WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.960 --> 00:00:08.160 Coming to you from Studio A at Proven Winners Color Choice Shrubs. There's no 2 00:00:08.320 --> 00:00:15.880 shrubstitute for this shows. It's the Gardening Simplified Show with Stacy, Hervella me, 3 00:00:16.079 --> 00:00:20.600 Rick Weiss, and our engineer and producer Adriana Robinson. All right, 4 00:00:20.679 --> 00:00:25.480 so Stacy, Adriana and I have the privilege and pleasure of getting to interact 5 00:00:25.519 --> 00:00:30.320 with all kinds of people across the United States, into Canada and around the 6 00:00:30.399 --> 00:00:35.600 world. And one Gardening Simplified Show listener sent us a note. Can you 7 00:00:35.679 --> 00:00:41.000 discuss the basics of getting a plant established? It's fun to select new plants, 8 00:00:41.439 --> 00:00:43.920 but if they don't make it through the first winter, it can be 9 00:00:44.000 --> 00:00:50.240 discouraging, causing one to trim back expectations by planting less in the coming season. 10 00:00:50.600 --> 00:00:54.520 For those of us learning as we go, getting plants established can turn 11 00:00:54.520 --> 00:00:59.039 out to be a bit of a steep learning curve. You know. I 12 00:00:59.079 --> 00:01:03.719 was thinking about this, thinking some people always seem to be in the right 13 00:01:03.760 --> 00:01:10.719 place at the right time, And I'd like to tell you that from my 14 00:01:10.840 --> 00:01:17.120 experience as a person, it's not just because they're lucky. For people they 15 00:01:17.159 --> 00:01:21.640 prepare, It's not just about proximity. These people have prepared for the moment. 16 00:01:21.959 --> 00:01:26.079 They shadow, they're willing to serve, they're consistent, they show up 17 00:01:26.079 --> 00:01:29.640 and show up well, and then they take a shot. Well, if 18 00:01:29.680 --> 00:01:33.040 you're going to take a shot with your plants, first of all, you've 19 00:01:33.040 --> 00:01:37.040 got to make sure that they're in the right place at the right time to 20 00:01:37.200 --> 00:01:44.640 give them that opportunity to grow. Building is like while planting is like building 21 00:01:44.680 --> 00:01:47.879 a structure. Okay, you've got to have a plan. You should have 22 00:01:47.920 --> 00:01:52.000 a plan, some sort of plan if you're going to do it. You 23 00:01:52.040 --> 00:01:57.560 need to establish a foundation on the plot of your choosing and the esthetics will 24 00:01:57.599 --> 00:02:02.280 come later. So there is an element of planning that goes along with putting 25 00:02:02.280 --> 00:02:05.959 a plant in the ground. Well, there is not, least of all, 26 00:02:06.040 --> 00:02:09.919 because you do have to consider what your conditions are, your light conditions, 27 00:02:09.919 --> 00:02:14.080 your soil conditions, and so you at least need to have that in 28 00:02:14.159 --> 00:02:17.680 mind right before you start picking those plants. And you know, I know 29 00:02:17.840 --> 00:02:22.439 personally as you do the heartache of falling in love with something only to find 30 00:02:22.439 --> 00:02:23.639 out it won't do well. It either gets eaten by deer, or your 31 00:02:23.639 --> 00:02:29.560 soil is too dry or it's not hardy. Usually is my situation. But 32 00:02:29.639 --> 00:02:34.479 yeah, you have to be prepared. Yeah, so a plant is established 33 00:02:34.520 --> 00:02:38.759 when the roots have grown into the surrounding soil and there's a bit of new 34 00:02:38.919 --> 00:02:42.840 growth on the branch tips. So a gentle tug is going to tell you 35 00:02:42.919 --> 00:02:46.599 when the roots are established, and if you've made good plant choices, odds 36 00:02:46.680 --> 00:02:52.240 are you're going to be successful. I like to use a few different examples. 37 00:02:52.240 --> 00:02:55.240 Stacy. One example that I would use, and for our YouTube viewers 38 00:02:55.360 --> 00:03:00.800 you'll see this in studio for those listening to the pod cast or radio, 39 00:03:00.319 --> 00:03:06.680 I'm putting a wineglass on the center of the table. Well that was as 40 00:03:06.919 --> 00:03:08.680 impressive as I thought it might be. Sorry, I was trying to give 41 00:03:08.680 --> 00:03:14.639 our radio listeners a little sound effect. Yeah, that doesn't work. Probably 42 00:03:14.680 --> 00:03:20.240 should have practiced that beforehand. Anyhow, that wineglass, to me represents a 43 00:03:20.240 --> 00:03:23.759 tree. Let's say we're trying to establish a tree. Now, many people 44 00:03:23.840 --> 00:03:28.840 think roots go deep into the soil, and they don't. It has a 45 00:03:29.000 --> 00:03:34.080 flared look the tree does, similar to a wine glass, and so it's 46 00:03:34.120 --> 00:03:39.439 extremely important to prepare the soil properly for whatever plant you're putting in the ground, 47 00:03:39.800 --> 00:03:46.680 trees or shrubs, because roots need oxygen just as much as they need 48 00:03:46.919 --> 00:03:51.000 water and minerals and they are going to flare out from the base of the 49 00:03:51.039 --> 00:03:54.680 plant. There's going to be structural roots that hold that plant in place. 50 00:03:55.120 --> 00:04:00.199 But Stacy, what we're trying to encourage our what we would call adventitious roots 51 00:04:00.240 --> 00:04:05.199 that are working their way into the soil profile. And those are the roots 52 00:04:05.240 --> 00:04:11.120 that are going to really do the work in establishing that plant by absorbing the 53 00:04:11.159 --> 00:04:16.199 minerals, the water, and taking care of feeding that plant. Right. 54 00:04:16.279 --> 00:04:19.040 So two things there. I think a lot of people, you know, 55 00:04:19.199 --> 00:04:24.199 you're either hiking in the woods or driving along the expressway and there a storm 56 00:04:24.240 --> 00:04:28.480 had gone through and you see those trees uprooted and they took a huge chunk 57 00:04:28.519 --> 00:04:30.199 of earth with it, and a lot of people probably see that and think, 58 00:04:30.240 --> 00:04:33.120 wow, that tree wasn't rooted that deeply. That's probably why it fell. 59 00:04:33.240 --> 00:04:38.199 And that's not the case. Plants don't actually grow as deep as many 60 00:04:38.240 --> 00:04:42.800 people think that they do, for the simple fact that oxygen does not penetrate 61 00:04:42.920 --> 00:04:46.879 that deeply beyond about eighteen inches in the soil, and its actually need oxygen. 62 00:04:46.000 --> 00:04:49.560 So yes, they are going to go somewhat deeper, but it's not 63 00:04:49.600 --> 00:04:53.720 like you know, when you see those trees, there's something wrong with them. 64 00:04:53.759 --> 00:04:56.319 They just they were in the wrong place at the wrong time and the 65 00:04:56.399 --> 00:05:00.040 wind happened to blow them over. But you know, this concept of a 66 00:05:00.040 --> 00:05:05.839 ablishment is so important because I think very few people fully understand or realize that 67 00:05:05.920 --> 00:05:11.519 a plant can only grow on top as much as its root system can support. 68 00:05:12.079 --> 00:05:15.879 And so after you plant something, you don't see a lot of growth. 69 00:05:15.879 --> 00:05:17.120 And we definitely hear from people who are like, oh my gosh, 70 00:05:17.160 --> 00:05:20.560 I planted you know, fill in the blank here and it hasn't grown and 71 00:05:20.600 --> 00:05:24.199 what's wrong and what am I doing wrong? And I'm a horrible plant parent. 72 00:05:24.639 --> 00:05:29.319 And no, just because you aren't seeing the growth above ground doesn't mean 73 00:05:29.360 --> 00:05:33.160 there's not a whole whole lot of activity underground. And until that root system 74 00:05:33.199 --> 00:05:38.319 is in place, the plant is not going to have the resources to devote 75 00:05:38.360 --> 00:05:41.160 to a lot of that top growth, to devote to a lot of flowering, 76 00:05:41.160 --> 00:05:44.519 to devote to a lot of color development, fruit development, whatever that 77 00:05:44.639 --> 00:05:47.759 ornamental feature is. It's really important just because we don't see the roots to 78 00:05:47.879 --> 00:05:53.560 understand that they really do control the growth of the plant. Yeah, exactly, 79 00:05:53.720 --> 00:05:58.000 you need to look down and out first, not down and out as 80 00:05:58.040 --> 00:06:01.920 in feeling depressed, but down and out because we need that root establishment. 81 00:06:01.959 --> 00:06:05.360 I was reminded of it this past week when there was a group of ladies 82 00:06:05.399 --> 00:06:09.720 at the greenhouse that approached me and said, hey, I bought these hearty 83 00:06:09.839 --> 00:06:14.040 mums last year and they're supposed to be perennials, but none of them came 84 00:06:14.079 --> 00:06:16.439 back. And you know I can guarantee. I always tell people with hearty 85 00:06:16.519 --> 00:06:20.319 mums, once they're done late October November, cut them back, but leave 86 00:06:20.399 --> 00:06:25.560 some stubble on them, a little mulch over the top, because if you 87 00:06:25.720 --> 00:06:29.040 don't, those plants aren't well rooted in the ground. When you've put them 88 00:06:29.040 --> 00:06:31.240 in the ground, they'll push up or heave out of the ground and you'll 89 00:06:31.319 --> 00:06:36.639 lose the plants, those fine roots. So it's about establishment in the soil, 90 00:06:36.839 --> 00:06:42.120 having a good foundation. You're not going to build a house that does 91 00:06:42.199 --> 00:06:46.160 not have a good foundation. Let me give you a quick lime rick on 92 00:06:46.360 --> 00:06:53.360 this subject. My gardening skills have astounded by beautiful plants. I'm surrounded. 93 00:06:53.759 --> 00:06:58.079 Don't tell me I got lucky, because my plants are plucky. We just 94 00:06:58.160 --> 00:07:01.079 make sure we're well ground. Did So that's the key, right, Yeah, 95 00:07:02.199 --> 00:07:06.279 yeah, so competition in nature. So I don't care if you're putting 96 00:07:06.319 --> 00:07:11.519 a house plant in some soil indoors, or a tree in the ground, 97 00:07:11.639 --> 00:07:18.279 or a flowering shrub or some perennials. That seasonal timing along with good soil 98 00:07:18.639 --> 00:07:24.759 establishment as well as as we talked about, oxygen for the roots, is 99 00:07:24.800 --> 00:07:29.560 going to make a world of difference for your plants. Now, Stacy, 100 00:07:29.680 --> 00:07:32.879 you'll see a lot of these starter fertilizers out on the market, like vitamin 101 00:07:33.000 --> 00:07:39.000 B one, and there are many people who think that's just silly, doesn't 102 00:07:39.000 --> 00:07:44.120 work, other people who swear by it. I mean, what's your position 103 00:07:44.160 --> 00:07:47.759 I'm using a starter fertilizer. My position on using a starter fertilizer is that 104 00:07:47.800 --> 00:07:53.000 it's not typically needed. Okay, first of all, because especially when you're 105 00:07:53.040 --> 00:07:57.120 buying something you know, new from the greenhous or nursery, it has been 106 00:07:57.160 --> 00:08:01.120 fertilized within an inch of its life. You know there fortizing it regularly, 107 00:08:01.600 --> 00:08:05.639 It had a time, it had a time release fertilizer like osma code or 108 00:08:05.680 --> 00:08:11.279 whatever incorporated into the soil, and so it's nutrient needs are really really well 109 00:08:11.360 --> 00:08:16.319 covered. And adding a bunch of stuff to the soil when the plant is 110 00:08:16.680 --> 00:08:20.199 doesn't necessarily have the root system to take them up. It's just kind of 111 00:08:20.199 --> 00:08:26.319 a ways things can leach out. But I get the idea that people feel 112 00:08:26.319 --> 00:08:28.120 like they want to make a perfect little home for their new plant, and 113 00:08:28.360 --> 00:08:31.960 I think that's a very good approach to take to it. But I just 114 00:08:33.080 --> 00:08:39.679 think that the answer doesn't always lie in buying something for said beautiful cozy home 115 00:08:39.720 --> 00:08:43.039 for your new plant. It really just results. It's really just a matter 116 00:08:43.080 --> 00:08:46.320 of taking the right steps so that the plant can live. So they're not 117 00:08:46.440 --> 00:08:50.120 usually harmful. And we've talked about mike rizing before and my approach to and 118 00:08:50.200 --> 00:08:54.840 those are very often a part of starter fertilizers. And my viewpoint on microrizing 119 00:08:54.919 --> 00:09:00.519 is they are absolutely great, but adding them to your soil is likely to 120 00:09:00.519 --> 00:09:03.559 work because they're a living thing and if you don't have the right conditions, 121 00:09:03.720 --> 00:09:07.320 all any microizing you add is going to die. And if you have the 122 00:09:07.399 --> 00:09:11.960 right conditions, they're already in there any ways. It's similar to like the 123 00:09:11.039 --> 00:09:16.919 vitamins or the phosphorus thing. You can overdo it just because it's not necessarily 124 00:09:16.919 --> 00:09:20.840 that more is better. There is a sort of stasis there of how much 125 00:09:20.919 --> 00:09:24.720 a soil can hold in terms of nutrients, in terms of other supplements like 126 00:09:24.840 --> 00:09:28.159 dwan or microizing. Yeah, that's true. You can buy a beautiful car, 127 00:09:28.240 --> 00:09:33.039 but if there's no engine under the hood, it's not going to function 128 00:09:33.159 --> 00:09:37.440 well. So roots not only anchor the plant, but again, the adventitious 129 00:09:37.519 --> 00:09:41.639 roots are going to reach into that parent soil where you've placed this plant and 130 00:09:41.799 --> 00:09:46.799 give that plant a good feeding foundation. Stacy, I wanted to mention for 131 00:09:46.879 --> 00:09:52.200 our listener who also reached out to us on this establishment issue. I have 132 00:09:52.279 --> 00:10:00.759 found many times pruning and pinching also important in the initial establishment of a plant. 133 00:10:00.840 --> 00:10:03.759 In other words, when you buy a beautiful plant at the garden center, 134 00:10:05.120 --> 00:10:09.039 the garden center wants this thing to look beautiful why full of flour, 135 00:10:09.279 --> 00:10:16.039 because you're going to buy it impulsively, right, But sometimes pinching or pruning. 136 00:10:16.120 --> 00:10:18.720 I'll often do that when I put aunt flowering annuals in the ground, 137 00:10:18.759 --> 00:10:24.919 we'll pinch them first because we want to focus on that root establishment and we 138 00:10:24.000 --> 00:10:30.120 want the top growth to be proportionate to the root system. Does that make 139 00:10:30.159 --> 00:10:33.759 sense? It does make sense because what you're basically saying is is, you 140 00:10:33.759 --> 00:10:37.559 know, thinking about things as roots growing in proportion to the top. The 141 00:10:37.559 --> 00:10:39.720 top that you have is proportional to the root mass. But if you take 142 00:10:39.759 --> 00:10:43.519 away some of that top, now you have more root mass than you need, 143 00:10:45.200 --> 00:10:46.879 and that will help it get more established. It can put it's more 144 00:10:48.240 --> 00:10:50.519 of its energy into growing those roots instead of just growing up, up, 145 00:10:50.639 --> 00:10:54.600 up up up. Yeah. I understand that's a difficult process for people to 146 00:10:54.639 --> 00:10:58.559 pinch beautiful new plants that they just got, so I don't think it's imperative, 147 00:10:58.600 --> 00:11:00.960 but it can be a good idea. And if you believe that that's 148 00:11:01.000 --> 00:11:03.120 what you need to do, then I'd say, by all means, do 149 00:11:03.159 --> 00:11:05.320 it. Sure. And that's why last week when we talked about fall is 150 00:11:05.399 --> 00:11:09.080 for planting. Because the soil is warm, but the plant isn't putting all 151 00:11:09.120 --> 00:11:13.120 that energy into top growth. It may be a good time for you to 152 00:11:13.159 --> 00:11:20.440 try to establish plants in the landscape. Coming up later on today's show, 153 00:11:20.679 --> 00:11:24.519 segment four Branching News, we're going to talk gardening trends. That's truly be 154 00:11:24.559 --> 00:11:28.720 a lot of fun gardening trends that you have to look forward to in twenty 155 00:11:28.879 --> 00:11:35.000 twenty four. But first Plants on Trial, Stacy's going to introduce us to 156 00:11:35.080 --> 00:11:37.799 a beauty. You don't want to miss this that's coming up next here on 157 00:11:37.960 --> 00:11:50.000 the Gardening Simplified Show. Proven Winner's Color Choice Shrubs cares about your success in 158 00:11:50.039 --> 00:11:52.399 the garden. That's why we trial and test all of our shrubs for eight 159 00:11:52.440 --> 00:11:56.480 to ten years, making sure they outperform everything else on the market. Look 160 00:11:56.480 --> 00:12:03.519 for them in the distinctive white container at your local garden center. Creating's Gardening 161 00:12:03.519 --> 00:12:07.639 friends, and welcome back to the Gardening Simplified Show. You know, we 162 00:12:07.639 --> 00:12:11.039 were just talking about plants getting established, and it's I had to have to 163 00:12:11.080 --> 00:12:16.080 deliver some news to you Rick about plants getting established. I was thinking of 164 00:12:16.080 --> 00:12:18.039 you in the garden. I happened to walk by my cannas that you gave 165 00:12:18.039 --> 00:12:22.759 me at the end of the season looking fabulous. Absolutely love them. The 166 00:12:22.840 --> 00:12:28.600 hummingbirds are going crazy. We'll never be without them again. But these puppies 167 00:12:28.039 --> 00:12:33.759 busted through the fiberglass container that I have them planted in. Wow. I 168 00:12:33.799 --> 00:12:37.360 was walking by and I was like, something caught my eyes, said what 169 00:12:37.559 --> 00:12:43.840 is that? And they incredibly hulked it right out of that container exactly. 170 00:12:45.639 --> 00:12:48.799 Yeah, and I did overplant them in the container, but you know that's 171 00:12:48.799 --> 00:12:50.360 easy to do. Because you got these cannonrhizomes. You got a big I 172 00:12:50.360 --> 00:12:52.360 had, like a big twenty two inch container. I'm like, oh yeah, 173 00:12:52.360 --> 00:12:56.240 I'll just pack them in there. It'll be fine. Now they're huge 174 00:12:56.960 --> 00:13:01.000 and so strong, and they've grown with so much force that they have actually 175 00:13:01.759 --> 00:13:09.879 broken the side of the container. Wow, a root awakening, And I 176 00:13:09.919 --> 00:13:11.679 mean the container is destroyed. But I'm also sitting here wondering how in the 177 00:13:11.679 --> 00:13:16.240 world I'm going to get these things out of here when they have filled it 178 00:13:16.440 --> 00:13:22.639 so abundantly. So accept compliments on their robust growth. Yes, it's they 179 00:13:22.679 --> 00:13:26.360 are robust, I will say that. And speaking of robustness, we were 180 00:13:26.399 --> 00:13:31.440 just talking about establishing plants, and you know, I always like to tie 181 00:13:31.519 --> 00:13:35.360 the plant on trial to whatever we're talking about, and so as I was 182 00:13:35.360 --> 00:13:37.519 thinking about which one we're going to put on trial today, I said, 183 00:13:37.799 --> 00:13:41.200 this could go either way. I could choose a plant that's slow to get 184 00:13:41.320 --> 00:13:43.720 established or a plant that's fast to get established. But then I said, 185 00:13:43.759 --> 00:13:48.080 you know, a couple of weeks ago, we covered Sweet Summer Love Clematists 186 00:13:48.080 --> 00:13:50.679 as our plant on trial, and that is a plant that, as I 187 00:13:50.720 --> 00:13:56.639 said during that segment, is definitely slow to get established the plant the clematists. 188 00:13:56.679 --> 00:13:58.320 They have really thick, fleshy roots. It just takes a lot of 189 00:13:58.440 --> 00:14:03.440 energy for them to grow enough of them to perform well and grow a lot 190 00:14:03.480 --> 00:14:05.159 on top. So I said, you know what, now I'm gonna go 191 00:14:05.200 --> 00:14:07.399 opposite. I'm going to talk about a plant that's fast to get established, 192 00:14:07.440 --> 00:14:13.519 and that plant is Kodiak orange dervilla. Natalie Carmoli here at Proven Winners Color 193 00:14:13.639 --> 00:14:18.279 Choice Shrubs got me excited about this plant. I put it in my landscape. 194 00:14:18.480 --> 00:14:20.639 I love it. Yeah, it's a great plant. Now, I 195 00:14:20.679 --> 00:14:26.000 will say for everybody who's listening at home that it is not the showiest of 196 00:14:26.039 --> 00:14:28.200 the Proven Winner's Color Choice shrubs. This is and that's okay. That's a 197 00:14:28.240 --> 00:14:31.639 good thing. I mean, if every single plant in our garden is showy, 198 00:14:31.840 --> 00:14:35.960 you don't know where to look because everything's popping off and going crazy. 199 00:14:37.039 --> 00:14:41.480 So this is going to be one of those quieter plants that you use, 200 00:14:41.559 --> 00:14:45.480 maybe incorporate into your landscape. I have several and so. Dervilla is a 201 00:14:45.519 --> 00:14:48.960 North American native shrub. In fact, here in Michigan you'll see it growing 202 00:14:48.000 --> 00:14:52.159 all over Macina Island and in many places up north. It is a member 203 00:14:52.279 --> 00:14:58.080 of the honeysuckle family, and as such, it has very tidy opposite foliage, 204 00:14:58.120 --> 00:15:01.759 So the leaves are a range opposite one another on the stems, and 205 00:15:01.919 --> 00:15:07.080 it just has like a very neat, clean look, and the new growth, 206 00:15:07.559 --> 00:15:11.679 the new foliage growth emerges a really really nice orange. It gets really 207 00:15:11.759 --> 00:15:15.440 nice red orange fall color, and then all through the summer it puts out 208 00:15:15.440 --> 00:15:20.440 these small yellow flowers that attract a lot of different pollinators, especially bumblebees. 209 00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:24.600 So you know, it gets to you about three to four feet tall. 210 00:15:24.679 --> 00:15:26.360 So it's kind of one of those plants where you might just say, like, 211 00:15:28.159 --> 00:15:31.879 yep, it's a plant, but it really has a subtle color that 212 00:15:31.919 --> 00:15:35.159 I think helps it blend so nicely with other things. I think the orange 213 00:15:35.159 --> 00:15:39.480 goes great with brick homes, which can also often be very difficult to landscape. 214 00:15:41.080 --> 00:15:45.600 And of course in terms of the establishment, this is a very tough 215 00:15:45.879 --> 00:15:48.879 and very durable plant. I find it to be drought tolerant. It's yeah, 216 00:15:48.960 --> 00:15:52.320 so that was my experience too. So you know, as we've said, 217 00:15:52.320 --> 00:15:56.919 we've both garden and really sandy soil dunes, a dune sort of environment, 218 00:15:58.480 --> 00:16:02.960 and I have and I'm not suggesting that you do this listeners, watchers, 219 00:16:02.960 --> 00:16:07.399 however, you're joining us on gardening simplified. I have transplanted it in 220 00:16:07.440 --> 00:16:10.519 the middle of the summer, and I swear this thing did not miss a 221 00:16:10.519 --> 00:16:15.519 beat. Wow, it's fantastic. And they have their roots are, you 222 00:16:15.559 --> 00:16:18.159 know, like a pretty much a regular shrub root kind of system. They 223 00:16:18.200 --> 00:16:22.440 do have sort of almost like a runner. Now, they they aren't like 224 00:16:22.440 --> 00:16:26.519 a suckering shrub. They do sucker a bit, but really they mostly stay 225 00:16:26.600 --> 00:16:30.360 kind of within the plant body. And these vigorous suckers are what help it 226 00:16:30.480 --> 00:16:34.559 get established so quickly. It just is really able to grow those roots very 227 00:16:34.639 --> 00:16:40.200 quickly and get established. So you start enjoying that color, enjoying good growth, 228 00:16:40.320 --> 00:16:44.200 enjoying that flowering a lot sooner you're not waiting, you know, the 229 00:16:44.240 --> 00:16:47.639 typical establishment time frame, which usually we say is two to three years. 230 00:16:47.840 --> 00:16:49.399 Yeah, if you're keeping score at home, you want to google it. 231 00:16:51.039 --> 00:16:56.679 We're talking about Kodiak orange Dervella. At least, Stacy, you called it 232 00:16:56.879 --> 00:17:02.480 dervella. I've always called it dear vella. And I planted it because allegedly 233 00:17:02.559 --> 00:17:06.799 it's kind of deer resistant, it's kind of desist, it's kind of that 234 00:17:06.880 --> 00:17:08.680 was a good way to say it. It's nibble done the flower. Yeah, 235 00:17:08.720 --> 00:17:11.480 yep. So I find that the deer do nibble it a bit, 236 00:17:11.640 --> 00:17:15.519 especially in spring, which is very common a lot of things that are otherwise 237 00:17:15.519 --> 00:17:18.640 deer resistant, you know, they come out of winter, they're super hungry. 238 00:17:19.200 --> 00:17:23.960 Anything that is you know, first out and has that tender new growth. 239 00:17:23.960 --> 00:17:26.680 They're like, yeah, I'm eating it. I need a salad. 240 00:17:26.720 --> 00:17:30.759 I'm tired of all this mark. And so they do nibble it a bit, 241 00:17:30.799 --> 00:17:33.400 but overall they don't seriously damage it. So they do eat it a 242 00:17:33.400 --> 00:17:36.319 bit, but not to the point where you're like, oh my god, 243 00:17:36.559 --> 00:17:40.000 there's nothing left. So it's just something to keep in mind if you have 244 00:17:40.079 --> 00:17:41.720 deer. I find that the damage does taper off, you know, by 245 00:17:41.759 --> 00:17:47.359 summer, when the growth gets a little bit more you know, tough and 246 00:17:47.799 --> 00:17:51.599 woody, rather than that really super soft spring growth, which they really really 247 00:17:51.640 --> 00:17:56.599 like. So this plant, this Kodiak orange darvilla, was developed by a 248 00:17:56.640 --> 00:18:00.759 gentleman by the name of Mike. I don't hope I don't miss pronounce his 249 00:18:00.799 --> 00:18:06.440 last name uckneat Uneat And you may not know his name, but I can 250 00:18:06.519 --> 00:18:08.720 almost assure you that you have grown some of his plants. Now, he's 251 00:18:08.759 --> 00:18:15.160 not normally a woody plant breeder. His most impressive breeding introductions have been annuals, 252 00:18:15.839 --> 00:18:19.200 and one of them is wave petunia. Oh yeah, now you know 253 00:18:19.279 --> 00:18:22.799 that's a huge one. Obviously, wave petunias are not the proven winners petunias 254 00:18:22.839 --> 00:18:26.640 we have the supertunias. Wave petunia is a different brand, but it has 255 00:18:26.680 --> 00:18:32.119 a similar sort of idea behind it, that it doesn't need deadheading, that 256 00:18:32.160 --> 00:18:36.039 it's very, very vigorous, much more heat tolerant than the older variety. 257 00:18:36.119 --> 00:18:38.680 So he was on the team that developed wave petunias, and he is also 258 00:18:38.720 --> 00:18:44.000 the person who developed all of the fabulous dragon wing begonias that are so popular 259 00:18:44.079 --> 00:18:48.599 right now. So some serious breeding chops. This is one of his earlier 260 00:18:48.640 --> 00:18:52.920 forays I think into woody plants. But we're really grateful to have it. 261 00:18:53.000 --> 00:18:56.799 And again it's a simple plant, but I think it's it's a really nice 262 00:18:56.839 --> 00:19:02.440 one to It can make a nice hedge, It could make even a taller 263 00:19:02.559 --> 00:19:07.400 edging, a good screening plant. I include it in my native plant you 264 00:19:07.400 --> 00:19:10.720 know borders, so it just kind of intermixes with all of my different native 265 00:19:10.759 --> 00:19:15.480 perennials. It does not need pruning, but you can prune it if you 266 00:19:15.519 --> 00:19:19.559 want so. In our trial gardens they do often prune it to kind of 267 00:19:19.640 --> 00:19:26.440 keep it a little bit more compact and shaped. So if you prefer that 268 00:19:26.480 --> 00:19:30.440 look, this can easily withstand pretty much as much pruning as you want to 269 00:19:30.480 --> 00:19:33.359 give it. I do prefer more of the natural, taller look, so 270 00:19:33.400 --> 00:19:37.519 I do not prune mine. Another thing great thing about darvilla is that it 271 00:19:37.599 --> 00:19:42.160 is quite shade tolerant, and certainly when you see it in the wild it's 272 00:19:42.200 --> 00:19:47.200 growing in sort of the edges of woods where it's it's typically quite shady. 273 00:19:47.839 --> 00:19:51.839 And if you grow it in too much shade, now the orange part of 274 00:19:51.920 --> 00:19:55.519 kodiac orange will be a little less orange, the plant will probably be a 275 00:19:55.559 --> 00:19:57.480 little bit more green. But you know, sometimes I think, you know, 276 00:19:57.480 --> 00:20:00.839 knowing if you have a lot of shade, just knowing what to expect, 277 00:20:02.000 --> 00:20:04.160 knowing that it will live, but maybe just not do you know the 278 00:20:04.279 --> 00:20:08.319 best not have as many flowers, not have as bright of an orange foliage, 279 00:20:08.319 --> 00:20:12.039 and certainly not have as good fall foliage. You know, plants like 280 00:20:12.079 --> 00:20:15.640 this are often a good choice when you have a situation like I do, 281 00:20:15.680 --> 00:20:18.160 where my front is half sun and half shade. So you want some symmetry. 282 00:20:18.720 --> 00:20:22.359 Yeah, it's a common thing, I think. So you want some 283 00:20:22.359 --> 00:20:25.160 symmetry, you want some cohesion. But what are you going to do when 284 00:20:25.160 --> 00:20:26.599 one side is very very sunny and one side is very shady? Will you 285 00:20:26.640 --> 00:20:32.400 get a plant like this or boxwood that can really take either of those conditions 286 00:20:32.400 --> 00:20:37.000 and then that kind of gives it that cohesiveness that people really like. That's 287 00:20:37.039 --> 00:20:42.799 fantastic. Did a little research, Stacy. The plants named or der Vella 288 00:20:44.079 --> 00:20:47.960 or deer vella, whatever you want to call it. Plants named after a 289 00:20:48.039 --> 00:20:53.519 French surgeon from the seventeen hundreds, doctor Marin dear Ville m. He was 290 00:20:53.559 --> 00:20:59.599 a botanist, a travel writer, and a French surgeon. Wow, busy 291 00:20:59.640 --> 00:21:03.279 guy. He was a busy guy, a real renaissance man. It's a 292 00:21:03.400 --> 00:21:07.680 very Francied plant. Now. I do use the name durvilla to describe this 293 00:21:07.720 --> 00:21:11.319 plant. I don't like its common names. The most popular common name that 294 00:21:11.359 --> 00:21:15.119 you will see on this plant is bush honeysuckle, and I don't like that 295 00:21:15.279 --> 00:21:21.559 because it's in the honeysuckle family, as I already said. But a lot 296 00:21:21.599 --> 00:21:25.039 of people they hear some honeysuckle and they immediately think we invasive, not going 297 00:21:25.079 --> 00:21:26.839 to grow it, and this is not an invasive plant. It's not going 298 00:21:26.880 --> 00:21:32.079 to self sew all over. Just because it's in the family doesn't mean that 299 00:21:32.079 --> 00:21:33.359 it is. In fact, the flowers aren't fragrant, which is what most 300 00:21:33.359 --> 00:21:37.119 people expect from a honeysuckle, so it's not going to be doing that either. 301 00:21:37.160 --> 00:21:42.359 So that's why we use the common name durvilla to refer to this excellent 302 00:21:42.440 --> 00:21:47.079 native plant. You can see pictures of it on our website, Gardening Simplified, 303 00:21:47.119 --> 00:21:49.720 on air dot com, or in another place that you might frequent Instagram 304 00:21:49.759 --> 00:21:55.680 because Gardening Simplified it now has an Instagram account Gardening Simplified Show if you were 305 00:21:55.720 --> 00:22:00.160 there, and we will be featuring the plant on trial every week so you 306 00:22:00.200 --> 00:22:03.359 don't have to go far to find out and see it. If you happen 307 00:22:03.359 --> 00:22:04.960 to listen to us on radio, We're going to take a little break. 308 00:22:06.000 --> 00:22:07.559 When we come back, we're opening up that gardening mail bag, so please 309 00:22:07.559 --> 00:22:18.680 stay tuned. At proven Winner's Color Choice, We've got a shrub for every 310 00:22:18.720 --> 00:22:22.799 taste and every space, whether you're looking for an easy care rose, an 311 00:22:22.880 --> 00:22:26.880 unforgettable hydrangea, or something new and unique. You can be confident that the 312 00:22:26.880 --> 00:22:30.920 shrubs and the white containers have been trialed and tested for your success. Look 313 00:22:30.960 --> 00:22:36.799 for them at your local garden center. Greetings, gardeners, and welcome back 314 00:22:36.839 --> 00:22:40.960 to the Gardening Simplified Show. It's time or we open up the Garden mail 315 00:22:41.000 --> 00:22:45.519 Bag and answer questions from gardeners across the country and in fact often around the 316 00:22:45.559 --> 00:22:49.240 world. And if you are a fan of the Garden mail Bag, like 317 00:22:49.359 --> 00:22:55.599 hearing about other people's problems in the garden and our answers to them, we 318 00:22:55.680 --> 00:22:57.920 are actually going to do an extra We're going to do a bonus episode of 319 00:22:59.079 --> 00:23:03.880 Just Guarden in Mailbag questions. I know, you know, I've We've had 320 00:23:03.920 --> 00:23:06.680 a lot of questions and they're all important. But when we can only do 321 00:23:06.759 --> 00:23:10.359 three in a show, that makes it really hard to like get to everybody. 322 00:23:11.000 --> 00:23:14.440 And so we're going to do a special episode of just Q and A. 323 00:23:14.720 --> 00:23:17.640 This is gonna be fun. I see London, I see France, 324 00:23:18.680 --> 00:23:22.359 I see problems with your plants. That's why we're here. It's really wondering 325 00:23:22.359 --> 00:23:29.039 where that was going, right, That's where it went. So the cameo, 326 00:23:30.559 --> 00:23:33.759 the all Mailbag episode is not going to be here on the radio, 327 00:23:34.160 --> 00:23:37.799 but it will be on your favorite podcast platform as well as on YouTube, 328 00:23:37.839 --> 00:23:41.000 so please check us out there if you would like to see that. You 329 00:23:41.000 --> 00:23:45.480 can also visit Gardening Simplified on air dot com and you can find it there. 330 00:23:45.559 --> 00:23:48.039 So what's in the mailbag today? All right? Shirley writes to us 331 00:23:48.079 --> 00:23:53.079 one, how does one prune a Wolf River apple tree to bear fruit? 332 00:23:53.519 --> 00:23:56.799 Our other apple trees fruit out, but we do not get fruit from the 333 00:23:56.839 --> 00:24:02.839 Wolf River tree. All the apple trees planted in twenty seventeen, they've got 334 00:24:02.920 --> 00:24:07.559 multiple apples and crab apples, so pollination shouldn't be an issue. They failed 335 00:24:07.559 --> 00:24:11.319 to see blossoms in spring. They just want to make sure that it's being 336 00:24:11.519 --> 00:24:18.240 pruned correctly, right, so I think. Now, I don't know. 337 00:24:18.400 --> 00:24:21.279 I'm not an apple expert by any stretch. Now, I did read that 338 00:24:21.279 --> 00:24:25.920 Wolf River apple was developed in Wisconsin, so should have good heartiness. But 339 00:24:26.079 --> 00:24:30.960 I do wonder if there's something about the actual sighting of this tree or something 340 00:24:30.000 --> 00:24:34.079 else where the blooms are getting frosted off every year. That's my suspicion. 341 00:24:34.200 --> 00:24:38.240 It's a hardy, what we'd call antique tree. You're right, Wolf River, 342 00:24:38.359 --> 00:24:45.640 Wisconsin, eighteen seventy five and super hardy, super cold hardy. So 343 00:24:45.880 --> 00:24:51.400 it's hard to figure out what's going on here with this tree. But I 344 00:24:51.440 --> 00:24:53.559 would tell you that I did a little research when I saw this question, 345 00:24:53.839 --> 00:24:56.720 and I see people out there with the same problem. Really, some I'm 346 00:24:56.759 --> 00:25:00.519 saying it's been six years. There were a few that said it's been twelve 347 00:25:00.640 --> 00:25:06.640 years. So I'm not so sure it's anything. Surely's doing wrong. I'm 348 00:25:06.640 --> 00:25:11.359 sure you're doing it right, surely, And I would tend to agree with 349 00:25:11.440 --> 00:25:15.039 you, Stacy that number one, it takes a while to establish to fruiting 350 00:25:15.119 --> 00:25:19.400 size. And number two, boy, those spring blooms, maybe we're losing 351 00:25:19.440 --> 00:25:22.400 it right. And you know, it could be that it just blooms earlier 352 00:25:22.559 --> 00:25:26.240 and they're getting you killed off by late frosts. You know, it's it's 353 00:25:26.240 --> 00:25:30.200 sort of one of those situations, not unlike big leaf hydrangels Hydrangel macrophila, 354 00:25:30.279 --> 00:25:36.039 where yes, the plant is hardy, but are those flower buds as hardy 355 00:25:36.079 --> 00:25:37.480 as the plant itself? I don't. I don't know. I'm not an 356 00:25:37.480 --> 00:25:41.799 apple expert, but that would be my suspicion that it is some sort of 357 00:25:41.880 --> 00:25:45.000 weather condition. And I know that doesn't make things easy. You've already got 358 00:25:45.039 --> 00:25:49.160 a bunch of time into your Wolf River apple. But it definitely sounds like 359 00:25:49.160 --> 00:25:52.279 Sureley knows what she's doing. She knows about pollination, she knows about pruning. 360 00:25:52.279 --> 00:25:56.279 If she's getting fruit on her other trees, and you know, maybe 361 00:25:56.279 --> 00:26:00.519 this one is just obstinate. I think it's going to take a little time. 362 00:26:00.720 --> 00:26:03.319 I really do, surely. Also as a question, what makes leaves 363 00:26:03.440 --> 00:26:08.200 on pear trees cup up? We have one young pear tree that has cupped 364 00:26:08.279 --> 00:26:14.640 leaves. It's planted near other pear trees that seem perfectly healthy. There's no 365 00:26:14.720 --> 00:26:18.920 obvious sign of insects or fungus treated with nem oil fertilized the trees. It's 366 00:26:19.000 --> 00:26:26.079 just not thriving and dropped its fruit in early summer. I would say, 367 00:26:26.160 --> 00:26:30.799 Stacy that if it dropped fruit in summer early summer, some fruit drop and 368 00:26:32.279 --> 00:26:37.519 the leaves are cupping. Sometimes that is a water indication with a pear tree. 369 00:26:37.559 --> 00:26:42.279 If there's no evidence of insects or disease, it could be a water 370 00:26:42.400 --> 00:26:45.200 issue in that spot. Yeah, you know, when a plant doesn't have 371 00:26:45.359 --> 00:26:48.759 enough water, it's like whoa, it can't support all this fruit. There 372 00:26:48.759 --> 00:26:51.880 you go, don't eat you anymore. I'm going into survival mode, not 373 00:26:51.920 --> 00:26:56.000 fruit ripening mode. And you know, even if you have a situation like 374 00:26:56.039 --> 00:26:59.400 surely does, where you have a number of trees and other ones are healthy, 375 00:26:59.440 --> 00:27:03.160 there can be so many different factors that aren't visible to the eye, 376 00:27:03.200 --> 00:27:07.720 whether it's underlying bedrock or another tree in that's not even necessarily super close to 377 00:27:07.759 --> 00:27:11.480 it, that is out competing it for water. And you know, when 378 00:27:11.519 --> 00:27:17.440 I research this question, did I find a host of answers or potential explanations. 379 00:27:17.960 --> 00:27:22.599 I saw drought stress, nutrient efficiency, herbicide drift, fungal diseases like 380 00:27:22.680 --> 00:27:30.079 anthracnose pests like the pair leaf curling midge. So surely suffice to say, 381 00:27:30.160 --> 00:27:34.240 we cannot give you anyone answer, but we can give you some guidance. 382 00:27:34.240 --> 00:27:37.160 And so I would say, this is definitely a great situation for your local 383 00:27:37.160 --> 00:27:41.960 cooperative extension. You know, I think that they're especially valuable when it comes 384 00:27:41.000 --> 00:27:45.920 to fruit because that's one of the things that they really specialize in. And 385 00:27:45.960 --> 00:27:48.079 if you do want to dive into it more online, I'm going to repeat 386 00:27:48.160 --> 00:27:52.559 my best advice for searching and finding reliable information on the internet, which is 387 00:27:52.559 --> 00:27:56.079 simply to type in your terms, you know, pair cupping leaves or pair 388 00:27:56.200 --> 00:28:00.839 weird foliage, however you want to say that, and then in cite si 389 00:28:00.960 --> 00:28:07.720 te colon dot edu. And that will limit your results to just university websites 390 00:28:07.839 --> 00:28:10.759 that are based on research and you don't have to weed through that. You 391 00:28:10.759 --> 00:28:14.680 know, with every person who has a gardening blog, you know, throwing 392 00:28:14.680 --> 00:28:18.279 out what they think it might be, you're actually finding some reputable information that 393 00:28:18.359 --> 00:28:21.759 you can hopefully use and put into action to improve that pair. Yeah, 394 00:28:21.799 --> 00:28:25.200 if it's a curling midge or disease, you're probably going to see it on 395 00:28:25.240 --> 00:28:29.200 the foliage, maybe browning margins or whatever it may be. If those leaves 396 00:28:29.200 --> 00:28:32.480 are green and cupping, we've got to go down a different rooms. Ye, 397 00:28:32.839 --> 00:28:37.000 all right, Karen writes to us Japanese beetles. Big problem for Karen, 398 00:28:37.440 --> 00:28:44.200 do you foresee new cultivars that will be Japanese beetles resistant? If you 399 00:28:44.240 --> 00:28:48.480 can now buy roses that are disease resistant, why not come up with ideas 400 00:28:48.559 --> 00:28:53.400 for resistance to beatles? Yay, good question, Kim. It's such a 401 00:28:53.400 --> 00:28:57.200 good question, and I can certainly seek why people would be like, well, 402 00:28:57.240 --> 00:29:00.359 gee, if you can accomplish all these other things things, And we 403 00:29:00.400 --> 00:29:03.599 do talk a lot about what plant breeding can accomplish, like why can't it 404 00:29:03.640 --> 00:29:07.359 do this? And so I thought about it, and you know, a 405 00:29:07.400 --> 00:29:11.039 lot of disease resistance does occur at the genetic level. And if something is 406 00:29:11.079 --> 00:29:15.000 controlled by a plant's genes, which disease resistant, Not just plants, but 407 00:29:15.480 --> 00:29:21.079 humans are very often their genes control whether they are more susceptible or less susceptible 408 00:29:21.079 --> 00:29:26.240 to certain diseases. Plant breeders can work with genes. They can identify which 409 00:29:26.480 --> 00:29:32.079 gene is causing the problem. They can work on modifying that gene or changing 410 00:29:32.079 --> 00:29:37.039 it or reducing its prevalence in the parentage by through selective breeding, and induce 411 00:29:37.079 --> 00:29:41.440 that disease resistance. Now, insect resistance is quite another story, because no 412 00:29:41.480 --> 00:29:48.359 plant is necessarily born resistant to insects, and insects are you know, basically 413 00:29:48.440 --> 00:29:51.960 non discriminating feeders. They're just like, I'm on this thing. Take a 414 00:29:51.960 --> 00:29:53.920 little bite, taste pretty good, I'll eat some more. And if they 415 00:29:55.079 --> 00:29:59.200 like it, they call others to join the party. It because the plant 416 00:29:59.200 --> 00:30:02.480 will start to emit hormones like hey, I'm in stress, and the insects 417 00:30:02.480 --> 00:30:04.400 are like, whoa looking for some stress plants to eat? Here you are, 418 00:30:04.480 --> 00:30:11.200 this is fantastic party time, And so that makes it more difficult. 419 00:30:11.319 --> 00:30:18.119 Now, we do know that Japanese beetles do tend to prefer roses that have 420 00:30:18.279 --> 00:30:23.319 thinner foliage, So roses that have thicker glossier, more leathery foliage are definitely 421 00:30:23.519 --> 00:30:29.200 less preferred by Japanese beetles. But I would not go so far as to 422 00:30:29.240 --> 00:30:33.000 say they are Japanese beetle resistant, because what I think would happen, since 423 00:30:33.079 --> 00:30:37.440 Japanese beetles love roses so much, is that say you said, okay, 424 00:30:37.880 --> 00:30:41.519 you find this rose, someone says, hey, this is Japanese beetle resistant. 425 00:30:41.519 --> 00:30:44.599 You take out all your other roses, you put this new you know, 426 00:30:44.640 --> 00:30:48.000 supposedly Japanese beetle resistant rose in there. They love roses. They're just 427 00:30:48.000 --> 00:30:51.920 going to eat it. You know, just because you don't see them on 428 00:30:51.960 --> 00:30:56.160 it doesn't mean that they won't eat it. They're opportunistic. So it's a 429 00:30:56.200 --> 00:31:00.599 lot harder, even though we can can select for certain qualities that are less 430 00:31:00.599 --> 00:31:04.359 appealing to insects, testing for it, ruling out all the possibilities as to 431 00:31:04.440 --> 00:31:11.160 why it might have been eaten less one year than other roses is unfortunately nearly 432 00:31:11.400 --> 00:31:15.359 impossible. So in the meantime, just keep smashing those Japanese beetles, tell 433 00:31:15.400 --> 00:31:18.559 your friends to do the same, and maybe eventually if we all pitch in, 434 00:31:19.200 --> 00:31:22.559 well manage to control it. I'm a dreamer. Well, you know, 435 00:31:22.640 --> 00:31:27.640 with roses, it's the aromatic oils and the flowers, and yeah, 436 00:31:27.680 --> 00:31:33.119 you know you're gonna have that. The beetles just love them so and the 437 00:31:33.240 --> 00:31:37.200 larva become adults and just start feeding on roses. Yeah, they're tired of 438 00:31:37.240 --> 00:31:42.680 being grubby. I don't know. Hey, a question from Cleopatra. Michaeleb 439 00:31:44.519 --> 00:31:49.240 that Cleopatra. That's fabulous, and I hope I pronounced it right. I've 440 00:31:49.359 --> 00:31:52.839 ordered from you before, loved what I receive. Why can't I go online 441 00:31:52.839 --> 00:31:57.519 and order from you anymore? I have the Gardening Simplified issue number nine, 442 00:31:57.559 --> 00:32:00.200 and I love it. So this is such a great question and I can 443 00:32:00.240 --> 00:32:04.240 answer it pretty quickly. Now, I do want to say, Gardening Simplified 444 00:32:04.279 --> 00:32:07.160 is the name of our show. It's also the name of the landscape guide 445 00:32:07.160 --> 00:32:10.200 that Proven Winners Colored Choice Shrubs puts out every other year. So we just 446 00:32:10.240 --> 00:32:14.920 had one that came out this past year. That's the one yep. And 447 00:32:15.000 --> 00:32:17.480 so that is not a catalog of things that you can order. It's a 448 00:32:17.480 --> 00:32:22.440 look at all of our plants. But all Proven Winners shrubs are actually sold 449 00:32:22.480 --> 00:32:27.519 in garden centers or online, and so we don't sell them directly. So 450 00:32:27.559 --> 00:32:30.839 where we come here in this studio a from Proven Winners Color Choice Shrubs, 451 00:32:30.079 --> 00:32:34.000 we are not a place where you can actually buy them. Instead, you 452 00:32:34.039 --> 00:32:37.480 actually have to go to your local garden center. So even though a booklet 453 00:32:37.559 --> 00:32:40.359 like Gardening Simplified, we'll tell you what we have so you can go look 454 00:32:40.359 --> 00:32:44.599 for it at your garden center, it's not someplace that you can order from. 455 00:32:44.640 --> 00:32:46.759 And if you can't find what you want at your local garden center, 456 00:32:46.839 --> 00:32:51.319 please do you ask them. They can usually order what you want from the 457 00:32:51.359 --> 00:32:54.680 person who supplies them with Proven Winners Color Choice Shrubs. Now we have got 458 00:32:54.680 --> 00:33:05.079 a guest waiting for branching news, so please stay tuned. The Gardening Simplified 459 00:33:05.119 --> 00:33:08.599 Show is brought to you by Proven Winners Color Choice Shrubs. Our award winning 460 00:33:08.640 --> 00:33:14.240 flowering shrubs and evergreens have been trialed and tested for your success, so you 461 00:33:14.359 --> 00:33:17.640 enjoy more beauty and less work. Look for proven winners color choice shrubs in 462 00:33:17.640 --> 00:33:24.319 the distinctive white container at your local garden center. Welcome back to the Gardening 463 00:33:24.359 --> 00:33:29.119 Simplified Show. It's time for branching news and excited about today We're going to 464 00:33:29.200 --> 00:33:35.799 talk about garden trends twenty twenty four and talking to Katie Dubal. Katie is 465 00:33:35.880 --> 00:33:40.119 the second president of the Garden Media Group, a women owned and run public 466 00:33:40.200 --> 00:33:46.039 relations firm that specializes in the home and garden industry, celebrating more than thirty 467 00:33:46.240 --> 00:33:52.880 years of business, and they author an annual Garden Trends Report. I love 468 00:33:53.039 --> 00:33:59.400 reading this report every year, and it's around this time of the year that 469 00:33:59.480 --> 00:34:02.400 the report it comes out. Now, Katie travels the world, scouting and 470 00:34:02.480 --> 00:34:08.920 presenting garden trends to audiences from Italy to Chicago. Katie lives in Westchester, 471 00:34:09.079 --> 00:34:15.079 Pennsylvania, and her goal is to convince people that brown thumbs can in fact 472 00:34:15.440 --> 00:34:20.079 be turned green. Boy, that seems like a good mission to me. 473 00:34:20.280 --> 00:34:23.880 Katie. Welcome to the Gardening Simplified Show. Thanks so much, it's good 474 00:34:23.920 --> 00:34:28.880 to be here. It's great to have you on the show and talking garden 475 00:34:28.960 --> 00:34:31.760 trends for twenty twenty four, and I had the opportunity to see you speak 476 00:34:31.800 --> 00:34:37.599 in Ohio earlier this year. The seven trends, if I'm correct, that 477 00:34:37.840 --> 00:34:45.199 you are releasing this year, are buying power or to futurism, delight in 478 00:34:45.239 --> 00:34:50.480 the dark, bugging out, hanging in there, nature calls, and a 479 00:34:50.559 --> 00:34:55.119 color of the year. So let's dive into that and maybe start with buying 480 00:34:55.159 --> 00:35:00.199 power. Who's buying all these plants out there in twenty twenty four? Oh 481 00:35:00.239 --> 00:35:04.760 sure, yeah, so I love the way our trends. Just for those 482 00:35:04.760 --> 00:35:07.880 of you who I know you'll you'll plug how to download it. But at 483 00:35:07.880 --> 00:35:12.639 guard Media groups dot com back to last trends. But the way that we've 484 00:35:12.679 --> 00:35:15.400 done it this year is that you actually pick a persona that works for you. 485 00:35:15.519 --> 00:35:20.280 So if you go through them, you'll see different words. So the 486 00:35:20.400 --> 00:35:24.480 words for buying power are digital, influential, and humble, and we call 487 00:35:24.559 --> 00:35:29.719 them the Zoomer generation, so gen Z and the little play on words for 488 00:35:29.800 --> 00:35:35.320 the boomers. But interestingly enough, all the data shows at gen Z is 489 00:35:35.400 --> 00:35:40.760 buying houses ahead of generations before them, so they have greater percentages. Thirty 490 00:35:40.800 --> 00:35:46.000 percent actually of that twenty five year old group now own their home compared to 491 00:35:46.000 --> 00:35:51.360 twenty seven percent of Gen z's or Gen xers and twenty eight of millennials of 492 00:35:51.400 --> 00:35:54.679 that same age, So they're ahead of the curve there in buying their homes, 493 00:35:54.679 --> 00:36:00.599 which, as we know in the landscape corticulture green industry is great for 494 00:36:00.719 --> 00:36:04.679 us because when you're investing in your home, you're investing in your landscape. 495 00:36:04.840 --> 00:36:08.400 But there's another little new thing here that we're looking at is that old pandemic. 496 00:36:08.679 --> 00:36:15.000 And because this generation in particular has worked from home for a big chunk 497 00:36:15.119 --> 00:36:20.639 of their career, they're willing to send more money on things around the home. 498 00:36:20.800 --> 00:36:23.840 So they want that fancy stand up desk and that real ergonomic chair, 499 00:36:24.280 --> 00:36:29.440 but they also are willing to invest more in their landscapes and the products that 500 00:36:29.480 --> 00:36:35.320 go along with that landscape containers, premate containers, plants and things that go 501 00:36:35.480 --> 00:36:38.760 outdoors, plus of course the things that swoop up their office indoors. Right, 502 00:36:38.800 --> 00:36:43.400 you got to have a good zoom background for all those remote meetings you 503 00:36:43.400 --> 00:36:49.440 can have outdoors. Impress them with your garden exactly. Is this a group, 504 00:36:49.960 --> 00:36:57.480 Katie, I recall within the trends you talking about echo anxiety. Is 505 00:36:57.519 --> 00:37:02.400 this a group that experiences this or is this everybody in general that drives us 506 00:37:02.480 --> 00:37:06.960 to put more plants in the ground and enjoy gardening the way we do. 507 00:37:07.960 --> 00:37:13.239 No, you're right, sixty seven percent of Americans eighteen to twenty three experienced 508 00:37:13.280 --> 00:37:16.239 that eco anxiety. And I have a lot of teachers in my family from 509 00:37:16.239 --> 00:37:21.199 you know, preschool up to the college level, and when I was telling 510 00:37:21.199 --> 00:37:24.159 them about the Trends report, they all really identify with the fact that they're 511 00:37:24.280 --> 00:37:30.519 young students experienced this kind of hopelessness that they feel like what have we been 512 00:37:30.559 --> 00:37:34.639 handed? Like why would you hand the parable climate down to us? And 513 00:37:34.840 --> 00:37:37.679 what can we do about it? So you're right that this generation's experience is 514 00:37:37.760 --> 00:37:43.360 kind of this black luster attitude about what can we do? And so one 515 00:37:43.400 --> 00:37:46.239 of our overarching trends is called eco optimism, and that's what the whole report 516 00:37:46.320 --> 00:37:50.280 is about. All of our trends by back to that, and we really 517 00:37:50.280 --> 00:37:53.639 hope that, you know, part of the mantle of us as horticulturists, 518 00:37:53.639 --> 00:38:00.199 as scientists, as landscapers communicators is that we spread the positive news of about 519 00:38:00.199 --> 00:38:02.480 the joy that gardening can bring and all the other data that's great out there. 520 00:38:02.480 --> 00:38:08.639 There's really positive data and climate facts real science based facts that things are 521 00:38:08.679 --> 00:38:13.320 happening in a positive way. But of course that's not a sensational thing that 522 00:38:13.360 --> 00:38:17.159 the media wants to support. So we really urge a lot all of the 523 00:38:17.519 --> 00:38:22.719 companies out there to be those harving years of that positive news. Is that 524 00:38:22.800 --> 00:38:27.480 part of the reason, Katie, that there's so much interest in insects and 525 00:38:27.679 --> 00:38:31.239 pollinators. Also there certainly seems to be a lot of interest in insects, 526 00:38:31.360 --> 00:38:35.159 to be honest, you know, every year we try to put pollinators in 527 00:38:35.159 --> 00:38:38.639 our trends, even though what is it five years now, honey nut ceios 528 00:38:38.679 --> 00:38:44.559 took to be off of the box of curios to raise awareness about the decline 529 00:38:44.559 --> 00:38:49.039 of pollinators. So it's not really a trend anymore. It's here people understand 530 00:38:49.079 --> 00:38:52.800 that there is insect decline. I've been seeing a meme lately about how to 531 00:38:52.800 --> 00:38:54.840 turn your life out if you've been seeing that, like different faults you can 532 00:38:54.880 --> 00:38:59.920 buy that are more insects friendly. So I think that that's kind of more 533 00:39:00.159 --> 00:39:05.000 mainstream now. So every year we are challenged to put something in our reports 534 00:39:05.239 --> 00:39:08.719 that is current, but also the field taps into that passion that people have 535 00:39:08.840 --> 00:39:13.360 for insects, and this year the trend is called bugging out, and what 536 00:39:13.360 --> 00:39:16.880 we've really seen is a rise of not just bug the core inside, not 537 00:39:16.960 --> 00:39:22.519 just you know, a bug on a wall, the tax to Journey classic 538 00:39:22.559 --> 00:39:29.639 ones, but really super realistic displays. So the rugs that have these moths 539 00:39:29.760 --> 00:39:34.199 and beetles and they actually look real. They're not that qute honey nut cheerios 540 00:39:34.239 --> 00:39:38.800 b anymore. And so it's helping people understand that and appreciate. Let's hope 541 00:39:38.960 --> 00:39:44.000 that indoors, if they can live with that beetle or live with that mob, 542 00:39:44.280 --> 00:39:47.440 they'll be more accepting of it outdoors. Absolutely. Now, tell me 543 00:39:47.480 --> 00:39:54.440 about hort to futurism. I'm probably mispronouncing it, but hord of futurism. 544 00:39:54.719 --> 00:39:59.440 It kind of sounds sci fi to me. What's that all? You got 545 00:39:59.480 --> 00:40:01.400 it exactlete. Well, when we do hide trend support, you know, 546 00:40:01.599 --> 00:40:05.400 we don't just make it up. We do a lot of research and we 547 00:40:05.440 --> 00:40:09.480 look at the you know, the western markets in China and you see they've 548 00:40:09.480 --> 00:40:14.920 reported a fifty percent year on year increase in sci fi profits their film and 549 00:40:15.000 --> 00:40:17.000 TV. So we say, oh, there's got to be something there if 550 00:40:17.039 --> 00:40:21.639 that market is blowing up in sci fi, and look at our own you 551 00:40:21.639 --> 00:40:23.760 know, The Last of Us where we're all being eaten by a deadly mushroom 552 00:40:23.800 --> 00:40:29.679 and they're a fun gui. So it's we are obsessed with that science fiction. 553 00:40:29.840 --> 00:40:32.800 But the one thing that we see really different here is when we all 554 00:40:34.079 --> 00:40:37.440 picture maybe the future or sci fi, it has traditionally been a very cold 555 00:40:37.880 --> 00:40:43.960 metal like I Robot style, But actually when we're seeing these things come to 556 00:40:44.039 --> 00:40:46.440 play now, they're filled with color. They're bright, and they're bold, 557 00:40:46.519 --> 00:40:52.760 and they have flowers everywhere. There's a fantastic exhibit that's actually right now happening 558 00:40:52.760 --> 00:41:00.000 in Asia, and it is where you walk through the into the have a 559 00:41:00.400 --> 00:41:05.360 cousin who just went to Japan. You walk through the exhibited, super immersive. 560 00:41:05.719 --> 00:41:07.480 It's called Team Labs. Sorry I couldn't remember the name Team Labs. 561 00:41:07.519 --> 00:41:13.320 You walk through the exhibited barefoot in six inches of water and it's mirrored, 562 00:41:13.639 --> 00:41:16.920 but you're surrounded by plants. Every room is different plants, so it's this 563 00:41:17.039 --> 00:41:22.280 immersive experience. Philadel Philadelphia Flower Show this year, the Garden Electric. It 564 00:41:22.320 --> 00:41:28.880 was a mix of neon floor to feeling lights with horticulture. We're seeing a 565 00:41:28.880 --> 00:41:32.559 lot of different displays at garden centers. The South Coast Batanical Garden has an 566 00:41:32.559 --> 00:41:37.519 event called Astra Lumina, and it's pushing that envelope of our traditional garden light 567 00:41:37.559 --> 00:41:42.320 displays. We all love our holiday light displays at our public gardens, but 568 00:41:42.360 --> 00:41:46.159 they're really pushing those boundaries. So we're seeing so many more ways of looking 569 00:41:46.199 --> 00:41:52.559 at horticulture that's more futuristic, that get that taps into what we're seeing in 570 00:41:52.719 --> 00:41:58.199 pop culture this size by type of attitude adventures. I'm concerned about one of 571 00:41:58.239 --> 00:42:04.760 the trends in the report, and that is dark gardens or Halloween gardens, 572 00:42:04.840 --> 00:42:09.719 or Victorian gardens or goth gardening, or plants that are like half dead. 573 00:42:09.800 --> 00:42:15.519 And to me, that does not sound like job security for me, I 574 00:42:15.559 --> 00:42:21.280 want to help people grow playing what's the deal? Sure well, this one 575 00:42:21.360 --> 00:42:25.639 was actually born out of a conversation that I had with the director of horticulture 576 00:42:25.679 --> 00:42:30.719 at the Oakland Oakland Cemetery down in Atlanta. And her name is Abram Lee, 577 00:42:30.840 --> 00:42:34.920 and she's a dear friend of mine. She just recently became their director 578 00:42:35.440 --> 00:42:38.199 border culture, and she says that you would not believe how cemeteries have become 579 00:42:38.199 --> 00:42:43.079 the third space. I'm sure we all know this term Starbucks point that you 580 00:42:43.119 --> 00:42:45.599 know the place. It's not your home, it's not your office. Where 581 00:42:45.599 --> 00:42:47.800 do you hang out? And she said, you wouldn't believe the number of 582 00:42:47.920 --> 00:42:52.679 we talked about these zoomers in particular, but the number of people who are 583 00:42:52.760 --> 00:42:57.559 walking the cemetery, walking their dogs, taking yoga classes. You know, 584 00:42:57.599 --> 00:43:00.559 the cemeteries were once on the outskirt of our modern cities. But as our 585 00:43:00.559 --> 00:43:07.119 cities grew, so did the population, and they engulfed these cemeteries and became 586 00:43:07.559 --> 00:43:12.639 these giants, let's sake free public parks in the parts of Atlanta and the 587 00:43:12.679 --> 00:43:16.760 heart of Philadelphia and the heart of Massachusetts or Boston. So they're becoming third 588 00:43:16.800 --> 00:43:22.480 spaces. So I'd got really into the idea of what people experience as they 589 00:43:22.519 --> 00:43:27.320 walk around that cemetery. And what we love about that is it's not just 590 00:43:27.599 --> 00:43:31.599 you're looking at the history to the people the past, but also the plants. 591 00:43:31.639 --> 00:43:37.320 Some of our modern directors of horticulture of these cemeteries are really into kind 592 00:43:37.599 --> 00:43:40.320 in historical plants with the people who are buried there, or as they call 593 00:43:40.400 --> 00:43:45.440 them in Oakland, their residence. So if you started to research this this 594 00:43:45.679 --> 00:43:50.119 more, I realize that there actually is a big trend right now of people's 595 00:43:50.159 --> 00:43:53.719 obsession with kind of this. Gop Wednesday, the show Wednesday with a big 596 00:43:53.800 --> 00:43:59.760 hit on Netflix of famous football player did a darkness retreat where he spent two 597 00:43:59.840 --> 00:44:04.840 days in complete darkness and silence. You look on TikTok, the skult Pasta. 598 00:44:05.159 --> 00:44:08.800 It is just across all different types of industries. We had this obsession 599 00:44:08.880 --> 00:44:13.559 with darkness and then I don't know rick it. When you were at Cultivate, 600 00:44:13.599 --> 00:44:17.599 you noticed lots of dark foliags, lots of dark plants were being released 601 00:44:17.599 --> 00:44:22.760 this year. Even at Far West there was a collection of dark foliage plants 602 00:44:22.800 --> 00:44:27.599 that was announced, the brand new collection. So the consumer is taking this 603 00:44:27.760 --> 00:44:31.840 passion of Conada's darkness and they're getting furious. They want more of this dark 604 00:44:31.840 --> 00:44:37.039 few plants, blood red plants, stark peeling on trees, eeries, spooky, 605 00:44:37.480 --> 00:44:40.880 not just a Halloween, but they're wanting it all year round. Wow, 606 00:44:42.440 --> 00:44:46.840 that's interesting. I visited Cape cod this past summer and it was fun 607 00:44:46.960 --> 00:44:52.679 walking through the cemeteries. I thought it was very interesting. Same thing in 608 00:44:52.840 --> 00:44:55.400 Boston, but I didn't know that I was trendy. I guess as far 609 00:44:55.440 --> 00:45:00.239 as dark plants are concerned, yeah, you see that on Pinterest. Also 610 00:45:00.280 --> 00:45:06.639 it's a trend. Yeah, so hanging in there, hanging baskets. Containers 611 00:45:06.719 --> 00:45:09.400 still still a hot trend, right, Yeah. They can't ignore the fact 612 00:45:09.400 --> 00:45:15.920 that container gardens are huge. The National Gardening Association survey that it was a 613 00:45:15.960 --> 00:45:19.920 two hundred percent increase in people contain our gardening last year. And when we 614 00:45:19.960 --> 00:45:22.039 look at that number, we thought, Lord have mercy, that is a 615 00:45:22.159 --> 00:45:30.119 huge increase a spend of let's spend seventy two point seventy two dollars up from 616 00:45:30.119 --> 00:45:32.320 twenty two, up twenty two dollars in the last year. And this is 617 00:45:32.440 --> 00:45:37.320 actually jen X who get often ignored when we talk about, you know, 618 00:45:37.880 --> 00:45:43.000 generations and demographics, but it's the gen xers who are spending the most on 619 00:45:43.119 --> 00:45:45.519 containers. But it can't just be containers. Yes, containers are hot, 620 00:45:45.760 --> 00:45:49.880 but what we really are looking at here is the way that people are we 621 00:45:50.039 --> 00:45:53.719 using more plants into their life so they can't can't get anymore on their deck, 622 00:45:53.760 --> 00:45:58.920 they can hang plants to maximize the space and the plants in their home. 623 00:45:59.239 --> 00:46:00.840 And we love this friend. We love seeing it because of course it's 624 00:46:00.920 --> 00:46:05.760 it's healthier for the plant and it's a binding or trailing plant, it has 625 00:46:05.800 --> 00:46:09.559 more room to grow, let mold or mildew around it. And then of 626 00:46:09.559 --> 00:46:13.960 course as a social media star, when you take pictures of your plants, 627 00:46:14.079 --> 00:46:17.800 a vertical picture performs better on social and a horizontal picture, so it's going 628 00:46:17.840 --> 00:46:22.159 to get more play online. So we just think this trend is here to 629 00:46:22.239 --> 00:46:24.519 say that people are going to be maximized. You see those memes online, 630 00:46:24.559 --> 00:46:29.519 it's like just the to the garden center and the trug is filled with plants 631 00:46:29.519 --> 00:46:32.199 and you can't see the person. People want more plants, and this trend 632 00:46:32.239 --> 00:46:36.320 we see is just a way to give them more access and more space. 633 00:46:36.760 --> 00:46:39.559 I'll tell you what, Katie, don't forget about us baby bloomers. Also 634 00:46:39.760 --> 00:46:44.760 because we like hanging baskets and containers because we don't have to bend over to 635 00:46:44.880 --> 00:46:52.400 maintain it exactly. So when the water totally stacy. One of the fabulous 636 00:46:52.400 --> 00:46:57.559 flowering shrubs that we talk about on the Gardening Simplify show is Limelight and the 637 00:46:57.559 --> 00:47:02.519 new introductions of Limelight, and you're saying that cyber lime and lime is the 638 00:47:02.559 --> 00:47:07.639 color. Lime is a vivid, punchy, powerful that's a that's a color 639 00:47:07.760 --> 00:47:12.880 shades of green and lime for twenty twenty four. Correct, Yeah, yeah, 640 00:47:13.079 --> 00:47:15.000 Well, when we do the research on this, we look at trend 641 00:47:15.039 --> 00:47:20.280 forecasting firms and everywhere you turned it was green, green, green. And 642 00:47:20.320 --> 00:47:22.760 the reason that they cited non industry related people, right, they said, 643 00:47:22.760 --> 00:47:28.119 it's sause it's harmony with nature. But when we really we've already picked green, 644 00:47:28.239 --> 00:47:30.079 and because we're in the industry, we've really learned to hone in on 645 00:47:30.119 --> 00:47:35.039 that color and saying, well, what shade of green exactly do we think 646 00:47:35.079 --> 00:47:38.320 we'll be trending, And both indoors and out, we think that cyber lime 647 00:47:38.519 --> 00:47:43.079 because look, we talked about forty futurism. We think these ideas of these 648 00:47:43.199 --> 00:47:46.320 right neond are going to be trending. So it's the brightest green you can 649 00:47:46.360 --> 00:47:50.679 get. Someone the other day that it reminded them of permit of frog. 650 00:47:51.119 --> 00:47:54.320 But I like your lemon, your lime light. And of course where we 651 00:47:54.360 --> 00:47:59.280 talk about house plants, people always want to know what's trending with house plants. 652 00:47:58.960 --> 00:48:05.119 Indoors, we see this lime green taking over the peak color interiors as 653 00:48:05.119 --> 00:48:08.639 well. Interesting. Well, thanks for your time, Katie, appreciate it. 654 00:48:08.639 --> 00:48:12.400 By the way, I want to mention to you that NFL player who 655 00:48:12.440 --> 00:48:19.079 spent time in darkness was Aaron Rodgers Rogers who went to the New York Jets 656 00:48:19.119 --> 00:48:23.360 and last night was injured in his first game and they're not so sure he's 657 00:48:23.400 --> 00:48:27.559 going to play again this year. So kind of a sad thing for all 658 00:48:27.599 --> 00:48:30.079 those New York Jets fans out there. Not me. I'm a Celia Eagles 659 00:48:30.119 --> 00:48:34.440 for all the way. That's what I was trying to draw out of you 660 00:48:34.559 --> 00:48:38.960 and find out where you stood. Her name is Katie Daboo and Katie is 661 00:48:39.000 --> 00:48:45.119 the second president of Garden Media Group, a women owned and run public relations 662 00:48:45.119 --> 00:48:49.400 firm specializing in the home and garden industry. We appreciate you being out there, 663 00:48:49.559 --> 00:48:52.000 Katie and bringing us up to speed on some of these trends for twenty 664 00:48:52.039 --> 00:48:54.840 twenty four. Oh well, you're welcome. Thanks so much for having me. 665 00:48:55.079 --> 00:49:00.280 Thanks Katie, have a wonderful day. Wow. That was fascinating and 666 00:49:00.320 --> 00:49:01.679 that was a lot of information. We couldn't get it all on the radio 667 00:49:01.719 --> 00:49:06.000 show, So listen to the podcast or check us out on YouTube if you 668 00:49:06.000 --> 00:49:08.440 want to listen to the entire trends report and everything that Katie Dubow has to 669 00:49:08.480 --> 00:49:13.000 say about it. In the meantime, we thank you for listening, thanks 670 00:49:13.039 --> 00:49:15.039 to Adriana for Rick, and wishing you a great week in the garden ahead.