WEBVTT 1 00:00:07.839 --> 00:00:12.679 Hey everybody, thanks for coming to another episode of My Angular Story. I'm 2 00:00:12.679 --> 00:00:18.440 the host Aaron Frost and as our guests today we have Zama Khan, Mohammed 3 00:00:18.480 --> 00:00:22.920 Zama Khan and if you've been he's been on a couple podcasts recently. But 4 00:00:23.000 --> 00:00:26.399 go ahead, Muhammad, ahead and introduce yourself. Hi, guys, this 5 00:00:26.480 --> 00:00:31.160 is Zamakhan Muhammad. I'm a software architect and I'm also an open source contributor 6 00:00:31.199 --> 00:00:36.560 to some of the open source projects in related to Angler modules and stuff, 7 00:00:37.000 --> 00:00:42.280 and also write some technical blog posts and uh just recently also authored a book. 8 00:00:43.320 --> 00:00:46.719 This episode is sponsored by centriy dot io. Recently, I came across 9 00:00:46.759 --> 00:00:49.920 a great tool for tracking and monitoring problems in my apps. Then I asked 10 00:00:49.960 --> 00:00:52.719 them if they wanted to sponsor the show and allow me to share my experience 11 00:00:52.759 --> 00:00:56.399 with you. Century provides a terrific interface for keeping track of what's going on 12 00:00:56.439 --> 00:00:59.000 with my app. It also tracks releases so I can tell if what I 13 00:00:59.039 --> 00:01:02.679 deployed makes things better or worse. They give full stack traces and as much 14 00:01:02.679 --> 00:01:06.319 information as possible about the situation when the error occurred to help you track down 15 00:01:06.359 --> 00:01:10.040 the errors. Plus one thing I love. You can customize the context provided 16 00:01:10.040 --> 00:01:12.799 by Century, so if you're looking for specific information about the request, you 17 00:01:12.799 --> 00:01:17.719 can provide it. It automatically scrubs passwords and secure information, and you can 18 00:01:17.760 --> 00:01:21.680 customize the scrubbing as well. Finally, it has a user feedback system built 19 00:01:21.680 --> 00:01:23.439 in that you can use to get information from your users. Oh and I 20 00:01:23.519 --> 00:01:26.879 also love that they support open source to the point where they actually open source 21 00:01:27.040 --> 00:01:30.760 centry. If you want to self host it, use the code dev chat 22 00:01:30.879 --> 00:01:34.519 at Century dot io to get two months free on Century small plan. That's 23 00:01:34.599 --> 00:01:41.439 code dev chat at Century dot io. Yeah, how long you been a 24 00:01:41.439 --> 00:01:46.879 developer? Seven years? But I was in web development, Like I had 25 00:01:46.920 --> 00:01:53.599 interest in web development from day before that. I started like diabbing into web 26 00:01:53.599 --> 00:02:01.319 programming in my bachelor's degree way back like ten years ago, just playing with 27 00:02:01.400 --> 00:02:09.159 some dream tools and just just doing some photoshop at Hope after Effects, playing 28 00:02:09.199 --> 00:02:15.719 with all these different tools from Adobe and just getting interested in webdom and overall 29 00:02:15.719 --> 00:02:20.919 cool. So I feel like I know so much about you because we just 30 00:02:20.919 --> 00:02:30.159 did a podcast you you dabble an open source and your father right, yes, 31 00:02:30.360 --> 00:02:38.159 yes, and you you're an author, which means you're a glutton for 32 00:02:38.240 --> 00:02:42.960 punishment. Because you like to do big, big, long efforts. So 33 00:02:43.120 --> 00:02:47.240 that's awesome. How's your book selles going? Like, how's how is how's 34 00:02:47.280 --> 00:02:52.039 the book going? Like people receiving it? Well, yeah, I have 35 00:02:52.199 --> 00:02:57.120 got a lot of good reviews, but yeah, the sales report is yet 36 00:02:57.159 --> 00:03:00.680 to come to me. Like I think the publishers actually submitted like every three 37 00:03:00.759 --> 00:03:05.199 months, so I'm still waiting for it. It's just like a couple of 38 00:03:05.280 --> 00:03:09.080 months that went by. Yeah, so I'm like behind them, like provide 39 00:03:09.120 --> 00:03:14.800 me, Like I'm behind them to provide me promo code for like everyone listening 40 00:03:14.800 --> 00:03:19.520 here, but like they just moved to a new platform. It seems like 41 00:03:19.560 --> 00:03:23.199 an e commerce platform and they still figuring out how to get the promo code 42 00:03:23.240 --> 00:03:28.000 stuff working. So right, right, Yeah, so you're still like, 43 00:03:28.120 --> 00:03:30.719 look, you're still not one hundred percent sure how the sales are going. 44 00:03:30.439 --> 00:03:34.719 Yeah, I'm not sure. Like you just have to wait for another like 45 00:03:35.280 --> 00:03:40.639 a month probably to get it. Cool, So any more books coming or 46 00:03:40.719 --> 00:03:46.879 you're done then for a while. Yeah, I'm thinking maybe I should be 47 00:03:46.919 --> 00:03:52.680 going into like video creation, like maybe Egghead videos maybe or something sort of 48 00:03:52.719 --> 00:03:57.759 like that, maybe where I have you know, content prepared and create like 49 00:03:57.840 --> 00:04:02.039 high quality videos and submit them. Have you have you heard of thinkster Dio? 50 00:04:03.000 --> 00:04:05.960 Yeah, that you should. You should talk to Joe at Thinster. 51 00:04:06.039 --> 00:04:11.800 I know he'd be he'd probably be really interested in having someone with your experience. 52 00:04:12.479 --> 00:04:15.839 I'm thinking of doing something in denselflow Dodgas, which is like a neo 53 00:04:16.120 --> 00:04:20.319 platform. So yeah, something like that would be really great. Like, 54 00:04:20.480 --> 00:04:28.000 yeah, thankful. I think it's from He's just I don't remember his name. 55 00:04:28.399 --> 00:04:31.680 You just named him right from Yah jo James? Yeah, yeah, 56 00:04:32.360 --> 00:04:39.120 Joames is like super and like in plural side videos. Yeah, he is 57 00:04:39.160 --> 00:04:43.199 great. He's my hero. I love the guy. Shout out to Joe 58 00:04:43.199 --> 00:04:46.360 Eames. If you don't follow Joames, go follow him on Twitter at Joames 59 00:04:46.920 --> 00:04:51.319 and and uh, feel free to tweet at him and make up some fact 60 00:04:51.399 --> 00:04:55.839 that I said about him. See if we can't see if we can't get 61 00:04:55.920 --> 00:05:00.360 Joe some tweets with some weird random facts that I made for those listening. 62 00:05:00.480 --> 00:05:10.279 Your book is about nine different angular projects, and each project is approaches something 63 00:05:10.360 --> 00:05:15.360 different. Is that true? Yes? So basically what I do is I 64 00:05:15.439 --> 00:05:20.160 take every single different concept that we can build, like I take like I 65 00:05:20.199 --> 00:05:26.160 start with basic flash game application, which doesn't require any uh, you know 66 00:05:26.279 --> 00:05:30.720 routing or any like it requires form like a small form, so just just 67 00:05:30.759 --> 00:05:36.319 a simple application like that and then going to routing and then just leave the 68 00:05:36.360 --> 00:05:41.399 flash game right now, like it uses different component library, et cetera. 69 00:05:41.600 --> 00:05:45.240 But then when I go into a new chapter, I use a new component 70 00:05:45.279 --> 00:05:50.959 library, and I started started from scratch so that people get not only how 71 00:05:51.000 --> 00:05:55.720 to develop an Angler, but also see what are the different tools and different 72 00:05:55.759 --> 00:06:00.240 component libraries available that they can use and what are the differences between them, 73 00:06:00.639 --> 00:06:04.399 and then look for it. Like from there, I go into PW application 74 00:06:04.480 --> 00:06:09.240 and then I use Angler material, I use Bootstrap, I use Velma, 75 00:06:10.439 --> 00:06:15.040 I use Momentum UI, which is a UI framework from Cisco. I use 76 00:06:15.079 --> 00:06:20.480 Clarity Design, which is from a component library from VMware. So just trying 77 00:06:20.519 --> 00:06:25.720 to use a lot of things like with this component librari is. You also 78 00:06:26.160 --> 00:06:30.040 have to write less CSS in your application, which is also good for me 79 00:06:30.120 --> 00:06:33.000 because I don't want to put more CSS code in the book to show oh 80 00:06:33.079 --> 00:06:36.279 yeah, you can style this by using this style. I don't have a 81 00:06:36.279 --> 00:06:42.920 library about yeah, So just using destroying the users different component libraries and different 82 00:06:42.959 --> 00:06:49.279 concepts that they can create using Angler. Do you cover like service side rendering 83 00:06:49.319 --> 00:06:55.720 at all or yeah, suicide rendering native script application. I also at the 84 00:06:55.879 --> 00:07:00.560 end also touch on testing as well as how to create competent libraries and publish 85 00:07:00.639 --> 00:07:04.839 them on NPM, so that I mean it's really I would like push people 86 00:07:05.199 --> 00:07:09.800 if they are creating any competent libraries in their company to open source it, 87 00:07:10.000 --> 00:07:16.199 like it really helps not just their company, like by getting stuff done from 88 00:07:16.480 --> 00:07:21.600 like a lot of open source developers will help you maintain it and then also 89 00:07:21.639 --> 00:07:25.839 it will be good for your organization or it could be used for any other 90 00:07:25.879 --> 00:07:30.120 application. Like when I started at Cisco, we were using this internal momentum 91 00:07:30.199 --> 00:07:33.680 UI library and it used to be called collab UI library and then once we 92 00:07:33.720 --> 00:07:40.759 open source it, like now when I left them, they open sourced it, 93 00:07:40.800 --> 00:07:44.319 and so I still go there and help them out like if I need 94 00:07:44.360 --> 00:07:48.240 to. And they have packages in Angular, React View and a lot of 95 00:07:48.279 --> 00:07:54.279 different things just one component library with different frameworks, so yeah, I help 96 00:07:54.360 --> 00:08:00.560 them in Angular a bit, and yeah, like just go out there do 97 00:08:00.720 --> 00:08:05.600 some stuff and help others. Yeah, that's crazy. You're still involved. 98 00:08:05.120 --> 00:08:09.959 Kind of speaks to your level of dedication. That's awesome that you a fun 99 00:08:11.000 --> 00:08:20.000 fact yeah. I've been working less on Angular projects, like on applications for 100 00:08:20.120 --> 00:08:26.399 almost about two and a half years because I'm involved in React projects more so. 101 00:08:26.639 --> 00:08:31.159 What I like to do is I try to see what's good and React 102 00:08:31.159 --> 00:08:35.679 community and try to bring that in Angler community. For example, React community 103 00:08:35.759 --> 00:08:46.879 has this JSX accessibility lending rules and it helps people to keep their applications accessibility 104 00:08:46.960 --> 00:08:52.440 maintained, like it doesn't allow you to break some accessibility, some small level 105 00:08:52.600 --> 00:08:58.440 accessibility features. And I liked that about it, and then I tweeted about 106 00:08:58.480 --> 00:09:05.279 it Minco and Vassin about oh, what do we have an Angler community for 107 00:09:05.360 --> 00:09:09.960 this? Is there something that I can create or is there something that we 108 00:09:11.039 --> 00:09:13.879 can do here? And they said, yeah, you can do probably in 109 00:09:13.960 --> 00:09:18.960 cordializer. I like what certilizer. I thought, it's just for typescript. 110 00:09:18.159 --> 00:09:26.000 How can we like check types and validate stuff in our template? And they 111 00:09:26.000 --> 00:09:28.240 said that it's possible. Would you love to contribute it to it? And 112 00:09:28.279 --> 00:09:31.600 I was like, okay, let me go ahead and try it, and 113 00:09:31.639 --> 00:09:39.279 then I contributed like ten different rules related to accessibility. I wrote a blog 114 00:09:39.320 --> 00:09:43.879 post on web web dot dev slash Angler and also wrote a recent blog post 115 00:09:43.919 --> 00:09:50.279 on angler block about access building accessibility in Angler applications isn't web dot dev, 116 00:09:50.480 --> 00:09:54.039 isn't web dev? Isn't that Google's website? Yeah? That is? And 117 00:09:54.120 --> 00:09:58.639 you go do the guest blog there. Yeah, all thanks to Minco. 118 00:09:58.519 --> 00:10:01.960 Yeah. He comes up and says, oh, would you write this blog 119 00:10:03.000 --> 00:10:05.960 post for webdo dev? Do you want to write it for Angler? Bloy? 120 00:10:05.000 --> 00:10:11.799 And I'm like, what hell? Yes, that's awesome. Hey, 121 00:10:11.840 --> 00:10:16.720 folks, this is Charles Maxwood and I just launched my book, The Maxicoters 122 00:10:16.720 --> 00:10:20.720 Guy Defining Your Dream Developer Job. It's up on Amazon. We self published 123 00:10:20.759 --> 00:10:22.240 it. I would love your support. If you want to go check it 124 00:10:22.279 --> 00:10:26.639 out, you can find it there, The Maxicoter's Guy Defining Your Dream Developer 125 00:10:26.720 --> 00:10:31.039 Job. Have a good one, max Out. Yeah, dude, Minco 126 00:10:31.159 --> 00:10:33.320 is one of the nicest people ever, right right right right? Oh he's 127 00:10:33.360 --> 00:10:39.879 so He's so nice and so helpful. I really really really like Ninko. 128 00:10:41.519 --> 00:10:43.480 I liked, I mean ever since before he joined the Angry team. He's 129 00:10:43.480 --> 00:10:46.360 been one of the nicest, easiest people to work with. So I'm a 130 00:10:46.360 --> 00:10:52.679 big Ninco fan. So just so we can kind of get to know you 131 00:10:52.720 --> 00:10:58.039 better. Where are you from, I'm basically from India, Uh, the 132 00:10:58.120 --> 00:11:03.000 south end and out of India. Basically, I'm a Hyderabadhi. So we 133 00:11:03.159 --> 00:11:09.120 have a unique style of speaking Urdu and Hindi and people know us by saying 134 00:11:09.399 --> 00:11:13.960 how and naco and so like you won't to understand it. Those are like 135 00:11:15.159 --> 00:11:18.759 those are like slang words to refer to someone from Hyderabady. It's like yes 136 00:11:18.960 --> 00:11:24.799 and no, but in a very hidera Badi style, like a South Indian 137 00:11:24.799 --> 00:11:28.919 style. And whenever people hear us talking, and if they hear those words, 138 00:11:28.919 --> 00:11:33.240 they will be like, Okay, this guy is a Hyderabadi. So 139 00:11:33.440 --> 00:11:39.240 yeah, I'm from there. I came for masters, uh, studied from 140 00:11:39.480 --> 00:11:45.639 University of Texas at Arlington. Stayed in Texas for the whole Like after master, 141 00:11:45.759 --> 00:11:48.039 I just stayed in Texas. Didn't move to any other place maybe in 142 00:11:48.159 --> 00:11:54.080 future, I don't know, but currently in Texas and loving Texas. Cool. 143 00:11:54.639 --> 00:11:58.399 So you're in the Dallas area. Yes, that's awesome. Are you? 144 00:11:58.440 --> 00:12:01.879 Are you? Do you like American football? Are you Dallas Cowboys fan? 145 00:12:01.759 --> 00:12:07.279 No? Okay, no, all right, I thought i'd check. 146 00:12:07.840 --> 00:12:16.200 So all right? Cool? You you your recent dad? Recent? Like 147 00:12:16.720 --> 00:12:22.279 your baby six months? Six months? Man? So you're going through the 148 00:12:22.440 --> 00:12:28.440 baby sleeping Okay, no, not at all. Yeah, he sleeps like 149 00:12:28.600 --> 00:12:33.200 Max photo was. Okay, that's I mean, I can understand how how 150 00:12:33.279 --> 00:12:37.080 fair my wife is and how she is dealing with all of that. Yeah, 151 00:12:37.440 --> 00:12:41.679 it's a lot of work for sure. Being the dad has a lot 152 00:12:41.679 --> 00:12:45.320 of work. That's the fact. Mom's mom definitely has the harder job. 153 00:12:45.600 --> 00:12:50.399 Yeah, hottest. With my wife and I I don't even pretend. I 154 00:12:50.399 --> 00:12:54.679 mean, I know she has a much much harder job than I. Like, 155 00:12:56.080 --> 00:12:58.559 sometimes we'll be like talking to people and she'll be like, no, 156 00:12:58.639 --> 00:13:01.399 I just stay home with the kids, And I'm like, I just like, 157 00:13:01.399 --> 00:13:05.440 like as if it was easy, Like I couldn't do it. It's 158 00:13:05.480 --> 00:13:11.720 it's not a thing that I could do for a little. My wife's definitely 159 00:13:11.720 --> 00:13:15.080 tough as nails. She does a job I could never do. Yeah, 160 00:13:16.159 --> 00:13:20.240 I might never be able to do that. Like she is like up at 161 00:13:20.320 --> 00:13:24.679 night, she like the whole day she has to take care. Yeah, 162 00:13:24.679 --> 00:13:33.279 it's a huge Yeah. Shout out to the mom's you're a mom, you're 163 00:13:33.399 --> 00:13:39.799 killing it. Good job your dad the MoMA mom's hard. No, but 164 00:13:41.240 --> 00:13:45.720 being a dad's hard too. It's it's uh, it's hard to get out 165 00:13:45.720 --> 00:13:50.440 and like get really emotionally and mentally buried in your work, and then sometimes 166 00:13:50.480 --> 00:13:52.919 it's hard to come up for air and still be a good dad. So 167 00:13:54.279 --> 00:13:58.600 uh, it's it's something I constantly try and focus on a battle with as 168 00:13:58.600 --> 00:14:05.519 well, make sure I'm not too too much work, because I mean, 169 00:14:05.559 --> 00:14:07.200 my kids are getting old, I mean not old. I have a fourteen 170 00:14:07.279 --> 00:14:11.320 year old, she's my oldest all the way down to a one year old, 171 00:14:11.440 --> 00:14:16.559 and so, uh, there's different stages in life. The older they 172 00:14:16.559 --> 00:14:20.120 get, the more involved have to be homework, science fair projects, classes, 173 00:14:20.200 --> 00:14:24.919 coaching their teams and stuff. So yeah, that's cool man. So 174 00:14:24.960 --> 00:14:28.759 me and you we almost we almost if we ever see each other, we 175 00:14:28.799 --> 00:14:33.039 have to fight, right because we have competing open source projects right right, 176 00:14:33.240 --> 00:14:39.120 and people are joining like I saw Julie joining with his library, and then 177 00:14:39.200 --> 00:14:45.720 we have domas having a different library well solving kind of like different problems. 178 00:14:46.080 --> 00:14:48.840 Yeah, but yeah, like having a very good, strong community, Like 179 00:14:50.639 --> 00:14:54.639 yeah, it's always good. We should, uh, we should merge ours 180 00:14:54.679 --> 00:15:00.000 and then beat Eerie and beat Thomas and by by Tom as you're talking about 181 00:15:00.039 --> 00:15:05.399 Thomas Strahan, right, Thomas, Yes, Thomas Thomas is you know that 182 00:15:05.519 --> 00:15:09.399 guy is smart. We did a podcast with him and I didn't really know 183 00:15:09.480 --> 00:15:13.200 him, but after that podcast, I walked away thinking, this is a 184 00:15:13.240 --> 00:15:18.639 smart guy. All right, right, really smart guy. Maybe we should 185 00:15:18.679 --> 00:15:22.639 uh, we should merge ours and then we'll just go out and we'll just 186 00:15:22.679 --> 00:15:26.720 be better than Arry and better than Thomas, and then we have to fight 187 00:15:26.759 --> 00:15:33.000 when we see each other. We can just be friends. But yeah, 188 00:15:33.080 --> 00:15:37.559 so what else? What else about you talk to us? Like tell if 189 00:15:37.600 --> 00:15:41.600 you were going to say, hey, this is who I am. So 190 00:15:41.720 --> 00:15:45.600 yeah, even though I did my master's and commuter science, I consider myself 191 00:15:45.639 --> 00:15:50.919 more of a self taught developer just because we don't learn we're programming and our 192 00:15:52.039 --> 00:15:58.360 masters or bachelor's like it's it's it's up to the students to learn and and 193 00:15:58.480 --> 00:16:04.159 implement those projects in there in the classes. Right, So never learned web 194 00:16:04.200 --> 00:16:11.480 programming like dowstrip or anything. So I think that is where something has to 195 00:16:11.519 --> 00:16:15.799 be done, like on a university and a college level, where we can 196 00:16:15.759 --> 00:16:21.759 teach students about what web programming can do, like it's it's so much, 197 00:16:22.039 --> 00:16:26.080 so many applications can be built using it. And nowadays you see that everything 198 00:16:27.159 --> 00:16:33.200 needs child script like IoT like wild devices and everything. Yeah, seriously, 199 00:16:34.639 --> 00:16:40.600 And I think, yeah, that's where something is lacked, and if if 200 00:16:40.679 --> 00:16:42.399 the community can do something there, like I know, like there are a 201 00:16:42.480 --> 00:16:48.799 lot of good and gy girls and a lot of different organizations looking for getting 202 00:16:49.360 --> 00:16:56.720 students into development. But if we don't get it from the universities and the 203 00:16:56.759 --> 00:17:00.639 colleges and the high schools, then I have saying it it would be a 204 00:17:00.679 --> 00:17:08.000 lot difficult for us, because if it gets through university schools and everyone educated 205 00:17:08.039 --> 00:17:12.279 about web programming, that would be much easier for people to get in in 206 00:17:12.680 --> 00:17:17.480 it. Yeah. I agree. It's so interesting, right, It's like 207 00:17:17.599 --> 00:17:21.640 when I I love UI development just because when I cold, I can see 208 00:17:21.680 --> 00:17:30.680 something on the screen. Yeah, besides just watching in the terminal Yeah td 209 00:17:30.799 --> 00:17:37.799 D, Yeah exactly, that's funny. Are you a TDD guy. I'm 210 00:17:37.839 --> 00:17:44.400 not much of a t SO anything that has to do with t I don't 211 00:17:44.400 --> 00:17:52.799 do much of SO testing altogether. Just because I come from QUA, so 212 00:17:52.839 --> 00:17:56.200 I started it should be more into that. Then. Well, here's the 213 00:17:56.279 --> 00:18:02.400 problem is in q A, I realize how stupid developers are, and so 214 00:18:03.000 --> 00:18:06.160 I learned one of the one of the things I learned that I can't learn 215 00:18:06.279 --> 00:18:11.079 is never to never trust the developer, and so it's hard for me to 216 00:18:11.119 --> 00:18:15.640 like trust the quality of the software to the people who are at least qualified 217 00:18:15.799 --> 00:18:18.920 to test it. So I don't know. I mean, it's hard for 218 00:18:18.920 --> 00:18:22.920 me to unlearn. It's hard for me to learn other people's like I know 219 00:18:22.960 --> 00:18:26.799 they swear by it, but I learned a tough lesson as a cure person. 220 00:18:26.920 --> 00:18:30.519 So anyway, Yeah, So to start with, I started at so 221 00:18:30.599 --> 00:18:36.799 I was once I did my master's, let me go back. Actually, 222 00:18:36.920 --> 00:18:40.759 once I did my bachelors, I knew that web programming was there. I 223 00:18:40.799 --> 00:18:45.119 knew web programming, but I didn't like people around me always made me feel 224 00:18:45.160 --> 00:18:48.200 like web programming is not for like, like it's not like a professional job. 225 00:18:48.799 --> 00:18:55.720 It's just like a very low level kind of a role. So so 226 00:18:55.799 --> 00:18:59.400 I was looking for something professional, and I was looking into networking, and 227 00:18:59.480 --> 00:19:06.119 I did some networking courses, did my CCN examination and all that Cisco certifications. 228 00:19:06.359 --> 00:19:11.119 But then I never had love for it because it's like when you do 229 00:19:11.240 --> 00:19:15.599 networking, it's like you just have like black screen and then you code in 230 00:19:15.680 --> 00:19:21.200 it. It was not for me. So when I came to for masters 231 00:19:21.200 --> 00:19:25.640 here in US, I thought to do my masters in networking society since I 232 00:19:25.720 --> 00:19:30.079 did my certifications and stuff, and I saw that no one cared about my 233 00:19:30.079 --> 00:19:34.680 certification and I didn't like they went into very low level networking programming. So 234 00:19:34.720 --> 00:19:40.119 I also what I did is I also took up software development together. So 235 00:19:40.160 --> 00:19:44.519 I was doing networking as was software development. And I love software development much 236 00:19:44.599 --> 00:19:48.359 more. And what I wanted to do is I want So I wanted to 237 00:19:48.559 --> 00:19:52.559 look for a job, and everyone said, okay, Java is something that 238 00:19:52.599 --> 00:19:57.720 you should look for and target for. And I was looking for Java jobs. 239 00:19:57.799 --> 00:20:03.200 But suddenly I interviewed for AT and T as a consultant. They were 240 00:20:03.240 --> 00:20:07.920 more interested for web programming than Java development. And that's why I call myself 241 00:20:07.960 --> 00:20:14.319 as accidental web programmer. Like I was interviewing for Java, but then I 242 00:20:14.400 --> 00:20:18.799 ended up as a web developer. AT and T was like a great experience 243 00:20:18.839 --> 00:20:23.880 for me, even though the project was shared. I mean, what was 244 00:20:23.920 --> 00:20:30.000 good for us back then was we started from j Querry. Right right now, 245 00:20:30.279 --> 00:20:33.400 no one is looking for a person who has jQuery knowledge. Maybe a 246 00:20:33.480 --> 00:20:38.480 few positions might, but working for a big organization like AT and T and 247 00:20:40.240 --> 00:20:45.759 starting with jQuery and then going to backbone, not actually from jQuery we used. 248 00:20:45.319 --> 00:20:51.279 We were using STML and jQuery, and then we moved added handlebars, 249 00:20:51.759 --> 00:20:57.400 and then we moved to Backbone and then angler JS. So so we should 250 00:20:57.400 --> 00:21:03.279 be thankful that we got the whole taste of what we're programming is and we 251 00:21:03.440 --> 00:21:06.599 understand as a whole. But for a new person who is coming in, 252 00:21:07.000 --> 00:21:11.200 it's really difficult for him to just getting into Angular and learning types, crap, 253 00:21:11.519 --> 00:21:21.240 learning, confidence design and the whole services and everything. So education is 254 00:21:21.279 --> 00:21:27.000 really important, and I think people focus into frameworks a lot than just education 255 00:21:27.680 --> 00:21:32.960 of the whole tam CSS. I feel like people bash CSS a lot. 256 00:21:33.559 --> 00:21:37.640 I don't know. I don't know about you, but I love CSS sometimes 257 00:21:37.680 --> 00:21:41.319 like when I do CSS, I don't I'm not like, oh, I 258 00:21:41.319 --> 00:21:45.319 don't know, I why it's not working because I understand CSS. Yeah, 259 00:21:45.359 --> 00:21:48.680 so because we have that experience, we used to support IE eight browsers, 260 00:21:51.119 --> 00:21:55.960 so it's it's not a big deal by using Flexbox with such a great support 261 00:21:56.039 --> 00:21:59.960 right now, it's it's much better than what it used to be. Yeah. 262 00:22:00.079 --> 00:22:03.640 Yeah, so education is really important. And yes, being a self 263 00:22:03.640 --> 00:22:08.240 taught developer, it's like difficult, but it takes time half some mentor or 264 00:22:08.400 --> 00:22:15.599 something and I agree. I agree. Adventures in Angler is a dev chat 265 00:22:15.640 --> 00:22:21.000 dot tv production made in partnership with hero Devs. Hero Devs is a group 266 00:22:21.079 --> 00:22:25.839 of Angular experts who can help your team code like true developer heroes. If 267 00:22:25.880 --> 00:22:29.680 your team needs an Angular expert, reach out to Aaron at hero dot dev 268 00:22:29.720 --> 00:22:34.160 today. How many I mean I run into a lot of developers. How 269 00:22:34.160 --> 00:22:40.359 many developers do you think are self taught? I feel like, especially web 270 00:22:40.359 --> 00:22:45.839 programmers, I think majority of them are. Yeah, it seems like there's 271 00:22:45.960 --> 00:22:49.240 quite a few, except like nowadays, boot camps are teaching it, which 272 00:22:49.319 --> 00:22:55.440 is great, but I still feel like boot camps are a bit expensive than 273 00:22:55.960 --> 00:22:59.960 they are supposed to be. I feel like boot camp still falls into this 274 00:23:00.039 --> 00:23:04.759 self taught category because boot camps only three months maybe four, you still have 275 00:23:04.799 --> 00:23:10.960 to teach yourself a lot like they basically have there. That is good, 276 00:23:11.640 --> 00:23:15.759 yeah, but it's more of a more of a self teaching. Yeah, 277 00:23:15.279 --> 00:23:19.359 I would still throw boot camps into the self thought just because you didn't go 278 00:23:19.440 --> 00:23:22.680 to school for four years. You know, you went to school for four 279 00:23:22.720 --> 00:23:26.200 months and then you had to learn the rest on your own. So yeah, 280 00:23:26.240 --> 00:23:30.759 I uh, I dropped out of college. I was going for computer 281 00:23:30.799 --> 00:23:34.279 science. But oh wow, I'm gonna drop out. Oh that's great, 282 00:23:34.440 --> 00:23:42.480 you're from the great Bill Gades and that category. No, because I mean 283 00:23:42.519 --> 00:23:45.160 I took more school than the boot camp people, did you know? Like 284 00:23:47.160 --> 00:23:52.839 the boot camp people, they they took four months. I took. I 285 00:23:52.880 --> 00:23:56.319 took like a year and a half of college maybe two years. It actually 286 00:23:56.359 --> 00:23:59.000 took me like three and a half years to do because I hadn't I had 287 00:23:59.000 --> 00:24:03.720 my children, that hous, My afternoons were all really busy. But I 288 00:24:03.720 --> 00:24:12.000 feel like there's a lot of people who who are definitely self taught and kind 289 00:24:12.000 --> 00:24:15.720 of follow in that category, right, Like it feels like majority. But 290 00:24:15.839 --> 00:24:22.359 yeah, you do get some essential basics stuff from engineering, but I don't 291 00:24:22.359 --> 00:24:27.759 know how how you would relate it to your hard work that you put while 292 00:24:27.839 --> 00:24:34.519 learning yourself Like yeah, yeah, it also helps you, like I mean 293 00:24:34.799 --> 00:24:44.880 learning from different concept from database, like knowing relational database also helps you to 294 00:24:45.000 --> 00:24:51.559 grow. But at the end, it's your your efforts that will shine. 295 00:24:52.200 --> 00:24:57.160 Yeah, I agree. Well cool, Uh I when am I going to 296 00:24:57.200 --> 00:25:03.319 meet you? Are you coming in g comp? I'm deciding to for sure? 297 00:25:03.480 --> 00:25:08.279 Like are you boss? Yeah? For sure? Yeah, hopefully because 298 00:25:08.279 --> 00:25:11.720 it'd be fun to hang out with you world. Are you are you? 299 00:25:11.759 --> 00:25:17.680 Are you traveling around giving me talks this year? Not traveling anywhere? Yeah, 300 00:25:18.160 --> 00:25:22.680 So basically I don't know if you saw my talks or not. But 301 00:25:22.799 --> 00:25:30.359 people disagree. But I feel like my communications skills are really like I when 302 00:25:30.400 --> 00:25:33.799 I talk in conferences, I like try to search for words while talking, 303 00:25:33.839 --> 00:25:38.279 and I don't feel a lot confident. I also told this to others and 304 00:25:38.319 --> 00:25:40.720 they were like, no, no, no, no, no, you 305 00:25:40.880 --> 00:25:44.279 should go and stay at conferences. But yeah, I just tried to. 306 00:25:44.440 --> 00:25:48.240 I just started like talking at meetups, and I'm just trying to like bring 307 00:25:48.279 --> 00:25:53.400 that confidence in myself first of all, and then slowly go into like conferences. 308 00:25:53.440 --> 00:25:57.119 But but apart from talking, I can still I should be going to 309 00:25:57.200 --> 00:26:04.680 conferences. You should. You should definitely be going. But starting with meet 310 00:26:04.759 --> 00:26:07.799 upsets where I started, I think that's where a lot of us start speaking. 311 00:26:08.039 --> 00:26:12.119 So I think it's good to get out there and teach what you know. 312 00:26:12.200 --> 00:26:15.680 And you clearly know a lot, so you should get out there and 313 00:26:15.720 --> 00:26:18.880 share that as much as you can, all right, And I mean, 314 00:26:18.279 --> 00:26:25.680 for what it's worth, I think you're a fantastic speaker, Like just in 315 00:26:25.680 --> 00:26:27.519 this conversation. In the conversation we're having, and on the other podcast we 316 00:26:27.559 --> 00:26:32.200 had, you do a great job at explaining your ideas and stuff. So 317 00:26:32.559 --> 00:26:37.000 I think whatever's holding you back. Another fun fact, I don't know if 318 00:26:37.039 --> 00:26:41.200 we should talk about it or not, but I did fail my gd exam 319 00:26:42.079 --> 00:26:48.319 GD Yeah, I tried it. I passed my first interview but then failed 320 00:26:48.400 --> 00:26:53.519 the next one. But that's probably just because you didn't have enough community stuff 321 00:26:53.599 --> 00:27:00.000 right right, Like my book wasn't published. Yeah, I knew I was 322 00:27:00.079 --> 00:27:04.440 trying a bit too early then, but yeah, hopefully that our books out, 323 00:27:04.960 --> 00:27:08.960 you give more talks and meetups, do some blogs, do some podcasts. 324 00:27:10.359 --> 00:27:12.440 You've done three podcasts and I've seen in the last few months. Anyway, 325 00:27:14.680 --> 00:27:21.960 I did one yesterday for angler air Anngie Houston was one. Yeah. 326 00:27:21.960 --> 00:27:25.559 I don't consider though, I don't know if we should consider them a podcast 327 00:27:25.720 --> 00:27:27.720 or Yeah. You did the adventage in Angular, now you're doing this one 328 00:27:27.759 --> 00:27:33.920 too. Yeah, so yeah, yeah, you just try again in like 329 00:27:33.279 --> 00:27:37.880 a few months, you'll be ready to go. I also started a JavaScript 330 00:27:37.920 --> 00:27:45.759 meetup group here in Dallas called called JavaScript Dallas, and just one of the 331 00:27:45.799 --> 00:27:49.519 events happened, So I'm like I have to schedule another one for next month, 332 00:27:49.559 --> 00:27:53.799 and you know, trying to do some some open like meetup stuff there, 333 00:27:55.680 --> 00:27:57.920 right right right, what's cool? Yeah, dude, with you with 334 00:27:57.960 --> 00:28:03.200 that stuff on your resume, next time you interview, you'll be fine. 335 00:28:02.880 --> 00:28:07.920 But it's just the requirements, that's right. They just can't let everyone in. 336 00:28:07.000 --> 00:28:11.880 But it sounds like you went a little too early. Maybe you should 337 00:28:11.880 --> 00:28:15.279 have waited a few months because it sounds like you're ready about now. So 338 00:28:15.359 --> 00:28:18.240 all right, what's cool? Man? Well, if anyone wants to reach 339 00:28:18.279 --> 00:28:21.839 out with you, reach out to you, have any questions, needs any 340 00:28:21.880 --> 00:28:25.599 help. What's the best way to get hold of there? Just do npx 341 00:28:25.720 --> 00:28:33.359 Mohammad Zamarkhan in your node in your terminal, npx Mohammad Zamakhan. It is 342 00:28:33.680 --> 00:28:40.279 h M a kh and you should get all the information about me and links 343 00:28:40.319 --> 00:28:45.680 for Twitter, LinkedIn and other cool things. So is there some MPM package 344 00:28:45.720 --> 00:28:49.039 other called Mohammad ama Khan. Yes, if you install that, it just 345 00:28:49.079 --> 00:28:52.920 prints out to screen. Yeah, it's just doing it using NPX And yeah, 346 00:28:53.119 --> 00:28:57.200 it runs that node script and prints out the whole information. Oh that's 347 00:28:57.240 --> 00:29:02.759 awesome man. Yeah, I saw that Thomas doing it, so I was 348 00:29:02.799 --> 00:29:06.240 like, Okay, I can do that too. Let's let's get the inspiration 349 00:29:06.319 --> 00:29:11.400 from others. I like that. I like that a lot. All right, 350 00:29:11.799 --> 00:29:14.119 Well, if so, if anyone wants to reach out to you, 351 00:29:14.160 --> 00:29:18.279 go ahead and MPX Mohammed amecan and he'll give you the He'll get that. 352 00:29:18.279 --> 00:29:22.759 That should give you the information you need to to get a hold of them. 353 00:29:22.799 --> 00:29:26.960 Cool. I like that. All right, let's move on to the 354 00:29:26.000 --> 00:29:33.680 picks. I I'm kind of drawing blanks on picks. So I don't know 355 00:29:33.680 --> 00:29:41.759 if you've watched Chrome Deaf Submit like which happened this week. Yeah, did 356 00:29:41.799 --> 00:29:44.319 you happen to watch it? Like it has? I watched some of it. 357 00:29:44.359 --> 00:29:48.759 What did you see that you liked? I loved Audio's money is adaptive 358 00:29:48.039 --> 00:29:56.039 loading and yeah that was exciting. And some other Pedo Bluey advancements like how 359 00:29:56.079 --> 00:30:03.440 to share videos and photos and to your PW applications which was never there before. 360 00:30:03.480 --> 00:30:11.680 Like so many different features were enabled using this PWA and a lot of 361 00:30:11.720 --> 00:30:17.839 these things are in experimental, but I feel like confidently contact speaker and stuff 362 00:30:17.839 --> 00:30:22.680 coming to PW I will help pws in a long run, right right right, 363 00:30:23.039 --> 00:30:27.920 Just bridging that gap, because I mean I know, like native applications 364 00:30:27.960 --> 00:30:32.480 have barcode scandras and stuff like I mean, which cannot be done in p 365 00:30:32.720 --> 00:30:38.559 w as currently, but hopefully they are all coming in and hopefully web programming 366 00:30:38.599 --> 00:30:44.759 should be enough for creating applications for mobiles and stuff in the future. Yeah. 367 00:30:45.240 --> 00:30:51.039 Cool, Well that's our pick then our pick audist talk from the Chrume 368 00:30:51.119 --> 00:30:55.240 Dev Summit. I get to the end of the week sometimes and I've done 369 00:30:55.359 --> 00:31:00.319 three podcasts and I run out of pick. So you're our pick team. 370 00:31:00.359 --> 00:31:06.759 We're done picks today. Well cool. If anyone needs to get ahold of 371 00:31:06.799 --> 00:31:10.680 us, you can find us on Twitter. Mohammed Zama, thanks for coming 372 00:31:10.720 --> 00:31:14.039 on the show. It's always good to chat with you. I hope I'm 373 00:31:14.039 --> 00:31:18.079 going to meet you soon. So thanks Frosty, thanks for inviting me for 374 00:31:18.119 --> 00:31:23.279 this short session casual to talk. Yeah, and to the listeners, I'll 375 00:31:23.319 --> 00:31:26.880 say thanks for coming and getting to know Zama a little better and we will 376 00:31:26.880 --> 00:31:33.200 see you next time. Thank you. Bandwidth for this segment is provided by 377 00:31:33.240 --> 00:31:37.400 cash Flve, the world's fastest CDN. Deliver your content fast with cash Live. 378 00:31:37.519 --> 00:31:41.559 Visit c A c h E f l Y dot com to learn more.