Big Food and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo. These guys are your favorites,
so light say subscribe and rade it. I'm stuck and me listening, oh
watching, Lim always keep it swatching. And now you're hosts Cliff Berrickman and
James Boobo Fay, Hey Bobs, how you doing? Man? All right?
How are you doing? Cliff? Pretty good? Pretty good, Just
cruising along at the end of my day, doing a podcast with some of
my best friends. So everything's looking down. Guys, who's that Matt Pruitt
and Bobo of course? All right, Hey Bobs, we're pretty excited.
Why don't you let's get us into the guests. Man, this is too
good to talk anything else about. Yeah, I've heard of this guys.
Uh, you know, I heard about him for a while ago, but
I don't remember the details ory thing. But yeah, our illustrious producer Matt
Pruitt actually got in touch with him and it was pretty shocking to hear that's
who that. When I heard he said he got ahold of him, I
was like, Wow, that's nuts. So Matt tell us tell us how
you got ahold of him? Yeah, it was really funny. One of
our beloved members. One of our Patreon members had reached out to me and
said, hey, I understand you know, we live in the same town.
We should meet up and have lunch talk squatch. And no one's ever
accused me of not talking enough, so I was like, oh, I
had an opportunity to go talk, you know. So we're hanging out and
making small talk. And I'd asked him like, what got you into interested
in the subject, and he said, well, I was always kind of
interested. But I met a guy here in Nashville who had seen one and
I was like, well, that's cool, and he said yeah, he
was actually an elk hunter and a guide in Colorado. And I was like,
oh, that's really interesting and he said yeah, he watched it through
binoculars for a few minutes, and I immediately recognized the story because I was
always a big fan of the writings of a researcher from Kansas named Keith Foster,
and he actually worked with a number of elk hunters and people that were
prominent in that community in Colorado to put together a lot of information about Sasquatch
sidings there. And then there was a journalist for the Denver Post named Theo
Stein who had written this. So I immediately I just took a chance with
this guy and I said, Hey, is this friend of yours? Is
his name Jeff die Singer? And he was like, yeah, how did
you know that? And I was like, I got a pretty good memory
man for sasquatch related stuff, and so to learn that he lived here in
the same area as I do, I reached out and we had a great
conversation, and I thought, we've got to get him on the podcast.
And so I know you guys are somewhat familiar with the story, but I'm
going to let Jeff tell it, so you guys can host the conversation and
I'm all here for it. All right, good score pro So welcome Jeff,
thanks so much for coming on. Hey, thank you guys, Hey,
Joe, Hey, Bobo. I will say this to just begin that
I have never done a podcast on this ever. I've done a bunch of
podcast on elk hunting and backcountry bow hunting and and shooting professional archery but in
the military stuff, but I've never done this, so so this will be
a first for me. Yeah, us too, We've never had you on
this. It'll be great. Yeah, this will be fund you condense your
like what you usually say on a on a podcast about hunting, kind of
kind of gave us a prettif inch on you like what your what your qualifications
in the woods are. Sure. I grew up here in middle Tennessee,
small town, grew up hunting, uh, you know, mostly small game,
that kind of stuff. Grew up hunting a place that y'all are probably
familiar with. I heard of called Land between the Lakes. Never once in
my life have I ever thought about Bigfoot, especially all the time I spent
down there as a kid. And then, you know, after high school,
I went to the military. I was a part of the seventy fifth
Special Forces out of Fort Benning. Been deployed in South and Central America,
Africa, over in the Middle East. So did that, and I was
with a QRF, a Quick Reaction Force team, so if people got in
trouble, it was our job to go and get them out and that sort
of thing. I was a part of Somalia where I was you know,
wounded three times over there. And so anyway, I got out, went
to college in Oklahoma, played a little baseball there, and then after college
I came back to Nashville, and played music professionally for about three years.
What'd you play. I'm a piano player by trade. Yeah, I've been
doing that my whole life. But and I'm it's weird because you know,
of course Nashville is a country vibe and all of that. But I grew
up playing a lot of blues, Southern Almond Brothers, that kind of stuff.
Those were my influences. And anyway, when I was on the road,
I would always go out to Colorado and go elk hunt. And one
year, the year before I got out of the music business, I had
called in this bull elk and had shot him with a recurved bow, and
I thought I was the only person in the world. And I'm down there,
you know, quarnering and skinning this thing. And I was about six
miles in I was backpacked bow hunting, and this was probably like ninety five,
maybe ninety six, somewhere in there, and this cowboy rode up on
a horse with like two mules out of nowhere and scared the snot out of
me and ended up being the owner of one of the largest outfitters in the
country, really is Pike's Peak Outfitters. And he said he'd set up on
the mountain and watched that whole thing, and he goes, you ever want
a job, call me, And by Georgie the next year, I've had
enough of the music business, and and so I called him and kind of
escaped out to Colorado and and started guiding full time. So and you know,
did that in the fall, and then they also had a wilderness program
and was an instructor there during the summer and and you know, book tunts
and that sort of thing. So I was I was only one of two
guys that were full time there when everybody else was seasonal. And so I
spent literally probably three hundred days a year out you know, in the outside.
So so yeah, and then you know that brings that brings us to
when when the sighting happened? Really, you know, so, uh,
before we do go onto that, how did you take Dicky Bett's death?
By the way, Uh, guitarist for the Almen Brothers. Do you want
me to be honest? Not a huge Dickey fan. He was the mean
one of the bunch, you know. I got to say, I've never
seen a picture of him smile. Good player, no great player, great
player, But I mean when you're playing beside Dwayne Almand. I mean,
does it get much better than Dwayne? Really? But I will say this,
Dicky's a heck of a songwriter and a heck of a player, and
I'm sure that his fans are sad. And of course, you know,
half of the Allman Brothers are gone now, but as far as the band
is concerned, most all of them are gone. Really, But I didn't
take it too hard, not when Dicky died. So gosh, well,
you mentioned that's the timely sort of thing. I wanted to ask about that.
Why had a chance? So okay, so let's get get back to
the big foot thing, which I guess is important for this podcast before your
encounter, which we'll get to in just a moment. How much credence or
how much thought ever went into the big foot thing at all? Was?
He wrote? Zero? It was just nonsense, this background garbage noise that
you've been hearing about probably most of your life. Never really thought about it,
that's kind of thing. The only time that Bigfoot ever came up in
my life. And this is gonna sound bad because I should have probably researched
this. But when I was a kid, maybe twelve thirteen years old.
There was a movie now and this is y'all might can help me with this.
But I remember in the movie they'd put out like this electric fence out
in the middle of nowhere, and this thing was breaking all the barriers.
And I had gone to see that, and you know, when I walked
out of that, I was like, Oh, that's crazy there. You
know, those things don't aren't real what you're about. Oh so if I
was so seventy seven, i'd have been ten. So probably seventy eight,
seventy nine. Maybe that's a Probably that Sasquatch one where all the guys going
that that horse train out into the woods. Get Yes, that's it,
Yeah, that one. What is it? We have a poster of it
on staves in the museum a Sasquatch. It's called Sasquatch the Legend of Bigfoot.
There you go, yeah, thank you, Matt Pruitt. Sasquatch the
Legend of Bigfoot. Yeah, nineteen sixty eight or something like that, or
I mean nineteen seventy six rather yeah, so yeah, I was like nine,
nine or ten. Yeah, So anyway, I saw that, and
you know, had no credence towards that at all, like, you know,
I'm in Tennessee. You know that's it's a big old hoax. And
I don't know that you even really see sasquatch in that movie. And so
I never believed in anything like that ever. So you know, even when
I got to the Mountains of Colorado, I just nobody ever brought it up,
and you know, and I honestly never thought about it. So well,
then let's let's go into your sighting. What's the context? What were
you doing out there? When was this? You know, all that sort
of stuff kind of lead us up to a walk us through it. So
and I'm sorry, I am so unprepared. I did a report right after
the right after I had the second sighting, So that report on the BFRO
will tell you. I want to say. It was like ninety eight.
Maybe I had been guiding for a couple of years, had won Colorado Guide
of the Year the year before, I do remember that, and so we
me and the head guide that summer had found a spot on the backside of
PAC's Peak back in the wilderness area there that summer and had found just a
bunch of elk, and so he and I decided that two weeks prior to
season, we would go in, take a couple of the new guys and
set up some wall tents and you know, corrals for the horses. Because
it was my horse. It was probably about a three and a half four
hour ride by horse. And so we'd gone in and you know a couple
of weeks prior to the season, and by that time I had clients that
repeat clients, so they had hunted with me in years, you know,
a couple of years passed and he had definitely had repeat clients, and so
we're like, man, let's let's give these guys a great hunt. And
so we took me and him, Bob Gorman. We had we each had
two clients and then we had a cook slash, a wrangler. He took
care of the horses and stuff. And so the day the clients get in
we have so four six we had seven horses and probably eight mules to pack
everybody stuff in on and all of that for a seven day hunt. And
each client had an elk tag and each client had a deer tag, and
one of my clients actually had a bear tag. So we went in that
you know, we went in on a Saturday. We got there Saturday afternoon
and got it. Everybody settled, and you know, the cook did his
thing and just had a great afternoon and evening riding in. And next morning
we get up and we killed three elk right away, three bulls, and
we're having like, we're like, holy cow, this is amazing. I
don't know if you've ever done that or not, but when you kill an
elk, it's it's an all day process, really, and so when you
kill three elk, it's really an all day process. And so you know,
we didn't finish till late at night. And then the next day my
other client who didn't kill he and I went out by ourselves while the rest
of them went meal dier honey, and my client killed a bull that morning
about nine o'clock. Well, so we start working on that elk and we
get back, well, the other three guys had already killed a mule dinner.
I'm like, holy cow. They're like, we're having a like the
best time ever, you know. And so anyway, the next morning we
get up and my client kills a mule deer and we went back to one
of the gut piles, and that afternoon he shot a bear. So in
three days we had killed you know, four four deer and a bear.
I mean, it was just the most amazing thing. And so it was
on a Wednesday, Wednesday or Thursday, and we decided that we were going
to pack the meat out, and where the wrench was was close to a
town called Cripple Creek. They're on the back side of Pike's Pee. And
so we were like, let's let's pack out in the morning or you know,
whenever. We get everything packed and ready to go, and we'll go
back to the ranch. We'll get the meat hung in the coolers and all
that, and get the hides and the heads taken care of, and then
we'll go spend a couple of nights in Cripple Creek and have fun. And
everybody was up for that, and so that's that was the plan. So
by the time we got off our gear and everything situated and horses ready and
every you know, meat and heads and all that, by the time we
got ready to go, it was it was probably one or two o'clock in
the afternoon. And so we're coming back and we're about more than halfway back
to the trailhead where the trucks and the horse trailers were at and we're coming
along the side of this mountain and on the trail it does like almost a
ninety degree loop, if you will, like a horse shoe. And so
I'm in the lead. I've got two or three pack animals, and then
we've got the four clients just on horses, and then we've got the cook
and he's probably got a couple of pack animals, and then the head gud
Bob was riding drag and he's got the rest of the meals. He's got
probably six meals with him. So we're in this horseshoe and I get through
the horseshoe and my horse just started acting crazy, like he wouldn't go anywhere.
He was like trotting, like just his front feet, like he was
trying to stemp out something. And so Bob's on the other side of me,
not fifty yards, and we're looking at each other and he's like,
what's going on. I said, man must be a bear or a mountain
lion or something. I said, he smells something, cause I mean I'd
had that horse's and parades and nothing really bothered that horse. And so Bob's
like, we'll get off and lead him on up the trail, and so
where we were at it was pretty steep grade right there, and so instead
of getting off on the downhill side, because I'm only five to nine so
I'm not real tall, so I got off on the right side of the
horse on the upside of the mountain. And as soon as I got off,
this thing burst between everybody down this valley. And I'll be honest with
you, the only thing I really saw was like a head and the shoulders,
and I'm I'm going, is that a bear? Like? What is
that? Is that a bear? And this thing is so fast, so
fast didn't make a noise, like like you could hear the pine vals like
you know when you're running on them, but like it wasn't any crunching or
any sticks breaking or anything like this. I mean, it was like full
speed down this mountain. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and beyond with Cliff and
Bobo will be right back after these messages. And so all these guys are
freaking out, and I'm thinking bear, I'm like, is that a bear?
Like? You know? Because all I could I could barely see over
the saddle where I was at. And so anyway, my horse starts acting
weird. So, you know, twenty thirty seconds, maybe a minute later,
everything kind of calms down. I get back on my horse and off
we go, and I'm asking Bob. I'm like, man, I've never
seen a bear do that. And Bob goes, that was no bear.
I'm like, what do you mean? That wasn't no bear. Well,
the clients right away started yelling bigfoot, and I'm like, what bigfoot?
Like, that's not a thing. Come on, that was a bear,
man, No, come on as a bear, and Bob goes, dude,
it was on two legs. And I'm like, are you kidding me?
Like, no way. So I was still doubting what I saw because
I didn't I didn't get a clear, clean look at it. So anyway,
we get back up to the horse trailers and the wrangler has the big
horse trailer and then I have a horse trailer, and then we had somebody
meet us down there to pick up the clients. Well, we got every
the clients got picked up, and we never really had a conversation at all
with them, you know, unloading horses and geared meat and all that kind
of stuff, and so it was just me and the wrangler and Bob there
and we're getting everything loaded up and the Wrangler's like, dude, that was
bigfoot. I'm like, man, there's I said. It's not even real.
Man, Like, come on, And so Bob gets in the truck
with me and we've got probably about an hour drive back to where we're going,
and we're going up the mountain and Bob's like, man, I've heard
people talk about that thing, but I've never, ever in my life,
ever thought i'd see one. And he'd been doing he'd been guiding. He
was probably in his sixties then, and I mean this guy had been guiding
since he was thirty, so I mean he's got thirty years out there and
had never seen this thing. And so one of Bob's big things was,
look, when we get back to the ranch, we don't talk about it.
We like this never happened. And I'm like, what are you talking
about? He goes, man, what if it gets out that we saw
a bigfoot? He's like and it gets out like big time. And this
was way before like social media and all that match, right, and so,
and what was I mean back then, we were getting like all the
good write ups and like Western Horsemen and you know bow Hunting magazine, North
American Hunting Magazine, and so his big thing was don't say a word.
I'm like, no worries by me. You know, I'm not gonna say
anything. So I never paid any attention. And so fast forward almost a
year to the day, almost it's opening season. So I've got two brothers
that are coming in from Michigan that had hunted with me the year before,
and so they had booked another hunt with me. So everybody comes in on
a Saturday, and not that it matters, but when you're a new guide,
these people show up, you kind of mingle with them. And if
you hit it off with somebody and they like you and you like them,
that's who you got. Well, I was in a position where I didn't
have to do that anymore. I had to repeat customers, and I knew
who was coming in, and I know what they liked and what they didn't
like, that sort of thing, and so you know, I'm just kind
of sitting there at the lodge and I'm mingling with people and I'm waiting for
my guys to get there from the airport. And I get a phone call
from the two brothers saying that their dad had passed away and that they weren't
going to be able to make it. And so this was like nine o'clock
at night, and so by that time all the other clients had been taken.
So here I'm left with not having any clients for the for the week.
And so I go to the owner and the head guide and I said,
Hey, do you guys want me to stick around this week? I
said, I have an elk tag in my pocket. I'd love to go
hunt. And Bob goes, where are you going to go hunt? I
said, probably down there. We had that great hunt last year. And
Bob goes, I don't know if i'd go down there. I'm like,
come on, man, really, And so anyway, the next morning,
I get up and I go to the trail head and so I hike in.
You know, I have a backpack, got my bow, and I
even took a fishing ride because it's a couple of beaver ponds down there that
have brook troiling in them. And you know, I was just going to
do it up for a week and have fun. And if I'd killed one,
i'd hiked out and come grab my horse and packed it out, and
it'd been a lot easier you know that way. So anyway, I hike
in there that afternoon, and I get in there, you know, fairly
late in the afternoon, probably three o'clock or so, because it takes me
about five hours to get in there, walk in five or six, and
I get in there, and I set up a tent, and I'm at
the very last beaver pond. And where this place is located, to the
south is this big, huge ridge that goes on for like two miles.
It's just solid rock and it's probably a couple thousand feet tall, like the
only way anybody's going up or down that way. You'd have to be a
professional rock climber to do that. But there's this valley that comes out of
it, and it's meadows with aspen and it's just like the perfect little cubby
hole for elk, and there's lots of water in there. And so I'm
at the very last beaver pond and caught a couple of brookies and cooked those
up, and the elk were bugling, and I mean, it was just
a perfect night. And so I get up the next morning and make some
coffee, and I hear the elk bugling, and so I go up and
I passed a couple of these beaver ponds. Is I'm headed kind of up
towards the cliffs, and to the right there's an outcrop in there. So
I crawled up on the outcropping and I was gonna wait for the sun to
come up. And during all this, like I said the elk word,
screaming and bugling and doing everything, and I was so excited, like like,
I was having so much fun. And so the sun's starting to come
up a little bit, and to where I can use my binoculars. Now,
when you're guiding, binoculars is your number one friend. I mean,
if you don't have binoculars, you're you're gonna miss so much out there in
that big country that's out there. And so we had become sponsored by all
these different manufacturers, like you know, we were sponsored by Rocky Boots and
you know, Real Tree camouflage, and but one of our best and biggest
sponsors was Seiss Binoculars. And it was kind of before Sarovsky had come out
and become big and all that. So Seiss was as good as it gets,
when you know, it was as good as it got during that period
or whatever. And so I had a pair of ten by fifty Zeiss and
when you're guiding on just a regular hunt, you were in those binoculars probably
eighty percent of the time, so you know, and then with all my
training and stuff in the military, there's a way to glass areas and especially
if you're looking for you know, enemy guys and all that, and it
pertains the same way basically to Honey. So anyway, I'm up on this
out cropping and it's daylight, it's getting daylight, and so I hear an
elp bugle, and I would you know, I'd get my binoculars up and
oh, there he is. He's three hundred yards away. And another one
would bugle, and you know, he's five hundred yards away. And all
in all, there was probably seven or eight different bulls than this herd of
elk, and they were just scattered all along this like meadow area. So
anyway, I heard just bugled down by where my tent was, and my
tent was probably about three hundred and fifty four hundred george away, and so
I just glassed down there and it bugled again, and I realized that he
was closer to me than my tent. So I'm kind of working the glass
back up towards me, and I'm hitting these beaver ponds. You can see
these beaver ponds, and I noticed this thing in this beaver pine. Like
I said, man, those elk are down there wallowing in those beaver ponds.
And so I'm, you know, it's right at first light, and
so I'm, you know, I'm really focused on what's going on down there,
because I could get to those elk fairly quick, you know, if
I wanted to. And so I'm looking at this beaver pond and then all
of a sudden, this thing raises up out of this pond and I'm like,
holy cow, like, what in the world is this? So then
it gets out of the beaver pond, and right away I'm thinking, Okay,
that's the bigfoot that they're talking about. I'm freaked out inside a little
bit because, I mean, nobody, if you've never seen one, I
mean, you don't know till you know, right, I mean, I
don't know how else to explain that. I Mean, you know, we
can say there's aliens, but until you see one, you don't know how
you're going to react, especially with a big foot or a sasquatch. So
this thing gets out and he kind of shakes off a little bit, and
man, I am like zooming in on this thing, and he's probably about
one hundred and fifty yards out, so with ten by fifty s ice like,
I can see this thing blinking, you know. And my first thought
really wasn't you know, oh my gosh, oh my gosh or whatever.
My first thought was, this is a monster. And if he comes at
you, and I'm hunting with a recurved bow like the Indians used to do,
I'm like, if this thing comes at you, you're gonna have one
shot. That's it. Did you have a sight on? No? I
still don't even, like, even to this day, I don't carry a
gun in the woods. It's not an ego thing. I've seen too many
people carry firearms and shoot animals that they think they're getting attacked by that.
If you had just used a calm head, it wouldn't have happened, you
know kind of thing. So I'm not. I don't claim to be something
I'm not or anything. I just never have. I mean, I'm holding
a bow in my hand, so you know, if I can't get something
to stop by me shooting it with an arrow, you know, and I've
had some close calls, you know, up in Alaska, I had a
close call. I've had one mountain lion experience that was kind of a weird
thing. But you know, in all my years of doing this, I've
been doing this for over thirty years, and you know, I'm just I've
never put myself in a position to where I felt like I needed to carry
for arm. So but so anyway, this thing kind of he's kind of
shaking the water off of him. I guess you would say, not like
a dog, but you know, there's like one arm and then the other
arm. And while he's doing this, I am noticing that, like this
thing is built like anything I've never seen. Like the forearms were massive,
the hands were massive. I mean, the legs were like like, man,
you know, looking back in a calm area, I'm like, man,
I wish I had legs like that, you know. I mean,
this thing was just for a reacher or whatever you want to call it.
I mean, this thing was in peak physical condition. And so I'm sitting
there watching it and he's kind of turned. I'm I'm sitting facing to the
to the northeast. That's kind of where he's at but he's facing more north
than east, and he hasn't I don't he hasn't seen me, at least
I don't think he had. And he turns. And when you're when you're
in a when you're in glass like that ten by fifty binoculars like that,
when he turns and looks up towards me, you think he's looking you through
your soul, you know, when in fact, he's probably looking past me,
or he could have been looking at me. I don't know, but
through the binoculars, it was like he was looking through my soul. But
he didn't look he didn't look scary though, I mean, he looked to
me more man like. Then you know, people describe gorillas or whatever.
And we'll get back to Keith Foster, because he did a drawing that was
just amazing. I mean it was so spot on. And so I'm sitting
here and this thing doesn't appear to be a threat to me, and so
I kind of you know, I'm at a twelve, and so now I'm
at like a ten, and I'm thinking strategy more than anything else, Like
if he comes at me, what are you gonna do? Da da da
da that kind of thing, and but I'm getting to watch him and he's
just middling around this beaver pond, and you know, I watched him mess
with his face, like he touched his face. I'm watching his eyes blink,
you know. At one time he reached down to get like a clump
of mud off his leg, which was kind of different. And so then
he turns and he walks north towards my camp, and he's having to go
up this hill, and so he gets kind of cross side heeling, if
you will, and he gets about even with my tent, and he squats
down like he's using the bathroom, and he's looking right at my camp and
he's just sitting there and he's watching my tent. And so I've already decided
that once he crosses that hill, I'm going to give it about ten minutes.
If he doesn't come back, I'm going to go down there and grab
my gear and I'm getting out, because I mean, he was scary enough
that I didn't want to be in there by myself with him. I don't
care how many Elko's in there. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with
Cliff and Bobo will be right back after these messages. So Anyway, he
sat there probably about two or three minutes, and he gets ups and he
goes up and over the hill. And so, like I said, I
waited ten or fifteen minutes, and I crawled down off that rock that I
was on, and I ran down to my camp and I quickly packed it.
And it took me about five or six hours to get in there,
and it took me about three and a half to get out. So I
basically ran or jogged all the way back to the car or the truck,
and so yeah, I mean the whole episode of seeing this thing was probably
about ten minutes long. And once I get back to the vehicle, of
course, coming out of there, I was totally paranoid, like it's this
thing following me, Like you know what happens he jumps out blah blah blah,
and so you know, this total state of paranoia hiking out of there
and running and you know, just almost killing myself to get out. And
so I get to the truck and immediately I go to the ranch and it's
probably gosh, I don't know, it's probably around lunchtime, maybe at one
o'clock, and so everybody's out hunting, like there's no guides there, there's
no clients there, but the owner was there, Gary Jordan, and I
go into Gary's office and he's like, man, did you kill one?
Did you come to get the horses? And I'm like no, Gary,
I said, you know that thing that happened to us last year with me
and Bob and the coat, And he goes, yeah, I said,
I saw this thing up close. And he goes, what are you talking
about. I said, I watched him for ten minutes this morning and he's
like, no, you didn't. He goes, it was a bear.
I said, Gary, I have how many bears have I got it on?
I had up to that point, I'd killed probably me personally, had
probably killed like five bears, but I had got it on probably twenty five
or thirty by that time. So I know what a bear is, you
know. And that's what I'm telling Gary. I'm like, that was no
bear, man. I'm like that, I don't know what it is,
you know. And like I said, I'd never researched sasquatch or Bigfoot,
didn't have any knowledge of any of that, and so I didn't have anything
like nowadays you hear people go, well, it's a mix between a man
and an ape or a monkey or something. I didn't have that. I
was like, it was one of the best built men, Harry people that
And I came up with like Neanderthal, because that's what I think of Neanderthal
would look like. And that's what I told Gary, and Gary goes,
well, he goes, you're obviously shook. And I had an apartment down
in Colorado Springs at the time, and he goes, you need to go
home and spend a couple of days and come on back up here Friday night
and let's get back on the saddle and start guiding again. I'm like,
okay. So I go down there, and I do have a computer at
the time, and I get on there and I google Bigfoot or Sasquatch,
and I start seeing all this stuff. And it's the first time of me
seeing the Patty film. And this thing looked a lot like Patty, except
the mail version. And because it was a mail and so anyway, I
come across the BFRO website. Didn't know they even had a thing like that,
and it said, hey, if you've had a sighting or whatever,
please tell us. So I sat there for like two hours typing, and
I would like, you know, like I'm going, is this too much
information? Not enough information? You know, blah blah blah whatever. And
it's on like a Wednesday. No, it's not even that. It's on
like a Monday or Tuesday. And so I write my story and tell what
happened, you know, both accounts, the first one and then this last
one, and I write on there you know, this happened yesterday. And
I submitted it. Well, within like less than an hour, I get
a call from Matt Moneymaker. Oh how was that? I had no clue
who he was. Like, he goes, hi, am Matt Moneymaker and
you know President bf R own Boom, and he goes, tell me about
your story. And I'm like, okay, you know, and he's like,
can we if I get a guys out there, can you know,
can we come and look? And I'm like, I said, well,
I'm a full time guy, and I said, if you got somebody out
here that the only way I'd do that is if they came in the next
day or two. Well, by George, that night, I get a
phone call and to my for my life, I can't think of the name
of these two guys. One of them's name was Jim and maybe y'all can
help me with this. But he and I don't know if he was just
telling me a story or what, but he had said that he at one
time he had set like the highest altitude sky diving record or something, and
his name was Jeff something. I took him in there and we looked around,
and sure enough, we found prints around that beaver pond. And up
until a couple of years ago, I actually had a copy of that casting
and or had the original cast really and through a divorce and all that and
moving, I have no idea where it's at. But so anyway, so
that happened, and shortly after that, man I started getting phone calls from
all kinds of people. And what was one of the weirdest things that happened
to me was I get a call from this guy like I didn't and he
goes, hey, is your address blah blah blah blah, and I'm going
yeah, he goes, good, at four o'clock today, you're going to
receive a package. He goes, I'll see you there at like five o'clock.
I'm like, who are you? He goes, I got this coming
to you. He goes, I got to know if this is what you
saw. And it was the original copy of I want to say, Memorial
Day footage where the people were in the boat and the and the bigfoot runs
across the side hill and then jumps that big gully. It was that footage.
And I'm going, well, who are you, like, where did
you like, are you CIA or FBI or something? You know, because
I've worked with those guys when I was, you know, in the military.
I'm like, this is some CIA FBI stuff going on here. And
so he actually I told him, I said, man, I don't have
a VCR. He said, he brought a VCR with him and we hooked
it up to my TV and watched it. And I'm going, well,
the one I saw wasn't quite as big as that. I mean, the
one I saw was probably like seven foot maybe. I mean, he wouldn't
know. It wasn't like ten twelve foot or whatever something like that. He
wasn't. I mean, seven foot's pretty big. But I mean this dude,
this thing I saw was just jacked up. I mean just every part
of his body was just muscled up. And so when this thing jumped that
gully, I was like, I could totally believe that, and he goes,
what do you mean, I said, the way these things are built,
I said, I said, he could have probably jumped up on that
rock outcome cropping and ate me for you know, breakfast that morning, and
just the way he was built. And so after that, I really,
I never really had any more interaction. It didn't really change the way I
felt in the woods. And I think the reason being is that, for
lack of a better word, was a peaceful encounter. You know, I
didn't feel like this thing was going to eat me or tear me apart or
any of that. And you know, and I was fascinated by how it
looked and all that. But you know, weeks and months following that,
I kept thinking that, you know, that thing probably watched me walk right
by him, because I followed that series of beaver ponds going up to that
rock out cropping, and so that kind of set me on edge a little
bit. But you know, I never had any ill will or bad feelings
or you know, anything like that towards towards what I saw, and so
you know, I carried on as normal. You know, I still guided,
I still hunted, but hoping that maybe i'd see another one something,
you know, because it was just cool. So now I'm not going to
tell you that coming out of a mountain, you know, and you're six
miles from your vehicle and your own foot and it's dark, you don't think
about that because you do. But you know, as far as ever being
scared or you know, beyond being able to do whatever, and just never
happened for me. So well, at the end of the day, I
mean, if they're real, they were real before you saw them too,
So what why should anything change? Right? Could you describe how it moved
asarng as you said, it shook, It shook itself dry when it got
out of the water. Yeah, you know, so like when you get
out of the shower, you know how you might take say the right arm
and you and you kind of brush your left arm just to get the excess
water off. Yea, it's kind of like that. Was it just to
the arms or did it do it's all over the body too. He kind
of like from the shoulder to probably the mid forearm. He kind of did
that, and then he did it like where his belly would be like there,
and he like his thighs and then he bent down and was picking like
I assumed it was a clump of dirt or mud or something since he had
been in that beaver pond, and like he was picking something off his leg,
like mud or or something like that. And so that's that was the
when he got out of the beaver pond there. How about the eyes you
said you saw the you saw the eyes through the did Yeah? I don't
know if you did. I did. I send you a copy or a
photograph, Matt, of the drawing that Keith did. No, I don't
have that, but I'm going to try to search for it right now while
we're talking to it, and I'll send it to you. Oh that'd be
great. Yeah. So, I mean this thing, it looked ninety eight
percent human to me, with the exception that it had a lot of hair.
So I mean, it kind of had like a everybody says a crowned
head like, but it was it was more like a domed kind of rounded
head. His nose was almost like that of a person, you know,
a little flatter against his against his face. But his lips were I mean,
can you use the word normal, but I mean they were normal for
what I was looking at. I guess. And the eyes just looked they
looked like our eyes, really, I mean, you know they there wasn't
anything crazy about on. Could you see the whites there? No? I
couldn't. No, I didn't see it that good. But I couldn't tell
when it was blinking because the whole forehead would move when he blinked. So
did it blink like a human like I've heard they don't blink very much compared
to humans like they they don't blink his office A lot of people have reported
did you notice that? No? I mean as far as how many times
he blinked or whatever, not really, but I do recall that he blinked.
And the reason I do is because he had like this above his eyes
was like a brow line kind of thing, but it wasn't like huge,
But when he did blink, that brow line would move and you can see
that, And so that's that's how I know he was blinking like fat.
There was fat up in there, not just like the bony brow. It
was like like a fat depositive or something. You think maybe, I mean,
you ever seen those old guys that have like the unibrow kind of kind
of look like that, except it protruded a little bit, So you know,
I don't know if that was just like a unibrow kind of thing where
if that was a part of his you know, muscular makeup. I'm not
sure, but I do know that when he blinked, that whole section moved,
and you know, I didn't notice that he didn't have much of a
neck on him. How is the body proportions like limb legs and comparison,
like a human was like longer his legs, and his arms weren't proportional to
his body, like his arms were longer than normal. I don't know that
they came down to his knees, but they definitely hung lower than what a
person's would. But I could tell that like his torso was the bigger part
because his legs were so massive, like just so massive, and so his
legs were smaller than the rest of his body. I guess is the best
way to say that. I don't know any way describe that, I guess.
So I guess his torso from his waist up was bigger or taller than
from the waist down. So I don't know if that makes the arms look
different or not. So stay tuned for more Bigfoot and beyond with clipp and
Bobo will be right back after these messages. The hands big hands, and
I mean full on massive, massive hands, because I noticed his hand when
he reached down to pick whatever was on his leg. Off, I noticed
that his hand like was as big as his leg, if that makes sense,
Like it was huge. Did it seem proportional to the size of the
body or is it a bigger in proportion or smaller in proportion? I think
it was proportional. I do think they were probably proportional, because I mean
this thing, I mean even making a reference to like I don't know the
body of the actor of Arnold Schwarzeninger. Yeah, thank you Arnold's I mean,
as far as his physicality was, he was all that and then so
like had you know, I couldn't actually see the six pack, you know,
abs, but I mean you could tell that it was just built.
I mean, this thing was just built to live there. It was it
was unreal. How about hairlict and coloration. So he was between like so
when the when he when he did that side, he'll he kind of got
up into where the sun was finally cresting over the mountain a little bit and
up until that point he looked brown to me. But then when he hit
the sunshine, the sunlight a little bit, it kind of almost had like
a reddish tint to it. So I don't know if that was just the
sun reflecting off his brown hair. But the hair was pretty proportional. I
mean, you know, it wasn't like long, stragglely something crazy like you
see in some of these movies. I mean, it was pretty I don't
want to use the word man or groomed, but I mean, you know,
his face probably had maybe an inch or half inch hair, and his
head probably the same, and then around his neck was had like a almost
like a maine kind of like you could his hair started getting longer at his
in his chest, in his arms, and so his hands were didn't have
any hair on at all, like you know, especially the palm of his
hand had no hair at all. So and it was it was like a
and I haven't thought about this in forever, but I remember it was like
a baseball, mit is what it looked like to me. What color was
the skin almost like a almost like a grayish black color, more gray,
I think, so it was like a weathered I remember it being like this
weathered look. I've heard reports of people who have said, I've spoken to
people actually who like yourself, who had seen them very close or through binoculars
or something like that, and they commented about how the face look weathered.
They did use the weather just like you did, but they also use things
like wrinkled and old, leathery, and like, did they have any of
that kind of characteristic to it, like in desperate need of moisturizer? Yeah,
no, because he, the one I saw, had like quite a
bit of hair on his face. The only place void of hair was kind
of around his lips, in his nose, and then the rest of it,
you know, was pretty hairy. But it was weird because it looked
almost groomed, like if he'd gone if you'd gone to a barber and had
it shaved to a certain length or something. But what what I looked at
didn't appear to be old at all. No, I sent Matt the picture.
I mean, that's exactly what what you're looking at is exactly what I
saw exactly. I mean, so if you look at that picture, I
mean, I don't know if you could age that or not. I mean,
thirties forties I mean not old enough to be like an old withered man
kind of thing, you know. And for the people listening who are members,
I guess we'll go ahead and put that on the on the Patreon.
Is that right foru? It? Yeah, I'll post that there and yeah,
Bobo, I sent it to the group. Text oh, text email,
Jeff, you mentioned earlier when you first put your eyes on this thing,
you were actually looking for an elk bugling? Was there was there an
elk in the area or was the thing making that noise? No, there
was elk, because there was elk everywhere. There must have been. Yeah,
there must have been probably, and I don't want to exaggerate, but
at least seventy five to one hundred elk in that little valley. Wow.
Yeah. So I can't say that he was making that noise because i'd heard
all kinds elk that morning and actually had glassed up two or three that were
bugling. So I was just up there trying to figure out which one I
was about to go after. So do you have photographs of the original cast
that you mentioned? I don't. I don't have any, but you know,
I think I think my sister might have one, because I moved back
to Nashville for a short stint, and I had it sitting on a coffee
table, and she took a picture with it. So I'll get with her
and see if she has it, and if it does, I'll certainly afford
it to you guys. But I remember the dimensions of it, so it
was it was probably somewhere between sixteen and eighteen inches long, and it was
the width of my hand and then some so probably I'm guessing four or five
inches wide. Made me. You're the perfect guy to ask. I mean,
boat hunters, and you're a guy, so you've chopped up tons of
animals. If you think it's seven foot tall, how much you think it
weighed? That's a great question. So the way the way I would probably
approach that is, we know Shaquille O'Neill is seven to right, and Shaquille
probably weighs three hundred three h five something like that. Maybe I'm guessing this
thing was probably because of how muscular it was, because you know, muscle
weighs more than fat. Anyway, I'm guessing, if I had to be
accurate, probably somewhere between three fifty and five hundred, because Shack's about three
fifty. Yeah, so then this thing probably had to be at least you
know, four to five hundred. Then there's no way at weighed eight one
hundred or one thousand pounds. I just that'd be hard to say for me,
but I'm guessing probably on the high end, probably five hundreds after the
sighting and and the realization, after your two sightings, and your realization that
like, oh they smoked, these things are actually out there, These things
are real. I have looking back at your previous guide experience and all the
time you spent in the mountains, do you think you might have ever been
close to one before that and you just didn't know because they weren't on the
radar? You know what? I do think I have and it's only one
one or two occasions because somebody else had asked me that. So when you're
when you're hunting elk, elk put out a smell that you can if there's
especially if there's a bunch of them during the mating season, a bull elk
will will urinate on himself and and he'll get in what we call walls,
which is they dig out of and it'll kind of that has water, and
they'll make mud out of it, and they'll get in there and they'll coat
themselves in this mud because an elk will spend more time. A lot of
people don't know this, but elka spend more time trying to stay cool than
he will anything else. And so by kicking himself with his mud and all
that, it helps him stay cool. And so during the mating season,
what an elk do. He'll get in there and he'll start wallowing and doing
all that. And while he's doing that, he'll urinate in the mud on
himself. And so when the rut occurs, it usually goes on somewhere between
anywhere from twenty five to forty days long. So you're thinking that this thing
is doing this, you know, at two or three four times a day,
and so that creates a smell. So it gives you that musky smell.
And so a lot of times when you're hunting and you're down when of
an elk, you can smell long before you ever seen them. And there
had been a couple times that the stitch has come over us and you're going,
that's not like, man, that is the grossest smelling elk I've ever
smelled, you know, And in the back of your mind going, you
know that don't even smell like an elk, and so so not knowing one
hundred percent, you know, if I had, I would say probably,
just because I think I've smelled them before. So yeah, probably. Did
you talk about finding that gutted or female elk the cowk that was gutted that
you didn't see the actual antle that you heard it? Yeah, I was
gonna say, like, there's there's some really cool stuff that happened in the
aftermath of all that that I think would be great for the member section that
involved some of those things and some tracks and some sounds that I think you
guys would love to hear, and I know our members would too. All
right, well why do we do that? Then? Why don't we skid
out all over to the member Because if there's follow up things and other unusual
finds and observations in the area, I'd like to hear about those, and
I'm sure our members would as well, And of course are any of our
regular listeners. If you want to be a member, it's just five bucks
a month and you get an extra hour of content every single week as well
as the regular episode with zero commercials at all, No commercials, no advertisements,
just our beautiful voices in your earballs there. So if you want to
do that, be a member. Go to the Bigfoot and Beyond podcast dot
com website, hit the membership link, and then I'll tell you everything you
need to know. All right, folks, Well, thanks a lot of
Jeff Desich for joining us. It's really important you know that we have,
you know, qualified eyewitnesses. I mean disguis. I mean we're talking about
a guy that's one outfit of the Year for Colorado. I mean, so
this guy's an expert. So I appreciate his uh an applaud his candor and
honesty and bravery to come forward. So thank you, Jeff, and until
next week, y'all keep it squatching. Thanks for listening to this week's episode
of Bigfoot and Beyond. If you liked what you heard, please rate and
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