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Hello, everyone, Welcome to the
latest episode of Hardwood Knox. We're coming

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to you live on the Green Room
app hosted by Spotify, coming live right

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after the end of the Hawks Bucks
game played without Trey Young, played without

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janisad the Dakumpo. So it is
now three two Bucks after a one twenty

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three one twelve victory film four Milwaukee. We'll be talking about that game,

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about the Sun's advancing to the NBA
Finals for the first time in Chris Paul's

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career, and answering some questions that
we got from you the listeners. But

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before we do any of that,
Dan, how's it going. I am,

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as you know, a bit frazzled
at the moment, but Noah says,

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it is eleven o'clock. Hey,
we're doing a bonus mailbag for your

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weekend travels. That is what's happening
here, and we're gonna have a special

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podcast to release on Monday for y'all. That's why we're doing this now.

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Don't complain about the extra content.
Noah, jeez, it was disappointing to

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like not have Trey or Jannis in
this game, but I obviously care about

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their long term health more. You
did say though, But well, I

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guess how are you doing? I
guess that matters more theoretically. I'm doing

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all right. Said I've been I've
been in a snarky mood all week on

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Twitter. I think I've just been
easily irritated, and it happened again tonight,

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just because I'm tired of the laziest, most cliche form of complaining about

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a team's performance, which is just
citing a free throw disparity without any context

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whatsoever. And just if your team
isn't shooting as money as many free throws

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as the other team, it must
mean that the refs are favoring it and

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rigging it, and Adam Silver is
pulling the strings behind the scenes and has

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a desired outcome that he wants to
see the impetus for. This was the

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third quarter of the Atlanta Milwaukee game, in which Milwaukee shot twelve free throws

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in Atlanta shot zero. So you
knows as a Hawks fan, I tend

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to have a lot of Twitter follows
who are Hawks fans as well, and

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almost universally I see complaints about that
disparity. Did you watch the game?

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Did you see Milwaukee attacking the basket
on every possession? Crashing the offensive glass,

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having I believe six to one offensive
rebound disparity in that quarter. Did

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you see Atlanta settling for contested jumper
after contested jumper every single time down the

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floor. If they got a switch
on to Brook Lopez, here comes a

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contested step back three point or with
no hope of drawing contact. The Bobdon

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Bobdanovitch flagrant foul when he closed out
on Chris Middleton in the corner was ridiculous.

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I'll give the Atlanta fans that,
but this quarter could have had an

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even larger free throw disparity. And
just citing that twelve to zero number without

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providing any context whatsoever or looking at
how the teams played, it's just lazy.

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It's just a cliche and it shouldn't
happen. It's ridiculous. That wasn't

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very snarky. I think that was
more kind of spot on what are you

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expecting leading into Game six? It
feels like it entirely depends on who's available,

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right I mean, if Trey Young
is going to play dealing with a

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bone bruise right now, he was
questionable for this game. He went through

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shoot around and warm ups and was
then ruled out, so clearly like there's

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some possibility of that happening in game
six, then Atlanta has a much better

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chance. You know, obviously if
Jannis plays, then everything changes and we

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have no idea what to expect for
that timetable. But if these current rosters

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as they stood for Game five are
in play again, I just I don't

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see a path to victory for this
Atlanta team. They don't have a counter

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to an aggressive Drew Holiday. No. I was telling you Dan before we

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started recording, Like, if Drew
Holiday is the key to everything Milwaukee is

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doing on offense and probing into the
pain and setting up everyone and initiating everything

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at the point of attack, and
Atlanta has no personnel to stop him without

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sacrificing bodies on the wings, Like
why is Chris Donn on this roster?

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It feels like there's issues on defense. There's issues with the interior defense against

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Brook Lopez, who is far more
aggressive in Game five. There are issues

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on offense because ultimately, without Young, who is very much the head of

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the offensive snake on a nightly basis, where is the production coming from.

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Bogdanovich had a phenomenal shooting game.
He was really the lone bright spot for

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Atlanta in this Thursday night contest.
But you have Lou Williams initiating, you

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have Bogdanovich initiating, you have Kevin
Hurder initiating, and none of those guys

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are who you want to get everyone
involved And the strength of this Atlanta team

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is how diverse the offensive attack can
be. But you need someone who can

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set it up. And there isn't
an answer to that question unless Young is

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healthy. So unless the availability of
the stars changes, it's not going to

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go well for the Hawks. I
don't think it's probably in their best interest.

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Like even if Joanna's and Trey are
both back, I think that's a

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good thing for it for Atlanta.
Do you, my writing teachers, Let's

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go from Tony welcome, Welcome to
the room? Is so after Atlanta spent

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this money in free agency on Bogdanovitch, on Gallo, don Chris Dunn himself,

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he granted he was injured for a
long time, but they have not

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They've just not used him basically is
and he was never going to be the

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initiator for them. Is it a
concern for you that they don't have that

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or do you envision them if they're
healthier next season, even Hunter, because

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he was doing people forget he was
an on set candidate for most improved Players,

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being more stuff off the dribble.
But I don't think I think Bogdanovitch

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would come closest to being the guy, closest to being able to run lineups

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without Trey, And so if he's
not that guy and he is banged up,

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but if he's not that guy,
then you still don't have that guy.

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No, I think you need to
search long and hard for a viable

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backup point guard because Trey is ultimately
irreplaceable, and this roster has built around

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that irreplaceability. But even when Bogdanovich
is playing well, even when DeAndre Hunter

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is available, you still need that
second point guard, and it's just not

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there right now. Donne has not
panned out, whether it's because of the

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injuries that prevented him from really being
worked into the rotation. They made the

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move for Lou Williams, who had
a great scoring night but a lot of

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turnovers. Tony's suggesting Rajon Rondo for
Atlanta, and I guess like maybe that

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would have been better in this particular
situation. As awful as he as he

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played throughout the postseason, but like
he kind of got externally for that.

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I can't I can't stop laughing about
that one, Tony. I appreciate that.

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Do you think, well, I'm
gonna be honest, do you think

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Rona wouldn't have helped them here?
Right? No, he wouldn't have helped

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him. I don't think. Yeah, I mean he wouldn't have helped him.

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He might have been like more useful
in this specific scenario when you just

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need someone to get everyone involved.
But even then, like there are so

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many shortcomings. I'm not sure that's
a great idea. Hey, look,

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Cameron Paine's music might be playing during
the offseason. That could be someone that

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they would target. I mean,
I don't think he would ultimately like kind

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of run it back. You just
need that one supplementary piece. This is

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not that an indictment of the core. It's you need moves around the periphery

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because you have to be able to
account for a situation like this where Young

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isn't available for a game or two, or to prevent him from needing to

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play forty minutes a game. My
thing is is it kind of is an

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indictment on the core. At this
point because the money they spent. Look,

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they're further than anyone expected. I
don't want to hear. You know,

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we did the whole viral asterisk rant
between you and I last time.

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But they're here and so they're close. But the fact that that's still after

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what they did last offseason, that
this is their biggest hole. And again,

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it wouldn't have mattered Trey Young sits
out. You have someone to run

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the offense. It wouldn't have mattered
like Trey Young. Losing Trey Young,

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even against the buck seams doesn't have
be honest, you're screwed. But overall,

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the fact that this and they did
tread water up points in the season

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without Trey Young. But the fact
that this is still kind of your problem.

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I don't want to say it's an
indictment of last offseason, but I

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actually think it's a it's a pretty
big deal. It is a pretty big

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deal. There's there's no doubt about
that. I do like Tony's more serious

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suggestion of t J McConnell for at
Land and free agency. That would be

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a fun fit, but both for
the point of attack defense and for the

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initiation skill. You know, not
a super glamorous signing, but I think

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that's the kind of move that these
Hawks need to be looking at. It's

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also it's also a little bit tough
to get a full picture because as much

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focus as there's been on injuries throughout
this postseason, I'm not sure that there's

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been enough attention paid to just how
injured this Atlanta team has been throughout the

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entire season, because it did prevent
continuity, It did derail the Hunter improvement

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and the Cam Reddish experiments and all
of these pieces who are now attempting to

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play integral roles in such a high
pressure situation and really adjusting on the fly.

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So maybe, had the injury bug
not been quite so pervasive throughout the

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regular season, we aren't really having
this conversation because the team has figured out

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better ways to initiate offense. I
want to ask you this last question though,

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and I'm not trying to I feel
like this is kind of raining on

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the Hawks progress this year, which
is unfair a little bit. But with

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the Wings, when you look at
Cam Reddish, Kevin Herder, DeAndre Hunter

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and how close all of them are
getting to being on their second contracts,

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is this a point where you consider
maybe consolidating those using those in addition to

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other stuff to find the piece that
you're talking about, or you're very much

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Tony East mentions TJ McConnell in free
agency, you would rather go that route

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and have what projects is like this. Yeah, they've even gotten like good

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minutes from kungrua points during the postseason. That's like a twelve. I've been

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really impressed with him. I've been
really impressed with him. So theoretically you're

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at the point then we would be
like this, you're going to prioritize depth

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rather than trying to consolidate into maybe
someone who's a because I don't know that

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you can. We saw it in
Phoenix this year, but there was also

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one Phoenix you could have Chris Paul
or Devin Booker on the court at one

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time every game. The Hawks don't
have that yet that like it's you know,

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it's Bogdanovitch. Isn't the same?
Gallop certainly isn't the same. So

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would you be opposed to using those
guys, maybe not alone, but consolidating

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some of that young talent or do
you think that's sort of an over pay

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when you're talking about someone to supplement
Trey Young's offense rather than getting this other

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star. I would be good with
that. I mean, I think what

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you're suggesting is like packaging together Reddish
Hurter and a couple of picks for like

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Damian Lillard. And I think that's
a great idea. That's too much.

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I can give you the subtext.
I can read your subtext here. You

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know, I have the benefit of
looking at you on Skype while we're recording

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this, so I see I see
it in your eyes. All I'm going

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to say is, if you're doing
that deal Portland, how many like Portland

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probably to send you back Robert Covington
and n CJ. McCollum too, Like,

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that's way too much value to give
up for Dame. But in all

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seriess I do wonder if Atlanta is
kind of a sneaky inclusion on the star

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market, if someone you know,
Bradley Beal becomes available, do they Does

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Atlanta have enough pieces that could be
packaged together in a consolidation trade to look

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at that kind of option. I
think they would be, just because of

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all They're more likely to now because
of how these pieces have shown out.

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I mean, we saw Hurd perform
in a big game we've seen, you

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know, Reddish is back and at
least doing something. Now. Who knows

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what to expect from John Collins on
a nightly basis at this point, but

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the pieces are there. I'd be
curious is does that skew too much towards

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all offense? But I guess it
doesn't matter because Bradley beyond try young or

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not what you would consider two way
players, and that's where it would sort

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of run into some issues. But
I would be all for the Hawks going

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that route. To be clear,
I would as well if nothing else would

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be fun. I think we have
to pour one out for the Suns before

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we get to we have a oh
past Cassiakam in Atlanta that I like that.

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That's an interesting one. That's just
does I mean, does he really

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give you a secondary shock creation or
is he just gonna dribble and spin I

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call it. He could spin his
way around a lot of stuff. Yeah,

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just not that suggestion was all of
Tony East, longtime friend of NBA

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math and both of us. Tony, if you want to speak at any

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point were we are more than willing
to have you on as well, just

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so you know up and I'm especially
called by request. Yeah, how's it

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good. I'll talk for a few
minutes. I'm about to record my own

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pod, so I need to warm
up. That's perfect. Yeah, exercises,

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Yeah yeah, plug away, No, I will. I will not

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be plugging, but I will.
It's locked on Pacers listen to it.

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I've been on it, so they
definitely slum it from time to time.

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But it's a fun podcast. Yeah. When when this Warriors Pascal stuff came

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out, I was like, wow, why would they trade Pascal? But

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irrelevant to that, I thought about
Pascal and the Hawks. I was like,

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wow, that actually kind of makes
sense for for Pascal in the Hawks

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at least. I haven't thought about
it for the Raptors. But I thought

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it was a fun time to jump
in and say that because I haven't had

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a chance to hear that thought anywhere. So what are the hot I love

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that. Yeah, you're gonna reset
Collins? Yeah? So oh no,

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how would you replace John Collins?
Wait? What's the framework here? Let's

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let's talk through this. I just
assumed this was a situation. So first,

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your Toronto landing number four probably incentivizes
them in this scenario and be like,

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hey, we're gonna start over and
Pascal is going on twenty eight?

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Right? Is he twenty seven?
What is he so you don't necessarily view

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him as part of your core?
And why wouldn't you pair him with John

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Collins? They compliment each other.
No, or do you think you're not

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getting enough rebounding up front or something? Messiah FROMO will you please listen to

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my offer very quickly? I'm ready? Okay, Danilo Gallinari for money purposes,

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very very minimal important value here,
Cam Reddish the twentieth pick in the

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upcoming NBA draft and DeAndre Hunter?
Do we have a deal? Or have

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I oversold my hand? I thank
you? That's enough for Toronto? Yeah,

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you're right, but then what else
can the Hawks do? That doesn't

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make that just scary? For ku? Was he in that deal? I

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didn't hear his name. No,
I feel like I feel like that's close

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though. I think Hunter's trajectory at
the beginning of the season at least makes

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it close enough to the point that
you can probably throw in a few future

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draft considerations and make it happen.
If Toronto is sold on going the rebuilding

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route, and if that's the case, like, yeah, I'm good with

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that. Okay, there we go. See the other thing with the Hawks,

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and you guys were kind of hinting
at this before we post mortemized and

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completely it is like I would worry
about them running too fast, like you

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really over exceed expectations in your one. So they do something like that and

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then it doesn't help and it doesn't
help them enough and they don't have the

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asset pool anymore. But Pascal is
close to being the guy you do it

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for, so I thought it was
very interesting. I do think he's a

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guy you can do it for.
But yeah, I do think like this

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roster. My only rebuttal to that
point is that this roster feels like it

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has reached a point where you can
kind of straddle those two timelines. There

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is enough youthful intrigue that you can
continue to progress that way because you're not

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throwing in every chip even I mean, even in this scenario, you still

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have a cong with there, you
still have Hurder, you have more room

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to resign Hurder. You don't know
what you're going to do with John Collins.

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So I feel like Atlanta has become
the rare team that can kind of

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get ahead of its skis a little
bit because it has that fallback option.

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That's true. That's definitely true.
And I think Dan, we've got to

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talk about the Collins u Saka potential
fit too, which is like good enough

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that you could even swing that,
and then if that doesn't work, you

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have the trades to do something else. Yeah. Yeah, unless you're moving

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Collins is part like he needs to
be on bigger money for you to move

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him, and he will be obviously
now. But like signing trades are weird,

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so like next season mid season,
if it's not working out and he

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passes his you know, trade by
date or ken trade date, that would

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be super interesting the other player and
Oklahoma City fans will get mad at me

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precially. But Shay Giljisavsander would be
so perfect for this team. Well,

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I mean yeah, I feel like
you'd be perfect for most teams. But

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I'm saying like, because people get
too caught up in timeline, and I

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very much recognize that a twenty two
year old Shay is your timeline. At

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the same time, if you get
a big enough offer, he's about to

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be maxed out. You don't.
You have all these picks that can kind

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of either compliment it's max salary or
complicate your your situation. So if you

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00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:11,400
get a large enough offer, I
would consider it, especially because and I'm

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not a doctor, so this is
like the worst take in the world.

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Whenever I see like plant or fascia
injuries, I get super super nervous.

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And so if Toronto, let's say
Toronto came and said we'll give you number

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four Adnobi for Shay at number sixteen
and like Kendrick William or something, I

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might I'm gonna consider that. If
I'm Oklahoma City and I'm not gonna lie.

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If the Hawks through the bag at
me and the bag being hunter picks

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00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:45,079
galore O kung Wu, I'm gonna
I'm gonna think about it. I mean,

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00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:48,200
you said the magic word for Sam
Presti already, which is picks.

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So once that enterest the equation,
who knows what the hell is gonna happen.

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Yeah, he's gonna campaign to an
increase to twenty roster spots per team

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at some point, I'm assuming,
right. But Tony, before you get

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to go record, you want to
answer one of our mail back questions for

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00:18:02,839 --> 00:18:04,400
us? Oh yeah, is it
about the patients? By chance? I

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have no idea. Dan has access
to all of them, So he's gonna

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throw something your way. I like, oh, do you care? We

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don't have a Paciers question? Which
no, I don't talking about other teams.

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I talked about the Pacers enough.
Okay, where do you rank?

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This question comes from? Well,
I'm not gonna say where it comes from

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00:18:23,240 --> 00:18:26,759
because then it spoils it. Where
do you rank de Jean Day Murray on

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the point guard list? And this
comes from j Da Warri? So wow,

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uh, I don't have a list
of point guards in front of you,

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but not baby top twenty? Is
he the best point guard on his

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own team? I'm a big Derek
White guy. Is that a hot take

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for the show? No? Also
because DeMar derozen is technically yeah, true,

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he's also a point guard. Now
how about this. Let's let's frame

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it. Let's let's make you throw
him on the Crystal Basketball scale here.

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Oh oh okay, yeah, I
can do that is eight All Stars,

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nine all Star, nine is all
Star eight is high on starter. I

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think I do seven or eight.
Let me think about that. His defense

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is like phenomenal. I don't think
like if I could write about anything,

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I would I would want to write
a piece about his defense at some point

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because it's very good, but his
offense is not not that like like unrefined

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self creators are the hardest players to
grade, you know, because you never

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know if it's gonna come around,
and they could just be like like Eric

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Bledsoe on offense forever and that's not
good. So I like to Jontay,

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but there, you're kind of older
for a young player, which is an

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you know what I'm saying, and
younger than Derek White, still, right,

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Derek White is very old for a
young player. Yeah, definitely,

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but you know, he's definitely good, like solid starter for a long time,

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but I don't think he'll ever reach
the All Star level. So yeah,

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seven or eight on the on the
crystal ball scale, I'm in the

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00:19:55,839 --> 00:19:57,960
same boat. I think I'm leaning
a little more strongly towards the eight,

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just be because of this improvement he
showed as a finisher this year, like

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getting getting to the basket a little
less frequently, but he could knock down

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everything in that range, whether he
was finishing with power or using an increasing

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arsenal of tricks around the sixty four
point nine percent within three feet, like

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that was a big stride from the
last three years or the first three years

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of his career, I should say, but yeah, I think that's the

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right range. I think also just
now, I was just gonna say,

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his decision making as an initiator has
gotten better. Part of that might be

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because they've given some of it to
de Rosin, so you've seen his turnover

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00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:38,640
rate sort of go in the right
direction. But even in transition, he

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00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:41,839
feels like he's smarter there. And
I think, you know, this was

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00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:45,319
year two of him shooting forty five
plus percent between ten feet and the three

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point line, So there's like there's
that in between game there. And I

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00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:53,720
do think I said this about Marcus
Smart before he kind of turned. A

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willingness to shoot threes is important,
even if they're not falling at a high

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clip. And so the fact that
this season he attempted three point three p

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thirty six minutes, not a ton, but a career high and is continuing

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00:21:06,519 --> 00:21:08,839
upwards, that absolutely matters. I
just don't know if he's ever going to

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be the guy that hits these,
you know, these off the dribble jumpers,

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like even is in between looks.
They feel like very slow paced and

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methodical, and you can see them
coming from a mile away where the Rosan

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00:21:19,440 --> 00:21:23,319
can use more of his changes of
directing directions and is a little bit quicker

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00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:27,319
with his with a shot motion.
Yeah, he's got a little bit of

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00:21:27,319 --> 00:21:32,599
Oladipo Eidis where there's like one in
every games where like the second he catches

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00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:33,920
the ball, like I can tell
you what he's gonna do. It's so

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weird. There's some players where they
just have those games where like even you

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guys and I like as fans not
even playing in the game, or like

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00:21:41,960 --> 00:21:44,759
card Course scouts were like, oh, I know he's gonna shoot like on

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00:21:44,799 --> 00:21:47,319
this touch. You know, you
just know. And Depot is really bad

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00:21:47,359 --> 00:21:49,319
about that. Murray is a little
bit bad about that, especially when he's

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got that slow ish MIDI game.
It's not there being a floater. I

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think he could potentially reach all start
level at some point, but he doesn't

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at all. Like that help carres
Lavert's developments as he got that floater and

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00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:03,519
then he was way harder to guard
on his drive, so that would help

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00:22:03,599 --> 00:22:06,359
him on too. I really do. I do like him. He is

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00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:08,519
good, Like watching him in Pearl
Defend pick and rolls is outstanding. They're

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00:22:08,559 --> 00:22:12,799
so good at that. But his
offensive ceiling just scares me just enough to

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00:22:14,160 --> 00:22:17,240
not know where to put him.
As soon as you said oladipo itis,

324
00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:19,200
my knee started hurting, and then
I realized it just as I was sitting.

325
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Funny, I still keep thinking that
he wants to max this off season.

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I'm like, oh boy, oh
oh, right out there with Dennis

327
00:22:26,279 --> 00:22:30,480
Shrewder wanting nine figures in his next
conference too. I aspire to have that

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00:22:30,599 --> 00:22:33,480
much self confidence. Confidence Tony.
We did actually just get a Pacers question

329
00:22:33,880 --> 00:22:37,759
to come. Oh really, okay, I'll answer a favorite question. It's

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00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:42,880
literally three words comes from Rob Sager
Turner or Sabonis. Oh boy, oh

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00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:47,880
boy? What have you guys seen
the video? Just so you know,

332
00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:53,240
we only have like thirty forty more
minutes of recording. Have you guys seen

333
00:22:53,319 --> 00:22:57,240
the video of the comedian who's like
pretending to be an IKEA worker making fun

334
00:22:57,319 --> 00:23:02,160
of people who supers in the store. It was very funny. So I

335
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:04,720
have a screen cap of that video
of the part where he says and what

336
00:23:04,799 --> 00:23:07,599
do your eyes say? And I
know that if you haven't watched the video,

337
00:23:07,599 --> 00:23:10,599
you have no idea what that's in
reference too. But I have that

338
00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:12,319
screen cap because some dabs. I
use it for basketball analysis, and it's

339
00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:17,079
kind of strange because I really like
Myles Turner. I think he's very good,

340
00:23:17,480 --> 00:23:22,039
especially in that context. Incredible defender, and then this year he played

341
00:23:22,079 --> 00:23:23,599
a lot with the bench, and
his on off numbers are ridiculous, and

342
00:23:23,759 --> 00:23:27,559
Yorker and ball really suited his play
style and he really popped off the page

343
00:23:27,599 --> 00:23:32,559
and had more confidence and was a
very talented player. And now all these

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00:23:32,599 --> 00:23:36,039
people are thinking, hey, maybe
Miles Turner is a little better than Sabonus,

345
00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:37,759
or he's got more value of his
team and they could trade Sibonus if

346
00:23:37,759 --> 00:23:41,319
it's big Hall, And sometimes I
just want to reply with the what do

347
00:23:41,400 --> 00:23:45,119
your eyes say? Meme? Because
when you watched the Pacers, Sus is

348
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:49,240
just better. He's just a better
player. Like he has the ball a

349
00:23:49,319 --> 00:23:52,720
lot, and people to point to
his touchoos as a negative, but like

350
00:23:52,839 --> 00:23:55,279
he does something good with it all
the time, with his handoffs or his

351
00:23:55,359 --> 00:23:59,759
screens or good finishing or he's even
got a decent jumper from fifteen feet and

352
00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:03,799
he's a good defender of centers.
When they made him chase guys around the

353
00:24:03,799 --> 00:24:07,680
perimeter, altis along which I'm sure
you guys read a bunch of sets about

354
00:24:07,759 --> 00:24:11,279
he was miserable, but he's a
good defender of centers, really likes his

355
00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:15,799
team, likes being a pacer,
and it's just a better player, right,

356
00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:18,880
So it's what's your eyes say for
me? So my answer is is

357
00:24:18,920 --> 00:24:22,000
Demonte spunts, he's better. That
said, I'd really like Miles Turner,

358
00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:25,039
So it's I hate answering that question, but it's a honest for me.

359
00:24:26,160 --> 00:24:30,440
My follow up question there is are
you aware that Miles Turner and Dan are

360
00:24:30,519 --> 00:24:34,160
best friends? Now? Oh god, no, Miles Turner. Miles Turner

361
00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:38,680
was so mad when I didn't put
him on my projected top three ballot for

362
00:24:38,759 --> 00:24:42,079
Defensive Player of the Year after a
month into the season, and I did

363
00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:45,279
it rather than a live look as
where I thought you about this. I

364
00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:48,319
remember that. Yeah, it turned
out I was right, but I do

365
00:24:48,519 --> 00:24:52,599
regret the way I approached it because
there was way too much confusion on Twitter

366
00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:57,160
and the Pacers account was mad.
Miles Turner was mad. So I regret

367
00:24:57,240 --> 00:25:00,519
that whole situation. But I'm sure
that is the most common question that you've

368
00:25:00,559 --> 00:25:04,319
been asked by people in general who
aren't like nitty gritty into the pacers.

369
00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:08,359
My stands on it. I agree
with everything you say. My other thing

370
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is like, is it weird to
think that you can get more value for

371
00:25:11,759 --> 00:25:17,359
Turner on the trade market than Sabonis? Because for Sabonis to be most effective,

372
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he has to be allotted a certain
usage, a certain number of touches

373
00:25:21,519 --> 00:25:25,799
for his impact to really be felt, whereas Turner because of his defense and

374
00:25:25,839 --> 00:25:27,799
then the fact that he just faces
the Florida position, where that is still

375
00:25:27,799 --> 00:25:32,559
a commodity even when you're not shooting
the average from three, that teams are

376
00:25:32,599 --> 00:25:37,079
going to be more inclined to give
up more assets for him rather than Sabonis.

377
00:25:37,799 --> 00:25:41,759
Yeah, it's interesting, like Turner
basically is plug and play right,

378
00:25:41,880 --> 00:25:45,240
like he shoots three is well enough, especially for a center to fit on

379
00:25:45,319 --> 00:25:48,240
any team. And when you're a
top whatever, you know, I don't

380
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:49,720
want to get you in more trouble, but top whatever, high number,

381
00:25:51,519 --> 00:25:56,119
a low number position on defense,
right like he is defending centers or defending

382
00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:59,599
in general. Yeah, you have
value on literally any team. You can

383
00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:02,440
play on any team. You don't
need that many touches, and you'll be

384
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:07,359
super important. So that maybe because
teams will be competing in a potential trade

385
00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:08,480
for him that ups his value,
But to me it's a bonus. It's

386
00:26:08,519 --> 00:26:14,559
like, sure, maybe only sixteenths
could really use the seventeen, but his

387
00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:18,079
value tho seven teams is extremely high. Like to me, Vuchovich is like

388
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:22,640
his value right, he's younger but
is probably a little bit better. And

389
00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:26,759
Boots just got two first Wendell Carter
and the Salary, and I would say

390
00:26:26,799 --> 00:26:29,920
they have similar fits on other teams. I don't think Turner's fetching you that

391
00:26:30,039 --> 00:26:32,359
much, so I would say Sibonus
still has more value. That said,

392
00:26:32,359 --> 00:26:34,960
I understand why Turner does have more
value than I get him credit for.

393
00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:41,799
Sometimes New Orleans and says, yeah, New Orleans calls you though and says,

394
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,440
we'll give you Nikkil, Alexander Walker
and number ten for Turner. Oh

395
00:26:45,519 --> 00:26:48,440
I do that, Yeah, I
would do that. I would definitely do

396
00:26:48,519 --> 00:26:51,519
that. That's good because I just
wrote about that exact trade that saved the

397
00:26:51,559 --> 00:26:56,160
Pacers money and I would definitely do
that. It's a great litmus test for

398
00:26:56,240 --> 00:27:00,359
you there, Dan, that's a
trade up really bad, like all my

399
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:02,480
mentions and like, how can they
trade up? How can they trade up?

400
00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:06,039
And I'm like, it's kind of
hard because they'd have to trade Turner

401
00:27:06,079 --> 00:27:07,200
to trade up, but then they
just get a better pick, like what

402
00:27:07,279 --> 00:27:11,079
they don't need him and thirteen to
do it, So it's kind of awkward,

403
00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:12,599
but that would kind of solve the
problem about They'd get a young player

404
00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:17,720
and a thing, so maybe that's
the solution. Thanks damn, no problem.

405
00:27:17,799 --> 00:27:19,359
You feel free to feel free to
steal that one, because when people

406
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:23,119
get mad at me, I'm just
gonna say that Tony East Pacers podcaster indorsed

407
00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:27,559
the ship out of this to say, I did, I did, Okay,

408
00:27:27,599 --> 00:27:36,519
I have to go yell about ja
car Sampson the one that makes Thank

409
00:27:36,599 --> 00:27:40,359
you for having me on your on
your black room for a couple of minutes.

410
00:27:41,319 --> 00:27:44,519
Thank you so much for the patience
Tyler while we were talking to Tony,

411
00:27:44,599 --> 00:27:47,759
but we do have you on now. How's it going all right?

412
00:27:47,839 --> 00:27:52,079
Thank you guys for having me.
Just got a quick question for you guys.

413
00:27:53,039 --> 00:28:02,799
So do you guys think uh injuries
have ruined this year's playoffs? Like,

414
00:28:03,559 --> 00:28:07,400
I know it's part of the game, but I don't think I've ever

415
00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:15,039
seen this many injuries, you know, to the biggest stars and like in

416
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:19,680
previous years, I don't remember this
many injuries, but like, what do

417
00:28:19,759 --> 00:28:23,200
you guys think? Yeah? For
sure. So first, thank you for

418
00:28:23,240 --> 00:28:27,039
the question, Dan, Do you
want me to let you go ahead with

419
00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:32,279
this one? Yeah? So this
is a good time to plug the Hardware

420
00:28:32,319 --> 00:28:36,119
Knox podcast. If you haven't subscribed
before, please do. The last episode

421
00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:38,240
I went on rant that also went
I don't know if you can call it

422
00:28:38,359 --> 00:28:41,599
viral on Twitter, but there was
a lot of talk about it on Twitter

423
00:28:41,680 --> 00:28:47,119
and I posted it. I'm a
big believer in not ascribing an asterisk to

424
00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:51,400
any season because of injuries, because, just as you mentioned, every team

425
00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:55,039
went through shit. I do think
what's interesting about this is he kind of

426
00:28:55,039 --> 00:28:57,440
mentioned did injuries ruin the playoffs?
Because you're not necessarily trying to say this

427
00:28:57,599 --> 00:29:03,559
title doesn't count, but it's a
game Like there's a difference there, Yeah,

428
00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:06,440
because you're there's a distinction because the
Hawks and the Bucks were both missing

429
00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:08,480
a star, you rather would have
seen them. I've found the playoffs wildly

430
00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:12,599
entertaining, probably because of the randomness. I'd prefer not to have the injuries.

431
00:29:12,720 --> 00:29:15,799
And to be clear, when you
look at players who've actually missed games,

432
00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:18,920
let's not even throw people who are
just battling injuries like Devin Booker's broken

433
00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:25,240
nose. You can build two super
teams worth of players that have missed games,

434
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:29,000
multiple games with injuries during these playoffs
or let's say a critical game like

435
00:29:29,079 --> 00:29:33,799
you know Jannis right now. So
I think that matters, and it's a

436
00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:37,920
talking point in the context of,
hey, maybe we've rushed this season,

437
00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:42,119
because it's not just about the teams
that had a short layoff. Where you

438
00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:47,359
look at Lebron and ad in Los
Angeles and those fans with a lot of

439
00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:49,599
those Lakers fans, I'll say,
want to put an astrict on this title.

440
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:52,359
That's gonna be the reason why I
don't actually give that much validity,

441
00:29:52,440 --> 00:29:56,039
but I would absolutely they have the
shortest offseason in sports history. They in

442
00:29:56,079 --> 00:30:00,359
the heat, so you can absolutely
argue that screw them over. But even

443
00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:04,119
teams that didn't have the you know, there were teams with extended layoffs,

444
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:07,920
the Hawks were among them. You
had those guys all of a sudden ramp

445
00:30:08,039 --> 00:30:11,400
up. I'm not saying after basically
going from yeah, they were doing stuff,

446
00:30:11,519 --> 00:30:15,000
but there's a difference from doing stuff
on your own in limited capacity,

447
00:30:15,119 --> 00:30:19,000
Because what were these guys doing when
they had limited access to Jim's maybe equipment

448
00:30:19,119 --> 00:30:23,519
for the non stars. Trey Young
was randomly and like a packed open gym

449
00:30:23,559 --> 00:30:26,839
at Oklahoma, I think at the
height of the pandemic. But whatever,

450
00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:30,759
So I'm not saying that contributed to
his ankle injury now when we're that far

451
00:30:30,839 --> 00:30:33,759
down the line, but it definitely
could have impacted the regular season or just

452
00:30:33,839 --> 00:30:37,039
put extra wear and tear that quick
ramp up and then the second half of

453
00:30:37,079 --> 00:30:41,119
the schedule for some of these teams
that missed games during the first half had

454
00:30:41,119 --> 00:30:45,039
them rescheduled, and then the second
half just seemed like it was heavier for

455
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:48,640
teams in general. So the data
that's come out feels conflicting because if you

456
00:30:48,759 --> 00:30:52,960
look at in street clothes, I
think they've come out with stuff that it

457
00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:56,039
says there's been an uptick in injuries. I think the NBA released a statement

458
00:30:56,119 --> 00:30:59,720
that basically said there wasn't or that
these players actually had more time off and

459
00:30:59,799 --> 00:31:03,440
jen because of the pandemic. Pandemic
time off wasn't time off. That was

460
00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:07,440
the like some of the dumbest shit
I've ever read. I probably shouldn't be

461
00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:10,519
so heated about it because I can't
pinpoint exactly when and where it came from.

462
00:31:10,599 --> 00:31:12,599
But that was an actual thing that
was released by an entity that should

463
00:31:12,599 --> 00:31:18,000
not have released it. So there's
it's a confluence of factors here. I

464
00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:22,279
think it sucks these injuries. It
feels like there's been more of them to

465
00:31:22,359 --> 00:31:26,200
these star players. I don't know
what the contributing causes. I'm just speculating

466
00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:29,759
suggestive. I still don't think it's
ruined the playoffs because the stories for me,

467
00:31:30,440 --> 00:31:33,599
Trey Young before his injury has probably
done more than any player in the

468
00:31:33,599 --> 00:31:37,079
playoffs to build up his reputation.
Devin Booker probably comes pretty close, but

469
00:31:37,119 --> 00:31:40,200
I think he kind of turned perception
just based off the season, the Sun's

470
00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:41,480
hat and even before then you look
back at the bubble, but he was

471
00:31:41,519 --> 00:31:45,279
still right out there. That's a
great storyline. CP three making the Finals,

472
00:31:45,839 --> 00:31:48,640
winning in the Conference finals, just
the numbers he put up, like

473
00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:52,680
some of the games the Nuggets series, his Western Conference Finals game six.

474
00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:56,799
It also kind of sucks what happens
to the Clippers where there Paul George basically

475
00:31:56,799 --> 00:32:00,759
said, we would have won if
we had surged Zubos and Quas. Maybe

476
00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:02,920
I wouldn't have picked them too,
But was also there is it was really

477
00:32:04,039 --> 00:32:07,839
cool to see a furtherance of the
I guess we call them resurgences or renaissances

478
00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:12,720
of Nick Patum, Reggie Jackson,
like, those were guys that really stepped

479
00:32:12,799 --> 00:32:17,400
up for them. So I think
in there were there were interest points,

480
00:32:17,599 --> 00:32:22,880
tantalizing storylines that came up in lieu
of having everybody healthy. But of course,

481
00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:25,680
ideally we don't have these injuries,
but I think it far from ruin

482
00:32:27,079 --> 00:32:30,279
the playoffs. And maybe I'm I
feel like casual basketball fan has tossed around

483
00:32:30,279 --> 00:32:32,200
too, and I'm say, look, Tyler's listening to this podcast, so

484
00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:37,000
you're a diehard NBA fan. If
you're sensing that, then it's definitely concern

485
00:32:37,039 --> 00:32:40,480
amongst the hoops nerds. I just
think there's been enough entertainment and enough interesting

486
00:32:40,559 --> 00:32:46,680
things to follow that no these injuries, while again infinitely lamentable, they haven't

487
00:32:46,759 --> 00:32:52,200
ruined the playoffs. For me,
I'm right there with you where I wish

488
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:54,279
that none of the injuries had happened. It sucks that we haven't gotten to

489
00:32:54,319 --> 00:32:59,440
see some of these stars, but
honestly, like tonight's Game five between Atlanta

490
00:32:59,440 --> 00:33:02,440
and Milwaukee was really the first time
where I felt like there was a diminished

491
00:33:02,519 --> 00:33:07,319
product because of those injuries. Like, yeah, the Nets weren't at full

492
00:33:07,359 --> 00:33:09,640
strength, Yeah, the Clippers weren't
at full strength. There were some really

493
00:33:09,839 --> 00:33:15,920
entertaining basketball games in both of those
series, as there have been in basically

494
00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:20,119
everyone. I feel like almost every
series has been compelling. We've had nightly

495
00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:23,839
entertainment just in terms of close games
and comebacks, both within games and with

496
00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:30,240
series. We saw Kevin Durant attempt
to reassert himself as maybe the best player

497
00:33:30,279 --> 00:33:34,079
in the NBA because the other stars
in Brooklyn were injured, and it produced

498
00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:38,319
that overtime masterpiece of a game against
Milwaukee in the previous round. Like,

499
00:33:39,559 --> 00:33:44,839
these playoffs have been so compelling,
they featured so many breakouts, the ones

500
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:49,240
that Dan hinted at and mentioned more
explicitly. DeAndre Ayden is another one where

501
00:33:49,599 --> 00:33:52,000
you know, we got to see
him emerge because he needed to with other

502
00:33:52,079 --> 00:33:59,240
guys ailing a little bit. It's
just one example after another of how deep

503
00:33:59,359 --> 00:34:04,319
the talent pool is in the NBA
and how competitive and entertaining these games can

504
00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:09,320
be even without the most marquee names
available. So I totally understand the question.

505
00:34:09,400 --> 00:34:14,840
I totally understand why people are frustrated, upset that they haven't been able

506
00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:17,199
to watch some of the best players
in the world play basketball, some of

507
00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:22,159
their favorite players in the world play
basketball. But it's still been a really

508
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:28,119
entertaining product. If anyone has questions, they can throw it in the chat.

509
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:32,280
We're asked to speak when you have
other questions from listeners, the I

510
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:37,719
already lost it or so oh.
This comes from Ranish A zem As was

511
00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:40,320
Julius Randall's season of fluke? Or
is this his new norm? Of course,

512
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:44,559
his usage might change if the Knicks
get another star, he adds in

513
00:34:44,639 --> 00:34:49,440
parentheticals, I think the answer has
to lie somewhere in the middle. I'm

514
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:53,000
guessing the impetus for a lot of
those feelings are that Randall really struggled in

515
00:34:53,079 --> 00:34:57,400
the first round against the Hawks.
Couldn't shoot to save his life, couldn't

516
00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:00,159
play defense. It was just a
disaster of a series for him in a

517
00:35:00,320 --> 00:35:04,599
matchup that, based on the regular
season results, felt like one that he

518
00:35:04,639 --> 00:35:08,880
should have been able to capitalize upon. But we also saw so much demonstrable

519
00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:14,599
evidence throughout the regular season that it
was legitimate growth. I mean, the

520
00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:19,000
shots that he became comfortable taking,
those turnaround fade away jumpers on the base

521
00:35:19,079 --> 00:35:22,519
lines, the pull up threes,
everything that he was doing, you know,

522
00:35:22,559 --> 00:35:27,079
waiting until the last second of a
jump to release a cross court pass.

523
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:30,599
They were high risk, high reward
plays, which naturally creates more variants

524
00:35:30,639 --> 00:35:35,760
and lends itself to the bottom falling
out like it did in the first round

525
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:38,280
against the Hawks. But I don't
think that that means that we can't expect

526
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:43,440
him to play at an All Star
or All NBA level going forward, because

527
00:35:43,599 --> 00:35:46,719
you could see throughout the entirety of
the season how much he was able to

528
00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:51,840
change New York's culture, to make
people around him better, to elevate his

529
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:55,599
game through huge skill leaps, which
tend to be more sustainable than anything else.

530
00:35:55,920 --> 00:36:00,280
He's probably not going to have another
season where every one of those fade

531
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:02,480
away shots that he was taking managed
to find the bottom of the net.

532
00:36:04,320 --> 00:36:08,159
But he can make that shot,
and that's the growth that is more sustainable.

533
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:14,360
I agree with everything you said and
the thing that I'm looking at,

534
00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:16,239
though, Julius Reynold's been solid for
a while, Like when you just look

535
00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:20,159
at dating back to his final season
in Los Angeles, it felt like he

536
00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:22,320
was even underrated then, where they
were just you know, they obviously ended

537
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:25,159
up with Lebron James during free agency
then, but he was They had the

538
00:36:25,159 --> 00:36:30,719
opportunity to keep him in twenty eighteen
free agency and they didn't, So it

539
00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:32,679
does seem like he was wildly undervalue. Then. The thing that I think

540
00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:36,280
is the biggest outlier here, it's
not even the passing, just because if

541
00:36:36,280 --> 00:36:37,719
you put the ball in his hands
that much and play him to almost thirty

542
00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:40,199
eight minutes a game like, yeah, six assists is not out of the

543
00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:44,960
question. And look, he had
the turnovers to go along with it,

544
00:36:45,159 --> 00:36:46,360
like his when you look at his
US, it's like, yeah, his

545
00:36:46,480 --> 00:36:51,039
turnover rate wasn't astronomical. It was, you know, one of the better

546
00:36:51,119 --> 00:36:53,000
ones of his career. But just
like the media, that doesn't stand out.

547
00:36:53,039 --> 00:36:57,559
It's the three point shot making and
the overall tough jump shot making.

548
00:36:57,639 --> 00:37:00,679
He made more step back threes this
year and in all of his previous seasons

549
00:37:00,719 --> 00:37:05,039
combined. And I know that shot
has become more of a staple in the

550
00:37:05,199 --> 00:37:08,320
NBA, But when you're also shooting
forty one point one percent from three's overall,

551
00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:12,880
that you know, that's something I'm
going to be watching long term for

552
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:15,639
them. I think there's a chance
that his job becomes easier if they could

553
00:37:15,639 --> 00:37:19,920
get him a secondary initiator next to
him. Is that RJ. Barrett?

554
00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:22,519
Is it training for someone? It's
probably not signing anyone in free agency that's

555
00:37:22,559 --> 00:37:27,039
on the market, Like that's not
Lonzo Ball might make his might help the

556
00:37:27,079 --> 00:37:30,360
Knicks actually run and improve the spacing. That's the other thing. This team

557
00:37:30,679 --> 00:37:32,280
shot the ball well from three,
could stand to shoot more, and some

558
00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:37,800
of their lineups you had Randall a
traditional big, and then sometimes like if

559
00:37:37,840 --> 00:37:40,960
Peyton was on the court or just
another non shooting wing, it could get

560
00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:44,840
a little crampy in the half court. And so there are things they could

561
00:37:44,840 --> 00:37:47,239
do to help him doing sure that
his job gets easier and these numbers sustain.

562
00:37:47,760 --> 00:37:52,800
I am just specifically watching though,
the three point and just overall jump

563
00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:55,880
shot making from him, and I
do think a big part of it is

564
00:37:57,239 --> 00:37:59,760
maybe it goes down. But if
they want Julius Randall to play, I

565
00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:02,119
don't think he's Look, I'm not
a big fan of Oh he plays in

566
00:38:02,159 --> 00:38:06,079
New York, so he got more
consideration if he didn't play in New York.

567
00:38:06,119 --> 00:38:07,639
I don't know if he makes second
team All NBA this season. I

568
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:10,599
think he deserved third team All NBA, and I'm not you know, I

569
00:38:10,639 --> 00:38:15,559
don't quibble over how high he made
it, but I don't know that that

570
00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:17,559
can be his new normal because second
team All NBA implies you're one of the

571
00:38:17,559 --> 00:38:21,719
fifteen best players in the league because
the positions are wonky and everything. I

572
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:23,239
don't know if that's sustainable. We
have to wait and see. I think

573
00:38:23,280 --> 00:38:27,840
he's earned the benefit of the doubt
in the context of, Hey, this

574
00:38:28,039 --> 00:38:34,280
could be the second best player on
a really good team, and maybe maybe

575
00:38:34,719 --> 00:38:37,119
a on a title contender. I
don't know yet. He definitely looks like

576
00:38:37,199 --> 00:38:39,280
he could be like a third best
player on that type of team. It's

577
00:38:39,320 --> 00:38:44,000
just this type of workload. It
wasn't completely new the level of shot making,

578
00:38:44,039 --> 00:38:45,960
though, and that's become I'm stepping
over my own words now. That's

579
00:38:46,039 --> 00:38:51,159
the biggest outlier, and so I'm
interested to see how or whether that sustains.

580
00:38:52,159 --> 00:38:53,840
We do have multiple speaker requests right
now, so I'm gonna tag in

581
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:58,360
the first one, which is Jason
Meredith. Welcome to the show. How's

582
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:01,880
it going today? It actually a
Nick fan, but I'm going to ask

583
00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:06,679
you a question about the Trailbazers because
the Nicks are just not really saying anything,

584
00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:10,079
so there's not really I can ask
you. You keep reading, I

585
00:39:10,239 --> 00:39:15,199
keep reading, everyone keeps saying that
Damian Leonard's like putting gonna put pressure on

586
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:21,039
the front office, and you know, barring really a Ben Simmons trade,

587
00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:24,800
what I don't really know what they
can do, Like what what trades do

588
00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:28,719
you think the front office for the
Trail Blazers can actually make to really improve

589
00:39:28,760 --> 00:39:35,320
this team with outside of like a
Ben Simmons trade. I think Ben Simmons

590
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:39,199
would be target number one because the
CJ McCollum plus stuff framework for Ben Simmons

591
00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:45,519
has been out there. If they
refuse to break up to see H McCollum

592
00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:49,159
and Damian Lillard back court, I
kind of understand it because I think CJ

593
00:39:49,239 --> 00:39:52,719
mcllums would come underrated. I will
say, if you want to keep Norman

594
00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:55,800
Powell and you believe in Anthony Simmons, he has never been more expendable to

595
00:39:55,920 --> 00:39:59,639
you, You're not going to pay
all four of these dudes McCollum, Lillard,

596
00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:02,039
Si and Powell. And if you
can keep if I ad him,

597
00:40:02,199 --> 00:40:06,440
and if I threw this to you
very quickly. I tell you of a

598
00:40:06,519 --> 00:40:12,400
McCullum or you can pay Norman Powell
and Anthony Simons combined what you're paying McCullum.

599
00:40:13,079 --> 00:40:16,639
Are you still taking McCullum, Yes? Absolutely? Is it by wide

600
00:40:16,679 --> 00:40:21,800
margin? I think so? All
right? Fair enough, but I think

601
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:23,480
you need to be more open to
moving him. I don't know how attractive

602
00:40:23,519 --> 00:40:28,239
he is. And I think the
fact that when Ben Simmons's trade value is

603
00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:30,360
at his Nate year, when you
talk to Sixers fans and people, they

604
00:40:30,360 --> 00:40:35,000
would rather float it into next season
to see if they could reboot Ben Simmons's

605
00:40:35,039 --> 00:40:37,599
trade value and accepting C. J. McCullum says, it all about probably

606
00:40:37,639 --> 00:40:43,360
the defensive challenges he injects into your
system. And even though he's look,

607
00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:45,320
he's a bucket and he's proven time
to get into the playoffs that he could

608
00:40:45,320 --> 00:40:50,559
do it. What they could do
is you have Yusef Nurkis's this spiring deal.

609
00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:53,320
You do have Simons and during a
contract year you can trade first round

610
00:40:53,360 --> 00:41:00,119
picks starting in twenty twenty three,
can you do a smaller scale but still

611
00:41:00,239 --> 00:41:07,519
impactful deal that appreciably improves your defense? And the names I have circled here

612
00:41:07,800 --> 00:41:09,480
as just suggestions, and I don't
know how, I don't know what necessarily

613
00:41:09,559 --> 00:41:14,639
the framework would be. Larry Nance
Jr. Would be fantastic for this team

614
00:41:15,239 --> 00:41:19,119
when you look at everything he does
defensively, can switch, can probably give

615
00:41:19,159 --> 00:41:21,639
you some minutes at the five,
but he can also play against Nurkics or

616
00:41:21,639 --> 00:41:27,360
another five. Jonathan Isaac would be
fantastic coming off that ACL injury. I'm

617
00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:30,559
wondering if the Magic would be willing
to sell medium where if you're giving them

618
00:41:30,679 --> 00:41:34,760
two first simons, you know,
are you probably get a third team in

619
00:41:34,840 --> 00:41:37,760
there to see can you get something
for nurkicch or Covington that you send back

620
00:41:37,760 --> 00:41:43,039
to Orlando. Those types of names
where none of them are stars, but

621
00:41:43,199 --> 00:41:47,079
they're really high end role players and
they can help you one on one defensively,

622
00:41:47,159 --> 00:41:51,519
because ultimately that's what this team lacks
is Robert Covington is an excellent team

623
00:41:51,559 --> 00:41:54,760
defender. What Portland needs is probably
more of a Josh Richardson. How gettable

624
00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:59,960
is he? Can you do that
without giving up Covington or cj or Dane.

625
00:42:00,119 --> 00:42:04,760
Of course, they need that type
of player to really boost their defense

626
00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:07,320
in the playoffs because there might be
ways to get by with just nurk in

627
00:42:07,320 --> 00:42:09,360
the middle of the regular season become
playoff time, like you need. The

628
00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:14,159
Jazz showed it they still needed someone
aside from Royson Neible to tackle those bigler

629
00:42:14,199 --> 00:42:16,840
assignments that boy on Bodonovitch doesn't have
to do it, and they have the

630
00:42:16,880 --> 00:42:22,119
shot making between Powell between Dane,
between CJ. It's I think they're closer

631
00:42:22,199 --> 00:42:25,679
than people realize, but they need
that defensive lynchpin and I don't think it's

632
00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:29,159
Nurkitch. I would be willing to
trade him in a heartbeat if you could

633
00:42:29,199 --> 00:42:34,119
get it. I have trouble seeing
Jonathan Isaac being moved by the Magic,

634
00:42:34,320 --> 00:42:37,599
and I feel like we have to
clarify that we're talking about twenty nineteen twenty

635
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:43,119
Josh Richardson and not current season Josh
Richardson because those teams effectively. But that

636
00:42:43,199 --> 00:42:45,960
helps the Blazers, right, that
helps the Blazers because it's definitely it's probably

637
00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:49,480
gonna opt in and maybe his value
is lower, but yeah, I should

638
00:42:49,519 --> 00:42:52,519
have prefaced with and look, I'm
probably talking more so about twenty eight twenty

639
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:57,719
nineteen Josh Richardson will be fair because
he wasn't exactly a fantastic in Philly.

640
00:42:58,840 --> 00:43:02,760
Fair enough. I'm move on to
our next speaker though, which is Tavish

641
00:43:02,840 --> 00:43:06,800
Logan. And if I mispronounced that, please correct me in my apologies.

642
00:43:06,840 --> 00:43:14,440
But you are now on the show. How's it going? Hey? You

643
00:43:14,519 --> 00:43:17,400
guys? There, we are here. How are you hey? I'm doing

644
00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:20,920
great. So I had two questions
for you. I know you guys are

645
00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:23,760
talking sort of long term stuff and
my second question is sort of a hopeful

646
00:43:23,840 --> 00:43:30,320
question. But the initial question is
who do you guys think the Sun should

647
00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:34,280
be rooting for in this next game? Do they want a longer series or

648
00:43:35,320 --> 00:43:38,760
do they want, you know,
like a quicker game. How much you

649
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:42,719
know, injuries have been a huge
part of the playoffs, so how much

650
00:43:42,760 --> 00:43:47,320
does extra rest affect their performance?
Yeah? With that one, I do

651
00:43:47,599 --> 00:43:53,199
think that it is in Phoenix's best
interest to have the Eastern Conference Finals go

652
00:43:53,320 --> 00:43:58,920
seven games because this second half of
the season has been so condensed, and

653
00:43:59,039 --> 00:44:02,679
the playoffs and particular have been so
condensed where there isn't the typical, you

654
00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:07,519
know, occasional two days of rest. It's one day off, it's playing

655
00:44:07,559 --> 00:44:09,000
the next day. It's one day
off, it's playing the next day.

656
00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:13,960
And given that You're still trying to
make sure that Chris Paul is in fully

657
00:44:14,000 --> 00:44:17,360
functioning form and that Devin Booker has
had as much time as possible for his

658
00:44:17,920 --> 00:44:22,920
broken nose potentially twice broken nose to
heal that it does make more sense for

659
00:44:23,039 --> 00:44:29,280
them to root for the series to
go as long as possible with Atlanta winning

660
00:44:29,320 --> 00:44:35,000
it, because ultimately they have counters. The Suns probably have defensive counters for

661
00:44:35,320 --> 00:44:42,320
both Janisantaakumpo and Trey Young unlike many
teams, but I do think that Atlanta

662
00:44:42,559 --> 00:44:46,400
is the better matchup for them because
they can throw bodies at everyone. They

663
00:44:46,519 --> 00:44:51,079
know that they can score, they
know that they can defend, and ultimately

664
00:44:51,159 --> 00:44:55,559
Atlanta is the less experienced team with
players who you're not quite sure that you're

665
00:44:55,599 --> 00:45:00,480
not sure that they're quite as reliable. Yeah, the only thing I want

666
00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:01,880
to add to what Adams said is
just that they have even more options.

667
00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:06,119
That the Hawks are easier in general, but they have even more options to

668
00:45:06,239 --> 00:45:10,519
throw at Atlanta than Philly did,
just because like eight and against Collins is

669
00:45:10,639 --> 00:45:15,039
different from and beat against Collins or
and beat against like there are just so

670
00:45:15,079 --> 00:45:17,000
many different things they could do,
and the fact that they're built to play

671
00:45:17,039 --> 00:45:21,519
small. When Atlanta goes to its
all offense units, there's a chance that

672
00:45:21,599 --> 00:45:27,679
that's a very quick series because between
Micaal Bridges and Chris Paul with Entre Young

673
00:45:27,800 --> 00:45:30,559
and then you're still gonna have Jay
Crowder floating around somewhere out there, and

674
00:45:30,679 --> 00:45:32,639
Tory Craig can help out on Trey
Young and it has been fantastic. By

675
00:45:32,679 --> 00:45:36,960
the way, how about you know, Tory Craig going up against the Bucks

676
00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:40,400
in the finals, that's got to
give Milwaukee some like PTSD because they gave

677
00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:46,440
him away for nothing for nothing.
Two. But and also just if Trey

678
00:45:46,519 --> 00:45:49,960
Young's ankle is like what if the
Hawks make it, they won't. What

679
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:52,519
if the Hawks make it out of
the East and Trey Young still injured,

680
00:45:52,679 --> 00:45:55,239
It's much easier to beat the hobbled
Hawks even than the Bucks. So I

681
00:45:55,320 --> 00:45:59,400
think they image up well with both
teams. But I would agree that it's

682
00:45:59,559 --> 00:46:05,840
you to face the Hawks by far
if you're Phoenix. Hey, thanks guys.

683
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:08,280
Second question, real quick, long
term. I'm a big Memphis Grizzlies

684
00:46:08,320 --> 00:46:10,760
fan, been a big fan for
a while, and I just want to

685
00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:14,920
know who are the names I should
look out for, the people I should

686
00:46:14,920 --> 00:46:17,239
look at, but I should be
excited for like older players, younger players,

687
00:46:17,639 --> 00:46:22,400
just anyone who's available. I know
you guys clearly know the cap and

688
00:46:22,519 --> 00:46:25,360
what the market looks like. So
interesting your insight, and thanks for taking

689
00:46:25,440 --> 00:46:30,840
my call. Absolutely, thanks for
asking the questions. All right, Dan,

690
00:46:31,079 --> 00:46:34,639
I'll let you go first on this
one, since you're much more of

691
00:46:34,679 --> 00:46:37,840
an off season grewer than I am. Yeah, so when you look at

692
00:46:37,880 --> 00:46:43,199
free agency this summer, the Grizzlies
can have cap space if they if they

693
00:46:43,280 --> 00:46:46,599
really want it. I would argue
that, even though he's been terrible for

694
00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:50,880
them, the fact that they took
on so much money in the first place

695
00:46:50,920 --> 00:46:55,800
to get Justice Winslow, keep him
operate as an over the cap team and

696
00:46:57,199 --> 00:46:59,280
you can use your mid level exception. I don't know who that puts you

697
00:46:59,320 --> 00:47:00,760
and play for, because then you're
using a tool. It's about nine point

698
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:05,519
eight million dollars this year that a
lot of better teams and more glammor markets

699
00:47:05,559 --> 00:47:08,920
are using. What I was talking
about on Twitter the other night is I'm

700
00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:14,159
wondering if and I'm using this first
example isn't perfect because he ended up leaving,

701
00:47:14,239 --> 00:47:16,400
but Paul George was traded to Oklahoma
City. They convinced him to stay,

702
00:47:16,559 --> 00:47:22,239
and while he eventually wanted out,
they got hat a capslock hall for

703
00:47:22,400 --> 00:47:27,480
him, Toronto training for Kwai.
He gives them one season they want a

704
00:47:27,559 --> 00:47:31,000
title. The Suns they trade for
Chris Paul on a contract year. And

705
00:47:31,519 --> 00:47:35,480
I know a lot of people don't
expect the exercises player option, but given

706
00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:37,840
how well he's played, I think
it was always on the table. You

707
00:47:37,000 --> 00:47:40,119
might win a title, and you
made the conference finals. I am hoping

708
00:47:40,719 --> 00:47:45,920
that this Embolden's teams in non glammor
markets. I hate calling it small markets,

709
00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:50,320
but let's say non traditional markets to
go for it when these types of

710
00:47:50,360 --> 00:47:54,119
players become available, or to initiate
talks to force them to become available.

711
00:47:54,679 --> 00:47:59,719
And when I look at Memphis,
they are they're situated to do some things.

712
00:48:00,360 --> 00:48:04,199
If you just say John Morant and
Jaren Jackson Junior are untouchable, they

713
00:48:04,280 --> 00:48:07,239
still have just so many assets to
move and the fact that they have dual

714
00:48:07,360 --> 00:48:10,519
first round picks in twenty twenty two
and in two twenty four, that,

715
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:15,559
my god, that Golden State pick
in twenty and twenty four might be super

716
00:48:15,679 --> 00:48:19,800
valuable. And I still cannot believe
that the Warriors gave that up to grease

717
00:48:19,840 --> 00:48:22,559
the wheels of the Igadala dump.
I would like to see Memphis this offseason

718
00:48:22,639 --> 00:48:25,519
given what they've done the past two
seasons. The names I am zeroing in

719
00:48:25,639 --> 00:48:30,039
on would be, I think one
everyone's gonna mention Bradley Beale. The fact

720
00:48:30,079 --> 00:48:35,039
that he's a little bit older,
has a player option. Yeah, that

721
00:48:35,119 --> 00:48:37,840
would be his technically fourth contract because
he signed an extension already. Might have

722
00:48:37,920 --> 00:48:42,159
more of an idea of where he
wants to go turns twenty nine next June.

723
00:48:42,559 --> 00:48:45,039
Not the ideal one, the one
I'm actually circling because I don't think

724
00:48:45,079 --> 00:48:47,679
he's someone who would be, Oh, I have to go to a nixt

725
00:48:47,719 --> 00:48:53,000
team. But Zach Lavine just so
in line with the windows of John Morant

726
00:48:53,599 --> 00:49:00,000
and Jaren Jackson junior's best years.
So if you're willing to give up picks

727
00:49:00,719 --> 00:49:06,639
salary matching of which you have,
you have both in this scenario when you're

728
00:49:06,679 --> 00:49:09,239
looking at it, and so like
a package just to kick around would be

729
00:49:09,840 --> 00:49:14,480
the Grizzlies get zac Lavine, the
Bulls get Grayson Allen, Desmond, Baine

730
00:49:14,639 --> 00:49:17,960
Melton, they get number seventeen in
this year's draft, and then a twenty

731
00:49:19,119 --> 00:49:23,159
twenty three two twenty four first round
pick. You have the twenty twenty two

732
00:49:23,159 --> 00:49:25,960
picks to Danglin there too. That
doesn't have to be the exact package.

733
00:49:25,960 --> 00:49:29,599
I think it depends a lot.
If e zach Lean doesn't ask for out

734
00:49:30,280 --> 00:49:31,800
from Chicago, you have to give
up more. If he has for out,

735
00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:36,840
maybe you're able to not give up
Desmond Baine in that scenario. You

736
00:49:36,960 --> 00:49:39,639
also have to know that he's resigning
obviously, and I don't think he elevates

737
00:49:39,679 --> 00:49:45,280
you to championship contender status the way
that Kawie did for Toronto, the way

738
00:49:45,400 --> 00:49:47,840
that Paul George never really did that
for Oklahoma City, but he had Russ

739
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:51,519
next to him. But the way
that Chris Paul did that for Phoenix.

740
00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:54,719
It puts you on a track to
where if John Morant continues progressing, Jaren

741
00:49:54,800 --> 00:50:00,400
Jackson Junior stays healthy and he still
needs to improve defensively just he is,

742
00:50:00,639 --> 00:50:02,719
the versatility is there, but it
just feels like the reaction time, the

743
00:50:02,800 --> 00:50:07,800
decision making isn't quite there yet.
That gives you a viable starting point in

744
00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:10,639
you still have stuff, and I
don't need to call it stuff, but

745
00:50:10,760 --> 00:50:15,039
you have Kyle Anderson, you have
you still have picks left over after the

746
00:50:15,079 --> 00:50:20,559
framework that I had mentioned. They're
still You're still Xavier Tillman, maybe Brandon

747
00:50:20,639 --> 00:50:23,239
Clark, who you know, his
jump shot looks like buffering dial up internet

748
00:50:23,320 --> 00:50:28,119
nowadays, but he was still good
during his rookie season. You still have

749
00:50:28,840 --> 00:50:31,039
quality players the means to still I
trouve Dylan Brooks. Didn't even mention him

750
00:50:31,159 --> 00:50:36,400
earn some all defense considerations this year. You're keeping Justice winslow in the scenario

751
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:37,840
I mentioned, what if he hits
like, what if he just hits stand

752
00:50:37,880 --> 00:50:40,760
still threes and gives you a lockdown
defender. They have options, and I

753
00:50:40,760 --> 00:50:45,400
would really like to see them explore
them and make a quasi all in swing.

754
00:50:45,480 --> 00:50:49,360
I don't want to see them,
you know, give up five six

755
00:50:49,920 --> 00:50:53,159
first round picks plus swaps for Bradley
Beale. But if you can give up

756
00:50:53,199 --> 00:50:57,119
multiple firsts and some of the players
I just mentioned to get a Zach Lavine,

757
00:50:57,480 --> 00:51:00,519
I think that set you up nicely. And I think the Grizzlies are

758
00:51:00,519 --> 00:51:02,280
just I didn't even mention Joanna Valentcuinis
throughout all this who might have been or

759
00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:06,639
was their most consistent player this year
when you factor in the John Morant injury.

760
00:51:07,039 --> 00:51:09,679
So Memphis isn't a good spot.
I think that they would probably prefer

761
00:51:09,719 --> 00:51:15,119
to slow play this, but I
don't know there even though they still feel

762
00:51:15,159 --> 00:51:19,719
far from the very tippy top of
the West. A Zach Lavine deal for

763
00:51:19,760 --> 00:51:22,599
me, And first of all,
is there a more exciting duo in the

764
00:51:22,679 --> 00:51:27,280
league than a John Moran Zach Laine
backcourt? That bead like, Yeah,

765
00:51:27,519 --> 00:51:29,639
so that's the end. That's the
end of my rant. There those are

766
00:51:29,760 --> 00:51:32,599
and also those are like the only
two stars that you can fathom becoming available.

767
00:51:32,880 --> 00:51:37,440
I don't like Siakham for this team. If Fred van Fleet became available,

768
00:51:37,440 --> 00:51:39,199
that may be like kind of interesting. But the fit with John Morant,

769
00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:44,360
like maybe it's actually it's not terrible. I just don't know where you're

770
00:51:44,360 --> 00:51:47,559
giving up for the offensively, it's
perfect Defensively. I was just wonder because

771
00:51:47,679 --> 00:51:51,840
Fred van Fleet has to then cover
a lot more. You know, he's

772
00:51:51,840 --> 00:51:53,800
going to experience that in Toronto anyway, because if Kyle Lowry leaves, like

773
00:51:53,920 --> 00:51:59,920
his defensive workload changes a little bit. So you know, but yeah,

774
00:52:00,119 --> 00:52:02,159
I want to see Memphis make the
win now trade. It doesn't have to

775
00:52:02,239 --> 00:52:07,800
be on the level of you know
what the Bucks gave up for Drew Holiday

776
00:52:07,800 --> 00:52:10,519
and necessarily because they're not that close
or what the Nets gave up for Harden

777
00:52:10,719 --> 00:52:15,400
obviously, but give me zac Lavine
in Memphis. I'm still on teams slow

778
00:52:15,440 --> 00:52:20,039
play the hell out of this.
If you can get Lavine or Bill for

779
00:52:20,119 --> 00:52:22,039
a reasonable price, then do it. That's I'm fine with that. Like

780
00:52:22,360 --> 00:52:27,440
if the asking price for Lavine is
one or two the younger guys one or

781
00:52:27,480 --> 00:52:30,199
two picks, fine, make that
make that win now move. But I

782
00:52:30,400 --> 00:52:34,639
still just look at this roster,
which, assuming that you pick up the

783
00:52:34,760 --> 00:52:38,440
Justice Winslow option, has fourteen players
under contract for next season, and I'm

784
00:52:38,480 --> 00:52:42,679
just intrigued from top to bottom.
You know, we talked about this when

785
00:52:42,719 --> 00:52:45,599
we were doing the most underrated player
on each team within the Western Conference,

786
00:52:46,039 --> 00:52:51,480
and while Jonas Valentinas was ultimately my
pick for Memphis because I still think maybe

787
00:52:51,519 --> 00:52:53,920
this is changing after how he played
at the back end of the season,

788
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:58,400
that he might be the most underrated
player in the NBA. You can throw

789
00:52:58,440 --> 00:53:01,079
a dart at this roster and find
an underrated player. You know, you

790
00:53:01,239 --> 00:53:06,840
mentioned so many names and we really
didn't even focus on Desmond Baye and if

791
00:53:06,920 --> 00:53:09,800
Brandon Clark turns things around, and
Xavier Tillman Senior's potential impact, and Grayson

792
00:53:09,840 --> 00:53:15,840
Allen has shown flashes and de Anthony
Melton has been so effective in smaller spurts.

793
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:21,800
This roster has so many intriguing pieces
with top end pieces that have significant

794
00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:25,159
upside. Valan Junis was the most
consistent player on the roster, probably the

795
00:53:25,280 --> 00:53:30,440
MVP of this season for Memphis.
Marant has all NBA potential. Jaren Jackson

796
00:53:30,519 --> 00:53:32,840
Junior still has all NBA potential.
You have a lot of guys who are

797
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:37,239
valuable role players. You're shaking your
head about Jaren Jackson Junior, but we

798
00:53:37,400 --> 00:53:40,960
still we still have seen enough in
smaller spurts that I don't think it's that

799
00:53:42,239 --> 00:53:45,480
unreasonable to think that he has that
kind of growth potential. But even if

800
00:53:45,519 --> 00:53:49,840
he doesn't, and you know,
he's still on the younger end, like

801
00:53:49,960 --> 00:53:52,719
he's he turns twenty two in September, like, we can in no way

802
00:53:52,800 --> 00:53:58,519
discredit how much upside there is there. This roster has so many intriguing pieces

803
00:53:58,880 --> 00:54:00,639
that I think it would it would
be a mistake to not see it out

804
00:54:00,840 --> 00:54:06,519
unless you're swinging for the fences.
But that would be my question. Where

805
00:54:06,559 --> 00:54:10,960
are you getting the that guy from? You need the second guy, And

806
00:54:12,000 --> 00:54:14,920
in today's NBA, the second guy
probably isn't gonna be Jared Jackson Junior,

807
00:54:14,920 --> 00:54:16,639
even if he peaks, someone who
doesn't really create their own shot. And

808
00:54:16,760 --> 00:54:22,199
I don't look. If you tell
me he's going to become someone who guarantees

809
00:54:22,280 --> 00:54:28,639
you a top thirteen defense and is
going to bomb threes like he did during

810
00:54:28,679 --> 00:54:31,480
his sophomore year, I get it. You still need another guy. And

811
00:54:31,639 --> 00:54:37,760
when you look at this roster,
where is that guy coming from? By

812
00:54:37,840 --> 00:54:40,360
committee? I think that this is
the rare team that is deep enough with

813
00:54:40,559 --> 00:54:45,119
two way players that you could potentially
have a different guy stepping up on different

814
00:54:45,199 --> 00:54:52,599
nights. Because we just described the
twenty nineteen twenty Toronto Raptors and they peaked,

815
00:54:52,360 --> 00:54:54,880
they weren't enough. That's just my
I think if you're Memphis, maybe

816
00:54:54,920 --> 00:55:00,199
that's fine, but like I would
aim for something bigger. I mean,

817
00:55:00,360 --> 00:55:04,320
I think if you if you slow
play it, you're looking at a higher

818
00:55:04,440 --> 00:55:09,360
variance range of outcomes. But I
do think that that outcome includes a potential

819
00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:14,639
championship down the road, assuming that
you get the growth that we're expecting here.

820
00:55:15,519 --> 00:55:19,519
It's it's a riskier play, But
I do think that that ceiling would

821
00:55:19,519 --> 00:55:22,480
be there if you told me you
wanted to wait a year before making me

822
00:55:22,519 --> 00:55:25,079
all in place, you get a
better feel for what Jaren Jackson Jr.

823
00:55:25,199 --> 00:55:28,880
Is. I kind of understand it. But then you're in a situation where,

824
00:55:28,960 --> 00:55:31,159
yeah, there's always a next star
up, but Bradby Beale and Zachalvine

825
00:55:31,239 --> 00:55:35,400
or suddenly off the table. And
that's an area as hard we've seen.

826
00:55:35,599 --> 00:55:37,440
I mean, how many stars in
the last few years have we seen become

827
00:55:37,480 --> 00:55:42,800
available who we had no way of
expecting them to become available. Well,

828
00:55:42,880 --> 00:55:46,119
there's Foule examples from every offseason.
I do think that there's enough youth and

829
00:55:46,239 --> 00:55:51,719
upside here that you're not ruining the
hand that you have for potential trades,

830
00:55:51,880 --> 00:55:55,519
especially because that twenty twenty four Warriors
pick could only become more valuable as time

831
00:55:55,559 --> 00:56:00,960
progresses and we see that the Warriors
aren't making a leap back towards championship contention.

832
00:56:00,000 --> 00:56:04,840
They might, but it might look
more valuable too. You talk about

833
00:56:04,880 --> 00:56:07,000
a team that needs to trade for
Zach Lavine Golden States up there, If

834
00:56:07,039 --> 00:56:09,280
you're telling me that you want to
wait a year before making the all in

835
00:56:09,320 --> 00:56:13,199
play, as long as you recognize
that we're approaching a point where they probably

836
00:56:13,280 --> 00:56:17,360
need to make some sort of double
down outside of the current roster. I

837
00:56:17,480 --> 00:56:22,320
think this conversation is a lot different
and has a lot more urgency next year.

838
00:56:23,519 --> 00:56:27,760
All right, I can. I'll
accept that I'm not about it.

839
00:56:28,360 --> 00:56:35,559
It's satisfactory. That's usually good enough
for me. We have other questions here.

840
00:56:35,599 --> 00:56:37,960
Let's get this evening and get to
them for a couple of quick ones.

841
00:56:37,000 --> 00:56:43,400
Fred asked Zach Collins's career over.
Zach Collins to date has missed exactly

842
00:56:43,480 --> 00:56:46,440
half of all possible regular season games
that he could play in. He had

843
00:56:46,480 --> 00:56:51,360
the left shoulder injury that hurt him
at the beginning of the twenty nineteen twenty

844
00:56:51,559 --> 00:56:55,199
twenty season. He came back,
but he was eventually out for the season

845
00:56:55,280 --> 00:57:00,719
because of a left ankle injury,
which surgery in August then kept him out

846
00:57:00,719 --> 00:57:05,519
for all this season. He ended
up refracturing that ankle recently. I'm not

847
00:57:05,679 --> 00:57:09,320
going to write off his career,
but like I would imagine, with these

848
00:57:09,400 --> 00:57:14,480
injuries, he's probably not going to
be the defender that he projected as,

849
00:57:14,559 --> 00:57:17,639
which was someone who could capably guard
fours and fives and move on the perimeter.

850
00:57:19,000 --> 00:57:22,920
And then before he went down last
season was it I can't remember what

851
00:57:22,920 --> 00:57:24,880
the season was, but he shot
well from three. It was in such

852
00:57:24,880 --> 00:57:29,400
a limited sample. It's two seasons. Yeah, we still last season,

853
00:57:30,000 --> 00:57:34,480
we still don't. We still don't
even have like a reasonable sample to be

854
00:57:34,559 --> 00:57:37,320
like, oh, he's a floor
spacer. That's very much theoretical. So

855
00:57:37,400 --> 00:57:42,400
I don't think his career is over, but I'm very curious to see like

856
00:57:42,840 --> 00:57:45,639
where his peak ends up panning out, And I hope that he's able to

857
00:57:45,719 --> 00:57:49,559
return because that look that sucks,
Like you're young and you there were high

858
00:57:49,599 --> 00:57:52,760
expectations, and I think this wouldn't
have changed everything in Portland this season,

859
00:57:52,199 --> 00:57:55,840
but he very much healthy Zach Collins
would have made a difference for them on

860
00:57:55,920 --> 00:58:00,559
defense. Yeah, it's way too
prem chair to say that his career is

861
00:58:00,679 --> 00:58:05,119
over. And we're talking about a
six foot eleven, twenty three year old

862
00:58:05,559 --> 00:58:08,679
who in brief spurts has shown rim
protection ability, the ability to switch on

863
00:58:08,719 --> 00:58:13,199
the perimeter, and the ability to
knockdown three pointers. And that's what teams

864
00:58:13,239 --> 00:58:16,719
want from big So even if he's
diminished in each of those areas, when

865
00:58:16,760 --> 00:58:21,880
he does eventually make his return.
There's going to be a roster spot for

866
00:58:22,079 --> 00:58:24,840
him somewhere. I mean, we're
talking about a league that just signed Michael

867
00:58:24,840 --> 00:58:29,400
Beasley to a summer league deal,
Like there's going to be a chance.

868
00:58:29,519 --> 00:58:36,039
So Blazers no less a couple.
Let's try to get to these last two

869
00:58:36,079 --> 00:58:37,320
questions. Let's we have any other
speaker requests that I think are good notes

870
00:58:37,360 --> 00:58:43,199
to end on that we offer listeners. Lima's asked, CP three is the

871
00:58:43,280 --> 00:58:45,559
latest star to shine with mid range. How much as spacing helped stars rely

872
00:58:45,760 --> 00:58:50,639
on this low percentage shot, CP
three can snake to the elbow with ease.

873
00:58:50,719 --> 00:58:53,599
He'd bump into a teammate in twenty
seven. Now, this before you

874
00:58:53,679 --> 00:58:57,960
answer books, author of You is
a very high level of mid range question.

875
00:58:58,079 --> 00:59:01,519
I love the way this is framed
as opposed to oh, like,

876
00:59:01,639 --> 00:59:04,920
why is the mid why do people
think the mid range is dead? Or

877
00:59:05,000 --> 00:59:07,880
is CP three proof that analytics are
stupid or something? And that's not to

878
00:59:07,920 --> 00:59:10,920
say master underscore Red was saying this
politely, but this is just this is

879
00:59:10,960 --> 00:59:15,400
the mid range conversation that we can
have, is my point. I'm totally

880
00:59:15,519 --> 00:59:21,039
on board with this question and the
assumptions that it's making. I do think

881
00:59:21,119 --> 00:59:25,679
that there's some validity to the idea
that the proliferation of three pointers has spaced

882
00:59:25,719 --> 00:59:30,920
out defenses enough that it's a better
spot to be shooting from. Ultimately,

883
00:59:30,840 --> 00:59:36,239
the analytics are looking at the points
per shot attempt, and that area of

884
00:59:36,280 --> 00:59:39,199
the court is naturally still going to
be lower than it is from a few

885
00:59:39,239 --> 00:59:44,400
steps back, which is why there's
so much of a tendency to take more

886
00:59:44,480 --> 00:59:47,320
three pointers. But no one has
ever said that those are always bad shots.

887
00:59:47,800 --> 00:59:52,199
And yeah, I mean like people
like Chris Paul, like Chris Middleton,

888
00:59:52,320 --> 00:59:57,280
there are plenty of examples. C
J. McCollum. If you can

889
00:59:57,400 --> 01:00:00,440
make those shots, then you should
take them. And yeah, I do

890
01:00:00,639 --> 01:00:07,119
think that the ability of bigs to
set screens and then either slip and free

891
01:00:07,239 --> 01:00:09,960
up that snake or pop out to
the three point arc and draw out a

892
01:00:10,039 --> 01:00:14,920
big it does create more space.
So I totally buy into that idea.

893
01:00:15,239 --> 01:00:20,280
I would love to see data that
helps confirm that somebody far smarter than either

894
01:00:20,360 --> 01:00:23,320
of us needs to do that,
but I buy I buy the premise.

895
01:00:24,360 --> 01:00:28,599
I reject the notion that there's anyone
in the world who's smarter than you,

896
01:00:28,840 --> 01:00:30,639
and I agree with everything you said. I think Seth Partner of the Athletic

897
01:00:30,719 --> 01:00:32,880
when he was on this podcast put
it to me the best where it was

898
01:00:32,960 --> 01:00:38,559
just mid range shots aren't bad standing
in the mid range if you could make

899
01:00:38,599 --> 01:00:42,079
them. Obviously, all shots are
bad if you can if you can't make

900
01:00:42,159 --> 01:00:46,760
them, but standing attempts for me
as a terrible idea. Right highest percentage

901
01:00:46,760 --> 01:00:50,920
shot on an NBA court. But
like for me, that's a terrible idea.

902
01:00:52,119 --> 01:00:53,559
So if you're standing in the mid
range, and this was alluded to

903
01:00:53,639 --> 01:00:59,079
in the question from Leemas, was
that if you're going to run into a

904
01:00:59,079 --> 01:01:01,880
teammate in two seven or in twenty
twenty one, if your teammates Ben Simmons

905
01:01:01,920 --> 01:01:05,840
because he was just chilling in no
man's land and wasn't a wasn't a threat

906
01:01:05,840 --> 01:01:08,920
to do anything when he was outside
the dunker spot, So that the catch

907
01:01:08,960 --> 01:01:13,000
and shoot looks. If you're gonna
stand still, you're more valuable beyond the

908
01:01:13,079 --> 01:01:15,719
art because in theory it forces your
defender to be pulled more outside the paint

909
01:01:15,760 --> 01:01:19,400
and allows players like CP three to
get in to his spots. And of

910
01:01:19,480 --> 01:01:22,719
course you need to be hitting those
looks like Kevin Durant, whether it's concessed

911
01:01:22,840 --> 01:01:24,119
or not, CP free, whether
it's concessed or not, Devin Booker,

912
01:01:24,159 --> 01:01:28,320
whether it like shoot it like that's
but it's for the role players. Like

913
01:01:28,360 --> 01:01:30,199
you don't want these catch and shoot
middies. You don't want them standing around

914
01:01:30,239 --> 01:01:34,920
there, and you definitely don't want
someone who's bad. I don't want Ben

915
01:01:35,039 --> 01:01:37,880
Simmons dribbling into a bunch of mid
range jumpers, is my point. Like,

916
01:01:37,000 --> 01:01:40,760
just because their unassisted looks doesn't mean
that they're good looks. The other

917
01:01:40,840 --> 01:01:46,320
thing that I feel goes vastly under
talked about is if you have a homogeneous

918
01:01:46,440 --> 01:01:52,599
offensive style, it just inherently makes
it easier for the defense. So just

919
01:01:52,760 --> 01:01:57,840
by expanding a shot profile and forcing
defenses to, at least in the back

920
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:01,960
of their minds, consider the idea
of guarding mid range jumpers, that opens

921
01:02:02,039 --> 01:02:06,639
things up for cutters, for backdoor
cuts, for those slips off the screens.

922
01:02:07,079 --> 01:02:13,519
It opens up a lot of offense
really quickly. Here this is actually

923
01:02:13,760 --> 01:02:17,920
the final two questions, because this
is not worth a discussion. The Cooper

924
01:02:19,159 --> 01:02:22,239
the Cooper Cooper asked, may I
have an insane Shay Gil just Alexander stat

925
01:02:22,360 --> 01:02:27,280
Please, you've come to the right
podcast, my friend, here's your insane

926
01:02:27,360 --> 01:02:31,559
shake gilg Just Alexander shot this season
before he injured the planter or fascia in

927
01:02:31,639 --> 01:02:37,480
his right foot. Stephen Curry and
Kevin Durant were the only other players who

928
01:02:37,480 --> 01:02:43,119
averaged over twenty points and five assists
per game while shooting as well on twos

929
01:02:43,360 --> 01:02:49,119
and threes as shay Gilji Alexander.
What's incredible about this efficiency he shot fifty

930
01:02:49,159 --> 01:02:52,119
four point seven percent on two and
forty one point eight percent on threes.

931
01:02:52,920 --> 01:02:57,639
Is that eighty seven point one percent
of his made buckets point unassisted. That

932
01:02:57,880 --> 01:03:04,760
is the highest share of made field
goals that went unassisted by four hundred and

933
01:03:04,840 --> 01:03:07,840
thirty nine players who appeared in at
least twenty games this season. That is

934
01:03:07,920 --> 01:03:15,480
wild, and I think that is
what renders the Shay Gilchest Alexander superstar trajectory

935
01:03:15,599 --> 01:03:17,719
valid because he can be an offensive
hub. If you're shooting that well and

936
01:03:17,800 --> 01:03:22,199
unassisted looks, it's I mean,
it's game over. So he is fantastic.

937
01:03:22,239 --> 01:03:24,440
Do you have anything to add before
I get to our final question?

938
01:03:25,519 --> 01:03:30,320
My favorite one is that his scoring
average, his rebounding average, and his

939
01:03:30,440 --> 01:03:35,000
assist average have gone up in each
of his first three seasons, and that

940
01:03:35,239 --> 01:03:39,639
is despite a minutes per game decrease
this year. I don't feel like we've

941
01:03:39,679 --> 01:03:45,039
seen the best of SGA to this
point. And I also think because of

942
01:03:45,119 --> 01:03:49,880
his gradual progression, it's where his
season this season for him feels like less

943
01:03:49,880 --> 01:03:52,519
of an outlier than Julius Randalls season
for him. And I'm not trying to

944
01:03:52,519 --> 01:03:55,000
say Julius Randalls was an outlier,
but just the type of role he's had

945
01:03:55,039 --> 01:04:00,480
in the past versus his past progressions
in his previous two years. That's why

946
01:04:00,480 --> 01:04:02,159
it just feels so much of a
given that he's this good. To me,

947
01:04:03,039 --> 01:04:09,320
I'm with you, Idris Mohammed,
kun't damy. I really hope I

948
01:04:09,400 --> 01:04:14,400
didn't put your that too much.
Most underrated MBA free agent this off season.

949
01:04:16,360 --> 01:04:21,559
This is a damn question for surely
waiting for your answer. I would

950
01:04:21,599 --> 01:04:29,320
have two here, the first of
which is Frank Jelkina's, so it's it

951
01:04:29,440 --> 01:04:32,400
is a knick. I actually think
Alec Burks has a chance to be wildly

952
01:04:32,480 --> 01:04:38,440
underrated. He hit more than thirty
seven percent of his spot up, of

953
01:04:38,519 --> 01:04:40,960
his spot up, of his pull
up threes this year, and he hit

954
01:04:41,039 --> 01:04:44,559
some really big buckets for the Knicks
in the fourth quarter, judging by efficiency

955
01:04:44,639 --> 01:04:47,400
in his volume and the number of
looks that he took that were unassisted,

956
01:04:47,679 --> 01:04:50,559
which is basically a given. In
the Knicks's crunch time offense, he was

957
01:04:50,639 --> 01:04:56,239
just one of the He provided the
biggest bang for buck among a ton of

958
01:04:56,239 --> 01:04:58,800
players in the league during crunch time, just one of the most efficient weapons

959
01:04:59,000 --> 01:05:01,280
there. And so I think,
no, you don't want him running your

960
01:05:01,320 --> 01:05:03,639
offense, and he can deviate from
the offense, which is why you know

961
01:05:03,679 --> 01:05:09,199
the Knicks where they're not like trying
to run all these just superintuitive sets.

962
01:05:09,559 --> 01:05:12,079
Maybe they were a good fit for
him, but it's like a secondary guy

963
01:05:12,639 --> 01:05:15,840
off the bench. Reymis just wanted
to start him alongside a Julius Randol or

964
01:05:15,880 --> 01:05:19,159
just another shot creator. He can
you know, he can be really good

965
01:05:19,199 --> 01:05:23,000
for you and he's not gonna cost
a ton. So I think between this

966
01:05:23,039 --> 01:05:26,599
season and at least a stint during
his time in Golden State he didn't play

967
01:05:26,599 --> 01:05:30,559
so well in where do you finished
Season Philly last year, he's really up

968
01:05:30,639 --> 01:05:31,719
his value. I'm curious, as
he would have guess. And then Doug

969
01:05:31,800 --> 01:05:35,840
McDermott is my other one. He
is so scalable and what he does.

970
01:05:36,159 --> 01:05:40,000
There are defensive challenges of playing him, for sure, but he can give

971
01:05:40,039 --> 01:05:43,320
you minutes at the three, three
and four spots. He shot three eight

972
01:05:43,360 --> 01:05:46,480
point eight percent from three this year, and that sustains whether he's taking you

973
01:05:46,559 --> 01:05:51,599
know, stand still threes or he's
off motion. He's become a reliable finisher

974
01:05:51,719 --> 01:05:54,920
when putting the ball on the deck
and drives. That was an element to

975
01:05:55,000 --> 01:05:58,440
his game that he added. He
averaged one point five to seven points per

976
01:05:58,440 --> 01:06:01,400
possession as a cutter this year,
which is that that sounds and reads like

977
01:06:01,440 --> 01:06:05,840
a type of for anyone wondering to
scale. And he just doesn't cannibalize touches.

978
01:06:06,440 --> 01:06:10,320
Almost eighty five percent of his made
buckets this season we're assisted on and

979
01:06:10,440 --> 01:06:15,480
the efficiency just for a guy who
takes as many threes as he does off

980
01:06:15,519 --> 01:06:17,519
the charts better than sixty percent on
twos and as I already mentioned, thirty

981
01:06:17,559 --> 01:06:23,159
eight plus percent on threes. The
only other players to shoot sixty plus percent

982
01:06:23,239 --> 01:06:27,239
on twos and thirty eight plus percent
on threes while burning through as many shot

983
01:06:27,239 --> 01:06:30,280
attempts overall. Can you even guess
one of them at him? There were

984
01:06:30,320 --> 01:06:35,920
two and it's it's not going to
be anomalist in the sense that, oh

985
01:06:36,000 --> 01:06:40,079
he's he's in the company of stars. It sort of fits the plug and

986
01:06:40,159 --> 01:06:44,679
play scalable Mold, mcaial Bridges,
and Michael Porter Jr. Like this is.

987
01:06:44,960 --> 01:06:46,840
I think Doug McDermott probably gets the
full mid level exception, and it

988
01:06:46,840 --> 01:06:49,599
wouldn't surprise me if he got more, which is why I think Indy,

989
01:06:49,719 --> 01:06:54,360
who won't paid the tax but needs
to also keep him, probably has to

990
01:06:54,440 --> 01:06:58,800
dump salary unless they want to lose
Doug McDermott this offseason. So Alec Burks

991
01:06:58,960 --> 01:07:01,199
and Doug McDermott are my two most
underrated free agents. And this was done

992
01:07:01,239 --> 01:07:03,679
by the way. I did look
up the mcdermotts stats while I was talking

993
01:07:03,719 --> 01:07:05,840
about Alc Burks. This was off
the top of my head. So I'm

994
01:07:05,840 --> 01:07:10,400
sure we could build a list that
goes on and on and on. Yeah,

995
01:07:10,519 --> 01:07:12,400
I mean there are plenty of options, Jimmy. You can look at

996
01:07:12,440 --> 01:07:15,159
someone like Dennis Shrewder. He's probably
gonna get sixty million and thinks he's worth

997
01:07:15,199 --> 01:07:17,000
one hundred and eighty millions, so
like he's underrated in his own mind,

998
01:07:18,559 --> 01:07:23,760
wouldn't shock you. I'm Sorry,
what did it shock you if Dennis Shrewder

999
01:07:23,800 --> 01:07:26,519
ended up signing somewhere for the mid
level, Because I think a lot of

1000
01:07:26,599 --> 01:07:30,880
his value is riven. The Lakers
have no other options. But if they

1001
01:07:30,960 --> 01:07:33,440
go out and like complete assign and
trade and say screw the hardcap, I'd

1002
01:07:33,480 --> 01:07:36,199
just be curious to see what his
market is. Sorry, go ahead,

1003
01:07:38,000 --> 01:07:41,599
No, that's totally fine. I
kind of I'm kind of leaning towards Lonzo

1004
01:07:41,679 --> 01:07:44,360
Ball here. I know he gets
a lot of attention, but I still

1005
01:07:44,400 --> 01:07:47,440
don't think that people recognize how impactful
he was during the second half of the

1006
01:07:47,519 --> 01:07:51,599
season and the growth that he's shown. Whether he's gonna be resigned to New

1007
01:07:51,719 --> 01:07:56,800
Orleans or end up in New York
or somewhere else, I just feel like

1008
01:07:56,880 --> 01:08:00,559
he's a drastically better player than the
perception of him allows for him to be.

1009
01:08:00,960 --> 01:08:03,960
And to me, like, that's
what the underrated part means. It's

1010
01:08:04,239 --> 01:08:12,639
where there's a large variance between perception
and actual performance. If we're talking about

1011
01:08:12,719 --> 01:08:18,600
someone who might sign like a contract
that is far too low for their actual

1012
01:08:18,720 --> 01:08:23,600
value. Maybe Jamichael Green, who's
thirty one but has shown that he can

1013
01:08:23,640 --> 01:08:27,800
work in a lot of different lineups
and has defensive chops and the ability to

1014
01:08:27,880 --> 01:08:30,600
space the floor on offense to switch
on defense. A valuable role player.

1015
01:08:31,840 --> 01:08:35,760
I don't see him signing a monstrous
contract, but he can have a significant

1016
01:08:35,800 --> 01:08:41,279
impact on any sort of contender.
So, as you said, there are

1017
01:08:41,640 --> 01:08:45,079
a bajillion options, especially in a
free agent class that is lacking in star

1018
01:08:45,159 --> 01:08:49,479
power at the top. Just by
nature, there are going to be a

1019
01:08:49,560 --> 01:08:53,680
lot of bargains out there. Yeah, I mean, like even a Bobby

1020
01:08:53,720 --> 01:08:56,279
Portis or Ken Birch at this point, those are all names keep an eye

1021
01:08:56,319 --> 01:09:00,119
on. And Spenser, genuinely he
could sign a blow value contract, is

1022
01:09:00,199 --> 01:09:03,359
coming off an injury and a bad
three game sample. I kind of expect

1023
01:09:03,439 --> 01:09:05,079
him to get the bag. But
yeah, I mean, if you're getting

1024
01:09:05,079 --> 01:09:10,159
spencered in wity for under sixteen million
dollars a year, you've won. And

1025
01:09:10,399 --> 01:09:12,960
I would agree with you on Lonzo
Ball if you think that there's more half

1026
01:09:13,000 --> 01:09:15,079
court initiation in him, and I
honestly don't, but I could see why

1027
01:09:15,119 --> 01:09:17,840
people think that there might be,
so I would, but he's I feel

1028
01:09:17,840 --> 01:09:20,399
like he's going to get near max
money and so that might prevent me from

1029
01:09:20,960 --> 01:09:26,039
throwing him in there. Which this
was great This was great. Thank you

1030
01:09:26,079 --> 01:09:29,199
to everyone who meandered in and out
of the room for the past seventy one

1031
01:09:29,319 --> 01:09:31,880
minutes. We are Hardwoodknox, so
if you haven't checked this out, search

1032
01:09:31,960 --> 01:09:36,600
Hardwoo Knox on iTunes, Spotify,
Stitcher, wherever you get your podcast YouTube.

1033
01:09:36,640 --> 01:09:40,840
We're on YouTube as well. Check
us out. Subscribe to us five

1034
01:09:40,880 --> 01:09:43,359
stars only please on iTunes and it
helps us out a bunch. Leave a

1035
01:09:43,359 --> 01:09:46,560
review that helps us out even more. Download every episode and again we're everywhere,

1036
01:09:46,560 --> 01:09:49,640
so subscribe to us until next time. We leave you with the shout

1037
01:09:49,680 --> 01:09:55,680
out to the one, the only, the single most underrated free agency and

1038
01:09:55,760 --> 01:10:00,880
the history of NBA free agency,
apparently the eventually twenty plus a million dollars

1039
01:10:00,920 --> 01:10:08,000
a year player A long the Wall
h