WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.880 --> 00:00:13.759 Adventist Radio London. Inspiration for the song we Welcome to Talking Point with Ray 2 00:00:14.400 --> 00:00:21.000 Senor Pedro Angela discussing the hot topics and answering your questions Saturday's five to seven 3 00:00:21.079 --> 00:00:26.640 pm on Adventist Radio London. It's talking Point. It's talking Point. It's 4 00:00:26.679 --> 00:00:34.079 talking Point, it's talking Point. Conversations you need to have. Welcome, 5 00:00:34.119 --> 00:00:37.280 Welcome, Welcome everybody to Talking Point. We want to thank you for joining 6 00:00:37.359 --> 00:00:40.799 us this evening. We've been off for a couple of weeks. A couple 7 00:00:40.799 --> 00:00:42.880 of things happened, but you know, guys, it's good. We are 8 00:00:42.920 --> 00:00:48.399 back on live tonight and we have a subject it is good to our hearts, 9 00:00:49.039 --> 00:00:54.719 men's health. So today we're gonna go right in Is in the studio. 10 00:00:55.439 --> 00:00:58.960 She's gonna be handling the board, making sure we get the music and 11 00:00:59.439 --> 00:01:02.039 the breaks in and everything like that. But today we're gonna do a little 12 00:01:02.039 --> 00:01:03.359 something different. We're gonna have like the Men's Show, where we're gonna have 13 00:01:03.920 --> 00:01:11.319 a kind of men come on and talk about mental health, mental health and 14 00:01:11.400 --> 00:01:15.560 all aspects. So we're gonna get right into it today because you know, 15 00:01:15.239 --> 00:01:19.159 it goes really fast. As we know, next thing, you know, 16 00:01:19.200 --> 00:01:23.760 will be time for us to end. So I'm joined today by Mark Simple, 17 00:01:23.799 --> 00:01:33.519 He's from Cornerstone. He's a counselor there and Twine and Andre. Uh. 18 00:01:34.359 --> 00:01:38.400 I guess we'll just do one by one. Antoine, would you like 19 00:01:38.480 --> 00:01:45.840 to tell us your name and your show show? So my name's Antel husband 20 00:01:46.079 --> 00:01:49.079 I'll actually know is that? There? And Andre for quite some time now, 21 00:01:49.280 --> 00:01:53.439 I think over ten years. I don't seen for over ten years, 22 00:01:53.560 --> 00:01:57.719 but yeah, a while back, I always a member of do for church 23 00:01:59.319 --> 00:02:06.280 along way, so then I think, and a couple of weeks ago there's 24 00:02:06.319 --> 00:02:09.439 sort of an outreach sort of march. I think the young guy had died 25 00:02:09.479 --> 00:02:14.879 unfortunately, and just following that reached out to me last week he said, 26 00:02:14.879 --> 00:02:17.479 you know what, we've got the food coming up about men's mental health. 27 00:02:17.520 --> 00:02:22.960 Would you like to collaborate, you know, you know, lend your thoughts 28 00:02:22.960 --> 00:02:25.400 and that sort of thing. So I hope I can I can do that 29 00:02:25.400 --> 00:02:30.199 and maybe provide a different perspective today. All right, cool, cool, 30 00:02:30.319 --> 00:02:35.800 definitely? What do you What do you do? So? I work as 31 00:02:35.800 --> 00:02:42.520 a commercial manager, you having a commercial space construction, so primarily working with 32 00:02:43.240 --> 00:02:46.639 air conditioning, quite high intensive, I would say in essence, of a 33 00:02:46.719 --> 00:02:52.680 suit. You know, I'm a suit a suit. I worked some in 34 00:02:52.800 --> 00:02:57.000 around London, meetings, expos that sort of thing. That's that's that's, 35 00:02:57.039 --> 00:03:00.280 that's where the Burridge keep the suits. That's. I don't like meetings. 36 00:03:00.280 --> 00:03:02.719 I don't how you get I don't know how people do meetings, because meetings 37 00:03:02.759 --> 00:03:08.960 is just you get used to. I'll never get used to the meetings. 38 00:03:12.000 --> 00:03:14.919 Uh, we're gonna go Andre next, because you know Mark. But we're 39 00:03:14.919 --> 00:03:16.520 gonna go and Andre has been on before, but we're gonna ask him just 40 00:03:16.520 --> 00:03:23.240 to give us a quick synopsis again of who he is. Okay, So 41 00:03:23.360 --> 00:03:35.039 Andre Jones is half French something on a pio case past us. Kick was 42 00:03:35.039 --> 00:03:38.479 a pastor, grew up in the church. I have one brother, three 43 00:03:38.520 --> 00:03:45.840 children, one wife and what else can I say? I worked more in 44 00:03:45.879 --> 00:03:54.879 the tech field. I see people bought to Dadminton and chill that's me. 45 00:03:59.039 --> 00:04:00.439 That's cool. As You've been on Forward when we did the Siblings show, 46 00:04:00.919 --> 00:04:04.319 so I'm sure some of our listeners will remember you from that show when you 47 00:04:04.319 --> 00:04:08.360 had your brother, your younger brother of like ten years younger than you. 48 00:04:08.520 --> 00:04:13.360 Right, Yeah, I know it's around there, and I'm glad. I 49 00:04:13.360 --> 00:04:17.759 don't remember that much. And yeah, last, but not least, we're 50 00:04:17.800 --> 00:04:23.000 going to have Mark Marcus works in Cornerstone as I don't want to say, 51 00:04:23.040 --> 00:04:30.240 well as a psychologist or as what it is. I'm a trauma trauma counselor. 52 00:04:30.560 --> 00:04:32.800 I work with trauma. Yeah right, trauma counselor. Right, Okay, 53 00:04:32.920 --> 00:04:39.920 well then give us a little bit more about you. Well, I 54 00:04:40.240 --> 00:04:46.399 seem to be becoming a regular on this program. I don't mind. I 55 00:04:46.519 --> 00:04:53.040 work. I have a private practice. I work with trauma addictions, different 56 00:04:53.040 --> 00:05:01.079 types of addictions. And I have my wife, no kids, which have 57 00:05:01.160 --> 00:05:06.480 a good relationship. I think I'm alone today because the wife is in New 58 00:05:06.560 --> 00:05:15.000 York having some family something. So yeah, yeah, all right, cool 59 00:05:15.279 --> 00:05:21.319 Paul, Paul, I'm sorry deep of texting. Yeah, so that's that's 60 00:05:21.360 --> 00:05:25.240 great to hear. As we said, You've been on before too, so 61 00:05:25.519 --> 00:05:27.839 I think this is gonna be a good show. We have different aspects of 62 00:05:27.839 --> 00:05:31.079 different men. Of course, I'm your host Pedro today because Zanya and Angela 63 00:05:31.199 --> 00:05:34.319 decided to throw me out to the wolves, and I did tell them I 64 00:05:34.360 --> 00:05:38.800 was going to do that. So yeah, well, I mean I'm just 65 00:05:38.839 --> 00:05:40.759 like yeah, They're like, yeah, well you should meet this is your 66 00:05:40.759 --> 00:05:43.199 other man in the group, and I'm like, yeah, that's nice. 67 00:05:43.279 --> 00:05:46.240 You could have said something not on Thursday, but yeah, that's cool. 68 00:05:46.720 --> 00:05:51.199 But anyway, yeah, anyway, we're gonna get right into it. Like 69 00:05:51.199 --> 00:05:55.600 I said, we saw our topic today is gonna be about men's health issues, 70 00:05:55.680 --> 00:06:00.399 men's health situations, and I guess I'll go right back. Two. 71 00:06:00.680 --> 00:06:03.399 Oh by the way, Angela and Xenia are on the show today, so 72 00:06:04.079 --> 00:06:09.240 don't be afraid to if you have a question, ladies to ask. Even 73 00:06:09.279 --> 00:06:13.720 though this is, you know, a men's panel, I don't mind. 74 00:06:13.800 --> 00:06:18.439 I wanted you guys to still be answer that you can talk or if you 75 00:06:18.439 --> 00:06:24.759 have a question, because it's not just men's health issues. Men's situations also 76 00:06:24.839 --> 00:06:31.319 deals with women, so we still like to get the women's perspective sometimes I 77 00:06:31.680 --> 00:06:36.360 would say sometimes that you know, I'm talking like a husband of eighteen years, 78 00:06:36.399 --> 00:06:39.720 so that's why I'm saying it like that. So let me let me, 79 00:06:39.800 --> 00:06:41.839 let me like smoove it off. I don't mean it in that way, 80 00:06:41.920 --> 00:06:45.120 like you just like to get a woman's perspective, you know, we 81 00:06:45.240 --> 00:06:48.800 like to get that perspective, so you know, does you know it does 82 00:06:48.879 --> 00:06:56.600 make a difference it does make a difference so well and tone. I wanted 83 00:06:56.639 --> 00:07:00.879 to start off from you since I started with you to begin, Yeah, 84 00:07:00.920 --> 00:07:04.160 what does mental health means to you? And when you are having a mental 85 00:07:04.160 --> 00:07:11.879 health issue, how do you deal about it? Man? I think it's 86 00:07:11.879 --> 00:07:17.439 a loaded question, and I think sometimes it's it's sometimes hard to to put 87 00:07:17.480 --> 00:07:21.519 into words. I think, and I think it's it's it's a problem. 88 00:07:21.759 --> 00:07:25.319 It's a problem that it's hard to put into words. I think that's because 89 00:07:25.360 --> 00:07:28.000 of how we've had to really deal with it over the years and not necessarily 90 00:07:28.000 --> 00:07:31.439 know what it is. But I can't more of an understanding over the last 91 00:07:31.480 --> 00:07:40.560 few years because I felt that it's affected my physical being. So to me, 92 00:07:40.560 --> 00:07:49.160 mental health it's something that you can't necessarily see, but it has I 93 00:07:49.160 --> 00:07:57.360 think one of the greatest impacts on your physical state. It affects your emotions 94 00:07:59.319 --> 00:08:03.680 on a day to day basis. But I think it's also something that if 95 00:08:03.680 --> 00:08:07.199 you know how you can learn to control, you can learn to manage, 96 00:08:09.759 --> 00:08:15.920 you know. I think sometimes we might say, you know, just just 97 00:08:15.959 --> 00:08:18.560 in day to day life, you know, we're stressed, you know, 98 00:08:18.920 --> 00:08:22.160 as men were stressed because work is difficult and all of that sort of stuff. 99 00:08:22.160 --> 00:08:28.920 But I think stress is to a degree mental health. I think to 100 00:08:28.959 --> 00:08:39.639 what extent is what's important and understanding that Mike, so go on, So 101 00:08:41.000 --> 00:08:46.639 a question, No, Okay, my coping mechanism. I suppose it's the 102 00:08:46.679 --> 00:08:50.039 gym. I've been in the gym for years, but I didn't actually know 103 00:08:50.200 --> 00:08:56.279 it was a coping mechanism until there was a period that I wasn't getting to 104 00:08:56.320 --> 00:08:58.000 the gym. You know, I was working day in, day out, 105 00:08:58.080 --> 00:09:01.519 sometimes long hours. I have a business for a moment that was struggling, 106 00:09:03.480 --> 00:09:09.399 and I didn't have a work life balance at all, and something was wrong 107 00:09:09.440 --> 00:09:11.039 with me and I didn't really know what it was. Sometimes you know, 108 00:09:11.080 --> 00:09:15.879 you find that you're getting a little bit angry or you're getting stressed, or 109 00:09:15.879 --> 00:09:18.600 you're miserable, and you don't really understand why. And I didn't have any 110 00:09:18.639 --> 00:09:26.200 balance in my life. So for me being able to control it, or 111 00:09:26.200 --> 00:09:30.480 what's helped me control it, I would say is a physical activity, something 112 00:09:30.519 --> 00:09:35.200 that's regular, something that allows me to have time for myself, time to 113 00:09:35.200 --> 00:09:41.039 shut out the outside world. You just do me, and that's helped to 114 00:09:41.159 --> 00:09:48.720 keep me stable. I would say. I think in doing that without realizing 115 00:09:48.639 --> 00:09:54.399 there are certain changes that you know, we're seeing as a positive from the 116 00:09:54.440 --> 00:09:56.039 outside in. So you know, my family will say, Okay, you 117 00:09:56.039 --> 00:10:01.399 know what, you're happier today, you know, or you know, you've 118 00:10:01.399 --> 00:10:03.679 seen calmer today, you know. But I didn't really realize because I'm just 119 00:10:03.679 --> 00:10:07.200 stressed and I'm just working and it's just you know, everything, it's just 120 00:10:07.200 --> 00:10:09.000 gotting crazy. But then when I had that balance and when I was able 121 00:10:09.039 --> 00:10:15.720 to do something for myself, something to just free my mind, that became 122 00:10:16.320 --> 00:10:20.759 you know, that healing for me, if you like. So that's how 123 00:10:20.840 --> 00:10:24.120 I've I would say, I've been able to manage mental health to me, 124 00:10:26.440 --> 00:10:30.000 that's good. That's good. Yeah, that's one where keep yourself busy. 125 00:10:30.000 --> 00:10:33.679 But then working out. We've had my son on the show before too. 126 00:10:33.720 --> 00:10:37.279 He talks he likes, he's really into working out, and I think he 127 00:10:37.320 --> 00:10:41.919 says that's how he does with his issue when he's when he's down, it 128 00:10:41.080 --> 00:10:45.039 just kind of revives them and gets them going for the next you know, 129 00:10:45.080 --> 00:10:50.159 for the next day. Andrew, Andrew, I want to call you from 130 00:10:50.240 --> 00:10:54.559 Andrew. I'm so sorry, and Andrew. Next question, the same question 131 00:10:54.639 --> 00:10:58.600 for you. Just wanted to have a you know, an idea how you 132 00:10:58.639 --> 00:11:03.120 feel about this. Funny enough, I found myself nodding as Ang was talking 133 00:11:03.200 --> 00:11:11.240 because I think I call pretty much all of what he said in that well, 134 00:11:11.360 --> 00:11:18.360 okay answer the mental health. Mental health for me is it's having that 135 00:11:18.440 --> 00:11:22.200 stability because you can't avoid stress stress. If you're live, you're going to 136 00:11:22.240 --> 00:11:26.639 have stresses. Anything that changes cause of stress. So stress in life is 137 00:11:26.679 --> 00:11:33.000 not the problem. It's how we manage and how we quote the stresses and 138 00:11:33.200 --> 00:11:37.919 the coping mechanisms that we were able to employ that will give us that balance, 139 00:11:41.039 --> 00:11:46.279 that clarity, and that kind of stability as well. And exercising is 140 00:11:46.279 --> 00:11:50.720 one thing that I found helpful for me was badminton. I'm a very quiet 141 00:11:50.720 --> 00:11:52.720 person, and who knows me will tell you I'm a very quiet, soft 142 00:11:52.679 --> 00:11:56.679 spoken person. If you find me on a badminton court or a voterball court, 143 00:11:56.720 --> 00:12:00.200 you see a different side of me. We hear the show, to 144 00:12:00.240 --> 00:12:03.840 hear the screams, you hear the you see the burst of energy that you 145 00:12:03.879 --> 00:12:07.879 know unless I see on an ordinary day a more kind of laid back person 146 00:12:07.919 --> 00:12:13.120 generally speaking. But that's my outlets and that's always been a place where I've 147 00:12:13.159 --> 00:12:20.000 been able to kind of really get frustration, clear my head and come that 148 00:12:20.159 --> 00:12:26.559 fresh. It's either wall badminton, and sometimes singing. Singing has also been 149 00:12:26.559 --> 00:12:31.879 a source of balance for me. What I would add to what's been said 150 00:12:31.919 --> 00:12:37.759 so far is having someone that you can open up to and talk to real 151 00:12:37.840 --> 00:12:45.840 talk, I mean real talk, and I find amongst men we don't often 152 00:12:45.919 --> 00:12:50.399 do that. Some some guys have that body that can really be free with 153 00:12:50.000 --> 00:12:56.559 see how it is no judgment and this kind of yeah, whether it's getting 154 00:12:56.600 --> 00:13:01.919 really emotional or they're just being sharing things that are not that you could easily 155 00:13:01.919 --> 00:13:07.039 be judged for, and that is rare. But it helps to have that 156 00:13:07.080 --> 00:13:13.480 space because I remember watching I can't remember it as Instagram or YouTube a clip 157 00:13:13.519 --> 00:13:16.679 that basically said, especially as black men, we are not allowed to be 158 00:13:16.720 --> 00:13:22.440 vulnerable. We're not allowed to show weakness, anything that is perceived as weakness, 159 00:13:22.440 --> 00:13:24.840 a softness. You know you're not a man if you finish, if 160 00:13:24.879 --> 00:13:30.440 you're showing those things. But we all go through payers where we need to 161 00:13:30.559 --> 00:13:35.840 be able to say that hurt, or to say I'm hurting or I'm sad, 162 00:13:35.960 --> 00:13:39.600 or I'm I just I don't have the energy, I don't have the 163 00:13:39.679 --> 00:13:45.080 motivation I just can't do it anymore. But I guess I like address of 164 00:13:45.159 --> 00:13:46.919 pount chiming in terms of what you agree with what I'm saying I'm not. 165 00:13:48.360 --> 00:13:52.480 I find as black men don't often, we don't often have that liberty to 166 00:13:52.559 --> 00:13:54.320 deep that vulnerable, to be in that state. We have to always be 167 00:13:56.279 --> 00:14:01.320 on top of things. Yeah, I definitely agree with you, not because 168 00:14:01.440 --> 00:14:05.840 I find being that I've lived over different places I lived in the States from 169 00:14:05.919 --> 00:14:11.879 you, and here I find here when I'm honest with people how I feel, 170 00:14:11.639 --> 00:14:16.559 they call it being aggressive. And it's not that I'm being aggressive. 171 00:14:16.720 --> 00:14:20.399 I'm just telling you how I feel and you know, and I'm just being 172 00:14:20.720 --> 00:14:24.039 honest and how I feel like because I'm getting stressed mentally. So I'm like, 173 00:14:24.159 --> 00:14:28.000 this is how I feel because you're stressing me, like at work, 174 00:14:28.039 --> 00:14:31.360 say something at work, and then they'll say, well, now you're being 175 00:14:31.399 --> 00:14:35.639 too aggressive. You could be more less like passive, and I'm like, 176 00:14:35.440 --> 00:14:39.960 but I don't even it's not even say anything, it's just by words, 177 00:14:39.720 --> 00:14:43.399 and I don't you know, I'm trying to understand why do they feel like 178 00:14:43.480 --> 00:14:48.600 I'm being aggressive by just expressing how I feel it because I don't know if 179 00:14:48.600 --> 00:14:52.759 they're used to a man expressing themselves the way that I do personally. This 180 00:14:52.840 --> 00:14:58.759 is just me personally, Do Mark you want? You can go next with 181 00:14:58.840 --> 00:15:05.759 the question and then we can go want to the whole Okay, let me 182 00:15:05.799 --> 00:15:11.080 I just gonna read a bit. In terms of what the ENERGS website says, 183 00:15:11.120 --> 00:15:16.399 its mental health is or emotional, a psych a physical, and social 184 00:15:16.519 --> 00:15:20.279 well being. It affects how we think, feels, an act. It 185 00:15:20.639 --> 00:15:28.840 also helps determine how we handle stress related to others and to make choices. 186 00:15:30.240 --> 00:15:37.399 Mental health is important at every stage of life, from childhood, an adolescent 187 00:15:37.759 --> 00:15:46.480 to adulthood. For me, mentor how I deal with mental health is basically, 188 00:15:46.080 --> 00:15:50.960 I do a lot of gym. I will whenever I can, I 189 00:15:50.080 --> 00:15:56.600 go to the gym. I love reading, and so these are the things 190 00:15:56.679 --> 00:16:03.320 I do. I also want the things I do I'm big in doing. 191 00:16:04.240 --> 00:16:12.559 I like aquariums, so I had a beautiful aquarium and yeah, so those 192 00:16:12.600 --> 00:16:18.120 are the things that tried to calm myself down. And yeah, so that's 193 00:16:18.200 --> 00:16:22.799 me truly. Yeah. I have to say, I don't know if this 194 00:16:22.919 --> 00:16:27.080 is a transfer ustery discuss any of the points I've been raised so far, 195 00:16:27.159 --> 00:16:32.759 Pedro, Yeah, yeah, I have to say, just touching on, 196 00:16:33.799 --> 00:16:37.279 you know, some of the things that Andre mentioned before, some of these 197 00:16:37.320 --> 00:16:44.440 touch points about as men not feeling comfortable with communicating, you know, what's 198 00:16:44.600 --> 00:16:52.159 what's really going on. I have to say that over the last probably about 199 00:16:52.200 --> 00:16:56.360 three to six months of my life, I have been doing a little bit 200 00:16:56.399 --> 00:16:59.480 of that with a very close circle that I have, just two friends, 201 00:17:00.320 --> 00:17:03.279 and it's been quite refreshing, that's been quite free. I mean, we've 202 00:17:03.319 --> 00:17:06.799 known each other since we were young anyway, so we can be truthful. 203 00:17:06.839 --> 00:17:11.279 But even to that extent, it's never something that we've really talked about because 204 00:17:12.400 --> 00:17:15.119 you know, as you're saying, you know, as a man, especially 205 00:17:15.160 --> 00:17:18.799 a black man, we've got to be strong in the society. That's really 206 00:17:18.880 --> 00:17:22.799 tough on us as it is. But we've been doing that and in doing 207 00:17:22.880 --> 00:17:27.039 that, you know, we've been finding other kind of solutions. It's sort 208 00:17:27.079 --> 00:17:32.119 of like we can even use it like a brainstorm and exercise to figure out 209 00:17:33.039 --> 00:17:36.039 or what can we do, what can we do to be simply happier? 210 00:17:37.160 --> 00:17:38.680 Do you know what I mean? I think it's also about just understanding what 211 00:17:38.839 --> 00:17:44.720 makes you happy, and that can be, in my opinion, another way 212 00:17:44.960 --> 00:17:52.920 to sort of heal and to overcome any ailments that's that's causing you to suffer 213 00:17:52.039 --> 00:17:57.880 from mental mental illness or whatever whatever it is. Yeah, yeah, I 214 00:17:59.039 --> 00:18:03.599 totally agree with you on that. For myself, like dealing with mental health, 215 00:18:04.079 --> 00:18:07.119 probably my first couple when I was in my twenties and thirties I had 216 00:18:07.400 --> 00:18:11.680 it was really I as to get like I was watching something the other day 217 00:18:11.680 --> 00:18:15.440 and it just popped in my head just how he's a feel, you know, 218 00:18:15.559 --> 00:18:18.680 like the F one races where I think it's like some kind of it's 219 00:18:18.759 --> 00:18:22.279 like invisible guys that burned you. Yeah, but you can't see it, 220 00:18:22.359 --> 00:18:27.759 but you're on fire. Yeah. Yeah, Like that's how sometimes when when 221 00:18:27.759 --> 00:18:30.559 I was suffered, like when I was a good that mental health issue, 222 00:18:30.599 --> 00:18:33.640 that's how I felt like. I felt like I was burning but nobody can 223 00:18:33.720 --> 00:18:37.480 see me burning and I'm just and nobody's did to help me put it out, 224 00:18:37.559 --> 00:18:41.279 so I'm just all over the place. I'm just skittish. And then 225 00:18:41.359 --> 00:18:45.400 I just realized as I got older, because I'm I can't believe I'm gonna 226 00:18:45.400 --> 00:18:48.200 say this, but three months I think IM gonna be fifty in March. 227 00:18:48.279 --> 00:18:52.279 Yet March I'll be fifty and probably over the last five six years. I 228 00:18:52.519 --> 00:18:56.839 just don't care. I as a man, you know, like I know 229 00:18:57.000 --> 00:19:02.599 who I am, and I'm just comfortable in myself for my own mental health. 230 00:19:02.960 --> 00:19:06.839 So I've just developed that, like you said, just get a small 231 00:19:07.079 --> 00:19:11.240 snap of people that's in my life. And if you're not in my life, 232 00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:15.759 like you know, you meet people and they're good for that time, 233 00:19:15.839 --> 00:19:19.680 but not everybody's meant to stay there, And so when that time comes for 234 00:19:19.799 --> 00:19:22.839 them to let them go, you just let them go. If they meant 235 00:19:22.880 --> 00:19:26.079 to stay there, they'll stay there. But if they're not meant to, 236 00:19:26.279 --> 00:19:30.039 they just let them go and you just keep on moving. And I just 237 00:19:30.079 --> 00:19:33.400 stick with my wife and my kids. For me personally, I don't have 238 00:19:33.480 --> 00:19:37.759 time to work out because I drive a lot. But believe it or not, 239 00:19:37.880 --> 00:19:41.680 the driving is like my mental Like I could just turn off everything, 240 00:19:41.759 --> 00:19:45.920 just drive and I could just like mentally decompress. I can think about things, 241 00:19:45.720 --> 00:19:51.240 I can come up ideas, I can figure out how I'm going to 242 00:19:51.319 --> 00:19:52.640 figure out, you know, figure out how I'm going to do something. 243 00:19:52.880 --> 00:19:56.599 You know, when something's mentally stressing me or when something's really getting on my 244 00:19:56.759 --> 00:20:00.200 you know, getting me down and then when I get home my wife and 245 00:20:00.319 --> 00:20:04.720 kids are pretty good, I can go and just kind of disappear for an 246 00:20:04.759 --> 00:20:08.279 hour. Go to my room, read something, you know, read a 247 00:20:08.319 --> 00:20:11.680 little something I should. I used to read a lot more. I don't 248 00:20:11.680 --> 00:20:15.480 read as as much as I used to, and then just sit there just 249 00:20:15.039 --> 00:20:18.599 kind of because I tried working out, but I just don't have the time. 250 00:20:18.680 --> 00:20:22.200 It's like, when I get home, I'm so tired. I don't 251 00:20:22.240 --> 00:20:26.519 want to have to go down the road to go work out. Plus, 252 00:20:26.680 --> 00:20:30.079 I always thought working out by myself was kind of weird, but that's just 253 00:20:30.240 --> 00:20:32.279 me, you know. As we said, we all have our own little 254 00:20:32.319 --> 00:20:36.559 you know pros. And know something else that I've tried recently, well, 255 00:20:36.880 --> 00:20:37.920 I tried it last year. I haven't done it much recently, but I 256 00:20:38.000 --> 00:20:45.839 found it really really therapeutic. It's going to spa, going to a place 257 00:20:45.880 --> 00:20:56.079 that has a uh sauna, right and steaming room and relax. Did you 258 00:20:56.160 --> 00:20:57.680 get into an interesting conversation with people who are in there as well? But 259 00:20:59.759 --> 00:21:03.880 and song of the chill Out? Going in the song to just chill out. 260 00:21:03.640 --> 00:21:06.799 They have a nice cool water plunge you can jump in out towards and 261 00:21:06.839 --> 00:21:10.759 then go back again. That was there's a place that poe close to me 262 00:21:10.799 --> 00:21:15.640 in Colchester, really really reasonable, and that was my I tried to go 263 00:21:15.680 --> 00:21:18.240 at least two three times a week and that was probably the best period I 264 00:21:18.279 --> 00:21:22.119 had in terms of combining that together with my Dadminton. That was. That 265 00:21:22.319 --> 00:21:26.160 was, Yeah, that was good. I think we'll go to a swimming 266 00:21:26.160 --> 00:21:33.480 pool myself. I think swimming kind of relaxes me. Yeah, because I 267 00:21:33.519 --> 00:21:34.799 don't know, sitting in a hot thing getting all sweating, I'm like, 268 00:21:34.880 --> 00:21:45.039 I can do this at all. But but but that is because as we 269 00:21:45.079 --> 00:21:48.559 all past, they used to be on the show. That explains why he 270 00:21:48.599 --> 00:21:52.079 goes to the Egos all the time, to the spa. So I don't 271 00:21:52.119 --> 00:21:56.279 know what. Now we know why, yeah, you just you just you 272 00:21:56.359 --> 00:22:00.440 know, we let we now know why. So yeah, because the music 273 00:22:00.599 --> 00:22:03.160 all the time, like at least once a week he went, So now 274 00:22:03.240 --> 00:22:07.359 we know why he was going. So yeah, he never will admit it, 275 00:22:07.440 --> 00:22:12.200 but yeah, and I just probably, well, so I think we're 276 00:22:12.200 --> 00:22:15.839 all seeing similar things in it. It's like for men, I think it 277 00:22:15.960 --> 00:22:18.319 might be different with women. I don't know, you know, I can't 278 00:22:18.359 --> 00:22:21.079 really speak to women in that sense, but I think it's men. I 279 00:22:21.160 --> 00:22:25.119 think if we do a solitary thing, there's something that we can just do 280 00:22:25.240 --> 00:22:29.680 for ourselves and we can just be in our own space. For me, 281 00:22:29.759 --> 00:22:33.039 anyway, I find that that's more beneficial that some people. They might say, 282 00:22:33.079 --> 00:22:37.079 YE need to I need to go out and be social. But for 283 00:22:37.240 --> 00:22:38.119 me, I think when you're just in your own space, it gives you 284 00:22:38.200 --> 00:22:45.559 just time to just unload everything you know and just and just reflect. So 285 00:22:45.720 --> 00:22:48.240 I think, just do things in a solitary way for me personally, And 286 00:22:48.799 --> 00:22:52.160 sounds like that's what you guys are saying as well. It kind of seems 287 00:22:52.200 --> 00:22:56.359 to help. I think, I think you have to. I think you 288 00:22:56.480 --> 00:23:02.359 have to look at it in two ways. Yes, some people like that 289 00:23:02.680 --> 00:23:06.079 space wherein they can go and reflect and do what I need to do. 290 00:23:06.720 --> 00:23:15.200 But for me, I got energized by Reich and rejuvenated by by people by 291 00:23:15.359 --> 00:23:22.359 talking, by by interacting with people. So I can do both the solitary 292 00:23:22.440 --> 00:23:29.079 thing, and I can also do the wherein I like to talk with people. 293 00:23:29.440 --> 00:23:32.079 I like. That's why I like to work with young people, because 294 00:23:32.119 --> 00:23:36.519 I want someone to ask me a question, wherein I have to think or 295 00:23:36.599 --> 00:23:41.960 I have to basically go research or something like that. So each individual has 296 00:23:42.039 --> 00:23:47.799 a different way and how they when it comes to swimming or anything like that. 297 00:23:48.079 --> 00:23:52.640 I cannot swim, So that is going to put more stress. And 298 00:23:52.960 --> 00:23:56.920 I'm serious, I can't swim. Look, I went to my wife, 299 00:23:56.960 --> 00:23:59.319 said to me, Mark, you need to learn how to swim, because 300 00:23:59.359 --> 00:24:03.640 we went to eat e jip and they went off and do the snorkeling thing 301 00:24:03.119 --> 00:24:07.039 and I nearly drunk. So I came back. I came back. I 302 00:24:07.160 --> 00:24:14.039 did turn the two sessions with the little kiddies bluepool was you know, halfway 303 00:24:14.119 --> 00:24:18.759 to my knee. I did turn to two sessions of swimming and realize, 304 00:24:18.839 --> 00:24:21.480 you know, on the last session, I can't swim. So I went 305 00:24:21.640 --> 00:24:29.279 out with another turty two sessions and I still can't swim. So s is 306 00:24:29.359 --> 00:24:36.920 not one thing at all a little combination that could be useful. And this 307 00:24:37.079 --> 00:24:41.000 is for guys in the pannel and those listing as well. If some of 308 00:24:41.119 --> 00:24:44.160 us have mentioned working out, going to the gym, right, not kind 309 00:24:44.160 --> 00:24:45.759 of physical exercise, a really good sweat, I would just let it out 310 00:24:48.240 --> 00:24:56.039 physical perfect combining that with a SPA session golden m hmm, yeah, yeah, 311 00:24:56.000 --> 00:25:03.160 yeah, all right, I'm gonna see to try. It's a try 312 00:25:04.000 --> 00:25:07.200 because I just know, I just if I'm not exercise person. So the 313 00:25:07.240 --> 00:25:11.359 only exercise I would do is probably swim because it's just easy and because I 314 00:25:11.400 --> 00:25:12.359 go up on the island. If I don't know how to swim, I'm 315 00:25:12.359 --> 00:25:15.839 in trouble. But if I ask your question, Pedro, you said that 316 00:25:17.480 --> 00:25:22.240 sometimes you just you just go and find your space at home. Yeah. 317 00:25:22.680 --> 00:25:26.039 Do you find that you get left alone to do that enough? Yes? 318 00:25:26.039 --> 00:25:32.519 Yes? Yeah. My my my wife, man, she's she's my rock, 319 00:25:32.599 --> 00:25:34.559 she's my man. Eighteen years, she's my rock. My wife knows. 320 00:25:34.640 --> 00:25:37.960 And the same thing with my wife too though. See that's the difference. 321 00:25:37.519 --> 00:25:42.960 I know my wife needs the space. So we both have learned when 322 00:25:44.039 --> 00:25:48.079 each other needs that space. We have learned like if I just like, 323 00:25:48.160 --> 00:25:51.319 even if she has a question, she should I'll say, hey, just 324 00:25:51.359 --> 00:25:52.440 give me five minutes, give me ten minutes, and she said okay, 325 00:25:52.960 --> 00:25:57.000 and she'll give me ten minutes, sometimes fifteen, you know, And so 326 00:25:57.240 --> 00:26:00.640 we just learned how to read each other. My children, yeah, they'll 327 00:26:00.640 --> 00:26:03.359 come and they'll say, hey, Dad, give me a her kiss. 328 00:26:03.960 --> 00:26:04.839 And then I'm like, look, I'll be down in a minute, all 329 00:26:04.880 --> 00:26:07.359 right. That no pou, I'm cool, and they will go back to 330 00:26:07.440 --> 00:26:11.240 what they was doing. You know, my son is fifteen, so he's 331 00:26:11.519 --> 00:26:14.440 he stays in the room anyway, so that's easy. It's the girls, 332 00:26:14.519 --> 00:26:17.799 you know, they want to jump and play and give me a hug and 333 00:26:18.160 --> 00:26:19.759 hold on tight, don't let go. I'm like, I'm like, sweet, 334 00:26:19.799 --> 00:26:22.160 you just give me five minutes, okay, that okay, and then 335 00:26:22.160 --> 00:26:25.359 they'll give me then, you know, five ten minutes, they'll come up 336 00:26:25.359 --> 00:26:26.599 to the room like can I ask you a question? You know, But 337 00:26:26.720 --> 00:26:30.319 then that's fine. But yeah, my family's great men. When it comes 338 00:26:30.319 --> 00:26:36.079 to that day, they have they have learned how to We have learned. 339 00:26:36.720 --> 00:26:38.279 We still mess up back, you know, because we're not perfect, but 340 00:26:38.400 --> 00:26:44.359 we have got a good rhythm down in the sense of navigating space for each 341 00:26:44.400 --> 00:26:48.400 other. Okay, because speaking to my region about this, no names or 342 00:26:48.440 --> 00:26:52.759 anything, but he's he's in a position where he works quite a lot sometimes 343 00:26:52.839 --> 00:26:56.440 at home, and he's got children, the wife and so on, and 344 00:26:56.559 --> 00:26:59.839 then you know, they'll get back and then he's with them, and then 345 00:27:00.119 --> 00:27:03.279 he's kind of feeling like, what, I'm always in this house, I 346 00:27:03.559 --> 00:27:07.039 have my time or anything like that, and I'll say you know, sometimes 347 00:27:07.119 --> 00:27:10.200 you just got to if you can't find a space to the house, sometimes 348 00:27:10.240 --> 00:27:11.640 you just got to get out of the house. Maybe just find a hobby 349 00:27:11.759 --> 00:27:15.400 or something that you can do. Mm. But I know for some people 350 00:27:15.480 --> 00:27:19.400 it's not easy to do that, especially if you weren't doing that in the 351 00:27:19.480 --> 00:27:23.279 beginning of your relationship. If you've now sort of realized that's what I need, 352 00:27:23.440 --> 00:27:26.400 but you're you know, two, three, four or five years how 353 00:27:26.440 --> 00:27:30.519 many years deep into that relationship now to now say this is what I need 354 00:27:30.640 --> 00:27:34.039 to do. I think it's also managing the expectation of who you're who you're 355 00:27:34.079 --> 00:27:40.359 in a relationship with, because they have to be on side, right, 356 00:27:40.559 --> 00:27:42.039 they have to say, all right, this is this is something that I 357 00:27:42.160 --> 00:27:47.000 need to be on board of you and you know, allow you to do 358 00:27:47.400 --> 00:27:52.119 and respect that. That could also be difficult. Yeah, I mean I 359 00:27:52.119 --> 00:27:55.200 would because would have said, like go for a thirty minute drive, fifteen 360 00:27:55.200 --> 00:27:57.160 minute, thirty minute drive just but then, like you said, with the 361 00:27:57.240 --> 00:28:00.599 children, then you have to have to wife the one to watch them because 362 00:28:00.599 --> 00:28:03.720 you can't just leave the children. So yeah, I get that that point. 363 00:28:03.960 --> 00:28:08.400 There's definitely something that a conversation needs to be had and both parties have 364 00:28:08.480 --> 00:28:12.119 to be on board. But yeah, with me, definitely both we're both 365 00:28:12.200 --> 00:28:17.680 on board in that aspect. And it just and it wasn't It didn't happen 366 00:28:17.720 --> 00:28:22.440 overnight. This is something that over time happened a lot of conversations, a 367 00:28:22.519 --> 00:28:26.079 lot of a lot of arguments, a lot of disagreements, a lot of 368 00:28:26.440 --> 00:28:30.079 you know, not understanding each other, you know, And as time went 369 00:28:30.119 --> 00:28:34.119 on, we we when she saw that if she let me do that, 370 00:28:34.359 --> 00:28:41.920 I'm a different my mental space is different, then she realized, let me 371 00:28:41.960 --> 00:28:45.039 give him that, because then he comes back. You know, I'm more 372 00:28:45.119 --> 00:28:48.839 receptive to what she's saying when I'm not. When I'm not, you know, 373 00:28:51.000 --> 00:28:52.759 recepted to what she's saying is because I'm so stressed at the moment. 374 00:28:52.880 --> 00:28:56.759 She realized she's not gonna get through to me anyway. So it was a 375 00:28:56.799 --> 00:29:00.160 recognition on her part too to say, Okay, you know what, if 376 00:29:00.160 --> 00:29:03.079 I just give him that extra fifteen minutes, then I can talk to about 377 00:29:03.079 --> 00:29:06.359 what I need to talk about. He will hear me and we can get 378 00:29:06.400 --> 00:29:10.400 something accomplished, and then you know, stuff is not going all over the 379 00:29:10.480 --> 00:29:14.599 place. Yeah, so we're gonna We're gonna just put a pin in it 380 00:29:14.680 --> 00:29:17.880 right there for the moment, as as I used to say. And we're 381 00:29:17.920 --> 00:29:22.599 gonna go to repaid it all by west Morgan. And when we come back, 382 00:29:22.640 --> 00:29:26.400 we're gonna get into different signs of symptoms and what we can do to 383 00:29:33.839 --> 00:29:37.799 sorry the kids. And we're gonna go into something. We're gonna go into 384 00:29:37.000 --> 00:29:41.359 the different aspects of the signs and symptoms of mental health for men. Okay, 385 00:29:45.319 --> 00:29:56.519 the lovely zen you start that for us unselfishly died on Calvary. Oh 386 00:29:56.680 --> 00:30:03.759 how you gave your life f bruise, scorned, crowned your head with on. 387 00:30:03.319 --> 00:30:10.680 No greater love beform for me. Nelvin you pay, Nelvin, you 388 00:30:11.000 --> 00:30:18.319 fee piercing your side, could barely breed, could have came down, jadd 389 00:30:18.400 --> 00:30:25.720 you remains standing in awe of the pride of pain. I never knew of 390 00:30:25.839 --> 00:30:30.079 a love so true. You gave a lie f and still I heard you 391 00:30:30.640 --> 00:30:37.240 lossom men, time to supply you a pin. But I repent forgive me 392 00:30:37.359 --> 00:30:47.000 for my seat. You paid it all, bone crawl you let die so 393 00:30:47.400 --> 00:30:52.880 here I am siring nerving the hole got him my cry, my knees up 394 00:30:53.119 --> 00:31:07.359 all you paid it all all, Oh, you paid it all oh oh, 395 00:31:07.920 --> 00:31:17.480 you paid it all, however your lives. I'm no good, ain't 396 00:31:17.519 --> 00:31:25.279 no money. I can't pay, and it's shade father blood you shame shed 397 00:31:25.440 --> 00:31:36.680 for my thing, shame surrender my heart behad by all as a living sacrifice. 398 00:31:36.880 --> 00:31:41.720 Lord, I give up everything that's not pleasing in your side so I 399 00:31:41.839 --> 00:31:51.279 can handle a last. You paid your life. You gave your life so 400 00:31:52.160 --> 00:32:00.680 right, So many times I rove the bad you for kidding from saying both 401 00:32:00.839 --> 00:32:16.000 cross you play you the song shan laud him my crossbow as you paid him. 402 00:32:17.920 --> 00:32:31.640 You're a cross you paid, You play your sad. You can't up 403 00:32:31.759 --> 00:32:38.799 joan. You sacrifice some of the temple marcass of the healthcare life. But 404 00:32:39.359 --> 00:32:51.799 you came off your plahamas so I can run storryself yourself. You paid it 405 00:32:51.920 --> 00:33:14.680 off upon the cross you play time. Huh oh you put the cross, 406 00:33:15.319 --> 00:33:21.720 you pass the time cold. Either of the loss shut her hair, smit 407 00:33:22.000 --> 00:33:31.160 is mind not him her fause you paid it. If you paid, you 408 00:33:31.480 --> 00:33:44.079 paid, Will you jill your lord? I want to thank you. You'll 409 00:33:44.200 --> 00:34:06.720 find an answer, yesterda we who canceled your past? Wait you pay do 410 00:34:06.880 --> 00:34:27.199 way there too to see you? You you you paid it all come on, 411 00:34:27.400 --> 00:34:34.519 come on, hello, hey me, Kirk, I need to speak 412 00:34:34.519 --> 00:34:40.039 to Bishop sure, hold on, all right, Hello, Hey, I 413 00:34:40.119 --> 00:34:45.599 got some stuff I need to talk to you about. Lately, Pastor. 414 00:34:45.639 --> 00:34:50.719 I've been having all these crazy kind of dreams. It's hard to sleep, 415 00:34:50.760 --> 00:34:52.679 I can't eat, it's scary. You know, I know what you mean. 416 00:34:53.239 --> 00:34:58.400 I mean, ever since that Tuesday seemed like like this's getting real strange, 417 00:35:00.039 --> 00:35:02.000 shoot an thracks, terrorist attacks, and I ain't even trying to get 418 00:35:02.000 --> 00:35:06.079 on a plane. God feel you. And you know when I try to 419 00:35:06.159 --> 00:35:08.320 pray that his voice killing it. God's not real, you know, that's 420 00:35:08.440 --> 00:35:12.199 just hiding me. Yeah, but you ain't feeling me, No, son, 421 00:35:12.320 --> 00:35:15.440 I know just how you feel. See, just because I preach and 422 00:35:15.599 --> 00:35:19.679 teach, don't lead or don't get scared sometimes yeah whatever, but you kiddy 423 00:35:19.800 --> 00:35:22.360 jake, But then I don't make a mistake. Well then they tell you 424 00:35:22.440 --> 00:35:25.960 what's on my mind. But your smile is gone. Yeah, but I 425 00:35:27.079 --> 00:35:34.840 feel so long although your heart is given. See, but you don't know 426 00:35:35.000 --> 00:35:38.599 mind. I mean a little sick and tired of off. She just got 427 00:35:38.719 --> 00:35:42.079 laid off, and the top it off, the rents too, So tell 428 00:35:42.159 --> 00:35:46.000 me what I got to gain? We'll see trials coming to make you storms, 429 00:35:46.400 --> 00:35:51.559 la. How can I trust God and all this myth? Well? 430 00:35:51.639 --> 00:35:54.480 See, that's the reason for a song. See wherever you go, that's 431 00:35:54.519 --> 00:35:58.679 one thing you got to know. God is writing there by your side. 432 00:36:00.119 --> 00:36:07.800 Man. You told me so, thank you for calling. It's always good 433 00:36:07.840 --> 00:36:09.440 to hear from you. Yeah, I gotta go now waiting. I have 434 00:36:09.519 --> 00:36:14.880 another call online too, But I ain't through. See, I'm thick and 435 00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:16.719 tired of all these church folks talking about stuff. And as bad as the 436 00:36:16.800 --> 00:36:20.559 things say, y'all don't feel my pain. I don't have pain. I 437 00:36:20.639 --> 00:36:22.480 don't see how you're on a couple of Time magazine. See, but you're 438 00:36:22.519 --> 00:36:25.679 looking at it now and you don't know how I struggled and what I've been 439 00:36:25.760 --> 00:36:30.320 through. Yeah, whatever, now you cross the line. I'm just speaking 440 00:36:30.400 --> 00:36:32.880 my mouth, okay, so let me speak mine too. I've had some 441 00:36:34.079 --> 00:36:37.760 mountains, I've seen some balance. I've even had to cry sometimes that when 442 00:36:37.760 --> 00:36:40.760 I lost my mother, your mother, my mother. I'm sorry, No, 443 00:36:40.880 --> 00:36:45.480 son is fine. Life is full of ups and downs. But God 444 00:36:45.559 --> 00:36:47.679 said the strong wold last long. But how'd you make it through? The 445 00:36:47.880 --> 00:36:52.519 boy? I thought you knew it was a love. They kept me strong, 446 00:36:52.639 --> 00:37:02.639 smileless, hell foe alone. Although your heart is of it, y'all 447 00:37:02.679 --> 00:37:07.360 don't feel mine. And I'm getting very stick of of all the ships got 448 00:37:07.440 --> 00:37:09.599 laid off in the tope, off the wrinch, Douke Ho, tell me 449 00:37:09.679 --> 00:37:15.719 this what I gotta gain till your trials come to me? And those who 450 00:37:15.039 --> 00:37:20.079 storms? How can I trust God in the midst of all this? Men? 451 00:37:20.639 --> 00:37:23.400 See, that's the reason for this song. Wherever you go the some 452 00:37:23.519 --> 00:37:35.039 of you got to know Gord Steel Care. That's not ninety one, Franklin 453 00:37:35.079 --> 00:37:37.719 say nine nine one. I'm thinking nine ninety nine. In the UK, 454 00:37:37.960 --> 00:37:42.679 I went back on talking point. Guys. We are joined by Tom, 455 00:37:43.280 --> 00:37:47.239 Andre and Mark and myself and as I said, Zenya and Angela are on 456 00:37:47.360 --> 00:37:52.840 the panel. They're just listening to us chump a bit about men's health and 457 00:37:53.159 --> 00:37:59.800 symptoms and issues that men go through mentally. We're gonna start with Anton and 458 00:38:00.079 --> 00:38:04.679 want to just go right off right with when it comes to the stigma, 459 00:38:04.960 --> 00:38:07.400 how do you think the stigma surrounded mental health and seeking help as a man, 460 00:38:08.760 --> 00:38:13.880 And if you have any like ideas like what will be an effective coping 461 00:38:14.079 --> 00:38:21.800 strategy for managing distress? Well, I think it starts when when we're young. 462 00:38:22.559 --> 00:38:28.280 I think it's something that is uh has to be taught. Unfortunately, 463 00:38:29.360 --> 00:38:31.840 uh, you know, the previous generations before us had to come from, 464 00:38:32.519 --> 00:38:36.519 you know, a place where they had to have some sort of immense strength, 465 00:38:36.760 --> 00:38:39.000 you know, because they faced all kinds of difficulties, you know, 466 00:38:39.760 --> 00:38:45.360 inequality, you know, all sorts. So even for me, if I 467 00:38:45.440 --> 00:38:49.920 think back from when I was young, my dad was real tough man. 468 00:38:50.000 --> 00:38:53.079 He was. He was tough. I know that, Andre, you might 469 00:38:53.960 --> 00:38:58.719 you know about my dad, and he was a bit different at home. 470 00:38:58.800 --> 00:39:00.079 You know, I don't know what he's like. I can't even remember too 471 00:39:00.199 --> 00:39:04.880 much, but it was tough. But but the world required him to be 472 00:39:05.000 --> 00:39:08.639 tough, so he was you know, he brought up, he was brought 473 00:39:08.719 --> 00:39:12.639 up in a really difficult place. I would say. He had a really 474 00:39:12.719 --> 00:39:17.119 tough upbringing. So everything about what he taught us, I would say, 475 00:39:17.239 --> 00:39:21.559 was about how to be tough and deal with the world because it's a it's 476 00:39:21.599 --> 00:39:28.119 a rough and hard place and there is no space for weakness. And that's 477 00:39:28.159 --> 00:39:30.400 what's just carried me through, you know, without even realizing. You don't 478 00:39:30.440 --> 00:39:34.320 even know, you know. And then I grew up and I've grown up 479 00:39:34.360 --> 00:39:39.000 in London, East London and East London. You know back in the day, 480 00:39:39.159 --> 00:39:43.559 it wasn't not rough rough, but you know he had its, had 481 00:39:43.599 --> 00:39:45.880 its, had its rough days sometimes, but it wasn't a place for the 482 00:39:45.920 --> 00:39:50.440 week, not really, you know, even when you're in school. So 483 00:39:50.800 --> 00:39:54.000 you didn't have any space to be weak, especially as a black man. 484 00:39:55.079 --> 00:39:59.239 You know, it was tough being black and then tough growing up in East 485 00:39:59.320 --> 00:40:04.719 London, so you had to you had to have something about you, and 486 00:40:05.000 --> 00:40:10.079 any kind of talk about your emotions or feelings was just weak. That's just 487 00:40:12.159 --> 00:40:17.679 what's that disagree with you? You're disagreeing, No, agreeing with you, 488 00:40:17.800 --> 00:40:21.119 you're agreeing? Okay, okay, cool cool cool? Yeah, yeah, 489 00:40:21.760 --> 00:40:23.639 it was. It was just you know, if you want to talk about 490 00:40:23.760 --> 00:40:28.719 feeling sad or feeling upset, you're just weak. You know they'll probably quelling 491 00:40:28.800 --> 00:40:34.159 something else, but they're weak. That's the word that me and man up, 492 00:40:34.639 --> 00:40:37.119 Man up, Man up? What do you mean sad? Upset? 493 00:40:37.199 --> 00:40:42.039 For what? You know? Come on, So as you grow up now 494 00:40:42.119 --> 00:40:45.039 and as I move into manhood, that's just been carried with me and I've 495 00:40:45.119 --> 00:40:57.559 never really learned how to be expressive outside of being tough. You know, 496 00:40:59.000 --> 00:41:04.039 doesn't matter how difficult the situation is lies ahead. I can't show that no 497 00:41:04.199 --> 00:41:09.159 way. I'd rather be wrong and strong. I rather fail, you know, 498 00:41:09.599 --> 00:41:14.960 trying. You know, there's no space for that. So I think 499 00:41:15.400 --> 00:41:21.800 it's something that has to be instilled in young men or boys from when we're 500 00:41:21.840 --> 00:41:27.760 young. But I think that teacher needs to come ideally from men, because 501 00:41:27.800 --> 00:41:30.760 I think women can show it quite well, because I think naturally they do. 502 00:41:31.400 --> 00:41:34.880 But I think we as men, once we I think we need to 503 00:41:34.960 --> 00:41:37.599 realize what mental health is. And once we've realized it, we need to 504 00:41:37.639 --> 00:41:38.840 say, Okay, you know what, I've been through a little bit of 505 00:41:38.880 --> 00:41:43.239 a rough life, if you like, I haven't been able to express myself. 506 00:41:43.239 --> 00:41:45.079 But I'm not going to allow my son to go through that as well. 507 00:41:45.199 --> 00:41:52.199 So I'm going to so that it's okay to express himself. It's not 508 00:41:52.360 --> 00:41:54.960 weak to do that. You know, you're any less of a man if 509 00:41:55.000 --> 00:42:01.239 you do. And I think that's how we change things. I definitely agree 510 00:42:01.239 --> 00:42:05.400 with you on that because I have a well, two of my oldest boys 511 00:42:05.400 --> 00:42:07.559 they men now, so they live in the States, but I have a 512 00:42:07.639 --> 00:42:12.559 fifty on he's dealing. He's dealing for a lot in the terms of he's 513 00:42:12.599 --> 00:42:15.880 in an all white school, he's the head boy, he's black, he's 514 00:42:15.920 --> 00:42:20.400 popular, but he goes through he goes through stretches where I can see he 515 00:42:20.519 --> 00:42:23.559 just mentally burnt down and he doesn't know how to express himself. And I'm 516 00:42:23.599 --> 00:42:30.920 trying to teach him how to express himself being a black man in a predominantly 517 00:42:31.000 --> 00:42:37.840 white school, but also just also not to be too aggressive and doing so, 518 00:42:37.000 --> 00:42:39.920 like I will probably be aggressive doing it like I was, like you 519 00:42:40.000 --> 00:42:45.840 said, you know, like I'd rather be wrong. You know that's that 520 00:42:45.920 --> 00:42:49.119 friend. Strong, Yeah, wong and strong, But there's the other thing, 521 00:42:49.239 --> 00:42:52.480 like you know, you you beke for forgetness after like do it, 522 00:42:52.639 --> 00:42:54.480 and then you beg for the forginness after its you know, like no, 523 00:42:54.760 --> 00:42:59.039 sometimes you have to realize, Okay, maybe I need to step back, 524 00:42:59.119 --> 00:43:00.840 take a minute, you know, take a breath, and then go about 525 00:43:00.880 --> 00:43:07.159 the right way. You know. So you're trying to teach him that and 526 00:43:07.400 --> 00:43:10.119 just trying to get him to stand up for himself because I think sometimes he 527 00:43:10.239 --> 00:43:15.079 just wants to be an ink, you know, he wants to be liked 528 00:43:15.280 --> 00:43:19.440 because he is such an outsider that he may do things that I'm like, 529 00:43:19.760 --> 00:43:22.440 you know, that's a little that's a little on the line that you need 530 00:43:22.559 --> 00:43:25.360 to be more aggressive and saying I'm not going to do that, you know. 531 00:43:25.800 --> 00:43:31.360 But yeah, definitely just thinking because that's a lot what you just said 532 00:43:31.400 --> 00:43:36.239 to unpack, because it's I think it's something that is meant we go through. 533 00:43:36.599 --> 00:43:38.320 We go through it every day, and like you said, if I'm 534 00:43:38.360 --> 00:43:43.039 young and we don't realize the stress that our young adults are going through, 535 00:43:43.440 --> 00:43:47.719 the stress and the pressure, especially nowadays with social media, that our kids 536 00:43:47.760 --> 00:43:53.159 are going through trying to navigate, you know, being a teenager trying to 537 00:43:53.239 --> 00:43:57.119 go into an adult, trying to do the right thing, trying to be 538 00:43:57.199 --> 00:44:00.679 a Christian, trying to be seven adventors, trying to just be do the 539 00:44:00.800 --> 00:44:06.480 right thing. It's very difficult nowadays as not when we was growing up as 540 00:44:06.519 --> 00:44:10.079 it were. Andrea, I see you have thoughts, So go ahead. 541 00:44:12.199 --> 00:44:17.880 I kind of want to include what Antoine just said. I think it also 542 00:44:19.000 --> 00:44:23.360 includes it's not just for men. This is in general, but I'm going 543 00:44:23.400 --> 00:44:27.719 to say it most in terms of men. It's okay to making mistakes. 544 00:44:28.920 --> 00:44:32.280 It's okay to mess up sometimes because we don't have that even in the schooling 545 00:44:32.320 --> 00:44:37.480 system, you're punished for making mistakes. You know, you have the perfect 546 00:44:37.480 --> 00:44:40.760 score if we get it. But as we are adults, you learn, 547 00:44:40.840 --> 00:44:46.159 and you realize that mistakes and this opportunities learning opportunity. If you see it 548 00:44:46.239 --> 00:44:50.840 more as that, rather than as a failure to making mistakes or or even 549 00:44:50.960 --> 00:44:57.719 feeling at something fine, if you feel cool, dust off, reflect what 550 00:44:57.840 --> 00:45:01.639 you learn from that, and you go again, rather than being a sign 551 00:45:01.679 --> 00:45:09.199 of weakness or a sign of fuel your full stop, If that makes any 552 00:45:09.239 --> 00:45:14.320 sense. I think that also kind of ties into our mental health and the 553 00:45:14.400 --> 00:45:17.639 confidence that we carry ourselves with. Yeah, and the confidence we have in 554 00:45:17.719 --> 00:45:22.639 ourselves. Make a mistake is part of life, is actually a good thing. 555 00:45:23.119 --> 00:45:28.719 How many many times? How many game points have did Michael Jordan miss 556 00:45:29.719 --> 00:45:32.199 before she won? We know how many rings you got? How many times 557 00:45:32.280 --> 00:45:35.920 he won the game? For the for the Lakers, for the role. 558 00:45:36.039 --> 00:45:42.320 Sorry, but there's a lot of shots in the meantime. It's all perfect. 559 00:45:42.320 --> 00:45:44.400 It's all part of the game. You know what's funny. I'm not 560 00:45:44.559 --> 00:45:52.480 my good fan, so I've seen I've now started to see just following what 561 00:45:52.480 --> 00:45:54.280 you say, Andrea, I've started to see, you know, there's a 562 00:45:54.320 --> 00:45:59.079 few if you like celebrities, if you like now sort of talking about mental 563 00:45:59.159 --> 00:46:05.639 health, which is good because well that's who the younger generation usually look up 564 00:46:05.679 --> 00:46:12.000 to. But saying that, I still don't think they give it the raw 565 00:46:12.800 --> 00:46:15.159 language that it needs, you know, I mean, I don't think the 566 00:46:15.280 --> 00:46:19.800 raw truth about it comes across. Like the younger lot. They still they 567 00:46:19.840 --> 00:46:22.000 look on social media and I see a little saying a look quote, and 568 00:46:22.000 --> 00:46:24.159 it's got nice, lovely music around it, and you know, nice graphics 569 00:46:24.239 --> 00:46:30.679 and that's it. But the ugly truth of what it can lead to. 570 00:46:31.000 --> 00:46:36.679 I don't think that necessarily comes across, do you know what I mean? 571 00:46:36.719 --> 00:46:38.719 I feel like that's what we need to that's what we need to do to 572 00:46:39.000 --> 00:46:44.320 to to change it. I think we as men who have now gone through 573 00:46:44.320 --> 00:46:47.559 it, need to give the raw truths to the younger, to the younger 574 00:46:47.639 --> 00:46:52.800 generations, to say this is what it's really like. If you don't recognize 575 00:46:53.960 --> 00:47:00.199 what mental health is from an earlier age and see your point. I let's 576 00:47:00.199 --> 00:47:04.760 see your point. Because you're talking like just raising raising boys. You gotta 577 00:47:04.960 --> 00:47:09.280 show, like you said, we afraid to make mistakes for like, so 578 00:47:09.519 --> 00:47:13.719 for me personally, I'm not afraid to make a mistake. I'd bother make 579 00:47:13.760 --> 00:47:15.800 a mistake. You tell me I did something wrong, then fix it. 580 00:47:15.400 --> 00:47:20.920 Then try to go through the whole process of trying to cover up the mistake 581 00:47:21.000 --> 00:47:22.800 with like white lives or whatever, you know, whatever you want to call 582 00:47:22.840 --> 00:47:29.159 it, and teaching or even talk to young people, tell them that you 583 00:47:29.239 --> 00:47:31.599 know you like be truthful. I think that's more than anything else, is 584 00:47:31.719 --> 00:47:36.360 just be truthful with yourself or what what you're doing and what you're not doing 585 00:47:37.320 --> 00:47:39.920 and if you're and then telling them to if you haven't an issue, if 586 00:47:39.920 --> 00:47:42.639 you haven't a problem, to police, come talk to me. If you 587 00:47:42.679 --> 00:47:45.360 can't talk to me, talk to somebody else, like I tell my children. 588 00:47:45.360 --> 00:47:47.199 If you can't talk to us, then talk to God. If you 589 00:47:47.239 --> 00:47:51.679 can't talk to God, talk to the elder, talk to the talk to 590 00:47:51.800 --> 00:47:55.159 somebody. It's always talk to whoever you feel comfortable talking to. But just 591 00:47:55.280 --> 00:48:00.519 talk, yeah, you know, and just get that. How do we 592 00:48:00.599 --> 00:48:04.519 help someone of them play when they when they need to talk to someone, 593 00:48:05.280 --> 00:48:07.960 Well, how do we have for the symptoms out this is getting to a 594 00:48:08.000 --> 00:48:14.159 point where I need something. Well, that's gonna be a mark question right 595 00:48:14.199 --> 00:48:20.280 there. Let's be jumping here. You know, we notice takement. Big 596 00:48:20.360 --> 00:48:24.559 boys don't graft, you know, and yet still as men, we died 597 00:48:24.639 --> 00:48:30.559 ten years younger earlier than women. And because of the fact that what is 598 00:48:30.760 --> 00:48:39.119 happening is you have to we have to look at the psychological new psychological also 599 00:48:39.679 --> 00:48:46.440 different things that is happening within our assystem. No. Anto one, you 600 00:48:46.760 --> 00:48:52.280 talk about the way your dad brought you up. One of the problems that 601 00:48:52.440 --> 00:48:55.320 we have is that our parents, a lot of us, most of us 602 00:48:55.880 --> 00:49:00.199 comes easily say that our parents did not teach us how to emotion and you 603 00:49:00.320 --> 00:49:05.280 regulate because they didn't know how to do that. They come from a system. 604 00:49:05.719 --> 00:49:08.480 It's not like most of us come from either the Caribbean or Africa or 605 00:49:08.559 --> 00:49:13.159 wherever we're coming from, and they don't know how to do that. So 606 00:49:13.519 --> 00:49:17.840 basically what happens is that when we get these pressures, you have to think 607 00:49:17.920 --> 00:49:22.920 about there's something that we a hormone that we call cordisol, not cortisoon, 608 00:49:23.079 --> 00:49:30.880 cortisol within the system that is that is responsible for a lot flight fight flight 609 00:49:31.000 --> 00:49:37.719 and fight flight freeze flop mode, the kind of thing you know of which 610 00:49:37.800 --> 00:49:44.800 cordisole mixed with different other hormones can either get you out of the situation, 611 00:49:45.360 --> 00:49:47.400 put you you know, fight your way out of the situation, or you 612 00:49:47.480 --> 00:49:52.239 freeze or your flop. The problem is is that we don't know how to 613 00:49:52.360 --> 00:49:57.119 regulate. And because of that, you find that while women has the tool 614 00:49:57.239 --> 00:50:00.559 of crying, there are two ways cortisol comes out of for our body, 615 00:50:00.039 --> 00:50:06.519 were two major ways, really crying, two tear drops cortisol comes out of 616 00:50:06.599 --> 00:50:10.199 our body, and by exercising. But it's how we exercise that would bring 617 00:50:10.320 --> 00:50:14.199 cortisols out to the body. Now, a woman would cry, and she 618 00:50:14.280 --> 00:50:16.719 would have a good cry, and she feels good about it. But because 619 00:50:16.800 --> 00:50:22.119 we were taught big boys don't cry, we keep it in. Cortisole stays 620 00:50:22.280 --> 00:50:27.920 there and it's a block on so it blocks a whole lot of other good 621 00:50:28.039 --> 00:50:34.239 hormones and other good things. When the cortisol hits things like for men, 622 00:50:34.840 --> 00:50:38.239 testosterone and so on and so forth, cortosole produces a whole lot of different 623 00:50:39.119 --> 00:50:45.960 crazy results in both men and women. Yeah, so there are a lot 624 00:50:46.039 --> 00:50:52.320 of things that we need to understand about what is happening to our bodies when 625 00:50:52.440 --> 00:50:58.800 we hold in these things. What we've learned to do as men is basically 626 00:50:59.079 --> 00:51:04.599 just suck it up and move on, you know. And I learned a 627 00:51:04.840 --> 00:51:07.960 hard the hard way when I first keep to England. I learned the hard 628 00:51:08.039 --> 00:51:14.320 way in terms of not saying anything to anybody, because it came to a 629 00:51:14.440 --> 00:51:20.000 point where one day, I remember when I came to England with six years 630 00:51:20.079 --> 00:51:22.840 within me being in England, and one night I said to my wife, 631 00:51:22.880 --> 00:51:28.679 I said, are you going to I'm grew up in Canada. Are you 632 00:51:28.760 --> 00:51:30.880 going to Canada with me? She's like, I don't know. And I 633 00:51:31.000 --> 00:51:36.039 said to her, if I don't get off this island, I'll put the 634 00:51:36.079 --> 00:51:42.400 gun to my head. And then she realized that I was going through ten 635 00:51:42.599 --> 00:51:46.719 years of depression because in my life I've never seen so much rain in a 636 00:51:46.880 --> 00:51:54.000 country in my life. I could not handle it. You know. At 637 00:51:54.039 --> 00:51:58.519 this point in time, I'm half through my art because there's so much rain 638 00:51:58.639 --> 00:52:02.800 happening now. But basically, these are the things that we've learned as men 639 00:52:04.039 --> 00:52:07.000 that you know what you shouldn't basically say this, You should talk for you 640 00:52:07.079 --> 00:52:13.000 should. You know, it's difficult for a man because if we show a 641 00:52:13.079 --> 00:52:19.320 little bit of emotions, people just want us to show very little emotions. 642 00:52:20.480 --> 00:52:24.559 If you show too much, you're a way. If don't show, you 643 00:52:24.679 --> 00:52:29.280 don't have any emotions. So a lot of times with us as men get 644 00:52:29.360 --> 00:52:31.280 caught in a rock and a hard place. We don't know what to do 645 00:52:31.760 --> 00:52:40.719 because emotions it is so much on us because we don't know how actually do 646 00:52:42.000 --> 00:52:47.000 this. No one teaches a man how to dispel these feelings what's happening the 647 00:52:47.239 --> 00:52:52.880 No one teaches us how to do that. So that's one of the difficulties 648 00:52:52.119 --> 00:52:58.960 in being a man in church in their day to day life. How do 649 00:52:59.079 --> 00:53:01.800 we do this? And I think that's what you're talking about, Antoine, 650 00:53:02.159 --> 00:53:07.760 both Antoine and Andrew in terms of how we need to start to speak up 651 00:53:07.800 --> 00:53:12.280 about this other stuff. And I haven't even this is not even the surface. 652 00:53:12.360 --> 00:53:16.039 I'm scratchy because to the fact that there is so much when we need 653 00:53:16.119 --> 00:53:21.719 to look at our behavior patterns, behold in a lot of things, and 654 00:53:22.039 --> 00:53:30.000 and then what we do it comes out in like volcanic effect. You know, 655 00:53:30.199 --> 00:53:34.440 we just blew for you know, the de straw that broke the camels 656 00:53:34.519 --> 00:53:37.599 back, and we blow for things that really actually doesn't even need that. 657 00:53:37.840 --> 00:53:43.480 So these are the things that we need to talk about and in our churches, 658 00:53:43.920 --> 00:53:46.480 in our homes. How do we deal with that, How do we 659 00:53:46.760 --> 00:53:54.599 basically help our young men to emotionally regulate because we're seeing them doing some crazy 660 00:53:54.800 --> 00:54:00.599 things out there in terms of cause of the fact that they don't know how 661 00:54:00.760 --> 00:54:06.639 to deal with the emotions. Yeah, no, trust me, I'll shut 662 00:54:06.679 --> 00:54:09.719 it there for not I was going to what you're talking about. So like 663 00:54:09.800 --> 00:54:15.519 with the church, I know, I know, like growing up in the 664 00:54:15.639 --> 00:54:19.679 church, we usually have rap sessions. We don't do that anymore in their 665 00:54:19.760 --> 00:54:24.119 church. We used to give the youth manning boys and girls and just chop 666 00:54:24.159 --> 00:54:27.440 it up. Sometimes we just have the boys. Sometimes we just have the 667 00:54:27.480 --> 00:54:29.639 girls, you know, like you even will separate them, have all the 668 00:54:29.800 --> 00:54:31.480 all the girls and then all the boys. And you have like the elders, 669 00:54:31.559 --> 00:54:36.480 or you have like Antoine or Andre not even an elder, just a 670 00:54:36.639 --> 00:54:38.719 member of the church. They may be going through some things that can that 671 00:54:38.880 --> 00:54:43.800 can relate to the children. And talk to the children and you know, 672 00:54:44.519 --> 00:54:47.760 try to get them to understand or try to get them to open up and 673 00:54:49.519 --> 00:54:52.880 what you just said, like to teach them, you know, like it's 674 00:54:52.920 --> 00:54:57.519 okay to feel, it's okay to not not you know, not the hold 675 00:54:57.559 --> 00:55:00.719 it is. It's okay to let it out. I don't know how the 676 00:55:00.840 --> 00:55:05.159 churches out here that in that aspect, because you know, in the sense 677 00:55:05.239 --> 00:55:08.400 of I know we have some like a Y was a thing of that we 678 00:55:08.480 --> 00:55:10.960 did on a regular basis. I know, some churches do AY here, 679 00:55:12.039 --> 00:55:15.719 some churches don't. And then after AY then we would have the session and 680 00:55:15.760 --> 00:55:20.079 you know, oh you have it in between like lunch. After lunch we 681 00:55:20.119 --> 00:55:22.599 have like an hour or thirty minutes or forty five minutes of a session before 682 00:55:22.639 --> 00:55:24.920 you had a Y. You know, like we spent the whole day in 683 00:55:25.000 --> 00:55:29.639 church. I don't know, we don't do that like that anymore here in 684 00:55:29.719 --> 00:55:31.920 the UK. This was in the US. I think that would be a 685 00:55:31.960 --> 00:55:38.199 good way because I think the church is just as much needs to get involved 686 00:55:39.079 --> 00:55:42.880 and helping our young people as much as also at home, because as I 687 00:55:42.960 --> 00:55:45.320 say, you know, it takes a village to raise a child, and 688 00:55:45.400 --> 00:55:47.000 I think some somewhere along the way, we got away from the village and 689 00:55:47.039 --> 00:55:51.000 we just went to you know, like just leaving it to the parents. 690 00:55:51.920 --> 00:55:54.719 And even though the parents it is the responsibility of the parents to do that, 691 00:55:55.639 --> 00:55:59.159 I think it's also good. Sometimes you know, you gotta look at 692 00:55:59.159 --> 00:56:01.719 the parents to see do they need help? Then they need some instruction, 693 00:56:01.800 --> 00:56:06.400 Do they need some kind of guidance on what they need to on what they 694 00:56:06.480 --> 00:56:09.960 need to do or to help with their children that may be giving them a 695 00:56:10.000 --> 00:56:15.039 hard time because sometimes parents, as parents, sometimes we just we get so 696 00:56:15.280 --> 00:56:19.119 emotionally stressed that we just kind of notot give up, but we just kind 697 00:56:19.159 --> 00:56:22.360 of like become what's that word, like I don't know what to do now? 698 00:56:22.639 --> 00:56:25.320 Like you know, we're just like we're at our ends rope and we 699 00:56:25.360 --> 00:56:28.760 don't know what to do. Can somebody help me in? But there's no 700 00:56:28.880 --> 00:56:31.719 help coming, and then that's when everything kind of goes off the rails. 701 00:56:31.760 --> 00:56:40.519 But you agree with that, mark or am I little after myself? I'll 702 00:56:40.559 --> 00:56:47.000 see this the problem we have. Let me give an example, and this 703 00:56:47.239 --> 00:56:52.920 is some I'm not seeing all churches, but sometimes I look at it from 704 00:56:52.960 --> 00:56:57.639 this perspective. I remember a number of years ago I had the young people, 705 00:56:57.760 --> 00:57:06.519 and I call it jam session Jesus and me right and and and and 706 00:57:07.159 --> 00:57:12.199 the young people were coming and we were discussing the kind of issues and they 707 00:57:12.280 --> 00:57:15.639 were flocking and bringing friends from their school and so on and so forth. 708 00:57:16.199 --> 00:57:24.000 Uh, and sometimes us as adults feel that, you know what, we're 709 00:57:24.159 --> 00:57:30.360 talking too much of the worldly things. And so what did the guys did 710 00:57:30.639 --> 00:57:35.159 was a few elders came and they hijacked. They hijacked and next thing, 711 00:57:35.280 --> 00:57:39.440 you know what is for us when for us men a lot of times when 712 00:57:39.719 --> 00:57:45.719 we don't want to go deeper in conversation, we just moved towards religiosity. 713 00:57:46.000 --> 00:57:50.519 You know what, somebody do a vest but somebody do something and we go 714 00:57:50.679 --> 00:57:53.320 to the Bible. And I'm not saying that the Bible is not important. 715 00:57:53.440 --> 00:57:59.840 It is. But the young people need to talk about these issues. That's 716 00:58:00.079 --> 00:58:05.000 what is hindering these young people. The reason why a lot of AYS programs 717 00:58:05.119 --> 00:58:12.320 are dying within our churches is because us as adults have no connection with what 718 00:58:13.400 --> 00:58:16.199 is happening to the young people now. And so our programs are still stuck 719 00:58:16.239 --> 00:58:21.679 in the sixties and seventies. And basically the young people are in the twenty 720 00:58:21.719 --> 00:58:27.800 first century, So what is going to happen? We are still singing songs 721 00:58:27.920 --> 00:58:30.920 like love is a flap, flow and high when the young people are basically 722 00:58:31.000 --> 00:58:38.199 stabbing each other. If I can jumping off the back of that that I 723 00:58:38.280 --> 00:58:44.199 haven't been in the church for a long time. I used to. I 724 00:58:44.280 --> 00:58:46.079 grew up a shafter church. Then I was in KA church a very very 725 00:58:46.119 --> 00:58:54.000 long time. And thinking back on it now, I can't really put opin 726 00:58:54.119 --> 00:58:59.639 on the reason why I haven't been there, but I know when I was 727 00:58:59.679 --> 00:59:02.480 young, was bored. It was boring. It was boring for me. 728 00:59:05.039 --> 00:59:08.000 There were periods where it was really lively. I don't I can't remember all 729 00:59:08.039 --> 00:59:12.519 the posses that we had in but some were, you know, quite with 730 00:59:12.639 --> 00:59:15.239 it if you like. The youth loved the church, and there's a lot 731 00:59:15.280 --> 00:59:16.880 of a lot of a lot of things going on. There were music days 732 00:59:17.000 --> 00:59:22.840 and youth days and all this kind of stuff. But then after that you 733 00:59:22.920 --> 00:59:29.039 just got really boring and really dull. And what that meant is I was 734 00:59:29.119 --> 00:59:32.360 drawn to things outside the church. Yeah, my brethroom's at school and stuff, 735 00:59:32.480 --> 00:59:36.920 you know. And because these are the guys, because I'm not really 736 00:59:37.159 --> 00:59:38.920 being taught about, you know, the world and how it's going to affect 737 00:59:38.960 --> 00:59:43.800 me mentally and emotionally, and all this stuff from my dad so much because 738 00:59:43.840 --> 00:59:46.719 he didn't know how I'm getting that from my friends who also don't know how 739 00:59:47.280 --> 00:59:53.679 because they're in the same position anyway. So we're just kind of it's just 740 00:59:53.920 --> 00:59:58.920 a bunch of uneducated people, I feel like about the world teaching each other, 741 00:59:59.760 --> 01:00:04.960 you know, and we don't really know what's worth and just struggling our 742 01:00:05.280 --> 01:00:09.920 way through life and all that kind of stuff. And I've often thought that, 743 01:00:10.039 --> 01:00:15.760 you know what, there's there's times where I felt that the Seventh day 744 01:00:15.760 --> 01:00:20.679 Adventist Church, if it adopted some of the ways that I've even seen the 745 01:00:20.760 --> 01:00:24.239 Pentecostal churches do things with the youth, will be in a much better position. 746 01:00:24.280 --> 01:00:27.440 There's a lot of a lot of guys that I went to church with 747 01:00:27.559 --> 01:00:30.159 back in the day offered in Strafford, and they got to Sunday Church now 748 01:00:30.239 --> 01:00:31.960 Pentecostal Church. And the reason why they do that is because they're getting a 749 01:00:31.960 --> 01:00:37.519 lot of they're getting a lot of environment. They talk among each other and 750 01:00:37.840 --> 01:00:42.079 like Mark said, they talk about things that are going on in the world, 751 01:00:42.280 --> 01:00:45.679 relevant things. They always bring it back and they always tie it back, 752 01:00:45.760 --> 01:00:50.679 which is great. Yeah, but they're talking about things that because look, 753 01:00:50.719 --> 01:00:52.039 we're in church one day a week, you know, we're in church 754 01:00:52.519 --> 01:00:55.320 one day out of the seven days. The other six days were in the 755 01:00:55.400 --> 01:01:00.960 world. So most of the things that impact us are outside, and if 756 01:01:01.000 --> 01:01:07.719 we're not talking about what's going on outside, then then then what help I 757 01:01:07.760 --> 01:01:12.679 think? I think what you also not just that, I think what Mark 758 01:01:12.800 --> 01:01:15.840 just said, Well, you just said, actually when men like they hijacked 759 01:01:17.039 --> 01:01:22.440 children don't like to be judged. Yeah, And that's part of the And 760 01:01:22.599 --> 01:01:24.880 I'm just being I'm just being frankly honest. I mean, I've seen I've 761 01:01:24.880 --> 01:01:30.360 seen some sessions where I've had you sessions in the church and the elder just 762 01:01:30.239 --> 01:01:34.880 just pray to God and it will be okay. Doesn't always work that way. 763 01:01:35.000 --> 01:01:38.039 God is the main focus of what we are talking about. But we 764 01:01:38.239 --> 01:01:43.639 need to be able to to bring, like you said, bring the twenty 765 01:01:43.679 --> 01:01:46.480 first century into it and be a little bit, you know, off cuff 766 01:01:46.559 --> 01:01:51.559 or be a little bit off off the beaten path, you know, so 767 01:01:51.639 --> 01:01:53.639 that we can relate because, as you said, like you know, after 768 01:01:54.079 --> 01:01:59.159 it just becomes like it just becomes boring and you're like, oh, they're 769 01:01:59.239 --> 01:02:01.400 just gonna throw a whole bunch of Bible verses at me, and that's not 770 01:02:01.480 --> 01:02:05.960 what I need right now. You know, the Bible verses can come at 771 01:02:06.000 --> 01:02:09.480 points throughout the conversation, you know, to make a point. But when 772 01:02:09.480 --> 01:02:15.400 you just thought bombarding all Bible verses, are you just going as Mark sid 773 01:02:15.559 --> 01:02:21.679 just with the with that that out of just biblically all the way through it. 774 01:02:22.079 --> 01:02:24.000 Sometimes some people, especially when they're not in the especially when some of 775 01:02:24.039 --> 01:02:27.639 the members are not even of the church. And that's how we can get 776 01:02:27.679 --> 01:02:30.159 more young people into the church, if we can show that we can be 777 01:02:30.320 --> 01:02:35.679 more proactive and not judgmental, because I think that's that's the main thing is. 778 01:02:35.760 --> 01:02:37.760 You know, it just comes off as being judgmental. Oh, you 779 01:02:37.800 --> 01:02:40.039 know, you do this, You're gonna go to hell. You do this, 780 01:02:40.119 --> 01:02:43.320 You're gonna you're not gonna be saved. You do this, you're gonna 781 01:02:43.519 --> 01:02:45.840 you're gonna die. You know. It's it's not it's not that we all 782 01:02:45.920 --> 01:02:51.079 sin and come short. But it doesn't mean that because I sin, I'm 783 01:02:51.159 --> 01:02:53.360 gonna die. I sin, ask God for forgiveness. God forgives me. 784 01:02:53.920 --> 01:02:57.519 I move on. I try not to make that sin again. That's that's 785 01:02:57.559 --> 01:03:00.400 how God has That's how I was taught, you know, That's how I 786 01:03:00.519 --> 01:03:05.239 was taught in the sense of we're gonna make mistakes, but God forgives us. 787 01:03:05.320 --> 01:03:07.400 And it's funny because God forgives us, but we can't forgive each other. 788 01:03:10.079 --> 01:03:13.400 We always holding onto the past. We always holding on to what you 789 01:03:13.440 --> 01:03:16.320 did negative was holding on to what the problem is. You know, instead 790 01:03:16.360 --> 01:03:19.880 of trying to fix the problem, we want to keep talking about the problem. 791 01:03:20.280 --> 01:03:23.760 That's not fixing the problem. I just thought throw that out there in 792 01:03:23.800 --> 01:03:30.159 that In that sense, I want to ask a question Mark, how do 793 01:03:30.239 --> 01:03:32.239 you I think I think Andrew actually asked this question, but I'm asking you 794 01:03:32.239 --> 01:03:37.559 again about how do you know when when we do need help? As a 795 01:03:37.599 --> 01:03:42.280 male, like, how can we how can we decipher? But how can 796 01:03:42.320 --> 01:03:45.920 we recognize for ourselves? Because I think sometimes it's men we don't even realize 797 01:03:45.960 --> 01:03:50.119 that we need help. We we kind of just push and push and pushing, 798 01:03:50.199 --> 01:03:52.400 and we start working too much over I know I've done it where we're 799 01:03:52.440 --> 01:03:57.519 just working and working and working, but you're just hurting yourself more and more. 800 01:03:57.760 --> 01:04:00.519 So, how can you? What do you? How do you? 801 01:04:00.599 --> 01:04:05.519 How can you? What are some point recognize when someone needs There are certain 802 01:04:06.880 --> 01:04:15.760 behavior patterns, psychological, physiological symptoms that comes about when us as men, 803 01:04:16.239 --> 01:04:20.960 basically we get snappy. Some of us basically get more quiet than we are. 804 01:04:21.239 --> 01:04:28.920 Some of us withdraw we tend to basically get more aggressive a lot of 805 01:04:29.039 --> 01:04:33.519 times. Here's a few things that happening to our young men. Also in 806 01:04:33.719 --> 01:04:42.000 terms of the addictions. You have to not going to get into the pornography 807 01:04:42.039 --> 01:04:45.199 and so on and so forth as much as yet, but you know, 808 01:04:45.280 --> 01:04:49.559 pornography and substance addiction and uh and so on, an alcohol and these other 809 01:04:49.639 --> 01:04:55.280 things. So there's a lot of things that happening. You find that men 810 01:04:55.480 --> 01:05:00.039 start to lose weight and start to lose the motivation, going into depression and 811 01:05:00.199 --> 01:05:08.360 these anxiety something also big among men that we don't really and truly even notice 812 01:05:08.559 --> 01:05:15.880 because of the fact that men do comfort anxiety. Wherein you can you look 813 01:05:15.920 --> 01:05:18.119 at the man and he looks very comfortable and nice and so on and so 814 01:05:18.239 --> 01:05:23.360 forth. But I call it the swany fact. You know, I'm pretty 815 01:05:23.400 --> 01:05:26.719 out of the top. But then look under the water and my foot is 816 01:05:26.800 --> 01:05:30.920 paddling like crazy because I'm trying to figure out about the family. I try 817 01:05:30.000 --> 01:05:36.480 to figure out about work. Next day, someone I'm I'm being bullied at 818 01:05:36.599 --> 01:05:41.880 work. I'm all these things, am I go the man in my home, 819 01:05:42.239 --> 01:05:45.559 all these things men are thinking about. But because of the fact that 820 01:05:46.360 --> 01:05:53.920 we all look uniform and I normally talk to my wife about this uniformity Christianity, 821 01:05:54.280 --> 01:06:00.239 we all look alike, and we there not basically talk each other about, 822 01:06:00.360 --> 01:06:08.800 actually, how are you feeling what's happening? And that's where one say 823 01:06:09.039 --> 01:06:13.679 you've got a prayer about a prayer. Pray sis the pray because I may 824 01:06:13.800 --> 01:06:18.000 not be able to take on what you will regard to take on me, 825 01:06:19.519 --> 01:06:25.519 and so you keep your stuff to yourself and I keep mine to myself. 826 01:06:26.719 --> 01:06:31.039 And so a lot of times we sit down and we look at the men 827 01:06:31.159 --> 01:06:38.119 in church, men on a whole. You see them struggling. But because 828 01:06:38.159 --> 01:06:44.280 we all basically work thought that we should not. Here's my mom and I 829 01:06:44.440 --> 01:06:47.199 know a lot of us parents will say, don't air your dirty laundry in 830 01:06:47.320 --> 01:06:56.920 public. Then basically we just to ourselves. They say I did when I 831 01:06:57.119 --> 01:07:03.400 was writing a research paper when I was doing my as traumatologies, and it 832 01:07:03.519 --> 01:07:09.760 says a black man is twenty times more likely to commit suicide than his white 833 01:07:09.800 --> 01:07:20.960 counterpart. Yeah, yeah, definitely. And because of the fact that and 834 01:07:21.400 --> 01:07:30.800 what I wrote it on is what I wrote the paper on is it is 835 01:07:30.920 --> 01:07:39.880 the normal normalization of PTSD and complex complex trauma within the black and ethnic minority 836 01:07:40.039 --> 01:07:47.119 community. Before we even go out as black men, we are already seen 837 01:07:47.360 --> 01:07:51.480 as dangerous. We don't even have to basically do anything or open normal. 838 01:07:53.079 --> 01:07:58.199 We see all these things basically common us and we have it, and we 839 01:07:58.320 --> 01:08:02.480 can sit down in church and talk about these things, but we don't because 840 01:08:02.519 --> 01:08:06.719 of the fact that we just want one more sermon. I stop listening to 841 01:08:08.119 --> 01:08:10.920 not that I stop listening to sermons, but I'm I'm gonna say this. 842 01:08:11.159 --> 01:08:14.480 I don't need another sermon to take me into heaven. I made that decision 843 01:08:14.519 --> 01:08:19.000 already. What I need is a brother or a sister to help me to 844 01:08:19.119 --> 01:08:27.399 get there, not a sermon. And if all of us have basically made 845 01:08:27.479 --> 01:08:31.159 that decision to make it into heaven, then the Bible is right, Jesus 846 01:08:31.199 --> 01:08:35.800 said. But no, what how we make disciples out of each other is 847 01:08:35.920 --> 01:08:41.399 not by a sermon. It's by our life and by how we basically deal 848 01:08:41.680 --> 01:08:46.239 with each other. So we are doing we all focus in. That is 849 01:08:46.279 --> 01:08:53.000 why the church also is dying, because we focus in inwardly and we're imploding 850 01:08:53.680 --> 01:09:00.720 when the message should go outwardly. Yeah, that's the thing that's on that 851 01:09:00.800 --> 01:09:06.800 subject of I was just thinking because as myself personally, I agree with you 852 01:09:06.920 --> 01:09:11.800 on that aspect of the church. The church is the main cog and what 853 01:09:11.960 --> 01:09:16.119 we need. But I think also too, as fathers, it's our responsibility 854 01:09:16.239 --> 01:09:20.600 to, like with my with my family, we have worship every every night 855 01:09:21.520 --> 01:09:26.760 even if we don't have and doing that worship is weird because sometimes you know, 856 01:09:26.960 --> 01:09:30.399 my children sit down. My wife is very in tune with their feelings 857 01:09:30.920 --> 01:09:32.239 one than I am. And I admit that because I'm out most of the 858 01:09:32.319 --> 01:09:35.520 day. So I come in and I can see sometimes something's not right, 859 01:09:36.119 --> 01:09:40.239 but she's already got them from when they got home, and then she'll say, 860 01:09:40.279 --> 01:09:42.920 hey, something's not right with junior, or something's not right with your 861 01:09:43.000 --> 01:09:45.000 daughter, you know. So then I started observing it when I get home, 862 01:09:45.039 --> 01:09:48.439 and I'm like, okay, So when we have worship, we'll we'll 863 01:09:48.520 --> 01:09:51.560 bring the biblical part with the worship, but then also in the worship we'll 864 01:09:51.600 --> 01:09:57.319 also sometimes we'll end up having a thirty forty five in hour session of just 865 01:09:57.439 --> 01:10:01.159 talking like what's going on on, guys, how is your day? Tell 866 01:10:01.199 --> 01:10:05.319 me how your day went, and then let them express how they feel Okay, 867 01:10:05.359 --> 01:10:09.079 how can we fix it? How can we deal with it? How 868 01:10:09.159 --> 01:10:12.279 can we you know, navigate through this. Even if they go to bed 869 01:10:12.359 --> 01:10:15.880 late, I'd rather them go to bed late, but go to bed and 870 01:10:15.960 --> 01:10:18.199 a good frame of mind, then to go to bed and that frame of 871 01:10:18.920 --> 01:10:23.399 that all that stress on their head, you know, because then it stresses 872 01:10:23.479 --> 01:10:27.760 me out all night and then I can't sleep. So you know that that's 873 01:10:27.880 --> 01:10:31.439 just one way for me personally that I would deal with my stress. And 874 01:10:31.520 --> 01:10:35.399 then also like passing it on to my kids and then being transparent. I 875 01:10:35.479 --> 01:10:42.920 think as parents we can be more transparent to our kids and how we handle 876 01:10:42.960 --> 01:10:45.479 stress and let them see how we handle stress. Like me and my wife, 877 01:10:46.119 --> 01:10:48.840 we will have a disagreement in front of our kids, but then will 878 01:10:48.920 --> 01:10:51.800 make up in front of our kids, so they see, Okay, mom 879 01:10:51.840 --> 01:10:55.920 and dad, they had a disagreement, but you know what, they came 880 01:10:56.000 --> 01:10:59.800 together, they had a discussion, they fixed it, you know, because 881 01:10:59.840 --> 01:11:02.600 I think that's another thing too that we don't teach our kids is how to 882 01:11:02.920 --> 01:11:09.119 fix the problem that you are having, you know, not that go behind 883 01:11:09.159 --> 01:11:12.680 closed doors and fix the problem, because they don't know what are they doing 884 01:11:12.800 --> 01:11:14.560 in the room. Why do they got go in the room. Wh what's 885 01:11:14.600 --> 01:11:17.159 so secrative? What are they saying? What are they doing? You know, 886 01:11:17.279 --> 01:11:19.960 so we know we do it in front of them. So we have 887 01:11:20.039 --> 01:11:24.920 a disagreement, we have an argument because look I'm married. I mean that's 888 01:11:24.960 --> 01:11:28.880 gonna happen. But then we will come, we'll we'll have a meeting at 889 01:11:28.920 --> 01:11:30.359 worship and say, okay, guys, you know we had a disagreement. 890 01:11:31.039 --> 01:11:34.439 This is why, but this is what we're gonna do to fix it, 891 01:11:34.560 --> 01:11:38.199 or this how we're going to fix it, and we explain, you know, 892 01:11:38.319 --> 01:11:43.199 to them. And I think it allows your child to see that it's 893 01:11:43.279 --> 01:11:47.479 okay to sometimes blow up. It's okay sometimes to get frustrated. It's okay 894 01:11:47.560 --> 01:11:51.640 sometimes to like I did something wrong. But if I be truthful, if 895 01:11:51.680 --> 01:11:55.640 I be honest with myself, if I be honest with my peers, I'll 896 01:11:55.680 --> 01:12:01.239 be honest with my future spouse, that we can get through this. I 897 01:12:01.279 --> 01:12:05.960 don't know what you think of subject, go ahead, go ahead, and 898 01:12:06.159 --> 01:12:09.600 you can time. Yeah, definitely, A few things, A few things. 899 01:12:09.680 --> 01:12:13.840 First of all, I didn't know where to start with. All right, 900 01:12:13.840 --> 01:12:17.199 I'm going to start by putting a text. We'll circle back around the 901 01:12:17.279 --> 01:12:20.880 Bible doesn't tell you not to get angry. It tells you get angry and 902 01:12:21.039 --> 01:12:26.000 sitting not. There's not the wrong with getting angry, it's just how you 903 01:12:26.760 --> 01:12:29.239 manage that anger, how you deal with it, and how you deal with 904 01:12:29.359 --> 01:12:31.560 others in that state of mind. All right, I'm going to partner that 905 01:12:31.640 --> 01:12:36.680 for a second and circle back around in terms of you know, when you 906 01:12:36.680 --> 01:12:43.039 want to, like going somewhere, you get those safety alerts, and the 907 01:12:43.600 --> 01:12:47.920 thing they tell you is make sure you're off the mask first, and then 908 01:12:48.600 --> 01:12:53.920 help the one next to you. Right. So, I'm thinking of this, 909 01:12:54.279 --> 01:12:58.760 I'm listening just said, I'm thinking, I really love what you what 910 01:12:58.840 --> 01:13:02.600 you should in terms of you use your family worship time to kind of address 911 01:13:02.640 --> 01:13:05.840 various things. But I'm going to take a step back and say, we 912 01:13:06.000 --> 01:13:13.000 need to learn as men how to manage our emotions and how to identify and 913 01:13:13.079 --> 01:13:16.119 manage our mental health. As we understand how we do that, we can 914 01:13:16.239 --> 01:13:21.199 then help those around us for boys, et cetera. But we need to 915 01:13:21.279 --> 01:13:29.680 understand that first so we can then help them. Right. Also, in 916 01:13:29.760 --> 01:13:31.720 that family setting, the family worship plan that you mentioned, I really like 917 01:13:31.840 --> 01:13:38.199 that. I think I would want to add to that that sometimes allowing whether 918 01:13:38.279 --> 01:13:42.600 it's the child or whether it's your brother in to talk and say what's really 919 01:13:42.640 --> 01:13:45.159 on the mind. It doesn't necessarily mean that you need to give them a 920 01:13:45.239 --> 01:13:50.640 solution or action plan. Sometimes they just need to vent. I don't know. 921 01:13:51.039 --> 01:13:56.399 I don't know if if any of you have watched that show on Apple 922 01:13:56.439 --> 01:14:04.720 TV plus Ted ted Lasso, but they have this kind of powow dog session 923 01:14:05.199 --> 01:14:09.800 where the guys they can talk about something they're struggling with. Yes, yes, 924 01:14:09.960 --> 01:14:14.920 yes, yes, yes, yeah yeah yeah, And every now and 925 01:14:14.920 --> 01:14:16.399 again they have a chat about someone kind of talks about what they're going through 926 01:14:16.880 --> 01:14:23.319 and everyone hears and maybe identified sometimes and then it ends. And there was 927 01:14:23.359 --> 01:14:28.279 one guy who's really not too too good with handling's emotions kind of really bust 928 01:14:28.319 --> 01:14:30.199 out and said what was on his mind, Like I can't be doing this, 929 01:14:30.239 --> 01:14:33.159 I'm struggling this and I don't understand what to do. And then we're 930 01:14:33.199 --> 01:14:36.960 kind of yeah, I get where you're coming from, right, And then 931 01:14:36.960 --> 01:14:42.199 they kind of ended that what is that it? Yeah, I mean I 932 01:14:42.239 --> 01:14:45.640 can just talk. Yeah, it doesn't need to be or I love to 933 01:14:45.680 --> 01:14:48.439 hear what this is what you need to do and this is oh you should 934 01:14:48.680 --> 01:14:54.680 wrong. Sometimes it's just good and having that space is out and just be 935 01:14:54.800 --> 01:14:59.560 real with how you're feeling and having someone that you can trust, because not 936 01:14:59.640 --> 01:15:02.640 everyone I can tell stuff to. And we know this, we're all growing 937 01:15:02.720 --> 01:15:05.520 up in the church or being in the church or even just in the world. 938 01:15:05.600 --> 01:15:09.760 You know, you can't tell her what you did this. But if 939 01:15:09.800 --> 01:15:14.600 you have that one or two people around you that you can just really just 940 01:15:14.760 --> 01:15:17.239 chop it up or just let it out and not have to worry in the 941 01:15:17.279 --> 01:15:21.199 back of mind are they going to tell the next body or the next body. 942 01:15:23.520 --> 01:15:28.399 That is so therapeutic I find and I my brother is one person could 943 01:15:28.399 --> 01:15:31.279 do that way for example. That's that's one person for me. And maybe 944 01:15:31.359 --> 01:15:33.560 you have one or toilet people that I could do that with. I don't 945 01:15:33.600 --> 01:15:39.680 always tap into it because it's hard, honestly, some of the stuff that 946 01:15:39.720 --> 01:15:43.399 you sometimes dealing with. I can't feel like I need to keep it close 947 01:15:43.479 --> 01:15:45.039 to my chest. I can't let it when you know what I'm doing. 948 01:15:46.319 --> 01:15:51.720 I'm that duck on the pond feeling smooth, everything looks cool, calm, 949 01:15:53.560 --> 01:16:00.479 I'm gonna I'm gonna go ahead. I like I like the worship every day. 950 01:16:00.520 --> 01:16:02.960 I think that's really good, Pedro. And I also like the fact 951 01:16:03.000 --> 01:16:06.800 that what you just said andre about sometimes you just gotta let him speak. 952 01:16:06.880 --> 01:16:11.880 And I've got a thirte year old son and he's going through what he's going 953 01:16:11.960 --> 01:16:15.399 through. Now, you know, someone is out, Yeah, hormonal change. 954 01:16:15.439 --> 01:16:21.159 Well, when I say, you know, feeling out, I mean 955 01:16:21.239 --> 01:16:25.039 I don't. I don't mean, you know, people think that it's sexual. 956 01:16:25.079 --> 01:16:27.800 I don't mean in a sexual way. I'm talking about like feeling themselves, 957 01:16:28.800 --> 01:16:30.000 you know, like they're like, I'm getting, I'm getting I'm becoming 958 01:16:30.039 --> 01:16:33.680 a man. I'm becoming a man, you know. People people, that's 959 01:16:33.800 --> 01:16:38.359 that's what people think of it as that, oh you know, but no, 960 01:16:38.439 --> 01:16:41.399 it's more like I'm becoming a man. So I'm gonna rise up on 961 01:16:41.479 --> 01:16:44.039 my pop so every now and a rise up with my parents every now and 962 01:16:44.199 --> 01:16:46.479 done, you know. Yeah. So he's not so much rising up. 963 01:16:46.520 --> 01:16:49.800 Sometimes he just looks miserable, and I know his body's going through whatever it's 964 01:16:49.840 --> 01:16:55.560 going through and so on, and I need to always ask him or fix 965 01:16:55.640 --> 01:16:58.199 your face or while you're looking miserable or that kind of thing. But then 966 01:16:58.319 --> 01:17:02.000 I kind of realize it. Sometimes I just need to just leave him yeah, 967 01:17:02.640 --> 01:17:05.760 just just leave him, you know, because he's figuring it out a 968 01:17:05.800 --> 01:17:11.600 little bit. So I think sometimes we want to we we especially for thinking 969 01:17:11.600 --> 01:17:15.760 about men heal, sometimes we want to fix. But sometimes I think in 970 01:17:15.920 --> 01:17:20.840 order to fix, sometimes you also allow them to self discover what maybe is 971 01:17:20.920 --> 01:17:25.399 doing within themselves. And every time I've done that, give a bit of 972 01:17:25.479 --> 01:17:29.479 time and he's he comes around and he's fine, okay'll come to you after 973 01:17:29.479 --> 01:17:30.600 a couple of days. They I'll be like, you know, Dad, 974 01:17:30.640 --> 01:17:33.600 I was I was feeling this way yesterday, you know I was feeling Yeah. 975 01:17:33.680 --> 01:17:36.960 Yeah, definitely because I have a pressure in my mind right and now. 976 01:17:38.359 --> 01:17:41.199 Let me say, like even in the worship, sometimes I kind of 977 01:17:41.199 --> 01:17:44.880 misspoke because I made it seem like we fix it every time. Sometimes you 978 01:17:45.039 --> 01:17:47.640 just say, okay, that's how you feel. Let's, you know, 979 01:17:47.760 --> 01:17:50.760 sleep on it. We'll come back to it when you feel, you know, 980 01:17:50.880 --> 01:17:55.520 ready to talk about it, you know. So it's not like it's 981 01:17:55.560 --> 01:17:58.680 always because I don't want people. Yeah, I definitely agree with both of 982 01:17:58.720 --> 01:18:01.520 you in the sense of you can't always fix the problem. That's the next 983 01:18:01.560 --> 01:18:05.720 problem we have as men. We try to fix everything right then and there, 984 01:18:06.279 --> 01:18:10.359 or we want it to be you know, like sort of or like, 985 01:18:10.479 --> 01:18:13.239 you know, situated, But it doesn't always work out that way, 986 01:18:13.279 --> 01:18:15.840 because even for us, it doesn't always work out that way. Sometimes we 987 01:18:15.920 --> 01:18:18.159 need an extra day or two to kind of get our thoughts together, get 988 01:18:18.319 --> 01:18:23.039 our get our the thoughts in our heads together so we don't say it the 989 01:18:23.079 --> 01:18:25.880 wrong way or say it, you know, mean in the meanway. We 990 01:18:26.000 --> 01:18:30.720 gotta get our minds straight ourselves before we can express how we really feel. 991 01:18:30.399 --> 01:18:33.319 Because, like you said, you know something you get angry, you know, 992 01:18:33.479 --> 01:18:39.039 but it's how you handle that anger is what shows you know how what 993 01:18:39.159 --> 01:18:41.880 type of man you are or you know what type of person you are in 994 01:18:42.000 --> 01:18:45.640 that aspect, you know. So definitely, I think that when it comes 995 01:18:45.680 --> 01:18:53.399 to emotions, the wrong thing that we say is good and bad emotions. 996 01:18:53.479 --> 01:18:58.079 Emotions are not good and bad. God is the These emotions are God keeping, 997 01:18:58.119 --> 01:19:00.600 no matter what it is. Anger, all these things that God gave 998 01:19:00.640 --> 01:19:08.319 it, we use them wrong mm hmm. And we use them wrong because 999 01:19:08.560 --> 01:19:15.079 of our childhood issues that we're coming with and the coping strategies that we've used 1000 01:19:15.319 --> 01:19:20.000 to actually fix things. We use these emotions wrong. But they're not wrong. 1001 01:19:20.119 --> 01:19:25.800 They're not bad they're not bad in any way, we just use them 1002 01:19:25.840 --> 01:19:30.680 wrong. And so in terms of let me give you an example one you 1003 01:19:30.720 --> 01:19:33.800 guys were talking about it in terms of my nephew called me and said, 1004 01:19:33.960 --> 01:19:43.800 oh, Mark, he has his son in thirteen, and he basically was 1005 01:19:44.000 --> 01:19:47.279 close to his son until around age ten. But then when he started the 1006 01:19:47.479 --> 01:19:51.880 little boy started to become, you know, change and turn into you know 1007 01:19:53.239 --> 01:19:59.079 he because his dad left him when he was that age and he had no 1008 01:19:59.279 --> 01:20:03.600 more material you'll other, and how to bring up a child after ten eleven 1009 01:20:03.680 --> 01:20:08.039 twelve thirteen, He didn't know what to do. What why do Mark, 1010 01:20:08.079 --> 01:20:12.520 because and I think a lot of us as men, we've lost parents or 1011 01:20:12.640 --> 01:20:16.399 fathers or whatever it is, and we don't know how to move on in 1012 01:20:16.600 --> 01:20:21.079 terms of what to teach this child first and first be gonna need to start 1013 01:20:21.159 --> 01:20:26.680 to again skill herself up. Maybe just maybe your churches need to start to 1014 01:20:27.600 --> 01:20:32.239 look at men's ministry and work with that from that perspective also, but also 1015 01:20:32.439 --> 01:20:36.479 as I think it was you on one that says something you don't have to 1016 01:20:36.680 --> 01:20:41.600 I said to him, why do you have to always do something or say 1017 01:20:41.680 --> 01:20:45.439 something? You know, take him out for an ice cream or whatever it 1018 01:20:45.600 --> 01:20:49.640 is, and just sit there and listen. Shut up. You know, 1019 01:20:50.159 --> 01:20:55.439 you don't have to basically solve him everything for him. Shut up and listen 1020 01:20:55.479 --> 01:21:00.680 to him and let him talk. You know. Please, you are present, 1021 01:21:00.840 --> 01:21:03.920 be present for this young man, you know, and and yes at 1022 01:21:04.000 --> 01:21:09.840 times because us as many are mister fix it. We need to fix everything, 1023 01:21:09.880 --> 01:21:12.479 and we need to fix it now. Next, you know, we 1024 01:21:12.680 --> 01:21:15.119 just fix it next, next, next. We can't do that. We 1025 01:21:15.399 --> 01:21:19.600 have to be able to keep you know, these indie young ones in our 1026 01:21:19.680 --> 01:21:24.840 presence. Yeah, okay, we're gonna put a pen in it. We're 1027 01:21:24.880 --> 01:21:28.880 going to come back in a minute, but we're gonna play a song. 1028 01:21:30.000 --> 01:21:32.079 I had it now I don't. Oh yeah, I am by James fortune. 1029 01:21:32.920 --> 01:21:36.159 So hopefully Zanya has heard me and she will start to play the song 1030 01:21:39.319 --> 01:21:57.680 I'm here. Give a shout out of your hair, all right. Two 1031 01:21:57.800 --> 01:22:03.199 Peter one in three tells us that God has given us everything that we need 1032 01:22:05.119 --> 01:22:13.319 for life and godliness through our knowledge of Him. Everything. I have everything, 1033 01:22:14.680 --> 01:22:36.720 I have, I have reathing, I have the great. I am 1034 01:22:38.640 --> 01:22:50.199 brow byes for the great. I am grow by love. I have everything 1035 01:22:50.640 --> 01:23:12.520 I have time, I have agreeing b Thank you Jesus, I freezing because 1036 01:23:12.560 --> 01:23:20.840 the great a great idea. Oh byes, oh fucking the great eye. 1037 01:23:23.039 --> 01:23:30.560 Oh bye? Can your strength is made perfect and not weakness A swim when 1038 01:23:30.239 --> 01:23:53.880 by you almost shrimp, when you almost when great the gay? Oh byes 1039 01:23:57.520 --> 01:24:26.920 the gray. All my needs are supply because that's everything the good He's holling 1040 01:24:27.079 --> 01:24:35.119 enough, fuy there, don't I thank you because of whoever I need, 1041 01:24:35.199 --> 01:25:15.680 you to be whoever I need because you are. You're ba. You can't 1042 01:25:15.720 --> 01:25:42.319 win it away when his drum people help with the type of trouble you got 1043 01:25:42.439 --> 01:26:00.159 flat when I'm cool fla, when I'm held for rank racks. No, 1044 01:26:00.600 --> 01:26:23.720 I can't you your head as putandic you wi steverything, said s s. 1045 01:26:27.319 --> 01:26:57.319 Nobody you we pishcuse you? Thank you well? See you taking secure? 1046 01:26:57.359 --> 01:27:43.239 Suppose you stop? Thank you? Jees It's all right. So we're back. 1047 01:27:43.319 --> 01:27:47.039 I am by James's fortune. We're gonna go into now we're gonna talk 1048 01:27:47.039 --> 01:27:53.920 about some coping strategies strateged I can't even say the word coping mechanisms that we 1049 01:27:54.039 --> 01:28:00.960 can that sometimes man go into when they are dealing with mental stress or mental 1050 01:28:01.000 --> 01:28:06.600 health. So with that we're going to ask mark to go into and talk 1051 01:28:06.640 --> 01:28:13.960 about that a little bit. Yeah, there are a few things that bussess 1052 01:28:14.079 --> 01:28:18.079 men do when we It's across the board, both men and women. But 1053 01:28:18.680 --> 01:28:23.760 a lot of times you find that aggression is one of the ways that we 1054 01:28:24.399 --> 01:28:30.880 use to hope as men, to hope either aggression, substance, misuse. 1055 01:28:30.520 --> 01:28:42.039 You find that we actually do self harm at times. Men. We you 1056 01:28:42.119 --> 01:28:45.920 know what we also do, behavioral avoidance. We disassociate from the family and 1057 01:28:46.000 --> 01:28:51.880 all these things, emotional suppression, those are escape and avoidant behaviors that we 1058 01:28:53.039 --> 01:28:56.600 do. One of the other things that we do what they call we call 1059 01:28:56.680 --> 01:29:01.119 it maladaptive coping strategies. We do different things just the pup because of the 1060 01:29:01.600 --> 01:29:10.840 fact that the tension that because we were not taught how to emotionally regulate properly, 1061 01:29:11.479 --> 01:29:15.960 then we developed That's what maladaptive coping strategy is. Because we were not 1062 01:29:16.119 --> 01:29:23.600 taught how to emotionally regulate properly. I think it was andre that says precious 1063 01:29:23.960 --> 01:29:31.880 stress because we were alive comes how you cope with it basically makes the difference. 1064 01:29:32.359 --> 01:29:35.920 And because we grew up in homes that our parents did not teach us 1065 01:29:35.960 --> 01:29:41.920 how to do this, we develop different things. You have the little schoolyard 1066 01:29:42.000 --> 01:29:46.159 bullies, and you have the you have things like guys do things like pornography 1067 01:29:46.319 --> 01:29:50.319 and all these things. It's just to cope with the stress and the pressure 1068 01:29:50.399 --> 01:29:59.039 that we are going through. This is another one somatic complaining. That's you 1069 01:29:59.119 --> 01:30:02.720 know, you know that individual, we're in the moment you beat them, 1070 01:30:02.800 --> 01:30:06.600 you start to complain about the dear bad life, what is happening to them. 1071 01:30:06.920 --> 01:30:12.760 Constantly, people start to keep away from them because they just keep sematic 1072 01:30:12.840 --> 01:30:17.039 complaining and it is a way of basically, you know, is attention seeking. 1073 01:30:17.520 --> 01:30:23.159 Most of the things that we do also is attention seeking because of the 1074 01:30:23.279 --> 01:30:27.239 fact that we're saying that, you know what good attention, bad attention, 1075 01:30:27.479 --> 01:30:30.720 I'm getting attention. So these are the different things that we do. You 1076 01:30:30.920 --> 01:30:41.600 find that people we develop very bad issues hoping strategies because of the fact different 1077 01:30:42.079 --> 01:30:48.520 different I would say that different societies have different bad hoping strategies. So, 1078 01:30:49.279 --> 01:30:56.960 yeah, those are just some of them. They are numerous, and each 1079 01:30:57.079 --> 01:31:05.279 individual can basically come up with their own bad coping strategy depends on their home 1080 01:31:05.479 --> 01:31:10.760 origins, where they're coming from. That they can develop bad coping strategies so 1081 01:31:10.880 --> 01:31:15.439 yeah, that's basically it. I think what we need to look at is 1082 01:31:16.039 --> 01:31:23.319 good hoping strategies to actually replace those bad coping strategies. And I think it's 1083 01:31:23.399 --> 01:31:29.079 something that we as men need to start to look at because of the fact 1084 01:31:29.119 --> 01:31:38.279 that I always say to people, where are you going? Because as men, 1085 01:31:38.359 --> 01:31:41.159 let us sit back and look at it this way, we were not 1086 01:31:42.119 --> 01:31:48.319 most of us were not taught anything from our dads other than either violence or 1087 01:31:48.439 --> 01:31:54.840 anger or whatever it is. Then where are we going? Because we all 1088 01:31:55.000 --> 01:31:59.720 need a blueprint in terms of what the where are we, where we're going 1089 01:31:59.800 --> 01:32:03.479 to, where we're going to when we get there, how will we know? 1090 01:32:03.920 --> 01:32:09.279 Because I can keep pushing myself and pushing myself and don't know when to 1091 01:32:09.399 --> 01:32:15.359 stop. So we definitely need a place destination. Okay, I'm going here. 1092 01:32:15.439 --> 01:32:20.359 I Pedro talk about worshiping and so and so, and that's an absolutely 1093 01:32:20.560 --> 01:32:27.680 beautiful idea. As men, we need to start to share these things with 1094 01:32:27.880 --> 01:32:32.600 each other in terms of the little good things that we are doing within our 1095 01:32:32.760 --> 01:32:41.079 little pocket of families and syvill we can try these and different good coping strategies 1096 01:32:41.159 --> 01:32:45.439 to get it. To get this biye, So Pedro, that's just in 1097 01:32:45.600 --> 01:32:48.880 terms of the bad coping strategies. We'll look at the good coping strategies in 1098 01:32:49.000 --> 01:32:55.520 a few I think, all right, all right, that's a lot to 1099 01:32:55.880 --> 01:33:00.239 take. I think, Antoline, you had had a thought that you had 1100 01:33:00.279 --> 01:33:06.640 about one coping strategy that could help with what would you said you had on 1101 01:33:06.720 --> 01:33:10.520 your on your mind that you wanted to talk about. Well, I thought 1102 01:33:10.520 --> 01:33:15.399 maybe it was more of a solution. But I think maybe finding a solution, 1103 01:33:15.600 --> 01:33:19.279 we can find that coping strategy. I don't know if this is fat, 1104 01:33:19.520 --> 01:33:26.760 but when I look at maybe this is just in films and series and 1105 01:33:26.760 --> 01:33:31.279 stuff like that, but it looks like things like therapy. It's something that's 1106 01:33:31.319 --> 01:33:35.199 not necessarily seen as a negative in certain countries. I think in America it's 1107 01:33:35.239 --> 01:33:40.960 not necessarily seen as a hooha as such. Tell me if I'm wrong, 1108 01:33:41.000 --> 01:33:45.239 because I don't know. But in over here, if you do therapy, 1109 01:33:45.199 --> 01:33:50.600 you look weak, you know. But there are sometimes things that are done 1110 01:33:50.800 --> 01:33:55.960 in Sunday churches that I've seen where they do therapy for people that get married. 1111 01:33:56.560 --> 01:34:02.600 So maybe if we could have a solution where we provide therapy to kids, 1112 01:34:03.359 --> 01:34:06.479 young boys, you know, whether whether we feel they need it or 1113 01:34:06.560 --> 01:34:15.239 not, that might actually uncover issues earlier, and then maybe from that we 1114 01:34:15.319 --> 01:34:18.159 could find whatever cope and strategy might work, because I would imagine Mark, 1115 01:34:18.199 --> 01:34:21.640 you would say that it's going to be different for everybody. Right, Everyone's 1116 01:34:21.680 --> 01:34:27.920 going to have to find that good coping mechanism that works just for them. 1117 01:34:28.079 --> 01:34:32.439 But to find that is I think requires some sort of solution and action. 1118 01:34:32.720 --> 01:34:35.680 And I think if we and that's a community effort as well, and that 1119 01:34:35.720 --> 01:34:39.520 would actually start with the church, if we were to say, all right, 1120 01:34:39.680 --> 01:34:44.520 let's involve ourselves more more in some way with the youngsters in a routine, 1121 01:34:44.920 --> 01:34:48.520 routine, routinely manner. Maybe you know, every Saturday, then there's 1122 01:34:48.520 --> 01:34:53.319 a there's a fifteen minute slot as an example, after church where every child 1123 01:34:53.359 --> 01:34:57.800 can speak to, you know, a designated person who talks about how they're 1124 01:34:57.800 --> 01:35:00.680 week was and all that sort of stuff. Maybe we can these things and 1125 01:35:00.720 --> 01:35:04.560 then help them to find that mechanism, that strategy that helps them to overcome 1126 01:35:04.880 --> 01:35:11.079 you know, these issues that they come across. I think it is difficult 1127 01:35:11.159 --> 01:35:17.640 because in America, therapy is something that's normal. Everybody send the child to 1128 01:35:17.760 --> 01:35:25.920 therapy. But here again, wants a young man see another young man or 1129 01:35:26.000 --> 01:35:29.640 hear another young man go to therapy, he's gonna get bullied because of the 1130 01:35:29.720 --> 01:35:38.920 fact that he's seen as we So we're gonna have to find and because most 1131 01:35:39.159 --> 01:35:44.960 of us are coming from cultures that which therapy is not something that is a 1132 01:35:45.079 --> 01:35:50.039 norm. The African culture, the Caribbean culture, especially us as men, 1133 01:35:50.479 --> 01:35:55.119 we find it hard to go to therapy as men. Why do we think 1134 01:35:55.159 --> 01:36:00.279 that our young boys will walk? You know? So maybe just maybe is 1135 01:36:00.399 --> 01:36:04.359 if we as men start going and show the young men that well it is 1136 01:36:04.479 --> 01:36:10.560 okay, it's okay to basically deal with these situations, then they will be 1137 01:36:10.720 --> 01:36:16.119 able to actually say well okay, because it's by example. And I think 1138 01:36:16.239 --> 01:36:20.199 that's one of the things that we need to look at. The next thing 1139 01:36:20.960 --> 01:36:30.279 that you need to also look at is okay in terms of we can use 1140 01:36:30.800 --> 01:36:38.119 the we can use the men's ministry and so on, as the teen's ministry, 1141 01:36:38.279 --> 01:36:44.239 the youth ministry. We can use these areas to start to have conversations. 1142 01:36:45.239 --> 01:36:53.199 I know of a Pedecostal church that what they do they use the teen's 1143 01:36:53.279 --> 01:37:00.520 youth and so on ministry and from those discussions they basically refer these individuals out 1144 01:37:06.039 --> 01:37:13.119 and I think that's the link because of the fact that they are trusted individuals 1145 01:37:13.319 --> 01:37:20.359 in those organizations. What that knows we're not capable of dealing with this situation. 1146 01:37:20.560 --> 01:37:27.119 We need to refer out. Okay, but in our church is an 1147 01:37:27.239 --> 01:37:32.640 elder whatever this think I can deal with this situation when I don't have the 1148 01:37:32.920 --> 01:37:38.840 skills, you know, And that is why we end up. The children 1149 01:37:38.960 --> 01:37:44.880 are not trusting us because of the fact that you know, I and I'm 1150 01:37:44.920 --> 01:37:48.560 not gonna say, but the fact is that we need to basically have these 1151 01:37:48.760 --> 01:37:57.399 conversations with the young people started in Sabbath schools in you know, we need 1152 01:37:57.520 --> 01:38:01.479 to start it somewhere wherein we can see. Okay, Look, the whole 1153 01:38:01.720 --> 01:38:08.680 idea about this is to see those young individuals who are struggling with mental health 1154 01:38:08.680 --> 01:38:12.079 because they are, but they're not going to come and talk to us because 1155 01:38:12.119 --> 01:38:17.640 they don't trust us. And I think that's one of the big problems problems 1156 01:38:17.680 --> 01:38:25.399 that's happening in the church, that young people are not finding enough adults to 1157 01:38:25.600 --> 01:38:30.840 trust. And when they do find an adult to trust, that adults need 1158 01:38:31.039 --> 01:38:39.399 to start to focus on I need to refer to someone that can actually deal 1159 01:38:39.520 --> 01:38:45.680 with this issue. M and then I have a question mark with the counseling 1160 01:38:48.600 --> 01:38:55.039 in your opinion, like as an adventist, is it okay for us to 1161 01:38:55.159 --> 01:39:01.199 go to a How can I put it to the counseling, to a secular 1162 01:39:01.359 --> 01:39:06.000 counselor or to a Christian counselor whether it will make a difference or it just 1163 01:39:06.079 --> 01:39:12.920 depends on the individual that you're dealing with. Does that make sense what I'm 1164 01:39:12.920 --> 01:39:16.079 saying? It makes a lot of sense. I will say this about Cornerstone 1165 01:39:16.760 --> 01:39:23.119 all our counselors because some people get mixed up with what is Christian conselin and 1166 01:39:23.279 --> 01:39:27.239 what is just regular constlin And that's what I'm asking the question. I'm sure 1167 01:39:27.279 --> 01:39:29.720 some people are thinking. I'm sure some people are thinking it right now as 1168 01:39:29.720 --> 01:39:35.800 we're talking, and different people say I'd rather see a Christian chong selor first 1169 01:39:35.840 --> 01:39:45.439 thing at Cornerstone. All our counselors are basically certified counselors. They are Christian 1170 01:39:45.560 --> 01:39:53.720 conseling is not okay, let me just speak on Cornerstone and Cornerstone alone. 1171 01:39:54.520 --> 01:40:01.279 Cornerstone is a sad the England Conference initiative. Okay, we have qualified counselors 1172 01:40:01.680 --> 01:40:09.119 that with different genre of therapy you can go to any other counselor and have 1173 01:40:09.720 --> 01:40:16.560 that those same therapies that we offer in Cornerstone. However, with us at 1174 01:40:16.640 --> 01:40:25.720 Cornerstone, you have someone that understands your religious persuasion. Okay, so then 1175 01:40:26.000 --> 01:40:31.159 basically you have kids that are struggling with different issues, can basically talk about 1176 01:40:31.199 --> 01:40:38.000 these issues even from a religious perspective, and someone understands. But when you 1177 01:40:38.319 --> 01:40:42.880 actually think about a Christian some people, when they talk about a Christian counselor, 1178 01:40:43.279 --> 01:40:47.600 what they actually need is a Bible study. And that's not Christian counseling. 1179 01:40:48.720 --> 01:40:54.079 Yes, so then because of the fact that the issues that people are 1180 01:40:54.159 --> 01:41:00.359 bringing may not need at that time a Bible study. And so so that's 1181 01:41:00.439 --> 01:41:09.039 where Cornerstone, even though we can include the religious aspects within your consoling session, 1182 01:41:09.439 --> 01:41:17.520 it is still about you basically dealing with or processing those traumatic your traumatic 1183 01:41:17.680 --> 01:41:21.159 past, and not me saying, well, you know what, you need 1184 01:41:21.199 --> 01:41:25.760 to go away. I have known of people that come to me and say 1185 01:41:26.000 --> 01:41:29.760 this consol said, I need to go away and pray more, and these 1186 01:41:29.800 --> 01:41:34.520 are things that's not it. It's about basically helping people to move forward and 1187 01:41:34.760 --> 01:41:42.239 move away from their past. That's it. So Cornerstone I said. When 1188 01:41:42.359 --> 01:41:47.880 I was studying counseling, and I tell even my non Christian colleagues about what 1189 01:41:48.239 --> 01:41:53.520 Cornerstone was doing. They were like, please, please, please, can 1190 01:41:53.680 --> 01:41:59.640 be common work for your organization. You know, Cornistone has an excellent counseling 1191 01:41:59.720 --> 01:42:03.359 and and I think that as a church or a lot of people in church 1192 01:42:03.560 --> 01:42:09.960 or churches are using it. A lot of people out of our churches are 1193 01:42:10.119 --> 01:42:16.720 using it, and so it's an unique it's a unique organization because a lot 1194 01:42:16.840 --> 01:42:21.199 of us have are very skilled in what we do. So in other words, 1195 01:42:21.319 --> 01:42:26.439 you're in the twenty first century, not not the sixties. Cornerstone, 1196 01:42:26.520 --> 01:42:29.960 Yes, Cornerstone is Yeah, that's That's what I was trying to get to. 1197 01:42:30.039 --> 01:42:31.880 It is like we need to because I think sometimes, as we said, 1198 01:42:32.119 --> 01:42:35.880 we get so bogged down with the past and what we worked in the 1199 01:42:35.960 --> 01:42:40.680 past. So it's going to work now, but it's totally different now than 1200 01:42:40.760 --> 01:42:43.600 it was in the past. You know, we have to we have to 1201 01:42:43.640 --> 01:42:46.119 be able to adapt. We have to be able to feel it out, 1202 01:42:46.239 --> 01:42:51.439 adopt, investigate, you know, talk and then go from there and then 1203 01:42:51.479 --> 01:42:58.279 make a conscious you know, a conscious decision based on what it feels to 1204 01:42:58.479 --> 01:43:00.560 us. If it would help us or not. So that's that's how I 1205 01:43:00.680 --> 01:43:05.039 was trying to get with that with that question. I like that you said 1206 01:43:05.079 --> 01:43:09.560 that, Pedro, because it's one of the things I always wondered, is 1207 01:43:10.399 --> 01:43:14.199 if it was a thing. Firstly, I didn't know, so so thanks 1208 01:43:14.319 --> 01:43:19.279 Mark. But also, well, they understand what the youths are actually going 1209 01:43:19.359 --> 01:43:24.279 through if they're not with the times, which is what you're basically saying, 1210 01:43:24.319 --> 01:43:28.279 Pedro. Now we're looking down. There's there's young boys that are stabbing each 1211 01:43:28.279 --> 01:43:32.439 other, that there's there's there's something that's instilled in the mentally that's causing that. 1212 01:43:32.680 --> 01:43:39.880 But if you're not somebody who can relate or understand even elements of their 1213 01:43:40.039 --> 01:43:44.600 journey and why they are where they are now, I can't see how you 1214 01:43:44.640 --> 01:43:47.640 will be able to communicate with them. They don't you know, they need 1215 01:43:47.720 --> 01:43:53.560 to speak to someone who they feel gets it, gets the struggle, gets 1216 01:43:53.760 --> 01:43:57.279 the lifestyle that they've had to lead or they are leading, or or where 1217 01:43:57.319 --> 01:44:04.359 they've come from. M hm, you know, go ahead, andrewa something 1218 01:44:04.399 --> 01:44:13.520 to say. I was gonna echo want one said. In terms of when 1219 01:44:13.560 --> 01:44:16.319 it comes to mentoring, young people need to beild to. You don't necessarily 1220 01:44:16.319 --> 01:44:19.960 have to live the same lifeesel that they're living or have lived it. Sorry, 1221 01:44:20.039 --> 01:44:24.600 not necessarily, but you do need to be identified with where they're at 1222 01:44:25.279 --> 01:44:30.399 and be real with them. Young people have evolved in there. We know 1223 01:44:30.800 --> 01:44:39.960 when when we're just being given fluff, if someone can't identify what we're going 1224 01:44:40.000 --> 01:44:45.319 through, it feels like a per conversation. And your people will switch off 1225 01:44:45.600 --> 01:44:48.840 very quickly when they realize that, if they realize you do not, you 1226 01:44:48.960 --> 01:44:54.920 cannot understand. And to be sure, okay, I have teenagers. Most 1227 01:44:54.960 --> 01:44:57.960 times they don't think I can identify what they're going through. That's most times. 1228 01:44:58.560 --> 01:45:01.840 Okay, I'm already in the backfoot, Dad, you don't understand. 1229 01:45:02.039 --> 01:45:05.800 You don't get it. We were never children before. We were never children 1230 01:45:05.800 --> 01:45:10.039 before. Right, So there's that, there's that layer of it, but 1231 01:45:10.159 --> 01:45:13.920 even beyond that layer, or even deeper than that layer, because you can 1232 01:45:14.119 --> 01:45:17.600 if you have a real conversation with you before and they're not too much of 1233 01:45:17.640 --> 01:45:23.520 their feelings, they can they can they can accept that Okay, you may 1234 01:45:23.600 --> 01:45:25.840 not be really the exact same thing I'm going to know, but you get 1235 01:45:25.880 --> 01:45:29.680 it. You can get it. But that only happens with me. To 1236 01:45:29.840 --> 01:45:33.800 have a real conversation I remember, and this is I'll share from part of 1237 01:45:33.840 --> 01:45:39.479 my experience. My son said once to me he thought I was perfect. 1238 01:45:41.199 --> 01:45:44.439 He thought I never kind of messed up. And I was like, where 1239 01:45:44.439 --> 01:45:48.159 did you get that from me? So I must have I clearly messed up 1240 01:45:48.520 --> 01:45:53.880 right there already and given him the impression somehow that I was always a perfect 1241 01:45:53.960 --> 01:45:56.880 child, never made it a mistakes, never did anything wrong, blh blah 1242 01:45:56.880 --> 01:46:00.640 blahlah blah. And I'm kind of breaking on that or breaking on that illusion 1243 01:46:01.199 --> 01:46:06.600 that missed. No. No, it opened up the gate for him to 1244 01:46:06.680 --> 01:46:13.560 have more real conversation with me, and that then makes a huge difference in 1245 01:46:13.640 --> 01:46:18.920 terms of being able to help someone hope with something that's really wearing anown mentally 1246 01:46:19.760 --> 01:46:27.399 or emotionally, and having an outlet to explore what they're feeling and just be 1247 01:46:27.439 --> 01:46:31.119 able to share it, if even if it's not for advice purposes, but 1248 01:46:31.159 --> 01:46:35.720 at least to share it and then see where we go from there. Yeah, 1249 01:46:38.199 --> 01:46:40.159 when you were talking, Aure, I just had a thought. As 1250 01:46:40.720 --> 01:46:44.680 parents, as we say, you know, we were children growing up, 1251 01:46:45.319 --> 01:46:48.840 but it was handled differently. I think we have to fight against that urge 1252 01:46:49.159 --> 01:46:54.680 to try to handle the problem the way we was handled when we were younger, 1253 01:46:55.159 --> 01:46:58.960 because it's different because like now this hope, we're talking about mental health 1254 01:46:59.000 --> 01:47:01.880 and getting in people to talk. You know, when we were young, 1255 01:47:02.119 --> 01:47:04.600 you didn't speak. Unless you spoke, you were spoken to. You know, 1256 01:47:04.720 --> 01:47:08.520 my father was from the South, So like to this day, if 1257 01:47:08.520 --> 01:47:11.560 you're not saying my name, if you could be around me having a conversation, 1258 01:47:12.479 --> 01:47:17.720 I won't listen to your conversation unless you say my name, because it's 1259 01:47:17.800 --> 01:47:23.399 just ingraved is engraved in me that I just don't eavesdrop on conversations because like 1260 01:47:23.399 --> 01:47:26.880 the parents are talking, you don't say you don't listen to the parents conversation, 1261 01:47:26.960 --> 01:47:30.239 you know. But today's kids they're all like my children, me and 1262 01:47:30.319 --> 01:47:31.960 my wife having a conversation, and all of a sudden, my daughter be 1263 01:47:32.079 --> 01:47:33.760 like, but no, You're like, wait a minute, why are you 1264 01:47:33.800 --> 01:47:38.520 in our conversation? But you have to understand now, you know, Like 1265 01:47:38.920 --> 01:47:42.279 that's the way children are. They're very attentive. They want to they want 1266 01:47:42.399 --> 01:47:45.600 knowledge, they want to know what is going what is going on, what 1267 01:47:45.800 --> 01:47:49.600 is happening, why is it happening? How is it happening? And I 1268 01:47:49.680 --> 01:47:53.800 think we have to as you say, I'm trying to like come to the 1269 01:47:53.840 --> 01:47:57.520 twenty first off, you know, even letting another thing too is like letting 1270 01:47:57.560 --> 01:48:01.439 our child, letting people, even another man, like you said, just 1271 01:48:01.720 --> 01:48:04.640 vent, just talk, we have a habit or something. Just cut like 1272 01:48:05.239 --> 01:48:08.680 you know you're not supposed to do that or you know, back in the 1273 01:48:08.760 --> 01:48:11.760 day, we handled it this way, and we try to handle it like 1274 01:48:12.159 --> 01:48:15.359 we are in the sixties and seventies and not like we're in the twenty first 1275 01:48:15.399 --> 01:48:17.039 century. So I just want to just I don't want that just pop in 1276 01:48:17.079 --> 01:48:19.319 my head, but I just want to just bring that out. Yeah, 1277 01:48:19.319 --> 01:48:23.079 that's good. Had it. When your son says you don't get it, 1278 01:48:23.439 --> 01:48:25.880 you won't get it. Yeah, exactly like he said, you're perfect because 1279 01:48:26.079 --> 01:48:28.640 yeah, because he's he's looking like he's looking like, oh, you know, 1280 01:48:28.760 --> 01:48:30.840 Daddy's perfect. So that now you put a lot of pressure on him. 1281 01:48:30.920 --> 01:48:33.359 You don't. And the thing is that, like you said, it's 1282 01:48:33.399 --> 01:48:36.279 not that you was you fail on purpose, but we do fail, we 1283 01:48:36.359 --> 01:48:41.119 fall down. But you know, you realize that you're putting undue pressure on 1284 01:48:41.159 --> 01:48:43.600 your son because he's thinking, I got to be perfect all the time, 1285 01:48:43.920 --> 01:48:46.560 and you don't even realize that you're even putting that kind of pressure on your 1286 01:48:46.640 --> 01:48:50.279 child, you know, to be like, oh, he thinks I'm perfect, 1287 01:48:50.359 --> 01:48:54.239 So therefore he's he's trying to be perfect and he's making mistakes, and 1288 01:48:54.319 --> 01:48:58.560 that he's getting frustrated because he's not able to immolate what my fault, what 1289 01:48:58.680 --> 01:49:00.600 my you know, what his father's doing, you know. So and then 1290 01:49:00.960 --> 01:49:04.960 they go into that dynod spiral and then we don't realize that they're even in 1291 01:49:05.119 --> 01:49:09.279 that space, you know, because then they don't want to talk about it 1292 01:49:09.640 --> 01:49:13.319 because we don't talk about it. So it's like it all starts. I 1293 01:49:13.359 --> 01:49:16.399 think it all starts with us as fathers and as men to be able to 1294 01:49:16.600 --> 01:49:19.199 just express ourselves, as hard as it may be, sometimes as hard as 1295 01:49:19.239 --> 01:49:26.239 it may hurt. Sometimes we just need to be more adaptive to talking and 1296 01:49:26.439 --> 01:49:31.079 letting people and letting our feelings out there, even if it's going to hurt 1297 01:49:31.159 --> 01:49:35.239 us. Sometimes it's gonna be hard for us to do sometimes. Well, 1298 01:49:35.359 --> 01:49:39.079 that makes sense, Mark, because I say, you look like you're thinking. 1299 01:49:41.000 --> 01:49:43.640 I was thinking what you're saying, and it makes a lot of sense. 1300 01:49:43.720 --> 01:49:45.880 I think that one of the things about us as men, and that 1301 01:49:46.119 --> 01:49:51.079 is why the mental health issues that we have is that we have a lot 1302 01:49:51.159 --> 01:49:57.319 of narrative of what may happen if we only open up, you know, 1303 01:49:57.680 --> 01:50:02.399 if I only open up, then the not like me or and that's not 1304 01:50:02.600 --> 01:50:06.079 only men, but I'm talking about me, talking about men. But so 1305 01:50:06.520 --> 01:50:12.479 we have these narratives that we tell ourselves before we even open up, and 1306 01:50:12.600 --> 01:50:15.079 then we say, oh, you know what, They're not even gonna listen 1307 01:50:15.159 --> 01:50:17.800 to me, so I'm not gonna say anything, or who's gonna care about 1308 01:50:17.840 --> 01:50:21.319 it? So I'm not gonna say anything, And so we keep those every 1309 01:50:21.600 --> 01:50:27.600 time. And that's and again that's a maladaptive hoping strategy. Every time we 1310 01:50:27.760 --> 01:50:31.279 basically want to say something, every time we want to speak our mind. 1311 01:50:31.640 --> 01:50:35.159 You know what, who's gonna listen to me? They may? And those 1312 01:50:35.199 --> 01:50:41.039 are the things that we bring from child, those kind of negative thought patterns 1313 01:50:41.319 --> 01:50:46.079 that basically I'm either gonna be shut down, I'm either gonna be basically dismissed. 1314 01:50:46.279 --> 01:50:50.920 I'm either gonna somebody's gonna be offended, you know, and so on. 1315 01:50:51.520 --> 01:50:54.479 People are saying, speak your mind, speak your mind, and when 1316 01:50:54.520 --> 01:50:57.399 you do speak your mind, people are offended that you speak your mind, 1317 01:50:57.399 --> 01:51:01.439 and so you don't mind anymore. So So these are the things that we 1318 01:51:01.680 --> 01:51:06.039 do and we go through as men in terms of how we deal with this 1319 01:51:06.239 --> 01:51:11.039 sort of stuff. And it's about us saying to ourselves, Okay, look, 1320 01:51:11.840 --> 01:51:15.800 we're gonna have as men for us to help each other. In terms 1321 01:51:15.840 --> 01:51:18.960 of the mental health issues, we're gonna have to come together a little more 1322 01:51:19.359 --> 01:51:25.199 than we're doing. And we're gonna have to have part or and and and 1323 01:51:25.960 --> 01:51:32.640 then pray after you know, so talk about this, then pray after Most 1324 01:51:32.720 --> 01:51:36.479 of the time we end up when we don't know what to do, we 1325 01:51:36.720 --> 01:51:42.640 run and fill it our time with scriptures and whatever it is, and deflect. 1326 01:51:44.079 --> 01:51:51.000 And we need to have heard talk in churches and and and then also 1327 01:51:51.520 --> 01:52:00.039 the churches need to be able to be able to accommodate these conversations because some 1328 01:52:00.119 --> 01:52:04.479 people say that conversation is not for church, that conversation is not for church. 1329 01:52:04.680 --> 01:52:10.880 And you think to yourself, come on, you know you want to 1330 01:52:10.920 --> 01:52:15.800 talk to about sex in churches. Churches, some people will shut you down. 1331 01:52:15.479 --> 01:52:18.600 It's not the appropriate timer, it's not appropriate. And then we have 1332 01:52:18.880 --> 01:52:26.039 children walking around having babies and we chastise them because of the fact that we 1333 01:52:26.239 --> 01:52:30.079 cannot deal with our own emotions when we didn't have to talk. Yep, 1334 01:52:30.479 --> 01:52:33.960 check them out the church, this on them, shut them away all that. 1335 01:52:34.359 --> 01:52:39.640 Yeah, and then we wonder and then yeah, that's a whole other 1336 01:52:39.680 --> 01:52:43.279 subject. That's a whole other talking point show. As then you put in 1337 01:52:43.359 --> 01:52:48.880 the chat early a TP jam session. Yeah you know so, So I 1338 01:52:49.119 --> 01:52:54.640 do think that Look, as churches, we need to say look, and 1339 01:52:54.760 --> 01:52:59.720 the Bible is encouraging us to actually do this, that you know what, 1340 01:53:00.159 --> 01:53:03.760 we need to come together. This is how this is how the world know 1341 01:53:04.000 --> 01:53:09.760 that we are His disciples when we come together and have these talk and be 1342 01:53:09.960 --> 01:53:17.079 comfortable enough to share our feelings and be comfortable enough to be vulnerable. Vulnerability 1343 01:53:17.199 --> 01:53:23.439 and man don't go along. So basically we need to be vulnerable with each 1344 01:53:23.560 --> 01:53:27.760 other and so that we can be able to support each other. Other than 1345 01:53:27.840 --> 01:53:32.800 that, this mental health issue has in church is going to continue and we 1346 01:53:32.960 --> 01:53:39.840 need to understand this God has I think God has been protecting us as a 1347 01:53:40.000 --> 01:53:44.880 church because of the fact that I think that this is His church whatever it 1348 01:53:45.079 --> 01:53:49.600 is. However, we've had a lot of near misses in the years and 1349 01:53:49.760 --> 01:53:55.039 people haven't done. People have tried but haven't been succeeded. And you haven't 1350 01:53:55.079 --> 01:53:59.960 succeeded and so on as so forworth, we need to have these conversations. 1351 01:54:00.039 --> 01:54:05.920 Yes, all right, well we're getting really like. That's why I wanted 1352 01:54:05.920 --> 01:54:10.600 to get right into it because, like I said, two hours ago, 1353 01:54:10.760 --> 01:54:15.359 so you look look up and it's like, oh my goodness, almost seven 1354 01:54:15.359 --> 01:54:20.000 o'clock. So but I just wanted to just bring up some of what you 1355 01:54:20.119 --> 01:54:25.960 just said for me. I'm this from my personal perspective as a man, 1356 01:54:28.199 --> 01:54:31.159 like I said I think I said earlier. I think when as a man, 1357 01:54:31.239 --> 01:54:35.960 if you can get to a point where you can just not when I 1358 01:54:36.039 --> 01:54:41.960 say not care just in the sense of like, I just feel like I'm 1359 01:54:42.000 --> 01:54:46.439 not gonna let myself get so mentally stressed that to make you happy. So 1360 01:54:46.520 --> 01:54:50.159 I'm gonna say how I feel. And I've learned that being here, I've 1361 01:54:50.279 --> 01:54:57.560 definitely have come across that where I can rub people the wrong way because I'm 1362 01:54:57.640 --> 01:55:00.560 just gonna spit. I'm just gonna spin it out. I'm not gonna hold 1363 01:55:00.600 --> 01:55:02.199 it. I'm not gonna, you know, sugarcoat it. I'm not gonna 1364 01:55:02.199 --> 01:55:04.840 beat around the bush. I'm going straight through. I'm an set fire. 1365 01:55:04.880 --> 01:55:10.239 I'm just gonna boom and my feeling is. If you like me, you 1366 01:55:10.399 --> 01:55:11.960 like me. If you don't, you don't, But at least you know 1367 01:55:12.039 --> 01:55:15.640 how I feel like. When you get to a point as a man, 1368 01:55:15.760 --> 01:55:18.880 you want people to respect you. Not everybody's going to like you. So 1369 01:55:19.439 --> 01:55:21.680 as long as you respect me, that's all I ask. You don't have 1370 01:55:21.760 --> 01:55:24.399 to like me. You don't have to like my viewer. I don't have 1371 01:55:24.439 --> 01:55:27.000 to like the way I am, you know, but that's just how I 1372 01:55:27.119 --> 01:55:30.239 am. As long as my family's okay, if it, I'm okay with 1373 01:55:30.359 --> 01:55:36.359 it. That's how I feel. That's how I get through my mental issues. 1374 01:55:36.399 --> 01:55:41.960 Sometimes it's just like you said, because I find it just makes it 1375 01:55:42.039 --> 01:55:45.720 easier for me in life. I'm not holding onto things that I used to 1376 01:55:45.760 --> 01:55:47.560 hold onto in the past because I just say it boom. That's what I'm 1377 01:55:47.600 --> 01:55:51.359 gonna I'm just gonna tell you. Once I get off my chest, I 1378 01:55:51.439 --> 01:55:55.239 can come and talk to you like I can tell you off, and then 1379 01:55:55.399 --> 01:55:58.119 a minute later come and talk to you like nothing happened because I've let it 1380 01:55:58.199 --> 01:56:01.239 off my chest. Because it doesn't I think we don't. Just because I 1381 01:56:01.319 --> 01:56:03.760 don't like something you're doing doesn't mean I don't like you. I just don't 1382 01:56:03.800 --> 01:56:08.399 like what you're doing. So when you can get you know, through that, 1383 01:56:08.840 --> 01:56:13.399 that through that myriad of field where you understand that, then we cool. 1384 01:56:14.319 --> 01:56:18.840 But like I said, that's just my personal opinion. We're gonna need 1385 01:56:18.880 --> 01:56:21.600 to have final thoughts. So Antoine, you can go first and give you 1386 01:56:21.640 --> 01:56:26.000 a final thought you know of the show and yeah, yeah, first, 1387 01:56:26.039 --> 01:56:28.680 thanks, We have about a minute and a half. Yeah, thanks having 1388 01:56:28.720 --> 01:56:32.840 me and invite me to Talksanya, good, good chat. My final thoughts 1389 01:56:32.880 --> 01:56:35.479 are that, yeah, we just need to do more and we need to 1390 01:56:35.520 --> 01:56:41.520 reflect, look inwards. We need to discover ourselves I think a little bit 1391 01:56:41.560 --> 01:56:46.359 more first, and then we need to teach upwards from as young as possible. 1392 01:56:46.359 --> 01:56:49.560 And I think if we do that, we will be creating a better, 1393 01:56:50.000 --> 01:56:56.640 better space for them going forward. All right, Mark, any final 1394 01:56:56.680 --> 01:57:02.359 thoughts. We have about thirty seconds. Yeah, I just I'm absolutely grateful 1395 01:57:02.560 --> 01:57:08.640 that to be as men are able to have this forum to just talk about 1396 01:57:08.760 --> 01:57:11.880 this, and this is just for me. I think this is the beginning. 1397 01:57:12.039 --> 01:57:14.680 Maybe we should have this a lot more, a little more often. 1398 01:57:15.039 --> 01:57:18.720 Yeah, all right, Well, Andre Unfortunately his battery died, so he 1399 01:57:18.840 --> 01:57:21.680 was unable to give his final thoughts. That's why he's no longer on. 1400 01:57:21.840 --> 01:57:26.039 Yeah, so I want to thank you both for joining us. It was 1401 01:57:26.079 --> 01:57:30.840 a really good shot. Thank you for all your points, Antoine, Mark 1402 01:57:30.880 --> 01:57:32.119 and Andre if you listen, well you're not listening because his phone has died. 1403 01:57:32.199 --> 01:57:35.600 But Zanya and Angela, you've been on the show too, but you've 1404 01:57:35.680 --> 01:57:39.199 just been listening. So we want to thank you all for joining us. 1405 01:57:39.920 --> 01:57:41.800 This is talking point. We want to thank you all for joining us. 1406 01:57:41.800 --> 01:57:44.960 We want to just say a quick prayer before we go, and then we'll 1407 01:57:45.399 --> 01:57:49.399 we will sign off. Let's pray heaveny five. We want to thank you 1408 01:57:49.439 --> 01:57:54.560 for bringing us together in this talking point show that we can talk about the 1409 01:57:54.680 --> 01:58:00.800 issues of men's health and men's issues and hopefully to somebody listening that they maybe 1410 01:58:00.000 --> 01:58:03.920 get some points and some views on how they can handle themselves, as we 1411 01:58:04.079 --> 01:58:06.840 never know what people are going through as well. Right now, we ask 1412 01:58:06.920 --> 01:58:13.880 Lord that hopefully this conversation will help somebody to navigate the field and navigate the 1413 01:58:14.279 --> 01:58:16.760 path that they are going down right now. And we won't say we want 1414 01:58:16.800 --> 01:58:23.359 thank you Lord for just allowing us to be able to talk freely and honestly 1415 01:58:23.680 --> 01:58:27.479 about mental health and that not only is it helping ourselves that we're helping other 1416 01:58:27.520 --> 01:58:29.840 people. So we thank you for this. Let us all have a good 1417 01:58:29.840 --> 01:58:32.439 week, and we thank you love, for your prayer, for your love 1418 01:58:32.520 --> 01:58:40.119 and your grace and your understanding for this U Premi your holy name. All 1419 01:58:40.199 --> 01:58:42.439 right, guys, so this is talking. We want thank you for joining 1420 01:58:42.520 --> 01:58:45.680 us today and we're gonna be signing off. So my name is Pedro, 1421 01:58:48.039 --> 01:58:54.319 and there's Antoine and there's Mark Zanya and Angela. I just signed us all 1422 01:58:54.439 --> 01:58:57.279 uf. Thank you for joining us and have a good week, guys. 1423 01:58:57.479 --> 01:59:09.319 Be safe. 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