WEBVTT 1 00:00:05.639 --> 00:00:12.439 Hey, Welcome back to another episode of the Ruby Rogues podcast. Our guests 2 00:00:12.480 --> 00:00:16.199 backed out for this week, so it's just us. I'm here with Valentino. 3 00:00:16.280 --> 00:00:22.559 Valentino, you want to say hi. Yeah, So I thought we'd 4 00:00:22.640 --> 00:00:26.239 just catch up. You know, we usually don't talk about us, so 5 00:00:26.760 --> 00:00:32.520 occasionally you'll mention, yeah, I'm building machine learning models and doing important nifty 6 00:00:32.560 --> 00:00:37.399 stuff, and I thought, you know what, it might be fun to 7 00:00:37.439 --> 00:00:40.280 catch up. The other thing is is I started listening to some of the 8 00:00:40.320 --> 00:00:43.960 other Ruby podcasts out there that hadn't Like, I knew there were more out 9 00:00:43.960 --> 00:00:46.439 there, and I'd been subscribed to some of them, like Ruby on Rails 10 00:00:46.439 --> 00:00:53.000 podcast for a long time and things like that. But I ran across Remote 11 00:00:53.079 --> 00:01:00.880 Ruby with Jason Charns and Chris Oliver and Andrew Mason. I ran across Rooftop 12 00:01:00.200 --> 00:01:03.439 Ruby and I can't remember those guys' names, but they've got nice accents, 13 00:01:03.560 --> 00:01:10.040 nice British accents. And then Ruby for All, which is also Andrew Mason. 14 00:01:10.079 --> 00:01:14.480 But he talks to Julie and I'm kind of getting the picture that she's 15 00:01:15.000 --> 00:01:19.359 a recent I don't know if she's a boot camp grab grad or just graduated 16 00:01:19.439 --> 00:01:25.519 from school or just decided to become a programmer because she used to be something 17 00:01:25.519 --> 00:01:29.000 else. But anyway, so they just chat and I was like, oh, 18 00:01:29.040 --> 00:01:32.480 we should just have a chat, right, So it's kind of both. 19 00:01:32.560 --> 00:01:36.920 So what are you working on and let's chat? Yeah, we're gonna 20 00:01:36.920 --> 00:01:42.799 tell us stuff. I just I guess my latest thing is I just bought 21 00:01:42.840 --> 00:01:48.879 this massive three GPU machine. Oh wow, that I'm gonna start having some 22 00:01:48.959 --> 00:01:55.359 fun training and fine tuning of my own models for AI related Thanks, I'm 23 00:01:55.400 --> 00:01:57.599 really looking forward to that. Are you using lane chain or something for that 24 00:01:57.799 --> 00:02:02.200 or I will be? Yeah, I mean that's what every everybody uses. 25 00:02:02.799 --> 00:02:07.199 So uh, I'm gonna try and do it in Ruby. That's kind of 26 00:02:07.199 --> 00:02:13.319 my plans to do as much as I can and then maybe benchmarkham and see 27 00:02:13.639 --> 00:02:21.159 see if it's possible to do it in Ruby. R isn't written in Ruby, 28 00:02:21.240 --> 00:02:23.120 but yeah, so you're just going to use it kind of like to 29 00:02:23.280 --> 00:02:27.280 use a database. Yeah, I mean that. I think the hurdle is 30 00:02:27.280 --> 00:02:30.000 PyTorch, which there is a port of it for Ruby. I haven't had 31 00:02:30.000 --> 00:02:34.719 a chance to play with it yet, so I'm kind of curious to see 32 00:02:34.960 --> 00:02:40.199 how well it works, like be doing some you know, hard GPU competational 33 00:02:40.240 --> 00:02:46.759 stuff, so we'll see it should be fun. Yeah, yeah, cool, 34 00:02:46.000 --> 00:02:52.520 Yeah, that sounds awesome. I guess. I guess the other one 35 00:02:52.560 --> 00:02:57.199 big one in the space is TensorFlow. I would imagine, yeah you can. 36 00:02:58.000 --> 00:03:00.840 So so the tools that I talked to people and I had people bringing 37 00:03:00.879 --> 00:03:05.520 it up during the Ruby Dev summit, it was well, Ruby needs to 38 00:03:05.560 --> 00:03:07.800 be better in AI because if not, then Ruby's going to be dead on 39 00:03:07.919 --> 00:03:10.319 arrival and all this stuff. And I don't I don't know if I buy 40 00:03:10.360 --> 00:03:15.039 that, but you know, I'm looking at it and I'm going, Okay, 41 00:03:15.080 --> 00:03:20.639 well, nobody's going to build the modeling engine in Ruby, at least 42 00:03:20.800 --> 00:03:23.719 not that i'm seeing. I guess they built it in Python and we're we're 43 00:03:23.800 --> 00:03:30.520 performed a dish like Python. So maybe. But yeah, what I'm typically 44 00:03:30.520 --> 00:03:31.960 seeing when I talk to people who are doing this is yeah, they're plugging 45 00:03:31.960 --> 00:03:37.759 into something else like PyTorch or like chane or something. Yeah, you know, 46 00:03:37.840 --> 00:03:40.199 it's everybody. It's funny, like you mentioned it, like everybody does 47 00:03:40.319 --> 00:03:44.800 like that it's the default. Oh, Python's doing AI, but like really 48 00:03:44.879 --> 00:03:47.319 it's like C and C plus plus that is doing AI and then they have 49 00:03:47.400 --> 00:03:53.439 like buying Yeah, well, I think I think where it's gained the most 50 00:03:53.439 --> 00:03:58.280 traction is with like the laying chain people that have really like set up pipelines 51 00:03:58.319 --> 00:04:02.879 and tooling around like the parallelization, which is like kind of crucial for a 52 00:04:02.879 --> 00:04:08.319 lot of the uh you know, hard computation that's needed for it, and 53 00:04:08.439 --> 00:04:12.319 so they've said they've like focused on that, and I think they've set up 54 00:04:12.319 --> 00:04:15.879 a functional framework that's worked really well for them. Uh. I'm hopeful that 55 00:04:15.959 --> 00:04:20.279 we can kind of get something out of that from Ruby too. Uh. 56 00:04:20.319 --> 00:04:25.439 Definitely. Ruby three has all the acinc stuff, Yeah, which we could 57 00:04:25.439 --> 00:04:28.920 probably get just as close to be honest. So that's what I plan to 58 00:04:29.160 --> 00:04:32.519 kind of test out a couple theorios I have there. Yeah. Absolutely, 59 00:04:32.600 --> 00:04:36.279 Yeah. You mentioned that it's mostly C and stuff, and you're right. 60 00:04:36.480 --> 00:04:41.800 I mean there are two reasons that Python has kind of taken some of the 61 00:04:41.839 --> 00:04:46.720 space here, and one is that they have kind of the the math libraries 62 00:04:46.759 --> 00:04:49.680 and things that a lot of the academics wanted and then they backed it on 63 00:04:49.680 --> 00:04:56.399 to see so it's freaking fast. Yeah, It's funny because like if you're 64 00:04:56.480 --> 00:05:00.959 running even if you're running imprints, like you're kind of just like shelling out 65 00:05:01.000 --> 00:05:05.879 to run the CPP library and the ground right, Like, so, uh, 66 00:05:08.160 --> 00:05:11.079 it's that's going to be the fastest. And if you especially if you're 67 00:05:11.120 --> 00:05:15.680 trying to like you have to optimize on the speed of the tokens. Like 68 00:05:15.560 --> 00:05:18.519 what you end up doing is you download the model and then you want to 69 00:05:18.600 --> 00:05:26.279 run infrints on it, and you run the inference through a faster library that 70 00:05:26.319 --> 00:05:30.240 processes in real time since you want to stream it often. Yeah, so 71 00:05:30.639 --> 00:05:34.879 that's I'm I'm interested in all the open source models and what you can do 72 00:05:34.920 --> 00:05:40.959 with that and missdrill and mixed drill and all that. You can get very 73 00:05:41.040 --> 00:05:45.639 similar outputs for a lot of certain kinds of tasks, and so that's why 74 00:05:45.639 --> 00:05:50.240 I want to kind of see where I could take fine tuning in models get 75 00:05:50.360 --> 00:05:56.959 very specific input outputs and you can like make something really fast, right Yeah. 76 00:05:57.160 --> 00:05:59.800 Yeah. One of the things that I'm playing with in the AI space 77 00:06:00.199 --> 00:06:02.480 little bit, and I'm just barely starting to pick it up because I you 78 00:06:02.480 --> 00:06:05.800 know, I have the Summit, I've got like eight zillion things going. 79 00:06:06.920 --> 00:06:12.160 But I've been talking to Alex Rudol, who wrote the open aigm. We 80 00:06:12.199 --> 00:06:17.319 had him on the show a while back, and yeah, I've basically we 81 00:06:17.439 --> 00:06:21.839 talked after I interviewed him for the Ruby Dev Summit and decided that we're going 82 00:06:21.920 --> 00:06:27.279 to do a five day challenge where you hook into open Ai and so I'm 83 00:06:27.319 --> 00:06:30.680 trying to learn it so that I can teach it, if that makes sense, 84 00:06:31.079 --> 00:06:39.319 But I also want to integrate it into top end devs basically because I'm 85 00:06:39.360 --> 00:06:43.639 starting to put out more content. And the system that we use is called 86 00:06:43.680 --> 00:06:47.879 cast Magic. They had some apps Zumo lifetime deals, so I get like, 87 00:06:48.120 --> 00:06:51.360 I don't know, like four hundred or six hundred minutes a month or 88 00:06:51.360 --> 00:06:55.519 something I can't remember, but I get not enough minutes a month on there 89 00:06:55.600 --> 00:07:00.480 every month without having to pay anything extra for them. And yeah, I 90 00:07:00.519 --> 00:07:02.879 talked to a few people and it looks like you can just hook into the 91 00:07:02.879 --> 00:07:05.240 open ay stuff and it'll do a lot of that work for you. So 92 00:07:06.120 --> 00:07:10.519 I'm much more on the consumer and much less on the how how do I 93 00:07:10.560 --> 00:07:15.439 make this model come together? But I think it'll be interesting. Yeah, 94 00:07:15.480 --> 00:07:17.160 I Mean the biggest challenge too, is like where do you host it? 95 00:07:17.319 --> 00:07:21.519 Because like you gotta, you know, put the weights somewhere and you know, 96 00:07:21.639 --> 00:07:25.959 then you have like, you know, all these different services that offer 97 00:07:26.560 --> 00:07:31.480 like a Chat GPT API related you know setup that just like less you run 98 00:07:31.480 --> 00:07:38.480 infernts on your weights like so that it's like, yeah, at some point 99 00:07:38.720 --> 00:07:42.079 it starts to be like, well, you know Chat, you know opening 100 00:07:42.160 --> 00:07:47.199 eyes API isn't that expensive? Yeah? Yeah, so well it depends on 101 00:07:47.240 --> 00:07:53.079 what you want, right, Right. If if Chat GPT has a model 102 00:07:53.399 --> 00:07:59.600 you know, using GPT three point five or you GPT four that that does 103 00:07:59.639 --> 00:08:01.560 your does the job for you, then yeah, why build your own, 104 00:08:01.720 --> 00:08:07.920 right, unless unless you have another reason to. But yeah, it's it's 105 00:08:07.959 --> 00:08:11.000 for those other setups or other circumstances where it's like, you know what, 106 00:08:11.680 --> 00:08:16.480 I either foresee that I'm going to need to expand beyond what chat GPT offers, 107 00:08:16.800 --> 00:08:22.399 or you know, my my scenario is different for some reason and so 108 00:08:22.480 --> 00:08:28.639 I need a custom model. Yeah. I mean the most interesting part to 109 00:08:28.680 --> 00:08:33.559 me is like the next chipsets that come out are versions of the MAC. 110 00:08:33.080 --> 00:08:37.679 You know, they're all going to be driven to run enterance fast, right, 111 00:08:37.759 --> 00:08:41.080 and they right like the current ones already like do pretty great, and 112 00:08:41.159 --> 00:08:46.519 so like if it's very easy to run inference and like you can just download 113 00:08:46.519 --> 00:08:50.159 the weights for an open model that get pretty much the same as you know, 114 00:08:50.240 --> 00:08:54.240 GP three point five Turbo, which is like pretty great outputs. Yeah, 115 00:08:54.279 --> 00:08:58.559 Like then anybody can just run locally any model that they want and get 116 00:08:58.679 --> 00:09:03.879 like chat GPT locally and not have to, you know, worry about security 117 00:09:03.039 --> 00:09:07.600 or anything like that. Well, I guess you always have to worry about 118 00:09:07.600 --> 00:09:11.240 security, but less less of who you're giving your you know, all your 119 00:09:11.279 --> 00:09:15.360 questions to which you know right now it's Google for a lot of people, 120 00:09:15.360 --> 00:09:22.039 and it'll be interesting to see that change. Yep, absolutely, So what 121 00:09:22.080 --> 00:09:28.320 else are you working on? So? I joined a maker space at the 122 00:09:28.399 --> 00:09:31.799 end of end of the last year and I've just been having so much fun. 123 00:09:31.879 --> 00:09:39.080 They have a ton of three D printers and laser cutters and a metal 124 00:09:39.120 --> 00:09:43.840 shop and a wood shop and uh so I have a bunch of projects that 125 00:09:43.879 --> 00:09:48.279 I've just like had in the back burner for a while, and one of 126 00:09:48.320 --> 00:09:52.039 them is at Doctivity. I've made I've run out a little team that we 127 00:09:52.120 --> 00:09:58.080 do like cat GPD for for healthcare for physicians. And I wanted a way 128 00:09:58.120 --> 00:10:03.240 to like just have like a button that I could push and like have it 129 00:10:03.320 --> 00:10:05.840 talked back to me. Since they have like the Texas speech, and so 130 00:10:05.879 --> 00:10:09.399 I thought there could be some cool applications where oh, you just pushed a 131 00:10:09.399 --> 00:10:11.720 button and it talks back, and we we kind of have this like internal 132 00:10:13.039 --> 00:10:18.440 Uh that's a little funny. But in in you know Microsoft word back in 133 00:10:18.480 --> 00:10:22.440 the day, these have a little clip clip art you know, you know 134 00:10:22.879 --> 00:10:26.080 paper clip that would show up and they would be like, oh, do 135 00:10:26.080 --> 00:10:28.720 you have any questions, like let's chat. It was like one of the 136 00:10:28.720 --> 00:10:35.320 first like chat bots that was like in an application or like Clippy I think 137 00:10:35.320 --> 00:10:39.240 they called it. And so somebody, somebody at work was like, oh, 138 00:10:39.320 --> 00:10:41.519 we should have you know, Clippy, but for doctors. So it 139 00:10:41.519 --> 00:10:46.879 would be like a stethoscope. So somebody like made this like your kind of 140 00:10:46.919 --> 00:10:50.720 funny clip art looking stethoscope. So I thought, how funny would it be 141 00:10:50.799 --> 00:10:54.120 to have like a real life stethoscope that had like googly eyes the same way 142 00:10:56.840 --> 00:11:00.960 that I could talk to I would give me the responses that. So I 143 00:11:01.039 --> 00:11:05.600 have that underway just for fun, like, well, what are you gonna 144 00:11:05.679 --> 00:11:07.960 name him? You have to give it a good name. Well, the 145 00:11:09.840 --> 00:11:16.759 internal name has been Stepie. Yeah, so I don't know, there's no 146 00:11:16.879 --> 00:11:20.519 real name yet. But either way, like I wanted to now, so 147 00:11:20.600 --> 00:11:22.679 now I wanted to set up where Okay, I don't want to have to 148 00:11:22.960 --> 00:11:28.240 like depend on open AI for all of this. So there's like an open 149 00:11:28.279 --> 00:11:31.240 source whisper. Like whisper itself is what open a uses for, like, 150 00:11:31.679 --> 00:11:37.240 you know, transcribing what you're saying. And so they they published that and 151 00:11:37.279 --> 00:11:39.919 you could download and run it and so like you you could just yourself transcribe 152 00:11:39.919 --> 00:11:45.080 anything. And so I got a little micro controller already, and I got 153 00:11:45.080 --> 00:11:48.320 a you know, a tiny little microphone on it and you just talk to 154 00:11:48.360 --> 00:11:52.519 it and it transcribes, and so step one is done. And now I 155 00:11:52.559 --> 00:11:56.279 wanted to use one of these you know, open models and just like give 156 00:11:56.320 --> 00:12:01.440 back the responses all locally. So I'm to get it onto a board, 157 00:12:01.480 --> 00:12:09.080 which is like hard to do because the inference does take time and computation. 158 00:12:09.519 --> 00:12:15.159 And so what I've done is offloaded that and I stream that to my MacBook 159 00:12:16.440 --> 00:12:22.399 just over an open like TCP connection and sin it's on the same network, 160 00:12:22.480 --> 00:12:26.919 Like I don't have to worry too much because it's just serving local requests. 161 00:12:26.080 --> 00:12:31.720 Uh, and it's proxy there and so like uh, then I run the 162 00:12:31.720 --> 00:12:35.919 inference on the Mac and then stream it back to the device and so then 163 00:12:35.960 --> 00:12:39.879 I basically get like just I'm just streaming wave files at this and it works 164 00:12:39.919 --> 00:12:43.320 great. And so I got you know, the clipping and you push the 165 00:12:43.360 --> 00:12:46.759 button and it like you know, submits your requests, does the infers and 166 00:12:46.919 --> 00:12:50.600 outputs back, and I don't know, it's just a lot of fun. 167 00:12:50.960 --> 00:12:56.360 So Makerspace like that project. And then I have a split flap display that 168 00:12:56.399 --> 00:12:58.919 I've put off for way too long where I want to chain together upon by 169 00:13:00.039 --> 00:13:03.480 show split flaps, which if you're not familiar there like the old school, 170 00:13:03.519 --> 00:13:07.000 like if you're at an airport and the displays would change here, like right, 171 00:13:07.840 --> 00:13:11.080 that's all. I want to set those up on my desk stop so 172 00:13:11.159 --> 00:13:15.080 I could just like say, send a message to it, it would like 173 00:13:15.159 --> 00:13:22.639 start flipping it and right, oh yeah that's old old school stuff right there. 174 00:13:22.600 --> 00:13:26.320 Yeah. Yeah, So I don't know, it's just having a lot 175 00:13:26.320 --> 00:13:35.679 of fun with that nice very cool. How do you working on? So 176 00:13:35.720 --> 00:13:39.759 where do I start? So the big thing that I'm spending most of my 177 00:13:39.799 --> 00:13:43.919 time on is the Ruby Dev Summit. As we record this, it's going 178 00:13:43.000 --> 00:13:52.799 to be next week February thirteenth through sixteenth, and yeah, so the plan 179 00:13:52.080 --> 00:13:58.399 is effectively, I've done twenty one interviews. You were one of the interviews. 180 00:13:58.360 --> 00:14:03.279 But yeah, so putting that up, yeah, I figured you did. 181 00:14:03.960 --> 00:14:07.759 So anyway, the talks will be available for twenty four hours from when 182 00:14:07.759 --> 00:14:13.159 they release, and then if you sign up for one of the subscriptions on 183 00:14:13.200 --> 00:14:16.559 Top end devs, then you get forever access. Incidentally, we have one 184 00:14:16.600 --> 00:14:20.080 person watching, or somebody may go watch the replay on Twitch or something. 185 00:14:22.240 --> 00:14:26.200 Oh we went up to two people, all right, So anyway, it 186 00:14:26.519 --> 00:14:31.480 also gets you early access. So I have six of the twenty one uploaded 187 00:14:31.559 --> 00:14:35.840 right now. My editors get me more as we go, and he'll have 188 00:14:35.120 --> 00:14:41.279 he'll have them all for me, you know, by say Monday, right, 189 00:14:41.360 --> 00:14:43.759 which is one day early access. But if you want to watch them 190 00:14:43.759 --> 00:14:46.279 at your leisure and you don't want to have to worry about that time window, 191 00:14:46.559 --> 00:14:50.399 you can sign up. But if you go to rubydevsummit dot com and 192 00:14:50.480 --> 00:14:54.600 you enter your email address and I'll email you when they come out, Hey, 193 00:14:54.000 --> 00:14:58.600 this talks out, here's the ur I'll go watch it right So anyway, 194 00:14:58.639 --> 00:15:01.000 it'll be really cool. And I talked to a whole bunch of people 195 00:15:01.080 --> 00:15:05.039 like on the Ruby core team, so you know, we got Utasito did 196 00:15:05.320 --> 00:15:15.480 Ruby Wazam. I talked to Soto Matsumoto, no relation to Matt's. Incidentally, 197 00:15:15.559 --> 00:15:22.200 I asked him who does the RBS typing stuff. Talked to Jeremy Evans, 198 00:15:22.960 --> 00:15:26.559 I've talked to, I mean, just all kinds of people. I'm 199 00:15:26.840 --> 00:15:31.080 we talked. I talked to Marc Andre Cornoier last week for Ruby Rogues, 200 00:15:31.879 --> 00:15:35.879 and I emailed him to see if I can get him to do it because 201 00:15:35.919 --> 00:15:41.600 he wrote thin the web Server, so and he's got a whole bunch of 202 00:15:41.639 --> 00:15:46.200 stuff that he's been thinking about and working on anyway, interesting stuff from interesting 203 00:15:46.240 --> 00:15:50.679 folks, and just getting that together kind of raise awareness of the subscription and 204 00:15:50.720 --> 00:15:54.080 then you know, let people know, hey, look I'm putting out these 205 00:15:54.159 --> 00:15:56.480 videos. If you want to learn Ruby stuff or real stuff, you can 206 00:15:56.519 --> 00:16:00.519 get one or both of the video series. And then just getting videos for 207 00:16:00.519 --> 00:16:03.000 the video series done is the other thing that I've been working on, and 208 00:16:04.039 --> 00:16:10.039 for the Rails series in particular, I'm actually showing you how I'm building the 209 00:16:10.720 --> 00:16:15.720 website for Rails Composer, which is the last thing that I'm working on work 210 00:16:15.759 --> 00:16:19.399 wise, besides my client project, which is a whole other thing, so 211 00:16:19.559 --> 00:16:23.120 rails composer. I've talked to a whole bunch of people that have either started 212 00:16:23.360 --> 00:16:30.879 businesses like SaaS businesses or maybe like some of them don't necessarily qualify as a 213 00:16:30.879 --> 00:16:33.440 SaaS business, but you know they have like hey, you pay this, 214 00:16:33.519 --> 00:16:37.840 and you get a license, and you have a subscription to renew your license 215 00:16:37.840 --> 00:16:41.039 and things like that, and then they're selling other software like Dragon Ruby for 216 00:16:41.039 --> 00:16:47.919 example. I talked to a mirror John and right, he's got a thing 217 00:16:47.960 --> 00:16:52.559 where you pay, you pay for your license for dragon Ruby and then you 218 00:16:52.039 --> 00:16:56.960 can go download it right and your license to use it. So when I 219 00:16:57.000 --> 00:17:02.639 was talking to him and I mentioned this idea and started talking through it with 220 00:17:02.679 --> 00:17:04.759 them. And I've talked to a few other people too who are building or 221 00:17:04.759 --> 00:17:07.799 have built SaaS and I was like, well, what I want is I 222 00:17:07.839 --> 00:17:11.759 want to be able to say, hey, look, you know, plug 223 00:17:11.799 --> 00:17:15.279 this in, do some config. Now you've got payment processing right within an 224 00:17:15.279 --> 00:17:19.359 hour or two, plug this in, you know, do some config and 225 00:17:19.400 --> 00:17:23.160 now you've got user management right, and it you know, has something that 226 00:17:23.200 --> 00:17:27.880 works cleanly with device or active off or you know whatever, right, and 227 00:17:27.920 --> 00:17:33.480 so you can set up off. I feel like oth's been handled for rails, 228 00:17:33.519 --> 00:17:36.079 so I don't need to do that. But you know, so any 229 00:17:36.119 --> 00:17:40.160 of those common scenarios that you build into your application, right, maybe I'll 230 00:17:40.160 --> 00:17:44.880 build in a licensed distribution thing, right, so you can license your software 231 00:17:45.000 --> 00:17:48.640 or you know, just different things like that. The inspiration actually came from 232 00:17:48.720 --> 00:17:52.920 Laravell. I don't know if you've looked into Laravel a whole lot, but 233 00:17:52.000 --> 00:17:56.599 larravel dot com. If you go look and you click on their products, 234 00:17:56.200 --> 00:18:00.599 it lists a whole bunch of different things. So one of the other things 235 00:18:00.599 --> 00:18:07.279 I want to put together is so they have Forge, which is essentially you 236 00:18:07.319 --> 00:18:11.519 can deploy your applications to Digital Lotion or linod or whatever. Right, so 237 00:18:11.559 --> 00:18:17.200 you set up the machines and it'll deploy them. And I think it's pretty 238 00:18:17.200 --> 00:18:22.160 similar actually to hatchbox, which is Chris Oliver's solution. But what I want 239 00:18:22.200 --> 00:18:26.000 to do is I want to do it more along the model of camal And 240 00:18:26.079 --> 00:18:30.640 so instead of saying, hey, deploy you know, set up brails on 241 00:18:30.680 --> 00:18:33.319 the server and deplay it there, what I want to do is I want 242 00:18:33.319 --> 00:18:36.960 to say, take this app, containerize it, and then deploy it to 243 00:18:37.079 --> 00:18:41.519 whichever machine in the set of machines that you've told me about that you want 244 00:18:41.559 --> 00:18:44.000 it to go on. And so then what you can do is you can 245 00:18:44.039 --> 00:18:51.359 deploy multiple apps onto the same set of machines and have it load balance and 246 00:18:51.440 --> 00:18:56.440 everything else like you would expect and anyway, just have everything kind of play 247 00:18:56.519 --> 00:18:59.039 nicely together that way. And then if, yeah, if one of your 248 00:18:59.079 --> 00:19:03.039 apps starts taken over resources so that the other ones are starved for resources, 249 00:19:03.200 --> 00:19:04.559 you know, you can migrate them off and just give you a clean way 250 00:19:04.599 --> 00:19:12.519 to migrate them off with Kamal, because ultimately it's just containerized, and so 251 00:19:14.759 --> 00:19:15.880 you know, you kill it over here and start it over here, and 252 00:19:15.880 --> 00:19:19.200 then you tell the load balancers over there now and you're done. And so 253 00:19:19.359 --> 00:19:23.519 it gives you all kinds of flexibility and you can do all kinds of stuff 254 00:19:23.559 --> 00:19:26.039 with it. But the other thing is is essentially what you wind up doing 255 00:19:26.119 --> 00:19:30.680 is giving me an SSH key onto your machine or you know, in some 256 00:19:30.799 --> 00:19:33.599 other way, you know, accessing the machine so I can set it up 257 00:19:33.880 --> 00:19:38.160 with an sshkey so I can deploy to it, and then from there it 258 00:19:38.640 --> 00:19:42.240 just does all the things and so you don't have to go get deep in 259 00:19:42.240 --> 00:19:45.440 the weeds with Kubernetes and stuff. But you know, they have all kinds 260 00:19:45.480 --> 00:19:49.039 of other solutions for different things. They have their own queueing solution. I 261 00:19:49.039 --> 00:19:52.279 don't feel like I need to build that. They have an authentication solution for 262 00:19:52.359 --> 00:19:55.960 Laravel. I don't feel like I need to build that. But there are 263 00:19:56.000 --> 00:20:00.720 some of these other pieces that if I was building a SAT and I've looked 264 00:20:00.720 --> 00:20:03.839 at building SaaS apps for podcasters, it'd be nice to just say, Okay, 265 00:20:03.839 --> 00:20:07.160 look what I want to do is I want to manage the guest workflow. 266 00:20:07.480 --> 00:20:11.440 Right. I don't expect that anybody's going to have a library or rails 267 00:20:11.440 --> 00:20:15.640 engine it's going to do that for me, Right, I have to build 268 00:20:15.680 --> 00:20:21.559 that myself. But managing users, supporting users, managing their subscriptions, collecting 269 00:20:21.599 --> 00:20:23.839 payments. I mean, everybody that builds a SaaS app has to do that, 270 00:20:26.279 --> 00:20:27.920 and so why not just have a quick and easy way to do it. 271 00:20:29.279 --> 00:20:32.559 And then the other thing is is I want to give people more of 272 00:20:32.599 --> 00:20:36.880 a system for building their SaaS apps and not a system technical system, but 273 00:20:37.000 --> 00:20:40.480 like, hey, you need to validate your idea, here's how you do 274 00:20:40.519 --> 00:20:41.880 it, here are the steps you take, here's how that works, right, 275 00:20:42.079 --> 00:20:45.200 and so then what you do is you pull the engine in to schedule 276 00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:52.000 calls with your potential customers, right, and then you just embed the component 277 00:20:52.440 --> 00:20:53.839 you know, on your front page and say, hey, we're launching. 278 00:20:55.640 --> 00:20:57.240 If you fit this criteria, we'd like to talk to you, or you 279 00:20:57.279 --> 00:21:02.000 know, however you do that to attract people in. And then once you've 280 00:21:02.039 --> 00:21:06.000 started validating the idea, then you know, maybe you put up a change 281 00:21:06.039 --> 00:21:10.119 log or early access as part of the user management, right, and so 282 00:21:10.160 --> 00:21:12.440 you can plug in these different systems as you go. You set KPIs for 283 00:21:12.519 --> 00:21:18.200 your your app, and then you get an engine that allows you to and 284 00:21:18.240 --> 00:21:21.920 I don't know if this is a rails engine or if there's a library and 285 00:21:21.960 --> 00:21:25.519 an engine, or you know however that would go together. But then it 286 00:21:25.640 --> 00:21:30.599 collects the metrics for those KPIs so that you can say, hey, I 287 00:21:30.759 --> 00:21:37.559 need to be growing by this many users, or I need to be reaching 288 00:21:37.559 --> 00:21:41.160 out to this many potential users, or you know, what have you Or 289 00:21:41.200 --> 00:21:42.960 if you're marketing, you know, you have a podcast and you're trying to 290 00:21:44.000 --> 00:21:45.680 get people on your mailing list because that seems to be the effective way to 291 00:21:45.720 --> 00:21:49.200 sell it. Right, It's okay, well I need to have so many 292 00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:52.680 people signing up for my email list, right, and having a way to 293 00:21:52.720 --> 00:21:56.119 track that and then display it so that I can go look at my dashboard 294 00:21:56.160 --> 00:21:59.599 every week or every day or every month or however often and I can say, 295 00:21:59.640 --> 00:22:03.880 oh, I need to focus more on you know this angle. And 296 00:22:03.920 --> 00:22:07.480 then also with those KPIs, recognizing I'm not getting enough traffic, how do 297 00:22:07.519 --> 00:22:11.279 I get more traffic? Or I am getting enough traffic but they're not converting. 298 00:22:11.279 --> 00:22:14.200 How do I get to convert? And so just giving people the tools 299 00:22:14.240 --> 00:22:17.519 to grow their SaaS that all live within their Rails app, Right, I 300 00:22:17.559 --> 00:22:22.240 don't have to go sign up for some third party service out there and you 301 00:22:22.279 --> 00:22:25.240 know, have it plug into my thing and then have all my data sent 302 00:22:25.319 --> 00:22:32.200 off to the cloud and then hope that the provider doesn't you know, disappear 303 00:22:32.240 --> 00:22:36.000 on me or whatever. So anyway, that's that's what I'm looking to build. 304 00:22:36.039 --> 00:22:40.039 I feel like Rails is already the awesome one person framework, and I 305 00:22:40.079 --> 00:22:42.200 want to make it the one person SaaS framework where it's just like if I 306 00:22:42.240 --> 00:22:47.559 was going to build a SAS, this solves eighty percent of the common problems 307 00:22:47.920 --> 00:22:49.519 and so I can just be in my zone and genius and know what to 308 00:22:49.519 --> 00:22:55.039 do next to make it grow. Tell me you've looked at bullet train. 309 00:22:55.759 --> 00:23:00.000 I have looked at bullet train. So what are you saying as a differentiator 310 00:23:00.039 --> 00:23:07.759 from bullet train. So bullet train building on it. So the issue with 311 00:23:07.880 --> 00:23:18.640 bullet train that I have is and I haven't actually tried it, but my 312 00:23:18.759 --> 00:23:26.039 understanding is is that you you basically get one template and so you you use 313 00:23:26.119 --> 00:23:29.720 the template in your for your rails app. And what I want to do 314 00:23:29.799 --> 00:23:30.720 is I want it to be more of a plug in model, so you 315 00:23:30.720 --> 00:23:37.759 can pick and choose which pieces you put in. I also don't know if 316 00:23:37.799 --> 00:23:40.920 I want to be opinionated on some of the things that they're opinionated on. 317 00:23:41.039 --> 00:23:47.720 So for example, device, you know, I just I don't. I 318 00:23:47.720 --> 00:23:49.160 don't know if I'm really keen on it. I don't know how their one 319 00:23:49.240 --> 00:23:55.160 click deployees work. Oh it deploys the Kuroku, right, And so that's 320 00:23:55.160 --> 00:23:56.559 another thing, right, I don't know if I want to lock into all 321 00:23:56.599 --> 00:24:03.559 of this stuff. I mean that that's a big piece of it. The 322 00:24:03.599 --> 00:24:11.200 other thing is is that so one of the things is they're using like can 323 00:24:11.279 --> 00:24:18.680 can can for their their roles and permissions and stuff, and I want to 324 00:24:18.680 --> 00:24:22.920 be much more surface to UI on that stuff. Right, So if I 325 00:24:23.039 --> 00:24:26.680 have a non technical co founder who's helping me set some of this stuff up, 326 00:24:27.119 --> 00:24:32.079 I want them to be able to manage permissions and things like that, 327 00:24:32.279 --> 00:24:36.400 right at a more fundamental level. And so, you know, some of 328 00:24:36.440 --> 00:24:41.599 those things as I go in, i'd like I'd like to tackle I mean 329 00:24:41.640 --> 00:24:48.880 some of the stuff like you know, teams, you know, tailwind, 330 00:24:51.440 --> 00:24:56.359 theming. Yeah, a lot of these other things. You know, good 331 00:24:56.400 --> 00:25:03.119 looking form fields you know that are JavaScript in and stuff like that. It 332 00:25:03.160 --> 00:25:08.559 has outgoing web hooks, which probably isn't a bad idea. So yeah, 333 00:25:08.599 --> 00:25:11.519 there are definitely things here, but I want you to be able to just 334 00:25:11.880 --> 00:25:15.759 pull in the pieces you want, not have to use the whole framework. 335 00:25:15.319 --> 00:25:23.519 And I want to make this I don't want you to have to basically code 336 00:25:26.680 --> 00:25:30.240 or customize my stuff. I want you to be able to set it up 337 00:25:30.279 --> 00:25:33.839 and have it do eighty ninety percent of what you need and then if you 338 00:25:33.880 --> 00:25:37.759 really do need to customize that, you can and that should be easy. 339 00:25:37.799 --> 00:25:41.319 But for the most part, it's like, hey, look, you know, 340 00:25:41.839 --> 00:25:45.039 we've already built in three of these features. So we're just going to 341 00:25:45.119 --> 00:25:48.319 grab the plug in for this other thing and integrate it. Yeah, that 342 00:25:48.359 --> 00:25:52.880 makes sense. It sounds like you're getting on the bandwagon of using rails as 343 00:25:53.000 --> 00:25:57.559 much as possibly can and just for Yeah. Yeah. The other one that 344 00:25:57.599 --> 00:26:02.759 I found out there that does this is jump Start, and I haven't I 345 00:26:02.759 --> 00:26:07.000 haven't looked at theirs because there's there's is a paid deal, but I think 346 00:26:07.039 --> 00:26:11.720 it's kind of the same thing. Yeah, I've just jumped Start before. 347 00:26:11.759 --> 00:26:15.960 It's pretty good. Yeah. Does it gets you right up and running and 348 00:26:15.039 --> 00:26:18.240 in no time? Yeah. Yeah. I've heard a few people very plain 349 00:26:18.319 --> 00:26:25.400 about bullet Train. They had some issues making it bending it to their will. 350 00:26:26.759 --> 00:26:30.519 Yeah, it's very opinionated, I will say that, but it is 351 00:26:30.680 --> 00:26:34.960 very featureful. So right, if you're looking if you're looking for all the 352 00:26:36.000 --> 00:26:38.799 things that you would need for a SaaS business, it's like pretty turnkey and 353 00:26:38.839 --> 00:26:42.440 configurable in that way. Yeah. But I feel like, yeah, jump 354 00:26:42.519 --> 00:26:48.799 jump Start, bro. I feel like that was more of like a platform 355 00:26:48.960 --> 00:26:51.599 and then you build on top of it kind of thing. Yeah, rather 356 00:26:51.640 --> 00:26:55.839 than trying to tune the knobs. Yeah, and yeah, what I'm looking 357 00:26:55.880 --> 00:27:00.920 for is a little less use my platform and a little bit more of Hey, 358 00:27:02.279 --> 00:27:07.799 here, here's your toolbox, right, here's I still can't believe that, 359 00:27:08.920 --> 00:27:15.759 yeah, that Reels new does not have an interactive element. What do 360 00:27:15.799 --> 00:27:22.039 you mean so that I mean, there's the Mayo WTF that started to try 361 00:27:22.079 --> 00:27:27.160 and you know, cannibalize all the griefs that people feel are in the Reels 362 00:27:27.240 --> 00:27:33.200 ecosystem. I'm trying trying to focus on like new you know, people new 363 00:27:33.279 --> 00:27:37.920 to the community. And one of the things is, you know, everybody 364 00:27:37.240 --> 00:27:44.519 like at some point has made some kind of configurator to start a new Rails 365 00:27:44.559 --> 00:27:47.920 app. Like there's a way to like have your templates, so you can 366 00:27:47.920 --> 00:27:51.160 have a template that you generate all your new Reels apps off of, which 367 00:27:51.240 --> 00:27:52.799 is nice, right, but then you have to end up having to maintain 368 00:27:52.880 --> 00:27:57.000 the generator and make sure that you know, the template is up to speed 369 00:27:57.079 --> 00:28:03.799 while all the new generator dates. And then so like the whole idea was 370 00:28:03.839 --> 00:28:08.559 okay, well, rails could just like use its existing generator and we'll just 371 00:28:08.599 --> 00:28:12.000 make it, you know, add little UI toggles. So in the command 372 00:28:12.079 --> 00:28:18.400 line you could just have you know, a dash dash interactive and it'll step 373 00:28:18.440 --> 00:28:21.680 you through, you know, walk you through all the steps for do you 374 00:28:21.759 --> 00:28:25.640 want to use like the asset pipeline, right, do you want to use 375 00:28:25.680 --> 00:28:27.880 turbo like hot wire? Yea, And like you know all the things that 376 00:28:27.960 --> 00:28:33.039 all the flags and features that already has that are just unless you do like 377 00:28:33.279 --> 00:28:36.240 you know, reels new dash dash help, Like you have no idea that 378 00:28:36.319 --> 00:28:41.519 they're in there, right, And so just for the rails flags themselves, 379 00:28:41.559 --> 00:28:44.519 not for just for the rails flags, like just start there, right, 380 00:28:44.880 --> 00:28:48.839 yeah, And so somebody built that and they're like, yeah, like we 381 00:28:48.839 --> 00:28:52.599 could do this pretty easy, like and they built it and uh, you 382 00:28:52.640 --> 00:28:56.079 know, shut down pretty quick and that oh we did want to have to 383 00:28:56.119 --> 00:29:00.319 maintain it. Then anytime I knew flag, we also have to you know 384 00:29:00.440 --> 00:29:03.680 change the generator. And you know that's fine, but like that's also true 385 00:29:03.680 --> 00:29:07.319 of all these flags and all this other stuff, like you know, wouldn't 386 00:29:07.359 --> 00:29:11.559 be that much more to maintain. I don't know, Like yeah, for 387 00:29:11.640 --> 00:29:17.720 the number of times as somebody just from scratch makes the rails configurator, I 388 00:29:17.799 --> 00:29:22.480 feel like maybe the benefit weighs all the time wasted doing that. Right. 389 00:29:23.279 --> 00:29:30.079 Well, it's funny because so railscomposer dot com I got from Daniel Keho, 390 00:29:30.680 --> 00:29:36.079 who did rails apps and he built Rails composer, which would ask me totally 391 00:29:37.240 --> 00:29:41.079 yeah, And so you know, I emailed him and asked him if I 392 00:29:41.119 --> 00:29:45.480 could buy it from him, and we worked out a deal and anyway, 393 00:29:45.519 --> 00:29:48.200 it was pretty funny. He's like, yeah, I'm not maintaining it anymore, 394 00:29:48.240 --> 00:29:51.640 so you know, Yeah, anyway, he didn't have any heartburn giving 395 00:29:51.680 --> 00:29:55.119 it up. But anyway, it was just kind of funny because yeah, 396 00:29:56.759 --> 00:30:00.799 I kind of want to do that kind of a thing for yeah, for 397 00:30:00.200 --> 00:30:03.599 SaaS app. So then it could be Rails composed and it would be Okay, 398 00:30:03.640 --> 00:30:07.559 which of these things do you want to pull in? Right? And 399 00:30:07.640 --> 00:30:10.240 yeah, I'd love to put built themes into it, right, So it's 400 00:30:10.640 --> 00:30:14.160 hey, look, you know, we've got a whole bunch of nice looking 401 00:30:14.279 --> 00:30:18.640 view components right that are all all have the right CSS classes and properties and 402 00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:23.759 what have you, And so if you switch themes, it just pulls in 403 00:30:23.799 --> 00:30:32.720 a different set of view components and magic manic. But yeah, I mean 404 00:30:32.759 --> 00:30:34.640 I've got all kinds of ideas of things that could go into that, and 405 00:30:36.680 --> 00:30:40.839 I mean there are a lot of things that you could really provide to people 406 00:30:40.880 --> 00:30:45.599 off of that, But those are the biggies. Those are the big things 407 00:30:45.599 --> 00:30:48.079 that I'm working on. I mean, I volunteer at a bunch of stuff 408 00:30:48.359 --> 00:30:53.279 here locally, but it's not really anything that people who watch or listen to 409 00:30:53.279 --> 00:31:00.160 the podcast are that interested in. So yeah, you know, we both 410 00:31:00.160 --> 00:31:03.920 probably have just like so many ideas, And I feel like the more senior 411 00:31:03.960 --> 00:31:07.400 you get, the more ideas that you just have that just like end up 412 00:31:07.400 --> 00:31:10.799 on a shelf. Yeah, And I feel like there's like there's a missing 413 00:31:10.839 --> 00:31:15.920 opportunity there to just like have like some kind of uh you know, employment 414 00:31:17.000 --> 00:31:22.799 option, just like work on people's side projects. Maybe you know where I 415 00:31:22.799 --> 00:31:26.799 feel like I might get to a point where, like, you know, 416 00:31:26.880 --> 00:31:30.720 I could afford to just like okay, you know, pay somebody to try 417 00:31:30.759 --> 00:31:33.319 out a couple of them, you know, see see how far you can 418 00:31:33.359 --> 00:31:38.119 get. And maybe like that's like an internship opportunity to write maybe just like 419 00:31:38.640 --> 00:31:45.359 and like junior like onboarding like apprenticeship kind of style program that could be made 420 00:31:45.359 --> 00:31:48.359 from this, right, like just trying to chip away at people's side projects, 421 00:31:48.400 --> 00:31:52.440 like because you know, whether or not they do anything, like they're 422 00:31:52.559 --> 00:31:56.200 end up where they are anyway and will continue to be right, Like, 423 00:31:56.440 --> 00:31:59.160 I don't have time to do all these side projects, but I got a 424 00:31:59.160 --> 00:32:04.359 lot to do it. Some of why I wanted to do like Ruby bits 425 00:32:04.359 --> 00:32:07.880 and Rails clips and video series was so that I could work on the side 426 00:32:07.920 --> 00:32:13.839 projects, right, And so yeah, I mean for Rails clips, I 427 00:32:14.240 --> 00:32:17.599 am building Rails Composer, right, So I am building an actual business, 428 00:32:20.000 --> 00:32:22.240 right and then yeah, I intend to show you, Okay, I'm building 429 00:32:22.279 --> 00:32:27.440 in the you know, the user management console that's going to wind up being 430 00:32:27.480 --> 00:32:34.599 for sale on Rails Composer, right. But anyway, it's for me. 431 00:32:34.680 --> 00:32:37.400 It is. It's that I do. I have like eight ideas that I 432 00:32:37.400 --> 00:32:40.839 imminently want to do that I just don't have time for it, all right, 433 00:32:42.279 --> 00:32:45.440 I see, wouldn't it be nice to just have like an apprenticeship program 434 00:32:45.680 --> 00:32:49.319 where you can get a pipeline of people right ready to work on it for 435 00:32:49.440 --> 00:32:53.440 the experience and exposure and to have a product that they could join potentially if 436 00:32:53.440 --> 00:32:57.799 it becomes fruitful. Right, that's true, if it starts paying me, 437 00:32:57.960 --> 00:33:01.160 I can use that to start paying them, right. And so I don't 438 00:33:01.160 --> 00:33:07.720 know, Yeah, I feel like so many now I have a project to 439 00:33:07.799 --> 00:33:15.440 run many of my projects exactly, thanks, I'm It's like so many hours 440 00:33:15.480 --> 00:33:19.559 are wasted on developers, just like making it to do app, right, 441 00:33:19.640 --> 00:33:22.319 Like yeah, instead of a two do app, why not just like join 442 00:33:22.400 --> 00:33:27.759 this like apprenticeship program and like yeah, work on some idea that somebody has 443 00:33:27.839 --> 00:33:30.519 fleshed out that like it's pretty much a to do app, but just like 444 00:33:31.000 --> 00:33:35.880 you know, right, or their own version of it. Right. So, 445 00:33:36.000 --> 00:33:37.559 like one of the things that I want to build is just a guest 446 00:33:37.599 --> 00:33:43.519 workflow manager because I have been cobbling things together using zampier for years and it 447 00:33:43.599 --> 00:33:46.720 still breaks all the time, right, And so it'd be nice it was 448 00:33:46.839 --> 00:33:51.200 just okay, it does all the things right. Sure, it integrates with 449 00:33:51.279 --> 00:33:53.400 Google Calendar and one or two other things in order to do some of its 450 00:33:53.400 --> 00:34:00.920 work, but it doesn't the way I want it, right, Or maybe 451 00:34:00.920 --> 00:34:06.400 I'll do that. Maybe maybe I'll start the apprenticeship program. And so if 452 00:34:06.440 --> 00:34:08.599 you're out there listening and you have projects that you need an apprentice for, 453 00:34:08.840 --> 00:34:12.760 you know, just let me know and I'll get like a nice big list 454 00:34:12.800 --> 00:34:17.360 going. And if you're somebody interested in like learning Ruby and rails and you 455 00:34:17.440 --> 00:34:22.719 want like exposure and experience, like you know, with some tips from a 456 00:34:22.760 --> 00:34:24.559 pro, like you know, reach out to me. You know, I'm 457 00:34:24.559 --> 00:34:28.840 on the Twitter, let me know, and if we get a good enough 458 00:34:29.159 --> 00:34:32.599 bace, you know, maybe hey, maybe something will happen here. I've 459 00:34:32.639 --> 00:34:37.239 got a couple of projects that honestly, if somebody came to me and wanted, 460 00:34:37.920 --> 00:34:39.480 you know, a little bit of coaching every week, I would I 461 00:34:39.480 --> 00:34:43.239 would totally help them if they would help work on those, right, especially 462 00:34:43.280 --> 00:34:45.440 if it would be made right Like, I would just like love to use 463 00:34:45.480 --> 00:34:49.519 it open source wise, you know, like hey, and then it's yours 464 00:34:49.559 --> 00:34:52.800 if you want it, like really, you know, if I need to 465 00:34:52.840 --> 00:34:54.719 make some tweaks to it, I'll do the open source thing and submit a 466 00:34:54.719 --> 00:34:59.440 PR for it, you know, like yeah, I feel like, I 467 00:34:59.480 --> 00:35:01.480 mean, I've looked at some of the open source stuff and I have to 468 00:35:01.480 --> 00:35:07.719 say that this might actually tick people off, but some of these projects I 469 00:35:07.719 --> 00:35:12.360 would I would open source them as like LGPL or something so that hey, 470 00:35:12.360 --> 00:35:14.400 look, if you're going to use it or contribute to it, you have 471 00:35:14.440 --> 00:35:16.719 to contribute back. And I'm the only person that can actually sell it and 472 00:35:16.760 --> 00:35:22.079 make money at it, because if I'm going to invest all the time, 473 00:35:22.159 --> 00:35:23.559 effort and money into it, yeah, I'd like to profit from it. 474 00:35:24.000 --> 00:35:28.079 Yeah, I mean licens thing is important. I think it's often overlooked and 475 00:35:28.480 --> 00:35:32.920 get hubs MIT default. I think maybe uh you know, catches people off 476 00:35:32.960 --> 00:35:37.320 guard when they go and try and do something. I think I think MIT 477 00:35:37.559 --> 00:35:43.159 licensing is great for like the vast majority of open source stuff because it's hey, 478 00:35:43.199 --> 00:35:45.239 look, this is out there to help other developers, and so if 479 00:35:45.239 --> 00:35:51.880 they want to tweak it, tweak it, tweak away. Right. Yeah, 480 00:35:52.039 --> 00:35:55.199 But for some of the other business stuff, yeah, I don't know. 481 00:35:57.360 --> 00:36:00.719 Yeah, I know that there was a couple of Ruby projects that just 482 00:36:00.880 --> 00:36:08.159 like completely wipe the get history right because they they changed the license or something 483 00:36:08.199 --> 00:36:13.480 like that. I forget what it was. I don't know. I haven't 484 00:36:13.519 --> 00:36:19.840 heard about that. Oh okay, but one project that is from a local 485 00:36:19.840 --> 00:36:22.639 company here. There's a company here called Instructure and it's a it's a fairly 486 00:36:22.719 --> 00:36:28.400 large rooby shop actually, and they have a product called Canvas and it's the 487 00:36:28.519 --> 00:36:32.159 systems it's used on like college campuses, and I think my kids' schools use 488 00:36:32.199 --> 00:36:36.800 it and stuff. Right. It's kind of funny because you know, they 489 00:36:36.880 --> 00:36:38.280 kind of give me funny looks when I go I know the guys that built 490 00:36:38.320 --> 00:36:45.679 it. But anyway, so yeah, they they started putting it out there, 491 00:36:45.840 --> 00:36:51.639 and the big player in the space was Blackboard. I think it was 492 00:36:51.679 --> 00:36:54.239 Blackboard, and that was what was out there when I was in college, 493 00:36:54.920 --> 00:36:59.239 right to hand out assignments and stuff on the Internet. And they had a 494 00:36:59.239 --> 00:37:02.519 whole bunch of stuff that they had patented processes and things like that, and 495 00:37:02.840 --> 00:37:07.280 they basically came out and at one point publicly stated that they would not sue 496 00:37:08.039 --> 00:37:15.119 other learning systems that used the stuff that they had patented if they were open 497 00:37:15.119 --> 00:37:21.239 source systems. And so what Canvas did is they took advantage of that and 498 00:37:21.280 --> 00:37:24.119 released an open source version of Canvas, so if you wanted to, you 499 00:37:24.119 --> 00:37:28.199 could go stand up your own version of Canvas. And in fact, at 500 00:37:28.239 --> 00:37:31.719 the time I was picking up contracts customizing Canvas for different people, right, 501 00:37:31.840 --> 00:37:36.920 so they'd gotten it installed on their machine and then they had forked it. 502 00:37:37.320 --> 00:37:39.079 But it was LGPL, so you could use it for your own stuff. 503 00:37:39.519 --> 00:37:44.480 But then any changes you made to it also had to be open sourced, 504 00:37:44.880 --> 00:37:49.559 right, because that's GPL and LGPL. No, it was a pharaoh. 505 00:37:49.599 --> 00:37:53.639 GPL was AGPL. But you also couldn't sell it, right, so I 506 00:37:53.679 --> 00:37:58.519 could sell services to help people set it up and things like that, and 507 00:37:58.559 --> 00:38:00.719 they could run it, but I couldn't actually like run a service that says, 508 00:38:00.719 --> 00:38:08.079 hey, you know, have a canvas so and you couldn't close the 509 00:38:08.119 --> 00:38:12.639 source. And so that was the way they got around those patents because then 510 00:38:12.679 --> 00:38:16.960 Blackboard couldn't go after them without giving themselves a black eye. And I think 511 00:38:16.960 --> 00:38:22.079 they eventually ate their lunch and took most of their business. That's another thing. 512 00:38:23.000 --> 00:38:25.800 But yeah, so you know a model like that where it's like, 513 00:38:25.800 --> 00:38:30.400 hey, look, I don't really care if you use my app, but 514 00:38:30.760 --> 00:38:35.320 I don't want you know, I don't want you competing directly with me to 515 00:38:35.599 --> 00:38:39.320 give people access to run my stuff. Right, so all the non programmers 516 00:38:39.400 --> 00:38:43.719 out there who want, you know, a version of the thing that I 517 00:38:43.800 --> 00:38:47.039 built, they have to come to me and pay me in order to have 518 00:38:47.079 --> 00:38:50.719 it, right if they're not going to go set up an open source version 519 00:38:50.760 --> 00:38:57.360 themselves. Oh that makes sense. So anyway, but I don't even know 520 00:38:57.400 --> 00:39:00.000 if I'm gonna get there with some of these projects because I don't have time. 521 00:39:00.320 --> 00:39:06.920 So so we were talking about time management before the show. You know, 522 00:39:06.960 --> 00:39:09.599 well, yeah, are you using anything special for your to manage all 523 00:39:09.599 --> 00:39:14.239 of these ideas that you have right now, I just have this like trello 524 00:39:14.320 --> 00:39:20.800 board that's just like it might as well just be a text file. Yeah, 525 00:39:20.920 --> 00:39:25.239 it just keeps growing. So I used to be better about this and 526 00:39:25.360 --> 00:39:28.639 what I used to do, and I just got out of the habit and 527 00:39:28.639 --> 00:39:30.639 I need to get back into the habit is. I would basically write down 528 00:39:30.760 --> 00:39:34.719 three to five things that I needed to do today and I would just make 529 00:39:34.719 --> 00:39:38.599 sure I got those done and so yeah, and then I do the same 530 00:39:38.599 --> 00:39:43.480 thing for the week, right as I'm like, these big chunks of stuff 531 00:39:43.519 --> 00:39:45.440 have to happen this week, right, and so it's hey, you know, 532 00:39:45.800 --> 00:39:50.559 like I'm an officer for the Utah County Republican Party, right, and 533 00:39:50.559 --> 00:39:52.920 so it's hey, I got to get this stuff done for the party. 534 00:39:52.960 --> 00:39:54.039 I got to get this stuff done for work, I got to get this 535 00:39:54.039 --> 00:39:59.840 stuff done for this other thing, and you know, and so then it's 536 00:40:00.079 --> 00:40:01.320 it's just a hey, I got to get these things done. And so 537 00:40:01.760 --> 00:40:05.280 then I look at the next thing that has to happen for those things, 538 00:40:05.360 --> 00:40:07.400 and I put three or three to five of them on a list. I 539 00:40:07.440 --> 00:40:09.800 get them done, and I usually actually block out time on my calendar. 540 00:40:12.119 --> 00:40:15.880 I haven't been doing that lately, and even then sometimes it's overwhelming because I 541 00:40:15.880 --> 00:40:17.599 don't see how I can fit everything in when I try and put it into 542 00:40:17.639 --> 00:40:23.000 my calendar. So I don't know, I don't know what the answer is, 543 00:40:23.000 --> 00:40:25.760 because I feel like I have more things than I have time still, 544 00:40:27.440 --> 00:40:29.920 and so then I have to start taking things off my list. But it's 545 00:40:29.920 --> 00:40:34.639 all stuff that I feel like has to happen. So yeah, I have 546 00:40:34.679 --> 00:40:38.320 a hard time balancing like the uh, like the work and play time mm 547 00:40:38.360 --> 00:40:44.800 hmmm, because like I have a pretty good schedule for like work. At 548 00:40:44.800 --> 00:40:46.079 the beginning of the day, I just write down the things that, like 549 00:40:46.159 --> 00:40:50.760 you said, you need to get these things done, and then some you 550 00:40:50.800 --> 00:40:53.000 know, extras at the bottom what would nice to have? Yeah, And 551 00:40:53.079 --> 00:40:55.920 then then I have my list and I was looking. I stares at me 552 00:40:55.960 --> 00:41:00.360 all day, and I got to cross the stuff off and so but at 553 00:41:00.360 --> 00:41:01.960 the end of the day, you know, I don't have anything I'm looking 554 00:41:01.960 --> 00:41:07.079 at because I you know, I've got a family and kids and dinner and 555 00:41:07.119 --> 00:41:09.559 all the yeah, stecking up. And then so like then it becomes well, 556 00:41:09.599 --> 00:41:14.119 okay, I found this like hour in the morning every morning that I 557 00:41:14.159 --> 00:41:17.480 could do other stuff. But like it's not really enough time to like write 558 00:41:17.519 --> 00:41:22.119 stuff down and get across to It's like just enough time to like, you 559 00:41:22.159 --> 00:41:27.119 know, read some stuff and like play around, you know, with an 560 00:41:27.159 --> 00:41:32.320 experiment, and you don't really have time to build anything. Yeah, yep. 561 00:41:32.960 --> 00:41:37.039 So Dave Kimura, I asked him how he was, you know, 562 00:41:37.119 --> 00:41:40.639 because he does drifting ruby on top of a full time job. And what 563 00:41:40.719 --> 00:41:45.639 he said was that he worked something out with his wife so that most days 564 00:41:45.679 --> 00:41:50.559 seven pm to ten pm is his time to do drifting ruby and whatever else. 565 00:41:52.000 --> 00:41:54.960 That doesn't work for me. And part of the reason why that doesn't 566 00:41:54.960 --> 00:41:58.679 work for me, I don't know how old your kids are. Maybe I 567 00:41:58.679 --> 00:42:01.679 should ask how old are your kids? Right out? They're eating seen. 568 00:42:02.480 --> 00:42:07.239 Okay, So my lifestyle is a little different. My kids are eighteen, 569 00:42:07.559 --> 00:42:14.840 sixteen, fourteen, twelve, and eight, and so they all have things 570 00:42:14.880 --> 00:42:20.800 that they need to be at and do. And the other piece of the 571 00:42:20.800 --> 00:42:25.239 puzzle is is that my wife works at the charter school. She's the lunch 572 00:42:25.280 --> 00:42:29.519 director over there, and so she's gone all day too, and so if 573 00:42:29.559 --> 00:42:32.800 there's anything that happens that has to get handled, a lot of times it's 574 00:42:32.840 --> 00:42:37.440 me, right or my my daughter just started a job at Subway, and 575 00:42:37.480 --> 00:42:43.760 so she doesn't have a driver's license yet, and so I wind up driving 576 00:42:43.760 --> 00:42:46.559 her to work or picking her up or right. And so there's always something, 577 00:42:47.119 --> 00:42:51.920 always something, And then being involved in the party, you know, 578 00:42:51.960 --> 00:42:54.199 with the political stuff. You know, there'll be a state legislator that wants 579 00:42:54.239 --> 00:42:59.639 to meet for lunch, or there's some thing like what Utah's caucus Night is 580 00:42:59.639 --> 00:43:01.960 coming up in March, right, and so making sure that we have that 581 00:43:02.039 --> 00:43:07.760 altogether so that people who want to express their you know, their opinions on 582 00:43:07.840 --> 00:43:12.119 because we're also doing a presidential preference poll at caucus night, and so we 583 00:43:12.159 --> 00:43:14.920 want to make sure that that comes out fair and square and that we're not 584 00:43:15.000 --> 00:43:19.440 tipping the scales inadvertently in any way or anything like that. And so, 585 00:43:19.679 --> 00:43:22.280 you know, there's always the other stuff that comes up, and so having 586 00:43:22.360 --> 00:43:25.320 a set time that I can do that stuff from seven to ten, it 587 00:43:25.480 --> 00:43:29.960 just you know, in the evening, it's just it's not something that I 588 00:43:29.960 --> 00:43:36.119 can reliably do. And so what I've started doing this week is I've just 589 00:43:36.119 --> 00:43:38.920 started putting in at least an hour on that stuff, and then I'll start 590 00:43:38.920 --> 00:43:42.400 doing the other stuff. So then I'll work on the client stuff or the 591 00:43:42.480 --> 00:43:49.800 party stuff or whatever. But yeah, it's not always enough. Yeah, 592 00:43:49.840 --> 00:43:55.000 I think I just needed to work on optimizing that one hour window. Yeah. 593 00:43:55.239 --> 00:43:58.440 There have been a couple of nights this week where I've gotten like three 594 00:43:58.440 --> 00:44:00.960 hours of sleep because I just stayed up, kept working on stuff. I 595 00:44:01.000 --> 00:44:05.159 mean, I only have two interviews left for the summit, and that's taken 596 00:44:05.239 --> 00:44:07.159 up some time too, So that's one thing that least will kind of fall 597 00:44:07.199 --> 00:44:12.199 off my plate. Yeah, I don't know, I'm thinking more about this 598 00:44:12.239 --> 00:44:16.199 apprenticeship program. You know, I'm loving that idea, the only valid way 599 00:44:16.280 --> 00:44:22.880 to expand my hour window. I think I'm very seriously thinking about whole stale 600 00:44:22.920 --> 00:44:28.599 wholesale stealing your idea and saying, these are the projects I'm working on. 601 00:44:29.679 --> 00:44:31.360 You know, hey, let's collaborate, you know, let's just make a 602 00:44:31.880 --> 00:44:37.840 simple to do app that's you know, Chuck and Valentino's like you know, 603 00:44:37.519 --> 00:44:43.039 wish list, and then hey, sign up, you know, sign up 604 00:44:43.079 --> 00:44:46.880 for the apprenticeship program, pick your projects. Yeah, you know, it 605 00:44:46.960 --> 00:44:51.159 comes with, you know, I don't know, a couple hours a week 606 00:44:51.239 --> 00:44:55.920 of you know, yeah, mentorship one, the mentorship and then like a 607 00:44:57.000 --> 00:45:00.480 review period right where after you know quarter reviews. You know, you go 608 00:45:00.519 --> 00:45:05.280 through and you get a little extra time and get to review the progress, 609 00:45:05.360 --> 00:45:08.480 right, Like, yeah, I'm not interested in having them apprentice on a 610 00:45:08.559 --> 00:45:12.559 to do app. I've got some other ideas also. Well, I don't 611 00:45:12.559 --> 00:45:15.159 mean, I don't mean it to do app. I just mean, you 612 00:45:15.199 --> 00:45:19.039 know, we make just a website that is a to do list. Oh, 613 00:45:19.119 --> 00:45:22.840 I gotcha, that has the projects that are on our list. Yeah 614 00:45:22.960 --> 00:45:25.920 that we want. That makes sense. Yeah, Wesley Curry asked if we're 615 00:45:27.079 --> 00:45:31.559 live. We are live, so Hi to West Virginia. But yeah, 616 00:45:31.719 --> 00:45:37.559 yeah, I kind of like that idea, some kind of project management thing 617 00:45:37.719 --> 00:45:42.000 or something like that. So I'm kind of digging the idea, right, 618 00:45:42.039 --> 00:45:45.119 So then it's yeah, it's Ruby Apprentice something rather. And I would even 619 00:45:45.159 --> 00:45:50.840 be open to experienced people. Right if you're between jobs and you want a 620 00:45:50.840 --> 00:45:52.719 project to work on, and you want me to refer you because you do 621 00:45:52.800 --> 00:45:59.079 good work, sure sounds good to me. Exactly. I got some advanced 622 00:45:59.119 --> 00:46:01.320 projects. I yeah, I like wanted to try, you know, like 623 00:46:02.119 --> 00:46:09.679 I wanted to I wanted to try setting up a a rail's GP I o 624 00:46:09.840 --> 00:46:15.639 JEM where I could hook up real time action cable to a GP I open 625 00:46:16.320 --> 00:46:22.039 on the Raspberry Pie. Yeah, you know, like that could be advanced 626 00:46:22.199 --> 00:46:25.440 and I feel like it could be fun too. You know, that's really 627 00:46:25.519 --> 00:46:29.679 interesting. I've never seen that before. It says it says Wes Wesley Curry 628 00:46:29.760 --> 00:46:32.360 was banned and their comments were removed because we're did you do that? Or 629 00:46:32.480 --> 00:46:37.440 was that you did that? Yeah, he started posting bizarre stuff and I'm 630 00:46:37.480 --> 00:46:46.519 like not interested. Yeah so anyway, oh so so yeah, so yeah, 631 00:46:46.519 --> 00:46:51.320 we should definitely flesh this out some. I don't know that it'll get 632 00:46:51.400 --> 00:46:53.320 traction, but maybe it will. Maybe there are people out there looking for 633 00:46:53.519 --> 00:46:59.559 a project to think to contribute to and to be perfectly honest, the other 634 00:46:59.599 --> 00:47:06.880 thing is like, as I'm working through Rails composer or working through ruby bits 635 00:47:06.920 --> 00:47:10.280 or Rails clips or some of the other videos or you know kind of premium 636 00:47:10.320 --> 00:47:15.320 access things, I'm totally willing to let people in if they're willing to contribute, 637 00:47:15.480 --> 00:47:20.639 right Yeah, And you know, I feel like that's a hard it 638 00:47:20.679 --> 00:47:25.000 could bridge a gap too, right like for open source, where like the 639 00:47:25.039 --> 00:47:30.159 hardest part is finding contributors, right, Like, you have a set of 640 00:47:30.199 --> 00:47:32.480 things that you know need to get done, just you know, you don't 641 00:47:32.480 --> 00:47:36.000 have the time for it, or it's just like right, you know, 642 00:47:36.039 --> 00:47:39.239 you have a backlog of issues. You don't just throw them on the apprenticeship 643 00:47:40.000 --> 00:47:44.079 page, you know. I like that if you're willing to devote a certain 644 00:47:44.079 --> 00:47:49.280 amount of time right to like mentor somebody for so long, just and they'll 645 00:47:49.320 --> 00:47:52.800 get you know, they'll work on this set of issues or whatever it may 646 00:47:52.840 --> 00:47:54.480 be for you. Yeah, I feel like I feel like it could work 647 00:47:54.519 --> 00:47:58.239 out. Yep, all right, And I want to know how you and 648 00:47:58.440 --> 00:48:00.800 him I did. I didn't know you could do that. Oh, they 649 00:48:00.800 --> 00:48:08.920 have a little Hamburger menu on you can put on YouTube. It was on 650 00:48:09.320 --> 00:48:13.960 stream yard. Okay, good deal. Yeah. I think you can do 651 00:48:14.039 --> 00:48:17.719 it with the top end of user too. Okay, just good to see 652 00:48:17.719 --> 00:48:22.480 that. I don't know how to get them out of time out though. 653 00:48:23.800 --> 00:48:27.599 Oh yeah it's right there. Delete comment, put user in time out, 654 00:48:27.760 --> 00:48:36.119 bend user all right. Cool. Yeah, I've I've played with the layouts 655 00:48:36.159 --> 00:48:38.239 of stuff. All right, good deal. Was there anything else do you 656 00:48:38.239 --> 00:48:43.559 want to make sure people know about? Maybe maybe our first mentorship project will 657 00:48:43.559 --> 00:48:49.159 be the mentorship website. Yeah, right, let's put it out there. 658 00:48:49.360 --> 00:48:53.320 If you're interested in building a mentorship website. Yeah, but the thing is 659 00:48:53.320 --> 00:49:00.440 is that I would also be willing to so just as an example, not 660 00:49:00.599 --> 00:49:05.280 just the mentorship thing, but also like, if you're willing to contribute in 661 00:49:05.320 --> 00:49:08.800 a meaningful way on a regular basis to my project, then I am willing 662 00:49:08.840 --> 00:49:12.880 to give you in return. Right, And so there's kind of an informal 663 00:49:12.960 --> 00:49:16.320 or I don't want to say contract, but understanding right that Hey, I'm 664 00:49:16.320 --> 00:49:21.760 going to get an hour a week of your time in exchange for contributing at 665 00:49:21.840 --> 00:49:24.719 least, you know, closing so many issues on a ge hub repo or 666 00:49:27.199 --> 00:49:30.760 you know, if you solve these issues in the repo, then you'll get 667 00:49:30.760 --> 00:49:35.440 two hours of my time, right, and then I'll put more up next 668 00:49:35.480 --> 00:49:38.639 month than you can claim those as well, or you know, but that 669 00:49:38.719 --> 00:49:42.360 way, you can incentivize people with more than that, right, And then 670 00:49:42.559 --> 00:49:45.840 I could go in there and say I have this project, I need these 671 00:49:45.880 --> 00:49:47.960 things done, and if you do it, then you'll get access to my 672 00:49:49.800 --> 00:49:52.840 whatever course or whatever right as part of the deal. And so if people 673 00:49:52.840 --> 00:49:59.360 want to work for their access instead of pay for it, then that's an 674 00:49:59.360 --> 00:50:04.000 option. Yeah, that's pretty cool. Well, I don't know, if 675 00:50:04.000 --> 00:50:06.039 I don't know if I have anything else to add, But I'm kind of 676 00:50:06.039 --> 00:50:09.400 digging this idea. This is kind of floating to the top of our conversation 677 00:50:10.280 --> 00:50:16.639 this way. It wasn't planned. We had not discussed this beforehand. It's 678 00:50:16.679 --> 00:50:22.320 something I've been thinking about a lot. Yeah, but like I just sat 679 00:50:22.360 --> 00:50:24.880 half the time. Yeah, you know, like I throw ideas out on 680 00:50:24.920 --> 00:50:30.800 Twitter all the time, and I'm like, hey, yeah, yeah. 681 00:50:30.880 --> 00:50:37.280 Well. The other thing is is I've put before when I put the summits 682 00:50:37.280 --> 00:50:40.199 together, you basically just had to pay or you couldn't even get to the 683 00:50:40.239 --> 00:50:45.199 videos. And this time I'm putting them up for free for a week or 684 00:50:45.280 --> 00:50:49.760 during a week, I should say, for twenty four hours each And I'd 685 00:50:49.800 --> 00:50:52.920 have people come to me and say, well, I live in you know, 686 00:50:52.000 --> 00:50:55.119 this really small country and I'm poor and I can't afford it. And 687 00:50:55.119 --> 00:51:00.960 I was always not sure how to give it to them, you know, 688 00:51:00.000 --> 00:51:02.639 because it's like, well, I do have people who are actually paying full 689 00:51:02.719 --> 00:51:07.199 freight for this, right, and I don't know that I feel good giving 690 00:51:07.239 --> 00:51:08.559 it away. But I could say, hey, look, you know, 691 00:51:09.400 --> 00:51:13.280 this should take you a couple hours, and if you submit a pull request, 692 00:51:13.280 --> 00:51:19.360 then I merge it. Then I'll give you a ticket future. Yeah, 693 00:51:19.519 --> 00:51:21.559 all right, good deal. Well, I don't I don't know if 694 00:51:21.599 --> 00:51:22.559 I had Like I said, I don't know if I have anything else. 695 00:51:22.559 --> 00:51:25.840 How about you than anything else you wanted to bring up or that you're working 696 00:51:25.840 --> 00:51:30.159 on? No, No, not really. That's it for me too. 697 00:51:30.400 --> 00:51:35.119 It's a you know, I've got to start. I have this blog that 698 00:51:35.159 --> 00:51:42.440 I used to keep track of my you know, my embedded systems discovery, 699 00:51:42.480 --> 00:51:45.599 and I haven't done it in a while. And that's where I'm gonna go 700 00:51:45.639 --> 00:51:50.559 next probably is get finally get some of these projects up and document it because 701 00:51:50.679 --> 00:51:53.599 they're just they're too fun. Yeah, it's worth the story. Yeah, 702 00:51:53.639 --> 00:51:57.320 I love it. All right, Well, let's go ahead and do some 703 00:51:57.360 --> 00:52:00.519 picks and then we'll wrap it up. Why don't you go ahead and go 704 00:52:00.559 --> 00:52:06.519 first. Yeah, So I'm gonna do all ai picks. My first one 705 00:52:06.639 --> 00:52:10.119 is a LAMA. I've been using that a lot O L L A m 706 00:52:10.199 --> 00:52:15.519 A. It's just like a super easy, you know, way to download 707 00:52:15.760 --> 00:52:22.840 open source models and run them locally, super slick. It configures it by 708 00:52:22.880 --> 00:52:25.599 your system, so you get the optimizations of the Mac if you're on one 709 00:52:25.880 --> 00:52:32.280 or you know whatever GPU you may have. It does pretty great and runs 710 00:52:32.280 --> 00:52:37.800 fast convenient. It sets up like a local api for you to to hit 711 00:52:37.880 --> 00:52:40.679 too, so you get like, uh, you know, open Ai style 712 00:52:42.440 --> 00:52:46.480 chat api to complete stuff with using your local models, which is pretty neat. 713 00:52:47.360 --> 00:52:50.679 So I've been playing a lot with that and having a lot of fun 714 00:52:52.239 --> 00:52:57.199 to check that out. And yeah, the other one, I've been playing 715 00:52:57.199 --> 00:53:04.719 with Turbo more and I keep going going back to this hot Rails tutorial and 716 00:53:04.760 --> 00:53:14.440 we've had what's his name, Alexander oh oh Man blanket on his name. 717 00:53:15.199 --> 00:53:20.519 I have it open here rubon yep, Alexander Ruban. We had him on 718 00:53:20.519 --> 00:53:23.079 once and to talk about it and just it's great. It's such a great 719 00:53:23.079 --> 00:53:28.320 reference and it sets you up with like a great looking site that's just all 720 00:53:28.679 --> 00:53:34.360 the NILA's CSS, and it uses like the Beam methodology, which is uh, 721 00:53:34.599 --> 00:53:37.119 you know, some people are saying it's dated, but it's solid and 722 00:53:37.159 --> 00:53:44.920 it works well, super easy to integrate within rails and yeah, it's just 723 00:53:44.960 --> 00:53:50.360 so much fun to play with Turbo and trial the Turbo streams and get stuff 724 00:53:50.400 --> 00:53:54.960 updating live on the page, all of just rails views. It's no JavaScript. 725 00:53:55.920 --> 00:54:00.039 I love it. So I've got a couple of picks here. The 726 00:54:00.039 --> 00:54:02.800 first one is a game called Atiwa. I know I'm saying that wrong. 727 00:54:02.840 --> 00:54:10.679 I'm sure I'm saying that wrong. It is a board game where you basically 728 00:54:10.760 --> 00:54:16.320 are breeding bats. And so what it is is you start with a village 729 00:54:17.039 --> 00:54:21.199 and you can put different things on the village. You can put trees, 730 00:54:21.239 --> 00:54:25.559 you can put families, you can put wild animals, you can put goats 731 00:54:27.239 --> 00:54:30.440 and bats. And what you're trying to do is you're trying to expand your 732 00:54:30.519 --> 00:54:38.440 village and raise more bats. And so when you get a family, they're 733 00:54:38.480 --> 00:54:42.400 untrained. Once you train them, then you can give them a bat to 734 00:54:42.440 --> 00:54:47.320 work with. And then, yeah, it's fairly involved game. It's mostly 735 00:54:47.360 --> 00:54:52.039 a worker placement and then you're managing your own little economy on your own. 736 00:54:53.119 --> 00:54:57.159 It's a little bit more involved game. Board game geek actually waits at a 737 00:54:57.199 --> 00:55:00.360 two point seven to two. So I keep telling people, like the average 738 00:55:01.440 --> 00:55:06.079 gamer, you know, if you're a casual gamer, two is you know, 739 00:55:06.199 --> 00:55:10.639 kind of your sweet spot. If you want something that's mildly challenging to 740 00:55:12.079 --> 00:55:15.559 follow along with, but not so much that you have to really think hard 741 00:55:15.559 --> 00:55:17.760 about it. A Tea is a thinker game. It's it's but it's so 742 00:55:17.920 --> 00:55:25.480 fun. Played it last night with my buddies. We let my my friend 743 00:55:25.519 --> 00:55:31.199 Mike picked the game because today's the first anniversary of when their baby passed away, 744 00:55:31.719 --> 00:55:34.920 and so we're just like, dude, whatever you want. That's what 745 00:55:35.000 --> 00:55:37.719 he wanted to play. But it's a fun game. It's an awesome game. 746 00:55:37.360 --> 00:55:45.320 So I'm gonna pick a tea and let me just get another link here 747 00:55:45.320 --> 00:55:49.400 to Amazon. This is an affiliate link, so I do get, you 748 00:55:49.440 --> 00:55:53.400 know, the three percent or whatever for referring it through them, But anyway, 749 00:55:55.199 --> 00:55:59.679 I really enjoyed it. Another thing that I'm gonna pick. And I've 750 00:55:59.679 --> 00:56:04.320 just been on a kick the last three or four days listening to Toby Keith 751 00:56:04.440 --> 00:56:09.760 music because he passed away three days ago, and I grew up kind of 752 00:56:09.760 --> 00:56:15.719 as a teenager listening to his music, and in college I really got into 753 00:56:15.800 --> 00:56:20.000 his stuff, and so I really enjoyed It's kind of irreverent country rock, 754 00:56:20.400 --> 00:56:24.280 this is the way I kind of describe it. But yeah, he's had 755 00:56:24.320 --> 00:56:30.039 a whole bunch of just terrific songs, and I've really really enjoyed his music 756 00:56:30.079 --> 00:56:37.599 over the years, so you know, yeah, I'll miss him making new 757 00:56:37.800 --> 00:56:43.639 more of it, so anyway, so Toby Keith and then yeah, I 758 00:56:43.639 --> 00:56:47.480 should have pages up for Rails Composers soon to go check that out at Railscomposer 759 00:56:47.519 --> 00:56:54.320 dot com and the Ruby Dev Summit. I think we're two weeks ahead, 760 00:56:54.360 --> 00:56:58.480 so I think this episode will come out after the Summit's already been out for 761 00:56:58.559 --> 00:57:00.719 free. You want a copy, just go. You can still go to 762 00:57:00.840 --> 00:57:06.880 Ruby Dev Summit, enter your email address and then it will take you to 763 00:57:06.920 --> 00:57:10.599 a page where you can sign up for Ruby Clips and or Ruby Bits and 764 00:57:10.719 --> 00:57:14.599 Rails Clips. I get them mixed up all the time, Ruby Bits and 765 00:57:14.880 --> 00:57:17.320 Rails Clips, So you'll get a video a day or video a week for 766 00:57:17.360 --> 00:57:23.719 each series, and you can get it for half off the second video series, 767 00:57:24.119 --> 00:57:29.119 so it's basically twenty nine dollars instead of instead of nineteen for each one. 768 00:57:29.920 --> 00:57:37.159 And so yeah, go check that out. And then yeah, the 769 00:57:37.199 --> 00:57:40.400 other the other one that I'm really getting into these days is Tailwind tailwind AI 770 00:57:40.760 --> 00:57:46.519 or UI in particular. So Tailwind UI is basically you can pay for it 771 00:57:46.519 --> 00:57:52.960 and then you get templates for different components or layouts in with Tailwind. Now 772 00:57:53.159 --> 00:57:59.519 the layouts are all react so that you know you can get a next JS 773 00:57:59.559 --> 00:58:02.920 app, and what I found is that it's not terribly difficult to convert it 774 00:58:02.960 --> 00:58:09.960 from next jas components or react components into rails View components. And so that's 775 00:58:09.960 --> 00:58:13.400 what I've been doing, is I've just been pulling it over. The only 776 00:58:13.440 --> 00:58:17.559 thing that I've run into is that they use the headless library for the animations, 777 00:58:17.639 --> 00:58:21.679 right, so if you click the button and it drops down the menu 778 00:58:21.840 --> 00:58:25.480 things like that, they use Headless. But I haven't found anything in there 779 00:58:25.480 --> 00:58:30.159 that wasn't terribly hard to implement with stimulus, So I've just been putting stimulus 780 00:58:30.159 --> 00:58:32.679 on it, so then if you click it, it does the couple of 781 00:58:32.679 --> 00:58:37.280 transformations and off you go to the races. So anyway, I've been pretty 782 00:58:37.280 --> 00:58:40.639 happy with that. The first couple of rails Clips videos actually cover how I've 783 00:58:40.679 --> 00:58:45.880 handled a couple of those before I get into the nuts and bolts of Okay, 784 00:58:45.880 --> 00:58:47.519 now I'm atting users, now, I'm atting permissions, now I'm atting 785 00:58:47.920 --> 00:58:53.320 at whatever rights sprite. So if you're looking at that and going, well, 786 00:58:53.360 --> 00:58:59.400 I like the idea behind tailwhen UI and I've you know, I've grabbed 787 00:58:59.400 --> 00:59:04.119 some of the components, but I either picked up just the HTML version that 788 00:59:04.159 --> 00:59:08.920 doesn't have the JavaScript to animate it, or I have this React component that 789 00:59:08.960 --> 00:59:13.679 I don't really want to pull React into my app to use. Then yeah, 790 00:59:13.719 --> 00:59:17.440 i'll walk you through how to convert them. So anyway, those are 791 00:59:17.440 --> 00:59:21.239 my picks. But yeah, I'm really digging tailing you. I am not 792 00:59:21.320 --> 00:59:22.760 a fan of trying to figure out how to make it look good on my 793 00:59:22.840 --> 00:59:27.840 own. One other thing that I found, incidentally that I thought was funny 794 00:59:27.880 --> 00:59:32.360 is I think it's the salient layout. If you go to go rails their 795 00:59:32.440 --> 00:59:37.519 main page, it's it's salient, and I'm wondering if they're running next JAS. 796 00:59:37.639 --> 00:59:40.920 I'm wondering if Chris is running next JS there instead of Rails, or 797 00:59:40.960 --> 00:59:45.519 if he converted it. But I've seen a couple of other people running it 798 00:59:45.519 --> 00:59:51.199 to people within the Ruby community who I know generally use Rails, So anyway, 799 00:59:51.440 --> 00:59:57.199 I'm not the only one using it. But yeah, I think that's 800 00:59:57.239 --> 00:59:59.679 all I've got, So we'll go ahead and wrap it up. Thanks for 801 00:59:59.679 --> 01:00:02.880 coming, Valentino. Looking forward to seeing more of your projects. Thanks for 802 01:00:02.960 --> 01:00:07.800 having men. This is great. Yeah, I'm looking forward to apprenticeships, 803 01:00:07.920 --> 01:00:14.719 you know, like, let's do it. Yeah, all right, you 804 01:00:14.760 --> 01:00:20.079 know, the thought bought had the apprenticeship program for so long, you know, 805 01:00:20.360 --> 01:00:23.039 and I think they still have. But it's it's paid, uh you 806 01:00:23.039 --> 01:00:27.039 know, so there may be a little bit difference there. But I feel 807 01:00:27.119 --> 01:00:30.320 like, you know, a pay to play kind of situation. Uh, 808 01:00:30.440 --> 01:00:36.119 you know, I don't know. It's just a way, Honestly, if 809 01:00:36.159 --> 01:00:40.199 I just had a way to just you know, have a list for people 810 01:00:40.239 --> 01:00:45.000 to work on that are also interested in mentorship, like you know, what 811 01:00:45.199 --> 01:00:50.519 a great way, right, I feel like, yeah, some birds. 812 01:00:51.119 --> 01:00:53.280 Yeah, I do have to say, you know, and we're still live, 813 01:00:53.719 --> 01:00:57.960 but I do have to say that. The only other hang up I 814 01:00:58.079 --> 01:01:02.159 have is that technically, unless you sign a contract or something, you own 815 01:01:02.199 --> 01:01:07.159 any code you write, and so we might have to have some kind of 816 01:01:07.199 --> 01:01:12.159 agreement that says you know that. And what I would do is I would 817 01:01:12.199 --> 01:01:15.880 just have the mentor opt into it, right, And so they say I 818 01:01:15.360 --> 01:01:19.599 need my apprentices to opt into this. That says any work that I do 819 01:01:20.280 --> 01:01:27.480 on or related to my project becomes property of myself or my company. And 820 01:01:27.519 --> 01:01:30.719 that way, there's just no hang up. If you have somebody work on 821 01:01:30.760 --> 01:01:34.639 something, it's like, yeah, you know, you're the one that ultimately 822 01:01:34.679 --> 01:01:38.960 has say on how it's licensed, use whatever. But then you can pull 823 01:01:39.280 --> 01:01:45.599 people in on private repos for you know, company owned projects too and not 824 01:01:45.639 --> 01:01:49.519 be worried about Okay, they're going to come back and sue me because they 825 01:01:49.559 --> 01:01:54.119 own ten percent stake now in this code base. Yeah, I mean, 826 01:01:54.320 --> 01:01:58.800 hey, I have projects where I don't mind. Yeah, if it's on 827 01:01:58.920 --> 01:02:06.000 it, well, if it's open, let's start step one. Yeah, 828 01:02:06.039 --> 01:02:09.039 let's start step one. You know, don't projects that don't involve licensing, 829 01:02:09.599 --> 01:02:13.960 right, you know, yeats, let's get that step. We'll get there 830 01:02:14.039 --> 01:02:16.039 when we get there kind of thing, you know. Yeah, And then 831 01:02:16.639 --> 01:02:20.840 here's some projects we want it to be made. You just don't have the 832 01:02:20.880 --> 01:02:22.480 time. Do you want to work on it? And you know, get 833 01:02:22.480 --> 01:02:28.679 some mentorship like I got plenty of those still. Yeah. Well, and 834 01:02:28.760 --> 01:02:32.679 if anybody knows a good attorney that does those kinds of contributor agreements, something 835 01:02:32.840 --> 01:02:37.960 we just put together and then just have on the website that people sign as 836 01:02:38.039 --> 01:02:42.519 part of the deal. Right, And so then it's hey, I need 837 01:02:42.559 --> 01:02:45.039 people to assign this right, and so then it's I agree and wave all 838 01:02:45.119 --> 01:02:49.960 rights to specifically the work on this project. Right. We'll make it very 839 01:02:50.079 --> 01:02:52.840 narrowly focused but yeah, that then people can just get help wherever they want, 840 01:02:53.039 --> 01:02:55.599 and they can open up more opportunities to people on the other end. 841 01:02:57.000 --> 01:03:00.599 And I mean, yeah, you're right. Some of the apprenticeship programs I've 842 01:03:00.599 --> 01:03:05.239 seen them where they yeah, they're paying the apprentices to work on actual apps, 843 01:03:05.719 --> 01:03:07.840 but there just aren't enough of those opportunities for everybody coming out of a 844 01:03:07.880 --> 01:03:13.639 boot camp or making your career change. And it would be terrific to have 845 01:03:13.760 --> 01:03:16.360 people be able to come in and really take advantage of that. And then 846 01:03:16.519 --> 01:03:22.119 after six months working on my project or your project or somebody else's project, 847 01:03:22.679 --> 01:03:25.880 they go out there and they have they have that on their resume. Well, 848 01:03:25.920 --> 01:03:29.239 for the last six months I've been working on this job board, or 849 01:03:29.239 --> 01:03:32.079 the last six months I've been working on this internal app, and you know, 850 01:03:32.320 --> 01:03:36.239 here's my reference, right, And then the reference is somebody in the 851 01:03:36.280 --> 01:03:40.639 community who can say, yeah, they did a great job. Yeah. 852 01:03:40.760 --> 01:03:47.760 I mean you know who is it? A man the Ruby friend program, 853 01:03:47.840 --> 01:03:54.400 right, Uh huh, that's such a great I don't think it was Brian 854 01:03:54.440 --> 01:04:00.599 Hogan. I think it was He's Ruby mentor. I think, oh no, 855 01:04:00.760 --> 01:04:09.159 there was one participated in a while ago. Yeah, he orchestrated the 856 01:04:09.159 --> 01:04:15.880 whole thing himself, just like via email. Oh man, I'm so bad 857 01:04:15.920 --> 01:04:23.119 with names and k yeah Andy krawl yep. And it was great, you 858 01:04:23.159 --> 01:04:27.320 know, like he just are you interested? Yes? Okay, he put 859 01:04:27.480 --> 01:04:30.599 put you on the list, and are you interested in the mentorship? Yes, 860 01:04:30.760 --> 01:04:33.320 put you on the list, and then you know, random sample pair 861 01:04:33.400 --> 01:04:40.079 people up and boom like okay, here go meet, here's some guidelines, 862 01:04:40.920 --> 01:04:45.400 you know, be respectful, like you know, and it worked out that 863 01:04:45.760 --> 01:04:51.119 it's still going, you know, and I feel like that combined with projects 864 01:04:51.119 --> 01:04:57.199 that people have, right, yeah, like you can actually make stuff out 865 01:04:57.199 --> 01:05:00.960 of it, you know, like, well in in a lot of ways, 866 01:05:01.719 --> 01:05:04.400 I know people who are willing to be mentors, but then they're like, 867 01:05:04.480 --> 01:05:09.239 I don't have time, and so this gives them some incentive because it's, 868 01:05:09.679 --> 01:05:12.239 hey, this is ultimately going to save you at least some of the 869 01:05:12.559 --> 01:05:15.440 time back, right, because you don't have to go and do the work. 870 01:05:15.639 --> 01:05:17.599 Yeah you have to review the code and yeah you have to you know, 871 01:05:17.679 --> 01:05:21.840 spend time helping this person learn stuff. But the other end of it 872 01:05:21.880 --> 01:05:27.000 is is that yeah, you know, they spent twelve hours doing something that 873 01:05:27.039 --> 01:05:31.199 would take you two hours, but you you know, net spent an hour 874 01:05:31.280 --> 01:05:38.519 with them, and so you earned an hour back, right, And I 875 01:05:38.519 --> 01:05:41.920 mean to be honest, like, if somebody is interested in getting into open 876 01:05:41.960 --> 01:05:45.280 source, right, like they just haven't found out how Like this is part 877 01:05:45.280 --> 01:05:49.880 of open source, right, like taking a contribution from somebody, reviewing it 878 01:05:50.039 --> 01:05:55.880 and getting emerged in and managing that process Like it's honestly a great way to 879 01:05:56.000 --> 01:05:58.679 like set somebody up for that, right, Like if you have an interest 880 01:05:58.719 --> 01:06:04.760 in open source apprenticeship program mentorship apprenticeship, like it is very similar to open 881 01:06:04.760 --> 01:06:10.480 source, you know, yeah and winning combo, let's let's get it done. 882 01:06:11.039 --> 01:06:15.320 Yeah, well there's no reason why open source projects couldn't submit to this 883 01:06:15.400 --> 01:06:20.599 too, right exactly? Yep, all right, good deal. Oh yet 884 01:06:20.639 --> 01:06:24.800 another thing for me to do. But this one sounds pretty rewarding at least, 885 01:06:25.880 --> 01:06:29.519 right at least I mean we got to get you know, all these 886 01:06:29.559 --> 01:06:32.960 newcomers into the you know, into the unity, Like yeah, you know 887 01:06:33.039 --> 01:06:38.199 that that is definitely like still a barrier to entry, is like how do 888 01:06:38.239 --> 01:06:41.519 you get people up to speed and feel uncomfortable talking to people? Right? 889 01:06:41.639 --> 01:06:45.519 Like, you know that that barrier is still there and doesn't have to be 890 01:06:45.559 --> 01:06:47.599 and you shouldn't need to spend money on a conference to get it, you 891 01:06:47.639 --> 01:06:51.719 know. Yeah. Well, the other thing is is that I talked to 892 01:06:51.760 --> 01:06:56.320 some people, and they do a good enough job selling themselves to where they 893 01:06:56.320 --> 01:06:59.920 can go from I've never worked at a company that did any kind of program, 894 01:07:00.000 --> 01:07:03.800 I mean before to get somebody to hire them because they can demonstrate one 895 01:07:03.800 --> 01:07:08.159 way or the other that they're worth taking a chance on. And then there 896 01:07:08.159 --> 01:07:10.480 are a whole bunch of other people that just aren't so lucky, and so 897 01:07:10.559 --> 01:07:15.039 what they wind up doing is effectively they wind up doing this, except you 898 01:07:15.079 --> 01:07:17.639 know, they have their own project, and they don't really have good mentorship, 899 01:07:18.079 --> 01:07:20.719 they don't have a way of building their network, and so they're kind 900 01:07:20.719 --> 01:07:25.079 of just stuck there until they can convince somebody that, hey, look, 901 01:07:25.079 --> 01:07:27.239 this is all the stuff I did on my own, this is stuff I'm 902 01:07:27.280 --> 01:07:30.800 learning on my own, and then get somebody to take a chance on them 903 01:07:30.800 --> 01:07:33.239 once they have a pile of things to shove in their face and say I 904 01:07:33.280 --> 01:07:39.000 can do this stuff. Yeah. Yeah, you know, even like from 905 01:07:39.039 --> 01:07:42.880 somebody that's trying to like change languages, like this doesn't know Ruby but wants 906 01:07:42.920 --> 01:07:45.400 to know Ruby, Like yeah, I feel like This is another great opportunity, 907 01:07:45.440 --> 01:07:49.480 you know, like how do you pick up speed? Right, like 908 01:07:53.840 --> 01:07:59.840 react on so many projects? Right? Yeah, No, I agree with 909 01:07:59.840 --> 01:08:01.760 you. Yeah, we'll have to talk about it offline and see what we 910 01:08:01.800 --> 01:08:05.079 can come up with, and maybe it'd be fun to do another episode about 911 01:08:05.079 --> 01:08:12.639 it once we kind of recap. Yeah yeah, but I'm totally down figuring 912 01:08:12.679 --> 01:08:15.479 out how to make this happen. Let's do it all right, all right, 913 01:08:15.479 --> 01:08:18.720 I'm gonna wrap this up until next time, folks, max out