1 00:00:15,519 --> 00:00:20,519 What is Krakalac and fellow Thermonuclear A efforts. I am Dan Valley coming at 2 00:00:20,559 --> 00:00:24,800 you with a very brief intro and another footnote on our positional rankings. We 3 00:00:24,839 --> 00:00:28,760 are up to our top ten centers from Grant and myself. We did, 4 00:00:28,800 --> 00:00:34,159 however, discuss this before the Joel Embiid injury news came down where it wasn't 5 00:00:34,200 --> 00:00:36,479 sure whether he was going to play for the rest of the season. I'm 6 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:40,520 honestly not sure how this would have impacted the rankings because we were juggling what 7 00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:44,119 we've seen, what we already know with what's to come for the rest of 8 00:00:44,119 --> 00:00:48,399 this year. He's very clearly in a certain spot when it comes to centers 9 00:00:48,439 --> 00:00:51,039 anyway, and so you can quibble over that, but we get into some 10 00:00:51,079 --> 00:00:54,840 honorable mentions. Wanted to know what that very quickly. That's enough for me 11 00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:59,520 though. Let's get to our top ten centers from Grant and myself right now. 12 00:01:00,079 --> 00:01:03,799 What is krack A lacin Fellow Thermo Nuclear A efforts. I am Dana 13 00:01:03,879 --> 00:01:08,799 Valley, coming at you as always with my certified fantabulous Thermo Nuclear af co 14 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:15,599 host mister Grant Hughes. We have reached the end of our top ten positional 15 00:01:15,879 --> 00:01:19,920 MBA rankings, We're on to the centers. Another bloodbath is en Rout, 16 00:01:21,480 --> 00:01:25,040 but Grant first and foremost, How the heck are you doing? What a 17 00:01:25,120 --> 00:01:32,840 journey. It's been just really seeing where our philosophies on life and basketball line 18 00:01:33,200 --> 00:01:36,000 and divert. It's just we've really learned, you know, We've learned a 19 00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:38,719 lot about positions. We learned a lot about each other, you know, 20 00:01:38,879 --> 00:01:42,280 and maybe ourselves. Maybe that's really what this has been about. I think 21 00:01:42,719 --> 00:01:46,599 I'm getting loopy because we've been recording for a couple hours here, but I'm 22 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:49,719 really excited to do the centers because we don't really have to mess too much 23 00:01:49,719 --> 00:01:53,760 with the positional stuff, and it's just kind of going to be what do 24 00:01:53,799 --> 00:01:57,400 you value? And I hope we have some differences because that's always the most 25 00:01:57,400 --> 00:02:00,840 fun part. I think there's going to be there. So there ended up 26 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:04,280 being between thirteen and fourteen names here, Like I have a very long list 27 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:07,319 of names that I thought about, but they ended up being between twelve and 28 00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:13,120 thirteen or fourteen depending on how you factor an availability previously, and it was 29 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:15,759 just like gutting and so there's like to me at the top there was a 30 00:02:15,800 --> 00:02:21,319 delineation maybe in the top four or top definitely the top three, and then 31 00:02:21,319 --> 00:02:23,360 it's like, well, fuck, like it got really hard for me after 32 00:02:23,400 --> 00:02:25,879 that. I don't know about where it got hard for you. I'll be 33 00:02:25,960 --> 00:02:30,960 shocked if we don't have the same top three, probably in the same order. 34 00:02:31,000 --> 00:02:34,319 I would have thought we'd have the same top four. But when we 35 00:02:34,360 --> 00:02:37,199 talked a little bit beforehand, I think you tipped your hand that your four 36 00:02:37,479 --> 00:02:39,680 number four center is not the same as mine. So maybe we should just 37 00:02:39,719 --> 00:02:43,639 get into it. Do you want to so, since I'm assuming we have 38 00:02:43,759 --> 00:02:46,479 the same we have the same top two, right, do you want to 39 00:02:46,479 --> 00:02:50,879 give us your top Yes, Yokich one, EMBIID two. So I actually 40 00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:53,439 had EMBIID one. I'm just kidding. No, I would well you had 41 00:02:53,479 --> 00:02:57,719 me because I could if you had EMBIID one. I mean, the injury 42 00:02:57,800 --> 00:02:59,759 kind of makes it a little easier to get out of it. Let's say 43 00:02:59,759 --> 00:03:04,039 they're has no injury issue, would you have I would have still had Yokic 44 00:03:04,120 --> 00:03:07,360 one if EMBIID were if his knee were fully healthy right now. And maybe 45 00:03:07,360 --> 00:03:10,840 that's controversial, but I just Yokic is a no notes guy for me. 46 00:03:12,240 --> 00:03:15,520 He's got the ring. He's that we don't have any questions anymore. Embiid 47 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:17,560 still has the is he gonna hold up? And again this year the answer 48 00:03:17,560 --> 00:03:22,919 looks like no. Uh. And I just I've seen Yokic do it, 49 00:03:23,000 --> 00:03:25,199 haven't seen Mbiid do it in the playoffs, So it just made it easier 50 00:03:25,199 --> 00:03:30,719 for me. The injury was not a factor. And the thing that I 51 00:03:30,719 --> 00:03:32,639 mean, this is unfair to this is what I this is what I hate 52 00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:36,159 about it because now we get into well, how do I discredit Embiid so 53 00:03:36,199 --> 00:03:38,280 that I can make my case for Yokic. I don't really want to think 54 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:44,960 like that. But Nicole Jokic does not as a score, but define so 55 00:03:45,080 --> 00:03:49,879 much more about the way the Nuggets play offense that it matters to me where 56 00:03:49,879 --> 00:03:53,360 it's yes, Embiid is shouldering and incredible workload, but like the Nuggets offense 57 00:03:53,560 --> 00:04:00,360 and this is a team that is a reigning champion, is nearly twenty points 58 00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:04,159 better permane hundred possessions with Jokic on the court, and just overall, like 59 00:04:04,319 --> 00:04:09,000 they are over twenty two points better per one hundred possessions with Jokic on the 60 00:04:09,000 --> 00:04:12,599 court. This is a team that is a title contender because of Nicole Jokic, 61 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:15,560 just like the Sixers are title contender because of Embiid when he's healthy. 62 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:18,360 But it's just like a different level for the Nuggets. And you could say, 63 00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:21,199 what is the argument now, like you do you think, okay, 64 00:04:21,240 --> 00:04:25,879 the Nuggets just have better what third, fourth, and fifth options because you're 65 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:29,000 Tyre's max and Jamal Murray. I think some people are just gonna take Tyrese 66 00:04:29,040 --> 00:04:32,160 Maxi out right right now, which is perfectly fine. It's the supporting cast 67 00:04:32,240 --> 00:04:35,800 might be better, but it's not like certain like the Sixers have the more 68 00:04:35,879 --> 00:04:40,160 proven supporting cast when you're just looking at like, well, Christian Brown's a 69 00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:45,439 wildcard, Peyton Watson's a wild card. Nicole Jokic's ability to define his team's 70 00:04:45,519 --> 00:04:49,800 championship window in a way that Embiid does not because of the availability and injury 71 00:04:49,879 --> 00:04:54,439 concerns, and then just some of the performances we've seen from him the playoffs 72 00:04:54,439 --> 00:04:56,800 that was you know, you don't want a journey too far back, but 73 00:04:56,839 --> 00:04:59,839 it remember the discourse against yok where it was like, well, yes, 74 00:05:00,040 --> 00:05:01,399 made it to the finals. Can he be the best players championship team? 75 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:05,519 The moment you gave him a team that was healthy and full strength. They 76 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:11,279 just they didn't just win the championship steam rolled everybody in front of them. 77 00:05:11,519 --> 00:05:14,720 Yeah no, And it's not just a this year thing. I think if 78 00:05:14,839 --> 00:05:18,240 the point of the if, part of the way that we're making decisions is 79 00:05:18,279 --> 00:05:21,000 who do you want for the rest of the year in the playoffs? You 80 00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:28,839 almost like Embiid would have to be so much better statistically than Jokic to outweigh 81 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:32,639 the fact that he has, like literally every season he's had a chance at 82 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:36,360 going deep in the playoffs, like an injury or underperformance has been a factor, 83 00:05:36,600 --> 00:05:42,040 whereas like Jokic has basically never had a major injury and he's basically I 84 00:05:42,079 --> 00:05:45,079 mean, and he just wanted to put different styles, which is like, 85 00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:47,040 but like Jokic does always look like he just came out of a street fight 86 00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:50,600 too. So yeah, I mean, yeah, if we just measured this 87 00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:55,160 on number one, the number one center is the one that has the most 88 00:05:55,279 --> 00:05:58,959 like looks like he was mauled by a tiger, scratches on his arm. 89 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:02,040 He would just he would still run away with this. So Jokic, Embiid, 90 00:06:02,079 --> 00:06:05,800 Anthony Davis has to be three, right, I'm glad that we agreed 91 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:09,959 on that. I thought maybe because of the season that Gobert was happ but 92 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:12,680 yeah, he's number He's number three for me as well. So you both 93 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:15,800 have a d at at number three? Do you wanna you want to? 94 00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:18,879 I think some people might might push back against it. I'm not saying they 95 00:06:18,879 --> 00:06:20,920 do not have a case. I'm not saying that this should be consensus. 96 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:24,519 But it was easy for me, is what I was saying. Yeah, 97 00:06:24,519 --> 00:06:28,319 I didn't. I think I think the drop off starts here, and Davis 98 00:06:28,360 --> 00:06:32,199 isn't a tier by himself. I think after Yokichen embid in before ten players, 99 00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:34,839 like, yeah, I have That's how I like to do my rankings. 100 00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:38,519 It's tiered. But there's nine of them in the ten players thing. 101 00:06:39,439 --> 00:06:43,759 I mean, I think he's probably you got it. The durability thing is 102 00:06:43,759 --> 00:06:46,040 an issue, like, but he not this year I guess now as now 103 00:06:46,040 --> 00:06:49,720 it is with the hip and the Achilles stuff. But like to this point, 104 00:06:49,720 --> 00:06:54,240 like he's played much more than Embiid, He's played more than well, 105 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:57,560 I don't want to spoil, but two fewer games than Jokic as we're recording 106 00:06:57,600 --> 00:07:00,879 this, and Jokic is like the model of durability. So I think just 107 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:06,560 his Anthony Davis's defensive apex is like defensive player of the Year level, and 108 00:07:06,959 --> 00:07:13,000 I think offensively, you know, the three point shot just just may probably 109 00:07:13,120 --> 00:07:15,480 is never going to happen. At this point, it's been long enough to 110 00:07:15,480 --> 00:07:17,439 where we can just stop saying like, oh, but what if he doesn't 111 00:07:17,439 --> 00:07:21,360 need it because he's a center now and he's getting you twenty five and twelve 112 00:07:21,519 --> 00:07:25,680 and blocking shots, and it's just like, I don't know, what else 113 00:07:25,720 --> 00:07:30,759 do we need to there? And so this kind of loops into a larger 114 00:07:30,839 --> 00:07:33,240 Lakers discussion when people were annoyed that they got two All Stars or like Howard 115 00:07:33,279 --> 00:07:36,040 A d and Lebron is good and the Lakers are still so bad. The 116 00:07:36,199 --> 00:07:42,040 drop off from their second best player their third best player has to be the 117 00:07:42,120 --> 00:07:46,639 largest in the league, or at least like among teams that have immediate aspirations, 118 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:47,879 and probably even just in the league in general. I don't I don't 119 00:07:47,879 --> 00:07:50,800 know I need that qualifier. That's such a bad I hate that argument so 120 00:07:50,920 --> 00:07:54,720 much. I mean, all, you know, all Star arguments are always 121 00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:58,839 like kind of weird, but like, well, the reason the Lakers are 122 00:07:58,839 --> 00:08:01,160 so they can have to All Stars. You play five guys at a time, 123 00:08:01,319 --> 00:08:03,879 like the other three just aren't good enough. That's what you normally have 124 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:07,560 to play, like eight to twelve guys the entire game. So like that's 125 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:11,639 gonna scu result a lot, right, No, so I think Davis is 126 00:08:11,680 --> 00:08:15,480 just easy. Three. So four as I think where we're gonna differ. 127 00:08:16,399 --> 00:08:20,279 I have been a while at four. Okay, so I had I had 128 00:08:20,360 --> 00:08:24,959 Rudy Gobert at four. Gobert shows up for me at oh, I have 129 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:28,680 him at six right now, but I don't. I'll just leave over. 130 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:33,200 Okay, So let me make my case for Goberts. So I'll put Gobert 131 00:08:33,759 --> 00:08:37,120 on the screen at four and then vamp about him for a minute. I'm 132 00:08:37,159 --> 00:08:39,440 not gonna I'm not asking you this. This is a retort question. Have 133 00:08:39,480 --> 00:08:43,440 you seen the way that he is moving on defense this year, Waite? 134 00:08:43,120 --> 00:08:46,799 It's it's way better and it might be the best ever that he has ever 135 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:50,879 moved on defense. And so it's not just a matter of well, yeah, 136 00:08:50,919 --> 00:08:54,080 now he has guys who can actually move or playing in front of him. 137 00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:56,840 No, it's not just that I have not seen he's flying around like 138 00:08:58,480 --> 00:09:00,519 No, he's not you know, getting out there and lock it. And 139 00:09:00,559 --> 00:09:03,120 he's not Anthony Davis getting out to the three point line. I want to 140 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:07,399 make that clear. But he's just flying around everywhere he is. I think 141 00:09:07,399 --> 00:09:09,080 he has to be the defensive player of the year right now. I've gotten 142 00:09:09,360 --> 00:09:13,600 between him and Anthony Davis. I think is number two for me at the 143 00:09:13,600 --> 00:09:16,120 moment. Like, looking at it, this is just I didn't consider it 144 00:09:16,159 --> 00:09:20,600 before doing this. This is just very much off the cuff. So I'm 145 00:09:20,679 --> 00:09:24,039 just I understand that there are offensive limitations from him. But you know what, 146 00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:28,759 they Minnesota Timbers will dump him the ball in the post. They will 147 00:09:28,799 --> 00:09:31,879 do more handoff stuff with him. He's cleaning up missus. Still like, 148 00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:35,440 this is someone who is wearing enough hats on offense. I think even if 149 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:39,039 you view him as a restrictive offensive player and he is unmake that clear where 150 00:09:39,039 --> 00:09:43,279 I look at it and I go when you're this defensively dominant, where it's 151 00:09:43,279 --> 00:09:46,799 like he's kind of the og Ananobi of Biggs type deal, where it's og 152 00:09:46,879 --> 00:09:50,720 Ananobi is versatile and dominant. I think Rudy Gobert has reached that level of 153 00:09:52,080 --> 00:09:54,600 versatility and dominance to where, yeah, bam, what he does on defense 154 00:09:54,639 --> 00:09:58,840 for sure, Like we got to start having a conversation about why the heat 155 00:09:58,879 --> 00:10:01,879 always suck when band plays without Jimmy. Yeah, yeah, I think that's 156 00:10:01,879 --> 00:10:07,240 fair. I think so the Gobert thing, for me, maybe I should 157 00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:11,320 just give So I had Auto Bio four, Porzingis five, and go Beart 158 00:10:11,399 --> 00:10:18,360 six, and so I think the justification for me of having porzingis Porzingis is 159 00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:20,159 the tough one that I was like, oh am, I really gonna do 160 00:10:20,240 --> 00:10:24,799 this. It the goat. So maybe some of this is outdated and some 161 00:10:24,879 --> 00:10:28,200 of it I know when when this when this narrative was out there, which 162 00:10:28,240 --> 00:10:31,840 is that you know, Gobert failed against that Clippers team in the playoffs. 163 00:10:31,080 --> 00:10:35,519 They based him out. No I'm gonna I'm gonna cut it down. You 164 00:10:35,519 --> 00:10:39,720 know, they they exposed him. You can't win in the playoffs with this 165 00:10:39,799 --> 00:10:43,879 type of center, I think in a I think broadly speaking, I still 166 00:10:43,919 --> 00:10:46,879 do have questions about about Gobert in a deep playoff run. I just I 167 00:10:46,919 --> 00:10:52,440 still do. I think it was unfair to blame what happened against the Clippers 168 00:10:52,440 --> 00:10:54,360 on him because it was point of attack defense. It sucked for Utah and 169 00:10:54,399 --> 00:10:58,559 he just had too many messes to clean up as much as also, like 170 00:10:58,919 --> 00:11:01,159 the numbers will back this up. By the end of that series, the 171 00:11:01,240 --> 00:11:05,559 Jazz didn't figure out the Clippers, Like the defense wasn't what killed them. 172 00:11:05,759 --> 00:11:09,840 Yeah, well, I mean if Terrence Man doesn't have that one incredible game, 173 00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:11,879 like who knows what we're saying about, who knows what we're saying about 174 00:11:13,120 --> 00:11:16,159 Google go Beart might be on the Jazz still, like that team might never 175 00:11:16,200 --> 00:11:20,200 have gone like they that they might have advanced deeper, and like we just 176 00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:26,120 don't have this utah realizing this core doesn't work thing. But so I have 177 00:11:26,440 --> 00:11:31,000 I have no playoff questions about BAM, so like because unless Jimmy Butler's not 178 00:11:31,039 --> 00:11:33,960 out there, but like if Anthony Edwards isn't out there, I don't think 179 00:11:33,039 --> 00:11:39,279 Gobert is carrying the Wolves anywhere either. Uh. I think BAM has demonstrated 180 00:11:39,639 --> 00:11:43,440 like playoff impact to the ultimate round of competition, and so that just matters 181 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:48,080 to me, the switchability, the defense, the facilitation. He's getting you 182 00:11:48,120 --> 00:11:50,879 twenty a game this year. I just you know, he's not a one 183 00:11:52,519 --> 00:11:56,720 not a number one option, but neither is I thought that's where you're going, 184 00:11:56,240 --> 00:12:01,080 but neither's anybody else here other than other than kitchen embid and you'll getch 185 00:12:01,159 --> 00:12:03,480 I don't even know what option I would consider him like, he's whatever he 186 00:12:03,519 --> 00:12:09,120 wants to be. Porzingis is the tough one that I would just justify by 187 00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:13,080 saying, you get the stretch. He's better in space defensively than I think 188 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:16,320 a lot of people give him credit for. He's an awesome rim protector, 189 00:12:16,399 --> 00:12:20,960 and he can kill mismatches now in the post and so I feel like maybe 190 00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:26,200 they'll be proved wrong. He feels a little not much more playoff proof than 191 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:30,720 Gobert, and maybe not to the level of autobio. But again, I'm 192 00:12:30,759 --> 00:12:33,840 just over indexing towards guys that I think will be on the floor in the 193 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:37,720 most important minutes and making an impact in the games that really matter for this 194 00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:43,440 exercise, so I can more easily imagine that with Porzingis than Gobert. Now 195 00:12:43,440 --> 00:12:46,519 you can raise the durability concern with Porzingis as like a counter to that. 196 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:50,799 I don't I don't love having Porzingis ahead of Gobert, but I am going 197 00:12:50,879 --> 00:12:54,759 to stick with it just because I think he gives you the two way you 198 00:12:54,799 --> 00:13:00,600 know boost in a postseason context and could be like a huge plus on either 199 00:13:00,679 --> 00:13:03,960 end of the floor, like could be like a game breaker that spaces out 200 00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:07,240 other centers and gives the Celtics a bunch of good options against switches too. 201 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:11,799 So I'll tackle this a little reverse. I've Chris Stops at ten just because 202 00:13:13,320 --> 00:13:16,240 and if this was last year, I might have him higher. He's playing 203 00:13:16,279 --> 00:13:20,679 more of a complimentary role now and so that's made him better, which I'm 204 00:13:20,679 --> 00:13:24,960 not faulting him for, but I do appreciate the degree of difficulty that some 205 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:30,240 of these guys shoulder defensively and even offensively. But his ability to punish mismatches 206 00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:31,679 is a big one. And the way that he just breaks defense is because 207 00:13:31,720 --> 00:13:35,200 of his stretch is also a big one. He's one of the best rim 208 00:13:35,200 --> 00:13:39,519 protectors in the game. So I also have though Domos at five, and 209 00:13:39,519 --> 00:13:43,200 then we get to Bam at six. I know that the numbers with Domos, 210 00:13:43,200 --> 00:13:46,200 Sibonis on and the Iron Fox off this year are bad, and they've 211 00:13:46,240 --> 00:13:48,720 kind of flipped flat from last season where a lot of the year was they 212 00:13:48,759 --> 00:13:52,960 were worried about the Fox without the bonus minutes. Yeah, that is someone 213 00:13:52,000 --> 00:13:56,960 who can initiate your entire offense and It's become very clear to me that I 214 00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:01,840 don't know if Bam is that guy. I think Bam is improved as a 215 00:14:01,879 --> 00:14:05,519 scorer overall, but like the more I watch him as a playmaker and someone 216 00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:09,960 who doesn't have the benefit of someone better than him on the court, it's 217 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:15,000 just I struggle to see it. The vision there more and more. Now 218 00:14:15,240 --> 00:14:18,200 what makes it really tough is you mentioned the playoff argument, and then there's 219 00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:20,799 just this level of defensive dominance from him. But he's also as a center, 220 00:14:22,159 --> 00:14:26,000 and this is not everything I value versatility. He's just never been like 221 00:14:26,080 --> 00:14:28,200 a great rim protector. Yeah, he doesn't have the size. He really 222 00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:31,879 is undersize. So it's and I don't want to you know, I'm not 223 00:14:31,919 --> 00:14:33,840 critic well, you know I'm you know, I'm ranking domas higher because he's 224 00:14:33,840 --> 00:14:37,080 taller than Bam. It's not necessarily what I'm saying. But like jo masabone 225 00:14:37,159 --> 00:14:41,399 is at least going to clean up opponent misses to ensure your offense starts. 226 00:14:41,639 --> 00:14:45,360 He's a better facilitator of the offense and can facilitate it in more ways. 227 00:14:45,799 --> 00:14:54,000 And his offensive range to me, is not as repressive functionally repressive as Bams 228 00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:56,240 can be. Where it's like we can Bemoan that, why isn't the bonus 229 00:14:56,279 --> 00:14:58,960 more of a shooter. It's like, well, because he does more stuff 230 00:15:00,279 --> 00:15:03,120 off live dribbles, like the decision making there than Bam. I'm just gonna 231 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:07,320 trust it at this point. I mean now statistically, because we didn't want 232 00:15:07,320 --> 00:15:09,879 to date this, I'm not gonna dig into the certain numbers, but like, 233 00:15:09,919 --> 00:15:11,960 yeah, Bam can be really good in certain instances, and he is, 234 00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:16,519 especially for his position, is a great playmaker. To me, Sabonis 235 00:15:16,559 --> 00:15:20,799 on offense is on another level. And the gap between I guess what's tough 236 00:15:20,919 --> 00:15:24,559 is the gap between sabonus and Bam on offense he would have to make the 237 00:15:24,639 --> 00:15:30,120 case is larger than the gap between Sabonis and Bam on defense. I don't 238 00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:33,799 know if that's the case I'm prepared to make. I'm valuing I'm outright saying, 239 00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:37,679 and this might be an inconsistent line of thought that I'm just valuing the 240 00:15:37,759 --> 00:15:41,759 higher ceiling Domas gives you offensively and by the way, like he has also 241 00:15:41,919 --> 00:15:46,279 proven that you can kind of see the spotlight to darn Fox and still just 242 00:15:46,279 --> 00:15:50,759 be an offensive powerhouse yourself. Yeah, I don't know I'll try to keep. 243 00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:54,200 So I'll just say Sabonis is not in my top ten and that's gonna 244 00:15:54,200 --> 00:16:00,279 seem insane because of the counting stats and because of just like the efficiency and 245 00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:03,720 look, I'll even this, Look, he's of the guys we're going to 246 00:16:03,799 --> 00:16:07,039 talk about going forward here for this position. He's got the highest box plus 247 00:16:07,039 --> 00:16:11,799 minus you know, leads him in rebound like freaking this will be dated, 248 00:16:11,799 --> 00:16:15,399 but eight assists a game is just like ridiculous, and he matters a ton 249 00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:18,679 in that offense. I would just say, and this has been my argument 250 00:16:18,679 --> 00:16:22,879 with him for a long time, is that he does, I think, 251 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:26,120 limit your ceiling as a playoff team in ways that a lot of these other 252 00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:30,360 guys do not. And Bam has proved that he doesn't have that effect. 253 00:16:30,799 --> 00:16:34,440 So Sabonus to me is someone that like, look, it'd be one thing. 254 00:16:34,559 --> 00:16:38,360 So you know, go ahead, I get the Bam argument because I 255 00:16:38,399 --> 00:16:41,039 even said, like, maybe I'm being a little bit too inconsistent. Yeah, 256 00:16:41,080 --> 00:16:44,279 to not have him in the top ten, yeah, I know. 257 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:47,440 I'm so anxious to see the rest of your list now. Is just I'm 258 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:51,279 trying to figure out what hurt more. Draymond Green, like kicking him in 259 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:55,360 the face or or in the groin, or this maybe the way to frame 260 00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:57,759 it for me. And now you're thinking, now you're making me think I 261 00:16:57,759 --> 00:17:03,200 should have him like down here. So Kevin O'Connor seems like he hates do 262 00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:07,599 mas a bonus is a building block, not as a person. You're like 263 00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:15,839 Rant hugely dislikes Kevin o'hatees Jo Masons usually despises don't well. So here's what 264 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:21,559 I'd say, Like, I think, my it's it's probably a weird case 265 00:17:21,559 --> 00:17:26,279 of confirmation bias, because I think I went into the playoffs last year acknowledging, 266 00:17:26,279 --> 00:17:29,079 as I still do, that Sabonis is an awesome regular season player and 267 00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:32,720 a floor raizer and like does things on offense that most bigs just cannot do, 268 00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:36,279 and did it successfully and was a major piece of what at the time 269 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:38,519 was the most efficient offense we've ever seen. All true, But I thought 270 00:17:38,559 --> 00:17:42,839 going into the playoffs on both ends, he would you would limit the kings 271 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:48,079 in significant ways, like not a room protector, can't guard in space, 272 00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:51,319 doesn't space the floor in a way that scares defenses, and if he runs 273 00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:53,759 up against the guy that is strong in his size, he can't bully him, 274 00:17:53,759 --> 00:17:56,759 and so like not a lot of offensive value because you don't guard him 275 00:17:56,799 --> 00:18:00,200 on the handoffs and give and get game, you know, pick and roll. 276 00:18:00,400 --> 00:18:03,799 He's easy to guard in that setup and defensively just is a target. 277 00:18:04,279 --> 00:18:08,240 And then that's exactly what happened, right, Like he wasn't the reason the 278 00:18:08,319 --> 00:18:11,319 Kings didn't beat the Warriors, but like it was a huge factor. Like 279 00:18:11,359 --> 00:18:15,279 it's a little over, Oh, Kavon Looney's better than Sabonus, kavan Luonne's 280 00:18:15,279 --> 00:18:18,759 not better than Sabonas, but like like it's not even close. But like 281 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:22,519 that's the nicest thing you've said about. When the exact things you suspect based 282 00:18:22,519 --> 00:18:27,559 on his game materialize in reality, then for me, it's just a prove 283 00:18:27,599 --> 00:18:30,960 it. Like if Sabonis has a huge role in a playoff run for the 284 00:18:32,000 --> 00:18:34,359 Kings this year, I'll change, I'll change what I think I will. 285 00:18:34,400 --> 00:18:37,519 I will say I'm sorry and say I was proved wrong, and maybe that 286 00:18:37,599 --> 00:18:41,079 happens, but until it happens, like what I was concerned about with him 287 00:18:41,119 --> 00:18:45,079 happened, and so I'm not gonna move off that. If we're ranking now 288 00:18:45,839 --> 00:18:48,440 some of the guys I have ahead of him. Your people are gonna say 289 00:18:48,480 --> 00:18:52,880 that's insane, but I just like, if I'm caring about the playoffs, 290 00:18:53,319 --> 00:18:57,039 I can't put the guy above some other people when his team got bounced in 291 00:18:57,079 --> 00:19:00,799 the first round because he failed in the way that I thought he might fail. 292 00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:03,200 So that that's all. That's the short version. Man. It's just 293 00:19:03,359 --> 00:19:07,920 he was part of what they did well defensively against Golden State though, and 294 00:19:07,960 --> 00:19:14,160 so it's kind of like, and was it more about how they defended him 295 00:19:14,519 --> 00:19:18,559 on defense or about oh, like Key and Murray couldn't hit a wide open 296 00:19:18,599 --> 00:19:21,720 three. It's like all these wide open threes from the Kings started missing. 297 00:19:21,799 --> 00:19:26,799 I just feel like, I I think your premise is valid. I just 298 00:19:26,839 --> 00:19:30,880 feel like we're ascribing too much of the blame to what happened in the playoffs 299 00:19:30,119 --> 00:19:36,160 to Domas Sabonis to the point where veers away from actually how good he is. 300 00:19:36,200 --> 00:19:38,400 And like there's also, yes, the playoffs matter, but like, 301 00:19:38,519 --> 00:19:42,559 as someone who's gonna navigate you through an eighty two game season with durability and 302 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:45,559 be able to drive the offense even if you don't vieume as a number one, 303 00:19:45,559 --> 00:19:51,039 that's fine as a number two. Bam, bam, can't do that, 304 00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:53,359 So you're you know what, that's the best, that's the best. 305 00:19:53,559 --> 00:19:59,079 Counter is that I'm just totally devaluing the regular season when it comes to Sabonis. 306 00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:02,640 I think I think that's absolutely fair and that that's fair to say, 307 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:04,519 and it's unfair for me to do. So here's what I'm gonna do. 308 00:20:04,599 --> 00:20:08,319 I'm not gonna I'm gonna make a decision where you go. Frankly, the 309 00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:11,920 part of the rankings I hate is that I think these are all fantastic players, 310 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:17,160 and I just spent like discrediting, Like I don't like what rankings do 311 00:20:17,319 --> 00:20:22,640 to me. As like if you had to rank the feelings that doing rankings 312 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:26,559 cause you, would consternation be ahead of anxiety or below it. Yeah, 313 00:20:26,559 --> 00:20:30,200 it's like self loathing number one. Self loathing might be number one. Uh 314 00:20:30,279 --> 00:20:32,759 Okay, So I'm gonna get Sabonis in here at some point. I'm just 315 00:20:32,799 --> 00:20:37,279 not gonna do it yet. Uh So my number seven and we're starting the 316 00:20:37,359 --> 00:20:40,000 round of guys that you're like, you put this guy ahead of bonus. 317 00:20:40,240 --> 00:20:44,720 Uh My number seven is Alprin Shangoon, with some people would say is basically 318 00:20:44,799 --> 00:20:49,720 like Sabonis but not as good. I think Shanoon is. I mean, 319 00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:52,519 he scores a little more, it's not as good a rebounder. I think 320 00:20:52,559 --> 00:20:56,559 he's a little better defensively, which is like, definitely he's been better defensively 321 00:20:56,599 --> 00:21:00,960 this season for sure. Not a high bar to clear, but but that's 322 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:03,039 just the case. Uh. There you go, shitting on some bonus again. 323 00:21:03,799 --> 00:21:07,839 Yeah, sorry, I gotta resist the urge. God, am I 324 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:11,799 really gonna do that? Now? I have Shane as well, if that 325 00:21:11,799 --> 00:21:15,160 makes you feel better. But if you have Bonus at five, uh well, 326 00:21:15,279 --> 00:21:18,079 So the thing with Shangoon is that he is still We've seen the way 327 00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:22,039 that they tether his minutes to Fred van Fleet and vice versa. For sure, 328 00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:26,039 that's someone who's even right now. He just feels and maybe that's more 329 00:21:26,039 --> 00:21:29,640 about the personnel around him, but he's a little bit less equipped. He 330 00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:33,519 can initiate the offense, it feels like in more ways than the Bonus when 331 00:21:33,519 --> 00:21:37,440 you're kind of looking at the full floor and not by like a huge margin. 332 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:41,240 But like SA Bonus is actually more equipped. SA Bonus can do more 333 00:21:41,519 --> 00:21:45,079 with less around him offensively, is how I would frame it all right now, 334 00:21:45,119 --> 00:21:47,880 I'm just completely I knew this was gonna happen. I'm gonna make you 335 00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:49,839 take shang Can you take shanguon off of my seven? There, I've just 336 00:21:49,880 --> 00:21:53,319 talked myself out of it. I'm gonna go Sabonis seven. I just it 337 00:21:53,359 --> 00:22:00,200 feels like I am too stuck in my playoff fixate with him. I was, 338 00:22:00,279 --> 00:22:02,880 you know, I was gonna feel bad for a second, but you 339 00:22:02,920 --> 00:22:06,759 did. You sold me on shake Gilds Alexander. So there's that. So 340 00:22:06,799 --> 00:22:10,440 you're gonna move What do you want to do with I want? I would 341 00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:15,240 like to go, please Sabonis seven, Shangoon eight? Okay? So I 342 00:22:15,319 --> 00:22:18,160 so Shangun You're gonna bump down to eight? Yeah? All right? And 343 00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:22,319 then I can't move them up. Well, I'm just I'm narrating for the 344 00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:23,839 people who are listening while I'm also trying to delay time so I can put 345 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:26,119 it up on the screen. Well, I'll talk about it. I think 346 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:30,240 as looking at the two next to each other, I think they're similar enough 347 00:22:30,279 --> 00:22:34,160 that Sabonis just has to be Statistically, it's like the true shooting, the 348 00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:38,759 advanced metrics, the catch alls, and it's not like shan Gun's. Like 349 00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:44,440 floor spacing is so much better that it's a meaningful difference maker. So I 350 00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:48,079 feel better about Domos there at seven Shangoon eight. Oh can I give you 351 00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:52,640 my eight? Yeah? This is where I mean like this, As I 352 00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:56,039 said, after number four, it got kind of tough for me, but 353 00:22:56,160 --> 00:23:02,160 like after number six it got really really tough for me, and this was 354 00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:07,440 one of them. I have chet at eight. I just think what he 355 00:23:07,519 --> 00:23:12,039 does defensively is on par right now with a Victor Weben Yama, a jar 356 00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:17,519 Now and all the names that you would consider in this spot, and then 357 00:23:17,559 --> 00:23:21,240 where he's gonna get the edge even over Evan Mobley or a Jaron Jackson junior. 358 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:25,599 Knowing your role on offense, and I know he has the benefit of 359 00:23:25,759 --> 00:23:29,160 these creators around him who get on the ball. He does have some jiggle 360 00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:30,960 and joggle to his handle when you look at him attacking close outs are in 361 00:23:32,039 --> 00:23:37,599 space, stretching the floor and then being so efficient at it largely is just 362 00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:41,759 it's monstrous. And I think when you get to the center position and you're 363 00:23:41,759 --> 00:23:45,920 not a featured weapon or a featured offense like Rudy Gobert would be a good 364 00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:49,559 example. He's someone who can he's so dominant defensively, this doesn't matter. 365 00:23:49,559 --> 00:23:53,000 But like He's someone who can be a little bit annoying on offense because you're 366 00:23:53,039 --> 00:23:56,279 not this featured option. But like, do you need people to dump it 367 00:23:56,319 --> 00:23:59,200 off to you in the post, or like do you insist on getting these 368 00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:04,279 handles like Chet just functionally scaling to the situation Oklahoma City needs him to play 369 00:24:06,079 --> 00:24:11,599 is monstrous and what has him over I don't have Wemby in my top ten. 370 00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:14,559 I'll be just spoiler right there. The things he does defensively are right 371 00:24:14,559 --> 00:24:18,480 there. He's still very much a theory and experiment. On the offensive end, 372 00:24:18,519 --> 00:24:21,720 he's gotten better, he's gotten more efficient. If we're doing this list 373 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:23,880 at the end of the year, I'm Wemby might be two for me. 374 00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:30,400 I don't know. But like Chet having not the I understand Wemby has a 375 00:24:30,440 --> 00:24:33,680 more complex role. I understand that even Christops has a more complex role. 376 00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:37,079 When you look at what Boston asked him to punish with mis mismatchge. He 377 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:41,640 is so dominant in his role that I think that needs to count for something. 378 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:45,359 And so when we're getting into this tier where you're a player who probably 379 00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:52,440 isn't going to define your team's entire offensive attack, I value that, like 380 00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:56,000 the way that his offense just translates to so many different lineups and situations. 381 00:24:56,400 --> 00:25:00,720 Yeah, I think so I had him. I had Chet as seven before 382 00:25:00,759 --> 00:25:04,720 I uh came to Jesus and saw I needed to include Sabonis and then bump 383 00:25:04,759 --> 00:25:08,039 Seingoon up for some reason too. Uh So Chet has to be nine for 384 00:25:08,079 --> 00:25:11,279 me because he's definitely in this in this group. I think, you know, 385 00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:15,720 there's everything good that I said about Porzingis. I think you might very 386 00:25:15,759 --> 00:25:19,119 soon be able to say about Chet. And like I think as an off 387 00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:22,680 the dribble threat, like he's already better than Porzingis has ever been at that, 388 00:25:22,799 --> 00:25:26,240 So I think going downhill for sure. Yeah, I mean he's like 389 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:29,880 posts and turnarounds and I've said it before, like he really does move like 390 00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:32,799 a guard like and he has guard instincts I think too, like he wants 391 00:25:32,839 --> 00:25:36,079 to up fake and go like a lot. I wish Chet would shoot more 392 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:40,079 threes just without hesitation, but like he's not. I think he's more wired 393 00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:42,119 to be like I'm gonna put it on the floor and make a play whether 394 00:25:42,160 --> 00:25:45,960 I get to the bucket or I make up. Like he's just I think 395 00:25:45,039 --> 00:25:48,319 Chet's gonna be awesome And I have Winby. I mean, the numbers are 396 00:25:48,319 --> 00:25:53,200 gonna be closing this, but he's a better just like ball mover than pazingis 397 00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:56,400 when it comes to facilitation, like you'd probably trust Chris tops to yeah, 398 00:25:56,440 --> 00:26:00,480 facilitate out of the elbows or something more right now, but like as a 399 00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:04,039 passer overall, is I would say he's better. Yeah, Chet's wiring is 400 00:26:04,039 --> 00:26:07,839 is uh as a six is a six to five guy, Like I think 401 00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:11,079 his offensive wiring is just that's what he thinks he is. And I think 402 00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:14,559 his skill set is like good enough that that might be he might play like 403 00:26:14,599 --> 00:26:18,440 that guy with the shot blocking on top of it. So I don't know 404 00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:21,720 if you're here, I said Wemby at ten, and I I almost it's 405 00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:23,119 almost because like I just want to be on the right side of history, 406 00:26:23,559 --> 00:26:27,680 because there's so many more established guys that you could make a case for going 407 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:33,400 in this spot. I do hate that bumping some bonus in costs me. 408 00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:36,960 Jared Jackson Junior, who I had at ten, even though he's having not 409 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:40,240 a great year. I just think, like your defensive player of the year, 410 00:26:40,359 --> 00:26:42,200 you can stretch the floor in theory and have done it a couple times 411 00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:45,079 in practice. It's tough to not have Jackson on here, but but he 412 00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:49,160 doesn't make it. Yeah, so him and Wemby were my toughest cuts. 413 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:53,960 I'm surprised a little bit, but it's it does fit with the theme of 414 00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:57,359 the clothes to this podcast that you didn't have Jared Allen, who's my number 415 00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:00,640 nine. Yeah, he is been. This is not just like a whole 416 00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:04,559 year he's shooting like sixty plus percent on hook shots, but during him helping 417 00:27:04,599 --> 00:27:10,799 them navigate kind of the the kind of him helping them navigate the Evan Mobley 418 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:14,440 absence and Darius Garland absence. Of course, there is more. What he 419 00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:17,200 does defensively is big, like as a rim protector, as someone who's a 420 00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:19,640 little bit more mobile than I think people give him credit for. Generally, 421 00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:25,079 the things that I don't think are common acknowledgements from him. People might know 422 00:27:25,119 --> 00:27:26,519 it because I know that, you know, people who listen to this podcast 423 00:27:26,519 --> 00:27:30,160 and just fans in general are watching basketball. His offensive usage is just so 424 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:34,599 more complex and expansive than meets the eye. Like he can make these one 425 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:38,000 and two dribble decisions. He can now He's like added face ups to his 426 00:27:38,039 --> 00:27:41,599 game with complicated footwork he will keep the ball moving. And what he also 427 00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:47,240 doesn't get enough credit for this is in the minutes with Evan Mobley, his 428 00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:52,359 spatial awareness is fantastic of knowing where to be whether Evan Mobley has the ball 429 00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:53,599 or doesn't have the ball. So you are not yees. Some things can 430 00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:57,880 come up a little bit with Cleveland's offense, like he's not really part. 431 00:27:59,359 --> 00:28:00,880 He's a part of the problem in so far is he doesn't shoot threes. 432 00:28:02,079 --> 00:28:04,359 It's just but like other than that, he understands where to be in the 433 00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:07,759 clumpiest lineups or where other guys are. If he was smaller dudes hanging in 434 00:28:07,759 --> 00:28:11,599 the dunker spot because you brought Jared Allen hanging up, brought Jared Allen up 435 00:28:11,799 --> 00:28:17,480 higher. I just appreciate how smart and adaptive he is as someone who, 436 00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:22,160 in theory should be this kind of restrictive archetype. I think people just are 437 00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:26,079 still in the the mode of oh, he's just like this rim running like 438 00:28:26,559 --> 00:28:30,759 rim detector. He's he's more than that. That's fair. This was there 439 00:28:30,759 --> 00:28:38,160 were the cuts were brutal on this one. So so you said cuts type 440 00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:41,559 before, so just because you mentioned them already, were Wemby and Jaron Jackson 441 00:28:41,599 --> 00:28:45,440 Junior. I just don't. The Wemby one is the one. Jared Jackson 442 00:28:45,519 --> 00:28:48,279 Junior is just the Efficiency's all over the place offensively, So it wasn't too 443 00:28:48,319 --> 00:28:52,400 hard to leave him off, given who's in front of him. The Wemby 444 00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:55,319 one just like guts me. But I'm looking at these players right now and 445 00:28:55,359 --> 00:28:57,759 I'm like, well, honestly, who do you want for the rest of 446 00:28:57,759 --> 00:29:03,599 the season less than Wemby? And it's just I don't. I don't know. 447 00:29:03,680 --> 00:29:06,000 And then I'm like, well, my discounting the progress Wenby is made 448 00:29:06,079 --> 00:29:10,039 on offense, my discounting how just transcendent he already is on defense. I 449 00:29:10,039 --> 00:29:11,599 look, the icon we're using for the teams might look right here. I'm 450 00:29:11,599 --> 00:29:15,640 just yelling at myself that avatar. Man, That's how I feel right now. 451 00:29:15,119 --> 00:29:18,920 I mean, like Wemby and Chet both could be three and four. 452 00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:22,759 You know, the next year when we do this, I think, I 453 00:29:22,759 --> 00:29:26,440 think so much upside there. So yeah, I agree. So Allan was 454 00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:29,839 a brute was a tough cut for me. Jared Jackson, I said, 455 00:29:30,599 --> 00:29:34,799 just to run through a couple more miles. Turner didn't really seriously consider it, 456 00:29:34,839 --> 00:29:38,519 but like he's a you know, good starting center Brook Lopez, Nick 457 00:29:38,519 --> 00:29:42,000 Claxon, Evan Evan Mobile, that's a Player of the Year last season and 458 00:29:42,079 --> 00:29:45,960 still good this year. Not just Brook Lopez. I considered him, but 459 00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:51,400 it wasn't like he was never seriously in my top ten, which is what 460 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:53,960 feels feels a little wrong. Huh. That's the thing. Like you get 461 00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:59,079 past the top I'd say, really the top three, and it's almost like 462 00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:03,720 you could reorganize four through like fifteen in a lot of different ways. It 463 00:30:03,839 --> 00:30:07,160 would mean all these guys we mentioned, and probably a couple we've forgotten. 464 00:30:07,759 --> 00:30:10,880 Yeah, I mean, like I'm pretty I feel like my top six. 465 00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:14,799 I mean you could order go I guess go Baar, Domas and Bam differently, 466 00:30:14,839 --> 00:30:18,359 but like seven through I don't know, like twelve or thirteen. Even 467 00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:21,359 we both didn't mention him. I mentioned him in the Power Forward, but 468 00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:25,000 like Evan Mobley, where this might have been made a lot harder if Evan 469 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:27,240 Mobley never gets injured, right well, and Cat, I mean I don't 470 00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:30,200 think I think well, like you could easily make the case for Cat over 471 00:30:30,319 --> 00:30:34,880 like Wemby for example, or even like Sabonis if you're really just fixated on 472 00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:38,200 like I need this premium shooting or you know, there's ways to do it. 473 00:30:38,279 --> 00:30:41,640 I do think. I think no matter what, Shangoon probably stays in 474 00:30:41,680 --> 00:30:45,480 the top ten for both of us. But then after that it gets it 475 00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:49,160 gets pretty iffy. Even imagine if I had Nick Claxton on my long list, 476 00:30:51,079 --> 00:30:52,720 but imagine if he doesn't deal with injuries to start the season. Based 477 00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:56,720 off how he's playing nowt Whne Carter Junior might have factored in. Yeah, 478 00:30:56,880 --> 00:30:59,319 that's another one I'm trying to. I want to make sure we're not forgetting 479 00:30:59,359 --> 00:31:03,680 anybody else just because like Hartenstein hasn't played nearly enough, but like all the 480 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:10,079 advanced metrics are like top twenty in EPM, which is crazy, No Lively 481 00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:12,680 Zubots is a couple of I mean, if Mitchell Robinson says really healthy, 482 00:31:12,920 --> 00:31:17,279 I mean that's probably he's not getting in the top ten. Well he makes 483 00:31:17,279 --> 00:31:19,920 a long list for like Jonas found Chunas not even being like a consideration here 484 00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:25,039 is crazy. A lot of great, a lot of town. I mean, 485 00:31:25,039 --> 00:31:27,279 in centers are tough because yeah, in the context of you're not taking 486 00:31:27,319 --> 00:31:30,920 a lot of these guys over, I mean, after jokicchen embiid if we 487 00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:34,960 were doing the rankings of players, like, regardless of position, who's the 488 00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:37,799 first Anthony Davis. I guess in the first center to appear, But where 489 00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:42,279 is he appearing? It might be pretty low, like relative to one another. 490 00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:47,559 This is a really wrenching exercise. Yeah, so I'll go through my 491 00:31:47,559 --> 00:31:51,440 my top ten. Here you'll catch at one, embiad At two, Anthony 492 00:31:51,519 --> 00:31:56,440 Davis three, were in lockstep. There I go bam At four, Porzingis 493 00:31:56,480 --> 00:32:00,319 five, Rudy Gobert six, Dolmas Sabonas seven, Alprin, shangun At eight, 494 00:32:00,599 --> 00:32:05,599 Chet Holmgren nine, Victor Webbin Yama rounding out the top ten. I'll 495 00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:07,920 just say, even if Kings fans are mad at where Domos is ranked on 496 00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:14,039 your list or even my list, I deserve some appreciation for getting him on 497 00:32:14,079 --> 00:32:15,039 your list. And Jane, you did you did it. You did it. 498 00:32:15,079 --> 00:32:17,799 The conversation did it. That's that's the best part about this is you 499 00:32:17,839 --> 00:32:22,519 talked me out of a I was. I was too stuck in my uh 500 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:25,519 you know, I didn't really want to do this, like prepare for this 501 00:32:25,559 --> 00:32:29,400 exercise. But now that we've done the podcast, the discussions about how we 502 00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:32,599 classify guys and why were a lot of fun you kind of like pointing out 503 00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:37,400 the shake Gildas Alexander stuff with me, are talk about Booker as a point 504 00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:39,119 guard or shooting guard and then this, So it was a lot of fun 505 00:32:39,119 --> 00:32:44,640 to record this. My top ten were Yokichen embiid one and two, Anthony 506 00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:49,200 Davis at three, Rudygobertt four, Domas a Bonus at five, bam Adebayo 507 00:32:49,279 --> 00:32:52,000 at six, Alprin Shangoun at seven, chet Holme Grind at eight, Jared 508 00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:57,559 Allen at nine, Christaps Porzingis at ten, and my two toughest cuts just 509 00:32:57,599 --> 00:33:04,359 three at eight Jaron Jackson Junior and Well Victor yam wow good, yeah, 510 00:33:04,759 --> 00:33:07,519 yeah, tough cuts for me. Jared Allen Jared Jackson Jr. Speaking of 511 00:33:07,599 --> 00:33:09,720 Jared Allen, you ready to take it out of here? I am? 512 00:33:10,599 --> 00:33:14,920 You know what? I would like to start this outro with an apology to 513 00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:17,519 Jared Allen, and I will sandwich a second one at the end of it. 514 00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:22,720 You were close, man, You're you're worth way more than your contract 515 00:33:22,039 --> 00:33:25,240 I was. We were dead wrong about that. One thousand apologies, so 516 00:33:25,240 --> 00:33:29,319 we'll have a thousand and two apologies by the end of this. Thanks everybody, 517 00:33:29,359 --> 00:33:30,720 for listening, for watching. Let us know what you think of our 518 00:33:30,839 --> 00:33:38,079 rankings. Congratulate Dan for alleviating some of my regular season blindness as it pertains 519 00:33:38,079 --> 00:33:45,400 the demonised Bonus. Follow us on our socials at Hardwood Knox rate with five 520 00:33:45,440 --> 00:33:49,799 stars, thumbs up, lots of positive comments, give good reviews. Wherever 521 00:33:49,839 --> 00:33:52,759 you get your podcasts, check out our stuff on YouTube, Share that with 522 00:33:52,799 --> 00:33:58,880 your friends, Let your enemies know as well. Links for the for our 523 00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:04,039 discord and how to get our merch or on YouTube and podcast descriptions. Shout 524 00:34:04,039 --> 00:34:08,159 out Franklin Lakina. Additional and final apology not forever, but for this episode 525 00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:09,000 to Jared Awaren