WEBVTT 1 00:00:03.919 --> 00:00:08.839 You are listening to the IFAH podcast Network. For more amazing filmmaking and screenwriting 2 00:00:08.880 --> 00:00:14.839 podcasts, just go to ifahpodcastnetwork dot com. Welcome to the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, 3 00:00:14.960 --> 00:00:18.359 Episode number three seventy three The Way I see it. If you want 4 00:00:18.359 --> 00:00:23.160 a rainbow, you got to put up with the rain dolly parton broadcasting from 5 00:00:23.199 --> 00:00:26.960 a dark, windowless room in Hollywood when we really should be working on that 6 00:00:27.000 --> 00:00:32.399 next draft. It's the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, showing you the craft and business 7 00:00:32.399 --> 00:00:36.880 of screenwriting while teaching you how to make your screenplay bulletproof. And here's your 8 00:00:36.920 --> 00:00:42.439 host, Alex Ferrari. Welcome, Welcome to another episode of the Bulletproof Screenwriting 9 00:00:42.439 --> 00:00:46.640 Podcast. I am your humble host, Alex Ferrari. Now, today's show 10 00:00:46.719 --> 00:00:52.679 is sponsored by Bulletproof script Coverage. Now. Unlike other script coverage services, 11 00:00:53.119 --> 00:00:58.439 Bulletproof Script Coverage actually focuses on the kind of project you are and the goals 12 00:00:58.479 --> 00:01:02.159 of the project you are, So we actually break it down by three categories, 13 00:01:02.240 --> 00:01:04.680 micro budget, indie film, market, and studio film. There's no 14 00:01:04.799 --> 00:01:08.640 reason to get coverage from a reader that's used to reading tempole movies when your 15 00:01:08.680 --> 00:01:12.480 movie's gonna be done for one hundred thousand dollars and we wanted to focus on 16 00:01:12.560 --> 00:01:17.439 that. At Bulletproof Script Coverage, our readers have worked with Marvel Studios, 17 00:01:17.519 --> 00:01:23.079 CIA, WME, NBC, HBO, Disney, Scott Free, Warner Brothers, 18 00:01:23.120 --> 00:01:26.480 The Blacklist, and many many more. So if you need your screenplay 19 00:01:26.640 --> 00:01:33.719 or TV script covered by professional readers, head on over to covermiscreenplay dot Com. 20 00:01:34.200 --> 00:01:38.159 Now, Guys, today on the show, we have filmmaker Edson Oda 21 00:01:38.799 --> 00:01:44.719 Now. Edson has directed and written an amazing new film called Nine Days, 22 00:01:44.760 --> 00:01:49.719 which premiered at the Sundance Film Festival and is getting a lot of buzz for 23 00:01:51.200 --> 00:01:56.000 possible Oscars this year. And I've had the pleasure of seeing that film and 24 00:01:56.079 --> 00:02:00.840 I understand why people are talking about it in that way. Nine Days is 25 00:02:00.920 --> 00:02:07.640 about a person who sits in judgment of new souls and they have to basically 26 00:02:07.760 --> 00:02:13.960 go through a nine day process to get to be awarded life. And so 27 00:02:14.120 --> 00:02:17.840 basically, newborn souls come in, there's a review process, and if you 28 00:02:17.879 --> 00:02:23.039 don't pass the review, you don't go forward towards life. And it is 29 00:02:23.000 --> 00:02:30.719 haunting and wonderful and heart wrenching, and the film just pulls every emotion that 30 00:02:30.879 --> 00:02:37.360 you have when you're watching it. It was really interesting because the film was 31 00:02:37.960 --> 00:02:43.120 part of the Sundance Screenwriting Lab and this is his first feature film with an 32 00:02:43.199 --> 00:02:47.120 amazing cast. It looks like the MCU just kind of blew up in his 33 00:02:47.280 --> 00:02:53.199 movie because he has a lot of NCU alumni in his film. But let's 34 00:02:53.280 --> 00:02:58.319 just get into it because it's such a fascinating conversation on how he went from 35 00:02:58.400 --> 00:03:05.120 commercial in Brazil to directing Nine Days. So, without any further ado, 36 00:03:05.159 --> 00:03:08.520 please enjoy my conversation with Edson Oda. I like to welcome to the show. 37 00:03:08.639 --> 00:03:12.479 That's an oda. How you doings in good good man? How's it 38 00:03:12.520 --> 00:03:15.919 going? Thank you? Thank you doing well man. I'm so happy to 39 00:03:15.000 --> 00:03:16.759 have you on the show man. Like I was telling you before we got 40 00:03:16.800 --> 00:03:23.360 on, I had the pleasure of watching Nine Days and I absolutely loved it. 41 00:03:23.479 --> 00:03:25.879 I think it's it's a film that we need in this world now, 42 00:03:27.400 --> 00:03:31.599 just kind of starts that conversation, starts that conversation about a deeper conversation about 43 00:03:31.639 --> 00:03:37.879 what we're doing. And I think the pandemic is really made us think about 44 00:03:38.039 --> 00:03:42.280 our lives in general. But before we go down the rabbit hole on your 45 00:03:42.319 --> 00:03:46.759 film, how did you get into business? Yeah, I was born and 46 00:03:46.840 --> 00:03:52.759 raised in Brazil, and then I started working advertising, like straight out of 47 00:03:52.879 --> 00:03:54.800 college, and then I worked in everyth that's for like ten years as a 48 00:03:54.840 --> 00:04:00.000 copywriter. And then afterst that, I moved here to the West. I 49 00:04:00.080 --> 00:04:03.879 went to film school, Grab film school, and uh yeah, and then 50 00:04:03.960 --> 00:04:09.159 I just started writing stuff. And there's at some point it just rolled nine 51 00:04:09.240 --> 00:04:12.919 days and got to the Sunder's Labs, and then from Sunden's Labs, I 52 00:04:12.960 --> 00:04:15.920 got like I'm genius, some producers and then from then on it just like 53 00:04:15.959 --> 00:04:20.319 started saying out and so like got finance. So that's pretty that's awesome. 54 00:04:20.600 --> 00:04:24.839 So when you were in Brazil you were working in the commercial world. I 55 00:04:25.000 --> 00:04:27.560 was, yeah, I was. I used to work in advertising agency. 56 00:04:28.160 --> 00:04:32.279 Oh I got oh very much. So I've been a commercial director for twenty 57 00:04:32.360 --> 00:04:36.759 years, so I yeah, but I've been a commercial director for over twenty 58 00:04:36.800 --> 00:04:41.399 five years, between music videos and commercials and stuff. So I and before 59 00:04:41.439 --> 00:04:45.519 that I was editing in editing commercials as well. So I'm very well aware 60 00:04:45.560 --> 00:04:53.199 of the agency side of the agency side of the business. Now, you 61 00:04:53.240 --> 00:04:55.879 know, coming from a commercial background and a music video background, how do 62 00:04:55.959 --> 00:05:00.560 you how did that prepare you to jump into your first feature? Uh? 63 00:05:00.720 --> 00:05:04.000 It prepared a lot actually, you know. And it was interesting because when 64 00:05:04.040 --> 00:05:06.160 I migrate, you know, I said like, oh, yeah, not 65 00:05:06.279 --> 00:05:11.800 gonna I'm just going to start from you know, uh, from beginning, 66 00:05:11.920 --> 00:05:15.120 you know. But then I think as it was just when it was doing 67 00:05:15.199 --> 00:05:19.160 prap and it was filming, I saw that it was it prepared quite a 68 00:05:19.240 --> 00:05:26.800 bit actually, especially writing because it was a copywriter. And it was interesting 69 00:05:26.879 --> 00:05:32.240 because in terms of uh, I think commercials are a very high concept, 70 00:05:32.480 --> 00:05:36.199 you know, and you you always try to grab people's attention in like a 71 00:05:36.319 --> 00:05:40.920 short span of time, and there's something that even like nine day, if 72 00:05:40.959 --> 00:05:44.600 you pitched someone there, there's a kind of a element like, oh this 73 00:05:44.759 --> 00:05:46.959 is this is weird, this is different. And I think even when it 74 00:05:47.040 --> 00:05:51.480 was coming up with the concept that was trying to go uh with something that 75 00:05:51.680 --> 00:05:57.160 sell kind of unique somehow, and it felt in the same time when you 76 00:05:57.800 --> 00:06:00.639 in advertise, you always you're push to just like I have the best execution 77 00:06:00.839 --> 00:06:04.639 to one single scene that's like thirty seconds, you know, so I think 78 00:06:05.040 --> 00:06:10.560 every every single scene somehow I saw more or less like an you know, 79 00:06:10.639 --> 00:06:14.480 a commercial in the way that I need, you know, tons of the 80 00:06:14.519 --> 00:06:16.120 execution, just just I know one that I felt like, all this this 81 00:06:16.199 --> 00:06:18.639 switch well to the story and what I want to achieved. So it was 82 00:06:18.759 --> 00:06:24.079 it was very helpful to be honest. Yeah, I mean when you're writing. 83 00:06:24.160 --> 00:06:27.000 When you're writing, you ideally you're supposed to have a beginning, of 84 00:06:27.000 --> 00:06:30.439 the middle, and end in every scene. Uh. And with commercial you 85 00:06:30.560 --> 00:06:33.600 are trained to do that every thirty seconds. So it helps you with your 86 00:06:33.639 --> 00:06:38.120 writing a lot. I'm sure. Now, how did nine Days come to 87 00:06:38.199 --> 00:06:44.600 life? No pun intended. Yeah, no, it's it's it was a 88 00:06:44.839 --> 00:06:50.040 burdatory than someone's like it was. It was such a you know I started 89 00:06:50.040 --> 00:06:56.319 writing it. It was like two thousand and fifteen. Yes, it was, 90 00:06:56.399 --> 00:06:59.319 so it was pretty quick actually, and then they were like this first 91 00:06:59.399 --> 00:07:02.600 draft. I wanted to write this kind of like you know, uh, 92 00:07:03.040 --> 00:07:08.439 micro budget movie because I felt like even if people don't you know, invest 93 00:07:08.560 --> 00:07:11.519 money in it, h coorset case in there, just like I do a 94 00:07:11.600 --> 00:07:14.560 Kickstar or something, and they just making myself. So I felt like, 95 00:07:14.800 --> 00:07:17.279 yeah, I'm gonna write something that I can produce with like a interact with 96 00:07:17.399 --> 00:07:21.160 like one hundred k or something like that. Sure, and they will It 97 00:07:21.240 --> 00:07:27.439 took me like a I think one month or something after I figure out when 98 00:07:27.439 --> 00:07:32.199 I want to write about one love to just for sure that all the thoughts 99 00:07:32.240 --> 00:07:35.720 that I had, And then after that took me like three or four months 100 00:07:35.839 --> 00:07:39.480 just to you know, bride the pages. And so it was more like 101 00:07:39.639 --> 00:07:45.079 four months and two I had like a rough first draft, and then I 102 00:07:45.199 --> 00:07:47.000 got to the Sunless Labs. And after the labs, it just started working 103 00:07:47.079 --> 00:07:51.240 on that script for like a year and a half two years or something like 104 00:07:51.319 --> 00:07:57.480 that. And then from then I just like start just like meeting producers and 105 00:07:57.920 --> 00:08:01.399 and the and from from that all it was like it was something that was 106 00:08:01.519 --> 00:08:07.160 just wasn't just me, it was some something, something took something took over 107 00:08:07.240 --> 00:08:11.279 the project at that point. Yeah. Yeah, mostly was mean because it 108 00:08:11.399 --> 00:08:15.560 was a would be the person just doing like most of the you know, 109 00:08:15.720 --> 00:08:18.680 try to sell tragic and stupideh I give you money your stuff like that. 110 00:08:18.600 --> 00:08:22.480 But it was and then people were just like be on my side. Yeah, 111 00:08:22.519 --> 00:08:26.040 yeah, give money to something. Yeah, he's he's a good he's 112 00:08:26.040 --> 00:08:28.000 a good film. It's okay, give him some money, give us money. 113 00:08:28.000 --> 00:08:28.720 He's gonna do it. He's not gonna lose it all, It'll be 114 00:08:28.759 --> 00:08:35.480 fine. It's always I always, I love I love talking to filmmakers about 115 00:08:35.879 --> 00:08:39.000 getting the money for their projects, because I don't care who you are. 116 00:08:39.159 --> 00:08:41.279 Everyone's got to hustle. Everyone's got to hustle to get there, to get 117 00:08:41.320 --> 00:08:45.639 their financing. There's very few directors who don't hustle to get their finance, 118 00:08:45.720 --> 00:08:48.120 especially for your first film. But when watching that film, but watching the 119 00:08:48.240 --> 00:08:52.200 movie, I can see that it could have easily been done for one hundred 120 00:08:52.200 --> 00:08:54.840 thousand dollars. You know, it was you know, control locations. I 121 00:08:54.960 --> 00:08:58.960 mean, obviously not as grand a scale, but you could have push Come 122 00:09:00.080 --> 00:09:03.240 to Shove made an independent version of that without question. We're talking so much 123 00:09:03.240 --> 00:09:05.759 about the film, let's can you tell us to the audience what this film 124 00:09:05.840 --> 00:09:11.159 is about. Yeah, this is such a weird we'll be to pitch, 125 00:09:11.200 --> 00:09:15.840 but I practiced a lot. So this movie is about this interviewer. It 126 00:09:15.960 --> 00:09:18.720 happens in this This is a distant reality. I don't call like you know, 127 00:09:18.840 --> 00:09:24.360 it's a it's just a local fire. And then in the same vein 128 00:09:24.440 --> 00:09:31.159 of movies like Eternal Sunshiny, Spotless Mine or Her, and and then there's 129 00:09:31.200 --> 00:09:35.279 this like a reality which is kind of a pre life reality. As a 130 00:09:35.360 --> 00:09:39.840 call, it's a before life reality. And there's like this interviewer whose name 131 00:09:39.919 --> 00:09:43.440 is will in interview souls to choose one soul for the privilege of being born. 132 00:09:43.559 --> 00:09:48.440 And the process, you know, takes like nine days to be concluded. 133 00:09:48.720 --> 00:09:50.679 And during these nine days you just get you know, talk to the 134 00:09:50.759 --> 00:09:56.120 souls, knowing them better. We'll be right back after a word from our 135 00:09:56.159 --> 00:10:05.639 sponsor and now back to the show. And then by the end of the 136 00:10:05.679 --> 00:10:09.960 processes just pick one. Two people aren't to me where we all uh at 137 00:10:11.039 --> 00:10:16.960 now? So what is your definition of a soul? That's what's an interesting 138 00:10:18.559 --> 00:10:26.440 question. You know. I think it's it's everything that's not uh created through 139 00:10:26.519 --> 00:10:30.679 the environment, you know. I think it's it's things that are innately there 140 00:10:30.679 --> 00:10:33.759 are you know, part of us before we interacted to one another. But 141 00:10:33.879 --> 00:10:39.879 somehow they tell how the interactions, you know, or or how the environment 142 00:10:39.879 --> 00:10:45.200 will shape us just kind of you know, I think scientifically would be or 143 00:10:45.360 --> 00:10:50.559 DNA. But it's interesting, but it's not the DNA because as you can 144 00:10:50.639 --> 00:10:54.799 see, you know, there's so many frames variables. Yeah, there's veryble 145 00:10:56.279 --> 00:10:58.559 but on a but on a spiritual level, what do you think your definition 146 00:10:58.639 --> 00:11:03.320 of a so is if if if I may ask, I think I think 147 00:11:03.320 --> 00:11:07.279 it would be more like the DNA of your personality. It would be the 148 00:11:07.399 --> 00:11:13.360 Danna of your of you was not nothing related to your body as a being, 149 00:11:13.519 --> 00:11:16.399 as a being, as a being, Yeah, as a being? 150 00:11:16.879 --> 00:11:20.000 Is it being? Because I love first of all, I love the casting, 151 00:11:20.159 --> 00:11:24.759 and I loved the variety of ages, the ages, the the the 152 00:11:26.480 --> 00:11:30.440 the colors. It was like a rainbow. Its fantastic to watch. But 153 00:11:30.559 --> 00:11:33.080 I love that, you know, some of the souls that came in for 154 00:11:33.200 --> 00:11:37.600 the interviews were older, some were younger, uh, and they were all 155 00:11:37.720 --> 00:11:43.399 different personalities. And I found it so interesting that the concept that you know, 156 00:11:43.519 --> 00:11:48.559 a freshly arguably a freshly born soul, which is what I took from 157 00:11:48.600 --> 00:11:52.759 the film that is as a freshly born soul comes in and goes, Okay, 158 00:11:52.759 --> 00:11:56.000 I'm here, I'm going to interview. But if I don't make it, 159 00:11:56.080 --> 00:11:58.120 I just go back into the mix and then hopefully I'll get born against 160 00:11:58.159 --> 00:12:01.799 some other time and maybe another opportunity. But I just love that they all 161 00:12:01.919 --> 00:12:09.480 came in with some with attitude, Some were very pleasing, some wanted to 162 00:12:09.519 --> 00:12:13.000 please, others were very stand off it. It was it was a really 163 00:12:13.120 --> 00:12:18.039 interesting character study. I think it was almost so almost a sociology experience. 164 00:12:18.679 --> 00:12:20.360 Would you agree, yeah, a hundred percent. You know, it was 165 00:12:20.440 --> 00:12:26.279 interesting before I chose to become like advertiser, was like in between like psychology 166 00:12:26.320 --> 00:12:31.879 and sociology. And then I felt like I always want to somehow understanding of 167 00:12:31.039 --> 00:12:35.080 society or even give something back to society or do something for them. But 168 00:12:35.159 --> 00:12:37.960 then but at the same time, I felt like it was I had this 169 00:12:39.080 --> 00:12:41.600 kind of selfish desire of creating, you know, and just like I have 170 00:12:41.759 --> 00:12:45.279 the fun of creating that. At the time, it was just you know, 171 00:12:45.480 --> 00:12:48.559 when with advertising and that, and then later in my life it we 172 00:12:48.720 --> 00:12:50.960 just felt like, yeah, it was so interesting to do something. There 173 00:12:52.039 --> 00:12:56.360 was more like a connecting connected to war people. You know, how I 174 00:12:56.480 --> 00:13:01.879 steal about the environment around us, and it's almost like a sociological study. 175 00:13:01.000 --> 00:13:05.960 And nine Days is more or less like that. It's like how what happens 176 00:13:05.039 --> 00:13:09.159 is or something and why we are the way they are? You know. 177 00:13:09.279 --> 00:13:13.320 It's it's not it's not about like I feel trying to just answer anything, 178 00:13:13.399 --> 00:13:16.080 but it's more about like just raising the questions and like it started discussion which 179 00:13:16.519 --> 00:13:20.200 for me, it was just very very interesting. Yeah. No, the 180 00:13:20.240 --> 00:13:24.600 film definitely starts questions, and it started it asks questions and definitely will start 181 00:13:24.840 --> 00:13:28.559 discussions. I have to ask you, how was it to workshop this at 182 00:13:28.600 --> 00:13:33.279 the Sundance Writer's Lab. Well, the right, Yeah, it was even 183 00:13:33.279 --> 00:13:35.440 broke up a little bit. Yeah, so yeah, how was it? 184 00:13:35.720 --> 00:13:39.159 Yeah? How was it to workshop the film in other script at the at 185 00:13:39.200 --> 00:13:43.399 the screen at the Sundance Writers Lab, which is you know, it was 186 00:13:43.759 --> 00:13:46.279 amazing, Yeah, it was. It was just amazing. It was just 187 00:13:46.840 --> 00:13:50.240 I think since you know, when when I got to uh I got here 188 00:13:50.279 --> 00:13:54.000 in the West, I think I didn't know so much about the Sundance Labs. 189 00:13:54.039 --> 00:13:56.840 But then when I got to know, I just felt like this, 190 00:13:56.039 --> 00:14:00.120 this is this kind of white dream. You know, we want to to 191 00:14:00.240 --> 00:14:05.240 being board and you know, selected to to just workshop the script with like 192 00:14:05.360 --> 00:14:09.799 the amazing ventors and they give you feedback and something interesting. It's not just 193 00:14:09.879 --> 00:14:15.000 about the feedback and how you know, you meet them and they give you 194 00:14:15.080 --> 00:14:16.639 like notes, but it's more about the environment, you know, It's more 195 00:14:16.679 --> 00:14:22.559 about It's interesting because like like my movie, you know, the whole process 196 00:14:22.679 --> 00:14:26.799 is very almost like spiritual. It's it's like a bunch of people who are 197 00:14:26.840 --> 00:14:28.960 there, you know, isolated, and the rule number one is just like, 198 00:14:30.159 --> 00:14:33.360 let's not here listen to the industry. Now we're here, we want 199 00:14:33.480 --> 00:14:37.159 to do something that's human, you know, something that makes the difference, 200 00:14:37.559 --> 00:14:41.799 something that you know it's you or you you you know, and let's just 201 00:14:41.919 --> 00:14:48.200 forget what other people you know are saying. Just find the reason for why 202 00:14:48.240 --> 00:14:52.720 you're telling your stories and why it's important. And then we after finish this, 203 00:14:52.039 --> 00:14:56.159 we just go and and start just like you know, pitching it. 204 00:14:56.320 --> 00:15:01.039 So it was interesting because the whole place, the who arm and process so 205 00:15:01.159 --> 00:15:05.600 much about learning how to be vulnerable, learn learning how to be personal, 206 00:15:05.799 --> 00:15:09.600 learning out to you know, their own stories, but not just by you 207 00:15:09.639 --> 00:15:11.879 know, telling story for the sake of telling stories, because it has how 208 00:15:13.000 --> 00:15:16.000 so to do with how can we help you with the craft in order to 209 00:15:16.159 --> 00:15:20.759 you to tell the story. So it was it was just like a perfect 210 00:15:20.000 --> 00:15:24.679 environment for me, like a personal but also very technical too. It's like 211 00:15:24.840 --> 00:15:30.960 going to Tibet with a monk. It sounds like it's like it's your yours. 212 00:15:31.159 --> 00:15:33.759 You're completely walled off from the rest of the world. It's a whole 213 00:15:33.799 --> 00:15:37.159 bunch of other monks. They're teaching you how to meditate in the in the 214 00:15:37.240 --> 00:15:41.159 craft of storytelling, like you know, I don't know if you watch like 215 00:15:41.480 --> 00:15:46.360 Cobra Kai, of course it's of course, I mean it's more like the 216 00:15:46.480 --> 00:15:52.159 Nyagy do you know when and Hollywood is more like a later you came just 217 00:15:52.240 --> 00:15:54.799 after you go to Yago do you can go to you know, Cobraka and 218 00:15:54.879 --> 00:15:58.320 see like, oh, this is the script that I brought from Yang Doors. 219 00:15:58.480 --> 00:16:04.320 Just such a that's such an amazing analogy of Biaggy Do versus Cobra Kit. 220 00:16:06.279 --> 00:16:08.720 It's and I think, like we I'm doing advertising for the Cobra but 221 00:16:08.759 --> 00:16:11.679 I'm sinking now that the new season we got to learn that both of them 222 00:16:11.960 --> 00:16:18.200 need each other, which at the end of the day is true because Hollywood 223 00:16:18.279 --> 00:16:22.279 does need the independent story, and the independent story needs the infrastructure of Hollywood. 224 00:16:22.279 --> 00:16:26.759 Because all of our great at all of our great directors and writers, 225 00:16:26.799 --> 00:16:32.159 they all they all start somewhere, you know, they all start with their 226 00:16:32.240 --> 00:16:36.360 independent films, generally speaking, before they don't just generally come out the gate 227 00:16:36.480 --> 00:16:41.480 with one hundred million dollars, striking first tracking hard. Wow, we're going 228 00:16:41.600 --> 00:16:45.600 right, We're going deep down the cover type's let's go back to nine days. 229 00:16:48.759 --> 00:16:51.279 That's so funny, all right, Still, can you to explain if 230 00:16:51.279 --> 00:16:52.639 you can tell us to kind of take a step by step. So you 231 00:16:52.840 --> 00:16:57.159 you're done at the at the Sundance Lab, you finish the script, you 232 00:16:57.240 --> 00:17:02.039 meet a few producers, and then you basically just go out into the world 233 00:17:02.120 --> 00:17:04.759 and just start looking for financing and money to try to put this project together. 234 00:17:06.200 --> 00:17:07.200 Yeah, how long did that? What was that project? Like? 235 00:17:07.519 --> 00:17:10.480 What was that process? Like it how long did it take you to do? 236 00:17:11.200 --> 00:17:14.359 Oh? Yeah, it was so it was interesting. Right after the 237 00:17:14.680 --> 00:17:18.079 so the sundst laps, I just went back to you know, went to 238 00:17:18.160 --> 00:17:22.119 my desk and then just start writing writing, right, So yeah, okay, 239 00:17:22.200 --> 00:17:25.519 now we're ready to just go out to my managers, and you know, 240 00:17:25.880 --> 00:17:29.000 my team just like started saying out to producers and Sundance as well. 241 00:17:29.079 --> 00:17:32.359 It's interesting because I was done with Sundance, but sunlsces never you know, 242 00:17:32.640 --> 00:17:36.599 done with you. They they always warn you. So and then like for 243 00:17:36.880 --> 00:17:41.200 for the next like months that we just started saying script and just start carrying 244 00:17:41.359 --> 00:17:45.440 like producers. So I think during one year I started just like working with 245 00:17:45.640 --> 00:17:49.359 producer for one year but it's more client you know, find investors and people 246 00:17:49.359 --> 00:17:52.839 who would be interested. At the same time, it's just hard for you, 247 00:17:53.000 --> 00:17:56.839 as you know, a first time director to get like money because the 248 00:17:56.920 --> 00:17:59.880 way they want to do it, they want to do like, you know, 249 00:18:00.640 --> 00:18:03.559 more of with more resources. And and when I when I wanted to 250 00:18:03.599 --> 00:18:07.279 do when it wroll, okay, I do like under K, but they 251 00:18:07.359 --> 00:18:11.759 wanted to do with war more than und K. So so when you started 252 00:18:11.799 --> 00:18:15.839 like asking investors, we were very interested, but as well, but they 253 00:18:15.920 --> 00:18:18.200 were also like, you know, yeah, we like his vision and all 254 00:18:18.240 --> 00:18:22.960 this stuff, but who would play you know, this character? Always that 255 00:18:22.799 --> 00:18:27.799 Yeah, that was the time when we just started going introducing the script two 256 00:18:27.839 --> 00:18:33.079 actors and having meetings and uh, you know from I think that it was 257 00:18:33.160 --> 00:18:38.839 like during one year and and then a couple of months later just having conversations 258 00:18:38.920 --> 00:18:44.599 the cast and we have like a amazing cast. Directors were ready like in 259 00:18:44.680 --> 00:18:48.240 the beginning of the process of us kid gallery and uh and and and and 260 00:18:48.519 --> 00:18:57.079 and just uh and just oh my god, I we have to readit which 261 00:18:57.119 --> 00:19:06.680 went what part our our cat cast? Directors? Yeah, directors, and 262 00:19:06.759 --> 00:19:11.279 we just like we just we just started just staying all this could to everyone, 263 00:19:11.680 --> 00:19:18.079 and and and then the actors were so you know, uh receptive to 264 00:19:18.440 --> 00:19:23.400 the script. And and from that we just you know, uh when when 265 00:19:23.440 --> 00:19:26.519 people say that, yeah, once you know, play this this role and 266 00:19:26.599 --> 00:19:30.319 everything, we we we just like went back to the arrestlers and the like, 267 00:19:30.359 --> 00:19:33.599 yeah, we just go out you know, oh yes, yeah. 268 00:19:33.599 --> 00:19:37.039 I mean after that cast I would invest to. I mean, it was 269 00:19:37.079 --> 00:19:38.240 a heck of a cast that you got put together there. I mean, 270 00:19:40.000 --> 00:19:41.880 it's an actor's dream. This, this script is an actor's dream. All 271 00:19:41.920 --> 00:19:48.799 the parts, even the small parts, have so much meat in them that 272 00:19:48.680 --> 00:19:53.240 most actors would love to play that part. And then and I forgot his 273 00:19:53.400 --> 00:20:00.119 name, but the will who plays the lead. We'll be right back for 274 00:20:00.160 --> 00:20:10.319 a word from our sponsor. And now back to the show us. Yes, 275 00:20:10.519 --> 00:20:14.359 he's he's gonna get He better get a nomination for Best Actor. I 276 00:20:14.440 --> 00:20:18.759 mean he he was a tour de force performance. I was just I was, 277 00:20:19.319 --> 00:20:25.279 I was enchanted, enthralled with him. He just he has such a 278 00:20:25.359 --> 00:20:30.400 presence. Generally he's a very large man. From Black Panther and from US 279 00:20:30.480 --> 00:20:34.400 he's a very large man. But his presence because he wasn't I mean, 280 00:20:34.480 --> 00:20:37.079 he was a little bit there was. There were moments where he showed his 281 00:20:37.119 --> 00:20:41.880 physicality in the movie, but he was normally just very quiet, very gentle, 282 00:20:42.039 --> 00:20:47.319 and he still just had such presence. And when you start mixing in 283 00:20:47.400 --> 00:20:49.920 all these other actors, I mean, what was it like for you as 284 00:20:49.960 --> 00:20:52.839 a first time filmmaker, for that first time filmmaker, the first time feature 285 00:20:52.880 --> 00:20:57.000 filmmaker, to have a cast like this. What did you feel like going 286 00:20:57.119 --> 00:21:00.920 on the set for the first day or the table read the first day, 287 00:21:02.000 --> 00:21:04.160 Like what are the nerves? What are like? How did you approach this 288 00:21:04.359 --> 00:21:07.880 process? Yeah? No, it was amazing. Just not not remember then, 289 00:21:08.079 --> 00:21:11.799 just yeah, both both guests rects with Jessica Kelly and Kid Gallery. 290 00:21:15.720 --> 00:21:18.519 They did an amazing job. They did an amazing ever did yeah, they 291 00:21:18.519 --> 00:21:22.400 did it ready job. So yeah, it was it was. It was 292 00:21:22.400 --> 00:21:26.279 an amazing process. Just like you know, she's stayed one we we're just 293 00:21:26.359 --> 00:21:30.279 talking to It was fair surreal because it was my first teacher and just having 294 00:21:30.359 --> 00:21:34.799 this you know, uh a miss actors with you and and I remember like 295 00:21:34.920 --> 00:21:40.240 being having all those you know, actors and the table read and like they 296 00:21:40.400 --> 00:21:42.720 just reading their lines and adding like so much, you know, to to 297 00:21:44.039 --> 00:21:47.880 to the work. They put in the page. And it was interesting because 298 00:21:47.960 --> 00:21:52.799 I think the beginning there's so much like a collaborative process, and for me 299 00:21:52.960 --> 00:21:56.720 it was like, okay, I wrote those those lines and those stages. 300 00:21:56.079 --> 00:22:00.720 But it was interesting that every oh, you know, person in the team, 301 00:22:00.839 --> 00:22:06.119 they just like brought like different you know interpretations for who who the characters 302 00:22:06.160 --> 00:22:10.319 were, you know. And even for example, Wisdom, he didn't want 303 00:22:10.359 --> 00:22:14.480 to play the character was with the depressive guy, you know, like who 304 00:22:14.640 --> 00:22:18.319 is always like one saying no, and so he was always trying to find, 305 00:22:18.400 --> 00:22:22.880 you know, what's what's the what's the happiness behind well, what's what's 306 00:22:22.960 --> 00:22:26.319 what's going on in and not in a way that he's just like this one 307 00:22:26.440 --> 00:22:29.880 old person, but just try and find more of his humanity. And and 308 00:22:30.079 --> 00:22:34.039 like some other characters, like the souls, had like deep discussions in a 309 00:22:34.079 --> 00:22:38.799 way like how so how they're gonna you know, interact with how they're gonna 310 00:22:40.079 --> 00:22:45.039 and they're gonna like interact with the world surrounding them. And then because since 311 00:22:45.039 --> 00:22:48.000 they're all souls, one couldn't just like you know, look at water and 312 00:22:48.039 --> 00:22:49.720 say like, oh my god, this is water I never tasted before. 313 00:22:51.079 --> 00:22:52.839 And the other ones just be like bless a bold water. It's like, 314 00:22:52.920 --> 00:22:56.640 oh, cool water. But they they would need you with some kind of 315 00:22:56.759 --> 00:23:02.720 you know saying uh, you know thing kind of energy towards things around it. 316 00:23:02.799 --> 00:23:06.759 So we have like deep discussions about how would they you know, act, 317 00:23:07.359 --> 00:23:11.000 and everyone had like reading great ideas in a way because it was pretty 318 00:23:11.039 --> 00:23:15.240 much like experimental work if you think of it. People who don't have any 319 00:23:15.240 --> 00:23:18.599 even backgrounds or beast and when we have just find what, you know, 320 00:23:19.079 --> 00:23:23.599 how they would react to the world else, you know, outside What was 321 00:23:23.680 --> 00:23:27.400 the hardest day on set for you where you were just like, oh my, 322 00:23:27.519 --> 00:23:30.799 because we all have it like we're on set, there's that day, 323 00:23:30.839 --> 00:23:33.279 there's that something that happens. We're just like, how are we going to 324 00:23:33.319 --> 00:23:37.480 make it through this? There's always something, So what was the hard day 325 00:23:37.559 --> 00:23:41.160 for you? I think was we hadn't we didn't have a lot of days 326 00:23:41.240 --> 00:23:48.240 to shoot, so it was like we had twenty three days to shoot everything 327 00:23:48.559 --> 00:23:53.319 like the pace photography and I remember especially like the less Wishes, the bicycle 328 00:23:53.400 --> 00:23:57.359 and all stuff so beautiful. It doesn't it's just one page in script or 329 00:23:57.440 --> 00:24:03.720 have bit, but kind of they take like that a day. But we 330 00:24:03.119 --> 00:24:07.759 we we we didn't have a lot of days. So I remember we we 331 00:24:07.960 --> 00:24:11.880 just shot like the bicycle, you know, the beach thing. Everyone said, 332 00:24:11.960 --> 00:24:14.880 yoh, this is great. It's amazing that the bicycle as well. 333 00:24:15.000 --> 00:24:19.039 But and then I had this conversation when the producers uh as like producers and 334 00:24:19.319 --> 00:24:22.480 was you know, doing all the gadeling, saying we're not going to finish 335 00:24:22.559 --> 00:24:27.599 this, you know, and we're behind, We're behind, we can't make 336 00:24:27.640 --> 00:24:32.599 it happen. And it was interesting because we wouldn't because later we got some 337 00:24:32.720 --> 00:24:36.000 more Dave, but it was kind of tough to just like we were we 338 00:24:36.079 --> 00:24:40.359 were filming something that really felt really special, but we kind of and I 339 00:24:40.400 --> 00:24:42.519 got it, we can't we can't make it, you know. And uh 340 00:24:42.640 --> 00:24:48.640 and it was a day that everything kind of went really uh didn't go right, 341 00:24:48.759 --> 00:24:51.240 you know, and the projection and all stuff. It was just like 342 00:24:51.359 --> 00:24:56.039 a different, very difficult, you know, thing to handle. So it 343 00:24:56.160 --> 00:24:59.799 was kind of a I always had this feeling like, oh, we're doing 344 00:24:59.839 --> 00:25:02.559 some thing special here, but I'm not going to be able to finish. 345 00:25:03.119 --> 00:25:07.000 Oh yeah, and that day was the representation of that fear. Yeah listen, 346 00:25:07.079 --> 00:25:10.559 I mean, I mean, I'm sure Francis for Gopola felt the same 347 00:25:10.599 --> 00:25:15.640 way through Apocalypse. Now, Uh, I mean, I mean that's I 348 00:25:15.720 --> 00:25:18.680 mean, look two and a half years in the jungle. I mean, 349 00:25:18.039 --> 00:25:22.759 but we all always I think, I don't I don't know that. It 350 00:25:22.880 --> 00:25:26.039 doesn't matter what what level you are as and as a filmmaker, there are 351 00:25:26.119 --> 00:25:29.400 those days that you want to have your vision put up there, but the 352 00:25:29.559 --> 00:25:36.160 realities of filmmaking it's not easy. And when I saw those scenes with the 353 00:25:36.200 --> 00:25:38.799 second you said, well, the scenes with with the wishes, I was 354 00:25:38.839 --> 00:25:41.759 like, oh, yeah, I looked at those scenes and like, those 355 00:25:41.799 --> 00:25:44.880 don't look easy to shoot. There's a lot of stuff going on, the 356 00:25:45.039 --> 00:25:48.440 projection, the light, the water. There was a yeah, it didn't 357 00:25:48.440 --> 00:25:51.519 seem easy, but yeah, that was Those are so beautifully shot too. 358 00:25:51.640 --> 00:25:56.519 Oh and the music, the music, the music was wonderful. How did 359 00:25:56.559 --> 00:26:03.480 you how did you find the sound for this film? Yeah? Always being 360 00:26:03.559 --> 00:26:07.119 like a huge fan of Antonio Antonio Pinto. I don't know if you're familiar 361 00:26:07.160 --> 00:26:11.640 with his work, but he you work on the Central Station, Seat of 362 00:26:11.720 --> 00:26:15.799 God. He working all those you know, amazing prosil and you know and 363 00:26:15.000 --> 00:26:19.759 movies and and I remember his friend of you know, he was working with 364 00:26:19.839 --> 00:26:23.359 a friend of mine and then got introduced to him and it was amazing. 365 00:26:23.400 --> 00:26:27.480 Antonio is pretty much like the representation of genius. You know, he's very 366 00:26:27.559 --> 00:26:32.960 cool guy. We just feels like he's just you know, concerned about the 367 00:26:33.200 --> 00:26:34.880 of the year and just all of a sudden, you just come with something 368 00:26:34.960 --> 00:26:38.039 that you know, it's amazing. It was working with them during a pre 369 00:26:38.160 --> 00:26:45.720 production and most of the songs decomposed before we started photography because he needing the 370 00:26:45.839 --> 00:26:51.119 songs before we shooting the girl playing the violin, which thought like before I 371 00:26:51.160 --> 00:26:53.559 started past photography, and it was and first it was just like, yeah, 372 00:26:53.640 --> 00:26:56.480 let's just camp something like stamp, you know, you compose and then 373 00:26:56.559 --> 00:27:00.680 later you just composed something you know, worl elaborate for the rest of the 374 00:27:00.759 --> 00:27:04.000 movie. But the solos were so good that they were just kept kept those 375 00:27:04.079 --> 00:27:08.720 songs and started just composing, you know, songs based on that that that 376 00:27:08.880 --> 00:27:12.759 main song. It was just like you know, having skype meanings like the 377 00:27:12.920 --> 00:27:15.720 same way we're having out. It was just like, yeah, let me 378 00:27:15.960 --> 00:27:18.759 play something to you, you know, and it was just like getting your 379 00:27:19.359 --> 00:27:22.480 his instrument or something and just like yeah, and then he say said, 380 00:27:22.559 --> 00:27:25.880 yeah, I don't know about that it would just like play something else and 381 00:27:25.880 --> 00:27:27.680 it was just like, oh, yeah, that's exactly. So it was. 382 00:27:27.799 --> 00:27:33.960 It was just like an amazing work and verse. No, I love 383 00:27:33.079 --> 00:27:37.319 the aesthetic of what you did with the film, the production design, with 384 00:27:37.440 --> 00:27:42.920 the vintage everything being vintage, which was such a lovely touch. It wasn't 385 00:27:42.960 --> 00:27:48.559 super sci fi or or anything like that. It was all vintage and all 386 00:27:48.640 --> 00:27:55.279 those vintage TVs representing souls lives. But I have to ask you, how 387 00:27:55.319 --> 00:27:59.039 the hell did you shoot all of all that footage for all the souls that 388 00:27:59.079 --> 00:28:03.480 are constantly like how did you shoot? Was that during production or was that 389 00:28:03.960 --> 00:28:08.160 after production? Production? Yeah, pre production almost everything was kind of name 390 00:28:08.200 --> 00:28:11.759 here because it was I was planning, you know, all the the shoot 391 00:28:11.960 --> 00:28:17.279 and all the stuff and doing everything prep and then later the day it would 392 00:28:17.359 --> 00:28:21.359 just like the picture locking, you know, the the stuff, and we 393 00:28:21.440 --> 00:28:25.440 would shoot like during nine days, like the main thing that would go on 394 00:28:25.480 --> 00:28:29.880 to TVs. And then after that we were just like started like the heavy 395 00:28:29.960 --> 00:28:33.839 pro production for print photography, but it would still be adding picture locking the 396 00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:38.279 stuff that would go on the TV during like Prince photography. So it was 397 00:28:38.400 --> 00:28:41.839 it was crazy, and we shot in Utah most of the stuff. But 398 00:28:41.920 --> 00:28:48.000 also we just firm them out, like like shining in Brazil in La So 399 00:28:48.960 --> 00:28:52.960 most of the stuff that you saw, they were all yeah, it was 400 00:28:53.000 --> 00:28:57.640 all practical onset too. Most of them were practical on set. But then 401 00:28:57.759 --> 00:29:02.680 there's some you know, Taylor, some TVs were not like the hero TVs. 402 00:29:02.720 --> 00:29:07.640 It's called that. They then they were like, uh, comped great, 403 00:29:07.000 --> 00:29:11.599 yeah they were comped in afterwards. No, it was it was beautiful. 404 00:29:11.680 --> 00:29:15.400 I just loved the analog aspect of everything that Will was riding constantly in 405 00:29:15.440 --> 00:29:18.400 the filing cabinet and all that stuff. It was what made by the way, 406 00:29:18.480 --> 00:29:21.519 what made you come up with that idea of vintage as opposed to the 407 00:29:22.000 --> 00:29:26.240 Because something like this you could easily have gone sci fi much more sci fi 408 00:29:26.599 --> 00:29:33.079 esque. So what made you do the whole vintage vibe? I think that 409 00:29:33.279 --> 00:29:37.720 there's so much about the word and the ceiling that I want people to have 410 00:29:37.960 --> 00:29:41.839 is it was more so much connected to, you know, the nostalgic feeling 411 00:29:42.319 --> 00:29:48.400 past, and then it's it's hard for me like what represents my past and 412 00:29:48.440 --> 00:29:52.400 where presents like my you know, my you know, we'll be right back 413 00:29:52.559 --> 00:30:02.160 after a word from our sponsor. And now back to the show, uh 414 00:30:02.960 --> 00:30:06.160 years ago, it would be like the eighties. You know, there was 415 00:30:06.559 --> 00:30:11.279 one white child that happened happened, So I knew that would need something like 416 00:30:11.359 --> 00:30:14.400 that, and I knew it wouldn't have to be like technological like you know 417 00:30:14.640 --> 00:30:17.440 X marchin or you know, So that's one way. It would be nice 418 00:30:17.480 --> 00:30:21.160 to have like this kind of very and then this texture of like wood in 419 00:30:21.240 --> 00:30:25.519 this structure of like glass and not like you know, iPads or iPods or 420 00:30:25.559 --> 00:30:27.079 anything like that. And then it created this kind of cost of that. 421 00:30:27.160 --> 00:30:32.319 I imagine that Will got in prisoned during the time period when he died, 422 00:30:32.799 --> 00:30:37.920 so like he wouldn't see anything in this house as kind of a goal that 423 00:30:37.279 --> 00:30:41.039 comes after, so he wouldn't be leading in this eighties. You know, 424 00:30:41.079 --> 00:30:47.480 a lot of time period for the recipe in existence. It's like stuck into 425 00:30:47.519 --> 00:30:52.440 it. Will Will Will ever become alive again? I don't know, I 426 00:30:52.799 --> 00:30:59.119 don't Yeah, I wish you know that's the sequel. There'll be ten days 427 00:31:03.559 --> 00:31:07.680 now. So okay, so you've you've made this beautiful film. Yeah, 428 00:31:07.519 --> 00:31:11.640 you you put it all together, have great cast grapes, and then you 429 00:31:11.720 --> 00:31:17.319 send it out to the festivals and you get the phone call that every filmmaker, 430 00:31:17.359 --> 00:31:21.359 independent filmmaker wants to get, which is the call from Sundance. What 431 00:31:21.640 --> 00:31:25.160 was that phone call like for you? It was amazing, you know, 432 00:31:25.559 --> 00:31:33.680 and it was such a we're we're so working such a time, very short, 433 00:31:33.839 --> 00:31:37.759 you know, amount of time with schedule because we we shot in September. 434 00:31:38.400 --> 00:31:42.799 We finished shooting September, and we just had to edit and finish everything 435 00:31:42.839 --> 00:31:48.480 like a cut to sentence to get into the you know, to screen in 436 00:31:48.519 --> 00:31:52.759 the festival like January. So it was like very very rush. And remember 437 00:31:52.920 --> 00:31:56.920 there's so much in terms of pressure and stuff. Yeah it comes from the 438 00:31:56.039 --> 00:32:00.319 last but it's not you know, not that some films you know, from 439 00:32:00.319 --> 00:32:05.400 the laps day screen Sundance best way. And I remember it was just so 440 00:32:05.839 --> 00:32:07.920 stressed, like how I M I knna make it or not. It was 441 00:32:08.000 --> 00:32:13.559 just in the gym. And that you know, someone who actually was someone 442 00:32:13.599 --> 00:32:15.720 who went to USC with me, who called me to give me the good 443 00:32:15.759 --> 00:32:21.839 news and yeah, yeah she she started working a sundance and stuff. And 444 00:32:21.880 --> 00:32:24.480 it was even job when I started working sundances, like yeah, maybe one 445 00:32:24.559 --> 00:32:29.759 day you just gonna give me a call or that my film was accept or 446 00:32:29.920 --> 00:32:32.400 do the Q and A and everything just let me know and give me the 447 00:32:32.480 --> 00:32:36.079 call, and it just like started Yela and screaming. It is like, 448 00:32:36.160 --> 00:32:38.680 God, don't believe it. And it's interesting because during the festival she was 449 00:32:38.799 --> 00:32:45.720 one of the uh the the organizers who didn't like K and A, which 450 00:32:45.799 --> 00:32:49.759 was very cool. So it was almost like yeah, so it was very 451 00:32:50.200 --> 00:32:53.160 very very very special. Man. It was it was just like my connection 452 00:32:53.279 --> 00:33:00.720 with Sundance our uh it was my dream you know, uh becoming Alumli and 453 00:33:01.039 --> 00:33:05.480 then a dream going to the Fast Winding and and now we you know, 454 00:33:05.599 --> 00:33:07.680 they're they're always so supportive, they love the movie, you know, and 455 00:33:08.799 --> 00:33:13.200 I really still like they're they're kind of my family. So it was it 456 00:33:13.319 --> 00:33:20.039 was great just to there like this very you know, day face and just 457 00:33:20.160 --> 00:33:23.799 being screening with other people some very where and where did did you screen at 458 00:33:23.799 --> 00:33:30.480 the Echoes? Screened at the Echoes? What was what was that? It 459 00:33:30.720 --> 00:33:35.440 was? It was terrible, like it was I just couldn't, you know, 460 00:33:35.599 --> 00:33:40.920 my stomach not doing well and there was none of my actors watched the 461 00:33:42.000 --> 00:33:45.240 movie before the screen so and everyone want to stole pump. There is so 462 00:33:45.400 --> 00:33:47.880 much hype and people all, this is gonna be great. It's gonna be 463 00:33:50.039 --> 00:33:53.920 I don't know, and no one watched it, so we didn't know what 464 00:33:54.000 --> 00:33:58.200 would be the reaction is such a different movie, right, so we don't 465 00:33:58.240 --> 00:34:01.319 know. And it was interesting. I remember remember going to the basketball and 466 00:34:02.119 --> 00:34:06.759 super nervous, and and then I met Tony Hill there and just said, 467 00:34:06.839 --> 00:34:12.119 yeah, don't don't don't let don't let what happens you know out there they 468 00:34:12.280 --> 00:34:15.519 find who you are, you know, and that that was very nice. 469 00:34:15.599 --> 00:34:17.039 You know, that was something that I think got care for the rest of 470 00:34:17.480 --> 00:34:22.159 my career. It's like you he was, yeah, because short him like 471 00:34:22.239 --> 00:34:25.039 we did something special, We did something that was and what they say is 472 00:34:25.119 --> 00:34:30.079 just like you know, can control whatever and just go there and and but 473 00:34:30.239 --> 00:34:35.280 luckily you know that people we had like an standing ovation for like at all 474 00:34:35.320 --> 00:34:38.159 how many minutes people are just crying. People just came to talk to us, 475 00:34:38.280 --> 00:34:42.960 and and it was it was it was very special. I'm not going 476 00:34:43.039 --> 00:34:45.639 to give the ending away, but I teared up. I teared up when 477 00:34:45.679 --> 00:34:49.320 I watched it. I was just like because I didn't see it coming. 478 00:34:50.000 --> 00:34:55.119 I didn't see it coming until maybe until probably probably about four or five minutes 479 00:34:55.119 --> 00:34:58.480 before it happened, was like, wait a minute, could that? I'm 480 00:34:58.519 --> 00:35:00.360 like, oh my god, that's still then, So I didn't catch it 481 00:35:00.440 --> 00:35:05.039 right away. So that's always something fun because I've seen so many movies in 482 00:35:05.119 --> 00:35:08.199 my life. It's hard to get one past the goalie in many ways with 483 00:35:08.320 --> 00:35:12.360 plots, and that was a really nice touch. But oh yeah, I 484 00:35:12.599 --> 00:35:15.800 definitely tear it up after I watched it. It was it was great. 485 00:35:15.239 --> 00:35:19.840 The one thing I love about the whole story and the concept is that we 486 00:35:20.000 --> 00:35:25.159 as human beings are always defining our happiness by the goals that we set, 487 00:35:25.239 --> 00:35:28.280 Like, you know, we're going to get married. I'll be happy when 488 00:35:28.280 --> 00:35:30.320 I'm married. I'll be happy when I get that job. I'll be happy 489 00:35:30.320 --> 00:35:35.599 when I get the sun dance, I'll be happy when I and and your 490 00:35:35.679 --> 00:35:39.880 story is like, well, the goal is just to get here, which 491 00:35:39.960 --> 00:35:45.519 is which is an interesting way of looking at it because so many of us 492 00:35:45.559 --> 00:35:52.079 are born into this world and we think that another in anyways, your film 493 00:35:52.119 --> 00:35:54.559 says you won, You're here, Now what are you going to do with 494 00:35:54.639 --> 00:35:59.880 it? Is the question? Yeah, yeah, no, ndred percent isn't 495 00:35:59.880 --> 00:36:04.760 you see? Because it comes from the you know, the genesis of this 496 00:36:04.960 --> 00:36:07.800 work or less coming from like going through like some hard times and and and 497 00:36:07.920 --> 00:36:12.880 and feeling like it you know this this I'm kind of hating what I'm going 498 00:36:12.960 --> 00:36:16.599 through. But what if? What if this is something just by being here, 499 00:36:16.800 --> 00:36:20.920 something that's a privilege, you know, And then it'd be so much 500 00:36:20.920 --> 00:36:25.840 about like the uh trying to aim at some goals and say like when when 501 00:36:25.920 --> 00:36:29.320 this happens, I will you know? And for really it was the same 502 00:36:29.360 --> 00:36:32.679 because I remember being advertising and working advertising was just like when I when I 503 00:36:32.719 --> 00:36:37.679 win the Gold Liar, I will, you know? And I remember like 504 00:36:37.079 --> 00:36:43.519 exactly the feeling of winning it and then remember like being on the stage and 505 00:36:43.639 --> 00:36:46.679 saying yeah great and people like, oh congratulations, and when it stept out 506 00:36:47.360 --> 00:36:52.360 and just when I when I went back home, I just felt like what 507 00:36:52.519 --> 00:36:57.159 does it means? Meaning thing or something? And it wasn't And I think 508 00:36:57.199 --> 00:37:00.039 it was one of the moments that I felt like, yeah, maybe I 509 00:37:00.079 --> 00:37:02.719 shouldn't do something else, which was interesting. Yeah, there's so many times 510 00:37:02.760 --> 00:37:07.960 that we put so much emphasis on a goal, and when you get that 511 00:37:07.079 --> 00:37:12.880 goal, there's depression afterwards because you've worked all your life. So people like 512 00:37:12.920 --> 00:37:15.679 I want the Oscar, I want the Oscar, And I've spoken to people 513 00:37:15.719 --> 00:37:17.079 who won the Oscar who's just like, after the Oscar, I'm like, 514 00:37:17.719 --> 00:37:21.320 I was depressed, like where do you? Where do you when you get 515 00:37:21.360 --> 00:37:23.360 to the top of the mountain? Where do you go? Because if your 516 00:37:23.440 --> 00:37:27.480 goal of life is to get to the top of the mountain, but the 517 00:37:27.559 --> 00:37:30.400 goal of life should be enjoying the ride up to the top of the mountain 518 00:37:30.719 --> 00:37:34.000 and also walking back down and going back up to another mountain and all that 519 00:37:34.079 --> 00:37:37.039 kind of stuff. So that's a that's a really yeah, And I'm glad 520 00:37:37.079 --> 00:37:39.639 that you had that experience because if I just had the goal in line, 521 00:37:39.719 --> 00:37:43.039 look, I got it. Hell, what do I do? What do 522 00:37:43.119 --> 00:37:46.840 I do now? I'm not eighty five, so my life is not over 523 00:37:47.000 --> 00:37:51.079 yet. What do I do now? And it's crazy they didn't have to 524 00:37:51.239 --> 00:37:53.519 sell this, you know. I went back to Brazil and it'saw like what 525 00:37:53.679 --> 00:37:57.800 do I do now? Because it was pretty much like, this is my 526 00:37:58.480 --> 00:38:00.519 I want to make my first feature. Then I made my first feature, 527 00:38:01.079 --> 00:38:05.320 you know, and now then we'll go to theaters and all this stuff. 528 00:38:05.320 --> 00:38:08.360 And then I say, yeah, and what's what's the what's the point now? 529 00:38:08.440 --> 00:38:12.000 What's theirs? So what's the next? Yeah, what's next when you 530 00:38:12.119 --> 00:38:15.159 when you put all the energy in in like goals, because then if they 531 00:38:15.599 --> 00:38:19.480 you know, happen or don't happen, it's just like so much about about 532 00:38:19.519 --> 00:38:23.320 it. If it's very interesting that you brought up about the maybe we read 533 00:38:23.360 --> 00:38:29.280 achieved the goal, right exactly. We're just so caught up in in this 534 00:38:29.599 --> 00:38:32.320 physical reality that we don't understand that we're like, it's a pleasure, it's 535 00:38:32.320 --> 00:38:37.639 an honor just to be here. It's kind of like, I'm honored just 536 00:38:37.679 --> 00:38:44.199 to be nominated. I mean, it's it's nice to win, but I'm 537 00:38:44.239 --> 00:38:47.599 honored just to be nominated, you know. So no one says that like 538 00:38:47.760 --> 00:38:52.840 I'm not I'm not to be alive, Yeah, exactly, but most people. 539 00:38:52.840 --> 00:38:58.599 But the thing is that right now as we're speaking, certain there's there's 540 00:38:58.880 --> 00:39:04.159 people right now as we speaking leaving this earth, and as we're speaking, 541 00:39:04.440 --> 00:39:07.239 new souls are coming in. So I promise you that people who are leaving 542 00:39:07.599 --> 00:39:13.000 many wish that they continue to have the honor of living. So it should 543 00:39:13.000 --> 00:39:15.800 be something that people, you know, hopefully take away from this film that 544 00:39:15.920 --> 00:39:24.800 this isn't it really is an honor just to be nominated until it's time and 545 00:39:25.079 --> 00:39:30.880 until the security escorts you out. Now you know you've ridden this amazing movie 546 00:39:31.480 --> 00:39:37.199 about the soul's journey. Why do you think we are here? As you 547 00:39:37.280 --> 00:39:40.320 know? Why do you I'd love to hear your thoughts on this, because 548 00:39:40.480 --> 00:39:44.119 after this movie, I would love to hear what you think. I have 549 00:39:44.440 --> 00:39:52.559 no idea, you know, it's just yeah, it's interesting. I don't 550 00:39:52.599 --> 00:39:58.440 know. Sometimes I sometimes I know, I'm pretty sure you know right as 551 00:39:58.480 --> 00:40:02.239 a meaning you know, we'll be right back after a word from our sponsor 552 00:40:06.880 --> 00:40:12.719 and now back to the show, because I'm pretty much like a half of 553 00:40:12.880 --> 00:40:15.559 we and Emma. You know, at some moments, I feel like, 554 00:40:15.679 --> 00:40:17.039 yeah, some moments, I just feel like, yeah, this doesn't make 555 00:40:17.039 --> 00:40:22.800 any sense, and I think it's just for me. It's just like this, 556 00:40:23.119 --> 00:40:25.039 and I think it's gonna be for the rest of my life. Like 557 00:40:25.119 --> 00:40:30.360 there's many or that meaning, there's many or that meaning there's some purpose or 558 00:40:30.440 --> 00:40:34.960 not purpose. So it's hard for me. Just it's interesting because people come 559 00:40:35.039 --> 00:40:37.559 to me and say, like, oh, you wrote that movie about you 560 00:40:37.639 --> 00:40:40.280 know, enjoying the war and stuff, and then there's this day. It 561 00:40:40.360 --> 00:40:44.440 was just someone was telling me like, oh, lot, how the sunset 562 00:40:44.559 --> 00:40:47.840 is amazing. That's not right. It's it's not and it's not the it's 563 00:40:47.880 --> 00:40:57.119 not the Avengers about it, not joking. Yeah, but it's interesting because 564 00:40:57.480 --> 00:40:59.840 so there's some moments that I feel like, yeah, there's there's that, 565 00:41:00.119 --> 00:41:04.719 there is pressure, that's kind of energy, and there is like many and 566 00:41:04.880 --> 00:41:07.360 that, and there there's some some always that just feel very you know, 567 00:41:07.800 --> 00:41:13.760 sitting you know, both things things, but that but that is that's the 568 00:41:13.840 --> 00:41:15.320 upside, that's the up and debt. But but isn't that the up and 569 00:41:15.400 --> 00:41:19.639 down of life? Though? I Mean there's days that you like, you're 570 00:41:19.679 --> 00:41:22.559 on top of the world, and other days you're like, oh god, 571 00:41:22.599 --> 00:41:24.760 I forgot to pay that bill now my car got repossessed or something, and 572 00:41:24.880 --> 00:41:30.280 you're just like and the thing you do is that you're being very optimistic because 573 00:41:30.320 --> 00:41:36.480 usually really worth Oh I'm being very kind. Yeah yeah, it could be 574 00:41:36.719 --> 00:41:38.320 yeah, it could be like a million different things that could happen. It 575 00:41:38.599 --> 00:41:43.599 is, but that is this crazy thing that we call life. Now, 576 00:41:43.639 --> 00:41:45.480 I'd love to have I'd love to ask this one question of you. What 577 00:41:45.599 --> 00:41:51.639 do you think your soul's purposes on this on this journey, what you think 578 00:41:51.719 --> 00:41:54.559 you're here to do for you know, for your not only for yourself, 579 00:41:54.559 --> 00:41:58.400 but for other people, because this film is for other people, no question 580 00:41:58.440 --> 00:42:01.639 about it, not only just for yourself. I think. I remember, 581 00:42:02.719 --> 00:42:09.079 but there's a moment in my life I felt like very you know, lonely 582 00:42:09.199 --> 00:42:15.760 in a way that it was like I think there's no isolating in a way 583 00:42:15.840 --> 00:42:20.760 that I was. I felt like it was all by myself, you know, 584 00:42:20.960 --> 00:42:24.599 there's no one would and it felt terrible. It was in a way 585 00:42:24.679 --> 00:42:29.519 that I felt like this, it's so disconnected from everyone and everything, you 586 00:42:29.599 --> 00:42:36.400 know. And I remember I came up with this and there's a writing I 587 00:42:36.480 --> 00:42:42.159 started thing and it was interesting because especially after writing nine days, I put 588 00:42:42.159 --> 00:42:46.079 a lot of those feelings on the page and how isolated felt, how desperate 589 00:42:46.119 --> 00:42:52.719 it felt, how you know, out of hope I felt. And then 590 00:42:52.880 --> 00:42:57.440 now people who felt the same coming to me and telling like, oh, 591 00:42:57.639 --> 00:43:00.840 I felt the same way. You know, Oh, is this is something 592 00:43:00.920 --> 00:43:05.480 that I also win true, you know, and and and and somehow it's 593 00:43:05.639 --> 00:43:10.760 like so powerful, like I I by showing that, you know, it 594 00:43:10.880 --> 00:43:16.079 felt that way, it can make people not feel alone, you know, 595 00:43:16.760 --> 00:43:21.280 because it kind of shared the same feeling. So it was it was interesting 596 00:43:21.400 --> 00:43:24.199 that I think if I can do anything, you know, look that your 597 00:43:25.239 --> 00:43:31.239 is so much about uh putting it out and uh and letting people like me 598 00:43:31.480 --> 00:43:36.360 know that they're not alone, and and that way, I'm also going to 599 00:43:36.440 --> 00:43:38.519 figure figure out that I'm not alone tohoot. So I think that's that's something 600 00:43:38.599 --> 00:43:44.199 that that there wants to do. That's that's a great, great answer, 601 00:43:44.360 --> 00:43:49.760 because there's so many souls or people in this world to feel alone, whether 602 00:43:49.840 --> 00:43:52.880 it be in their professional lives and their personal lives. And I think that's 603 00:43:52.920 --> 00:43:57.960 what that's the magic of movies when you watch a character going through something and 604 00:43:58.079 --> 00:44:01.440 you go, oh, I'm out alone. And that's the brilliance of what 605 00:44:01.639 --> 00:44:07.039 we do as filmmakers. And I think you definitely nailed it with nine Days, 606 00:44:07.119 --> 00:44:08.760 my friend. That would I ask you. I appreciate it, And 607 00:44:08.800 --> 00:44:12.440 I'm gonna ask you a few questions. Ask all my guests, what advice 608 00:44:12.480 --> 00:44:16.719 would you give a filmmaker trying to break into the business today. Don't try 609 00:44:16.800 --> 00:44:21.320 to break into business, I think, just don't think of danger. I 610 00:44:21.360 --> 00:44:25.679 think the same thing that we were we're discussing here about the goal and trying 611 00:44:25.800 --> 00:44:30.000 just that. I think it would just tell the story you want to tell 612 00:44:30.440 --> 00:44:36.320 in something that's not there, you want to see me and then things will 613 00:44:36.320 --> 00:44:38.039 happen in the consequence, you know. And just you know, keep keep 614 00:44:38.119 --> 00:44:44.119 doing stuff and and and also don't put your your you know, hopes and 615 00:44:44.360 --> 00:44:47.599 other people. So maybe if you write something it's very personally, just writ 616 00:44:47.679 --> 00:44:52.000 in a way that you can do yourself, so you don't don't let your 617 00:44:52.079 --> 00:44:54.360 dreams in the hands with other people. Just okay, so you know one 618 00:44:54.400 --> 00:45:00.360 does it? Just do my things right. And so so writing writing a 619 00:45:00.400 --> 00:45:02.639 script that could be done for one hundred thousand dollars or could be done for 620 00:45:02.719 --> 00:45:07.719 ten million, Yeah, that's the idea, because if you'll be waiting for 621 00:45:07.800 --> 00:45:09.400 ten years for that ten million if it doesn't work. Yeah, And it 622 00:45:09.559 --> 00:45:14.159 just name dropping that there actually was an advice that a Quinting trying tune give 623 00:45:14.239 --> 00:45:16.599 to me. I mention him because they won a competition like a wileble. 624 00:45:16.679 --> 00:45:21.679 It was before coming to West twenty twelve. I did like a short and 625 00:45:21.719 --> 00:45:24.400 then I had changes to sit with him for like thirty minutes and then yeah, 626 00:45:24.480 --> 00:45:28.320 it was amazing. And then I asked him for advice and he said 627 00:45:28.360 --> 00:45:30.039 like, yeah, it's pretty much like it was telling me to do the 628 00:45:30.079 --> 00:45:34.840 same that he did with reserve for dogs, because he would make reserve dogs 629 00:45:34.920 --> 00:45:37.280 with like I think, forty thousand dollars. Yeah, and you could have 630 00:45:37.400 --> 00:45:40.360 it, you decrid it. Yeah. So the same way I wrote million 631 00:45:40.440 --> 00:45:44.800 days, I couldn't make nine days with like one hundred k or something, 632 00:45:44.840 --> 00:45:47.119 you know. And I think there came now is the new version of forty 633 00:45:47.159 --> 00:45:52.440 thousand dollars, but with all the inflation and stuff. But then I was 634 00:45:52.559 --> 00:45:55.360 lucky like him, you know, to find people invest. But if even 635 00:45:55.440 --> 00:45:59.559 if you know, I didn't find people choosing on invest in my dream, 636 00:46:00.079 --> 00:46:02.559 I would say, Okay, screw it up. I just gotta make them 637 00:46:02.599 --> 00:46:07.400 move anyway. So I think that was that was a great advice that I 638 00:46:07.519 --> 00:46:09.719 just passed for I'm trying to look cool, but I have to admit it's 639 00:46:09.760 --> 00:46:15.559 not It's not bad advice to pass forward from a from a little from a 640 00:46:15.599 --> 00:46:21.000 little known director like Winter. Yeah. Now, what is the lesson that 641 00:46:21.039 --> 00:46:23.480 took you the longest to learn, whether in the film industry or in life. 642 00:46:24.480 --> 00:46:30.159 Uh, it's still a lesson I haven't learned yet. I think it's 643 00:46:30.280 --> 00:46:35.840 too uh, leaving more in the moment. The same way that Emma leaves 644 00:46:35.840 --> 00:46:39.280 in the moment and just enjoy the ride in the way that you know. 645 00:46:39.760 --> 00:46:45.440 I think Nine Days the movie to remind me of that as well, because 646 00:46:45.480 --> 00:46:46.840 there's a part of me that, yes, can you can enjoy the moment, 647 00:46:46.840 --> 00:46:52.480 but there's someone so many you know, it's moments there's hard to you 648 00:46:52.559 --> 00:46:55.880 know, be past into practicing and I feel like that's the happiness is pretty 649 00:46:55.960 --> 00:46:59.559 much that, you know. I think that three is just being able to 650 00:46:59.719 --> 00:47:06.679 just they accept things as they come and and being you know, good with 651 00:47:07.199 --> 00:47:09.760 what's life's giving you, and not always they can do that. I think 652 00:47:09.760 --> 00:47:15.960 I'm getting better, but that's something that I'm still learning. I've learned. 653 00:47:16.119 --> 00:47:22.320 I've learned so where you're talking about it is almost becoming a spiritual master, 654 00:47:22.480 --> 00:47:24.960 because that's what spiritual like yogis do that like whatever comes to them, they 655 00:47:25.039 --> 00:47:30.360 just kind of like life is good and that's what we all try to get 656 00:47:30.360 --> 00:47:32.880 to. Not even nothing is good, but they just accept it. Yeah, 657 00:47:32.920 --> 00:47:37.199 there's an acceptance life sucks sometimes, but it's just like they're accepted. 658 00:47:37.480 --> 00:47:40.519 Yeah, a lot of a lot of times life sucks. I think that's 659 00:47:40.639 --> 00:47:46.360 Uh, don't use that as your marketing for the film. Sometimes life just 660 00:47:46.440 --> 00:47:52.039 sucks, but sometimes it's just amazing, and I think the combination is right 661 00:47:52.599 --> 00:47:55.639 and it's yeah, and it wouldn't be amazing if it didn't suck before. 662 00:47:55.880 --> 00:47:59.800 So it's almost like, yeah, so you need I mean, if you, 663 00:48:00.000 --> 00:48:01.599 if you, if you were, if you just kept hitting home runs 664 00:48:02.239 --> 00:48:07.519 all the time, it would be boring. And all them movies are like 665 00:48:07.599 --> 00:48:09.079 that. You know, someone is like struggling and stuff and then nets to 666 00:48:09.079 --> 00:48:12.639 see and oh cool, it's great, but you need the struggle. But 667 00:48:12.719 --> 00:48:15.159 you need the struggle you need or else it is. It's a horrible story. 668 00:48:15.320 --> 00:48:20.639 If yeah, if if if Luke knew the force at the beginning? 669 00:48:20.880 --> 00:48:24.800 What's the Boy as bad as? Yeah? Chris? And what are three 670 00:48:24.840 --> 00:48:29.599 of your favorite films of all time? Oh? My god? It was 671 00:48:29.639 --> 00:48:36.280 writing a list right now, So I have to put the Matrix on my 672 00:48:36.400 --> 00:48:40.360 top three as well, Sir. I love I love this movie. I 673 00:48:40.440 --> 00:48:45.440 love City Lights, Charlie Chopling movie. I love that movie too. He's 674 00:48:45.480 --> 00:48:49.199 so good man. The other one, I'm I want to put it like 675 00:48:49.280 --> 00:48:52.880 a yeah, I have seven s and I have a can put the earrings 676 00:48:52.920 --> 00:48:57.679 of his hore But yeah, I'm so American man. I'm putting all this 677 00:48:59.039 --> 00:49:04.360 I had to match the Future. There's nothing wrong with that. We're not 678 00:49:04.440 --> 00:49:07.199 talking about movies that influenced me as a director, but more as movies that 679 00:49:07.400 --> 00:49:12.119 you know, reflect my childhood. I think those movies are movies there. 680 00:49:12.800 --> 00:49:15.119 Yeah, I have to put it's a bit. Back to the Future is 681 00:49:15.119 --> 00:49:16.039 one of the most perfect films of all time. I know, I just 682 00:49:16.159 --> 00:49:20.239 wanted to, you know, sound a little more art. No, don't 683 00:49:20.360 --> 00:49:23.119 I know that people are like I don't know, Citizen Kane and Seventh Samurai 684 00:49:23.400 --> 00:49:28.159 really like I had a friend of who every time I would tell my movies 685 00:49:28.199 --> 00:49:30.360 and back to you for though, you would just kind of, you know, 686 00:49:30.159 --> 00:49:34.320 be a little more like snobby. He would be snobbybby. Yeah. 687 00:49:35.119 --> 00:49:37.360 And then of course I love, you know, love the Seventh Seal and 688 00:49:37.480 --> 00:49:40.480 love you know, No, I mean, look, I love Seventh Samurai, 689 00:49:40.559 --> 00:49:44.920 I love High Low and love I love a lot of Kubrick's you know 690 00:49:45.079 --> 00:49:49.920 films. But you know, but if Back to the Futures on, yeah, 691 00:49:51.000 --> 00:49:54.440 I'm watching it, you know, if the Matrix on, I'm watching 692 00:49:55.599 --> 00:50:00.960 to I think more than plenty of time, you like to second one of 693 00:50:00.960 --> 00:50:04.599 the best. When I was a kid I loved their video facts. Oh 694 00:50:04.719 --> 00:50:07.320 my god, the future of the field. Oh god, yeah, yeah, 695 00:50:07.760 --> 00:50:13.199 we can geek out. We can geek out about that. And uh 696 00:50:13.320 --> 00:50:15.519 and and when is the movie coming out? And where can people see it? 697 00:50:15.239 --> 00:50:19.840 So yeah, it's already no, actually it's out in the late in 698 00:50:19.960 --> 00:50:24.199 New York. But now it's coming out to a nationwide uh this Friday, 699 00:50:24.639 --> 00:50:29.920 this Friday, Yeah, Friday. Yeah, we'll watching. That's awesome. 700 00:50:30.159 --> 00:50:34.800 Listen. I congratulations on the film. Uh. And I wish you nothing 701 00:50:34.840 --> 00:50:37.599 but continued success on your journey, my friend, You're you're doing good work 702 00:50:37.679 --> 00:50:42.559 here. Uh and and and I really do help, I really do hope 703 00:50:42.559 --> 00:50:45.559 it. It not only entertains people, but makes people think a little bit 704 00:50:45.000 --> 00:50:52.639 about being just honored to be nominated. Yeah, why you're not even nominated? 705 00:50:52.280 --> 00:50:54.719 Well, if you're not ever nominated, then you go out and what 706 00:50:54.840 --> 00:50:57.679 happens to the souls? Happens to the souls? You know, I'm not 707 00:50:57.679 --> 00:51:00.079 gonna ruin it, but that's when. That's why is when you're not nominated. 708 00:51:00.840 --> 00:51:04.400 That's true, My friend, thank you so much for being on the 709 00:51:04.440 --> 00:51:06.480 show. I guess I'll last man. I appreciate it. I want to 710 00:51:06.480 --> 00:51:09.719 thank Edson for coming on the show and sharing his journey with us. I 711 00:51:09.880 --> 00:51:15.159 really appreciate it. I implore everybody to go out and watch Nine Days cinematically. 712 00:51:15.320 --> 00:51:20.840 It is stunning. It is beautifully shot, beautifully acted, beautifully written, 713 00:51:20.960 --> 00:51:24.039 and really does the job of what a good movie is meant to do, 714 00:51:24.280 --> 00:51:30.519 which is pull on your emotions and make you feel something. So if 715 00:51:30.559 --> 00:51:32.320 you want to get links to anything we spoke about in this episode, including 716 00:51:32.599 --> 00:51:37.480 how to watch Nine Days, head over to the show notes act Bulletproof Screenwriting 717 00:51:37.719 --> 00:51:42.280 dot TV Forward slash three seventy three. Thank you so much for listening, 718 00:51:42.360 --> 00:51:45.880 guys, As always, keep on writing no matter what. I'll talk to 719 00:51:45.920 --> 00:51:52.000 you soon. Thanks for listening to the Bulletproof Screenwriting podcast at Bulletproof Screenwriting dot tv.