He was cold, cold. That was the navel. He was cold.
Mine, what's going on up there? Could be the most important event in
history. Now I have to come and destroyer worlds, I said. I
hope this is close to Hell's all ever again. Hello and welcome to the
Tales from the Dark podcast. I'm your host Bomb here with my lovely cost
Brittany. Hey, yeah, this what's up britty Brittany? How you doing?
I'm good? Other than that voice crack, I'm good. Well,
I threw you a little sweet nothing in there. We have an exciting episode
today. This is something that do you know, normally you would hear podcasts
like we've been in. This has been in the works for months. It's
been in the work for about eight days. We had this this weird little
brain idea to do this paranormal roundtable. I got a hold of Eric Freeman
Sims from the Unseen Paranormal podcast. He's like, hey, I'll put this
together, and in true Eric fashion, he put it together in record time.
Yes, he really did so. The only thing that I want to
go through real fast. If you guys join the Facebook group over it Tells
from the Dark. We today we put about a thing from amal paranormalitymag dot
com, where you can go and you can vote for your favorite paranormal podcast.
Now, we don't do very much of this, but it would mean
the world to us if we take two seconds join the group and vote and
also joined the group. You guys are currently missing out on dank memes,
conversations, show updates, you name it. That's where it's that is over
at the Talesman Dark Facebook group. Yes it is. So with that being
said, miss Britany, I think we just need to give all these gentlemen
a call and just let the chaos begin. Let's do it all right,
So we are joined. Thank you guys actually for joining us for our first
paranormal roundtable. Tyler Terry is in the studio live for the first time in
like a year. So if you guys don't know who Tyler Terry is,
Tyler, why don't you tell everyone a little bit about yourself. Hello,
tales from the Dark people. You already know who I am, Tyler Terry.
I have been with this little crew for how long have you guys been
doing this? Three years now, Almus, three years paranormal enthusiast in general,
for since I can remember being allowed to go places by myself, dark
cemeteries and wherever I could sneak into. Filmmaker. Now I guess editor,
director, producer Fantom Farm with Tales from the Dark and yeah, that's a
discoverer of hay Snake. Well, yeah, don't sound too excited about it,
Tyler. Okay. So we're also joined by Eric Freeman Simms, who
might be the best podcast host on the side of the Mississippi. I think
that the ballot's still out for that. But Eric, how are you,
sir? I am good. How are y'all doing today? We're doing well.
So why don't you tell the crowd a little bit about yourself? Yeah,
I don't know about the best podcaster. I try, though. You
know. I am the host of the Unseen Paranormal podcast. I've been an
investigator researcher paranormal for over twenty years now, and I am the main organizer
for the Tennessee Hanson Legend X BOO. Very well said. So, mister
Brandon Alvis, how are you doing? Thank you for joining us? Tell
us a little bit about yourself? Well, first off, thanks for having
me on here. Guys. My name is Brandon Alvis. I'm the founder
of the American Paranormal Research Association. Founded the organization in two thousand and six
to solely investigate historical locations across the United States. And I've been looking for
answers into the possibility of consciousness, consciousness surviving death for a number of years
now. So I'm excited to be here and can't wait to talk with you
guys about everything. Now. We're glad to have you and Mustapha got a
Lourie, Sir, how are you doing, and tell us a little bit
about yourself. My name is Mustapha Getta Laurie. I'm doing just fine.
Began researching and investigating the paranormal when I was eighteen years old thirty seven now,
so it's around nineteen years I've been doing this. Opportunity came up to
join the team of A and E's Ghost Hunters, and during casting for this
beautiful man, Brandon Alvis and we kind of had We've realized that we had
very similar ways that we like to work, and now we are producing new
shows and programs documenting our paranormal research called Haunted Discoveries. And yeah, I
work every day with him to break new ground in the paranormal field, and
it's it's been amazing. I absolutely love that. So now I guess let's
just jump right into it. We'll kind of go in the same order,
Tyler, what is your most compelling evidence of life after death or the paranormal
or whatever we want to call it this week? Because we seem to change
our opinion on the title as often as we change our opinion on the subject
matter. Well, I'll rehash my kind of history with the paranormal. It's
I'm basically a skeptic, forged out of just experimentation. I got really into
ghost hunting with ghost hunters, of course, in the early two thousands.
That's when I kind of learned that you can structure it. I kind of
grew up, not grew up, but I spent some prime years of my
childhood in a house that had some weird activities. So there was kind of
confirmation from the whole family. Some very strange things happened. And my family
just has a bunch of crazy stories from down in eastern Kentucky that just always
kept me interested and fascinated by these unexplained things. But I would do things
like go to the cemetery stand in mausoleums and just ask for things to contact
me. And over time, the more things I did, nothing ever happened.
So I just learned to take more of a skeptical approach, where it's
like it needs to show itself to me or you know, my criteria are
pretty strict. So do I have compelling evidence? Not really so far.
Unfortunately. There's one thing that happened back when I was more of a believer.
There's a strange phenomenon where I thought. I thought I was going to
keep getting evidence because I believed, so I didn't really care about this piece
of audio. I worked at a hotel and left a a quarter in a
room that was allegedly haunted for my whole eight hour shift, went and picked
it up. When I got it back, this was this was a locked
room. I was the only person. I was a night auditor, so
I had control. I had the keys to the building and all that.
When I got it back, listening to the recorder inside the locked room,
heard the hardware on the dressers jiggling like clinking. So I know we had
like gas pipe issues in that building, So I don't know if the building
was shaking, that would be pretty extreme and then I heard a noise outside
the windows on the second floor. Somebody that I thought thought it sounded like
a young girl saying mama. I thought it definitely could have been a cat,
but the hardware on the dresser was definitely undeniable. And I have no
idea what happened to the audio clip. I just thought, oh cool,
this is what it's going to be like, and I probably recorded over it
with something silly. That's the paranormal negative of the group of cat. Yes,
I also love Tyler. You were in a documentary. I love that
we're still so skeptical yet we caught. I still believe you. I firmly
believe this to be some of the best evidence that I've ever seen, and
I was a part of. And I still, well, Tyler wasn't.
Tyler wasn't in the room, so that's not standing there right. He doesn't
think it was him, So oh fair enough, all right, Well what
about you, mister Eric, What do you consider to be compelling evidence or
something that's happened to you that really just still stands out in your brain.
For me, it kind of it started when I was a kid, and
I've just had so many things happen over the years that are unexplainable, And
I call myself a skeptical believer because if I can debunk something it's not being
paranormal, then I'm going to try to debunk it anyway that can. There
are too many people out there today that just label everything paranormal, and they,
you know, try not to debunk anything. But I just had some
crazy experiences, caught some crazy EVPs over the years, and and photos that
I can explain. Probably the personal experiences or some of the biggest ones for
me. My first experience I remember was when I was around eight years old.
I woke up out of a dead sleep in the middle of the night
and there was a glowing apparition sending my door and I jumped up and foot
the light on and kind of slammed the door. They kind of scared me
because you know, I was a kid, And then just started seeking out
the panel when I was a teenager and seeing it, experiencing everything from like
I said, footbody apparitions to found them, voices, footsteps and things like
that, just up until today, you know, going out and investigating.
I've done hundreds of investigations over twenty something years and gone to many many locations,
and so many things. Can't explain one of the biggest if you want
a prime example, I guess one of the biggest things when I worked at
a nursing home when I started out in my medical career as a nurse tech,
and I worked night shift on Alzheimer's lockdown unit, and you had to
have a code to get into this part of the building. And this is
the oldest part of the building. It had been a nursing home since in
nineteen forties. And this is back in the early two thousands when I worked
there, and I worked with two other nurses on the floor. They went
to lunch. One night, I was only one there except for all the
patients, and everybody's in bed. All the lights are off except for the
nurse to station light. And I was going to do around where I would
walk around just check them on patients, make sure they're in bed, things
like that nobody's got out of bed falling or anything like that. And I
went to walk down one of the hallways and there was a tall, skinny
man in a black suit, younger guy sent at the end of the hallway,
and I looked at him. He looked at me, he smiled,
turned and walked into patient room. And I walked down there because I thought
it was a real person that nobody's supposed to be in the building at three
o'clock in the morning. And I got down there and go in the room
and turn the light on, and there's nobody in there except for the four
patients and they're all women, and they're all on the bed that same place.
Used to walk into rooms and see silhouettes sitting in wheelchairs, and then
when you trying on the light, there's nobody there. Things like that,
Lots of things like that. When I was younger than several the years of
investigating, definitely experienced the stuff me and awesome that Laurence have a lot in
commons that tolls anything. We're some fucking haunted people. Yeah, absolutely,
Yeah that that dude is a walking He's a paranormal accident to happen. He
is an entity of himself. Yeah. So so what about you, Brandon,
what got I mean, we kind of discuss this a little bit when
you were on our show, But is there any evidence that sticks out to
you that's just this is why I keep doing this. With the exception of
the drive to find proof of life after death for lack of a better arm.
You know what I'm curious about with Brandon Mustafa is has your best or
most compelling evidence happened in the seasons of Haunted Discoveries or this spinoff? Because
I've I've I've watched the interviews of what's your most compelling evidence? Hurts some
answer, So I'm curious if it's stuff that right now you can't talk about
because it's on the show, if your new kind of tactics or experimentations have
brought on new things. Well, i will say that there was one specific
moment actually an episode I'm editing right now. I'm taking a break from it
to do this podcast with you guys. But Harriman Hospital in Harriman, Tennessee
a place that, obviously, you go to a hospital, there's going to
be massive reports of death and ghost stories. I mean, almost every hospital
I've been to that's even active, there's always some kind of story associated with
unexplained things taking place amongst the staff. Right it kind of happens. Good
friend of mine who was part of Apper for many years, he worked in
the morgue at a hospital and talked about all kinds of crazy stuff that would
happen when he would transport bodies to the morgue. So we go to Harriman
Hospital and we were lucky enough to take doctor Harry Klore with us, who's
the first person in history to receive two PhD simultaneously, a brilliant scientific mind,
a living historical figure. He's our resident scientist and he's been working with
us closely on the paramil photon theory and us trying to collect photonic events in
these set up haunted locations with the EMCCD camera. And this is a guy
in doctor Clore who is a skeptic, but in the classical sense of not
a nonbeliever, but a skeptic that you know, a person that wants to
find evidence that something exists. Right, So we took him down to the
first floor of the hospital, the oldest portion of the hospital, where there's
a story very similar to yours, Eric, which is kind of crazy about
a man in a black suit with a black hat and a ribbon bow tie
who was seen by the hospital staff walking into rooms. And when this guy
would walk into these rooms, a code blue would be called and the patient,
unfortunately pathway and we actually spoke to some of the former hospital staff who
saw this figure and reported the code blues and reported all the unexplained happening going
around that. But we took Harry down to the first floor. He was
by himself. Again, a guy who's a skeptic. He doesn't jump to
conclusions. He's always trying to find rational explanations for anything taking place. And
he himself said that it felt like it did when he grew up in the
Oregon woods, where you would walk through the woods by yourself and you just
know you're not alone, right, you know that there's wildlife out there and
you could have that sense of being watched, and that's something he experienced while
being alone down on the first floor. But it wasn't until a few hours
later that we had an e MCCD session running where we were shooting down a
hallway and we captured something that not only we can't explain, but I think
even had doctor Klore kind of freaked out for sure, And that's something I
cannot wait for people to see on Haunted Discoveries. But a moment, you
know, you can't really say it's a ghost, right, We don't know
exactly, but we can say that this huge photon event manifested itself out of
nowhere in a portion of the hospital that was not accessible in an area that
was not only chained off with a bike chain, you literally couldn't get there.
But if someone was to somehow get into that portion of the hospital,
there are motion sensors that alert the property manager to someone being in that area
and actually gives a live feed of video to show that there's someone there.
And we captured something just completely unbelievable that we have no rational explanation for and
correlates perfectly with some of the reports going back to when the hospital was still
active. Very interesting. So I guess Mustafa the same question for you,
And after this orsoever one knows, we're gonna kind of abandon the structure conversation.
I want, I want to just be able to jump in for the
questions after this one, So Mustafa go ahead, Yeah for sure. I
mean, you know, in addition to being on a series of dates before
I got Marrinerat and being subsequently ghosted by every single woman that I talked to,
I would say other paranormal experiences that I've had, the one that Brandon
mentioned is definitely rate ranks up there. I think it's important. I'm going
to kind of like amend the answer and the trajectory of the answer a little
bit. And I think it's really important how you go about the investigation too,
because we've been in numerous instances where we just always kind of felt like
there's something strange that's happening, and we thoroughly kind of not only do we
vet all of these locations and vet all of the people that we're talking to,
and but we take their accounts as true and we try to look at
the entire situation of their accounts, and we really try to go as full
force as we can with it. And we've been on hundreds of investigations combined,
like you know, everybody on the crew, so we kind of get
a sense of like when okay, like there's something here, but we can't
really put our finger on it. When it came to that phenomena, there
was a lot leading up to that. There was just like you know,
there's a whole lot of nothing, a whole lot of like blue balls moments,
a whole lot of like you know, things where you go down like
a hallway you kind of feel like there's something there and there's not, but
everything kind of seemed to point us to this one area of the hospital and
then it just kind of caught us by surprise and what we captured there.
And then there's the feelings that were associated with it, the the experience that
happened, the way that the air was electric, literally electric, it was
it felt very you felt weightless when you walked down this hallway after it happened.
It was ethereal, very very memorable. It was just a kind of
beautiful and scary, transcendent moment that I'm very very happy that we were able
to capture on camera. Personally, I've had experiences in the house that I
grew up in, and I've been having like weird things happened where I could
have swore, like on multiple occasions, like I've seen myself like in passing
walking like through my house, and it's like I'm always kind of going in
and out of my head like, oh am I crazy? Like you know,
I was like, am I just seeing things? Like? You know,
because we've all kind of relied on our feelings. If you've been in
any bad relationships, you know that that happens where it's like oh man,
And then you look back on it, You're like, oh wow, that
person was kind of psychotic and they treated me like garbage and they never you
know, I was just looking at it through rose tinted glasses. But that's
why I like that we're able to document these things and that occurrence that we
were able to capture, including a lot of other ones throughout the course of
these investigations on haunted discoveries. Yeah, those that one definitely ranks up there
as one of Like if I were to show somebody who is really really skeptic,
I'll be like, Okay, check this out. I think that would
get the coals burning a little bit. And I have a longtime friend who's
very, very skeptic, and he's still convinced. I'm like signed to some
NDA where like I have to, like it's like a pro wrestler keeping up
k fabe. He's like, come on, man, I'm like, no,
dude, Like this is like what I've been researching. This would have
been doing, like you know, for like pretty much almost all more than
half of my life now, like you know. And he's like, and
I tell him that story, and I show him an image that we had
from that and when you can. When I can see him pause like a
little bit, I'm like, all right, yeah, that's that's really cool.
So yeah, one thing I find really awesome and interesting about every one
of the stories that we just heard from you guys is there's always some element
of this is how the environment was controlled. These are the external factors,
and you're doing it unconsciously. I think that really shows like the work that
people who go out and research these things, and our paranormal investigators, the
work that goes into developing those habits. So I find that very interesting that
you all had the exact same response when it came to the elements that could
affect your paranormal experience. I mean, very different stories all around, but
very interesting. Nonetheless, no, I agree, and again you guys can
jump in at any point in these these these coming questions. But I want
to discuss evidence for a second, because we kind of just went over all
of our personal occurrences or happenings or encounters and compelling evidence that we've had but
we can all acknowledge. I mean, the one reason I wanted to do
this roundtable as we have you know, documentary filmmakers, podcast hosts, you
know, the closest thing to a professional investigator I know is Eric, and
then we have all these different types of parental investigators, but we're still in
that same bubble. But there's a lot of bullshit when it comes to evidence
that's put out there. What do and again jump in whenever, what do
you guys consider to be real evidence? Because I'm extremely critical when it comes
to everything that's sent to me. Eric showed me a really compelling clip a
little while ago. The first thing I did would say, Hey, send
this to me. I want to tear this apart. I want to show
you why it's nonsense, because that's how I approach everything, and I approach
it kind of with that asshole tendency of if I wasn't there, I can't
prove it was there, and so that's where my skepticism comes from. So
I want to know everyone's opinion. What do you consider actual evidence? And
what does it take Someone like Tyler Terry where he filmed into Ruck to a
documentary where we had something that he could definitively, definitively say wasn't within the
crew and we still were like, Eh, let's find a reason that this
wasn't real. Let's find the reasons like this wasn't legitimate. I think for
me, the approach when you're going into an investigation at the very first and
the way that I approach it, I think is similar to probably mossed off
in Brendan too. But my motto is, we don't investigate a haunting.
We investigate stories of a haunting. Because if you go in to investigate a
haunting that you alreadys believes there, you're already biased. And so when it
comes to evidence, I tend to be very critical as well, and especially
when I present it to other people, I present it as this is what
I caught. What do you think. I never go in and say,
look, I caught you know a ghost or I don't know if it's a
ghost. None of us know if it's a ghost. Hell, it could
be time slips, it could be all kind of other different phenomena, black
holes, and you know, some of the things that they're doing skinwalker rnsers
crazy but in some and it could just all kind of different phenomena. It
doesn't necessarily have to be the afterlife. We're running off the theories and educated
guesses based on experiences and things like that. So even though I would never
thought anybody's story because I wasn't there, so I can't say what the conditions
were and things like that. And it's the same with my own stories,
you know, because I want people to believe the things that I've had happened
when either that's to get it. And hopefully I'm credible enough and talk intelligently
and educated enough too for people to believe when I tell you a story,
this really happened to me. But can I tell you that's a ghost or
it's a place is haunted. I don't think anybody can do that, just
like there's no experts in this field. And I hate when people use that
moniker and they put it, producers put it on TV, and it's ridiculous
because you can't be an expert and something you can't prove. And so you
know, I'll come and show you a picture and be like, look at
this, you know, what does it look like to you? And I
can describe the conditions and you can believe it or not. But I'm never
going to come to you and say, even with that EVP, I'm just
gonna come and say, listen to those voice we caught, here's the conditions
Rosemont, for example, in Gallatin, Tennessee, we caught a horse any
on an EVP and there's the walls are three foot thick brick. There's no
horses within ten miles of the place. I can't explain that. But I
can't tell you that that was a ghost horse either, So that's kind of
my approach. I can't really I just know what I believe, and it
comes down to belief a lot and being there and like we were saying,
the feelings that you get the kind of extra century that your body has in
the environment. But I can't say that that's a ghost or a spirit or
the afterlife. You know, it may just all be imprints on the environment,
which you know, we call residual hauntings, even some of the intelligent
stuff. And there's even some people researching into that we're haunting ourselves, especially
to locations that we've been at multiple times. If you get your name on
an EVP or through you know, any other piece of equipment, maybe that's
just where we left an imprint on the environment. And the last time we
were there, we introduced ourselves and now we're just hearing it again. So
there's all different kind of things out there, so it's hard to say with
evidence. And then you also with evidence, you have all the people who
they just want attention, and so they're gonna everything's demonic or everything's this or
that, and they're just going to jump to conclusions because they want the attention.
They don't want a real explanation that a picture is a lens flayer or
you know, naturally occurring issue with a piece of with a camera or something
that you know, we know like Apple cameras are notorious for these green orbs
because of the way that camera lens is made with a expicted glass on it,
and so if you if you know things like that, then it's a
lot easier to debunk natural things that are occurring in the environment. For me,
I would say it has to be quantifiable data that can be tested and
analyzed by a third party, and a third party that's a professional from a
technical industry. I mean, you have a lot of param enthusiasts and people
that investigate the supernatural that go out there and use these devices specifically made de
fine ghosts right, and in reality that's just simply not true. But if
we can utilize technology from other technical industries that give us quantifiable data that can
be looked at by a professional that uses that technology on a day to day
basis that can tell you this is something that's natural or something that's not natural.
That's when we're taking that next step to finding proof, if you will,
or at least some kind of answers as to what is something we can
or cannot explain. So for me, it's quantifiable data, putting ourselves through
that scrutiny and understanding what methodology is and you know, what protocol should be,
standards and ethics, and utilizing professional equipment from other technical industries that can
be analyzed by a third party to say, hey, this is an artifact,
Hey this is something we've seen before, this is clearly natural, or
hey we have no idea what this means and how you captured it. So
I think once you start to add all that up and you start to actually
have that data, that's when we take the next step and actually have what
we would consider proof. To kind of piggyback and I think, oh,
I'm so sorry. I was just gonna say to piggyback off of what you
guys are saying, another kind of side question I want to add in here.
Is do you think it's more important for you to find answers for yourself
or find answers to present to the public. I know, as we all
have multi media outcomes and outlets that we have with podcasting, videos, documentary
shows, what do you find is more important with that compelling evidence? I
think first and foremost, if you are legitimately doing it for yourself, right
and not some kind of like personal seeking or some kind of you confirmation of
some delusion you're trying to create for yourself. Having that high standard for yourself
is going to invariably cover what you're going to give to the public. Right.
So if you have a high standard and you're putting yourself before you put
any kind of discovery you make out there, or trying to present some type
of evidence or relay any findings that you had right by when we when we
did Haunted Discoveries, I did not think we would have captured a fraction of
what we were able to capture. All I wanted to do and Brandon was
of the same mind, which let's document our methodology. Let's attack the usage
of this methodology to the highest level that we possibly can. For every minute
of filming that we're doing in pre production and all of that, and let's
let's just document the results. And that's a hundred percent. It's gonna sound
counterintuitive, but it's one hundred percent of selfish endeavor on our part because we've
we've again, this is gonna sound like super arrogant, but I think a
lot of people here would probably agree is that we set that bar for ourselves.
Okay, this is what we need to do. And as a result
of setting that bar, I think that kind of spurs something and sets a
spark in the investigation that even makes it possible to document whatever it is that
we're documenting. I think the pursuit and the study of the afterlife is in
itself the pursuit of life and living. It's a reflection on death is what
kind of makes you want to live life. More So, if there is
this idea that we're kind of communicating with individuals who have passed on, right,
then wouldn't that resonate with them? And wouldn't that kind of fement that
energy to become alive or echoes of the past or whatever it is that we're
documenting. So I think it inherently has to be a selfish pursuit. I
really do, because then I think what ends up happening is if you're going
in with I need to show this to other people, right, and if
you're working in the TV space, and I could imagine that there are a
number of individuals who are going to try and get ghosts. So this is
why you have this garage teche that comes out. This is why you have
devices that are easily manipulated that you can key with a walkie or like you
know, show it on to TV so people can be like, oh,
wow, look there's there's a ghost here. I think it really really has
to come from a place of personal discovery, fighting to have a genuine interest
in the subject matter. And we're human like you know, our desires and
feelings, Wax and Wayne, just like you know the seasons. But upholding
that methodology that you set for yourself in a very selfish way, I think
is what helps inform the rest of your work. There's a motto that Bob
has heard me say probably a million times, and that is personal is universal.
Whether we're writing stories or doing investigations or whatever the creative work is.
I feel like every human is a microcosm of humanity. In general. That's
why we have archetypes, That's why we have all these story formulas that that
work, and then people follow because somehow, one way or another, our
our life always ends up following that track. So I feel like when you're
looking forever, when when you're doing anything, I don't care if you're selling
spoons, If you're honest with yourself, if that's your passion and you're doing
it the right way for yourself, it will resonate with other people because we're
so similar in so many ways. And so I always feel like when I'm
asked what's the best type of evidence, it's like, I'm never going to
convince you, and it always ends up going to you need to go out
and try it yourself to see how it really feels. Because sometimes the biggest
skeptics, and I'm and I'm one of them, but sometimes the loudest skeptics,
I guess can't even walk into a dark building, like they're they're too
afraid, they can't spend time. In the end, it's like they're talking
to them, they're trying to talk themselves into being a skeptic, but they
can't actually do the work. So but I would say if I have to
pick evidence, then I would. Yeah, I would totally agree with the
way that that Mustaf and Brandon do things. I'm totally fascinated by the photon
events and the EMCCD camera and how that works. I've never I mean,
I've seen it on ghost Hunters, but you know, I've never gotten my
hands on one to see how it actually works. And I'm curious. What
what is you? You said, a EMCCD. So that's I did a
little bit of homework. Electron multiplying charge couple device which I know charge couple
devices just what older cameras would would use as a sensor. But what is
it? What does a session look like? I know you guys have to
keep some stuff for your for your season premiers and all that, but what
does a session look like as far as the parameters and and how you guys
go through that. How long does it last? And what does it look
like for the photons? Sorry, a day, twenty four hours as possible.
You know, we want to monitor an environment for as long as possible.
But again we're basing in the off of eyewitness testimony of what people claim
to see in these locations, right, so we're utilizing this camera that we've
been very lucky to work with doctor clore On and have his expertise. I
mean, the guy has written many papers about photon events, and he was
the one of the people that actually suggested to us when we said if we
were to monitor a supposed haunted location, what we would look for. He
mentioned, you know the possibility of photon events, right, So we control
the environment as much as possible. The EMCCD, like you said, at
electron multiplying sensor, it's looking for light events that typically aren't seen by the
human eye, and this camera's extremely sensitive, so you have to control an
environment as much as possible. But again we go to locations where, for
instance, on episode two of season one, there's this story about a woman
in a black dress walking up a servant staircase in this location, and that
particular staircase is surrounded by windows in a eighteen hundreds home, and at night,
you know, you have gas lamps that are outside the window with a
flicker of a flame, you have street lights coming through. But with this
particular camera and the spectrum you're allowed to see and you can see those different
light forms showing up in not only different colors, but the way it casts
the shadows and the way it just casts a light onto an environment, and
we were able to actually capture something pretty significant. But again with this camera
being that it's so sensitive and that it sees light in ways that I've never
experienced before with any kind of device, you have to be very mindful of
everything. But again with a photonic event, we're looking for these light anomalies
that are showing up that in theory, have their own energy source. The
only way we were able to recreate some of these photon events that we've collected
throughout the country is by lighting a map on camera. To see not only
the light associated with the flame, but to see the way it kind of
can busts on camera. Is the closest thing we I think got right,
Mustafa to trying to naturally recreate some of these events that we've captured on camera.
Yeah, it's it's it's really fascinating stuff and it kind of it Also
it also calls into question a lot of things that we may have discounted in
terms of like orbs, Like a lot of times that's just like you know,
a consequence of like Eric was saying earlier, of like camera sensors.
But then you know, a lot of these events we saw they literally look
like something out of the movie Poltergeist. You know, it's just this weird
thing that's inexplicable. We don't know what it is, but it is its
own energy source, and it is coming from somewhere in many instances, and
all of them actually come out of nothing to come out of nowhere. It's
just a photon event. It's an energy source that manifests, It travels a
short distance or stays stationary and kind of burns and then disappears. What is
that? We don't know, but I think what you want to you want
to be in a position where in order to come up with a practice,
If you're reaching to come up with a practical explanation for something, then you
can be like, oh, okay, this is paranormal. Like Brandon says,
if it's not normal, it's it's paranormal. So if if you're showing
this to people who are experts in the usage of this equipment or people who
are experts in their respective fields and they're kind of left grabbing at straws to
how to explain something, You're like, all right, we got something special.
On our hands here, and we've been fortunate enough to be in that
position quite a few times. So I want to dive into texture in just
a second. One I want to I want to expand on the camera specifically.
Is this a consumer grade camera? Is this something that's built for you
and your team or with the doctors you work with. And if it isn't
a consumer grade camera, what parameters are you guys taking to ensure that there
is no external stimulants that may be pushing this camera to give these photon events
more direct evidence. And again we'll get into it with the like said,
the equipment side of things, I'm very critical about paranormal equipment. I will
spend hundreds, if not thousands of dollars to buy the stuff, taking apart
and explain why it works or doesn't work. So this photon camera that I
want to know a where did that come from? How did you guys acquire
this style of investigation? But also what steps are you doing consistently for a
camera like that that's so out of the norm to ensure that it is calibrated
properly and it's working and it's intended use before anyone answers that can I just
say one small boring science saying about how the camera works. Yes, so
normally when you with a camera with an imaging sensor, you have the light,
which for these purposes, I think we can we can equate photons with
light light particles, even though it's not that simple. But they go onto
the sensor and they move. They energize electrons, which are you know,
those are the only two particles I'm going to mention, I promise, So
if you're listening and you're like, I'm not going to do this today,
only two because I also hate it. But so those those electrons move and
then they basically map out the picture that was taken. So with these EMCCD
cameras, the photons go in, the electrons move, and then they are
charged. They are electrified before they map out the picture. So it's amplifying
that light. It's amplifying those photo electrons, which is the photoelectric effect and
you can google it, but basically photons hit electrons, it makes them move.
So that's how it amplifies it to the point where it's used in like
the medical field and in a stre me and all that type of stuff.
So that's what I love about this camera because most things that we use in
the field have like ir light or things that penetrate, and this is just
kind of soaking up the environment, which is why it's so exciting to me.
So I just wanted to put that in there. You know, it's
funny like so, going by everything you just said, it was brilliant by
the way, it was awesome. But going back to the question, so
we were given this camera by one of our scientific consultants that we worked with
for a number of years out of Texas, and he's used it specifically for
astronomy. That's what he's utilized it for. And when he gave us this
piece of equipment, he said, pointed at the sky, and I was
like, Okay, that's not really the purpose. While we're getting which I
have not yet to do that yet. We've used it outside in graveyards in
places where there's been eyewitness testimony, but I've never actually pointed it up at
the sky. And that's one of the purposes. He's used it for many
years and he's captured a lot of things that he can't explain. He's using
it for scientific research purposes, but he's gotten stuff just in the sky that
he can't explain he's sent me clips before. There's just mind blowing stuff,
which some of it's kind of similar to stuff we've captured before mist Office,
specifically at Octagon Hall in the enslaved people's cemetery, very similar looking things,
but I mean just pointing straight up at the stars. But again, like
you said, it's soaking up the environment. That's why it's such an important
factor to try and control that environment as much as possible when we're utilizing the
camera. Like I said earlier, with like the Louisville bourbon in and that
specific scenario with that staircase where you were literally monitoring the same live and you
can see the different pools of light that are coming in from different sources,
and you can just it all encompasses everything in the image where you can tell
what is coming from, what's right, and that's when we have these moments
where these photonic events manifest and show up and are put through the sensor and
recorded that are just kind of mind blowing and sometimes even to the fact where
we ask for it to happen and it's actually happened before. So it's it's
mind blowing stuff. But again, doctor Clark can speak to it in a
way more scientific nature and really break it down. But that was a great
explanation everything you just said. But again going back to controlling the environment,
very important with that sensitive piece of equipment. And again there's been some stuff
we just simply can't can't explain it at all. Very cool. So I
want to discuss now gimmicks versus features when it comes to para equipment because a
very unexpected byproduct with the rise of the need for paranormal entertainment and the popularity
in this field has been everyone and their sister suddenly has an engineering degree and
they can create these devices that detect ghostspun So Eric, you know, Eric
and I had a great conversation at the Thomas house when we went through all
of his equipment and we had an in depth discussion about why I don't trust
certain pieces of equipment. Again, I'll buy this stuff to take it apart
and never use it again. Like and I'm just gonna throw this out there
because I can say this publicly. The hufbox is a great explanation of a
gimmick versus a feature written piece of equipment. How are you guys? And
Tyler, you as well, we had this discussion we did Fantom Farm.
What equipment we were actually going to share how everyone in this group, how
are you approaching the equipment that you're using and you're bringing in one film and
you're utilizing to collect what maybe evidence of life after death? Because again,
we're extremely critical about these types of things, and I want to know every
new spirit box. I want to take it apart. Is there a repeater
in there? Can I put an SD card? Is there anything I can
do to influence this to give me quote unquote evidence Tyler to the rimpod.
We are extremely critical about the rimpod because we found six ways from Sunday to
set it off. It. We just can't trust that piece of equipment.
And that's one of the most universally accepted ones that you see on almost every
television show. And you don't know as someone standing behind the camera, at
camera operator or even outside the building pressing that button. This second Tyler ask
question, you don't really know. So I want to throw that out to
you guys. What is a what separates the two and what is a feature
that you have to have or you feel like it's an essential part of your
your tool kit as an investigator. Well, I can give a short answer
first and observing the way that that Gustaf and Brandon Eric. Sorry, I've
never seen you investigator or anything, so I can't comment on how on your
style, but I know that that Mustaf and Brandon have an approach that I
agree with where they use the EEDI the environmental detection instruments, and when something
happens, they're measuring multiple factors in the environment. So when those things line
up, that's much more compelling. There really is never one device that you
know. Your your EMS starts streaming, you don't know if it's a battery
issue or what's going on. I've we we both I think, have followed
EMF through a house to a furnace or something that's I don't understand that when
it's in Uh, there was a place I went that's surrounded by powerlines.
It's like it moves through and waves. If I'm not as educated an investigator,
then I think I'm following a ghost girl into the closet instead of just
this thing that's happening once every hour or so. I think it's just a
collection of things that have to spike when the door handle shakes or there's an
EVP or something like that. That's kind of the only way that it's going
to be compelling to someone else. Other than that it's just a personal journey.
Well, I can say with Eric in particular, when we went to
Thomas House, he very rarely had any piece of equipment that we didn't put
in your hands when it came to actually investigating. So I know Bob wanted
to say something, then we'll pass it on. Well, basically, so
for Tyler, it needs to be coupled with an external stimulant and an internal
internal being. The environmental factor, whether it be EMF you're following, or
barometric pressure change. I'm still on team bring back barometers. Every investigating team
should have a damned giant barometer they carry around with them at all times.
Brandon and Mustafa correct me if I'm wrong. Does the EEDI have a brom
are in it? Yep, it does. It's like like we always talk
about the Swiss Army Knife of the paranormals, what that is and the guys
that actually created that device. We're not paranormal people, you know. They're
actually really brilliant engineers that put together a very specific device that in reality every
paranormal investigator should be using. I think that if you're going to be a
ghost hunter or paramal enthusiast orn investigator, that's the device you should have right
there, because not only you documenting everything from barometric pressure to temperature, humidity,
EMF, vibration, but you're also collecting that data and recording it to
an SD card and able to actually chart that and graph it out, which
is really cool. So that's something we're always using in conjunction with say the
EMCCD camera because going back to the photon events, we've noticed that when we're
seeing these photonic events happen, we're seeing drastic changes in barometric pressure, right
which is another interesting angle in that whole PARAMORL photon theory we've been talking about.
But also one thing we've added in the last couple of seasons is outside
of using the EEDI Plus with the mcc camera, we're also using devices from
Kestral who Kevin Audio, our field investigator, reached out to the National Weather
Service and they directly gave us this equipment to monitor all the environmental conditions in
a location, everything from windspeed to barometric pressure, humidity, temperature, magnetic
compass, all these things that they use in the field with the National Weather
Service that we have adapted into our research now that's used in conjunction with the
EEDI plus and say the MCCD camera, and we're trying to correlate all those
devices together, and we were very lucky with the last couple investigations we did
to have all three of those devices correlate together at the exact moment, from
the visual anomaly with a photon event to the magnetic compass changing on the Kestral
device ten degrees and having very much pressure change on the VII plus, which
was a pretty crazy moment. What is the kestral device measuring? It's all
kinds of stuff right in the stuff It's it's pretty wild. And what's great
about it too, is not only are you data logging all that information,
but you're also able to monitor in real time. Be an app a really
nice application they put together. But again, everything from windspeed to direction,
a magnetic compass, a parametric pressure, I mean, everything you can imagine.
The National Weather Service is documented at any given time. It's literally all
there and giving you real time data. So that'll also be helpful for ruling
out you know, weather and temperature changes that would change the pressure at that
time, which is always something that I hear that I was probably just getting
cold. In another interesting thing, we don't really rely on em very often.
We more utilize em say like a tri field meter to rule out the
natural electromagnetic frequencies in a location. That's when we're typically using it. I
think there's been a few times we've had things happen with EMF that just couldn't
be explained, one of which was at a jail with doctor Klore where being
in those jail cells, it was essentially a Faraday cage right in an area
that does not have any electricity, no outlets, anything like that, and
you're in a perfect fair Day cage. And we had some responses with it.
But again with the Kestral device and that magnetic compass that's on there,
that to me is a more credible way to try and document any EMAP anomalies.
Like going back to utilizing a compass, just a standard compass for magnetic
fields. It's very similar, but in a digital sense, and we had
a moment with that that to me, that was credible EMF data more so
than utilizing say like you know, rimpod or whatever the hell people are using.
So I think it's just again utilizing technology from other technical industries, talking
to these people that utilize that in their professional fields day in and day out,
and for them to you know, allow us to use this equipment,
and then for us to document things and send them that data. That just
takes it a step further for sure. Yeah. So for me with equipment,
I am very low tech. I don't I don't do EMF meters.
I hate rampods. EMF meeters were brought into the field originally to rule out,
like Brandon was saying, rule out unshieldreed wiring and houses and things like
that. And I've even been on a private investigation where they were seeing operations
and things in their house and their wireless modem because the ladies husband was a
big gamer, so they had a really fast internet connection to this crazy wireless
modem that was given off fifteen hundred milligals. Well, that's going to cause
anybody hallucinate to hear things, see things if you're especially if you're sensitive to
to E m F. And that's scientifically proven in facts that high ems.
You can look up to God experiment the God helmet experiment and things like that.
But and then as far as like rampods, rimpods, I mean,
any powerful radio will set them off. You can have a walkie talkie key
it up. And I showed this to everybody that comes on public investigations with
us when we sell tickets. That's all it takes. But also, even
if you don't have a walkie talkie, who's to say that the trucker down
the street has a you know, driving by on the interstate, doesn't have
a really powerful CB radio that's setting it off, and you know things like
that, So you you can't control those outside factors with with equipment like that.
I'm just big on video. I have a flee your thermal camera.
I guess on my cell phone that that works really really well that we've got
some anomalies with. So yeah, just video audio and and uh I do
I do like the s's method. We've gotten some crazy experiences out of that.
Now was it paranormal? I don't know, but we've just gotten some
really cool answers and things that people wouldn't know and things that we didn't even
know that we've gotten about locations. But yeah, as far as apps and
and other uses equipment. I may use a motion detector every once in a
while, but the things that I use they're not made by anybody that's in
the paranormal. I mean, the motion detector is something that I ordered off
Amazon. That's just a motion detector, like you know, so there's no
there's nothing in there that's you know, hacked or or made to get false
positives and things like that. Not saying a motion detector can't. But you
know, for the most part, you break that beam, it's gonna go
off. It's very simple device. But yeah, I don't I don't like
gadgets in that way that they're they're fallible, and especially the ones that are
like you know, ghost Tube, ghost Pro. Everything's fucking ghosts something and
it's just ridiculous. It's you know, well that's how you know it's for
ghosts. Just buying hardware to fix a house or something. Oh my goddamn
brain. I do want to jump in because it's important. This is for
everyone's audience. No app works, stop using them. I'm not gonna I'm
not gonna carry you. I don't need to argue with this. I okay,
you just killed half of the YouTube paranormal content streaming. I don't know
what you're but my thing is with with paranormal apps, we've we've proven them
wrong six ways from Sunday. I can't even I can't even approach that discussion
because I've seen this way too often. I was like, yeah, I
had this happen on my app, and then my hair stood up on the
back of my neck. I definitely got molested by a ghost. No,
you fucking didn't. That never happened. You're you're you're grasping at straws.
So I do want to quick kind of throw it over toward the sponsor of
the show, the Tennessee Hawnson Legends Expo, Eric, can you walk us
through everything with the Tennessee Hawnson Legends because it's our first expo and you know
firsthand getting me out of Ohio it's it's that's an impossible task. I don't
do events. In the fact that you got me there. You got me
on my first live investigation that I did with anybody else was with you.
And again it's that silky smooth radio voice, it really is. I can't
say no spelling. So tell us about the expo. Yeah, well you're
not, You're not the only one. I'm very honored that Brandon agreed to
do the expo also because he does he's not one to do conventions and things,
and and I'm grateful to him and must offer for a greening to do
the expo. But yeah, we have some great speakers. That's coming to
the Nashville Fairgrounds in Nashville, Tennessee on October twenty feet and uh, it's
the first big expo that we've done, but it's called Tennessee Hanson Legends Expo.
Tickets are just for the general public or ten dollars and then twelve and
hundreds free. All of the proceeds are going to two separate charities. One
is a hanted astoric location called Trousdale Place in Gallatin, Tennessee, and the
other half of the proceeds will go to the Animal Rescue Corps. And what
they do is they break up puppy mills. So they'll go out to Bumfuck
County, Tennessee, where they don't have animal control and the sheriffs department things
can't afford to break up these puppy mills, and they go out and give
them the the volunteers and the money to break up these puppy meals and they
actually put the dogs and the and the cats and to into no kill shelters
with natural Humanist, big big partner, THEIRS, but they're kind of all
over the southeast. And so two great charities. Trousville plays. It's a
historic location, has a great history, and of course like any other location,
they're nonprofit. Any other historical location, they're nonprofit. They live off
of you know, five dollars tours coming in the door, and you know
they have upkeep. You know, a storm comes through and blows a tree
down on a property, they have to pay somebody to clean it up or
they've fixed the foundation. That's one of the issues they're having right now.
And so yeah, I just keeps that history alive and help them with the
animals. And we have a great day of speakers, the whole speaker lineup.
Brandon Mustafa will will be our key speakers that day. They have an
hour to get up and talk about what they do and talking about how discoveries
and things like that. And then also Tyler, Bob and Britney will be
there. You're gonna have a Bob and Brittany. You' are gonna have the
Tails from the Dark booth, and you also have a Missing Person Mysteries booth
as well. Yep. And we're gonna do a screening of Phantom Farm documentary,
and then we're gonna follow that up with a panel of all of y'all
up there talking to the audience about the film and and answering questions and things.
Who We're definitely excited. Like I said, it's it's it's for a
great cause and it's with great people. I'm very I'm very excited. I'm
excited about I'm also against a lot of the conventions that are out there because
it's it's a clear money grab. Yeah, and I hate to say it
there against you too. Yeah, well that's trying to check your money,
you know. But when when you you know, when you brought this to
us, it's for a good cause. We'd like to have you guys down.
First off, we can't tell Eric, no, we really can't.
We all need a band together, everyone in this call and figure out what
kind of juju Eric has over us. All right, Yeah, look,
I'm just what you see is what you get, whether you talk to me
on the phone, online, on the podcast, in person. I'm the
same exact fucking person, no matter when you see me, when you talk
to me, I'm just okay, Satan, I've heard this before. We
don't see camera are effigies of us. The mine is just a stretch arms
drawing. I do want to talk to you guys. What are your guys
as pet peeves and the paranormal not just necessarily television documentaries, but the paranormal
community because it is weird. People have like these little camps of like everything's
a demon, and if you say it's not a demon, you're not a
real investigator. And then there's a bunch of like weird I'll die on this
hill paranormal stances. I don't that I don't really understand from me, But
my biggest pet peeve has to just be there has to be this hyper masculine,
macho face of every group that has to say I'm here, this is
my group, I'm in charge. I'm gonna bend this ghost over. That's
my biggest pet peeve. That There's what I've been railing about on my show
the whole fucking three years I've had my show, is there's no diversity in
the paranormal, especially paranormal TV. There is diversity. Paranormal is not represented
on TV. It's it's it tends to be a bro culture wearing fucking affliction
t shirts and every episode, fuck him, fuck him. I wish you
would pick a fight with me. It'd be good for my brand. But
but yeah, it's just ridiculous. Like you know, it takes all of
us to try to figure this out, and and to see even these even
really large paranormal podcasts that have been on that have been out for years,
that have nothing but men on his guest and then maybe twice a year they
have a woman on and it's just ridiculous. And whether they do that on
purpose or or subconsciously. And I really didn't realize until I started booking guests
and I started giving comments about from people in reviews and things that one of
the reason they liked my show is because I talked to everybody, not just
a bunch of bro culture men. And you know, I have groups with
all women and things like that, not to two mind horn, but I
just want to talk to everybody. It wasn't even something I consciously did.
It's not something I constantly do now. I just book everybody. But to
see some of the bigger podcasts. It just made me realize, yeah,
they do, you know, but just that hyper masculine culture bullshit, because
like I said, it takes all of us in this field too to figure
this out, and it's not just one group or another. The other thing
that I could talk about is is religion in the paranormal field period, because
that's where you get the demon ship from, is looking at it from a
religious standpoint and Rose Cutter glasses there. But I won't get on that soap
box. Well, no, no, I wanted to write a book that
I was going to call the Separation Separation of Church and Ghosts because because I
completely agree with you. And then the other thing. I don't know if
you guys have watched The Little Rascals, but the terrifying film. Current paranormal
culture is very much like the The He Man Woman Haters Club, and you
see that way too often, and it's very bizarre because like I often consider,
you know, I'm the co host of the show and Brittany, you
know, runs everything without Brittany Tellsman Dark doesn't exist, Fantom Farm didn't happen.
That's the way that I approach all of these conversations and I want to
expand this to Brandon and Mustaffa as well, because I sure, I'm sure
you guys see this in a different way, and I guess Tyler could be
included. Well, if I could say one quick thing, I think it's
I try not to judge what everyone's doing, how they investigate or whatever,
because I don't think it's I think it's a symptom of a barrier to entry,
because the real way to do it, the way that Brandon and Mustafa
do it, it's not that like fun like a you know, you're not
gonna you're not gung ho about, You're not in there for the jump scares.
It's not like a horror movie, right, And it's so scientific.
As someone who I guarantee watches more paranormal content than anybody here. It's a
problem, it is, But but most of the time I'm just you know,
this is what not to do. This is what I'd rather do.
A lot of the paranormal YouTubers they do two things. It's rampods and turn
on their apps, and their apps will tell the story and they see,
oh that person's doing it. It's working, So I'm going to do it.
I think if we can, and this is why I see such a
bright light and like Haunted Discoveries and all these things, is if we can
simplify that or make it approachable to where people can start doing it on YouTube
and have this kind of formula to follow. It's it's never that simple,
but I think it's a it's a trend thing and a barrier to entry thing.
So we have people that are doing the easiest thing, and yeah,
it's not it's there's not really a simple solution to it, but it's tricky,
it's work. I think that we went from as a culture, especially
when the paranormal went from Okay, the journey is the point to now the
destination is the point. So let's get it to the fucking destination as quick
as we can. To hell with the journey to get there. I always
think that the journey in the paranormal films that I like documentaries and things and
YouTube channels, it's it's always the ones that like small town monsters that are
documenting documenting, not just the evidence they caught or the investigation. It's it's
all about how they got there to begin with. That I find more fascinating
anything and I think that's what brendanm. Stoffer doing as well with Hunt of
Discoveries. It's okay, we have a journey to getting to the investigation and
the evidence and things, but we need to understand the history, the lineage,
all these other factors we need to understand about this location before we ever
get to you know, the payoff, which is you know, the paranormal.
I guess when people watch the shows. But yeah, I think a
lot of those shows have have and and people on YouTube, they just get
straight to the to the destination and the hell of the journey because that's what
people want to hear and see. Yeah, I mean, I mean first
we have to just discuss the girls have COVID bees. I think that's all
right, listen, Well that's I think. No, I think a lot
of it just has to do about like you were saying, Eric is it's
it's the work. I think, as long as you're focusing on a methodology
and the work that you're doing. And I think Brandon would agree on this,
is that, like you know who we work with and collaborate with,
and we've had guests, investigators, and we brought people in on Haunt of
Discoveries and who we work with. I mean it's we don't really care like
about any kind of agenda, whether it's in terms of optics or anything like
that. All we really kind of care about is the work. I think.
And then and then you have shows like you know, Kesha's Paranormal Show
or Demilovado like you know, Singing the Ghosts or whatever, and then it's
just like, hey, hey, hey, look at this, we got
this diversity. Check this out. And then it's like okay, but you're
still using mpods and your methodology is crap. So then it's just like and
then you can't say it's bad because then you're not progressive. But it's like
it doesn't change. No, I'll say, I'll say it right now.
It is like, yeah, it's so I do think, yeah, I
do whatever. I man, I cancel myself on a daily basis. But
I think I think it's just it's it's really important to highlight like, you
know, the efforts that people are doing or a really really interesting new approach.
A lot of times with like I think that hypermasculinity and all that other
stuff that you know people are getting upset about is that you know, Ghosts
Adventures is a very very very very popular show Baggan's is a very very very
popular brand. So then people are going to go and try to replicate that.
I mean, the Barbie movie made a billion dollars and then now they're
already going to make a Polly Pocket movie or like whatever, and it's like
who cares? Like you know, just as like an example in the entertainment
sphere. But again, methodology, the work, the journey of getting to
that methodology and explaining it and really applying it in interesting and intriguing ways in
a in a situation, location case. Any of that I think can not
only be gratifying and informative, but it can also be scary, because Brandon
I say this, all time science is scary, like when when when you
when you can rule out any possibility of this, having a practical explanation and
going through that, and then if you show things that are you know,
oh, we've we've debunked this, we've debunked that, and then you come
across something that you truly cannot explain. With a group of people from all
walks of life, from all parts of the country and in some cases the
world, working together to be like, hey, we're working towards this thing,
to run towards this common goal. Like that's the stuff that like every
cool like video game RPG you grew up playing, was about every movie.
It's like, you know, the Goonies, but in real life. And
it's a really, really kind of beautiful thing when you can when you can
touch that, even if just for a little bit. And yeah, if
you're doing good work and focusing on that, that trumps everything else because then
everything else is just you know, it's just sprinkles on top and it's all
sprinkles, but the cake sucks. So make a good cake, which is
your work, and then the rest will fall into place, you know.
I think to add to that, one thing that I don't think a lot
of parallel investigators think about is filmmaking skills. And it makes a big difference
when you're you know, you could have good investigators that have horrible audio,
the winds beating on the mic and you can't hear anything they're doing or saying.
If you want to capture you have to learn to capture that magic at
some level. There are so many YouTube videos I watch where they just blind
the tour guide or the docent with a light and film them talking for a
two hour tour or something, and then they start their investigation where they set
their rimpot down and run around some structure would really help to highlight these investigators
who are probably more focused on their technique, rightfully so, because they have
so much work to do. But if there could be a balance of some
filmmaking skill that could make it more appealing to a mass audience. No,
I want to jump in on that because I do think that mustaphic you outline
something that's vitally important that people understand. There's a difference between personality and brand,
and I feel like that gets lost in translation when you go through the
editing process and what have you, and you have people who consistently don't grasp
that who they show on screen is not always who they are as a person.
And so you have a ton of investigators attempting to mimic what they're seeing
consistently on television, and I think that can be equally damaging because they don't
understand that it wasn't like that day one they had to work into said brand
and so picking up where they left off, which again we talked about that
on the show here all the time. It's really important to leave your investigation
in your research and a point that someone can pick it up and continue.
You have to also pay omage and respect of what got you to that point
in the first place. I know, I got Brandon and Britney, So
to go in your guys's pet peeves, I want to hear Britney specifically,
Oh God, Brittany or Brandon and go Brandon, You're good, you can
go first. Well, I mean again, I just to piggyback off what
everyone was saying. I mean, you guys kind of hit the nail on
the head with all of it. But again, it's methodology man for me,
and a lot of times to seeing these people go into these very tragic
historical situations and hijack, hijack that person's storyline and make that storyline their own
in a way. That's a big pet peeve of mind is that sometimes these
stories are just not ours to tell in any way, shape or form,
right, And it's always kind of sad to see certain investigators or filmmakers whoever
maybe kind of spin a very tragic storyline into something that is kind of about
them. So that's always tough to see. So I think That's one of
my biggest pet peeves is like, just you know, sometimes the stories aren't
ours to tell. Be factual, be accurate, and let people decide for
themselves. Don't make it about you, right, Yeah, there's a lot
of exploitation of tragedy. I think people just don't see it because they're so
concerned with having a cool story. It's like the more horrible it is,
the cooler it is. And that's just I don't know if it's a youth
thing or what, but it's not preserving history. That's the issue. So
coming from my perspective, and it comes to parent noormal. I started relatively
recently three years ago with Tales from the Dark. I grew up in the
South, and I grew up with the belief of ghosts exists, and I
grew up in a Baptist home, So you know, my theory of ghosts
was that it was maybe stuck in between or it was just remnants of what
was before. So I grew up believing, and then as I got older,
I stopped believing. And then once I got into Tales from the Dark,
I relearned and kind of change from all these uh basically parallels euphanisms I've
had in my head. Thank you of what paranormal was. As a woman
in the field, I do not feel like I feel like I've been very,
very lucky because I don't feel like people exclude me because of my gender
or what have you. I feel one with the team, especially with our
team for freedom Form. I never felt excluded at all, and I felt
like I've never liked you. But okay, well, you know what I
was going to ask. Is it because the tyler wears as tight of jeans
as you do. It's tighter jeans. Actually, they're tighter. They're tighter.
Yeah, he buys them from hot topic. It's fine, No,
But on a real note, I feel like it's I have been valued as
a woman, and I have been valued as coming from a scientific background really
to for what I bring to the table. I don't feel like I have
been targeted or put down because of that. And I know the hyper masculine
has been a huge issue even growing up watching Ghost Hunters and Ghost Adventures.
I mean it's it's been ghost Hunters not so much, but Ghost Adventures especially
has been very, uh hyper masculine for a very long time. So I
agree with you guys that it is an issue, but I will personally say
I've not seen it myself. Now, Tyler's getting redder and redder because you
are insulting his pair of idol over here. I know it's his Lord and
Savior. He's gonna flip, He's gonna flip the studio to ask and run
out here a second. I'm just waiting for it. Well, we've been
over this many times, but I shouldn't waste time on it. But the
most entertaining show probably Zach begins an entertainer and it stops there. All right,
Anyways, I have some sorry, go ahead. Part of the part
of the problem is there's so many people that don't take that show is just
entertainment. That is the problem that that's part of the problem is that you
have so many people out there emulating that show. And that's why everything on
YouTube is demons, because that's what's selling right now on TV and it's all
about fucking ratings and that shit. And we'll get into the satanic panic here
soon, which kind of goes hand in hand with everything's a demon. So,
but what were you gonna say, Tyler? Well, I wanted to
ask Brandon mustaff about a couple episodes of ghost Hunters they did. One was
the Cape Gerard am I saying that right, GERARDU Missouri yep, mustaff.
You had a scratch on that one, I believe, and I thought it
looked interesting. It was so with Okay, so we we did Fantom Farm
and we got a much evidence. Seems like the longer we're away from it,
the more things we can think of to explain away certain problems or we
should have done those should and that. With the scratch, it almost didn't
even look like you're maybe I was seeing it wrong. Your skin wasn't raised,
it was like indented. And I'm just wondering, I mean, because
that's a pretty big deal. I've never had anything like that happened to me.
Be totally crazy. What what are your thoughts about that now being so
far removed from it. Yeah, I mean, honestly, what wasn't shown
in the episode was just my I was really really incredulous about the whole thing.
Like I was kind of laughing because I thought, you know, I've
seen the shows where people gotten scratched or people have talked about it, and
my arm kind of just felt like I got stung by a jellyfish, Like
it was just very very weird. And then I looked down on it and
I almost didn't even want to bring it up because I'm just like, I
don't want to like waste time and resources on this thing if it's just like
some weird reaction I'm having. But I'm like, I should, I should.
And then to me, I honestly believe it had a lot to do
with the fact that I was taking a little bit I think of of an
aggressive stance. You know, the people they lost that the family there,
and that home, they lost their home under a very very tragic series of
circumstances. And me personally, I felt really guilty about that because you know,
my family when we were growing up, we lost our house and uh,
and it's still not something that I've like, I don't think I'll ever
get over it. It's just like kind of like like you know, PTSD
or whatever, like when I think about it, and it's really bad.
So for me, I kind of felt guilty by like bringing that up.
But yeah, I definitely I don't know. I can't explain it. I
don't know what happened. I'm I wouldn't have brought it up if I thought
there was any kind of practical explanation for it. So and and I actually
had more when I went back to my hotel room and then you know,
I was, you know, all sweaty and Kate Gerardo and the muggiest weather
possible. You know, I'm like peeling my closed off myself at the end
of the night. And on my back there was a scratch. There were
scratches, you know. And I didn't have any fun times with any you
know, weird goth chicks on the road, so that didn't that didn't really
explain that. So yeah, I just had these markings all over my back
too. So I don't I don't know. I don't know what it is.
I do know that Brandon experienced something similar when we were on the Discoveries
and a place at bethlen We can be right, Brandon, Yeah, very
similar situation, which was my first time ever experienced in something like that,
similar sensation like you mentioned, like it felt like a jellyfish sting on my
back. And then I you and David, who are a cameraman, is
completely a skeptic, doesn't believe in anything, But I think the show scared
the hell out of him, and he didn't come back for season three.
But anyways, we were there and I had a very similar thing, and
it was, you know, there were scratches there. Whatever that is that,
I don't think it's some negative, demonic type thing in any way,
shape or form. I don't know what the hell it was. But first
time I experienced it, I haven't experienced it since, so I have no
clue what the hell it is. So what does that do to your side?
Is that like, is that the point where you're like, oh,
it's all real or is it just another unexplained phenomenon. Well, for me,
I thought to myself, maybe I scratched myself, like you know,
you're putting your arm down and you do things unconsciously like that sometimes. But
I was wearing gloves all night because it was gosh, almost what five degrees
right in stopping there was no power in the house. No, Yeah,
So for me, it wasn't really proof of anything. Maybe it was more
psychological than anything. I don't know. I don't know what it was.
But to me, beyond the physical sensation of it, it didn't affect me
any other way or made me think twice about it being supernatural. I don't
know, it's it's hard to explain. I don't know. I do find
it hilarious, Mustafa that you kind of just summarized the entirety of what got
us to phantom for him. Yeah, we're all just we're all just eyeballing
each other. Hearing you say exactly, Yeah, it was like basically word
for word, they to the well for a and I'm like, is this
guy just repeating tire welcome? You know I was welcome baby. Yeah.
I was literally like this guy script, he's rereading the fun with us like
that? Did you start repeating every line? Yeah? Because it was so
weird because Tyler, when you brought up some of you're like, hey,
I know I already know, but what are your thoughts on this year's a
video? But I know, and we had that, We had a pretty
explained that there was a fantom scratch and Phantom farm one of our investigators,
and hearing you guys describe it was that's basically the exact psychological process that he
went through. He didn't think it happened. He was just trying to play
it off and he was on the whole time. Now, his his scratches
only lasted about twenty to thirty minutes. Misstaff had did you notice did your
disappear after a while or how long did they stay? Now they were there
until the following morning. Wow, yeah, they were there for a few
hours. I would say they were there for at least like eight nine hours.
Yeah, that sounds way worse than so I have one more, right,
Yeah, that would be well, you know, that's that's what I
thought. And then our fellow investigator, it really seemed to mess him up
for probably a couple of weeks. I mean, I don't want to speak
for him and his personal tragedies and stuff, but there was other things going
on behind the scenes that kind of fed into that. But there is there
is one more episode that I thought was kind of crazy. Now we probably
all remember the Saint Augustine Lighthouse ghost Hunter's episode from way back in the day
with the shadow peeking over the stair way there. I always thought in a
weird way that that looked like a cartoon. I was like, is that
a cartoon or is that what the phenomenon? It's like, it's almost like
what you would imagine seeing an aliens, like something you've never ever seen,
can't comprehend and I'm like, is that what it looks like? Or is
that fake? And then I saw the hotel Hall's England, I think is
I think that's what it's called. And Hanes Alaska. For anyone who wants
to watch it's season thirteen, episode five. If ye described didn't happen,
like exactly what the frame, just watched the whole episode for context. And
also I didn't write that down. That episode just seems to be a hodgepodge
of activity. And there are these white I don't know if they're white misty
forms, but they gave me the same vibe as that Sant Augustine Lighthouse shadow
figure, and I'm just wondering, I can't imagine being there, like what
the hell was that? Because it's so confusing to look at uh And if
you guys know which part I'm talking about, those kind of white figures coming
in, it literally like it translates pretty well on the episode. I mean
the raw footage itself. I mean it literally looks like the scene from Beetlejuice
where they're wearing the white sheet. Right, it looks so like but it's
cliche almost. It's it's just when we first saw that. I'll never forget
that. Masapa and I were in the hotel room and he's like, dude,
if you got to see this, I was like, what the actual
fuck man like? And we knew what I mean, we know the environment
really well. I mean, obviously this thing was really translucent and transparent,
which made it even stranger. But the audio data we collected as well up
in that area made it even even more interesting. But it's just I have
no clue what it was, especially being on the body cam is what it
was collected on, and we have when we have those body cams, they
run all night continuously, like they don't turn on and off. So we
had this ridiculously long take and so it was it was really weird to see
it when we were actually analyzing it. But that was a strange moment.
I don't stop. It was up there with Daryl when that happened, and
that was pretty damn weird, pretty damn weird. Yeah, it was so
one thing they didn't include in the episode because they just it was so so
strange and they just I guess the editing team at Pilgrim they didn't they couldn't
fit it in or they didn't know how to contextualize it or whatever the case
was. But in the lead up to Daryl capturing that apparition on his body
cam, I started experiencing one of the claims for a few seconds that the
guy with the interviewee that we talked about, you know, who had his
experiences up there where there was moments of temporary like paralysis, like I couldn't
move my arms for a solid like five seconds, And if you can't move
your arms for five seconds, that might as well be five years, because
you don't know if you're gonna be able to move your arms again. I
just could not move my arms. And then finally, like when I was
able to break him free, I'm like, what the hell was that?
And then Daryl's like what And I'm like, dude, like I couldn't,
like I couldn't move my arms, and he's like, yeah, I feel
attention to my lower back. And then that's when we started getting hits on
the EDI of changes in barometric pressure. And then Darryl not once but twice
said that something charged him. So when we were going back to listen to
the audio, the one bit of audio on the embisonic microphone that we picked
up was a voice where it kind of sounds like somebody saying like it's me,
it's me. It's this guttural, kind of like almost comically evil voice
you would hear in like a movie. But that same voice before Darryl says
I feel attention in my lower back, you hear that same voice say I
feel attention to my lower back. And then it goes to Darryl saying I
feel attention on my lower back. As if this thing or whatever it was,
predicted what he was going to say or influence what he was going to
say. I don't know, but it was just super super strange. And
then something that they didn't put on camera because the film crew, I think
they were doing a run with Kristen and Rachelle in another part of the property
was we were in this one area and the stairwell right below that, and
then Darryl and then Brandon had the EMCCD camera set up and fleear thermal imaging
camera and we captured very strange visual anomalies in that area, and we heard
footsteps coming down the stairs and then that same translucent figure. Because I was
just recording stuff on my cell phone at that point, just in case we
captured something. I saw that same translucent figure in the corner in this one
room where things were like weird, that same translucent figure on my cell phone
camera footage, just chilling in a room. And then it was gone.
So that was a very very very weird, weird place. And I tell
anybody like, hey, if you're ever good, if you're a paranormal investigator,
you want to go to Alaska, Like check that place out, because
there's something about that. I think the fourth floor of the Halls and Glenn
Hotel and Haines, Alaska. That's it's creepy as hello four am and drop
that down. Well, what's interesting is is Alaska in general. I give
it you in portlack Alaska, Port lack Alaska, big Foot, the there's
a million UFO sidings of the triangle, the Alaska Triangle. There's no shortage
of high strangeness in Alaska. So I find that I look for patterns.
That's that's my big thing is trying to find patterns and what connect case is.
My question is when you have a case, it's that jam pact.
Let's say you go to the next night and absolutely nothing happens. How are
you guys preparing yourself mentally, and how are you keeping it entertaining? Because
I mean, we all know ninety nine percent of our the time you're in
the dark by yourself, nothing happens. So so from a I guess a
television show perspective, how are you keeping the energy up going from you know,
what might have been the craziest investigation ever to something completely dead the next
night. Well, for me, I think that just explaining the process and
the methodology is entertaining. Right, Just going through the motions and trying to
go in and recreate results or trying to find logical explanation to what you've captured,
to me is entertaining. And I think that's where you can make entertainment
value. And there is high entertainment value in the process and in the methodology
and in the research itself. So for me, I never go into a
situation thinking about entertainment. I think about the process and the methodology, and
I think that it all comes down to the fact that if you're you know,
checking off all the boxes and following through with your methodology and your research,
that is equally as entertaining is running around yelling dude brow with a spirit
box. But maybe that's just me. I don't know, right, It's
it's kind of like find your audience type deal. Well, no, it's
it's it really is. It's it's that simple, but it's that difficult because
once the again just from an entertainment or like TV or perspective, when you
have the lights on you and branding can attest to this. Even when we
were doing like, you know, because we had a screen test for this,
they you know, they flew me out to Burbank and a bunch of
other people and they just wanted to see how you were going to perform under
pressure. Off camera. Everyone was a star. Off camera, everyone was
you know, king shit, and they knew everything about the power and Roll.
But the second the camera started rolling and they had lights on them,
they froze because the only thing that they were going after was being entertaining.
But if you have something to say, that should mean something to you,
And if you've been doing this work for a long time, or any kind
of work, if you rely on just giving that honest take under pressure,
your honest take on something and what you want it to be, what it
should be for you or what you're hoping it can be and then in the
moment showing maybe your disappointment that you're not getting off what you want to get
off. All that stuff, which will happen if you're working. Everything else
falls into place, Everything else falls into place. I love that this is
where everybody. Why the hell do we investigate at nighttime? Can any want
to answer that? Because I well, well that's why. That's kind of
my next question too, is at nighttime or in the dark, Like,
what are our that? Right? Well, I mean for us, I
mean on Hauntered Discoveries, you're gonna see multiple episodes where we do a bulk
of that work during the day. So it's not something we followed per se
on, you know, according to the formula that is the shows from the
beginning to now. But I think a lot of it if you were to
look at it from a practical point of view, investigating the night's gonna cut
down on as much contamination as possible. So for me, I mean,
if you're looking at it from that point of view, you're gonna have less
traffic. You're gonna have buildings that are typically open as a business or a
tourist attraction during the day that will be way quieter night and you'll have more
access. But again with the Haunter discoveries and especially this last season, we
just shot You're gonna see I mean four or five episodes where we started our
investigations at two pm. You know, so there's gonna be a lot you'll
see on that show. That's gonna show a lot of the work done during
the day. But we were lucky enough to be at locations where we had
access to these locations and they were pretty isolated and didn't have a lot of
contamination, so the night factor wasn't as big of a deal as some of
these other locations would be. You know, you could have just said it's
spooky and that would have been like, that would have been fine. Okay,
Oh my god, Eric, what's your opinion? I mean, you
go all over you you do these these group investigations. Why why are you
guys doing it at nice? I think, like Brendan said, for the
most part, it's it's convenience. I mean, to do to do investigations
at night with a group of people, it's it's entertaining. I mean,
when when when people without bullshitting people, they come by ticket to investigate with
us. We still have to be entertaining, because the truth of it is,
we're probably gonna set the fucking dark five hours and nothing's gonna happen,
And so you have to be entertaining somewhat and doing it in the dark.
People just scare the shit out of themselves right off the bat, especially people
that aren't used to doing this. They're just scared of the dark, and
they're gonna scare themselves and they're gonna get a kick out of that and they
get a little adrenaline rush. But but I also think, like Brendan would
say, and it just takes a lot of contamination out of it. You
don't have a lot of traffic at night, you don't have you know,
a lot of the other light contamination things like that. I also think for
me, I like it because I feel like it heightens my senses a little
more. I'm a little more on edge. I think when it's dark,
walking around the dark and I think I'm paying for myself, my body.
I'm paying more attention to what's going on around me in the environment than the
people that are around me or the you know what environment I'm in. But
yeah, the biggest thing is just the convenience and the keeping contamination now very
very well said, So, Tyler, do you have anything else real quick
for I want to get to our final topic? Well, going off of
something that Stop said earlier about basically finding your own perspective. Oh, I
thought you're you're gonna grinder compare profiles. No, no, this this isn't
only phantoms. Okay, it's the only place. I'm done. I'm leaving
on that note. We'll talk after as the only as the only gay man
in this chat right now, I've never evender, so I'm sorry. All
of those aren't so lucky. Okay, over here in Jersey, man,
Oh my god, Tyler, what were you going to say? Well?
I have something that I kind of want to run by you guys about the
double slit experiment, and I promise it won't be all scientificy and boring.
Well most of it won't. So do you guys care if I talk about
that? For a second floor? Is yours? Okay? So we're probably
all slightly familiar with the double slit experiment, but for the listeners, basically,
your you're moving particles through two slits, and just imagine water going through
two slits and how it would go turn into waves, and the waves kind
of hit each other and it kind of looks like, I don't know,
like fish scales. That's that wave pattern. That's normal. Now, particles
will do that unless they're being observed. So there's this big thing with does
the observer affect the particles? If they're being observed, they'll just go,
they'll group together through the slits, and when they hit the wall, you'll
see that they're in two straight lines. Observation does change the behavior particles,
right, So that's that's a theory. But so my theory would be that
I've thought about and this is a I thought I was being unique, but
this has already been thought of. Is the equipment that is being used because
obviously we can't observe particles, we can't see them. So it's the equipment
that they're using to observe the particles, and I think of like IR light
and things like that. Are the electromagnetic emissions or anything that they're using to
observe those protons and electrons because they literally some of the equipments I looked into,
they have to grab the particles to know that they're there. They are
manipulating the natural order the natural state of those particles, which I let.
I'll let them and also answer that because the act of observing isn't just looking
with your eye. In order to see these particles, you have to use
either certain lights or certain equipment manularly detected and measured, so you really don't
need a human to be there. So what I'm what I'm focusing on is
the conscious observer. Like if a human stood there without using the measuring equipment,
we would never know if it happens because we can't use the measuring equipments.
Kind of a paradox. So I got to thinking about that with paranormal
equipment. If if the equipment is disturbing the particles and collapsing their super whatever
they call it, you'll have to google that. But if it is affecting
particles, then could our ir lights or our regular lights or our radio frequencies
be breaking up a a wave form or a wave pattern? And what if
things, whatever things are, need to use a wave pattern because that's the
way of nature. Everything seems to happen in waves too manifest and we're breaking
it up. And that's again why I like the EMCCD camera because again it's
not penetrating or breaking up, it's just looking. So I just wondered if
if you guys have ever thought about that perspective of the double slitter, or
if you have any thoughts on it about us kind of penetrating and breaking up
things by using light and other forms of frequencies. That's something we've talked about
with doctor Klore and actually tested in the field many times as well. And
one thing we tested on and Discoveries, especially season one, is the observer
affecting the environment not only from equipments, but also from you know, a
person's belief affecting the environments. That's something that we actually conducted an experiment with
with Kyle Cadell and Daring West at the Bethlehem Academy with some research they've been
conducting for a number of years and things that we've been working on, and
we just came together for one big experiment to you know, project into the
environment, I mean, and we're able to document anything around that and let
stop. I think there was probably some pretty interesting things that came out of
that, wouldn't you say? Oh? Yeah? I Mean that's something that
we're we're consciously kind of just going back and forth on. I mean even
just our presence in a certain area. Right when we're investigating, we're always
toying with the ideas like, oh we kind of think there's something here,
but you know, is the is the sheer fact that like we're just here,
you know, kind of you know, influencing the environment or the activity
there in some way. So, uh yeah, we toy around with that
a lot. We'll leave places alone for a while, We'll go back and
forth in Yeah, that's that's something that's constantly on our mind. We're we're
always thinking. We're always thinking like whenever we're in a place and oh is
this dead here or not or whatever? So uh yeah, that we we
work with that a lot. So this is where the conversation might descend or
us end into esoterica. But I saw you guys published through Llewellen Worldwide,
which we all know is mostly witchcraft and paganism. There definitely are haunted and
ghost hunting books on there. But with that thought of a conscious observer affecting
matter, I think that that implies intuition and other things like that, which
are deeply rooted in magic and witchcraft and other things. So with that being
said, is there in maybe episodes we haven't seen, or in future projects
a place for like spiritualistic seances or rituals or summoning things where you play with
your intention or your belief in your investigation. Yeah, we did just that.
It's exactly what we did. Yeah, it's we're open to it,
right, And we wanted to try and document the environment in every way,
shape or form, and we want to look at that from different belief systems,
utilizing our methodology and the way we can our research, but allowing others
a space to do their work and allowing us to document that around them.
And that's something that we did do in the first season upon our discoveries and
specifically bringing in a Spiritesi mode to come in and conduct a seance and to
try and conjure a specific person that is said to haunt that exact place,
and we had great results. And again something we're open to and something that
we're always trying to play with in ways that we feel comfortable with, but
allowing others to do what they believe and their belief system, but finding that
common ground of us working with our methodology and allowing these people to practice their
own beliefs that's awesome. Yeah, I love that, and I want to
kind of build off. So you mentioned Kyle and Darien, So Tyler and
I spoke about this briefly before the show. I want your opinion now that
you live in Kentucky on the Kentucky Anomaly. We talked about this briefly when
you're on the show. There is something about Kentucky. I don't think anyone
that's been there as an investigative capacity can deny something is weird with Kentucky.
And are you familiar with the official quote unquote official Kentucky Anomaly. Oh,
yeah, yeah, I know. It's it's actually the main thesis of the
first season upon our discoveries. That's the reason we came here, and the
reason we came to investigate very specific locations is because of the Kentucky anomaly,
which mainly centered in Somerset, Kentucky, but it also extends out beyond that,
and we did examine the NASA reports, the minimal reports that are out
there about the Kentucky anomaly. And then bringing doctor Harry Chlorin. He his
first PhD was in gravitational anomalies, so that's something that he is very familiar
with and did it? Did it actually look at the anomaly, the gravitational
maps and everything. And at one point right was Stoppica. We're in Somerset.
He started talking about gravity and some of his research and let let some
slip out of it or glory thoughts with out of it. Yeah, it
was. It was pretty great because we were interviewing him on camera and then
he had he had rattled off some like numbers and figures and facts about an
area, and our research that we were going by was from like I think
like a decade prior. And then there was like certain figures that we were
talking about, and then he started like snowballing and we're like, oh,
okay, cool, Yeah, we were looking at this and what about these
figures and everything. And then he's like, oh, is that what your
guys research said and we said yeah, and he's like okay, all right,
and then he like continues with the interview and then right off camera and
he like gets up, takes his micy off and he's like, I have
to check something. I think I said something I shouldn't have said and it's
not declassified yet, and he goes back to his like laptop and everything.
He's like oh thank god. Yeah, no, no, I can talk
about it. And there were like jeez, Louise, like he had like
access to some database or something that he was free to discuss this like knowledge
that shouldn't have been public knowledge because you know he was I think consulting with
NASA and you know, working on some stuff with them. So that was
a very very cool for me. It was my first time meeting doctor Korn
person, so you know, I've read his work and I'm familiar with him
and you know, interacted with him, you know, be a phone and
email and stuff. But then like to see that, I was like,
what a hell of an introduction to this guys. So it was super cool.
That's that's fantastic. So I can toss in one little I do this
thing with because I'm too stupid to read like research papers and all that,
so I just used chat GPT to summarize them. So it might not be
perfect, but for anyone who was hearing this and doesn't think that the Kentucky
anomaly is real or wasn't really researched by NASA, you can go to the
actual dot gov website, like literally just google Kentucky anomaly and you'll find it.
But this is a summary of their report, which I could not read
because of all their mumbo jumbo, but it says NASA found a strong magnetic
region under Kentucky and Tennessee, larger than initially thought. It's magne ties similarly
to Earth's overall magnetic field, suggesting it's not from an ancient quote unquote frozen
magnetic field, which is something that can it's basically the way the Earth is
in that place can look like a signature of an ancient magnetic field. But
that's a whole other That paragraph is longer than this one, and it's basically
saying that it's not that. They use various tools and data types to come
to these conclusions, so I could barely understand that the terminology that they were
using, But it looks like pretty thoroughly they know that for some reason,
the gravity is stronger in that area. Very interesting. So the last thing
I want to bring out, I'm sorry, go ahead, No, I
was gonna say just one last thing, but that if you were just take
a map and lay that over the magnetic map of that area in the gravitational
pool in that area, you see all the strange shit that's been happening in
Kentucky and Tennessee too, So it's it's a very interesting core relation. And
you know, does it lead to some form of psychological effects or does it
lead to some kind of supernatural effect. That's that's what we were definitely looking
into and hopefully have more answers than not. You know, again, it's
tough, but it's very interesting that there's also a higher level of psychosis in
those areas too, in Kentucky and Tennessee as well. Long story short,
at the bell Wich is a hollow Earth alien. That's what these Yeah,
well who wasn't Yeah yea, thank you for saying that. All right,
So the last thing I want to talk about. We could have gotten to
lay lines and a whole bunch of other keep Kentucky weird. There's there's there's
a million things to talk with Kentucky, but I want to get everyone's opinion.
I mean, we talked to Marco Visconti. I don't know if you
guys are familiar, but he wrote the Alistair Crowley Manual, and we had
a pretty in depth discussion when it came to the Satanic panic and the importance
of mitigating that when it comes to paranormal research and paranormal content because as we
spoke, you know, a couple times of the last hour and a half,
there's so many people out there that just everything's a demon, everything has
to be the devil. Now we also know that some of that comes from
upbringing. Brittany talked about growing up as a Southern Baptist, where everything is
the devil, but there's also the other side of the coin, where this
is where we can put our tinfoil hats on. But there's a level of
control, and there's also a monetary benefit to pushing the demon narrative consistently.
So I kind of wanted to get everyone a chance to kind of discuss their
opinion on the resurgence of the Satanic panic. It's definitely different because Tyler and
I grew up small town, Ohio in the nineties. We had one terrible
thing that happened to our town and we had a group one guy killed a
handful of young women and it was terrible. But after that, a lot
of things change for me and a lot of my friends, where suddenly my
parents were instead of being concerned about me being out too late or not being
back by dinner, time, there was a concern that there was murderers everywhere
and there was a cult. There was every town had a cult that was
taking children. And Tyler and I grew up with hearing these stories about River
Road outside of Sydney, Ohio, where every kid heard the same story.
Yep, there's colts out on River Road. They're stealing children and they're sacrificing
stuff. Everyone kind of heard that. Then it kind of meant, you
know, went away, and now it's back. And I think with social
media being what it is and information traveling a million times faster than when we
were kids, I think we could be in this for a lot longer,
and it could be a lot worse than it was during one point, oh
for lack of a better term here. So I wanted to kind of get
everyone's opinion. Are you seeing this in your work that you're doing. Are
you consciously trying to stay away from this and making sure that we are pushing
the correct story, the correct narrative, keeping history first, or is it
kind of something we don't You guys aren't really factoring in. And again,
Eric having his show Us Having Tales from the Dark, Tyler having hit his
upcoming show it's something that I want to get everyone's unique opinion and perspective on
because it is something that I think should be talked about a lot more,
and it's going to be, in my opinion too late by the point that
we address the ELpH in the room. Yeah, I just I just the
guess that I have. On my show this week, he said something that
really that I laughed at, but it really made me think he's agnostic and
I'm agnostic too, coming from the Bible Belt. And I asked him.
He's been investigating for over forty years down in New Zealand, and I asked
him, you know, if he's ever come across anything that he would turn
demonic, and he said, it's funny how they don't bother you when you
don't believe in them. So I thought that was a very teelling thing because
I've never come across anything like that either, and anybody that's talked to me
though, that is my motto is if you're an asshole on life's probably got
be an asshole on death. And even even having a demonologist on my show,
which he's the real Deality demonologist, but he's a parent on investigator too,
and he'll tell you that a parent on investigating, he's never come across
anything demonic, he said, through the church, because he works as a
as a demonologist. You know, they see it all the time because that's
who people go to when they think they're possessed or that haven issues like that,
They go to the church. So he said, you know, he
sees it quite often there. But he said, in his twenty years of
panelmal biscuit and he's never seen it. And I find it interesting. And
then and then even me and Mustafa talked about before how when he was growing
up, I think it was I think it was your dad, Mustafa,
that anything bad that happened, it was the Gin. And so I think
it has a lot to do with with your upbringing, in your cultural beliefs
and religious beliefs. And I think there's lots of things to factor into that.
I think, you know, with going back to the said ten and
panic in the eighties, a lot of that was kicked off by the true
crime case to West Memphis three where the two kids went missing and then were
found in a creek and horrible things that happened to them, and they charged
these three kids. One of them has an IQ of like eighty. You
know, he can barely form a sentence, let alone, and he falsely
confessed. Well, that got the other two convicted, and they because they
were Gothic and things like that, played the Biji board, listened to heavy
metal. They turned them, you know, Satanic worshippers, and they weren't
they they they didn't have any kind of religious belie as far as I knew,
and they were poor, and so they convicted them, and now they've
been I think one of them took an Alfred plea which basically said I did
it. But they vacated a sentence. And I think the other two you
got, got acquitted, got their their sentences completely vacated. And they never
found who killed the two kids and did horrible things of them. But that
was a huge thing in pop culture back in the eighties. I know that
kind of kicked in the Satanic panic with uh, like I said, pop
qution in general, because that became the poster case for there's a there's an
epidemic of you know, Satanist and all this other things that really wasn't true.
And I think, and that's what I've been asking a lot of my
guests, do you think we're going through a second wave of Satanic panic and
and why they think that is. And I've gotten some really interesting answers,
Like I said with with my guest Mark Wallbank said, what's funny how they
don't bother you if you don't believe in them, you know, So some
interesting perspectives out there of what's going on and if it's going to continue or
not. Brandon and the stuff. I have you guys noticed any type of
like anxiety or anything around occult behavior activity or or anything you guys have tried
during your investigations, like hesitance from the client not personally No, no,
again, I know I see it more in the paranormal spaces with the YouTube
shows and groups and podcasts and all that seems like that's all they can talk
about. But I think what Eric just said, that quote from his guests
is pretty spot on. Again, I think a lot of that stuff stems
from the Warrens and the Conjuring films. Is that faith based belief system that
they had that every entity they ever own, no matter where they were,
was demonic in nature. And I think that all goes back to their belief
system and through pop culture and through people watching other people replicate this, I
think it's kind of based a lot on the Warren's research, especially in the
paranormal circles. Yeah, and you have to remember that when they started out,
Lorraine Warren was not a psychic. She just all of a sudden became
a psychic. And and Ed Warren was a self proclaimed demonologist. He was
never ordained by the Catholic Church or anybody else as a demonologist. They just
came out of the woodwork and ordained themselves these two things, and that they
knew how to deal with paranormal and so yeah, I'm with Brandon. I
think it has a lot to do with that too, because back in the
eighties with Satanan fanik Yet and the horror come out which the family Let's family
come out and said was true, and also the bullshit that is, you
know, nobody else has ever had an issue in that house, so you
know what I mean. The current owners even changed the iconic windows because they
were tired of people coming to trample on their lawn. You know, people
can't find it anymore. They even changed the name of the streets so people
would stay away from that house because everybody's lived there since then. I haven't
had any problems, you know, well, and so it's yeah, I
think it's it's people trying to make money. I think it was the warrants
trying to make money back then. It's people trying to make money. Now
I would agree with that, but y'all start to be careful about the whole
ordained thing. That's that's a that's a very weird thing to make important because
I'm I'm more I I myself have been an ordained minister for a decade and
I did it as a joke. I went online, took a three questionnaire
and did it as a joke. So now you're going to heaven so real,
hilarious. No, I didn't he to kind of, you know,
as an early sites my Catholic my bringing in two so I could marry my
gay friends. That's the whole point of me being an ordained minister. My
husband is ordained minister in the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, the Postafarians,
and he actually went and got that so that he could marry two of
our friends and uh yeah, the Postafarians. Yeah. So no, when
I say ordained, what I mean is he has he had no training whatsoever,
none whatsoever the beliefs of the Catholic Church. I don't even think they
were Catholic, you know what I'm saying. And exorcism and possession and thing
is kind of really a Catholic thing more than it is anything else when it
comes to Christianity. And so he was just not he just he just said
I'm a demonologist because he read a book or something. You know. There
was no deep research there. And that's and that's like the rain Warren was
never a psychic before and then after they got a few cases in she all
because all of a sudden has these fucking psychic powers and as a medium now
and talk to dead people, you know. So yeah, I think what
I meant when I said ordained was there was no he just said, I'm
a demonologist without any kind of anything. If we apply this to if we
just keep this to uh, paranormal investigation, I think the only real knowledge
is experience. There's only so much you can tell someone or teach someone.
Orst you know, a story that you follow or a belief that you follow.
If you stick to your experience, your first hand go into a place
that's allegedly infested with demons, this is how I became as skeptical as I
am. Go to the places that people say you can't go there and not
experience something. I go there, I stand around, I try everything that
I can. Nothing happens because I ignore the stories. If I go in
there and I'm believing the stories, and you know I and I believe every
every shadow and every corner is what this person told me it was. I
don't under I mean, I guess I do understand people that are like that,
But you think after a while, you would realize you're not the worst
thing that can happen. This is something I think about all the time.
The worst thing that can happen to me is I get killed by something supernatural
and it's on camera and the whole world changes because it's the it's the most
amazing. So that's not something to be afraid of. Like, what's the
worst that's going to happen, right, Well, yeah, if there are
people in there, that's that's a different story. But if that happens,
then people just say it's fake because it's now it's a found footage. Yeah,
but it's all about me though. That's the important personal is university?
Well, Brittany, what are your guys's opinions on Satanic panic two point OCAs.
Again we've made I don't want to beat a dead horse here. I
think it's back, and I think it's worse than the first time, but
I want to make sure we get everyone's opinions. So do you think this
is extremely important that it's addressed before it takes hold of all of our audiences
individually this stuff, I'll let you go first. Okay, thank you,
man, I just jumped right in anyway. No, I think it just
kind of, oh my god, this is going to sound like such a
fatalistic way of looking at things. But I think it just kind of like
our species in general, dating back to thousands of years. There's two camps
of people there. There. There are individuals who really, really really like
to focus on putting the blame of their inability to live a life that they're
happy with on certain external factors. Whether those external factors are practical everyday things
that you know, get in the way of our happiness, like you know,
I'm not getting a raise at work, or like I hate my job,
or you know, the government, or you know my neighbor who just
won't stop you know, cutting his freaking tree and everything gets in my lawn
or to like there's this evil demon that's like causing me to do these things
and these supernatural forces and and that's why my life stinks. And and for
the most part, in the early days of my paranormal research, it was
mostly to help a lot of my family members and members of the Albanian Muslim
community and then you know, our Muslim community and people around me that I
knew through friends and family members who really kind of had held these superstitious beliefs.
And I use paranormal investigation almost as a sort of like not pageantry,
but like a way I had interest in it, but I wanted to help
them kind of get over these dependencies on external factors for being the reason why
they're leading lives that are making them unhappy. So I think that you know,
you see, people have this really weird obsession with the horrible things that
other human beings are capable of, because they just fucking love just toxic shit,
and they just love bad stuff, and it's like they get off on
it. They get off on it, schaden freud, whatever the hell you
want to call it. So I think it's it's just a really crappy thing
that our species does. And then you have like Brandon mentioned the conjuring films
or Eric and you mentioned the ambity of the horror movies or stuff like that,
Like there's a reason why this this horror generates so much income and generates
so much interest. People's obsession with true crime documentaries and stuff like that,
Like some like you gotta watch this true crime document it's about this little girl
got our head bashed in by like this adoptive family, like all this stuff.
It's like, I don't want to watch that, Like I don't want
to see the beginning of the new It movie where this brother's crying out for
his older brothers he's getting dragged to a sewer, Like I don't need to
see that, Like I don't want to watch that, like for me personally,
Like you know what I mean. So if it's an integral part of
an investigation that we're doing, yeah we'll tackle that subject matter, but I
don't want to see that or think about it. Doesn't mean I don't acknowledge
that that stuff exists, but I don't want to make my life about that.
And there have been times where, like you know, we've been been
and I know we've been on the road for a long time when we've been
going gnarly case after an early case, and like it's so important for us
to just kind of like sit back and tell beef butt jokes or like whatever,
or like watch the Lakers game and like just relax, to kind of
like distance ourselves from that thing, to remind ourselves that like, yeah,
there's there's amazing things about life as well. So yeah, I think I
think that's that's kind of what it's rooted in. If there if if you
know, Bob, you do believe that there's like a huge resurgence and a
more fortified interest in the satanic panic or more dark and macops subject matter.
I think that's just kind of a reflection on where at large. Not to
sound like the George Castanza mean, but that's what like, you know,
society is kind of going after now. It's like, you know, there's
this what people are going for and they're very very obsessed with very very bad
things, and that I think is just a circumstance of that larger phenomena.
I think you also see that overlap in the paranormal community a lot with people
who love horror and people who love the paranormal. And I think that could
also play into what Brandon was saying earlier about exploiting tragedy. It's like,
if you're desensitized to these things, if you love horrible true crime stories,
and you know, to each their own way, whatever, but these horrible
movies stuff that I personally can't watch some of it just the story alone makes
me resteckt to my stomach. But if you're desensitized to that, then of
course you're going to go in a location and like flaunt this stuff like it's
the greatest thing in the world. I also think it's easy for all of
us who are immersed in the paranormal world all the time to kind of get
tunnel vision as well, because I know, until I started my podcast,
you know, three years ago, I didn't have as many paranormal groups on
my Facebook page, and I didn't go into these paranormal groups because I didn't
give a shit, you know, I didn't I watched a few of the
TV shows, I went out and investigated and did my thing, and really
didn't pay attention to paranormal and social media and didn't really pay attention to reading
a lot of paranormal books and things because I was going out and doing it
myself. But now with the podcast, I read a lot of paranormal books
because I have the authors on and things, and I talk paranormal all the
time. And even with the new podcasts that I'm doing, I'm telling stories.
And so I think it's easy to get tunnel vision when that's all your
Facebook pages because of what we do, and that's who you're interacting with,
and that's the ship you see on YouTube because you're you know, everybody and
their mama asks you to subscribe to their channels and they want you to follow
them, and they follow you. And so I think when that's all you
see, I think it's easy to get that tunnel vision. And I will
kill that too. To working in emergency medicine for fifteen years like I did,
and working in the er, I got tunnel vision sometimes that you know,
fuck, everybody's sick, you know, you when you're immersed in that
and working especially on the ambulance twenty four hours shifts and all you're seeing is
the bad part of the world, it's very easy to get tunnel vision and
think, well, the world's just gonna shit and everybody's bad. No,
everybody shooting everybody, everybody's stabbing everybody, you know, and things like that.
It's easy to get that tunnel vision. So I think it's important for
us to kind of maybe refocus sometimes and get the hell out of the And
I try to do this at least couple of times a week, to get
out of the Facebook and in the social media's and all that stuff and do
something completely different, just to kind of I don't know, palate cleans.
I guess for me, it's true crime. And the reason it's true crime
for me is not because I want to see BloodGuts and gore. I've seen
that shit and fucking person in real life. It's because I am fascinated by
why somebody could do that to somebody else, the psychological part of it,
sociological part of it, but because the true crime is completely to me,
is completely different than paranormal. It's a for me to listen to a true
crime podcast or something like that, it kind of gives me that downtime that
I need to not have tunnel vision. That Okay, the whole all the
paranormal communities this way, they're all like look at me or it's all demonic
or it's all this shit, and I find myself doing that as well,
and until I have to kick myself in the ass and be like, no,
that's not how it is. It's just the microcosm of a world that
I'm in right now, and this is what people are doing, right.
You have to be careful what you put in your container, basically, no,
absolutely, And that's something Brittany and I have talked about a lot,
because you know, we have the Missing Person's Mysteries YouTube channel where all we
cover is doom and gloom. The missing Person's shedding a light on the enigma
that is what's happening in our national park system, so on and so forth.
So it's very easy to get lost down that rabbit hole. And is
something that you know, I edited for the channel long before we took over,
and something that Brittany, you know, she takes it like a chant.
I used to have to like sit back and like, fuck, I
need to watch some kids. I need to watch kids fall down on YouTube
to feel better about what I just edited for three hours, like it sucks.
And Brittany has a great way of having that filter up of this is
the story we're telling. This is why it's important, but I'm not gonna
let it impact me too much. And I don't you know, I stn't
want to hear your opinion on the Satanic panic, Britney. But that's something
that we do have to deal with an our end and also take some accountability
for to not push that. You know, everything is terrible because there are
you know, the missing person phenomenon is so it's so large, and it's
something that we make sure that we never push the narrative of everyone's going to
go missing the second you set for the National Park, You're fucking dead.
We definitely go out of our way to ensure that we're telling the story in
its most complete way, but we're also not pushing any kind of a fear
narrative just for the viewership. So I'm gonna throw it over to Brittany here.
I mean, y'all really gave me a very large palette to sample from
here, so I gotta jump around. So the first thing I want to
talk about is desensitization. Jesus excuse me of everyone when it comes to social
media and the things that we're consuming day in day out, advertisements, Twitter,
you name it. It's all we are so overloaded with new information and
with new issues, with new crisis, with new you name it, it's
coming out. So basically, what I'm trying to get at is that with
that overload of information, it has caused us to change our mentalities of how
we deal with our tragedies, how we deal with you know, something bad
going on in the world, or even something good. And I have seen
that on social media across very different groups, particularly on Facebook. And one
thing I want to talk about when it comes to the Satanic panic, and
one of the reasons why I believe it is coming back, is because if
you look in the conspiracy theories, and I know we're really getting in the
crazies here, but if you look in these conspiracy theories groups, I have
seen a trend from knowing conspiracy theorists years and years and years ago to now
where everything has turned into demons, everything has turned into the devil, and
it's turned into these secret cults and secret occult rituals. Now. I know
that is a very small portion of the entire nation, in the entire world.
However, I will say that having interactions with people who have nothing to
do with high strangists at all, paranormal, UFO, cryptids, occult what
you name it, are starting to use occult references or rituals or the Illuminati,
for example, which has become very mainstream as excuses for bad things happening.
I find that when we are regularly using these excuses, and we are,
we are desensitizing that excuse it, it's gonna escalate, and then it's
gonna get worse, and then it's going to turn into persecution for people who
practice those rituals or for people who don't believe the way that you believe.
I do see this as a trend that's going to get worse and worse and
worse until we eventually fix it. How I don't know, but I do
think, especially in the occult community, we are trending towards something a little
dangerous here. I think all we need is just a constant, you know,
once a day everyone gets a voice text message of Eric just saying,
hey, it's all right, that's it. The world's world, the world's
not ship like all right. I believe you. I don't know who you
are. I see what you're saying, Brittany, but I think for me
growing up in the as a gay man for one, growing up in the
Bible belt, the buckle of the Bible Belt. I've heard it my entire
life that everything's demons because I'm surrounded by Church or Christ in Southern Baptist and
you know, the Church Christ think the Southern Baptist going straight to hill and
the Southern Baptist Church Christ scoring straight to Hill, and they hate each other,
you know, and they're screaming about the same things. So coming from
culture in the South, and you're from the South as well. But I
think just growing up where I did, it's always been that way. And
then I still get the ship when I do any kind of event out here
or people will catch me out in public, they always want to talk about
demons and always want to tell me what I'm doing is demonic and there's no
such thing as ghosts or spirits. They're all demons. And you know how
many times I've been scolded about a little granny at the fucking grocery store because
she heard through the grape vine that I do the paranormal. So I,
you know, I just I've been in that my entire life, so I
don't I haven't seen a change or an uptick. Yeah, I guess is
what I'm getting at. You know, No, I completely get that,
and I agree with you as well. I mean, every growing up,
everything was the devil. You know. My mama would tell me the devil
made me do it. That was one of the most common like phrases in
our entire household. Was the devil made me do it, and not today's
satan and not today's satan. I said that so much, Oh my god.
But anyway, No, you're absolutely right, and it is something I
was and dated with growing up, and I completely understand where you're coming from.
I think my point of view kind of pulls more away from paranormal and
goes more into a spiritualistic side of things, just because we research so much
when it comes to the occult, you know, we research all branches of
high strangeness, paranormal, cryptids, UFOs, and a cult, and so
I think that my views on the occult kind of led into this paranormal satanic
panic discussion as well. But yeahs as someone who also is in some online
occult circles and and some people that I know, I don't personally see it,
I think it could be a matter of perspective, and I as far
as the Satanic panic coming back, and I think we have something that they
didn't have in the eighties and nineties, which is limitless information and an ability
for everyone to have a platform like as much as as much bad that that
comes with we have. Eric was talking about the West Memphis three. One
of those guys is Damien Ekels, and he is a ritual magician. You
know, he was like famous for he was hanging out with Johnny dep and
stuff, and he's trying to get out. He credits magic for getting him
out of prison. He was on death row for eighteen years solitary confinement.
But now he has an online following. He talks about high magic and what
it really means, and he's shedding light on what happened to him back then
when just because he listened to Metallica or whatever and had black hair, they
thought, oh, you're the devil kill children. So there's a lot in
my circles. I see it as like a positive, yeah, like a
beautiful thing that's like showing people this is what it really is. It's based
in nature, it's based in spirituality and all this kind of stuff. So
once again I think we have an antidote. We can't subtract things just like
our thoughts. We can't subtract bad thoughts. If we try not to think
about something that's all we think about. We can only add positive thoughts.
And I think in society or culture, just keep piling on the positive shit
and hopefully the rest will just kind of drown in that. Well, I
think that's a great point to end on. Just before we go, Eric
Brandon Mustafa, where can we find more of you? I know we have
a We've Hunter Discoveries to spin off if you want to talk about that real
quick. And I want to just make sure that everyone knows if they want
more Eric, where can they hear that voice some more? Well, anywhere
you go listen to this podcast. And also I'm kind of wanted down Unseen
Paranormal podcast for the season, but there's like one hundred and forty episodes,
and I'm kicking up my new podcast where I narrate three stories a week from
different authors that I've gotten permission to use their stories, True paranormal stories,
true stories, and missing people, weird true crime, all kind of a
cob things has strangeness, just anything strange and it's called Strange Chapters and it'll
be on all podcast platforms and YouTube as well. But I'm all over social
media as well, so come say on Facebook or Instagram, Twitter, LinkedIn.
Yeah, we have a new spinoff series of Haunt of Discoveries. Mistop
and I are going to start shooting a couple of weeks from today. But
it's called Hunt of Discoveries Family Spirits, and it's about people that have come
in contact with their deceased loved ones and relatives and where we're telling that through
a testimonial type show where we not only speak about these experiences they've had with
their deceased relatives, but also recreating that and also diving into the genealogy behind
their family's life and how does that connect to what we call, you know,
the ghost gene So we're excited about that show and we're excited to announce
more once we have more information about where you can watch it, and I
can't wait for that. So what about you, Tyler, what do you
have going on apart from Phantom Farm. Well, if you want to follow
someone who never posts on social media, you can follow at Tyler Terry now
on Elon musk Land or whatever it's being called now Instagram or whatever, you
know. I haven't even started filming, but working on a series called Finding
Nothing that is not dissimilar to what Brandon just described. I'm kind of diving
into my family history. I have family from and around Harland, Kentucky,
like Lecture and Cumberland Gap in places like that, going to go down and
kind of get all their stories. They're all getting older, get their stories
and some history behind it, and kind of study the land. And of
course, like every white family in the South, they think we're related to
famous Native Americans. So I'd like to get into some genealogy stuff and capture
that process. If this is what true, this is what's not. And
I just think there are many avenues to explore that's not just paranormal, that
can be very entertaining and relatable if I keep it personal and honest. So
that's what's coming. But like I said, haven't you started filming? Just
getting everything together for that awesome well. I appreciate everyone for joining. I
know we went a little longer than we expected. I know everyone has a
busy schedule, so thank you all so much for joining. We'll have to
do this again. I can't wait to meet everyone at the Tennessee Hanson Legends
Expo. And that's all I've got. All right, Well, Brittany and
Tyler, that was a lot of fun. Was it what you guys expected?
That's that's what I really want to know, because I didn't have any
expectations going into this. No, I really didn't either. I'm not sure
what I was expecting, but I'm pleasantly pleased. I think we had a
really good conversation about the paranormal. I also didn't have any expectations. I
just thought it was really cool and they were really chill and open about everything.
So yeah, it's always nice to see because there's there's We talked about
the gate keeping in the paranormal way too often, so it's nice to have
the the opposite of that. I kind of knew what we were getting into
anyway, from doing homework on those guys, so I had a feeling it
would be like them, Well, good deal. So unless you guys,
either of you this is weird. Do Tyler or Brittany have anything else to
add? No, I'm done, I do not. All right, Well,
is that being said, we're going to add our first paranormal round table
to our never ending, never ending, but are always growing, always growing
tails from the dark the