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What is crack lacing fellow thermonuclear efforts. I am Dana Valley joined by for

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the first time in quite a while, but he is the co host of

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one of my favorite team centric podcasts, the Chase Down podcast. Cleveland Cavaliers

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podcast. Carter Rodriguez co host to
Chase Down with Dustin Rowan, one of

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my favorite podcasts. As I stumbled
through this, we're going to talk about

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the Cleveland Cavaliers. Follow Carter on
Twitter at carter Underscore. Shade spelled exactly

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as it sounds. Carter, it's
been Wait, I think you're on this

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podcast a couple of years ago.
It's been way too long. So one,

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apologies, and two, how the
heck are you well? Luckily for

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you, I'm horrible at accepting pod
invites, so you know, the reality

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is it's probably you probably did be
a favor by not making me have to

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say no, no, I'm doing
great. Calves are super duper fun right

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now. Family is super good.
You can't ask for much more. Yeah,

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I mean the Calves. We're here
to talk, of course about Evan

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Mogley trade packages, which is yeah, get We're here to talk about Look,

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as we're recording this Darius Garland is
back, Evan Mobley is back.

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I don't think I ever would have
predicted they would have made it through that

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stretch, including the one game with
Mobiley. Of course, they have the

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best net rating in the NBA.
Since that initial game, we're both Mobiley

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and Garland lost. I have to
start there. There are a lot of

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elements that I think when you look
at it, that go into what they

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did but were. There are like
a few things that stood out in particular.

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Everyone's talking about jaredown or Donovan Mitchell
or said, like, what is

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what is just the secret sauce behind
the calves just not just surviving this stretch,

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but thriving during it. I'll knock
out all the boring stuff first,

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because I do think it's important to
present a balanced blah blah blah blah blah.

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Uh. So they have had a
pretty darn easy schedule during this nineteen

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game stretch. They've had one of
the hardest stretches in the league. And

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even even after this relatively easy stretch
where they've gone fifteen and four, they

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still have the third easiest schedule the
rest of the way, which really underscores

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how brutal the first you know,
fifteen twenty games of their year, were

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they all? And even when they've
had some of their tougher matchups, you

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know, they'll you know, going
on the road to play at Orlando,

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who has been really great at home
all year, things like that, it

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was the third game in four nights. Like they've had a couple of those,

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like good breaks. They've also only
played nineteen games. They've only played

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nineteen games during this stretch. Twenty
seven other teams have played at least twenty

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two. The Pacers have played twenty
six in the same stretch. So I

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didn't notice that when I was looking
at the numbers. G Yeah, so

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they they've now part of that is
skewed by the fact that they played They

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had only one game in one week
when they went to Paris to play Brooklyn.

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So it's not like it's just been
super spaced out like they've had you

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know, relatively normal canes within that. But they're not getting like slam with

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back to back after back to back
after back to back in the in this

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window since December fifteenth, so like
plenty of you know, So that's all.

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That's all like the boring context that
I feel like I have to provide,

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to be a good guest on your
podcast and be relatively bounced. That

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ain't context. That makes you the
best team in the league over during your

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quarter of the season, right with
two of your three best players missing like

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that, that is that that's like
the reason why you might win one or

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two more than expected. Not going
on a tear that you know, puts

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you right at the top of the
Eastern Conference race for like the two seed,

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Like they're right there with with Milwaukee, with Philly and with New York

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and I think some of it has
been just a straight up shot profile change.

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They were not They didn't have a
bad shot profile perconally in the last

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ed that the fourth best in you
know, before December fifteenth and the league

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mostly living at the rim though they
were first in the league in frequency of

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shots at the rim, they were
about six I believe there were sixteenth in

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frequency from three. Since then they
are numero one from three. I mean

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they are they are bombing away,
my friend, they are. They have

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really they really had to embrace basically
they come from deep that's that's something,

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and they had to embrace that kind
of high variance style. You know,

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when you're when you're missing a lot
of your ball handling. Because by the

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way, Donovan Mitchell missed four or
five of those games of those nineteen Karis

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missed four or five of those games, So like they had to kind of

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lean on their strength. And it's
crazy to say, but you look up

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and down their roster and Donovan Mitchell, Sam Merrill, which we'll get into

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sam Merril, the meryl Sons,
George Niang, Max Struce, Dean Wade,

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Like they just have a lot of
stretchy guys that can that can bomb

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away, and they kind of lean
into that. I also think there was

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a degree of simple vacation, like
they were a little just yucky on offense

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to start the year. It's just
everything felt like kind of a labor Everything

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was a was a thought process.
Nothing felt crazy smooth and like one thing

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I think really helps, Like you
look at the lineup they were starting of

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Donovan Mitchell, Isaaca Coro, Max
s Trus, Dean Wade, and Jared

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Allen. Everyone knows their job in
that starting five. You know, Jared

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Allen, we had Serena Winters,
who does amazing sideline work for for Ballet

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sports on just on equip that's just
totally unfazed. She's a g man,

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the no look fistpump for jareded and
she mentioned that she talked about how Jared

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stepped up in the stretch and he's
like, yeah, like I just know

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I have to attack because like sometimes
I think that the quote is like sometimes

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I'll take the easy way out and
just throw it up to Evan and the

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dunker spot. Like like the fact
that he just has to attack that that

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Dean Wade, who is famously like
at his worst is a guy who just

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will disappear on offense for a whole
game. Like he's a guy who might

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play thirty three minutes and only get
up two shot at syms and like that's

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just really hard to deal with.
But like there's no better option when you're

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missing that many guys. So if
Dean's a little open in the corner,

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the team's like, bro, you
got to shoot it. So like all

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of these, you know, all
of this decisiveness and clarity of purpose,

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I think really helped them kind of
bridge the talent gap because if you look

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at their results, you know,
we talk a lot about shooting luck on

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the chase down because it matters a
lot it's like, you know, a

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lot of these games come down to
did you make your wide open threes or

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did you miss them? And sometimes
you can look at a team's hot stretch

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and go, oh, they're just
hitting all their threes and that will normalize

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and they'll they won't win that much. The Cavs are fifteenth in effective three

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point or an effective field goal percentage, Like they are not out there actually

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way undershooting their profile during this stretch. So like, even though it feels

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like the offense has opened up so
much, they're just they're just leaning into

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that high variance. That high variance
is married them along with a defense that

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is just killing teams at the point
of attack, with Isaaca Korro and Dean

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Wade getting a ton more minutes,
like they're their two best perimeter defenders on

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the team that are sometimes the eighth
and ninth man for them and they were

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starting, so you know, being
able to throw those guys at a Dame

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Lillard and a Chris Middleton or a
Paul George and a James Harden or a

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Kawhi Leonard like that stuff really helps. And even though they have gotten a

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little lucky on opponent shooting, the
fact that they've had the number one defense

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in the league during the stretch without
their best defensive player, I think really

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speaks to the way those guys are
playing at the point of attack. So

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it's funny when people ask, like, what's going so well? I have

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nothing to say other than everything everything
was going well. They didn't have a

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single player who was playing poorly.
Sam merrill Is taking the third most three

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pointers per one hundred possessions in the
history of the league and shooting forty two

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percent on them. Yeah, I
mean, like what, yeah, that's

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just it's like and even so you
look at it, you know, you

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were mentioning. Okay, so they
struggled from the field in certain areas,

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but they make up for it with
their three point shooting. And it's like

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even Max Struce, I think ever
since I think it was since the Garland

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injury, he's at like thirty one
percent from three or whatever it is,

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and just the stuff he does has
won a threat then, like his secondary

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playmaking and movement inside the arc,
it's just there. They it was so

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collaborative the way it was happening,
right down to Donovan Mitchell. But I

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think the name that has received the
most shine during this has been Jared Allen,

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because we all know what Donovan Mitchell
does and so I'm just curious as

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to one. I know you don't
know this, but like we skewered the

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Jared Allen contract when it was signed
on this podcast. So one of our

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outrosy, we shout out Frank Nilokino
because he's a legend, and then we

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apologize to apologize to Jared Allen at
the end of every podcast that Grant and

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I do together for the past couple
of seasons, I've talked to Justin about

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how much better he's gotten on offense
over the years. And then there's like,

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now there's another level to it this
season where you're looking at, yeah,

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we know we can do the one
and true dribble decision making. We

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know he has the hookshot. Now
it's like, oh, he has like

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this crazy footwork when he's moving off
the dribble and facing up to what has

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most impressed you about the way that
he's played or his offensive progression or just

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what he has done during this stretch. I mean, again boring answer everything

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he is he is. Really,
they just kind of replaced Evan Mobley's top

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of the key dribble handoff sets with
Jarrett and you know, he's not quite

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the passer Evan is, but he's
done a heck of a good impression.

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You know, he's had plenty of
six to seven assist games, which has

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just never been a part of his
profile on offense. That's never been his

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game. He's a he's been a
play finisher, not a play initiator.

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And the Cavs just were like,
well, how about we try it,

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buddy, and you know, like
they and he's been able to do that

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on super spaced courts where his reads
are easier and he's just making the right

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play more often than not. Then
as an attacker, he's taking more mid

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rangers, which he's always been a
very good as a cavalry. He's been

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a very good mid range jump shooter
and just never takes them. He's got

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like fifty three percent or something from
mid range this year. That's why I

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talk. I'm like fifty two attempts, but I don't really care. That's

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like you're gonna get that from your
center. That's lie by me. Yeah,

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So he's he's taken those. I
think his face up game, he

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talked a lot. He talked to
us at media Day about how he's really

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been working on his face up game
and how he attacks and when they've they've

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played Milwaukee three times or four times
this season, he's killed brook Lopez in

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every game in isolations like brook will
get him every now and again on some

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of these rim attacks. But he's
beating brook Lopez off the dribble from the

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elbow to get to finish through him
or finish over him when Brooks in too

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deep of a drop, like we
saw this guy get completely wiped out by

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a drop defense in the playoffs against
the next I mean completely, And the

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fact that you know that you can
tell this is a thing he's like,

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Man, I'm just not happening to
me again. If they dropped that far.

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I'm going to find a way to
kill teams, whether it's in my

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dribble handoff game, whether it's in
my floater game, whether it's in a

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mid range jumper. And he's doing
all of it and staying really, really

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efficient. And then the one thing
I really haven't seen in terms of praise

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for Jarick because obviously everyone he's one
of the most likable players in the league.

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So I feel like whenever he does
well, like everyone starts to gravitate

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towards him. One thing I haven't
seen is praise for his rebounding, because

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that's the other spot where the Cavs
got absolutely murdered last year in the playoffs.

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They were dead last in the league
after the All Star Break and defensive

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rebound rate in the playoffs, they
were certainly dead last because the Knicks just

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destroyed them on that side of the
ball. Through this stretch, they've been

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the number two defensive rebounding team in
the league. I think how he might

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even have him at one at this
point after the Clippers game. That is

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very, very possible. So the
fact of the matter is, like they're

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doing that without Evan Mobley, who's
the second best defensive rebounder on the team.

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Uh And really like Dan Wade isn't
a high rebound guy. Max Steus

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has never been a high rebound guy. Isaaca Kor has never been a high

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rebound guy. Tristan Thompson is,
but he's mostly been an offensive glass guy.

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He's never been a particularly elite defensive
rebounder. So the fact that Jared's

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like, I think Jared's just secured
his sixteenth consecutive double double today, he's

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just cleaning the glass in a way
that like he's high pointing the ball,

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he's grabbing, he's squeezing the orange
and finishing plays like these are the these

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are the little bits of improvement.
Like the Cabs clearly learned a lot from

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that playoff series. And I always
talk about what lessons a front office chooses

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to learn, because you can't just
like you can't just try to solve every

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problem that pops up in the playoff
series because everything is so interdependent, right,

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every every you know, everything you
do, every tweak you have,

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like whether it's oh we have to
go switch on that, so now we're

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not going to rebound as well.
Like you can't just solve everything. You

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have to figure out like what's like
the root diagnosis. You not just treating

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symptoms. The Cabs clearly were like, shooting this is a roote diagnosis.

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We think if we can shoot the
ball better, all this stuff goes away

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and all the other things won't feel
so bad. They did not go and

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improve their defensive rebounding, like they're
actually playing a little smaller on the perimeter,

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and you know, and they're they're
about the same in terms of the

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front court. They're still just playing
two traditional bigs throughout the whole game.

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They're not playing any burly power forwards
other than Evan Mobley, who you know,

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obviously they haven't had a lot of
chance to do that. They just

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clearly as a team were like,
Hey, let's not suck at this anymore,

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let's get better at this. Let's
choose to care about this. And

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they have and it's working, and
it's one of the reasons their defense is

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so freaking elite, despite the fact
that you know they've been missing their best

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defender for half the year. Yeah, he's I can't say enough good things

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about Jared Allen. And part of
that might be compensating for our takes like

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two or three years ago only sign
that that kind. Sometimes sometimes you got

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to overcompensate. That's part of it. Donny Mitchell shooting six his effective field

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goal percentage on step back jumpers.
I included this in the outline because I

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didn't even think it. When I
went to look it up, I was

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like, it feels like this will
be high, and they expect to be

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that high. Sixty six effective field
goal rate on step back jumpers. Everyone

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knows what he's done. As a
score. I do think that he has

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00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:22,600
done a really good job of toggling
gears without Darius Garland this year. And

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I don't mean that just as when
you dig into the passing numbers, they're

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different, Like he's passing on more
of his drives, his sist rate's going

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to be higher, but he's also
not like I know, he goes through

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stretches where it's the Donovan Mitchell show
almost because it has to be like this

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is someone who embraces being a part
of the larger context as well, And

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it feels like he's actually done that
just as much, if not more,

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without Darius Garland. And so just
curious about your thoughts on whether that's an

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00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:50,759
accurate observation, whether you feel the
same way, or what's impressed you the

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most about him during this stretch.
Well, frankly, I was a little

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disappointed with the way the season started
for both Donovan and Darius. I just

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didn't think they were playing particularly well. To go, I thought they were

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doing like I was listening to National
podcast going it's just more hitting my turn

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year urn. I was like,
they weren't doing that last year, They're

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just doing it now. And I
don't know why. There wasn't that synergy

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for whatever reason. And I just, frankly, I didn't think he was

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playing crazy selflessly, Like I was
really impressed by how selfless he played last

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year, and I just didn't I
wasn't seeing it. I felt like maybe

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it was maybe he was just trying
to take maybe he was just pressing.

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I'm not sure what it is,
but I wasn't seeing him play the kind

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of ball I thought he could play. And I feel like over the last

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month or two he's been playing his
best basketball, perhaps of his career.

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Without Darius, you would think any
offense who has a first unit led by

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Donovan Mitchell as the only ball handler
and a second unit led by Kris Lavert

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as the only ball handler, you
would think that would be a little bit

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of a you know, iso Joe
Hawk's esque offense right where it's like,

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hey, you might be able to
muster a good offense. Sure, that's

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00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:07,159
nice, but like, you're not
gonna be a ball movement offense. You're

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00:16:07,159 --> 00:16:11,759
not gonna be a you know,
it's it's not gonna feel like the Spurs.

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It's gonna feel very like you're just
gonna be efficient by not turning the

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00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:18,759
ball over and just always getting a
shot up. The Cavs over the since

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00:16:18,759 --> 00:16:22,440
December fifteenth, are first in the
league in passes per game, second in

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the league in potential assists per game, and fourth in the league in points

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00:16:26,279 --> 00:16:30,600
generated off of a sisper game.
And I feel like that is purely Donovan

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00:16:30,639 --> 00:16:37,480
Mitchell setting the tone. You know, I think no one has seemed to

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00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:44,200
enjoy Sam Merrill's renaissance quite like Donovan. He is hunting for him for a

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00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:48,600
handoff action guard guard screens, finding
him in semi transition as a trailer,

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Like he is really really looking to
build up his teammates in a way that

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I just don't know if he's ever
been at this level as a playmaker.

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You know, I've always considered him
a very functional playmaker. You run a

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00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:04,680
spread, pick and roll, he
gets into the teeth of the defense.

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If someone slides down, he passes
to the corner. If they don't,

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he shoots, you know, And
it feels like he's doing a lot more

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orchestrating and passing guys open, and
you know, making the skip pass to

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00:17:17,400 --> 00:17:23,799
the opposite corner some really audacious driving
kicks. In terms of both the angles

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He's generating and the zip he's putting
on the ball on the way out.

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He's his playmaking has been on another
level. And then defensively, he's never

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00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:37,599
going to be a great ISO defender. I just think the way he plays

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angles are not great, But the
closeouts have been really, really good.

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He has that low center of gravity
and it really helps him on those closeouts

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where he can fly at the ball
but still shop his feet and not get

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blown by. And the rest of
the Cavs defenders, you know, Dean

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00:17:57,079 --> 00:18:00,079
Wade and Isaaca Kor, they're not
big steels guys, that's not really their

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brand. They are crazy fundamental and
they just they just keep guys in front

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of them and make them take hard
shots. Donovan's been playing a lot of

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free safety and he is kind of
the chaos engine on the defensive end of

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the floor for them. He's the
one that's just you know, jumping passing

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lanes and going for pick sixes.
And that's a really important thing. You

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know, Like there's a lot of
fundament because fundamental defense gets beaten a lot

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in the league because guys are so
stinking good. So it's the rules defense

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00:18:33,400 --> 00:18:34,759
doesn't get played. That's why Carr, come on, So no, it's

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00:18:34,799 --> 00:18:37,559
I forgot it wasn't. It's because
no one tries on defense. No,

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00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:42,039
like fundamental defense gets speeding a lot. So you need that chaos engine every

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00:18:42,039 --> 00:18:45,359
now and again just to muck things
up and get teams off their rhythm and

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make them think about it. Frankly, you know you you need you know,

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some of these hyper aggressive defenses will
mess you up just by making you

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00:18:52,759 --> 00:18:56,359
think about, you know, a
lazy pass every now and again. And

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I just think he's done really,
really well on both sides of the floor.

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00:19:00,359 --> 00:19:04,359
He it really hasn't been his most
efficient as a scorer during the stretch.

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It just hasn't mattered because the everything, because every other part has been

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so darn good. Yeah, he's
like shooting sub thirty two percent on catch

286
00:19:11,079 --> 00:19:15,039
and shoot threes during the stretch,
which is just like those are the looks

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00:19:15,039 --> 00:19:18,240
that you expect Don with Midgell to
shoot a pretty high clip on. I'm

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00:19:18,279 --> 00:19:21,240
wondering if we could, in part
because we are pressed for time overallf we

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00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:25,960
can run through the others very quickly
and you can talk about what's most impressed

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00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:30,200
you or we should be monitoring with
them moving forward. So are you ready?

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00:19:30,359 --> 00:19:33,279
I included them. The alphabet's tough
for me, but they're an alphabetical

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00:19:33,400 --> 00:19:36,640
order. I'm not ranking these players
in terms of importance for anyone who cares.

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So we begin with cars Lavert.
Kris has been really, really good.

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00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:45,319
You can see the times where he
is overextended as the team's de facto

295
00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:51,960
backup point guard with Ricky Rubio's retirement
in Ty Jerome's long term ankle injury that

296
00:19:52,039 --> 00:19:56,000
he unfortunately just had to have surgery
on because it's just not healing. He

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00:19:56,240 --> 00:20:00,000
kind of needs to be in that
role though, because they got to play

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00:20:00,079 --> 00:20:03,640
Sam Merril. Merril has been so
good that he kind of needs to be

299
00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:07,079
the tenth man in their rotation,
and that means that you don't have room

300
00:20:07,079 --> 00:20:08,640
for a backup point guard. So
you feel that every now and again,

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00:20:08,720 --> 00:20:12,279
he's just he's just as a hot
and cold player, you know, when

302
00:20:12,319 --> 00:20:18,039
the jumpers falling, he feels really
really really deadly and like a crazy luxury.

303
00:20:18,039 --> 00:20:19,720
And when he's getting to the teeth
and doing driving kicks, which he's

304
00:20:19,720 --> 00:20:25,920
always been a better driving kick guy
than people understand. Yeah, back to

305
00:20:25,960 --> 00:20:29,079
the time in Brooklyn, like that
was just the thing. Yeah, So

306
00:20:29,079 --> 00:20:33,599
so he's a he's a very solid
playmaker for a bench guard, you know.

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00:20:33,119 --> 00:20:37,200
Uh, and then he really has
been competing on the defensive end.

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00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:41,599
Sometimes he just space cadets a little
bit and he'll he'll kind of, uh,

309
00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:44,880
you know, he'll play an angle
wrong or or not or you know,

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00:20:45,720 --> 00:20:48,880
uh, someone will pre rotate and
he doesn't go get that guy's guy,

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00:20:48,079 --> 00:20:51,680
you know, things like that.
But overall, been really happy with

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00:20:51,759 --> 00:20:56,079
Kris, and like you know,
it's it's hard to ask more of them

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00:20:56,319 --> 00:20:59,559
than what they've asked of him.
Yeah, his and I do think you

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00:20:59,599 --> 00:21:03,400
mentioned it the probing, Like he's
really jacked that up on a permittent basis

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00:21:03,079 --> 00:21:07,039
during this stretch. So that's been
huge for them. Next up on the

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00:21:07,079 --> 00:21:11,799
list is everyone's been waiting for this
sam Merril fire off the takes. I

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00:21:11,839 --> 00:21:15,559
mean, he's just get him in
the three point contest for stuff. I

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00:21:15,599 --> 00:21:19,680
mean, he's just been He's really
added something to this team. And I've

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00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:25,200
already kind of talked about his three
point rate, which is unbelievably elite.

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00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:29,160
But he's also defending well. His
playmaking has been good. When guys run

321
00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:33,359
him off the line, is he's
got he's starting to get that querver level

322
00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:40,359
respect where other guys are getting wide
open layups because people are so panicked about

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00:21:40,400 --> 00:21:45,680
him, you know, like like
Donovan Mitchell ran past him in semi transition

324
00:21:47,240 --> 00:21:49,279
and kind of faked into a dribble
handoff and then just waltzed in for a

325
00:21:49,359 --> 00:21:53,200
layup just a few games ago.
And it's like, because both guys went

326
00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:57,960
to Meryl, Like, you know, those kind of players are are truly

327
00:21:59,599 --> 00:22:03,079
valuable for you, especially in the
regular season, and he's done enough on

328
00:22:03,119 --> 00:22:07,599
the other end to be out there. He leads the team in charges drawn

329
00:22:07,839 --> 00:22:11,480
even though he's really not in the
rotation that long, and I've just been

330
00:22:11,519 --> 00:22:15,119
super pleased with him. He's been
amazing. And also, this is a

331
00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:18,920
spot where you have to give a
little credit to the front office because when

332
00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:22,279
I've said this a lot, when
you go all in on any trade,

333
00:22:22,759 --> 00:22:26,119
whoever it may be, and you
spend a lot of pit capital, the

334
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:30,400
onus becomes goes to the front office
to be like, Okay, you got

335
00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:33,839
to go find diamonds in the rough
because the traditional way of finding role players,

336
00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:37,279
aka the draft, is not going
to be available to you. So

337
00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:44,279
finding a guy like Sam Merrill is
really really important. And you got to

338
00:22:44,279 --> 00:22:48,279
be geeked to hear the Caps George
Niang And why is it his secondary rim

339
00:22:48,319 --> 00:22:53,440
protection? You know, George started
out, he had a really rough start

340
00:22:53,519 --> 00:22:57,480
to the year. Yeah, that
signing wasn't looking that hot at the beginning

341
00:22:57,480 --> 00:23:00,599
of the season. It was looking
back, uh, because he was shooting

342
00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:04,400
like twenty eight percent from three,
a guy who has been the most reliable

343
00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:10,400
forty probably in the entire NBA.
I think he had a here's my pet

344
00:23:10,440 --> 00:23:15,519
theory. It's completely unsubstantiated aggregator alert. Okay, there we go. I

345
00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:23,440
My theory is that playing next to
Joel Embiid with his archetype changed the way

346
00:23:23,519 --> 00:23:27,240
he moved in an offense, because
Joel Embiid's one of the few players in

347
00:23:27,279 --> 00:23:33,680
the league who generates an advantage and
triggers a defensive help before you've done anything,

348
00:23:33,119 --> 00:23:37,319
Like he just gets a catch and
guys how to start moving, you

349
00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:41,480
know, playing on one leg as
we saw against yeah the Warriors on Yeah,

350
00:23:41,519 --> 00:23:47,400
no kidding, So George could just
could plant himself in the corner and

351
00:23:47,480 --> 00:23:49,400
just wait for the ball to get
to him. Uh. You know,

352
00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:52,200
with this team, he's had to
move a little bit more. Uh,

353
00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:56,400
kept you know, shoot off of
relocations and things like that, so I

354
00:23:56,440 --> 00:24:00,559
think it took him a second to
find his stride and leaning to a lot

355
00:24:00,599 --> 00:24:03,119
of like these weird for you know, dribble drives to the hoop that were

356
00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:07,359
not going well. You know,
it was getting and it's just hard for

357
00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:11,640
him, with his body type to
an athleticism to guard. So if he

358
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:15,400
wasn't scoring, he certainly wasn't gonna
be a great defender, and it wasn't

359
00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:18,680
going well. As of late,
though, I think he's really found a

360
00:24:18,759 --> 00:24:22,920
rhythm. He's shooting better, but
more importantly he is just he's making the

361
00:24:23,000 --> 00:24:26,839
right reads. He's in the right
parts of the floor, on both sides

362
00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:30,799
of the floor. His you know, it's not a particularly bulky team,

363
00:24:30,319 --> 00:24:33,359
and when he gets to guard guys
who aren't blazing fast, you know,

364
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:37,039
like he's done well against the Julius
Randalls of the world, even did well

365
00:24:37,079 --> 00:24:41,519
on Kawhi on a few switches in
their game against the Clippers. So I've

366
00:24:41,519 --> 00:24:45,640
been really pleased with George and uh
he was someone I really wanted them to

367
00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:48,799
sign. I thought I had some
egg on my face, but it has

368
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:55,200
been ticking back up. Let's just
say Isaac perhaps the most underrated passer in

369
00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:59,720
transition in the League of Korro.
He has been. He is their best

370
00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:03,680
trans player UH and as a result, he's also their best foul drawer.

371
00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:08,839
UH. He leads the team in
fre throw rate. And I've been really

372
00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:14,559
really impressed with Isaac and the jumpers. Will I think always be kind of

373
00:25:14,559 --> 00:25:17,160
a work in progress. I don't
know if it's ever it's gonna be reliable.

374
00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:19,759
I mean, the numbers look good, the you know, on the

375
00:25:19,799 --> 00:25:22,519
eye test doesn't always look good.
You know, you can kind of tell

376
00:25:22,559 --> 00:25:26,359
the second that leaves his hand if
if you got enough you know, if

377
00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:27,839
he snaffed the wrist well enough,
and if you got enough arc on it.

378
00:25:30,279 --> 00:25:33,039
What I don't think I understood because
Justin and I have obviously spent a

379
00:25:33,119 --> 00:25:36,319
lot of time the last couple of
years just talking about all the ways we

380
00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:38,359
could see Isaac getting better. Justin
has spent a lot of time with the

381
00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:42,440
past couple years selling me on I
score or I've been I've been a pretty

382
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:48,400
avid critic of him, but Justin
has been there Pedlin his stock. That's

383
00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:52,519
what he Justin loves him and I
do too. But one thing that you

384
00:25:52,519 --> 00:25:55,279
know, for all the times we've
talked about, oh, he can do

385
00:25:55,319 --> 00:25:56,799
this, he can do this,
he can do this, he can get

386
00:25:56,799 --> 00:25:59,920
better at this, one thing we
haven't spent any time talking about is how

387
00:26:00,079 --> 00:26:03,839
if he would get better on defense. And he's taken another leap defensively this

388
00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:11,359
year. He is not fouling and
he is destroying top level guards. Dame

389
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:15,640
Lillard's like nine for like thirty against
him this year. He James Harden had

390
00:26:15,680 --> 00:26:22,119
like four points through three quarters against
the Clippers. He is I think in

391
00:26:22,319 --> 00:26:30,799
that n ninety ninth percentile among perimeter
defenders, especially on guards, and it's

392
00:26:30,839 --> 00:26:34,720
made him kind of indispensable. You
know, they have all these guys that

393
00:26:34,759 --> 00:26:38,759
they have to play, and you
know, minutes are a finite resource,

394
00:26:38,799 --> 00:26:44,240
so that's scary. But yeah,
I mean, I just think he's been

395
00:26:44,279 --> 00:26:51,200
so freaking impressive and the way he's
guarding is has gone up another notch.

396
00:26:51,319 --> 00:26:56,160
And you know, I posted a
montage of of Dame trying to get the

397
00:26:56,200 --> 00:27:00,160
same foul call and like six straight
possessions against him, and Isaac was just

398
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:02,920
chest to chest with him the whole
way. It was. It was unbelievable,

399
00:27:03,200 --> 00:27:06,839
So very very impressed with Isaac,
even if the jumper hasn't felt that

400
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:10,440
much better. We had on this
next player. We had a question in

401
00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:11,960
one of our mail bags a few
weeks back from a Discord member, and

402
00:27:12,000 --> 00:27:15,720
so I ended up doing a ten
minute breakdown on Craig Porter Junior. It's

403
00:27:15,759 --> 00:27:19,920
not something I had on my twenty
three to twenty four NBA season podcasting bingo

404
00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:25,039
card. What can you what can
you say about him? Yet another diamond

405
00:27:25,079 --> 00:27:29,119
in the rough? You know,
you everyone everyone after he is an early

406
00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:30,559
season burst, were like, how
does this guy go on draft? And

407
00:27:30,599 --> 00:27:33,599
it's like, well, he's twenty
three and small and not really a shooter.

408
00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:40,359
Like that's that's a pretty unusual profile. But like again, you have

409
00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:42,680
to find diamonds in the rough if
you're in you know, a Cavs organization

410
00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:47,200
that only had one late second round
pick in the draft, and I think

411
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:52,759
they found one in CPJ. His
athleticism is just off the charts. He's

412
00:27:52,759 --> 00:27:57,680
got such bounce, he's quick off
his feet, he's got crazy fast hands.

413
00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:07,000
He led his college team in blocks, which is ridiculous one and when

414
00:28:07,119 --> 00:28:10,200
I saw that, I immediately went
and checked out his wingspan. He has

415
00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:15,480
a very normal wingspan. He's not
exceptionally long either. It's not like one

416
00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:17,799
of these guys who six to one
but with a six to eight wingspan.

417
00:28:18,119 --> 00:28:19,920
It's like a normal I don't remember
exactly what it was, but it wasn't

418
00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:26,759
exceptional. He just has elite timing
and he just gets up off his feet

419
00:28:26,799 --> 00:28:29,960
really fast. He's one of those
kind of you know, like Zach Levine,

420
00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:32,319
like the first time we watched him, how he just kind of levitates

421
00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:34,240
in the air. You know,
he doesn't have a huge load up to

422
00:28:34,279 --> 00:28:41,400
get up. He has that really
great kickcraft, really great read in the

423
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,200
pick and roll, not to go
full moneyball meme. But his defect is

424
00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:49,480
he can't shoot. He doesn't want
He does not want to take threes.

425
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:52,759
He is not interested in taking threes, and even though he's made some,

426
00:28:53,079 --> 00:28:56,480
when he misses, it's one of
those things where it's like, oh,

427
00:28:56,519 --> 00:29:00,480
that's why you didn't want to shoot. And though he's like a water wiggy

428
00:29:00,599 --> 00:29:03,160
from the in between where it's like
he can't really figure out what he's going

429
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:06,400
to do or like cover him there, So that helps a little bit.

430
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:08,000
I have no idea what I just
did with their fireworks. Going off of

431
00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:11,559
my background, I'll fix. Are
you on Mac? Yeah, it's a

432
00:29:11,599 --> 00:29:15,240
new it's a new Mac camera feature. It's so weird that's I'm not even

433
00:29:15,319 --> 00:29:18,039
using my Mac camera right now.
This is annoying as hell. Well,

434
00:29:18,359 --> 00:29:22,720
Craig Porter Junior got fireworks. Yes, he's a fireworks. He is.

435
00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:26,880
He is the embodiment of fireworks.
But I mean he's out of the rotation

436
00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:30,960
right now. Some people are not
super thrilled with that. I totally understand.

437
00:29:30,400 --> 00:29:36,160
H JAB can only play so many
guys, and I do think the

438
00:29:36,279 --> 00:29:40,119
jumper is a limit when he's not
getting to be on ball, and like

439
00:29:40,279 --> 00:29:41,519
when the team's fully healthy, he's
just not gonna get to be on ball.

440
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:47,680
But his fearlessness and coolness, I
mean, it's clear. There's a

441
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:51,119
reason you can tell he's twenty three. You know, he's played a lot

442
00:29:51,119 --> 00:29:55,319
of basketball, and he is much
more comfortable than a lot of guys in

443
00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:59,119
his position would be in some of
these spots. I mean he went straight

444
00:29:59,119 --> 00:30:03,680
into Joelle and b Chest for a
go ahead layup in overtime earlier in the

445
00:30:03,759 --> 00:30:06,640
year. I mean, you can't
get much better than that in terms of

446
00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:10,519
fearlessness. So I think he's on
a two way right now if he ends

447
00:30:10,519 --> 00:30:11,960
the year on a two way,
I'll be stunned. Yeah, because they

448
00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:15,079
have roster spots open too, and
just given the injuries they've dealt with,

449
00:30:15,119 --> 00:30:18,880
it would be weird if they didn't
convert him. Yeah, I think they're

450
00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:23,480
just playing it slow in the meantime
while they get through the deadline and things

451
00:30:23,559 --> 00:30:26,640
like that. I think they are
right up against the tax. I think

452
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:30,480
they're like two and a half two
point seven million, so they might.

453
00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:33,680
I think they're trying to hold that
spot just in case like a crazy buyout

454
00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:38,480
opportunity comes by after the deadline.
That's my guess. At least they also

455
00:30:38,559 --> 00:30:41,680
have like if they could compensate someone
to take on TDD Jerome, they could

456
00:30:41,759 --> 00:30:45,000
you know, get some more we
go rum under the tax as well.

457
00:30:45,079 --> 00:30:48,119
Yes, yeah, there's plenty of
roads. I just don't think. I

458
00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:49,960
don't think they want to count their
chickens before they hatch because like, why

459
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:55,960
would you. He's on you know, he has eligibility left for the regular

460
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:59,200
season on his two way, although
I don't think he spent a single game

461
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:03,839
in the G League, but he's
you know, but like, while they

462
00:31:03,839 --> 00:31:04,599
have it, I just think they're
in no hurry. You know, they

463
00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:08,160
signed Pete Nance to attend Day just
to you know, do him a solid

464
00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:11,519
I think, and use that because
you have to have you can't leave two

465
00:31:11,599 --> 00:31:17,440
roster spots open for I think it's
like past fourteen days. I forget the

466
00:31:17,920 --> 00:31:22,039
window. But I kind of suspect
they'll do the same and get through the

467
00:31:22,039 --> 00:31:26,759
deadline and then you know, make
finalize their roster for the postseason. Max

468
00:31:26,759 --> 00:31:30,640
Streus Streus has just been really fun. You know, he's a guy who

469
00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:37,759
isn't shooting well and you know a
lot of smug heat twitters were like,

470
00:31:37,799 --> 00:31:41,079
ah, see see what we said, and I'm like, I don't know

471
00:31:41,119 --> 00:31:45,960
what you're talking about. He's still
really freaking helpful, Like he's guarding at

472
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:51,839
a high level. His movement and
gravity really do a lot for this team.

473
00:31:52,400 --> 00:31:55,359
His playmaking has been really good.
He's averaging a career high and assists,

474
00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:57,279
Like early in the year he was
averaging four or five assists a game,

475
00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:00,920
which he's never been that kind of
Again, he's just a play finisher

476
00:32:00,960 --> 00:32:06,720
for Miami. So, you know, really great chemistry with Evan Mobley that

477
00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:10,640
I'm eager to see him rediscover now
that Mobley's back. He was. He's

478
00:32:10,680 --> 00:32:15,880
been the plus minus god for these
guys throughout the year and he's earned every

479
00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:22,279
bit of it. And to wrap
this up, Dean put the word out

480
00:32:22,480 --> 00:32:25,240
that he's back up Wade. Dean's
been great, man, And like,

481
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:31,079
I think if jb ends up deciding
to trim down the road, he's never

482
00:32:31,119 --> 00:32:36,359
been a ten man rotation guy in
his entire coaching career, and he played

483
00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:42,359
He's played in ten tonight against the
Pistons, and man, he's got a

484
00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:46,039
hard choice to make because if he
does end up going down to nine,

485
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:51,960
he probably is going to have to
choose between two of Sam Merril, Dean

486
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:55,559
Wade, and George Niang. And
I don't know who he should pick because

487
00:32:55,880 --> 00:33:01,160
Dean has been so good, and
you know, I think Dean has kind

488
00:33:01,200 --> 00:33:06,559
of been the inverse of George,
where the defense is so excellent but he

489
00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:10,279
just disappears, And George the defense
is sketchy, but the offense in the

490
00:33:10,279 --> 00:33:14,440
spacing is always there, And like, if you could just meld those two

491
00:33:14,519 --> 00:33:16,960
together, you'd probably have one of
the best, you know, role playing

492
00:33:17,599 --> 00:33:25,079
four men in the league. But
like Dean at his best is as helpful

493
00:33:25,079 --> 00:33:30,039
as any role player on the Caps
it's just that finding that consistency. He's

494
00:33:30,079 --> 00:33:35,359
not been a consistent three point shooter
in his career. He goes to stretches

495
00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:37,799
where he's unbelievable, and he'll go
through stretches where he'll go ten games and

496
00:33:37,839 --> 00:33:43,839
take you know, twenty six threes, Like it's just not enough if you're

497
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:47,519
going to be a medium to high
minutes player. But the defense for him

498
00:33:47,559 --> 00:33:52,960
has been as good, if not
better, or as good as Isaac except

499
00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:59,160
guarding bigger guys. He is their
best option against big wings, guys like

500
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:04,200
Jason Tate, Kawhi Leonards of the
world. And he's taken on that challenge

501
00:34:04,240 --> 00:34:07,759
every time, and I've just been
really really impressed by him. You kind

502
00:34:07,759 --> 00:34:08,800
of touched on this already, though, So when we're looking at a full

503
00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:13,599
strength, even playoff type rotation,
you think it ends up being Dean Wade

504
00:34:13,599 --> 00:34:15,800
and Sam Merrill is like the most
important of them, and we know Kris

505
00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:19,719
Lburtch is going to be in there, like of these guys that we've mentioned

506
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:23,039
those, do you think those end
up being the most prominent factors? I

507
00:34:23,159 --> 00:34:28,480
don't know yet, to be honest, And like what I've what I've described

508
00:34:29,199 --> 00:34:32,519
is that I think the Cavaliers.
This last year, JB had maybe five

509
00:34:32,599 --> 00:34:37,119
and a half guys he trusted,
which is pretty tough, you know,

510
00:34:37,480 --> 00:34:40,360
because Isaac was hurt. You know, he's missed the month leading up to

511
00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:45,239
the playoffs and was questionable for Game
one. Not a lot of people remember

512
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:49,039
that Dean Wade literally couldn't lift his
arms above his shoulders because he was so

513
00:34:49,159 --> 00:34:53,559
hurt. Yeah, and you know
he quick clearly couldn't play and couldn't help.

514
00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:58,320
This year, JB has a lot
more guys to play. So what

515
00:34:58,320 --> 00:35:02,840
I've been describing is they've got great
pumpk insurance. Like every postseason series,

516
00:35:04,360 --> 00:35:07,280
one of your role players is going
to turn into a pumpkin. It' see

517
00:35:07,280 --> 00:35:09,840
either like either the moment's too big
for him, it's a tough matchup,

518
00:35:10,079 --> 00:35:14,039
their jumper just isn't going whatever it
may be. Like, That's why they're

519
00:35:14,119 --> 00:35:17,760
role players. You can't always count
on them. So I think that they

520
00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:24,480
have unbelievable pumpkin insurance at every single
position. You know, if if George

521
00:35:24,599 --> 00:35:29,440
is the first guy in a playoff
rotation and he's just getting run off the

522
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:31,159
floor on the other end and he's
getting attacked, okay, maybe you turn

523
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:39,000
to Dean. If if the two
big lineup is just the spacing isn't working

524
00:35:39,159 --> 00:35:43,280
and you're not getting enough points,
Okay, then Jarrett maybe goes down to

525
00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:46,039
twenty to twenty four minutes from his
normal thirty and you play more George and

526
00:35:46,079 --> 00:35:52,280
Dean. If Kris is spacing out
and the jumper isn't hidden, okay,

527
00:35:52,320 --> 00:35:57,800
Sam, you're up like they have
a lot of If the starting lineup isn't

528
00:35:57,840 --> 00:35:59,880
defending well enough at the point of
attack, okay, Isac, We're going

529
00:35:59,920 --> 00:36:02,920
to give you more minutes. Like
I just feel like for all the criticism

530
00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:07,719
of JB. Bickerstaff in that postseason
series, and like there were things I

531
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:09,960
took issue with. Don't get me
wrong, I had my own criticisms and

532
00:36:10,840 --> 00:36:15,559
thoughts. I don't think enough people
have acknowledge, like I just do only

533
00:36:15,559 --> 00:36:22,559
add that many levers to pull with
that with a post consolidation trade, a

534
00:36:22,679 --> 00:36:25,800
roster that you know, they made
the Donovan Mitchell trade at the end of

535
00:36:25,840 --> 00:36:29,559
the off season. A lot of
people don't remember that it was like pretty

536
00:36:29,599 --> 00:36:31,559
close to media deck, like all
the other moves had been made, so

537
00:36:31,679 --> 00:36:36,039
like they didn't have a roster that
was like made for what they had become.

538
00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:39,920
I feel like this roster is much
closer to that. One thing that

539
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:46,840
I've said a lot and was my
goal for the off season was the role

540
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:52,039
player. The fit in the depth
were so rough and they had so few

541
00:36:52,079 --> 00:36:57,760
styles they could play that I don't
think I could even evaluate the core four

542
00:36:57,800 --> 00:37:00,360
guys because it's like, Okay,
is the starting line, did the two

543
00:37:00,360 --> 00:37:05,559
big thing that work on offense?
Or was Isaac o'coro's man always coming down

544
00:37:05,559 --> 00:37:08,800
and tagging because they weren't guarding him? You know, like like does Jarrett

545
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:14,000
really not be able to work against
the short role or did or was Danny

546
00:37:14,039 --> 00:37:19,039
Green or seventh man like you know, like you know, coming off of

547
00:37:19,199 --> 00:37:25,159
destroyed knee. Like so I wanted
from this roster to and from this front

548
00:37:25,199 --> 00:37:30,880
office to build a roster that allowed
me to properly evaluate the core guy the

549
00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:35,079
core four guys at an individual level
and they're fit together long term. And

550
00:37:35,119 --> 00:37:37,119
I think this roster has that because
they should. They should be able to

551
00:37:37,119 --> 00:37:39,599
be chameleons, they should be able
to play a lot of different styles.

552
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:44,119
I don't know how, I don't
know if how many of those styles are

553
00:37:44,159 --> 00:37:46,920
eight pluses and like they might run
into that against some teams that just have

554
00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:51,519
certain styles that they're like, we're
killers with this and you can't do anything

555
00:37:51,519 --> 00:37:54,199
about it. Like I do see
that as a potential, but like they

556
00:37:54,199 --> 00:37:59,400
can at least be a BB plus
playing like seven different ways, and that's

557
00:37:59,519 --> 00:38:02,760
that's a big when I think,
and you've touched on this a little bit.

558
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:07,360
Part of the downside of this run
is that it's turned the discourse into,

559
00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:09,559
well, the counts are just better
off with one big or the donald

560
00:38:09,639 --> 00:38:14,400
they've lose to Detroit tonight, the
discourse is gonna be a running wild Damn

561
00:38:15,119 --> 00:38:16,800
what are we like? What will
you add? So there's two parts.

562
00:38:16,840 --> 00:38:22,199
I think there's legitimate concerns to have
about this team on offense, and they

563
00:38:22,239 --> 00:38:23,840
might have addressed it with some of
the players that are there because you mentioned

564
00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:28,320
the Isaaca Korro stuff. Now having
Max Struce there or Sam Merrill, that's

565
00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:30,920
gonna be different about how they can
defend the two big lineups. We just

566
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:34,119
haven't been able to see enough of
it. So one, I think we

567
00:38:34,159 --> 00:38:37,880
can all agree that level heads the
discourse there is just premature, Like let's

568
00:38:37,920 --> 00:38:40,000
just revisit it after this playoff run. If everyone's actually healthy and see what

569
00:38:40,039 --> 00:38:44,239
happens. But what will you actually
be watching for or what are you maybe

570
00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:49,079
actually concerned about as you're looking at
these four now coming back together and playing

571
00:38:49,119 --> 00:38:52,880
together for what hopefully will be an
actual sample size. I think there's really

572
00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:58,039
only one thing that is really appropriate
to angst about. And maybe it's just

573
00:38:58,079 --> 00:39:02,159
because it's the one thing I'm angsting
about, So I'm giving myself more leeway

574
00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:07,880
than the other angsters out there in
the world. But I do worry about

575
00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:12,199
their point of attack defense. This
was my concern the second day sign Strews,

576
00:39:12,679 --> 00:39:16,639
which is like, Okay, you
now have three volume three point shooters

577
00:39:16,639 --> 00:39:22,159
to help booie the offense, because
it doesn't really matter if Evan and jareded

578
00:39:22,159 --> 00:39:25,039
don't shoot if the other three are
getting up like twenty seven threes between the

579
00:39:25,079 --> 00:39:30,079
three of them, which I think
they can do. Like those three should

580
00:39:30,079 --> 00:39:34,599
be high volume three point shooters,
all three of them. However, we

581
00:39:34,679 --> 00:39:39,920
looked at you know, I praised
their rebound rate earlier since those guys went

582
00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:45,079
down, and I do think part
of it is that Jared Allen and Evan

583
00:39:45,079 --> 00:39:49,000
Mobley were having to clean up a
lot of bs to start the year on

584
00:39:49,039 --> 00:39:52,159
that side of the ball, they
were having to go out, don't come

585
00:39:52,239 --> 00:39:54,440
up and help because guys were getting
blown by. Because Darius can be as

586
00:39:54,440 --> 00:39:59,679
fundamental as he wants, he's still
a small guy and Donovan is never going

587
00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:01,119
to be an elite on ball defenders. So it's like, all right,

588
00:40:01,199 --> 00:40:06,599
Max, you're gonna be our our
wing stopper. That's a little scary.

589
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:08,840
You're gonna be who we throw on
Trey Young, you know. So,

590
00:40:09,079 --> 00:40:15,199
like it's kind of what I felt
this season represented. And maybe that'll change

591
00:40:15,239 --> 00:40:20,159
now that they've had to learn all
these hard lessons with these injuries. But

592
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:23,400
I was most interested in like they
kind of took the too big and the

593
00:40:23,400 --> 00:40:30,639
too small thing to their logical extremes, Like if we're gonna have two bigs

594
00:40:30,679 --> 00:40:34,719
that don't shoot, then our top
then our other three guys got to shoot

595
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:36,840
the crap out of the ball,
and they got to shoot it a lot.

596
00:40:37,920 --> 00:40:40,239
And then on the defensive end,
if we're gonna if and if we're

597
00:40:40,280 --> 00:40:44,079
gonna play these two bigs that can't
shoot, they got to be able to

598
00:40:44,079 --> 00:40:46,920
clean up everything that's that that is
our that's gonna be our belief system.

599
00:40:47,320 --> 00:40:52,760
And we saw Utah tried to do
it with one person with Rudy and like

600
00:40:52,840 --> 00:40:55,599
Boyan Bgdanovitch as the four, Like
they were like that was clearly that didn't

601
00:40:55,639 --> 00:40:59,599
work, that was too too far
in the spectrum. But what if we

602
00:40:59,639 --> 00:41:04,159
had to elite defenders that can be
in charge of cleaning up for the other

603
00:41:04,239 --> 00:41:07,519
three. So that I feel like
was kind of their gamble. The front

604
00:41:07,519 --> 00:41:13,880
office is gamble this summer and like
we just haven't had enough time to see

605
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:16,920
how it goes. It's funny their
defense has actually been good. It's their

606
00:41:17,000 --> 00:41:22,480
offense that has been a lot worse
than what it was with Isaaclecorro at the

607
00:41:22,519 --> 00:41:27,400
three for that five man unit.
So I would presume, you know,

608
00:41:27,519 --> 00:41:30,880
call me crazy, but I think
Max Struz should help your off your starting

609
00:41:30,920 --> 00:41:35,480
five's offense and could part of inject. But it's like they've were clearly like

610
00:41:35,519 --> 00:41:38,239
they've experimented with stuff with Evan Mobley
and like that could just be part of

611
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:42,280
that learning curve as well. And
how many how many games does those five

612
00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:45,119
play together? Like ten, this
is their twealth game of special Year tonight,

613
00:41:47,280 --> 00:41:51,400
and not a ton of minutes either, So like they just haven't gotten

614
00:41:51,400 --> 00:41:53,760
a chance to do that experiment.
But I still think that is the core

615
00:41:53,840 --> 00:42:00,559
of their experiment because like justin my
co host will write like he's been getting

616
00:42:00,559 --> 00:42:04,440
a little grumpy with how much people
are focusing on the starting five. Like

617
00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:07,800
he's like, and he's right,
if you're worried about the two those four

618
00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:09,960
together. Last year, by the
way, they had like an offensive rating

619
00:42:10,039 --> 00:42:15,519
that was like almost one twenty twenty
two. Yeah. So but like what

620
00:42:15,559 --> 00:42:17,000
he would say is like, if
you're worried about two bigs, congratulations,

621
00:42:17,039 --> 00:42:21,679
they only do that together sixteen minutes
a game. You're four out the other

622
00:42:21,760 --> 00:42:24,599
thirty two. So, like there
is a bit of over indexing on who

623
00:42:24,719 --> 00:42:29,760
starts and and how those lineups work. But I do, at a fundamental

624
00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:34,559
level believe your best five has got
to be a killer. Like you look

625
00:42:34,559 --> 00:42:37,760
at every great team of the in
the history of the league, their best

626
00:42:37,800 --> 00:42:40,760
five has been really freaking good.
So I do think it matters, even

627
00:42:40,760 --> 00:42:44,280
though it might be over indexed on, And like, I want to see

628
00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:46,559
how that experiment goes. Turns out, Uh, not a great start against

629
00:42:46,599 --> 00:42:50,360
the Pistons, who have one hundred
and eighteen points, but the Cavs looks

630
00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:52,199
like they might get out of it
so but but yeah, like it's one

631
00:42:52,199 --> 00:42:58,039
of those things I'm just I find
it super fascinating and for all the things

632
00:42:58,079 --> 00:43:00,679
I feel like I didn't get to
learn last year, hopefully now that the

633
00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:04,960
team's healthy, I feel like I'm
gonna get to learn a lot about the

634
00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:07,880
limits of what these guys can do. Yeah, I tend to be concerned

635
00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:14,199
about Darius Darlin's three point volume.
There's definitely just the way brother, They're

636
00:43:14,239 --> 00:43:16,400
definitely the way defenses can guard them
with the two bigs. I think Jared

637
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:20,440
Allen, by the way, doesn't
receive enough credit for like his spatial awareness

638
00:43:20,480 --> 00:43:22,400
on and off the ball when playing
with Evan Mobley, that'll help. And

639
00:43:22,480 --> 00:43:27,440
it comes back to you mentioned the
levers to pull when you look at who

640
00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:30,440
their most you fifth player was last
year, Like aside from Mosco Coro,

641
00:43:30,920 --> 00:43:34,039
it was they had Jeddy Osmon or
Cowis Lavert. Now it's like, well,

642
00:43:34,039 --> 00:43:36,519
if you have a healthy Dean Wade
to added that equation, or just

643
00:43:36,559 --> 00:43:40,119
two new players in Max Drews and
Sam Merrill, like it changes the dynamics

644
00:43:40,159 --> 00:43:43,480
of what you can do. I
still oltimly think like a lot of it

645
00:43:43,559 --> 00:43:46,239
might come down to Evan Mobley's own
offensive development. It feels like to me,

646
00:43:46,480 --> 00:43:52,280
he goes through extended stretches of just
indecision, and I'd like to see

647
00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:55,159
him be more decisive and make quicker
decisions, especially when he's moving inside inside

648
00:43:55,159 --> 00:43:58,760
the arc, And that feels like
it could be a big turning point in

649
00:43:58,800 --> 00:44:00,079
the regular season. By the way, I just think this team at hell,

650
00:44:00,119 --> 00:44:02,519
WHI always want a shit ton of
games. Yep, it's the playoffs

651
00:44:02,519 --> 00:44:06,519
where I think that is why I
hotter the most. I think Evan is

652
00:44:06,599 --> 00:44:10,199
cursed by too many choices, you
know, Like it's one of those things

653
00:44:10,199 --> 00:44:15,039
where he's so he can do a
little bit of everything. And like you

654
00:44:15,079 --> 00:44:19,480
know, I talked when you ask
why this stretch has been so good,

655
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:22,119
and I talk about how everything's been
kind of simple. Everyone is their job,

656
00:44:22,280 --> 00:44:27,159
Evan. Nothing about Evan's game is
crazy simple, you know. Like

657
00:44:27,239 --> 00:44:30,320
part of what makes him a special
prospect is the passing, the decision making,

658
00:44:30,360 --> 00:44:35,599
the ball handling, the perspective touch
and jump shooting which isn't quite there

659
00:44:35,679 --> 00:44:38,960
yet. So I feel like Evan
is at his best when he does just

660
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:44,199
get to be decisive. I just
think, sometimes in fairness to him,

661
00:44:44,480 --> 00:44:46,840
if we want him to experiment with
growing his game and doing all the things

662
00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:51,960
we wanted to do. Then we
might have to be okay with some indecision

663
00:44:52,079 --> 00:44:54,920
and to watch his processor work.
You know, it's like when you open

664
00:44:55,000 --> 00:44:59,559
up a laptop and you like you've
got too many programs open. You start

665
00:44:59,559 --> 00:45:02,840
hearing that were like, that's what
I see when Evan is having to think

666
00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:07,920
too much. But like that part
of me wonder is like, maybe we'll

667
00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:12,960
all feel better if he just only
does decisive things. But like, is

668
00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:16,840
that actually the best serve pace development? I'm not sure that's a fair point.

669
00:45:17,280 --> 00:45:21,840
I'll fold these two last topics into
one. The trade deadline is coming

670
00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:23,400
up. They are probably the team
in the league that's the least likely to

671
00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:27,920
do anything significant just because so many
of their keys guys have been injured.

672
00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:30,760
They're so deep. Now, is
there like a type of player you would

673
00:45:30,760 --> 00:45:35,079
like to see them target? And
I'll also fold this into if you need

674
00:45:35,119 --> 00:45:37,880
to just get off your chest as
to why, like the Donovan Mitchell trade

675
00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:40,400
talk is so stupid at this moment, and does there ever come a point

676
00:45:40,440 --> 00:45:44,519
is it like, let's see,
do we have to revisit this depending on

677
00:45:44,559 --> 00:45:46,840
how the postseason ends, and that's
when the level of concern around Donovan Mitchell's

678
00:45:46,840 --> 00:45:50,800
future can rise, or is it
very much sort of right now, not

679
00:45:51,039 --> 00:45:53,599
within the organization or within the fan
base that it's just not a high level

680
00:45:53,599 --> 00:45:58,199
of concern moving forward. It's these
national people that are just like drooling over

681
00:45:58,480 --> 00:46:00,639
the idea of more player movement.
Well, I'll knock at the Donnie stuff

682
00:46:00,719 --> 00:46:04,719
quickly, Like I do think it's
gonna it's gonna linger. You know,

683
00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:07,360
it's gonna be a national story because
he's kind of the most eligible bachelor on

684
00:46:07,400 --> 00:46:13,800
the perspective market right now, and
like you know, of course Cleveland just

685
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:19,119
exists to feed these other more glamorous
places. But on a more serious note,

686
00:46:19,159 --> 00:46:22,000
like I just see you see all
these perspective buyers. The Knicks go

687
00:46:22,119 --> 00:46:25,480
trade their assets for og the Heat
go trade some assets for Terry Rogier.

688
00:46:25,599 --> 00:46:30,519
Like it feels like all the places
that you kind of hear link to him

689
00:46:30,559 --> 00:46:34,639
just kind of aren't that palatable of
options, or they're they're looking in other

690
00:46:34,760 --> 00:46:37,800
places. So with the team playing
as well as they are and with some

691
00:46:37,840 --> 00:46:42,199
of these options drying up, like
I just I don't think anyone's interested in

692
00:46:42,199 --> 00:46:45,480
it, And I'm glad. I
have more fun when we actually get to

693
00:46:45,519 --> 00:46:47,239
talk about what we're seeing on the
court, And what we're seeing on the

694
00:46:47,280 --> 00:46:51,679
court is a crazy bought end dude
who is working really really hard, Like

695
00:46:52,440 --> 00:46:54,880
you know that's knowing about all this
though? Is the reporting is we're reporting

696
00:46:54,880 --> 00:47:00,599
respective He's never attached to Will Donovan
Mitchell wants this. It's just Miami or

697
00:47:00,599 --> 00:47:02,159
New York. And I probably disagree
with you on the assets New York has

698
00:47:02,199 --> 00:47:06,639
available. I think the bigger thing
is just like Donno Mitchell and Jalen Brunson,

699
00:47:06,679 --> 00:47:09,800
like, what is the defense of
that? I don't think the Knicks

700
00:47:09,800 --> 00:47:15,480
want to do that, So,
you know, ultimately I think he,

701
00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:19,519
like I don't think Donovan is the
kind of guy who would who's going to

702
00:47:19,559 --> 00:47:21,599
request a trade like I. You
know, as far as I know,

703
00:47:21,719 --> 00:47:25,639
he still hasn't ever admitted to asking
out of Utah. I just think he

704
00:47:25,679 --> 00:47:30,360
really cares about his image and cares
about how he is represented in like within

705
00:47:30,400 --> 00:47:34,400
his local market. And I think
that's awesome. By the way, I

706
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:37,880
think that's exactly what players should do. Like if we're all gonna ask to

707
00:47:37,920 --> 00:47:42,360
buy into this noble lie and we're
all rooting for laundry, Like, we

708
00:47:42,400 --> 00:47:45,039
might as well play the part,
you know, we might as well play

709
00:47:45,079 --> 00:47:49,199
the part. So like, if
he cares about about, you know,

710
00:47:49,239 --> 00:47:53,239
being a good representative of the Cavaliers
and representative of the place he's playing,

711
00:47:53,320 --> 00:47:57,639
that's freaking awesome to be to me. At least, you know, he

712
00:47:57,719 --> 00:48:00,880
goes to like local high school games
just to support the local scene and things

713
00:48:00,920 --> 00:48:04,320
like that. Very quickly. People
should want this because they should want teams

714
00:48:04,360 --> 00:48:07,320
like the Cavaliers to make the aggressive
play that they did for Dono Midgell in

715
00:48:07,360 --> 00:48:10,440
the first place, so that when
we're talking about these players actually being available,

716
00:48:10,719 --> 00:48:15,719
it's not just the Knicks Lakers heat
rint cycle repeat. Yeah, Like,

717
00:48:15,079 --> 00:48:20,760
what a nice thing it is that
this has happened. So I've really

718
00:48:20,800 --> 00:48:25,440
been pleased with him and what you
know, I feel like with a player

719
00:48:25,519 --> 00:48:29,559
like that, you can just see
by watching the game, and you see

720
00:48:29,559 --> 00:48:34,119
a guy who's crazy invested right now
and working really really hard of recruited guys

721
00:48:34,119 --> 00:48:36,679
in the offseason. So if he
leaves, he leaves. But I'm not

722
00:48:36,800 --> 00:48:38,920
in any hurry to make any moves
with regards to the rest of the trade

723
00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:44,840
deadline. I think you're spot on, man, they have a weird cocktail

724
00:48:44,960 --> 00:48:52,039
of too many helpful guys that aren't
like crazy young aka crazy valuable around the

725
00:48:52,119 --> 00:48:59,079
league, and they don't have any
really significant draft assets, so it's like

726
00:48:59,800 --> 00:49:04,559
the places that they could upgrade or
that like archetypes that they could looked up

727
00:49:04,559 --> 00:49:07,800
grade, like I you know,
an example that puts around caps Twitter a

728
00:49:07,840 --> 00:49:10,119
lot is Dory in Phinney Smith.
He's kind of he kind of is that

729
00:49:10,719 --> 00:49:15,960
Dean Wade George Nang mashup of a
guy who guards well but also shoots a

730
00:49:15,960 --> 00:49:20,679
lot of threes and you know,
has been trusted to do so in big

731
00:49:20,679 --> 00:49:24,599
moments. So the Calves don't have
the ability to get him because you know,

732
00:49:24,639 --> 00:49:27,880
the Nets would want a couple first, but let's say they could.

733
00:49:28,519 --> 00:49:31,079
Is he so much better than the
best version of Dean Wade and George Niang

734
00:49:31,440 --> 00:49:35,679
that you'd be one to include one
of those guys and a guy like Karris

735
00:49:35,719 --> 00:49:39,119
Lavert and lose all that blake playmaking
and ball handling, like you're just kind

736
00:49:39,119 --> 00:49:43,679
of having to do Like they're in
a spot where they probably need to do

737
00:49:43,719 --> 00:49:45,760
like a three for one, but
none of their three are like guys that

738
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:50,760
teams are like salivating over even though
I'm sure no team would be like,

739
00:49:50,840 --> 00:49:52,639
shit, we got Dean Wade.
That sucks. No, they like everyone

740
00:49:52,840 --> 00:49:55,639
like having Dean Wade. But he's
not. Like you're not winning a press

741
00:49:55,679 --> 00:49:59,920
release by trading for Dean Wade.
Yeah, So, like, I just

742
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:05,440
I don't see. I feel like
almost every player on the Cabs right now

743
00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:09,440
their value to the Caves outpaces their
value on the open market. Okay,

744
00:50:09,679 --> 00:50:15,920
And if that's the case, I
just don't see the move. And it's

745
00:50:15,920 --> 00:50:19,199
not I'm like any other fan.
I love trades. They're super fun.

746
00:50:19,199 --> 00:50:22,280
I'm on the trade machine all the
time. I don't think I've ever been

747
00:50:22,320 --> 00:50:25,320
on a in a deadline this close
to the deadline. I don't think I've

748
00:50:25,320 --> 00:50:30,079
ever opened the trade trade machine less
because I just I can't figure out something

749
00:50:30,079 --> 00:50:35,079
that would even interest me, let
alone like be a smart trade for two

750
00:50:35,119 --> 00:50:38,639
teams. Yeah, you need to
get probably a seventh guy, is what

751
00:50:38,639 --> 00:50:42,079
it is. And that's hard to
do. Like you know, oh,

752
00:50:42,119 --> 00:50:45,199
he's our seventh best player in the
playoffs, and that's just that's really hard

753
00:50:45,199 --> 00:50:47,400
to do when you have such minimal
assets. And then, as you mentioned,

754
00:50:47,480 --> 00:50:51,599
when the players that are in house
mean more to you or more valuable

755
00:50:51,599 --> 00:50:54,159
to you than they're going to be
on the outside market. I have kept

756
00:50:54,159 --> 00:50:58,199
you six minutes longer than I said
I would. Do you have anything else

757
00:50:58,239 --> 00:51:00,119
that you think that I missed or
that you to get off your chest before

758
00:51:00,119 --> 00:51:04,599
I let you skidatt Oh, I've
been doing quite a few long monologues,

759
00:51:04,639 --> 00:51:07,039
so if anyone's kept me long,
it's me, buddy, And no,

760
00:51:07,119 --> 00:51:10,480
I think we do. I think
we've tackled it all. So are you

761
00:51:10,519 --> 00:51:14,679
able just to tell our listeners where
they can find you and all the fantastic

762
00:51:14,679 --> 00:51:16,239
work that you do if they're not
following you already. Yeah. Absolutely.

763
00:51:16,239 --> 00:51:22,679
You can follow our podcast at Chase
Down pod and all of our shows are

764
00:51:22,719 --> 00:51:25,199
live on the official Cavaliers YouTube channel, So just go over to that page,

765
00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:29,559
hit U subscribe and you'll see us
live after not most games, but

766
00:51:29,639 --> 00:51:34,039
you know about half of them.
We go twice a week, so we

767
00:51:34,119 --> 00:51:37,320
love doing postgame stuff. It's really
fun and I hope you guys join us

768
00:51:37,360 --> 00:51:40,199
there. The link to where you
can subscribe to the Chase Down podcast will

769
00:51:40,199 --> 00:51:44,679
be in the podcast and YouTube description. Thank you so much for your time,

770
00:51:44,760 --> 00:51:47,159
Carter. I will past you again
in the future. And fully expect

771
00:51:47,159 --> 00:51:51,480
you to say no that time.
No no no, it's only if my

772
00:51:51,599 --> 00:51:54,920
children ruin it. Thank you so
much man, I'll talk to you so

773
00:51:54,960 --> 00:51:55,800
good. Thank you