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Hudson River Radio dot com. This
is Travis Walton and you are listening to

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UFO Headquarters Feutiful Headquarters, and welcome
to another exciting episode of UFO Headquarters.

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I am Michael Wharton and as always
with Linda Zimmerman. Linda, how are

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you doing. I'm doing great?
How about you? You know we're talking

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about UFOs. I'm doing really good. And I wanted to mention the episode

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tonight is called Government Lies and Deception, and it's a very fitting title,

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not just for what we're going to
discuss, but basically the government's approached to

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UFOs in general since at least nineteen
forty seven has been lies in deception.

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Yeah, I think I think this
could be the first of a ninety eight

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part series. Yeah. I think
that, you know, you know,

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from discounting the incredible witnesses of pilots
and combat veterans all the way to astronomers

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and telling them, you know,
well, you don't know what that was

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Venus apparently don't know what venus is, you know, or swamp gas or

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whatever it is. So these two
I think tonight the stories are really exciting

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and compelling. Absolutely, and um
we are going to start out the show

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with a bombshell, and in my
world, it's a bombshell. In the

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world of Hudson Valley UFOs and the
wave of the eighties, this is a

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bombshell. As we have spoken about
in the in the past episodes, during

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the nineteen eighties, there was that
huge Hudson Valley wave, thousands and thousands

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of witnesses saw these massive triangular silent
craft and discs and you name it,

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and in as little as an hour
after a mass sighting or sometimes the next

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day, at the exact same time, those hoaxing pilots in the cessnas and

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the ultra lights would be seen following
the exact same path of the craft.

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Like Yeah, one witness said,
it was just uncanny. It was like

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they knew exactly where it had been. So for years I've been saying,

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while either these pilots in their little
flying clubs were monitoring police broadcasts, but

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still, I don't know that that
would give you the exact flight path.

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No, maybe one time you could
guess it. But isn't that something we've

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talked about in the past with wondering
how did these cessnas and ultra lights always

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seem to show up like yeah,
it was like the and I will confirm

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for the listeners. You called me
right after you learn this information. It

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was like, I mean, you
were excited, and I was like,

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and it's amazing information. It's it
doesn't happen often in this field or any

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field. To have that either,
to get this confirmation, which is which

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is coming up hanging there I have. So, you know, we're speculating

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and wondering why did the FAA never
punish these pilots. They were breaking the

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law, several laws. They were
being a public menace, they were a

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safety hazard. You know, why
didn't they do anything? Okay, So

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for years been speculating the government might
have had something behind this, And of

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course, oh, you're a conspiracy
you know. Nut. If you think

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the government was behind it, well, guess what. I gave a lecture

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a few weeks ago. And after
the lecture, this man in the audience

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start telling me about his son in
law's grandfather who flew hot air balloons and

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ultra lights and lived in the Hudson
Valley. And I'm thinking, okay,

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that's a nice story. It got
better. This man belonged to an ultralight

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club that flew out of Stormville,
Stormville, Duchess that area. I'm my,

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I'm starting to get more interested.
And he did this in the nineteen

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eighties during the big wave of sightings, and apparently after a major sighting,

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the FAA would call him tell him
where the craft was seen, so that

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he could get his ultralight club together
and fly over the same area in the

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same direction, following the same path
to provide a cover story for the sighting

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bingo game set match. There it
is. The freaking FAA was complicit.

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They were behind at least some of
the fact that hoaxing pilots would be mimicking

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the path, and they went against
their own guidelines ultra lights. They have

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guidelines ultra lights cannot fly a half
an hour after sunset. And here's somebody

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from the FAA calling this ultralight pilot, Look, get your buddies together and

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fly this path over this town.
And what the hell? Yeah, that's

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just amazing information. And to get
that firsthand from somebody who also got you

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know, at least it was passed
down from a somewhat reliable source. I

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mean, of course we're not interviewing
the direct source. I'm sure the Grandpa

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was probably deceased at this point.
Unfortunately he passed away last year. He

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was out there all that time.
I was looking for him. But you

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know, and when this man was
telling me, he didn't know that that.

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He just thought it was an interesting
fact. He didn't realize I have

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been searching for some sort of corroboration
for decades and there it was. I

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was, Yeah, I was bouncing
off the walls and I'm like, I

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gotta call Mike. Yeah, I
was. I mean when you called him,

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like, Okay, what is either
she's won the lottery or found something

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great, and it was It wasn't
the lottery, but it was the research

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lottery. I guess you could say
it was. Yes, it was the

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research lottery. So what does this
mean? Why did the FAA do this?

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What I mean, they were obviously
trying to cover So what do you

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think cover it up? But why? You know, I think this way,

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by having the ultra life or the
cessnas or whatever was being used present

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in the immediate aftermath of these sightings, it could always raise that reasonable doubt,

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so to speak. Oh well there
was ultra lights in the area.

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Oh look, we have a flight
log of ultra lights, or we have

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you know, a sessa or people
saw the airplane take off, and then

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they can always say, well,
well, yeah, people saw things.

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They're mistaken on the time, you
know, yeah they thought it was five

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thirty, It was really probably closer
to six. And back then, I

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mean, we didn't have cell phones. How many people were so in tune

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with the time. Nowadays, we
probably know more about the time of the

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day because we're constantly staring at a
phone in front of our face. So

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it would be and we'd be taking
pictures today of these things. But no

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one walked around cameras back then,
and I think it was a great way

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to establish doubt and cast, you
know, shred the witnesses, so to

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speak, like, no, that's
not what you saw. You saw,

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you know, an airplane. They
were flying out of the airport at that

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time. And then people also go, well, it look like an airplane,

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but I guess yeah, if they
said it's an airplane, I mean,

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and they start to doubt themselves in
what they heir own eyes saw.

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So why was the FAA doing this, Who were they protecting? What were

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they covering up? Was it something
government or was it something they knew was

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beyond their control? And was just
trying to hide it, so absolutely huge.

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I'm I'm going to hopefully get more
information. Oh, I will get

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more information. I'm hoping they still
have this man's log book, his flight

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logs, because if I can,
yes, if I can show you know,

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March twenty fourth at seven pm there
was a mass sighting and suddenly March

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twenty fourth, at eight pm,
the ultralight club took off, you know

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what I'm saying. So so I'm
just I am just ecstatic with that information

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because finally, and that just ends
up a whole other can of worms.

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And for people who say, oh, it was all you know, all

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the sightings were just these guys faking
it. No, all this was guys

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faking it after the FAA told them
where the real sighting was. So the

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flight log would be fascinating because if
you can take the dates that he flew

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during that period and match them up
with more than one event, you know

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one, Okay, I'll give you
a coincidence, you start matching up multiple

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yeah years. Yeah, that could
lead to a whole nother down a huge

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that would be an atomic level bomb
discovery and research terms. Yeah, Mike,

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we may need your your freedom of
Information Act Request skills to see if

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my pen's ready ready, I do
have a case from the Hudson Valley that

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matches exactly. You know this now
explains, So let me just go over

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this one. It was Dover Plains, New York, nineteen eighty seven.

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A whole family, three generations of
this family, see a huge diamond shaped

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UFO. They described it as having
a gray metal frame, porthole, windows,

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girders, I mean, very bizarre. And they all said it had

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these beautiful multi colored jewel like lights, and it was moving extremely slowly tree

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top level. They did have the
presence of mind to grab a camera and

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take pictures. These were thirty five
millimeter and when they had it developed,

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the film was black, which you
know happens with radiation and things. So

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a spotlight actually beamed down on them. That's disconcerting. And one of them

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said, it was like every molecule
in my body was shaking, buzzing and

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reverberating. That's a that's a moment
in your life you don't forget. And

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one of them said this bothered me
for a long time. I mean,

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how do you defend against this?
That's a good point there, you go.

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You know, so they called the
police, and the police literally laughed

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at them and asked, are you
seeing pink elephants? Too? So that's

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nice. Now, just to preface
this a little. One of the witnesses

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name was Grace and her father was
a Cessna pilot, so she knew Cessna's

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in and out, flew in Cessna's, you know, she knew everything about

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Cessna's The next not that night,
but the next night, the very next

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night, at this same exact time, they see seven Cessnas in a v

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formation and she said, quote,
they flew the same exact route, the

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same route. There was no question
that those were planes though I know as

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Cessna from whatever that thing was right. So this was a case where I

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guess the Cessna guys couldn't get together
that night, so they know the path,

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they know the exact time, and
I wonder how they found that out.

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Yeah, and we have a witness
who knew the difference between what that

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person saw and what Assessa looked like, yes, and sounded like because the

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other one was silent. So you
know the other thing I'm waiting to find

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out now that we know the FAA
government sanction and cover up here or muddying

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the waters. Did they pay them? I think they must have, because

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most of I know the names of
a lot of these Cessna and ultra light

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pilots. They were commercial pilots.
If they got busted, they could have

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lost their livelihood, They could have
lost their licenses for what for stupid prank?

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Why would you? Why would you
risk your your livelihood to pull people

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into thinking UFOs are out there unless
you're doing it under the protection of the

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FAA. Who's not going to yank
your license because you're doing what they've instructed

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you to do exactly exactly. So
take that anti conspiracy people. And one

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last thing about this story. It's
very funny. The father of this this

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woman had served his whole life in
the military, I guess for a long

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time, and when he comes out
of the house sees this massive, silent

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UFO and he says, oh,
it's just them. Okay, okay,

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what does that mean? Um?
I wish they had asked him, could

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you could you elaborate on that?
But they were a little busy watching this

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massive UFO. So um, how
about we take our first break and come

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back for a lot more of government
lies and deception. Hudson River Radio dot

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com Hudson River Radio dot Com,
a subsidiary of Glacier Entertainment called LC blasting

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the competition in New York's Hudson Valley. Welcome back to UFO headquarters, Linda.

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That really is fascinating information because you
know, we joke and call it

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like, you know, an apotomic
bomb level of research. But both of

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us have done research in a variety
of different fields, and when you get

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a breakthrough, there's no feeling like
it when you know it's a major piece

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of a puzzle. I always say
we're putting together puzzles without the benefit of

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the box. All we have are
scattered puzzle pieces. But the problem is

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it's about fifteen different puzzles that have
had all the pieces mixed together, so

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we don't know what we're putting together. We have no idea what it looks

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like. And here we are hunting
around and of course half the pieces are

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missing. So when you find that
critical piece, people that do genealogy are

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going to know the same feeling when
that genealogical you know, brick wall has

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overcome. So it is a great
feeling and that's could have a significant amount

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of you know, impact on how
we view the Hudson Valley weave. You

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said it brilliantly. That is,
it's just re defines the Hudson Valley wave.

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Now, it's it just puts it
in a different level. And maybe

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other people will come forward. Now
maybe I'll find you know that his log

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book exists and that maybe he wrote
something down. I don't know, but

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yeah, tremendous. So I just
want to cover one more thing before you

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launch into your major case. Nineteen
ninety seven, August third, New York

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Times article. You can look this
up headline CIA admits government lied about UFO

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sightings. Really what No, I
don't believe it. They said it was

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to protect and hide the growing fleets
of spy planes of the fifties and sixties.

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They claim that half of all sighting
were either of the U two or

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the SR seventy one spy planes.
Now, a lot of sightings were at

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tree top level. I would just
like to point out the U two flew

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at sixty thousand feet and the SR
seventy one flew at eighty thousand feet.

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So but yeah, so, if
for some reason some of you have access

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to the CIA journal called Studies of
Intelligence, there was an article CIA's Role

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in the Study of UFOs nineteen forty
seven to nineteen ninety by Gerald Haynes.

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This was actually the first admission of
federal deception. Clearly not the first deception,

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just the first admission of deception.
So the CIA tweeted in twenty fourteen,

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remember reports of unusual activity in the
skies in the fifties, that was

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us. So maybe some of it
was them, But that's a really ignorant

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answer when you look at the wealth
of sightings, particularly close up. So

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speaking of the nineteen fifties, Mike
take it away. Yes, before I

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jump in, I just wanted to
mention that, you know, the CIA

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just with that tweet, Oh that
was us. Again, it's one way

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to cast out on a whole blanket
of different sightings. What was us?

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But what does that mean? They're
not telling you when, where, what

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times? You know, they're not
giving you like, look, we have

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logs here that have been declassified.
They're just saying it was us. Well,

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that's an easy excuse. That doesn't
mean you're the CIA. I kind

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of expect you to not be honest. You know, you are spies,

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so you know, forgive us if
we're not a little you know, accepting

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of your word here. Yeah,
I cannot dismiss all two decades of sightings

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that it was just them and that
was it. Yeah, sorry, maybe

207
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one or two. Absolutely, But
like you said, a spy plane at

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sixty thousand feet, you're not mistaken
that for being over your trees in the

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backyard, right as we've seen in
the Hudson Valley, you know, over

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the swimming pool pulling water up out
of it. You know, like,

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no, it's not so that wasn't
the SR seventy one pulling in at eight

212
00:19:27.480 --> 00:19:33.559
thousand feet, no refueling practice.
Yeah, all right, So we're gonna

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jump back in time here to nineteen
fifties United States, and I just want

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to give a little context for the
listeners because some people may not quite understand

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what America was like in the fifties
and the post World War Two era.

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And as a historian, of course, I always like to put things in

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00:19:51.519 --> 00:19:56.160
context. You know. So the
nineteen fifties, we are in the Cold

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00:19:56.200 --> 00:19:59.079
War. You know, we've come
out of the World War two era,

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00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:02.759
the War two soldiers have returned home, they're now married, they're starting their

220
00:20:02.799 --> 00:20:06.440
families, and we are in a
Cold War with the Soviet Union, our

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former allies during the war against the
Nazis. We of course had the atomic

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bomb in forty five. The Soviets
developed the atomic bomb in nineteen forty nine,

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caught us off guard, caught us
by surprise, and basically sent us

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into a panic that the Soviet Union
now had atomic bombs in Europe. And

225
00:20:26.839 --> 00:20:36.720
so the Cold War era was fraught
with suspicions, espionage, communist infiltrators,

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00:20:37.000 --> 00:20:41.319
McCarthy ism. Remember the McCarthy hearings
from the late forties into the nineteen fifties,

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00:20:41.319 --> 00:20:45.559
people denouncing other people as communists and
you know, getting them blacklisted.

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Whether it was in Hollywood, the
fear was very real. You know.

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My dad used to talk about being
in elementary school and doing the duck and

230
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cover under the desk and yeah,
were you doing it? And I think

231
00:21:00.440 --> 00:21:03.160
he mentioned that he thought it was
so kind of even at a young age,

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00:21:03.200 --> 00:21:07.480
like what's a desk gonna do against
the tomic bomb? You know,

233
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here's an elementary kid, I guess, but he remembers that that was a

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real fear. He actually dug in
my grandparents' basement, started trying to dig

235
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a bomb shelter because you know,
they were preparing for the end of the

236
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world, so people are very patriotic. The Rosenbergs have been convicted a year

237
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before of espionage and we're later electrocuted
in sing Sing for spying against the United

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States fifty three they were executed,
So it's just a different era. We're

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00:21:37.079 --> 00:21:38.960
in the midst of the Korean War, a proxy war with the Soviets.

240
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So hopefully people get this really big
image that this is a different world in

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00:21:45.160 --> 00:21:49.000
nineteen fifties and specifically in the summer
of nineteen fifty two. And as I

242
00:21:49.079 --> 00:21:52.400
was researching this, I was going
through a lot of different newspaper articles and

243
00:21:53.240 --> 00:21:59.039
unfortunately my browser crashed and I couldn't
save one. But there was some places

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00:21:59.200 --> 00:22:04.839
running saw ads for m saucers sales
on the weekends, like for two consecutive

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00:22:04.880 --> 00:22:07.599
weekends. You could get a discount
out of saucers sale with a little flying

246
00:22:07.640 --> 00:22:11.759
saucer in the ad. Because of
what we're about to talk about having spread

247
00:22:11.759 --> 00:22:17.880
throughout the country and this is going
to be the Washington flap, Washington,

248
00:22:17.960 --> 00:22:22.559
DC flap, that's a state.
It's also called the Washington National Airport sightings.

249
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Washington National Airport is today known as
Reagan Airport. But here's the one

250
00:22:29.000 --> 00:22:34.599
I thought was the best, the
Ominous Invasion of Washington. That was some

251
00:22:34.680 --> 00:22:41.480
good headlining there of Washington. So
there was no invasion people, Washington d

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00:22:41.559 --> 00:22:45.319
C. Was never invaded, except
maybe in eighteen twelve, to say the

253
00:22:45.440 --> 00:22:52.559
Talk of the British that was a
little different. But over consecutive weekends in

254
00:22:52.640 --> 00:22:57.440
July of nineteen fifty two, there
was a barrage of UFO sightings in and

255
00:22:57.480 --> 00:23:02.640
around the capitol United States of America
of Washington. And we're not just talking

256
00:23:02.680 --> 00:23:06.440
about eyewitnesses who looked up and saw
either a craft or what they believed to

257
00:23:06.480 --> 00:23:10.480
be a craft. We're not talking
about people that saw some odd lights that

258
00:23:10.519 --> 00:23:18.359
couldn't be explained. We're talking about
military witnesses, civilian radar operators and pilots

259
00:23:18.960 --> 00:23:23.119
who know what they're talking about.
And I do also want to mention,

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I know you watched the show that
I watched, Project Bluebook on what was

261
00:23:27.839 --> 00:23:33.640
it the Discovery or something. Well, they dedicated a whole episode to this

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00:23:33.920 --> 00:23:37.759
episode ten season one. They called
it the Washington Merry Go Round, but

263
00:23:37.920 --> 00:23:41.960
that was loosely based of course,
it was you know, fictionalized and dramatized,

264
00:23:42.000 --> 00:23:47.119
but it was loosely based on the
Washington Flap of nineteen fifty two,

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which I thought was pretty cool that
It's actually what I liked about the show

266
00:23:49.079 --> 00:23:52.920
is they actually based them on some
real stuff. Bring it back, discovery

267
00:23:53.559 --> 00:23:59.400
or whatever. History history. Yes, yeah, history, bring it back.

268
00:24:00.279 --> 00:24:03.720
That's on my request. But anyway, so let's go back to My

269
00:24:03.839 --> 00:24:07.559
notes are a mess, so please
bear with me. My handwriting is really

270
00:24:07.559 --> 00:24:11.160
bad. It's like I was looking
and wondering why I didn't go to med

271
00:24:11.200 --> 00:24:15.480
school with the scribble that I met, Well, you would have been perfect

272
00:24:15.559 --> 00:24:18.759
for prescriptions writing prescription Oh my gosh, yeah, I would have been awesome.

273
00:24:19.759 --> 00:24:25.079
All right, So we're going to
go to July nineteenth through twentieth,

274
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nineteen fifty two. At about eleven
forty pm. It's on a Saturday evening.

275
00:24:30.039 --> 00:24:34.160
An air traffic controller by the name
of Edward Nugent is on duty at

276
00:24:34.200 --> 00:24:41.079
Washington National Airport, which is again
today Ronald Reagan Airport. Spotted seven objects

277
00:24:41.160 --> 00:24:45.720
on his radar, so his radar
is picking up seven different objects. They

278
00:24:45.720 --> 00:24:49.160
were about fifteen miles south to southwest
of the city of Washington, and there

279
00:24:49.240 --> 00:24:55.599
was no known aircraft in that area, and the objects were being observed on

280
00:24:55.640 --> 00:25:00.799
the radar were not following any known
prescribed flight path, so nothing that the

281
00:25:00.920 --> 00:25:04.599
air traffic controller would look at and
reasonably suspect to be an airplane. At

282
00:25:04.599 --> 00:25:10.400
that point, he unified a super
supervisor, a man named Harry Barnes,

283
00:25:10.440 --> 00:25:15.880
who came in and verified that the
objects were on Nugent's screen. He saw

284
00:25:15.920 --> 00:25:21.039
it, and they actually had other
controllers come over and verify that everything was

285
00:25:21.079 --> 00:25:25.759
working. So the first conclusion that
these and you know, no matter jumping

286
00:25:25.799 --> 00:25:29.920
to is not UFO. They're not
thinking UFO, They're thinking, okay,

287
00:25:30.400 --> 00:25:33.039
is something wrong with the radar unit
itself. They have two other people look

288
00:25:33.079 --> 00:25:37.359
at it to verify this is working. And I like that about this story.

289
00:25:37.880 --> 00:25:40.839
They didn't just immediately go, oh
my god, we got blips,

290
00:25:40.880 --> 00:25:44.799
we have alien rights, we have
UFOs right there. Professionals doing their job.

291
00:25:45.200 --> 00:25:49.400
Yes, they're they're troubleshooting. They're
going through and the other air traffic

292
00:25:49.400 --> 00:25:53.599
controllers look at it and say it's
working fine. And they also were observing

293
00:25:53.599 --> 00:25:57.640
the blips on the radar screen,
and one of them out the window did

294
00:25:57.680 --> 00:26:03.880
see a bright light hovering outside in
the distance that should not have been there.

295
00:26:04.799 --> 00:26:08.920
Other people in other areas, other
airports. The military were also picking

296
00:26:08.960 --> 00:26:14.519
things up on their radar, including
radar blips that moved over the White House

297
00:26:14.920 --> 00:26:18.920
and the United States Capitol Building.
So nineteen fifty two, in the middle

298
00:26:18.920 --> 00:26:23.000
of the Red Scare, can you
imagine thinking if you're a military base,

299
00:26:23.119 --> 00:26:27.599
like, is this is this world
again? You're not thinking UFO, You're

300
00:26:27.640 --> 00:26:34.119
thinking Soviet right, So the fear
and you know, that's unimaginable if they

301
00:26:34.119 --> 00:26:40.039
were going through at that moment.
So they contact Andrews air Force Base,

302
00:26:40.640 --> 00:26:47.400
which is about ten miles away,
and the man at the air Force base

303
00:26:47.400 --> 00:26:51.720
hold on, my notes are really
really bad. They're not bad. I

304
00:26:51.759 --> 00:26:57.200
just you know, I scribble.
Andrews does not see they're picking these things

305
00:26:57.240 --> 00:27:03.000
up as well. But it's not
military craft, so they're not they're not

306
00:27:03.160 --> 00:27:06.880
you know, there's no confirmation that
we have military craft in the sky.

307
00:27:07.319 --> 00:27:11.880
It's not civilian aircraft. It's not
military aircraft. They're picking these things up.

308
00:27:11.480 --> 00:27:15.200
And one of the airmen, a
man named William Brady, who was

309
00:27:15.240 --> 00:27:19.079
looking out, sees he's in the
control tower Andrews, and he describes,

310
00:27:19.119 --> 00:27:23.240
and I'm going to quote this from
his words, He describes an object which

311
00:27:23.240 --> 00:27:29.200
appeared to be like an orange ball
of fire, unlike anything I had seen

312
00:27:29.440 --> 00:27:33.880
before. It was in the sky, and as he alerted other people,

313
00:27:34.039 --> 00:27:38.440
like other personnel to look, he
observed that the ball, the orange ball,

314
00:27:40.279 --> 00:27:42.799
took off at a very fast,
high rated speed. He quoted called

315
00:27:42.839 --> 00:27:48.200
it unbelievable speed. So and we
how many times we heard that again?

316
00:27:48.240 --> 00:27:52.799
They go from still to shooting off, very common in these. On the

317
00:27:52.880 --> 00:27:57.279
runway was a pilot who worked for
Capital Airlines. I don't think they're around

318
00:27:57.319 --> 00:28:02.279
anymore, not sure if they.
He came somebody else, but a pilot

319
00:28:02.359 --> 00:28:06.720
named sc Peerman, and he was
in his DC four waiting to take off,

320
00:28:06.839 --> 00:28:08.920
and he thought he saw a meteor. This is out, you know,

321
00:28:08.960 --> 00:28:15.519
the airport. And then he's told
that the aircraftic control tower detected unknown

322
00:28:15.559 --> 00:28:18.920
objects. So once he's in the
air, they pick up these objects.

323
00:28:19.519 --> 00:28:26.880
While he's air bound in the air
and he sees white lights and the sky

324
00:28:26.279 --> 00:28:30.920
for about fourteen minutes. He sees
he's over a fourteen minute period. He

325
00:28:30.960 --> 00:28:36.599
describes him as fast, white and
no tails. So these are just balls

326
00:28:36.599 --> 00:28:41.079
of light, apparently moving without leaving
like a telltale trail behind them he was

327
00:28:41.119 --> 00:28:48.119
in contact with the ground and according
to the reports, air traffic Control was

328
00:28:48.200 --> 00:28:53.119
able to able to confirm they were
receiving a blip on their radar screen at

329
00:28:53.119 --> 00:29:00.960
the same time he was observing one
of the white round objects. So we're

330
00:29:00.960 --> 00:29:06.200
getting eyewitness report and we're also getting
on the ground rate oar confirmation that what

331
00:29:06.319 --> 00:29:12.440
he's seeing is physically there. Yeah, to have you know, eyewitnesses and

332
00:29:12.480 --> 00:29:19.680
then rate our confirmation so it's not
anybody's imagination, right, and you know,

333
00:29:22.079 --> 00:29:23.559
you can discount something if it seemed
once and radar goes, well,

334
00:29:23.559 --> 00:29:26.160
we had nothing. You know,
we've been watching the skies and we had

335
00:29:26.160 --> 00:29:30.960
you the whole time. But when
you start to confirm again it's one times

336
00:29:30.960 --> 00:29:34.440
a coincidence. You start to establish
a pattern that that shows there's something else

337
00:29:34.480 --> 00:29:37.680
going on here. And you know, we don't get that a lot in

338
00:29:37.799 --> 00:29:44.119
UFO research, having consistent patterns and
good verifiable reports. You know, we

339
00:29:44.160 --> 00:29:49.240
take sometimes what you can get.
When he reported the light, he basically

340
00:29:49.279 --> 00:29:52.839
described that the last sighting was it
took off at a very high rate of

341
00:29:52.880 --> 00:29:59.400
speed and when that happened. Air
traffic Control also confirmed that the blip that

342
00:29:59.440 --> 00:30:04.359
had been on radar screen disappeared from
the radar screen, so it wasn't just

343
00:30:04.440 --> 00:30:07.799
that it was happening, they were
confirming it. But when he reported it

344
00:30:08.079 --> 00:30:14.119
ended, they reported their blips had
now ended. So that's really a great,

345
00:30:14.240 --> 00:30:19.279
great encounter. They scrambled jet fighters
from an Air Force base in Delaware,

346
00:30:19.799 --> 00:30:25.079
which I think is a pretty fascinating
aspect at about three am, and

347
00:30:26.519 --> 00:30:27.920
well they arrived around three am,
so they must I don't know how far

348
00:30:27.960 --> 00:30:33.519
that would be, probably half hour
maybe, And by the time they arrived

349
00:30:33.640 --> 00:30:38.359
all the objects had vanished. But
the jets as they were returning to go

350
00:30:38.440 --> 00:30:48.160
back, they felt that the UFOs
were listening in on their traffic, like

351
00:30:48.200 --> 00:30:53.880
their radio traffic, and felt like
they were basically the UFOs were responding to

352
00:30:53.920 --> 00:31:00.920
them being there, like they knew
what was going on and purposely disappeared,

353
00:31:00.039 --> 00:31:04.440
moved away, and we're in intervening
or in listening into the radio contact.

354
00:31:06.440 --> 00:31:12.920
So that was a very you know
when they're they're up to right, And

355
00:31:12.960 --> 00:31:17.759
the last objects by radar were about
five to five thirty in the morning,

356
00:31:18.400 --> 00:31:21.119
so this is just over one night. This has all happened. Wow,

357
00:31:22.359 --> 00:31:26.839
So of course it's in the newspapers
all over the country. The next day.

358
00:31:26.119 --> 00:31:30.200
It's big news, you know,
and the Air Force is investigating it.

359
00:31:30.440 --> 00:31:36.559
And it's very entertaining because I have
these newspaper subscriptions online for research,

360
00:31:37.279 --> 00:31:40.200
and the headlines are great, some
of them, you know, it's very

361
00:31:40.200 --> 00:31:44.759
clever, very entertaining. Some took
it seriously. Some really were just having

362
00:31:44.799 --> 00:31:48.119
fun with it. They were running
with it. But one of the headlines

363
00:31:48.200 --> 00:31:56.359
was the Saucers swarm over capital and
large black letters. The head of at

364
00:31:56.359 --> 00:31:59.400
the time there was a US Air
Force captain by the name of Edward Rupel.

365
00:31:59.640 --> 00:32:04.480
He's a captain and a supervisor of
Project Blue Book, as we know,

366
00:32:04.599 --> 00:32:09.160
being the UFO investigation. He was
in Washington, d C. At

367
00:32:09.160 --> 00:32:14.640
this very time on an unrelated reason. He wasn't there for this. He

368
00:32:14.680 --> 00:32:21.319
wanted to investigate it when he learned
about it and approached on the base about

369
00:32:21.359 --> 00:32:24.480
getting a car to take it out
and you know, go and visit the

370
00:32:24.519 --> 00:32:28.960
locations, interview people, and was
told that he couldn't use a staff car

371
00:32:29.200 --> 00:32:32.079
because he wasn't an officer. It
wasn't a captain or a general I guess,

372
00:32:32.240 --> 00:32:37.279
or higher than above a captain.
I mean, he wasn't anything more

373
00:32:37.319 --> 00:32:40.480
than a captain, so they wouldn't
let him have a car and told him

374
00:32:40.480 --> 00:32:44.359
if he wanted to really go out
and research it, he could hire a

375
00:32:44.359 --> 00:32:50.279
cabin pay for it, which you
can see how anxious they were for him

376
00:32:50.319 --> 00:32:53.319
to research this. And I think, you know, how great would it

377
00:32:53.359 --> 00:33:00.039
had been had he been the boots
on the ground in the immediate after to

378
00:33:00.160 --> 00:33:05.240
have spoken to witnesses either on the
ground or from airplanes or from you know,

379
00:33:05.400 --> 00:33:09.279
air traffic, and maybe he wouldn't
have learned anything. But it's you

380
00:33:09.319 --> 00:33:15.119
know, those what ifs are always
like frustrating for people that that study anything

381
00:33:15.160 --> 00:33:21.079
like this. So he um he
went back to Wright Patterson Air Force Base,

382
00:33:21.119 --> 00:33:23.319
which is out in Ohio. That
was where the Project Blue Barrack was

383
00:33:24.559 --> 00:33:29.839
headquartered out of. And the general
consensus from the Air Force was it was

384
00:33:29.880 --> 00:33:35.799
basically, um inverse weather patterns,
you know, the temperature inversion, Yes,

385
00:33:36.000 --> 00:33:39.039
the temperature in version than you please, So basically what is it.

386
00:33:39.079 --> 00:33:44.720
There's colder air on top of warmer
air or vice versa, and they can

387
00:33:44.759 --> 00:33:49.000
be picked up as bullips on radar. Yeah, yeah, because you know,

388
00:33:49.279 --> 00:33:54.880
all of these radar experts at how
many different airports combined with the visuals.

389
00:33:55.000 --> 00:33:59.839
You know that. I mean,
it's a it's an insult, you

390
00:33:59.839 --> 00:34:06.440
know, it's an insult to the
professional radar guys who don't know a temperature

391
00:34:06.480 --> 00:34:12.880
inversion when and if it's my understanding
that weather conditions were not even that you

392
00:34:12.920 --> 00:34:17.039
know, right, were conducive to
a temperature inversion to begin with, I

393
00:34:17.039 --> 00:34:21.719
don't believe they were. So it
was just another convenient way of explaining it

394
00:34:21.760 --> 00:34:25.400
away without having to go into actual
details or research into the Yeah, what

395
00:34:25.519 --> 00:34:30.639
happened? Could this have been a
government lie in deception? What are you

396
00:34:30.639 --> 00:34:37.920
implying? Implying here over the US
capital? We have to say something?

397
00:34:38.800 --> 00:34:44.960
And and again, you know,
let's just look at the circumstantial evidence.

398
00:34:45.480 --> 00:34:50.960
It's not just radar blips. It's
radar, it's the air traffic control seeing

399
00:34:51.000 --> 00:34:55.360
things, it's pilot seeing things,
it's people seeing things at the same time

400
00:34:55.400 --> 00:35:00.199
you're getting a blip on the radar. You know, you have all these

401
00:35:00.239 --> 00:35:04.760
different levels of confirmation. You know, again, could it be a temperature

402
00:35:04.800 --> 00:35:07.920
in version? Absolutely, but maybe
one time you're not. They're gonna move

403
00:35:07.960 --> 00:35:09.840
around, they're gonna shoot off,
They're going to be visible to the pilots

404
00:35:09.880 --> 00:35:16.880
now, so you know, let's
not let facts get in the way of

405
00:35:16.880 --> 00:35:21.840
a good cover up. Yeah,
you know, as funny because you know,

406
00:35:21.840 --> 00:35:25.320
as we know from Project Blue Book, they really love their explanations out,

407
00:35:25.360 --> 00:35:29.599
no matter how ridiculous they could be. Oh yeah, so yeah,

408
00:35:29.599 --> 00:35:32.679
this is they should teach a course
about it, perhaps on how to explain

409
00:35:32.760 --> 00:35:37.239
things away UFOs. So let's go
to the following weekend, July twenty sixth,

410
00:35:37.480 --> 00:35:43.159
nineteen fifty two. It's around eight
fifteen pm, and there's a flight

411
00:35:43.159 --> 00:35:49.400
attendant pilot on a National Airline flight
heading into Washington, and they observe above

412
00:35:49.440 --> 00:35:54.960
the plane overhead some lights which they
don't really have an explanation for. It

413
00:35:54.960 --> 00:36:01.519
shouldn't be there, and they learn
within minutes radar is now tracking and at

414
00:36:01.559 --> 00:36:07.719
both National Airport in Andrews Air Force
Base, we're tracking multiple unknown objects on

415
00:36:07.760 --> 00:36:10.599
the radar. Again. So this
is the following weekend, and it seems

416
00:36:10.599 --> 00:36:16.480
like everything's happening all over again.
A sergeant, a master's sergeant for the

417
00:36:16.559 --> 00:36:22.280
United States Air Force by the name
of Charles E. Cummings, visually observed

418
00:36:22.280 --> 00:36:27.960
the objects and said that they didn't
appear to him to be shooting stars.

419
00:36:28.440 --> 00:36:31.800
They did not have the trail behind
them, and they traveled faster than any

420
00:36:32.159 --> 00:36:37.280
shooting star that he had seen.
Wow, that's fast. So his first

421
00:36:37.280 --> 00:36:42.199
instinct must have been, well,
maybe they're shooting stars. But then you

422
00:36:42.239 --> 00:36:44.159
know, basing it upon what he's
looking at, like, well, no,

423
00:36:44.280 --> 00:36:50.800
that's that's not a moving star or
a shooting star. A press spokesman

424
00:36:50.920 --> 00:36:55.119
for Project Bluebook had arrived at the
airport and of course wouldn't allow the photographers

425
00:36:55.159 --> 00:37:02.440
to photograph the radar screens for security
reasons. So I get that this is

426
00:37:02.480 --> 00:37:09.079
by nine thirty pm, and the
radar at this point is detecting unknown objects

427
00:37:09.079 --> 00:37:12.960
all over it and every sector of
their radar screen. You know, they

428
00:37:13.000 --> 00:37:16.000
had the big screens with the various
so basically the whole thing is lighting up

429
00:37:16.239 --> 00:37:22.280
with multiple objects being detected. I
can imagine the confusion with that. Again,

430
00:37:22.320 --> 00:37:24.960
what is going on? You know? Oh yeah, the fear and

431
00:37:25.119 --> 00:37:30.440
especially a weekend a week later,
like really right, I should have called

432
00:37:30.440 --> 00:37:36.119
in sick tonight, you know,
like one of those moments. So they're

433
00:37:36.159 --> 00:37:39.760
monitoring this and multiple many times,
the objects traveled slowly, sometimes they would

434
00:37:39.760 --> 00:37:45.800
reverse direction, sometimes they would move
across the radar scope screen at a very

435
00:37:45.880 --> 00:37:52.559
high rate. Of speed, which
was estimated to be seven thousand miles per

436
00:37:52.800 --> 00:37:59.119
hour. Wow. I mean that's
just astronomically fast. Once again, they

437
00:37:59.159 --> 00:38:05.760
scramble air Force fighter jets out of
Delaware to go an attempt to intercept the

438
00:38:06.360 --> 00:38:13.280
objects over Washington, and one of
them was a Captain John mcugo. He's

439
00:38:13.360 --> 00:38:16.800
the flight leader. He's in his
plane, his jet fighter and radar.

440
00:38:17.039 --> 00:38:21.760
The operators are trying to direct him
to one of the blimps. You know,

441
00:38:21.760 --> 00:38:24.199
they're looking at the radar, watching
the blip, watching him and trying

442
00:38:24.199 --> 00:38:29.559
to give him feedback in direction so
that he can intercept one of these blips.

443
00:38:30.159 --> 00:38:34.119
So he's in route to that but
sees nothing. He can't find anything,

444
00:38:34.119 --> 00:38:37.800
and there's multiple attempts to do this
and nothing happens. Another pilot,

445
00:38:37.840 --> 00:38:44.000
a Lieutenant William Patterson, saw white
glows in the distance and he pursued them

446
00:38:44.000 --> 00:38:47.000
in his fighter jet. So he
wants to intercept them. He pursues them,

447
00:38:47.639 --> 00:38:53.280
and he claims he maxed out the
speed of his aircraft and could not

448
00:38:53.440 --> 00:38:59.480
catch up with them. He eventually
crawled off the pursuit because they were so

449
00:38:59.599 --> 00:39:05.159
far he knew he had no way
of ever catching up. Wow. So

450
00:39:07.679 --> 00:39:14.360
that was really fascinating. So according
to what that pilot later said, I

451
00:39:14.480 --> 00:39:15.679
see them now, and they're all
around me. This is coming from the

452
00:39:15.679 --> 00:39:21.920
cockpit, and he asked what he
should do, and at air Traffic Control

453
00:39:22.000 --> 00:39:25.400
reported basically no one answered because no
one else knew what to do. Yeah,

454
00:39:27.239 --> 00:39:30.800
yeah, what do you do there? They can outrun your best fighters.

455
00:39:31.239 --> 00:39:37.840
You don't know what they are,
you can't identify them. So I

456
00:39:37.880 --> 00:39:42.599
just think it's very fascinating. Now. Of course, you know, the

457
00:39:42.960 --> 00:39:50.920
explanations do start to trickle in and
different. Um the temperature inversion that was

458
00:39:50.920 --> 00:39:55.360
the big one as being the responsible
cause. But I did want to read

459
00:39:55.400 --> 00:40:00.480
an actual account here if you don't
mind. Oh yeah, this was a

460
00:40:00.519 --> 00:40:06.920
good one. I thought. This
is from the San Diego Union Tribune of

461
00:40:07.000 --> 00:40:14.599
July twenty ninth, nineteen fifty two, So nineteen fifty two, San Diego

462
00:40:14.719 --> 00:40:22.320
Union Tribune. And this is essentially
a civilian radar specialist who compiled this report.

463
00:40:23.400 --> 00:40:31.159
So radar specialist Washington Air Route Traffic
Controls Center. Until unidentified objects began

464
00:40:31.239 --> 00:40:36.760
moving onto our radar scopes, I
thought people who reported flying saucers were just

465
00:40:37.039 --> 00:40:40.880
seeing things. Now I don't know
what to think I have talked to representatives

466
00:40:40.920 --> 00:40:45.519
of the Air Force and they say
they can't explain the appearance of the flying

467
00:40:45.559 --> 00:40:50.119
objects. Neither can we. All
we can do is tell you what we

468
00:40:50.199 --> 00:40:54.440
saw on our instruments and what the
Air Force and commercial pilots reported when they

469
00:40:54.480 --> 00:41:00.480
tried to investigate. It was nine
o eight pm Saturday when the last identified

470
00:41:00.519 --> 00:41:07.639
objects we called them targets, moved
onto our scopes from the northwest. These

471
00:41:07.679 --> 00:41:10.719
objects were about thirty miles from the
airport when we first made contact with them.

472
00:41:12.360 --> 00:41:15.480
We spotted twelve objects and judged that
they were moving in a southeasterly direction

473
00:41:15.559 --> 00:41:21.559
at a speed of about forty miles
per hour. The Air Force sent some

474
00:41:21.639 --> 00:41:25.440
jets up jet planes up to investigate, and we helped vector the pilots towards

475
00:41:25.440 --> 00:41:30.440
the objects. I should explain here
that our radar scope is about two feet

476
00:41:30.440 --> 00:41:35.719
in diameter. When it showed a
plip contact with the substance in the sky,

477
00:41:36.519 --> 00:41:40.639
we placed a plastic marker on the
spot. The radar beam swings around

478
00:41:40.679 --> 00:41:45.519
in a giant circle, and when
it returns to the same area, it

479
00:41:45.559 --> 00:41:49.840
will make another contact with the same
object. If the object has moved.

480
00:41:50.119 --> 00:41:53.760
We moved the marker, and after
a number of repetitions, we can determine

481
00:41:53.800 --> 00:41:59.920
the object's direction and approximate speed.
When we vector a plane onto the object,

482
00:42:00.559 --> 00:42:04.320
we are in radar contact with both
the object in the plane and also

483
00:42:04.360 --> 00:42:07.960
in radio contact with the pilot of
the plane. We keep telling the pilot

484
00:42:08.000 --> 00:42:13.400
how to turn an approach the object
until it makes a sighting. The first

485
00:42:13.400 --> 00:42:17.119
political up Saturday Night reported that he
cited a steady white light that appeared to

486
00:42:17.119 --> 00:42:22.960
be about ten miles distant when he
tried to draw close as the light disappeared.

487
00:42:23.320 --> 00:42:29.039
I think hearing it from the words
of a witness so much more compelling

488
00:42:29.079 --> 00:42:32.800
than anything I can I can say
from my chicken scratch notes. Yeah,

489
00:42:32.840 --> 00:42:38.800
because he was a blow by blow
account of you know what was going on,

490
00:42:39.880 --> 00:42:44.039
and I really like, um,
should we take our second break real

491
00:42:44.119 --> 00:42:46.199
quick and then come back and talk
about that. Oh? Yes, I

492
00:42:46.239 --> 00:42:50.079
think we have to. Yes,
let's take our second break and we will

493
00:42:50.119 --> 00:42:54.039
be right back. This is Unson
River Radio dot com, your local Rockland

494
00:42:54.079 --> 00:43:12.239
County station Radio dot com. And
I guess one of us has to say.

495
00:43:12.719 --> 00:43:16.840
I was distracted looking at I was
trying to just put together in my

496
00:43:16.920 --> 00:43:20.519
head to thought I had before we
took the break, and it was basically,

497
00:43:21.480 --> 00:43:24.559
I like this reporter's name, where
were the guy that reported? They

498
00:43:24.599 --> 00:43:30.159
don't identify him in the article that
I could find, But the fact that

499
00:43:30.199 --> 00:43:35.519
he says, you know, until
he saw it for himself, he just

500
00:43:35.519 --> 00:43:39.159
thought people who had reported these things
were seeing things. So he's not a

501
00:43:39.159 --> 00:43:45.760
believer in UFOs. His first instinct
when he sees the blips is not aliens.

502
00:43:45.840 --> 00:43:50.360
It's I have a job to do. What are these blips? For

503
00:43:50.440 --> 00:43:52.440
him to then be like, well, bait, and he still doesn't say

504
00:43:52.440 --> 00:43:55.280
they're alien. You notice that he
says, now I don't know what to

505
00:43:55.400 --> 00:43:59.960
think, which I find really interesting. He doesn't come out and say,

506
00:44:00.119 --> 00:44:05.519
now I believe they're they're aliens,
or they're Russians, or they're reptilians or

507
00:44:05.519 --> 00:44:10.159
whatever that they are. He doesn't
know, which I think is an honest

508
00:44:10.199 --> 00:44:14.400
answer. I don't know what they
are. Yeah, they clearly weren't saucers.

509
00:44:14.400 --> 00:44:17.079
I mean people were calling them flying
saucers, but nobody reported an actual

510
00:44:17.119 --> 00:44:22.599
saucer shape at this time. But
I think that became a really popular euphemism

511
00:44:22.639 --> 00:44:25.719
at that time. They weren't really
using UFO much, so it was,

512
00:44:25.760 --> 00:44:29.800
you know, flying saucers. So, you know, a great witness.

513
00:44:30.000 --> 00:44:31.000
I'm gonna look a little bit more
up and see if I can track down

514
00:44:31.000 --> 00:44:35.039
a name on him and see if
there's anything else he may have written or

515
00:44:35.119 --> 00:44:39.599
been quoted. One witness like that
is is great, but it's a very

516
00:44:39.639 --> 00:44:45.119
interesting case. Yeah, being honest
saying how you know, prior beliefs were

517
00:44:45.719 --> 00:44:52.239
overturned by the evidence, which is
how science is supposed to work, not

518
00:44:52.559 --> 00:44:59.000
covering it up with temperature inversions.
So so really the government just dismissed the

519
00:44:59.159 --> 00:45:06.760
entire two nights of incredible sightings and
radar contacts. Yes, and again the

520
00:45:06.880 --> 00:45:09.199
context of the time, you know, I mean maybe they were doing it

521
00:45:09.199 --> 00:45:14.400
out of fear that people would panic
and think this was maybe the Soviet Union

522
00:45:14.440 --> 00:45:20.400
developed some type of weapon that or
aircraft that could reach the United States very

523
00:45:20.480 --> 00:45:23.559
quickly. You know, maybe they
maybe that was a concern and they didn't

524
00:45:23.599 --> 00:45:27.039
want to scare people. I don't
know, you know, we don't have

525
00:45:27.119 --> 00:45:29.679
that. You know, all they
knew is all we know is that they

526
00:45:29.719 --> 00:45:35.760
claimed it was temperature persons. Yeah
it wasn't. I don't know what it

527
00:45:35.800 --> 00:45:37.000
was either. I wasn't there,
I was I wasn't even thought of.

528
00:45:38.320 --> 00:45:44.320
But you know, um, I
would I would love to see more about

529
00:45:44.360 --> 00:45:46.880
this. I'm gonna keep digging on
this one. Yeah, it's it's a

530
00:45:46.920 --> 00:45:55.519
fabulous case and clearly the whole attempt
by the government to not take it seriously

531
00:45:55.840 --> 00:46:06.000
even though military pilots and radar sought
and tracked it. Um, no nothing

532
00:46:06.039 --> 00:46:10.320
to see here, move along.
It's crazy. In terms of witnesses,

533
00:46:10.360 --> 00:46:16.280
you can't ask for almost a better
ensemble of witnesses between a radar operators,

534
00:46:16.360 --> 00:46:22.639
air traffic control pilots of various levels
of you know rank up to captain.

535
00:46:23.039 --> 00:46:29.480
Yeah, you know, commercial pilots, you know, flight attendants. If

536
00:46:29.480 --> 00:46:34.159
you had to hand select people to
be your witnesses, this is almost like

537
00:46:34.199 --> 00:46:37.960
a dream team of witnesses. You
almost don't get much better. Yeah,

538
00:46:37.280 --> 00:46:44.400
all these people to dismiss them all, it just is it's pilots, don't

539
00:46:44.440 --> 00:46:47.239
get it there. Yeah, pilots
their lives and the lives of all their

540
00:46:47.280 --> 00:46:55.639
passengers depend on their ability to see
the sky, you know, uh know

541
00:46:55.800 --> 00:47:00.559
what's going on. But they right, So when they all say, I

542
00:47:00.599 --> 00:47:05.159
don't know what that was, and
it moved faster than anything I'd ever seen

543
00:47:05.239 --> 00:47:14.719
before. Um, maybe we should
pay attention or maybe not, depends on

544
00:47:14.719 --> 00:47:17.519
who you ask. Asked a government, Yeah, well, I have two

545
00:47:17.639 --> 00:47:24.360
other things that we can we can
add if you're oh, yeah, you've

546
00:47:24.360 --> 00:47:30.320
wrapped up. One thing I came
upon from March twenty fifth, nineteen sixty

547
00:47:30.480 --> 00:47:37.000
six from the office of House Minority
Leader Gerald R. Ford of Michigan,

548
00:47:37.599 --> 00:47:43.639
who went on to be President Ford
and who, since Brian is at the

549
00:47:43.679 --> 00:47:46.079
controls, I have to mention,
was on the War and Commission, which

550
00:47:46.119 --> 00:47:52.039
the War and Commission Report is the
Project blue Book of the Kennedy assassination.

551
00:47:52.159 --> 00:47:57.639
There I've made that statement is our
next podcast. That would be a whole

552
00:47:57.719 --> 00:48:01.679
lot of podcasts. But there were
a lot of sightings in Michigan at that

553
00:48:01.760 --> 00:48:07.719
time. And this is a press
release he put out. He today proposed

554
00:48:07.840 --> 00:48:15.760
that Congress investigate the rash of reports
of sightings of unidentified flying objects in southern

555
00:48:15.800 --> 00:48:22.920
Michigan and other parts of the country. Ford said he believed a convention congressional

556
00:48:22.960 --> 00:48:30.039
inquiry would be worthwhile because the American
people are becoming alarmed by the UFO stories.

557
00:48:30.159 --> 00:48:36.599
He noted that the Air Force investigators
have been checking on such report for

558
00:48:36.719 --> 00:48:43.280
years but have come up with nothing
conclusive in the light of these new sightings

559
00:48:43.280 --> 00:48:47.920
and incidents, Ford said, it
would be a very wholesome thing. Wholesome,

560
00:48:49.440 --> 00:48:53.480
It would be a very wholesome thing
for a committee of the Congress to

561
00:48:53.599 --> 00:49:00.480
conduct a number of hearings and to
call responsible witnesses from the executive branch of

562
00:49:00.480 --> 00:49:05.679
the government and witnesses who say they
have cited these objects. I think the

563
00:49:05.719 --> 00:49:10.480
American people would feel better if there
was a full blown investigation of these incidents

564
00:49:12.000 --> 00:49:17.039
which some persons alleged to have taken
place. He sent an attached letter to

565
00:49:17.079 --> 00:49:22.599
the chairman and the ranking Republican members
of the House Committee of Armed Services and

566
00:49:22.880 --> 00:49:30.880
Science and Astronautics urging that one committee
or the other investigate UFOs for it is

567
00:49:31.039 --> 00:49:37.639
not satisfied with the Air Force explanation
of the recent sightings in Michigan, and

568
00:49:37.800 --> 00:49:46.039
describes the swamp gas version given by
astros physicist Jay Allan Heineck as flippant.

569
00:49:47.480 --> 00:49:53.880
So there you have it, you
go, Jerry it back in sixty six.

570
00:49:54.440 --> 00:49:59.320
Maybe the government should look into this. This is important. People are

571
00:49:59.360 --> 00:50:07.239
scared. There's you know, responsible
professional people who are having these sightings,

572
00:50:07.800 --> 00:50:12.559
and what's happening now The same thing. Maybe we should have you know,

573
00:50:12.679 --> 00:50:17.960
Congress is finally starting decades and decades
later. I mean clearly, I don't

574
00:50:17.960 --> 00:50:24.000
think the government ever stopped looking into
it. But in public he's trying to

575
00:50:24.159 --> 00:50:30.559
encourage and I love the way he
calls out Heineck and his swamp guess thing

576
00:50:30.599 --> 00:50:36.000
there as flippant. So he knows, you know, clearly from this he

577
00:50:36.079 --> 00:50:43.519
knows things are being suppressed or just
not talked about, and looking for openness

578
00:50:43.800 --> 00:50:49.800
in government. Yeah, good luck. And the last thing, of course,

579
00:50:50.000 --> 00:50:52.320
it's been all over the news.
We don't need to cover it all.

580
00:50:52.360 --> 00:51:01.519
The latest whistleblower intelligence officer Air Force
intelligence officer Dave Grush. He was

581
00:51:01.760 --> 00:51:07.480
on a show with Ross Coltart,
whom is an Australian. He's on the

582
00:51:07.519 --> 00:51:15.920
Australian version of sixty Minutes and you
can look up News Nation Ross Coultart interview

583
00:51:16.719 --> 00:51:28.199
and Rush said there was a sophisticated
disinformation campaign which was keeping information from Congress

584
00:51:28.280 --> 00:51:36.039
and that new UAP task force.
He talked about retrieving non human vehicles.

585
00:51:36.679 --> 00:51:43.159
He kept referring to NHI, which
is our new acronym non human intelligence.

586
00:51:44.480 --> 00:51:51.239
He doesn't know if they're et other
dimensions but he just simply says we are

587
00:51:51.320 --> 00:51:55.719
not alone. And Coltart asked him, well, if you're retrieving craft,

588
00:51:57.239 --> 00:52:02.360
are you retrieving bodies of whatever this
is? And he said, well,

589
00:52:02.400 --> 00:52:07.679
of course, if there are crashed
objects, there are dead pilots involved.

590
00:52:07.119 --> 00:52:20.800
So you look at this guy's credentials
and their phenomena the highest of clearances.

591
00:52:20.280 --> 00:52:29.800
Is he being fed misinformation to be
a high profile puppet or does he note

592
00:52:29.920 --> 00:52:36.840
you know he has the actual information? So what a surprise, a sophisticated

593
00:52:37.320 --> 00:52:43.519
disinformation. Here we are twenty twenty
three, all of these decades later,

594
00:52:44.239 --> 00:52:49.639
and government lies and deception are flourishing. And how easy would it be to

595
00:52:49.719 --> 00:52:53.880
take somebody who's on the inside who
has information, and then utilize them to

596
00:52:54.039 --> 00:52:58.800
promote more information, but just make
it misinformation, like you said, to

597
00:52:58.920 --> 00:53:00.920
go out there and spread it around. I mean they've been doing that since

598
00:53:01.320 --> 00:53:07.119
since pretty much forty seven, at
different levels. You know the It's definitely

599
00:53:07.159 --> 00:53:10.559
not something I put past them.
No, no, not at all.

600
00:53:10.719 --> 00:53:15.400
So you know, some people are
like, this is disclosure. No it's

601
00:53:15.480 --> 00:53:22.079
not, but um, you know
it was. It's a big step towards

602
00:53:23.519 --> 00:53:28.960
getting some people in government to say, wait a minute, we're being lied

603
00:53:29.000 --> 00:53:31.639
to. Maybe you know, the
government itself is being lied to, so

604
00:53:31.760 --> 00:53:37.639
maybe some doors will be opened.
But yeah, you can go. It's

605
00:53:37.719 --> 00:53:43.679
fascinating. Watch it's I think it's
about an hour long interview. So again,

606
00:53:44.360 --> 00:53:46.440
I just wanted to ask you to
clarify for me. So my understanding

607
00:53:46.480 --> 00:53:51.920
is he had no personal direct knowledge, right, he had never seen any

608
00:53:51.920 --> 00:53:53.159
of the craft or the bodies.
Okay, I wanted to make sure I

609
00:53:53.239 --> 00:53:57.960
understood that correct. Yeah. See
that's the that's the other problem. This

610
00:53:58.079 --> 00:54:02.760
is what was told to him by
what he considers reliable sources. You know,

611
00:54:02.880 --> 00:54:10.239
eyewitnesses told him. Um, what
we need is the actual eyewitnesses to

612
00:54:10.440 --> 00:54:15.559
with a piece of something to come
right, to come forward. I hear

613
00:54:15.599 --> 00:54:23.320
there's all sorts of whistleblowers now wanting
to come forward. Um, So once

614
00:54:23.360 --> 00:54:30.679
again it's you know, is it
is it another hoaxing pilots thing? And

615
00:54:30.719 --> 00:54:36.679
the FAA is replaced by the NSA
and I don't know, but it's certainly

616
00:54:36.920 --> 00:54:43.280
intriguing and worth worth following up on. So so this was episode one of

617
00:54:43.639 --> 00:54:49.320
at least ninety eight on government.
Now I'm kidding the government it would be

618
00:54:49.400 --> 00:54:57.320
much more than episode al Right,
episode four hundred thirty seven. Now what

619
00:54:59.719 --> 00:55:01.440
so we have better things, Well, we have other things to cover,

620
00:55:01.559 --> 00:55:06.599
we have the truth to cover.
But yeah, that was an excellent coverage

621
00:55:06.599 --> 00:55:10.920
of that Washington flap, which you
know, people can go, like you

622
00:55:10.960 --> 00:55:15.719
said, newspaper articles, read it, read it as it was happening,

623
00:55:15.719 --> 00:55:20.199
and see people's reactions. And that's
that's probably the most fascinating part. You

624
00:55:20.239 --> 00:55:22.800
know, we've well you've helped me
do a lot of historical research, and

625
00:55:22.800 --> 00:55:28.960
there's nothing like reading the newspaper articles
contemporaneous to what you're studying. It's so

626
00:55:29.000 --> 00:55:31.960
easy to forget it's the twenty twenties
and you all of a sudden, I'm

627
00:55:32.119 --> 00:55:35.199
you know, I thought I was
in the eighteen hundreds. Quite a few

628
00:55:35.199 --> 00:55:38.039
times. My head's buried in newspapers. I come out of the house,

629
00:55:38.079 --> 00:55:43.119
I'm like, oh, wait a
minute, there's cars. But you know,

630
00:55:43.199 --> 00:55:45.480
we get we get very wrapped up
in this stuff. It's fascinating.

631
00:55:45.719 --> 00:55:51.519
Yeah, and you're right to put
yourself in the time frame and the mood

632
00:55:51.639 --> 00:55:57.360
of the nineteen fifties, the paranoia, you know, in fear, and

633
00:55:57.400 --> 00:56:02.480
then all these objects are showing up
over the US capital that cannot be identified

634
00:56:04.159 --> 00:56:09.519
and yeah, huge story, huge
story, So bring us out in your

635
00:56:09.559 --> 00:56:15.199
own inimitable style. Thank you to
everybody out there listening to UFO Headquarters here

636
00:56:15.280 --> 00:56:20.800
on Hudson River Radio. We appreciate
you tuning in. If you are new

637
00:56:20.800 --> 00:56:22.920
to us, thank you for joining, and please binge listen to all of

638
00:56:22.960 --> 00:56:27.519
our previous podcasts. If you've been
with us for a long time or just

639
00:56:27.800 --> 00:56:30.039
for a few weeks, thank you. We really appreciate your support. We

640
00:56:30.159 --> 00:56:35.199
do this because we know everybody out
there loves hearing about it, loves his

641
00:56:35.280 --> 00:56:37.880
topic as much as we do.
So on behalf of myself, Linda Desermin,

642
00:56:38.199 --> 00:56:44.639
keep your eyes on the sky.
Hudson River Radio dot com a favorite

643
00:56:44.639 --> 00:56:45.079
among shut ins and dogs,