Rivalries are the lifeblood of college football. Rivalries are just about everything in college
football, and this, of course is Rivalry Weekend across the landscape of college
football and most specifically in our Big Ten. Welcome into the Big Ten paradigm.
Here at the College Gridiron Coast to coast network, my name Ismart Rogers.
You can join me on a daily basis at the Voice of College Football.
We've got a main channel, We've got fifteen team channels, including Ohio
State and Michigan. Iowa has won the Big Ten Western Division. Regardless of
Friday's result in Nebraska, there are other rivalry matchups across the Big Ten that
hold a ton of weight for those particular fan bases and those alumni. Northwestern
Illinois the Eliini must win to get to six wins and a bull berth.
Also Minnesota and Wisconsin. The Badgers got their sixth win to reach bowl eligibility
last week. They take on Minnesota and the Gophers have slumped badly here in
November. They've got to defeat the Badgers to get to six wins themselves.
But our focus here on the Big Ten paradigm is where the focus of college
football is period. It's Ohio State, it's Michigan. It is for the
Big Ten East, it is for a probable College football Playoff Berth. We
join Steve Hellwagen of Bucknuts two four seven Sports, Kevin Noon, and Tony
Gerdemann from the Buckeye Huddle each and every Wednesday at eleven am Eastern Time for
Buckeyes Live. It's the game. Yeah. I think people are going to
need to slow build up to Saturday or their heads are going to explode before
kickoff. There is a lot of pe and vinegar out there right now between
the fan bases. Both teams appear to be taking everything in stride. But
I will say this. You go back to twenty nineteen and you talk to
Ohio State fans and there was not a lot of talk about the game.
Oh yeah, it's all well and good. We're all focused on the CFP
and everything else. Nobody that I talked to at this point is really that
focused on the College Football Playoff. It's all about this game. After being
on the wrong end of the last two games, the allegations that are out
there about what Michigan may have done to have success in the last two seasons,
and everything else, it's all going to culminate at twelve o'clock in ann
Arbor on the Fox Broadcasting Company. But it's you know, there's a lot
going on here, and Ohio State is probably as healthy as it has been
going into this game, certainly in the last couple of years. And I'm
expecting a real doozy in this one. And you know, I'm you know,
I'm trying to run up a slow build too. I'll probably be spitting
nails by the end of the show, but right now, I'm just trying
to slow burn Tony, Ali and Frasier would be the only thing I could
put close to this in regards to There's nothing in team sports like it where
the focus of your entire season comes down to three hours and everything else is
just considered, you know, window dressing. Yeah, And really, the
build up for this game started with the build up to the Georgia game.
After Ohio State lost to Michigan last year, they realized that they didn't go
into that game properly and they didn't want to have that happen against Georgia,
and they haven't wanted to have that happen all season long, and they certainly
don't want it to happen again in this game. So they've been working on
this. As Ryan Day and Urban Meyer have said, you respect the rivalry
by working it every day, and that's not new at Ohio State. The
results the last couple of years have been sort of new, I guess you
would say, but the focus on this, and as Kevin said, like
the lack of talk about the playoffs at this point, it's just all about
this and whatever happens after this happens. But right now this is the most
important thing I think for both programs and for a number of different reasons.
And whether or not this is the biggest Michigan Ohio State game ever, we'll
probably talk about later in the show, but I think for as many reasons
on the field, there is just many reasons off the field why this thing
is gigantic. Steve, Yeah, I mean, you know I said this
yesterday on Spectrum, and you know Woody and Bow. You know people think,
oh, they hated each other and this, that and the other.
Well Bo actually worked for Woody in Ohio State and then he tried to leave
to go to Miami and become the head coach there, and what he was
like, you don't want to do that. You want to stay here and
help us win here at Ohio State and you could be the next coach at
Ohio State. Well then he goes on and becomes the head coach at Michigan.
And they went against each other for ten years, and there was this
s grudging respect between them if both shim Beckler was raising money for the children's
hospital at the University of Michigan, what he hayes was number one on the
guest list to be there for the big fundraising you know thing whatever they you
know, it was the scrudging respect that the two had for each other underlying
friendship. None of that exists today because Jim Harbaugh and Ryan Dave never really
worked together, and they can't even say each other's names, and one side
stands accused of trying to spy on the other side as well as every other
opponent has had seemingly for three years to steal food right out of their mouths,
basically, and so it is deeply, deeply personal this time, and
it hadn't been like that in a long time. So this one, this
one means more, I think, is what I would say in the stakes
couldn't be any higher because this last year, the four year of the fourteen
playoff. You know, starting next year, you can lose this game and
still get in to the playoff. You just have to play an opening round
game as opposed to having the first round by perhaps, although you could actually
lose this game go on and beat the team the following week and get the
first round by So it's kind of crazy the way that this is all shaking
out, But this is the last year. It means what it does,
and in my way of thinking, they've come close. They had twenty one
million people watched the twenty sixteen game, which was eleven and zero versus eleven
and ah. Maybe they can catch that Florida State Notre Dame game from nineteen
ninety three or ninety four that had twenty two million people, the most watched
regular season game in modern college football history. We could have that with Fox
on Saturday. Steve, just real quick, when you say one team's spying,
you need to clarify that you're talking about Michigan, because Michigan fans might
think you're talking about Ohio State doing that spying. Yes, to clarify that
was Michigan that did the spying. The evidence seems to be mountains and overwhelming
to where they've fired an assistant coach because he impeded the investigation. Must have
been something in there that he didn't like that you know, he didn't want
people to know about. So you know, this one's real, O High
State. You know, for all those years of High State rubbed Michigan's knows
in it, the last two years Michigan has rubbed Ohio State's knows in it.
And now Michigan stands accused of going to great lengths to find a way
to beat Ohio State once again. And if that's not enough for is State
to you know, finally put up or shut up, then I don't know
what would ever be enough for Ohio State to try and win this game.
I will say these two coaches obviously don't like each other. Even Brady Hoak
and Urban Meyer attended to barbecue together, and we're seeing having a meal together.
I don't think you'll see Ryan Day and Jim Harbor having a meal together
anytime soon for any reason. Yeah, that was at the Sound Mind,
Sound Body football camp up there. I was there for it, and I'll
tell you that barbecue was good by the way it was sat barbecue. It
was very good barbecue. But no, I don't think that that these two
coaches are going to spend a lot of time together and they're not going to
on the field on Saturday, because let's not forget Jim Harbaugh is not going
to be on the sideline with the team. I mean, you know,
let's let's not forget about that, which you know speaks volumes. I mean,
I don't know why they would do that to an innocent program that's just
done nothing. We're just sitting here minding our own business. But you know,
sure we're all. You bring up Brady, how kids one and during
contribution is great barbecue. It's barbecue. I'm guessing Kevin remembers nothing else about
that event except the barbecue with barbicue. Well, there were way too many
kids at that camp. I mean it, you know, sound mind,
soundbody. Is a great event and it's open up to like everybody, But
there they are just too many kids there to be able to go there and
scout anybody. It's it's it was a lot. I appreciate great barbecue,
but you appreciate great barbecue. I haven't had it. I haven't had a
chance to to do anything with the smoker recently. Maybe maybe after you know,
this week and then potentially next week if Ohio State wins and goes to
Indianapolis, maybe I can, you know, maybe do a brisket or something.
Kevin, Let's stay with you. We'll go with this round of questioning.
Because of everything that you guys just mentioned. There is a thought out
there that Ohio State has more pressure on it. Number one, they've lost
two consecutive games. Number two, Ryan Day is coaching against an interim coach,
and he personally would lose three consecutive games. Beyond all the eleven to
zero championship on the line, all the typical and the pride and the bragging
rights, but just the situation that has been brought on by Michigan, let's
face it has put more pressure on Ryan Day in Ohio State. I say
there's a lot of pressure on Michigan too, and I said this on Serious
XM last night. Look at it this way, Michigan has what forty four
seniors. The loser of this game is going potentially to the Orange Bowl to
play Louisville. May as well call it the the opt Out Bowl, and
that team is going to scatter into the wind. And if you do believe
that Michigan is going to be face facing a lot of n C two A
punishments coming down the line, and they're doing this to you know, they're
they're kicking the can down the road in order to you know, this is
a special team. We think we can win a national championship. You know,
Damn the consequences, we'll deal with those later. If you're going through
all of this and you lose the game and you go to the opt out
bawl and you lose to Louisville because half your team has taken off because they
don't care about that game. And if you're not the CFP, you're gonna
have a lot of opt out. So there's pressure on Michigan too. And
and that's not that's not to diminish the point that Ohio State has a ton
of pressure. Ryan Day personally has a lot of pressure. That's all there
too. But I certainly have heard the narrative that all the pressure is on
Ohio State, and that is just not true. What do you think,
Yeah, yeah, I agree with Kevin. I mean, I think,
yeah, Michigan needs to win this year because the future is very uncertain for
the University of Michigan football program. I think the NCAA is going to throw
the book at them. They're going to vacate wins. And I think that
is entirely possible that they could face a postseason ban in twenty twenty four because
of what has happened in the past, and if and when that comes down,
there could be a number of players that go into the transfer portal.
I think it is entirely possible that the university president, the athletic director,
and coach Jim Harbaugh could all lose their jobs as a result of this scandal.
And you know, again, I don't think they embrace this the proper
way. I think that, and I don't know what the proper way would
have been for them in salvage a chance to win the championship this year.
I don't know. I guess they're militants in questioning the Big ten's purview.
To do anything in the interim while you await the long term NCAA process is
probably the most just head scratching thing that you know you're you're above the Big
Ten to where you can do this to the thirteen other Big Ten schools and
expect there to be no repercussions. I mean, I just I just don't
know how you what kind of worldview you have to think that you're above everybody
else. To get away with something so egregious, so obvious, is as
obvious as the nose on your face. And they just thought, oh,
well, we're Michigan, we're number two in the polls. They shouldn't do
anything to us. Well, in a sense, they really didn't. They
just took the head coach away for these three games. If they somehow win
this week, he's back in for the championship game next week against Iowa,
and back in for the playoff. So you know what's really hurt them this
year? Nothing? You know, it's been a minor slap on the wrist.
They're still eligible. They should thank they're lucky stars that they were still
eligible. So I think the NCAA is going to throw the book at them,
and you know that the mountains of evidence are there, and so I
agree with Kevin, this is the year they need to win it all,
create those memories, show that Michigan is capable of doing this, and then
when Matt Campbell or whoever comes in to salvage this disaster in twenty twenty four.
You know, hopefully by twenty twenty five they can have a winning team
back on the field, because I think they're in for a root awakening.
I think after the first of the year, I'm seeing the comments from Mike
and Tice about vacate wins for what you guys are delusional, You've got don't
forget soft well, Michigan has three head coaches this year who have been suspended.
So you know, if you want to count the two suspensions for Jim
harbaught like three times they've had head coaches suspended, it could because Searon Moore
has been suspended. Jim Harbaugh has been suspended twice. And let's never forget
Michigan has agreed with the last suspension, or else they would have stuck to
their temporary straining order. They would have continued to go through the injunction.
So they agreed with this one. They imposed the first one. They have
agreed with the second one, or else they would have done something to stop
it. So this is something real has happened here because Michigan has again imposed
their own three game suspension, trying to keep a four game suspension from happening.
There's still going to be a suspension from that first situation carried on to
next year because the NCAA is not going to take your three games when they
wanted four, and and then there's more coming from this. So there's there's
obviously a ton of a ton of pressure on both programs, both teams,
both head coaches. Sharun Moore, there's a ton of pressure on him.
You don't want to lose this game and then be the be seen as the
reason why, because you know you are in control of the game and then
you are the reason that they lost. You don't want that. Obviously,
Ryan Day doesn't want to lose three in a row. Obviously doesn't want to
miss the playoffs. Michigan doesn't want to miss miss the playoffs. Pressure for
this game is is immense. I also do think I think there's a chance
if Michigan loses this one, they will opt out themselves. They will self
impose a ball band to try to get back into the postseason a year earlier
and once again say yeah, we've realized something bad has happened here. They
usually do it with them, They drag their feet on it, but eventually
they come around when they see the punishment coming down, so like the yeah,
yeah, yeah, yeah, we agree there should be some more punishment
here. So I would be shocked. And that's another reason why it's big
for Michigan to win this and to continue to move on and hopefully get what
they are shooting for and some would say selling their soul for at this point.
But yeah, the denial from the Michigan side is incredible for Michigan fans.
When you have head coaches suspended, your coach, head coach is currently
serving a suspension. Something real is happening here. There is a lot going
on, and whether you disagree with the rules or not, that's pointless.
That means nothing. You can disagree with them all you want. They're right
there and they clearly have not been followed to the point that your head coach
has been now suspended for half of the regular season. And the reason we've
never seen that before is because generally a school would fire coach for this level
of needing to be suspended. You see, I saw Bruce Feldman reporting on
Saturday that there's a possibility that Harbor would be suspended the entire twenty twenty four
season. The reason that has never been happened that never happened before is because
the coach would be fired for that. And Michigan has not chosen to act
on any of this other than they when they have to and trying to appease
the NCAA. I don't think they'll have to appease the NCAAA in terms of
their head coach, because I would expect Jim Harbroughs to eventually leave. And
I've thought this was his last season since the first NCAA in fraction when he
wouldn't accept the four game suspension just really quick too. And I don't want
to lump all Michigan fans together, and unfortunately we see a lot of them,
like on social media, the vocal ones that dude from the Young Turks,
who's insane. I mean, there's a lot of stuff going there.
But there's this Eric Cartman debate club situation going on where the loudest voice in
the room is the one that's going to win, and we hear constantly,
well it's a stupid rule. Well it's still a rule. I think paying
tax is a stupid still got to pay him. I mean, they're there's
a lot of that going on. Well, there's no real advantage. Well,
if you go to the if you go to the article from the Athletic,
it disagrees with you, just because potentially Scott Leffler said, Oh,
it wasn't that big of a deal, and we don't know that. I'm
just saying it was an opponent of theirs that they played earlier in the year.
Oh, they could have had you know, all of our we could
have had all of their plays and it wouldn't have mattered. Well, yeah,
when you're talking about a group of five team against a top end power
five team, that's just generally what's going to happen, unless you know,
we're talking about Appalastian State and you know there's a lot lot going back there.
But uh, Toledo, Yeah yeah. So you sit there and you
it's just no, no, we're just going to be louder. We're just
going to keep saying the same thing over and over and over again. And
they keep getting fed the same line of ship from people. And I'm sorry
that but it's it is. They keep getting fed the same line and they
just parrot it. They parrot it over and over and over and over again,
and people are like, well, Ohio, State would do the same
thing. Well, Ohio State is no stranger to running a foul of NC
two A rules. And honestly, Ohio State fans have more history fighting with
each other than they do with everybody else. That's just generally how it works.
So I just still don't know where we are in the five stages of
grief. I think we just keep resetting it. I mean, because we've
been in anger for a long time. We've got a large contingent of Michigan
fans on our channel, some of them make their way to the Ohio State
show, and most of them are above board and recognizing something serious and then
it should be dealt with. And certainly there's going to be an amount of
offense to any fan base to try to minimize that as much as possible,
and that's human nature. But to completely ignore it or actually turn it around
to be this attack that's unwarranted and malicious by the other big ten schools in
the NCAA is a bit ridiculous, all right. And one other note,
Kevin had pointed us toward the future, and of course we will have plenty
of time to go through the post mortem. But I see Ohio States get
the second ranked recruiting class in the nation for twenty twenty four and should hold
in the top four. You would think Michigan doesn't seem to have capitalized on
this two year run. They're at fifteen. That's pretty much where they are.
I don't know if this investigation has had any kind of adverse effects on
their recruiting class, but that's where that lands. And I know the transfer
portal has changed much of how important that final high school recruiting ranking is,
and Michigan's been more active and effective in their transfer portal than Ohio State.
But still the Buckeyes continue to be a monster on the recruiting trail. Just
wait, just wait until twenty twenty five quarterback Bryce Underwood from the state of
Michigan commits to LSU. I promise you that's happening. It's a done deal,
and the amount of anger and everything that's going to come out there is
going to be insane because Bryce Underwood is not going to Michigan. Michigan's recruiting
it's a situation of they don't recruit. I mean, okay, you can
still have a great class and not recruit head to head with Ohio State on
a lot of kids. Michigan has tried to move into the state of Ohio
and recruit some, but it's still not to the point of where Lloyd Carr
was doing. When Lloyd Carr had this rivalry completely tilted in his direction,
he could come into Ohio and short of a legacy kid could at least create
a level of indecision that would go down until the final moment, until the
kid was ready to decide. Michigan is the king of recruiting Connecticut, I
mean, is the king of recruiting Massachusetts. Boston College should be pissed off
about the amount that they recruit up there in that area. But you know,
Michigan is not necessarily getting involved with the main kids. And I mean,
yes, to be a top fifteen team, recruiting is still pretty nice.
I mean they still get some kids or some kids in the last couple
of classes. I'm like, that's, you know, that's a really good,
you know, looking football player. I think that that's going to be
a huge get for them. But I don't I don't know if I'm going
to say, you know, at least in twenty four I don't think it's
going to have a major impact on recruiting, especially because National Signing Day is
less than a month away and the nc two A can't do anything in that
amount of time. So there's not really going to be anything there that I
think that's going to sway any kids decisions. At this point, hell sign
with them. You can go in the portal. If the program gets nuked,
you can just jump in the portal and leave. So it doesn't really
matter, but it could have some impacts in twenty five and twenty six.
But the Bryce Underwood decision been made a long time ago. I do wonder
about that in terms of if this all, if the NCAA does have all
of the proof that they need, do they just get vacated for the games
that they spied on spied for, or do they get do they vacate the
non conference games as well? Like you're not going You're not sending somebody to
spy against Bowling Green, you know, sending somebody to spy against East Carolina
or Hawaii, although maybe you had people wanting to go spy against Hawaii,
But do they still get those wins? Or because this operation is going on
during these games, like because it exists, are all of those games vacated.
I don't know that's a good point off. I mean, if you
have actual receipts that you know which ones were directly impacted, or is it
just kind of more of a blanket thing of you know, this is under
the administration of cheating, so we're just going to to you know, wipe
all of them out in just one fell swoop. But the good news is
Michigan will get the opportunity sometime down the line to to get win number one
thousand again. So you know they can they can save all of those little
cutouts and everything else, and the press releases you just have to just have
to cross off the names and the dates and things like that. But you
know, there's always there's always a silver lining to every dark storm. They'll
get a chance to win number one thousand twice. Yes, yes, I
did see and uh some interview Blake Kor I'm talking about how the thousand wins
they can't take that away, and I was like, h they might be
able to. Pretty sure they're gonna it's happening. Can I ask a deal
with the bigs? MIC's come at here? What will OSU fans say about
Ryan Day if he loses again to Michigan. I know the fans last year
calling for his job. Fans are always calling for jobs. They're called for
a job for a miss third down. So obviously they're going to call for
a Rhinda's job after a second loss to Michigan last year, and they will
certainly call for his job again if he loses this week. That's that is
a given. That's what fans do, that's what media does. We call
for jobs. But Ohio State is the underdog in this game on the road
against the number two team in the nation. It's a game technically, mathematically
you should lose, so I don't think you get fired for something that should
happen. But again, as I've said many times, John Cooper didn't get
fired for losing the Michigan. He got fired for losing the program. And
then all of those added, those losses to Michigan never helped. And so
if they had had better Bowl performances and better just not flaming out the way
they did, I think he would have withstood the losses in nineteen ninety nine
and two thousand, especially after the nineteen ninety eight season being as good as
it was. But that team once nine two thousand things were dropping off of
a cliff and they needed to make a change. And so three losses for
Ryan Day's just go back to work the day after you go back to work
on November twenty sixth, then you get back at it. And that's it.
I've said. The Doctor Pepper commercials are patterned after the people at Texas
A and M right down to the maroon, you know, just the way
that they overreact to everything in just their the way they are. But if
Ohio State gets stopped for no gain on the first play of the game,
that also applies to Ohio State fans, so they, you know, they
throw the twel in at the first sign of weakness or first mistake or whatever.
They go off the deep end. And you know, I just watched
a videotape. You know, Woody Hayes fans are fickle. You know,
That's that's what Woody Hayes always liked to say. And Ryan Day's fifty six
and six and bring in great players, and you know, you don't want
to lose to Michigan three times in a row. That would not be good.
But I don't think he's going anywhere if that were to happen. I
mean, you never want to stop and think about, you know, well,
what would happen if they did lose this game, They'd be eleven and
one unless some other teams all lost Texas, Oregon, Alabama, Florida State,
Washington, you know whoever. You know, like four of those five
teams lost. You're not going to backdoor your way back into the playoff again
this year like you did last year. So you're probably gonna get relegated to
the Orange Bowl to play Louisville, and half the team isn't going to play
because they want to preserve their draft status. So we've covered what will happen
if they don't win, which you know you don't want to even conjure that
thought. It's time for Ohio State to get back to Indianapolis. It's time
for High State to win the Big Ten again. It's time for High State
to beat Michigan. And so, no, I don't think they'd fire Ryan
Day. No, none of what will happen if they lose to Michigan is
the least bit desirable. But you know, he's your coach and he's your
guy, and I don't think that's going to change regardless of this. I
mean, you do have a new president coming in Ted Carter in January,
new athletic director coming in probably in March or April to work alongside Gene Smith
for a few months. So you know, just as I've said with the
basketball coach Chris Holtman, some of the insulation will be gone for Ryan Day.
But again, you know, when you're in the top five in every
poll for years and years and years and years, and you're going into an
era now with a twelve team playoff and you figure to be in it ten
or eleven times every twelve years, you know, why would you rock this
boat and try and start over and hope that it'll be better than what you've
already got. Because there is a second part to the firing. You have
to then hire someone. So it's not just to get rid of him.
There has to be a capable, suitable, better replacement. Steve Dason and
I went back and forth about that. He stated that if Ohio State's really
as serious about football as he believes that they are, if Ryan Day loses
this game, they're going to fire him. And I said, I do
not see that in any such way happening, nor should it happen. He's
winning eleven games a year, So why wasn't Jim Harbaugh fired for losing?
I responded, but in that same way five Street or whatever and declining to
play another like, is it because Michigan isn't as serious? And that's been
a claim that some Michigan fans have said that, you know, that's why
Ohio State takes this stuff too seriously. It's just football. It stops being
just football, won't you start winning? Then it's life or death, and
this is why we're better than you. But and there were people that wanted
Jim Harball gone, and probably Steve himself. I do remember Steve not even
watching the twenty twenty one or the twenty twenty one game one because yeah,
because he knew it was going to be bad. And so that's that was
the situation with Jim Harbaugh. Then and something something changed. And you know,
for years, a couple of years, I had said leading up to
that twenty twenty one season, this was not Jim Harball had stopped having fun.
This was a miserable dude coaching his team and had a miserable attitude just
just talking to him, seeing interviews, just staring off into space, and
then the team. The team kind of stared off into space too, but
then something changed. Twenty twenty one. He's more energized. He's and you
can probably go back and just look at the video from one year to the
next, maybe ignoring twenty twenty stuff because that was COVID and everybody was crazy.
But this is a more energized guy than he had been for a couple
of years. And I don't know if it's the which is the the chicken
or the egg. Was it the energy that brought the wins or was it
the wins that brought the energy. And I'm not even gonna discuss how those
wins came to be. It's just you know, this is a different Jim
Harbaugh right now. David Greenshield, thank you so much for the contribution.
We know David is going to be amped up on Saturday. Best game in
the series. David's best are nineteen eighty seven in two thousand and six.
Gotta love the earl headbands. Yes, twenty three to twenty Yes, that
was a quite the game. And of course sending off Earl in style.
Eighty seven game was one of my first Ohio State Michigan memories. Did Chris
Pielman have two interceptions in that one or is that? I think that's the
Cotton Bowl game, right, I don't think he had entered. Yeah,
yeah, I don't think he had two interceptions in that game. Neither one
of those teams in eighty seven was very good, obviously the way it panned
out. But I was at that game and it was very cold that day.
It was probably about thirty degrees and my friend Joe and I we were
in our second year sophomores at Ohio State, and we just we went to
senior tackle. Woody Hayes Center was brand new in nineteen eighty seven. I
think it was the first or second year that they had practiced inside that indoor
facility. When they had to go inside, they would go over to the
french Fieldhouse, which was a little farther away from the Biggs facility, which
is, you know, what was their practice facility there. And so they
built this nice indoor thing and they had the senior tackle there. I was
there, Chris Bielman hit the dummy for the last time and all those things,
and then we hopped in the car and it was blowing snow all the
way to an arbor and we parked our car and we went through the parking
lot looking for tickets, and this really nice guy from Michigan was there with
his family. He's probably in his sixties, and said, here, have
a hot dog, have a pop whatever. Saw Ohio State students, whatever,
and said, yeah, we're looking for tickets because well I got extra
tickets. And I go, well, how much do you want for him?
Well, it says seventeen dollars right here, and my buddy and I
each pulled out a twenty and said keep the change. You know, It's
like we were expecting to pay top dollar and got in for a face value.
We were on the thirty yard line in Ohio State. We didn't expect
Ohio State was going to win, but we wanted to be there, you
know, for Earl's last stand. And you know, they won the game,
and yeah, that was that was a great memory. That's the first
time I went to Michigan Stadium. And if you've never been there, to
see it for the first time, it's a little bit jarring. It's different,
much different than Ohio Stadium. I'll say that I think the whole state
of Michigan's a bit jarring. To be honest with you, it just seems
like a dark, dire, cold place. Of course, I'm only there
in the wintertime for Michigan football, and you know, every time you go
to Michigan State seems like the weather is pretty adverse. I don't think I've
ever been to Michigan State on a sunny, seven degree seventy degree day.
But you know, maybe if we get a September game up there one year,
that would be great. But then I go up for Michigan football or
Michigan basketball and Michigan State basketball there's usually a foot of snow on the ground
as well, so that kind of adds to it as well. But compared
to Ohio, it just, I don't know, it just seems like it's
Canada. I don't know, you know, bad Canada, but since it's
Michigan. But I don't know. That's just my impression of being there.
This will be the thirty I think I've been at twenty nine of the last
thirty Michigan games. The only one I missed was in two thousand and one
my wife was pregnant. My daughter, her twenty second birthday will be on
Monday. Sometimes it's the day of the game. Sometimes it's Thanksgiving, sometimes
it's Black Friday. This time it's two days after the game. But that's
the one I missed in two thousand and one, the Breakthrough with Jim Tressel,
and I watched that on television in my basement and wrote the story for
the game from my basement with the help from our people that were on the
site that day. So yeah, a lot of memories of Michigan and eighty
seven that was that one took the cake for sure. Well. I made
this similar comment to somebody this week that was commenting to the channel that said
something like, and I don't know where this person was writing from, maybe
you know, South Florida or something, who said, you know where,
does it matter where this game is? It's always cold up there anyway,
And I said, and my recollection is it seems like every every game that's
in Columbus seems like it's about fifty five or sixty degrees, and every game
in ann Arbor like it's on the brink of you know, snowfall and ice
and cold. It just that's that's not the exact truth, but it just
seems that way. I will say I've been to some lakes in Michigan in
the summer, the weather is fine there in the right place is it's a
lovely state. But Steve's right. When we go to Michigan State campus is
beautiful and the leaves have changed the colors. But then after the game,
it's all like ice and snow. I don't know, like the winter happens
at night and it gets cold there. We have we've been there when in
October and like the there's a layer of ice on the field, there's snow
covering the pool outside of the stadium. And then of course Michigan, anytime
we're driving back from there, it feels like we're driving through blinding area just
blowing snow. Back on twenty three, dealing with construction and wind and snow
and things like that. But it's gonna be another one the thirty low thirties
around game time, and I think it's dry. At this point, we
know how much Ohio State does not like the snow. We've heard about that
from Michigan fans for a couple of years now, So I don't know what
the latest weather is. But I'll be in a press box, so I
don't care. Ner Fed Hacks is telling us as we were discussing a few
minutes ago about the changing landscape in college football starting next season, losing to
Michigan won't matter. So why would they fire Ryan Day? Silly oops,
silly ops say silly things. Postseason records matter moving forward. They would hire
him because he was the head coach overseeing a program that's going to get hit
with major infractions. That's why you fire him. They're talking about right Day.
Oh okay, I'm sorry. I had to step away to yell at
animals. And although everything else, there's a segment of the Michigan fans that
would say, you are absolutely correct, he has overseen well and that was
the thing. That was the thing. I went to the lowest of hanging
fruit. So I apologize to the super chatter. Yeah, no, I
don't. I will yield my time. I don't have anything to say on
the other side of things. Well, we will eventually need to get to
some matchups on the field here, but before we do that real quick.
It's kind of connected to the pressure narrative, would be the psyche, especially
with Ohio State. Steve, what do you think the psyche? So I
like in this not exactly of course, but in a sense, going into
the Georgia game after what could be termed a demoralizing defeat against Michigan, even
three weeks later, I'm thinking, what is this team going to be?
I know what Georgia is, I'm kind of infinite of how they're going to
show up, but which Ohio State team's going to show up? And if
they show up the way they're capable of. I was expecting an excellent game,
and so they delivered that. But I thought if they don't show up
with their heads screwed on straight, then they're going to get blown out of
the stadium. So what are your thoughts about what the psyche of this group
could be after two consecutive losses. Yeah, I think that they have a
great deal of resolve, and I think that their coaches have drummed it into
them that anything less than a win is not acceptable, and I think they're
going to go up there and be very focused, very business like, and
play their best football. What we've seen as a team defensively, it's not
a fluke anymore. This is eleven games that they have played just outstanding football
against some pretty good offenses. Now, you know, we could say Michigan
State and Minnesota the last few weeks, Rutgers, Wisconsin, and some of
these teams you know, don't have a whole lot going for them offensively,
but you know, Michigan and Ohio State, I think they have what is
it, seven common opponents this year with the five other teams in the division,
and they both played Minnesota and Purdue, and Michigan's margin of victory in
those games is twenty eight. Ohio State's margin of victory in those seven games
is twenty four, so it's pretty comparable. And there were a couple of
blowouts that skew the margin there a little bit. So Penn State is a
barometer. Ohio State beat them twenty to twelve, and Michigan beat them twenty
four to fifteen. So everything seems to be, you know, as comparable
as it almost could possibly be. Michigan's giving up nine point zero points,
Ohio State's giving up nine point three, so everything seems to be just dead
even when you look at any way you want to qualify this, and I
think Ohio State has that incentive and has that motivation given what's happened, double
digit losses the last two times they've played them. And yet the players can
put the film on and see what Maryland just making routine plays. They didn't
have to stand on their head to score twenty four points. And in fact,
had Maryland not self destructed and turned the ball over for a touchdown on
its own five yard line and you had a safety or actually two safeties and
done some stupid things, maybe Maryland wins that game. Penn State. We
took covered the show that week. Penn State James Franklin had three galactically stupid
strategic decisions in that game. Now, Drew Aller could have stood out there
all day, he wasn't going to find his receivers. But you know,
Penn State was in that game, you know, all the way down to
one fifty remaining when Franklin went for two and didn't get it. But so
this is not an invincible Michigan team. It's a very good Michigan team.
There's nothing for Ohio State to be scared of. And I really like Denzel
Burke yesterday said we're going to do this for for Ohio. We're going to
do this because we need to do this. We have to do this.
There is no alternative. We have to go up there and win this game.
I think that's and he's locked in. I mean you could see in
his eye that he's not. You know, he ordinarily he's happy, go
lucky Denzel Burke. He wasn't bullshitting around yesterday. He was ready to go.
And you know Tommy Eickenberg's ready to go. You know, Kate Stover's
ready to go. You know Marvin Harrison's ready to go. So I'll take
my chances with these guys this week to you know, this is their vision
quest, this is the one they've got to win to ensure their legacy,
and they're too good not to not to go away with at least one win
over Michigan. The Denzel Burke thing, I think one of the questions was
what concerns you most about the Michigan offense, and his answer was nothing.
There's something to that effect, and then he went on to talk about the
offense and the Ohio State defense. He was definitely very serious in terms of
the scoring margins, and margins are what they are. But since counter stallions
was suspended and since teams were aware of Michigan's scheme to cheat the game,
there have been four common opponents. Ohio State's margin of victory total in those
four games is ninety seven. Michigan's is ninety three. So just a little
bit of information there. The Michigan State, Purdue, Penn State, Maryland,
those four games the four common opponents since the Stallions thing came about.
But none of that means anything right now. It doesn't mean anything on Saturday.
Michigan nearly lost to Illinois the week before the Ohio State game last week
or last year didn't mean anything. Michigan gets a very tough game at Maryland
this week may not mean anything. I think it did give Ohio State some
a good look at what a quarterback, a capable quarterback can do against this
Michigan defense, as long as you don't turn it over. And Tealia Tunguebailoa
turned it over three times in that game, including a fumble that was returned
for a touchdown. So if you just hold on to the football, I
think if com McCord gets protection, there's gonna be some opportunities to go downfield.
I just I'm also not expecting Michigan to play Maryland the way they played
that the way they will play. I don't expect them to play Ohio State
the way they played Maryland, I expect them to keep some safeties up top,
try to limit the big plays and maybe force Ohio State to just be
patient and run for six yards, run for six yards, throw for eight
yards, because I don't think there are some defensive coordinators. I still don't
think Ohio State is patient enough to do that. It's gonna be up to
Ryan date you stay that patient. Ohio State did not have Trevion Henderson last
year in the game in Michigan, didn't have Blake ORMs, so you know,
we can look back there. But I think the biggest thing that hurt
Ohio State last year is when you are settling for three versus seven, and
Ohio State was three of three in field goals last year, and you can't
do that and you can't stop scoring. Ohio State really did not put up
any points in the second half of that game and then got into a position
where it had to sell out on defense, and eventually the defense broke.
So Ohio State just has to maintain a level of consistency. If Ohio State
can get up, it has to keep the pressure on Michigan for the entire
four quarters. Michigan. It's not an explosive offense. I mean, that's
not to say that Michigan hasn't put up a lot of points and everything else,
but they are not a team that does it with with home runs.
They do a lot more you know, singles out there and do a very
good job at it. But you know, I will be interested to see
how Ohio State's in tier offensive line holds up against the Michigan defensive tackles.
I think that's something that's going to be very important there. But Ohio State's
red zone struggles that have been a recurring theme this year cannot be part of
this game. Ohio State has to put up seven when it is it has
the opportunity, and I understand Michigan for much of the season did not have
an end goal against it, but you know, Ohio State is not the
opponent that Michigan has played in the previous eleven weeks, and Ohio State has
to do a better job in those nd goal situations than is done in ninety
five percent of this season. Traveon Henderson is a different back than we saw
fail in a short yardage key situation at Michigan two years ago. Not his
fault. Offensive line of course not getting the push, not getting but Ohio
State being a little bit maybe not stubborn, but getting away from what they
do best in a couple situations two years ago and thinking that they could show
themselves to be tougher and ram it ahead. But man Traveon Henderson to me
is just for his talented and as great at the season as he had in
twenty twenty one, he was just you know, riding creases and seams and
exploding through them basically and showing off speed and agility versus now he's a much
more determined, focused, running with anger kind of running back. I think
he's also more patient. You've seen him not just running straight into the line,
but he's he's looking for or the hole and he's reading things, and
then he's got the explosion to get through there and make make guys just not
even get into the picture. But he's also making guys miss. And that's
the difference between him and anybody else in the Ohio State backfield is he can
he can get to the hole because the holes aren't staying open for long and
Chip train him can only get there so quickly. I do think maybe now
they are able to play Dallan Hayden and not lose a red shirt. Ryan
Day clarified that after the game on Saturday, saying that the postseason games don't
count for the red shirt situation, So if you could see him playing the
rest of the way out, I am. I will be interested to see
if he is the number two running back. I don't think he will be,
but I wouldn't be surprised if he he eventually becomes the number two back
at some point this season. But yeah, the thing that they're getting from
Henderson has been fantastic. He's averaging over one hundred yards rushing a game when
he's actually out there. I think Notre Dame rush for one hundred, and
of course is rush for one hundred or so any last three games. And
I'm still I don't know that there's gonna be much success between the tackles.
I think you're gonna have to go outside the tackles against Michigan. But Penn
State rush for like one hundred and forty hundred fifty yards on them and they
have no passing game. So I think Penn State showed that you can you
can move the ball between the tackles and on the ground and we'll see if
Ohio State can do that. I'll believe that part when I see it.
But it also only does take like one big hit in between the tackles to
make everything else look good. Whether you go to games all the time or
you've got your heart set on that one huge matchup. Go to ticketsmarter dot
com to save big Ticket Smarter technology gives you the best competitive prices on the
secondary market. Your purchase price is safe and guaranteed. Use promo code big
Big to get ten dollars off of any purchase of at least one hundred dollars,
or the promo code big twenty Big twenty to get twenty dollars off of
any purchase of at least three hundred dollars. Use the promo code as many
times as you'd like. There is no limit. Get in the game with
ticketsmarter dot com or the ticket Smarter mobile app think Smarter, Ticket Smarter.
These recent weeks with Michigan, you know they looked like the most complete team
in football. Maybe not the best Georgia, but look like the most complete
team against mediocre Big ten teams and now here in recent weeks, and most
notably against Maryland. We see JJ McCarthy during this Harpboss suspension his QBR,
he's been inconsistent. He made a bad mistake in the red zone right before
half against Maryland, and of course the Maryland defensive and I know Roman Wilson
caught a ball and then he was on the sideline the rest of the game.
But those Maryland cornerbacks locked down on those Michigan receivers for one thing,
they contested every throw practically, and then of course Michigan having issues at the
tackle position, especially on the right side, and mixing and mashing and moving
guys around. Ladarius Henderson's out. Miles Hinton left the game last week,
so they're starting to show some cracks that they did not earlier. I'll just
say it was a month ago. Yesterday was JJ McCarthy's last touchdown pass wow,
and he was set on Monday at the press conference. Hopefully he's just
saving all of that up for Ohio State, which would be a fantastic way
for him to get out of that slump. But not throwing a single pass
in the second half against Penn State, well, obviously limit your opportunities,
but throwing that interception at the end of the first half in the end zone
against Maryland was bad. The pass he threw before that, which could have
been intercepted by two different guys. One guy knocked it down. That was
even worse. That was a scramble throw back across your body into the end
zone, and that should have been intercepted. And then the very next pass
he throws gets intercepted because he didn't see the linebacker in front of the receiver.
So he does need to step it up. He's a little banged up.
Whether or not he's he will be healthy enough. Obviously he's going to
play. I just he needs to be able to run the ball in this
one and keep plays alive. But while keeping plays alive, he can't make
mistakes in terms of throwing the ball back across the middle. He killed Ohio
State last year with the big plays, but he only completed twelve to twenty
four passes, and it was just it was the big plays, the bad
coverage, the the the Jim Knowles aggressive defense last year, and that was
a less talented secondary for Ohio State a year ago as well, and Michigan
took advantage of all that and exactly the right time, and this year a
high state feels much better about their defensive chances. I'm sure. Yeah.
I'm watching that game last week. It's twenty three to three, and you're
thinking, Wow, this Michigan team's amazing. And that was the first twenty
minutes, but the last forty minutes left. You know, they left a
lot of football out there in that last forty minutes and so allowed Maryland you
know, to get its closed as five on a couple of occasions. And
they even had the ball down five I think, and he threw a talk
of I low to throw a pick. Otherwise they could have driven it down
and taken the lead. And that's just, you know, amazing when you
think about it in the fourth quarter to be in that position. But you
know, this game, I think both teams are going to play their best
football. And I think that there is a factor that says, you know,
the week before that game that you you sometimes get caught look ahead.
Although Ohio State really didn't with either of these last two games against Michigan State.
They were only head of Maryland thirteen to nothing or Minnesota thirteen to nothing,
and they did need to come out of the locker room with the spark
and Henderson provided that and then Sawyer had the force fumble and they scored another
touchdown, you know, two touchdowns in the first ninety seconds of the second
half, and now you could look ahead to Michigan. It was a done
deal at that moment. And yet, you know, I don't think Minnesota
was going to generate much of anything. The Ohio State defense has come within
two fifty yard field goals of shutting out its last two opponents, and you
know, I think it was at three games this year where they've only given
up three points. So you know, they're legitimate in my opinion, they
are really playing great football. And obviously it helps if Mike Hall could play
this week and help stop the run up front against Michigan. But to me
and the Ohio State, finally after a couple of years as a team that's
ready to counter what Michigan has for it up front, and we see a
Jim Noles defense, I mean, at least a Jym Knowles play Cauler on
defense of where he's not gambling as much at least in terms of Ohio State
not giving up the big plays. Only forty yard play was the crazy play
against Rutgers. The fumble, rusky, double hike, whatever situation you I
mean, it really hurt Ohio State last year in the biggest situations of where
they had momentium on their side and felt like they were going to get the
opponent off the field and then you go cover zero and it all falls apart
at that point. So I think that as long as Ohio State stays true
to who it's been in the previous eleven year or eleven games, and I
I'm not going to apologize by saying Michigan is significantly better than anybody that Ohio
State's played. So you know, if you're coming out and expecting Ohio State
to hold Michigan to three, you're probably going to be disappointed. There's going
to be there's going to be a lot of swings in this game. There's
gonna be a lot of times where everybody's cheering and a lot of times where
everybody's ready to call for everybody's head. But you know, I like Ohio
State if it does not get away from from what it is in terms of
in its defensive structure and things of that nature. We haven't talked a whole
lot of Kyle McCord. In my eyes, he's reasonably progressed, meaning you
know, he's not a different player than he was ten weeks ago and become
you know, the the reincarnation of c. J. Stroud or anything like
that. But he has taken steps to become a better quarterback, a more
fluid, confident, more decisive quarterback, and he's reached this game in what
is a reasonable manner in regards to, you know, really taking the position
and progressing each week. In my view, yeah, I would agree with
you. You know, at halftime, we had people wanting to enter the
transfer portal looking for anybody else to play quarterback because they got it down the
red zone and settled for field goals three times, and I think on each
one of those there were two incompletions in each one of those series that led
him to have to kick field goals, and he missed some receivers, there's
no two ways about it. Now, some other cases guys were covered.
I give Minnesota credit. Their defense really is not that bad, so he
can play better. But he ended up over two hundred yards and two touchdowns
and completed two thirds of his passes. Just had another comm Accord day,
and he's one hundred and one yards from becoming the seventh different quarterback to go
over three thousand yards in a season at Ohio State. It'll be the eighth
time it's happened. CJ. Stroud did it both of his years as the
starter, so will be the third year in a row that they'll have a
three thousand yard passer. They didn't have one obviously in twenty twenty with fields
because of the COVID year, But so, you know, he's fine.
I don't think they lose this game. If they lose it because of Kyle
McCord, and they may not win it. If they win it because of
Kyle McCord. They may win it because of great running game and great defense,
and Marvin Harrison made one great play in the red zone or something like
that, and that's it. I'm picking Ohio State to win the game twenty
to seventeen. I just think that, you know, we're in for,
you know, one of these old time you know, head head smashing type
games, and the ball could be moved between the twenties, but then it
comes down to what do you do for me in the zone. And I
just think that there's going to be some settling for field goals and different things
like that as opposed to a lot of touchdowns in this game. I'll just
start out real quick. In November. Three games in November, cal McCord
leads all Big Ten in pass efficiency one hundred and seventy one rating. JJ
McCarty is sixth and Big Ten passing efficiency November at one hundred and twenty six.
Calvimccord eight touchdowns, one interception in November. JJ McCarthy zero touchdowns,
one interception in November. At the very least, there is going to be
a question about the Big Ten Quarterback of the Year. For the longest time,
that was just going to be JJ McCarthy. I think the winner of
this game was probably going to be the winner of that award. And if
you can keep cal mc cord upright, I think he's going to beat Michigan.
If you can't, then you've got some issues. And JJ McCarthy just
needs to when he is trying to make a play, he has to make
a good play rather than bad play. If he makes more good plays,
it makes no bad plays that I think Michigan would yes, and they probably
want to keep calm McCord in the twenty five to twenty eight pass attempt range.
I would think that that sounds like the formula. If they're only throwing
the ball twenty five or twenty eight tons, that tells me they're running the
ball or they're going free and out. So I guess column may or Colum
b there Mark, Yeah, and Ohio State just has to be able to
shut down. I mean, the last two games, Michigan has eight rushing
touchdowns against Ohio State. Granted one of them had six and is rushed for
I think it combined five hundred and forty nine yards if I remember correctly,
averaging like thirty eight. Thirty nine carries a game with the clock rules.
You know, we're not talking about them as much now as we were earlier
in the season. But if they do that, that means that they're you
know, A they're not getting away from their game plan, which means they're
probably winning. And B they're keeping Ohio States offen the on the sideline.
And in Michigan, while it has put the ball on the ground nine times,
only has lost two fumbles. So you know, I don't really like
Ohio State's chances of stripping the ball if Michigan gets things going in the running
game. So Ohio State has to do everything it can to try and limit
that Michigan running game. You know, whatever that may mean for Roman Wilson
and for Colston Loveland and guys like that, and Kevin, you usually bring
up the winner of the rushing yardage battle as one, what twenty one straight
something like that. I'm still in the process of writing Tale of the Tape.
That's how much I love this show. Stop. I was in I
was in a groove. I was writing, and I'm like, oh,
I got to get on the Rogers show, so I have to get back
to that. As soon as we are done. Well, Kevin, we
appreciated, and as soon as we read this super chat, we will let
everyone know where what they can find. Kevin and everyone else we got,
Mike thirty eight eighty three, appreciate you. I'm tired of the Wolverines.
Comparing Illinois last year to this Maryland game, Illinois last year had a great
defense. This year both teams sucked. Okay, Doly noted Mike. Yeah,
I mean Maryland. Maryland is Maryland, and it did its usual thing
of where it plays pretty well to start the season and then goes into a
bit of a November nos dive. I mean, of course, that was
different a couple of years ago when Ohio State went there the week before playing
Michigan and had to escape with its life in a fifty two to fifty one
overtime thriller. But yeah, Maryland. You know, Maryland went through a
lot of the season being like the number four team in the Big Ten.
And now nobody, nobody is necessarily talking like that after the turps have fallen
completely off the table and into a hole next to the table. We so
much appreciate you being here on the Big Ten Paradigm each and every week.
We will catch you next week. But in the meantime, you can catch
me and join our live call in shows each and every day at the Voice
of College Football on YouTube. So we will see you then and till now.
Enjoy the games, enjoy the rivalries, and we will see you back
here next week on the Big Ten Paradigm.