You're listening to the Paranormal UK Radio Network, the best in paranormal talk radio
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Network. Hello, who fetch the famous of Stollmer, Sir Patrick Moore?
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Where is exactly who are we going? Sir Patrick? The newer normally discovering
tuissively a pronomysy a your black Holes. Welcome to Twin Souls. Twin Souls
is brought to an association with the Panormal UK Radio Network. Your host's Philip
and monokin Seller. Now, our next guest needs no introduction. In fact,
I have to tell you, ladies and gentlemen, it's none other than
Steve Aspin. Now, Steve is a multiple abductee and has had the most
incredible UFO and alien experiences, and all of this is outlined in his book
Out of Time, The Intergenerational Abduction program explored. And you must go out
and buy this book because by definition, to my mind, it is one
of the most impressive books that I have read for many long years, not
since Whitney Streaber's Communion. This book is something that goes into far more detail
and complexity. So welcome Steve. How are you hi, guys, I'm
great. Thanks. So it's want to see you and you as well.
And you know, it's really great to have you on the show because I
know that your book is incredible and it's something that really moves you, not
only because of your experiences, but also of your technical investigations and data that
you've brought to the table and certain theories regarding, you know, the whole
matter of abduction. So tell us how did this all start for you,
Steve? How did how did the UFO phenomena integrate within your life? Well,
it's a long story. I'll try and give you a short version from
infancy. I experienced nighttime incidents, which a lot of abductees do, where
they're paralyzed and they have little creatures around the bed and they just feel that
something is happening to them that they really can't make sense of and doesn't it
doesn't feel like it's part of normal human experience. It feels like it's something
from outside. It's very difficult to explain how you can rationalize this. My
mother was the abduct see in the ancestral line because it was noticed many years
ago by more than one researcher. That's all abductees have either one or both
parents who are also abductees, and one or more grandparents and their children are
also tends to one of their children at least sometimes more than one tends to
be in what I call the program. Like the entities prosecuting, this program
tends to work down on sexual lines. And I think it's because they are
changing the abductee populations slightly in they're changing their genetics and subtle ways, almost
too subtle for our genetics understanding to comprehend what they're doing. But the intergenerational
aspects of the abduction phenomenon is very important to the instigators. And I had
experiences as a young adult which involved seeing flying sources and sometimes in the company
of other people, and one extraordinary experience when I was sixteen years old,
wish I I outline in the prologue of my book Out of Time, where
on a Saturday morning, I was impelled to rise from sleep and for some
reason I want I went out of the house and I walked for ten minutes
to a nearby building site which wasn't near any inhabited houses, inhabited dwellings,
and suddenly I lost two hours and twenty minutes, and the air around me
with pulse stating, with wishing sounds, and I was surrounded by blue and
indigo lights pox stating lights, and I saw a flying for flying sauce of
for once of a best description in full view, about one hundred meters away
and at about thirty thirty degrees elevation from the ground, and it was in
full view, and I had no idea what was going on, absolutely no
idea what was happening to me. And I had a voice in my ears
saying in my head saying, you're going to forget everything that we've done this
morning. You won't remember anything. And then suddenly banged, just like snapping
your fingers. Everything was back to normal, and it was now I got
to this place at five to six in the morning, and when this concluding
minutes or so of memory two and twenty minutes after after I got there when
this happened. It was eight fifteen quarter Path says, and it was July,
so it was quite warm and sunny and a clear blue sky. And
as I walked home, I could feel the skin on my cheekbone below my
left eye sockets was damp and it kept weeping. And when I got home,
I looked in the bar from a mirror and there was a perfectly round
mark of as if the skin had been burned or scraped off with a scalpel.
And so they had this this strange missing time experience, this mark on
my face, which took three or four months to heal, and this sighting
of a flying saucer through this window where there was because the house was partly
built, you know, in construction, there was no glass in the windows.
Side had really full heel of it through this aperture. And I didn't
know what to do with this experience, because there in nineteen seventy two in
the English province English Provinces, there was no there was no understanding of what
alien abduction was. There was the been a cup of cases internationally, like
the the Bet and Barney Hill case, which was first came to public attention
in nineteen sixty six in the United States when John Fuller published his book The
Interrupted Journey, and there was a strange case in Brazil by an an architect
who was from a farming family called called a Sorry he is a lawyer.
He was a lawyer by profession, who called Antonio Villas Bollos. And these
two cases and smashing of others had been recognized as being linked to the UFO
phenomenal. They parceled up with the contacts and all this stuff a flying source
of sightings by military pilots, and it was all packaged together into one jumble,
you know where where if you had if you bought a magazine or a
book on on the UFO phenomenon, which were quite rare in those it isn't
quite difficult to find, you found it all jumbled together. Sometimes the Hill
case and the anti Antonio Villas Bollis case which just popped into chapter eight and
they're just like a single paragraph and then then the narratives were moved on.
So I had no acquaintance with this, and I had nowhere to put this
experience for years afterwards, and I just suppressed it because I couldn't. I
couldn't think of how I would describe what had happened to me or how it
fitted into all the other things that had happened during my childhood. Wish I
outlined in the first chapter of the book. The first chapter is about thirty
pages, and it's called The Slow Revelation. Are you know, I can't
remember the subtype of what it's. It's our bonds with non human our involuntary
bonds were non human entities speak, which was what was happening to my mother
and me and my mother and I didn't didn't recognize it until after she died.
I realized what she was on about, because I actually event got to
grips with the abduction phenomenon academically, and I started to seek outs people who
had demonstrated a serious research interest in it and has written books about it and
has got some understanding of it. People by Bud Hopkins, which who who
is living in New York at the time, Now I lived in London,
and he was the guy really wants to meet and you know that quite a
bit of a central section of the book is about that, about that endeavor
and the meeting him and the time we spend together and what I learned from
this. That's incredible. I think that you know and what you've created in
terms when I say created, in terms of your analysis of the not just
the abduction phenomena, but also the you've tried to bring the physical evidence to
the table. Your book Out of Time certainly goes in depth. I mean,
you know, just to let your listeners know out there that it is
a very detailed and highly strutted and articulated piece of work. Yes, I
was going to add that that the first part is very haunting because you're like,
in a way, you're the only person at the time who is aware
of this. And the haunting aspect of it is is that there you are.
It's like something from the Invaders. I'll put that tongue in cheek.
The old science fiction film was like, it's quite nasty because David Dincon was
on his own and he had to suffer on his own, and no matter
how much he tried to explain this to people that he was rebuffed. So
but your book, it's very and this is the terrible thing about it.
They're so calm and they're so nice about it. This is a nasty thing
about it. You're not going to remember so casually, you're not going to
remember. So in terms of when they say that, it's a very matter
of facts is completely avoided in the emotion. It's just like describing I don't
know what, it's just describing factual likeness. You see something on the paper
on the on the street and you say that's a so so, Yeah,
that's the dog's bone, or that's that's a tennis ball, and they just
walk on. It's really that factual and avoid of emotion. Oh, you're
not going to remember. It's just the same as a fact. Now,
this is actually much confidence. Yes, this actually occurred with you with regards
to one of these so called grays. So you know that has been well
documented within the world of uphology. Give us a little bit of a description
about what happened, because there's some questions I'd like to ask about your thoughts
with with these grays. I mean, you know this this was an experience
you had where you are under their basically control. And tell us about that,
Steve. Do you mean when I when I asked one of the why
are you doing this to me? Yea, I was about ten at the
time, ten years old, and I had one of these nighttime incidents where
I was paralyzed again. It's very very unpleasant feeling because you don't seem to
have any control over your actions at all, and you don't know where you
are, and these people manipulate you and a complete in control of you.
And I asked one of the it was these aliens that the great aliens in
popular culture. I wish I believe a genetically engineered beings. They have a
kind of soul, they have a soul lessens in them. But there it's
a very complicated thing to go into on ans podcast like this, but I
developed quite quite a lot of time to this and the book on in Chattery
in particular. There's there's the tall ones and the ones who've come to get
you, come to collect you and deliver you back again. Usually work in
a group of three, and they're small. They're typically three ft or three
foot six about a meter hot tour and they have the standard morphology which which
has been expressed in popular culture for decades, like in Spielberg's film Close Encounters
of the Third Kind. In the final reel, he tried to recreate the
morphology of these beings as they've been described by hundreds or thousands of witnesses,
so they're always they're always the thin spindley aliens with a great big large and
large craniums and great big bug eyes. There's a taller type, which are
it's not a gradation of different body sizes body heights there. They're just the
the short ones or they're the tour ones, and they're really easy to tell
a pass. And the taller ones generally work with the adoptee alone, sometimes
two of them, and they seem to be in charge with the shorter ones,
and they tend to do all the complicated procedures, anatomical procedures you'll need,
like a harvesting of over and sperm from from adoptise, and neurological procedures
where they stare into adoptise eyes and can access the optic nerve, whereby they
can take control of the abbotise memories. Like this sounds absolutely incredibly if you
have no acquaintance with the phenomenon, but that's actually what they can do.
This isn't this is an ability engineered into them. And I asked this tall
one who was kind of in charge of what was going on, why me,
why why do I deserve this special attention. Why are you doing this
to me? And do you do it to everybody else? And he said,
oh, it's because of your mother and your grandmother and your great grandmother,
and you're next in the line. And he just carried on with what
he was doing, and it it was quite a match from a factor about
it. And they always they said to me more than once, it doesn't
matter what we tell you, because you're not going to remember anyway. But
occasionally some memory kind of sticks with you. It bleeds through or it returns.
Because they don't eliminate the memories completely. What they do is they bury
it in the part of the brain where you can in the long term memory,
so you can't actually immediately recall it if something's just happened to you.
That is why, this is why adaptsies always say they've have missing time.
You know, that can be walking along a woodland track or something and suddenly
they find it's two hours later and they feel really strange and they thought,
something odd happened to me. I don't know, I why is it two
hours later? And they've they've they've all our sense of is missing, the
time has gone missing. They can't they can't understand whether they've had a kind
of mental blackout or whether they've kind of fallen asleep where they're standing up.
They just don't understand it. But what happens is is the time of the
abduction is buried in the long term memory. So it seems like a part
of the memories cut out with a pair of scissizens. Then just two ends
are joined, and these memories are still in there. They are in your
long term memory. But you have to if you, if you, once
you realize what might be going on with you, you have to adopt,
learn to do adopt techniques to access along term memory. It's it's it's possible
to do that, but you need really a skilled practitioner. A very small
number of abductees, a very small percentage of them claim they can remember big
chunks of the abduction or or even all of it without any assistance that they
people have who have a very unusual relationship with a long term memory. But
you know, human neurology is varied, is infinitely varied along you know,
along a line of of abilities and so forth. So some people can remember,
but there are a really small minority of abilities. Most people just don't
remember a thing because they stick it in a long term memory, and all
you have is this two hours of missing time, or sometimes three hours of
missing time. I mean, there's one case out of time that I outline
in chapter two. When I list seven, I go, I explain and
describe seven cases from the classic literature. The Allergash case, which of your
audience will probably know about, was with four guys, four university students in
their twenties, and they were all artists, and they went to they were
America, and I think they were in a Boston, Massachusetts, at the
university there, and they went to the Allergash Waterway in Maine, which is
a state on thee on the Atlantic coast of North America, just underneath Canada.
And they went there to do some fishing and just camp and get into
the wilderness and so forth, and they had a combined abduction the four of
them called is called the Allergash case. And they would gone for three hours
or maybe more than three hours, and they all knew that they had this
three hours of missing time. So the time of the abduction varies sometimes for
from like half an hour to three or four hours, but the average time
is about two hours they'd take you. And there's a reason they have to
spend a certain amount of time with you. Yes, And I wanted to
ask Steve, there are two questions that I think have always been prevalent within
my mind. And although that you know most of your listeners won't know at
the moment, most of your thoughts on this, But when you were in
the presence of this gray and he spoke to you meta effectly, as though
you know, it was just and that really chilled I remember the first time
you I read it and you told me it chilled my bones. Did was
did you recognize the gray? Did you feel like you recognized it at all?
In any way? Well, they all kind of look the same,
but they have they have different You can tell what them apart. Usually if
and I thought, I think this one had been dealing with me for many,
many, many many years, It's possible a different one dealt with me
sometimes, because I think that happens sometimes, especially if you're away from home,
you kind of get a different crew they choose interact with you. Because
I don't know how they do this. I don't know how it works.
Because they've got an extremely sophisticated system, and sometimes people are a thousands of
miles away from their home, you know, if they're on a holiday or
business trip, and the ones they deal with the abductees who have fairly intact
memories or say that the team that they've dealt with on that occasion was different
to the usual crew. So there's a way that they have picking you up
if they could. They can recognize adulties. And it's it's it's a program
which I go into a not very deeply, but but an enough depth to
give the reader enough enough food for thoughts. That that's what it is.
It's a program. They're planning something, and it's a it's got a beginning,
a middle, and an end. Yes. Yes. So the other
question we won't go into to too much detail because of course you needed your
listeners to buy this amazing book. But with regards to this program and with
regards to these grades, I mean, do you think and it's a hypothetical
question here is Steve, do you do you think that they're in some way
immortal? Is that a question we can ask, It's the question you can
ask. It's very difficult to answer. I think it's they're probably not immortal.
That's my feelings they have they have a lifespan like organic life, but
I think it's quite long, because this one seems to know, seemed to
have no my great grandmother born in eighteen seventy three, because he puts images
in my mind of her when she was younger. My grandmother was born in
nineteen hundred and eights, and he put images of these when there were young
women, teenagers or young women, and I knew immediately it was them,
even though I didn't know what my grandmother, great grandmother looked like in eighteen
seventy three, and you know, I didn't have any photographs of us still
two. She was, you know, a fairly mature adult. But I
knew that they they these images of these women were my ancestors. And so
he's got that information in his memory from somewhere. The obvious thing is because
he was dealing with them. Yeah, it's like a doctor. It's it's
rather like they are, to put it crudely, like finding cabinets, say,
there are an akeshic record of you, and I am extremely good analogy.
Yes, yeah, And also of course it makes sense even though because
we wouldn't know what our grandmother looked like when she was a young child or
teenager. So this was accompanied by it from him knowing to you. So
it's like they just it's like, yeah, you get what I mean.
It's like a foul that's downloaded. Oh that said, that's your grandma,
that's your great grandma. You know when you say those pictures, you know
instantly, So he is part of that. He is evidently, you know,
integral in that. And it's like it's quite chilling when he says,
oh, you know, it's so you won't be remember this. This is
what really haunts me, is because like a doctor just peering into your eye
and saying, oh, well, we'll let you know anyway, because you're
going to Eucali, forget it anywhere you're not going to know. It's quite
chiming. Actually, before I wrote the book, i'd it's kind of a
long story of my journey, but it's not really the book is really about
me. It was it's about how abductees can recognize that they're in this program,
and as a whole chatter on that and a lot of another big chunk
of another chatter as well, and then I dive into an analysis of what
the program is really about. And then i'd give evidence for the medical and
forensic and scientific analysis of various things that over the years I've accumulated, like
I've got a bodily scarring, which a lot of abductees but not all adoptees
tend to have so and I had a scoopmark scar on my right shoulder behind
my right shoulder that my woman is now my wife found We weren't married at
the time, but were living together in a two thousand and eight. In
August two thousand and eight, she found it when I got out of the
shower and she said, pointed to it, stays, Steve, that thing
on your shoulder is one of those scoop mark things which I've seen in books
about alien abductions, and you've got one, and i'd never Obviously, they
tend to make these cuts and decisions where they in places on the body where
the aboltee won't necessarily see them, like the behind the calves or behind the
thighs or behind the shoulders is the favorite places because they can't see them.
Sometimes they're in more obvious places, but they're never or I've never known an
instance of one on the face or on obviously, on the hands or somewhere
where where the avolitee can see them really use. Yes, I devote a
chapter to the analysis of the implants, where they put them, and how
we know that that and the forensic evidence for this. And I devote a
lot of time to a specific implant which was removed from a patient by Dr
Rogerlio, who some of your audience may know of. He died in twenty
fourteen, unfortunately, but between nineteen ninety five and twenty fourteen, that's nineteen
years he took eighteen He removed eighteen implants from abductees. One of them proved
to be prosaic, just a piece of glass at tiny, tiny piece of
glass, and the other the other audi others were exhostic. And I developed
quite a lot of time to the analysis of these things in the book,
and I put it produced quite a lot of data from the materials analysis from
a laborator in California, the materials laboratory analysis of California, which has not
really seen the light of the day. Although the materials analysis a guy called
Steve Colburn, and he doesn't he didn't disguise the fact that he had been
involved in the analysis of this particular object, but he's not really publicized that
much. I brought it to public attention. There's also analysis of some hairs
which we found. Yeah, we had an abduction events in twenty fifteen fifteen
and sixteen fifteen in my half inch house late in the evening when when my
wife was upstairs asleep because she went to better but earlier than me. And
on that occasion I did remember the I had dim memory of the the two
abductors entering the house through through the glass doors and the garden doors. And
the following day my wife found a hair under the dining room table and a
second hair on the patio just outside the doors, and they seemed to be
identical, and they were both white and seemed to be sustained with a blue
pigments, and they definitely didn't belong to us because of our hairs, you
know. Complete my hair at the time was red, and she was a
red head Irish woman anyway, and she was a lot younger than me,
so she had no gray hairs. I did if you have a few,
but you wouldn't have any blue. So we got these hairs. We realized
there might be important. We put them in a a ziplock freezer bag,
and she hid them somewhere where I wouldn't know where they were. The reason
being she thinks that the abductors can read your mind, which I know they
can do, and they find them, and if they if they were doing
a mind scamp procedure, they'd find them, or certainly there was a risk
they be discovered it. So she hidden them, hid them somewhere where they
wouldn't find them, and I wouldn't find them. I wouldn't know where they
were. So eventually they ended up in a laboratory in Illinois, well LLC,
which is a forensic analysis lab in Illinois, and someone else I didn't
don't really talk about this in the book with someone else paid for the analysis.
Somebody was very interested in in the results stumped up the cost for it.
And there was second abducts in California who had found a long hair following
an abduction events, and she remembered, she claims to remember it exactly how
she acquired it. She remembers that the circumstances really very precisely. So the
third appendix in this series of four is about the analysis of all these hairs,
and the results are quite surprising. Yes, you's get those results.
And I think, to be honest with you, you know, there have
been cases, most notably where abductees have actually, you know, been out
in a bookstore and looked around and there are some kind of strange being that
seems to be represented in a false human suit, i e. Wearing a
a wig and wearing sunglasses. I know that with Terry Lovelace Esquire, he
also had this experience with this gray but almost like a hybrid that seemed to
be wearing this this false hair sunglasses. Gave her a name, didn't he?
Yes? Was it Betty? I'm sure I think it was. Yes,
it was. And you know, I think he killed her Betty because
she reminded him of Betty Rubble in the Flint Stones, because of her hair
do for the wig, you know. But I think this is really incredible,
Steve, because not only have you been an abductee, and you've worked
so hard to bring not just your experiences to the table, which I think
are amiable because you know, you know, dealing with the subject matter on
a theoretical level and a research level and bringing evidence to the table, but
also bringing into the phray your experiences is very brave, indeed, but the
way that your book has been written is extremely amazing, beautifully written, it
is, and articulate. I have to use the word as well, articulately
done. The other thing that I feel about these grays, you know,
I keep going back to these grays as you do, and we all do,
because we're all asking the question, you know, about their modus operandi
or their origins. So, do you think it's possible, Steve, that
this intelligence, whatever it is, whatever behind the mask? You know,
do you think that these smaller grays are a creation from the taller grays?
What's your idea about that? Yeah, I think the instigations of the program
are not to the gray aliens very often, well, I don't know how
often this happens, but there's a lot of abductees reports dealing with different types
of entities, some of them are reptilian like, and I discuss in a
final chapter what the why they why people see reptilians and why why I believe
that they involved and they're involved in the abduction and how that how that happens
and who and who are what they are? But one of the one of
the entities that abduptsies often describe as a creature like a big praying mantis,
re thin and spindley and with a head like a praying mantis, and they
are between seven and eight feet tall, and they they abduptees report them as
being having the very strongest degree of mental control over them, and they invade
their minds straight away, and they take possession of everything they're thinking. And
these there's usually just one involved in an events. There's never a room full
of them. There's just one of these creatures. And they they are often
reported to have very lengthy and deep dialogues with an abduptcy in which the adbutcy
can't hide anything from them, and they can sometimes dump huge amounts of information
in the abdupsey's mind who they then take hours or days to process that afterwards.
But these these mountis like beings have been reported for decades, and they're
not ubiquitously. They're not always reported to viabilities, but they're reported often enough
for them to be are definitely a thing because people who don't know each other
always always report them. You know that that they encounter these these creatures I
suspect, but do not know and cannot know that they are the instigators of
the program. And I suspect that the gray aliens are created by these this
racid beings from genetic material, their own genetic material and human genetic material.
And so I think there's some sort of hybrid creation designed to prosecute the abduction
program and do the everyday grunt work. Yeah, it would show that they
are masters of genetic I mean, they seem to absolutely know what they're doing
with our genetic sciences only by one hundred years old, you know, since
since genetics were first discovered. If you had been involved in this for a
million years, say, which is a fraction at the time, you know
that the at the universe has been has been with us. You know,
you can you can barely imagine what the abilities would be and what sophistication of
science might be. It's interesting as well that, you know, when when
you're saying that Steve, it's that the universe itself. I mean we've discovered
recently by the wonderful James web Space Telescope that they're now scratching their heads about
the big band. They're not so sure now and and all credit to the
scientists, and you know they're trying. We're trying to work out where we
are on what we're in. So imagine these creatures are put put it politely,
but I would think they were being so much better versed with the universe,
because they might understand it much better than our It's just that they don't
consider that to be mainframe when they're abducting us. It's like we are their
complete focus, or the people like your souls. The abductees are their focused
that's their job. They're not going to impart the scientific data to you.
They are going to impart universal knowledge. It's just that that's one thing that
terrifies me about this is that their focused soul. It's like tunnel vision,
you know, the subjects you are this is part of our project, like
in a lab. You know, they're not going to tell you what else
is going on behind the scenes. They're just concentrating on this. But this
is interesting because what on earth are they ultimately aspiring too? That is the
question why the generations. Yeah, it's very difficult to know, yes,
with any certainty that any of this that what you'd have to do is just
go on the evidence of what what abductees report happens to them. Yes,
yes, and you've got you can't be certain of anything, but we can
be fairly sure things that get repeatedly reported by a large numbers of adoptcies through
various populations at the time that the SI yeah, yeah, I said.
It's also with the genuine cases of abductions, the more they smash them,
the more they, as you rightly said, they can learn. I mean,
sometimes they might slip up. Let's hope. Sure there are surprisingly that
there's a few abduction cases where there seems to have made small errors and it's
those errors that have brought the case. It's to public attention because like in
the in the Witness case and in Manhattan the Brooklyn Bridge and sometimes the bridgebduction.
I when I was in during my time, Hawkinsley show me all the
correspondents that the the witnesses sent to him, and he'd he got twenty plus
letters. This was in nineteen eighty nine, was before the internet was a
thing, or it was very embryonic in those days. People still didn't have
email in the eighty nine and the inlitious road letters and these some and there
are all these witnesses who were usually in the car and driving cars and stopped
at two or three o'clock in the morning, which when this incident was a
witness. They're all there are all all their accounts corroborate each other, and
none of them knew each other. But those of your audiences who don't are
not not familiar with this place. With this case, the abductacy was seen
emerging in from the side of an apartment building on the Brooklyn Bridge, on
the Manhattan side of the Brooklyn Bridge, and a company by three small grades,
and several witnesses wrote that Bud Hopkins was after he published his book as
saying they were there and they saw this happen, and they thought a movie
was being made, and this was a kind of pologram or special effests,
and they were just seeing it in the middle of the night, and it
was amazing, and they didn't realize it was anything real. You know,
if if there was a Hollywood movie in the making and they had an influential
gentleman in the car, there wasn't a second general, Yes, as the
Secretary General of the United of Nations, who at the time was a heavier
Paris to Quaire. He's died recently, but he lived to ninety nine years
old and he died recently and he was proving by origin. But I know
what you mean by that, sorry from truck Steve, because they're these aliens
are in full daylight, well at night, beaming this woman up, taking
her. She was a fatal position, taking her up into their ship in
front of everyone. I mean, it's it begs belief, but there must
be some there must be some method behind it, something they did, the
reason why they did it, because they're not stupid. They're not stupid at
all, you know Dave Jacobs, who I've got over, it's really well.
Yes. Also, obviously it was very close to this case. He
didn't investigate it like Bud Hoppies didn't the investigation, but Budden and Dave used
to work together very closely and confine each other, and Dave thinks it was
a mistake. They didn't mean the aliens didn't intend to be seen. But
I think there's strong evidence on the other side of that that they did intend
to be seen on this occasion. But we really don't know whether there's an
error or could have been sometimes. I mean, you know, it's something
that people maybe laugh when they say when we hear about the old cases of
the crashes, Roswell being a prime example. Sometimes they might well, do
pilots crash their planes? The most sophisticated tech can crash. It could be
a million or a billion variables, you know, but these things still happen.
So, yes, who's to say that it might have been a mistake
on their part? Yes, extremely topical at the moment because of the congressional
hearings. Oh yes, yes, yes, we don't comment on that.
Comment on one of the questions i'd ask is this is interesting because as a
human species we are, you know, we have a very limited version about
our genus of where we really came from and how we developed. You've got
the religious interpretation of the scientific interpretation. Both are osters one at one another.
I'm sure there could be an infusion of both. They're brought together on
a different level of understanding, but with a lot of the elements of what
we call the paranormal in terms of like psychic connections, mediums or so with
their death experience and alien abductions and also with crypt zoology. Communication is normally
achieved through this mental transference for a better word, telepathy. We are the
only species that cannot perform successfully this task of reading someone else's mind or knowing
what's going on in one person to another. So it's interesting I think that
these Grays appear fascinated by not only our genealogy or what makes us tick,
but also about this whole thing of memory. I think I think this is
important as well. I mean, you know, what is it that you
think, Steve, that they are in a roundabout way? After? What
do you think they're looking for? They could have created that? Well,
I'm just asking Steve the question. I know you'll know if you read you
read the Final Chester out of time do speculate a little bit about this,
But I think there is evidence that they've they've been I think a hybrid race
which are look one hundred percent human, but there's a small amount in them
that there's a small something in them in there they have Mentally, they seem
to have the abilities, especially when they're in groups, they seem to have
some abilities to control humans and to make them think things that they want them
to think. And as an example, you know, I was talking to
one one out to see says. He told me he was in a in
a store and the the hybrid that he was with took an item of clothing
and just walked out with it. And what he what he was given to
understand, was that he just made the security cameras for some reason not working
this in this area and for the shop staff to think, are that's okay,
you can do that, and then devot their attention to something else.
So they have they seem to demonstrate the ability to change human perception and to
control what they consider to be important or what they consider to be of noteworthy,
and they can control you it to that degree. A lot of adruptees
say when they deal with these hybrid humans that they are anxious about the propensity
for humans and human society to be violent, and they are very anxious about
that, and they take measures to guard against being harmed by that, so
that a lot of the way they organize is to neutralize or pacify humans mentally
so that they cannot be violent. The threat of this is removed. So
you know, we might we might consider that to be quite a useful faculty
to have in ourselves that in all circumstances, you know, all the time,
but that they they definitely are, they definitely have been creating a hybrid
race and it is Back in the nineteen seventies nineteen eighties, people abducts thees
used to report that they saw when they were abducted. They saw tanks of
little cylindrical tanks of with fetuses in on an embryos and growing in in and
just stating in a fluid tank with a with a umbilical cord attached. And
at some point they're quote born and quotes and they become become toddlers and children,
and abducts sees were were always asked to play with them, or to
nurture them, or to love them and interact with them. And for some
reason, the aliens who instigates the program find I think consider this to be
very valuable that that abductees are encouraged to have emotional attachments to these these beings
little look exactly like us, but they're not exactly like us. So what
they're doing, what they're the the the intention eventually intention is I don't We
really don't know. We can say for certain that these human looking hybrids have
been reported over a wide part of the world by thousands of adductees for many
decades, that they seem to be able to have some mental control over humans
and they look exactly like us, but they're not. Yes, I think
the bonding is like school, isn't it perhaps teaching them empathy or some degree
of emotion. It could be possible, as you have stated, that when
they've reached a suitable level being human looking, they're placed down on Earth and
integrated. Yeah, they seem to be. It seemed to be important to
the integrator of the program that these beings are really nurtured in their environments and
they're introduced into the human environment at a much later stage when their loyalcy is
not cannot be questioned. Or Yes, what a marvelous way of integrate in
the midst of the world silently and quietly. And if they are I just
had a thought, you know, if they are of extrastual makeup, the
genetics a half and half, imagine the respectfully a breeding program that they eventual
DNA manipulation, and what a wonderful way to colonize a planet very quietly.
You mean, the hybrids integrating. It's only a very vague thought. It's
not it's just an idea. It's a program and anything, it's a massive
program. Yeah. I asked the question in what in a chapter at near
the end of the book called question Time. I asked how many abdications there
are in the population. I think there's evidence, scans, evidence, but
it's pray, fairly substantial in some ways. That's it's a measurable percentage of
the human population. So the addoptacy population we're talking about now, not hybrids,
and I think it's between two percent and five percent of the living human
population. So you could be talking to someone and not knowing that they are
actually a hybrid. Yeah, yeah, the hybrids. I don't know how
many hybrides there are another but it's a massive program and that's what that seems
to be a main focus of what they're doing. So, I mean,
you know that about the sperm harvesting, you know, and overharvesting, Well
you'll do your listeners will very well to understand that. Yeah. Well,
I just say, I'm just going to say that male appltudies who have sufficient
recovery of memories are very embarrassed about this, but they say that they they
sperm is taken off from them on every single occasion they're abducted, and so
you know, you ask why would they do that, because don't they know
about freezing sperm samples like r ivs clinics too. You know, there's millions
and millions of sperm in each sample, so why don't they just freeze it?
And you know the apolite alone. There's a reason they go back to
the world every time, and we can only speculate about that. But there's
there's a US behind this and there's a reason they do that. So I
wonder if it's because things are changing one other on Earth. It changes something
to them, respectfully, Yeah, it does. Something. They're testing them
to see if something they're introducing could perhaps modify this something they will speculate.
I speculate that male attitude. Well, all abdultacies are being being changed genetically
very subtly over time, and whatever whatever processes advocacy is subjects to that.
This modification takes a long times, like a whole generation and the next generation
the next generation, and we can't tell the difference. Our genetic sciencests can't
sell the difference. Obviously they're looking for that, but it might be it
might be literally or just one or two genes which you're being subtly modified,
you know, on one chromosome. We just don't know what they're doing.
But there's something that they're doing to the human genetics where you would expect because
the sperm is all newly manufactured, whereas over and not newly manufactured. There
there, there there, and then fewmale female childs are like several million at
birth and then they over just some of them, many most of them die.
But that one egg is released from one over them or the other every
twenty eight days for the whole facility period of the other woman. So whereas
the sperm is newly manufactured, and that you'd expect, if there were genetic
changes being being done to the abducty population, you'd would be able to detect
or measure that and a certain and that's maybe the reason why they have to
do that, why they choose to take a new sample every time, you
know, because that samples freshly up to date with that's do you know what
I love about this? We're all like in a way like Sherlock Holmes.
You can open up these boxes and you can deduce or deduct. But it
doesn't mean to say that's right, but it's good that I know what I
love about you. You open up all these boxes, Steve like us,
and we look at them and think, well, can it or can it?
Can it not? It's only way we can try and figure this out,
rather like a jigsaw puzzle, putting the pieces together. I mean,
we're probably at a far cry from what they are doing, but my goodness,
your people, like yourself, were given it, your best shot and
qualified enough to actually do so. I want to ask you a question,
Steve, do you believe that they are When I say they, I mean
these grays, these aliens will not necessarily the grays, but the force,
the intelligence behind the masking of what's going on. Do you think they have
our interests at heart or do you think they're here only for their own agenda.
That's almost impossible to answer, I understood. I don't think they're doing
it exclusively for us. No, I think they're doing it for their own
purposes. But I'm from what I get, from what I can pick up,
I think they sincerely believe, maybe with good cause, that we are
going to benefit from this in ways that they see would be beneficial to us
in the long term. Yes, yes, in the long term. Yeah.
Look at they look at here. You know, the way the humans
organize their societies, and they see chaos and yeah really so, yeah,
I don't understand either, Steve, that you know, within our culture and
our society, you know, people want to state the unobvious that we are
a violence species, that you know, we have so much to change within
ourselves and within the world. And it makes me laugh, you know,
because you know, with this denial of the UFO phenomena, and yeah,
you know, you just stand and you you just to observe a tiny portion
of what we call space. So we don't even understand. And I've never
been able to get my head around the fact to say, well, what
is your problem in not accepting the idea? But there's alldoctrination. Yeah,
I be govertized into getting up and you're owning money, paying tax and living
as long as you can. And that leads me on to my next question.
I'm going to ask Steve, where do you think, Steve, they
are coming from? Where do you think they're hanging out? Are they in
the bar down your own or I Actually I've never really, I've never really
giden that much source in those terms. What are your ideas about that?
Well, I have this idea there's two that there's possible and it's they're nothing
though, one is that they we know they're here already, that there is
question that they are beneath the surface of the world, under the oceans,
which would which would make sense because they'll be areas that they can't be got
at. I think in terms of like caves and caverns, they're quite they
you know, earthquakes well live in style, I should actually or there is
what they call the interdimensional hypothesis, which is I think more in line with
because the only way that we know that well, I can't state categorically that
we you know, but the way that the objects came. The last viewing
of our UFOs, which were spectacular and very at low arrange, the area
around us was like a bubble. So it kind of like was a feeling
that the energy or the intelligences had somehow altered and not so much as time,
but the space around where it was thrown in. Yeah, it like
it. Like, so I think that it's possible that you know, some
scientists I've heard saying it's impossible, Well, they're fools, because science changes.
It does. Yeah, it's modified according to what needed to what's in
discovered in it. Yes, it's the interdimentional hypothsis does explain a lot of
things that I'm not sure scientifically we know we understand that very I mean we
don't. We don't understand no more than communicating with those on the other side
that operate on a completely different frequency or vibration that can sometimes occasionally be matched
by the individual. So I think that there are that we hear of these
stories of ending it had experience, and people have these amazing experiences, and
they are in a world that's more real to them that no one else can
see. And I think that perhaps these entities are able to interlock into our
reality and do much the same thing, but on a completely different level.
I was just adding that, you know, I saw recently this Congress referring
to these crash disks putting the other side apart basically with the technology of this.
It absolutely staggered me to believe that they think they could back engineer these
things, because we're talking about two completely alien worlds. Will give it that
definition so we can understand it. A technology that is so advanced, and
this is you see, I know why people are doing it. They're knocking
the people who suspect as I do with those at Congress of a gentleman who's
the whistleblower, I do admire him very much, admire I think. I
think he's trying to bring out the truth as well as the journalist. Brilliant
man, wonderful man. But the thing is that I agree with them.
I don't think this tech would be easy to back engineer because it would be
rather like with all due respect to Caveman discovering a transistor radio or your cell
phone. It's just it's just these ideas. But the people who argue this
and say they have is because they don't want egg on their face, so
ego comes into it. They can't be proved wrong, as the Ross Walship
people are stating, matter of factory that it didn't happen because they published books
on it. And of course they're saying where it's a proof, well there
was a There is no proof at the moment. This is the whole point.
They're pushing for proof. The Congress cannot give proof until they have permission
or they have insights into it where they can open this up. They have
to wave for this for photographs and documentations to come out. I think this
is the thing with you of a community. It is very ugly because in
a sense, it is very unhappy because you have the diversity that is absolutely
magnified beyond any shadow of a doubt. You mentioned anything online anything, If
I put a comment on them, my goodness, you will get one,
two, three who will completely attack you. They know all the answers.
Nobody knows anything but people as yourself. You're qualified to answer these because you've
had first had experience with them them and I think that's admirable of you coming
out and publishing this wonderful book and ladies and gentlemen, it's beautifully written,
so well researched, beautifully researched, and Steve has taken a lot of time
to write it. Actually I called him, I made him love. I
called him a perfectionist, Yeah, perfectionist. Yeah, yes, it's it's
been very thoroughly edited, and it's a feather in your cap. Wonder,
it's a feather in your cap. So we are coming to the end of
the program. I can't believe how quickly an hour goes. But I just
have to say Steve that it's been an honor to have you on our show,
and we will have you back on at some point in time, not
out of time, hopefully. I think that that title is so out of
time it's beautiful. I'm just going to give the book title out of Time
the intergenerational Abduction program explored by Steve Aspen. Steve Aspen has met with some
of the finest minds within your pharmacy, and I have to tell you,
ladies and gentlemen, his book is first to class and when I read it,
I have to say it was like Communion when that came out. I
mean, this book is but so much more involved in the scientific, more
scientific, specially with the implument you have. I tried to plant and tell
a story that would engage people. Also, it's important that to just make
the point that I was writing for a certain kind of audience that like,
I've worked in them in surgery and medical diagnostics for decades of my life,
and I've met hundreds, maybe thousands of surgeons that I worked with, and
consultant physicians and humisologists and semples, and I know the way this population thinks,
and a lot of them are really quite open minded if forensic, scientific
medical evidence about something is presented, So what I wanted to do that They're
pretty much dismissive of the paranormal in general, because you know, they don't
really haven't seen the evidence for it, and they they're so busy, you
know, they that they can't you know, they're so caught up in their
in their responsibilities. So I wanted something that would appeal to that particular sector
of the reading public where the the forensic, medical, scientific evidence is going
to grab them, to impress them to the degree that they might actually take
it seriously and think, yeah, this could be true for let's talk about
that. And I think that your doctors in higher places may not have seen
you, or they could have seen you writing this book, and there could
be one of them now fingering through its pages. Some of them will recognize
me from the photograph and know who I am. But I never went I
never went there with this subject asshold during my professional life. I just kept
it. Yeah, like like you know, they have a secret life.
You know. Well, it's a good job that you have brought it forward,
because you're bringing a whole news stance to the subject matter. Attitudes are
changing and a change and it's a valuables. This something on with the US
Congress and David Grush and all the other you know witnesses and is opening up
the make it a more serious and credible thing. But question and the book
will be on generously on twenty fourth four of us which it will be in
hardcover, a classy hardcover with one oh five fridges and pages and color illustrations,
and a paperback which shall be half prices are cover with great scale illustrations,
and an ebook and they will all appear around about the same time,
around about the twenty fourth War was in high street bookshops and online from Amazon,
Waterstones and on these retail a lists, so you'll be able to get
it anywhere. Congress elections for that yes, so that is amazing and lessen
and do you have a website as well, and you've got out of Time
book dot info wonderful. So that's out of Time Book dot info. So
if you go to that web page, you'll see how you can how you
can order it. Well, we'll get that information on the platform when your
show airs. And we just want to say a big thank you to Steve
for taking the time out. A remarkable man, a remarkable book, and
I'm telling you that book is just going to fly off the shelves. When
it comes back, because every single person interested in your apology, and even
researchers should have that problems has been given glittering reviews. Yeah, from esteemed
colleagues in the UFO field, New fun as well, members of that I
believe. Well, yes, but thank you very much, Steve. It's
been a pleasure having you on. Thank you guys, fantastic. Yeah,
see you next time. Yes, yeah, and you've been You've been listening
to Twin Souls in association with a panel UK Radio network. Your host,
Philip I Look and seller are esteemed guests. Steve Aspin, author of Out
of Time, the intergenerational Abduction program, explored go out and buy it.
You will not be disappointed. Us in