We'll come Bend podcast podcasting day. They're talking Welcome to Movie Film. In
this episode two hundred and sixty three, we are in the middle of February
or middle Ish. I am, Zachie Hassan, Brian Hall. Are you
here, I'm here. It's it has been touch and go. Yeah.
Usually it's the end of the year with the holidays and everything where things get
kind of sticky. But it's kind of funny how at the beginning of this
year usually sort of the you know, the early dulgrums of the year,
we're uh, yeah, we're finding it hard hard to find time to get
together and do this, but we did today. People listening are going to
be like again with that, you know what I mean? I know,
but but I kid you not. I mean, for the last couple of
days, it felt like you and I After Brian new degree, it's like
we are we are in the cockpit on the launch pad. We're strapped in
and we're just waiting for Mission Control to give the go and then they're like,
hey, there's a weather pattern coming in and we scrub the launch.
That is really how it feels, honestly, I mean, obviously, these
are life things that in this metaphor with the weather, but like that is
so what it is. It's like on the calendar, like anticipating in at
three and then I'm like, Zaggie, how's tomorrow for you? You know?
So this is now our really our third time trying to make this happen.
Yeah, yeah, but here we are, we're doing it. I'm
just happy we're here. I know it's going to happen. I always wish
it would it would happen on time or you know, more frequently, but
as long as it happens at all, I'm happy. Well, we'll talk
to me. I mean, what have you been up to? Well?
I uh, in terms of things I've been watching. I you know,
it's funny. I started Yellowstone because we had been talking about that. Oh
yeah, and I enjoyed it. I saw the pilot. My brother and
his girlfriend actually sat me down. When they watch it, they put on
cowboy hats and put toothpicks in their mouths. They're they're doing the full cosplay.
Yes. So they invited me over. They made me dinner, and
then they handed me a toothpick and they're like, we're showing you Yellowstone.
I was like, ah, so you know, and and I was like,
got it, Like I I like the vibe, I liked the setting.
And then I kind of got derailed because Ryan Johnson's murder Colombo mystery thing,
you know, pesstiche poker Face dropped on Peacock, and out of curiosity,
I checked it out. Oh well, I should say I have a
friend that worked on it, and so I've been seeing tweets or Instagram posts
and stuff from her for the past couple of months. So I just wanted
to say I watched it, and what I really liked about it was it's
just one and done, like it's just a mystery in episode. And so
it kind of derailed Yellowstone because then I found myself like, oh well,
yeah, I saw that that was satisfying, Like I'm done for the night.
And then the next night I thought, well, I could do Yellowstone.
What happened in the last episode, what's you know? I could do
poker Face, you know, And so I've That's what I've been doing is
I just started binging through poker Face and I I'm not quite caught up yet,
but I'm enjoying it. It goes back to like I said, the
Columbo seventies kind of you know, person gets dropped into some sort of murder
mystery thing and then is kind of clever, and then you know, the
people are like, I don't like this person snooping around. They're gonna figure
me out. And then you know, she plays a little aloof and sort
of the oh yeah, just one more thing, kind of you know,
VI, I should say, Brian, I know, for you cable TV
watching types such as you, it may not be aware, but on network
television they have lots of one and done this. I had this thought.
Actually I realized, I don't know if it was the Grammys or something,
because I do have YouTube TV, and I mean, which is basically cable
with another name, and I was flipping channels. Usually what I do is
I go straight to like TBS T and t HBO just kind of look around
there for like a movie or something, and the Grammys were on, and
it occurred to me how little attention I pay to, yeah, like network
television, Like I didn't even know the Grammys were on. I didn't know.
I don't know what like Chicago PD is, you know, like and
it's probably if poker face is you know, indicative of anything, it's probably
you know, I would enjoy these things or like getting into I know you're
a huge fan of law and order. You know there's all a billion of
those. I could be, you know, watching and kind of enjoying,
and there's low commitment room required in that vain Law and Order Criminal Intent was
essentially this style because it was Vincent Denofrio as a quirky detective Kurt Nah who
just won more things as way into yes, solving the murders every week.
Yeah, and in this one, you know, uh, Natasha Leone who
plays the main character, she has like a quirk, right, So her
her sort of superpower is she knows when people are lying pretty much without fail
so exactly. I mean well in that vein right, like she has a
tick or something that sort of gives her, like I say, a superpower.
But what's interesting is she won't always she doesn't know why you're lying,
so like she'll be speaking with someone and they're not telling the truth. So
then she's got to figure out, okay, well this is I know,
this is hinky, So now I've got to like work around this sort of
area. And what's that mean Brian Hinky about bullshit? Sam? Hey,
I made up for the off air. I missed a future of reference.
This is all we do, folks. We just have fugitive call and response.
I just real quick, I should I should mention this because because we've
been talking about the Fugitive a lot recently. I was watching it was on
TV, and it was it was the point where you know, um uh
Sam, you know, the the ID he pulls it up and he's like
this mondo, you know, and I was explaining the boys, yeah exactly.
I was explaining it. I was like, I can text Uncle Brian,
this Jo Louis, and I will get back where are you at this
mondo? And I was like, if if that text exchange was uncovered,
like that's the only evidence of us, people would be like what in the
world. You know? Yeah, yeah, but we know we know,
um poker face, I recommend it, you know. I It had this
funny thing where when the pilot started, I thought it was going to be
a little snappier than it was, and so I was like, oh,
interesting, like I'm kind of choosing to keep going with this rather than getting
lost in it. And then the thing is is the acting is so good
that that's what really begins to captivate you. And by the end I was
like, oh, let's do another one. And then the next one started
and I kind of the same I was like, Okay, yeah, no,
I'm choosing. I'm choosing this, and then by the end, I
was like, oh, let's do another one. So that was kind of
the effect it was having on me. And you know, another interesting thing
too about it is you spend time with the victim and whatever characters in their
orbit for almost like fifteen minutes before leone even comes into the story. So
it's kind of sometimes I'll find myself watching the story present itself and I'm ten
minutes in and I'm like, well, now I know these people. I
don't want any of them to die. You know, it really invests you
in those people, I think, versus showing up and then they're sort of
a corpse, and it's like, all right, let's talk to the people
they know. Are they new? You know? Um, I don't know.
I'd be curious if you check it out. I'm hoping to at some
point, but but unlike you, I am working my way through Yellowstone,
so yes, which I will get to next. So how far into that
are you? Two episodes? Oh? Snap, Okay, not not far.
Yeah, I mean it's definitely you know, some I think on on
Saturday Night Live, somebody described it as succession but outside sure which that that
really is what Yellowstone is, you know? Um, but I yeah,
I've been watching it with my wife and it's definitely like really like just the
worst family. Like you would never want to be part of this family,
right right, you know, and you're like, God, if this is
what money does to people, goddamn you know, right. But that said,
you know, I've said to you, you may find the prequels and
easier on ramp. Yeah, you've mentioned this, So maybe I should be
heating your advice because I I think there's nothing there's nothing in the prequel shows
that, at least thus far, that lives or dies on fore knowledge of
what comes in Yellowstone. So I think you'd be good with those. It's
just like, oh, okay, this is this is my entry into this
universe, and then I can see where they're at, you know, one
hundred years later, right right, Okay, Okay, perhaps I will do
that. I have two poker faces to go and then maybe I'll return to
Montana. Well, and I mean, speaking of Yellowstone and I don't know
if you saw the news most recently. I mean, this is this is
the most popular show on television based on just like the number of viewers.
And yeah, it's weird how and maybe this is because I live in the
Bay Area. Like I've yet to meet anyone in person who actually watches it.
Yes, same like it this is a new thing. I mean it's
been around for what four seasons or something, and it's like you say,
it's the hugest thing. Yeah, yeah, And I'm just like my brother
just got into it, you know. And I actually I reconnected with a
friend from high school recently and they were talking about it, and I was
like, this is the first conversation I'm having about Yeowstone with anybody. So
yeah, it's it's kind of interesting. It's well, Kevin Costner stars on
the show, and he I mean, that was a big deal from doing
this show. And I would say probably that's what you know, got got
a lot of eyeballs initially. Now he wants to he wants to leave.
He has this like eighteen hour western that he's directing. Right, you know,
I knew it was like a film or is It's like, no,
it's like a movie. It's gonna be ridiculously long, though, and so
that's what he wants to do, and he wants to focus on that.
So he now apparently his contract with the Yellow Stoe to something like he films
sixty five days out of the year, which I don't know, seems kind
of kind of like a sweet gig to me. I mean, yeah,
if he why not have that that going, you know, like and then
and then yeah, make your patching project on the side or you know,
in the other days. Yeah, And and so I think that And and
by the way, I mean, Constner's pulling down like twenty million dollars a
season off this show, wow, not including his producer fee, So that
means he owns a piece of it, right wow. So like he's doing
okay. But but I think maybe he's just had enough. Maybe the series
life isn't for him, you know. And that's true. I mean,
maybe he's not used to playing a character the same character for you know,
years and years, and he's like, Okay, I did what I want
to do with this, and now I'm ready for something different. Possibly yeah.
So but of course the problem is that Yellowstone is the hub of like
what is now a major franchise, and so if he's like, hey,
peace out, well that could conceivably take the show with him, you know.
And I wonder if there's something too about it being active that makes it
a somehow still more of a draw, because if it just ended, maybe
people would be like, oh, well that was a thing that happened,
and they won't feel as compelled to come to it. I don't know,
Oh yeah, yeah, it could be right, yeah, yeah, Well
isn't there to talk about Matthew McConaughey coming on? And it's sort of pivoting
a little bit into well that's I mean, what they haven't said is what
a McConaughey lad show would be. So is it another prequel? Is it
a sequel? What happens to Costner's character who is the patriarch of the family?
You know, I think this is just me. I think that if
you're going to do something with McConaughey, which I can easily see him in
this universe, sure it should not be Yellowstone. It should be something else,
even if I to me, I think Yellowstone is the Kevin Costner story,
right, So that's I you know, I wonder like, is he
just angling for a raise, m maybe you know which. To me,
it's like, look, man, I you know, we love Kevin Costner,
sure so, you know, but but I'm like, look his this
show has given him visibility at this stage of his life that he simply did
not have in the movies. Right, Well, in twenty million for sixty
five days, when many blockbusters take more than sixty five days to make,
I mean that's you know, nothing to sniffet. Yeah, and and I
mean for a lot of the episodes, it doesn't it involves him like sitting
at a table and you know, glowering angrily. You know, so I'm
curious. I mean, it's definitely a story that as soon as it dropped,
there was a portion of the TV watching audience that just you know,
screamed heavenward. And then the other portion is like the who's doing what to
what now? Because it's not even on their radar? Right? You know?
Do you remember a couple on SNL just now, the Pedro Pescal episode
they had like the movie, Yeah, tell me you didn't relate to that
sketch? It was you know, it was amazing. Is they did stump
me? Right? I mean, well, the premise is like Hollywood trivia,
right, and so they'll be like, you know, the nineteen eighties
or the nineteen forties, or is something that like everyone can kind of answer,
like Wizard of Oz or you know, name this movie about this,
and then they're like, oh, let's talk about the twenty twenties. And
it was something like this, you know, Prestige series on I don't know
what streamer, you know, stars Nicole Kidman and she won an award for
it, and people they're like, I, I don't know, and they're
like Roar. It was called Roar and no one's heard of it, and
I'm like, I've never heard of it. And the joke being there's just
so much fragmented TV and entertainment out there now. It's like, I don't
know, there's probably a lot of people won't even know the majority of what's
going on except for what's directly in front of them or what they're choosing to
watch it. Really, I you know, maybe I sound like a grumpy
grandpa here, but this continual fragmenting makes me very sad because it's robbing us
of a shared language, the pop culture language, and conflicted because I agree
with you and at the same time I got to watch him a Grooger TV
series, you know, and like there is just the fact that this movie
that I don't even think made ten million dollars at the box office, but
that I love, actually got a series made because Peacock was like, well
we need something at six thirty. You know. I mean that makes no
sense, but you know what I'm saying. Um, so it's it's kind
of cool in some ways. And and also you get something like a squid
game, Like Squid Game would have never been put in front of us without
this landscape, and somehow that did become one big thing everyone was talking about
at a minute. But that's that's one of the rare big things that everyone
right, like true, true, Like I guess that's that's kind of like
it's like using Yellowstone as an example, right, this is again it's a
hugely successful show. It's very expansive, and it's a prestige production, and
yet probably more than half of like the TV watching audience has no concept of
it. Yeah, And I contrast that with Dallas sure sure, which,
being honest, Yellowstone is just twenty twenties Dallas. Yeah, I don't say
that as a negative because yeah, yeah, as you know, Brian,
I am a fan of Dallas. But in the eighties, even if you
didn't watch Dallas, I'm gonna assume you didn't watch Dallas. I didn't watch
Dallas in the eighties, but we were aware of it. We knew it,
we knew the shorthand I could joke with you right now about who shot
JR. Exactly and I don't even half know what that means. I just
know what it is. Yeah, And so the fact that everything has gotten
so fragmented that it makes me sad only in that sense that that pop culture
was a language that connected people, it connected generations, and those threads are
being cut, and that is you know, that's disappointing. Yeah, I
no, I agree, I agree. I wish there was yeah or or
I mean there are the big tent pole thing that everybody sees either because they
love them, word of obligation, I mean, you know, like Marvel
and whatnot. But it's like, yeah, sort of those lists. Yeah,
yeah, the one I'm trying to think of unlikely as the wrong word,
but something that would be less likely to happen today that like we were
in the nineties. I mean like I don't know what's The Fugitive is kind
of an example, like even though we joke about how it hasn't quite lived
on necessarily in like the uh you know, the quoting vernacular for people,
but like that was a big movie at the time, you know, like
a big I'm sure it made like a lot of money. Yeah, but
but that is unlikely to become a thing. Well. Actually there's a really
good example because again, maybe it hasn't carried over as much lately, but
the whole you know, I didn't kill my wife, I don't care,
you know, or the One Armed Man or like for a long time,
those were referenced in movies like The Mask and The Simpsons and and all sorts
of things, right, like everybody knew that stuff from that thing. But
I feel like that movie would be like, oh, yeah, there's this
movie that's like pretty good. It made like thirty million at the box office.
Maybe I'll catch it on Netflix. You know, like that feels like
what would happen to the Fugitive now? It's so true? Yeah, you
know, like it's hard to find those those multi generational things that that you
know, I've said on the show before, like my students reference friends a
lot, right, But that's a rare thing, right, right, Everything
that old, Like, I don't even hear Seinfeld references and my students,
you know, it's funny. Yeah, I guess I don't hear that as
much as like, yeah, friends or something. But I saw some sort
of graph where it was the top streamed stuff and Seinfeld was in there,
like the top ten or twelve or something, and I thought, wow,
I kind of surprises me. It's you know, a couple of weeks ago
when they had that when Jimmy Kimmel had his twentieth anniversary thing and they had
all the clips from so Liberty's were like, hey, Jimmy, you know,
congratulations whatever, right, yeah, and there's a clip of Jennifer Aniston
and um my, my uh fourth kid. He's like, who's that?
And and you know, she's like, oh, she's from Friends. That
is crazy. And I'm like, how does she know? She's five?
How does she know friends? I'm actually genuinely curious. I have no idea.
Yeah, but isn't it amazing? That is amazing? Right? I
was, by the way, real quick, and is is she you know,
you know, Elmira from from Tiny twon adventures. Oh yeah, yeah,
yeah, yeah, that's her with our cat. Oh that's so funny.
She will not leave this cat alone. That is hilarious. Does the
cat enjoy like being he's he's fine with the other ones, but he sees
her coming, he races in the opposite direct. Really, Oh no,
you know she now bear in mind, she's I mean, she's gonna be
six next month. She's she has been the baby for six months, six
six years, right, and and now suddenly she knows what it's like to
have competition. M So she's acting out in all those She literally told my
wife, she's like, you love the cat more than me. Wow.
Oh man, so that's another thing I have to deal with. Yeah,
wow, I'm calling her in. But she's older, I mean not now,
but you show her like a clip, so she's just like bunny bunny,
you know. Yeah, yeah, this thing. Yeah, anyway,
sorry you were saying, Oh no, I was just gonna say, just
speaking of all these things too, and I don't know, now we're kind
of like getting broader and broader, but just with relevancy and hanging on and
what lasts. And just as a side note, I was in like a
Target or something, and I saw the kid's clothes section and I saw a
Jurassic Park shirt, which isn't too crazy because of course, you know,
the movie came out last year, but but still I was like, wow,
that that's from like when I was, you know, thirteen or something.
And then there was a super Mario Brothers shirt, and I thought,
wow, if if like twelve year old me or something time traveled to the
future and was like, so, what's everybody into? And it's like literally
everything I like Right now, that's kind of wild. Well because they probably
could they got that movie coming out right, of course, of course,
but it's just amazing. I mean, that's the shirts I would have wanted
it as a kid, and you probably still wear them now, you're right,
right, yeah, but will I watched something else, Aki, Yes,
I checked out your pal and mine. One of our our filmmakers that
it's complicated feelings, but we can't stay away. M Knight Shamalan. I
saw a Knock at the Cabin. I kind of love how through through thicker
thin you you you got skin in the game. You're like, you know
what. M Knight's got a movie out. I'm gonna go see it.
Shamalan always has a ticket from me, always, and even when he was
on the decline, you know, for for a minute there I saw it
didn't like it was ready for the next one. Like I'm just in the
bag for this guy, and I think, I mean, look, I
love the sixth Cents, I love Unbreakable of Signs. Actually watched half of
Signs on TV the other day, and so he hooked me. And the
thing is is he has the things he's not as strong at. You know,
maybe sometimes with the script or you know, landing the plane, you
know, story wise at the end, whatever it is. But like he
is a really compelling filmmaker. I mean, he just know how to make
you want to look around a corner where he puts the camera. He knows
how to draw your eye to something or to make you feel something with a
static camera and the right edit. And that's just so darn rare these days.
You know, I love someone who has intention behind every choice in their
filmmaking, and that can absolutely be said about Shamalan. So yes, anything
he puts out, I'm in, I'm in. And even this premise looked
really dark, like I think we've talked before, like Home invasion movies kind
of get under my skin. I just find them they're so nihilistic, you
know, and just horrifying and kind of real worldye, and they just they
really creep me out. But I was like, well, what Shamalan got
to say about this? So do you have any interest in this? By
the way, I would say, enough to check it out when it hits
streaming, but not to rush after the theater to watch it. Yeah,
so bas basically to try to avoid any spoilers or whatever the IMDb description is.
While vacationing, a girl and her parents are taken hostage by armed strangers
who demand that the family make a choice to avert the apocalypse. So this
was interesting. I saw this with my brother and it's like a very Twilight
Zony kind of yarn. And at the end of the day it does get
a thumbs up from me, and I think the reason is it's a really
intriguing premise, and every minute that passed, I was like, what is
going to happen next? What is going on? And like the acting was
so good, very good, maybe some of the best acting he's had in
any of his films, which really really helped. I think with this one
in particular, the filmmaking is like on fire, the choices, you know,
the the lenses, when he's choosing certain depths of field. I mean,
it is just you know, chef's kiss. I think the thing is,
though, is when the movie's over, like the story, it's it's
logic and it's rules, just kind of you know, all the holes start
to show, the light starts to come fus. Yeah, yeah, you
know. Well, I mean credit words due, I mean like six cents
and all. I mean, like he nailed He's nailed it before, but
I think he's living having to live up to that every time since, you
know, and I think that, yeah, with this one, when you
when it was over, I looked at my brother and he was just like,
you know, I it did not It didn't land like, it didn't
add up to anything. But I have to say I enjoyed being on the
ride, and I was like, yeah, I get that, But I
think I would say I enjoyed it a little bit more because I was so
taken with the craft and with the acting and with the tension and the mystery
of it all. But I think he's absolutely right. Unfortunately, at the
end, it doesn't add up to something completely satisfying or profound, or you
just start asking questions, you know, and maybe maybe that's what he wants,
but I think there are questions that make you wonder if it was good
or not the story at least, So yeah, I would say at the
end of the day, for me, it was a successful viewing experience,
like it was worth my time, and I enjoyed seeing the artistry, and
I enjoyed being taken on the ride, and I really was tense and confused
and intrigued. But yeah, I think it's absolutely worth saying if those things
are not going to satisfy people, like if it's all gonna matter what the
culmination is at the end, which is completely understandable, I think people are
going to feel, you know, a little deflated at the end. And
I saw that it got a C Cinema score, so I mean, you
know, like the the ending, I mean, you know that's what you
walk out with. So I yeah, it's it's a hard movie to recommend,
but I think if you like his craftiness, it's a great experience.
But yes, at the end, unfortunately, you just wish it had kind
of stuck that landing or landed on something a bit more profound. You know,
what do you think of Dave Bautista in this? Oh Man? All
the acting is good in this, I mean Dave Bautista, he has a
really tricky role because the thing is is he's supposed to come in. I
mean, this isn't the trailer, so I don't feel like this is spoiling
anything. But he's saying, look, the end of the world is going
to happen unless one of you in this three person family kills someone, like
you're someone in the family. One of you has to choose someone in your
family to die so the world won't end. And the thing is is they're
not going to do it. They're not there to do it. They're just
the messengers. And what's so difficult about what he's doing is he doesn't want
this to happen, Like he just knows that the world is going to end
if it doesn't happen, and so he is racked, you know, with
pain and guilt but also conviction. I mean, it's a really really tricky
tightrope. And I think Boutissa just oh man, I mean, in his
hulking presence, but there's this sorrow and this also weird, like politeness because
he's I've got to come in, you know, soft with this because I'm
going to present you something you do not want to hear. He's fantastic.
Um, they all are. I mean, Jonathan Groff was great. This
other guy I don't know his name off top my head, but the one
who plays his husband in this, Ben Aldridge, I thought he was really
really good. Yeah, the acting is is great. So I'd be so
curious for you to see this and talk about it with you. You've got
me, Yeah, you've got me more intrigued to check it out. So
yeah, yeah, maybe maybe I will. Maybe I will go to the
AMC. And you know, I have the A list, So I'm not
going to be affected by their weird price plan to charge more for certain seats.
Let's talk about that for a minute. I mean, like, what
do you think about that? I mean, yeah, what what was zactly
talking about? If if people haven't heard this is AMC is not proposing.
I think they're just going to do this. They're going to charge different prices
for the same screening depending on where you sit. Right, So there's if
you sit in the first couple of rows that won't cost as much as the
plum seats, say, in the middle of the theater, and then everything
that's not in the quote unquote. I guess best seats of the house the
middle, depending on your preferences. But if you all the other seats will
be some sort of middle price. That's right. What do you think about
that? Well, I have a couple of thoughts. I'm on the one
day, and it's easy to be like, well, I have a list,
so it doesn't affect me. But that's sort of that, you know.
That's like, well, for then they came for these people and I
said nothing, and then you know, I feel like, wait long enough,
eventually this stuff does get back to you. I think it's dumb.
First of all, I don't think going to the movies is like on to
a concert. Yeah, right, like the fundamental Conceit is silly in my
opinion, because I don't I don't think people approach it the same thing.
However, that said, I also am sympathetic because I'm like, well,
maybe this is just another way for these places to keep the lights on,
in which case I'm not opposed to that. You know. That's yeah,
conflicted, That's how I feel. Because my theater actually closest to my place
is closing, and it's the one that you and I saw Crystal Skull at
like years ago, and yep, and it was an ARC light for years,
which I just absolutely adored the experience there, and then it turned into
a regal, which, you know, you it lost a little bit of
the fairy dust, but at the same time it was fine. The employees
there were actually really friendly. Every time I went there, I felt like,
you know, there, I had like a small conversation with an employee
and it was like, Wow, I like this place, Like it left
me with a really great feeling. And and then I just learned, yeah,
this month is the last month I think it'll be operating. So and
it's crazy because I mean, I guess when it was an ARC light,
it was their highest grossing you know, box office arc light in the country,
so at one point it was a draw, one of the biggest draws.
But yeah, when I go to the movies these days, it's not
nearly as full. I could say, you know, like I remember Megan.
I think Megan, which I don't think I talked about on the show,
but we saw Megan over here, and that was maybe the most crowded.
I've seen a theater since twenty early twenty twenty, so yeah, I
get it. I'm sympathetic that I don't I don't know, But it also
is sort of you know, Elijah Wood had some sort of tweet that I'm
in a paraphrase where it was like it almost turns it into this elitist thing
where it's like, well, if you don't have the money, you get
the bad seats, and the people who have the money get the good seats.
And there's something kind of icky about that. Yeah, I don't know,
I just it. I guess they have tried this in certain regions,
and I guess based on the success there, they're deciding to go, you
know, to continue on with it. But at a glance, it doesn't
seem like a smart way to keep people coming, you know. When I
heard I've you know, heard other people's convert stations talking about who's going to
enforce this, you know, like, who's to say someone doesn't go in
there, buy a cheap seat and then just go sit in the middle.
But you paid for the middle, and that person's in your seat, and
so then you've got to go get some poor teenager to come in there and
settle a dispute. And I mean that's you know, excuse me, sir
purchased already. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah,
we'll see, we'll see that. That's kind of a TVD. I feel
like it's gonna we're gonna have to see see where things go with that.
Maybe Nicole Kidman will usher us through this with some sort of right now,
this is her moment. Yeah, we need we need you, Nicole,
it's her time. Yeah. Um, well, well here's the thing I
saw. You know, we're talking about going back to things that sort of
the entire country was talking about at one time. I decided to revisit the
miniseries V. Yeah, yeah, V I've never seen. You've never seen
V. Well no, wait, wait, wait, which the you're talking
about the eighties one? Right, the eighties one? Yeah, there was
there was like a re remake or a reboot or whatever you call it about
about ten or twelve years ago. Not talking about that. But this year
is the fortieth anniversary of the original V miniseries, and I thought, you
know, I'm gonna bust that out, And so I watched it with my
nine year old and uh, definitely he is like fully, like, oh,
man, put on the next rat like whatever that was. So that
was fun watching it. You know, this is this is written and directed
by Kenneth Johnson, who I know him as a guy who created an incredible
whole TV show. You know him as the guy who directed Short Circuit too.
Hey, Yeah, absolutely, and so there's Yeah, if you haven't
seen it, you know, I certainly think the first mini series is pretty
darn good. I think it holds up very well. It's it's a metaphor
for fascism, right, so it's substitutes instead of you know, Russians taking
over something during you know, during the Cold War. It has space aliens
and it has you know, and it goes through a lot of those same
tropes. But I think it's very effective. It's it's on the nose,
but I think a story like this should be on the nose. Sure,
yeah, you know it's it's in a broad sense. It's inspired by a
book by Sinclair Lewis called it Can't Happen Here, Right, And it's kind
of that same idea that fascism comes in wearing a friendly face and eventually people
just don't even realize they've been taken over and that's that's what what makes V
effective. Now. The first mini series when it came out was a I
mean it was like Roots level of like people watching and talking about it.
It was very you know, there was a whole marketing campaign where people they
had post they had posters, you know of like propaganda posters of the Space
Aliens and their red uniforms and happy and you know, friendship is universal in
this type of stuff, and they put those all around subway stations and then
people like, hell is this And then after a week or so, people
went around and spray painted red vs all over them. That's good, that's
good. V isn't viral, Brian, because right as it got people talking
and so the first miniseries very effective, and it did so well. I
mean it was like up until then, it was like the second highest rated
miniseries ever after Roots. So NBC Warner Brothers they're like, hey, let's
come on, let's come back, Let's do the sequel. And Ken Johnson's
like, all right, here's my plan for the sequel. And they're like,
no, you know what, We're gonna do something else. And they
fired him from his own thing, which isn't that just like the most Hollywood
thing. Yeah. Wait, two questions. So how long was the first
mini series? How many episodes? So it is in total it's about three
hours to two parts of ninety minutes each. Oh dang, okay, I'll
watch it. Um. Yeah, I was in my head, I was
thinking like a two season show or something. It's like, oh, that's
a Sunday thing. But no, so what do they want? They wanted
him to make a did it ever turn to a show? Or they wanted
him to make another three hour total sort of thing. Yeah. Well,
so there was a second mini series that was intended to sort of wrap up
the story, and I think I think Johnson had intentions of, well,
you know, we can keep this thing going, right, sure. I
think I think NBC and Warner Brothers probably wanted cheaper and more, more explosions
and that type of thing. And so you have a second mini series which
it's almost like you can you can track at what point Kenneth Johnson's involved stopped?
You know what I mean? Because because I think if the first mini
series is like a solid ah, you know, the second miniseries is like
a it's like a solid bat. So it's it's still watchable. You know
what I mean, do you know what he wanted to do versus what they
did? Um? Well, I know what he didn't want to do.
Without spoiling anything. I think the way it ended was something that just just
knowing what I know of Kenneth Johnson's sensibilities, I'm like, well, that
definitely wasn't a thing he would have wanted. Um, but I think it
is an effective wrap up. And then they came back and they did really
well. And then they came back a few months later and they had a
weekly series with no budget and no no idea what they were doing, and
so with each episode I think it lasted nineteen episodes. You can sort of
see them running out of money with each episode. You know, they keep
repurposing special effects shots and it sort of becomes comical, and you're like,
man, talk about self immolation of what could have been a long term franchise,
right it is? It is interesting to watch now that all being said,
I'm now going through the weekly series with my nine year old, and
I think it's sort of it works at his level because you know, he's
not gonna be looking at all that stuff, right. But the original miniseries.
Oh my gosh, it's fantastic. Okay, let's check it out.
Yeah, I mean that that was one that because I saw the second miniseries
when I was a kid. I saw in Sali Arabia. I didn't see
the first miniseries until I was probably sixteen seventeen. Okay, it was a
little bit older, but but it you know, I appreciated all the subtext
and just straight up text, you know, in terms of what it's trying
to say. And I do think it's kind of an evergreen story, right
evergreens, because they're like they're listen, how are the dual effect or specially
effects, I should say, I think they hold up for the most part,
you know, I think I think there's some stuff that's a little that's
a little dodgy, where you know, you have these space aliens and they're
they're shoving you know, groundhogs in their mouth, you know, because they
eat like livestock. Um. That that's a little dodgy. But I think
the the you know, I think Kenneth Johnson just in general, it is
very smart about not not letting his reach get too big, and so the
effects serve the story. For in terms of what they were capable of achieving.
And I think in that sense it holds up. I'm smart, But
if you end up watching, it'll be very curious what you think. Yeah,
for sure, you know a lot of folks in there who like Mark
Singer from The Beast Master. He's he's the main character. But you got
like Robert England before Freddy wow Um, either before or right around the first
night Man on Street. Um, you know, Joanna Kerns is in there
and like a small girl like all these people, you're like, oh,
hey that person, Yeah, hey, that guy. Right. Also,
I wanted to mention that the new season of Star Trek Piccard is about to
drop on Paramount Plus. Now you know what you said before about about mcgruber.
Yes, I feel like that's just as applicable here, because certainly,
without the streaming age, I would not get like whatever, it is like
five Star Trek shows that are just airing one after the other on Paramount Plus.
So we have the final season of Star Trek Piccard. And what makes
this season particularly exciting is that Terry Mattellis is the new showrunner. He wanted
this to be knowing it was last season. He wanted this to be a
proper farewell for the cast of Star Trek the Next Generation, who have not
appeared on this show. Wow. You know, in the first season we
had a couple of guest appearances by Jonathan Frakes, as as William Riker and
Brent Spiners showed up. But really, for whatever reason, Patrick Stewart was
like, I don't want this to be just another regurgitation of the Next Generation.
Oh interesting, And so I guess they twisted his arm or whatever,
and so they made this kind of the farewell that the Next Generation crew never
got. The last Next Generation movie was in two thousand and two Wow,
and it got beat at the box office opening weekend by Maid in Manhattan,
the Jennifer Lopez rom com Wow. So an ignominious fate in that movie.
You know, so the Next Generation crew never really got their farewell, you
know what I mean. Like like Star Trek six, which you've seen,
you know, it ends with you know, Captain Kirk and you know,
and he gives his h you know, his captain's log and he's like,
this is my final cruise, aboard this ship and do it. And you're
like, oh, wow, you know, this is the end. Like
like the Next Generation never got that right, And so I've so this is
a ten episode season. I've seen the first six. This is how confident
Paramount was. They're like, here you go, three weeks early, six
out of the ten episodes. Do you think of that? Yeah, and
I'll tell you, I mean, this is this is that, this is
this is the legacy sequel of the Next Generation. You know. That's fantastic
and it weaves with what they've done in previous seasons. Yeah, it was
what I would say. What I would say is it doesn't so much weave
with it as it doesn't ignore it, but it doesn't necessarily go out of
its way to acknowledge it. So in in in the sense that I think
I think they tried really hard to make this something that people who either got
board with the previous season or just didn't watch them can just watch cold and
they'll get what they need too out of it. And I I the other
thought I had, and this is this is a discussion and I have had
a lot. It really does feel like the Star Wars sequels have ended up
mapping out in a lot of ways what legacy sequels should not do. HM
Sure, when when it comes to specifically legacy characters. Yeah, I mean,
well you can. Yeah, I mean, you get such strong reactions.
It's it's almost impossible not to be like, oh when when when people
try this, you tend to get this kind of reaction exactly right, So
so and you hate that that's the case. Yeah, Yeah, you want
to be able to feel free, to to make bold choices, yeah,
you know, but but it is what it is. But there's definitely it.
Watching this, you get the sense that, Okay, Star Wars went
in this direction and that didn't work out so well in terms of polarization in
the fan base. Let's go in the opposite route. So this really goes
to great lengths to pull these characters back together and make them all relevant.
And you know, for me, I mean you know this, Brian,
I mean, gosh, I grew up watching The Next Generation. I've loved
these characters all my life and and so seeing them back is obviously great.
And and I don't know how it's the season is going to end, but
based on the first six episodes, I find it difficult to believe that they
will just completely shit the bed right right in the last four. You know,
it feels like they've built up a pretty solid head of steam. But
you know, fingers crossed. I'm knocking on wood as I say this,
But I watched it my kids were camping that weekend. I'm just blazing through
it, and I'm like, God, I can't wait to watch this with
my kids. You know, that's so cool you can share that with them
that they like it too. Yeah. Well, that's the funny thing because
because I went through, I've gone through the next generation with them twice.
Now, you know. I watched it with my oldest one, you know,
and and at the time he was like nine or something, you know,
So so my second one he was, you know, seven, So
now he's like, well, I don't really remember it. Let's go.
So I'm going through it. Yeah. Uh so I know that they're going
to joy it. But I you know, and this may not mean as
much to you, Brian, but I know people listening who watched the show,
Jonathan Frakes, it's like his best performance ever as Commander Riker. Uh.
You know, we get Brent Spiner gets something new and interesting to do
with his character. I don't know what is planned with these next generation characters
after this, maybe nothing, but if This is indeed the final hurrah for
them. I think what we missed out on twenty years ago we get now,
which is a true emotional farewell. It's fantastic. Yeah. So with
that, let's take a short break and we'll come back right up, please,
And we're back. And we got a couple of listener letters here,
Brian. Cool. So first up we got we got a question for you
from Corey Hebne, who asks Brian, what's your deal with Bluie? Like?
Was my deal with it? Like that? What's my beef? Or
like, what's my relationship? Well, I given that that's all there is,
I suppose feel free to interpret as you choose your deal with Blue.
This question is a Rorschach test for you, Brian. I will say exactly
what my deal is with Blue, because I think it can be distilled quite
simply. I heard it existed and that it was good, and so I
chose to like watching, to watch an episode and was like, oh,
this is adorable and hilarious and sweet and clever, and so then I started
watching a couple more, and I don't have them in my DVR or anything,
but I remember I was like a loan in a cabin like I did,
like a getaway weekend, like a a year or two ago, and
I was flipping through channels and Bluie was on and out of everything. I
was like, yeah, Bluie. So I watched, like, you know,
at a couple of Blueism and then, you know, I have friends
with kids and they'll be like, ah, you should see this one,
and so I watched one where it was so funny. It was like their
cousin comes to visit and the kid didn't take his nap, so he's very
delirious and he's acting like he's drunk. And so it's like these little kids
trying to take care of this drunk little kid who like you know, goes
out and takes like their their big wheel kind of car thing and it's like,
oh, like shouldn't be driving. And it was so funny. Um.
So yeah, I've seen a handful. I've had ones recommended and I
checked them out, but I have not like gone through the whole series.
But I really love it. I really respect it to the the acting and
the writing is so great. So that's my deal with Bluie. That's your
deal with Bluie. Okay, fair enough, Yeah, glad we glad we
established the parameters of the question. Uh yeah, my daughter loved that show.
She went through the whole thing. Oh really Yeah. Now she's moved
on to some other stuff, but she had her blue ee face there.
That's that's great. Yeah, it's it's great. I mean it's something that
you feel, I think, happy to put your kids in front of because
it is imaginative and clever and you know, it's not talking down to them.
Yeah. I agree with that. Yeah. Yeah. Uh. Here's
a note we got and this is from Scotland. Brian. Oh, so
this is from Hamsa, who's not not my son Hamsa unless he's in Scotland
right now. Ms uh, he says. My name is Hams and I'm
from Scotland, the home of groundskeeper Willie Andy. Yes, he's a pretty
accurate depiction of a Scotsman. He says. I recently came across your podcast
and I feel like I have struck gold. I love listening to you guys
talk about everything, and I am now working my way through all of your
past episodes. Well that's nice. Wow, he says. I just want
to thank you for such consistently and siful and hilarious conversation. Many are the
times when you've had me laughing out loud. For example, in a recent
episode, you guys were talking about Tommy Lee Jones movies where he basically just
shouts at people, which otherwise known as Tommy Lee Jones's entire IMDb listing.
Right, could you guys please share your list of the top movies of that
specific genre. I would also love to hear both of your thoughts on the
actor himself and why it is so joyous to watch him shout at people.
Once again, I love the show and really appreciate being able to spend time
in your company. From a far vesters, thank you. That means a
lot. Thank you so much, as I did not know at the start
of this year how much time we would end up spending talking about Tommy Lee
Jones. Yeah, you know. And it's funny because for me, the
Fugitive Kicks started my relationship with him, right, and so then he had
like we were saying, he had that run in the nineties, kind of
an unlikely run where he was, you know, the lead of all these
movies, Like, um, seeing that this is what I'm actually this is
the point I'm gonna get at I don't know that. I saw a lot
of them, like, like is Tears of the Sun. That's a thing,
right, Yeah, that was that was Bruce Willis No Heaven and Earth
right, Oliver Stone, Yeah, Heaven and Earth. That was Tommy Lean
that's the Oliver Stone. That's right. Yeah, National Born Killers. That
was Wild Batman and forever Batman, Forever. I will say, even though
it might not be my favorite actual Tommy Lee Jones movie, Yell, my
absolute favorite impersonation is you doing him an ad Astra, Come get me,
yell, come get me, Come get me. Federica and I say that
to each other all the time, all the time. I don't go don't
get me as my favorite. I know you probably have seen more of his
films than I have. Well, so under Siege is first time I heard
of him, although I saw The Fugitive first. I watched Underseage after that,
and under Siege also as a distinction of being, uh, the only
good Steven Seagal movie. Yes, and that's a wild performance from him.
I mean he's playing kind of a raucous sky, which is not usual Tommy
Lee Jones, I mean Tommy Lee Jones. Yes, sorry, that's right,
yeah. I was like, I was like, no, Stephen Seagale
is not raucous and anything. I'm a chef. Yeah. You know,
it's so funny because because with Steven Seagal, he again, you know,
we talk about the these these epochs in time, right like Tommy Lee Jones
had a moment. Steven Seagal had a moment too. Oh yeah yeah,
and this is this ship we need like archaeologists to delve into the the cultural
you know, look at the sandstone degradation and try to figure out like what
was what was the the cultural milieu in which Steven Seagal emerged, you know,
right like he would he would come out with a movie and people would
be like, oh, Steven Seagal has a new movie, and then they
would pay money and go and sit in a room to watch Steven Seagal on
the big screen. And that entire concept makes no sense to me, you
know, because I did not get swept up in that personally. I think
Van Dam I I sort of we've talked about this before with blood Sport,
Like, I didn't really get into Van Dam either, except you know,
I saw like hard Target and a couple of those because there he had,
you know, he could do the splits, and he had kind of like
moves, and he had like this sort of like charisma and whatnot. But
yeah, it was Seagal. I don't know what I mean, I don't
know what he brought that kept people comments. He I mean, like you
you look at his you pull up his page on IMDb, and it's like
above the Law, hard to Kill, Mark for Death. It's like it's
just like these generic sounding names where if you were to like switch words around
you probably it would sound like a Stephen Seagal movie. Out for Justice that's
another one, and you could be like, Okay, how about uh above
Justice, you know, marked to kill, you know, out for the
Law or you know what I mean. It's all they're all kind of you
know, right, And so so that's like nineteen eighty eight, nineteen eighty
nine, and then you jump to now and you got like force of execution,
code of honor, you know, and you're like, he's just doing
the same shit right right right, and I do. I don't know if
I'm assuming all of these are straight to video, but I'm like, there
was a minute there where people went to people went to watch his movies yeah.
Yeah. I I went Brian. I I saw two Stephen Seagal movies
in the theater, do you tell Yeah, one of which was On Deadly
Ground, which he not only starred in, and which h Academy Award winner
Michael Caine starred in. Oh huh okay, I didn't know that. Yeah.
Uh. And and Stephen Seagal it directed this movie? Wow? And
wow? Is it? Well? What does what does the phrase Stephen Seagal
directed this movie conjure to your mind? It is that? Okay? I
mean it was because I I went with my uncle and he was like on
board, sure, and I now this is this. This was nineteen ninety
four, so I'm like thirteen fourteen, and I'm like, I think this
movie ish, Like that's right right right? You know? Yeah? And
you know I have not bothered revisiting it. But I mean, it is
a preposterous, ridiculous thing. Where where Seagal is. He's in Alaska and
he works he works for Michael Kine, owns like an oil refinery. And
I don't know, if you know, like Segal that was his big thing
in the nineties where he was like environmentalist. It rings a bell. It's
been a while, it was you know, there's a sheriff for a minute.
Yeah, I think he still is. Right. He hosted an episode
of SNL, Yeah, which is renowned far and wide as the worst episode,
the worst guest host like that they've ever had. That's the only host
that cast members will actually admit by name was the worst host in their experience.
Yeah, that's right, and and so like famously like like he didn't
want to he he had no concept of humor, and he was very self
important. When you talk about two leathal ingredients in an SNL host, right,
Yeah. And so there's a sketch in that episode where it's uh,
these these like uh uh like oil company big wigs, none of whom are
the cast, who are like, hey, we're gonna you know, you
know, ruin the environment. And then Steven Sadal comes in and just beats
the shit out of him, and then he points to the camera and goes,
that's what's gonna happen to anyone who ruins the environment, and then ge
Smith is like bay Barrel, I mean, it's just nonsense, you know.
And now imagine that that's like a five minute sketch. Imagine that spread
out over ninety minutes and right, right, right, right, it's just
just nonsensical, right does he drown Michael canan oil? Like this is what
you love, isn't it? Kind of a thing? Like pretty good?
That's a pretty good impression of all right, that's that's angry Seagal. There's
also uh now now now do happy Seagal my birthday. I can't believe it.
That might have been too much actually a surprise for me, how delt
I'm just a cook, That's all I got. So he did that and
then and then like like two years later, Uh, he was in executive
decision if you remember, which I like. By the way, I remember
liking that. It's been a while. I think the reason the reason that
movie is because Seagal is in it for about ten minutes and he gets blown
out like the hatch of an airplane. Yes, and it's meant to be
the shocking thing. But I don't know if you remember this. They gave
that shit away in the TV spots. Oh see, I don't remember that.
Yeah, because basically it's like Kurt Kurt Russell's like, we're I'm not
gonna make it and then said I it's like you are and you just see
like the hatch clothes and they're like, well he's gonna die, right,
and you kind of you see like this hatch blow up in a little like
from a distance this like dummy, Yeah, I just float out then,
you know yea directed by Stuart Baird, by the way, who did us
marshals just like a year later. Interesting. But but my point is that
that I don't even know how we went down this ration under siege because of
Tommy Lee Jones. Wow. Sorry everybody. So that's how I feel about
Tommy Lee Jones. Moving on, you know what, actually I thinking about
what Humsa was talking about, the sort of barking Tommy Lee Jones. I
think for me it's less the bursts, but it's sort of his exasperated,
frustrated speeches like I mean, immediately off the top of my head, just
to like actually answer the question like the fugitive, I mean, you know,
I want a hard target search of every gas station, residents, wherehouse,
farmhouse, you know, like that thing is really memorable from that and
then also of course I mean the men in black thing, which is like
you could put that on a sign and hang it somewhere, you know,
where he's like, you know, persons, smart people are dumb, panicky,
dangerous animals and you know it. And those two lines coming out of
his mouth are just, I mean absolutely elevated from what you know, just
anyone else would have done well. And I think I think right there with
Agent K and Sam Girard, you kind of have the poles of what makes
for a compelling Tommy Lee Jones character, which is he is um soft spoken
in in in uh in that he it takes a lot to rouse him,
and he has sort of everyman quality and so that exasperated barking as we see
in in The Fugitive that's one lane and you get your you know, volcano
is there and you know double jeopardy. It kind of you know fady yeah
yeah, which is kind of like the unofficial Third Fugitive movie, like you
could just kind of headcanon him into being Sam Gerard in that movie. Yeah
wow, I forgot about that. Yeah right. But but like Agent Kay
is also like that that character works because of the way Tommy Lee Jones has
this sort of folksy charm, right, and when you think about it,
like when we did our commentary for for Batman Forever, that was sort of
our frustration with with Tommy Lee Jones playing that interpretation of two phase, which
is like, why not lean into his strengths, which is that sort of
bubbling cauldron that's just underneath, as opposed to him screaming and prancing around and
doing all that, you know, yeah, yeah, yeah, kind of
acting kind of trying to match Jim Carrey in a way. That's right,
you know, when yeah, he's why not playing to this sort of yeah
yeah, like you said that bubbling and English he could not sanction his buffoonery
and yet there he was befoooning it up. That's hilarious. And I just
have to take this opportunity just for Homesa to say hi to Scotland, because
my fiance Frederica, with a friend went and visited Scotland recently and absolutely adored
it. She has not stopped talking about it, and she was saying,
you know, she really wants us to go there at some point because she
just is continuing to think about it and what a great time she had there.
So sending sending love over to Scotland, Well, there we go.
That's kind of cool. Yeah, hopefully you found out what we had to
say about Tomi Lejo. Oh and one thing I'll say, he has one
of the great line deliveries of his career in Captain America The First Avenger at
the near the end of the film where Captain America is about to climb on
the bad guy's plane and he kisses Hailey at well, yeah, and he
kind of looks over at at Tommy Lee is driving thing It's just like,
I'm not kissing you. Yeah. That's good. That's a good one.
That's a good one. I mean, when you think about it, actually,
that character in Captain America is is such like it's just a it's it
benefits so much just from plugging Tommy Lee Jones in because it's not it's not
a sizeable role, but it's integral and it leans heavily on just our fondness
for him as a as a performance. Yeah, right, And that that's
certainly something that those early MCU movies did a lot of, where they'd have
these well known beloved actors in kind of small key roles. Yep. You
know. But with that, let's take another short break. We'll come back.
We got some headlines to discuss, all right, and we are back
and Hey, there's some there's some news, there's some there's some deals that
are that are developing. Brian wheeling and dealing at lots of lots of stuff
in that vein happening. I thought this was interesting. We have some new
Disney sequels coming. Okay, so this is iger igering over there, or
you're not getting people excited or what is this? Did this come from some
sort of earnings call or something or what's Yeah? So this this is Bob
Iger after uh, several rounds of layoffs and losses in the last month that
Disney. Disney has not had a great couple of months. M uh so,
Bob. They got rid of the other Bob. What's his name,
Jaypec, Right, that's his name. I think so so so he was
the head. He had signed a new contract and they said, actually psych
never mind right, showed him the door. Although he's doing okay because I
think his golden parachute is quite golden. Um. But they brought back Bob
Iger to to write the ship. And one of the things he's announced is
that Disney as a whole raft of new sequels coming, among them Frozen three,
okay, Inside Out two, you write Zootopia two, and perhaps most
polarizing toy story five. Yes, yes, because I think that one is
interesting because four, I feel people were like, oh, you know,
three had a nice little bow on that you know, unexpected probably you know
arc, but there was an arc and it had a nice little ending and
h and then four came out. I was like, oh, well,
what are we doing here? And then they sort of broke things up a
little bit, right story wise, you know what, he went on,
found love and left everybody. That's right. So, and it's funny because
I think I remember saying on this show that four didn't feel necessary, but
it was so well done that you're like, that's a good story. Yeah,
I just witnessed a good story, so I can't be mad at it.
So then with five, it does make me think like, oh,
you almost have this feeling of well, don't don't break it, you know,
like you've you did something perfect and then you added to it and that
happened to work. So like few, and then with five you're like,
ooh, oh you you're gonna try it again, you know, But this
is the problem I see, Brian. Yeah, I think that in order
to get a toy story five, you have to undo the ending of Toy
Story four. Yeah, right, And and I you know, I was
talking about this with my with my students today. So these are people who
were you know, let's say between eighteen and twenty, and they were vehemently
opposed to any notion of a Toy Story five. Interesting. So there are
those who say there shouldn't have even been a fourth one. Uh, the
third one was just fine. And then there are those who say the fourth
one was a good ending. But all of them, almost to the one,
nobody was like I'm excited for that. And I found that interesting because
they're all I mean, maybe I was gonna say more than us, but
I mean, we we grew up watching these movies. I mean, these
are multi generational films at this point. All of them have grown up with
within this world, and all of them are like, it came to an
ending. And I just find that so interesting because it puts to the line
this idea of like, oh, you just keep going, and that's what
people want, right, you know what I mean? Well, and I
I don't like the feeling of a movie coming up from a series that I
love, and my my first thought is, oh, don't screw it.
Up. Yeah, you know, like rather than yay, right, um,
you know, I mean look this, I also have resigned to the
fact that this is just what's gonna happen. And I mean, you know,
you and I were texting this week. I think we last episode we
were talking about like I mean, maybe we're done. I think new things
are done. Like we're just gonna keep all we're gonna do. We're gonna
like be like the bad Guys and Tenant and we're just like reversing the flow
and we're just kinda like steamroll everything that already happened and just regurgitate and like
I think I sent you that they're remaking Matlock's right, and it's like what
but that's just I'm not even mad anymore. It's like yeah, yeah,
you know, and so boys stories eight, Yeah, you know what's gonna
happen. So it's like, all right, just please let it be good,
you know. And I you know, I guess that's kind of where
maybe it's like a little resigned sort of well they just make it good.
I mean, I you know, I just like I'm more and more I
think about Back to the Future three and I'm like, you know, will
something else happen with this franchise kind of like, well, probably at some
point something, but for the time being, that story is done, and
and that's just great, you know, like there's value in the ending,
you know, And that's sort of where I'm at with Toy Story Forward.
I'm like, you know, and this time we talked, when we talked
about the movie on on this podcast, right, and that there was real
I felt real sadness at Buzz and Woody separating. Yes, me too,
Like they're they're not going to see each other again. And so I feel
like any contrivance you come up with to get them back together takes away the
value of that ending. What if it's Buzz's funeral that's dark? Sorry,
um no, obviously I don't want that. Yeah. Yeah, like you
can't, um, you can't do Toy Story without buzzing Woody. So it's
not going to be like the Adventures of Buzz by himself. Yeah yeah,
So then you have to you have to undo the end of the fourth film,
and I just don't. To me, that's like in the next Avengers
movie, Uh, you know, Robert Downey shows up and he's just like,
hey, everybody, I'm back. Actually yes, I never died,
you know, right, Well, and then that's I guess maybe that's the
problem is they keep ending it. Maybe they shouldn't be ending it, although
they were great endings, you know so, but yeah, yeah, it's
it feels like a just kidding on accident, whether they mean it or not.
Yeah. Yeah, the other sequels that they proposed, I'm not I
don't have as much emotional investment in, but just as at a glance,
it seems like there's more room to do stuff there. M sure. Yeah,
right, like you say, well, I haven't seen a second Frozen,
but I'm my daughter will be thrilled, I'm sure. But but Zootopia,
Yeah, well of course you can do a sequel to that. Yeah.
Yeah, it makes sense and it's pretty beloved, right, you know,
so why not read spend more time with the characters inside out? Feels
like you could do something with a whole new group of characters. You do
it in a different kid or something, and I think you could do that
or actually, yeah, maybe that is the best way to do it,
like a fresher approach. But I was going to say, you know,
it was sort of about a kid turning into an adolescent and how feelings get
more complicated, Right, you start with sort of these basic feelings and then
they become way more complicated, and it's like, well, I don't know,
I mean, what happens when they become twenty you know? Or I
guess you could. You could sort of do that, so there's room there.
But when you say Toy Story, you know what it feels like to
me, it feels like they got freaked out by how nobody watched light Year.
They want to sort of no, no, no, Our final stamp
on the buzz character is the one you know and love, right, exactly
interesting, interesting, it feels like that to me, you know, sure,
yeah, you know, so I don't know that that's ah, I
feel like that's development it. I don't know if you remember, but the
only reason Toy Story three even happened was because Disney was going to do their
own version. Do you remember this? Oh? Was that three or two?
That was three? Okay? Yeah? Because Disney what they had,
you know, Pixar was not part of Disney, right, they had like
a contract with Disney, right, and so they were going to go their
own way. So Disney is like, well, We're just going to do
our own Toy Story three and then you know, they acquired Pixar. Part
of the deal was Pixar would do Toy Story three, right, and it
turned out fantastic, m but it was it was a coin toss, you
know. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it wasn't. I mean, they
had some sort of like street to video division, right, and weren't they
going to do that? That's right. The plan was to do something.
It's kind of you know, return of Jaffar type. Yeah, yeah,
exactly, you know it. I feel like they've gotten lucky with these Toy
Story movies, which is why I'm skeptical, you know. Yeah. Uh
that said, I didn't realize at the time we discussed the fourth film,
but I mean it is fairly polarizing among fans of these movies, you know.
I guess I don't really know. I just kind of remember my feelings
on it, which was, like, I guess, I don't feel like
it was necessary, but I thought it was well done. That was kind
of my But yeah, I guess, I don't know. I don't know
what the consensus is out there, but it's interesting to hear from your students.
I mean, people that have had these movies in their lives since they've
been born. Yeah, and that's that's their feeling. Yeah, I mean
that that the plurality were like, no, no, no, no,
you know. Yeah, that said, here's another thing that's not going away
anytime soon, Brian, and that is DC. I don't know, DC
based stuff. Yeah, not not DC the city, but DC the company.
Yeah. And you're not even just strictly cinematic, right, I mean
this covers all DC. This is TV, this is video games, this
is movies. So this is a lot yes, and so yeah, we
talked about this a couple months ago. James Gunn is now the head hauncho
of DC. He is he is the Kevin Figy of DC. Yep.
Now, interesting to note we were just talking about Bob Iger. He mentioned
how back in twenty fifteen, uh Isaac Promoter, who is the head of
Marvel at the time, wanted to fire Kevin Figi. Right, the only
reason he's still around is because Iger built a wall around Kevin Figy to keep
him from having to answer to anybody other than Alan Horne, who is the
head of the Motion Picture division at Disney at the time. Now, what
could be the excuse in twenty fifteen when Marvels on a tear to let him
go. Well, what happened was that I promotter Man, this guy is
interesting. He did not want any female led movies. Ah, this is
kind of coming back to me, okay, which is the reason it took
soul. I mean it took until Captain Marvel before they had a solo female
lead, right right. And he also did not believe Black Panther would be
a hit wow, which is a historically stupid thing to say, right,
yeah, yeah. And so essentially what was actually happening behind the scenes is
that he was just he kept the purse strings really tightly closed, and so
it made it hard to make deals with people. So I don't know if
you remember this, but right this, the timing works out around twenty fifteen,
what's his name, Robert Downey was done with his contract, and so
Kevin Figi was trying to make another deal with him, and Pearl Mutter was
not letting that happen. And then this all happens in the background, if
you notice, right then they announced, Oh, Downy's going to be in
Civil War and down He's going to be in the next two Avengers movies.
Oh and Down He's going to be in Spider Man Homecoming. That all happened
at the same time the Spider Man deal times out with this too, right,
you know, So I think I think I think to your point,
I think Iger was like, well, this guy is doing a good job.
Why are you trying to get in his way? You know, and
so very smartly. Obviously that worked out, and it's set the template which
DC has been desperately trying to emulate for for for nine years now. Yeah,
like having everything interconnected. Yeah, and I think you know, they're
The plan was for Zack Snyder to be the guy that clearly did not happen,
and then it was let's get Jeff John's have him be the guy that
had its own set of issues. And then they brought in you know,
Walter Hamada had to be there. I mean, it's it's revolving doors over
there, right. So James Gunn, along with Peter Saffron, was brought
in. He made his pitch to David Zaslav, who's the head of this
new company one of us Discovery, this is his idea, and they went
along with us. So now he's the guy. Now he unveiled the whole
slate that they have planned for the next five years or something. I am,
Brian deeply skeptical that the majority of these projects will be made. I'm
not saying that they won't be made. I'm saying at this point it's probably
too early to be pointing to a whiteboard. Mean, I've got all this
ship we got coming in the next seven years. You just inadvertently answered the
question that was brewing in my mind, which was not are you excited about
all this? But is it wise to try to plan so far in advance
before thing one isn't veiled upon the world. That's right. You know,
we've we've been to this dance already, not just with DC, with fifteen
others shared cinematic universes. Yes, and I know we sort of look at
DC is standing beside Marvel. But like Marvel didn't plan this, you know
what I mean? Like I think it's like they they took swings and then
saw something was working and had a dream and it worked. And like you
said, so many other would be franchises have tried to do this and it
just doesn't work that way. You know, when you try to engineer it
so precisely right at the start, it's like you kind of have to,
you know, improvise a little bit and see what's working and what isn't and
find your footing and find your flow. And then once you got that,
and once you got everybody hooked, then you start going all right, then
then we're gonna do this saga. We're gonna do that saga. But yeah,
I was sort of like, wow, it's sort of interesting, sort
of bold to come out of the gate and be like, here's the this
isn't what it is, but like, here's the next ten years. Thanks,
right, Well, we'll see, we'll see what the brave and bold
Brian. Yes, So let's go down the list here now, now this
is this is chapter one of what I'm assuming James Gunn and I mean smartly,
he's he's using his Marvel experience as something to build on, which,
of course it makes sense. So presumably chapter one is the cooling A Phase
one, but he calls it Gods and Monsters, And so what we got
here? We got creature Commandos and this is an animated series that's going to
span seven episodes, and it's basically a team of commandos Brian, who are
also creatures. We got, we got we got Rick Flagg Senior. We
got for the Frankenstein Monster Gi Robot, which I have to admit that I
just love the name of that character. That's great, that's like he manum
And this is, like I said, this is going to be animated.
But but what's interesting is that whoever they cast to play the voices have to
play these characters in live action as well. Yes, that is interesting across
all platforms, even video games apparently, so the plan is for unanimity across
platforms. I find that interesting. Yeah, let's see what else we have
Waller yep, and this is going to be a Peacemaker spinoff right now.
I find this interesting because because this is Biola Davis playing Amanda Waller's character Peacemaker.
She's in the Suicide Squad both movies, so that means that she is
carrying over from the pre Gun era. I didn't even think about that.
So maybe that's a little clue that it is possible for Galghadatts or you know,
Jason Momoa or any of those people that continue. Yeah. Right,
because they are doing a Peacemaker season two. This is meant to be kind
of like Peacemaker season one point five or something. Here's the big one,
Brian. This is gonna be the first feature out the shoot, and it's
going to be a Superman legacy Yes, written by James Gunn himself, written
by James Gunn, possibly directed by James Gunn. We'll see how that goes.
But according to Peter Saffron, it's not an origin story. It focused
on Superman balancing his Kryptonian heritage with his human upbringing. He is the embodiment
of truth, justice in the American way. He is kindness in a world
that thinks that kindness is old fashioned, and he will wear his underwear on
the outside. He didn't say that, but I'm a sitmame. Didn't he
pull Twitter about briefe? I think that was meant as a goof and then
of course, yeah, it was an informal pole, I should say,
But I wonder if he was kind of curious though, you know. Yeah,
And I don't even know how where where things landed with that pole,
But I don't either. I am. I am firmly team Trunks. Brian.
Yeah, same, I'm like, put that shit on the outside.
That's how good way. I mean everything you just said describing this take on
Superman is exactly what I want to see. So I have high hopes for
this that that is true. However, worth mentioning that everything everything I just
said was was echoed by the previous DC trust like three months ago, when
Henry Cavill was all like, hey guys, I'm back, Yeah, yeah,
and then they pulled that rug right out from under him. That's true.
They pulled those red trunks right off of him, you know. So,
yes, I think I think you need a strong Superman franchise in order
to have any strong D universe. I think that just that goes without saying
I and of course you know me, I no bigger Superman fan than I
have an entire wall of my cave that is covered with Superman paraphernalien. That
being said, this is now, by the time this comes out, it
will be what it was a twenty twenty five right, So we're talking three
Superman movies in twenty years. M wow, right from Superman Returns to Superman.
Like, so you got Man of Steel in the middle. Now,
Man of Steel is a movie that you and I both like, but it
was clearly it was received with polarization. Yeah, and I don't I don't
know that the general audience. I don't think the general audience is paying attention
to Zach Seider, this that the other thing. But I think they are
like, oh, another Superman, m you know what I mean, hmm
will. I like the idea though, of a different era of his life,
like a different feeling. It's kind of a different feeling. I don't
want it to just feel like every other CG laden superhero movie it just happens
to be Superman. I want this to be Superman specific, like his feelings,
his conflicts, his you know, like I don't want to see him
battling craziness in the first one, Like let's let's get there. Like I
really hope this is kind of a character driven story and becomes like the anchor
for whatever it is they want to build out from. Well and and to
that point, I think that's the reason that Gun is not doing something with
Henry Cavill. Yeah, I think it's too. It's it's so that he
can he can truly set the boundaries of this union is the way he wants,
rather than sort of having to incorporate. Yeah, it was done there
and that's not a judgment on that film, but it is like, well,
he wants to broaden the canvas or whatever it is, you know what
I mean. And I also, I genuinely think he wants to have a
Superman who has a secret identity. He wants to have sort of the classic
set up with Jimmy Olson, etc. He wants to have all those pieces
in place. Yeah, right, So Man of Steel just you know,
just skewed the Superman having a Superman and Clark Kent being separate identities for Lois
Lant, they just did. They did away with that right from the beginning.
That worked for that story. But I have no doubt that that's part
of what he wants to to maintain in this Yeah, yeah, you know,
or retain the secret identity. I just had a thought, do you
think, I mean the Flash movie, do you think this is going to
be a bigger sort of catalyst for what lies ahead than they ever imagined when
they first set out making that movie, where it'll be all right, Flash
messed up everything, you got eighty nine Batman, you got this person,
you got that person, and then at the end it'll be I don't know
why I thought of that that SNL season where they didn't know who they were
going to keep which cast members. So they pretended like there was a fire
in the studio do you remember that? And they're like, well, who's
gonna make it through, you know, like to the next season, like
let's see and Lauren Michaels like takes John Love's hand and pulls them across and
like, you know, so you think it's gonna be like that where Flash
is like, um, mamoa, take my hand, can take my hand?
Sorry to other people, then like go into whatever prime universe. You
know, I wouldn't doubt it, honestly, I think because because Gunn has
said that the Flash movie he is said by the way that it's one of
the best superhero movies you've ever seen, which I find interesting because he doesn't
have really any skin in that game, you know what. I'm sure,
well, or does he does this like kick off whatever he's planning to do,
But he he didn't need to say that. It's kind of my point,
right, that's true. That's true. He could leave that in the
dust and say you know, Flash is coming too, but he's like and
buy the way, yeah, right, But he said, are they that's
the one that resets the universe? He said that hm An Aquaman comes out
after that, right right, right, right Aquaman two. So that that
is very telling to me anyway. It did Mamoa do some post like a
video of himself on Warner Brothers that like I'm so happy, like not saying
anything, but you're like, well okay, and everybody's trying to as a
pruder that, right, you know. And I was like, is he
so happy that he gets to keep being Aquaman? Yeah? I don't know.
I think he's a great Aquaman. I want him to stick around.
I think I read a separate quote. I think it was from Peter Saffren.
He says Jason wants to do a trilogy. He'll get his trilogy,
all right, referring to Aquament. Yeah. So that to me, says,
well, then they're probably keeping that character around. Yeah. I think
Alga dot Is is more of like a moving target right now. I don't
know. I don't know what because because they've got a new Superman coming,
They've got a new Batman coming, right right, right, right? I
forgot about the Batman one. Yeah. Well here's another thing. We got
lanterns. Yeah. Yeah. This is about a company that makes light fixtures
in the it's kind of a man on the street perspective. So this is,
uh, this is going to be a Green Lantern TV series for HBO
Max or HBO. I guess they haven't said uh. And and Saffrance is
our vision for this is very much in the vein of True Detective, and
it'll have the Hell Jordan and John Stewart Green Lantern character is solving some kind
of space crimes that apparently leads into whatever the big big thing they're they're building
up to. M M. True Detective. So bleak and fart, sniffy,
there's my hot take. No, um no, yeah, all right,
I'm into it. I'm into it. You know. It's funny because
because once you get past Superman, this list starts reading like the conversation you
have with the kid on the playground. I was in charge, this is
what I would do. It kind of does right, I mean, not
to skip ahead, but sort of like swamp thing. You're like, yeah,
oh well, I'll be yeah. I mean, there's I got that.
I got those vibes because because the next up on the list you have
the authority, which I'm gonna go ahead and say, Brian has no idea
what the authority is. I do not. Okay, see that. So
The Authority was not originally it was not even a DC property. It was
actually Wildstone was created by Jim Lee at his company, um, and then
it jumped over it became a DC property because they've just bought his company.
Okay, but it's kind of it's meant to be like a gritty, realistic
and I'm using air quotes version of The Justice League. Okay, So you
have characters who are in essence like pastiche characters sort of Watch Many a little
bit, but not as dark as that. But yeah, in that vein,
so the Authorities. The Authority is a spin off of the original version
is called Stormwatch and became The Authorities written by Warren Ellis. And for example,
you have two characters in the Authority are Apollo and Midnighter, And Apollo
is like the hopeful superpowered hero and Midnighter is the dark vigilante in a mask.
So these are pastiches of Superman and Batman. The difference being that Apollo
and Midnighter are a gay couple. So you know, the it's it's essentially
like this is what I find interesting. It's like, well, The Authority
is a great book. You know, but it works as a pastiche of
the Justice League. I was gonna say, if your kickstarting Batman and Superman
off, it feels a little, right, redundant. Yeah, that's kind
of my thought, right, And I'm also like it it feels this is
where we get into like I'll believe it when it happens, right, because
I'm just like, I don't know, you know, sure, sure,
we're starting to get into like maybe you know, I think it would be
a great I think it's a great idea for something. I wouldn't say a
movie. I would say maybe like a series, you know, like they
did The Watchman. Serious, yes, yes, something in that vein.
But I the idea that this is meant to exist in the same universe that
you have a Justice League also that is meant to show up at some point
I'm assuming, Yeah, that's odd to me. I do appreciate the bold
move, but I have to admit, if the Authority was coming out this
summer, I might catch it. Sure, you know what I mean,
But like if you put out Batman and you put out Superman and kind of
get me primed and then you start building out, you know, to the
other corners, I mean, I know, I'm just saying what Marvel does,
but like it kind of works. It works for a reason. I
don't know, but we'll see that. I definitely like, like you just
staying in the Gun neighborhood, right, we we we went through a whole
phase and a half before we got to Guardians with the Galaxy. Yeah,
sure, yeah, And it feels like the authority is something in that vein,
you know, totally totally right. Uh, what else they got?
Oh, here's here's one you might find interesting, Brian Paradise Lost. Okay,
so this is this is an HBOO Max series that's the origin of Themiscira.
Actually that that doesn't like something i'd be interested in, right, kind
of a Game of Thrones Wonder Woman origin without Wonder Woman in it. Yeah,
And like I have, like, you know, like a surface knowledge
of it. So I'm like, all right, let's dig in. So
this is where I appreciate that Gun really is coming at it as just like
a comic book node mmmm, because this is stuff where you know, he
sees the potential there and I'm like, well, that's that's a good idea.
And in that vein, obviously you can't have a DC universe without Batman,
and so we have the Brave and the Bold. Yeah. Yeah,
so tell me about this. I have not read read this. So this
is based on a comic book storyline called Batman and Son hum which is all
about how Batman and his wife Olive Oil they have a son. Oh wait,
that's Papaye and son. Sorry. Oh. I was like, you're
you're kidding me. Sorry, wrong. Thing Now this is he has a
son with Atalia Ah okay, and she raises him to be just this little
shit who's like ten years old and he's going to be assassin. And then
she just drops him off at Batman's doorstep and she's like here, here,
he is, peace out. And so now Batman has this son he's never
known, whom he has to train to not be a murderer, and so
he becomes his new Robin. I gotta be honest, that sounds really cool,
right. At the same time, that is a movie I want to
see period. At the same time, if you're trying to kick off something
that you want to last for the next ten plus years, I guess.
I mean, obviously the kid will grow older, but there's always It reminds
me of a Superman returns, right where kind of like saddling a superhero with
a kid, it can sometimes become like a weight, dragging it down a
little bit. Like that's well, here's my thought on this. I think
that they're probably looking at this in terms of, well, Matt Reeves is
still doing his thing. Yeah, that's a good point. So Matt Reeves
has a bat universe, and we know there's going to be a sequel to
the Batman, there's going to be the Penguin television show, and I'm assuming
other stuff, right, and and that's Batman early years, which I think,
without realizing is what I was sort of saying, I want to spend
some time with yeah before yeah, exactly. So I'm guessing that you you
cast well, I don't know, I mean, how much older do you
want to cast? Right? I mean I would say, you cast a
Batman who's in his mid thirties, you're probably good. Yeah. So that
would that's like how Pattinson is anyway, isn't it. Yeah, I would
guess. Yeah, right, so so I think but my guess my point
is this Matt Reeves is really drilling down into this is gritty grounded, like
you thought Nolan was gritty and grounded. Well you know, screw you,
that's his right, and so your face. Yeah exactly. So I think
this is going to be the more fanciful, you know, more comic bookie.
And I don't mean that in a pejor sense version of Batman. That
sounds fun to me, honestly, I'm I'm ready for that. I And
the reason I say this is that if you've read the Grant Morrison run on
Batman, which spanned several years, I mean, it really is its own
little Batman epic. What Grant Morrison, what they wanted to do was create
a version of the character that could encompass the dark and the light, like
all the different iterations, you know. And and that was something Grant Morrison
was really hit hard on. Like, like what Grant Morrison said, as
far as they're concerned, every story that Batman has ever been in happened.
And so that's a spectrum that's able to encompass all these different tones, right
yeah, right, right. And this is this is a meta conversation that
you and I have all the time where I'm like, look, Batman can
be the animated series and the brave and the bold Cartoon Show and the Adam
West Show and the Matt Reeves and it's all Batman. Yeah, so that
was the Grant Morrison approach, and the fact that James Gunn is looking at
that as something to build on. I'm like, well, that's interesting to
me. Yeah, I can dig it, right So, and certainly,
again, Joe, I think, just well, you got to do something
to differentiate it from whatever Matt Reeves is going to be doing, you know.
And I, if I'm being entirely honest, I really enjoyed the Matt
Reeves the Batman, but it's a lot, you know. And and I
was thinking, like, oh, so this is like the next ten years
of Batman, and I will anticipate them to a degree, but I don't,
you know, I'm like, okay, buckle up, like you know,
like this is gonna be heavy. And I kind of like then that
these can co exist, because I'm okay with heavy Batman, but I don't
want that to be the only Batman for a long time. So I kind
of like the prospect here where I can kind of get both. I agree
with that, you know, And I think certainly the Reeves version doesn't lend
itself to a broader superhero universe. So fine, just put that in its
own I don't I don't want to see that that version end. And and
A Gun has even said this is going to have its own sort of header,
right, like DC else Worlds or something. That's right. Yeah,
so like the Joker sequel that they're doing, yeah, which I don't think
they should be doing. But it's I mean, but yeah, it's interesting.
I keep forgetting about that, but I mean I keep forgetting that the
first one made over a billion dollars, yeah, which is why they absolutely
And then I you know, Lady Gaga's in it, and it's I I
gotta admit, I'm very curious. See And actually to that point, I
think the fact that the sort of the Suicide Squad verse is continuing its on
way, I think that's a way of keeping Margot Robbie in the mix,
right right, oh right, Peacemaker and yeah yeah, yeah, smart,
I think I think it's smart. Yeah yeah, so uh so that's the
brave and the bold I mentioned the the the Batman sequel is just for twenty
twenty five, same year as Superman. Oh yeah, yeah, so well
but the first time ever you have a Superman movie and a Batman moving in
the same year, assuming dates don't slip. Well, yeah, we got
Booster Gold. I'm excited about this one. Brian, Okay, yeah,
you're gonna have to premium speed. Well, it's a Booster Gold is a
comic book character who I was introduced to via the Justice League in the mid
eighties. And there was an iteration of the Justice League in the mid eighties
where they didn't have any of the heavy hitters. So no Superman, no
Wonder Woman. Batman was like the biggest name, and it was just it
was like the Blue Beetle and these various characters who were just kind of um,
you know, it's sort of like it's imagine a superhero version of The
Office. Okay, So they would they would fight bad guys and stuff,
but it was also just as much about the banter and them playing pranks on
each other and things like that. That's fun, okay, you know.
And you had Blue Beetle and Booster Gold were like this this comedy duo,
okay, and it was just it's one of the great runs of that title
in my opinion. So Booster Gold, he's a guy from the future.
He's like a janitor in the future, all right, and he basically steals
some future technology and sends himself into the past because he's like, well,
my life in my present sucks, so I'm going to go back to the
past where I have knowledge of the future, and I'll become a superhero and
then people will respect me. I like it already, yeah right, yeah,
I'm like, well, I love the character, and I love that
they're approaching it as an HBO Max series because I'm like, this would totally
works as a series, totally totally. I like, it just feels so
totally different too, Yeah, as long as you're going to do all this
at the same time. Now, now speaking are different because this is a
character who just had an incarnation recently. We have a Supergirl movie called Supergirl
Woman of Tomorrow right right, which I don't know that much about. It's
based on a recent run by a writer named Tom King. But I think
I've said before, like I basically tapped out of DC of just comics in
general after like twenty ten, so I'm not super familiar with this, but
I think they're they're coming at it from a darker angle, just to contrast
her with Superman. Okay, so what they were You know what I read
in that statement from Saffron about Superman he's a symbol of hope et here.
It's this is a quote from well, I don't know who said this,
whether it's Gun or Saffron, but the quote is, we'll see the difference
between Superman, who has sent to Earth and raised by loving parents from the
time he was an infant, versus Supergirl, raised on a rock, a
chip off of Krypton, who watched everyone around her die and be killed in
terrible ways for the first fourteen years of her life and then comes to Earth.
Well, that's that's kind of an interesting angle. Yeah, I love
it different. He's older than Superman, but because of timey whymy wibbly wobbly
space travel stuff, she comes to Earth and she's younger than him. So
he's her baby cousin who's now older than her. M Okay, So why,
um, why why go through all that? Why? That was something
that they added in the comics in the in the two thousands. Yeah,
so here's some backster. So Supergirl has existed since the nineteen fifties, and
um, she was always his Superman's younger cousin she shows up on Earth,
She's like, hey, here I am, yeah, and you know,
while you eat you know what? Um And and then in the in the
in the nineteen eighties, there was a mini series called Crisis on Infinite Earths,
which I think you know of, yeah, and that was where DC
kind of reset its continuity. So they killed off Supergirl in that story.
That was a big deal, and then they re rebooted Superman after that.
And one of the one of the ground rules that they put in place with
Superman was that he is and I think they misread this, but you know,
he's the last son of Krypton. So they're like, he is the
last Kryptonian. There's no one else, okay, right, So basically for
twenty years there there was, let me rephrase, there was no Kryptonian Supergirl.
However, Supergirl is a DC property, and they wanted to preserve the
merchandising opportunities and the licensing and whatnot, soy they arrived at a way of
having a Supergirl character who basically looked like the original Supergirl, but her origin
was that she was a protoplasmic entity from another planet who came to Earth and
sort of imprinted on Superman and then she merged with a earthborn angel from the
heaven Realm. I mean, I'm not making any of this up. Yeah,
and it was a lot. And the problem was that if you're trying
to boil down a character's origin, you say, well, Superman, he's
a last survivor of this planet, you know, the flash. So he
got dipped in these chemicals and you know, well, Supergirl, well sit
down and drink some water because here and open your mind. Yeah, exactly
right. So they they reintroduced the Kryptonian Supergirl into the comics in like two
thousand four or five, I think it was okay. And so when they
did that, they came up with this idea that, oh, she was
initially sent to krypt sent from not even from Krypton, but whatever, the
Kryptonian city she's from to watch over Kalel. But her ship got you know,
you know, way laid along the way or whatever. And by the
time she lands on Earth so much time, it's been you know whatever,
thirty years or whatever, and he's he's a grown up already, right,
And I think they just did that to kind of give like an interesting new
angle to the story. Sure, sure, sure, but I'm like,
well, that's probably that's kind of an interesting approach to take. Yeah,
yeah, no, I get it, I get it. I appreciate you
sharing that because now now I have it in my head. That's a lot.
Yeah, so that's that's again. They haven't said what it is,
but I believe it's meant to be a film. And then lastly, you
alluded this earlier. We have Swamp Thing, which yeah, is meant to
be a horror film. Now here's the thing about whenever these people say,
oh, this comic book thing is going to be a horror film, I
treat that as suspect sort of like the latest example would be Doctor Strange.
Right, that's right, it was gonna be a horror film, which I
mean it was. It was horrific at times. I will admit that has
probably come the closest to write, you know when when people make that proclamation,
because yeah, you know, I had like decaying faces and those sorts
of things. What's funny, Brian, I was. I was watching that
with Dominic because she didn't she didn't go to the theater, and we got
to the part where Anson Mount like his mouth gets sealed and he blows his
brain open or whatever. Yeah, I remember that. Yeah, I'll let
you I'll let you imagine that in your head. Yeah. And literally I'm
and was like, okay, I'm not watching this anymore. And oh really
we never finished it. We never finished it. Wow, that's so interesting
because that, to me was horrifying but also still had kind of a colorful
sheen to it, like it felt acceptable within the Marvel boundaries or something.
But it was like the stuff that surprised me was yeah, closer to the
end with like the corpses and all that stuff. Yes, Like she she
didn't get there yet. We never made it. She was like, did
you take as out of this? And I was like, no, I
I didn't see it, but I'm assuming there was an eye dart there.
Yeah. I was like, of course not. Um so so she ducked
out of there. Meanwhile, I'm like, but it so cool? Is
braid blew up is amazing? You know? Right? But James Gunn,
I mean, he's kind of a horror guy, so it makes sense that
he'd be like, all right, let me have a little fun over here,
you know. But what's funny about is swamp thing. Like we just
did swampthing, just a couple of years ago. If you remember, there
was that TV series, short lived, but people liked it, right,
I thought it was pretty good. Yeah, um, but I get you
know, Swamp Thing. They've actually done a bunch which I actually didn't realize
this, but there was, of course two movies. The first one directed
by Wes Craven. Wow. I don't know if I knew that. I
know they're like trauma things. That's the only thing I knew about them.
I mean, they're trauma ish, but they're not from trauma. Oh they're
not. Oh I thought they were trauma. Oh I see No, No,
you're you're thinking of the Tuxic Avenger. That's what I'm thinking about it.
Yeah. Yeah. The first swamp Thing movie, it stars Ray Wise
by the way as like the scientist or becomes like that's what I think of
I could see, right, Yeah, and Adrian Barbeau, isn't it.
But yeah, Wes Craven, so this is pre night man. I'm straight.
I'm pretty sure, Okay, and it I mean, I wouldn't say
it's a good movie, but I think it's good for what it what it's
doing, you know. Sure, Sure, And then they did the sequel
which was like eighty eight or eighty nine, I think it was just before
Batman and you're like, okay, so we're just this is just camp.
Sure, sure, sure, that's what it is. In my head.
I think that even why I sort of mixed it up a toxic Avenger and
all that. Yeah. The second one was because Heather Lockleyer is in it
as the love interest and it's pretty ridiculous. And then I don't know if
you remember this, there was a TV series on the USA kind of I
don't think I had cable in that era, so it's like it's like a
vague sort of little thing in my head. But yeah, you know,
I knew of the show, and it was only relatively recently that I found
out that it lasted for like sixty some episodes, like a long time.
Huh right. It shows also not good? Oh really no, I mean
they had like a dollar fifty to make this thing. Sure sure. And
then there was also an animated series, Dad I do remember, yeah,
yeah, and and it the theme song was swamp Thing song to the tune
of Wild Thing. I think I think that's the only reason it's memorable.
But anyway, my point is they have done a lot with swamp Thing,
far more than I realized. Yeah, yeah, same, I just didn't
think about it. I just picture like a VHS cover I saw it at
the video store when I was young. That like made an impression on me.
Yeah, and and so I'm kind of like, Okay, well that
that's all well and good, But but what what they've never really captured on
screen um is sort of the Allen More take on the character, which is
I think what he's most known for what what Swamping is most known for sure,
which is which is what like what what's his sort of take? So
what he did he comes in and so so the the swamp Thing character was
essentially, here's a scientist who he's experimenting. These bad guys show up,
he gets doust with these chemicals, he jumps into the bog and then it
merges with him and he comes out as swamp Thing, right, And what
Alan Moore did is he he did a story called, I think it's called
The Anatomy lesson that that was his first issue I think, where basically swamp
Thing is being sort of dissected by actually by by the character Jason Woodrow who's
played by John Glover in Batman and Robin oh huh uh. But he what
swamp Thing finds out anyway, is that he's not Alec Holland reborn as a
swamp creature. He is a bunch of swampshit that thinks it's Alac Holland.
Huh. So like Alac Holland already died and there's just swamp Thing is just
something else, you know. And and that was kind of a big deal
at the time. That was sort of you know, it was a last
Jedi esque kind of pivot pot. Yeah, exactly. And so you know,
he had a great run on the title for quite a while. And
I think for among comic fans, if if they have any fondness, it's
because of what Alan Moore did. I'm guessing that that's what Gun wants to
get to with Swamp Thing. It certainly feels like if you're gonna do something
and you want to make it different, like that's one way to do to
approach it, right. You know. I gotta admit when I heard this
was happening, I was like, all right, But hearing about this stuff,
I'm like, well, now I'm I got something to connect with.
I'm like, that sounds interesting. I think, so, you know,
it could be like I'm I'm I'm cautious about all of this because honestly,
let's say Superman Legacy pulls a Superman returns, Well, then it came over
right at the starting gate, right, Yeah, why didn't that one land?
By the way, if you have a theory, and what can they
do to avoid that? Well, a couple thoughts. I think that first
of all, it was too expensive, and I think part of it is
because they folded in the development cost of like the previous ten years worth the
Superman films that they were trying to get made, because you had you had
the Tim Burton one, you had the one that Brett Ratner was going to
direct, like there's a few versions right right. And then the other thing
is I just think it was too dour. I mean, I honestly think
that people want to feel uplifted a little bit when it comes to Superman film
and people are like, oh, he was too slavish. We're talking about
Brian Singer to to um the tone of the Richard Donner film, and I'm
like, I that's not true because other than the sort of the window dressing
aspects, like I was going to say the aesthetic maybe, but yeah,
yeah, and even then, I mean, look at the Daily Planet.
It doesn't look anything like the other you know that, Like like Donner lent
the whole thing very similitude, and there was it was, it had a
wit. Yes, and and and I think that Superman Returns is very morose.
Yeah. I was gonna say like it has a fuzzy warmth to it
or something just visually like it looks like he was trying to copy like the
visuals. But yeah, I didn't missed those things that made Yeah. Yeah,
and I think there's stuff in it that I really like, but I
don't. I don't think he quite nailed the appeal of Superman the movie if
he was trying to make an homage to it, like I'm just I'm kind
of like. And then obviously the stuff about he's been in space, like,
I just think there was a lot. I think that it's just me.
I think that you could do a an homage to the the Donner film
and the Christopher Reeve films without needing to dig so deep into their continuity.
I think you could have just you do Superman. He kind of vaguely looks
like the other Superman. You have the music and people would have gone along
with it. I think that was the way to go. I don't think
we needed another origin yeah till a Superman story, you know. So I
think with Man of Steel it was just as much a response to Superman atturns
with super that was a complaint or Superman. What does he He doesn't do
anything. He he fights an island or something, you know, right right,
He's like, all right, well in this one, he's gonna fight.
You know, he's gonna tear down a half the city and you know,
and then people got upset about that too, right, right, But
everything's a response to the other thing, you know. So I guess what
Superman legacy it's going to be a response to Man of Steel. Sure,
yeah, you know, for good or for ill, that's what's going to
happen. Yeah, but I'm excited. I am excited though, for like
a new Superman. Like it feels like a fresh start, you know,
even if some actors characters carry over, Like I'm ready let's start a new
journey. I'm mean, what what they still have next year's slate coming up?
Right, so you've got or not next year? This year we're in.
We're in next year, Shazam is about a month from now, Flash
is in the summer, Blue Beetle is coming in August, and then Aquaman
in December. So you got Blue Beetle and Aquaman coming out after the Flash.
And I was thinking, I was like, well, if Flash is
meant to restart the universe, they could have switched up the scheduling if Aquaman
was not meant to exist in this new universe. So there's a reason that
they're they're keeping it the way it is, right. You know what they
now now teen Titans, or rather it's it's just called Titans. That series
has been going on HBO Max that's ending, Doom Patrol that is ending.
Pennyworth the Origin of Batman's Butler. Yes, Pennyworth Colin the Origin of Batman's
Butler. That is ending, right. I think the only DC show that
is continuing on for a short while is Superman and Lewis h okay, And
I think a Gunn said something the effected like, well, everyone likes it,
it's doing well, yeah, we'll let it run for at least another
couple of seasons. Okay, So I could see that ending just before this
new movie. Comes out. Yeah, that that makes sense, right,
the timing, timing would work out, and then and then the plan is
basically all of the everyone needs to be rolling in the same direction. So
essentially they're gonna do what Marvel is doing with the Disney plus shows and all
that. Right, So that is a lot, Well, that is a
lot. That is a lot. But I mean, could I say the
audience, could we have a better guide than Zachi helping us way through this
announcement? Well, here here's something interesting. H James Gunn said that he
has spoken with Zack Snyder about all this. Oh huh, and Zack Snyder
told him to kick rocks. Yuh, don't let the door hit you now.
Um uh. It says here that you know, I don't know if
you know this, but and you wouldn't because you don't live online. But
the Zaddies, bless their little hearts, they are obviously very upset about this.
They're they're taking, they're taking. But of course, sure, yeah,
because this means that that the you know, the the universe that they've
been clamoring for is is fanito. Now what they want is for Netflix to
buy the Snyder Verse. That feels like an Internet idea, right, yeah,
godless. So there's there's a hashtag like, you know, sell you
know, sell the Snyder Verse to Netflix or some such. But basically they
want they want Netflix to buy whatever Snyder had planned originally. So that's you
know, three Justice League movies, Ben Affleck's Batman movie, which again he
has said he does not want to do right right the man said I would
have drunk myself to death if I made that movie, and yikes, I
mean that, you know, good, then don't make it like I don't
want him to do it, you know, to punish himself. Uh.
And and then yeah, they want the alternate David a or cut up suicide
squad. So okay, so that's it's like guys like, I mean,
what do you even watch that? By the way, yes I would,
but yeah, I think at least you know that universe. There's there's there's
something there. I mean, that's a box set there. So that's that's
something to be happy about if nothing else. You know. I'm I'm I
said this when when Snyder's Justice League cut, I'm like, this thing was
written off as an impossibility, and there it is. It's you can own
a you can own a blu ray of it. Take the win yep.
Anyway, So James Gunn, uh it took you know, notice of of
this what was going on? And he says, I have to say,
this has got to be the wackiest hashtag ever. Everybody. What was the
hashtag? Again? The like, sell the Snyder Verse thing whatever it is,
sell the Snyder Verse to Netflix. That's the hashtag. So here's here's
what James Gunn said. He says, Number one, Netflix hasn't expressed any
such interest, although we've discussed other stuff. And two Zach hasn't expressed any
interest and seems to be happy doing what he's doing. And yes, we
two have talked. He contacted me to express his support about my choices.
He's a great guy. Again, he seems really happy with the massive world
building he's doing. Now he's doing that whole um those zombie movies. But
he's this other thing too, write the sci fi like his Star Wars.
Basically, yeah, a rebel moon I think it's called. Yeah, And
people forget that like Snyder and James Gunn work together. Yeah yeah, Gunn
wrote that. Yeah, yeah, we forget that right now. Now what
what gun says? We know We're not going to make every single person happy
every step of the way, but we can promise everything we do is done
in the service of the story and in the service of the characters we know
you cherish, and we have cherished our whole lives. Uh it sounds to
me, I mean just from the slate he is a fan. Yes,
yes, that's It's like he's like, let me get to work and read
some of this stuff and we'll we'll plot something out. Like he's he's got
the toys and now he's excited to open the chest and then have some fun.
I think, what what what I'm What infuses me about this Gods and
Monster slate is he's got a proper proportion of big guns and deep cuts.
Huh yeah, And I think that's that's kind of what you need, you
know. And that's I would say even for someone like me who's like a
casual casual as they get fan of this stuff, like you know, like
that's what I want. I want more Superman, I want more Batman.
But like guardians, I like being introduced and getting excited about new things.
Also, so I like I'm intrigued by the possibilities, like oh well,
I don't know. This office superhero office thing sounds kind of intriguing, like
I can't wait to hopefully fall in over that alongside the stuff that I also
know and can't wait to see. Well, with that in mind, I
would love for our listeners to write in with their comments. What do you
think about the James Gunn DC slate? Do you think it'll even happen again?
I have to say I prefaced all of this with I remain skeptical.
Yeah, well there'll probably be some red marker on the right. Yeah,
on this list coming up over the years, I think some stuff is gonna
get crossed out. Yeah, and like rearranged and rethought and I'm sure,
well, you know there was a dark universe that was planned with Tom Cruise
and Johnny Depp and how Very Bardam and Angelina Joe Lee. Yeah, and
uh we all point and laugh at that. Now, Russell Crowe, Russell
crow it's going to be there, Nick Fury, Nick Fury, h So
you know I am I am, if not skeptical, I am cautious.
But with that, like I said, let us know your thoughts. You
can emails at Movie Film Podcast at gmail dot com. You can also hit
like on our Facebook page, Facebook dot com, slash Movie Film Podcast and
message just there. If you're looking for me, I'm line. You can
find me on Twitter for now. Let's see how how long that continues to
be the case at Zackie's Corner. That's also my website SAP dot com,
and you can see my reviews at the San Francisco Chronicle and also at IgM.
Brian, what do you have going on? Well, I can't remember
if I said this on the last episode, but Puppy Dog Pals, the
final episode is out. It is now a completed series. It's it's kind
of amazing. So that is all out there, you know, Disney Channel,
Disney Plus, Disney Junior, and just today Thursday the eighth or whatever.
This is Young Jedi Adventures, the Star Wars animated show that I'm working
on currently, has officially announced a release date, which is May the fourth,
if you can believe it, and they'll be coming out on Disney Plus
and Disney Junior. So it is wild for me. I've been on this
for yeah, gosh, coming up on two years maybe or something, and
like seeing these images finally released in these characters and it's it's very exciting,
so looking forward to the lead up to this. So I love this this
show. I'm really excited about it. Well I know, I know I'm
excited to see it, and I know everyone listening is curious to see it
as well. Yeah, yeah, what's exciting about it too? And with
your kids even in mind some of your kids is it's really I mean,
it is for a younger audience, but the whole idea behind it is,
you know, I've had a lot of parents tell me my friends, I
want to show my kids Star Wars, but they're not ready, like they
either can't sit that long or you know, a little things are too intense
or whatever. But this is sort of that that on ramp. This is
the introduction to lightsabers and the Force and Jedi and these you know ships and
the light speed and all this stuff, and then hopefully getting that sort of
building in excitement and you know, a familiarity with these sights and sounds,
and then they're like, hey, give me more of this, and you're
like, well, if I got something for you, and you get to
show them the movies and hopefully make them fans. So wow, okay,
well, well we will be back in our next episode talking about aunt Man
on the Wasp Quantumnia. So that will be our next episode, but until
next time on behalf of my partner Brian Home. My name is Zachi Hassan.
This has been movie film two sixty three. Catch next time. Thanks
everybody, welcome back. Stoby Podcast Podcasting joined the show Jacky and Ryan and
talking about the baby each Morning Now podcast on the radio.