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Coors Brewing Company, Golden Colorado What's Up part with knocks listeners. 11 00:00:43,359 --> 00:00:47,479 In case you haven't heard, Blueliar Studios just drop their first original podcast, 12 00:00:47,560 --> 00:00:51,399 Golden Goal. The show gives you ten minute episodes all about soccer legends 13 00:00:51,479 --> 00:00:54,840 and the moments that made them. Whether you're just learning about soccer for the 14 00:00:54,840 --> 00:00:59,280 first time or a diehard fan, this podcast is a great listen for everyone. 15 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:02,679 The fine two episodes are live right now, or you can binge the 16 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:06,599 entire season. To learn about your favorite soccer stars, check out Blue Wire's 17 00:01:06,680 --> 00:01:23,239 Golden Goal, available anywhere you listen to podcasts. Hey yo, Hardwood Knox 18 00:01:23,359 --> 00:01:30,560 listeners, I am Dan Favali coming at you at the start of an official 19 00:01:30,920 --> 00:01:34,760 new era of Hardwood Knox. As some of you may have noticed, Adam 20 00:01:34,799 --> 00:01:40,959 Frommel a founding member of Hardwood Knox way way back when we started, and 21 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:42,959 these were only on YouTube, and we're even worse, if you can believe 22 00:01:44,000 --> 00:01:48,879 it, than they are now. He is returning in an official capacity, 23 00:01:49,120 --> 00:01:53,439 so he is now the co host of the Hardwood Knox podcast once again. 24 00:01:53,519 --> 00:01:57,760 Follow him on Twitter, Welcome him back at Frommel zero nine. He works 25 00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:00,200 for Bleach Report. He's an editor. He's also the founder and editor in 26 00:02:00,239 --> 00:02:06,359 chief of NBA Math, which often hosts this podcast or host every single one 27 00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:10,439 of these podcasts. This also means that Andy Bailey will no longer be a 28 00:02:10,439 --> 00:02:15,840 member of Hardwood Knocks. We wish him well. You can still check out 29 00:02:15,879 --> 00:02:21,719 his work at Bleacher Report. We hope anyone who was stumbled across this because 30 00:02:21,759 --> 00:02:24,080 they were members of his jazz following, we hope you stick around. We 31 00:02:24,159 --> 00:02:28,960 do work really hard to pump out content, but we are moving forward. 32 00:02:29,199 --> 00:02:32,159 I'm excited. There'll be more guests. Adam will have some on himself, 33 00:02:32,199 --> 00:02:37,039 I'll have some on myself as we normally do, and these collective pods will 34 00:02:37,039 --> 00:02:40,199 continue to be awesome. Speaking of which, we are going to chugg along 35 00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:46,240 with our decade rankings series and we're up to the New Orleans Pelicans. Before 36 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:49,840 we get started, just to shout out to our sponsor as always for making 37 00:02:49,879 --> 00:02:57,520 this podcast possible, bet Online dot Ag, and most importantly officially publicly welcome 38 00:02:57,560 --> 00:03:00,599 back, Adam. I'm excited and I hope you are excited. Oh it's 39 00:03:00,599 --> 00:03:06,039 good to be back. It's hard to believe how much has transpired since we 40 00:03:06,199 --> 00:03:09,000 first started this thing. I mean it was what was it like six or 41 00:03:09,039 --> 00:03:13,919 seven years ago now that we were we were doing the first episodes and and 42 00:03:14,000 --> 00:03:16,280 like you said, publishing them on YouTube for a hundred people to check out, 43 00:03:16,319 --> 00:03:21,400 and getting excited if if three hundred people did and uh yeah, I 44 00:03:21,439 --> 00:03:24,840 mean it's it's been through multiple states, through multiple jobs, through so much 45 00:03:24,879 --> 00:03:30,520 stuff, but it's I'm excited to to get to rejoin in this capacity and 46 00:03:30,719 --> 00:03:36,759 to continue trying to produce good content here again As I mentioned already, I'm 47 00:03:36,759 --> 00:03:38,639 excited as well, and it's for us. It's nice to reflect from those 48 00:03:38,719 --> 00:03:43,599 days, which probably like twenty sixteen, twenty fifteen, around that point on 49 00:03:43,680 --> 00:03:47,919 YouTube audio quality was way worse. And now here we are twenty twenty, 50 00:03:47,960 --> 00:03:52,719 we're in Bleacher Report, team stream, the podcasts popping up there. You 51 00:03:52,840 --> 00:03:59,280 found it a popular statistical website around NBA data. It's It's been a ride, 52 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:02,319 and I'm excited to continue going with it, and I'm glad to be 53 00:04:02,360 --> 00:04:05,759 sharing it with you. I'm glad you're back, and I'm probably not as 54 00:04:05,759 --> 00:04:10,479 glad to start talking about the best Pelicans players of the decade. This was 55 00:04:10,479 --> 00:04:14,599 a fun one because it allowed us to be creative with who we chose, 56 00:04:14,719 --> 00:04:17,600 and we both said before we recorded that we took this as an opportunity because 57 00:04:17,639 --> 00:04:23,240 so many of the longest tenured players were not the highest impact players. I 58 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:27,240 would say it was an opportunity to just delve into the one season guys and 59 00:04:27,519 --> 00:04:31,439 give them them rankings, and so I took that as flexibility and license throughout 60 00:04:31,439 --> 00:04:35,839 this process. I did the same We've we've talked throughout every one of these 61 00:04:35,920 --> 00:04:41,720 episodes, and we're probably pushing closer to twenty or so in this series at 62 00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:46,360 this point about the airness concept, just how much time a player has spent 63 00:04:46,519 --> 00:04:48,839 on the court for the franchise in question, for the decade in question, 64 00:04:48,879 --> 00:04:54,040 which is twenty ten eleven through the present day. I think this is the 65 00:04:54,120 --> 00:04:58,680 least attention I've I've paid to the Birness factor and any of them, because, 66 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:00,959 like you said, you know, we had so many role players who 67 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:03,759 didn't do much. We'll talk about one of them at the very end, 68 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:08,399 who is third in games played, six ten minutes played, and didn't appear 69 00:05:08,439 --> 00:05:11,519 on a single ballot, either for us or for any of the fan submissions. 70 00:05:11,759 --> 00:05:15,480 There are a couple other members of the top ten and theirness who aren't 71 00:05:15,519 --> 00:05:17,800 really going to receive much love whatsoever, aside from the back end of a 72 00:05:17,839 --> 00:05:24,000 couple fan ballots, because there are so many intriguing one season players, including 73 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:29,040 guys who you might typically think of in higher standing for this franchise like David 74 00:05:29,079 --> 00:05:32,839 West and Chris Paul, who only have one season of eligibility for these particular 75 00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:36,920 rankings just because the end of their ten years happened to coincide with the start 76 00:05:36,959 --> 00:05:41,839 of this decade. So this was a fun one. I enjoyed one. 77 00:05:41,959 --> 00:05:46,519 I enjoyed it. And I think one of the reasons why the Pelicans had 78 00:05:46,560 --> 00:05:49,399 to be tackled in this way is because they traded their franchise superstar basically at 79 00:05:49,399 --> 00:05:54,160 the top of the decade, and so that almost invites turnover thereafter. At 80 00:05:54,199 --> 00:05:59,639 the same time, though, there was this rush to sort of rebuild around 81 00:05:59,639 --> 00:06:01,920 Anthony Davis and become this competitor right away because he was ready right away, 82 00:06:02,000 --> 00:06:06,920 and in doing so, that created more turnover because of how many iterations backfired 83 00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:11,480 or how many moves were were mishandled. And so yeah, there were some 84 00:06:11,480 --> 00:06:13,920 players that stayed on the team, but they either weren't the players they were 85 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:16,120 supposed to be, they wildly underachieved, they battled injuries, and so that 86 00:06:16,160 --> 00:06:20,519 caused them to go look at guys elsewhere, and so it just it was 87 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:25,120 I would I don't want to say it was a turbulent decade, but it 88 00:06:25,240 --> 00:06:30,839 definitely wasn't one necessarily rooted in continuity. Given the quality of the names that 89 00:06:30,879 --> 00:06:35,600 are going to populate these rankings, it's somewhat staggering that the franchise only has 90 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:41,959 three playoff appearances in the last decade and has won just a single playoff series. 91 00:06:42,600 --> 00:06:46,279 Like it's it's difficult to fully wrap your head around that, unless I 92 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:49,920 guess you're a New Orleans fan who has had to live through the mediocrity treadmill. 93 00:06:50,279 --> 00:06:57,399 But Anthony Davis that the last part of the Chris Paul era the beginning 94 00:06:57,399 --> 00:07:03,000 of the Zion Williamson brandon ingram era, it just hasn't resulted in postseason success, 95 00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:08,319 and even this year, as the restart of the season looms, like, 96 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:11,319 we don't know if the Pelicans are going to be a playoff team, 97 00:07:11,959 --> 00:07:14,480 especially since Zion left the bubble. How many games is he gonna end up 98 00:07:14,519 --> 00:07:16,199 missing? I might I probably would have picked them to make the eight seed, 99 00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:19,600 but this is just throws more variants into the equation. Can you briefly 100 00:07:19,680 --> 00:07:24,240 take us through once again how the process works before we get into the number 101 00:07:24,240 --> 00:07:28,240 ten player. As always, we asked you, the fans the listeners, 102 00:07:28,279 --> 00:07:30,680 to submit your top ten ballots for the last decade, and a lot of 103 00:07:30,680 --> 00:07:33,199 you came through for us, so thank you as always for that. We 104 00:07:33,319 --> 00:07:38,079 combined all those into a composite fan ranking, and then that was treated as 105 00:07:38,120 --> 00:07:42,560 one component alongside my votes and Dan's votes, and those were all combined to 106 00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:46,800 form the overall composite rankings, which is what we're basing the order of this 107 00:07:46,839 --> 00:07:50,680 podcast on. So eleven people appeared in the top tens of either the composite 108 00:07:50,680 --> 00:07:55,120 fan vote, my own ballot, or Dan's ballot, and I think we 109 00:07:55,199 --> 00:07:58,639 have to start with number eleven. Even though he just missed the cut here. 110 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:03,360 He appeared eighth on the fans vote. He did not appear on either 111 00:08:03,399 --> 00:08:05,959 my ballot or Dan's ballot, though I would imagine that Dan, like myself, 112 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:11,040 gave serious consideration because his nineteen games have been that stellar And it's Zion 113 00:08:11,079 --> 00:08:18,839 Williamson for me, as exciting as magnetic as his play has been only nineteen 114 00:08:18,839 --> 00:08:24,120 games. You know, it's the same it's the same discussion as the Rookie 115 00:08:24,160 --> 00:08:26,600 of the Year race against John Morant, Like what do you do when the 116 00:08:26,680 --> 00:08:31,240 quality is so high but the sample size is so small, And even though 117 00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:33,799 we gave credence to a number of one season players, there's a difference between 118 00:08:35,159 --> 00:08:39,399 one season of fifty or so games, sixty or so games, even eighty 119 00:08:39,399 --> 00:08:45,200 two games, and nineteen games. Yeah, I mean, I was so 120 00:08:45,360 --> 00:08:48,120 tempted to put him in there, but as you already mentioned at the top, 121 00:08:48,279 --> 00:08:50,919 there were a ton of quality players who their tenures weren't long, but 122 00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:54,759 they were there for an entire season and had more than nineteen appearances under their 123 00:08:54,759 --> 00:08:58,399 belt. For what he means to the franchise and for what he's done on 124 00:08:58,399 --> 00:09:01,720 the court already, I totally understand if he's someone's number ten wherever they want 125 00:09:01,759 --> 00:09:05,320 it. I don't. It'd be ridiculous if you're saying Zion's number five already. 126 00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:07,200 To me, I totally get putting him in there, but I do 127 00:09:07,279 --> 00:09:11,200 think there was enough. Here comes one of the favorite words, optionality, 128 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:15,200 where you probably should have went with with others. I mean, Greg Steizma 129 00:09:15,320 --> 00:09:18,679 has blogged the more minutes in the Pelicans uniformed this decade than Zion Williamson, 130 00:09:18,720 --> 00:09:24,360 and I think that ultimately has to matter. Sorry who Greg Stevesma so name? 131 00:09:24,399 --> 00:09:28,399 I haven't heard in a long time. Zion actually did get a first 132 00:09:28,440 --> 00:09:31,159 place vote from the fans, just so you know, and it didn't seem 133 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:35,039 like it was a troll ballot either, just given that Chris Paul, Anthony 134 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:39,360 Davis, Drew Holiday and Brandon Ingram joined him in the top five on that 135 00:09:39,399 --> 00:09:43,120 ballot and all ten spots seemed to be taken seriously. But I think that 136 00:09:43,120 --> 00:09:46,240 that like goes to show just how much he already means to this fan base 137 00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:50,960 into this franchise. He appeared in every spot except fourth on at least one 138 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:54,279 fan ballot during the wedding process. Yeah, I mean, he was just 139 00:09:54,559 --> 00:10:01,519 he was all over the place. Just you know, he has invigorated the 140 00:10:01,519 --> 00:10:07,120 franchise that was probably struggling to find an identity after Anthony Davis wanted out and 141 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:13,240 they had to trade him away to the Lakers. I think it helps us. 142 00:10:13,279 --> 00:10:16,879 The Pelicans were just obliterating opponents whenever he's on the floor, right, 143 00:10:18,039 --> 00:10:20,279 I mean, there's definitely a case to consider him. I'm not going to 144 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:26,159 begrudge anyone who put him on the ballot, just given how incredible that small 145 00:10:26,200 --> 00:10:31,080 sample has been. Yeah, so didn't make either of ours though, and 146 00:10:31,519 --> 00:10:35,399 that ultimately displaced him from the composite. So who was number ten in the 147 00:10:35,440 --> 00:10:41,720 composite? Number ten was another guy where only one season gets considered, and 148 00:10:41,759 --> 00:10:45,320 that was David West. He was ninth for both you and I. He 149 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:50,039 was tenth for the fans, but we only get to count that one twenty 150 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:54,440 ten eleven season, in which he played just seventy games. He averaged eighteen 151 00:10:54,519 --> 00:10:58,559 point nine point seven point six rebounds at two point three assists. It's unfortunate 152 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:01,960 that we don't get to count those first seven years of his career, which 153 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:05,080 include the only two All Star seasons of his career. But those are the 154 00:11:05,159 --> 00:11:09,159 rules, and you know we made them and we're not going to break them. 155 00:11:09,279 --> 00:11:11,240 No, that's where that's where you deflect. We don't make the rules, 156 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:13,720 we're just trying to follow them. Now, we do make the rules, 157 00:11:13,759 --> 00:11:18,840 we can own those just the rules are bad. Yeah, look, 158 00:11:18,879 --> 00:11:20,600 it was a really good season. And seventh I know these aren't the end 159 00:11:20,639 --> 00:11:22,639 all be all, as we mentioned all the time, but seventh and win 160 00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:28,759 shares despite only playing one season for excuse me, tenth and wind shares for 161 00:11:28,759 --> 00:11:31,120 the decade and so like, that's enough to squeak him into the top ten 162 00:11:31,159 --> 00:11:37,320 and immediately in my opinion. And this was a situation whereas we've already said, 163 00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:39,039 we could reward guys that haven't spent as much time in the uniform because 164 00:11:39,039 --> 00:11:43,000 one they were really good and two they're not really beating out anyone that deserves 165 00:11:43,039 --> 00:11:46,960 it more. I don't think you can be angry that David West makes this 166 00:11:46,039 --> 00:11:50,919 list instead of Zion Williamson or instead of an a Mecca Oka. For like, 167 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:54,480 that's not something that is going to rankle people. David West, though, 168 00:11:54,559 --> 00:11:58,320 just like, did he ever miss along too? I don't. I 169 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:01,159 think he just shot one hundred percent from there for his career, especially not 170 00:12:01,279 --> 00:12:07,120 during this season. Even though even though he didn't make the All Star team 171 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:09,480 like he did in two thousand and eight or two thousand and nine, this 172 00:12:09,639 --> 00:12:15,320 was arguably as well as he played while wearing a New Orleans uniform. I 173 00:12:15,639 --> 00:12:18,240 think it was the best he played on defense, maybe the best he played 174 00:12:18,279 --> 00:12:22,360 on offense, given that mid range game and the passing skills that had continued 175 00:12:22,679 --> 00:12:28,759 to develop. He had more of a handle on operating out of the high 176 00:12:28,759 --> 00:12:33,240 post and hitting teammates in stride rather than trying to force the action. And 177 00:12:33,360 --> 00:12:37,879 as as you mentioned that that long too always seemed to find nylon. He 178 00:12:39,039 --> 00:12:43,120 probably doesn't deserve to be called a star or a superstar during this Age thirty 179 00:12:43,159 --> 00:12:46,840 season, but he was pretty damn good, right, always an underrated passer 180 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:50,960 as you sort of already mentioned, and then just to re emphasize a long 181 00:12:50,039 --> 00:12:54,240 two thing, forty nine percent shooting from sixteen feet out to the three point 182 00:12:54,279 --> 00:12:58,360 line, and that accounted for basically one quarter of his shots. One of 183 00:12:58,399 --> 00:13:01,279 those players where, even though the times were different, it's kind of just 184 00:13:01,360 --> 00:13:05,840 like what happens if you just scooted out a few feet to the three point 185 00:13:05,919 --> 00:13:09,039 line and just took more of those, Because it feels like he could have 186 00:13:09,080 --> 00:13:13,120 been one of the players that that shot well from beyond the art consistently, 187 00:13:13,120 --> 00:13:16,879 and we saw that towards the end of his career in his final three seasons. 188 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:22,320 And look, these accounted for, I'll say, of an incredibly small 189 00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:26,120 share of his shots, but forty two point nine percent from deep in one 190 00:13:26,159 --> 00:13:30,120 season with San Antonio, and then thirty seven point five percent with the Warriors 191 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:33,679 in each season that he spent there. Again, the samples incredibly small. 192 00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:39,600 We're talking about nine of I think twenty five shots twenty three shots, so 193 00:13:39,039 --> 00:13:43,639 those aren't a ton, but it feels like he was someone who always could 194 00:13:43,639 --> 00:13:46,799 have expanded that range, and even looking at some of the more meat and 195 00:13:46,799 --> 00:13:52,000 potato seasons of his career in Indiana as well, I've just still, i 196 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:54,559 don't want to say baffled because I know the game was different then, but 197 00:13:54,600 --> 00:13:58,080 you know, thirteen twenty fourteen would have been that crazy to be like, 198 00:13:58,120 --> 00:14:01,440 hey, David West need to launch one hundred three pointers. I don't think 199 00:14:01,440 --> 00:14:03,480 so, and I would have liked to have seen him do it. At 200 00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:07,799 the same time, though, he was one of those players where I don't 201 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:11,080 have as many qualms with him taking those shots, just because he was such 202 00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:16,840 a consistent threat from those areas. And even if you're sacrificing from a purely 203 00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:22,519 numerical standpoint points per possession by shooting forty six percent or whatever the exact number 204 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:28,399 was from sixteen feet and beyond, forcing defenses to pay attention to those spaces 205 00:14:28,440 --> 00:14:33,039 matters and ups the efficiency of the offense in other areas. I think he 206 00:14:33,159 --> 00:14:37,480 was above the threshold at which I'm comfortable with him taking those shots. Would 207 00:14:37,519 --> 00:14:41,879 it have been nice if he stepped back and started making threes instead of twos, 208 00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:43,600 Sure, but I don't think it was like a detriment to the offense 209 00:14:43,679 --> 00:14:48,480 or anything that he was taking them with such frequency, given his accuracy now 210 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:52,039 when he was still looking at most of his career, particularly in New Orleans, 211 00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:56,799 a power forward who can space the floor out to twenty feet or whatever 212 00:14:56,799 --> 00:15:01,360 it is. That's a floor spacer during it is it is. And speaking 213 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:05,240 of floor spacers, our number nine guy in these rankings is de Marcus Cousins. 214 00:15:05,759 --> 00:15:09,360 So we're actually moving from a seventy games sample to a sixty five game 215 00:15:09,399 --> 00:15:13,639 sample in a Pelicans uniform. But that's just how this episode is going to 216 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:16,360 go. He was seventh in the fan vote. He was eighth for me, 217 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:20,279 he was tenth for you. Yeah, I just felt like he while 218 00:15:20,320 --> 00:15:24,440 he was there. It just he played more games, I believe than David 219 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:28,159 West during this time. Oh no, he actually did not through his like 220 00:15:28,679 --> 00:15:31,159 basically, I guess you would call it one season because he didn't. He 221 00:15:31,159 --> 00:15:33,679 didn't finish his second season because of his injury, and then was traded during 222 00:15:33,799 --> 00:15:39,000 the during the twenty seventeen All Star Game. That was a moment. I'll 223 00:15:39,039 --> 00:15:43,399 always remember that he was an absolute beast before his achilles injury. The season 224 00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:46,000 that he started with the New Orleans Pelicans. Look even the season that he 225 00:15:46,039 --> 00:15:50,960 finished twenty five point two points, five point four assist, twelve point nine 226 00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:54,799 rebounds, one point six steals, one point six blocks, and he's shooting 227 00:15:56,080 --> 00:15:58,279 thirty five point four percent from three on six point one attempts per game that 228 00:15:58,360 --> 00:16:02,799 year and still fifty three percent of his twos. Was someone who could put 229 00:16:02,799 --> 00:16:07,240 the ball on the floor from above the break and take guys off the dribble. 230 00:16:07,519 --> 00:16:11,440 That's just for someone not only a six foot ten inch big man, 231 00:16:11,519 --> 00:16:15,360 but someone who had the heft that he did, just so nimble footed. 232 00:16:15,399 --> 00:16:22,519 One of the most I think skilled and dominant offensive bigs in recent memories, 233 00:16:22,519 --> 00:16:26,879 and definitely one of the more impactful ones in NBA history. The fact that 234 00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:33,320 the Pelicans were still like fighting for their playoff lives at the time when when 235 00:16:33,360 --> 00:16:37,080 he went down, I don't know if that mars this at all. Maybe 236 00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:41,480 the sample size we've we've already talked about the on off splits. They could 237 00:16:41,480 --> 00:16:45,600 get a little wonky with him during that one season, So I understand that 238 00:16:45,639 --> 00:16:51,080 there's a level of complexity to this. But he was just as looking at 239 00:16:51,120 --> 00:16:56,120 an individual level, just so absolutely dominant on offense, and so he was 240 00:16:56,159 --> 00:16:59,519 an easy inclusion for me. But I just thought it almost felt like his 241 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:03,279 tenure in New Orleans ended up not really meaning anything because he didn't he didn't 242 00:17:03,279 --> 00:17:06,519 come back, and he didn't do what he was intended to do, which 243 00:17:06,599 --> 00:17:12,680 was put them over the top. I feel like twenty seventeen eighteen DeMarcus Cousins 244 00:17:12,759 --> 00:17:18,160 was the fully idealized version of Boogie. It was everything he had worked on 245 00:17:18,359 --> 00:17:25,000 throughout his tumultuous time in Sacramento coming together into just this totally dominant force. 246 00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:30,119 I don't think his impact measured up with this comparison, but in terms of 247 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:37,279 the combination of physicality, finesse, overpowering power, and skill, he felt 248 00:17:37,359 --> 00:17:44,920 like the closest thing that we'd seen to Shaquille O'Neill since Shaquie O'Neill, Again 249 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:48,240 not saying that he made a similar impact, but just in terms of like 250 00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:52,880 playing style. In those combination of physical attributes, he was just this overwhelming 251 00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:59,920 force who was so much more than just this physical specimen who could overpower opponent. 252 00:18:00,200 --> 00:18:03,880 He understood how to play the game and how to leverage his skills in 253 00:18:03,920 --> 00:18:07,920 the most useful way possible. And it's just such a shame that that time 254 00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:11,440 was cut short, because it felt like, before those injuries and before he 255 00:18:11,480 --> 00:18:15,960 moved away from the team, that he and David and Anthony Davis were really 256 00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:21,319 starting to figure out how to make their partnership, not just work but excel. 257 00:18:22,079 --> 00:18:25,400 That was such. That was so weird too, because the Pelicans then 258 00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:30,200 go on through the playoffs and sweep the Blazers that season without DeMarcus Cousins, 259 00:18:30,200 --> 00:18:33,160 And so would they have gotten out of that series with him? I would 260 00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:37,359 say probably, because I don't know that their defensive approach to Damian Lillard changes 261 00:18:37,559 --> 00:18:41,839 and then he clearly wasn't ready for that volume of trapping that New Orleans was 262 00:18:41,880 --> 00:18:45,920 throwing at him. Does he help them though in that series at all? 263 00:18:45,960 --> 00:18:48,440 They never would have beaten them, let's be honest, But does he help 264 00:18:48,519 --> 00:18:52,559 them at all in that series? Again? Who they played? Was that 265 00:18:52,559 --> 00:18:56,920 the Warriors? I believe that they played it was So that's just fascinating to 266 00:18:56,960 --> 00:19:00,960 considers. If he's healthy, one, he's probably still there is anthy Davis 267 00:19:00,279 --> 00:19:03,440 still there. That's sort of like this. There are a ton of inflection 268 00:19:03,480 --> 00:19:07,279 points throughout this decade that could have directed Anthony Davis at the door. But 269 00:19:07,319 --> 00:19:11,599 if the Marcus Cousins, if Darcus Cousins one never gets injured and then two 270 00:19:11,640 --> 00:19:17,119 resigns, is Anthy Davis still in New Orleans? He very well could be. 271 00:19:17,839 --> 00:19:21,519 It's so difficult to speculate on that, just because we don't really know 272 00:19:22,039 --> 00:19:26,640 what exactly the motivations were for A. Davis's departure. I'm not sure that 273 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:30,960 we'll really ever get an honest answer to that question until he's been retired for 274 00:19:30,000 --> 00:19:36,279 a while. It's possible, and I think that's the most we can give 275 00:19:36,319 --> 00:19:41,000 there. 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Can you take us to number eight? We are moving 285 00:20:17,039 --> 00:20:21,319 at a snail's pace. We've already spent forever on the bottom two players bottom 286 00:20:21,400 --> 00:20:23,720 three. I think, honestly, I think the bottom portion of these rankings 287 00:20:23,759 --> 00:20:27,240 is the most interesting, especially because the sample size is about to get even 288 00:20:27,400 --> 00:20:33,559 smaller, because we're now talking about Brandon Ingram at number eight, who his 289 00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:37,000 only season with the Pelicans is the one currently in progress in which he's He's 290 00:20:37,039 --> 00:20:42,920 played fifty six games, and the breakout this season has been immensence spectacular and 291 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:47,079 resulted in the first of what should be at least a couple of All Star 292 00:20:47,119 --> 00:20:49,400 appearances during his career. Where you know, he's more comfortable operating off the 293 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:53,039 bounce, He's more comfortable as this all around offensive weapon who can carry a 294 00:20:53,079 --> 00:20:57,759 team. He's also more comfortable operating in conjunction with other primary ball handlers. 295 00:20:59,319 --> 00:21:03,960 It's still only fifty six games. The fans had Ingram up at number six, 296 00:21:03,079 --> 00:21:07,680 which I get because of the recency. You had him at number eight. 297 00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:10,519 I had him down at number ten. I just I wasn't willing to 298 00:21:10,920 --> 00:21:15,680 overlook the sample size quite as much here, just because with Cousins, it 299 00:21:15,759 --> 00:21:21,839 felt like he was so dominant, and it was the result of the previous 300 00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:23,799 near decade that he's spent in the NBA, and it felt so sustainable, 301 00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:27,839 and I'm I'm just not quite sure I'm there yet with Ingram, especially given 302 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:33,119 the current roster composition and how much could change as Zion continues his emergence, 303 00:21:33,119 --> 00:21:38,480 as Lonzo Ball continues his development into a player who unquestionably impacts the winning cause 304 00:21:38,519 --> 00:21:44,720 and other things like that. He one, I've always been a brandon Ingram 305 00:21:45,119 --> 00:21:48,000 stand and somebody that accounts for me putting him a little bit higher. He's 306 00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:49,440 also been really good, which helps, and I echo everything you said. 307 00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:53,279 The Pelicans have even now been posting photos of him hitting it off the dribble 308 00:21:53,359 --> 00:21:56,680 three, and so now that some of his off the dribble twos are going 309 00:21:56,680 --> 00:22:00,640 down, and he just has a more willing uh you know, touch more 310 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:03,519 from beyond the arc, off the catch, if you sprinkling and off the 311 00:22:03,559 --> 00:22:07,920 dribble three, now it becomes like it almost feels like game over. And 312 00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:10,799 they're like, he could do more defensively, I guess if he were stronger, 313 00:22:10,839 --> 00:22:12,480 but he's still kind of a disruptor on that end, and I feel 314 00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:15,839 like he could be. I do get the sense that he's probably better off 315 00:22:15,880 --> 00:22:18,880 in one on one situations, but I also feel like he is smart enough 316 00:22:18,920 --> 00:22:23,799 to be a good team defender as well this year, though, twenty four 317 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:30,319 point three points four point three assists per game with fifty nine true shooting prior 318 00:22:30,359 --> 00:22:33,880 to this year, those are benchmarks that have only been hit by one player 319 00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:37,400 in his age twenty two or younger season. You edited the article I put 320 00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:41,319 this in, so I'm curious as to whether you know who that one player 321 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:45,680 is. I should, given that I just edited this last night. But 322 00:22:45,839 --> 00:22:51,640 twenty four points four assists on fifty nine true shooting. One other player until 323 00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:55,480 this season has done that in his age twenty two season or younger. I 324 00:22:55,519 --> 00:23:00,039 mean, is it Lebron, It's Michael Jordan even better, arguably maybe about 325 00:23:00,039 --> 00:23:06,640 the same. Well, yeah, let's sprinkle a little goat debate using Brandon 326 00:23:06,759 --> 00:23:10,319 ingram as the launch point the springboard for it. I wonder if that's happened 327 00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:14,119 since he moved on from the Lakers. The other thing I wanted to touch 328 00:23:14,119 --> 00:23:17,599 on that you already hit that I think is a really big deal is his 329 00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:21,480 ability to play alongside other players, and his catch and shoot three is a 330 00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:25,319 big part of that. The improvement there, but that's always been a struggle 331 00:23:25,319 --> 00:23:27,039 because he's always been someone who could get to his spots. Just wasn't maybe 332 00:23:27,079 --> 00:23:30,279 the best finisher, and he's hitting. He's just a better shot maker this 333 00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:33,079 year. That's helped his game so much because I think if you watched him, 334 00:23:33,079 --> 00:23:37,599 even if you didn't necessarily like him, it was someone who seemed like 335 00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:40,000 he had a feel for the game just because of how he could get to 336 00:23:40,039 --> 00:23:42,319 his spots with the ball in his hands. Now you've plugged in not just 337 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:48,279 other ball handlers, but someone in Zion Williamson who does He's hit some threes 338 00:23:48,359 --> 00:23:51,720 this year and I'll never forget his first game draining four four that was absolutely 339 00:23:51,759 --> 00:23:55,519 spectacular. But it compromises the spacing and it's another guy who's better off with 340 00:23:55,519 --> 00:23:57,480 the ball in his hands or even as a play finisher, just needs to 341 00:23:57,519 --> 00:24:02,799 operate inside the arc and it's most worked. Brand Ingram's efficiency has dropped in 342 00:24:02,839 --> 00:24:04,799 the minutes that he's played with Zion Williamson, but it hasn't cratered and he 343 00:24:04,839 --> 00:24:10,920 hasn't been making this diminutive impact in those minutes or you haven't seen him look 344 00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:15,720 terrible and moving forward, provided he's just willing to shoot threes off the catch 345 00:24:15,759 --> 00:24:18,759 like Lonzo Ball is now, which is also up the Pelicans. This ends 346 00:24:18,799 --> 00:24:23,319 up being what I think could be a really feckinged partnership. So the level 347 00:24:23,319 --> 00:24:27,000 of improvement that that Ingram is shown this season, I really do truly believe 348 00:24:27,039 --> 00:24:30,720 it's for real, and for the pelicans sake, you better hope it is 349 00:24:30,759 --> 00:24:34,200 because he's getting the MAX when free agency gigs off this offseason. Yeah, 350 00:24:34,240 --> 00:24:38,880 I was gonna say, assuming that he comes back on the MAX deal that 351 00:24:38,920 --> 00:24:42,799 he's inevitably going to get as a restricted free agent, the pieces feel like 352 00:24:42,839 --> 00:24:48,559 they're in place for the Pelicans to become like a dynastic force, assuming developments 353 00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:53,759 go right, which is always a question, assuming health, which is especially 354 00:24:53,799 --> 00:24:59,759 a question when Ingram and Zion Williamson are involved. But these pieces fit together 355 00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:03,960 so well. If Ingram can continue developing as this off the ball weapon who 356 00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:07,920 also thrives on it, If if Zion continues to just wreak havoc whenever he's 357 00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:11,480 on the court, Lonzo Ball is a perfect fit next to those two more 358 00:25:11,519 --> 00:25:15,240 ball dominant forwards. And I'm gonna throw Jackson Hayes in here too, because 359 00:25:15,279 --> 00:25:18,839 even if he hasn't shown that much during his rookie season, what we have 360 00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:23,079 seen has been really impressive and if he can be that like almost DeAndre Jordan 361 00:25:23,319 --> 00:25:30,160 esque force in the middle with a bit more shooting range that fits so perfectly 362 00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:36,559 next to those other incumbents. Where I diverge from you is that I'm probably 363 00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:41,279 not as high yet on the fit of these of these players, just because 364 00:25:41,599 --> 00:25:45,799 we have to see Lonzo Ball on Ingram like probably keep up this efficiency from 365 00:25:45,799 --> 00:25:48,160 deep off the catch for another season. And Lonzo balls always bring good so 366 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:51,960 I'm not saying that they're bad, but because you have Drew Holiday, because 367 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:53,240 you have Zion linked in. And then the other thing where I diverge is, 368 00:25:53,279 --> 00:25:56,680 I don't think Jackson Hayes long term can be on this team for them 369 00:25:56,720 --> 00:26:00,519 to reach their best. It's not He'll probably get better on defense and more't 370 00:26:00,519 --> 00:26:03,359 foul every single person known to man. But if you have, you know, 371 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,480 him and Zion on the court at the same time, you're giving up 372 00:26:07,519 --> 00:26:10,839 a lot of spacing there. And then if Brandon Ingram or a Lonzo Ball 373 00:26:11,319 --> 00:26:15,160 sort of slump off in the shooting department, that becomes an issue. And 374 00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:18,160 like, look, let's just brandon Ingram, Lonzo Ball, Drew Holiday. 375 00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:21,559 Let's all say they're good to above average shooters, but they're not like these 376 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:23,680 lights out shooters, and so if things get a little tight, I would 377 00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:26,799 believe. I'm certainly open to the take though, because when you look at 378 00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:33,720 individually, especially their top four guys Lonzo Brandon, Ingram, Drew Holiday, 379 00:26:33,720 --> 00:26:37,079 and Zion Williamson, that just feels like a core. Looking at all the 380 00:26:37,079 --> 00:26:41,960 talent collectively that can really run rough shot in the West at some point. 381 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:45,920 And you can even argue that the Pelicans already have three top thirty players at 382 00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:51,480 least this season. It all depends on because look Drew and Ingram relative to 383 00:26:51,519 --> 00:26:52,920 the rest of the field top thirty players. In my book, hands down, 384 00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:56,359 Zion is sort of the wild card because he's played in nineteen games, 385 00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:00,599 So so how do you view him? But I'm with you, but there 386 00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:03,079 is still a level of skepticism where I'm fascinated to see what happens the rest 387 00:27:03,119 --> 00:27:07,759 of this year, but also what happens next season. Yeah, I believe 388 00:27:07,799 --> 00:27:11,359 in Lonzo's shooting improvements and that he is going to continue improving there, and 389 00:27:11,480 --> 00:27:15,759 I just I trust Zion's work, ethic and drive to keep improving. It 390 00:27:15,759 --> 00:27:18,799 wouldn't surprise me at all if he was a knockdown three point shooter as soon 391 00:27:18,799 --> 00:27:22,640 as next year. I agree with you there too, and my guest would 392 00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:26,079 be that the top four all work out. I'm just not as high on 393 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:27,880 Jackson Hayes. That just plays with a lot of energy, and maybe in 394 00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:32,640 lineers without Zion you can get more out of him. I just don't think 395 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:36,039 he's going to end up being the long term answer in the starting lineup at 396 00:27:36,039 --> 00:27:38,039 the five. Maybe that'll be Zion, or if it's not him, it 397 00:27:38,039 --> 00:27:41,880 needs to be somebody else. I don't think it's Derrick Favors either, even 398 00:27:41,920 --> 00:27:44,240 though those two have worked well together. There just needs to be more of 399 00:27:44,279 --> 00:27:47,240 an element of floor spacing. I think if you're going to put Zion at 400 00:27:47,279 --> 00:27:49,519 the four, well let's check Bick back in on this in about three years 401 00:27:49,599 --> 00:27:52,960 and move ahead to number seven in our rankings. For the time being, 402 00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:59,519 we are about to switch course dramatically because the first three, really four, 403 00:27:59,559 --> 00:28:03,200 if you lude Zion players that we've talked about, are all these one season 404 00:28:03,279 --> 00:28:08,079 wonders, and now we're shifting to each one more more. Where was he 405 00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:11,960 in the fan ballot? He was Oh, that's right, he was not 406 00:28:11,079 --> 00:28:15,720 there because he was eleventh. He was seventh for me, he was up 407 00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:18,759 at fifth for you. I'm assuming that's in part due to theirness factor fifth 408 00:28:18,759 --> 00:28:22,240 and minutes played, and also just because he's been such an effective specialist as 409 00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:26,119 a three point shooter right and there. When you look at the different iterations 410 00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:30,400 of this team that he's navigated forty point four percent from three during his time 411 00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:33,319 in New Orleans, fifty one point four percent on twos. They've had him 412 00:28:33,359 --> 00:28:37,359 handle the ball at the varying degrees. Doesn't need to do it so much 413 00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:40,799 the past two seasons, but in the previous two there was more of that, 414 00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:44,200 and then there was a time where they needed him to defend wings. 415 00:28:44,359 --> 00:28:48,720 That's also something that hasn't happened so much this year in his role has declined 416 00:28:48,759 --> 00:28:52,319 because they're so deep, and he clearly doesn't factor into their future. But 417 00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:57,000 he's been there and he's been good. That he's a plug in play role 418 00:28:57,039 --> 00:29:00,920 player, and there's a ton of value in that, particularly if they're going 419 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:03,000 to shoot as well as he does from three. When I say he provides 420 00:29:03,000 --> 00:29:07,519 functional shooting, no, you don't want him, you know, firing up 421 00:29:07,799 --> 00:29:11,839 coming around screens or off the dribble. Still, this all matters, and 422 00:29:11,880 --> 00:29:15,599 the Pelicans have needed like stability on the margins. He's provided it. It's 423 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:21,720 because they haven't had that stability at the top that they've sort of floundered so 424 00:29:21,799 --> 00:29:25,240 much during this decade. So I was a little bit surprised, or I 425 00:29:25,279 --> 00:29:26,799 won't say a little bit. I'm very surprised that he finished eleven on the 426 00:29:26,799 --> 00:29:32,200 fan ballot. I even get putting Zion in there, but just the theirness 427 00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:34,680 and the quality role play alone, I thought it would get him there. 428 00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,720 Now. I know the host of the in the No podcast or Blue Wire, 429 00:29:40,039 --> 00:29:44,720 they are not each one More fans Shama Dua, who great analysis and 430 00:29:44,720 --> 00:29:47,680 the Pelicans. I remember talking to him once and he just wasn't a each 431 00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:52,839 one More guy, And so maybe there's maybe there's something there like that I'm 432 00:29:52,839 --> 00:29:56,519 missing, and because it's you know, he's not like a great defender, 433 00:29:56,559 --> 00:30:00,839 but he was also just overstretched in what he he was asked to do, 434 00:30:00,319 --> 00:30:03,599 and so I'm not sure what there would be to just dislike if you were 435 00:30:03,599 --> 00:30:07,279 expecting him to be something he wasn't. Where you think he don't live up 436 00:30:07,319 --> 00:30:08,960 to his contract. I think they got him at four and thirty two. 437 00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:12,799 I don't know if you would call that a steal, and I don't even 438 00:30:12,799 --> 00:30:15,960 know if it can be consensus market value. I would say that it's not 439 00:30:17,079 --> 00:30:21,519 this demonstrative overpay and that he's failed to live up to it. Yeah, 440 00:30:21,559 --> 00:30:26,039 I mean, let's get out of the way right away that this is to 441 00:30:26,119 --> 00:30:30,359 be taken with a grain of salt because basketball references positional determinations are sometimes a 442 00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:33,640 little bit shaky and often just determined by height. But there's value in a 443 00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:37,759 guy who's spent twenty three percent of his minutes with New Orleans at the one, 444 00:30:37,799 --> 00:30:40,680 I'm sixty nine percent of the two and eight percent of the three because 445 00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:44,440 he can fill so many different roles. He's capable of plugging gaps within the 446 00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:48,279 starting lineup. He's capable of taking on a bigger role with those second units 447 00:30:48,279 --> 00:30:51,720 and making sure that you know, these leads aren't going to be squandered when 448 00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:55,680 the bench is asked to play. At the same time, it's it's easy 449 00:30:55,720 --> 00:31:00,119 to forget that he exists just when you're thinking about the last decade of Pelicans. 450 00:31:00,279 --> 00:31:03,200 Well, no, and that's both that's both a compliment and an insult 451 00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:07,759 because his ceiling isn't particularly high. But I think there's also value and being 452 00:31:07,799 --> 00:31:12,519 a forgettable player by not making mistakes. You know, it's not that he's 453 00:31:12,599 --> 00:31:17,720 uninvolved and can be forgotten about, it's that you just don't worry about him 454 00:31:17,759 --> 00:31:19,799 when he's on the court, both as a positive and as a negative. 455 00:31:21,519 --> 00:31:25,319 That was like just a fantastic way of phrasing anything. It's okay to be 456 00:31:25,359 --> 00:31:30,440 a forgettable player when you're forgettable because you didn't stand out for anything incredibly bad. 457 00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:33,079 I like it. Yeah, I mean how many how many times have 458 00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:37,880 we watched players who don't belong on the court at a high level NBA game 459 00:31:37,960 --> 00:31:41,440 and it's like, wow, like you really stand out because you're just functioning 460 00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:45,039 as a turnstyle or because you're just jacking up these two pointers and they are 461 00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:48,920 not hitting anything but iron like, there's there's value into just filling your role 462 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:56,759 seamlessly and not standing out. I'm totally with you. I'm I remain flabbergasted. 463 00:31:56,799 --> 00:31:59,480 Would actually be the proper word here that he was not on the fan 464 00:31:59,519 --> 00:32:07,000 ballot. Yeah, he rose as high as fifth on a couple of ballots, 465 00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:10,279 but for the most part he was left off, Like I can't even 466 00:32:10,279 --> 00:32:14,039 remember at this point. Yes, you did have him fifth, but you 467 00:32:14,079 --> 00:32:17,319 were not alone. I got you in the fan voting. There was a 468 00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:22,480 huge drop off after him, like he was one of the guys who was 469 00:32:22,839 --> 00:32:25,920 at least in the tier that included eleven players. But then there was a 470 00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:31,839 gigantic drop off to Rajon Rondo in twelfth place. Rajon Rondo will not be 471 00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:37,119 appearing in the top ten, but Tyreek Evans will be because he's checking in 472 00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:39,319 at number six. He was number nine for the fans, he was number 473 00:32:39,319 --> 00:32:43,759 six for me, and Dan had him all the way up at number four. 474 00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:49,559 Yeah. Look, there's relative to everyone else who makes this list. 475 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:53,079 The veriness factor helped him fifth in wind shares for the decade with with the 476 00:32:53,119 --> 00:32:58,880 Pelicans. He was also pleasantly seventh in minutes, so that's going to help 477 00:32:58,960 --> 00:33:02,319 him as well. And yeah he was seven seven in minutes. Excuse me, 478 00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:07,079 battled injuries. There another one of the like the remnants of Hey, 479 00:33:07,119 --> 00:33:10,799 they tried to rebuild too quickly around Anthony Davis and expedite that thing, but 480 00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:15,200 before they should have. But his years in New Orleans, you know, 481 00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:19,920 the first two, and he was actually more available than I remember in New 482 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:22,759 Orleans. Eric Gordon's the one that battled a ton of injuries. But in 483 00:33:22,799 --> 00:33:28,799 his two full seasons there fifteen point six points five point nine assists, shot 484 00:33:28,799 --> 00:33:31,119 forty seven point two percent on twos, did not shoot the three ball well. 485 00:33:31,839 --> 00:33:35,480 And then it was also kind of the boomerang because he comes back, 486 00:33:35,559 --> 00:33:39,599 he comes back. In twenty seventeen, he was part of the DeMarcus Cousins 487 00:33:39,599 --> 00:33:42,720 trade, or no, that they trade him that. Oh, and he 488 00:33:42,759 --> 00:33:45,039 was there for full three seasons. I'm sorry, I'm looking at my wrong 489 00:33:45,079 --> 00:33:49,039 note here. So three full seasons, fifteen point five point six assists, 490 00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:52,039 forty seven percent on twos. I think for the as many jumpers as he 491 00:33:52,079 --> 00:33:54,880 took, that's not too shabby. He only played in twenty five games in 492 00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:59,000 twenty fifteen twenty sixteen, and then it was funny that they sent him back 493 00:33:59,079 --> 00:34:02,039 to the to the Sacramento Kings in that DeMarcus Cousin's trade. That's just that's 494 00:34:02,039 --> 00:34:07,119 the footnote doesn't really matter, so that thereness definitely works in his favor. 495 00:34:07,279 --> 00:34:12,159 And I understand that he represents some of their flawed thinking, but he wasn't 496 00:34:12,599 --> 00:34:15,880 like this terrible player with them. If he could have shot the three ball 497 00:34:15,960 --> 00:34:19,079 better, and he did in his final full season three eight point eight percent 498 00:34:19,119 --> 00:34:21,800 from three on fair volume. But if he could have shot the three ball 499 00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:24,440 better, we're talking about someone who, in the lexicon of the entire NBA 500 00:34:24,599 --> 00:34:28,760 just rked a lot higher, but someone who would have been infinitely more useful 501 00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:34,519 to the Pelicans as well. Whenever I watched Tyreek Evans, whether it was 502 00:34:34,559 --> 00:34:37,639 with the Sacramento Kings during that phenomenal rookie season, or with the Pelicans, 503 00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:43,400 or you know, with Memphis or Indiana in his last season, I always 504 00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:47,320 was left with the impression that he should be better at defense than he actually 505 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:51,760 was. And I think that was especially true in New Orleans, where he 506 00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:55,239 was taking on an even bigger offensive role, asked to function as more of 507 00:34:55,239 --> 00:35:00,880 a playmaker with some limited pieces around him, that he almost forgot that he 508 00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:05,639 needed to dedicate some of his attention and energy to the defensive end. And 509 00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:10,039 just given you know, his six six, two hundred and twenty pound frame, 510 00:35:10,159 --> 00:35:13,880 that was you know, he was he was muscular, he was strong, 511 00:35:13,960 --> 00:35:16,639 he was quick both laterally and in a straight line like it felt like 512 00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:22,480 he should have been an impact defender in the backcourt who could switch on to 513 00:35:22,559 --> 00:35:25,840 bigger players, and that he never was. Made him kind of disappointing in 514 00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:30,239 my eyes, and I wonder if that's why I had him a little bit 515 00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:34,440 lower than you here, even if the numbers seemed to indicate that he should 516 00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:37,400 be higher, just like I couldn't get my own bias out of the way 517 00:35:37,440 --> 00:35:39,920 here. I think that's totally fair. It was. I do remember too, 518 00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:44,440 thinking when he was in Sacramento, especially New Orleans, he actually wasn't 519 00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:46,639 bad during that well, he was fantastic overall that one year he spent in 520 00:35:46,679 --> 00:35:51,800 Memphis, but he wasn't bad defensively that that year. But he did seem 521 00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:55,639 like someone who always had the tools to be more on the less glamorous side 522 00:35:55,639 --> 00:36:00,760 of the floor than he ever really was. Speaking of right defenders, though, 523 00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:05,559 let's move on to Chris Paul at number five. This is very much 524 00:36:06,079 --> 00:36:10,360 buoyed by the fan vote that had him at number three and even gave him 525 00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:15,639 four spots in first place. I did have him exactly at number five. 526 00:36:15,679 --> 00:36:19,519 You had him down at number seven, and he is the best example of 527 00:36:19,639 --> 00:36:23,519 the one season star for the Pelicans in this decade. It sucks that we 528 00:36:23,599 --> 00:36:29,320 can't include the first five seasons of his career as fantastic as they were, 529 00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:35,039 because if we were talking about an all time New Orleans franchise rankings, he 530 00:36:35,079 --> 00:36:38,440 would be number one. I don't think you can put Anthony Davis ahead of 531 00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:42,280 him. You can't put Zion ahead of him yet ahead of him though, 532 00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:45,119 and there's a game maybe yeah, maybe maybe even Boogie, But yeah, 533 00:36:45,159 --> 00:36:49,280 I mean we're only looking at the one season before the filed trade to the 534 00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:52,800 Lakers and the subsequent trade to the Clippers. And during that year he played 535 00:36:52,800 --> 00:36:55,639 eighty games, he led the league in steals, he averaged fifteen point nine 536 00:36:55,639 --> 00:37:00,159 points and nine point eight assists. It was not his best season. It 537 00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:04,880 did lead to a playoff appearance and a first round exit for the then New 538 00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:09,159 Orleans Hornets, who lost in six games to the Lakers that season. But 539 00:37:09,760 --> 00:37:13,679 you know, it was tough to put him any higher than this, as 540 00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:16,400 much as he meant to the franchise and as good as he was, because 541 00:37:16,519 --> 00:37:22,599 we had to separate those early years from this one. Yeah, and I 542 00:37:22,199 --> 00:37:25,239 when I looked at his numbers for this season, because he was always going 543 00:37:25,280 --> 00:37:28,320 to kind of fall in the middle for me, I don't have qualms that 544 00:37:28,360 --> 00:37:30,679 he ends up at five at all. Again, this was a ranking of 545 00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:37,159 opportunity when looking at the entire franchise, I am I did not remember that 546 00:37:37,159 --> 00:37:40,840 this was the year he averaged under sixteen points per game, Like Chris Paul 547 00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:45,519 doesn't need to score and necessarily impact the game. But he was also kind 548 00:37:45,559 --> 00:37:47,559 of you know, he has that season two and eight two thousand nine where 549 00:37:47,559 --> 00:37:52,559 he's just he was a monster that year twenty two point eight points and eleven 550 00:37:52,559 --> 00:37:55,800 assists. Always felt like someone who maybe should have probably scored more, where 551 00:37:55,840 --> 00:37:59,320 it's like, you know, hey, Paul, you definitely could have and 552 00:37:59,400 --> 00:38:05,360 probably should have taken like on that iteration of the Pelicans, what fifteen shots 553 00:38:05,360 --> 00:38:07,559 a game? Definitely not eleven point six per game, which where we was 554 00:38:07,599 --> 00:38:10,880 at for that year. Just still, though I know he has a weird 555 00:38:10,920 --> 00:38:15,639 reputation as a teammate, although it seems like things are hitting nicely for him 556 00:38:15,639 --> 00:38:20,960 in Oklahoma City, but he just such a great player, and this year 557 00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:22,760 specifically, he's a case is a top ten guy. Again, there are 558 00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:27,639 a lot of superstars who were injured, so that helped. But he's going 559 00:38:27,639 --> 00:38:30,840 to make an All NBA team, which is just absolutely ridiculous since age thirty 560 00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:34,920 four season and he just still I feel like defends with the same kind of 561 00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:38,480 mentality that he had during his prime, the beginning of which was spent with 562 00:38:38,599 --> 00:38:45,280 the Hornets slash this Pelicans franchise. So I Chris Paul is one of my 563 00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:50,519 favorite players of all time, and even now, just his New Orleans, 564 00:38:50,559 --> 00:38:52,000 just his New Orleans days just so fun to watch, and like, if 565 00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:55,320 you go back and watch those highlights, you know, he's still cooking people 566 00:38:55,360 --> 00:39:04,199 now, but he's just absolutely dismantled deconstructed defenses during his time in New Orleans. 567 00:39:04,239 --> 00:39:07,880 So I have no qualms about him being a higher than I actually put 568 00:39:07,960 --> 00:39:12,320 him. This was one where if you even had players with a larger sample 569 00:39:12,360 --> 00:39:15,440 size that deserve to be here, you could justify putting Chris Paul. You 570 00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:19,320 know, not Ingram, not Boogie, but Chris Paul can basically be ahead 571 00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:22,840 of anybody in this lone season because he's just so damn good. There are 572 00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:27,559 certain players in NBA history where you feel like, if they want to get 573 00:39:27,599 --> 00:39:30,440 to a spot, they're gonna get to it in an advantageous way, and 574 00:39:30,559 --> 00:39:35,559 Chris Paul is near the top of that list. I think Alan Iverson might 575 00:39:35,599 --> 00:39:38,159 be at the absolute top of that list. In my opinion. But like 576 00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:45,880 Paul's ability to work his pet play, you know, that lateral movement alongside 577 00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:49,639 the lane to one of the elbows and then that kind of leaning, kind 578 00:39:49,679 --> 00:39:53,320 of fade away jumper, Like he gets that whenever he wants now, and 579 00:39:53,360 --> 00:40:00,880 he got it whenever he wants back then. Yeah, I just just so 580 00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:05,360 incredibly consistent with his Like he hasn't did he ever have a bad year. 581 00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:08,239 We could talk about availability because he said, but he's never had a bad 582 00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:12,199 year. I mean, you know what they say, like smallest point guards 583 00:40:12,239 --> 00:40:16,719 always age really well. Yeah, definitely him and Kyle is kind of defining. 584 00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:22,280 Yeah. So and look, because Paul's prime basically started right away. 585 00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:24,840 The fact that he's aged so well. I know they've been injuries again, 586 00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:29,400 he might have cost the Rockets a series against the Warriors because the haams Re 587 00:40:29,480 --> 00:40:31,840 injury, but he started out his age twenty season. So the fact that 588 00:40:31,880 --> 00:40:37,679 he's just aged so well despite being the undersized point guard is actually incredibly impressive. 589 00:40:37,679 --> 00:40:40,960 And really, look the shop making, you know, I think you 590 00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:45,280 could it's safe to say he's lost a step on offense where just the you 591 00:40:45,320 --> 00:40:47,519 know, really breaking ankles. It's still possible, but it's just a different 592 00:40:47,599 --> 00:40:52,440 kind of baking of these bigs. When they switch on to him defensively, 593 00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:54,280 I feel like, yes, he's not the same, but he's just it 594 00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:59,639 still feels so exhaustive watching him. And that's just wild to say. This 595 00:40:59,679 --> 00:41:01,760 has nothing to do with his ranking in this exercise, but I feel like 596 00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:04,639 it needs to be noted. The other thing that needs to be noted is 597 00:41:04,639 --> 00:41:07,719 a smart team would actually trade for him. I'm like, his contract is 598 00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:10,760 not great, two years and eighty five point six million left. I think 599 00:41:12,000 --> 00:41:15,440 if I'm a team though, like if Yannis signs the Supermax this year and 600 00:41:15,480 --> 00:41:16,519 I'm the Heat, I'm trying to figure out a way to get Chris Paul. 601 00:41:16,599 --> 00:41:19,519 Or if I'm Utah, I'm trying to figure out a way to get 602 00:41:19,679 --> 00:41:22,679 you know, use Mike Conley as the salary anchor. To get Chris Paul 603 00:41:22,039 --> 00:41:25,079 Milwaukee, you probably have to give up your entire team because of a lack 604 00:41:25,159 --> 00:41:30,840 of salary matching pieces at the level you really need to bring back Chris Paul 605 00:41:30,880 --> 00:41:34,239 salary. I'm trying to get Chris Paul too. He's so good, and 606 00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:37,519 I'm just convinced of you to offer a Jannis for Chris Paul. There anyone 607 00:41:37,599 --> 00:41:40,599 but Jannis or Middleton, But you basically need to trade anyone but Jannis or 608 00:41:40,639 --> 00:41:44,559 Middleton. It's not that stark, but it's pretty bad. I've gone through 609 00:41:44,559 --> 00:41:47,599 the scenarios. I just feel like he's going at least one of the next 610 00:41:47,599 --> 00:41:51,199 two years are going to be all NBA caliber, if not both of them. 611 00:41:51,199 --> 00:41:53,159 I really think that there's a chance for him to do that. I 612 00:41:53,159 --> 00:41:55,840 wouldn't be surprised at all. But before we move on to number four, 613 00:41:55,880 --> 00:42:00,000 since this is already going to be a ridiculously long episode about just the Pelicans, 614 00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:02,760 I have to get all my soapbox for a second here, because I 615 00:42:02,800 --> 00:42:08,559 still I just I hate the narrative that Chris Paul has been bad or unsuccessful 616 00:42:08,599 --> 00:42:15,119 in the playoffs and that that's used to diminish his legacy or all time standing. 617 00:42:15,440 --> 00:42:20,280 Like this one season with the Pelicans is such a perfect microcosm of how 618 00:42:20,920 --> 00:42:23,920 he didn't necessarily have postseason success as a team, but he's sure as hell 619 00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:28,039 did as an individual. If you look at his stats in the series, 620 00:42:28,079 --> 00:42:30,960 the first round series against the Lakers that they lost four to two, he 621 00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:34,960 averaged twenty two points six point seven rebounds, eleven point five assists, and 622 00:42:35,039 --> 00:42:37,440 one point eight steals. He's got fifty four point five percent from the field 623 00:42:37,440 --> 00:42:44,000 and forty seven point four percent from three. He was absolutely spectacular. He 624 00:42:44,119 --> 00:42:50,679 was so fantastic on both ends of the floor. I believe it's been a 625 00:42:50,679 --> 00:42:52,719 while since I've looked at this one up, but I think they outscored the 626 00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:57,280 Lakers by a significant amount with him on the floor. It just wasn't enough 627 00:42:57,320 --> 00:43:00,280 to swing the series. And like that's going to be held against him because 628 00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:01,800 it's a first round loss. Oh no, Chris Paul lost in the playoffs 629 00:43:01,840 --> 00:43:05,840 again, like as soon as you die, Like it's it's not even like 630 00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:10,679 a deep analysis that's needed to kind of refute the idea that he's been bad 631 00:43:10,679 --> 00:43:15,039 in the playoffs. It just requires you to go slightly below the surface level 632 00:43:15,039 --> 00:43:17,880 and not just look at serious results. And this is the perfect example. 633 00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:22,239 Yeah, I just when you look at the contact, some of the Clippers 634 00:43:22,280 --> 00:43:25,800 collapses were just bad. That one against the Rockets. I can't remember what 635 00:43:25,920 --> 00:43:29,559 year was, was that twenty fifteen, whatever it was, that was absolutely 636 00:43:29,599 --> 00:43:32,400 terrible. But here's here's something of anyone who's played in at least one hundred 637 00:43:32,400 --> 00:43:37,960 playoff games. Chris Paul is seventh in winshares for forty eight minutes. Again 638 00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:40,519 not an end all marker, but just for reference, the six players in 639 00:43:40,519 --> 00:43:45,760 front of him number six, Wilt, number five, Jerry West, number 640 00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:50,119 four, Magic Johnson, number three, Kawhi Leonard number two, Lebron James, 641 00:43:50,239 --> 00:43:53,559 number one, Michael Jordan, and just it's a fairly decent list. 642 00:43:53,599 --> 00:43:57,880 It's okay. And look the players behind him are okay, David Robinson eight, 643 00:43:57,960 --> 00:44:00,880 k D nine, Steph ten, Tim eleven. Korea lost me though 644 00:44:00,920 --> 00:44:04,599 because Steph has been bad in the finals. So yeah, he was terrible 645 00:44:04,719 --> 00:44:09,159 during that finals against the Cavin finals, So why is he there? Can 646 00:44:09,239 --> 00:44:12,360 you actually take us too? What are we up to? Number four? 647 00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:16,400 Number four? Somehow only number four and that is Eric Gordon who was number 648 00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:20,639 four for the fans, number four for me and number six for you. 649 00:44:21,440 --> 00:44:24,920 Probably another beneficiary of the Barness factor because he's thirteen minutes played for the decade, 650 00:44:24,920 --> 00:44:29,159 behind only Drew Holiday and Anthony Davis. But he was also good, 651 00:44:29,159 --> 00:44:32,559 even if he didn't really want to be in New Orleans. I just remember 652 00:44:32,599 --> 00:44:37,440 that when he signed the offer sheet with Phoenix and was like, Phoenix is 653 00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:40,280 where I want to be, and it just it seems like Pelicans fans genuinely 654 00:44:40,360 --> 00:44:44,239 did not like him when he left. And look, part of that was 655 00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:49,920 he was so unavailable there. But during his five years in New Orleans at 656 00:44:49,920 --> 00:44:54,880 fall under this decade, fifty five point fifteen point three points per game, 657 00:44:55,239 --> 00:45:00,360 three point three assists, did not shoot really well on two pointers forty three 658 00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:01,960 point nine percent, and part of that is he's never been like the greatest 659 00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:07,920 finisher at the end, but thirty nine percent on threes. So look, 660 00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:12,119 I almost I wanted to put Chris Paul in front of him, but I 661 00:45:12,159 --> 00:45:15,320 had a rule that Chris Paul had an average at least thirteen shot attempts per 662 00:45:15,320 --> 00:45:17,239 game in his long season to use ever him, but he didn't. I 663 00:45:17,480 --> 00:45:21,599 red, that's another fair role, Like we're only making fair roles for these 664 00:45:21,639 --> 00:45:23,920 exercises. I'm actually impressed, though, that he ends up at number four 665 00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:27,679 in the composite, just because I couldn't put him any higher than six, 666 00:45:28,239 --> 00:45:31,320 specifically because it seemed like one there's the you know, relative to other people 667 00:45:31,360 --> 00:45:36,559 on this list. Yes, he was available, but that's because he played 668 00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:39,599 five seasons there. It's not like on average he just wasn't available, and 669 00:45:39,599 --> 00:45:44,599 then it just really seems like he never connected or never wanted to be on 670 00:45:44,639 --> 00:45:46,480 that team, and that the fans didn't like him, and so I couldn't 671 00:45:46,480 --> 00:45:50,039 put him any higher. I even thought six might have been a little too 672 00:45:50,079 --> 00:45:54,400 ambitious. I think it was partially that and also partially that he was disappointing. 673 00:45:57,119 --> 00:46:02,639 He came from Los Angeles, and the expectations were so high because of 674 00:46:02,679 --> 00:46:07,960 what he just accomplished on the Clippers. You know, this was a high 675 00:46:07,039 --> 00:46:13,719 flying guy who could attack the basket and finish well above the rim while also 676 00:46:13,840 --> 00:46:16,000 taking and making a bunch of threes off the bounce. It seemed like he 677 00:46:16,119 --> 00:46:21,519 was the next, like top tier shooting guard who was going to challenge the 678 00:46:21,599 --> 00:46:25,480 Dwayne Wades and Brandon Roys and you name him at the position for supremacy at 679 00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:30,960 the position. And then the knee injuries kind of sapped both his availability and 680 00:46:31,119 --> 00:46:36,280 some of that bounce, and it took him a little bit to adjust to 681 00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:38,559 being more of a role player, but he got there by the end of 682 00:46:38,559 --> 00:46:43,039 his time with New Orleans before he moved on to the Rockets. So even 683 00:46:43,079 --> 00:46:46,320 if the start was disappointing, I think he ended up justifying his place there, 684 00:46:46,679 --> 00:46:50,400 maybe begrudgingly, which is also going to hold it down. But it 685 00:46:50,440 --> 00:46:52,079 didn't. It didn't hold him down in these rankings, which, like you, 686 00:46:52,159 --> 00:46:57,079 I was surprised by. I have nothing to add on Eric Gordon. 687 00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:02,559 Fan to move on Ryan Anderson. Yes, Ryan Anderson was third in the 688 00:47:02,559 --> 00:47:06,360 composite. He was fifth for the Fans. He was third for both of 689 00:47:06,559 --> 00:47:10,119 us. So if you want to take it away, here consistent floor spacer 690 00:47:10,320 --> 00:47:14,039 at the four, thirty seven point one percent shooting while he was in New 691 00:47:14,159 --> 00:47:17,960 Orleans, and he jacked over fourteen hundred threes during his seasons there. I 692 00:47:19,000 --> 00:47:25,480 will say that the game passed him by very quickly, and a lot of 693 00:47:25,480 --> 00:47:30,440 that was because he just he really couldn't move on defense, and he was 694 00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:34,840 never gonna be. He was just never gonna be. You were never gonna 695 00:47:34,840 --> 00:47:37,239 be able to keep him at the four. As the league progressed towards smaller 696 00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:39,159 power forwards, it just became untenable to keep him at the four, and 697 00:47:39,159 --> 00:47:43,400 you weren't going to put him at the five because that would have been a 698 00:47:43,480 --> 00:47:46,440 defensive disaster. So that was kind of sad to see. But he look, 699 00:47:46,480 --> 00:47:49,920 he got paid at the right time, right before he went to Houston. 700 00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:52,440 And the distance on his threes, I know that was really a bigger 701 00:47:52,440 --> 00:47:55,199 thing when he went to Houston, but that helped while he was in New 702 00:47:55,280 --> 00:48:00,960 Orleans as well, and the consistency with which he scored. Did you want 703 00:48:01,039 --> 00:48:05,360 him to do more as a rebounder, I guess maybe, but like you, 704 00:48:05,400 --> 00:48:07,159 look, he was playing with Anthony Davis, like, not all those 705 00:48:07,159 --> 00:48:10,559 boards are going to be available, and so it's a you know over his 706 00:48:12,079 --> 00:48:16,920 role diminished a little bit towards the end of his time there, but he 707 00:48:17,039 --> 00:48:20,960 spent He ended up spending I think it was four seasons there. He had 708 00:48:20,960 --> 00:48:24,159 correct four seasons and sixteen points a game, and hit, like I said, 709 00:48:24,159 --> 00:48:27,920 thirty seven percent of his threees, was forty six point three percent on 710 00:48:28,039 --> 00:48:30,280 two's, and could always do a little bit more inside the arc than given 711 00:48:30,360 --> 00:48:32,880 credit for. But the other thing that made him complicated is just not someone 712 00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:37,320 who was adept at moving the ball, even from stan still positions. You 713 00:48:37,360 --> 00:48:38,800 couldn't even trust him to do that, and I think that factored into why 714 00:48:38,880 --> 00:48:45,800 the game ended up essentially blowing him by Yeah, I think at the beginning 715 00:48:45,840 --> 00:48:52,480 of his time in New Orleans, Ryan Anderson kind of became the NBA's first 716 00:48:52,599 --> 00:48:58,440 like true stretch for you know, that's a label that we can apply retroactively 717 00:48:58,559 --> 00:49:02,719 to guys like Bob McAdoo or Jack Sikma or Bill Lambier, maybe even Larry 718 00:49:02,719 --> 00:49:07,079 Bird, definitely drk Nevitski, but they had more to their game. I 719 00:49:07,119 --> 00:49:13,119 think Anderson was one of the first, maybe the first stretched forest whose value 720 00:49:13,639 --> 00:49:19,920 almost solely stemmed from his ability to provide floor spacing, both from the three 721 00:49:19,960 --> 00:49:24,199 point line and from a couple of feet beyond it. But as the NBA 722 00:49:24,360 --> 00:49:30,599 continued to trend towards that kind of role and having so many players who filled 723 00:49:30,639 --> 00:49:37,199 that role, his inability to do other things meant that he failed to maintain 724 00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:40,039 that same level of impact for very long. So as fantastic as that twenty 725 00:49:40,079 --> 00:49:45,440 thirteen fourteen season was in a small sample, and then twenty fourteen fifteen, 726 00:49:45,480 --> 00:49:47,519 where his shot kind of fell off a little bit, his scoring definitely fell 727 00:49:47,559 --> 00:49:54,280 off it, the amount of time he spent as a star a fringe star 728 00:49:54,440 --> 00:50:00,239 level player was so small that I had trouble even cementing him in this third 729 00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:05,559 spot. I like pretty strongly considered moving Eric Gordon and Chris Paul above him. 730 00:50:05,760 --> 00:50:07,280 They were kind of clumped together in my rankings. I don't know if 731 00:50:07,280 --> 00:50:10,639 any of that rambling made sense. It all made sense, and I'm totally 732 00:50:10,679 --> 00:50:15,360 with you on everything there. So I do wish he would have been able 733 00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:17,119 to stick a little bit longer. But when when you can't do anything on 734 00:50:17,159 --> 00:50:21,960 defense and you can't even be trusted to to really and look when you're so 735 00:50:21,960 --> 00:50:24,000 far away from the basket, which I don't know if people have considered, 736 00:50:24,039 --> 00:50:27,079 but when he was taking three so far away from the basket, like you 737 00:50:27,079 --> 00:50:29,320 can't you don't even have that leverage of well, at least I could put 738 00:50:29,320 --> 00:50:31,039 the ball on the floor and attack closeouts, you know, if you're near 739 00:50:31,079 --> 00:50:36,360 the timeline, like you're not beating he's not beating anybody. So but look, 740 00:50:36,400 --> 00:50:38,760 his time in New Orleans was was great. They were smart to not 741 00:50:38,960 --> 00:50:45,039 resign him when he entered free agency, it turns out, but probably not 742 00:50:45,199 --> 00:50:46,480 in the macro. You don't want to say that he was when you had 743 00:50:46,480 --> 00:50:50,000 Anthony Davis for so much of this decade. You don't want to say that 744 00:50:50,039 --> 00:50:53,519 he ended up being your third best player of the decade. Right right now, 745 00:50:53,679 --> 00:50:57,719 number two, I think it's pretty obvious, and it's Drue Holiday who 746 00:50:57,760 --> 00:51:00,440 was number two across the board, both in the fan ends and both of 747 00:51:00,480 --> 00:51:05,920 ours. You know, he's second in minutes played by a lot, so 748 00:51:06,119 --> 00:51:09,119 Eric Gordon is third at seven one hundred thirty minutes. Drew Holiday as thirteen 749 00:51:09,159 --> 00:51:14,239 thousand, seven hundred eighteen. So the veriness factor clearly supports him. The 750 00:51:14,360 --> 00:51:19,519 level at which he's played through multiple eras of Pelicans slash Hornets basketball is clearly 751 00:51:19,559 --> 00:51:22,760 in his favor. And yet, you know, I think that four games 752 00:51:22,800 --> 00:51:27,559 alone could have boosted him into this number two spot, and that's the twenty 753 00:51:27,599 --> 00:51:32,599 eighteen first round series against the Portland Trailblazers in which he just thoroughly owned Damian 754 00:51:32,639 --> 00:51:36,719 Lillard on both ends of the floor. You know, it felt like he 755 00:51:36,800 --> 00:51:40,280 averaged thirty points per game while holding Lillard to negative points. Like the discrepancy 756 00:51:40,320 --> 00:51:45,039 between the two was that great, and it's hard to make Damian Lillard look 757 00:51:45,079 --> 00:51:51,239 like that, but Holiday did. And again, like those four games alone, 758 00:51:51,280 --> 00:51:54,559 had he not done anything else in the New Orleans uniform, I think 759 00:51:54,559 --> 00:51:59,719 those four alone would have been enough to get him some serious consideration on these 760 00:51:59,719 --> 00:52:05,239 bats. He's just auto at this point and he's still in New Orleans, 761 00:52:05,280 --> 00:52:07,960 so this it works. He's just an auto like twenty point seven assist per 762 00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:13,400 game at this point is basically where he's at. And I've really one of 763 00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:16,000 the things I've respected most about his game is how adaptable he is on offense. 764 00:52:16,119 --> 00:52:20,960 Despite not being the best shooter, He's still able to blur that line 765 00:52:21,039 --> 00:52:28,719 between primary option and creator and then offensive accessory's. He's hitting a lot of 766 00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:31,880 unassisted threes this year. Actually, I think over forty four percent of his 767 00:52:31,920 --> 00:52:35,760 three point attempts are going on assisted, which is actually up from last year, 768 00:52:35,760 --> 00:52:38,280 which doesn't really make sense when you look at how many other ball handlers, 769 00:52:38,280 --> 00:52:40,920 specifically Lonz of ball and brand Ingram that the Pelicans have added, But 770 00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:45,519 that's a testament to what he can he can do. And then defensively, 771 00:52:45,599 --> 00:52:49,519 I know people said that he's dropped off. I eat, that's fine, 772 00:52:49,719 --> 00:52:54,280 but he's shouldering. He shoulders such a heavy workload on defense that I can't 773 00:52:54,320 --> 00:52:59,920 begrudge like a slight decline and he's still at an all defense level this season. 774 00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:04,519 And specifically, the six players he spent the most time guarding include Luca 775 00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:08,480 Lebron, CJ McCollum, Shake Gildest, Alexander, Damian Lillard, and Devin 776 00:53:08,559 --> 00:53:13,159 Booker. I mean, my goodness, so I know, I can't believe 777 00:53:13,199 --> 00:53:16,119 those assignments are so easy. The other thing I found interesting is two way 778 00:53:16,159 --> 00:53:22,239 primary usage, which is a metric developed by Nylon Calculus is Krishna Narsu. 779 00:53:22,800 --> 00:53:25,599 It measures the amount of time a players spends as the number one option on 780 00:53:25,679 --> 00:53:30,320 offense while guarding the other team's number one scorer. This season, Ben Simmons 781 00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:35,159 is the only player in the league with a higher two way workload than Drew 782 00:53:35,199 --> 00:53:39,280 Holiday. That doesn't surprise me. And he's never going to complain about it, 783 00:53:39,599 --> 00:53:43,599 and he's just gonna keep being professional and keep giving it his all on 784 00:53:43,639 --> 00:53:47,199 both ends. And I'm citing this season so much because it's basically a snapshot 785 00:53:47,239 --> 00:53:51,559 of his time in New Orleans. Yes, he's scored less, but it 786 00:53:51,599 --> 00:53:55,880 doesn't matter because he played with rotations that were in flux because he's been there 787 00:53:55,920 --> 00:53:59,599 since I don't know if people remember this, but he's in the New Lands 788 00:53:59,639 --> 00:54:02,639 and the Welt. He's been there since twenty thirteen, so he's had different 789 00:54:02,679 --> 00:54:07,199 roles. But the fact that he's taken on so much more offensively specifically over 790 00:54:07,239 --> 00:54:10,519 the last you know, three years. There was a major jump from him 791 00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:17,440 in from twenty seventeen to twenty eighteen, and he's a borderline All Star in 792 00:54:17,480 --> 00:54:21,360 the Western Conference, even the fact that he's maintained that level when the guard 793 00:54:21,400 --> 00:54:24,679 position is so ridiculously deep across the league at this time. And I still 794 00:54:24,679 --> 00:54:28,719 think though that he's I would call him the top twenty five player right now 795 00:54:28,719 --> 00:54:34,239 fairly easily, and yet I still think he's somehow underappreciated. During this decade, 796 00:54:34,280 --> 00:54:38,079 only four members of the New Orleans Pelicans have made at least one All 797 00:54:38,119 --> 00:54:43,559 Star appearance. Chris Paul during the only season of the decade he's spent in 798 00:54:43,599 --> 00:54:46,480 New Orleans, brandon Ingram during the current season, DeMarcus Cousins in twenty eighteen, 799 00:54:46,519 --> 00:54:50,719 and Anthony Davis has made six All Star teams. I think that we 800 00:54:50,760 --> 00:54:54,760 should just give Drew an honorary All Star appearance because he belongs on that list. 801 00:54:54,840 --> 00:54:59,239 And it's, you know, I feel like so many times I advocate 802 00:54:59,280 --> 00:55:01,880 for expanding all our rosters, and he's yet another example of a guy who's 803 00:55:01,920 --> 00:55:07,039 just gotten screwed out of out of those kind of accolades. Because he happens 804 00:55:07,079 --> 00:55:09,880 to play a loaded position in the Western Conference, which is overloaded with backcourt 805 00:55:09,880 --> 00:55:15,039 talent. See. I just don't read too much into All Star appearances anymore. 806 00:55:15,079 --> 00:55:16,960 So I don't feel's strong. I wish I wish that we didn't need 807 00:55:17,039 --> 00:55:22,440 to And I think that's like they get cited so much your historical conversations, 808 00:55:22,440 --> 00:55:23,599 and that's what I agree with. You're looking at it from the perspective of 809 00:55:23,599 --> 00:55:25,800 people are going to talk about this and they're gonna mention, oh, we 810 00:55:25,880 --> 00:55:30,679 only made one All Star Game in twenty thirteen and that wasn't even close to 811 00:55:30,760 --> 00:55:37,079 his best basketball of his career. So hashtag Eastern Conference there. Yeah. 812 00:55:37,119 --> 00:55:38,320 I mean, we're like, we're guilty of doing that too. You know, 813 00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:42,079 it's so easy to look back at, you know, the sixties and 814 00:55:42,159 --> 00:55:45,280 seventies and guys who we weren't around to watch play and just be like, 815 00:55:45,280 --> 00:55:47,599 oh, like we're gonna dismiss him because he only made one All Star team 816 00:55:47,639 --> 00:55:51,239 or he never made an All Star team, And I just I don't want 817 00:55:51,239 --> 00:55:54,320 that to happen to guys like Drew Holliday and Mike Conley and and you know 818 00:55:54,400 --> 00:55:59,800 other guards in the West who just haven't been Steph Curry, Russell Westbrook, 819 00:56:00,039 --> 00:56:05,800 James Harden, whoever else has been there. I'm totally Holiday feels like one 820 00:56:05,800 --> 00:56:08,360 of the most egregious examples. Yeah, and Mike Conley would be one in 821 00:56:08,400 --> 00:56:13,119 previous years as well. Yeah, and the Jazz hope he can get back 822 00:56:13,159 --> 00:56:17,039 to that level. Yeah, but that was another podcast. That was another 823 00:56:17,079 --> 00:56:22,199 podcast. Needless to say, he will not be appearing in the Utah Jazz 824 00:56:22,239 --> 00:56:25,679 episode of this series, either will Anthony Davis. Neither will Anthony Davis, 825 00:56:25,719 --> 00:56:31,519 who is number one pretty much unanimously. He appeared second on five ballots, 826 00:56:31,559 --> 00:56:35,519 third on one ballot, but other than that, you know, he was 827 00:56:35,599 --> 00:56:37,599 number one for both of myself and Dan. He was number one on the 828 00:56:37,599 --> 00:56:42,920 remainder of the fan votes, and he was the very obvious inclusion. I 829 00:56:42,960 --> 00:56:45,960 don't there's nothing to really talk about with him in the context of his game. 830 00:56:45,000 --> 00:56:50,719 But I find this incredible is that he has seventy two win shares for 831 00:56:50,719 --> 00:56:53,480 the decade with the Pelicans. Holiday is second at twenty eight point six's. 832 00:56:54,199 --> 00:57:00,039 That's closer to a three to one lead than it should be. That's ridiculous. 833 00:57:00,119 --> 00:57:04,280 Yeah, I mean that is and carrying the franchise, and it's it 834 00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:08,559 does suck the way that his tenure ended there. I am, I am, 835 00:57:08,599 --> 00:57:13,480 like you, extremely pro player, but it does seem that he allowed 836 00:57:13,519 --> 00:57:17,760 that to be handled poorly. I understand he was trying to inflict more of 837 00:57:17,800 --> 00:57:22,719 his agency on the situation by requesting a trade eighteen months out from free agency 838 00:57:22,760 --> 00:57:28,119 as opposed to one year, but to do it before the trade deadline, 839 00:57:28,119 --> 00:57:30,559 and this is as he's at fault just as much as you know his actual 840 00:57:30,599 --> 00:57:35,280 agents on because I'm sure this was their plan. Not giving the Pelicans enough 841 00:57:35,280 --> 00:57:37,360 time to suss out a deal was disingenuous to actually getting him out of New 842 00:57:37,480 --> 00:57:43,840 Orleans, and it created this awkward situation that exacerbated everything the bad feelings where 843 00:57:43,840 --> 00:57:45,719 Pelicans fans. Had he requested out over the summer, or if this had 844 00:57:45,760 --> 00:57:51,480 come in December, they probably would have respected it more. But because it's 845 00:57:51,480 --> 00:57:55,480 say, came so close to that twenty nineteen trade deadline, it really ended 846 00:57:55,519 --> 00:57:59,960 up damaging perception of his stay there. It's become about well, can you 847 00:58:00,119 --> 00:58:02,440 win with Anthony Davis as your best player? And look, the NBA's at 848 00:58:02,480 --> 00:58:06,599 fault, yes, yes, who can? Just to be clear, there 849 00:58:07,320 --> 00:58:10,559 the NBA is at fault there too, because threatening to find the Pelicans are 850 00:58:10,559 --> 00:58:15,360 not playing Anthony Davis. Now you put him in the situation where he's playing 851 00:58:15,400 --> 00:58:17,000 for teamm he openly didn't want to be on, and then the fans are 852 00:58:17,000 --> 00:58:23,199 booing him. Just so many levels of awkward. And it sucks that that's 853 00:58:23,239 --> 00:58:27,719 how his tenure ended, because I think this could have been a situation like 854 00:58:28,000 --> 00:58:31,559 Lebron leaving Cleveland the second time, where you could have just understood it, 855 00:58:31,719 --> 00:58:36,639 and it was different because it's the first time and the franchise was so invested 856 00:58:36,639 --> 00:58:39,719 in him. The upshot is because of the way this thing ended and where 857 00:58:39,760 --> 00:58:44,800 they wound up in the lottery order. They end up with Zion Williamson, 858 00:58:44,960 --> 00:58:49,320 and the slightest difference could have ended up penalizing him because if he played more 859 00:58:49,360 --> 00:58:52,239 of the season, they'd be better. Had they traded him, they would 860 00:58:52,239 --> 00:58:54,719 have been worse. And so it ended up working out for them, But 861 00:58:54,800 --> 00:58:59,719 it was it was polarizing, fun to make jokes about and you couldn't look 862 00:58:59,719 --> 00:59:02,519 away. But because of how good he actually is, and I do think 863 00:59:02,519 --> 00:59:07,559 how good he actually is was sort of obfuscated by playing in New Orleans and 864 00:59:07,599 --> 00:59:10,360 I've been to New Orleans. I love New Orleans. But because he wasn't 865 00:59:10,360 --> 00:59:14,960 in a bigger market and consistently not in the playoffs, I wouldn't say he 866 00:59:15,000 --> 00:59:19,599 was underrated because you're still going to find him consistently in the top seven NBA 867 00:59:19,679 --> 00:59:22,840 player rankings. It's just now there's this perception that he can't win. It 868 00:59:22,920 --> 00:59:27,679 exists mostly outside of New Orleans, even if people were you know, we're 869 00:59:28,000 --> 00:59:31,159 we're resentful over how he left there, but that it sucks that that's what 870 00:59:31,199 --> 00:59:34,440 we're now we're spending time talking about, is we could have done. This 871 00:59:34,480 --> 00:59:37,440 is a person that we should just spend thirty seconds on here because you don't 872 00:59:37,440 --> 00:59:39,320 need I'm not going to say anything about the numbers you don't already know about 873 00:59:39,320 --> 00:59:43,320 his game, how the way he plays on defense, his position list to 874 00:59:43,360 --> 00:59:45,639 fight, despite the fact that he's you know, a terrot actyl where he's 875 00:59:45,679 --> 00:59:50,400 like seven feet and has the wingspan that goes on for infinity. That we're 876 00:59:50,440 --> 00:59:53,360 talking about this at all, but that's I wonder if he is on the 877 00:59:53,400 --> 00:59:55,599 ballots, you know, you talk about one that was where he was number 878 00:59:55,599 --> 00:59:59,440 two or where jokes one that put him lower. If he leaves under better 879 00:59:59,440 --> 01:00:04,360 circumstance. Is he just like the unanimous number one with no one but he? 880 01:00:04,440 --> 01:00:07,719 I mean he should be, but like a Kemba Walker situation where you 881 01:00:07,719 --> 01:00:12,159 remember him more, way more fondly than you do now right, I am 882 01:00:12,239 --> 01:00:15,159 going to share one stat just for fun before we say that's all folks and 883 01:00:15,159 --> 01:00:21,320 put a rap on this episode. And that's just his block standing in franchise 884 01:00:21,400 --> 01:00:24,880 history. So the top five in New Orleans history for block shots, Drew 885 01:00:24,920 --> 01:00:30,440 Holiday is actually fit at two sixty three, Tyson Chandler fourth at two sixty 886 01:00:30,519 --> 01:00:34,480 nine, Ameca Okafer three h five, David West four thirty five, Anthony 887 01:00:34,559 --> 01:00:37,760 Davis one thy one hundred and twenty one. He has more blocks than West, 888 01:00:37,800 --> 01:00:42,719 Okafer, and Chandler combined. Who are the three players directly below him 889 01:00:42,760 --> 01:00:45,719 in that hierarchy? And that's ridiculous. But like you said, you know, 890 01:00:45,800 --> 01:00:50,400 we could spend a lot of time talking about how great Anthony Davis was 891 01:00:50,519 --> 01:00:52,760 and is. We don't really need to, just because that kind of goes 892 01:00:52,800 --> 01:00:58,239 without saying. And unfortunately, it did become more interesting to talk about the 893 01:00:58,320 --> 01:01:01,639 exit and what that meant for his legacy and what it meant to the team 894 01:01:01,639 --> 01:01:07,079 then and the ripple effects that it had on the organization, And you know, 895 01:01:07,480 --> 01:01:10,360 I wish that it had happened differently. It didn't. That is what 896 01:01:10,440 --> 01:01:15,280 happened, and we had to react accordingly. I'm totally with you. Do 897 01:01:15,320 --> 01:01:17,039 you want to take us through some honorable mentions? Can't believe we're going over 898 01:01:17,079 --> 01:01:22,400 an hour on the new orleased Pelicans a transitioning to this. You're welcome. 899 01:01:22,639 --> 01:01:28,519 I can one hundred percent believe that given our history. But yes, honorable 900 01:01:28,519 --> 01:01:30,719 mentions. We had each one more at eleven. On the fan vote, 901 01:01:30,719 --> 01:01:36,079 we had Rajon Rondo at twelve, Alfa Rukamino at thirteen, Nikolamirotich and Omar 902 01:01:36,119 --> 01:01:39,159 ashik Are tied at fourteenth. At sixteenth we had a tie between Anthony Morrow 903 01:01:39,199 --> 01:01:45,440 and Paygostoyakovitch at an eighteenth. At eighteenth we had a tie between Ameca okaf, 904 01:01:45,599 --> 01:01:49,719 Jj Reddick, Lonzo Ball and Robin Lopez. Twenty second we had another 905 01:01:49,719 --> 01:01:53,679 big tie between alexeiy agensa Buddy Healed, Derek Favors, Jarrett Jack and Trevor 906 01:01:53,719 --> 01:01:59,239 Ariza. Two way tie between Jim Or Fredet and Julius Randall for twenty seventh 907 01:01:59,400 --> 01:02:01,960 Grievous Vaz and Brian Roberts at twenty ninth, then at three way tie between 908 01:02:02,039 --> 01:02:07,760 Darius Miller, Gustavo Ayone and Austin Rivers for thirty First, I just want 909 01:02:07,800 --> 01:02:15,440 to say I'm excited that Brian Roberts got got a vote. The other thing 910 01:02:15,440 --> 01:02:17,639 I'll say, and that's how I'll lead us out. And before we get 911 01:02:17,639 --> 01:02:21,400 out of your please remember to rate, review and subscribe to us wherever you 912 01:02:21,440 --> 01:02:23,760 get these podcasts, even if you're not listening on iTunes. That's a great 913 01:02:23,760 --> 01:02:27,320 way to help us out. Throw us a five star rating right or review. 914 01:02:27,320 --> 01:02:30,719 Put whatever you want in there. Talk about Adam's huge calves, or 915 01:02:30,920 --> 01:02:35,199 critique us same meme things. Talk about Frankie Lakina. I'm here for all 916 01:02:35,239 --> 01:02:39,400 the Frankie smokes propaganda. We appreciate it all. But I will leave you 917 01:02:39,440 --> 01:02:43,559 all until next time. And when we next record the decade ranking series, 918 01:02:43,559 --> 01:02:45,960 who comes after the Pelicans? Oh, we'll be directly to the Oklahoma City 919 01:02:45,960 --> 01:02:52,239 Thunder because there's no NBA franchise in between. Just just kidding. The Knicks 920 01:02:52,239 --> 01:02:55,320 will be up next anyway, shout out. It might not be sober for 921 01:02:55,360 --> 01:02:59,079 that episode to get through it. I'm not going to be able to be 922 01:02:59,119 --> 01:03:01,800 sober for that episode. No, until next time, though, We leave 923 01:03:01,840 --> 01:03:07,800 you with the shout out to the one the only Pelicans legend huge snub from 924 01:03:07,800 --> 01:03:12,000 this exercise because he was sixth in minutes played for the decade, yet did 925 01:03:12,000 --> 01:03:22,480 not receive a single vote on the ballot. Dante Cunningham, Sugar Ray Leonard, 926 01:03:22,719 --> 01:03:28,239 Roberto Duran, Marvelous, Marvin Hagler, and Thomas Hearns. Legends whose 927 01:03:28,320 --> 01:03:32,159 four way rivalry define one of the greatest errors in boxing history, relive their 928 01:03:32,199 --> 01:03:37,000 decade of dominance in the new Showtime Sports documentary The Kings, a four parts 929 01:03:37,000 --> 01:03:40,039 series premiering Sunday, June sixth, only on Showtime