What is krack Alac and fellow thermonuclear a efforts. I am Dan PAVALLEI coming
at you with my certified fantabulous dripping with fantabulous miss co host mister Grant Hughes.
We're excited to bring you another episode of the biggest, most awesomest podcast
in the media business. Yes, it has happened. It took a little
while to get here, almost two weeks. We are the most popular media
property as of now, ranked number one every single chart you see. Incredible.
Thank you all for your support. Grant, how the heck are you
doing? Actually, I'm gonna say very quick psych because I've decided of what
I'm already going to title this episode, and it's gonna be misleading for anyone
who is clicking on this and expecting your one thing. It's gonna be something
else. We're going to talk about the NBA playoffs. Go figure, Grant,
how the heck are you doing? I'm doing well. I I've you.
You broke the news to me, surprising. I didn't know that today
was the day that we had ascended to the mountain top of all media.
That's really exciting. Also, I when you start that bit each time so
far, I've like forgotten that that's like a thing that's happening frequently now,
and it's just like, wait, what what are we? All? Right?
Right, it's the bit I'm doing very well? What bit? These
are facts? No? No, no, yeah, I know the bit.
I mean we should move on. I feel like I just stepped all
over it. NBA playoffs, Huh, they're happening every series. We're well,
should we even say okay, I know we weren't going to say,
oh, this is stale, this is stale. We're just going to talk
about the situation as it exists right now, uh, and go with it.
Yeah. Yeah, So we're recording this before the do the diead of
Game five that we are going to see on Tuesday. This will live immediately,
so maybe you're listening to this before those Game five shout out to you.
And we're basically just going to get into our biggest question slash questions for
every remaining NBA playoff team in so far as they have to do with the
series. It's not going to be well, the Cavalier is going to trade
down the Mitchell he after this summer. That'll be a question for a different
podcast. So let's where do we want to start. Let's start with the
teams that are not playing on Tuesday. If you want to bounce around,
you will see the time stamps. I always put them in there because we
are the biggest sports media property or the biggest media property in existence. We
all make sure you have time stance about like that's that's just the level that
we're operating at right now. Of all these luxuries, Well, maybe we
ought to start with the easy one of the of the two that are not
in action tonight, which is which is Boston Cleveland. I don't know how
you absorbed it, but like I I vaguely remember that Donovan Mitchell had a
oh that didn't quite look right with in Game three with the calf and then
like fairly close to tip because I just hadn't been up on it. It's
like, oh, he's not playing. It's like, well, am I
watching this game now? And I did, and you know it was like
I guess, I guess before I throw it to you. The number one
thing I could take away from that game, which is like obviously compromised because
you don't have Jared Allen and now you don't have Donovan Mitchell and Boston is
Boston. I think probably the main thing I would take away is that,
like from Cleveland's side, I am starting to wonder really seriously about whether the
whole is less than the sum of the parts in Cleveland, which is,
you know, like you should have gotten smoked really without Mitchell there. But
Garland played pretty well. I think he had thirty and Mobley didn't have crazy
numbers but actually had some finishes inside where he was just like, oh,
I'm bigger than whoever's on me. I'm gonna turn around and dunk it.
Which you know, those have been into my mind like fairly short supply,
and you just wonder, like, you know, we're not going to get
into all the offseason stuff necessarily, but I feel like that game offered a
little more evidence that maybe like the two big in two smalls, which we've
talked about a ton, just isn't producing the returns that it feels like it
should, and they're not that much worse off maybe with you know, one
of each or two of one and one of the other. Obviously they're worse
without Donovan Mitchell. Like that's we don't even need to like put that out
there. By the way the performance he had He's Grade three where he really
went at Boston's defense and like they were made, like the way that the
Caps operate out of the pick and roll in that game, and he was
injured ap like it's just and he's been banged up to the PRP injection right
before the playoffs too. Just absolutely magnificent. So kudos to him. But
he's as we're recording this, he's i think listed as questionable and not many
people are expect him to play in Game five. And then Jared Allens is
dealing with this rib injury and the fact that it's kept him out through these
critical games is like shit, I can't believe he still listened as questionable,
Like at some point it's are you doing that as gamesmanship to maybe to keep
the Celtics on tilt and you just know that like the just rule him out
for the series and season at this point. Yeah, Well, speaking of
unless you want to hit the my half baked theory about Cleveland, well I
did go. I'm I just I wonder how much of it is, Like
is it I guess because we saw it earlier in the year when they were
dealing with these injuries. And like they just go on these runs, but
it's or not go on these runs. But they had that incredible record during
the stretch where Mobley and Garland missed a ton of time. And now we're
kind of seeing it's not the inverse, like now Mitchell's not there, and
then the Cavs looked one way like this, But it helps that you're not
always gonna get that game from Max Struce. I think there's probably Carousel verts
one of his better games of the Playoffs, And so I wonder how much
of it actually used to do with is it less about the four and how
they fit together and more about what does this embolden some of the other like
supporting cast members to even Sam Merrill goes two for seven from the field,
but like, okay, the volume is there, and he was crucial at
the beginning of the game he hit those two threes. I think in the
first quarter. I don't I'm not dismissing your theory. I guess there's something
to It's funny that I said we're not gonna do this through the CASI to
break it up at this one. I find that interesting, but I still
feel like it would be more of a situation where it's one of the four
where you think it makes it easier, and I just I'm very much of
the mind that we haven't seen enough of what their best five man unit would
be to kind of go that route. You might get to a point and
say, you know what, that kind of like where the Pelicans are now,
it's we're just never gonna be at full strength when it matters most,
and so like that's the sample and we have to work off it. So
I'm not quite as far there as you, I really do think, to
throw it back to you, I just I want to see where this team
would be if they didn't have so many of the stop and start absences,
to where it almost feels like Donovan Mitchell and Darres Carnan were better together last
year than this season, and a lot of that probably had to do with,
well, there was more time on the court together from them. And
so does that familiarity those reps? How much do those matter? And that's
why you know, it's different when you're fitting in a supporting cast member on
the fly, whereas you know we need to play Marcus Morris tonight. It's
just it's easier to account for a guy like that, and you might look
better because it's you have your one. You're pecking order is simplified because you're
missing not to forget about Jared Allen, but offensively like okay, you're missing
don to Mitchell, Like we know what's gonna happen now with Darius Garland and
Evan Mobley, and then what's going to happen on the margins with everybody else.
And when you're fitting at smaller pieces around that, you're bound to look
better because it's an easier adjustment. Whereas now if you're throwing another all star
player into the mix, so certainly someone who needs to operate on ball into
the mix, it just gets like you're forcing adaptation, not just from role
players, but from there's a trickle down effect on at least two stars there.
Yeah, I think it's just it's really I want to clarify, like
I'm also not totally convinced that we got to bust it up. This isn't
gonna work it. The thing that as you were talking, strikes, it's
just so unfortunate that this is year two of this roster essentially, like you
know, they added Max Struz this year, but like I feel like we
know less now than we did before because like and you know, you said,
and you're right that Garland and Mitchell weren't as good together this years last,
and that's like discouraging, but like I mean, some of that is
just Garland has been worse, you know, And and he's the one that
again started the year out with like a couple of freak injuries and just like
that can throw the whole operation off. And then to say nothing of like
everybody else you know, having long stretches where they're out. So yeah,
I I don't know. I think really it was a game effort to just
get back to the game from the Calves for most of it. I also
never once thought that Cleveland could win that game, you know. And that's
with and to flip it to Boston now, like to ask a question about
the Calves, Sure, yeah, what is it going to take for them
to generate Evan Mobley easier bucket? You mentioned it was cool that he had
those possessions where it was just kind of you know, not strictly yamming on
dudes, but oh, you're smaller than me, and like I am a
little bit stronger than I was last year, and so I like seeing that
physicality from him, but I'm just like, can we do something that doesn't
involve getting him the ball from a standstill? Yeah, it's kinda it's got
to be addressed on all sides. Like some of it is he's still not
just he doesn't I don't know what it is, like he's not an intuitive
bucket getter, like he's just doesn't seem totally wired that way, which is
why I was so encouraging to see him get like some Aaron Gordon duck Ins
on small guys and just go up right, like just don't don't think about
it, don't think about you know, where's the right pass what like I
gotta gather, just go up, you know. Use he's so long,
like he really can't just extend over centers too. He had a couple of
little baby hooks too that were just oversized, like he can do that.
So some of it's him I think, and being drilled on just like,
hey, remember how big you are when you're close to the basket. We
don't need to overthink anything. I think some of it is, like you
know, the spacing crunch when he plays with Alan, like that's a real
thing. Some of it is. I don't know, maybe he's just too
deferential to to the fact that like we have Mitchell and Garland and those guys
generate the offense and I'm not, you know, thinking to score that way.
And then I guess the other aspect is just schematically like there it just
needs to be a point of emphasis for bicker Staff and for the rest of
the guys on the roster that actually have the ball to figure out like is
it on the roll? Is it like does he need to be like a
baseline cutter like again to draw the air and yeah, like bring it up.
See what happens, Like initiate a pick and roll with one of the
small guards and like, I don't know, have Mobily be the ball handler.
See if that gets you anywhere. The very worst, you might get
a switch where a big is out on Garland all of a sudden or something.
I hope, I don't know, I seem more creative. And again
I like he's actually been he's been really good this series. Yeah optimistic now,
I'm I feel better about mobilely now certainly than last postseason. And I
kind of thought though, just like we might see more of that functional progression
because of the injury to Jared Allen, but now also in that game for
specifically Donovan Mitchell's out. But I guess maybe it's like, if it's not
something they've been actively doing or been unable to prioritize because of their seasons,
felt so stop and start, yeah, right and through the postseason. So
it's probably unrealistic to think about. But to your point about him maybe not
being wired as a score if you're putting him in situations where either it's you're
using him as like kind of this on the move playmaker, or you're just
giving him less time to think and it's more like about reacting than trying to
get those deliberate buckets. I feel like that might be where he excels even
more than that. So I was just something that stood out. But I
think you absolutely have to appreciate what you said, which is having some of
those really physical possessions and coming out on the on the right end of it,
because that needs to be definitely a tool in his belt. It's just
when you look at him because of how he's built, it's not something that
I view as that like playing me Aaron Gordon type role as the an that's
just not something I view as I don't want to say sustainable, but the
optimal deployment of Evan Mobley. Yeah, and like Aaron, we look,
I think we both are very in on Aaron Gordon, like he's phenomenal at
what he does, but like you want Mobley to be to do all that
and more right, Like ideally I just think Gordon's yeah, I know,
I don't know, just anecdotally too, Like it doesn't feel like you see
a lot of probably because Alan is in there a lot of the time,
not in this series, but generally where it's like, how often do you
just see a straight pick and roll that gets mobilely a lob for a dunk?
Like I don't feel like you get a whole lot of those with with
Cleveland, And I probably should have just looked it up because that information exists.
But uh, it seems like if you're talking about let's get him something
where like talk about one where you don't have to think and you just react,
it's like he can't do like the Derek Lively just go up and get
it type of thing, or you know, even GAFFERD. Gafford's kind of
GAFFERD is like hardwired to catch lobs. That is like what he does.
But I feel like if you're trying to spoon feed is maybe not the right
term, but just kind of make it easier, like some of that would
be great and just more cutting more. I don't know if putting the ball
in his hands is gonna be the way to like get him in a position
where he's not thinking more. You know, Like I feel like that's when
the gears start to grind a little bit more. He's had three and a
half rollman possessions per game at the moment, which is like almost a quarter
of his offensive possessions. I would just say that number needs especially when you're
gonna when there's only the one big it feels like that number should be exponentially
higher. Yeah, it's easy to explain it if there's a second guy there
because you just sort of can't do it. But yeah, okay, that
that that that rings true. You watched you got for Boston? Well,
like I guess all the big picture question is like should we be discouraged that
like they kind of had Cleveland hanging around in this game. I mean,
like you're kind of concern trolling at this point because they're gonna win this series,
it's probably I'll be done in five. You know, they they gave
away one. Like I said, Game four never felt like it was,
you know, really up in the air. But like the reason that the
Cows kind of hung around is a lot of the same Boston stuff like happened
offensively with the the ball mount moving, the pull up jump shot like after
fifteen seconds, and dribble pounding like that kind of stuff was very much still
just part of their identity. And you mess around and get away with that
against Cleveland with you know, two starters out. It's one thing. I
guess the quote maybe the biggest question is is like can will Boston just be
able to continue getting away with what it does through the Eastern Conference playoffs,
which is like because you're gonna get New York or Indy and it's just for
different reasons. I don't know that either of those teams are going to be
up to like really making you pay for the bog down offense and for the
for all the stuff we've always you know, harped on about the Celtics like
it's hard to come up with another takeaway for me, honestly, because like
plus porzingis isn't there that might change things a lot to guarantee that Porzingis is
gonna be the one is he's put we haven't heard anything resembling a concrete timeline
for Yeah, I don't know. How do you feel about Boston? Do
you? Is it kind of the same thing, like just yeah, we
know what the issues are. They haven't had to pay for him yet.
I would agree with that. And then I sometimes wonder if do we read
too much into games like they, okay, they played down to the shorthanded
Cavaliers. That could happen with teams. Do you lose that game to Miami
with basically playing nobody at that point? But it's okay, they they made
eighty three pointers, and so if if for some reason with Boston it feels
like we read into the variants of their opponents and then sometimes read lesson to
their own variants, where case in point, here they're shooting the Boston for
the series is shooting thirty three point three percent of wide open threes. Yeah,
that number is what it's at like forty percent for the playoffs, which
isn't astronomically high, but when you're also factoring in the thirty three point three
percent they've been shooting through the last four games. That is astronomically high,
and so it's okay Derek White should be hitting more of his open looks.
Al Horford couldn't buy a bucketing game four, and so there's going to be
variability caked into the way that they like to play. So I'm I don't
feel worse about Boston. If anything, it feels like they might be the
team that we understand the best, but maybe we also don't because it's well
they be tested at the level they need to be tested before they get to
the finals. It's like the question would be like is there even a way
or is it Is it realistic to expect them to change the way they operate
on the offensive end when it's been something that's not just ingrained into this season
but basically like the past few years of Celtics basketball. And I guess what
gives me hope or makes me incline to hold them to a higher standard is
that we've seen when it doesn't stick when they're not playing to drain the shot
clock, like they kind of wear down the stretch with Cleveland, And so
part of it to me is is this a mindset thing where it comes back
to ad Jason Tatum or even sometimes you'll see it from a jail in brown
Less so from a Drewllide or Derek White. And is that a good thing?
Is it a bad thing? It might just be the defining flaw of
this team. I just the more I watch them, I don't know if
it's it's definitely not going to be a fatalistic flaw in the Eastern Like if
they don't make it out of the Eastern Conference, let whatever takes. We
probably won't, but I give everyone permission or I encourage them, let it
takes fly, because that's just this is not a team, even with flaws
and all, or even you think they're kind of sleepwalking through this, this
is a team that should emerge from the Eastern Conference losing a total of maybe
four playoff games, and they've already lost two of them, so you have
two more in the bank. They're that good even without Porzingis. I would
argue they definitely don't need him to reach the finals, going against the Nuggets
or the Wolves of the Thunder or the Mass entirely different story. So I
don't know that I feel I definitely don't feel worse about them, especially when
you're to your one about Cleveland specifically, Like when you look at that Miami
game, it's just they hit twenty three three pointers, right what you're losing.
You're losing that game. That's a bit basically like it's like, so
what do you want them to do? And then in this one, it's
more just like, well, Cleveland's kind of been the optimized version of himself
when it has two of its four best players missing. I can't explain it,
but like that's just been something that they've that they've done. I mean,
like they also had this is like get having Dean Wade backs a big
deal for Like, I don't think people realize how important he was to what
they're doing defensively, and so I don't. I still it would put me
in like if you this might be the way to frame it based off what
you've seen and I don't necessarily know where your priors have been. If the
Celtics make it to the finals, which of the West teams would you pick
them to beat in a best of seven series? Of the four that are
remaining? Yeah, I mean I was gonna flip it and say, like,
don't you think that either any of the four West teams remaining would be
giving Boston a better series than it's gonna get prior to the finals. Like
it's true, good, but will Boston made a series on its own accord?
Yeah, no, I think I will. Obviously I would say Denver
now, although sure wouldn't have said that last time a recorder when they were
down oh two, I'd probably say Minnesota could beat them, and I think
Dallas and okac't. I'm not sure, but certainly at least two of the
four I think I would pick over Boston in the finals, Like, yeah,
what's your number is? Do you think it's more than two? It's
only the MAVs at this point, I think even with and we'll get to
the Thunder eventually, so I won't. I won't jump there, but I
think it's the Thunder have shown that even when they're struggling, there's like a
there's there's like a more of a stability. And maybe it's because they have
more optionality on the roster, where it's Boston's optionality just built into their top
five, like you don't need anything else of those stuff like you can't anything
that you have an issue with with Boston, it can be resolved with their
top five or six players, whereas okay, see, it's what we kind
of have to play like the gidea like a like are we pulling him?
And then it's all right if Isaiah Joe isn't really taking or make three is
like what do we do? Theirs is case of Wallas Knight, so they
have more buttons that they kind of need to push an experiment with. But
the way that they've played and even like they're win in game four over the
Mavericks just like where it's just Shay but then they're finding they're so imperfect and
yet they're still finding ways to beat you out on the margins. Boston seems
to lack that sometimes where it feels like when they're not playing up to their
usual standard, it's a confluence of things that kind of just compound on top
of one another and makes the entire products worse rather than man if we could,
it's not just at the offense bogging it's bogging down. It's like they
kind of just look lackluster with their ham court defense when they're not making shots,
and so it's like infectious almost Yeah, for a while, I don't
know, maybe this is still something worth exploring. Like for Boston, do
you ever think about how the fact that you know, you mentioned their top
five guys, and that's very different than when you're including porzingis because he is
the guy that punishes switches, but others when it's Horford and the four wings
slash guard slash forwards, it's kind of like every defense is just gonna switch
at least one through four and even probably feel okay switching one to five,
And so that just invites a lot of the like stagnant you know, I'm
gonna get a two point jumper off the dribble or a step back three up
because we can't create advantages by guys having to you know, fight over screens,
go under trail like rear view contests. It's just like it's kind of
built in a little bit where it's like you're almost asking for ISO ball when
you have four like primary ball handler slash scorers that can all theoretically be guarded
just as well by like a two as a four or whatever. So you're
just gonna switch a lot. But that doesn't explain the other stuff you're talking
about with Boston, where it's like it's not just that the offense bogs down.
It's that for stretches, they kind of just don't seem to have it
like competitively or defensively or just like mentally so and you know that they do,
which makes it more frustrating that it's not, oh Ken, it's not
a team with questions, Well, can they actually reach and sustain that level?
Yes, we've seen it. Yeah, that that makes them so maddening.
Yeah. Well, I mean, like it's it's so hard to just
dismiss how dominant the regular season was for them, like just i mean not
talked about enough, like one of the all time most just run away you
know, conference finishes, and just the net rating was way up there all
year. But then it's just like, this doesn't seem like that team so
far, and I think it's just because they haven't had to be. And
then you worry about, like, well, how good of a team do
you have to be for us to trust you have you can flip the switch,
so to speak, like because it does feel like Boston will have to
flip it at some point, probably in the finals. But and you look
at the regular season and say, like, well, clearly they can,
but we just haven't quite seen it, and you wonder if you get like
deconditioned a little bit by I saw somebody today was asking like, will this
be the easiest road to the finals any team has ever had? And it's
like it's a conversation just because of the injuries that they've seen on the other
side, and and what what's probably waiting in the conference finals, Like you're
you're just not gonna get I mean, the fact that Indiana would be like
the healthiest team they're gonna see, and Indiana is a team that, like
I don't think anybody sees as a serious title threat or has at any point
this year is kind of wild. Like that's it's pretty wild. So I
guess maybe the real thing is now I'm just eager to see Boston like really
tested, Like whenever that happens. I think that's the most exciting thing going
forward, at least in the East. What do you think is the best
It sucks that I would have probably said of the team's remaining if the Cavs
probably had the best chance of testing them, But then the Donovan Mitchell injury
happens, and it's so I guess it probably is Indy at this point,
just because you look at how fast they play, and like, that's just
not like if Boston's gonna have one of those high variant nights where they're missing
shoster of Jason Tatum, what is he shooting twenty three percent from deep for
the conference semifinals, so off his you know, back to his jumper not
falling at the clip that you you needed to. So I think it's just
probably in I mean, that's not really they're the healthiest team. They'ressing Benic
Mathurin for the season, but it's just kind of like other than that,
they're still dealing with maybe some of the ramifications of their mid season turnover.
So I it's it is a little bit uninspiring though this team is so but
you I think it was you mentioning how dominant they were in the regular season
is important because that team is just so good and if you look at them
and for like almost I know that the Nuggets exist. Timbrolves had a great
year, but like the Celtics should just be the runaway favorites to win the
title. But logistically, the fact that their odds of coming out of the
East are so hot, like that's already. Just getting there is a huge
part of the battle, and so the fact that we think we know they're
going to be there should make them even more right in the runaway favorite,
right, because yeah, even if you think Denver and I think I'm getting
back to that like still is the best team probably or like I think they'll
win it, but like they're not guaranteed to be there at all, like
they I mean, their percentage chance of being there was in therobably single digits,
like not that long ago. So uh, yeah, I don't know.
Should we get to do you have anything else here? Do you want
to get to Thunder MAVs? Yeah, let's talk about the let me start
with the MAVs. I'm just like, my biggest question is what is it
going to take for not just Kyrie and Luca don just to get going in
the same game for consecutive games as scores And I think there are two caveats
here. Is the Lucas knee is just you can see it like he's put
the He's actually strung together a lot more good defensive possessions than I would have
expected over the course of these playoffs with him dealing with that sprain knee,
like you can just see it, like in terms of getting to his spots,
or when the way that his three pointer has not been falling for the
most part during these playoffs, and it's definitely impacting. You know, he's
back to kind of being complaining whiny Luca whereas we saw it. We saw
it definitely in the game four. And then with Kyrie, it's it's a
little bit frustrating to see him not look for his own shot more aggressively,
especially early on. But then it's he's done some really nice things as a
playmaker. I think he's had specifically as other a fantastic defensive series. But
you're not like, yes, you want that stuff from those guys, but
they're you're patting them to get buckets and I know that, okayc is taken
away, some not taken away, but they're encouraging you to live with the
well, go give it to PJ. Washington, Go try and throw it
to one of your bigs in the middle of the floor, or give it
to a Dante Exemer, Derek Jones Junior or Josh Green and so on and
so forth. Or if you're Jason Kidd and it's crunch time, and you're
just gonna sum in Tim Hardaway Junior for some reason. I like, I
don't know what more they're supposed to do. And it's almost we saw the
thunder because PJ. Washington was playing so well, especially early on in the
game four, like they kind of even got away from we're gonna throw the
kitchen sink at these two and it still didn't like result in either one of
them. I don't even want to say taking over, but like looking like
they should as scores. And I do think there has to be something to
the mass are so built around Luka doncs having the ball. I don't think
that's a bad thing, but when he is not Luka Danc's, when he's
this injured, it's not that it's not an excuse, but like you don't
have not even you don't have the safety valves, you don't have the experience
tapping into them because he is so central to everything that you typically do.
And I think, as a player, if you're going to be on the
court and that's the level of agency you had over the offense all year,
but basically your entire stint there, the onus is still going to then fall
on you. And like then it becomes fair criticism of like, you know,
like at least don't complain, like, don't exacerbate the situation by not
getting back on defense. Yeah, I'm surprised you beat me to the complaining
thing, because even in you know, a tightly contested not doing or Die
but like obviously hugely important Game four, I just the thing I thought about
most was how fucking annoyed I was with Luca and how much like I've just
officially arrived now at the point where like I don't enjoy watching him play,
like, you know, at least relative to like how great he is,
like he like, I'm not taking anything away. This is not like it
shouldn't even need to be said, Like there's no argument that against him being
a truly great offensive player, and like he played great defense for most of
the series too, despite being injured. But like the the constant complaining and
and the the foul baiting and the flailing and just like all of the all
the and not even even when he's not complaining, Just like his expressions towards
the refs are just like this is I don't know what somebody will measure this
someday, but like it cannot have a positive effect on your teammates when you're
just like like it just I don't know it. It's super frustrating. He's
so much better than this, Like it doesn't need to be this way,
and it makes him unlikable and like harder to watch. I don't feel like
that's an uncommon opinion, ie like maybe that's how a lot of people feel,
but like, I think the fact that he's clearly injured is is making
all of that worse, and that that was like my main takeaway weirdly through
most of that game of Game four was just just the fact that we gotta
like, I know you're hurt. I know it's frustrating. I know lou
Dort is basically like tackling you on every possession, like we just can't,
we can't do this. This, this is not helpful and and it just
left a sour taste in my mouth. Having said all that, like pretty
amazing that he's that banged up and Dallas is still tied in this series with
Kyrie. What do you think about Kyrie, because it feels like it's being
painted as like a choice like his his sort of you know, every every
commentator is referring to it like, well, he kind of likes to ease
into things in the first half and get teammates involved, and then he goes
on these runs and has big second halves, except like when he doesn't in
game four or what do you think that is is? Because it is really
conspicuous how deferential he is early in these games when maybe he needs clearly with
Luca hobbled, like he needs to be like I'm getting you forty like every
night, right, Like that's just I don't understand the thinking. I think
MAVs fans who've watched more of their games this year can probably to it better
than anyone, but they're like, I think that's just what he's been in
Dallas. And I don't know if it's a matter of him and lugadanshich works
so well kind of independently of one another together, but like we don't see
a lot of like Luca and Kyrie, and maybe it's just because of who
Luca is and just like you can't like if you were to do something with
like, let's just boil it down to if you wanted to run pick and
roll with Kyrie and Luca, the person who is most comfortable handing the ball
in that situation, Like Luga Doncs is not a screener. That's just not
something that he's going to do. And so how do you kind of can
you put him in the post? And then if Kyrie just throw him entry
pass, like that's not really so it feels like that's just been a season
long theme at least, and I don't really I don't know that it's actively
a choice, but it almost feels like it's his role or mindset by design.
And can you ask him to flip it during the playoffs? And I
guess part of the reason you pay in trade for Kyrie Irving is so yes
that he will. But I mean, I'm with you there when you kind
of I mean, we could give all the credit in the world. Jalen
Williams has been all over Kyrie for a lot of this series, so good
for him, especially when he's been pretty rough on offense. But like and
they've thrown bodies at the MAVs. But it's like Kyri there, I don't
know, is it just he's getting older? And so it's like when you're
like in the face of like this athleticism or if you're gonna see two on
the ball, like you're just more deferential in general. I don't. I
honestly don't know. I wouldn't do you would do you ascribe it to just
as a choice the way that I didn't. I guess I haven't been paying
to announce the announcers enough to hear. Yeah, I think it's hard,
Like That's why I framed it that way initially, because it's hard when you
see the things that he can do still, like I think, I mean,
I don't know, I don't know who needed to see it or hear
it, but like Kyrie Irving is just like a breathtaking like offensive basketball like
he still he still has all of the like he had the I think it
was in Game four where he was like driving left and one handed it in
his left hand and didn't put his right hand back on the ball and throws
like sort of an over the head dump pass like just right underneath perfectly for
a dunk like offhand. He's like his physical skill is just still beyond like
anything, and so when you see him do things like that, it's like
you could probably find a way to like force up a few more like semi
tough shots if you really wanted to. So that's why it feels like a
choice to me, because I just don't think. I don't think he's someone
that you like shut down like really ever, Like I just that's that's not
he Like I think the best description I ever heard of, like why he's
so difficult to guard is like he doesn't really have a plan. He just
waits for you on defense to like do a thing and he's like, oh,
I know what to do now, And just because he can do everything
either hand either foot, there's just like there's no game plan to stopping him
because he doesn't have a preconceived idea of what he's doing against you until you
screw up basically, which is just like the most badass way to play offense.
It's so cool. But yeah, it doesn't seem like he can be
stopped if he doesn't want to be, or at least prevented from getting shots
up. So yeah, I don't know. I mean, it's hard to
knock it, like Dallas has advanced this far and they're not super healthy where
it really matters, so it seems to be working, but could have done
with a little more. In Game four is analyzing the rest of this series
from Dallas's perspective, as simple as like are we going to get a big
Luca game or is this just what it's going to look like going forward.
I think the other thing you could ask is are they going to hit their
free throws? Because that I would argue, there's reasons why they lost the
game four. There was some weird crunch time decision making, but like they
could have easily put that game away given how the Thunder shot from three for
I mean the thunder made six and said they were six of twenty I believe
in the restricted area. And the other stat I saw is they went thirty
seven minutes in the of game time without a restricted area basket. That is
that is bonkers. I mean, like you're ever scoring inside. And also
the other thing that's happening is like that was all for most of that game.
It was I know, Jayalen Williams J dub your guy. I don't
know what's going on with him offensively necessarily, but he's He's come out a
couple times down the stretch, but it was like Shay willing them back into
that game. And so the free throw has just become so important, I
mean so important here and they're shooting. I think it's under sixty four percent,
or do you have the box score up? It was like ten of
twenty something. They they missed more shots at the foul line than the Thunder
made at the rim. So it's just like that's not ideal. And when
you have such a like when you win the three point battle, specifically while
Lucas shooting, so Poorli and Kyrie's giving it's just my god, that's that
feels like such a missed opportunity by them, and so like that's a stupid
question, can you hit your free throws? But it's they've played look for
a lot of that game because they were leading in Game four, and it's
just been a lot like they're they've been really physical on defense, Like okay,
so he was missing some higher quality looks from deep, but like the
Mavericks have been in their face, they're running them off the line. They've
gotten them to take like, yeah, Shaye wants to get to like the
mid range of his spots. But I think that this series has kind of
also highlighted how the Thunder could use more of a not that they need someone
better than Jalen Williams, but he kind of maybe needs to develop even more
counters inside the arc in terms of side to side amble, just because you
really only have Shay in that regardless. Also why it's been such a weird
series for Josh Giddy. I know everyone's kind of pointing to, Oh,
he was a net plus in Game four, Okay, awesome, Like that
lineup with him on the court is still getting blasted for the for the playoffs
night or definitely for the for the series. So I just like, you
have to control your controllables, I guess from Dallas, and so if Luca
is not going to be Luca, to just like be this down bat,
the frout line is really problematic for them, and they're like, look for
the series, they're losing the points off turnover battle, they are winning the
second chance points battle, They're about even. It's actually pretty closer on the
break than I would have expected. I think they've done a good job this
is to say of kind of displacing Oklahoma City from a lot of their their
element and kind of limiting them to the half court. And this is also
a team that they're about even It's like within six points of each other of
points scored inside the paint, which is you know, that's fine. It's
like the free throw stuff, especially if you're not going to have the version
of Luka Nachts that you need. But it probably is as simple. I
don't know if it's I don't want to absolve Kyrie of blame here, but
it really does. Like if this is just the version of Luca you have,
I don't know if you're going to get enough, even if Kyrie is
scoring thirty points a game or something, to then win this series. Yeah,
I think that's right. I want to correct myself. Twelve of twenty
three. I'm sorry if you said it was was Dallas from the foul line
in game four, and everybody fixates on the one that Luca missed because that's
always you know, that's the most conspicuous that could have tied the game late.
But I mean that's like, I just don't know how you overcome making
half of your free throw, you know, slightly more than half of your
free throws in a game you'd lose by four. That's we don't It's kind
of like fixating on the officiating as the reason you lost. It's like you
always want to throw out stuff like free throws too, but like in this
instance kind of I mean, especially with the Thunder being twenty three of twenty
four, it's like the game really was decided at the foul line. That's
not like, that's not an outlandish thing to say. And it's also just
like they have if you if I told you this at the start of the
series that on possessions in which Derek Jones Junior has registered as even a partial
defender on Shay Gilgolexander, the Thunder as a team are averaging under point nine
to nine points per possession. If I would have told you that at the
start of series that we'd be going into game five and that's the number.
Yeah, you might said, Dallas is up three to one, I'd say,
how do we get to game five? Probably? Did they change the
rules? That's crazy, That's that's amazing. And it's just like, I
mean, it's not like the shots that Shay hit last night to seal that
game were easy. They were all just contested pull up twos, like the
one went over the corner of the back. In the post, it was
like, yeah, that was what do you say? Like that was ill?
I don't know what that was. I love his post games because he
actually thinks about the question. You can tell he like is actually listening to
the question and then basically gives you an answer like that, or it's just
like yeah, I don't know, I prepare and I made. It's just
like very simple. One other thought I had with respect to Dallas, and
like, granted it's part of the scheme, it seems like for the thunder
that PJ. Washington is gonna just get some really clean looks at three and
some of them are gonna come from the corner. But Micro, do we
need to like be careful about deciding who a player is when he's only ever
played for a team slash a poorly run franchise, which is the case for
Washington in Charlotte and Macro like, how much more do we need from Gafford
in Washington, if anything, to sort of make us have to re litigate
was that trade worth it? Because I think we both said that it was
too much. You can't like these guys aren't needle movers of a great enough
degree to justify making it so you cannot compete with like the bigger offers this
summer in trade because you gave up, you know you've dipped into your first
round pick equity, which wasn't great to begin with. Like it's kind of
like the go bear question we talked about before of like is the trade officially
justified now because Minnesota is a contender and even if that's only for a second,
Like, isn't that all you can ask for? So, like,
have Washington and Gafford contributed enough and put the MAVs on a high enough level
to like where that cost is now justified? I'm asking, I don't know,
we need to work it out. It's a weird situation because they could
make the conference finals. They it could happen, and so in theory it's
worth it. I'm just more of the mind of, Okay, well then
how do you go from here to actually winning the title? And if it
happens this season or if you make the finals, then it would seem like
yes, But there seems something I don't want to say. It's a frameral
about what's happening, but it's the West is only gonna kind of get harder,
which is a Memphis is gonna be healthier, and maybe New Orleans is
healthier next year. But they're also not baron of assets this summer. If
they need, Like they have the Tiple Hardway junior expiring contract, they still
have some first round equity they could trade. So I, as of right
now, I'm very much I will acknowledge that I was apparently too hard on
the trade, but it's weird. I just didn't see I didn't see the
level of physicality they were going to bring, specifically with PJ. Washington.
I promise you I've not seen. Well, he's in the playoffs, so
I've seen more of him in Dallas than in Charlotte, But I was not
watching way more of PJ. Washington with the Mavericks versus when he was in
Charlotte. The level of just defensive physicality that he has brought is unlike anything
that I remember seeing consistently from Charlotte. So maybe I underestimated him bringing that
element of it. It's still in a weird spot though, where if you
ask me if I'm still making that trade, if I were the one running
the Mavericks front office, I can't tell you yes right now. I guess
maybe there's a maybe I'm not adjusting my priors enough. Maybe that's unfair.
But like if they get to the conference finals and lose in five, or
it's just like how do you view like the was it worth it? But
then you can also look at it, well, look at what Luca was
doing when he was banged up. In the fact that they were still able
to get there wasn't account for something. The answer here is yes. I
guess My whole point is, I don't if you had to rank the teams
that are most likely to win a title of those that are left right now,
I'm gonna have Boston and the Timberwolves and the Thunder and the Nuggets in
front of them. So you're fifth of You're fifth of eight at this point.
And you know what, if you told me Cleveland was fully healthy,
I might go with Cleveland above them too. And so I think what my
issue is is that it feels like they're still missing something or someone. And
maybe that's the skeleton key that is Maxi Kleiba and what he can do with
some of those lineups. But we've kind of seen that, like he's not
always going to be healthy, and so am like, do you need to
go out and find someone else? Am I just underestimating what they're able to
do with the PJ. Washington and A and a big type of setup.
It's just like what And it's almost I'm again, I'm criticizing myself here by
just saying, what is it more that I'm looking for from this team?
And it's I honestly, I don't want to say that. I don't know,
but it still feels like they are a semi significant player short of getting
there, because it always feels like they're kind of making when you're looking at
their best lineups, it feels like they're still making one or two large concessions
at one end of the floor where it's this guy needs to be not even
just twenty five to thirty percent better, but needs to be like fifty percent
more. Like, yeah, it will be a different type of player.
Yeah, I think I want one. I wonder if Luca were fully healthy,
like and and in that case, like maybe this is three to one
Dallas or maybe maybe you know some or something like that, and Dallas,
you know, had it would have had an easier time in the first round.
Potentially, Like I think the calculus on judging the Washington trade fair or
not might be different because you'd say, like holy, like you know,
maybe maybe in that scenario, Dallas isn't fifth of eight in your title odds
it's like third or fourth or something like. You know, it's just it's
it's such an interesting I don't have an answer. It's just I think it's
a topic like we don't really talk about enough because it's like not buzzy or
not. Like I don't know, it's it's kind of esoteric, I guess.
But it's like, at what point can you say, like, this
was a team that was trying to get better in the immediate and they did
it, and like how good how good does that better quote unquote have to
be for the trade to pay out? You know what I mean. Like,
it's just there's no right answer because you don't know if Dallas thought this
is a trade that makes us the favorite. But I also would say too,
the way Dallas played and defended, specifically like down the stretch of the
regular season suggests to me that like they should go into next season, assuming
all the principles are back and healthy, like like expected to be a top
five defense. I think like that should be the expectation if if you proved
it over that long of a stretch and you've got Derek Lively, got another
year of experience and theoretically he'll improve and you've got another, you know,
a full season of Gafford as a two headed monster protecting the rim and Washington's
there all year, like they should have a high expectation for next year.
So it's not just like, you know, everything turns back into a pumpkin
after this postseason run. You had your one shot at justifying this trade and
you didn't. It's like they're still next year. But but yeah, I
just it's it's such an interesting thing because you never know, Like, I
guess I got trades on the brain because that's what I've been working on a
lot. But it's like, how do you decide and when do you decide
if a trade was a good one or a bad one? And Dallas is
like at least making us think about it, which is which is clearly wasn't
we ethered it? And it's clearly like the I was wrong on that front,
I guess and what I was. It really feels like they need someone
that just melds what will the concept of Tim Hardaway Junior with Derek Jones Junior
and it's like sort of the two way, like three guys, and it's
just yes, we know what Dante x Me and Derek Jones Junior able to
do it points offensively during the regular season, but like they're not super high
volume when it comes to it. Uh So it always feels like they're kind
of making concession at that spot, which as Kyrie gets older, I know
he's defended well during these playoffs and like like a point throughout the season.
It's just that isn't like when Luka and Kyrie are your back court and you
can't count on them to be exceptional defensively on a night. To that basis
that three spot. Yeah, really, even with PJ. Washington and Gafford
arelive like it, I think it needs to be a better player than they
have now. If you're going to win the title, I would have said,
if you're going to win two playoff round, that needs to be a
better player. This needs to be a better setup. I was clearly wrong
about that. I wonder, like, because you mentioned Jones and ExHAM,
I think maybe it's as simple like it, I don't know who this player
is, but just say it's Jones. Because Jones brings a ton of athleticism
and is defended well, but he's still someone that the opponent is going to
say, if you want to get up nine threes and you think you can
make four or five of them, we will happily lose that way. You
know, like that's just an exum even you know, exhem gets dared to
shoot even more. If that player can bring most of what Jones does,
like defensively, athletically, rebounding in tangibles and also is like we can't leave
him, then that Like that's the kind of player you're talking about, right
that whatever percentage better that is. It's like, now Dallas is officially just
I don't know what you do on defense with with another like doesn't even have
to be like a premium shooter, like if it's Jalen Williams, Like if
it's if it's him instead of Derek Jones, maybe that's all all it takes.
What do you got for the Thunder? It's your biggest question for them,
that's my biggest question for the Thunder. I don't know, well,
I mean after last night, it's like how much longer? How long can
you survive with Shae being the only guy that can create and make difficult shots
like that was it was amazing to watch, but like I just kept possession
after possession, with with the Thunder being unable to one get into the lane
for a clean look or get anything up or finish anything because Dallas is just
walling off and like it wasn't just like Giddy wasn't out there long enough to
just blame him. It's like Gafford was on him some. Gafford was on
Aaron Wiggins some and was like sagging and just you know, if a thunder,
if you want to have Aeron Wiggins shoot a bunch of threes, that's
scarier than Derek Jones. But we're good with that, and we'll just wall
off the paint like that. The Thunder have to crack that. It can't.
You can't just have Shae, you know, making what was I forget?
I saw the stat earlier, but it was just like I think it
was sixteen two point jump shots or it was like the highest we've ever seen.
I'll pull it up while you're talking next. But like that's unsustainable even
for someone as great as SGA, like that can't be the driver of your
offense. So I'm curious to see if Jaylen Williams can get anything gone.
I'm curious to see if they can just make better use of Isaiah Joe as
someone to just run around and create chaos and get some spacing going. But
I guess it's mostly offensively for the Thunder Just maybe that's recency biased, but
I need to see them figure out some other ways to score as the series
goes on. No, I think I think that is kind of the big
question. And they do still seem at their best when they're able to get
well at least everybody else does, when they're able to get into more of
their early offense stuff. So that's something that could be like like a greater
focus. And I mean, look, that's where Jay Dubb has been at
his best in this series. It feels like going into like those early offensive
situations you mentioned the Joe thing and that lineup where you're basically having him come
in for giddy has absolutely destroyed the Mavericks. I think they're like a plus
eight that that five is like a plus eighteen and no, they're yeah,
they're a plus eighteen in twenty three minutes. And so yeah, part of
that is, Okay, there's streeting nine to twenty from three, YadA,
YadA, YadA, But like that makes so much more sense because it's changing
fundamentally the way that Dallas can defend since it's i mean, like you say
the same thing if you go from like Giddy to Case and Wallace, or
even if you want to like they threw some Kendrick Williams in there, but
because Isaiah Joe is so dangerous as a movement guy, it really does bend
a lot of the stuff that Dallas wants to do. And I know there
are probably some people that are calling, like why is Giddy even starting at
this point? It's just Mark Daniel's kind of done the thing all year.
It's like Giddy's gonna start and sometimes he won't start in the second half,
and he's gonna limit his minutes is as he sees fit. It's I'm gonna
be fascinating to see how they continue to sort of juggle that because as you
can just say, like, yeah, he's clearly he's clearly Mark Dagnell and
the under clearly making a decision that's the best to win. Otherwise would be
playing more if they were getting into sort of the political equity of like this
guy is supposed to be super important to our future. He's extension eligible this
summer, and so you know that when push comes to shove, they're gonna
have what they deem is the best lineup on the corporate When you are struggling
outside of Shake Gillier's Alexander to generate easy offense, it's well, do we
need to go to this sooner? Do we need to go to it from
the jump? Do we need to go to it more? And if we're
not going to, well, then how do we kind of open up things
for I think we've seen it a lot with just looking at the quality of
looks that Chet, Honggrin and JDub are getting with Giddy on the floor versus
relative to him not or when Dallas feels like they can play off anybody,
even like a case in Wallace which made Dallas. He made Dallas pay a
couple of times, you can kind of just see the material shift and the
types of maybe not even the types of looks, but the level of difficulty
on them. And so I would agree with you that it kind of comes
down to, like, all right, how are they gonna kind of run
their offense here? And it's like they haven't been by the way, They're
a one to twelve, say, offensive rating for the series which isn't like
astronomically low, but it's like that game against Dallas felt like such a slog
to get through because of how tough life was for them offensively, and it
really came down to just the clamps they were able to put on Dallas defensively.
Which are you able to rely on that if Lucas having a Luca game,
or if he's a little bit healthier or a spry or in a certain
matchup. Yeah, it's so funny, like we're we get so deep into
the weeds and I just circle back to like what if Dallas made sixty percent
of its free throws? You know, we're like early trying to unpack this
whole thing, and it's always little things like that. I got to have
the stat. So SGA was twelve of sixteen on mid range shots in Game
four, tying Land Marcus Soldiers for the most mid range buckets in a playoff
game over the last ten years. So that's all to say what we just
spent eight to ten minutes talking about, like the thunder of gotta find some
ways to get baskets that don't involve record setting mid range shooting. That's the
challenge ahead anything else on this or should we should we go to the games
for tonight. I will say I feel a lot better after watching Cason Wallace
on both ends of howrbes specifically defensively, and like, yeah, sometimes he's
not you know, sometimes he's getting vested by if if he's on Kyrie.
But feel really good about putting him on first team All Rookie after watching him,
Yeah, I think you should feel pretty solid about that one. Let's
do Nick Pacers, which team you got a question for? I mean it's
got to be the Knicks, and it's how many bodies? Yeah, they
even have left? And I will say, I don't know what, I
don't have answers like I just my question is just like do they have enough
to win this series? And how do you respond following a game four like
that? On what that was? Just in a basketball atrocity. But I'm
looking at this team and it's just Pacers have made some adjustments more Aarony Smith
on Jolen Brunson and even just having that slightly extra length the exercise. I
think he has like two inches on Andrew Nemhar. It's gone, it's gone
really well. And then we also kind of saw that he Nemhard was tracking
Dante DiVincenzo More which took him. It looked like out of the element in
Game four? How do the Knicks respond to that? But the bigger thing
is fifteen I think it's fifteen point three percent of their shots are coming late
in the shot clock between seven and four seconds left. Now, if you
include zero to four seconds, that shoots up to like almost thirty percent.
I think it's like twenty seventh percent of their shots are coming early and late
ultra eight in the shot clock. Those who combine that is by far and
away would have been the largest share during the regular season. And there are
just too many possessions right now where you're watching them, and it's they don't
even especially if Jalen Brunson is not in the game or if he's not handling
the ball. It took them seventeen seconds to get inside the three point line
or look that entire possession went by. It wasn't like an early offensive possession
where they got a shot up. It was twenty one seconds kicked off the
clock and they didn't even get inside the three point line. And I'm watching
Jalen Brunson and if he you know, summons just something from the depth of
whatever he has left after playing all these minutes and playing hurt and has some
of that jiggle joggle to put the Pacers defense back on tilt. I don't
know the solve. I think the Knicks can play better defensively. I think
when you look at the personnel, like they are built to play better defensively
than they did obviously in game four, Like the just level of intensity wasn't
there, but you knew they were down bad when Josh Hart needed a rest
right game four. It it's just like, I don't want to oversimplify this
because we've been driving it home throughout the entire playoffs, but are they running
out of bodies? Are they running out of stamina? And look, maybe
it works in their favor that, you know, the starters were kind of
some of the starters were kind of in pretty late in game four, you
know what, because the Knicks are run out of bodies and like you can't
just like emptying your bench means what, Yeah, so I I don't I
know that I still picked it. I don't move off my picks. We
saw some of this in the Nuggets thing. I got Nuggets responses, which
By the way, Nuggets fans like you know, we were wondering if they
were broken. Absolutely take your victory. Lap. I didn't not of us
picked them to lose the series. We just said we were more uneasy.
So I won't move off my pick. I just don't do that, Like
I'll just what I'm thinking. But the more I'm watching this team, I'm
just like, how do you pick them to win this series? Right now?
You could say it's they've responded to adversity all year. We're reaching critical
mass here where it's not just the adversity they're facing, but the toll that
it has taken on the players who are actively still in the game and just
without ogn and Obi specifically like won the backbone of their defense, the nervous
system to it all. And then just like the minute he's gotta been playing,
then the injured Jalen Brunton, and there is Yo. This is the
one thing. Here's a little aside of an anecdote. I cannot stand.
It's I understand that there are different levels of fandom, but I'm at Mother's
Day brunch, well, Matt, my family hosted it, uh and I'm
speaking with they don't listen to this podcast. I'm just gonna put them on
blast. One of my brother in laws saying he doesn't like Jalen Brunson always
has the ball, doesn't like his attitude, and I'm trying to explain to
him, I can picture you like crawling out of your skin trying other things
said as well that I need to bite my lip about, as you know
full well, but this is just strictly basketball, and I'm trying to explain
to him. They first of all, you can't ascribe a player's play style
to attitude. It's like ascribing Tobias Harris makes this much and he's not playing
well, so he's a terrible human being, Like you don't you don't give
from like point A to point Z like that. I'm trying to explain him.
They don't have anyone else. And I tried to point out a possession.
I was like, look, John Brunson didn't touch the ball there and
the Nicks didn't get inside the three point line, and he just dismissed it,
like so that's but that's what this team is like. It's literally like
I know what people think about Josh Hart in the early offense and in transition,
I know what Isaia Hartenstein can do. I know what, I know
what. I don't think Evincenzo can do on like he has some certain pop
on possessions. John Brunson is the only from Score their second best frum scratch
creator right now? Is Al Birks? Right? That's not okay, that's
where we are. That's where we are. I think. I mean,
Jokic is obviously the answer, but if you exclude him, you could have
come into this playoff saying is there another player who is more singularly important to
his team's success than Brunson. When you said is the answer, I was
like, to what this team needs? The question? Yeah, that was
all. I think the Knicks need Jokich. They should trade for him.
What do you think? Did discuss? No, Like, I'm not look,
I'm not breaking up the Villainova squad for Nicole? Did he go to
Villanova? Sorry, Chris Jenkins or who that's That's who made the shot?
Right? No? Because it's just it's like you said, there just isn't.
It's not just that the Knicks are losing bodies and guys are breaking down.
It's that they came into this postseason hobbled as it was like Julius Randall
is by no means like a like the kind of shot creator you ideally want
on a playoff team, But for the Knicks like, hey, we'll take
it, because if it's not him, then it's yeah we could. We
don't beggers, can't be choosers, Like we'll take nob And everyone was excited
he had he had the game of his life, I will say, before
he got injured. Yeah, really he can do ain and then missed that
finish. He can do a little bit O g could. But that's like,
that's that's that just illustrates the point of like if you're to the if
you're at a place where og Annobi's individual offensive creation is actually very important to
your success, Like that's a pretty clear signal that you are short on shot
creation. And like if Brunson again it's I hate this, but like it's
kind of like Dallas with Luca. It's like, how do you discuss the
series in any way without starting with, well, this guy is beyond critical.
Like if if Brunson I saw that, I didn't know they could do
this. I think it's second Spectrum or some kind of tracking software that said
well, Brunson's jumping an average of like two inches lower on his pull ups
or on his shot attempts, and it's just like as an indicator of like,
yeah, he's which like no shit, he's obviously injured and hurt and
like not one hundred percent. But like if he can't be just a forty
point guy, then what are we talking about? Like that you just because
you can't get It's like Dante DiVincenzo has exceeded expectations. He's he was clearly
tired, as was everybody else, but like he was gassed in in game
four, and like he's not a shot creator. That just isn't what he
does. And so like neither is Josh hart Neither is I mean Hartenstein's a
good passer, Like maybe maybe we just start running the offense through him if
you're the Knicks, I don't know it. We're over complicating it, I
think to a pretty significant degree if we get too far beyond what if do
me? Bride plays like he has a pulse again on offense because like that
it's it's but it is fair at the end. I hate that so many
well not so many, but I guess, well, yeah, so many
three of these series. I kind of dismissed the Cavaliers boss, like,
yes, Cleveland's missing. It's I don't want to dismiss it. The Cavs
are a good team, but like so many of these series are just we're
gonna look back and say, was this just a war of attrition? Because
you know, one of the three best players in the world and the Dallas
okayc series was clearly not healthy, a player who finished top five on the
MVP vallot in Pacers Nicks wasn't healthy. And look, hey, they were
already missing their second most important shot creator, and then they were missing I
guess you call him to your second most important center at this point, but
he was your starting center at the beginning of the year. And that's oh,
their most important defender just went down. And then it's I mean,
Cavs Celtics. It's well, they're missing two of their four best players in
game in Game four, and they've missed Jared Allen for what he was he
missed now since the end of the was it just game seven he missed against
Orlando or he missed more time than it doesn't match. They missed him as
at least one might have been two, but yeah, but he's been out
the whole series. So it's just like I hate that, Like thank God
for timber Wolves Nuggets, which we'll get into it side, So there's no
point in overcomplicating for the I do think I've seen a lot of well,
like the Knicks, like now they can run it back and like everyone gets
healthier. And I will say, you read into this and you look at
and you say, if you want to run it back, you need to
be damn sure. Do you think Julius Randall is the missing shot creator type
of needed And the answer to that, by the way, is no,
he's not. And it's that's just that's where I'm at. I think he
did a good jobkind of blending in more in the larger pitcher this year.
They are not one Julius Randall away from kind of playoff proofing their offense.
It's just I'm sorry if they're not there, and so you need to take
that. I think it might be even harder to understand that because of what's
going on with Jalen Brunson right now, and even just because of the success
like the lineup with og and Obi and Hartenstein and Brunton and I think it
was is it Devincenzo and Hardley? They absolutely destroyed the Pacers in the minutes
they played before OG went down. Uh, so that's something they need to
remember. Unless you had anything else to add on the Knicks, what's kind
of your biggest question here for uh Indiana? For the Knicks, I would
just one more. I think that Chwa needs to play a lot more.
I oh, fuck, look, here's what needs to happen with it.
Youua, he can play more, don't start games and then keep Jericho Sims
all the way from this series. This is not the matchup for him.
So well, I guess I didn't mean to dismiss that, like don't we
don't need to start pressed like that? No, we don't like that paves
the way for you to that or you need to play way more so you
don't lean on a jerk because this isn't the Jericho Sims series. Like it's
just clear the way the Pacers space the floor and like even just some of
the lines like with the bench right yeah, I mean, and to be
fair to Sims, he is like the fourth big on this team, so
he shouldn't be I'm getting into, Well, you need to play precious to
chew him more like, what are we doing here? No, yeah,
Jalen Brunson's secondary imports a chewa needs forty minutes. That's just the fact for
the pacers. I mean, I don't know. I will just say I
just love the Aaron Smith experience. Uh. It's kind of one of my
favorite role players all year. He he's like I had the thought of watching
him play because like he will make the odd like bad foul, or he'll
like run his guy over or or like knock into someone accidentally. He's like
a missile that you know how like missiles have like the four fins like on
the back to like keep it steady. That's like he's like one of those,
which means he's really fast and destructive, but like he's missing one of
those, so it kind of wobbles as it goes. But it's still he's
just like his athleticism is always turned off all the way up and it's just
but it's like not always like in this perfect straight line where and that's almost
a good thing for like really intense defense against someone like Brunson, because he's
just like all over the place. He's all arms and legs. He's super
physical and kind of reckless and kind of dangerous seeming, and that's like what
you want on all on a smaller guard if you can get it. And
the fact that moving Nemhrd somewhere else didn't really hurt Indy because maybe just because
Devincenzo was exhausted and maybe because nem har is just better suited to guard someone
like him, pretty encouraging. I just, you know, I don't know
where else to go based off Game four, just because things over like I
don't know at the twenty five minute mark, I mean maybe before that,
maybe the twenty minute mark, it was fairly well decided. It was a
twenty point game in the first quarter. Like, you know, I don't
know how much how much credit do you give the pacers, you know,
for being where they are versus like how much are we just going to acknowledge
that the Knicks are fo You have to give him a ton of credit because
I know that the Knicks are banged up, Like this team was down two
to zero and very well could have been down three toero based off towards the
ending of Game three, which was tight and it was I think I don't
know if we recorded since that podcast, but I definitely I think I texted
this to you and it said it felt like, as odd as it sounds,
that the Knicks needed that game, ye just to give themselves a margin
for error that was more doable. And so I give a ton of credit
to Andy, and I'm sort of like, again, the adjustments they've made
defensively, I think have absolutely impacted the Knicks, and injuries I'm sure have
helped it. But like the other thing that I've really appreciated, and I'm
wondering if they need to get It's counterintuitive because it involves maybe staggering Tyres Haliburt
and Pascal Siakam even more. But there are these kind of bench heavy mobs
that they're running out and they're just nuke and the Knicks in these small samples,
and the two lineups that stand out to me have played a total thirteen
minutes in this series and they've outscored the Knicks by twenty one total points.
And so there's the TJ McConnell, Miles Turner, Obi Toppin, Haliburt and
Ben Shep unit that we've seen in a couple of games, and then there's
the TJ. McConnell, Pascal Siakam, Ernie Smith, Isaiah Jackson, Ben
Sheppard unit that we've also seen in a couple games, and like those two
combinations and even like throw the what's been one of the more part like the
McConnell's Siakam Toppin' Jackson and Shepherd one too. Like those, you've gotten to
these starter light, one star Bencher heavy mobs that have been able to just
really take the Knicks down, And I don't necessarily is it because you're playing
even faster or is it like I think you're better suited in some of those
units, And maybe it's you know, especially when you're yanking Turner off the
court and you're throwing some Jackson, like are you just better suited to rumble
with the Knicks on the glass. That's the other thing that they've done.
I know that the Knicks have like you look at the Knicks offensive rebounding rate
and it's, oh, okay, it's at it's at thirty percent for this
series. Uh, that's high, but it's also not super high for the
Knicks to relative to they play And fun fact, Indiana has more second chance
points than the Knicks, right now in this series. So it's again the
offensive rebounding rate. There's difference like on that, but you're you're winning that
battle. So I'm I guess my one question for the Pacers is are they
able to like keep this up and take advantage of the situation that they've done.
And my answer almost is yes, like to answer my own question,
because you've seen some of the adjustments that they've made, and I'm just I'm
very curious to see what kind of happens when if they get punched in the
mouth where it's game five, or if you know, in a game six
or something, and is their room to see more of these Again, it's
counterintuitive because you should want Haliburton and Siakam on the court at the same time.
But like these bench mobs, and they're not strictly just going up against
the Knicks bench because then they don't play their bench because they don't have a
bench right now, they're absolutely like slaughtering these dudes during those minutes. Yeah,
I feel like, you know, not to turn it back on the
Knicks a little bit, but it's related, Like I definitely came into the
postseason thinking what TJ McConnell has done during the regular season is nice, but
like that's there's gonna be ways to make it so you just as the Pacers
cannot lean on McConnell for as much as he played during the season, and
like you could almost make him a detriment, right you would think, like
he doesn't want to shoot threes and he's the size disadvantage is like you could
finagle some offensive sets where you're getting a bigger guy on him. But the
Knicks just like aren't built to do anything to exploit like other team's weaknesses right
now if you think about it, because like they ideally they play like fairly
like sized guards. You know, between de Vincenzo Brunson and Heart. I
mean, Heart's not really a guard, but you know he's six four six
' five, and so it's not like you can so easily like let's get
McConnell switched on to like a big that can punish him with size. It's
like, okay, so precious Achua is now gonna attack McConnell. Honestly,
Like that's not so. I think credit to Indy for just like getting away
with playing guys that on. In normal circumstances, you might be like less
inclined to put out there in a postseason series because of the way they might
get exploited, and to the Pacers for just like they're still running. There's
still I mean, if anything like this is the god this is the wrong
series for a tired team to be playing, right because the Pacers still are
just just gonna get X number of just runouts on made baskets because guys are
tired on the other team. So yeah, I don't know. I mean,
like, if you're Indiana, well this it feels so trite to say
because it's Game five and it's tied to to I still feel like it's a
more important game for the Knicks to win because if the Knicks somehow are rested
and get this one, then you can lay another egg and you still get
another shot Game seven home court in the best of three series right now,
obviously, but like, if Indiana can get this one, man, like,
I just I'll be so impressed, because I don't know, I just
I didn't think that Siakham was a good enough second, you know, star,
I didn't think that a lot of Indies players would be like up to
the challenges of the postseason. So yeah, I don't know. I don't
It's hard to have a lot of notes for the pace after like a game
that was spent mostly One of the questions I felt I might have is how
do we make sure that Tyre's Haliburton stays higher volume on the offensive end?
And like he's done that basically the past three games. There are still these
pockets as time when he's on the court and it feels like he's not,
but it's they've gotten they've definitely gotten progressively smaller, and he's now turned in
a handful of just really good games, so that's not even a question for
them at this point. I was even thinking like what would the Pacers do
if the Knicks kind of change the way that they're defending Haliburton? And I'm
kind of just looking at it, like what else are Like who who is
the guy that you're deciding to say, oh, do they need to have
more Duce McBride on Tyre's Haliburton? Like what is that? What is that
even doing? I think from the Pacers side, if you're you know,
more of a from a standpoint of more of like how do they like stick
the knife in? Like Siakam was seven of nine in Game four, and
the more often the Knicks go with McBride as like the fourth guy uh instead
of a Chua like can just go to work in like the mid post and
on the elbows and if you get him on one of those smaller guys in
a pick and roll, like Siakim is someone that really should have like a
at some point before this series is over, based on how the Knicks like
how limited their options are in terms of like wing size, he should be
able to have like a monster game or two. I would think it might,
you know, it just seems like he has such an advantage with his
length, and like all he's got to do is take two hard dribbles and
spin and then he's six feet away and there's a six foot four guy on
him. Like it just seems like that's somewhere that the Pacers could really go
to much more often, just because the Knicks aren't don't have the personel to
like do anything about it. Really, Like I'm surprised Sakam hasn't hasn't had
like a super kick ass game, you know, at least you know,
once in the last couple Just with that, I've actually kind of wondered why
they haven't used him to go after Jollen Brunson Moore sure to where And maybe
it's part of it because who Jalen Brunson is predominantly inn guard, It's going
to be Aaronie Smith or Andrew Nemhard. But it's like, just have those
dude screen for Sakam then And I know Nick don't like to switch, but
maybe is that going to force and if if maybe if they're switching, like
are they gonna try and do you know scram or peel switching and then it's
gonna complicate matters and you bust up the defense that way. That's something that
I kind of thought about could they do, But I'm almost just like,
it really feels like the key to what the Pacers do is that when they're
playing so fast, not only is that kind of exhausting the Knicks's stores,
but like they're just not you've seen the Knicks defense. It feels like the
best A few games get progressively more confused when it comes to not even the
game. Game four is its own beast, like very early on, but
yeah, you're kind of sea where the matchups just aren't where they're not supposed
to be or they're just not set. And so it feels like that is
more of a collective key to what India is doing. And it's it's not
even a question because it's just like that's just ingrained. It's more of a
question for the Knicks is well, how do you slow down the pacers?
And it's make shots so you can get your defense set. And right now,
they're just not built to make shots in the half court on a consistent
basis. And then you could say, well, if they're getting we we
did talk about this. There's a duality here. Well, if you start
to get up and down the floor fast or one, where's that doing to
Brunson's leg? And two that's Indie's strength. Like that's like, so if
you're not gonna be hyper efficient, you're just gonna put yourself in a more
compromising position because Indy's gonna either come off of a turnover a live rebound and
get the push out of that situation. Yeah, it's it's like the Knicks
are at the risk of like having a really nasty feedback loop where like you
can't score and so there's a bunch of live ball rebounds and they run the
other way, which tires you out, which makes it harder for you to
score, which creates more live It's just like, how do you get how
do you pull out of that tailspin? It's it's gonna be tough. But
I do think, I don't know, this may not matter. I do
think the Knicks are gonna win Game five. I just that's if I had
to get wait to date a podcast, right, God, seventy two minutes
into it, you're always doing that. I just have to be honest.
Speaking of dating the podcast, let's start with the Nuggets, who I was
beyond impressed with. I don't know how I felt. I think I was
more morbidly curious with a degree of nervousness, because I didn't want this series
to devolve into a shit show where if they would have lost Game three,
well this is co I want a competitive series with these other three series where
there are so many people injured and it's only gotten worse in most cases.
So the way they responded in games three and four on the road is just
like, okay, like this kind of not that we needed to be reminded
that these were the reigning champs, but it's a lot of people pointed this
out and they were right. I will not diminish them going and winning the
title last year. I think people who do that don't recognize that they were
the only great team in the Western Conference. Okay, the Western Conference only
had one great team. It was them, and that's why they won the
way that they did. Now this season, they've already been I think Minnesota
is the toughest test that they faced over the past, and it's not even
close. I think you can argue both postseasons. It was the toughest test
for them to come back like they did and to see like the functional adjustments
that they're making of just you know, yeah, Jamal Murray has made some
tough shots, but they also feel like they don't. I would have to
go look at the possession time, which I'm just not inclined to do when
it's a game by game basis, Like they're not having the ball in his
hands from the jump as much. It's more of Nikola Jokic being aggressive,
or it's more of we're putting the ball in Aaron Gordon's hands. Because this
is gonna force like you can't hide, well you can. It forces the
timberlves this awkward decision where it's okay, we'll still press Aaron Gordon, but
then like we kind of need to hand him off to Rudy Gobert once he
gets there, and that's not great. And then okay, we can defend
Jokic straight up And look, I think Rudy Gobert has defended Jokic straight up
incredibly physically, which is to say, well, it doesn't fucking matter when
Nikola Jokic is in the mindset of I'm gonna take these shots. He hits
tough shots. I don't want to boil it down to Nikola Jokic decided to
be a score. And that's what happens. When Nikol Jokic takes tough shots.
They're not a he's easy. They're physical. He's using all these different
like you look at him under the basket and sometimes you can't like, is
he gonna go up? It's like he will miss a shot, grab his
own board without having like a he doesn't need a second jump so much.
It's just like he's just there. He's just gonna grab it. The dude
is both physical, crafty, has this level of finesse. But you've seen
a shift in how the Nuggets are playing and I really appre that it even
feels like and which I think is smart. Like they've changed the way they're
defending Anthy Edwards and they've part of that has been all right, Like it's
not just not like it's it's playing Christian Brown sometimes at the expense of Michael
Porter Junior's minutes, because like we know that Christian Brown could hold up against
some of these defensive assignments. More just a masterclass I think in not losing
their composure after get like for the series and just making these I don't even
think that they're the I think what's really wild is that these aren't subtle adjustments
is that they're they feel more. Maybe they are subtle in the like I'm
not an NBA head coach, but like they're they're real to where it's something
that you could argue, well, why would they get away from this?
Yeah, we've seen more Jokic Murray two man action. It feels like they
even want to slow it down a little bit more. That's where the most
comfortable. They were a little bit too sped up through those first two games.
But it's like what you're doing with Aaron Gordon, ye, Like that's
a material adjustment, and so I give them kudos to not getting I was
say, stuck in their ways, but to be willing to make an adaptation.
That is, if it's not stark, it's significant enough that I don't
think it's a guarantee other teams would have made it. I think, I
think that's really interesting. I remember, I'll keep notes in my phone,
like as I'm watching games, just like throughout the course of the year,
like just some thought I'll have that I know I'm not gonna remember. And
one of the ones I made, I don't know, it could have been
like December or something. Was. Yokic always has the last word tactically,
like in terms, so like whatever you think is gonna work against Jokic,
he will have the last word in that exchange, like he will counter it,
and then you won't have a counter to the counter and he wins like
that, you know, whether that's defensive coverage, whether that's the types of
shots you want to make him take. I think what Games three and four
have shown is that it's not just Yokic like that that applies to it's Denver
as a whole, and it's it's again like, how do you ever evaluate
this stuff. But I think it's a lot of Michael Malone too, because,
like one, it would have been really easy to let this series get
away after that O two hole for like a number of reasons, like from
a motivational perspective or from like you push the wrong buttons, you panic a
little bit, you make the adjustment you think is going to work, and
it doesn't. But it just feels like the Gordon thing in particular is huge
that like Denver, I think is showing now that it as a unit is
going to have the last word tactically, like it will make the last adjustment
and put you back on your heels and force you to say, Okay,
what do we do against that now? And it feels like the Wolves may
not have a great counter to the counter, like we've we've seen this series
shift now and I don't know what needs to happen for Minnesota to shift it
back. Maybe that will happen, like it's it's it's it's hard to be
super confident because neither of us foresaw the Wolves winning the first two games,
and like nobody saw that, so we don't have a great grasp on the
series, like from the jump, pretty obviously. The other thing I think
just macro because I think you definitely hit on like some of the key specifics
of it, but big picture, I think you said it last time we
talked, you root for chaos, which, like the Wolves beating the beating
Denver the first two games and seemingly putting a stranglehold on the series was chaos
and it was awesome because it was like what do we now what? Like
everything is in disarray league wide? Denver was our pick, Like this is
awesome unless you're a Denver fan, like this is this is the most fun
it could be. Watching Denver come back and win games three and four reminded
me that what I actually like, even more than the chaos is when greatness
says like hold on, like we know we will will decide what happens here.
And I think that's a symptom of coming up as a basketball fan,
like during the second Bulls three peat, where they'd be down and Jordan would
just be like, Nope, I'm gonna find a way to win this game,
whether it's the flu game or just whatever, or you know, the
last sequence against Utah with the steel and the jump around Brian Rut like just
greatness just finds a way. And I think that like formed me as like
a real one of the formative things of my basketball fanom and seeing a team
I think is great and a player I think is great just reassert like this
is what it looks like, which is what Denver's doing is fucking awesome.
Like, I just I love the response. I love how good they looked
in games three and four. I love that, like just now going forward,
it feels like Minnesota is really on its heels because Edwards had frigging forty
four points in Game four and it just wasn't like close to enough. I
I just it made me read we like chaos. For I like chaos.
I love seeing like something special, just like certify that it's special and that
feels like what we what we got in games three and four. Yeah,
I that that's a great way to frame it. And I guess if you
were asking for like a question with Denver, because now it's like they're almost
they're back to being that kind of no notes team. It's like I almost
kind of focus on what by the way, recognizing from kind of the jump
that this needed to be a justin Holiday series and Peyton Watson series. I
mean, that's amazing, but you also kind of have to wonder, like,
is he going to continue to shoot sixty two from three? Yeah,
like he's kind of sixteen for the series, I think something wild like that.
So he missed two in game four, so I've really dragged his numbers,
so he's already fallen off. Yeah, So I just but again,
like that would probably be my question, and it's do you get to a
point where because of how you like to run your offense and like you've been
playing for more. I mean, look, they use the in game four,
that twenty eight to four run where it was kind of like you show
that you could punch the mouth, But if it's later, does that have
to change the way they run their rotations at all? Does it limit what
you could do with Christian Brown because he's giving you some offense, but he's
not necessarily a four space who's a great mover off of it. But you
also kind of need him because you've had to change the way that you were
defending Anthony Edwards and a lot of that is CACP. By the way,
we talk about Murray's cash strain caseyp's dealing with an ankle issue, and that
would probably be my other biggest question is that how do you overcome because we
even saw it in game four where there's just like there's pockets of time where
Murray doesn't look like Murray or isn't playing too well. What did you get
another game yeah where that's the case or games and how do you respond to
that? That's kind of my question with them. If you don't have anything
else on the Nuggets, I do have, like what is your biggest question
for Minnesota for the rest of the series. I mean, like it's it's
definitely got us well, just in terms of like nuts and bullets, like
how are we gonna handle the Gobert Aaron Gordon like interplay? Because I think
what was you said it was so successful in the first couple of games.
Is Gobert being able to kind of rove a little bit and be there as
a second defender or to pick Yok up if he needs to and someone else
will recover out to Gordon and so far as the Wolves are even interested in
doing that, if he's beyond the arc like it is, what's the adjustment
to the adjustment? So let's assume that Gordon does more ball handling and is
forcing Gobert or whatever forcing the Wolves to not do what they wanted to do,
Like what's what? What? What? Then? What what is Minnesota's
move? Like? How do you do? You do? You put Kat
out there now? And because Cat has quietly not quietly, but like we
haven't really discussed him at all, had a really rough game four, Like
I just don't know what the tactical switch is there. And then I think
to like somebody besides, and this may just be Cat, Like it can't
just be Edwards making tough shots or breaking down the defense on his own and
finishing layups, which he does like so easily. I can't understand it sometimes
how he's able to just get layups out of isolation against the said defense.
Yeah, I don't know. I think I think the guy that needs to
play really well on both ends, and that might mean he's also covering Gordon
a little bit more as Towns, because that's got he's got to be able
to supplement Edwards scoring. Maybe some pick and roll some some Cat Edwards pick
and rolls however you want to structure those would be good. Yeah, I
don't know, I don't I guess it's just like the biggest question for the
Minnesota is like how do you get your feedback on the ground after being up
too oh and then seeing Denver like hit another level that you couldn't match for
two games. Yeah, and I'm wondering could an adjustment be and we saw
it a little bit in game four? Do you go three bigs and like
you're kind of just banking on Well, then you can have nas Reed do
the Gordon thing and that'll still you could still try to figure out ways to
then have Rudy Gobert on the bet, have Towns on Jokic and then are
you hope But again, what is who's Rudy Gobert on? So it's just
I guess it depends on so if they have Brown in there instead of Michael
Porter Junior like during those minutes, maybe that's something. Look or at this
point with the way he's been shooting, is it just like CACP becomes that
guy. I'm just wondering if it's worth trying that. I'll be very interesting
if are there any more wholesale adjustments there? You mentioned kat Is is a
really good one where Okay, there's the blowout and only takes seven shots and
there's a very inefficient game in game four. The answer is like, who
are you else? Are you expecting to level up your offense? We've seen
the half court offense fall off since, you know, the first two games.
It's been the opposite with Denver, where they had they were averaging like
point eight to nine points in the half court during those first two games,
and now and again it feels like to me that they're I mean, they're
going with their bread and butter of Murray and Jokic, but they've also kind
of like allowed them cells to slow down where it feels like they were trying
to actively or at least Murray was maybe trying to actively make quicker decision or
Yokic was trying to get rid of the ball. And now over the past
two games, Denver has a half court offensive rating a one point one eight
per possession, which is that's high especially after that's pretty good. Uh,
But yeah, with Minnesota, it's you need and it's Towns is just such
a fascinating player, especially when it comes to the postseason. Just the peaks
and valleys that he's able to explore. But like, if it's not going
to be him, are we really sitting here saying okay, well, then
you know we need Nasried to really step up and drop twenty points a game
when it feels like, you know, the Timberwolves are kind of worried about
how he's going to hold up on defense against Denver's peak offense. And after
that it's okay, well then we'll just you know, a thirty six year
old Mike Conley, or after that it's like deh is it Nikhil Alexander?
Well, I just it has to be Towns, And I don't know what
it's really a matter of either is how do you go about getting Towns?
You know, the volume is one thing, but how do you go about
getting him him? I get, I guess more volume, but to be
more consistently present on the offensive end. Yeah, it's hard like he it's
he's one of the I know, we overreact to every game in the series,
or at least I do. Where it's like if Team X wins,
it's like impossible for me to imagine how Team Why is ever going to win
a game in the series. When Kat has a bad game, it's just
like I can't ever imagine how he's going to be effective going forward. Like
because his bad looks bad, Like it's the Wayward drives out of control stuff,
the passes to nobody, Like when he doesn't look right, it's it's
so conspicuous, but like he's still someone that you got to be able to
get. He's got to be how many he had I guess he got a
He got four to threes in thirty eight minutes in game four. I need
Cat shooting like eight or nine threes just to just to like maybe all this
time just uh, you know, unclogged the offense a little bit, right,
Like that seems that's always seemed like one of the easier fixes for a
Wolves offense. That has been it's weak link for you know, all year.
It's just like, see what happens if Kat gets up ten threes in
a game or whatever. I know that's easier said than done, obviously,
but like if you're looking for fixes, it's, like you said, it's
got to come from him either getting downhill with an advantage or just spacing out
to where the guys on him can't, you know, feel comfortable. I
was fascinated by the big lineups that the Wolves used a little bit in Game
four, Like it I just wonder while there will be some payoffs, like
if you have too many bigger, slower, relatively speaking guys on the floor,
is that just kind of begging Jokic to just pick you apart as his
smaller teammates are moving around off the ball and getting into space, and like
it's just harder for big guys to one navigate screens they get hung up,
and two just to move as quickly like I would expect if the Wolves go
bigger, because they had like I can't even remember what it was. It
must have been go Bear Towns read Edwards and like Alexander Walker or McDaniels was
the one that they had out there in Game four for a while and it
was just like every guy on the floor is enormous and just physical. I
think if you do that too much, as the Wolves, you might end
up getting burned by it. It might not be as valuable defensively as you
think if the Nuggets can space it out and just like kind of cut it
to pieces. But the line of your about was Edwards and McDaniels. Yeah,
with the three bigs, I might try it. I would not do
because you sort of have to try it, but I would also be really
ready to pull the ripcord if you get back cut like three times in a
row type of stuff. But yeah, I like, well that's the thing.
One of the other ways to go though, is just a bunch more
conly go bear like high pick and roll or so you know, things like
that. So then but then you need Conley out there, because that might
be one of the other ways you can score. It's that. I think
it's gonna be the type of thing where the Wolves just have to like try
some difference, try both of them those things and several other things, and
whichever one starts to work for a while, just running into the ground and
hope it gets you enough to pay off in the end. I will also
say the other question on half for the wolves is can they regain control of
the non yo kicch minutes of which there aren't going to be many. But
they were actually worse during non yokitic minutes. And it had to do with
like one minute stretch, Like that's how these things work, the entire thing
when you look at the minute yokiest play and it is a mini stretch.
But they ended up getting outscored by five points when the Coole Yaks was off
the court in Game four, which is worse than what it was in Game
three, where I think they still won the non Yokic minutes if I remember
correctly, Like, that's just I understand that you want to mirror certain looks
of your lineup like at that point, but at the same time, it's
I mean, if you're getting I'm trying to think of what the lineup was
that was blitzing them. I think it was Murray, Gordon, Holliday,
Porter and Brown. If that lineup is going through like this two or three
minute stretch and they're just you know, outscoring you by like nine or ten
points whatever, it ends up like that can't like those are those are precious
Like It's the same way if you're the Nuggets and you're looking at okay Anthy
Edwards is off the court, that is precious time. Yeah, that you
cannot afford to squad like at least play it to a debt, even because
sometimes yes, there's gonna be the dual star looks. I mean, like
the dual Stars, they'll be out at the same time. But it's just
sort of you know, you're looking at Anti Edwards place forty point five minutes
a game, Those seven and a half minutes he's off the court, those
are big for the Denver Nuggets. Nicoleyoka is that like forty minutes a game
for this, so it's like he can't especially when there's other yea like the
way that Yoka is playing himself. I don't know necessarily what the answer is.
You just mirror saying, you know what, like do we completely flip
flop it where it's okay, we'll pull like go bear off the court during
that time, but we want, you know, like we're gonna throw like
we're gonna play everyone else like that's gonna be Edwards Conley Towns read who's your
McDaniel? Like, do you just put out your best non go bear five
during that? Say, our goal here is to create some separation or at
least bridge the gap. I like, is that is that stupid to?
You know? I love it because I think like if you if you're putting
together the list of what absolutely must happen for us to beat the Nuggets while
they're playing, well, it's like you got to be plus ten and like
this the four to eight minutes, Yokic isn't on the floor because you're not
winning the other minutes general, most likely if the Nuggets are going well.
So like, however you do, like what if you just turn those stretches
into like the most high variance portion of the game where all you do is
come in and like, let's get up if it's a three minute stretch,
let's get up a three like every time down, let's like just hunt,
like hunt space, hunt threes, run it like crazy, like just hope
that you can go you get you get your plus eight in those three minutes
and maybe you get another section of plus two or three, Like you can't.
That's a must because you aren't. History suggests you are not winning the
Yokic on minutes as the Wolves like you're just or anybody else like you can't
do it. So you have to find the advantage in that tiny window and
whatever whatever you need to do to exploit it, like you gotta because yeah,
like Denver did have lineups out there and has had lineups out there during
the series where it's like, how is this a functional offense? You know,
because it'll be brown and it'll be like they're just maybe it's a hobbled
Murray and like four other guys that aren't gonna create shop it happened they want
like Reggie Jackson wasn't. It's like okay, like the can't like this.
Yeah, that's that is the lowest hanging fruit of any series against the Nuggets,
and you just have to pick all of it. And I don't know,
you know, if the Wolves, maybe that's just the barometer, like
if the Wolves can win those minutes handily, that's gonna offset the bulk of
the minutes of the game, which you aren't gonna probably win. I don't
know this this series is still would you say this is the most interesting series
still? Like, because there's kind of interesting, But I think you can
make a case that I think some people have made the case and I just
won't go there because I have a ton of respect for Boston and Oklahoma City
specifically that this is basically the NBA Finals playing out. It's just such a
it's such a slugfest here and there's just there's so much like weird noise that
isn't necessarily injury related because you're looking at it and it's the Nuggets like primary
baseline, like they're starting five. I believe has been outscored for this series
still, and so it's like Howard's almost like, well, how are the
Wolves like not even up by even more? There? So I and like
the Wolves' own starting lineup is like this huge plus for the series. So
there's just a lot of weird like like noise there. So I do think
this is the most interesting series, and I think it's the one where my
my my whims have shifted game to game more than most other series too.
I think maybe the Knicks might be an exp like when you're losing like a
starter a game basically is what it feels like like that's just gonna happen.
Yeah, I think again, you're always trying to learn something about like how
to approach things next time. Even so, let's make a pledge next time
something like this happens where the Wolves are up a team like the Wolves that
isn't supposed to is up two to oh on a team like Denver which isn't
supposed to fall behind by two oh. We don't freak out because I just
thought I really didn't think, like I mean, I thought that it would
still be a series. But it's like, how do you come back from
losing the first two games at home? If either of us said, which
I don't think we did, that they were absolutely going to lose the series,
we said, or that they looked like they were broken, and then
you know what, because we're the number one media property in the world,
they might have listened heard that, and that's what prompted Nikoliochic to send the
team text. They deserved all the criticism for that lifeless ass performance. They
their coach gave it to him worse than we did. Like in the media,
if we sat here and said there's no chance they were winning, then
yes, we were wrong. We don't normally, I at least don't adjust
my playoff predictions like that. So well, I think I have a memory
of saying It's like, as we were getting out of the conversation about them
after Game two, I think I said, like, Minnesota probably wins this,
right, and like, I don't know if that goes as far as
saying, like if who said that we were wrong and we're sorry, but
I have hashtag no regrets. Yeah, they deserve to be they deserve to
be crucified after that game to performance. But game one close, competitive,
lose, it happens. Game two was bullshit. I just uh, I'll
get all the way back to My favorite point about this whole series is like,
it's pretty awesome when a really great team just decides we're we're not gonna
let this happen and it's tied to to so maybe like the less word has
not been issued the series where you've kind of I guess, would India and
New York be the second most one where you've seen them kind of deviate from
I don't want to call them, call them core principles, but maybe they've
deviated from. This is how we're entering the series. We're gonna try to
do this and then we're just gonna completely shift it. I'm trying to think,
like what other series would be like this defin not thunder MAVs that you
like, but yeah, it's not in this postseason I think you go back
away as it's like, you know, teams will switch starters, you know,
and take guys out of the rotation and stuff like that. That's like
we haven't had anything quite like that, but yeah this, I mean,
look, and that's the reason this series has tilted so drastically, right,
is like you had two games where one team looked unbeatable, and then two
more where things changed significantly strategically, and like, I guess from a give
a shit standpoint, and like now it's completely the other way and it's all
square and the series is awesome. Give me, give me more of these
forever non playoff related thing grant. I don't know if you know this,
but the Atlanta Hawks won the twenty four million draft lottery despite entering with the
tenth best odds of doing so. We also saw Houston ends up with the
number three pick. We also saw a few media companies not this one,
we're bad at math, and said that the Pistons basically got fucked when statistically
they're basically right where they should at number five. We're not. We're neither
of us are. Like I've started to get shin deep into draft prep because
I had to write a little bit about it. We're not gonna talk about
the prospects here other than I do have a question about it being so wide
open. But I really think the I mean, he's tied two together.
Does the Hawks winning the draft lottery set the stage for more collective chaos or
is this a situation where it just kind of made Atlanta's own decision tougher because
We have talked about them as a team that could look to do they move
Murray or Young? Would they consider moving both? Like are they gonna look
to maybe even buy? Does this make that decision even harder? Because now
you have the number one pick, and so it's not just a matter of
oh, okay, we're gonna move Murray and be done or is that still
what it is because you owe your first round your San Antonio controls your first
basically twenty five, twenty six, and twenty seven. Yeah, So everything
we could possibly discuss about Atlanta, specif or the draft lottery itself is complicated
by the fact that nobody thinks this draft is any good. I had had
a good authority that people around the league, and I told you this before
we started, that they think there are five players that could realistically go number
one. Now pius the season for noise, and just based off the little
that I know, I just feel like, who's ever at one? Should
pick Alex R and move on. But that's not like the most wide wide
open I remember it being was the Jabbari Smith, Palo Bank Caro and chet
Hondren debate, and then before that it was do you remember I think it
was the twenty thirteen draft or Anthony Bennett ends up. The Bennett draft came
to mind. Yet feel like it might have the level of mystery that twenty
thirteen has, which is bonkers. Yeah, no, I I I'm not
even like I know the names, like I gues Sar keeps coming up at
the top, and Zachary Resache is another name that we keep hearing as a
possibility, and then after that, I don't know. Yeah, if it's
five, great that could go number one. So but to get back to
Atlanta, I'm I'm and I'm like Pinky toenail deep in draft prep right now.
So you've got a huge advantage on me. By that, you mean
that you know it takes place in June? Is it? Does it?
Is that? What? Yeah? Maybe they rescheduled it, like the draft
lottery for the afternoon on a Sunday. Is the draft tomorrow? I think
that's what. That's why the way I freaked out. It was Mother's Day
and I already mentioned earlier with Puckast that we were hosting brunch at our house.
But of course, like I have the lottery on some I in they're
watching it, and I see Atlanta jump up to the top four, and
so I'm like, when I saw it they won, I literally said,
holy fuck. And all I heard from like my kitchen slash I was,
what's wrong. I was just like this basketball team on this draft lottery,
I thought you were going to get so many on from the other room like
language. Oh they know. I can't help. I don't know what it
is. I think I grew up in a household where my mom wouldn't let
me say, wouldn't even let me have like the parental advisory seat. She
used to confiscate them, which I got them that maybe like as I got
olders, just all I'm gonna encoorse all the because now I just use profanity's
like a form of compliment. Atlanta Hawks. No. I So, okay,
here's what I think. I think. To me, it doesn't make
Atlanta's direction any clearer necessarily, like, well, because they got number one,
it means they're way more likely to do to to trade Murray or Trey
Young or neither, or to keep the pick or like I just I don't
have a good feel for that. What I do think, I think I'm
confident that it offers you cover at least from like a I don't know,
like a pr standpoint to do like a semi drastic thing like trade Tray Young
because you can say it's not like you're gonna sell anyone on like, well,
we have this and this is gonna be our next superstar. Because I
think even casual Hawks fans will know, like, this doesn't seem like the
draft for that although if Alex Starr has been the one that whenever you talk
about these comps and I know they're imperfect, you normally land in like the
middle end when people are trying to make them, and Sar keeps getting compared
to Jaron Jackson Junior, and I'm like, you're didn't draft him, that's
great. Yeah, I mean, it's it's just so unknown, but I
do do you see you understand what I mean though, Like it if you
were let's say they had landed where they were supposed to win the lottery,
which is like what tenth Yeah, then you trade Trey Young for whatever you
get for him, and like the tenth pick is whatever, Like it doesn't,
it doesn't. It's not like a needle mover in terms of hey,
but hey we got this, you know, let's think about this. Let's
focus on this, this like, this is a bright thing for our future
being number one. I think I don't know, maybe it's just me,
but I think if you move young or Murray, like that might feel like
a disappointment in a vacuum where if the circumstances were different, because it's like
things are gonna change and they may not get better in the short term,
although that would be the point of trading any of those guys. But having
that pick is kind of like just offers like cover or offers like a distraction
isn't quite the right word, but it's like, is it optionality, other
avenue of things we can think about as Hawks fans or as an organization we
can still like, but hey, we still have this. I don't know,
it just that's what it feels like to me, not not having a
good feel for like should they just use the pick on someone or should they
move it or anything like that. Yet I think what's tough about because what
it doesn't solve is I don't think it gives them the I don't think it
gives them the cover to enter a full tilt rebuild unless no, that's not
what I mean. No, No, I know, but I'm saying because
it gives them some level of optionality. But does it also because if you're
just saying, let's just say Stars the pick and it kind of works out,
where's like, yeah, they do need wings, but like that's the
position you come in. We've seen some rookies play really well defensively over the
past few years, right, And like Clin Capella is there as a placeholder
you're not really married to when Yekakungu as your starter, not that you need
to move him him it Sark could probably play together if you believe in Stars
jump shot, But like I feel like if you're to frame it this way
for me, that is it more likely that they just draft Alex Sar and
then kind of stand pat and go the rout of what does it? Or
maybe they move Clint Capella and like what does this do for us? Or
do they do something more drastic. I'd probably go with the stan Pat because
everything just feels pointless because even if you're moving Murray, there's unless you're attaching
picks to Murray, which okay, who are you getting? But where is
the trade that you're getting better at the top of your roster? You're rather
breaking him up into more depth, or you're trading him for picks, and
unless those picks are your own picks, which san Antonio controls for three years
in twenty twenty five twenty seven, the twenty six one's a swap like this
doesn't make entering a rebuild to me any more palatable. And so it's the
same question with Trey Young. I've seen a lot of the framing of this
makes it more likely they trade Young. And now, if you're telling me
that the Spurs are giving them back all their own picks, fine, then
I'll listen. But if they're not, then you need to explain to me
how this makes Atlanta better in the short and long term by moving Trey Young
after winning the number one pick. Yeah, because like, if you do
the let's just say it's to the Lakers and you get Reeves and Hatchamura and
gave Vincent and a first or two or whatever, you better get the three
first that they could offer. If you're if you're flipping Tray Young, that's
all. If yeah, I don't know, are they willing? Yeah,
right, so they probably should be willing to do that. But like that
plus the number one pick, plus Murray and the current Ross, Like,
what is what is that? You know? I don't it's not a better
team than you had. I don't think probably not, so then you are
I don't know, maybe maybe we're overthinking it, and like the number one
pick actually doesn't play a role at all in Atlanta, whether Atlanta should rebuild
or not, because it's not the type of pick that anyone views as like
they're cornerstone coming like here, here we go, we're getting Chet, we're
getting Pallo, we're getting Edwards, whatever, although none of those guys were
viewed as corner stones at the time, which is maybe instructive. And it's
like Edward, there were questions about Edwards. Remember it was like, oh,
this draft's not so hot. But like maybe I don't know, maybe
just make the pick and assume that because everybody thinks this draft sucks, they're
all wrong and like there's gonna be a half dozen guys that'll be all stars,
slash whatever coming out of this. So just I don't know, I
was, I mean, see if they if you start hearing leaks of like
they're shopping it, like unequivocally shopping it like that, that would be very
interesting to me. Well, Landrey Fields was basically speechless when they were asking
them questions about anything, because it was basically, how the fuck did this
happen? Like, why are we sitting here right now at this I think
I think we'll hear a lot of noise about them shopping it, but it
could just be degrees of they're looking at getting a. I mentioned this too
from the top, like what if Washington really wants Sar and they're worried Landa
will take them. They're offering you number twenty six and number two for number
one, and so the Hawks get to play the really like one of these
wings that are that are right there, and then we're gonna get an extra
first round pick, and so we like it could be something like that.
There's also I mean you talk about the Spurs giving them back their own picks,
like the Spurs have four and eight in Atlanta's own picks, Like how
many do you need to attach to four or eight to move up to one?
Because then in Atlanta, I'm like, doesn't like if this happened if
the Spurs said, hey, here's number eight, We'll give you back your
twenty five and then either your swap or your twenty twenty seven pick to move
up to first, Like that actually makes a rebook more palatable because you control
more of your own future draft and you're still some high up in the order.
I think there could be something like that in terms of sheer player equity,
though I was trying to think of, Okay, the Hawks are a
team because you do have Trey Young, maybe they really want to win.
Now, who is the best player that you could envision getting for the number
one pick, and like you don't need to attach anything else other than salary
to it. And the name I came up with, I really like him,
Like, I don't know if it's a nut. Was McHale Bridges.
And it's so Brooklyn comes at you and says, we will give you McHale
Bridges, Dorian Finney Smith and Phoenix's twenty twenty seven pick for number one.
I don't know who says no there, given what we know about this draft,
is it why would Brooklyn do all that? Or is it Atlanta say
okay, like we're giving up the number one pick for the chance to get
McHale Bridges, who can be the third best player on the title team,
which is yeah, that's great, But it's tough because I don't know how
to evaluate Bridges right now. He's in this weird like middle space. My
first reaction was like, oh, I think Brooklyn says no, because Bridges
is like a known commodity and is very good but maybe not great, and
this number one pick might get you, Like, what are the odds that
this first overall pick gets you someone that will become as good as Bridges?
Probably less than fifty percent, right, Yeah, I don't know. I
mean that's again, it's hard because we're not somehow we're still not totally sure
how good Bridges is exactly. I think he's probably I think he's showing that
he could be like two point five, like yeah, okay, like an
option to B or something, but like but with like insane scalability, like
with just the any and anywhere fit. Right, So that's like maybe that
gets them all the way up to the equivalent of like a number two but
not, but you know what I mean, like via a different route.
I don't know. If Andrew Wiggins was the second best player on the title
team the Coal Bridges can certainly be the best second best player on Let us
never, let us never forget, let us never forget that Glory Woking situation
is complicated themselves because they don't control their own draft. Their next next time,
they control their own drafting. I think it's twenty twenty eight, like
Atlanta does. It's like maybe it's okay, well, it's cool that we
have there's number one PIP, Like we're not good. That's not gonna augment
our own asset base. Uh I am. I do think though that the
this speaks to a larger draft class than Atlanta. I would just make the
pick. By the way, if I'm Atlanta, I'm sure I'm assuming you
had if it's a matter of moving down and like you're not really that high
on SAR and you want to capitalize, like maybe San Antonio or Detroit or
someone really wants them. But I would make the pick. I do think,
though, the ambiguity or the shallow impressions of this draft class are going
to lend itself to chaotic activity when it comes to trades leading up to or
on Draft night. Yeah, I think it could go that way. I
also think what we could see is a bunch of teams want all wanting to
trade down, and nobody being interested in trading up. You know that because
if you're not sure, like what the difference is between six and one or
ten and four or seven and three, Like you're not gonna want to move
up into that spot, like although that could maybe that changes as we get
through more workouts and things like that, where it's like Sar just is clearly
the guy. For example, if I'm Atlanta, my number one choice would
probably be the trade back if I could, But I don't think there's gonna
be like a line out the door of teams scrambling to get that pick.
It doesn't it's at least it doesn't seem like that right now. Would you
trade number one and de Jontay Murray to Detroit for number five Asar Thompson and
Jade and Ivy yep? I would? Who says no? Uh, Atlanta
says yeah yes, So Detroit is saying no. Had to really work that
out myself there, I guess, because if you're moving up to get Sar,
and you already have Duran, but I don't think Durn's good enough to
like, and you could probably sandwich Duran into that deal, but it's to
me Jay and Ivy just doesn't really have trade value right now. Like maybe
he's different outside the confines of Detroit or out of Monty Williams's doghouse. But
he has not shown at minimum, I'll put it. I think this is
the kindsay he's not shown enough as an off ball, just shooter, offensive
player for me to be like, this guy has net positive trade value two
seasons into his career. Yeah, I mean, look, he's in the
PJ. Washington camp to some extent of like, let's see what it looks
like on a real team. I unabashedly still have some Jade and Ivy stock,
and it might need to be relinquished next year if we get another season
like this. But I probably value him more highly than than certainly you do,
and and most like. But if you're selling if if it's if it's
from Atlanta's perspective, and maybe if I'm trading Murray, I'm probably not trading
Trey Young. Let me get some of S. R. Thompson on this
team to defend. I think that's pretty exciting to me. My only pause
for Lanta would be there is a chance that as soon as next season you
ended up trading away the two best players in this deal. But yeah,
there's there's a chance that the number one pick is better than usar Thompson,
Like there's a chance that could absolutely happen. It kind of should be likely,
you would normally right, right, And so like that's why I was
like do they need durn too? But then like how intrigued are they by
him? And a Kung Wu? Just and also what is Jaden purposes?
Jay and Ivy serve in Atlanta? It's like, Okay, Murray's gone and
now you have this really high imprint. Does it make it? Then?
Oh we could move young and like now we're really gonna or is it all
we want to try and groom more develop him or is he just trade bait
in a whole field? That's it's really hard because, like I mean,
even Landry Field basically said it. I keep pulling the same quote up when
I'm talking about the Hawks of like basically he says like we've seen the numbers,
the lineup data, like we kind of know it doesn't work, and
he's referring to He doesn't say it quite that explicitly, but was like,
we know we have the information. I think is about as far as he
went, but the implication is like, yeah, we get it. The
young Murray thing has not been what we wanted it to be, and so
like that leads you to think, well, like because together in Atlanta,
they aren't really that valuable, Like it doesn't work that you know, Okay,
there we can pretend like they both don't have separate objective trade value,
where like the package should still be like pretty significant for both of those guys,
because you know, Trey Young on Team X is like super valuable maybe
and same with Murray on another team, but together on Atlanta, their value
is not very high. So it's like, when you're putting together trade package,
it's really difficult for me to like square the fact that, well,
we all know this doesn't work here, and so like how do we even
like how do we get anything for these guys? But other teams are like,
yeah, we'll take Tray Young. He's an offense by himself, We'll
work with that. I don't know. So that's another layer to like the
complications the number one pick brings is like, how do you what are the
relative valuations of both of those guards around the league? I don't feel like
I know, I don't feel like I have a great sense of what those
guys are worth. No, i'd be with you. I think everyone assumes
that they would get a haul for Tray Young, But then everyone if you're
sitting here saying that they should look to trade Tray Young. I tend to
value Trey Young more than you do. But just if that's the impression of,
yeah, they should move him, if that's how you're feeling about someone
who's just during his prime and supposed to be all NBA type player, like
why why are all these other teams gonna feel so much differently that there's gonna
be the sweepstakes? Yeah for him? So I don't it's hard. I
don't know any other draft thing. No, there's no other draft things because
I have moved on to stat Paddy. That's two times in a row I've
stepped on the sound effect for stat padding. Not a good I mean,
that's a major bummer. Thanks to everyone who sent stuff in. I'm so
far behind in my direct messages because I'm trying to figure out how to do
thirty hours of work in twenty four hour days. But I can start us
off for you. We have one from a Rubik scal Are you yetty?
Who won? I grew up in a single parent household. My mom worked
at multiple jobs to raise the family. That is not gonna help me.
Okay, who too? My last ring was with the Los Angeles Lakers towards
the end of my career, though most people associate me with another franchise.
Last ring was with my last ring most people Robert Dorry incorrect? I like
the guests though. Was his last ring with the Lakers? I don't know.
Probably not now. I meant it was or no need to get a
spurs one after I thought he got a spurs one at but I can't remember.
He probably did, Okay who three? I have played roughly one thousand
games and started over seventy five percent of them, so big time starter ring
with the Lakers, which was his last ring, but had some with other
teams. Uh well, now I was Gonnah? Is it? Danny Green?
Incorrect? Oh? Fel good about that one? Thought I had it?
Okay? Who four? I am primarily remembered for playing one position,
though I've played both guard positions. Oh mmmm, My last dring was for
the Lakers. Who's a guard that is not associated with the Lakers but won
a title there Combo guard? I feel like I should throw a guess out
just because it's not Rondo. Rondo is only a point guard. That is
correct. It is Rondo. Hey, there's but there's kind of a twist
here. Okay, I'm all gonna go through the clues one by one,
all right. Five. I have played for the Lakers, Clippers, the
Cavaliers, and the Bulls and perhaps other teams. Clu six. I was
drafted in the first round two years after the goat, and I want to
ring with him. Clue seven. I averaged one point five plus steals per
game over my career, and multiple seasons with more than two steals per game.
Clue eight. I wore the number four and number nine jerseys. And
here's twist. Clue nine. What if I told you I'm not one but
two players. That's right, every one of these clues fits two NBA players
drafted in different years. Hint. The goats in question are Lebron and Jordan.
Would you care to venture a guess as to who the other player is?
Wait a minute, So and these so the all these clues apply to
somebody else besides Rondo. So one, I'll give you the additional clue.
One of us went to Miami University in Oxford, Ohio, and the other
went to the University of Kentucky and Louisville, Kentucky. We know that the
Kentucky one is obviously Rondo, god who got the but this is also a
so two years after Jordan is this other guy? Right? Okay? Yeah?
Two years after Jordan. So that's eighty seven played for the Lakers,
Clippers, Caves, and Bulls. Oh god, so much work went into
this. I also want to ring with Jordan. Don't forget oh shit,
Lakers, Clippers, Caves, and Bulls. Ron Harper correct, there you
go. Ron Harper is a we are I mentioned the ninety six Bulls team
or the second three people Bull's team that was psychopathic stuff. Rubik scal favorite
intense. I appreciate that effort. Before we go any farther. Uh you
asked me last podcast, like what rule would I change? And I feel
like I really dropped the ball. I was unprepared. I did think of
one. Well, they're prepared because you don't get warnings for stat pat That's
okay, I should have had it ready. It's a specific rule if you
act like you were hitting the face in an NBA basketball game and in fact
we're not hit in the face. Upon review, it is a technical foul
on you, and if you do it again, you can be ejected like
it's a normal technical foul. The other thing I thought about was, is
like whatever the penalty would have been had you been hit in the face as
severely as you acted like you were, that penalty is assessed to you if
you were not hitting the face. I'm just sick of guys like getting hit
in the chest or shoulder or not hit at all, and go down in
a heap with hands over face and like act like they've been shot. So
I would like to let you you don't like flopping. It really all comes
back to flopping. I'm sick of it. And this did happen to come
up while I was watching the Dallas Mavericks, So I'll leave it there,
all right. I have one for you, Dan from Nicole Cha Coole ev
here. This is a guy that comes up very often for so many reasons.
That's the clue, not a clue, that's just the clue. Number
one. After a three year career at Marquette, invaluable information for Dan.
I was drafted in the thirties. Just get players go, Greg Buckner.
Clue number two. My draft was a weird one despite only twenty three teams
exis at the time. The Cleveland Cavaliers were awarded a courtesy twenty fourth pick
because their owner Ted Steppien kept trading away their first round picks, which prompted
the eventual rule against trading first round picks in consecutive years. So they were
drafted twenty fourth overall, is what. No, they said they were drafted
in the thirties. Drafted in the thirties. The draft was a weird one
though, because he's basically giving you like you know, there's only twenty three
teams, so this is like a minute ago. But the Cavs got a
twenty fourth because Ted Stepien was a lunatic. I don't even have a guest,
all right, clue three. I promise you will get this before I
got drafted in nineteen eighty three, So now we have the year. I
represented the US men's national team at the nineteen eighty two World Championship, helping
them win a silver Individually, I was awarded the MVP of the tournament.
I'm assuming you don't remember the nineteen eighty two World Championships. Nope, are
here you go? During my thirteen year career. I ended up playing for
four teams one time All Star. I spent eight years playing for the team
that drafted me, tem X. I was the all time leading assist man
for TMX with three and sixty six until earlier this year when they're multi time
All Star passed me. He now has exactly two assists more than me.
Yeah, I got nothing, okay, uh, CLU five. I come
from a family of basketball players. My uncle Jim Brewer was the nineteen eighty
was a nineteen eighty two NBA champion. I don't remember Jim Brewer. I
don't remember him either, all right, CLU six, remember that All Star
guard that passed me as the leading assist man on TX. There's a chance
he doesn't get to extend his lead this coming season. There's a chance he
doesn't get So he's a free agent. I guess is what there is what
they're saying, that's how I took it. A guard who's a free agent,
and that just set a record for the franchise. And that's not even
the answer of what the question is. When I looked through this earlier,
I couldn't. I don't know who that is. Yeah, trying to think
so someone's long standing they're a free agent, are they or are they just
like going to be traded? This is tough. Yeah, yes, continue
to give me. Well, well let me see, let me see if
I could just pull something. No, that's not something I keep thinking of,
Like, oh, I'm trying to backtrack from Yeah, we would hold
the record and assists, and then it's like, well, they're not going
to leave, but they're not in a position to where they're ye. And
then even if you get that player, you have to know that this other
the actual guess a player you're doing here played for that franchise, which is
like there's two layers going on. Yeah, please carry on right, changing
gears. Clue seven, back to my talented family. My oldest son has
played in the NBA G League, My daughter played volleyball at the University of
Florida and is married to an NBA player, while my middle son has spent
eleven years in the NBA. Is this uh no? But is it spent
eleven has spent eleven years in the NBA. Can you read that last clue
again? Yep? Clue eight. Did I mention how talented my family is?
I've spent more than twenty years. I've almost blew it reading you Clue
eight because it starts the same way back to my talented family Clue seven.
My oldest son has played in the NBA G League. My daughter played volleyball
at the University of Florida and is married to an NBA player, while my
middle son has spent eleven years in the NBA. Ugh my middle son,
I have no idea. Can you probably will get it here? Uh?
Klue ait? Did I mention how talented my family is. I've spent more
than twenty years as a head coach in the NBA. During that River,
you say Doc Rivers, it is Doc Rivers? Is I didn't realize that.
I didn't know that Austin Rivers was a middle child. I guess I
thought about that. I should have just said Doc Rivers one. I wonder
that was I feel like I should know this. So I think when you
said like or is he going to be traded? I think maybe the guy
that passed Rivers for all time assists for a team as Trey Young with the
Hawks, because I think Rivers was drafted by the Hawks. But I really
don't know. I think of Rivers as I don't know what like a nick
maybe? Uh. I always associated Doc Rivers with three to one leads people
out, So I don't know. I'm gonna I'm gonna look it up.
Uh Are you ready to uh do a guess a player from Mike? Yes,
I am, okay. It wasn't Land by the way, Sorry,
go ahead, so that it must have been Trey, I think so.
Clue one, I was drafted by the Washington Bullets in the lottery in the
nineteen eighties. Gotta try Bullets eighties. That's just that's too far back.
I can't think of anybody that's on the Bullets from eighties. I would love
to have attempted a one shot, but I'm not gonna have an answer for
that. Clue two. My playing times are rookie dropped significantly when my coach
was fired and replaced by Wes Unseld Senior. Clearly, poor coaching decisions ran
in the family regardless despite only starting fourteen games, the team in steals.
Oh. I was gonna say minute Bowl, but I don't think he's a
highest Steel incorrect, Nor was I sure that the Bullets drafted him or that
it was in the eighties. Uh. Sorry, led the team in steals
as a sophomore. Uh as a rookie. As a rookie, yeah,
only started fourteen games and led the Bullets and steals. I got nothing CLEW
three, Washington, going to Washington. They left me unprotected in the upcoming
expansion draft. Hmmm, Scott Skiles incorrect. Good guess though CLU four.
The following season, the expansion team that drafted me made me a sixth man.
I'll just guess Scott styles again, probably still interact, believe it or
not. So wait, so this is a I guess we could be late
eighties and our expansion team was or what like Miami and then Orlando or Charlotte.
I guess is probably in there. Oh uh is this Muggsy correct?
That's good. You got it on CLU three of eleven. I read a
biography of Muggsy Bogues in seventh grade. I remember there was like a big
deal that because he was from Baltimore and it was a big deal that he
got that the Bullet He played for the Bullets for a minute. I'm sorry
you got it on CLU four out of eleven, though, that was impressive.
Five. I'm going to become a fixture in the team's high tempo offense
for the next ten years CLU six and ninety seven. My relationship with the
team sour massively as my coach suggested I retire due to knee issues I'd been
having. The next week, they signed my replacement, CLU seven. Two
games into the ninety seven season, I was traded to the Warriors with Tony
Delk for bj Armstrong. I went on to lead the Warriors and assists despite
only playing thirty six games due to hamstring and knee injuries and chicken pox.
I'm starting to think I'm somewhat cursed. In nineteen eighty nine, I signed
with the Raptors, reuniting with my best friend from two teams ago, Del
Curry Clue nine. I played eighty three games in the Purple, Black and
Red before being traded again to the Knicks for Chris Childs in a first round
pick. That offseason, I was shipped again to Dallas for Shandon Anderson,
Howard Eisley, and Glenn Rice. I stepped away from basketball to take care
of my sick mother. CLU ten. Mark Cuban, who just bought the
Maps, fully guaranteed the remainder of my contracts. Before waiving me so that
the rest of my contract will be paid out to me, tolling over three
million dollars, something I publicly thanked Cuban four in twenty eleven, as his
active kindness was not lost on me. Cool eleven, I'm the short king,
as I am the shortest player in NBA history. Nice Hellve Mosey Bogues
was a very early favorite player for me, like among my favorites, just
because like, oh he's little, Like that's cool. I'm almost that tall,
all right, I have several from Mike. I'll give you one of
them, would you like, like, what level of obscurity would would you
prefer here? Like on a one to ten scale, with one being not
obscure, give me a give me a seven. Oh okay, there's only
one choice here then, clue number one. I was drafted in twenty nineteen
outside the lottery. Who is the number one pick in twenty nineteen? Again,
that was Jesus who was twenty nineteen too early for the Because twenty nineteen
twenty twenty doesn't twenty twesdays two twenty three, this would have been a fifth
season, which means they're already on their extension well, if they're outside the
lottery, I mean that they might have only got like a like one of
those two year deals or three year deals. Didn't say how far outside the
lottery. Oh wait, outside the lottery, outside the first round, there's
outside the there's still scale, So that's the same difference. What if Okay,
all right, he was drafted. That's all. That's all I know
so far. Oh okay, all right, keep going. Well, I
I haven't read the rest of the clues. I don't want to mislead you
and say like, it's definitely not the first round. I don't know.
Oh yeah, I'm just describing. So I'm thinking he was still drafted in
the first round. Okay, drafted outside the lottery in twenty nineteen, twenty
twenty, I mean in twenty nineteen. But I'm my point was this would
be his fifth season then, because yeah, nineteen twenty te yeah yeah,
yeah, yeah, right, so this this was his fifth season unless he's
out of the NBA. Who was drafted out nineteen that's still in the NBA
fifth season? Do I think of who started the Uh? Aaron Smith is
not Aaron Smith by the way, Do you can we sidebar and figure out
who was the first pick in twenty nineteen, because I can't remember. Is
that the Ions draft? No, it couldn't be. Couldn't he just started
his extension this year, ton't or no this ion jaw. I don't want
to look it up because then I'm yeah, I know, well, I'll
look it up later. I'm so bad at that going by the year,
Okay, Klutu. Before being drafted, I played professionally for the Serbian team
KK Megabasket, also being loaned out to two other teams in that league,
one in Serbia, one in Montenegro. I am not from one of the
former Yugoslavian nations. Oh Man Fakuno Komposo wasn't drafted, right, I don't
know. I don't think, so Okay, carry on all right. Clue
three, I am the second highest drafted player from my home country, which
is yeah, I don't know it. We don't know it. And as
I'm trying to think of it because I know who it is because I looked
ahead, I I can't remember. Clue four. Though not a lottery pick,
I was thought of as someone who could could have or should have gone
in the lottery because of my upside having been coached at KK Megabasket, a
club known for developing NBA talent. Zip zilch noda for me, I don't
even have a name, did there? I was just started named a few
that were drafted in twenty nineteen. That's assuming what thing you get the right
draft class? Right. Well, I also could not have told you that
this guy was drafted in twenty nineteen. Like if you'd given me like a
three year window, I probably could have got close. But I just so
you're saying you thought he was in the league for less time or more time.
I mean, now that I've had time to think about it, sounds
about right, but I'd probably say less. If I had to guess,
I would lean towards less. You asked for a seven on the obscurity scale.
So this is you signed up. I know this player, Yeah,
you know, you know? Uh, clue five. I didn't get much
playing time in my first two seasons, averaging only ten minutes a game in
ninety nine games, as I was buried behind a glut of other big men
on my team. Okay, so they're a big man and there's a glut,
and that doesn't really help me. No, just a big in twenty
nineteen, now, keep going okay, in the postseason, in my second
season, I was fined by my team for getting into an on court altercation
with an assistant coach. I feel like I should know this one now I
don't remember that. Then maybe not fine for an altercation in what year in
the playoffs? It'd be his second season, so it'd be the twenty one
playoffs. Yeah, right, pandemic time. My brain was mush, like
what month even were the playoffs that year? August? Yeah? Yes,
keep there was a young big fine for an altercation on a team where he's
buried behind a glut of other bigs. That's a good clue because I do
think of him like in that context at that time. Yeank you going all
right? Clue seven. The next season, I started sixteen games and started
to develop the signs of an outside shooting game. Holy hell, who is
this? That's such a good clue. This was a third season, I
believe, so yeah, yes, two starts apparently taking threes. Rashaun Holmes.
No, that's a good guess though, also you know that well is
it said explicitly this is a guy, This is a European guy. Based
on all this kk MEGA and oh yeah, I forgot about that, although
like the clue, to be fair, the clues don't say that specifically.
It says he's not from Serbia or Montenegro, but like, okay, I'll
just tell you that that might give it away. All right, carry on,
all right? Uh Clue eight, here you go, Dan. In
my fourth season, I was waved after the trade deadline and ultimately signed with
Orlando. Oh is it Bobol Nope? Is this waved? And then signe
with Orlando? Move Wagner? Nope, he signed in free agency. That's
right, at the trade deadline. Go go Pitazz. That's correct. I
wanted to tell you, like you're so close, so you're just all over
it. Uh okay, clute, you only had two more here, I
think for sure. Cluton nine was I started thirty three games this past season,
and some people thought that the Magic might move Wendell Carter Junior because I
was playing so well. As we've got it there, Yeahahice, because we
definitely talked about that. And also the shooting clue was really sneaky because like,
that's not the player he became like he became. And now I'm remembering
his altercation on the Pacers with an assistant coach, right. I don't know
if that was in the clue. Yeah, I don't remember that. I
remember the minute there where it was like this pacer center that's behind Turner and
I guess Sabonis and probably somebody else is like, oh, he can shoot
threes. But that was like just I don't know, maybe a month or
two or something. Clue ten was I went viral before ever getting drafted,
as there was a photo of hundreds of reporters interviewing the player at the table
beside me, Zion Williamson, there you go, there's our answer, and
no one was at my table to interview me. Dwayne Wade and Draymond Green
both said on podcasts that I should use that image as motivation. I have
not. You don't know that, Mike. Maybe he's very motivated by that.
Still he's still in the league. I'm go gobaze sufficiently obscure. I
think that was That was a tough one. I should have went with an
easier one to feel good about myself. But a couple other ones I think
you would have gotten pretty quickly. Although I haven't read the clues, so
I don't know. Well, considering we've been going for over two hours and
sixteen minutes, those will be safe for next time. Grant, would you
like to take us out of here? Sure? Another banner get in and
Get out podcasts by the book, we're only dropping two a week. Although
we dropped three, we've drop this is the first week. We're probably gonna
drop two unless I put out one over the weekend. But we're giving you
probably over four hours of content. Some would say too much. Probably,
I don't know, maybe not enough. Thanks everyone, especially to those of
you who contributed for the guest players always appreciated. Thanks for listening. If
you're not rating, reviewing, subscribing, please please help us out and do
those things. Tell your friends about the podcast, spread the word. We
don't know where there is to go beyond number one. We'd just like to
explore and see what other heights are out there. I think that's going to
do it. Other than to say, if you want to contribute in the
future, join our discord and leaks for that YouTube and podcast description the same
place we find some merch shouts Frank Milakeina apologies, Jaed Allen