The Clouds Authenticity Podcast. Michael Flynn is a professor of philosophy and history and
author of Visions of Atlantis. Michael, thanks for being here. Oh,
thank you so much. I appreciate it. Yeah, I've been very interested
to have you on because the topic of Atlantis, there's a few people out
there talking about it, but I don't think there's anybody that's really profoundly describing
and going into details the way that you really do. So it's very awesome
to me. But can you tell me what got you interested in Atlantis?
I wish I knew, you know, I was just your pretty run of
the mill, you know, a jink professor of history and philosophy, and
to be honest, just one day, I think I was just reading you
know, ignotious donal Lee's The Anti Deiluvian World, which you know as a
classic from the nineteenth century, one of the I still think one of the
most interesting investigations of the topic. And you know, like most people,
I think I was aware of it. You know, I think it's seeped
into pop culture to such a degree that even people that you know, necessarily
don't believe in it have been familiar with, you know, the Lost Continent
or Lost island, however you want to describe it, of Atlantis. But
really it was that book that peaud my curiosity because it started to seem much
less like a you know, fictional account than something totally lost on us that
people were trying to piece together with whatever evidence they had. And so that
led me down a probably seven or eight year almost full time investigation, this
while I was still working, and then later I stopped teaching for about three
years just to fully investigate the subject. And you know, I was quite
surprised what I found, because you know, it's commonly thought that this entire
story was created by say Plato, and that there's no source before this that
mentions Atlantis, which is one of the main critiques, which you know,
turns out not to be true. And of course, you know Plato,
according to his account in Timaeus and Critias, is two dialogues from around three
hundred and sixty PC. The chain of custody, if you will, of
the story, you know, ultimately goes back to Egypt, because that's where
Plato's distant relative Solon allegedly traveled, and he spoke to the temple priests at
Sayus, who told him. Let us tell you the story of Atlantis,
because we keep longer records than you Greeks, and you know, I think
a lot of people would really do themselves a favor just to reread Plato's dialogues,
not a secondary source talking about it, but actually read what Plato said
that the Egyptians told so long. And it's quite interesting because here you have
the description of a celestial body hitting the earth, some sort of comet,
you know, which people like Graham Hancock and others have you know, repopularized
today by you know, way of evidence from nano diamond deposits and you know,
flood patterns in the Americas and whatnot. But here you have, in
three hundred and sixty BC, a Greek philosopher whose you know, reputation precedes
him describing a story of a celestial body hitting the earth around nine thousand,
six hundred BC and ending the civilization of Atlantis, which again is a quite
fascinating date because mainstream science would tell you that that's when, you know,
the Holocene period basically begin as the Younger dry as you know, ended and
we came out of the Final Ice Age, if you will, and you
know, the other things that really shocked me were as I started to exhaust
historical evidence from Mediterranean, Indian, Egyptian sources on the subject, it led
me to some more I guess you would say experimental sources, which would be
remote viewing clairvoyance. And you know, I was of course aware that the
average person generally is taught from an early age if they grow up in the
Western world, that none of these things hold any water, which is of
course hilarious because you know, the United States government has been using remote view
for forty five years to great effect, and they absolutely understand it's real clairvoyance.
It's a tricky case because anybody can go into a so called trance and
say I had had a bad slafe in Atlanta's and this is what it looked
like. But I was interested in who were the first people to do that,
and who were the most reliable people. For example, I picked you
know, Edgar Casey, because Edgar Casey of his you know, nearly fifteen
thousand readings that he gave in a medically supervised near coma state, a hypnagogic
trance that wasn't just you know, sitting on his couch. He was in
a state near death, according to medical doctors who witnessed it. You know,
edgar Casey was mainly concerned in the early nineteen twenties and thirties with medical
diagnoses, so he wouldn't diagnosed people without seeing them, and those people would
later get help based on his recommendations. And there's hundreds, if not thousands
of sworn testimonies, you know, testing to his abilities. It's not my
imagination, it's not fiction. There's fifteen thousand transcripts that i've you know,
read through, and in those transcripts, occasionally he would mention Atlantis at a
time when you know, very few people were really talking about it in the
nineteen thirties in Virginia Beach to his you know, devoutly Christian friends and clients
who were coming to visit him for past life readings or medical readings and things
like this, and so those were really interesting because, you know, a
man who in his own waking life, by his own emission, had absolutely
no knowledge or interest in Egyptology or geology or even Atlantis, found himself when
he would waigh up and read what he said in a you know, thirty
minute trans session, he was quite surprised and it actually changed his life because
he was raised about Baptist and he suddenly describes things like reincarnation. He describes
the soul of Jesus being one of the first incarnations in Atlantis, which contradicted
a lot of his congregations beliefs, and you know, led them to really
study this subject more. And what's really curious is that at a time when
almost no one could have known some of these things that I mentioned in the
book, dates of extinctions, river beds that had never been discovered, he
was talking about it, you know, and that to me is heart evidence,
regardless of how it's gleaned. You know, if a man in a
trance, real or imagined, describes accurately a you know, river system in
west central Africa that no one in the world had discovered, and describes it
accurately and describes where it started and where it ended, and then in nineteen
eighty six, space Shuttle imaging actually discovers that it's real. I mean,
that's a data point, you know. And so the book, you know,
I call it Visions of Atlantis because it's not just historical accounts of Atlantis,
but it's also literally you know, hypnogogically channeled accounts or visions, if
you will, of what life could have been like, you know, using
people like Edgar Casey, using another kid named Frederick Oliver, who wrote a
channel The Claire Audience book that he claims was dictated to him by voices in
his head, which again I mean myself on the surface, when I'm reading
these things, I'm a very skeptical person. So I just look at,
well, what did this book say? You know, let's just pretend it
wasn't channel Let's just say it was a really smart seventeen year old kid in
eighteen eighty four writing a novel about Atlantis. Well what does he say?
And if you read the whole thing as I have, it's four hundred pages,
it's almost impossible that, I mean, there's only a couple possibilities.
A. It is a truly channeled account. B. This is a child
who was as intelligent as Nikola Tesla three. It was a secret contributor.
But then why was it not published in his lifetime? And why did he
himself know things that no one could have known in eighteen eighty four, you
know, And so these were the things that I really wanted to do to
separate this book from the you know, thousands of books written on Atlantis that
seemed to me to have reached a dead end in terms of the research the
sources. I had seen a lot of people just repeating the same sources,
the same sources, or I had seen the field compartmentalized, where it's this
is a book just about clairvoyant visions of Atlantis, you know, and here's
a book quote unquote just on the hard science of Atlantis. Whereas I thought
a more holistic approach would suit the subject and kind of bring people from both
sides together to see that, Hey, look, there is an actual science,
you know, as Dean Rayden would explain to you, and you know,
Stanford University and the Institute of Noetic Science is that. Yeah. Actually,
clairvoyance is real. It's very rare, it's hard to develop, but
it is real. Remote viewing is real, that's undeniable. Psychic archaeology has
proven to you know, lead to discoveries. Stephen Schwartz's proof in that in
his excellent work. I mean, it's just that the mainstream never engages with
that, and it's an important part of the story because we're dealing with the
subject that, according to Plato's account himself, is over you know, twelve
thousand year years old by this point, So it's not going to be something
where you're going to find necessarily an Atlantean potshard at the bottom of the Atlantic,
but you might find megalithic remains of the final and breakaway cultures after the
final destruction, which I would argue Giza would be a prime example of that.
Well, that is fascinating. I mean, I don't know very much
on this topic. I remember growing up my grandmother had tons of works by
Edgar Casey and that was my first exposure to stuff like that. So naturally,
being a young child, I was remaining curious about his work and it
just seemed like he was spot on about so many topics. But apart from
that, in present times, my main exposure would have been people like Barbara
hand Klaud speaking about these lations, or most recently we have Sarah Brestman caused
me with her work, you know, and people always ask me where chit,
Like, hey, can you regress me to Atlantism? Like no,
I can't do that, Like I can't suggest to you where you would go
in a regression. So you know, it's interesting, but people do have
this subconscious need to know about that time period, and that in itself suggests
to me that it's a real tangible thing, if nothing else. And I
have to ask you this question, why do you think there is an attempt
to control the narrative on this topic? Well, you know, it's I
think I wouldn't say that there's a necessarily concerted or centralized conspiracy to suppress this
specific topic. I would just say that the weight of you know, the
way academia works. I mean, as a person who used to you know,
work in that field full time, you know, not even to take
a subject like Atlanta. Let's just take a subject like the possible, you
know, an alternative ending, let's say to World War Two. You know.
So, you know, the FBI releases their declassified files on Hitler that
show very good evidence that you know, the FBI was tracking him in Argentina
for a decade after the end of the war. You know. Again,
not my opinion, that's what the FBI files say. But have I seen
you know, college textbooks or college professors that taught me update that. No,
it's still he died in the bunker, and that's it. You know,
which again is a story that began with Hugh Trevor Roper, who was
a medieval you know, historian who was assigned to write the official you know,
history of the Third Reich many years after the fact, based on interviews
with Nazis I wouldn't consider the most reliable sources and you know, your investigations.
So it's like that's a mainstream subject, World War Two, that's fairly
contemporary. You know, you're talking only seventy five eighty years ago, and
that's a narrative that we can't challenge, you know, or people that have
you know, alternative views of you know, other you know, medieval history.
It gets even more difficult to challenge the established narrative of this is what
it was like during feudalism, and it's like, well, new evidence suggests,
nope, no, we don't want so when you're dealing with the subject
that basically nobody knows anything about except from extremely ancient records and deduction, I
think it's much easier just to say, well, we know that it wasn't
real, instead of saying, yeah, you know, this actually could be
real and there could have been a highly event. Civilization was utterly or almost
utterly destroyed, and you know, the sands of time have covered that up
and only left us with let's say, megalithic architecture, which you know has
changed and been weathered and warped, and you know withstood dozens, if not
hundreds of other cultures that have you know, used it for certain purposes,
like say Giza Plateau. And so it's just easier to say, well,
you know that was just built for Kufu as a tomb. And you know,
again I asked people, well, there's no evidence of that. That's
as fantastical as the Atlanteans built. And in fact, that's more fantastical because
it doesn't make any sense. It doesn't resemble a tomb. It is complicated
on a level that makes absolutely no sense if it were to and that would
be like discovering the Pentagon and saying, well, there's a box somewhere in
the Pentagon that's squares, so it must have been a tomb for the president
that they had. You know, it's like, no, it was a
very different subject. It's very different structure. Then, you know, the
one thing left after ten thousand years, Let's say, if indeed it was
as old as Edgar Casey said it was, which was you know, completed
in ten thousand, three hundred and ninety pc by the descendants of Atlantis.
So I think it's you know, a function of the way the game works
is people would rather say something's not true than admit they don't know. You
know, there's this push I've noticed with academics for certainty, and particularly with
the quote unquote scientists these days. You know, that's unfortunately not how science
works. It's the opposite of science, or science is supposed to be by
definition, hypothetical, in tentative and based on you know, preponderance of evidence
towards a new working theory, not some monolithic This is the way it is
forever. But unfortunately, you know, in the last i'd say thirty forty
years with the subject of Atlantis from my research looking at the intent, I
are historical record of everyone to my knowledge who talked about it. It wasn't
treated this way until you know, really like forty years ago. It started
to change, and in thirty years ago it started to get more and more
just kind of you know, discussed as a fantasy, and particularly recently,
while there's been this huge outflowing of renewed interests from the popular level, there's
been a as you've seen, you know, I'm sure with Graham Hancock and
the pushback from the Dusty Academy, I mean they hate him because number one,
he doesn't have a PhD you know, from Oxford, and he didn't
spend a lot of money, and you know, keep that game going.
And it also shows them just absolutely how flawed their own reasoning could be.
You know, and there's people that I mean, that's a culture more than
an institution. I've noticed that as well. You know, you don't really
go to Oxford because you're going to read better books or have better classes.
You go there, so you could say you went to Oxford, and therefore
your opinion carries more weight than you know, a guy like me who used
to work at a bar and you know, moonlight as a professor on the
weekends. But you know, I still have my master's degree, I've still
read thousands of books. I would say the evidence speaks for itself. You
know, anybody can do the work. And you know, to my great
surprise, you know, some of the best researchers on the subject were not
traditional academicians, you know, naishas Donnelly was a congressman and a friend of
Abraham Lincoln, and he wrote still one of the best books on Atlantis.
You know, he wasn't an egyptologist. Edgar Casey was a Sunday school teacher
and a guy who gave medical readings for thousands of people to help them.
He wasn't an egyptologist. Most of the things he said turn out to be
true about archaeology. And so it's interesting, you know, because I liked
the way the book came out at the end, because you've got you know,
traditional high level sources, the Mahabarata, turin King's List, the usual
you know, kind of dusty tomes that everybody talks about. But then you
see like how average people talked about it, how people in the thirties talked
about it, how people who got psychic greetings discussed it, and how it
affected their lives. And then you know how actual people that were not in
the field of atlantology ended up discovering things that supported things that they themselves would
never have put together with the bigger piece of the Atlantean puzzle because they weren't
looking for it. You know, Like, for example, there was a
researcher in the nineteen fifties and sixties, a guy named Maurice Ewing, and
he did a really one of the first full scale surveys of the mid Atlantic
Ridge, which it's self was discovered in eighteen seventy seven. And it's really
interesting because again it just shows you how different people were in terms of considering
these things. You know, in eighteen seventy seven, for example, the
Challenger, which was a very primitive, you know, sale basically a sale
ship. I'm not sure if it had steam power as well, but it
was a sailing ship, you know, a three masses sailing ship that discovered
the mid Atlantic Ridge on an expedition, and then later the Dolphin and the
Porpoise other ships confirmed it. And you know, the first thing that the
researchers, these were some of the best oceanographers in the world at the time,
the first thing these people said when they discovered the mid Atlantic Ridge off
of the Azores was they wrote an article that I found I've never seen anybody
site this article. You know, it took me a long time to dig
this one up, but it was an article I think in Scientific American and
you know, published in eighteen seventy seven seven, and the title of the
article is Glimpses of Atlantis, and they subscribe to the catastrophic explanation of ice
age flooding, and they said, as the New America was forming, it's
likely that the old Atlantis was sinking. And it appears that the story Solon
told Plato, you know, by way of Critius et cetera, et cetera,
indeed was true. So when they found the mid Atlantic Ridge in eighteen
seventy seven, they had basically said, mainstream scientists, we found Atlantis.
Now it's interesting because today, you know, National Geographic and Scientific American,
all they do is write pieces about how if you believe that you're crazy,
you know. So the book was as much about showing what this could have
been as showing how the whole game works in academia. How just because people
today with fancy newspapers and fancy journals tell you you're crazy, well that's not
what they said one hundred and fifty years ago. In fact, the smartest
people in the Enlightenment, including you know, gion Rinaldo Carley, who was
a friend of Voltaire's, in a polymath, he figured it out in the
seventeen hundreds. You know, Albert Einstein was friends with Charles Hapgood, who
was a researcher into ancient maps. You know, when nobody believed him,
Albert Einstein wrote him a letter of recommendation. Tesla got a recommendation and a
life reading from Edgar Casey. You know. So it's like this idea that
only crazy people who you know meditate with you know, incense and you know
a Ouiji board are into Atlantis is really not true. And of course,
when you strip away the ad Hominem attack aspect of the investigation, you're really
left with exactly what you would expect to find if it were real, which
is, okay, we have a mid Atlantic ridge, you know, the
Atlantic Ocean, which again the Atlantic Ocean where Atlantis was, according to Plato,
you know, has a mid Atlantic ridge. It's not just an empty
basin. And Plato said basically that the high point of the mid Atlantic ridge,
where the Azores chains are now is where Atlantis was. And then Frederick
Oliver, who in eighteen eighty two eighteen eighty four drew a channeled sketch of
what the final island would have looked like after multiple destructions. When no one
knew what that bottom of the Atlantic actually looked like. It had not been
contoured by a satellite, and it turns out to confirm what modern satellite imaging
says that part of the Azores Basin looks like. So it's like, well,
if that's not evidence, I mean, I don't know what would be.
You know, because steel doesn't last twelve thousand years, the glass doesn't
last twelve thousand years. Megalithic architecture does us, but it's difficult to date
it. And in the case of say the Great Pyramid, you know,
the inscriptions which allegedly were on the limestone casings have all been removed. So
it's like, we don't have a lot. And so I understand people's frustration.
But until perhaps you know, the famed Hall of Records, or you
know, a crystal skull that we can decode with a computer, or something
is revealed to the world, it's kind of like the extraterrestrial question, where
it's like there appears to be a preponderance of evidence, there appear to be
people obfuscating the truth, but until the masses are shown on CNN, you
know, the bodies under right Patterson Airfield in a you know, pink liquid
with the glass case. They're not going to believe it. And so I
never set out to prove anything. I just set out to show people that,
look, this is a really fascinating story and it's not that fantastical,
you know, And the same thing could happen to us right now if we
were faced with say, a you know, two kilometer wide comment or something
you know, similar to that, Well, shit, you could not have
given a better answer to that question. It's very interesting because I guess you've
managed to find so much information, both channeled accounts and physical evidence, and
yet you're really just sifting through a very small amount of information because it wasn't
the majority of it destroyed at one point, like everything that we know,
the majority of information that we have in the history books has been destroyed.
So we're all feeling from a very small reserve of information. But oh my
god, I mean you have to think, you know, people always talk
about the destruction singular of the Library of Alexandria, but really there were three
destructions, you know, the first under Julius Caesar, when he set the
docks on fire trying to save Cleopatra, his seventeen year old lover from her
crazy brother in a civil war which caught the the you know megale Bibliotheke I
guess they called it in Greek caught that part of a library on fire and
destroyed the majority of you know, ancient records at the time. And then
you know, four hundred years later, you have I believe it's Emperor Theodosius
the First, who you know, decides there's only going to be one version
of Christianity, which the Roman Empire has adopted at that point, and he
ordered the specific destruction and dismantling and probably theft to the Vatican you know archives
at that time or whatever they were. You know, we're storing things at
that time in Rome. And then the third was under one of the first
Islamic armies that occupied and they destroyed the final I think the Serapium was the
final piece that they destroyed. So I mean you're talking about you know,
millions of scrolls, millions of archives, millions of books from all over the
world. And it's really interesting because you know, edgar Casey had one reading
on the Library of Alexandria that I've never seen anybody site. It really was
difficult to find and He said that the material that later was put in that
physical building from say the time of you know, the Potolemaic dynasty, after
Alexander the Great, when they started to really collate all the material from the
Mediterranean into one spot. Because Ptolemy was really interested in that. Apparently he
used to steal books from ships that docked at Alexandria. Is the anecdotal evidence
that he would He would say, oh, I just going to make a
copy, and then the cap and said, can I got that book back
now? And that's how you amassed so many books, is one of the
ways people say. But Edgar Casey said that the material that was destroyed had
been accumulated from ten thousand BC after the fall of Atlantis, and so we
can only imagine what was destroyed in that or I would argue locked away in
Rome where it's probably still, you know, in some archive that I'm sure
somebody knows, you know. Allegedly, according to a friend of mine who
I think had a friend who knew Dolores Ken and when she was still alive,
she allegedly told his friend that she got a private tour of the Vatican
and saw unbelievable amounts of unknown Egyptian artifacts and things like this because she was
interested in Atlantis, and the tour guide kind of did it on the on
the on the low after hours because he knew she was famous. And I
think she was doing a reading there and or regressions there, and you know,
he even said like, yeah, we can't, you know, we
can never disclose what we really have because it would upset you know, not
just Christians, but the whole balance of history. So I think I think
that story is probably true. I mean, whether it's true or not,
the fact remains that, you know, we're lucky to even have access to
Plato and Aristotle. You know, we're very lucky, and we're very lucky
to have, you know, the records that the Arabs preserved during their occupation
of Spain, because a lot of those were not even known until you know,
fifteen hundred, you know, after Columbus basically set sail, and they
started to rediscover these texts after the Ray Conquista. And so you're absolutely right,
man. It's it's like, it's a lot of information to me,
but it's probably point zero zero zero one percent of the potential historical record that's
just gone. Yeah, it is. It's It's always been a big driving
force in my thinking because I wonder how many people have lived and died and
they had all this information about topics like this and they just they never wrote
it down or something, you know, or you know how it's just interesting
how everything that we know right now in the way that society is, is
so similar. There's so many parallels to the Atlantean civilization, and yet it's
really hard for people to grasp the idea because there just isn't this information that's
in the mainstream, you know, right, And I guess that's the way
it goes with conditioning. That's why it's called conditioning, because they only want
us to be who they want us to be, you know, for control
purposes. But sure, you know what to ask you? Oh go ahead,
Oh you go ahead. No, I was going to ask you.
You know, if the information in your book became household knowledge, how do
you think that would change society? Well, you know, I guess it's
kind of like with these you know, revelations on extraterrestrial influence in humanity.
You know, I think it's pretty clear to mom and pop in you know,
Dayton, Ohio, watching the six o'clock news or something that well,
you can't just say this is all make believe, you know, this isn't
just X files or something like the government is admitting, yeah, we've recovered
bodies and craft, but like we're not going to really tell you much.
But they've admitted that, which again, whether you think that's just info or
that it's still an admission from the unfortunately, you know, the central authorities
that you know, most people believe, and you know the world hasn't ended,
People haven't jumped out of buildings, the Vatican hasn't burned down. I
think it's going to be the same with Atlantis because I think as time goes
on, more and more things just by the nature of the way history works.
You know, when Graham Hancock wrote Fingerprints of the Gods, go Beckley,
Tempe hadn't even been discovered. You know, it wouldn't be discovered for
another you know, eight ten, twelve years, and when it was discovered,
it's like, okay, now do you believe him? You know that
there could have been an eventsivilization then thousand years ago, and then it's like
it just keeps going. You know. The Gonum Padang, a pyramid in
you know, Java, which nobody knows it could be as much as twenty
thousand years old. And then they find a mine, you know that recently,
you know, going back fifty five thousand years. And then I saw
something else that we have to push the date of Harminid's back, because we
found a flint in you know, upper Ethiopia that is a million years old.
And it's like it just keeps getting older and weirder. And you know,
they know that people were domesticating crops in the Amazon ten thousand years ago,
that that has to change. But it's like, you know, I
think it's not so much like going to be a shocking revelation or anything,
because I mean, the pyramid exists. It's existed, it's been able to
be visited for thousands of years, and yet we can't construct it. There's
no explanation of how it was built. And people just seem to kind of,
you know, keep watching the game and eating hot dogs and drinking beer
like the world ends. So I think that you know, short of finding
like I said, some sort of you know, I don't know, piece
of technology that's somehow still functional or as edgre Casey and many others have said,
a sealed hall of records that has some sort of decipherable script that literally
explains the history of this culture and leads to more discoveries. I don't know.
I don't know if there's going to be any kind of like aha moment.
I think at this point, people are so infantilized and so desensitized to
novelty, just through social media and just the crazy unraveling of daily world events,
that nothing is shocking. You know. It's like that great Jane's Addiction
album, Nothing is shocked. It's true. I mean, I think that's
why I think I say in the book, you know you could find a
VHS a TOF and you know Rata, who Casey said, built the pyramid.
You know you can find a VHS put it in and shows and building.
I don't think anybody would care. I think people are just trying to,
you know, buy milk and put gas in their car. Yeah,
you are spot on there with the infantilization and the desensitizing of people. That's
really what it has come down to. And yet whenever I start talking to
people about stuff like this, and I say, you know, the way
things are going right now, it's not hard to believe that the way that
a civilization like Atlantis was destroyed could have been as a result of AI and
we're going in that same direction. They look at me with the butts and
they say, oh, you're one of those crazy folks, aren't you.
And I'm like, what, Yeah, Well, you know, that's really
interesting because you know, of course, in the book, not to give
too much away, because I would love people to read it and you know,
and tell me what they think. You know, I have a very
thick skin, and I always appreciate feedback. But you know, of course
I had to investigate a couple of the alleged reasons. You know. You
know, in Edgar Casey's account, there's three destructions that span you know,
enormous amounts of time, one in fifty thousand BC, one in twenty eight
thousand BC, which you know, whittled a much larger continent into the final
island in the third iteration, which would have been the story Plato received,
would have been the third iteration of Atlantis. And you know, in Casey's
account, one of the destructions was technologically caused, you know, by a
misapplication of a extremely powerful technology akin to the Death Star on a terrestrial level
in Barbrahan Klow's account, which again I always tell people, you know,
the reason I focus so much on these early early channelers was because they had
no precedent, so they had nobody to copy. And as much as I
respect people like Barbarahan Klow and Philis Schlemmer and other you know channelers from the
seventies, eighties and nineties, there's no way I could prove to a skeptic
that they didn't just read or were subconsciously influenced by Sayega Casey or other things.
But I still include them because they even predicted things that, to answer
your question, are kind of happening now. Like, for example, Barbaraha
and klowd wrote a book called The Atlantis Signet. It's a very weird book
from nineteen ninety one or two. Now think about this. She said that
she's channeling her past life as a scientist who works in a photon laboratory that's
run by an extraterrestrial from the Pleiades named Haton, and he's a basically transhumanist
alien scientist king who does not like humanity, and his goal is to implant
well, she says in twenty one thousand BC, is her timeline. This
had already been done, that the human race had or whatever was around at
that time, you know, members of different cultures, Atlanteans, people in
Memoria, perhaps, I don't know. She doesn't go into much detail on
that, but she says that the people had been in This is in nineteen
ninety two. She says this. She says the people had been implanted with
crystal implants to make them all think alike, and the goal was to create
a one basically well, she says it the new World Order centered on Atlantis,
run by plead and scientist gang named Haton, And she says that once
everybody was chipped with the crystal implant and tracked, that Haton wanted to This
is very bizarre and again how would I prove this? But according to Barbarahan
and Cloud, the center of the Earth is not a ball of magma.
It's an actual semi molten iron crystal. That's how she describes it. Now,
again I'm not a geologist, I'm just reporting what she said. She
said that that destruction was a result of this scientist king deciding okay, now
it's time, and he wanted to quote unquote strike the crystal with some sort
of technology that would basically instantly reentrain all humanity to be in sync with his
agenda, which was an extraterrestrial agenda, and in doing so, it completely
backfired and caused some sort of chaotic resonance wave that emerged from the center of
the Earth and basically sucked down that portion of the Earth and precipitated a global
cataclysm. Now again, who the hell knows, But what's interesting is that
she's describing an agenda that we're watching unfold right now, and she described that
in nineteen ninety two, and very few people besides maybe, like I mean,
David I debuted that year. So it's like, that's a really interesting
data point to me that she basically predicted and she called it the New World
Order, which, of course George Bush had already given that speech in nineteen
ninety ninety one. I believe the New World Order speech. But it's interesting
because it still wasn't widely talked about outside of say, Bill Cooper's circles and
things like this. But you know, that was interesting because that explained one
explanation of, say, how this could have been destroyed, you know,
and in Casey's case, the Towy Stone overcharged and basically did the same thing.
And it's hard to say, like, were they both talking about the
same thing. I don't know. Casey doesn't describe a scientist king he describes
a scientist who accidentally overturned a power source on the Principal Island, so you
know. And then the final destruction case you never mentions what caused it.
I go to Plato for that one, because he describes a comet, and
because there seems to be some evidence that a comet did hit the Earth,
probably on the North Atlantic ice sheet around that time, because there's not a
great explanation for the rapid flooding you know that happened. So I'm just an
open minded person. I don't have an agenda. I personally don't care if
we, you know, find or don't find it as cool as it would
be. It's not something I think that's you should approach that way. I
think when you when you approach a topic with I'm gonna do this, that's
really not scientific. And so I really spent a lot of time writing this
book to see what was real and what was not real. You know,
I did not want to prove to myself that Atlantis was real. I actually
discovered that there's more evidence that it did exist than not through a very honest,
objective, seven year investigation. You know where I would be lying if
I said I don't believe that Atlantis existed, because there's too much evidence to
suggest that it did. And it actually logically makes sense, and it explains
a lot of what human beings, who anatomically have been the same for a
quarter of a million years, had been doing for the first you know,
one hundred thousand plus of those years, which mainstream quote unquote science doesn't have
any explanation. It's nothing, nothing, nothing, nothing. And then one
hundred and ninety five thousand years later, Sumiria Pyramids. Yeah, arah,
blah blah blah blah. It's like, well that doesn't make any sense.
Well, God bless your ability to jump down a rabbit hole. Man,
You jumped all the way down it for seven ye that's the only way to
go. You got to go all in, and you got to you got
to just I always tell people. I told them all my students. I
still teach you if you really want to be a historian. You know,
I'm not a scientist. I'm not a geologist. I'm not a clairvoyant.
I've never had a past life reading. I'm a historian. That's my job.
But if you really want to be a historian, you got to go
outside of what most people think historians do. You got to really get in
there and look at every goddamn thing that has ever been said about the subject.
You know, my advisor used to tell me that, you know,
newspapers anecdotes an old lady at a coffee shop that's just as valuable, often
as it might lead you to something you'll never believe, you know, And
you know, I don't quote old ladies that I met at coffee shops that
you know, heard something about Atlantis. But it's been so fascinating to see
the influx of letters and emails, you know, since this book, which
you know, went to number one best seller it's strangely in ancient Egyptian history
category, which again I find not surprising, because the story of Atlantis is
the story of Egypt. By their own admission, and a colleague of mine,
Rob Nyland, who's friends with the egyptologist Manu Sifzada, he just gave
a presentation where he deciphered with the help of a German colleague, I believe
a you know, temple script that he argues even describes Atlantis in detail that
nobody has really been able to refute yet. So it's like this idea that
it comes from Plato. Even Plato says it's like it. Just when anytime
I hear people say that, it's like, then you haven't even read the
first paragraph of the dialogue because he tells you where it comes from. And
then if Edgar Casey is telling you after the final destruction of Atlantis, the
Atlanteans migrated to three parts of the world, and one of them was Giza.
And then you look at like Robert Bovall's research and it's like, well,
the three pyramids appear to be aligned to ten four hundred and fifty BC.
Okay, that's when Edgar Casey said the pyramids were, you know,
starting to be built. That's when Plato said Atlantis was basically about to be
destroyed, give or take five hundred years. That's when you know the younger
dry has ended. That's when Maurice Ewing says, you know, we can't
explain why there was freshwater diatoms that you know, we're probably above water in
ten thousand BC in the mid Atlantic. That's when you know all these other
stories from the other places. Edgar Casey said, the Atlanteans went like the
Yucaton that produced the Maya, which later produced you know, the Aztecs.
Even their own stories suggest that Atlantis was real. So it's like either Edgar
Casey was a you know, bullshit artist, which I go to great lengths
to show in the book. All the people that tried to debunk him.
A Harvard psychologist lived with him, a psychiatrist lived with him. All of
them went specifically too debunk him, and later came out saying, you know,
we cannot explain this. This is a truly aberrant person who actually has
the ability to remote diagnose not just illnesses, but find missing objects and know
things that no one could know, non local information. And that's documented,
and I show that whole story in the book. It's like a sub chapter
of the book is how his powers work. But I think at the end
of the day, it was, you know, something I did for me.
You know, even though the book, to my great surprise, sold
thousands of copies and has become something of a career for me, I never
set out to write a book for anybody. You know, I didn't.
I didn't care if one person wrote. I just said, I want to
know, and I'm going to write the best goddamn book on this subject for
me. And if one other person likes it, great, But this is
for me. And like a crazy person, sometimes when I'm traveling and I
have a lot of books, I'll reread my own book and I'll find new
things every time, which to me is the sign that I actually did the
work. You know, that it does stand the test of time, and
I think it's, you know, been a really enjoyable thing. But it's
kind of something that after seven years I can say, all right, that's
done, you know, now onto the next. Well, I can't wait
to see what you're coming with next, Michael, me too. Yeah,
but I really appreciate it, man, And I've actually got to get going
now. I'm still teaching on the clock officially here. But you know,
I really I encourage people. You know, it's on Kindle Unlimited. If
you don't want to, you know, purchase it. You can read it
for free on Kindle Unlimited if you have that service. On Amazon preview it
and if you're interested in some of the sources and other researchers that are interested
in this. You can go to my website Michael leflem one word l E
f l e M dot com and there's a lot of great resources there,
and you know, other interviews and even copies of you know, public in
the public sphere books from the nineteenth and early twentieth century that might be tricky
to find, and you can read those. I uploaded some great links.
But you know, it's a collaborative effort. It's something I couldn't have done
without the work of you know, great researchers that you know, come hundreds
of years before me, going back all the way to Plato. He was
very brave to put that out there. In his time, he was you
know, ridiculed by some of his Greek contemporaries. And you know, it's
nothing new if you do anything. You know, Tesla was ridiculed. You
know, would anybody today say that Nicola Tesla's an idiot? No, but
many people at the time did, you know, so I obviously, you
know, I'm aware that certain people think this subject is is silly, but
generally those people don't know anything, and so I'm not really you know,
I'm more concerned with other experts in the field who perhaps have found, you
know, additional or contradictory evidence. I'm actually always excited when somebody says,
hey, you know that thing he said that actually might not be true,
but here's a better way to look at it. That actually excites me.
You know. I actually really do not like authors that just blanketly say this
is the way it is, and if you disagree with this, dating you're
crazy, you know. Unfortunately, there's a lot of people like that.
Their ego gets involved. If the you know, reshot structure is not Atlantis,
signed, sealed and delivered, then go to hell. It's like,
well, Atlantis was an empire according to Plato and all other sources, so
you're goun to find traces of it in different places. You know. That's
why I never say Atlantis as a single location. You know, there's the
British Empire, then there's London. Doesn't mean they're the same, you know,
I think. So what I suggest to people is, you know,
just keep an open mind and imagine looking for the British Empire in the year
twelve thousand and twenty two. What are you gonna find. It's gonna be
very difficult, and we don't even build megalithic architecture anymore, so there might
be no evidence of our current conversation ever again in the future. And does
that mean we're fake. No, it just means that it's very difficult to
say anything with authority. But it's just as stupid to say it's all fake
that I cannot abide. I agree with you, Michael, thanks for being
on the Boundless Authenticity podcast. Absolutely man, and I wish you the best
brother. Same to you.