Oh we got more's coming fast and furious. Now this is getting excited.
Forget Brook Lopez, he hasn't signed. Oh my god, you're gonna be
the guessing game again? Or did you see him already? Eighty for Yakob
Purtle, you hit another one. You were over on sixteen million. That
is tough for a for as good a defender as he can be and as
decent as he is, as like a handoff hub. That's a lot of
money for a non stretch, non switch mostly non switch center. Right,
that's is this are we gonna have to apologize to him though, because I
feel like I said a lot of the same things about Jared Allen. H
I don't like Jared Allen has a deeper offensive bag at this point. Yeah,
what are the Raptors doing? Well? Now you would so more or
less likely the van fleet is back. Got to be more if you're spending
this. Yeah, and look, Cam Johnson, uh four for one oh
eight? What do you think about that? Also? We hit that you
said or you did? You said over twenty five million comfortably per year?
Well he wasn't comfortable. What's that twenty seven on average? Look at I
could do math too, Dan, if you give me enough time to think
about it, Uh, I have no problem with this. For for I'm
actually surprised that somebody didn't, although you know, there was less and less
cap space over the last couple of days. But I would not have been
shocked to see a thirty thirty million average annual value for him. So,
like, I don't know if you can say this is a screaming deal for
Brooklyn, but I think it's hard to go wrong with a combo forward who
can shoot the three, you know, So twenty seven million a year on
average is pretty solid, not like a not a heist by any stretch,
but but that for them, I kind of wish that there had been a
little bit more of a bidding war. But so far have have have we
seen a restricted free agent leave yet? As that I guess, I mean,
have we seen an offer sheet even reported yet? I have not.
I did. I thought that maybe we would see it, just because the
matching period is so like, it's so accelerated out one from what was it
seventy two to like thirty six or twenty four whatever it was. But I
mean, if if you really look at and like, if you really look
at I guess how quickly the news is coming out about other signings. I
guess I kind of understand, like, all right, why teams are not
that's not their first instinct. I want to get back to the Yaka Purdle
deal just because I see a lot of split opinions about it on Twitter.
I know that twenty seems to be the going rate for so with no I
hope my palic is make a major move. It would have to be be
a trade blown with no Detroit offer. So I'm bias pissess fans. They
knuked their cap space with the Joe Harris trade. I think that was a
pretty good indicator that they didn't view Cam Johnson as gettable. But I guess
the theory is like, look at how fast these deals are happening, and
already agreed to that. You don't want to waste your time throwing money to
restricted free agent you assume another team is going to match. So but I
was wrong in the sense that I thought this might be a year where we
see a little bit more restricted free agent activity from rival teams, right,
you know? So, I mean Austin Reeves is kind of one of the
most interesting restricted free agents, So do we think maybe because I was dead
set on he's someone's going to offer him the four hundred million dollars deal over
four years and the Lakers will mash it. I'm kind of thinking now it's
not going to take that for the Lakers because so far, like we're not
seeing restricted free agent offers. Sheet's thrown out there for the reasons you mentioned.
I mean, if if the Lakers could get him back, you know,
at a at a Yaka Peartle level, let's say, like pay pay
him four for eighty, it could be so if when you're looking at the
probant to get back to this Peartle deal, because it's sticking with me,
I don't it might be my third, my secondly favorite one, behind that
Reggie Jackson atrocity. By the way, whenever I'm commenting on these, anyone
who listens to us regularly knows good for Reggie Jackson. We like his sort
of renaissance with the Clippers was awesome. This has nothing to do with him.
If they could have given him more and he got more, I don't
think they should have given him more. I'm happy for players when they get
paid. I don't understand this from Nuggets perspective at all. Just like with
the Raptors, they were clearly pot committed because you gave up a top six
protected first round pick for some reason. I just I don't know, man,
like four for eighty when on this team, that's what's the other thing
here is four for eighty on this team. You can say that, Okay,
that's what that's like Jared Allen money, which is fine, But I
think Jared Allen's probably a lot better than Peartle. Maybe you trust Petle Moore
as a screener and he is a better passer. I just on this team,
we're spacing is so hard to come by. I I just I don't
necessarily understand it, and like it felt like something that should have been even
in the new cap climate, where it's, okay, this is what fifteen
fourteen percent of the new salary cap. I guess that first starting center is
fine, But the theory of this team right now, to me makes no
sense. Like how intrigued are you by minutes in which you could see Scottie
Barnes, Yako Peardle, and Pascal Siakam and even Ogianna Nobi on the floor
at the same time, Like I don't think that I know O Gianna Nobi
can shoot, but like, I don't ever want to see three of those
four players together basically right now, unless you see Scotty Barnes improve his jumper
or we see Pascal Siakam hit more of his threes like he did it at
one point. I just I don't love the Peardle deal. And if it
were me, you obviously you wouldn't go out as long because you can't.
I just like I would pay Brook Lopez more than I would pay Yaka Peurdle
per year right now. And Brook, well, I'm saying Brook Lopez is
thirty five, Yaco Peurdle's like, what is he twenty six? I don't
even know how old he is, Like he's almost a decade younger. I
think he is. He's twenty seven, so he's like eight years younger.
So just like I would pay if we were so you can go up to
I think three years for Brooke. I would have given Brook three years and
sixty before I gave Yaka Peardle three years to sixty. That's just I would
agree. Get let's let's walk through this real quick, and you can correct
me if I'm wrong, because what this means for Toronto is potentially really interesting.
So if you just using Peardle's seventeen point eight million dollars cap hold,
which now is going to go up to twenty, well it might not go
up that much. Actually, if you're if you're having over the let's just
use the cap hold as a number as a starting salary, because if it's
averaging twenty, it doesn't start at twenty. Most likely his four year deal.
So if they are like six million short of the first apron right now,
and that's assuming van fleet, but his cap hold is thirty just under
thirty two million. So if if they come back with you and you throw
some roster charges on here, like are the raptors gonna just go over the
apron and just not care if they do anything of consequence? Get up towards
the second apron for this roster? Is that is that where we're heading.
I look, my guests would be. I had heard rumbling, I had
heard I read rumbling. Sources told hartwood Nin that there was like a Gary
Trent junior extension that was going to be something like he opted in, which
suggested either he was going to be traded or he would be extended off that
number. I will now be a little bit more surprised if he's not being
moved. But if we look at their if we look at their other contracts,
and would you say they're fift within fifteen million of the apron with van
Fleet's cap hold or without it. With it they are at one sixty one
hundred and sixty six million, And that's with van Fleet at a thirty one
point eight just under thirty one nine and Peartle's cap hold at seventeen point eight,
which is probably a pretty good proxy for what his first year salary is
going to be on this new deal. Yeah, so I mean, if
you need to cut salary, I mean, I guess they could make it
work with the apron came in it. What was it one seventy two ish?
That's really close. That's really close. I guess. Like I'm just
looking at like the other deals, Chris Bouche has two years and like twenty
three million left on his deal. That's someone you could move. Maybe you
move Otto Porter Junior's expiring contract. Are they still in on the precious that
Chew experience? You could like move Malachai Flynn. My guests would be that
they're going to shed salary somehow. And just to get to some comments since
we've been neglecting them, U Strew sign and trade has to be Oko or
Osman since Bridles sing wasn't ask what they what they said Jared Allen third team
involved? That would be if there's a third team, Jared like he shouldn't
go to Miami. But we did say Okoro and Osman, and yeah,
Singleton, would I would do I think did we say that if we're Miami?
Would you do that for Miami? I guess it's like having two smaller
deals to move. And Okoro did shoot three as well during the regular season
and gives you another I wouldn't trust him to play up to the four,
but another defensive stopper. I don't mean to jump around here. Let's get
back to Toronto. I apologize well. First, first, I want to
answer your Cavs question because it made me remember something that I believe to be
true that we don't think about often enough. Always assume whoever is leaving the
Heat will get worse, and always assume whoever is coming to the Heat is
going to get better. So like if you if you're telling me, I
get the heat versions of Ocoro and Osman. I kind of like it,
and I think we should assume that Struce won't be as good with the calves.
This is my it's not it's I don't know what you would call it,
because it's sort of like it's mostly based on anecdotal evidence and just observation,
because certainly there have been players that left the heat and we're good and
the heat players that showed up with the heat that weren't as good as they
were elsewhere. But it's just like Deon Waiders, Hassan Whiteside, Derek Jones
Junior, I assume gave Vincent if he leaves will not be as good.
So it's just like, this is what happens with the heat. So I
would I would like to see the version of Isaac Accorro that the Miami heat
could turn him into that, if that's what this is, we don't have
specifics yet, But anyway, back to Toronto, because that this is kind
of a more interesting topic here, would you guess that I think I did
say over because we picked thirty two million was the number for Fred van Leet
and was the number for Fred van Vleet, and I picked over. I
think he probably gets more than the thirty one point eight, right, I
mean, like if Yaka Pearl got twenty. I know he's younger, but
he plays a position that's more saturated or not as big of a need like
not for the Raptors specifically, but actually they need Fred van Fleet more than
Yakom Peartle. Well, that's the question I was going to ask, is
if van Fleet is not back, who's is it? Scotty Barnes point guard
full time? Is that what we're doing, because you know, I don't
know what this was. A team that's who's half court offense has tanked it
two years in a row, and now you're facing the potential of bumping up
against the first Apron by bringing back Van Vleet at a bigger number or just
not having a point guard like I mean, that's and and speaking of Trey
Jones is off the market because he got two for twenty to go back to
the Spurs, which I love, no problem with that. I was actually
I mean, they need a like an offensive organizer until that works. He
has a real like pull up mid range game. I know people harp on
his three, but he makes really good pocket passes, knows how to maintain
his ball. I think that's a that's a rock sill. And look,
it's just so short term, and so they're just gonna keep kind of rolling
with this and can make changes on a whim. I love that deal,
per you know, I don't know who was going to give him more.
I would say that ten million for someone who I would say he's a fringe
starting point guard, right like he's quote he's not maybe a starting point guard,
but he's a fringe starting point guard. I think that's a pretty good
value. Yeah. I think he's a low end starter with the capacity to
get a lot, like if he's a if he's a thirty six percent three
point shooter, there's no fringe about it. Like, he's a quality starting
point guard, I think, And it's I have no reason to believe that
he can't improve, right Like, that's so two for twenty for a guy
with significant upside who's already pretty good at his age. Is Yeah, that's
that's one of my favorite deals so far. Actually, now that I'm kind
of running over it in my head, that's a big and I think they
needed because I don't know who else they were gonna sign we're seeing. I
mean we've we haven't seen Fred van Fleet come off the board. He would
have made if they wanted to make the play that someone who comes in doesn't
disrupt development and you can just say, hey, like, can you help
streamline the development of our other young guys. And I think that that's a
you know, that really does help out. But like the point Guard market,
which is like even the mid end options was, I don't think Gabe
Vincent is that dude, Like he's just not that dude, you know,
Kyrie. They weren't going to be in on that business. They're not gonna
be in on the James James Harden business. So I think that this was
kind of their only move and I think that it'll really help. Just maybe
some of the spacing can be wonky if you're gonna play Wemby and then you
know Jeremy Soon at the same time with Trey Jones, like, yeah,
there could be some, but having Zach Collins can help you open up the
floor. Devin Vessel as well, I love that deal for san Antono.
I think I'm with you might be one of my favorite ones from like a
team perspective so far. Yeah, which again, I'll echo what you said
earlier. That's the only perspective we look at this from, which is why
we say deals are terrible when players get filthy rich like that's that's just because
of the prism through which we're looking at these things. And I'll say,
I think Chris Middleton got underpaid, Like I know, people are gonna be
concerned about his injuries like I would have thought. I know, he guaranteed
himself a bunch of money if he's happy and would in whatever, if he's
happy in Milwaukee. I get it. I just if I were a team,
if I were the Rockets, if I were the Spurs, I just
like, we'll give you three years and one hundred and twenty, just like
I don't like maybe so or two at the max you go to too,
just maxim out for two years. I think I think there were definitely two,
yeah that I like, I definitely would have done something like that.
I'm I'm like fascinated by the by the Raptors now more than I was.
Maybe is it morbid fascination like this could be. I want to be clear.
They're a team that I think could be better than Atlanta, you know,
New York next season they could. I just, I just what are
they doing here? Like I just I don't love the balance of their roster
offensively just yet. And I think Peartle was a big help to Van Fleet's
passing, Like he kind of needs that screener, that pick and roll guy,
but you have enough spacing to adequately compliment it, Like I just,
I don't know. It leaves me a little cold thinking about a team that
you and I have both kind of been in the bag for ever since they
won the title, you know, as just other teams better than you think,
or you know of the you know whoever was sort of in the six,
seven, eight, nine ten range of the East the last couple of
years. We always liked the Raptors the best, or I did anyway.
I don't want to speak for you, but I think you know, I
think I would have to check, but I think we both had them aggressively
high. Yes, But so it leaves me a little cold. Do you
feel the same way that hypothetically or not hypothetically. So far, it looks
like they're kind of just bringing the whole gang back from a team that we
would, based on our expectations, has been disappointing, and I guess there's
like Scotty Barnes could get a lot better. Precious to Chua is still kind
of like a mystery box. You don't know what you're going to get there.
Maybe Ann and Obi makes a leap, like there are ways for them
to improve, But I'm not excited to see the same roster back with a
different coach, Like maybe that's all that. Maybe it'll turn out that's was,
but I you know, I just I don't know how you can look
at what happened the last two years with the same problems, you know,
just repeating themselves, and just decide, yeah, year three will be It's
like one of it's like the meme of like it doesn't work for anybody,
but maybe it could work for us. It's like, no, I think
we've got two years to suggest it will not work for you. And so
I get why that. I think it's a funny joke. But I think
you can explain why the Raptors struggled so much last year. But it's just
so funny that they had this high asking price on all of their guys and
yet they were just not a good basketball team. And I think my big
concern here is even if you believe in this core as Scotty Barnes getting better,
which by the way, is a perfectly reasonable stance to make, and
I would I would take it like I believe Scotty Barnes will get better.
I like the players at the tippy top of this core. What are you
doing to flesh out your depth at this point, because as you mentioned,
like they are so close to that second apron and I don't even know,
like is this a team they're gonna want to pay the tax for? But
like like even like forget about the second apron, Like are they even gonna
want to pay the tax for this team? So I I'm just I'm fascinated
to see what their direction is. But I would argue they're not done,
and I would say it's not just a matter of resigning van Fleet. It
feels like this is gonna be We're gonna see some cost cutting maneuvers. I
just now, I'm really curious what Van Vleet gets if he stays, and
what the options are now to go someplace else, because it's almost I'm sure
you know, I'm trying to look at the who's got the room to do
anything? And just is there anyone that you could see as a realistic possibility
to just sign Van Vleet out right, like, other than Houston? Is
this just Van Fleet's going to Houston and the Raptors are going to figure it
out, you know, using a roster exception to replace them. Look,
if they wanted to, the Spurs could want to still do it, but
we know that that's not their moo. If the Jazz could still get there,
like, they could still easily get there. So and I kind of
love him there. I don't know how you feel about him in Utah.
Yeah, him, I guess I love him everywhere. By the way,
Orlando still sitting out there right like they could do it. We know they
don't want to, but they could still do it. I guess the Jazz
I did forget that. Excuse me, Jordan Clarson opted in, so like
they would have to move. I would think someone would take on, like
Kelly Olynik or so, Yeah, it's tougher for them. I would throw
Utah out of there. There's a lot of people who thought they would wave
Olynic and that Clarson and town Horn tuck we're gonna opt out, and then
none of those blown said a three team sign and trade for Max Strews is
about to happen. Who's involved there? Douglas Mark gets a Grant, should
give a ten percent gig back to Troy Weaver. Grant got paid. I
think Joe Cronin deserves all the credit here. Actually, at this point,
so Gavin Gomez wants to go to the Bruce Brown deal. Nobody in Denver
with an IQ over seventy thought Bruce Brown was coming back. We knew he
was gone before the postseason started. I just didn't want him to go to
the Lakers. I would respectfully just say that the consensus among Nuggets fans and
my Twitter mentions and our YouTube mentions and our TikTok mentions, I would just
disagree. I just there was an overarching sentiment I think among at least a
subset of Nuggets fans that he was just gonna take less money and go back.
I'm I'm happy he got the bag. I'm still kind of shocked though,
that he didn't get more, I mean, were more guaranteed. I'm
sorry, I've yeah, I got I got what you mean. I kind
of thought, I mean, well, we just cited the Batoum example.
So many times, and talking about Bruce Brown was like, well, there's
precedent this happens the wink wink, you know, come back for way less
than your market value and then we pay you off in the subsequent seasons.
That made it semi plausible. But I don't know that anybody foresaw Bruce Brown
just getting this, Matt, you know this forty five over two years.
That's because then you just get the real bonus there is, just get back
on the market, like he's not gonna you know, he's in the middle
of what should be his prime years. I think I get it. Why
maybe, So that's all just to say there was a Bato Mesk like,
wink wink, you know, come back for seven point eight with a player
option for you know, twenty four, twenty five, and we'll just give
you some stupid number a year from now. But the stupid number showed up
from Indiana, So I mean, not stupid, but like a crazy high
number. I think we both have said several times we like this for the
pacers. There is a lull in the act right now, so that would
be good time to get your comments in questions, and if you want them
answered, I will say so Minnesota. I did see they're using part of
their mL for both Nikkil Alexander Walker, And why am I just blanking on
the other player? Who's the other player that? Oh, Troy Brown.
I don't know that Troy Brown was good enough to command a lot more than
the minimum, But if you're splitting your MLI among those two, I get
it. I STI don't love losing Tony and Prince. I feel like I
know this team has shooting when you look at Anthony Edwards off the dribble,
when you look at Karl Anthony Towns being there like they don't have a sigh
from Karl Anthony Towns. They don't have caps locks shooting, And so to
get rid of Grant, it just feels, you know, when you have
Kyle Anderson on that team, when you have Rudy Gobert on that team,
that just feels like it could be this understated loss. Maybe even Jaden McDaniels
continuing to up his volume, and you do have nas Read in the front
court as well, but his three point percent urget cloth is not a really
strong note, but it's been It can be a little topsy turvy, just
the Tory and the logic here makes me a little uncomfortable. But Nick kay
Looxander Walker did play well enough to be like, hey, you need to
like you need to keep him, like that's someone who can help you at
back, a point guard with win defense, and maybe he gives you some
shooting as well. Yeah, you're preaching the choir on that one. Big
big, big news, big news for us since we keep track of this
stuff now. So Kim Johnson's four year deal, this is Michael Scotto just
just tweeted this a couple of minutes ago, can reach up to one hundred
and eight million with full bonus incentives. So I don't know where that's gonna
Does that mean I was correct and over twenty five million or not? Do
we base it on the total maximum number of his deal? Or you know
what I mean? Because what is how many incents due to say how much?
No, it doesn't say just it's just it's very uh, basically against
the agent sore reporting that gave the four for one oh eight number. If
we're being honest, two million a season for incentive sounds about right, which
is all you would need to be to be. So it's like I think
you're you're still in we'll go with the total amount, because I was just
I want to know which team was going to offer him, and I felt
that way a lot more after the Pistons went and traded for Joe Harris,
because yeah, he could work in an indie but like Utah uses cap space
and like indiedn't I view Cam Johnson is He's a very good player, and
he's more versatile on defense than I'm about to frame this, but I view
him as more of a like a pure four than I do someone who can
hang at the three or slide up to the five. And I think that
there's this Julius Randall he is not like but even like, all right,
I'll frame it this way, and maybe maybe I'm wrong. Would you rather
play John Collins at the five or Cam Johnson at the three? Oh?
I think I'd rather Johnson at the three, but that's because I really don't
want John Collins at the five. What I do think this illuminates, though,
is that Johnson might have been worth more to the Nets than a lot
of other teams, because you do have the guy in Michl Bridges that is
that guy that can guard the threes, and so Johnson really is not going
to have to do a lot of that, so he can just play to
his strengths, guard force, make shots, do that. So you know,
sometimes we don't think enough about I'm including myself in this roster construction in
terms of fit and what a guy might be worth in you know, destination
a versus b And because Bridges is in Brooklyn, it makes the john you
know, you could pay Johnson more there potentially than another team would and it
would be justifiable. The let's get this comment for us, going to say,
Keith Smith has like a big board of the free agents, the best
free agents available that would probably be good to go through. Blown says,
the bull seems to be in basketball purgatory. I was. We didn't talk
about the Boots deal. He got three and sixty guaranteed. Kobe White apparently
was three for thirty three and it can get up to forty, I believe,
is what Grant told me. They don't seem to be in bestaball.
They're just there. I don't know what their path out of here is.
I don't think that they've gotten noticeably better from a trade asset perspective by keeping
White and Booch. I think both those numbers, and I believe I mentioned
this, Actually I didn't mention this on podcast. I thought it was three
for eighty when I first saw the report, and I like, I went
into them, but it was three sixty, which is it's just fine,
and it's like you do need I think it wasn't so much a bird right
trap as Okay, well he was a starting caliber center and you want to
roll some of these salary slots over if you do want to move them.
But this is just you know when you had Suns fans talking about, well
we could just overpay Tory Craig and then move him later. Yeah, but
you need other teams to value that deal, and I don't think I think
there are plenty of teams that would acquire voos on this deal. I don't
think there are many that would consider it like a material asset. And for
the Bulls, do you have any thoughts. I'm like, it's clear we
can talk about that meeting to tear it down and start over, but they're
not doing that. They just pay like it's just it's not happening. It's
like, what is the like reasonable path forward for them? Well, first
of all, that comment could have been from like any point in the last
four years, and it would have been accurate because the Bulls have just been
here forever. I don't know what the path is because if you bring Vosovich
back, I would agree, it's like it's not a crippling deal, but
it's you know, it's probably more than it's worth it. It's just as
a signal of what the team is trying to do. It's kind of a
bummer if you want to rebuild or you want, you know, just some
ambition other than let's fight for the eighth seed. I think maybe the direction
is we were really good for like half of a year over a year ago,
and all these players plus Lonzo Ball, who's all by all accounts is
not going to play this year, are the reason we were, you know,
top of the East in like January of what would that have been twenty
two or something. Remember that for a hot second when the Bulls were really
good, which is and I that was a large what a lot of or
something. I'm sorry, would you say, I didn't mean to interrupt you,
No, no, no, I'm just saying, like that's the only
way I can get to justifying the Bulls just not doing something more drastic to
try to go one way or the other, and you know, to an
extreme degree, is they're just hanging onto that that that's the best explanation I
can give. Go ahead, and I understand that. I just don't know
how you get back there without Lonzo Ball, who that whole thing is just
it sucks like he was just so good for them, and I think one
of not the only pathway, one of the only pathways would be Patrick Williams
explodes, which is not I was talking to a friend of the podcast,
Reet Bauer about this. I just don't trust his offense nearly as much as
the numbers should say that I do. And part of that might just be
as rhet pointed out, and literally I try to be better about this,
like maybe I'm evaluating him too heavily within the context of this team where he's
kind of buried in the pecking order. I just don't see how that goes
away. Yeah, you know what I mean. Yeah, No, the
circumstances won't change. He is like kind of alarmingly low usage, and it's
it's hard to as blown says free Zach Lavine, I mean free the Bulls,
that mutual free free Yeah, yeah, no, I I agree that,
And and look, we just talked up Kobe White, so like,
I guess there's more than one way for this to you know, end a
little better for the bulls if you are banking on organic growth. But yeah,
Williams has not looked like a guy that's gonna blow up, and and
if he is, the situation is just not going to allow for It's gonna
make it way harder than it would be if he were on another team.
Can I can I real quickly? Because as we're talking about it, so
Vootch and Peartle are getting roughly the same average annual value. Peartle has an
extra year, but is younger. Do you hate the Peartle contract more than
the Vouchovitch contract because it's essentially equal money annually? Because I kind of like,
I like, I'd rather have Peartle, honestly, and like I'm kind
of down on that signing for what it portends about Toronto's direction too, but
like I'll you'll take the defender. Do you know what's interesting is that if
you flip flopped these two players on the teams, I might like their deals
better, because I don't woods would help Toronto space like not much for their
rim protection, so Peartles should help there though, was riom protection kind of
slipped while he was there? But I would actually kind of love him in
Chicago. Yeah, and I would love Booch and like if I which deal
do I like? I probably like Yakob Peartle's deal less. I'm not gonna
lie. I guess he's a little bit younger, but he's not his verstime
on the offensive and you can't play him in crunch time. He's not gonna
hit his free throws. And maybe this is me being too married to the
to the context. Oh that's funny. I was shouting out Ret Bauer is
actually in here shout out Ret for watching, unless he just heard his name
and just and just rolled in, which is even more impressive up the signal.
Yeah, So I don't know how you like. If if Yaka Peartle
could shoot like seventy percent from the foul line instead of like twelve percent or
whatever it is, I probably feel a little bit better. Uh, Gabe,
No, yeah, Gabe Vincent three years and thirty three million dollars to
the Lakers. Okay, Delos going where. I guess they ca'll play together.
But like you're gonna pay Austin Reeves, Gabe Vincent and Delo well,
and they're still shrewder. They're still shrewder hanging out there. What becomes of
him? Yeah? That is first of all, I love I think I
love the fit. I would prefer if Gabe Vincent was a more proven shooter,
but he had some like really hot stretches. Uh, like like in
the playoffs last year. Do you want to know what I love about about
all this? Uh? Please tell me? Is in the second sentence of
Seaum's tweet reporting reporting the Vincent deal, Vincent's agent Bill Neff, negotiated the
new deal for a tremendous undrafted success story. We need that does that kind
of plagiarism for woe because Wode is the one that uses tremendous. I just
I don't need end up editorializing. I don't I we get it like this
came from the agent. We don't need to like shout him out and say
and pump up GiB Vinson. He just made thirty three million dollars. He's
good. We don't need to. We don't need and so is it like
a quid pro quo if you that you can't tag the agents Twitter handle because
they don't have one, so you get to give the it's either your Twitter
handle or you get to spin it. Yeah, so I don't so some
questions that, oh the number, I thought he was predicting. I thought
fk Retcher was predicting someone's record or shot profile. Are the Spurs trying to
get anyone? Wouldn't it be funny if they just came in and like got
Van Vleet or Brook Lopez Right now, I've told you I love Lopez alongside
Wemby, just even for like a year. Just go beat people up and
shoot threes and block shots and let Lembi run around. Both of us will
take a victory lap if Devo goes to the Raptors, because we just we
said that kind of erroneously, both of us in separate TikTok videos, by
the way, so maybe you said it first and I copied off of you,
but we both said Delo that the Raptors could use Delo. I mean,
I don't remember saying that, but but that's the case for most things.
I say. Well, it's almost it's just like there's this musical chairs
game with the point guards of which there are very few in this free agency
class, and it's like, well Van Fleet leaves, like, who who
is there for the Raptors to get that's a starting caliber player. I don't
think either of us like Delo very much, but there's just not that many
other options, if you know so, I wouldn't be surprised at all if
that's how it ended up. Even though I don't, I don't love the
fit. I like so I think with Yeah, I'm just and FK Retro,
I still like the poison pill idea with Iota the Spurs. I just
don't think it takes a poison pill. I think it takes just like an
offer. Here's an offer. I'm playing for Auston the Bulls probably out of
walg at this point, uh Reeves to the Spurs. They could they could
poison pill him just to be like, let's fuck with the Lakers payroll and
worst case scenario, we have to pay on average twenty five million a year
for Austin Reeves. That might be that is steep. I won't. I
won't. That's I've I've already you've anyone who's watched our trucks that you so
brilliantly put together, I have threatened to poison pill Austin Reeves immediately, so
I would I have no problem paying him as much as you possibly can in
an offer sheet. Yeah, that's true as well. I guess the Heat
taken major losses right now. I mean the Max s Trusse was a sign
in trade, and so if you come out of that with Okoro and Jetty
Osman, I think you're fine. Vincent on the Lakers, I guess so
gives you some point of it. I would guess Shrewder is gone unless he's
coming back on the minimum, because Vincent's going to replace his point of attack
stuff. I don't think you want to be too small ish on the perimeter
with you know, Vincent and Reeves and then Shrewder. And if you bring
back Delo, I think it was the tallest person. They're six five and
so none of them are really wings. Tracey said he would much rather have
Reeves on the Spurs than Fred van Fleet. That's I just trust Fred van
Fleet more as a shooter and someone who could actually run the offense than Reeves.
But maybe you could expand that role for Reeves. We did see it
in the in the playoffs. Well, and the money wouldn't be equal between
those two either. Though. That's the thing I think, I think,
I guess, I'm I'm just like talking myself into the bag for Reeves over
and over this offseason. But I would rather have him than van Fleet.
And that's assuming van Fleet's getting thirty plus and Reeves tops out at twenty five
or so actually would start lower than that. So it makes it even easier
for me to stomach that I do. I think, Oh, you're,
well, you gotta face what happened. Someone's a bunch of people are retweeting
this. Oh, there's no way I can't. I don't know. There's
someone's reporting that brook Lopez isn't going back to the Bucks, and I would
argue, his name is Chris Roberts, doesn't not a lot of Twitter followers,
but some people that I trust are retweeting him. We're not. That's
I think that's a prettymature reaction. I would have bet large amounts of money
that, uh, brook Lopez was staying in Milwaukee after we saw that Middleton
deal. Like his number came down by what was his playoffs for forty one?
Yeah, like that number came down by eight million, about let's say,
unless they're doing a d escalating scale. Uh yeah, fk Retro.
We already talked stars to the Warriors. I think we were both. I
mean for the minimum. I'm actually surprised that. Okay, so he didn't
have the roster space, but like, that's someone who I would equivocate it.
Not that everyone has the biannual, but like bi annual money at four
million, I would have given him U even like Indiana, just like throwing
sharks the room exception or something like. I don't like that would have been
semi interesting. A lot of teams, by the way, could have done
that and I would have thought it was semied or really interesting. What was
I just talking about? Oh, broke bugs. If he leaves, where
where would be the most likely deccision? Probably Houston because they're just gonna throw
some crazy number at him, right, that's you're right, Like they haven't
paid anyone after saying they were gonna pay everyone, so then it'll be you
know, this is sometimes all the early slop Is did and so are the
Rockets just gonna have Van Vleet Lopez and Brooks? Like, is that is
that where that money is gonna go? I mean that's that's actually more gap
space than they have to spend. So well is it? Well? I
guess if you used the mL E for it depends on how you well can
they do that Dylan? If Dylan Brooks is seven million, like if he
gets the room exception, uh, and you sign you could give van Fleet
and Brook Lopez like thirty million each if you really want, I really do
that. So he went, let's say thirty three for Fred VanVleet and you
did what do you want to say sixteen for Brooke? Or do you think
he? I mean the yaka peartle deals fucking with my head right now.
I think I think Lopez has got to get over twenty to leave Milwaukee,
don't you? All right? So yeah, I mean if you spend fifty
five to sixty on Fred van Fleet and Lopez, you could then techinically use
the room exception to get Dylan Brooks. Yes, only one dot z.
We talked strus to the calves already. I'm still waiting. Do we have
the exact signed in trade details? I don't. Everyone says it's they're they're
still working on it, which is just like, well, maybe this is
a classic. Well we just want to make it seem like we didn't talk
before free agency actually started. Did you see the report was funny by the
way, where it would mention who's the player that they had, it was
they were working on side. I think it was Struce. There was a
report that the Calves were working on a sign and trade with the Heat and
it's like, uh, like, that's damn break like this. It was
thirty day So Royan Ruth, where does Utah go for a point guard in
the free agent or trade market? So this would be a good time to
bring up maybe I should put it on the screen. I'll see if I
could do that. Well, some of them have been signed, so but
like some of the point guards that are available, D'Angelo Russell, Russell Westbrook
and Fred Van Fleet. I guess Austin Reeve's is technically a guard that and
Dante DiVincenzo is still floating around out there. Also nothing so far for Hachimura,
PJ. Washington, or Grant Williams, who were all restricted. Christian
Woods also still available. I think him and Lopez were clearly the two best
centers left. Joe McDaniels, I'm eyes like in a wing light market,
Yeah, and that we haven't. That's actually so this is a question that
I had before I forgot to ask you. The hardened stuff is holding up
at least some of these transactions because John McDaniels is on Philly right now.
And then for the Clippers with Russ Westbrook, I think a lot of people
assumed he would just come back. Maybe they would sign them with early bird
rights next year, but they would give him the one or twenty percent raise.
If they're now waiting on Harden, there's no way you're bringing back Russ
to play with with Harden. So it's at least holding ups. And then
Miami, can you go about I know you you've already lost guys, but
like, were you if you're in on Harden or really waiting for Dame Even
were you if there were outcomes to both of those guys already, would you
have been more likely to keep Vincent? Maybe I don't, I don't know.
Maybe not, I will say. And because we've had a few people
mentioning how the Heat are kind of looking like they're bleeding a little bit here,
I just don't see a scenario where the Heat are losing these guys is
without some larger plan happening, Like I just maybe it's naive, but I
refuse to believe that the Heat are just going to allow talent to leave without
it being part of an idea to get just you know, one big player,
like and I don't know who that is because Dame seems less likely now
that the Blazers spent a trillion dollars on Grant and then the Clippers are the
front runner for Harden, So who is that guy? But I'm not as
down on where the Heat are right now, just because I think this isn't
this isn't the end game for them. I think right like, it can't
be. You can't go for making the finals a couple of times in a
short stretch to just like letting your talent leave with no sort of backup plan.
I do think what helps too is and let's just I'm assuming it's Jetty
Osman and Isaaca Cooro for Max Drew's I just don't like even if it's Dean
Wade and Jetty Osman, I don't think that that would give the Calves enough
wiggle room to work with salary rise. I'm assuming it's not Ricky Rubio,
Like you've gotten two players who can be in your rotation, you know what
I mean? Like, so a corel like none of them give you the
playmaking that Dave Vincent would have, so if you need someone to organize your
offense. But I think just if you're losing two rotation players and then you're
replacing them with two rotation players who aren't expiring contract, it keeps you very
flexible moving forward. And look, they could still I don't know who,
Like do they just end up with, Like Malik Beasley is slowing around?
Like what if his market created so much that would be a perfect rehab guy
for Miami, looking at his value as someone who could like come around,
fly through the half court and shoot a bunch of threes. I get that
it looks like they're taking els at the moment, but they didn't lose Streus
for nothing. And I just when you have Lowry, maybe you're banking on
Oladipo being healthy, you have Jimmy Butler, And I think the key here
is you are trying to trade for another playmaker, Like even if it's hardened
Dame Zach Lavine, for all I care, I think that it just this
doesn't feel like a huge, huge el to me, and maybe I'm also
I guess I was so encouraged by Duncan Robinson's performance on some of the big
stages this year that it's kind of like, I'm not trying to be like,
oh, like both of these Caucasians and Max Drews and Robinson or shooters
like other Rapson was doing things off the dribble. Max rus is better defensively,
So I think that softens the blow a little bit. I don't know
if you like, if that's where you end up too, Yeah, I
think so. I think I think we need to do like a little bit
of a macro thing here. We're ninety minutes in. What is the most
surprising signing to you? And what is let's just say with that because I
have one that just popped across my feed that takes the cake for me,
the most like shocking sign surprising just like huh. I would not have guessed
that, whether it's the years, the dollars or the team, Reggie Jackson
getting the full tax player from I think it's Kuzma for me. I just
didn't I never thought he would go back to Washington. I just it wasn't
like it just didn't seem realistic, which like, like, now, I
I kind of understand it since we've talked through it, that like you just
keep the guy that you can trade on a reasonable number as opposed to letting
and walk. But I just in the spectrum of possibilities for Kyle Kyle Kuzma,
it was just like, well, he'll sign for a crazy number with
Detroit or Houston or the Kings or whatever. I just didn't I'm shocked that
he's back in Washington. I guess, so it's surprising given everything else they
did. But like and turn, like, for someone like yourself who preaches
asset preservation, is it really that surprising? I guess. Do you think
it's surprising that they gave him that number because this is not someone that you're
planning on having, you know, as Phone says in the chat, like
Kuzma times like, that's not the core you're planning on having moving forward.
Kuzma seemed like a guy most likely going to be low balled by other teams
to me, and one look, one certain cap spaceed right up, like
if Indy was more in on Bruce Brown, the smaller combo guard fringe wing
than the combo forward and Kuzma. Then, yeah, that's really a good
theory. I guess what might take me back? I'm at twenty five plus
per year viewing that as someone that you could then turn aroun out and move
and maybe get actual value for. I guess that's pretty surprising. Is that?
Is that sort of where you're at, because like, you don't want
to lose him for nothing? Yeah, no, I mean I am.
I like, I'm sort of saying two contradictory things here, because that's a
preservation is kind of the name of the game, especially if the alternative is
just like he leaves and you have nothing to show for it. But I
just didn't just everything Washington did suggested we're not spending anything on anybody that's not
young and projectable and whatever. But you made a face, and I think
it's, uh, he hasn't involved you to Watsonabi, Yeah, well yes,
but it also involves Joe Ingles getting twenty two million dollars from the Magic
Oh okay, I almost gave us. I almost made the memorable careerving hands
to the head thing. That's a lot of money. Don't screenshot at it.
It'll be going up on Twitter moments. I like Joe Ingles a lot,
that's I mean, and he can shoot it and he can run a
pick and roll if you need him to. Although this is all stuff called
from like pre acl Joe Ingles with utah. I just I don't, I
don't know. I hate to be down on a Joe Ingles deal, but
that seems like a lot. It seems like a lot. It's only two
years though, and they're clearly just not going to spend and he look he
could run point for them, well you know what, yeh can he?
Though? I guess I guess like running point for Orlando is like a very
different job than it would be for other teams because both your forwards are gonna
create shots, so like that, yeah, as as like a supplementary piece
that's gonna space the floor, which he can still do for sure. That
that's It's I just I thought maybe he was going to be like a biannual
guy or you know, closer to the minimum than this isn't full mle money.
But you know, eleven million a year for him is surprising to me.
I didn't think Ingles mainly it's a sticker shock. I didn't think Engle
is gonna get that much I'm I'm with you there, and by the way,
it's a loss, I would say from Milwaukee, just as someone who
shot forty percent from three and gave you some they need, like they need
more ball handling in the half court. I know it's not him because they
want that to come in the form of athleticism. But like first of all,
Jay Crowder still floating around out there by the way too, I haven't
seen anything on him, so it's not it's not a nothing lost from Milwaukee,
even if you just didn't like to fit there. I the number is
a little shocking, but it's just one of those like, hey, we
gave this vet in or he's gonna come in. They needed shooting hit threes.
Him and Jet Howard can stretch the floor around these guys and with how
kind of slow they sometimes play in the half court, like you could run
stuff like he could give you secondary pick and roll ball handling if you they'll
be okay. Angles got cooked by undrafted players. Look, he's old and
he's coming off that like the torn acl or wherever he had. And the
other thing is Utah wants an obbies. You mentioned the Phoenix. That's a
home run signing. They only had the minimum, he should actually play good
three point shooter could probably stand to take more. So he's low volume on
offense, which does make it a little he can be annoying, like kind
of the want to Conno Anderson syndrome where it's like just like more. Yeah,
and then as FK Retro says, do you think this means Tory Craig
is gone? I would say no, they have his early bird rights and
I don't they let like a code. Well, Kobe's going back, so
maybe does this make it more likely? Like if you've Utah wants an Abby
at the minimum for your combo forward role, is that better than Tory Craig
at x dollars per year? I'm not sure what I think it's gonna take
to get Tory Craig, But I don't feel like this. Well, I
should say I think Wat's an Abby is about is probably one of the best
minimum signings you could possibly have made. Do you agree with that? I
know you've been in camp Utah for a while, but like that's he became
like a mainstream free agent. Yeah, because of all these things that have
no money that wanted to sign him, which good, like good for him
I thought, I said, if I were a cap Space team, like,
honestly, Joe Angeles is more proven than Utah wants an iby, be
like if you were the Pacers or something like, why not two years,
ten million or something, just like to try it. I thought maybe that
would be something that we could see a cap Space team. Do I agree?
I'm surprised it was the minimum that got him. Yeah, I honestly
thought he was gonna price himself out of minimum. But maybe teams know something
we don't. Uh I, I don't know how you would not like this
deal for Phoenix just such an like, I'm shocked he won for the minimum.
I'm not gonna lie. I really thought he was gonna The way you
feel about Joe Angles contract being too much, I feel about Utah want an
Abby being too little. Well, how about this. If if Uta had
gotten two ears for twenty two million and Angles had gotten the minimum, it
would have seemed a little more like Okay, yeah, that checks out.
That's the best way. That's the best way to frame it. Uh So
second year on Angles is a team option apparently, Okay, that's I mean,
that's not a bad deal. It's not a bad deal. I was
just in there, yeah, and shooting, like they needed shooting. What
did we say they needed shooting and ball handling? Yeah, he's he's I
feel like this is an under talked about part of his game, but like
he's a really sloppy pastor out of the pick and roll. I don't know
if he just tastes too many chances, but he commits turnovers. I'm like
twenty percent of all his pick and roll possessions. This this is And by
the way, if you need to leave, leave at any point and I'll
go solo for just a little bit. I was trying. I was hoping
we would get like a Brooke Opez deals, the one that I'm waiting on.
Oh oh interesting, Yeah that's what are the Sixers gonna do here?
What what's going on in Philadelphia right now? Uh? Brian sile thing,
I like shaking minus. Yeah. Look, he can run pick and roll,
he shot well catching shoot threes last year, and he's I feel like
he's bigger than people who realize it's six five. So the theory of him,
like he's not gonna get run over defensively, and they needed a backup
point guard. I thought they needed shooting, just as much and they've lost
Sumtorian Prince, but Shake Milton gives you kind of he gives you both essentially,
so and I guess that's they're not using the mL E on Shake,
Troy Brown Junior and naw Right like that's not getting you. Maybe it does.
All those times I was just douming, this is for the minimum would
be my pointer or maybe the I don't think they might have the bi annual
if they if they lumped all those guys into the MLA. I think Minnesota
just had the best off season in the league two years in a row.
Right, last off season went great. I think this is just they're just
banking another one right now. I'm bias pressess fan, nobody the Pistons.
I'm sure you got Joe Harris. Yeah, come on, but we haven't
talked about Joe Harris. Hold on, Yeah, we'll get to Kirk's comment.
But then, what do you think about Joe Harris. I thought that
was like on an expiring deal, getting pure shooting if you didn't think you
were gonna get Cam Johnson. And I also, by the way, I
would argue he's for the way that it seems like they want to play they
have all these front court players that feel like centers or four point five's when
you look at sure Of and Isaiah Stewart or Marvin Bagley, and if you
want to play two of those bigs together at all times, Joe Harris is
a better fit. Thank Cam Johnson is, because like that's someone at the
two, the three, and he look, he's I think he's probably gonna
hold up better defensively against wings than certainly, well maybe not. Bogdanovitch is
kind of strong sometimes. But this also is just, hey, we didn't
make any long term commitments now, and so put that one up. Bryan
Singleton Atlanta saw if a starting went out for cigarettes. I mean, look,
they gotta avoid the tax. They can't be spending money. I don't
care about rest. They're not trying to spend money. Oh man, that
was great. Now you were that, Ryan Man? What were we just
talking about? Yeah, what do you think about with the Pistons or would
you have preferred, Like do you think you're at the point where, Look,
Kim Johnson's twenty seven, so let's throw that like his that a four
year deal would have taken him into his thirties. I'm not saying that Joe
Harris is like a better player or like much better fit that I do think
just based off position only what they need. I think the idea or someone
like Joe Harris is a better fit, even if you would have preferred Cam
Johnson. I respect and would probably applaud the Pistons for not doing something that
could infury unnecessarily accelerate their timeline, or just it's such a long term,
big commitment it could theoretically have a higher chance of turning into a bad deal.
I mean, first of all, it's kind of funny to me to
imagine the It's funny to me to imagine the Pistons and the Nets talking,
and the Nets saying like, please don't offer Cam Johnson like thirty five a
year, Just please don't. We'll give you Joe Harris, just can you?
Will you just take Joe Harris and leave us alone, because we'd like
to clear some money so we can stay under the tax or under the first
Staprin or wherever they are and signed and sign Cam Johnson. No, I
think I think Harris makes everybody who matters in Detroit, makes their jobs easier.
Jade and Ivy Kay Cunningham, all their bigs, him and Bogdanovich if
they play together enough like pretty premium spacing from your three and your four,
So like, yeah, I get it. Like, and I guess I'm
I'm caping for this move a little more just because you know, unbiased Pistons
fan you put them up in the chat is struggling mentally here, but because
the Pistons, that's all they've done so far. But I think the sentiment
was mostly negative I guess from Pistons fans and people that that we're just kind
of down on this deal. I guess it's underwhelming because you know, if
your team has cap space, you're just hoping that it's for something splashier than
Joe Harris. But like if if he's healthier than he's been, he's a
like I mean, how many shooters are there better than him in the league
over the last like five six years. I mean, it's a real short
list in terms of just pure three point percentage for high volume guys, And
that's just that makes life easier for young guards and guys that need space to
just get better. So I really actually really like it for for Detroit.
Yeah, I just and well harris Is shot kind of fell off towards last
year, and we saw his playing time. It felt like him and Seth
Curry after the Durrant trade were like caught between one another a little bit.
But I'm just yeah, I'm I don't know if I'm going to be like,
oh this is I did like the Joe Harris steal for what it's worth.
Well, we just don't think you're not struggling mentally. We're trying to
spin this like you could be okay. We this as a call for help.