For thirty five years, Cindy Stumpo has been a female home builder with a
passion for design, a mastery of detail, and a commitment to her crack.
With daughter Samantha Stumpo by her side, I don't need my whole family
on a date with me. That's a good note. It's goddymn weird.
See. Stumpo Development is the only second generation female construction company in the country.
You're crazy, You're a wacko, You're insane. I mean, it
just doesn't end together. Cindy and Samantha welcome guest to explore the world of
construction, real estate, development, design and more. You're unpredictable. Every
time I think I know what you want, you switch it out. But
that's what makes your houses all Your need discuss anything that happens between the roof
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She can yell at, chi can scream, but when you get her
alone, she's the best person on the planet. Cindy Stumpo is tough as
nails and welcome to Tough as Nails. Cindy Stumpo on WBC News Radio ten
thirty and tonight, we have a special guest. Want to take it from
here. We've got Samanthon' showroom. We also showroom. We got we got
Samanthon the showroom. When I go back to the country. You're trying to
buy a new cars. What you're talking about, willis. And then we
have Nelson. Nelson introduced yourself. Hey, I'm Nelson to Peger real Estate
Developers, Special guest host and I'm here to learn a little bit more about
what you're doing. Okay, and who's our guests for receiving. So we
have Adam Tucker, the CEO of Addiction Treatment Center of New England. Glad
to be here, thanks for having me. We're talking about, you know,
a former addiction specialist for the White House Office of National Drug Control Policy.
We're talking about someone who's had the honor of advising the Executive Office of
the President federal level addiction policy. We're talking about someone who owned who holds
a master's in professional Counseling from Grand Cannon University and a BA in psychology from
the University of Tennessee, Knoxville. So we're talking about a really experienced individual
here right Like to Adam, I mean, tell me what's your background.
Sure. So, I'm a small town boy from Virginia, born and raised
with two parents that were in the education business. I was always in and
around the helping profession, had a love for trying to take care of people,
and pursued that due to some personal experiences that I had in my life
and has led me to this profession, which is the only thing that I've
done in my entire career. I'm gonna I'm just gonna star. I'm not
going to get right to the questions here. I just want to talk freely
and clearly. Here. We have a massive problem on massif as rightly,
and it's not getting any better. And it seems like all we're doing is
taking the keyn and kicking it down the road. We moved the people a
mile, another mile down the road, another mile down the road. Well,
the truth is, I think we've never had this conversation, you and
I. No, Throwing money at this is not the problem. Throwing money
to beds and we have facilities is what we need to do. People have
to be housed, and if you want them to get better, right,
if they continue and this cannot be a seven day cleanout, because they're going
to run right back out exactly. I think we've all known now to get
an addic clean, they need a year program, they need a long time,
can't. I think it's individual ize treatment, but definitely along absolutely,
but the seven two weeks that insurance companies will pay for, and it's getting
to a point with insurance companies. Unfortunately, they will not bring you in
for dope sic. Because if you're doing any of heroin or any of the
painkillers and you stop using them, you're going to be sick for three or
four days, like you get the flu and you're back on your feet.
Now you know you're doing benzos alcohol. You can die coming off benzos.
You can die coming off alcohol. I think you're going to find the insurance
companies as we go down the road. I'm not going to take you in
for heroin or the painkillers, which is going to be a problem for me.
But addictions, addiction, unfortunately, the insurance game is a tough one
right now. You know they want to pay for the physical withdrawal symptoms,
and when the person is able to physically that's it. Out the door,
you go, yep, out the door, you go. May the force
be with you and we'll see you again in three months, right exactly,
or when it gets cold in Boston, you need a bed exactly. Okay,
I've played this game a long time. I've been in construction for thirty
six years. Union and non union. The only difference I can say is
the unions to take care of their guys at one point, I can't speak
now. I've been out of the union for twenty years, eighteen seventeen years.
But it was a time that they got them in places and they bought
some of their own facilities to house their own guys, to get them better.
But this is becoming a bad epidemic. And the other problem is we're
losing too many kids. We're losing too many adults, young kids, young
people to overdoses. Yeah, this is not nineteen eighty two. You did
a line of coking, you didn't die. It's not you did it.
You know. Now these kids are buying anything on the streets and slays with
fatanol even in add medication something it. And these kids, I don't know
that they're playing with fire. They're taking a thirty eight. They're putting in
the head with one bullet and spin it and let's see if the bull goes
in. Right. The recreational drug use is a thing of the past.
Right, It can take you out one shot, one shot. Ye.
Now, do I believe that there are kids that can use recreational drugs,
Yeah, I do. I mean I stawted my generation. Sure. But
eventually, if you've got that personality, that recreational drug is going to take
you over. And that's it. And I do believe that some of some
of us have that addictive personality and some of us don't. Ye. Fortunately,
it's going to catch you a lot quicker now with the drugs supply and
they just you ever meet a business where they want to kill their clients?
Never understood this business any want to kill your clients. It's very different.
So it's when I go back. This is a very sense of subject for
me too, Okay. And when I went back, when we go back
thirty years ago and I was out raising money, I was already six years
into my business and could do this. I was twenty twenty three I started
my company. So let's say I lost a brother at twenty six. He
was twenty eight, So twenty nine I was heavily involved raising money for drug
addiction homes. You would have thought I was asking for I don't know,
Jesus Christ all Mighty to come down. The answer would always be no,
No, we don't give those causes it And these are my friends. We
will give for breast cancer, this, that, but not now. Now
we all have children. My daughter's thirty six now right, and those parents
the Newton Brookline area that we lived in, now they started to feel the
last ten years of their kids getting involved in Now it's an easier pull and
an easier play to get money. But prior to that, I was like,
yeah, you know, we don't give tactics that would piss me off
because nobody decides, hey I want to go up and be an addict.
Doesn't work that way. Okay, Yeah, it's a very stigmatized disease.
And unfortunately, and you're a low life and you're this and that, and
it's a disease. Let's call it what's it's a disease, the mental illness.
As far as I'm concerned, I put under the mental umbrella. Now
you take it from there. I'm just saying that it was always a hard
cry to get help. Sure, yeah, absolutely, to support these houses.
Yeah, like I said, it's it's a very stigmatized disease. Unfortunately,
people have done a lot of research now that as has caught up with
the times and people are starting to understand it. However, the stigma is
still large and in charge over top of it, so it keeps people out
of treatment. Right, I stigmatize my own disease. I don't want to
go into treatment because I don't even want to admit to my family that I
want that I have this issue. So a lot of it's held internally based
upon everything that's taking place out in the world as far as a disease is
concerned. So it's there's still a lot of room that needs to be done
in terms of calling a disease, making it a widespread It's not a moral
failure here that we're dealing with. And like you said, you immediate the
nail on the head. We didn't. We didn't ask for this as a
child, right now, They didn't wake up and say I want to be
an addict. Right. This is this is a problem of why do we
feel bad for the press that gets cancer. We don't feel bad for the
press that's sticking a needle in there on right right, But that well,
we didn't ask for the cancer, they can stop putting you need Yeah,
okay, you don't know that, Okay, So I always say, never
spit in the water. You may have to drink. And that's been my
philosophy because you don't know when it's going to be one of your children exactly,
or somebody that you love in your family. Right, And there's where
the empathy is not there. It's it's getting better. But man, thirty
years ago, twenty five years ago, twenty there was no empathy for this.
Well, I think the truth of the matter is with the stigma and
people again doing research and raising awareness, it's come so far now that I
would venture to say there's not many individuals out there that haven't had some relatability
to some person that's in the last decade, right exactly Exactly. People have
personal experience, whether it's themselves, a loved one, a family member,
a friend that they've seen go through this and hopefully they're still alive. And
my last question, I'll let Nelson take over the others. You've been through.
How many governors now in the state of Massachusetts tried to fight this.
So I'm a new bosson boy here, I've been here so you've just been
coming on to mea wu ye okay, yep under okay, So keep going.
We also take off because I don't want to. I don't want to
lose any seconds. I don't want to lose any time yet. Yeah,
honestly, just listen to the conversation between you both. You know, it
has me wondering is the government doing enough to combat this crisis? I think
there's always all that thought, we've got to go to break and then we'll
come right back to that. I'm sending Stumpley you listen to the Nails a
w BZ News Radio ten thirty sponsored my floor in Decor, National Lumber and
Village Bank, and let the wrong one los in pad in danger to immerse
it semen and I'm sending stumbling you listening to Tampa Nails on WBZ News Radio
ten thirty. Let's take it back Sammy Nelson and I guess let's talk about
it, Adam, let's do it. So is the government doing enough to
combat this crisis? You know, I think they're I think they're going in
the right direction. I think there's always room to do more with the disease
of addiction, just because it's so misunderstood, And I don't think it's always
the best the best angle to point blame at the government, you know,
but I think they're trying, and they're taking on, they're taking on a
massive problem, uh throughout our country, and it's uh, it's tough.
It's tough to wrap your head around it from a from a state level,
from a federal level, even just from a from a family system's point of
view. So again, I don't know if I want to point fingers at
anybody, but I think there's always room to expand in terms of what we
need to do. But Okay, that'll be the finger points. So yeah,
go for Itkay, you don't. You can be politically correct. I
don't have to be politically correct. I do blame our government. I do
blame our states and cities and towns because there is more we can do.
Come on, we can't stop this. We don't stop this because there's too
much money involved. There's a lot of money involved. And yeah, like
I said, I think there's more to do. I think there's more that
can be done perhabs that people can I have friends that literally the last excuse
me, last five to seven years have spent millions on their children to get
them clean, right, have taken family money because when you stop, sure,
right, but we can't get a kid clean or an adult clean unless
they want to get clean. Point. And the work's going to be put
into it, right, hard work. And I've seen guys, especially in
construction, go twenty years end up in the hospital because they hurt their back
or whatever. They give them morphine. They come out of the hospitals and
they're back running at fifty years old again or sixty. It bites them right
back, It doesn't. You can have all that time and then you're right
back on the pony right like that time never even lapsed that you were clean.
Yep. It's a chronic progressive relapsing disease is what we call it.
And you if you have a period of abstinence and you relapse, you go
right back to where you came from, just as if you've been using the
whole time. Exactly. So when we talk about methadone mile in Boston,
if you asked me twenty years ago if I thought I'd ever see this,
I would have left. I was at absolutely not. What have I seen
this in areas like Chelsea before I would have saw this mass out you know,
I mean under the bridges in Chelsea where back in the day, that's
where they were selling everything and anything they could. Yeah, but mass Ave
I never I never saw this copy. Are you telling me there's no place
that we can house them like in ear if we took them to ear Mass?
Ear Mass. Let me ask this question. Ear Mass used to have
all these old Armi barracks. Are those Armie barracks still standing around or have
they been demolished and rebuilt? You'd have to tell me. You'd have to
tell me. I remember being ear masked about twenty three years ago, Miles
ear Barrick. You know what I mean, like empty boarded up New Hampshire,
boarded up places. There is a place to put them. There's a
place to put them, you know. I think unfortunately it's it's it's a
housing issue, but it's a it's an it's always that we don't have enough
good help to go around. Also, that's a piece of it, you
know. And I could talk about the various aspects of treatment and what it
takes to really involve somebody in quality individualized care, and the truth of the
matter is the level of acuity of individuals that are down on mass av Right
now, it's going to take complete wrap around services for those individuals so we
can get them clean. There's there's what's called a housing first model, which
is you get them in a house, you get them in a residence,
and that takes care of their first step of care right. And however,
what they find is in the house they continue to use right because they're not
stable mentally, physically, emotionally. And so there's that aspect of it.
There's a spirituality aspect of it. There's a family system's aspect of it that
goes into all this, and that's you can't just chuck money at that,
right. That takes individuals that have been trained that can that can provide this
certain aspect of that individual's disease. And it's time. It's it's a relationship,
right. I can't dive in with you. I'm a therapist at heart,
That's how I got into this business. I can't begin to help you
until I even begin to develop rapport with you. So how would you even
begin to dig down into these individuals that are at mass and casts. You
can't even begin to have a relationship with them because of their level of instability.
So it's going to take it's going to take a complete effort from all
aspects of care because the truth of the matter is, even I imagine putting
yourself down on the mass and cast right now, every single moment that you
were down there, you would acquire more trauma, right, you would acquire
more trauma. I can't even drive down that street without having trauma. Can
you imagine living on it? No? Right, So, because I'd never
say anything like this, this is this is like I went down with my
bodyguard because I was afraid to go down myself. But yeah, it was
like walking zombies. It was like it was like a movie. Sure,
it's like a scary movie. It was a terrible yep. And so trauma
change changes, sorry, changes the brain, right, and it changes how
the brain functions. And so these individuals are in a non stop fight or
flight stance, right, and so to to even get them to a perspective
where they could see outside of that, it's going to take a lot.
So we're not just looking at a one size fits all blanket cover to fix
these individuals. We're gonna have to have people that go down there. So
what what is really the plan the governor brought you here. Nope, the
government had brought not bring me here. I worked for the federal government for
a period of time, and then once my contract ended, I moved to
the Addiction Treatment Center of New England, where I work now as a CEO.
We're an outpatient treatment program set in Brighton and that's that's my full time
gig now. And how much does it cost to come through your program?
So we're a state program. We have Medicare, Medicaid, it's it's insurance
based, it's it's very cheap. Yeah, so we we how many times,
you know, getting drugs? Like what was the place down the Cape
Sammy Gosne Gosnell back in the day, used to be a good place.
Right now they're just pulling tennis balls over with drugs in it, right because
maybe you have to go to jail if you don't go to rehabs. So,
you know, I don't know. I look at there's so much money
in the state of Massachusetts. There's so much money here. We're not I
recognized that in my time here. Okay, and private people can only do
so much. But we could open up beds, we could open up eds,
absolutely. What is the plan here? Absolutely? When you meet with
the politicians here, what's their plan? Some may better clean up mass ave
Yep. Absolutely, So that's a piece of it. And she hasn't done
anything as far as I can see. Okay, I haven't been here long
enough to see it. I have, I have, so you know our
maya has got to do something. Sure, sure, absolutely So I think
about all these people that own that real estate on MASSV right, and they're
crying every day like please push this. Sure, what do we do here?
Yep? It's a again, it's a funding from a housing perspective.
That's a piece of it. But it can't just be housing, right,
It's got to be it's got to be services. So those those individuals down
there, the amount of clinical services that they would need, the amount of
medical services that they would need, the amount of vocational and employment service.
This right, because you can think about it. If I get a house
and I don't have a job, where are you gonna end up? How
many people losing on Mass have every day? I can tell you that I
can't tell you that number, but I can tell you it is estimated in
the last year that we lost over twenty three hundred to opiate overdose. And
I just ran outical that we're losing thirty to fifty people a day. Is
that true? I wouldn't doubt it. You wouldn't doubt it. Right,
just in Massachusetts, just on that one street, honey, just on that
one street. Oh my god. Yeah, it's crazy. Well, and
it's it's not just fentanyl. Now, there's drugs out there called xylazine,
which is essentially a horse trequilizer that I mean, it's again, the drug
supply is a totally different beast, so we could dig into. But it's
again I used to think of the past again, It's not nineteen eighty two
picking up a grammar cocaine, going out with your friends, having a good
time, and everybody's going to come home alive. It doesn't work that way
anymore. They just keep cutting with things that want to make it more addictive,
more addictive, highly addicted. Like heroin. You do a line of
oh, then you're gonna need it because there's something in that that's making you
physically. Cocaine wasn't a physical drug. It was more of a mental drug.
You like that feeling of feeling like we used to call it the wop
wopping Knights like everybody's I love it, blah blah. Now you do a
line of coca and you're dead on the ground, following at the mouth.
I mean you know, yeah, let me take you inside of the mind
of a substance user, which is down on mass f If if I find
out somebody has has overdosed, I want to go to that dealer because I
know that's the stuff that's strong that can get me to the level that I
want to get to. So they push the boundaries now right, like we're
not just using to get high, We're using to get to that point of
I mean death, right. They don't want to die, they want to
get right there. And so that's a piece of the drug supply down there
right now. And that's that's the name of the game that we're trying to
fix. And again, we can't take these drug deals off the streets.
Why I think, Right, But here's what I say, I die from
your drug, you go to jail. I'm dead, you go to jail.
I'm sorry. There's gonna be saying. That's like having a loaded gun
of thirty eight and putting it right in his head. That's how I see
it. You're not wrong, but yeah, you're not wrong, and we
can't take them off the streets. The question is why don't we want to
take them off the streets. Why we bust a couple and we put them
away and we made an example that to me, I believe that goes way
past my pay grade, your pay grade, everybody's pay grade. Somebody makes
money off drugs somewhere, and it's so far up that political chain I don't
even know where it stops and stops. But we're going back to break.
I'm sitting stumbling and listen Tough of Nails on WZ News Radio ten thirty.
And Right Back sponsored by Pillow Windows of Boston, Next Day Molding and Kennedy
Carpet Welcome Back, Top and Dale Sity Stuff on WBZ News Radio ten thirty.
And I'm here with Sammy, I'm here with Nelson, and I'm here
with my amazing guest. Right here. You're supposed to introduce yourself, Adam
Tucker, CEO of the Diiction Treatment Center of New England. There you go,
Adam, tell us if you could boom step your finger, give me
what that looks like for a fix? Yep, that's the question, right,
And I think that's what's so hard. Money's no objects. Money's no
object. Politicians is going to play with you. Yeah, do what they
whatever you want. Yep, you got the you got the Christmas gift of
lifetime. Go ahead, time right, give me it's it's time. It's
time spent with these individuals to learn their story, to learn who they are,
to learn how they got to the point of where they're at right now,
and for somebody to show them love that they've probably never had in their
life, because it's going to be the hardest thing that they've ever dealt with.
And so that's time. From a housing perspective, that's time. From
a medical perspective, that's time. From a therapeutic pic. All right,
I'm gonna hold you that I've seen good kids come out of bad homes.
I've seen bad kids come out of good homes. Right, sure. But
I've always said this, this is just my and I've talked to many doctors
on this, but usually the self medicating starts from something at a young age,
whether it's anxiety, panic, not feeling confluent in your skin, shy
abuse, whether it's been mental, physical, sexual. Okay, I think
most people I've met in my career, my life, and my career,
my personal life, most had those underlying problems, right, and they would
never diagnose properly, and especially the ones that were sexually molested. Sure,
and they ran, yep to run. And it started with hot alcohol as
teenagers than just jump jump jump. Who thought in twenty twenty three we'd be
back to nineteen sixty four in the Boston Commons when I was a little girl,
right, I was born sixty four, so maybe I was five six
years old on the ducks was what were those duck boats? The duck boats?
They're still there. Yeah, But I used to be I used to
be scared as a little girl holding my dad's hand looking at all the protesters.
No they were they were like daisies and on their heads like whatever,
whippie hippies they were all they were all using those type of drugs. And
then I remember watching the movie as another young girl that affected me was Charles
Manson and watching that whole movie, right, oh wow, I never want
to do that, Like, I never want to be that person. I
don't. All those things affected me along the way to stay away from drugs.
And I've never had a drink of alcohol in my life, and those
choices were made because I just saw too much bad with it that why do
I can live vicariously through you? Okay? And I do suffer from panic
disorders since six years old. So if anybody should go there and self medicate,
sure, give me, give me a scotch, give me something to
throw it back and get rid of the panic attack. Right yep. I
think that's what's so confusing about it, right, is it's not It's not
a blanket disease. Right. I can't say if you have panic disorder,
if you have anxiety or bipolar one, or it's gezo effective, that you're
going to choose substances as your vice to be able to escape from that.
That's just not the case. And if it was, it'd be way easier
to treat, right, it'd be it would be your normal disease where you
go to the doctor and they would say this is what you have. You've
got diabetes, this is the treatment for it, and it would lay out
that way. But it comes from so many different directions and maybe no direction
at all as to how it got there, that it's not a one size
fits all blanket and that's the that's the complexity of it all. So there's
not you're not agreeing with mental abuse, not enough love in the house.
Oh I'm absolutely agreeing with Oh you are. I am absolutely So that's how
it starts. Basically, there's a piece of that, right, there's a
piece of that. There's a piece of that. And again, you know,
I don't want to This may seem like a vague answer, but it
can come from all different directions. But then you can get the kid that
grew up in the perfect family with mom and dad that loves him or her
and a good family, good home, upper class and they're still running too,
and they still end up out on the streets. Well, they might
not end up on the streets on mass Ave because mommy and daddy keep fixing
the problem with money because they can well, and let me paint you another
picture. We don't always get to see inside of the homes. So maybe
mommy and daddy had money, and maybe mom and dad were there, But
maybe and mommy and dad weren't there, right, Maybe they worked a long
time, and maybe they had a job that pulled them away, and we
don't know what kind of emotional trauma that calls for that individual, right,
there might be an experience that that kid needed support at that time, and
Daddy was at a conference in California. Daddy didn't choose for that to happen,
right, Daddy didn't mean for that to happen. Nobody meant for that
to happen. But I don't get to choose how I respond to these traumatic
situations. My brain does, right, My brain says, I need somebody
here for me right now, and Daddy's not here for me, right,
And so that's the start. That's one, that's step one, and then
other experiences happen where that leads into that trauma, right, and it builds
and it builds and it builds it. Then I get a substance, and
that substance is my best friend. That substance allows me to get away from
that because I haven't been able to get away from that. So you actually
probably your first love is that substance. It is your best friend, right,
and then it kills you, right, It slowly eats away at you.
And so that's what's so tricky about these individuals getting care, which is,
at one point time, this substance was my best friend, and it
took me out of these situations and this trauma and this turmoil that took place
with me, you know, probably internally on a daily basis, and it
slowly eats away at me. And now you're telling me that I can't have
that vice in my life and I have to essentially, I have to go
back and deal not only do I not get that vice, but I don't
I have to go back and deal with that trauma in order to get cleaned
somewhere. Wow. And then you're telling me that it's a twenty four hour
disease that I have to train every day. The stone has made a song,
Mother's Little Helper, Right, I'm for that song. Right. That
was just to get through having two three kids. Right. Sure, you
know think about this. Back in the day, my mother tells me stories
that after you had a baby, they gave you black beauties you could lose
the weight. And then you got a bunch of women running around in their
sixties running around cleaning everybody's house. Is the parents, the grandparents, they
lived in three decades because they're all wite out on black beauties. Wow.
And their mothers were giving them the black beauties to help them lose the weight.
Yeah, but they didn't know that black beauties were going to be a
dictating They didn't know. You went to the doctors. You were stressed out.
Raised mom went to the doctors. She had three boys fourteen months apart.
Pick up a pack of cigarettes to smoke, a pack of you know,
go smoke cigarettes, so it'll relax you. Sure, here's the xanax.
Welcome to the club. There you go, Adam, Let me ask
you a question, right, has this gotten worse over time when you look
at the statistics right on a graph? On a graph shater, has this
gotten worse over time? Or are we getting in a better place? It's
getting worse, right, it's getting worse. I think I think it was
trending in that direction, naturally. I think COVID expedited it because addiction breeds
itself in isolation. Right, it could be my whole family right here,
right, I could have all the support in the world. But if I
don't think I have it, I'm in that state of isolation, right.
The only thing I need is that vice. So, and that's all we
had for that whole period of time, which was isolation, right, and
so it only you know, I can't tell me how many people that I
know that that picked up again during COVID that had years and years and years
of sobriety due to the fact that they went back to that state of isolation.
So it's only getting worse. The drug supply adds to that. We
had no meetings, Yeah, they were all closed down, all the church
meetings, everything. If you got online you could catch a meeting maybe,
but those people need to be a meetings. But you have to understand something.
You go to a meeting and the minute you walk out the door,
this five drug dealer is hustling you. The minute you walk out the door.
Wow, So you go to a meeting to do the right thing and
then you walk out the door. And I'd come out with some of my
guys. Look, I've left job sites. My guys have needed me,
and you know my kids know this. And I've gone in the middle of
two o'clock, three o'clock in the afternoon and grab one of my guys.
I see is falling, let's go going to a meeting. And that could
have built a really bad reputation for me where I build right Newton Brookline.
Joe Dommley, I didn't give two craps what people thought of me. You
want to think I'm a drug user, Go, I think I'm a drug
user. But I've been asked to leave rooms because somebody would say, she
doesn't use drugs, and the guy riding the room would say, or the
meeting excuse me, But you're making that press uncomfortable. You are a drug
user. No, I'm not a drug user. But see the guy i'm
here with, he's going with me for twenty years. I'm going to stay
right by his side. So tell the person that's got a problem that I'm
in the room to leave the room. Yeah, okay, or get over
it, because I could really here who's in this room, And I'm not
here to talk about anybody that's in this room. So that's her problem or
his problem, not mine. And I'm not leaving here. That's funny,
I mean, that's that's how I started. I'm not in recovery myself with
my childhood best friend at a young age started using, and I did the
same thing. I said, let's go, dude, you're ass in this
room. I'll sit here with you in the same experience. Right, That's
the only thing I knew, Right, I grew up with parents that were
teachers, and I said, I'm gonna take you to class, Bud,
like, let's go right, And so that's all I knew to do.
But it's it's hard, man, being being on the other side of the
boat is hard for the individual that has a substant use disorder, but it's
also hard for the individuals that are loving them from the outside. No,
absolutely, so, Adam, let me ask you this high level what and
what needs to happen in order for us to go down? Right, let's
crime. What needs to happen? Yeah, high level? Yeah, boom
boom boom boom yep, let's crime. Money needs to get needs to get
spent on the on the supply side of things, the drug dealer side of
things, right, we need to there needs to be Hey, hold,
I thought, I'm sorry, guys, I gotta be the rude one.
I'm sinny stumbling you. Listen to the Toughest Nails on WBZ News Radio ten
thirty will be right Back, sponsored by new Brook Realty Group, Boston,
would Smaller Insurance World Auto Body and Tosca Drive Auto Body go into Dante into
the show, Good Constant and welcome back to Tough Snails. On WBZ News
Radio ten thirty and I'm here with Sammy, I'm here with Nelson, I'm
here with Adam. Good Adam, finish up what you're saying just now.
Yeah. Sure. So money needs to get spent on the supply side of
things, right, We need to attack the dealers in the in the drug
supply. Money needs to get spent on housing. Money needs to get spent
on raising individuals to to want to work in this profession. Right, there's
a very difficult profession to work in. The level of burnout is through the
roof Wow, and and and frankly, these are some of the in a
professional terms, these individuals have to have some of the most empathy of anybody
that I've ever seen. So as money's got to get spent on workforce,
and then I think he's got to get spence on I guess what you would
call like, I'm gonna call it quality treatment. Right. There's tons of
treatment out there, There's there's all kinds of access to treatment. But the
end but the care that's actually given to the individuals is it individualized treatment for
that person that you're that you're working with, right right, right, right,
And the other problem here Nelson, and you've got small children, and
where you're from, you have parents like this. I don't think drugs have
ever been something that's impacted your family. But it takes one child, one
one parent, one person family that will bring down the whole family. You
will all come to your knees because of one that's doing drugs, because then
the parents are fighting over that one child, and they're fighting with each other,
and the other siblings are fighting. Every is fighting. One person is
doing all the wrong and the rest are getting effected. That's why they have
something called alan On. And then I did. I went to an alan
On meeting and I'm like, why am I here? Why am I sitting
this meeting. I'm not the one that needs to help, but you do
because your brain gets so messed up because they'll love you, half of your
family, and you see some self destructing and you can't stop it. We
took Samantha, she was eighteen, less than eighteen seventeen, to we made
it do four or five drugs. She didn't do drugs, but we made
her. We wanted her to see and I went with her and her dad
and there was an aisle between us, so her and her father was sitting
next to each other. I had been to enough of these meetings right with
my guys at work, and I'm over on through the aisle, right and
I'm looking at these two crying their rise outyep, because they couldn't handle the
stories. But I don't know about you guys, but I watched a movie
in school. I don't know if you had at Sammy. It was called
Skid Straight. I know of it. I don't know if I've seen it.
I think they stopped playing it in junior high schools and high schools.
But let me tell you, it impacted me to stay straight. Okay,
so it was called Skisvan. I don't know if they still do it.
But Sammy, do you remember going back those days when you went, when
we took those meetings to show you what can go on if you pick up
drugs? Do you remember sending the crying, hearing the stories. It was
a meeting. Of course, you had a meeting. There you go,
and that's real and in your face. And I think every parent, even
if your your kids could be super straight, bring them, expose them absolutely
to the real world. I've got a three four year old and they're coming
to work with that. Come on, let's check it out. You know,
she was exposed. This is what can happen. This will be your
story. So maybe for the next general bringing the next kids up, subject
them to this, let them make better decisions that they maybe can make by
hearing other people's stories. Yeah, there's a huge education awareness DARE, but
I don't think that's the thing anymore. Here was in schools. I don't
think DEAR did much of anything. It's there still, it's pretty few and
far between. I don't know how effective DARE was, but I do think
there's a huge piece right now that you know, education awareness and prevention from
a young age age is going to be part of it, right, Like
it has to be. It's critical. It's a critical piece of this.
And it doesn't even necessarily have to be from you know, I'm gonna scare
you out of your you know, you're soon to be substance use disorder at
some point. But like, here's what it is. Here's sort of how
it manifests, and let's just have the awareness and keep an eye on it.
If something was to pop up, right, you know, I think
you know, any sort of mental illness or emotional you know, trauma at
a young age, Get the individual, get the kid help, right,
Like, let's let's catch it early on before it starts to fester and manifest
to where it gets to a point like this. What's your feelings on the
rehab programs when you start flying your kids to Colorado, your husband to call
it to the mountains, and you're spending one hundred thousand maybe a bit more
a month, right, get a bed? Yep. I've seen more.
I've seen more people stay clean coming out of the Meridian House, which is
a hardcore program. You grab and twilage you're cleaning. You don't get this,
you know boushy Okay, linen beds with your vag covers, right,
yep? Yep? Which program to works the best? I think they could?
Yeah? Well again, I'm gonna give you another vague answer. I
think they can both work the same. I think it's it comes down to
one factor, which is what is that individual's level of readiness to change at
that time? Right? Because if I push you, I don't care where
you go. If I push you in the Meridian House, if I push
you out to the bougie Colorado beds, if you're still what they call pre
contemplative, which I'm not even that. What that means is I'm not even
contemplating changing at this time. Or maybe if I'm contemplative and I'm just kind
of perusing it around my mind. You know where you're going, right,
Like, the individual has to be ready to change in order to do this,
and and and we can't make them. And that's what's so hard from
an outside perspective, which is I love somebody so much that I'm willing to
do whatever I want, whatever I can do for this individual. And truth
of the matter is, I can't do a damn thing about it. So
let's say, okay, somebody goes into McLean's, we get them a bed
for which would happen? We can get you a bed for four days,
get you cleaned out, then we had nowhere to put you, right,
Okay. I did notice they would try the hottest to try to find.
Now, if you had good insurance, it's always easy, right. Sure,
if you don't have a good insurance, it kind of like stuck.
But I didn't notice that they would find a lot of good place up in
Hampshire where there's you can breathe. It's not the city. You're out there
in the wildlife. You know what I mean, you're out there in the
woods, you're out there. Is there something to be said about those type
of programs up there? There is, for sure. I think there's a
big piece of it that where you get treatment needs to be out of the
environment that you got sick. Right, I can't if I got sick on
mass ap and I'm trying to get clean on like, come on, man,
that's not going to work, right, Get me somewhere else, Like
it doesn't have to be big and bougie with a private chef and you know,
you know, all the bells and whistles. But but get me out
of get me out of where I got sick. I get to I get
to take a step back, I get to you. I get to get
out of this environment, and I get to assess everything that's taking place in
that environment. So it's another problem. And I'm not sure, but I
mean, you go you stock going to western mass right, here's a mass
it's very cheap. The land is still cheap. Sure, you go up
to New Hampshire. Land is cheap to be able to do this or is
it? We don't want to not backyard attitude. I think there's a piece
of that. And I think I probably need to clarify when I say you
got to get out of the environment that get that you got sick. You
know, these individuals that we will go back to Massing Casts, right,
they don't have to leave the city. They probably just need to get away
from Mass and Casts where the hustle and bustle is and where they can't get
out of there and what the drug deals just keep coming by there and selling.
Is that what they're doing. I'm sure there's a piece of that.
Right, I'm going to go to wherever the demand is. As a dealer,
you know, it's a business. It's a business, right, So
where they gained the money? Where the dealers getting the money? No,
we know, we know the dealers get the money. Where these people get
the money, Well, they're homeless, they're homeless. I think. I
think what you got to understand about somebody with substan Choose disorder is they are
incredibly resilient and incredibly resourceful, right, I think, And again I'm not
I'm a new bosson boy here, but what I've heard about the mass and
Cast area is that they had these tent villages and they came back and they
wiped them all away, right, they took all their tents away. Now,
what'd you find happened after that? They got all new tints exactly right
right the street, right down the street. Right. So they're incredibly resilient
and incredibly resourceful. Like having a job in an income to fuel substance chose
disorder is not a problem for somebody that has that issue. They get in
the cash, they'll make it work, right, they'll make it work.
And again I don't want to get too far down. They don't have jobs,
so they robbing people? What are they doing? Maybe maybe they you
know, they might be collecting cans and selling recycling. Like, they'll make
it work, right, because that that disease is so strong, I'm going
to fuel it. What are they to do over the winter time? It's
really cold here. That's tough. What's gonna be the answer? Then?
That's tough. It's uh. Again, we we got to get them in
some sort of housing, even if it's just for like, what's the plan
right now to treat their physical needs? I don't know. I don't know
what there is from a political standpoint, right, I can tell you what
what we do at our treatment center. But I can't. I can't tell
you from the political standpoint. I haven't lived here long enough. I haven't
I haven't seen different different mayors. But but I can tell you that that
we're gonna have to get these individuals off the street. Okay, So when
you were working with the White House, Yeah, what EXPERI answers, Well,
that was, man, what what what is that? The lowest on
the TOTEM poll? No, no, no, no, it's uh,
there's there's so many discussions that happened at the same time at the White House,
and what a cool experience that was for me. I got brought on
as again, I'm a therapist by trade. That's how I got into this
game, yep. And I got on to advise their federal level policy from
the perspective of somebody with boots on the ground as a therapist. And so
there's tons of different experiences and conversations that they're having, and I think one
of them is housing that that they're looking into in terms of federal money spent,
never gonna happen. They can't get them the streets, right, But
it's good to dream. But we can all dream. But all that thought
I'm Sidy Stumbling listening to Tampa's Nails on WBZ news Radio. Tempory lead right
back, could stay week It's just to agree and welcome back to Tampas Nails
on WBZ News Radio ten thirty And I'm Sindy. I'm here with Sammy,
and I'm here with Nelson. I'm here with Adam, absolutely Adam. So
tell the people how can they reach out to you? How can they connect
with you? So we are We're the Addiction Treatment Center of New England.
We're set down in Brighton, Massachusetts, on the grounds of the bright Marine
Hospital. We are an outpatient treatment program that has medicated assistant treatments, behavioral
health counseling, recovery coaching, and we even have a program that provides transportation
to us. You can you can look at our website. It's a t
c n E dot net as in the Addiction Treatment Center of New England dot
net. It's got all of our admission criteria and ways to make referrals to
us. And we're there to help and would love to be able to hold
individuals hands and care. Everybody. Have a great, safe weekend. This
is Cindy Stampo on WBZ news radio ten thirty