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You're listening to the Paranormal UK Radio
Network and now it's time for the Paranormal

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Peep Show. Hi, welcome to
the Paranormal Peep Show with myself near Ward

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and we're broadcasting out on the Paranormal
UK Radio Network. And who have we

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got tonight with us? It's my
co host Ben Emlyn Jones. Ben,

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how are you, hey, Neil, I'm not bad, Thank you.

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Yeah, I've been had an exciting
time since the last show. I went

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to Weird Weekend North, which is
a conference which is pretty much all about

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the kind of things and you talk
about on this show, and it was

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very very good. One difference is
you don't have to eat lard on the

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show, but I did enter a
lard eating competition and came second. So

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yeah, something I was watching out
on YouTube and Monica, my wife,

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and I I said to Monica said, Ben's been eating large you want to

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watch this. So we watched it
and she was sort of going, oh

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my god. And I actually thought
you were going to win because you took

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that lab with both hands and you
literally were biting a bullet. But the

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other guy, your your your contestant
pal, he was doing it very slowly

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and I thought, no, he's
not going to catch up with you.

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But somehow it was like the thoughts
and the hair, he raced past you

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and beat you. Yeah he did. Ben Fiddler, Yes, he's another

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lard eating champion. He's deposed me
from my title, but I'll see if

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I can win it back next year. It's just a tradition started by Richard

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Freeman, who has that kind of
sense of humor. He likes that kind

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of thing, and so I think
you've had him on your show. I

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believe interesting chap. Yeah, it's
yeah, well it's something that was It

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was actually quite difficult to do.
It was a huge gluttony kind of endurance

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test. I felt pretty ill afterwards
actually, And it's not it's not the

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sort of sport you can really practiced
because, as Alan Parsters said, I'd

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be dead. I'm glad to get
that over with. Wow, you're a

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champion for doing it at least and
the fact that you you've kind of like

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done it a couple of years in
a row now is hats off to you.

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You you know you're you are the
lard eater, which is it sounds

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really unhealthy. I must admit I
was not something I would really want to

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enter into a competition. I'm the
sort of quiet guy that my inter color

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and competitions, and you know,
I'm not a hard man like you are

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in these things, and I must
help people. Sorry that Andy isn't here,

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he sends his apology. He's actually
not here tonight. He's actually away,

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so he will hopefully be with us
next month around, but Ben has

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kindly agreed to step in and talking
away. I went away after the last

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show was recorded. I went away
to the Orkney Islands to visit my daughter,

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and it so happens, literally just
as I arrived, I ate something

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not quite the equivalent of lard,
but something probably just as dangerous. I

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had a dodgy cheese sandwich that I
bought in him Ns airport, and about

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three hours later I was thrown up
on a coach virtually and by the time

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I arrived in Orkney, I was
full blown food poisoning from this cheese sandwich.

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So all our plans for you know, driving about and going here,

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there and everywhere literally had to be
put on hold. I was absolutely sick

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for about four days for the whole
duration, and I only started to get

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better when I had to leave work
in head down to Edinburgh to then visit

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my son. So yeah, the
pitfalls of eating cheese damages. Always check

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the date, folks, and I
just didn't bother check in the date.

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But they should have thrown it away
by by all accounts, but obviously they

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didn't, So thank you W Smith
in the Ness Airport. Anyway, did

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you enjoy the week weekend? Author's
some interesting folks that you saw there talking

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very much? Yes, it was
great fun. I mean it was a

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social event more than anything else.
I think, like most of these conferences,

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I got to hang out with some
of the other people from the Center

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of fourteen Zoology and other paranormal groups
around the country, and I had a

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really, really wonderful time, and
the speakers were really good quality. I

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don't know if I could pick a
favorite. Possibly Bob Fisher, who talked

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about he He gave a very very
biographic autobiographical speech about his interest in weird

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stuff when he was a kid,
about how he fantasized about portals and things

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like that, which is actually very
much similar to myself. I'm of a

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similar age to him, and we
had the and I can sort of identify

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with that I suppose the differences.
He didn't really talk about any real type

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evidence. Other people did though.
I mean there was a discussion of ghosts

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of vampires, several other things like
that. Was the videos. There would

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be videos on the to watch pretty
soon, I think. So many thanks

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to everyone who's on Glenn Valdry and
his wife Kerry and who organized it and

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did the catering and things like that. Excellent work, brilliant contence. In

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which town do they do this?
In the North. It's called Rixton mcglaze

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Brook. It's actually a little village
just outside Warrington, Cheshire, and it's

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very easy to get to and it's
a lovely remote area night near the Manchestership

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Canal and you can actually get quite
easy by bus from either Warrens or from

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Manchester. And it's a charming hilariu
and some flat in the flat valley and

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it's it's really beautiful then and when
the weather's nice it's it has a real

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atmosphere to it, cool, excellent. Oh well, maybe you know one

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day I might go up there and
still you love it? Now, you

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really love it? Yeah, it
does sound up my street. I'll just

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stick clear of the lard. But
I think apart from that probably fair quite

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fair, quite well. So yeah, anyone who's you know been connected with

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that show, please get in touch. Maybe I've Ben do your talk at

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some point. Anyway, we better
crack on with our show. So those

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people that are with a stute hearing
and may have heard a few giggles whilst

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me and Ben were talking about Lardie
Cake. So that was our guests that

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are waiting in the wings to join
us, and that is Mark and Liz

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Froud, otherwise known as the Crafty
Nihilists. Hello, Mark and Liz,

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how are you guys? Hello,
Hi, great to say thanks for having

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us us. Thank you. So
whereabouts are you in the UK? Roughly

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not your full address, but just
rough in the UK for those that want

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to stalk you from a distance at
least. Well, I think the people

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that listen to us know that we
live in Box, a small village in

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Wiltshire, so miles outside of Bath, very near all of the stone circles

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and Avebury Stonehenge. And also as
people on Ben's channel would have seen when

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he came to stay with us and
we went to the Glassyby Symposium. But

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we're been around here, We're very
close to Ruddlow Manor and all those potentially

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alien connected underground military base. And
that's on top of a deep underground military

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base which could explain the super large
rabbits that Miles Johnson goes on aut So

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Rudlow Mannor, Yeah, that's a
famous one that comes up in UFO literature

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as a place that's supposedly got some
UFO stories connected with it. And I

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actually wonder myself. I mean,
I've actually just written about it in this

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book that I'm doing called True Tales
of the Paranormal. And about thirteen fourteen

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years ago, I was doing a
talk at a pub in Hampshire and it

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was about ghosts and spirits and that
kind of stuff. But one of the

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questioners asked me his name is Dave. He said, oh, can you

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tell me that all ghosts come in
sort of different shapes and sizes? And

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I said, well, what do
you mean exactly and he said, well,

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I used to work in it's really
sort of say what it was,

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but he said, we used to
do some sort of technology development in the

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early nineteen seventies in a kind of
manor house. He didn't name what it

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was, but I think he indicated
it was the mood as a kind of

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contract or something like that, and
he said it's what you would call today

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as like the silicon chip, that
they didn't call it that then. And

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he said that he was working there
with his technician buddy, and he was

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working on one side of the room
and his work on the other side of

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the room. And from as I
said, it's in an old manor house,

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it could have been ruddlow manner.
And he said, suddenly the room

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lit up with a blue haze everywhere, and they both looked around. So

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who switched that blue light on?
And they looked and they both looked behind

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them, and between them was this
blow blue in box about the size of

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a shoe box. And he said
it was just floating past them silently,

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down between them in this workroom they
were in. He said, it went

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out the door and turned right and
went down the corridor, and they kind

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of gulped. What the bloody hell
was that? And so they went and

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found their boss because they lost track
of this blue box. I went and

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found their boss and sort of we've
just seen this blue flying box going down

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the hallway sort of thing. And
he said, come with me. So

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he took him down to the basement
where this old guy I had been working

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there for years, and so these
two technicians told him, yeah, we've

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seen this blue float floating box.
And this old guy said, yeah,

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I've seen it too many a time
that I've been working here. So I

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write about it, but I don't
call it a ghost. And I actually

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said this to the guy Dave,
when he told me, I said,

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I don't think it's a ghost.
I said, the best guess that I

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could come up with at this time
is perhaps it was some sort of reconnaissance

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device, because it sounds like it's
going around looking at people. Maybe we're

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recording people in some way. Whoever
it's from don't know, Russians, Chinese,

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North Korea, or it could be
even further afield alien tech, something

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like that. I don't know for
sure, but they both witnessed it.

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And of course it's not going to
be written down in some sort of news

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to declare being in some MD kind
of kind of a till they're going to

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release to the public. I think
stuff pretty pretty shushed because they don't want

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to presumably tell people that their premises
are being infiltrated in ways that they can't

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stop. But yeah, yeah,
and it could be rudd Low Mannet for

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all intense purposes, I don't know, And imagine that a lot of these

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manor houses are kind of taken over
by contracting companies for the MD and places

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like that. Yeah. So yeah, yeah, yeah, Well we saw

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you've quite a few places, didn't
we. Yeah. Yeah, that little

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thing that we saw just before lockdown. Now, I don't know if you

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can remember the name of it,
but then we've told you about it a

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lot. So we were driving back
from I've got a very sweary video on

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my channel, and we were driving
back from Sainsbury's and I always go down

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Box, just the normal road,
the eight for or whatever it is,

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and I just got this impulse just
to left and go through Redlow. I

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don't know why. And then all
of a sudden we come to a little

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roundabout and it's all cordoned off and
there's like hundreds of police cars, felt

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like hundreds, probably a back three, and then these massive lorries. There

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was about three massive lorries. Yeah, huge. It was going forever something

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like what was it, Giant computers, Giant computers on these lots. Again,

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it's mentioned on Ben's video. I
can't remember the name of it,

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but I think Ben looked it up
and it was a contractor that deals with

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computer hardware. But you know,
obviously major scale, not just a few

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laptops, and the size of these
sides of these lorries were absolutely enormous.

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Driving down to a real sky Net
drive. Actually we've got a sky Net

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drive in red Low. You captured
an image of the of the logo that

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the emblem of the company on the
side of the vehicle, which is very

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useful because I did look it up. It is an electronics firm that specializes

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in military intelligence contracting, so it
develops a classified technology for the national security

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state. So it's exactly what you
would expect to be in that area.

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And indeed it is a very mysterious
place. I mean it's we had I

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mean, funnily enough, Rudlow Manor
now appears to have been sold. And

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when we went to visit it,
we found it was completely open. You

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could just walk in, probably not
legally, but we to be American tourists.

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Yeah, but we we went in
there. There were some builders renovating

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it, so it looks like that's
been sold. So whatever was in there

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appears to have moved out, it
want on to new premises. But it's

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a bit intriguing though, because in
the windows they had photos of portraits of

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Charles and Camilla and William and Kate
just in the front windows. Just wondered

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if there was an ann ection there, if they were planning a little of

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hideaway in the in the country something
because of the because of King Charles's accession.

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It could have been to celebrate that. This was not long after the

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king actually, well, it was
just just was it before or after the

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coronation? I can't remember. I
think it was just before the coronation.

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It was last summer, so yeah, the symposium ben because we were going

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up there, So it's just after
the coronation. It could be they were

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just celebrating that, or it could
be it could have been for another reason.

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It could be they were just patriotically. It is nod thing to see

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in a in a window because I
think that was a sorry to intruty,

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but yeah, that was another thing
about Rudlough, apart from obviously the the

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rumors about alien connections, but I
think it was also I mean it's been

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disputed, I think, but it
was also claimed to be one of the

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places where the Queen would go in
the event of the nuclear war type thing,

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and it was one of those.
Yeah, there are bunkers. There

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are bunkers. I mean it's not
secret. There. There are some bunkers

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that are publicly available and you can
visit some of them. And there's Kelvidon

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Hatch, which actually that's in sorry
that's in I think that's in Essex somewhere,

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but there's something a bit like Keldon
Hatch in Wiltshire in that area and

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it is indeed a nuclear bunker headquarter
place for the for the state in the

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event of a nuclear war, some
of the massive catastrophe. Yeah, so

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yeah, it could be it could
be that. Yeah, it could be

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that's where they're meant to go the
royal family. Does that not limit them

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where they can go? I mean, for instance, the Queen obviously spent

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a lot of time our Moral and
places like that, and now I think

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Charles would presumably be doing the same
sort of thing. So for them to

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suddenly have to fly you know,
two hours or something it is from top

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of Scotland down to rud though Man
or wherever it is in Wiltshire, it

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would take quite a lot logistics effort
where it might be perhaps there's another Corps

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two in that area. I mean
there's a lot of area basically around there

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that Aberdeen and in Loss and places
like that. I presume that they could

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have sort of emergency bunkers there for
very important vi P type people. Some

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people think they're all connected as well, though only or don't they, because

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there's railways underneath the ground leaf where
we where we live, there's a railway

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and there's some photos online of old
abandoned bits of you know, small trains

213
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and that sort of thing. So
some people do think that these bunkers are

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all connected up so they won't even
have to go above ground to get their

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kind of thing. Because we're also
on the virtually the nearest house to Box

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tunnel, which course that the longest
tunnel in the country, which was isn't

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barking to Brunell. It was the
longest longest tunnel in the world when they

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built, and that I think has
has or used to have connections through to

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the underground military base. So it
certainly goes right underneath where that base around

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Buglow, so and that's got interesting
connections as well, like the I think

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when they try to prove it,
they said it was slightly off, but

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still this idea that Brunell had designed
it so that a certain time, was

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it his birthday or somebody for they
thought it was on his birthday that the

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sunshine all the way through. It's
about well, it's just under three thousand

225
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meters long, and we were just
saying, how there was a rumor that

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on Isimba Kingdom, Brunell's birthday the
sunshines all the way through and it's around

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his birthday, so it's in April, and it's kind of a round his

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birthday, not and then we were
sort of saying, well, well,

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why would he even have that idea. It's quite an esoteric, potentially free

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Masonic thing to even consider doing.
You know, it's not usually what you'd

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imagine an engineer of a tunnel to
be even building into his construction. And

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the fact that it does a ligne
at least close to his birthday, you

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know, it's the sort of and
then we were wondering why was it even

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built around here? And you know, there's a lot of lay lines,

235
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there's a lot of this, that
and the other. And now obviously we've

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got the mod it's all going on
around here, and the longest tunnel in

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the world at the time. Would
that needed to have been built here when

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we know that there's underground things here
as well. It's all very I seem

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to remember reading that they were saying
it because it obviously cost a huge amount

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of lives. About one hundred people
died. It took five years to build,

241
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about one hundred people died. Yeah, and it was this sort of

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determination, right, this is where
it's going to go, even though maybe

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there could have been okay, slightly
longer, but we could have go round

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the hill and rather than through the
having to put the town through a massive

245
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Hillah. Did they say what the
purpose of this tunnel was for. Oh,

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well, they said it was just
to get people from London to Bristol.

247
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I think it was going to take
four hours to go one hundred and

248
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twenty miles, But that I don't. I think there's something more to it.

249
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There's something more. Of course,
you've got all these well as this

250
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says so much esoteric type connections all
around this area. But of course,

251
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you know, maybe it shortened the
journey the connection between Bath and London,

252
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and Bath of course had caught sort
of by elite sort of connections. And

253
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we did a video a while ago
going round Bath, which is just a

254
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few miles from here and looking at
all a lot of the major sites there,

255
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the circus and the Royal Crescent designed
by John with the Elder and his

256
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son, and a lot of that
was based around his surveys of Stanton Drew,

257
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Stone Circle and Stonehenge, and again
there were free masons and it was

258
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all connected with their a lot of
free masonry connections in the design and it

259
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represents the sun and the moon possibly
on the lay line as well, so

260
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again very much a freedoms on connection. You look at it from an aerial

261
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perspective that the Royal present and the
circus in Bath actually is the shape of

262
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a key, which not so much
now but used to be a really important

263
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symbol for freemasonry back in the day, didn't they. But the king at

264
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the time of building the tunnel,
I can't remember who it is now was

265
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opposed because he said, we don't
want the peasants traveling around the country,

266
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so he was opposed to it apparently. But it reminds me of Surn a

267
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little bit, this giant tunnel,
because back in the day, it would

268
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have been the navvies. They brought
in thousands and thousands of navies congregated on

269
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box and all sorts of pilavas.
You know, it was a night there

270
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to be fair back in the day
when they were building it. Won't you

271
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think about cern Now that's kind of
the modern equivalent. And look how many

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people died of that and it kind
of makes you wonder about in that weird

273
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Wickerman times a million opening so many
times I don't even know where most of

274
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the bodies are buried. And that
leads me on one of my experiences later,

275
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how many people have died during the
building of the Sun Tunnel, which,

276
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for those that don't know, it's
this great big I'm trying to think

277
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how you describe it, but it's
a huge. It eighteen miles which separate.

278
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Yeah, it goes over the borders
of Switzerland and Italy. Is it

279
00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:06,079
or France, I can't remember.
It's on French Swiss border near Geneva.

280
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It's very, very huge, so
you couldn't really build this on the surface.

281
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It's the largest instruments in the world
scientific instrument ever created. So loads

282
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of people died during the building that
I wasn't aware of that. Yeah,

283
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so have you ever seen that really
weird opening ceremony where there's like a strange

284
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goat and it's just very weird.
I don't know if you've seen it,

285
00:21:26,640 --> 00:21:30,119
Neil, But when they're climbing up
the big aisle of the big thing that's

286
00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:33,240
at the back, all these people
keep falling off and they say they symbolize

287
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all the people that died building the
tunnel. I'm not actually sure how many.

288
00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:41,039
I'm going to have a quick look
now. I remember four or five

289
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in that ceremony, but I'm not
saying that's representative exactly how many things the

290
00:21:45,119 --> 00:21:48,759
Gotta based tunnel. But that's another
thing. But it is in the same

291
00:21:48,799 --> 00:21:55,519
areas in Switzerland. Yeah, and
with the the people that were building the

292
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sern were also at the ceremony and
part of the ceremony, and you've seen

293
00:22:00,759 --> 00:22:03,839
them falling through. You see them
what looks like they're falling through some kind

294
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of port lets a screen when you
see people from the goat is well.

295
00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:14,319
I mean that the national symbol of
Switzerland is the Ibex, which is a

296
00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:18,880
type of mountain goat, but it's
like the anthropomorphic goat. It has a

297
00:22:18,880 --> 00:22:22,640
head, that looks a bit like
Bafomet basically, and also it's doing rather

298
00:22:22,759 --> 00:22:30,240
naughty things to a young lady from
behind and then then from behind and there's

299
00:22:30,279 --> 00:22:36,000
like like some sort of devil childer
coming, but it's like some sort of

300
00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:41,200
progeny has come from this rape basically
by this horned creature, and this is

301
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an opening ceremony for this great scientific
I mean, that was one of the

302
00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:48,119
seeing. Seeing that ceremony in the
video of that, which this showed me

303
00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:52,000
was one of the things that opened
my eyes. Really. I was just

304
00:22:52,079 --> 00:22:56,880
like, yeah, I don't even
imagine there was an opening ceremony for cern

305
00:22:56,079 --> 00:22:59,640
or you know, connected. No, you don't think of it, do

306
00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:03,000
you know? And certainly wouldn't have
thought of it like a seen from the

307
00:23:03,039 --> 00:23:08,640
Wickerman on steroids. Yeah, I've
never seen it. I've heard various things

308
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:15,799
alluding to it and talking about apparently
nine people, nine people. It does

309
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remind me of, you know,
was that the Blue New Tunnel that we

310
00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:25,680
literally when the train goes by our
house shakes were that close. Was that

311
00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:32,400
their kind of version of I don't
know that rituals and sacrifico, sacrifices,

312
00:23:32,839 --> 00:23:36,079
I don't know so much seems to
have from ancient science as well, you

313
00:23:36,079 --> 00:23:41,720
know underground connection. It's it's weird
because I mean, this is this sort

314
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of thing goes on to this day. For example, and there was that

315
00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:49,039
ballet troupe that did a special It
was actually made into a film in the

316
00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:55,720
CON was called but there was this
song. There was this ballet troupe who

317
00:23:55,759 --> 00:24:00,599
did this performance inside the large Hadron
collider and it was made this very very

318
00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:04,960
sophisticated film and it involves, for
example, you see someone rising up through

319
00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:08,119
a black hole and emerging in a
portal and things like this. There was

320
00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:14,160
a strange ritual as well. Someone
filmed it that took place on the above

321
00:24:14,160 --> 00:24:17,519
the ground on the campus where it
looked like some kind of people with gowns

322
00:24:17,519 --> 00:24:21,400
on its very eyes white shut They
came in gowns and mass and they did

323
00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:27,759
a mock human sacrifice. There's the
ballet was called simply that's right, yes,

324
00:24:27,799 --> 00:24:37,960
thanks to I've just checked it.
There was a strange There's other strange

325
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:41,759
things. For example, if you
look at the CERN logo with some people

326
00:24:41,119 --> 00:24:45,519
say it has a six six six
in it. There's also a statue of

327
00:24:45,559 --> 00:24:48,839
the god Shiva. Now this was
presented by the Indian Nuclear Science Institute or

328
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:55,599
the which is set up by Chandra
bow Is, the famous Indian physicist at

329
00:24:55,720 --> 00:25:00,119
Kalie Garrbert Einstein and now in the
Hindu pantheon, Shiva is one of the

330
00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:06,759
most potent gods of all. His
role is as the creator destroyer. So

331
00:25:06,799 --> 00:25:11,200
what he besides over the turning of
the Great wheel as they say in India,

332
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:15,440
which means the movement from one age
to the other, which is always

333
00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:22,440
was always interspersed with a period of
chaos and upheaval and destruction from which a

334
00:25:22,519 --> 00:25:26,160
new world emerges. And again this
is this is an odd thing. I

335
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:30,079
mean, it's something you think they
might put on display, maybe in the

336
00:25:30,160 --> 00:25:33,519
in the entrance hall or in a
glass case somewhere, But it's in pride

337
00:25:33,519 --> 00:25:37,480
of place, in the open right
right in front of right in front of

338
00:25:37,279 --> 00:25:40,359
the carp that's the first thing you
see when you go in there. And

339
00:25:40,359 --> 00:25:41,839
I think that's a rather odd thing. I don't know what they're trying to

340
00:25:41,839 --> 00:25:45,200
tell. They're trying to give us
a message here, I don't know.

341
00:25:45,519 --> 00:25:48,640
Well, there's an actual video.
There's a video that somebody just took on

342
00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:52,400
their phone of a strange kind of
mock sacrifice in front of that. They

343
00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:56,920
don't know if students mucking around or
if it was actually some sort of I

344
00:25:57,000 --> 00:26:00,400
seem to remember the time, there
was sort of all this old know this

345
00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:02,480
is fake news and that, and
then in the end they say, oh,

346
00:26:02,599 --> 00:26:04,039
oh yeah it was, but it
was just some students, you know,

347
00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:07,160
working there, working about type thing. You know. It's it was

348
00:26:07,319 --> 00:26:11,119
very creepy. I mean, I
mean yeah, I mean, living in

349
00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:14,680
Oxford, I know that students can
get up to weird stuff, but I've

350
00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:18,119
never seen anything quite like that.
I mean it was real. Yeah,

351
00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:19,839
I mean you could see people moving
forward. There was there was a mockuman

352
00:26:21,279 --> 00:26:23,279
moving forward towards the statue, and
there's this mock human. Sacrifices seem very

353
00:26:23,319 --> 00:26:27,519
well organized. It's clear some kind
of secret society. And I just thought,

354
00:26:29,319 --> 00:26:33,680
that's just when you put into context
all the other weird things associated with

355
00:26:33,759 --> 00:26:37,400
CERN, that just made me feel
a bit odd. And of course,

356
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:41,720
CERN is the reason people are concerned
about this, if you excuse the pun,

357
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,839
is because there's it's it's been predicted
that CERN might have some strange effects,

358
00:26:47,519 --> 00:26:51,880
including opening portals to other worlds and
things like that. In a true

359
00:26:51,880 --> 00:26:57,240
alchemical sense. You know, so
in a heavy industrial way, did you

360
00:26:57,319 --> 00:27:03,200
say that there's been some news recently
about or they've said it certain something something

361
00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:07,240
has happened. They are commoner.
I can't remember what they said, but

362
00:27:07,319 --> 00:27:12,039
I know years ago there was that
u l O. Wasn't now the unidentified

363
00:27:12,039 --> 00:27:18,400
al object because in a vacuum,
supposedly nothing supposed to pop up. But

364
00:27:18,519 --> 00:27:26,599
apparently there was this minuscule or whatever
that appeared in the vacuum proven that presumably

365
00:27:26,599 --> 00:27:32,000
creation comes out of nothing. But
it's a bit terrifying because they were talking

366
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:37,519
about they haven't talking about entities and
things, and you know, some of

367
00:27:37,519 --> 00:27:42,160
the serious scientists have even been talking
about entities and portals. The stuff we

368
00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:47,240
talk about is actually being mentioned by
some of the some of the extra scientists,

369
00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:51,880
and they trying to cover themselves in
case they do create something. You

370
00:27:51,920 --> 00:28:00,519
know, because the unidentified lying object
was in the beam pipe of this seventeen

371
00:28:00,599 --> 00:28:04,119
mile underground tunnel. Now this is
a vacuum tube where the proton beam scattered

372
00:28:04,279 --> 00:28:11,880
and they collide and scattered particles.
Now this this, this vacuum is it's

373
00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:15,440
a harder vacuum than space, than
deep space. It's very very intense.

374
00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:19,920
It's completely sealed off from the outside
world, so how on earth could something

375
00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:26,680
appear in there? But this what
what this guy dtr Rook, this guy

376
00:28:26,039 --> 00:28:30,960
who helped Professor Albert Rook de Rook, He said that the unidentified lying object

377
00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:34,039
turns out not to be a problem
for the operation. It's just something to

378
00:28:34,079 --> 00:28:37,839
keep an eye on. It's in
the vacuum tube. That's a problem as

379
00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:41,359
long as it doesn't move and remain
stable. Blood. We've got some things

380
00:28:41,400 --> 00:28:49,240
in our house like that, to
be honest, accident, you know.

381
00:28:51,079 --> 00:28:53,359
So are they going to build another
tunnel? This is what I've heard that

382
00:28:53,519 --> 00:29:00,160
this isn't big enough for the job
they wanted the FCC the future a future

383
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:03,880
something collider, it's gonna be even
bigger. I think it's gonna be about

384
00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:08,240
forty seven miles in circumference. So
whatever whatever they plan to do with certain

385
00:29:08,279 --> 00:29:15,240
they plan to upgrade it, or
to do it again, or to expand

386
00:29:15,279 --> 00:29:19,000
it, I don't know what what
that will happen. Obviously, it's gonna

387
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:22,440
take a long time to build so
and it'll take a cost a lot of

388
00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:25,279
money. And it hasn't even started
yet. So we've got a little we

389
00:29:25,319 --> 00:29:27,359
don't have to worry about it just
yet, but it's still it's still something

390
00:29:27,400 --> 00:29:30,920
to keep an eye on, isn't
it. And I mean it's been connected

391
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:34,640
the activities that's CERN have been connected
to things like the Mandela effect. That

392
00:29:36,119 --> 00:29:41,640
the Mandela effect didn't exist until it
was identified by Fiona Broom just after CERN

393
00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:45,640
began its run too in twenty ten. Before that, it didn't really was

394
00:29:45,759 --> 00:29:48,359
never a thing. And then suddenly
people start coming forward saying, oh,

395
00:29:48,359 --> 00:29:52,599
I remember, oh, but looney
tunes used to be looney tunes, didn't

396
00:29:52,599 --> 00:29:56,720
it when Nelson Mandela didn't need die
in ninet eighty six or something. But

397
00:29:56,759 --> 00:30:00,359
you identified match stick men and match
dick cats and dogs. It's much storkman

398
00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:14,240
though, that's nonsense. It's really
weird storkman because I'm a eighteen tunnel just

399
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:19,839
so that we can argue about looney
tunes. But now, interestingly, still

400
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:25,519
talking about this this CERN tunnel,
is that our friend philipkins Seller, who's

401
00:30:25,559 --> 00:30:30,960
a medium as well as a UFO
experiencer and things like that, he actually

402
00:30:30,079 --> 00:30:36,960
was experimenting around the time that the
certain thing was coming online with a ghost

403
00:30:37,079 --> 00:30:41,480
box type of receiver, and he
said that he got some scientists that are

404
00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:47,200
deceased on the other side, and
so he decided to take the opportunity to

405
00:30:47,240 --> 00:30:53,119
ask them, you know, is
this SERN tunnel? Is there any other

406
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:57,279
nefarious purposes it is going to be
used for? And he said, I

407
00:30:57,319 --> 00:31:00,640
think that's what you said. Anyway, he said the there was a pause

408
00:31:00,799 --> 00:31:04,160
and then there was a kind of
a laughter and he said, not an

409
00:31:04,240 --> 00:31:11,319
evil laughter, but a laughter of
almost sarcastic kind of tones coming back through

410
00:31:11,359 --> 00:31:17,039
this ghost box from these scientists on
the other side. We can't tell you

411
00:31:17,119 --> 00:31:19,599
that type of thing, as if
they knew something, but they didn't want

412
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:23,160
to kind of let the Earth people
know about it type of thing. You

413
00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:29,759
know. It's interesting. I mean, I've thought about cern. I think

414
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:33,279
obviously SURN wasn't the first sort of
particle accelerate, and that there were some

415
00:31:33,279 --> 00:31:37,799
others before that, but obviously this
was a huge, much great scale than

416
00:31:37,839 --> 00:31:45,039
previous. But I've been interested because
you were talking about with wee can Northern

417
00:31:45,279 --> 00:31:51,480
that the talk about which I heard
about all those programs, the children's programs

418
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:53,920
and things like that around the nineteen
eighties my era as well, growing up

419
00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:57,920
as a child, and how often
had a thought since I was doing academic

420
00:31:57,960 --> 00:32:04,720
work about something drawing me to the
nineteen eighties, and when I was doing

421
00:32:04,759 --> 00:32:08,960
researching to the Lost Child, and
programs on mainstream were like Stranger Things and

422
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:13,000
things like that which are flash back. They're set in the nineteen eighties,

423
00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:16,519
and they're around all these ideas of
strange things happening with reality and time.

424
00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:22,160
And I wonder, sort of it
was around the time of these particle accelerators

425
00:32:22,799 --> 00:32:28,519
kicking off. If maybe that's all
tied up. But like I think you've

426
00:32:28,599 --> 00:32:30,880
you've talked before about the nineteen eighties, Ben, and I don't know,

427
00:32:30,920 --> 00:32:37,559
it just seems like a time when
times started to get a bit weird,

428
00:32:37,799 --> 00:32:43,799
and maybe there was another sort of
shift again in how they're playing around with

429
00:32:44,799 --> 00:32:49,359
our perceptions of reality. Something became
mechanical as well. Each the kids,

430
00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:52,279
everything was mechanical. It was almost
as if there was a bit of a

431
00:32:52,319 --> 00:32:57,880
shift in the technology where the Internet
that was also came from cern, didn't

432
00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:00,680
it. I think, Yeah,
that's just weird. And I I remember

433
00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:05,599
that because I suppose we're the first
generation of kids that we brought up with

434
00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:08,400
computer games, and computer games really
only became a thing when when I was

435
00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:12,759
a kid. I mean when my
dad's generation, there was nothing. In

436
00:33:12,799 --> 00:33:16,400
the seventies, there was these atari
kind of like video computer games but which

437
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:20,519
you plugged into your TV. But
in the in the eighties, in the

438
00:33:20,599 --> 00:33:25,319
early eighties, things like the Spectrum
X Spectrum came along. I was reminiscent

439
00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:29,400
talking about it on your video.
Yeah, that's why I remember. I

440
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:30,920
remember very well. There was the
kids. There was a huge it was

441
00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:34,839
a huge thing, the computer games
and everything, massive thing when we were

442
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:37,799
kids, and there were kids who
had commodorees and kids who had the kids.

443
00:33:37,839 --> 00:33:42,200
Some of the kids had spectrums.
I had. I had a Spectrum

444
00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:45,319
Plus, which is basically a Spectrum
with a better keyboard. And there was

445
00:33:45,359 --> 00:33:49,160
also some of the kids, usually
the more middle class children, who had

446
00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:52,839
BBC computers. I do remember that. Yeah, there was kind of class

447
00:33:52,880 --> 00:34:01,880
divide there, but one that was
called a spectrum kid like Ben. You

448
00:34:02,079 --> 00:34:07,200
get the games, but I mean
thinking about the BBC like you. I

449
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:08,679
went to one of those kids,
it was called Joseph, and he had

450
00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:14,079
a BBC Model B and he had
a modem in those days, which you

451
00:34:14,079 --> 00:34:17,119
actually plugged a phone handset into and
he got on to use net. This

452
00:34:17,199 --> 00:34:22,639
is the first time I ever went
online, and I was absolutely astounded that

453
00:34:22,679 --> 00:34:27,280
he could access this, this Usenet, which is a simple, primitive version

454
00:34:27,320 --> 00:34:30,679
of the World Wide Web. And
it was the pages. Each page took

455
00:34:30,679 --> 00:34:31,920
about two minutes to load, and
it just had text on it and a

456
00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:36,280
couple of little pictures. But I
was astounded by this. And they said,

457
00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:37,679
oh, yes, I'm having a
conversation with a chap in Austria.

458
00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:46,400
Look, And I was like,
and it was actually outserd, which it

459
00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:51,039
did exist in those days. It
had like some some smaller that they actually

460
00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:55,239
the very first service for the early
networks, these early uh in these these

461
00:34:55,320 --> 00:35:01,360
pre internet kind of networks, was
were there? Yes, which I think

462
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:08,039
is extraordinary, extraordinary eventuality. It's
just a strange synchronicity. Yeah. I

463
00:35:08,039 --> 00:35:13,280
think it was picked up by the
US US military at some point. I

464
00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:17,000
seem to remember. But yeah,
again, all these things that were interconnected

465
00:35:17,079 --> 00:35:22,159
around that same time. And also
I think it was early days of satellite

466
00:35:22,199 --> 00:35:28,559
TV and also as as Ben said, you know video games, com home

467
00:35:28,639 --> 00:35:34,519
computers. Do remember the first guy
the original satellite literally had a satellite dish

468
00:35:34,519 --> 00:35:38,519
on your house and it was came
and TV was just becoming and it was

469
00:35:38,559 --> 00:35:45,480
really odd because like it did feel
like we were having our minds expanded into

470
00:35:45,519 --> 00:35:50,320
other worlds, and because, as
Bob Fisher was explaining, he said,

471
00:35:50,320 --> 00:35:53,159
for him, his little Spectrum plus
didn't allow him access to a new world.

472
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:57,800
He described it as literally being he
felt. And a lot of these

473
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:01,719
games, as simple as they were, were very very they were very immersive.

474
00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:06,119
They were very absorbing, these little
simple games, and kids, the

475
00:36:06,199 --> 00:36:09,559
kids used to love them. I
remember, and I was gonna say something

476
00:36:09,599 --> 00:36:12,519
else I've forgotten now will come back
to me in a minute. But I

477
00:36:12,559 --> 00:36:15,719
suppose in the negative way, that's
the thing. I suppose it's sort of

478
00:36:16,559 --> 00:36:21,000
obviously now it's gone on to the
whole other level, and it's is it

479
00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:24,440
that the powers that shouldn't be that's
where they're more and more want to suck

480
00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:29,440
people into that virtual world to take
us out of the everyday reality. So

481
00:36:29,480 --> 00:36:32,880
we just plugged it in twenty four
to seven to the virtual world and we

482
00:36:34,000 --> 00:36:40,119
can Yeah, we already have people
who's like who just are so lonely they

483
00:36:40,199 --> 00:36:47,800
just talk to aibots all the time, and which is sad. Apple virtual

484
00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:52,000
reality headset my son was showing me
when I visited him in Edinburgh and he

485
00:36:52,039 --> 00:36:54,559
said, look at this, this
is where it's going now sort of thing.

486
00:36:54,599 --> 00:37:00,199
And you show me these YouTube people
that are reviewing these Apple like three

487
00:37:00,239 --> 00:37:07,719
thousand pounds maybe or three thousand dollars
and then like AI virtual reality headsets and

488
00:37:07,760 --> 00:37:10,800
you're walking around and you can see
the street and people, but you've got

489
00:37:10,880 --> 00:37:16,360
like like desktop icons appearing in the
in the vision of this thing, you

490
00:37:16,360 --> 00:37:19,679
know, and you can kind of
blink and you can open up your email

491
00:37:19,679 --> 00:37:23,000
and thinking that's crazy. Can't you
just go and enjoy life, you know,

492
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:28,800
rather than be glued to this bloody
virtual world all the time. It's

493
00:37:28,599 --> 00:37:31,679
just crazy. Agreed. See other
level from obviously people just wandering along looking

494
00:37:31,719 --> 00:37:36,159
at their phones so they're not looking
around them, you know. And yeah,

495
00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:42,199
it's like a website of all these
people like photographed at spectacular locations like

496
00:37:42,199 --> 00:37:45,239
the Grand Canyon and that, and
it's like teenagers just looking at their phone.

497
00:37:45,440 --> 00:37:51,440
Yeah. That was like when we
went to Osland because one of my

498
00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:57,119
favorite artists is Edvard Munk, and
he's quite the depressive. His paintings are

499
00:37:57,199 --> 00:38:00,679
very you know, melancholy, screamed
the screen. Yeah that's right, that's

500
00:38:00,760 --> 00:38:06,199
right. Yeah, and when we
were there, So the scream, there's

501
00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:09,480
three versions of it. There's like
a print, a painting, and another

502
00:38:09,599 --> 00:38:17,039
kind of print, and they close
one off and then open it, so

503
00:38:17,199 --> 00:38:22,119
you only get to see actor's scream
for a short amount of time before they

504
00:38:22,199 --> 00:38:24,920
put a cover over it to keep
it protected. And we were just sitting

505
00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:29,039
there waiting for the actual painting to
come along because that's what we wanted to

506
00:38:29,079 --> 00:38:34,800
see. And this guy he came
in with his phone and he looked at

507
00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:37,840
the screen through his phone and then
walked out, and the whole of the

508
00:38:37,880 --> 00:38:44,760
experience, he still never saw the
painting because he viewed the whole experience through

509
00:38:44,840 --> 00:38:46,920
his phone. It kind of just
looked it up on the internet. And

510
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:52,360
then there was another one, a
different picture I think where it was actually

511
00:38:52,400 --> 00:38:55,000
the one that's called Melancholy. It's
a really sad painting. And this dad

512
00:38:55,079 --> 00:39:00,760
got his daughter to stand in front
of this really sad painting. I was

513
00:39:00,800 --> 00:39:02,559
in tears when I was looking at
this this art for the first time,

514
00:39:02,559 --> 00:39:08,199
because it's my favorite artist. And
it got in front of this painting called

515
00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:20,559
Melancholy, and they trait face.
I mean, postmodernism gone mad. I

516
00:39:20,639 --> 00:39:29,400
was quite an awful trivialization philistines,
honestly total philistines. I just I wanted

517
00:39:29,440 --> 00:39:30,280
to ask you, guys, because
I mean, I've known you a long

518
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:35,199
time, and I don't I can't
remember if we ever discussed this privately.

519
00:39:35,280 --> 00:39:37,639
But of course are there's a two
of you. Listen, Marth and you

520
00:39:37,679 --> 00:39:42,320
are a couple. You're you're marriage
and your your spouses, and but you

521
00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:47,280
have the shared identity this stelt sort
of this stut manifestation of the craft.

522
00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:52,039
We always talk to you about it
rather than them. I tend to say

523
00:39:52,079 --> 00:39:55,280
them and something I say it.
But where did that come from? And

524
00:39:55,440 --> 00:40:00,960
the name and the idea? Where
did that come from? Well? I

525
00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:05,639
have an Etsy shop. It doesn't
have many things for sale on it at

526
00:40:05,679 --> 00:40:09,800
the moment, and I wanted a
name for my Etsy shop. Now I'm

527
00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:14,679
quite out of the two of us. I'm the glass half empty, whereas

528
00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:21,559
Marks the glass half full. So
I quite enjoy nihilistic humor. And because

529
00:40:21,559 --> 00:40:24,920
I can be down in the dance
quite a lot, so to get me

530
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:29,440
out of being down in the dumps, I've always turned to art and creating

531
00:40:29,840 --> 00:40:36,559
and creativity, and I used to
make quite humorous nihilistic cards to sell it,

532
00:40:37,480 --> 00:40:38,599
used to make me laugh, used
to cheer me up, used to

533
00:40:38,719 --> 00:40:44,079
get me out of the doldrums.
And so I named my shop the Crafty

534
00:40:44,159 --> 00:40:49,119
Nihilist and my logo is like a
yin yang, so it's the dark and

535
00:40:49,159 --> 00:40:52,559
the light and it's joined together in
the middle by what I tried to make

536
00:40:52,599 --> 00:40:54,679
it look like stitches because that was
when I was in my embroidery phase.

537
00:40:54,719 --> 00:41:00,400
So it sort of symbolizes craftiness,
the art that can that brings me personally

538
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:02,880
out of the doldrums. But then
we got onto YouTube and it kind of

539
00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:09,440
works because we're a little bit Mark
on YouTube calls himself the less nihilistic Mark,

540
00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:15,360
but kind of that version of the
kind, so we're ying yang,

541
00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:17,639
well, ya ying yang. So
it kind of worked. But it did

542
00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:22,239
start off because I needed a name
for my Etsy shop at one stage when

543
00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:25,599
I had longer hair on my head. When we first got together, I

544
00:41:25,599 --> 00:41:30,159
thought we should have a sort of
a clothing range. Hippie in goth yeah,

545
00:41:30,159 --> 00:41:35,000
golf and hippie. Yeah. Yeah. It started off. You know,

546
00:41:35,119 --> 00:41:39,760
I was quite I can be quite
nihilistic sometimes and creativity just gets me

547
00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:44,920
out of that frame of mind.
That's where it started, but then this

548
00:41:45,360 --> 00:41:50,400
kind of works. Well you collaborated, like, for example, Marks written

549
00:41:50,440 --> 00:41:52,599
the book. I've read the book
actually, and it's this kind of poetic

550
00:41:52,679 --> 00:41:57,880
kind of novel type story. But
you've done the cover art list and it's

551
00:41:57,559 --> 00:42:00,880
and it works quite well that way. We're a good combination. Thank you.

552
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:04,480
You've actually done a book of poetry, but we haven't got it published.

553
00:42:04,519 --> 00:42:07,119
Let well, we've both done the
poetry and the words, so we're

554
00:42:07,159 --> 00:42:09,920
hoping to do more. Yeah,
and I've done a few bits of art

555
00:42:09,960 --> 00:42:15,320
with it. But thank you Ben
for mentioning the book in all good bookshops.

556
00:42:15,320 --> 00:42:17,960
It's not in all good book jobs, but it's on bloodoo dot com

557
00:42:19,559 --> 00:42:25,440
called the individual in any bad bookshops. But but yeah, just it's great

558
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:30,599
to have that combination. I think
we compliment each other well, is more

559
00:42:30,639 --> 00:42:38,079
on the visual side and more on
the words as well. As you are

560
00:42:38,159 --> 00:42:45,360
the one that kind of if I
understood this right from your emails that you

561
00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:50,480
were more into all the kind of
alternative thinking, the richer d halls,

562
00:42:50,639 --> 00:42:57,840
the UFOs, paranormal maybe and then
Mark kind of slowly kind of came around

563
00:42:57,840 --> 00:43:01,000
to it. Is that right?
Yeah, Yeah, So I've been into

564
00:43:01,039 --> 00:43:07,400
it for years, but it was
kind of entertainment, you know. It

565
00:43:07,519 --> 00:43:10,320
was just it's never gonna happen in
my lifetime. I just used to do

566
00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:15,400
you remember when David like us to
have all those videos. It was open

567
00:43:15,519 --> 00:43:19,400
your mind, you remember with that
song on and I just bloody love it.

568
00:43:19,679 --> 00:43:22,920
But I wasn't expecting it to start
happening in my lifetime. So when

569
00:43:22,920 --> 00:43:28,559
I met Ben, when I met
Ben Fred slip there, I think I

570
00:43:28,559 --> 00:43:36,320
should I think I should leave now
coming now. Yeah, I met Mark.

571
00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:39,199
He was a right lefty, woky, right lefty. It was a

572
00:43:39,280 --> 00:43:44,079
right lefty wokey. We used to
have not arguments, but we did have

573
00:43:44,480 --> 00:43:49,480
discussions, debates. But because every
time I used to say global warman is

574
00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:52,079
a load of rubber, she'd call
me Donald Trump or that didn't go down.

575
00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:57,320
I've learned, I've learned. But
you've got better hair than him.

576
00:43:59,199 --> 00:44:04,159
I mean, yeah, I mean
totally. I will one hundred percent accept

577
00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:09,400
really, and I think it's I
think I could be the positive of a

578
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:15,920
way because you see all these things
where the sort of wil Sanders type of

579
00:44:15,239 --> 00:44:19,960
Oh. I used to be a
conspiracy theorist, but I've I've come out

580
00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:23,679
of the I've woken up now from
the stupidity and seem sense and it's like,

581
00:44:24,039 --> 00:44:28,519
well, I'm the other way around, you know. I've I used

582
00:44:28,519 --> 00:44:31,559
to be a woke liberal and now
I realized and saw a sense and knew

583
00:44:31,559 --> 00:44:37,559
that I was looking at ridiculous ideas
and the wrong way. And now I've

584
00:44:37,559 --> 00:44:40,480
realized a much better way of seeing
the world. You know. But I

585
00:44:40,519 --> 00:44:49,960
think I always had I always had
an interest in all belief that there was

586
00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:53,199
more to life than what the material
world that you could see and feel.

587
00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:57,960
And you know, when I was
a kid like Ben, you know,

588
00:44:57,960 --> 00:45:02,280
I used to get the Unexplained magazine. Has had an interest in sort of

589
00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:07,199
I suppose you could call it esoteric
phenomenon, and it came out and sort

590
00:45:07,199 --> 00:45:13,760
of liking science fiction and that sort
of thing. But I guess politically I

591
00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:17,440
did get sucked down into that route. I think it's how they do it.

592
00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:21,119
It's you know, they put things
out to appeal to people, and

593
00:45:21,159 --> 00:45:24,480
they think, oh, we don't
like the system because the system is wrong

594
00:45:24,519 --> 00:45:29,320
and it's controlled by powerful people,
so we need to do something to change

595
00:45:29,320 --> 00:45:34,639
it. So they sort of present
this opposition or you know, be a

596
00:45:34,719 --> 00:45:37,519
left winger then, because you're against
all these powerful, rich elites. But

597
00:45:37,599 --> 00:45:42,239
you sort of, as I've come
to realize, it's sort of it's all

598
00:45:42,280 --> 00:45:46,519
the game that they're playing, both
sides off against each other, and you

599
00:45:46,559 --> 00:45:52,480
could, yeah, just get caught
up with false, false, sort of

600
00:45:52,559 --> 00:45:55,480
stories about how the game is being
played and these sort of left hight paradigm

601
00:45:55,679 --> 00:46:01,400
in politics and things like that.
So, yeah, just listening to things

602
00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:05,239
with Liz. It was Richard haw
thing. I made you watch the Maddie

603
00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:10,360
mccamn think that was one of the
big ones because by academic book which could

604
00:46:10,360 --> 00:46:16,360
get properly published, was was around
the lost child and it was English literature

605
00:46:16,440 --> 00:46:21,480
was my thing that I did at
university. So it was looking at lost

606
00:46:21,559 --> 00:46:27,679
children and how prevalent they are in
writing, going back to fairy tales and

607
00:46:27,719 --> 00:46:30,360
beyond that and up to a modern
time. You know, mentioned stranger things.

608
00:46:32,360 --> 00:46:37,440
So the Motherlie McCann case was and
also she was supposedly abducted on my

609
00:46:37,519 --> 00:46:44,360
birthday how many years years ago?
It was so yeah, looking at Richard

610
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:47,639
D. Hall's Yeah, looking at
Richard D. Hall's videos, the way

611
00:46:47,679 --> 00:46:55,159
he forensically brilliantly dissected the you know, the the lies of what had been

612
00:46:55,199 --> 00:47:00,119
said, and he went into such
detail and it was it was like,

613
00:47:00,679 --> 00:47:04,400
well, you know this is this
is certainly not some crack pop that's just

614
00:47:04,519 --> 00:47:07,880
making something up off the top of
the head. You know. He proved

615
00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:10,880
it in such a way that you
could see that the official narrative was definitely

616
00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:15,079
not as they said it was.
And it's one of those things you sort

617
00:47:15,079 --> 00:47:19,039
of think, oh, well that's
they were lying about that, So what

618
00:47:19,159 --> 00:47:22,719
other things are they lying about?
And yeah, there was certain that was

619
00:47:22,760 --> 00:47:25,559
one of the big ones, which
d Hall and Madeline macn But also I

620
00:47:25,599 --> 00:47:30,360
said, that's certain opening ceremony just
blew me away. But yeah, certain

621
00:47:30,400 --> 00:47:35,599
things and just over time, something's
harder than others to sort of it is

622
00:47:35,679 --> 00:47:38,239
that thing of trying to sort of
break down beliefs you've had for a long

623
00:47:38,280 --> 00:47:44,639
time. But rexit was another one
one that you sucked me back in,

624
00:47:44,840 --> 00:47:51,320
honestly. But but yeah, but
you know, I've seen better on my

625
00:47:51,320 --> 00:47:54,159
my ways. It's good to see
both sides of things, I suppose.

626
00:47:54,239 --> 00:47:58,039
Yeah, definitely I tried to do
that. I think interesting by the way

627
00:47:58,079 --> 00:48:00,519
that I mean obviously that we're we
are definitely in the sense you're quite a

628
00:48:00,559 --> 00:48:05,239
recent convert mark and you were married
to someone who sort of like that helped

629
00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:07,679
you see that way. And everyone
has their sort of like how I got

630
00:48:07,719 --> 00:48:12,920
red pilled story? But what one
thing I think most one thing I noticed

631
00:48:12,960 --> 00:48:15,480
we tend to have in common,
And it's not universal that we in terms

632
00:48:15,519 --> 00:48:19,800
of age, we tend to be
of the generation late generator, late gen

633
00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:23,079
X, early millennial. And maybe
it is to do with the influence sort

634
00:48:23,079 --> 00:48:28,880
of like the rise of technology and
electronics as childhoods. Then of course,

635
00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:31,719
when you know, our early adulthood
was dominated by what I might call a

636
00:48:31,760 --> 00:48:37,559
golden age of of woo woo.
The X Files TV series, which is

637
00:48:37,559 --> 00:48:43,599
the nearest thing we have to creation
mythology basically was a big hit on TV.

638
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:46,239
And then of course it was also
at that same time there was the

639
00:48:46,280 --> 00:48:51,000
early Internet. Well, the Worldwide
Web started become popular in the in the

640
00:48:51,079 --> 00:48:54,639
nineties and it sort of took over
from where the earlier networks sort of left

641
00:48:54,679 --> 00:49:00,599
off. And so I think that
may be the reason why so many of

642
00:49:00,639 --> 00:49:02,880
us are of this kind of age
group. I mean, obviously they're older,

643
00:49:02,920 --> 00:49:07,480
they're older conspiracy conspiracy theories, so
they were younger ones, but generally

644
00:49:08,440 --> 00:49:12,639
we tend to be the sort of
age group, and I think I'm the

645
00:49:12,679 --> 00:49:19,480
older ones talked about that. I'm
thinking, oh my god, that's like

646
00:49:19,760 --> 00:49:23,079
I was working when you you kids
were watching you know, X files or

647
00:49:23,119 --> 00:49:28,920
something like. You know, I
grew up with portals of mister Ben.

648
00:49:29,239 --> 00:49:37,920
You know, mister Ben my first
introduction to Portals reality is, didn't he

649
00:49:39,480 --> 00:49:45,480
mentioned? It's mentioned that when you're
talking about the chaps. I'm sorry forget

650
00:49:45,519 --> 00:49:52,199
his name Fisher and you said,
oh, what about mister Bens. Ben

651
00:49:52,440 --> 00:49:55,880
was the first portal guy that I
knew. And for those that don't know

652
00:49:55,920 --> 00:50:00,559
who mister Ben is, check it
out on YouTube. Even if it was

653
00:50:00,599 --> 00:50:02,280
just for the themes. He used
to come back with the ports, didn't

654
00:50:02,320 --> 00:50:07,800
He always used to bring something to
come back, something to remember the adventure

655
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:13,079
by. But I noticed that he'd
always Chinese costumes each week or each episode,

656
00:50:13,440 --> 00:50:15,519
and he never used to hire them
or pay for them. The guy

657
00:50:17,039 --> 00:50:22,000
and then he free of costume and
come back and no money was exchanged.

658
00:50:22,119 --> 00:50:31,960
You know, what's the guy?
What was it? Mister Ben had the

659
00:50:31,960 --> 00:50:36,760
bowler hat I think yeah, and
he used to take it off and then

660
00:50:36,800 --> 00:50:40,280
the costume of magically appear over him. So the Egyptian connection or you know,

661
00:50:40,719 --> 00:50:46,079
make around. Yeah, so obviously
the creative mister Ben had some heteric

662
00:50:46,199 --> 00:50:52,440
knowledge. Roger Roger Hark is one
of the I think one of the greatstic

663
00:50:52,559 --> 00:50:59,760
authors. Yeah, did you know
he used to do Mister Ben. Maybe

664
00:50:59,800 --> 00:51:06,360
it's wrong Google times, but you
know it's it was a great series.

665
00:51:06,400 --> 00:51:08,480
I mean I used to love it
and it was very interesting, and it

666
00:51:08,559 --> 00:51:14,679
did have this idea of parallel world
and things like that. And maybe when

667
00:51:14,719 --> 00:51:20,000
you're talking about all these other theories
been online, like Jamie and the Magic

668
00:51:20,079 --> 00:51:22,039
Torch, Yes, that was a
that was another when he shined the torch

669
00:51:22,079 --> 00:51:24,760
and he would go down this slide
and he find himself in another world.

670
00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:30,400
And this is a recurring theme in
all all through history and in more recent

671
00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:35,440
fiction we find it. We mentioned
Stranger Things, which is a more recent

672
00:51:35,519 --> 00:51:39,159
series which has basically the same kind
of plot and involves like missing children as

673
00:51:39,199 --> 00:51:45,639
well and experiments and there's that young
girl they find who has with the short

674
00:51:45,639 --> 00:51:49,320
hair, who's been in a laboratory
horrible and things like that. Yeah,

675
00:51:50,119 --> 00:51:54,039
and it's that again ties in with
I think with the X Files and things

676
00:51:54,039 --> 00:51:59,039
like that. So I do find
it an extraordinary weird thing. I mean,

677
00:51:59,039 --> 00:52:02,440
Bob Fisher mentioned this. This goes
back into times of ancient mythology like

678
00:52:02,480 --> 00:52:07,519
it. There's this cave where in
Ireland where you go to the tiernan og

679
00:52:07,800 --> 00:52:12,280
the the the land where there's a
kind of spiritual beings is like a parallel

680
00:52:12,320 --> 00:52:15,880
universe. But there's these spiritual beings
is we we of course in we also

681
00:52:15,920 --> 00:52:22,000
have legends of the spirit world or
heaven and things like that. And the

682
00:52:22,039 --> 00:52:24,000
cave to Tian and Oak by the
way, you can visit. It's in

683
00:52:24,119 --> 00:52:28,440
County Down in Northern Ireland. If
you go in there, apparently you and

684
00:52:28,519 --> 00:52:30,960
get the tiann and Oak. But
I know a few people actually calling the

685
00:52:30,960 --> 00:52:34,760
Bob people have gone into it and
they've not found Tiann and Oag. But

686
00:52:35,119 --> 00:52:40,639
it's according to what Irish is.
The in Irish mythology is the land of

687
00:52:40,639 --> 00:52:47,800
the spirits She It's spelled it's spelled
the She, which is the spirits spiritual

688
00:52:47,840 --> 00:52:52,400
beings. Yeah, that's where the
gen is supposed to hang out in caves.

689
00:52:52,679 --> 00:52:59,119
She and the Gina very similar.
Interesting. In my research recently,

690
00:52:59,480 --> 00:53:05,480
I've been looking into Pan and the
mythology of Pan, and there's a guy

691
00:53:06,239 --> 00:53:12,599
part of Findhorn Foundation was assisted by
this man who was a scientist called Rock

692
00:53:12,679 --> 00:53:15,280
something. I forget his name,
but he encountered this little thorn creature in

693
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:20,679
Edinburgh who followed him or he followed
it or something I can't quite remember.

694
00:53:20,679 --> 00:53:24,480
And then a month later, this
same guy on one of the western arms

695
00:53:24,480 --> 00:53:29,960
of Scotland encountered Pan with another chap
and he said he grew out of the

696
00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:34,519
ground like as a monk, then
revealed his hood and he was over twenty

697
00:53:34,519 --> 00:53:37,559
five foot tall, and he said, I am Pan. Blah blah blah

698
00:53:37,599 --> 00:53:40,079
blah. You know. And apparently
when I was reading up on Pan,

699
00:53:42,239 --> 00:53:45,280
that's where the word panic comes from, because it used to be still fear

700
00:53:45,320 --> 00:53:50,360
into people the sight of seeing Pan. Hence the word panic, which I

701
00:53:50,360 --> 00:53:54,280
thought was very interesting. Talk about
synchronicity. I don't know if you ever

702
00:53:54,320 --> 00:53:59,320
listened to Ed from the Outer Light. He's also got a mirror world.

703
00:53:59,320 --> 00:54:04,760
He's got lots of different YouTube because
he keeps getting kicked off. He's a

704
00:54:05,000 --> 00:54:07,679
New Zealand guy and he's great and
this is such a coincidence, and he

705
00:54:07,760 --> 00:54:15,440
stumbled across. He loves a half
hot mum. He loves really old British

706
00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:20,679
comedies. He loves it. He's
really nostalgic. And at the end of

707
00:54:20,840 --> 00:54:24,159
two of his recent videos, he
played whispering grass, who's a singer?

708
00:54:25,320 --> 00:54:34,800
Oh this and dont honestly, well, he played that and it made me

709
00:54:34,840 --> 00:54:37,920
a little bit tearful because it's so
beautiful and you kind of forget we've got

710
00:54:37,920 --> 00:54:40,039
all this nonsense music. Now anyway, that's nothing to do with what I'm

711
00:54:40,079 --> 00:54:45,599
talking about, but it's a real
coincidence because he was talking about where did

712
00:54:46,159 --> 00:54:52,480
some one of his viewers said,
oh, that's where we get the saying

713
00:54:52,960 --> 00:54:58,280
grass or to grasp somebody up because
of this song whispering grass. Well,

714
00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:00,119
we don't know that. And he
was looking into it because of this,

715
00:55:00,280 --> 00:55:06,159
and he said that one of the
maybe we get it from Pan, the

716
00:55:06,199 --> 00:55:09,880
myth of Pan, because apparently Pan
fell in love with a beautiful woman and

717
00:55:10,760 --> 00:55:13,840
I don't know, I only heard
it this morning. That's what I Mean's

718
00:55:13,880 --> 00:55:16,719
such a coincidence, how you're talking
about Pam and the beautiful woman was for

719
00:55:16,760 --> 00:55:22,480
some reason turned into reeds of grass, and you could and you could hear

720
00:55:22,559 --> 00:55:24,400
her singing, or when the reeds
moved, you could hear her singing.

721
00:55:24,599 --> 00:55:29,360
So that's why you made his pan
pipes out of these reads. It's just

722
00:55:29,400 --> 00:55:32,880
a synchronicity, just a little synchronicity. You're bringing up Pan, And I

723
00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:37,760
literally just learned that this morning.
Very fascinating as well. Another one of

724
00:55:37,760 --> 00:55:42,719
my things from academic times is about
language and what lies within it, and

725
00:55:43,679 --> 00:55:45,800
it's so it's fascinating. I didn't
know that about Pan and Panic. So

726
00:55:45,800 --> 00:55:52,119
it's all those connections of language and
mythology and the supernaturals. There's some of

727
00:55:52,280 --> 00:55:59,119
these mysterious spiritual things within words,
you know, that hidden inside them and

728
00:55:59,559 --> 00:56:04,119
hidden me things. You know.
It's quiet, Yeah, yeah, I

729
00:56:04,159 --> 00:56:08,599
mean yeah. I've been sort of
going through through my notes and things methodically

730
00:56:08,679 --> 00:56:15,960
trying to basically improve this book that
I've got called True Tales of the Paranormal.

731
00:56:16,119 --> 00:56:20,920
And so this is why I came
across it recently about the Panic thing,

732
00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:25,239
which I thought added greatly to it. But the original tale sprung from

733
00:56:25,239 --> 00:56:30,559
a story that told me on an
aeroplane, an easy jet plane going to

734
00:56:30,559 --> 00:56:34,440
Spain about fifteen years ago now,
and he was an Iranian, but he

735
00:56:34,480 --> 00:56:37,239
said he was an architect, but
he lives in London, but he said,

736
00:56:37,239 --> 00:56:39,760
I'm from Persha. Originally, he
says, I prefer it to call

737
00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:45,360
it Persha, but you know today
as Iran. And so he said,

738
00:56:45,400 --> 00:56:50,239
what do you do. I showed
him some of my photographs of my artwork

739
00:56:50,320 --> 00:56:53,000
fairy beans and oh, your artwork
is done in by the way, Neil,

740
00:56:53,079 --> 00:56:58,679
you're thank you very much, thank
you, very good, thank you.

741
00:56:58,760 --> 00:57:00,800
So I showed him all the artwork
common phone and I ran this fairy

742
00:57:00,920 --> 00:57:05,679
museum at the time in Orkney Island, Scotland, hence the Orkney visit earlier

743
00:57:05,679 --> 00:57:08,920
that I mentioned about. And so
I said, what do you do?

744
00:57:09,000 --> 00:57:13,000
And he said, well, I'm
an architect and I'm going out to Spain

745
00:57:13,199 --> 00:57:15,320
to check on the properties that I've
been developing. So I said, oh,

746
00:57:15,360 --> 00:57:20,320
that's that's nice. So I thought
I'd start talking about some of the

747
00:57:20,440 --> 00:57:22,880
weird fairy stories that I've come across, because at the round about that time,

748
00:57:22,920 --> 00:57:28,159
I've been watching this DVD called The
Fairy Faith by a Canadian filmmaker called

749
00:57:28,239 --> 00:57:34,320
John Walker. And in The Fairy
Faith they interviewed this Glaswegian builder called Steve

750
00:57:34,360 --> 00:57:39,719
o'dale and he had gone to this
fairy hill somewhere in the Candorms, I

751
00:57:39,719 --> 00:57:43,960
think, in Scotland, on holiday
in about nineteen ninety seven, we think

752
00:57:44,000 --> 00:57:49,880
it is. And he said that
he was just looking at the rainbow forming

753
00:57:49,920 --> 00:57:52,239
over the valley and thinking what a
lovely view it was, because it just

754
00:57:52,239 --> 00:57:57,360
stopped raining and the sun was coming
out from behind the clouds and the rainbows

755
00:57:57,400 --> 00:58:00,760
forming over the valley, and he
thought, oh, that's absolutely But he

756
00:58:00,800 --> 00:58:05,000
said, the whole time his peripheral
vision of something down by his feet,

757
00:58:05,039 --> 00:58:07,480
and it was annoying him. But
he thought, now I'm going to carry

758
00:58:07,480 --> 00:58:10,880
on looking at this lovely view opening
up before me, with this beautiful panorama

759
00:58:10,920 --> 00:58:15,280
of the valley. But all the
time that annoying thing was down by his

760
00:58:15,320 --> 00:58:17,880
feet. So he thought, what
is that? And you see what it

761
00:58:19,000 --> 00:58:21,880
was? And he said he saw
this woman about sort of so high it

762
00:58:21,960 --> 00:58:24,480
maybe a meter made a cuple of
feet and I'm quite sure, brown leathery

763
00:58:24,559 --> 00:58:29,440
looking skin, and a sort of
a small brown hat pointing up. And

764
00:58:29,519 --> 00:58:32,559
he said she had an old pair
of sort of sheep shears. And he

765
00:58:32,599 --> 00:58:37,679
said that she was cutting around the
sole of his shoe. And he said,

766
00:58:37,719 --> 00:58:43,880
where his shadow extended in the afternoon
sun, where his shadow stopped,

767
00:58:44,039 --> 00:58:49,599
he said, was the male equivalent
of this brown being lady, probably a

768
00:58:49,639 --> 00:58:52,960
similar height. And he said that
he was rolling up this guy's shadow like

769
00:58:53,159 --> 00:58:58,360
paper in the creeps. Yeah,
rolling out the shadowy paper. And he

770
00:58:58,400 --> 00:59:00,960
said, he said he didn't know
what to think. Of course, you

771
00:59:00,039 --> 00:59:07,920
don't, do you say I as
he looked at the pot, and he

772
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:13,199
said, they looked at each other
in absolute surprise, thinking, oh my

773
00:59:13,239 --> 00:59:15,719
god, he can see us,
and he went they vanished, and he

774
00:59:15,800 --> 00:59:21,800
said, I dread to think what
would have happened had I not seen them?

775
00:59:22,079 --> 00:59:27,119
And it devides kind of physics about
a their disappearance from start. Physics

776
00:59:27,119 --> 00:59:30,599
doesn't allow that kind of thing in
conventional physics. But when you're rolling up

777
00:59:30,599 --> 00:59:36,960
a shadow anyway, that's even beyond
that. And maybe that is the physics.

778
00:59:37,000 --> 00:59:39,000
And he just happened to Yeah,
maybe he was in their dimension.

779
00:59:40,320 --> 00:59:45,480
I thought about the risk. I
told this to the the Iranian guy on

780
00:59:45,559 --> 00:59:46,760
the plane with me, and that's
what I'm going to lead to. But

781
00:59:46,800 --> 00:59:50,320
I'll just tell you this before we
get to the Ranian guy on the plane,

782
00:59:50,440 --> 00:59:53,880
because he tells me an equally interesting
story. Well are they gone?

783
00:59:54,079 --> 00:59:59,960
Are you? We can still see
you? But we've still okay, that's

784
01:00:00,000 --> 01:00:01,559
that's right. But as long as
you can steal him, that's fine.

785
01:00:04,239 --> 01:00:08,559
So basically I was analyzing this store
and thinking, okay, it just rained

786
01:00:08,679 --> 01:00:12,960
and the sun had started to come
out, which then I thought about it.

787
01:00:13,000 --> 01:00:16,679
I thought those begins were there to
steal his shadow. That shadow wouldn't

788
01:00:16,679 --> 01:00:21,599
have formed until the sun had come
out and made a nice crisp shadow on

789
01:00:21,639 --> 01:00:24,440
the ground. So therefore I think
there must have been laying in wait somewhere,

790
01:00:24,960 --> 01:00:29,320
waiting for that sun to come out, waiting for that rainbow, and

791
01:00:29,400 --> 01:00:32,559
then striking literally while the iron is
hot. And you don't talk about iron

792
01:00:32,559 --> 01:00:37,599
to berries because they don't like it. But I told this. I told

793
01:00:37,599 --> 01:00:38,880
this story to the guy on the
plane with me, and I said,

794
01:00:38,880 --> 01:00:42,360
oh, I saw this really freaky, you know story, and he sort

795
01:00:42,360 --> 01:00:45,679
of said, oh, that's very
interesting. Pun Up, he kind of

796
01:00:45,719 --> 01:00:49,960
decided that maybe I should be the
guy to tell because he said many years

797
01:00:50,000 --> 01:00:52,719
ago, when he was in Iran, he was conscripted into the Iranian Army,

798
01:00:53,159 --> 01:00:59,400
and I had put this probably about
the mid mid seventies, maybe early

799
01:00:59,440 --> 01:01:00,800
eighties, not really sure. He
never told me the date, but he

800
01:01:00,800 --> 01:01:05,719
said he was patrolling the streets at
the night with an army buddy he said,

801
01:01:05,719 --> 01:01:08,159
a sandstorm kicked up one night,
and he said they both decided to

802
01:01:08,199 --> 01:01:12,840
seek shelter in a mosque. So
they went into this mosque, and he

803
01:01:12,880 --> 01:01:15,400
said to his army buddy, right, you lay down and go to sleep.

804
01:01:15,840 --> 01:01:19,440
And you know, you take your
shoes off in a mosque, by

805
01:01:19,480 --> 01:01:21,239
the way, and for those that
don't know, so they all took their

806
01:01:21,280 --> 01:01:22,159
shoes off, and he said to
his body, you lay down and go

807
01:01:22,239 --> 01:01:25,079
to sleep, and I'll sit by
the wall, and I've got the gun,

808
01:01:25,119 --> 01:01:28,800
and I'll keep an eye out for
any trouble. So he goes okay,

809
01:01:29,559 --> 01:01:31,719
and this guy I called him Hussein. He said, he sat with

810
01:01:31,800 --> 01:01:35,960
his back to the wall with his
gun. And now how hard he tried

811
01:01:35,960 --> 01:01:38,320
to stay awake, he kept falling
asleep, and he nodded off and thought,

812
01:01:38,760 --> 01:01:40,719
oh, I must wake up.
I must wake up. And he

813
01:01:40,800 --> 01:01:44,159
nodded off again, and he said, oh my god, I must wake

814
01:01:44,239 --> 01:01:45,880
up. I must wake up.
And for three times he nodded off and

815
01:01:45,920 --> 01:01:50,480
woke up. And then the third
time he woke up, he was suddenly

816
01:01:51,480 --> 01:01:58,320
startled to see two people crouching down
looking at his feet and looking at his

817
01:01:58,360 --> 01:02:01,679
friend's feet. It was a lady
and it's also a young girl who he

818
01:02:01,760 --> 01:02:06,559
thought to be about eight nine or
ten. And they were both crouching down,

819
01:02:06,639 --> 01:02:09,280
staring intently at their feet, and
he thought, where the hell did

820
01:02:09,280 --> 01:02:14,679
these people come from? So he
said he started to press his elbow on

821
01:02:14,800 --> 01:02:17,559
his mate's chest to try and wake
him up surreptitiously. And he said,

822
01:02:17,599 --> 01:02:22,440
no matter how hard he pressed on
his mate's chest with his elbow, his

823
01:02:22,599 --> 01:02:27,519
mate waking up. So Hussein said, I thought I was going to make

824
01:02:27,519 --> 01:02:29,840
her run for it, he said, And I don't understand why he was

825
01:02:29,840 --> 01:02:30,760
going to make a run for it, because he was the guy with a

826
01:02:30,800 --> 01:02:34,440
gun. So he said, he
started to wrap the strap of the gun

827
01:02:34,480 --> 01:02:37,159
around him so it went swing as
he ran. And he said that must

828
01:02:37,199 --> 01:02:42,840
have alerted this lady because she suddenly
looked up from looking at his feet and

829
01:02:42,880 --> 01:02:44,760
looked at him in the eye.
And he said, as soon as I

830
01:02:44,800 --> 01:02:47,119
stared at her in the eye and
we made eye contact, he said,

831
01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:52,199
I instantly knew that she was not
from this world. There was something that

832
01:02:52,239 --> 01:02:54,800
just clicked. I know that she's
not from this world. And he said

833
01:02:55,039 --> 01:02:59,559
with that, they both stood up
and turned and walked away. He said,

834
01:02:59,599 --> 01:03:02,400
now as they walked away. He
said he noticed they both had cloven

835
01:03:02,480 --> 01:03:07,800
hoofed feet, and they vanished into
the wall of the mosque. And when

836
01:03:07,840 --> 01:03:09,480
he told me that, when he
told me that, that sent shiver up

837
01:03:09,519 --> 01:03:15,920
and down my spine, I thought, oh my god. Wow, the

838
01:03:15,920 --> 01:03:19,599
connection with the other story, it's
amazing. Yah. Yeah, yeah,

839
01:03:19,599 --> 01:03:22,599
And it makes you wonder that again, where these legends come from. So

840
01:03:22,760 --> 01:03:27,760
the whole idea of that these clothing
hoof beings that we have in legends,

841
01:03:28,159 --> 01:03:31,679
maybe they're to them. And the
fact that it's come through the wall of

842
01:03:31,719 --> 01:03:35,199
a moss, which is a place
where you prayer, you might send out

843
01:03:35,320 --> 01:03:38,440
energy or create kind of thought bombs
or something with your mind, and it

844
01:03:38,519 --> 01:03:43,280
creates like a portal. I don't
know, but something happened to them to

845
01:03:43,320 --> 01:03:45,880
come through and kind of engage with
him to a certain extent. And the

846
01:03:45,920 --> 01:03:50,159
weird thing is about it. You
kind of realize now why they were staring

847
01:03:50,159 --> 01:03:52,960
at their feet, because to them, the human feet were the oddity.

848
01:03:54,760 --> 01:04:01,920
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah,
thank you. I think we're about to

849
01:04:02,000 --> 01:04:05,519
take a break here now on the
Paranormal Peep Show. So we've just come

850
01:04:05,679 --> 01:04:12,599
past the hour, and so we're
talking to the crafty Nihilists. That's Mark

851
01:04:12,639 --> 01:04:16,519
and Liz Froud and we have our
guest host presenter which is ben Emlyn Jones.

852
01:04:16,880 --> 01:04:21,119
So join us in Part two.
Stay tuned for more of the interesting

853
01:04:21,360 --> 01:04:27,039
chat about all things weird and strange
on the Paranormal Peep Show. In just

854
01:04:27,119 --> 01:04:33,480
a minute, the day's the best
day made life listening to the Paranormal UK

855
01:04:33,760 --> 01:04:40,199
readio Network. Join Andrew o' neil
every month on the Paranoral Peep Show,

856
01:04:40,400 --> 01:04:44,920
part of the Paranoral UK Radio Network
for fun, frolics and lots of information

857
01:04:45,320 --> 01:04:49,000
about weird stuff, UFOs, ghosts
and things that go bump in the night

858
01:04:49,079 --> 01:04:54,719
and everything associated with them. Fascinating
guests, fascinating talk, fascinating information.

859
01:04:58,239 --> 01:05:02,320
Hi, welcome to para more peep
Show. The part two section that is

860
01:05:02,400 --> 01:05:06,480
This is Neil Ward and I'm enjoyed
with ben Emlyn Jones and we've also got

861
01:05:06,559 --> 01:05:11,719
Marke and Liz Froud otherwise known as
the Crafty nine List. So in part

862
01:05:11,760 --> 01:05:14,480
one we were talking about all things
strange, but that is the thing.

863
01:05:14,519 --> 01:05:16,880
We are a strange show, so
we talk about strange things like weird ghosts

864
01:05:17,159 --> 01:05:21,800
and cern projects and weird tunnels.
And now we're going to move on to

865
01:05:23,159 --> 01:05:28,519
more about Mark and Lizz's personal experiences
of the paranormal. So, guys,

866
01:05:29,519 --> 01:05:32,039
I know you've both talked about it
in emails to me about your kind of

867
01:05:32,440 --> 01:05:36,440
weird ghost of the experiences where you've
kind of felt yourself frozen and you've seen

868
01:05:36,519 --> 01:05:41,119
beans in the room. I think, if I'm I'm saying correctly, you

869
01:05:41,199 --> 01:05:46,239
both had those experiences yourself, but
on separate occasions. Yeah, so you've

870
01:05:46,239 --> 01:05:50,559
had a couple, aren't you,
babe. Yeah, probably less than Liz.

871
01:05:50,840 --> 01:05:56,599
I'd count myself maybe as being a
less intuitive person than Liz. But

872
01:05:58,360 --> 01:06:00,880
before I met her, I did
have the experience. I think it was

873
01:06:00,880 --> 01:06:02,880
one of these times I think I
was a bit stressed. It was when

874
01:06:02,880 --> 01:06:09,039
I was in exams or something like
that university, something that seemed to be

875
01:06:09,400 --> 01:06:15,920
quite being quite stressed, and it
was sort of a classic I was lying

876
01:06:15,920 --> 01:06:19,199
in bed, and I don't think
I was asleep dreaming. I think I

877
01:06:19,239 --> 01:06:29,760
was in a sort of semi conscious
or almost a dark figure standing at the

878
01:06:30,000 --> 01:06:35,239
at the bed, and it seemed
very real and I certainly had a moment

879
01:06:35,280 --> 01:06:40,639
of fear, and I felt this
sensation as if it was going to drag

880
01:06:40,679 --> 01:06:45,480
it drag me towards him or towards
it, but it was only a very

881
01:06:45,480 --> 01:06:50,559
brief experience, and I just sort
of said to myself, you're not real,

882
01:06:50,920 --> 01:06:54,400
You're the real you know, get
out of my head type thing,

883
01:06:54,559 --> 01:07:00,760
and it just went. And you
know, so it was one of these

884
01:07:00,800 --> 01:07:06,639
things that I almost forgot about,
but it certainly did seem very real,

885
01:07:06,880 --> 01:07:14,000
and it certainly was more than a
dream. But you know, it's got

886
01:07:14,159 --> 01:07:20,760
quite a rare experience for me.
And then just just not that long ago,

887
01:07:20,920 --> 01:07:28,280
when I was with Liz and I
just sort of went to sort of

888
01:07:28,440 --> 01:07:32,079
turn over to sort of say something
to her and just study out the corner

889
01:07:32,079 --> 01:07:35,719
of my eyes, is that there
was a dark just to the side of

890
01:07:35,719 --> 01:07:41,360
me that was turning at the same
time as me and just almost like well

891
01:07:41,440 --> 01:07:45,960
literally shadowing me. And again it
was a blink of the eye and it

892
01:07:45,039 --> 01:07:50,559
was gone. But it was just
very unsettling, this idea of something else,

893
01:07:50,719 --> 01:07:56,559
some other level of reality. You
know, did you get any kind

894
01:07:56,559 --> 01:08:01,400
of impressions from that second experience of
the I don't know you felt any telepathic

895
01:08:01,400 --> 01:08:08,679
communication there or anything. No,
nothing like that. It was really very

896
01:08:08,719 --> 01:08:13,920
much exactly like a blink of an
eye. But I must say my most

897
01:08:14,360 --> 01:08:18,960
esoteric experience, which I again I
sort of folded my memory banks. But

898
01:08:20,880 --> 01:08:25,199
it wasn't long after me and this
got together, but we'd been to Avebury

899
01:08:26,840 --> 01:08:31,039
and we came back to the house
and we were just sort of, I

900
01:08:31,039 --> 01:08:34,520
suppose, trying to be a bit
spiritual and get candle lights in and sort

901
01:08:34,520 --> 01:08:40,479
of almost sort of charming or trying
to speak in tongue sort of thing.

902
01:08:40,560 --> 01:08:43,760
And it's something I've never done before, but it was trying to maybe open

903
01:08:43,800 --> 01:08:47,039
this up inside of me because I
was saying that and I believed that there

904
01:08:47,119 --> 01:08:54,600
was more than the material. I
hadn't actually felt it, and something came

905
01:08:54,640 --> 01:09:00,600
through and it was like it wasn't. I just started how he's like a

906
01:09:00,640 --> 01:09:09,039
dog just sort of almost like arcing
at the moon type thing, and it

907
01:09:09,119 --> 01:09:11,640
was again it wasn't. It was
very short lived, and then I was

908
01:09:11,680 --> 01:09:15,000
just sort of panting it just sort
of to my breath away. And we

909
01:09:15,079 --> 01:09:18,880
had a dog at the time,
departed Frodo, bless him, and he

910
01:09:18,960 --> 01:09:25,399
sort of jumped up and was looking
at me like a another another dog that

911
01:09:25,479 --> 01:09:30,039
I had sort of turned into.
It was it was just again a very

912
01:09:30,039 --> 01:09:34,079
brief experience. But it was like, I can't say that I felt something

913
01:09:34,079 --> 01:09:39,880
coming through me or anything like that, but I just suddenly started howling like

914
01:09:39,960 --> 01:09:45,239
a dog. Just it. Something
made me do that, which never had

915
01:09:45,279 --> 01:09:48,439
anything Mark Mark. That's not I'm
not used to howling like a dog.

916
01:09:48,520 --> 01:09:55,520
If I started doing that, you'd
be like, it's something I guess.

917
01:09:55,520 --> 01:10:00,520
I I don't know what it is. Although again, even before my more

918
01:10:00,560 --> 01:10:05,439
recent awakeness, I did believe that
there was more to life, and I

919
01:10:05,479 --> 01:10:12,119
was certainly interested in the paranormal.
So it wasn't that I was skeptical or

920
01:10:12,159 --> 01:10:16,279
disputed that that was ever a thing, but I didn't intuitively feel it.

921
01:10:17,119 --> 01:10:21,000
We sort of put it into the
academic brain and maybe overthinking, didn't we.

922
01:10:21,520 --> 01:10:25,960
Yeah, maybe that is it,
and maybe just a fear of letting

923
01:10:26,000 --> 01:10:29,479
go, you know, whether that's
emotionally or spirit let me go in that

924
01:10:29,560 --> 01:10:31,479
moment. Yeah, And then that
happened, isn't it. Yeah? And

925
01:10:32,119 --> 01:10:35,760
partly as I say, we'd been
to abury and I don't know, it

926
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:41,680
was just an emotional time and and
go into a new phase of my life,

927
01:10:41,680 --> 01:10:45,319
I suppose with Liz and something,
things were opening up very you know,

928
01:10:45,359 --> 01:10:50,720
in a different ways. Spiritually and
emotionally and intellectually as well, but

929
01:10:50,840 --> 01:10:58,159
just a different kind of intellect.
You know, you need to it's important

930
01:10:58,199 --> 01:11:01,880
to have those different sides too,
you know, rather than just reading something

931
01:11:01,880 --> 01:11:06,319
in a book, to actually get
a personal connection with something that's something like,

932
01:11:08,159 --> 01:11:12,399
Yeah, I mean you could see
it from all sorts of angles.

933
01:11:12,399 --> 01:11:15,079
You might psychoanalysts might see it as
some sort of ole. Yeah, you're

934
01:11:15,600 --> 01:11:21,439
opening up another aspect of the self, the subconscious, the ego has created

935
01:11:21,479 --> 01:11:26,199
a personality or something like that.
All these weird theories that come out with

936
01:11:26,359 --> 01:11:31,119
but whatever it is, it's not
your everyday thinking, acting self that you

937
01:11:31,159 --> 01:11:35,239
know, walks and talks and does
the things that you need to do.

938
01:11:36,720 --> 01:11:41,720
But it's also like in the dream
part of ourselves. When we're in a

939
01:11:41,800 --> 01:11:45,680
dream, we're not really unless you're
one of those clever people that can do

940
01:11:45,760 --> 01:11:47,880
the waking within a dream thing,
you know, the lucid dream. I've

941
01:11:47,880 --> 01:11:54,000
occasionally stumbled into it, into that
kind of thing. But you know,

942
01:11:54,000 --> 01:11:59,720
when you're in a dream, you're
completely different scenario, walking and talking and

943
01:11:59,760 --> 01:12:02,760
meet people from your distant past,
not even thinking about the fact that you

944
01:12:02,800 --> 01:12:05,880
don't see these people anymore. But
they're popping up in dreams as a character,

945
01:12:06,439 --> 01:12:12,439
you're interacting with them, and you
accept that when you wake up and

946
01:12:12,479 --> 01:12:15,359
you look back at your dream and
self, well, that's just a dream.

947
01:12:15,359 --> 01:12:18,239
But it's still an acknowledgement. It's
still a characterization of yourself in some

948
01:12:18,479 --> 01:12:23,760
part, although it's framed on the
inner network of your being rather than the

949
01:12:23,760 --> 01:12:28,439
outer network of your being. But
it's still a very valid kind of personality.

950
01:12:28,479 --> 01:12:31,319
If you like that constructs itself,
even if it's on a temporary basis,

951
01:12:31,640 --> 01:12:36,239
to navigate its way around the psycho
your mind. If you like,

952
01:12:36,319 --> 01:12:41,640
you know, doing your shadow work, think, yeah, so what's the

953
01:12:41,680 --> 01:12:44,560
shadow work? Is this where you
face it's the darker side of yourself in

954
01:12:44,600 --> 01:12:47,720
some sort of Freudian world or something. Yeah, well it's more yunni and

955
01:12:47,760 --> 01:12:55,319
than Freudian. But have you ever
seen the film Fight Club? No?

956
01:12:55,399 --> 01:12:59,359
I haven't. No, Oh,
Neil, you need to watch that.

957
01:12:59,359 --> 01:13:02,960
That is BA basically all about somebody
doing their shadow work. I can't actually

958
01:13:02,960 --> 01:13:08,479
tell you because it's big spoiler alert. But yeah, he confronts his shadow,

959
01:13:08,520 --> 01:13:12,560
I would say, And I think
we're all constantly trying to do that.

960
01:13:12,840 --> 01:13:15,920
Well, maybe some of us are
repressing it. But I think if

961
01:13:15,920 --> 01:13:19,039
you repress it, maybe that is
when it comes out potentially this sceral way

962
01:13:19,119 --> 01:13:25,880
like that like it did for Mark. Maybe I don't know, Yeah,

963
01:13:26,399 --> 01:13:30,039
yeah, I think so. So
much of what we you know, we've

964
01:13:30,079 --> 01:13:34,079
talked to recently on our channel about
it seems like with the way they're doing

965
01:13:34,159 --> 01:13:40,640
the modern world with the media and
that it's like they're making the shadow the

966
01:13:40,760 --> 01:13:44,039
hero. And you've got so much
of these things that are in Hollywood and

967
01:13:44,960 --> 01:13:50,439
TV, Internet, and it's it's
making the dark side as if that is

968
01:13:50,800 --> 01:13:57,000
the thing to be admired and the
way to be. But that to me

969
01:13:57,159 --> 01:14:00,600
is a perversion of twisted idea of
doing your shadow work is actually making the

970
01:14:00,640 --> 01:14:03,359
shadow take over. So the whole
you know, when we were talking about,

971
01:14:03,439 --> 01:14:08,680
well, the crafty nihilist is kind
of me doing a shadow work.

972
01:14:08,720 --> 01:14:13,000
It's accepting that nihilistic part of me
and kind of integrating it in a positive

973
01:14:13,039 --> 01:14:15,279
way, like with my creativity.
So the light in the dark, but

974
01:14:15,359 --> 01:14:19,039
in our logo it's balanced. But
like Mark says, you know, Superman

975
01:14:19,159 --> 01:14:21,720
used to be a good guy.
Batman used to be a good guys kind

976
01:14:21,720 --> 01:14:26,359
of a bit of a scary bad
guy. These days, you know,

977
01:14:26,439 --> 01:14:29,439
and it's almost like, Okay,
we've integrated the shadow. I know,

978
01:14:29,720 --> 01:14:31,880
let's make the shadow a hero,
and it's not supposed to be like that's

979
01:14:31,880 --> 01:14:35,720
supposed to be an integration of both
light and dark. In my opinion,

980
01:14:35,840 --> 01:14:42,560
yeah, absolutely, as far as
you're as far as where you describe the

981
01:14:42,560 --> 01:14:46,600
beginning mark, this I think is
a very obvious case of sleep paralysis.

982
01:14:47,359 --> 01:14:51,399
I know that because I experienced it
too. I actually I think I have

983
01:14:51,439 --> 01:14:56,079
spiritual sleep prices, probably about maybe
once a fortnight. It's quite commone.

984
01:14:56,119 --> 01:14:59,880
Usually when I'm in a shallow sleep, like maybe if I wake up then

985
01:15:00,279 --> 01:15:01,479
in the morning and go back to
sleep for a little bit before my love

986
01:15:01,520 --> 01:15:08,840
goes excuse me, don't go into
it now, Ben, No, But

987
01:15:10,159 --> 01:15:15,159
I often I'll wake up and I
am like completely completely I can't move tall.

988
01:15:15,279 --> 01:15:18,439
I'm just completely paralyzed apart from my
eyes. Ben, you get a

989
01:15:18,479 --> 01:15:21,039
little bit. No, it's about
it, No, because it's something I've

990
01:15:21,039 --> 01:15:26,359
had my whole life. I know
people who experience it just like it's suddenly

991
01:15:26,680 --> 01:15:30,760
it's something something happens spontaneously, just
a one off in their life, and

992
01:15:30,800 --> 01:15:34,119
it's it's terrifying for those people.
But for me, I know what to

993
01:15:34,159 --> 01:15:36,840
do. I just I just lie
there for a bit and eventually wears off.

994
01:15:38,600 --> 01:15:41,039
And while I'm I'm in sleeper and
I just like hope my eyes look

995
01:15:41,079 --> 01:15:44,960
around me and everything just looks as
it does normally. But to every short

996
01:15:45,399 --> 01:15:48,479
it's only happened a handful of times. I do see beings in the room

997
01:15:48,520 --> 01:15:55,800
with me. One of them is
a is a is a humanoid being with

998
01:15:56,399 --> 01:15:59,880
a bleak black cowl like the Ring
raiths in The Lord of the Ring.

999
01:16:00,000 --> 01:16:03,439
And it just stood by my bed
and just looked him. I couldn't see

1000
01:16:03,439 --> 01:16:09,119
his face because it was covered in
this hood, but I got the sense

1001
01:16:09,119 --> 01:16:13,640
it was just standing there looking at
me. There's another instance where I saw

1002
01:16:14,760 --> 01:16:17,960
a strange, old Chinese looking woman
with a big, big buns in her

1003
01:16:18,000 --> 01:16:24,039
hair and like pins in the buns, and who saw wearing a scruffy blue

1004
01:16:24,079 --> 01:16:26,920
dress, and she was leaning over
like that and shivering and all like that.

1005
01:16:27,000 --> 01:16:29,520
You know. Funnily enough, I
was actually lying it. I was

1006
01:16:29,600 --> 01:16:31,720
lying in this bed. It was
daytime, and I was lying in the

1007
01:16:31,760 --> 01:16:33,920
bed, and my partner was beside
me, and my partner of the time

1008
01:16:34,039 --> 01:16:38,720
was beside me, and I remember
I was lying there with sleep passes,

1009
01:16:38,760 --> 01:16:43,000
but I just managed to get words
out to alert her, saying so so

1010
01:16:44,239 --> 01:16:47,520
true, like that I could I
could hear myself like calling her name and

1011
01:16:48,079 --> 01:16:50,800
what Hannimal was. I eventually woke
up and the appression disappeared. As soon

1012
01:16:50,800 --> 01:16:53,800
as I woke up and I asked
Sue, I said that, did you

1013
01:16:53,800 --> 01:16:56,880
hear me calling you? She's no, you were completely silent. You were

1014
01:16:56,880 --> 01:17:03,279
asleep. The the strange thing about
sleep paralysis is that it's it's the skeptic

1015
01:17:03,520 --> 01:17:09,119
explanation is simply an effect of our
brain, because we do actually have a

1016
01:17:09,159 --> 01:17:12,960
mechanism that paralyzes our bodies. A
chemical is released by the brain that paralyzes

1017
01:17:13,000 --> 01:17:15,079
our bodies when we're asleep. If
we didn't do that, we'd act out

1018
01:17:15,119 --> 01:17:20,000
our dreams. So people exact where
that chemical fails. That's when you get

1019
01:17:20,039 --> 01:17:26,000
somnambulism, people walking in their sleep. Now I used to agree with that,

1020
01:17:26,159 --> 01:17:30,000
No, it's good, that's sascaria, But yeah I was, But

1021
01:17:30,119 --> 01:17:34,159
I was like, just what you'll
find is that the skeptics say, well,

1022
01:17:34,159 --> 01:17:38,560
this is just basically a dream.
You are dreaming what you experienced,

1023
01:17:38,560 --> 01:17:41,920
your sleep paralysis. Your eyes can
open but you see, you're still dreaming,

1024
01:17:41,920 --> 01:17:45,079
and that's what you see. You
see the beings. But the strange

1025
01:17:45,079 --> 01:17:49,239
thing is these beings you get that
the cow figure, the hat man.

1026
01:17:49,239 --> 01:17:53,039
They're the big dark, showy man
with a big broad brimmed hat. The

1027
01:17:53,079 --> 01:17:58,840
old Hag who's an incredibly ugly and
foul, nasty old woman with a big

1028
01:17:58,880 --> 01:18:04,239
scruffy dress and very ugly ragged dressed, point big broad brind pointed hat,

1029
01:18:04,479 --> 01:18:10,680
which is interestingly as the Hollywood meme
of the witch suse I find very interesting

1030
01:18:10,920 --> 01:18:15,119
in films like Wisdom was As,
I find very interesting that one is actually

1031
01:18:15,159 --> 01:18:18,640
sometimes quite violent. It'll sit on
you and try to suffocate you, sometimes

1032
01:18:18,720 --> 01:18:23,239
sexually abuse you, things like that. Most of them, you know,

1033
01:18:23,359 --> 01:18:26,800
sometimes some of them are quite nasty, these beings. But if they're dreams,

1034
01:18:26,800 --> 01:18:29,000
you got to ask yourself the question
is you know these these are not

1035
01:18:29,119 --> 01:18:31,920
figures that appear in most people's dreams
all the time. Yet they do appear

1036
01:18:32,119 --> 01:18:38,319
very regularly onong people who are sleep
paralysis. They also appear from people of

1037
01:18:38,520 --> 01:18:45,119
very very different racial, cultural,
and geobiographic backgrounds. So basically everyone from

1038
01:18:45,199 --> 01:18:50,800
Nottinghaman to Namibia, from Arizona to
Australia will tend to see the same beings

1039
01:18:50,840 --> 01:18:56,520
when they're in a sleep paracess situation. There's only two explanations therefore. The

1040
01:18:56,560 --> 01:19:00,399
first one is that our brained,
every human brain in the world, despite

1041
01:19:00,439 --> 01:19:02,800
you know, very very different backgrounds, Like I said, in terms of

1042
01:19:02,840 --> 01:19:09,720
a race, culture, geography,
environment, every single human brain on Earth

1043
01:19:09,920 --> 01:19:15,880
is hardwire to produce certain images under
certain states of consciousness, which is in

1044
01:19:15,960 --> 01:19:20,239
South takes fantastic explanation. The only
other alternative is what people are seeing is

1045
01:19:20,239 --> 01:19:26,359
objectively real. It's not coming from
inside our brains. It's coming from outside

1046
01:19:26,760 --> 01:19:30,319
our brains, and that to me
makes more sense. It's much more likely,

1047
01:19:30,800 --> 01:19:33,439
which is it's an extraordinary concept,
but I think it's quite likely it

1048
01:19:33,560 --> 01:19:36,680
is true. It's interesting because so
that's something Mark and I have in common.

1049
01:19:39,039 --> 01:19:45,079
I'm interested about the idea about there
being a connection that people share,

1050
01:19:45,520 --> 01:19:49,720
humanity shares because I'm interested in this
idea that the sort of Joseph Campbell idea

1051
01:19:49,760 --> 01:19:57,399
of the common connections of mythologies from
all different disparate cultures and across you know,

1052
01:19:57,600 --> 01:20:00,720
centuries all over the world, where
they've got these bithhological themes that go

1053
01:20:01,840 --> 01:20:05,880
that that seem to follow all these
different different cultures have these same themes in

1054
01:20:05,920 --> 01:20:13,079
their stories, so that I'm wondering
that you know the same thing with these

1055
01:20:13,119 --> 01:20:15,920
images that are in sweep paralysis and
that sort of thing, whether there is

1056
01:20:15,960 --> 01:20:19,520
some sort of common links you know, and where that where that comes from?

1057
01:20:19,600 --> 01:20:25,119
I don't know where, but but
it could because you would say the

1058
01:20:25,119 --> 01:20:30,119
same. The same actually applies to
aliens actually the beings people meet who when

1059
01:20:30,119 --> 01:20:34,039
the experienced alien abductions. The difference
being is the the the extra trashles clearly

1060
01:20:34,079 --> 01:20:38,800
have an obvious physical presence. They
leave footprints behind, things like that.

1061
01:20:39,359 --> 01:20:43,479
They kind of they leave behind a
corpse when they die, other things like

1062
01:20:43,520 --> 01:20:46,800
that. But usually you've got the
same people from right across the world.

1063
01:20:46,880 --> 01:20:51,800
Regardless of your which country you come
from, you tend to see the same

1064
01:20:51,840 --> 01:20:58,880
beings when you have a et concept. M now with with you talking about

1065
01:20:58,880 --> 01:21:04,279
the the old hag and happens to
people all across the world. I'm just

1066
01:21:04,359 --> 01:21:08,560
wondering, for instance, if you
are an old hag, like in your

1067
01:21:08,560 --> 01:21:13,359
eighties and you're having a dream,
do you still have your hag? It's

1068
01:21:13,399 --> 01:21:18,279
scared because it might be like,
oh, it's my sister. Yeah,

1069
01:21:19,359 --> 01:21:28,359
slightly confusing, you know you do? Yeah, you don't know good today,

1070
01:21:28,399 --> 01:21:31,439
do you? You know? I
don't find it fascinating actually where Hollywood

1071
01:21:31,439 --> 01:21:35,479
gets his ideas from, because this
is the this is the classic Hollywood witch,

1072
01:21:36,119 --> 01:21:39,560
and you get it in all all, but not just Wizard of Ours.

1073
01:21:39,840 --> 01:21:43,279
It appears in other films. It
appears in the in the cartoons of

1074
01:21:43,399 --> 01:21:48,960
various MGM cartoons and things like that, and the Warner Brothers cartoons. The

1075
01:21:49,840 --> 01:21:56,279
horrible old lady, ragged dress,
ugly line, crooked face, big broad

1076
01:21:56,279 --> 01:22:00,199
brimmed hats. Where as they go
next door. I'm sure we all know

1077
01:22:00,279 --> 01:22:04,760
someone really like that. But these
are the hag tends to be associated with

1078
01:22:04,880 --> 01:22:08,920
very unpleasant experiences now, people who
have sleep prices. So I mean,

1079
01:22:08,960 --> 01:22:12,800
I'm lucky. I've never felt threatened
by any of the beings I'm meeting my

1080
01:22:12,880 --> 01:22:17,039
sleep prialysis. But other people are
creatures will come and sit on you.

1081
01:22:17,319 --> 01:22:19,880
There's this famous painting, it's called
the Nightmare. Actual, it's the famous

1082
01:22:19,880 --> 01:22:24,920
painting a woman lying in bed and
there's this horrible, hunched creature sitting on

1083
01:22:24,960 --> 01:22:28,239
top of her chest. And I
mean, well she saw lying in bed,

1084
01:22:28,279 --> 01:22:30,960
but as our heads hanging off like
that, which you're going to sleep

1085
01:22:30,960 --> 01:22:35,039
in that position. You're asking for
troubles. But is that who who made

1086
01:22:35,079 --> 01:22:40,920
it? Who made painting? Maybe
that's a that's a often happens. People

1087
01:22:40,920 --> 01:22:45,239
who who often report the hag will
come and sit on their chests and the

1088
01:22:45,279 --> 01:22:49,720
hag is will have trouble breathing.
I start gasping. The Hag's very heavy.

1089
01:22:50,159 --> 01:22:57,840
Also that this is the experiences have
been very very Yeah, I get

1090
01:22:57,239 --> 01:23:04,039
sweet paralysis, but I get absolutely
terrifying sleep paralysis. But it's really interesting.

1091
01:23:04,880 --> 01:23:08,560
I don't mean to interrupt you,
Ben, do you want to I'm

1092
01:23:08,560 --> 01:23:12,760
just going to say this creacial sometimes
sometimes the or sexual abuse as well.

1093
01:23:13,600 --> 01:23:15,680
This crusure will essentially rape you.
I mean, whether you're a woman or

1094
01:23:15,680 --> 01:23:21,560
a man. She's not fussy,
it's it's these are kind of thing I

1095
01:23:21,720 --> 01:23:26,359
don't want you want to give any
details of your experiences. List just understandable

1096
01:23:26,399 --> 01:23:32,039
she does. So I've had three. I've had loads of sleep paralysis,

1097
01:23:32,119 --> 01:23:38,920
but there's been three really terrified,
really terrifying ones. So the first one

1098
01:23:39,199 --> 01:23:43,520
kind of relates to what we were
talking about earlier and where I lived,

1099
01:23:43,560 --> 01:23:45,800
so Box Tunnel, so many years
ago, when I was with my ex

1100
01:23:45,880 --> 01:23:50,359
husband and the kids were little.
We're talking twenty odd years ago. We

1101
01:23:50,479 --> 01:23:54,279
bought a new tent, like an
eight man tent because we're going to go

1102
01:23:54,399 --> 01:23:58,079
camping. So we set it up
in the garden in box, which is

1103
01:23:58,239 --> 01:24:01,319
right next to is this closers.
You can get to box tunnel as you'd

1104
01:24:01,359 --> 01:24:04,680
want to get to be honest,
And so we set the tent up like

1105
01:24:04,760 --> 01:24:08,000
you do, just to see if
you can set it up. And then

1106
01:24:08,000 --> 01:24:11,680
the kids wanted to sleep near that
night, so me and my ex husband

1107
01:24:11,720 --> 01:24:14,079
stepped in one of the pods,
the kids slept in one of the other

1108
01:24:14,159 --> 01:24:18,479
pods, and you know, and
that's when I had a sleep paralysis.

1109
01:24:19,960 --> 01:24:27,720
Like you're talking about, Ben,
it was very personal in nature, so

1110
01:24:27,840 --> 01:24:30,239
read into that what you will.
But it wasn't an old hag. It

1111
01:24:30,479 --> 01:24:40,199
was a bloke. And I would
have described it as a navvy and without

1112
01:24:41,119 --> 01:24:46,359
remembering that that's who came over and
built the tunnels, all these navvies,

1113
01:24:46,479 --> 01:24:50,520
because we used to hear hobnail boots
when there was nobody there going around our

1114
01:24:50,600 --> 01:24:55,520
house because where I live now would
have been the field where they would set

1115
01:24:55,600 --> 01:24:58,920
up camp. Literally, we used
to find clay pipes in our garden when

1116
01:24:58,960 --> 01:25:01,399
we'd dig up the garden that used
to belong to the Nabbes. And it

1117
01:25:01,479 --> 01:25:08,720
was only when I was researching it
a little bit later that I found out,

1118
01:25:08,800 --> 01:25:13,800
like I said earlier, that the
hundreds of these Nabbys were killed building

1119
01:25:13,840 --> 01:25:17,079
this tunnel and nobody knows where they
were buried. So yeah, that was

1120
01:25:17,520 --> 01:25:25,359
absolutely terrifying. That was one that
I had. I had another one which

1121
01:25:26,840 --> 01:25:33,319
not very long ago, and that
was very strange. We've got a school

1122
01:25:33,840 --> 01:25:38,560
clock, a school bell that chimes
on the hour, but it always stops

1123
01:25:38,720 --> 01:25:45,000
at ten o'clock. So I thought
I was hearing this this church clock.

1124
01:25:45,319 --> 01:25:48,159
It woke me up and I thought, why is it ringing past ten o'clock.

1125
01:25:48,159 --> 01:25:51,880
It's too late for it to be
ringing past ten o'clock was going on,

1126
01:25:53,000 --> 01:25:57,439
So I was in my dream and
I woke up and all the time

1127
01:25:57,600 --> 01:26:00,479
was wrong. So my kids were
there, but Connor was one age,

1128
01:26:00,600 --> 01:26:03,680
Caleb was the other age, and
my mum was still alive. Mark was

1129
01:26:03,760 --> 01:26:09,119
here when he shouldn't have been when
the kids were little, and they were

1130
01:26:09,159 --> 01:26:12,279
all looking out the window and waking
us up and like, what's going on?

1131
01:26:12,399 --> 01:26:17,079
What's going on outside, what's going
on outside? And when we got

1132
01:26:17,199 --> 01:26:19,199
to the bottom of the stairs,
me and Mark, we were trying to

1133
01:26:19,199 --> 01:26:21,880
find out what was going on.
We opened the door to go outside and

1134
01:26:21,960 --> 01:26:25,840
find out what was going on.
Mark went first, and I can still

1135
01:26:25,880 --> 01:26:30,640
remember him about twenty foot down the
road. But I got to the front

1136
01:26:30,720 --> 01:26:34,720
door, stepped one foot out and
couldn't go any further. And I just

1137
01:26:34,880 --> 01:26:36,960
heard this like, well, I
didn't just hear it, it was my

1138
01:26:38,079 --> 01:26:41,039
whole body and I was paralyzed.
I couldn't move in my bed at this

1139
01:26:41,319 --> 01:26:45,079
stage, and my whole body is
just throbbing, like the noise you would

1140
01:26:45,119 --> 01:26:49,439
expect a sci fi spaceship to make. That's the only way could describe it.

1141
01:26:49,760 --> 01:26:55,279
So my whole body was pulsing like
with this spaceship. It wasn't a

1142
01:26:55,279 --> 01:26:59,239
spaceship. I felt as if my
body was pulsing. I couldn't just hear

1143
01:26:59,359 --> 01:27:03,279
it, could feel this pulse in
horrible sensation, and I couldn't wake up

1144
01:27:03,319 --> 01:27:05,760
from this dream. At the time, I didn't even know I was in

1145
01:27:05,800 --> 01:27:11,079
a dream. And for my peripheral
vision, I could see, Like I

1146
01:27:11,119 --> 01:27:14,680
say, I don't know if you've
ever seen the series Lost, but there

1147
01:27:14,760 --> 01:27:17,760
was a horrible smoke monster in lost, and it was that it was this

1148
01:27:18,119 --> 01:27:21,760
black smoke, a sentient black smoke, and it was coming towards me,

1149
01:27:23,520 --> 01:27:26,680
and I could see Mark, and
Mark couldn't help me. And I could

1150
01:27:26,720 --> 01:27:30,000
see Mark and we're just looking at
each other, and this black smoke just

1151
01:27:30,119 --> 01:27:34,800
engulfed me. And I was trying
to fight and trying to wake up because

1152
01:27:34,840 --> 01:27:38,880
then I knew that this was a
dream. So I was trying to wait,

1153
01:27:38,960 --> 01:27:43,439
and then I kind of just gave
up and as if, Okay,

1154
01:27:43,600 --> 01:27:45,239
I just need to give up.
There's nothing. I can't fight this.

1155
01:27:45,399 --> 01:27:51,279
I'm going to die. And then
I woke up and that's where Mark comes

1156
01:27:51,359 --> 01:27:56,479
in. There was sweating. I
was terrified. I mean, yeah,

1157
01:27:56,479 --> 01:28:01,279
I've never seen this like that.
This was shaking in terror. You know,

1158
01:28:01,439 --> 01:28:06,279
it was a totally visceral, bodily
experience that you could tell you even

1159
01:28:06,319 --> 01:28:15,479
though she'd was now conscious and but
it was shaking that was so deep inside

1160
01:28:15,520 --> 01:28:18,000
her, and you know it was
it was it was terrifying for me to

1161
01:28:18,319 --> 01:28:24,960
see like that. You know,
it was that you've been through a really

1162
01:28:25,000 --> 01:28:29,640
horrible I'd been through something now talking
you know, Ben, what you were

1163
01:28:29,680 --> 01:28:34,119
saying earlier about skeptic saying it's a
real thing and it's just a dream that

1164
01:28:34,359 --> 01:28:39,800
is true, but you might know
or you might not. I'm very interested

1165
01:28:39,840 --> 01:28:44,600
in Rosemary Ellen Guiley's work and Philippin
Brongo and they wrote the vengeral Gin,

1166
01:28:45,439 --> 01:28:51,199
and I'm quite interested in the information
on the Gin. And Rosemaryell and Guily

1167
01:28:51,359 --> 01:28:55,840
bless her. She's rest in peace, she's not with us anymore. She

1168
01:28:55,960 --> 01:29:00,279
said, yes, it is something
our body does. But the in that

1169
01:29:00,399 --> 01:29:06,079
can take any form because they're smokeless
fire, they can take any form,

1170
01:29:06,720 --> 01:29:12,800
and they can take advantage of the
fact that we do have this natural self

1171
01:29:12,920 --> 01:29:16,119
paralysis, so they can take advantage
of that. They can also induce that.

1172
01:29:16,720 --> 01:29:21,479
So, yes, it's a natural
thing that we do have this paralysis

1173
01:29:21,520 --> 01:29:27,079
in sleep, But that doesn't mean
that there isn't an entity taking advantage or

1174
01:29:27,159 --> 01:29:32,279
doing terrible things when we're in that
state. If that makes sense, Yeah,

1175
01:29:33,760 --> 01:29:40,960
grabbing you WHI are you bounds off? Literally? Jerry Mudzinski as well.

1176
01:29:41,000 --> 01:29:44,279
It's talked about how when you're in
a not only him, but when

1177
01:29:44,279 --> 01:29:50,119
you're in a vulnerable state, then
that's when entities you're you're able, they're

1178
01:29:50,159 --> 01:29:53,880
able to get into you and one
hundred percent, and they all talk about

1179
01:29:53,920 --> 01:29:58,600
it being electric. So they talk
about the gin as electric smokeless fire,

1180
01:29:59,079 --> 01:30:05,199
which is elect trick. And Rosemary
says, one of the ways to counteract

1181
01:30:05,239 --> 01:30:09,520
this is turn the telly on,
turn the lights on. Some reason,

1182
01:30:09,600 --> 01:30:13,399
they don't like it when there's a
lot of electricity around. But when Jerry

1183
01:30:13,479 --> 01:30:18,720
Mazynski was he works with schizophrenic well, he used to work with schizophrenic patients

1184
01:30:19,479 --> 01:30:25,680
in hospitals and prisons, and he
realized the voices were real, they weren't

1185
01:30:25,720 --> 01:30:29,960
hallucinations, all these reasons that he
comes to. While he realizes they're not

1186
01:30:30,479 --> 01:30:33,079
hallo, you know, they're real. They're entities or parasites, he calls

1187
01:30:33,159 --> 01:30:40,000
them. And he said that when
he realized that, he challenged one of

1188
01:30:40,039 --> 01:30:43,319
his patients and he read them out
something. Who was it from I've got

1189
01:30:43,399 --> 01:30:49,479
written down? He read them out
something from a book by Don Miguel Ruez,

1190
01:30:49,720 --> 01:30:54,800
who was basically a chap like Carlos
Castanada. So we read him out

1191
01:30:54,880 --> 01:30:59,760
something from one of his books,
and it was all about you're just energy,

1192
01:30:59,800 --> 01:31:04,399
hearting, you're real, but you're
not material. And this patient,

1193
01:31:05,359 --> 01:31:10,760
this patient with schizophrenia just stared at
him like a zombie, his words,

1194
01:31:11,399 --> 01:31:14,359
and all of a sudden, Jerry
was in his office and he heard this

1195
01:31:14,479 --> 01:31:17,640
crackling like an arc welder behind him, and he was too busy staring at

1196
01:31:17,680 --> 01:31:20,600
this patient with schizophrenia because he thought
he was going to attack him because of

1197
01:31:20,640 --> 01:31:25,680
this horrible stare. And he could
hear this crackling going up the wall behind

1198
01:31:25,760 --> 01:31:29,439
him above his head, hover over
the patient, back down the wall on

1199
01:31:29,520 --> 01:31:34,600
the left, and boom went into
his waste paper basket. So it's electricity

1200
01:31:35,000 --> 01:31:38,479
has a part to play in this. And I just I just find that

1201
01:31:38,920 --> 01:31:45,039
find it fascinating, Yeah, terrifying. Oh and then when he went home,

1202
01:31:45,520 --> 01:31:49,920
he did have the paralysis to sleep
paralysis, and he had that feeling

1203
01:31:50,000 --> 01:31:54,720
of the entity on his chest trying
to suffocate him, you know, on

1204
01:31:54,880 --> 01:31:59,000
his chest, pushing down on him. So smokeless fire. That they're not

1205
01:31:59,159 --> 01:32:01,960
material, but they can take the
form of material and they can affect the

1206
01:32:02,079 --> 01:32:08,600
material world, if that makes sense. Yeah, it's dyingly strange enough.

1207
01:32:08,680 --> 01:32:12,520
She said that she's I was talking
to her. She met her. She

1208
01:32:12,600 --> 01:32:15,840
was a leads and I said,
he's great. Yeah, she was a

1209
01:32:15,880 --> 01:32:18,000
great lady. She said, oh, don't have any mirrors in your bedroom

1210
01:32:18,000 --> 01:32:23,520
when you're sleeping. Absolutely. I
got rid of an antique mirror. Funny

1211
01:32:23,600 --> 01:32:26,720
enough, in the film Constantine,
which is actually a really good film,

1212
01:32:26,720 --> 01:32:30,880
there's a scene which is clearly copied
partly copied from the Exorcist where the main

1213
01:32:30,960 --> 01:32:34,880
character played by Kila Reeves as she
does an exorcism, and a man and

1214
01:32:35,000 --> 01:32:39,800
he uses a mirror he puts she
puts a mirror over the bed to extract

1215
01:32:39,840 --> 01:32:43,720
the demons. Yeah, she ums
out in the mirror. I can't remember

1216
01:32:43,720 --> 01:32:48,039
the way. Yeah. But my
ex wife she was told in her early

1217
01:32:48,159 --> 01:32:54,319
days in psychic developing circles because she
was seeing spirits faces in mirrors all the

1218
01:32:54,439 --> 01:32:57,239
time. And she spoke to the
lady who ran the circle and said,

1219
01:32:57,279 --> 01:33:00,880
what do I do? And she
goes cover up your dressing table with tee

1220
01:33:00,960 --> 01:33:03,720
towels or whatever, just so you
don't see them anymore, because you were

1221
01:33:03,760 --> 01:33:09,439
seeing things in the mirror the whole
time. Wow. And then you think

1222
01:33:09,439 --> 01:33:13,960
about Alice through the looking glass,
you know, also another all through another

1223
01:33:14,039 --> 01:33:19,680
world. And our friend Philip Kins
told me that he had investigated doesn't research

1224
01:33:19,880 --> 01:33:24,880
into mirrors to look into them,
to try and see if you can see

1225
01:33:25,359 --> 01:33:28,880
spirit faces and things, I don't
think you have much success. But I

1226
01:33:29,000 --> 01:33:33,239
know the Egyptians used to have a
black scrying mirror, and so yeah,

1227
01:33:33,359 --> 01:33:36,560
something like the sidian or something like
that, maybe to try and see stuff.

1228
01:33:38,199 --> 01:33:43,560
So do you remember, sorry,
well, because I just remember staring

1229
01:33:43,600 --> 01:33:45,920
himself in the mirror once, try
and see if I could see something.

1230
01:33:45,079 --> 01:33:48,119
But your vision just goes all blurry. You know, you don't actually see

1231
01:33:48,319 --> 01:33:53,000
a part from yourself going or blur. I've never seen anything, but not

1232
01:33:53,039 --> 01:33:59,840
in this count happened. He didn't
explaire them the AAP, the ACEAP conference,

1233
01:34:00,720 --> 01:34:03,479
I can't remember what it stands for, something paranormal something or another bend.

1234
01:34:03,520 --> 01:34:08,319
You'll probably know. So they the
Situation for the Scientific Study of Anomalist

1235
01:34:08,359 --> 01:34:11,399
Phenomena. I knew you'd remember.
But do you remember he was talking about

1236
01:34:11,880 --> 01:34:14,319
they got a whole load of them
with mirrors, and they were trying to

1237
01:34:14,359 --> 01:34:16,479
do this experiment, weren't they.
I don't know if you remember them talking

1238
01:34:16,520 --> 01:34:21,640
about that. Yeah, you stand. They to lower the lights in whichever

1239
01:34:21,720 --> 01:34:25,680
room not not not as completely dark
as it was, very very dim.

1240
01:34:26,199 --> 01:34:30,039
Stare at yourself in a mirror and
you'll see the face of some kind of

1241
01:34:30,119 --> 01:34:32,920
monster appear over your face. There's
quite I mean, I did try it.

1242
01:34:33,000 --> 01:34:35,720
I mean it's quite scary. It's
something. It's something I actually did

1243
01:34:35,760 --> 01:34:38,760
when I was a kid, and
I noticed when I was a little kid.

1244
01:34:38,920 --> 01:34:42,079
But I think it may have something
more to do with the workings of

1245
01:34:42,159 --> 01:34:45,199
the eye and the appearance, but
it's still it's the sort of thing they

1246
01:34:45,359 --> 01:34:48,319
like to do. Funny, enough
about Jerry, and I want to mention

1247
01:34:48,359 --> 01:34:51,920
about Gerry Marcinski because I listened to
a couple of his things as well.

1248
01:34:53,479 --> 01:34:57,000
He was a train trainer as a
psychiatrist. With how he got into this

1249
01:34:57,119 --> 01:35:00,239
treating schizophrenics. During his training,
he was hold over and over again,

1250
01:35:01,319 --> 01:35:06,920
never ever humor the patients with their
fantasies. They are just fantasies, they're

1251
01:35:06,920 --> 01:35:11,479
not real. Don't even discuss them, don't even think about them, and

1252
01:35:11,600 --> 01:35:15,239
never and certainly they never try to
suggest, just to discuss with what they

1253
01:35:15,319 --> 01:35:18,960
might be like with the patient.
So this is this is interesting because of

1254
01:35:19,000 --> 01:35:23,079
course he broke that rule, which
is how he did his research. And

1255
01:35:23,520 --> 01:35:29,159
it must be, it must be, It must be very very difficult because

1256
01:35:29,159 --> 01:35:33,600
there's some that there's some kind of
denial maybe even an active cover up within

1257
01:35:33,680 --> 01:35:38,560
the medical establishment of this phenomenon.
May Well, he was making them better,

1258
01:35:38,680 --> 01:35:41,920
ben so they didn't need their medicine. Yes, that's sorry. The

1259
01:35:41,960 --> 01:35:46,479
old Prozac, the oldlands a Pine
and things like that would lower they would

1260
01:35:46,479 --> 01:35:49,439
lower the lower the sales figures one
at the share holds, one like that.

1261
01:35:49,920 --> 01:35:53,840
But it's just it's I find other
interesting. And of course this is

1262
01:35:53,880 --> 01:35:56,520
a This is a pattern repeated over
and over again, especially in things like

1263
01:35:56,640 --> 01:36:01,079
uthology, where the phenomena is denied
rejected by the establishment. The good old

1264
01:36:01,159 --> 01:36:04,319
Jerry, though he broke his rule. He spoke to the patient about it,

1265
01:36:04,399 --> 01:36:09,359
and he discovered so much about it, not least in a clinical sense.

1266
01:36:09,439 --> 01:36:13,960
He found the means of a much
more effective for treatment. Shit touch

1267
01:36:14,000 --> 01:36:15,960
of the old Robin Williams going on
there, I think, yeah, Patch

1268
01:36:16,000 --> 01:36:23,520
Adam, Yeah, yeah, yeah. So Liz you mentioned also about was

1269
01:36:23,560 --> 01:36:27,920
it your son seeing a UFO once? Yeah, So that was a very

1270
01:36:28,000 --> 01:36:34,359
strange one, because my sons are
both for you know, awake, whatever

1271
01:36:34,399 --> 01:36:39,199
the word we use these days.
They think I'm a nutter because of the

1272
01:36:39,359 --> 01:36:42,079
ufone bit. To be honest,
that's the only bit. They think I'm

1273
01:36:42,119 --> 01:36:45,319
a nutter about, but we were
I couldn't figure out if it was twenty

1274
01:36:45,439 --> 01:36:47,720
nineteen or twenty twenty, if we
were just going into lockdown, or if

1275
01:36:47,720 --> 01:36:51,319
we were in lockdown. Yeah,
I can't quite remember, but yeah,

1276
01:36:51,640 --> 01:36:55,079
but yeah, it must have been
just before it was must have been late

1277
01:36:55,159 --> 01:36:57,640
in the midnight time because we were
both asleep, and then all of a

1278
01:36:57,680 --> 01:37:00,680
sudden, Connor's shouting at us to
get out of bed, and he'd been

1279
01:37:00,720 --> 01:37:03,279
watching this thing for bloody Angels and
didn't wake us up, and he's like,

1280
01:37:03,640 --> 01:37:08,479
helicopters don't move that fast. Bloody
helicopters don't move that fast. I'm

1281
01:37:08,520 --> 01:37:14,319
like, uh, you know.
The weirdest thing about that was so he'd

1282
01:37:14,319 --> 01:37:19,920
been watching this thing, you know, demanding that helicopters don't go that fast.

1283
01:37:20,399 --> 01:37:23,880
And he is a bit of a
sin when it comes to the UFO,

1284
01:37:24,000 --> 01:37:27,640
so we wouldn't have said that.
And then me and Mark looking at

1285
01:37:27,680 --> 01:37:29,840
the window trying to see what he's
seeing, and all of a sudden his

1286
01:37:29,960 --> 01:37:33,279
torchlights come through all of our windows, through Connor's window from my window.

1287
01:37:33,760 --> 01:37:38,239
That was a bit terrifying, so
we shout out, oh, what the

1288
01:37:38,239 --> 01:37:41,840
boo deal's going on? In the
garden and there as his copper has his

1289
01:37:41,960 --> 01:37:46,479
bloody policeman searching through our garden and
searching in through our window, and I'm

1290
01:37:46,560 --> 01:37:50,720
like, what are you doing?
And it kind of didn't just he had

1291
01:37:50,760 --> 01:37:54,399
to come up, didn't just come
out of his mouth, did it.

1292
01:37:54,439 --> 01:38:00,439
It was almost like we're we're looking
for a middle aged woman. It wasn't

1293
01:38:00,880 --> 01:38:02,159
oh, we're looking for a middle
aged woman. It was almost as if

1294
01:38:02,399 --> 01:38:06,359
it sounded like an excuse. That
was the only time I'd phoned up and

1295
01:38:06,560 --> 01:38:10,359
reported it to the police, a
UFO siting I must have been it.

1296
01:38:10,520 --> 01:38:15,359
It does seem a strange position,
you know, kind of having seen the

1297
01:38:16,159 --> 01:38:20,319
strange lights in the sky and then
and then police shining torches in the garden

1298
01:38:20,399 --> 01:38:25,159
and searching for something. Yeah,
exactly, and you know, not something

1299
01:38:25,439 --> 01:38:29,000
that we've ever had it before or
since, you know, we're closest to

1300
01:38:29,079 --> 01:38:34,119
the tunnel. Yeah, yeah,
and yeah, and Rudlow Base, Yeah,

1301
01:38:35,640 --> 01:38:40,960
this had also seen a UFO on
a different occasion many years previous to

1302
01:38:41,039 --> 01:38:45,119
that time. Well it was the
previous occasion. What was that UFO about

1303
01:38:45,159 --> 01:38:49,880
then? So that was kind of
Benjim, remember when we were looking for

1304
01:38:50,000 --> 01:38:57,479
Rudlow manner and we went and asked
that posh lady and it was by there.

1305
01:38:58,079 --> 01:39:00,520
So this was years and years ago
when I don't even think my youngest

1306
01:39:00,520 --> 01:39:02,840
son had been born, and Caleb
must have only been one or two.

1307
01:39:04,840 --> 01:39:08,840
And I was with my ex husband
and we were driving back from Cautium,

1308
01:39:08,880 --> 01:39:12,520
so we must have been going out
for a meal or something. My mum

1309
01:39:12,640 --> 01:39:16,680
was babysitting Caleb, and we got
to the top of my red blow and

1310
01:39:16,800 --> 01:39:24,960
these I can remember about five lights, all different colors, and I can't

1311
01:39:25,039 --> 01:39:30,920
remember the details, but I can
remember it was so significant that me and

1312
01:39:30,039 --> 01:39:34,399
my ex husband we pulled the car
over and we did that like in all

1313
01:39:34,600 --> 01:39:39,960
thing. But then I can't remember
anything except for being back at home and

1314
01:39:40,079 --> 01:39:42,279
saying to my mum, turn it
tally on. It's going to be all

1315
01:39:42,319 --> 01:39:45,520
over the news. And my ex
husband was like, oh my god.

1316
01:39:45,640 --> 01:39:47,439
You know, we didn't know the
word disclosure then, didn't know that was

1317
01:39:47,479 --> 01:39:49,920
a thing, but we're like,
this is it real. It was so

1318
01:39:51,079 --> 01:39:56,880
you know, for what I can
remember, it was almost like close encounters

1319
01:39:57,039 --> 01:39:59,760
kind of lights. It was so
over the top what we saw that we

1320
01:39:59,840 --> 01:40:02,199
were convinced it was going to be
all over the news. Absolutely nothing,

1321
01:40:02,239 --> 01:40:06,159
and then I forgot about it for
twenty years. But I have been doing

1322
01:40:06,239 --> 01:40:12,039
some research at NEIL and I found
some If I can find it, I

1323
01:40:12,119 --> 01:40:14,239
might have to just read this out
because I won't be able to remember it.

1324
01:40:14,800 --> 01:40:24,319
Some Freedom of information reports on gov
dot UK with regards to sightings round

1325
01:40:24,399 --> 01:40:29,560
about that time, so nineteen ninety
seven and the ones that make sense to

1326
01:40:29,720 --> 01:40:34,439
me because my birthday is the tenth
of July and the one that jumped out

1327
01:40:34,479 --> 01:40:38,239
to me was on the eleventh of
July, and that would make sense as

1328
01:40:38,279 --> 01:40:41,960
to why I was out, because
you know, I had a young son.

1329
01:40:42,079 --> 01:40:44,800
I didn't go out very often,
so the only time I probably would

1330
01:40:44,840 --> 01:40:49,000
have gone out was from a birthday. So what I discovered on these reports

1331
01:40:49,359 --> 01:40:55,800
that from the sixth of July nineteen
ninety seven to the eleventh of July,

1332
01:40:56,079 --> 01:41:01,199
there were sixteen reported sightings over the
UK and seven was similar to me.

1333
01:41:01,920 --> 01:41:06,560
So if I could just give you
a few examples. So the sixth of

1334
01:41:06,680 --> 01:41:13,600
July, skeedness Lincoln sheer a bright
star shaped object. It had sparkling red,

1335
01:41:13,720 --> 01:41:16,000
green, blue and white lights.
That's what I saw. It made

1336
01:41:16,119 --> 01:41:21,239
erratic movement and slowly moved to the
south. Then there was Wrexham on the

1337
01:41:21,399 --> 01:41:27,399
eighth of July, one object with
four lights, all yellow orange in color.

1338
01:41:28,119 --> 01:41:30,880
It moved to the north, then
turned to its original position and disappeared.

1339
01:41:32,039 --> 01:41:35,119
And there's two or three more.
But the one on the eleventh of

1340
01:41:35,239 --> 01:41:40,319
July was in Swindon, and that's
only twenty five miles up the road from

1341
01:41:40,359 --> 01:41:44,079
me. So that was possibly on
the same light I was out, and

1342
01:41:44,720 --> 01:41:49,199
they were ported two possibly three lights
sometimes looked like fireworks or stars, all

1343
01:41:49,319 --> 01:41:55,000
fairly bright. The lights were going
round in tiny little circles. Now,

1344
01:41:55,079 --> 01:42:00,319
the weird thing is it was so
such an event and then I forgot about

1345
01:42:00,319 --> 01:42:04,880
it for twenty years. As strange, isn't it. Yeah, so you

1346
01:42:05,039 --> 01:42:10,159
think you had this in time or
something, I mean, a story that

1347
01:42:10,399 --> 01:42:15,119
was sold. I couldn't honestly honestly
say, you know, I couldn't.

1348
01:42:15,239 --> 01:42:18,520
I couldn't honestly say because I didn't
look at the clerk, or you know,

1349
01:42:18,880 --> 01:42:26,199
I just remember not remembering. Yeah, you know, that's really interesting

1350
01:42:26,239 --> 01:42:30,359
thing because I remember many, many
years ago a friend of mine who originally

1351
01:42:30,439 --> 01:42:34,640
came from the States. She said
that as kids, and this would have

1352
01:42:34,800 --> 01:42:39,479
been somewhere in the mid early seventies, I think because she's a bit older

1353
01:42:39,479 --> 01:42:43,239
than me. But she said,
obviously those big American cars, ire usaid,

1354
01:42:43,319 --> 01:42:45,359
back then, knew you could get
a whole bloody family of fifty in

1355
01:42:45,439 --> 01:42:50,079
a minner. She said that she
remembers being in the back of this big

1356
01:42:50,239 --> 01:42:57,000
car I don't know whose kite was
a family member with her cousins and uncles

1357
01:42:57,079 --> 01:43:01,520
and other people, and they said
they saw this huge bloody I don't know

1358
01:43:01,560 --> 01:43:05,680
if it was a flying triangle or
just a disufie. I can't remember how

1359
01:43:05,720 --> 01:43:10,359
she described it. They described the
size of its being as huge as a

1360
01:43:10,479 --> 01:43:14,920
football field size, which is the
typical description here these days, the huge

1361
01:43:14,960 --> 01:43:17,680
you and there's just wall going over
them sort of thing, you know.

1362
01:43:18,319 --> 01:43:21,279
And they looked going, oh my
god, look at that. And they

1363
01:43:21,359 --> 01:43:27,720
remember driving back to the house and
then one of them running down the lane

1364
01:43:28,119 --> 01:43:30,760
to try and track to see where
it had gone. And then nothing more

1365
01:43:30,880 --> 01:43:35,600
was ever said about it. And
then it was like thirty years later she

1366
01:43:35,760 --> 01:43:41,640
was talking on the phone to a
brother or so. She said, can

1367
01:43:41,680 --> 01:43:44,359
you remember that thing? Weed?
As kids? You know, the great

1368
01:43:44,399 --> 01:43:46,560
big flyings also, And he said, oh, I thought that was a

1369
01:43:46,680 --> 01:43:51,319
dream, you know. They hadn't
forgotten it, you know, so I

1370
01:43:51,479 --> 01:43:57,800
rolled it again. I wonder.
I think the only time I recorded again

1371
01:43:57,920 --> 01:44:01,640
was when I was actually at the
UFO conference that Gary what's his names,

1372
01:44:02,039 --> 01:44:06,520
Gary Hessel time when we went to
the UFO true we met Ben, first

1373
01:44:06,560 --> 01:44:10,159
time we met Ben, and that
was the first UFO concience we went to.

1374
01:44:10,399 --> 01:44:13,640
And that's when I think I sat
in the audience and remember because he

1375
01:44:13,680 --> 01:44:15,880
said, does anybody see the UFO? And my aunt went up and I

1376
01:44:15,920 --> 01:44:21,680
went, oh, yeah, your
subconscious movie before your conscious mind. It's

1377
01:44:21,720 --> 01:44:25,960
sort of thing. I mean,
why was I a bloody UFO conference?

1378
01:44:27,279 --> 01:44:29,960
Why was I there? Yeah?
Because you know, it wasn't even in

1379
01:44:30,720 --> 01:44:33,000
the forefront of my mind, to
be honest, It was in the background.

1380
01:44:33,079 --> 01:44:39,680
He was in the background. Very
strange. So any strange marks on

1381
01:44:39,800 --> 01:44:45,720
your body anything else, well,
that was still run. As you mentioned

1382
01:44:45,760 --> 01:44:55,359
that. We'll put that down to
the visiting hag, shall we. That's

1383
01:44:55,439 --> 01:45:00,960
one one name to call him.
Well myself that I have one of them

1384
01:45:00,079 --> 01:45:03,079
things and implant, but I can't
remember where. Oh no, it was

1385
01:45:03,159 --> 01:45:05,840
in me chained, but I think
that was just me being mad, so

1386
01:45:06,079 --> 01:45:10,439
not not to my knowledge, but
you can if you overthink these things.

1387
01:45:10,479 --> 01:45:14,479
Convince yourself with things, can't you? So I don't think so. I

1388
01:45:14,560 --> 01:45:17,840
don't think so to be honest with
you, if I'm being honest, But

1389
01:45:17,920 --> 01:45:21,560
it's it's funny that I was you
were saying about forgetting the UFO experience,

1390
01:45:21,640 --> 01:45:28,920
because yeah, that experience when this
dog spirit, whatever it may be,

1391
01:45:29,039 --> 01:45:32,119
all part of something inside me that
came through. I mean, it's the

1392
01:45:32,159 --> 01:45:36,680
most amazing experience that's ever happened to
me. But I hardly I almost forget

1393
01:45:36,720 --> 01:45:40,520
about it. And when you were
sort of we were coming on this show

1394
01:45:40,560 --> 01:45:45,479
and it's like you have I had
any paranormal experiences and that kind of thing

1395
01:45:45,520 --> 01:45:46,920
doesn't happen to me. Liz has
had a lot of things. But remember

1396
01:45:46,960 --> 01:45:53,640
when you challenge you channeled Lassie.
Yeah, I mean, and it's like,

1397
01:45:53,720 --> 01:45:58,880
bloodyh yeah, there was that that
was let me now, but it's

1398
01:45:58,960 --> 01:46:05,159
just went to the back of my
mind. And maybe that's maybe that's to

1399
01:46:05,279 --> 01:46:10,039
talk more, you know what I
mean. By this time, and you'd

1400
01:46:10,039 --> 01:46:15,760
have an agent, you know,
a different sub genre on a playlist,

1401
01:46:15,800 --> 01:46:18,199
on a channel with ust start sort
of doing dog videos or something like that.

1402
01:46:18,279 --> 01:46:23,520
I started don'tifying as a dog when
you're bringing through the spirit of Barbara

1403
01:46:23,520 --> 01:46:26,600
Woodhouse, and that was one of
the kind of call signs coming through,

1404
01:46:26,800 --> 01:46:29,199
you know. It's I thought,
we're going to say Barbara winter there from

1405
01:46:29,239 --> 01:46:34,520
and that's going to well, is
everybody walking? You know, we've gone

1406
01:46:34,600 --> 01:46:38,439
vogue again and yeah, we've gone
We always do this on our channel,

1407
01:46:38,479 --> 01:46:44,359
Sorry to do it on your channel. The Richard D. Hall material this

1408
01:46:44,479 --> 01:46:51,680
is obviously something I actually met Ben
at Richard D. Hall conference when he

1409
01:46:51,720 --> 01:46:55,560
did something in London, so it's
interesting. It kind of brought us all

1410
01:46:55,600 --> 01:47:00,039
together in that sense. So I
heard about Richard D. Hall one time.

1411
01:47:00,119 --> 01:47:04,439
I was reading comments. I was
watching UFO videos on YouTube, and

1412
01:47:04,600 --> 01:47:09,920
someone in the comments said, oh, you've got to watch Richard Diehl's NATO

1413
01:47:10,159 --> 01:47:13,520
and the Human Mutilation Program. So
I thought, oh, what's that?

1414
01:47:13,680 --> 01:47:18,319
Then? Cool? So I copied
the title, punched it into YouTube and

1415
01:47:18,520 --> 01:47:23,319
came up with it, and I
remember watching it thinking, oh my god,

1416
01:47:23,479 --> 01:47:27,399
this is disturbing stuff, you know, And then I sort of found

1417
01:47:27,399 --> 01:47:30,239
out about the rich Planet website and
started to watch all the videos on there

1418
01:47:30,319 --> 01:47:34,439
and it just went from there.
Really I really did like his earliest stuff,

1419
01:47:34,520 --> 01:47:39,680
you know, he talked about the
UFOs and the mutilations, the aliens,

1420
01:47:39,760 --> 01:47:44,800
and then he started to get into
all sorts of other stuff. Wasn't

1421
01:47:44,880 --> 01:47:48,560
so much interested in the historians,
Baron Blackett and all that kind of stuff.

1422
01:47:48,560 --> 01:47:54,479
It wasn't really my kind of time, teaming cup of tea sort of

1423
01:47:54,520 --> 01:47:58,399
thing, you know. And then
he started to get into the other sorts

1424
01:47:58,399 --> 01:48:02,399
of stuff like the Boston bobby or
the Manchester bombing and that kind of stuff.

1425
01:48:02,680 --> 01:48:06,840
So where do you where's he now
sit in your kind of thing?

1426
01:48:06,920 --> 01:48:11,520
I mean, do you still go
with him or does there any particular part

1427
01:48:11,560 --> 01:48:15,640
that you really enjoyed? Or I
think he's one of our one of our

1428
01:48:15,199 --> 01:48:18,920
I personally think he's one of our
kings, if you know what I mean,

1429
01:48:19,680 --> 01:48:23,600
he's one of the kings in this
movement. I think, yeah,

1430
01:48:23,600 --> 01:48:27,439
I mean I well, as we
said earlier, he was. He was

1431
01:48:27,560 --> 01:48:31,880
one of those that made me open
my mind to a lot of things,

1432
01:48:32,039 --> 01:48:38,960
just because as someone coming from a
point of view where, you know,

1433
01:48:39,399 --> 01:48:45,159
believe in them all mainstream wilbeit sort
of thinking old authorities bad, but still

1434
01:48:45,399 --> 01:48:56,399
believing a mainstreams. The way that
he forensically dissected things and presented such very

1435
01:48:56,479 --> 01:49:00,720
good arguments just so detailed. Obviously, the medel of Maccain, the Joe

1436
01:49:00,800 --> 01:49:03,840
Cox work that he did, I
think as well, was something that really

1437
01:49:03,920 --> 01:49:09,319
blew my mind, you know,
just the way I thought, I can't

1438
01:49:09,840 --> 01:49:12,000
you know, you can't argue with
this. I think, you know,

1439
01:49:12,560 --> 01:49:17,119
he's so that detail, I think. But but yeah, I mean a

1440
01:49:17,840 --> 01:49:21,359
very broad section of his work,
really, I think so much. You

1441
01:49:21,439 --> 01:49:25,720
know, even the historical stuff,
like you say, did fascinate me as

1442
01:49:25,760 --> 01:49:31,760
well. Yeah, so I think
he became quite a good also platform for

1443
01:49:31,920 --> 01:49:38,039
other people presenting their work, and
he's almost like Britain's Alex Jones. Now,

1444
01:49:38,159 --> 01:49:41,640
I think what they had to have
a scapegoat or the establishment have used

1445
01:49:41,680 --> 01:49:44,600
him like that. I think with
this court case, they're trying to make

1446
01:49:44,720 --> 01:49:48,800
him like the Alex Jones to set
an example. They're obviously trying to crush

1447
01:49:49,199 --> 01:49:55,319
free speech and you know, people's
right to think for themselves and question authority,

1448
01:49:55,439 --> 01:49:59,000
and he's been used as a as
a scapegoat. I think it's just

1449
01:49:59,079 --> 01:50:03,000
something. You've been to the court
case to see it all happening. So

1450
01:50:04,479 --> 01:50:08,000
the hals of this mole, So
what's your perception of the whole thing.

1451
01:50:08,039 --> 01:50:10,680
Well, yes, I went into
the the public gallery of the first hearing

1452
01:50:10,720 --> 01:50:15,640
wherever Richard was facing facing these these
charges, this this lawsuit. That's something

1453
01:50:15,680 --> 01:50:21,920
I predicted actually because when Alex Jones
was prosecuted for supposed to harassment or whatever

1454
01:50:23,079 --> 01:50:27,159
change, they brought on him for
questioning the Shady Nook incident, You've got

1455
01:50:27,239 --> 01:50:31,520
to be careful what you say on
YouTube. The families of the alleged victims

1456
01:50:31,600 --> 01:50:35,079
sued him. This seems to be
I said, this is a tactic they're

1457
01:50:35,119 --> 01:50:41,079
using its outsourced lawfare. Rather than
just passing laws to signce people. They

1458
01:50:41,159 --> 01:50:44,760
get these to just paramilitaries to come
in and do it for them. And

1459
01:50:45,680 --> 01:50:46,960
I said, they're gonna they're going
to do the same thing in other countries.

1460
01:50:47,000 --> 01:50:49,640
They're going to do saying they're going
to take on David Ike over here,

1461
01:50:50,239 --> 01:50:53,600
and I thought they pick on David
because David is probably the most the

1462
01:50:53,600 --> 01:50:59,319
biggest and most famous of the people
in the conspiracy over here said they chose

1463
01:50:59,399 --> 01:51:02,439
Richard. Probably why they didn't Bend. That's probably why they didn't. Maybe

1464
01:51:02,479 --> 01:51:06,199
they thought it was an easier option. It could it could be they thought

1465
01:51:06,199 --> 01:51:11,079
they tackle Richard because he'd be he'd
be a softer target. Well, they

1466
01:51:11,079 --> 01:51:14,800
certainly underestimated him in that case.
And you know, well, Richard's actually

1467
01:51:14,840 --> 01:51:16,840
handling it very differently to Alex,
and I think he's doing the right saying

1468
01:51:17,399 --> 01:51:23,119
Alex. When Alex Jones was facing
these charges, he groveled and he he

1469
01:51:23,399 --> 01:51:26,920
took the knee and he apologized he
didn't really mean it over and over again

1470
01:51:27,000 --> 01:51:30,279
in court and it got him precisely
nowhere. They still screwed him ragged,

1471
01:51:30,439 --> 01:51:33,760
and I knew they would do that. Richard instead has decided to run at

1472
01:51:33,800 --> 01:51:38,760
them. He's standing his ground,
he's sticking by his guns. And I

1473
01:51:39,640 --> 01:51:42,600
mean, Andrew Johnson did a video, but Andrew Johnson's a very interesting video

1474
01:51:42,600 --> 01:51:45,319
about that way. He predicts that
probably this, this, this whole thing

1475
01:51:45,359 --> 01:51:51,560
will be dropped eventually because Richard's defiance
is going to it will ye to back,

1476
01:51:53,079 --> 01:51:58,880
it'll backfire on the establishment because in
no way do if there's actually no

1477
01:51:59,039 --> 01:52:01,720
way that the Hip are actually behind
all this. I mean, they say

1478
01:52:01,760 --> 01:52:05,319
they are apparently, but they make
comments earlier on saying they didn't really care.

1479
01:52:05,359 --> 01:52:09,399
Then he bother them much and then
suddenly they are. They're in contact

1480
01:52:09,439 --> 01:52:13,079
with Marianne Spring at the BBC,
and before you know it. Then they

1481
01:52:13,119 --> 01:52:16,800
suddenly then suddenly Martin becomes all uperity
about it and and all, oh my

1482
01:52:16,920 --> 01:52:20,560
goodness, be righteous indignation. I'm
going to sue this guy. And then

1483
01:52:20,840 --> 01:52:24,920
he did this TV show. He
does a radio show on a TV show,

1484
01:52:25,560 --> 01:52:30,600
which is a complete piece of emotional
manipulation and propaganda. It's it was

1485
01:52:30,840 --> 01:52:34,720
totally notly devoid. Factually it was
fact. It was a factual vacuum,

1486
01:52:34,840 --> 01:52:41,159
but loaded and loaded with sentiment.
Like propaganda, good propaganda is it appeals

1487
01:52:41,159 --> 01:52:44,119
to the heart, not the head. It doesn't try to persuade rationally they

1488
01:52:44,399 --> 01:52:48,079
what good propaganda, effective propaganda does, but it builds up powerful emotions and

1489
01:52:48,520 --> 01:52:51,000
in the people it says, look, this is this horrible thing's happening.

1490
01:52:51,159 --> 01:52:56,560
Is this evil man behind it?
The thing is they can't fight the truth,

1491
01:52:56,640 --> 01:53:00,119
Ben That's why they're not allowing him
to bring his evidence to court and

1492
01:53:00,199 --> 01:53:02,439
not actually allowing him to show the
truth. That's why I think it will

1493
01:53:02,479 --> 01:53:05,199
fail because the only way to prove
that he's wrong is to let him show

1494
01:53:05,239 --> 01:53:09,399
his evidence, and they're never going
to do that. Yeah, we're here

1495
01:53:09,439 --> 01:53:12,279
in the first quarter here was all
about that and more. Richard wanted that

1496
01:53:12,359 --> 01:53:15,600
what Hammond was the Hibbitts were trying
to They had their barrister in there and

1497
01:53:15,640 --> 01:53:18,479
he was trying to prevent Richard from
bringing his evidence. This is why,

1498
01:53:18,680 --> 01:53:21,600
this is why, by the way, they chose harassment rather than libel.

1499
01:53:23,520 --> 01:53:26,600
But you know, the industry standard
for this sort of thing is libel.

1500
01:53:27,000 --> 01:53:29,039
Where they said, but the thing
is, if they're going to if they're

1501
01:53:29,039 --> 01:53:31,079
going to actually sue you for libel
that is basically saying nasty things about you,

1502
01:53:31,560 --> 01:53:35,479
you have the defendant has the right
to plead fair comment, which Richard

1503
01:53:35,479 --> 01:53:40,039
would go. But then then in
that case they would have to let him

1504
01:53:40,039 --> 01:53:43,760
present his evidence to the court.
And they don't want to do that.

1505
01:53:43,880 --> 01:53:47,439
They don't want Richard because Richard is
right, this is the thing. They

1506
01:53:47,479 --> 01:53:50,119
don't want the jury to see that. Now. I just all I can

1507
01:53:50,239 --> 01:53:55,479
hope is that this will this goes
Richard's way. But what I do know

1508
01:53:55,600 --> 01:53:58,479
is fortune favors of the bold,
and Richard is being bold about this.

1509
01:53:58,680 --> 01:54:04,439
He's doing exactly right what Alex Jones
did wrong. He just recounts for those

1510
01:54:04,520 --> 01:54:09,520
that don't know about this case,
and there's people that think what they talking

1511
01:54:09,560 --> 01:54:12,600
about, so they just nack track
a little bit, so you're explaining,

1512
01:54:13,079 --> 01:54:16,720
Yeah, the Manster of Evening Evening
incident, which happened in twenty seventeen,

1513
01:54:16,800 --> 01:54:20,600
made the twenty second twenty seventeen.
There's a lot twenty two's in this in

1514
01:54:20,680 --> 01:54:25,199
which a twenty two year old man
killed twenty two people with a bomb at

1515
01:54:25,279 --> 01:54:29,840
twenty two hundred hours on the twenty
second, and allegedly this is what happened.

1516
01:54:30,119 --> 01:54:32,600
Richard has researched this along with several
other people, and has made a

1517
01:54:32,960 --> 01:54:36,920
couple of very good documentaries about it, and he's discovered that there's reasons we

1518
01:54:36,960 --> 01:54:43,119
should question that and what we maybe
look at is some kind of fake some

1519
01:54:43,239 --> 01:54:47,199
kind of not even a false flag, some kind of stagecraft present created for

1520
01:54:47,319 --> 01:54:50,960
the media, and she brought her
in a fast, fascinating evidence to bear.

1521
01:54:51,000 --> 01:54:55,560
He's worked very very hard. He's
just field re search. He didn't

1522
01:54:55,600 --> 01:54:59,039
just sit around talking about it online, you know, like I do most

1523
01:54:59,079 --> 01:55:03,560
of the time. He does field
research and he uh as a result of

1524
01:55:03,600 --> 01:55:08,840
this, he's I think he's reached
quite a large audience and and I think

1525
01:55:08,880 --> 01:55:13,840
the estampishon are very worried. That's
that's because I think they I think Richard

1526
01:55:13,880 --> 01:55:17,359
is right I think what he's discovered
is legitimate, and the authorities are scared

1527
01:55:17,399 --> 01:55:20,720
that this is going to get this
is maybe going to the point where there

1528
01:55:20,720 --> 01:55:26,159
will be what's that phrase they use, a breakdown of public trust. So

1529
01:55:26,399 --> 01:55:28,840
they're they're now trying to silence Ricians, trying to shut him up. But

1530
01:55:28,880 --> 01:55:31,600
it looks like it's backfiring. So
I'm because, yeah, man, So

1531
01:55:31,960 --> 01:55:34,840
I do hope that considers. Andrew
Johnson thinks they they're probably just to bantle

1532
01:55:34,880 --> 01:55:39,760
the whole thing eventually, and I
hope that's true. Why why would they

1533
01:55:40,119 --> 01:55:43,239
Okay, I know that why they
would not want to show his evidence,

1534
01:55:43,319 --> 01:55:46,840
But how can they, in a
legal saying, prevent someone who's being in

1535
01:55:47,079 --> 01:55:51,039
charge with something present their own events
of the because he's not being charged with

1536
01:55:51,159 --> 01:55:56,399
libel, he's been he's been sued
for harassment or that the what the what

1537
01:55:56,479 --> 01:55:58,800
the judge said in the end was
that the point is not the point of

1538
01:55:58,800 --> 01:56:01,279
whether Richard's right or wrong of what
being to it's Richard's actions in the course

1539
01:56:01,319 --> 01:56:09,239
of his investigation, which which which
is sense which unfortunately see that I believe

1540
01:56:09,319 --> 01:56:13,079
that whether Richard is right or wrong
is relevant to it. But in the

1541
01:56:13,239 --> 01:56:15,000
unforce in the letter of law.
It is not. What they claiming is

1542
01:56:15,039 --> 01:56:20,199
that Richard carried out illegitimate and unethical
practices in his research, which is not

1543
01:56:20,359 --> 01:56:26,079
true. And Richard is actually very
obvious. But they're trying to fix they're

1544
01:56:26,079 --> 01:56:28,880
trying to fix it. They're trying
they're trying to poison the media against him

1545
01:56:28,880 --> 01:56:31,880
by saying, oh, he followed
a disabled girl along the street and pointed

1546
01:56:31,960 --> 01:56:38,960
the camera that it had a sharpened
spike, the sharpened spike, sharpened spike

1547
01:56:39,760 --> 01:56:42,920
around spring this this young woman who
works for the BBC, she's behind all

1548
01:56:42,960 --> 01:56:45,760
this, I think, And of
course that means Richard won't get They want

1549
01:56:45,800 --> 01:56:48,680
to try and poison the public against
him, because what's the jury is made

1550
01:56:48,720 --> 01:56:51,800
up of the public, isn't it. I mean, I think it's a

1551
01:56:51,920 --> 01:56:57,560
notable with that other event which we
can't name, with the Alex Jones,

1552
01:56:58,039 --> 01:57:02,399
that both of those events the bunch
to one as well, that the Richard

1553
01:57:02,439 --> 01:57:11,000
D. Hill's been both involving supposedly
lost children children. So are you saying

1554
01:57:11,399 --> 01:57:21,560
the particular emotive being the most emotive
triggers that that can push. So it

1555
01:57:21,680 --> 01:57:28,880
seems to me that they particularly used
events like this and maybe by particularly creating

1556
01:57:29,000 --> 01:57:34,199
them and knowing that there are people
like Richard and the people in America that

1557
01:57:34,760 --> 01:57:40,359
as it smiteses, I can remember
the chap's name that they did a lot

1558
01:57:40,359 --> 01:57:45,560
of research on the unnameable American incident, but knew that the people would research

1559
01:57:45,720 --> 01:57:50,079
that and point out the obvious flaws
in the official story. But then as

1560
01:57:50,119 --> 01:57:53,800
soon as that happened, they could
then seize on that. And there's like,

1561
01:57:53,960 --> 01:57:58,920
these people are denying that these tragic
deaths happened, and they're besmirching the

1562
01:57:59,039 --> 01:58:01,720
name of these lost children. And
as I say, that's sort of something

1563
01:58:02,119 --> 01:58:08,800
about so much the same he's challenged
the Jill Dando thing, he challenged,

1564
01:58:08,840 --> 01:58:14,760
that Brexit woman thing. He's challenged
so many, so many adult things he's

1565
01:58:14,920 --> 01:58:17,920
challenged. You make a good point. It's the children one that they go

1566
01:58:18,079 --> 01:58:23,079
on because it is so emotive,
and you can't question that it is because

1567
01:58:23,239 --> 01:58:26,760
because obviously people have these feelings for
children, I mean, they feel sorry.

1568
01:58:27,159 --> 01:58:30,239
And most of the victims of the
the alleged victims of this incidence in

1569
01:58:30,319 --> 01:58:36,279
Manageter were your teenagers and young young
kids. And it's it's for itchaling.

1570
01:58:36,279 --> 01:58:44,640
I mean, the concert was we
had a Gray Evening news arena. Yeah,

1571
01:58:45,439 --> 01:58:47,560
yeah, I don't know who she
is. I mean, you can't

1572
01:58:47,680 --> 01:58:50,319
think. I mean, I feel
sorry for I feel sorry for Eve here,

1573
01:58:50,359 --> 01:58:54,239
but I mean she she if she
has this injury to her brain,

1574
01:58:54,319 --> 01:58:56,840
you know, And I mean,
whatever the cause of it was, it's

1575
01:58:56,880 --> 01:59:00,600
sad when here, like a fourteen
year old girl has the trauma brain injury,

1576
01:59:00,640 --> 01:59:04,600
that's pretty sad. However it happened
and how that happened, you know.

1577
01:59:04,920 --> 01:59:09,479
I think she doesn't seem to be
the instigator of all this, and

1578
01:59:09,760 --> 01:59:12,399
I feel sorry for it. Same
with all the other kids that were hurt,

1579
01:59:12,479 --> 01:59:16,680
and Richard believes that some of them
did actually die shortly before this incident,

1580
01:59:16,920 --> 01:59:20,880
and that's how they've managed to fiddle
them in. But I mean,

1581
01:59:20,880 --> 01:59:26,840
I do remember, I do remember
just in the mainstream news just stuck in

1582
01:59:26,920 --> 01:59:30,600
my mind, and it was around
I presume the inquest or something like that

1583
01:59:30,720 --> 01:59:33,960
that they had around it, but
all in the very much in the mainstream,

1584
01:59:34,039 --> 01:59:38,640
so obviously it was a bit of
a whitewash or whatever. But I

1585
01:59:38,720 --> 01:59:42,680
do remember it being in the mainstream
news that the sort of I think ambulance

1586
01:59:42,760 --> 01:59:45,960
crews, emergency services, first responders, and they were saying they were frustrated

1587
01:59:45,960 --> 01:59:49,880
because they were held back and were
allowed to go straight in to the to

1588
01:59:50,000 --> 01:59:56,279
the scene of what's supposed to have
happened, and that they were and I

1589
01:59:56,359 --> 01:59:58,840
think there was they said, oh
no, they couldn't. He wasn't safe.

1590
01:59:58,840 --> 02:00:01,840
But I mean emergent see first responders, I mean, I do a

1591
02:00:01,920 --> 02:00:04,880
job that I could ever do,
but heroically, you know, as a

1592
02:00:04,960 --> 02:00:09,199
disaster area. They go in there, risking their own lives to try and

1593
02:00:09,279 --> 02:00:12,800
save others. And the idea that
they'd be held back for a certain length

1594
02:00:12,880 --> 02:00:15,960
of time, I mean that that
doesn't Something doesn't sit there. And that

1595
02:00:15,199 --> 02:00:19,239
was something that came out just in
the mainstream inquest which made me think that

1596
02:00:19,520 --> 02:00:26,560
there is something wrong. There was
I think a lot of confusion was generated,

1597
02:00:26,600 --> 02:00:30,039
but the fact there was there was
a drill on the same day,

1598
02:00:30,079 --> 02:00:36,319
and you get this, well,
where does that happened? Ben? This

1599
02:00:36,439 --> 02:00:40,079
is how a lot of these things
that a lot of the confusion is generated.

1600
02:00:40,119 --> 02:00:44,239
And and see there was an emergency
service drill and Richard Richard actually believes

1601
02:00:44,279 --> 02:00:47,359
that some of the footage was created
from that drill rather than the main event.

1602
02:00:47,560 --> 02:00:51,119
So the Emergency Services, Police et
cetera would have been involved in that.

1603
02:00:53,760 --> 02:00:57,119
So a lot of the a lot
of the emergency services staff who weren't

1604
02:00:57,119 --> 02:01:00,199
directly involved with the incident would possibly
have reason and to say, well,

1605
02:01:00,239 --> 02:01:05,840
this is the cause of the confusion, and it's it's possibly that it's possible

1606
02:01:05,880 --> 02:01:11,159
that some of these what if people
think this is not possibily is There are

1607
02:01:11,199 --> 02:01:15,880
many many incidents in which, for
example, that you know, imaginary and

1608
02:01:16,960 --> 02:01:23,560
fake scenarios are created for the purpose
of exercise for the police, for the

1609
02:01:23,640 --> 02:01:27,119
emergency surfaces, for the armed forces, the air, entire companies that generate

1610
02:01:27,479 --> 02:01:30,840
fake terror and did I've been involved
in some of these myself. In my

1611
02:01:30,000 --> 02:01:33,319
case as a hospital porter, it
was actually within the hospital site itself,

1612
02:01:33,399 --> 02:01:40,000
but I took part in drills for
fire and other accidents and floods and other

1613
02:01:40,039 --> 02:01:44,359
accidents that are within the hospital.
I practiced evacuating patients from certain wards to

1614
02:01:44,439 --> 02:01:46,479
another and things like that. I
had to play the role of a patient

1615
02:01:46,520 --> 02:01:50,560
ones lie on a bed and pretend
that I had a broken leg, things

1616
02:01:50,640 --> 02:01:54,600
like that, And as far as
you know, people say, well,

1617
02:01:54,720 --> 02:01:57,600
well, you know, well,
it can't just make people disappear. You

1618
02:01:57,680 --> 02:02:01,119
can make people disappear under a protection
program. It happens all the time where

1619
02:02:01,359 --> 02:02:05,279
people will literally be given a completely
new identity and moved out their area.

1620
02:02:05,319 --> 02:02:12,079
Happened with well, sometimes it's people
who are pretty disreputable, like the Robert

1621
02:02:12,079 --> 02:02:16,199
Thompson and John Venables who actually killed
a little boy called James Bulger in the

1622
02:02:16,279 --> 02:02:21,479
eighties. They have been basically moved
out of it. They've be given you

1623
02:02:21,600 --> 02:02:25,640
completely new identities, new names and
everything, and they've been moved to different

1624
02:02:25,720 --> 02:02:29,479
locations away from where they live.
That can be done, so you know,

1625
02:02:29,520 --> 02:02:31,640
I don't be surprised, Like if
you you may be walking through the

1626
02:02:31,720 --> 02:02:36,840
Pennines in going to a little remote
village and you meet a woman called Jane

1627
02:02:36,880 --> 02:02:42,960
Smith who looks and sounds a little
bit like Joe Cox. You seen you

1628
02:02:43,079 --> 02:02:46,680
before somewhere, and they'll be given
backstories things like that as well. I

1629
02:02:46,760 --> 02:02:50,760
mean, this is this is clears
can be done. I mean, Joe

1630
02:02:50,840 --> 02:02:56,720
Cox is actually very similar figure to
the kind that generally we use in these

1631
02:02:57,880 --> 02:03:00,840
in these proper gand for example,
she's not a child, but she's quite

1632
02:03:00,880 --> 02:03:03,560
young and well forty one is forty
one is quite young to be an MP.

1633
02:03:03,760 --> 02:03:08,439
Most MP's are a bit older than
that, and she was like smiling,

1634
02:03:08,520 --> 02:03:12,479
and she's pretty young lady. She's
a family woman and everything. Yeah,

1635
02:03:12,520 --> 02:03:16,720
she's the she's the perfect martyr to
get people's heart, to tear people's

1636
02:03:16,760 --> 02:03:21,680
heart stranged in this sense. And
this was just before the Brexit and was

1637
02:03:21,720 --> 02:03:25,680
going to vote leave, but you
know, I'm just going to vote Leave.

1638
02:03:25,720 --> 02:03:28,359
But you know it's really you know, she she said she was what

1639
02:03:28,520 --> 02:03:31,159
she was a remainer and she's and
her husband's going around saying love like Joe.

1640
02:03:31,920 --> 02:03:33,760
You know, he's not he's not
at home with his family. He's

1641
02:03:33,760 --> 02:03:38,119
just going from TV student a TV
studio the day after she's dead. I

1642
02:03:38,199 --> 02:03:41,920
mean, so that that's you may
think, well, that wouldn't work,

1643
02:03:41,960 --> 02:03:46,279
but it does. It does work
on a lot of people. Rather persuading

1644
02:03:46,359 --> 02:03:49,800
rashly because they tried to persuade us
rationally to do what the government thought was

1645
02:03:49,840 --> 02:03:54,800
the right, saying a camera even
sent three million leaflets to us it's to

1646
02:03:54,840 --> 02:04:00,399
say well stay in the didn't work. So yeah, so I think Richard

1647
02:04:00,520 --> 02:04:03,239
is I think Richard is right.
I mean, you're not right about everything,

1648
02:04:03,319 --> 02:04:06,960
but I think he's right about this, and he certainly has should not

1649
02:04:08,079 --> 02:04:10,640
be being treated like us. No
one should be treated in this way,

1650
02:04:11,159 --> 02:04:15,279
and it's despicable what they've done to
him. I hope, hope things work

1651
02:04:15,319 --> 02:04:17,439
out for him, I really do. I would give a shout because you

1652
02:04:17,520 --> 02:04:23,560
can give donations if you go onto
his website. I think it's just work

1653
02:04:24,159 --> 02:04:27,000
a couple of quids just to help
him out with his legal fees, you

1654
02:04:27,119 --> 02:04:30,039
know, just a little shout out. Mm hmm, yeah, rich,

1655
02:04:30,159 --> 02:04:35,000
and don't I think is yeah?
So, will you be going to any

1656
02:04:35,079 --> 02:04:39,760
other court of the court cases coming
up then? If I can, Yes,

1657
02:04:39,840 --> 02:04:42,960
I'll report on them. I've reported
on the two so far. That

1658
02:04:43,159 --> 02:04:46,479
the second one was on was just
online Microsoft teams. But I'll report on

1659
02:04:46,520 --> 02:04:51,359
as many as I can. Yes, so, and of course they appreciate

1660
02:04:51,399 --> 02:04:56,199
the emotional support. You know.
Is it July or something. It's not

1661
02:04:56,279 --> 02:04:59,079
been fixed yet for the final because
there is going to be niche one more

1662
02:04:59,119 --> 02:05:01,239
hearing and that's we've got no date
for it yet if should it go ahead,

1663
02:05:01,239 --> 02:05:05,399
because it might not even go ahead
because I was thinking about this where

1664
02:05:05,439 --> 02:05:10,159
he wasn't allowed to show his evidence, which I thought was really really absolutely

1665
02:05:10,960 --> 02:05:14,039
what the hell's going on there?
You know? Why can't you devenge yourself

1666
02:05:14,079 --> 02:05:16,520
and allowed to show your evidence of
why you think you you know, ever,

1667
02:05:17,199 --> 02:05:19,720
and I thought that, hang on, that's just a bit like the

1668
02:05:20,239 --> 02:05:27,439
Helen Duncan case in the Second World
War where they prevented her from giving a

1669
02:05:27,520 --> 02:05:31,720
demonstration of her own mediumship to prove
that she had these supernatural powers if you

1670
02:05:31,800 --> 02:05:35,439
will, to the court and the
members of the jury, and they voted

1671
02:05:35,560 --> 02:05:41,239
not to entertain that at all.
She wasn't allowed to prove herself. You

1672
02:05:41,439 --> 02:05:45,560
know, if you're ever in court
and you're facing some kind of charge and

1673
02:05:45,880 --> 02:05:48,920
you know the trial is rigged against
you when you're when you have the potential

1674
02:05:49,199 --> 02:05:54,680
to exonerate yourself and you're not allowed
to. They give you a fake,

1675
02:05:54,880 --> 02:05:59,000
they give you a different route to
try and exonerate yourself. And well there's

1676
02:05:59,000 --> 02:06:01,039
a very easy way of doing in
another way. And that to me,

1677
02:06:01,439 --> 02:06:04,640
Yes, there are there are parallels
between the Witchcraft trial and what's happening to

1678
02:06:04,760 --> 02:06:11,920
Richard. Definitely a lot of parallels. It's it's yeah, that's what's very

1679
02:06:12,039 --> 02:06:15,319
underwear and the history. Yeah,
there's one's very unfair and of course very

1680
02:06:15,359 --> 02:06:20,960
distressing for Richard. M we wish, yeah, one hundred percent and and

1681
02:06:21,479 --> 02:06:26,000
it's so important because it's as we've
as you've been saying, Ben, and

1682
02:06:26,439 --> 02:06:32,479
it's it's part of a much bigger
program where they're trying to stop anyone dissenting

1683
02:06:32,680 --> 02:06:40,199
from from challenging the new World order. And so it is a crucial importance

1684
02:06:40,239 --> 02:06:45,039
because you know, if they get
away with this, then obviously they're going

1685
02:06:45,119 --> 02:06:49,600
to do more or more, and
it's just going to prevent any of us

1686
02:06:49,680 --> 02:06:54,680
being able to speak out and and
talk about these things. And so it's

1687
02:06:54,680 --> 02:06:58,840
slight importance that he's defended. Yeah, that's the ultimate objective, to create

1688
02:06:58,880 --> 02:07:01,800
a common law precedent which can be
used against other people. Yeah, if

1689
02:07:02,039 --> 02:07:08,079
Richard goes down, we're next.
Yeah, it's all about all about fight.

1690
02:07:08,520 --> 02:07:12,199
Yeah yeah, yeah, right.
I think we're coming to the end

1691
02:07:12,239 --> 02:07:14,640
of our show here, folks.
I mean, we could obviously go on

1692
02:07:14,680 --> 02:07:18,359
all night, but we have to
draw a line somewhere, and we're now

1693
02:07:18,880 --> 02:07:23,239
over an hour into our second part, so I think that is probably a

1694
02:07:23,319 --> 02:07:27,920
good conclusion to end upon. So
I'd like to say thank you to Liz

1695
02:07:28,079 --> 02:07:31,479
and Mark Brown for joining us to
see on the Parallel Peak show to give

1696
02:07:31,520 --> 02:07:35,880
us some insights into your lives.
And then you want to tell the ABI

1697
02:07:35,920 --> 02:07:42,119
answer about your channel, and about
your websites and about your art and anything

1698
02:07:42,159 --> 02:07:45,439
else you want to tell us about
before we leave you. It's a growing

1699
02:07:45,560 --> 02:07:49,600
it's a budding channel. It's a
growing channel. So basically the crafty Nihilist

1700
02:07:49,920 --> 02:07:56,880
you'll I think Mark does Twitter X
is it? Mark does it? I'm

1701
02:07:57,000 --> 02:08:01,119
sort of on there, but more
performing Facebook. We're sort of on Twitter,

1702
02:08:01,239 --> 02:08:03,880
We're sort of on YouTube, we're
sort of on Next, but it's

1703
02:08:03,960 --> 02:08:13,039
mainly a YouTube channel. Yeah,
it was slowly growing. So oops,

1704
02:08:15,479 --> 02:08:18,680
frozen again. They go on again, terally going to get to I thought

1705
02:08:18,680 --> 02:08:22,239
we were going to get to the
end and they wouldn't. Really the bail

1706
02:08:22,279 --> 02:08:28,520
you have pulled the plug. Well, I can say that they do have

1707
02:08:28,680 --> 02:08:33,039
a YouTube channel and they do their
live quiz shows. I think on Saturday

1708
02:08:33,119 --> 02:08:37,119
nights. Don't they on the Crafting
Nartists on YouTube? It's worth if they

1709
02:08:37,920 --> 02:08:43,760
join them for that. I think
it's like seven seven o'clock seven. I

1710
02:08:43,920 --> 02:08:46,359
really do enjoy it. I often
take part in these myself. You could

1711
02:08:46,399 --> 02:08:48,520
join the chat box and they make
it very amusing and they it's always great

1712
02:08:48,600 --> 02:08:54,000
fun and they have the quiz and
then Mark usually does it give us a

1713
02:08:54,000 --> 02:08:58,359
little lecture about usually very interesting subject
So I do recommend going to that,

1714
02:08:58,520 --> 02:09:01,880
Yes, definitely. So what can
we expect to see? Have you been

1715
02:09:01,960 --> 02:09:05,640
in the next couple of weeks?
Well, I'm going to be. I'm

1716
02:09:05,640 --> 02:09:13,479
actually speaking at the Mablethorpe group at
the week is This is actually the weekend

1717
02:09:13,680 --> 02:09:16,680
the Monday the thirteenth, actually the
Monday the thirteenth of this month, which

1718
02:09:16,760 --> 02:09:18,960
is made. By the time this
show goes out, it may have already

1719
02:09:18,960 --> 02:09:22,119
passed, but it's there will be
a video available for it, so you

1720
02:09:22,159 --> 02:09:26,520
can I'll be talking about the BBC
and propaganda and the kind of the things

1721
02:09:26,560 --> 02:09:30,159
we've been talking about this evening,
some of the things we've been talking about

1722
02:09:30,159 --> 02:09:33,800
the evening, So yeah, I
will be The maybe Fork group is a

1723
02:09:33,840 --> 02:09:35,520
local group but it doesn't have a
website or any think. It's just some

1724
02:09:35,600 --> 02:09:39,520
people in the area who get together
and are open minded and they've invited me

1725
02:09:39,600 --> 02:09:41,800
to go and do a talk.
And this has been the second time I've

1726
02:09:41,800 --> 02:09:45,600
spoken for them, and I'm really
looking forward to it. They're great people.

1727
02:09:46,439 --> 02:09:48,640
And when is that Ben? That's
on Monday the thirteenth of this month,

1728
02:09:50,640 --> 02:09:54,199
Monday the thirteenth. I think our
show would have gone out by then,

1729
02:09:54,479 --> 02:09:58,000
so that's excellent. Oh yeah,
but that's no good luck of that

1730
02:09:58,119 --> 02:10:01,239
anyway. Are you going to be
videoing it or something? Yes, so

1731
02:10:01,399 --> 02:10:05,840
will be will be making a recording
and you, just like I did for

1732
02:10:05,880 --> 02:10:09,680
the last one, I will be
making a recording so we can say as

1733
02:10:09,720 --> 02:10:11,199
you miss it, yeah, but
do come along better if you can come

1734
02:10:11,199 --> 02:10:13,359
along. It's much more fun if
you can come along too. Yeah.

1735
02:10:15,159 --> 02:10:18,319
But as I say, our recording
will go out after you've already been there,

1736
02:10:18,600 --> 02:10:22,359
so unfortunately this is old news now. But never mind, I'm sure

1737
02:10:22,399 --> 02:10:26,720
we can catch it on Ben the
j our Reporter. Yeah, on YouTube,

1738
02:10:26,840 --> 02:10:30,720
and add well hospital porters kids,
you will, and also, of

1739
02:10:30,760 --> 02:10:33,960
course do you to pick up my
books while rising a novel of disclosure?

1740
02:10:33,720 --> 02:10:37,520
Please if you like this program,
you'll enjoy this book, you really will.

1741
02:10:37,960 --> 02:10:41,000
And there's two sequels. Yeah,
definitely, can you definitely pick that

1742
02:10:41,079 --> 02:10:45,479
one up? All right, Well, thank you for joining us at once

1743
02:10:45,600 --> 02:10:50,119
More Ben as guest host, and
please do come again. We'd love having

1744
02:10:50,199 --> 02:10:54,640
you on and really enjoyed it.
In augun us. You're coming down to

1745
02:10:56,159 --> 02:10:58,880
dor sit to talk Dorset Earth Mistress
in August, so we'll be catching you.

1746
02:11:00,119 --> 02:11:03,439
But then, so it looks like
our crafted eyes have returned briefly,

1747
02:11:03,600 --> 02:11:09,600
so we can just say good night
to them. I'm afraid listen, Mark,

1748
02:11:09,600 --> 02:11:13,039
we've just done We've just we've just
done your little outro because you were

1749
02:11:13,159 --> 02:11:16,600
there in your absence and sorry,
yeah, don't think they can hear me.

1750
02:11:18,279 --> 02:11:22,039
We can, you can see you, we can hear. We've just

1751
02:11:22,600 --> 02:11:24,880
through the mic, so we just
give you a good outro. We've described,

1752
02:11:26,000 --> 02:11:31,279
we've described your Saturday evening show and
things like that very much. Yeah,

1753
02:11:31,359 --> 02:11:33,439
but yeah, we're still recording the
show here, so we're still being

1754
02:11:33,560 --> 02:11:37,439
You're still were being precluding this section. So your live show goes out on

1755
02:11:37,560 --> 02:11:41,319
Saturdays, doesn't it we your quiz
is that right? Yeah, Saturday nights

1756
02:11:41,359 --> 02:11:46,560
at seven pm UK time. But
Mark's going to see go Beckley Teppee for

1757
02:11:46,600 --> 02:11:48,600
two weeks, so it might be. Yeah, I'm going on the cute

1758
02:11:48,800 --> 02:11:56,840
Hugh Newman Megalithomania tour to Turkey to
Beckley Tepe and the ancient sides frown there,

1759
02:11:56,880 --> 02:12:01,680
so I'll have information and video footage
of that when I come back on

1760
02:12:01,800 --> 02:12:09,359
the channel. We still still yeah, yeah, but yeah other than that,

1761
02:12:09,840 --> 02:12:13,399
this is our exery site and mainly
Mark's Amazing Talks is what you want

1762
02:12:13,399 --> 02:12:18,439
to be on there for Marks Amazing
Talks. I learned a lot from those,

1763
02:12:18,479 --> 02:12:22,960
Yeah, I do very much.
It's very nice, very nice,

1764
02:12:22,000 --> 02:12:26,680
you just say so. All right, thanks guys everyone for joining us on

1765
02:12:26,760 --> 02:12:31,000
the Paranormal Peep Show. Stay tuned
for next month when we'll be hopefully back

1766
02:12:31,039 --> 02:12:33,760
with a B and another guest.
I don't know who yet, but we'll

1767
02:12:33,760 --> 02:12:35,800
certainly hopefully a guest lined up for
you, so stay tuned with us.

1768
02:12:35,800 --> 02:12:41,039
Stand So, thanks well and all
for the Paranormal Beat Show and thanks for

1769
02:12:41,119 --> 02:12:45,960
watching and look out for other great
shows on the Paranormal UK Radio Network.

1770
02:12:46,079 --> 02:13:26,840
Good night, all right. You're
listening to the Paranormal UK Radio Network,

1771
02:13:26,279 --> 02:13:30,319
number one for paranormal topics in the
UK.