WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:03.960 Welcome to the nonprofits. It seems like every week we have a story about 2 00:00:04.000 --> 00:00:08.119 Florida. Well this week is no exception. Sandy Plaza. What's happening in 3 00:00:08.119 --> 00:00:14.320 the Sunshine State this week? Typical Florida guys story again. This story from 4 00:00:15.240 --> 00:00:21.679 the Friendly Atheists and Man Meda written on May twenty twenty four. It talks 5 00:00:21.719 --> 00:00:27.879 about a program in Florida installed by our friend Governed Descentis in twenty twenty two 6 00:00:28.199 --> 00:00:34.200 that gives bunny to teachers if they follow a series of courses meant to basically 7 00:00:34.200 --> 00:00:39.399 turn them into some sort of missionaries for their Christian nationalist agenda. This is 8 00:00:39.479 --> 00:00:46.520 part of what he calls his Civic Literacy Excellence initiative, along with the defending 9 00:00:46.560 --> 00:00:51.679 of public schools in favor of private and charter schools. So then this is 10 00:00:51.759 --> 00:00:56.920 the second story this week so far that we've done that's about education. Do 11 00:00:57.000 --> 00:01:00.119 you think that there is there something sinister going on as as part of a 12 00:01:00.200 --> 00:01:03.840 larger plan or do you think maybe just a coincidence. Yeah, no, 13 00:01:03.920 --> 00:01:07.400 it's definitely not a coincidence. It's a feature, not a bug. But 14 00:01:07.799 --> 00:01:15.319 while the far right manufacturers and ideological war against the so called war agenda. 15 00:01:15.719 --> 00:01:22.640 They are actually waging a real war on secularism in this country, trying to 16 00:01:22.640 --> 00:01:29.000 turn it into some sort of theocracy in every way possible. I see those 17 00:01:29.519 --> 00:01:34.719 as the last attempts from a small number of old white men to stay relevant 18 00:01:34.799 --> 00:01:40.599 because they realize that region is going away from the population, and so they 19 00:01:40.799 --> 00:01:48.359 try to keep it as it is as much as they can. But even 20 00:01:48.640 --> 00:01:52.680 if it's a small number of people, they still can do a lot of 21 00:01:52.719 --> 00:01:57.040 harm, and so we still need to fight back, hence our presence here. 22 00:01:57.280 --> 00:02:04.000 So it seems like, I mean, it's like almost cartoonishly obvious propaganda 23 00:02:04.200 --> 00:02:07.000 campaign, right, Kara, Do you think that these propaganda techniques are going 24 00:02:07.039 --> 00:02:12.240 to be effective? You know, I'll say again, I'm going to take 25 00:02:12.680 --> 00:02:20.439 a cautiously optimistic view on this. I think although this is a definite campaign 26 00:02:21.120 --> 00:02:25.319 trying to get a lot of dangerous ideas and ideologies into schools that I am 27 00:02:25.360 --> 00:02:31.400 concerned about. Having looked at some of the images in this article where it 28 00:02:31.479 --> 00:02:37.400 shows you know, what was on the slides in this literacy excellence initiative, 29 00:02:37.520 --> 00:02:42.120 I mean, it's almost comical. It reads some of these slides read like 30 00:02:42.199 --> 00:02:46.800 some of the Christian homeschool workbooks that I did as a child that are you 31 00:02:46.840 --> 00:02:50.960 know, unsourced or you know, the sources that are in them are things 32 00:02:51.000 --> 00:02:57.680 like, you know, scripture versus or misleading references to what the founders collectively 33 00:02:57.879 --> 00:03:02.319 may have thought or said. There's one slide stating the Christian principle of covenant 34 00:03:02.360 --> 00:03:07.159 with God is reflected in Locke's social compact theory, which is a new one 35 00:03:07.240 --> 00:03:12.840 on me. I am aware of a social contract theory by Lock, but 36 00:03:13.759 --> 00:03:17.159 I don't know, maybe I missed that one. But I think that these 37 00:03:17.240 --> 00:03:22.680 are not the kind of arguments that are going to be very convincing to teachers 38 00:03:22.759 --> 00:03:28.240 who are educated and have a strong background in their field. And I understand 39 00:03:28.280 --> 00:03:32.039 that not all teachers necessarily are able to teach classes that they have a lot 40 00:03:32.039 --> 00:03:35.919 of degrees in or things like that, and so yes, there are going 41 00:03:36.000 --> 00:03:39.479 to be teachers coming here who maybe aren't able to tell that these are not 42 00:03:39.639 --> 00:03:45.199 factual statements and that these are not sound arguments. But I think for the 43 00:03:45.240 --> 00:03:50.400 most part, I find it kind of funny that they're trying to educate educators 44 00:03:50.680 --> 00:03:57.159 using very factually and accurate, wildly biased slides saying ridiculous things I mean, 45 00:03:57.240 --> 00:04:01.120 if I was there as an educator, I would be first offended and then 46 00:04:01.280 --> 00:04:06.120 amused by how silly this is. And I suspect there are people that are 47 00:04:06.120 --> 00:04:10.840 going to be having that reaction. But at the same time, there may 48 00:04:10.879 --> 00:04:15.439 also be teachers who believe in this ideology and want to be teaching it to 49 00:04:15.759 --> 00:04:18.199 kids because they think it's the truth or the best thing for them. And 50 00:04:18.480 --> 00:04:23.560 I think this is the kind of thing that would embolden people like that and 51 00:04:23.600 --> 00:04:27.439 make them think not only that this is now allowed, but it's being encouraged 52 00:04:27.439 --> 00:04:30.120 and it's something they should do. So for that reason, I think it 53 00:04:30.199 --> 00:04:34.600 is very dangerous, but on its face it it's kind of absurd too. 54 00:04:35.319 --> 00:04:39.720 So you said offended first and then may be amused, I would add maybe 55 00:04:39.800 --> 00:04:44.120 terrified. As the stage three of the reaction to that, Jason, can 56 00:04:44.160 --> 00:04:47.360 you flesh out some of the details of what DeSantis has going on down there? 57 00:04:47.600 --> 00:04:50.079 I mean, I took some notes on this, so you know. 58 00:04:50.120 --> 00:04:55.199 This started in kind of around twenty twenty two. Florida began adoctrinating public school 59 00:04:55.199 --> 00:05:00.399 teachers with this Christian nationalism more or less to spread misinformation. DeSantis he had 60 00:05:00.399 --> 00:05:04.680 a multimillion dollar what We just talked about the Civics Literary the Civics Literacy Excellence 61 00:05:04.759 --> 00:05:10.879 Initiative. It's hard to say so twenty two. In twenty twenty two, 62 00:05:11.160 --> 00:05:15.639 there were several voluntary three day training seminars. Here's the thing, it's always 63 00:05:15.639 --> 00:05:19.720 money right in capitalism Sin He's talked about this before. Teachers who attended were 64 00:05:19.720 --> 00:05:24.560 told that they would receive a seven hundred dollars stipend, which is a lot 65 00:05:24.600 --> 00:05:27.839 more than teachers making multiple days worth of work, you know, for coming 66 00:05:27.920 --> 00:05:30.439 to the thing, and they would be eligible for a three thousand dollars bonus 67 00:05:30.600 --> 00:05:34.519 if they completed you know, additional tasks the seminars. Yeah, yeah, 68 00:05:34.560 --> 00:05:39.800 the seminars developed. They were developed with the help of a Hillside College. 69 00:05:40.319 --> 00:05:45.240 It's a conservative Christian school in Michigan. There was additional participation by the quote 70 00:05:45.519 --> 00:05:48.399 Bill of Rights Institute, and it was founded by one of the right wing 71 00:05:48.839 --> 00:05:53.360 Koch brothers, Koch just so in case nobody knew, look it up, 72 00:05:53.439 --> 00:05:58.480 Koh, look them up. So it endorsed the Christian nationalist beliefs that conservative 73 00:05:58.560 --> 00:06:02.319 Christianity is a bedrock of the country, that church state separation, as we 74 00:06:02.360 --> 00:06:08.199 know it is actually a myth and that the Christian God gave us the rights 75 00:06:08.199 --> 00:06:12.399 we have, and they just you know, and like Kara who was talking 76 00:06:12.399 --> 00:06:17.959 about before, they just generally promoted misinformation at these seminars. And I really 77 00:06:18.000 --> 00:06:21.360 feel like, I don't know if this is so much to like change people's 78 00:06:21.399 --> 00:06:25.079 minds, like, oh, this makes sense, this is great. I 79 00:06:25.120 --> 00:06:29.720 think what it is you're just knocking down more walls of that church state separation 80 00:06:29.879 --> 00:06:33.560 thing, and you're telling the public kind of like what happened with other people 81 00:06:33.600 --> 00:06:38.279 who have been in places of extreme power in our country. They say some 82 00:06:38.519 --> 00:06:41.120 dumb shit, and then you know, the dude of works like, well, 83 00:06:41.199 --> 00:06:44.000 this guy said some dumb shit, So that means I'm right about my 84 00:06:44.079 --> 00:06:46.160 dumb shit, because I believe it is dumb shit, you know, So 85 00:06:46.399 --> 00:06:48.560 I'm gonna say some dumb fucking shit. And yeah, yeah, that's fathering 86 00:06:48.600 --> 00:06:53.120 some dumb shit. Oh you're just a fucking bitch for not you know, 87 00:06:53.399 --> 00:06:56.399 being cool with my dumb shit that i've you know, ten years ago, 88 00:06:56.439 --> 00:06:59.680 somebody would have fucking, you know, maybe thrown something at me at for 89 00:06:59.759 --> 00:07:01.879 saying and you know, but now since this fucking guy who's in charge, 90 00:07:01.959 --> 00:07:05.079 that's some dumb ship. That's what this is. This is this is a 91 00:07:05.240 --> 00:07:09.920 this is more dumb shit campaign that that's that's all really is. I want 92 00:07:09.920 --> 00:07:13.319 to touch on Jason. You mentioned the the money, right, So there's 93 00:07:13.360 --> 00:07:17.480 a stipend and then additional stipends for for for deeper dive and and so it 94 00:07:17.560 --> 00:07:25.240 seems that not only is are they trying to uh propagandize teachers in general, 95 00:07:25.600 --> 00:07:29.360 but maybe even targeting the newer teachers. They're the ones who are going to 96 00:07:29.399 --> 00:07:30.720 be at the bottom end of the pay scale. They're the ones who are 97 00:07:30.720 --> 00:07:34.800 going to need those, you know, those extra opportunities to make a few 98 00:07:34.800 --> 00:07:39.720 extra bucks. But they're also the ones who might be the least secure in 99 00:07:39.839 --> 00:07:43.519 their uh, you know, in their subject area knowledge. So what exactly 100 00:07:43.560 --> 00:07:46.360 are some of the can you give us some examples of some of the misinformation 101 00:07:46.439 --> 00:07:51.759 that we're that's being spread around there? Well, so, I mean Jesus 102 00:07:51.839 --> 00:07:58.319 Christ so much so they downplaced slavery. Uh, they embellished the impact of 103 00:07:58.360 --> 00:08:03.040 the Judeo Christian leafs had on the nation's founding documents, you know, the 104 00:08:03.120 --> 00:08:07.519 social compact or contact that they had, and they implied that the conservative judicial 105 00:08:07.519 --> 00:08:13.120 philosophy that says quote the founder's desires, all that matter when deciding a case 106 00:08:13.759 --> 00:08:18.000 was engineered into our legal system. They prioritize the views of religious thinkers over 107 00:08:18.040 --> 00:08:22.120 the Enlightenment thinkers. When it comes to those who influenced the founders, the 108 00:08:22.160 --> 00:08:28.279 founders, they cherry pick connections between the Bible and the federalist papers, i 109 00:08:28.399 --> 00:08:31.759 e. Creation the Fall Ten Commandments, as if to say, those were 110 00:08:31.759 --> 00:08:39.120 the basis for our founding document. And it's wild because the state awarded he 111 00:08:39.120 --> 00:08:43.080 brought up money. The state awarded eleven thousand teachers more than thirty three million 112 00:08:43.120 --> 00:08:48.720 dollars for completing those training sessions in twenty twenty three. DeSantis he is proposed 113 00:08:48.759 --> 00:08:52.159 budget for twenty four through twenty five, which they had released in December, 114 00:08:52.360 --> 00:08:58.200 included forty five million for the continuation of this Induction Nation program. This is 115 00:08:58.240 --> 00:09:03.039 really similar to the Texas like you know, private school voucher of things that 116 00:09:03.039 --> 00:09:07.840 we've talked about before. They're just they're incentivizing people to more or less buy 117 00:09:07.919 --> 00:09:11.960 in, and of course people need money. Teachers aren't paid what they should 118 00:09:11.000 --> 00:09:15.360 be fucking paid, so it's going to incentivize and then do you get the 119 00:09:15.399 --> 00:09:18.080 social pressure thing where it's like, I don't need to rock the boat. 120 00:09:18.440 --> 00:09:22.200 I wonder, I wonder if they're going to spin this as a way of 121 00:09:22.240 --> 00:09:24.240 increasing teacher salaries. Well, they're going to use it as a way to 122 00:09:24.240 --> 00:09:28.679 increase teacher salaries, and it's also going to ostracize teachers who don't you know, 123 00:09:28.799 --> 00:09:31.000 it's just going to be just another tactic. One hundred percent. I 124 00:09:31.399 --> 00:09:35.679 prophesy it. You heard it here first, folks, right here on the 125 00:09:35.720 --> 00:09:37.720 non right here on the nonprofits. Uh, Cindy, I want to I 126 00:09:37.759 --> 00:09:41.559 want to come back to you for a second here. We know that there's 127 00:09:41.639 --> 00:09:48.240 various kinds of immunity that protect governments and government officials from things like civil lawsuits. 128 00:09:48.159 --> 00:09:54.440 But if the policy decisions are demonstrably harmful, as it seems is the 129 00:09:54.480 --> 00:10:00.039 case here, and possibly even a breach of a government official's oath, do 130 00:10:00.120 --> 00:10:03.600 you think government officials like a governor, for example, should be vulnerable to 131 00:10:03.919 --> 00:10:09.559 civil lawsuits based off of their policy decisions because currently now they enjoy a certain 132 00:10:09.600 --> 00:10:13.000 amount of protection from that kind of thing. But do you think if we 133 00:10:13.120 --> 00:10:16.159 started holding them a little bit more responsible in the civil arena, do you 134 00:10:16.159 --> 00:10:22.120 think that would that would change the landscape here it's a very interesting question. 135 00:10:22.919 --> 00:10:28.559 Before I answer it, I would like to just point out something because we 136 00:10:28.600 --> 00:10:33.039 are talking about this very specific event, but we need to put it into 137 00:10:33.519 --> 00:10:39.279 contexts with something we talked about like two weeks ago. It's about the trend 138 00:10:39.519 --> 00:10:46.799 to accept more and more teasers without any degrees. So when you factor that 139 00:10:46.919 --> 00:10:50.840 in too consideration with this specific event, then it makes even more sense to 140 00:10:52.039 --> 00:10:58.080 target those teachers because since they are not qualified, there are less paid, 141 00:10:58.240 --> 00:11:03.360 and so they will be more entitled to uh to try and go to those 142 00:11:03.000 --> 00:11:07.399 seminars to to get some money. So, yeah, we need to put 143 00:11:07.399 --> 00:11:11.240 the two side by side, because in my opinion, it's it's a concerted 144 00:11:11.320 --> 00:11:16.120 effort to to to join the two. But to your question, I would 145 00:11:16.200 --> 00:11:22.440 say, I'm I'm I'm going both ways there because I I think it's it's 146 00:11:22.600 --> 00:11:33.240 dangerous to to start making politicians accountable for their decisions uh as uh while they're 147 00:11:33.480 --> 00:11:37.480 in office. But on the other hand, we we need to have people 148 00:11:37.519 --> 00:11:46.799 who decide more based on data, information and science rather than just political views 149 00:11:46.919 --> 00:11:52.799 or indoctrination or yeah, yeah, and and so finding a way to to 150 00:11:52.879 --> 00:11:58.080 apply that without I don't know, it's it's a it's a tough topic. 151 00:12:00.240 --> 00:12:03.799 I'd have to think about it. Okay, I have one. I have 152 00:12:03.840 --> 00:12:05.639 one other question here I want to ask. I'll give everybody on the panel 153 00:12:05.639 --> 00:12:09.840 a chance to answer this one. So, the federal government gives states a 154 00:12:09.879 --> 00:12:16.480 fairly wide berth when it comes to UH selecting their K twelve curriculum standards, 155 00:12:16.480 --> 00:12:20.960 when they want to decide what the state wants to teach. We've seen the 156 00:12:20.000 --> 00:12:24.879 federal government step in, you know, in certain circumstances where states were getting 157 00:12:24.879 --> 00:12:28.120 a little too far afield. Slavery is a perfect example of that race. 158 00:12:28.120 --> 00:12:35.639 Slavery was declared illegal at the national level in you know, as some states 159 00:12:35.679 --> 00:12:39.440 were. We're protesting against that, so do UH. And so we'll start 160 00:12:39.480 --> 00:12:41.440 with Cara here. Do you think that this is a situation is a good 161 00:12:41.639 --> 00:12:46.840 argument for the federal government to step in and to have more hands on approach 162 00:12:46.879 --> 00:12:50.559 with setting curriculum standards, or do you think this is just Florida's problem in 163 00:12:50.600 --> 00:12:52.960 Florida is going to are going to fix it? Oh? Well, that 164 00:12:52.200 --> 00:12:56.799 is a really complex question that I think people have been arguing over since the 165 00:12:56.840 --> 00:13:01.240 beginning of the United States. So I don't know that I can give a 166 00:13:01.279 --> 00:13:07.519 great resolution to that question you have. Yeah, I'm not going to be 167 00:13:07.559 --> 00:13:11.000 able to do it, but I will say that, no, I don't 168 00:13:11.000 --> 00:13:13.639 think this is just a problem for Floridians to fix. You know, as 169 00:13:13.720 --> 00:13:18.600 we've discussed previously, this same kind of thing is going on in Texas, 170 00:13:18.679 --> 00:13:22.519 it's going on in other states. It's affecting people all over the country in 171 00:13:22.559 --> 00:13:26.799 different ways. And it is an instance where if you happen to live in 172 00:13:26.840 --> 00:13:33.039 a state that has a governor in power who wants to basically force schools or 173 00:13:33.080 --> 00:13:41.480 do everything that they can to encourage schools to teach kids garbage literally just factual 174 00:13:41.519 --> 00:13:46.919 inaccuracies, that is an argument for some kind of regulation for that. Having 175 00:13:48.120 --> 00:13:52.120 said that, I mean we could be having the same problem at the national 176 00:13:52.200 --> 00:13:56.879 level too. There's no guarantee that the same kind of people with the same 177 00:13:56.960 --> 00:14:01.879 kind of goals wouldn't just put themselves into positions of power and the federal government. 178 00:14:01.960 --> 00:14:05.600 And now we're just doing it at that level too. So I think 179 00:14:05.879 --> 00:14:11.399 the solution has to be something else besides that. But it is a concern, 180 00:14:11.480 --> 00:14:15.240 and I guess my answer is I don't know how to fix this, 181 00:14:15.679 --> 00:14:20.279 and that does keep me up at night. So you think maybe the federal 182 00:14:20.320 --> 00:14:24.000 government stepping in would be a little maybe on the heavy handed side, or 183 00:14:24.440 --> 00:14:28.679 or runs a risk of being misused, kind of like you know the atomic 184 00:14:28.759 --> 00:14:33.679 bomb, right that was originally developed as a quote unquote deterrent, but it's 185 00:14:33.720 --> 00:14:37.720 a horrible, horrible, wicked device in the wrong hands. Jason, what 186 00:14:37.720 --> 00:14:41.559 do you think about that? Well, I think I think it's necessary that 187 00:14:41.600 --> 00:14:46.360 the federal government starts paying attention to what's going on. If not, that's 188 00:14:46.559 --> 00:14:48.600 at that point I have no faith that they will. I mean, with 189 00:14:48.679 --> 00:14:52.120 the Roe v. Wade shit, that's you know, those people fu fucking 190 00:14:52.320 --> 00:14:56.200 lost all. I mean, just lost me all hope is it's terrible, 191 00:14:56.480 --> 00:14:58.480 And with what they're talking about with Oberfell and all this, I just just 192 00:15:00.039 --> 00:15:01.639 so. But yeah, that's what the Fed's there for, because what's happening 193 00:15:01.679 --> 00:15:07.200 here is a clear violation. They're they're incentivizing people to to merge church state. 194 00:15:07.200 --> 00:15:11.360 They're they're literally what they're doing is on What they're doing is treasonous and 195 00:15:11.360 --> 00:15:16.080 traitorous. That's what DeSantis is promoting, something that is treasonous and traitorous to 196 00:15:16.120 --> 00:15:18.919 the American way of life and to the foundations of what of what we call 197 00:15:20.000 --> 00:15:24.279 America. They're there. He's he's crossing into too many lanes and it's wrong. 198 00:15:24.320 --> 00:15:26.159 He's one the wrong way in traffic. I don't know how the way 199 00:15:26.200 --> 00:15:28.600 to put it, you know, So yes, I think the federal government 200 00:15:28.639 --> 00:15:31.120 should step in. Uh. The reason they're not is because you know, 201 00:15:31.360 --> 00:15:35.759 they fucking suck. So you know, it's this, This should have already 202 00:15:35.799 --> 00:15:41.720 been happening. The fact that people like DeSantis, people who have a message 203 00:15:41.759 --> 00:15:46.559 like DeSantis, How do I say this? The messages that DeSantis is promoting, 204 00:15:46.960 --> 00:15:52.080 in my opinion, are anti American, and the decisions he's been making, 205 00:15:52.200 --> 00:15:58.279 especially with things like this and actually funneling money into it and promoting it 206 00:15:58.320 --> 00:16:03.200 and having it be a state thing, is in my opinion illegal and should 207 00:16:03.240 --> 00:16:06.159 be should be. I just I don't know, I don't I don't know 208 00:16:06.200 --> 00:16:08.639 how to say it without you know, going forward against candidate. I'm just 209 00:16:08.720 --> 00:16:11.799 really not good with what's going on, and I think it needs to have 210 00:16:11.840 --> 00:16:15.360 already been stopped and dealt with. In the fact that he already has a 211 00:16:15.360 --> 00:16:18.559 fund, it's disgusting to me. So so, Cindy, do you agree 212 00:16:18.639 --> 00:16:22.279 with Cara that weis that you know, we think something should be done, 213 00:16:22.320 --> 00:16:26.360 but we're not really sure. Or do you think are do you ascribed by 214 00:16:26.399 --> 00:16:30.919 the you know, burn it all down approach of Jason or what do you 215 00:16:30.919 --> 00:16:33.519 think on that? Sandy? Do you think the federal government should step in 216 00:16:33.840 --> 00:16:37.440 and say Florida slap him on the risk. No, that's not okay. 217 00:16:37.519 --> 00:16:47.879 I think that all local school boards should be uh terminated and everything about education 218 00:16:47.960 --> 00:16:52.519 should be decided at the federal level. I think the because the possibility to 219 00:16:52.600 --> 00:17:00.519 infiltrate local school boards is extremely easy. We've seen it in in the last 220 00:17:00.600 --> 00:17:04.960 years. It's been infiltrated by crazy people with crazy ideas, and and they 221 00:17:06.119 --> 00:17:12.359 get and they get elected, and it needs to be decided not by parents 222 00:17:12.720 --> 00:17:18.960 but by scientists and and people who are knowledgeable in the subject areas. Is 223 00:17:18.960 --> 00:17:22.200 that what you're saying that that seems that makes a lot too much sense to 224 00:17:22.240 --> 00:17:27.480 me. But yeah, since I'm not in from the US, so I 225 00:17:27.559 --> 00:17:34.680 don't have this this few of state rights and UH and are founding fathers, 226 00:17:34.799 --> 00:17:41.920 which again I think it's it's another huge problem when friends had I think it's 227 00:17:41.960 --> 00:17:51.880 fourteen different constitutions since the Revolution, and I don't understand how the entire United 228 00:17:51.880 --> 00:17:56.599 States keep talking about how we should or should not follow the words of people 229 00:17:56.599 --> 00:18:00.839 who are that have been there for two hundred year is I don't understand that 230 00:18:00.839 --> 00:18:06.200 that that framing, I don't understand that mentality. I don't get it. 231 00:18:07.200 --> 00:18:10.240 I think I think that's a that's a that's a good point to to to 232 00:18:10.359 --> 00:18:14.079 wrap up here. We have some great opinions. I think we had some 233 00:18:14.119 --> 00:18:17.240 great discussions. We could have kept talking for hours and hours, I think, 234 00:18:17.240 --> 00:18:18.039 but we're out of time for tonight.