WEBVTT 1 00:00:28.320 --> 00:00:32.840 Welcome back to the Path Went Chili. I'm Robin, I'm Jules, and 2 00:00:32.920 --> 00:00:38.719 I'm Ashley. Let's dive right into this week's case. November one, two 3 00:00:38.799 --> 00:00:44.880 thousand and one, State College, Pennsylvania. After spending Halloween night partying at 4 00:00:44.880 --> 00:00:49.520 a club, twenty one year old penn State student Cindy Song is dropped off 5 00:00:49.560 --> 00:00:54.159 at her apartment complex at four am. She's never heard from again, but 6 00:00:54.280 --> 00:00:58.359 some of her personal items and a piece of her Halloween costume are found inside 7 00:00:58.359 --> 00:01:03.920 her apartment. Years later, and informant tells police that Cindy was abducted and 8 00:01:03.000 --> 00:01:10.159 murdered by a pair of suspects named Hugo Soelenski and Michael Kurkowski. The search 9 00:01:10.159 --> 00:01:15.680 of Celenski's property uncovers the remains of Kurkowski and several other victims, but no 10 00:01:15.799 --> 00:01:19.640 trace of Cindy is ever found. After that, the Path went Chilly. 11 00:01:21.519 --> 00:01:23.359 So today we'll be covering a case which is considered to be one of the 12 00:01:23.359 --> 00:01:29.239 most famous unsold mysteries to take place on Halloween, the two thousand and one 13 00:01:29.239 --> 00:01:34.239 Disappearance of Cindy's Song. It involves a young woman from Korea who was living 14 00:01:34.239 --> 00:01:38.079 in the United States on a student visa and entering her final year at Penn 15 00:01:38.159 --> 00:01:42.599 State University. Cindy was planning on graduating in the spring and had a bright 16 00:01:42.640 --> 00:01:46.400 future out of her but before this could take place, she went out partying 17 00:01:46.400 --> 00:01:49.359 with some friends on Halloween night, and after being dropped off at her apartment 18 00:01:49.359 --> 00:01:53.159 complex during the early morning hours, she vanished without a trace and has not 19 00:01:53.200 --> 00:01:57.439 been seen since. This case would be featured on one of the final episodes 20 00:01:57.480 --> 00:02:01.799 of Unsolved Mysteries, and if you perform any research online, you'll likely come 21 00:02:01.799 --> 00:02:06.840 across a photograph of Cindy's song with Bunny Ears, which was part of her 22 00:02:06.840 --> 00:02:12.039 Halloween costume. This photo is particularly haunting to look at, knowing that Cindy 23 00:02:12.039 --> 00:02:15.560 would vanish within hours of it being taken, and the picture would often be 24 00:02:15.639 --> 00:02:20.680 featured on her missing posters. However, a piece of Cindy's Halloween costume was 25 00:02:20.719 --> 00:02:23.840 found inside her apartment after she disappeared, which indicated that she did make it 26 00:02:23.919 --> 00:02:30.240 home safely before she inexplicably vanished. A convicted serial killer named Hugo Selensky was 27 00:02:30.280 --> 00:02:36.759 eventually implicated in Cindy's disappearance, as the remains of multiple victims were found buried 28 00:02:36.800 --> 00:02:40.240 on his property. But since none of these remains belonging to Cindy, investigators 29 00:02:40.240 --> 00:02:45.520 have been unable to find any definitive evidence that Selenski killed her. So this 30 00:02:45.599 --> 00:02:47.919 lead is going to be one of the focal points on her series of episodes. 31 00:02:50.159 --> 00:02:53.280 So this case is interesting because if you think about Halloween and someone who's 32 00:02:53.280 --> 00:02:59.120 going out to a party, I mean that has the ability to be dangerous, 33 00:02:59.159 --> 00:03:00.960 right. People can be drinking, people can be doing drugs. There 34 00:03:01.000 --> 00:03:05.479 can be people you're not familiar with, and there can be people who you're 35 00:03:05.520 --> 00:03:09.439 familiar with who might have a reason to harm you. But this really scary 36 00:03:09.479 --> 00:03:14.479 part about Cindy's case is that they're pretty sure she actually did get back to 37 00:03:14.520 --> 00:03:16.800 her residence, which means she's in the place she should have been the most 38 00:03:16.840 --> 00:03:21.000 safe and should have been able to go to sleep after she was dropped off, 39 00:03:21.240 --> 00:03:25.520 and come to find out, she's probably abducted and murdered. And so 40 00:03:25.960 --> 00:03:30.479 I'm assuming they never found her body. Is that correct? That is correct? 41 00:03:30.520 --> 00:03:32.080 I mean I mentioned that they looked on a property of a guy named 42 00:03:32.199 --> 00:03:37.000 Hugo Selenski and found a bunch of human remains, but none of them belonged 43 00:03:37.039 --> 00:03:39.639 to her. And another weird detail is that there was no sign of any 44 00:03:39.680 --> 00:03:45.080 struggle or violence in Cindy's apartments, so it doesn't seem like she was abducted 45 00:03:45.080 --> 00:03:47.759 from there. So it's possible that after she was dropped off at home, 46 00:03:47.840 --> 00:03:53.159 she stepped outside for a brief period and that's when she was abducted. Oh 47 00:03:53.240 --> 00:03:54.840 yeah, absolutely, she could have gone out to go to the car, 48 00:03:55.120 --> 00:03:59.280 to get a smoke, to do something, or maybe she was even lured 49 00:03:59.319 --> 00:04:01.120 out of the house with someone saying, hey, come meet me here or 50 00:04:01.159 --> 00:04:04.639 something to that effect. Very scary, very scary. To add on to 51 00:04:04.719 --> 00:04:09.080 the top of it, that it's Halloween night adds to the eeriness. But 52 00:04:09.159 --> 00:04:12.360 to me, it's the fact that she did get home that evening and somehow 53 00:04:12.599 --> 00:04:17.240 she still ended up missing and most likely harmed by somebody. It's so creepy 54 00:04:17.319 --> 00:04:21.399 too, like, what are the chances that an opportunistic predator would at that 55 00:04:21.560 --> 00:04:26.240 very moment when she decides to go out, be there and snatch her off 56 00:04:26.240 --> 00:04:30.000 the street. But clearly it does happen. I believe it happened in the 57 00:04:30.000 --> 00:04:32.879 case of Mara Murray. It just it seems like, what are the chances? 58 00:04:32.920 --> 00:04:38.279 But these things do happen particularly here since she was last seen to be 59 00:04:38.319 --> 00:04:41.680 alive at four am, So that could mean that a predator was just roaming 60 00:04:41.759 --> 00:04:45.079 around that area during the wee hours of the morning and Cindy was just in 61 00:04:45.120 --> 00:04:48.199 the wrong place at the wrong time. Is it also possible that someone who 62 00:04:48.279 --> 00:04:53.480 knew her, or someone who dropped her off or something was involved. Because 63 00:04:53.680 --> 00:04:56.360 I used to tell my students, you're more likely to get hurt by the 64 00:04:56.399 --> 00:05:00.399 person walking you home to protect you from the person in the bushes, then 65 00:05:00.439 --> 00:05:02.519 you are the person in the bushes. So is it possible that it could 66 00:05:02.519 --> 00:05:06.199 have been someone who knew her and might have known her timeline. They looked 67 00:05:06.199 --> 00:05:10.480 into that angle, but they couldn't find anyone who stood out as a potential 68 00:05:10.519 --> 00:05:13.879 suspect, So they are thinking that if she was harmed, ivo was by 69 00:05:13.920 --> 00:05:19.040 a complete stranger. Our story begins in State College, Pennsylvania, in two 70 00:05:19.040 --> 00:05:24.560 thousand and one. Our central figure is twenty one year old Hyun John Song, 71 00:05:24.959 --> 00:05:29.199 who goes by her nickname Cindy. Cindy was originally born in Seoul, 72 00:05:29.240 --> 00:05:32.360 South Korea, who moved to the United States on a tourist visa in nineteen 73 00:05:32.439 --> 00:05:38.399 ninety five after living with her aunt and uncle in Virginia and graduating high school, 74 00:05:38.800 --> 00:05:43.800 Cindy elected to attend Penn State University in order to major and integrate of 75 00:05:43.959 --> 00:05:48.240 arts, so her tourist visa evolved into a student visa. She got consistently 76 00:05:48.279 --> 00:05:51.800 good grades and was hoping to graduate in the spring of two thousand and two. 77 00:05:53.759 --> 00:05:57.360 As she entered her final year at Penn State, was living off campus 78 00:05:57.439 --> 00:06:02.000 at the State College Park apartments with a mat and working two jobs. Shortly 79 00:06:02.040 --> 00:06:08.160 after the fall semester began, Cindy's roommate had to return home to Philadelphia for 80 00:06:08.240 --> 00:06:12.959 an extended period of time because of family issues, so for the last half 81 00:06:13.000 --> 00:06:16.879 of October, Cindy was living alone. On Halloween Night, Cindy and two 82 00:06:16.920 --> 00:06:20.959 of her friends decided to go out and party at the Player's nightclub. For 83 00:06:21.040 --> 00:06:25.920 her Halloween costume, she decided to dress up as a playboy bunny, and 84 00:06:26.000 --> 00:06:30.480 her costume consisted of a pink sleeveless shirt with a bunny design imprinted on the 85 00:06:30.480 --> 00:06:34.079 front, bunny ears, false eyelashes, and a white tennis skirt with a 86 00:06:34.079 --> 00:06:39.000 cotton bunny tail on the back. At around two a m. On the 87 00:06:39.000 --> 00:06:43.560 morning of November first, Cindy and her two friends left the club after it 88 00:06:43.600 --> 00:06:47.399 closed and spent the next two hours traveling through the downtown area and hanging out 89 00:06:47.399 --> 00:06:53.480 at a friend's apartment to play video games. One of Cindy's friends, Stacy 90 00:06:53.560 --> 00:06:57.879 Pake, drove her back to her apartment complex. Cindy had spent much of 91 00:06:57.920 --> 00:07:01.120 the night drinking and was mildly intoxic by this point, but not so much 92 00:07:01.160 --> 00:07:05.800 so that she couldn't handle herself. At around four am, Stacy dropped Cindy 93 00:07:05.879 --> 00:07:11.240 off, and while she watched her walk towards her apartment, Stacy could not 94 00:07:11.360 --> 00:07:15.480 confirm that Cindy actually went inside before she drove off, and unfortunately, this 95 00:07:15.519 --> 00:07:19.240 would turn out to be the last time that Cindy was confirmed to be alive. 96 00:07:20.360 --> 00:07:25.040 Okay, here's what's rule said, poor Stacy, imagine what kind of 97 00:07:25.040 --> 00:07:30.879 grief she's going through where she's in some ways responsible for Cindy in that moment. 98 00:07:30.879 --> 00:07:33.480 I'm sure she feels that way. Right she drove her home, she 99 00:07:33.680 --> 00:07:36.800 watches her walk to her apartment. I mean, apartment complexes can be set 100 00:07:36.839 --> 00:07:41.639 up all kinds of ways where possibly it's not that she didn't even wait to 101 00:07:41.759 --> 00:07:45.439 watch her walk into the apartment. She might not have even visibly been able 102 00:07:45.480 --> 00:07:47.040 to see her front door, right, It could have been in a little 103 00:07:47.079 --> 00:07:50.360 hallway, it could have been around the corner. But she gets her home 104 00:07:50.480 --> 00:07:55.120 safely after a night of having fun, and you know, no part of 105 00:07:55.160 --> 00:07:59.279 her thought anything other than the fact that her friend is about to go in 106 00:07:59.360 --> 00:08:03.920 and go to sleep. And then i'm sure later that next day or you 107 00:08:03.920 --> 00:08:09.920 know, several hours later, she realizes something could have happened to Cindy. 108 00:08:09.959 --> 00:08:13.920 And so my heart breaks for Stacy as well, who is in this position 109 00:08:13.040 --> 00:08:16.959 of a friend taking care of another friend and at the end of the day 110 00:08:18.560 --> 00:08:20.480 has no idea what happened when she dropped her friend off. So there's got 111 00:08:20.519 --> 00:08:24.759 to be a very complicated grief going on there for Stacy too. Yeah, 112 00:08:24.759 --> 00:08:28.199 as we're going to talk about, they do find evidence to indicate that Cindy 113 00:08:28.319 --> 00:08:33.679 did make it inside her apartment. So even if Stacy hung around for another 114 00:08:33.759 --> 00:08:37.879 minute longer and confirmed that she actually saw Cindy go inside, it may not 115 00:08:37.960 --> 00:08:41.320 have made much difference because it's possible that whatever happened to Cindy did not happen 116 00:08:41.399 --> 00:08:46.759 until a long time later, So it probably happened after Stacy was already gone, 117 00:08:46.720 --> 00:08:50.720 so later that day, Cindy's roommate returned from Philadelphia and was surprised to 118 00:08:50.759 --> 00:08:54.639 discover that Cindy was not at their apartment. For the next two days, 119 00:08:54.879 --> 00:08:58.159 none of Cindy's friends heard from her, has she missed her classes and a 120 00:08:58.159 --> 00:09:03.159 shift at one of her so they finally contacted the Ferguson Township Police Department and 121 00:09:03.240 --> 00:09:07.559 reported her missing. As far as I can tell, the door to the 122 00:09:07.600 --> 00:09:11.879 apartment was locked when Cindy's roommate returned on November the first, and there were 123 00:09:11.879 --> 00:09:16.559 no signs of forced entry or struggle. When police checked inside, they found 124 00:09:16.559 --> 00:09:20.279 some of Cindy's personal belongings, including her backpack and cellular phone, and the 125 00:09:20.320 --> 00:09:24.919 false eyelashes she had worn as part of her costume were on the counter. 126 00:09:26.080 --> 00:09:30.000 This seemed to suggest that Cindy had entered the apartment after she was dropped off 127 00:09:30.039 --> 00:09:33.960 by Stacy Pake, but some of her other items, including her keys and 128 00:09:33.000 --> 00:09:37.519 her purse, were missing, and the rest of her bunny costume could not 129 00:09:37.559 --> 00:09:41.480 be found. A check of Cydey's bank account and credit cards showed no activity 130 00:09:41.600 --> 00:09:46.320 since she was last seen. Upon learning of Cindy's disappearance. Members of her 131 00:09:46.360 --> 00:09:52.000 family, including her mother, band sun Song, and her older brother Keiho, 132 00:09:52.519 --> 00:09:56.720 made the trip from South Korea to Pennsylvania. Within days, they were 133 00:09:56.720 --> 00:10:01.519 granted access to Cindy's apartment, but to the surprise the police, the Songs 134 00:10:01.559 --> 00:10:07.559 wound up cleaning the place and they have inadvertently destroyed potential physical evidence. Oh 135 00:10:07.639 --> 00:10:11.519 goodness. Okay, So when you look at what's missing from her apartment, 136 00:10:11.639 --> 00:10:16.279 she has her keys and her purse when she goes outside, but she doesn't 137 00:10:16.320 --> 00:10:20.360 have her cell phone, which is really bizarre because it's like she's taking critical 138 00:10:20.399 --> 00:10:24.120 items but not the phone. You would think even back what was this two 139 00:10:24.159 --> 00:10:28.799 thousand and one? Yeah, okay, so even back in two thousand and 140 00:10:28.840 --> 00:10:31.360 one, if you had a cell phone, that's something that is almost as 141 00:10:31.440 --> 00:10:35.840 necessary as your car keys, right, it was something that you would likely 142 00:10:35.919 --> 00:10:39.159 take with you, especially in the early morning hours or late late at night. 143 00:10:39.159 --> 00:10:43.720 If you were a young girl, you would probably take your phone too. 144 00:10:43.320 --> 00:10:48.000 So the combination or the lack of combination of the person the keys with 145 00:10:48.080 --> 00:10:52.240 her, and the cell phone left at the house is really really interesting, 146 00:10:52.679 --> 00:10:56.519 Like could she have possibly been running up to the convenience store to get a 147 00:10:56.559 --> 00:11:01.320 snack or could she have been going to just meet someone that she knew around 148 00:11:01.320 --> 00:11:05.000 the corner. It doesn't really line up like take it all or don't take 149 00:11:05.039 --> 00:11:09.879 any of it, but having those items separated to me causes a little bit 150 00:11:09.879 --> 00:11:13.759 of concern. And then you have her poor family who makes this trip from 151 00:11:13.799 --> 00:11:20.399 South Korea to Pennsylvania to find their baby and their sister, and they're not 152 00:11:20.679 --> 00:11:24.480 doing anything other than trying to make sure Cindy's okay, and in the act 153 00:11:24.879 --> 00:11:31.879 of cleaning her apartment really could have damaged the investigation. Again, an added 154 00:11:31.919 --> 00:11:35.159 layer of grief and trauma for the family thinking we're helping, We're here to 155 00:11:35.240 --> 00:11:39.120 help and look for her, and then you know, finding out, oh 156 00:11:39.120 --> 00:11:43.840 my gosh, something we did could have compromised the investigation as well. Really 157 00:11:43.879 --> 00:11:48.559 really sad, Robin. Do you know if Cindy had a cell phone, 158 00:11:48.600 --> 00:11:52.320 Like this is at the time when not everyone had a cell phone, but 159 00:11:52.360 --> 00:11:54.879 a lot of people did. Well, Yeah, they just confirmed that that 160 00:11:54.919 --> 00:11:58.559 she left her cell phone behind. Oh okay, sorry I missed that part. 161 00:12:00.360 --> 00:12:01.799 Yeah. So, but like you said, it is very unusual. 162 00:12:01.840 --> 00:12:05.120 This is two thousand and one. They're not as common, but people generally 163 00:12:05.159 --> 00:12:09.240 took them when they left the apartment. But that's what makes me think that 164 00:12:09.320 --> 00:12:11.679 she decided to step out for what she thought was going to be a very 165 00:12:11.679 --> 00:12:16.559 brief time period, and before she had a chance to make it back, 166 00:12:16.639 --> 00:12:18.799 something happened to her. And I think the fact that the rest of her 167 00:12:18.799 --> 00:12:24.120 bunny costume was not found is a very important clue, because you think that 168 00:12:24.120 --> 00:12:26.840 if she's returning home for the night and planning to go to bed, she 169 00:12:26.879 --> 00:12:30.759 would have taken the costume off and changed but the fact that it was not 170 00:12:30.879 --> 00:12:33.200 found that indicates that she still had it on her when she stepped out of 171 00:12:33.200 --> 00:12:39.240 her apartment and was likely abducted. I think it's important to note as well, 172 00:12:39.639 --> 00:12:43.720 that our relationship to our cell phones has evolved so much a lot of 173 00:12:43.720 --> 00:12:46.279 people wouldn't remember what it would be like. You wouldn't be as attached to 174 00:12:46.320 --> 00:12:50.840 it as you are today, So there could be a strong likelihood that you 175 00:12:50.960 --> 00:12:54.720 might, if you were running to a convenience store, leave your cell phone 176 00:12:54.759 --> 00:12:58.519 behind. Because they weren't like little computers like they are today, where our 177 00:12:58.559 --> 00:13:01.559 whole lives are at our fingertips when we have our phone. They were a 178 00:13:01.600 --> 00:13:05.240 lot different back then. Don't you guys think, Oh, definitely, And 179 00:13:05.279 --> 00:13:09.320 as far as I can tell, texting still wasn't a thing yet in two 180 00:13:09.320 --> 00:13:11.960 thousand and one, right, So it's not like she would be texting her 181 00:13:11.000 --> 00:13:13.799 friend Stacy or something like that and saying, oh, I'm just running up 182 00:13:13.840 --> 00:13:18.679 to the market, because these were very low tech phones compared to today. 183 00:13:18.519 --> 00:13:20.799 If there were, if there was texting at the time, it was one 184 00:13:20.799 --> 00:13:24.080 of those where you had to push the button three times to get to the 185 00:13:24.120 --> 00:13:26.759 letter C and move over and hit it again. Do you know what I 186 00:13:26.759 --> 00:13:33.600 mean to that's what I remember. Yeah. Yeah. Investigators did explore the 187 00:13:33.639 --> 00:13:39.120 possibility that Cindy may have disappeared voluntarily in order to complete suicide. Three months 188 00:13:39.120 --> 00:13:43.120 earlier, Cindy had been sharing the apartment with her boyfriend until he broke up 189 00:13:43.159 --> 00:13:48.360 with her and moved out. However, Cindy's friends insisted that she was not 190 00:13:48.519 --> 00:13:52.440 depressed and that thanks to the aid of counseling and medication, she was able 191 00:13:52.440 --> 00:13:56.000 to get over the breakup and was in very good spirits when she went out 192 00:13:56.000 --> 00:14:01.240 partying on Halloween night, in fact for a Britney Spears concert, which Cindy 193 00:14:01.360 --> 00:14:05.559 was looking forward to attending. The following week were left behind in the apartment, 194 00:14:07.120 --> 00:14:09.360 and there was also a receipt to show that she had recently ordered a 195 00:14:09.399 --> 00:14:15.360 computer, which was set to be delivered days after she went missing. The 196 00:14:15.440 --> 00:14:18.519 consensus seemed to be that Cindy had been the victim of an abduction, and 197 00:14:18.600 --> 00:14:22.720 while police did look into Cindy's ex boyfriend, they did not consider him to 198 00:14:22.720 --> 00:14:26.879 be a suspect. Since there were no records of any calls on Cindy's phone 199 00:14:28.200 --> 00:14:31.799 around the time she went missing, there didn't seem to be any reason for 200 00:14:31.840 --> 00:14:35.879 her to leave the apartment after she arrived home, but it was theorized that 201 00:14:35.960 --> 00:14:39.639 she may have stepped out to visit a nearby twenty four hour supermarket that she 202 00:14:39.720 --> 00:14:43.799 often frequented. The market was only located two hundred yards away, and it 203 00:14:43.840 --> 00:14:48.159 was not uncommon for Cindy to walk there at odd hours, But when police 204 00:14:48.159 --> 00:14:52.559 attempted to check the surveillance footage from the market, they discovered that their footage 205 00:14:52.559 --> 00:14:58.759 from the early morning hours of November first had already been taped over. It 206 00:14:58.840 --> 00:15:03.440 wasn't long before a woman and came forward with an eyewitness sighting of Cindy nearly 207 00:15:03.480 --> 00:15:07.919 two hundred miles away in the Chinatown district of Philadelphia. According to the witness, 208 00:15:09.000 --> 00:15:11.759 she had walked past a car which contained an Asian woman resembling Cindy, 209 00:15:13.279 --> 00:15:16.279 who was crying and yelling out for help. A man described as having an 210 00:15:16.360 --> 00:15:22.039 olive or light brown complexion suddenly intervened and told the witness to get lost because 211 00:15:22.039 --> 00:15:26.200 this was none of her business. When the police did release a composite sketch 212 00:15:26.279 --> 00:15:31.320 of the unidentified man, they expressed their skepticism that the witness actually saw Cindy, 213 00:15:31.720 --> 00:15:35.639 as she wound up changing her story several times. Okay, I won't 214 00:15:35.720 --> 00:15:39.840 go down the rabbit hole of our conversation when we talk about the problems with 215 00:15:39.879 --> 00:15:46.440 eyewitness identification. But as likely as it is that this woman was trying to 216 00:15:46.440 --> 00:15:50.639 be incredibly helpful and probably did see a domestic dispute, it's two hundred miles 217 00:15:50.639 --> 00:15:56.960 away, and it's more likely she saw Cindy's picture and thought, oh my 218 00:15:56.960 --> 00:16:00.159 gosh, that looks like the lady who I saw getting hurt by this guy. 219 00:16:00.159 --> 00:16:03.039 I'm going to call the police and try to help. So probably well 220 00:16:03.080 --> 00:16:07.679 intended, but less likely to be accurate. Then let's say if someone was 221 00:16:07.720 --> 00:16:11.240 seeing her at the convenience store the evening she went missing. That is exactly 222 00:16:11.240 --> 00:16:15.200 what I was thinking. Remember going as a college kid, like I just 223 00:16:15.240 --> 00:16:19.399 remember being hungry after your drinking, and if it was only a couple of 224 00:16:19.480 --> 00:16:23.039 hundreds of yards away, she could have easily walked that direction and taken her 225 00:16:23.120 --> 00:16:27.399 keys in her purse, the keys to get back into her apartment, and 226 00:16:27.440 --> 00:16:30.480 then her purse to pay for the goods she was going to get. If 227 00:16:30.519 --> 00:16:34.200 she was intoxicated, it's not too far away. She can go get that, 228 00:16:34.279 --> 00:16:37.799 she can get a little late night snack, and then she can go 229 00:16:37.840 --> 00:16:41.559 back home and rest again. Like you guys said, all they found in 230 00:16:41.600 --> 00:16:45.919 the apartment were the accessories to her costume. She hadn't changed, so she 231 00:16:45.960 --> 00:16:48.120 could have very easily walked in, taken her bunny ears off, kind of 232 00:16:49.279 --> 00:16:52.720 dehalloween to herself a little bit, and then said I'm going to go get 233 00:16:52.759 --> 00:16:56.759 a snack, and that's when she met fate with somebody who was out for 234 00:16:57.080 --> 00:17:02.919 something devious. That's what I think is the most logical explanation for what happened, 235 00:17:02.919 --> 00:17:04.720 That she just decided to go to the market to get a quick snack, 236 00:17:04.839 --> 00:17:08.319 like you said. But if so, then that's just rotten luck that 237 00:17:08.359 --> 00:17:11.839 she just happened to cross paths with the wrong person at that time in the 238 00:17:11.839 --> 00:17:15.160 morning, So it just is kind of an example of her being in the 239 00:17:15.160 --> 00:17:18.440 wrong place at the wrong time, that some predator may have been in that 240 00:17:18.480 --> 00:17:23.200 neighborhood at four am. Well. On January the thirty first, two thousand 241 00:17:23.200 --> 00:17:27.400 and two, the Coalition for the Search for Cindy Song, a group consisting 242 00:17:27.440 --> 00:17:32.799 of Cindy's family, Penn State students, and community members, held a press 243 00:17:32.799 --> 00:17:37.640 conference to criticize law enforcement and university officials for the lack of progress of the 244 00:17:37.640 --> 00:17:42.599 investigation. They made a comparison between Cindy's case and the recent disappearance Alicia Koza 245 00:17:42.640 --> 00:17:47.400 Kiwitch, a thirteen year old white girl who went missing on New Year's Day 246 00:17:47.480 --> 00:17:49.440 after being lured out of her home by an older man she met on the 247 00:17:49.440 --> 00:17:55.599 internet. Alicia immediately had over fifty FBI agents assigned you her case, and 248 00:17:55.640 --> 00:18:00.599 they managed to find her alive within three days. Some minority grew from Penn 249 00:18:00.640 --> 00:18:06.480 State campus also expressed their dissatisfaction with the investigation and wondered why Cindy's disappearance did 250 00:18:06.519 --> 00:18:11.279 not get the same treatment as Alicia's. For their part, investigators insisted that 251 00:18:11.279 --> 00:18:15.119 they were doing everything in their power to find Cindy, but were simply hampered 252 00:18:15.160 --> 00:18:19.079 by the lack of evidence and solid leads. This press conference prompted the Ferguson 253 00:18:19.119 --> 00:18:23.960 Township PD and the Song family to cut off all direct communication with each other. 254 00:18:25.839 --> 00:18:30.079 Both sides conceded that some friction was caused by the cultural gap between the 255 00:18:30.079 --> 00:18:34.480 way police investigations were conducted in the United States and South Korea. By his 256 00:18:34.519 --> 00:18:41.359 own admission, Cindy's brother Keiho said he was baffled by the quote unquote constitutional 257 00:18:41.400 --> 00:18:45.960 restraints on police investigations, such as the length peak granjury subpoena procedures required to 258 00:18:47.039 --> 00:18:51.160 access Cindy's phone and internet records, and he wanted the police to act more 259 00:18:51.240 --> 00:18:56.000 quickly and forcefully. Kiel With quit school and remained in the US to help 260 00:18:56.039 --> 00:18:59.039 out in the search for his sister, while their mother, ban Soon, 261 00:18:59.160 --> 00:19:03.200 was eventually forced to return to Korea in order to care for her sick husband. 262 00:19:03.440 --> 00:19:10.039 Here's the interesting thing, right, They're comparing her case a college girl 263 00:19:10.079 --> 00:19:14.480 who goes missing after a Halloween party to a thirteen year old child who's lured 264 00:19:14.519 --> 00:19:21.440 out by some adult predator and there's a known kind of idea here that an 265 00:19:21.519 --> 00:19:26.000 older man reaches out to her. So there's this known perpetrator or known idea 266 00:19:26.119 --> 00:19:30.000 of a perpetrator. There's an underage child, right, and so I think 267 00:19:30.039 --> 00:19:37.160 it's a different dynamic in the case. That's horrifying an media grabbing that some 268 00:19:37.680 --> 00:19:41.680 child could have been lured out by a predator online. And this was very 269 00:19:41.839 --> 00:19:44.640 new back then. Remember we were in chat rooms and things like that, 270 00:19:44.759 --> 00:19:51.119 so it wasn't necessarily as common and known as human trafficking is now and stuff 271 00:19:51.160 --> 00:19:56.119 like that. It doesn't make it any more valuable than the disappearance of Cindy. 272 00:19:56.359 --> 00:20:00.319 But when you're looking at attention given and the dynamics of the case, 273 00:20:00.759 --> 00:20:06.680 those are two very very different cases. And it is possible that there was 274 00:20:06.680 --> 00:20:08.440 some bias saying, well, Cindy was out at a party. She could 275 00:20:08.440 --> 00:20:11.720 have gone missing on her own. She's an adult, right, But it 276 00:20:11.759 --> 00:20:17.319 does seem like the police were taking this case seriously, that they were responding. 277 00:20:17.960 --> 00:20:22.319 I do think there's a possibility that there's a conflict of saying this is 278 00:20:22.359 --> 00:20:25.880 how much we can involve the family, and this is how much we have 279 00:20:25.960 --> 00:20:30.680 to keep private, and police have the mentality. We are not your counselors, 280 00:20:30.799 --> 00:20:33.279 right, we are investigating this case and cannot get caught up in the 281 00:20:33.480 --> 00:20:40.200 grief and emotional trauma that the family's experiencing. There's definitely leeway and there's definitely 282 00:20:40.240 --> 00:20:45.160 a need for law enforcement to be compassionate and empathetic. But there is a 283 00:20:45.880 --> 00:20:51.400 conflict usually between families and unsolved cases and the police because of the unsolved nature. 284 00:20:51.759 --> 00:20:53.559 And if you haven't solved my case, then you're not giving it enough 285 00:20:53.559 --> 00:20:59.039 attention. That is human nature one oh one. So I feel bad for 286 00:20:59.119 --> 00:21:03.880 both parties. I do think very very interesting to make the comparison between Alicia's 287 00:21:03.880 --> 00:21:07.039 case and Cindy's case. But at the end of the day, it just 288 00:21:07.039 --> 00:21:11.240 comes down to every single person who goes missing or is murdered is equally valuable. 289 00:21:11.400 --> 00:21:15.519 It's just you don't see that in society play out the same way. 290 00:21:15.599 --> 00:21:18.240 Right. There's all kinds of factors that play into that. Some of it 291 00:21:18.359 --> 00:21:22.359 just comes down to which case had more evidence in it. And for Alicia's 292 00:21:22.400 --> 00:21:27.880 case, with regards to the FBI involvement, was there an abduction that crossed 293 00:21:27.880 --> 00:21:33.119 state lines or was it something to do with the online communication that led to 294 00:21:33.160 --> 00:21:36.920 the FBI being involved, because they aren't usually just involved in a straight up 295 00:21:37.000 --> 00:21:40.480 child abduction case, are they. Yeah, I think I might have had 296 00:21:40.519 --> 00:21:44.000 to do with the internet angle. I can't remember if Alicia did cross state 297 00:21:44.119 --> 00:21:48.640 lines, but I can understand why they devoted so much attention to her case, 298 00:21:48.680 --> 00:21:52.480 not only because she was thirteen years old, but because there's a strong 299 00:21:52.519 --> 00:21:55.680 lead to work with, because she was lured by someone she meant on the 300 00:21:55.720 --> 00:21:59.960 Internet. And on a side note, I'm currently Facebook friends with Alicia Kosek 301 00:22:00.519 --> 00:22:03.279 as she's now a motivational speaker and doing quite well. So I'm glad to 302 00:22:03.279 --> 00:22:07.559 see that she recovered from this trauma quite well. That's amazing. That's absolutely 303 00:22:07.559 --> 00:22:11.640 incredible. It's nicey or happy ending to one of those stories, because so 304 00:22:11.799 --> 00:22:17.200 often we hear the opposite. The case would be featured on a number of 305 00:22:17.240 --> 00:22:21.960 TV shows, including Unsolved Mysteries, who featured Cindy's story in one of their 306 00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:26.559 final episodes, which aired in September of two thousand and two. This failed 307 00:22:26.599 --> 00:22:30.440 to bring about any substantial leads, but within a year a surprising connection will 308 00:22:30.480 --> 00:22:36.759 be made to a career criminal named Hugo Soolensky. Now the entire saga of 309 00:22:36.839 --> 00:22:41.559 Hugo Soolensky is one hell of a crazy story and you could probably produce an 310 00:22:41.759 --> 00:22:45.000 entire podcast series about him. But here's how he fits into this case. 311 00:22:45.880 --> 00:22:49.519 In June of two thousand and three, an associate of Selenski's name, Paul 312 00:22:49.559 --> 00:22:56.359 Weekley, was facing a felony burglary charge and decided to inform on Selensky by 313 00:22:56.440 --> 00:23:00.000 leading the authorities to his property in Louser And County. To everyone's shock, 314 00:23:00.079 --> 00:23:04.880 the remains of no less than five victims were found buried in Selensky's backyard, 315 00:23:06.359 --> 00:23:11.440 and Weekly claimed that Selensky was responsible for the murders of up to sixteen people, 316 00:23:11.880 --> 00:23:15.759 including Cindy's song. According to Weekly, Selensky told him that he and 317 00:23:15.839 --> 00:23:22.359 an accomplice named Michael Kurkowski had been in State College during the early morning hours 318 00:23:22.400 --> 00:23:26.160 of November one, two thousand and one, and saw Cindy walking down the 319 00:23:26.160 --> 00:23:30.319 street. They assumed she was a sex worker and proceeded to abduct her and 320 00:23:30.400 --> 00:23:34.920 take her to Krekowski's home in Hunlock Creek. Cindy was kept in prison inside 321 00:23:34.960 --> 00:23:41.400 a walk in safe and sexually assaulted until she died before both men buried her 322 00:23:41.440 --> 00:23:48.599 body absolutely horrifying, in heartbreaking. It's insane that this person would be telling 323 00:23:48.640 --> 00:23:53.359 them about these murders, right, And there is proof that he did murder 324 00:23:53.400 --> 00:23:59.279 at least five people, and Weekly saying, listen, it was up to 325 00:23:59.359 --> 00:24:03.839 sixteen people, including and he specifies Cindy Song. And so when you look 326 00:24:03.880 --> 00:24:08.839 at Weekly's story, we know there is some credence to it because eventually police 327 00:24:08.880 --> 00:24:14.599 will go and find the remains of five individuals. But if Weekly's accurate, 328 00:24:14.839 --> 00:24:21.160 right, and he knows that Michael Kurkowski helped helped with the murder of her, 329 00:24:21.240 --> 00:24:25.480 of Cindy Song, don't you think that eventually they'd be able to find 330 00:24:25.559 --> 00:24:30.000 the remains if they have Michael and Hugo in custody. But then again, 331 00:24:30.680 --> 00:24:33.680 if they don't talk, they don't talk. But this is insane to me 332 00:24:33.759 --> 00:24:38.440 that he is able to accurately describe that Hugo is a murderer. You need 333 00:24:38.480 --> 00:24:42.839 to be looking at his home. They find five people, So who's to 334 00:24:42.920 --> 00:24:49.880 say that Kurkowski and Hugo didn't kill Cindy Song Because it's horrifying to think that 335 00:24:51.440 --> 00:24:53.400 she could have just been walking up to the convenience store. They see her 336 00:24:55.039 --> 00:24:59.680 make an assumption about who she is because of the costume she's wearing. She's 337 00:24:59.720 --> 00:25:03.599 walked out late at night on the street, and they say, oh, 338 00:25:03.680 --> 00:25:07.759 well, because she's this vulnerable person, more so than just a college kid, 339 00:25:07.799 --> 00:25:11.440 she's a sex worker, they decide they're going to target her, kidnap 340 00:25:11.480 --> 00:25:17.799 her, abuse her, and then kill her. Absolutely heartbreaking if that's true. 341 00:25:18.400 --> 00:25:21.759 Well, as I'm sure you know, none of the remains found on 342 00:25:21.799 --> 00:25:25.440 the property did belong to Cindy, so they couldn't corroborate this story. But 343 00:25:25.720 --> 00:25:27.359 right now, I haven't revealed it yet, But now I'm going to tell 344 00:25:27.400 --> 00:25:33.119 you what happened to the alleged accomplice, Michael Kurkowski. Now, like I 345 00:25:33.160 --> 00:25:37.119 said, it was established that none of the remains found on Selensky's property belonged 346 00:25:37.160 --> 00:25:41.000 to Cindy, as Selensky did not actually live there until several months after she 347 00:25:41.039 --> 00:25:45.400 went missing. But do you know who was buried there? Michael Kurkowski. 348 00:25:47.200 --> 00:25:51.480 Kurkowski had previously worked as a pharmacist until he was arrested in June of two 349 00:25:51.519 --> 00:25:55.839 thousand and one for running an illegal prescription drug ring, and had shown up 350 00:25:55.880 --> 00:26:00.680 on the authorities radar after one of his clients died of an overdose. Krekowski 351 00:26:00.720 --> 00:26:04.400 would be convicted of multiple felonies and was awaiting sentencing when both he and his 352 00:26:04.440 --> 00:26:10.640 girlfriend, Tammy Fassett vanished in May of two thousand and two. It was 353 00:26:10.680 --> 00:26:14.400 initially believed that Kirkowski had gone on the run as a fugitive, but it 354 00:26:14.440 --> 00:26:18.240 turned out that Selensky had used flex ties to strangle both Kurkowski and Facet to 355 00:26:18.319 --> 00:26:23.400 death, and the couple's remains were found buried together on his property. Weekly 356 00:26:23.440 --> 00:26:29.640 told investigators that one of the reasons that Selensky decided to kill Kirkowski was because 357 00:26:29.680 --> 00:26:33.839 he had kept Cindy's bunny ears as a souvenir. In actuality, the primary 358 00:26:33.839 --> 00:26:38.960 motive was robbery, as Selensky entered Kurkowski's home and killed him because he had 359 00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:45.079 sixty thousand dollars in cash stashed there. The only reason Facet was murdered was 360 00:26:45.119 --> 00:26:48.279 because she happened to be in the house at that time. Weekly said that 361 00:26:48.279 --> 00:26:52.839 Selensky committed the crime with an accomplice named Patrick Rusen, and that they initially 362 00:26:52.839 --> 00:26:59.119 buried the couple at another location until Selensky asked Weekly to help move the bodies 363 00:26:59.160 --> 00:27:06.200 onto his proper so bizarre. It's interesting because Kurkowski was already in trouble with 364 00:27:06.319 --> 00:27:11.599 law enforcement, and there could have been a fear also that he was going 365 00:27:11.640 --> 00:27:15.200 to talk. But shoot, if you have sixty thousand dollars in cash stash 366 00:27:15.240 --> 00:27:19.359 in your home and you're working with some pretty dark people, it makes sense 367 00:27:19.440 --> 00:27:26.160 that money would be the motivator there. Do you have any kind of weight 368 00:27:26.240 --> 00:27:30.000 on Weekly's honesty here, because I mean, I know he's also in trouble 369 00:27:30.000 --> 00:27:33.440 with law enforcement, but he says he actually helped move bodies, so he's 370 00:27:33.480 --> 00:27:38.640 implicating himself in these crimes as well. So what did the police think about 371 00:27:38.680 --> 00:27:41.960 him and his stories? Well, as we're going to talk about later on, 372 00:27:42.119 --> 00:27:47.359 there are credibility issues with Weekly, and other than his story, there 373 00:27:47.359 --> 00:27:52.799 really isn't any corroborating evidence that Hugo Soelenski and Michael Kurkowski murdered Cindy. And 374 00:27:52.839 --> 00:27:56.640 we're going to go into more detail about Kurkowski's background later on as well. 375 00:27:56.680 --> 00:28:02.799 But even though he was undeniably Aminol who was running this illegal prescription drug ring, 376 00:28:03.160 --> 00:28:06.359 he didn't really have any history of violence, Like, he wasn't known 377 00:28:06.359 --> 00:28:10.240 for being the type of guy who would just kidnap someone who he thought was 378 00:28:10.240 --> 00:28:14.720 a sex worker and hold her in captivity to sexually assault and torture her before 379 00:28:14.720 --> 00:28:18.799 he committed murder. So some people are finding this convenient that what Weekly is 380 00:28:18.839 --> 00:28:22.480 deciding to pin this crime on a dead guy who was no longer around to 381 00:28:22.480 --> 00:28:29.279 refute any of his allegations. I'm wondering if Kurkowski had a substance use disorder 382 00:28:29.319 --> 00:28:33.480 and that's why he got into the illegal prescription drug ring, because to invest 383 00:28:33.599 --> 00:28:37.519 all of the time and energy into becoming a pharmacist and to risk it all 384 00:28:37.920 --> 00:28:41.160 when it seems like the probability is so high that you could get caught. 385 00:28:41.559 --> 00:28:47.880 I could see if he had addiction issues, then that could be a catalyst 386 00:28:48.039 --> 00:28:52.880 for maybe making these kind of risky choices that seem like they're not very smart, 387 00:28:52.880 --> 00:28:56.720 and somebody who's going to go through all that education, it just seems 388 00:28:56.759 --> 00:29:02.559 so preposterous you would be kind of fraternizing with these criminals that are really dangerous. 389 00:29:02.640 --> 00:29:06.759 So I really wonder if he was just this predator that saw an opportunity 390 00:29:06.880 --> 00:29:11.119 and decided to engage in selling illegal prescription drugs, or if it was something 391 00:29:11.160 --> 00:29:15.880 that he did to kind of support his own habit. I think it might 392 00:29:15.920 --> 00:29:18.039 be the latter. Like I don't know if he had any addiction issues, 393 00:29:18.079 --> 00:29:22.599 but it would not surprise me because from what I've read, he didn't sound 394 00:29:22.640 --> 00:29:26.119 like a bad guy. He was a guy who had an ordinary life, 395 00:29:26.160 --> 00:29:29.960 who, like you said, became a pharmacist but then got himself embroiled in 396 00:29:30.000 --> 00:29:33.319 criminal activity. But he also had a girlfriend, he had a close relationship 397 00:29:33.319 --> 00:29:37.519 with his own family, and as we're going to talk about, he pretty 398 00:29:37.559 --> 00:29:41.680 much got conned by Hugo Selenski when he crossed paths with him. So he 399 00:29:41.799 --> 00:29:45.000 just doesn't seem to fit the profile of someone who had just ducked, sexually, 400 00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:49.240 insalt and murder a random woman. But in addition to the bodies of 401 00:29:49.319 --> 00:29:55.839 Krakowski and facet bone, fragments for at least three other victims were found in 402 00:29:55.839 --> 00:30:00.799 a burn pit on Selenski's property. Two of them belonged to Frank James and 403 00:30:00.920 --> 00:30:04.279 to Day Keeler, a pair of drug dealers who allegedly belonged to a gang. 404 00:30:04.759 --> 00:30:10.960 The third victim has never been publicly identified, though it's unclear if investigators 405 00:30:10.960 --> 00:30:15.920 have deliberately chosen not to release that information or if they still have no idea 406 00:30:15.960 --> 00:30:19.680 who the victim is. It would turn out that Selenski and Patrick Rusen had 407 00:30:19.759 --> 00:30:25.079 lured James and Keeler to the property in order to steal their money in drugs 408 00:30:25.480 --> 00:30:29.480 before they were both shot to death and their bodies burned down into bone fragments. 409 00:30:30.279 --> 00:30:33.359 Ruston wound up pleading guilty to two counts of third degree murder, and 410 00:30:33.400 --> 00:30:37.799 both he and Paul Weekley testified against Selenski when he went on trial for the 411 00:30:37.839 --> 00:30:44.119 two murders in two thousand and six. Selenski's defense was that weekly had framed 412 00:30:44.160 --> 00:30:48.480 him by planting the victim's remains in the burn pit and leading the police there, 413 00:30:48.519 --> 00:30:52.240 and believe it or not, they were able to generate some reasonable doubt 414 00:30:52.240 --> 00:30:57.240 for the jury. They ultimately acquitted Selenski of Keeler's murder and deadlocked on James's 415 00:30:57.279 --> 00:31:03.240 murder. They did find him guilty on two counts of abusing a corpse. 416 00:31:03.079 --> 00:31:07.200 The jury seemed to believe that Selensky was involved in the crime and at the 417 00:31:07.279 --> 00:31:11.519 very least helped dispose of the bodies, but did not feel there was enough 418 00:31:11.559 --> 00:31:17.160 evidence to prove he personally pulled the trigger and committed the murders. Himself. 419 00:31:18.119 --> 00:31:22.519 However, the state wasted no time charging Selensky with the murders of Michael Kurkowski 420 00:31:22.599 --> 00:31:27.000 and Tammy Facett, though due to a number of delays and legal wrangling, 421 00:31:27.400 --> 00:31:33.119 he would not actually go on trial for this crime until twenty fifteen. It 422 00:31:33.200 --> 00:31:37.519 also turned out that, rather than simply helping Selenski move the victim's bodies, 423 00:31:37.119 --> 00:31:42.720 Paul Weakley actually participated in the murders, so he agreed to testify against Selensky 424 00:31:42.880 --> 00:31:48.559 in order to avoid the death penalty. This time, Selensky was convicted on 425 00:31:48.599 --> 00:31:52.319 two counts of first degree murder and received a life sentence. Yeah, it's 426 00:31:52.400 --> 00:31:59.079 really difficult here because Weekly obviously knows information. He's in fact, part of 427 00:31:59.480 --> 00:32:04.119 the idea that these people were murdered and placed on Hugo's properties. So we 428 00:32:04.200 --> 00:32:08.920 know that Weekly is a problematic character, right because he himself is involved in 429 00:32:09.000 --> 00:32:15.880 criminal activity. But to know these details could indicate that he is telling the 430 00:32:15.920 --> 00:32:21.839 truth, right, even though he's a questionable figure. He's clearly giving information 431 00:32:21.960 --> 00:32:24.880 to try to get himself off the hook. But that information could be true. 432 00:32:25.400 --> 00:32:30.359 So what's sad here is that he has this horrific account of what happened 433 00:32:30.400 --> 00:32:37.119 to Cindy Song, and there's no way to prove that it did or didn't 434 00:32:37.240 --> 00:32:40.359 happen given the evidence that they have right now, So her family is left 435 00:32:40.400 --> 00:32:45.079 with that being the only information and the only story that they play in their 436 00:32:45.119 --> 00:32:49.559 head right is, well, if that's what this guy said happened to her, 437 00:32:50.000 --> 00:32:52.759 then that's what we have to assume happened to her. And it's one 438 00:32:52.759 --> 00:32:57.519 of the most just horrific thoughts for a mother and a brother and a dad 439 00:32:57.640 --> 00:33:04.559 to be thinking Cindy went to a convenienced and was abducted and sexually abused and 440 00:33:04.920 --> 00:33:08.799 murdered and then just buried, thrown away like trash. And that's the thing. 441 00:33:08.839 --> 00:33:13.680 How cruel would Paul Weekly be if he's just completely making up this story 442 00:33:13.720 --> 00:33:19.000 and making Cindy's family believe that she was abducted, tortured and held in captivity 443 00:33:19.039 --> 00:33:22.160 before she was sexually assaulted and murdered, if he just completely made that story 444 00:33:22.240 --> 00:33:25.160 up. But we're going to talk about this in a few moments. How 445 00:33:25.160 --> 00:33:30.799 Weekly is kind of a problematic figure with credibility issues. But even though they 446 00:33:30.799 --> 00:33:35.839 didn't find the remains of Cindy on Selenski's property, when they found the other 447 00:33:35.960 --> 00:33:38.960 victims. It is important to reiterate that he did not move there until two 448 00:33:39.000 --> 00:33:44.000 thousand and two, so if he committed this murder in November of two thousand 449 00:33:44.000 --> 00:33:47.119 and one, it's likely that he would have disposed of Cindy's remains at another 450 00:33:47.200 --> 00:33:52.039 location. Anyway, due to Weekly's credibility issues, there are doubts about his 451 00:33:52.119 --> 00:33:58.799 story that he heard Selensky confess to being involved in Cindy Song's disappearance. When 452 00:33:58.799 --> 00:34:02.519 he was initially arrested. Selenski's attorney stated that several people could place his client 453 00:34:02.640 --> 00:34:07.680 over one hundred and thirty miles away in wilkes Bury at the time Cindy went 454 00:34:07.720 --> 00:34:13.159 missing. A search of Weekly's computer also showed that he had downloaded several articles 455 00:34:13.159 --> 00:34:17.039 about Cindy's case, so he theoretically could have learned enough details about her disappearance 456 00:34:17.119 --> 00:34:22.480 online in order to fabricate a story. It's also worth noting that in January 457 00:34:22.480 --> 00:34:28.400 of twenty fourteen, a grand jury indictment was filed against Selenski, his current 458 00:34:28.440 --> 00:34:34.159 attorney, and a private investigator on allegations of bribing and intimidating witnesses, and 459 00:34:34.239 --> 00:34:38.719 the indictment stated, quote Luzerne County authorities believed that Selensky was directly involved in 460 00:34:38.760 --> 00:34:44.599 the murder of approximately twelve human beings found burned and buried in a pit in 461 00:34:44.639 --> 00:34:49.079 his backyard. End quote. At the time, there was a gag order 462 00:34:49.119 --> 00:34:52.760 which prevented anyone involved in this case from discussing it publicly, so it's unclear 463 00:34:52.760 --> 00:34:58.519 if additional victims were found on Selenski's property who have yet to be identified. 464 00:34:59.320 --> 00:35:04.559 Regardless, the authorities have obtained a DNA sample from Cindy's parents and added it 465 00:35:04.559 --> 00:35:08.679 to the national databases for Missing Persons and unidentified remains, but that's far. 466 00:35:08.880 --> 00:35:14.679 They have yet to make any matches. Officially, no conclusive evidence has ever 467 00:35:14.719 --> 00:35:20.440 linked Hugo Selenski to Cindy's song, and her disappearance continues to remain unsolved. 468 00:35:20.719 --> 00:35:24.960 So I guess you could say the path went chilly. This whole case has 469 00:35:25.000 --> 00:35:30.679 that just heartbreaking element of you would think when you send your kiddo away to 470 00:35:30.760 --> 00:35:34.719 college. She's a good student, she's being a typical college kid. She 471 00:35:34.760 --> 00:35:37.519 went to a Halloween party. You think your kids are safe, right, 472 00:35:37.559 --> 00:35:42.320 This is innocent. It's what every kiddo does. It goes to college, 473 00:35:42.760 --> 00:35:45.719 and she went to a Halloween party. Her friend is responsible and brings her 474 00:35:45.760 --> 00:35:51.599 home, and it's likely Cindy had this thought, Hey, I'm hungry or 475 00:35:51.760 --> 00:35:53.679 I want somebody to drink. I'm going to run grab something at the convenience 476 00:35:53.679 --> 00:35:58.599 store that I go to all the time, and come home, get ready 477 00:35:58.599 --> 00:36:01.079 for bed, and hit the sack. Recover from my fun evening at a 478 00:36:01.119 --> 00:36:07.559 Halloween party, and that night of innocent fun turns into the likelihood that her 479 00:36:07.599 --> 00:36:12.800 life was stolen away from her, and it's possible that it's at the hands 480 00:36:12.840 --> 00:36:17.199 of someone who is a sadistic serial killer. And the only thing left is 481 00:36:17.360 --> 00:36:22.800 this story that we have from Weekly, And so my heart just simply breaks 482 00:36:22.880 --> 00:36:30.119 because, at least give me some evidence in concrete facts that that's what happened 483 00:36:30.119 --> 00:36:31.840 to my baby. Right, let me know that's what happened to her. 484 00:36:32.239 --> 00:36:37.480 Let's hold this person responsible and have that sort of resolution to But this family 485 00:36:37.639 --> 00:36:44.480 doesn't have that, and it's likely they won't ever have that unless that DNA 486 00:36:44.599 --> 00:36:47.840 sample happens to hit on some kind of remains that are found one day. 487 00:36:47.920 --> 00:36:53.239 It's profound that you said he didn't buy that house till twenty oh two, 488 00:36:53.320 --> 00:37:00.639 because at that point she had been dead for what at least two two months, 489 00:37:00.679 --> 00:37:04.199 possibly up to fourteen months by the time he settles in that house. 490 00:37:04.719 --> 00:37:08.360 So of course she wouldn't be buried there unless he had said, oh, 491 00:37:08.400 --> 00:37:12.519 move her body back to my property too, like Weekly said, he helped 492 00:37:12.559 --> 00:37:15.679 her do with some other bodies. But to me, that's profound. He 493 00:37:15.880 --> 00:37:22.840 supposedly, according to Weekly, killed her at the other man's house, and 494 00:37:22.960 --> 00:37:27.440 then they went and buried her together, and so who knows where she could 495 00:37:27.440 --> 00:37:31.480 be. Heartbreaking, absolutely horrific, And it just gives you chills to think 496 00:37:31.519 --> 00:37:36.000 that you sent your baby away to school, she went to a party, 497 00:37:36.360 --> 00:37:39.400 and her life was stolen from her. I have a special place in my 498 00:37:39.519 --> 00:37:45.159 heart for families who send their kids off to another country and they hope that 499 00:37:45.199 --> 00:37:47.440 they're going to have all the opportunities in the world. And that's what the 500 00:37:47.480 --> 00:37:52.039 Song family did with Cindy. And to think, Okay, she does her 501 00:37:52.119 --> 00:37:57.280 high school there, and she's now having this experience at Penn State, and 502 00:37:57.320 --> 00:38:00.480 she's got all of these friends. Her whole life is a head of her. 503 00:38:00.920 --> 00:38:07.639 And then to have to find out that your daughter is missing and presumed 504 00:38:07.679 --> 00:38:12.039 to be murdered, have to come here from Korea, and it's a completely 505 00:38:12.039 --> 00:38:17.079 different culture. I'm trying to understand how investigations are conducted in the US and 506 00:38:17.159 --> 00:38:22.239 being sorely disappointed at the way that the investigators are going about it. It's 507 00:38:22.400 --> 00:38:28.440 just my heart really breaks for the family here because it makes it so much 508 00:38:28.440 --> 00:38:31.880 more difficult when it's a culture that you don't necessarily understand and a language that 509 00:38:31.920 --> 00:38:37.440 you don't necessarily understand. So there's just so many layers and so much nuance 510 00:38:37.519 --> 00:38:39.800 to this case. Yeah, we're going to discuss this and more in depth 511 00:38:39.840 --> 00:38:45.400 on our next episode. But even though Hugo Soelenski is undoubtedly an awful human 512 00:38:45.440 --> 00:38:49.800 being who has murdered at least five people, which technically makes them a serial 513 00:38:49.880 --> 00:38:52.920 killer, but the more you look into his background, the more you wonder 514 00:38:52.039 --> 00:38:57.639 would Cindy's disappearance really fit his profile, Because from what I can tell, 515 00:38:57.719 --> 00:39:00.880 the people he did murder he did in order to rob them. It was 516 00:39:00.920 --> 00:39:04.440 for financial gain. He has never done any known crimes in which he has 517 00:39:04.480 --> 00:39:08.760 revealed himself to be a sexual predator who targets innocent young women at random. 518 00:39:08.840 --> 00:39:14.199 So it does make you wonder is Paul Weekly's story true. Could he have 519 00:39:14.320 --> 00:39:17.719 actually abducted Cindy and held her in captivity before killing her. Or is he 520 00:39:17.800 --> 00:39:23.159 just fabricating this story in order to help his own legal problems. So I 521 00:39:23.159 --> 00:39:25.679 think this would be a good time to bring it into part one. But 522 00:39:25.880 --> 00:39:30.079 joy us next week as if we present part two of our series about the 523 00:39:30.119 --> 00:39:34.559 disappearance of Cindy. Song Robin, do you want to tell us a little 524 00:39:34.559 --> 00:39:37.480 bit about the Trail Went Cold Patreon? Yes. The Trail Cold Patreon has 525 00:39:37.519 --> 00:39:43.079 been around for three years now, and we offer these standard bonus features like 526 00:39:43.199 --> 00:39:46.880 early ad free episodes, and I also send out stickers and signed thank you 527 00:39:46.960 --> 00:39:51.400 cards to anyone who signs up with us on Patreon. If you join our 528 00:39:51.440 --> 00:39:57.159 five dollars tier tier two, we also offer monthly bonus episodes in which I 529 00:39:57.199 --> 00:40:00.159 talk about cases which are not featured on the Trail Wind Cold's original feed, 530 00:40:00.239 --> 00:40:05.320 so they're exclusive to Patreon, and if you join our highest tier tier three, 531 00:40:05.400 --> 00:40:08.320 the ten dollars tier. 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So until next time, be sure to bundle 549 00:41:15.880 --> 00:41:21.320 up because cold trails and chili pass, call for warm clothing music by Paul 550 00:41:21.440 --> 00:41:22.679 Rich from the podcast Cold Callers Comedy