WEBVTT

1
00:00:00.280 --> 00:00:07.200
You're listening to kf I am six
on demand. Jay, Welcome to the

2
00:00:07.280 --> 00:00:11.839
Jesus Christ Show. Hi Jesus,
Hi Jay. I'm going to join a

3
00:00:12.000 --> 00:00:18.879
church because for all the wrong reasons, oh boy, because I don't want

4
00:00:18.879 --> 00:00:22.280
to join a country club. I'm
sick of golf and tennis. I'm looking

5
00:00:22.359 --> 00:00:26.440
for a little fellowship. And yeah, maybe I'm doing it for all the

6
00:00:26.480 --> 00:00:29.760
wrong reasons. But I think once
I get through the door and I get

7
00:00:29.800 --> 00:00:33.439
in there and part of the program, I think good things will stuck to

8
00:00:33.520 --> 00:00:36.560
happen. What do you think.
I think that's a great idea. There's

9
00:00:36.560 --> 00:00:40.079
nothing wrong with I mean, yeah, you're saying because you're you fall into

10
00:00:40.159 --> 00:00:44.479
the realm of skepticism. I've always
been a skeptic. Okay, well,

11
00:00:44.520 --> 00:00:48.479
do you know what the philosophy of
skepticism is? Boy, how'd you like

12
00:00:48.560 --> 00:00:52.960
to hear it? It is to
suspend judgment upon all things. Okay,

13
00:00:53.000 --> 00:00:56.039
that's hard to believe, Okay,
yeah, yeah, exactly. That's what's

14
00:00:56.039 --> 00:00:59.320
funny about it, is like a
I guess you suspend judgment on all things

15
00:00:59.359 --> 00:01:04.959
excepticism. So it's it's one of
those kind of belief systems that that is

16
00:01:06.120 --> 00:01:10.599
can be healthy if it's propelling you
forward if you can't sit in skepticism because

17
00:01:10.599 --> 00:01:15.480
by the very nature that means you
you are accepting skepticism, which is a

18
00:01:15.560 --> 00:01:19.560
non skeptical thing to do. So
I'm not just a grubby old guy.

19
00:01:19.719 --> 00:01:23.560
Yeah that could be as well.
So the important thing is is that you're

20
00:01:23.560 --> 00:01:29.079
moving forward in life and try it
out. What can I hurt sit but

21
00:01:29.200 --> 00:01:33.480
receive it. If you sit there
in a restaurant and you don't want to

22
00:01:33.480 --> 00:01:37.040
taste anything, and you don't want
to really experience anything, then you're not

23
00:01:37.400 --> 00:01:40.519
it's not going to do you any
good. You might catch the eye of

24
00:01:40.640 --> 00:01:42.120
somebody and you might have a chat
and that'll be fine, but you're not

25
00:01:42.159 --> 00:01:49.879
going to experience truly the restaurant unless
you're consuming of its goods. So I'm

26
00:01:49.879 --> 00:01:53.920
hoping that if if you go in, you're going in to receive and to

27
00:01:53.959 --> 00:02:00.200
see what's there and truly experience it. I don't think that is against skepticism,

28
00:02:00.359 --> 00:02:04.560
honest skepticism in any way, shape
or form. But to sit in

29
00:02:04.599 --> 00:02:10.719
your skeptic bubble U is a it's
not productive because the skeptic is still seeking

30
00:02:13.039 --> 00:02:16.680
has to be well. I kind
of like the idea of fellowship among people

31
00:02:16.800 --> 00:02:23.120
that that believe in uh, you
know, high self esteem. You know

32
00:02:23.319 --> 00:02:25.759
certain in certain areas that you go
to, there are people there that that

33
00:02:25.960 --> 00:02:30.240
genuinely feel bit about themselves. And
I think that's kind of a step in

34
00:02:30.240 --> 00:02:34.840
the right direction. Yes, and
often, and I'm not a fan of

35
00:02:34.919 --> 00:02:38.120
churches that do that pretending with the
smiles and everybody's always honky doory and all

36
00:02:38.120 --> 00:02:43.280
that. But if there's genuine peace, Scripture says that there's a piece that

37
00:02:43.319 --> 00:02:50.520
surpasses understanding that it's it's not based
on what most people experience jay, which

38
00:02:50.560 --> 00:02:54.879
is happiness, and happiness is a
momentary feeling of joy due to a happening.

39
00:02:55.439 --> 00:02:59.000
So if something goes on, you
have cake, you have a party,

40
00:02:59.120 --> 00:03:01.280
somebody's nice to you, and you
get this boost or this rush of

41
00:03:01.439 --> 00:03:06.919
this like little window to joy,
and then it goes away. Whereas a

42
00:03:06.960 --> 00:03:12.199
true believer should be finding that that
that place of joy, which is something

43
00:03:12.240 --> 00:03:15.759
you experience regardless of the circumstances around
you or whether things are good or bad.

44
00:03:16.120 --> 00:03:22.680
It should be joy based on the
sheer existence and understanding that you're created

45
00:03:22.800 --> 00:03:27.759
by a creator who has a purpose. And then you know there are people

46
00:03:27.840 --> 00:03:34.560
that tend to flock together in groups. Like there's people that are well with

47
00:03:34.719 --> 00:03:37.759
skeptics, of course, but then
there's people that are just down on everything

48
00:03:38.039 --> 00:03:40.800
they tend to get get into groups, and then there's people that are up

49
00:03:40.840 --> 00:03:45.560
more upbeat, and they tend to
hang out together. Well, yes,

50
00:03:45.599 --> 00:03:50.960
that can be the case. It's
different like different chemicals that bond together,

51
00:03:51.840 --> 00:03:55.879
or different textures that fit together,
or different colors that fit together, and

52
00:03:55.919 --> 00:04:01.159
things like that. But with human
beings, quite often it's much easier to

53
00:04:01.159 --> 00:04:04.879
bring someone down than it is to
bring someone up. So even in a

54
00:04:04.919 --> 00:04:11.639
group where there's a lot of positivity
or happiness or true joy, it's it

55
00:04:11.680 --> 00:04:15.719
can be difficult if somebody comes in
who's a black cloud and really trying to

56
00:04:15.759 --> 00:04:18.240
bring the room down. And you've
seen that happen as well, you can.

57
00:04:18.399 --> 00:04:23.120
It seems it seems that the darkness
can suck the light out of a

58
00:04:23.240 --> 00:04:29.079
room sometimes, but the grouping can
meet different ways. I've seen people come

59
00:04:29.120 --> 00:04:32.480
in in very dark places in their
life, jay very ugly, ugly,

60
00:04:32.560 --> 00:04:38.480
ugly dark places in their life,
and come into a room with genuine believers,

61
00:04:38.639 --> 00:04:43.160
good godly people who don't have weird
agendas, who aren't just about the

62
00:04:43.279 --> 00:04:50.040
church and this weird Churchianity or any
of these things, but genuine believers that

63
00:04:50.120 --> 00:04:57.759
have come to understand God, that
that just penetrate deep inside that person,

64
00:04:58.120 --> 00:05:01.839
and you wouldn't recognize them night and
day weeks later, and they'll tell you

65
00:05:01.879 --> 00:05:08.240
the same that it just being around
those that are you know, in tune.

66
00:05:08.319 --> 00:05:11.319
You can tell if you've ever been
around an instrument that's out of tune.

67
00:05:11.519 --> 00:05:15.040
I don't care if you know about
instruments or not. You can hear

68
00:05:15.079 --> 00:05:17.720
it. You can feel it in
your bones that something's wrong, even if

69
00:05:17.720 --> 00:05:21.600
you can't place your finger on it. And likewise, you know when something

70
00:05:21.680 --> 00:05:27.759
is in tune and that harmony of
God and the Creator and everything else,

71
00:05:27.839 --> 00:05:31.000
it just it can be, It
could be seen, it can be,

72
00:05:31.120 --> 00:05:35.600
it could be felt. And as
much as you wouldn't argue necessarily the Christian

73
00:05:35.639 --> 00:05:45.000
experience theologically to somebody, especially as
skeptic, because experiences are hard to quantify,

74
00:05:45.560 --> 00:05:46.959
you've got to at least give it
a nod and say, well,

75
00:05:47.000 --> 00:05:51.800
something is taking place there and it
is worthy of investigation. You can tell

76
00:05:51.839 --> 00:05:56.879
a lot about a place just by
the landscaping, Yeah, you sure can,

77
00:05:57.000 --> 00:06:00.439
which you know what a lot of
police departments feel the same way.

78
00:06:00.439 --> 00:06:03.680
And a lot of neighborhoods are very
adamant about the way the front yards look

79
00:06:03.800 --> 00:06:08.800
because they say, once windows are
broken or somebody puts a car on the

80
00:06:08.839 --> 00:06:13.199
front lawn or they don't mow their
lawn, that crime actually creeps in.

81
00:06:13.800 --> 00:06:19.079
And my producer Neil recently before he
moved, he was in an apartment complex

82
00:06:19.439 --> 00:06:24.399
and he watched, he did a
study, watched that one piece of trash

83
00:06:24.439 --> 00:06:27.600
because he's kind of big on going
around and picking up trash and things like

84
00:06:27.639 --> 00:06:32.160
that. That one piece of trash
when left on this one corner of the

85
00:06:32.199 --> 00:06:38.000
property, and a couple of days, became two pieces of trash, then

86
00:06:38.079 --> 00:06:42.519
became a broken couch, then became
a broken couch and a broken table,

87
00:06:42.680 --> 00:06:46.120
then became a broken couch, a
broken table, and a broken television set,

88
00:06:46.480 --> 00:06:54.279
then became bags of canine fecal matter, and all in a matter of

89
00:06:54.639 --> 00:07:00.959
one week. It sounds like me
and I yeah, so that can happen,

90
00:07:00.160 --> 00:07:05.920
you know it. It tends to
perpetuate. People are looking for permission

91
00:07:05.959 --> 00:07:11.920
to do wrong in life quite often, or justification. And if you turn

92
00:07:12.000 --> 00:07:15.040
that on, you look like you're
you sound like you're on a really good

93
00:07:15.120 --> 00:07:19.120
quest Jay, to find that balance
and and to find out what makes people

94
00:07:19.160 --> 00:07:24.160
tick and in the church, and
you find a good church church, and

95
00:07:24.199 --> 00:07:28.319
you have that fellowship, and you
have good, healthy discussions, and maybe

96
00:07:28.319 --> 00:07:32.279
even find one that that has a
you know, an apologetics program or something

97
00:07:32.319 --> 00:07:36.439
where they would enjoy having those types
of discussions with you, or maybe talking

98
00:07:36.480 --> 00:07:43.319
about skepticism or you know, the
health of questioning things and those ideas,

99
00:07:43.360 --> 00:07:46.120
and you might I'm only a part
time skeptic. I see. Okay,

100
00:07:46.199 --> 00:07:51.319
well that's that's convenient. Yeah.
The way I'm curious is that on your

101
00:07:51.360 --> 00:07:56.720
business card. Two things I want
to leave you with as we're up against

102
00:07:56.720 --> 00:08:01.279
the clock care Jay. First scripture
talks about that says live a life that

103
00:08:01.360 --> 00:08:05.399
people will come up to you and
ask why, you know, why do

104
00:08:05.399 --> 00:08:09.040
you have that hope? Why do
you have hope deep inside you when things

105
00:08:09.079 --> 00:08:11.639
are a mess. And secondly,
I want you to think about a belief

106
00:08:11.680 --> 00:08:20.800
system like Christianity that started that started
Jay with a death and being nailed to

107
00:08:20.839 --> 00:08:26.720
a cross, that started on a
note on death, on the one thing

108
00:08:26.720 --> 00:08:30.839
that everybody fears equally on earth,
that says that that's the last straw that's

109
00:08:30.879 --> 00:08:35.080
the end of it all. It
started there. That was the seed,

110
00:08:35.159 --> 00:08:39.919
that was the birth of this faith. And you won't get any lower than

111
00:08:39.960 --> 00:08:46.159
that. And starting from that,
the presumed ashes of that event blooms the

112
00:08:46.200 --> 00:08:54.200
most resilient and arguably this is the
Jesus Christ show, most beautiful faith on

113
00:08:54.240 --> 00:09:01.559
the planet. Pat Welcome to the
Jesus Christ Show. Thank you Jesus.

114
00:09:03.559 --> 00:09:09.000
Frequently or occasionally, as a teacher, you come across a young student who's

115
00:09:09.120 --> 00:09:16.559
not only intelligent, but shows a
wisdom beyond their years, and and they're

116
00:09:18.039 --> 00:09:24.679
referred to sometimes as like an old
soul. And I was wondering, you

117
00:09:24.720 --> 00:09:30.600
know what you had to say about
reincarnation. Well, scripture is very clear.

118
00:09:30.639 --> 00:09:37.480
There's their reincarnation is not playing to
the Judeo Christian scriptures. It says

119
00:09:37.519 --> 00:09:41.559
in Hebrews, and this is in
Hebrews chapter nine, verse twenty seven,

120
00:09:41.639 --> 00:09:46.759
inasmuch as it is appointed for men
to die once and after this comes judgment.

121
00:09:46.159 --> 00:09:48.799
Paul also said to be absent from
the body is to be present with

122
00:09:48.840 --> 00:09:52.639
the Lord. It says nothing of
the sum sorrow or the cycle of life

123
00:09:52.639 --> 00:09:56.039
from coming back and all of those
things. I will tell you that the

124
00:09:56.080 --> 00:10:00.360
old soul concept. The interesting thing
is is if you came a across a

125
00:10:00.399 --> 00:10:03.399
child who seemed stronger than normal,
you wouldn't think they were reincarnated. You'd

126
00:10:03.399 --> 00:10:09.759
think that physically, physiologically, they
were created in such a way that they

127
00:10:09.840 --> 00:10:13.080
had greater strength. Maybe they were
going to become an athlete or something,

128
00:10:13.080 --> 00:10:16.799
but they had greater strength. Intelligence
is one of those things that people think,

129
00:10:16.840 --> 00:10:18.919
oh, well, if they're smart, or if they're a good painter,

130
00:10:18.320 --> 00:10:22.440
they must have been you know,
Picasso in another lifetime. And the

131
00:10:22.519 --> 00:10:26.879
funny thing was, I heard somebody
say this once. There was a young

132
00:10:26.919 --> 00:10:31.879
girl, a very talented painter,
that painted very similar to Picasso. She

133
00:10:31.000 --> 00:10:35.039
was quite young, and the early
comments were, oh, my gosh,

134
00:10:35.039 --> 00:10:41.480
she's Picasso reincarnated. However, if
you look at Picasso's history and you look

135
00:10:41.559 --> 00:10:45.720
the way he propelled himself in his
art, that he was constantly changing and

136
00:10:46.919 --> 00:10:50.840
creating new things, not going backwards, but going forward as many artists do,

137
00:10:52.039 --> 00:10:56.480
trying new things. A lot of
times artists become known for a particular

138
00:10:56.519 --> 00:11:00.600
style of art, but really they
have gone through many different styles to get

139
00:11:00.600 --> 00:11:05.600
to that place. So if Picasso
was going to reincarnate, why start back

140
00:11:05.799 --> 00:11:11.480
on a style that he was died
propelling from that he was actually leaving at

141
00:11:11.519 --> 00:11:16.200
the time. I think it's more
human for people to look at that and

142
00:11:16.240 --> 00:11:20.440
think, oh, well, they've
come back and have this ability, when

143
00:11:20.480 --> 00:11:28.360
really it's just a child who is
exceptionally bright or observant and taking in more

144
00:11:28.639 --> 00:11:33.080
of their surroundings and repeating them.
You say wisdom, but a lot of

145
00:11:33.120 --> 00:11:39.120
times it's not wisdom, it's parroting. It's children hearing things. Maybe they're

146
00:11:39.159 --> 00:11:43.120
around smart people, or they're very
observant, or are very aware and take

147
00:11:43.200 --> 00:11:48.840
in all of the elements around them, learning words quicker, learning ideas quicker.

148
00:11:48.080 --> 00:11:52.559
Maybe they're a deep feeler and they
feel emotion in a way and are

149
00:11:52.600 --> 00:11:58.679
able to articulate that, and so
it appears that they're actually an old soul,

150
00:11:58.759 --> 00:12:05.519
But really it's just a child.
They still you can't drive. Put

151
00:12:05.519 --> 00:12:07.840
them behind a wheel. You put
an old soul behind a wheel, they

152
00:12:07.879 --> 00:12:09.799
won't know how to drive. And
I don't recommend trying that, by the

153
00:12:09.840 --> 00:12:13.639
way, But there are things that
you could put them, situations you could

154
00:12:13.639 --> 00:12:18.159
put them in that would that they
would fail at As children. They would

155
00:12:18.159 --> 00:12:22.200
be exactly like what you'd expect a
child to do. So it's if it

156
00:12:22.240 --> 00:12:24.919
was reincarnation, they would still know
how to drive, or they'd still know

157
00:12:24.960 --> 00:12:26.799
how to do this, or they
still don't know how to do that,

158
00:12:28.240 --> 00:12:31.759
and it doesn't play out that way. I think it's just easier to read

159
00:12:31.799 --> 00:12:37.960
into it sometimes as adults that children
aren't as dumb as some adults think they

160
00:12:37.960 --> 00:12:43.039
are, and so when they stand
up and they say something smart, I

161
00:12:43.039 --> 00:12:48.799
think it's kind of partly based on
the bias of the adult, assuming that

162
00:12:48.840 --> 00:12:52.120
the child's not going to say something
smart, and because the child happens to

163
00:12:52.159 --> 00:12:58.960
be exceptionally observant. Reincarnation is a
really there's more to it than that,

164
00:12:58.080 --> 00:13:01.279
but scripture doesn't allow for it.
There's no place in scripture. Wasn't taken

165
00:13:01.279 --> 00:13:07.080
out as scripture as some people contend. Either on its face, there are

166
00:13:07.080 --> 00:13:15.240
problems with reincarnation. The westernized reincarnation
really is a manufactured want to be based

167
00:13:15.360 --> 00:13:20.279
on the actual Eastern belief and Westerners
believe, oh, well, gosh,

168
00:13:20.360 --> 00:13:22.799
it's like a do over. That's
not what it's there for. It's and

169
00:13:22.919 --> 00:13:28.240
reincarnation is not considered a good thing, and most Eastern beliefs it's a refinement

170
00:13:28.240 --> 00:13:30.440
of sort. But it means you
didn't get it right the first time.

171
00:13:33.799 --> 00:13:39.279
Greg. Welcome to the Jesus Christ
Show. Hello Jesus Thy Greg. I've

172
00:13:39.279 --> 00:13:45.200
got a unique situation. I'm not
sure how to ask my question or question

173
00:13:48.759 --> 00:13:54.559
my wife. Last year she murdered
my infant son, my toddler, and

174
00:13:54.879 --> 00:14:00.200
she has a trunk coming up here
soon. And for what I understand her

175
00:14:00.200 --> 00:14:05.480
defense, she's pleading insanity, and
her defense of course let's come on trial.

176
00:14:05.519 --> 00:14:11.720
But I think that she feels that
she was speaking with God and that

177
00:14:11.840 --> 00:14:20.919
God instructed her to help my son
go to heaven. And I guess my

178
00:14:20.159 --> 00:14:26.840
question basically is a couple There's a
couple lines of thought here. At first,

179
00:14:26.879 --> 00:14:33.279
if it's reasonably sane to speak to
God, then why under certain circumstances

180
00:14:33.360 --> 00:14:43.399
is it considered insane if he speaks
to you. And secondly, if someone

181
00:14:43.559 --> 00:14:52.440
firmly believes that God is instructing him
to do something, even something that is

182
00:14:52.519 --> 00:15:01.120
horrendous, but they believe it,
is it possible that that is doing God's

183
00:15:01.159 --> 00:15:07.559
will? Yeah, I don't know
how to put the words, but no,

184
00:15:07.759 --> 00:15:16.720
I think you're I think you're doing
an amazing job. Actually, you

185
00:15:16.799 --> 00:15:22.600
ask a question that's part of theology, but really seated in one of the

186
00:15:22.600 --> 00:15:33.360
most horrific life experiences anyone can go
through. So imagine where I sit.

187
00:15:33.120 --> 00:15:37.320
There's answers I want to give you, and I will. But when you're

188
00:15:37.320 --> 00:15:50.320
telling me that your wife killed your
your son because she heard God tell her,

189
00:15:50.360 --> 00:15:56.200
So that's that's outside of the realm
of academics, wouldn't you say?

190
00:15:56.720 --> 00:16:02.679
I would think so. And I'm
trying to which is from an academic perspective,

191
00:16:02.799 --> 00:16:07.159
because if I dive into the emotion
and the feeling, it would rip

192
00:16:07.200 --> 00:16:11.679
me to shreds. More So,
I think it's a protective mechanism for me.

193
00:16:11.679 --> 00:16:15.480
All right, are you a person
of faith? Greg? Uh?

194
00:16:15.840 --> 00:16:18.919
It's questionable right now. Sure,
let's just put it that way. I'm

195
00:16:18.960 --> 00:16:22.080
into sciences, that's okay. They're
not mutually exclusive. Oh they are not,

196
00:16:22.399 --> 00:16:26.919
and most people don't understand that.
But you know, I there was

197
00:16:26.960 --> 00:16:32.639
after the murder, lady with the
best intentions of the world. You know,

198
00:16:32.720 --> 00:16:34.360
she's trying to find solace. But
when she said that this was God's

199
00:16:34.360 --> 00:16:41.240
will, that really hurt. And
if this is God's will, I look

200
00:16:41.320 --> 00:16:45.840
forward to having a talk with him
at some point. Yeah, I would

201
00:16:45.879 --> 00:16:51.679
imagine that would be completely legitimate.
Yeah, I'll tell you this. There

202
00:16:51.679 --> 00:16:57.720
are there are things in scripture people
will point to Abraham and Isaac and the

203
00:16:57.840 --> 00:17:03.640
calling of him to kill his son. And the interesting part when you go

204
00:17:03.680 --> 00:17:11.680
into that in scripture is the words
that Abraham uses. He's supposed to go

205
00:17:11.759 --> 00:17:14.799
up on the mountain and take the
life of his son, so commanded by

206
00:17:14.839 --> 00:17:19.079
God. The words he uses as
he tells the guys at the base of

207
00:17:19.119 --> 00:17:26.640
the mountain is here, hold this, watch this, I and my son

208
00:17:26.960 --> 00:17:32.839
will return shortly. Now, this
is someone who's been commanded to kill their

209
00:17:32.920 --> 00:17:41.319
son, and yet his statement was
that they're both going to return, which

210
00:17:41.400 --> 00:17:45.799
is the belief in his mind that
either God was not going to have him

211
00:17:45.839 --> 00:17:49.920
follow through with it, or that
God would rectify it and reverse it if

212
00:17:49.960 --> 00:17:56.640
necessary. There is not any examples
that you're going to go through in scripture

213
00:17:56.640 --> 00:18:00.960
that's going to meet the experience that
you are going through currently. But I

214
00:18:02.000 --> 00:18:07.200
will tell you this that there are
specific usages of that kind of dialogue with

215
00:18:07.279 --> 00:18:12.759
God, but they don't exist in
the New Testament, and they would not

216
00:18:12.960 --> 00:18:19.359
exist except under the most extreme of
circumstances here on this earth at this time,

217
00:18:19.440 --> 00:18:23.720
in this way. So It would
be the equivalent of somebody knowing you,

218
00:18:23.759 --> 00:18:29.039
Greg and saying, Greg, is
this type of person? Well,

219
00:18:29.119 --> 00:18:33.319
if somebody called me and sounded like
you, Greg and told me to do

220
00:18:33.400 --> 00:18:36.880
something that was so out of the
out of character of everything I knew about

221
00:18:36.920 --> 00:18:41.960
you, I would automatically know that
it wasn't you telling me. And in

222
00:18:41.960 --> 00:18:49.640
this particular case, your wife was
battling with what is thought to be severe

223
00:18:49.960 --> 00:18:56.559
bipolar Correct, that's one of the
rumors that get started. She was never

224
00:18:56.240 --> 00:19:00.200
diagnosed to my knowledge, Okay,
and is this These facts would come out

225
00:19:00.240 --> 00:19:04.160
in the trial, obviously, and
so there was no sign of any mental

226
00:19:04.200 --> 00:19:08.240
illness prior. Well, she was
troubled and what do you what do you

227
00:19:08.279 --> 00:19:15.039
mean by troubled? Right, she
Well, I don't want to get into

228
00:19:15.039 --> 00:19:18.519
the specifics because of the trial,
but sure no. But the last months

229
00:19:18.680 --> 00:19:23.319
to two months she u she had
some issues that she began a downward spiral

230
00:19:23.359 --> 00:19:30.880
and it became it was pretty hard. And then she what she evidently had

231
00:19:30.920 --> 00:19:34.799
done was it's like after the fact, when you see a jigsaw puzzled it

232
00:19:34.880 --> 00:19:38.160
together, the pieces don't make sense
the forehead. Sure no, no,

233
00:19:38.200 --> 00:19:42.160
it makes sense afterwards. And she
was telling different people, different things,

234
00:19:42.400 --> 00:19:48.119
and then collectively a huge red flag
was that. But I missed it,

235
00:19:48.039 --> 00:19:56.599
and other people that were close to
her missed it. But she I remember

236
00:19:56.680 --> 00:20:02.279
one evening she told me that God
had given her the secrets to the universe,

237
00:20:03.119 --> 00:20:07.279
and it was it ended up being
a heated discussion and that she she

238
00:20:07.880 --> 00:20:14.079
did not think that I would ever
understand, and so she got very defensive

239
00:20:14.119 --> 00:20:18.559
and very upset with me, and
so at that point she stopped really talking

240
00:20:18.599 --> 00:20:26.920
to me about any of this stuff. And so you know, and she

241
00:20:26.960 --> 00:20:30.400
also had another sun who his home
on the day of the murder, and

242
00:20:30.960 --> 00:20:36.359
he's he's living through his own personal
health right now. Now, did the

243
00:20:36.400 --> 00:20:53.839
boy uh see the aftermath? Or
yes? There's no words, Greg that

244
00:20:53.920 --> 00:21:03.519
are going to comfort you in the
sense that your child is gone. Your

245
00:21:03.640 --> 00:21:10.720
boy was killed at the hands of
his mother, and we're talking about a

246
00:21:10.839 --> 00:21:18.359
mother taking the life of her child. I didn't call for I didn't think

247
00:21:18.400 --> 00:21:23.880
there were words, and I really
don't know why I called, but I

248
00:21:25.319 --> 00:21:30.440
was Are you mad at God?
I've got anger, absolutely, I'm mad

249
00:21:30.480 --> 00:21:37.119
at myself not seeing the scigenist?
But what sign? What what does a

250
00:21:37.240 --> 00:21:41.920
sign like that look like to a
sane human being. It doesn't you're trying

251
00:21:41.920 --> 00:21:45.400
to rationalize something that's your rationalist.
Yeah, if you could think like that,

252
00:21:47.119 --> 00:21:51.160
you'd be the one with the issue. True, there's now if you

253
00:21:51.279 --> 00:21:53.119
let something go on and go on
and go on. But when you're in

254
00:21:53.960 --> 00:21:56.720
you know, when we say this
on on the program a lot that the

255
00:21:57.880 --> 00:22:03.279
lifeguard is out of the pool for
a reason. You know you can't you're

256
00:22:03.400 --> 00:22:07.319
in the middle of it, Greg. And there's times where I've had people

257
00:22:07.400 --> 00:22:11.160
on the air and we've been talking
and when they've experienced something and you know

258
00:22:11.319 --> 00:22:18.279
that they're at the end of a
long journey of stupid decisions and you look

259
00:22:18.319 --> 00:22:21.079
at them and you say, didn't
you see this? And they say,

260
00:22:21.160 --> 00:22:23.519
yeah, I saw this and this
and this and this, and they saw

261
00:22:23.640 --> 00:22:29.160
a huge line of them that you
can look them in the eye and say,

262
00:22:29.160 --> 00:22:32.720
shame on you. You knew this
from before you got into this place.

263
00:22:33.680 --> 00:22:37.680
But your wife being in her late
thirties at the time, correct.

264
00:22:40.960 --> 00:22:48.319
There are it's outside of the scope
of this program, but there are psychological

265
00:22:48.319 --> 00:22:52.480
problems that tend to menace fest in
the thirties, and there are things that

266
00:22:52.519 --> 00:23:00.319
can come up that weren't there before, and there are changes chemically that can

267
00:23:00.359 --> 00:23:07.319
go on in a person's head,
and their brain can go from one speed

268
00:23:07.359 --> 00:23:15.720
to another speed. And it's an
ugly part of truth and life as you

269
00:23:15.759 --> 00:23:19.359
know it and experience it. And
you had someone that you knew in love,

270
00:23:21.160 --> 00:23:26.839
that you brought a child into this
world with, and that you created

271
00:23:26.880 --> 00:23:38.480
a family with that became a monster
of outrageous proportions unfathomable by your average human

272
00:23:38.519 --> 00:23:44.279
being. And how are you going
to see the signs of that unless they

273
00:23:44.279 --> 00:23:48.400
are so drastic, I mean,
talking about God or even having bizarre concepts

274
00:23:48.400 --> 00:23:55.160
of God. That doesn't that doesn't
make you crazy, you know they're My

275
00:23:55.240 --> 00:23:57.960
producer, Neil often says that not
everybody in the church is crazy, but

276
00:23:59.039 --> 00:24:04.039
everybody that's crazy is in the church
because there's something about religion that brings that,

277
00:24:04.039 --> 00:24:11.960
that tends to attract that or combine
with that or whatever it is.

278
00:24:11.720 --> 00:24:18.839
And in this particular case, you're
seeing the most ugly signs of that that

279
00:24:18.880 --> 00:24:21.880
combination. Greg, hold on a
second as we take a break, because

280
00:24:21.920 --> 00:24:30.640
I still want to talk to you, all right, hold on, Greg,

281
00:24:30.720 --> 00:24:34.880
you're still there, Thanks for holding. Obviously, your story is so

282
00:24:37.920 --> 00:24:45.839
is so outside of normalcy to even
you know, even the things I hear,

283
00:24:47.079 --> 00:24:52.119
and trust me, I hear a
lot, and I'm overwhelmed by your

284
00:24:55.480 --> 00:25:00.920
your courage to make the call and
to bring people up to speed, Greg,

285
00:25:02.319 --> 00:25:11.119
Greg's wife took the life of their
seventeen month old boy wear their own

286
00:25:11.119 --> 00:25:19.240
hands. This is there's You're still
sitting with a lot of questions, and

287
00:25:19.359 --> 00:25:22.160
I know that you're going to be
angry. You're going to be angry at

288
00:25:22.160 --> 00:25:26.359
God, You're going to be angry
at your wife and confused. This is

289
00:25:26.440 --> 00:25:30.720
the woman you love, that you
wanted to have a family with, and

290
00:25:30.799 --> 00:25:37.119
now to try and make sense of
it. Something definitely was going wrong.

291
00:25:37.240 --> 00:25:41.359
As far as your question, Greg, about if God, if people can

292
00:25:41.359 --> 00:25:45.319
talk with God, and God can
talk with people, and God can tell

293
00:25:45.559 --> 00:25:51.799
people things and motivate them and encourage
them down directions, why couldn't God say

294
00:25:51.880 --> 00:25:59.119
something so heinous? And the simple
response is that it's against the nature of

295
00:25:59.160 --> 00:26:03.599
God as he stays now, as
he's shown himself in scripture and revelation.

296
00:26:04.960 --> 00:26:12.960
There is what they call special revelation
and general revelation. So general revelation is

297
00:26:14.000 --> 00:26:18.440
that when you look at the universe, Greg, when you observe even through

298
00:26:18.440 --> 00:26:25.119
the sciences when you look at creation. The whole reason why believers say they

299
00:26:25.160 --> 00:26:30.799
believe in creation is that when you
look at Mount Rushmore, for instance,

300
00:26:30.839 --> 00:26:34.240
you don't look at that as a
reasonable person and say that happened because of

301
00:26:34.279 --> 00:26:41.200
erosion. It doesn't make sense.
It has design and specificity in its very

302
00:26:41.279 --> 00:26:45.079
nature. So that's general revelation that
you can look at something and you can

303
00:26:45.160 --> 00:26:48.599
tell a lot about it by just
observing it as it is. You can

304
00:26:48.599 --> 00:26:56.839
tell that a watch didn't just happen
because of ore and metals and silicone and

305
00:26:56.880 --> 00:27:00.200
all these things coming together. You
look at it say this is handcrafted.

306
00:27:00.599 --> 00:27:04.279
And then there's specific revelation that is
the Bible, That is that there are

307
00:27:04.359 --> 00:27:10.319
specific things said by God and that
have been passed down to man, and

308
00:27:11.200 --> 00:27:19.599
in both of those they scream against
the harming of one another. In nature

309
00:27:19.640 --> 00:27:29.160
and creation. It cannot perpetuate if
you had that kind of blatant disregard for

310
00:27:29.240 --> 00:27:36.319
your children. And God is never
going to tell you to do something that

311
00:27:36.440 --> 00:27:42.720
is against the very nature of God. Thou shalt not kill? Really is

312
00:27:42.839 --> 00:27:48.160
thou shalt not murder? The word
there in the Hebrews rot shah means to

313
00:27:48.799 --> 00:27:59.279
dice into pieces the innocent, and
everything that your wife did was contrary to

314
00:27:59.359 --> 00:28:02.559
the Word of God in its current
stand in its current form, and its

315
00:28:02.599 --> 00:28:07.279
current teachings. So it is no
more different than, as I said,

316
00:28:07.359 --> 00:28:12.000
for you to say something that was
out of character so much so that I

317
00:28:12.039 --> 00:28:18.000
would disregard it on its face,
because it's outside of the character in the

318
00:28:18.039 --> 00:28:22.160
realm and structure and understanding that I
have of who you are. Something went

319
00:28:23.079 --> 00:28:27.119
wrong with your wife, whether that's
chemical or whatever. That's not for the

320
00:28:27.119 --> 00:28:33.160
scope of this show. That does
happen to some, but it certainly would

321
00:28:33.200 --> 00:28:41.400
never excuse such a heinous act to
take place. And you know, I'm

322
00:28:41.440 --> 00:28:52.039
not a big fan of the pleading
when it comes to insanity. From what

323
00:28:52.119 --> 00:29:02.079
I understand, the legal definitions are
paramount, and only that through the trial

324
00:29:02.119 --> 00:29:07.079
of course. Well, I mean, obviously there's my opinion there's something wrong

325
00:29:07.160 --> 00:29:12.839
with her, and but whether alleviates
her from her responsibility, of course,

326
00:29:12.880 --> 00:29:15.319
that's up to the jury, you
know, to decide. Sure, and

327
00:29:15.559 --> 00:29:22.079
it needs to be a level of
accountability always, And the things of the

328
00:29:22.160 --> 00:29:26.599
spiritual nature, the things of God
are different, and the there's a difference

329
00:29:26.640 --> 00:29:33.079
between the price that needs to be
paid here on Earth versus what we'll take

330
00:29:33.079 --> 00:29:37.920
place in heaven is a whole nother
issue. But I know that time goes

331
00:29:37.960 --> 00:29:42.279
by quickly on the program and our
time is cut short. But I want

332
00:29:42.319 --> 00:29:45.759
to talk to you off the air. If you can hang tight just for

333
00:29:45.799 --> 00:29:51.799
a moment, think as I'd like
to pray with you as well. Kf

334
00:29:51.920 --> 00:29:53.039
I am six on demand