1 00:00:06,719 --> 00:00:11,320 Hello everyone, Welcome to Adventures in Angular, the podcast where we keep you 2 00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:16,239 updated on all things Angular related. This show is produced by two companies, 3 00:00:16,239 --> 00:00:20,280 Stop and Devs and Onvoid. Top and Doves is very great Top and Doves, 4 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:24,280 so get top and way pay and recognition. We're working on interesting problems 5 00:00:24,280 --> 00:00:30,039 and making meaningful community contributions an Onvoid, which provides remote design and software development 6 00:00:30,120 --> 00:00:34,520 services on a task basis, so clients only pay when tests are delivered and 7 00:00:34,799 --> 00:00:40,759 approved. In today's episode, we will talk about a very at least in 8 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:46,359 a first glance advanced topic, but perhaps we're going to see that it doesn't 9 00:00:46,359 --> 00:00:53,560 need to be so complicated as it initially seems, which is contributing to Angular. 10 00:00:54,039 --> 00:01:00,240 Yep, it's you, the developer that uses Angular, contributing to the 11 00:01:00,280 --> 00:01:04,319 actual creation of this amazing framework. My name is Lucas Paganini. I'm your 12 00:01:04,359 --> 00:01:10,200 host in the podcast, and joining me in today's episode is the also great 13 00:01:10,400 --> 00:01:19,319 host Subrette Mischa. Hello everyone, and our special guest Santash. Hey, 14 00:01:19,719 --> 00:01:23,040 well, and let me introduce Santage a little bit. So he has a 15 00:01:23,239 --> 00:01:29,120 very long intro if we're going to talk about everything that he does. So 16 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:34,920 he is a senior software engineer at Seloni's Google Developer expert for Angler, so 17 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:38,959 he knows what he's talking about. He's a GitHub star and ex champion. 18 00:01:41,640 --> 00:01:47,840 What an MMA winner joke, But yeah, he does have awesome titles. 19 00:01:48,079 --> 00:01:52,920 He loves contributing to Angler and its ecosystem. He's also a co founder of 20 00:01:53,120 --> 00:02:00,200 This is Learning and he is also the author of NGX Builder's package and part 21 00:02:00,359 --> 00:02:07,480 of the nas JAS add onscore team. Besides that, somehow he finds some 22 00:02:07,599 --> 00:02:12,680 free time to also run his own talk show, which is called This is 23 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:17,159 Tech Talks, where he invites industry experts to discuss different technologies. So, 24 00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:22,039 Santage, thank you so much for taking the time to be here. It's 25 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:27,479 a pleasure to have you on the show. Yeah, I was looking for 26 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:31,360 like this this two one selves free and then and I was like, okay, 27 00:02:31,439 --> 00:02:38,759 let's do this exactly great. Okay, so let's just dive into the 28 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:49,319 subject. So Santage, first off, let's dismistify the complexity of contributing to 29 00:02:49,439 --> 00:02:58,199 Angler. So how hard is it in practice? Because also let's just let's 30 00:02:58,280 --> 00:03:02,919 not pretend that it's like super trivial and any developer that is just getting started 31 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:07,280 is going to be able to do this. This is probably not for someone 32 00:03:07,319 --> 00:03:14,719 that is just getting started, but how complex really it is? Because I 33 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:20,680 myself have been working with Angular for many years and I'm not so sure if 34 00:03:21,080 --> 00:03:24,960 I would be able to be a valuable contributor to the Angular cod base. 35 00:03:25,039 --> 00:03:30,719 It just feels too complex and too big of a codase, too big of 36 00:03:30,719 --> 00:03:37,319 a project even to find myself in there. So how would you advise people 37 00:03:37,400 --> 00:03:45,800 that want to make Angular better? Remember, so you don't have to contribute 38 00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:47,639 in every area. And so if you think about Angler as a framework, 39 00:03:47,800 --> 00:03:52,319 you have fonts, you have out there, you have so many things different 40 00:03:52,319 --> 00:03:57,120 packages which gets published inside Anglo. So someone to get started with, I 41 00:03:57,199 --> 00:04:02,120 always recommend to actually start with talks, right, So because talks are like 42 00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:05,719 of course, when you are going, when you're learning Angler, you will 43 00:04:05,719 --> 00:04:10,319 probably end up at the dogs. Right. And if you think like there 44 00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:15,960 is something just missing or which is not well explained, that's or maybe brittain 45 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:17,439 in a complex way. It depends upon the writer, right, I mean 46 00:04:17,959 --> 00:04:25,160 some engineer, let's say, who is working on Angler. Probably they may 47 00:04:25,279 --> 00:04:29,120 not explain it an easier wing because they know already know stuff which happens with 48 00:04:29,160 --> 00:04:31,879 all of us in all of us right even at day to do ta work. 49 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:35,439 When we write some design doc as we already know know those things. 50 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:41,480 We try to complex it unnecessarily because that's the only way probably we can write. 51 00:04:42,040 --> 00:04:45,920 But not that that might not be a good in the terms of someone 52 00:04:45,959 --> 00:04:50,839 who is new to the framer and talks should always focus on making it easier, 53 00:04:51,319 --> 00:04:56,000 like to get new learner, right or someone who is learning the technology 54 00:04:56,160 --> 00:05:00,759 to get into this framework. So that's that's one way you can think about 55 00:05:00,759 --> 00:05:06,040 it, like making your first contribution. Also like and it keeps improving, 56 00:05:06,199 --> 00:05:11,199 so they're adding more features, more and more features. So it's possible that 57 00:05:11,279 --> 00:05:14,879 some dogs are missing because you know, hang, the team is not really 58 00:05:14,879 --> 00:05:17,800 big, right, so it has probably twenty five people who work on frameworks, 59 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:21,879 so maintaining dogs and everything it is a little bit complex. But they're 60 00:05:21,879 --> 00:05:26,800 doing a great job. I mean they're trying to keep their talks up to 61 00:05:26,879 --> 00:05:29,720 date, uh, which is which is a good thing. But yeah, 62 00:05:29,720 --> 00:05:34,680 that's a that's also your opportunity once you become like and one more thing, 63 00:05:34,759 --> 00:05:40,519 right, I mean, contributing to talks also gives you some idea about how 64 00:05:40,560 --> 00:05:44,680 they get flow works, I mean get because they use get up actions right, 65 00:05:45,480 --> 00:05:48,000 so you know like how how the guitub actions are, what are the 66 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:54,920 steps are necessary, basically making you're set up on your local machine right and 67 00:05:55,199 --> 00:05:59,560 making sure the build works and you're able to verify all those things locally. 68 00:05:59,720 --> 00:06:02,680 You also learn about a lot of kid concepts, which I mean, I 69 00:06:02,720 --> 00:06:05,680 believe me. When I made my first contribution, I was I had no 70 00:06:05,759 --> 00:06:10,680 idea about repased and of course it's not bad thing, right, I mean 71 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:15,160 probably never used it. So you learn a lot of concept as well when 72 00:06:15,279 --> 00:06:20,759 contributing to talks, So it makes your future ps much better. But now 73 00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:25,360 let's come back. What after Dogs? I mean, of course you can 74 00:06:25,720 --> 00:06:30,000 still continue contributing to Dogs, but as you said, Tangler is a very 75 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:34,120 big favor, there are many more areas. So this is what I used 76 00:06:34,160 --> 00:06:38,519 to do when I started contributing. So I used to watch the reposits. 77 00:06:38,839 --> 00:06:42,000 That's the first thing which I did. I just clicked on watch and I 78 00:06:42,079 --> 00:06:47,319 started watching all the issues which are raised and see like which issue can be 79 00:06:47,439 --> 00:06:51,920 like very maybe not easy, but yeah, which issues something which I can 80 00:06:53,000 --> 00:06:56,360 pick up right? Because let's say, if there is there is something which 81 00:06:56,399 --> 00:07:00,279 is a bug, and I think I can I can broadly defert that bug'll 82 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:02,360 pick it up. So keep and watch. And let's say, if you're 83 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:09,720 planning to start contributing to framework, just just ortuant click on that subscription button. 84 00:07:10,120 --> 00:07:13,040 Just don't get up, so you start getting all the notification about new 85 00:07:13,079 --> 00:07:18,079 issues and then probably don't jump in. And then of course you saw the 86 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:21,120 first session and you tried to go it and pick it up. But I 87 00:07:21,240 --> 00:07:27,240 think for sometimes just read it like what people are doing, See the different 88 00:07:27,279 --> 00:07:30,920 piers, like how people probably wrote the code. Try to read the code. 89 00:07:31,360 --> 00:07:34,079 Try to debug it locally. I mean, it's not something you have 90 00:07:34,120 --> 00:07:38,720 to do it in framework because you're already using framework, right if you're an 91 00:07:38,759 --> 00:07:43,120 angry defliper, you are installing Angular and you're using it. So try to 92 00:07:43,160 --> 00:07:46,759 debug it on your local machine. See how code works. For example, 93 00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:50,600 let's say if you're talking about form, just a debugger, right, and 94 00:07:50,759 --> 00:07:55,360 then see like what happens when you try to create a firm group or when 95 00:07:55,360 --> 00:07:57,720 you try to create a firm control, or if you're trying to add a 96 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:01,480 validation. What are the code which were executed inside the framework, which also 97 00:08:01,560 --> 00:08:05,519 gives you enough ida. I would say, pick up an area to start 98 00:08:05,560 --> 00:08:09,759 with. If you think you want to contribute to forms or if you want 99 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:13,319 to contribute to Router, pick up one area you also have. So I 100 00:08:13,399 --> 00:08:16,319 mean to give you an idea. Angle has three different repositives. It's not 101 00:08:16,480 --> 00:08:22,399 like onely Angler. So Angler has a framework which is inside Angler slash Angler, 102 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:26,399 but they have CLA and they have material as well. So if you 103 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:31,120 think like, okay, the framework is something not maybe you don't want to 104 00:08:31,639 --> 00:08:35,519 contribute that much, go to cl I. I'm in CLS. Everyone is 105 00:08:35,519 --> 00:08:39,480 building CLA right, and that that would be something which may be familiar to 106 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:43,360 maybe because that's written in a plain time script. Right, there's nothing advanced 107 00:08:43,440 --> 00:08:48,080 up there. You can become many issues there. I think there are still 108 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:52,360 many open issues in CLA. You can do that. Or if you think 109 00:08:54,080 --> 00:08:58,000 you're someone who is better at designing the component and you know how to do 110 00:08:58,120 --> 00:09:01,679 it, just go angular components, which is nothing but the Angler material. 111 00:09:03,879 --> 00:09:11,279 And yeah, so these are the areas where you can country and what do 112 00:09:11,399 --> 00:09:16,960 we need to keep in So first off, I love that you mentioned starting 113 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:22,480 with the dogs, because first off, yes, this is the easiest part 114 00:09:22,600 --> 00:09:28,080 for someone just starting out, and it's also the most valuable for the community 115 00:09:28,159 --> 00:09:33,240 as a whole, because in terms of people that are just starting out, 116 00:09:33,600 --> 00:09:39,600 they have a fresh mind because they didn't get used to many of the things 117 00:09:39,639 --> 00:09:43,759 that we might that we might take for granted but maybe confusing to someone just 118 00:09:43,799 --> 00:09:48,759 getting started. So if they do start with the dogs, then they are 119 00:09:50,279 --> 00:09:56,679 the ones most qualified to make it simpler. Right. Of course, they 120 00:09:56,759 --> 00:10:01,720 have the issue that they don't have advanced knowledge the framework, so maybe they 121 00:10:01,799 --> 00:10:05,279 wouldn't be able to understand some of the other things that could be presented, 122 00:10:05,960 --> 00:10:11,559 so that's always a challenge, but they can definitely think about ways to simplify 123 00:10:11,679 --> 00:10:16,279 their understanding, especially if they just finish going through the dogs for the first 124 00:10:16,320 --> 00:10:22,120 time, so it's like someone just read the entire dogs for angular, then 125 00:10:22,559 --> 00:10:26,919 they have most of the knowledge that they need to contribute to it, and 126 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:33,000 they also have freshened their minds, which were the parts that weren't very easy 127 00:10:33,080 --> 00:10:39,120 to get through. So that's an excellent point. I think it makes total 128 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:43,519 sense when we do get to the code, though, do you think that, 129 00:10:45,759 --> 00:10:48,399 like you mentioned, oh, perhaps you're not too comfortable with this particular 130 00:10:48,480 --> 00:10:52,960 part of the code, so maybe you can try this other one. But 131 00:10:52,559 --> 00:11:01,919 do you think there's any part that has more or maybe less easier things to 132 00:11:03,039 --> 00:11:09,919 do, Like I know that many open search repositories have issues tagged as good 133 00:11:09,039 --> 00:11:15,559 first contribution, right, but I'm not so sure if there's still room for 134 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:18,279 that in Angler, because I imagine that if there's anything that is pretty easy, 135 00:11:18,919 --> 00:11:26,480 then the actual team members of Angler would probably address that fairly quickly. 136 00:11:26,120 --> 00:11:33,639 So yeah, how is that in terms of easy tasks to do? In 137 00:11:33,799 --> 00:11:39,399 some of those inner modules of Angler, there are still because I said, 138 00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:41,600 like Angler is not a very big team, and in case they find some 139 00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:45,840 good first issue, they do market as a good first issue because I have 140 00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:48,240 I mean when I started up, of course I have picked up some good 141 00:11:48,279 --> 00:11:54,320 first issues message and mostly like right now, if you want to contribute, 142 00:11:54,840 --> 00:12:01,159 you can find a lot of issues, probably elated totalks because Angler teams like 143 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:03,759 created a new dog if you remember, like it used to be Angler dot 144 00:12:03,799 --> 00:12:09,360 io and now it's on dot So this is a new website and there are 145 00:12:09,799 --> 00:12:13,519 things to do and anglating needs have help, right, so they marked them 146 00:12:13,559 --> 00:12:18,200 as good first issue. Or you can search for dogs. They might not 147 00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:20,159 be good first issue, but you can just search go to label and just 148 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:24,279 search for dogs and you'll be able to find some good first issue to contribute 149 00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:28,200 with. But yeah, I mean, if there are some good first issues, 150 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:33,440 they do market. So it's not like there are nothing or there are 151 00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:35,799 no good first issues in Angular. It's it's not like that. But I 152 00:12:35,879 --> 00:12:41,600 think most many projects have that, and that those can be related to some 153 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:46,120 migrations, maybe some code which was like there from a long time they wanted 154 00:12:46,159 --> 00:12:50,159 to remove it, maybe some Pluto's those are those are kinds of things which 155 00:12:50,639 --> 00:12:56,279 you can actually pick up from the repository. So I haven't seen many good 156 00:12:56,320 --> 00:13:01,399 first issues in Cli, but of course a good first issues in Angler and 157 00:13:01,519 --> 00:13:09,120 companies, that's fine. Yeah, you have one question like coming to your 158 00:13:09,159 --> 00:13:11,639 minds for a newcomer, Like suppose they come and they know that angle is 159 00:13:11,720 --> 00:13:18,320 quite popular, and suppose they selected doc as a issue or some good good 160 00:13:18,399 --> 00:13:22,320 first issue. There might be that a lot of other similar developer also trying 161 00:13:22,360 --> 00:13:28,480 to create pull request, So how like how to make that your pull request 162 00:13:28,519 --> 00:13:33,799 will be picked up first and to reve it first. There is some criteria 163 00:13:33,879 --> 00:13:37,559 for that, or they have some contribution guidelines and all. Yeah, I 164 00:13:37,679 --> 00:13:41,799 mean, so to make sure like you are not doing the same same thing, 165 00:13:41,879 --> 00:13:45,159 which is which another developer is doing. Make sure that you comment there, 166 00:13:45,759 --> 00:13:48,519 uh and tell them, okay, you're doing it. It's not like 167 00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:52,080 you have to like you have to get it assigned, but you have to 168 00:13:52,159 --> 00:13:54,759 let them know that you are going to take care of it, right, 169 00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:58,360 so the team knows that you're working on it, and anyone else. Like 170 00:13:58,840 --> 00:14:01,279 if I go to the same issue and I see, okay, you have 171 00:14:01,320 --> 00:14:05,720 already commented, so probably I will not do the same now. And it's 172 00:14:05,879 --> 00:14:09,200 it's an unwritten rule in open source that you should not do it. But 173 00:14:09,279 --> 00:14:13,960 I have seen some yeah over curious the purpose maybe and they just squared and 174 00:14:15,039 --> 00:14:20,639 open the PR. But the chances that their PR will be rejected it depends 175 00:14:20,720 --> 00:14:22,159 upon you, right, I mean, if you're already commented that you are 176 00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:26,159 taking care of it, and you already have PR in working, then of 177 00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:31,159 course there are no chances that uh, the other person's PR will be picked 178 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:35,399 up. So so we need to mark that we are we are looking into 179 00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:39,240 it and then raise a PR, right exactly, just first comment. I 180 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:41,360 mean, if there are no comments, people will think that okay, no 181 00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:46,120 uncertain moment. So make sure that you have clear intent, right, I 182 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:50,639 mean you have like you have given your intention that you're doing, you're going 183 00:14:50,720 --> 00:14:52,919 to work on it. Yeah, as you are discussing about, like for 184 00:14:54,159 --> 00:14:58,919 for a complete Wigner, like would you like to like put a light upon 185 00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:03,840 like we need to fog the project than from there, like we need to 186 00:15:05,159 --> 00:15:11,000 create a PF from our projected to that because a lot of people are used 187 00:15:11,039 --> 00:15:15,200 to with a single repotect is the dust clone it posts the code, but 188 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:18,840 here will it will work a little different? Yeah, sure, I mean 189 00:15:18,879 --> 00:15:22,600 you opensours is different, right, so you trrectly don't push it until unless 190 00:15:22,639 --> 00:15:28,240 you have maintainers probably and if you're someone who's right starting, So the first 191 00:15:28,279 --> 00:15:31,080 stup is, of course quodit for the project. A good thing about I 192 00:15:31,159 --> 00:15:37,759 think the truly has improved a lot. I mean because when I started contributing 193 00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:41,480 back in ninety nineteen, it was it was a little bit of a mess 194 00:15:41,559 --> 00:15:45,919 up because I think they were using vessel. It was not compatible between those 195 00:15:45,919 --> 00:15:48,399 a lot of things and it was hard to set up. But now I 196 00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:54,159 think you also have get a course spieces, which is free for open source. 197 00:15:54,440 --> 00:15:58,399 Right, so let's say you can just fork your project and then you 198 00:15:58,480 --> 00:16:03,840 can start making changes for example, especially in terms of oxychanges, it has 199 00:16:03,879 --> 00:16:07,480 become much easier, right because earlier I had to plan everything, run it 200 00:16:07,559 --> 00:16:12,440 on my machine and make sure that everything is working. But now thanks to 201 00:16:12,519 --> 00:16:15,840 get up giving course spaces for free, you can just open it in core 202 00:16:15,919 --> 00:16:21,039 spaces and then just make your change and push the pier. So it depends 203 00:16:21,080 --> 00:16:23,639 upon how you want to take it. If you are comfortable using code spaces, 204 00:16:23,679 --> 00:16:27,399 of course it's free for everyone, and if you want to do it 205 00:16:27,720 --> 00:16:32,559 on your local, just go it and do that. But one thing which 206 00:16:32,559 --> 00:16:38,159 I'd always recommend in case you're planning to be a long term contributed so newcomers 207 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:42,879 they have like tendency to actually just push everything into their masterpit brunch and open 208 00:16:42,919 --> 00:16:48,240 a per, which makes things a little bit complicated because what in case you 209 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:52,200 want to open another per. Let's say in open source, there's this thing, 210 00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:56,600 right, I mean it's open source because and no one has dedicated or 211 00:16:56,799 --> 00:17:00,039 what you can say, see alloted time to do your per. So it 212 00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:03,559 may take one day, it may take a month, it depends, really 213 00:17:03,599 --> 00:17:07,759 depends. But you may have a new per which you may want to work, 214 00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:12,119 or a new issue which you won't become within that month, So always 215 00:17:12,319 --> 00:17:15,359 do this. So in case you're forking a new project, always create a 216 00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:18,680 new branch, create a new brunch, and then open a PR. So 217 00:17:18,759 --> 00:17:22,079 it gives you like, yeah, then what you can do is you can 218 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:26,200 actually create different branches and you can still work on it. Meanwhile, your 219 00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:30,599 other pier isn't review. So a lot of tebribus actually don't follow this and 220 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:36,200 then they beat the master branch work it again, and which is a lot 221 00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:41,920 of that makes sense, okay, And we also should talk a little bit 222 00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:48,720 about their commit structure, right because they have a very standardized way to well 223 00:17:48,839 --> 00:17:52,880 to say what your commits are doing. So I know that we have different 224 00:17:52,960 --> 00:18:02,039 scopes and that can be a little an extra acted for first time contributors. 225 00:18:02,799 --> 00:18:06,799 Whenever you're contributing, make sure that you go through the Contributing dot MD because 226 00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:10,480 that's where they define all the scope. I mean, even when I'm open 227 00:18:10,519 --> 00:18:11,200 my first PER, I was not aware of it. I was like, 228 00:18:11,279 --> 00:18:17,880 what is this pynaper keeps failing because there is some Yeah, the commit structure 229 00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:19,759 doesn't match, like okay, what is this? But good thing is, 230 00:18:19,839 --> 00:18:25,839 of course you can go ahead and open any existing merged PR, right, 231 00:18:25,880 --> 00:18:27,519 So in case you're confused. I mean, of course contributing dot md is 232 00:18:27,559 --> 00:18:32,400 where you can find everything. But just in case you're confused, just open 233 00:18:32,480 --> 00:18:36,039 an existing PR and see like how they have permitted and if we give you 234 00:18:36,119 --> 00:18:37,400 a ideal, like okay, this is how I have to follow. This 235 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:41,920 is what I do generally, because there are let's say, if you have 236 00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:45,559 multiple contributing to multiple open source projects, they have different structure and it's hard 237 00:18:45,599 --> 00:18:49,920 to remember those right after second got to contributing dot MD. But yeah, 238 00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:53,200 I mean the best way is, of course, say the exting per the 239 00:18:53,279 --> 00:18:57,359 close pier and the Nate idea. And one good thing about contributing dot md 240 00:18:57,519 --> 00:19:00,680 is also they like they mentioned the like how you can run it locally, 241 00:19:02,079 --> 00:19:07,920 how you can changes, so everything is that gotcha. Also, just going 242 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:14,240 back to this commit structure again, So just to contextualize the audience a little 243 00:19:14,240 --> 00:19:21,839 bit, what I was referring to is that Angler standardized a pattern for prefixing 244 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:27,440 their commit messages with what they do. So you have different types of commits. 245 00:19:27,559 --> 00:19:33,920 You have feet commits, which are introducing new features. You have shore 246 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:41,519 commits, which are just doing day to day stuff like running well, updating 247 00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:48,839 something or updating some dependency for example. Then you have refactor commits, which, 248 00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:52,799 as you may think of, they are just refractory something but don't really 249 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:59,039 introducing any functional changes at least in theory. And then you also have like 250 00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:04,599 style which they literally don't introduce any functional changes at all because they're for example, 251 00:20:04,759 --> 00:20:11,720 running the formatter, so they're definitely not introducing any functional changes. So 252 00:20:11,799 --> 00:20:17,599 you have different types of scopes for your commit messages to you. So for 253 00:20:17,720 --> 00:20:21,480 example, you have a feed, but you can put it into parentheses saying 254 00:20:21,559 --> 00:20:25,559 that this feet is for the form's module, so you could say feet under 255 00:20:25,640 --> 00:20:32,720 parentheses forms, and then you have your commit message and the importance of this. 256 00:20:33,079 --> 00:20:36,880 So at first, at first glance, it might seem like just a 257 00:20:37,119 --> 00:20:41,960 convention that humans are using to understand what's going on, and yet that does 258 00:20:41,079 --> 00:20:48,160 help. But they also use it to automatically generate change logs when they cut 259 00:20:48,319 --> 00:20:53,680 new releases. So I'm actually I always wanted to stop and take a look 260 00:20:53,680 --> 00:21:02,599 at how they're generating this, because it seems like it would really save up 261 00:21:02,720 --> 00:21:07,359 a lot of time, even for closed source projects, just for the product 262 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:11,240 thing, to look at the changes afterwards and figure out what you go into 263 00:21:11,279 --> 00:21:17,160 an email marketing or not. So that's actually valuable even for other projects. 264 00:21:17,559 --> 00:21:21,319 Do you know a little bit more about how that works, Centage, perhaps 265 00:21:21,359 --> 00:21:25,880 we can talk a bit about how to even add that to other projects. 266 00:21:26,920 --> 00:21:30,960 Yeah, I mean, so for example, kit tub already has something called 267 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:33,480 releases, so you can do from there. So let's say if you have 268 00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:38,720 if you're following this semitic commit, what is the yeah, Sember right, 269 00:21:38,799 --> 00:21:44,519 So if you're following a proper semantic versioning and you're following this comments, you 270 00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:48,079 can generate it using guitub actions, so not get up actions. But I 271 00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:52,640 mean you can also do it with geituba actions. But let's say just forget 272 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:56,000 about kitab action, you just want to do it manually, you can actually 273 00:21:56,160 --> 00:22:00,079 use gitubs itself. So if you go to geitub dot com and if you 274 00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:03,920 go to your project, there is something called releases, so you can create 275 00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:07,240 a new release, and as soon as you create a new release, it 276 00:22:07,319 --> 00:22:10,240 will create of course a new version, and it will create a creator change 277 00:22:10,279 --> 00:22:14,039 log for you as well. But if you don't want to do it manually, 278 00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:15,960 you can do it by get up actions. So a lot of people 279 00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:21,519 do use guitup actions to do this by automation because you don't have to be 280 00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:25,920 like physically good and click them button right. So choose whatever fits for you. 281 00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:27,839 I mean, if you're doing it, your release is manually get up 282 00:22:27,839 --> 00:22:32,680 actions, that's a very cool thing to do. Otherwise just auto makee using 283 00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:37,480 getub action guitub actions. Also you can see gutub also has the APIs to 284 00:22:37,599 --> 00:22:41,720 extract change log and do it for you. And there are some open source 285 00:22:41,559 --> 00:22:44,960 get up actions as well. We use it internally, I mean, that's 286 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:48,359 salonest. We use one open source project I don't remember the name, but 287 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:53,720 yeah, we do have an open source get up action. Now another subject 288 00:22:53,839 --> 00:23:00,119 that, yeah, I think that's a I think after creator Bass, a 289 00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:03,920 lot of things became became easier, like now people cannot come it a lot 290 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:08,680 of things, but some people like like for now. Some people love the 291 00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:14,720 escort, some people love wame. So say, it depends on what you 292 00:23:14,960 --> 00:23:18,519 like and how how it can push, And it really depends, right, 293 00:23:18,559 --> 00:23:22,920 I mean, for example, so what we're talking about is the committed history, 294 00:23:23,039 --> 00:23:26,480 right, So the important thing is here here is following a commit structure 295 00:23:26,599 --> 00:23:32,400 which fits your use case. I mean, for example, as lucas mentioned 296 00:23:32,799 --> 00:23:37,240 in angler they have feature, then package name and then commit masses. But 297 00:23:37,519 --> 00:23:41,640 it can differ for your fear for your org, so you can choose something 298 00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:47,039 else. It totally depends on how you want to show your change log to 299 00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:52,160 the end user. For example, let's say in our use is for Salonist, 300 00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:56,240 we have a single repository mono repository, and then we have close to 301 00:23:56,319 --> 00:24:00,119 twenty five projects, so of course we want to like group it buy the 302 00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:04,160 project name right, so we actually do in that way, so we make 303 00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:08,119 sure that when when we've come in, we have all this project name tact 304 00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:12,559 There is another way called labels. You can also use labels. For example, 305 00:24:12,599 --> 00:24:18,839 let's say I can define that in case that my my project has something 306 00:24:18,920 --> 00:24:22,440 called project slash even project or project slash way to project, and I want 307 00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:26,559 to group them in my change clock, I can also follow labels. So 308 00:24:26,799 --> 00:24:32,680 labels are also good ideas. And it's easy to define as well. I 309 00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:36,519 mean you can just have a labeler dot biment find, define your path and 310 00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:42,359 define which folder like, define your folder and then define the label name and 311 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:48,599 then any tools. Of course, if you're creating a changelog, I mean 312 00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:52,599 you can define, okay, how it should be grouped and then it will 313 00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:56,519 it will be visible like that in a change lat. Yeah. One thing 314 00:24:56,599 --> 00:25:02,279 that we haven't talked much about yet, but I think you already hinted on 315 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:08,079 it was that Angular is not the core code, it's also the ecosystem. 316 00:25:08,599 --> 00:25:14,400 So people can also contribute to Angular, not just by writing code to the 317 00:25:14,519 --> 00:25:22,039 main repository, but also contributing to other community libraries or even creating their own 318 00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:27,440 libraries. Do you think that this would be like when do you think would 319 00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:33,160 be a good moment for people to go to that Would you say that this 320 00:25:33,319 --> 00:25:38,000 should be a first step before they try to contribute to the main core code, 321 00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:42,640 or do you think there's no such thing that people can just never have 322 00:25:42,799 --> 00:25:47,839 experienced contributing to libraries and just go straight to contributing to the car code. 323 00:25:48,519 --> 00:25:52,200 Really it depends. Let's say, if I mean, I generally try to 324 00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:56,759 categorize the contributors into area, right, someone who is a new developer who 325 00:25:56,759 --> 00:26:02,920 have never done Angler, and someone who's experience developer. So if you're an 326 00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:07,160 experienced eveliper, you already know a bunch of libraries because you use it daily, 327 00:26:07,559 --> 00:26:11,200 right, I mean, by using by just using Angler, you can 328 00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:14,400 probably do some limited stuff, but if you need, for example, state 329 00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:18,079 management, you probably will reach out to JX or NGXS or any of the 330 00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:23,119 library and you might have tons of similar libraries in your project. So of 331 00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:27,119 course that's an opportunity for you in case you really want to get interested, 332 00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:34,000 like get involved, because let's agree to this. Everyone wants to contribute to 333 00:26:34,079 --> 00:26:37,400 big project like Angle, right, but no one wants to focus on the 334 00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:42,119 libraries. And that's why a lot of maintenance are open source maintenances are struggling 335 00:26:42,839 --> 00:26:47,359 because of course they have they also have limited time. They also work somewhere 336 00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:49,920 as a full time development, but no one cares about it even though that's 337 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:56,000 that library has millions of downlows until less it's an old version and then your 338 00:26:56,240 --> 00:26:59,440 employers say say why it's not updated or we want to update Angler, and 339 00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:03,960 we are struggle because this library is not that latest version. Until that time, 340 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:07,640 no one cares about it. So as an experience developer, in case 341 00:27:08,559 --> 00:27:12,640 you're already using some of those live labels, just go and help them, 342 00:27:12,759 --> 00:27:17,119 right, I mean, you can just probably help them a grede to new 343 00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:19,359 version. That's also contribution, right, that that will help them as well, 344 00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:23,039 and that will also give you an idea like how to contribute to open 345 00:27:23,079 --> 00:27:29,240 source, or you're using some API from let's say, let's say you started 346 00:27:29,279 --> 00:27:33,359 doing state management and you ended up at some issue which is inside eng X, 347 00:27:33,319 --> 00:27:38,119 and if you can debuget and you can contribute back, that will be 348 00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:41,799 a great start as well, right, and that will be helpful for others 349 00:27:41,839 --> 00:27:45,839 as well. Of course, there is organizations which has some policy policy that 350 00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:49,759 they don't want people to contribute to open source because for some experssing reason. 351 00:27:49,839 --> 00:27:53,759 But if your organization does not allow to do it from your own time, 352 00:27:53,839 --> 00:28:00,039 right to do it only your time on your laptop and haven't separate probably a 353 00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:03,519 kid of account. Some employers are really have really happy to do, like 354 00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:08,680 have you use your own account? For example that Saloni ist Selonis is. 355 00:28:10,599 --> 00:28:14,519 Yeah, I can say they're pretty much supportive of these things. So they 356 00:28:14,559 --> 00:28:17,559 don't care. I mean they don't care in the terms. Yeah, I 357 00:28:17,559 --> 00:28:18,720 mean this is good for them as well. Right. They have people who 358 00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:22,119 are contributing to the film. But some companies don't think in that way. 359 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:26,279 They think that Okay, if you're contributing, you are probably helping your competitors. 360 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:30,480 I'm not sure how because you're contributing to not toget and you're in. 361 00:28:32,200 --> 00:28:34,799 But yeah, that's a different, different, probably topic to discuss about. 362 00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:37,039 But yeah, this is what you can do, like as an experienced empt 363 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:41,640 but you have more projects to contribute to. But if you're a new teftlopper, 364 00:28:42,319 --> 00:28:47,880 probably your chances are little bit limited because you just know about Angler, 365 00:28:48,079 --> 00:28:52,200 right, so you can just concentrate on probably picking up something from Angler. 366 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:57,200 Then try different libraries, because if you think about web, most of the 367 00:28:57,279 --> 00:29:02,279 technologies which you have out, what you will do using them? Probably you 368 00:29:02,279 --> 00:29:04,359 will create some product. It will be same, right, I mean probably 369 00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:07,240 will reach out to similar APIs. For example, let's say try and drop. 370 00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:11,759 If I have to drop and react, probably I'll reach out to some 371 00:29:11,119 --> 00:29:15,160 library which already exists. As a new learner, probably I will also do 372 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:19,039 the same. But that gives me limited opportunately because I'm not still not aware 373 00:29:19,039 --> 00:29:23,720 of how libraries work, so I have to be like That's why I always 374 00:29:23,759 --> 00:29:29,400 recommend that on day one, don't think about contributing to any project. On 375 00:29:29,559 --> 00:29:32,960 day when your thoughts should be like, because I will give give my six 376 00:29:33,039 --> 00:29:37,759 months to learn about this framework, right, I'll try to understand like how 377 00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:41,240 things work, how I can do this, do that, and then think 378 00:29:41,279 --> 00:29:45,079 about Okay, if once I think I have reached that point that where I 379 00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:51,240 know stuff how to do, probably create my own library. Then as we 380 00:29:51,279 --> 00:29:55,359 go ahead and to try to jump into the libraries and see if I can 381 00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:59,839 do so. Or again, for as an experience developer, let's say if 382 00:29:59,880 --> 00:30:06,640 you working on some internal project and you have use cases because you might want 383 00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:08,920 to implement something which is not there, which is not their noble source. 384 00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:14,799 This is also a good idea, a good opportunity where you can actually create 385 00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:18,960 that profensial project, share it with the community, and probably convince your employer 386 00:30:18,640 --> 00:30:26,680 that we should use this project. Right and if it gives more disability to 387 00:30:26,799 --> 00:30:32,880 your orgnation, why not do that? Perfect? Yeah, and let's let's 388 00:30:33,039 --> 00:30:37,680 bring the contributions to Angular even more closer to the reality of the day to 389 00:30:37,759 --> 00:30:42,640 day. So, for example, what I'd like to do is to explain 390 00:30:42,799 --> 00:30:48,519 to the audience some of the projects that you contributed yourself. So we in 391 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:53,160 the introduction we already briefly mentioned some of the things that you have already done, 392 00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:57,480 but perhaps we can even talk about some of the contributions that you did 393 00:30:57,759 --> 00:31:04,759 to the Angular core code because that is definitely going to help people bring through 394 00:31:04,799 --> 00:31:10,799 reality the types of things that they can do. Right. Yeah, I 395 00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:18,039 mean my first peer for Angler was actually dogs. So that was the time 396 00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:22,319 like I started exploring the ways how I can contribute to open source and I 397 00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:25,759 was like, okay, what should I do and how should I contribute to 398 00:31:25,799 --> 00:31:30,319 Angler? And then I ended up at an issue that you know, Angler 399 00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:34,920 has librarries, right, can create libraries, so it was not documented, 400 00:31:36,039 --> 00:31:41,279 like the project structure was not documented. There was uh your Angler application like 401 00:31:41,359 --> 00:31:44,559 how they looked like it was already documented. Then I was like, okay, 402 00:31:44,680 --> 00:31:48,160 this is my opportunity, and I went ahead and that I did that. 403 00:31:48,279 --> 00:31:52,440 That was my first pr for Angler. But before that actually opened my 404 00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:56,160 first peer for NGRX. So my first peer was not for Angler. So 405 00:31:56,519 --> 00:32:01,000 I went to NGLs because, as I said, like, if you're experienced 406 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:05,480 sevenumber, you feel tried to some different things, right, So I was 407 00:32:05,559 --> 00:32:10,400 exploring something called schematics. Strangler as this concept of schematics and prictus, and 408 00:32:10,519 --> 00:32:14,599 I was exploring about schematics and then I figured out, okay, there is 409 00:32:14,599 --> 00:32:17,400 an open issue related to schematics in NGI r X, and I was like, 410 00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:20,920 okay, let's let's take this, let's see how how to do it. 411 00:32:21,119 --> 00:32:22,599 Of course, it took me some time to go through court based like 412 00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:28,119 how they are doing it, and that's that's how I made my first per 413 00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:31,480 for NJRS and then I kept country builting. I mean, I I helped 414 00:32:31,519 --> 00:32:36,640 them with some APIs. For example, if I remember, my last PR 415 00:32:36,920 --> 00:32:40,400 was related to j X data, which I still don't understand. I think 416 00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:47,519 they replicated it any phase, and I also like phase several prs to upgrade 417 00:32:47,839 --> 00:32:52,039 jr X back in days. Now, I don't get that much time, 418 00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:57,440 like because of course you have full time job, and you're mean if you 419 00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:00,160 have been doing a lot of other stuff running a community and every thing, 420 00:33:00,279 --> 00:33:04,720 doing podcasts. So but whenever I get time, like if I see some 421 00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:07,720 open issue which I think I can do it, I take it. I 422 00:33:07,799 --> 00:33:10,759 mean, and most of them probably maybe talks. For example, my last 423 00:33:10,799 --> 00:33:15,759 PR for Angler first talks. So if with new talk side there was a 424 00:33:15,839 --> 00:33:21,200 section where you can migrate to standalone components, and that was missing, so 425 00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:23,920 I just added that because of course I had some free time lovel giveness to 426 00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:30,039 this, but I don't keep myself limited to onunly Angular and in chairings, 427 00:33:30,079 --> 00:33:34,319 I tried to see like if there are in other projects recently, are is 428 00:33:34,359 --> 00:33:37,400 the peer for Solid? So of course I don't work on Solid. But 429 00:33:37,519 --> 00:33:40,279 I was just on a podcast with Ryan Gardian to the creator of Solid and 430 00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:45,240 they're okay, how to contribute to Solid, and believe me, I opened 431 00:33:45,279 --> 00:33:49,559 the PR during the the podcast episode somehow, so Layer can do this. 432 00:33:49,799 --> 00:33:52,079 On the side, I was doing my PR, So it depends. I 433 00:33:52,119 --> 00:33:55,400 mean, now I don't try to keep myself in my last and now there's 434 00:33:55,440 --> 00:34:00,240 a PR which is still open, which is for backstage if if you know 435 00:34:00,319 --> 00:34:05,720 backstage, this is a tool for DevOps, right, so basically your devositve 436 00:34:05,799 --> 00:34:10,559 can create dashboard, different beat of dashboards, documentation, all those. So 437 00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,519 depends. So it's not like I'm just contributing to Angular and Angular ecosystem. 438 00:34:16,599 --> 00:34:21,440 Now. I try to help wherever I can, wherever I think, I 439 00:34:21,559 --> 00:34:23,280 think I have time, and I think this is something which I can wrap 440 00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:29,679 up because in continua, contribution is useful, right, I mean I don't 441 00:34:29,719 --> 00:34:32,679 think like this is the first thing which you could remove from your mind that 442 00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:38,920 oh this is very small contribution. No, I mean every contribution is apprecious 443 00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:43,039 because remember, no one else was dreaming it. I mean, there are 444 00:34:43,079 --> 00:34:45,400 millions of developers, but not everyone is actually doing open source right, and 445 00:34:45,519 --> 00:34:52,679 no one, not everyone is actually contributing or making something better even though they 446 00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:57,079 don't right. A lot of times we go to the doc, we find 447 00:34:57,119 --> 00:35:00,159 something wrong, and we just ignore it. So if you're doing it, 448 00:35:00,599 --> 00:35:04,440 you're doing something. Yeah, I would like to ask like a different kind 449 00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:09,039 of non technical questions. So as I as from our conversation and from the 450 00:35:09,119 --> 00:35:12,840 intro asual, A lot of people know that you do. You are doing 451 00:35:12,920 --> 00:35:16,360 a lot. They are doing a lot since a long time. Maybe like 452 00:35:16,599 --> 00:35:22,559 you said from tag nineteen, you might be doing prior to that. So 453 00:35:22,719 --> 00:35:25,880 this is just a from a I'm asking for myself as a how do you 454 00:35:27,639 --> 00:35:31,320 manage your time to do these many things? Or like when you get time 455 00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:37,159 to read what all those? How your taste work? Very complicated because when 456 00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:42,519 people ask me like time management and like okay, do that the wrong person? 457 00:35:42,639 --> 00:35:45,760 I mean I don't know like how how it works, because it works 458 00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:53,000 right somehow, somehow, I'm somehow it works. I try to manage my 459 00:35:53,159 --> 00:35:59,280 time. Probably it really depends when I'm feeling well. I don't try to 460 00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:06,000 push myself now because I have multiple what you can say, yeah, for 461 00:36:06,119 --> 00:36:12,239 good the time, responsib I know responsibility. I'm in a So there was 462 00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:15,400 time like I was not doing anything, so uh yeah, there's a there's 463 00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:19,280 a term for it, right, So now I don't forget about it. 464 00:36:19,840 --> 00:36:22,960 But there were multiple times that I was like not feeling feeling like to do 465 00:36:23,119 --> 00:36:28,360 anything because I pushed myself so much for like six months, and then the 466 00:36:28,440 --> 00:36:30,400 next three months or next six months, I was not doing anything. So 467 00:36:30,840 --> 00:36:34,159 now as I've stopped doing it, it's like, Okay, if I feel 468 00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:37,079 good and I think I want to do it, I would do it. 469 00:36:37,239 --> 00:36:39,239 Otherwise it's okay, I mean because I already have a lot of things to 470 00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:44,199 do. So for example, a podcast, we we do like two poadcasts 471 00:36:44,199 --> 00:36:47,480 per month, so of course that's that's something which also needs time. And 472 00:36:47,599 --> 00:36:52,840 then we are doing virtual this month, not this month, but next month. 473 00:36:52,039 --> 00:36:55,440 This is a great yea, so next month we're also doing a virtual 474 00:36:55,480 --> 00:37:00,960 fun So I'm also a little bit busy there promoting things and every like safe 475 00:37:01,039 --> 00:37:05,480 peace, collecting safe peace, asking people to reinstill, and we're doing it 476 00:37:05,599 --> 00:37:08,280 on our own, so it's not like it it will sponsored or something. 477 00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:13,320 So we're just trying to It's a virtually can basically, so we know like 478 00:37:13,519 --> 00:37:16,400 of course that we need to need for money back. I think we can 479 00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:21,719 manage because our community we mostly focus on free stuff. That's that's our mot 480 00:37:22,119 --> 00:37:27,519 we are. We are for free learning and open learning, mostly being open 481 00:37:27,599 --> 00:37:31,599 source, and my co founder Laws is also big time advocate for open learning 482 00:37:31,639 --> 00:37:35,639 and open source. So that's how we decided to do this. Uh. 483 00:37:36,320 --> 00:37:38,360 But for example, I was just I just came back from a vacation, 484 00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:42,920 so I was on vacation for two weeks. Because of course everyone needs the 485 00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:46,719 time of right, so time management. Yeah, I mean I'm really bad 486 00:37:46,760 --> 00:37:52,039 at retirement. I'm still like I want to record a course and believe me, 487 00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:57,719 it's been friending from a year now, so yeah, not the best 488 00:37:57,719 --> 00:38:00,719 person. That's the only thing is of course some how it works for me. 489 00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:07,800 But don't get motivated from what I do. Just see like how your 490 00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:10,519 should need works, how what you can do. Remember like if you're doing 491 00:38:10,599 --> 00:38:15,239 something community, that's enough, Like you don't have to do everything. For 492 00:38:15,400 --> 00:38:19,239 example, when I started, I was doing mostly open source, right, 493 00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:22,000 so when I started nineteen for India, I was just doing open source. 494 00:38:22,039 --> 00:38:27,119 Then I realized, okay, how long a person can do the same stuff. 495 00:38:27,559 --> 00:38:30,000 I mean, we noment right, be good, we get board. 496 00:38:30,599 --> 00:38:32,639 So I decided to do something and s try something else. So I decided, 497 00:38:34,079 --> 00:38:37,599 okay, let's do this podcast thing. So that worked, so we 498 00:38:37,679 --> 00:38:40,440 are still doing I'm still doing this podcast, but I also have co hosts 499 00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:44,719 just to make sure that in case I'm not there, so other people can 500 00:38:44,800 --> 00:38:46,960 take up. Then, of course, there was a time I was like, 501 00:38:47,039 --> 00:38:50,920 okay, I want to write. I don't write much now, but 502 00:38:51,360 --> 00:38:52,800 there was a time I was like writing every month. So I was like, 503 00:38:52,920 --> 00:38:57,559 okay, that this is my jab right now, and then I was 504 00:38:57,639 --> 00:39:01,000 doing that. So don't care. Don't think about like doing so much stuff 505 00:39:01,079 --> 00:39:06,400 at once. Just just think like what you feel like doing at that moment, 506 00:39:07,280 --> 00:39:08,880 and just do it. I mean, every contribution, as I said, 507 00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:14,000 like, it's a specious for someone who's trying to learn the same thing 508 00:39:14,039 --> 00:39:19,119 which you're planned to write. So just just think about that and keep contributing. 509 00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:22,840 Yeah, it's nice advice, like, don't very so USh to do 510 00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:28,320 a lot of things. Keep doing one things, and after some days, 511 00:39:28,360 --> 00:39:30,800 if you look back, you have done a lot of things. Yeah, 512 00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:37,880 I have another question which is not very technical, but maybe you feel the 513 00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:44,199 here that you have more knowledge about this than time management to to speak about 514 00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:52,119 this, which is the effects of contributing to open source in your career because 515 00:39:52,159 --> 00:39:59,519 a lot of developers they put in their minds that they must contribute it to 516 00:39:59,679 --> 00:40:07,880 open service to get good jobs. And that's not really true, but it 517 00:40:08,079 --> 00:40:16,440 does help. But I'm wondering from someone that did a lot of contributing a 518 00:40:16,519 --> 00:40:22,480 lot of contributions, how much do you think that people can justify their their 519 00:40:22,559 --> 00:40:27,159 time spent on contributing to open source in a way that they're going to think, 520 00:40:27,199 --> 00:40:30,679 oh, I'm doing this to actually this is actually a financial investment because 521 00:40:30,719 --> 00:40:36,840 this is going to increase my salary or or whatever. Like I'd like to 522 00:40:37,000 --> 00:40:43,599 bring a little bit more reality from someone that has dedicated so much time to 523 00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:46,840 it. A good question because I remember when I started contributing the first question, 524 00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:51,719 and so when I was contributing, so I was talking to ngatics team 525 00:40:51,719 --> 00:40:54,800 a lot, and one don't the court team member asked me like, why 526 00:40:55,039 --> 00:41:00,000 you're doing contribution? Of course it is your attention because they I'm enjoying it 527 00:41:00,159 --> 00:41:02,079 and it was like, oh, this is the correct way to do it, 528 00:41:02,559 --> 00:41:07,519 because there are a lot of people who do it for money or they 529 00:41:07,159 --> 00:41:09,519 they want to get a good job. There's nothing wrong in it, right, 530 00:41:09,880 --> 00:41:13,800 I mean, if you if you really think that contributing to that particular 531 00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:15,960 project will get you a better job, I'm into it. Not nothing to 532 00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:19,840 worry about. But my intention was clear of it. Okay, I wanted 533 00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:22,280 to do it because I want to health communitee and this is what I'm enjoying 534 00:41:22,360 --> 00:41:28,480 right now. So have an intention, make your intention clear, like if 535 00:41:28,519 --> 00:41:31,840 you're if you're contributed to a big project, I think having a clear intention 536 00:41:31,960 --> 00:41:37,400 or clear goald is really worth it. And there can be a bad intention, 537 00:41:37,559 --> 00:41:38,199 right, I mean, if you know, if you know about the 538 00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:45,079 new recent project text, See so they did it for two years, right, 539 00:41:45,159 --> 00:41:47,639 It's was not like they just added this back door in a day. 540 00:41:49,119 --> 00:41:52,320 They contributed for that to that project for two years and then they finally saw 541 00:41:52,480 --> 00:41:55,800 a chance and then they added a back to. So intention can be wrong, 542 00:41:55,920 --> 00:42:02,280 but have a clear board intention, like why won't you contribute? Most 543 00:42:02,280 --> 00:42:05,960 of the open source contributors are doing it. They are not doing it for 544 00:42:06,079 --> 00:42:08,519 money or they are not doing it for good job. They are just doing 545 00:42:08,559 --> 00:42:13,480 it because they love it that they love helping people, they love creating something 546 00:42:13,559 --> 00:42:16,119 new. If that's your intention, of course you will. You will contribute 547 00:42:16,159 --> 00:42:20,679 for a longer time. If your goal is to get a job, once 548 00:42:20,719 --> 00:42:22,199 you get a job, you will just manage. You will not do it 549 00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:27,360 because that was your goal, that was your intention. If your intention is 550 00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:30,159 to add a back door like two years after, so that's a that's a 551 00:42:30,199 --> 00:42:35,400 different thing. But but this is a really good question for a lot of 552 00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:39,159 people. So think why you're doing it, and remember you don't have to 553 00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:45,800 be like very like two hundreds of years seven. That's that's something of impossible 554 00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:50,639 until does your working on it full time right And I know some people who 555 00:42:50,719 --> 00:42:54,280 can who are doing it. For example Matthew who is contributing a lot to 556 00:42:54,360 --> 00:42:58,440 Angler. I don't know how it does that, but he is. He 557 00:42:58,599 --> 00:43:01,880 keeps like doing more feature and probably someone from Anger to So he has his 558 00:43:02,039 --> 00:43:05,920 intention right that he wants to do it. He wants to actually invest his 559 00:43:06,039 --> 00:43:10,840 time making this framework amazing and he's doing it. So yeah, have a 560 00:43:12,119 --> 00:43:14,639 clear gold, have clear intention why you want to do it. In case 561 00:43:14,679 --> 00:43:19,880 you want to go longer, just having a passion for doing it will take 562 00:43:19,880 --> 00:43:22,159 you longer. Because of course, if my goal was to get a job, 563 00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:25,639 I mean probably I have I would have stopped a year book or like 564 00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:29,280 after a year probably because I got it. I got a rey more job 565 00:43:29,320 --> 00:43:34,400 and than I'm happy now. And of course the impact right, of course, 566 00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:39,239 the impact of contributions. It can lead you to something better. I 567 00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:45,960 mean because I generally tell this tool everyone that whatever I have achieved is because 568 00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:50,639 of Angular community. Because that there was a day I decided, okay, 569 00:43:50,679 --> 00:43:53,159 we'll go it and contribute to open source. I will that this was not 570 00:43:53,280 --> 00:43:57,039 the goal. This was not the goal to get a good job or come 571 00:43:57,039 --> 00:44:01,360 to Germany, but it helped. It helped me get a visibility in the 572 00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:06,599 community that okay, this guy exists and he's doing something which is amazing, 573 00:44:07,320 --> 00:44:10,639 right, and people started recognizing me and there are people who wanted to work 574 00:44:10,679 --> 00:44:15,719 with. So if let's see, like if your goal was to get a 575 00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:19,400 job, you will get it to any phase in case like if you're if 576 00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:23,199 you're if you're making a bulling back, but have that goal that you want 577 00:44:23,239 --> 00:44:28,119 to actually just follow your passion, you want to actually support this project and 578 00:44:28,639 --> 00:44:32,400 it will help you in long term, because what's the what's the point like 579 00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:37,159 getting banished from everywhere after a year after you get a job, because you 580 00:44:37,239 --> 00:44:40,840 don't be to work on properly that in that oorgation for more than two years 581 00:44:40,920 --> 00:44:44,679 or three years and depends. I mean people work for five years, but 582 00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:47,840 aft of the three years you will come back and contribute to open source to 583 00:44:47,880 --> 00:44:52,880 get another job doesn't make sense, right, I mean making yourself visible takes 584 00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:57,039 time, and once you lose that visibility, it's it's hard to get back 585 00:44:57,119 --> 00:45:00,599 and show that, Okay, you have been doing this because you have start 586 00:45:00,639 --> 00:45:05,559 from zero, right, I mean in two years, the technology change changes, 587 00:45:05,559 --> 00:45:08,320 people change, there will be probably be net put in the community and 588 00:45:08,840 --> 00:45:15,079 you have to start from somewhere again. So yeah, I mean I just 589 00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:22,199 have a have that makes sutal sense, and it's great to give people this 590 00:45:22,400 --> 00:45:28,159 view of sure you can do it if you're just looking to have something in 591 00:45:28,239 --> 00:45:32,039 your resume, but it's probably not going to be a good investment of your 592 00:45:32,119 --> 00:45:39,159 time afterwards, because well for the for the repository owners, it's most probably 593 00:45:39,239 --> 00:45:43,760 not going to be a good investment of their time because if they stop to 594 00:45:43,840 --> 00:45:47,239 train you and then you just leave after you get a job, then what 595 00:45:47,400 --> 00:45:52,840 do they do at that time? But also for you, because if you 596 00:45:52,920 --> 00:45:58,199 don't stick around long enough to really deeply understand how things work in the cow 597 00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:01,800 base, then you're missing out on so many aha moments, you know, 598 00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:07,760 I think I think there's also value in debt. If you work long enough 599 00:46:07,119 --> 00:46:14,039 in a code base built by professionals that are more experienced than you, then 600 00:46:14,199 --> 00:46:17,960 over time, you're gonna internalize more and more some of the decisions that they 601 00:46:19,039 --> 00:46:24,039 made, and you're gonna consciously or subconsciously learn that and be able to apply 602 00:46:24,159 --> 00:46:29,079 that in your own projects. So it's kind of like working with I think 603 00:46:29,159 --> 00:46:35,360 people forget this this aspect of it. It's like, would you want to 604 00:46:35,679 --> 00:46:40,760 work with some of the best engineers in the world. Oh yes, I 605 00:46:40,800 --> 00:46:45,559 would love. I would learn so much from them. But I don't have 606 00:46:45,719 --> 00:46:47,280 a job at Google. I don't have a job at open Aye, I 607 00:46:47,320 --> 00:46:54,000 don't have a whatever. Like you don't really need that because there's so many 608 00:46:54,119 --> 00:47:00,559 open source projects that are maintained by those brilliant minds. So this is also 609 00:47:00,599 --> 00:47:04,840 a great way for you to develop yourself as a professional. And if you 610 00:47:04,920 --> 00:47:07,159 don't want to use this knowledge just to get a job, that's fine, 611 00:47:07,239 --> 00:47:12,400 like create your own startup whatever you know, like you can use that knowledge 612 00:47:12,480 --> 00:47:19,079 for however, you want to make an impact on your life on other people. 613 00:47:19,599 --> 00:47:22,559 So I think that's also something huge to keep in mind. Okay, 614 00:47:24,239 --> 00:47:30,280 guys, we're approaching almost fifteen minutes already. This is a very dense subject, 615 00:47:30,320 --> 00:47:32,119 so I'm sure that we could talk about it for ten hours more. 616 00:47:32,800 --> 00:47:37,719 But I wonder if there's anything you'd like to say before we start wrapping it 617 00:47:37,840 --> 00:47:42,960 up. So, I mean, I'll be a blessest confidence to start so 618 00:47:43,519 --> 00:47:47,239 ted con. This is on con is, which will be virtual ontreen sixteen, 619 00:47:47,840 --> 00:47:52,559 So if you can add that into your description and that will be helpful 620 00:47:53,320 --> 00:47:58,719 to on the listeners then so they can atend because we have more than footy 621 00:47:58,760 --> 00:48:01,360 speakers. That's the t I mean, I'm scared because this is good to 622 00:48:01,400 --> 00:48:07,679 be the first conference if you're doing and we have a little bit ambitious in 623 00:48:07,840 --> 00:48:10,159 terms of getting food these because in two days, but that's simple prob we 624 00:48:10,199 --> 00:48:16,440 can do it. And yeah, okay, Well on my end, I'm 625 00:48:16,519 --> 00:48:21,159 just going to promote the two companies that produce this show, so Top and 626 00:48:21,239 --> 00:48:25,639 DEVS and Void if you're looking to learn more about web development in general, 627 00:48:27,239 --> 00:48:30,639 then there are a bunch of other podcasts and content created about top and dew 628 00:48:30,800 --> 00:48:35,119 so you can take a look at the website. And if you're a company 629 00:48:35,280 --> 00:48:40,320 or just someone looking for outside developers and designers to help you on your project, 630 00:48:40,920 --> 00:48:46,079 then you may have experienced like a situation where you hire someone and you 631 00:48:46,199 --> 00:48:51,679 didn't like the way that the work was presented or the communication and then you 632 00:48:51,880 --> 00:48:57,320 just maybe got frustrated by that. So Void aims to solve this exact problem. 633 00:48:57,760 --> 00:49:00,840 So the way that they work is by feeling you only by task and 634 00:49:00,960 --> 00:49:06,599 only after they are delivered and approved by you, so you have predictable costs 635 00:49:07,119 --> 00:49:10,800 and you also have quality control because if you're not happy with the results, 636 00:49:10,840 --> 00:49:15,480 you can just ask for a change until it is up to your quality standards. 637 00:49:15,920 --> 00:49:22,599 So it is really the best of both forwards talking about outsourced design and 638 00:49:22,800 --> 00:49:27,840 software development services. So if you're interested in that is you and Void dot 639 00:49:27,960 --> 00:49:32,719 com. So on Void. Yeah, so this would be my pro host. 640 00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:37,840 I'm gonna take a look at this link to tell to say a little 641 00:49:37,840 --> 00:49:40,639 bit more about this comft. But in the meantime, Cigarette, why don't 642 00:49:40,639 --> 00:49:45,880 you tell us what you're working on. Yeah, so I would like to 643 00:49:45,039 --> 00:49:52,559 promote my channel YouTube channel which is fund of Furistic, I think mostly on 644 00:49:52,760 --> 00:50:00,679 Anglo, so please guard and watch it. And currently I'm working on like 645 00:50:00,440 --> 00:50:06,000 some new hobbies. I pick up that guy started kickboxing that's trying to see 646 00:50:06,000 --> 00:50:12,480 if it's how how it works, and will continue on that. Yeah cool, 647 00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:17,039 okay, okay, And I will also I will send this to our 648 00:50:17,119 --> 00:50:21,840 team so that they can add the link to the conference in the show notes. 649 00:50:22,239 --> 00:50:24,519 But for those of you that maybe don't have a comment section from where 650 00:50:24,559 --> 00:50:32,159 you're listening this from, it is TI l comf dot Netlify, dot app. 651 00:50:32,679 --> 00:50:38,800 So this is Learning Conference twenty twenty four. So I believe that if 652 00:50:38,880 --> 00:50:44,519 you look that up on Google, you should probably find that eventually. And 653 00:50:44,639 --> 00:50:52,639 it's going to be happening on May sixteen and May seventeen. Just to confirm, 654 00:50:52,719 --> 00:50:55,960 Satuch, this is going to be a remote conference or is this going 655 00:50:57,039 --> 00:51:01,039 to be in person? No, it's so much conference and it's free. 656 00:51:01,119 --> 00:51:06,920 It's free for everyone, so cool to start and end like for a full 657 00:51:07,000 --> 00:51:10,440 day or oh no, So we have planning to do it during a four 658 00:51:10,639 --> 00:51:15,679 to ninety p ANDC team time, so we can cover most of the time 659 00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:20,159 zones. Base and speakers are also from different time zones. So yeah, 660 00:51:20,199 --> 00:51:22,920 this is where I'm scared, as I said, so managing all those forty 661 00:51:22,920 --> 00:51:29,559 speakers in different time zones that will be there. Yeah, yeah, definitely. 662 00:51:30,079 --> 00:51:34,199 Okay, guys, thank you so much, Santage, thank you so 663 00:51:34,400 --> 00:51:38,159 much for being on the show. Please feel free to hop back and whenever 664 00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:44,480 you want to discuss anything, so you have our contact and for just send 665 00:51:44,559 --> 00:51:47,519 us a message and we can find this a lot. It's so it's great 666 00:51:47,559 --> 00:51:51,360 to have you on the show. Thank you so much, Thank you so 667 00:51:51,440 --> 00:51:53,280 Ber, Thank you Gus. And it was great like talking to you. 668 00:51:53,719 --> 00:51:58,119 Of course I missed the Albent but midday. Thanks you chat with him later. 669 00:51:59,199 --> 00:52:04,599 Yeah, thanks a lot for a nice conversation, pretty like knowledgeable for 670 00:52:04,719 --> 00:52:08,760 everyone. Yes, yes, okay, thanks everyone, and I'll see you 671 00:52:09,079 --> 00:52:10,400 in the next episode.