1 00:00:02,319 --> 00:00:06,919 He co founded the club and co designed the golf course with Alister Mackenzie. 2 00:00:07,519 --> 00:00:12,919 His intention had always been to have just a very informal golf tournament where his 3 00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:17,320 friends that were pros could come and gather and play a little golf have a 4 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:21,440 good time. Cliff Roberts saw it a little differently. He saw this as 5 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:26,359 being able to become the event though it is now so he was the one, 6 00:00:26,440 --> 00:00:31,039 in fact that really pushed for the word Masters to be attached to it. 7 00:00:31,359 --> 00:00:35,240 Bub hated that term Masters for a couple of reasons. One was he 8 00:00:35,280 --> 00:00:38,920 thought it was extremely pretentious, and then he also thought that a tournament that 9 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:42,520 was being held to the Deep South in the nineteen thirties, Masters might not 10 00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:46,359 be the best title for it. But by nineteen sixty, when Palmer had 11 00:00:46,359 --> 00:00:51,280 won it the second time, Bub said, I think Masters might be an 12 00:00:51,280 --> 00:00:56,759 apt description now because by then everybody who was anybody had to win the Masters 13 00:00:56,799 --> 00:01:00,000 to be considered a really great player. And that's true now too. Hey 14 00:01:00,039 --> 00:01:03,879 Cray, this is Karen Healy from Nakes County to their Ireland. I'm a 15 00:01:03,920 --> 00:01:08,680 member and play a beautiful Nake golf field found in eighteen ninety six. This 16 00:01:08,879 --> 00:01:15,560 is Golf Smarter number eight eight nine, The Masters, Augustin National and the 17 00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:19,560 legacy of legendary Bobby Jones with his grandson, doctor Bob Jones the Fourth. 18 00:01:19,680 --> 00:01:26,959 This is golf Smart, sharing stories, tips and insights from great golf mines 19 00:01:26,239 --> 00:01:32,000 to help you lower your score and raise your golf IQ. Here's your host, 20 00:01:32,359 --> 00:01:36,879 Fred Green. Welcome back to the Golf Smarter Podcast. Bob. Oh, 21 00:01:36,920 --> 00:01:41,719 it's great to be with you again. Fred. It's so nice to 22 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:45,439 look forward to April because not only do we have the Masters coming up, 23 00:01:46,400 --> 00:01:51,200 but we have a conversation with Bobby Jones' grandson, doctor Bob Jones the Fourth. 24 00:01:51,519 --> 00:01:53,920 So glad to have you back. So great to talk to you again. 25 00:01:53,159 --> 00:01:56,480 Oh, it's great to be with you as well. I can't believe 26 00:01:56,560 --> 00:02:00,680 we missed. We missed a meeting at the PGA show this year, so 27 00:02:00,719 --> 00:02:05,000 I'm glad at least we get to Eyeball this way. Yeah. I'm sorry 28 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:07,480 you couldn't come. I would have loved to meet you there. It was 29 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:12,520 completely overwhelming for me. There was so much going on. It's you know, 30 00:02:12,759 --> 00:02:15,080 I think it's the kind of thing that you got to do it multiple 31 00:02:15,159 --> 00:02:20,840 years, is you get comfortable and know the people and going once it's like 32 00:02:21,240 --> 00:02:24,120 deer in the headlights. It really is. And I mean, can you 33 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:32,520 believe how big a showroom floor that actually is. I mean it's like twenty 34 00:02:32,520 --> 00:02:37,240 thousand steps a day just to go through the whole thing. Oh easy. 35 00:02:38,360 --> 00:02:43,400 I spent many years working at the NFL experience at the super Bowl, where 36 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:46,159 they take over a convention center or a parking lot of a stadium. Major 37 00:02:46,240 --> 00:02:50,840 League Baseball would take over a convention center, so I worked on those for 38 00:02:51,039 --> 00:02:54,599 years. So I'm quite familiar with a million square feet of space and what 39 00:02:54,719 --> 00:03:00,719 it can mean and to your feet, Oh, very definitely. Oh so 40 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:06,479 this is um, let's talk about Bobby Jones. I love hearing stories. 41 00:03:06,719 --> 00:03:10,120 I love hearing family stories. Right now, you're in your den, and 42 00:03:10,199 --> 00:03:15,960 I can see there's a lot of Bobby Jones's memorabilia behind you. So we're 43 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:21,319 gonna have to share this video with the audience. Oh yeah, So please 44 00:03:21,560 --> 00:03:25,240 let's take a quick tour of what you're seeing, what's behind you, because 45 00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:30,800 there's some things that look a little different than just photographs. Some of them 46 00:03:30,840 --> 00:03:34,719 are Yes, should I pick up the iPad or just leave it and just 47 00:03:34,800 --> 00:03:38,240 show you from here? Just leave it and turn around in point if you 48 00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:43,960 like, but please give a full explanation, knowing that it's a audio audience 49 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:49,800 most of the time. Sorry, they need full explanations, so audio audience. 50 00:03:49,840 --> 00:03:53,639 Okay, Well you know audience, as you can see, no the 51 00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:59,120 I've got a portrait on the very top over my right shoulder of my grandfather. 52 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:02,199 It is a rep of the famous portrait that was done by golf artist 53 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:10,159 Thomas Stevens, and later on President Eisenhower would use that portrait as the model 54 00:04:10,520 --> 00:04:14,960 for one that he did. Both this one and the Eisenhower portrait of course 55 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:18,879 a very seriously part of the Augustin at Well. The Stevens portrait is now 56 00:04:18,920 --> 00:04:24,319 at the USGA, but it was commissioned by Augusta National. Below that, 57 00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:30,040 I have a wonderful print of the eighteenth green of the wingfoot West Course in 58 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:34,600 Mamaroneck, New York, and that is significant to my grandfather from the nineteen 59 00:04:34,639 --> 00:04:42,560 twenty nine US Open. My grandfather had had a collapse of almost measurable immeasurable 60 00:04:42,560 --> 00:04:47,120 proportions and he needed to make a twelve foot put on that green and in 61 00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:51,040 order to force a playoff with al Spinosa, and he made that put. 62 00:04:51,519 --> 00:04:56,120 Had he not made that put, there are many people who think, and 63 00:04:56,240 --> 00:04:59,439 I'm one of them, that it's quite likely that he never would have even 64 00:04:59,519 --> 00:05:02,920 won the Rand Slam. Now there's something behind me that looks like a big 65 00:05:02,959 --> 00:05:08,959 egg beater. Um, it's red and white. Yeah, yeah, I'm 66 00:05:09,000 --> 00:05:13,639 like what because it doesn't. It looks like a punching bag. Actually, 67 00:05:13,720 --> 00:05:19,759 but it has the stick of a flagstick for in a hole. Yes it 68 00:05:19,800 --> 00:05:25,199 does, and that's exactly what it is. It's it's it is a replica 69 00:05:25,319 --> 00:05:30,480 of the flagstick from Marion Golf Club. And Marion is, of course where 70 00:05:30,519 --> 00:05:36,399 my grandfather played in his first national championship in the nineteen sixteen United States Amateur 71 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:43,399 and also where he closed out the Grand Slam UH in nineteen thirty. And 72 00:05:43,519 --> 00:05:48,079 so we use those at Bobby Jones Golf Course here in Atlanta on special occasions. 73 00:05:48,519 --> 00:05:53,639 And Whitney Krause, who runs Bobby Jones links the company to manage that 74 00:05:53,879 --> 00:05:58,000 had these, and he said, you know, you really need to have 75 00:05:58,079 --> 00:06:00,040 one of these in your home. So now I don't. Oh, yes, 76 00:06:00,560 --> 00:06:05,399 that's awesome. Now that's amazing. Over my left shoulder, you can't 77 00:06:05,439 --> 00:06:09,639 see it, but that's Okay, if your audio you can't see it anyway, 78 00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:13,480 but even if your video you can't see it. But there is a 79 00:06:13,519 --> 00:06:17,480 replica of Calamity Jane that was given to me by Jack Nicholas in nineteen seventy 80 00:06:17,519 --> 00:06:24,399 six for the first Memorial Tournament. So let's talk about Calamity Jana. I 81 00:06:24,439 --> 00:06:31,000 was reading about Calamity Jane. Whom who what is Calamity Jane. Well, 82 00:06:31,040 --> 00:06:38,879 Calamity Jane was a was an entertainer in the old Wild West days. But 83 00:06:39,839 --> 00:06:45,399 my grandfather went up to play a round of golf in Long Island and Jimmy 84 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:49,519 Maiden, whose brothers, Stewart Maiden was one of my If my grandfather had 85 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:55,639 a teacher, would have been Stewart Maiden. Jimmy saw that Bub was trying 86 00:06:55,680 --> 00:07:00,879 to put with this very heavy mallet headed putter, and of course was just 87 00:07:00,959 --> 00:07:05,920 hitting the ball way too hard. And so he found had this blade putter 88 00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:12,639 called that had Calamity Jane stamped on the back of it, and he said, 89 00:07:12,800 --> 00:07:16,040 Bobby really ought to try this putter. Now, the story is that 90 00:07:16,079 --> 00:07:21,360 somebody had had Calamity Jane before and had gotten so frustrated they threw it into 91 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:28,120 the neighboring graveyard to Nassau Country Club. And I don't know if that's true 92 00:07:28,199 --> 00:07:30,680 or not, but you know, Fred, it's like the Italians say, 93 00:07:30,839 --> 00:07:35,160 if it isn't true, it should be Anyway, Love got that and he 94 00:07:35,279 --> 00:07:43,079 used Calamity Jane for many, many years until the face became concave and then 95 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:46,519 he had Jay Victor East. He had Jay Victor East to make a Calamity 96 00:07:46,639 --> 00:07:50,399 Jane too, and that's what he actually used. I believe it would be 97 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:56,319 in nineteen twenty eight, twenty nine and thirty. So that's Calamity Jane's history. 98 00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:05,560 Awesome, and Calamity Jane one is at Augusta National and Calamity Jane two 99 00:08:05,079 --> 00:08:11,120 is at the United States Golf Association. Very good, very good. So 100 00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:16,959 are these stories that are passed along, you know, through the family or 101 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:22,240 is this as a historian what you've studied and you've you've put to memory and 102 00:08:22,199 --> 00:08:28,800 gotten deep into the elements of the intricacies of these stories. A little bit 103 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:31,799 of both. Actually, my dad told me a lot of stories. You 104 00:08:31,799 --> 00:08:35,519 know. My grandfather didn't so much because he just wasn't one to really talk 105 00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:39,240 about stuff. My dad told me a lot of them, and then over 106 00:08:39,279 --> 00:08:45,480 the years, over the years, I've just kind of researched and picked it 107 00:08:45,559 --> 00:08:48,600 up. And I've got some friends Sid Matthew down in Tallahassee, who is 108 00:08:48,679 --> 00:08:54,559 a who is probably one of the leading Bob Jones scholars in the world, 109 00:08:56,360 --> 00:09:01,919 and Catherine Lewis here in Atlanta, and others, and overtime, you know, 110 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:05,279 I've just sort of collected them. I used to get really nervous about 111 00:09:05,320 --> 00:09:09,879 saying stories that Sid had told me, and I said, you know, 112 00:09:09,960 --> 00:09:11,960 Syd, you ought to be telling these. I mean, you tell the 113 00:09:11,000 --> 00:09:13,879 story better than I do. And he looked at me and he said, 114 00:09:13,919 --> 00:09:16,399 he calls me laddie. We call each other laddie. And he said, 115 00:09:16,639 --> 00:09:20,840 Laddie, let me just tell you. He said, you and I can 116 00:09:20,879 --> 00:09:26,120 tell the exact same story. And he said, and it really doesn't matter. 117 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:31,000 But if you're telling the story, well then it means something. And 118 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:35,320 I thought about it and I thought, you know, there's probably some truth 119 00:09:35,399 --> 00:09:43,000 to what he says. So I then have basically just collected them and I 120 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:46,320 trot them out periodically. And one of the nice things fred is I've realized 121 00:09:46,440 --> 00:09:52,000 is that they might be true, they might not who's going to tell right, 122 00:09:52,639 --> 00:09:58,360 No, but we actually actually though seriously, I do try to make 123 00:09:58,360 --> 00:10:03,720 sure that they are accurate, because there's so much mythology that has grown up 124 00:10:03,759 --> 00:10:11,960 around my grandfather that I think that the true stories are actually I think the 125 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:18,159 true stories are actually better, much better. Yeah. So yeah, so 126 00:10:18,200 --> 00:10:20,200 I try to do that. Well, it takes me back to the very 127 00:10:20,240 --> 00:10:22,919 first question I asked you when you were on a couple of years ago, 128 00:10:22,960 --> 00:10:26,200 and that is what's it like to be golf Royalty? And you you were 129 00:10:26,200 --> 00:10:28,480 like, no, no, no, no, no, no, it's 130 00:10:28,519 --> 00:10:31,200 like no, no, when you tell the story, it carries weight, 131 00:10:31,559 --> 00:10:37,799 it's probably yeah, and that's and that is probably true. However, you 132 00:10:37,840 --> 00:10:41,399 know, given what happens to royal families, I'm still going to resist that. 133 00:10:43,360 --> 00:10:46,799 Well, I don't know if they're going to be doing a five season, 134 00:10:46,840 --> 00:10:52,480 five season series on on you and your family. No, I don't 135 00:10:52,519 --> 00:10:56,080 you hope not, Mater. There's not enough material for that, So there 136 00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:58,799 you go. No, yeah, yeah, awesome. All right, listen, 137 00:10:58,799 --> 00:11:05,279 we're going to continue with our tour of your tribute to Bobby Jones, 138 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:16,320 but we're gonna take a break and we'll be back right after this. Bob, 139 00:11:16,399 --> 00:11:20,080 let's get back to these photographs because there's stuff over your left shoulder that 140 00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:24,279 I definitely want to hear more about. I appreciate that you're explaining it, 141 00:11:24,279 --> 00:11:28,480 so we all get right there with you no problem. When you come down 142 00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:33,960 to the second row, there are three rows of photos there. Well, 143 00:11:33,000 --> 00:11:37,279 one is a print, but underneath the top one, of course, is 144 00:11:37,320 --> 00:11:43,399 the Jack Nicholas Calamity Jane that he gave me in nineteen seventy six. But 145 00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:46,840 then you come down one and one of the things that you will see, 146 00:11:46,879 --> 00:11:50,799 which would be on the right hand so I had to turn around him look 147 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:56,799 on the right hand side, is actually a print that was taken of my 148 00:11:56,919 --> 00:12:05,639 grandfather when he was complete eating his final full shot into the eleventh green at 149 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:09,840 Marion in nineteen thirty. That was the last full shot that he hit in 150 00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:15,080 competition. And then there's a photograph in the middle that has a little silver 151 00:12:15,279 --> 00:12:20,600 thing that looks like a scorecard because in fact it is, and the photo 152 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:28,559 is of the very moment that Gene Holman's is conceding the put to my grandfather 153 00:12:28,840 --> 00:12:35,000 to win the Grand Slam. And in that photograph there are people thronging that 154 00:12:35,120 --> 00:12:41,919 eleventh green who are moving in very quickly and United States Marines that are going 155 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:48,360 into guarding. And underneath it is the actual scorecard of the final round with 156 00:12:48,440 --> 00:12:54,159 Holman's. The cute little thing about it is both Holman's and my grandfather double 157 00:12:54,240 --> 00:12:58,720 bogeyed the Well. I was going to say the easy tenth hole at Marion. 158 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:03,399 You have to understand that easy is a relative term when it comes to 159 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:09,600 Marion, and uh, and they both double bogied it, and my grandfather's 160 00:13:09,679 --> 00:13:16,279 circled both sixes and rode above it. Ha ha. And so that's uh, 161 00:13:16,360 --> 00:13:20,159 that is there. Then, Uh, let me ask you before you 162 00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:24,960 move on, let me ask you you you just said that was it match 163 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:30,440 play? He said it was the eleventh was the last full shot that he 164 00:13:30,519 --> 00:13:35,320 took? Correct? Yes, the match the Amateur back then and now for 165 00:13:35,399 --> 00:13:41,440 that matter, was the Amateur was a match play tournament. They only played 166 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:45,679 it, I think for maybe a decade starting in the nineteen sixties through the 167 00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:50,399 early seventies as stroke play and then went back to h to match play. 168 00:13:52,200 --> 00:13:56,399 Uh. Now, when you move all the way to the left, what 169 00:13:56,480 --> 00:14:03,639 you will see is a photograph of my grandfather Ben Hogan and Jean Sarahzin that 170 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:07,279 was shot in New York. At the time, they were the only three 171 00:14:07,320 --> 00:14:13,519 men to have won the Devil, which is both the Open Championships in the 172 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:20,440 same calendar year. So that's a cool photo. Underneath that, back to 173 00:14:20,559 --> 00:14:26,440 my far right, is a very unusual photo and if you look underneath, 174 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:33,279 it's a photo of my grandfather teeing off in front of the clubhouse of the 175 00:14:33,360 --> 00:14:37,360 Royal and Ancient Saint Andrews. And underneath it it says Bobby John's nineteen thirty 176 00:14:37,360 --> 00:14:45,559 six. And in nineteen thirty six he had returned to Scotland. He had 177 00:14:45,559 --> 00:14:48,600 returned to Scotland. I believe he was on his way back to the US 178 00:14:48,799 --> 00:14:52,320 after the Olympics in Berlin, or he was on his way to the Olympics 179 00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:58,440 in Berlin, and he said, I can't be this close to Saint Andrews 180 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:01,759 and not play a round of golf, And so Robert Woodruff signed him up 181 00:15:01,799 --> 00:15:05,799 to play, just signed it up as our Woodruff R. Jones, United 182 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:09,919 States. And when they got there, there was like a couple of hundred 183 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:13,720 people at the tea and by the time he hit the seventh hole, the 184 00:15:13,960 --> 00:15:18,120 entire city had shut down and thousands were following him and he hadn't played in 185 00:15:18,200 --> 00:15:24,519 months, but he hadn't played in months, but he was able to shoot 186 00:15:24,559 --> 00:15:28,600 seventy two that day. But it was such an emotional experience he was never 187 00:15:28,639 --> 00:15:33,600 able to really talk about it. There's a photo in the middle of a 188 00:15:33,679 --> 00:15:39,519 gentleman with a pipe who actually would be my great grandfather, my grandfather's dad, 189 00:15:39,799 --> 00:15:43,960 Robert Permidis Jones. And then all the way on the left there is 190 00:15:43,039 --> 00:15:50,320 a collage of photos from Highlands Country Club in Highlands, North Carolina, where 191 00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:54,960 my grandfather was a member, where I'm a member, where he hit the 192 00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:58,720 first ball in nineteen twenty eight. And at the bottom of it is a 193 00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:06,799 canceled stamp uh from from when when the post office dedicated one to him in 194 00:16:06,879 --> 00:16:11,279 nineteen eighty one. So that's my back wall. That's a good wall. 195 00:16:11,759 --> 00:16:15,879 Good wall. Thank you. Now I want to go back and pick up 196 00:16:15,919 --> 00:16:25,440 some of the details here. Um he won. Uh he only played uh 197 00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:29,480 from what nineteen twenty three to nineteen thirty. Uh? No, he only 198 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:33,120 won from nineteen twenty three to nineteen thirty. Oh, I see only one. 199 00:16:33,399 --> 00:16:37,840 Oh that's right, because nineteen sixteen he won the amateur championship. No, 200 00:16:37,399 --> 00:16:41,000 no, all right, Okay, nineteen sixteen. Yes you are that 201 00:16:41,039 --> 00:16:45,240 by Fred. This is why I'm there. We go, thank you. 202 00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:51,720 Here's here's what he did. In nineteen sixteen, he won the the inaugural 203 00:16:51,759 --> 00:16:56,200 Georgia State Amateur Capitol City Club here in Atlanta, and then went to play 204 00:16:56,240 --> 00:17:00,519 in his first National Amateur, which was at Marion. He then went through 205 00:17:00,679 --> 00:17:07,480 seven years what we were called the seven lean years, where he could make 206 00:17:07,559 --> 00:17:10,359 runner up, or he could make the finals, or he could do really 207 00:17:10,359 --> 00:17:12,839 well, but he just couldn't win. And then he finally broke through in 208 00:17:12,920 --> 00:17:18,720 nineteen twenty three and over the next Over the next eight years, he won 209 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:25,400 thirteen major titles, became the first person to win the double both Opens in 210 00:17:25,440 --> 00:17:30,599 the same year, became and became the only man in history to win the 211 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:36,279 Grand Slam, which was all four majors in a single year. You know, 212 00:17:36,279 --> 00:17:37,799 it's very fascinating to me. I mean it's like, even to this 213 00:17:37,920 --> 00:17:44,640 day, we have four major championships because that's how many he won. I 214 00:17:44,680 --> 00:17:48,680 mean, that's how dominant he really was. I mean, even to this 215 00:17:48,799 --> 00:17:52,480 very day, nobody I think has influenced the game of golf to the same 216 00:17:52,519 --> 00:17:56,759 degree that Bobby Jones has. I mean, he is still the benchmark by 217 00:17:56,759 --> 00:18:04,680 which everybody's measured, right absolutely, and so the when he won those majors 218 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:11,559 was he was amateur status. Was never turned prow he never turned professional. 219 00:18:11,680 --> 00:18:18,920 You know, there's some really interesting things like when he in his United States 220 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:22,160 Open titles, he you know, he won four of them. The only 221 00:18:22,200 --> 00:18:27,319 people to win four have been him, Nicholas Hogan, and Willie Anderson. 222 00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:34,400 And then but here's the interesting part. He won four of them, he 223 00:18:34,559 --> 00:18:38,880 finished second in four of them, and two of those he lost in a 224 00:18:38,920 --> 00:18:44,920 playoff. And he never finished out of the top ten. From nineteen twenty 225 00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:48,079 when he played in his first Open until nineteen thirty when he played in his 226 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:52,160 last, he never finished out of the top ten except for once, and 227 00:18:52,240 --> 00:18:57,759 that was in a tie for eleventh. Nobody ever beat him twice in match 228 00:18:57,839 --> 00:19:04,240 play, which is mind boggling to me. And in singles, in singles 229 00:19:04,279 --> 00:19:11,279 play in the Walker Cup, he never ever lost a match in singles play 230 00:19:11,359 --> 00:19:15,200 in the Walker's Cup. I think he tied one in the foursome's play, 231 00:19:15,279 --> 00:19:21,759 but never, never, never in the singles. Incredible record, incredible record. 232 00:19:22,039 --> 00:19:26,119 One of the statistics to flesh out a little more of what you said 233 00:19:26,799 --> 00:19:32,559 in thirty one championships that he played in he was first or second more than 234 00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:37,400 fifty percent of the time something like that. Yes, something like that. 235 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:42,519 I mean, it's just just just a staggering statistic. All all the while 236 00:19:42,599 --> 00:19:49,480 that he was attending Georgia Tech and going to Harvard studying law and getting married 237 00:19:49,480 --> 00:19:56,119 and starting a family. I mean, it's made. And after he won 238 00:19:56,680 --> 00:20:02,440 finished the Grand Slam in nineteen thirty, Yes, it was just so he 239 00:20:02,559 --> 00:20:04,000 was on top of the world. He's won the Grand Slam, He's won 240 00:20:04,039 --> 00:20:10,799 all these majors, and he retires he does That's exactly correct, very young 241 00:20:10,839 --> 00:20:14,519 age. He would have been twenty eight years old, because he had no 242 00:20:14,599 --> 00:20:22,839 desire at his athletic prime. Yes, he actually had no desire to turn 243 00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:26,839 pro. Now once somebody said to him, wow, didn't you think about 244 00:20:26,839 --> 00:20:29,319 it so well, I thought about it, but I just never really wanted 245 00:20:29,359 --> 00:20:30,680 to do it. I wanted to be I wanted to be a lawyer. 246 00:20:32,799 --> 00:20:37,000 And so that's what he did. And somebody made the comment to Walter Hagen 247 00:20:37,119 --> 00:20:40,880 once, well, you know, Bobby didn't want to turn pro because there 248 00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:45,000 just wasn't any money in it at the time. And Hagen said, well, 249 00:20:45,319 --> 00:20:51,240 if he had turned pro, there would have been oh so sure, 250 00:20:51,359 --> 00:20:55,519 because there was so much attention on him. Oh. Absolutely, But that 251 00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:57,759 was also part of one of the reasons why he wanted to go away from 252 00:20:57,839 --> 00:21:02,000 it. He wanted to us to get back to playing golf with his buddies 253 00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:08,799 and not have the pressure of tournament golf. Yeah, two very different piecets. 254 00:21:10,440 --> 00:21:15,000 I believe that's exactly what he said. Ooh, I've just made that 255 00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:18,039 up. All right, We're gonna take another time out and then we're inching 256 00:21:18,160 --> 00:21:25,200 up to you know, he won the last one in nineteen thirty. We're 257 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:27,720 not that far from twenty thirty, and there's some plans for that, So 258 00:21:27,759 --> 00:21:37,680 we're going to talk about it when we come back after this. So, 259 00:21:37,799 --> 00:21:41,640 as I was alluding to, twenty thirty is not that far in the big 260 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:48,359 scheme of things. But preparations are already being made for the hundredth anniversary, 261 00:21:48,400 --> 00:21:53,200 the Bobby Jones Centennial, And I know that the Jones family has been working 262 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:57,759 with the USGA and the RNA. Can we go into some details on that, 263 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:03,200 Yes, we can. We are in very preliminary conversations with them. 264 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:07,799 But one of the things that we are thinking of doing that we are going 265 00:22:07,880 --> 00:22:14,079 to do as a family is we are going to enter into a series of 266 00:22:14,160 --> 00:22:22,319 commercial events, a series of commercial events to celebrate all of the centennial victories 267 00:22:22,799 --> 00:22:26,680 that he had, both starting in twenty twenty three and leading all the way 268 00:22:26,759 --> 00:22:33,839 up to twenty thirty. These will be what we are looking to do is 269 00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:41,279 to sell corporate sponsorships to corporations that we feel embody the name and values of 270 00:22:41,319 --> 00:22:45,920 my grandfather, the values of him at least, and this will also give 271 00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:52,559 us the chance to tell the Bobby Jones story to an entirely new generation. 272 00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:56,920 You know, one of the things that we've discovered as a family over the 273 00:22:56,000 --> 00:23:03,039 years is that you have to do this commercially. Given the way things are 274 00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:06,400 in this day and age. You have to do it commercially to get the 275 00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:10,880 story out, and to get the story out so that young people will start 276 00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:14,720 getting interested in, Hey, who was this guy? Because one of the 277 00:23:14,759 --> 00:23:22,000 things that we've learned is that the Bobby Jones story is tremendously compelling and incredibly 278 00:23:22,039 --> 00:23:26,640 inspirational, and in the classic sense of the word, it's very heroic in 279 00:23:26,759 --> 00:23:33,400 almost every possible way. And so we feel that the centennial celebration will be 280 00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:40,759 a way to get the story told. And it is our intention to devote 281 00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:47,039 twenty percent of what we net, which is a pretty substant we hope to 282 00:23:47,079 --> 00:23:51,440 be a substantial number. We want to devote twenty percent of what wet net 283 00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:57,400 to go to finding to go to support organizations and foundations, including our Bobby 284 00:23:57,440 --> 00:24:03,759 Jones Kring Surringomlia Foundation, so that we can help find a cure for the 285 00:24:03,839 --> 00:24:10,480 disease that took his life. It's you know, research is an expensive proposition, 286 00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:15,920 and so we want to make sure that we want to make sure that 287 00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:23,920 we are doing something that can move the needle in research on syringomilia. So 288 00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:29,119 that's what we're gonna that's our plan between now and now in twenty thirty. 289 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:33,519 We're still at the somewhat preliminary stages, but hopefully I'll have more details to 290 00:24:33,519 --> 00:24:38,200 tell you when we meet by this time next year. Yeah, of course, 291 00:24:38,759 --> 00:24:45,000 it's interesting because here you have, you know, a name that people 292 00:24:45,720 --> 00:24:51,200 do recognize today. You know, there's some names you've even mentioned in our 293 00:24:51,240 --> 00:24:55,160 conversation so far that I'm like, I don't know who that is? Then 294 00:24:56,000 --> 00:25:00,480 who who may be major major winners, you know, I'm not I'm not 295 00:25:00,519 --> 00:25:06,440 a golf historian, but I try to learn as much as I can. 296 00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:11,240 But there's still names that I don't know that may had significant impact and shot 297 00:25:11,279 --> 00:25:14,799 an incredible score, had an incredible match, whatever it is. But a 298 00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:19,039 name a hundred years later, like Bobby Jones, that still resonates with golfers 299 00:25:19,079 --> 00:25:23,559 at every level is really remarkable. I think that. And I think that 300 00:25:23,599 --> 00:25:30,160 happens, as I said, because the word that describes above the best is 301 00:25:30,279 --> 00:25:33,640 heroic. And when I use that term, And I'm also working on a 302 00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:38,000 book, finally work again, working on this book. I've been I've been 303 00:25:38,039 --> 00:25:42,559 putting it off for decades, but I'm realizing I'm not getting any younger. 304 00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:47,160 But one of the things that I think is important to understand is what a 305 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:48,960 hero really is. We think a hero is just like, oh, a 306 00:25:49,039 --> 00:25:52,880 guy that does great things, but that's not exactly what a hero is. 307 00:25:53,519 --> 00:26:00,319 A hero is somebody that basically wrestles with their inner the inner devils, or 308 00:26:00,359 --> 00:26:07,799 their darker sides, or to put it in young terms, their shadow, 309 00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:12,039 and comes out somehow on top. And he did that. You know, 310 00:26:12,079 --> 00:26:15,839 he had this volcanic temper that he had to overcome. In order to win 311 00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:22,480 championships, and then he won those championships, and then later, just maybe 312 00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:26,559 fifteen twenty years later, all of a sudden, he's faced with an adversary 313 00:26:26,559 --> 00:26:33,279 that no one could have ever imagined, and that was that horrible disease syringomayelia. 314 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:38,640 And he dealt with it so well that even the great golf writer Herbert 315 00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:45,839 Warren Wind ended up saying about him was that in youth he stood up with 316 00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:49,759 grace and dignity to just about the best that life has to offer, which 317 00:26:49,839 --> 00:26:55,160 isn't easy. And then in later life he stood up with equal grace and 318 00:26:55,240 --> 00:27:03,319 dignity to just about the worst. So I think I think that that quality 319 00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:07,799 that he had was such that I mean, if he had not had that 320 00:27:07,880 --> 00:27:12,039 quality to him, we would just be talking about him like he was just 321 00:27:12,319 --> 00:27:15,279 some guy that did these great things. I know, who was he? 322 00:27:15,319 --> 00:27:22,480 Again? But because he did this with grace and dignity, because he embodied 323 00:27:22,519 --> 00:27:30,559 the amateur ideal, because he was dedicated to living a life not just as 324 00:27:30,599 --> 00:27:37,880 an athlete and yet conquering the athletic world, I think that's what makes the 325 00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:44,279 story so powerful and so compelling, and that's why we remember Bobby Jones and 326 00:27:44,839 --> 00:27:48,200 twenty twenty three, just as we did in you know, when he died 327 00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:56,279 in nineteen seventy one, maybe even more so. How much of it is, 328 00:27:57,079 --> 00:28:03,680 you know, your heroic view of him, is how you knew him? 329 00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:07,039 Or was it more about what you heard about him from your father and 330 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:15,640 what you've read both. You know, it's very funny. When I knew 331 00:28:15,720 --> 00:28:18,880 him, he was I remember him when he was on two canes, and 332 00:28:18,920 --> 00:28:22,400 then he went from there to a walker, and then he went from there 333 00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:25,799 to a wheelchair, and finally, by the time I was fourteen, he 334 00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:30,599 went to a bed. And yet for most of that time, insofar as 335 00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:33,880 he could, he would be he would have his valet dressing in the morning, 336 00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:37,240 who also was his chauffee, drive him down to work, and he 337 00:28:37,319 --> 00:28:41,200 went to work up until just a few weeks prior to his death in nineteen 338 00:28:41,279 --> 00:28:47,279 seventy one. And when he would come home, he would be changed into 339 00:28:47,279 --> 00:28:51,960 pajama pants and a T shirt, and he would sit and you know, 340 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:56,039 he would watch television, and he would engage in conversation with people that were 341 00:28:56,079 --> 00:29:02,720 there, and and I suppose, I'd suppose the greatest thing I could say 342 00:29:02,759 --> 00:29:06,759 to him is I get asked by people sometimes what was your grandfather like? 343 00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:08,160 And as well, you know how they say he was, you know, 344 00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:15,759 in terms of his grace, swan, his kindness when he was when he 345 00:29:15,759 --> 00:29:17,920 would meet people, and they said, yeah, so that's how he was 346 00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:21,680 at home too. Now, don't get me wrong. He could be a 347 00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:23,160 tough guy. He was not. I mean, this is a man that 348 00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:27,960 won thirteen major championships in a very short period of time. He was not 349 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:34,839 a week or a soft man. But he did, I think, represent 350 00:29:36,079 --> 00:29:42,279 a lot of what was genuinely good and virtuous in people. So but you 351 00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:48,200 also mentioned that he had quite a temper, was very much and did you 352 00:29:48,279 --> 00:29:52,960 ever see that or was that gone by the time that you arrived. I'm 353 00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:56,319 sure it was still there, but I never saw it. But you have 354 00:29:56,359 --> 00:30:00,720 to understand my relationship with my grandparents was a little bit different in this sense. 355 00:30:00,759 --> 00:30:04,519 For example, one time, my grandmother used to have dinner for us 356 00:30:04,559 --> 00:30:07,519 at the dining room table. Every night it was served. We had to 357 00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:11,839 dress up for it and everything. And one time I was down. I 358 00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:15,440 must have been about six or seven at the time, and I was acting 359 00:30:15,519 --> 00:30:19,079 like a total stinker, which I mean, I'm still capable of doing right. 360 00:30:19,599 --> 00:30:26,640 My father corrected me at the dining room table. My grandmother sent him 361 00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:34,839 to bed without his supper. So there were I was able to get away 362 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:41,920 with stuff that probably not many other people would. So the great grandchildren can 363 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:48,279 get away with a lot grandchildren children don't. Children don't grandchildren do. So 364 00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:56,240 was his relationship with his father, who was Robert Jones or Bob Jones Colonel 365 00:30:56,240 --> 00:31:02,519 Bob Yeah, yeah, No, his father was Robert Permedus Jones, So 366 00:31:02,799 --> 00:31:08,440 Robert tire Jones, the original was his grandfather, Okay, so he So 367 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:14,680 it's confusing, However, the fourth because Robert tire Jones, then Robert P. 368 00:31:15,519 --> 00:31:18,960 Then Robert tire Jones Junior, which was my grandfather, Robert tire Jones, 369 00:31:19,039 --> 00:31:23,680 the third was my father, and that I became the fourth. So 370 00:31:23,799 --> 00:31:29,759 it's the tire Jones that makes it the fourth as opposed to the Robert Jones. 371 00:31:29,839 --> 00:31:33,440 But actually is the fifth? Correct, That's right, Oh, that's 372 00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:41,960 confusing. Yes, we liked himself and did the Was the temper there in 373 00:31:41,000 --> 00:31:48,200 the previous generations from him from his father and grandfather? Were they his son 374 00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:52,400 on him? His father temper? Yeah, his father, Robert permedis Jones, 375 00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:56,720 or Colonel Bob as he was called. He was. He was notorious 376 00:31:56,119 --> 00:32:01,680 with his temper There was a story told the late Charlie Yates used to say 377 00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:07,440 that he was playing golf once with Colonel Bob and my grandfather, and then 378 00:32:07,519 --> 00:32:13,599 also Charlie was paired with Pierce Harris, who was a minister here in Atlanta, 379 00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:16,200 who was actually a very fine player himself, And at the end of 380 00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:21,440 the round, at the end of the round, my grandfather had shot like 381 00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:28,200 sixty six on East Blake. My great grandfather had shot maybe eighty and which 382 00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:31,039 was pretty good but never factored into a hole. But at the end of 383 00:32:31,039 --> 00:32:36,759 the round, Pierce Harris turned to Charlie and said, in one of these 384 00:32:36,759 --> 00:32:40,599 whispers that was designed to be heard by everybody, he pointed to my grandfather 385 00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:45,839 and my great grandfather, and he pointed to my grandfather's at Charlie, never 386 00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:50,279 in my life have I seen such a combination of proficiency, And then pointed 387 00:32:50,319 --> 00:32:55,799 to my grandfather great grandfather and said and profanity. So my great grandfather had 388 00:32:55,880 --> 00:33:01,079 quite a temperament. Also his motor and most notorious moment came in the city 389 00:33:01,119 --> 00:33:05,160 Ametur one year where he his friends came up to him and said, now, 390 00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:07,319 Colonel Bobby, you're going to go out and play against this this fellow, 391 00:33:07,599 --> 00:33:10,799 and you're going to need to really watch your language because he's a Baptist 392 00:33:10,799 --> 00:33:16,440 preacher. And so so my great grandfather gets on the first tea and he 393 00:33:16,519 --> 00:33:20,279 hits one pretty deep in the right rough and he hits as soon as he 394 00:33:20,319 --> 00:33:24,559 a thing's like why are that? Niker pulls it back and he gets and 395 00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:30,640 finally on the sixth hole, he just lets just this string of profanity go 396 00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:36,920 because he just is so furious at this point. And he turns and there's 397 00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:39,759 his opponent and he's staring him down. I mean he's just lying. His 398 00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:46,279 mouth is just wide open. And my great grandfather, Colonel Bob turns to 399 00:33:46,319 --> 00:33:51,240 the guy and he says, I'm sorry, preacher, I am so sorry. 400 00:33:51,279 --> 00:33:54,279 I just couldn't take it anymore. And the guy looked a himson, 401 00:33:54,960 --> 00:34:00,319 what did you call me? And Colonel said, well, I called you 402 00:34:00,440 --> 00:34:04,440 reference. I mean, you're a preacher unching and the guys, no, 403 00:34:04,599 --> 00:34:07,119 I thought you were a preacher. There are buddies that each played a trick 404 00:34:07,159 --> 00:34:10,360 on him and told him that the each each told them each that the other 405 00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:14,840 was a Baptist preacher. Well after that, for the rest of the round 406 00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:17,199 they were throwing clubs and cursing and had a great time. It was just 407 00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:22,920 they had so the temper. The temper does run down through the family. 408 00:34:23,159 --> 00:34:28,920 So there we go. I hope it didn't get to you. It did, 409 00:34:29,519 --> 00:34:34,119 it did. The thing that finally cured me, The thing that finally 410 00:34:34,159 --> 00:34:37,239 cured me was one I realized, true, really and truly, that nobody 411 00:34:37,320 --> 00:34:44,079 cared, and that I realized that I just wasn't having any fun. And 412 00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:49,199 we don't work golf. We play golf, and too many people work golf. 413 00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:54,559 So that's how I ended up losing, losing my tendency towards temper. 414 00:34:55,880 --> 00:35:01,000 That's amazing. Let's find out what's it happened on Golf Smarter Mulligans this week 415 00:35:01,519 --> 00:35:07,079 in This time Out This Week on Golf Smarter Mulligans is number six of nine 416 00:35:07,159 --> 00:35:10,719 in our Tony Manzoni series for twenty twenty three to help you launch your new 417 00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:15,679 golf season. In this episode, we address the most common question Tony received 418 00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:21,960 about the difference between his single pivot swing and stack and tilt. I can 419 00:35:22,039 --> 00:35:27,039 honestly tell you that when my article came out and Golf Illustrated. I got 420 00:35:27,079 --> 00:35:30,599 a lot of emails from people that bought their book and bought their tapes and 421 00:35:30,639 --> 00:35:32,519 said, I can't do this. It hurts my back. But when I 422 00:35:32,519 --> 00:35:37,159 tried your method, I could hit the ball. Now does that mean I'm 423 00:35:37,239 --> 00:35:40,360 right, No, It just means that some people think that my method is 424 00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:45,440 easier. I do know one thing. Ben O Hooligan rotated through the golf 425 00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:49,239 ball. He didn't tilt. He was what we call posted straight up and 426 00:35:49,280 --> 00:35:52,280 down. When he hit a golf ball, he did not tilt back. 427 00:35:52,719 --> 00:35:55,039 His chest was left with the target and he was always in perfect balance. 428 00:35:55,360 --> 00:36:00,159 That's Golf Smarter Mulligan's episode two hundred five, the six of nine featuring our 429 00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:06,000 friend and mentor Tony Manzoni checked the show notes to learn how to get Tony's 430 00:36:06,039 --> 00:36:09,840 book, The Lost Fundamental One Simple Move, Better Golf Forever, and gain 431 00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:15,519 access to his video of the same name. Please subscribe for free or a 432 00:36:15,599 --> 00:36:21,760 sister podcast that revisits the best of the Golf Smarter podcast called Golf Smarter Mulligan's 433 00:36:22,119 --> 00:36:29,760 being released every Friday from wherever you're listening right now. One of the things 434 00:36:29,760 --> 00:36:34,239 that Bobby Jones did that you just will not see in the twenty first century 435 00:36:34,280 --> 00:36:40,760 sports is He spent a tremendous amount of time and traveled with a newspaperman Obi 436 00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:47,119 Keeler. Yes he did. Yes, Oh, he most definitely did o 437 00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:55,760 Buz who actually he was a newswriter first and then became a sportswriter. He 438 00:36:55,880 --> 00:37:00,559 probably wrote one of them gripping accounts of the sync of the Titanic in nineteen 439 00:37:00,599 --> 00:37:07,000 twelve. But then when he was in Atlanta, he covered probably one of 440 00:37:07,039 --> 00:37:13,119 the darkest chapters, one of the darkest chapters in the history of Atlanta, 441 00:37:13,199 --> 00:37:19,440 which was the murder of a little girl named Mary Fagan and which led to 442 00:37:19,599 --> 00:37:24,599 the ultimately to the lynching of Leo Frank, which was just one of the 443 00:37:24,679 --> 00:37:31,079 darkest chapters in the history of our city. At any rate, Keeler. 444 00:37:32,360 --> 00:37:37,800 Keeler was one of those men that had almost like this classical sense of justice 445 00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:42,239 combined with a ribbeled sense of humor, which I'll tell you about in a 446 00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:45,000 second. But when it came time for my grandfather to start playing, you 447 00:37:45,039 --> 00:37:49,559 have to remember my grandfather was only fourteen years old when he started playing in 448 00:37:49,679 --> 00:37:54,199 national championships, and so Keeler would accompany him to all these tournaments, and 449 00:37:54,239 --> 00:38:00,599 in many ways he ended up being not just a sportswriter but also almost a 450 00:38:00,679 --> 00:38:05,639 sports psychologist to my grandfather Bob. When he was having a hard time before 451 00:38:05,639 --> 00:38:12,320 winning the nineteen twenty three US Open to start the eight strong hardcore years that 452 00:38:12,400 --> 00:38:15,800 he played, Obe was the one who came up to him and he said, 453 00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:21,960 Bob, you are the best golfer in the world. And when you 454 00:38:22,000 --> 00:38:23,719 get that through your head and you really believe it, you're not going to 455 00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:27,760 just win one tournament, but you're going to win a bunch of them. 456 00:38:28,559 --> 00:38:32,679 And that turned out to be exactly true. Keeler also, though I don't 457 00:38:32,719 --> 00:38:36,480 want to just make him out to be just this, you know, this 458 00:38:36,960 --> 00:38:40,000 very sage kind of individual, he also had quite a sense of humor. 459 00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:45,559 In fact, one night when Keeler had been spending the evening in the company 460 00:38:45,599 --> 00:38:51,159 of a woman who was not his wife. The next morning they came downstairs 461 00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:53,559 and she said to me, said, oh, Bie, you said you 462 00:38:53,599 --> 00:38:59,559 were going to write a poem about me, And he said, by golly, 463 00:38:59,599 --> 00:39:01,880 madam, I certainly did. And he sat down and felt it out 464 00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:08,360 something on the typewriter that went my typewriter's most ambitious to ensure your lasting fame. 465 00:39:08,800 --> 00:39:14,079 But the liquor we had was vicious and I cannot recall your name, 466 00:39:15,199 --> 00:39:21,480 and that was Obeque. He was an interesting, interesting man. I had 467 00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:25,480 never had the opportunity to meet him. Oh that's great. Oh that's a 468 00:39:25,519 --> 00:39:37,280 phenomenal story. And Bobby also received an accolade that is just set aside for 469 00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:42,199 those very special moments in the world. And he received a ticker tape parade. 470 00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:45,480 He received two. He received two of them, wow, okay, 471 00:39:45,519 --> 00:39:50,960 and one of them in nineteen twenty six when he came back to the States 472 00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:54,280 after winning the British Open at Royal Litham and Saint Anne's, and then the 473 00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:59,800 other one in nineteen thirty after he won both the British Amateur and the British 474 00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:04,039 so he was only halfway through the Grand Slam at that point. But yes, 475 00:40:04,079 --> 00:40:06,320 he won them, he won the both of them. In fact, 476 00:40:06,639 --> 00:40:10,679 Mayor Jimmy Walker said at that point, he said, you know, when 477 00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:15,920 when he was presenting the key to the City to bub he said, you 478 00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:21,039 know, it could not be foreseen or foreknown that today would bring two great 479 00:40:21,159 --> 00:40:28,000 polls together, namely that the world's greatest golfer should be introduced by the world's 480 00:40:28,199 --> 00:40:31,000 worst golfer. And then he handed my grandfather the key to the City of 481 00:40:31,039 --> 00:40:36,599 New York. So years later, when he was flying up to New York 482 00:40:36,679 --> 00:40:40,159 for some business with Arthur Howell, one of his law partners, they actually 483 00:40:40,599 --> 00:40:45,199 they were. They flew into Kennedy Airport back then it was called Idlewild, 484 00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:50,199 and the plane stopped before it got to the gate, and they opened the 485 00:40:50,199 --> 00:40:53,880 door and brought upstairs, and there were three New York City police cars that 486 00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:59,960 pulled up alongside to give my grandfather, a mister Howell, a ride down 487 00:41:00,039 --> 00:41:02,639 to the Waldorf Astoria. And Arthur just couldn't believe it. He's like, 488 00:41:02,679 --> 00:41:06,599 I just can't believe this is all here for you. And bub just looked 489 00:41:06,639 --> 00:41:08,800 at him. Well, Arthur, that key to the city's got to be 490 00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:15,000 worth something, don't you think. And that's so yeah, So that's right. 491 00:41:15,079 --> 00:41:17,280 He's he's the only one that has had two ticker tape parades and a 492 00:41:17,360 --> 00:41:27,119 police escort. Oh wow, now here we are in April, the Masters. 493 00:41:27,159 --> 00:41:30,960 It's really the opening of the golf season. I'm truly playing for a 494 00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:35,440 while, trying to get out of winter, and it just announces it announces 495 00:41:35,480 --> 00:41:44,840 spring more than anything else. But Augusta National and the Masters really is part 496 00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:51,239 of your family legacy. It is. It very definitely is, and you 497 00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:52,719 know, it's very funny. I mean, of course there are a fewer 498 00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:55,920 each year, but you know, every year when I go back, it's 499 00:41:55,960 --> 00:42:00,199 really fun because I get to see a lot of people that I've known for 500 00:42:00,679 --> 00:42:05,760 most of my life. But the numbers, the number were, you know, 501 00:42:06,039 --> 00:42:07,840 I'm starting to get to the age where that number is starting to get 502 00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:14,840 smaller and smaller each year, which in many ways makes me treasure it even 503 00:42:14,920 --> 00:42:22,320 more. And it's always enjoyable to meet people there who are there for the 504 00:42:22,360 --> 00:42:28,320 first time and are seeing the place for the first time and talking to them 505 00:42:28,360 --> 00:42:31,079 about what the experience is like. You know, as I'm getting older, 506 00:42:31,480 --> 00:42:38,119 I'm finding it more and more important to share, to share, not just 507 00:42:39,159 --> 00:42:44,039 you know, to share, to share legacy in a lot of different ways, 508 00:42:44,559 --> 00:42:49,360 but particularly in that you know, I realized, I realized about twenty 509 00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:54,840 twenty five years ago that if I didn't tell the stories, then that was 510 00:42:54,920 --> 00:43:00,239 leaving my grandfather's legacy to be dictated by people who might not have ever owning 511 00:43:00,079 --> 00:43:05,280 or who might not have the best interest at heart, and so that's become 512 00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:10,840 very important to me. But it's also important when I'm at someplace like Augusta 513 00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:17,760 to meet people. When I meet people, to also find out their experience 514 00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:22,079 and to share some things that have been important to me over the years as 515 00:43:22,119 --> 00:43:24,960 well. And of course, you know, it's always fun to see some 516 00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:29,159 of the changes, Like you know, number five now has got a tea 517 00:43:29,280 --> 00:43:34,039 that's somewhere back I think in Columbia County, which is the next county over 518 00:43:34,079 --> 00:43:37,960 from Augusta. And then they moved thirteen tea back I believe about fifty or 519 00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:43,519 sixty yards for this year. I'll be interested to see that. And yet, 520 00:43:43,679 --> 00:43:46,559 you know, for all the changes that occur at Augusta, and by 521 00:43:46,559 --> 00:43:52,239 the way, even since nineteen thirty five the constant at Augusta has been changed, 522 00:43:55,039 --> 00:44:01,360 it's still fun to see how that golf course still stands up and is 523 00:44:01,480 --> 00:44:07,280 such a firm test to the best players in the world. And I always 524 00:44:07,400 --> 00:44:14,920 enjoy I always enjoy watching them play it. And I'm very grateful that the 525 00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:21,440 club allows me and my family to be very cheer absolutely so, how did 526 00:44:21,480 --> 00:44:25,079 the nineteen was a nineteen thirty four was the first Masters as it was augusta 527 00:44:25,199 --> 00:44:30,800 national. And how did that come to be and what influence did he have? 528 00:44:31,199 --> 00:44:35,960 Well, he co founded the club and co designed the golf course with 529 00:44:36,000 --> 00:44:42,639 Alister mackenzie. His intention had always been to have just a very informal golf 530 00:44:42,679 --> 00:44:47,119 tournament where his friends that were pros could come and gather and you know, 531 00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:51,800 just kick it around a little bit and play a little golf, have a 532 00:44:51,800 --> 00:44:55,000 good time. Cliff Roberts saw it a little differently. He saw this as 533 00:44:58,039 --> 00:45:05,159 being able to become the event thought it is now and so he was the 534 00:45:05,159 --> 00:45:08,840 one, in fact that really pushed for the word Masters to be attached to 535 00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:14,920 it. Bubb hated that term Masters for a couple of reasons. One was 536 00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:19,000 he thought it was extremely pretentious, and then he also thought that a tournament 537 00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:22,000 that was being held in the Deep South in nineteen thirty four in the nineteen 538 00:45:22,039 --> 00:45:28,400 thirties, Masters might not be the best title for it. But by nineteen 539 00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:32,280 sixty, when Palmer had won it the second time, Bub said, I 540 00:45:32,320 --> 00:45:39,800 think Masters might be an apt description now because by then anybody who was everybody 541 00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:45,519 who was anybody in golf, you had to win the Masters to be considered 542 00:45:45,519 --> 00:45:50,360 a really great player. And that's true now too. You really do how 543 00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:54,880 woke of him in nineteen thirties to think to be that considerate of using the 544 00:45:54,880 --> 00:45:58,760 word. I mean, like we're not only we can't even say anymore. 545 00:45:59,000 --> 00:46:02,599 Oh, this is the master your bedroom, no primary bedroom, right, 546 00:46:02,880 --> 00:46:06,840 I can't call it a master by because he's referring to master in Slafe. 547 00:46:06,880 --> 00:46:09,679 Don't do that, right, But it's now the primary bedroom. But I 548 00:46:09,760 --> 00:46:15,079 doubt that the primary golf tournament. I don't think that. I don't think 549 00:46:15,119 --> 00:46:20,559 that Bub would have ever been classified as woke. But it's what he did 550 00:46:20,719 --> 00:46:28,239 have was he did have a very sharp and exquisite sense of fairness that was 551 00:46:28,320 --> 00:46:36,719 important to him. So it's good. Yeah, we're now his grandfather. 552 00:46:37,800 --> 00:46:43,920 We're probably talking the early eighteen hundreds, mid eighteen hundreds. Well know, 553 00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:50,239 he was in Canton, about thirty five miles north and but that was the 554 00:46:50,960 --> 00:46:54,800 he was part of the South, the Confederacy. Oh absolutely absolutely. In 555 00:46:54,840 --> 00:47:00,519 fact, his his father, William Green Jones, and his brothers, his 556 00:47:00,639 --> 00:47:10,800 younger his older brothers actually served in the in the Confederate Army. So yoh 557 00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:19,760 yeah, oh very definitely. I mean remember by the time my grandfather played 558 00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:22,760 in his first tournament, we weren't even we were just like, what fifty 559 00:47:22,840 --> 00:47:29,639 years from the end of the Civil War. Yeah, yeah, so it 560 00:47:29,679 --> 00:47:35,000 was still very fresh in people's memories, right right. I mean like you 561 00:47:35,079 --> 00:47:40,199 and I were born just a decade after World War Two, but it seemed 562 00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:45,519 like, oh, that's ancient history. As you're growing up, and now 563 00:47:45,559 --> 00:47:49,320 as we get to this place in our lives, thinking of ten years before 564 00:47:49,320 --> 00:47:52,039 you were born, it's like, oh, my gosh, that's yesterday. 565 00:47:52,440 --> 00:47:57,559 It is. It absolutely is. And so I mean that that just tells 566 00:47:57,599 --> 00:48:02,679 you something about the environment in which my grand father was raised. So absolutely, 567 00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:08,840 Um, please tell me about the family Foundation, and yes, promote 568 00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:14,400 promote where we can learn more about the centennial. Absolutely, to learn more 569 00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:19,079 about the centennial and about my grandfather in general, you can go to Bobby 570 00:48:19,159 --> 00:48:24,559 Jones dot org, Bobby Jones dot org. The foundation that we support is 571 00:48:24,679 --> 00:48:32,079 Bobby Jones c s F CSF Bobby Jones CSF dot org. And if you 572 00:48:32,239 --> 00:48:37,840 are on Facebook, you can keep up with us on a Facebook page called 573 00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:43,639 Bobby Jones Legendary Golfer And there, you know, every day we'll put up 574 00:48:43,639 --> 00:48:46,320 a new photo or several times a week we'll put up a new photo, 575 00:48:46,559 --> 00:48:51,559 or maybe there's an article that gets published that's interesting and we'll post that. 576 00:48:52,119 --> 00:48:57,559 So that's um, that's how to keep up with us, and you can 577 00:48:57,599 --> 00:49:04,079 fire you discovering new photos. Uh strangely enough, yes, wow, yeah, 578 00:49:04,239 --> 00:49:07,199 and I saw one that was taken of him at Pinehurst the other day 579 00:49:07,239 --> 00:49:13,480 that I'd never seen before in my life. And yeah, people just come 580 00:49:13,559 --> 00:49:16,320 up with them, and anybody that wants to follow me can always just follow 581 00:49:16,360 --> 00:49:22,280 me on my web page, which is dr that's DAS and Delta RS and 582 00:49:22,400 --> 00:49:27,679 Romeo Robert T. Jones dot com. Dr Robert T. Jones dot com. 583 00:49:27,719 --> 00:49:32,199 Excellent, Well, Bob again, it is such a joy to have 584 00:49:32,239 --> 00:49:37,239 you on the show to help kick off spring and get the masters week going 585 00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:44,320 to hear great, incredible, heartfelt stories that can only come from family. 586 00:49:44,639 --> 00:49:46,400 True. Well, thank you, Thank you, Fred. It's always a 587 00:49:46,440 --> 00:49:50,679 pleasure to visit with you, and one of these days we will do it 588 00:49:50,719 --> 00:49:54,920 in person. Bring him my recorder with me. Please stay healthy, my 589 00:49:54,920 --> 00:50:00,159 friend, you too, my friend. Take care of so. During this 590 00:50:00,199 --> 00:50:07,280 conversation that we mentioned that Bobby Jones had won thirteen majors between nineteen twenty three 591 00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:10,559 and nineteen thirty, but that number is based on the majors of the nineteen 592 00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:15,280 twenties, which are different from the majors of the twenty twenties. In addition 593 00:50:15,360 --> 00:50:21,360 to the US Open, which he won four times and winning the Open Championship 594 00:50:21,440 --> 00:50:27,440 three times, he also won the US Amateur Championship five times and the British 595 00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:35,280 Amateur Championship completing his nineteen thirty Grand Slam. Both amateur championships were considered majors 596 00:50:35,280 --> 00:50:39,079 in the nineteen twenties, and again when he retired after wrapping up the Grand 597 00:50:39,119 --> 00:50:45,280 Slam, he was still an amateur and only twenty eight years old. For 598 00:50:45,599 --> 00:50:51,800 historical perspective, Walter Hagen, who won eleven majors between nineteen fourteen to nineteen 599 00:50:51,800 --> 00:50:55,079 twenty nine, is third on the all time list behind Nicholas and Tiger, 600 00:50:55,559 --> 00:51:02,239 is considered the father of professional golf by bringing publicity, prestige, big prize 601 00:51:02,239 --> 00:51:07,840 money, and lucrative endorsements to the game. Last week, I mentioned that 602 00:51:07,880 --> 00:51:13,800 I was considering experimenting with having two guests on the show at once, each 603 00:51:13,840 --> 00:51:16,679 who've been featured on the podcast before I brought it up, and am still 604 00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:22,280 curious as to your feedback on who you'd like to hear, because after this 605 00:51:22,320 --> 00:51:25,559 interview with Doctor Bob Jones the fourth I mentioned the story of my encounter in 606 00:51:25,639 --> 00:51:30,960 Japan last October with the Zen Buddhist monk who had read Zen Golf by Doctor 607 00:51:31,039 --> 00:51:35,880 Joe. Parent Doctor Bob said that he loved that book and the work of 608 00:51:35,920 --> 00:51:38,599 Doctor Joe. I asked him if he'd like an introduction, which he was 609 00:51:38,679 --> 00:51:45,079 incredibly receptive and excited about. Almost immediately they had a successful email exchange and 610 00:51:45,280 --> 00:51:51,360 both reported back to me with their thanks. So I propose that the three 611 00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:58,079 of us record an episode together which they were both enthusiastically open. So stay 612 00:51:58,119 --> 00:52:01,880 tuned for a future episode feature a couple of PhDs who are part of history 613 00:52:02,239 --> 00:52:07,840 and have made history in golf. I want to thank Kiran Healy of Nas 614 00:52:07,840 --> 00:52:13,840 County Courthouse outside of Dublin, Ireland for opening up today's episode as a Golf 615 00:52:13,840 --> 00:52:20,480 Smarter ambassador. Kiran chose to receive Tony Manzoni's video of the Last Fundamental and 616 00:52:20,760 --> 00:52:24,559 you can too. Send an email to Golf Smarter Podcast at gmail dot com 617 00:52:24,599 --> 00:52:30,480 and request our simple instructions to leave a voicemail at our toll free golf Smarter 618 00:52:30,599 --> 00:52:34,360 line, and when you do, you can choose to receive one of three 619 00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:37,800 gifts, including a dozen balls with the golf Smarter logo from Odin Golf, 620 00:52:38,199 --> 00:52:44,280 the golf brand that sponsors and pays everyday golfers. These tour quality balls are 621 00:52:44,280 --> 00:52:47,559 a fraction of the price of what you'll pay for those expensive balls, and 622 00:52:47,800 --> 00:52:52,159 when you use the code golf Smarter at checkout, you'll receive an additional twenty 623 00:52:52,159 --> 00:52:57,320 percent off the order. Their link is in today's show notes. You also 624 00:52:57,360 --> 00:53:00,480 have the option to receive a new glove and glove storage compartment from Red Rooster 625 00:53:00,599 --> 00:53:05,639 golf dot com, and of course, you can also get a private online 626 00:53:05,679 --> 00:53:09,480 link to Tony Manzoni's video of the Lost Fundamental. So please send an email 627 00:53:09,599 --> 00:53:14,559 and I'll get back to you with some instructions of what to do and what 628 00:53:14,760 --> 00:53:20,519 to say. Just write to Golfsmarter podcast at gmail dot com or visit goolfsmarter 629 00:53:20,639 --> 00:53:23,239 dot com and click on the hay Fred button, especially if you have any 630 00:53:23,320 --> 00:53:29,519 questions, comments, or suggestions for upcoming episodes. Again, click on the 631 00:53:29,599 --> 00:53:31,679 Hey Fred button at Golfsmarter dot com.