Another spaces with me kalu Aja, that's my name, and of course every
weekend we try to do talk about the economy, personal finance and of course
how it affects your wallets. We want to make it personal to you.
Right, we pick a topic, how does it affect you personal? There
is no bigger topic this week if you are living in Nigeria or have business
in Nigeria, then the announcement by the President that the substitute has gone.
So lots of folks have focused around the issue of subsidy and why what all
that means? And also during the week we heard the Central Bank of Nigerent
was moving towards this should we say single interest rates or single exchange rates?
Sorry? So what does all that mean? What does it mean for your
wallet? I think it's very important that we spect well understand what does two
issues mean. I eat, the removal of the subsidy and of course a
translation to a single exchange rate. So to be very very simplistic, right,
what is a subsidy? Let's start from there. When you say you
are subsidizing a price, that means the surprise, but the market cannot pay
that price, or she would say the consumers cannot pay that price. Hence,
you subsidize that price so that the consumers can afford the price, which
means that it's a regulated price, a federal or federation regulated price. In
Nigeria's case, the retail price you pay at the pumps is regulated. So
everything station all across Nigeria is mandated not to sell above that price. They
can go below, but they cannot sell above that price. But that price
is lower than the market price of petrol if the same filic station had gone
to buy petrol outside the NNPC system. So wherever you get your PMS,
the federal government basically says you want to sell your PMS at this price.
Now let's call that price one hundred. But if you then get your PMS
at two hundred, the federal government would then pay you one hundred. That's
the subsidy one hundred. The subsidy has nothing to do with where it is
refined, or how it is transported, or how it is start. The
subsidy really has to do with the regulation of the retail prices. Hence,
if you're a good retail price, you don't get a difference between the federal
government price and the market price, if you take away the subsidy, what
you are simply doing is so you're saying there's no longer a regulated price.
So once you remove the regulation of prices, then in essence, there's only
one price in the market, ie the market price. That's what subtid remove
all means. It's the same thing. But the central bank and the exchange
rate of the naira. If you fix the exchange rate of the nihra,
which is what the central bank has done, which what we call capital controls.
If you fix the exchanges of the nihra, to say, one dollar
is going to give you four sixty four nira. If you do that right,
what you're essentially saying is that the market price, which is a seventh
fifty, does no longer apply. That the only price the central bank will
buy and sell currency to you is the four fifty four. That's a subsidy,
so you are subsidizing it from seven fifty to four fifty. So if
you say you want to do a single exchange rate, all the setter back
is scenes that are going to take it with the subsidy. They're going to
take it with the regulated price, which is that four hundred fifty four orbit
call then affix price. If they take it away, then all you have
left is the market price, no more regulated price. So essentially the strategy
of the policy that we're announced is a removal of regulated prices for dollar for
pms. And there might be more that they're going to take away, right,
They're going to take away a lot more than just the price for for
pms and for the for dollar, But that's essentially what they're saying. So
whatever name you call it, that's why you see the argument is the price
increases, the modulation is a subsidy, pricey, It doesn't matter. Focus
on that single thing that once you take it with the regulation or once you
introduce the regulated prices right or you take it away, all you have done
is to simply say that that price is now market driving. Vote for pms,
vote for for for dollar. That's essentially where we are right now.
So the question now is now, what's the effect on your wallet? Or
before let's what's affective the wallet? Clearly there's going to be an increase in
your cost of living because when you say the market price, the market price
can go up and the market price can come down. What makes the market
price go up? And down has to do with the price, the demand
and supply. If there is more supply, prices go down. If there's
less supply, prices go up. It's that's simple. So when PMS today
is five hundred plus, it's simply because there is no supply, end of
story. If the supply of PMS goes up, then the price will come
down. The supply of PMS is predicated on the price of crude oil,
not on the refinery. So again that the idea that the Danguti refinery is
going to reduce or it's going to amminurate the prices of the retail pumps,
it's not really, it's far fetched. You would remove the shipping, you
would remove the dumorage. All those costs are associated with bringing in PMS from
seeing the Netherlands to Nigeria. That would go away. But the price of
PMS is based on the price of crude oil. It doesn't matter whatever price
don got it pays. If he pays in naira or dollars is immaterial.
What matters is is he paying for the PMS for the crude oil in a
subsidy or not, Which means cruel today is about let's just say eighty dollars.
Is done going to pay fifty dollars or is he going to pay eighty
dollars. That's the question doesn't matter if he pays in nirah or dollars.
If you pay make him pay in naira and he's buying it at the real
price i e eighty dollars, then he would refine your PMS at eighty dollars
plus. But if you give him a subsidy, then he can refine at
that subsidy plus. That's the real determinant of the retail president Nigeria. The
price that Dante will pay for the internationally priced crude oil, which means that
the subs they say it's gone, it might not be gone depending on what
price dan Gote pays. Right, that's the powerway of no player off.
What price would he pay, not the currency the price if he pays in
dollar or nia, but what price is he going to pay at eighty dollars
or is you gonna pay at a subsidized dollar price? That's really will determine
the final product. Remember we're taking it with the government price and we're allowing
the market to the intermined prices. Market prices go up and down with demand
and supply. So right now there's limited supply because only an NPC down the
road. If more players come in, you might see prices fall down the
road. Same thing with the dollar. Dollar is seven hundred and fifty Nia
to one, not because that's the real exchange rate, but because there's really
only one supplier, the Central Bank of Nigeria. And why is the only
one supplier Because Central Bank of Niger has said it wants to buy your dollar
at four hundred and fifty regulated price. Nobody's gonna do that. If you
get dollars from your cousin in America, you go to the streets and you
sell it for seven fifty. That's what's going on. But if the central
bank says we're removing the regulative price withness the central bank, I eat,
the commercial banks will buy your dollars from you at the market price, which
is about seven fifty today. What you would actually see that there will be
an increase in the supply of dollars in the system and that will make the
price of dollars I eat dollars four. So the devaluation really ironically might cause
the nira to gain value exactly what the scenson is trying to avoid by fixing.
So when your job, if you have a child and you chel your
child don't talk to TV, what does the child do the child of the
television telling Nigerian do not hold dollars. All the Nigerians do the whole dollars.
But if you make dollars available to everybody, if you want dollars at
the market price, go get it. You will say there will be a
fall in the demand for dollars. Why would I hold dollars if I'm not
going to travel, if I'm not staying in Nigeria. But I know that
if I want to travel in three months or six months, I can even
go to an ATM, put my card in and get dollars on that ATM
as long as I am paying the market price. Then why would I want
to hold dollars in my domor accounts? It doesn't make any sense to just
take my Nira converted to dollars and just keep your domor account any nothing.
It doesn't make any sense. So all the domb account folks you see will
sell their domor account because it's wasting. It's just there, it's wasting.
There are no interest from it. It's in the dom account because the Nira
is not properly prized. Simply buying dollars and holding it has been the best
investment rick that I've made in the last eight years. That's why Pool had
keep dom accounts. If you buy a dollar and you have kept it,
one dollar was one sixteen and you saw it when dollar was some fifty.
Look at the rate of return. No return baits that none And that's why
you have dom accounts and people holding dollars. But if you go to America,
nobody holds pounds or euros in America because they can easily get it if
they want to travel. The price is not fixed, but the FED because
it's not a peg. They don't have a peg, so you're not buy
dollars. You go to your bank, you require giving the price and you
pay same way. If you go to the UK, no one holds dollars.
Why would a hold dollars. They don't spend dollars, but if they
want dollars, they can go and buy at the market price. The reason
why you don't have n dollars everywhere in Nigeria is because there's a regulated prize
for that dollar in the price was at the market rate, it would be
available and only the folks that need dollar would buy or would go get it.
So with talked about the subsidy. What it means, we'll set the
subsidy is really, really, really a removal of reluited prices. We'll then
talked about the dollar the same way. It's the removal of regular prices.
Finally, what does it mean for your wallet? Your costs are going to
go up. Guys, sorry, your costs are going to go up because
most of your food is important. Your PMS for now is important. That
might change. Look at the things you spend money on. Food is sixty
eight percent of your budget. It's important, right, most of it your
rents to build the homes, your the iron, the nails, most persons
are important. Education is local rights. Your teachers are all local here.
But the tools, those things you pay for abroad, a sec approachnal stop
is important. The points I'm making right, The bulk of Nigeria, Nigeria
as a whole exports more than she imports. But if you break down that
that report were spot more crude oil and we import a lot of things that
we shouldn't be important, like sparkling water. That is feeding local inflation because
you bring those things in like dst you guys wat ds, you watch arsenaw
you pay for that in dollars. So once you watch ars now you are
important. That's just the way it works. So if you don't cut down
on the import, your costs are going to go up. This means that
this is a great opportunity for anyone that wants to do import substitution. Anything
you can make locally to avoid the cost of the dollar, they are going
to make profit, right, which means it there's mellow, there's millow abroad,
there's millow Nigeria. The millow in Nigeria was going to cost you less
than the millow abroad because you are making it here and you are avoiding the
dollar. So anything at all that you make locally avoiding you converting to dollars
or important with dollars, that's going to make money for you. So big
opportunity there for everyone in terms of import substitution. You're costs are going to
go up, no mistakes about it. We take us to the final point
so we can all talk, right, you cannot. This is the government
of Nigeria. You cannot increase the costs of everybody in Nigeria via the removal
of PMS prices and the removal of the dollar exchange rate without giving a safety
net and a good sitty net is time. You cannot increase costs by three
hundred percent in twenty four hours, even in America. It's not done in
any economy. Three hundred percent increases a shock to the system, and no
one can take that shot to the system. It's just not possible. So
you either spread it over time, or you increase or reduce a shock by
increasing revenues. I either the incomes of Nigeria's either you give najeras a tax
cut or you increase our salaries. But you simply can't say something is gone.
Costs go up to hundred percent and it is what it is. That's
not going to happen when the economy will grind to a halt. Why because
people will have gone to spend all the money you spend this last week buying
pmis. It's money you are might to buy something else. Another thing is
suffering. So if you don't buy food, the farmers suffer because you bought
petrol. So you know it's a circle, your n only limited amount of
money. A comma mix is a subject of choice. So if you don't
buy food and you buy PMAs, food suffers. If you don't pay rent
and buy PMAs, your landlord suffers, and that's basically I might take.
So let's get the guys in here. I hope guys can hear me.
So I've got to have bright betore your bright. What's on your mind?
Houp, you can speak? Go ahead, so, hey, I'm very
well, thank you so much. Bright. Let me get your order to
go up a bit? Bright? Your audience kind of low? Can I
get your order to go up a bit? I can hear you, but
just louder. Yeah, that would work. I can hear you perfectly,
just louder. Go ahead. Yes, okay. Um, it's a reality
we have to leave worth. But my my, my concern, like you
said, um, is there any way that can be relieved as we have
to cut down on certain things that we do. We have to put down
um um, but I think that the politicians have gone because of course the
so cities are from fluids. We're playing for dollars. Your bays obviously on
dollars you're paying some video on m as so at the end of today to
edges. So what I think, um that if you take out one then
allowed although more pole so that I like license only end a piece because according
to any empty auto importably of what because you're but then even if they make
it hard, even if they make mood import now, I don't think anybody
will want more now and perhaps they want to put that got into starts rolling
now is prout then before then as it's just on our with So you're saying
physically, so so what you say that they should that maybe don't they don't
the fuel want and left the exchange you want to run in most subsidies on
fuel. But the same time you understand understand because for me you're taking out
of the dollar is still a r you understand, correct, I do single
you're gonna have single way you said you're taking the other one. There's the
room for all these nanigans that we're doing a year. So I expect that
they stick out the other one so that you can balance the people who are
scared the black market to buy the troll to import then come back at them
to sell it on that so they abso hear that maybe when I go to
buy now before I control our government with a increasing visual will be on the
av Yeah you said again, Yeah, then again is that where we're talking
about a policy we have not seen. That's the other thing again that it's
difficult for us to talk about right. All we are talking about it is
based on the pronunciation by the present saying something is gone. The NNPC has
come out. At the end, I watch the NNPC CEOs interview or in
on our right, what's very detailed. He gave a lot of background that
allows us even talk one The one he did on channel is okay, is
morful. But if you go to channels the one he did with channels the
next day, the next day, or the evening of that same day,
you will use see the different. Yes, the evening of that same day.
It's a care You know, before we were saying that Dancle day is
gonna get in Nia. You're gonna tell it to him in Nia, which
allows the pride not to go from um to go high. But in that
interview is gonna buy in Dancin buying crude from like any other. But the
only different here at this time is that all the other commodities that were allowing
to wait the way they're all gouldn't be local? Who quiet that the so
so so so so he cut just because so he contemned that Dangle is gonna
buy at the market price of PMS. Yes, he's gonna buy in donors
in yp does well, he said, because she asking how to buy?
Is getting me? Are gonna think? Said? Of course the same dollar
he's getting. Every other person gets that the same way he's gonna get.
You know what's gonna be what the advantage is that there will be many people
doing in the same business. But the important that time because we're gonna have
a sing good um exchange ready to do that. When there is more in
the market, a lot of people will go and buy people that will not
reduce the price. Do not start working between when price goes and when it
comes down. Gotcha so so so, just to be clear, Just just
to be clear, he's conferring that Dangles is going to buy at the market
price, no subsidy, yes, so so so that goes back to the
point I'm making to the last week. I was the guy I was arguing
about it's going to buy nira or it doesn't matter the currency. He buys
that. Yeah. What what matters is the price is thing? Yeah,
okay, So if if he's paying full market price, that means subsidy is
gone. That what it means to subsidy is gone with me. And what's
what that means is that there's no regulated price anymore. So you can bring
in your you can bring in your product and sell at any price you want.
You can go lower, you can go higher. So look at it
this way. Let me give you a scenario. Let me put this around
for you. Right, Julius Beggar gets contracts to build roads in Nigeria right
right now, is being paid in naira. They want dollars, but they're
paid in naira. So what do they do? They export cashoe knots from
Nigeria abroad. That how they get that dollars Angeles Beggar. So they export
cashoe knots. That's just beggar to get yeah, to get dollars. Good,
what they want. What Beggar can do now is to go to take
cashoe from Nigeria exported to Vietnam, then go to Chicago and buy PMS or
whatever in the world and bring it back to Nigeria. They don't need.
Yeah, they don't need dollars. Right now, the Indians are buying discounted
Russian diesel and selling back exactly. This is the point we'll make it because
and Beggar can bring that that PMS into Nigeria and sell at any price it
wants to get this. Yeah, so it gets it, gets paid one
hundred million naira, It takes one hundred and buys cashot of amon Era,
it exports it out, it gets dollars, uses the same dollars to buy
the diesel, and it imports the diesel backt to Nigeria and sells for one
fifty million. So it's made fifty million on that trade, just for example.
Right because right now there's no more regulative project can sell higher or lower.
So this is the market that we're going to go to. So long
term, the market price of crude and trade would determine the price at the
pump, not the regulative price. Long term, it might be better because
remember is going to sell order condensates byproduct of the of the pay of crude
oil. That would allow him to subsidize his own refinance. Even if it
makes a loss on PMS, he makes a profit on the other Yeah,
and this is this goes back to the failure of the of the Nigerian Federation
not feder federation. When you have crude that you say, why can't the
poor nager enjoy cheap petrol? They're right, as a Nigerian because you live
in this country and God has blessest country. What a bonus of cloud,
you should get a subsidy, they said, petrol is no. But if
we had run our refineries properly, we would have made a loss locally on
PMS but covered it up with other byproducts. The Dangote refinery, the dango
Tesque fertilizer plant quote and quote should have been an NPC fasilistics right and I
they had made profits on fertilizer, then they would have able to afford the
subsidy. The subsidy is because the federation has failed to expand the value chain
of crude oil. So the subthing looks looks like a lot. There is
no economy I change anyone show me any economy that does not subsidize something for
assistance. That's none. If good that, I've probably give my argument.
And you think this is one other things. One of the problems I have
was a part of that part of the world that I am. You see,
we don't want to push the narrative, push that narrative like that's how
it worked in other places. You remember doing this, Remember that because the
British confort and all of them want to give him debates on guards, especially
during winter. To give you a backup focus in America, prove the packs
on the pms and also gas, isn't it true? True? What do
you call that something? What do you call that? All? Right?
Good points? Good points? You see. Another thing I also know that
this is gonna do, is that we actually need to know the actually that
were consuming at. We need to know that we don't need so again again
first between, we don't need to know that. No one cares like do
you want more? How much cook sails? No? First, first let
me nobody they tells amount of gardian age, and no one wants to know
how much colors. So the Nigeria, if you can afford it, go
and pay for it. If Camel Roon can afford to pay for any piece
to come and buy, we don't care whoever can afford to buy. What
they're trying to do is that none that the prizes are related that allowed to
the market to determine they want to go into those countries to build their own
terminal so that they can sell they can export to that same countries by the
other And he said on the other two refineries, they one will be ready
by December. He didn't mention which one, but he said one of them
will be ready by December, the other already by mid of next year.
So, like I said, it's the circle that we have to go through.
But I think this plan will be better one. I will, I
will, we will, we will that. Okay, that's hopeful. You
remember your um, I'm town in legals four years between twenty twelve. I'm
that's gonna. I think I lost first. Okay, first, let first,
let me pause. I think I lost you all. I meant get
me the media in here to get this perspective as well, if you can
hear me. First, legal, I think I lost you. Let me
get me the media here to to get this perspective. Go ahead, sir,
Yeah, how are you doing? Okay? Yeah, I would like
to speak to this from three angles. Um, the idealistic angle, that
is from awesome way back and okay, the idealistic angle from use for where
we are now. And the last angle um the non idealistic, the practical
angle or the practical uh probabilities of you know, stuffs that can happen.
You know if you will go you know the memory line. You you know
that as far as seventy eight seventy neither as a country we will project I
had you know, Okay, we're going in population, we'll be another refinery.
That's how regarded where we want. That's how that's how we got the
first protacol one sorry, and later when Bevana in eighty nine ironicategory did that
one with some of these seven nine then wine eighty nine Babangida feloking rules,
we're going we need the bigger, really bigger um refining capacity to meet population.
And we the additional of his one ten or two because one to much
way for the put second photography refinery more. You know. So I'm still
talking to idealistically now, So you will expect that for a country of you
know, challenged people, educative people, people who you know other portulary are
working, traveling and all that. People will see what happens in other countries.
You know, you can tell people in the country a single bore that
do you know, like virtually has no all we're farming a gob from five
million powers per day. Idealistically you will expect, okay, but who we
have, all these shall move to share. Everyone will whatever you wander on.
All these people who task improve going to be people of them to build
refineries. I will say. Ideally and idealistically or theoretically, you will expect
the country like my dream you were not a crime scene kind of country.
You will be expect we should be doing all the two million bowels that are
probably we should approved do you see should be refined full because you make more
money from exploding refined products and selling the could products. You know, and
even at this time especially maybe pro spread the part spread and refined product is
better than is why we will be making a killing from fine hard So that's
that's idea is because but then as we were not really yeah, that's why
I thought that the whole idea of the subsidy iss a tax bad on federation
in afficiency. That's what's going on. Attacks we have we are paying attacks
on the inefficiency of the federation the federal states. Yeah, look a good
man. That's basically That's why I had to go They from free back and
talk, you know, like idealistically theoretically, so we are that's actually just
going to like my online we was here for. We are paying for the
inner dequoases or the criminal mindset of our rulers. Yeah, we are meant
to be a bronze now you get it. We're paying for their own inner
dequaces, inefficiency, or probably their own ways largely. Yeah, you know,
what do you say? Yeah, I would say, well, we'll
paying again for the inner dequations that reas strong and I'm gonna say strong and
contin letters like strong connection between the Myra, especially for country like Nigeria and
the prom Christ you know, see take it for example. Or let's stop
idealistically in the middle. You know, let's say zim. You know,
in two twelve, two thousand and twelve, you know, the dollar exchange
was at one one fourteen one fifteen one sixty there about. Now, idealistically
we should be produced. Is it agreed or is it's cool? Oil is
if you find all, you know, whatever, we should be able to
sustain production that will be able to sustain such exchange rates. Now imagine,
let's assume that we have exchanged and one hundred and fifteen dollars to a dollar
or two hundred nars to a dollar, and that exchange rate between the official
rate and say like else it used to be some ten fifteen years ago and
we're doing a passenger and whoever that Yeah, he spread between the official rate.
As a power market, you shouldn't be more than that. Let me
ask you a question. Let me ask you a question. Let me ask
you a question. Why do you think the black market started? Why do
you think a black markets started? Ask I'm asking a question, what do
you think whoa largely because of not really no no, no, no,
no no, not really, not really. It's very simple. Whenever you
see a black market, that means there's no supply. That's it. Whenever
you see a black market, there's no supply. The black market started because
there was no supply of the quote and quote subsidized dollars Nigeria. I remember
I was in school when my mom used to travel. I remember this conversation
where you're trying to buy dollars from someone at seven Nira. I remember in
my head as a child, and she was complaining better that this guy is
sending into her at seven era to one dollar. I remember, my head's
just complaining that she bought it for four era. Now it's seven era.
It was knew, She went on, No, I'm just telling you what
I remember, right, seven nira? Why was she buying it at seven
nira instead of the one nira? It was one era tenko bo in CBN
one era tenkobs buying at seven yarra. Why was she buying a seven era
Because if you apply at CBN at one era tenkobo, you don't get it.
That's why there's a black market. There is no black market for dollar
in America, in South Africa, in UK, maybe even in Ghana.
There's no black market. Why markets in countries dollars? You know, No,
you can't. You can't have a pile market. No no, no,
no need it? Need it? Let way? Where is the Where
is the pial markets in America? To tell me where is it? Wasn't
happen. You won't have in the US. You will have in the US.
You're having for example, you have it in you No, no,
no, you don't. You don't have a pile of market where there's no
capital controls. Pile market only comes when they are capital controls. So when
the central bank says if you want one thousand, will give you a hundred,
then it black market starts. It's not just for for dollars, for
anything their own. For example, now let me think of the country.
Now let's beating for example, if you go to most of our into the
part, it's a black market. Why if you buy foreign currencies. But
see the point is they get between the official rates and the black market or
power market. Okay, for example, let's say to one point two five
or one point three five two dollars single dollars dollar. The pole market is
every one point three six, one point three seven. Yes, So the
question is that why is there a black market? That's the question. The
question is why is there a black market in that country? Why? Yeah,
because not everybody will come to the bank to buy dollars exactly from people
are tourists exactly from the bank. You will happen from the from the part
even like for most countries. Exactly why is it all black markets in America?
Because American that's where the dollars come from. No, not because as
it does come because there you can walk, you can get dollars online,
you don't have to the market is available to everyone to get in and get
out. No, no, no, it has not do local currency.
The local currency of Ecuador is dollars. It has not do it the currency.
It has to do that. The fact that there is no control.
If I want to buy dollars today on my phone from a half year,
I can. Currency markets are international dollars, euros, pounds or slend dollars.
They are all convertible. They are all online. If you go to
China today and to do that, you can't buy dollars online. The ue
is not convertible. It had not do. The currency is the availability if
you want it. That's why there's no black market because you can't get it.
There's a black market in Nigeria because the central bank says, if you
want dollars at four hundred fifty four, we will give you, but if
you actually request, you don't get Look at the airlines are asking for dollars
at four hundred and fifty four, not affect it. They don't have it.
We have we have scarcity of dollars. That's the question. Why do
you have scarcity? The question is why do you have the scarcity? And
there's problem system as well. You don't have enough Why you don't have a
primaries as well? How do you get dollars dollars that you're supposed to have
it? You don't have enough. You don't have enough, you don't have
its place. You don't have enough dollars in Nigeria because you want to buy
at four hundred and fifty four. If you divalded nira to eight hundred n
all the guys that have dollars in bonds in the US will bring those bonds
or those funny portal investments to Nigeria. It's called hot money, it's called
they will transfer to a carry trade. You know why that way? What
do you mean? Want want? Simple? Right? Is a two thousand
vira two dollar? Now? When you have corruption, limar system used to
keep saying this corruption, it doesn't matter, it doesn't you see, the
market doesn't, it doesn't matter. When Nigeria was in the in the in
the JP Morgan bond index, what that meant was that if you buy an
imagined bond, you are automatically buying Nigerian bonds. What was the exchange of
the nira It was very low. De Niro was very strong. Why because
Nigeria was getting portfolio dollars in flu into Nigeria by default, you get it.
So as the dollars are coming in. Let me give you a clear
example. In twenty two thousand and seven, two thousand and eight, the
world experienced a global recession or seven or eight, the oil prices internationally crashed.
The Nigerian GDP went up, not down. Why did they go up
because we had reserves? Why did we have reserves? Because they then se
then governor threatened that if anybody tries to even attack the nira, he will
flood the system with dollars and you'll lose money. And he people looked at
his reserves. The guy had fought something million billion dollars and they backed off.
Why can't a mainflet do the same thing today? Because people look at
his reserves. It has forty his own eurobonds, his own China, his
owing every one dollars, so he can't talk. That's what the dollar is
going up because there's no supply. You get the points I'm making. Seven
um, remember the exchange rate at the bar market and what was was?
What was it? What was the act that's highest today? Was like iron?
But you could get it so again on your card. Remember it was
timing nine jeria on your card. On your on your card, you will
traveler brought with your card and spend dollars of how much on your card.
There was no restriction. You had a card. You would fly abroad with
your card and spend dollars with your card. Today it's twenty dollars a day.
Be the let me let let let me, let me get this.
Guys with you, but just hang in there, let me get what you
preciently. Don't go anywhere. Media m cheerful lows, high, cheerful loss.
How you do it? I've kept you with cheers. What you've got
the floor Menday is still here all right, but made it so. I
want to just make the point again to recollect everyone what has happened Nigeria.
What Tenable wants to do is to remove the regulator price on pms and on
the currency. If you take away the price, that means there's only one
price. There is now only the market price. What drives market price,
demand and supply. So on a policy level, I completely agree with to
noble take away the regulator price, let free market on the competition affect the
prices. But this is where I think he might be getting it very wrong.
You cannot shock the system with high prices and an economy like Nigeria where
people and still earn eighty thousand naira a month. That's still the official minimum
wage. I know most people have paid themselves more, but the official minimum
wage in Nigeria it's still thirty thousand nira. So NLC, the Nigeriable Congress,
yeah it's thirty is still still I mean I did two weeks ago,
I did a trend on bank salaries. I was getting screenshots. This is
actual screenshots from folks that are working in a bank. These are guys that
are the contract staff. So what happens in the banks is that the banks
without source, say a teller to a ted party, then the tired party
who would hire the teller back to the bank. You have people working in
Nigerian banks ending forty six thousand nira net. That's three dollars a day.
The property rate across the world is two dollars a day. Would wear tie
go to a bank, big bank? This bank is on Forbes. Yeah,
this guy is this bad is on Forbes. But they're paying their tellers
three dollars a day. Now that guy an in three dollars a day,
how will he afford a three hundred percent increase in petroleum prices? He can't.
He can't. So what you're gonna find is, how would the policeman
afford m a three percent The policeman would have gone, how would he afford
three percent increase? And what are they would do that he's gonna take his
dollars, his gone and demand more from you when he stops, he's gonna
take to pay him money. He's going to extort money from you because he
can't afford it. So it's not we're not being anti. We don't hit
the point giving the present good advice. You have to do two things.
Either you give a tax cuts to Nigerias or you increase your incomes, or
you do both. Your policy to well, there are many ways can do
a tax cut. There are many ways to do it. If you increase,
if you reduce the price of food, that's a tax cut. So
if you say you reduce, you eliminate importances on food for the next sixty
ninety or one to two days. Because the average Nigeria spends sixty eight percent
of his budget on food. So if you say you can bring in food
into Nigeria for the next thirty ninety days at zero percent, the price of
food will crash. Food is fifty one percent of Nigeria's consumer price. Indequit
means that the inflation you say today at twenty two percent is based on food
being expensive. So why is food expensive Because the bandits and the terrorists that
around in the Middle Belt don't allow farmers to farm. Also, there's no
infrastructure right to get the food to the cities. So what you need to
do is to have a plan. In the plan is going to be dropped
food prices by importation meet templates it. When you destroy the bandits, we
then start to build the infrastructure to reduce cost of locally generated food. So
it taxs cod for that just going to be lower lower food prices. If
that guy walking the bank in quote is ending his m sixty four thousand nairah
a month, can buy a bag of rice at five thousand naira. That's
a subsidy right there. But there is no way if you allow that bank
a boy to walk in a bank to end his sixty four k, he
will steal the money and when he's in front of God. If he would
tell God God, I was hungry and I stole money, how would you
jail that boy? He did still going to buy cow? He said,
I was hungry and I stole money. How do you jail him? He
hasn't let me not talk for them social media while my brother hireding, sir,
what's happening? Yeah, I used what we have seen one. Yeah.
You know, so you made a point just now about the government,
you know, giving allowances for people to bring you food. You know you
also go to me that look, that's all of policy. Call those where's
the dollars? I ever, they will have dollars one people have dollars,
Cian dollars. People have dollars. There's a dozen domar account and that you
are twenty billion or so. It's not on but the Cibian. There's dollars
abroad. My brother, my Brozon, is in Canada. I'll ask him
to lend me one thousand dollars. It's not Cybian money, so he will
give me one thousand dollars. Are we import? Are we imported? Online?
Import? Are we import frozen frozen turkey and frozen fish? One thousand
dollars from Walmart be you know for me of all those things that are temporary
measures, correct, correct, you know, because they're not things that you
know, into the longer term that you can use to sustain We try this
thing before where all, you know, the whole thing was propom for everybody
to bring itself and then at some point it becomes a majority incentive to Actually
I think for me, you know, and I mean proponent of something first,
this was subside we keep on talking about as an example. You don't
think he's one of the smaller things that were subsidizing as a country. I
think the subsidy in Nigerias was the big men. Listen to um. This
guy's you know talking a few days ago. You made very valid point,
you know about the government subsidising everybody that has so many things, and this
that boddictment for me. Honest an honest government, I WoT be honest about
this. What they need to do, you need listening the Culture's forum punted,
but where you can attract that forum counting as ex PI was a bit
of research and I actually wrote an article about this where between twenty sixteen and
nineteen sixteen, seventeen eighteen nineteen four years, sixty eight billion US dollars came
in to Nigeria. Yeah, and this was this, this is in former
kind of money. Who I'm Brooks. I mean people, my favorite,
my brother is successible. Nothing to really do with you know, company as
all structured money. Billion. Yeah, we have a government that is intentional
and China easier. People wonder when it's gonna saying, wonder the people you
see ruanties of young They put a certain percentage of the salary and decided who
every pleasant moment. So what am I say? You know, the forty
language of every government tends to dictate how people reflect and see them. All
of the sudden, I'm seeing a current speaker of House of reads the boxer.
I'm saying regard to his regard recycled in cover, you know, until
we are able to change all that forty language, all those wordy languages.
And you're just bringing it a sample samble. You know, even though the
government that has coming given with thirty five piece, I mean the lowest se
suicidist democracy, the lowest votes regarded by any incumbent. So let's people say
that. Look for some reason, you know, he's there go now,
and he says that too. I'm ready to do the right thing. If
that would you be entirely peferent from what we're seeing. Probably one. If
if I look at the subcity that you guys talked about, probably one.
You don't remo subsities without plans. There's only things you don't do. It
doesn't make any sense. You know. You also say you want to unify
your foreign next days you can't. We don't have money. I always says
something that I'm a very big person when it comes to prastructure. If you
look at that document I've talked about, and I that document says we need
to point night trailer West dollars over a thirty year period every year, every
year, every year, I prostructure every year to aplate to constructure for the
United States years now. This is a country that all are known, all
work currently generalities in deal, and we're still wasting it sensical things. So
this is where minel problem lize. When your prop you don't have enough money
to develop your infrastructure. Therefore all this we get putting. Can they give
a way? You know? Sometimes they can't and you want because that hope,
Now, why don't you as a government, which is why there's certain
people that fait certain conferents. If you're a manager, you don't how to
go revenue. This is the kind of the comment you will be learning to
lead. Why don't we look for ways that we can get moneies in easy,
easy way and start to focus infrastructure that can turn around food for us,
like and you said, you know our CPI could inflation. This is
crazy. Why don't we look for things that can help us to those things
that are very good? Therefore, he brings you back to that process that
recorder that that's for returns conversation. If we can attack that that's for a
return conversation in a very scruptured manner. You know they're doing it then you
know sort of process that people that's where I don't transscover. So nobody's ready
to put their money is where they mean? I mean, I would rather
that's where I wanted. But so h why don't we find your way to
attract six we can do what were the well you know, you know we
said it's in all the time. When I say put on Twitter, there
can't be posting things don't know. But I've told people before you can fix
exchange rate in day one. I've said it before, right, the markets
react to the future. To the future, the markets react to what's going
to happen, not what today to do. What's going to happen and what
has happened is that I'm I think to noble was brief that we are broke.
We were broke since twenty fifteen. But Harry simply paid the subsidy by
printing money from the CBN and as it was leaving government, he then made
the National Assembly past that illegal printing as law. So Tunubo knows he might
not be able to go there and do it again because everybody's eyes now on
ways and means. People's eyes want a ways and means, so he knows
he's broke. So I think he made that statement on purpose, right to
see what will happen, and what will happen was what happened. People ran
to the fuel pumps to bipure at the thousand nira. Then NNPACE then introduced
prices at five hundred nira to also see what to happen. All these things
have been done without any legislation. Remember what I said, there is a
regulated price. Has the regulated price been removed. Wasis a circular show?
To me, there has to be a removal of whatever to say that.
Is there a statements saying that in Nigeria today you can sell fuel at any
price? Is there any statements saying that if anybody has it, please sent
to us. So if you don't do that that I think there is plausible
deniability to say we haven't removed subsidy yet. To see what will happen?
I O look, go back to the CYBN. De Litrous published that Cibian
has developed Nia to about six hundred and eighteen or so see Santra mckima and
said they have not. I thought I was an era about the CYBAN.
Allow the story to play out and see what will happen. See what to
happen? What are dollars who flow into Nigeria? Because like I said,
wallet, whether I like Nigeria or I don't like Nigeria, if I take
a dollar today, let me let me carveet before we had all this Ukraine
war thing. If you take a dollar to an American bank, they're paying
you zero point two five to zero percent on your savings, So zero to
zero point two fives what the American bank would pay you on your savings.
Then Ukraine war has happened. Personal happened that they are paying you as high
as four five percent in America to attract an American to date for him to
take his money from Apple, Apple is paying four point five percent on your
phone to Nigeria. Niger has to pay that guy at least ten percent in
dollar. The problem that Nigeria can pay that ten percent and still make a
profit for you. And there's patriotism as well. It is possible to issue
actually issue alone alone at one percent, call it the ASPRA bond. And
Nigeria's are brought to still by because to them is development. Like you said,
we're sending money back for welfare, welfare. So if you go to
let me give an example. I don't want to be a tribal. Most
of these guys on the southeast, they build their roads, they build their
power from their town unions and their contributions. That's what they do right now.
Currently, if you pass a law you say any money you influ from
abroad, any dollar you eat from abroad, number one, the goth nager
will pay the transfer fears of their money. So if you influen one dollar
you get one dollar to your home state, that home state must you no
who bonus what that home state transfer fees. That's to see the and I'm
saying you won't you pay to Westernion. Won't you pay the American bank?
You pay an American bank. Now number two, that money must be useful,
distill the areas the way, the roads or power or irrigation, say
where it will be used. So the state's comment today will go and pass
every state. When you say these are my opportunity projects, these are my
projects, opportunity project that I want to have in my state, those projects
will be assessed. The fund will not go to the state government. It
will go to an SPV. You abroad will summon to the SPV. The
SPV will build that project on behalf of the state the same way. Pf
phase or the Feller government manage for the government money the same way. So
you build a road in a half year, you build power in all half
year at one percent return. I would do it because I am from Nigeria.
I'm not looking for the for me. It's a welfare bond. It's
not the bond for me to make money. You will get the money.
But again you said, it's trust and competence. I don't have to like
Nigeria to invest in Nigeria, but I would do it if you give me
a pathway, verybody. Their banks are broad. You can go and buy
one Chip County Bank in Atlanta. But you want Chip County Bank how much?
Then tell my enginiers in Atlanta, put your dollars in that comet back
in Atlanta were not transparent dollars. Put your dollars in that bank in Atlanta.
In Nigeria will print the Nira based on what that bank in Atlanta has.
You now have a miranda for in exchange in Atlanta. Then when you
want to you want to input, you will sell them from that bank in
Atlanta. Very easy solutions. They make everything look difficult. Oh you get
LIKEE says, money's not moving. The money stays where it is and there
are lots of ways you can do a wall lay sing. But again it's
back. This will is trust back to trust. Yeah, trust all they
wants to get in here. Let's heart. What's up? Yeah? Thanks,
just a conversation the post speakers and I wanted to alight, but I
think somebody is aquin. I think we have to Mike. Yeah. So
first, first of all, if you understand unification of the extery system,
it's not to maybe not a struggle week, maybe market efficient, good good
good points, good points about the CBS official challenges that big boys and those
that have pure for me, the have assets that have really created its functional
effects market and have put many in in Jupanty. So first of all,
I think it's a good to. Secondly, I have a problem with relics
many of us who always talk about years now you have and now you're a
prison. Now you're just prob breasing teenty systems to be done to every year
if you look at numbers that because for foreign education medical authority, for I
don't have a compact. That what I recorded the amount your place on foreign
education in the UK through the e Big Bank who form basic education in Nigeria.
So the person is the person is are we subsiding for the minority at
the advantage of the rejoice because which country subservices for their prostitisens to a new
pool the system greater after the opportunity. But in Nager, I think all
the substitut programs are pop for the upper musical as totally. I'm also want
to open on that seat, UH the present it on the move of the
SOO, on the speech that he spoke about the education of multiple activistem it
was spot on because what the message is sent market has really spawned investment curiosity
and that's why I've been seen so much engagement. Of course that he has
from your bonds to look out for. The continuation is what does he have
to lose right now to UH to stop to press the grace? I think
for me what what what you focus modes and its shuring that UM monetary policy
rules. I led with scal policies in the sense that you have to quote
ecagestems attitude that's on that problem. Strength of that depends. Would you want
on the export so well? Well, well little and again just make the
point again you're you're emphasizing the subsidy that we have in Nigeria is enjoyed by
the rich, not just individuals. Let me paint a picture for you.
How do we pay subsidy? When n NPC sales crude oil, the money
is paid to JP Morgan. Then JP Morgan will then credit the bank account
of CBN slash NNPC. Then the Central Bank NAGER will then go to that
account converted account from dollars to NIA and will then credit an NPC, who
then who then credits the national d FAC. Let's us call it a FAC
for now right, which means subsidy is paid by the Federation, federal states,
and local What does that mean? That means that the cars illegal state
are being paid for by states like Chigawa, a boring abber that don't have
cars. So if you drive a car in legals, your subsidy is being
paid for by every other residents in every other state, irrespect of the fact
I they have a car or not. That's the funny thing. So the
poorer states are subsidi, doesn't the richer states that have cars. Because the
Federation is basically the debuting across the board. All the states are local government
areas in Nigeria to pay for the subsidy, So it's an anti progressive tax.
It's a tax on inefficiency. We are paying for the inefficiency of the
federation, so we're paying hye feel prices. So it is good that the
subsidy goes. The point is this, no economy can sustain a two hundred
three hundred percent price increase it's unsustainable. I've given the example bankers are ending
sixty four thousand narra a month. How will they get to work on Monday
if your chat fees have gone two times three times of Explain to me like
a five year old, give me one bullet point, two bullet points.
How that guy will pay for transport and still buy food. So if you
work in a bank and they cannot buy food, what would he do?
It's gonna steal. And as across the board, you're gonna have crime corruption
because you wanted to move subsidy, so you don't. You don't kill one
problem to have another problem. So take away the subsidy. But you must
put in a policy, not I don't want to hear a PMS palliative.
There has to be a social safety net done for the injurience. If you
are below us as an amount of money, you must have something that the
government pays for. If it's to give everyone believes at the income class a
card that they can enter boss for free, do it. If it's a
give them innier to enter busses for free, do it. So are the
rich guys that have the jeeps pay the real price for petroleum but those guys
are walking the bank that are ending seventy thousand nine a month. They have
a card that they can tap and pay for bus or barty or whatever.
But you simply can't say, because subsidy is corruption, which it is,
we're going to take it off. If you have cancer today, cancer is
going to kill you. Would you just go to your doctor and doctor says
you have cancer? So as I'm looking at you, are going to cut
you open. Take no. They will prep you. They will tend to
go and change your diet. They two are going to give you the special
food to eat and then come back in next week or six months for your
operation. Why do they prep you because if you're simply just go into the
body immediately, you might actually harm the patient or than the cancer. So
we've got to have a policy. We've got to have advisors and ministers and
Nigerians can listen to and ask questions and the policy can be from lated.
We cannot build or increase prices because the president says subsidy is gone, whether
he meant it or not. That's the way that that's why you're run the
largest economy in Africa. Nine Hi don't name I've kept you waiting, So
how do sir? You've got the floor? Nasim can hear me? El
Nassim, Nasa Olim the question for you Oli, have a question for you
Olim and if you can hear me. When the last week I was talking
to a broker, big Man, he was then that the market is reacting
to the announcements by President to Noble that we're going to equalize interest rates and
we're going to remove this idea of WoT pay. So the market prices went
up. Of course, the empty uncle went up because they know they're going
to get their money back. Is that reaction the fact that dividend holders are
anticipating the payment of the dividend or one of them asking this, Why should
I ask a retail Nigerian like what the President said? Break it down from
me. What indus statement makes the price of the shares go up? If
South African would love it because it means that I'm getting the mone out of
Nigeria. But if I'm an investor, I bought Cadbris, what INDUS statement
is making the market go up? So qu Africa and have them you look
at the price right now, exacting correction. I explain it at all,
al certified you're gonna love the most expressive stock that's planning because in investors used
to use it to move forwards agay from the convuntry. You know it has
do listing instead because even the natural stock exchange that also in London. So
what point investors do usualize that buy and descend in long term book usual from
the presidents, which I think what a lot of people as saw from the
agent talking betwe that and some real investors that you are anticipating the fact that
your chi will have to be valued and definitely the big point you need me
Tom were buying institut of side said that buy in Q one so there was
already a prepal that might likely be a Polish run. So um presidents announcements
that was clouds means that competition in the energy sector coming and that was what
stocks that can bring it out money gains and for that descent. So yes,
it's it's a price that see that setting. Companies make a love of
money from this policy and that's what investors are looking at. Both for the
entification that definitely to definitely give banks more of psyche. You know, first
of all from equity side below vests that me complaining the fact that from pets
pasions that trecorded, so that we definitely attract for investors coming in. It's
definitely mental. Knew that that has also this commu uh afflicts looms getting the
cost of bringing deputy opened us interest rates, but that also played the rule
to vessels that look at the market dere to define banks can make more an
apple mont too. So I think everything investors that poison themselves any manergic stalks
the spar about problems. Also we've seen black s obserdative and feeling bigger tran
to present the monkey in me. I think the value will sustain except the
fact that we see our rest coming week. NFC said that the boole to
strike uh it's proberly could give the blue some resource of perpetiking on Friday,
but it starts accumentional that carprey. I think it's very tricky because Capria at
some point feel as well as twelve there and Qman. But right now is
running those to something that so one investors are looking at right now is that
value stalks we might really careful cettain websites. The fact that people spend more
on core items like this. But I think for me, emptying is already
at record that valuable stock on the n g X and the problems that I
will be banks. I think the president who try to sort that you know,
the banks are wings about one people that want to humanity. Uh deal
so that you know, can you your master and stop packet so you get
you know what happenst the lot of critics that that moth of you often times
is when the stock market those bad you know, data shoes that last four
years despite the packet bringing out positive bet the month of June has been very
perished, you know, so investors have to be question. But all lives
on the president or now you please have started Steve with the labor union hands
that Laborton is dead. That Laborton is dead. I heard the nothing guys
and the soups guys have pulled out so that Laborton is dead. I labor
guys to me and my opinions are like they are published the seeking Kim Kardashians.
That's what they are, Nita. They don't do anything. They wait
for like a policy that would make that will give them publicity, and then
they go to the streets. That's what they are. You don't see have
you seen labor emays going to piket banks about paying an adult walker sixty four
thousand ears a month? They don't do that. You see them picketing banks
to say hey, why can't women have maybe one year, but tend to
leave. They don't pick real labor issues. They pick all the fewer subsidient
thing because they know every every nina wants lower prices. So it helped them
to boost their street cred. But what have they done. My earliest memory
of labor is Adam to show Molly fighting or Bassenger because of Bassenger is going
to increase fuel price. But if your price is still up, Adam summits
the governor. He's now the one has known to increase fuel prices. The
more so, it's just they don't do anything label guys. They just look
for oh now I feel prices gone up? People don't life price. Let's
do a strike. Where were they for eight years when thirty one tree was
printed? Wait? Wait, wait, wait were they when billions were borrowed
that that the workers are going to pay back with higher taxes? Ware?
So that lable thing to me is it to fizzle out and to go up
to bid. But let me let me ask you, hum, let's come
to the The title says, subsidize the evaluation and your wallet. If I
subsidize, I EI removed in the legal price prices of PMS and dollar,
which is substant version go up. It affects my wallet negatively. So I
pay more for petrol, I pay more for anything important, So my wallet
suffers. Are bea So this is my question. So if my wallet is
suffering, I wonder what the stock market was rallying for because there's no I
you makee poisive points about the banks rolling because they are going to have epex
conversions, oil and gas ruling because it's going to be more competition. I
get that. I want to man cart breamente boring everyday retail stock that nest
leave card breedles everyday stocks ABC transport. So I'm wondering if the economy is
not set up for a massive shock because timbo is enheriting it a brooke for
the government. The government is broke. There's no more ways that means it
is broke. Ye good point, But you need to also understand the fact
that the stock market is highly ucalized. And one of the reasons why UM's
running right now is that investors give that utification of actuary system with definitive bringing
FBI. Also, you also to look at that many back stocks Nigia are
largely won't buy view unities like example, if you look at next different example,
uh, it's major alone by emotion national if you can discerning for example,
the movie has more than the the the right is that Nagia has.
Nagia has a country's perspicion in the stock market is very cool. So I
think what the will that be looking at it? The guys from the other
side coming in U also very good point you said, But I think also
investions are betting that the governments to this the economy equipments the economy left may
people will be more at the colt. You go what the market really wants
to posters and complains that players can come right now. That's about your concerns,
okay. So and again if we go back to the the whole Nadern
picture, the president sits down and he's given the briefing of his balance set
on his assets side, he has lots of opportunities, he has l L
N G he has an NPC he has that's throughout. Taxes are like teen
he can do. But the reality on his liability said is that he's owning
a lot of money. He's he can head. They can't even pay June.
They're gonna delay June salaries for further comment, I headed the report about
that. So he's owned a lot in his In his manifesto, he says
he was going to do to the couple the price and wallet you can hop
in if you have the answer. He says, gonna the couple the crude
oil price from the budget, which means that his budget speeches is not gonna
have benchmark. If he doesn't have a benchmark, that means if we sell
oil for eighteen n eighty dollars, we're gonna spend eighty dollars. There's no
excess crude again that's gonna go. Then a're gonna spend more and borrow more.
And he also said are going to print more. He also said in
that manifesto, you know we did it here. People didn't listen with we
analyzing man the first of the three guys. Here, he says he's going
to fix the price, which is in contact what I'm seeing now he said
I was going to fix the prices of agricultural product, which I heard him
say, and also for petrol and the currency. So in his manifesto he
says on about fixing the price for the currency for cultural prose. But now
I'm hearing him say there's gonna be a full decen' saidy yet. But I'm
here there's gonna be a devaluation. So for me, this is why I
want the cabinet to be announced. I want the advisors or the economic team
to be announced very very early. The Nigeria needs a mist of finance or
that it's going to be like and Ungs your coundre weller. Plus they share
they I'll do put together confidence smart that people can follow and say, even
though they work for the president, we can believe what they're saying. I
mean, Wall has made the point if you bring in the same cast of
characters that we had National Assembly, the guide that is your house, your
your your guide, that's your secretary, is the one that Robert stamped the
printing of thirty one trillion. That guy, the one that's your head of
service, signed off on the massive borrowing of the past administration. That's the
guy that's not going to run your office. So well, it was your
take, because you know, the person I always see an ideal should always
think about the two hundred medium plus people that the meant to govern over.
And you see when I get thought of all of these spark issues, you
know, the the current players, all of these guys in my views in
the past, minority of what we're talking about. You know, we have
data that says he hondered a twenty hundred and thirty million Nigerians you know,
live on some what's it called down thirty thousand, thirty five thousand narra you
know, per month. That's a data also says very very clearly that only
three point seven percent of Nigerians can spend a hundred and fifty thousand ran above.
Listen, gentlemen, well Le said that the game will they say it
again putting in here at the back see that how much they can spend says
you know, this was done by the World band. It says that only
three point seven percent of Nigerians can spend above hundred and fifty thousand era and
above per month. Three point seven percent can spend that amount permount. It
is ridiculous. Now, if you want to govern that kind of system,
my brother, which is why I keep on happening about infrastructure, the first
thing you need to do is cover up all the excess. Fact. You
know, there's so much you'll say, I saw all govern you know,
twenty boys, lexus, lexus, all this nonsense, paramandelia, you know
that or whatever it is says exit package that you know, I see all
sorts of lone sense, waste, waste, you know these things just me
and in my mind, the reality that I know is that these guys are
not ready to do anything about the current state of Nigeria. I can be
with that for in my bottom dollar, if if, if, if you
want to do something, if you're in that kind of I mean, look
at this repeated, we're a very poor country. If you want to do
anything in that kind of system, the first people that you should give report
to and those one hundred and twenty hundred and thirty million people, how are
they meant to survive? You know, which is why a lot of us
are saying, you will take out subsidy, don't you will do it in
a calculated manner? True, I think I need to encourage guys Google and
I imp that document is online. It was not in twenty thirteen. We
went to the We weren't represented into journal that in twenty four and I think
it was sited to love because um this there's this ministry that will houses it.
Now if you copulate, will see that the things online is there until
we face that documents because all of this monechy policy we talk about the in
their monety policies will never ever get us out of the doors in most balancing
with the fiscal Now, my challenge is over the last forty fifty years we
have been not that fiscal side of things. That's why whenever it raised,
we see all all sorts of dams you're going and everything bosting which which which
also affects agriculture. We see, you know, family produce all of those
things. People don't understand that wants you too much. You look at the
bigger picture. Bigger picture says be most invest in a fiscal side. They
have been people to do that. So if you look look that like you
has budgeting over the years, you will always see you don't recurrent expect very
high. You will see captain expectiture small and laundry. How can you build
a nation on this kind of love fided budgeting. We've twenty for years in
Jersey said, you know, last few years, We've been doing this thing
for years and Litten has lost as this is the time. And that's why
I go back and ACTEP saying where are the easy ways to get some amount
of money invested in new prastructor that can almost turn around things like carry You
always say something if if I be your people have been saying that if you
take food out of the man's problem, you solve the bulk of the problem.
The challenge is that Nigerians are hungry. You know, all the budget
talk that we do on Twitter is all faith. The bulk of Nigerians are
hungry, very hungry at that. So I always say, as a government,
why don't you address this issue first? You know, how can we
get in the lot of money compics into that turn around. You will employ
you not one that's the optics, right kind of talkability, you will create
the right kind of cameraight citizens. Well, it goes also it goes back
to the optics, the optics of government, right, you know, And
I don't want to get political, but we have to talk a bit.
You know, when you get elected with the lowest number of votes ever.
I had this start that more. I didn't want to go there. You
have to do quick things. There have to be the optics that you are
working for the man on the street. You know all I've seen in last
week. I saw the guy going to walk in them, these new bands,
I saw them having their meeting. I don't feel the urgency on Twitter.
I saw the silly arguments. One was seeing that you have to wait
for National Assembly to be in session before you can appoint ministers. Jesus hit
Christ listen. You can appoint. You can announce who you want to be
an economic team at any time. There are confirmations a different matter. Entirely
announce the team with We just left a present that didn't announce a team.
I will so how that went. Announce your team. The media guys,
the petrolum guys. Let them be the ones to drive policy. Then you
know you're asking people to cut down and order wallets to pay for for expensive
payments. But your official car is this massive, important Mercedes Benz. Please,
I'm not asking him to enter innocing or to enter a care I'm just
saying the optics when you do policy, think about the optics or will They
said that only three percent of Nigerians can afford to spend more than one hundred
and seventy five thousand nina a month convert or sent antonna a month to dollars.
That's how much only three percent can spend. Yet pure parents have gone
up three times. How are they going to pay? All the folks on
Twitter are saying is a good call. I agree, I've told you some
tooday was good. But you cannot take a cancer patience. Let me put
it better away. If you have malaria, they give you tablets. They'll
tell you to take four now, take four tomorrow, take for the next
day. There you can fa define maliia Messin and says take everything at the
same time. Just take all the whole twenty tablets, put in your mouth
and drink water. Because you've got malaria. You've got to have a plan.
You've got to and time is a plan. If you announced and you
say we are going to take away from your subsidy, and we're gonna do
it over four years, it's gonna be twenty percent every year that go.
They will come on stream that will reduce the pressure. Other guys are going
to come on stream and that will reduce the pressure as well. We're going
to increase in the mum wages. We're gonna do it infrastructure so people start
to see, Okay, I'm gonna suffer in quote for three months and hopefully
it's gonna get better. But if you said, please say it's gone,
you might run into turbulence that you didn't plan for. And her bless is
a big, big, big, big problem, right media, what's your
what's your take on this? Yeah? Go for it? Even uh uh
spoking to most things I would want to say. You talk about if you're
telling me to say, you're telling me start or probably fast. So you
are eating fast, you know you can't be eating fact while you're telling fast,
it's not gonna work like that. You mentioned what cuts like you also
mentioned what cuts is the government making both the exactive legislative at making you just
then portemra to really furnished the fournished asso and you're asking people that you are
giving. How do you talk a man on the street that you don't have
money? I mean, we have to say because we don't have many.
But then you can stand fort on furniture over there, well, other dad.
Every year you have to buy new furniture and you have to buy you
into little kitchen retail, so you spend over twenty one brewing amra for as
clinic alone. When people can give with the access primarily of care. So
in their defense, in their defense media that that's that's the old government right
in that defenders the old government that's leaving. Right. So there's a new
government. It's a it's any government on an economic side will do better than
people. Hardy administration. Any if you put a stone frog as the president,
it will do better economically than the harder administration. Any government will do
better. So these guys are going to be better than what we're hand in
the past, and they're going to have, you know, better, because
they're a bit more. We don't even though we like to be very hardest.
We know that's again and that don't know how much true we conceive like
I've said, like I said, it doesn't matter. We don't know in
the past and going forward we should. It should really matter. That's my
take on that. Let me get this the past what it doesn't matter,
prob yeah matter. People examples, you know, and we subside matters.
Thus it doesn't matter, you know, even if a contem hundred million liters
every day, you know, so the numbers we would be mine. Is
this so? And again exchange just just supposed to be claire as long as
we are paying full price for the crude oil. Subsidy has gone. If
we are subsidizing the subsidy and it's still there, I want to get I
want to get them in here. And am Nasa? Mister Nasa, how
are you doing? Hi? Yeah? What's what's happening? Where? Where
are you calling from? Sir um from how is kada? You guys have
fuel? We are It's called the free market? Wow, you can what's
in your mindset? Well? Um on vision that of all that believe mister
Alway, exclusion for harpitale on the side of the market, while we're almost
calling for so challenge towards doing and this a kind of itself as in democratcy,
but olgation that this government of on that on the economic Sorry to his
demord we used to do a kind of shallow understanding on the side of our
leaders regarding what sort of about you know, after the Great depression went arguing
that government really needs to come for regulatory majors again classical, that we should
have a full free much on my forces of demand and sulf And you begin
to under to realize one thing, one of the most brillonaries what sifty demands
you know, propriating and we prom company agree to push the understanding of major
economics to me that what's more like the program have you applicated? That's the
programing and the bottom line I'm paying shock about one when you see you are
subsidizing anything in the country, but on the side of publico where you can't
discriminate. And for a country like Nigeria, we are not supposed to adopt
that kind of shadow understanding of what has been right use for a new leader
community of action. I expected that where I should have been a from after
him, not on aligned thing with the idea of yes, main idea of
removing it is what is that not mister Darley? He and I had a
lot of people here agree with you. Look at but why is it that
company is not thinking about making the cost of governance? So this portrait is
the point that we are tied. We are we are practicing social fortunity and
capital for the four that demands just go whatever the mater completely. Want to
look at the dell out take it from two tavern at seven, look at
the devisions that I think there is the economic argument that when we're also here,
when prices right, when we happen, you begin to understand that we
have a sense of the charge, all other understanding of how the issue properly
people. And this is what stops me in the country that haply on imports.
You just come without comunity in wag of con ground, without proper plans.
How are we really do is how are we going through this on Nigerians
on the distance and ground and the other time you're talking about we we don't
even to have a union that because they only come to make noise and and
does for what what we're talking about? What happened in cost of VI of
mygia. I what we are having a mostly have been has always trying to
survive having reactuvenaries I do proactive. It is a general principle that beli of
dard of living of the count extend only about of bush At. So in
essense, now even where are you taking the point? Are you trying to
push economic aplings are we trying in production so that at the end of it,
the price AIS pros less right from domestic levels, it is a point
key less because you leavels keeping people are sending more on m he's going to
the kind of less because he has gotten more onto So yeah, I mean
again, you see that's the point. That's the point we're talking about subting
nature because we don't have any pulse in front of us. The only policy
we're have in front of us is the is the president's statements at inauguration and
the NNPC guys clarification. But we don't have a policy to go buy.
We don't know either removed the regation. We don't really know. Maybe I
wish we got a bit more context, but what we know is our prices
have gone up. Price have gone up, So that's what we know.
So and it's like you said, it's very interesting what you said that these
stations have got product, but because it's expensive, nobody's buying. So who
will blink first? Will the consumers be forced to buy? They cannot they
have no money. The consumers don't have any money. Wilayer I said that
only three percent and above Holland seventy five thousand a month with music. Guy
with with the SUVs are going to buy petrol. But nobody's gonna buy is
what I said. The economy will grind to a halt. Not because the
economy is going to go through ry or two, but because there's no money.
Nobody can afford the goods and services. The economy is many small wheels
turning. People in Carduna are not buying petrol. You bet yourself that people
in Abia in their buying in joys in oil. I'm not buying as well.
So there's gonna be a problem. You've got to stimulate consumption. If
there's no consumption, there's no economy. If you take away the money you
will use to buy food to buy fuel, the work kind of economy and
you're building is an interesting dilemmoa are gonna have to sort out going forward.
That's what's all happened. Mister billyam No, I've got by, mister Yakubu,
you've got the floors down. Hey are you doing? Kay? Let's
do cancer. Let's do cancer. If somebody has cancer and walks into the
cancer station, what happens? I'm saying you. Maybe maybe I don't because
I honestly um, you can't spend, they can't spend I have. What
he's saying is that the don't any enough to spend. It's not I it's
it's it's ignely research. It's it's documentary research. It's not it's what I'm
like. I our it's one project and I lewhere bro, bro. This
data is from nigeram Breal Statistics. It's not fake data. I can send
it to you. There are lots of other data like that support this one.
For instance, no, no, let me don't. Don't they do?
You know how many jams have more than one hundred thousand in their bank
account or five routs on the bank account. There are many that have support
this one. This is just one part of many data we do. We
don't have consuble captain Nigeria with owns. So let's leave the lord and make
your point. The data is factual. The data is factual that many Nigerians
cannot afford to spend more than a horders some five thousand era a month because
they don't end as much. I'm sure the bank employees and need some four
thousand. His factual of data. I would anybody that when I want anybody
that I like, but you need me? You people that people back.
It doesn't mean anything. You are making conjecture without that. It doesn't if
I go to a Balanday there are rules first, no balanda would I didn't
say a Bandai and guys can afford rules? Royce, it doesn't make any
sense what you're saying, sir, the data from I and I my brother.
Why do you think rice is sold in five kg? Why do you
think oil is sold in in in sashes? Why do you think all that
is happening in the economy? Why do you think so? Do you have
friends? Do you have any friend you do you have any friend that has
bought a brand new car that was not bought by his company or by his
employer, that took his own revenues and bought a brand new car in Nigeria
the last eight years? Do you know anybody not company car? How many
do you know? I love them? I did say financing, That's what
I'm asking you. Do you know Nigila dost have financing? Do you know
any Nigeria that bought a car in the last eight years? Nobody? But
bro, We're gonna move on, man, we gotta move on. I
love people. Take that people. People have been No, no, I
said, I I'm on some of these things. Like I said, honestly,
I don't that I don't because this thing has actually okay, I think.
Let me just make this point. I hear you. I hear you.
Get the point of making. You're saying that you agree with the subthing
to move out punch not the stage I see. The point I'm making is
this. There's no one you would find here that doesn't want something to go
away. No one. But the point you must understand is that Nigerians do
not end the average weighting Nigeria. Officially, it states NA a month.
There are tons of data to show that Nigerians do cannot afford is three hundred
percent shock. There is no financial person you can speak to that will tell
you. In any economy, forget Nigeria. In any economy, you can
increase prices by one hundred percent overnight, and that makes sense in any economy,
even credit economies. Nigerians do not have credit. They averaging. Nigerians
spend cash, which means if they earn ten nira, they have to spend
ten nira. If you increase fuel by a one hundred percent. All you
are doing is telling that I to do a choice between food and fuel.
That's all we are saying. We're not arguing with you. The reality go
out of the streets. If there was money Nigeria, you will see sachet
rice, you will see sachet toothpaste. You will see sasha. That nonsense.
There is sashi because people can't afford it. That's why it's there.
How much is a narrow money paying the pedroal going to painful? How much
the paying narrow money? Why do not paying one million nini money? What's
the salary of a police sergeant that has an a K for the seven on
the street? What is salary is at the nara? Convert to nara two
dollars and tell me what that is. So let's not make arguments because we
want to defend the government. I don't want to make a politicular. I
don't see whether you. I'll let you speak, whether you support tinable or
those portulable econom mix does not care. Economics will happen to everybody. If
you go to that police john today, you are going to pay five hundred
nara plus irrespect of the politicular sticker you have on your car. If you
have that money, God bless you. Let's let's get cheating here, che
diego V taking her name right, cheat gov. Hey, go ahead,
sir, what's up? I'm so sorry I don't have and it's not much
because about the very small practice I can't see, okay, in the fact
they are people. Maybe the naked um is that impopulate population that sup side.
No talk about what the rest of the we need this question of the
form body order their species that have there's the path. Yes, you want
to take out the first for you about taking across the borders to some other
countries and are founding know that column which is actually very true happening who we
have been seeing the effect you know that countries now that the subsidies are being
but then you coming to see take it off immediately it will be good fine,
end hundred thousand even spending forty thousand on month on transported or night and
any less hundred exactly. Yeah, you don't have the maths wizard to know
that. Man. Yeah, but but are we are we really having a
discussion If Nijas can't afford it to come on, that's not discussion. To
have everybody on this space, everybody on this space knows this. I want
to ask you, how much do you pay your cook? I said,
don't answer. Just tell me how much you pay your cook or your driver
or your housemaid. Do you pay them less than two dolls a day?
And don't answer. Just ask yourself that question. Do you pay your cook,
your driver, your men more than that two does a day? In
this Nigeria, we know the answer to this. That why we This is
not an argument to have. Now, this country has got the richest black
man on earth, Dangote in this country. Does it mean that in Canal?
They're not pourple in canal? That's his argument. So if we go
to if we look at Dangotes, will say, oh, because Dangote is
a billionaire, then we should increase the price of fuel because Dangota can afford
it. No, the lowest common multiples, where the society goes to the
government exists for those that cannot exist in a fair market. That's what the
government does. That's what they have. Obama Care. America has the best
care in the world, but they have Obama Care because if you can't avoid
medical care, then you get health insurance. Support in this same America,
this subsidize diesel for farmers. Farmers have their own diesel different color. The
color it differently is only farmers. But yeah, and we're here arguing that
we should remove we should remove the prices. You can't whatever policy want to
do. The point I'm making is that there is no economy on Earth or
any business on and two hundred percent price increase immediately, forget Nigeria, forget
whatever. The two hundred percent increase immediately is not sustainable. It's not sally.
What's up man? I did sal you, I did what's happened and
put the light and at the end of the in front of for example.
And and nobody can say categorically that disiness and that are the advantages or disadvantages
that or the thing that government is going to do to actually mitigate the effect
of to city removal. I'm wanting about pete comment denominator. Petrol doesn't just
affects cards because mustiper tho'to thing that that who people have pol have discussed.
Petrol affects almost everything the market we know at astronomically. So as much as
we are support of or I am in support of something but then I believe
that should be win with SUBSIDI, should be removed and should be done in
the right. By now partic should start ruling. The engineers should be able
to should be sure of the things that they're goings were enjoyed. So let
the lights that they plan to bring, let us bring their light. Let
us so the light the light to come to the beginning of the tunnel.
I'm going I'm going to use that that line. So you want the Sally
wants the lights at the beginning of the tunnel, not at the end of
the tunnel. Very interesting, and you see your point is valid. I
mean where I've not hitting anyone in the last week say they are against subsident
only analysis again subsident removal. So subject that has got to go. But
it has to go in a plan manner with pallities. And I don't want
few well subsidient pallties. I want a social safety nets to say if you
do not end money, if you are young, if you are in firm,
then the state will protect you. Not just a very very cost a
still low. So you can afford to pay people certain amount of money based
on where they live, based on how they spend and they can get by,
but you just can't. If you go to my avilagtion and you say
we're going to increase your price by one hundred percent, how are they going
to afford it? Where do they end? Who would they charge one hundred
percent to cover that increasing fuel price hundred percent? And my avilace is like
you, so think about the guy in your place. How would the guy
in your village be able to afford it? Uh? I do, I've
got you? What's up? Yeah? Hey, what's up? Yeah?
So, um, this space is really important for for everyone because it's it's
for us to look at all the sides of the argument, you know,
trying to dispel the propagandas and people that are trying to cast light Nigeria.
So this is really important for those purposes. Um, my own ancle is
I think the majority of us basis I agree that uh, subsidies is a
waste in the manner in which it's been revented, so that that's that's fine.
So subsidies, then how do we address that wist? Because that then
means that subsidies is not the problem for the manner in which the subsidy has
been implemented that the problem. So some of the arguments that subsidies benefating a
few rich Nigerians. First of all, the only people complaining so far had
had a break Nigerians. I don't see any rich Nigeria fighting at the first
lation. They still the abread nigerent. So Secondly, if we're saying that,
um, this subsidy now should be taken off because there is vistage and
it's benefiting a few, does that then mean that now that we are taking
this subsidies away, does that mean that automatically there are no more avenues in
the government that benefits a few rich And does that then mean that automatically in
all the vistages in the government has automatically stopped. This is the angle and
want naturals to come from. We shouldn't see subsidy as impacting. We are
blessed with oil. Why shouldn't we enjoy? Why should we go broke trying
to pay for something we're blessed with? Doesn't make any sense that are blessed
with oiled worldwide, they're subsidized that the economy. Most recently, UK had
to subsidize their citizens when they and enterprises went up Russia also subsidizes that the
citizens in terms of a petrolum product. And even when they're talking about phasing
out subs due to the ongoing crisis in Ukraine, they're doing it gradually.
No, you know, so they're telling that the major oil marketers that look,
we may eventually phase out the subscide by more than fifty percent. They
didn't just come and said, you know what, subsidi has gone and taxing.
So this is what my dreams are saying, well saying, let the
government talk to us, let the government carry us along, Let the government
show that we're in all this together. It shouldn't be like, oh,
because the way I'm looking at the subsidy now, I can't wrap around.
I can't wrap my head around the fact that I'm thinking it's more or less
like a tax now. And the way I look at it is this is
the AFR gals that are going to be responsible for paying the tax. And
mostly because the god that the death to GDP ratio is so high now that
we can continue borrowing to subsidize the foe. So if that is the case,
then how can we look for other sources of cutting governments? Ending subsidies
should not be this the sole skateboard, and I think that the handful we
should be looking at it from. I'm willing to give this new government the
benefit of the doubt because this policy was not made by them. The policy
was made by previous administration through the the i A and also mute lack of
provision for subsidy beyond true. So essentially what these governments did is to announce
it and to continue to Yeah, I think I like completely agree with all
you said. Just the last problem do addressed. I agree with you that.
Let me make it. You've if you've taught a few things, you
know you are touching right. Number one, the subsident removal is a tax.
It's a tax on government in a patiency because the government cannot get you
cheap, or should we say cannot get cannot make any MPC provide PMS without
going bankrupt. That's number one. Number two, this government right the policy
of subside removal. That's why I define the terms at the very beginning.
When you say subsidie removal, then we're putting into this box and we're not
getting the real intent of what's going on. What they are doing is removing
the regulated price. They are removing the regulated price. The policy was not
done but the last administration, nor was it done by the one before then.
It wasn't a long time ago in Nigeria. In Nigeria, a long
time ago, we regulated everything. The price of air travel, the price
of water, the price of everything was regulated and petrol has stayed. So
when the refineries went bad a long time ago, not eighty years or sixty
years ago, they went bad in the Military region because the price of PMS
was reculated, then there had to be a subsidy for the import. So
right now, fast forward to today, when people say that there's no provision
in the budget for subsidy, there has never been a provision for subsidy in
any budget. I challenge anyone to show me in the last budgets where there's
been a provision for subsidy, how has subsidy been paid for. The NNPC
pays for the subsidy. You only saw it in the budget because they passed
the PIA and NNPC was then saying that they were going they were own the
federal government. This differential between what they were paying over charging the government for
subsidy. The NNPC pays for subsidy NNPC is not in the federal budget.
The NNPC is not in the federal budget. So people say there's no provision.
You put a provision there, then you take of it wasn't there before
now, So I'm challenging piece on go back to the budget and show me
in say twenty fifteen where they says fuel subsidy. It's never there. So
when we now say it was not put in the budget, it was never
in the budget. What the government simply said was that the past PIA which
made an NNPC Limited, is now a quote unquote private company, and it
was a private company, then the Balanchiet is going to be separate from the
federal government. Right Hence the npisade said in twenty nineteen or so sally in
twenty twenty one subsidy will go, but they allowed us for one more year,
which was twenty twenty two. So in this year twent twenty twenty said
I are only going to pay for subsidy for six months, that they're going
to support the NNPAC for six months. But subsidy has not been in the
budget in the past. It's paid for by the NNPC. So if you
want to pay for subsidy going forward. You can, you can, and
like your brightly said sir, it has got to be a graduated thing.
You advise the country. We're going to move subsidy payments or over remove the
regulative price. Hey, this is a subsidy. It will go out over
four years and is how we're going to fund it. That's how we should
do it. But it shouldn't get an excuse to say there's no money in
the budget. There was never money in the budget at all to pay for
subsidy. N NPC is not individual budget. Are we are we thanks for
that clarification, just the roundom so that I don't hold So. One thing
I noticed from the previous administration is that there were very liberal in terms of
um you know, wildfare programs. We know about the creation of the humanitarian
ministry, you know, and programs. We know about the l power,
you know about the mc boras program. So essentially one these programs exist at
the moment, right, So do you think these programs have a role to
play in terms of these quotem quote palliatives that we're talking about, you know,
trying to question the part of this subsidy that is now gone. Do
you think they have any key role to play because the person has made it.
Claire that obviously there's need to increase the minimum which but we know what
a goot when the briss many people will still not INERTI int this minimum which
so that minimum which it itself is not really uh something that is going to
benefit majority may the government workers, because of course the government will implement it
some policy, but what about the private sector, what about the informal sector?
Are there going to keep to this minimum wage? Thinking about yeah,
two questions, two great, two great questions. So number one, the
the the the social the Ministry of Humanitarian was charged with this social um security
payments and all that they did not do a good job, and that was
a lost opportunity, right, Many people believe that that ministry is very arbitrary,
that they just announced money, but the money does only get to a
lot of the of the quote unquote poor people. That nothing wrong with the
idea we're trying to copy or we're trying to do the social security scheme or
social welfare scheme. But I just think it's not that transparent, and I
think they lost the opportunity of the good will of the population. And it's
not hard to do this right to have a social registrar. We have NI
and we have biometry support and see where the money is going to. So
that's one part there. If this god men can go back to that scheme,
you know, clean it up a point on that's very very trusted,
and roll it out and say, okay, if you earn, you have
to file taxes. If you file taxes and you say you end this income
below this median benchmark, then you qualify to receive social Security benefits unfunded social
circuited benefits or funded from payerial taxes. We can do that, and we
can have that scheme or Parron and even if it's to start with one million
people, start there, then build it up. We cannot say everybody must
pay market prices in capitalistic society. It's not going to work for everyone.
That's number one. Minimum wage that you talk about economist or so you say
capitalist, don't like it because when you're pricing, if you price wage,
you are then saying that when you price minimum wage, are actually going to
reduce employment because some coupitalists will say, oh I can't afford to pay this,
so I will pay less. I personally think you should have a minimum
way to say, below this level, you cannot employ anybody if you're not
going to pay employees level just for not just for social contract. You can't
have people anything less than a dollar a day because you have the right to
payiment doll already. So the minimum wage clearly has got to go up.
The question is always how do you pay for this? And the answer is
writ in front of us. You can pay for the minimum wage by cutting
back the fat and the waste that is currently in the federal government. Look
at National Assembly. I saw that, but it was the last year National
assemblies allocation is more than the Universal Basic educations allotment. How doesn't make any
sense. The National Assembly ends more or is allocated more than the universal basic
education. So cut all that fat a way, sell all those presidential if
you took a keep one or two, sell those things, cut down the
cost of being business and plow it back into paying minimum which increase for the
junior workers. So you can see level zero to level twelve. Maybe they're
going to increase their wages for now, and the economy improves, then we're
going to increasing wides for the upper or said workers but there has got to
be something to done with me. Mort which inflicition is twenty two percent twenty
two percent and minimum which has not moved since went to us announced off era.
So you don't have to be a math wizard to see that. We
have got to pay people more is you don't have to be a math twizard,
right, And we have to do this by asking ourselves where can we
get the money from to pay people? There's money in Nigeria. People don't
pay taxes, so tax them. You know you have homes and Abuja do
tournament rate? You can. You can't hide your house, it's right there.
Who owns this house? Tax the house and pay. There are many
ways to raise revenues. Cut down the waste, tax the rich and transports
of moneys so the poor people in Ninetia to survive. We can't build an
economy where the poor cannot feed. That's you can't build the society that way
where the poor cannot feel. You how this guy say there's petrolling Carena,
but nobody's buying. So if there's no money buying because they don't have money,
yes they don't. They don't have money. So when you come in
and say they will have money, but they're not showing it. If they
have the money, they will buy the five hundred fewer, but they don't
have the money. That's what you're not buying. Yake. I've got you,
sir, mister, I k I k I. What's up now?
So am I going to shut down the space? Maybe electant and spitter because
the technical issues on the space today is a bit low. We might have
to do the exact same topic next week. Yeah, but they tech issues
today all do is very very poor. I can add a lot of people,
it's just a space. I know what's going on with them, right,
So I CA, you've got the floor. You can go ahead and
speak when you're saying, which hasn't win day down and maybe next week will
do on that take on the same topic because I'm sure this week would have
more information that we can then speak on. So I can go to flossor
okay um, because I as I think move plus removed towards was bad.
Yes, it was bad, and I will keep still because the subsequent move
Um Majors of the Jena wants it. I feel that that is not the
only place for I whist the morning we want to fast. Okay, national
segment think about people's lives, realize anymore when you talk about art, doesn't
know that it's notting compared to what they can mean. Eve, they should
change the name for minimum ridge the minimal living rich to maybe two let thousand.
Let's be a living ridge, minimal living roo. People can understand.
Go it's to pour, it's to pour. I don't know if the county
just keeps making people poor and only the rich keep going high. They employed
people all over the police session, the UN forces, the military, and
they're about what is the salary skilled? How its increased? Every remote for
everything should not suffecting for everything. The price is changing and nobody can talk
follow us. Where are yourself or whatever? Imain'stay I was complaining to or
just beautiful something you looking drive, not just oppin. You should be complatively
removing this thing. I mean, I think so bad. Yeah, yeah,
And I don't want to put to give this excuse of of of of
I don't yeah, I don't want put to give the excuse of fog or
knock or budget. I'm just saying, in any in any eco system,
in any ecosystem, you can't increase prices by two hundred percent immediately in any
eco system, government, private sector charge masks. Even in your own house.
You can't just tell you your child, I used to give you Tony
before I'm going to give you want Era. There's no way it's done.
In any eco system. You can simply say, we know subsidy is corruption.
We know, but let me put us saying immediately, don't we know
the pots are corrupt? Don't we know the police are corrupt? Okay,
let's crap the entire police force tonight and let's build a new police force.
Since we know police are corrupt, let's crap the entire police today, and
let's start building your brand new police form tomorrow with anyone thing that's a smart
idea. No, because who police is treating in the country. So you
do it gradually. You say we're going to recruit new work and new police
people that are going to replace and phase out. It's in police force over
time in any ecosystem or so the argument of it has to go. No
budget argument. It was not in the budget before. I'm looking at the
budgets now right now, show me your budgets, your fagile budget where you
saw subsidy before Pia show it to me. And if you say, okay,
there's now Pia. Okay, there's say Pia, why do you still
have regulated prices? Is the PA being implemented. It's not been suspended.
It's been suspended, right, So what is your I mean, I can't.
I can't find his name. One can can DeFore, one can DeFore
you've got the flows because if you go at, you're having simple to the
name. So how are you doing, sir good? Yeah, soct something.
UM talked about relatives and reading minimum wags, which doesn't mean and I'll
see why a reason minimum wage. Everything that follows is always situation and private
goes up. So when you can talk about natives, I always he have
minimum wage, minimum wage. That's so, But nobody talks about the long
term effect of reading minimum wag. Nobody talks about um benefits for minimum wakes.
Race, I will following your lind We talked about fans not saying people
enough money. If you read the minimum wag, we know the banks not
raia salary. We know that things, pride of things are going to go
up. So yeah, up among them. Because at the end of the
day, price was still go up and you still have to raise animum wage
and it follows each other back to back to back, So it's not really
solving the problem I had. The politics are saying, oh, I would
have done it gradually, and I would have putting politives. Everyone keeps saying
politives are minimum ways, but that is not the solution. Yes, we
need to take out the subsidence, but no minimum which won't solve the problem.
Okay, So a question for you, which which one has come personate
you that inflational minimum ways increased? Um, it's like we're following back to
back, but that's the question. Was like, okay, so okay,
So have we increased the minimum wage in Nigeria? Saince was in twenty sixteen?
Have we increased since twenty sixteen? Has intention gone up? Okay?
So the answer is that I'm not. I'm not. I'm not saying it
will I'm saying inflation has gone up on an annual basis, It's gone up
by twenty percent annual. Business. That means that the salary you earned in
twenty fifteen has been cut down to say half today. But the minimum wage,
the official waging Nigeria, has not gone up. So even before we
even argue should we increase the minimum wage, you're not the point that your
wage has been eating by inflation. Before we even argue how much has been
eating, it has been eating already, So we have to try to match
prices. Fuel has gone from what seven narra to what to forget? This
new increase to your wage has stayed the same. So what should the workers
do? What tell me what the worker should do? I said, it's
a very very complicated thing. It's not just by reading minimum wagelone would not
solve the problem. Like I said, it's goodstlation. Yeah, but no
one, no one has no, no one has said something. Times we
can actually take out the subsidies and take subsidies. When the boil price crash
twenty sixteen, those are the best time to take our subside. Then let
the price go up at the same time poil price that No, this is
times when the house because very soon channel will start coming for us. I
start taking about wots and airports and the seaports and everything. Oh trying to
say everyone, I keep saying, um brace with more way, race with
more witch. It's not going to solve the problem. Ever. Keep silies
company the sect of these things. It's not a ship like Accusa moment that
everything is sold nothing. We are in broke country. We are not like
the southeast. You are not like you buying heavy rings all producing company but
country. Sorry, but we have brooke and we should realize that we should
stopped looking at mother country. I realize that we are poor and put a
put accordy to our side that I have to say this idea of oh let's
keep this thing that keep going back and fought on grazes in the more wage
and we should. But the topsy or not comes up to it. It
doesn't matter. We are not the rich country. We are cover two hundred
abion Nigerians and we are producing violence for this side of the country alias the
same amount of will with most same amount of oil body. But still they're
not that rich. I've expected to like sounding yeah yeah, But the question
is I think let's I've let you. You've made your point, but I'm
asking you simple questions. Right if inflation. No one has said that increasing
the minimum wage is going to solve any problem. We are saying increasing the
minimum wage it takes your wage to where it was before any problem will started
from do you agree with that? That's what we're saying. Inflation may minimum
wage does not cause inflation if you increase the minimum wage. Inflation occurs if
there's no productivity. So when you wonder would Dogi? Okay, but I
can give you a history, wonder would DOGI would Dogi? Awards? Nigeria
increased, not only increasing memo, way they paid a lot of money.
What happened there was inflation? Why because there was noting to buy. There's
a lot of money and order to buy. That's when you have the art
murder of cement ships in legals. I had a guy told me. The
guy used to work for the air conditioning factory in Niger. When you sell
a concer, you told me that right, people will come to their shop
and bribe these salespeople to keep air conditioners or fridge for them. There was
so much money in Niger that you couldn't buy a fridge. No, it
wasn't available anyone the important was sold. So people will come to the store
and bribe the shop attendant. Please keep off for me. That's why there
was inflation because of the productivity. Now let me give you an example.
If you go to the onion market in Jigawa. It does not matter the
minimum wage or the Montrey policy or whatever you do, the price of onions
will not go up. Why they are onions in Jigawa. There are no
onions in Legos. That's why there's inflation of food in Legos. There's no
supply of onions in Legos. Inflation occurs when you have cash moving in the
velocity in the economy and there's no productivity. Today in Nigeria, the essames
are not producing, so rice is not available. That's why food prices are
going up. Not because of the cash in your pocket chasing the rise.
There's just no rice to buy. You heard the guy sell you today there's
petrol in Karna. Nobody's buying, Okay, So say something about inflation.
Go ahead, good. So when you read the minimum with what happens.
Give a lot of money around and a lot of moneys around. That's what
happens. People have money to sponge on more things. That's what happens.
But that is not true. That is what they teach us. That that
is no, that is what a teachers. No, that's what it is.
That is what it's taught. Yes, now, Jesus Christ, and
the US printed trillions, trillions of dollars money, money to use, and
that will happen to us went up at might be said, at some point
the US printed two trillions of dollars under quantitative easing from two thousand and seven
interest rates in America, where zero percent trillions were printed. There was no
inflation in America. Go and pull up the data. Quantitative easing printed trillions
was introduced into the American economy, and there was no inflation. Why because
America is able to import cheaper and that sucks up the excess capital. Inflation
is simply not the increase in cash. It is when that cash has nowhere
to go, moving with velocity in the economy. Then it causes what you
then call cost push or demand push inflation. If you give everybody in Nigeria
and increase double increase in salary, and you increase the production of goods and
services in Nigeria, they will take their cash and buy the goods and you
will not have inflation. Inflation or cause when there are no goods and services,
when there is no productivity to soak up that cash. America printed dollars,
Zimbabwe printed dollars. Zimbabwe has inflation. America has no inflation. Pull
up the data. It's not to say I might expert, pull up the
data. If you go to any look food state in Nigeria where food is
produced, it does not matter the amount of currency in that state because the
supply of that food product is surplus in that state. There is no food
inflation in that state. Go to Benui, yam is available. Go to
a half year cassava is available. The problem is taking it from Benui or
appear to the market in legals. It's not a currency printing problem. It's
a supply problem. What the conny's called cost push inflation. Two taglets inflation?
All right, sir, who we got here? All right, so
I think we'll start to wind it down. Since the audience a bit low,
let's do this again, I guess let's start to wind down. And
our thirteen minutes of being here about th thirteen minutes. So the point I'm
making, guys, it's let's summarize. Let's sort of summarize what we've talked
about. Let's summarized all talking about today. Number one, the subsidy itself
is inefficient. It's a waste and it's a drag on government revenues. No
argument. So the subsidy is a waste and a drug. The government is
broke, so the government says they can no longer pay subsidy. That's fine.
The only issue I believe Nigerias have today is that it's taken off immediately.
So it has made prices or to we say, the cost of living
in Nigeria go up significantly. This has then reduced the purchasing power of their
fixed income because they have a fixed income, but they are able to spend
that same fixed income on the same goods and services. So yes, there's
patrol now, but nobody is buying because we have to choose between food and
school fees and patrol. So what do we do with default to honor scale
of preference to what is or important towards food and school fees. If this
continues and then no one is spending because we cannot afford it, then the
economy starts to contract and starts to shrink. Who can get the economy out
of a contraction? The same government, The same government has got to come
back in and expand the economy by spending or by giving a tax cut to
spenders. It can give an expansion of incomes to the lower class employee and
my jury say we're going to increase the salary, and it can give a
tax cuts to the DAN got to say, we want you guys to spend
more money on capital investments with this tax cut. So if you simply increase
costs without providing a palliative, I eat and talk to the government. Now
you are going to contract the same economy you want to tax in future to
pay for your growth. So it might not make sense to do that.
You might want to consider removing the subsidy. But given what the cognition,
are palliatives to ensure that folks can still consume. If I end a one
hundred thousand, how do I go to work? If you will it is
five hundred nina? And later, how explain it to me? So this
is I think the impact on your wallet. The government has a repair to
play in reflating the economy. If the economy contracts, they will spend more
to replace the economy than doing a proper plan to phase this in, and
how to phase the palliatives in. You can't in any ecosystem increase income or
cost by twenty it just can't take it, or I guess. On that
note, let me thank you all for journing us. You have a lot
of issues with the audio today because I don't know what's happening with spaces today.
But will definitely definitely try to do this again. I premier next week,
same to big but I hope, but then would have had a lot
more, should we say, more information from the governments, maybe one or
two guys that are appointed, and we'll listen to the NNPC guy a bit
more to get more a better sense of what they're talking about, to allow
us to reach a more information. But as it stands, if you will
allow just this price inquase to stay without the corresponding income support, the economy
is going to contract. Its maths, it's just pure maths or I guess.
Thank you so much you guys, have a wonderful rest of your evening
and bye to you.