaks

410
00:37:42,599 --> 00:37:45,920
of itself. And Jesus quotes the
Old Testament as God speaking. Yeah,

411
00:37:45,920 --> 00:37:52,000
but none of that prison is infallible, it cannot be broken. But none

412
00:37:52,039 --> 00:37:54,119
of those things personal scripture. So
you noticed that it's all non sequitors from

413
00:37:54,159 --> 00:37:59,480
Gavin Orland here, because God is
infallible, and sure it's the same of

414
00:37:59,519 --> 00:38:02,639
that. I mean Catholics make with
Vatican one, right, and mining the

415
00:38:02,639 --> 00:38:07,280
first thousand years of quote proof text
for Vatican one, where it's like,

416
00:38:07,159 --> 00:38:12,880
no, this here a track cat. Notice here it says that the Bishop

417
00:38:12,920 --> 00:38:16,039
of Rome was listed as first,
therefore Vatican wela. No, the fact

418
00:38:16,079 --> 00:38:21,159
that he's listed first does not in
any way prove Vatican one. And by

419
00:38:21,159 --> 00:38:25,639
the way, the Alexandria document admits
that ninety six prove Vatican one. So

420
00:38:27,199 --> 00:38:30,800
it's like they're using all these battle
It's no, it's the same type of

421
00:38:30,800 --> 00:38:44,280
fallacious move that Ortland or Lundia over
here and Russlan over here speech. So

422
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:47,880
us simply maintains that as scripture is
unique in its nature, so it is

423
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:52,360
correspondingly unique in its authorities. Well, again, the fact that it's unique

424
00:38:53,079 --> 00:38:57,880
does not equate to being the sole
infallible authority. So you notice that all

425
00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:04,440
of this so far has just traded
on non supporters. Okay, So notice

426
00:39:04,559 --> 00:39:07,800
what he's saying here. Scripture is
unique in its nature, and it's correspondingly

427
00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:15,239
unique as authority. So Protestants who
hold that scripture is the final authority do

428
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:22,000
not believe that modern day prophecy is
equal with scripture. This is why when

429
00:39:22,000 --> 00:39:25,000
people ask modern day prophets, do
you still believe in apostles and prophets and

430
00:39:25,039 --> 00:39:28,639
healings to day? And I say
yes, but not in the sense that

431
00:39:28,679 --> 00:39:30,840
we see it in the scripture,
meaning I do believe there was so wait

432
00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:36,679
he believes in apostles today, so
wait, so then what do you have

433
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:38,400
a problem with? That was ald
of succession. By the way, the

434
00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:45,000
best ships are not apostles. But
that's weird. The uniqueness of with the

435
00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:46,800
apostles, and a uniqueness with the
writing of scripture, and a uniqueness with

436
00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:52,639
the Old Testament prophets. And when
we see prophetic prophetic elements today or elements

437
00:39:52,639 --> 00:39:55,920
of apostleship today, it is not
with the same authority as the apostles in

438
00:39:55,960 --> 00:40:00,519
the Bible. Well, we saw
last time that this is nonsense, right

439
00:40:00,639 --> 00:40:06,760
because Zechariah specifically says that in the
Messianic era, you will not have people

440
00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:12,320
claiming to be profits. Prophecy will
cease. We don't need prophecy anymore because

441
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:15,760
the canon is closed. That doesn't
mean that there aren't people with clairvoyance or

442
00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:19,639
something like that, or elders and
people who have spiritual gifts. But those

443
00:40:19,639 --> 00:40:22,280
things are not right. The equivalent
of divine revelations. So we would agree

444
00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:28,639
with him that there is a uniqueness
to the apostolic deposit right, the faith

445
00:40:28,679 --> 00:40:30,639
wants for all delivered to the saints. But the whole fallacy here is to

446
00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:35,519
think that the faith once for all
delivered to the saints equates to and must

447
00:40:35,519 --> 00:40:37,360
be only what's in the written text, and none of that has actually been

448
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:42,840
demonstrated. None of the texts that
he showed so far actually demonstrate that it's

449
00:40:42,880 --> 00:40:45,920
just all been assumed. And again
we bring it back to the first point,

450
00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:51,000
which is that I think is Zechariah
thirteen. I think it's either eight

451
00:40:51,079 --> 00:40:53,960
or thirteen, but that's the chapter
that predicts in the Messianic era that you

452
00:40:54,000 --> 00:41:01,199
will not have people calling themselves profits, and people they call themselves profits will

453
00:41:01,239 --> 00:41:05,360
be stoned with stones. Now we
don't literally think that people are going to

454
00:41:05,400 --> 00:41:09,679
be stoned, but it means that
the New Testament equivalent of the quote death

455
00:41:09,719 --> 00:41:17,039
penalty or being excommunicated the way that
you would be ceremonially unclean in the Old

456
00:41:17,039 --> 00:41:21,280
Testament. For example, you couldn't
go to participate in the rituals and whatnot

457
00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:24,840
until you were cleansed in a bath. That's a type that's a foreshadowing as

458
00:41:24,880 --> 00:41:30,199
symbol of the New Testament notion of
being baptized and then being admitted to the

459
00:41:30,199 --> 00:41:35,800
Eucharist. So the way that you're
quote stoned and excommunicated nowadays is by not

460
00:41:35,880 --> 00:41:39,840
confessing your sins and not being prepared
for the admittance to the covenantal meal of

461
00:41:39,840 --> 00:41:45,559
the Eucharist. So there's a direct
parallel there to the New Testament. And

462
00:41:45,599 --> 00:41:52,760
in that text of Zachariah where talks
about in the Messianic era, if anyone

463
00:41:52,760 --> 00:41:55,000
says I am a prophet, his
father and his mother who who begot him,

464
00:41:55,039 --> 00:41:59,000
will stone him with stones. I
want to say, is zach rai

465
00:41:59,199 --> 00:42:01,000
ate? But it's been well since
we looked at that text. But Father

466
00:42:01,039 --> 00:42:05,840
Deacon and I covered this, and
he had a great point too about you

467
00:42:05,880 --> 00:42:12,119
know, if you look at Paul's
texts and Galatians one, Paul says that

468
00:42:12,519 --> 00:42:15,159
if anyone preaches a new gospel or
a different gospel to you right, ignore

469
00:42:15,199 --> 00:42:22,000
them. Well, if the can
and divine revelation, if public divine revelation

470
00:42:22,239 --> 00:42:29,639
wasn't sealed and wasn't complete, then
there wouldn't be a way to say that

471
00:42:30,159 --> 00:42:34,119
there weren't. There wasn't a defined
thing to test it against. So we

472
00:42:34,199 --> 00:42:39,559
agree with the Protestant that there's not
new ongoing public revelations. The councils and

473
00:42:39,599 --> 00:42:46,639
their teachings are authoritative interpretations of the
existing the positive faith. The positive faith

474
00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:51,400
is complete, as Jude says,
once for all delivered the saints. So

475
00:42:51,440 --> 00:42:55,199
therefore there could never be new divine
revelations. It's just not even possible.

476
00:42:55,880 --> 00:43:04,639
And it is zechari At thirteen,
and that day there will be a place

477
00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:07,840
in every place opened up to the
House of David and the habits of Jerusalem.

478
00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:12,119
So this is Messianic gar It will
come to pass, says the Lord

479
00:43:12,119 --> 00:43:15,679
of Hosts, that I will utterly
destroy, Hey, Jamie, could you

480
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:23,039
bring me a water? Excuse me? I will utterly destroy the names of

481
00:43:23,039 --> 00:43:27,360
the idols in the land, the
false prophets, the unclean spirits. If

482
00:43:27,360 --> 00:43:31,199
anyone says that they are a prophet
or shall still prophesy, his mother and

483
00:43:31,280 --> 00:43:35,079
his father, who begot him,
will say you are not. You will

484
00:43:35,079 --> 00:43:37,239
not live, or you speak falsehoods
in the name of the Lord. Thus

485
00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:43,679
his father and his mother who begot
him, will bind him when he prophesies.

486
00:43:43,800 --> 00:43:45,159
And it will come to pass that
the prophets will be put to shame

487
00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:52,000
their visions and their prophecies, and
they will put on leather skins because they

488
00:43:52,039 --> 00:43:55,639
spoke lies. And one will say, I am not a prophet, but

489
00:43:57,000 --> 00:44:00,360
rather I am a tiller of the
soil and man who brought me up thus

490
00:44:00,400 --> 00:44:04,360
from my youth. So I think
this tilling of the soil. Right.

491
00:44:04,559 --> 00:44:07,239
In the New Testament, this is
typically a reference to the work of the

492
00:44:07,239 --> 00:44:12,119
apostles. Right, so the church
is typically portrayed as a vineyard, as

493
00:44:12,159 --> 00:44:16,920
a field where the seed is sprinkled
and it's sown, and so tilling the

494
00:44:16,960 --> 00:44:22,920
field, right, you shall not
muzzle the oxen while it works. The

495
00:44:22,000 --> 00:44:27,159
New Testament, and Paul applies that
to the apostles. So the New Testament

496
00:44:27,199 --> 00:44:30,199
application is that, well, there's
gonna be a finality of revelation. Right,

497
00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:35,519
there's no more profits because, as
Jesus says, John was the last

498
00:44:35,519 --> 00:44:38,920
of the prophets. So there are
New Testament prophecies, but as paulices,

499
00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:45,599
prophecies will cease, so there's no
longer a need for the office of an

500
00:44:45,599 --> 00:44:51,039
Old Testament prophet, because that was
in anticipation too, the coming of the

501
00:44:51,079 --> 00:44:58,320
Messiah. And the common theme here
that I'm getting at is that for much

502
00:44:58,320 --> 00:45:05,559
of Protestantism, the error, the
underlying error throughout a lot of this is

503
00:45:05,599 --> 00:45:09,239
to think that we can move back
to the Old Testament status of things.

504
00:45:10,039 --> 00:45:15,079
And you'll notice they're always trying to
make this move, even inadvertently. They

505
00:45:15,119 --> 00:45:21,119
think that, oh, the way
the sacraments operate, well, it's like

506
00:45:21,239 --> 00:45:24,280
circumcision or any of the ritual meals
in the Old Testament. It's just a

507
00:45:24,360 --> 00:45:30,760
symbol. Wait a minute, that's
the Old Testament status. Oh well,

508
00:45:30,760 --> 00:45:32,480
if the Church is like Israel,
then it's just like Israel, and then

509
00:45:32,480 --> 00:45:36,639
it's just as fallible. Well,
this is prior to Pentecost. Jesus said

510
00:45:36,679 --> 00:45:38,800
the Holy Spirit woul be given to
the Church, and that it would never

511
00:45:39,199 --> 00:45:43,239
leave the church. I will never
leave you and never sink you. I

512
00:45:43,239 --> 00:45:46,960
will guide you into old truth.
And yet no, you see, according

513
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:51,679
to Process, the Church isn't an
actual historical thing. It's this amorphous,

514
00:45:51,800 --> 00:45:55,760
unknown, invisible thing which is just
ecclesiological in Hisstorianism. Oh, it's an

515
00:45:55,800 --> 00:46:00,119
invisible entity where everybody somehow might be
part of the Church, and there's not

516
00:46:00,199 --> 00:46:13,719
really a visible authoritative thing. Jay
reminds me of Alan Watts, the man

517
00:46:13,719 --> 00:46:16,719
who sings without an orchestra, just
just playing rhymeless music. That's what I'm

518
00:46:16,719 --> 00:46:23,679
talking about, absolutely, man,
there are no more profits. Now that

519
00:46:23,760 --> 00:46:32,159
we have a book. We worship
you, oh Holy Book. You are

520
00:46:32,280 --> 00:46:37,840
the one thing on myself that I
worship. Now, even though you're a

521
00:46:37,920 --> 00:46:43,719
creature, I worship you, Oh
Book. This is the way that Protestants

522
00:46:43,719 --> 00:46:49,000
should really do their prison worship,
right, I don't worship creatures. Even

523
00:46:49,039 --> 00:46:53,519
though a book's a creature. Boy, it is not with the same accuracy

524
00:46:53,599 --> 00:46:58,199
as the prophets in the Bible,
right that that that phase was unique.

525
00:46:58,800 --> 00:47:02,559
It's not with the same accurate So
now profits can like prophesy and be totally

526
00:47:02,599 --> 00:47:10,239
off. Actually, the structures on
quote prophecy are that if they don't get

527
00:47:10,239 --> 00:47:15,480
it right, they're dead to you
or they're stoned. Right, that's the

528
00:47:15,519 --> 00:47:19,880
Old Testament strictures. And where does
he get the idea that, well,

529
00:47:20,639 --> 00:47:22,960
you know, I mean basically like
no stradonka, don't you know what I

530
00:47:22,960 --> 00:47:25,840
mean? Like, if you get
like thirty percent of your prophecy right,

531
00:47:28,159 --> 00:47:30,840
you know, we'll let you slide. Right. It's not like it used

532
00:47:30,840 --> 00:47:31,800
to be, though, where you
had you had to get it like spot

533
00:47:31,880 --> 00:47:37,679
On. You know, the bar
was pretty high from Malachi. But for

534
00:47:39,599 --> 00:47:44,159
I don't know, for Benny hen
I will let you slide on about eighty

535
00:47:44,199 --> 00:47:46,360
percent of your failed prophecies. So
what that is he even talking about.

536
00:47:46,519 --> 00:47:50,920
So there's a distinction here. There
is a distincitionship. We believe Cruit is

537
00:47:51,000 --> 00:47:55,920
unique in its nature and it's authority. It's not the same. It's just

538
00:47:55,920 --> 00:48:04,840
so funny because as you think about
this, the whole methodology of the Protestant

539
00:48:05,199 --> 00:48:09,960
and their whole approach here is literally
to make the book God. I mean,

540
00:48:09,960 --> 00:48:15,559
they actually think that this is God. And that's super duper irony because

541
00:48:15,639 --> 00:48:21,440
number one, it's against their iconoclasm
position, because if this is God,

542
00:48:21,599 --> 00:48:28,039
then you're God is a creature and
the book is full of images words.

543
00:48:28,079 --> 00:48:31,320
Those are images if you didn't know, they're iconographic, and they're depicting the

544
00:48:31,320 --> 00:48:37,400
thing that you say can't be depicted. So actually you're just a book idolator,

545
00:48:37,559 --> 00:48:40,559
is all you are. Even though
Jesus says, and he quoted John

546
00:48:40,639 --> 00:48:49,280
ten citing Gavin Orlandia right, he
cited that where Jesus says the scriptures cannot

547
00:48:49,280 --> 00:48:52,840
be broken. But he also says
that you search the scriptures because you think

548
00:48:52,840 --> 00:48:55,760
that it's in them that you have
eternal life. Oh but you didn't cite

549
00:48:55,760 --> 00:48:59,880
that one, did you? Erusalem? Did you? Gavin? When?

550
00:49:00,000 --> 00:49:02,400
And it is they that bear witness
to me. So this is like a

551
00:49:02,480 --> 00:49:08,559
letter. Imagine mistaking a letter for
the person. That's that's the mistake they're

552
00:49:08,559 --> 00:49:13,840
doing here. It says silly,
right, somebody writes you a letter about

553
00:49:14,039 --> 00:49:16,800
how good of a rapper I am, and we all know I'm probably probably

554
00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:22,199
the best. I mean, we
know it's not Little aids aka Tristana.

555
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:30,239
So who's left me? That's it? Easy equation there, cancel out the

556
00:49:30,280 --> 00:49:34,440
second rateist rapper and you've only got
one left. Somebody writes a big letter

557
00:49:34,519 --> 00:49:39,480
explaining how good I am with my
vocal bars and skills. And you get

558
00:49:39,519 --> 00:49:43,519
this letter, and you read the
letter, and you, oh, dude,

559
00:49:43,519 --> 00:49:47,199
I know Jay now. I know
all about his freestyle. I know

560
00:49:47,280 --> 00:49:51,880
all about his flow because I read
the letter. And you're like, but

561
00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:53,239
do you know him? Yeah?
I read the letter, dude, but

562
00:49:53,320 --> 00:49:57,519
you don't know me. You read
a letter about me. This is how

563
00:49:57,559 --> 00:50:04,719
silly it is. Prophetic word the
authority positions tend to separate infallibility from inspiration.

564
00:50:05,239 --> 00:50:08,400
Second, Scripture functions with superior authority
than other authorities in the Church.

565
00:50:09,079 --> 00:50:16,360
So separating infallibility from inspiration distinguishing is
not separating so that people make these mistakes

566
00:50:16,360 --> 00:50:21,679
all the time. It's the same
move that like people the mistakes that people

567
00:50:21,719 --> 00:50:24,599
make in terms of the Trinity or
Christology. Oh, if you make a

568
00:50:24,639 --> 00:50:30,679
distinction, that means that there's separation
and division. No, just because scripture

569
00:50:30,840 --> 00:50:36,119
is infallible doesn't mean that there's nothing
else about. So again, these are

570
00:50:36,119 --> 00:50:38,440
it's all non sequitis. For example, in Mark seven, Jesus places scripture

571
00:50:38,559 --> 00:50:44,320
over the Pharisees traditions despite the fact
that the Pharisees had legitimate teaching authority and

572
00:50:44,360 --> 00:50:49,199
it claimed to possess an oral law
for Moses. Yeah, but that's an

573
00:50:49,199 --> 00:50:54,559
admission that the teaching is oral and
written even in the Old Testament. So

574
00:50:54,599 --> 00:51:00,840
he doesn't even understand that this isn't
own right, But the traditions are not

575
00:51:01,199 --> 00:51:06,760
all that, So this is a
I'm surprised that Gavin Ortland's approach was so

576
00:51:06,880 --> 00:51:10,400
low tier here actually, given how
much people talk about Gavin Ortland, I

577
00:51:10,440 --> 00:51:16,639
thought, and I expected something a
lot more quality than this. This is

578
00:51:16,719 --> 00:51:23,119
super like basic tier stuff, right, Like, well, Jesus is good

579
00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:29,760
traditions, traditions and men traditions to
me, Yeah, but those are traditions

580
00:51:29,760 --> 00:51:34,400
of men. We're talking about the
traditions of God, which Paul says second

581
00:51:34,440 --> 00:51:39,079
Massalonians two fifteen are written and oral. Famous claim of plus tradition is roughly

582
00:51:39,119 --> 00:51:43,559
equal authorities. The Pharisees could have
objected, but Jesus, where does the

583
00:51:43,559 --> 00:51:47,239
Old Testament explicitly say that it has
a greater authority than are oral traditions.

584
00:51:47,400 --> 00:51:53,760
But of course the Bible need not
anticipate every possible leader Jesus the way.

585
00:51:54,119 --> 00:52:00,400
Yeah, but that doesn't prove that
the idea of there being oral and written

586
00:52:00,519 --> 00:52:07,679
tradition is false. Right, So
that again, anywhere else, this guy

587
00:52:07,679 --> 00:52:12,039
has a new, a new ad. We think about the think about the

588
00:52:12,079 --> 00:52:16,039
serpent oral Torah and what was passed
down and all of these different things.

589
00:52:16,079 --> 00:52:22,119
And Jesus, so here's the mistake
here, because the Pharisees had a false

590
00:52:22,239 --> 00:52:28,000
oral tradition that Jesus, rebuking the
Protestant then thinks that this is a rejection

591
00:52:28,159 --> 00:52:31,840
of all oral tradition. That's silly
again, non secultor. It's always word

592
00:52:31,840 --> 00:52:36,920
concept fallacies and non sequitors. It's
like all it's everything acknowledged that they had

593
00:52:37,679 --> 00:52:42,480
authority. He incurs and do as
the Pharisees say, just don't become like

594
00:52:42,559 --> 00:52:46,239
that. Right, So it's it's
an interesting uh distinction here was right.

595
00:52:47,039 --> 00:52:53,159
Yeah, but I can agree with
that same idea that Jesus is rebuking the

596
00:52:53,199 --> 00:52:58,760
traditions of men and admitting that the
Pharisees have authority, and none of that

597
00:52:58,800 --> 00:53:01,480
has anything to do with proving so
scriptura. We could agree to the exact

598
00:53:01,480 --> 00:53:07,440
same critique that Jesus is making that
Rouslan is making, and yet we still

599
00:53:07,480 --> 00:53:09,719
don't get soul scripture from that.
The oral traditions of the Pharisees like the

600
00:53:09,800 --> 00:53:15,840
greater authority of holy scripture. Yeah, but the oral traditions of the Pharisees

601
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:20,880
are things that replaced the word of
God. The word of God still has

602
00:53:20,920 --> 00:53:25,559
not been demonstrated to be only written
yet that's just been assumed. Foreans noble

603
00:53:25,639 --> 00:53:31,119
for testing the apostolic message against the
scripture. Yeah, but none of our

604
00:53:31,239 --> 00:53:37,400
position, nobody in our position would
disagree with these texts. So again you

605
00:53:37,440 --> 00:53:44,320
see that checking the things against the
scriptures does not prove sola scriptura. Do

606
00:53:44,360 --> 00:53:49,760
you see how that's a non sequitar
It doesn't follow command is that Apostolic teaching

607
00:53:49,920 --> 00:53:53,440
and even Angelic teaching must be tested
according to the deposit of divine more relation

608
00:53:53,800 --> 00:54:02,480
given in the Apostolic age. But
actually, remember that Paul's standing command to

609
00:54:02,599 --> 00:54:07,360
Timothy and the Thessalonians is not to
only test everything by the written texts.

610
00:54:07,800 --> 00:54:12,559
It's also the things that you heard
from me in the presence of many witnesses,

611
00:54:12,559 --> 00:54:15,679
Paul says to Timothy. So if
they're going to make this an argument

612
00:54:15,719 --> 00:54:21,320
from Paul, then Paul now contradicts
himself because Paul also says to listen to

613
00:54:21,360 --> 00:54:25,440
his oral teachings, which they're equating
to things somehow inferior to what is written

614
00:54:25,480 --> 00:54:30,880
down. Well, where do you
think a lot of Paul's letters come from

615
00:54:30,159 --> 00:54:37,800
their oral teachings written down? This
is behind tests that which is to the

616
00:54:37,840 --> 00:54:40,199
inspired word of God, by that
which is the inspired word of God.

617
00:54:40,239 --> 00:54:46,840
So the entire video just relied on
the non sequitor that word of God equates

618
00:54:46,840 --> 00:54:51,039
to the written text, which was
never demonstrated, and in fact, multiple

619
00:54:51,039 --> 00:54:53,960
texts demonstrate that that's not true in
a contradiction, and that makes sense because

620
00:54:54,079 --> 00:54:59,559
God's speech has greater authority than other
seech. Now, these two considerations scripts

621
00:54:59,639 --> 00:55:04,039
nature in scripture's role don't yet establish, but they lead to the question,

622
00:55:04,519 --> 00:55:07,760
by the way, the nature of
scripture, like he never even addressed that

623
00:55:07,800 --> 00:55:14,440
he's just calling inspiration the quote nature
of scripture. Where was the ontology of

624
00:55:14,480 --> 00:55:17,199
scripture ever mentioned? Because as an
Orthodox person we would have a really excellent

625
00:55:17,239 --> 00:55:23,599
ontology of scripture which would mirror the
synergy in the two natures of Christ.

626
00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:31,239
Right divining human in synergy is the
model for how inspiration occurs and how the

627
00:55:31,280 --> 00:55:36,679
apostles also orally preached the word of
God. It's the same synergy. And

628
00:55:36,679 --> 00:55:39,960
the only difference between orally preaching something
and writing something down is the medium.

629
00:55:40,079 --> 00:55:44,320
That's it. The content is the
same, the authority is the same.

630
00:55:44,800 --> 00:55:50,000
So Peter orally preaching is no different
than somebody writing down what he orally preached.

631
00:55:50,119 --> 00:55:53,559
It's just the medium is different.
But the assumption here is that only

632
00:55:53,599 --> 00:55:58,000
what is written down is authoritative.
But where where does that come from?

633
00:55:59,159 --> 00:56:02,079
None of the text that were shown
prove that they're just assumed and read into

634
00:56:02,159 --> 00:56:07,280
it and in fact, multiple other
texts that reassert and reaffirm the authority of

635
00:56:07,320 --> 00:56:15,280
the oral prove our point that you
cannot read it in this limited, written

636
00:56:15,360 --> 00:56:20,559
only way. How does the church
possess any other rule that is comparable to

637
00:56:20,639 --> 00:56:24,320
scripture with respect to infallibility? What
it cric will be at some point to

638
00:56:24,440 --> 00:56:28,760
oral apostolic traditions that are mentioned in
in New Testament. But these were given.

639
00:56:29,199 --> 00:56:30,960
You noticed that that that he How
long did that stay up there?

640
00:56:30,960 --> 00:56:36,840
For about two seconds? So Gavin
kept that. The other quotes Galvin had

641
00:56:36,920 --> 00:56:40,400
up there for about fifteen to twenty
seconds. The two texts where Paul talks

642
00:56:40,400 --> 00:56:44,639
about there's other texts, but the
two where he mentioned tradition. Let's see

643
00:56:44,679 --> 00:56:47,440
how quick does Gavin allow this to
stay up that is comparable to scripture with

644
00:56:47,559 --> 00:56:54,079
respect to infallibility? What it crip
will be to orso one Mississippi two Mississippi

645
00:56:54,239 --> 00:56:59,440
Missisippi two seconds. So he gave
you two seconds to see versus talking about

646
00:56:59,480 --> 00:57:04,599
tradition interested directly by the apostles during
the era of public revelation while are still

647
00:57:04,639 --> 00:57:07,800
being written. We don't have those
oral traditions, right, You're how do

648
00:57:07,840 --> 00:57:12,199
you know that you're assuming that we
don't have the public oral traditions, and

649
00:57:12,280 --> 00:57:15,320
yet every liturgical scholar can go back
and tell us that, I mean it

650
00:57:15,559 --> 00:57:19,360
actually knows. I mean, even
the Protestant liturgical scholars will tell us that

651
00:57:19,400 --> 00:57:24,519
there's an Apostolic tradition for what the
liturgical services are. So Gavin Ortland just

652
00:57:24,519 --> 00:57:29,159
blew past that, acts like that
doesn't exist, which he probably doesn't even

653
00:57:29,239 --> 00:57:31,840
know that, right, because isn't
he a Baptist? Okay, so is

654
00:57:31,880 --> 00:57:36,039
a Baptist going to know anything about
the history of liturgical worship? Of course

655
00:57:36,079 --> 00:57:38,039
not right, ninety nine point nine
percent of them will not, So no

656
00:57:38,119 --> 00:57:43,320
surprise here that he doesn't. He
just assumes that there is no tradition.

657
00:57:43,880 --> 00:57:45,480
We don't have a And you know, it's funny when most of the time

658
00:57:45,519 --> 00:57:49,559
when Protestants talk about this and you
say, what do you mean we don't

659
00:57:49,559 --> 00:57:53,360
have any oral tradition, they're like, where's it written down? Well?

660
00:57:53,440 --> 00:57:59,480
Number one, again, we're all
just assuming the Protestant mindset here by well,

661
00:57:59,480 --> 00:58:02,239
the oral tradition must be written down
or we can't know it. Oh,

662
00:58:02,280 --> 00:58:07,159
really, let's apply that argument to
the canon. Where's the Protestant canon

663
00:58:07,400 --> 00:58:10,360
in the first second and third century. Oh it's not there, So I

664
00:58:10,360 --> 00:58:16,559
guess we can't know it by your
own standard, can we? Did you

665
00:58:16,599 --> 00:58:20,719
see that? Did you guys notice
this argument? If we apply his same

666
00:58:20,800 --> 00:58:25,159
logic of the bar the criterion of
what's expected to know quote a tradition,

667
00:58:29,079 --> 00:58:31,360
in his case, it's knowing an
oral tradition. If it's not written down

668
00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:37,039
in the first few centuries, it's
unknowable. Okay, let's apply that same

669
00:58:37,360 --> 00:58:43,000
principle to the Protestant canon of Scripture, the Protestant list of books where in

670
00:58:43,039 --> 00:58:45,159
the Church fathers, because there's no
other I mean, unless you want to

671
00:58:45,159 --> 00:58:47,320
go to liturgy. But I don't
think you want to go to liturgy as

672
00:58:47,320 --> 00:58:52,800
a Protestant as a basis for quote
tradition. Okay, where are we going

673
00:58:52,840 --> 00:58:57,639
to get the Protestant list of books? Oh there's not one in the first

674
00:58:57,639 --> 00:59:04,599
three centuries. Oh okay, so
then we can't know the canon according to

675
00:59:04,880 --> 00:59:09,679
your line of argument. You see
how silly this is. Christian bass historical

676
00:59:09,760 --> 00:59:14,920
facts like the date of Easter,
and each side appealed to Apostolic tradition to

677
00:59:14,960 --> 00:59:20,519
defenditive position. Actually, the early
Easter debates appealed to all kinds of things.

678
00:59:20,599 --> 00:59:23,800
They didn't just appeal to quote traditions. So I don't know where he

679
00:59:23,840 --> 00:59:30,280
gets the idea that Pope Victor and
the quarter deesseminarians were only appealing to quote

680
00:59:30,320 --> 00:59:32,800
traditions. I mean, the arguments
were all about all kinds of different stuff.

681
00:59:34,119 --> 00:59:38,559
And actually the arguments were about judaic
readings, right, So it's about

682
00:59:38,599 --> 00:59:45,079
whether we would celebrate Easter according to
a judaic kind of a tradition, or

683
00:59:45,159 --> 00:59:50,760
whether the Church has the authority to
decide how the calendar will go, and

684
00:59:50,920 --> 00:59:55,360
all of this constantly. You'll notice
the move of Protestants inadvertently is to always

685
00:59:55,920 --> 01:00:01,760
tend towards a judaizing tendency. They
just inadvertently automatically do it, and they're

686
01:00:01,800 --> 01:00:07,880
just rehearsing constantly ancient church heresies.
That's why protestantsm is always an historian.

687
01:00:08,320 --> 01:00:14,840
It's always tending towards Arianism. It's
always tending towards Montanism with its weird charismatic

688
01:00:14,960 --> 01:00:20,840
nonsense, gibberish, barking like dogs, rolling around acting like idiots, because

689
01:00:20,840 --> 01:00:27,119
they're just regurgitating every single ancient church
heresy in the first seven centuries. There

690
01:00:27,159 --> 01:00:30,519
is a difference between it and by
the way, there's still a difference between

691
01:00:30,519 --> 01:00:37,639
the Orthodox and the Oriental Orthodox and
the Catholics on when Eastern actually was oral

692
01:00:37,679 --> 01:00:40,559
teachings and what is that supposed to
prove? So Protestants always bring this up

693
01:00:40,559 --> 01:00:45,239
like this is some sort of will
you and Roman Catholics disagree? So what

694
01:00:47,159 --> 01:00:51,679
like? So if I found people
that disagreed with tuplus two equaling four,

695
01:00:52,280 --> 01:00:54,280
what would that have to do with
tuplus who equaling four or not? You

696
01:00:54,280 --> 01:00:58,480
see, this is just silly,
like this comes up all the time.

697
01:00:58,639 --> 01:01:01,360
I'm generally mystified. So why people
think that this is an argument or objection?

698
01:01:02,679 --> 01:01:12,400
Will people disagree? So you don't
know what straight from and the famable

699
01:01:12,400 --> 01:01:15,559
transmission process by which he is preserved. Wait a minute, so the fallible

700
01:01:15,559 --> 01:01:23,920
transmission process. So now Gavin's has
doubled down and doubly admitted that the transmission

701
01:01:24,000 --> 01:01:28,280
of these texts because he doesn't have
a time machine to go back to the

702
01:01:28,320 --> 01:01:30,800
autographa. You understand, there's no
time machine where we can get in and

703
01:01:30,840 --> 01:01:36,480
go back and see what Paul was
actually authoring. It doesn't exist. Those

704
01:01:36,480 --> 01:01:39,880
are called the autographa, the original
Apostolic text. No one has those the

705
01:01:39,920 --> 01:01:51,239
only things that exist are later copies
arranged in different collections and codesies. So

706
01:01:51,280 --> 01:01:55,039
if nobody has Paul's AUTOGRAPHA or Peter's
AUTOGRAPHA, what are we relying on?

707
01:01:55,079 --> 01:01:58,920
Oh, the church tradition. But
you just heard Gavin Ortland say that this

708
01:01:59,039 --> 01:02:05,639
is reformable and fallible. Yeah,
exactly. So every individual Protestant can study

709
01:02:05,679 --> 01:02:09,639
really hard and do a lot of
praying and prayer, praise of worship,

710
01:02:10,159 --> 01:02:15,800
do lots of praise and worship like
Poul Washer. Have you listened to a

711
01:02:15,880 --> 01:02:21,519
lot of Poul Washer. I'm going
to pass around this offering plate full of

712
01:02:21,599 --> 01:02:25,599
smooth small stones, and if I
don't preach according to that Bible over there,

713
01:02:25,639 --> 01:02:29,880
I want you to stone me.
And I'm going to cry right now

714
01:02:29,880 --> 01:02:31,920
because it's the forty five minute markt
my talk, and that's what the spirit

715
01:02:32,000 --> 01:02:37,119
moves me to cry. Give me
money, by the way, because I'm

716
01:02:37,119 --> 01:02:42,480
missionary. You give me money,
a little bit of Paul Washer. Therefore

717
01:02:42,480 --> 01:02:45,280
you, by the way, people
said, did you do your Paul Washer

718
01:02:45,280 --> 01:02:49,039
impression out your life? Event?
Yes, yes I did. I mean

719
01:02:49,039 --> 01:02:51,880
it wasn't long, but you got
you got a little dose of Paul The

720
01:02:52,039 --> 01:02:57,320
positive mechanisms of infallibility, but in
the new custody. Okay, but wait

721
01:02:57,360 --> 01:03:00,119
a minute. If there's no mechanism
of infallibility all to the post episode at

722
01:03:00,199 --> 01:03:07,280
Church, than the books that are
in this book can be reformable. Reformable

723
01:03:07,400 --> 01:03:14,800
that's the terminology of Gavin Ortlandia.
But there is not even a hint of

724
01:03:15,000 --> 01:03:22,000
any posts infallible. And I like
how this guy's whole video is just playing

725
01:03:22,039 --> 01:03:29,079
the Gavin Ortland video and him going
mmmmm mm hmmm. So again super low

726
01:03:29,119 --> 01:03:31,679
tier stuff. And I can't believe
you said that. You're so mean.

727
01:03:31,920 --> 01:03:45,199
Oh you're so mean, so mean
a faculty. I'm so mean. I'm

728
01:03:45,199 --> 01:03:50,039
so mean. I'm so mean,
also mean, I'm so I'm gonna start

729
01:03:50,119 --> 01:03:52,679
up. That's my next song.
It's gonna be an R. R.

730
01:03:52,800 --> 01:04:00,840
Kelly style song. I so mean, I'm so mean, I mean felt

731
01:04:00,880 --> 01:04:03,159
information about the offices in the nature
of the church. Nor did the only

732
01:04:03,239 --> 01:04:11,960
Church exhibit any awareness of possessing an
infallible authority. So when Athanasius speaks of

733
01:04:12,000 --> 01:04:15,960
the Holy Spirit speaking through the Council
of nicea right, So come on,

734
01:04:16,280 --> 01:04:28,440
right. And this quote here is
deceptive because Augustine talks about the authority of

735
01:04:28,480 --> 01:04:32,320
the Church. Augustine was a bishop
who believed that in his day, the

736
01:04:32,360 --> 01:04:36,840
Bishop of Rome had defined the canon
for the West right, so Pope Saint

737
01:04:36,920 --> 01:04:44,000
Damasis in Augustine's writings, had given
the church the dudoaconomical texts as part of

738
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:48,199
scripture famously. And here we have
Gavin Ortland in a very deceptive way or

739
01:04:48,280 --> 01:04:51,960
ignorant way, because all they do
is quote mine, giving a quote about

740
01:04:53,079 --> 01:04:57,360
the superiority of scripture above a letter
of a bishop. Of course, the

741
01:04:57,400 --> 01:05:01,400
scriptures are above the letter of a
bishop. That isn't but this is totally

742
01:05:01,480 --> 01:05:11,480
deceptive to act like a person who
believed in apostolic oral tradition Augustine that he

743
01:05:11,639 --> 01:05:18,039
taught solo scripture. So just remember
every time Protestants are quote mining, it's

744
01:05:18,079 --> 01:05:23,239
a lie much leader in history that
such an idea develops, and when it

745
01:05:24,119 --> 01:05:29,280
frankly doesn't have a good tracture like
extant, Ignatius says, where the bishop

746
01:05:29,400 --> 01:05:32,920
is right, there's the church.
When you hear the bishop speaking, it's

747
01:05:34,039 --> 01:05:36,760
God the Father, right, the
bishop is liking to God the Father.

748
01:05:36,840 --> 01:05:43,159
I'm not saying the bishop individually is
infallible. We don't believe that basically nobody

749
01:05:43,159 --> 01:05:45,800
believes that. Even Roman Catholics don't
believe that you know, Francis or who,

750
01:05:45,960 --> 01:05:50,039
that they're always infallible. So everybody
has strictures on this to a degree.

751
01:05:50,880 --> 01:05:57,320
Now, I think the Romancolic position
is totally inconsistent, but the Protestant

752
01:05:57,400 --> 01:06:03,199
position, which is the flip side
of the papal position, is totally incoherent

753
01:06:04,000 --> 01:06:12,039
because everything that Gavin Wrtland has said, again remember, undermines the post Episoltic

754
01:06:12,079 --> 01:06:15,079
decision of putting these books together in
the canon. And every time you bring

755
01:06:15,079 --> 01:06:17,800
this up to Protestant what do they
say. No, the scholars can tell

756
01:06:17,880 --> 01:06:24,639
us by going back to Jerome,
and this arbitrary. Why Jerome, I

757
01:06:24,639 --> 01:06:29,480
mean, Jerome doesn't teach solar scriptura. He doesn't teach he believes in absolt

758
01:06:29,519 --> 01:06:32,280
tradition. He believes in bishoprics,
he believes in the Pope of Rome,

759
01:06:33,280 --> 01:06:38,840
he believes in relics, he believes
in the perpetual virginity of Mary. He's

760
01:06:38,880 --> 01:06:48,000
got famous essays against vigilanteus. Right, So by your standards, Jerome,

761
01:06:48,159 --> 01:06:54,239
your one dude is a heretic.
He doesn't teach the Gospel of free grace,

762
01:06:54,599 --> 01:06:58,840
the Gospel of free grace, justification
by faith, the law none.

763
01:07:00,000 --> 01:07:01,920
He doesn't tease that, so he's
a heretic. Oh, but he's gonna

764
01:07:01,920 --> 01:07:05,760
give you the can So a heretic
gives you the canon. This is insane

765
01:07:06,280 --> 01:07:12,760
and it's totally deceptive. It's a
lie. That's why they have to do

766
01:07:12,800 --> 01:07:17,679
this deceptive move of going back to
the Church Fathers quote, minding them to

767
01:07:17,760 --> 01:07:23,920
make them into Protestants. But this
is actually a good thing because we forced

768
01:07:23,920 --> 01:07:29,760
the Protestants into having to now go
to the Church Fathers to try to betray

769
01:07:29,840 --> 01:07:35,400
them as proto Protestants. But that
will quickly be a failed endeavor because anytime

770
01:07:35,440 --> 01:07:40,559
you go into reading the Church Fathers, you will quickly discover just read the

771
01:07:40,559 --> 01:07:45,119
Canons of Nicea, ignorant. Slow
boys out there. I'm not talking about

772
01:07:45,480 --> 01:07:49,280
the Nicene Creed. I'm talking about
that Canons of Nicea. They don't believe

773
01:07:49,280 --> 01:07:55,039
anything like Protestants. Well, the
Church was corrupted by this side. They

774
01:07:55,079 --> 01:07:58,320
had followed away from the Bible,
but they didn't have the Bible yet,

775
01:07:58,840 --> 01:08:01,519
according to James White, so what
are they fall away from? They fell

776
01:08:01,559 --> 01:08:08,320
away from the proto canon of Malito
of Sardis Malito sartist didn't have the Protestant

777
01:08:08,320 --> 01:08:14,000
canon. Well they it was short
circuit. So again they're gonna short circuit.

778
01:08:14,079 --> 01:08:18,880
That's necessary. That's where we're going
in the process of the Protestants losing,

779
01:08:19,119 --> 01:08:24,520
and that's necessary. It's good.
There's nothing wrong with this. Now

780
01:08:24,560 --> 01:08:30,520
he's bringing up Vatican to contradiction the
Church. Yeah, well, I all

781
01:08:30,560 --> 01:08:33,840
agree with this one. So Gavin
Orlin is one point herefore pointing out the

782
01:08:33,880 --> 01:08:41,119
contradiction between cantate Domino and lemageum has
changed from allegedly infallible teaching in the medieval

783
01:08:41,119 --> 01:08:45,279
world to allegedly infallible teaching today.
Attempts to reconcile these problematic changes. Why

784
01:08:45,359 --> 01:08:51,439
is Galvin Ortland playing like Prager University
ad piano music in the background. It's

785
01:08:51,520 --> 01:08:58,079
like, is this I feel like
I'm being hypnotized by this weird piano.

786
01:08:59,000 --> 01:09:00,920
It's not an ad. Feel like
I'm watching an ad for some kind of

787
01:09:01,000 --> 01:09:05,960
like gay Silicon Valley app with this
piano music in the background. It's like

788
01:09:06,000 --> 01:09:12,560
some app that's gonna teach me where
can I find the biggest Skittles evangelical strip?

789
01:09:12,560 --> 01:09:15,840
Mall church? Right, and then
you have this piano playing Welcome to

790
01:09:15,800 --> 01:09:21,159
Gay church. We're going to find
you the greatest skittles non denominational megachurches in

791
01:09:21,199 --> 01:09:26,520
the San Francisco Bay area. Just
sign in here. And they've got this

792
01:09:27,800 --> 01:09:31,520
little piano playing in the background.
And remove the practical value of allegedly infallible

793
01:09:31,560 --> 01:09:36,720
teaching, because evidently it can be
misinterpreted. And where's Rouselan. He's just

794
01:09:38,279 --> 01:09:42,880
this whole video is him just going
like he's hungry. He's going to eat

795
01:09:42,920 --> 01:09:47,079
some some He's gonna eat him some. I don't know what a Rouslan's eat.

796
01:09:47,359 --> 01:09:50,760
I thought that sounds Russian, but
he said he's Oriental Orthodox, So

797
01:09:50,800 --> 01:09:56,920
I don't know. What does a
Ruse lawn eat. Damn, some kind

798
01:09:56,920 --> 01:10:00,800
of some kind of crouch. No, that's what Germans e, some kind

799
01:10:00,840 --> 01:10:04,720
of I don't know, some kind
of stew with water and cabbage in it.

800
01:10:04,760 --> 01:10:06,079
I don't know. Is that what
they eat? I don't know.

801
01:10:06,199 --> 01:10:13,520
Virtually everybody Ford sol is a healthy, good and necessary doctrine because it directs

802
01:10:13,600 --> 01:10:16,920
us to place our ultimate trust,
not infallible human beings who can air.

803
01:10:17,000 --> 01:10:20,760
He's gonna eat some of that Eastern
European beanstalk soup, right? Is that

804
01:10:20,760 --> 01:10:24,880
what they eat over there? But
rather than God and his word which will

805
01:10:24,920 --> 01:10:30,359
never fail us. Shout out,
so Gavin from Truth Unite. I love

806
01:10:30,399 --> 01:10:31,640
that breakdown. I think it's an
important one. And if you actually go

807
01:10:31,680 --> 01:10:36,479
back and watch more conversation with Trent
Horn, we got into Sola scripture and

808
01:10:36,479 --> 01:10:40,840
one of the things I said about
that is, I think it's easy to

809
01:10:40,880 --> 01:10:44,760
straw man Sola scripture when you're looking
at it from a when you're looking at

810
01:10:44,800 --> 01:10:47,720
the I would say, the very
like fringe fundamentalist version of it, versus

811
01:10:47,760 --> 01:10:53,800
looking at it in the context of
how Protestants have always viewed souls. Yeah,

812
01:10:53,800 --> 01:10:56,399
but that's not gonna matter because they're
both just as dumb. So no,

813
01:10:56,520 --> 01:11:01,039
that's the only you'll notice by the
way that look. I mean you're

814
01:11:01,079 --> 01:11:08,399
like, well, Jay, why
are you making this video? And you

815
01:11:08,439 --> 01:11:12,840
know, why are you laughing and
being so uncharitable and so look, we've

816
01:11:12,840 --> 01:11:16,960
been through this for many years now
pretty much in every case when I reach

817
01:11:17,000 --> 01:11:20,479
out to these people, I haven't
talked to Ruslan or anything, but I'm

818
01:11:20,479 --> 01:11:26,359
just saying, on the on the
on the average, what usually happens is

819
01:11:26,640 --> 01:11:30,239
we get people saying, yeah,
we could set this up, we could

820
01:11:30,239 --> 01:11:35,239
have this conversation we have this debate, and multiple times people have been canceled,

821
01:11:35,520 --> 01:11:40,720
right, and or they just out
of hand, no, I don't

822
01:11:40,720 --> 01:11:45,079
want anything to do with you.
And then they come up with some excuse

823
01:11:45,119 --> 01:11:48,399
that, well he's not nice enough. I'm sorry. I just this is

824
01:11:48,479 --> 01:11:54,119
just so soy and ridiculous. I
mean, let's think back to the Matt

825
01:11:54,199 --> 01:11:58,840
Frad days. Oh you mate fraid
Jake DoD will leave it, be onlaw

826
01:11:58,920 --> 01:12:03,560
Channel, be cool on just awesome. And I have this voice and people

827
01:12:03,600 --> 01:12:08,399
love it and like Crocodile Dundee and
all that stuff. Right, why would

828
01:12:08,399 --> 01:12:13,119
I hear He's mean, really mean? So the best that they've come up

829
01:12:13,119 --> 01:12:17,560
with is mean. And you know
what's funny is that? So I spent

830
01:12:17,640 --> 01:12:24,159
the whole last like three days in
Los Angeles in a bunch of comedy circles.

831
01:12:24,720 --> 01:12:26,880
So we were hanging out with all
these different comedy people, and we

832
01:12:26,920 --> 01:12:32,199
went to multiple comedy shows. And
what's funny is that in the comedy world,

833
01:12:33,720 --> 01:12:39,439
like it's standard to be roasted.
Okay, I wasn't involved in roasting,

834
01:12:39,520 --> 01:12:45,359
but people were talking about their classic
roasts. People were getting roasted.

835
01:12:45,239 --> 01:12:49,800
Sam Tripley was roasting people multiple for
like thirty minutes in two different sets.

836
01:12:50,039 --> 01:12:57,359
Okay, the comedians are roasting each
other. The only reason that Tim Gordon

837
01:12:57,359 --> 01:13:00,000
and I got to be buddies is
that we we we're roasting each other,

838
01:13:00,039 --> 01:13:01,720
make jokes, and he thought it
was funny that I was calling him the

839
01:13:01,760 --> 01:13:08,359
creed dude, and so then we
got to be So Tim is a real

840
01:13:08,399 --> 01:13:10,439
one. That's what I'm trying to
say, right, Because people that can

841
01:13:10,439 --> 01:13:17,199
take a joke and laugh, you
can already kind of tell about their personality,

842
01:13:17,840 --> 01:13:23,439
whether they're stable people or not,
and whether they can, you know,

843
01:13:25,079 --> 01:13:29,159
just freaking act normal. But most
people can't. They can't handle this.

844
01:13:29,199 --> 01:13:32,359
They're super emotional. Go watch the
video that we just posted from my

845
01:13:32,479 --> 01:13:39,000
Andrew Bustamante talk where actually the CIA
dude was saying this very thing, saying

846
01:13:39,000 --> 01:13:45,800
that people can't actually handle these challenging
situations and they become emotional, and that

847
01:13:45,359 --> 01:13:49,640
other people play on that manipulate people
through that. So all I'm trying to

848
01:13:49,640 --> 01:13:54,760
say is that this is just a
super weak excuse that people won't have those

849
01:13:54,800 --> 01:14:00,000
conversations because number one, we have
countless interviews, countless shows, countless debates

850
01:14:00,720 --> 01:14:05,640
where everything is perfectly civil, perfectly
formal, all these people will do is

851
01:14:05,640 --> 01:14:09,159
then say, oh, but look
at this blood sport that you did six

852
01:14:09,239 --> 01:14:13,039
years ago, where you're arguing with
some idiot who was acting like a complete

853
01:14:13,039 --> 01:14:16,199
idiot, and you dared to call
him a complete idiot. That's just not

854
01:14:16,319 --> 01:14:20,760
pios. I mean, it's just
disgusting. Right now, I'm not saying

855
01:14:20,840 --> 01:14:28,079
Rousselan did this. I've never talked
to Rousalan, but I'm already guessing that

856
01:14:28,119 --> 01:14:33,000
there's this convenient excuse that, well, I don't have to interact with him

857
01:14:33,000 --> 01:14:36,960
because he mean, what does it
even mean to say mean that? I

858
01:14:38,000 --> 01:14:41,680
don't even know what that means?
Mean? Is that a fat joke?

859
01:14:41,800 --> 01:14:46,119
Is that? What mean? Really? If you get your feeling term or

860
01:14:46,119 --> 01:14:49,479
a fat joke, you're not going
to be an Internet figure for very long

861
01:14:50,560 --> 01:15:00,840
because the Internet will rip you apart
for everything anyway. So and people that

862
01:15:00,920 --> 01:15:03,760
have larger size channels, they've been
ripped apart, I'm sure many many times.

863
01:15:03,960 --> 01:15:10,039
So it's not that that's the point. It's not that somehow magically mean

864
01:15:10,079 --> 01:15:13,119
and meaner than all the other people
on the internet. Shutter. That's not

865
01:15:13,199 --> 01:15:16,239
actually the case. So it's an
excuse, is what it is. And

866
01:15:16,279 --> 01:15:20,439
look, people don't want to have
their worldviews challenge. Of course not,

867
01:15:20,680 --> 01:15:24,920
and we know that, and that's
why it doesn't really bother me. I'm

868
01:15:24,920 --> 01:15:32,880
not bothered that people don't want to
talk to me because we don't have to

869
01:15:32,880 --> 01:15:38,319
have all these people right Like,
I can just put out my content and

870
01:15:38,399 --> 01:15:43,640
people can listen or not listen.
I just can't stand the piety signaling.

871
01:15:43,680 --> 01:15:45,439
Like the dudes today, the first
two dudes that we're talking about, the

872
01:15:45,479 --> 01:15:53,319
evangelical Skittles couple guy, like,
those guys talked mad crap. And then

873
01:15:54,359 --> 01:15:57,039
all I did was ask them in
the comments, would you guys like to

874
01:15:57,039 --> 01:16:01,359
come to bate? I didn't say
anything mean to them, literally nothing mean,

875
01:16:02,000 --> 01:16:05,039
would you guys like to come to
me? Because I assumed that if

876
01:16:05,079 --> 01:16:10,680
somebody does a two hour live stream
and they're talking mad crap, like,

877
01:16:10,760 --> 01:16:12,960
okay, well do they want a
debate? I guess I mean, is

878
01:16:12,960 --> 01:16:15,079
that what they're after here? Because
they're calling me out? I assume that

879
01:16:15,000 --> 01:16:18,000
that that's but no, but no, how dare you offer me a debate?

880
01:16:18,119 --> 01:16:20,680
He's like, you're a debate bro? You want dude? You're sitting

881
01:16:20,720 --> 01:16:25,039
there calling me out, and I
assume that means you want to have a

882
01:16:25,079 --> 01:16:30,359
debate. But then what I'm what
I'm learning is that people want to just

883
01:16:30,520 --> 01:16:35,199
talk smack and never have any accountability
for what they say. That's literally what

884
01:16:35,199 --> 01:16:40,920
I'm learning. In fact, one
dude like a month ago, who was

885
01:16:40,920 --> 01:16:44,439
like a young twenty year old dude. Remember when I invited that guy on

886
01:16:44,640 --> 01:16:46,479
like all the smack talkers and I
was like, so, what what are

887
01:16:46,520 --> 01:16:48,920
you mad about? He's like,
why do you reply to the people who

888
01:16:48,960 --> 01:16:53,840
talk smack to you? And I'm
like, why not? It seems like

889
01:16:53,880 --> 01:16:56,680
they want He's like, that's what
is supposed to happen. I'm like,

890
01:16:56,720 --> 01:16:59,239
what do you mean that's what's supposed
to happen. He's like, there's we're

891
01:16:59,279 --> 01:17:02,920
supposed to try to tear you down
and you are not supposed to respond to

892
01:17:03,000 --> 01:17:06,439
us. That's literally what he said. And I'm like, what so you

893
01:17:06,520 --> 01:17:11,520
ever said? Howpathetic? That sounds
like you want to be able to say

894
01:17:11,560 --> 01:17:17,640
anything with absolutely no consequences and no
accountability for the claims that you say.

895
01:17:17,760 --> 01:17:21,520
And I think that's actually the case. That's what this is. People don't

896
01:17:21,560 --> 01:17:28,399
want they're not even man enough to
like just deal with the challenges and the

897
01:17:28,439 --> 01:17:40,720
argumentation anyway. All right, So
that's Ruslan in this first argument. This

898
01:17:40,760 --> 01:17:43,279
one is kind of long, so
I'm not gonna play this. We're gonna

899
01:17:43,279 --> 01:17:45,079
go ahead and probably open it up. We got a lot of people in

900
01:17:45,119 --> 01:17:48,520
the chat here. If you have
questions, challenges, issues, topics,

901
01:17:48,560 --> 01:17:57,840
debates, We've got a nice over
thousand today. Boom roasted exactly exactly.

902
01:17:58,640 --> 01:18:00,119
I've invited people to come on and
roast me. I don't care like it

903
01:18:00,159 --> 01:18:02,840
doesn't If you hang out with a
bunch of comedians, you're gonna get roasted

904
01:18:03,000 --> 01:18:08,720
and it's fun. Like, I
don't understand why people don't want to enjoy

905
01:18:09,000 --> 01:18:13,279
the creativity that goes into roasting.
Remember that one dude called in or no,

906
01:18:13,399 --> 01:18:15,600
Austin, it was Austin Peterson.
Forget it. I'm like, dude,

907
01:18:15,720 --> 01:18:17,000
let me help you out to roast
me. Like you're trying to roast

908
01:18:17,000 --> 01:18:20,560
me. He's like, you look
like you stink and you don't have showers.

909
01:18:20,560 --> 01:18:23,319
I'm like, dude, you could
at least make fun of my rebel

910
01:18:23,359 --> 01:18:27,279
tooth, Like I got a rebellious
tooth over here. I've made fun of

911
01:18:27,319 --> 01:18:29,960
that, and you're over here making
like fourth grade jokes. Come on,

912
01:18:30,000 --> 01:18:32,680
man, you gotta step it up. Base philosophies ys are five dollars.

913
01:18:32,680 --> 01:18:34,880
I'm not gonna say around for the
stream, but I want to shout you

914
01:18:34,920 --> 01:18:42,960
out, all right, doll TND
five dollars. If Hellenic and religious platonic

915
01:18:43,000 --> 01:18:45,840
philosophy dismisses the material world as fake
and gray, that's not what he said.

916
01:18:45,880 --> 01:18:49,039
I had to that. Why was
there so much emphasis on physical beauty,

917
01:18:49,039 --> 01:18:57,600
strength and power and martial values and
athleticism. So Hellenic philosophy is not

918
01:18:57,760 --> 01:19:03,000
a monolithic thing. So certain philosophers
would have been more hedonistic and would have

919
01:19:03,000 --> 01:19:06,039
been maybe stoic, and would have
emphasized those things. Could you make me

920
01:19:06,079 --> 01:19:12,520
one more coffee before you go?
Thank you? So there were hedonists.

921
01:19:13,119 --> 01:19:18,119
There were Epicureans who would have been
absolutely pro physical beauty. They were not

922
01:19:19,199 --> 01:19:24,399
degenerates like a lot of people think
Epicureanism is like totally no. No.

923
01:19:24,439 --> 01:19:29,800
I mean to the Epicureans, the
height of pleasure would be like, you

924
01:19:29,800 --> 01:19:33,039
know, wine and cheese in a
philosophical conversation. But they didn't think that

925
01:19:33,079 --> 01:19:39,359
physical beauty, strength and power were
like bad. So Hellenic philosophy is not

926
01:19:39,439 --> 01:19:44,479
a monolithic thing. And I think
Aristotle would be very pro body. But

927
01:19:44,840 --> 01:19:50,520
it's Neil Platonism, Platonic strands that
emphasized the transcendent to the negation of the

928
01:19:50,520 --> 01:19:54,399
here and the now. That would
be the people engaged in that. And

929
01:19:54,399 --> 01:19:59,000
I would say that the Orthodox tradition, how could we be anti matter when

930
01:19:59,159 --> 01:20:02,159
the God of the universe assumed matter? Shawn two dollars. If the Kingdom

931
01:20:02,199 --> 01:20:05,680
is the Church, why is it
Christ of the Church is within us in

932
01:20:05,760 --> 01:20:10,039
Luke seventeen twenty one. That's because
it's both, right, So it's not

933
01:20:10,079 --> 01:20:13,119
in either or. The Kingdom is
the presence of the Holy Spirit. That's

934
01:20:13,119 --> 01:20:15,399
why Pentecost is so important to the
life of the Church. So the Holy

935
01:20:15,439 --> 01:20:18,560
Spirit dwells in us, in our
in our hearts, and in the Church

936
01:20:18,600 --> 01:20:25,760
as a collective body. Jesus says
it's within us, which sounds like Protestantism.

937
01:20:25,880 --> 01:20:30,880
No, why would I mean,
every Christian tradition out there would believe

938
01:20:30,960 --> 01:20:38,279
that the Holy Spirit is within us, So how would the verse be quote

939
01:20:38,319 --> 01:20:43,279
Protestant. There's no Protestant verses that
doesn't exist. So what I'm saying is

940
01:20:43,279 --> 01:20:50,159
that the Holy Spirit dwelling within us
does not mean that there's no external reality

941
01:20:50,199 --> 01:20:54,720
of the Holy Spirit. Right,
So what Protestism typically does is it takes

942
01:20:54,760 --> 01:21:00,279
one verse and it exclusivizes that verse
and excludes all the others. Right,

943
01:21:00,359 --> 01:21:03,600
So Jesus says that the gates of
Hell would not prevail against the Kingdom,

944
01:21:03,880 --> 01:21:09,920
which is a collective body the Church. Paul says in his letters that you

945
01:21:10,000 --> 01:21:13,279
are the body of Christ. He
says, the church at Ephesus, you

946
01:21:13,319 --> 01:21:16,479
are the body. He doesn't say
that it's an invisible body. He says,

947
01:21:16,520 --> 01:21:20,600
the actual physical group that meets at
Ephesus, you are the body of

948
01:21:20,680 --> 01:21:28,039
Christ. So it's not and cannot
be an invisible church. Icono Matt five

949
01:21:28,079 --> 01:21:30,039
dollars. I love your stuff.
My cousin is Protestant, and he was

950
01:21:30,079 --> 01:21:34,560
saying that the Book of Acts,
every time the apostles baptize, they do

951
01:21:34,600 --> 01:21:38,760
it in the name of Jesus and
not the Trinity. That's just a stand

952
01:21:38,800 --> 01:21:41,600
in, Okay, Does it literally
mean that they only repeat the name of

953
01:21:41,680 --> 01:21:45,960
Jesus. H And again, I
mean, I think that there's way more

954
01:21:45,960 --> 01:21:50,560
fundamental issues with your oneness, Pentecostal
friend there, which would be the Trinity

955
01:21:50,600 --> 01:21:54,760
itself. So rather than debating about
the name of Jesus the Book of Acts,

956
01:21:55,680 --> 01:21:58,760
we need to start talking about the
Trinity. Okay, in the Book

957
01:21:58,760 --> 01:22:02,199
of John. Just take your buddy
through, you know, John fourteen to

958
01:22:02,279 --> 01:22:06,000
seventeen and look at all the references
to Father, Son and Spirit in those

959
01:22:06,000 --> 01:22:10,920
passages. Those are the most trinitarian
passages. In fact, I've lectured through

960
01:22:10,960 --> 01:22:14,640
the entire Gospel of John. Like
these goober Protestants who said that, I

961
01:22:14,720 --> 01:22:16,880
quote, never go to the Bible, We've lectured through the entire Book of

962
01:22:16,920 --> 01:22:21,520
Genesis. We've lectured through the entire
Book of John. And every chapter of

963
01:22:21,560 --> 01:22:28,279
the Book of John includes deity of
Christ and or Trinity. J I T

964
01:22:28,520 --> 01:22:32,199
S two Q two dollars, Hi, J thank you, JITs to Q

965
01:22:34,000 --> 01:22:39,199
storm the cap five dollars in June
too. There looks like Taoist influence.

966
01:22:39,359 --> 01:22:44,640
I would not be surprised because they
talk about the religion is Zen Sunni,

967
01:22:45,560 --> 01:22:50,600
is Zen Sunni Catholicism. So it's
a perennialus merged type of thing, and

968
01:22:50,840 --> 01:22:56,199
I've talked about that extensively. This
is because of the legend of Lao Zi.

969
01:22:57,119 --> 01:23:00,600
He had knowledge and wisdom of an
enlightened philosopher and his and his mom's

970
01:23:00,640 --> 01:23:04,399
womb before he was born. And
this is like Alia Paul's sister. Absolutely,

971
01:23:04,520 --> 01:23:09,880
I think you're a spot on there. You know, Dune definitely borrows

972
01:23:09,920 --> 01:23:14,760
Frank Herbert borrows from multiple religious traditions. Arena Dacian blood. By the way,

973
01:23:14,880 --> 01:23:18,520
that's a good point because I actually
forgot to mention the zen elements in

974
01:23:20,520 --> 01:23:25,520
my Dinge andn elyses, So thank
you for pointing Arena Dacian blood. Three

975
01:23:25,560 --> 01:23:29,000
dollars. What's the What is going
on with the OCA? I have no

976
01:23:29,039 --> 01:23:31,159
idea, so I'm not in the
OCA. Couldn't tell you. Can you

977
01:23:31,279 --> 01:23:36,600
update about Bishop Gilitzen. I don't
know anything about it. Couldn't tell you

978
01:23:36,640 --> 01:23:44,119
what's going on. I would say, rather than worrying about jurisdictions per se,

979
01:23:44,880 --> 01:23:46,520
you know, in terms of your
saying worsh I go to church,

980
01:23:47,119 --> 01:23:53,680
just visit the local churches and find
out which of the local priests is the

981
01:23:53,720 --> 01:23:56,960
best fit for you, and I
wouldn't worry so much about jurisdictions. Alula

982
01:23:57,039 --> 01:24:01,560
five dollars. Jay, I wanted
to say that the Protestants that you're talking

983
01:24:01,560 --> 01:24:04,800
about here are cowards and they're not
men worthy of any respect. You know,

984
01:24:04,840 --> 01:24:08,720
this is typically what happens, and
that's what I'm getting at here is.

985
01:24:08,760 --> 01:24:12,359
I'm not about rouse Lam, but
the two guys the beginning who basically

986
01:24:12,439 --> 01:24:15,720
made an entire podcast and all these
clips about how awful I am and all

987
01:24:15,720 --> 01:24:19,520
this stuff. And then I,
in a very kind, polite didn't say

988
01:24:19,520 --> 01:24:23,520
anything mean way, asked them to
come in debate, and then they lie

989
01:24:23,560 --> 01:24:26,439
and they run away. So that's
exactly what they're snakes and cowards exactly.

990
01:24:26,560 --> 01:24:30,560
Chase Haggard three dollars. I debated
Matt Slick a few nights ago. Oh,

991
01:24:30,720 --> 01:24:33,680
interesting to know that he rambled and
appealed to I know what the interpretation

992
01:24:33,800 --> 01:24:36,039
is because I read it. Yeah, so the text means what it says,

993
01:24:36,039 --> 01:24:42,760
says what it means. Very naive
approach to how interpretation actually works.

994
01:24:43,800 --> 01:24:47,920
He appealed to his autism. I
don't understand how people are trying to defend

995
01:24:47,920 --> 01:24:54,800
this. Actually, I would rather
Matt Slick appeal to the tism than to

996
01:24:54,840 --> 01:24:59,199
the spirit, because in his debate
with Father Deacon and Aias he appealed to

997
01:24:59,279 --> 01:25:03,039
the Holy Spirit. Maybe he's confusing
the two comfy friend three dollars. Did

998
01:25:03,039 --> 01:25:06,880
you see that Father Stevens, I
don't know who Father Stevens is had a

999
01:25:06,880 --> 01:25:11,760
conversation with Gavin Orland. I have
not Oh you mean father Stephen to young.

1000
01:25:12,560 --> 01:25:15,359
I have not watched that yet.
It was a conversation, but Father

1001
01:25:15,640 --> 01:25:18,600
made Gavin's position look silly. Oh
good glad he No, I've not seen

1002
01:25:18,640 --> 01:25:21,840
that dation blood three dollars, Jay, would you consider making a few videos

1003
01:25:21,920 --> 01:25:28,560
on Orthodox spirituality. I'm not your
spiritual father, so probably not. And

1004
01:25:28,600 --> 01:25:30,520
then you get into moral issues and
all this kind of stuff. Now it's

1005
01:25:30,560 --> 01:25:40,960
not The people have roles and things
that are appropriate to them, and that's

1006
01:25:40,960 --> 01:25:45,520
not appropriate for me. Five gives
five dollars. This is a salute to

1007
01:25:45,039 --> 01:25:54,039
mauger In Christ from Jipiland, Romania. Okay, thank you, Logan Daily

1008
01:25:54,079 --> 01:25:58,720
five dollars. Who are the final
bosses of Protestant and papal apologetics? Will

1009
01:25:58,720 --> 01:26:01,600
you ever get to refute them?
Well? I guess. I mean,

1010
01:26:01,960 --> 01:26:14,000
I thought James White performed pretty poorly
against Trent Horn. Thank you. I

1011
01:26:14,000 --> 01:26:16,000
can't, I mean, can anyway? I feel like we already know who

1012
01:26:16,039 --> 01:26:19,159
the final bosses would be. I
mean, but James White doesn't do a

1013
01:26:19,159 --> 01:26:25,600
whole lot of debates as much.
I don't think he won his Trent Horn

1014
01:26:25,640 --> 01:26:28,720
debate. That doesn't mean that I
think Roman catholsy. I actually think the

1015
01:26:28,760 --> 01:26:33,079
funny part about the Trent Horne James
White debate was that James White brought up

1016
01:26:33,199 --> 01:26:39,840
great contradictions in Rumman Catholic dogma changing
towards the end of the debate, But

1017
01:26:39,920 --> 01:26:42,760
that wasn't the topic of the debate. The topic of the debate was sole

1018
01:26:42,800 --> 01:26:48,560
scriptura. So yeah, so I
guess James White is the final boss of

1019
01:26:48,640 --> 01:26:53,840
Protestant apologetics. I don't know who
else. I mean, if this is

1020
01:26:53,880 --> 01:26:57,880
the best that Gavin Ortland has that
was super weak, who's the best of

1021
01:26:57,920 --> 01:27:09,800
papal apologetics? I don't know.
You tell me, I mean, is

1022
01:27:09,840 --> 01:27:19,880
it what? By the way,
I guess Luigi debated. I forget the

1023
01:27:19,920 --> 01:27:26,560
hispanic dude's name, but he's like
he's at Barr's disciple, and Luigi debated

1024
01:27:26,640 --> 01:27:29,479
him, and Luigi and I are
going to be doing a debate review this

1025
01:27:29,560 --> 01:27:33,000
weekend. But I don't that that
guy wouldn't be the final boss. I

1026
01:27:33,000 --> 01:27:35,319
don't even know, you guys,
tell me who the final boss is?

1027
01:27:35,520 --> 01:27:39,000
Who's even left? Is it?
I guess it's just Trent. I mean,

1028
01:27:39,760 --> 01:27:45,439
is there anybody else that's better at
papal apologetics than Trent, I mean

1029
01:27:47,079 --> 01:27:50,439
Taylor Marshall. I mean Taylor Marshall
doesn't do debates, so how is he

1030
01:27:50,479 --> 01:27:55,600
the best? I mean I asked
Taylor Marshall to debate and he blocked me.

1031
01:27:55,680 --> 01:28:00,279
So what do you what does that
tell you? DC? What working?

1032
01:28:00,319 --> 01:28:02,880
Five dollars? Thank you so much, Petro Guard five dollars, Sola,

1033
01:28:03,039 --> 01:28:10,560
nub Tura, We follow the nub
alone. I did integrate a little

1034
01:28:10,560 --> 01:28:15,479
bit of Richard Dawkin's nub into my
impression stand up routine, so thank you

1035
01:28:15,520 --> 01:28:21,079
for that, Gigo, five dollars. Given the doctrine of deification of creations,

1036
01:28:21,119 --> 01:28:25,800
such as it relating to icons,
crosses, and relics, why would

1037
01:28:25,800 --> 01:28:29,199
you not wear one hundred cross and
necklaces and cover your house with icons?

1038
01:28:30,479 --> 01:28:33,680
You should and so you would.
You would then look like basically an orthodox

1039
01:28:33,720 --> 01:28:38,680
flave of flave, and that is
what I advocate. JITs two, Q

1040
01:28:38,920 --> 01:28:44,159
two dollars. What are your three
biggest tips that you would tell yourself if

1041
01:28:44,199 --> 01:28:45,960
you were eighteen? Again, Oh, that's a good question. Then we're

1042
01:28:45,960 --> 01:28:49,800
going to open it up to Q
and A. Here we got several people

1043
01:28:49,840 --> 01:28:56,399
here in the chat. Shout out
to our bros and sisters. In the

1044
01:28:56,520 --> 01:29:01,039
chat on x So if you want
to ask your questions, bring your comments

1045
01:29:01,039 --> 01:29:06,640
and your challenges, you can do
that through the link in the show description

1046
01:29:08,399 --> 01:29:15,840
Twitter space, so you call in
through the Twitter space right here. So

1047
01:29:15,880 --> 01:29:19,359
the nub thing comes from. I
didn't even realize this until Jamie was talking

1048
01:29:19,359 --> 01:29:24,479
about it in her chat, but
basically because of the joke I guess that

1049
01:29:24,560 --> 01:29:32,199
I made a while back that because
you know Richard Dawkins defending like evolutionary theory,

1050
01:29:32,279 --> 01:29:38,039
and the whole idea is that the
mutations that occur that continue on are

1051
01:29:38,079 --> 01:29:42,680
for the advantage of the species.
And my joke was, okay, well,

1052
01:29:42,720 --> 01:29:45,359
what does one eighth of a ppe
do? Right? Like? What

1053
01:29:45,439 --> 01:29:47,840
advantage is one eighth of a pepe? Maybe Richard Dawkins knows from experience,

1054
01:29:47,920 --> 01:29:51,640
right, But like a nub?
Like what advantage are you gonna get from

1055
01:29:51,640 --> 01:29:56,119
a nub? Right? Like?
What is one sixtieth of a teat of

1056
01:29:56,159 --> 01:30:00,000
a breast? How does that an
advantage to the species? You see?

1057
01:30:00,039 --> 01:30:02,279
You see how silly this is?
Anyway, So I did include some of

1058
01:30:02,319 --> 01:30:11,640
that in my routine. But my
three biggest tips. First biggest tip would

1059
01:30:11,640 --> 01:30:14,960
be one hundred dollars. Second,
biggest tip would be two hundred dollars and

1060
01:30:15,000 --> 01:30:20,720
the third biggest tip would be bitcoin. So those three tips, just kidding,

1061
01:30:21,199 --> 01:30:31,520
three tips. Don't go to college, start your own business, and

1062
01:30:31,600 --> 01:30:34,840
buy bitcoin. How's that be?
Like? What? What is bitcoin?

1063
01:30:35,399 --> 01:30:42,000
This is the year nineteen ninety eight. How do we just just listen for

1064
01:30:42,119 --> 01:30:45,039
this and when you hear it,
buy it? So go on the nerd

1065
01:30:45,079 --> 01:30:51,279
forums, in the freaking Pokemon card
forums or wherever you get that stuff and

1066
01:30:51,319 --> 01:30:57,199
buy bit. There you go,
And so what's my what's my uh advice?

1067
01:30:57,479 --> 01:31:00,680
Today? The same stuff? All
right, So we're gonna open it

1068
01:31:00,800 --> 01:31:10,239
up. If you would like to
come on. You can ask a question,

1069
01:31:10,359 --> 01:31:13,880
you can make an argument. That
doesn't mean argue with me. That

1070
01:31:13,960 --> 01:31:18,359
means make an argument. And to
make an argument means that you have a

1071
01:31:18,399 --> 01:31:26,760
premise, you have supporting evidence,
and you come to some kind of conclusion

1072
01:31:26,760 --> 01:31:30,640
on the basis of those things.
It does not mean that you machine guns

1073
01:31:30,680 --> 01:31:35,880
spit out your position. It doesn't
mean that your machine guns spit out to

1074
01:31:35,920 --> 01:31:44,600
me. The history of Wakanda and
the pyramids and how we was kings and

1075
01:31:44,640 --> 01:31:49,159
the ancient Hebrew Nephelin god. People
could fly the pyramids around I'm not joking

1076
01:31:49,159 --> 01:31:54,159
because every time I do this we
get this guy, multiple of those kinds

1077
01:31:54,159 --> 01:31:56,560
of dudes. I don't need to
care. I don't care about your hermetic,

1078
01:31:56,600 --> 01:32:00,760
alchemical, esoteric gibberish. I don't
believe it. I don't want to

1079
01:32:00,800 --> 01:32:04,479
hear about that. I want to
hear the argument for it. Those are

1080
01:32:04,479 --> 01:32:12,239
two different things. An argument is
not a story. Well, we have

1081
01:32:12,319 --> 01:32:17,119
an ancient lineage where the gods.
That's a story. What's the argument for

1082
01:32:17,159 --> 01:32:24,319
that? So the way it goes
is your request to speak. I'll give

1083
01:32:24,359 --> 01:32:27,000
you a microphone. Next up as
first up as sperguio. What's up?

1084
01:32:27,039 --> 01:32:35,680
Spurgio a Spurgio? Are you blueberl
Abril? What's going on? Bro?

1085
01:32:35,800 --> 01:32:41,279
You got to unmute. What's up? Man? So? Are your Orthodoxy

1086
01:32:41,439 --> 01:32:45,079
correct? Yes, sir, I
am Orthodoxy. I am all of Orthodoxy.

1087
01:32:45,039 --> 01:32:48,479
Okay, good. So I don't
want to say that I'm Protestant or

1088
01:32:48,800 --> 01:32:54,239
Orthodoxy or a Catholic. I'll usually
just call myself a polar it's just Orthodoxy.

1089
01:32:54,439 --> 01:33:00,079
Yeah. So my thing against Orthodoxy
is that a lot of the uh

1090
01:33:00,359 --> 01:33:05,399
whatever they came together during during the
meetings to decide what was going to be

1091
01:33:05,520 --> 01:33:09,439
you know, put into the Bible, or what we would all agree on

1092
01:33:09,520 --> 01:33:15,039
should be agreed upon all together.
It was usually based upon dreams, like

1093
01:33:15,159 --> 01:33:17,079
all all they would all have.
They would all come together every day and

1094
01:33:17,119 --> 01:33:20,319
they would talk about their dreams,
and if certain people had dreams that matched

1095
01:33:20,399 --> 01:33:27,600
up, then that would help them
to decide what was going to uh you

1096
01:33:27,640 --> 01:33:30,920
know, be a part of the
I'm gonna assume that that was a troll

1097
01:33:31,159 --> 01:33:38,800
because that's just that was so silly. Uh fda, you don't have the

1098
01:33:38,840 --> 01:33:43,560
request to speak. I've already I've
already sent you the the invite to co

1099
01:33:43,680 --> 01:33:47,319
host. Yes, all, yeah, all the ecumenical councils were just people

1100
01:33:47,319 --> 01:33:53,640
coming together on the basis of dreams. Basically just a big psychoanalysis, you

1101
01:33:53,680 --> 01:34:05,560
know. Uh the Seymour h m
hmm. It was a very odd trolling

1102
01:34:06,079 --> 01:34:15,720
dreams. You gotta unmute Seymour,
feed me Seymour, feed me Seymour on

1103
01:34:16,000 --> 01:34:30,000
mute or don't so you don't have
to request this. Father Diggan, do

1104
01:34:30,039 --> 01:34:31,880
you want to come on or let
me see if I can do it a

1105
01:34:31,880 --> 01:34:40,600
different way. There we go.
Next up is hex Nube. Sorry,

1106
01:34:40,880 --> 01:34:44,479
I don't know what happened, alright, you're on here, hex Nube.

1107
01:34:44,479 --> 01:34:59,399
What's up? Man? I'm mute, uh mute. I want to un

1108
01:34:59,560 --> 01:35:03,520
mute my soul for you. I
want to on me my soul. Lord.

1109
01:35:03,840 --> 01:35:10,560
Yep, sorry about that. Just
had a question, how would you

1110
01:35:10,640 --> 01:35:15,359
respond to Calvinists that appeal to Augustine's
view of predestination? And can you go

1111
01:35:15,560 --> 01:35:20,039
a little bit can you go into
a little bit of how Calvinists are considered

1112
01:35:20,079 --> 01:35:27,560
a historian, Sure, so it
is true that Augustine teaches double predestine well

1113
01:35:28,199 --> 01:35:31,279
single predestination, and then kind of
I wouldn't say double predestination, but he

1114
01:35:31,279 --> 01:35:35,800
doesn't have a problem basically saying that
the number of the elect is fixed so

1115
01:35:35,880 --> 01:35:43,000
to be precise single predestination. But
we also think he taught other mistakes as

1116
01:35:43,039 --> 01:35:46,880
well, and the error on predestination
has to do with his view of divine

1117
01:35:46,880 --> 01:35:51,720
simplicity. So, starting with reasoning
about God from the divine essence, which

1118
01:35:51,760 --> 01:35:56,600
you see all throughout the Confessions,
he has a lot of problems. For

1119
01:35:56,640 --> 01:35:59,840
example, and he expresses us in
Confessions he says, I don't understand how

1120
01:36:00,319 --> 01:36:04,680
an eternal, absolutely simple God could
act in time and space and do different

1121
01:36:04,720 --> 01:36:09,319
actions. And so for example,
we see that Gregor Palomos, when he's

1122
01:36:09,319 --> 01:36:13,560
debating with Barleam, says that God
rested on the seventh day from his work

1123
01:36:13,600 --> 01:36:16,079
of creation. So clearly the work
of creation is not the same as the

1124
01:36:16,119 --> 01:36:19,319
work of walking on water. They're
two different actions of God. So we

1125
01:36:19,359 --> 01:36:23,399
have to have an essence centergy distinction. Augustine does not teach the essen sentergy

1126
01:36:23,399 --> 01:36:28,199
distinction. But also strictly in terms
of predestination, the order is out of

1127
01:36:28,199 --> 01:36:31,920
whack. So the order of theology, like the Protestants do, begins with

1128
01:36:32,439 --> 01:36:36,720
the divine essence and the divine decree. We're not told about the divine decree.

1129
01:36:36,800 --> 01:36:42,800
We're told about Christ the Trinity.
So theology begins with the Trinity,

1130
01:36:43,199 --> 01:36:45,680
and then it moves to Christology.
And that's the actual process of the ecumenical

1131
01:36:45,720 --> 01:36:53,000
councils. And unfortunately, Augustinian theology, I should say fortunately, not unfortunately,

1132
01:36:53,079 --> 01:36:56,800
Augustine theology is not what's accepted as
the ecumenical teaching on the Trinity.

1133
01:36:56,880 --> 01:37:01,840
It's the Cappadocian teaching. So constant
to double one is the Cappadocian Trinitarian model

1134
01:37:01,840 --> 01:37:09,880
that's accepted for the Church. The
West professes to accept that and by the

1135
01:37:09,880 --> 01:37:12,840
time we get to the late Middle
Ages, it has already gone off into

1136
01:37:13,039 --> 01:37:16,720
deviating into the doctrines of the Filioque
and beginning to adopt to create a grace.

1137
01:37:16,760 --> 01:37:19,159
I'm not saying that all the West
was lost. I'm just saying that

1138
01:37:19,159 --> 01:37:23,600
that's the direction it goes. In
part of the reason that it's a Nestorian

1139
01:37:23,840 --> 01:37:27,680
or proto and Hisstorian would be the
idea that Christ, as Augustine says,

1140
01:37:27,720 --> 01:37:35,119
is the predestined man. And so
you can't predicate to Christ's humanity a predestined

1141
01:37:35,239 --> 01:37:40,119
status as if he's not the second
person of the godhood, as a godhead,

1142
01:37:40,159 --> 01:37:43,640
as this subject. So it's a
Nestorian in that regard. And the

1143
01:37:43,720 --> 01:37:47,239
question then is well, what happens
on the cross? So in Augustinian theology

1144
01:37:47,279 --> 01:37:54,079
you lose the cosmic scope of Christ
being the assumer of universal human nature.

1145
01:37:54,680 --> 01:37:59,039
Augustine doesn't believe that there's any connection
directly between Christ's assumption of human nature and

1146
01:37:59,079 --> 01:38:01,880
the reprobate, So why are the
reprobate resurrected? And you see him in

1147
01:38:02,239 --> 01:38:04,840
later on in the City of God
he struggles with us, and the same

1148
01:38:04,880 --> 01:38:11,039
problem applies to the Calvinists, why
would the reprobate be resurrected so they don't

1149
01:38:11,039 --> 01:38:14,960
have a cosmic scope of Christ's redemption, and assuming of all human nature.

1150
01:38:15,319 --> 01:38:17,479
If you understand that Christ assumes universal
human nature and that's why all humans are

1151
01:38:17,520 --> 01:38:21,560
resurrected, this would cancel out limited
atonement. It would cancel out the notion

1152
01:38:21,680 --> 01:38:29,079
that Christ only dies for a predestined
elect So those are a myriad of issues

1153
01:38:29,119 --> 01:38:32,840
and problems there that would make Nestorianism
ultimately. Calvin is ultimately the stumber,

1154
01:38:33,039 --> 01:38:39,199
the key killer. The kill shot
is actually the idea that Christ is damned

1155
01:38:39,239 --> 01:38:43,359
on the cross to pay the penalty
for the rest of us, and that

1156
01:38:43,399 --> 01:38:46,840
would be a Nestorian if you believe
that Christ is a human person who is

1157
01:38:46,880 --> 01:38:51,600
the subject of the damn nation,
that would split the hyposthetic union. Or

1158
01:38:51,840 --> 01:38:57,319
you are Arian if you believe that
Jesus is a human person or a creature

1159
01:38:57,359 --> 01:38:59,800
that gets damned by God the Father, and then you split the trinity.

1160
01:39:00,039 --> 01:39:04,319
Either of those are devastating. Got
it? Thanks a lot man, Yeah,

1161
01:39:04,399 --> 01:39:08,439
good question, And for those who
want a fuller treatment of that,

1162
01:39:08,840 --> 01:39:14,640
I've done multiple live streams for multiple
hours dissecting Calvinism Just type in Jay Dire

1163
01:39:14,680 --> 01:39:17,960
Comic Calvinism. You'll get the talks
on David Patrick Harry's channel. You'll get

1164
01:39:17,960 --> 01:39:21,640
the talk the five six hours on
Sam Shummuon's channel. So we've covered the

1165
01:39:23,159 --> 01:39:27,800
specifics of Calvinism and Augustinianism. I've
got hours of talks on Augustin again,

1166
01:39:27,840 --> 01:39:42,640
it's all on my channel. Next
up is Big Brain Bear. You gotta

1167
01:39:42,680 --> 01:39:49,000
unmute, bro. I wanna unmute
my soul for you. I wanna unmute

1168
01:39:49,000 --> 01:39:55,239
your soul. Oh yeah, sing
a praise and worship style. I'm gonna

1169
01:39:55,239 --> 01:40:00,960
come out with a praising worship album. Next, go ahead, big Lee,

1170
01:40:01,560 --> 01:40:15,119
big lead chew. All right,
no sound. We'll move on leaks

1171
01:40:15,159 --> 01:40:18,000
and freaks. That's what I'm talking
about. Leaks and freaks up in here.

1172
01:40:23,520 --> 01:40:31,439
I want to I'm mute my soul
for you. Hm, you gotta

1173
01:40:31,479 --> 01:40:41,319
un mute leaks, Guys, I'm
mute yourself to day. I had a

1174
01:40:41,439 --> 01:40:45,840
question about conscience because growing up,
I grew up in a reform tradition and

1175
01:40:45,880 --> 01:40:49,199
you ain't got one. You ain't
got one. Can you hear me?

1176
01:40:49,880 --> 01:40:55,960
Hello, it's just a joke,
man, Go ahead, Oh my bad.

1177
01:40:56,159 --> 01:40:58,840
Yeah, I grew up in a
reform environment and the freedom of conscience

1178
01:40:58,880 --> 01:41:02,039
thing where you have to you fully
assent to it. Oh yeah, have

1179
01:41:02,079 --> 01:41:06,760
all logical connections speed in your Mind's
a big thing growing up. And I'm

1180
01:41:06,840 --> 01:41:14,439
kind of wondering now as I've grown
and I'm definitely veering towards orthodoxy if there

1181
01:41:14,479 --> 01:41:23,479
are certain elements that that you don't
you haven't made the logical connections yet in

1182
01:41:23,520 --> 01:41:27,439
your mind, and you don't fully
have that like gun agreement with it,

1183
01:41:27,800 --> 01:41:30,840
what is the freedom of conscience deal
with that? Because I know for telementist

1184
01:41:30,960 --> 01:41:33,800
is a big deal where it's like
you don't if you don't have that,

1185
01:41:33,920 --> 01:41:38,920
you can't you shouldn't be assented to
it. You know, well, I

1186
01:41:38,920 --> 01:41:44,880
would agree you shouldn't assent to orthodoxy
if your conscience is still not convinced.

1187
01:41:45,000 --> 01:41:48,880
So I don't have a problem admitting
that, Like I wouldn't want people to

1188
01:41:48,920 --> 01:41:53,279
I wouldn't want to like mind control
people into becoming Orthodox and then against their

1189
01:41:53,319 --> 01:41:55,399
will and then they wake up they're
like, oh, I don't believe this,

1190
01:41:56,039 --> 01:42:02,560
So so we could affirm freedom of
conscient and the notion of authority.

1191
01:42:02,640 --> 01:42:08,560
So I don't think those things are
like in contradiction, because I mean,

1192
01:42:08,600 --> 01:42:11,600
don't you if you just think about
the Bible itself, right, I mean,

1193
01:42:11,720 --> 01:42:15,119
you have the same issue with the
Bible. So if you're a Protestant,

1194
01:42:15,399 --> 01:42:20,920
you've got all kinds of different Protestant
interpretations. Should I believe this one

1195
01:42:20,960 --> 01:42:25,239
that my pastor has, Should I
believe the pastor down the road? Should

1196
01:42:25,319 --> 01:42:30,359
I believe the woman pastor down the
road that's going to marry? The method?

1197
01:42:30,600 --> 01:42:35,640
Method ministries bros. I mean,
what you know, you're not gonna

1198
01:42:36,039 --> 01:42:44,359
You're not in any different position than
anyone else by having to adjudicate between conflicting

1199
01:42:44,479 --> 01:42:51,239
positions, and that doesn't violate your
freedom of conscience. So I mean,

1200
01:42:51,239 --> 01:42:57,960
if I understand what you're asking,
you're asking like the Protestant doctrines of freedom

1201
01:42:57,960 --> 01:43:01,279
of worship and freedom of conscience typically
go to go together. I just don't.

1202
01:43:01,399 --> 01:43:04,159
I don't see how that's really Like, are you just saying that if

1203
01:43:04,199 --> 01:43:06,920
I'm not convinced of all the orthodox
positions of my conscience, should I not

1204
01:43:06,960 --> 01:43:10,279
convert? I would say no,
you shouldn't. You should be convinced.

1205
01:43:10,640 --> 01:43:14,159
You should take your time, Okay. So to clarify, like, if

1206
01:43:14,199 --> 01:43:19,760
we're talking about the the door mission
or some of the Marian stuff obviously and

1207
01:43:19,960 --> 01:43:26,159
very harsh. Yeah, or the
perpetual virginity of Mary. Let's use that

1208
01:43:26,199 --> 01:43:29,520
as an example. Okay, if
that's something that you're kind of like,

1209
01:43:29,600 --> 01:43:32,399
Okay, well I don't it's not
a big issue for me. I kind

1210
01:43:32,439 --> 01:43:36,399
of don't believe that she never had
sex with Joseph or something like that.

1211
01:43:36,680 --> 01:43:40,880
Or give me for saying something about
the Blossop mother like that. But you

1212
01:43:40,920 --> 01:43:43,880
know, that's that's what I'm getting
at. That's fine. I mean,

1213
01:43:43,880 --> 01:43:47,199
I remember going through the same stuff. You're not going through anything different or

1214
01:43:47,239 --> 01:43:51,439
new that everybody else hasn't gone through. We all have these issues that we

1215
01:43:51,520 --> 01:43:56,159
have to work through. I remember
when I was a Calvinist and I was

1216
01:43:56,199 --> 01:43:59,640
going into Rome in two thousand and
three, I had to work through marry

1217
01:43:59,640 --> 01:44:03,000
an issue. Use. So yeah, there's it's part of the process,

1218
01:44:03,079 --> 01:44:08,800
the journey whatever, and yeah,
you should take your time and and and

1219
01:44:08,840 --> 01:44:11,720
work it out. It's much better
to do that than to jump into something

1220
01:44:11,720 --> 01:44:15,920
because people that jump into it.
One of the patterns I've seen is that

1221
01:44:15,920 --> 01:44:20,680
they'll jump into it and then they're
not ready for the challenges from I don't

1222
01:44:20,680 --> 01:44:23,520
know, let's say, let's say
you jumped it. Not you, but

1223
01:44:23,600 --> 01:44:27,359
let's say theoretically, somebody jumps into
Orthodoxy after I don't know, watching some

1224
01:44:27,399 --> 01:44:30,560
YouTube videos and a few debates,
and they read a book, I'm ready

1225
01:44:30,560 --> 01:44:35,079
to be Orthodox, and then like
a year later they hear some scholastic presentation

1226
01:44:35,560 --> 01:44:41,159
from a Roman Catholic or a Uniate. So this is the most common thing,

1227
01:44:41,239 --> 01:44:43,840
is that. And this is not
common in the sense of a lot

1228
01:44:43,840 --> 01:44:46,720
of a lot of cases. But
there's a handful of people who leave Orthodoxy

1229
01:44:46,760 --> 01:44:50,319
for Uniitism every now and then,
right, And usually what happens is they

1230
01:44:50,439 --> 01:44:57,319
rushed into Orthodoxy and then they act
like nobody ever told me about the Uniate

1231
01:44:57,399 --> 01:45:00,439
positions that I was laed to,
that I've could be Roman Catholic and be

1232
01:45:00,560 --> 01:45:03,640
Orthodox at the same time, It's
like, no, you just didn't know.

1233
01:45:03,920 --> 01:45:08,119
Look, nobody was hiding this from
you. You just didn't take your

1234
01:45:08,119 --> 01:45:11,880
time to study these issues out.
That's not anybody's fault but your own.

1235
01:45:12,319 --> 01:45:15,159
And then, by the way,
those people sometimes end up then just quitting

1236
01:45:15,359 --> 01:45:20,960
wholesale because they didn't get grass greener
situations. They thought the grass would be

1237
01:45:21,000 --> 01:45:27,079
greener. Oh guess what I have
to basically become a lawyer for Pope Francis.

1238
01:45:27,119 --> 01:45:30,239
And that's not a lot of fun
and it's not very easy to do

1239
01:45:30,399 --> 01:45:33,520
because you go nuts. So now
you're drunk, because being a Roman Catholic

1240
01:45:33,640 --> 01:45:39,279
is a lot of crazy hard work
to make this insane system work for Pope

1241
01:45:39,279 --> 01:45:43,319
frank anyway, so yeah, take
your time work through the issues. There's

1242
01:45:43,319 --> 01:45:47,079
plenty of good works from orthodox writers
on Mary. If you want to talk

1243
01:45:47,119 --> 01:45:51,560
about the perpetual virginity, just go
read the classic essay from Saint Jerome on

1244
01:45:51,600 --> 01:45:56,359
the Perpetual Virginity of Mary. You
know, read Saint John Maximovis's book on

1245
01:45:56,520 --> 01:46:00,840
Mary. For those in the chat
about Calvinism, look right here, people

1246
01:46:00,880 --> 01:46:05,000
are asking about how you review.
Go did We've been talking about Calvinism for

1247
01:46:05,039 --> 01:46:11,000
like seven years going back to actually
I was making comedy videos making fun of

1248
01:46:11,039 --> 01:46:14,199
Calvinists fifteen years ago. That was
like my first YouTube video right here.

1249
01:46:14,279 --> 01:46:19,279
However, if you just go to
these two this right here on Sam Simoon's

1250
01:46:19,319 --> 01:46:25,399
channel, uh twenty thousand views almost
or you can watch this one over here,

1251
01:46:25,720 --> 01:46:28,560
or you can watch this one over
here. So there's all of these

1252
01:46:29,399 --> 01:46:33,760
podcasts ready made for you. Anyway, go ahead. Yeah, definitely.

1253
01:46:33,840 --> 01:46:38,520
That answered my question pretty much.
And I just wanted to say that these

1254
01:46:38,640 --> 01:46:43,680
unions do they usually after they convert
from Orthodoxy to Catholicism? Did they usually

1255
01:46:43,680 --> 01:46:46,920
fall to Islam shortly thereafter? One
of them did? I don't know about

1256
01:46:47,720 --> 01:46:51,960
more of them. I think that
there was like one unstable priest who did

1257
01:46:53,000 --> 01:46:56,560
that, like you went UNI eight
and then he went to Islam or something

1258
01:46:56,600 --> 01:47:00,880
crazy Constantinople. I don't know what
his name was. Is your joke the

1259
01:47:00,920 --> 01:47:10,279
city of Constantinople? Yeah, got
it? I mean, yeah, I

1260
01:47:10,319 --> 01:47:15,399
don't have a problem saying that.
Constantinople. Uh, you know it is

1261
01:47:15,439 --> 01:47:19,680
not doing well. So good one, super funny, Dan Griffin, what's

1262
01:47:19,720 --> 01:47:31,319
up, any sir? I was
looking for the Eastern recognition of the canon

1263
01:47:31,439 --> 01:47:35,720
in Truel. I think I'd heard
you mentioned that that is where that was

1264
01:47:35,760 --> 01:47:41,479
the council that was. It's because
it affirms the Trollo affirms the canons of

1265
01:47:41,520 --> 01:47:45,960
Carthage. Carthage is what list but
but but Carthage is a local you know,

1266
01:47:46,079 --> 01:47:50,840
a series of local synods. But
Trollo says, we affirmed the canons

1267
01:47:50,880 --> 01:47:55,119
of Carthage. Blah blah blah blah, blah at list of the years,

1268
01:47:55,479 --> 01:48:00,319
and one of those includes the Orthodox
canon, which is more or less basically

1269
01:48:00,399 --> 01:48:03,840
the same as the canon of Pope
Saint Damasis in the West that Augustine talks

1270
01:48:03,880 --> 01:48:08,640
about. So West and East had
basically even though in the West it was

1271
01:48:08,680 --> 01:48:12,359
earlier. It's like, you know, four hundreds when Damasis lists his letter

1272
01:48:12,359 --> 01:48:16,560
that Augustin talks about, and then
it's Carthage was around the same time Ate

1273
01:48:16,560 --> 01:48:21,279
three hundred, four hundreds that we're
talking about, and then Trollo for Orthodox

1274
01:48:21,520 --> 01:48:28,000
is pretty normative, right, but
Trollo gets reaffirmed for sure by the Seventh

1275
01:48:28,039 --> 01:48:32,239
Council as authoritative and acceptable to the
Orthodox. I don't know. Rome has

1276
01:48:32,239 --> 01:48:36,640
actually shifted its position on At one
time they used to accept the Seventh a

1277
01:48:36,680 --> 01:48:41,439
Commentical Council in total, and then
no, we don't. We don't accept

1278
01:48:41,439 --> 01:48:44,640
all those because oops, has you
know, married clergy and Trollo, So

1279
01:48:44,680 --> 01:48:48,199
we don't accept because the Seventh Council
accepts quinnissex Trolo. Okay, yes,

1280
01:48:48,319 --> 01:48:53,840
yeah, no, I knew that. So I guess is it true then

1281
01:48:53,960 --> 01:48:59,399
that the East they loosely accepted it
basically when the West sort of accepted it

1282
01:48:59,560 --> 01:49:01,359
they just did and kind of put
a scamp on it. Well, the

1283
01:49:01,399 --> 01:49:06,560
difference, you can tell. The
difference is that between the Latin mindset and

1284
01:49:06,640 --> 01:49:11,920
I'm not saying that this was the
Latin mindset in the days of Damasis,

1285
01:49:12,399 --> 01:49:14,960
So in the days of Pope Demasis. If you had the patriarch of the

1286
01:49:14,960 --> 01:49:17,279
West of Rome, right, and
he says, Okay, here's the canon

1287
01:49:17,279 --> 01:49:21,119
that we accept, that's going to
be the normative attitude for a lot of

1288
01:49:21,119 --> 01:49:25,800
the West, just because that's the
patriarch of Rome. That's the the you

1289
01:49:25,840 --> 01:49:28,640
know, the key patriarch of the
West. In the East, it's going

1290
01:49:28,720 --> 01:49:31,520
to be a little different because the
recognition is not going to be oh,

1291
01:49:31,600 --> 01:49:34,720
let's just what is constant and oples
say, it's going to be more so

1292
01:49:34,920 --> 01:49:41,319
like, well, what's the closest
thing to a canonical or synodyl list of

1293
01:49:41,359 --> 01:49:45,439
the canon. And that's why Trollo
says, well, okay, here's Carthage's

1294
01:49:45,479 --> 01:49:49,560
list. You know this looks pretty
solid. We'll go with this. Okay.

1295
01:49:50,960 --> 01:49:57,239
That pretty much answers my question.
Do you intend on trying to get

1296
01:49:57,279 --> 01:50:00,560
a debate with Gavin sometimes soon?
He did something recent with father Stephen de

1297
01:50:00,640 --> 01:50:03,560
Young that was kind of, you
know, good to watch, but it

1298
01:50:03,560 --> 01:50:06,319
would be good to see somebody really
just rough them up. You know.

1299
01:50:08,399 --> 01:50:11,840
I haven't thought about it. I
mean, I'm not totally opposed to it,

1300
01:50:11,880 --> 01:50:15,800
but I kind of feel like the
expectation is that there will be the

1301
01:50:15,880 --> 01:50:19,720
same old. Oh he's mean and
he's a controversial person and I'm too good

1302
01:50:19,800 --> 01:50:23,359
impious to talk to him. That's
my assumption as to what would happen.

1303
01:50:23,399 --> 01:50:31,399
Scott Grace, what's up, dude? You gotta I'm mute, bro.

1304
01:50:32,439 --> 01:50:39,359
Uh well, Onna, I mute
your heart? Hey, how's it going,

1305
01:50:39,439 --> 01:50:44,840
Jay? Yes, sir. So
I'm a Protestant, and I've been

1306
01:50:45,119 --> 01:50:51,399
kind of looking into unconditional election and
looking into what Augustin wrote about it and

1307
01:50:51,399 --> 01:50:56,239
what a Quinas and the Thomas wrote
about it, and I was curious.

1308
01:50:56,880 --> 01:51:00,880
I can't seem to find anything.
How exactly did Augustine and Aquinas, how

1309
01:51:00,920 --> 01:51:11,920
did they reconcile the view of unconditional
election but also universal atonement. Yeah,

1310
01:51:12,520 --> 01:51:19,039
the position is basically reconciled by saying
that the grace is not identical. So

1311
01:51:19,159 --> 01:51:28,239
basically, can you mute it's a
loud background? Yeah, So basically there

1312
01:51:28,319 --> 01:51:31,800
is a kind of grace that comes
to all via the atonement, I think

1313
01:51:31,840 --> 01:51:36,079
they would say. And so God
does in a sense love everyone and have

1314
01:51:36,119 --> 01:51:41,239
a desire for everyone, but that
doesn't mean that he gives everybody the same

1315
01:51:41,319 --> 01:51:45,119
portion of grace so that they then
come to faith and persevere. So remember

1316
01:51:45,119 --> 01:51:49,520
Augustine, for example, believes that
you know, there's there's baptismal regeneration.

1317
01:51:49,960 --> 01:51:54,520
So everybody in the church that makes
it to the font is regenerated and in

1318
01:51:54,640 --> 01:51:57,600
Christ, but they can also fall
away. And so if you read his

1319
01:51:57,640 --> 01:52:04,520
book on perseverance, Augustine explains that
not everybody's given this specific additional gift of

1320
01:52:04,680 --> 01:52:12,239
perseverance until the end. Only the
elect, the conditional, the unconditionally predestined

1321
01:52:12,239 --> 01:52:15,319
fixed number of the elect also get
the gift of perseverance. So that's what

1322
01:52:15,439 --> 01:52:20,399
he says. Aquinas pretty much agrees
with Augustine on these topics. It's in

1323
01:52:20,920 --> 01:52:25,880
Suma book one. It's around I
don't know questions eighteen to twenty three.

1324
01:52:25,920 --> 01:52:30,960
Somewhere in there is where he goes
through his doctrine predestination. He does affirm

1325
01:52:30,119 --> 01:52:36,760
efficacious grace or what Augustina talks about
operative grace, and so operative grace is

1326
01:52:36,760 --> 01:52:42,279
what you need at the beginning to
convert, and then cooperative grace is where

1327
01:52:42,279 --> 01:52:45,600
you synergize your will. The Orthodox
view doesn't make that distinction. We think

1328
01:52:45,600 --> 01:52:48,600
that all grace is cooperative. The
human energy and will is never lost.

1329
01:52:48,640 --> 01:52:53,960
You were always at some point synergizing
with divine grace. So those are some

1330
01:52:54,000 --> 01:52:56,880
points where we would differ. But
another problem, as we said a minute

1331
01:52:56,880 --> 01:53:00,039
ago with the other guy, is
that number one and the scope of Christ's

1332
01:53:00,039 --> 01:53:03,560
redemption is cosmic. And this is
why Augustin struggles with it because of his

1333
01:53:03,640 --> 01:53:08,920
predestination doctrine. Because he begins his
atereiology with a divine decree, he doesn't

1334
01:53:08,920 --> 01:53:12,960
have an explanation for in what sense
Christ is connected to all men. And

1335
01:53:13,000 --> 01:53:16,199
that's because later councils, particularly picking
up on the teaching of Saint Cyril of

1336
01:53:16,199 --> 01:53:20,319
Alexandria. If through the McGucken book, it's very clear Christ assumes universal human

1337
01:53:20,399 --> 01:53:25,239
nature. That's why all men are
resurrected. And this is precisely why at

1338
01:53:25,239 --> 01:53:28,600
the end of City of God,
Augustine struggles with why the reprobate would be

1339
01:53:28,640 --> 01:53:30,760
resurrected. The only way to be
resurrected is have a connection to Christ.

1340
01:53:31,159 --> 01:53:35,039
Why are the reprobate resurrected, they
have no connection to Christ. So this

1341
01:53:35,199 --> 01:53:43,000
is the problem with the materiological element
of Augustine's theology. But there's also christological

1342
01:53:43,039 --> 01:53:47,640
problems with Christ being a predestined man, which would compromise seemingly him being a

1343
01:53:47,640 --> 01:53:54,680
divine subject. There's also problems with
the grace taking over or over writing the

1344
01:53:54,760 --> 01:54:00,319
human will. That would be presumably
a Monothelite or Monointurgist move, which the

1345
01:54:00,399 --> 01:54:03,640
Church rejects at the Fifth and Six
councils, ultimately the Six because the whole

1346
01:54:03,680 --> 01:54:08,039
debate of the Six Council is whether
there's two wills and two energies in Christ,

1347
01:54:08,399 --> 01:54:12,199
because those are fundamental components of human
nature. So if he has our

1348
01:54:12,279 --> 01:54:15,560
nature, we have to have the
same faculties that he has. That means

1349
01:54:15,640 --> 01:54:18,319
we have to have human will and
human energy. That means that we can't

1350
01:54:18,359 --> 01:54:24,880
never we can never not have human
will and energy. But the Calvinist and

1351
01:54:25,039 --> 01:54:31,119
Augustinian positions are premised on the notion
that there's a natural tension between man's will

1352
01:54:31,159 --> 01:54:38,159
and God's will, and so that
tension has to infallibly, efficaciously, irresistibly

1353
01:54:38,239 --> 01:54:41,760
be overcome by the divine will.
And energy to be saved and we don't

1354
01:54:41,760 --> 01:54:47,239
believe that, right, which makes
definitely makes sense from that perspective because obviously

1355
01:54:47,239 --> 01:54:50,800
they believe in total depravity, so
like like you said, obviously there'd be

1356
01:54:50,920 --> 01:54:55,840
like that, yes, And their
soteriology has nothing to do with Christology.

1357
01:54:56,119 --> 01:55:00,439
They don't even care. They will
be a Nestorian or arian to maintain their

1358
01:55:00,479 --> 01:55:05,359
soteriology. So the whole thing is
wrong headed because it's the wrong starting point

1359
01:55:05,800 --> 01:55:10,800
order theology, order of theology.
Their order of theology begins with the divine

1360
01:55:10,800 --> 01:55:15,399
decree and arguability, divine simplicity,
and then everything else is teased out from

1361
01:55:15,399 --> 01:55:19,239
that, and then we'll do trinity
and incarnation down the road from that.

1362
01:55:19,239 --> 01:55:23,840
That's why it's all heterodox. That's
why they end up a historian. That's

1363
01:55:23,880 --> 01:55:29,359
why they end up being Aran because
who's punished on the cross. Is Jesus

1364
01:55:29,439 --> 01:55:32,199
a human person that's punished or is
he the second person of Godhead who then

1365
01:55:32,239 --> 01:55:41,399
becomes damned and split from the trinity? Right, Yeah, thank you so

1366
01:55:41,479 --> 01:55:45,079
much for answering that question. Really
good insight into that. And then one

1367
01:55:45,079 --> 01:55:48,800
more question, just kind of a
fun one. Who do you typically enjoy

1368
01:55:48,880 --> 01:55:55,479
having discussions with more Protestants or Catholics? Who do you enjoy who hooting the

1369
01:55:55,479 --> 01:56:00,520
blowfish? Who would you say you
enjoy having who? Who? Okay,

1370
01:56:00,520 --> 01:56:04,439
I think he said hoodie. I
went in the back, chicker. Hi

1371
01:56:06,000 --> 01:56:13,920
sat on the roof and just cried
and fell sorry for myself. It's Calviners

1372
01:56:14,000 --> 01:56:19,760
cry as the tears rolled down,
moppery dustined tears face. Anyway, what

1373
01:56:19,920 --> 01:56:25,439
was your question, arnswer God?
Who do you enjoy having conversations with more

1374
01:56:25,439 --> 01:56:36,119
about theology? Protestants or Catholics about
theology. It's a tie like neither one.

1375
01:56:36,199 --> 01:56:43,680
I don't know. It's an equally
bad scenari and I'm joking. I

1376
01:56:43,720 --> 01:56:47,399
mean, I really enjoy talking to
Tim because Tim knows more philosophy than I

1377
01:56:47,399 --> 01:56:50,800
do. So actually I learned stuff
from Tim, so I'm usually happy to

1378
01:56:50,840 --> 01:56:57,479
talk philosophy with Tim because he knows
Aristola very well. He knows metaphysics well.

1379
01:56:57,960 --> 01:57:01,479
I don't agree obviously with everything.
But but that's not really theology.

1380
01:57:01,640 --> 01:57:06,159
So I don't know. Man,
that's a that's a tie for evil,

1381
01:57:06,279 --> 01:57:11,000
tie for worse. I'm just joking, but thank you for that question.

1382
01:57:11,039 --> 01:57:14,279
There's Scott Grace. That's a good
that's a good Calvinist. Name a good

1383
01:57:14,319 --> 01:57:20,039
Protestant, Scott Grace, Alex the
Inquirer. Man, it's getting hot up

1384
01:57:20,039 --> 01:57:31,119
in here, fan got on mute. I'm wan on mute your soul.

1385
01:57:31,760 --> 01:57:35,880
Hey. So, first of all, your work is greatly appreciated in the

1386
01:57:35,920 --> 01:57:40,840
Czech Republic. Thanks for all you
do for the church. There was so

1387
01:57:41,720 --> 01:57:46,560
although when we went to so when
we went to see Sam Tripoli at this

1388
01:57:46,680 --> 01:57:50,880
late night comedy store set, there
was like, literally, I'm not joking,

1389
01:57:51,640 --> 01:57:57,159
the weirdest gathering of people at this
late night comedy venue the other night

1390
01:57:57,199 --> 01:58:00,920
in La right, So there's like
literally twenty Canadians are there for no nobody

1391
01:58:00,920 --> 01:58:05,119
could figure out why. Different groups
of Canadians suddenly at the comedy store.

1392
01:58:05,479 --> 01:58:11,880
And this one dude with his mom
from the Czech Republic, and Sam Tripley

1393
01:58:11,920 --> 01:58:14,680
was up there just blasting the Czech
Republic. I don't know. It was

1394
01:58:14,720 --> 01:58:16,159
great he was talking about. He's
like, do you guys still have that

1395
01:58:16,199 --> 01:58:19,600
game Kick the Box in your failed
Republic? Anyway? I'm sorry, go

1396
01:58:19,600 --> 01:58:25,680
ahead, yeah, no problem.
So the church is actually growing here due

1397
01:58:25,720 --> 01:58:29,319
to the young converts all things too. So thanks for that. I'm just

1398
01:58:29,359 --> 01:58:32,079
becoming a Catechumban. But I still
have this one question. So if you

1399
01:58:32,119 --> 01:58:38,960
do not have external criteria such as
the Scripture to assess the truth of the

1400
01:58:39,079 --> 01:58:42,720
claims of different churches, for example, the Oriental, the Eastern and the

1401
01:58:42,760 --> 01:58:46,720
Assyrian Church of the East. Now
all of these churches claim that they are

1402
01:58:46,800 --> 01:58:53,119
inspired by the Holy Spirit. But
now if you don't have that external criteria

1403
01:58:53,199 --> 01:58:57,319
such as the scripture, how can
you assess their different truth claims? Like

1404
01:58:57,600 --> 01:59:00,800
if they all just say already won
true church, why, well, because

1405
01:59:00,800 --> 01:59:05,520
we have the Holy Spirit, because
hold on solar So what we do have

1406
01:59:05,560 --> 01:59:10,199
that right? So in other words, it's not like we we can't or

1407
01:59:10,239 --> 01:59:14,439
wouldn't appeal to scriptures. We would, So I don't I don't follow that

1408
01:59:14,479 --> 01:59:18,960
logic there. Yeah, So I
just wanted to know. I'm kind of

1409
01:59:18,960 --> 01:59:20,800
slow. Let me let me put
it this way. Let me put it

1410
01:59:20,840 --> 01:59:26,239
this way. So if I'm debating
with a Rouman Catholic or a Protestant or

1411
01:59:26,239 --> 01:59:30,199
an Oriental, can I appeal to
scriptures? Absolutely? Yeah, So the

1412
01:59:30,239 --> 01:59:36,000
fact that the scriptures aren't the sole
final authority doesn't mean that they're not a

1413
01:59:36,000 --> 01:59:41,760
authority. Oh and and and do
I have any way of knowing that,

1414
01:59:42,600 --> 01:59:46,520
So my church does have the Holy
Spirit and the Oriental one does not have

1415
01:59:46,600 --> 01:59:49,840
the Holy Spirit? Is there any
way to determine that, like our traditions

1416
01:59:49,840 --> 01:59:55,479
are right and theirs are not.
Well, there's there's no there's not necessarily

1417
01:59:55,520 --> 01:59:59,960
going to be for any of these
debates like one easy, Like I mean,

1418
02:00:00,159 --> 02:00:02,319
this is the whole argument of the
papacy right, and actually the Protestants

1419
02:00:02,359 --> 02:00:08,239
as well, like they both try
to have these like silver bullets that make

1420
02:00:08,279 --> 02:00:10,039
it to worry. Oh, you
know what, you don't even have to

1421
02:00:10,079 --> 02:00:14,880
worry about anything because the silver bullet
is the pope, and the other position

1422
02:00:14,960 --> 02:00:15,720
of the Protestant is, oh,
you don't have to worry about any of

1423
02:00:15,800 --> 02:00:19,159
that who cares about all this theology
and philosophy and because you have the silver

1424
02:00:19,239 --> 02:00:25,159
bullet of the Bible. But neither
of those quote silver bullets actually do the

1425
02:00:25,199 --> 02:00:29,000
work. So again, if you
go back to the beginning of today's live

1426
02:00:29,000 --> 02:00:35,520
stream, you'll notice that I talked
about the difference between individual existential certitude and

1427
02:00:35,600 --> 02:00:41,920
the question of normative authority. So
those are two different things, and it's

1428
02:00:41,960 --> 02:00:46,600
related, but it deals with your
question in a way, because there's no

1429
02:00:46,600 --> 02:00:53,199
nobody has like an epistemically privileged position
by which you can just sort of bypass

1430
02:00:53,239 --> 02:00:58,159
all the difficulties. Romagantholicism often tries
to sell this. This is like their

1431
02:00:58,199 --> 02:01:00,560
car salesman pitch that you don't have
to worry about any of these things because

1432
02:01:00,560 --> 02:01:03,239
the Pope. See you see,
the Pope makes this so easy. Oh

1433
02:01:03,239 --> 02:01:08,279
but wait a minute, hasn't Francis
actually just changed the position on the death

1434
02:01:08,319 --> 02:01:13,960
penalty. Hasn't Francis just changed a
position on blessing of unions which the CDC

1435
02:01:14,159 --> 02:01:16,600
document previously said couldn't be done.
Well, of course he has, yes,

1436
02:01:16,920 --> 02:01:20,680
So actually it's not doing the work
that you were promised. It's like

1437
02:01:20,720 --> 02:01:24,680
a lemon. It's like a car
salesman sells you this car that looks shiny

1438
02:01:24,680 --> 02:01:27,880
on the outside and there's no engine
inside, and you're like, well,

1439
02:01:27,880 --> 02:01:30,279
wait a minute, where's the engine. Oh sorry, that's your problem.

1440
02:01:30,439 --> 02:01:32,720
You got to work that out now. By the way, enjoy your nice

1441
02:01:32,720 --> 02:01:40,560
shiny car. Right. So yeah, of course we can appeal to scripture

1442
02:01:41,000 --> 02:01:44,840
and tradition and all these things.
And if you're in a dispute with somebody

1443
02:01:44,880 --> 02:01:47,479
who shares a lot of your scripture
and tradition, then it's going to be

1444
02:01:47,479 --> 02:01:51,680
a little more difficult. But my
point is just simply that there's no easy

1445
02:01:51,880 --> 02:01:58,600
silver bullet that bypasses really difficult disputes, as for example, between say Orthodox

1446
02:01:58,640 --> 02:02:01,520
and Orientals, you do, you're
going to have to go into the writings

1447
02:02:01,560 --> 02:02:05,399
of Cyril and the council. What
other way is there? Right? Because

1448
02:02:05,439 --> 02:02:09,880
in other words, if we just
appeal to a council, okay, well,

1449
02:02:09,880 --> 02:02:12,119
how do I know that that's the
true council? Right? An Oriental

1450
02:02:12,119 --> 02:02:15,319
will say, oh, that's a
false council. So there's just simply is

1451
02:02:15,359 --> 02:02:18,520
no one silver bullet way. And
even if you're arguing a bunch of scripture

1452
02:02:18,560 --> 02:02:23,920
texts with an Oriental, I mean, that's what Cyril and Thestorius have,

1453
02:02:24,000 --> 02:02:28,159
these kind of scripture text arguments.
But I could point you to one great

1454
02:02:28,159 --> 02:02:32,680
book on this that's very accessible because
the fifth Actamenical Council was called to reconcile

1455
02:02:32,720 --> 02:02:36,399
with Orientals. And so if you
read the Kenneth Vesha book on the person

1456
02:02:36,439 --> 02:02:43,640
in Nature of Christ in Saint Justinian, that book is probably the best readable

1457
02:02:44,520 --> 02:02:51,479
fifty eighty pages, two hundred pages
addressing the specific dogmatic decision between Orthodox and

1458
02:02:51,520 --> 02:02:57,720
Orientals. At the fifth Actemenical Council. So the the easiest I could make

1459
02:02:57,800 --> 02:03:03,399
this debate is that book? Right, thanks a lot, So that answers

1460
02:03:03,439 --> 02:03:06,079
my question. I'll definitely read that, But I just wanted to ask you,

1461
02:03:06,119 --> 02:03:12,680
do believe that every heretic is sinning? Or do believe someone can just

1462
02:03:12,720 --> 02:03:16,319
be wrong? Honestly? Yeah?
This is typically the distinction between material and

1463
02:03:16,359 --> 02:03:21,680
formal heresy. So just being wrong
is not what makes a person a heretic,

1464
02:03:21,880 --> 02:03:27,640
because being wrong is we're all in
some degree wrong. A heretic is

1465
02:03:27,640 --> 02:03:32,079
somebody who's obstinate. So there's an
obstinacy of will and a perpetual sort of

1466
02:03:32,119 --> 02:03:36,399
pushing over time, and there's no
easy dep what's the timeframe? Is it

1467
02:03:36,439 --> 02:03:39,760
like one year of heresy? No, it's like I mean, is James

1468
02:03:39,760 --> 02:03:42,640
White a heretic? Absolutely? I
mean, this guy's been pushing you know,

1469
02:03:42,840 --> 02:03:48,159
gibberish nonsense for thirty years, so
so there's a Yeah, there's definitely

1470
02:03:48,159 --> 02:03:54,279
a difference between somebody who is just
simply ignorant, and again it's possible that

1471
02:03:54,279 --> 02:03:59,239
they're wilfully ignorant, so that could
make them more culpable. But I think

1472
02:03:59,279 --> 02:04:03,359
typically that's why we don't. We
don't use sometimes the church does. But

1473
02:04:03,479 --> 02:04:09,640
usually heresy is like mentioned in a
public sense for a group, right,

1474
02:04:09,760 --> 02:04:13,720
like Protestantism is a heresy. That
doesn't mean that like I'm gonna go to

1475
02:04:13,720 --> 02:04:15,520
every individual Protestant and say you're damn
your damn your damn your, damn you,

1476
02:04:15,600 --> 02:04:18,239
damn you damn Right. It doesn't
work like that, Right, So

1477
02:04:18,279 --> 02:04:24,000
we can leave the judgment up to
God and say that in a general sense,

1478
02:04:24,279 --> 02:04:28,800
the confession of faith that I don't
know the Lutheran Church has is heterodox,

1479
02:04:29,079 --> 02:04:31,439
and we condemn that as a heterodox
position, and that doesn't put me

1480
02:04:31,479 --> 02:04:36,319
in the position of judging every individual
in that in that group. Now does

1481
02:04:36,359 --> 02:04:40,079
that mean that everybody then therefore is
saved? No, I'm not saying that.

1482
02:04:40,279 --> 02:04:44,279
But God doesn't tell us who he
works in and who he works with

1483
02:04:44,359 --> 02:04:48,600
and in what ways he can join
people to the mystical body. So what

1484
02:04:48,640 --> 02:04:51,680
I do know is that no one
can be saved without being joined the mystical

1485
02:04:51,720 --> 02:04:56,560
body. And does God have means
by which he can do that for people?

1486
02:04:56,600 --> 02:04:59,279
Sure? Does he tell me all
those means? No? So what's

1487
02:04:59,319 --> 02:05:01,000
my job to around and judge and
trying to figure out who's damn who's not?

1488
02:05:01,039 --> 02:05:04,960
Absolutely not. It's ridiculous, right, So what's our duty then?

1489
02:05:05,239 --> 02:05:10,720
Just tell people to become wardogs.
That's it so simple. Yeah, things

1490
02:05:10,760 --> 02:05:13,359
that that actually helps me a lot, because I know a lot of young

1491
02:05:13,359 --> 02:05:15,880
guys that are trying to figure out
which church is to write one, and

1492
02:05:15,920 --> 02:05:19,399
they're just nervous as hell about being
condemned to hell every night. So yeah,

1493
02:05:19,439 --> 02:05:25,119
that helps. Yeah, I mean
I think that's kind of a I

1494
02:05:25,119 --> 02:05:29,760
don't think we're God's not damning everybody
because they don't have all their theological you

1495
02:05:29,800 --> 02:05:31,960
know, if you don't have the
right Amazon wish list of the theology books

1496
02:05:31,960 --> 02:05:34,640
to buy, and so you're danned. I mean, God knows our hearts.

1497
02:05:34,640 --> 02:05:36,800
God's a fair judge. He's a
lot better of a judge than any

1498
02:05:36,800 --> 02:05:42,680
of the idiots on the internet.
So yeah, so yeah, let's see.

1499
02:05:42,720 --> 02:05:55,399
Next up is Sapphire. What's up, Sapphire? You're ummuted to go

1500
02:05:55,399 --> 02:06:00,399
ahead? Got I'm mute? Hey, what's up? Yeah? Jay?

1501
02:06:00,399 --> 02:06:03,279
So I have a few questions.
This doesn't take too long, Okay,

1502
02:06:03,880 --> 02:06:08,720
right out the gate. I don't
know how to praise this, but would

1503
02:06:08,760 --> 02:06:13,920
you consider non orthodox people who are
of the Christian faith. Are they Christians

1504
02:06:13,920 --> 02:06:18,039
in your view, or like Catholics
for example. I don't really think that

1505
02:06:18,079 --> 02:06:23,920
it's that helpful to use this generic
terminology of Christian for everybody. But I

1506
02:06:23,960 --> 02:06:28,600
mean, since the world and they
call themselves Christian, I don't typically make

1507
02:06:28,640 --> 02:06:30,680
a big deal about it that okay, So they call themselves Christian, okay,

1508
02:06:30,720 --> 02:06:36,520
But ultimately, I mean Christianity is
synonymous with orthodoxy. I see.

1509
02:06:36,920 --> 02:06:42,720
So what in your view constitutes a
Christian like being triditarian or the divinity of

1510
02:06:42,760 --> 02:06:45,560
Christ, things like that. So
there is a yeah, I think you

1511
02:06:45,600 --> 02:06:50,079
could make an argument that in the
Canons of the First Seven Councils, you

1512
02:06:50,159 --> 02:06:56,880
could argue that people who affirm like
the Nicene Creed are in a loose sense

1513
02:06:57,000 --> 02:07:01,359
Christian. So there is a canonical
argument that I think Rocorps makes on this

1514
02:07:01,479 --> 02:07:08,279
on this topic. So, but
there's still Christian in profession. I guess

1515
02:07:08,279 --> 02:07:12,560
you could say, I see,
uh the second question, oh sorry,

1516
02:07:12,560 --> 02:07:17,239
are you still talking? Okay,
the second one just might be a goofy

1517
02:07:17,279 --> 02:07:23,680
one. But in your view,
who is worse Mormons or Muslims? I

1518
02:07:23,680 --> 02:07:29,439
think with all the kind of sectarian
heterodox cult groups, And I would say

1519
02:07:29,479 --> 02:07:33,840
that Mormonism and Islam are basically Christian
heresies of a sort. Uh, there's

1520
02:07:33,880 --> 02:07:38,279
not really a tier system there.
They're all kind of the same. So

1521
02:07:38,640 --> 02:07:43,319
it's those two, by the way, have really similar a lot of the

1522
02:07:43,359 --> 02:07:47,560
moves. Yeah. Yeah, well
so so in your view, like non

1523
02:07:47,920 --> 02:07:50,840
like other religions, you don't think
some are better or worse than others,

1524
02:07:50,920 --> 02:07:59,239
or are they all just like equally
bad in your view, I think any

1525
02:07:59,279 --> 02:08:05,760
anti trendy Tarrian anti christ position,
and I would class both of those as

1526
02:08:05,760 --> 02:08:09,279
anti Trinitarian and thus anti Christ are
all They're always basically going to have the

1527
02:08:09,279 --> 02:08:15,039
same manifestations, so they're not really
going to have like tears, you know

1528
02:08:15,079 --> 02:08:18,640
what I mean. Like, I
just think that's interesting. They're all going

1529
02:08:18,720 --> 02:08:24,520
to have the same I mean,
individuals in that religion might be better than

1530
02:08:24,560 --> 02:08:28,359
others, Like I might meet a
Mormon who's a better, more moral individual

1531
02:08:28,479 --> 02:08:33,880
than the Muslims down the road,
but I don't know that in the sects

1532
02:08:33,920 --> 02:08:37,520
as a whole. You could really
tease out like some kind of graded system

1533
02:08:37,760 --> 02:08:41,840
or something. I understand. So
you, I mean, it is kind

1534
02:08:41,840 --> 02:08:43,960
of a Reddit topic, but you
wouldn't be able to make like a tier

1535
02:08:45,000 --> 02:08:48,520
list of all the religions of the
world, like it would just be Orthodox

1536
02:08:48,640 --> 02:08:50,800
Christianity of s and then everything else
that I get. I mean, I

1537
02:08:52,199 --> 02:08:56,760
do think that there's two perspectives that
you could have that are that are complementary,

1538
02:08:56,760 --> 02:09:01,680
they're not contradictory. So from the
vantage point of like capital t ultimate

1539
02:09:01,720 --> 02:09:05,439
truth is how many religions are there? Are they on a scale? No,

1540
02:09:05,479 --> 02:09:09,399
there's only one true religion, one
true faith. But in terms of

1541
02:09:09,479 --> 02:09:13,039
like, can we have dialogue with
people who share a lot in common?

1542
02:09:13,119 --> 02:09:16,039
Sure? Right, so, and
both of those things can be true at

1543
02:09:16,079 --> 02:09:20,600
the same time because they're two different
vantage points. So if we're talking about

1544
02:09:20,439 --> 02:09:24,159
you know, do we do we
in Roman Catholics have things in common that

1545
02:09:24,199 --> 02:09:28,399
we could dialogue about. Absolutely?
Absolutely, we share at least we're supposed

1546
02:09:28,439 --> 02:09:33,399
to right the first say seventh well
six seven ecumenical councils, even though they

1547
02:09:33,399 --> 02:09:37,319
don't really follow the seventh, So
we could, we could, we could

1548
02:09:37,399 --> 02:09:43,520
form a basis to have conversation,
dialogue and a lot of agreement there as

1549
02:09:43,520 --> 02:09:48,560
opposed to say a Muslim. So
while both of those things can be true,

1550
02:09:48,199 --> 02:09:50,199
I'm not gonna then turn around and
say, oh, well, because

1551
02:09:50,239 --> 02:09:54,600
we have you know, sixty percent
in common with a Roman Catholic. The

1552
02:09:54,680 --> 02:10:01,319
Roman Catholic is sixty percent above the
Muslim. It works that way because because

1553
02:10:01,439 --> 02:10:11,399
ultimately one significant heresy places you outside
of the visible confines of the church.

1554
02:10:11,880 --> 02:10:15,479
Yeah, it's kind of like a
binary, like you're you're either in the

1555
02:10:15,560 --> 02:10:20,560
church or not. Right, But
it's also true that you can have discussion

1556
02:10:20,600 --> 02:10:26,000
and dialogue on commonalities. Those aren't
mutually exclusive positions. I understand, like,

1557
02:10:26,039 --> 02:10:30,920
for example, Tim Gordon and I
would have way more in common than

1558
02:10:30,960 --> 02:10:37,520
I would have in common with Daniel
Hikikachu or Jake. Yeah. I was

1559
02:10:37,720 --> 02:10:39,640
just about to ask about Jake.
This maybe off topic, but the end

1560
02:10:39,640 --> 02:10:46,199
of debate you mentioned that Islam is
polytheistic. Is I haven't read the kron

1561
02:10:46,279 --> 02:10:50,520
personally, so this is news to
me. I just oh, I was

1562
02:10:50,560 --> 02:10:56,600
probably talking about in the context of
Jake's slophism where Allah has a foot,

1563
02:10:56,720 --> 02:11:01,680
two right hands, a shin that
would be according to his own I mean,

1564
02:11:01,680 --> 02:11:05,680
according to Islamic shirk, right.
I mean he's gonna say it's not,

1565
02:11:05,880 --> 02:11:09,000
but like, yeah, well,
okay, how come you get to

1566
02:11:09,039 --> 02:11:13,399
have anthropomorphism that's real? Uh,
and it's not idolatry. But and if

1567
02:11:13,399 --> 02:11:18,479
you read Sunny texts like Sunny text
will critique them on that that very basis.

1568
02:11:18,560 --> 02:11:26,640
They will say that the Salafi are
all anthropomorphic idolators. Yeah. So

1569
02:11:26,720 --> 02:11:31,439
I was just making the point that
the soonies make against the Jake crowd.

1570
02:11:31,479 --> 02:11:35,520
Okay, thank you, Yeah,
I guess my last question. Have you

1571
02:11:35,560 --> 02:11:41,720
seen the delay rage quin with Andrew? Yes, yeah, yeah, it's

1572
02:11:41,760 --> 02:11:43,760
on I put I put it on
my Twitter. I got like two hundred

1573
02:11:43,760 --> 02:11:46,680
thousand views. So now what was
your reaction when you saw that? I

1574
02:11:46,680 --> 02:11:52,119
mean, I didn't. I didn't. I did. I honestly did not

1575
02:11:52,279 --> 02:11:56,279
think Matt would do that, Like
it seemed odd to me. I mean,

1576
02:11:56,279 --> 02:11:58,760
I haven't talked to Matt since our
twenty eighteen debates, so I have

1577
02:11:58,880 --> 02:12:05,039
no idea like what his mental process
is nowadays. But you know, at

1578
02:12:05,039 --> 02:12:09,000
the at the time of the debate
between me and Matt, he seemed like

1579
02:12:09,159 --> 02:12:16,159
this very kind of like wanted to
be cool, calculating, methodical, unemotional

1580
02:12:16,199 --> 02:12:20,680
type of atheist. And the atheist
that I saw in that discussion was like

1581
02:12:20,880 --> 02:12:24,359
just an emo like can't control his
you know, rage or whatever. So

1582
02:12:24,479 --> 02:12:28,720
it was odd, not what I
expect it. I think he's gone downhill

1583
02:12:28,760 --> 02:12:33,279
in the last six years. Probably
well. I think the atheism is like

1584
02:12:33,359 --> 02:12:35,760
mind rot So you're yeah, you're
gonna go on hell yeah, yeah,

1585
02:12:37,359 --> 02:12:39,920
yeah, great questions. Appreciate that. We got a couple of super chats

1586
02:12:39,960 --> 02:12:43,960
here. I'll let Father Deacon he
since he's on, if he wants to

1587
02:12:43,000 --> 02:12:46,720
make any comments. Father Dickon,
you've been here for a while. You've

1588
02:12:46,720 --> 02:12:50,039
heard a lot of questions, a
lot of comments. We've we've heard a

1589
02:12:50,039 --> 02:12:54,880
lot of bad argumentation from the Ruslan
video. I want you to comment if

1590
02:12:54,920 --> 02:12:58,640
you if you have any insights.
Jay Zuna since twenty five dollars and says,

1591
02:12:58,640 --> 02:13:03,399
can you talk about the Orthodox stance
on death penalty? You mentioned an

1592
02:13:03,479 --> 02:13:07,000
article that you wrote in the past. Yeah. My article is called the

1593
02:13:07,039 --> 02:13:09,479
Patriarchal Principle and the death Penalty.
I think something like that. I'll try

1594
02:13:09,520 --> 02:13:15,600
to find it here now. Unfortunately, the OCA, I think is anti

1595
02:13:15,640 --> 02:13:18,399
death penalty. They have some statement
on their OCA website that they don't approve

1596
02:13:18,399 --> 02:13:22,159
of the death penalty. I disagree
with that. I've always disagree with that.

1597
02:13:22,279 --> 02:13:28,199
I think some Antiochians disagree with the
death penalty. The ro Corps traditional

1598
02:13:28,239 --> 02:13:33,520
statement affirms the death penalty. So
even though that's not like the most important

1599
02:13:33,520 --> 02:13:37,039
thing to me, Like I'm just
I do think it's pretty obvious that the

1600
02:13:37,079 --> 02:13:41,960
New Testament teaches the death penalty.
The early Church Fathers pretty consistently, maybe

1601
02:13:43,000 --> 02:13:46,640
a couple outliers teach the death penalty. So I've always been a porter of

1602
02:13:46,680 --> 02:13:52,760
it. I don't really understand.
I mean, just all the passivist stuff

1603
02:13:52,840 --> 02:13:58,880
drives me nuts. So here's my
article on it, and I include,

1604
02:13:58,880 --> 02:14:05,800
by the way, several Church Fathers
statements on the death penalty, and I

1605
02:14:05,840 --> 02:14:11,479
think the ro Corps it's at mospad
dot are you the roal course statement on

1606
02:14:11,520 --> 02:14:13,119
it's good? Here it is past
fist tendency in the patriarchal death penalty.

1607
02:14:13,119 --> 02:14:16,840
Here is my article, and we'll
look at a couple quotes down at the

1608
02:14:16,880 --> 02:14:22,239
bottom. Here is that essay if
you want to go read that essay right

1609
02:14:22,239 --> 02:14:35,079
there, and we'll see, for
example, Athenasius in Letter forty eight notes

1610
02:14:35,159 --> 02:14:41,640
that God permitted the lawful use of
the sword when he stated in Genesis one

1611
02:14:41,199 --> 02:14:45,760
or excuse me, a lawful use
of sexuality. I think he's talking about

1612
02:14:45,760 --> 02:14:48,880
there. And then he says in
Hebrews thirteen marriage bread should be undefiled.

1613
02:14:48,159 --> 02:14:52,680
And then it says, for example, Athanasius is saying that in some cases,

1614
02:14:52,800 --> 02:14:58,279
one action in certain situations might be
vice. In other situations that might

1615
02:14:58,319 --> 02:15:01,640
be virtue. So another word,
sexuality marriage is good, but outside of

1616
02:15:01,640 --> 02:15:03,880
marriage, he's saying would be a
vice. And he says likewise, it

1617
02:15:03,920 --> 02:15:09,399
is not right to kill, Yet
in war it is lawful and praiseworthy to

1618
02:15:09,520 --> 02:15:13,119
destroy the enemy. Accordingly, not
only they who have distinguished themselves in the

1619
02:15:13,159 --> 02:15:16,960
field are worthy of great honors,
but monuments are actually put up to their

1620
02:15:16,000 --> 02:15:20,239
achievement. So the same action is
at one time, under one circumstance unlawful,

1621
02:15:20,479 --> 02:15:24,239
while under other circumstances it is lawful
and permissible. So their Afthenatius is

1622
02:15:24,279 --> 02:15:35,279
calling the people who have exemplified bravery
in warfare worthy of praise and great honors.

1623
02:15:35,560 --> 02:15:39,880
So that is not pacifism. Saint
Ambrose, in his letter seventeen writes

1624
02:15:39,920 --> 02:15:46,680
that the Christian emperors have the right
to exercise the sword. Similar exhortation in

1625
02:15:46,720 --> 02:15:50,479
his fortieth letter to Theodosius. And
I mean, this is all stuff that

1626
02:15:50,720 --> 02:15:54,960
I worked through and learned. I
didn't write this in twenty seventeen. This

1627
02:15:54,000 --> 02:15:58,319
is an article I wrote from I
think about two thousand and fourteen, maybe

1628
02:15:58,359 --> 02:16:05,239
earlier. And I wrote this because
so many people try to make a religion

1629
02:16:05,279 --> 02:16:13,520
this weird pacifist thing, and it's
a huge problem, and it's just it

1630
02:16:13,560 --> 02:16:16,399
blows my mind. I don't I
don't get it. And they when you

1631
02:16:16,439 --> 02:16:18,520
bring this up, they don't care. They don't care what the church fathers

1632
02:16:18,520 --> 02:16:22,840
said. All they all they care
about is oh, well, you know

1633
02:16:22,720 --> 02:16:26,279
there were there were some statements of
pacifism by this saint here or that saint

1634
02:16:26,319 --> 02:16:31,319
there. So what like, what
does what does one person talking about pacifism

1635
02:16:31,399 --> 02:16:33,959
have to do with whether that's universally
the case? Uh, go ahead,

1636
02:16:35,000 --> 02:16:41,120
father Dan, Well that's right.
It just it's uh Christian, this this

1637
02:16:41,200 --> 02:16:48,079
whole idea innovation that comes into the
church, because it's certainly this pastism was

1638
02:16:48,159 --> 02:16:52,399
not something received or practiced throughout the
church. And I don't know why we

1639
02:16:52,440 --> 02:16:58,760
can't get across to people that it
doesn't matter if you can cherry pick and

1640
02:16:58,799 --> 02:17:05,479
find quotes from different saints. That's
not how orthodoxy works. It's it's what's

1641
02:17:05,559 --> 02:17:15,040
received. So whatever particular heresy or
weird thing that you want to do you

1642
02:17:15,079 --> 02:17:18,959
have to look and say, is
it received? It received in practice in

1643
02:17:20,000 --> 02:17:24,799
the Church? Of course it never
is. And i'd also have too.

1644
02:17:24,840 --> 02:17:28,840
I think there's something very compassionate about
the death penalty in terms of Christianity,

1645
02:17:30,719 --> 02:17:37,440
that it gives one a chance for
repentance that they wouldn't have they were sentenced

1646
02:17:37,479 --> 02:17:41,360
to life or something like that.
There's also the statement in Hebrews eleven.

1647
02:17:41,639 --> 02:17:46,000
We are told in Hebrews eleven that
the in the Hall of Faith chapter the

1648
02:17:46,360 --> 02:17:52,719
faithful who went before us, some
of them were heroes because they fought entire

1649
02:17:52,920 --> 02:17:58,159
armies, They turned to flight,
entire armies. They were valiant in battle.

1650
02:17:58,239 --> 02:18:03,879
Hebrews eleven in verse thirty four.
Now, how is that the case?

1651
02:18:03,079 --> 02:18:07,319
How would Samson, Gideon, Barak, Jeffa, the judges, David

1652
02:18:07,559 --> 02:18:13,239
and all these people, how would
they be valiant heroes and models if suddenly

1653
02:18:13,280 --> 02:18:18,319
the New Testament in this marcianit way, we're supposed to be pacifist. This

1654
02:18:18,360 --> 02:18:24,360
is a Marcianite argument. Like literally, I'm saying Marcion literally made these kinds

1655
02:18:24,399 --> 02:18:31,399
of arguments that you hear people arguing
today and add to contra pacivism. Look

1656
02:18:31,440 --> 02:18:33,440
at the warrior saints I was gonna
say the warrior saints exactly. By the

1657
02:18:33,479 --> 02:18:39,079
way, I'm not talking about saints
that you were part of the military before

1658
02:18:39,159 --> 02:18:50,479
conversion, right, I'm thinking of
for example, Sat Alexander Nevsky, Stefan

1659
02:18:50,600 --> 02:19:01,559
ChIL Mare, the Saint Stephen the
Great, Saint Olga of Kiev. They

1660
02:19:01,600 --> 02:19:13,440
were actually they were made saints in
part because of their leadership in wels Uh.

1661
02:19:13,719 --> 02:19:20,440
Saint Stephen Stephan the Great for killing
Muslims. Yeah, I was gonna

1662
02:19:20,479 --> 02:19:24,760
say, there's songs that the Serbs
sing about their Serbian kings fighting the Muslims.

1663
02:19:24,840 --> 02:19:28,520
I mean, this is just ido
idiocy. Right to act like christian

1664
02:19:28,559 --> 02:19:33,120
I mean, and as part of
the NGO, like pacifist liberal feminist push

1665
02:19:33,520 --> 02:19:37,520
is to make Christianity. It is
totally pacifist thing. That's part of the

1666
02:19:37,559 --> 02:19:41,440
strategy of how to basically cuck the
West. Chalk to Sexy. Three dollars

1667
02:19:41,680 --> 02:19:46,360
will you report refute Voice of Reason
on a stream? I don't know who

1668
02:19:46,479 --> 02:19:52,159
voice of reason is. There's a
million atheists agnostic people, so but maybe

1669
02:19:52,239 --> 02:19:56,000
one day evon Estrada three dollars,
how do I call in? The Twitter

1670
02:19:56,040 --> 02:19:58,600
link is bugged? I don't know
what Twitter link bug means it's you go

1671
02:19:58,680 --> 02:20:03,040
to my Twitter. It's the space
is right there. So I don't know

1672
02:20:03,120 --> 02:20:07,159
what you mean bugged. How does
one get saved in your worldview? Well,

1673
02:20:07,360 --> 02:20:11,120
we don't have this idea that salvation
is like this Roman's road, you

1674
02:20:11,159 --> 02:20:15,399
know, combe, dono alta bill
aguelmo, I've got hat choose pizzla,

1675
02:20:15,479 --> 02:20:18,159
don hilp alto. If you're coma
givill halt to jo, I'll give you

1676
02:20:18,239 --> 02:20:22,719
a little cocola on hats pizza.
We don't have that. Okay, So

1677
02:20:22,760 --> 02:20:26,680
you got to be catechized. You
enter the church six months, three year,

1678
02:20:26,799 --> 02:20:31,879
two year process of catechisas depending upon
your situation. Uh, and then

1679
02:20:31,920 --> 02:20:35,159
you beat test. Then you have
to get your PhD. In the Cappadocians.

1680
02:20:35,319 --> 02:20:39,959
And as those guys said, you
read the Cappa Docans in the original

1681
02:20:41,040 --> 02:20:45,600
Latin, even though the Cappuditions were
Greek. But procrastinator two dollars, what's

1682
02:20:45,600 --> 02:20:50,559
your advice or thoughts on procrastination?
Well, number one, don't call yourself

1683
02:20:50,600 --> 02:20:54,639
procrastinator, because you're just reinforcinating,
reinforcing that in your head. But calling

1684
02:20:54,680 --> 02:21:01,040
yourself procrastinator. So if you want
to fight procrastination. Get chalk. Chalk

1685
02:21:01,120 --> 02:21:05,079
dot com will give you so much
energy you'll be so amped up, especially

1686
02:21:05,159 --> 02:21:07,399
from the tongkat Ali. Head on
over to chalk dot com right now at

1687
02:21:07,440 --> 02:21:11,959
cchoq dot I'm using from J fifty
to get fifty percent off all those excellent

1688
02:21:11,959 --> 02:21:16,520
products, especially the Chad mode which
is now out, which is awesome.

1689
02:21:16,200 --> 02:21:22,280
But if you mix it with the
Patristic faith uh coffee. Ah, yes,

1690
02:21:22,399 --> 02:21:26,000
the lower coffee is listed in the
show description. There's the link if

1691
02:21:26,000 --> 02:21:28,799
you want to get that great coffee. Thank you for reminding me of that,

1692
02:21:30,120 --> 02:21:33,600
FDA. Get that link in the
show description and you can support my

1693
02:21:33,719 --> 02:21:37,680
work as well as Father Deacon Ananias's
work through lower Coffee, which will help

1694
02:21:37,719 --> 02:21:45,239
you to not procrastinate. So substances
such as chalk and coffee you can help

1695
02:21:45,280 --> 02:21:52,760
you to not procrastinate. Let's see
who's next, Dan moletor what's up Dan?

1696
02:21:54,799 --> 02:21:56,479
By the way, we're gonna have
to close it out pretty soon.

1697
02:21:56,520 --> 02:22:01,319
I have to go. I have
an interview with Deanna Lorraine tonight, so

1698
02:22:01,840 --> 02:22:09,879
this will probably be our last question
here tonight. Jay. So it's actually

1699
02:22:09,959 --> 02:22:16,879
just based off of what you just
talked about with Capital punishment or definitely can

1700
02:22:16,920 --> 02:22:20,159
you or father you can an and
ize speak to because I think when when

1701
02:22:20,200 --> 02:22:26,440
you say pacifism, like the Protestant
mindset will probably think of like the murtyrs

1702
02:22:26,600 --> 02:22:31,639
or turn the other cheeks, like
how how do you? Yeah, I

1703
02:22:31,639 --> 02:22:33,760
think that I think the answer,
yeah, this is a fair question.

1704
02:22:33,840 --> 02:22:41,120
And I think the answer to this
is that there's gonna be wisdom in determining

1705
02:22:41,239 --> 02:22:46,479
what the right action is in the
right situation. So there's not necessarily a

1706
02:22:46,559 --> 02:22:52,719
one size fits all solution to how
you, as a Christian would handle any

1707
02:22:52,959 --> 02:22:58,319
possible situation that comes along. So
let's say I'm a soldier and I'm called

1708
02:22:58,360 --> 02:23:03,159
into battle for let's say for the
Sego argument legitimate reasons. It would not

1709
02:23:03,239 --> 02:23:07,799
be legitimate in that case to say, oh, I'm suddenly a pacifist and

1710
02:23:07,840 --> 02:23:11,360
I'm not going to defend my homeland
because oh, I'm a pacifist. That

1711
02:23:11,399 --> 02:23:16,559
would be cowardice. So you would
not be exercising the virtue of bravery in

1712
02:23:16,920 --> 02:23:22,319
defying the providential situations scenario that comes
about for you where you should fight.

1713
02:23:22,959 --> 02:23:28,799
If I am I don't know,
a hermit out in the woods and a

1714
02:23:28,920 --> 02:23:31,200
battalion of soldiers. This has happened
many times in the history of the church.

1715
02:23:31,280 --> 02:23:37,120
Right comes out to my hermitage and
says, we're going to chop your

1716
02:23:37,399 --> 02:23:41,360
head off because you confess Christ.
To step outside here, it would not

1717
02:23:41,559 --> 02:23:45,559
it would be absurd to fight back
in that situation, right, So that

1718
02:23:45,600 --> 02:23:48,639
would be a call to martyrdom.
So, in other words, my take

1719
02:23:48,719 --> 02:23:52,319
on this is that I think in
various situations, depending upon our station and

1720
02:23:52,319 --> 02:23:58,120
our calling in life, will determine
what the right course of action is.

1721
02:23:58,159 --> 02:24:03,559
So, maybe you know, a
burglar breaks into my house at night and

1722
02:24:03,639 --> 02:24:07,200
he says, I'm going to take
your wife and your children and do what

1723
02:24:07,239 --> 02:24:11,079
I want with them. Okay,
that is not the time to say,

1724
02:24:11,079 --> 02:24:13,280
oh, I'm a silly man pacifist, do whatever you want. Now,

1725
02:24:13,319 --> 02:24:16,559
I have a duty to stand up
and protect my wife and my children,

1726
02:24:16,559 --> 02:24:22,000
and that would be soy pacifism.
To not step up, I would be

1727
02:24:22,000 --> 02:24:28,360
being a coward in that situation.
So the context will determine our actions that

1728
02:24:28,440 --> 02:24:31,760
are appropriate to what the situation is. Father Deacon A degree. Yeah,

1729
02:24:31,760 --> 02:24:35,959
I want to add too, that
we need to be careful of not kind

1730
02:24:37,000 --> 02:24:43,760
of falling into a continent deontological ethics. Rule worshiping. This is not how

1731
02:24:43,799 --> 02:24:48,040
we Orthodox do this. So when
we read commands like thou shall not lie

1732
02:24:48,600 --> 02:24:54,360
turn the other cheek, it's exactly
as Jay said that, Well, there's

1733
02:24:54,399 --> 02:25:00,399
going to be uh, that's not
a rule applied everywhere, at all times,

1734
02:25:00,440 --> 02:25:03,360
in all places, in all situations, in the same way. Otherwise

1735
02:25:03,440 --> 02:25:09,600
we're gonna be falling into kind of
a Kantian deontological ethics. And we certainly

1736
02:25:09,639 --> 02:25:15,959
aren't this Orthodox that And really what
you see is uh committing the fallacy of

1737
02:25:16,120 --> 02:25:20,440
accident. Accident. The fallacy of
accident is taking a rule and apply it

1738
02:25:20,520 --> 02:25:26,120
to cases it's not intended to apply
to. So you get a lot of

1739
02:25:26,120 --> 02:25:30,239
people, will you never ever ever
lie? Well, I found some of

1740
02:25:30,280 --> 02:25:35,399
the fathers say that in times it's
actually morally required for you to lie.

1741
02:25:35,200 --> 02:25:41,399
Let me give you another example.
You should always give property back to its

1742
02:25:41,520 --> 02:25:46,920
rightful owner. And uh, you
borrowed a hunting rifle from your neighbor.

1743
02:25:48,840 --> 02:25:52,200
And he's got he's broken up with
his wife, and he's been on a

1744
02:25:52,239 --> 02:25:56,479
meth for a week, and he's
he's uh, he says, I'm gonna

1745
02:25:56,680 --> 02:26:01,120
he's totally falling apart. I'm gonna
kill my wife, he says, and

1746
02:26:01,159 --> 02:26:07,959
I'm going to murder everybody in the
block. And then he asks you for

1747
02:26:07,719 --> 02:26:13,319
his rifle back. And what do
you do if you're a contient, Well,

1748
02:26:15,000 --> 02:26:20,120
the rule is you always give property
back to its rightful owner. You

1749
02:26:20,159 --> 02:26:24,639
see that that's committing the fallacy of
accidents. So this is an analogy for

1750
02:26:26,079 --> 02:26:31,159
turning the other cheek. Yes,
it's a general rule, and there's cases

1751
02:26:31,200 --> 02:26:33,159
that wouldn't apply to you. And
if you don't think so, you're committing

1752
02:26:33,200 --> 02:26:37,360
the fallacy the accident. That's what
I would add. Yeah, great point.

1753
02:26:37,479 --> 02:26:39,360
Thank you guys so much. I
am going to have to run.

1754
02:26:39,440 --> 02:26:43,600
I've got the interview tonight with Leanna
Lorraine. We're gonna be talking about i'm

1755
02:26:43,600 --> 02:26:48,719
sure British intelligence type stuff and what
happened to Kate Middleton. I have no

1756
02:26:48,799 --> 02:26:52,799
idea. Nobody really knows why she's
missing, so I don't know, but

1757
02:26:52,840 --> 02:26:56,040
we'll be speculating on what might be
going on, So look for that tonight.

1758
02:26:56,079 --> 02:26:58,719
I thank you guys so much.
If you would like to share and

1759
02:27:00,000 --> 02:27:03,479
support the show via the stream labs
function, or you can also if you

1760
02:27:03,680 --> 02:27:09,559
like tonight's discussion on this, you
can get all of my apologetic essays in

1761
02:27:09,639 --> 02:27:13,000
One Big Fat Thing, Essays on
Theologian philosophy at the website and