1 00:00:01,080 --> 00:00:07,200 You're listening to the Mind Over Murder podcast. My name is Bill Thomas. 2 00:00:07,719 --> 00:00:12,039 I'm a writer, consulting, producer, and now podcaster. I am now 3 00:00:12,080 --> 00:00:16,000 trying to use my experience as the brother of a murder victim to help other 4 00:00:16,079 --> 00:00:20,239 victims of violent crime. I'm working on a book on the unsolved Colonial Parkway 5 00:00:20,320 --> 00:00:24,719 murders and I'm the co administrator of the Colonial Parkway Murders Facebook group together with 6 00:00:24,800 --> 00:00:29,079 Kristin Dilley. My name is Kristin Dilley. I'm a writer, a researcher, 7 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:32,799 a teacher, and a victim's advocate, as well as the social media 8 00:00:32,840 --> 00:00:37,880 manager and co administrator for the Colonial Parkway Murders Facebook page with my partner in 9 00:00:37,880 --> 00:00:50,799 crime, Bill Thomas. Welcome to mind Over Murder. I'm Kristin Dilley and 10 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:55,320 I'm Bill Thomas. It's a lovely day out here in pollen Landia. I 11 00:00:55,399 --> 00:00:59,159 don't know about you, but Virginia is absolutely smothering me with pollen. How 12 00:00:59,159 --> 00:01:03,280 about you up there? Eeticuet mister Thomas, about four to six weeks behind 13 00:01:03,320 --> 00:01:07,840 you. I think it's a beautiful day, sunny, great day for a 14 00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:12,359 dog walk, which we just got back from. Pretty spectacular, but not 15 00:01:12,760 --> 00:01:18,159 heavy duty pollen. Not quite yet. Of course, we had snow on 16 00:01:18,200 --> 00:01:23,599 the ground six weeks ago, so yeah, you guys take a little bit 17 00:01:23,599 --> 00:01:26,480 longer to catch up with the rest of us. I want to imply that 18 00:01:26,480 --> 00:01:29,840 we live at the North Pole or anything like that. It's not Virginia, 19 00:01:29,920 --> 00:01:32,920 that's for sure. That is very true, and it is a lovely day 20 00:01:32,959 --> 00:01:36,760 here in coastal Virginia. So thank you all for joining us for this episode 21 00:01:36,799 --> 00:01:40,400 of Mind Never Murder. And as we have grown so very fond of doing, 22 00:01:40,439 --> 00:01:44,159 we've decided to do another true crime news round up. Because there is 23 00:01:44,239 --> 00:01:49,840 so much true crime news to report on and we're not even getting into some 24 00:01:49,959 --> 00:01:53,280 of those true crime stories. We can only cover so much. It is 25 00:01:53,319 --> 00:01:57,680 always a little bit of a trial trying to figure out what exactly do we 26 00:01:57,799 --> 00:02:00,079 need to cover. In this episode, we decided to pick some of the 27 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:06,040 big, hard hitting stories, and the one that has definitely captured my attention 28 00:02:06,079 --> 00:02:10,639 more than any other right at the moment is the trial of Doomsday mom Lorie 29 00:02:10,759 --> 00:02:15,520 Valo, for the deaths of her children Tylie, Ryan and JJ Vallow. 30 00:02:15,159 --> 00:02:21,000 I shudder every time I see Lorie Vallo's name or the expression Doomsday Mom. 31 00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:27,599 Yeah, very upsetting. And I just very recently finished reading the book The 32 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:31,599 Doomsday Mother from John Glatt, because we will be interviewing John on our podcast 33 00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:38,439 here fairly soon. You miss the full depths of the story just because the 34 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:42,240 news reports can only give you so much. And like the Murdoch case, 35 00:02:42,599 --> 00:02:46,800 which I really only feel I barely got a glimpse of before I watched the 36 00:02:46,879 --> 00:02:52,919 Murdoch Murders documentary, this one is also one of those deeply tangled, rather 37 00:02:53,039 --> 00:02:55,879 upsetting cases that you have to do a deep dive on to really understand it. 38 00:02:55,919 --> 00:02:59,439 I don't know if you feel the same way I do. And I'm 39 00:02:59,439 --> 00:03:02,680 really looking forward to this conversation with John Glatt to talk about his book The 40 00:03:02,719 --> 00:03:06,800 Doomsday Mother, and I think that will give us more of a chance to 41 00:03:06,879 --> 00:03:12,599 drill down because this story just goes on and on. Even reading over the 42 00:03:12,680 --> 00:03:15,639 last couple of days to prepare for this discussion, there were so many disturbing 43 00:03:15,759 --> 00:03:21,680 elements to their story that I had forgotten over the last couple of years. 44 00:03:22,439 --> 00:03:27,199 Yeah, and you know this, I can really only call it depraved because 45 00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:30,680 that's the best adjective I can think of. But I'm sure there are others. 46 00:03:30,680 --> 00:03:34,879 This story really started. It was right before we dropped our first episode 47 00:03:34,879 --> 00:03:39,039 of this podcast that started late twenty nineteen, and there was a report of 48 00:03:39,159 --> 00:03:44,919 two missing children. That is how we first learned the names Tylie, Ryan 49 00:03:44,960 --> 00:03:51,319 and JJ Vallo, and that escalated into an increasingly bizarre story that led to 50 00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:55,800 the arrest of Lorie Vallo, Doomsday Mom, and her boyfriend at first later 51 00:03:57,000 --> 00:04:00,560 husband Chad day Bell will get into his issue. She was in just a 52 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:03,879 couple of minutes for the murders of not only Laurie Valo's kids, but also 53 00:04:03,919 --> 00:04:10,759 the murders of both their former spouses. To make matters even more complicated in 54 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:15,840 a case that wasn't complicated enough, we have Lourie Valo's brother, Alex Cox, 55 00:04:15,079 --> 00:04:18,560 who played a role in both of the children's deaths, and just for 56 00:04:18,639 --> 00:04:23,959 good measure, we have a third husband of Laurie Valo who also ended up 57 00:04:24,040 --> 00:04:30,160 dead. So lots of craziness and the Alex Cox tie in where he may 58 00:04:30,199 --> 00:04:35,879 be responsible for the deaths the actual killing of two of her three children. 59 00:04:36,199 --> 00:04:42,279 Alex Cox ends up dying supposedly of natural causes, and I know you get 60 00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:46,360 into more detail in a minute. This story just has so many twists and 61 00:04:46,399 --> 00:04:49,680 turns, and there's so many people that end up dead. Almost everybody that 62 00:04:49,879 --> 00:04:55,160 Laurie Valo or Chad day Bell ever love, ends up being murdered. It 63 00:04:55,360 --> 00:04:59,560 is so bizarre and frustrating to try to get a handle on, but I 64 00:04:59,600 --> 00:05:02,959 will. The Doomsday Mother definitely helped me figure out. Okay, where do 65 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:08,240 we start. So we'll start with the fact that apparently for quite a while 66 00:05:08,319 --> 00:05:14,120 Laurie Valo was like a normal devoted mother to her children and her fourth husband, 67 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:18,759 Charles Vallo. Or marriages. She became acquainted with Chad day Bell, 68 00:05:18,839 --> 00:05:25,920 who was an author who wrote his books about the end times, the necessity 69 00:05:25,920 --> 00:05:30,240 of prepping for doomsday, those sorts of things, and neither of those are 70 00:05:30,279 --> 00:05:33,360 topics that I've ever felt the need to delve too deeply into. I don't 71 00:05:33,399 --> 00:05:40,480 know about you, more nut job conspiracy theory, craziness. They met at 72 00:05:40,519 --> 00:05:46,000 a conference called Preparing a People, where Chad day Bell was a featured speaker, 73 00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:49,920 and they started what started as an emotional affair and then very quickly moved 74 00:05:49,959 --> 00:05:55,959 into a physical affair. It's interesting John Glatt really paints this picture of Chad 75 00:05:56,040 --> 00:06:00,240 day Bell as being a charismatic cult leader, and he does call him a 76 00:06:00,279 --> 00:06:03,160 cult leader. And I can't say that I had ever really in the stories 77 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:06,800 that I had originally seen about this, I don't think that I characterized him 78 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:11,199 as such. When I think of cult leaders, I think of Jim Jones, 79 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:15,079 or I think of Charles Manson. But I can't say that I thought 80 00:06:15,079 --> 00:06:17,720 of Chad day Bell as a cult leader. I don't know if that image 81 00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:23,680 rang bells for you. Bill. He is out speaking at these bizarre conferences, 82 00:06:23,839 --> 00:06:29,319 and he has written best selling books about the end times, and I 83 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:32,680 think he probably does check enough boxes to call him a cult leader. So 84 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:36,519 she was already just like a very deeply religious person. They're both involved in 85 00:06:36,519 --> 00:06:41,839 the LDS Church. She met Chad day Bell at this Preparing a People conference. 86 00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:48,000 Apparently he just ensnared her and tainted her thinking. He started talking to 87 00:06:48,040 --> 00:06:54,079 her about the concepts of dark and light spirits and zombies, which aren't the 88 00:06:54,120 --> 00:06:57,720 flesh eating dawn of the Dead creatures that we think of. It are something 89 00:06:57,839 --> 00:07:00,839 entirely different, and he managed to convince her that her husband, Charles Valo, 90 00:07:01,079 --> 00:07:04,759 was a zombie, and he means a person who's been infected by a 91 00:07:04,839 --> 00:07:10,680 dark spirit whose real soul is now trapped in limbo, and if you listen 92 00:07:10,759 --> 00:07:14,720 to him, the only way to free that person who is now a zombie 93 00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:18,360 is to kill them. I think later they developed a theory that two of 94 00:07:18,399 --> 00:07:25,079 her three children were also in this zombie category and the only way, as 95 00:07:25,120 --> 00:07:29,360 you said, to free them is to murder them. It wasn't just Laurie 96 00:07:29,399 --> 00:07:33,120 who got ensnared into this too, it was her brother Alex Cox, and 97 00:07:33,199 --> 00:07:40,240 so he also drank the kool aid. He also shared Laurie's conclusion and Chad's 98 00:07:40,480 --> 00:07:45,120 that Laurie Valo's husband and her kids needed to die. Jumped on the train 99 00:07:45,160 --> 00:07:46,600 along with the rest of them. Jumped on the crazy train along with the 100 00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:49,160 rest of them. When she said, Hey, I'm going to need some 101 00:07:49,240 --> 00:07:54,120 help killing Charles Valo here, he said, Okay, sure, this is 102 00:07:54,160 --> 00:07:57,560 so convoluted and so crazy. Just bear with us here for a minute as 103 00:07:57,560 --> 00:08:01,560 we go through this. She called Alex Cox and said, I'd like your 104 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:09,720 help in killing my husband. She called her husband over to her townhouse to 105 00:08:09,759 --> 00:08:15,519 come see Tyle and JJ. When he arrived, her brother Alex Cox shot 106 00:08:15,600 --> 00:08:20,879 him to death and then inflicted himself with a superficial head wound to make it 107 00:08:20,920 --> 00:08:24,720 look like he had been attacked by Valo so that they could argue that it 108 00:08:24,759 --> 00:08:28,759 was self defense. And so the two of them claimed that that Charles Valo 109 00:08:28,879 --> 00:08:31,559 had come at Alex with a baseball bat and Alex had shot him in self 110 00:08:31,600 --> 00:08:35,279 defense, which the police always found a little bit hinky, but they couldn't 111 00:08:35,279 --> 00:08:39,879 really do a whole lot about it at that point. So now Laurie's free 112 00:08:39,919 --> 00:08:45,200 of her husband, and at that point, Chad day Bell murdered his own 113 00:08:45,320 --> 00:08:48,159 wife, Tammy. I'm sitting here shaking my head. The whole thing just 114 00:08:48,240 --> 00:08:54,240 gets so weird. It really truly is. It looks like initially her death 115 00:08:54,360 --> 00:09:01,039 was ruled as natural causes, but after Tylee and JJ's bodies were found, 116 00:09:01,279 --> 00:09:05,080 her family rightfully said, I'm not sure about that. Can we get an 117 00:09:05,080 --> 00:09:09,279 exhamation? And her body was exhumed and an autopsy was performed, and last 118 00:09:09,320 --> 00:09:13,360 I heard, and I think this only came out just last week, her 119 00:09:13,399 --> 00:09:16,519 cause of death was revealed to be asphyxiation, which sure doesn't sound very natural 120 00:09:16,519 --> 00:09:20,919 to me. So now we're down two spouses, But Laurie Vella does have 121 00:09:22,039 --> 00:09:24,879 three children, Tylee and JJ still lived in the home. Colby at this 122 00:09:24,960 --> 00:09:31,039 point had grown up and gotten married. Tad had managed to convince Laurie via 123 00:09:31,120 --> 00:09:33,480 a list that he had written out of all the people in her life that 124 00:09:33,639 --> 00:09:39,240 Tylee and JJ were dark spirits or zombies. It really became a matter of 125 00:09:39,399 --> 00:09:45,919 you have to breathe them from this infestation of bad spirits, and so she 126 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:50,399 enlisted the help of her brother, Alex Cox, who to murder her children. 127 00:09:50,840 --> 00:09:54,200 We don't have a lot of information on that because the person who very 128 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:58,279 likely killed Tylee and JJ has now died, and so there's no confession that 129 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:05,279 they can get out him. I've seen new reports that described testimony that an 130 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:09,480 area sheriff offered just in the last week or two. I know we try 131 00:10:09,519 --> 00:10:15,399 to avoid getting graphic here on mind over Murder, but the descriptions of the 132 00:10:15,440 --> 00:10:20,480 condition of these two kids whose bodies were found on property owned by Chad day 133 00:10:20,519 --> 00:10:26,919 Bell were so horrific. You could tell that these officers who have seen a 134 00:10:26,960 --> 00:10:35,559 lot were just so completely horrified by how these bodies had been abused. It 135 00:10:35,679 --> 00:10:43,799 was just completely mind blowing just how badly these children and then their bodies were 136 00:10:43,799 --> 00:10:50,399 treated by Lorie Valo Chad day Bell and her brother Alex Cox. It was 137 00:10:50,519 --> 00:10:54,840 horrifying. It's not details that we need to get into because they are so 138 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:58,399 graphic and so awful. Anybody who's interested, I'm sure can just dig that 139 00:10:58,519 --> 00:11:03,519 up social media or any current news site. Ultimately, the children were killed. 140 00:11:03,799 --> 00:11:09,320 Tyley was buried in Chad day Bell's pet cemetery, and JJ was murdered 141 00:11:09,440 --> 00:11:16,960 and placed in a wrapping of duct tape and then stuffed inside multiple trash bags 142 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:20,360 and buried by the pond on Chad day Bell's property. So they were not 143 00:11:20,440 --> 00:11:22,799 in the same place. They were in two separate locations on the same stretch 144 00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:28,679 of property. As we mentioned earlier, Alex Cox died of natural causes, 145 00:11:30,039 --> 00:11:33,240 assumedly natural causes, shortly after the murders of the children, so we do 146 00:11:33,279 --> 00:11:39,279 not have answers on what exactly happened. Given the track record of these two 147 00:11:39,320 --> 00:11:45,600 individuals, I challenge the idea that Alex Cox died of natural causes. This 148 00:11:45,919 --> 00:11:48,600 doesn't pass the smell test for me. I'm telling you, if they go 149 00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:54,759 back and take another look at Alex Cox and then circumstances of his death, 150 00:11:54,039 --> 00:11:58,279 I do not believe he died of natural causes. I believe that his sister 151 00:11:58,559 --> 00:12:03,720 and her husband are likely responsible for Alex Cox's death. He supposedly had a 152 00:12:03,799 --> 00:12:09,200 heart attack, but it's awfully convenient that he died of a heart attack shortly 153 00:12:09,320 --> 00:12:13,279 after being involved into these brutal murders at least three people that he may be 154 00:12:13,360 --> 00:12:18,240 directly responsible for killing, and then he conveniently expires. I guess you could 155 00:12:18,279 --> 00:12:24,320 indirectly tie him to the death of Lorie Vello's third husband, Joe Ryan. 156 00:12:24,759 --> 00:12:28,600 He did actually go after Joe Ryan with a taser at one point, and 157 00:12:28,639 --> 00:12:33,559 he tased him so badly that apparently it caused heart defects and heart issues for 158 00:12:33,600 --> 00:12:37,120 the rest of Joe Ryan's life. Even though Joe Ryan died of a heart 159 00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:41,279 attack, you could indirectly, if you really wanted, to tie Alex Cox's 160 00:12:41,279 --> 00:12:46,039 attack of Joe Ryan into his eventual death from heart issues. We believe that 161 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:52,440 Alex Cox, Laurie Vallo's brother, is responsible directly for the murder of her 162 00:12:52,679 --> 00:12:58,240 then husband, Charles Vallo, and we also believe that he's responsible for killing 163 00:12:58,360 --> 00:13:03,399 her two children, and then he conveniently dies. Yeah, it's a mess. 164 00:13:03,679 --> 00:13:07,960 It's a total mess. At that point, Laurie Vallo and Chad day 165 00:13:09,000 --> 00:13:11,879 Bell hopped to Hawaii, which was a place that both of them really liked. 166 00:13:13,320 --> 00:13:18,159 They were married in Hawaii and then decamped there. I'm sure they thought 167 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:22,399 it was permanently. After the police in Rexburg, Idaho, attempted to perform 168 00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:28,000 a welfare check on Tyli and JJ. JJ's grandparents, Kay and Larry Woodcock, 169 00:13:28,159 --> 00:13:31,080 reached out and said, we have not heard from him, and his 170 00:13:31,159 --> 00:13:35,240 mother will not let us speak to him. Can you do a welfare check? 171 00:13:37,039 --> 00:13:41,120 And after a lot of hemming and hallean and oh the kids are safe 172 00:13:41,240 --> 00:13:43,600 and this, that and the other thing, the police eventually said, you're 173 00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:46,840 going to need to produce these kids. You need to produce them, We 174 00:13:46,879 --> 00:13:50,720 need to see them, and rather than do that, they took off to 175 00:13:50,759 --> 00:13:54,879 Hawaii. I thought the Hawaii thing was weird too, because I lived in 176 00:13:54,919 --> 00:13:58,240 Hawaii as a kid. It does feel like you're on the other side of 177 00:13:58,279 --> 00:14:03,879 the world. At the same time, it seems like Laurie and Chad seem 178 00:14:03,919 --> 00:14:07,879 to forget the fact that the state of Hawaii is part of the United States 179 00:14:07,879 --> 00:14:11,840 of America and that they could have easily been forced to come back to Idaho 180 00:14:11,919 --> 00:14:18,039 to face charges. It isn't like they flew off to some South American country 181 00:14:18,120 --> 00:14:24,639 where there's no extradition. They're in Hawaii, flouncing around enjoying their honeymoon weeks 182 00:14:24,799 --> 00:14:28,399 after both of their spouses had been killed, and they're so delusional. They 183 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:33,919 almost behaved like they didn't expect that their behavior would be seen as suspicious. 184 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:39,200 It just is very tone deaf in that way. I definitely remember when we 185 00:14:39,200 --> 00:14:43,840 were first starting the podcast, the ongoing search for those two kids, and 186 00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:46,080 waking up every day to monitor the crime news and Joy and I wonder if 187 00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:50,000 this is the day they're going to find their bodies, And then of course 188 00:14:50,120 --> 00:14:52,480 the next question became, so where a Laurie and Chad. But I do 189 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:56,759 remember the day that they were ultimately arrested in Hawaii and brought back to the 190 00:14:56,799 --> 00:15:03,039 mainland. They kept asserting and that Tayli and JJ were fine, and they 191 00:15:03,080 --> 00:15:05,639 had the story that they were being hidden for their own protection. It's like 192 00:15:05,679 --> 00:15:11,559 they need to be protected from you and not anybody else, not anybody else. 193 00:15:11,039 --> 00:15:15,000 And John glad Outlines did a whole lot more in his book, and 194 00:15:15,039 --> 00:15:18,600 in a much more compelling and convincing way than I can do. Right at 195 00:15:18,639 --> 00:15:24,440 the moment. But Laurie had a long history of manipulating the police and trying 196 00:15:24,519 --> 00:15:31,360 to keep the children from their father Charles Valoe and previous stepfather Joe Ryan. 197 00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:37,080 She really just really made a point of making it difficult for anybody to believe 198 00:15:37,200 --> 00:15:39,919 anything that she had to say. They had this whole story about, oh, 199 00:15:39,960 --> 00:15:43,919 the kids need to be protected clearly from you, not from someone else. 200 00:15:45,320 --> 00:15:48,279 And at the same time, his wife had died two weeks prior to 201 00:15:48,320 --> 00:15:54,840 their fairy tale wedding in Hawaii. The whole thing is just too bizarre for 202 00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:58,279 words. It really truly is. So that's the overview of the case, 203 00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:03,559 and that brings to now, and we are two weeks into Laurie Valo's trial. 204 00:16:03,679 --> 00:16:07,240 I was reading that the trial is expected to last about two months. 205 00:16:07,679 --> 00:16:11,759 The death penalty is off the table for Laurie Valo, but I'm very interested 206 00:16:11,799 --> 00:16:15,200 to see some of what comes out of this trial. Her oldest son, 207 00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:21,159 Colby, testified against her the other day. Apparently was very emotional. Oh 208 00:16:21,279 --> 00:16:26,600 gosh, yes, quite explosive. She was talking to him using Tyle's phone 209 00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:30,600 for a while, like he was trying to get in touch with his sister 210 00:16:30,679 --> 00:16:33,600 and say where are you? Are you okay? She was withholding contact with 211 00:16:33,639 --> 00:16:37,840 them first for a while, and then later of course she murdered her children, 212 00:16:37,159 --> 00:16:41,480 but she was talking to him using Tyle's phone and saying, oh, 213 00:16:41,519 --> 00:16:45,639 I'm fine, I'm okay, I'm just busy, and he obviously very hurtful, 214 00:16:45,759 --> 00:16:48,759 very upsetting for him, and so he really did confront her on both 215 00:16:48,759 --> 00:16:52,240 of those issues in court. Very sad for everybody all the way around. 216 00:16:52,639 --> 00:16:56,279 These people are not exactly rocket scientists. And one of the things that came 217 00:16:56,320 --> 00:17:02,399 out at trial was that cell phone data places our Cox in the yard of 218 00:17:02,679 --> 00:17:06,960 Chad day Bell's property, which is where they found the two siblings who have 219 00:17:07,039 --> 00:17:11,960 been murdered. So jj Enti League's bodies hidden in separate locations. Here's Alex 220 00:17:12,039 --> 00:17:15,799 Cox, who doesn't even bother to leave his cell phone at home that day, 221 00:17:17,200 --> 00:17:22,480 probably murdering and burying those two kids in two separate locations, all the 222 00:17:22,519 --> 00:17:26,440 while he's got his cell phone in his pocket. The whole entirety of this 223 00:17:26,519 --> 00:17:30,559 case, we could do and will do a whole episode unpacking all of this, 224 00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:34,440 and we are very much looking forward to having John Glatt on, not 225 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:37,119 just to talk about the Valoe in the day Bell case, but to talk 226 00:17:37,160 --> 00:17:42,359 about his amazing and very prolific career as a true crime writer. So we're 227 00:17:42,400 --> 00:17:45,960 looking forward to that here in the next couple of weeks. But we'll continue 228 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:51,599 to update on things with the Valoe trial as it continues to unfold. Chad 229 00:17:51,680 --> 00:17:56,519 day Bell will be tried separately, but on similar charges here in the coming 230 00:17:56,559 --> 00:18:00,720 months, so look out for that as well. Another case we've been following 231 00:18:00,759 --> 00:18:07,200 pretty closely is the Phoenix Canal Killer case. You may recall that we did 232 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:12,160 two episodes on the Canal Killer in twenty twenty. Of course, Kristen, 233 00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:18,079 you feel a strong bond here because you went to school in Arizona and worked 234 00:18:18,119 --> 00:18:22,599 as a teacher after completing your master's degree. Yes, that's right. I 235 00:18:22,640 --> 00:18:26,160 went to asco Go send novels, and I teach for three years in Phoenix. 236 00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:29,599 So yeah, this is definitely a case that is near and dear to 237 00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:33,480 my heart. So the latest news is that a jury has found longtime suspect 238 00:18:33,559 --> 00:18:40,079 Brian Patrick Miller guilty of six counts of murder in the deaths of Angela Brasso 239 00:18:40,319 --> 00:18:44,960 and Melanie Burnus in Phoenix. In the cases that we now know as the 240 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:49,680 Phoenix Canal killings. Miller who called himself the Zombie Hunter. You may recall 241 00:18:49,799 --> 00:18:55,799 he had this bizarre vehicle all painted up with Zombie Hunter on the side. 242 00:18:55,799 --> 00:18:59,680 Here we are with zombies again. There seems to be a through line here 243 00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:06,759 bizarre sad killers who fashioned themselves as zombie hunters. He did special events where 244 00:19:06,799 --> 00:19:11,440 he would go and appear with this ridiculous car. He attempted an insanity defense, 245 00:19:11,440 --> 00:19:15,839 which went nowhere. His attorneys argued that the combination of abuse at the 246 00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:19,839 hands of his mother and his autism had turned him into a killer. And 247 00:19:19,920 --> 00:19:26,000 we've talked about this a little bit before, Kristen, I certainly understand that 248 00:19:26,119 --> 00:19:33,839 the abusive behavior of Miller's mother is extremely disturbing. She had shown him pornography 249 00:19:33,960 --> 00:19:38,519 as a very young boy, very violent films which were completely inappropriate for a 250 00:19:38,559 --> 00:19:44,720 little kid. It's understandable that his attorney would bring those things up as a 251 00:19:44,759 --> 00:19:49,720 potential defense. Supposedly, Miller appears somewhere on the autism's scale. As you 252 00:19:49,759 --> 00:19:56,599 were saying recently, Kristen, you can't say just because someone's autistic that they 253 00:19:56,599 --> 00:20:02,279 are now going to end up being serial killers. Seems like a ridiculous contention. 254 00:20:02,799 --> 00:20:06,880 It's the same sort of defense of someone who says that person has a 255 00:20:06,960 --> 00:20:10,799 mental illness or mental issues, or however you want to say it. Clearly, 256 00:20:10,839 --> 00:20:14,559 you can hear the air quotes under issues, and that means that they're 257 00:20:14,640 --> 00:20:18,079 somehow more prone to violence. That is just not true. The idea, 258 00:20:18,279 --> 00:20:25,400 the audacity that any defense attorney would say, oh, essentially, his autism 259 00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:29,839 made him do it. Now, that's disgusting and that's despicable, and it 260 00:20:29,880 --> 00:20:33,799 does a great disservice to anyone who is on the spectrum or dealing with any 261 00:20:33,839 --> 00:20:40,000 kind of autism related disorder. We had a couple of people on our social 262 00:20:40,039 --> 00:20:42,599 media page speak to very much the same thing, and they said it far 263 00:20:42,640 --> 00:20:45,920 more eloquently than I can. At the end of the school day, and 264 00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:49,279 I'm tired, I'm barely coherent. The idea that anyone would ever try to 265 00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:55,400 use his autism made him do it as a defense is despicable. I absolutely 266 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:57,519 cannot believe that they tried that, but I guess they had to try something. 267 00:20:57,799 --> 00:21:03,359 It smacks of desperate from my point of view. Brian Patrick Miller was 268 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:08,359 guilty up and down in sideways in the Phoenix canal killings. His attorney had 269 00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:14,799 to try whatever they could to offer a defense. It was a pretty feeble 270 00:21:14,839 --> 00:21:18,440 defense. It went nowhere. Judge Suzanne Cohen didn't buy any of this, 271 00:21:18,839 --> 00:21:23,079 and she found Miller guilty on all six counts and he faces the death penalty. 272 00:21:23,119 --> 00:21:27,240 Arizona is a death penalty state, so that's a possibility. As we 273 00:21:27,319 --> 00:21:32,400 know, death penalty cases tend to be very protracted, though, so it's 274 00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:37,200 often years before someone's actually sentenced to death. And this was a bench trial 275 00:21:37,599 --> 00:21:42,000 which took many months. I still have friends in Phoenix, and every week 276 00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:47,599 since January when the bench trial started, I have sent something to my dear 277 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:51,839 friend David and said, what's going on with canal killer yet? Anything yet? 278 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:53,599 Tell me more? And he just reached a point where he was sending 279 00:21:53,640 --> 00:22:00,440 me everything. Yeah, he didn't have to field my text anymore. He 280 00:22:00,440 --> 00:22:03,799 could just send me whatever. He did send me an article actually just this 281 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:06,880 morning, I haven't had more than a minute to look at it. I 282 00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:11,640 guess his defense attorney is arguing that life in prison, it's fine, it's 283 00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:14,400 fine. Life in prison is the better thing to do. You don't have 284 00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:17,759 to go for the death penalty. And again I know that's his role as 285 00:22:17,799 --> 00:22:22,559 his attorney. I got that our criticisms shouldn't be taken as implying that we 286 00:22:22,680 --> 00:22:29,759 think that Brian pet Miller deserves anything less than a vigorous defense. He's entitled 287 00:22:29,759 --> 00:22:33,680 to that legally. I just think that his attorney made a number of odd 288 00:22:33,759 --> 00:22:40,160 choices. The bench trial seemed like an odd choice in that keep in mind, 289 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:45,240 with a jury trial, all it takes is one juror not being willing 290 00:22:45,279 --> 00:22:49,079 to move forward. To move you to not guilty verdict, you have to 291 00:22:49,119 --> 00:22:56,960 have a unanimous twelve person jury buy into whatever is being presented. I thought 292 00:22:56,960 --> 00:23:03,319 the bench trial strategy was a range choice. I'm not quite sure what Miller's 293 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:10,559 defense thought they might gain. I think most judges have seen it all and 294 00:23:10,759 --> 00:23:15,599 heard it all, and not likely going to say this person is not guilty 295 00:23:15,839 --> 00:23:19,720 of this brutal series of homicides. I'm so glad that this is finally coming 296 00:23:19,759 --> 00:23:25,480 to an end because this has really haunted the Phoenix area and of course the 297 00:23:25,519 --> 00:23:29,359 families of the victims. I think it's going to be very interesting to see 298 00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:33,680 what ultimately does become of this. Does it become a matter of life in 299 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:37,640 prison without parole? For Brian Patrick Miller or does it become case for a 300 00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:41,920 capital punishment. It would be very interesting to see you're listening to mind Over 301 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:49,720 Murder. Will be right back after this word from our sponsors. We're back 302 00:23:49,759 --> 00:23:53,200 here at Mind Over Murder. We do encourage you, if you haven't done 303 00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:56,599 so already, to listen to our coverage of the Phoenix Canal killings. That 304 00:23:56,720 --> 00:24:00,680 was our sec and season of Mind Over Murder. I believe I think you're 305 00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:06,559 correct twenty twenty, and we did have an interview in there with Colleen Fitzpatrick, 306 00:24:07,200 --> 00:24:11,839 our very own resident rocket scientist, who did all that She did the 307 00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:15,839 gena and genealogy work for this and this is unbelievably cool for her to see 308 00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:19,559 this go all the way from we don't have a name to now we have 309 00:24:19,759 --> 00:24:23,279 a trial and a verdict. I remember when she was telling us the story, 310 00:24:23,319 --> 00:24:27,920 when she got to the place where she had figured out that they were 311 00:24:29,039 --> 00:24:33,640 looking for a suspect whose last name was likely Miller, she really knew she 312 00:24:33,759 --> 00:24:38,720 was onto something. And this is several years back, so investigative genetic genealogy 313 00:24:40,519 --> 00:24:45,279 was still fairly new, and of course Colleen is one of the originators of 314 00:24:45,559 --> 00:24:49,400 this technique. This is a case that she worked on in the early going 315 00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:55,079 of investigative genetic genealogy, so it's a fascinating story. I think this is 316 00:24:55,079 --> 00:25:00,079 a great outcome. This isn't going to bring back Angela Brasso or Melanie or 317 00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:03,880 us, but I think it hopefully will provide a small measure of justice in 318 00:25:03,920 --> 00:25:10,680 that case. Absolutely. In the continued saga of the rich Necks shooting here 319 00:25:10,799 --> 00:25:17,160 from January sixth, we do have charges that we're finally filed against Deja Nicole 320 00:25:17,279 --> 00:25:22,640 Taylor. She is the mother of the six year old school shooter, and 321 00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:26,480 because the Daily Press and various other media e lets have named her, we 322 00:25:26,559 --> 00:25:33,119 are as well. So she has been indicted by a grand jury in Newport 323 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:40,200 News on two charges of child neglect and reckless endangerment, and she did turn 324 00:25:40,279 --> 00:25:45,440 herself over to the Newport News police as arranged with her attorney and was released 325 00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:52,079 on bond that same afternoon. The felony charge is for child neglect, and 326 00:25:52,119 --> 00:25:57,079 then I think, bizarrely the firearm charge. This is allowing a minor to 327 00:25:57,119 --> 00:26:03,200 have access to an unsecured somehow in Virginia, that's a misdemeanor charge. I 328 00:26:03,279 --> 00:26:07,480 think that is very problematic as well. I think there should be two felony 329 00:26:07,559 --> 00:26:14,160 charges in this case. The grand jury is going to continue investigating whether charges 330 00:26:14,160 --> 00:26:18,000 should be filed against anyone else in this case, and that does include members 331 00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:25,039 of the rich Neck Elementary School administration eagerly looking forward to the results of that. 332 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:29,200 There was some reporting from the Daily Press, and again I'm eager to 333 00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:33,160 hear more about some of the issues that we have talked about from early on 334 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:37,920 in this case, and this is about the behavior plan that was put in 335 00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:42,039 place to have a family member attend school with the six year old shooter. 336 00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:48,799 The story revealed that plan was revisited after winter break, with the decision being 337 00:26:48,839 --> 00:26:52,000 made that it was no longer necessary for an adult to attend class with him, 338 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:55,599 and I think we can all see right now that it was necessary. 339 00:26:56,160 --> 00:27:02,599 It is still unclear from the reporting who set that behavior plan in place, 340 00:27:03,079 --> 00:27:08,240 because again, parent attending school with child is not a typical accommodation, and 341 00:27:08,319 --> 00:27:14,039 it is still not clear who decided that the six year old did not need 342 00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:19,160 parental accompaniment any longer. That person, I think definitely needs to be asked. 343 00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:26,440 I'm sorry what what you're thinking on this as Abigail z Werner's court case 344 00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:30,200 proceeds, I think we may get to the bottom of some of this, 345 00:27:30,319 --> 00:27:34,599 because these are really important questions. You had said that you have worked with 346 00:27:34,640 --> 00:27:38,400 a number of special ed teachers, and the people that you've talked to have 347 00:27:38,519 --> 00:27:44,440 said they've never heard of an accommodation like this where a parent was supposed to 348 00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:48,039 be with this child. It's worth noting, by the way, we're still 349 00:27:48,079 --> 00:27:52,079 not naming the child. We are now naming the mother because her name has 350 00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:56,759 been reported in the media. I think if this Werner case moves forward, 351 00:27:56,880 --> 00:28:00,680 as I expect that it will, these kind of questions will be asked and 352 00:28:00,799 --> 00:28:07,119 I hope answered in the future. It needs to the sequence of events here. 353 00:28:07,799 --> 00:28:11,519 The return from winter break was January third. Okay, everybody came back 354 00:28:11,559 --> 00:28:15,759 at the same time high school elementary winners. On January fourth, this kiddo 355 00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:19,599 smashed Abby's Warner's cell phone, so he can't even keep himself out of trouble 356 00:28:19,759 --> 00:28:26,799 for one day. He served a one day out of school suspension for smashing 357 00:28:26,799 --> 00:28:30,839 her phone on January fifth, and then next day, January sixth, he 358 00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:36,640 returned to school with a nine millimeter handgun and he shot his teacher. That 359 00:28:36,839 --> 00:28:41,640 is unconscionable, and this kid's out of control. I'm not even sure this 360 00:28:41,759 --> 00:28:48,359 kid belongs in a mainstream elementary school classroom. In some good news on this 361 00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:53,000 front, as we continued the saga here, Abby's Warner was honored on the 362 00:28:53,039 --> 00:28:57,440 floor of the Virginia Senate and hailed as a hero for the actions that she 363 00:28:57,519 --> 00:29:03,240 took on January six, in which she hearded her eighteen students to safety after 364 00:29:03,359 --> 00:29:07,920 she was shot before making her way to the front office to ask for help. 365 00:29:08,319 --> 00:29:15,119 Bravo to her, an amazing story. Couldn't ask for anything any greater 366 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:19,000 honor for her, that's fantastic. Right after all of this information came out, 367 00:29:19,119 --> 00:29:23,079 then came another story which all of us at school, like every educator 368 00:29:23,119 --> 00:29:26,839 that I know, is following this case because we're very interested in what all 369 00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:32,039 is going to happen. The day that this next story came out, a 370 00:29:32,079 --> 00:29:36,079 bunch of us were sending links to it back and forth to each other through 371 00:29:36,119 --> 00:29:38,759 text message to make sure that everybody had seen it, because it's very interesting. 372 00:29:40,599 --> 00:29:45,319 The family of a student who was in Abbey's Werners classroom at the time 373 00:29:45,319 --> 00:29:51,759 of the shooting has filed a complaint against Newport News Public Schools with the Department 374 00:29:51,839 --> 00:29:57,279 of Education. Now here's why. The student and the family those are unnamed 375 00:29:57,279 --> 00:30:03,200 at this time, represented by attorney Harold Bakowitz, And this is according to 376 00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:10,119 reporting from wtk R thirteen News. Now, mister Buckwitz was investigating every incident 377 00:30:10,359 --> 00:30:15,880 at the school that led up to the January sixth shooting of Abbey's Werner. 378 00:30:15,640 --> 00:30:21,200 Quote. We are aware of numerous incidents of bullying, harassment, and assault 379 00:30:21,319 --> 00:30:26,319 by students at Richneck Elementary School during the months leading up to the January sixth, 380 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:33,039 twenty twenty three shooting. School and NPS administrators chose to ignore ongoing parent 381 00:30:33,079 --> 00:30:38,359 complaints about such intolerable conduct. Concerning student behaviors went unaddressed, and the school 382 00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:44,960 system did not take necessary measures to stop or prevent it. That sounds pretty 383 00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:48,079 fair to me. Yeah, it does to me too. One of the 384 00:30:48,119 --> 00:30:52,599 things I'm wondering about is this is only one student being represented by the attorney. 385 00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:59,440 I'm wondering if other students within the classroom there were eighteen kids in the 386 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:04,640 classroom that day, if they may be joining in this lawsuit via attorney Belkowitz 387 00:31:04,799 --> 00:31:11,440 or filing a larger or independent lawsuit. The Newport News school system is in 388 00:31:11,519 --> 00:31:15,440 for a world of hurt. They have botched this situation from top to bottom. 389 00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:21,880 And now in addition to having Abigail's werner suing them, you now have 390 00:31:22,119 --> 00:31:26,960 the students parents whose kids were in that classroom that day, who obviously lived 391 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:32,960 through an incredibly terrifying thing seeing their teacher, who apparently was very popular and 392 00:31:33,119 --> 00:31:36,599 well liked by the students, nearly shot to death in front of them. 393 00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:41,519 I could see eighteen different sets of parents joining in this lawsuit. They have 394 00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:47,920 every right to go after Newport News. Newport News has failed on so many 395 00:31:48,039 --> 00:31:52,519 levels, and it continues to do so because there's more to this story if 396 00:31:52,519 --> 00:31:56,680 you can believe that. So, this attorney filed a formal complaint against Newport 397 00:31:56,720 --> 00:32:04,640 News Public Schools with the Department after school employees and administrators repeatedly failed to turn 398 00:32:04,720 --> 00:32:09,880 over requested education records to that family. For that lawsuit, families are allowed 399 00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:15,680 access to their education records. That's part of FERBA Family Educational Rights and Privacy 400 00:32:15,680 --> 00:32:19,920 Act. I'm going to quote here again among the records sought our documents relating 401 00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:24,759 to administrators failure to appropriately and effectively address the parents numerous please concerning the dangerous 402 00:32:24,799 --> 00:32:30,839 environment at Richneck Elementary. You can ask for your kids records. The policy 403 00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:36,440 from Department of d in VDOE is that the agency or institution or its components 404 00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:40,880 shall comply with the request for access to records within a reasonable amount of time, 405 00:32:42,680 --> 00:32:45,880 but no more than forty five days. So Balkowitz reached out to n 406 00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:50,960 NPS for those records on January thirtieth, and they said, now, we're 407 00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:54,680 not giving them up. Now. By my account, we're at seventy five 408 00:32:54,839 --> 00:33:00,680 days give or take at the time of this recording, and they've never responded. 409 00:33:00,759 --> 00:33:06,400 So they're more than a month late in responding to this attorney representing these 410 00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:09,640 parents, and they have a legal right to these documents and they're failing to 411 00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:15,599 provide them. They are just continuing to screw this case up. And I 412 00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:17,720 like the fact that this attorney did what I think is probably the only thing 413 00:33:17,759 --> 00:33:21,160 he could do at this point, which is play his hand and say, 414 00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:24,119 you know what, you're not going to respond. I'm telling everybody about it. 415 00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:30,000 Good for him. Starts to sound like the Colonial Parkway murders had done 416 00:33:30,039 --> 00:33:36,359 that he did say it is disturbing that NPS is hindering our client's lawful efforts 417 00:33:36,519 --> 00:33:39,799 to uncover the truth of what happened at Richneck Elementary School, And as of 418 00:33:40,079 --> 00:33:44,799 my last check on this, new Portnews Public Schools had not commented on the 419 00:33:44,839 --> 00:33:50,759 complaint. Let's just compound our mistakes by failing to comply with the law. 420 00:33:51,519 --> 00:33:54,160 We know that this is going to be a long and continued story. We're 421 00:33:54,200 --> 00:33:58,480 in for it. We're in for the marathon, not for the sprint, 422 00:33:58,480 --> 00:34:02,079 if you'll pardon the running pun there. So, of course, you will 423 00:34:02,119 --> 00:34:07,000 continue to hear more from us on this story as it unfolds. I referenced 424 00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:12,239 the Colonial Parkway murders a moment ago. I hope if you haven't had time 425 00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:17,280 to go back and take a listen to our podcast episode with Joyce Call Canada 426 00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:22,760 that ran last Monday. It's episode two hundred and fifty one regarding the thirty 427 00:34:22,760 --> 00:34:30,599 fifth anniversary of the disappearance of Richard Keith Call and Cassandra Sandy Hailey, and 428 00:34:30,639 --> 00:34:32,760 we talked quite a bit about the status of the investigation, and we hope 429 00:34:32,800 --> 00:34:36,960 you'll take a few minutes to listen to that episode and let us know what 430 00:34:37,039 --> 00:34:40,000 you think. We have irons in the fire. We have things that we're 431 00:34:40,039 --> 00:34:44,960 percolating, but that's going to be things that Bill and are working together on 432 00:34:45,039 --> 00:34:47,599 over the summer. And we were looking forward to bring any more information and 433 00:34:47,679 --> 00:34:52,079 more coverage on the Colonial Parkway murders. And then finally we wanted to update 434 00:34:52,159 --> 00:34:58,920 you on the Rust case. You may recall we've covered this situation. We 435 00:34:59,039 --> 00:35:06,119 found ourselves New Mexico, where film and television star Alec Baldwin was charged with 436 00:35:06,400 --> 00:35:12,960 two counts of manslaughter after an accidental shooting on the set of the Western themed 437 00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:19,880 film Rust. Helena Hutchins, cinematographer on Rust, was shot to death and 438 00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:25,320 director Joel Susa was badly injured after a pop gun was found to be loaded 439 00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:34,639 with live ammunition, and this resulted in Helena Hutchins's death and Joel Susan's injuries. 440 00:35:35,199 --> 00:35:38,519 Alec Baldwin was among the people charged, and of course Alec Baldman is 441 00:35:38,559 --> 00:35:44,679 the person that actually pulled the trigger. Surprisingly, today it was announced that 442 00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:51,599 it appears that manslaughter charges against Alec Baldwin have been dropped. This on the 443 00:35:51,639 --> 00:35:57,960 same day that shooting, that is, shooting of motion picture film has resumed 444 00:35:58,199 --> 00:36:01,719 on the Rust set. Which has now been relocated to Montana from its original 445 00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:09,000 New Mexico location. Interestingly, it was not reported that armorer Hannah Guceiera's read 446 00:36:09,519 --> 00:36:16,079 still has charges pending against her. She was also hit with two manslaughter charges. 447 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:21,719 Although charges seem to have been dropped against Baldwin, there's no mention of 448 00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:28,480 dropping those charges against Hannah Gutierra's read. David Halls, the first assistant director 449 00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:34,800 on set who was responsible for overall safety, had pled guilty unsafe behavior on 450 00:36:34,840 --> 00:36:40,519 the set, and he was only sentenced to six months unsupervised probation, which 451 00:36:40,559 --> 00:36:46,239 is essentially nothing at all, perhaps tying in all of these charges being dropped 452 00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:52,039 one by one, not one, but two separate prosecutors have stepped down in 453 00:36:52,039 --> 00:36:57,119 this case so far, which is not a good sign. Keep you posted 454 00:36:57,159 --> 00:37:00,880 on what we're seeing here. It appears that Alec Baldwin man end up walking. 455 00:37:01,039 --> 00:37:07,039 There was a civil suit and a substantial settlement to Helena Hutchins widower, 456 00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:15,480 and he's ended up becoming an executive producer on the Rust film, and whatever 457 00:37:15,559 --> 00:37:20,360 cash settlement was involved there appears to have been paid. In terms of criminal 458 00:37:20,440 --> 00:37:24,400 charges against Baldwin, they seem to be dropping one charge after another. I 459 00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:28,519 don't know how I feel about this. Honestly and clearly, it doesn't matter 460 00:37:28,559 --> 00:37:31,119 how I feel about it, but for the interest of this podcast, we 461 00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:37,760 read the affidavit and it is so clear that he was so negligent on so 462 00:37:37,039 --> 00:37:43,119 many things. I understand. He is Alec Baldwin, he is a famous 463 00:37:43,159 --> 00:37:49,679 actor. He's got amazing probably very well paid attorneys. We're working behind the 464 00:37:49,679 --> 00:37:52,599 scenes to make sure that this goes away. I really do feel that he 465 00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:57,719 is very much culpable, and I'm a little disappointed. I don't mean to 466 00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:02,280 sound cold blooded, are bloodthirsty, or anything like that, but I just 467 00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:06,960 feel like that's wrong. Really, something else needs to happen, and it 468 00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:10,199 shouldn't just be let me pay a ton of money to the victim's widower. 469 00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:13,920 I just feel like something else needs to happen there. I don't know, 470 00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:16,280 are you in the same boat with me or are you? I think all 471 00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:22,079 three of them, Alec Baldwin, Hannah Gautiera's Read and David Halls are all 472 00:38:22,159 --> 00:38:27,320 responsible, and I believe they all should be held to some appropriate standard. 473 00:38:27,400 --> 00:38:30,400 I think all three of them are culpable in this terrible accident. No one 474 00:38:30,519 --> 00:38:37,480 intended to shoot their cinematographer to death and badly wound their director, both of 475 00:38:37,519 --> 00:38:44,119 whom were standing directly in front of Alec Baldwin when he fired this gun so 476 00:38:44,239 --> 00:38:47,199 carelessly. But at the same time, David Halls, who handed in the 477 00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:52,159 gun, and Hannah Gautierra's read who was responsible for all the guns on set, 478 00:38:52,920 --> 00:38:59,400 it committed grievous errors that resulted in a woman's death and you can't get 479 00:38:59,440 --> 00:39:04,639 around that, and Alec Baldwin pulled the trigger. It's shocking to me that 480 00:39:04,719 --> 00:39:07,880 it seems like there isn't going to be any justice in this case. We'll 481 00:39:07,880 --> 00:39:13,400 see what happens with the remaining charges against Hannah Gauchier as Reid, who I 482 00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:17,360 think should be held accountable. But I don't see how she's more responsible than 483 00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:22,440 Alec Baldwin. He's the producer, he was the actor on set at the 484 00:39:22,519 --> 00:39:25,800 time. I think you just said it very nicely. This doesn't feel like 485 00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:30,159 justice to me, No, not in the least. We'll keep you posted 486 00:39:30,199 --> 00:39:36,559 on what we're hearing regarding the charges in this tragic shooting, and will report 487 00:39:36,599 --> 00:39:39,440 back to you as we can. There is so much true crime news, 488 00:39:39,480 --> 00:39:43,159 but we can only report on a small portion of it, and this is 489 00:39:43,199 --> 00:39:46,519 our small portion for this week. We hope you've enjoyed this true crime round 490 00:39:46,599 --> 00:39:50,599 up. If you like what we're doing with the podcast, please do leave 491 00:39:50,719 --> 00:39:53,519 us some five star ratings and reviews, and thank you to everyone who has 492 00:39:53,559 --> 00:39:59,199 done so. So far. We got some beautiful reviews that just made me 493 00:39:59,320 --> 00:40:04,559 blush. May even have made mister Thomas blush too. And again, thanks 494 00:40:04,599 --> 00:40:10,079 everybody for your kind words about us crossing the million plays threshold here at Mindover 495 00:40:10,159 --> 00:40:15,800 Murder. We really appreciate all of your kind words and the terrific reviews. 496 00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:19,880 That's going to do it for this episode of mind Over Murder. We'll see 497 00:40:19,880 --> 00:40:34,880 you next time. Mind Over Murder is a production of Absolute Zero and Another 498 00:40:34,960 --> 00:40:39,760 Dog Productions. Our executive producers are Bill Thomas and Kristin Dilley. Our logo 499 00:40:39,880 --> 00:40:45,159 art is by Pamela Arnois. Our theme music is by Kevin McLeod. Mind 500 00:40:45,159 --> 00:40:51,440 Over Murder is distributed in partnership with Coral Space Media. You can follow us 501 00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:54,480 on Facebook, Twitter, or Instagram. You can also follow our page on 502 00:40:54,519 --> 00:41:00,000 the Colonial Parkway Murders on Facebook, and finally, you can follow Bill Tom 503 00:41:00,000 --> 00:41:04,800 Thomas on Twitter at Bill Thomas five, six, Thank you for listening to 504 00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:06,400 Mind Over Murder.