1 00:00:01,679 --> 00:00:11,080 The paranormal Ufoss Mysteries. You're listening to Talking Weird and Know from a Kevin 2 00:00:11,160 --> 00:00:42,600 deep in the Northwoods. Your host, Doctor Dean Bertram. Wow, good 3 00:00:42,719 --> 00:00:46,799 evening to all my fellow weirdos and weirdows, all of us in the United 4 00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:52,240 States. I hope everybody's having a wonderful labor day long week end. I'm 5 00:00:52,240 --> 00:00:57,439 your host, Dean Bertram, here on Talking Weird for the Untold Radio Network. 6 00:00:57,679 --> 00:00:59,960 I had a wonderful day to day. I think most of you who 7 00:01:00,079 --> 00:01:03,119 listened to the show are probably conscious and maybe sick of me talking about the 8 00:01:03,119 --> 00:01:07,799 documentary I'm making about Ray Palmer Shaver Mystery and the birth of the idea of 9 00:01:07,920 --> 00:01:10,799 flying sources, called the man who invented flank sources. And to day, 10 00:01:10,840 --> 00:01:15,159 I spent a wonderful afternoon with Ray Palmer's son, also called Ray Palmer Raymond 11 00:01:15,200 --> 00:01:19,560 B. Palmer instead of Raymond A. Palmer, and I got to see 12 00:01:19,599 --> 00:01:26,040 all manner of marvelous Shaver and Palmer historical objects. I'd almost call them relics, 13 00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:30,560 including and I was almost stunned when I got to hold it some of 14 00:01:30,560 --> 00:01:38,120 the original Maury Island's debris from the famous Maury Island incident which Fred Chrisman sent 15 00:01:38,719 --> 00:01:42,200 Ray Palmer all the way back in nineteen forty seven, and the incident which 16 00:01:42,239 --> 00:01:49,400 supposedly predated Kenneth Arnold's siding, which Kenneth Arnold himself investigated under the employment of 17 00:01:49,640 --> 00:01:53,799 Raymond Palmer. So it was a wonderful afternoon, and I'll be keeping you 18 00:01:53,879 --> 00:01:59,000 posted on how the documentary travels. Tonight's guest is involved with the documentary a 19 00:01:59,079 --> 00:02:01,239 little bit, actually, and he's on the show before. He was born 20 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:06,719 and raised in the Cascade Mountains, and he hails from a family of storytellers, 21 00:02:06,840 --> 00:02:09,599 artists, and musicians. He and his wife Laura have spent years collecting 22 00:02:09,599 --> 00:02:15,159 folk tales and legends of the Pacific Northwest and beyond, and having listened to 23 00:02:15,199 --> 00:02:21,560 countless family stories regarding UFOs, bigfoot, strange supernatural beings, ghost towns, 24 00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:27,240 logging camps, railroaders, and bootleggers. He brings authentic, firsthand and oral 25 00:02:27,319 --> 00:02:30,599 histories for all ages and diverse audiences. With his wife, he wrote the 26 00:02:30,639 --> 00:02:35,840 twenty nineteen book The odd Man Up. He's also an incredibly talented musician, 27 00:02:36,759 --> 00:02:39,680 and I'm fortunate enough to have an amazing song of his in the documentary called 28 00:02:39,680 --> 00:02:44,439 Wizard Island and it's actually about the Darrow and the Tero and the rest of 29 00:02:44,479 --> 00:02:49,159 the Shaver mystery, which is just fantastic. Anyway, I could talk about 30 00:02:49,159 --> 00:02:51,800 that all night, and maybe I will talk with him a little bit about 31 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:53,479 it. But I'm delighted to welcome back to the show, The One, 32 00:02:53,680 --> 00:03:00,479 the Only, Bob ants Hone. Hello, everybody, so good to have 33 00:03:00,560 --> 00:03:05,120 you back. Bob, Thank you so much. Man, your theme is 34 00:03:05,159 --> 00:03:07,280 pretty jam in there. Who wrote that theme song? It's pretty cool, 35 00:03:07,599 --> 00:03:10,919 I be honest, I don't know, but I know Doug Hicheck put the 36 00:03:12,000 --> 00:03:15,680 video and the opener and all the audio and music together. Who's the founder 37 00:03:15,719 --> 00:03:19,520 and boss of the network, So he chose it, and I was happy 38 00:03:19,520 --> 00:03:21,520 with it when he did. When he made I was like, that's cool. 39 00:03:22,919 --> 00:03:25,840 So yeah, I'm glad you appreciate because your song Wizard Ireland people. 40 00:03:25,840 --> 00:03:30,800 How do people find your YouTube channel, by the way, which has songs 41 00:03:30,840 --> 00:03:34,439 and oh yeah, folk tale stuff on there as well. I believe unless 42 00:03:34,439 --> 00:03:36,439 there are separate channels. I know you've got a music channel. I'm not 43 00:03:36,520 --> 00:03:39,879 sure if that's the same as your one with the investigations and things. Yeah, 44 00:03:39,960 --> 00:03:46,199 so we have a band called Tinkham Road. Tinkham Road is one thing 45 00:03:46,199 --> 00:03:47,800 you can find on YouTube. You can also find Spotify, you can find 46 00:03:47,919 --> 00:03:53,479 on iTunes, but I also have just under my name Bob Antonia, I 47 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:55,719 have a music channel on YouTube, So if you're interested in seeing my solo 48 00:03:55,840 --> 00:04:00,639 music and some group performances and collaborations, you can on there. Oh excellent. 49 00:04:00,639 --> 00:04:04,280 I just like to say thank you to one of my favorite audience members, 50 00:04:04,400 --> 00:04:08,800 Nancy Malcolm, who's also a right the Superstick. Thank you so much 51 00:04:08,840 --> 00:04:12,479 for that, Nancy, it's very much appreciate it. Now, last time 52 00:04:12,479 --> 00:04:15,360 you're on the show, Bob, you talked about kind of obscure cryptids and 53 00:04:15,399 --> 00:04:19,199 I know how much how audience loved that. And today you're kind of coming 54 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:23,160 back, not this time to talk so much about cryptos, but just strange 55 00:04:23,720 --> 00:04:25,920 and you were telling me about some of them. I never heard about them 56 00:04:25,959 --> 00:04:29,160 before the show, So I guess in some ways obscure or unsolved mysteries. 57 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:33,120 Yeah. I grew up with the Unsolved Mysteries TV show, Love that show, 58 00:04:33,199 --> 00:04:35,560 Fall asleep of that show. Even to this day we turn it on 59 00:04:35,639 --> 00:04:39,879 and oh god, you can't I can't go wrong with that. So I 60 00:04:40,160 --> 00:04:45,519 compiled. We compiled a list of my favorite unsolved mysteries. Now some of 61 00:04:45,560 --> 00:04:48,959 these are local from our Seattle area and our neighborhood, our community here, 62 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:53,399 but then some are international. I wanted to kind of do fifty fifty, 63 00:04:54,160 --> 00:04:57,639 so I'll just start right at the top. This is a story from right 64 00:04:57,639 --> 00:05:01,879 here in our community. Now, recently, on August fifteenth, there were 65 00:05:01,879 --> 00:05:06,560 two people that went missing on the same day. Now not only two people, 66 00:05:06,600 --> 00:05:11,759 but when we talked to law enforcement, they said thirty two people went 67 00:05:11,839 --> 00:05:15,759 missing on the same day, August fifteenth, twenty twenty three. That is 68 00:05:15,759 --> 00:05:20,800 this mind blowing. So out of the thirty two, we went searching for 69 00:05:20,920 --> 00:05:26,600 two of them. And so you know, immediately everybody in the community is 70 00:05:26,639 --> 00:05:30,319 thinking, oh, serial killer. What are these two disappearances connected. You 71 00:05:30,319 --> 00:05:34,120 know, everybody has their wheels moving, They're thinking, what is going on 72 00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:40,839 here? We helped We helped the family of the first missing person. He 73 00:05:40,959 --> 00:05:44,720 was a sixty year old male. His name was Steve. And I know 74 00:05:44,759 --> 00:05:46,959 their family. We know their family very well. They're connected to our parish, 75 00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:51,240 our Lady of Sorry Sorrow's Catholic Church. So we helped in the search 76 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:57,519 for Steve. Now, what's interesting about this is both of them were found 77 00:05:57,519 --> 00:06:01,120 deceased, and without going into too much detail, I will say there is 78 00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:05,759 no serial killer that we know of. They were both natural causes, accidental 79 00:06:06,160 --> 00:06:13,240 causes of death, some very unfortunate causes. But Steve, this gentleman that 80 00:06:13,279 --> 00:06:16,600 we first started to search for, he was a witness in a very famous 81 00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:23,079 incident. Their family lives in a place called Circle River. Now in Circle 82 00:06:23,199 --> 00:06:29,160 River, they would look out the window on their front lawn and occasionally they 83 00:06:29,199 --> 00:06:33,879 would see this black shadow figure of this person kind of hunched over, kind 84 00:06:33,879 --> 00:06:38,680 of with a hoodie on, with like a Duffel bag, walking across the 85 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:43,040 front lawn. And then at some point this figure would just vanish, so 86 00:06:43,240 --> 00:06:47,160 kind of somewhat transparent and see through that kind of thing like a phantom. 87 00:06:47,199 --> 00:06:51,079 So it turns out shortly before these apparitions started to appear in Circle River, 88 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:56,720 and Steve, this gentleman that went missing, saw this apparition, there was 89 00:06:56,759 --> 00:07:00,639 an incident next door, and there was a a man named Ken Boonstra, 90 00:07:00,839 --> 00:07:04,000 And you can look this up. You'll find this in newspapers. This has 91 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:09,560 been reported on. He was obsessed with this woman that lived next door. 92 00:07:09,639 --> 00:07:14,839 He would stalk her and he would he would actually walk that exact trail right 93 00:07:14,879 --> 00:07:18,839 in front of the house, right where these folks saw this figure, and 94 00:07:18,959 --> 00:07:23,399 he would stand there and he would watch her for days and days and days, 95 00:07:23,480 --> 00:07:27,360 very very creepy. No one knows why he did this, and eventually 96 00:07:27,399 --> 00:07:31,480 he acted upon it. And first on Mother's Day he attacked the family, 97 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:38,160 just randomly attacked the family and knocked this woman over that he was obsessed with, 98 00:07:38,279 --> 00:07:41,120 knocked her to the ground, stole her purse, ran out in the 99 00:07:41,120 --> 00:07:46,560 woods. That evening, he came back and the dog started barking, and 100 00:07:46,639 --> 00:07:49,839 so the husband got up and he's this big firefighter and he's, you know, 101 00:07:49,920 --> 00:07:53,480 he's on itche man. He's going to protect his wife, I'll tell 102 00:07:53,480 --> 00:07:56,920 you what. So he gets up and he looks down the hallway and sure 103 00:07:56,959 --> 00:08:00,639 enough, he sees this shadow of this figures standing at the end of the 104 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:03,839 hallway, and his adrenaline, as my adrenaline would be just going and he 105 00:08:03,879 --> 00:08:07,839 went charging and this figure, Kemp, you know, came running right at 106 00:08:07,920 --> 00:08:11,319 him and they met right in the middle of the hallway and just started brawling. 107 00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:16,199 And you know, the wife got up and was screaming, and the 108 00:08:16,279 --> 00:08:22,680 intruder, Kenneth. He overpowered this firefighter. This guy was pretty big too, 109 00:08:22,279 --> 00:08:26,000 and no matter how hard he would hit him, he just wouldn't go 110 00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:28,519 down. He wouldn't go down. And and she could see that this intruder 111 00:08:28,600 --> 00:08:33,720 was overtaking her husband, so she went into the She went into the kitchen. 112 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:35,879 This is after hitting him over the head with like, you know, 113 00:08:35,879 --> 00:08:39,039 a baseball bat several times. She wanted to get him. She finally grabbed 114 00:08:39,039 --> 00:08:41,320 a knife, you know, this is what she had to do to defend 115 00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:46,080 her family. She finally grabbed a knife and she stabbed him like twenty seven 116 00:08:46,159 --> 00:08:50,360 times, and he finally he finally bled out and he died there. But 117 00:08:50,879 --> 00:08:54,559 so this gentleman that went missing on August fifteenth, his name was Steve, 118 00:08:54,480 --> 00:09:01,879 was someone who saw the apparition of Kenneth Boonstra creepy stalker guy that you know, 119 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:05,840 was retracing his steps through some kind of time loop, I don't know 120 00:09:07,159 --> 00:09:09,759 what you want to call it, but a residual haunting. He just kept 121 00:09:11,519 --> 00:09:15,519 crossing the same steps, you know, approaching the house with his duffel bag. 122 00:09:16,559 --> 00:09:20,320 Very very strange story. Nobody knows why he was so obsessed and why 123 00:09:20,360 --> 00:09:24,240 he lost his mind. So that's I should have started out with a banger 124 00:09:24,279 --> 00:09:30,519 there. What do you think there's incredible to people still say the apparition today? 125 00:09:30,639 --> 00:09:35,840 Yes, I have heard a few other neighbors reports seeing this apparition for 126 00:09:35,919 --> 00:09:39,519 sure. Yep. I mean, I guess it makes sense that something was 127 00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:43,799 so much violence and obsession attached to him. So I can only imagine the 128 00:09:43,799 --> 00:09:48,000 amounts of psake energy that would be involved in that kind of a situation. 129 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:56,120 Oh my gosh. Yeah, And so it's very interesting. The other the 130 00:09:56,159 --> 00:09:58,120 other brother, the whole family, and the other brother that saw this apparition. 131 00:09:58,159 --> 00:10:01,320 He's not a believer in God, say, he's sort of an atheist. 132 00:10:01,399 --> 00:10:05,360 He doesn't believe in the supernatural. But he did admit that he did 133 00:10:05,440 --> 00:10:09,360 see this apparition, which is huge, you know for somebody that does not 134 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:16,039 believe. So goodness gracious, it's a spooky haunting story. That is I've 135 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:20,440 never heard that story before either. Yeah, you can look it up Seattle 136 00:10:20,480 --> 00:10:24,679 Times. You can look it up Snoqualmie Valley Record. That's well well documented, 137 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:28,320 not the ghost part, that's the oral history section. But as far 138 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:31,799 as the crime. So I have another story. This is story number two 139 00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:37,519 This is one that I heard so often. My grandparents love to tell the 140 00:10:37,519 --> 00:10:41,720 story. In fact, they loved it so much they went to visit this 141 00:10:41,759 --> 00:10:46,639 location. So there is a spiral staircase located in New Mexico at the Loretto 142 00:10:46,799 --> 00:10:54,159 Chapel, and it was completed in eighteen seventy eight, and apparently the nuns 143 00:10:54,440 --> 00:10:58,759 were trying to solve a problem. There was a twenty two foot space between 144 00:10:58,799 --> 00:11:03,519 the ground floor and the choir loft, and they wanted to create an access 145 00:11:03,720 --> 00:11:07,159 so they could get up to the choir loft, and so they called a 146 00:11:07,200 --> 00:11:09,360 bunch of carpenters and the carpenters looked it over and said, oh, we're 147 00:11:09,399 --> 00:11:11,759 just going to put a ladder up. And they didn't like the idea of 148 00:11:11,799 --> 00:11:16,519 a ladder because this was a very this is a very ornate, beautiful church 149 00:11:16,039 --> 00:11:20,320 with a lot of architecture and a lot of thought put into it and engineering. 150 00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:24,799 So they decided they would pray for nine days. So they prayed to 151 00:11:24,960 --> 00:11:31,120 Saint Joseph, the Saint of carpenters, for nine days, and the story 152 00:11:31,159 --> 00:11:35,039 goes on the ninth day, a man appeared and he had a donkey with 153 00:11:35,159 --> 00:11:39,960 him, and he had a box of really crude tools and just you know, 154 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:43,919 really simple like handsaw and a little measuring tape and a kind of a 155 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:46,360 planer. And he came in. He said, I'm looking for work. 156 00:11:46,519 --> 00:11:50,559 I heard that you're looking for a carpenter, and so the nuns hired him. 157 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:56,039 So it says that a couple months later the staircase was completed, but 158 00:11:56,080 --> 00:12:00,720 there was no trace of the carpenter. So he just disappeared. He just 159 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:03,840 he went away. He didn't even want to get paid. The creepy part 160 00:12:03,879 --> 00:12:09,720 of this is that there are no supports. It was all so the staircase 161 00:12:09,759 --> 00:12:13,720 has three hundred and sixty degree turns, two of them, but no visible 162 00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:18,200 means of support. And the wood was analyzed. Now this is where it 163 00:12:18,240 --> 00:12:22,519 gets really good. This is this is factual. You can look this up. 164 00:12:22,559 --> 00:12:26,960 Scientists have analyzed the wood. They determined the wood to be spruce, 165 00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:31,159 but not native to the area. That's the first part. The other part 166 00:12:31,200 --> 00:12:35,840 that's very exciting. It's not native to anything found on Earth. That's what 167 00:12:35,919 --> 00:12:41,159 it says on Wikipedia. Yeah, quite literally, what off earth? Perhaps 168 00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:46,000 it's so interesting. And then he used wooden nails and compression kind of like 169 00:12:46,039 --> 00:12:52,120 the Amish. And but so so far advanced, so far advanced. There's 170 00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:56,639 thirty three steps equal to the years of Christ's age, you know, when 171 00:12:56,679 --> 00:13:05,000 he was crucified. Very very interesting. My grandparents visited that location and they 172 00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:09,399 walked up the steps and I heard it my whole life. Just a really 173 00:13:09,399 --> 00:13:11,879 really cool unsolved mystery. Right, what year did you say was built? 174 00:13:11,879 --> 00:13:18,919 Approximately or eighteen seventy eight? Okay? In New Mexico. New Mexico is 175 00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:22,840 the land of enchantment. I always think Wisconsin's a weed, but when you 176 00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:26,080 start to look at you start to look at New Mexico, it's loaded with 177 00:13:26,120 --> 00:13:30,600 all kinds of strangeness as well. That's not I've never heard that New Mexican 178 00:13:30,639 --> 00:13:35,159 tawb before, but it fits right in there. Half fantastic. All right. 179 00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:39,559 We got next up kind of on the same lines. We have the 180 00:13:39,759 --> 00:13:43,000 church in Lahinah in Maui. All of you have been following the news and 181 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:48,039 you probably know w Now, there was a major, you know, catastrophic 182 00:13:48,159 --> 00:13:52,600 fire that killed a lot of people in Maui. But one of the miracles 183 00:13:52,639 --> 00:13:56,559 that happened, and you can look this up, this is verifiable that the 184 00:13:56,639 --> 00:14:03,879 Catholic Church Maria Lanaquila Catholic Church and Lahinah was completely untouched. In fact, 185 00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:07,919 when the priest went in to check on the inside, the flowers hadn't even 186 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:13,679 wilted on the altar. Isn't that bizarre? Everything around it burned to the 187 00:14:13,720 --> 00:14:18,000 ground. You had the convent, you had the daycare, everything burned to 188 00:14:18,080 --> 00:14:22,360 ashes. The church was untouched. And so the Catholic Church is saying it's 189 00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:28,360 a miracle. It's definitely an unsolved mystery. No one understands the physics of 190 00:14:28,399 --> 00:14:31,960 that. It is absolutely bizarre. That is a miracle for that not to 191 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:39,960 be touched. The other place where that happened, very similar was Saint Paul's 192 00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:45,480 Chapel in New York City on nine to eleven. So when the you know, 193 00:14:45,799 --> 00:14:50,159 the towers collapsed, Saint Paul's was completely untouched. So it's another example 194 00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:52,879 of a Catholic church survival. I thought it was pretty cool. It's like 195 00:14:52,919 --> 00:14:58,080 the hand of God reached I from the city, not taking lace out absolutely 196 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:01,320 by act. Cool stories, and they're positive cool stories, which is good 197 00:15:01,320 --> 00:15:05,840 as well. It's always nice to have the mysteries which have the nice events 198 00:15:05,879 --> 00:15:09,120 instead of money. The spooky bent ones are fun as well, of course, 199 00:15:09,159 --> 00:15:11,559 but it's it's nice, too nice to hear the nice ones. Also, 200 00:15:13,919 --> 00:15:16,840 I agree, I'm loving your story. I'm loving your stories by the 201 00:15:16,879 --> 00:15:18,440 way. But yeah, and if anybody wants to ask Bob anything in the 202 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:24,639 any of our wonderful listeners in the our viewers in the chat, feel free 203 00:15:24,679 --> 00:15:30,320 to shooter for question to Bob because I'm I'm sure he'll he'll do his best 204 00:15:30,399 --> 00:15:33,600 to answer. I'm sure he will answer it. So what would when you 205 00:15:33,639 --> 00:15:37,600 hear something like that, Bob, do you do you tend to lean towards 206 00:15:37,639 --> 00:15:39,759 it being because I know there are skeptics that you just say, well, 207 00:15:39,759 --> 00:15:43,279 that's just a coincidence. But do you tend to lean towards a miraculous interpretation 208 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:48,080 when you hear a tale like that? Or I do I tend to lean 209 00:15:48,120 --> 00:15:56,720 towards miraculous? Yeah? Yeah, absolutely, m I have another great story, 210 00:15:56,799 --> 00:16:00,159 and this is shout out to our friends over in the u K. 211 00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:03,200 I have to add an English story. You'll love this one. This is 212 00:16:03,240 --> 00:16:07,200 so interesting, very well documented. You can look this up. If anyone 213 00:16:07,240 --> 00:16:11,840 wants to fact check me, do it because it's it's there's a lot of 214 00:16:11,879 --> 00:16:17,279 information. There was a gentleman named Andrew Jepson and he was from Wolverhampton, 215 00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:22,759 England. He was working on a construction site in the nineteen nineties. Now, 216 00:16:22,360 --> 00:16:26,240 he was distracted, he was I don't know what was going on, 217 00:16:26,279 --> 00:16:29,679 but he was distracted. And right behind him there was a four ton steam 218 00:16:29,759 --> 00:16:33,600 roller. A four ton steam roller, and this is kind of a device 219 00:16:33,679 --> 00:16:37,679 that compacts gravel and you're, you know, laying out layers of gravel preparing 220 00:16:37,679 --> 00:16:41,639 maybe to pour concrete or something like that, maybe asphalt. So he was 221 00:16:41,679 --> 00:16:47,960 distracted. The driver couldn't stop the steam roller, and you know what happened 222 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:52,919 next. He got his legs caught under this four ton steam roller and he 223 00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:57,159 was completely rolled over. And I mean, four tons come on, and 224 00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:02,559 I know, I know. And the thing that's so strange is that, 225 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:06,480 well the driver decided to just keep going. You know, he didn't even 226 00:17:06,519 --> 00:17:08,799 try to put on the brake because he figured it would minimize the damage. 227 00:17:10,039 --> 00:17:12,680 Well, when he got on the other side Andrews he gets up out of 228 00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:18,240 the gravel, it just kind of brushes brushes his hair, and I mean, 229 00:17:18,599 --> 00:17:22,319 oh my god. So there have been scientists that have actually tried to 230 00:17:22,359 --> 00:17:27,319 recreate this event. They used frozen chickens you can look at this on TV 231 00:17:29,559 --> 00:17:33,880 and they literally like laid this out and recreated it, and they said, 232 00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:37,799 there's no way that this guy could have survived. He should have been absolutely 233 00:17:37,799 --> 00:17:42,440 smushed into like blobs of fleshy meat. You know. Just it's the strangest 234 00:17:42,440 --> 00:17:48,640 story, the most interesting unsolved mystery. Yeah, those weird accident stories. 235 00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:52,759 It always fascinates me when somebody has an experience which should have killed or really 236 00:17:52,839 --> 00:17:56,640 seriously inching. They woke awab Sky. I remember my little cousin when I 237 00:17:56,720 --> 00:18:00,440 was a child. He was younger than me, probably be considerably younger, 238 00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:03,400 so I probably would have been twelve and he might have been, like I 239 00:18:03,400 --> 00:18:06,039 don't know, maybe I was ten, he was like two or something. 240 00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:08,920 At the back of my grandmother's house, it was like a two story house, 241 00:18:10,079 --> 00:18:11,960 and it was fairly kind of high. The back second story, like 242 00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:17,400 a big staircase went up and it was at an outside staircase so you could 243 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:19,119 access the bottom dwelling in the top dwelling, an old kind of house. 244 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:26,000 And he rolled off the top and it was a drop that I guarantee you 245 00:18:26,039 --> 00:18:27,480 if you or I rolled off, we'd be hospital, we'd be dead, 246 00:18:27,519 --> 00:18:33,240 or we'd be hospitalized for you know, a serious amount of time, unscathed 247 00:18:33,519 --> 00:18:37,440 and it was cement underneath. Like I'm talking about a drop, it'd be 248 00:18:37,519 --> 00:18:40,279 like from the top of my roof too. I mean I wouldn't say I 249 00:18:40,279 --> 00:18:41,920 don't think I'd even survive it. No, he was unscathed. Little kid 250 00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:45,759 just rolled off boom on a cement. So when things like that happened, 251 00:18:45,799 --> 00:18:49,279 you do one. Same with the steam rolling story. How on earth is 252 00:18:49,319 --> 00:18:55,319 this stuff possible? So strange, so strange. Just one thing I wanted 253 00:18:55,319 --> 00:18:56,079 to ask you too, because I knew you were going to. We were 254 00:18:56,119 --> 00:19:00,599 doing mysteries to night. When I gave the British one made me think of 255 00:19:00,599 --> 00:19:03,000 it because when I was a kid, one of my favorite British mysteries. 256 00:19:03,039 --> 00:19:06,960 And when I say favorite, it used to cause me many a sleepless night 257 00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:10,720 as well. I think it was talked about in one of the unwinned books 258 00:19:10,759 --> 00:19:14,720 on the supernatural, like Unwin's Book on Ghosts or something, which was a 259 00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:17,920 British book very popular in Australia when I was a kid, And that's the 260 00:19:18,000 --> 00:19:21,640 Jeff the Talking Mongoose story. And I've seen they finally made a movie about 261 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:26,759 it called Nandor Photo and the talking because I think Nandor Photo was the investigator 262 00:19:26,839 --> 00:19:29,920 or something. And Sam Shearon, who's been on the show before. I 263 00:19:29,960 --> 00:19:33,640 believe he's an artist who did the art for the film. Simon Pegg stars 264 00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:37,319 as Nandor Photo. And this new Jeff the Talking Mongoose movie, which I 265 00:19:37,359 --> 00:19:38,759 think it's in cinemas now, it's about to be. I can't believe they 266 00:19:38,799 --> 00:19:44,400 made a movie about the Jeff the Talking Mongoose story. How cool? Oh 267 00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:48,599 man, Oh yeah, I love that story. That's great. I've got 268 00:19:49,440 --> 00:19:53,480 I've got another one that is right back at our hometown. This is one 269 00:19:53,519 --> 00:19:57,680 of my favorite stories. In fact, I learned this from the local historian. 270 00:19:59,079 --> 00:20:03,480 Her grandfather just passed away at the age of one, one hundred and 271 00:20:03,519 --> 00:20:07,039 one years old. His name was David Lake. He was the he was 272 00:20:07,079 --> 00:20:11,000 the guy that shared this story. This was one of his famous stories. 273 00:20:11,200 --> 00:20:15,440 So she shared this with me, and in honor of David Lake are elder, 274 00:20:15,480 --> 00:20:19,720 I'm gonna I'm gonna share this. So back in the nineteen seventies there 275 00:20:21,279 --> 00:20:23,920 there used to be a warehouser mill. It's no longer there anymore. It 276 00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:29,319 was a sawmill. It's now completely gone. But back in the seventies, 277 00:20:29,799 --> 00:20:34,240 it was quite active and David was there working, and so there was a 278 00:20:34,279 --> 00:20:42,720 guest speaker from the University of Washington and he came to talk to the employees 279 00:20:42,759 --> 00:20:45,680 about the history of geology, the history of the Snoqualmie Valley, you know, 280 00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:51,960 Snoqualmie Falls, volcanic activity, the ice age, that kind of thing. 281 00:20:52,480 --> 00:20:56,839 So at some point during his lecture he says that he in a colleague, 282 00:20:56,759 --> 00:21:02,279 this is so cool. They found a tunnel under Mount Sigh. Now 283 00:21:02,319 --> 00:21:07,119 Mount Sigh is this right over here. And that tunnel went for about eight 284 00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:12,440 miles in the direction of Marysville, Washington, and they decided to explore this 285 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:18,559 tunnel and they went far. They went all eight miles, and they claimed 286 00:21:18,680 --> 00:21:22,480 the speaker claimed that he and a colleague found a fire ring at the center 287 00:21:22,559 --> 00:21:26,039 of the tunnel, and they carbon dated the fire ring and they said that 288 00:21:26,079 --> 00:21:30,640 there was human activity seven thousand, five hundred years ago something like that. 289 00:21:32,599 --> 00:21:36,119 And all these Rednecks, including David, was just like, you know, 290 00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:38,799 there's drool coming out of their mouths. There's like, oh my god, 291 00:21:38,839 --> 00:21:44,279 you know, because they they know these woods, right, they know these 292 00:21:44,279 --> 00:21:48,079 woods, and they're like, there's a tunnel the Mirrorsville, you know what 293 00:21:48,119 --> 00:21:51,880 I mean. And so they were just stunned, right, So they walked 294 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:56,400 up after the lecture, they shook this man's hand, Nice to meet you, 295 00:21:56,640 --> 00:21:59,480 but nobody remembered his name, of course, right. So for the 296 00:21:59,519 --> 00:22:02,720 next two weeks, all these guys, including David, they were in their 297 00:22:02,759 --> 00:22:06,440 pickup trucks and they're driving all over the mountains and they were they were looking 298 00:22:06,559 --> 00:22:08,359 for the entrance to this cave, this tunnel. They're just like, oh 299 00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:11,759 my god, where is this tunnel? And they of course they couldn't find 300 00:22:11,799 --> 00:22:15,640 it, right, they couldn't find it. So in frustration, they went 301 00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:19,880 back to their boss and they said, we demand to know who that speaker 302 00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:22,559 was. We've got to talk to him again. I want you to call 303 00:22:22,599 --> 00:22:26,519 the University of Washington. I want you to find out who that person was. 304 00:22:26,599 --> 00:22:29,119 We have to have answers. We want to know where that cave is. 305 00:22:29,960 --> 00:22:34,119 So the manager at the Warehouser mill they call University of Washington and they 306 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:37,680 get somebody on the phone and they're they're talking and asking questions and they're saying, 307 00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:41,359 hey, we had this event on this day, you know, and 308 00:22:41,759 --> 00:22:45,720 who did you send out to speak to the employees and you know, and 309 00:22:45,759 --> 00:22:48,279 so the answer was, well, we never sent anyone out to speak to 310 00:22:48,319 --> 00:22:56,079 anyone at Warehousers. So there's a mystery right there. So somebody just shows 311 00:22:56,160 --> 00:23:00,279 up and tell us this incredible story and then you know where he came from. 312 00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:04,359 The thing about it that's so fascinating is there is a fault line that 313 00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:10,920 goes right by our house here and in other parts of the world sometimes I've 314 00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:15,079 heard that faults can shift and create a hallway, and they've seen this in 315 00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:18,880 other parts of the world. Another mountain ranges. So it's very possible that 316 00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:23,039 the fault line that goes right here by the house it actually shifted, maybe 317 00:23:23,079 --> 00:23:26,839 during an earthquake, and maybe there really is a hallway that goes eight miles. 318 00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:32,359 It's very possible. Yeah, I know what Richard Shava would have said. 319 00:23:32,359 --> 00:23:36,680 He would have said it was one of the Kevin people visiting some way 320 00:23:36,720 --> 00:23:40,079 a terror perhaps maybe not the Darrow. The Derry probably wouldn't have told you, 321 00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:45,880 but maybe maybe somebody from the friendlier underground race kay to tell the pit 322 00:23:47,799 --> 00:23:52,000 a true story. Yeah, that's really cool. That actually could be. 323 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:55,279 Yeah, we could we could go that direction if you want. I can't. 324 00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:57,720 I can't help, but I can't help bring Shava. I've seen a 325 00:23:57,759 --> 00:24:02,960 number of comments that people say how creepy and like wow about the stories, 326 00:24:03,039 --> 00:24:07,119 and yeah, no, people are definitely enjoying great ghost story. But from 327 00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:10,839 a previous one. Yeah no, people are enjoying the stories. I think 328 00:24:10,839 --> 00:24:14,160 it's nice sometimes to have somebody on who just tells stories. It changes the 329 00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:18,119 dynamic a little bit too, you know, just a questioning kind of show 330 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:21,880 as soon as they see if there are any questions. Ken Rock said a 331 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:26,720 lizard person. Perhaps you never know, You never know who's down there in 332 00:24:26,759 --> 00:24:32,599 the cabins, and that, of course, putting Shave aside for a minute. 333 00:24:32,599 --> 00:24:34,720 It's there's a long history, of course of the idea that there are 334 00:24:34,759 --> 00:24:41,640 things and people underground and ancient civilizations and everything from lizard people to the fairy 335 00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:45,519 folk to the Taro to the Darrow to underground alien basis. These ideas have 336 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:52,000 been with us for almost ever, that there's mysteries beneath the earth, and 337 00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:55,240 that you said that fault line runs right past your place there too. You 338 00:24:55,279 --> 00:24:57,920 were saying, Yeah, the reason I know it's the fault line is because 339 00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:00,880 when when we're getting on the freeway and I've got a cup of coffee and 340 00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:04,240 I'm driving. It's always the spot where we go over the pumps and I 341 00:25:04,279 --> 00:25:07,880 spill a coffee all over my lap. So that's why I know it's the 342 00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:11,160 fault line. Ed Shoots, another regular on the show who used to be 343 00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:15,000 known as a psychic priest and was an exorcist for Ed and Lorraine Warren, 344 00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:19,200 is just completing his memoirs at the moment, Memoirs of a Psychic Priest set 345 00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:23,920 These stories should be in a book. So Ed is obviously enjoying the tales 346 00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:27,599 of Oh I'm so glad, thank you so much. That means a lot. 347 00:25:27,799 --> 00:25:33,079 And yeah, chairs to David Lake are elder and in honor of his 348 00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:37,279 recent passing. So he was a great storyteller and woodsman and all that good 349 00:25:37,279 --> 00:25:40,599 stuff. Okay, so you know about Ted Bundy. You've heard, you 350 00:25:40,599 --> 00:25:44,839 know, you know the name Ted Bundy. It's sure quite famous. So 351 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:48,519 in North Bend, Washington in the nineteen seventies, we have a little mystery 352 00:25:48,599 --> 00:25:55,319 here because there are certain individuals who claim to have seen and worked with Ted 353 00:25:55,359 --> 00:26:00,400 Bundy. And I've reached out to so called you know, Bundy expert and 354 00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:03,839 I've talked to even one of the victims that escaped, and you know, 355 00:26:04,079 --> 00:26:08,039 there was one lady that you jumped out of the car escaped, And I've 356 00:26:08,160 --> 00:26:12,400 ran this by folks and they don't know what to think. But the thing 357 00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:18,240 is, there have been multiple witnesses that claimed that Ted Bundy was working at 358 00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:22,880 the BUSYB Cafe in downtown North Bend, the town that I'm in right now, 359 00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:26,000 in the summer of nineteen seventy three. So when you look at the 360 00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:32,279 timeline of Ted Bundy's life, if you look at nineteen seventy three, that's 361 00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:37,319 right before his killing spree began. And it's a place where there's not a 362 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:41,000 lot of documentation. It seems to be a hole where possibly this could be 363 00:26:41,279 --> 00:26:45,799 true. So a woman named Kathy Johnson claimed to play pool and have a 364 00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:52,440 drink with Ted at the Sure Shot Tavern in the summer of nineteen seventy three. 365 00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:57,440 And then a woman named Aloa Burkabile she worked alongside him. He was 366 00:26:57,480 --> 00:27:03,559 supposedly a line cook. She actually worked right alongside him. And so that's 367 00:27:03,599 --> 00:27:07,400 a mystery that I would love any any Bundy enthusiasts, not that's not the 368 00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:11,680 right word. Any Bundy researchers there we go would like to delve into this. 369 00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:17,680 I would welcome some help on that because is it possible that he was 370 00:27:17,759 --> 00:27:19,720 here in the summer of nineteen seventy three, because that's that doesn't appear in 371 00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:25,079 any books, that's all history, and that would be an amazing chapter to 372 00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:27,400 add to the story of Ted Bundy. Would they do you know, if 373 00:27:27,440 --> 00:27:36,720 they were happen to coincide with any disappearances or or anything just curious not, 374 00:27:37,079 --> 00:27:40,279 no, not. It wasn't until seventy four that the disappearance has started, 375 00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:44,799 so we think that he was sort of thinking about it and fantasizing and sort 376 00:27:44,799 --> 00:27:48,720 of playing out these things in his brain the summer before, and it wasn't 377 00:27:48,799 --> 00:27:55,400 until January of nineteen seventy four where he started to actually enact upon those fantasies 378 00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:57,000 and that kind of thing. So it could be that he was just thinking 379 00:27:57,039 --> 00:28:03,000 about it, you know, scope it out type of thing. There's certainly 380 00:28:03,039 --> 00:28:06,240 been a bit of a Bundy renaissance. Was it an Amazon series or a 381 00:28:06,279 --> 00:28:11,119 Netflix series? It was some Bundy Girlfriends series recently, and it seemed to 382 00:28:11,599 --> 00:28:15,759 there's a fascination a lot of people have with the serial killer. Absolutely, 383 00:28:15,759 --> 00:28:21,799 and they say that like wherever he worked or lived or you know, did 384 00:28:21,839 --> 00:28:25,720 his thing, that there is sort of a residual evil or a demonic presence. 385 00:28:26,279 --> 00:28:27,400 And I think I've talked to you before, maybe it was you, 386 00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:33,799 I don't remember. The contractors at his childhood home reported paranormal phenomenon in the 387 00:28:33,839 --> 00:28:38,240 home, and so there were messages written in the dust. There were It's 388 00:28:38,279 --> 00:28:44,599 like the words helped me were written in the dust at Wow. I don't 389 00:28:44,599 --> 00:28:48,759 know if you did tell me that story before. Yeah, we went there 390 00:28:48,839 --> 00:28:51,960 one time, My wife and I just checked out the neighborhood and went to 391 00:28:52,039 --> 00:28:56,000 his house. But there was dust all over the basement, you know, 392 00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:59,960 and there were no footprints leading up to the window. But someone clearly wrote 393 00:29:00,160 --> 00:29:03,720 helped me, and there would have been footprints or evidence of someone walking up 394 00:29:03,759 --> 00:29:07,240 to do that that there wasn't. So, and there's other other things other 395 00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:14,400 places that he'd been that report like demonic energy or presences or things that are 396 00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:18,160 that are not quite good. So, yeah, did you have a check 397 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:22,000 out Maury Island when you were in the Techayma kind of area. We did. 398 00:29:22,160 --> 00:29:27,640 We actually walked the beach there where the events unfolded. We actually camped 399 00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:33,319 my wife and I for her birthday went to Maury Island and camped for four 400 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:38,640 days and went to the lighthouse there. It was really a fantastic beautiful place. 401 00:29:40,799 --> 00:29:45,319 Wow, yeah was here. Did you have any strange feelings or anything 402 00:29:45,359 --> 00:29:49,680 we had happened while you were there or yeah, we kind of did. 403 00:29:51,559 --> 00:29:56,799 It wasn't related to the Maury Island incident story. But so at the time 404 00:29:56,839 --> 00:30:00,640 we were there, I was preparing and we were preparing for an event coming 405 00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:06,680 up, and it was a naming ceremony for some of the local tribes here, 406 00:30:07,319 --> 00:30:10,960 and so I had been asked to carve some of the regalia and some 407 00:30:11,079 --> 00:30:17,160 of the pieces for this traditional naming ceremony. The traditional naming ceremony is like 408 00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:21,680 you receive a name in the language. And it was strange because some of 409 00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:25,799 the some of the elements of the story that was connected to this woman who 410 00:30:25,799 --> 00:30:30,480 we were sponsoring or we were working with, appeared in real life. And 411 00:30:30,519 --> 00:30:33,720 there was kind of some strange things that happened on Maury Island, and there 412 00:30:33,759 --> 00:30:36,799 was a wind that came out of nowhere, and there were some birds that 413 00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:40,519 were, you know, making themselves known. It's very interesting. But that's 414 00:30:40,640 --> 00:30:41,960 the only thing that I can remember that was a little bit odd. But 415 00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:45,920 in our life that's kind of common. I guess it happens all the time. 416 00:30:47,039 --> 00:30:52,799 So yeah, fantastic. I think I saw a video, a video 417 00:30:52,799 --> 00:30:56,279 of you and your wife. I saw going up Gravity Hill, one of 418 00:30:56,319 --> 00:31:00,680 those gravity hills recently. It was fascinating. Yeah, yeah, yeah, 419 00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:03,200 we did. We tried it out and it it was it was real. 420 00:31:03,359 --> 00:31:07,279 So where was that place? Where was it? Watched the video? But 421 00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:14,400 yeah, that's in Proser, Washington, Yeah, Procer. So a lot 422 00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:18,279 of people explain it as it's just an optical illusion, so you know, 423 00:31:18,599 --> 00:31:22,359 but it was pretty fun anyway. I think it is an optical illusion actually, 424 00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:25,319 But anyway, because you put your car in neutral and it looks like 425 00:31:25,359 --> 00:31:27,839 it rolls up the hill. So it's one heck of an even oncount even 426 00:31:27,839 --> 00:31:30,480 when you were filming and it looked like you were rolling up the hill. 427 00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:37,720 So I love it. Yep, just too just incredible. So are there 428 00:31:37,759 --> 00:31:42,200 any questions like from you from anything I've talked about so far? I think, 429 00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:48,519 I mean there's there's broad kind of I suppose forty in questions from me. 430 00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:52,240 Do you like, do you think do you think things for example, 431 00:31:52,359 --> 00:32:01,200 like the the Bundy childhood home, I said us, do you think that's 432 00:32:01,359 --> 00:32:08,720 some kind of extant spiritual reality or do you think that some residual psychic energy 433 00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:14,960 or what are your thoughts and things like that? Yeah, I think that 434 00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:22,160 My personal belief is that the more you know deaths and murders and suicides and 435 00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:28,920 dark things that happen on a landscape, it accumulates energy. It just starts 436 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:32,799 to grow, almost like a balloon filled with you know, helium or something 437 00:32:32,839 --> 00:32:37,200 like that. And the more it's like it's like snowballs, it's snowballs, 438 00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:42,720 and it becomes to a point where it can't be ignored anymore. So a 439 00:32:42,759 --> 00:32:45,799 lot of the famous hauntings, and I think Ted Bundy in his mind was 440 00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:51,119 like that. He was a he was filled up with that stuff. He 441 00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:54,400 was filled up with just this dark stuff right just in his wherever he walked 442 00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:59,480 around to he would spread it around type thing. But as far as locations, 443 00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:02,920 you know, there are so many places where because of the numerous deaths 444 00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:07,079 and murders suicides, it's you can't ignore it, you know, you just 445 00:33:07,119 --> 00:33:10,359 can't ignore it. And everybody knows that the place is haunted, and you 446 00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:15,279 know, people see things, even people that don't believe in the paranormal will 447 00:33:15,319 --> 00:33:20,519 see things at those locations. It's just a cumulative effect. It's uh, 448 00:33:21,319 --> 00:33:23,319 you know, it draws in energy, and some people, like in the 449 00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:27,799 dark Arts, you know, they try to harness that, They try to 450 00:33:27,839 --> 00:33:30,880 harness that, they use that as power, you know. So they will 451 00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:37,240 take that energy, that despair that you know, that fear, and they 452 00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:40,720 will use it for other things, nefarious things. So that's that's sort of 453 00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:45,440 the definition of like what you call black magic. You know, people take 454 00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:51,960 advantage of that energy. Do you think Bundy himself might have been influenced by 455 00:33:52,160 --> 00:33:59,039 by something spiritual or something outside of himself or yes, I do because in 456 00:33:59,119 --> 00:34:04,039 one of the interviews he talks about he was speaking to some entity. You 457 00:34:04,079 --> 00:34:06,680 can look this up. I think it was one one of the Netflix series 458 00:34:07,559 --> 00:34:12,559 and it plays a recording where he's admitting that he's talking to some dark entity 459 00:34:12,639 --> 00:34:16,880 within himself, not himself, but something dark, demonic and answering questions or 460 00:34:17,000 --> 00:34:22,559 taking orders from something in the darkness within himself, and that is documented if 461 00:34:22,559 --> 00:34:27,079 you look that up. Yeah, Well, I think Son of Sam had 462 00:34:27,119 --> 00:34:30,440 like a doggie talk to or something like a black dog or so, it 463 00:34:30,559 --> 00:34:34,039 is interesting that some of these people seem to be community. And of course 464 00:34:34,079 --> 00:34:39,360 the skeptical type of position would just be one the person was insane, so 465 00:34:39,440 --> 00:34:44,360 of course they're hearing voices and things. But I know, again getting back 466 00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:46,920 to Richard Shava, he often wond that if people didn't do things because they 467 00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:51,360 were malevolent, he would have thought it was the darrow. But maybe that's 468 00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:57,880 just a literalization of something which is a non human intelligence which directs or encourages 469 00:34:58,000 --> 00:35:00,920 people on a certain track to continue down that path to do wicked, horrible 470 00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:07,440 things. And speaking about speaking about influences, he's a question from Nancy for 471 00:35:07,519 --> 00:35:12,840 you, Bob. It says, do you think our storytellers may be attract 472 00:35:12,960 --> 00:35:17,519 or even summon paranormal entities or activities? I do. I think that's very 473 00:35:17,599 --> 00:35:23,320 possible. I think especially what language you're speaking in. So for instance, 474 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:30,480 if I was speaking in you know, indigenous language, I would automatically attract 475 00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:32,800 you know, those spirits that are right here on this land, and their 476 00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:36,719 eyes would just oh, they would perk up and they would hear me speaking 477 00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:39,400 their language, this ancient language. When a language has been spoken on a 478 00:35:39,480 --> 00:35:45,239 landscape for thousands of years. That also accumulates energy. So if you start 479 00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:49,639 telling a story in that language, oh my gosh, that is like direct 480 00:35:49,719 --> 00:35:52,280 You know, you're tapping into the spirit world. In my opinion, language 481 00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:57,440 is so important, and movement is so important. So like the order of 482 00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:01,719 your the rhythm of what you're doing, the rhythm of that ritual or whatever 483 00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:07,800 you're saying that poem, or the rhythm of your speech. If it's ancient, 484 00:36:07,079 --> 00:36:13,599 if it's been repeated over and over again, absolutely will it accumulate all 485 00:36:13,639 --> 00:36:17,880 of that history into that rhythm, into that space. Yeah, that is 486 00:36:19,039 --> 00:36:23,280 interesting. I was watching the new Small Town Monsters documentary Land of the Missing 487 00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:27,440 the other day, and there was somebody mentioned something in there. I've certainly 488 00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:31,559 heard before that there are certain Native American tribes that don't like to even talk 489 00:36:31,599 --> 00:36:36,039 about Bigfoot or sasquatch or whatever the term is, because they think then it 490 00:36:36,039 --> 00:36:39,800 will notice you. I've heard similar things talked about things like skinwalkers and various 491 00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:45,840 other entities. Even in the Western traditions, we don't like it was well 492 00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:49,480 known you shouldn't talk about the fair folk. Like even to say fair folk 493 00:36:49,599 --> 00:36:52,480 was a nice way of dealing with it rather than saying, like the fairies 494 00:36:52,559 --> 00:36:55,000 or something they might take offense to. But it was known that you shouldn't 495 00:36:55,039 --> 00:37:00,400 even talk about them because then they'll notice you. Yeah, that's why I 496 00:37:00,400 --> 00:37:05,280 when like someone recites the Rosary or says, you know, say the Lord's 497 00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:07,280 Prayer. You know, these words have been said for you know, in 498 00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:12,719 the same way often and repeated, and it has a power, a good 499 00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:15,480 power. It has the opposite, you know, And so that's a good 500 00:37:15,519 --> 00:37:19,199 example of you know, oral history, you know, just the prayers that 501 00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:21,920 people you know, recite. It could be a Buddhist prayer, it could 502 00:37:21,960 --> 00:37:24,800 be uh, you know, whatever religion. That is. If it's repeated 503 00:37:25,079 --> 00:37:29,719 verbatim, it has power. It has power of all those people before that 504 00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:34,280 have repeated that exact same thing. All of those lives are contained within that, 505 00:37:34,880 --> 00:37:37,920 you know, within that rhythm of that language. So that's what I 506 00:37:37,960 --> 00:37:43,079 believe. Absolutely. He who should not be named, Yeah, that's said, 507 00:37:43,199 --> 00:37:46,119 and Nancy was a thought. Thanks you for the question, and degrade, 508 00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:49,480 Yeah, yeah, there were certain things you shouldn't talk about. Ed 509 00:37:49,559 --> 00:37:52,480 Shoots also suggests I think when we were talking about potentially what what were the 510 00:37:52,519 --> 00:37:57,920 hauntings or what were the influences? He suggested stone type theory. What what's 511 00:37:57,920 --> 00:38:01,039 your tape take on that? Yeah, So, what I understand how stone 512 00:38:01,039 --> 00:38:05,559 tape theory is like, especially in England where there's castles and old ruins, 513 00:38:06,119 --> 00:38:09,480 you know, that some of the traumatic events or historical events are are somehow 514 00:38:09,599 --> 00:38:14,360 recorded in the framework of the old building. That's kind of kind of what 515 00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:16,800 I understand. Correct me if I'm wrong. That's kind of where the stone 516 00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:20,960 tape theory came from. A lot of these old buildings. It could be 517 00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:23,519 the East Coast, you know, but a lot of these old stone and 518 00:38:23,599 --> 00:38:30,039 brick buildings and that kind of thing are said to contain and record somehow the 519 00:38:30,119 --> 00:38:35,760 residual haunting within the wood, within the timber, within the stone, that 520 00:38:35,840 --> 00:38:38,440 kind of thing. So I think it's very possible. I've got a mummy 521 00:38:38,519 --> 00:38:40,760 story. If you guys want to hear it, you guys, really I 522 00:38:40,800 --> 00:38:45,440 want to hear it. Okay, this is bizarre, and this is not 523 00:38:45,559 --> 00:38:50,760 You cannot find this anywhere online. This is complete oral history. And I 524 00:38:50,840 --> 00:38:54,679 don't think I've ever talked about this publicly. So I had a friend that 525 00:38:55,280 --> 00:39:00,400 worked as a flagger over in eastern Washington and she is now deceased. Her 526 00:39:00,440 --> 00:39:06,639 name was Gail. She was part of the Yakima. She was yakimas Naqualmie 527 00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:13,320 Tribal and she was working on the sun Kadia Resort project. So there were 528 00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:17,320 folks in the woods and they were digging lines. There were utility lines you 529 00:39:17,320 --> 00:39:22,400 know there for natural gas and whatnot, trying to build up this sun Kadia 530 00:39:22,519 --> 00:39:25,320 resort. Suddenly one of the machines, the traco, turned off. She's 531 00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:29,519 like, huh. So she heard the guy turn his engine off, and 532 00:39:29,559 --> 00:39:32,760 he comes stumbling out of the woods and his face is just completely white, 533 00:39:34,360 --> 00:39:36,960 and he comes over to her and he goes, please come here, I 534 00:39:36,960 --> 00:39:38,760 got to show you something. Like he was so he was shaking. He 535 00:39:38,840 --> 00:39:44,000 was so frightened. He was so frightened. And so she put down her 536 00:39:44,039 --> 00:39:46,440 flag and she walked through the woods back to where he was working. And 537 00:39:46,559 --> 00:39:53,639 he had actually uncovered a hole in the ground that was airtight, kind of 538 00:39:53,679 --> 00:39:59,480 like a tomb, and there was a hole and he said that when he 539 00:39:59,559 --> 00:40:01,719 when he dug into this hole, like all this air kind of gushed out, 540 00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:06,079 almost like when they first opened the pyramids, you know, all the 541 00:40:06,119 --> 00:40:08,960 air that kind of gushed out, and they peeked in that hole and they 542 00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:13,119 had flashlights, and I'll tell you what they saw in that hole. You're 543 00:40:13,159 --> 00:40:15,960 ready. This isn't this is in Washington State. This is crazy. Gosh. 544 00:40:16,079 --> 00:40:21,000 There was a little woman, a mummy on an altar, and there 545 00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:24,119 were artifacts all around her, and it did not look like it was from 546 00:40:24,159 --> 00:40:29,400 this culture. And you know, it looked very strange. It looked very 547 00:40:29,639 --> 00:40:34,159 old, looked very old, and very strange, like she didn't recognize the 548 00:40:34,199 --> 00:40:37,000 culture. And it was definitely a mummy, but it was a little person, 549 00:40:37,039 --> 00:40:39,960 looked female. She said, she felt it was a female. And 550 00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:44,599 there were little artifacts, pieces of pottery and things all around her, and 551 00:40:44,679 --> 00:40:49,840 this altar and this sealed off tomb that he had broken into accidentally. Now 552 00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:52,280 this is up near the Yakaman River. This is up, this is up 553 00:40:52,280 --> 00:40:58,079 towards Ellensburg. Whatnot. So she said, she goes, I would like 554 00:40:58,159 --> 00:41:01,880 you to rebury this. I want you to not tell anyone what you saw. 555 00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:06,599 I want you to you know, please cover this backup. We don't 556 00:41:06,639 --> 00:41:08,599 want anybody to know about this. We want to leave this in the ground. 557 00:41:09,119 --> 00:41:12,800 Leave this in the ground. That was her. That was her cultural 558 00:41:12,840 --> 00:41:15,639 response, right, and that was her gut feeling, and so he did. 559 00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:20,480 He did. There were two gentlemen on the job, and so those 560 00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:23,280 guys they went, you know, naturally, they went home and they told 561 00:41:23,320 --> 00:41:27,960 their wives of what happened during the day. I mean, I would too. 562 00:41:28,039 --> 00:41:31,079 That's just like, whoa, that is so crazy, that's so interesting. 563 00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:36,719 Right. So the next day or the maybe two days later, they're 564 00:41:36,719 --> 00:41:42,559 on the same job, and these folks come from Central Washington University and they 565 00:41:42,639 --> 00:41:45,960 come up to her and they said, I heard you found something in the 566 00:41:45,000 --> 00:41:51,519 woods. They all knew about it the archaeology department at Central College in Ellensburg, 567 00:41:51,960 --> 00:41:53,320 and they were ready. And I would be too. I'd be like, 568 00:41:53,360 --> 00:41:58,280 oh my god, can you imagine the discovery. What if that was 569 00:41:58,360 --> 00:42:01,960 like, you know, some ancient race of human being that came and visited 570 00:42:01,960 --> 00:42:06,280 the area, and that, I mean, that is just mind blowing. 571 00:42:07,159 --> 00:42:10,000 So I don't know. The mystery is, I don't know what that mummy 572 00:42:10,199 --> 00:42:14,559 was. I don't know whatever happened to that whole situation. But all I 573 00:42:14,639 --> 00:42:17,519 know is when you go on the brochure of Suncadia and you read the fine 574 00:42:17,559 --> 00:42:22,639 print, it says something to the effect of, you know, the Yakima 575 00:42:22,719 --> 00:42:29,760 tribe came and oversaw some significant archaeological fines and it's a private matter, but 576 00:42:29,960 --> 00:42:32,199 it is in print. And what a story. I mean, wow, 577 00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:36,199 wow, wow, wow, that is a fascinating story. I think a 578 00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:42,920 lot. There's lots of tales about things being overlooked or heat and archaeologically in 579 00:42:42,960 --> 00:42:50,159 this country, like tales of giant scalletons and tales of early European expirations and 580 00:42:50,559 --> 00:42:55,559 things that Martin fit the traditional archaeological paradigm some people say intentionally get buried or 581 00:42:55,599 --> 00:43:00,639 ignored or put aside. We had a question from a horror Smith before. 582 00:43:00,639 --> 00:43:06,039 Horace Smith is the professor of astronomy and or a professor emeritus rather of astronomy 583 00:43:06,039 --> 00:43:07,519 and Physics at Michigan State University, and we had him on a couple of 584 00:43:07,519 --> 00:43:12,800 weeks ago with Edward Gamont talking about his new Lovecraft book when the stars are 585 00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:15,480 ride about Lovecraft and astronomy. But he has something and maybe you'll have a 586 00:43:15,519 --> 00:43:20,000 take on this. Bobby says, this is when we're talking about more supernatural 587 00:43:20,039 --> 00:43:22,480 type of experiences. And then there are those such as myself who never seemed 588 00:43:22,480 --> 00:43:28,679 to experience ghosts or paranormal phenomena just insensitive. What do you think about the 589 00:43:28,719 --> 00:43:32,400 predilection of some people who seem to experience and things which is supernatural and some 590 00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:37,079 people who never seem to have experiences. Bob, Yeah, I just think 591 00:43:37,119 --> 00:43:39,480 some people have that extra something, you know, like it's like a device 592 00:43:39,639 --> 00:43:44,519 that you know, you have the ability to pick up certain frequencies, and 593 00:43:44,679 --> 00:43:50,039 some human beings have an extra sense or they can they can see things that 594 00:43:50,119 --> 00:43:55,239 aren't normally sensed by other members of the population. I think it's very possible. 595 00:43:55,599 --> 00:43:59,800 There's so much around us, you know, and you talk to scientists 596 00:44:00,079 --> 00:44:04,599 are you know, studying quantum physics and the possibility of parallel dimensions, and 597 00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:07,039 there could be so much around us that you know, we can sort of 598 00:44:07,079 --> 00:44:10,559 sense at times, you know, and some of us have that extrability. 599 00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:15,960 I know there are studies about you know, the frontal lobe and like damage 600 00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:20,320 to you know, people that are have head trauma or PTSD. I know 601 00:44:20,360 --> 00:44:24,400 there are studies that say they're more prone to be sensitive to things like ghosts 602 00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:30,679 and paranormal phenomenon and that could be you know, a scientific explanation. I've 603 00:44:30,679 --> 00:44:35,360 heard that before, but in my lifetime, and I will just say, 604 00:44:35,440 --> 00:44:37,480 just working with all the different people that we've worked with, all the different 605 00:44:37,519 --> 00:44:42,760 cultures and witnessed so many different things. I just know there's something to it 606 00:44:42,880 --> 00:44:46,400 because I've I've seen things. There have been situations where a group of people 607 00:44:46,679 --> 00:44:51,559 who don't know each other will witness the same thing. They'll witness the same 608 00:44:51,599 --> 00:44:55,440 thing and it's totally totally out of this world bizarre, and there's no way 609 00:44:55,480 --> 00:44:59,360 that they would have got together and made that up together, and there's no 610 00:44:59,400 --> 00:45:02,480 reason or to do that. And I just I just think that not everybody 611 00:45:02,519 --> 00:45:06,119 can do that, you know, not everybody can see those things. And 612 00:45:06,159 --> 00:45:08,480 that's not a bad thing. It's just not as you know, It's just 613 00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:15,920 there's other senses in this world. Yep, Okay, odd things in the 614 00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:17,199 state. This is a very good show today, Thank you so much, 615 00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:22,639 Anita. Anita said, hello, all, I live in Washington State and 616 00:45:22,679 --> 00:45:23,920 I'm amazed at the odd things in the state. This is a very good 617 00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:29,079 show. Is a good show, Bob. It's always fascinating to talk to 618 00:45:29,159 --> 00:45:37,559 you. So I know you I've experienced all kinds of things. What is 619 00:45:37,599 --> 00:45:39,800 there a recent experience you could maybe tell us about something that's happened to you 620 00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:45,880 in the last few months or yeah, there there is that one, and 621 00:45:45,320 --> 00:45:49,760 it's very recent. But the thing about it, I do have to be 622 00:45:49,880 --> 00:45:52,360 kind of like, I can't talk about it just out of respect. Yet 623 00:45:52,599 --> 00:45:57,000 I think, yeah, is there another one you could tell us about it 624 00:45:57,079 --> 00:45:59,440 something, because I don't think we've had you on it for about six months. 625 00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:01,800 I think you were. You were a fairly early guest when we moved 626 00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:06,519 over to one told if I recall some time ago, I mean I could 627 00:46:06,599 --> 00:46:08,679 tell this story. I'll tell you a story. Okay, All right, 628 00:46:08,719 --> 00:46:13,039 here we go. So this is something that you could ponder. This is 629 00:46:13,159 --> 00:46:16,719 very interesting. So there was a time when we had some folks that lived 630 00:46:16,760 --> 00:46:22,000 here at our house temporarily. They were like foster care, just youth and 631 00:46:22,039 --> 00:46:27,000 their parents were going through a hard time. And at some point I heard 632 00:46:27,000 --> 00:46:31,199 a scream and the young lady that was here, she saw a bird in 633 00:46:31,199 --> 00:46:34,559 the back room. Have I told you the story yet about the bird? 634 00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:37,639 No? I want to hear it, Okay. So I went into the 635 00:46:37,639 --> 00:46:42,800 back room, which is right over here, and there was a snowbird, 636 00:46:43,079 --> 00:46:45,239 a snowbird, and it was flying around the inside of the frame of the 637 00:46:45,280 --> 00:46:50,920 window. And all three of these you know, kids, they were related, 638 00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:54,320 they were siblings. They were so scared because in the in their culture 639 00:46:55,159 --> 00:47:00,239 this is also like Irish culture as well. This is Celtic belief. When 640 00:47:00,280 --> 00:47:02,960 you see a robin or a bird on the inside of your house, that 641 00:47:04,079 --> 00:47:07,360 is an omen of death right and in the in the cultures here and the 642 00:47:07,360 --> 00:47:10,800 Puget Sound and the Sailors Sea, it's the same thing when you see a 643 00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:15,760 robin. So they were so scared. Their their grandfather had warned them, 644 00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:16,800 you know, if you ever see a bird inside, that's a sign of 645 00:47:16,840 --> 00:47:20,440 death. So I said, okay, don't worry, don't worry, don't 646 00:47:20,440 --> 00:47:24,079 worry. And so I reached down and I grabbed a piece of clothing off 647 00:47:24,079 --> 00:47:27,800 the ground, and I said, we're gonna get this bird outside. Don't 648 00:47:27,840 --> 00:47:30,599 you worry. Don't worry at all. And so I had taken this cloth 649 00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:32,880 or whatever it was that I grabbed a shirt, I don't know what I 650 00:47:32,920 --> 00:47:37,760 picked up off the ground, and I just sort of cornered that little snowbird 651 00:47:37,320 --> 00:47:42,039 and I wrapped that cloth around the body of the bird, and I could 652 00:47:42,239 --> 00:47:45,679 I could feel the bird wriggling in my hand. I could feel it wriggling. 653 00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:47,199 And I said, we're gonna we're gonna set them free. We're gonna 654 00:47:47,199 --> 00:47:51,679 go outside. So I walked out with the bird in my hand, wriggling. 655 00:47:51,679 --> 00:47:52,559 I could feel it the whole time. I knew it was in my 656 00:47:52,599 --> 00:47:57,159 hand. And we walked around the corner here and all three of the kids 657 00:47:57,239 --> 00:48:00,440 came with me, and we walked out the door here and we walked out 658 00:48:00,480 --> 00:48:07,480 the back yard and I said, okay, one, two, three, 659 00:48:07,599 --> 00:48:10,880 and I opened the shirt or whatever it was, and there was no bird. 660 00:48:10,920 --> 00:48:15,599 It had vanished in my hands. Goodness, it is. So all 661 00:48:15,599 --> 00:48:19,199 three of us, all you know, three kids and me, all four 662 00:48:19,239 --> 00:48:22,840 of us saw this bird and then saw it vanish. Totally unexplainable. Don't 663 00:48:22,840 --> 00:48:27,119 know what happened. So here's the end of that story. And this is 664 00:48:27,239 --> 00:48:31,119 very recently. So I mentioned Maury Island. I mentioned some of the artifacts 665 00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:35,800 or some of the regalia that we were working on that kind of thing. 666 00:48:36,320 --> 00:48:39,760 Well, the story that was connected to the naming ceremony happened to be Snowbird. 667 00:48:40,199 --> 00:48:45,880 The snowbird story. And this is a very old legend and it was 668 00:48:45,079 --> 00:48:50,840 it was shared back in the eighteen hundreds. It was documented by the university. 669 00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:54,280 It's a very old tribal story. Anyway, without going into detail about 670 00:48:54,320 --> 00:49:00,760 that story, the day of the naming ceremony, the day just this is 671 00:49:00,840 --> 00:49:05,320 crazy, Okay. I got up and my wife and I we looked out 672 00:49:05,320 --> 00:49:13,039 our bedroom window and there was the same snowbird that vanished in two thousand and 673 00:49:13,119 --> 00:49:17,719 three. It was on the outside and it was looking in our window. 674 00:49:19,599 --> 00:49:23,920 That's the same snowbird. So two twenty three, it was twenty years later 675 00:49:24,920 --> 00:49:30,880 suddenly, and it was connected to the cultural story. And its face was 676 00:49:30,960 --> 00:49:35,679 black, and in the story, the face of the snowbird is charcoal black. 677 00:49:36,000 --> 00:49:37,639 It's part of the legend, it's part of the folklore. And that 678 00:49:37,679 --> 00:49:43,920 bird appeared and that was the same bird that disappeared in my hands in two 679 00:49:43,960 --> 00:49:47,960 thousand and three. So there you go. Goodness gracious, there's something about 680 00:49:49,079 --> 00:49:52,920 birds, like some cultures think of them as as you were saying, like 681 00:49:52,119 --> 00:49:58,280 an omen of death. Somethink about storms carrying messages from the spirit world. 682 00:49:58,679 --> 00:50:02,400 Yung talked about the significance of some of his patients and birds at the window. 683 00:50:02,599 --> 00:50:07,239 I'll tell you my own bird story very quickly. This was super weird. 684 00:50:07,679 --> 00:50:10,760 Weird at me to heck out, not because it was overly scary or 685 00:50:10,800 --> 00:50:15,599 spooky, but the synchronicity of it was uncanny. A couple of years ago, 686 00:50:15,920 --> 00:50:20,280 my daughter used to love even probably more recently, she still liked to 687 00:50:20,320 --> 00:50:22,239 do it, but she was really into it. A couple of years ago. 688 00:50:22,320 --> 00:50:25,280 She used to love to make little animals and little figures out of pipe 689 00:50:25,280 --> 00:50:29,159 cleaners, you know, colored pipe cleaners. I used to do it as 690 00:50:29,199 --> 00:50:30,920 a kid, and I guess I taught her how to do it. She 691 00:50:31,039 --> 00:50:35,039 used to like me to make things for her that she was interested in. 692 00:50:35,079 --> 00:50:37,320 So she might be like, make a pony, or you know, make 693 00:50:37,639 --> 00:50:43,239 this cartoon character or whatever. And one day she came over while I was 694 00:50:43,320 --> 00:50:47,639 working at my working on my laptop down on the kitchen table, which is 695 00:50:47,679 --> 00:50:51,360 in a corner of a room with glass kind of windows all around it in 696 00:50:51,440 --> 00:50:54,760 the cabin, and she wanted me to make a hummingbird for her. She 697 00:50:54,920 --> 00:50:59,239 literally had come over make me a hummingbird. I started to make her a 698 00:50:59,280 --> 00:51:02,239 hummingbird, probably over halfway through making her the hummingbird, and there was this 699 00:51:02,280 --> 00:51:06,559 big tap at the window. Something hit the window. My door was like, 700 00:51:06,599 --> 00:51:09,559 what was that? And we went over there and a hummingbird had flown 701 00:51:09,599 --> 00:51:15,559 into that window and had stunned itself and was literally lying there somewhat unconscious, 702 00:51:15,599 --> 00:51:16,239 and we went out and looked at it, and then it kind of woke 703 00:51:16,320 --> 00:51:22,280 up and it flew away. But what was the probability of my daughter deciding 704 00:51:22,320 --> 00:51:25,079 she wanted me to make her a hummingbird, and in the process of me 705 00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:30,320 making her the hummingbird out of pipe cleaners, that a hummingbird would fly into 706 00:51:30,360 --> 00:51:32,519 the window immediately next to us, get our attention, and be stunned, 707 00:51:32,519 --> 00:51:37,159 and then fly away when we looked at it. That was uncanny. So 708 00:51:37,239 --> 00:51:39,440 there is something about birds. I'm not sure what it is, but there's 709 00:51:39,480 --> 00:51:44,760 something about them that is so cool. I love that. That's a great 710 00:51:44,800 --> 00:51:47,519 story. I actually posted on Facebook at the time because I was so stunned. 711 00:51:47,519 --> 00:51:53,679 I went, I can't believe this just happened, very strange. I've 712 00:51:53,719 --> 00:51:59,599 got another couple of little stories here. I thought I would bring up the 713 00:51:59,679 --> 00:52:02,039 name eleven. We talked about the church that survived nine to eleven. Now 714 00:52:04,440 --> 00:52:07,440 talking about time travel, you know, So there was a woman named Bonnie 715 00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:14,800 h Mcaninny whose husband Emon died in the attacks on nine to eleven, and 716 00:52:14,880 --> 00:52:20,679 she wrote a book called Messages signs, visits and premonitions from loved ones lost 717 00:52:20,719 --> 00:52:23,880 on nine to eleven, And so there are all these cases of people that 718 00:52:24,000 --> 00:52:27,480 had an instinct, you know, not to go to work that day, 719 00:52:27,599 --> 00:52:30,079 or not to get on the plane. Or there are even artists that painted 720 00:52:30,079 --> 00:52:36,079 pictures or did artwork, you know, right before nine to eleven depicting the 721 00:52:36,159 --> 00:52:39,079 events. So I wanted to bring this up because let's talk about time. 722 00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:44,400 So there's a theory, and I think it's pretty plausible if you really think 723 00:52:44,440 --> 00:52:49,000 about it, you could argue that if there's an event that is big enough, 724 00:52:49,559 --> 00:52:54,480 if you imagine like a rock being thrown in a pond or a lake, 725 00:52:55,119 --> 00:52:59,559 a big rock right in the ripples, you know, coming from that 726 00:52:59,639 --> 00:53:05,599 event coming and if you think about time, let's say those ripples are rippling 727 00:53:05,719 --> 00:53:10,119 back through time because that event, that rock is so large enough, that 728 00:53:10,159 --> 00:53:15,639 would explain psychic phenomenon on a scientific level. I think it could. I'm 729 00:53:15,679 --> 00:53:17,760 not a scientist, but I think it's very logical what I just said. 730 00:53:19,159 --> 00:53:21,320 And I don't know where I heard that from. I think I heard that 731 00:53:21,400 --> 00:53:24,159 from somebody. I can't claim that I came up with that idea, but 732 00:53:24,199 --> 00:53:29,840 I think it's a brilliant idea. So a lot of people think that because 733 00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:32,800 nine to eleven was such a large event, so many people died and so 734 00:53:32,920 --> 00:53:37,440 dramatic that the ripples of time just like that rock being you know, thrown 735 00:53:37,480 --> 00:53:40,920 in the water, you know, rippled back and people could you know, 736 00:53:42,360 --> 00:53:46,639 collect that information in various ways, you know, so fascinating. There certainly 737 00:53:46,719 --> 00:53:54,119 were popular culture interpretations of nine to eleven before nine eleven, like everybody's seeing 738 00:53:54,159 --> 00:53:58,400 the Simpson kind of people have gone back to the Simpsons and showing them nine 739 00:53:58,400 --> 00:54:01,519 to eleven coding in there. And the classic Loan Government episode, which was 740 00:54:01,559 --> 00:54:07,079 the series from the X Men where not the x Men, the X Files, 741 00:54:07,239 --> 00:54:10,400 where the Loan Government are trying to stop this plot to take down the 742 00:54:10,440 --> 00:54:16,880 World Trade Towers by flying in a passenger airliner which has been taken over by 743 00:54:16,960 --> 00:54:22,039 some type of sinister remote control. So yeah, that was and there's there's 744 00:54:22,079 --> 00:54:25,119 other things. I think. I think fight Club has a weird I had 745 00:54:25,119 --> 00:54:30,639 a guest on recently. We're talking about the how the release of Fight Club 746 00:54:30,719 --> 00:54:37,159 and the collapsing of buildings in their coincided spooky with nine elevens. So yeah, 747 00:54:37,159 --> 00:54:40,239 I think there is some and I've also I've also heard ideas, and 748 00:54:40,280 --> 00:54:43,599 I'm not a physicist, I won't pretend to be one, but I've heard 749 00:54:43,639 --> 00:54:47,800 people suggest and high ends of physics today that perhaps things that happen in the 750 00:54:47,840 --> 00:54:52,480 present can somehow impact the past as well. And that's mind blowing. I 751 00:54:52,599 --> 00:54:55,599 think what is done, yeah, ca and somehow, like you're talking about, 752 00:54:55,639 --> 00:55:01,400 ripple out and affect things before they happened. Like it's just you know, 753 00:55:01,679 --> 00:55:06,159 it's anyway, it's so weird, it's so strange. It's so strange. 754 00:55:06,159 --> 00:55:08,400 It's weird. Yeah, Okay, So I've got a UFO story from 755 00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:12,559 China. I thought we'd just go to China. Why not. You don't 756 00:55:12,559 --> 00:55:15,639 hear about UFOs in China very often. So there's something called the and I 757 00:55:15,639 --> 00:55:22,360 want to I hope I'm saying this right. Kaifeng Kaifeng ufo debris incident in 758 00:55:22,480 --> 00:55:28,000 China. So on June twenty third, nineteen ninety at three am, people 759 00:55:28,079 --> 00:55:32,599 in the Henan province saw a row of orange and green lights in the sky, 760 00:55:34,159 --> 00:55:36,719 and there was a gentleman sleeping on the roof of the police station. 761 00:55:36,760 --> 00:55:40,280 He was a police officer, and you spell his first name x U I 762 00:55:40,320 --> 00:55:44,320 don't know how to pronounce it. But it was so hot. It was 763 00:55:44,320 --> 00:55:46,400 the summertime, so a lot of people were sleeping on the roofs just to 764 00:55:46,519 --> 00:55:52,960 escape the muggy heat in their houses. So he heard a loud thundering sound 765 00:55:52,000 --> 00:55:58,760 and saw a fireball, and then he saw an object detach and it kind 766 00:55:58,800 --> 00:56:04,559 of landed in a very populated area, and so he got on the horn 767 00:56:04,639 --> 00:56:07,960 and he deployed his officers. He's a police captain, and he deployed all 768 00:56:07,960 --> 00:56:12,760 these police to find where this object landed. And they found it in the 769 00:56:12,800 --> 00:56:17,840 courtyard of number twenty four and I can't pronounce the street in Kaifeng, And 770 00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:22,119 there was a man named Zing I think that's how you say his name, 771 00:56:22,760 --> 00:56:28,119 Xi Ng. And it was his residence that hit his trees in his courtyard, 772 00:56:28,800 --> 00:56:32,159 damaged his trees, and they found the object laying there. And the 773 00:56:32,559 --> 00:56:37,000 first thing it was very strange is they expected it to be red red hot, 774 00:56:37,840 --> 00:56:40,639 and it was cold to the touch. It was completely cold. And 775 00:56:42,360 --> 00:56:49,800 the object was fifty by eleven centimeters and it was kind of a triangular long 776 00:56:50,119 --> 00:56:54,719 object, the block of some kind. It weighed about six kilograms and very 777 00:56:54,760 --> 00:56:58,639 mysterious. They had a scientist. This is all documented, this is through 778 00:56:58,639 --> 00:57:01,159 the government there, so this is all traceable. You can look this up. 779 00:57:01,199 --> 00:57:07,679 This is verifiable anyway. They someone analyzed the contents of this object and 780 00:57:07,719 --> 00:57:12,760 they broke down a ratio of aluminum and different elements. You can look that 781 00:57:12,880 --> 00:57:16,320 up online. So about a year later, the trees in this courtyard started 782 00:57:16,360 --> 00:57:22,360 to die, and so the government was afraid maybe there was radiation, so 783 00:57:22,400 --> 00:57:27,320 they had everybody in that block, you know, you know, temporarily leave 784 00:57:27,400 --> 00:57:30,280 that block and had them checked out at the hospital for radiation poisoning. People 785 00:57:30,320 --> 00:57:37,079 were complaining they were feeling sick, and the person that owned the courtyard himself 786 00:57:37,280 --> 00:57:39,719 was feeling really sick. In fact, he had like a stroke and he 787 00:57:39,800 --> 00:57:45,119 ended up in the hospital and he was unresponsive, almost like a coma state. 788 00:57:45,960 --> 00:57:51,199 And so the story goes that he he went from completely no hope. 789 00:57:51,199 --> 00:57:55,760 He was, you know, he was scheduled to pass away to miraculously coming 790 00:57:55,760 --> 00:58:00,599 back to full health. And before he came back, uh, and and 791 00:58:01,199 --> 00:58:05,320 came back and you know, stood up in the room he said he was 792 00:58:05,480 --> 00:58:12,440 visited by two alien beings at the bedside, two little strange creatures that came 793 00:58:12,519 --> 00:58:15,760 up and talked to him, and they talked to him in his language, 794 00:58:15,760 --> 00:58:20,840 I guess, and they were definitely not human. And so it's one of 795 00:58:20,880 --> 00:58:23,199 those really cool stories from China. I'd never heard about it before. I 796 00:58:23,239 --> 00:58:25,639 thought, what the heck, let's talk about it. It's pretty neat. 797 00:58:27,039 --> 00:58:32,239 Wow. What was what it was? June twenty third, nineteen ninety so 798 00:58:32,280 --> 00:58:36,239 you know, June twenty fourth, that's the Kenneth Arnold. Yeah, and 799 00:58:36,760 --> 00:58:38,760 June twenty first is the Maury Island incident. So I thought, oh, 800 00:58:38,800 --> 00:58:43,880 this is kind of cool. June. Now this is is very similar to 801 00:58:43,960 --> 00:58:47,880 Maury Island in a way. But you said you touched fragments of Lent incident. 802 00:58:49,000 --> 00:58:52,199 Yeah, I touched the one remaining fragment that the Palmers have, Like 803 00:58:52,280 --> 00:58:58,360 apparently, I think ray Raymond a Palma had multiple fragments. I think he'd 804 00:58:58,360 --> 00:59:00,440 given them away, and this is all that the family we have, no 805 00:59:00,599 --> 00:59:05,119 one remaining Marie Island fragment given to them by this. This is the fragments 806 00:59:05,119 --> 00:59:08,039 that Fred Christman sent them that launched the entire story back in the day when 807 00:59:08,039 --> 00:59:14,719 he shipped them to Rape Harbor, and he that instigated the the investigation. 808 00:59:14,880 --> 00:59:16,719 So yeah, sorry, go on but yeah, it's it's a first story. 809 00:59:17,519 --> 00:59:22,079 I love tying it with Maury Island. The thing about this story is 810 00:59:22,119 --> 00:59:24,880 that the fragment disappeared, so like the government, you know, took it. 811 00:59:24,920 --> 00:59:28,440 They never brought it back. No one can access no one knows where 812 00:59:28,440 --> 00:59:30,960 it went. It's gone, it's it's so this is all documented, well 813 00:59:31,039 --> 00:59:35,519 documented, the police, force, the government. Everything. Wonderful story. 814 00:59:35,719 --> 00:59:42,599 So wow. Yeah, and just quickly ed, who's actually married to a 815 00:59:42,639 --> 00:59:45,440 lovely lady from China, said that, and I would never have known that 816 00:59:45,800 --> 00:59:51,159 the Chinese name x Use is pronounced she with two ease, so he gives 817 00:59:51,159 --> 00:59:54,320 it's a long she, and he said, and he correct himself as zing 818 00:59:54,400 --> 00:59:58,440 as in x i n g. I would have thought it was pronounced zing 819 00:59:58,960 --> 01:00:06,000 is actually pronounce shing shing oh sing so perfect. Thank you so much. 820 01:00:06,119 --> 01:00:08,440 That helps me a lot. I would have had no idea it's And I'm 821 01:00:08,440 --> 01:00:12,599 from Sydney where we have a very big Chinese population, but I'm terrible with 822 01:00:12,599 --> 01:00:19,480 some of the pronunciations as well. Here's something Horrace talking about the the meteor 823 01:00:19,519 --> 01:00:22,880 rte or the debris found. Smaller meteor rites are usually cold, not hot, 824 01:00:22,880 --> 01:00:27,079 wind found part of the story has elements of Lovecraft's Color Out of Space 825 01:00:27,159 --> 01:00:30,320 with a happier ending. That's awesome, that's true, Thank you, Horace. 826 01:00:31,599 --> 01:00:36,559 Super cool. But no, the More Island incident is it's just such 827 01:00:36,599 --> 01:00:38,480 a fascinating story. We could probably do a whole show just talking about that. 828 01:00:38,800 --> 01:00:43,880 You and I absolutely pretty sure you've got one more. I've got one 829 01:00:43,880 --> 01:00:45,639 more story. I'd love to hear another. I'm happy to go over if 830 01:00:45,639 --> 01:00:49,119 you've got another story for me. Okay, so I've got a great one. 831 01:00:49,239 --> 01:00:51,960 You guys are gonna love this. This is awesome. This is a 832 01:00:51,960 --> 01:00:55,119 local story, but it has you know, it connects to the American Civil 833 01:00:55,159 --> 01:01:00,440 War. It's a very strange story. It's not necessarily parent normal. But 834 01:01:00,480 --> 01:01:04,400 if there's any treasure hunters out there, I would challenge you, if you're 835 01:01:04,480 --> 01:01:09,000 interested in finding this object that I'm about to describe, I would welcome you 836 01:01:09,000 --> 01:01:12,519 to come. You know, find where we live. You could use our 837 01:01:12,519 --> 01:01:14,880 house as a base camp. I'll go out with y'all, show you the 838 01:01:14,920 --> 01:01:19,159 area I want to find this treasure. Here we go, so back in. 839 01:01:20,039 --> 01:01:24,719 Let's see eighteen fifty three. Mister George McClellan, you know the name 840 01:01:24,840 --> 01:01:29,159 from the Civil War, he was a general. He was a West Point 841 01:01:29,199 --> 01:01:32,039 graduate, served in the Mexican American War, and then he became a surveyor. 842 01:01:32,880 --> 01:01:37,599 He was a railway engineer and executive until the outbreak of the American Civil 843 01:01:37,639 --> 01:01:42,840 War eighteen sixty one. November eighteen sixty one to March eighteen sixty two. 844 01:01:43,280 --> 01:01:45,480 He was the commanding general of the US Army. That before that, he 845 01:01:45,559 --> 01:01:51,679 came out to good old North ben Washington, and he was here under Governor 846 01:01:51,719 --> 01:01:55,280 Isaac Stevens trying to locate a decent route to build a railroad from eastern to 847 01:01:55,320 --> 01:02:00,360 western Washington. Was surveying the land, and so he was very stubborn, 848 01:02:00,440 --> 01:02:04,840 you know. He was very stubborn, and he was he was insubordinate. 849 01:02:04,960 --> 01:02:07,280 He didn't listen to his boss, you know, and so there was a 850 01:02:07,280 --> 01:02:14,320 lot of tension between Governor Isaac Stevens and mister McClellan here, and so he 851 01:02:14,519 --> 01:02:16,599 kept a journal. He never wanted to listen to anybody. He'd always get 852 01:02:16,639 --> 01:02:20,880 lost in the woods. And so the story goes, and I heard this 853 01:02:20,920 --> 01:02:23,760 through my family. This is a folk tale that's been passed down forever. 854 01:02:24,159 --> 01:02:30,519 But apparently there was a canon, a military canon that George McClellan had brought 855 01:02:30,559 --> 01:02:32,679 to the area. Now, the purpose of this cannon was to defend the 856 01:02:32,800 --> 01:02:39,519 settlers and the US government from possible Native American attack from Yakiman other tribes, 857 01:02:39,880 --> 01:02:45,079 and so he was scheduled to mount this canon. In some versions of the 858 01:02:45,079 --> 01:02:50,840 story, he mounted the cannons cannon successfully on McClellan's butte, which is very 859 01:02:50,880 --> 01:02:54,440 close to the house here, and then later it you know, it never 860 01:02:54,559 --> 01:03:00,559 was used. And so the story is that the canon then at some point 861 01:03:00,639 --> 01:03:05,960 slipped off the mountain and maybe is buried in a landslide. So over the 862 01:03:06,000 --> 01:03:08,480 years, my grandparents, my dad would mention it. My grandpa he said 863 01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:13,079 it, man, if you could ever find that cannon from McClellan, man, 864 01:03:13,159 --> 01:03:15,800 that would be worth a lot of money. So somewhere buried under this 865 01:03:16,119 --> 01:03:22,800 rock slide, there is a cannon from eighteen fifty three, and it's one 866 01:03:22,840 --> 01:03:27,360 of those great treasures. The other story is that he was so embarrassed that 867 01:03:27,440 --> 01:03:31,400 he lost his load in the middle of the Snoqualmie River, and he actually 868 01:03:31,480 --> 01:03:36,320 the cannon and everything washed down river. But he was so embarrassed about it, 869 01:03:36,360 --> 01:03:38,639 and he told his men, don't tell anybody what happened, and so 870 01:03:38,719 --> 01:03:45,159 it's very possible that the cannon has also possibly buried under Interstate ninety. So 871 01:03:45,199 --> 01:03:49,079 that's the story I wanted to end with. And there you go, man, 872 01:03:49,159 --> 01:03:51,920 Bob. It was so much fun having you back on the show. 873 01:03:52,000 --> 01:03:53,440 It was great to talk to you last time. It was great to talk 874 01:03:53,519 --> 01:03:58,719 to you again now and now everybody listening and coming in the chat, we're 875 01:03:58,760 --> 01:04:01,079 having a great time and enthralled by your twels as well. How do people 876 01:04:01,079 --> 01:04:03,119 get a hold of you or how do people see what you're up to? 877 01:04:03,840 --> 01:04:08,079 Oh? Okay, well, you know, you just go on like Instagram. 878 01:04:08,159 --> 01:04:12,800 You can type in Bob Antone. There's also our band, Tinkham Road, 879 01:04:12,920 --> 01:04:17,199 which is on YouTube. It's It's also on Spotify and iTunes. It's 880 01:04:17,199 --> 01:04:20,360 the band that I play in. I also have a YouTube channel where I 881 01:04:20,360 --> 01:04:25,880 play music. I'm a music teacher. I have private students. It's my 882 01:04:25,920 --> 01:04:30,679 main main gig. But I love to tell stories and we love to research 883 01:04:30,719 --> 01:04:34,239 obscure history of the area. We worked with a lot of historical societies. 884 01:04:34,280 --> 01:04:38,679 So just type in our name and Google and it'll send you all over the 885 01:04:38,719 --> 01:04:42,920 damn place and they'll find us. You're one of those rare people, Bob, 886 01:04:42,960 --> 01:04:45,760 who's incredibly talented at more than one things. I mean, I think 887 01:04:45,760 --> 01:04:48,840 most people at myself, I'm happy if I'm talented at one thing. But 888 01:04:48,920 --> 01:04:54,760 you'll like this incredible storyteller and research and you're also just an amazing musician. 889 01:04:55,719 --> 01:05:00,119 One of the highlights of making this film has been having your song we that 890 01:05:00,199 --> 01:05:02,719 Ireland in it and being able to work out how to use that within the 891 01:05:02,800 --> 01:05:05,000 structure of the film. So it's become a big part of the film. 892 01:05:05,039 --> 01:05:09,840 As I was mentioning to you before, but thanks so much, but let's 893 01:05:09,880 --> 01:05:13,840 keep in touch you and I'll be talking anyway. And thank you so much 894 01:05:13,920 --> 01:05:16,239 for coming on the show tonight. Thank you so much. That was so 895 01:05:16,320 --> 01:05:18,920 much fun. I had a good time. It was a great time until 896 01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:21,320 I talked to you again, until I talk to everybody else out there. 897 01:05:23,199 --> 01:05:23,719 Keep it weird.