WEBVTT

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Hold You is both. It showed
people say good money to see this movie.

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When they go out to a theater, they want cold sodas, hot

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popcorn, and no monsters in the
protection booth. Everyone pretend podcasting isn't boring,

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n it off. Tycho drumming goes
back thousands of years. But why

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aren't there more professional tycho players that
are women that are making careers for themselves.

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They're not part of the existing books
and documentary trees, and if they

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are, they're a footnote or they're
a side note. They're not part of

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the main story. Gorgeous. It's
my dream project to make a concert where

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you bring the best female taycho artists
from Japan and from North America together and

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fill the stage and make it incredible. Quick women center stage. It's okay,

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we're really doing this. Yeah,
so now it's gonna happen. I

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was like, I'm so happy here
you training, you chain, and you

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chrain, and you chrain and you
get this incredible experience. But this experience

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is forged in suffering. It's about
making space and celebrating something that's already there.

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Hey, folks, welcome to a
special episode of the Projection Booth.

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I'm your host Mike White. On
this episode, I'm talking with directors Don

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Michelson and Carrie Pickett, as well
as their documentary subject, Jennifer. We're

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all about the film Finding Her Beat. It is all about tycho drumming in

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the Midwest, specifically up Minnesota.
It is a great documentary and you can

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find out more about it at her
beatfilm dot com. Definitely check it out,

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and I hope you enjoyed the interview. Carrie and Donald, I'll start

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with you. Can you tell me
how you met each other and how you

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started working together. Carrie and I
met through an organization called film Fetel's chapters

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all over the world and we have
one in Minnesota. We met through that

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organization and I'd always wanted to work
with Carrie. She has an amazing eye.

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She has a background. She can
tell you this, but she has

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a background as a self photographer a
note. She's been all over the world

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and it has done amazing things.
And so I was lucky enough to know

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her. And then when Jen asked
me to have lunch with her to talk

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about this concert that she was going
to be putting on on the show in

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a couple of years, it became
very clear that Carrie was the person that

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I wanted to work with on this. What happened with Jen is that Jen

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wanted me to film the concert,
just to document the event. And the

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more we talked about it, in
the idea of all these women coming from

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around the world and spending time together
and living together for the first time,

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and what a historic event this was
going to be, I was like,

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Jen, this is a film,
this is a movement. We want to

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see how this all comes together,
and if this comes together and all of

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that. And so luckily Jen is
a person who says yes to exciting ideas.

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That is how she rolls, and
so she said, yes, let's

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do this. And then I reached
out to Carrie and said, hey,

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carry what are your plans for the
next few years? Carrie, what were

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your thoughts when you heard about this? First of all, yay to be

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able to work with Don and two
my other films, I had really been

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wearing most of all the hats,
and so it was an incredibly exciting opportunity

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to do a film in cinemabarity where
we would have two cameras at least on

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each side of the ocean and try
and be able to tell this story as

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the story unfolded. There's a lot
of different ways to do a documentary,

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and we chose the most difficult way, which is to really not impose any

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of our own ideas on the film, but let it emerge from the journey

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of these amazing, badass women realizing
their dreams with these big drums. And

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I jumped at the opportunity, and
also just it was a great opportunity to

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try and do something really hard,
and so when you do something really hard,

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the reward is tremendous when it works
out, and so I feel really

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happy to have been able to follow
Jen Megan how along with Don on this

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incredible journey. Jen, how did
you get involved with Tycho drumming. I'm

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a creed adoptee and I grew up
in North Dakota, so I didn't really

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have any exposure to Asian American culture
or community, and so I moved to

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the Twin Cities, Minneapolis, Saint
Paul, and I wanted to be an

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actor. But fortunately the director of
the theater company that I was working with,

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Rich Yomi, was also a Frooked
former tycho player, and so he

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incorporated Tycho drumming in a play,
and that was the first time I saw

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it. He rolled it in as
a demonstration in a fundraising event and he

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played a drum for maybe a minute, and that was it. Like,

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it totally hooked me. I'd never
seen anything as dynamic and engaging and as

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exciting as that, and so I
started out just wanting to learn, and

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then decades later, it's become my
life's Don said that you two had lunch

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together to start this project off.
How were you aware of her? Oh,

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cook ahead, This is wonderful.
Don and I go back. We

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knew each other in our early twenties. She was the freshman college roommate of

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my ex wife, so wake up. And I've always admired her work and

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that the amazing projects that she would
take on, and I had no concept

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of how that was even possible.
So it's been such such a delight to

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have this project to collaborate with and
to see her work in progress, and

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to get to know Carrie and be
exposed to this whole world of documentary filmmaking.

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It's quite incredible, and everyone I've
met along the way has been really

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inspiring. Yeah, you talked about
not imposing limits on this and just letting

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things flow. How did you find
the way as this kind of came together.

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I would say that one of the
things we did as we did a

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Kickstarter, we raised enough funds to
send a production crew to Japan, and

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that was really key in terms of
following several of the key artists from Japan

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and being able to do that way
ahead of the main event. And so

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we knew that we were building towards
an event and that things would happen,

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but it was anyone's guess on how
it would roll out, specifically Tiko through

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the same theater company theater move that
Jen was talking about. But really I

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learned as we were going along the
way the nuances. When I got to

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Japan, it was really cool to
see that a number of the people we

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were following represented both the ancient,
beautiful traditional art form of tycho and then

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also the I'm taking tycho and making
it a rock star concert view of tycho.

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And so I didn't realize before we
left how we would be encompassing all

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these different styles of tycho, and
that how all the women in the film

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would be these amazing leaders. And
so I learned a lot about tycho and

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I also learned to be able to
film in a language that I don't understand.

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Harry had very good instincts for finding
these intimate or special moments that you

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could feel were happening even though you
didn't know what was being said, and

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you couldn't stop film me to ask, so that I thought that was very

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impressive. She also had Shiho Rikata
who was there filming with her in Japan,

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who did speak Japanese, which was
andy, but yeah, and that

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was that's part of I think the
bigger vision of this film is that we

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really wanted this film to reflect the
goals of the concert, and that was

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to raise up performers, artists to
are normally sideline but our masters at what

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they do. And we decided very
early on that our crew would be made

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up almost entirely of female, non
binary, queer and Asian filmmakers and stuck

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to that throughout the production. And
it was an incredible experience in terms of

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having a crew that was so invested
in the story because they saw themselves in

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front of the camera. It wasn't
just a gig, this was this is

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my life too, this is my
struggle, this is what I feel when

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I'm told that I can't do a
thing, or I get sidelined and some

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guy grows up on the stage or
some guy I gets the camera. So

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I think that was really key to
it. I think the other thing that

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was key to putting this all together
was the collaboration with Jen and Taiko or

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It's Midwest and just We've talked about
this a lot between ourselves, but how

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collaborative this art form is that documentary, particularly when you're working with marginalized communities,

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it's so important to be working in
partnership rather than saying we've gone all

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the ideas and we're just going to
make a thing about you. Now,

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this is us making a thing together, and the film would not be It

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would not be without them without Tigo
Arts Midwest and Jen and Megan, and

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they were the ones who were like
shake, oklay, these are the people

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we need in Japan. They are
the ones that are going to bring it

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home because this is their world.
And I just have to say too that

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as you could tell with Carrie and
Don that they created such an atmosphere trust,

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which was really important because all of
these artists were coming together in a

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way that was probably terrifying for them. Everyone was outside of their comfort zone.

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But yet they also had this understanding
that this is like precious time,

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precious air, precious moment in history
that we were creating, and now it's

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forever there, Like for so long
these folks have been missing out of the

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story and out of the narrative of
what tycho is and can be, and

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now they're center stage, and now
you can because of what Carrion Conda did,

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you can't take that away like it's
going to be there now forever.

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And I really just appreciate their approach
in letting their stories emerge organically, because

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I think so many of them have
had their stories co opted or just erased,

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and so it was I just think
the integrity, even from our first

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conversation at that lunch, made it
clear that they understood the best way to

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approach this. You talk about that
whole marginalization. Did anybody ever try to

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tell you, Jen, you shouldn't
be playing these drums? Your women don't

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do this. This is interesting in
that what I would say is that,

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Okay, so you have thousands of
years of traditions where women weren't allowed to

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drum, and it's because Originally they
thought these drums were our way to communicate

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with the gods, and there were
only men should do that. And then

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in recent decades more women play tycho, which is fantastic, and it's flipped

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it so now almost like sixty five
percent of tycho players or wouldn't it.

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But what happened is that even though
participation changed, equity did not come along

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with it. So you didn't get
the same power, dynamics, the same

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financial support, the same all of
those things didn't change with the participation.

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And that was part of this film, is being part of a larger movement

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of like artists saying like all right
enough already, like things have to change,

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and we're just part of that,
an extension of that, a catalyst

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for that. But it's been happening, it's been bubbling up up, and

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there's so many people who are part
of that, not just in tycho,

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but like in so many other places
in the world, in different fields.

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But yeah, so no one told
me, no one told me you shouldn't

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play tychos. But the people that
i've I look to as visionaries and heroes

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and the people I aspire to be
in the same room with, they told

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them. When people do create something
out of nothing, you forget like how

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epic of a journey it was,
and then I'll soon come later. Oh

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yeah, of course there's no problem. No one's gotten in my way,

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but you're missing like this bigger picture, and then once you open your eyes

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to it, then you see it
everywhere, and then you can't not see

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it. So yeah, I think
it's a journey. But thankfully no one

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has gotten my face in that way, although I've been in rooms where the

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men fill the stage and the men
pick the mic and the men make the

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plans, and all of these amazing
female non baronyaria artists are in the room

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and always have been in the room, but aren't a part of those discussions.

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So yeah, it's a little bit
of both. You also mentioned that

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whole idea of that the tradition versus
the rock stars. Is there any sort

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of conflict when it comes to that, Is it like, don't show off?

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This is a very sacred thing for
me. I would say that people

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come to Tycho for many ways and
for many different experiences, and I think,

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of course that happens because what is
so essential to you may not be

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the essential thing for someone else.
Like and in any art form. So

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I think anything that has these embodied
cultural roots is always going to have a

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little bit of tension between tradition and
innovation. But who gets to say what

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is or isn't tycho? Who gets
to say what is or isn't worthy?

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That's part of the conversation and the
growth and the evolution. There's room for

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both and always, in my opinion, I think it's important to have integrity

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at roots and connection to why things
have and ben and what you can gain

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for that. At the same time, I think, be an artist,

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do your thing, carve your path. So I'm all for all of it,

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but I would like to throw in
there that I think that's what one

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of the things that makes Gen's work
revolutionary is that she did bring all of

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these artists to that very different styles
and perspectives on why they made the why

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they made Ticho, why they did
what they did, and particularly the first

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piece in the film and first piece
in the concert, which is all of

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these players with their different styles coming
together in one song. Which the fact

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that she pulled that off as a
freaking miracle because it's but it would I'm

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trying to think of what a parallel
would be in another art form, it's

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I don't know, rap and country
and sticking all those people together and be

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like, make us song, go
for it. But she did, and

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it was phenomenal. There's something to
that. She has a very inclusive worldview,

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which you'll see nfilm. You mentioned
the word logistics. You've got the

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logistics of the concert and then you've
got the logistics of the film going on.

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It must have been close to nightmarish
at times trying to get all of

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these pieces to fit together. Yeah, I would say whenever you take on

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a big project, it always seems
like a near disaster at every moment,

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and it's like you scrape by all
of these disasters and all these miracles happen,

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and it seems like it's just going
to fall apart into the moment that

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it comes together and takes off.
And Yeah, at any given moment in

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the journey of this, I could
have had a charming mental breakdown, let's

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put it that way. But at
every moment there was something that would keep

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you going because of the people involved, because of faith in the project,

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because of the art that you knew
was that was happening, and just the

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privilege the privilege of being in a
room with your heroes. We wouldn't just

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grasp that. Like someone else quoted, I think they said, it's like

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the Avengers of Tycho in that like
truly, like the world Superstar is coming

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together and we get to like share
space and try to create something special.

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It was an amazing time with the
logistics, technical logistics, language barriers,

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tired people. You'll see in the
film. There was an illness that swept

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through the artists and also swept through
the crew, so you don't see that,

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but because we were embedded, and
I would say that those are the

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big glaring things that come to mind. In terms of production, I will

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also say post production was done completely
in a COVID world. The film.

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We were lucky to finish production days
before the world shut down, literally days

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we got in and by the skin
of our teeth, that concert was set

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in years in advance, and we
were just lucky that it was scheduled with

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the day it was, or maybe
it was fortuitous. I don't know,

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but either way, we were doing
our post production entirely remotely, which I

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think as independents were used to,
but not to this level, not to

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the level of doing our color correction
remotely things like that. So it's that

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was both an opportunity and a curse, depending on which day you were looking

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at. Yeah, there were a
lot of challenges. This is a project

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that started in twenty eighteen and quite
frankly, is still going if you count

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distribution and getting your fill out in
the world, We're still going and it's

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twenty twenty four, although we did
wrap post production in late twenty twenty two

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is when we premiere to add No
Valley. But yeah, now, one

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of the things, listening juggling of
the international aspect of this was made a

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little bit easier by the fact that
we all lived together in one house,

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and so the intimacy was built in
the structure. And as a documentary filmmaker,

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I don't want to miss anything,
and the opportunity to stay in the

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same house with the artists provided a
chance for us to become really just part

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of the crew, where the people
stopped looking at the camera, the people

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stopped paying attention to the camera because
the camera was always there, and so

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that allows for a tremendous amount of
intimacy, and I think that's one of

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the strengths of the movie. And
Jen built that in. That was Jen.

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She'd maybe never done a film before, but she really set it up

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in a way that led to success. Don mention the premiere at Mill Valley,

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How was that for you? How
was it for the three of you

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seeing this on the big screen for
the first time with an audience. It

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was amazing. And we had we
had San Jose Tycho Reform after in the

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city square and everyone was dancing and
cheering and people clapped like in the middle

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of the film in several places.
That really surprised me. That was neat

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and an Oscar winning director stand up
and ask the first question and he gosh

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and just said, this is the
film the world really needs to see right

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now to have hope and inspiration for
people coming together and collaborating with diversity and

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respect and creativity. So we were
very well received. What are the three

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of you working on? Now?
I know you're not working together on a

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project necessarily, but what are the
three of you up to? So Jen,

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I'll start with you. Oh,
I'm trying to raise four million dollars

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to get a permanent building home for
our Tycho group and be a community center

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in North End. Saint Paul is
that all four million? Yeah, let

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me check me my wallet. I
might have that for you, Garry.

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How about yourself. I'm working on
new film and I told Dawn that I

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don't want to do any more films
without her, and so she's coming on

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board the film as well. It's
a film on my uncle Roy Blakey and

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his amazing life and times as a
world figure skater collector photographer extraordinaire. And

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he's ninety three years old and he
has a number of collections that are in

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Paerall and so I'm trying to follow
his journey. And don't you put on

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another movie between Finding Her Beat than
this one? Actually after Finding Her Beat?

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So that premiered in April, and
it's called Minnesota Mean, and it

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is following a year in the life
of Minnesota roller Derby as they are on

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a quest to win the international prize, which is called the Hydra. So

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it's an intimate, character driven piece
following a team in roller derby. And

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so yeah, that film is now
a little bit behind this one in terms

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of release. That one is currently
screening in select cities with roller Derby teams.

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That one has a mission not only
to entertain but also to help raid

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up the sport of roller derby,
which took a major hit after COVID because

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of COVID, and so this is
actually this year is their first year of

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international competition since COVID. So anyway, I'm doing a lot of screenings with

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a lot of roller derby teams and
having a ball while also working with Carrie

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and developing new projects which I'm not
going to talk about yet because none of

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them are none of them have signed
on the dotted line, but there will

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be more. Where's the best place
for people to keep up with the film

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and with the filmmakers probably social media. We have both Facebook and Instagram pages

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for Finding Her Beat at our website, so that's finding Herbeat dot com and

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the links to all of the things, and that is where we do our

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announcements to particularly screenings, because those
are still happening. We're still doing festival,

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We're still doing community screenings. We're
going to be out in New York

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in March. I think we're still
doing our things, So definitely follow us

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on the socials. And we have
one other super exciting thing too, and

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that is that the State Department chose
Finding Her Beat for part of their American

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Film Showcase and we will be on
a catalog for the next two years where

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embassy around the world can access our
film and so we're not like we're really

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literally going worldwide. And Jen,
is there a good place for people to

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keep up with you and the Tycho
community in Minnesota? Absolutely, tychoartsmidwest dot

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org can get on our mailing list. We have so many things going on,

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it's pretty exciting Tycho. I feel
is this untapped potential of healing and

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empowerment and connection and bless it's just
really fun to hit things. Yeah.

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I feel like the more people that
find Tycho drumming, the better the world

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will be. Thank you so much
everybody. This was so great talking with

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you all. Thanks to moving.
Thank you so much. Time to keep

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to keep st