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Hello, and welcome to Open Mind, You of All Radio. I am

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your host, Alejandro Rojas, and
I am joined by Uh, this guy's

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really cool. Cool dude, he's
so cool. In fact, I'm gonna

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call him today, Martin Polar Bear
Willis. Yes, did I tell you

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that we at snow last night?
Oh? You did? I didn't even

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know that. I think I remote
viewed that just now. You must have.

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Yeah. Yeah, it's a beautiful
winter wonderland. But it's just too

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darn early, if you ask me. Yeah, I knew it was cold,

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but isn't it. I mean,
it's that time. It's already late

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November, it's almost Thanksgiving. I
know. It's just we're so spoiled last

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year, such a beautiful winter,
really, so I didn't see too much

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snow. I've become less of a
fan of snow as time goes on,

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I guess, Yeah, I hear
you. I mean I am like definitely

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afraid of snow. I did set
my trip to go back to Denver,

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and you know, when I left
Denver, I thought i'd miss it,

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but I don't at all. It's
like I just do not look forward to

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the ice and cold and the snow
and it makes me cringe just thinking about

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it here sitting here in my flip
flops at the office here. Yeah,

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yeah, yeah, I'm gonna have
to put on shoes and socks. Well,

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looking forward to February already when I
have wake up to snow like this.

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Oh yeah, yeah. Out here
it's going to be beautiful. It'll

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be great because you know, out
here where we are able to wear less

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clothing, which is more natural,
like you know, when we were out

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in the wild. That's right,
you know, so we get to live

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more more like our wild, primitive
selves. You yes, yeah, all

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right. So my guest today is
a friend to you and I, and

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this is Ryan Sprague and really happy. His book is called Somewhere in the

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Skies, this new book that he
got out. I'm happy to have him

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on the show again. I've had
him on before, and I think I

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was one of the first people to
have him on, but he really kind

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of came out, uh you know, into the UFO field with us here

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at Open Minds. He started writing
for our magazine and written for the website,

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and so he's always been our buddy. And so it's appropriate and exciting

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that his first lecture at a UFO
conference will be at the UFO Congress,

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and I always like having people who
I think are great do their first lectures

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at our conference, especially if I
have faith in them, and I have

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the utmost faith in Ryan Sprock doing
a great job. But you know,

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we had Erica Luke's on the show
not too long ago, and she has

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she this won't be her first lecture, but she hasn't done this much and

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I've heard some great feedback, luckily
from I think what was her first lecture.

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So excited to have her doing a
lecture too. So we go a

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little bit out on the limb.
But with Ryan, I think it's a

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no brainer. He's just everybody loves
him and he's gonna do a great job.

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So I'm just really excited about that. Yeah, the guy has a

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huge personality. And it's Sprague,
by the way. I know you're just

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teasing him, aren't you. No, How do you know it's I don't

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think that's how you said that name. He's always told me Sprague. Okay,

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maybe he's uh maybe, I don't
know. Maybe that's how his family

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pronounced that name. Yeah, I
thought you were teasing him. Actually,

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No, like Prague Sprague like Prague
is. I'm pretty sure the way he's

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always told me. Well, may
I just stand corrected then? Yeah?

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Or I could be wrong, But
since the show was pre recorded, when

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I bring him on, I won't
be able to ask him. But we'll

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have to ask him at some point. Well, if you only had that

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darn travel time travel machine, you'd
be able to. But I've always said

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Sprague, and if I remember correct, he said it's like Prague. I'll

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bear yeah about that. Well,
in these parts here in Maine, they

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we have the Sprague oil and oh, spelled exactly the same. So it's

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a you know, big uh big
thing in Maine. Well how about that?

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Yeah, who knows? They could
pronounce it wrong. It's America.

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It's not like I say my name
exactly like it's supposed to be. Can't

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even physically move my mouth to say
raha, sir. I can't roll my

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rs. So oh, there you
go. See, So it could be

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one of those things. But so
before we talked to Ryan, though,

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you and I always talk ufhone news. In fact, that's what you're here

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for, not just to goof around, but to actually talk some UFON news.

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Well work, okay, yes,
all right, So this is an

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interesting image and it was posted on
November sixteenth, and a witness wonders if

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a video captured an alien. And
if you look at this, it looks

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like a silhouette of you know,
like you can almost even see like shadows

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where the eyes would be. It
looks like a silhouette of a gray I

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will tell you that, but well, i'll go into further you know,

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my thoughts about this, but it
is a spooky looking image. And it

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was taken back on June of June
seventeenth of this year, and it was

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during a video chat and the lights
were out and here's the witness is saying,

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my bathroom light was on so I
could see my computer. The witness

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stated, that is the light on
the left and the window curtains to the

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right. Whatever had to be right
behind me. So she's thinking this being

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possibly was right behind her. And
she has experienced of odd things and in

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the past, so you know,
to me, I just think it's just

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one of those oddball things that happened. And you know, you instantly try

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to make sense of any type of
image you see. I mean, it's

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a natural evolutionary thing that we do
as humans, and so it's there's also

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a I think it's called peridolia something
like that, and that's when it's a

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psychological psychological phenomenon, when the mind
perceives a familiar pattern where none actually exists.

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Of course, we can all look
at this image, not just her,

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and see that. Indeed, it
does look pretty freaky and it's a

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very round, large head looking thing. But what did you think about all

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that? So kind of a Jesus
On toasting alien in video chat? Yeah,

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by the way, did you know
that sold for I think it was

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twenty thousand dollars on eBay the coast. The piece of Toasti's in the museum

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in Las Vegas. Holy moly.
Yeah, that's pretty incredible. Yeah,

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I think this is that same kind
of thing. I mean, that's what

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the move On investigator said in this
report that he felt it was periodolia as

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well, because it's just a really
poor resolution image and it's real fuzzy and

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everything, so that it's just the
shapes of the shadow makes it look like

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it might be an alien. Even
you can even see two dark spots in

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the little eye area, right,
Yeah, so they're almond shaped, you

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know, just like just like the
other depictions so interesting. Jesus on toast

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or creepy alien creeping up on this
girl while she's video chatting. Yeah,

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photo bomb, it's a video bomb. Mm right, what did they did

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start doing that? I didn't realize
those things were saved the video chats.

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No. I think she said she
took a screenshot. I got it.

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Yeah, so, and who knows. Maybe they're or chatting and they're like,

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it's eel, buddy, that looks
that shadow looks like an alien buying

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you. And they're like that screenshot
and said that they'll move on. So

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that could be what happened. But
I guess you never know. But what

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if that's how aliens decide to start
to introduce themselves by kind of photo bombing

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us wow in chat rooms and things. Yeah, and our selfies. I

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mean we're a selfie nation, right, that's right. So that would be

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interesting that It makes me think I
saw a rival recently which was very good,

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and so you know, thinking about
this kind of first contact type of

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scenario, maybe that could be it. Oh you did go see that.

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I am slated to see that tomorrow
actually tomorrow. Cool. I hope you

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like it. People, we'll talk
more about it next week or the following

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week, or on your show or
at some point in a few sure.

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Sure, yeah, yeah, Well, although I already gave away the spoiler

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of the Chihuahua thing on your that's
true. Was it your show or it

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was? Yeah, I know it's
maybe. Yeah, I'll spoil my audience

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to you though. Just how I
told Martin. It was, she brings

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in her Chihuahua to meet the aliens
and they start barking. It starts barking

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at the aliens, and she's freaking
out, and she discovers it. The

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Chihuahua isn't trying to attack, The
aliens are communicating, and that's how Chihuahua's

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take over the world. Kind of
like Planet of the Apes. I added

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that last part. See, I
like my story maybe better. Her rival

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was good. It's probably gonna win
all of these awards. But the Chihuahua

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Planet of the Apes kind of thing. Might we might have something there.

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I think I see a sequel in
this. Yeah, yep, maybe a

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sequel to it. So another move
on debunking actually was this Trump UFO thing.

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So we had written about this quite
a while ago, which was that

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you know, Trump was coming in
somewhere I can't at the Iowa State Fair

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to say hi to people during the
campaign, and somebody took a couple of

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pictures and said, oh, there's
a UFO following it, but move on.

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Finally, I guess, because that
story's popped up again, release their

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report and wrote about that. Roger
Marsha did that via our website at Open

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Minds to not TV and they said
it's probably just a bird or a bug,

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which what I think most of us
had determined way back when. But

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of course the tabloids being what they
are, they're running with it and thinking

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maybe aliens are chasing Trump or something. So how did this, like this

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story revive itself. I think it
was just one of the tabloids dredged it

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back up because they had written about
it before or you know, when it

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kind of became a thing. And
I think they just because the timing,

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just drudged it back up and decided
to rerun it, and which you know,

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and so it's getting some more play. So anytime you put right now,

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especially now, you put the word
Trump and UFO together, I'm sure

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it's gonna get a lot of hits
and get a lot of attention. Yeah,

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exactly. So. Also, did
you watch that video we released on

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Friday? Uh? No, I
have not seen that yet. Are you

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at a computer? Yes, yeah, go play it because it's very short

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while I explain what's going on here. Alrighty then, so we have Yeah,

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we've got a vast photo archive from
Wendell Stevens, this guy who had

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researched for decades and people send him
pictures, but he also sought pictures out.

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Many of the pictures are from the
past, so before photoshop, and

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some of them are very, very
mysterious. So we've shared them on the

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magazine, the print magazine that we
used to do, the Open Minds magazine,

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but we also have been putting them
over the years online in videos or

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we write stories about them or both. So Michael Klein are our video guy,

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has been putting together some videos of
these, and the latest one he

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posted and put together was of some
photographs from him Megie himagie. Oh yes,

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I did watch Japan. Yeah.
They're from August of nineteen seventy six,

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taken by an eleven year old kid. He was with some friends when

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they saw this dark moving object.
He captured four color photos and it was

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kind of funny. I guess this
wasn't the first time they had seen the

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object. A month prior they had
seen it, but the photos really made

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it to UFO researchers when the guy
at the photoshop was, you know,

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printing him up and he saw them
and he said, oh my gosh,

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I got to get this to some
UFO people. So he contacted the UFO

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Research organization and got them in contact
with the kid. So then they were

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able to kind of investigate the whole
thing, uh, and they determined there

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was no fraud, that this was
something these guys had seen. And you

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know, if you zoom in on
the object, you see this kind of

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like a dome shape. Yeah,
like a dome on top of a dome,

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type of strange shape. So pretty
weird pictures. And again these are

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before photoshops, so pretty interesting.
You meant to say at the develop you

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said at the photoshop, and it
sounds like it's photoshop. You meant to

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say, when the film was getting
developed the Yeah, when the ALM was

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getting developed at the at a photoshop, right, yeah, at the program

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photoshop. Yeah, but it's before
the program photoshop, when they actually had

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these places called photoshops. Kids might
not know that. Yeah, yeah,

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I didn't really call them that.
I didn't know that. Well, that's

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why photoshop is called photoshoph Wow,
yeah, you're kind of see you learned

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something new all the time I did. Well, you were alive in nineteen

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seventy six when this picture was taken. I was, yes, you were

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already like my age. Oh come
on now, who are In fact,

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I'm just kidding. In fact,
I was in diapers when this picture came

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out. I remember sitting there in
diapers when I got a phone call.

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Hey, we've got this new UFO
photo in Japan. Could you take a

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look at it? I said,
yeah, this is interesting. At that

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time, I didn't have as much
experience with the whole thing, you know,

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only a few years experience, so
I wasn't able to do an in

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depth analysis. But they were thankful
for my input. And yeah, yeah,

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well you were. That was back
when you were believing all the third

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phase of the moon videos as well. I think, well, that's before

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their time. This is when I
used to analyze pictures by taking them and

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chewing on them, you know,
coming them up and getting them all soggy,

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and then handing them back and then
you know, I would shake like

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a little. I would tell them
my opinion at that point. So hey,

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everyone's going to start somewhere. So
yeah, yeah, so all right,

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well, is there any more news
you wanted to talk about? No,

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that's it for me here, okay, good, good, Well,

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thank you so much for joining us
again. I hope you're able to keep

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warm and keep your computer warm because
I know, you know, we had

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some computer issues coming in because of
possibly it's coldness and the studio's too cold.

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Yes, yeah, oh my gosh, that would be I mean,

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I rarely have to when we go
camping. I'll wear a coat, but

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that's about it, and it's nice. I like being warm. But hey,

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thank you so much for coming on
the show again. You and I

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have a great holiday. By the
way, Hello, yeah, Thanksgiving.

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Yeah, happy Thanksgiving everyone out there. And I doubt I'll be able to

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put together a show because I'm going
to have all this family in town and

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this craziness going on. So I'm
sure I'll talk to you on your show.

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Otherwise, as far as open minds, it'll be a couple of weeks.

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All right, all right, do
you have a good one. Talk

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to you soon, let's go ahead
and talk to Ryan Sprague or Sprague.

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I am very excited to welcome back
to the show. Ryan Sprague. Hello,

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Hey, Elehndro. It's been a
while. Mm hmmm. Whereas I

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like to say, and I hope
you don't take offense, I like to

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say Spragu sometimes. I have had
so many nicknames throughout my childhood, being

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an athlete, growing up and whatnot. So it's I love it. You

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know, give me what you got, I'll take it. And it is

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a total compliment because it makes me
think of Raygu and I love Ygu,

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and it makes me hungry for Italian
and and spaghetti. So and it's a

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it's a very pleasant feeling I have
when I when I think of that,

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the name that with you, I'll
tell you it's my favorite food. So

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I'm with you on that one.
Yeah. And you're in a great place

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for it, living in Manhattan.
Mm hmm. Yeah. Yeah, I'm

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here in New York City. I'm
currently resided in Queens. But I did

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I did do the whole Manhattanite lifestyle
when I first moved here, but I

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moved out to the quote unquote Burrow
Urbs at this point to just get a

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little bit more quiet, you know, some piece of quiet while I ruinate

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on UFOs and whatnot. So yeah, man, I'm going on ten years

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here, so I'm an official New
Yorker, I guess. Yeah. Well,

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and for those of us that you
know live out here in suburbia and

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the rest of the world, I
mean, Queens is still New York,

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you know, It's it's still city
to us. Oh yeah. Even when

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I have people come visit and I
tell them this is the quiet area,

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They're like, are you kidding me? Yeah it is. Yeah. I

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grew up in small town Syracuse,
New York, so I definitely know what

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it's like to live in the suburbs
for sure. But I would give anything

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to be out there in Arizona right
now. Trust me. Well, you'll

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be here soon enough, because the
UFO Congress is just a few months away,

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and you will be one of our
exciting speakers. Yes, I am

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so excited. It'll be my first
conference ever. So what an honor.

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I you know, immediately when you
asked me, I said yes without even

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thinking about it. And I'm putting
my talk together every day, and I'm

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really looking forward to bringing some new
stuff to the table. For sure.

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Well when you you know, had
announced you were writing this book or you

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were in even in the process,
I think at our last conference or while

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that was happening, but I thought, you know, oh, Man,

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and I had been thinking it would
be so cool if we could be the

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first people or the first conference that
Ryan speaks at, and I thought it's

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probably just not gonna happen. I
mean, because there's so long to go.

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Everybody's gonna you know, and I
get surprised people haven't had to speak

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at their conferences before, and it
looks like we're gonna make it. I

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think we'll make it where we will
be the first, and that's gonna be

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awesome because I have no doubt.
You know, you're definitely well loved in

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this field already, even though you
haven't spoken at conferences, and I just

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have every faith that people are gonna
love your information. They always do,

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so we also feel on it.
We're super happy that. You know,

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it's really cool that will be the
first venue for one of your talks,

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one of many, many many to
come, I'm sure, I hope so.

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Man. Again, like I think, it's all about getting new material

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out there and a fresh perspective and
I think that's what the quote unquote younger

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guard is really trying to do.
I mean, I'm thirty two years old

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and I'm considered young in this field, and I don't think that's right.

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I don't think that's right. But
when I come to your conference for your

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listeners that don't know, I volunteer
every year. I wasn't able to come

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last year, but I love coming
out there, and you know, whatever

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I have to do, tape down
chords, do the sound, do the

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lights. I love what you do, and you're bringing You're bringing the most

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credibility to this field that we could
possibly ask for. And I noticed that

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immediately and I wanted to be a
part of it. And that's what I

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tried to do with the book and
hopefully what I can do for the people

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who come to the conference. For
sure. Yeah, this time you won't

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be backstage because you'll be at your
table too, selling your books, so

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people can come talk to you and
buy the books, which is a lot

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of fun. But it's going to
be great to have you back. We

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definitely missed you last year. I
missed you guys too, So the book,

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00:22:33.079 --> 00:22:37.119
yeah, and bringing this new perspective. What approach did you take.

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The book is called Somewhere in the
Skies. It was just released. It

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was published by Richard Dolan Press,
so Richard Dolan and you might not even

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00:22:45.519 --> 00:22:51.000
know this yet, so this is
probably news to you. I just posted

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are essentially our rough draft of the
schedule. Hopefully it'll stick, but you

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00:22:55.880 --> 00:23:00.319
never know what happens. So I've
got you speaking right before Richard Dolan on

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00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:04.680
Saturday morning. Oh man, that
is uh, that's a lot to live

286
00:23:04.759 --> 00:23:07.759
up to you for sure. That's
like being the opening band for you too,

287
00:23:07.880 --> 00:23:11.359
or something. Well, at least
we had before and not after,

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which might be more daunting. Exactly. I wouldn't be able to live up

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00:23:15.720 --> 00:23:22.359
to that, No, don't.
Richard's amazing. I couldn't have asked for

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00:23:22.359 --> 00:23:26.960
a better publisher and someone to sort
of take me under his wing, show

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00:23:26.000 --> 00:23:30.039
me how it's done. And he's
one of my biggest inspirations. That's for

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darn shore, and that's exciting.
Yeah, that's the first I heard about

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it, So wow, I gotta
get I gotta get moving on this.

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But yeah, everything I did.
So when you decided to write a book,

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00:23:45.000 --> 00:23:49.119
I mean, was it at someone's
request or had you already thought about

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00:23:49.119 --> 00:23:53.759
it. Well, I've been you
know, I've been writing articles for you

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00:23:53.799 --> 00:24:00.880
guys for a while, a couple
other magazines out there as well, and

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I you know, it's it's limited
when you're writing articles. Your your job

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00:24:06.640 --> 00:24:10.559
as a journalist is to be objective, to do it concise, and you're

300
00:24:10.599 --> 00:24:12.559
limited to word counts and whatnot.
But I really wanted to give my own

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00:24:12.599 --> 00:24:17.640
opinion and be able to sort of
elaborate on those things I was writing about.

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And that's when I contacted Rich and
I said, hey, man,

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I want to write a book for
you, and he said, awesome,

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00:24:22.279 --> 00:24:27.640
what about And honestly, Alejandra,
I had no idea what my sort of

305
00:24:27.680 --> 00:24:33.599
my theos. Yeah, that's literally
what I said to the matter the UFOs.

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00:24:33.960 --> 00:24:37.319
He's like, yeah, great,
so does everybody what what? What

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about them? And that's really when
I had to sit down, as the

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sort of naive researcher that I was
at the time, and think, what

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can I What can I do?
How can I benefit the field and the

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00:24:51.200 --> 00:24:55.680
study and bring to the table something
new that people will actually not just want

311
00:24:55.680 --> 00:25:00.640
to read but think about. And
that's when he and I I sort of

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00:25:00.720 --> 00:25:04.519
narrowed it on this idea that let's
focus on the individuals, those who've witnessed

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00:25:04.640 --> 00:25:11.440
UFOs, those who've possibly had contact
and or an abduction experience with the possible

314
00:25:11.440 --> 00:25:18.599
occupants of said UFOs. So that's
what I did. The subtitle is a

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00:25:18.680 --> 00:25:22.599
human approach to an alien phenomenon,
And that's really what I focused on is

316
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how did the event affect these people's
lives afterwards? And while I cover the

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00:25:27.799 --> 00:25:32.519
event itself, it's not the focal
point of the book. It is the

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00:25:32.559 --> 00:25:37.920
implication to the event. How did
it change their lives? Religiously, socially,

319
00:25:37.680 --> 00:25:44.039
economically, sexually, psychologically, Everything
you can think of can be tied

320
00:25:44.079 --> 00:25:48.799
to the singular event, and I
really wanted to explore that. So I

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00:25:48.799 --> 00:25:53.519
interviewed, over span of two years, about two hundred people. I narrowed

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00:25:53.519 --> 00:25:57.240
it down to a couple dozen,
and that's what I focused on in the

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book. I followed them through the
event and talk to their family members,

324
00:26:02.720 --> 00:26:07.240
you know, people in their community, and how it changed them and how

325
00:26:07.240 --> 00:26:11.920
their outlook changed after the event,
and how it propels them forward. Were

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00:26:11.960 --> 00:26:18.480
these all people who believed they had
then some sort of contact, not necessarily

327
00:26:19.160 --> 00:26:26.799
The first sort of quarter of the
book chronicles people who've had UFO sightings something

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00:26:26.880 --> 00:26:34.359
so what many consider mundane just lights
in the sky or possible triangular craft or

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00:26:36.599 --> 00:26:41.960
quote unquote flying saucers. So while
they don't necessarily believe they were in contact

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00:26:42.000 --> 00:26:48.279
with any sort of et intelligence,
what they saw conveyed something otherworldly, something

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00:26:48.319 --> 00:26:52.400
they could not explain. So the
first, like I said, quarter of

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00:26:52.400 --> 00:27:00.119
the book follows those people and how
those events changed maybe their beliefs. I've

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00:27:00.160 --> 00:27:03.480
got a couple of pilots who I
interview, I've got a whole chapter on

334
00:27:03.640 --> 00:27:10.640
military witnesses, and you know how
that changed their outlook on everything they once

335
00:27:10.720 --> 00:27:17.200
perceived and their mindset moving forward.
And then I gradually work up to possible

336
00:27:17.279 --> 00:27:23.160
contact and then abduction experiences. So
there's definitely a three part structure to the

337
00:27:23.200 --> 00:27:33.079
book. It's interesting to me just
how impactful sightings, which many consider mundane

338
00:27:33.880 --> 00:27:41.119
are two people, even lights in
the sky doing weird stuff they shouldn't be

339
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can really have a strong effect.
I mean, did you find that with

340
00:27:45.400 --> 00:27:48.200
some of the people you talked to? Oh? Yeah, I mean I

341
00:27:48.240 --> 00:27:53.119
spoke to one guy in South Carolina
who saw these orange orbs, which I

342
00:27:53.160 --> 00:28:00.279
know you've covered on previous episodes with
certain researchers and whatnot. While these can

343
00:28:00.400 --> 00:28:07.319
sometimes be attributed to weather anomalies or
condensed energies you know, bald lightning we

344
00:28:07.400 --> 00:28:14.160
sometimes refer to, there are just
no explanation for some of these things.

345
00:28:14.200 --> 00:28:18.039
And this gentleman in South Carolina witnessed
this with other people around, was able

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00:28:18.079 --> 00:28:22.359
to videotape it, sent it off
to movefon, sent it off to the

347
00:28:22.480 --> 00:28:29.720
FAA, the nearby Air Force base. Nobody recorded anything in the skies that

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00:28:29.839 --> 00:28:36.599
night, so whatever he saw was
not a conventional and or commercial flight.

349
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Apparently it was not military. But
this changed this man's life a and andro.

350
00:28:41.720 --> 00:28:47.319
He he was a pretty stand up
guy, pretty laid back beforehand,

351
00:28:48.160 --> 00:28:52.839
very salt of the earth everything.
And after this event, he felt like

352
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something was sort of unlocked in his
mind and he became an artist. You

353
00:28:57.880 --> 00:29:04.839
know. We started seeing patterns within
his own perception of a blank slate in

354
00:29:04.880 --> 00:29:08.240
front of him, whether it was
you know, white paper, he would

355
00:29:08.279 --> 00:29:14.559
just start drawing and making these elaborate
patterns, and he was creating. And

356
00:29:14.599 --> 00:29:18.799
that was a passion he never really
had before the event. It was driving

357
00:29:18.880 --> 00:29:25.519
him to do something, to become
an artist, to find an outlet of

358
00:29:25.559 --> 00:29:30.039
sorts for what he had seen and
try to convey that in artistic ways.

359
00:29:30.759 --> 00:29:34.400
So that's just one of many that
I found. But a lot of people,

360
00:29:34.480 --> 00:29:41.319
yeah, they it completely changed their
concept of conventional aircraft first of all,

361
00:29:41.799 --> 00:29:47.759
and the perception of reality thereafter.
But I think that's fascinating. It's

362
00:29:47.759 --> 00:29:52.839
so fascinating that someone's life can completely
change by an event, any event,

363
00:29:55.440 --> 00:30:00.519
Loan, an event like this,
and regardless of what it was he actually

364
00:30:00.559 --> 00:30:06.240
experienced, and some he may never
know, but it can change your life

365
00:30:06.319 --> 00:30:11.160
so much. So some of these
people, you even spoke to friends and

366
00:30:11.200 --> 00:30:15.720
family or people around them who I'm
assuming also recognize this change in these people

367
00:30:17.759 --> 00:30:22.440
absolutely, you know, from the
day after the event. Yeah, some

368
00:30:22.519 --> 00:30:26.200
of some of these people it was
gradual, but for some it was immediate.

369
00:30:26.400 --> 00:30:32.920
And you can't argue with something like
that. These could even be attributed

370
00:30:32.960 --> 00:30:37.319
to a traumatic event in someone's life. Say you're in a car accident and

371
00:30:37.359 --> 00:30:44.279
you you never walk, and as
tragic as that is, that's going to

372
00:30:44.400 --> 00:30:48.400
change the way you live the rest
of your life, both physically, emotionally,

373
00:30:48.440 --> 00:30:53.079
and psychologically. So a lot of
these UFO events could be considered a

374
00:30:53.079 --> 00:30:59.880
traumatic event and that can often unlock
things in your brain. I've talked to

375
00:31:00.240 --> 00:31:04.839
Bishop a lot lately about this idea
of trauma unlocking things and opening up your

376
00:31:04.880 --> 00:31:11.880
awareness. There have been people who
have reported being able to speak an entire

377
00:31:11.000 --> 00:31:18.119
language after having a traumatic event that
they'd never spoken before or learned or remembered

378
00:31:18.160 --> 00:31:25.000
having learned. So a lot of
this has to do with the mind.

379
00:31:25.359 --> 00:31:30.319
And that's kind of where I'm heading
in my research. Is this whole cerebral

380
00:31:30.400 --> 00:31:36.240
aspect of the UFO phenomenon, you
know, not getting too metaphysical or in

381
00:31:36.279 --> 00:31:40.359
the consciousness realm, but there is
something to it and something that I think

382
00:31:40.440 --> 00:31:44.200
happens to each and every one of
these people, Like we said, from

383
00:31:44.240 --> 00:31:48.319
simple lights in the sky all the
way up to possible abductions. And you

384
00:31:48.319 --> 00:31:52.720
know, I think that's what's a
fascinating aspect of the whole thing, is

385
00:31:52.759 --> 00:31:59.319
that it's more than just lights in
the sky or even if these things are

386
00:31:59.480 --> 00:32:04.799
mundane, the effects or some of
these events are. The effects that they

387
00:32:04.839 --> 00:32:09.599
have on people and their perceptions are
really important, especially when you're dealing with

388
00:32:12.759 --> 00:32:19.519
such a large percent of the population
that is being affected somehow. Yeah.

389
00:32:19.839 --> 00:32:25.319
Yeah, And that's the other thing
the percentage of people having the experiences is

390
00:32:25.440 --> 00:32:30.279
much higher than we think. A
lot of people think UFOs are on the

391
00:32:30.319 --> 00:32:37.680
down the downfall, as it were. You know that uphology is coinciding with

392
00:32:37.759 --> 00:32:42.839
the lack of reports being made.
I don't necessarily see that true. You

393
00:32:42.880 --> 00:32:45.599
can take this book, for instance, a lot of events I cover,

394
00:32:46.440 --> 00:32:51.160
we're pretty darn recent, to be
honest, dating all the way up to

395
00:32:51.279 --> 00:32:53.960
like last year. I've got a
few that go pretty far back. But

396
00:32:54.960 --> 00:32:59.599
these things are still happening, and
they're happening all over the world. This

397
00:32:59.680 --> 00:33:04.160
isn't just a Western phenomenon. And
we know that we have reports from all

398
00:33:04.240 --> 00:33:09.680
over of these things happening, and
it does affect the family dynamic or a

399
00:33:09.759 --> 00:33:15.160
community dynamic as well. When these
things are reported. If you have one

400
00:33:15.200 --> 00:33:19.599
of these quote unquote abductees in your
town, your town, entire town has

401
00:33:19.640 --> 00:33:23.559
looked at differently. You know,
look at stuff like Allagash or Snowflake Arizona.

402
00:33:24.359 --> 00:33:30.720
That town is now known by that
face, whether it's Travis Walton or

403
00:33:30.319 --> 00:33:37.440
or what have you. This affects
everything, absolutely everything, whether it is

404
00:33:37.519 --> 00:33:43.839
a hoax or not. It's fascinating. It's a big sociological study for sure,

405
00:33:43.920 --> 00:33:46.920
and what I try to tap into
in the book and in my further

406
00:33:47.039 --> 00:33:52.599
research, I always think of,
you know, I keep thinking right now

407
00:33:52.039 --> 00:33:57.240
of that scene in Closing Encounters where
Truffau or the you know, the the

408
00:33:57.400 --> 00:34:01.000
French guy modeled after shockvallet is he
is talking to the military and he's he

409
00:34:01.480 --> 00:34:06.720
is so trying to get his point
across at I think it's the only moment

410
00:34:06.759 --> 00:34:13.039
he actually speaks English and he says, this is an event sociological Remember that.

411
00:34:13.119 --> 00:34:15.239
Do you remember that? I do. I was trying to get this

412
00:34:15.280 --> 00:34:21.559
across. But that's why, you
know, I guess. My next question

413
00:34:21.639 --> 00:34:24.719
leading up to what I'm getting at, I guess is do you have photos

414
00:34:25.199 --> 00:34:30.880
in your book? You like UFO
photos? No? No, no,

415
00:34:30.880 --> 00:34:34.880
no photos in the book. When
I first sat down to write it,

416
00:34:34.960 --> 00:34:38.679
I wanted to have a photo of
each individual in the book. First of

417
00:34:38.760 --> 00:34:44.119
all, everyone uses the real names
in the book. There are no pseudonyms.

418
00:34:44.679 --> 00:34:46.159
I made that clear from the start. Like, you know, if

419
00:34:46.199 --> 00:34:51.440
you're going to come forward with the
event, I want you to know that

420
00:34:51.440 --> 00:34:55.280
that I want your face front and
center. This book is about you,

421
00:34:55.719 --> 00:35:01.480
not the phenomenon and not me.
This is about you. So I told

422
00:35:01.559 --> 00:35:04.519
them, I want your real name. If you're not okay with that,

423
00:35:04.599 --> 00:35:07.599
I'm sorry. I got to move
on to somebody else. And that might

424
00:35:07.639 --> 00:35:12.679
seem a little, you know,
rude at first, but again, we're

425
00:35:12.719 --> 00:35:15.760
trying to get the most credible cases
out there to make this field of study

426
00:35:16.840 --> 00:35:22.920
both digestible and relatable, and I
thought having their faces front and center would

427
00:35:22.960 --> 00:35:30.239
do that. That would have taken
a lot of legal things and what not

428
00:35:30.360 --> 00:35:34.760
to do, so I decided not
to put photos in the book, but

429
00:35:35.039 --> 00:35:37.719
I do go on to describe,
you know, what I thought of these

430
00:35:37.760 --> 00:35:40.679
people when I first met them face
to face or when I first called them

431
00:35:40.679 --> 00:35:45.840
on the phone. You know,
what their voice was like, how there,

432
00:35:45.599 --> 00:35:49.599
you know, a husband grabbed the
hand of the wife who had the

433
00:35:49.679 --> 00:35:53.719
experience, and how she was trembling. I think small things like that really

434
00:35:53.800 --> 00:36:00.800
help in that aspect. And we've
we've mentioned before my first my passion here

435
00:36:00.800 --> 00:36:05.119
in New York is I'm a playwright. I focus on characters, and that's

436
00:36:05.199 --> 00:36:08.119
kind of what I took into this
book is to focus on that person,

437
00:36:08.280 --> 00:36:12.800
what makes them who they are and
how this event changed who they are.

438
00:36:14.239 --> 00:36:17.760
And the reason I asked you the
question is that I figured, you know,

439
00:36:17.800 --> 00:36:22.239
that would be your answer at least, that you didn't have photos,

440
00:36:22.760 --> 00:36:28.039
because I agree with you that these
stories are really the heart of the content

441
00:36:28.599 --> 00:36:31.440
of the phenomena, because you know, we get a lot of people when

442
00:36:31.440 --> 00:36:36.280
we post the story saying where's the
photo, where's the video, And it's

443
00:36:36.320 --> 00:36:38.519
like, you know, who cares
if there's a photo or video? Most

444
00:36:38.559 --> 00:36:43.599
of the time the photo or video
is poor, it doesn't really help the

445
00:36:43.599 --> 00:36:47.920
case very much. And even regardless
of whether there is a photo or video,

446
00:36:49.400 --> 00:36:53.960
it hinges on the content of what
the witness has to say. So

447
00:36:54.039 --> 00:36:57.840
that's really kind of the meat of
the story. I think this. It's

448
00:36:57.920 --> 00:37:00.519
just that maybe it's people are so
you know, they don't want to read

449
00:37:02.719 --> 00:37:08.000
it's some of it. But but
just kind of agreeing with you that that

450
00:37:08.280 --> 00:37:15.159
the content, those little details you're
talking about are what's important, and for

451
00:37:15.280 --> 00:37:21.119
people who have an experience, that's
really what they are fascinated by. When

452
00:37:21.159 --> 00:37:24.960
it comes to other people's experiences as
well, it seems, oh yeah,

453
00:37:25.000 --> 00:37:29.679
absolutely, And you know what,
I do see both sides of it,

454
00:37:29.679 --> 00:37:31.679
Alexandra, I fall victim to that
A lot of you know, prove it

455
00:37:31.719 --> 00:37:37.440
to me, show me photographic evidence
and that Unfortunately, that's that's the only

456
00:37:37.599 --> 00:37:40.599
sort of things that are going to
get the scientific community interested in this.

457
00:37:40.760 --> 00:37:49.719
Can we have evidence, irrefutable evidence, or repeatability to study? You know,

458
00:37:50.400 --> 00:37:52.960
most of the time these UFOs are
gone in the blink of an eye,

459
00:37:52.039 --> 00:37:57.039
So what is there to analyze?
Nothing? So a lot of the

460
00:37:57.119 --> 00:38:01.440
time all we have to rest on
is the story. And that's that's a

461
00:38:01.440 --> 00:38:06.760
big struggle for some people. I
don't I don't expect everyone to believe every

462
00:38:06.760 --> 00:38:09.760
story I tell in the book.
Do I believe every story? Yes?

463
00:38:10.119 --> 00:38:15.199
Absolutely. These are the most genuine
people I could find out there and that

464
00:38:15.239 --> 00:38:20.960
have had some of the most extraordinary
experiences. Now, whether or not it

465
00:38:21.079 --> 00:38:25.199
is quote unquote alien in terms of
e T that's a completely different story.

466
00:38:25.760 --> 00:38:30.960
The alien in my subtitle is more
of a you know, this was foreign

467
00:38:30.079 --> 00:38:37.880
to this human being. This event
was not something they were used to by

468
00:38:37.000 --> 00:38:42.920
any conventional terms. So again,
yes, for those who argue that a

469
00:38:42.960 --> 00:38:45.960
story is not enough, I would
have to argue and say a lot of

470
00:38:45.960 --> 00:38:51.239
the times it's all we have mm
hmm. And and I fall back on

471
00:38:51.480 --> 00:38:53.519
you know, I start to think
of, well, what are the best

472
00:38:53.639 --> 00:38:59.840
cases out there, and the best
cases out there that I feel art of

473
00:38:59.880 --> 00:39:04.760
that cases don't have photos or videos. So for example, Rendall Shim,

474
00:39:04.760 --> 00:39:07.199
which of course you're very familiar with. I think that's what we talked about

475
00:39:07.239 --> 00:39:09.480
last time you were on where you
were working on the play for that,

476
00:39:10.000 --> 00:39:15.719
but there's really no photos of a
craft or video of a craft there.

477
00:39:15.800 --> 00:39:21.280
The same with let's say Travis Walton, who you mentioned earlier, or Phoenix

478
00:39:21.400 --> 00:39:25.320
Lights has maybe a couple of very
controversial videos, but the heart of that

479
00:39:25.480 --> 00:39:30.840
case is in all of these is
the number of witnesses, the credibility of

480
00:39:30.880 --> 00:39:35.519
the witnesses, and the content of
what they have to say. Yes,

481
00:39:35.880 --> 00:39:39.440
absolutely. And you talk to some
of the family members of these people and

482
00:39:39.480 --> 00:39:43.599
you say, well do you believe
them? And they all say, I

483
00:39:43.760 --> 00:39:47.679
believe that they believe this happened.
And that's a very convoluted way of saying

484
00:39:47.719 --> 00:39:52.480
it. But again, that's what
we have. And you just mentioned three

485
00:39:52.519 --> 00:39:58.920
of the top cases arguably in uphology, and none of them have photographic evidence

486
00:39:59.800 --> 00:40:05.000
or anything to really back them up. We just have very genuine people who

487
00:40:06.159 --> 00:40:10.719
we can we can only trust our
telling us the truth. Sometimes that's that's

488
00:40:10.880 --> 00:40:17.559
enough for me. Now you mentioned
something really important. And I think with

489
00:40:17.639 --> 00:40:25.400
your book as well, that you
went with people who weren't afraid to share

490
00:40:25.440 --> 00:40:31.159
their name. And I think this
is what's really interesting is about your book,

491
00:40:31.199 --> 00:40:36.840
because there are a lot of people
witnesses, let's say, you know,

492
00:40:37.119 --> 00:40:40.000
such as these stories that we post
on on a daily basis of people

493
00:40:40.039 --> 00:40:47.639
seeing things or experiencing things, but
it's more rare for the person to be

494
00:40:47.800 --> 00:40:53.719
bold enough to share that experience with
friends and family. And often those people

495
00:40:53.760 --> 00:40:59.760
who do it's because it's been so
impactful they just kind of can't contain it.

496
00:41:00.079 --> 00:41:07.599
So that's what I think adds to
make the cases that you cover even

497
00:41:07.800 --> 00:41:13.480
more interesting. And I guess I
was wondering if you could share with an

498
00:41:13.559 --> 00:41:21.119
example of an individual maybe you can
think of whose surroundings, maybe family and

499
00:41:21.440 --> 00:41:31.239
or community, were very affected by
the experience. Yeah, definitely. There's

500
00:41:31.480 --> 00:41:36.280
one story that I can think of
in the book about a gentleman named Scott.

501
00:41:36.320 --> 00:41:40.679
He's a retired radio airman for he
was in the first Class for the

502
00:41:40.719 --> 00:41:49.239
Coastguard and he had a really dramatic
UFO siting back in nineteen seventy four in

503
00:41:49.719 --> 00:41:53.639
Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio, where he
was at a drive in with a friend

504
00:41:53.719 --> 00:41:58.679
late at night, and excuse me, not late at night, this was

505
00:41:58.840 --> 00:42:02.639
just at dusk and they're start They're
in their car, you know, hoping

506
00:42:02.679 --> 00:42:09.119
to maybe score a score a chick
or something that night, and they're about

507
00:42:09.119 --> 00:42:16.239
to start the movie and this chevron
shaped craft starts floating over the movie screen

508
00:42:16.559 --> 00:42:22.880
and over the entire parking lot.
So it's terrifying. You know. At

509
00:42:22.880 --> 00:42:27.119
this point, everyone is starting to
get out of their cars and they're staring

510
00:42:27.199 --> 00:42:31.239
up at this thing. Some people
start freaking out and they get out of

511
00:42:31.280 --> 00:42:37.039
their cars to leave, but nobody's
cars would start, so at this point

512
00:42:37.079 --> 00:42:42.239
it's directly above them. And Scott
remembers feeling like time sort of slowed down.

513
00:42:42.440 --> 00:42:46.199
Everything became hazy, very the air
became thick, this sort of fish

514
00:42:46.239 --> 00:42:52.960
bowl feeling that we hear about with
some UFO sightings. But the weirdest thing

515
00:42:52.239 --> 00:42:58.639
about it, Alejandro Scott goes to
use the restroom after this chevron shaped craft

516
00:42:59.199 --> 00:43:04.159
floats away, and nobody in the
whole drive through is talking about what just

517
00:43:04.280 --> 00:43:08.320
happened. They're all just dazed and
they continue to just wait in line for

518
00:43:08.400 --> 00:43:15.199
the restroom or go back to their
cars, which I might add, restarted

519
00:43:15.280 --> 00:43:21.320
once this thing was out of the
area and Scott couldn't remember anything that just

520
00:43:21.360 --> 00:43:24.440
happened, So he and his friend
they finished the movie and they go home.

521
00:43:25.400 --> 00:43:31.079
It wasn't until many years later when
he saw a book on UFOs that

522
00:43:31.360 --> 00:43:35.360
it was sort of a trigger and
all the memories started to fly back in

523
00:43:35.440 --> 00:43:39.719
of this event. So what Scott
did is he furiously looked for people who

524
00:43:39.719 --> 00:43:45.519
were there that night in his hometown
who had also witnessed this. He was

525
00:43:45.559 --> 00:43:49.559
able to find a couple people,
but nobody wanted to talk about it.

526
00:43:50.519 --> 00:43:54.039
He also tried to coroborate it with
his friend who was there that night and

527
00:43:54.159 --> 00:44:00.199
hasn't had any luck finding this guy. So what you have here is a

528
00:44:00.280 --> 00:44:07.760
case where a lot this was a
mass sighting, unquestionably, but everyone denied

529
00:44:07.800 --> 00:44:13.119
it or they had some sort of
instant amnesia to the event having happened.

530
00:44:13.920 --> 00:44:17.239
So this is kind of the story
of a town struggling with accepting that this

531
00:44:17.400 --> 00:44:22.559
happened, and we only have Scott
to rely on that this actually happened.

532
00:44:22.920 --> 00:44:28.119
And that's a lot of weight on
one man's shoulders when such a dramatic event

533
00:44:28.519 --> 00:44:32.239
occurred and no one's really talking about
it. So that's just one of many

534
00:44:32.280 --> 00:44:37.360
that I could find where a mass
sighting is kind of resting on the shoulders

535
00:44:37.400 --> 00:44:45.960
of one witness. Have There also
been situations which you know, an individual

536
00:44:45.440 --> 00:44:52.280
maybe who's influential in their community or
with their family, just because of title

537
00:44:52.440 --> 00:44:55.079
or because you know their characters.
Some people are kind of larger than life

538
00:44:55.159 --> 00:45:01.639
type of characters, and they were
so impacted by their event that they kind

539
00:45:01.639 --> 00:45:07.679
of brought it to everyone, and
everyone kind of I guess how did they

540
00:45:07.800 --> 00:45:14.079
deal m that's a tough one.
I can't say that I really found anyone

541
00:45:14.280 --> 00:45:19.119
of you know, such prominence that
it completely changed the structure of their town

542
00:45:19.239 --> 00:45:22.360
or anything like that. I do
cover a story about a man who had

543
00:45:22.360 --> 00:45:31.360
a very interesting and almost spiritual experience
with an abduction. Afterwards, he left

544
00:45:31.360 --> 00:45:35.039
the town he lived in, which
was here in New York City, and

545
00:45:35.280 --> 00:45:39.480
he moved away and became the pastor
of a church and started talking about his

546
00:45:39.679 --> 00:45:47.199
events and how he related this to
an angelic presence. Almost so, right

547
00:45:47.239 --> 00:45:53.440
there, you have a direct experience
influencing a man and his congregation, as

548
00:45:53.480 --> 00:45:57.360
it were. If we were to
get a little more on the religious side

549
00:45:57.400 --> 00:46:04.199
of all this, that's your interesting. Yeah, very much so that this

550
00:46:04.280 --> 00:46:10.480
one man's experience he took as a
religious one and imparted that onto the people

551
00:46:10.480 --> 00:46:14.960
who were willing to listen to him. M hmm. Now with him,

552
00:46:15.280 --> 00:46:19.960
how did you find him? I
mean did he does he believe it was

553
00:46:20.039 --> 00:46:28.280
spiritual but also extraterrestrial? Yes?
Yes, he Again we can sort of

554
00:46:28.559 --> 00:46:36.159
connect UFOs and the abduction phenomenon to
so many different things, science, religion,

555
00:46:36.960 --> 00:46:40.000
theology, everything, and this is
what this man chose. While he

556
00:46:40.079 --> 00:46:46.360
does believe that this was et and
origin, he also believes that the greater

557
00:46:46.559 --> 00:46:51.920
Power, whatever that may be,
is also the creator of these ets.

558
00:46:52.800 --> 00:46:58.199
I remember when I was, oh
gosh, very young, and I went

559
00:46:58.239 --> 00:47:01.400
to confession at my Catholic church and
I asked my pretty straight up amen,

560
00:47:01.800 --> 00:47:05.760
like, UFOs, what do you
got for me? Do you believe in

561
00:47:05.840 --> 00:47:09.280
him? What does the church believe? I really put the the inquisition on

562
00:47:09.400 --> 00:47:14.480
him, and he told me,
he said, yeah, I believe there

563
00:47:15.000 --> 00:47:19.639
there is possibly life out there,
and it just shows how great God's power

564
00:47:19.679 --> 00:47:22.159
actually is, you know. And
I don't want to get too much into

565
00:47:22.159 --> 00:47:27.320
religion, but that is a very
big facet of this phenomenon. A lot

566
00:47:27.320 --> 00:47:30.559
of people see it that way,
and a lot of people use prayer to

567
00:47:30.679 --> 00:47:35.679
try to fight it off as well. For those who may think this is

568
00:47:35.679 --> 00:47:39.639
demonic or evil in some way,
you can't fault anyone for feeling that way

569
00:47:39.679 --> 00:47:46.480
when their lives have been intruded upon
so vigorously. So right, Yeah,

570
00:47:46.559 --> 00:47:52.360
So that's funny because that that's going
to be my talk at at the conference.

571
00:47:52.400 --> 00:47:57.119
It's going to be about UFOs and
religion, their impact on religion,

572
00:47:57.800 --> 00:48:02.760
the idea of aliens and then and
you know, religions had to spawned from

573
00:48:02.760 --> 00:48:08.639
it. But I was inspired by
someone who did something similar to what you're

574
00:48:08.719 --> 00:48:15.039
talking about, although he it was
a ghost thing. So he wrote a

575
00:48:15.079 --> 00:48:19.519
book and I interviewed him about it
about something like why is a good Catholic

576
00:48:19.559 --> 00:48:22.920
boy believe in ghosts or something like
that. But that was his thing,

577
00:48:22.039 --> 00:48:25.559
is that I think it was his
mom who saw the ghost or at first,

578
00:48:25.679 --> 00:48:30.039
and then he felt that, you
know, his house was haunted and

579
00:48:30.639 --> 00:48:37.719
he's a publisher in New York there
for a big publishing company, and he

580
00:48:37.840 --> 00:48:40.599
thought, am I even you know
when this started happening, He's like,

581
00:48:42.159 --> 00:48:45.599
but I'm I'm you know, I'm
Roman Catholic. Am I supposed to believe

582
00:48:45.639 --> 00:48:49.880
in ghosts? So he did the
same thing. He went to the church

583
00:48:49.920 --> 00:48:52.679
and he's like, am I supposed
to believe in this? And he was

584
00:48:52.719 --> 00:48:57.599
shocked to find that they were like, well, you can believe in it,

585
00:48:57.639 --> 00:49:00.559
and we even have you know,
parts in the Bible that talk about

586
00:49:00.599 --> 00:49:05.320
it and other research. So he
shared his whole experience that way, and

587
00:49:05.360 --> 00:49:07.960
that's where I was headed, was, you know, because I think a

588
00:49:07.000 --> 00:49:10.159
lot of people feel like that with
religion. Is you know, am I

589
00:49:10.239 --> 00:49:15.320
supposed to believe in aliens or whatever? And that So that was kind of

590
00:49:15.320 --> 00:49:21.400
the angle I took for for when
I built this whole presentation. That's fascinating.

591
00:49:21.519 --> 00:49:24.719
I can't wait to hear that man, because a lot of outsiders view

592
00:49:24.880 --> 00:49:30.920
Eufology as a religion, and that's
tough, you know, we can't really

593
00:49:31.000 --> 00:49:35.480
deny that at times. But at
the same time, that's why there are

594
00:49:35.519 --> 00:49:39.199
people out there willing to look at
all angles scientifically, theologically, theoretically,

595
00:49:40.199 --> 00:49:46.519
and religiously. It's such a broad
spectrum. And that's first of all,

596
00:49:46.559 --> 00:49:52.079
you know, I can't plug the
congress enough. You bring every angle to

597
00:49:52.199 --> 00:49:57.320
the table, and then it's left
for the audience. To decide and what

598
00:49:57.480 --> 00:50:00.719
they do with that information afterwards,
we get down to it. It's about

599
00:50:00.760 --> 00:50:07.480
starting conversations. It's not about bickering, arguing one person's point over another.

600
00:50:07.360 --> 00:50:12.280
We don't have time for that anymore, you know what I mean. Like

601
00:50:12.360 --> 00:50:15.960
we're at, especially here in America, we were at some interesting times,

602
00:50:16.280 --> 00:50:22.480
you know, whether politically, uh
environmentally, we're at some very interesting times

603
00:50:22.519 --> 00:50:28.400
in this world, and we gotta
we gotta keep looking forward. And if

604
00:50:28.480 --> 00:50:31.800
UFOs have anything to do with that, let's put that mirror up to ourselves

605
00:50:31.840 --> 00:50:37.480
and really ask the big questions.
Mm hmmm. And that kind of brings

606
00:50:37.559 --> 00:50:43.440
up your your talking to Congress,
because you're gonna be tackling, uh,

607
00:50:43.960 --> 00:50:49.719
that topic at the Congress. So
I guess maybe explain what your talk is

608
00:50:49.760 --> 00:50:53.480
going to be about. Yeah,
sure, I'm really I'm really going out

609
00:50:53.719 --> 00:50:58.599
on a limb with this one.
And for my first talk, I'm wondering

610
00:50:58.639 --> 00:51:00.599
if I'm being a bit too ambitious, But I guess that'll be up for

611
00:51:01.880 --> 00:51:06.519
you and the audience to decide.
But what I want to focus on is

612
00:51:07.000 --> 00:51:12.679
the talk is called UFOs versus ufology, the convergence of experience and study.

613
00:51:13.280 --> 00:51:17.000
So we have those like in the
book, who have come forward with their

614
00:51:17.039 --> 00:51:21.480
experience. And then we have the
other side of it, the study of

615
00:51:21.599 --> 00:51:28.559
ufology, which many consider a scientific
study, and they can't rely on these

616
00:51:28.559 --> 00:51:32.960
witnesses stories to prove anything. So
right there, you have that line in

617
00:51:34.000 --> 00:51:37.880
the sand of if we want the
scientific community and the mainstream to take this

618
00:51:37.960 --> 00:51:43.960
topic seriously, what can we give
them, How can we get scientists involved

619
00:51:43.960 --> 00:51:49.840
in this? And even in the
book, Alejandro, I interview many scientists.

620
00:51:50.440 --> 00:51:59.599
I interviewed, let's see a astrophysicist, as astrobiologist, psychologists, they're

621
00:51:59.639 --> 00:52:02.639
all in and they're all willing to
talk about it and hear me out that

622
00:52:02.719 --> 00:52:07.559
the witness and the experiencer have to
be the backbone to the scientific data,

623
00:52:07.920 --> 00:52:12.519
to the analysis. So that's kind
of what I want to do in the

624
00:52:12.639 --> 00:52:17.119
talk is look at both sides of
the spectrum and find that middle ground and

625
00:52:17.199 --> 00:52:23.960
how we can come together and make
eufology sort of a unified field. I

626
00:52:24.000 --> 00:52:29.679
really feel like that's what's holding us
back. We have too many people arguing

627
00:52:29.760 --> 00:52:32.000
that one side of it is not
more important than the other, and I

628
00:52:32.000 --> 00:52:37.119
think there's many arguments to dissuade that. So let's have a conversation about it.

629
00:52:37.400 --> 00:52:42.280
I'm not there to preach to anyone
about it. I want to hear

630
00:52:42.360 --> 00:52:45.559
people's thoughts. You know, if
there's a Q and A at the end

631
00:52:45.599 --> 00:52:49.679
of the talk, I want to
ask questions of the audience. That's what

632
00:52:49.719 --> 00:52:52.599
I want to do there, man, I want to open up the dialogue

633
00:52:52.000 --> 00:52:55.960
and I want to get fresh perspectives
on it. I want to I want

634
00:52:55.960 --> 00:53:00.519
to hear from the younger people,
you know, getting back into politics.

635
00:53:00.679 --> 00:53:06.119
Let's hear from the younger people who
have voices that get put down so often,

636
00:53:07.599 --> 00:53:09.880
because I guarantee you the younger people
out there have a lot to say

637
00:53:10.360 --> 00:53:16.239
and that could make some big ripple
effects in the field. M what is

638
00:53:16.360 --> 00:53:23.840
your perspective being You were laughing earlier
about how you're considered a younger person in

639
00:53:23.840 --> 00:53:28.119
this field and you're thirty two.
I mean there's that whole saying, what

640
00:53:28.280 --> 00:53:34.199
was it? Don't trust anybody over
thirty? Yeah, what do you think

641
00:53:35.119 --> 00:53:39.920
the younger people are looking for?
What do you think you know when it

642
00:53:39.960 --> 00:53:47.000
comes to this, I guess field
of study. It's tough, man,

643
00:53:47.639 --> 00:53:53.360
because the younger people now have lived
on nothing but the internet. I mean,

644
00:53:53.440 --> 00:54:00.719
you and I can remember life before
the Internet and how we gathered our

645
00:54:00.760 --> 00:54:04.519
research before that. It was in
libraries, it was over the phone,

646
00:54:04.559 --> 00:54:07.079
it was waiting two freaking weeks for
a letter to arrive. You know,

647
00:54:08.480 --> 00:54:15.280
there is so much instant access to
UFO content now over the Internet that where

648
00:54:15.280 --> 00:54:22.639
do you even begin? How do
you separate the hoaxes from the possible authentic

649
00:54:22.719 --> 00:54:28.079
cases. It's endless, It's such
a sesspool when it comes to the Internet.

650
00:54:28.480 --> 00:54:31.159
So what I think, what I
think we got to do, and

651
00:54:31.159 --> 00:54:37.039
what I think as a person on
the younger side of it is hear them

652
00:54:37.119 --> 00:54:42.880
out. What did they think aliens
are? What do they think they represent?

653
00:54:44.400 --> 00:54:49.119
And that's separate from UFOs. Again, we always tie these two together

654
00:54:49.599 --> 00:54:53.800
so often that immediately UFOs are aliens. We don't know that. We do

655
00:54:53.840 --> 00:54:59.519
not know that in every case.
So what do they think UFOs are?

656
00:55:00.280 --> 00:55:05.960
What do they think the most interesting
cases are? Where are they finding their

657
00:55:06.079 --> 00:55:10.840
content? And then how can we
guide them into what we feel is the

658
00:55:10.880 --> 00:55:17.039
most positive and beneficial way to look
at this phenomenon. And we have to

659
00:55:17.079 --> 00:55:22.760
start looking at it other than a
nuts and bolts field. You know,

660
00:55:22.159 --> 00:55:29.400
in so many years we haven't been
able to grab a fine saucer and analyze

661
00:55:29.440 --> 00:55:32.960
it at least that the public knows
of. We could do a whole show

662
00:55:32.960 --> 00:55:37.840
on that, obviously. But yeah, man, let's let's hear from the

663
00:55:37.920 --> 00:55:43.360
younger people. Let's get them interested. We've got people like Tom DeLong out

664
00:55:43.360 --> 00:55:47.880
there. Love him or hate him, he is getting younger people interested,

665
00:55:50.039 --> 00:55:52.719
and that's contentious with the information he's
bringing forward. It could be nothing but

666
00:55:52.760 --> 00:55:59.000
disinformation. But again, he's getting
people interested in the topic. And if

667
00:55:59.039 --> 00:56:02.440
that's what we could take what he's
bringing forward, kudos to him. That's

668
00:56:02.519 --> 00:56:06.760
that's all I have to say.
Again, love him or hate him,

669
00:56:07.039 --> 00:56:09.239
right right? And I agree,
I mean I applaud his effort. I

670
00:56:09.280 --> 00:56:14.960
mean, he's putting in a work
and effort and and you know, maybe

671
00:56:15.039 --> 00:56:20.639
he's starting from the beginning, but
so does everybody. But he's really in

672
00:56:20.800 --> 00:56:25.360
there, trying hard, and and
I think that's great personally. Yep.

673
00:56:25.480 --> 00:56:29.960
And again, you know, only
time will tell what information he really has.

674
00:56:30.239 --> 00:56:34.480
But when it comes down to it, let's take whatever we can get

675
00:56:34.519 --> 00:56:37.159
and then work from there. Mm
hmm. And and you know, his

676
00:56:37.400 --> 00:56:45.639
journey of discovery will be also a
journey of discovery for those who who do

677
00:56:45.000 --> 00:56:50.400
follow him. And so at least
everyone will be learning along with him,

678
00:56:50.719 --> 00:56:54.199
even if they don't bring this field
any further along. But then again,

679
00:56:54.239 --> 00:56:59.199
he may, but even if he
doesn't, at least he's bringing others into

680
00:56:59.760 --> 00:57:02.840
on that journey with him. Yeah. Man, it's amazing how much this

681
00:57:02.920 --> 00:57:07.400
parallels you know, politics in America
right now, doesn't it. Yeah,

682
00:57:07.559 --> 00:57:13.519
yeah, it really is about it's
a learning process, you know, and

683
00:57:13.880 --> 00:57:19.800
we all just got to work together. And I see that nowhere greater than

684
00:57:19.840 --> 00:57:23.920
in the field of ufology. We
are a team and there are those little

685
00:57:24.000 --> 00:57:29.639
sandboxes of people arguing, but when
it comes down to it, all all

686
00:57:29.679 --> 00:57:32.599
of us want our answers, and
we've been looking at this our whole lives.

687
00:57:32.679 --> 00:57:37.119
It takes up so much of our
time, and it's because we believe

688
00:57:37.199 --> 00:57:40.719
that there is a core mystery to
this to be solved, and that's what

689
00:57:40.840 --> 00:57:44.960
keeps me going. Man. Mm
hmm. You know, I think that

690
00:57:45.280 --> 00:57:52.719
people like you or I think that
what's great about a lot of the people

691
00:57:52.920 --> 00:57:58.000
I respect, mostly in the field
are ones who can focus on what they

692
00:57:58.079 --> 00:58:05.320
do but appreciate what others do as
well as opposed to, like you're saying,

693
00:58:06.440 --> 00:58:10.000
those who focus on what they do
and they're upset at everybody else because

694
00:58:10.039 --> 00:58:13.760
everybody isn't doing it the way they
do it, which they think is the

695
00:58:13.760 --> 00:58:17.920
only and the right way to do
it. But I mean the world is

696
00:58:17.960 --> 00:58:25.119
more colorful and broad and there's more
discovery when we all appreciate our different perspectives.

697
00:58:27.039 --> 00:58:30.480
Yeah. Yeah, I couldn't put
it better myself. My inspirations are

698
00:58:30.480 --> 00:58:36.119
the old guard of euthology, Stanton
Friedman, Peter Robbins. They probably don't

699
00:58:36.119 --> 00:58:37.840
want me to say their old guard, but come on, man, I

700
00:58:37.880 --> 00:58:43.920
mean the grandfather of euthology. I
have nothing but the utmost respect for him,

701
00:58:44.320 --> 00:58:51.119
and he's still pumping out new content
and that's where I got my knowledge

702
00:58:51.159 --> 00:58:52.679
from. And now I need to
take that and run with it. It's

703
00:58:52.840 --> 00:58:57.440
like basketball. You get that pass
and then you have to decide what to

704
00:58:57.480 --> 00:59:00.880
do from there. Yeah, yeah, you know what. And listening to

705
00:59:00.039 --> 00:59:02.840
younger people too, I think that's
a big deal. It's funny you said

706
00:59:02.840 --> 00:59:09.000
that because my cousin Jason, I
think you've met him, so yeah,

707
00:59:09.000 --> 00:59:15.039
because he also volunteered at our first
one, as did you. But he

708
00:59:15.559 --> 00:59:21.039
started up a college group and it
was sort of an experiment. This was

709
00:59:21.079 --> 00:59:27.280
in Colorado and move On was headquartered
there, and you know, they also

710
00:59:27.320 --> 00:59:30.440
had the concern of how do we
get younger people involved? And he after

711
00:59:30.519 --> 00:59:35.960
a year of having this club and
trying different things, he found out they

712
00:59:36.000 --> 00:59:38.239
want to be listened to, they
want to have discussion, and they want

713
00:59:38.280 --> 00:59:43.159
to talk and ask questions. And
it was kind of funny because it was

714
00:59:43.199 --> 00:59:46.800
brought to certain people and they were
like because they really wanted to know what

715
00:59:46.880 --> 00:59:51.360
they wanted, and they were like, oh, we can't do that.

716
00:59:51.559 --> 00:59:53.239
I mean, they don't know anything. They need to sit and listen to

717
00:59:53.320 --> 00:59:57.760
us because we're the ones who have
the decades of research and we're the ones

718
00:59:57.760 --> 01:00:02.119
who know something. And it's like, well, you know, that's there's

719
01:00:02.159 --> 01:00:07.039
your problem. There's the problem right
there. Yeah, you're right. And

720
01:00:07.159 --> 01:00:14.679
the way to impart information in discussion, yep, absolutely. I think you

721
01:00:14.719 --> 01:00:17.039
guys do a good job of that
with your panels at your conference is you

722
01:00:17.079 --> 01:00:22.320
know, you'll have Stan Friedman sitting
next to a Jeremy Corbel and they'll have

723
01:00:22.000 --> 01:00:25.360
a discussion. It could get heated, but come on, that's where the

724
01:00:25.400 --> 01:00:30.960
real passion comes out, you know. But there you go. You've got

725
01:00:30.039 --> 01:00:36.440
decades between these two in age and
all they're trying to do is come to

726
01:00:36.480 --> 01:00:39.840
an agreement on what we have to
do to get those answers. And that's

727
01:00:39.840 --> 01:00:45.960
invigorating to me. And you're right, Younger people want nothing more than to

728
01:00:45.000 --> 01:00:51.000
be heard, and yes, they
have a lot to say outside the UFO

729
01:00:51.000 --> 01:00:53.760
field as well, and we have
to we we just got to listen man,

730
01:00:54.119 --> 01:00:59.519
all of us. And it's interesting. It's interesting. You know people,

731
01:01:00.079 --> 01:01:04.000
you know, they're online so much
more and I guess they're doing a

732
01:01:04.000 --> 01:01:08.400
lot of discussion there, but that
human interaction seems to be a bit of

733
01:01:08.440 --> 01:01:14.400
what they crave. Yes, I
mean, I've had arguments over text messages.

734
01:01:14.480 --> 01:01:16.760
I can't tell you how many times
until that person says to me,

735
01:01:17.280 --> 01:01:22.599
you know what, let's go grab
coffee. And then again, it's being

736
01:01:22.679 --> 01:01:27.760
in the room with that person.
So much gets lost over these stupid screens

737
01:01:27.800 --> 01:01:31.800
in front of us, or over
even phone calls. That face to face

738
01:01:31.840 --> 01:01:36.400
interaction is where it really happens.
And I think that's why conferences need to

739
01:01:36.480 --> 01:01:39.400
continue, and we need to be
in the room with one another because you're

740
01:01:39.440 --> 01:01:45.760
going to get impulsive reactions and answers
that you won't get over the internet,

741
01:01:45.920 --> 01:01:51.360
which is so heavily edited and so
heavily biased in so many ways. We

742
01:01:51.519 --> 01:01:54.000
got to keep that face to face
interaction going, and that is the human

743
01:01:54.400 --> 01:01:59.719
side of all this. Well.
And when you were talking about your book

744
01:01:59.760 --> 01:02:02.800
and your approached the book at the
beginning of the show, it reminded me

745
01:02:02.960 --> 01:02:09.039
so much of being a filled investigator. And you know, I think that's

746
01:02:09.119 --> 01:02:15.039
why I have a passion for these
individual stories as well, like your book

747
01:02:15.159 --> 01:02:23.400
is focusing on because when you are
face to face with a witness who experienced

748
01:02:23.400 --> 01:02:30.719
something they can't explain, and they're
expressing to you the impact that had on

749
01:02:30.800 --> 01:02:39.639
them. Even though you know the
thousand word story on you know, our

750
01:02:39.679 --> 01:02:45.519
website might be boring to you,
the experience of talking to these individuals is

751
01:02:45.559 --> 01:02:52.800
so rich and so fascinating that you
know it even sticks with you. Those

752
01:02:52.880 --> 01:02:57.360
interviews I used to do, those
are what really have stuck with me throughout

753
01:02:57.400 --> 01:03:01.159
the years. I can only imagine. I'm envious, to say the least.

754
01:03:01.159 --> 01:03:05.159
I've always want You've done the same
thing, though, I mean that's

755
01:03:05.199 --> 01:03:07.480
what you're doing with your book,
your research. You're doing the same thing,

756
01:03:08.159 --> 01:03:12.320
Oh totally, man, And I
can readily admit, like the catalyst

757
01:03:12.400 --> 01:03:17.119
for the book was one woman's story. When I met her at your congress.

758
01:03:17.800 --> 01:03:22.960
I sat with her at the diner
at the casino and she was crying

759
01:03:23.079 --> 01:03:27.800
her eyes out next to her husband, holding his hand, gripping it so

760
01:03:27.920 --> 01:03:31.000
tight, trying to tell me this
story. And had she sent me an

761
01:03:31.039 --> 01:03:34.320
email about it, I would have
been like, oh, okay, cool,

762
01:03:34.400 --> 01:03:37.000
Yeah, maybe we'll get to it. But being in that room with

763
01:03:37.079 --> 01:03:43.239
her and feeling her like n tapped
the table from underneath. She was so

764
01:03:43.440 --> 01:03:49.920
nervous and so so much bald up
energy and adrenaline telling recalling the story,

765
01:03:50.480 --> 01:03:52.760
that is what spoke to me,
And that's what made me decide to write

766
01:03:52.760 --> 01:03:55.760
the book and to focus on the
individuals, because you're right, there is

767
01:03:55.840 --> 01:04:00.800
nothing like being in the room with
that person, and it could completely change

768
01:04:00.800 --> 01:04:04.559
your whole outlook on the UFO phenomenon
in general. I could hear a million

769
01:04:04.639 --> 01:04:09.599
stories, see theming in a newspaper. That's not going to convince me anything.

770
01:04:09.920 --> 01:04:13.800
The people having the experiences are the
people are the things that are going

771
01:04:13.800 --> 01:04:16.920
to convince me. Mm hmm.
So that's really exciting. How long has

772
01:04:16.960 --> 01:04:23.519
your book been out now? Almost
two weeks now, so yeah, it

773
01:04:23.559 --> 01:04:28.440
hasn't been very long and the best
place. I mean, they can get

774
01:04:28.480 --> 01:04:30.599
it on Amazon or I guess you
could go to Richard Dolan Press. And

775
01:04:30.639 --> 01:04:35.880
then you have a website too,
somewhere in the Skies dot com. Yes,

776
01:04:36.000 --> 01:04:40.000
yeah, that's where you can find
all my work. I still post

777
01:04:40.119 --> 01:04:46.079
articles there and my own thoughts on
the field and some articles as well.

778
01:04:46.599 --> 01:04:49.760
M And what else are you doing? I mean you're pretty busy out there.

779
01:04:49.840 --> 01:04:57.000
You're doing podcast or podcasts. You're
writing for a website or I should

780
01:04:57.039 --> 01:05:00.360
say websites, like what are where
can people from my your stuff? Yes?

781
01:05:01.519 --> 01:05:04.880
Sure, and let's go. Your
listeners are gonna get sick of my

782
01:05:04.960 --> 01:05:12.679
portfolio. I write for the Paranormal
brain Trust over at Jim Harold dot com

783
01:05:12.719 --> 01:05:16.400
with the likes of Marie D.
Jones and Micah Hanks and Nick Redfern.

784
01:05:16.719 --> 01:05:18.960
That's a lot of fun. That's
where I get to stretch my muscles,

785
01:05:19.280 --> 01:05:25.000
go a little outside the UFO field, you know I talk about My last

786
01:05:25.000 --> 01:05:29.679
one was about secret Soviet psychic spies, so that's a lot of fun.

787
01:05:30.440 --> 01:05:33.320
I do have two podcasts. One
is called UFO mod Pot, which is

788
01:05:33.360 --> 01:05:40.880
a fresh look at the UFO phenomenon, and that's with Jason McClellan and Maureen

789
01:05:40.960 --> 01:05:46.519
Elsberry your two good buds. And
I have another podcast called Into the Fray

790
01:05:46.760 --> 01:05:51.559
and again that's sort of diving out
of my comfort zone and covering cryptids,

791
01:05:51.639 --> 01:05:59.119
ghosts, paranormal and that's with Shannon
mcgrow and Sam Shearing and other than that.

792
01:05:59.239 --> 01:06:02.920
Man. You could find me now
on Mysteries at the Museum on the

793
01:06:02.960 --> 01:06:11.039
Travel Channel. I'm a reoccurring person
on there talking about UFO cases. Just

794
01:06:11.039 --> 01:06:15.599
filmed another episode there about the Robert
Sallis case, so look for that in

795
01:06:15.639 --> 01:06:19.119
the very near future. God,
one of the best UFO cases out there

796
01:06:19.159 --> 01:06:24.360
for sure. So busy busy,
Yeah, it's super busy. And that

797
01:06:24.440 --> 01:06:31.360
doesn't include you having a regular job
and working as a playwright. I know

798
01:06:31.400 --> 01:06:38.840
you've written some plays that have made
it to the stage. Are there still

799
01:06:39.320 --> 01:06:44.320
you know plays? Are some of
your plays still showing? And do you

800
01:06:44.400 --> 01:06:50.760
do more than just write them to
participate in other ways in the stage work?

801
01:06:51.599 --> 01:06:56.199
Yeah? Yeah, you know,
the plays are always an ongoing thing,

802
01:06:56.280 --> 01:07:00.239
whether it's you know, through developing
them or having them actually up there

803
01:07:00.239 --> 01:07:04.000
on the stage. I do have
a production coming up in February. It's

804
01:07:04.039 --> 01:07:10.559
a horror thriller play I wrote about
a modern day Jack the Ripper, So

805
01:07:10.760 --> 01:07:14.000
yeah, that's that's gonna be a
fun one. That'll be premiering in February

806
01:07:14.079 --> 01:07:18.880
here in New York City in the
dad of winter. And other than that,

807
01:07:18.920 --> 01:07:21.800
I just came out with my first
feature film based on one of my

808
01:07:21.880 --> 01:07:29.440
plays, So I'm getting more into
the film world and that just opens up

809
01:07:29.440 --> 01:07:31.599
the doors to a lot of other
stuff. You know, you get to

810
01:07:31.679 --> 01:07:38.079
expand the universe of the play and
show it, you know, instead of

811
01:07:38.119 --> 01:07:42.119
telling it. So that's really exciting. I've got a lot of that stuff.

812
01:07:42.159 --> 01:07:46.079
My playwriting and movies can be found
at my other website, Ryandspreague dot

813
01:07:46.119 --> 01:07:50.760
com. And yeah, man,
anything I can do to keep busy.

814
01:07:50.960 --> 01:07:55.400
And I'm starting to mix my passions. Like you said, I've got to

815
01:07:55.400 --> 01:08:01.559
play about the Rendel shown case.
I'm working on another play about disclosure that'll

816
01:08:01.559 --> 01:08:06.679
be in dark comedy because I don't
see it any other way. Yeah.

817
01:08:06.719 --> 01:08:12.800
So again, man, just getting
the UFO topic out to people who wouldn't

818
01:08:12.840 --> 01:08:16.039
necessarily ever think about it, and
that's you know, a play audience,

819
01:08:16.359 --> 01:08:21.479
a theater audience, and to those
who've never really looked up in the sky.

820
01:08:23.159 --> 01:08:25.479
There's a lot going on up there, and I just want to do

821
01:08:25.520 --> 01:08:29.000
my part to try to show them
that mm hmmm, what is the name

822
01:08:29.039 --> 01:08:33.319
of that feature film? That film
is called Reverie Lane. Right now it's

823
01:08:33.479 --> 01:08:40.119
making the festival circuit, but it
will be available in digital format very soon.

824
01:08:40.319 --> 01:08:45.239
And again you can find out more
on that at ryandspread dot com.

825
01:08:45.720 --> 01:08:48.760
Wow. So and that you're also
you've also got a girlfriend, which of

826
01:08:48.760 --> 01:08:54.399
course that takes up time. You
know, you're very in love I and

827
01:08:54.439 --> 01:09:00.680
you're you share that, you know
on your Facebook. Now that's wonderful because

828
01:09:00.720 --> 01:09:04.039
I share that as much as I
can. Also. Oh yeah, man,

829
01:09:04.159 --> 01:09:06.359
I mean she puts up with me. God bless her with all the

830
01:09:06.439 --> 01:09:12.880
UFO stuff. But she's really into
it. She edited my book actually cool.

831
01:09:13.439 --> 01:09:15.199
I do have to give her kudos
to that. She made me actually

832
01:09:15.239 --> 01:09:19.800
sound like I'm a decent writer and
that's all I but not only that,

833
01:09:19.840 --> 01:09:25.439
she's passionate about the material and she
herself is really into it. So you'll

834
01:09:25.479 --> 01:09:29.760
be meeting her in February and everyone
else, you'll finally get to meet the

835
01:09:30.399 --> 01:09:34.680
face of the person I'm always fawning
over. Yeah, I was excited for

836
01:09:34.720 --> 01:09:38.560
that. Well, that's so cool. I don't know how you can do

837
01:09:38.600 --> 01:09:43.399
all of that and stay so busy. You mess definitely have the heart and

838
01:09:43.399 --> 01:09:47.359
soul of a young person. But
is it maybe that your homes are so

839
01:09:47.439 --> 01:09:50.640
small in New York or you've got
to share them with other people that you

840
01:09:50.760 --> 01:09:54.920
just want to kind of be out
and about keep him busy as much as

841
01:09:54.960 --> 01:09:58.680
possible. If I can do something
that's going to get me out of this

842
01:09:58.720 --> 01:10:03.399
god forsaken city for a week,
like Arizona, I am all for it.

843
01:10:03.439 --> 01:10:08.039
And a lot of these opportunities have
brought me to places all over the

844
01:10:08.079 --> 01:10:13.239
country, possibly the world, and
it's exciting, man. And I can

845
01:10:13.279 --> 01:10:17.520
tell you one other thing. Coffee
works, wonders. I hear you on

846
01:10:17.600 --> 01:10:21.960
that. All right, Well,
we are totally out of time. Thank

847
01:10:23.000 --> 01:10:26.399
you so much for coming on again. It was so fun to talk to

848
01:10:26.399 --> 01:10:30.600
you. The time flew, of
course, and I am looking so forward

849
01:10:30.720 --> 01:10:35.119
to not just hanging out with you
again at the Congress, but actually sharing

850
01:10:35.399 --> 01:10:41.000
and being able to, you know, be a part of you sharing your

851
01:10:41.039 --> 01:10:45.239
information with everyone. I know they're
gonna love it and we're gonna have a

852
01:10:45.239 --> 01:10:47.880
wonderful time. I'm excited, man. I've been a huge fan of everything

853
01:10:47.880 --> 01:10:53.720
you've done since your first podcast,
and I can't thank you enough for the

854
01:10:53.760 --> 01:10:57.119
opportunity. So I'll see you in
February. Yep, our pleasure. We'll

855
01:10:57.119 --> 01:11:00.840
see you soon. All right,
Thank you so much much to Ryan for

856
01:11:00.880 --> 01:11:04.279
coming on the show again. I'm
so happy for him and his book.

857
01:11:04.279 --> 01:11:08.479
It looks like people are really enjoying
it, you know, if you go

858
01:11:08.560 --> 01:11:11.359
to his Facebook, it's kind of
cool. A lot of people are taking

859
01:11:11.680 --> 01:11:16.000
pictures selfies with themselves in the book
and posting those, and he's reposting those,

860
01:11:16.319 --> 01:11:19.640
so there are a lot of fun
go check out Ryan on Facebook.

861
01:11:19.680 --> 01:11:25.760
You can also find him on the
website we talked about, Somewhere in the

862
01:11:25.840 --> 01:11:30.479
Skies and that's where you'll find out
more about the book and how to get

863
01:11:30.520 --> 01:11:35.000
the book. So a lot of
cool information at that website. Again,

864
01:11:35.079 --> 01:11:44.119
that's just Somewhere in the Skies dot
com. And otherwise, like he said,

865
01:11:44.159 --> 01:11:47.279
I mean, on his Facebook and
then also on his personal website you

866
01:11:47.319 --> 01:11:51.520
can get more about his plays and
everything. So just a busy, busy

867
01:11:53.239 --> 01:11:57.520
fellow, which is so cool.
That's awesome that he keeps so busy and

868
01:11:57.600 --> 01:12:03.039
he's able to, you know,
continue to do stuff all around the board.

869
01:12:03.279 --> 01:12:05.880
So just a busy, busy you
know, in New York. They're

870
01:12:06.000 --> 01:12:09.760
there, those people do a lot
of stuff. They're busy people. They're

871
01:12:09.760 --> 01:12:15.399
always here, hither and nither,
here to and fro running around. They're

872
01:12:15.439 --> 01:12:19.279
crazy, they're they're nuety of those
New York people. But I love it.

873
01:12:19.520 --> 01:12:25.680
New York's awesome. That's it for
today's show. And the holidays are

874
01:12:25.680 --> 01:12:29.600
coming up, like we talked about
with Martin, Thanksgivings coming up, so

875
01:12:29.600 --> 01:12:33.560
I hope you guys have a wonderful
Thanksgiving. We probably will miss next week

876
01:12:33.560 --> 01:12:38.159
as far as shows go. I'm
sorry. I know everybody's like, where's

877
01:12:38.239 --> 01:12:41.359
show? There's shoe, Well,
you just have to wait another week.

878
01:12:41.600 --> 01:12:45.199
However, I'm sure there's some archives
you can catch on, Like did you

879
01:12:45.760 --> 01:12:54.439
hear our first interview with Ryan Sprague? Did you listen to our interview with

880
01:12:55.359 --> 01:13:00.479
Jacques Valet? Huh? He's really
cool, in fact that he's got a

881
01:13:00.560 --> 01:13:04.159
We just posted this in the news
today, a Q and A about UFOs

882
01:13:04.199 --> 01:13:10.960
for the Oxford University Press. Huh. That's pretty impressive. So someone at

883
01:13:11.199 --> 01:13:15.640
Oxford, an author you know,
interviewed him and they posted that on their

884
01:13:15.680 --> 01:13:19.399
website, so you could check that
out. After you listen to the podcast

885
01:13:19.479 --> 01:13:24.920
that we did with Jacques Valet for
Open Minds, So go check that out.

886
01:13:24.960 --> 01:13:28.960
There's lots lots of archives, tons
and tons of archives. We've got

887
01:13:29.039 --> 01:13:35.000
over five million listens, so there's
just and and a lot of that.

888
01:13:35.079 --> 01:13:39.840
It's not just from the thousands and
thousands of people who listen to the show

889
01:13:40.159 --> 01:13:44.119
every week, but also from people
listening to archives. I hear so much

890
01:13:44.199 --> 01:13:47.600
that from people who will just kind
of start at the beginning and listen,

891
01:13:48.319 --> 01:13:51.439
and I wonder, you know,
that makes me think of how I used

892
01:13:51.479 --> 01:13:56.600
to be compared to how I am
now. I mean, was I a

893
01:13:56.640 --> 01:14:01.840
complete idiot at the beginning? Probably
am I idiot now? Some think so,

894
01:14:02.800 --> 01:14:06.359
but regardless, thank you all so
much for listening. You know,

895
01:14:06.399 --> 01:14:11.399
we've got new information on the website
about the UFO Congress, so check that

896
01:14:11.479 --> 01:14:15.279
out. People are registering like crazy, which is really good because we have

897
01:14:15.640 --> 01:14:19.279
lots of really cool stuff and we're
gonna have a lot of What I haven't

898
01:14:19.319 --> 01:14:26.720
posted is the Phoenix Lights oriented stuff
we're gonna have. It's a twentieth anniversary

899
01:14:26.760 --> 01:14:30.800
of the Phoenix Lights and of course
the conference is just outside of Phoenix in

900
01:14:30.840 --> 01:14:38.119
the Phoenix area, So it makes
sense that we celebrate that phenomena at our

901
01:14:38.159 --> 01:14:41.680
conference, and we will, and
we're gonna have some special events surrounding that.

902
01:14:41.680 --> 01:14:44.720
That's the only thing we haven't announced. Otherwise, you can see all

903
01:14:44.760 --> 01:14:47.640
of the other incredible speakers there.
I talked about Erica lukesa. A lot

904
01:14:47.640 --> 01:14:51.720
of people saw her recently and they
really loved her talk, so you got

905
01:14:51.720 --> 01:14:57.119
to come and check that out.
Otherwise, we've got lots of really great

906
01:14:57.680 --> 01:15:01.119
stuff, new talks, and that's
what's fun. If if you see listed

907
01:15:01.239 --> 01:15:06.439
on the website researchers you've seen before, most likely this talk that they're going

908
01:15:06.520 --> 01:15:11.239
to do at our conference is going
to be something new and different. Because

909
01:15:11.920 --> 01:15:15.000
we keep up with what people are
doing, you know, we we or

910
01:15:15.079 --> 01:15:20.399
what they have done in the past, the actual details of their their research

911
01:15:20.720 --> 01:15:26.880
or work, and so I've been
able to communicate with them to talk about

912
01:15:26.960 --> 01:15:30.760
what are something what is something new
and different that you can discuss at our

913
01:15:30.760 --> 01:15:33.920
conference. And these people that we've
brought are doing new and different things.

914
01:15:33.920 --> 01:15:38.920
They're continuing their research and they're going
to show share the latest and greatest and

915
01:15:38.920 --> 01:15:43.600
you can read about what they're going
to be talking about at the ufocongress dot

916
01:15:43.640 --> 01:15:47.800
com. Other than that, you
know, thank you all again for being

917
01:15:47.880 --> 01:15:53.760
here. Thank you to Caleb Hanks
for the opening and closed music, and

918
01:15:54.000 --> 01:15:57.359
I hope you have a wonderful Thanksgiving. We'll talk to you in a couple

919
01:15:57.399 --> 01:16:59.279
of weeks. Audio's mood, use
your motion, sound the glass trees suffering.

920
01:17:00.199 --> 01:17:02.520
On my second thought this issue