What is Kracklakin Fellow thermonuclear a evers? I am Danvelly coming at you four
the hashtag return of the Certified pants tabulous. Mister Grant Hughes, we have
a unique podcast today, Well, I guess not a unique. I guess
peak offseason podcast for you today. I would call it. We're going through
draft in the facsimile of rankings the best twenty three and under players as of
August second, two, twenty three, So anyone who is twenty three or
under as of August second, two, twenty three, not taking into account
that some of them are going into their age twenty four season. People always
seem to get confused by that. I know the date is arbitrary, where
it's at. Their birthday is before January thirty first, YadA, ya YadA.
So it's gonna be we're just gonna draft them for the rest of their
careers. We're taking them as if we want them for the rest of their
careers. We'll get into the criteria first. Please remember subscribe if you haven't
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link to that is in the podcast and YouTube description as well. I appreciate
the screenshots that some of you posted on Twitter, or screenshots pictures some of
you posted on Twitter of yourself wearing the merch. Continue to do that or
post it in discord. And now we ask the question that people have been
waiting weeks to hear the answer to Grant, how are you doing? I'm
doing great. I've enjoyed a couple of vacations slash time off recently, and
I was disappointed to not be here speaking to you uh as we normally do,
but I was not disappointed to sort of mostly not be working. And
I was also not disappointed. This is this will be on brand for anyone
that's been listening for any length of time. I took Twitter off my phone.
Uh is it X Now I refuse to change the logos on our Twitter,
but is it? If you're asking the guy that took it off his
phone what it like, I call it what you want. Uh, but
it immediately made my life better and made me feel better, and so I'm
going to see how long I can go keeping it off my phone. Probably
not good for promotional purposes for this podcast or just anything, but I do
love, not habitually, uh, clicking on it just to see what's what
bad things are in the world, or or being said about me or you
or us. So that's that's But yeah, I'm glad to return and talk
to you, especially because I did notice while I was gone that the level
of fantabulousness was dipping. So I'm glad. I'm glad to provide whatever that
is, I'm glad to be back to provide it. Wow, look at
Grant just thrown shade at the guests we had in his absence. Well,
I mean, they're great and better than me, but they were less fantabulous.
So I mean, I think that's I think that's fair enough to say
we're excited to have you back. I'm kind of with I don't scroll through
Twitter anymore. I don't think you're not gonna be well, I guess unless
they stop using it, but like, you're not gonna be able to function
once the season starts back up and you need like the woes and shams notifications
to do your job. Yeah, you have to have it for that,
but I'm just gonna I'm just gonna enjoy this period of time where I don't
have to. I have Blue I have a blue skuy code if you need.
It's interesting if you want to hop on another social media app that about
threads. Is Threads still happening? Uh? It might be. I'm not
on it. I just I g is always has been the and I post
stuff there for the podcast's always been the most tedious app for me, and
I don't really enjoy it. So I was like, I don't really want
to tie myself to Threads, but a lot of people are on threads.
Blue Sky Conversations a lot better. The audience is like I have like seventy
followers, which is just like, that's what sucks about Twitters. We spend
years building this brand where it's like Hardwoo Knox has four or five K followers
whatever it is. I have twelve plus, and then it's just like it
doesn't matter anymore, and so I've lost the I don't get that, not
even a rush, but I don't have the same impetus to want to promote.
And I also keep forgetting to promote on Blue Sky because it's like you
know that meme of like DJ and the three People, that's like basically what
it's like posting on Blue Sky at this point. Pretty much, yeah,
pretty much. So this draft, so the criteria, as we already mentioned,
is going to be drafting these players for the rest of their careers,
and everything we've seen and analytics it will go into it. But like the
point of this exercise, because we're talking about entire careers, Like when I
made my big board, I took some swings where it's just like I'm trying
to protect Like, yeah, rookies, incoming rookies are going to be a
part of this. It's not just going to be a Wemby situation. And
so I'm curious did you approach it in any different way? Were you more
did you gravitate more towards the known quantities or did you look at Okay,
well, if this player is twenty three, I'd rather latch onto this nineteen
year old guy. Yeah, I kind of. I didn't go into it
intentionally. I just sort of looked at all the names and started going and
started with some tears basically, and then sort of subconsciously I ended up way
way more highly valuing established commodities insofar as you can be an established commodity at
twenty three or twenty two, or some of these guys are twenty one and
younger. So I think I think there's a good chance we approached this like
from pretty opposite ends of the spectrum, which will make it more interesting.
Maybe we'll just each of us will get all the guys we want, but
they'll be my average age will be like twenty two and six months and years
will be like nineteen or something. Right, And I will say I didn't
even bother to rank Jayalen Williams because I just knew he wasn't gonna end.
But I'm not gonna make it. You and I will look up, well,
let's do the maja culpa in advance, and it should be me because
I'm the one who built the database of players if we left off anyone who
was actually aged twenty three or younger. On August second, two, twenty
three, I apologize. I went through it a bunch of times, and
I feel like there were some deep cuts that I really didn't need to include,
and so maybe by trying to throw so many names in there, I
forgot one. I'm hoping I didn't, but you can let us know.
I apologize in advance, but I think we got all the main characters that
fall under this tier nobody. This is again, I shouldn't throw my lot
in with you on this because I could otherwise, just like skate if you
did forget someone, but I didn't. There wasn't anyone that I was like,
oh, this is an obvious miss. So the two that I went
through the fifth time and I included Kelton Johnson and Anthony Black, I didn't
have on the list, and so it's like, right, well you put
and this is not to say like they were in our rankings whatever, Like
you had Taylor Hendricks and Jars Walker and Blow Coolbali and the cool Pool players,
but not Anthony Black. It's just like, so, here's hoping that
we didn't. I didn't suck it up in any way. But I don't
know how to determine who gets the first pick. I wish I had a
coin to flip. Let's just give you the first pick. Well, this
is another because we're just gonna preamble the shit out of this. If the
I feel like usually in this situation, whoever gets the first pick, the
next person should get two in a row, and then you alternate from there.
How do you feel about that? Is that too big of an advantage
for going second? I would say we could do that if you want,
But I looked at this more of like we're not even trying to see who
has the best roster, though we should definitely see what it's like after the
fact, but like, because it's more of just a like I have to
take if I'm second, Like I just have to take what I think is
like the best. Then at that point I don't think it needs if we
were trying to go for if you want to see who we can build the
better team, I will go. I don't because I don't want to think
about positions at all. No, I didn't when I made like my board,
so neither all right, If I'm going first, then let's just start
this. I have to take ween Binyama and justify the ship out of that
one because that's so controversial. No, I've it kind of should be because
like he hasn't played yet, so like there's at least as a baseline issue,
like that's a real thing, and because we're gonna talk about that more
later as we you know, as we get farther into it, it's like,
how do you weigh just I don't think either of us is gonna take
Anthony Black, but like, how do you weigh Anthony Black? Who has
who has well, I don't know, maybe you are, I'm not who
hasn't played at all, versus like someone who's twenty three and is just just
does not have an all star ceiling, Like how do you you know,
how do you make that? Anyway, it's when Banyama, if any of
the if like eighty percent of the hype is legit, I think it's a
totally defensible pick. I maybe he don't even need to defend it, and
like, would you have taken him first if it were your pick? Yeah,
he was. It wasn't begging. By the way, if anyone's watching
my new setup does not really allow me to type on my screen, so
I'm putting it into my phone to keep track of the picks and hopefully the
time stamps as well. So Grant, I'm not ignoring you. It's just
it's for the sake of the final product. How would it not be Wemby.
It's like I said to you, and I said it to actually Katie
because we took Katie hin No, because we talked about Victor weman Yama briefly.
I only saw his bad Summer League game, and I came away thinking
he's gonna be one of the greatest players of all time, and so why
would you not take He's just starting out. And look, I know you're
saying he hasn't played yet, but like the stuff he does on defense is
going to translate immediately, and even if you're worried about the offense, like
it happens. I feel like sometimes we skew too far, you know,
how we romanticize rebuilds, but at the same time, like we just assume
that rookies need to have this steep learning curve. Sometimes rookies come in even
post Tim Duncan, where they're not these seasoned products. They come in and
they're just amazing. Why can't that be him? I think I think the
argument against whim ban Yama, if you had to make one, is just
we're talking about entire careers, and like the injury risk, given his like
unprecedented physical profile is there, and just guys that are anywhere near his size
tend to not last very long, so that would be it'd just be a
risk, a risk, like aversion argument. Right, It's like, well,
he might not get more than like six or seven good years, and
who knows, like how many of those will come in a row, whereas
some other guys that we're going to talk about, you know, project to
be good for a dozen years uninterrupted potentially, just because the injury risk is
lower. But like, if we're gonna start thinking about injuries, that's gonna
make this much more complicated, right, And it's like, I mean,
well, I did think about injuries with respect to one player who I think
when I did this exercise. It's kind of just like, wow, he
really still is twenty three? Yeah, and I'm sure everyone knows what we're
talking about now. I'm curious as too, so I guess we want to
move on to number two. I think this I can't. It's just it's
Wemby. I think he's going to be If I set the over under right
now on Victor Weman Yama, all NBA teams at eleven o five, are
you taking me? I would take the over. That's so many I guess
I'd go under, just betting on health or betting against health. But I
would feel terrible. I feel like a terrible person for doing that. He
wasn't good. All right, you gotta pick make your you gotta pick number
two here because I'm wondering if this is gonna surprise like this immediately got harder
effort to Yama. For me, I am going with Anthony Edwards. I
am just we can talk like the defensive disruption. He's gotten better on that
end. He's come such a long way as an offensive player when you're looking
at his playmaking ability, and then also he shot thirty eight plus percent on
step back threes last year, so there's still gonna be some just junkie attempts
when you're looking at what he does off the dribble, like he's eventually going
to be probably one of them, I would think one of the most dangerous
off the dribble. Shooters in the league. The rim pressure he could already
put on throws the defense into chaos. And even if you don't trust just
him being more than just this thirty six percent or whatever three point shooter,
long term, he's gonna be fine. Like we've seen that he can hit
the spot up jumper element and to know that this is someone I wouldn't predict
it, but I think in any given season, this is someone that could
just make an all defense team while also being the driving force of a really
good offense. I'm honestly surprised. I guess when you're when you're talking about
the immediacy of it, because we're doing this for the rest of their careers,
and we've also weeded out players like Yokichen Yannis when you're talking about and
we did this exercise for over the next five years for Bleacher Report, an
Age was just thrown out of the equation. I feel like he gets he
tumbles down that list because of some of the players that we know about,
right really so. But I'm also just kind of wondering, why is he
not being talked about as the second best building block in the NBA. Like,
even if you go into under twenty five territory. All right, I
guess Luca don Chich is still there, so I like it, does it
feel like his and I know he just got the max extension. Does it
feel like his mega stardom or potential for it has flown under the radar a
little bit? Or am I just trying to romanticize my own my own genius?
Well, first of all, that is the correct pick. That was
the only other guy I considered taking first, and I did actually for a
minute there think about should I just take this guy and begin I know he's
gonna be good, I don't know. I don't know, Like I feel
like he's probably thought of. He's not a he's not thought of on the
Jannie Yokich, Luca whatever other whatever other guys we had in our top five
level would be. But that's because like, as we're recording this, he's
twenty one. He's for like three more days, but still like he's gonna
be twenty. This is an age twenty two season coming up, And as
I was comparing him to some other guys further down the list, it was
just like, well, what was that guy doing in his age twenty one
season? And almost across the board is like not what Edwards did last year.
So just you get both with him because he's been an All Star,
he's already proven to be a really good playoff, like level upper type of
guy, and he's got the youth still, like he's on the younger side
of most of the guys were gonna pick, So you kind of get it
both ways with him. I think there's a good he's also the only other
guy on this list, and I want to make sure I'm not maybe there's
one or two others that you're like, Oh, in twenty twenty six,
this guyon was MVP. It's like, well, ween, be sure,
but Edwards is. I think if you had to pick another guy from this
list, it'd probably be him. So upside established level of performance, we
all care more about the playoffs in the regular season, or at least like
that's increasingly how we're evaluating players. If you're if you care about like doing
it right, I think in my opinion, so he's just like, he's
obviously the number two guy. I think I think there's a better argument for
him as number one than there is for him falling to three. How about
that? Oh? I like that? And also you mentioned this. When's
the last time we just saw someone right away? It's just this good in
the playoffs, Like he's just able to turn on I guess, Luca,
is that like coming into the league and I'm trying to think of like the
last player that was like that and Edwards is I'm dodging your question because I
don't know who else to throw in that in that group. But like Edwards
has the added bonus of, like you said, not only is he a
guy that is scoring average goes up in the playoffs, he just is better.
Like he's also the guy that, Okay, I don't know, we're
playing the Celtics or whatever, it's like, go get Tatum, like you
like Edwards is gonna be I mean, he has Jade McDaniels on his team,
but he's I think capable of changing a game defensively too, which is
like a wild thing for your your leading scorer and just the guy who's gonna
be on the ball the most. So yeah, we love, we love
Edwards. That's the correct pick. I hate this next pick because I have
like four five guys in the same tier and because I had a just wemby
Edwards and then it's like a mash of dudes. So I don't think there's
any chance I'm going to take your guy and I'm gonna pick from three or
four guys here. Please, dude, there's this way too early for challenge
Williams, do not do it. I think I'm gonna take Scoot. I
feel like that is controversial and cuts against my when I professed that I cared
about established track record. I just think I think he's the best point guard
prospect we've seen in the draft in a really long time, and I would
include guys like Jaw and some other players that we've had really high in the
lottery. I think I think he has a chance to be like Chris paul
Ish with like way more athleticism and size and all that stuff, and so
like, I just kind of want to get on board for that. So
I again, there were like four other guys I like agonized over, but
I think I'm going Scoop just because I don't really see one how he fails
like athletically, and I don't see how he fails in terms of how he
sees like the intellectual part of the game. So I just think I think
his floor is really high. And then as I've already said I think his
ceiling is like he's gonna be regarded as the best point guard prospect and like
you just decide how many years it is a long time? Is that a
ridiculous pick? Was he in the running for you? There? He was
number five for me? So just like, yeah, I don't I'm I
don't know why I'm like looing and eyeing. I just I feel like,
you know what it is, guys, Grant just scouted the twenty twenty three
drafts where he's just taking all of those guys because there's so fresh. But
I just I came away. I watched I didn't watch his low in summer
league performance live. I watched every single possession, so all like eight of
them or whatever. I just came away. I was like, oh,
holy fuck, Yeah like this, so I'm with you that he's going to
be that transcendent. I thought it a little bit. You know, we
need I want to know what he's going to be on defense. I want
to know what the off the dribble jumper looks like. And because I believe
wemen Yama just going to have that transcendent impact on the defensive and I wasn't
able to put Scoot as high. But he was when I was making like
the list for number two and even number three, anthy Edwards springing to mind
immediately. I didn't give him. I will say I didn't consider Edwards over
Wemby, but I considered like Henderson in that kind of same tier. And
though I totally understand that pick, and I'm curious as to whether you know
if we went back and revisited this in a year, the context of the
Blazers, I think is gonna like, are we gonna be able to see
him have full agency right away depending on what happens with the Dame stuff or
even playing just with Simons and they're sharp is there and you want to see
those two play together. So this might be a slower burn than some than
a Wemby, But I firmly believe like this is a not just an all
NBA type, like an MVP level type talent that the Blazers just got.
Yeah, if he doesn't make all NBA teams, I mean, and we
always talk about how stacked the guard position is, but like I think the
expectations should be by like year three, he should be very much in the
running for all NBA, and like even year two, we're like talking about
him as a fringe All Star assuming the Blazers are any good. That's that's
the other variable here is like depending on you know, they're they're a ways
away if Dame is gone, and then you're like you're entrusting a ton of
shot creation and running the offense responsibilities to like Scoot and Shade and Sharp who's
like painfully young. Still there's just it maybe a while before the Blazers are
good unless and this is like the Chris Paul effect right away when Chris Paul's
on your team, no matter how young he is, like, oh you're
good now, like the offense works. Scoot might be that guy we'll see
For number four, I'm going to take the player who is in my number
three spot, but I gave a lot of thought to this one. This
one was tough. I'm going with Evan Mobley, who I had him as
my Defensive Player of the Year pick this year, which runs counter two.
I'm just gonna troll this person again because they've always been super condescending in our
mentions, called me a careerist who just follows the pack with my opinions,
while complimenting someone else, like they called Adam frommel the co host basically,
which is I know they listen because they've complimented the podcast too before, but
they call me a careerist, just so condescending. Stop listening. We don't
we don't need you here if like you're gonna approach it with that condescension and
you're not the arbiter of like what just because any analytic that makes James Harden
look good you view as gospel. That's my little rant right there. It's
there on defense, and I know that the Calves have had some trouble with
lineups when it comes to rebounding. When he is the five, I don't
think he one needs to be your five, But I also think the context
of his role can change if you also don't need him to be like your
best wing defender, because having Jared down behind you one, you want those
two to play together, You're gonna float more around the perimeter. He's still,
by the metrics, going to be one of the most value well rim
protectors in the league. And that's all that is not being his primary responsibility.
I'm so sold on the defense. The offense, it does take more
vision they're not working with the They weren't working with the best base in Cleveland
last year. He has two ball dominant guards. There's the whole. They're
not trying to occupy the same space, but like they want to finish from
the same places for Mobile and Jared Allen. But when I look at what
he could do if you gave him touches from the elbows or above the keys,
from those standstills like he has, it's not just oh, he can
spot guys who are moving around and dime them up. It's no. He
could put the ball on the floor and he might not have like the methodical
control that a lot of other guys do, but he can make things happen
from those standstill positions. I'm more sold on the two, and I think
they need to do a better job of getting to this is. Let's ramp
up the pace, have him do a bunch of grab and ghost stuff in
the vein of a let's say Bam out of Baio or even a Janis Attenta
Kompo, and he can do all that. And so it comes down to
do you think what would be the absence of do you trust him developing a
mid range jumper or set three pointer. I honestly don't know. I just
don't think he needs one to be so absolutely dominant. And the fact that
I already felt comfortable enough calling him my defensive player of the Year, it
was just like, how do I not put him? He was number three
on my board? And that's the offensive concerns. I get it, but
I feel like we have to imagine as part of this exercise for me,
Okay, well, what would he look like if he had more agency,
more runway within the offense. And I think that there's a chance that he
can be not as impactfully is on defense, but like a similar like he
can be an offensive star, is what I would say. It's interesting I
had him, I had Mobile high. I love Mobile. He was not
quite as high as you, I think because you're asking, well, as
Anthony Edwards, someone that we maybe don't like rightfully put in a high enough
tier. I think I think that really applies to Mobile because and that's why
this upcoming season for him, he's gonna be one of my most I'm gonna
be most interested in what this year brings for him because the most recent memory
of him is really kind of one of failure, right because like he did
have and like that's fine at this age. You can't be great at everything.
But I think the takeaway from that Nick series is like, oh,
this guy has like a couple of things that are pretty important to you know,
maximizing his value that he's not that great at yet. And you know
it's a small sample, it's the playoffs, but like that's kind of what
the postseason is for, is to show guys like, here's where you gotta
maybe supplement your game a little bit. And for Mobile, like there can
be no question what he needs to improve on. And so I'm fascinated if
we see just you know, he shows up in October and he can you
know, he can finish through contact a little better, he can make like
a split second quicker decisions as a role guy, or just like or just
like, god forbid, if this guy, you know, becomes a semi
reliable three point shooter, then it's like it's over. Like so that's all
to say. I think he is like uniquely positioned to prove all the hype
coming across the last two years about this guy's potentially Kevin Garnett, you know
that kind of thing like this to me coming This year coming up is the
year where we'll see, right, I think, or we'll get a really
good idea of of is he able to sort of address you know what he
doesn't do well because others. But and if he doesn't, he's still a
guy that's going to be defensive Player of the Year candidate every year for ten
years basically, So it's solid pick. I still am in this cluster of
guys. I'm gonna go the complete opposite direction because Scoot was a very unsafe
pick for me as my second player. I'm gonna take Tyrese Haliburton. I
doubt very much that you had him this high. There are all the point
guards. He was four. It was between him and Mobli for three is
what I was struggling with that he's four. For me, we have way
too much group think between the two of us. Uh, we're careerists.
Want us we're careerists. But you know, I still I don't know how
many times I included it in an article I wrote this year talking about Haliburton,
But just the twenty percent from three, it's just like basically unprecedented.
I think it was unprecedented in NBA history, especially if you for a guy
as young as him. He's just like he's a great shooter, he's a
great decision maker. He understands how to make people better. He's really young.
I think he's in a position to succeed with this Pacers team specifically and
how they play. So it's kind of a boring pick, I guess because
of some of the guys that are still on the board. But I just
feel like Haliburton is is as good of a young point guard as there is
in the league right now, and I don't think he's anywhere close to topping
out. I still think people don't appreciate him as a shot creator and maker,
where they might view him as this fantastic passer. And it's does he
have the ability to generate his old looks at multiple levels in the vein of
all these other elite players that you would pick before more he about you know,
a scoot or thinking about a even just like having the ability to like
a Steph Curry, Like you know, he's not the same ball handler,
but like is he that type of a score? And the answer is just
yes to me, And so he still feels not that he's flown under the
radar, But I still don't think that people understand how high end his ceiling
is. To where should he be mentioned in the same breath as Evan Mobley
And then the answer is absolutely he should be. I think this is there's
no way to mention, like measure this accurately. But he's probably like has
the highest basketball IQ of anybody that we're gonna think about here, Like I
think just in terms of like to your point, he's not someone that is
not like an A plus running jump athlete, but he gets the spots,
and he when he is in those spots, he understands like the decision tree.
I think he reads the decision tree of offensive basketball like faster than probably
anybody else we're going to talk about, which is hard to measure, but
I don't know whatever Pacers fans are here, like, please testify to this,
because he just understands where the ball needs to go and win it needs
to get there. And that's just a pretty singular skill for especially for a
guy as young as he is. Where do you land on kind of him
defensively, like did that factor in it all? For you? Better off
the ball than on it, which which I don't know that he has,
Like the frame to really be a great on ball defender. I think he's
going to be someone that as the years go by, he'll just be a
right place, right time type of guy that does reasonably well with his physical
tools to like, you know, maybe we'll get to a point where he's
not getting pick and roll to death and just forced into the action. Although,
like, because of his offensive responsibilities, is probably smart for teams to
just try to tire him out that way. I think he's going to top
out as like he's not gonna kill you, And I think if he's passable,
if he gets to like us, you know, Steph Curry was always
picked on forever, and I think Steph Curry is a perfectly adequate defender now.
And I think, you know, Haliburton probably has pretty similar you know,
run jump, lateral speed tools to Curry, but he's longer. So
I think I think you could get to a point where the offense is phenomenal
and the defense is something that does not get like relentlessly targeted or at least
not targeted effectively. So but I did have that thought. But the other
guys I was thinking about, especially Backcork guys, are also mostly bad defenders,
so that made this pick a little easier. So that brings me to
when are we up to number six? So I took and I'm curious where
you had this player. I'm rulling with Palo ben Caro at number six,
did not have him that high. He is to me, I think one,
let's start with him. I think it's perceived weaknesses would be the shooting.
In the defense. He was just not a liability on defense last year.
Maybe that's part of the magic infrastructure. But like he's going to be
just more I think switchy than people could. I don't know if he's ever
going to be a you know, an imposing rim protector or someone who you
want like going in you know, being on a complete island, but like
you can move him around as part of a team scheme to where no,
he's not on the lowest usage player, maybe he's on the third, like
the third best player on the team. Like that's like that's great. And
the fact that he could do it against No, it doesn't have to be
like kind of a pure big type guy, a slower guy. I think
that's big. And then the shooting, I just believe in it, like
there is I think it's gonna be quicker. He went through stretches last year
and there were pockets where he actually shot not on high volume, but really
well from three and the fact that he's comfortable like getting to his spots from
the in between range. What it comes down to for me is one,
I see the outline of what's going to be a terrific passer and to be
as a rookie. He had an assist rate over seventeen and a turnover rate
of under thirteen, which is just like it was around league average turnover rate.
That's great for a rookie. Had so much as usage was over twenty
five, that's huge. And then as a score, just the ability to
get to the basket, to kind of bully his way there, to play
with the combination of force and finess. I'm getting to the line. I
mean, if you look at all rookies who have scored more than twenty five
points per one hundred possessions while playing over fifteen hundred minutes and then sort them
by free throw attempts, there's David Robinson, Shack, Blake, Griffin,
Alonzo, Morning Michael Jordan, John Drew, and then Padalo ban Caro,
who's just ahead of Lu Luka don Chich and like, that's really fantastic company
as just as a rookie to be able to like have that many free throw
attempts. I think it'll be interesting to see how he adjusting year two where
who I don't know if you saw who recently said I think it was Tyrese
Haliberton, actually who you just picked said that year two is different because you
think you're gonna make all this progress, but teams have more film on you,
and so I'm very interesting to see what he adds to his game.
But I look at this guy and the player who I have on my board
after him, and a couple of players like I would have. I thought,
had you asked me like leading into last year, there was no way
that he would have usurped any of them. And it's just I came away
last year completely sold on Palo Bean Caro's entire package. And is this me
not having seen let's say, Kay cunning Ham played in a while, Is
there that effect? Okay? Maybe like there is, you know, I'm
a lot of this too, is like, okay, he had fifty three
true shooting as a rookie. I just I don't care when you're in the
first like two years of your career as much as I do if you're in
year four and it's a problem, and just the ability he's shown on offense,
I think this is someone who's absolutely going to be like a multi time
All NBA guy. Yeah, I think I did have Ben Carroll pretty high
too. I had like one or two more guys I was going to think
about ahead of him. But I think if you're coming at it from the
perspective of because there are a lot of these guys that are going to be
All Stars, they're all very good starters, some of them already. But
Ben Carroll I think probably is on that list of like his ceiling as like
the most important kind of player you can have, which is a primary shot
creator who can score and compromise as a defense, as like a big wing.
Like they're just like that's the thing that you want, right that is
that is the most prized possession in NBA basketball. And he's kind of the
only guy for a long while here that you could even really say like he
has a decent chance of becoming that. So I want to ask you,
because I have a hard time kind of envisioning like what the best version of
him looks like, is it like a more physical Jason Tatum? Is that
like two oversimplified of you know what I mean? Just like imagine ban Caro
maximizes, like what type of player because Tatum the knock was has long been
you know, his finishing package has developed but was never a strength and like
he doesn't really have a lot of craft around the basket. Ban Carro definitely
has that stuff. He doesn't have the like I'm creating a pull up three
out of nothing that Tatum does, but yeah, that's hard. The one
I gravitate towards a lot is just like a less explosive Blake Griffin who's better
on defense, and like, if he can get the level on his jumper
that Blake got to it, his absolute apex ends up being a huge deal.
But I don't know if I'm just viewing too much as I see them
as similar size and build, where Blake was definitely more chiseled. But we'll
see, how you know, pallet, they have like a similar strength profile,
it feels like, but I mean, like if you're looking at a
more physical, maybe interior Jason Tatum, like you're in pretty good shape.
I would be curious because I'm higher on Paalo Ben Carroll's defense. I don't
think he has that level of like Jayson Tatum, but offense specifically, that's
an interesting comp Yeah, okay, do you want to how we need to
one banner pace? We'll need to beat it up. But this is terrible.
I guess it's a good or terrible podcasting that you're like, we're six
picks in and the three picks that you have are all in my top six.
It's like my top six guys are just off the board. Now.
Well, I mean it'll I think it's gonna get pretty messy here as we
get further down the list, hopefully. Just for the record, I had
Mobili at eight, but in a tier with like all these guys I'm still
considering, So I'm still in my same stupid tier and bank Hara was like
nine, I think, and in a new tier. Okay, are you're
taking like Jalen Williams is like four or something like? What is happening here?
He might he might be in the next tier. I'm gonna take Jaw
and I feel really uneasy about it. I still just think I'm buying low
one and I'm taking him over somebody else in his draft class that I'm sure
you had higher. I think Jaw still if he gets the like whole,
like actual life side of being a professional athlete in order. The athletic talent
is like undeniable. He's been on highly successful teams that have not made it
as far as you would hope in the playoffs at a really young age.
I think it's not It wasn't that long ago. You know, the first
month, six weeks of twenty two twenty three where his three was falling and
it was like, well, this is a top five MVP player. That
was the conversation at the time. The shot is we'll see I think mechanically,
I don't know if I believe it's ever gonna be. You have to
be all the way out on jow because he's gonna make thirty eight percent of
like eight attempts a game. I doubt it. I think as long as
his athleticism holds up, which I think is believable, you know, for
three, four or five more years, I think he could potentially be all
NBA. I just love a lead ball handler that can just break the defense,
and he's that. And I there's another guard that is way safer that
I did not take over him that is still on the board. But I
wanted I just I couldn't. I couldn't look at the name there and not
pick him. You didn't have job this high. I could tell by your
face. Yeah, I'm like wow. I just so I wanted him so
badly to be twenty four because he's about the third twenty four to a few
days I had him thirteen, So it wasn't like incredibly low seven versus he's
going seven versus where did you have him on your board specifically five? So
it's like there's a I just I don't know when we're talking about the rest
of the career, I haven't seen anything that makes me think his game is
going to age super well. No, it's not, it's definitely not.
I'm just and like you said, like we saw the three point shot fall
for a little bit, but I don't know, just is he gonna be
able to get to his floater, let's say, if he doesn't have the
same odd ball juice as he gets older, and so that would be like
my main question with him, in addition to the the off court stuff you
have to factor in as well. But the talent. The talent right now
is unquestionable for sure. I mean he's made an All NBA team. I
forgot about that. I mean not last year, but the year before.
No, I mean I acknowledge all the risks. I definitely this is a
pure another upside play. I think even though like there's yeah, the red
flags are all over the place. But did you take the safe point guard
that I did not take with your next pick? No? I took the
well I guess is he could be consider a point guard. I'm swinging for
the fences here and we're going with Zion Williamson. The rest of his career
is is terrifying. I want to make that clear. We just watched him
be a top ten player in the league for what was the best or second
best team in the West, the Pelicans, at the second best point differential
in the West. To close out twenty twenty two, you put the ball
in his hands. It doesn't matter that he's like kind of a one level
score. He's just going to make things happen. He's improved his passing.
I thought his defense got a little bit better before he was injured. The
entire point of this thing is to find the guy who could be the best
player on a championship team. To find the guy who can just be a
top ten, top five player at their absolute peak, I will roll the
dice on his health. And I thought about, like, you know,
having Kaid Cunningham here as like, because I mean I remained very high on
Kaide. But my other thing is just like, well, kid Cunningham asked
that, like you had the best availability to start his career, and so
at least we have the track record of Okay, Zion is this dominant force,
and it's like what if Shack had wheels basically, and like, no,
he's not the defensive player Shack was, but like offensively my god.
And so to Kake in the fact that he should get better, he's twenty
three, Like, it's not this is not the the peak. It's certainly
not the peak of his availability. Hopefully this pick has if we go through
another season where he appears in like twenty nine games or thirty four games or
something stupid, this it probably it might look bad to some people. Now,
I don't know where you had him on your board, but the talent
is just like you can't question it, Like it's it's more proven than me
go I went with Mobili at three. The Zion dominance relative to the rest
of the league is more proven than that. I just I think I'll acknowledge
that, like, there is absolutely the possibility that he just does for a
full year what he's done in his abbreviated stints, and then he probably should
be number two or three or something in this in this redraft if that were
to happen to me, I actually think it's more likely that in terms like
would let me ask you this, would you agree that as much or maybe
more than anyone on this list, you probably would throw Jaw in there.
He is dependent on athleticism to be successful, right, I mean I think,
I think, I mean, if you disagree, I think you know,
I'm open to it. But I just think, and I also think
we've seen the best of Zion the athlete, and it was like at Duke,
and it has gotten worse progressively. So that that as much as the
chronic unavailability, which is related obviously because it's health and you know, injury
stuff, that was what made him feel too risky for me, is like,
not only is there he might play twenty five games a season, and
definitely there's also the like if he just isn't as quick or as able to
elevate, he just is a different player, Like it becomes a lot.
So I don't know if that's gonna happen. I think there's a good chance
that like athletically, he just isn't gonna be as good as he was as
a college player or as a rookie. Like I just kind of feel like
if I don't know, just you watch him. Even when he was really
great, he still wasn't the same as as he was in college, just
athletically, I'm talking running, jumping. But it's that good that he's less
athletic and still so dominant. Well maybe, yeah, I don't know.
Anyway, that's what gave me pause. I think, and look, that's
fair, and it might point to an inconsistency and just how I view him
versus job because I daw thirteen. I think he ended up. I actually
made him. He jumped a shark. I had him at number eight,
but I'm taking him like there's one person who I had in front of him,
but I actually just decided to take him over. Now, Yeah,
so he picked with your heart. Yeah, And I just think, look,
I think that's a fair criticism. I'm just we're talking about the rest
of their careers. But if you like told me that you could have the
rest of Zion's prime versus the rest of John Morant's prime, I'm going to
take Zion over that. I think the criticism might be, well, should
you be taking him before some of these other players that were about to get
into Yeah? Right. I think for both of those guys, like,
it's not like Jaws like immune. I mean, John misses tons of time
every year, and it's not always for like off court stuff. My boring
point guard is still there. I'm not going to take him because even though
he's the highest guy left on my list, I'm gonna take Jaren Jackson Junior
and just squeak this in under the wire because he has like forty more days
as a twenty three year old. I actually had him a spot ahead of
Evan Mobile because Jaren Jackson Junior has one defensive player of the Year. I
don't know how justified that was, but it matters. That's on the board
ref home cooking with blocks. Yeah, how dare you? I think the
difference for me is like if you were the things you hope Evan Mobley ends
up being able to do or at least a few of them. On offense,
Jackson already does. He shot thirty five percent on pretty good volume from
three last year, and that's just like a cheat code because and he can
run. He's like not just a stand sill guy. You they run him
off screen sometimes. So the defensive value to me, like fled the league
in blocks per game two years in a row. Just an elite interior defender
who can move. And if he can continue to like not alternate good and
bad shooting years and just be someone that hits thirty hits league average on decent
volume from three, I think that's just like that's such a unique that is
a unique player. So I love the defense. I can't take another tiny
guard because I have a bunch already. I know, I know, I
know, I just from my own enjoyment of this draft. I can't have
like six point guards. That's boring. I know, I know we're not
going to play a real game with these teams. I was surprised. I
guess I'm not surprised that he lasted because you took Mobiley totally justifiable. But
I love Jaren Jackson. So now I have I have forty percent of the
Grizzlies starting five. I don't feel great about it. Yeah, I'm laughing
at the like valuating this through, Well, it makes sense you didn't take
triple Jay because you have Evan Moobia. That's I just don't know what,
like how sustainable is his offensive peak and like how dependent is he long term
on like everyone else? And I think we saw flashes and maybe extended pockets
this year where where he wasn't and he has some of the health issues.
But again this is coming from someone who picks I on the defensive values just
it's spoken for, like even the three point percentage when it slumps, the
volume is huge. And so I actually had him number eleven. It's like
we're not that far off ninth pick. This was number nine yea, so
it's reasonable. I'm so I'm in an interesting spot at number ten because like
I feel like, do I go with my what is the safe pick?
Or do I swing here? And I think I'm gonna swing. I want
to be true to my brand and someone that I would have taken with the
last pick if I held drew to my board, which I didn't. I'm
going kid cutting him the efficiency has not caught up to yes aesthetics. He
was injured for most of last season, but I think we kind of forgot,
like how good he was as a rookie, just the look and feel
of him, and now that this team can give him. I know there's
some complications with Jay and Ivy and a star Thompson there, like you can
between Babodanovitch and Alec Burks, and now Monte Morris is there, Joe Harris
is there. You could really build some heavy space spacing lineups if you say,
hey, Thompson and Ivy are on the bench cutting him during three shooters.
I think that's when we'll really get to see what he's made of.
There is a real intuition when he has the ball in his hands and he's
able to set up for his teammates. I believe that the jumper, the
efficiency on offense is going to come along when you look at kind of the
form and again just the equal librium with which he operates on ball, and
I think this is something that's just gonna hit. Looks off the ball like
you need him to have a set three. Okay, maybe he's never like
a pull up jump shooter. Fine, he doesn't need to be. And
I kind of feel like the conversation with him, a lot of times you
talk about like how valuable these bigger point guards are. Kake Cunningham is that
dude, like the six eight point guard who could run your entire offense and
who quite frankly, you know everyone was This is not to compare the two.
He's only starting out in his career, but everyone's excited about the Anthony
Black experience for what he could do. And it's like, well, Kate
Cunningham is not as poor of a like a non level, non multi level
score as as Anthony Black really is at this stage in his career. And
just like, yeah, he doesn't stand out on defense when you look at
who he's matched up against and what he's gonna do on the ball, But
just like, this is not Luca don Che either, and like Lucy Donte
isn't always going to be the worst defensive liability because of his size, and
like Kate Cunningham is way more mobile and more malleable on the defensive end.
And so I don't know what your and that's what I want to ask you,
is like, what is your biggest concern with him? That would I
don't know where you had him, but that would have you displace him from
this spot. I'm taking a swing here because I believe in the aesthetics of
his game that we saw really as a rookie, because we didn't really see
him as a sophomore. Yeah, I have I had him thirteen, so
and you took him ten. I think so very much. And he's in
the same tier as like three other guys. Do you wonder where I had
him initially? Where initially he winds up being eight, but I had him
seven because I end up having his eye on leap program. So I think
my concerns obviously the health is an issue issue, but like that's whatever.
I think. He feels to me a little so far, a little more
like a guy that is definitely at home on a really good team, but
probably not as its best player. And that's like that feels like a knock,
which it shouldn't be because it's like, well, you know, everybody
made the Chris Middleton comp which is kind of off base because I think Kate
already can do so much more with the ball than Middleton could, like at
his peak. Probably maybe that's unfair. But while I would trust Cunningham two
of like being more of every level score, where Chris Middleton felt like the
two level for the most part. I think that's fair. So that's I
guess that's that's my main reservation is like, I'm still trying to find guys
that are and we're kind of out of them really and almost actually definitely are
out of him. Just looking at my list, which right, by the
way, I'm so analog and I have this written down on paper. Do
you are Do you respect that or do you hate that? I respect that.
I was when I was just talking to Katie Heidel, She's saying she
still writes stuff like when she's doing stories, like she will write things on
paper if she has like writer's block there. Oh wow, respect Yeah,
No, that's that's my only reservation about Kade is that. But like,
I mean, I had him right in the same range that you took him.
I'm upset that he's off the board because I feel like any of the
other guys I'm thinking about right now are going to be subject to criticism.
But I have to trust my board, and I'm gonna take Darius Garland.
I was that's the one who I've been grappling over for the next two picks.
It's not like a pick right, that's my safe point guard. I've
been referencing forever. I was trying to figure out. I was, like
he said, talking about kay No. I mean, so he's a forty
percent three points, like thirty eight points something for his career, was forty
one last year. Is just gonna be like a really good primary shot creator
who has massive value off the ball because he can just he makes shots.
He's small, like that is the best. That is the most applicable criticism
for him, and small point guards just some unless you're just you know,
like we've talked about Chris Paul. Unless you're prime Chris Paul, it's really
tough for you know, the six foot ish point guard to see all the
passing angles to be able to make all the passes you need to make.
But he still is a big assist guy, like you know, he's gonna
be in seven eight nine per game, guy that takes care of the ball.
So he's just like he's really good. He's twenty three. He does
everything you want a point guard to do, and with the added bonus of,
you know, if you have someone like Donovan Mitchell, who's like the
best pick and roll operator. All of a sudden in the league, you
can put Garland off the ball and there's no value lost because you cannot ever
leave him alone. So I think I think he's safe. He's kind of
boring, but he's just he's I think he's just better than everybody else we
have left, unless you're just taking swings on upside guys, which I think
it's probably almost time to start doing that. Which I think he's the right
pick, and he probably just looking at who already went. I feel like
he should have went earlier. Even I was taken him over John Morant without
question. He's in the same tier. I could have taken him over Job
for sure. Like they're just they're right next to each other. I originally
had him at ten and so like I had picked number ten and didn't take
him because I still had Who's I just take already forgot? Oh? Kay
was like, but I was struggling between Kaye and Darius Garland there. Number
eleven is still pretty high in this exercise though, like to be like with
this pool of players. He like he said, I don't think he's boring,
but I do think he's safe. I do kind of view him though,
as higher upside than a Jaren Jackson junior, and I guess more of
a complete player than a job Morant. Yeah, I think it depends,
like I think Jaws the upside play Jackson is like, you know, I
don't know. I think probably just with Mobile off the board, even though
again, I know we're not building a team. It's like somebody's got to
play defense. I just I value the defense. Yeah, I'm really curious
to see who you take next, though, because I'm just like, I
don't it could be any of like seven guys for me, I don't know.
It's not it's not that I don't. So I'm gonna take a swing.
This is what this is why we're here's it takes swings. Cat Holmgren,
come on down. Can I tell you right now? Sorry? Sorry,
I was gonna guess. I was gonna guess you're taking Chet right at
the spot. I swear to God, Go okay, go ahead. By
the way, he was, I initially had him ahead of Oh no,
he was at number nine, So I don't think he was ahead of anyone
that I took yet, or maybe he was, but I'm just like this
dude is he's what I got from him in Summer League is the biggest question
was can he play center? And you watch him, it's like, no,
he should play center. It's not play center. It should he play
center? Yet there's a luxury if you want to play him with Jalen Williams
as your front court. Okay, fine, if you wanted to have a
Brook Lopez on this team or go out and get another big, but like
it's almost that he makes more senses if you wanted to go trade for Pascal
Siakam. Now where you don't want Pascal Siakam to be your five. You
don't need him to be because you're chet Homegren. But he can also play
the four. I the two things we know what he's gonna do as a
floor well, we don't know what we're gonna do, but I think everyone
is gravitates towards these bigs who are floor spacing rim protectors. The two things
that actually are just like swing developments that I think are not even developments at
this point, but maybe certified fringe givens. Certified for fringe givens. How's
that for equivocating but not a shirt. There's a floor game to him,
and I don't think it needs to just be one that's in open space,
like there could be eventually more directionality there and then this is not just a
rim protector on the defensive end. This is like in a racer of Worlds.
Yeah, I think, and I could see him having like a higher
defensive impact than Evan Mobley as like a true big to where I think you
probably trust Evan Mobley is more of the Okay, if you need him to
be your primary winning defender, that's Evan Mobley comprehensive. There's a chance that
chet Homegrin is more dominant on defensive that's just me where it's like Rudy Gobert
one defensive player of the year because he was so dominant in these one or
two areas versus other players who might have been more complete packages let's call them.
It's a swing. We have not seen him play, and it's not
on the level of Wemby just because there are He's not a self sustaining on
offense at his absolute zenith. We know that, but let's just make the
swing. I mean, it's what we're drafting for the rest of their careers
here, and so I have to go. I have to go. I
don't have to go, but I'm gonna go with Chet. You said Mobley
as a camp like I think, and makes me wish I had just picked
him. It could be better than Jaren Jackson in like two years, Like
that's not ridiculous at all in terms of overall value, because he could be
as good or better defensively and just as as like in terms of ball skills,
he's probably already not probably, I think he is better than Jaren Jackson
in terms of like bring the ball up the floor once in a while or
just get in a triple threat position and beat a guy like to that that.
I think Chet probably is already or certainly projects to be a lot better
at that stuff. But yeah, great pick. I have no qualms with
that one. I hate, though, that you keep leaving me with guys
I don't want to take, And so why would you want to take these?
I don't understand because I wanted to take Chet there, and I just
feel like you're going through all these like these players are all exceptional grass.
I'm gonna take LaMelo, and I want to see before I defended what you
think about that pick, because I feel very uncomfortable with it. I get
why you feel uncomfortable. It's spot on because he's number fourteen on my board
and you're taking him with a thirteenth pick. So I was thinking about this
the other day. I don't think this is likely to happen, but I
love the theory of LaMelo is actually just like the floor for LaMelo could be
like a better Lonzo, which is like cheap and like lazy because they're brothers.
But I think somewhere in there, somewhere in there, LaMelo could be
like a luxury like premium connector as like a passer, and he can be
a good spot up three point shooter. I think he can be a good
defender because he's even bigger than Lonzo, Like he's just wired to play differently
though, like he's gonna be and on the ball, you don't you don't
maxim out if you're not going to have him be your primary pick and roll
operator all this other stuff. I think the other thing that favors LaMelo in
addition to like there's a lot of different routes his career could take that all
have high floors, is that like Charlotte just isn't so has not so far
been this will shock you a great developmental environment for him, and I think
he would really benefit from playing in games worth higher stakes. And I don't
know how you factor that into like how good is the player actually, but
I think he's better than he's been given an opportunity to show if you had
better players around him in the games mattered more. I don't know, obviously,
the knocks are there, Like I don't know he's ever going to be
a good finisher. I don't know if he's ever going to try consistently on
defense. But he's been an all star. He's he was a guy that
really drove success relatively speaking for the you know, the best Hornets team of
the last whatever three years. And I just I think, like the size
and the multiple offensive skills are just like, you know, he could have
a better career than Kaide, right, Like there's no question, Like so
I think just given that, I gotta take him here because you know,
if we're going upside and ceiling, he's still he's still got plenty of it.
Yeah, the only pause for me with him is I want to know
if he's ever gonna become stronger and a better finisher, just to add that
level to his game. And I'm actually not as worried with the defense.
I think if we would have gotten a chance to see him a full season
under Steve Clifford, that there would have just been appreciable progress. Yeah.
There, I think he can get better there. I totally agree, though,
Like I just don't know if he's has the type of athleticism that's ever
gonna make him a good finisher. And you know, in a congested paint
like he's, he's gonna have to be a floater guy. He's gonna have
to be someone that figures out how to maximize, Like you know, he's
he's like a big wing basically playing point guard. So there are like workarounds
for him. But he's never gonna just rise up and jump over guys or
blow pass. He's got to sort of figure that stuff out. Yeah,
Okay, glad. I'm glad that wasn't a ridiculous selection. I'm curious to
and I think the fan base will actually think this is too low for him
relative to who's taken. I don't think it is. I think you might
think it's a tad too high. I'm going with Franz Wagner. He's just
he's better on defense. He just doesn't receive any attention for his defense.
And this is someone who is like an actual, like capable on ball defender
already, and this is nothing of his offense, which is not only infinitely
scalable, a term that I used to coin John Collins when he was good
back in the day, back in the day, when John Collins is good,
who I still was finite for him. But there's like he can really
put the ball on the floor and this year the flashes of the off the
dribble jumper in addition to being able to just attack the basket and set defenses
with the ball on his hands. I'm just like, there was part of
me when I went through this and the answer was no, I want to.
I was say, is there a chance that he just ends up having
the better career than Palo Bank Caro? And I couldn't get there because of
Palo Bank Carroll's ability to get to the line and even to just like the
way that he can just bulldoze over people. And there's just angles he uses
that I think are gonna put him ahead of Franz Wagner eventually. If not,
you know, immediately next season, he might already be there just as
a level of facilitator, but he isn't. I don't want to keep saying
that these players are underrated, but I don't think he's mentioned among the best
building walks in the NBA nearly enough. And I know Orlando Magic fans know
how good he is. I know basketball sickos know how good he is in
general, But like, this is what we're talking about, the best twenty
three and under players, And like if we were to think about where he
would go if we were only using they have to be going to their age
twenty three or under season, Like a couple of these guys would have come
off the list. He has like a case to be firmly inside the top
ten. I think he's a really hard player to evaluate because like what he
was on arrival was not at all like what he was projected to be.
Because I'm going back to draft night and doing some of the lead up,
you know, studies of that draft, I feel like he was someone that
like, yeah, he's gonna make open threes and you know he'll be in
the right place defensively. I just really don't know how much like off the
dribble stuff he's gonna be able to do attacking the basket, I'm not sure
limited, Like he's just that's I think like getting to the basket with his
like eurostep game is one of his defining skills. Now, just being able
to create shots for himself at close range is one of the things that makes
him so great. And yeah, like he's a good enough spot up shooter
and he's a way better passer than anybody I think thought he would be,
So that makes me sort of want to like reel in any He's just a
tricky guy to evaluate because we're starting, we've just basically had our baseline expectations
flipped because he was supposed to be X and he's very much wide. So
yeah, now it's like, well, I don't know, I don't know
what to think of his ceiling because he wasn't supposed to have any of these
skills to begin with, right, So I think it's probably a credit to
him and makes it easier to be optimistic because he either developed these skills quickly
because he knew he needed him, or he just has always had way more
in his bag than anybody expected. So I love that pick. Remember more
of the concerns too, was can he play more than just a four at
the NBA level. It's like he could play it too. Yeah, he's
like at two to four whatever you need him to be. He's a big
wing that can do everything. Like, oh, that's where did you have
him on your board? If I had him, I think fifteen or sixteen,
So we're like, like we haven't been aside from I guess Jaw was
the biggest discrepancy. I had him at thirteen. You had him in I
think Mobley was a big It was a big ish one because I had him
at eight, pretty similar to the Jaw one. Though, all right,
is it time to do it? I'm excited. Is it time to take
Jalen Williams. Oh uh, I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna take I
had him at seventeen. Yeah, I'm gonna do it. I had him,
I had him at like twelve, so it's past it's past time.
I don't know. I think all the criticisms are like the concerns that were
there forgetting like better players frankly like Cade or even like you know, someone
I think of as like a pretty comparable guy value wise, like Wagner,
it's like, is this guy the going to be the best player on a
really good team? Probably not, like almost definitely not. But I just
think you talk about scalability, I think that totally applies to Williams. He
can make shots off the ball. I mean the numbers don't bear that out.
Other than some hot stretches late in the year. He's really like I
talk about underrated, just like finishing craft and ability to use his strength already
to get to the basket and like beat contact. He contorts and finds these
weird angles with either hand, he goes off either foot. It's just all
these like this guy's a basketball player with like a bunch of like the real
niche skills that you gotta have. He's got the size, he's super long.
Defensively, I think he has a massive potential. I just like everything
I think he does, all the stuff I care about. Well, it's
just like he's not an a plus at anything, like you know, and
so he seems like another guy that he should show up on really good teams
indefinitely, like and just be the second or third best player. And maybe
is someone that you know has a great playoff series and is the best player
in a playoff series once or twice like that kind of that kind of thing
for me, Maybe maybe I'm selling him short to like the real Jill Williams
supporters, of which I consider myself one. But there are people that are
even higher on him than I am, so I love him. It's an
irrational pick, and I'll apologize for nothing. I guess it comes down to
just how much you believe, and because I don't think he's ever gonna be
He's a good enough three point shooter, but it's his level of shot creation
is very much going to be going downhill. It feels like, which is
he's incredibly dangerous at doing I want to make that clear, so I don't.
I mean, look, you took him at what pick was that number
fifteen? I've had at seventeen, so you might have like juiced him up
for me, like subconsciously, so I could have waited longer and gotten way
better value because you probably just I'm surprised that you even had him on your
bad I would have I would have made a big thing about it if he
was still there for like the seventeen pick or whatever it was. I'm curious
as to where you land on this one. I don't think a lot of
people are the analytics are going to hate it. I want to make that
clear. Can you guess who it is based off that it's Jalen Green and
he's next on my board? Yes, okay, oh wow? Nice?
So I'm just you watch him. He needs to learn how to slow down,
I get it. And he needs to learn like how to be more
under control when he's finishing he gets to the basket. This is someone who
can play away from the ball. He's going to be in every level score
And if you're concerned, is about the efficiency ticking up? Kind of look
at the level of difficulty, honest shots, Those are going to get simpler
now that Fred van Fleet is there, now that there should be lineups with
better spacing, now that it feels like there'll be a more coherent coaching approach
there. And I don't know what he's gonna do on defense. He's kind
he's listed at six six. He feels like he might be a little bit
smaller. He's playing with Fred van Fleet a bunch as opposed to Kevin Porter
jior a bunch like that's gonna do wonders for him. And then Amen Thompson
is there now, and so you talk about someone that he's gonna be able
to capitalize on, Amen Thompson just blowing by dudes like that lineup where I
don't even know who else is in it, where it's Fred van Fleet and
Jalen Green just dotting. Amen Thompson just getting downhill is absolutely terrifying. And
I just look at his scoring package. He's only a couple of years into
his career, Like he will learn how to slow things down, maybe be
a little bit more deliberate, a little bit more coherent, and even through
all this chaos that's happened in Houston and with his game, like he has
not turned the ball over at an astronaumic clip for someone who had what do
you have last season? Twenty eight plus percent usage and a turnover rate of
eleven point three, And so it's like, yeah, you kind of maybe
do you want to see like the assist rate tick up a little bit for
someone who has the ball in his hands that much? I guess, But
like we're not talking about like a Jail and Brown level of assist the turnover
ratio here either, And so the control to me is going to come and
when he gets more measured. I fully believe this is someone's gonna be twenty
plus points per game, gets to a point where, like he even was
able to increase his foul line frequency last year. I don't know if he's
ever going to be hyper efficient to where we stand and look at it him
and say, like, oh, like Jalen Green, Jalen Green just took
shot fifty eight percent on two pointers, but like we've seen him in his
rookie season hit over fifty percent of his twos, and so like he'll get
back up there, and I do think he'll be like a thirty eight percent
three point shooter and someone who's going to hit a fairly high quip on those
self creative looks. I thought, actually, you were gonna maybe give me
more pushback than this, which is why I'd be like, I didn't even
need to elaborate as much as I did. I think maybe listeners or other
people wouldn't be as high as putting him here. It's really easy to dismiss
him because of the like the inefficiency and the decision making and all the stuff
you mentioned. I just think I think the rockets last year and really for
both years of his career have been one of the worst you know, organized
environments for young Like look at how much better Jubarry Smith junior looked granted at
Summer League, but he looked like a different player and Summer League jbar Smith.
So I think I think there's a good argument to be made that,
like we really have not seen like anything close to what Jalen Green can be.
And he's still average twenty two a game last year. And to your
point, like not only I mean he got to the line more. And
if you're worried about the three point shooting at all, which is I don't
think of a huge concern. You just like shave off two really difficult attempts
per game and you're good. He's like right under eighty percent from the foul
line. So like that's not someone that's going to shoot thirty four percent from
three. I don't think as long as he like again trims off you know,
the over the course of the year, like the one hundred most difficult
and possible threes that he tries to take. Everything he's good at you can't
teach, and everything he's bad at you can. Is like I how I
would look at it, and I tend to overvalue the other kind of player,
where it's like or at least a different type of skill like that you
can't teach, like the court sense and like the all the Haliburton type stuff,
Like you can't teach that you have that, But like you also can't
teach someone to be as fast and as vertically explosive as Jalen Green, and
like he's good enough with the ball to where you can just tighten up a
handle and suddenly it's like all the zach lavine stuff starts to seal, you
know, seem pretty real. So I have no problem at all with Jalen
Green. It's it's like where are we fifteen? In? He was fifteen
on my board, So I mean that actually makes me feel a lot better
about the pick. Yeah, you should feel good about it. And there's
nobody left for me to pick, So I really don't appreciate that nobody like
Gregos shipping all over all omating players. Well do I go with because now
we're in another big chunk of guys. Do I go with the safe pick
or do I go with like let's buy the lottery ticket? Who would be
the safe pick here? Do you mean optically or functionally functionally like, this
guy's gonna be really good. I think he'll make four or five All Star
teams. But that's gonna be about like that's about it, probably, and
I'm gonna do it now to spite you. I'm gonna take Devin Vassell.
No, I don't know where he was on your board. I hope he
was next because you stole Jayalen Green from me. Devin Mifel is just good,
and I think he's gonna be even better with the Truth Superstar next to
him in women Yama. Eventually, there's not a lot he doesn't do well
he had. I don't even have his stats open in front of me,
but I want to look up. You may you may know this. What
do you think he averaged just like points, rebounds, assists last year?
Unless you have it in front of you and then you can just I don't,
But wasn't he had like nineteen points eighteen five and then basically four and
four, you know, three nine and three six, shot thirty eight point
seven percent from three, took way more threes last year. He just he's
last Last year was his age twenty two season. He's still twenty two as
we're recording this, so he's under the wire by a full year. Basically
has big wings, like good wing size, maybe a little more two than
three. I don't know, but I just like, I don't I see
no failure for him. I think he's gonna be a guy that averages twenty
plus, you know, four and four or five and five with good percentages,
and it's going to be a good enough defender to just you're gonna start
every year until you're thirty three. You're gonna make a couple All Star Games.
And I just have no questions about Devin Wasssell's future. Wow, you
had him way higher than where did you have him on your board? I
have him in like my second tier guys, which are just in a big
chunk. So he's not I don't have a number ranking for him because he
was like twenty four twenty five on my board. Well, I thought I
thought you liked Apparently not. I'm so high on his ball scales relative to
consensus. Apparently I've met him one who's even on either that or you You
incepted me talking about him over the years so much. Yeah, that that
explains why you had Devin Wasssell so high and I had Jalen Williams actually pretty
close to where you took him, so that that would make sense. I
love the pick. I just probably would have went with more swings. And
I can't believe I don't even want to take this player, but like we
have to at this point, I'm going with Scottie Barnes. I know he
just came off the down year, but let's put him on a team that
has actual spacing. And I think that the processing speed improved last year relative
that there were moments. Yeah it wasn't all the time, but where he
was making decisions quicker, and like he can get to his in between game.
Yeah he can throw up some junkie turnarounds, but like he can get
to the basket. We saw if you split up certain games like okay,
the three pointer was going in, he'll dribble into some of them. That's
something that could work long term. I think he's going to be better defensively
on the ball, off the ball, He's just going to be better.
He has the physical makeup from it. And I also I do think that
this is someone who who probably could have went a lot higher. It's just
the stench from last year. It's just like because if we did this exercise
after his rookie season, would he have gone in front of Franz Wagner,
Jalen Green, LaMelo, Jalen Jan Williams wasn't the league yet, but like
Devin Missel like, he probably would have. There are people that would have
taken him over Evan Mobile, and they did because he won Rookie of the
Year. I think I had him as my Rookie of the Year over Mobili
and so just like he is a case to actually go way higher, I
think I'm getting great value here even though we're not building rosters. I also
think that you still have to believe in his game and the defense this year
was a little concern name because like that should have been there shouldn't have been
a drop off there. But they were also trying to give him this additional
runway on the offensive end while not actually giving him the resources to capitalize on
set flexibility. And so I just think it might not be this year because
I'm gonna name here's every single above average shoter on the Raptors right now,
Grady Dick and Gary Trent Jr. I don't know where you land on og
like he feels like an average guy. So I don't think this facing is
going to be there for him yet. But this is someone who when you
talk about that they're gonna make four or five All Star appearances. I would
still expect him to eventually be in that range, if not higher. And
his highest end outcome, which yes, do I feel a little bit shakier
on him reaching it? Sure his highest end outcome is still oh he should
have went ahead of Evan Mobley, like that is still his highest end outcome?
Yeah, I agree, certainly a much higher ceiling than Vassel. Right,
Like, just to compare the back to back picks, The two things
that concern me about him are you know less so but it was there is
the like, you know, whispers that maybe he like wasn't the best teammate
or kind of thought he was hot shit after winning Rookie of the Year and
like didn't maybe work that hard over the summer. Like that was like a
minor thing. The major thing is the shooting, Like if he isn't someone
that can shoot the ball and lay environment, conceded the environment was not good
for him last year in Toronto because of the lack of shooting and will be
that way this year too. If he's gonna be the starting line up,
there's no spacing inside that. If he's a sub thirty percent three point shooter,
like I just, I don't know where you can And if he's not
going to be an elite, elite defensive player, which he was not last
year, then I don't know. I don't know what you do with them.
But like tools wise and like ceiling wise, he's the best pick in
like the last five or six that we've made. So no, no,
no big argument there. It's I guess it's more of a swing than approven.
Just like you're taking someone who shot thirty percent on catching shoot threes last
year. That's a it's a swing, But thirty percent in Toronto on catching
shoot threes is like forty five percent on a regular basketball team. Is how
I feel it, Like you have to adjust a little bit for the environment.
All Right, I'm gonna take Tyres Maxie again, going with like the
more established, slightly older guy. This might look really good or really bad
depending on what he looks like, assuming he gets much a much larger share
of the offensive responsibility with Hard and Gone this year. But just to be
as a transition weapon, like he might be the fastest guy in the league,
or he's in the conversation and they shot forty three percent from deep last
year and forty two percent the year before that. He's a little small,
he's a bad defender, just like full stop. Oh he's a twenty point
scorer. You don't think that. I've always thought MAXI was like, he
just doesn't put some on ball chops to him and its athleticism, but he's
just like, I don't know, he's just there, and then he's not
there defensively, Like I don't think he well anyway, not known for his
defense. I think we could agree, but I think I think he's someone
that a lot of this will depend on. Is it, in fact the
case that he could be doing way more than he was doing certainly last year.
And I think it's more likely than not that he actually can. And
so from there, you're talking about a guy that can get you twenty five
and you know, six assists and shoot forty plus percent from three and just
be like a game breaker in transition. So I think, again, not
like a sexy pick, but I think I think he's just he's really good
now and he's going into his age twenty three seasons. So I guess I
just is there more of a self creation other than the put the ball on
the floor and attack the basket to his game? And do you trust him
to drive your half court offense as the primary playmaker? Were the questions I
had. And maybe we haven't gotten a good enough idea of that because he
played with James Harden and Joel Embiid last year, and I guess he might
be playing with those two again this year. This is a big divergence for
us. I had him twenty nine on my board. Wow, Okay,
I'm so curious who you have left because I got just a bunch of long
shots. I feel like I'm taking swings and you're out here like I'm gonna
take this age thirty guy in this age twenty three under exercise now. So
I don't know if I'm reading too much into summer league here. I'm going
with Jabari Smith Jr. I think he showed a lot more as the regular
season ended last year defensively, looking at the way he's able to move around
some of the offensive decision making, and then for watching him in summer league,
I'm just like, why can't in fury, he be the best prospect
that Houston actually has. There's a dominant defensive player in there, just an
absolute monster who plays, who's like a hybrid wing center hype like three four
or five guy, and if he has like the ability to do just drive
with the ball in his hands and go and he probably fell in love with
it too much as a rookie of points, like throwing up some of those
mid rangers. But it's like, if he can start getting up shots more
on the move more efficiently, you trust his set three pointer, want to
throw stuff to him in the post. It just feels like there's more of
an offensive armory there that he kind of showed at points last season. But
just after like what we the possessions I watch from him in summer League,
I'm all the way in on it, and I would expect him to be
like a hyper efficient offensive player this year unless Houston kind of really messes with
the lineups around him and you're dealing with a lot of suboptimal spacing again,
but just that his role is going to be streamlined. I think when you
nudge him down the pecking water and say, okay, you're number three on
offense right, or even number four rather then oh like your number two or
is it number three? That opens up a lot of different doors for him.
But he is more than I think. A lot of the time last
year I viewed him as he was gonna be best suited in a play finishing
role. And maybe that's where Houston winds up having to I don't want to
say pigeonhole him into because like it's a bad term, but maybe that's what
he does the most looking at the other town around him. But he has
the ability to be more, and so I trust just after Summer League specifically,
like I trust him his future. EON's more than I did just a
couple of months ago. For sure. For sure, I think I think
again the Houston thing, like it may just be that all these guys are
way better than we thought and we're going to find out this year because they
have a real coach. Where was he for you? Was this two?
I I have? What do I have him? No? I think it's
given based on the guys I'm looking at right now. He was he was
not next on my board, but he's in a chunk with like three other
guys in the What are we in? Like the twenty range. Basically,
I was picked number twenty. What pick are we going to? By the
way, I don't know. I was gonna ask you this that right,
Well it's twelve or fifteen because that would be the size of roster. So
what do you want to do? Let's do twelve, so we just get
two more? Is that right? Yeah? That'll be twenty four, and
then we can throw a we can throw a joint just so it's twenty five.
We could throw who would go number? We'll throw it. We will
have to agree on that. Okay, I haven't taken a swing in a
while. I'm gonna take a swing, and I'm gonna take Amen Thompson could
have taken. Would you like? I have a Sar Thompson higher than him?
And I didn't know what to do with those two because I feel like
they both looked so good, but a Sar played more in summer league.
Yeah, that's a great point, and I take both. I feel like
they should be a package done both. It's just purely like the athleticism is
like they're already both both of them. I'll just talk about them like they're
one person, even though there are different players. Amen, Thompson is in
like the ninety nine percentile of NBA athleticism like right now today, and the
fact that he seems to have like real playmaking instincts as like an on ball
guy and competes defensively and just feels like someone that if the shot doesn't really
come around, is still gonna have ways to be like a massively impactful player
that just like does it for me. It's purely upside. It's a lottery
ticket. If he can't figure out how to shoot, then like this is
you know, this is a bad pick, But my god, like athletically
and in terms of like demeanor and how hard he plays and all the other
stuff. I just I think he has ridiculous potential. It Like I don't
know what the odds are. He hits it, It hits the ceiling,
but the ceiling is real high. Yeah, I'm the fact that we've now
shrunk, Like not that I want to go to thirty, but like thirty
total picks. I'm like changing my board at real time, I think because
the player I should be taking. I'm with you on everything with Amma Thompson.
But the reason I would segue like this is I'm gonna take us our
Thompson now at number twenty one, and I the the defense, He's just
going to be a monster there. He's going to be dominant on the ball
from the ball, maybe even right away. I think you have to question
whether he's going to be the level of passer that almen can be because he's
going to get like, maybe not as good a burst, but he's gonna
be able to get buy guys. Will you make the right decisions after that?
I think it's a fair question what I trust about him more and why
why he was higher? And I didn't have them back to back, by
the way, I'm not just looping twins together. I had Thompson Osar.
Thompson was twenty and Amen Thompson was twenty two, so they're pretty close together.
Would it will be interesting to see if the person who sandwiched between them
gets picked. I trust his jumper more. It's not pretty and I went
through this on a previous pod, but like he can get it off a
lot. It seems like a lot quicker than Amen Thompson. To use him
as the analog, and it was just like there were moments where it was
going in during Summer League and like it was some off the dribble stuff,
and it was also just like quick like off the catch, and that's even
more important to just like if you can work and sort of that role.
And so if you can get off shots that quickly, that means the processing
speed to catch it and go, I'm either going to take there, so
I'm gonna drive is going to be right there, which I think can make
him more of an offensive compliment than Amen Thompson in the sense of, you
know, when you're looking at even some of these other guys that like we
took where it's like you're looking at uh Josh Giddy, is getting to this
point where you can view them as more of an offensive accessory, then Oh,
he needs to have the ball in his hands. I'm not sure if
Amen Thompson can be that unless you're gonna have him be used as a screener
or something. And I think I'm also just I think our Siren Thompson's gonna
be the guy in Detroit where it's yeah, like you just just go guard
that guy, yeah, and you know you're on your own, like that's
him, that's that's him. So that's who I went with, and I
he jumped someone because I'm like, oh, I only have one more pick
after this. I think I want to I really want to get him.
That's what did it for me too with with Almen. So I have one
more is that correct? Before we get there's number twenty three, so it'll
be the twelve spot on your roster over all, right, So I gotta
reach again. I gotta go Shad and Sharp that's who sandwiched in between the
Thompson. I thought it might be so just athleticism and the potential that he
showed in Summer League as like, oh, maybe this is going to be
a guy that can run a bunch of pick and rolls. Like maybe not
going to do that with Scoot Henderson on your team, but like if he
if he's able to shoot it from deep and able to just I don't know.
This is almost like an argument against him, but I'm just kind of
gaming out what his career might look like like. If Scoot is as advertised,
I mean, Sharpe is going to get four just spoon fed easy buckets
a game, it would seem like or at least really good looks. And
so if he's getting those, and then in addition to that, actually has
some creation shops he could. He's just he just looks like a guy that
is supposed to be a superstar. I feel like, which is the least
intellectual argument either of us has made at any point in this conversation. Can't
defend or has not decided to defend at all, But like, whatever we're
talking about guys that are twenty years old, so happy to get shade and
sharp and take him out of the Thompson Brothers bookend spot on your draft board.
His ability is just gonna get downhill and some of the shots he can
take, like they're not always going in right now, but some of the
shots that he can just get off. Yeah, it's like a Jalen Green
argument a little bit. Is he gonna be able to get that shot up?
I don't know if it's going in, but not everybody can get those
shots up. I don't know what to do here because this is the final
pick, like that would round out like the top twenty four, so twelve
of us each. I have Brandon Miller on my board because I'm like,
how much do we read in the summer league a week close to the season.
This is someone six nine has real feel for the game, can get
off shots, can defend some. But I'm just like looking at Josh Giddy
and Trey Murphy and Jane McDaniels. I have Jay and Ivy and this like
territory as well, and I'm just wondering if any of them need to go
over him. This is not the pick that we're allowed to talk through,
so I can't ask your help on this. Well, I want to throw
you more names just to make it harder on you that I still have on
because you're gonna say Jane McDaniels, and I have Jeremy so in here as
well, and we know how I feel about him. And I'm just like
a m I taking too many rookies because like, at some point I should
bet on these known commodities. I'm gonna go with. I don't know who
I'm gonna go with. Who do I go with? Do I go?
It has to Is it Giddy? Is that's the right pick? He is
not the next highest guy, or he's not in the highest group left on
my board, stiff Brandon Miller. Even in that group, Brandon Miller is
not someone I was gonna take. I'm gonna take Josh Giddy, guy,
I loved the improvement I saw from him as someone away from the ball.
Last year. It really improved his three point stroke, even like during the
early going when it wasn't going in as consistently, and there was like a
huge stretch of time this season we were shooting like a monster clip from three.
The rebounding, the defense, the playmaking when he gets into the lane.
It's kind of like, what if Rajon Rondo was actually an impactful basketball
player and not just like one of the most overrated players in the NBA history
at least post like two thousand eight or whatever. And so it's a risk
here. I get the appeal of Brandon Miller, but I'm gonna go with
Josh Giddy. I think he is a very comprehensive basketball player. And if
this is someone who just like starts shooting thirty five percent from three four entire
seasons thirty six percent, it's not you know, it's not game over level
of okay, if you know Victor weinban Yama is doing that game over.
But it's oh, like he's probably in some All Star conversations and this is
there shouldn't really be a barometer, but like he's gonna be extension knowledgeable next
summer, and he probably gets if he has the season he did this year,
he probably gets a max extension. And so that makes me feel a
little bit more comfortable or at least close to it with this pick. So
I was kind of hoping like a Devin Vassell was still going to be available.
That's rady to be honest with you. So that wasn't going to be
as hard of a decision. Just talking about the names that have gone since
him, I dramatically overdrafted de Vassell. But yeah, no, the fact
that Giddy went from twenty six percent to thirty two percent year over from deep
is really encouraging. And the guy's just been a starters, like you,
started every game he's played, so like he Yeah, I think if Giddy
gets like twenty percent better, you're talking about like a guy that's averaging like
nineteen nine and eight. You know, it's like him just being able to
play off Shay as well, like now where it's like, oh that that
works. It just makes you feel so much better. Yeah, No,
that's a good one. Okay, we need to form a consensus on player
number twenty five. Let's go through. Give me some of the names that
you have like coming up, and then I'll see if there's any divergences,
like I'll add on to it basically, believe it or not. I only
have four guys left because I didn't rank everybody. Oh, I had like
a fifty player big board, forty four player big board. Also every single
player in my top twenty win, so we like, we got the we
got the we got the hits. I'm a coward. I had Brandon Miller
nineteen. Otherwise everyone in my top that was was this literally yeah, everyone
in my top twenty one except for him, Okay, in no particular order,
albren Singun, Jane McDaniels, Walker Kessler, Tyler Hero. Those are
the four guys left in the twenty three and under that have not been picked
that I at least took the time to put into a tier someplace. So
I also have an addition to those guys all made it, Jane and Ivy,
Trey Murphy, Jeremy Sown, Taylor Hendrix, who I recognize that I
might just be obscenely high on a consensus ousman Jang. I think, by
the way, that is my prediction would be this season, we're gonna look
back and be like, holy fuck, the thunder have usman jang too.
I think that's what's gonna happen. I had Tyler Hero. You mentioned schen
Good Benedick Mathin. I thought about putting him higher than this. He's number
thirty five on my board, but I could have been talked like putting him
in twenty fifth. Balah Kolabali Dyson Daniels. Is he ever gonna have some
sort of a jumper? Keegan Murray, Patrick Williams and like we're getting into
okay, Kelvin Johnson, Jalen During Christian Brown, Mark Williams, o'chaiak Baji
Denny Avia. Can I just give you the player that I'm just like I
think could enter at least this part of the conversation after this year, I
didn't get I didn't rank him, but I just I want the record.
I thought about Peyton Watson. I think I've been thinking about I thought you
were gonna say cominga because we haven't talked about him at all. No,
I guess she didn't. He probably should have been in my top forty four.
I don't feel bad about not including him over anyone we pick that might
be an oversight on the top forty on the top fifty list that I had,
so I didn't spend any time thinking about Jonathan cominga. I didn't realize
I didn't have Moses Moody in our initial pool, but we didn't. We
didn't need him. That was unnecessary. I think we can kick Hero out
because he's on the older side, and I think this sort of he is
what he is at this point, right, which is like him from Tyres
Maxie that much for you? I think just the raw athleticism one and the
idea that I mean, actually the correct answer is like not a lot,
because we just have to regard him Simon's we're not talking twenty three other Like
there are different types of players, like Tyler, Hero has that off the
dribble jumper, whereas like Maxi has that pure like catching go. Yeah.
Would you do you think general This is impossible to answer, but my opinion
is that I think Maxi is just generally more highly regarded than Hero. But
I don't know if that's totally fair. So do you think it's it feels
like this happens when they sign their extensions, and so if Maxe, we
know he's not going to get an extension because the Sixers don't want to give
him one. But if he were to sign an extension that pays him max
money or thirty million dollars a year, I wonder if there would be some
pullback. I think that's I think you're one hundred percent right, because just
like we're not, Oh, Max, he's honors rookie scale deal, what
a value? How good is this guy? You know? And then suddenly
there are expectations when you make you know, twenty five or thirty million.
I still feel a little kay getting hero out of this. I don't know
that's inconsistent with me taking Maxie. But then it's like, if you had
to pick one, who would be your pick? Here? If it's just
my team, I'm talking career, I might just take Kessler because I feel
like Kessler is going to be like a top five defensive Player of the Year
candidate just for ten years. But that's so boring because he's like has such
massive and obvious limitations, you know. I I think I would go Trey
Murphy because he's just like, has so much more to offer on offense than
we've seen, and the fact that we already know he can be this ultra
deep motion shooter in addition to holding up on defense across the two, three
and four, and I think he has I'm looking at Jane McDaniels is another
one where I feel like there's more of a floor game to him. But
I just think Trey Murphy's is going to be even better. And and then
it's just like not having Bred and Miller or Jay and Ivy there. But
I think I would campaign for Trey Murphy with if you could tell me that
Jeremy someone was going to be like even close to a league average shooter,
which be him. So one was the name. I was like, are
we should we? Are we overthinking this because I know we both love him
well, so we could go a bonus pick for each So you could have
Kessler and I'll Trey take Trey Murphy and we'll let's do that. Let's do
that. Did you think was Singuon a consideration for you at all? Or
is it just like he's never gonna be able to defend so there's like no
point? So he was actually where did he finish? Let me look where
he finished on my board. I had him at thirty three just so in
part because it's not even the defensive concerns. I just don't unless you were
NICOLEA. Yokich that level of player, and he's not that level of shooter
or score just yet. It's just because of like the playmaking and the vision
there and some of the wild attempts that passes that he attempts. Would you
ever is someone ever going to actually build their entire team around him? And
so when we're in this part of the exercise, like, no, we're
not. You know, maybe I'm not thinking of Trey Murphy building around my
entire team around him, but there's just more of the I imagine him being
in a higher profile role for longer, and it's maybe I'm just jaded by
how teams are typically built these days. Yeah, I think you've kind of
made me realize. That's my argument for Kessler is like you will in fact
build at least your defense around him or he that's that's someone that is a
central figure on your team, although offensively I don't really know what you do
with him. Yeah, he was. I had him ahead of Shanegun I
had By the way, do you want to see how how much of a
idiot or sickle I am? I have Taylor Hendricks ahead of Walker Kessler because
I just think that Taylor Andrews is gonna be this offensive beast in addition to
kind of just being like this really like eclipsing rim protector and valuable defender as
well. And that's just that's pure. I was taking a swing. Yeah,
if if we went the full thirty picks or like fifteen each, I
probably would have taken Walker Kestler over him. Like being Walkers was really good
and I missed on him. This was this was fun, though I hate
myself afterwards a little bit. But don't you feel like I just feel like
I made like fifteen mistakes whatever, hope and at least like leave anyone off
that's like super just like, oh, how is this? Like it?
Like you know someone who's like top fifteen the NBA right now? Guess what
we'll hear about it? Can you? Did you triple triple check that Luca
is twenty four? He is twenty four? Perfect because I actually did at
twenty three and under exercise already, but we didn't go this deep. I
didn't go this deep on it, and I knew Luca was excluded. We
Jayson Tatum is only nineteen though, so I don't know Arrow was angling up
for young Jayson Tatum these days, look out for him. Are you ready
to take it? Goes out of here unless you have anything else to offer?
I never am, and that's why I always have to prompt me.
Everybody, thank you for listening. As Dan said at the top, you
probably just want to go back and listen to Dan do this because he's better
at it than I am. And I always forget things. But rate reviews.
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and as always be closed with a shout out to the one only Frank kl
and then apologies. Jerry