WEBVTT

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Hi. This is deb post of
debs Data Dojo, part of the Calling

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All Beings podcast network. Today,
I'm happy to speak to Susan Fenston.

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Susan is an author, publisher,
artist, and a paranormal and UFO enthusiast.

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Her book You Have a Soft Voice
Susan is her true tale on online

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stalking experience. Susan is the creator
of unique paintings of extraterrestrials. She recently

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graciously donated one of her pieces for
the Pause Middle Georgia charity. Welcome Susan.

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I'm so happy to see you today. Thank you for a nice to

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be here. Thank you for inviting
me. Well, I'm thrilled because I

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feel like you just have so much
going on. You have artistry, and

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you're an author, and yeah,
you've been really interested in the paranormal for

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a long time. So thank you
for coming. Happy to be here.

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So one thing I noticed today is
when DJ promoted this chat, he says

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you were a lifelong UFO enthusiast.
Is that accurate? Well, life would

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be all my life, and it's
not all my life, but it's a

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lot of it. It just sort
of just happened. I think a lot

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of people are just in UFOs and
it's a natural thing pondering the universe.

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We see it in the media,
movies, books, sence science fiction.

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I loved science fiction when I was
in high school. I read a ton

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of Ray Bradberry and all that great
stuff, and I would just consider myself

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an open minded person. And it
wasn't until I went to Arizona. I'm

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from New York and I'd never really
been out of the Tri state area until

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I was like twenty two. I
went out to Tucson, Arizona for a

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month and a half and then drove
back across country and went upstate to be

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part of an art like an art
colony upstate in Chautauqua, New York,

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where I was studying and working in
a hotel and you know, paying my

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way and just like you know,
an adventure art adventure. And I remember

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when I got out to Tucson,
I was talking to somebody who had grown

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up there. I hit the first
thing I asked, and I wasn't really

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obsessed with UFOs, and I just
the first thing I thought of was like,

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have you ever seen a UFO?
I mean, think about this would

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be the place Arizona, the desert
and she's like, yeah, we we

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see things like this all the time. They're not it's not that unusual.

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It was like, really, I
want to I really hope I get to

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see something. And she described this
large, enormous, silent, floating thing

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that would fly over the city like
early in the morning. And I mean

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I thought, well, yeah,
this this would be the place. But

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for all my looking at my start
looking at the stars and thinking about it,

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nothing ever really actually happened. But
it wasn't until I left. I

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had a strange dream that this is
really what turned out to be my first,

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very first UFO painting, or first
UFO inspired painting. I had a

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dream that I was taken to this
very old place and I was being shown

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all this knowledge and information on a
screen. This was nineteen eighty five,

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It's a pre technology era that we
lived in, and there was this sort

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of eyeball like sphere that was projecting
this light and water and knowledge and all

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of this stuff was just like it
was like a gift of knowledge, and

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it was kind of flowing over me
like light like water. It just seemed

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like the wisdom of the ages was
just being given to me and flowing over

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me. So I painted a painting
of it right away so that I could

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remember, and I wrote about it
my diary. So it wasn't until it

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was many, many years later that
I looked back at that and I thought,

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what does what did that all of
that really mean? Because I put

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it down for a reason, you
know, and I've made that painting a

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reason to remember it. And I
remember writing in my diary like, I'm

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writing this down because I have to
come back and think about this some more.

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It just seems so urgent. But
then, like all dreams, when

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you wake up, they just kind
of evaporate and they go away and go

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on with your day, and more
thoughts come and go, and you're just

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swimming through this ocean of thoughts and
some get left behind and some for ahead.

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But when I went back and read
my diary, like twenty thirty years

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later, there was things that I'd
forgotten that I wrote about in this experience.

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And joining UFO Twitter was a way
for me to, you know,

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reconnect the dots where I'd kind of
left off, because you know, my

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whole UFO education was really done on
my own, through reading books and writing

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letters and getting letters in the mail
and getting books in the mail. It

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was a very slow, solitary kind
of experience. You know, it's not

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that it's a subject that attracts a
lot of people so normal, like most

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people like they're going through this like
completely alone, like there's no one to

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talk to. You're just there,
you know, staring into this this,

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this this thing. So it's it's
It was until I started listening to like

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little bits and pieces of like Grant
Cameron talking about download experiences that I was

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able to kind of maybe put that
into a context because there was this whole

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rush to like abduction, Right,
Was I abducted? Was I contacted?

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You know, the whole Whitley Strieber
phenomenon came out and it really just like

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lit up the whole world when you
you know, tapped into something. So

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I never really considered that I was
abducted in those ways, and it wasn't

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until many many years later, like
I said that, I was sort of

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thinking about the download experience, and
I thought that maybe there is a consciousness

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outreach that part of the energy of
the Earth and the natural order of the

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Earth and all of these invisible forces
that are all around us at all times,

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like Gamma rays, cosmic rays,
and the Earth's magnetism and solar flares,

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and I think that there's we're in
the middle of this kind of like

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four storm of forces. And I
thought, well, maybe that's something that

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planted an idea in my head.
Yeah, okay, go ahead, it

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was. I was gonna say that
it seems like a lot of people are

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talking about something called the collective consciousness, and I feel like, when I

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look at all these different pieces of
this puzzle, everything has a place,

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nothing actually doesn't fit. So when
people talk about the collective consciousness, I

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feel like that might be a part
of where we might be getting some of

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these And before I continue, we
have a visitor coming in. Hey,

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hey, Susan. Happy International Women's
Day, Miss Susan Fenston. And Deb

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and the I mean I was I
was doing. That was a dramatic pause.

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In case you didn't recognize that,
Susan dramatic pause. She's like,

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shut up, just get on with
it. Debs data Dojo. Hello,

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Okay, I'll be quiet. Now
back back to back to the lecture at

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hand. Oh yeah, well,
I was gonna say, welcome, DJ,

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host of Calling All Beings, thank
you for joining us. I never

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heard Thank you, Debs. I
really appreciate it. I appreciate your open

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invites to come and join you.
I'm sure Susan is feeling love. You

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have an amazing show and an inexplicable
connection with all beings. Well, we

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were just we were just kind of
getting into a discussion about how those beings

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may be connecting to us. So
and actually it connects to a question that

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someone had for you, Susan.
And I'll go ahead and ask that question

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because I feel like you touched on
this. It was from Jared. I'm

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gonna say Jedi Camper. I'm not
sure if that's the great way to say

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it. Okay, is there a
specific project you've made that you felt you

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were most you felt you were most
contacting the liminal where ideas were coming to

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you. What did it feel like
to follow and receive this inspiration from outside

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yourself? And I feel like that
directly connects to what you were just talking

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about with that dream. Yeah,
that that experience and that painting and that

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dream was nothing like anything else ever
in mind, entire artistic experience, journeying,

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learning about UFO experiences. It was
so profound that the painting doesn't come

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anywhere near what it was like.
And as I went back to the dream,

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I went back to my notes.
And this is what I always encourage

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people to do. When you have
experiences, no matter what they are,

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even if they're dreams, write it
all down, get a diary, get

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it down, because memory is,
you know, not always that great,

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but the pen and ink is always
there. And there were things that I

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had forgotten. As soon as I
reread them, it was like, oh,

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yeah, that's right, I remember
this. There was, you know,

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a scene where we were in a
and my descriptions about rounded glass and

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a round room and a woman on
a table who I described as an Asian

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woman in a totally nude body stocking. I read that like thirty five years

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after I wrote it down, and
I thought, wow, what does that

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mean? You know what was I
trying to interpret? I don't think it

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literally meant there was an Asian woman
wearing a nude onesie body stocking on a

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table. Why would somebody even be
on a table? So I am not

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making any staking claims to what is
traditionally thought about and discussed and you know,

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argued over what any of this means. But I just want to say

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I had a brush with something.
And then I became very psychic, and

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I started becoming very precognitive, and
I had a lot of precognitive dreams,

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and and then I had a very
explosive poltergeist experience. Not long after that,

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I lived in an apartment that was
just alive, and I'd never experienced

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anything like that before. And you
know, I've lived a lot of old

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apartments in the city, and you
think, well, they must all be

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haunted, but they're not. And
not all places are the same, and

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not all you know, atmospheres are
the same. So just like as and

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as you go and as you learn
and you have experience, as you start

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hearing about other people's experiences, and
then I started to be amazed to learn

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that this was part of a process, like a step that other people have

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gone through too. That really blew
me away, and that made me feel

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really good, like I'm part of
a pattern. I'm not a standalone weirdo,

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you know, like, yeah,
no, you're with other weirdos like

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dev myself. Actually I do.
Before we get too far away from it,

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I just want to point out and
I think Deb and you Susan are

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aware this is a topic. Nathan
is really fascinated with is this how should

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I say it? Ufo inspired informed
art And I know if he was here

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right now, he would be have
his shovel out, his spade shovel,

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and he'd be digging down on that, on the inspiration, this cross section

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between art and the phenomenon. So
I'm so glad that you share that because

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when he hears it, he's going
to be pretty happy about that. So

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so sorry, it's okay. I
wanted to share something that I had as

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an experience when I was a child. I had a very vivid dream that

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you know, I wasn't a very
religious person, but I had a dream

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that Jesus took me to some water
and showed me the fish in the water

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and showed me how some of them
were not swimming with the school of fish

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and informed me that I was going
to be different and that I wasn't going

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to swim with the school. And
the reason I bring this up is because

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in recent years I've been meditating quite
off and most of those years I spent

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inside what I called the cave.
But it was a very rigid cave.

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It didn't let me do anything to
it. It was always the same and

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then recently I decided to try to
leave the cave, and one of the

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first things I saw was that pathway
up to the water that I saw as

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a kid when I was dreaming.
So I'm just wondering if you've tried to

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explore any of this in meditation,
any of what happened, yes, with

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your dream. I don't really know
how to meditate, Like, it's not

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something I've ever practiced. I've considered
what that means, and I don't really

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I've never done it. I've never
sat and tried to tried to do that.

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I just I'm always just kind of
like thinking, like my mind is

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like a machine. It just like
never stopped. So I don't know that

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I can actually completely sit down and
c my mind. Maybe I should try

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it, but no, I never
have. I just connect all of this

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in with just what is just a
natural part of like everything that's accessible to

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me, all the natural order of
things that are accessible to me, Like

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my ghost experiences. You know,
I don't think of them as horrifying or

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it's just like to me, they're
just way more interesting, and it's just

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that getting past the veil, you
know, Wow, there's there's something there

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there's absolutely something there, and it
is communicating with us. And I think

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maybe if you're if you're good at
meditation and you're and you're good at channeling

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that, and if you are able
to communicate out to that, I think

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that could be really valuable. I've
never tried it, but I know because

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I've seen and heard. I have
a question for each of you. Ready

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to go for it each? Okay? So first Deb's point because it came

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first, and then Susan's point.
So you said that relative to the cave,

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you said I was never able to
change it, and that struck a

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chord with me because I'm thinking,
oh, I didn't know that in these

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dreams that you can shape them.
So apparently you have in your mind or

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had in your mind at that and
actually because you still have these dreams,

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but that you should have been a
you wanted to be able to or thought

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you could manipulate the cave. Okay, So to be clear, my meditation

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is awake. I'm awake when I'm
doing it, right, Yeah, it's

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it's so. And also I wanted
to add that to what you said,

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Susan. Meditation doesn't have to be
about empty in your mind and what I

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did was I used this cave to
try to have a visual of a place

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to go to just calm down,
right, But it kind of created itself

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very quickly. It was already there, basically, and I wasn't able to

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do anything to it. DJ.
It was already everything was already in a

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place and well in fact, but
you thought you could, which is interesting

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because you mentioned it, and I
just find that I found that intriguing.

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Yes, I've I've thought that it
would be what I imagined, and actually

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I've made an effort to imagine another
place and I failed at it completely.

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Again. Yes, I tried to
imagine like a white palace with Asian furniture

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everywhere, because that's what I would
have thought would have been a cool place

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to go sit in, right,
Because I love Asian art, yes,

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which is why I also really love
that you use the ink, because I

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love Asian art. But Anio,
so I'm going to ask also if you

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00:17:52.119 --> 00:17:56.880
use rice paper, but I'll get
into that lead. I have a Susan

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question too, from her last point. Susan, what you were talking about

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earlier about the ghosts, do you
find in that since you've been studying the

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phenomenon for so long? Are you
find or did you find a connection when

210
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you were with that? The ghosts
for our spirits, I'm not sure what

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we want to call them and what
we would consider other intelligences. This to

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me, the two specific experiences were
very different, totally different places, decades

213
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apart. I don't have a pattern
of finding this wherever I go. It

214
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just seemed to be rooted to where
it was. These things were just very

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human. They were part of us, They were part of what comes after.

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That's the impression I got. The
first one was a very noisy poltergeist

217
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in my Brooklyn apartment where I lived
for like about six months. Like you

218
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know, back then, rent was
cheap. You could move around a lot.

219
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I mean, you pick up the
village boys, Oh there's an apartment

220
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down the street, or oh there's
You could just move around. It was

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a totally different city, It was
a totally different world and time. There

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were a lot more freedom, So
moving around a lot was pretty common.

223
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And you know, you didn't like
your roommate, you were like, I'm

224
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out of here, you know,
I'm gonna go get a new place and

225
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find this apartment. Everything seemed fine, and then I started hearing footsteps walking

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through the apartment, and of course
you know the logistics of it. I

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was in a corner apartment. I'm
on the top floor, there's no one

228
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above me. I can't hear the
footsteps below me. This was clearly coming

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from inside the apartment. And that
went on for quite a while, and

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I was telling my friends. People
weren't believing me, but they'd want to

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come over and hang out and see
they would. They'd come over like we

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I'd make tea. I'd make some
really really strong Scottish black tea, and

233
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we would sit in this apartment in
this drug infested neighborhood with the fire house

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right around the corner, and the
motorcycles going around the block and the prostitutes.

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And we're sitting in my little haunted
apartment drinking tea until four o'clock in

236
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the morning, waiting for something to
happen. And it would never happen like

237
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that. But anyway, long story
short, I did have a witness to

238
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one of the most dramatic events.
And it was my boyfriend at the time.

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Came to stay over, and he
wasn't believing me either at all.

240
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We would like lie down and we
were about to go to sleep, and

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we both heard at the same time
from the other room in the apartment,

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heavy chains rattling like you can imagine
like giant ships chains. And after these

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chains were just rattling like this long, agonizing moan just fill the entire apartment,

244
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and he just like shut up.
We both shot up and we looked

245
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at each other like like what seemed
to be an eternity. Our eyes were

246
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just looking at each other like what
was that? And He's like, I'm

247
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gonna go see what it is,
and I was like, don't. I

248
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don't want any visual confirmation like hearing
it was when enough, I mean,

249
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but it wasn't the kind of thing
where you like run from the house screaming.

250
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To me, it was just like
plumbing the depths of like the most

251
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interesting stuff that there is in the
world, okay, is what we're dealing

252
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with the unknown. And some of
this is not always good for you for

253
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your mental health after a while,
because you're like, what is that what

254
00:21:42.720 --> 00:21:45.680
I'm hearing? And I'm hearing things? Am I going crazy? And it

255
00:21:45.720 --> 00:21:49.119
does start to like get in there
in not the greatest ways. But I

256
00:21:49.720 --> 00:21:53.680
did have that experience. To me, it was completely human. It was

257
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something left over from some life that
was very much attached to that apartment.

258
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Did not follow me, thank god. But there was no hitchhiker effect with

259
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that incident. And the next one
was just like a curious mist many many,

260
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many many years ago up in Woodstock
and an old family house and people

261
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had died in the house. Family
had died in the house. It was

262
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a house had been in the family
a long time, and it were dead

263
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asleep in the middle of the night, cold winter, cold, silent,

264
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and I opened my eyes for just
a second and there was this heavy,

265
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milky mist just hovering over the bed, like literally like in our faces,

266
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just over us, up against us. That he was dead asleep. Boyfriend's

267
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dead asleep. I'm so tired that
I just opened my eyes. I looked

268
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at it, and I thought,
like, well, I can't deal with

269
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this right now. That was my
reaction. I just went, what am

270
00:23:03.799 --> 00:23:07.839
I going to do? I don't
want to like, oh what I like

271
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deb telling them to stay out of
my house. Yeah, I don't know.

272
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I definitely can relate to just being
like that right now. It was

273
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like to me, it's part of
the natural world, is like but that,

274
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But do you think there's a connection
with the phenomenon. That was my

275
00:23:26.920 --> 00:23:33.240
original question. Yes, okay,
no, I think it's a I have

276
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a different theory on it. I'm
gonna chime in on that. I think

277
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it's not so much a connection as
in the ghosts and the aliens are the

278
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same or whatever. But I think
it's a connection of our ability to perceive,

279
00:23:51.920 --> 00:23:56.720
our ability to pick up on these
things. We're picking up on that,

280
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and we're starting to pick up more
and more on other phenomenon which we

281
00:24:03.759 --> 00:24:10.039
could say, is, you know, interdimensional, we could say it's extraterrestrial.

282
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We still don't really know. We
only have hope of what it could

283
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be. Right, So I feel
like it's more about our ability to tune

284
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in, and I think that that's
something that's increasing over time and maybe something

285
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we used to have all the time, because it sounds like we had a

286
00:24:30.119 --> 00:24:36.960
lot more contact back in the day
and then now it's perhaps coming back.

287
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I think we are receptors at our
brains are processors, and we're just processing.

288
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What is I mean, where is
the mind? Where is conscious?

289
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I don't know. I don't have
to answer. Is a great question.

290
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I loved thinking about this stuff.
I just don't know. I think that

291
00:24:55.079 --> 00:25:03.359
being open, awake receptor of looking
at things, always open to things,

292
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always you're going to come across a
lot of things, because there are a

293
00:25:07.519 --> 00:25:11.960
lot of things to come across.
And I think that there's tears and levels,

294
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and there's underworld and there's outer world, and I think that they're all

295
00:25:17.119 --> 00:25:19.960
different, like you know, the
way all the creatures of our world inhabit

296
00:25:21.039 --> 00:25:25.000
are our world, the monkeys and
the whales, and everybody's all different,

297
00:25:25.599 --> 00:25:29.880
but we're all connected. So I
think that's kind of the way it is.

298
00:25:30.079 --> 00:25:36.680
But there's something about the UFO phenomenon
that you know, is just extra

299
00:25:37.480 --> 00:25:42.680
right. It's that this is extra
interesting. Human beings are interesting, but

300
00:25:42.720 --> 00:25:52.359
when you're talking about intelligences that are
we've heard, we've read the books,

301
00:25:52.119 --> 00:25:56.880
we're in it up to our eyes, you know. I mean, I've

302
00:25:56.880 --> 00:26:00.480
never seen a flying saucer, but
I will tell you they are real.

303
00:26:00.920 --> 00:26:07.079
And all of this is real,
and we are just struggling to deal with

304
00:26:07.759 --> 00:26:12.319
this thing that's just impressing into our
reality and out and has far more reach

305
00:26:12.480 --> 00:26:17.160
than we do. And I've heard
people describe things that they'd seen that have

306
00:26:17.240 --> 00:26:25.279
materialize and de materialize. Is that
that reality seemed stronger than this one,

307
00:26:25.799 --> 00:26:30.720
which is sort of interesting, like, wow, there's a real power to

308
00:26:30.799 --> 00:26:34.039
that. You know, when they
can bridge into our world. You know,

309
00:26:34.920 --> 00:26:38.119
they're not exactly sitting down and having
tea with us, you know,

310
00:26:38.200 --> 00:26:45.440
like Alice in Wonderland, They're I
just don't know. I mean, you

311
00:26:45.519 --> 00:26:48.640
hear the negative stories, you hear
the positive stories. And I think all

312
00:26:48.680 --> 00:26:52.160
of us, in our hearts,
in our minds, we kind of gravitate

313
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to what satisfies us the most.
Some people want to be afraid, some

314
00:26:56.119 --> 00:27:00.559
people just want to feel love.
And then there's that contradiction of all this

315
00:27:00.720 --> 00:27:06.240
love talk from these cold and motionless
beings. What are they talking about when

316
00:27:06.279 --> 00:27:11.559
they're talking about love? You know, what does it praying mantis know about

317
00:27:11.119 --> 00:27:17.200
love? And are all these other
creatures. So I'm just saying like we

318
00:27:17.279 --> 00:27:18.720
are just at the very beginning,
and I think all of us are part

319
00:27:18.759 --> 00:27:23.599
of the part of that new era
of what is coming. You know,

320
00:27:23.680 --> 00:27:27.599
this is the groundwork, you know, all the ones, you know,

321
00:27:27.640 --> 00:27:33.480
all the peeps that came before us, you know, all the homies that

322
00:27:33.519 --> 00:27:36.920
aren't going to see the day.
We may not see the day, but

323
00:27:37.160 --> 00:27:41.680
it's it's coming. Something is real. It's absolutely real, and uh,

324
00:27:42.640 --> 00:27:47.279
I want to see it. I
want to see I think we will.

325
00:27:47.799 --> 00:27:51.000
I think we will. I think
you know, I know we keep hearing

326
00:27:51.119 --> 00:27:55.279
the government's locking down on us,
but I think that there it's unavoidable.

327
00:27:55.559 --> 00:28:00.400
I think it's so pervasive. So
many more people are paying attention just the

328
00:28:00.599 --> 00:28:06.440
act of looking up at the sky
alone. It's like more people are looking

329
00:28:06.599 --> 00:28:11.000
up and paying attention. Now they're
going, oh, today, today,

330
00:28:11.079 --> 00:28:15.119
I too will get to see something. Yeah. Think about all of those

331
00:28:15.200 --> 00:28:18.519
military guys out on those planes in
the Navy that have said that we see

332
00:28:18.519 --> 00:28:22.559
those every day. We see them
every week, We watch them for wee

333
00:28:22.799 --> 00:28:26.680
years, we watch them. I
want to be on that boat, I

334
00:28:26.759 --> 00:28:30.799
really I want, don't you I
want to. I want to. But

335
00:28:30.160 --> 00:28:36.480
it's amazing how yes, I know
that doesn't like break out from there.

336
00:28:36.640 --> 00:28:42.880
This is such a tremendous event,
right, And yeah, I want to

337
00:28:42.920 --> 00:28:48.119
say I'm going to say no to
being on the boat because I think that

338
00:28:48.319 --> 00:28:52.000
those particular objects are getting a little
too close or attracted to the nuclear stuff,

339
00:28:52.480 --> 00:28:56.200
and they're getting a little close,
and they are dangerous for us.

340
00:28:56.359 --> 00:29:02.200
I would much prefer to, you
know, have just something land because when

341
00:29:02.240 --> 00:29:06.640
it's off, apparently it's not dangerous. And then I'll go up and talk

342
00:29:07.200 --> 00:29:10.319
That's what I wanted to. Hey, can you guys shut it down and

343
00:29:10.359 --> 00:29:15.160
then I'll approach thank you. Yeah. But but but I hear so many

344
00:29:15.200 --> 00:29:21.880
stories about like people should not be
going over and trying to touch these things

345
00:29:21.880 --> 00:29:25.440
while they're in motion, and that's
just kind of common sense. It's sort

346
00:29:25.440 --> 00:29:29.920
of like going in front of a
train. But but I would I would

347
00:29:30.079 --> 00:29:34.240
like them. Yes, that's terrible. Oh what a mistake. You know.

348
00:29:36.400 --> 00:29:40.319
But you know, I think we
will get with the upcoming report in

349
00:29:40.359 --> 00:29:45.240
October. I think we're going to
get more information about that what's going on

350
00:29:45.279 --> 00:29:51.160
with the military, for sure.
I think we're going to get little bit

351
00:29:51.480 --> 00:29:55.160
trips and drabs. I mean,
are they really gonna sit down and here's

352
00:29:55.200 --> 00:30:00.559
the men, you guys, here's
the beings, here's here's where they're from,

353
00:30:00.599 --> 00:30:03.920
here's what they want, here's what
you're gonna do. I don't think

354
00:30:03.920 --> 00:30:06.920
it's gonna I just don't think it's
gonna be like that. I just don't

355
00:30:06.960 --> 00:30:10.519
know. I think that there's so
much more at play than that, and

356
00:30:10.559 --> 00:30:14.720
it really goes far beyond what our
military wants and the power of our countries

357
00:30:15.240 --> 00:30:22.400
want and all the desire for weapons
and flying carpets and everybody. You know,

358
00:30:22.440 --> 00:30:25.759
I don't know. I'm not really
not interested in the machinery at all.

359
00:30:26.279 --> 00:30:30.480
I want to know who they are
and what are they about. I

360
00:30:30.519 --> 00:30:33.400
want to know their history. I
want them to tell us our history.

361
00:30:34.039 --> 00:30:38.519
But is that really gonna happen?
I don't know, but I'll tell you

362
00:30:38.559 --> 00:30:42.200
what. It keeps you sharp.
I mean, this thing gets into your

363
00:30:42.240 --> 00:30:47.440
mind and it just keeps you,
keeps you gripped. I mean, I

364
00:30:47.440 --> 00:30:52.039
can't believe there are people who aren't
interested in it. Yeah, I think

365
00:30:52.079 --> 00:30:56.640
that When you were talking about your
dream, it made me think of doctor

366
00:30:56.680 --> 00:31:03.079
Persolka from American Cosmic talking about you
know, kind of like the calling right,

367
00:31:03.440 --> 00:31:08.960
and it's like a a switch is
flipped right, And a lot of

368
00:31:08.960 --> 00:31:14.400
people experience that. And everyone tells
me about something that pulls them in,

369
00:31:15.000 --> 00:31:18.160
and it's different for everybody. It
sounds like your dream was part of you

370
00:31:18.279 --> 00:31:23.319
being pulled in. Oddly enough,
I was interested in a lot of other

371
00:31:23.440 --> 00:31:29.599
paranormal stuff, but wasn't really as
into UFOs because to me, it was

372
00:31:29.640 --> 00:31:32.920
just like that's natural. Also,
it's just what it is. In fact,

373
00:31:33.000 --> 00:31:37.039
sometimes I'm a lie. Sometimes it's
hard to be enthusiastic, and I'm

374
00:31:37.079 --> 00:31:41.559
like, why are we bending over
backwards about something that's just the equivalent of

375
00:31:41.640 --> 00:31:45.640
whales? You know, Like it's
because it's the same. It's so natural

376
00:31:45.720 --> 00:31:49.359
to me, right, But yeah, everyone everyone, Some people have sightings

377
00:31:49.440 --> 00:31:53.680
that that pulls them in. I
feel like that's what happens. The switch

378
00:31:53.759 --> 00:31:59.279
is just flipped. Speaking of switches, I was talking to somebody just a

379
00:31:59.279 --> 00:32:02.440
couple of weeks ago or so about
we're not we don't know each other through

380
00:32:02.599 --> 00:32:07.240
UFOs or about UFOs. It's a
producer who's working on developing a podcast for

381
00:32:07.400 --> 00:32:13.480
my book, and she took a
look at my Twitter account and she's read

382
00:32:13.480 --> 00:32:16.519
my book twenty times. She and
I have been very much enmissed and talking

383
00:32:16.519 --> 00:32:21.680
about this project, and this was
an aspect of myself that she didn't know

384
00:32:21.720 --> 00:32:24.079
about. And she's like, well, you're really interested in UFOs and I

385
00:32:24.119 --> 00:32:28.400
was like yeah. And I asked
her, I said, have you ever

386
00:32:28.440 --> 00:32:32.640
seen one? She's like yeah.
I was like, WHOA, how come

387
00:32:32.759 --> 00:32:37.279
I didn't have that experience? She
said that where was this? I forget

388
00:32:37.319 --> 00:32:42.480
where it was either California. It
was somewhere on the West coast and she

389
00:32:42.599 --> 00:32:47.400
and her brother were out playing somewhere
and all of a sudden they looked up

390
00:32:49.119 --> 00:32:54.279
and there was a disc, she
said, a metal flying saucer disc,

391
00:32:54.440 --> 00:32:58.359
just there, out of nowhere.
And then it was there for a while

392
00:32:58.440 --> 00:33:01.880
and then it just it just disappeared. And when she looked back, she

393
00:33:02.000 --> 00:33:06.440
wanted to look away, but because
she was afraid, she wanted to look

394
00:33:06.440 --> 00:33:07.640
away, but she didn't want to
because she said, if she looked back

395
00:33:07.640 --> 00:33:09.680
and it wasn't there, so she
didn't want to take her eyes off of

396
00:33:09.720 --> 00:33:12.920
it. And that's why everyone's like, why did you take a picture,

397
00:33:13.200 --> 00:33:17.640
because like people don't want to take
their eyes away because so enrapturing. And

398
00:33:17.720 --> 00:33:21.279
she as soon as she turned away
and look at her brother and she looked

399
00:33:21.319 --> 00:33:23.720
back again, it was gone.
And she said, the funniest thing about

400
00:33:23.799 --> 00:33:30.359
that was that it was just so
amazing, and she and her brother never

401
00:33:30.480 --> 00:33:36.400
talked about it again. Now when
people say that, it's like I hear

402
00:33:36.480 --> 00:33:40.160
that a lot. You know,
Yeah, it was just this overwhelming,

403
00:33:40.319 --> 00:33:46.079
like almost spiritual moment, like shapers
creepers, and then you don't talk about

404
00:33:46.079 --> 00:33:52.920
it again, Like, yeah,
they don't, and it's consistent throughout a

405
00:33:52.960 --> 00:33:58.359
lot of accounts like why yeah,
And I actually spoke to a therapist about

406
00:33:58.359 --> 00:34:01.400
that recently. It's almost like they
almost don't remember. It's almost like they're

407
00:34:01.440 --> 00:34:07.759
in a fog or something afterwards.
And then a Q is what some people

408
00:34:07.839 --> 00:34:10.719
call it. I think Preston Denitt
called it. A Q triggers it.

409
00:34:12.480 --> 00:34:16.760
And the guy, he's an actor, I just spoke about him. He

410
00:34:16.920 --> 00:34:22.639
was talking about he saw the Phoenix
lights. He reported the Phoenix lights for

411
00:34:22.840 --> 00:34:28.719
Russell, Thank you, Thank you
DJ and he didn't remember it for like

412
00:34:28.840 --> 00:34:31.679
two years he had done it,
he reported it, he didn't remember it,

413
00:34:31.760 --> 00:34:35.599
and then something on the news popped
up and he goes, oh,

414
00:34:35.599 --> 00:34:37.519
that's what I saw, And then
he's like, why didn't I remember that

415
00:34:37.599 --> 00:34:42.519
for like years? H Yeah.
Kurt's a pilot, so he was flying

416
00:34:43.599 --> 00:34:45.199
at that time. I think he
must have landed. It's some airfield in

417
00:34:45.199 --> 00:34:52.079
Phoenix. Also heard a narrative about
that one where I don't know if they

418
00:34:52.119 --> 00:34:55.639
were F sixteen pilots from Luke Air
Force Base that took off either F sixteen

419
00:34:55.719 --> 00:34:59.920
or F fifteen. I know Luke
to have F sixteen's but in any case,

420
00:35:00.239 --> 00:35:04.360
they took off, and some of
the crew chiefs that caught those airplanes

421
00:35:04.400 --> 00:35:07.199
when they landed and parked said they
looked, you know, like, I

422
00:35:07.239 --> 00:35:10.199
hate to use this white as a
ghost because we were just talking about the

423
00:35:10.199 --> 00:35:14.920
connection between ghosts and the phenomenon,
but yeah, but said that they looked

424
00:35:15.320 --> 00:35:24.079
rather startled and unusual exiting the aircraft. Yes, since you were saying,

425
00:35:24.119 --> 00:35:28.960
Susan that you're kind of you kind
of went through the process of maybe I

426
00:35:29.000 --> 00:35:30.920
was abducted. You might be in
the same place as me, just kind

427
00:35:30.920 --> 00:35:36.519
of waiting for that queue, waiting
for which queue is going to unlock something

428
00:35:36.559 --> 00:35:39.159
else. Yeah, you know,
I mean there, I guess it's like

429
00:35:39.199 --> 00:35:43.559
a rorjack in some ways. I
mean, sometimes something is so big and

430
00:35:43.599 --> 00:35:46.440
so vast you can almost just kind
of hook something into it somewhere along the

431
00:35:46.440 --> 00:35:49.599
way and say, yeah, I
had a similar experience to that, And

432
00:35:49.639 --> 00:35:53.199
maybe that meets up with what my
expectations are, what this phenomenon is.

433
00:35:53.239 --> 00:35:58.320
You know, I had massive nose
bleeds when I was a kid, like

434
00:35:58.440 --> 00:36:02.320
inexplicable, and this is something I've
read about, like that that nose bleedes

435
00:36:02.400 --> 00:36:06.559
and children and like, and the
phenomenon is like closely linked. And I

436
00:36:06.599 --> 00:36:12.880
thought, how would that happen?
Because I'm from Manhattan, right, And

437
00:36:12.920 --> 00:36:19.719
I thought, flying saucers just don't
land in Spanish Harlem on my roof and

438
00:36:19.920 --> 00:36:23.719
come down into my apartment where my
second grade little body is lying in bed

439
00:36:24.159 --> 00:36:29.119
with a massive nosebleed. Like I
just couldn't like connect that. But you

440
00:36:29.159 --> 00:36:30.840
know what, Susan, they might
land in Spanish Harlem. You want to

441
00:36:30.880 --> 00:36:34.880
get take out from rails, you
know, if you want to get take

442
00:36:34.880 --> 00:36:37.440
out from rails, you gotta go
to Spanish Harlem. If they want the

443
00:36:37.440 --> 00:36:39.639
phenomenon knows this, they know this. That's the reason to come to Earth

444
00:36:40.480 --> 00:36:46.000
and to stay for a while.
Absolutely, So look, I guess I

445
00:36:46.320 --> 00:36:51.840
just don't know, and I think
I'm open to any possibility. Are they

446
00:36:51.960 --> 00:36:55.360
just putting us on like an on
a blast? Is there some sort of

447
00:36:55.400 --> 00:37:02.119
like emp pulse that goes out through
consciousness that takes in like a net certain

448
00:37:02.760 --> 00:37:08.519
lights in our humanity, certain people, certain souls that are open and receptive.

449
00:37:08.599 --> 00:37:14.519
Do they pulse and if somebody responds, I mean, it's becomes a

450
00:37:14.639 --> 00:37:22.679
personal experience for the experiencer. Or
is it something far more dramatic like beings?

451
00:37:22.719 --> 00:37:27.119
At your bed, floating you out
of a window, taking you into

452
00:37:27.239 --> 00:37:32.199
you know that I I would just
be so overwhelmed. I think that would

453
00:37:32.280 --> 00:37:37.320
just be so overwhelming to reality to
think about that, that that tipe of

454
00:37:37.400 --> 00:37:43.280
situation. Meanwhile, Dev's is like, I hope it happens before bedtime because

455
00:37:43.320 --> 00:37:47.239
if I can squeeze this in before
it, well, I will say once

456
00:37:47.320 --> 00:37:53.639
I started just embracing all of this
and like it, it was, you

457
00:37:53.639 --> 00:37:58.000
know, it's kind of weird,
and I'm like more open about this on

458
00:37:58.119 --> 00:38:00.559
now. A lot of people have
heard me say this. I I'd seen

459
00:38:00.599 --> 00:38:05.280
a UAP, right, I've seen
one, but it just again, it

460
00:38:05.360 --> 00:38:09.440
was so normal to me. And
I've spoken to someone who said that that

461
00:38:09.639 --> 00:38:16.559
probably means you've seen them before.
That just wasn't weird to me. There's

462
00:38:16.719 --> 00:38:22.119
other things that happened in my childhood
that are really strange that could line up.

463
00:38:23.079 --> 00:38:25.360
And so maybe, like I said, I'm waiting for a queue,

464
00:38:25.440 --> 00:38:31.840
but can you describe what you saw? Not clearly? I know that I

465
00:38:31.920 --> 00:38:37.159
did the checklist when I was looking
at it. I know that it was

466
00:38:37.360 --> 00:38:44.000
not a typical flying saucer. It
wasn't round like that on the bottom.

467
00:38:44.199 --> 00:38:51.199
It was more complicated, and it's
the closest shape I've seen is a little

468
00:38:51.199 --> 00:38:58.519
bit like what is what is that
craft that you use in the water to

469
00:38:58.559 --> 00:39:00.920
go really fast? It's like a
person at the most craft. It's like

470
00:39:00.960 --> 00:39:07.079
a little motorbike almost on the water. What is that called? Yeah,

471
00:39:07.079 --> 00:39:10.719
So it had more of that shape, but much bigger, and it was

472
00:39:12.079 --> 00:39:15.679
you know, no no propellers at
all. Was just sitting there, not

473
00:39:15.760 --> 00:39:23.559
moving, not doing anything near an
airport. Symmetrical, Yeah, but I

474
00:39:23.679 --> 00:39:29.639
like, but not it had that
bump in the front. It was interesting,

475
00:39:29.880 --> 00:39:34.800
like it was like bump like that. You know, I can't listeners.

476
00:39:34.840 --> 00:39:37.960
I'm sorry, I can't do the
hand gesture for you. So but

477
00:39:37.960 --> 00:39:40.719
but but it wasn't It wasn't like
this bump was in the middle. You

478
00:39:40.760 --> 00:39:46.199
know. I remember just thinking that
asymmetrical. Asymmetric. Yeah, but but

479
00:39:46.199 --> 00:39:51.360
but it was it was I think
it was more oval. And I can

480
00:39:51.440 --> 00:39:58.480
tell it was white silver, like
really bright white with like a silvery metallic

481
00:39:58.639 --> 00:40:01.639
look to it. And I was
just sitting there, like I said,

482
00:40:01.679 --> 00:40:06.480
it was there for a while.
Was it at night? Was it it

483
00:40:07.159 --> 00:40:12.320
was the day? It was during
the day, And the reason I was

484
00:40:12.360 --> 00:40:17.719
looking in the sky is because things
fly pretty low in the airport. It's

485
00:40:17.800 --> 00:40:23.719
just a little airport in Maryland,
and sometimes things would fly right over the

486
00:40:23.760 --> 00:40:29.760
car, like because I would be
driving my clients like every week. Every

487
00:40:29.760 --> 00:40:31.800
week, I would go back and
forth, and sometimes things fly right over

488
00:40:31.960 --> 00:40:36.880
overhead. So I look on the
sky whenever I go past the airport,

489
00:40:37.360 --> 00:40:42.639
and I caught this just sitting there, and it really wasn't my only experience,

490
00:40:45.119 --> 00:40:51.079
but I guess, you know,
like you said, sometimes it could

491
00:40:51.159 --> 00:40:57.880
just be we're just like we catch
on to something and then we're kind of

492
00:40:57.960 --> 00:41:00.360
roped in, you know, like
there like, oh you noticed us,

493
00:41:01.960 --> 00:41:08.000
We're gonna, we're gonna have some
words with you now. I like that

494
00:41:08.079 --> 00:41:13.519
whole pulse thing that I hadn't heard
anyone say it quite liked, Susan Dee,

495
00:41:13.599 --> 00:41:16.239
I'd never really thought of it before. I'm just kind of like spitballing

496
00:41:16.280 --> 00:41:22.239
in here as like ideas or trying
as I'm trying to explain, you know,

497
00:41:22.320 --> 00:41:27.239
what I think as a possibility,
and it's just like a big email

498
00:41:27.320 --> 00:41:32.159
blast like okay, humans, you
know, we're gonna we're gonna, you

499
00:41:32.199 --> 00:41:38.840
know, we're gonna enlighten you somewhere. And it's just I can't I can't

500
00:41:38.840 --> 00:41:44.719
imagine going through life without wonder and
about without wondering all of this stuff,

501
00:41:44.760 --> 00:41:47.280
you know, like it's just been
the greatest asset to my life. And

502
00:41:47.320 --> 00:41:53.280
I had so many difficulties dealing with
people. And my interest in UFO is

503
00:41:53.360 --> 00:41:58.519
because like they just laugh at you. You know. I've been called everything

504
00:41:58.679 --> 00:42:05.039
like from medieval to I don't know. It's just like UFOs when they weren't

505
00:42:05.079 --> 00:42:07.159
cool, that's when I'm and that
was when I was like really into them,

506
00:42:07.400 --> 00:42:09.360
and everyone was like, why do
you think about that, that's so

507
00:42:09.519 --> 00:42:15.440
nineteen seventies. I'm like, no, but it's so interesting. When I

508
00:42:15.480 --> 00:42:21.400
got my first job in publishing in
nineteen eighty nine, I worked in the

509
00:42:21.400 --> 00:42:31.440
publicity of Double Day Publishing, Yes, and one of my jaws was dealing

510
00:42:31.480 --> 00:42:36.840
with the author mail and mail would
come in. It was a big publishing

511
00:42:36.840 --> 00:42:39.760
house, Double Day Publishing. We
got mailed all the time, people writing

512
00:42:39.760 --> 00:42:45.239
to authors, and it just occurred
to me, like I didn't know that

513
00:42:45.280 --> 00:42:47.559
you could write to authors. It's
like, I didn't know you could do

514
00:42:47.599 --> 00:42:52.639
that. So the first author that
I wrote to was John Keel because I

515
00:42:52.679 --> 00:42:57.639
had read The Mothman prophecies. So
I thought, well, I'm going to

516
00:42:58.400 --> 00:43:01.519
got the address of his publisher.
I wrote him in a handwritten note online

517
00:43:01.559 --> 00:43:07.119
to notebook paper and sent it in. You know the thing about mail,

518
00:43:07.159 --> 00:43:10.360
you know, mac back in those
days, you put the mail in the

519
00:43:10.400 --> 00:43:13.639
mailbox, and then you know you
have to really wait. You know,

520
00:43:13.760 --> 00:43:17.559
time goes by the mail lens on
someone's desk, it sits there and then

521
00:43:17.599 --> 00:43:22.639
it gets shut all over here.
He called me on the phone. I

522
00:43:22.679 --> 00:43:28.360
came home. I was having a
really lousy day. I checked my answering

523
00:43:28.400 --> 00:43:31.000
machine. It was like, dude, Hi, this is John Keel.

524
00:43:31.400 --> 00:43:37.639
You wrote me a letter. Oh
god, he's calling me. John Keill

525
00:43:38.760 --> 00:43:43.559
call like me. I mean,
it was like to me at the time,

526
00:43:43.639 --> 00:43:45.519
and I guess even this time too, it would be like like Mick

527
00:43:45.639 --> 00:43:51.639
Jagger calling you, like like the
most important person in your world. It's

528
00:43:51.679 --> 00:43:53.599
like calling you on the phone.
Anyway, we had I called him back.

529
00:43:54.400 --> 00:43:59.840
We had a long talk on the
phone, and he wanted to know

530
00:44:00.119 --> 00:44:04.519
about my ghost experience, and I
was like, ghosts. I mean,

531
00:44:04.960 --> 00:44:07.679
who cares about ghosts? Everybody sees
ghosts. I want to hear about UFOs,

532
00:44:08.480 --> 00:44:10.840
I want to hear about aliens,
and you know, he didn't.

533
00:44:12.159 --> 00:44:15.079
He was like no, he wasn't. Like he didn't call me up to

534
00:44:15.119 --> 00:44:16.159
say, okay, here, Susan, here's the book of truth. I'm

535
00:44:16.199 --> 00:44:20.039
going to read a page two,
you know, and here's all the real

536
00:44:20.159 --> 00:44:22.360
deal here. I mean it just
that's not the way any of this works.

537
00:44:22.760 --> 00:44:27.000
So we had a great conversation.
I joined the New York Fordian Society

538
00:44:27.360 --> 00:44:32.000
and went to meetings every month.
And anyway, after my phone conversation with

539
00:44:32.079 --> 00:44:40.079
John Keeo, my phone started getting
this beeping sound on it. I was

540
00:44:40.159 --> 00:44:46.920
on other calls with friends. These
are old dial up rotary copper wire phone

541
00:44:47.239 --> 00:44:55.239
and I'm talking to a friend and
there was this intermittent beep, very lonely,

542
00:44:55.519 --> 00:45:00.480
very far, always sound. It
almost sounded like it was coming from

543
00:45:00.800 --> 00:45:07.559
space. I mean it was like
beep beep. It was like steady.

544
00:45:07.800 --> 00:45:10.199
And I was saying to my friend
do you hear that? He's like,

545
00:45:10.280 --> 00:45:14.360
yeah, what is that? I
said, well, ever since I talked

546
00:45:14.360 --> 00:45:17.440
to John Keele on the phone,
I've had this beeping on my phone.

547
00:45:17.639 --> 00:45:21.440
And he was so jealous. He
was like, you talked to John Keel.

548
00:45:21.480 --> 00:45:23.840
I was like yeah, because I
was ahead of the curve Okay,

549
00:45:23.840 --> 00:45:29.000
I was the lone weirdo into the
subject, and all my partsy partsy hip

550
00:45:29.199 --> 00:45:31.079
New York City downtown friends were like, oh, that's just so not cool.

551
00:45:31.119 --> 00:45:35.039
Then suddenly they realized UFOs were cool, and then they were like all

552
00:45:35.079 --> 00:45:37.639
over me, like, oh my
god, you have to put me in

553
00:45:37.679 --> 00:45:39.280
touch with John Keel, you know. And you know, it was like

554
00:45:39.679 --> 00:45:45.559
things had changed, and I wasn't
going to give his phone number out.

555
00:45:45.559 --> 00:45:47.079
There's just no way, I said, if you weren't right to John Keele,

556
00:45:47.519 --> 00:45:51.480
go right ahead, I'm not.
I'm never going to give anyone's phone

557
00:45:51.519 --> 00:45:57.280
number out. But anyway, I
don't how we got that whole subject.

558
00:45:57.440 --> 00:46:04.400
But it's just been a great journey. It's just been a spectacular, great,

559
00:46:04.800 --> 00:46:09.760
fun, challenging, spooky, amazing, inspiring and still inspiring and it

560
00:46:09.880 --> 00:46:15.360
always will be. You know,
you are a receiver, Susan fenced and

561
00:46:15.400 --> 00:46:20.760
clearly both you and this young lady
here, both of whom's hair looks outstanding

562
00:46:20.840 --> 00:46:25.920
tonight, and thank you and and
maybe you want to mention never mind,

563
00:46:27.039 --> 00:46:34.960
okay, uh, I want to
wish you guys a very happy International Women's

564
00:46:35.039 --> 00:46:37.679
Day. It's great to talk to
my New York home girls, I'm gonna

565
00:46:37.719 --> 00:46:44.559
leave you in the capable hands of
Maryland's own soon to be the neighbor of

566
00:46:44.679 --> 00:46:50.320
one quantum Witch, Priscilla Debstata Dojo, also known as Study of UAPs.

567
00:46:51.119 --> 00:46:54.360
Thank you for letting me barge in
on your day. Thank you Green for

568
00:46:54.400 --> 00:46:57.840
the hard chakra. It was good
to talk to you today. To Susan,

569
00:46:58.159 --> 00:47:04.440
always love you, guys, Thank
you, Thank you. Bye.

570
00:47:07.639 --> 00:47:14.400
Okay, so we're still Oh yeah, we're still gone. So I had

571
00:47:14.440 --> 00:47:19.920
a question. Oh but I've got
to ask the rice paper question before.

572
00:47:21.360 --> 00:47:27.400
Do you use rice paper? I
have? It's just a regular I'll get

573
00:47:27.400 --> 00:47:31.840
it hold on for for those who
are not aware. While she's looking,

574
00:47:32.679 --> 00:47:37.880
she does a lot of the ink
painting. Oh yeah, okay, I

575
00:47:37.239 --> 00:47:43.360
have some of those. Okay,
I was just serious, just regular old

576
00:47:43.440 --> 00:47:52.119
paper, and here you can see. Why do you say it's because of

577
00:47:52.159 --> 00:47:55.800
your interest in the UFOs that you
do extraterrestrials so often, because it seems

578
00:47:55.840 --> 00:48:01.840
like that inspires you a lot.
I've never done this type. This is

579
00:48:02.000 --> 00:48:07.800
recent. All of this ink drawing
stuff comes from being inspired from UFO twitter.

580
00:48:07.880 --> 00:48:10.840
I'd never really done anything like that
before I used. What I used

581
00:48:10.880 --> 00:48:21.239
to do were oil paintings of like
old what looked like old CPA Victorian photographs

582
00:48:21.239 --> 00:48:24.880
of sea scapes and landscapes, and
then I would just paint in little UFOs

583
00:48:24.960 --> 00:48:30.639
and them and it's all very serious
stuff, of course, and a couple

584
00:48:30.639 --> 00:48:37.719
of other odd and and very large
paintings. It just sort of happened.

585
00:48:37.760 --> 00:48:42.440
I wasn't I didn't really know to
join UFOs and art right away. I

586
00:48:42.559 --> 00:48:46.519
was sort of in an abstract phase
and not really knowing what to do with

587
00:48:46.559 --> 00:48:52.360
my art. And my my ex
husband was like, I was like,

588
00:48:52.360 --> 00:48:54.679
well, I don't know what to
paint. He goes with, just paint

589
00:48:54.719 --> 00:48:59.320
what pin pint what you like,
you know, paint what's important to you.

590
00:48:59.360 --> 00:49:04.639
And then it was like, oh, UFO, so that's perfect,

591
00:49:05.599 --> 00:49:08.159
and then I just it was all
from there. It was just paintings at

592
00:49:08.199 --> 00:49:12.960
UFOs. But it wasn't. These
these drawings really just came from doodling,

593
00:49:13.159 --> 00:49:16.440
from spending a lot of time on
ufo Twitter, and they started out kind

594
00:49:16.440 --> 00:49:20.320
of rough and then they just got
kind of better and better, and uh,

595
00:49:21.119 --> 00:49:23.440
it was just really reignited my love
of art. I hadn't done art

596
00:49:23.440 --> 00:49:29.400
in a long time, so it
was nice to have just this flowing,

597
00:49:29.440 --> 00:49:31.679
and it was just flowing and flowing
the summer in the fall last year.

598
00:49:31.719 --> 00:49:36.000
I mean I would be doodling and
drawing and drawing, and then I would

599
00:49:36.039 --> 00:49:38.440
I wake up the next day and
drink coffee and then I'd look at like

600
00:49:38.519 --> 00:49:44.360
five or six like very detailed drawings, and I really didn't I not that

601
00:49:44.400 --> 00:49:45.840
I forgot that I drew them,
but it was more like they were just

602
00:49:45.880 --> 00:49:51.800
like gushing, like just gushing out
of me. So it's just been really

603
00:49:51.840 --> 00:49:55.960
exciting to be able to do that, thatd be able to make that magic

604
00:49:57.039 --> 00:50:00.760
with the with the with the brush. It's the best thing. Yeah.

605
00:50:00.800 --> 00:50:07.440
So I actually have done some painting, and I feel like I'm almost hesitant

606
00:50:07.840 --> 00:50:13.360
to do paintings on this subject because
it might be a little too overwhelming because

607
00:50:13.400 --> 00:50:17.639
I'm already feel like I'm so driven
to do something. I'm so driven to

608
00:50:17.880 --> 00:50:22.400
it. Yeah, I I am
hesitant. It's so weird. I've I've

609
00:50:22.440 --> 00:50:28.119
done a lot of different types of
paintings. I've been told I have a

610
00:50:28.159 --> 00:50:34.119
primitive style, and I've done work
with CG. But I feel like if

611
00:50:34.199 --> 00:50:37.280
I if I tap into that,
I don't know what place I'll end up.

612
00:50:38.239 --> 00:50:43.599
I feel like I'm already a little
overwhelmed with the meditation experiences that I

613
00:50:43.679 --> 00:50:49.440
have and things like that. But
some people think that when we do art

614
00:50:49.960 --> 00:50:53.320
we access something similar to that dream
that you had, that might be like

615
00:50:53.400 --> 00:50:58.920
a different plane, like you know, I wish I wish Chris was here

616
00:50:58.920 --> 00:51:06.320
because she might be able to talk
about the Acotic records and that that other

617
00:51:06.559 --> 00:51:10.480
plane, that that beyond the veil, as you said earlier, and doing

618
00:51:10.639 --> 00:51:16.039
art sometimes kind of unleashes that.
Well, the art, I think is

619
00:51:16.079 --> 00:51:22.480
the bridge between the two or multiple
worlds. It's the bridge. It's connecting

620
00:51:23.159 --> 00:51:29.920
us with the unseen and the unknown
and and and trying to bring it down

621
00:51:30.199 --> 00:51:36.800
into our our carbon and our essence
and our molecules, because this is something

622
00:51:36.840 --> 00:51:44.079
that is it's just not it's not
really human. It's not human. And

623
00:51:44.119 --> 00:51:45.840
if you really want to get into
aliens, I mean, are they from

624
00:51:45.880 --> 00:51:47.960
Earth, they live in the Earth, they live underground. Are they in

625
00:51:49.000 --> 00:51:51.559
a different universe, Are they in
a different planet. Are they coming from

626
00:51:51.599 --> 00:51:57.119
time, the past, the future? Nobody knows. So when you're when

627
00:51:57.159 --> 00:52:00.679
you're doing dealing with this subject,
I mean, yeah, you could do

628
00:52:00.760 --> 00:52:04.440
like lighthearted stuff. You could do
pretty paintings, you can do, and

629
00:52:04.480 --> 00:52:07.599
then sometimes you really just don't have
control over what you're doing. It just

630
00:52:07.679 --> 00:52:12.719
kind of it just kind of happens. You know. There's so many good

631
00:52:12.880 --> 00:52:17.039
artists that do great work, and
it's all interesting in different styles, and

632
00:52:17.880 --> 00:52:22.800
I think it's a great way to
kind of bring these things together and help

633
00:52:25.400 --> 00:52:30.480
understand understand what we're thinking, right, because this is our this is our

634
00:52:30.599 --> 00:52:35.159
gig, you know, this is
us trying to deal with with something we

635
00:52:35.239 --> 00:52:38.480
don't really know anything about. And
I think we're doing a pretty good job

636
00:52:39.199 --> 00:52:43.800
for the most part, you know, and I think the world is ready

637
00:52:44.079 --> 00:52:49.360
for some some newness, right.
I mean, look, we're not going

638
00:52:49.440 --> 00:52:53.199
to come down and stop the war
in Ukraine. They're not going to stop

639
00:52:53.239 --> 00:52:58.159
new because they haven't done anything.
And I don't really understand why people think

640
00:52:58.199 --> 00:53:02.000
that they're here to save us from
ourselves. When has that ever happened.

641
00:53:05.400 --> 00:53:10.639
We have a terrible track record as
a creature, And every day I'm just

642
00:53:10.679 --> 00:53:15.880
so sad people, you know,
Yeah, I feel like that's not their

643
00:53:16.000 --> 00:53:22.239
job and they know it. And
I also get this strong sense that they

644
00:53:22.440 --> 00:53:29.960
value each and every one of their
lives, especially you know, considering however

645
00:53:30.119 --> 00:53:36.000
they're existing or traveling or living or
whatever is not always like the safest,

646
00:53:36.239 --> 00:53:38.639
right, Like I think they want
to They don't want to come here and

647
00:53:38.679 --> 00:53:43.840
then go get shot by somebody or
something crazy. Right, So that's the

648
00:53:43.920 --> 00:53:46.920
sense that I get that they're not
going to just kind of engage unnecessarily.

649
00:53:47.079 --> 00:53:53.400
There's it's going to be done with
caution. But yeah, I understand the

650
00:53:53.519 --> 00:54:00.000
concept that you were talking about about
trying to use art to explain it all

651
00:54:00.159 --> 00:54:06.400
so and to because frankly, without
art, other people who haven't seen these

652
00:54:06.440 --> 00:54:12.559
things or haven't it had experiences or
not gonna get that visual. So it's

653
00:54:12.639 --> 00:54:15.239
it's almost like a message to people
like, this is what's possible, this

654
00:54:15.320 --> 00:54:22.280
is what I am seeing. So
yeah, maybe one day I'll get to

655
00:54:22.320 --> 00:54:24.719
that point where I can do that. I feel like I'm just a little

656
00:54:25.320 --> 00:54:29.519
because I when I paint, I
get into a zone. You know,

657
00:54:29.840 --> 00:54:32.480
I'm sure you know'st great. Yeah, I get into a zone and I'm

658
00:54:32.519 --> 00:54:36.199
like, well, like, well, how long will I be sucked into

659
00:54:36.239 --> 00:54:38.480
that zone? If I do that, You're gonna be sitting there doing it

660
00:54:38.519 --> 00:54:43.519
for so long You're going to forget
to make dinner and the sun's going to

661
00:54:43.599 --> 00:54:46.760
go down. And you're going to
be hungry and you didn't make any spaghetti,

662
00:54:46.880 --> 00:54:52.000
and you're That's what happened to me. I get so so submerged in

663
00:54:52.079 --> 00:54:58.320
it. And I haven't done.
I've taken a little break because I've got

664
00:54:58.320 --> 00:55:00.880
some other stuff I'm working on.
But I was just looking at some of

665
00:55:00.920 --> 00:55:02.679
my old drawings. I think,
yeah, I'm gonna jump right back into

666
00:55:02.679 --> 00:55:05.719
that. I just I have to
be in a really I have to be

667
00:55:05.760 --> 00:55:08.280
in a good mood. And I
just think that I'm so sensitive. I'm

668
00:55:08.440 --> 00:55:14.239
kind of responding to what's going on
around me and the fact there's a war

669
00:55:14.360 --> 00:55:17.159
going on. Does it make me
feel too cheerful or like like It's not

670
00:55:17.199 --> 00:55:22.519
that I'm not optimistic, but I
just don't feel like that that effervescence,

671
00:55:22.760 --> 00:55:24.800
like yeah, let's do some RT. I'm just kind of concerned about what's

672
00:55:24.840 --> 00:55:30.760
going on in the world. But
that'll change. But I recommend it because

673
00:55:30.800 --> 00:55:36.960
look, art is so important to
the phenomenon, because we wouldn't have the

674
00:55:37.039 --> 00:55:42.599
children's drawings from the aerial school,
I mean, all of their their their

675
00:55:42.679 --> 00:55:46.880
memories and everything that went down on
paper, and every witness whoever scratched anything

676
00:55:46.920 --> 00:55:52.000
out on a Napkin. I mean
like artifacts these sort of like so important,

677
00:55:52.039 --> 00:55:55.400
like the Dead Sea scrolls, all
of this this stuff, like cave

678
00:55:55.480 --> 00:56:00.960
paintings. Think about how important cave
paintings are are and what they tell us

679
00:56:01.119 --> 00:56:08.320
about humanity and what was going on
inside of their minds and their their lives,

680
00:56:08.360 --> 00:56:14.960
and how it transcended just the eating
and reproducing aspects of life, that

681
00:56:15.000 --> 00:56:19.159
there was a transcendentence going on.
And you know, let's not make the

682
00:56:19.239 --> 00:56:22.039
mistake to think that all art is
about God. You know, because everything

683
00:56:22.079 --> 00:56:28.039
they find that's prehistoric or paleolithic,
a little carving, it's like, oh,

684
00:56:28.079 --> 00:56:30.599
it's a lion God. It's like, well, maybe it was just

685
00:56:30.679 --> 00:56:34.719
a lion. I mean, it
doesn't have to be a god, right,

686
00:56:34.880 --> 00:56:38.760
I mean so anthropologists and you know, they rushed to judgment on these

687
00:56:38.920 --> 00:56:44.800
artifacts. So, but these artifacts
are incredibly important. That's why I think

688
00:56:45.000 --> 00:56:49.679
art to end the phenomen as relates
to the phenomenon is very important. You

689
00:56:49.760 --> 00:56:52.480
know, Bud Hopkins was an artist, as we were talking about on Twitter

690
00:56:52.639 --> 00:57:00.199
earlier. Yeah, it's it's interesting
because it also serves their purpose. When

691
00:57:00.239 --> 00:57:07.159
people present those pieces, the viewer
has a chance to respond and it's almost

692
00:57:07.199 --> 00:57:15.039
like a test in a way if
they respond as if they're afraid, or

693
00:57:15.079 --> 00:57:19.440
if they respond as if they're comforted. You know, it's it's it's really

694
00:57:19.480 --> 00:57:22.199
interesting. It is a little bit
like a roar shock, you know.

695
00:57:22.280 --> 00:57:29.280
And I mentioned that because someone showed
me a painting of a being that supposedly

696
00:57:29.360 --> 00:57:35.119
spoke to Clifford's Stone. Oh that's
a skiren going by, okay mine?

697
00:57:35.679 --> 00:57:43.199
Yeah, Yeah, someone showed a
painting that was supposedly a being that had

698
00:57:43.320 --> 00:57:47.440
interacted with Clifford Stone. And when
I looked at it, my response was,

699
00:57:47.599 --> 00:57:52.760
it just looks like a person with
a different face to me. Other

700
00:57:52.880 --> 00:57:59.599
people when they see images are terrified, like it really freaks them out.

701
00:58:00.000 --> 00:58:04.400
But it really is almost like the
what you present. Uh, it's like

702
00:58:04.480 --> 00:58:07.400
a test almost to see how people
are going to respond to that. It's

703
00:58:07.440 --> 00:58:15.800
interesting. Yeah, some people are
very terrified by their experiences. M it's

704
00:58:15.880 --> 00:58:22.639
natural. I can completely understand it. I just cannot imagine being confronted with

705
00:58:22.800 --> 00:58:28.039
thinking like that. I think that, you know, that's where we have

706
00:58:28.119 --> 00:58:32.039
a lot of confusion because we're getting
so many mixed messages and some of these

707
00:58:32.119 --> 00:58:37.480
experiencers change their tune later, like
Travis Walton I mentioned him. I've heard

708
00:58:37.559 --> 00:58:42.239
him say, I've changed my mind
about what happened to me. I don't

709
00:58:42.239 --> 00:58:45.440
think it was what I thought it
was. And you know, some people

710
00:58:45.719 --> 00:58:50.360
initially are like, oh, this
is going to be a horrible experience,

711
00:58:50.400 --> 00:58:53.480
and then later they're like, actually, I think they were, you know,

712
00:58:53.559 --> 00:58:59.719
trying to give me this message about
world peace and stuff. But ultimately

713
00:58:59.760 --> 00:59:06.119
the bottom line is, you know, I really hope that the contact that

714
00:59:06.159 --> 00:59:12.159
we're all kind of hoping for happens
so we could get clarity about what's going

715
00:59:12.199 --> 00:59:15.960
on there, because that is not
how you should be interacting with humans.

716
00:59:15.280 --> 00:59:21.559
Like it's just not going well,
no, not at all. I mean,

717
00:59:21.599 --> 00:59:27.320
it's it's a funny kind of system
when you think about it. I

718
00:59:27.320 --> 00:59:30.280
mean, there's so many theories.
You know, what are we? What

719
00:59:30.440 --> 00:59:36.599
are we to them? You know, are they responsible for us? You

720
00:59:36.599 --> 00:59:40.199
know, did they create us?
Because there are huge gaps in the fossil

721
00:59:40.280 --> 00:59:46.519
record that don't explain the rise of
Homo sapiens that there's a big blank spot.

722
00:59:47.159 --> 00:59:54.360
Now in terms of you know,
geology and fossils, there are no

723
00:59:54.639 --> 01:00:00.559
big blank spots. There are layers
and stories and stone that tell the stories

724
01:00:00.599 --> 01:00:05.880
of everything from comets hitting the earth
to you know, everything else. So

725
01:00:07.440 --> 01:00:10.079
I'm willing to accept that. You
know, I'm not so religious that I

726
01:00:10.119 --> 01:00:17.400
can't incorporate something into my world,
you know, my perception of the world.

727
01:00:20.119 --> 01:00:22.719
I'm I'm happy to entertain almost any
idea. I mean, I've read

728
01:00:22.800 --> 01:00:28.800
just about every book that there is
and have taken it all like pretty seriously.

729
01:00:29.039 --> 01:00:30.440
You know, I don't. I
don't think everyone's a liar. I

730
01:00:30.440 --> 01:00:35.639
don't think everyone is just trying to
make a book. I think that there

731
01:00:35.639 --> 01:00:42.079
are serious people who've had very real
experiences and they're doing their best to interpret

732
01:00:42.119 --> 01:00:45.199
and share. And then there's all
of the people who probably will never tell

733
01:00:45.239 --> 01:00:52.079
their stories, have never told,
will never tell, and and on and

734
01:00:52.119 --> 01:00:55.840
on. And there's there's that gap, right, There's that blank spot in

735
01:00:55.880 --> 01:01:02.840
the record, right. And there's
also the whole weird washing phenomenon where someone

736
01:01:02.920 --> 01:01:07.760
has an experience and they tell the
story, but they kind of leave out

737
01:01:07.280 --> 01:01:13.599
details so they don't appear completely crazy, you know, they don't. That's

738
01:01:13.719 --> 01:01:19.400
that's common, and I think that
partly is lingering stigma, you know.

739
01:01:19.800 --> 01:01:23.920
Really, I mean, I've been
telling, like I said, parts of

740
01:01:23.960 --> 01:01:28.800
my story at a time. It's
very hard to say it all at once,

741
01:01:29.280 --> 01:01:32.079
because when you say it all at
once, that's when you know,

742
01:01:32.159 --> 01:01:37.239
you're like, okay, people are
going to think that I'm just crazy or

743
01:01:37.320 --> 01:01:40.400
you know whatever. Like so you're
cautious, right, You're cautious about what

744
01:01:40.480 --> 01:01:45.039
you reveal, but you're certainly right
that there are people who are holding on

745
01:01:45.119 --> 01:01:50.639
to their stories, people who may
not even be a part of any UFO

746
01:01:50.719 --> 01:01:57.119
community. And I've certainly had since
I started with all of this, Like

747
01:01:57.199 --> 01:02:00.320
I said, totally out of the
blue. Not been related to the UAP

748
01:02:00.519 --> 01:02:06.119
siting I had, which was probably
about five years ago, but just totally

749
01:02:06.159 --> 01:02:10.039
out of the blue. Was felt
this compulsion to do this. When it

750
01:02:10.159 --> 01:02:15.800
happened, people started telling me those
stories privately in messages, so I knew,

751
01:02:15.920 --> 01:02:21.840
I knew, and very few were, you know, brave enough to

752
01:02:21.920 --> 01:02:25.679
come out and share it in a
public way. Those people I put their

753
01:02:25.719 --> 01:02:31.320
stories on my web page, the
UFO Connector, because I wanted to help

754
01:02:31.400 --> 01:02:37.480
them get the chance to tell people
this is what's going on. I don't

755
01:02:37.599 --> 01:02:43.599
I don't like when we ignore experiencers. And I'm yeah, there's just so

756
01:02:43.719 --> 01:02:46.159
many that are not there yet,
you know, there's so many that are

757
01:02:46.400 --> 01:02:51.000
but but I think it's getting better. I think the fact that people who

758
01:02:51.079 --> 01:02:58.000
are coming out from significant positions coming
out and being honest about what happened with

759
01:02:58.039 --> 01:03:05.599
them is helping. Mhm. It's
still slow. It's still baby steps,

760
01:03:06.079 --> 01:03:09.719
you know. And we have a
lot of sort of little battles and skirmishes

761
01:03:09.760 --> 01:03:15.599
within the community and with you know, people who are anti experience or whatever

762
01:03:15.679 --> 01:03:21.719
that means, and are averse to
WO whatever that means. Because without WO

763
01:03:22.000 --> 01:03:29.920
and experiencers, we don't have anything, right, there isn't anything. And

764
01:03:29.960 --> 01:03:32.760
if it weren't, if it weren't
weird and bizarre and just mind blowing,

765
01:03:34.119 --> 01:03:36.440
no one would be interested in it. It would just be like, oh,

766
01:03:36.480 --> 01:03:37.880
it's like studying a new form of
algae, you know what I mean.

767
01:03:37.920 --> 01:03:45.719
It's because it is so powerful and
because it is the most challenging topic

768
01:03:45.840 --> 01:03:52.880
phenomenon, it will retain. It's
it's still got that currency, and it's

769
01:03:52.920 --> 01:03:58.719
it's it's still it's it's more popular
now than when I started getting into this,

770
01:03:59.119 --> 01:04:03.719
like back in eighties, because well, that was yeah, that's actually

771
01:04:03.719 --> 01:04:06.840
one of my questions that I had
for you tonight. I wanted to know

772
01:04:09.000 --> 01:04:15.480
if you could as an overview reflect
on how you ufology if you want to

773
01:04:15.480 --> 01:04:19.559
call it that, or UFO research, or just the UFO community, however

774
01:04:19.639 --> 01:04:24.880
you want to see, it has
changed over the decades, because we know,

775
01:04:25.239 --> 01:04:29.199
of course, in the beginning,
you know, people were enthusiastic,

776
01:04:29.480 --> 01:04:32.760
they were reporting, and then the
government turned around and started telling people that

777
01:04:32.800 --> 01:04:38.840
they were crazy. Everyone got quiet
for a while. Then people would still

778
01:04:38.960 --> 01:04:44.719
sneak stories where they could to the
media, right like the Inquirer. And

779
01:04:44.760 --> 01:04:48.440
then of course it became like a
popular thing for TV shows for a while.

780
01:04:49.239 --> 01:04:55.519
I know that I watched a few
unsolved mysteries where UFOs were definitely brought

781
01:04:55.639 --> 01:05:01.039
up. It was a popular thing
for Hollywood all those. Interestingly enough,

782
01:05:01.079 --> 01:05:06.280
some of the movies that people saw
were actually influenced by people by who came

783
01:05:06.320 --> 01:05:13.039
from Project Blue Book, right so, and they were influenced by apparently the

784
01:05:13.079 --> 01:05:19.159
CIA as well in the military was
involved in some scripts like Contact. So

785
01:05:19.239 --> 01:05:23.119
I guess I just wanted to know, like, how how do you see

786
01:05:23.280 --> 01:05:30.239
things having changed? Uh, That's
that's a very it's a huge question.

787
01:05:33.920 --> 01:05:39.119
It's become kind of like a like
a little bit more sharp elbows. You

788
01:05:39.119 --> 01:05:42.920
know, there's a lot more sparring
going on. There's a lot more challenging.

789
01:05:43.000 --> 01:05:46.599
And it's not just because there's you
know, little little gnarly little like

790
01:05:46.880 --> 01:05:51.679
spats on Twitter UFO Twitter, But
I I think that like because it's like

791
01:05:51.719 --> 01:05:58.880
the more pressure is being applied,
the more sort of like intense it sort

792
01:05:58.920 --> 01:06:02.440
of becomes. And people are becoming
a little anxious about it, and they're

793
01:06:02.559 --> 01:06:08.320
very suspicious of the government, and
they're very critical of the government. And

794
01:06:08.360 --> 01:06:11.079
I'm all, you know, fine, criticize the government. That's what it's

795
01:06:11.119 --> 01:06:14.920
there for. Be suspicious, be
suspicious of our government. Our government has

796
01:06:14.960 --> 01:06:21.880
a long track record for reasons to
be suspicious of what they're doing. I

797
01:06:21.920 --> 01:06:27.320
don't know. I'm really interested in
reading glue Elissando's book when it comes out,

798
01:06:28.039 --> 01:06:32.480
because I think he is He's going
to say some things. We know

799
01:06:32.760 --> 01:06:36.599
he can't tell us everything, and
boy, I would love to hear,

800
01:06:38.800 --> 01:06:41.239
you know, I'd love to just
sit down, like just me and him.

801
01:06:41.400 --> 01:06:45.280
Just just tell me. And I
promised Lou, I won't tell a

802
01:06:45.360 --> 01:06:49.880
soul, just tell me what's going
on. I'm excited, but I'm also

803
01:06:49.920 --> 01:06:54.280
grounded because I do know the long
view, and I do know that there's

804
01:06:54.320 --> 01:06:57.880
many ufologists who have lived and died, you know, like Stanton Friedman,

805
01:06:58.400 --> 01:07:04.280
without ever completely getting across the finish
line. What I'm hoping is that for

806
01:07:04.360 --> 01:07:08.559
Stanton and for all of us,
is that when we do pass on to

807
01:07:08.599 --> 01:07:12.800
the great beyond, that there will
be a pamphlet that God hands out on

808
01:07:12.880 --> 01:07:15.639
the other side, like here's all
the questions.'s the answers to all

809
01:07:15.760 --> 01:07:21.920
the questions. I think they priority
know they're probably watching. Every time I

810
01:07:23.000 --> 01:07:27.880
add another face to the memorial part
of the UFO Connector. It makes me

811
01:07:28.000 --> 01:07:30.760
really sad. Sometimes I want to
cry. I don't know, I get

812
01:07:30.760 --> 01:07:35.199
so emotional about it because they're not
going to be the ones that are there,

813
01:07:35.880 --> 01:07:41.039
as you said to the at the
finish line, and they worked so

814
01:07:41.239 --> 01:07:45.159
hard, some of them worked so
hard to get us there. Yeah.

815
01:07:45.280 --> 01:07:51.000
Yeah, I mean we just think
about like Bud Hopkins and Whitley Strieber and

816
01:07:51.440 --> 01:07:58.039
you know, Linda Moulton Howe who
lately has become very criticized and looking into

817
01:07:58.079 --> 01:08:02.119
that. But I love these people. These people were like my you know,

818
01:08:03.360 --> 01:08:08.880
to my little guiding lights throughout like
all those years of just reading and

819
01:08:09.239 --> 01:08:13.599
wanting to know more, and uh, you know, you sort of come

820
01:08:13.639 --> 01:08:16.279
to really depend on them, So
I don't know. I don't know what's

821
01:08:16.279 --> 01:08:19.840
going to happen next. I'm very
interested. I always will be, and

822
01:08:19.920 --> 01:08:25.640
if I don't learn before I leave
this earth, I will at least be

823
01:08:25.800 --> 01:08:30.359
satisfied to say that, you know, I tried. You know well,

824
01:08:30.600 --> 01:08:34.479
I think what is going to happen
next is we're going to turn the page

825
01:08:34.640 --> 01:08:42.920
from the story collectors to the science. I really think that's what's we're on

826
01:08:43.000 --> 01:08:47.199
the rge of. And I think
that we're getting we're getting told what science

827
01:08:47.239 --> 01:08:51.720
has already existed slowly. Those are
what a lot of those drips are about.

828
01:08:54.399 --> 01:09:01.119
We're being told what involvement the government
has already had slowly also, But

829
01:09:01.199 --> 01:09:05.800
I feel like the page will be
turned. It's going to be less about

830
01:09:05.880 --> 01:09:13.279
things that happened seventy five years ago
and more about the discoveries that the scientific

831
01:09:13.359 --> 01:09:17.680
community will be sharing with us.
That's what I think is going to happen

832
01:09:17.760 --> 01:09:21.800
next. I hope. So.
I think that they definitely the scientists have

833
01:09:23.119 --> 01:09:26.399
something to contribute, but I wouldn't. I'm not going to put it all

834
01:09:27.119 --> 01:09:32.479
in the science hands because their rulers
can't measure certain things, and it's no

835
01:09:32.640 --> 01:09:36.600
knock on them or their brilliance at
all. It just means that we're dealing

836
01:09:36.600 --> 01:09:44.039
with something so complicated that is almost
absurd to even start to think about,

837
01:09:44.159 --> 01:09:48.399
because once you go down that rabbit
hole, it's difficult, you know,

838
01:09:48.960 --> 01:09:57.359
it's difficult to walk away from.
I hope it's a combination of different people

839
01:09:57.399 --> 01:10:00.880
of different walks of life, you
know, artists, scientists, people or

840
01:10:00.960 --> 01:10:05.039
philosophers, people who are interested in
spiritual matters. I hope it's a combination

841
01:10:05.159 --> 01:10:10.640
of all of it, because I
don't think science the way we understand science

842
01:10:10.880 --> 01:10:15.199
can tell the entire picture. You
know, science still can't really confirm whether

843
01:10:15.319 --> 01:10:21.720
there's any life beyond death. But
yet I've seen and heard things that tell

844
01:10:21.800 --> 01:10:26.680
me that there is. So can
I prove it scientifically? No? Does

845
01:10:26.720 --> 01:10:30.960
it mean it didn't happen? So
that's you know, that's that's part of

846
01:10:30.479 --> 01:10:36.720
our challenge is to make all of
these things work together and not exclude because

847
01:10:36.760 --> 01:10:40.920
it sounds too weird or that's not
going to happen, or oh god,

848
01:10:40.920 --> 01:10:44.560
there can't be dino beavers. You
know. It's like, well, I'm

849
01:10:44.560 --> 01:10:46.399
making room for dino beavers. I'm
making room for it. Let it,

850
01:10:46.520 --> 01:10:50.359
let it walk right by me.
Because I've seen things that just as you

851
01:10:50.399 --> 01:10:55.079
know, weird in the you know, the scheme of like the baseline of

852
01:10:55.079 --> 01:10:59.039
what we consider reality, you know, chains and moaning in the middle of

853
01:10:59.079 --> 01:11:01.720
my Brooklyn apartment that sounds like something
out of the you know, the London

854
01:11:01.840 --> 01:11:09.560
Tower. I can't explain that,
but it absolutely happened. So right,

855
01:11:09.680 --> 01:11:14.279
and I think that I think that
science will eventually. I think That's where

856
01:11:14.319 --> 01:11:17.960
I'm at with that. I think, you know, for instance, if

857
01:11:18.000 --> 01:11:23.560
you if you look at the right
group of scientists, there are scientists who

858
01:11:23.600 --> 01:11:29.279
are studying some of the phenomenon in
a different way already, that have been

859
01:11:29.319 --> 01:11:33.800
doing it for decades. Like people
keep saying science needs to be involved,

860
01:11:33.840 --> 01:11:38.840
well, there have been plenty of
scientists involved, if you if you know

861
01:11:38.880 --> 01:11:43.960
where to look for. And so
my example is so a lot of people

862
01:11:44.079 --> 01:11:49.159
for for centuries have been talking about
chi they've been talking about the chakras.

863
01:11:49.520 --> 01:11:54.680
They've been talking about the soul,
this internal energy that we have inside of

864
01:11:54.760 --> 01:11:58.239
us, inside of us, and
now science has a name for it,

865
01:11:58.319 --> 01:12:02.359
and they call it the bio feel, and scientists have studied it. People

866
01:12:02.399 --> 01:12:09.199
are researching it, they're doing studies
on it. So I think Eventually,

867
01:12:09.239 --> 01:12:14.560
what will happen is science will catch
up to what's already happening and come up

868
01:12:14.600 --> 01:12:16.920
with a name for it. Will
they be able to measure all of it?

869
01:12:17.119 --> 01:12:21.319
No, but I think that they're
starting to understand some things. Another

870
01:12:21.399 --> 01:12:27.039
example is Gary Nolan was very interested
in that one part of the brain,

871
01:12:27.720 --> 01:12:31.079
which a lot of the people who
heard that go, that makes so much

872
01:12:31.119 --> 01:12:35.880
sense. People who are into the
paranormal have said that, you know,

873
01:12:35.920 --> 01:12:42.119
that's that's like part of the whole
third eye thing, you know, you

874
01:12:42.119 --> 01:12:45.960
know, obviously we have the front
and then also the back, and then

875
01:12:45.000 --> 01:12:50.119
there's people who do the se five
say well, yeah, of course,

876
01:12:50.199 --> 01:12:58.680
we are like antennas, you know, like little beacons. So I feel

877
01:12:58.720 --> 01:13:03.159
like science can marry this concept and
be effective in doing so. I think

878
01:13:03.600 --> 01:13:10.560
some people will really appreciate that.
It'll help bring more people in. Well.

879
01:13:10.560 --> 01:13:15.920
Listening to Gary is very is very
exciting because he's a brilliant guy,

880
01:13:16.560 --> 01:13:19.960
and he's willing to take on subjects
that have been tabooed for a long time

881
01:13:20.239 --> 01:13:28.359
and handle them in a sober,
methodical, intelligent way. So important.

882
01:13:28.840 --> 01:13:33.239
So that part, yes, absolutely, So we're just in the beginning.

883
01:13:33.760 --> 01:13:38.399
I mean, we really are just
in the beginning. I mean, if

884
01:13:38.439 --> 01:13:43.119
there's going to be any massive disclosure, it's going to be it's going to

885
01:13:43.199 --> 01:13:46.880
just happen. If it's like a
mass sighting, or if there's some communication

886
01:13:47.119 --> 01:13:53.840
or something, then that's the way
it's going to be. But I don't

887
01:13:53.880 --> 01:13:59.279
think the government's going to be handing
out any great, big announcements lately,

888
01:13:59.399 --> 01:14:03.640
especially and we've got a war going
on and we've got problems with Russia and

889
01:14:03.760 --> 01:14:11.119
all of that stuff that I hate
politics and war and endless aggression, and

890
01:14:11.720 --> 01:14:18.439
you know, it just seems like
what's the point. I just don't get

891
01:14:18.439 --> 01:14:21.039
it. I mean, maybe because
I grew up in the nineteen sixties,

892
01:14:21.319 --> 01:14:26.560
you know, I have this sort
of love love everybody kind of thing.

893
01:14:26.680 --> 01:14:29.680
I just don't understand what the point
of, like, you know, any

894
01:14:29.720 --> 01:14:34.479
of this is, and it's really
holding us back. And you know,

895
01:14:34.520 --> 01:14:38.560
once you get to be a certain
age and you've seen this that happen over

896
01:14:38.600 --> 01:14:46.199
and over and over again, you
think this is just us rights. And

897
01:14:46.279 --> 01:14:50.239
I think, you know, a
lot of people want the giant, big

898
01:14:50.319 --> 01:14:56.279
disclosure despite everything that's going on in
the world, and of course the timing

899
01:14:56.439 --> 01:15:00.199
is terrible, but I think it
won't happen because the trip method is so

900
01:15:00.439 --> 01:15:05.159
much more palpable. And I also, and I've said this a few times,

901
01:15:05.159 --> 01:15:10.640
I think the UFO community is like
the guinea pig for how this is

902
01:15:10.800 --> 01:15:15.800
all being revealed anyway. So they're
kind of like, we'll throw this out,

903
01:15:15.960 --> 01:15:19.119
see what happens. See if that's
going to work. If it worked,

904
01:15:19.159 --> 01:15:24.239
well, we'll push it to another
level. It will throw this out,

905
01:15:24.359 --> 01:15:27.479
See what happens, See what the
problem is. If it doesn't work,

906
01:15:27.479 --> 01:15:30.399
we're just going to move on to
something else. And I see it

907
01:15:30.439 --> 01:15:36.800
over and over in the time that
I've joined the community, and I think

908
01:15:36.840 --> 01:15:41.359
that's what's happening with that. And
I just don't think we're ready for like

909
01:15:41.439 --> 01:15:47.680
someone just standing up and saying,
ABC, this is it Not entirely I

910
01:15:47.680 --> 01:15:50.920
think it would be a real shock
to most of the population. I think

911
01:15:50.960 --> 01:15:56.079
that we still have to go on
with our very human lives. But when

912
01:15:56.119 --> 01:16:01.319
you think about what the powers that
or going through right now we're looking at

913
01:16:01.319 --> 01:16:05.640
we're at a very interesting point in
history where we're seeing the control of the

914
01:16:05.680 --> 01:16:15.640
masses on such a scale between you
know, social media technology, big tech,

915
01:16:17.359 --> 01:16:23.760
population control. Living in the kind
of a neo feudal world, you

916
01:16:23.800 --> 01:16:28.000
know, with no real one government
but sort of a lot of shifting alliances.

917
01:16:28.359 --> 01:16:32.880
I think we have governments really on
the power flex with facial recognition technology,

918
01:16:33.479 --> 01:16:38.880
social credit systems. I think that
we're watching our governments right now throughout

919
01:16:38.920 --> 01:16:45.039
the world just going through these like
power sort of pulses, you know,

920
01:16:45.279 --> 01:16:50.479
like like the whole COVID thing was
like a blueprint for how to mass control

921
01:16:50.640 --> 01:16:57.399
populations. And I think this is
this is going to work against any kind

922
01:16:57.479 --> 01:17:06.479
of refreshing, honest, amazing,
liberating, exhilarating, cathartic experience because we've

923
01:17:06.479 --> 01:17:12.840
got the government and everything that's in
controlling us working in the opposite direction,

924
01:17:13.239 --> 01:17:19.920
against liberation, against free thought,
against not being controlled and monitored constantly.

925
01:17:20.159 --> 01:17:27.600
So it's really up to us,
right we can only just keep pushing this

926
01:17:27.680 --> 01:17:31.000
along, because I think we've got
other forces against us that are sort of

927
01:17:31.239 --> 01:17:35.760
much greater and much more like a
tsunami, like a tidal wave in terms

928
01:17:35.800 --> 01:17:41.960
of power and control than we had
in America in the nineteen fifties. In

929
01:17:42.000 --> 01:17:45.560
the nineteen forties when this was all
just kind of beginning, right the dawn

930
01:17:45.640 --> 01:17:53.239
of the modern UFO age, this
was minuscule back then compared to the control

931
01:17:53.279 --> 01:17:57.399
systems that are in place now.
I mean, they're working on ways to

932
01:17:57.479 --> 01:18:01.960
control cryptocurrency, right, there's always
the the beauty of having cryptocurrency is to

933
01:18:02.000 --> 01:18:08.640
be outside of, you know,
the system, so that our system is

934
01:18:08.680 --> 01:18:14.279
now trying to greater control that greater
control almost everything. So good luck.

935
01:18:15.119 --> 01:18:18.560
Yeah, it's funny, it's just
the thought about what's going on with marijuana

936
01:18:18.680 --> 01:18:21.399
came through my head when you said
that. Even that. I was like,

937
01:18:21.520 --> 01:18:27.399
they like how they want to tax
it and control who grows it and

938
01:18:27.479 --> 01:18:30.880
control how it suspense. They were
never gonna let us do what we wanted.

939
01:18:31.319 --> 01:18:34.079
They were going to tax it,
they're going to control it. They're

940
01:18:34.079 --> 01:18:40.560
going to corporatize it. They're going
to put things in it the way they

941
01:18:40.560 --> 01:18:45.039
put in cigarettes. You know,
cigarettes is not pure tobacco. Cigarettes are

942
01:18:45.119 --> 01:18:49.119
loaded with all kinds of chemicals that
it would shock you if you really started

943
01:18:49.119 --> 01:18:53.920
thinking about it that keep the burn, even that keep the burning, the

944
01:18:54.000 --> 01:18:57.600
chemicals in the paper when you think
about what that kind. If you just

945
01:18:57.640 --> 01:19:00.800
smoke normal tobacco that you grew in
your back yard, I don't think it

946
01:19:00.800 --> 01:19:02.880
would be nearly as toxic as lighting
up a cigarette that you bought to the

947
01:19:02.960 --> 01:19:08.920
deli. So yeah, there's a
lot of money in marijuana and they know

948
01:19:09.079 --> 01:19:15.079
it. So yeah, so I
mean, I see, I see it,

949
01:19:15.119 --> 01:19:18.520
But I also see the flip side
where there are people fighting against that

950
01:19:18.680 --> 01:19:27.720
control system. Even the Director of
Intel was, you know, making the

951
01:19:27.800 --> 01:19:34.000
point that we have way too much
confidentiality, like way too much secrecy that

952
01:19:34.079 --> 01:19:41.279
it's gotten to the point where even
like an email about like where you're going

953
01:19:41.319 --> 01:19:45.920
on the weekend is like being labeled
top secret and it's bogging down the system.

954
01:19:46.319 --> 01:19:50.720
So it's funny because actually it's like
a full circle when you think about

955
01:19:50.720 --> 01:19:57.359
it, because all of this started
with their concern that the system was going

956
01:19:57.399 --> 01:20:01.319
to be bogged down by reports.
All the Sigma started because of that.

957
01:20:01.439 --> 01:20:06.479
They wanted to stop bogging down on
reports because it was just too overwhelming for

958
01:20:06.560 --> 01:20:13.640
them. And now we're at the
other extreme right where all things are being

959
01:20:15.439 --> 01:20:23.720
classified and therefore they have to declassify
like so it's like they got bogged down

960
01:20:24.119 --> 01:20:28.039
in both ways. So yeah,
so there's like a I think a fight

961
01:20:28.640 --> 01:20:31.960
that we're not quite seeing, but
we're getting some hints of going on behind

962
01:20:32.119 --> 01:20:39.840
behind the scenes about that power struggle. Yeah, there's a lot. There's

963
01:20:39.920 --> 01:20:45.359
a lot going on, so right, people are still seeing things. Those

964
01:20:45.439 --> 01:20:49.439
tic TACs are still I'm sure bobbing
around out there somewhere. They don't just

965
01:20:49.520 --> 01:20:58.000
go away. Absolutely, there's still
people who pilots who've seen things. Please,

966
01:20:59.159 --> 01:21:03.000
it's just going to continue to happen. And it's just such a fantastic,

967
01:21:03.159 --> 01:21:08.439
fertile land of lore. You know, so much from the beginning,

968
01:21:08.640 --> 01:21:12.159
from you know, the Adanski era, you know, and then into the

969
01:21:12.239 --> 01:21:17.039
nineteen sixties and then into the seventies
and then the eighties and now now it's

970
01:21:17.159 --> 01:21:21.600
very high tech. I mean,
we weren't really thinking about tic TACs back

971
01:21:21.640 --> 01:21:25.800
in the nineteen seventies. You know, it was still like the Travis Walton

972
01:21:25.880 --> 01:21:29.439
era, you know, of the
right, you know, take you up

973
01:21:29.479 --> 01:21:32.760
in the spaceship and you know,
terrify you and then put you back down.

974
01:21:32.880 --> 01:21:34.800
And you know, I mean,
the thing is like, even if

975
01:21:34.800 --> 01:21:38.920
you don't believe Travis Walton, and
I know that people who don't, I

976
01:21:38.960 --> 01:21:43.319
don't have enough facts to really analyze
it and really come down on one side

977
01:21:43.359 --> 01:21:45.880
or the other. But the fact
is that it's not just Travis Walton.

978
01:21:46.399 --> 01:21:50.600
You know, there are a lot
of you know, he's not just the

979
01:21:50.640 --> 01:22:00.760
one lone guy, right. So
I actually felt inspired at one point to

980
01:22:00.880 --> 01:22:05.399
look up a quote that I love
and it actually is from the first time

981
01:22:05.439 --> 01:22:12.079
I heard it was a movie called
Millennium, which is about time travel,

982
01:22:13.800 --> 01:22:17.920
and I'm going to read the quote
it is and apparently I did not know

983
01:22:18.039 --> 01:22:24.680
it's Winston Churchill. It is now
is not the end, It is not

984
01:22:24.800 --> 01:22:29.000
even the beginning of the end,
but it is perhaps the end of the

985
01:22:29.039 --> 01:22:34.840
beginning. So well, every beginning
will have an end, and then you

986
01:22:34.920 --> 01:22:40.279
work slowly to the middle. Yes, and I think we're at the end

987
01:22:40.319 --> 01:22:45.159
of the beginning, our beginning chapter
on UFOs, which was unfortunately a very

988
01:22:45.279 --> 01:22:49.479
dark time in many ways. I
think we're at the end of the beginning

989
01:22:49.760 --> 01:22:55.159
chapter, and I think we're about
to hit chapter two, and I'm excited

990
01:22:55.439 --> 01:23:00.680
for chapter two. I'm especially excited
for the epilogue, which willfully we'll all

991
01:23:00.720 --> 01:23:05.479
get to see. But inspecially time
I want to hear. I want to

992
01:23:05.520 --> 01:23:09.119
hear more. I never hear I
read a book and I'm like, well,

993
01:23:09.159 --> 01:23:11.600
I'd like to hear more. I'd
like to hear a whole book about

994
01:23:11.640 --> 01:23:16.119
like that, you know, like
in the Skinwalker Ranch book when they talked

995
01:23:16.119 --> 01:23:18.920
about certain things and they just went
right on to something else, and I'm

996
01:23:18.960 --> 01:23:21.399
still stuck on that one thing,
like, wait a minute, wait,

997
01:23:21.439 --> 01:23:26.960
wait, tell us more. You
know, I want to hear more about

998
01:23:26.960 --> 01:23:30.000
what the Katski saw. I want
to hear in much greater deal. I

999
01:23:30.079 --> 01:23:32.359
want to see him do a drawing
of what he saw. I mean,

1000
01:23:32.399 --> 01:23:40.920
I'm very interested in that because because
that's just weird. Okay, that's not

1001
01:23:41.000 --> 01:23:45.560
your normal alien spaceship or you know, ghost story, or when you have

1002
01:23:45.680 --> 01:23:53.239
something just manifesting itself in front of
you in a in a very intelligent and

1003
01:23:53.359 --> 01:24:00.720
directed way, it just defies all
of our other narratives. And that's just

1004
01:24:00.840 --> 01:24:05.199
incredible to me. That's like the
highest form of art right there, that

1005
01:24:05.239 --> 01:24:12.039
they can create this right whatever is
happening in Skinwalker Ranch, be it Earth

1006
01:24:12.680 --> 01:24:17.399
energy or from above or from the
magnetism in the area, or the energy

1007
01:24:17.479 --> 01:24:21.640
is coming from that place, because
they've done measurements, they've done some scientific

1008
01:24:23.720 --> 01:24:28.520
experiments with readings and things like that
in the area, and apparently there's something

1009
01:24:28.640 --> 01:24:33.800
very charged about the mineral life in
that part of the world. So I

1010
01:24:33.880 --> 01:24:38.680
want to hear more about that.
But they just it was a very skinny

1011
01:24:38.680 --> 01:24:42.279
book. You know they could have. Yes, I agree a little bit

1012
01:24:42.319 --> 01:24:45.800
further in places I'd like to go
back. I wonder if that was Pentagon

1013
01:24:45.920 --> 01:24:49.600
censorship a little bit. I do. Oh yeah, they said it was

1014
01:24:49.640 --> 01:24:54.760
a big book, and I think
I felt the same way. So a

1015
01:24:54.800 --> 01:25:00.399
couple of things came to mind just
now. One was, you know,

1016
01:25:00.479 --> 01:25:12.279
some people have talked about crop circles
being done with electromagnet waves essentially, right,

1017
01:25:12.800 --> 01:25:16.640
and then that it has to do
also maybe with gravitational waves, and

1018
01:25:16.680 --> 01:25:21.560
that is perhaps the form of art. And while we were talking earlier,

1019
01:25:23.560 --> 01:25:28.600
I was thinking about whether or not, you know, these visitors had a

1020
01:25:28.640 --> 01:25:32.079
form of art other than of course
their symbols that we sometimes hear about.

1021
01:25:32.600 --> 01:25:36.840
But now that you've mentioned this part
again and said that that might be their

1022
01:25:36.880 --> 01:25:41.119
form of art, it's almost like
you answered a question I was thinking in

1023
01:25:41.159 --> 01:25:49.000
my head. Well, I think
the crop circles are absolutely a form of

1024
01:25:49.159 --> 01:25:55.279
art, and art that has a
much greater meaning because than just art.

1025
01:25:55.359 --> 01:25:58.600
I think that you know, with
the mathematics and the fractals and all of

1026
01:25:58.640 --> 01:26:01.960
that stuff that goes into it,
it's very precise, it's very directed,

1027
01:26:03.800 --> 01:26:08.800
the spaceships themselves, if you want
to call them spaceships, the craft that

1028
01:26:08.960 --> 01:26:15.319
people have talked about for ages,
the beauty, the beauty of these things,

1029
01:26:15.600 --> 01:26:21.800
the way that they're described as as
almost like being alive, like the

1030
01:26:23.119 --> 01:26:26.359
machines themselves, of actually being alive. That there's like a sort of an

1031
01:26:26.359 --> 01:26:34.079
exo skin that's living, light,
light emanating. That's all. They're beautiful.

1032
01:26:34.319 --> 01:26:41.800
This stuff is beautiful looking, Okay, silver discs and tic TACs and

1033
01:26:41.880 --> 01:26:49.560
the design they Art and science are
very connected. And if they're not trying

1034
01:26:49.560 --> 01:26:54.000
to do art the way we think
of art, they are absolutely excelling as

1035
01:26:54.119 --> 01:26:58.119
artists because of the beauty of these
of the things that they have and the

1036
01:26:58.159 --> 01:27:01.680
things that they've done. I mean, it's like you're like speechless, and

1037
01:27:01.720 --> 01:27:04.600
it leads to kind of speechless just
looking at them. You know, they're

1038
01:27:04.640 --> 01:27:09.640
not just like you know, like
a bus. It's just very utilitarian.

1039
01:27:09.720 --> 01:27:13.520
These things are just like they're just
showing off, you know what I mean,

1040
01:27:13.600 --> 01:27:17.319
They're just it's just goes beyond.
That's true. It could be doing

1041
01:27:17.319 --> 01:27:21.239
a really big presentation for us.
And that that leads to another thing that

1042
01:27:21.279 --> 01:27:27.600
I was thinking earlier when you were
talking about them basically sending out a signal

1043
01:27:27.640 --> 01:27:30.079
that some of us are picking up. I was thinking, how often are

1044
01:27:30.159 --> 01:27:35.199
they trying to communicate but we're just
not hearing it. I don't know.

1045
01:27:35.439 --> 01:27:41.640
There could be a whole plan involved, There could be a you know,

1046
01:27:43.119 --> 01:27:46.359
a time to the place for everything, right, they reach certain levels where

1047
01:27:46.359 --> 01:27:51.119
they have certain tasks to do,
because I think that there is definitely a

1048
01:27:51.239 --> 01:27:58.279
very serious involvement. I don't think
it's just random or whenever they feel like

1049
01:27:58.359 --> 01:28:00.880
it. I think they're because I
just don't get the sense that this type

1050
01:28:00.920 --> 01:28:04.880
of intelligence is just bored and just
doing things for the hell of it.

1051
01:28:05.000 --> 01:28:12.079
I think that there is a very
u there's a script. You know,

1052
01:28:12.319 --> 01:28:15.359
there's a book. There's a script
that's being played out, and it's being

1053
01:28:15.399 --> 01:28:23.760
done in such a way that it's
almost imperceptible. But they go in and

1054
01:28:23.840 --> 01:28:28.119
out, you know, when you
when you listen to Preston Dennett's accounts of

1055
01:28:28.279 --> 01:28:31.000
especially, what always comes to mind
are the flying saucers that appear that drive

1056
01:28:31.079 --> 01:28:36.840
in movies. Have you ever listened, I mean, if you've referred to

1057
01:28:36.880 --> 01:28:43.439
that book. Actually recently I spoke
to them. That is amazing. That

1058
01:28:43.640 --> 01:28:47.399
is absolutely an out and out display. I mean to dark behind some trees

1059
01:28:47.479 --> 01:28:49.960
or dart into the ocean when people
are looking, they don't want to be

1060
01:28:50.000 --> 01:28:55.079
seen. But when they're showing up
at a drive in movie in the middle

1061
01:28:55.079 --> 01:29:00.279
of California in the nineteen fifties,
I mean, what does do explain that

1062
01:29:00.279 --> 01:29:05.439
that is a deliberate here we are, they're not doing it right now.

1063
01:29:05.520 --> 01:29:11.079
So I think that there's a reason
for all of this, and it's it's

1064
01:29:11.239 --> 01:29:15.960
coming in like phases. Yeah,
And it really is interesting because all these

1065
01:29:15.960 --> 01:29:19.920
things just click in so many different
things that people have said. And a

1066
01:29:20.000 --> 01:29:25.720
people are paying attention and they see
it as a forest instead of the trees,

1067
01:29:26.239 --> 01:29:30.479
they'll see how the trees are actually
making the forests. And Valet,

1068
01:29:30.680 --> 01:29:39.000
who's very very interested in this topic
and it's done extensive research and extensive participation,

1069
01:29:39.640 --> 01:29:45.359
says it is a control mechanism.
He thinks that there's a system behind

1070
01:29:45.399 --> 01:29:51.520
the scenes that how things are being
done is also being calculated, just as

1071
01:29:51.560 --> 01:29:57.119
you said. So it's interesting how
that clicks into place. And I was

1072
01:29:57.159 --> 01:30:01.640
thinking again about you know, some
of the things that have been seen in

1073
01:30:01.680 --> 01:30:09.079
the sky that people have filmed.
They can see like plasma moving and becoming

1074
01:30:09.159 --> 01:30:14.560
something else. They can see it
happening before their eyes, they film it.

1075
01:30:14.760 --> 01:30:21.479
They I think the Vigilantes of Mexico
are a good example. That's a

1076
01:30:21.520 --> 01:30:29.159
group that has shown numerous sightings in
the sky. So I wonder what message

1077
01:30:29.159 --> 01:30:31.760
that is, What art are they
trying to give to us that we're not

1078
01:30:32.159 --> 01:30:38.720
quite catching, But hopefully one day
we will. I think if I were

1079
01:30:38.800 --> 01:30:45.319
them, I would really hope that
we would start to kind of you know,

1080
01:30:45.880 --> 01:30:49.720
you know, sort of transcend it
become a little bit, i don't

1081
01:30:49.720 --> 01:30:57.279
know, less violent, less less
aggressive, less less this lot we have

1082
01:30:57.319 --> 01:31:01.319
a lot of problems, go down
the list. I mean, honestly,

1083
01:31:02.560 --> 01:31:09.319
we as a species are we're very
self destructive. And if we're dealing with

1084
01:31:09.479 --> 01:31:13.920
an intelligence that's very advanced and it
has transcended all of this, I mean,

1085
01:31:13.920 --> 01:31:16.279
it must be very frustrating for them
to see us in this kind of

1086
01:31:16.319 --> 01:31:25.560
turmoil constantly. So I would I
would hope that there's some evolution taking place

1087
01:31:25.720 --> 01:31:32.279
conscious wise and that will inter sort
of interconnect into the only other gears that

1088
01:31:32.319 --> 01:31:38.680
it requires for us to continue to
advance. But I'm not that I'm not

1089
01:31:38.840 --> 01:31:43.840
that hopeful. I'm really not.
For humans, Yeah, exultly. It

1090
01:31:44.039 --> 01:31:47.199
just occurs to me. Just now, we talked briefly a little bit about

1091
01:31:49.119 --> 01:31:55.800
the possibility of like hybridization, like
the missing link. Great. I was

1092
01:31:55.880 --> 01:32:02.479
just thinking, everyone's assuming that the
aliens or breeding with us to make hybrid

1093
01:32:02.560 --> 01:32:10.560
children for their benefit. But maybe
they're just hoping to breed out our aggression,

1094
01:32:11.720 --> 01:32:16.399
like we just eliminated. I don't
know, Well, they have a

1095
01:32:16.439 --> 01:32:18.960
lot of do they have a lot
to deal with then, because we have

1096
01:32:19.359 --> 01:32:26.560
how many billions of people on the
strength and we have not just chaos in

1097
01:32:27.119 --> 01:32:31.319
Ukraine, I mean it's all over
in every continent. There's very little like

1098
01:32:31.600 --> 01:32:35.039
real solid, stable peace. I
mean, you'd have to be living in

1099
01:32:35.079 --> 01:32:40.159
the middle of the Pacific Ocean on
an island somewhere to really be away from

1100
01:32:40.399 --> 01:32:45.680
all of this, the whole hybrid
thing. That could take another ten hours

1101
01:32:45.760 --> 01:32:51.119
to really kind of to break that
down, get in and you know what,

1102
01:32:51.319 --> 01:32:55.800
hopefully we'll get to do that again
in the future. But as it

1103
01:32:55.920 --> 01:32:58.800
is, I feel like I've taken
a lot of your time tonight, and

1104
01:32:58.840 --> 01:33:01.279
I'm gonna know it's good. Yes, I don't want to I don't want

1105
01:33:01.279 --> 01:33:04.399
to take too much more. I'm
it close. It out. Okay,

1106
01:33:04.960 --> 01:33:10.840
So I wanted to let you tell
everyone where they can find you, and

1107
01:33:10.920 --> 01:33:15.600
I know that you'll be on UCR. It's Friday, right, yeah,

1108
01:33:15.520 --> 01:33:23.159
talking about the art club. I
saw that. That's exciting. So can

1109
01:33:23.199 --> 01:33:29.279
you please let let people know where
they can find you? On Twitter?

1110
01:33:29.560 --> 01:33:36.680
Yah, Susan Finston at Susan Finston
and also on Facebook same just Susan Finceston

1111
01:33:36.800 --> 01:33:41.720
and Facebook. I don't use Facebook
as much, but I do check in

1112
01:33:42.119 --> 01:33:48.479
periodically. I think UFO Twitter has
kept me pretty welded to Twitter for a

1113
01:33:48.560 --> 01:33:54.800
while now, and so if you
ever want to hit me up and say

1114
01:33:54.800 --> 01:33:59.680
hello, that's where I am.
And I believe Da Vinci is where a

1115
01:33:59.720 --> 01:34:03.880
lot of your ink paintings are at
the moment. Yes. Oh and the

1116
01:34:04.039 --> 01:34:10.720
NFTs, Yeah I did. I
did a couple of month's worth of NFTs

1117
01:34:10.800 --> 01:34:15.119
at Da Vinci at Da Vinci Gallery, and I've sold a couple, which

1118
01:34:15.159 --> 01:34:20.760
is nice. But I just I've
taken a little break from doing that because

1119
01:34:20.760 --> 01:34:25.600
I have to sort of concentrate on
things that actually make money. That's not

1120
01:34:25.640 --> 01:34:29.319
making any money, but a couple
of people have bought them and I'm totally

1121
01:34:29.520 --> 01:34:36.319
totally flattered and just thrilled that anybody
wants to buy or look at or be

1122
01:34:36.439 --> 01:34:42.479
interested in. So thank you to
everyone for that. Well, if you

1123
01:34:42.560 --> 01:34:45.680
ever put them on T shirts,
I think a lot of people would want

1124
01:34:45.720 --> 01:34:49.000
those too, I thought, yes, I think I would want one on

1125
01:34:49.039 --> 01:34:54.439
a T shirt. Also like one, Oh you know what, the one

1126
01:34:54.439 --> 01:34:58.760
that I put on the connector is
the one where the entity is in a

1127
01:34:58.800 --> 01:35:04.399
bathtub and I just loved it.
Oh yeah, I should I And I

1128
01:35:04.560 --> 01:35:10.960
liked the one that you used for
the charity, for the Paul's Middle Georgia

1129
01:35:11.439 --> 01:35:15.680
charity. Yes, I thought that
was quite fun. I guess I like

1130
01:35:15.800 --> 01:35:19.159
I like the I like the fun
ones. I guess that's the right way

1131
01:35:19.199 --> 01:35:23.680
to put it. But like if
you put those on, yeah, if

1132
01:35:23.720 --> 01:35:27.239
you put those on T shirts,
I think that you would find people buying

1133
01:35:27.359 --> 01:35:30.119
those. I have a feeling,
Yes, I think so. And there's

1134
01:35:30.159 --> 01:35:34.640
lots of ways to do that now
with like I used Sazzle back in the

1135
01:35:34.720 --> 01:35:39.119
day. I don't know if that's
still around, but yeah, so I

1136
01:35:39.119 --> 01:35:42.520
think that I had thought about it, and then I got kind of carried

1137
01:35:42.520 --> 01:35:45.319
away into the NFT thing and then
I thought, well, I don't want

1138
01:35:45.319 --> 01:35:48.000
to be like, you know,
a little mis merchandiser. But if somebody

1139
01:35:48.039 --> 01:35:50.520
wants a T shirt, I mean
I think that's great. I mean I

1140
01:35:50.520 --> 01:35:55.199
think I should pick out a couple, or maybe I should ask people like

1141
01:35:55.319 --> 01:35:59.720
if you could have a T shirt
like which one and just have them done

1142
01:36:00.439 --> 01:36:02.880
instead of like printing up like a
whole bunch of them or something like that.

1143
01:36:03.039 --> 01:36:08.319
Well, the nice thing about digital
art nowadays, or any art that

1144
01:36:08.399 --> 01:36:14.520
you put in a digital format,
is you really could just provide the picture

1145
01:36:14.800 --> 01:36:17.359
and my company will do all the
printing for you and take care of the

1146
01:36:17.479 --> 01:36:21.319
orders, and you just get the
percentage. You have to of course find

1147
01:36:21.359 --> 01:36:25.840
the right one. But AnyWho,
I was just saying that that might be

1148
01:36:25.880 --> 01:36:30.880
a fun thing to think about.
Everyone would benefit from having a Susan fencet

1149
01:36:30.920 --> 01:36:34.479
in. Yeah, I've already said
I think a Susan fenceon would fit really

1150
01:36:34.479 --> 01:36:38.159
well with my dojo theme. As
you can see, this is all my

1151
01:36:38.319 --> 01:36:44.159
UFOs. I could put it right
here to pretty up my area. That's

1152
01:36:44.199 --> 01:36:46.720
what I'm thinking. One day,
when I get my taxes, I'll take

1153
01:36:46.720 --> 01:36:50.920
a look and see put a Susan
fencet in piece right there. Maybe no

1154
01:36:50.960 --> 01:36:56.399
one else. Sorry, I will
certainly keep the T shirt thing in mind,

1155
01:36:56.520 --> 01:37:00.399
because who doesn't love the good UFO
T shirt exactly? I think that'd

1156
01:37:00.439 --> 01:37:03.479
be so cool. All right,
Well, now you've given me something to

1157
01:37:03.479 --> 01:37:08.119
think about. Right, Well,
I'm glad that you know, with your

1158
01:37:08.239 --> 01:37:13.880
inspiration. I'm so proud that I
was able to inspire you and I inspired

1159
01:37:13.920 --> 01:37:15.199
you. I would love for you
to start, you know, doing a

1160
01:37:15.199 --> 01:37:18.319
little drawing and don't it doesn't have
to be a big serious thing, but

1161
01:37:18.359 --> 01:37:21.960
you could kind of start out and
then kind of see where it goes.

1162
01:37:23.800 --> 01:37:26.960
Yeah, I think it would be
like I'd be gone for a weekend and

1163
01:37:27.000 --> 01:37:30.159
everyone would be like, where did
she go? And I'd have to come

1164
01:37:30.199 --> 01:37:33.520
out of it saying I did this
painting. I think you would really love

1165
01:37:33.520 --> 01:37:38.199
it. I think there's nothing more
satisfying than making something that you love.

1166
01:37:38.880 --> 01:37:43.039
And I really do. I do, And I just wonder what would come

1167
01:37:43.159 --> 01:37:48.680
if I brought the two together,
brought the painting and this topic together,

1168
01:37:48.840 --> 01:37:53.880
what would happen. I think I'd
maybe meditate first, so it's like,

1169
01:37:54.000 --> 01:37:58.279
tell me what to show, because
I find that's why I was saying it

1170
01:37:58.319 --> 01:38:00.279
earlier. I think that if you
gave it a try, I thought of

1171
01:38:00.279 --> 01:38:04.600
it more, maybe as a visualization
than trying to clear your thoughts because that's

1172
01:38:04.640 --> 01:38:10.960
impossible. Then you might you might
tap into some of that dream and figure

1173
01:38:11.039 --> 01:38:16.439
it out a little bit. It's
incredible the messaging that you can get once

1174
01:38:16.479 --> 01:38:20.960
you open yourself up for that.
So yeah, I don't know, just

1175
01:38:21.000 --> 01:38:25.000
something to think about. Let me
know if you do it, I'd think

1176
01:38:25.079 --> 01:38:30.279
about. Okay, So everyone,
I'm going to say good night, thank

1177
01:38:30.359 --> 01:38:34.840
you for listening, or good day. Of course, you know I tend

1178
01:38:34.840 --> 01:38:39.319
to joke about you know, we
have some future humans out there. Yes,

1179
01:38:40.560 --> 01:38:44.680
and I want to say. This
is deb from dev stat at Dojo,

1180
01:38:45.119 --> 01:38:48.359
part of the Calling All Beings podcast
network. If you want to reach

1181
01:38:48.520 --> 01:38:53.600
me, you can find me at
Study of UAPs. I'm on Twitter,

1182
01:38:53.840 --> 01:39:00.560
Facebook, LinkedIn, and of course
with the Calling All Beings Cabby Family on

1183
01:39:01.079 --> 01:39:06.199
YouTube. So have a good day, everybody, take care. Thank you. Jeb