Hey, what's going on? Clippers fans, Clippers people, Clippers folks.
It is me William Upjack Year, Clips and Bit. This is season two,
episode twenty five. You don't know We are Clips and DiPT, your
favorite Los Angeles Clippers podcast. Join, as always by my two fabulous co
hosts or one really good co host, one okay co host. I'll let
you make your own decisions. Charles Mocker. How's it going, guys.
I'm doing good. I guess Clippers one. Went to see The Killer in
theaters that was awesome, got a new pair of shoes today, had a
late brunch. I'm feeling great after what we saw from the starter, specifically
last night. So I'm doing good. Adam, how are you I?
I'm doing okay. I had to watch The Killer at home because I wasn't
invited to the theater with these guys or anything. It takes you forever to
be We had to make a tight ten thirty showing guys, there's midnight showings
out there on a Friday night. You couldn't. Netflix really limits those release
things. Releases, you guys are killing me. I was a little underwhelmed
by the ending, by the way I liked it. I thought it was
good, but I think the ending was We're gonna finish off. We're gonna
finish off. We're gonna finish up with my thoughts on the Killers, be
sure to stay tuned for that. But we are talking about the Clippers.
They're back in the win column. Meati win over the Rockets. We're gonna
talk about that, what we liked from the starters as well as some of
the sloppiness from the offense. Uh. And then we in the second segment,
we got to talk about what is going on with this bench. They
continue to hemorrhage points. It was on full display in that game, albeit
a win. And we'll also have a little preview for you of the Spurs
game coming up. Clippers got a Texas double header. I don't know,
I don't know what you call that. The too long, too long,
I don't know any missionary two step is when I'm calling it, all right,
that's fantastic. Actually, yeah, let's let's get right into it,
because I think as clunky as the offense looked at times from the Clippers,
for me, one of the most encouraging or one of the most positive takeaways
was we did get three great individual performances from three of our top guys.
I'll let you Adam jump in. Where do you want to jump in on
what you saw from the starters. Pick your poison. You go with Hard
and you can go with PG. You you can go with Westbrook if you
want not a starter, but hey, I know you like to go off
the rails on this show. Who me? I'm going with James Harden because
this was somewhat of a playoff template for how things could go. The intensity
in this game and late in the fourth quarter, the desperation you saw really
from both teams, because the Rockets wanted to keep their winning streak going the
Clippers wanted to end their losing streak. It was impressive, It was ratcheted
up. There were big moves made late, but I was getting frustrated with
the amount of hero ball by Kawhi and Paul George being the only guys taking
shots for a while. There was about a four minute stretch from the six
minute mark to about the two minute mark where the Clippers didn't make a field
goal, and I said, look, he brought in James Harden to run
the offense through him. And what happened after that? He finds of each
Zubots for a couple of easy ones. Zubots has a block on Sengoon and
then dunks on him on the other end. Paul George to be I mean
so far that Zubots is best done to the season and might end that that
might end up being the best don of the season for Zoo. He had
too, They were pretty similar in the last two minutes. I think he
had all six of his points in the fourth quarter in the last two minutes
and it was all due to the thread of the pick and roll with James
Harden and also Zoo just being fierce, just being a beast out there.
And I guess postgame coach Lou came out and said that I guess I listened
to it, but he said de Visa Zubats was dealing with some of those
back spasms in the first half, he didn't have the same bounds. Well,
it was there in the fourth quarter when they needed it most. That
was his best stint of the season by far, one of the best of
his careers, because you can make the argument he was the best player for
them in the fourth quarter. Now, he was dependent on James Harden setting
him up, but the way he was finishing with authority, and the block
on Sengoon, who he played beautifully all night Defensively, the Rockets they won
six games in a row for a reason. I know a lot of people
still it's not it's hard to wrap your head around the fact that the Rockets
were playing that well. I guess it just doesn't really compute because they've been
down for so long. Yeah, but the truth is they were playing very
good basketball and the Clippers made them look pretty average for the most part.
Guys who were playing great in Sengoon also Jalen Green getting blocked like that by
Paul George and then Paul George getting the layup on the other end off a
pass from Kawhi Leonard in transition that block from PG thirteen after he had just
missed a three, like he was upset with himself and got back on defense.
Then Kawhi ripped it from a Jalen Green and got a steal steel one
of them in the fourth quarter from Kawhi. This was that fourth quarter last
season against Memphis to also break their losing streak after they had lost their first
five with Russell Westbrook, after they had given up that fifty point third quarter
and looked like it was all falling apart, and then the Clippers said enough,
we have to win this game, and they did. That's what it
looked like out there. But James Harden coming through with that clutch shot,
that's what he can do. Oh my god. For everyone questioning the move
and Russell Westbrook going to the bench or them deciding to play through James Harden,
it's like, how do you not see the vision? Guys? I
posted what I said in show when I said, look, I think the
biggest reason to do this is so us is coming off the bench where he's
better suited, where he can run the second unit, and he did not
have a very good game early in that fourth quarter. Yeah, but this
was James Harden having the ball in his hands more than he ever had,
and guess what, he looked the most comfortable he's ever had so far in
a Clippers uniform. And it's just ramping up. You could see it from
the Denver game. He's slowly getting better and better, more downhill attacks at
the basket. The step back three, though, was just a thing of
perfection. We've seen that go against the Clippers, go against the entire league
for so long, and finally the Clippers had that on their side where he
gets fouled on an and one step back three pointer and converse the four point
play to win it. There couldn't be a more poetic way for the Clippers
to end the losing streak than James Harden doing that against his former team in
the Rockets. Yes, we were talking about kind of the big three individual
performances and I put this down on the breakdown, but this game felt like
a worse scenario offense win for the Clippers. And what I mean like,
it's not bad, right like, we still have it's a new starting lineup.
There wasn't cohesion. We talked about this a lot of people were talking
about on Twitter during the game, where yeah, we got we got the
individual beforeances we need, which is great, but this is what the worst
case is, right like once the offense really gets humming and you know,
the starters, the starting line up, which we'll talk about the net rating.
It was great. It was so nice to see what we've been told,
you know, if things break down, we have these guys to still
get it done, and we got it done against a team that had the
sixth best defensive rating, Like this was exactly the kind of win other than
a blowout, which wasn't gonna happen against this Rockets team. This is exactly
the kind of win. No, I disagree, it really could have,
but we can get into that a bit. But it didn't. But this
is what we loved from the Big three, Like we got I mean,
Kahi started slow. He took what two field goal attempts in the first quarter.
I thought he was I thought he was kind of invisible in the first
through no fault of his own, it's totally it's one damn yeah. But
he made it. It was a three his first he made. He was
started three. I was telling you, I was like, in the Terrence
Man starting era, Kawhi has one hundred percent field goal percentage. But anyway,
he it seemed like he was deferring a lot. I at one point
had to like look up at the jumble trying to be like, why still
on the floor right, Like I thought it was that it was that apparent.
So they're they're very still They're very much still in the tentative steps where
they're trying to feel each other out. No one's trying to step on anyone's
toes. But Charles, sorry, I defer back to you. I couldn't
all good. And then PG he started hot, really rough stretch on the
third, but who was there to pick everything up? The other two guys
like this was this is everything we were sold. It was a small dose
of it. But comforting whin Yeah, sure, someone say on micro does
Uh. I don't know if comforting win is the right word, but it's
a really like, oh, this is some ship we can get used to.
And anyway, after a six game losy, you're not gonna go ahead
and go on record and say as a comforting win. Okay, yeah,
it was a necessary win, right, like not a must win, No,
it was a must win. Well, if you want to say,
like that feeling of you have to have it type of game. It's early
in the season, but you're right, it's as close at least as you
can get without being in a playoff situation and needing an early season victory to
start to turn your season around. Yeah, and then the starters were plus
twenty and sixteen minutes we talked about Zoo. Terrence Man had a very Patrick
Beverly like stat line twenty one minutes, one point six boards, three assists,
one steal, one block plus fifteen What did we think we're working?
Like a knee knock there or something too Yeah, which before he shot the
free throws which for his one point, he made one which would be his
one point, he took it. He was grabbing his knee there after a
play and it seemed like he was he was being a little tentative to put
wait on it. He did not go back to the tunnel though, I
was watching that in stadium, and he did stay on the bench, So
hopefully that is nothing too serious. What did we think of Terrence was a
starter? Adham? How did you feel on his perfect It's exactly what I've
been wanting for. This was the starting lineup When we talked about who do
you want starting like? This was the starting lineup I said I wanted from
the get go, once, once the straight like. To the front office's
credit and to Tyler's credit, this is the bill of goods that we were
sold. It's not like this came out of nowhere. This is the bill
of goods that we were sold coming into the season. I definitely think it's
what the front office has wanted. But having that versatility out there and switch
ability with James Harden, who you can just sick on whoever the best offensive
player is on the other team for a few possessions. So Kawhi and Paul
George don't get tired or worn out guarding those guys. To their credit,
they were spectacular late with their defense. But maybe it's because they had a
little bit more in the tail because they got sixteen minutes with that starting five
and Terrence Man doing a lot of the dirty work. And I think he
had a play where he had a nice offensive rebound that looked like Patrick Beverley
to your point, Chuck, and I'm trying to see here. Yeah,
he did have one offensive rebound and I believe he kicked it out for a
three pointer, Like just making those little plays like that. By the way
of EATSA Zubats, that kickout he had. It was on the short roll
in the fourth quarter. I tok the into Zubats, then to Paul George.
He misses the three pointer, and then Zubots bats it into the hands
of Norman Pale who knocks the three pointer down. Was six minutes left.
I just can't say enough about it. Eatsa zubats in that fourth quarter.
He was amazing. But more about normal we talk about the bench, but
sorry. Yeah, with Terrence Man, I thought was a was a very
natural fit. It's just easy, it's just seamless. It just he's never
a negative. It never ever feels like Terrence Man has a bad game,
regardless of the shooting stats. Yes, I and he's he's not the Avery
Bradley unstatable, but he is an unstatable that seems to contribute more to winning.
Yeah, yeah, unstatable. It contributes to winning. I think is
a great way to describe it. There were a couple of times earlier early
in the game. I think it was the first two uh opportunities for this
where Harden passed up a catch and shoot three and you kind of heard the
crowd on the second one kind of be like like what are you doing?
Like a little like eh. But that felt like it evened out a little
bit and they kind of figured out that maybe Terence should maybe be taking those
catch and shoot threes or something like that. So we saw kinks being worked
out in real time for the first time with James Harden, which hey,
it took some time. No real shocker there, But it felt like we
were seeing guys iron things out as the game went on, which we hadn't
with the other starting lineup. We just were running our head into the same
wall every single possession. In this it was like shots were falling, which
was great from our three stars, which makes things easier always, but like
they were figuring it out in real time. Terrence and James had kind of
a defensive discussion after a blown coverage. I can't remember who got the easy
layup, but someone on the Rockets did and they had a spirited discussion and
it didn't affect anything. So like, that's also what you like to see
too, is guys can figure things out together on the court without any weird
miss being prevalent. In the midst of a sixth game of Sixth Street,
James also had it wasn't counted as a steal for him because he got the
deflection, somebody else came up with the basketball. It was in the fourth
quarter. It was big. It was like, oh, yeah, by
the way, when I need to in the post, I can play defense.
It all kind of went into that just feeling of urgency that I felt
like they had in the fourth quarter already everybody was doing a little bit more
to help this team win well, and James Harden too. I feel like
that's the thing, Like, even when he was at the peak of his
career, like when he won the MVP and when he was in those conversations,
the big thing, like I feel like the big talking point was always
always defense, his defense. He's always been a fairly sound post defender,
especially for his size, and at one point led the league in deflections.
Uh. And I thought he had some really he rebounds in this game,
Like I you know, like that came up in some clutch minutes that you
know that that were really important towards winning this game. He led them with
nine boards. Yeah, you're right, he led with nine I thought it
was Like I thought the rebounding was incredible, And obviously that's a group effort,
you know, that's a that's zoo boxing now, but there's a lot
of things that go into it. But I thought him like being like aggressive
on the boards is very helpful. Now he's the guy we want the ball
in his hands if he gets it off the boards. More rebounds of PJ.
Tucker an actual center. We're gonna talk about PJ. Tucker in the
second segment for sure, No, this was I think this was as well
as the starting five could have gone against this Rockets team. I did want
to say, like this is like a positive segment because these were good and
hey, we can be negative. We don't have to be. I do
want to say. The thing that has to get ironed out is all three
are very hesitant on the on the catch and shoot three. It's like it's
so slow. Every single one of them is like taking an extra dribble,
taking an extra thought. We've seen this with Kawhi before in the past,
we've seen this with but now I feel like we've even seen it with Paul
George. Like it's that's just one of those things like when when they get
faster to release on those wide open shots, even if they're not making them,
it just makes the offense home a lot more. It makes it a
lot more dangerous. I mean, in a game where they shot sixty six
percent the starting lineup and almost put up fifty points in just sixteen minutes,
I agree with you. They can still be better. It's crazy to say,
but they had an offensive rating of one point thirty a defensive rating of
seventy the starting They were great for that to happen in Game one where Russ
comes off the bench and Man to be in there. I do think it
speaks a lot to Man and just smoothing out the kinks in the offense and
also just being in tune defensively together. What was cool too, was just
like ty Lou before the game, he was asked about pace and he was
just like, I don't care about pace anymore, like but to say to
kind of like I think Adam, we were there. It was very funny
how he responded to this question. But I think he met like, pace
doesn't mean we're just sprinting up and down the court. This goes back to
what we talked about with like what will what you were saying. Once they
figure out to shoot these threes a little quicker, the offense looks quicker,
right like, and then Harden getting these boards that helps the pace more too,
because it's just it's pace within the game itself. It just doesn't mean
sprinting up and down the court. Yeah, I know, I agree one
hundred percent. And I think when we think about pace, we think about
teams like rip, roaring and transition and like it would be great I could
get some of those easy buckets. That's just not really been their game.
It's never really been their game. There are different ways to improve the pace,
and I just think even you know, having the ball be less stagnant
in a possession and not having that hesitancy to shoot when there is an open
shot there, like not looking because we've seen this too, even when the
Clippers offense was humming a lot better, right like one maybe two extra passes,
like you know, like people being maybe a little too deferential. And
that's even you know, before adding James Harden. So it's just one of
those things like pace, pace to mean is it's important, but it's it's
not only one thing, you know, it's it's not just it's not just
running all the time, because that's not what this Clippers team is ever gonna
be. I think there was sorry could go, no, no, no,
you go. There was an example of that early in the third quarter
where the Clippers are down two at the half and they got up four,
so they were a quick plus six to start off the third. But then
there was a play where Kawhi Leonard had it on the left wing. It
was knocked away from him. He goes almost into the back court to retrieve
it, and Coach Slew said enough time out at the eight forty two mark
or the third corps just because they started playing slow again, like within the
half court set. There was no more movement. It was isoball and I
think that's why he called that time out. He had just seen enough.
Their offense was already starting to fall into those bad habits. Yeah, ty
no on when to call that. Tie's time out management was a little interesting
last night, but that was a great time out on his part. He
also came in that press conference he did not seem to be in the highest
of spirits, which I don't know who would be during a six game losing
streak. So it's I'm very happy for Tyler as well to get this win
after everything that had been talked about during the insanity of the six game losing
streak. Yeah, people laid off your shoulders, especially with two days off
afterwards you lose again, seven game losing the streak, more of the same
questions. That's what I was worried about. If they would have lost this
game and then two days off before playing the Spurs, like it just would
have been. You know, the national media pays attention to the Cliffers now
when they're losing. Usually, if they're playing good, they say, we
don't want to trust him yet, and if they're playing bad, they say
yeah, they say, this is his teammate, so happy. They easily
could have lost this game. They were down six late. I thought when
Jabari as they were knotted up at ninety four or three minutes left, and
then Jabari Smith Junior hits that three pointer. It felt like at that time
because nobody could score that, it was like a twenty point lead. Just
just going up by three. That's how it felt. And then the offense
ran through James Harden and they go on a twelve to one run to finish
out the ball game. It was good stuff, it was. And also
before we go to the second segment in season tournament fun like the vibe It
was fun on last night. I mean something to say right like, was
this more? I don't know that this was more like the intensity was because
it was in season tournament game so much as it was one team with a
great winning streak and one team with blue court. Blue court made it more
fun. I'm not giving the n season much credit for the intensity. I
think the Clippers knew they need to win. I'm cashing my check from Adams,
my seventy five dollars check from Adam Silver for mentioning how good it was
right now, so you guys can feel free to hop on, get you
extra seventy five bucks or not. Come it up. We do. We've
loved the starters. We talked about how good they were, but we have
but we have to talk about the bench, which was not ideal. If
you're wondering what we were just laughing at if you can't see us, it's
Adam's very funny name on our video version of this podcast. You tube.
Hey the YouTube go to YouTube dot com slash at Cliverer's podcast. You can
see all the funny name. Subscribe, like and subscribe. Yeah, that'd
be great. But coming up, we're gonna be talking what's up with the
bench. Daniel Tice had his debut. I mean, I don't I don't
know how you can judge his debut, but we're gonna talk about what happened
because he certainly did try and block a couple of dunks. The ads have
been allowed for some people. If that's been the case, where you go
ahead and turn it down. We got bench talk, come it up in
three two one. Welcome back in Cliffs and Dip season two. Good to
be here. I'm out of MASLM. We've got Chef Mockler and William Updyke.
If you're watching on the YouTube, my current name is not giving the
un season tournament much credit. I'm not sticking with it for now. Coming
up will preview the Texas two step happening in San Antonio where they're staying.
So it's like a stationary two step whatever. They're just they're just moving around
in a circle. They're just hanging out, hovering holding pattern. Yeah,
a holding pattern is where they'll be in San Antonio. But they do have
a day off in between Monday and Wednesday or those games. So let's talk
about the bench, which I think there's real concerns here. To put it
lightly, and for me it comes down to uh one pairing that has not
worked well at all. Well. Avitza Zubats next to PJ. Tucker at
the four has been really tough. Yeah, really a struggle in the Clippers
so far. So any center for sure, but those two in particular have
played in seven games now in thirty four minutes of play, they are a
net minus forty seven point two. The Clippers are shooting twenty seven percent from
the floor when those two are out there together, and last night they combined
to be a minus eighteen as they went two for thirteen from the floor.
The Clippers did when those two were out there, and guys, the eye
test matches it. I was, Oh, yeah, PJ. Tucker's just
hanging out in the far side corner. The defense pays him no mind,
They crowd the paint, Paul George is on the floor. There's no space
to operate whatsoever with PJ. Tucker and A beats the Zubats there. And
what was baffling to me was Terrence Man comes out at about the four and
a half minute mark of the first cour and I'm thinking, Oh, they're
still gonna run that same second quarter lineup that has been successful with the Vitza
Zoo bots, which means Zoo Terrence, Paul George, Norman Powell. And
who am I missing here that they threw in? Was it PJ Tucker,
Zoo Terrence Norman Powell, PJ Tucker. Maybe PJ Tucker was the one out
there with him no, because he and Zoo would be in the same matchup.
All right, I'm having trouble figuring out exactly what I'm out there right
now. Terrence, it was Norm, it was Paul Russ. I'm missing
Russ. That's who it was. That five man group of Russell Westbrook next
to Paul George, Norm Palll, Terrence Man, and Viza Zobots was doing
damage to start off second quarters. That was a nice adjustment that was made.
So Terrence Man comes out with about four and a half minutes left in
the first and I'm like, oh, it's because he's gonna come out to
start the second. The only difference to start off that second quarter in the
five man lineup was PJ. Tucker was in for Terrence Man, next to
Russ, next to Paul George, next to Norman Powell, and unfortunately next
to a beat to Zubots. And they got crushed. And it happened again
to start the fourth quarter, and they got crushed. And that's why I'm
saying they could have easily won this game by fifteen points if they just didn't
do that. Sary. It was that detrimental and it has been so far
and it's it's just the spacing. It's not going to work. They don't
respect PJ Tucker as a shooter. Zuobots is not a shooter. The court
is absolutely congested out there. Well, I felt like even worse is we
saw three guard lineups somehow with three non shooters, like we saw lineups with
uh Russ and Harden and Norm and PJ and Zoo. So you're not stopping
a you're not stopping anything, and you're also not scoring because you have three
non shooters on the floor from I believe, defensively, they're giving up like
one hundred and thirty points per one hundred possessions with Zoobots and PJ Tucker out
there in those minutes so far this season, and offensively can't it's below ninety's.
It makes zero sense. It's not working on the entire point of doing
that is for boards and defense. You're giving up something offensively, but you're
gonna be better defensively. Well, that has not worked at all so far.
How can you be good offensively? I just don't get how you can
be good offensively in the modern NBA with three non shooters on the floor,
like even against a second unit, how are you scoring. It seems like
they're just trying to find minutes for guys in PJ. Tucker because pregame said
coach Will, Coach Lou said, where else do you put him? No?
No, no no, they thought no, no, no, Coach
Lou said, in regarding to who was coming in to be that fifth guy
with Russ coming off the bench, Terrence Man or PJ. Tucker, he
thought about PJ. Tucker in the starting five, like that is this is
a little bit concerning. Yeah, I think my thing is is, like
I know that I'm insane for saying this, but if PJ. Tucker has
to play fifteen minutes a game for some reason, which just he does,
you just don't have enough front there is not true. That's not true.
Affee only played twenty one minutes. My point is they took him out early
in the first quarter. They could have put him right back in to start
the second with that second unit that had been working, and they didn't.
He only played twenty one minutes. Guys like he easily could have filled those
minutes that PJ. Tucker was out there, or a mere coffee some or
Kobe Brown or Moose of the yabatsa there are there are other options that are
not going to bleed points and not get you any to the degree that we've
seen so far with PJ. Tucker next to Viata Zubos And again I like
to minus twenty four in just under fifteen minutes. I'm support recorded not a
single stat other than three personal fouls the Tony Snell catline. It was as
bad as the box score looks. It was that bad. Now again,
I think at the five there's utility there against certain teams, like against Denver.
Yeah, but you can't have him and it beats a zoobots matched up
together. It's just it's bad. Or Tyson. I also think Tyson doesn't
make sense. Yeah, him and can't be together. He's played together.
I don't think that makes sense. I really, I just don't, especially
if Russell Westbrook is on the floor at any point, I just don't.
How is that ever gonna work? Do we think that this that's not even
a knock on rust. It's just like you need to like you need to
make life that are catered to what you're you know, like what your players
are good at. And having Russ with two non shooters on the floor,
Like I just don't really understand how it's beneficial for him. The I want
to talk about the Amir thing really quick, because La Murray was on Twitter
today also singing the praises of a mirror who moves better than PJ Tucker.
PJ Tucker cannot switch between like multiple like he can switch between the four and
the five on guarding guys. He can't defend on the perimeter. He's lost
a step there. A mere coffee has is I think it's someone on Twitter
said this, but they're like, if a mere coffee brings us seventy percent
of the defense that PJ. Tucker does, but one twenty percent of the
offense, which is not a lot, but he can't shoot the ball and
things like that, we should just play a mere coffee, Like he would
be a better option than he knows the system. He'd be a better option
than PJ Tucker. He brought up a mir coffee two weeks ago on this
show. And then I get somebody the comments section saying, like, Adam,
we're not exactly concerned about a mirafe right now. There's other issues.
It's like, well, he can help, he can help the police is
a huge issue. Guys have to figure this out because I thought that,
I mean, I think that's been like as they start to gel, even
as clunky as it looks, it just becomes more and more apparent like this
second unit is killing them, Like it is killing them. Every shift they're
you know, they're mine, they're they're minus ten. But it seems like
most shifts, the best the starters have to come in at this crazy deficit,
already not working that great together, and then you're now under the gun.
You're always playing from behind. So yeah, everybody wants to get into
their ISO thing. Everybody want thinks like, hey, let me put some
of this on my shoulders, Like it's not a recipe for these guys to
ever establish like the the pen ultimate form of their chemistry. If all the
time they're like, yeah, they're at the gun. Well, I'm old
enough to remember when a Mere Coffee signed that new contract. What a bargain
it was to get him at that price three years, eleven million, whatever
it was. It's not for him to sit on the bench. That doesn't
make it a bargain. That makes it kind of worthless. You're not getting
your return on that money if he's never playing anymore, and you're complaining about
not having as many wings. I'm not saying the Clippers are, but people
in the comment sex who we're complaining about that. And I'm like, Amir,
Amir is still on this sad guys. Try um, He's been good.
He was legit their best player for an entire month. He kept them
afloat before like to say that this guy has somehow gotten way worse. He's
not thirty nine, he's twenty six or something. His skills have not diminished.
What are we talking about? And I have the exact number for you
because I want to be exact here A PJ. Tucker and vitz Zubots in
their thirty four minutes, their offensive rating is eighty three point six the Clippers
with them two on the floor, their defensive rating is one thirty point eight.
That's a minus forty seven net rating in thirty four minutes with them two
on the floor. So yes, there are second units that are not going
to be a plus. But there's a difference between getting beat by two or
three points in your minutes played versus getting demolished by eighteen points in the eight
minutes. Those two guys were out there last night together and let's s the
best plus minus from the bench last night was minus six from Daniel Tyson Norm
Powell. Norm Powell forty from three so far on the season on four and
a half attempts per game. Loved the offensive start from Norm Powell to this
season. He's been everything. I liked him in closing lineups too. Yeah,
his offense has been great. Daniel Tys will talk about we got to
talk about. The big change with the bench was Russell Westbrook was leading the
bench. This was not Russell Westbrook's best game. He was two of nine
from the floor, and to the start, it was brutal. Some of
the shots selection. He took multiple off the dribble threes, which like,
look man, we're not trying to dump on Russ. That has never been
a part of his game, not like even not even like when he was
an MVP. He was not taking off the dribble threes. That's never been
a part of his game. And he also too early in the fourth quarter
that were not corner three pointers where he has been shooting well. And that's
James Harden got subbed in. There was a time out. I think they
were down six, and that's when James Harden was put back in, and
I think it was related to Russ was definitely taking some ill aby shots and
he was missing. He missed every single shot he took at the rim.
He was zero for three at the rim. The only shots he made were
threes. You can be the biggest Russ fan in the world, you want
to see him make his twos. I would love to see him make those
twos. Just don't take six threes, right like Russ, norm and shoot
if they are all catch and shoot threes and that like, that's the flow
of the offense. Great, and we have to sure Russ, Norm Hard
and Kawhi and Tice were plus six and four minutes, but I don't know
how real that was. If that makes sense. Can I tell you the
line up that I thought was going to happen in the second quarter that had
been doing damage, but instead they put in PJ. Tucker for Terrence Man.
And what their offensive rating is? Let it make it rain? So
with let me make sure you get this right. Uh, With Russ next
to Paul George Norman, Palo beatz zubots Terrence Man in eight minutes, their
offensive rating is one thirty seven point five and their defensive rating is eighty one
point three. So don't tell me there aren't solutions for how to work the
second unit and find one that is effective. They they just did, and
then they went away from it. Even though Terrence Man only played twenty one
minutes and was taken out early in the first quarter, he could have started
that second quarter in that lineup I just quoted. He absolutely could have.
Yeah, you're right, it's a little bit alarming that, like they're trying
to make sure to get PJ. Tucker minutes, so even if he has
to play next to a Viata Zubots, well whatever, we gotta get him
on that. I didn't do it because I didn't want to be an asshole,
but I was gonna. I was gonna tweet his his quotes from the
recent OC registered article with his egg. Well, I don't know, Yeah,
we don't. Let's not. Let's wait a little bit before we start
throwing gat. We don't need another uh Clippers fans, you suck thread from
a Clippers player, J tuckering. Do we think the UH signing deadman to
the G League is maybe an emergency? Oh? God, PJ Tucker sucks.
Move. No, I don't I like the Deadman signing. I'm not
against it, but like if it was, oh god, PJ Tucker sucks.
He wouldn't have gotten fifteen minutes last night, he wouldn't get as many
opportunities. They're looking for something with him. They're trying to say, if
it flips around next Toots, I don't think there is next to Zubots though,
next to either Big, at least not with other second unit guys.
Like Okay, if they had Paul George Kawhi and James Hard next to Zubots
and PJ Tucker, Yeah, that's gonna be a plus rain. Yeah,
because they can make anything work. But he's still not optimate. Is that
what I'm hearing? That's apparently what Coach Lou was considering. He said it
pregames so wild and I were like, if he has to play fifteen twenty
minutes like you have, I don't know. You just I don't know how
else you can maxify those minutes. I really like, I get it's not
figure it out. The logic is there. I totally understand where you're Here's
what I would do if you have to play him. What I would do
is play a vitch Zubats the entire first quarter, and I would start PJ.
Tucker next to Norm pal Terrence Man, Paul George and Russell Westbrook to
start the second quarter because at least you have spacing. Then I don't know
how well it's gonna work, but if you have to play him, that's
what you do. Yeah, I like that idea. He and Russ like
that that. I mean, everyone else has to be able to shoot,
like und like if those two are on the floor, so you know,
period, like there can not be any more non shooters on the floor than
that in the modern NBA. Like, it's just not it would be possible
if one of them was like a force athletically, you know what I mean,
then you could have some more like non shooters design but like not like
they're not that like they're not that guy. And we're not trying to bag
on PJ. Tucker. We're all saying there are certain situations where we under
man he was effective against the Denver Nuggets. I don't think it's about a
fire with PJ. Tucker. He's got that. It's ability. At this
point, He's he's the second oldest player in the league. He's limited in
some ways you can't play him at the four. I don't think to figure
out the numbers all say. No. Coach was quoting all the advanced numbers
on Thursday at practice, so I'm sure he has an idea. They're looking
to see if the defensive number turns around. Yeah, it has not happened
so far. They're there. They're probably saying, like, it just doesn't
make sense. It's only been thirty four minutes. There's gotta be something there
with him and Zoo defensively, where even though we're not going to be as
good offensively, maybe there's something there defensively and that's how they get away with
it. Four more games with the sample size of him and Zoo, that'd
be tech. If they lost this game last night, it would be directly
correlated to that lineup. Oh yeah, and that's all we'd be talking about.
We would have opened up the show with that. So if people are
wondering why we're still talking about this in a win, it's because even in
wins, sometimes you can build bad habits and losses. Sometimes you can build
good habits that eventually turn into wins. It's not that simple. And this
is when I met by kind of the worst case scenario win right, like
the offense that was like we had we needed this because of minutes from PJ.
Tucker next to a five like we needed And this isn't new like in
the Losing Street, which is now over, like the second unit has been
a bismos. But I'm telling you there's a lineup right there. Paul George
Russ, Norm Powell, Terrence Man I vitza zoo bus. They're destroying play
it it works? What did? So let's talk, Uh, Daniel Tice.
I would say I was a little surprised that he debuted. Not a
knock on him or anything. He just, you know, kind of fresh
off the plane. Let's get you some minutes. Uh looked like a guy
who is debuting with the brand new team. Got dunked on twice, got
absolutely post rized. But you love to see the effort. You'll love to
see the effort to try and get the block. He did not did not
seem particularly close, but the effort was there. Did I tell you he'd
can test everything at the rim? He really did? You You fucking nailed
that. And this it's to feed him a couple of times on some passes
that I was kind of like, okay, like if if, like once
they get a little bit more in sync, I can see some things go.
I can see offensively that pairing picking up a little bit more. I
mean, obviously I still think you prefer to have Mason plumbling, but in
his absence, I can kind of see some things there, and I like,
I do appreciate the effort defensively, I do wonder, like sort of
what his game shape is like, Like, we know that he wasn't exactly
happy with his playing time there in Indiana. I thought that he looked bad
later to start, not necessarily like in sync, but just activity wise and
physicality wise. It seemed like he was getting a little tired as the game
wore on, and so I sort of wonder how that's gonna change, just
even as he gets more reps. I don't even mean like clicking in with
the offensive leads. I don't know that he's in his like peak game shape
currently. His he had not a knock once again, not a knock.
He had a nice cut for his only basket. I think where he just
you know, the defender kind of lost track on me, just cut straight
into the paint. His cut is going to be really nice for this Clippers
team, and the connection is there too, Like, yeah, there was
something else with Russ last night. In his first game off the bench.
He was overpassing a few different times where it looked like he had an open
layup he would have an opportunity for an easier shot, and late in the
third quarter he kicked it out to Tyson the far side corner for a three
pointer. He missed it, and it just seemed like Russ is trying too
hard to be unselfish here, like no, take take that lay up there,
Like can't you had a nice matchup where he could bully somebody and do
the rock the baby thing and he didn't do it. Yeah, he might,
and then you know, it's an adjustin period for us too. I
think Russ is going to be obviously better off the bench than he was against
the Rockets. It's the same as it is with the starters, you know,
like it's and also there was some stuff where people were talking about how
he like didn't stay and talk to the media after the game. If you
haven't been in an NBA locker room after a six game losing streak, once
you break it and you win, you kind of just want to go home,
Like I don't think there's anything to read into at all. It's also
a Friday night game. I'm so sorry, but like it's a job like
any other jobs. Killer he was there sometimes on Friday night you gotta go.
Stassbender was there. Yeah, yeah, that would be sick. He
also hasn't talked to the media over the like the last two weeks during this
losing streak, so it wasn't necessarily out of the ordinary. I can't remember
the last time we got postgame from a locker room audio from Russ. Yeah,
and then let's talk bones. How many more d n P does the
Does the five to six game samples start over? Now that we have the
new starting lineup? I hope not. I hope not totes. I don't.
Oh, I don't know because then another idea, So where do we
put him? Like what who's losing time between Tye Westbrook, Norm Powell,
and PJ. Tucker that you actually can take time away from We need size
right now, which sucks. So like maybe you give it, you know,
you give some a like I don't think you can't give him Norm's minutes.
Norman is doing everything that he should be doing, which is hitting threes.
Maybe could be a little better defensively, but I don't think bones is
really helped him out. I like the effort though, and I actually thought
he had a couple of great, uh individual performances on VanVleet like that,
you know, like he's gonna there's certain guy he's more equipped to guard.
There's certain things that he can do, and yeah, exactly, it's it's
it is what it is a situation. But it's not like for lack of
tryh Yeah, I just feel bad for him. Sorry, go ahead on
him now. I'm kind of surprised, uh in seeing that through eleven games,
Norman is shooting fifty percent from the field and forty five percent from the
outside. Crazy. I did not expect to see that. But that lineup
they closed with was with Norman there instead of Terrence Man plus the starters,
and that lineup is an offensive rating of one twenty one point two in a
defensive of ninety six point six. So people have been tweeting at me,
like, why is Norm getting more minutes than Terrence Man? Like that LINEUPO,
I mean like it was working. Yeah, well, and you know,
Mark watching with your eyeballs that was working. He's hit some timely threes
to the six minute mark three in that game off the tap out from Zoobots,
but then the three pointer he hit with about three minutes left in Denver.
I think is what made coach Louse stay small with that lineup and it
it has worked. Yeah and yeah, So like where you're right at him,
where do you put bones? Where does he go? I feel fast,
but that you can't. Yeah, it sucks for it sucks for bones.
He was playing so good Bones is the odd man? Or or does
this obliterate the only other guy? Sorry? What's that? Does this obliterate
their ceiling? Because that was before they got James Harden No topless right now,
the caps not flipped off, nothing like that. The only other guy
he could play for is Russ, which guys that he could come in FORO
damn that sucks. Actually, try to maybe run a second unit that's four
guards plus suit, something to think about. You can think about it all
you want. I'm not I'm gonna. I would rather think about PJ.
Tucker starting than four guards plus sue. Any last words on this bench?
Are we feeling going? Are we optimistic? It's gonna get better? Is
it mostly on Tylu? Tomayr asked Tylu last night about the matchup with PJX
two of Vita Zubos. Yeah. Tomyo Izarali from Clutch Points asked him about
it, said, you know, it's not a lot of minutes yet,
but it hasn't looked great out there, and coach Lou kind of deflected a
little bit with it. Uh, it was after the game. He said
I need to see And he says this all the time, so I don't
think he's being disingenuous, but he said, you know, I got to
see, I got to rewatch the game tape something to that degree. So
I think the questions are gonna keep coming if it's not working, and maybe
there will be a change. I don't know. I don't know what else
they need to see from that, unless they just feel like the numbers are
skewed right now. They're better than that defensively with PJ next to Zoo and
it can turn around. I don't know. I think defensively like they could
possibly get better. It just it makes it so hard to score. Yeah,
it's too difficult. Coming up, we're gonna be previewing the stationary texts
two step as Adams so eloquently named these games against the Spurs they play on
Monday and Wednesday. Spurs are currently kind of destroying ish the Grizzlies, so
their record might be a little bit better than three and nine. The ads
have been too loud for you. Go ahead and turn it down. We
got Spurs preview coming up in three to one. Thank you for joining us.
You're on clips and Dip. We are talking Clippers verse Spurs. We
beat the Spurs by forty last time, not entirely sure if they've gotten way
better since we beat them by forty. We do have a bit of a
different looking team, but they've been smoked in some games. They've lost like
four games by at least twenty five points. I think three by thirty five
or something like that. Adam, what do we want because we should win
these two of these games, both of these on Monday and Wednesday. What's
the what's your biggest worry on getting over this Spurs hurdle? Spurtle? If
you will, Well, they've kind of gone as Victor like when they've won.
It's because Victor wenbin Yama has a good game where they play him more
minutes or they play him at the five in the fourth quarter and then he
comes alive because they've kind of been babying him so far. So he's been
inconsistent with his play. If you watch the game against Oka, see where
they got blown out against Chet, Like, they're really just letting him dip
his toe in the water a little bit. Now, that's a big toe
and it might reach the bottom, but it's it's still they're handling him with
kid gloves so far, and they're big gloves because okay, I'm done.
Yeah. The point is, yeah, they're relying on a rookie who's phenomenal
and one of the biggest attractions in sports right now. But if you do
a good job against him and don't let him get going, and the Clippers
certainly did the first time around, but that was a different Clippers team.
They had Roco on him the majority of the time. So we're going to
see Terrence Mann, We're gonna see more Paul George, more Kawhi Leonard.
I don't know that's interesting. I have I have noticed this. You know,
we talked about the Houston Rockets and we were kind of skeptical on how
good they were and defensively, teams had been shooting thirty two percent against them
from three. Well, the Clipper shot thirty eight percent against them from three,
And now I'm seeing the San Antonio Spurs though not which is not related
to the threes, but I was they were physical. I think their defense
is legit overall. I just think thirty two percent wasn't sustainable. They're not
that good on the perimeter. H San Antonio is twenty ninth when it comes
to opponent three point percentage. Teams are shooting forty point five percent from three
against them. That's how you get smoked. Who's worse? Who is worse
than the Spurs right now? On that opponent? Is itzz? It is
the Memphis Grizzlies. Yeah, teams are shooting Memphis Clippers lost to them.
Yes, well we don't got to talk about that. Yeah, the Grizzlies
are twenty eighth in defensive rating, twenty eighth in offensive rating, thirtieth in
net rating. They do, however, get the what is it the third
most shot attempts up of any team? Something. Lookout for the pace their
third That's why. Yeah, they're getting a lot of shots up, but
they're not going in exactly, they are seventeenth and three point percentage, seventeenth
and two point percentage. They don't get any free throws. They take the
fewest in the league because again it's a team full of young guys, which
does skew. I think your your free throw numbers will be fair. I
thought the Clippers got a good whistle last night. We always complain when they
get a bad whistle, as they did against Denver. I thought they got
a favorable whistle ultra for Houston, and there was a did you see the
Paul George on Sengoon clip that they picked? There was a no call on
Sengoon that I was happy was a no call because Paul George. We got
a couple of refuse suck chants early and we did which look from Denver though
I'm not usually I don't you know, like usually singling people out with crowd
chants. There's nothing better than a refuse suck. Everyone is united, even
opposing fans will join in on a refuse suck chane because sometimes the ref suck.
What about bull Well, yeah, that's yeah, I'm in on that
one. There were some Yeah, that's the same. That's the crazy part
of the family. Did you guys ever have a high school that had really
inappropriate chance about the refs? No, we had. There was a chance.
That was when I was in high school that they it got like the
whole student section suspended, basically, like students couldn't go to games for a
couple of weeks because the chant was a rope a tree hanging the reference Jesus,
and the ref was like nope, like everybody gone, everybody get out
of it. That was not my high school. That was my rival high
school, of course, of course. But so like what I guess,
what do we want to see in this game? We want to see more
of the same from the starters. Hope they're at least plus sixteen together.
That would be nice. And this is a nice chance for the bench to
get a little bit of momentum. Right They got two games against quite literally
one of the worst defensive teams in the league. The Spurs don't have a
deep bench despite playing everybody. They've played like all fifteen guys at least four
times so far this year. There's a chance for Russ to get a little
bit of rhythm and maybe figure some stuff out. Like I'm more like to
see some of this like that, I would like to see some of the
hesitancy, especially given how well teams are shooting from three against the Spurs,
Like, I would like to see some of this hesitancy on the catches shoot
gone. I don't want to see any more like double dribble into a step,
wait for defend, Like why spotting your defender three seconds to come out
and argue Like I just don't really understand it. So I want to see
that turned around. Yeah, that's a good call, Adam. What are
you looking for on the bench from the Clippers? I want to see them
be a little bit more connected. Well, I'll tell you what I'm looking
for, Paul George now Terence Man. Yeah, yeah, it beats a
Zubos play the lineup that has been working. But if that's not the case,
I hope it's a situation where the Clippers starters do get off to a
hot start, and overall the starters only playing sixteen minutes against Houston. I'd
like to see him get closer to twenty two minutes, that starting unit getting
to play together a little bit more. Sixteen minutes together isn't a lot.
Now, some of that's just because Norm came in for Terrence Man late in
the fourth quarter, and that lineup has been successful, so I don't hate
it, but in this one, I wouldn't mind to see a little more
continuity built up between the new starting guys and the starting unit. Yeah,
and he played forty minutes against Houston, which makes sense. We needed it,
thankfully, and I don't think that happens without the two day break.
But yeah, if he's gonna play forty minutes, I agree, I'd like
over half his minutes to be with the starters. He also had his ankle
rolled up on in the fourth quarter. That was very concerned. It looked
like he grimaced at first, but he played through it. I hope that
wasn't just adrenaline and he's fine. You know, it didn't look good.
Was there any updates or anything. I didn't see anything else because I remember
you tweeting about that. The update was he blocked the shit out of Jail
and Green afterwards. Who guess. Yeah. One thing I do want to
point out the Clippers broke They're losing streak only after US three sevens giving out
Player of the Game awards. Am I wrong? I thought Jamiel tizes edition
but you thought it was nice time? Baby? Who is our pick for
WLL? What are you doing with the audio? Oh? Yeah, sorry,
we were hearing clickies. You guys trying to look at porn while we
do this, look at porn while we do this? Have you heard what
bourn sounds like? So Player of the Game picks? Who are we going
with? We never remember follow up on this, but it does motivate the
team, as we've seen since they're want to know since we started doing it.
Will Adam? Wait, Adam, you look really excited? Who is
your Who is your pig? And we're doing Player of the Game? So
this has to be over two games. You can only pick one guy.
Now, you guys go first. I just thought I remember that I picked
Vita Zubats coming into the last game maybe and I'm like, yeah, I
think you did. But who could pick wrong? Right? Yeah? I
think I picked Why Will not have said PJ Tucker? I picked PJ Tucker.
Oh that's right? Will picked Bones? Yeah that Uh that didn't work
out out? Uh? Will? Who are you? Who are you picking?
For this two game? Boom? Who are you picking? I'm gonna
go normal. I'm gonna go normal. I think uh. I think he
looked really good in those closing lines, in the closing lineup, and I
hope that they can get him some more minutes next to next to the big
trio. Okay, h Adam, you said we should go, we should
go before you, I am going to go Zoo again. Feels like kind
of a cheat code because this person is not incredibly good down low. I'm
going Russ. I'm going Russ. I think Russ feels good off the bench
in this one. It's a it's a cupcake matchup. Potentially. I think
Russ has a nice little two game stretch. What that does for some people's
feelings about where he should be on the team. I don't necessarily look forward
to, but I think Russ helps us more off the bench than he hurts
us. All Right, Terrence Man hasn't scored more than eleven points so far
this seas I'm gonna take him to go above that and at least one of
these games. While Terrence Man's an easy pick because all the little things,
but I'm saying specifically he's gonna score more than eleven points in one of the
games. Everything else he does great already. Yeah, Hey, you're great.
Terrence. Just keep it up, just score. Get back on Twitter.
All we're saying is you're the best. You're the best. Yeah,
please get back on Twitter. That's what's so funny, Adam. You brought
this up when he talked about how he hates NBA Twitter. It's like but
Clippers Twitter specifically, everyone loves Terrence Man. No one dislikes Terrence Man,
which makes total sense. I think about that. That about wraps it up.
I think we're doing we're doing a double dip after both the games.
No, The Killers not in theaters anymore, so I don't know what the
hell I'm gonna do. The Killer two is on to B though. Shout
out to be big, shout out to two B. This is is good.
I love it has that all on air. It's James Vanderbeek as the
hit Man. Yeah yeah, it's the Killer. Yeah, it's The Killer
with one oh yeah. Before we get out of here, guys, thoughts
on The Killer. Loved it, loved it. It's loved it. I
dig that. It's it's exactly what the title says it is. It's exactly
what the trailer said it was. It's you know, it's a movie about
a Hitman. It's not seriously, it's not trying to not trying to do
too much. I love it. I just thought the ending was a little
bit underwhelming because I don't know when we give it away. Yeah, no
spoilers, but okay, I'll just put it like that. Then you thought
that the one guy should have been Yeah, no one's gonna be able to
crack this code check, Well the guy is. I will say. My
favorite part is there's an evil billionaire character and the costume department for the killer
has him wearing a sub pop T shirt. That was I was like,
yeah, yeah, I love that. Yeah, you loser. Yeah.
And then also I have to give a shout out the Montana griz destroyed,
uh, the Montana State bobcats so rest and piss ms U. That's what
I got to say about. Are you sure you guys weren't the ones with
a chant? Well, we have some Grizz game stories that we can talk
about off there that. Look, you know, we were not proud of
some things, but you know, that's what happens. We will probably have
a full episode Tuesday, Saturday. Turkey Break makes things kind of weird.
I'm not calling it Thanksgiving I'm calling it Turkey Break from now on. That's
my new thing. So unclear, but we will have one tripod episode next
week. I feel like some turkeys are going to be confused, like we
want to break why you can break, Adam, But you love doing this,
It's your favorite part of the show. One positive thing to send these
Clippers fans out on before they have to go shop for their turkey break fixings.
It worked so far. James Harden playing through him late in the ballgame,
the difference in offensive execution with having some semblance of an offense late in
the last two minutes on that twelve to one run instead of just io ball
back and forth, and even when it turned into that with Kawhi Leonard and
it was Jabari Smith Junior on him. Yeah, probably shouldn't take that shot.
He's a very good defender. He's got a lot of length, not
exactly Wemby, but he's tall, he's long, he's strong. Kawhi defers
to another Hall of Famer who ends up knocking down a three pointer. How
about that? It's kind of crazy and embarrassment of riches. We'll take it,
We absolutely will take it. We hope it happens a bunch versus the
Spurs over Monday and Wednesday. We hope everyone has a wonderful pre holiday or
whatever you're doing. Welcome to all the new listeners and post holiday, Welcome
to all the new listeners. Find us on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, YouTube,
YouTube dot com, slash at Clippers Podcast. We're gonna go live when
Tyler announces PJ. Tucker as the starter, so Will can take victory lap
around wherever he's at because it just weirdly feels like it might happen. That'll
be Adam's not gonna be there for that one. Yeah, we'll talk to
everybody next week and as always, let's go clips