What's up y'all is Drusky and I've teamed up with Mountain Dew to produce a hilarious new basketball podcast called The due Zone with Drusky. Learn the backstories of your favorite balls and celebrities like Jamal Murray. Did you have like a favorite team? Was it the Raptors at the time or no? Was the Raptors even started around the topic? Come on, Brode like I'm fifty, Taylor Rogues, Asian Wilson, and any more. You won't want to miss this. Listen to The due Zone with Drusky on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and wherever you listen to podcasts. This podcast episode is brought to you by Coors Light. These days, everything is go, go go. It's NonStop hustle all the time. Work, friends, family, expect you to be on twenty four to seven. Well, sometimes you just need to reach for a Coors Light because it's made to chill. Corse Light is cold loggered, cold filtered, and cold package. It's as crisp and refreshing as the Colorado Rockies. He's literally made to chill. Corse Light is the one I choose when I need to unwind. So when you want to hit reset, reach for the beer that's made to chill. Get Coors Light and the new look delivered straight to your door, which drizzle your instant cart. Celebrate responsibly. Coors Brewing Company, Golden Colorado. What is krak alackin Hardwin Knocks Listeners. Yes, it happened. Victor Oladipo was traded to the Houston Rockets, the move that we were all waiting for. We were also waiting for that. James Harden got to get moved, and he did. It happened rather quickly. He just decided to go scorched Earth after their loss to the Lakers the other night. I believed, and they granted his wish and they moved him within I think eighteen hours of his comments of saying that the Rockets basically sucked and there was no hope for him. That was not verbatim. I'm giving as synopsis of it. Who better to bring on to just go through this type of fourteen megabuster. We'll get to the details, but it involved the Rockets, the nets, the pacers, and the calves. But who better to go through this with than my good friend and colleague Bleacher Reports Grant Hughes. As ever follow him on Twitter at gt underscore Hughes and check look at his work. He's a fantastic writer in basketball mind and it's always fun to do these reaction pods with you. Grant first and foremost, though, how are you doing tonight? I'm doing well, Always glad to be honest speak with you. And you've given out my Twitter handle? Actually, you know makes sense? Say because it did you realize I tweeted today? I didn't get my notification on my phone that say Grant Hugh was tweeted for the first time in a while, So no, I didn't. It was really it was really great. It was something like I don't know who won the trade, but it made all parties involved more fun. That's kind of analysis you get when you come to my underscore US account. Look, the one thing I want to say really quickly is I am kind of done with the or was done with the hardened? Where is he gonna go on? Is he gonna get moved? Discourse? Him getting moved to one of the two primary teams he wanted to get moved to was so anticlimactic and disappointing. I really wanted him to just go somewhere random. And I know now because of Kyrie and stuff and Brooklyn that is interesting, and then what does this mean for Philly and YadA, YadA, YadA. There's all this cool fallout that we will talk about. But I wanted to see him go to like Toronto, not even making fun of Toronto, but like, let me see him in Toronto, or you know, ship him through like New Orleans, just going nuclear. I wanted something like that to happen. I'm convinced that you, like you talked yourself into that just because like I was, and I'm sure everybody that kind of is in our line of work was so tired of, well, it's Brooklyn or it's Philly and we don't know when it's gonna be or what exactly, but those are the only two teams. And then like you get sick of thinking that and you just want something else. And I totally sympathize with that, because it's like, you know, I had just people friends that follow the NBA casually before, like literally today, based on his comments last night of like, oh this is gonna happen. Now he really turned the heat up. They're like, where do you think he's gonna go? And it's just like it's Brooklyn or Philly, like it's not. I wish I had something more interesting, just like I just it just wasn't. It didn't make sense. No place else made perfect sense, which was why somebody's else would have been more fun. But it just wasn't to be. Well, I couldn't vince myself it wasn't going to be Philly. And that's something we could get into later. But let's se I want to probably better to break this down team by team, and I'll throw with you first, but let's let's go through these details. So why don't you sit tight for an hour and then I'll just run through the all the moving parts. Here, here's the full trade. This is per Sham Shurania over at the Athletic. The Houston Rockets are getting Victor Oladipo, Dante Exam Rodeon's coup Roots, three Brooklyn Nets first rounders outright in twenty twenty two, twenty twenty four. In twenty twenty six, they're getting one Milwaukee first rounder in twenty twenty two it's unprotected and via the calves, and then they're getting four Brooklyn first round swaps twenty twenty one, twenty twenty three twenty five and twenty twenty seven as far out as you can go right now, the Nets are getting James Harden the Pacer. Oh and they're also getting a second round pick. I have not confirmed the year though. The Pacers are getting Iris LeVert and a second rounder. The Calves were getting Jared Allen and Torrean Prints. Let's start with we should definitely start with the Pacers here. Now, let's start. Let's start. Let's start with the Rockets. What were your what are your thoughts, general impressions, grades, whatever that you have for them, and how they did in this deal. Yeah, so you and I and some other some others did kind of quick reaction grades. And I already don't remember what mine were exactly, but because that's just how my brain works. But I know the Rockets to me, like did I don't know what the grade is. It's an A, it's some version of an A. But but like, just looking at where they were as far as everyone in the world had known for months that this guy wants out, they were going to have to trade him, and really it seemed like in the end they were only competing with one other team, right, so, which was the Sixers and so you wouldn't think necessarily that that would you know, enable them to get as much as they got. So all those picks, everything's unprotected. I don't know if you specified that, but all those you don't forgot to. But there's just nothing like they are just getting the nets unprotected first and even years through twenty twenty six and swapping in the odd ones basically, plus that the cows pick via the bucks. It's just they're just getting those picks. That is because of the way I phrase it, that's a better way to look at it, where it's like you just have every single Brooklyn pick unprotected from now until two twenty seven. Yeah, And like this is kind of a trend that we've seen, you know, because with with if you weren't giving you know, the picks out right, you were giving swaps in the odd years to get around the stepping and rule, like the Paul George trade and the Westbrook trade, and you know, various recent Superstar trades have kind of had that structure. But the only the only thing I could quibble with, and it's a minor thing really in the scheme of this is that they swapped carous Lat for Victor Aldipo, who is in the last year of his deal. To me, I think Lavert might have had more value if you were thinking just as an asset like longer, you know, seventeen and a half million dollars a year on average over the next three and he's at worst a really good sixth man with an injury history. Sure, but Oladipo is not exactly you know, Sterling in that regard. So I think I think Oladipo, they they must have just wanted him, or they were kind of into the idea of like, hey, when he's off our books, we might actually have cap space, which is crazy to think about. For the lo and behold the Rockets on accident of course the tax again, yeah, I mean that we probably should have led with that because but yeah, no, I think the Rockets did phenomenally well. They basically, you know, if Brooklyn is bad, the Rockets reap the benefits for the better part of a decade, which is I mean, the Nets I think at some point are going to be bad. You know, like the team they've constructed is a bunch of guys, you know, to the two principles, Harden and Duran are over thirty hard and I think every one agrees is probably not going to age great Kyrie Irving, who knows. We probably should talk about that at some point. But yeah, I thought the Rockets did super well and they didn't really seem to be in a position of a whole lot of leverage, so to do this, I was really impressed. I think they got a ton. Yeah, and also it came at a time when his value theoretically never should have been the lower because of how poorly he was playing, and he just came right out and said, this shit's unfixable, basically, and I think what probably helped them. And it's kind of in the same vein of what happened with New Orleans and Milwaukee, where Milwaukee couldn't afford to lose Janis, so New Orleans could basically set the market Andrew Holiday because he was available, and now you're looking this is sort of different. But because the Ben Simmons scenario was lurking in Philly, you had to beat out the idea of Houston getting a twenty four year old All NBA type player under contracts for a half decade. The only way to do that. And I probably still would have preferred Ben Simmons if Houston. But the only way to do that is to include all the picks plus Caro Silverton, Jared Now and your your best players there they were able to broker that. I share your thoughts on the Oladipo stuff there. He definitely is a higher ceiling than Carol Silvert. You look at what he's able to do. Defensively, Lavert is the better passer. They're both, I'll say they're even as like off the dribble scoreres Lavert's again shooting thirty five point seven percent. I'll pull up threes after doing so at thirty eight point seven percent clip last time last year. Vitor Oladipo has been hitting those looks pretty efficiently. He's probably the easier fit, at least statistically off the ball right now. Lavert's always struggled with that for some reason. I don't know if because they don't have a bunch of their own picks in the near term, that Oladipo is more interesting to them because he actually uplifts their roster, or if this is an issue of well, maybe this year they're trying to see if they could make the playoffs and then they can be a sign and trade vessel for him this summer, or I've considered, do they just believe that, you know, it's let's say it caused Caius Lavert and a second to get Victor Ladipo. Are you just betting that you can get more for Victor Oladipo closer to the trade? Devine's a tough that's a tough call. I mean, it depends on what it's my gut, my first reaction when because we didn't know that the Oladipo Lavert thing was part of this until I don't know, like it's sort of like the second phase of the second series of tweets that came out after we knew the deal was done. But my gut was that just like it seems to me that the Rockets just preferred Oladipo. They are just convinced that he's the better player because contract wise, you know, I think Lavert is just is just a better value. But I agree with you that you know, certainly Oladipo's had the higher ceiling. He was an all justifiable All NBA player that but you know, granted that's a couple of years ago now and prior to a significant injury. I have some reservations about Oladipo. Like I've watched the Pacers a handful of times. I can't proclaim to be an expert, and probably should have. You should probably be talking to Caitln Cooper about the But like he he doesn't look he looks to It looks to me like the all NBA level is just not attainable. I think he could be an all Star guy, but he's not quite as quick. He's getting to the room more, but he's not finishing nearly as well there as he did. So just little signs of, you know, the balance and the explosion just aren't going to be all the way back. I don't know what the answer is in terms of to me, if the Rockets intend to trade Oladipot before the deadline, which seems I just gut it seems unlikely. I still think, do you get a first for him if if the team that's getting him isn't sure he's going to resign. It's that it's the same thing you run through with any you know, expiring contract trade. But yeah, I don't know. We're just circling over the top of each other now. In terms of the old Depot thing. Hey, everyone Before we get into today's pod, I want to tell you about Blue Wire Hustle, a brand new program where you can host your very own podcast here at blue wire Us. What was created to give everyone the opportunity to take your podcast to the next level. Or if you want to host a podcast and just don't know where to start, Hustle is the perfect place for you. 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But that's BW Hustle com slash joint Sugar Ray Leonard, Roberto Duran, Marvelous, Marvin Hagler, and Thomas Hearns legends whose four way rivalry define one of the greatest errors in boxing history, relive their decade of dominance in the new Showtime Sports documentary The Kings, a four parts series premiering Sunday, June sixth, only on Showtime. Do we agree that the Rockets did the best out of the teams involved in this or do you think someone else? It's such a hard comparison because the other things are some minor compared to what they did. But I think Cleveland's might have been their side might have been more of a no brainer, just because you give up a unless something like if Drew Holliday leaves Milwaukee this summer or something like that twenty twenty two pick is going to be garbage positioning, and so you turn it into Jared Allen essentially and Torrian Prince, who in theory is a useful one who can hit threes. You don't want him operating off the dribble and he's always underachieved defensively, but just another way to put on your roster. And he comes off the after next season, I believe. But and then you get Jared Allen, who's a viable defensive anchor, a better fit long term, just with age and function to your roster. And yes, he's going to be a restricted free agent, and yes the Cavs were going to have cap space, so they could have theoretically gotten him for nothing. It is so hard to poach worthwhile restricted free agents, and now they have the VETO rights on him, and I think that's sort of made this more of a no brainer. I know, now you sort of tether yourself to the rising cost of a roster since he's going to run long term money, Colin Sexton's extension eligible, Darius Garland's going to be right behind him. You still have Kevin Love on the books. At the same time, they might have just paid Andre Drummond over the next two or three years. Anyway, I'd rather have Jared Allen over the next four than whatever Andre Drummond's gonna give you at that price point. So I thought that was more of a no brainer. But I think because their outlook in Houston was just so dire, and you knew how this was going to end. You could probably spin it as they made out the best of any team just because they had the gloomiest outlook of any of them. And just I mean, you know, you mentioned the nets and we should probably wrap up the Cavs quickly. I'll throw that to you in a second, since I just talked about them. But having those picks goes so far out. I don't know when Brooklyn's going to be bad. But even if you resign Kevin Durant, Kyrie Irving, and James Harden, all of whom I believe have player options in the summer of twenty two, correct, Like, that's still that title windows going to run its course even with two or all three of those stars in tow. And so when you get to like twenty twenty five, like that's when those picks start to get super valuable. And then who knows whereth Houston is at that point, Maybe they do need a top prospect, Maybe they're so good that they can use those picks to trade for another star or something. So they got eight, They in essence got eight first round picks. That's what they essentially got here. That is that is wild, It's it's unheard of. I'd real quick on Cleveland. It's because this nobody cares relative to the rest of this. But like, what don't we always ask bad teams to do, you know, if they have cap space, you know, instead of spending it, instead of whatever, just take on bad money with a first attached. Like that's our just default. That's what we always ask bad teams to do. And so I think if you're critical of Cleveland for taking on Tory and Prince, who I think is bad money, all this is is just pretend Jared Allen is a future first or what you just think of that as the asset that you're getting with this bad money, Like it's the same thing. So I just I don't know what the what the possible criticisms of Cleveland's into this could be. But if it's that that like, oh, you know, you got this dead salary of prints you're gonna have to pay Allen, just think of it like he's twenty two, right, Like, just think of it as you got a really useful, valuable first round pick and you have to take on a guy that's got twenty five million or so over the next two years. Like that's just that's good business, that's smart. I think the calves And now you look at if you have Sexton and Garland, who have both looked just like objectively good this year when they've played, and you have now a twenty two year old center like Timeline starting to line up, you have seventy five bigs on the roster that'll have to change, Like that's one of the shots. But the other thing is, like I did see criticism on Twitter for that. It's like Andre Drummond is going to be a free agent. Maybe you could set and it's McGee and it's like, you can't. You can't think in terms of Kevin Love's contract either. It just you can't. It can't work like that. And but just before I throw it back to you and started for interrupting, it's like no Coro nance and Alan as a front court that is incredibly great, Like defensively that has serious potential, that's really fun. Yeah I should I didn't even think of a Coro as part of that core. But yeah, he's got some, he's got a little something. I think so far we've seen at least athletically and defensively that's fun. We got to talk Brooklyn, though, I guess right, I'm gonna guess you're higher on the Brooklyn side than I am, because I've gradually talked myself into it being a kind of a catastrophe for the nets. Do you remember what you gave him as a great when you were doing it for Bleacher Report? I gave a C. I do remember that. So I gave him a B minus, which means we're not like too far away, but you seem like you're ready to give him an F when I was texting you before we started. Yeah, and this just is I'm pretty fickle, but but I just the more I thought about it, So they got the best player in the trade, right, Like, that's that's probably your starting point. That's generally that's in terms of when superstars get traded. You always talk about the other side got seventy five cents on the dollar or however you want. You know, they got a bunch of pieces and assets and whatever, and it just never seems to go as well for that end of it. So you got the best player. That's good. From there, It's just I don't know where to start really, I mean, the obvious, the obvious one, And the really hack take is you know that there's only one ball thing, And to me, that's just like so trite and so easy to say that, Like I almost don't want to say it. But Harden is like the most singular distillation of that kind of idea where he has played this one unique way for a very long time, and I'm not convinced that he can play a different way. Like you cannot have Houston Rockets James Harden on the nets, I don't think if you did. Like Durant and Kyrie Irving are pretty awesome space there's and you're never going to be able to throw two guys at Harden without really paying for it. But I just have a hard time believing that the Nets are going to just become the Rockets and Harden's gonna play the same just the fit the fit issue, the one ball thing that, to me is a real kind of minefield that I just Steve Nash is a first year coach. I know Dan Tony's there. That's just a lot to try to figure out over the course of a trunk aid season with major stakes, because as you said twenty twenty two, all these guys can go or you know, somebody's going to be unhappy. That's something. So that's the big one. The other thing is, are you telling me, I know Bradley Beal is not technically available, are you telling me that you couldn't have put like seventy five percent of this offer on the table to get bal who I think would have made more sense and I think would have not just completely you know, assured that Bill's a bad defender, but I think Harden's on another level. Like I just the opportunity cost thing. What was the urgency on Brooklyn's part to give up so much for just this guy? There were gonna be other players where you wouldn't have had this surrender as much. Maybe you hold on the Allen and your defense isn't god awful at the rim forever from now on? Maybe you know, I don't know what the other moves are. I just have a hard time getting, you know, feeling good about giving up this much for this guy right now, with all the fit issues, with all the defensive issues, it's going to cost. I just it just makes me. It makes me think that that look, the ceiling may be higher, because maybe there's a splim chance that this roofs it's the roof. The ceiling is the roof. Yeah, but like the disaster potential is immense now, I think, and the negative consequences of this going disasterously are similarly immense, because if you are bad, you have no route out of this, Like you're just giving top five picks to the rockets forever if you're bad. So I just that's I'll throw it to you. I'm sure I'm gonna come up with five more things. But but that's kind of where I've sort of slid down to after thinking initially, well, they got the best player, they're gonna outscore absolutely everybody, but then all the doubts kind of started to creep in. So that's kind of where I'm at on it. Yeah, And I don't know if it's I think the more I've thought about it, and maybe part of listening to you has made me a little bit lower on it. They've just they've shrunken their window so much. And I don't want to compare it to what they did with Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett because age thirty one, James Harden is not age thirty seven. Kevin Garnett is not age thirty six Paul Pierce. So there's a huge difference there. I'm wondering, and maybe this is where it hurts us that we haven't done any other research before. We're like, we're listening to other cakes before we're coding. This podcast doesn't say anything about Brooklyn's view on the viability of Kyrie Irving long term that they went ahead and did this. Now, I don't want to speculate why he's not with the team, and I would I've basically held off commenting on it until we actually know, because you know that the Nets and presumably his teammates no, actually more than they're letting on too, if he actually hasn't spoken with his teammates or Kevin Durant like, yeah, there's an issue with that. The thing that still is tough to reconcile is he is the vice president of the players union that collectively bargained this season set up, including what's happening now where there's even more, you know, stringent measures being put in place. And then to see the video of him and is I think it was his sister's thirtieth birthday party without a mask. I know it's immediate family, but again, this was just part of the deal of signing on to play this season, and you're the vice president of the players unions. That's what's tough for me to wrap my head around. I understand that the coverage of him to some extent has been unfair. I've gone back and forth with I'm uncomfortable how his mood swings have been covered. That information is just out there and it's almost disguarded as if, what if it's actually a symptom of something else. I'm also not going to dikenose Kyrie Irving from afar because that's unfair. One I can't I'm not an expert. But two, that's unfair to Kyrie Irving. Two you can't just assume that he's depressed all the time. So I don't know enough to really pass a judgment on the Kyrie Irving stuff and how validated or not this absences, or how extensive or not it is. The latter I think is what's more important is you made this deal now for a reason. It came together super quickly. It seems like there was at least it was happening last night, Like just the sense of the way Harden was playing, Like you get the sense this was unfolding before Harden's actual oppressor, and maybe he just decided to unleash to get it past the goal line, or because he was just done and knew it was happening. Who knows. That's the thing that I have to wrap my head around. And you've you have subscribed yourself to this two year window by having Kevin Durant and Kyrie Irving, and what you what you've done is look, Kevin duran as we're recording this, played into a back to back for the first time, and he beat the Knicks. But it's it's the Knicks you've You're better suited now to navigate the games he will miss and the games that Kyrie Irving's already missing and inevitably well miss as well in a way that Caro Silvert was never going to help you do. Maybe if Spencer did. When he never gets injured, It's harder for me to wrap my head around the logic here. I think now though star Power had to trounce depth for them just because of what they're dealing with in terms of in what he's injured. We don't know what is going on with Kyrie Irving and just looking at the long term trajectory of this team. I don't know that you could bank on, you know, all three of these guys being here past their current contracts, you know when they're able to opt out. And Kyrie's long just been fickle. He wanted his number retired in Boston, only didn't leave that following summer. And so you've inoculated yourself a little bit maybe against him becoming disenchanted with the franchise. And I think that's where it's justifiable. And because you're on this finite win anyway, it does make sense to go all in. I would be curious to know one, whether Kyrie was on board or how much he knew about this. And two, you have to assume Kevin Durant gave the green light here, because you're not making Kevin Durant's the one who can dictate the decision making here. Because he's Kevin Durant, he's more important to you than Kyrie Irving is like, that's just a fact, especially given how Katie is played now. So I as you you said, the one ball argument is kind of like lowbrow, and it is, but they're too easy. It's too easy. At the same time, one of these guys needs to be the third option, and I don't think any of them are gonna feel good about it. And it's not going to be Kevin Durant, Like that's not going to be your third option, even though he might functionally be the best suited to be the third option because of how good is he sort of has done this, you know, so, and maybe that's what makes it easier. And the other thing is like you can kind of use James Harden as your Carris Lavert just without bringing him off the bench, because they were basically before the injuries, before Kyrie's absence, Katie and Kyrie Irving were just playing so many minutes together. And so now you can still do that, but instead of, you know, maybe you just stagger hardened from the two of them. And there's the sense that that works. Still, it's fair to question, like how this looks on offense. And I'll close it with this, James Harden has taken over the past two seasons and eight games, because that's how many games he's played this year, he has taken one thousand, nine hundred and forty three three pointers. How many of those do you think have come off the catch? I was gonna cut you off and say you're gonna you're gonna give a James Harden catch and shoot stat right now. I have no idea, but I'm sure the number is like a joke. How small it is, one hundred and fifty five, which is fewer than eight percent of all his three point attempts. That's and Love hit him at the catch and shoot ones. I didn't calculate that, but he was. I put that's on me. I put you on the spot, my fault. It's a quick eye test, though. He is probably about like forty percent on them from what it looks like he was over. He's been over. Oh yeah, he's well over forty percent. So there's that probably about forty two percent. So that's good. But it's such an infrequent part of his game, and he was playing with other stars during that time. That's Chris Paul, Russell Westbrook and then whatever time he spent with John wall I guess this year. So I think it's fair to question how the fit works out. I would default too. I think they'll be fine offensively. So the questions are what happens to the defense, What does this look like long term? Have you mortgaged too much of your future, or you've actually done the right thing, because hey, maybe this is something where you couldn't count on Kyrie to stick around anyway, and you'll still have James Harden and Kevin Durant, and look, whoever resigns from this group, I think it's probably fair to say that let's just throw the contracts out of the equation. How long do you think the title window in Brooklyn would be open with at least two of these three players? There? Probably three four years? Yeah, not beyond that, certainly, just because you know Harton and Durant will be in their mid to late thirties. You know, that's just that's it. And if you view it through that context though, of hey, we're trying to wedge open a three to four year window, I find it more justifiable. But again, at the same time, and I won't give away this tape because it's something I have about why I didn't think the Fixer should do it. I'm not I'm just not sure this was the season to make such a move like this interesting, all right, So I gotta hit a couple of things that that stuck out to me. Because we're gonna stick with Brooklyn So the first thing is I agree that Durant had to have had had to have given an okay or a nudge maybe like hey, you need to do this. And that is to me like inextricable from the irving situation. Like if we presume that Durant knows something, let's Stephen A. Smith, I think has said like Kyrie should retire. I don't know. I don't know, Like, but let's say that's like putting like value or to a situation that we really don't I'm sure our media members that no more like we know that's how the game works. Yeah, still, like we don't know enough to be like, oh, Kyrie doesn't want to play basketball. It's like, I mean, Kyrie's ridiculously good at basketball. I'm gonna go out a legend say he at least enjoys it to some extent and maybe just hate sing and that goes with us. He seems unhappy or less happy about literally everything else bud basketball, Like I think, you know. So that's that's a little out there. But so the Kyrie thing is interesting because like which way, let's say hypothetically the Nets, Durant, somebody involved on that side hasn't has reason to believe that Irving is just not going to be around, whether that's the rest of this year or whatever. Let's say that that was part of the impetus for well, shit, we gotta get hardened in here, or if Durant says, you gotta get me somebody, if I'm not going to have this guy, let's just say hypothetically, that's it. I think that actually makes the trade. I mean, in one sense, you gotta do what Durant says like that, I guess, But just from a competitive perspective, that makes the trade less defensible because if you're talking about, well, the nets are pushing for this tiny window, that what they're trying to do is get the ceiling as high as possible. I don't think hard and Durant and like what they've got left is enough. I think if you're going for the high ceiling, you need all three of those guys. So if part of the reasoning was we're not going to have Kyrie, so let's do this, I don't know. I think that at least that's at least a debate like that at least cuts both ways for whether that justifies or sort of whatever. The opposite of justifies. It pushes you, pushes you away from doing the deal, just because the ceiling is lower without Kyrie. The other thing is like, there is a lot of sense to me in how they how the nets could stagger right, Like just if you say Harden is going to be the LeVert, that's cool, Like he can just he could play Harden ball with you know, And however many minutes Duran and Irving aren't out there. Whatever you want to do. But again, if your goal is to win the most important games against the best competition, you got to be able to put all three of these guys on the floor at the same time. And it has to work, because you know, that's just you can't. It's it's cool if it's going to preserve these guys in the regular season, or the fit works better if you split them up. But in the end, they got to play together, and they got to play against really great defenses and defend really great offenses. And that's the last thing is I think Brooklyn is going to lead the league into the amount of zone defense played for the rest of the year. I would bet almost anything on it, because this is untenable. Like DeAndre Jordan cannot move and James Harden. Defenses have been designed specifically to switch just for him for years and so now like that's not gonna work because you're gonna involve Jordan and Harden in every pick and roll and like, that's just you can't. The Nets defense. As bad as it is, it just got so much worse. So I just think you cannot engage teams man demand from now on. I think you have to play zone. It's gonna be crazy. It's gonna look like a college team. But I will bet you look don't. I don't know, but if it were me, like I would just look at the personnel and say, we can't guard anybody straight up. We have to do weird stuff. And I think, if any that's one of the most interesting aspects to me is how the Nets are going to figure out ways to make this defense not the bottom five, like, because that's where they're headed with this with the players they have right now. But it's kind of ironic. They're thirteenth per cleaning the glass and points allowed per possession. There's a lot of noise in there. But I looked at their defensive location affect the field goal percentage, which just in case anyone doesn't know is if this team allowed the league average field goal percentage from all their locations on the floor, what would be their opponent's expective field goal percentage? They rank fifth in this and so they're allowing, for the most part the right types of shots. They're thirteenth in the frequency with which opponents shoot at the rim and their fifth in three point a tenth three. Now, how much of the rim stuff changes without Jared Allen there? DeAndre Jordan just picked up it did not play coach's decision the day before the game, before the trade and when ESPN tret out the tweet out the graphic of the nets new lineup, they went with Jeff Green instead of DeAndre Jordan. I don't know how tell tell that is, but that is kind of funny because you would think that DeAndre Jordan just has the should have a more name recognition at that point. It's it really is fair to wonder though, like had they made a move for Aaron Gordon without having it, like, could they I still feel like they could do. They could have done. Spencer didnwanny in a pick for Aaron Gordon or something, or maybe even Orlando's willing to do Spencer Dinwoody, and I'm not sure if the salaries match up Spencer Dinwoodie and salary for Aaron Gordon, just because they want to take the they want, they don't have cap space. They think Spencer Didnty is a great fit. A cl Tears aren't the end of the world, and they want Spencer Dinwoody. Maybe that's something they consider doing. I still think this team is incredibly good, if not better equipped. Again, though, this all presumes that the Kyrie Irving stuff isn't an issue, and that's where and here's the other thing for me is I don't I'm not really the opportunity cost of tangible assets isn't that big of a deal because James Harton is worth Torrian Prince, Cruts LeVert and Jared Allen in a vacuum. Jared Allen is not changing your defense. He might up a floor a little bit, he's not changing it. And I would argue he's definitely moves really well on defense and he can step out of the paint. But you could probably approximate his value on the cheap, and he was headed towards restricted free agency, so you might have viewed that as a lost cause anyway, I'm not saying go out and sign Dwayne Dedman and you're going to be fine. That's not what I'm trying to imply. It's the picks that are unsettling. And so if you remove the picks from the equation which mattered to this trade, this deal becomes a lot more defensible from a pure basketball standpoint. I think where the risk really is involved is the future beyond this title window. I don't think they wedged it open any longer than it already was, but they probably have maximized it again, particularly if you just have no idea what's going to happen with Kyrie Irving right now. Yeah, I just I don't know. I think we do get caught up. This is sort of related to what I was saying earlier about like it really just matters that your best players can play together at the end of the game. We do get caught up in depth, I think in ways that ultimately aren't aren't as a important as as we think they are, particularly with respect to like, if you're in a finals game, you're only playing seven eight guys and everybody's playing thirty eight minutes. So I think it's irrefutable that Brooklyn got way thinner, but maybe that doesn't matter as much. Again, though, I just I just have such a heart. I'm understanding how they're gonna defend. I just I just don't know. It is gonna be interesting to me because I if this works, I'm not really sure how you guard them guard the nets. So it's gonna be a fairly good test of like can you just you know, you always we joke about bad teams, Well, we're just gonna try to outscore them. You're bad defensive teams. Like this is gonna be a pretty good test of, like can you just actually outscore everyone? Because that's the only way that they're gonna win, I think, And that's presuming again, I think we both have our doubts, maybe me more than you that like the offensively is gonna is gonna look very good. So yeah, I don't know. I don't know what else I have on the nets. There's just we we've really covered a lot I think with them, they are probably a little bit deeper. Just an advertise right now, just because Timothy Lowell Cabaret has been really good for them. You have to figure out what every sham it's going to get a bit better. Bruce Brown will give them some defense. He was probably already he's now their best defender. He just has to be Oh for sure, there are real issues here. I guess the other thing to look at too is they don't have other moves left in them now the picks are gone. You still have Spencer Dinwoody's salary, but what team is going to take him at this point? Again, I mentioned Aaron Gordon. Maybe there was a pathway there if you had other stuff to include, But now it looks like, you know, would they do sham Itt and Dinwoody for Aaron Gordon? And then how much does that necessarily help you? But they need they need someone to anchor their defense, and Aaron Gordon probably isn't even necessarily that guy. It's just that he hears you someone to cover both bigs and wings, and they don't have that wingstopper. They're probably even less likely to have him now because at least Tory and Prince body type made set in that role. No, you know, you don't want Kevin Durant having to do that. So I'm kind of interesting to see what happens. Maybe they're big buyout players. Like does Trevor Rezel wind up here or something? But I don't know how how that ends up toiling in their favor. And this leads me into I think the last thing to really talk about that is when you're doing a championship hierarchy right now, where the nets rank on it. I don't even know that I would have them favored to come out of the East at this point. It's tough. I feel like with every team i'd say, well, I just need to see more, but especially with them, I think I think it's reasonable, like if they if they did come out of the East, it would not be a surprise, it would not be a shock, but like for that to be the expectation, I think it's crazy. I mean, you know that Milwaukee, Philly go down Indiana. I don't know. I just think I think it's tough. And look as I was as you were talking, I don't know if we've mentioned that Dinwiddie has a player option for next year, right, so, like given his injury, maybe he picks that up. But he's always taken an unconventional path towards his contracts and what he's done and all that, Like he's heavily vested in bitcoin, so he's probably doing it. He's in dinwitty coin and it's it's its own thing, right he Uh so if you're trading for him, I mean, in addition to the injury and the like, what's he gonna be when he's back, you don't even know if he's gonna if he's gonna opt in. So, I like, he's a really tough and to your point, they do not have a lot of other moves. It is going to have to be the buyout market. That's just the way that they're gonna add talent. I don't see, realistically, like almost any other way they're gonna be able to do anything unless they traded Kyrie Irving. I mean, I don't know that. I mean, I don't know. I consider it, but I don't I don't know how much of this is but kyreing who's trading for him? Well, I think I think you could find a team to do it. The Knicks probably do it in a heartbeat, and I don't know that that would necessarily be a bad decision. I think could you find a third team that because the Knicks don't have stuff that you actually want, Like you could get other teams involved to get things that you actually want. It's I just the thing. Here's where it gets tricky, though, is like if Kyrie Irings out bored with this and he just comes back and he's trying harder and evens like he was, there's a chance that this ends up being a non issue. But the whole thing lingering over this is how like this does his absence right now infer anything about how he's feeling, not just about basketball, but just towards the nets, Like is this Does this represent a break in the relationship at all? And I honestly don't know. I'm not speculating one way or the other. I do think it's bizarre. But if there is something that's sort of fractured, then it makes even more sense though that you would go out and pay this cost for hardened because maybe there's something going on with Kyrie and KD and he's you know, he and James Harden they have the higher ceiling together because they're the two better players. And so now Kyrie Irving is in theory expendable. Is he gone? Because they were inching towards this trade and he didn't want it to happen. There are so many scenarios in play there. I just honestly don't know. It wouldn't shock me if they came out of the East, but I think in the West there are at least two teams that I would definitively favor over them, and that's both LA squads at this point. And you might be able to talk me into a no. I mean, I remain insanely high on the Phoenix Suns, and I could probably talk myself into them over the nets. Yeah. No, I just we need to see more. You are going to get aggregated though. For that Kyrie Tay, that's that's a pretty smart take. I hadn't even thought about that, Like that's why he's away. But again, we don't know anything. We can we can't, we can't stress enough how little we know. Would I'll say that I might respect it if that's why he's away from the team because they were going to trade for James Harden, Like that's something that I could I could genuinely respect. I think maybe. So you're you're saying something about this isn't the year to do this? Am I getting out of order here? I'm curious what you're gonna say. Let's be fair of the Pacers here first because they were actually involved with the trade. So they made an interesting decision. Victor Ladipo a contract year Victor Ladipo for Caris Lavert and the second round pick. Basically is what it amounts to. Caris Lavert has including will include this season because we're only like, you know, ten or fifteen games into this season. He has three years and fifty two point five million is his deal. That's actually the extension he signed. He is not the most efficient score. He's a better passer than Victor Oladipo, i'd hazard, and he is going to give you some of the same off the dribble juice, not going to finish at the rim, but Oladipo wasn't doing that anyway. He's probably not going to reach it as often either, not the best. You know, he's not gonna bait defenses into vows. But I'm just curious as to what you think about this. For for Indiana, this decision no brainer. I think there were rumblings, you know, weeks months ago that Oladipo was unhappy, which he shot down in a kind of methinks the lady does protest too much kind of way. Like indicating that it actually was true. And I think, look, if you're the Pacers, you're either a losing Oldipo for nothing or be probably paying too much to keep in and still facing the specter of whatever this unhappiness you know, reportedly stemmed from. And so to get a player who I think is at least debatably as good and possibly better, that's under contract at a reasonable rate, certainly for far less that you're than you were going to have to pay for Ladipo, I just I don't know what the downside is. I think, you know, there will be concerns of well, Lavert, it's kind of the same thing as as he was facing in Brooklyn. He's just so much better on the ball that you know, who who does that take away from? I kind of like what the Pacers have been doing with Sabonis, you know, can be a facilitator, uh you know Brogden Well, Actually, I mean I'm almost arguing against myself because I do think Lavert makes sense fit wise, But that's just sort of the counter because I love Brogden off the ball, like I think he's succeeded in that role. He's lights out, you know, he's shooting ridiculously beyond fifty forty ninety right now, at least the fifty forty part. Nobody's shooting from the line. But like, I think Lavert makes a lot of sense. He gives the Pacers a guy that can take somebody off the dribble. I think Oladipo was that. I don't know that he would continue to be so I just, I mean, I don't see the downside honestly for Indiana. I just really don't, I think. But also matters for them and the other downside, and I did this right now, but the other downside of not having read or listened extensively to other stuff. You're gonna have to trust my math. Here they're shaving like four plus million dollars in salary, which gives them more room under the tax. And I'm not going to count a team's you know, I'm not going to town a team remaining far into the tax. But the reality is Indiana is not going into the tax, and so this gives them a little bit more flexibility leading into the trade deadline. But this also does because look, there's a chance that if Lavert salaries averaging seventeen point five million, is there a chance that that ends up being like between nine and eleven million less than what Victor Ladipo's making. And yes, because the twenty twenty one free agency classes all of a sudden shallow, the answer is yes, TJ. Warren is going to be a free agent in twenty twenty two. This probably gives you more flexibility to not keep him and you still have Lavert. I do like the fit overall, just because there's a clear path to Lavert having the ball in his hands here, which is how he's sort of best served, and you know, you can stagger him and brogged in and while he will have to play off Sabonus some you can stagger him from Sabonus. That's probably what's more important. What is really odd though, and I view this is almost encouraging, but it's something that's worth noting. So over the past three seasons, he's shooting thirty seven point one percent, about thirty seven percent on off the dribble three pointers. That's incredible. He's shooting thirty percent on catch and shoot threes. And it's almost encouraging because in theory, if the catch and shoot stuff is easier to pin down. But like that is also an issue because you need him to play off of Sabonis, Malcolm Brockton a little bit, Warren a little bit. Maybe the Pacers will heavily stagger them. Who knows, but it is something to monitor. That being said, just for the value of what it is. Knowing with Victor lit deep was gonna cost you, and I think the other thing you mentioned but we're not talking about enough. I don't think Victor Oladipopo wanted to be in Indiana. It was Jay Michael put it based on his response to denying the rumors that Victor Oladipo is as loyal as his options and he was going to have a bunch of options in free agency. And look, if he really was, I can't remember who reported this, so I feel bad. Was it from the athletic I think that he was asking other players if he could join their team last season? He denied that, but if that was at all happening, so there's not even we don't have to view this as a callous element of Oh, they opted to pay a slightly inferior player less money than what it would have cost retained Oladipot. Maybe Oladipo didn't want to be there, in which case that makes this decision even more of a no brainer. Yeah, I agree. I think that is real too. I just don't I don't feel like the reports of him wanting out, not in so many words like those, seemed like very legitimately, so, you know, we never can be sure, but that's not the type of thing that someone just gets wrong. It didn't feel that way to me, so so yeah, I don't know. Even the way he returned like he was. He announced that he wasn't going to play in the Bubble instead of the Pacers, which was weird, and then he announced that he was going to play and it wasn't the Pacers, which was also weird. There's always seemed not always, but lately, at least the past year plus, it feels like there's been that disconnect there, and I do believe that needs to be baked into any verdict of this deal, and ultimately it makes it look a lot better for the Pacers. Well, let's this is maybe a small thing, but you can correct me. I don't think Oladipo has really ever chosen where he's played, because he was, you know, signed with Orlando as a rookie, traded to the thunder traded to the Pacers and you know, signed a new deal in that time, but it was I think it was an extension. So he maybe it's just like it just cuts, it just augurs towards he if he wanted to explore free agency for the first time, like that's that's totally justifiable. It doesn't mean he's like a bad guy. I think that's probably what some people will think whenever a player says he wants out. But yeah, I don't know, I don't He wasn't going to be on the Pacers beyond the season, that's my opinion. So to get anything, let alone a potential young, really good rotation players great, and he's really run the gamut of trade value when you look at he was first traded for Serge Ibaka, then Paul George, and now Carris Lavert. Like that's just like that's very pinbally. So I do think two teams that are inevitably going to be impacted by this are the Wizards because everyone's going to focus on Bradley Beale now and it's not even like James Harden was the domino everyone was waiting to fall. The other name, one of the other names people were monitoring was Vitrol depot and he was moved within the same deal, so the attention shift to Bradley Beal. There's also the Sixers, which seems like they were heavily involved the reporting going around right before the Harden deal was done. It really seemed like Houston was trying to get more out of Philly, or maybe they were trying to leverage Philly against Brooklyn. But it wasn't just them getting Ben Simmons and then salary to make it work. It was they were going to get Tyrese Maxey and door Matisse, Thyball and maybe picks, and Philly was trying to find a third team to facilitate picks. I got killed for this take on Twitter buy Rockets fans, so take that with a grain of sault because their player was James Harden. My I was of the opinion that Philly should not trade Ben Simmons for James Harden, and I justified it like this is, I know, we romanticize the unknown, and we're doing that with the Nets picks a little bit like, oh, how could you trade your picks? In twenty twenty five and twenty twenty six, Ben Simmons is not an unknown. He's a twenty four year old All MBA type star under contract including the season for the next half half decade, no player options. Moving him for Bradley Beale, who's both younger and a COMFORTI or fit beside Joel Embiide would make more sense to me than going after Harden. He shrinks your title window because of his age, and there's greater combustibility there just because of how ball dominant, how polarizing he is on offense. And here's where the take I alluded to. I don't even know if it's that spicy or like I hope you're all over waiting for this. Maybe it's stupid. There's a chance I feel differently if this were a normal season, but the pandemic has turned the NBA into this competitive crapshoot and the competitive balance is just on tilt. Now. I don't know that this was the season to go all in on a deal, because what is happening is you're losing at minimum one year in which you don't have the usual amount of control over title viability. And we've seen it in Philly right now with having Ben Simmons miss time when he was in health and safety protocol. So it's not that you couldn't win the title this year with James Harden, but your team you could have you might win the title without James Harden. That's just how these things go. And it might be the same argument for the Nets is was this the season to do this? And you could counter with Will Hardon only has one year left on his deal after this anyway, so why wouldn't you want more of James Harden. Yes, objectively, you want as much of James Harden as you can get. But for a team like Philly where they have a top twenty player who's six seven years younger or whatever it is at this point underlocking key for the next half decade, that same urgency isn't there as it is for the Nets, they're not, you know, they maybe they have to worry about a Joel Ebead trade request. That's not really as like gutting I think as people necessarily think it is, and that's not an insult to Joel embiids like they could turn around. They would still then have Ben Simmons in that scenario to build their entire team around, whereas with Harden, because he's older, it just shrinks your windows so much. For the Nets, I think you can justify it because that's the image of their team, is this finite truncated title window for Philly. They're competing for both the now and later. They're similar to the Celtics, except they're not going to tell everybody they almost acquired every single player that was on the market. So that's where I look at this. For the Sixers, I don't know what ends up happening with Simmons and embiad and maybe if Bradley Beal's on the table, I'd be curious to see if you think they should give up Simmons for him, and I don't know that I definitely would. I will say I guess to round this out is I would have I would trade Ben Simmons for Bradley Beale before I would have traded him for James Harden, even though James Harden is clearly the better player. I think I agree with that, and the better player thing, I mean, I guess so, but it has been the better player and I think we've sort of alluded to it several times. But in addition to the whole like the stylistic overhaul or the stylistic challenges. I guess I should say that hard Having James Harden on your team presents like they're generally good challenges because he kind of makes your offense good by himself, but they're challenges, and I think it's just difficult to fit him sometimes Bill just doesn't have any of that. And so yeah, Harden is, you know, like the gold standard for high volume, high efficiency scoring, like has just done it better than anybody from a numbers perspective. I just kind of think, and he's one way more than Bial has, and he's been a more singular driver of winning than Bial has. But for sure, if you're not even specifically to the Sixers, but but especially to the Sixers, a player like Bial just it just makes more sense. So if yeah, I agree. So if you're gonna trade Simmons for an offensive star and you're almost any team, I just think it's so much easier if that guy is Bial then if it's hardened, I mean not even we haven't talked about age. I mean there's the age thing too. I think you know, if you look out, you know, forecast the next three years, like Harden's trend line is going to be headed down. Bial is at an apex and could stay at that plateau for a while, just based on his part of that. What makes it so valid what you just said about Hardened, it is because he's been such an iron man throughout his career. Is It's like, it's not necessarily the style he plays, it's just how much he has played. So is Clay Thompson like that We talk about these iron man until they're just not and like that's how the that's how a lot of iron Man streaks tend to end. Just can't move anymore. I can't move anymore. No, So yeah, I just I'm just echoing what you're saying. I don't think that's a hot take. I think that's a sensible take. Bill fits Bill's next three years. I'll bet you will be more valuable than Hardens. That's probably whatever I'll say it. And he just yeah, So, although, let's do you think that if because it felt like starting this season that sort of Simmons and Embid were on like a trial period. That's how sort of how it was played, like, let's let's see if this works. If it doesn't work, I'm Daryl Moore. You know I'm gonna do something. Do you think that if the Sixers had not started out this well, and if Embide had not looked like an MVP and all this stuff, do you think they would have done the Simmons deal or was that just because My thought is they sort of drew the line of like, yeah, we'll do seven future first round assets, but like eight, that's ridiculous. Like I just I just have a hard time believing that the Sixers start, you know, made this just not happen. I think, like the packet, if the package made sense to the Sixers would have done it. I don't think this was you know, a successful trial period that like staved off a trade from happening. One of the other things is people pointed out too, is that Bal as of now is not available and so you weren't making that decision of hardener Bal. I still wouldn't have made this deal if I were the Sixers, just because is there a chance that they're able to pull off like a smaller scale move without having to give up one of their stars that's similarly impactful, Like now that Tyrese Maxie has emerged, you have Danny Green's expiring contract. The Raptors are bad. What if Kyle Lowry becomes available. What if you can get zach lavine from Chicago. It probably takes a bunch of picks to go along with Maxie and Filler, But like that's it seems like there's less risk there because you're not cutting into the incumbent star power that you already have. And you could probably even talk me into that a smaller even a smaller move than that makes this team like just as fit to really make some noise in the playoffs. I do agree with your overarching point though, of this doesn't necessarily I feel like Philly was so good in the limited time that they've seen in Bead and Simmons together this year, that's why they didn't make this deal. It had to be a matter of they were never going to do it, or Houston wanted too much, or you know, something in between, where it's they just weren't sure. They didn't see enough yet. Because we're still super early in the season and both in Bead and Simmons have missed some games, they were staggering them less. It's like maybe you can get a better feel for how they were playing if you're looking at that, But it definitely doesn't feel like, uh, you know it was, oh this was you know that if they were they were on the goal line and then something happened that pushed them away. It felt like something that they were very standoffish from in general. Yeah, yeah, I agree. You got anything else? I just you just made me think of one more question. But that's I don't know what else I have to say about this. I do, I have one question related to Bradley Beald the Wizards, but if you were related to the Sixers, no, that's just a general thing. Go ahead. So I'm wondering if what just happened helps or hurts Bradley Beal's trade value, because I look at it in sort of two veins. Is one, they've taken another star off the board. Drew Holidays traded, even Victor Ladipo has been traded, so he's like the only guy. And because of how thin twenty twenty one free agency is, any teams that even if they were gonna have cap space this summer, it's just not as valuable. So if you want a star, you need to fork over the moon to get bal Now that being said, looking at all these teams that have just given up so much to get these stars, it also feels like the market for Beal has just become more finite, where if you know, is it fair to say, even though I would trade Simmons for Beal before I would Harden, is it fair to say that the Sixers think if they weren't going to trade Simmons for a top five player, they're not going to trade them at all. And so now you remove them from the books, You've clearly you know, the Bucks aren't going to be able to piece together a package. And it's just I'm looking, you know, going up and down the list of prospective teams, and it's like, you know, the thunder and Pelicans could do something wild if they wanted to, But they're not Houston, they're not Milwaukee, or excuse me, they're not Brooklyn, They're not Milwaukee. They're not that close to a title. Miami just doesn't I guess Miami. But at the same time, it's like, does Tyler hero Duncan Robinson and then fewer picks than New Orleans got for Drew Holiday really wet your whistle if you're Washington for Bradley Beale, I honestly don't know. The Warriors could still do some weird stuff, But it really feels like this isn't the season for them to do it either, just they need to see what they have in Klay Thompson and the team at large before they make that call. Well, especially since Andrew Wiggins is going to be First Team All Defensive I'm sorry, could we? I know you're not falling into this trap, But every at least for the past three or four years, Andrew Wiggins has like these scorching hot starts to the season and people buy into them. Every time. I saw there's an article I think it was from the NBC's Bay Area Warriors whatever it is, that the Wiggans trade was a heist for Golden State. I think in retrospect right now they're winning it. And that's not a take I had at the time, So I copped being wrong, but a heist like, can we get the game twenty five, which Wiggins has never done playing at this level before we make that verdict? Nope, I'm one of those people. Dan get it. I get the Andrew Wiggins pump pump the Andrew Wiggins kool aid. I'm not gonna drink it, pump it into my veins because he's never defended like this. I had no idea at all. No, right, yeah, and he's definitely not known for just being awesome for a week and then terrible for another week. No. But but the Beal thing I am. I texted my brother, who is we were equally diehard Warriors fans before I had this job, and now he still is and I'm trying to get back there, but I'm struggling to be impartial. My text was, Andrew Wiggins is fucking good and I meant it sincerely. So like, his defensive play has been incredible and he's just played really well. But we're not talking about Andrew Wiggins. He'll be terrible next week. I'm positive the Beal thing. I think the Harden trade is good for Beal for two reasons. One, it sets the market. Okay, this is what it costs now. And if if there's even a question, as we have just spent several minutes talking about that, Bill is is he a better asset than James Harden. I don't know if there's even a question, which I think there is a question. This is this is the market now. It's complicated because you know, Brooklyn was in a unique position with all these forces pushing them to do crazy stuff that we you know, just discussed. But the other thing is, you know, you'll say, well, there's just there are fewer destinations. You know, some of these teams that would have been players for Bill are maybe not going to be I think the Sixers and Nets just proved that it only takes two. It only takes two teams just make the takes one. It only takes one in some cases. But yeah, so I think it's great for Bal or great for the Wizards, I guess, since since they're the ones that are going to roop the benefits here. But but yeah, I understand that the idea of you know, the Nets would have made sense for him, and the Sixers would make sense. But maybe they're just not trading Simmons. But yeah, I think you set the market, and we know it doesn't take a whole league bidding against one another to really have this incredible return package materialize. One team that I would like to see make a run at BEAL would be Phoenix. Throw Eton on the table, Cam Johnson, Jalen Smith. You need Darius arch salaries to work for Bill and Robin Lopez. That really guts their depth upfront, because Sarich and Eton have both been playing center. Smith is another body that you would throw at center. It's like there's levels to that, but just the way that the offense has, you know, it's like kind of sort of struggles still figuring itself out, Like Bill is just you could really inject some juice in there. And if you have lineups of Booker, Paul mcale, Bridges and Bill and then just whoever the fifth is, is that Robin Lopez is it? You know, maybe you're able to keep Jalen Smith instead of getting Robin Lopez. And there their picks and there obviously can you sign a big off the street you still of Frank Kamitzky, They would be incredibly interesting to me. And Bill's Bill intrigues me there because Phoenix has probably based on talent, it feels like they've under achieved a little bit on offense, but he's also like not bad enough on defense, where you're just dealing with these three offensive first players. Chris Paul's above average at his position still and if Bill is just going to be okay there like he has been for good points of this season. They just that's a team that I would like And eight and suddenly feels expendable, which is part of it for me, is like, now you have that glitzy trade chip that you could still move, and I would love to see Bradley Bale and Phoenix. I think that would be a fantastic fit. Yeah, I think that's great. It's a testament to Bill though, that you could pick literally any team and without having to do any sort of gymnastics say like, well that makes sense if Bill is on that team to a good point, that works. So but yeah, no, the Suns are definitely one. I just I mean, he's gonna I don't know what I think about that he's getting moved. Is that what you're gonna say? Yeah, He's it has to happen now, don't you think. Yeah. I mean Washington looked Russell Westbrook experiment is failing. Thomas Bryant is done for the season. They are better than the third worst team in the East on paper, but right now there's still the third worst team in the East, and Bradley Bill said he wants to win even though he hasn't requested a trade. He bought them sometime with the extension they've signed, but like, they just don't have a way out of this situation. It's also bad luck that Davis Burton's is not shooting nearly as well as they expected to after giving him a boatload of money. So my guests would be that he's moved before the trade deadline, not even before next season. I would think that he'll get moved before marks twenty fifth, although you know, maybe some teams we are thinking along the lines of the way. I was just talking to you, where is this the season to do this? Because so much more than usuals outside of their control. Yeah, I don't know. I think he'll move. I think it just has to happen there. I don't even know what the other potential trade domino is, Like, I don't know who the other marquee player would be. Yeah, there's like right now, I know we say that there's always another star trade in the NBA lurking around the corner, and that's not wrong, but like you can always kind of see them festering, and right now, there's just not that situation. The Sons took care of it with Devin Booker by getting Paul Harden is now gone and you saw that coming from forever away. Beal if that gets resolved and so like, what is the alternative, Like Kyle Lowry really isn't on that scale right now? Is it Steph? Like is it Steph? I don't think it is, but is it? No? And maybe Karl Anthony cowns But that's you know, they went all, I mean, he has four years left on his deal. I don't know that would be like that is jumping the gun here a ton if it ends up being being him. So there's not that other name, which I guess is probably good for Beal's trade value. Yeah, again, there's another We didn't even add that to the list of reasons why he's kind of a winner here. What was your observation or question that you had? It was just so obviously the way Harden sort of conducted his business created urgency for the Rockets to move him. Although they could have just said, I think they were going to say, like just kind of go away for a while, it seemed like what was which, what was going to happen? And then Brooklyn suddenly for I think, fell into this this urgent situation. It just struck me as strange that it seemed like both parties that eventually the main parties, the Nets and the Rockets might have, Like I just, I'm just, who do you think felt more urgency to do this now? Because it seems like it should have been the Rockets. But the way this came together so fast and in conjunction with the Kyrie stuff, it almost feels like Brooklyn this total speculation. Brooklyn probably had an offer on the table and upped it, is the sense that I get, because I don't think the Hardened saying this is unfixable and all that stuff like that wasn't really that different from how he'd been operating with the Rockets. So I don't feel like that was the straw that broke the camel's back and they're like, we all, he's got to go now. It feels more to me like the Nets said we got to do it, and it just that's weird. That's weird to me that the urgency came from the team that is getting the disgruntled star as opposed to the one giving it up. That's not really question, just the thought that or could Houston have looked at it as, oh, Kyrie has just thrown them into this, you know, just this hurricane of uncertainty and now their picks look even better. So we'll take this offer. I think I'm with you, though it feels like the Nets became more urgent, and again it feels like that's at least explicable because the Kyrie Irving stuff all of a sudden happened. You lost Spencer Dinwoody. Still, I would be curious to know what their initial offer was that they upped it from, or maybe not initial, but what was their previous offer? Because how far up did they go? Like this, this was the entire war chest. The only thing they spared was Spencer Dinwoody instead of Torrian Prince, I would say, and maybe the only reason they did that is because Spencer didnybody isn't healthy. Yeah, Like, what was what was the rockets initial ask? You know, because you come in high obviously if you're going to negotiate, like they couldn't have asked for more than they got. I mean almost literally, it's crazy that, like the negotiating, I would love to know what the back and forth was because to arrive at this like, I just can't fathom what the Rockets wanted that they didn't get out of this? Do you The other question that kind of springs to mind here is do you think there's a problem that James What happened with James Harden hints at a problem of players asking out too far before their contracts are up. I've mostly tilted toward this is happening with maybe one player a year, and it's it's only if you're a top fifteen player. Is as far out as you can go with it. That being said, I kind of already mentioned, like, what if it's just karl Anthy Towns is all of a sudden, like I need out of Minnesota because they're just still so bad and he has It's not now, let's say it's next season when he has three years left including that year. So do you think this is an issue or is that element of it overblown? I go back and forth, and I'm wondering if what I sort of feel like it is an issue. It's just because some of these, when they do happen again, that one player per year thing, it's so drawn out and overcovered and talked about that it feels like it's happening more often than it actually is. Yeah, the one trade a year has a way of sort of consuming a hugely disproportionate percentage of like what we talk about over the course of a given season, so it can seem like it's, you know, way more prevalent than it is my kind of default. This is just what feels most rational to me, is just that. Yet, Yeah, players sign contracts, and in any other line of work, you honor your contract, and you would understand that, like, this may not go the way that you want it to, but you're signing this thing, and you are obliged to abide by the terms of this thing you signed, and we're not guaranteeing you that everything's going to be exactly how you want it to be. So I understand that argument. You sign a contract, suck it up, stay put. That just feels like kind of the crotchety old man approach to it. That ignores the idea that the very real scenario where teams can just trade you. So I think it's Zach Low that said, all all trade demands do is even the playing field. It's it's because if a team can trade a player under contract without his consent, assuming there's no ability to block a trade, then in theory, it's only fair that a player, at least a player of the kind that we're talking about. The hardens the Anthony Davis is like that level a player. At least that guy should have the same amount of power to say, you know what, I want to move now. So all to me, the idea that it levels the playing field resonates as as true and feels equitable. Although we just saw that the guys that play with Harden, that whose opinions should really matter, we're like, this is some bullshit, like we you know, so the players definitely don't seem to feel that way when a guy angles fort to get out. I don't know if that's more specific to the way Hardened conducted things, but it feels to me. I'm not, I'm not. The concept of player empowerment, to me is not a negative. I think it's taken on a negative connotation, like people grumble about it, but I honestly don't have a problem with it. Harden could have handled it better. I don't begrudge him wanting to play someplace else. And the other thing is that it works both sides. Where it's the people who are sort of trumpeting player empowerment as this great thing, I think that's definitely overblown because it applies to such a select few. But then the grumps who are like, oh, yeah, it's all skewed toward these superstars and what they want to do. It's well because it's just those ten or fifteen players, like, it's just not as big of an issue. So I think I really agree with you there. I don't, you know, I just don't. It feels like there's this void for the first time in a while. And maybe that's not a bad thing. Maybe we focus more on the basketball now, but because Jannis has resigned, just because it feels like the superstar trade market is now barren, there's this void there, and I'm wondering how the news cycle or how the league landscape reacts, because look, media is going to cover stuff, but like their teams are thinking far out and so if there aren't any splashy imminent plans that they can focus on, like the Chatters gradually going to shift to Hey, the Boston Celtics, they're planning on pairing and Karl Anthony Towns with Tatum and Janlen Brown at some point. So I'm curious as to the response or will just be all Bill everything, And because we both think that he's going to get moved before the trade deadline, like we're gonna find out about a lot about the discourse thereafter. Yeah, I think you're right, I think. But my hope is that we could just like just for like a month, assuming there are going to be games played over the next month, which is actually that's the biggest story now, is like what are we gonna do about it? Isn't that part of it? Though? Imagine giving up this much for a player, and like there's still I don't know what the percent chances because the NBA will probably come hell or high water like they're gonna soldier through this. At the same time, it's like there a one percent chance that there's not even a championship crowd this year, in which case you've just like punted on so many assets for nothing. Like it's it's not zero. I mean there's a there's a non zero chance. Yeah, no, that that so whatever Brooklyn's grade is, you got to knock it down by like a tenth of a percentage point just to account for the possibility that there will be no champion this year because their goals to chi. I just I wish, I hope we can focus on the basketball because one thing these trades did all four of these teams got way more interesting. Like I want to know, I want to know how the nets are gonna look, I want to know what laverts. I like. I'm actually interested in the basketball aspect of this. It would be cool if we could focus on that. I don't think the the people that consume NBA content are as interested in that as talking about Bradley Bield trade packages. But it's fun to dream sometimes. That's where NBA Twitter sort of, you know, goes on a detour where and look, I want to focus more on the basketball too, But Twitter is like such a small snapshot of the demographic that the NBA's targeting. There's clearly an issue when you look at ratings and stuff, but like Twitter is not like that. That's a snapshot of a snapshot, and there's proof in the numbers, based on what we do for a living that people care about the stuff that's happening off the court in fury in trade rumors a lot more than they care about going in depth on Portland's defense this season, or rich On Holmes's floaters because he hasn't missed one since twenty eighteen. I don't think so. Yeah, it's I hope we do get to focus more and look, these teams are fascinating. I'm sure we'll focus on the basketball for a little bit, but I'm mentioning all these names. Who are we going to shift two next? We might already be on Kyrie at this point because Steven A is calling for him to retire, so that's going to take on a life of its own. I'm not advocating for any of this. I'm just it feels like there's a sense of finality to the way that the news cycle has been running itself. But it can't be actual finality, so it's gonna shift to just something that's so either like far I guess far away would be the way to put it, because Bill is sort of that last strand of well, which really great star, which top twenty player is going to move next? Yeah, cycles don't have endpoints. That's that's why they're cycles. So we'll come up with we'll talk about like it doesn't even have to be beal Like, it'll just be what about Zach Lavine, Like gotta get him out of Chicago. He's gonna be you know it. We'll just be the next tier down of players will just suddenly become the It won't matter it doesn't matter, like that'll be the next group that we talk about. Towns though, I don't know. Man Towns is an interesting one. It's way too early. He's three more years left on his deal. That would be if it even if it happens this office, if he does it when he has three plus seasons or three seasons left on his deal, that would be wild. Yeah. Well that's one where if you're the Wolves, you just say like, nah, sorry, right, Like, hey, we got you one of your best friends. We're just gonna have to do you have anything else on this or ten gentially laid it to this. Is there a team? Is there a team of these four that you're most interested to watch after this? Oh, it's got to be Brooklyn. I just I just want to see how the experiment works. Yeah, I felt like that was a terrible question on my problem. Actually no, actually, so one of the things I did in the wake of this was kind of just slapped together depth charts for these four teams as as they'll look. The Rockets. Starting five is like kind of fun because if you go walll Oladipo, Gordon, maybe it's House. I think it should be Gordon, Tucker and Christian would. I don't know how good that is, but that's interesting getting traded, right, not to bring this back to trade. No, well, yeah see there you did it. Well. I was gonna try to talk about the basketball fit and you got to talk about no. Yeah, that's percent. The Rockets have to trade Tucker and he does s fit perfectly into the Warriors disabled player exception, So keep that keep an eye on that one. Yeah. No, the Rockets are interesting, but but the Nets for sure, Like I just this is gonna be fascinating. I do not NBC Nash. I did not want him to take this job because I just thought it was going to be you know, the standards were gonna be too high and it was gonna be a headache. But now the standards are higher and the headaches are bigger, so it's gonna be wild. This was great, Grant. I always love parsing through these things with you. I'm not sure whether the next time you come on it'll be because of a Bradley Beal reaction trade, Karl Anthony trade demand, or we'll be talking about actual basketball if you're on before anything like that happens. But again, I always love these convos. Thank you. Thank you for coming on. Guys, if you're not following Grant or his work, you can do so at GT underscore Hughes on Twitter. And it's great because maybe he won't tweet all the time, but you'll get the notification when he does because it'll be the first time he tweeted in a while, and so you can score right that tweet, don't even have to sift through your timeline. Thanks so much, Grant, and I'll be talking to you soon, as you very well know at this point. Thanks Dan Sugar, Ray Leonard, Roberto Durant, Marvelous, Marvin Hagler, and Thomas Hearns legends whose four way rivalry define one of the greatest errors in boxing history, relive their decade of dominance in the new Showtime Sports documentary The Kings, a four part series premiering Sunday, June sixth, only on Showtime