Hello, and welcome to the show. I'm Martin Willis your host, and
we have a great show this evening. I'm pretty excited about our guest,
Seth Breedlove. I'll talk about him in just a second. I do want
to say that I do have a little bit of housekeeping, so I want
everyone to please excuse the website. We're under going some work on it and
it's being migrated. Hopefully it's active when you're checking it out, and you
do want to go over there at this podcast UFO dot com, by the
way, but you want to go over there because we have a great blog.
It's one of two by Charles Lear and it's called the Kelly, Kentucky
UFO Goblins. I don't know if anyone's ever looked into the Hopkinsville Goblins are
called, or there's all different types of names for it. But this happened
back I believe it was August in nineteen fifty five, and it seems like
in the fifties there was a lot of things going on. It's a great
story if you have not heard about it. It was actually a horrific night
for a family. I think their name was the Langfords, and they were
dealing with these beings that were on the roof, and there was fireshot shots
fired, fire shot shots fired, and again it was a horrific night for
that family. And again it's this is the first part of that story.
Check it out over at podcast ufo dot com. I want to thank everyone
that supports the show. Anyone can do that, and we are encouraging people
to go to Patreon. We have a banner on a website that's linked right
to the Patreon page and there's also an RSS feed over there for your media
player. Our guest tonight is Seth Breedlove and he's an Ohio filmmaker and he's
written, edited, and produced and directed shorts in features about a variety of
topics, but he's best known for his production company and films they've produced under
the small Town Monsters banner. I was talking to him earlier, we were
talking about cities and small towns, so I like that title for him.
It fits him well. Seth helped launch in episodic series under the title of
On the Trail of and We're gonna be talking about On the Trail of UFOs.
He produced the first season along with his wife and went on to direct
shoot and edit the second season, which focused on Bigfoot, and then of
course he turned his attention to UFOs, which we'll be talking about tonight.
And this year Seth will also direct The Mothman Legacy that's always thought that was
pretty fascinating, and the Mark of the Bell, which that I've heard of
but I don't know anything about. We may touch on those topics later.
Welcome to the Show of Seth. Yeah, thanks so much for having me.
Yeah, Seth, so you you study a lot of different topics.
It must be hard to keep, uh, you know, informed about all
of them. How do you get all your information on, you know,
for the things you're looking into. It's it's funny. It was a lot
easier when I had a full time job because, as weird as that sounds,
because what I what I used to do, like what I got did
when I got into all this was medical billing. And when I was doing
the medical billing job, there's there's nothing. There was nothing else for me
to do in between all the data entry other than like listen to podcasts,
and so I found like I could listen to podcasts, I could listen to
old radio shows and stuff like that, which is how I sort of discover,
like the the old Flatwood's Monster radio interviews and stuff like that. I
found I used to have a much easier time of digesting information than I do
uh these days. So the way I do it now is I have to
very consciously set aside time in between each project, and every year it gets
a little more difficult because each year we're adding more and more projects. So
I mean, if you you know, in the beginning, it was one
maybe two in a year, and usually we were shooting, you know,
every every couple of months. This year, there was there was rarely a
month that went by or we weren't doing some sort of like in the field
production work, especially within the trail of UFOs filming, which ended up being
a close to thirty day shoot, which for us is a really extensive period
of time for us to be doing anything. So we shot that over the
course of three three different sort of major trips, and and then that included
that encompassed to all the states that you see in this series. So um
So, anyway, that the short answer is I have to make time to
really sit down and start taking in information for whatever I'm working on next.
But we also in the last year have brought on a research assistant named Heather
Moser who's been helping me a lot with all the different projects. She did
not work on on the trail of UFOs, which is interesting because it's like
the largest number of interviews we've ever ever had into anything, but she's hard
at work on the Mothman Legacy and the Mark of the Bowich and she helped
out with our Momo the Missouri Monster project as well, so she's she has
been a huge part of being able to get all the stuff done that I
need to get done. Wow. Interesting, Now did you actually you know,
was UFO was part of something you looked into, you know young,
or is this something that you you just you know, took on as far
as the rest of the series of things we're doing. Yeah, I think
it was. Actually UFOs were kind of an interest for me before most of
the other stuff, which is interesting because I've focused much more heavily on cryptids,
especially Bigfoot since we launched on small town Monsters. But it was UFOs
that I was really into in the beginning, and especially that very early era
of UFO research, like the nineteenth to late forties and at early fifties really
piqued my interest because it was so much it was rooted so much in like
the government involvement, and I always loved the idea of the They sort of
not loved the idea, but the shadowy government conspiracy side of that always appealed
to me, especially that that sort of just getting into the Cold War era,
So that stuff always appealed to me, and I was very much interested
in it. And we have touched We've touched on the UFO topic in a
number of our projects. I guess the first is probably The Moth Me at
a Point Pleasant, where we where we did discuss some of the UFO sightings
that were going on around Point Pleasant in the sixties. And then we got
into The Flatwoods Monster, which is very much a UFO film in my opinion.
I mean, it's all about you know, UFOs over over the state
of West Virginia. UM. So we've touched on it, but I don't
think I don't think we had ever really had a chance to really sort of
fully invest ourselves in it, and that was exciting to me when we decided
to hit hit this project. And I guess the hardest thing too for me
though, as someone who's into the topic of UFOs but has never invested myself
or not invest myself, but it has never sort of, um put put
my toe in the waters of the UFO community. That was a little intimidating
just coming into it because you're aware that we're we're always trying to appeal to
an audience of people who might not be aware of the UFOTO, you know,
And that's good. Yeah, And that's that's kind of how we come
at this stuff every project we do, and we do that mainly because that
seems to be our core audience or people who were just sort of starting to
get into these topics. So when we hit upon this, it was it
was perfect for me because I felt like, in a lot of ways,
I was learning along with the audience. So even though I've been interested in
UFOs for a long time, a lot of this stuff that we were including
in the series, I had just learned or was learning, especially like the
airship waves has been fascinating for me for the last year and my friend Mark
and I had really done a deep dive on that topic for our podcast,
And because of that, that's why airships ended up on the trail of UFOs.
Is because it was something I was excited about at the time. Same
way with we did an entire episode, episode number six about mystery lights,
and that's why we we'd that's something I've just gotten into the last year or
so. It's a passion project in a way. But also, you know,
it's not yeah, well, you know, we do have um there's
a lot of people that are seasoned listeners that have been paying attention to this
topic a long time, but there's also I hear from new people listening to
the show all the time, new people that are interested in this topic,
and it's the topic is new to them. So a lot of times,
you know, I don't think to get into a description of something. It's
not a good thing that sometimes I just assume that someone knows what Roswell was,
or or Kecksburg or any other sighting phoenix lights or you name it.
But it really is good. You know. Maybe it's a little boring because
some people that's heard the story over and over again, but for the new
person out there that's looking for information, I think it's great and that we
should, you know, explain a little more. And I did watch your
series. I watch the screeners and I agree you you actually are. There
was a lot of things I knew, but some of the things I learned
too, So let's see. That's that's that's the biggest That's the biggest compliment
for me is that, UM, I honestly expected this to be a series
that that sort of UFO UM. The people that are educated on the UFO
subject might not get as much out of it, But we very consciously we're
trying to hit that middle ground where yes, we're putting a bunch of information
in here that's already out there, but we're also trying to give enough breadcrumbs
that that someone that's well educated on the subject can follow along too and find
things that are interesting. I think I think the key is, honestly what
is said in the first episode, which is that we were going to put
the focus back on the people. So so so many of like the the
television shows and stuff about this subject are about UM actors running through the woods
chasing lights in the sky, and that just wasn't something we wanted to do.
And what I really wanted to do was was let that the investigators and
researchers we talked to sort of tell tell the story of ufology, but also
let us have some insight into who they are as well. And that goes
doubly for for witnesses and experiencers we talked to, Like, I think you
can't you can't have a series like this if you're not going to UM you
know, have a good number of witnesses and people that are willing to talk
about their own experiences with the subject. And I think that's what keeps people
like yourself maybe invested as well, is that, you know, like,
for for all the information you might know about like Area fifty one, you
probably had never heard Dan Weiese's story. And Dan Dan is the you know,
the witness we interviewed in the first episode. I don't know why I
talk about Dan probably more than anyone in this entire series. He's he's a
friend of mine and he had told me that story years ago and it's always
stuck with me. UM And I think the reason it really stands out is
because if you go to the spot and you see where he claimed this happened,
it's the most bizarre thing to have happened in that location because it's such
a populated area. Why don't explain that a little? Yeah, yeah,
Dan Dan was just a little kid. This would have been the very early
nineties, and him and his sister were staying at their grandmother's house. Him
and both of his sisters actually were staying at their grandmother's house, and they
had gone outside for a walk, and actually it was just him and his
older sister, and then his other older sister had also been out for a
walk, but they weren't together. They were walking and they they fixed for
some reason, something caught their attention off to the east. They were in
a town called Barbaraton, Ohio, and it's a populated town. It's a
it's a very I would I would hesitate to call it a city, but
it's basically a large suburb of Akron, so it's a part of Acron Essentially,
it's a very populated area. They were in a populated section of town.
They were walking, they something caught their gaze. They looked off to
the east and what they saw was a light, or I guess a series
of flashing lights in the sky that he said looked like a carnival ride,
you know, like I can't remember the name of the specific ride he referenced,
but but there's a ride, you know, that actually looks like a
UFO with the flashing lights all around the edge, And that's essentially what he
thought he saw coming across the sky, and him and his sister saw it.
His other sister who was coming up the road at the same time,
saw it, and then a jogger who was coming down the road at the
same time saw it. So you had three three of the kid three of
the west children see it, and then this other guy that they they ran
into saw it as well. The object came across the sky sort of seemed
to hover and then go down behind these trees, which would be the only
section of the area that is not neighborhood how built residential buildings, commercial buildings.
Is this giant forest that sits in the middle of this town. It
seemed to hover and go down behind the trees into that forested area. They
never saw it leave, They just saw it together. And now there isn't
there. There are some some some things that are involved in that story that
I would really want to get back into at some point. One of them
is the fact that there seemed to be a number of minds under Barberton.
In fact, the mines that are down there stretch all the way to Lake
Erie, which is about forty miles to the north, and these were I
don't want to say salt mines. I can't remember what kind of mind they
were, but they there's also there's so large the mines down there are so
large that they actually store they stored all the old excavate earth movers and excavators
down there as well, and these are still down there as far as I
can fine, So we're curious to do a little bit of digging into the
no pun intended, we're curious to do a little bit of digging into what
actually is in that forest and maybe beneath that forest. Because the other part
of that story that got left out is that Dan is almost convinced that shortly
after their sighting, there was a fence erected around the forested area. Now
we went, we went back there, and it looks to us like you
can get in there today. So there's no there's no fence. So he's
not he's not positive he's remembering that, right, you know. I mean
I think he was like, I think he was like nine years old at
the time, so he was pretty going. But he was almost positive that
they had put up this spense after the fact. Yeah, so anyway,
that that event really affected him, and I think the episode it all takes
place in episode one. I think episode one, you get a good sense
that it affected him in a major way, to the point where he's still
really curious about it today. And he talks to his sister on the phone
in the episode and you can kind of hear her corroborate history and she thinks
about it as well. I just think that that the effect that even just
seeing something for seven seconds in the sky can have on a witness is really
impactful. Oh. Absolutely absolutely. I was I'm going to bring up someone
that's on your show because I've I've his friends on Facebook and know this gentleman
and he contacted me, I don't know, a couple of years ago and
he said, hey, you remember you were at my house and looking at
my antiques and for auction and all that stuff. And I said, oh,
yeah, yeah, yeah, how you doing and all this stuff?
And he goes, well, guess what, I'm listening to your show and
you had him on your show. Dean Merchant. Oh Dean, yeah,
yeah, yeah, Dean's great. We The strangest thing about Dean's interview is
that it was. I mean, that's one thing. What you've seen is
eight episodes on the Trail of viet Those features almost thirty interviews, clocking in
it over two hundred and seventy minutes, and we still have enough content that
we could have cut four or five more episodes, Like if time and money
weren't an object, we would have easily had another four or five episode,
three or four episodes in there, and Dean would have been featured in another
few because he had a lot of information about a lot of topics that we
never actually got to in this season. So we're really hoping to be able
to do multiple seasons. But Dean's are really knowledgeable. I call him like
a UFO historian because I don't know what else to refer to him, as
he's not crazy about like the investigator or researcher, you know label right,
Well, I invited him on this show, and he's possibly going to come
on at some time in April or May something like that. He's got the
great New England accent too. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. The funniest
thing about his New England accident was I shipped off his I have to send
off the interviews to be transcribed, and this time around, I hired a
service that was computerized, and the computer had no idea what was happening.
His reading his interview is one of the funniest things I've ever seen in my
life. Oh, that's a riot. I hope, I hope you let
him know that. Yeah, I'll have to. Yeah, I haven't yet.
Yeah. Oh that's great. That's great. Um, and so we're
going into breaking about four minutes or so that if you would, um,
well, first of all, Shannon LeGrow from Las Vegas, if I remember
right, Um, she's like the lead person. Um, basically it's it
looks, you know, it appears from watching the videos that it's basically her
in the lead. But you you're there and you're you're throwing some questions to
some of the people. And so, how did you find She's a very
nice woman? How did you find Shannon? We've Shannon and I have been
friends since before I started Spontime Monsters, and we enough we met at a
Finding Bigfoot town hall taping town hall meeting taping here in Ohio back in twenty
fourteen, during this very short period of time where she lived in Ohio.
So we met in twenty fourteen, and then she worked with me last year.
She was in one episode, well she's in three episodes of On the
Trail of Bigfoot, but we were together out in the out in the field
for one episode of On the Trailer of Bigfoot, which is the final episode,
episode six, And I liked the way we worked together and her approach
to witness interviews and just her approach to these topics in general is really similar
sort of to mine. And also I don't really like being on camera.
I was on camera for On the Trailer of Bigfoot. I was the lead
for that series, and I kind of hated it. So I asked her
if she would sort of be the you know, the face and the voice
on the trailer of UFOs. So it is it's her story, um,
you know in her stories that she's joining us to make to make the series.
I mean, we don't really make up hooks, you know. I
think a TV show would have made up some sort of hook for this.
Um, we didn't really do that. It's it's pretty much explicitly stated in
the first episode she's going on her own journey to learn about the subject,
and she's joining small town monsters as we make the series to do it so
it you know, we try we try to do pretty much everything is honestly
and upfront as we can possibly be with this sort of thing. Um.
You know, she she's leading a lot of the the interviews, um especially,
and I think I think as as the person sort of at the center
of it, she she does a terrific job of anchoring the whole thing right
right. And you know, there's actually you know, speaking of Las Vegas.
Um. You know Peggy who runs our Facebook page and um, but
there's a lot that actually happened in Las Vegas. There's a lot of sightings.
Um. You know. Yeah, I'm friends with someone that is not
into UFOs and she found out I was. She's in the She was actually
on TV for um, I can't remember the channel, but she basically did
decorating and stuff like that. And I've known her for a while and she
said, oh, you guess I just saw your show in UFOs, And
she started telling me about this amazing, huge black triangle she saw right outside
of our hotel room and down to Las Vegas. Pretty amazing phoenix. The
Phoenix lights were also seen in Vegas, which was like something that I found
when we were interviewing David Weatherley for the for the series, is that there
were sightings of the Phoenix las in Vegas, which I had never heard of
before. So yeah, I'm not I'm not as in the loop. Yeah,
Okay, Well it's we're gonna head into break, so everyone hanging there
will be right back right after. These messages still live on YouTube and right,
so let's let's talk on miss break here. Let's let's talk a little
bit about what happens in um in Ohio. Have you looked I mean,
actually a lot of things happen in Ohio in particular, but is that something
you've ever looked into as far as the UFO of sightings and yeah, yeah.
The most frustrating part about this first season of On the Trail of UFOs
was we didn't get to do the coin incident at the Coincident because yeah,
yeah, because that was like I actually spoke at a mouf on conference.
I was asked to speak at a mouf on conference this past year, and
that was my first time really learning about it. Again, I'm a newbie,
so take it easy on me. But but I had never been aware
of that incident and what really it's it's kind of CLUSI into, like what
a monster nerd I am, because like the thing that caught my attention about
it is where the where the the UFFO first intercepted the helicopter would have been
right over um Charles the Charles Mill Lake and Charles Mill Lake in the fifties
had a really famous local monster called the Charles Mill Lake Monster, which was
sort of a creature from the Black Lagoon type monster. And so as soon
as they said something about Charles Mill Lake had piqued my interests. But was
what was really cool about that was the fire chief of the county was there.
And it turned out that the fire chief back when the incident took place,
When when the coin helicopter incident took place, the fire chief was a
teenager and him and like twenty other kids saw the UFO intercept the helicopter from
the ground, So I had I was really excited about the idea of doing
some retelling of that incident on the trail of Bufo. So I'm really hoping
we can get a season two off the ground because I'd love to do that.
But beyond that portage, the Portage Lakes or the Portage County UFO chase
is one of my always been one of my favorite UFO stories. I'm super
fascinated and that we've got a couple of minutes. Can you talk about that.
The coin one always fascinated me as well. And basically a UFO actually
levitated the helicopter. It actually grows up. It was very scary and anyone
could check that out if you just go into coin. I don't. I
can't remember if that spelled CEO why And it's like I think I think it's
CEO y n E. And they were flying. They were flying from an
air base in Cleveland down to me. I think he said in Mansfield,
um, you know, and they if you if you know the area that's
Charles Mill Wake is like right in between those two two locations, and so
I guess yeah. They started sort of they had basically what amounts to like
I mean, it was it was a long period of time where they essentially
had almost like a dog fight. Um. And what was interesting to me
was the crew of this helicopter, despite what should have been sort of a
really intimidating or at the at the very least intimidating, if not downright terrifying
encounter. They were never actually scared, in fact, like they all sort
of talked about how how they were all more fascinated and excited by what they
were seeing. In the entire crew of this helicopter were witnesses to whatever this
object was, and they will corroborate this story. One of them is still
a detective in Cleveland today, one of the crew, and the other one
recently moved. One of the other ones moved down to Atlanta and as a
member of the police department in Atlanta. And I can't remember what happened to
everyone else as you got going back on ye all right, welcome back.
My guest is Seth Breedlove and we were actually talking during the break up.
You mentioned a famous UFO case in Ohio that is one of your favorites,
and I ever heard of it. Can you tell me what that case is
called? Again? The Coin No, the other one, the Portage County.
Yeah, I don't know of that one. I'm pretty sure you'd do.
It's it's given a lot of different names. The reason why I call
it the Portage County UFO chases because it originated in Portage County. But it's
the one where the where the two police officers started getting calls about about a
UFO. They see it and they proceed to chase it all the way into
Pennsylvania. Yes I know, yes, uh yeah, and they're told they're
told it's a it's being they're chasing the plane at venus essentially with other,
you know, law enforcement officials from all over the the state sort of joining
in. But I call it Portage County because that first patrol car that goes
rushing towards Pennsylvania was actually in Portage County, which is only like fifteen minutes
from where I live. But that's always been one of the most fascinating to
me because of the the way the policemen were treated simply for reporting what they
encount that's right. And how many there were quite a few involved. Was
it something like six or was it I think I want to say it was
six, but it might have been more than that. And I heard a
great talk about this like a year ago. I can't remember the guy's name.
Now that's going to drive me crazy, but but I've always been really
fascinated with that story because it's so close to us. But I'm I'm always
drawn to stories more because of the human component and the and the way that
that story negatively affected the witnesses. I always thought was really really kind of
sad and spoke. So it sort of speaks to the to the larger way
witnesses are treated in general, or at least were treated, particularly at that
time for coming forward with the sighting, and especially if you were working in
law enforcement. It seems like it was a really just a terribly negative thing
that ended up honestly destroying the careers of a few of those guys that were
involved in it. That's that's not that's not unusual unfortunately. UM, what
do you think if I ask you this question, do you think you know
anything more about this topic of what these things might be or do you think
you know less about it since you actually went into this. Uh, I
think I probably know. I think I probably know a little bit less.
If you're going on and you're trying to sort of subscribe to one of those
right, and then you realize that there aren't a lot of commonalities between encounters,
Um, there are, but there aren't, and you know we point
them out in episode two. I think we tried to do a somewhat decent
job of pointing out some of the commonalities and like craft descriptions, and you
can definitely like start drawing from the data, you know, as far as
what all the all the what we're putting out in the series. You can
start to draw from that and draw lines between some things. But I think
at the end of the day, I have no I don't know that I
even have a theory anymore that dominates any of the others as to what is
what is actually going on? Right, Yeah, I have no idea.
And you had Linda Zimmerman on which I have a lot of respect for,
a really nice lady, and I think she said something along the lines of
this flying saucer was in fashion at that time. And it's kind of it's
kind of funny because you know, I mean, people are seeing different things
than you know, what I saw would be described as a flying saucer in
two thousand and six. But you know, there's a cigar uf shaped UFOs
and some people say, well, those are just the saucer shaped, you
know, at a side view, But a lot of people are describing actually
seeing you know, cigar shape UFOs. And you know, the funny thing
about those, the more people I've talked to that talk about those have all
said almost all said that they've seen like portholes like um, yeah, little
round windows on them, which is really bizarre. Yeah, and that's a
that's a that's another correlation to those airship reports from the from the early nineteen
hundreds. Yeah. Yeah, So let's let's talk a little bit about those,
because people, I mean, if you go back, you can see
the old newspaper clippings of some of these what they called airships, and you
know, they weren't dirigible, so I mean they didn't uh, some of
these actually were you know, um, these reports were prior to when those
were flying the round. Yeah, that's was just at the height of a
major airship wave that was sort of going all around the West coast. Uh.
In this in this series we get into the ones more on the East
Coast, especially like the Hudson Valley flap that was happening in the in the
early nineteen hundreds. But there was that very late eighteen hundreds flap of sightings
that started in like San Francisco. If you do any sort of archival newspaper
archival research into airships, you'll find no shortage of very detailed reports that we're
being run in newspapers at the time of encounters with these flying craft that we're
singing over, like San Francisco, San Jose, I mean San Diego,
They're all over that California area, and then they start going moving out into
the Midwest. What's really interesting is you can track them, you know,
like you'll there's there's actually points in time where you'll see you're you're able to
track their movement by the reports popping up in the newspapers around the country.
Um so they start in one area and then they move out across you know,
the country. And obviously, if you're a skeptic, your response to
that is going to be, well, that's just other newspapers picking that same
story up and they start running their own, you know, falsified version of
it. And that is like anytime you do archival research, that's a danger
you'll run into. Is newspapers in the eighteen hundreds and nineteen hundreds, some
would argue, up till today love making up stories to sell papers, and
yeah, yeah, and and so you do run into that. But a
lot of these stories have a lot of details that are that are able to
be corroborated. So you've got names of witnesses and things like that that in
a story that's falsified in a newspaper, they typically wouldn't add those details.
So as long as you can at least corroborate some of these people existed,
that that in itself is a major indication that some of these things actually happen.
Um. So yeah, those those airship waves are super interesting to me.
And when you get into the nineteen hundreds waves that hit like the East
Coast and especially that Hudson Valley area, Um, those those get really interesting
as well because of the fact that there are actual encounters with In some instances,
there's actual encounters with the occupants or the people that are said to be
piloting the vehicles and they get off the ship and they'll talk to someone and
they'll claim to be from like you know, New York City or Europe or
something. But there's that didn't happen. This was all happening well before dirigibles
were really taking to the skies. So you know, I've heard people sort
of conspiracy theorist posset that maybe this was like the government testing some sort of
aircraft or something like that. But you know, when you get into those
eighteen hundreds reports, that starts to make you scratch your head. Well,
especially because I think it was in Britain, but back in I think it
was prior to eighteen ninety there was a report and a lot of people saw
this hairship they called I may have called it something else, ghost ship or
something like that, but a bright light shot down to the ground and everybody
reported that. And you know, they didn't have the technology at that time
to do something like that, which is that's that's interesting something, that's something
that Linda talks about. Actually in the Hudson Valley flap was that and this
is like nineteen thirteen, I I don't remember the exact date Linda gifts,
but they were these they were shining these bright lights while they're flying across the
sky. And Linda relates that farmers and people living in the area would look
out their window in the middle of the night and there would be these ships
moving above their fields with these lights like combing, combing the ground. And
this is, you know, the very early nineteen This is the earliest days
of the twentieth century. So it seems to to sort of point to something
a little more unusual than an experimental craft, right, And I think as
she also talks about maybe it's not her, but someone does about beings on
top of a craft, standing cop and waiting or am, I think,
yeah, I've heard that story, but I don't think that was one that
she told. What's interesting too about those airship waves is that there's some some
similarities to the Black Triangles or even just even just like the Phoenix Lights where
they you know, they're obviously some of this is going to be because these
are airships and they were moving slower, but there's there's similarities between the airships
and the Black Triangles, and that they start in one area and they just
sort of like move over a location as if they want to be seen.
Um, you know that that's that was always what was so unusual about the
Phoenix Lights to me is that, if I think doctor Keti said that,
it looked like a parade more than anything, like they were wanting to be
noticed. And some people would argue that that's the way that the airships were.
You know, it wasn't like they were trying to stay It wasn't like
the airships were trying to stay hidden. They were, you know, they
were very bold about the fact that they're flying around out there and people can
interact with them and see them at night. And I would say I would
argue that in a lot of cases, it seems like the Black Triangles,
especially in the Hudson Valley area. Again, the Hudson Valley comes up a
lot, mostly because I'm fascinated by those cases, but also because it's I
feel like the Hudson Valley UFOs stuff is overlooked a lot these days, and
I think it was really important to uphology. I don't know if you would
agree with that or not. Well, I think there were tens of thousands
of people that saw something. It wasn't just like a few. Yeah,
there's a lot, a lot of witnesses. Yeah, But that was something
I a conclusion I can do while I was editing the series. Actually,
it was just the strange similarities between the airship waves and the Black Triangle waves,
and how the behavior of the craft actually seems very similar, e release
similar in some situations, right right, Yeah, I don't know. I
just love the early cases. And you know, I have Dave Marler's going
to be on next week. We're not going to be talking about black triangles,
but we may touch on a little bit. But you know, he's
the go to for that and I have his book. Oh you do.
Yeah, I do believe the first sighting of a of a triangle was in
the late nineteenth century. I do believe. I think we might have referenced
it. I can't remember. It's been a while since I edited episode two.
We might have referenced that sighting because Alejandra actually talked about Marler and the
work he had done during his interview, So I'm not sure if a few
referenced that are not. But um, yeah, that that to me is
really intriguing as well, just the idea that black triangles might have been around
long before, you know, like most people credit them as showing up in
the in the eighties and nineties. It would be really fascinating if you could
track down sightings from from that far back. Yeah, yeah, I saw
that Alejandra was in there and out there. That keep asking me how he
is. I've talked a little bit about him last week, and he's just
taken a little break from the UFO scene for the most part, but he'll
probably will be back. But he's just he's concentrating on doing something different and
you know, hopefully we'll have him back. He says, he is paying
attention to the UFO headline. So so, but he's doing really well for
all those out there that wonder how he's doing. And I did see him,
you know, I see how he's edited in into most of the episodes,
isn't he Yeah, he's in. I think I think the real like
mouthpieces for the series end up being David Weatherly alejanigou Man. Those two were
in almost every episode. Linda is in I think five or six of the
eight, so it's it really is pretty pretty heavy. They're they're featured,
you know, and I know going into it who I think is going to
end up being that sort of figure. So I knew, because of how
knowledgeable he is about the history of the whole thing, kind of knew going
into it that he would be featured pretty heavily. So when he we interviewed
him for like two and a half three hours, which for us is a
is a very long period of time. Our interviews don't usually last long.
But I made sure to hit pretty much everything. I mean, he talked
about contacts, he talked about you, know, the Black Triangles airships.
He talked about pretty much everything. Yeah, yeah, no, he's great.
He's a really a bit a lot of knowledge there. And you said
there was did you say there were thirty people interviewed totally? And I think
that I think the total number that we interviewed is like twenty nine. But
you know there's a couple of people that were in there that there was actually
an interview that was shot with a guy named Mark Munsey who's an author in
Florida, and his interview got scrapped because the audio got destroyed while we were
in the Chestnut Ridge in Pennsylvania. That's terrible when something like that happened,
it's too bad. Yeah, it's frustrating. Yeah, oh absolutely. Yeah.
We've had our We've had our audio problems on this show too. It
just does happen. And when you're live, it's a you know, you
have that one shot. Um, what would you say, is to your
the favorite case of yours that you looked into for this for this series?
Yeah? Yeah, I mean I think it does come back to like Dan
Weis, but we already talked about that one, so it's probably going to
be the Gary Treibert from from the Hudson Valley. UM. And what's really
frustrating again about the fact that there's only eight episodes in the series, that
Gary could have had a whole episode like just for himself to talk about all
the things that have that have happened to him, because he alludes to it
in the in the abduction episode. UM that that what he talks about in
that episode is just one small facet of what's gone on in his life.
UM, he had. I don't know if that's here or on your end,
but they're probably grant that they're coming to get me. UM. Now,
Gary, Gary, when he was a kid, was um was seeing
craft on above this hill outside of his parents' house in upstate New York,
UH, specifically the Hudson Valley area, And there was a gravel quarry and
there were multiple instances where he saw this craft sort of hovering above above the
forest up on the quarry. And one time him and his dad walked up
to see because they saw his craft, and they walked up together to get
a closer look, and I guess about halfway up, his dad turned him
home and said you go back home. And Gary went home and his dad
was gone for hours and that that part of the story is really unusual,
but it's what happens next is so much more unusual. And this did not
make it into that episode because it's so bizarre. I could not find a
way to put this in there and have it make sense for the audience.
And I'm probably going to do a terrible job of recalling this. But basically,
Gary, after that instance where he saw the UFO above the gravel Corey
as a kid, he went into the woods one day and encountered a man
who was wearing coveralls and was about four feet tall, and the man had
a cartoon face. This is how Gary recalls it. The guy. The
guy had a like a cartoon face or something like that. But Gary seems
to believe that that instance incident was sort of either a you know, like
maybe a memory that was planted in his head or something, and he believes
that that was potentially the first time he was abducted. And years later Gary
would and this is actually in episode seven. Gary does believe he had an
instance of abduction or missing time in which he was he was driving to the
to the grocery store or something to get beer in the middle of the night,
and halfway there he started noticing his car was being followed by a light
in the sky, and he comes he's coming on his back road. He
comes around a bend in the road and all of a sudden, the craft
is down in the middle of the road, And like two three hours later,
he wakes up or comes to or whatever you want to call it,
not knowing what happened to the hours prior. He didn't even realize how much
time had passed until he drives into town and goes to the grocery store and
walks in and realizes as they're closing he had left home at like he had
left home at like eight o'clock and it was now almost midnight something like that,
and realizes all this time's beast goes home, and then later he would
have some Some things happened physically, he was waking. He woke up with
scoop marks on the back of his neck, which he was he actually showed
to us he had. One day he was out fixing his car and he
started feeling dampness on his leg. He looked down and there was blood seeping
through his pants. Not there wasn't a rip, it was like blood was
was coming out of his pants. He goes inside, he drops his pants
and he's got a massive scoop mark in his leg um that almost looks cauterized
where blood is now pulling inside of um. And then he started getting and
then he started waking up with nosebleeds, with with dried blood all around his
face. And and I guess one of these times he woke up with with
the nosebleed. He went into his children's room the next morning. He had
three twins, and then his wife also had a son um wow, And
when they went into the bedroom, all four of these kids had blood coming
out of their nose. So the triplets and the little boy had had blood
coming out of their nose. What was really strange about that to me?
And this is one this probably points to a larger, a larger, you
know, statement about experiencers and how they all react differently to what happens to
them. But Shannon was really curious if Gary, how Gary felt about that,
you know, because now your homes being invaded, your children are being
brought into this, how do you feel about it? And he was very
I don't know how to put it. I don't know how to put it
right. He wasn't angry. If this was me, I'd be angry,
you know, I'd be very very angry. I'd want to know what's happening.
I'd want to protect my children. Was his reaction wasn't anger It was
it was more of a sort of like acceptance of what's happening. And I
thought that was really an interesting dichotomy with how you would expect him to react
to something like that. But what I just said is honestly barely, barely
scraping the surface of all the things that he told us about while we were
in there. His interview went for about forty five minutes, and it was
really him just sort of recalling all these things that happened. He recalled his
mom having sightings um outside of their house as a child, of lights and
the sky, he recalled um, he recalled his his I believe it was
his mom came into his room when he was a kid, and and oh
maybe it was him. Maybe maybe he recalled going into his children's room and
seeing something in the room in the middle of the night. UM. So,
whatever whatever the case may be, it was was pretty obvious that whatever
had happened to him had never stopped and seemed to be generational. Wow.
Wow, that's really interesting. Well I have to tell you up. Well,
first of all, I'm going to tell something a little personal about myself
that I'd never really talk about. And uh, but it's nice and that
is up. Um. Well it all started. I went into Staples,
Local Staples up to do some work on an appraisal that I'm doing basically for
the antiques world, and um, the the girl at the counter said,
oh, I like your lighthouse that you have for your logo. What made
you choose a lighthouse? And I said, well, I said, it's
an interesting story. My father was a lighthouse keeper in the Coast Guard and
he was lonely at a place called a whale back light in kit Re,
Maine. He was very lone. He was from Georgia and so he's out
there all alone for like a long stretch at a time. So he would
call the operator just for someone to talk to. And he met the operator
and fell in love with her. And that was my mother. So it's
quite a story. So I told her that story and she said, oh,
that's great. She goes, hey, have you gone to the local
lighthouse out here? And I said, yeah, I've been there. It's
quite nice. And she says, did you know it's haunted? And I
said, it's Al's Head Lighthouse. I guess it has a story of being
haunted. So I said no, I didn't know that. And anyway,
so she goes, well, I said, out, you know, guess
what I do a show on UFOs. And so she started to tell me
the story and it was very interesting. I love hearing UFO stories from people
that don't really pay attention to the UFO topic and they had an experience and
they are probably telling the experience for maybe a couple of times in their life
or whatever, or anyway, it's always interesting. And she said something along
the lines of basically describing what she saw, which was some type of craft
and lights, and then her parents seeing it. But then her parents the
next day had no idea and she said it was almost like they didn't know
the time had gone by. And it's again, it's like the missing time.
You mentioned that. That's kind of what a lot of people talk about,
this missing time thing, which I think is fascinating. It's not unusually
you can go it. Yeah, his story. Gary's story really reminded me
of very Arc, who we interviewed for our Invasion on Chestnut Ridge movie back
in twenty seventeen. He Barry had very similar occurrences to Gary, almost eerily
so, in that he was driving somewhere one night, sees a light and
Sky wakes up hours later, doesn't know what happened, and then starts suffering
from physical effects after the fact, you know. And Barry Clark was a
major UFO case investigator in the nineteen seventies with Stan Gordon. He was one
of Stan Gordon's like right hand guys. And Barry was so studious and in
documenting things that happened to him. He had file cabinets full of cases he
had looked into, and when all of this started happening, it drove him
out of the field to the point where he burned all of his files.
The stuff, the stuff that happened to him was so traumatic, and I
mean, this was the only time we've ever had this happen. He actually
shut yet, he had to shut off the cameras and he told us,
like all these things that had happened, he didn't want to document it.
And I'm not permitted obviously to tell what happened to him. But it was
one of the more disturbing interviews I've ever been a part of because you could
immediately see how much it affected him emotionally and mentally even to that day.
Wow. Wow, it's amazing. In the scoop marks you talked about,
that's something you do here quite a bit about. It's not unusual. We're
actually going into a real break this time. So when we come back about
a half hour into the next segment, we're going to be taking phone calls.
So that number, if you want to write it down, is,
let's see, it's eight five five four seven two five four eighty three.
And again we'll be doing that about a half hour in. And my guest
tonight is Seth Breedlove and we'll be right back right after these messages. All
right, everyone, welcome back to the show. My guest tonight is Seth
Greedlove, and we were talking about his series called On the Trail of UFOs
and so, what other on the Trail series do you have on the Trail
of big Foot? I can see that one. Yeah, It's it's funny
because the idea behind the entire on the Trail of concept is kind of changed
originally on the Trail of each season was going to focus on a different subject.
So the first season was all about the Lake Monster champ that said to
the reside in Lake Champlain, and then from there we did On the Trail
of Bigfoot. But it's going to morph now because On the Trail of big
foot's about the pick up a season two, and that's going to be happening
at the same time that On the Trail of the Lake Michigan Mothman, which
is a special event that's probably going to be around ninety minutes, will come
out. So it's basically morphing into its own sort of sub subsect of small
town monsters. It's it's basically our way to do episodic storytelling. We'd really
like to do a second season on the Trail of UFOs. So what we're
looking to do eventually is get to the point where we would have like On
the Trail of Bigfoot running, on the Trail of UFOs running, and then
another on the Trailer of sort of series each year, and that's addition to
the films we put out. So there's a lot a lot in her future.
But yeah, On the Trail of Bigfoot was sort of the one that
propelled the entire idea forward, and that came out last year and it's at
like four million people have watched on the Trail of Bigfoot. So that's that's
what really helped set that path for us. I know this isn't about UFOs,
but I'm still a little bit fascinated about the Lake Champlain. Did you
find anything interesting, anything interesting come out of that? Well? I that's
actually the only STM project I didn't direct. I produced that. But what
Alexander Pettikov, who directed it, put in the series that I thought was
most compelling was the where the petrogs that they found in the river, one
of the rivers that feeds into Lake Champlain. The actually found these petroglyphs that
were would have been done centuries ago by local native tribes. They clearly depict
some sort of pleasius or looking creature, and I thought that alone was a
pretty strong piece of evidence for the existence of something at some point in history
having been in that area. Am I hearing music? Do I hear music?
That is that clock? That is all the clock? Yes? You
mentioned our lovely town Square clock. Okay, yeah, you can't do much
about that. I was actually stranded on Lake Champlain. I had an antique
boat that had an engine trouble, so I was staying at a hotel on
the lake, and it was four o'clock in the morning by the time I
got back, and I was lost. I got totally lost in the middle
of the night out there, and I started some passive I started thinking about
that Lake Lonster. Yeah, but are there actual people that have taken pictures
or I don't recall of anything. I mean, I think I think it's
like Bigfoot or anything. You know, there are a number of purported photographs
of what people claim his champ, none of them entirely convincing. You know,
it's like anything that the best evidence it's like UFOs or Bigfoot. The
best evidence comes down to the fact that you've got these very believable, perfectly
reasonable, rational people who will tell you they saw something and weirdly enough,
I mean, we made a movie near Lake Champlain back in twenty sixteen,
actually filmed in twenty fifteen, called The Beast of Whitehall. And Whitehall is
this tiny town that's actually the birthplace of the US Navy. It sits right
on the banks of Lake Champlain and the Champlain Canal runs right through the middle
of the town. But we made a movie about a bigfoot siding there that
happened in the seventies. While we were making this Bigfoot movie, we up
to having people come up and tell us about their champ their champ encounters,
and that was sort of actually the first time I thought, we need to
do a movie about Champum. But yeah, there's there's a lot of witnesses,
a lot of people still claiming to see something in there, you know
today, but nothing super believable in the way of photographic evidence, right right.
You know. I got to ask you this when you have done all
these different series and looked into all these different things, were their crossovers were
you know, the same place that you just mentioned kind of a crossover there
with the champ you know, people seeing him. But were there are other
crossovers between big foot in UFOs You kind of hear that sometimes. I think
the biggest is is actually the Chessnut Ridge where Stan Gordon is, because you've
you've got so much strange activity taking place up there and we we I don't
know if it's just that the Chestnut Ridge is relatively close to where I live,
but we can't seem to escape. It. Made this movie in two
seventeen called Invasion on Chestnut Ridge, which was actually a massive flop. But
for some reason, it's like it's like the movie that everyone I talked to
really loves, and for some reason I feel like it's it's one of our
best. Um it's there's there's people in Hollywood I've spoken to who found us
because of that movie. Um, so it's it's a weird thing. But
we made that movie in twenty seventeen, and then we went back in twenty
eighteen and shot episodes of On the Trail of Bigfoot, and then this year
we shot more for for On the Trail of UFOs. And it's a place
where you've got a confluence of very strange paranormal slash uphological slash cryptozoological activity all
taking place in one location. But that Whitehall Bannington Triangle upstate New York,
you know the Adirondack stretching up into like a Vermont and Connecticut. There's a
lot of really weird activity that happens up there too, where you get you
know, UFOs Bigfoot scene together. The strangest thing about Whitehall is you have
it's everything. While we were there, we spoke to bigfoot witnesses. The
Whitehall case is one of the more famous bigfoot cases, but you've also got
Champ right down the road. And then while we were there, we had
these police officers tell us about seeing a what they claim is a terrodactyl sit
in a tree right down the road from a bear road, which is sort
of the location of this really famous bigfoot you know sighting. But that's that's
those two places are the ones that seem to have the most of that sort
of activity that we've been to or we've made films on. And the Chestnut
Ridge. There's so much to explore with the Chestnut Ridge that I've kicked around
the idea of doing an entire episodic series just hanging out with stand Gordon as
he takes us through all the crazy stuff he's investigated. We met up a
year like a year ago at a con somewhere, and the first thing he
says when he sits down is he sits down and goes, well, now,
now I'm getting reports from a local police officer of this creature with no
head. It's got eyes in the middle of his chest and no warms and
I'm just like, yeah, I mean, why wouldn't you Sure Like every
time it's Akistan, he's got something, you know, something insane he's he's
looking into on the ridge. It's and it's never surprising. Yeah, all
stands great. He's been on the show a number of times and he does
he actually does a great job, and he's he's he's not a BS guy.
I mean, you just know he doesn't try to stare anyone in any
certain way. Um. We had I love his work on Kecksburg, which
is still a mystery. Some people say it was you know, uh,
I forget exactly what I had someone on that. There was a little bit
of a debate on what the object actually was. But yeah, he's always
great. He's got the stories about everything that are happening here. I can
understand why I want to do that. Yeah. Yeah, So, um,
one of some of the other places you ended up traveling to and and
talking you know, some other cases. Yeah, for this for this series,
we started in so the first trip actually took us to Nevada and Arizona,
and we started in Phoenix. Um, we interviewed doctor Keti about the
Phoenix Lights, and then we interviewed another. I don't know if you can
quantify as what he experienced as an abduction. But Donovan, we interviewed in
Phoenix as well. On Donovan had this really unusual incident that happened to him
when he was a kid. He woke up in the middle of the night.
He went to get out of bed to go to the bathroom, and
this strangely green mist appeared under his bed and he felt like it was trying
to grab him keep him in the place. He jumped back into bed,
and the next day he was told by a friend of school they had seen
a UFO hovering over his house roughly around the same time, that this would
have happened to him, and that that story is relayed much better by him
in episode seven of On the Trail of UFOs. But that was sort of
the first stop of that trip was Phoenix, where we interviewed those two people
and Alejandro. Actually we did Alejandro's interview in Phoenix as well, and then
we did Sedona. We traveled to Sedona. While we were in Sedona,
we interviewed ron Ron Rigear and Malava. Malava is actually a tribal elder.
We are not allowed to state who his tribe is. But it's pretty obvious.
I mean, if you watch the episode, it's pretty obvious who he's
talking about, and their stories were both. Ron is one of my favorite
people as far as like the way the way he's so old school about everything
and just just sort of his recollections of working on the radars when when like
the Phoenix lights happened, the satellite array that he was he was actually tasked
with operating at that time, He was aware of what was happening in Phoenix
when it was happening. He was actually tracking the Phoenix lights from this geosynchronous
satellite that he was actually that was his job at the time, was to
monitor this satellite and they were actually able to track the Phoenix lights. He
also was involved in tracking the Tehran Iran UFO that that occurred as well.
Oh I wasn't here. Yeah, um so so both of those should we
really should just back up just a little bit for the new listener. Yeah.
I think it was something like March thirteenth or something like that in nineteen
ninety seven, the Phoenix the Phoenix lights, uh and and ongoing. You
know a lot of people have reported seeing something similar, but some people have
including Peter Davenport, has gotten calls at night and people were were estimating something
that could have been miles wide, that the object was so big and going
over but that was in more than one state, you said, so,
yeah, it seems like it's And that's that's where ron came in. Is
is where they first tracked. Where they first saw the Phoenix lights appear on
their geosynchronous satellite UM was coming out over area fifty one, so they see
it near area fifty one for the first time. Is where they first catch
a blip of this thing, and then they track it all the way to
Phoenix UM and along the way it supposedly went over Las Vegas and what the
for For anyone who doesn't know what the Phoenix Lights are, it seems to
descriptions vary in terms of the number of lights, but the most common description
that is that it was basically seven lights in a in a v formation that
traveled across um, Arizona, and Nevada. Apparently according to run a year
beginning near area fifty one and it travels down over the area and it is
witnessed by thousands of people all across the area. That I was actually asked
recently why it's a historically significant case, and I said, the reason it's
historically significant is that we can still talk to This isn't like Roswell where we've
lost all the pertinent witnesses. This is we're still able to go talk to
these people and learn from them if people actually do that, and that that
every year, more and more witnesses are coming forward that claim they saw,
you know, the Phoenix lights. So I think it's important just just for
that reason. Um, but yeah, the lights were seeing all across the
area. They go over the the city of Phoenix, they actually hover over
the Sky Harbor International Airport. They're they're seen on their radar by air traffic
controllers who claimed that the craft This was stated by air traffic controllers that the
craft that was seen on radar was over a mile wide. So whatever this
thing was, it was, it was huge, it was silent, and
it seemed to want to be seen. And the event was sort of laughed
off by Governor Fife Symington, who later came out as being a witness of
the of the Phoenix Lights. And it's gone down in history is one of
the most important mass sightings in US history. Yeah, it was just h
I forget the was a hailbop. I can't remember the comment. Yeah,
it was a hailbop. Yeah, people are outside just to watch that.
And that's why, you know, it was a clear knights so many sis
and you know, some people claimed that it blacked out the stars up above
and and another person said it looked like a wave, a heat wave,
like you could see rippling um you know through it. U But still,
you know the fact that it was silent, it was huge. If that
technology, if that was military technology in nineteen ninety seven, it would be
you know, amazing that it wouldn't be used, you know, somewhere somehow,
or we wouldn't know something about it by this time. I would think.
So yeah, I agreed. Yeah, And it's it's cool to me
too, just just from like, you know, like what interests me about
all this a lot of times is how culturally it impacts the area where where
the events take place. And to see Phoenix, that that event has been
embraced in a way by by the City of Phoenix now to the point where
the Historical Society has an entire exhibit sort of dedicated to the Phoenix Lights that
you can walk through. So there's there's little things like that that are I
think important just from a euthological sort of incident standpoint. Right. I didn't
even know about that until I watched her film. I didn't know they had
a a little museum set up. I didn't realize either. Yeah, and
that's in that is in the historical society. That is that is as that
is as legitimate as you can get. Yeah. Um, yeah, there's
illustrations. There's like there's a hanging craft, uh, you know, showing
you know what most people saw thought they saw and yeah, um, and
you know, it is interesting that Fife Symington, as you mentioned, you
know, first of all, kind of ridiculed the situation his claim with that
alien, um you know that came in and uh, you know, his
his uh a friend or whatever came in and an alien costume him and said
here's the culprit and all that. But you know, according to him,
he was trying to release the tension because the phone was ringing off the hook,
and you know, he had a lot of a lot of people to
answer to. You wanted to give a shout out to someone that's in the
chat room, right, Gary Treiber who I talked about earlier, Um was
actually in there, so I'm not sure he's if he's still in there,
but yeah, Gary, if Gary's in there, UM, shout out to
Gary. And it was funny when I met Gary. We actually interviewed Gary
for on the Trail of UFOs, but I had met him weeks prior at
the Mothman Festival in West Virginia, which was kind of a strange coincidence because
I had I had no idea who he was at the time, and then
I wound up interviewing him for something completely unrelated in a state, you know,
three states away a few weeks later. So that was that was one
of those weird synchronicity right right. The Mothman is another thing that is bizarre.
I know this is a show about UFOs, but occasionally we'll talk about
other topics and I don't mind talking about that. But before I asked you
about that, what is this Bell Witch? I don't know exactly what you
call it? The Yeah, what is that exactly? Uh, there's there
was a case from the eighteen hundreds where off the Bell family and Adams,
Tennessee, we're haunted by a disembodied sort of voice and experienced a number of
strange sort of pulter geist activity around their home. We're going to make a
movie that examines, um, what what that story entailed, because it's never
actually just been straight retold by anyone. You have a lot of the typical
like ghost hunting shows with people running through houses with night vision on, but
no one's ever done a historical documentary about that case. So we're going to
do that. And then we're also going to we've thankfully made some really good
contacts locally in Adams and we have some leads on some present day activity that
we're really excited to get into as well. Wow, so there's a lot.
There's a lot to that story that we're we're going to unpack, I
think when we get into that and the Mothman up. So what did you
you mentioned earlier? I believe you said something like there was actually you fo
sightings. I didn't. I didn't Well, oh yeah, yeah, the
Mothman, the sixties flap that took place in that Everyone sort of knows the
Mothman because of the nineteen sixty six and sixty seventh flap. That whole thing
was kicked off by the injured cold Woody Darrenburger encounter. I'm assuming you've heard
of that. I have not. Okay, may buy something else, but
I don't know of that. No. Yeah. The grinning Man, as
he was called Woodrow Darrenburger, was a salesman that lived in a town called
Mineral Wells, West Virginia, and he was on his way home one night
from Parkersburg, West Virginia. He's driving down seventy seventh South, which would
have been a two lane highway at the time. Today it's it's a big
highway, but at the time it's just two lane highways. Driving home,
he sees a craft in the sky. Craft drives over the highway lands next
to the highway. He pulls to the side of the road and a hatch
on this craft, which he described it as looking like an upturned or a
kerosene lantern, like turned on its side essentially, or a chimney from the
kerosene lantern, I think is how we put it. The hatch on.
The door opens and outsteps this man that has a very eerie grin, who
walks toward the car and telepathically communicates with Woodrow Darrenberger that he is a man
named injuried cold from the planet Lannulus. Yeah, okay, so that kicks
off that kicks off that event is actually what kicks off the moth Man event.
And very often those two things are tied together. They're not like,
they don't seem to have anything in common other than the fact that Mineral Wells
is about an hour from point Pleasant. So two weird things happening in the
span of like two nights. Apparently that's enough to connect them. But with
that UFO sighting, the of inciting to kick off. Obviously, the Mothman
was a six foot tall creature with a ten foot wingspan of red eyes that
was seen all around the Ohio Valley during that time period and really all of
Appalachia. But what most people seem to leave out of this, for some
unknown reason, is that during the starting in like nineteen sixty four and continuing
well into the nineteen seventies, there was a pretty much endless wave of UFO
activity around West Virginia and to the point where we were making when we were
making our Flatwoods Monster movie, we were in the town of Flatwoods, and
Flatwoods is central West Virginia. It is smack dab in the middle of West
Virginia. It is as West Virginia. When you think West Virginia, this
is what you're probably calling to your mind. It's like back roads, would
you know, like gravel roads. It's hills and hollers. It's people living
up in the middle of nowhere, you know that don't wear shoes and drink
a lot of moonshine and that kind of thing. And when you we were
making that movie, we came to interview a witness who told us about her
parents seeing or her grandparents, actually her mama and papa seeing UFOs almost on
a nightly basis between like nineteen sixty five and nineteen seventy seven, to the
point where they saw UFOs landing behind their barn. And I asked her,
I said, that would have been at the height of sort of the Mothman
stuff too, right sixty six and sixty seven. And she said, yes,
that was right in right in that time period. And she said that
it wasn't just them, it was people all around the state. So a
lot of people think during sixty six and sixty seven win the Mothman sidings were
going on, And a lot of this is because of John Keel and in
fact, like I'm sorry, I'm not trying to get off track. Artists
like Keel. Keel came two point pleasant to do a story on UFOs being
seen around West Virginia for Playboy, so he was in. John Keel came
to point wasn't for that reason, not really to cover the Mothman. It
was because of the UFO wave. So he's there covering the UFO wave,
and then the Mothman stuff starts happening. And what's really interesting is people always
try to tie the Mothman to like the Silver Bridge collapse. Right because the
Silver Bridge collapsed forty seven lives were lost. You can't really do it.
There weren't sightings of the Mothman over the bridge, but there were sightings of
UFOs all up and down the Ohio River in the days ahead of the collapse
and in the days afterward. And I'm not blaming I'm not blaming the UFOs
for collapsing the bridge. I'm just saying people like to draw that line,
but they completely leave out the UFO aspect of that story. So there's there
were there were major waves that were taking place all over the region at that
time, to the point where the Charleston. I want to say it's the
Herald Standard, I think is the name of the local paper there. They
had a beat reporter who we interviewed for the moth made a Point Pleasant movie,
who told us that they had a UFO desk. It was there were
so many reports coming in. They had a UFO desk with a guy stationed
on the phone to take UFO reports throughout the day. Mary Hire, who
wrote who took a lot of the initial Mothman reports and lived in Point Pleasant
despite working for the Athens, Ohio newspaper. She did a newspaper column called
Where the Waters Mingle, And it started out as like her little slice of
life column, and then over time morphed into her just like telling people's weird
encounter stories from around the area, and the bulk of that column became her
relating UFO cases. People people around the town of Point Pleasant and around Gallop
Police, Ohio, and all around that Ohio River Valley area seeing UFOs during
that sixty six, sixty seven and into the early seventies. What were they
describing the UFOs like every everything under the sun? Really, um, you
had you had. The most traditional thing that we've found is the description that
we found a sort of just lights in the sky. Um but uh,
you know, like you had your classic flying saucers, you had a cigar
shaped object that hovered, was seen hovering over a school um end Point Pleasant.
You had a case from UH nineteen sixty seven where a teacher from Point
Pleasant was driving down the road that connects UH Point Pleasant to the T and
D factory area, which is where sort of the first sightings of the Mothman
took place at the TNT factory area. She was driving down that road and
claimed that she saw a UFO flying in the sky. She saw the Mothman
streak across the sky and seemingly go into a door on the on the UFO.
UM. So so during during that hide of one of my favorite stories
that gets left out of all of this a lot is a sighting that was
actually related by I can't remember if this is two women or two men that
were driving down seventy seven North the same night as Woodrow Darrenburger's encounter, who
claimed that they saw a similarly shaped craft land on the side of the road
and two men in coveralls get out of it, and that that sighting would
almost corroborate to some extent Woodrow Darrenburger, but that story, for some reason,
it never really gets talked about. But they're you know, like part
of the part of the problem is that Keel's book is so disjointed. And
I love Keel and I love his research, but that book is so disjointed,
and it becomes more about him than it does the case, and a
lot of the details of those sixties UFO aspects of the story get sort of
glossed over in favor of like the men in black and the prophecies that he
was receiving. Wow, very interesting. We are now taking calls. I
actually see the phone ringing. We have a screener over there. Race will
talk to you, and that phone number is eight five five four seven two
five four eight three, And I see the phone ring and I don't see
it being picked up, So keep calling now there it goes. Okay,
so we'll have a call here in just a moment that you know, that
whole thing is fascinating. I never ever heard the UFO aspect of this.
I've heard a lot about the Mothman. Now was as far as you know,
was the Mothman as popular before that blockbuster movie. I mean, we're
not really okay, yeah, but I don't know why, because the movie
was popular, but it some popular enough where you would see it rocket to
the sort of like top cultural mainstay that it's become today. So I don't
know. There is something about the Mothman story and the Mothman as a character
quote unquote character that has appeal in ways that something like Bigfoot doesn't even have
anymore. It seems to draw the attention of a younger audience, especially much
more than than some of the other paranormal subjects that we've looked into. But
I also think there's way more sightings than than we realize. I'm making.
I'm making a follow up to The mothmana point pleasant called the Mothman Legacy that
tracks sightings from nineteen sixty seven up till present day. So the first movie
was about sixty six and sixty seven sort of ended with the collapse of the
Silver Bridge, but that bridge collapse didn't didn't sort of signal an end to
the sightings. They were sighting thlong and after that in their sightings today,
but we had no We've had no problem. I'm finding witnesses, which is
one of the first times I've run into that where you can basically throw a
stone and you'll hit someone who wants to tell you their moth Man sighting story.
Wow, that's great. We have Andy. Whoops. Yeah, I
think I'm going on the air. Yeah, Andy on the air from Connecticut.
How are you doing, Andy? How you doing guys? I'm doing
it again. How do you have a question for our guest tonight? Yes,
sir, My question for Seth is kind of a two part is is
he aware of what is his opinion on the cluster of sightings in the Chicago
area of winged humanoids, some of which are very similar to moth Man?
And then part two, i'll take your answer off the air, would be,
does Seth have a theory on everything somewhat into maybe Paul or ben Eno?
Is there a connection between all paranormal activity? And I'll take your answer
off the here. Thank you guys, good job, Yeah, thank you
And all right. Yeah, the we're actually going to make an on the
trail of the Lake Michigan Mothman, so that'll track those Chicago sightings. And
we've actually covered that topic already in our movie that came out last year called
Terror in the Skies where we tracked winged creature sightings all around the state of
Illinois going back centuries. But yeah, my knowledge of that case comes from
the minimal amount of time I spent on the case when we were making Terry
in the Skies. That story only makes up about eleven minutes of that movie,
but we're going to do a full ninety minute look at the case.
All I can tell you is that there's a lot more to it than you
would think just by looking into it. My initial outlook on the Chicago Mothman
stuff was that it was more than likely made up of misidentifications and hoaxes.
But in listening to what Tobias Wayland is sort of uncovered in his research into
that case, it seems like there's a lot of sightings that are going on
that are much more believable and verifiable than what was initially reported. And we're
now talking hundred, not hundreds, but well over a hundred sightings that stretch
back to twenty seventeen, and they're not just relegated to Chicagos. It's probably
worth mentioning as well. They were going to call the movie the Lake Michigan
on the trail of the Lake Michigan Mothman because they stretch that whole um Lake
Erie or Lake Michigan shoreline and towns you know in Indiana, Illinois, Michigan.
There's there's people that are seeing things all over that area. So I'm
very familiar with it. I'm not as well versed in it as I will
be in about a month when when we shoot that that series. And as
far as like having a theory of everything, I do not have a theory
of everything, and I don't ever subscribe to theories of everything. I think
it's trying to try to neatly tie everything together with a bow. Won't happen.
Albert there's Albert Einstein couldn't do it. Yeah, I just don't.
I just don't. I just don't think it's I just don't think it's doable.
And I know, I know, you know John Keel talked about the
ultra terrestrials and all that kind of stuff, and that was all sort of
aimed at uniting everything, coming up with a common, unifying theory for what
was the cause of it. And I just don't think that's You're not gonna
I don't think that's what we're what we're dealing with. I think Paul,
you know Paul and Benn, you know their Their theory is more or less
He's been on the show quite a few times, and I think it's more
or less a little long along the lines of interdimensional um is how he explains
that. Now have Dirk. Dirk is calling from Pennsylvania. Welcome to the
show, Dirk, Hi, thanks for going the show. I got three
things on Foot. Oddly enough, every time anything on. Bill Muns the
guy who restored the Patterson Gimwin and he's a monster makeup guy from Hollywood.
He did some excellent work. Yeah, I'm I'm very familiar with the work
he's done on the Patterson Gimwin film. I haven't connected with him yet,
but I'm actually hoping to in the next year or so. That would be
great because I think all of this information has gotten buried under a bunch of
not very good stuff. Well most of what most of what goes on,
most of what goes on with Bigfoot these days is not very good. So
I just think it's entertaining. And I have a problem with momos. He
only has three toes. There aren't any Basically, there's hardly any mammals at
all with three toes. Everything has five, including whales. If you look
at their skelton, they have five fingers perfectly yeah mey just can't be yeah.
And what's weird about that is there were a rash of sightings or not
sightings, but findings in the seventies of three toaed casts, including Stan Gordon
actually found some on the Chestnut Ridge, and they seemed to be in areas
where people were seeing, you know, bigfoot like creatures. That was one
of the stranger things about about the sightings of Momo was that they were finding
these three toed casts. At least one of the really famous track ways we
know was faked by this girl we actually interviewed for Momo, the Missouri Monster,
and she she recalled actually faking the trackway when she was a kid,
But the same thing actually happened with the Boggy Creek Monster, the Falcon Monster.
They the tracks they were finding where we're three toad or appeared to be
three toed down there as well. So during the seventies there was either like
an abnormally number high number of three toed bigfoot running around, which again like
I'm like you I don't think that that can be or there were a lot
of hoaxes, or there was misidentification of tracks that were you know, bear
steps or something. There's something going on there. Yeah, that actually brings
me to my last point pretty well, actually question the Bray Road Beast.
What that has gotten so popular now? Everybody is seeing these things everywhere and
that's kind of weird to me. I think it's kind of like those three
toad things things. People get it in their head and then they just start
seeing it. Yeah. What I always say is that people people want to
be a part of the story, so so that that is a problem you
get. You get case contamination where people the more popular a story becomes,
the less you can believe immediately every single thing that people tell you. And
obviously you always want to try to trust the witnesses, but you you can't
necessarily believe every single thing you're told. So, yeah, that the hot
cryptid right now seems to be dog Man, And I don't know I would
I mean, it would be cool to say it was because our movie The
Bray Road Beast that came out a year and a half ago, it was
a big hit, But I don't think I could take credit for that,
So I don't know if there's It does seem like there's more and more sightings
every year of what they call dog Man, and I don't know what that
is attributable too. I have no idea, and the sightings are so strange.
I do know a lot of the quadruped reports seem to just be um,
you know, like a koi wolves or some sort of wolf hybrid,
since those those reports very often do not actually entail a like a wolf on
a time legs. Very often it's just a abnormally large wolf running on four
legs. I think my favorite was the one wearing a hat and smoking a
cigarette. Yeah, yeah, I've seen that guy. Wow. All right,
A lots better about your movie spake all right, Yeah, we're going
to talk about how people can watch the movies too here before before the end
of the show, definitely. So we also have Josh. He's calling,
I think from the north part of the Hudson Valley, Albany, New York.
Josh, how you doing. I'm wonderful. How are you guys?
Good? Good? You have a question for our guest tonight, Yeah,
totally. Um, I've enjoyed your conversations very much. I called Martin.
I called when you had Gary Hesselton on and I asked about I spoke to
him about my sighting of an object with the barbershop type pole light on it.
Um so, But now I'm calling because Seth, I actually found your
work a while ago without knowing it was your work. The the movie The
Chestnut Yeah, that you had mentioned earlier that most people will find you through
Yeah. Yeah. Um, that's the first time I had seen anything from
you. I did. I enjoyed it very much, and I'm super looking
forward to the new series. I myself am a writer and filmmaker. It's
part of the reason I moved to New York from Massachusetts. Cool. I'm
wondering if you have any advice on on how I can get myself out there,
if you can talk about how you yourself? Um, I mean yeah,
anytime anyone asks for advice, I have a couple of things to say,
and they're always abnormal from what I hear from other filmmakers. But um
really like the first bit of advice is to be too dumb to fail,
because I genuinely I believe that's where I'm at. Like I'm I wouldn't even
say we're like a raging success. I mean, you know, like we
were, I make movies for a living, but you know, like we're
not. We're not Hollywood, we're not millionaires. We just get to do
what we love and I think that in itself is a success. But um,
yeah, yeah, but there's a certain um stupidity in what I do,
and that what we do has never been done before as a company.
I can tell you that as someone who who has an agent, who's talked
to other people, who understands that our business model is not a model you
can follow, and and there's no blueprint for what we do. Um And
at times there's been there have been times where we should have quit, where
I should have realized, I'm putting my I'm putting myself in financial distress,
I'm putting my wife through financial distress. I should probably call it a day.
And I was too dumb to do that. And so there is a
certain element of putting your head down and just bulldozing forward and being persistent in
what you're doing that goes into becoming a success. And then the other thing
is just to really work, and I mean like really really work and to
you know, like if you if you look at I'm a big basketball fan.
I'm weirdly enough, in the last couple of years, I've become a
sports guy. I never was growing up, but today I am for some
reason. One thing I look at a lot is those guys they never stop
working at what they do. So basketball players, they just play basketball.
They're constantly shooting, They're constantly working on the shot, free throws, whatever.
It's the same concept with filmmaking. Like all my free time that it
isn't spent with my wife and kid, I am watching YouTube tutorials on how
to edit better, better editing techniques. I'm trying to teach myself different aspects
of filmmaking that I don't know how to do so I can help us save
money. During the production and on the trail of UFOs, I had to
teach myself how to do effects work because our budget ran out, Like we
just didn't have money to keep hiring freelancers to do effects work, so I
had to teach myself how to do it. So there's a there's also just
a certain element of just you've got to keep your head down and work really
really hard. Josh, thanks for the call. Thanks for the answer.
You got to have a good night all right too. So the line is
open and that number again is eight five five four seven two five four eight
three. Yeah, I agree, hard work as uh. Maybe I'm I've
been a little too dumb for this UM show. I just keep going when
things come at me. But but it's still interesting and still you have to
have a passion for something otherwise why bother. And you just made a really
good point. If you if you love what you have to do, then
that success. And I'm lucky for what I actually have to do for work.
I really love what I do, and so that's it's all good stuff,
and it must be. I can't imagine. You know, I've been
a little bit involved in a film with a friend of mine, um over
the years, you know, many years ago. Actually, um, it's
so much fun. It's to me, it's not like not like working at
all. Good stuff. Yeah. My wife asked me what the most monotonous
part of my my job is, and I said, it's never the stuff
you think it would. It's not like the editing. Like I love all
the aspects of editing. Even when I'm sitting here in my computer keeps crashing
as I'm trying to run renders and stuff, you know, like you compared
to sitting at a desk doing data. And I'll take this any day.
But you know, for me, it's never It's never the things you think
it would be. You know. I love obviously, I love the travel
and filming on location, but even teaching myself the minuscule amount of effects work
I did on the trail of UFOs I had a blast with. So I'll
go home tonight and I'll watch tutorials when I get When I get home,
that's like, that's what I do in the evening, I watch various videos
about filmmaking. Yeah, yeah, we're in a time where you can do
that. I mean, yeah, you know, twenty years ago that would
be unheard of, unfin Yeah, I mean, honestly, I wish I
had said this to Josh, But like, don't don't buy I mean maybe
you already did, but don't buy into the idea that you have to go
to film school because at this point there's more You could go on YouTube and
learn more than you would going to going to film school. I took I
took a film course on a website taught by Werner Herzog, like, that's
not something you could have done five years ago, you know. Yeah,
so pretty awesome. One thing we haven't done yet, and that is we
haven't talked about when and where. Isn't the release today or no, the
official release date is actually March twentieth, so it's still it's still coming up.
We're still we're still a little ways out. But a link now an
active link or there is. Yeah, pre orders for the series. There's
two ways to pre order. You can pre order through the website at small
toolmasters dot com or you can guarantee a copy when you back the There's a
kickstarter that we run. We run a kickstarter at the start of every year
and that's how we fund everything we do through the year. And we launched
our kickstarter two weeks ago. We're one hundred and nineteen or one hundred and
seventeen percent funded now, so we already reached our goal. So we set
a stretch goal, and once we reached the stretch goal, we will be
doing our best to get on the trail of the Lake Michigan Mothman out this
year, in addition to the other three projects we haven't have coming out,
so if people want to look up the kickstarter all the informations on small Town
Monsters dot com. Well, that obviously is an attestament to your work if
you're getting funded like that, because there are many many people that try to
do those fund raisers and nothing happens. So I think it's I think it's
start working. And then also the rewards are really cool, Like we put
we put a lot of effort and time and money back into the campaign,
so basically what people put into the Kickstarter they get back in their rewards.
So there's like this year we added Blu ray copies, so if people want
to see you on the trail of UFOs and you've seen it, so like
the scenery in itself would be worth watching the series in my opinion. I
mean, obviously I'm the guy that made it, but seeing it on Blu
Ray is going to be incredible. I'm actually really excited about that. Very
I noticed that also whatever you're using for a camera is very good, and
also that you're editing if you're doing it yourself, as pretty impressive. I
told that to alle Hundre the other day when I was talking with them.
Thank you. Yeah cool. Yeah, So I really that's a one good
thing about doing the show, like I do, I get to see things
before everyone else. So I like that, And you know, it makes
me actually want to see some of your other work. So I'm actually,
even though I do the show on UFOs, the other topics I do find
pretty interesting. So let's talk. We've got about five, five or six
minutes left. Let's talk a little bit more about some of the cases that
you researched while you were doing this series. Yeah, I realized after the
fact that I cut myself off because we that first trip was only the first
of three trips. The next one took us to the East Coast. We
actually started in Florida and worked our way up to New Hampshire, with stops
in Manhattan and the Hudson Valley, North Carolina, to shoot an episode on
the Brown Mountain lights. And I mean, that's probably worth talking about real
quick. Is episode number six, which is titled um, I'm Gonna let
it Shine or just let it shine, I think, which is my little
nod to that hymn that my parents used to sing when I as a kid.
Um. But it's an episode that's entirely about mystery lights and that's a
subject that is very often ignored or overlooked when it comes to UAPs. And
you know, I knew making the series that it would be a bit of
a stretch to include mystery lights in a series about UFOs. But m thankfully,
like some of our winter our interview subjects, did a great job of
tying it back into uphology. And I thought overall that that that episode did
a much better job of sort of expanding on how large in scale the the
UAP subject is. Um But we we actually went to Brown Mountain where the
Brown Mountain lights are seen, and we interviewed Mika Hanks about about the Brown
Mountain light, and then we interviewed we got to talk to two different witnesses,
two people that have claimed to seeing the Brown Mountain lights. We interviewed
a guy who had a sighting of what you would, I guess described as
like an orb near Asheville, New York, while he was hiking with his
friend. They were actually they were hiking near Asheville late at night. They
did night hiking. They were trying to find a camping spot and they were
in the middle of nowhere up in these woods, and they came into a
pine forest and they encountered this glowing, massive sphere in the air that approached
them. They were overcome with absolute fear from from what they told me,
and took off running, and the thing actually followed them little ways. So
that episode is all about sort of that strange stuff. And then episode seven
is called The Taken, and that is our abduction episode. And I,
you know, like, what we wanted to do with the series is give
you some of the high points, some of the key points of ufology,
and obviously one of those is going to be Betty and Barney Hill. But
we wanted to do it in a way where it didn't bog down people like
yourself who are very knowledgeable about the subject. So because I do understand the
idea that if you're sitting there and watching an episode that spends twenty minutes on
Betty and Barney Hill, when you've already heard that story one hundred times,
we're going to lose you. So what we did there is, you know,
like we actually went to the White Mountains, We went to the locations
where the Hills were, and that story is explained throughout the episode, but
it's intertwined with it's basically using the Betty and Barney Hill abduction events as a
way to explain how it's indicative of something much larger and that's the abduction phenomenon
in general. And we interviewed multiple experiencers, people who claim to be abducted
or have gone through abductions, and then we sort of expand on that and
get into some of the theories why that's happening and what the purpose of it
is. But the Hill's abduction was really important to me to have involved.
And then John Horgan was kind enough to give us access to that interview with
Betty, which was actually hurled last interview. I think it was done in
nineteen ninety nine, and you'll actually see snippets of that interview, and if
you want to, you can actually watch that whole interview on YouTube. I
think if you search like the Secret or the Last, it's either the Secret
Betty Hill interview or the Last Betty Hill interview, you'll find that. But
but we we were able to use snippets of that interview, and I think
that does a lot to to really heighten the tenseness of that episode. But
yeah, there was also a trip to Area fifty one we went on which
happened to coincide with the same day that that storm Area fifty one event where
a broke in the mainstream happened to be the same day that we were driving
out the area fifty one. And when we got out there, we had
Facebook messages we had we had been live streaming of our drive out there.
In four hundred and seventy five thousand people ended up watching our live stream because
it was going viral, and someone had shared that in that Storm Area fifty
one group. So there were there were a lot of incidents like that that
happened throughout the series. And I'm trying to think of like some really key
cases and everything is slipping in my mind, so I'm doing a terrible job
of that. Well, that's all right. We have a one caller,
Bill from New York. Bill. We're gonna have to make this quick because
we only got a couple of minutes left, So go ahead. What is
the picture on the right hand side in the comments section, we had it
narrowed down to an ant eater or Jesus Man. This is in YouTube.
There's a video of us basically for the cast listener. So we have on
YouTube. Seth's background has some posters. So yeah, what do you have
going on? Back on the right hand side, So this side, is
that what we're talking about, because on the far on the far side,
the white one, small one looks kind of like an ant eater from here,
or it could be Jesus. We're not sure Jesus. Jesus isn't in
here. There's there's uh, there's a there's a Mothman poster, there's a
Minerva Monster poster, and then like a small Town Monsters compilation poster. Over
here. I've got an original lobby card from the Legend of Boggy Creek.
But you might be looking at the what is actually like a moth It's actually
the poster has a full scale moth on it. The other side, the
little one, Oh, this one, that's what I just said. That's
a lobby card. That's a lobby card from the Legend of Boggy Creek,
and it's uh, it's one of the it's one of the characters falling through
a window after being terrified by the Fouk Monster. Wow, hey, Bill,
you weren't even close. So that was entertaining, Bill, So thank
you for the call. All right, thanks, all right, So we
just have a couple of minutes left, so are just like a minute or
so one more time if you would give out the website where someone can go.
I saw there was on iTunes. It's what other platforms are you going
to have that on? Yeah, So the big rollout for On the Trail
Of is going to hit Amazon and Vimeo on demand right now, that is
the only two planned release date places, but we have a meeting tomorrow that
could affect that. It could get a much wider release. But all of
our stuff is available on Amazon too, if you're if you're into cryptids and
all that, you can look up small Town Monsters on Amazon and it'll take
you right to a landing page that will link you back to pretty much every
move movie. And I know we just put up the Moment of the Missouri
Monster on Amazon Prime, so that's actually free for Prime subscribers. A lot
of our movies are actually free on Amazon R so you could if you're going
if you're listening to this and you want to watch Invasion on Chestnut Ridge,
and that's on there. The Mathmada Point Pleasant and The Flatwood's Monster are not
currently free on Prime, but they're both on there and everything is on there
if you're looking for if you're like an iTunes Google Play user, you can
look up the Mathmata Point, Pleasant Invasion on Chestnut Ridge, and Boggy Creek
Monster on there. You can learn more about us at Smalltown Monsters dot com
on the Trail of dot tv. We post everything you can actually watch on
the trail of Bigfoot free at on the Trail of dot tv. And if
you're interested in helping fund to our movies and getting some really cool rewards in
return, you can go on Kickstarter and just search Smalltown Monsters or Mothman or
bell Witch or UFO. You should be able to to turn it up that
way. Thanks so much, Seth. We are totally out of time.
I really appreciate it. Thanks for having me, all right, have a
good one, all right, everyone, So thank you, and that's it
for our show tonight. Thank you so much for listening. We'll be back
next week with Dave Marler and I want to thank everyone that is listening and
supports the show as well, and remember to keep your eyes to the sky.