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In today's exciting episode, we have
more UAP news coming out of Congress,

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an interview with a ball lightning scientist, and Enigma updates including looking at a

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couple more signings. Stay tuned,
Welcome to Open Mind UAP News. I'm

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your host, Alejandro Rojas. Let's
get right into the news. To start

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off with a little bit of sad
news. Unfortunately, well known UAP researcher

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Bruce mcabee passed away last week.
This is a post from his wife kind

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of informing people. He was eighty
two years old and he was very well

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known. He was actually a Navy
optical physicist for many years and had examined

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a lot of UFO signings. In
fact, just a couple anecdotes from my

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personally knowing him. I met him
for the first time twenty odd years ago

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when I was helping Muffon put on
a conference, I think the very first

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conference I helped them with, and
it was very cool because, like a

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lot of hotels, there was a
piano in the lobby and someone was playing

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it and I thought, wow,
this is gorgeous. It must be someone

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that the hotel hired. That was
really cool of them. So I go

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to take a look, and lo
and behold, it is Bruce mcabee here

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in his suit. You know,
he looks like a scientist. He's there

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playing the piano, and he's just
wonderful playing great classical music, and he

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was kind of known for that.
I was very shocked, and I was

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excited because I knew who he was
and I was really excited to meet him

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for the first time. So I
thought that was really cool. Moving forward

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through the conference, I was really
busy and I was the last one to

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sit down for dinner at the big
keynote talk and large you know evening dinner,

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and the last seat available was next
to Bruce mcat. So actually I

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was very excited. Of course,
I had a seat that was with kind

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of the people that were organizing the
conference. They gave that away to,

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you know, some researcher I think
they wanted to talk to. But I

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was very happy to sit next to
Bruce mcabee because I had several questions for

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him. At this time, I
was a filled researcher and I had sent

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him some cases to look at and
he had kind of poo pooed them.

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He was like, you know,
sorry, this isn't what you think it

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is, and I was a little
bit frustrated, but I learned something very

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important when talking to him. He
was like, I was saying, you

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know, you said this could have
been a street lamp, but you know

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the witness said this is and that, And he made a great point.

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He said, I'm the photo and
video analyst, so I only look at

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the data that the photo or the
video can provide, and if I can't

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rule out a street light, then
it's likely a street light. And he

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had a great point because this is
data, and if you can't rule something

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out using that piece of data,
then he's got a great point. Then

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you know you don't have something that
can substantiate that something abnormal happened. So

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I learned a very important lesson to
this day. Even when we get to

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some of the cases we'll talk about
like Egglin Air Force Base. This was

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an important one recently where Matt Gates, the congressman, had come forward and

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said, DoD have you looked at
this case? The dood looks at it,

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and they essentially are saying, we
can't rule out a balloon. I

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told you all I would look more
into it, and I did. There

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were several radar targets that they weren't
able to correlate, so they didn't know

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what those were. The pilot did
not see those targets. He only saw

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one object, which we can't explain. It doesn't necessarily look like a balloon.

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But to the point of the report
from Arrow, we also can't rule

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it out. There's no characteristics or
no observed even or recorded movements of this

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object that show that it would not
have been, you know, a balloon

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or something that isn't moving at incredible
speed. So they have a great point.

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There's just not enough data to prove
otherwise. Now, allegedly there is

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a video. One researcher said he
is looking for a video, although the

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error report said there was no video. There wasn't a video able to be

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captured. So again we have something
that could be strange, but we don't

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have evidence that it. Certainly is
not enough scientific data. So that was

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something really important that I learned from
Bruce mcabee. I worked and talked with

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him for a lot throughout the years, interviewing him or discussing different cases.

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One of the most important interactions I've
had with Bruce mcabee was that he was

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investing gating a case in late seventies
where these airman had an alleged UFO sighting.

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He was investigating it and found them
to be credible, but they told

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him to talk to this guy named
Dody, Richard Dody. He did this.

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Richard Dody guy had a lot of
weird things to say, and he

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kind of blew it off. He
said, I don't really buy this guy

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stuff. I think he was lying
to me. When he Tooya Documents about

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this case. They sent him a
bunch of documents about Richard Doty. He

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said, I don't know why they
sent these to me, but I kind

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of ignored them. And you can
see this on his website. I'll put

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a link up to it. Those
documents were really important to me because they

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told the story of this disinformation kind
of thing that had happened. And I've

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talked about this before and I'll definitely
talk about it again and I'll put a

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link in the show description. But
it's essentially an Air Force disinformation case that

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has not been addressed. Even though
ERO was supposed to look at disinformation and

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include it in their historical report,
they did not. Anyway, this led

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me to Foya Documents and get the
same documents that he did on Richard Doty

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and do my investigation that I'll put
in the show notes. So he was

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a big part of that. But
he's been a big part of UFO research.

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He's done a lot of foil work
to get a lot of CIA and

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FBI documents. He has some books. In fact, let me show you

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here. He's got several books,
the FBI CIA UFO Connection, The legacy

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of nineteen fifty two, which was
a very important year for the topic of

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UFOs. And another, perhaps the
most important case is he calls it three

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minutes in June the UFO siding that
changed the world, and that's the Kenneth

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Arnold siding. He wrote a book
on that as well. So these are

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things you can get on Amazon.
You'll also see that he wrote a couple

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forwards to some of Stanton Friedman's books, and that's what those other two you

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see here are so very well known
figure and he will definitely be missed.

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He was an important guy in this
field. And we actually with Open Minds

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did a bio for him when we
gave him an award previously, and I'll

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put that in the description as well
for everybody to see. Moving on aliens

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invade Taylor Swift. So you see
here you might not have seen this in

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bar lighthearted news. I just wanted
to share this because look at how amazing

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that graphic is. So I don't
know if any of you have gone to

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the concert. This is something they
just added recently, but pretty amazing visuals

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of a UFO that she's added to
her conference. And of course Taylor Swift

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always is big news, so that
was big news out there, and I

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just wanted to share it with you
because it just looks so cool. But

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moving on to some of the more
official stuff going on. This is a

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memo that went out May ninth and
twenty twenty four from the National Archives.

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And why is this important because,
as it states here, the NDAA for

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twenty twenty four, that's the National
Defense Authorization Act. Essentially, these are

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the acts where Congress says, hey, DoD if you want to get paid,

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here's what we want you to do. Because Congress is in charge of

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the budget for the Pentagon, and
of course, as we know, they've

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been asked to get involved with UAP
and one of the things that they're supposed

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to do is collect all the UAP
documents and put it into this archive for

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the National Arts Archives, And that's
what this memo was about, going out

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saying hey, all of you agencies, here's your directive on getting some files.

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When this went out, there wasn't
much that was sent in. But

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now you can go look at this
then that the records related to Unidentified Anomalist

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Phenomena at the National Archives, and
you'll find there is a bunch of stuff

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here. So there are pictures and
images, videos they call them moving images,

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still, Presidential library information, microfish
films, a bunch of blog articles

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here that had been previously written on
UAP, and this database is growing larger

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and larger, so there's a lot
of stuff in here. It's pretty cool.

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I mean, in some of these
cases there'll be information that you can

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get. Otherwise it'll be stuff where
it'll tell you where it is to go

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get it or print it. That
can be a little more difficult, but

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there are times that you I've worked
with some of these presidential libraries and they

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can be pretty helpful. You can
call them up and say, hey,

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whatch you happen to have this or
that, and they'll look for it for

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you and they'll email it to you. I've gotten some great pictures in the

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past through doing that. So this
is going to be a great research area

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resource for people, and it's not
something that has been talked about much out

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there, so definitely want to go
take a look at that. This is

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some interesting news coming out of Canada. So this is CTV News. This

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is written by Daniel Otis, who
has been doing a lot of great work

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writing about Canada and UAP and this
one he's talking about US intelligence officials wanted

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to meet with Transport Canada's UFO lead. So Transport Canada, I guess their

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Department of Transportation has been tasked with
kind of taking the lead on UFOs,

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but they don't want to. Essentially, this article says, despite the US

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Director of National Intelligence coming to Canada
and saying, hey, we would like

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to talk to you about your records, they're shirking them. They're saying,

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you know, they're setting up meetings
or pretending like they will. They're saying

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verbiage like, you know, they
don't want these kind of requests that they're

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calling any UFO request are harassment.
But they're really pushing back having to do

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anything on this topic. And so
that's what this article is about pretty disheartening

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to see, especially given how the
US government has gotten so into this.

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Canada just doesn't want anything to do
with it. And we still have a

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long way to go here in the
US. And here's what I mean by

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that. So Dean Johnson, Dean
Johnson has a site here. You can

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find him mostly on Twitter or x
and if you click on it, you

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know you can see some articles here. But he's been great. He's been

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keeping an eye on the bills out
there. He works in this area,

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and he's been able to kind of
summarize what's been going on and in Congress,

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especially with legislation. One of the
things he's written about in which you

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might have heard about is Rep.
Tim Burchett, along with the UAP Caucus,

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have written a bill. It's a
page and a half and it essentially

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says to release all the UAP records. Very very strange to have a proposed

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bill that is only a page and
a half. The Schumer Amendment, for

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example, on UAP with sixty four
pages. If you go look at the

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legislation when it comes to the NDAA
out there at their pages and pages.

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So it's certainly not going to be
seen as credible, only being a page

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and a half. And again it's
this UAP caucus group not really you know,

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although they're out there making a lot
of noise, and we'll look at

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that a little bit more in a
second. You know, they're not really

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giving an air of credibility with stunts
like this. So far. These guys

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are part of the Oversight Committee in
the House, and the committee has not

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taken up this bill to look at
and approve to move forward to the wider

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House for a vote. It may
not happen. We really haven't heard much

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since May sixteenth when they posted this, so we'll see about that. Certainly

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not the best way to go to
bring credibility and really prove your point,

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especially when they are alleging a lot
of conspiratorial things. You know, you

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think that you would want to substantiate
that and substantiate that, you know,

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there's a lot of records that are
being hidden and not being shared. You've

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got to make that argument, and
that argument really just isn't made here.

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And that's why this probably won't be
taken too seriously moving forward. And someone

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who has been more effective, which
is Christian Deal a brand. She did

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an interview with CBS News recently to
talk about UFOs. Well, actually it

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was to talk about Israel border security
and she was asked about UFO. She

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seemed a little surprised to get the
question. It's a pretty long video,

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so I won't play it all for
you here. You can go take a

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look at it. But essentially she's
just talking about the importance of UAP and

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that the Pentagon is looking into it, so she's definitely supporting their current efforts.

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But she also brings the conversation to
drones and how it's important that we

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take a look at drones, and
you'll notice drones are kind of taking over

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a lot of the conversation when it
comes to UAP, and I think it's

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because of what I've reviewed in the
last few shows, is that the credibility

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of this topic has kind of deteriorated, that the real credible cases have kind

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of lost kind of the attention they've
gotten due to a lot of the conspiratorial

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stuff that many felt has been debunked, and so we're kind of at a

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lull as far as when it comes
to the credibility of the topic. Now,

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she is saying it's important that we
look into this but then of course

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she segues into drones as opposed to
talking about the real unidentified cases like the

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Nimitz case that we can't understand,
and that has been a driving force for

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really kind of tackling the true unknowns. Drones are a subset of UAP when

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they are not immediately identified, and
that is the definition they've used. If

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something cannot be immediately identified, then
it is a UAP until it can be

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identified. Often drones, just by
visual inspection or by looking at photographs or

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video, things can be determined to
be drones. But of course when they're

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not, they're more mysterious, and
sometimes the characteristics of these objects that are

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captured are outside of the capability of
drones, and of those are the ones

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that are really interesting. But the
conversation kind of keeps being brought back to

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drones. Drones are obviously a very
important topic. There are the swarms of

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drones that have been seen over sensitive
areas, in sensitive aerospace and training areas,

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even over military warships, and we
don't know what they are. So

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it's something we definitely need to get
a handle on, and Congress is very

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focused on. It's just hopefully the
importance, or at least the credibility of

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the UAP topic doesn't droop low enough
where they just kind of drop it.

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But it doesn't seem like that's going
to be the case anytime soon. So

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on the top of a Congress and
UAP, there was a hearing by that

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oversight committee that the UAP caucus belongs
to Timberchat, Luna, some of those

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others I've mentioned, And in the
hearing they were interviewing the Secretary of Energy,

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Jennifer grand Holme, and Timberchat asked
her a UAP question. Let's take

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a look. Let me switch gears
the responsibility. It was a responsibility of

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the Federal Protective Services within the Nuclear
Security Administration. Are you talking about transporting

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fuels? No, ma'am. I
wanted you to speak well. I was

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going to follow up with the numerous
reports by the Federal Protective Services officers describing

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suspicious occurrences of ups over nuclear facilities. Let me just say the Defense Department

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has said there is no evidence of
UFOs, etc. Or aliens in the

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United States. However, at those
sites, there may be drones that may

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be nefarious, and so we are
definitely looking at that and making sure that

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our national security sites are protected.
We have a whole program related to countering

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drones that may be coming from but
this isn't about drones, and this is

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prior to drones. Even what protocols
Apartment of Energy have for reporting and responding

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to the up sidings near unclear infrastructure
and people joke about this, but I

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get a lot of questions about this, concerning this and about this hearing today

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from my constituent. So I would
appreciate you answering that if they're already protocols

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instantly, there are protocols whenever we
see anything unusual around our nuclear sites or

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our national security sites are large,
Okay, we'll switch gears. So,

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on the one hand, it's great
that Burchett asked the question. On the

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other hand, it would have been
great if he would have corrected her,

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because that statement she made is completely
inaccurate. She said the Defense Department has

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said there is no evidence of UFOs. Again, that is completely false.

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They have not said that. They
have said there's no evidence of aliens,

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but not of UFOs. Further,
the point could have been made that the

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Pentagon has been directed with making sure
to come up with protocols for reporting UAP,

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and she should be known that UAP
are an issue, and drones are

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a subset of UAP, like we
said, when they cannot immediately be identified,

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So she needs to be aware by
somebody. Congress is the right place,

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and too bad or Chett didn't take
this opportunity to let her know that,

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no, you are wrong, that
is not what the DoD said.

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She needs to be corrected and she
should. Then the point could be made

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that if the Pentagon's taking this seriously
and they're coming up with protocols, don't

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you think you should too? And
I think that's where she could be challenged.

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And in the historical record you can
see cases historically, not just in

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the US, but throughout the world
where UAP and they have been determined not

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to be drones have been spotted over
nuclear facilities. So it's a topic that

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she could have and hopefully will be
probed a little bit more on. No

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punintended. There was another question that
came up, so Represented of Luna then

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followed up and let's listen to her
conversation here sec Grandfall and earlier, when

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Representative Burchett asked you about SAP stuff, you said that the DoD essentially had

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denied any existence of that, and
you referred to them as drones. Correct.

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It's my understanding that the Department of
Defense has looked like it's an issue

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to report about it. I have
a lot of questions, so just quick

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and concise if possible. There have
been persistent claims in reports, including those

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from credible whistleblowers to this committee,
suggesting that the US government, potentially including

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the Department of Energy, has been
involved in reverse engineering technologies recovered from up

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For example, the Pentagon's proposed ConA
Blue program aimed at reverse engineering such technologies,

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although it was ultimately not established.
Can you clarify whether the Department of

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Energy has been involved in any such
efforts, either historically or currently to analyze

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reverse engineering materials from related to you
IPS, I have no knowledge of that,

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Okay. There are several reports indicated
frequent drone incursions over DOE nuclear facilities,

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including an incident on April first,
twenty twenty one at Lawrence Livermore National

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Laboratory also known as l NL.
Can you detail the deey's current secretary security

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measures to prevent unauthorized drone activities or
ups and what steps are being taken to

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Hancy's measures of frequencies of incidences.
Yeah, we have a whole counter drone

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effort to make sure that all of
our national security sites in our labs are

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protected from incursions from drones. I'll
just say that are not authorized. So

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there's a whole series of protocols probably
not right for discussion in this public setting.

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Correct. So I review some unclassified
materials from around the forties and fifties,

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and so they weren't just being reported
as drones back then. Then I

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encourage you to look over those materials
because I think that you guys should be

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upgrading that program to cover down on
UAPs. There have been documented sidings of

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metallic spheres over DEEY facilities if you
want to call them drones in this instance,

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such as one report on April thirtieth, twenty nineteen OVERLNL. What investigations

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have been connected in regards to these
settings and what conclusions do you guys have

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about the nature and nature and origins
of these objects. I'm happy to follow

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up with you on that. Okay, we'll be submitting also too for public

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records and questions after this. If
you could please answer those considering the Dewy's

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involvement and nuclear and sensitive research facilities. How does the DEWEY coordinate with agencies

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like the Department of Defense and ARROW
to investigate UAP sidings we are part of

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We obviously are teamed with the Department
of Defense because of our national security and

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nuclear mission. Are you able to
cite any specific investigations or shared data analysis

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efforts? I don't have information on
that, okay as of right now.

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Again, we'll be submitting some questions
for you after this, but I hope

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that you guys can answer those in
a timely fashion. And again, for

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those that might be tuning into this, I would encourage you to look at

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some of those unclassified materials and we'll
be happy to provide your office with that.

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I'll just follow up by one other
question, guess to close it out.

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Does the Deuty currently work with Jaysock
in order to handle security measures?

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We work with all of the security
entities around the federal government. We're part

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of an overall all of government effort
on both cyber as well as national security.

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Did you guys work with Jaysock?
Yes, yes, we do.

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Okay, all right, thank you, So there you go. This one

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was interesting. I mean, it
was great that she cited that there were

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cases historically, there are cases that
are actually more recent than the fifties and

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sixties, but to her point,
in the fifties and sixties there was more

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official concern and in fact you can
see that in some of the CIA papers

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from that era, and I can
post some of that also in the description

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below. But again she gave her
a pass to let her call these these

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metallic orbs drones when you know they're
UAP. And I was hoping at the

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beginning that she was going to clarify
the difference between UAP and you know,

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drones, but unfortunately that didn't happen. So that education still needs to happen

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with grand Holme obviously on the distinction
between the two, especially if like she

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says, she's working with the Department
of Defense and will cooperate with aer ROW.

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So yeah, some interesting You now
have the Department of Energy on the

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record saying they're not aware of UAP
cases, you know, and they're definitely

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not back engineering UAP. That's not
what the Department of Energy does. So

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that's no surprise. We really don't
have except for in the conspiracy areas much

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in regards to UAP and the Department
of Energy. I did find some files

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recently and I will post those in
a link below. But yeah, yeah,

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there's a lot more to do here, I think, with educating that

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group. But this is the first
time I think the Department of Energy has

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really kind of been faced with being
involved with all of this, although they

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have been cited by Congress in a
few occasions. So we'll see what happens

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going forward with this. Enigma Labs. So I did want to get into

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and here's a piece of news out
there when it comes to Enigma Labs.

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They have some new state sighting pages, so and here you can see an

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article in the Risewell Daily Record about
the siting pages in New Mexico and a

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really interesting sighting that they posted here. Maybe we'll look at that one later

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on. But I did get some
really good cases out of New Mexico recently,

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and if you go into the app, you'll be able to see those

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in the content feed that first tab. But what's interesting about these pages,

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and let me bring one up here
for you Enigma Labs dot io. So

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if you go to Explore, you
can go to Explore Sightings and then you're

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going to see a bunch of countries
and the different sidings numbers of sightings they've

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had. Of course, we want
to look at the United States right now

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because I want to look at the
state ones. Of course, two hundred

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and thirty sidings. That's a conglomerate
of different sightings that we've collected from many

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different agencies. Of course, if
we go to let's say New Mexico,

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you can see a graph, you
can see some characteristics. You'll see like

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that where they are on the number
of sightings. That's not per population,

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so you know where there's more people, there's more sightings reported. But you

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do get kind of top shapes,
not surprising. Usually a point of light

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is the most common one, or
spheres which is also kind of could be

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a point of light. And then
you'll see some videos. So if you

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don't have the Apple app to be
able to get in there, this is

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a way for you to kind of
look at some sightings in your area or

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throughout the world. So it's kind
of a cool feature. So last week,

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the strange video that we looked at
was kind of this orb traveling through

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the sky and it kind of looked
like potentially ball lightning. There was lightning

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going on in the background, so
I sent that to a ball lightning scientist.

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I've been talking to Carl Stephan and
invited him on the show to talk

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to him about more specifics and his
work researching ball lightning. So let's check

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out that interview. All right,
I'm very happy to welcome Carl Stefan from

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the Texas State University, an expert
on ball lightning. Thank you so much

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for joining us. I'm glad to
be here. Thank you for having me

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to start off. I would like
to know how you got involved with this

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sort of work. Well, there's
how I got involved and how I got

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interested. How I got interested was
I was in a public library in Fort

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Worth, Texas when I was in
high school and just cruising through the science

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stacks, and I found a book
that was titled ball lightning, you know.

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So I pulled it out and began
reading. And I'd never heard of

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it, I'd never seen it,
I'd never met anybody who'd seen it.

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But it sounded interesting. And nothing
really happened at the time I except I

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said to myself, someday I'm going
to look into that. Well about forty

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years later, someday happened. Someone
published a paper out of Israel claiming to

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have produced something that might be ball
lightning. And it turns out that the

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equipment they were using was very similar
to some equipment that a colleague of mine

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in Austin had in his lab.
So we put some machinery together to replicate

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their finding and publish, you know, a paper saying, well, it

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has you know, a slight resemblance
to ball lightning, but on the other

357
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hand, there's these other problems.
And that's that that got published, you

358
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know. And so I found that
you could actually publish papers on ball lightning

359
00:28:06.160 --> 00:28:10.359
and respectable journals, and you know, one thing, I do another.

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So it's been about fifteen years ago, and you know, I have tenures,

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so I don't have to worry about
publisher parish necessarily. But I do

362
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like publishing, although what I publish
about is not something that gets a whole

363
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lot of attention, but it's it's
still interesting. Was that equipment in what

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way were they reproducing or potentially reproducing
ball lightning? Well, it was a

365
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high power microwave generator, and they
were doing something that has actually been known

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for many years since World War Two. Microwaves at high power used for like

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radars and stuff, traveled down a
rectangular wave guide. It's basically a rectangular

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pipe, and if the power gets
too high, it can actually arc over.

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You'll have a spark in the waveguide
and the arts travel actually towards the

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source of the power. These people
who were publishing the paper, instead of

371
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having just an art traveling along the
waveguide, they set up a tungsten electrode

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and concentrated the arc in a particular
spot, and they found it. By

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withdrawing the electrode and setting up certain
wave conditions, they could get a little

374
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thing that looked like a tear It
was shaped like a tear drop floating at

375
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the top of the waveguide. But
it was extremely bright. You had to

376
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wear goggles to look at it without
blinding yourself, and it would just kind

377
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of wiggle around and hover, and
it looked almost liquid. And so they

378
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published a paper saying, oh,
is this what ball lightning is? And

379
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so forth. They didn't make any
specific claims that they discovered it, but

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they pointed out strong resemblances of this
phenomenon. Two ball lightning, and we

381
00:29:56.960 --> 00:30:00.519
had the same kind of high power
RF generator or microwavegenerator. So we built

382
00:30:00.559 --> 00:30:04.839
a similar set up to theirs and
managed to duplicate what they were doing.

383
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But the difficulties were that as soon
as you turn off the power, it

384
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goes away within milliseconds and ball lightning. One of the big mysteries about ball

385
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lightning is it seems to have its
own source of energy. People have seen

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it appear inside closed rooms inside aircraft, in addition to appearing outside, where

387
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you could at least imagine it's getting
energy from someplace, and a lot of

388
00:30:30.160 --> 00:30:34.319
the early theories of ball lightning claimed
that it was getting energy from an external

389
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radio frequency field, but nobody has
ever measured such radio frequency field, so

390
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that theory is pretty well disregarded by
now. Whereas it was very obvious where

391
00:30:47.240 --> 00:30:49.559
the power was coming from to make
this object. It was coming from the

392
00:30:49.599 --> 00:30:53.480
generator at the other end of the
wave guy. So we said, you

393
00:30:53.519 --> 00:30:59.279
know, perhaps there are aspects of
this phenomenon that resemble ball lightning, but

394
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it's certainly not the whole show.
It's not the whole explanation. And how

395
00:31:03.599 --> 00:31:08.079
did the term get coined? What
were being observed where that, you know,

396
00:31:08.160 --> 00:31:11.960
created this kind of area of study. You're talking about how did the

397
00:31:12.039 --> 00:31:18.759
term ball lightning get coined? Correct, I actually don't know the origin of

398
00:31:18.839 --> 00:31:27.960
it. Miss suspicion is it began
perhaps as a translation from the German koglle

399
00:31:27.960 --> 00:31:37.319
blitz. I can't pronounce the Russian
equivalent of ball lightning, but there are

400
00:31:37.519 --> 00:31:44.559
and then there's a French term google
Blitz means Google being ball and blitz being

401
00:31:44.640 --> 00:31:48.960
lightning. A German by the name
of Brand published an extensive study of ball

402
00:31:49.039 --> 00:31:56.640
lightning in about nineteen twenty, and
I believe it has been translated into English.

403
00:31:57.119 --> 00:32:00.480
But even if it wasn't, people
in this country wanting to study it

404
00:32:00.480 --> 00:32:06.400
would have read that book and then
they would transliterate the google blitz into the

405
00:32:06.440 --> 00:32:12.519
word ball lightning. I haven't actually
done one of those Google word studies of

406
00:32:12.599 --> 00:32:15.440
you know, finding a frequency of
appearing versus time. That's what actually be

407
00:32:15.480 --> 00:32:22.319
an interesting thing to do. But
I suspect that before about nineteen hundred,

408
00:32:22.599 --> 00:32:29.240
people would refer to balls of fire
that would be seen around thunderstorms and other

409
00:32:29.440 --> 00:32:35.160
and sometimes volcanoes, And that there's
a phrase that goes back even farther than

410
00:32:35.160 --> 00:32:43.519
the term ball lightning. So the
association with lightning was not always prominent,

411
00:32:44.359 --> 00:32:49.519
but as time went on, people
started to notice that these odd, persistent

412
00:32:50.240 --> 00:32:57.319
spheres of light were associated with thunderstorms, and so the term ball lightning began

413
00:32:57.400 --> 00:33:00.880
to be accepted as a term for
these The trouble is, of course,

414
00:33:00.920 --> 00:33:05.799
that we cannot reproduce ball lightning in
the laboratory. We don't have a single

415
00:33:05.880 --> 00:33:12.319
accepted theory as to what it is, and so the term itself is somewhat

416
00:33:12.599 --> 00:33:16.400
I wouldn't say so much as ambivalent. But people see something and they say

417
00:33:16.440 --> 00:33:20.960
it's ball lightning, and it's difficult
sometimes to say whether it is or not.

418
00:33:21.559 --> 00:33:27.440
But there's been enough reports about phenomena
that people call ball lightning, which

419
00:33:27.480 --> 00:33:31.279
have a common set of characteristics,
so that at least I believe that there

420
00:33:31.359 --> 00:33:38.240
is an actual physical phenomenon behind these
multiple sightings. And we can say that

421
00:33:38.279 --> 00:33:44.599
there is probably one, or at
least perhaps more than one phenomenon, but

422
00:33:44.680 --> 00:33:50.000
probably just one phenomenon that's actually ball
lightning. What is the set of characteristics.

423
00:33:51.359 --> 00:33:54.279
Well, one is it's associated with
thunderstorms, not all the time,

424
00:33:54.359 --> 00:34:02.240
but most of the time. The
second characteristic is it persists for at least

425
00:34:02.279 --> 00:34:07.759
a second, possibly up to ten
or twenty or thirty seconds, meaning it

426
00:34:07.839 --> 00:34:14.800
stays more or less the same shape
and brightness during its lifetime. Another characteristic

427
00:34:14.920 --> 00:34:17.400
is it does not seem to rise
like a heated gas would you know.

428
00:34:19.119 --> 00:34:22.159
Flames are a form of plasma,
just ordinary flames coming out of a campfire

429
00:34:22.400 --> 00:34:27.320
or your gas burner on a stove, But because they're hot air, they

430
00:34:27.400 --> 00:34:32.800
rise by convection. Ball lightning does
not often seem to rise by convection.

431
00:34:32.960 --> 00:34:37.960
Sometimes it falls from the sky.
It's been observed to move against the wind.

432
00:34:38.840 --> 00:34:43.559
It typically move when people see it
move. It moves more or less

433
00:34:43.559 --> 00:34:47.280
horizontally at you know, three to
five feet per second, at almost a

434
00:34:47.320 --> 00:34:57.239
walking pace, sometimes higher. But
its motion is unusual compared to any kind

435
00:34:57.280 --> 00:35:01.079
of glowing object that people see,
which is one so they remember it so

436
00:35:01.159 --> 00:35:07.360
easily. It's just like nothing they've
ever seen before. The size is typically

437
00:35:07.480 --> 00:35:10.119
it can be as small as a
baseball, large as a basketball. Grapefruit

438
00:35:10.239 --> 00:35:17.199
is about the average size. The
colors can vary from white. Orange,

439
00:35:17.320 --> 00:35:22.480
yellow, red are the most typical
colors. Occasionally blue, very rarely green,

440
00:35:23.039 --> 00:35:29.119
sometimes multiple colors. It doesn't seem
to have a structure. Most people

441
00:35:29.199 --> 00:35:34.760
can't see inside it, you know, but sometimes sometimes people can and when

442
00:35:36.920 --> 00:35:39.079
at the end of its lifetime or
at the end of when people can see

443
00:35:39.079 --> 00:35:43.760
it, it either goes around a
corner and goes out of sight, or

444
00:35:43.800 --> 00:35:46.440
if it's insight, when it gets
to the end of its lifetime, it

445
00:35:46.440 --> 00:35:52.440
either vanishes or sometimes it explodes,
and when it explodes sometimes it damages things.

446
00:35:53.039 --> 00:35:58.920
Wow. So those those are the
common features of most sightings of ball

447
00:35:59.000 --> 00:36:05.519
lightning that would qualify as quote unquote
genuine sightings. Yeah, I've reviewed a

448
00:36:05.679 --> 00:36:10.400
video from Enigma Labs last week on
the show, and I sent that video

449
00:36:10.440 --> 00:36:15.840
to you, and I'm kind of
excited because it could be about lightning.

450
00:36:15.079 --> 00:36:21.159
It didn't move horizontally, but of
course we need to get more information,

451
00:36:21.360 --> 00:36:25.440
but it might be an example.
Yeah, there are You know, the

452
00:36:25.519 --> 00:36:31.880
distance from which an object is cited
is important. If I'm recalling that video

453
00:36:31.920 --> 00:36:37.519
correctly, it appeared to be an
object that was, you know, hundreds

454
00:36:37.599 --> 00:36:39.800
or thousands of feet away from the
camera, which is okay. I mean,

455
00:36:39.800 --> 00:36:45.920
you can't do more than you can
do. Another question is was somebody

456
00:36:45.000 --> 00:36:50.360
watching the object in addition to recording
the video. I don't know the answer

457
00:36:50.400 --> 00:36:54.480
to that question, because if people
are watching it, they may get from

458
00:36:54.760 --> 00:36:59.679
you know, environmental clues a better
idea of how far the object was away.

459
00:37:00.239 --> 00:37:02.599
But a simple, you know,
two dimensional photograph with a bright spot

460
00:37:02.639 --> 00:37:10.559
on it, you can't immediately tell
the how far away it was. It

461
00:37:10.599 --> 00:37:15.320
could be a great, big object
miles away. It could be I've had

462
00:37:15.360 --> 00:37:22.719
people send me videos of things that
from security cameras that are probably gnats flying

463
00:37:22.760 --> 00:37:25.960
within a few inches of the lens, but it looks like this big,

464
00:37:27.000 --> 00:37:32.280
mysterious blowing orb, you know.
And so without further information, sometimes you

465
00:37:32.400 --> 00:37:38.519
just can't decide where it was exactly
or what it was. But certainly,

466
00:37:39.000 --> 00:37:44.679
you know, the motion and the
brightness are somewhat consistent with ball lightning,

467
00:37:44.719 --> 00:37:49.679
but I wouldn't make any definite conclusions
without getting more information. Have people been

468
00:37:49.760 --> 00:37:52.880
hurt by a ball lightning? Yes, there was a case of a child

469
00:37:53.039 --> 00:37:58.599
sitting in front of a fireplace with
his father and ball lightning came down the

470
00:37:58.639 --> 00:38:01.519
chimney. Back when people use chimneys
a lot, at least in this country,

471
00:38:02.760 --> 00:38:07.679
instances of ball lightning coming down chimneys
were fairly common. It struck the

472
00:38:07.760 --> 00:38:15.239
child, and when the child was
taken to a medical facility, the people

473
00:38:15.280 --> 00:38:22.639
there took photographs of the abdominal area
where this child was struck, and there

474
00:38:22.679 --> 00:38:28.159
were what are called Liechtenberg figures.
It looks like a little lightning bolt itself,

475
00:38:28.199 --> 00:38:36.159
a little branched lines on the skin, which is something that can happen

476
00:38:36.199 --> 00:38:44.199
with conventional lightning, and apparently this
ball lightning also created those Liechtenberg figures.

477
00:38:45.320 --> 00:38:52.679
There are records of people being killed
by ball lightning. A scientist named Richmond

478
00:38:52.800 --> 00:38:58.360
I believe in Russia was killed by
ball lightning or what appeared to be ball

479
00:38:58.440 --> 00:39:02.239
lightning. There's some reports out of
Russia of people being killed by ball lightning.

480
00:39:02.760 --> 00:39:08.199
It's very unusual, but it has
there are records of people being killed

481
00:39:08.239 --> 00:39:12.559
by it. Yeah. My advice
to people who see it is don't stick

482
00:39:12.559 --> 00:39:15.559
your finger in it, you know, get out your phone, get out

483
00:39:15.559 --> 00:39:19.320
your cell phone and take pictures,
but don't stick your finger in it.

484
00:39:20.519 --> 00:39:24.119
Which gets me to the next question, which is they can also be close

485
00:39:24.159 --> 00:39:29.000
to the ground, I guess,
and even inside of buildings. Definitely,

486
00:39:29.079 --> 00:39:31.639
yes, people, We have dozens
of reports. We have a ball lightning

487
00:39:31.800 --> 00:39:37.960
report website and we've collected over eight
hundred raw reports, just the numbers,

488
00:39:37.599 --> 00:39:44.719
many of which are probably genuine ball
lightning, and many of these describe ball

489
00:39:44.760 --> 00:39:51.000
lightning appearing in bedrooms, living rooms, in front of televisions, you know,

490
00:39:51.199 --> 00:39:53.800
showing up along a staircase and going
down the hall and out the front

491
00:39:53.800 --> 00:40:00.239
door. Things like this. They
can move through closed glass windows, which

492
00:40:00.280 --> 00:40:05.920
is pretty remarkable. Wow, from
outside to inside or vice versa. But

493
00:40:07.159 --> 00:40:12.039
you know, that's one of the
most paradoxical features of the object, the

494
00:40:12.119 --> 00:40:17.760
fact that you know, inside a
room or even a metal airplane, ball

495
00:40:17.840 --> 00:40:23.880
lightning has been seen several times inside
metal aircraft. That's the difficulty because metal

496
00:40:23.880 --> 00:40:30.480
typically shields the interior from electromagnetic effects, and that would be one of the

497
00:40:30.559 --> 00:40:36.039
obvious sources of power for ball lightning
is some kind of electromagnetic you know,

498
00:40:36.119 --> 00:40:40.239
electric or magnetic field. But they
don't seem to be bothered by that much,

499
00:40:40.320 --> 00:40:45.199
and they show up wherever they want
to more or less. Wow.

500
00:40:45.719 --> 00:40:50.880
So in those cases where they've gone
through material or even affected people, what

501
00:40:51.000 --> 00:40:54.760
are the kind of things have they
recorded, such as maybe electromagnetic or other

502
00:40:54.840 --> 00:41:01.480
types of effects. Well, there
are not a great many instances of ball

503
00:41:01.559 --> 00:41:10.840
lightning causing electromagnetic effects that had been
registered. One exception is a report by

504
00:41:10.920 --> 00:41:16.440
a qualified scientist named Dimitriev that was
out of Russia. Oh, I think

505
00:41:16.440 --> 00:41:20.280
it was in the fifties or sixties. I don't remember the exact date.

506
00:41:21.239 --> 00:41:27.239
He was camping on a river bank
and had a portable radio with him and

507
00:41:27.280 --> 00:41:32.840
it was playing presumably some local station, and there was a boom, which

508
00:41:32.880 --> 00:41:37.440
is a series a chain of logs
that stretched out into the river, and

509
00:41:37.679 --> 00:41:44.440
he saw ball lightning appear on this
boom and move toward him along the river

510
00:41:44.480 --> 00:41:50.440
bank or toward the river bank.
He noticed that the AM radio I presume

511
00:41:50.480 --> 00:41:54.280
it was an AM radio, was
overcome by static as a ball lightning came

512
00:41:54.320 --> 00:42:00.360
closer. He also had a lot
of other equipment with him, a device

513
00:42:00.440 --> 00:42:07.599
to measure ionizing radiation and a device
to take air samples. The device to

514
00:42:07.719 --> 00:42:15.639
measure ionine using radiation registered a very
high level, and the samples he took

515
00:42:15.800 --> 00:42:22.360
of a kind of a smoke trail
that the ball lightning left indicated elevated levels

516
00:42:22.360 --> 00:42:28.360
of ozone. So he is probably
one of the persons who got the most

517
00:42:28.519 --> 00:42:34.559
objective data on a ball lightning sighting, and other people have seen it interfere

518
00:42:34.599 --> 00:42:37.039
with televisions back when TV's had the
rebbit ears, you know, and the

519
00:42:37.960 --> 00:42:45.800
antenna was basically mounted on top of
the TV. So there is some evidence

520
00:42:45.880 --> 00:42:52.840
that ball lightning produces electromagnetic radiation that
can interfere with radios and televisions. Yeah.

521
00:42:52.920 --> 00:42:59.239
Interesting, And then you know,
it seems doesn't have characteristics you talked

522
00:42:59.239 --> 00:43:06.039
about it moving strangely that people may
ascribe to, you know, it being

523
00:43:06.159 --> 00:43:09.760
having some sort of intelligence or some
kind of method to the madness and how

524
00:43:09.800 --> 00:43:15.039
it's moving. You know, are
there properties like that where it could change

525
00:43:15.079 --> 00:43:22.559
direction? The emotions that people describe
are somewhat erratic. You know, they'll

526
00:43:22.559 --> 00:43:24.960
say it moved around the table and
down the hall like you know, it

527
00:43:25.079 --> 00:43:31.440
was walking. Not many people say
that, you know, a tribute kind

528
00:43:31.440 --> 00:43:37.840
of an intelligent controlling agent behind the
object. We don't see a lot of

529
00:43:38.199 --> 00:43:45.519
people claiming that it does seem to
avoid obstacles. This could possibly be a

530
00:43:45.559 --> 00:43:52.559
purely physical phenomenon, though there's you
know, current air flows or something that

531
00:43:52.599 --> 00:43:58.519
would just make it avoid obstacles.
Sometimes it does land on metal obstacles.

532
00:43:59.760 --> 00:44:06.559
The the reason the reason it moves
is unclear, and I would not venture

533
00:44:06.639 --> 00:44:10.960
to guess what the total net forces
are on it that causes it to move.

534
00:44:12.800 --> 00:44:15.400
It doesn't seem to be much heavier
or lighter than air. Because it

535
00:44:15.480 --> 00:44:17.880
was heavier in air, it would
go down to the ground all the time.

536
00:44:19.519 --> 00:44:21.760
If it was lighter than air,
it would float up all the time.

537
00:44:22.440 --> 00:44:27.000
And it does neither in many cases. So it must have approximately the

538
00:44:27.000 --> 00:44:30.800
same density as air, if that's
an appropriate term to use for it,

539
00:44:30.920 --> 00:44:36.000
you know, And are you aware
of places where it happens more often?

540
00:44:36.519 --> 00:44:42.000
I wish I were. It does. It doesn't seem to favor any place

541
00:44:42.039 --> 00:44:47.679
other than locations where thunderstorms typically occur. Places where there are no thunderstorms are

542
00:44:47.719 --> 00:44:54.920
very few thunderstorms. Also do not
report many ball lightning sightings. But there

543
00:44:54.920 --> 00:44:58.840
aren't any you know, favorite places
it always shows up, you know.

544
00:45:00.360 --> 00:45:06.599
I maybe I may remember one incident
of a of a stove, you know,

545
00:45:06.679 --> 00:45:09.880
with a stovepipe that maybe somebody saw
ball lightning coming out of it two

546
00:45:09.920 --> 00:45:15.800
or three times or something like that. But and there's there's been one or

547
00:45:15.800 --> 00:45:21.360
two reports that we haven't been able
to follow up of people saying that the

548
00:45:21.400 --> 00:45:24.719
thing shows up, you know,
in their hall closet several times, or

549
00:45:24.960 --> 00:45:30.159
you know, on a weekly basis
or something like that. Not quite that

550
00:45:30.239 --> 00:45:36.800
often so there are little isolated possibilities
that you know, the things have shown

551
00:45:36.880 --> 00:45:40.280
up, but we have not been
able to track down any location where you

552
00:45:40.320 --> 00:45:44.480
know, it's it's regular, like
old faithful, and we can just you

553
00:45:44.519 --> 00:45:46.280
know, set our watches and go
watch it the next time it shows up.

554
00:45:46.719 --> 00:45:52.039
It doesn't do anything like that.
The most I can say is a

555
00:45:53.360 --> 00:46:04.400
conditions under which a very large area
or volume highly intense electric field appears seemed

556
00:46:04.440 --> 00:46:09.519
to favor the formation of ball light
There was one famous incident in the city

557
00:46:09.559 --> 00:46:15.480
of neu Ruppin, which was in
East Germany at the time in the nineties.

558
00:46:15.320 --> 00:46:21.760
There was a thunderstorm in the middle
of the winter and an extremely bright

559
00:46:21.880 --> 00:46:27.559
and intense lightning strike outside the town
proper few kilometers outside the town. Within

560
00:46:28.480 --> 00:46:35.599
minutes of that strike, the weather
station began getting dozens of phone calls about

561
00:46:35.599 --> 00:46:39.000
people seeing ball lightning, and a
person wrote a paper about this new Ruppin

562
00:46:39.079 --> 00:46:47.360
incident and counted at least eleven or
twelve almost simultaneo, almost simultaneous appearances of

563
00:46:47.440 --> 00:46:52.079
ball lightning within or near the town
of neu Rope and Germany. So you

564
00:46:52.119 --> 00:46:59.159
know, there was apparently some condition
probably having to do with electric fields They

565
00:46:59.199 --> 00:47:02.280
also saw spots coming out of telephones
and jumping off of fences, and so

566
00:47:02.719 --> 00:47:08.159
there was obviously an intense momentary electric
field over large areas of the town,

567
00:47:09.199 --> 00:47:15.639
and so there were many ball lightning
sightings as well. So you know,

568
00:47:15.760 --> 00:47:21.679
any place that large intense electric fields
happen over large volumes of space seems to

569
00:47:21.719 --> 00:47:24.440
favor the occurrence. But there aren't
any places on Earth that I know of

570
00:47:24.559 --> 00:47:30.440
that just typically have large volumes of
electric fields showing up. So the other

571
00:47:30.519 --> 00:47:38.639
case I would imagine is volcanic eruptions. There have been reports of volcanic eruptions,

572
00:47:38.679 --> 00:47:44.519
like from a ship at sea.
They were actually in the ash field

573
00:47:44.519 --> 00:47:47.519
that was coming down from the volcano
and they were seeing ball lightning all over

574
00:47:47.559 --> 00:47:54.320
the place at their location. But
again, there are often conventional lightning strikes

575
00:47:54.599 --> 00:48:00.840
that occur in conjection in conjunction with
volcanic eruptions, and so that's not surprising

576
00:48:00.920 --> 00:48:05.800
that you'd see ball lightning there as
well. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah,

577
00:48:05.920 --> 00:48:07.599
with those last couple of questions,
one of the places I had in mind

578
00:48:07.679 --> 00:48:15.199
was his place at Hasdelen familiar with
I think, yeah, it's either Norway

579
00:48:15.280 --> 00:48:21.159
or Denmark. Norway? Yeah,
I am not that familiar with the Hestealin

580
00:48:21.639 --> 00:48:28.280
stuff. There's there's a project there
which has been attempting to document something and

581
00:48:28.400 --> 00:48:32.800
the journey. The papers I've seen
out of there have either not been specific

582
00:48:32.920 --> 00:48:39.039
enough or uh, I'm not sure
what's going on there. It's a difficulty

583
00:48:39.119 --> 00:48:45.480
that I have not investigated myself.
Uh. That brings up the topic of

584
00:48:45.519 --> 00:48:51.760
what we are called earth lights though
hesteline is what people call an earth light,

585
00:48:52.360 --> 00:48:57.079
which is a locality where you know, lights that glow for some amount

586
00:48:57.119 --> 00:49:01.159
of time tend to show up.
I spent six weeks in West Texas investigating

587
00:49:01.239 --> 00:49:07.760
something called Marpha lights, which reportedly
are similar to Hestealin lights. They just

588
00:49:07.800 --> 00:49:12.079
show up at random times and move
around, and there may be some connection

589
00:49:12.159 --> 00:49:19.079
between ball lightning and earth lights.
Unfortunately, the information we have on earth

590
00:49:19.159 --> 00:49:27.719
lights is not sufficient to make a
definitive judgment as to whether they have characteristics

591
00:49:27.719 --> 00:49:31.639
of ball lighting or not. The
eyewitness reports differ from ball lightning, and

592
00:49:31.679 --> 00:49:36.639
that the earth lights, at least
the Marpha lights that Colling of Mind research

593
00:49:37.199 --> 00:49:42.440
tended to last a lot longer than
ball lightning typically lasts. The typical ball

594
00:49:42.519 --> 00:49:46.199
lightning site sighting is between five and
ten seconds before it either disappears or goes

595
00:49:46.239 --> 00:49:52.920
out of sight. The earth lights
can last up to minutes, and that's

596
00:49:52.920 --> 00:49:57.360
a significant difference. I don't know
whether it means anything in terms of the

597
00:49:57.360 --> 00:50:04.760
physics or what other than that.
Just the appearance of earth lights, according

598
00:50:04.760 --> 00:50:08.000
to people who have seen them close
up enough to describe them, resembles the

599
00:50:08.000 --> 00:50:12.280
appearance of ball lightning, you know, mm hmm. Yeah, That's what

600
00:50:12.280 --> 00:50:14.960
I was going to ask you about
next, is earthlight. It's very interesting.

601
00:50:15.880 --> 00:50:21.719
So when it comes to earth lights
or or I guess I either I

602
00:50:21.800 --> 00:50:24.719
had seen an experiment, and I
believe this is when I was in Colorado,

603
00:50:24.800 --> 00:50:29.159
and I think it might have been
a school of minds where they had

604
00:50:29.880 --> 00:50:36.760
compressed rock and there was some sort
of plasma that came off of it.

605
00:50:36.800 --> 00:50:42.000
Is that that is experiments which a
guy named Friedaman Freud has done. He's

606
00:50:42.199 --> 00:50:46.159
associated with NASA. It turns out
that certain types of igneous I think the

607
00:50:46.320 --> 00:50:52.440
igneous rocks I don't remember Gabbro I
think is one of the types of rocks.

608
00:50:53.159 --> 00:51:00.599
If they're subjected to sudden stress,
something goes on which creates a large

609
00:51:00.639 --> 00:51:05.800
electric field in the rock. And
they've got photographs of the thing blowing from

610
00:51:05.840 --> 00:51:09.559
the corona that comes off of it. This is a pretty well documented and

611
00:51:09.599 --> 00:51:15.519
reproducible effect. This may be part
of the explanation of what are called earthquake

612
00:51:15.599 --> 00:51:23.199
lights. Numerous people and even photographs
exists of lights generated before, during,

613
00:51:23.239 --> 00:51:29.320
and after certain earthquakes. They can
be lights in the sky, they can

614
00:51:29.360 --> 00:51:34.880
be ball lightning, light glowing objects
on the ground. They can be kind

615
00:51:34.920 --> 00:51:39.760
of a sheet of glowing blue on
the ground, kind of traveling. Even

616
00:51:39.239 --> 00:51:45.320
there was an earthquake in Canada several
years ago that people published about regarding these

617
00:51:45.440 --> 00:51:52.800
earthquake lights. And if you allow
for the possibility that the types of rock

618
00:51:52.920 --> 00:52:00.480
which generate large electric fields are present
in the locations where these earthlights occur,

619
00:52:00.159 --> 00:52:05.880
then it makes sense if there's you
know, stresses caused by earthquakes, or

620
00:52:05.960 --> 00:52:10.000
even without the earthquakes being there,
the stresses can be there. These electric

621
00:52:10.039 --> 00:52:15.800
fields could give rise to phenomena similar
to ball lightning, because, as I've

622
00:52:15.800 --> 00:52:19.880
said, ball lightning tends to show
up when there are high electric fields over

623
00:52:19.920 --> 00:52:25.079
a large volume of space, and
that could occur with these rocks being subjected

624
00:52:25.119 --> 00:52:31.480
to stress that is high enough to
produce electric fields from them. Really interesting

625
00:52:31.519 --> 00:52:36.719
and then, of course, in
the subject they showed you AP what I

626
00:52:36.760 --> 00:52:40.159
find as interesting as you know,
to me, ball lightning would be a

627
00:52:40.159 --> 00:52:45.000
subset. It would be a phenomena
that we haven't explained yet that we're trying

628
00:52:45.039 --> 00:52:50.960
to research. Have you you know, really interface that has there been much

629
00:52:50.960 --> 00:52:55.199
interface in UAP research as far as
you know, and ball lightning research not

630
00:52:55.360 --> 00:53:01.079
to my knowledge. One difficulty I
face is that I want to preserve my

631
00:53:02.920 --> 00:53:07.639
bona fides, if you wish to
call it that as a scientific researcher.

632
00:53:08.679 --> 00:53:16.119
The entire field of what used to
be called UFOs does not enjoy a good

633
00:53:16.159 --> 00:53:22.760
reputation in the science community. Let's
put it that way. In that you

634
00:53:22.800 --> 00:53:28.480
know, if you just write a
paper following all the rules but saying that

635
00:53:28.519 --> 00:53:31.519
you've seen a UFO or UFOs or
this, and that, you're very unlikely

636
00:53:31.559 --> 00:53:37.760
to get it published. So,
in order to remain believable to the types

637
00:53:37.800 --> 00:53:42.639
of people I want to reach,
who are physicists, basically in geophysicists,

638
00:53:43.400 --> 00:53:51.760
I have stayed away from any kind
of publications that smack of unidentified aerial phenomena

639
00:53:52.079 --> 00:53:57.800
or UFOs or things like that.
I try to stick to you very credible

640
00:53:57.800 --> 00:54:01.960
witnesses objective evidence when at all possible. A lot of my papers have been

641
00:54:02.000 --> 00:54:07.760
on laboratory experiments, and you know
that's you know, anybody can reproduce those

642
00:54:07.880 --> 00:54:13.199
as the right equipment, and so
there's no issue there with regard to what

643
00:54:13.360 --> 00:54:15.719
was it. I know exactly what
it was. I built a machine that

644
00:54:15.760 --> 00:54:21.280
did it. You know, this
is not to say that there could be

645
00:54:21.519 --> 00:54:28.159
some fruitful interaction with what you might
call the UAP community, because the average

646
00:54:28.199 --> 00:54:32.239
person seeing ball lightning for the first
time, it is an unidentified aerial phenomenon

647
00:54:32.280 --> 00:54:37.480
to them. They've never seen it
before. Most people these days have never

648
00:54:37.519 --> 00:54:42.679
heard of the phrase ball lightning.
Apparently it was more publicized in the sixties

649
00:54:42.760 --> 00:54:46.280
or seventies, but I talked to
people under thirty, and I'd say nine

650
00:54:46.400 --> 00:54:52.239
or nine point five out of ten
people I ask have never heard of ball

651
00:54:52.320 --> 00:54:58.480
lightning. Wow. So when they
if they see it, they're not going

652
00:54:58.559 --> 00:55:01.760
to know what it is and call
it an unidentified aerial phenomenon if they have

653
00:55:01.840 --> 00:55:06.519
to call it something. So,
you know, if we can get more

654
00:55:06.559 --> 00:55:13.320
information out about what this thing called
ball lightning looks like, we can't quite

655
00:55:13.400 --> 00:55:16.880
say that it's identified in the same
sense that conventional lightning is identified. I

656
00:55:16.880 --> 00:55:21.199
mean, we know a whole lot
about the physics of conventional lightning. We

657
00:55:21.280 --> 00:55:24.400
can generate, you know, imitation
lightning and laboratory all that kind of stuff.

658
00:55:25.079 --> 00:55:29.719
So it's not identified in that sense. Ball lightning isn't, but it

659
00:55:29.840 --> 00:55:36.480
is a recognizable category of observed phenomena
which other people have seen and which appears

660
00:55:36.559 --> 00:55:39.599
to be fairly consistent. So it's
identified, and that we have a name

661
00:55:39.639 --> 00:55:44.519
for it, ball lightning. And
so if you if you say that it,

662
00:55:44.800 --> 00:55:49.039
you know, naming something identifies it, then it's not an identified it's

663
00:55:50.800 --> 00:55:54.360
you know, so it's almost a
semantic question. M M. Well,

664
00:55:54.440 --> 00:55:58.599
knowing so many people don't know about
it makes me even more excited to do

665
00:55:58.639 --> 00:56:02.800
this interview and educate people on what's
going on, because you know, you

666
00:56:02.880 --> 00:56:07.800
have even you hear of stories of
balls of light. Even people ascribe like

667
00:56:08.159 --> 00:56:13.480
paranormal or ghostly kind of answers to
it, but it could be, of

668
00:56:13.559 --> 00:56:16.800
course a natural phenomenon that they're observing. Yeah, and you know, I'm

669
00:56:16.840 --> 00:56:23.679
not logically speaking, and I can't
rule out paranormal or supernatural phenomena. In

670
00:56:23.719 --> 00:56:30.920
fact, a book I was reading
recently actually takes that tact toward unidentified aerial

671
00:56:30.960 --> 00:56:36.920
phenomena. They they went ahead and
claimed it. I just got to the

672
00:56:36.960 --> 00:56:37.960
part of the book where it says, well, I think some of them

673
00:56:38.000 --> 00:56:44.679
are demons. Wow, So you
know, I'm not going to go around

674
00:56:44.679 --> 00:56:51.440
investigating demons. That's that's another department
entirely theology rather than astronomy or physics.

675
00:56:52.320 --> 00:56:57.159
But I'm not going to, you
know, say that I'm not I'm not

676
00:56:57.199 --> 00:57:00.719
going to be so doctrinarious to say
those things are impots. You know,

677
00:57:01.239 --> 00:57:07.400
if you just take the philosophical point
of view and want to base your conclusions

678
00:57:07.440 --> 00:57:14.800
on evidence, then you know,
that's probably the last alternative I'm going to

679
00:57:14.840 --> 00:57:19.159
turn to after I've eliminated absolutely everything
else. But I'm going to turn to

680
00:57:19.519 --> 00:57:24.360
the most familiar, you know,
physical causes first. If we have to

681
00:57:24.360 --> 00:57:28.679
eliminate those, then I will maybe
look at the possibility of ball lightning.

682
00:57:29.199 --> 00:57:31.480
If it can't even be ball lightning, then maybe we can talk about other

683
00:57:31.519 --> 00:57:37.920
things. But there's there's a kind
of a series you work down and and

684
00:57:37.599 --> 00:57:44.400
paranormal and supernal supernatural stuff is kind
of the last alternative that we turn to,

685
00:57:45.679 --> 00:57:49.320
and that that that's outside the realm. Of science. Really, it's

686
00:57:49.360 --> 00:57:53.960
not science as science is currently practiced. M And do you feel like we're

687
00:57:53.960 --> 00:57:57.679
getting closer to answers? Do you
feel like it? You know, this

688
00:57:57.800 --> 00:58:01.159
field is making progress. Well,
a couple of things have happened in the

689
00:58:01.239 --> 00:58:07.320
last decade or so which are encouraging. For one thing, everybody is carrying

690
00:58:07.320 --> 00:58:14.360
around a high quality video camera in
their pocket. And another thing is high

691
00:58:14.440 --> 00:58:22.519
quality video cameras are popping up on
millions of homes and so what you know

692
00:58:22.599 --> 00:58:27.480
in nineteen fifty would have cost Untold
billions of dollars to do, namely,

693
00:58:27.519 --> 00:58:32.960
put video recorders on every street corner
has happened. Now the question is can

694
00:58:34.000 --> 00:58:37.039
we look at you know, can
we look through what they are recording and

695
00:58:37.119 --> 00:58:43.159
find what we're looking for? That's
the next challenge. It turns out that

696
00:58:43.239 --> 00:58:46.000
the lifetime of typical ball lighting is
just about the amount of time it takes

697
00:58:46.000 --> 00:58:51.079
to take out your phone and push
the camera and get it going. You

698
00:58:51.119 --> 00:58:55.639
know, we haven't yet, I
haven't, at least on our report website,

699
00:58:57.119 --> 00:59:02.159
encountered anyone who has successfully Well,
I won't say that I haven't encountered

700
00:59:02.239 --> 00:59:07.760
anyone. There have not been a
lot of encounters with very close objects that

701
00:59:07.800 --> 00:59:13.480
have been filmed by you know,
someone's cell phone camera. There have been

702
00:59:13.800 --> 00:59:16.039
a lot of people shooting stuff with
their cell phone cameras that they didn't know

703
00:59:16.079 --> 00:59:21.199
what it was, but it's typically
far enough away that we can't tell what

704
00:59:21.239 --> 00:59:25.119
it is either. There is one
exception with regard to a security camera.

705
00:59:25.519 --> 00:59:32.679
I'm currently working on a paper which
has some security camera footage of an object

706
00:59:32.679 --> 00:59:36.840
that was about forty feet away from
the camera, and there are lots of

707
00:59:36.880 --> 00:59:40.480
details, and so I won't say
anything more about that because it's in process

708
00:59:40.559 --> 00:59:46.920
now. But you know, I
think other recordings like that are going to

709
00:59:46.960 --> 00:59:52.119
come to light as we just have
more stuff out there and more people become

710
00:59:52.159 --> 00:59:57.280
aware of what could be ball lightning
and they can send, you know,

711
00:59:57.360 --> 01:00:01.159
reports to our ball lightning report website
or to you or to other things.

712
01:00:01.360 --> 01:00:07.119
And I think that's an encouraging development, simply that there's a lot of equipment

713
01:00:07.159 --> 01:00:14.920
out there capable of generating data that
may be usable. It's not ideal.

714
01:00:15.000 --> 01:00:19.920
We don't have networks that are set
up with spectrometers and other instruments to get

715
01:00:20.000 --> 01:00:23.199
more you know, simultaneous data,
images and other interesting things. We'd like

716
01:00:23.280 --> 01:00:29.599
to do a colleague of mine and
myself have proposed to the Air Force to

717
01:00:29.639 --> 01:00:34.039
do just that actually, but you
know, it's a start, and so

718
01:00:34.800 --> 01:00:39.880
just citizen science raising awareness of ball
lightning and other things and having people look

719
01:00:39.920 --> 01:00:45.760
at their cell phone videos and security
videos and if it looks interesting send it

720
01:00:45.800 --> 01:00:49.639
to somebody who could use it.
That would be great. Well, I'm

721
01:00:49.760 --> 01:00:52.960
really excited about your work. I've
always been really interested in this topic since

722
01:00:53.000 --> 01:00:57.800
I came across it, especially because
you know, it's one of the answers.

723
01:00:57.840 --> 01:01:00.400
It could be a big answer to
the type of thing where looking at

724
01:01:00.400 --> 01:01:04.639
when we're looking for UAP, and
it's something that to me seems like some

725
01:01:04.679 --> 01:01:07.719
low hanging fruit when it comes to
actual scientific discovery related to this sort of

726
01:01:07.719 --> 01:01:14.480
work. So I'm excited to gathering
more data and hopefully being around when when

727
01:01:14.480 --> 01:01:17.280
you when you figure it out.
Well, if I don't figure it out,

728
01:01:17.280 --> 01:01:20.679
somebody's gonna figure it out. But
right, you know, we we

729
01:01:21.039 --> 01:01:24.000
can, we'll we'll progress comes kind
of when it feels like it, but

730
01:01:24.119 --> 01:01:28.280
you know, we can do everything
we can to encourage it. You know.

731
01:01:29.480 --> 01:01:31.599
Well, thank you so much for
coming on. You know, hope

732
01:01:31.599 --> 01:01:35.800
to interface with you more, maybe
hopefully it gets you some great videos and

733
01:01:35.840 --> 01:01:38.719
some data and information to help your
work. But thank you so much for

734
01:01:38.800 --> 01:01:42.920
coming on and sharing this information.
Well, thank you. I enjoyed it.

735
01:01:45.360 --> 01:01:50.920
Thank you so much. To Carl. I personally get really excited with

736
01:01:50.960 --> 01:01:55.400
the ball lightning stuff just because I
think that, you know, this is

737
01:01:55.400 --> 01:01:59.440
an area where we can really make
some progress. This is an area where

738
01:02:00.039 --> 01:02:05.440
maybe we can help discover something about
ball lightning and prove that the study of

739
01:02:05.519 --> 01:02:10.159
UAP can help with science and scientific
discovery. And that's what makes me so

740
01:02:10.280 --> 01:02:16.159
excited. Not only that for any
long time UAP researcher, you know,

741
01:02:16.199 --> 01:02:22.159
people don't understand why we get so
excited about debunking things. And the reason

742
01:02:22.239 --> 01:02:25.119
why is it's good to roll things
out. Let's role out what is not

743
01:02:25.400 --> 01:02:30.639
mysterious so we can focus on what
is mysterious, because the mysterious objects are

744
01:02:30.639 --> 01:02:36.159
the ones where we can grab data
and figure more out about them and potentially

745
01:02:36.239 --> 01:02:40.039
discover something really novel, really different
and weird, something that hasn't been discovered

746
01:02:40.039 --> 01:02:44.159
before. And if we can figure
out the nature of ball lightning, then

747
01:02:44.199 --> 01:02:47.079
we'll be able to be able to
figure out you know, what UAP out

748
01:02:47.119 --> 01:02:52.280
there are ball lightning and what out
there is something more mysterious and strange.

749
01:02:52.280 --> 01:02:54.840
And you heard those characteristics that he
gave when it came to ball lightning.

750
01:02:54.880 --> 01:03:00.920
So that's something important to consider as
we're investigating UAP cases. Speaking of which,

751
01:03:01.039 --> 01:03:07.960
let's look at a couple of UAP
cases in today's Enigma Sightings of the

752
01:03:07.000 --> 01:03:15.920
Week. We have partnered with Enigma
Labs to bring you interesting UAP cases weekly

753
01:03:15.039 --> 01:03:20.239
that they collect via their app and
website. If you have a report to

754
01:03:20.280 --> 01:03:23.159
submit, you can download the app
at the Apple App Store or submit it

755
01:03:23.280 --> 01:03:29.679
via the website at Enigma labs dot
io. In the interest of full disclosure,

756
01:03:29.800 --> 01:03:32.320
I am a pay consultant for Enigma, and that's how I can keep

757
01:03:32.440 --> 01:03:37.400
up to date with the best videos
that come to light. In fact,

758
01:03:37.440 --> 01:03:39.639
I look at them daily to find
the good ones. And I've got a

759
01:03:39.679 --> 01:03:44.519
lot of good ones that we're working
on, and I'm getting to researchers and

760
01:03:44.559 --> 01:03:47.880
we're looking at more closely to figure
them out. Girl Stephan will be looking

761
01:03:49.000 --> 01:03:52.800
at the video and hopefully we can
get a hold of the witness and do

762
01:03:52.840 --> 01:03:58.280
some more evaluation on that one.
But we have other exciting ones, including

763
01:03:58.679 --> 01:04:01.519
one of the videos I want to
show you today that I'm super excited about.

764
01:04:01.760 --> 01:04:05.039
But first, one of the things
I think you can be really excited

765
01:04:05.079 --> 01:04:09.400
about is that you're getting a preview
on some of the sightings that are kind

766
01:04:09.440 --> 01:04:14.159
of getting on the internet and making
news on my show before they get out

767
01:04:14.159 --> 01:04:16.119
there. So, for instance,
the New York siding, I was talking

768
01:04:16.159 --> 01:04:20.000
about that one quite a bit before
it got out there in the news and

769
01:04:20.079 --> 01:04:26.960
made quite a buzz, and we
have some more information on that one,

770
01:04:27.360 --> 01:04:31.199
so we did do some investigation.
We had a Twitter spaces like I talked

771
01:04:31.199 --> 01:04:35.320
about last week. Hopefully some of
you were able to join that. I'll

772
01:04:35.320 --> 01:04:41.119
put the link below, But we
invited a scientist, doctor Doug Butner,

773
01:04:41.239 --> 01:04:45.440
who has a PhD in aerospace engineering. He's done a lot of work with

774
01:04:45.480 --> 01:04:49.119
the Pentagon and otherwise. Of course, we also had on researcher Ben Hansen.

775
01:04:49.519 --> 01:04:54.159
Now, when I first saw this
video, I thought, you know

776
01:04:54.239 --> 01:04:57.960
what, that looks like a balloon
to me, in particular, I thought

777
01:04:58.000 --> 01:05:01.880
perhaps it was a solar balloon.
Now Ben Hansen had looked at it and

778
01:05:01.920 --> 01:05:06.559
said he didn't think so, because
he has actually done some experiments with solar

779
01:05:06.599 --> 01:05:12.840
balloons, and solar balloons are essentially
long trash bags that you fill with air.

780
01:05:13.239 --> 01:05:15.000
They're black, so when the sun
hits it, the heat from the

781
01:05:15.039 --> 01:05:19.039
sun makes the air inside of it
more hot, and so it begins to

782
01:05:19.079 --> 01:05:23.559
float because of hotter air, of
course is lighter than cooler air, so

783
01:05:23.599 --> 01:05:29.079
it's going to float. That's the
case with these. However, they're very

784
01:05:29.119 --> 01:05:34.840
flimsy, and Ben had estimated the
wind at the altitude of this object that

785
01:05:35.039 --> 01:05:41.119
was seen over New York out of
this aircraft. Because of the winds we're

786
01:05:41.159 --> 01:05:45.000
at thirty miles per hour, it
probably would have made that solar balloon collapse.

787
01:05:45.039 --> 01:05:47.400
It can't float in that big of
wind, so that was kind of

788
01:05:47.480 --> 01:05:51.199
ruled out. So what could it
have been? Some people said it looked

789
01:05:51.280 --> 01:05:55.599
like a giant rumba lying in the
sky, and if you look at this

790
01:05:55.679 --> 01:05:58.599
picture, it kind of does.
In fact, we'll look at the video

791
01:05:58.679 --> 01:06:02.800
here a little bit upper in the
upper right boom, you see it there

792
01:06:02.880 --> 01:06:08.079
just very quickly go by. Was
it moving, was it not moving?

793
01:06:08.239 --> 01:06:11.960
How big could it be? So
we did some estimates. Now some online

794
01:06:12.000 --> 01:06:15.559
people did some estimates as well,
and people are thinking, well, it's

795
01:06:15.599 --> 01:06:19.400
probably not that far from the aircraft. It's probably moving around two one hundred

796
01:06:19.400 --> 01:06:27.639
and fifty miles per hour relative to
the person taking the image, and if

797
01:06:27.760 --> 01:06:30.760
it is not too far away from
the aircraft, let's say fifty sixty feet,

798
01:06:30.800 --> 01:06:34.800
then it is about the size of
a regular party balloon. And in

799
01:06:34.920 --> 01:06:40.760
fact, I argue one researcher said
it looked like maybe one that was a

800
01:06:40.920 --> 01:06:44.159
shape like a seven. I don't
think so. I think this is a

801
01:06:44.199 --> 01:06:46.880
soft edge that we see here,
not a hard edge like a seven would

802
01:06:46.880 --> 01:06:51.480
be. But doctor Buttner, who
we had on our Twitter spaces with us,

803
01:06:51.880 --> 01:06:56.840
he says he thinks it's a zero
shaped balloon, and I think he's

804
01:06:56.920 --> 01:06:59.960
probably right, So this one probably
does turn out to be a blue.

805
01:07:00.519 --> 01:07:02.719
Now you're probably saying a balloon going
at two hundred and fifty miles per hour,

806
01:07:03.239 --> 01:07:06.840
that is the speed relative to the
person taking the picture, and they're

807
01:07:06.880 --> 01:07:13.760
able to determine that. The speed
is determined by how quickly it moves through

808
01:07:13.840 --> 01:07:17.079
the screen and also how many frames
that the image is caught in, because

809
01:07:17.079 --> 01:07:21.079
there is a certain amount of frames
per second that these videos take. By

810
01:07:21.119 --> 01:07:26.000
measuring those things, you can determine, you know, its speed at different

811
01:07:26.039 --> 01:07:30.039
distances, and if it was I'd
say about sixty feet and it would be

812
01:07:30.079 --> 01:07:34.400
traveling at about two hundred and fifty
miles per hour as relative to the person

813
01:07:34.480 --> 01:07:39.320
taking the photo. So in other
words, it could have been perfectly still.

814
01:07:39.360 --> 01:07:42.840
But the aircraft is moving at about
two hundred and forty miles per hour.

815
01:07:43.119 --> 01:07:45.239
So the object then maybe is moving
at ten miles per hour in the

816
01:07:45.280 --> 01:07:48.400
wind, or if it's moving at
thirty miles per hour, it's still within

817
01:07:48.480 --> 01:07:54.159
the range of that speed being you
know, a combination of its speed and

818
01:07:54.199 --> 01:07:59.559
the aircraft speed. So that really
fits. And like I said earlier,

819
01:07:59.719 --> 01:08:01.360
is kind of a case of also, can we rule that out. Can

820
01:08:01.400 --> 01:08:05.079
we say it definitely wasn't a balloon? We can't, and it really does

821
01:08:05.159 --> 01:08:10.039
fit closely. Now there are going
to be some exercises to try to mirror

822
01:08:10.079 --> 01:08:14.559
this. Some people have already done
it online. I think Ben Hansen wants

823
01:08:14.599 --> 01:08:17.479
to do something like that. To
me, I think case closed. I

824
01:08:17.479 --> 01:08:21.520
mean, other people have already done
it and shown that it can look very

825
01:08:21.560 --> 01:08:26.239
similar. I don't think we need
to repeat that. To me. I

826
01:08:26.239 --> 01:08:29.640
think the work's been done. And
when it comes down to, like I

827
01:08:29.720 --> 01:08:32.479
learned from doctor Bruce mcabee, if
you can't prove that it's not a balloon,

828
01:08:32.680 --> 01:08:36.319
then you really don't have much more
to work with here. Still a

829
01:08:36.359 --> 01:08:44.119
really good case and a very compelling
video. So very thankful to Michelle Reyes,

830
01:08:44.279 --> 01:08:47.079
the witness, who is able to
share this with us. Great catch.

831
01:08:47.359 --> 01:08:50.800
We just got to keep examining these
because that's kind of the name of

832
01:08:50.800 --> 01:08:56.560
the game. It's a numbers game. We don't have very many videos that

833
01:08:56.600 --> 01:09:01.279
are definitively un identified, you know. So the more of these at we

834
01:09:01.359 --> 01:09:05.279
get, the more we learn and
the more we can prove something unusual is

835
01:09:05.319 --> 01:09:11.359
going on. That's what's so exciting
about Enigma and people sharing their videos is

836
01:09:11.399 --> 01:09:15.399
that it's better data. It's more
data, and that's what we need.

837
01:09:15.920 --> 01:09:20.399
Speaking of good and better data,
this is a video that I'm really excited

838
01:09:20.479 --> 01:09:28.039
about. So this video was taken
near Signal Mountain in Tennessee on September thirtieth,

839
01:09:28.600 --> 01:09:32.640
twenty twenty three. And I've got
to say Dustin from Utah movef On

840
01:09:32.840 --> 01:09:35.840
is the one who pointed this one
out to me, and it is a

841
01:09:35.880 --> 01:09:40.199
really good one. And I'll make
this full screen so you can see it

842
01:09:40.439 --> 01:09:42.880
now. It's a ten minute video. We're not going to look at all

843
01:09:43.079 --> 01:09:46.880
of the video, but i'll go
over the highlights here for you. Let's

844
01:09:46.920 --> 01:09:51.199
go ahead and start at the beginning. So it's a great video. First,

845
01:09:51.720 --> 01:09:56.920
nothing happens for about a minute and
forty seconds, but if you go

846
01:09:57.079 --> 01:10:02.079
forward, let's go forward a bit
here, so at about a minute and

847
01:10:02.279 --> 01:10:06.399
forty seconds you'll see an object.
Right now, you just see stars.

848
01:10:06.560 --> 01:10:12.039
These are just stars. But at
a minute forty you'll see an object coming

849
01:10:12.039 --> 01:10:15.960
in from the bottom right, moving
towards the center. Here it comes.

850
01:10:16.600 --> 01:10:19.600
It's from the bottom right, moving
to the left, and then it moves

851
01:10:19.840 --> 01:10:26.399
and starts going up. So not
a satellite, a very weird movement.

852
01:10:26.479 --> 01:10:30.720
It's also very slow, so not
a bug. A bug would be moving

853
01:10:30.760 --> 01:10:39.880
pretty quickly. But it moves up
and stops, stops just for a second,

854
01:10:40.399 --> 01:10:45.520
and then moves up again again.
Something stopping and hovering. A drone.

855
01:10:45.920 --> 01:10:48.000
But look, it looks just like
the stars in the video, so

856
01:10:48.239 --> 01:10:53.960
really weird. This is weird too. So it keeps moving up slowly,

857
01:10:54.039 --> 01:11:04.720
kind of slowly, kind of going
up, and then it stops and it

858
01:11:04.840 --> 01:11:09.079
stops for about a couple minutes.
For a couple minutes, it just sits

859
01:11:09.159 --> 01:11:13.960
perfectly still here. What I love
about this is that it fits in with

860
01:11:14.039 --> 01:11:17.239
the stars. It looks exactly like
any of the other stars up there,

861
01:11:17.560 --> 01:11:23.640
and it's just sitting there very still. So I'm going to fast forward this

862
01:11:23.680 --> 01:11:28.840
because it sits for about two and
a half minutes just perfectly still there.

863
01:11:29.399 --> 01:11:34.000
Then about five minutes into the video, in just a few seconds here we'll

864
01:11:34.039 --> 01:11:40.039
see it start to move again.
So fascinating that it just sits perfectly still

865
01:11:40.039 --> 01:11:43.680
there. It does seem a little
bit dimmer than before, but here we

866
01:11:43.720 --> 01:11:50.680
go. There you go starts moving
again slowly across the screen to the left.

867
01:11:50.920 --> 01:11:55.960
And just for people who know this
looks like a camera that is on

868
01:11:56.159 --> 01:12:00.000
somebody's roof. It is a sort
of kind of security camera. We are

869
01:12:00.000 --> 01:12:05.479
in contact with the witness. The
camera is looking up at the sky in

870
01:12:05.560 --> 01:12:11.359
between a couple trees. You just
see stars and then this object. Now,

871
01:12:11.640 --> 01:12:15.520
this object is kind of more quickly
moving through the screen from the right

872
01:12:15.720 --> 01:12:20.840
to the left. It's not going
in a straight line. And then at

873
01:12:20.880 --> 01:12:27.640
about this point it turns around and
then it goes back. Now we're about

874
01:12:27.680 --> 01:12:30.479
five and a half minutes into the
video. Now it is traveling in a

875
01:12:30.560 --> 01:12:38.960
straight line back the way it came
from. So it's moving fairly quickly.

876
01:12:39.439 --> 01:12:43.479
Now it's getting really close to the
spot where it hovered for a couple minutes.

877
01:12:43.880 --> 01:12:48.319
It's kind of moving downward a little
bit, so it's changing direction once

878
01:12:48.399 --> 01:12:56.439
again, just kind of quickly moving
and then leaves the screen to the right.

879
01:12:57.279 --> 01:13:03.199
How weird is that. This is
a really strange video. The period

880
01:13:03.239 --> 01:13:05.920
of time where it just sits there. I kind of want to go back

881
01:13:05.960 --> 01:13:13.199
to that here it is where it
just kind of sits there for a couple

882
01:13:13.239 --> 01:13:17.239
of minutes, completely still, and
then moves off again. This is a

883
01:13:17.279 --> 01:13:21.479
really weird video. It's one solid
light that looks like a star that is

884
01:13:21.560 --> 01:13:25.600
moving. Now when it moves around
on a screen, you do you see

885
01:13:25.720 --> 01:13:30.199
kind of a trail, but that
is likely an effect from the camera because

886
01:13:30.199 --> 01:13:33.800
it's kind of a it's a you
know, it's using the night vision and

887
01:13:35.159 --> 01:13:39.640
so anything that will move through the
screen will kind of leave a tale like

888
01:13:39.680 --> 01:13:43.119
that. We're going to do more
analysis on this. In fact, we

889
01:13:43.359 --> 01:13:47.279
are getting more videos from this camera
to show like how it reacts to maybe

890
01:13:47.319 --> 01:13:51.239
a satellite or other things, to
see what those look like as opposed to

891
01:13:51.279 --> 01:13:56.439
this object. We're getting information on
the direction, you know, trying to

892
01:13:56.439 --> 01:14:00.279
figure out elevations, all of this
kind of stuff. So we'll be doing

893
01:14:00.279 --> 01:14:03.960
an analysis on this. Ben Hansen
is helping me out with that. We'll

894
01:14:03.960 --> 01:14:12.239
probably get Doug involved with this again, but really really interesting case. I'll

895
01:14:12.239 --> 01:14:15.560
post this in the show notes for
you guys to watch it if you're listening,

896
01:14:15.119 --> 01:14:19.119
and if anybody has any ideas on
what this is, let us know,

897
01:14:19.279 --> 01:14:23.840
because this is such a weird one. I really don't know what the

898
01:14:23.880 --> 01:14:28.600
heck this is. This is an
exciting one for me, so weird,

899
01:14:29.199 --> 01:14:33.039
and I've got more. So keep
tuning into the show, and don't get

900
01:14:33.039 --> 01:14:36.479
disappointed if we figure out what this
one is. And I doubt it,

901
01:14:36.520 --> 01:14:42.079
I really a this is one that
I think it's going to go down as

902
01:14:42.239 --> 01:14:45.640
unidentified. But let's say we do
figure it out, like we figured out

903
01:14:45.760 --> 01:14:48.680
New York. That's okay, because
there's more out there. We're getting more

904
01:14:48.800 --> 01:14:54.399
and more videos every day, so
there's more and more videos like this to

905
01:14:54.560 --> 01:14:59.319
look at every day. So keep
an eye on the Enigma Lab social media,

906
01:15:00.159 --> 01:15:02.399
keep an eye on my social media
because I'm sharing these good ones.

907
01:15:02.680 --> 01:15:05.399
And if you've got the app,
and I really implore you to have it,

908
01:15:05.840 --> 01:15:10.399
be sure to check that content feed
and when you open up the app,

909
01:15:10.439 --> 01:15:14.800
that'll be the first button on the
left, and it's just videos.

910
01:15:14.800 --> 01:15:17.319
We're going to be putting more stuff
in there, but it's just good videos

911
01:15:17.560 --> 01:15:23.800
that I found that I'm posting there
that are either really mysterious or cool looking.

912
01:15:23.880 --> 01:15:25.880
We know what they are, but
they look really cool. So for

913
01:15:25.920 --> 01:15:32.920
instance, you might find some starlink
or some rockets or some fireballs like we've

914
01:15:32.920 --> 01:15:36.399
seen in the news lately in there, but they're just really cool looking.

915
01:15:36.520 --> 01:15:44.840
But what a cool and mysterious video
that is. Well, thank you too,

916
01:15:45.039 --> 01:15:48.000
Carl Stefan, and thank you to
all of you for tuning in once

917
01:15:48.239 --> 01:15:51.079
again, o cape an eye on
the show notes for links to all of

918
01:15:51.119 --> 01:15:56.039
the news and the items that we
talked about. And again I just want

919
01:15:56.079 --> 01:16:00.439
to emphasize that we don't have to
chase the government for information. We certainly

920
01:16:00.479 --> 01:16:04.960
don't have to get conspiratorial in order
to just start gathering data and analyzing data

921
01:16:04.960 --> 01:16:10.760
on our own as citizens, scientists, as people out in the public,

922
01:16:10.800 --> 01:16:15.319
public citizens interested in this topic.
We can gather a lot of data and

923
01:16:15.359 --> 01:16:18.720
we have a lot of our own
ability to do our own analysis and research

924
01:16:19.000 --> 01:16:24.399
and to bring to some of this
mysterious information, so thank you so much

925
01:16:24.439 --> 01:16:27.399
for joining, and we'll catch you
next time.