Hello, everyone, Welcome to the latest episode of Hardwood Knox. We're coming
to you live on the Green Room app hosted by Spotify, coming live right
after the end of the Hawks Bucks game played without Trey Young, played without
janisad the Dakumpo. So it is now three two Bucks after a one twenty
three one twelve victory film four Milwaukee. We'll be talking about that game,
about the Sun's advancing to the NBA Finals for the first time in Chris Paul's
career, and answering some questions that we got from you the listeners. But
before we do any of that, Dan, how's it going. I am,
as you know, a bit frazzled at the moment, but Noah says,
it is eleven o'clock. Hey, we're doing a bonus mailbag for your
weekend travels. That is what's happening here, and we're gonna have a special
podcast to release on Monday for y'all. That's why we're doing this now.
Don't complain about the extra content. Noah, jeez, it was disappointing to
like not have Trey or Jannis in this game, but I obviously care about
their long term health more. You did say though, But well, I
guess how are you doing? I guess that matters more theoretically. I'm doing
all right. Said I've been I've been in a snarky mood all week on
Twitter. I think I've just been easily irritated, and it happened again tonight,
just because I'm tired of the laziest, most cliche form of complaining about
a team's performance, which is just citing a free throw disparity without any context
whatsoever. And just if your team isn't shooting as money as many free throws
as the other team, it must mean that the refs are favoring it and
rigging it, and Adam Silver is pulling the strings behind the scenes and has
a desired outcome that he wants to see the impetus for. This was the
third quarter of the Atlanta Milwaukee game, in which Milwaukee shot twelve free throws
in Atlanta shot zero. So you knows as a Hawks fan, I tend
to have a lot of Twitter follows who are Hawks fans as well, and
almost universally I see complaints about that disparity. Did you watch the game?
Did you see Milwaukee attacking the basket on every possession? Crashing the offensive glass,
having I believe six to one offensive rebound disparity in that quarter. Did
you see Atlanta settling for contested jumper after contested jumper every single time down the
floor. If they got a switch on to Brook Lopez, here comes a
contested step back three point or with no hope of drawing contact. The Bobdon
Bobdanovitch flagrant foul when he closed out on Chris Middleton in the corner was ridiculous.
I'll give the Atlanta fans that, but this quarter could have had an
even larger free throw disparity. And just citing that twelve to zero number without
providing any context whatsoever or looking at how the teams played, it's just lazy.
It's just a cliche and it shouldn't happen. It's ridiculous. That wasn't
very snarky. I think that was more kind of spot on what are you
expecting leading into Game six? It feels like it entirely depends on who's available,
right I mean, if Trey Young is going to play dealing with a
bone bruise right now, he was questionable for this game. He went through
shoot around and warm ups and was then ruled out, so clearly like there's
some possibility of that happening in game six, then Atlanta has a much better
chance. You know, obviously if Jannis plays, then everything changes and we
have no idea what to expect for that timetable. But if these current rosters
as they stood for Game five are in play again, I just I don't
see a path to victory for this Atlanta team. They don't have a counter
to an aggressive Drew Holiday. No. I was telling you Dan before we
started recording, Like, if Drew Holiday is the key to everything Milwaukee is
doing on offense and probing into the pain and setting up everyone and initiating everything
at the point of attack, and Atlanta has no personnel to stop him without
sacrificing bodies on the wings, Like why is Chris Donn on this roster?
It feels like there's issues on defense. There's issues with the interior defense against
Brook Lopez, who is far more aggressive in Game five. There are issues
on offense because ultimately, without Young, who is very much the head of
the offensive snake on a nightly basis, where is the production coming from.
Bogdanovich had a phenomenal shooting game. He was really the lone bright spot for
Atlanta in this Thursday night contest. But you have Lou Williams initiating, you
have Bogdanovich initiating, you have Kevin Hurder initiating, and none of those guys
are who you want to get everyone involved And the strength of this Atlanta team
is how diverse the offensive attack can be. But you need someone who can
set it up. And there isn't an answer to that question unless Young is
healthy. So unless the availability of the stars changes, it's not going to
go well for the Hawks. I don't think it's probably in their best interest.
Like even if Joanna's and Trey are both back, I think that's a
good thing for it for Atlanta. Do you, my writing teachers, Let's
go from Tony welcome, Welcome to the room? Is so after Atlanta spent
this money in free agency on Bogdanovitch, on Gallo, don Chris Dunn himself,
he granted he was injured for a long time, but they have not
They've just not used him basically is and he was never going to be the
initiator for them. Is it a concern for you that they don't have that
or do you envision them if they're healthier next season, even Hunter, because
he was doing people forget he was an on set candidate for most improved Players,
being more stuff off the dribble. But I don't think I think Bogdanovitch
would come closest to being the guy, closest to being able to run lineups
without Trey, And so if he's not that guy and he is banged up,
but if he's not that guy, then you still don't have that guy.
No, I think you need to search long and hard for a viable
backup point guard because Trey is ultimately irreplaceable, and this roster has built around
that irreplaceability. But even when Bogdanovich is playing well, even when DeAndre Hunter
is available, you still need that second point guard, and it's just not
there right now. Donne has not panned out, whether it's because of the
injuries that prevented him from really being worked into the rotation. They made the
move for Lou Williams, who had a great scoring night but a lot of
turnovers. Tony's suggesting Rajon Rondo for Atlanta, and I guess like maybe that
would have been better in this particular situation. As awful as he as he
played throughout the postseason, but like he kind of got externally for that.
I can't I can't stop laughing about that one, Tony. I appreciate that.
Do you think, well, I'm gonna be honest, do you think
Rona wouldn't have helped them here? Right? No, he wouldn't have helped
him. I don't think. Yeah, I mean he wouldn't have helped him.
He might have been like more useful in this specific scenario when you just
need someone to get everyone involved. But even then, like there are so
many shortcomings. I'm not sure that's a great idea. Hey, look,
Cameron Paine's music might be playing during the offseason. That could be someone that
they would target. I mean, I don't think he would ultimately like kind
of run it back. You just need that one supplementary piece. This is
not that an indictment of the core. It's you need moves around the periphery
because you have to be able to account for a situation like this where Young
isn't available for a game or two, or to prevent him from needing to
play forty minutes a game. My thing is is it kind of is an
indictment on the core. At this point because the money they spent. Look,
they're further than anyone expected. I don't want to hear. You know,
we did the whole viral asterisk rant between you and I last time.
But they're here and so they're close. But the fact that that's still after
what they did last offseason, that this is their biggest hole. And again,
it wouldn't have mattered Trey Young sits out. You have someone to run
the offense. It wouldn't have mattered like Trey Young. Losing Trey Young,
even against the buck seams doesn't have be honest, you're screwed. But overall,
the fact that this and they did tread water up points in the season
without Trey Young. But the fact that this is still kind of your problem.
I don't want to say it's an indictment of last offseason, but I
actually think it's a it's a pretty big deal. It is a pretty big
deal. There's there's no doubt about that. I do like Tony's more serious
suggestion of t J McConnell for at Land and free agency. That would be
a fun fit, but both for the point of attack defense and for the
initiation skill. You know, not a super glamorous signing, but I think
that's the kind of move that these Hawks need to be looking at. It's
also it's also a little bit tough to get a full picture because as much
focus as there's been on injuries throughout this postseason, I'm not sure that there's
been enough attention paid to just how injured this Atlanta team has been throughout the
entire season, because it did prevent continuity, It did derail the Hunter improvement
and the Cam Reddish experiments and all of these pieces who are now attempting to
play integral roles in such a high pressure situation and really adjusting on the fly.
So maybe, had the injury bug not been quite so pervasive throughout the
regular season, we aren't really having this conversation because the team has figured out
better ways to initiate offense. I want to ask you this last question though,
and I'm not trying to I feel like this is kind of raining on
the Hawks progress this year, which is unfair a little bit. But with
the Wings, when you look at Cam Reddish, Kevin Herder, DeAndre Hunter
and how close all of them are getting to being on their second contracts,
is this a point where you consider maybe consolidating those using those in addition to
other stuff to find the piece that you're talking about, or you're very much
Tony East mentions TJ McConnell in free agency, you would rather go that route
and have what projects is like this. Yeah, they've even gotten like good
minutes from kungrua points during the postseason. That's like a twelve. I've been
really impressed with him. I've been really impressed with him. So theoretically you're
at the point then we would be like this, you're going to prioritize depth
rather than trying to consolidate into maybe someone who's a because I don't know that
you can. We saw it in Phoenix this year, but there was also
one Phoenix you could have Chris Paul or Devin Booker on the court at one
time every game. The Hawks don't have that yet that like it's you know,
it's Bogdanovitch. Isn't the same? Gallop certainly isn't the same. So
would you be opposed to using those guys, maybe not alone, but consolidating
some of that young talent or do you think that's sort of an over pay
when you're talking about someone to supplement Trey Young's offense rather than getting this other
star. I would be good with that. I mean, I think what
you're suggesting is like packaging together Reddish Hurter and a couple of picks for like
Damian Lillard. And I think that's a great idea. That's too much.
I can give you the subtext. I can read your subtext here. You
know, I have the benefit of looking at you on Skype while we're recording
this, so I see I see it in your eyes. All I'm going
to say is, if you're doing that deal Portland, how many like Portland
probably to send you back Robert Covington and n CJ. McCollum too, Like,
that's way too much value to give up for Dame. But in all
seriess I do wonder if Atlanta is kind of a sneaky inclusion on the star
market, if someone you know, Bradley Beal becomes available, do they Does
Atlanta have enough pieces that could be packaged together in a consolidation trade to look
at that kind of option. I think they would be, just because of
all They're more likely to now because of how these pieces have shown out.
I mean, we saw Hurd perform in a big game we've seen, you
know, Reddish is back and at least doing something. Now. Who knows
what to expect from John Collins on a nightly basis at this point, but
the pieces are there. I'd be curious is does that skew too much towards
all offense? But I guess it doesn't matter because Bradley beyond try young or
not what you would consider two way players, and that's where it would sort
of run into some issues. But I would be all for the Hawks going
that route. To be clear, I would as well if nothing else would
be fun. I think we have to pour one out for the Suns before
we get to we have a oh past Cassiakam in Atlanta that I like that.
That's an interesting one. That's just does I mean, does he really
give you a secondary shock creation or is he just gonna dribble and spin I
call it. He could spin his way around a lot of stuff. Yeah,
just not that suggestion was all of Tony East, longtime friend of NBA
math and both of us. Tony, if you want to speak at any
point were we are more than willing to have you on as well, just
so you know up and I'm especially called by request. Yeah, how's it
good. I'll talk for a few minutes. I'm about to record my own
pod, so I need to warm up. That's perfect. Yeah, exercises,
Yeah yeah, plug away, No, I will. I will not
be plugging, but I will. It's locked on Pacers listen to it.
I've been on it, so they definitely slum it from time to time.
But it's a fun podcast. Yeah. When when this Warriors Pascal stuff came
out, I was like, wow, why would they trade Pascal? But
irrelevant to that, I thought about Pascal and the Hawks. I was like,
wow, that actually kind of makes sense for for Pascal in the Hawks
at least. I haven't thought about it for the Raptors. But I thought
it was a fun time to jump in and say that because I haven't had
a chance to hear that thought anywhere. So what are the hot I love
that. Yeah, you're gonna reset Collins? Yeah? So oh no,
how would you replace John Collins? Wait? What's the framework here? Let's
let's talk through this. I just assumed this was a situation. So first,
your Toronto landing number four probably incentivizes them in this scenario and be like,
hey, we're gonna start over and Pascal is going on twenty eight?
Right? Is he twenty seven? What is he so you don't necessarily view
him as part of your core? And why wouldn't you pair him with John
Collins? They compliment each other. No, or do you think you're not
getting enough rebounding up front or something? Messiah FROMO will you please listen to
my offer very quickly? I'm ready? Okay, Danilo Gallinari for money purposes,
very very minimal important value here, Cam Reddish the twentieth pick in the
upcoming NBA draft and DeAndre Hunter? Do we have a deal? Or have
I oversold my hand? I thank you? That's enough for Toronto? Yeah,
you're right, but then what else can the Hawks do? That doesn't
make that just scary? For ku? Was he in that deal? I
didn't hear his name. No, I feel like I feel like that's close
though. I think Hunter's trajectory at the beginning of the season at least makes
it close enough to the point that you can probably throw in a few future
draft considerations and make it happen. If Toronto is sold on going the rebuilding
route, and if that's the case, like, yeah, I'm good with
that. Okay, there we go. See the other thing with the Hawks,
and you guys were kind of hinting at this before we post mortemized and
completely it is like I would worry about them running too fast, like you
really over exceed expectations in your one. So they do something like that and
then it doesn't help and it doesn't help them enough and they don't have the
asset pool anymore. But Pascal is close to being the guy you do it
for, so I thought it was very interesting. I do think he's a
guy you can do it for. But yeah, I do think like this
roster. My only rebuttal to that point is that this roster feels like it
has reached a point where you can kind of straddle those two timelines. There
is enough youthful intrigue that you can continue to progress that way because you're not
throwing in every chip even I mean, even in this scenario, you still
have a cong with there, you still have Hurder, you have more room
to resign Hurder. You don't know what you're going to do with John Collins.
So I feel like Atlanta has become the rare team that can kind of
get ahead of its skis a little bit because it has that fallback option.
That's true. That's definitely true. And I think Dan, we've got to
talk about the Collins u Saka potential fit too, which is like good enough
that you could even swing that, and then if that doesn't work, you
have the trades to do something else. Yeah. Yeah, unless you're moving
Collins is part like he needs to be on bigger money for you to move
him, and he will be obviously now. But like signing trades are weird,
so like next season mid season, if it's not working out and he
passes his you know, trade by date or ken trade date, that would
be super interesting the other player and Oklahoma City fans will get mad at me
precially. But Shay Giljisavsander would be so perfect for this team. Well,
I mean yeah, I feel like you'd be perfect for most teams. But
I'm saying like, because people get too caught up in timeline, and I
very much recognize that a twenty two year old Shay is your timeline. At
the same time, if you get a big enough offer, he's about to
be maxed out. You don't. You have all these picks that can kind
of either compliment it's max salary or complicate your your situation. So if you
get a large enough offer, I would consider it, especially because and I'm
not a doctor, so this is like the worst take in the world.
Whenever I see like plant or fascia injuries, I get super super nervous.
And so if Toronto, let's say Toronto came and said we'll give you number
four Adnobi for Shay at number sixteen and like Kendrick William or something, I
might I'm gonna consider that. If I'm Oklahoma City and I'm not gonna lie.
If the Hawks through the bag at me and the bag being hunter picks
galore O kung Wu, I'm gonna I'm gonna think about it. I mean,
you said the magic word for Sam Presti already, which is picks.
So once that enterest the equation, who knows what the hell is gonna happen.
Yeah, he's gonna campaign to an increase to twenty roster spots per team
at some point, I'm assuming, right. But Tony, before you get
to go record, you want to answer one of our mail back questions for
us? Oh yeah, is it about the patients? By chance? I
have no idea. Dan has access to all of them, So he's gonna
throw something your way. I like, oh, do you care? We
don't have a Paciers question? Which no, I don't talking about other teams.
I talked about the Pacers enough. Okay, where do you rank?
This question comes from? Well, I'm not gonna say where it comes from
because then it spoils it. Where do you rank de Jean Day Murray on
the point guard list? And this comes from j Da Warri? So wow,
uh, I don't have a list of point guards in front of you,
but not baby top twenty? Is he the best point guard on his
own team? I'm a big Derek White guy. Is that a hot take
for the show? No? Also because DeMar derozen is technically yeah, true,
he's also a point guard. Now how about this. Let's let's frame
it. Let's let's make you throw him on the Crystal Basketball scale here.
Oh oh okay, yeah, I can do that is eight All Stars,
nine all Star, nine is all Star eight is high on starter. I
think I do seven or eight. Let me think about that. His defense
is like phenomenal. I don't think like if I could write about anything,
I would I would want to write a piece about his defense at some point
because it's very good, but his offense is not not that like like unrefined
self creators are the hardest players to grade, you know, because you never
know if it's gonna come around, and they could just be like like Eric
Bledsoe on offense forever and that's not good. So I like to Jontay,
but there, you're kind of older for a young player, which is an
you know what I'm saying, and younger than Derek White, still, right,
Derek White is very old for a young player. Yeah, definitely,
but you know, he's definitely good, like solid starter for a long time,
but I don't think he'll ever reach the All Star level. So yeah,
seven or eight on the on the crystal ball scale, I'm in the
same boat. I think I'm leaning a little more strongly towards the eight,
just be because of this improvement he showed as a finisher this year, like
getting getting to the basket a little less frequently, but he could knock down
everything in that range, whether he was finishing with power or using an increasing
arsenal of tricks around the sixty four point nine percent within three feet, like
that was a big stride from the last three years or the first three years
of his career, I should say, but yeah, I think that's the
right range. I think also just now, I was just gonna say,
his decision making as an initiator has gotten better. Part of that might be
because they've given some of it to de Rosin, so you've seen his turnover
rate sort of go in the right direction. But even in transition, he
feels like he's smarter there. And I think, you know, this was
year two of him shooting forty five plus percent between ten feet and the three
point line, So there's like there's that in between game there. And I
do think I said this about Marcus Smart before he kind of turned. A
willingness to shoot threes is important, even if they're not falling at a high
clip. And so the fact that this season he attempted three point three p
thirty six minutes, not a ton, but a career high and is continuing
upwards, that absolutely matters. I just don't know if he's ever going to
be the guy that hits these, you know, these off the dribble jumpers,
like even is in between looks. They feel like very slow paced and
methodical, and you can see them coming from a mile away where the Rosan
can use more of his changes of directing directions and is a little bit quicker
with his with a shot motion. Yeah, he's got a little bit of
Oladipo Eidis where there's like one in every games where like the second he catches
the ball, like I can tell you what he's gonna do. It's so
weird. There's some players where they just have those games where like even you
guys and I like as fans not even playing in the game, or like
card Course scouts were like, oh, I know he's gonna shoot like on
this touch. You know, you just know. And Depot is really bad
about that. Murray is a little bit bad about that, especially when he's
got that slow ish MIDI game. It's not there being a floater. I
think he could potentially reach all start level at some point, but he doesn't
at all. Like that help carres Lavert's developments as he got that floater and
then he was way harder to guard on his drive, so that would help
him on too. I really do. I do like him. He is
good, Like watching him in Pearl Defend pick and rolls is outstanding. They're
so good at that. But his offensive ceiling just scares me just enough to
not know where to put him. As soon as you said oladipo itis,
my knee started hurting, and then I realized it just as I was sitting.
Funny, I still keep thinking that he wants to max this off season.
I'm like, oh boy, oh oh, right out there with Dennis
Shrewder wanting nine figures in his next conference too. I aspire to have that
much self confidence. Confidence Tony. We did actually just get a Pacers question
to come. Oh really, okay, I'll answer a favorite question. It's
literally three words comes from Rob Sager Turner or Sabonis. Oh boy, oh
boy? What have you guys seen the video? Just so you know,
we only have like thirty forty more minutes of recording. Have you guys seen
the video of the comedian who's like pretending to be an IKEA worker making fun
of people who supers in the store. It was very funny. So I
have a screen cap of that video of the part where he says and what
do your eyes say? And I know that if you haven't watched the video,
you have no idea what that's in reference too. But I have that
screen cap because some dabs. I use it for basketball analysis, and it's
kind of strange because I really like Myles Turner. I think he's very good,
especially in that context. Incredible defender, and then this year he played
a lot with the bench, and his on off numbers are ridiculous, and
Yorker and ball really suited his play style and he really popped off the page
and had more confidence and was a very talented player. And now all these
people are thinking, hey, maybe Miles Turner is a little better than Sabonus,
or he's got more value of his team and they could trade Sibonus if
it's big Hall, And sometimes I just want to reply with the what do
your eyes say? Meme? Because when you watched the Pacers, Sus is
just better. He's just a better player. Like he has the ball a
lot, and people to point to his touchoos as a negative, but like
he does something good with it all the time, with his handoffs or his
screens or good finishing or he's even got a decent jumper from fifteen feet and
he's a good defender of centers. When they made him chase guys around the
perimeter, altis along which I'm sure you guys read a bunch of sets about
he was miserable, but he's a good defender of centers, really likes his
team, likes being a pacer, and it's just a better player, right,
So it's what's your eyes say for me? So my answer is is
Demonte spunts, he's better. That said, I'd really like Miles Turner,
So it's I hate answering that question, but it's a honest for me.
My follow up question there is are you aware that Miles Turner and Dan are
best friends? Now? Oh god, no, Miles Turner. Miles Turner
was so mad when I didn't put him on my projected top three ballot for
Defensive Player of the Year after a month into the season, and I did
it rather than a live look as where I thought you about this. I
remember that. Yeah, it turned out I was right, but I do
regret the way I approached it because there was way too much confusion on Twitter
and the Pacers account was mad. Miles Turner was mad. So I regret
that whole situation. But I'm sure that is the most common question that you've
been asked by people in general who aren't like nitty gritty into the pacers.
My stands on it. I agree with everything you say. My other thing
is like, is it weird to think that you can get more value for
Turner on the trade market than Sabonis? Because for Sabonis to be most effective,
he has to be allotted a certain usage, a certain number of touches
for his impact to really be felt, whereas Turner because of his defense and
then the fact that he just faces the Florida position, where that is still
a commodity even when you're not shooting the average from three, that teams are
going to be more inclined to give up more assets for him rather than Sabonis.
Yeah, it's interesting, like Turner basically is plug and play right,
like he shoots three is well enough, especially for a center to fit on
any team. And when you're a top whatever, you know, I don't
want to get you in more trouble, but top whatever, high number,
a low number position on defense, right like he is defending centers or defending
in general. Yeah, you have value on literally any team. You can
play on any team. You don't need that many touches, and you'll be
super important. So that maybe because teams will be competing in a potential trade
for him that ups his value, But to me it's a bonus. It's
like, sure, maybe only sixteenths could really use the seventeen, but his
value tho seven teams is extremely high. Like to me, Vuchovich is like
his value right, he's younger but is probably a little bit better. And
Boots just got two first Wendell Carter and the Salary, and I would say
they have similar fits on other teams. I don't think Turner's fetching you that
much, so I would say Sibonus still has more value. That said,
I understand why Turner does have more value than I get him credit for.
Sometimes New Orleans and says, yeah, New Orleans calls you though and says,
we'll give you Nikkil, Alexander Walker and number ten for Turner. Oh
I do that, Yeah, I would do that. I would definitely do
that. That's good because I just wrote about that exact trade that saved the
Pacers money and I would definitely do that. It's a great litmus test for
you there, Dan, that's a trade up really bad, like all my
mentions and like, how can they trade up? How can they trade up?
And I'm like, it's kind of hard because they'd have to trade Turner
to trade up, but then they just get a better pick, like what
they don't need him and thirteen to do it, So it's kind of awkward,
but that would kind of solve the problem about They'd get a young player
and a thing, so maybe that's the solution. Thanks damn, no problem.
You feel free to feel free to steal that one, because when people
get mad at me, I'm just gonna say that Tony East Pacers podcaster indorsed
the ship out of this to say, I did, I did, Okay,
I have to go yell about ja car Sampson the one that makes Thank
you for having me on your on your black room for a couple of minutes.
Thank you so much for the patience Tyler while we were talking to Tony,
but we do have you on now. How's it going all right?
Thank you guys for having me. Just got a quick question for you guys.
So do you guys think uh injuries have ruined this year's playoffs? Like,
I know it's part of the game, but I don't think I've ever
seen this many injuries, you know, to the biggest stars and like in
previous years, I don't remember this many injuries, but like, what do
you guys think? Yeah? For sure. So first, thank you for
the question, Dan, Do you want me to let you go ahead with
this one? Yeah? So this is a good time to plug the Hardware
Knox podcast. If you haven't subscribed before, please do. The last episode
I went on rant that also went I don't know if you can call it
viral on Twitter, but there was a lot of talk about it on Twitter
and I posted it. I'm a big believer in not ascribing an asterisk to
any season because of injuries, because, just as you mentioned, every team
went through shit. I do think what's interesting about this is he kind of
mentioned did injuries ruin the playoffs? Because you're not necessarily trying to say this
title doesn't count, but it's a game Like there's a difference there, Yeah,
because you're there's a distinction because the Hawks and the Bucks were both missing
a star, you rather would have seen them. I've found the playoffs wildly
entertaining, probably because of the randomness. I'd prefer not to have the injuries.
And to be clear, when you look at players who've actually missed games,
let's not even throw people who are just battling injuries like Devin Booker's broken
nose. You can build two super teams worth of players that have missed games,
multiple games with injuries during these playoffs or let's say a critical game like
you know Jannis right now. So I think that matters, and it's a
talking point in the context of, hey, maybe we've rushed this season,
because it's not just about the teams that had a short layoff. Where you
look at Lebron and ad in Los Angeles and those fans with a lot of
those Lakers fans, I'll say, want to put an astrict on this title.
That's gonna be the reason why I don't actually give that much validity,
but I would absolutely they have the shortest offseason in sports history. They in
the heat, so you can absolutely argue that screw them over. But even
teams that didn't have the you know, there were teams with extended layoffs,
the Hawks were among them. You had those guys all of a sudden ramp
up. I'm not saying after basically going from yeah, they were doing stuff,
but there's a difference from doing stuff on your own in limited capacity,
Because what were these guys doing when they had limited access to Jim's maybe equipment
for the non stars. Trey Young was randomly and like a packed open gym
at Oklahoma, I think at the height of the pandemic. But whatever,
So I'm not saying that contributed to his ankle injury now when we're that far
down the line, but it definitely could have impacted the regular season or just
put extra wear and tear that quick ramp up and then the second half of
the schedule for some of these teams that missed games during the first half had
them rescheduled, and then the second half just seemed like it was heavier for
teams in general. So the data that's come out feels conflicting because if you
look at in street clothes, I think they've come out with stuff that it
says there's been an uptick in injuries. I think the NBA released a statement
that basically said there wasn't or that these players actually had more time off and
jen because of the pandemic. Pandemic time off wasn't time off. That was
the like some of the dumbest shit I've ever read. I probably shouldn't be
so heated about it because I can't pinpoint exactly when and where it came from.
But that was an actual thing that was released by an entity that should
not have released it. So there's it's a confluence of factors here. I
think it sucks these injuries. It feels like there's been more of them to
these star players. I don't know what the contributing causes. I'm just speculating
suggestive. I still don't think it's ruined the playoffs because the stories for me,
Trey Young before his injury has probably done more than any player in the
playoffs to build up his reputation. Devin Booker probably comes pretty close, but
I think he kind of turned perception just based off the season, the Sun's
hat and even before then you look back at the bubble, but he was
still right out there. That's a great storyline. CP three making the Finals,
winning in the Conference finals, just the numbers he put up, like
some of the games the Nuggets series, his Western Conference Finals game six.
It also kind of sucks what happens to the Clippers where there Paul George basically
said, we would have won if we had surged Zubos and Quas. Maybe
I wouldn't have picked them too, But was also there is it was really
cool to see a furtherance of the I guess we call them resurgences or renaissances
of Nick Patum, Reggie Jackson, like, those were guys that really stepped
up for them. So I think in there were there were interest points,
tantalizing storylines that came up in lieu of having everybody healthy. But of course,
ideally we don't have these injuries, but I think it far from ruin
the playoffs. And maybe I'm I feel like casual basketball fan has tossed around
too, and I'm say, look, Tyler's listening to this podcast, so
you're a diehard NBA fan. If you're sensing that, then it's definitely concern
amongst the hoops nerds. I just think there's been enough entertainment and enough interesting
things to follow that no these injuries, while again infinitely lamentable, they haven't
ruined the playoffs. For me, I'm right there with you where I wish
that none of the injuries had happened. It sucks that we haven't gotten to
see some of these stars, but honestly, like tonight's Game five between Atlanta
and Milwaukee was really the first time where I felt like there was a diminished
product because of those injuries. Like, yeah, the Nets weren't at full
strength, Yeah, the Clippers weren't at full strength. There were some really
entertaining basketball games in both of those series, as there have been in basically
everyone. I feel like almost every series has been compelling. We've had nightly
entertainment just in terms of close games and comebacks, both within games and with
series. We saw Kevin Durant attempt to reassert himself as maybe the best player
in the NBA because the other stars in Brooklyn were injured, and it produced
that overtime masterpiece of a game against Milwaukee in the previous round. Like,
these playoffs have been so compelling, they featured so many breakouts, the ones
that Dan hinted at and mentioned more explicitly. DeAndre Ayden is another one where
you know, we got to see him emerge because he needed to with other
guys ailing a little bit. It's just one example after another of how deep
the talent pool is in the NBA and how competitive and entertaining these games can
be even without the most marquee names available. So I totally understand the question.
I totally understand why people are frustrated, upset that they haven't been able
to watch some of the best players in the world play basketball, some of
their favorite players in the world play basketball. But it's still been a really
entertaining product. If anyone has questions, they can throw it in the chat.
We're asked to speak when you have other questions from listeners, the I
already lost it or so oh. This comes from Ranish A zem As was
Julius Randall's season of fluke? Or is this his new norm? Of course,
his usage might change if the Knicks get another star, he adds in
parentheticals, I think the answer has to lie somewhere in the middle. I'm
guessing the impetus for a lot of those feelings are that Randall really struggled in
the first round against the Hawks. Couldn't shoot to save his life, couldn't
play defense. It was just a disaster of a series for him in a
matchup that, based on the regular season results, felt like one that he
should have been able to capitalize upon. But we also saw so much demonstrable
evidence throughout the regular season that it was legitimate growth. I mean, the
shots that he became comfortable taking, those turnaround fade away jumpers on the base
lines, the pull up threes, everything that he was doing, you know,
waiting until the last second of a jump to release a cross court pass.
They were high risk, high reward plays, which naturally creates more variants
and lends itself to the bottom falling out like it did in the first round
against the Hawks. But I don't think that that means that we can't expect
him to play at an All Star or All NBA level going forward, because
you could see throughout the entirety of the season how much he was able to
change New York's culture, to make people around him better, to elevate his
game through huge skill leaps, which tend to be more sustainable than anything else.
He's probably not going to have another season where every one of those fade
away shots that he was taking managed to find the bottom of the net.
But he can make that shot, and that's the growth that is more sustainable.
I agree with everything you said and the thing that I'm looking at,
though, Julius Reynold's been solid for a while, Like when you just look
at dating back to his final season in Los Angeles, it felt like he
was even underrated then, where they were just you know, they obviously ended
up with Lebron James during free agency then, but he was They had the
opportunity to keep him in twenty eighteen free agency and they didn't, So it
does seem like he was wildly undervalue. Then. The thing that I think
is the biggest outlier here, it's not even the passing, just because if
you put the ball in his hands that much and play him to almost thirty
eight minutes a game like, yeah, six assists is not out of the
question. And look, he had the turnovers to go along with it,
like his when you look at his US, it's like, yeah, his
turnover rate wasn't astronomical. It was, you know, one of the better
ones of his career. But just like the media, that doesn't stand out.
It's the three point shot making and the overall tough jump shot making.
He made more step back threes this year and in all of his previous seasons
combined. And I know that shot has become more of a staple in the
NBA, But when you're also shooting forty one point one percent from three's overall,
that you know, that's something I'm going to be watching long term for
them. I think there's a chance that his job becomes easier if they could
get him a secondary initiator next to him. Is that RJ. Barrett?
Is it training for someone? It's probably not signing anyone in free agency that's
on the market, Like that's not Lonzo Ball might make his might help the
Knicks actually run and improve the spacing. That's the other thing. This team
shot the ball well from three, could stand to shoot more, and some
of their lineups you had Randall a traditional big, and then sometimes like if
Peyton was on the court or just another non shooting wing, it could get
a little crampy in the half court. And so there are things they could
do to help him doing sure that his job gets easier and these numbers sustain.
I am just specifically watching though, the three point and just overall jump
shot making from him, and I do think a big part of it is
maybe it goes down. But if they want Julius Randall to play, I
don't think he's Look, I'm not a big fan of Oh he plays in
New York, so he got more consideration if he didn't play in New York.
I don't know if he makes second team All NBA this season. I
think he deserved third team All NBA, and I'm not you know, I
don't quibble over how high he made it, but I don't know that that
can be his new normal because second team All NBA implies you're one of the
fifteen best players in the league because the positions are wonky and everything. I
don't know if that's sustainable. We have to wait and see. I think
he's earned the benefit of the doubt in the context of, Hey, this
could be the second best player on a really good team, and maybe maybe
a on a title contender. I don't know yet. He definitely looks like
he could be like a third best player on that type of team. It's
just this type of workload. It wasn't completely new the level of shot making,
though, and that's become I'm stepping over my own words now. That's
the biggest outlier, and so I'm interested to see how or whether that sustains.
We do have multiple speaker requests right now, so I'm gonna tag in
the first one, which is Jason Meredith. Welcome to the show. How's
it going today? It actually a Nick fan, but I'm going to ask
you a question about the Trailbazers because the Nicks are just not really saying anything,
so there's not really I can ask you. You keep reading, I
keep reading, everyone keeps saying that Damian Leonard's like putting gonna put pressure on
the front office, and you know, barring really a Ben Simmons trade,
what I don't really know what they can do, Like what what trades do
you think the front office for the Trail Blazers can actually make to really improve
this team with outside of like a Ben Simmons trade. I think Ben Simmons
would be target number one because the CJ McCollum plus stuff framework for Ben Simmons
has been out there. If they refuse to break up to see H McCollum
and Damian Lillard back court, I kind of understand it because I think CJ
mcllums would come underrated. I will say, if you want to keep Norman
Powell and you believe in Anthony Simmons, he has never been more expendable to
you, You're not going to pay all four of these dudes McCollum, Lillard,
Si and Powell. And if you can keep if I ad him,
and if I threw this to you very quickly. I tell you of a
McCullum or you can pay Norman Powell and Anthony Simons combined what you're paying McCullum.
Are you still taking McCullum, Yes? Absolutely? Is it by wide
margin? I think so? All right? Fair enough, but I think
you need to be more open to moving him. I don't know how attractive
he is. And I think the fact that when Ben Simmons's trade value is
at his Nate year, when you talk to Sixers fans and people, they
would rather float it into next season to see if they could reboot Ben Simmons's
trade value and accepting C. J. McCullum says, it all about probably
the defensive challenges he injects into your system. And even though he's look,
he's a bucket and he's proven time to get into the playoffs that he could
do it. What they could do is you have Yusef Nurkis's this spiring deal.
You do have Simons and during a contract year you can trade first round
picks starting in twenty twenty three, can you do a smaller scale but still
impactful deal that appreciably improves your defense? And the names I have circled here
as just suggestions, and I don't know how, I don't know what necessarily
the framework would be. Larry Nance Jr. Would be fantastic for this team
when you look at everything he does defensively, can switch, can probably give
you some minutes at the five, but he can also play against Nurkics or
another five. Jonathan Isaac would be fantastic coming off that ACL injury. I'm
wondering if the Magic would be willing to sell medium where if you're giving them
two first simons, you know, are you probably get a third team in
there to see can you get something for nurkicch or Covington that you send back
to Orlando. Those types of names where none of them are stars, but
they're really high end role players and they can help you one on one defensively,
because ultimately that's what this team lacks is Robert Covington is an excellent team
defender. What Portland needs is probably more of a Josh Richardson. How gettable
is he? Can you do that without giving up Covington or cj or Dane.
Of course, they need that type of player to really boost their defense
in the playoffs because there might be ways to get by with just nurk in
the middle of the regular season become playoff time, like you need. The
Jazz showed it they still needed someone aside from Royson Neible to tackle those bigler
assignments that boy on Bodonovitch doesn't have to do it, and they have the
shot making between Powell between Dane, between CJ. It's I think they're closer
than people realize, but they need that defensive lynchpin and I don't think it's
Nurkitch. I would be willing to trade him in a heartbeat if you could
get it. I have trouble seeing Jonathan Isaac being moved by the Magic,
and I feel like we have to clarify that we're talking about twenty nineteen twenty
Josh Richardson and not current season Josh Richardson because those teams effectively. But that
helps the Blazers, right, that helps the Blazers because it's definitely it's probably
gonna opt in and maybe his value is lower, but yeah, I should
have prefaced with and look, I'm probably talking more so about twenty eight twenty
nineteen Josh Richardson will be fair because he wasn't exactly a fantastic in Philly.
Fair enough. I'm move on to our next speaker though, which is Tavish
Logan. And if I mispronounced that, please correct me in my apologies.
But you are now on the show. How's it going? Hey? You
guys? There, we are here. How are you hey? I'm doing
great. So I had two questions for you. I know you guys are
talking sort of long term stuff and my second question is sort of a hopeful
question. But the initial question is who do you guys think the Sun should
be rooting for in this next game? Do they want a longer series or
do they want, you know, like a quicker game. How much you
know, injuries have been a huge part of the playoffs, so how much
does extra rest affect their performance? Yeah? With that one, I do
think that it is in Phoenix's best interest to have the Eastern Conference Finals go
seven games because this second half of the season has been so condensed, and
the playoffs and particular have been so condensed where there isn't the typical, you
know, occasional two days of rest. It's one day off, it's playing
the next day. It's one day off, it's playing the next day.
And given that You're still trying to make sure that Chris Paul is in fully
functioning form and that Devin Booker has had as much time as possible for his
broken nose potentially twice broken nose to heal that it does make more sense for
them to root for the series to go as long as possible with Atlanta winning
it, because ultimately they have counters. The Suns probably have defensive counters for
both Janisantaakumpo and Trey Young unlike many teams, but I do think that Atlanta
is the better matchup for them because they can throw bodies at everyone. They
know that they can score, they know that they can defend, and ultimately
Atlanta is the less experienced team with players who you're not quite sure that you're
not sure that they're quite as reliable. Yeah, the only thing I want
to add to what Adams said is just that they have even more options.
That the Hawks are easier in general, but they have even more options to
throw at Atlanta than Philly did, just because like eight and against Collins is
different from and beat against Collins or and beat against like there are just so
many different things they could do, and the fact that they're built to play
small. When Atlanta goes to its all offense units, there's a chance that
that's a very quick series because between Micaal Bridges and Chris Paul with Entre Young
and then you're still gonna have Jay Crowder floating around somewhere out there, and
Tory Craig can help out on Trey Young and it has been fantastic. By
the way, how about you know, Tory Craig going up against the Bucks
in the finals, that's got to give Milwaukee some like PTSD because they gave
him away for nothing for nothing. Two. But and also just if Trey
Young's ankle is like what if the Hawks make it, they won't. What
if the Hawks make it out of the East and Trey Young still injured,
It's much easier to beat the hobbled Hawks even than the Bucks. So I
think they image up well with both teams. But I would agree that it's
you to face the Hawks by far if you're Phoenix. Hey, thanks guys.
Second question, real quick, long term. I'm a big Memphis Grizzlies
fan, been a big fan for a while, and I just want to
know who are the names I should look out for, the people I should
look at, but I should be excited for like older players, younger players,
just anyone who's available. I know you guys clearly know the cap and
what the market looks like. So interesting your insight, and thanks for taking
my call. Absolutely, thanks for asking the questions. All right, Dan,
I'll let you go first on this one, since you're much more of
an off season grewer than I am. Yeah, so when you look at
free agency this summer, the Grizzlies can have cap space if they if they
really want it. I would argue that, even though he's been terrible for
them, the fact that they took on so much money in the first place
to get Justice Winslow, keep him operate as an over the cap team and
you can use your mid level exception. I don't know who that puts you
and play for, because then you're using a tool. It's about nine point
eight million dollars this year that a lot of better teams and more glammor markets
are using. What I was talking about on Twitter the other night is I'm
wondering if and I'm using this first example isn't perfect because he ended up leaving,
but Paul George was traded to Oklahoma City. They convinced him to stay,
and while he eventually wanted out, they got hat a capslock hall for
him, Toronto training for Kwai. He gives them one season they want a
title. The Suns they trade for Chris Paul on a contract year. And
I know a lot of people don't expect the exercises player option, but given
how well he's played, I think it was always on the table. You
might win a title, and you made the conference finals. I am hoping
that this Embolden's teams in non glammor markets. I hate calling it small markets,
but let's say non traditional markets to go for it when these types of
players become available, or to initiate talks to force them to become available.
And when I look at Memphis, they are they're situated to do some things.
If you just say John Morant and Jaren Jackson Junior are untouchable, they
still have just so many assets to move and the fact that they have dual
first round picks in twenty twenty two and in two twenty four, that,
my god, that Golden State pick in twenty and twenty four might be super
valuable. And I still cannot believe that the Warriors gave that up to grease
the wheels of the Igadala dump. I would like to see Memphis this offseason
given what they've done the past two seasons. The names I am zeroing in
on would be, I think one everyone's gonna mention Bradley Beale. The fact
that he's a little bit older, has a player option. Yeah, that
would be his technically fourth contract because he signed an extension already. Might have
more of an idea of where he wants to go turns twenty nine next June.
Not the ideal one, the one I'm actually circling because I don't think
he's someone who would be, Oh, I have to go to a nixt
team. But Zach Lavine just so in line with the windows of John Morant
and Jaren Jackson junior's best years. So if you're willing to give up picks
salary matching of which you have, you have both in this scenario when you're
looking at it, and so like a package just to kick around would be
the Grizzlies get zac Lavine, the Bulls get Grayson Allen, Desmond, Baine
Melton, they get number seventeen in this year's draft, and then a twenty
twenty three two twenty four first round pick. You have the twenty twenty two
picks to Danglin there too. That doesn't have to be the exact package.
I think it depends a lot. If e zach Lean doesn't ask for out
from Chicago, you have to give up more. If he has for out,
maybe you're able to not give up Desmond Baine in that scenario. You
also have to know that he's resigning obviously, and I don't think he elevates
you to championship contender status the way that Kawie did for Toronto, the way
that Paul George never really did that for Oklahoma City, but he had Russ
next to him. But the way that Chris Paul did that for Phoenix.
It puts you on a track to where if John Morant continues progressing, Jaren
Jackson Junior stays healthy and he still needs to improve defensively just he is,
the versatility is there, but it just feels like the reaction time, the
decision making isn't quite there yet. That gives you a viable starting point in
you still have stuff, and I don't need to call it stuff, but
you have Kyle Anderson, you have you still have picks left over after the
framework that I had mentioned. They're still You're still Xavier Tillman, maybe Brandon
Clark, who you know, his jump shot looks like buffering dial up internet
nowadays, but he was still good during his rookie season. You still have
quality players the means to still I trouve Dylan Brooks. Didn't even mention him
earn some all defense considerations this year. You're keeping Justice winslow in the scenario
I mentioned, what if he hits like, what if he just hits stand
still threes and gives you a lockdown defender. They have options, and I
would really like to see them explore them and make a quasi all in swing.
I don't want to see them, you know, give up five six
first round picks plus swaps for Bradley Beale. But if you can give up
multiple firsts and some of the players I just mentioned to get a Zach Lavine,
I think that set you up nicely. And I think the Grizzlies are
just I didn't even mention Joanna Valentcuinis throughout all this who might have been or
was their most consistent player this year when you factor in the John Morant injury.
So Memphis isn't a good spot. I think that they would probably prefer
to slow play this, but I don't know there even though they still feel
far from the very tippy top of the West. A Zach Lavine deal for
me, And first of all, is there a more exciting duo in the
league than a John Moran Zach Laine backcourt? That bead like, Yeah,
so that's the end. That's the end of my rant. There those are
and also those are like the only two stars that you can fathom becoming available.
I don't like Siakham for this team. If Fred van Fleet became available,
that may be like kind of interesting. But the fit with John Morant,
like maybe it's actually it's not terrible. I just don't know where you're
giving up for the offensively, it's perfect Defensively. I was just wonder because
Fred van Fleet has to then cover a lot more. You know, he's
going to experience that in Toronto anyway, because if Kyle Lowry leaves, like
his defensive workload changes a little bit. So you know, but yeah,
I want to see Memphis make the win now trade. It doesn't have to
be on the level of you know what the Bucks gave up for Drew Holiday
and necessarily because they're not that close or what the Nets gave up for Harden
obviously, but give me zac Lavine in Memphis. I'm still on teams slow
play the hell out of this. If you can get Lavine or Bill for
a reasonable price, then do it. That's I'm fine with that. Like
if the asking price for Lavine is one or two the younger guys one or
two picks, fine, make that make that win now move. But I
still just look at this roster, which, assuming that you pick up the
Justice Winslow option, has fourteen players under contract for next season, and I'm
just intrigued from top to bottom. You know, we talked about this when
we were doing the most underrated player on each team within the Western Conference,
and while Jonas Valentinas was ultimately my pick for Memphis because I still think maybe
this is changing after how he played at the back end of the season,
that he might be the most underrated player in the NBA. You can throw
a dart at this roster and find an underrated player. You know, you
mentioned so many names and we really didn't even focus on Desmond Baye and if
Brandon Clark turns things around, and Xavier Tillman Senior's potential impact, and Grayson
Allen has shown flashes and de Anthony Melton has been so effective in smaller spurts.
This roster has so many intriguing pieces with top end pieces that have significant
upside. Valan Junis was the most consistent player on the roster, probably the
MVP of this season for Memphis. Marant has all NBA potential. Jaren Jackson
Junior still has all NBA potential. You have a lot of guys who are
valuable role players. You're shaking your head about Jaren Jackson Junior, but we
still we still have seen enough in smaller spurts that I don't think it's that
unreasonable to think that he has that kind of growth potential. But even if
he doesn't, and you know, he's still on the younger end, like
he's he turns twenty two in September, like, we can in no way
discredit how much upside there is there. This roster has so many intriguing pieces
that I think it would it would be a mistake to not see it out
unless you're swinging for the fences. But that would be my question. Where
are you getting the that guy from? You need the second guy, And
in today's NBA, the second guy probably isn't gonna be Jared Jackson Junior,
even if he peaks, someone who doesn't really create their own shot. And
I don't look. If you tell me he's going to become someone who guarantees
you a top thirteen defense and is going to bomb threes like he did during
his sophomore year, I get it. You still need another guy. And
when you look at this roster, where is that guy coming from? By
committee? I think that this is the rare team that is deep enough with
two way players that you could potentially have a different guy stepping up on different
nights. Because we just described the twenty nineteen twenty Toronto Raptors and they peaked,
they weren't enough. That's just my I think if you're Memphis, maybe
that's fine, but like I would aim for something bigger. I mean,
I think if you if you slow play it, you're looking at a higher
variance range of outcomes. But I do think that that outcome includes a potential
championship down the road, assuming that you get the growth that we're expecting here.
It's it's a riskier play, But I do think that that ceiling would
be there if you told me you wanted to wait a year before making me
all in place, you get a better feel for what Jaren Jackson Jr.
Is. I kind of understand it. But then you're in a situation where,
yeah, there's always a next star up, but Bradby Beale and Zachalvine
or suddenly off the table. And that's an area as hard we've seen.
I mean, how many stars in the last few years have we seen become
available who we had no way of expecting them to become available. Well,
there's Foule examples from every offseason. I do think that there's enough youth and
upside here that you're not ruining the hand that you have for potential trades,
especially because that twenty twenty four Warriors pick could only become more valuable as time
progresses and we see that the Warriors aren't making a leap back towards championship contention.
They might, but it might look more valuable too. You talk about
a team that needs to trade for Zach Lavine Golden States up there, If
you're telling me that you want to wait a year before making the all in
play, as long as you recognize that we're approaching a point where they probably
need to make some sort of double down outside of the current roster. I
think this conversation is a lot different and has a lot more urgency next year.
All right, I can. I'll accept that I'm not about it.
It's satisfactory. That's usually good enough for me. We have other questions here.
Let's get this evening and get to them for a couple of quick ones.
Fred asked Zach Collins's career over. Zach Collins to date has missed exactly
half of all possible regular season games that he could play in. He had
the left shoulder injury that hurt him at the beginning of the twenty nineteen twenty
twenty season. He came back, but he was eventually out for the season
because of a left ankle injury, which surgery in August then kept him out
for all this season. He ended up refracturing that ankle recently. I'm not
going to write off his career, but like I would imagine, with these
injuries, he's probably not going to be the defender that he projected as,
which was someone who could capably guard fours and fives and move on the perimeter.
And then before he went down last season was it I can't remember what
the season was, but he shot well from three. It was in such
a limited sample. It's two seasons. Yeah, we still last season,
we still don't. We still don't even have like a reasonable sample to be
like, oh, he's a floor spacer. That's very much theoretical. So
I don't think his career is over, but I'm very curious to see like
where his peak ends up panning out, And I hope that he's able to
return because that look that sucks, Like you're young and you there were high
expectations, and I think this wouldn't have changed everything in Portland this season,
but he very much healthy Zach Collins would have made a difference for them on
defense. Yeah, it's way too prem chair to say that his career is
over. And we're talking about a six foot eleven, twenty three year old
who in brief spurts has shown rim protection ability, the ability to switch on
the perimeter, and the ability to knockdown three pointers. And that's what teams
want from big So even if he's diminished in each of those areas, when
he does eventually make his return. There's going to be a roster spot for
him somewhere. I mean, we're talking about a league that just signed Michael
Beasley to a summer league deal, Like there's going to be a chance.
So Blazers no less a couple. Let's try to get to these last two
questions. Let's we have any other speaker requests that I think are good notes
to end on that we offer listeners. Lima's asked, CP three is the
latest star to shine with mid range. How much as spacing helped stars rely
on this low percentage shot, CP three can snake to the elbow with ease.
He'd bump into a teammate in twenty seven. Now, this before you
answer books, author of You is a very high level of mid range question.
I love the way this is framed as opposed to oh, like,
why is the mid why do people think the mid range is dead? Or
is CP three proof that analytics are stupid or something? And that's not to
say master underscore Red was saying this politely, but this is just this is
the mid range conversation that we can have, is my point. I'm totally
on board with this question and the assumptions that it's making. I do think
that there's some validity to the idea that the proliferation of three pointers has spaced
out defenses enough that it's a better spot to be shooting from. Ultimately,
the analytics are looking at the points per shot attempt, and that area of
the court is naturally still going to be lower than it is from a few
steps back, which is why there's so much of a tendency to take more
three pointers. But no one has ever said that those are always bad shots.
And yeah, I mean like people like Chris Paul, like Chris Middleton,
there are plenty of examples. C J. McCollum. If you can
make those shots, then you should take them. And yeah, I do
think that the ability of bigs to set screens and then either slip and free
up that snake or pop out to the three point arc and draw out a
big it does create more space. So I totally buy into that idea.
I would love to see data that helps confirm that somebody far smarter than either
of us needs to do that, but I buy I buy the premise.
I reject the notion that there's anyone in the world who's smarter than you,
and I agree with everything you said. I think Seth Partner of the Athletic
when he was on this podcast put it to me the best where it was
just mid range shots aren't bad standing in the mid range if you could make
them. Obviously, all shots are bad if you can if you can't make
them, but standing attempts for me as a terrible idea. Right highest percentage
shot on an NBA court. But like for me, that's a terrible idea.
So if you're standing in the mid range, and this was alluded to
in the question from Leemas, was that if you're going to run into a
teammate in two seven or in twenty twenty one, if your teammates Ben Simmons
because he was just chilling in no man's land and wasn't a wasn't a threat
to do anything when he was outside the dunker spot, So that the catch
and shoot looks. If you're gonna stand still, you're more valuable beyond the
art because in theory it forces your defender to be pulled more outside the paint
and allows players like CP three to get in to his spots. And of
course you need to be hitting those looks like Kevin Durant, whether it's concessed
or not, CP free, whether it's concessed or not, Devin Booker,
whether it like shoot it like that's but it's for the role players. Like
you don't want these catch and shoot middies. You don't want them standing around
there, and you definitely don't want someone who's bad. I don't want Ben
Simmons dribbling into a bunch of mid range jumpers, is my point. Like,
just because their unassisted looks doesn't mean that they're good looks. The other
thing that I feel goes vastly under talked about is if you have a homogeneous
offensive style, it just inherently makes it easier for the defense. So just
by expanding a shot profile and forcing defenses to, at least in the back
of their minds, consider the idea of guarding mid range jumpers, that opens
things up for cutters, for backdoor cuts, for those slips off the screens.
It opens up a lot of offense really quickly. Here this is actually
the final two questions, because this is not worth a discussion. The Cooper
the Cooper Cooper asked, may I have an insane Shay Gil just Alexander stat
Please, you've come to the right podcast, my friend, here's your insane
shake gilg Just Alexander shot this season before he injured the planter or fascia in
his right foot. Stephen Curry and Kevin Durant were the only other players who
averaged over twenty points and five assists per game while shooting as well on twos
and threes as shay Gilji Alexander. What's incredible about this efficiency he shot fifty
four point seven percent on two and forty one point eight percent on threes.
Is that eighty seven point one percent of his made buckets point unassisted. That
is the highest share of made field goals that went unassisted by four hundred and
thirty nine players who appeared in at least twenty games this season. That is
wild, and I think that is what renders the Shay Gilchest Alexander superstar trajectory
valid because he can be an offensive hub. If you're shooting that well and
unassisted looks, it's I mean, it's game over. So he is fantastic.
Do you have anything to add before I get to our final question?
My favorite one is that his scoring average, his rebounding average, and his
assist average have gone up in each of his first three seasons, and that
is despite a minutes per game decrease this year. I don't feel like we've
seen the best of SGA to this point. And I also think because of
his gradual progression, it's where his season this season for him feels like less
of an outlier than Julius Randalls season for him. And I'm not trying to
say Julius Randalls was an outlier, but just the type of role he's had
in the past versus his past progressions in his previous two years. That's why
it just feels so much of a given that he's this good. To me,
I'm with you, Idris Mohammed, kun't damy. I really hope I
didn't put your that too much. Most underrated MBA free agent this off season.
This is a damn question for surely waiting for your answer. I would
have two here, the first of which is Frank Jelkina's, so it's it
is a knick. I actually think Alec Burks has a chance to be wildly
underrated. He hit more than thirty seven percent of his spot up, of
his spot up, of his pull up threes this year, and he hit
some really big buckets for the Knicks in the fourth quarter, judging by efficiency
in his volume and the number of looks that he took that were unassisted,
which is basically a given. In the Knicks's crunch time offense, he was
just one of the He provided the biggest bang for buck among a ton of
players in the league during crunch time, just one of the most efficient weapons
there. And so I think, no, you don't want him running your
offense, and he can deviate from the offense, which is why you know
the Knicks where they're not like trying to run all these just superintuitive sets.
Maybe they were a good fit for him, but it's like a secondary guy
off the bench. Reymis just wanted to start him alongside a Julius Randol or
just another shot creator. He can you know, he can be really good
for you and he's not gonna cost a ton. So I think between this
season and at least a stint during his time in Golden State he didn't play
so well in where do you finished Season Philly last year, he's really up
his value. I'm curious, as he would have guess. And then Doug
McDermott is my other one. He is so scalable and what he does.
There are defensive challenges of playing him, for sure, but he can give
you minutes at the three, three and four spots. He shot three eight
point eight percent from three this year, and that sustains whether he's taking you
know, stand still threes or he's off motion. He's become a reliable finisher
when putting the ball on the deck and drives. That was an element to
his game that he added. He averaged one point five to seven points per
possession as a cutter this year, which is that that sounds and reads like
a type of for anyone wondering to scale. And he just doesn't cannibalize touches.
Almost eighty five percent of his made buckets this season we're assisted on and
the efficiency just for a guy who takes as many threes as he does off
the charts better than sixty percent on twos and as I already mentioned, thirty
eight plus percent on threes. The only other players to shoot sixty plus percent
on twos and thirty eight plus percent on threes while burning through as many shot
attempts overall. Can you even guess one of them at him? There were
two and it's it's not going to be anomalist in the sense that, oh
he's he's in the company of stars. It sort of fits the plug and
play scalable Mold, mcaial Bridges, and Michael Porter Jr. Like this is.
I think Doug McDermott probably gets the full mid level exception, and it
wouldn't surprise me if he got more, which is why I think Indy,
who won't paid the tax but needs to also keep him, probably has to
dump salary unless they want to lose Doug McDermott this offseason. So Alec Burks
and Doug McDermott are my two most underrated free agents. And this was done
by the way. I did look up the mcdermotts stats while I was talking
about Alc Burks. This was off the top of my head. So I'm
sure we could build a list that goes on and on and on. Yeah,
I mean there are plenty of options, Jimmy. You can look at
someone like Dennis Shrewder. He's probably gonna get sixty million and thinks he's worth
one hundred and eighty millions, so like he's underrated in his own mind,
wouldn't shock you. I'm Sorry, what did it shock you if Dennis Shrewder
ended up signing somewhere for the mid level, Because I think a lot of
his value is riven. The Lakers have no other options. But if they
go out and like complete assign and trade and say screw the hardcap, I'd
just be curious to see what his market is. Sorry, go ahead,
No, that's totally fine. I kind of I'm kind of leaning towards Lonzo
Ball here. I know he gets a lot of attention, but I still
don't think that people recognize how impactful he was during the second half of the
season and the growth that he's shown. Whether he's gonna be resigned to New
Orleans or end up in New York or somewhere else, I just feel like
he's a drastically better player than the perception of him allows for him to be.
And to me, like, that's what the underrated part means. It's
where there's a large variance between perception and actual performance. If we're talking about
someone who might sign like a contract that is far too low for their actual
value. Maybe Jamichael Green, who's thirty one but has shown that he can
work in a lot of different lineups and has defensive chops and the ability to
space the floor on offense to switch on defense. A valuable role player.
I don't see him signing a monstrous contract, but he can have a significant
impact on any sort of contender. So, as you said, there are
a bajillion options, especially in a free agent class that is lacking in star
power at the top. Just by nature, there are going to be a
lot of bargains out there. Yeah, I mean, like even a Bobby
Portis or Ken Birch at this point, those are all names keep an eye
on. And Spenser, genuinely he could sign a blow value contract, is
coming off an injury and a bad three game sample. I kind of expect
him to get the bag. But yeah, I mean, if you're getting
spencered in wity for under sixteen million dollars a year, you've won. And
I would agree with you on Lonzo Ball if you think that there's more half
court initiation in him, and I honestly don't, but I could see why
people think that there might be, so I would, but he's I feel
like he's going to get near max money and so that might prevent me from
throwing him in there. Which this was great This was great. Thank you
to everyone who meandered in and out of the room for the past seventy one
minutes. We are Hardwoodknox, so if you haven't checked this out, search
Hardwoo Knox on iTunes, Spotify, Stitcher, wherever you get your podcast YouTube.
We're on YouTube as well. Check us out. Subscribe to us five
stars only please on iTunes and it helps us out a bunch. Leave a
review that helps us out even more. Download every episode and again we're everywhere,
so subscribe to us until next time. We leave you with the shout
out to the one, the only, the single most underrated free agency and
the history of NBA free agency, apparently the eventually twenty plus a million dollars
a year player A long the Wall h