WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.200 --> 00:00:06.799 In this episode. This is my first solo interview. Probably gonna botch it, 2 00:00:06.839 --> 00:00:10.480 probably gonna fuck it all the fuck up, But you know, hang 3 00:00:10.519 --> 00:00:16.519 in there. Lucky for you all, I have our own Latter Day Lesbian 4 00:00:16.600 --> 00:00:24.600 superstar here. Today I will be interviewing Austin Arrowwood. So let's take a 5 00:00:24.679 --> 00:00:27.199 quick break. Or maybe I won't. I don't know at this point. 6 00:00:27.239 --> 00:00:29.760 I don't even know if I'm gonna do commercials. How about that. I 7 00:00:29.760 --> 00:00:33.399 don't know what I'm doing. Okay, So I'm gonna take a break just 8 00:00:33.439 --> 00:00:39.759 in case, and then come right back. Welcome to the Latter Day Lesbian 9 00:00:39.799 --> 00:00:45.600 Podcast, the podcast about an ex Mormon gay girl just trying to figure out 10 00:00:45.640 --> 00:00:49.840 her life. I am Shelley. That's fucking it. I am Shelley. 11 00:00:50.640 --> 00:00:56.320 But today we have Austin Arrowwood. Welcome to the show. Austin. Thank 12 00:00:56.399 --> 00:00:59.159 Shelley. I'm happy to be here. Good. It would suck if you 13 00:00:59.200 --> 00:01:07.519 were like talk a little bit really quickly about Austin. Austin was born and 14 00:01:07.680 --> 00:01:12.239 raised as a faithful Mormon. He's the second of six children. By age 15 00:01:12.400 --> 00:01:18.640 five, he knew his gender did not match his insides. Austin was born 16 00:01:19.120 --> 00:01:22.599 female. He got married in the temple to a man at age nineteen and 17 00:01:22.640 --> 00:01:26.120 had two kids. Sorry about that, by the way, the whole temple. 18 00:01:26.159 --> 00:01:30.400 Shit, yeah, yeah, we can do secret handshakes later. Okay. 19 00:01:30.280 --> 00:01:34.079 They divorced. When he was twenty nine, Austin came out as a 20 00:01:34.159 --> 00:01:38.400 lesbian and was excommunicated from the church. He rejoined the church and lived as 21 00:01:38.439 --> 00:01:42.000 a celibate lesbian for eight and a half years. Oh, we're going to 22 00:01:42.040 --> 00:01:44.959 talk about that. We are going to talk the fuck about that, Austin. 23 00:01:45.840 --> 00:01:49.280 In twenty fifteen, he had his name removed from the church records after 24 00:01:49.319 --> 00:01:55.200 the exclusion policy was leaked and his daughter was denied for missionary service. He 25 00:01:55.280 --> 00:01:57.879 was in and out of a mental health unit thirteen times from age twenty five 26 00:01:57.920 --> 00:02:02.840 to forty three, whilst struggling to hide his true identity from himself and everyone 27 00:02:02.879 --> 00:02:07.599 else. In twenty twenty, Austin came out as trans. He started testosterone 28 00:02:07.639 --> 00:02:12.879 in April of twenty twenty. He had top surgery in November of that year, 29 00:02:12.919 --> 00:02:20.800 and next week he will be getting bottom surgery. Four days. Oh 30 00:02:20.840 --> 00:02:24.879 my gosh, so ld Ellers just see you know, when I asked Austin, 31 00:02:24.879 --> 00:02:28.520 I'm like, hey, man, I know you're getting surgery coming up, 32 00:02:28.560 --> 00:02:30.560 would you be comfortable talking about it, because yeah, it's kind of 33 00:02:30.560 --> 00:02:35.000 a private thing. And Austin was like, fuck, yeah, nobody talks 34 00:02:35.000 --> 00:02:37.960 about it. This needs to be talked about, Like where do you get 35 00:02:38.000 --> 00:02:40.319 the information? What do you so whatever, we're going to talk about that 36 00:02:40.439 --> 00:02:46.879 shit. So, Austin, when you and I first met, God, 37 00:02:47.000 --> 00:02:50.639 did you start listening to the podcast at the very beginning? I think so 38 00:02:51.039 --> 00:02:53.280 I did. Yeah. I think I came in when you were like three 39 00:02:53.319 --> 00:02:58.360 episodes in or something. Shit. But you started episode one though, right, 40 00:02:58.639 --> 00:03:02.520 yes, of course? Okay, okay, good, good who and 41 00:03:02.520 --> 00:03:12.919 and back then you were presenting as a woman like I met you as I'm 42 00:03:12.919 --> 00:03:19.199 a pretty but sure, right right there was a talk of trans just yet 43 00:03:19.280 --> 00:03:23.919 right right, So tell me, I guess how you found the podcast and 44 00:03:23.319 --> 00:03:28.000 I kind of was a little bit of your journey from there. Okay, 45 00:03:28.360 --> 00:03:32.800 so the podcast actually found I think I was googling like lesbian Mormons, you 46 00:03:32.840 --> 00:03:38.520 know, because that's such a small group of people, or I thought it 47 00:03:38.599 --> 00:03:42.599 was anyway, and it's not a dating site by the way, go ahead, 48 00:03:42.719 --> 00:03:46.919 right right, So, uh, and I came across the podcast and 49 00:03:46.960 --> 00:03:49.520 I listened and I was like, hey, I like these people. They're 50 00:03:49.520 --> 00:03:52.680 pretty funny, you know. And I was like seven kids, Holy fuck? 51 00:03:53.159 --> 00:03:57.680 And uh, you know just got drawn in, I guess, and 52 00:03:58.199 --> 00:04:01.319 you were still Mormon. Then I was, yes, well I was just 53 00:04:01.439 --> 00:04:06.240 leaving the church actually, okay, yeah, and I then I got married 54 00:04:06.240 --> 00:04:13.960 to a woman, and that was another yeah. Anyway, so I love 55 00:04:14.000 --> 00:04:15.079 how you skimmed right over that. Do you need to do you need to 56 00:04:15.120 --> 00:04:20.120 pry because I will pride? Okay, yeah, you got you got married. 57 00:04:20.160 --> 00:04:25.000 You got married to a woman as a woman, you were lesbian woman. 58 00:04:25.199 --> 00:04:28.040 Okay, yeah, so I got married to a woman as a woman. 59 00:04:28.480 --> 00:04:30.439 My parents refused to come to the wedding. They said they could not 60 00:04:30.519 --> 00:04:35.519 be where evil resides. So yeah, so they would not attend my wedding. 61 00:04:35.759 --> 00:04:42.800 And one of my siblings came, one of my sisters, and that 62 00:04:42.839 --> 00:04:46.639 marriage was only for four years. It was one of those we probably should 63 00:04:46.639 --> 00:04:49.639 have never gotten married. We made really good friends, but yeah, I 64 00:04:49.680 --> 00:04:54.560 should should have never gotten married. Do you think that that we never should 65 00:04:54.560 --> 00:04:58.800 have got married has anything to do with you being trans? Very much? 66 00:04:58.839 --> 00:05:01.040 So? Yeah, okay, cool, I knew that I was trans. 67 00:05:01.480 --> 00:05:08.279 I remember telling a therapist when I was twenty five that my gender did not 68 00:05:09.639 --> 00:05:15.720 match right, and she convinced me at the time that no, I'm just 69 00:05:15.800 --> 00:05:20.120 a lesbian. You know, I'm not trans. Your therapist convinced me yes. 70 00:05:20.639 --> 00:05:24.480 And this was not a Mormon therapist. Was this a mom therapist? 71 00:05:24.519 --> 00:05:28.199 Okay, thank God? No. Actually, funny story. I was in 72 00:05:28.279 --> 00:05:30.040 Mormon therapy for a long time because my bishop told me I needed to be 73 00:05:30.399 --> 00:05:36.160 oh God. And the Mormon therapist actually told me, if you have to 74 00:05:36.279 --> 00:05:42.800 choose between killing yourself or leaving the church, please leave the church. Years 75 00:05:42.879 --> 00:05:46.439 later, I came across him on the next Mormon board. He's no longer 76 00:05:46.439 --> 00:05:49.480 a member. He took his whole family out with him. Good for him. 77 00:05:49.680 --> 00:05:54.279 Yeah, and he was not I was with oh the S Family Services 78 00:05:54.279 --> 00:05:57.399 when he was my therapist. He's no longer you know. He judged them 79 00:05:57.399 --> 00:06:01.399 a couple of years later. So yeah, wow, they're so okay. 80 00:06:02.000 --> 00:06:05.879 I know this is supposed to be an interview about your upcoming surgery, but 81 00:06:06.600 --> 00:06:12.560 we're just there's so much to talk about here. I just have a million 82 00:06:12.639 --> 00:06:15.759 questions. So first of all, how old are you? I am only 83 00:06:15.879 --> 00:06:19.319 forty nine in March. Okay, so we're like a year. I'm a 84 00:06:19.399 --> 00:06:21.959 year older than you, so as you're elder, I'm going to talk down 85 00:06:23.000 --> 00:06:27.439 to you and tell you how life is okay because I've got this shit all 86 00:06:27.519 --> 00:06:35.399 figured out right. So for me growing up, trans it wasn't a thing. 87 00:06:35.720 --> 00:06:40.399 You know, it was people were called transvestites, and it was a 88 00:06:40.439 --> 00:06:44.959 bad thing, and it was just men who dressed like women in order to 89 00:06:44.959 --> 00:06:47.800 be pedophiles. Like that was the knowledge that I had. Is that absolutely 90 00:06:48.160 --> 00:06:51.800 that's how you were taught. Yes, yeah, that's that's exactly it. 91 00:06:51.839 --> 00:06:57.600 I did not know that trans men existed. I never heard of that. 92 00:06:57.680 --> 00:07:00.279 I've heard it, you know, I've heard of butch lesbian dykes as they 93 00:07:00.279 --> 00:07:04.240 were often referred to. I had heard that, you know, women like 94 00:07:04.279 --> 00:07:11.120 to be masculine because they have penis eNB but never trans men. That was 95 00:07:11.160 --> 00:07:15.519 not something I had ever heard of. So when I was twenty five and 96 00:07:15.519 --> 00:07:19.759 I told my therapist, like, I feel like when God was handing out 97 00:07:20.160 --> 00:07:26.279 jumpsuits in heaven, he gave me the wrong one, and like that's how 98 00:07:26.279 --> 00:07:29.360 I worded it because I was like, I knew it was incongruent, it 99 00:07:29.360 --> 00:07:32.439 didn't match with how I felt. But I did not know that that was 100 00:07:32.439 --> 00:07:36.959 actually a thing that could happen. All I'd heard about was the negative. 101 00:07:38.319 --> 00:07:41.680 There are men who dressed like women and molest children, that's right, you 102 00:07:41.720 --> 00:07:44.199 know, And so I was like, oh, I'm not one of those 103 00:07:44.240 --> 00:07:47.519 people like that. Yeah, you know. So yeah, I didn't think 104 00:07:47.560 --> 00:07:51.279 it was even I didn't even know it existed. So at what point, 105 00:07:51.839 --> 00:07:58.920 I know we had I couldn't even tell which episode, but we interviewed someone 106 00:07:58.920 --> 00:08:05.600 one time who's transom and her first eye opening experiences experience was watching the Jerry 107 00:08:05.639 --> 00:08:09.480 Springer Show where she saw like these trans people and she's like, oh my 108 00:08:09.519 --> 00:08:11.839 god, that's me, which is so weird to have that, you know, 109 00:08:11.920 --> 00:08:16.519 insight from the Jerry Springer Show. But was there something that clicked with 110 00:08:16.560 --> 00:08:20.040 you that made you think, wait, this is actually a thing, right. 111 00:08:20.680 --> 00:08:24.920 Well? I remember, like when I was five, I would play 112 00:08:24.920 --> 00:08:28.120 house with my best friend who lived down the street, and I always wanted 113 00:08:28.120 --> 00:08:31.000 to be the dad. I would put like rolled up socks in my pants 114 00:08:31.480 --> 00:08:35.600 so that I would have a bulge, like I knew how my body I 115 00:08:35.639 --> 00:08:41.120 wanted my body to look. When I was twelve eleven twelve, a girl 116 00:08:41.120 --> 00:08:46.080 moved in across the street and I remember putting my hair up in my baseball 117 00:08:46.120 --> 00:08:48.960 cap and like rolling up my sleeves and playing basketball out on my patio, 118 00:08:50.440 --> 00:08:52.519 trying to get her to notice me and wanting her to think I was a 119 00:08:52.519 --> 00:08:54.039 boy, like I did not want her to notice me as a girl, 120 00:08:54.320 --> 00:09:00.840 gotcha, which was also confusing. And then I had dreams starting when I 121 00:09:00.879 --> 00:09:05.440 was twelve, like sexual dreams, and in my dreams, I was always 122 00:09:05.480 --> 00:09:09.159 male. I always had male genitals. I was always having sex with girls. 123 00:09:09.480 --> 00:09:15.159 So it was very confusing to have this going on in my head. 124 00:09:15.240 --> 00:09:16.879 So I would stay in my head. I knew from the time I was 125 00:09:16.919 --> 00:09:22.200 little, little, but I didn't have words for it, right, I 126 00:09:22.279 --> 00:09:26.720 just knew that, like and all I knew was I must be horrible and 127 00:09:26.799 --> 00:09:31.720 awful and wrong because the church said you were female in heaven, you're female 128 00:09:31.799 --> 00:09:35.799 now, you'll be female when you die, so like there was no other 129 00:09:35.840 --> 00:09:37.840 option. That that's it's kind of like, you know, I got married 130 00:09:37.840 --> 00:09:41.559 in the temple because there was no other option, Like, right, you 131 00:09:41.879 --> 00:09:45.960 don't go be with women, that's not going to happen because you were born 132 00:09:46.000 --> 00:09:50.279 with the wrong genitals, So you know, it's not actually a choice, 133 00:09:50.360 --> 00:09:56.000 like sometimes people have told me, well, you chose to get married, 134 00:09:56.440 --> 00:09:58.360 you chose to have all these kids, Like did I really you know, 135 00:10:00.240 --> 00:10:01.080 I guess at the end of the day, I was like, like, 136 00:10:01.480 --> 00:10:05.240 yeah, I made the babies with the husband. I got married in the 137 00:10:05.279 --> 00:10:09.200 temple. But the choice is you do this because God wants or you don't 138 00:10:09.200 --> 00:10:11.639 do it and you are a sinner and you go to hell and your family's 139 00:10:11.639 --> 00:10:16.440 sad. Like it's not a choice. It really isn't. Yeah, it's 140 00:10:16.720 --> 00:10:20.960 like your choices. I tear apart my family for all of eternity and everyone 141 00:10:20.039 --> 00:10:24.519 hates me because I destroyed the family unit. Or you get married and have 142 00:10:24.559 --> 00:10:28.440 babies, like you know, like it's not really a choice. It's kind 143 00:10:28.440 --> 00:10:33.039 of like really is expected and you will do it right, right, you 144 00:10:33.080 --> 00:10:39.639 know that expectation is thick and running. Yeah, it's not at least in 145 00:10:39.679 --> 00:10:41.159 my family, and I'm assuming for years as well and most of our listeners. 146 00:10:41.519 --> 00:10:45.039 It's not just a pass of like you know, it would be nice 147 00:10:45.039 --> 00:10:46.000 if you would get married in the temple. No, no, no, 148 00:10:46.799 --> 00:10:50.120 no. It was like you do this or you do nothing at all, 149 00:10:50.440 --> 00:10:52.639 Like there's not an option if you look back. I mean, I taught 150 00:10:52.639 --> 00:10:56.759 primary for several years. If you look back to primary age, you know, 151 00:10:56.879 --> 00:11:00.840 starting at age three, I love to see the temple. I'm going 152 00:11:00.879 --> 00:11:05.159 there someday. Families are forever hate that song. These are the songs that 153 00:11:05.240 --> 00:11:09.879 you're taught from the time you're three years old, so you know there is 154 00:11:09.960 --> 00:11:11.759 no other option. If you're a boy, you will serve a mission. 155 00:11:13.200 --> 00:11:16.039 You will get the priest, you'll pass the sacrament, you will go to 156 00:11:16.279 --> 00:11:20.080 you know, like there's no choice. You'll go to seminary, you'll get 157 00:11:20.120 --> 00:11:24.360 married in the temple, and you'll have your babies, and you'll die and 158 00:11:24.399 --> 00:11:28.000 go to heaven like that's that's it, and keep having babies for eternity. 159 00:11:28.080 --> 00:11:31.759 That sounds horrible, by the way, I know, I know well. 160 00:11:31.759 --> 00:11:37.080 And something else I wanted to say. So for our age group growing up, 161 00:11:37.080 --> 00:11:41.240 there wasn't the Internet. It's not like you could do research and start 162 00:11:41.279 --> 00:11:43.399 to think, I wonder if this is a bunch of bullshit. There was 163 00:11:43.480 --> 00:11:48.320 nothing. There was nothing that would make you think for a second that it 164 00:11:48.480 --> 00:11:52.200 wasn't true. It was just this is true. Am I gonna be obedient 165 00:11:52.279 --> 00:11:56.159 and make everyone happy and go to heaven? Or am I going to be 166 00:11:56.240 --> 00:12:00.559 disobedient and burn in hell and have my whole family sad and cry. There 167 00:12:00.639 --> 00:12:03.720 was no this might not be true, right right, right, that's not 168 00:12:03.799 --> 00:12:07.279 an option. No, I didn't think this might not be true till I 169 00:12:07.320 --> 00:12:11.399 was in my forties. Oh exactly. I actually left the church before I 170 00:12:11.480 --> 00:12:18.840 determined that it wasn't true. So you so you left the church because lesbian 171 00:12:18.080 --> 00:12:22.840 right at the time, that right, because of the final straw for me 172 00:12:22.159 --> 00:12:26.360 was the exclusion policy. I had actually been excommunicated in two thousand and four 173 00:12:28.080 --> 00:12:31.080 when I had an affair with a woman and ended my marriage and you know 174 00:12:31.440 --> 00:12:35.120 all that kind of stuff. Yeah, so I was excommunicated and and then 175 00:12:35.200 --> 00:12:41.240 I rejoined the church because my girlfriend at the time was also Mormon, and 176 00:12:41.320 --> 00:12:45.960 she said, I cannot be with you unless you remember the church. Wow, 177 00:12:46.039 --> 00:12:50.720 because we weren't having sex anyway after the first six months. So I 178 00:12:50.840 --> 00:12:56.440 was like, all right, So I rejoined the church, went through all 179 00:12:56.440 --> 00:13:01.000 the process to get my tune to recommend back, and is a card carrying 180 00:13:01.039 --> 00:13:05.240 member for the next nine years. Wow. Wow. In this relationship that 181 00:13:05.360 --> 00:13:09.960 was it was not a good relationship. It was one of those ones where 182 00:13:09.960 --> 00:13:13.519 it was it was my first real love and I thought, you know I'm 183 00:13:13.519 --> 00:13:16.759 never going to find another woman like her, so I need to stay with 184 00:13:16.799 --> 00:13:20.919 her, even though we were both miserable, and it should have never lasted 185 00:13:20.919 --> 00:13:24.320 as long as it did. But that's another story. Oh you've got lots. 186 00:13:24.679 --> 00:13:28.840 Awesome, you've got lots. I do, I've lived a lot. 187 00:13:28.240 --> 00:13:35.000 Yeah. The requirement that the church had for you to get baptized again, 188 00:13:35.039 --> 00:13:37.559 what were some of the things that they wanted from you? So the first 189 00:13:37.559 --> 00:13:41.639 thing I was told is that if I were to be rebaptized, there would 190 00:13:41.639 --> 00:13:43.919 be an asterisk next to my name on the records of the church. The 191 00:13:43.960 --> 00:13:48.480 asterisk next to my name gave them the knowledge that I could not work with 192 00:13:48.559 --> 00:13:52.320 youth. The junior primary was fine, Shut the fuck up. Well, 193 00:13:52.639 --> 00:13:56.679 junior primary was fine. Not senior primary, and not youth, the young 194 00:13:56.679 --> 00:14:01.240 men, young woman because I guess if you're a lesbian, you're a pedophile. 195 00:14:01.600 --> 00:14:05.120 Not really sure how that works, but well that's anything that's not straight 196 00:14:05.240 --> 00:14:11.240 is pedophile, right, according to the church back then, And there's still 197 00:14:11.240 --> 00:14:15.120 a lot of people that I think believe that to this day. The Church 198 00:14:15.159 --> 00:14:16.639 has come a long way. I'm not getting props to the church when I 199 00:14:16.639 --> 00:14:20.759 say that, I'm just you know, not at all. I'm just saying 200 00:14:20.799 --> 00:14:26.279 it's not as rampant that everyone feels like if you are gay, queer, 201 00:14:26.320 --> 00:14:28.799 whatever, that your pedophile. But there still a lot of them, do 202 00:14:30.000 --> 00:14:33.000 you know? I still think the app rachelons believe that shit, all the 203 00:14:33.039 --> 00:14:37.320 old dudes. Yeah, for sure. So how did that make you feel? 204 00:14:37.440 --> 00:14:41.240 I'm sure you must have recognized like, oh, they don't trust me 205 00:14:41.399 --> 00:14:46.320 with like young teenage girls. How did that make you feel? It made 206 00:14:46.360 --> 00:14:50.399 me feel creepy. Yeah, like honestly, especially since I had kids, 207 00:14:50.919 --> 00:14:56.919 like right, you know, so it just made me feel gross, like 208 00:14:58.039 --> 00:15:03.120 I wasn't on the same level as the other people at your you know. 209 00:15:03.440 --> 00:15:07.720 And then there's also the I had to meet with the bishop every week, 210 00:15:09.000 --> 00:15:13.440 and in these meetings it would be you know, have you had any inappropriate 211 00:15:13.519 --> 00:15:20.720 thoughts? Have you masturbated? Wow? Watched any pornography? You know? 212 00:15:20.799 --> 00:15:24.000 Do you think about kissing other women in relief society? No? You know, 213 00:15:26.000 --> 00:15:30.200 like wait, wait, kiss other women that are in release society? 214 00:15:30.320 --> 00:15:33.799 Or while you're written relief society thinking about kissing other like kissing other women in 215 00:15:33.840 --> 00:15:37.480 the ward? All right, right right, their a friend. I'm going 216 00:15:37.519 --> 00:15:39.399 to drag down another woman in our ward and you know, take her out 217 00:15:39.399 --> 00:15:43.559 of her celestial marriage, like you might have had that power, Austin. 218 00:15:43.600 --> 00:15:50.720 I don't know. Maybe props to you. Yeah, thanks, Yeah. 219 00:15:50.799 --> 00:15:56.960 You know what sucks too is that so many men have been accused of and 220 00:15:58.000 --> 00:16:03.720 even convicted of being pedophiles, of having sexual contact with youth, and they 221 00:16:03.759 --> 00:16:10.039 are still allowed some of them are still allowed to work in the youth program. 222 00:16:10.480 --> 00:16:14.960 Oh yeah, Like, what the fuck's up with the double standard? 223 00:16:15.120 --> 00:16:18.320 You know, I have no clue. Yeah, there isn't an answer for 224 00:16:18.360 --> 00:16:22.320 that, because it's it's bullshit for sure, for sure. Okay, so 225 00:16:22.919 --> 00:16:27.480 you were able to come back to the church and you did this for the 226 00:16:27.879 --> 00:16:33.200 girl that you were now just going to be friends with, right right, 227 00:16:33.559 --> 00:16:38.399 right? So how that worked out? You know this sounds ridiculous, right 228 00:16:40.039 --> 00:16:44.240 I do? I do? And she so she would make contact with me, 229 00:16:44.480 --> 00:16:47.759 okay, yeah, like every six months she would cut off contact with 230 00:16:47.840 --> 00:16:52.360 me because she'd say she had revelation that that's what needed happen Jesus. Then 231 00:16:52.399 --> 00:16:56.960 when she missed me, suddenly the revelation was gone. I don't know. 232 00:16:56.120 --> 00:17:02.399 She'd come back and we did this back and forth for a long time and 233 00:17:02.440 --> 00:17:06.480 then I said. One day tour. We were talking on the phone. 234 00:17:06.480 --> 00:17:08.319 It was first thing in the morning, and I said, I can't do 235 00:17:08.440 --> 00:17:11.519 this anymore. And I meant the back and forth, like the up, 236 00:17:11.559 --> 00:17:15.599 down, in out, you know thing. Yeah, she took it as 237 00:17:15.640 --> 00:17:18.599 I can't do the relationship anymore. So she blocked me on everything. She 238 00:17:18.640 --> 00:17:22.319 moved all of her stuff out, like done, that was it, and 239 00:17:22.400 --> 00:17:26.200 y'all were living together. She was living with me part time, but she 240 00:17:26.240 --> 00:17:29.079 didn't have her kids. She would be at my house, and then when 241 00:17:29.119 --> 00:17:30.200 she had her kids, she would be at her house. So but you 242 00:17:30.279 --> 00:17:40.279 were just roommates. Yeah, of course. So when she moved out all 243 00:17:40.319 --> 00:17:45.160 of her stuff and cut off all contact, it was like a month later. 244 00:17:45.359 --> 00:17:48.119 She was posting on Facebook about like her new girlfriend and how she was 245 00:17:48.400 --> 00:17:52.960 like totally with her and posting pictures with her. And I had been blocked 246 00:17:52.039 --> 00:17:56.559 from posting anything about our relationship anywhere. Wow. So I was like, 247 00:17:56.680 --> 00:18:00.920 well, thanks, I guess and I was like, I screw you, 248 00:18:00.200 --> 00:18:03.720 I'm done. And so she just came all the way out, like you 249 00:18:03.799 --> 00:18:07.319 know, I'm assuming she left the church. I don't know. I just 250 00:18:07.920 --> 00:18:12.160 think I think I no longer remember I'm not sure how that worked out. 251 00:18:12.240 --> 00:18:17.319 I don't talk to her anymore, so, like we have zero contact at 252 00:18:17.319 --> 00:18:21.000 this point. So yeah, it was weird, but whatever. I know, 253 00:18:21.079 --> 00:18:23.000 you look back on relationships and things, You're like, wow, that's 254 00:18:23.279 --> 00:18:26.799 now that I'm saying it out loud, that's really weird. I know. 255 00:18:26.240 --> 00:18:30.480 I know, I look back and I'm like, I was an idiot, 256 00:18:30.680 --> 00:18:34.599 but okay, I learned. It makes a good story, I know. 257 00:18:36.079 --> 00:18:42.839 Wow. So we broke up in September of twenty fourteen, and then the 258 00:18:42.920 --> 00:18:48.519 exclusion policy happened in I think it was January of twenty fifteen. Yeah, 259 00:18:48.519 --> 00:18:51.359 so for some of our listeners might not know what that is. Do you 260 00:18:51.359 --> 00:18:53.839 mind explaining that? Yeah, So the exclusion policy was something that was actually 261 00:18:53.920 --> 00:18:59.319 leaked. It wasn't supposed to be not general knowledge to the church members, 262 00:18:59.400 --> 00:19:02.720 and some linked it on the internet, of course, and it came out 263 00:19:02.759 --> 00:19:06.119 that they will put in the handbook that children of gay parents could not be 264 00:19:06.160 --> 00:19:08.519 baptized, they could not get blessed, they could not serve missions, they 265 00:19:08.519 --> 00:19:15.240 could not advance in the priesthood, and all gay members would be considered apostates 266 00:19:15.359 --> 00:19:21.640 if they were, you know, like it's went into all these basically, 267 00:19:22.480 --> 00:19:25.480 you are less than if you are gay or if your parents are gay. 268 00:19:25.599 --> 00:19:30.359 And so I'm like, my issue was, you're punishing children because they do 269 00:19:30.440 --> 00:19:33.319 believe it's punishment to not be able to get baptized, blessed, whatever, 270 00:19:33.440 --> 00:19:37.480 go on a mission. You know, you're punishing children for the sins of 271 00:19:37.519 --> 00:19:41.880 their parents, right, sins and quotations. Right, Which isn't that what 272 00:19:41.920 --> 00:19:45.400 they say in the second Article of Faith where we don't do, yeah, 273 00:19:45.480 --> 00:19:48.480 punish for own sins and not for Adam's transgressions. I wonder how many of 274 00:19:48.519 --> 00:19:52.119 those I could still I could still rattle off. Unfortunately I can still say 275 00:19:52.119 --> 00:19:56.599 all of them. But we'll say that for you know, for another time. 276 00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:03.640 Yeah, okay. So so when that policy came out, I was 277 00:20:03.400 --> 00:20:08.279 kind of leaving the church ish, I mean I was mentally had left, 278 00:20:08.319 --> 00:20:12.920 I guess, and I was being a little more vocal on social media about 279 00:20:14.000 --> 00:20:18.839 some problems issues that I was having, and that policy came out and I 280 00:20:18.920 --> 00:20:22.160 made some complaints about it, and some ward members are kind of like, 281 00:20:22.160 --> 00:20:25.319 well, what do you care? Right, what do you care? You 282 00:20:25.359 --> 00:20:26.720 and Brent both left the church. Why do you care? And it's like, 283 00:20:27.319 --> 00:20:33.400 okay, let's pretend Brent hadn't left the church, none of my kids 284 00:20:33.880 --> 00:20:37.880 would be able to go through the steps of Mormonism. Now people I think, 285 00:20:37.920 --> 00:20:41.359 well, good, you don't want them to anyway, That's not the 286 00:20:41.480 --> 00:20:45.839 point. Here's the point is that these kids, if they are believing, 287 00:20:45.559 --> 00:20:49.440 they are going to be looked down upon by their peers because they're not getting 288 00:20:49.440 --> 00:20:53.319 baptized, they're not getting the priesthood, they're not advancing in these ranks, 289 00:20:53.359 --> 00:20:56.480 they're not doing all the cool shit you get to do as a boy when 290 00:20:56.519 --> 00:21:00.039 you go higher and hire in the ranks. Why because their mom is gay. 291 00:21:00.799 --> 00:21:06.680 So that's basically, in a nutshell, it's it's it's I guess it 292 00:21:06.680 --> 00:21:10.519 does punish the parent and that you are heartbroken for your child, but it 293 00:21:11.079 --> 00:21:15.000 puts this divide between the parent and the child because now it's your fault, 294 00:21:15.039 --> 00:21:19.240 Austin, if your kid can't go on a mission or if you're you know, 295 00:21:19.279 --> 00:21:22.880 if my could get it's my fault for being gay, you know, 296 00:21:22.519 --> 00:21:26.279 And that's that fucking sucks. So that was a big That was a big 297 00:21:26.319 --> 00:21:30.200 deal. So that was your turning point, you would say, is that 298 00:21:30.319 --> 00:21:34.279 was my turning point because my daughter had put in her mission papers and this 299 00:21:34.400 --> 00:21:41.599 policy came out. Fuck, and they knew that I was a lesbian, 300 00:21:41.039 --> 00:21:45.720 and they my girlfriend, my new girlfriend had moved in with me or she 301 00:21:45.759 --> 00:21:48.119 was just a roommate at the time. We weren't even dating, I think, 302 00:21:48.799 --> 00:21:52.960 and she had moved in to the extra room in our house, right, 303 00:21:53.400 --> 00:21:57.799 and they found out about her living there, that I was a lesbian. 304 00:21:59.200 --> 00:22:00.920 That wasn't even practic to sing lesbianism at the time, you know, 305 00:22:02.039 --> 00:22:07.400 right, And she was excluded from missionary service, honorably excluded. That was 306 00:22:07.400 --> 00:22:12.079 all they would tell her. Wow, And I was like, that's really 307 00:22:12.119 --> 00:22:17.079 they didn't give They didn't give her a reason. M What did she say 308 00:22:17.119 --> 00:22:21.799 about that? God, that's fucking crazy. She was upset, Yeah, 309 00:22:21.839 --> 00:22:25.880 because she knew why, you know, she wasn't She's not stupid. She 310 00:22:25.960 --> 00:22:27.880 knew why she was being excluded. Would she upset it? You or at 311 00:22:27.880 --> 00:22:32.759 the church? At the church good good? Although she is still an active 312 00:22:32.759 --> 00:22:36.440 member, sure, but just saying she could see the difference and that's good. 313 00:22:36.559 --> 00:22:38.799 Yes, Yeah, she knew. She she and she has actually given 314 00:22:38.799 --> 00:22:42.640 talks in church about this. You know, she has said, my parents 315 00:22:42.720 --> 00:22:48.279 had no choice in how they feel. They have no choice, like they 316 00:22:48.279 --> 00:22:51.599 were born this way, and if you look back at photos of them as 317 00:22:51.640 --> 00:22:52.720 a child, you can tell they were born this way. Like this is 318 00:22:52.759 --> 00:22:56.279 not somebody they just woke up one day and we're like, I'm going to 319 00:22:56.359 --> 00:23:00.000 choose to do this. You know, like when you're shoving socks and your 320 00:23:00.119 --> 00:23:03.440 pants to have a bulge, Austin, that's a clear sign, right right, 321 00:23:03.720 --> 00:23:08.440 like something it's not right there? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 322 00:23:08.480 --> 00:23:11.119 So that was the final straw that for me. I was like, 323 00:23:11.160 --> 00:23:18.400 I can't do this to pretend like I'm okay with these doctrines that I'm not 324 00:23:18.440 --> 00:23:22.039 okay with. Yeah, you know. I was like one of the things 325 00:23:22.039 --> 00:23:26.519 we're taught or that the Bible taught was God is the same today, you 326 00:23:26.519 --> 00:23:30.160 know, yesterday and today and forever. Why does Mormon God change his mind 327 00:23:30.319 --> 00:23:34.799 so much about things like you know, blacks can have the priest said, 328 00:23:34.799 --> 00:23:40.240 oh nope, now they can you know, polygamy right right, yeah, 329 00:23:40.279 --> 00:23:41.720 no, wait, that's not working for us because we're getting kicked out of 330 00:23:41.759 --> 00:23:45.759 our state. So God doesn't want us to do that anymore, you know, 331 00:23:45.880 --> 00:23:48.440 yeah yeah, And so I'm like it's just to me, it was 332 00:23:48.480 --> 00:23:56.359 so frustrating that people were suffering because old men decided that they don't like gay 333 00:23:56.400 --> 00:23:59.519 people. It's the bottom line. It's nothing to do with God, right. 334 00:23:59.640 --> 00:24:00.680 I was like, this, this is not God. I don't see 335 00:24:00.680 --> 00:24:03.920 God anywhere in this. That was Yeah, that was my final straw for 336 00:24:03.960 --> 00:24:10.799 that one. Gotcha. So did you have your name removed from the record? 337 00:24:10.880 --> 00:24:14.240 You said you did that. Yeah. Yeah, So I sent to 338 00:24:15.279 --> 00:24:18.359 I don't remember if I send a letter or an email one or the other 339 00:24:18.640 --> 00:24:21.759 to salt Lake and I was like, hey, I'm done. I can't 340 00:24:21.759 --> 00:24:25.200 do this, and please remove my name from the records. Do not contact 341 00:24:25.240 --> 00:24:27.880 me. If you do, I will contact an attorney. And that was 342 00:24:27.920 --> 00:24:32.119 it. I got an email or a letter in the mail, I guess 343 00:24:32.279 --> 00:24:36.640 a few years later or a few months later that said you're done. You 344 00:24:36.640 --> 00:24:40.279 know your name has been removed. So how did your family take that? 345 00:24:40.920 --> 00:24:45.599 I mean, since I'd already been excommunicated once. Here we go again. 346 00:24:45.039 --> 00:24:52.400 Yeah, it wasn't like they were overly shocked. You beat them down already, 347 00:24:52.440 --> 00:24:56.599 Austin, exactly. You know, my mom had a bigger problem when 348 00:24:56.640 --> 00:25:02.240 I came out as trans, and my dad was actually not shocked. None 349 00:25:02.279 --> 00:25:04.519 of my siblings were shocked. None of my friends have been shocked that knew 350 00:25:04.519 --> 00:25:10.279 me, but my mom really had a hard time with it. Yeah, 351 00:25:10.319 --> 00:25:12.799 that's kind of a whole other level, you know, right, And it's 352 00:25:12.839 --> 00:25:17.519 not a bad level. I'm just saying like that, that's that could surely 353 00:25:17.559 --> 00:25:21.440 be a bigger jump for a parent to yes have been and being the oldest 354 00:25:21.480 --> 00:25:23.920 daughter, you know, Okay, Like, yeah, I mean you're the 355 00:25:23.920 --> 00:25:26.920 only daughter, so you kind of understand how that sure that goes. But 356 00:25:27.160 --> 00:25:30.880 I was the oldest daughter that was supposed to be setting any example for all 357 00:25:30.880 --> 00:25:36.119 my younger siblings, and you know, yeah, I fucked that up. 358 00:25:36.160 --> 00:25:41.960 So way to go, Austin. I know. So, how long after 359 00:25:44.400 --> 00:25:48.400 you completely left the church did you start, I guess having more the idea 360 00:25:48.480 --> 00:25:55.000 of transitioning. Yeah, I actually started testosterone in twenty seventeen. Okay, 361 00:25:55.119 --> 00:26:00.079 However, I was married to my wife at the time was not okay with 362 00:26:00.440 --> 00:26:04.400 the changes testosterone brought around. She was not okay with me being male. 363 00:26:04.640 --> 00:26:07.759 You know, She's like, I am a lesbian. I want to be 364 00:26:07.799 --> 00:26:10.519 with a woman, you know, And I was like okay, So I 365 00:26:10.640 --> 00:26:15.559 stopped testosterone, went back in the closet. Yeah, and then we moved 366 00:26:15.559 --> 00:26:21.720 to Texas, which was a whole nother shit show. And while we were 367 00:26:21.720 --> 00:26:22.880 in Texas, I ended up being in the mental health unit for a month. 368 00:26:25.400 --> 00:26:26.279 I would be in there for like ten days. I came home for 369 00:26:26.359 --> 00:26:30.599 like a day, and I'd go right back in again the first time going 370 00:26:30.640 --> 00:26:34.160 in. What happened? What was what was the break that made you go 371 00:26:34.319 --> 00:26:37.559 the first time going in? When you went to Yeah, when you went 372 00:26:37.559 --> 00:26:41.519 to Texas? Yeah, what was the So the well that was the last 373 00:26:41.559 --> 00:26:42.200 time I went in the mental health you know, is when we lived in 374 00:26:42.240 --> 00:26:45.359 Texas. Got you Okay? Yeah, My first time going to the mental 375 00:26:45.400 --> 00:26:48.559 health you know was when my son was two. So this was when I 376 00:26:48.599 --> 00:26:52.720 was twenty five, okay, And while I was in the mental health unit 377 00:26:52.799 --> 00:26:55.880 that time. Actually, that's an interesting story. While I was in the 378 00:26:55.880 --> 00:27:00.039 mental health unit, they had us straw a self portrait, and I I 379 00:27:00.119 --> 00:27:03.200 drew this self portrait. And my self portrait was a face divided down the 380 00:27:03.200 --> 00:27:07.799 middle, and on one half there was a girl with long hair and a 381 00:27:07.839 --> 00:27:11.599 frown and peers coming down her rise. And then on the other half there 382 00:27:11.759 --> 00:27:17.200 was a boy with a football jersey and a huge smile and like really short 383 00:27:17.200 --> 00:27:21.759 hair. Wow. And they asked me, like what does this picture represent? 384 00:27:22.400 --> 00:27:25.599 And I said, well, this is the person I see inside, 385 00:27:26.000 --> 00:27:29.039 and I pointed to the boy's side and I was like, but I know 386 00:27:29.160 --> 00:27:34.119 that this is what everyone else sees. And they were like, have you 387 00:27:34.160 --> 00:27:37.960 ever explored that with a therapist? And I was like, well yeah, 388 00:27:37.000 --> 00:27:40.279 but she told me I didn't know what I was talking about. So there 389 00:27:40.319 --> 00:27:44.000 you go. And you were still married and all that back then, right, 390 00:27:44.200 --> 00:27:48.440 like, yeah, wow, did your husband know about the self portrait? 391 00:27:48.640 --> 00:27:53.279 Was he aware of all of this? Yeah? Yeah, he had 392 00:27:53.319 --> 00:27:56.440 always wondered, you know, like when I came out as lesbian him, 393 00:27:56.519 --> 00:28:00.920 he was like, yeah, I know, and so nothing shocked him. 394 00:28:02.039 --> 00:28:06.400 He was not at all surprised. I got always dressed masculine. I'd always 395 00:28:06.960 --> 00:28:08.759 want to, you know, kept my hair short. It was not like 396 00:28:08.799 --> 00:28:12.279 this was a huge shocker, Oh my god. You know, but the 397 00:28:12.400 --> 00:28:15.480 last time I was in the mental health unit that was in Texas, and 398 00:28:15.519 --> 00:28:18.160 I would go in and i'd come out. As soon as I get home, 399 00:28:18.160 --> 00:28:22.440 I'd just feel this. I don't even know how to explain it. 400 00:28:22.440 --> 00:28:26.559 It's like a dark presence. I guess that would just settle over me, 401 00:28:26.960 --> 00:28:33.279 my whole body, and I felt so heavy, and so sad, and 402 00:28:33.359 --> 00:28:37.000 I was like, there's no way out of this except death. That was 403 00:28:37.200 --> 00:28:44.359 the point I was at, like, I can't escape this. And in 404 00:28:44.400 --> 00:28:51.359 the Church you're taught that any earthly ailments you have will be fixed when you 405 00:28:51.440 --> 00:28:55.440 die. You will be perfected in the next life, in the Church's version 406 00:28:55.480 --> 00:29:00.240 of perfection of course, right. And one of my biggest issues to this 407 00:29:00.400 --> 00:29:07.279 day with that teaching is that Mormon youth are killing themselves if they are LGBTQ 408 00:29:08.000 --> 00:29:15.680 because they believe that's the only way they're going to be accepted and loved and 409 00:29:15.680 --> 00:29:21.079 healed. That's again in quotation marks, you know, is to just die 410 00:29:21.119 --> 00:29:26.720 and make it to the other side. Yeah, that's I. I hate 411 00:29:26.759 --> 00:29:30.759 that for everyone. I hate that, especially for the for the youth because 412 00:29:32.200 --> 00:29:37.720 they don't have that life experience yet. Of you know, some do now 413 00:29:37.240 --> 00:29:44.920 as time goes on, but typically the youth, they don't have friends who 414 00:29:44.920 --> 00:29:48.240 are trans. There's not like trans people they see on TV. And even 415 00:29:48.279 --> 00:29:52.920 if they do, if they have been so brainwashed and thinking that's wrong and 416 00:29:52.960 --> 00:29:56.559 if you know it'll be, you'll be made clean after you die. Like, 417 00:29:56.559 --> 00:30:03.119 what a fucked up thing to to live your life just waiting to die 418 00:30:03.559 --> 00:30:07.039 because you can't act on how you're feeling, You're going to be lonely. 419 00:30:07.440 --> 00:30:11.920 You feel this darkness all over you know. I have gone through a lot 420 00:30:11.960 --> 00:30:18.759 of depressive episodes, and I would describe it similarly like black tar, heavy, 421 00:30:18.839 --> 00:30:22.039 black tar all over you. That it's heavy and it seeps into every 422 00:30:22.200 --> 00:30:29.039 pore and you just can't pull it off. So to live your life like 423 00:30:29.160 --> 00:30:33.039 that and know this is how I have to feel until I die, no 424 00:30:33.119 --> 00:30:38.279 wonder, no wonder. The suicide rate is higher than it freaking I mean, 425 00:30:38.680 --> 00:30:41.279 way higher than it should be, but for these poor kids because there's 426 00:30:41.319 --> 00:30:48.640 not there's no out unless you're dead, and that's horrible. Yes, it 427 00:30:48.759 --> 00:30:56.119 makes me furious. Yeah, So were you considering taking your life? Yeah? 428 00:30:56.640 --> 00:31:02.480 Yeah. And my wife and I moved back to Oregon. We've got 429 00:31:02.559 --> 00:31:07.319 a divorce because our marriage was not working. You know, we weren't physically 430 00:31:07.359 --> 00:31:11.359 intimate. She had no attraction to me at all. I was so miserable 431 00:31:11.400 --> 00:31:15.599 that I just snapped all the time, Like I was always snappy and grumpy, 432 00:31:15.759 --> 00:31:19.759 and like I just couldn't be happy. You stopped taking testosterone for her, 433 00:31:21.079 --> 00:31:25.440 right, Yes, you seem to have this pattern of trying to do 434 00:31:25.559 --> 00:31:29.759 what is right for you and then being like, oh fuck, I'm hurting 435 00:31:29.759 --> 00:31:36.279 someone, I'm disappointing someone, reverse reverse reverse, is that it's that people 436 00:31:36.319 --> 00:31:42.079 pleasing mode that you you know, yep, yep, oh god, yeah. 437 00:31:42.319 --> 00:31:45.680 So how did that end up? Then? Uh, well, we're 438 00:31:45.720 --> 00:31:48.559 we're good friends now. Oh that's good. Yeah, but it blew up 439 00:31:48.559 --> 00:31:52.240 at the time. We didn't talk probably a good year and a half after 440 00:31:52.319 --> 00:31:56.680 we broke up, just because there's a lot of hurt there, you know. 441 00:31:56.000 --> 00:32:00.039 Of course, that's a lot of things that were not nice. And 442 00:32:00.359 --> 00:32:05.400 I don't hurt people say things. That's what I've figured out through the years. 443 00:32:05.640 --> 00:32:08.319 Yes, yes you don't mean it, but it's how you feel at 444 00:32:08.359 --> 00:32:14.799 the time and still hurts to hear it, exactly exactly. So after her, 445 00:32:15.240 --> 00:32:17.640 I dated another person and I was fully out of chance to them, 446 00:32:19.119 --> 00:32:22.519 but they made it clear they were not okay with bottom surgery, And at 447 00:32:22.559 --> 00:32:24.920 first I was okay with not having bottom surgery. I didn't think I would 448 00:32:24.960 --> 00:32:30.160 want it. I hadn't had top surgery yet, and all I saw when 449 00:32:30.160 --> 00:32:31.200 I looked in the mirror was my boobs, So I was like, I 450 00:32:31.200 --> 00:32:35.960 don't even think about what's blow the waist like, you know, well, 451 00:32:36.000 --> 00:32:38.359 once those were gone, let's be honest, she had big boobs, Austin, 452 00:32:38.640 --> 00:32:44.640 I did, very Yes, even with the binder, you couldn't hide 453 00:32:44.640 --> 00:32:47.599 them, so okay, yeah, yeah, So once they were gone, 454 00:32:47.920 --> 00:32:52.519 I was like, well, let's not jump over that. I don't remember, 455 00:32:52.759 --> 00:32:57.160 and our listeners remember, because anyone here who doesn't know Austin Austin, 456 00:32:57.359 --> 00:33:00.559 he has always been very active in the latter day let be in podcast discussion 457 00:33:00.599 --> 00:33:05.799 group, very honest with what's going on, talking about things, and people 458 00:33:06.480 --> 00:33:08.839 are just all up in your business in a good way, like they cheer 459 00:33:09.000 --> 00:33:14.519 for you. When you were first talking about having top surgery, I remember 460 00:33:14.599 --> 00:33:17.680 you being excited for it, but then wavering, going back and forth and 461 00:33:17.720 --> 00:33:21.519 feeling like, oh shit, I'm about to disappoint it everyone. Maybe I 462 00:33:21.519 --> 00:33:23.160 shouldn't do this, Like, let's talk about that for a minute, because 463 00:33:23.200 --> 00:33:25.880 I remember that you had sent me some polos. I remember, and there 464 00:33:27.000 --> 00:33:30.160 was just some. You were depressed, you weren't sure, you were kind 465 00:33:30.160 --> 00:33:34.440 of backsliding a bit, Go ahead, talk about it. That was just 466 00:33:34.480 --> 00:33:40.680 the boobs. Yeah, I knew my family would be disappointed. Sure, 467 00:33:40.839 --> 00:33:45.160 you know, because there's no going back after you have parts of your body 468 00:33:45.200 --> 00:33:51.480 removed, so you know, and it kind of was the final Yes, 469 00:33:51.519 --> 00:33:54.319 this is really who I am. And I knew that that would be an 470 00:33:54.319 --> 00:33:59.480 issue. So as much as I hated them, and had hated them my 471 00:33:59.720 --> 00:34:01.480 entire life. Your boobs, not your family, your boobs yet right, 472 00:34:01.559 --> 00:34:07.800 right, I knew that it would still disappoint people, yeah, and change 473 00:34:07.880 --> 00:34:13.400 how they saw me. And I was scared about how my family would react 474 00:34:13.840 --> 00:34:15.760 when you know, when I came out as a lesbian, I was disowned 475 00:34:15.760 --> 00:34:20.519 for five months. Oh I'm so sorry, Like I said, they wouldn't 476 00:34:20.519 --> 00:34:24.920 come to my wedding. And then when I came out as trans, my 477 00:34:24.960 --> 00:34:34.440 mom sent me a message on Facebook that said I became gay to spite my 478 00:34:34.519 --> 00:34:37.960 ex husband, and then that didn't give me enough attention. So now I 479 00:34:37.039 --> 00:34:42.920 was being trans? Are you serious? Yeah? Yeah, I actually posted 480 00:34:42.960 --> 00:34:45.880 screenshots of it in the group. You must really hate that ex husband. 481 00:34:46.559 --> 00:34:54.079 I do. I'm going to be trans. I'm gonna have massive surgery because 482 00:34:54.079 --> 00:34:58.000 I hate him so much, right, And I was like, I hadn't 483 00:34:58.039 --> 00:35:00.519 even talked to him in years by at this point, so I was like, 484 00:35:00.679 --> 00:35:01.719 I really think she's got nothing to do with it, you know, 485 00:35:01.840 --> 00:35:07.440 like as soon as my kids were eighteen that that ended. Like I had 486 00:35:07.480 --> 00:35:12.920 no reason to talk to him anymore. Isn't it interesting that a parent, 487 00:35:13.480 --> 00:35:15.960 I you know, not just a parent, but people in general, would 488 00:35:15.079 --> 00:35:22.079 rather believe that you are just a super spiteful person and you're doing all this 489 00:35:22.159 --> 00:35:25.840 shit out of being mean than to believe that this is actually who you are, 490 00:35:27.320 --> 00:35:30.559 right, Like, because they can't grasp that either God made a mistake, 491 00:35:31.039 --> 00:35:35.599 or that being gay is a real thing, or that being trans is 492 00:35:35.639 --> 00:35:39.960 real, Like is that goes against their entire religious belief, you know, 493 00:35:40.199 --> 00:35:43.519 right, So it's got to be it's got to be something else. It's 494 00:35:43.519 --> 00:35:45.239 got to be that you're just real pissed off, Austin, You're pissed, 495 00:35:45.760 --> 00:35:50.360 that's really pissed off. Yeah, let's go on the knife because I'm that 496 00:35:50.519 --> 00:35:54.239 mad. Yeah, yep. She started to notice that I was different when 497 00:35:54.280 --> 00:36:01.360 I started testosterone, because I became happy for the first time in a long 498 00:36:01.440 --> 00:36:07.159 time. Tell me that why, a genuine smile, because I felt like 499 00:36:07.199 --> 00:36:10.400 I was finally doing something to align myself. Ah yeah, yeah, and 500 00:36:10.800 --> 00:36:15.519 I wasn't denying who I was anymore, right, Oh, I love it. 501 00:36:15.800 --> 00:36:17.840 My voice started to drop. Oh my god, that was such euphoria 502 00:36:17.960 --> 00:36:22.400 when I could sing along with like the male singers and actually get the write 503 00:36:22.440 --> 00:36:25.400 notes. Yeah, and my voice started getting deeper. I remember my dad 504 00:36:25.480 --> 00:36:30.199 called. I was like two months on testoster and my dad called and he 505 00:36:30.280 --> 00:36:32.320 was like, do you have a cold? And I said no, and 506 00:36:32.360 --> 00:36:37.079 he's like, well, your voice sounds really raspy. And I was like, 507 00:36:37.880 --> 00:36:44.079 that's the hormones. Nice, So yeah, oh I love that. 508 00:36:44.599 --> 00:36:46.280 And then you know, I started getting facial hair and I was like, 509 00:36:46.480 --> 00:36:51.480 yes, this is so so. I never had any qualms about the changes 510 00:36:51.480 --> 00:36:54.000 that were happening to my body. I was totally stoked about all of them. 511 00:36:54.039 --> 00:36:59.360 Just super happy. And I didn't need after I had top surgery, 512 00:37:00.119 --> 00:37:04.199 I didn't need my anxiety meds anymore. I didn't need my antidepressants anymore. 513 00:37:05.280 --> 00:37:12.559 I've had no suicidal ideation at all. That is phenomenal. Yeah, because 514 00:37:12.599 --> 00:37:15.960 I finally see someone I recognize when I look in the mirror, you know, 515 00:37:15.079 --> 00:37:20.519 Like that was the hardest thing for me. Like I remember when I 516 00:37:20.559 --> 00:37:22.320 was a teenager, I would sit and stare at myself in the mirror for 517 00:37:22.480 --> 00:37:28.559 hours, just staring at my face in the mirror. And I was trying 518 00:37:28.599 --> 00:37:32.639 to find something I recognized because I did not recognize the person I was looking 519 00:37:32.639 --> 00:37:36.719 at. So I would just look at my eyes. That was the only 520 00:37:36.760 --> 00:37:38.719 thing. I thought, that's me. Okay, those are my eyes, 521 00:37:38.960 --> 00:37:43.400 so that's me. But if I looked at the rest of my body, 522 00:37:43.400 --> 00:37:45.559 I was like, that's not me. That's got to be such a mind 523 00:37:45.599 --> 00:37:52.280 fuck. I can't I don't think anyone who was not trans probably, i'll 524 00:37:52.320 --> 00:37:57.039 say probably can't really understand how that feels. I know, for me, 525 00:37:57.079 --> 00:38:00.880 as a kid, I wanted to be a boy just because boys got to 526 00:38:00.920 --> 00:38:05.719 do the cool stuff and you know, all that kind of thing. But 527 00:38:05.840 --> 00:38:09.440 it wasn't like I felt like I was a boy and couldn't be Like that's 528 00:38:09.480 --> 00:38:15.360 a whole different ballgame. Wow. I uh, that just breaks my heart. 529 00:38:15.559 --> 00:38:20.280 Just to imagine that you, or anyone just sitting there staring at the 530 00:38:20.320 --> 00:38:23.679 mirror. I wanted to really quickly say, so, for you, after 531 00:38:23.760 --> 00:38:29.599 having your top surgery and getting on hormones, you didn't need to have your 532 00:38:29.639 --> 00:38:32.719 medications anymore. That worked for you. There might be people who still need, 533 00:38:32.800 --> 00:38:36.400 you know, medications after something like that. I'm not saying this is 534 00:38:36.400 --> 00:38:40.199 how it was for everyone. For you though, that was a life changer, 535 00:38:40.559 --> 00:38:44.199 right right. Yeah. For me, that was the cause of my 536 00:38:44.519 --> 00:38:50.039 depression and anxiety was when you when you're feel like you're living a double life. 537 00:38:51.440 --> 00:38:55.320 It's really hard to be happy and present in any life, you know, 538 00:38:55.559 --> 00:39:00.159 because like you're constantly feeling you're hiding something. Yeah, once I didn't 539 00:39:00.199 --> 00:39:05.039 have to hide anymore, it's like, oh okay, and it's kind of 540 00:39:05.039 --> 00:39:07.719 like now my family sees I post selfies, you know, I don't mind 541 00:39:07.719 --> 00:39:12.639 having my picture taken with my grandkids or my kids or you know. Yeah, 542 00:39:12.679 --> 00:39:15.400 you're all over social media. It's awesome. Yeah. Yeah. And 543 00:39:15.800 --> 00:39:21.559 I hated having my picture taken before transition. Hated it. Like I wouldn't 544 00:39:21.599 --> 00:39:24.400 post any pictures of me unless it was with my kids, and that was 545 00:39:24.440 --> 00:39:28.679 because it was with my kids. Wow, this is just amazing. And 546 00:39:28.679 --> 00:39:30.599 I'm loving this too, by the way, because again I met you before 547 00:39:30.639 --> 00:39:34.880 any of this was happening, and I've been able to watch it and it's 548 00:39:34.920 --> 00:39:40.039 just so badass to see where you are now. I want to know when 549 00:39:40.079 --> 00:39:45.800 your boob were first removed, what did that feel like when you woke up, 550 00:39:45.880 --> 00:39:49.840 sat up, whatever, The swelling's down and there are no boobs. 551 00:39:50.239 --> 00:39:54.800 Tell me. When I went in for my postop appointment where they removed the 552 00:39:54.800 --> 00:40:00.719 binder, I remember just looking at my chest like I got and I opened 553 00:40:00.800 --> 00:40:02.400 the winder again. I just looked in the mirror. I was like, 554 00:40:04.440 --> 00:40:08.360 wow, like that is what That's what that's supposed to look like. Okay, 555 00:40:08.360 --> 00:40:13.840 I'm good. I was so happy. You know, I saw these 556 00:40:13.920 --> 00:40:16.159 videos of guys like crying when when they're renders drew. I never did that. 557 00:40:16.239 --> 00:40:21.800 Like it wasn't like a you know, but it was definitely a oh 558 00:40:22.519 --> 00:40:24.159 yeah, oh this is this is it? Oh okay, yeah, I 559 00:40:24.159 --> 00:40:29.639 look like I'm supposed to look now. Yay. I love it so obviously. 560 00:40:29.719 --> 00:40:31.920 Then no regret, No what did I do? Not just maybe like 561 00:40:32.000 --> 00:40:36.079 why didn't I do this sooner? Kind of thing? Well even yeah, 562 00:40:36.280 --> 00:40:44.960 yeah yeah wow. And to see you post surgery and now you're like running 563 00:40:45.119 --> 00:40:49.599 races, getting in shape and you just start glowing and you're doing it seems 564 00:40:49.599 --> 00:40:53.480 to me like you're doing the things that you should have been doing for yourself 565 00:40:53.679 --> 00:40:57.719 for a long time, things that make you happy. Yeah. Yeah, 566 00:40:57.719 --> 00:40:59.920 Well, I mean, you know, I started caring about losing weight. 567 00:41:00.480 --> 00:41:01.719 You know, I was up over two hundred pounds. I'm only five foot 568 00:41:01.760 --> 00:41:07.000 tall, you know, are not tall? Yeah, and now I'm you 569 00:41:07.039 --> 00:41:10.599 know, one forty five, So I'm at a good wait with my muscle 570 00:41:10.599 --> 00:41:15.880 mass, my doctors happy. Yeah, you know my legs are like solid 571 00:41:15.920 --> 00:41:19.800 muscle because I ride a bike and you know I was doing thirty mile rides. 572 00:41:19.960 --> 00:41:22.400 I've seen the leg selfies. You're trying. You're trying to compete with 573 00:41:22.480 --> 00:41:24.519 my leg selfies. Tee. Where you're at? Okay, I see where 574 00:41:24.519 --> 00:41:29.000 you're at. I'm getting my ass back to the gym next week. Well, 575 00:41:29.079 --> 00:41:31.000 unfortunately I'm going to be away from the gym for like twelve weeks. 576 00:41:31.000 --> 00:41:38.000 But is true you've got that next surgery coming up. Yeah, So Austin, 577 00:41:38.159 --> 00:41:45.719 we are actually like forty five minutes in and we haven't even started talking 578 00:41:45.760 --> 00:41:49.800 about your nether regions yet, which is the surgery that's coming up. So 579 00:41:50.000 --> 00:41:52.079 I'm like, should we divide this like we we? We did your kind 580 00:41:52.079 --> 00:41:55.559 of intro to who you are, your life, talked about the boobs. 581 00:41:57.480 --> 00:42:00.800 Now you know, why don't we Why don't we wrap this up for today 582 00:42:00.639 --> 00:42:05.519 and let's let's record another time for the nether regions. I think that would 583 00:42:05.519 --> 00:42:07.719 be freaking awesome. Don't get me because I still have I still have so 584 00:42:07.760 --> 00:42:14.159 many questions and I haven't even gotten to like the the uh Patreon subscriber questions. 585 00:42:14.199 --> 00:42:17.440 We have people that are like, ask Austin, this you people, 586 00:42:17.960 --> 00:42:22.199 I mean people literally. When I posted on social media that I was going 587 00:42:22.280 --> 00:42:24.840 to interview you, I'm sure you've seen all the messages, people are like 588 00:42:25.039 --> 00:42:30.760 so pumped about that, and I just love to see people just rallying around. 589 00:42:30.920 --> 00:42:35.480 So it made me really happy. Oh good. People love you, 590 00:42:35.519 --> 00:42:37.119 Austin. I love you. I actually met you in real life one time, 591 00:42:37.239 --> 00:42:42.800 right and that was amazing. And I'm hoping to see you again this 592 00:42:42.880 --> 00:42:46.639 summer because I will likely be heading out toward the West coast for some shit. 593 00:42:47.159 --> 00:42:50.800 So I don't know. I'm still learning how to wrap up these episodes 594 00:42:50.960 --> 00:42:54.719 patrons, I don't have patrin names right now. We're we are still getting 595 00:42:54.760 --> 00:42:59.079 there, We're still I. I guess I need to remember to say I 596 00:42:59.119 --> 00:43:02.280 am still getting there and this, that and the other. So I guess 597 00:43:02.280 --> 00:43:07.440 that's it. Steer clear of cults because they are no joke, no joke 598 00:43:07.480 --> 00:43:09.320 at all. Oh shit, thanks for leaving in, Dan, Thank you 599 00:43:09.400 --> 00:43:13.760 Dan and extension audio. All this shit's coming back to me. Thanks Dan, 600 00:43:14.639 --> 00:43:20.039 and thank you to all of the subscribers on Patreon and supercast. By 601 00:43:20.079 --> 00:43:22.760 the way, got a new website coming up really really soon where we can 602 00:43:23.519 --> 00:43:30.320 where you can get all information about the podcast, listen to episode and be 603 00:43:30.400 --> 00:43:35.719 supporters and YadA, YadA YadA. That was a rambly ass ending. So 604 00:43:36.239 --> 00:43:43.159 on the next episode we will be talking about Austin gets a dick? Can 605 00:43:43.239 --> 00:43:47.840 we say that? I'm always saying that because you've said it, Austin. 606 00:43:47.920 --> 00:43:52.199 Okay, I'm not saying it all the time. All right on, all 607 00:43:52.320 --> 00:43:53.639 right, y'all. We'll talk to you later.