Hello, everyone, Welcome to the latest edition of Hardwood Knocks. This is
out of from Well Here with my fantastic co host, Dan Favalley. I'm
gonna try to put aside my sadness over my Atlanta Hawks losing to the Detroit
Pistons and overtime in a game that featured like the ugliest final two seconds of
basketball this season, and bring to you one of our mail bag episodes.
We have a bunch of out of the box questions, some really fun ones
to dive into. But before we can get to any of that, I
have to ask Dan, how's it going. I am frazzled as ever,
but in good spirits, especially after getting to catch up with you face to
face for the first time in a couple of weeks. How are you doing.
I'm good. I was on vacation over a long weekend and it was
great to get away from every thing. And it's great to be back too.
We're glad to have you back. I did a solo mail bag last
week. We had two guests fall through. That doesn't hit well one I
asked last minute, so I can't be mad in the health through. I
had two guests fall through and that never happens. But so we're happy to
have me back because I when I do a solo mail bag, I get
winded. Mystain is not what I used to do, understandably, So that's
a tough that's a tough ask, especially with like no one to bounce ideas
off or to have them go first on one of the answers. It's it's
a tough one. I respect you for doing it, and I respect you
for not calling out those those people who bounced my name. I can't anyone
who agrees with him on the podcast can catch Obviously you would never do that,
and nor should you. I am ready though for this mail bag,
we had a lot of great questions ad per usual, we'll start with our
discord questions, which nice little plug. Hey join our discord, don't forget
to rate, review, and subscribe to us on Twitter. All sports sites
are getting hitting hitting getting hit hard by traffic decline, So help us out.
Download very episode, Recommend us to people either by retweeting our promos or
just telling people about this podcast. Should you listen to it? We're actually
not hurting that badly. We've got a couple down episodes though, I'm just
gonna attribute to the fact that you weren't here and that was it. I
didn't even check the numbers in the last episode though, because I wanted to
be in good spirits and Amon killed it. So I'm sure that did like
at least two trillion episodes, if not a little bit more, if not
more. And I think like another thing to put you in good spirits is
you know you We saw in the discord channel that one of the mail back
questions and I don't know if you've you've picked this one to cover or not
actually used the thermonuclear af phrase that you've been pushing out on each episode made
me. That made me smile. That makes me smile too, and I
love when people mentioned it. So we will get to that, but we're
gonna start at the top from t Bloom one seven. What team do you
expect to make make the most slash biggest roster changes this offseason. I am
going to be surprised if we don't have the same answer here. But you're
so low on the Halks right now, I'm wondering if you think they should
strip it down, trade, trade young, and rebuild. I'm curious where
you're going with this because I don't know that there's a super obvious answer,
just because player movement has been so wildly unpredictable over the last few offseasons.
But like the Lakers feel like the obvious candidate just because of all the tumult
that has been affecting that organization, and it might have reached a point at
which they're going to attach assets just to move Russell Westbrook. We've heard Lebron
James trade rumors suddenly start to surface, trade speculation, I should say,
rather than rumors the rest of the supporting cast is just going to be ripped
to shreds because it should be. It feels like anything is on the table
for the Purple and Gold this offseason, So to me, they stand out
as the number one choice. But I've given up on trying to make these
predictions so early because with players requesting trades, demanding trades, saying they're going
to sit out, with so many blockbuster moves happening all the time, it
feels like any organization could go in wildly different directions at any point in time.
That's a good point. Also, free agency has changed to where it's
happening not in free agency really for the most part, now I will say
though it is the Lakers for me as well, and it's not just the
Russell Westbrook element, but the roster is built like a placeholders they have.
Let's just go and assume Westbrook picks up his forty seven point one million dollar
player option, and controversial, I know, maybe he declines it. Let's
also assume that Kendrick Nunn picks up his player option. If you're not signing
or if they're not playing yet this season, they have five players under guarantee
contract for next year. I'm assuming they'll bring back Austin Reeves. Okay,
there's six. That's six players under guaranteed contract next year. I don't think
all their one year guys are going to be back. That includes Malik Monk,
who if they don't have access to the non taxpayers mid level, I
don't know how they keep him unless he just really wants to be there.
And then you also have to kick in the Westbrook trade that they're going to
make. The coaching staff want to get rid of him. They're going to
have first round picks to trade. And we'll actually pivot since we're on the
Lakers now to a Twitter question a second, but I think they're kind of
the clear answer. And I look at sort of the rest of the league,
and I know there are always teams that you can spot sort of,
Oh, there's definitely gonna be some real blow up happening here. I kind
of feel like we're light on those candidates leading into this. The Knicks are
certainly one. I could see them if you told me they looked drastically different
and didn't made more move than the Lakers, I wouldn't be that surprised.
That's kind of like it. My sleeper answer here is the Detroit Pistons.
I think that given how good kid Cunningham has looked now that he's healthy,
and we've also seen strides from Marvin Bagley from Killy and Hayes from Sadique Bay,
they could make a move to accelerate the timeline in a way that drastically
shifts the makeup of this roster. I don't think that they're going to come
close to totally blowing it up, but we could feasibly see like three different
starters and a host of new backups for a team that's trying to immediately push
up the Eastern Conference standings. I was also going to say the Magic have
that vibe a little bit, just because there's so many different they still have
like Terrence Ross, maybe you look at moving him. You also have Mobamba
and Dreamer, Shard Trezi, but they have so many just like guys who
are worth looking at that I could see some upheaval there. I was gonna
reframe this though, and say, who is the team the candidate to make
the most impactful move in the opposite direction where I guess it's like the biggest
perspective, who's going to sell the best perspective player the summer? Who's most
likely to do that? I feel like it's still Washington either with Chris Stops
or Bradley Beal because to me, that organization it continues to be a mass
without any cohesive sense of direction. And I could see this being the off
season that you know, it's been talked about for years, But would any
wouldn't be surprised if after making these moves of the deadline to try to continue
competing in the season to try to acquire more talent, the opposite ends up
happening during the off season and Bill finally just has had enough. They are
probably the correct answer. I think you can make a case they're late.
I don't want to call them lazy cases. But until I hear something different
from the players that they're going to be talking about, I wouldn't select these
teams. It could be Portland or New Orleans technically go the dark course answer
is Utah. They lose in round one, maybe an unconvincing round two.
I just feel like there's Donovan Mitchell, the New York rumor all over again.
No, no, if you first of all, if you're training Donovan
Mitchell, now that if Danny Age even broaches the subject, he needs to
be fired. So I'm talking, do they decide to retool or rebuild around
Otovan? Do they look at just moving Rudy? Could this be a situation
where they moved Mike Conley and Rug Gobert. Their playoffs to me are going
to be defining because either they've made it so far and I would argue it's
probably the finals is the only thing that really inoculates them against any sort of
major change, or they've lost in round one or two, and I just
feel like there's gonna be noise there. And I don't think that's actually a
spicy take. No, it's not the question we have on the Lakers,
though, comes from Michael Opinionated MJ on Twitter. We always appreciate his questions
and one of our most loyal retweeters, so thank you Michael as well.
What will the Lakers get back in a Russ deal? Since they've driven down
his value down has driven down his value to most teams. I also really
wanted to ask this crazy left field question, considering what's come to light with
the threats to Russ's family, would it be far FETs to rust for Russ
to ask for a buyout. I'd just like to get out in front of
this and say, anyone who's threatening I didn't even know there. I could
probably not heard that either. I had not heard her seen this. If
you're threatening Russell Westbrook's family over how he's playing on a basketball court, you're
a fucking loser. Just it's worse than that. Yeah, it's I mean,
that was the kind of way I'm saying. It's a there's a g
rated podcast, so I didn't want to use I only wanted to use the
word loser. But yeah, so I want to know if there's anything of
the that second part obviously, So, by the way, thought Russ's fault
that the Lakers traded for him. It's the front offices, it's Lebron's,
it's AD's fault, more than it's Russell Westbrook's fault. Just to I want
to get that way. I can't see any situation which they agree to a
buyout at this point. Are we talking about like this this season or this
offseason? Because this season he wouldn't even be playoff eligible if he's bought out
at this stage. And I can't see that happening during the off season because
he's going to pick up his twenty twenty to twenty three player option, which
is for forty seven point one million dollars, and they're not going to bridge
that gap in a buyout. But because it is an expiring deal, I
think there is at least some chance of him being moved. But if you're
the Lakers, you are not moving him to get anything back in all likelihood,
you're attaching something to move him and to free up enough space on the
books that you might be able to sign someone else or make a trade for
a player who fits better with the incumbent pieces. So if you're the Lakers
and a Russell Westbrook trade if you're a fan of the Lakers and a Russell
Westbrook trade is being seriously discussed, you're not hoping for a top prospect back
in return. You're not hoping for an unprotected first round pick. You're hoping
that you can give up a first round pick with enough protections that it might
not convey. And I don't think there's any way around that. You think
you probably have to hope for a little bit more than that, in the
sense you can't just move You're even if you traded Russell Westbrook into space,
you're not going to have the cat flexibility to go out and add major significant
pieces. You have to hope that you can attach enough draft equity to acquire
someone and so they can move the twenty twenty seven and twenty twenty nine first
they have, and also include swaps in twenty twenty six and twenty twenty eight.
This offseason, we've gone back and forth a lot about how much value
distant first round picks have. Twenty twenty six isn't that far away if we're
talking after the draft, so if you can get too I oppose this question
in our discord, who's the best player they could get for Russ's expiring deal,
and that's that's what you hit perfectly. You're trading Russell Westbrook the expiring
contract, not Russell Westbrook as an asset. But who is the best player
you could imagine getting for Russ's expiring money and then two first plus two swaps?
I can't. So the overwhelming answer in the discord was something with the
Pacers built around Buddy Healed and Malcolm Brockden, which feels like the right at
least level of return, maybe you could. I just can't imagine them getting
back a player of Brockden's coup for you. You're giving up two first oh
if you're if you're including the first as well, But I think I don't
think you want to do that, though you absolutely need to do that.
Lebron is thirty seven years old. If you're intent on building a title contender
around Lebron still, but at some point, I don't know, I don't
know. I mean, given how poorly this season has gone, is there
any concern if you're a member of the Lakers front office that like, maybe
we need to stop mortgaging every single piece of the future we have for something
that's just not going to work. It would be different. It would be
different if they had a reliable second piece, if Anthony Davis's injury history history
just washed away and he was on the court every night. I think you
can talk yourself into doing that more freely. But when all you have is
question marks, like at what point do you have to just decide like enough
is enough? Like we can't set ourselves back to that we cannot possibly compete
for another decade just to have a chance of being the sixth seed. If
you think that way, though, my guests would be that you then are
talking about a Russell westbrook By out. I don't know that you could just
move, but I think this is any organization has the financial ability to do
so, it would be the Layers. Well, they couldn't afford Alex Caruso
and they were approved for a triple P load, so they are they are
hard up for money. They don't have the funds fair enough. But I
will say I think the best case scenario you could hope for without I don't
even know if it's the best case scenario what you're describing. I feel like
demands there to be The market that we just saw for the Christaps porzingis trade
where it's you divested a larger salad on a distressed asset into two cheaper distressed
assets. And I don't know if that out there because Russell Westbrook makes so
much money, so inspiring contract will help. Though, if you're not gonna
go the picks and prospects are out next to him, I don't know where
you're doing then, because you have Rona even if you even if you only
have him for two more years, you maybe maybe the Lakers are just trying
to be so bad that they can be the ones that draft Brownie James at
number one. The problem is is he ranked number thirty four in his class
right now, right right, I don't know that you need to be number
one unless you're planning on having the number one pick and then getting him in
the second. Before we move on, though, I just I want to
read one text that we just got from a friend of the podcast, Jacob
Warren, who is at the game tonight at ball Arena between and the Denver
Nuggets and the zombie Golden State Warriors. He said, twack scores are unimpressive
tonight. Best I've seen as the Warriors. Darrell, right, if you
don't know what twack is. I still encourage you go to sport smathnetwork dot
com. Check it out. It's super fun. We haven't gotten any submissions
yet. Be the person who changes that. Yeah, I'm I'm with Adam
on that one. Let's move this next discord question tack twack it up,
but we'll go to discord now. From Luke J thirty seven. Are there
any short term buyout centers the Calves should pick up after the jolt out Alan
injury or should they just roll with Ed Davis and playing more Evan Mobley at
the five. I would probably be more inclined to just stick it out right
now. The Calves have been hit so ridiculously hard by injuries throughout the second
half of this season. It feels like everyone who wears that uniform is susceptible
to some sort of injury. But because you're essentially playing with house money this
season, you have the ability to tease out what Mobley can do and an
expanded role at the five, and you're ultimately still five and a half games
clear of the eight seeded Charlotte Hornets heading into games on Monday night. You
do have the buffer to see what happens, So I don't. I don't
think a move is really necessary here because he's not out for the season.
If he I mean, if he's not gonna play again, that changes.
But he's going to The thing I'll also say is you have Ed Davis,
Evan Mobley, Kevin Love, Dean Wade, his six nine, Larry marking
in. I just I'm not signing another big, Yeah, and especially when
that big is gonna be Greg Monroe. Who is you know who's going to
be out there? The marketing is fine, I guess in twenty sixteen.
Yeah, he couldn't hang with the Bucks who were desperate for center play.
So but no, I wouldn't sign anyone. It does. The Caps are
just I mean they still beat Toronto. That I watched that game. That
game was that that was hashtag ugly at points in Toronto is officially confusing the
shit out of me. They were banged up, but still good question.
The Cobs are still They've had one of the most surprising seasons, and it
gets more shocking when you sort of view it against the backdrop of just all
the injury they've had, where it's not just Colin Sexton. They lost Rubio
before they traded him Karas LeVert is banged up, Darius Garland was dealing with
some stuff, Evan Mobley missed some time earlier on and now Jared Allen,
it's like, when does it end for them? If you if you had
told me that, if I had told you that Colin Sexton and Ricky Rubio
we're going to play forty five combined games for the Calvs this season heading into
the year, you probably think they're what like a twelve thirteen seed. I
honestly am shocked that the number is that high because I know Colin Sexton really
played, so yes, I would say that I might have had him as
the twelve or thirteen see coming into the season when they were on the roster.
So yeah, they've had a great year. I wouldn't want to play
them in the playoffs either, when you're just looking at how they still defend.
Jared Allen, if the defense is just a nightmare. Speaking of defense,
and I caught shit for something I said about the Celtics in the last
podcast, but not from JT Alexander that I know of if he asked,
the Celtics' defense has been the defensive version of thermonuclears. Fuck Thermo. Nuclear
af shout out jt using it the last couple of months. Doesn't improving offense
mean this team is ready to come out of the East or this question completely
reactionary. I don't think it's reactionary to me. It still doesn't feel like
there's a clear cut, overwhelming favorite to come out of the East. And
I would include Boston in maybe not that the one A tier of contenders,
but in the one B tier because that defense has been super legit all year
and we are now seeing what a detonation from Jason Tatum can do to the
offense. Things are clicking there. It's it's starting to make more sense.
The sets are smoother, the shots are falling, which was one of the
issues early in the season is that the open jumpers were not finding the bottom
of the net. Now that they are, even if it's just a progression
to the mean, this is a really dangerous team. So I think if
you're if you're ranking the pecking order within the East, you're still looking at
Philadelphia, Milwaukee, and Miami as those one A teams, But Chicago,
Boston, Toronto, Cleveland, Brooklyn, like those are the teams where I
don't know that it would be super shocking if they made it out, and
I'd probably have Boston at the top of that pack because I don't trust Brooklyn's
health and availability. To me, Boston is closer to moving up into that
one A tier than falling out of one B. I think you could make
a case for probably like four teams to come out of the East, and
the Celtics are one of them. The Brooklyn Nets are not I'm out on
the nets. It's just there's too many onets described to them. I do.
I am concerned. I know the offense has been better. I would
be curious to see whether they do have just enough off ball shooting, functional
shooting aside from Jason Tatum, aside from Jalalen Brown to get by in certain
postseason mats up matchups. But there, Wow, from where they were just
a month or two ago. Their their defense has been in the Derek White
pickup just now in retrospect, makes so much sense. They can defend and
they have. I don't know that you look at them. I know some
people tried to make like the Robert Williams Defensive Player of the Year case.
I don't know that I'm there yet. I feel like his role on defense.
They are reliant on him, but it does feel more streamlined. They
have like the deepest My point is, I don't know that they have someone
that you would consider one of the five best defenders in the league. But
they have so many not even just above average, but very impactful defenders who
work well within like these different team schemes that we saw where there was a
lot of switching earlier on in the year. I know they didn't work out
great, but it was still they were they were doing okay, and now
we've seen you know, Zack lo and Bryan Scalabrini talked about how they've had
like Robert Williams helping away from these corners where we've also seen I mean when
you were looking at the way they were playing against the nets like they have.
Robert Williams is like coming out super far and calling off guys who want
to get back because he wants to defend Seth Curry at points. They are
so versatile on defense, and they can they can win ugly, but they
can also win with haymakers. I wouldn't trust the ladder as much as their
defense. Like their offense, I said again, is probably just the shooting,
specifically just in the half court. Do they have enough lights out shooting?
That's my biggest concern with them. But Miami, Milwaukee, Boston,
and Philly, those are my four teams that I think are most likely to
come out of the East right now. Not necessarily, I think. My
biggest concern about Boston, not necessarily in one specific playoff series, but over
the course of the run that it takes the sixteen wins that are necessary to
win a title, is what happens if Tatum does go cold, because I
don't know that they have the secondary creation, the secondary playmaking to buffer against
that. And he's been pretty impervious to increase defensive attention, Like the amount
of tough buckets that he's generating against you know, double teams coming from the
weak side is just out of this world in recent weeks. But that could
wear you down. And if if it does, if they're in the Eastern
Conference finals and he goes cold, where are the points coming from. I
think that's my biggest concern about this team still, which I think it's fair,
but yeah, I don't think that's reactionary at all. I think actually
this sample has sustained long enough to wear Boston. That might be the best
way to frame it. Right now, who's more likely to come out that
he's Boston or Brooklyn? I would absolutely Boston. I think if we're actually
ranking, I would say Philly is number one, Milwaukee's number two, Miami's
number three, Boston's number four. You have who I'm sorry, can you
run that through again? Boston's for miam Philly, Milwaukee, Miami than Boston.
Do you get Philly above Milwaukee? Yes, I think I'm Milwaukee above
Philly, otherwise I might have the same order. I'm a little worried about
the Milwaukee death. I'm very worried about the Milwaukee death. But I think
I'm just like defaulting to the to the source that I trust at this point,
which is all on us everything. I totally get that. Strops As.
Now that we have a decent sample size of this year's rookies, what
are some all time comparisons or career paths that you can see for the top
five picks of the twenty twenty one NBA draft. I don't know that I
love the idea of jumping into comparisons here, because each player is ultimately a
unique player, and we see so much growth between year one and year two
that putting them into those archetypal buckets to me, makes more sense after a
sophomore season. But I do think it's not I don't think it's too early
to start talking about like trajectories and what kind of accolades they're going to be
competing for. I firmly think that Evan Mobley could factor into the best player
in the league conversation for four years, five years down the road, Scottie
Barnes, I think we're looking at all NBA accolades on a consistent basis if
everything goes according to planet continues to develop on both ends of the court.
Kid Cunningham has such a ridiculous feel for the game. I think he's a
guy who's going to get MVP votes down the road. And then the rest
of this the top of this class, guys like Franz Wagner and Herb Jones
and Iodasumu. We're looking at a lot of guys who have the juice to
squeeze to be able to factor in to All Star conversations during their best seasons.
I don't know if they're going to be consistent All Stars, but there's
so much to like about their feel for the game at such a such an
early stage, in Jones's case, in Dasumu's case. There on ball defense,
just how how much of a pest they can already be. And Jones
already playing passing lanes and just being able to switch onto all sorts of matchups
like he is legitimately in the all defensive conversation as a rookie, which doesn't
happen. This draft class should generate a lot of excitement. I do still
think it's too early for the historical comps. I don't think it's anywhere near
too soon to be throwing out the All Star, All NBA MVP caliber things.
Yeah, I look, and even there's I still have very high hopes
for Jail and Subs who's had and even Jail and Green he's played better.
Yeah, I'm not trying to just just include anyone there. There are just
too many names in this class to go through all. I mean, Jonathan
Kamiga has looked like a stud lately. I will say this is not a
perfect way to do it, But you have Scottie Barnes and Evan Mobili specifically,
are each averaging above point one win shares for forty eight minutes the last
the most recent rookies, I should say, to do that while playing as
many minutes as those two have thus far, which is nineteen hundred plus.
Before these two this season, there was eight in two eighteen twenty nineteen,
and Luca in twenty eighteen nineteen. Then Ben Simmons and Jason Tatum in twenty
seventeen twenty and eighteen, and then Chris Stops and Carl Anthony Towns in twenty
fifteen twenty sixteen. So that's was recently some pretty good company. And then
before that it didn't happen more recently than twenty two eleven, when we saw
it from both Blake Griffin and Greg Monroe. Not perfect Harving Jersey, but
those two you have to watch and look. Kate Cunningham might be there if
he had a better supporting cast in general or played more of this season.
I do think when you look at just the five picks specifically to try and
at least bring this back to Strops's range, how many of those guys,
is there a chance like three of those guys a best player in the NBA
ceilings When you're looking at Evan Mobley, Kay Cunningham and is that too much
of a stretch for you to say Scotti too much of a stretch. I
think it's too much of a stretch for anyone, but Cunningham and Mowbley,
Like this is lofty territory that we're talking about. I would not be surprised
if Barnes is, you know, on the on the periphery of a top
ten player in the league conversation, which you know, go look at the
names who are in that right now. That's a huge compliment. Please don't
take it as anything but like a sending to that you know could be the
unquestioned best player in the league. Is another level beyond that, And I
just I don't know that I see enough there that's fair. I would say,
if you were looking for specific player comps, I do see. I
do get the Kevin Garnett comparisons with Evan Mobley, even though their games still
feel a lot different. But I think that Mobley is probably more polished defensively
than KG was coming in than KG was way more polished offensively. And I
don't know if Mobile ever has that sort of jumper, but I totally get
those Barns it's been tougher for me to think of just someone who springs to
mind when when really looking at him. And it's also, I think,
because I'm so taken aback by some of the stuff he does on offense right
now, where he's like taking I don't want to call them catch and shoot
twos, but they're like these quick catches, them turns around there. They're
basically like catch and shoot twos. But he's been he's been fantastic. And
with Kay Cunningham, he's comp because he doesn't have like that explosive athleticism you
typically see from guys putting up these kinds of numbers and filling these roles.
You're talking about Kay cunning him. Yeah, yeah, he I think one
of the things I wrote about him, he's going to dominate through comprehension and
well roundedness, maybe more so than actually dominate in any one area. Is
Luca a bad comp I don't know if it's a bad comp, but like,
obviously they're different body sizes, and you know, we don't see the
same like long range step back threes with nearly as much frequency, but just
in terms of how they control the game with changes of pace and with that
cerebral ability. Could it be like a cross between Can he be the Luca
Dontrige version of Mike Conley? I'm good with that? Is that just is
that terrible? Is that like the worst thing you've ever shuld we move on
to next question? I've heard way worse. Okay, that's that at least
makes me feel better. Jay Dobbs ninety were asked who were some of your
favorite tertiary creators on offense? Guys who don't run the show, but maybe
he can create a decent late shot clock opportunity with a second pick and roller.
I senh, it's a great question. Do you have any that immediately
came to mind? It's the first time hearing the question, so yeah,
So I think when I looked into this, I was trying to see,
like if anything matched up with like my guesses, And it's funny to see
when you look at like people who made a bunch of late shot clock opportunities,
they don't align with really anything. I would be thinking here, Jellen
Brunson feels like someone who fits this bill. I don't know if someone would
like some would tilt him more towards number one status on this I thought Monte
Morris was a good example. Gary Trent Junior here, even someone who might
be able to give you just some even if it's not necessarily a ton of
pick and roll juice, although maybe he does that, but can give you
some rim pressure from scratch. Those are the guys that I think spray sprang
to mind. Excuse me the moment, if you're looking for like maybe an
ISO or something. I don't want to say that's that's way too high of
a compliment for Jordan Clarks. I'm gonna take that back a little bit.
But Dylan Brooks is the first name that came to mind for me. I
don't know if he's secondary or primary sometimes, but just as a guy who,
like in those late shot clock situations, has the aggression, has the
fearlessness to put the ball on the floor and just attack. Yeah, I
actually would probably strongly disagree with that one. I know you don't like Dylan
Brooks. That's not okay this way. I don't like him. But sorry,
I should have said I know you hate Dylan Brooks. Some of the
other names that I have listed, I don't know that they would be necessarily
my primary ones. I have Eric Gordon Franz Wagner is another one that I
think that you consider, and then this I think it rings hollow now because
of how bad he's been lately, But alc Works might phone into that category.
Burks also might lead the NBA and like side leaning jumpers to the right.
Just if anyone cares about that, I don't know if I can look
up that stat but if anyone cares to another another fun deeper cut one,
Doug McDermott, Like, he's typically more of an off ball threat, but
every once in a while there's a bailout possession where he can put the ball
on the floor and you remember just how good a score he was in every
situation at Crayton. It's not a feature of the Spurs offense so much as
something that like sometimes happens. So to me, when I hear tertiary creator,
that's the more where I'm going. That feels like a I don't know,
like an anomaly of a creator that's tertiary. Feels wouldn't be secondary to
where it's semi consistent. I don't know, because like how many offenses have
true tertiary creators? Do? Because the offenses in the NBA now are so
centric around one specific player that even some teams struggle to have a secondary creator.
So the idea of having a consistent third option, to me, because
so much is based on drive and kick and pick and pop action, it's
really tough to have a guy who is consisting instantly the third ball handling option.
That's kind of how I looked at it, was like nonsense, like
Jalen Brunson to me is secondary creator. I'm with you. I also think
and I think this is a compliment to die hard NBA fans and bloggers,
podcasts, whatever. It feels like we cover so much of the league or
consume so much of the league that there's a tendency to scale players abubble level
where they are where you've watched so much of you know, Alec Burke's or
even Cam Thomas or you know, like fun answer he cat cam Thomas could
be an actual answer here to where you you almost do their role as like
outside to this quat Jail Brunts, it might actually be the perfect example there.
Jail Brunts is absolutely a secondary creator, but he's been so prominently featured
in the Mavericks or there's been this desperate search to find Dallas a second best
player that he's been scaled up there, So there are there are probably a
lot of different options. I'd be curious if the names that we churned out
are on the lower end or the higher end of what most other people would
say, though I think the highest end name that we spit out was it
Brunson. It's definitely Brunson. It's just interesting because when I heard that question,
my first reaction was to think of guys like McDermott who just aren't ball
handlers, but every once in a while they're that bailout option. I guess
that would be interesting. And you can also late shot clock and have a
different meaning late shock clock. You know, missiles off the catcher are valuable
as well. Absolutely, let's move on to some Twitter questions. This one
is one that I've overlooked for the past two mail bags. It was in
my DMS from Walls of Oz. I apologize it took so long. Do
you think the defense and Dunk's guard style Gary Payton the second Bruce Brown for
example. We'll catch on and we'll see more players like this. Integrator will
remain a few anomalous players. Is there any other secret Sauce and Gary Payton
a second or Bruce Brown's game besides athleticism, the ball IQ and the right
coach least team to utilize them, and some guys who the league may have
passed by, like Chris Downer Shaq Harrison, find a fit somewhere by assuming
a dunker spot offensive rule. I do think I can see that as the
natural evolution of where the league starts to go next, because at some point
we hit this tipping point where everything is so in favor of offensive players just
by design. You know, even with the NBA changing the rules emphasis and
the foul calling at the beginning of this season, whether it's been followed through
on as a topic for another time, there's still so much of a leading
to the offensive side of the ball. So when every player almost has to
be able to shoot threes, then all of a sudden, you're buying yourself
more leeway to have guys like Gary Payton who might not be the best shooters
and might need to be put in the dunker spot on offense, but can
reek so much havoc defensively that it still makes sense to play them because ultimately
you're getting the spacing from those non traditional spots within a rotation. So matisset
Table, I think, is another great example of a guy who just isn't
going to add much on offense, but you can play him situationally. You
can play him at a more scaled up role because you know that he's going
to be an asset defensively in on and off ball situations more frequently than he
might have been even a few years ago. Because with so many players shooting
threes, taking one of those out of their rhythm matters a lot more.
So I can totally see more and more of those players emerging down the road,
not necessarily as stars, but definitely not as anomalies because it's a specific
role on a team that has demonstrated value. And I don't even know that
it's going to require the right coach so much as the right player, who,
as the question put it, has that combination of athleticism, basketball IQ
and defensive intensity. Also, think, what matters and would affect the frequency
with which these players emerge is the team makeup to where do you either are
you not playing Biggs true biggs, or are your your front court players predominantly
able to space the floor in most of your lineups because having for the traditionally
or conventionally, you want your guards to be some of the ones who are
spacing the floor or who are on the ball, both whatever. If you
don't need that from your your centers or your let's say, your fours or
whatever, and you can play these guys like Biggs on offense because you have
the flexibility elsewhere positionally, that would, for sure, I think, enable
you to even test this out. As far as guys that spring to mind
who might be able to work in this role, I didn't have anyone.
I thought he doesn't fit the athleticism role. But like some smart team will
get Frankie Lahina a chance in this role. It just needs to happen.
I actually went historical with examples because I think that there there are some players
who missed this opportunity by a decade or so. The first one that came
to mind, and this is kind of a deep cut. Do you remember
watching Chris Kramer at Perduell No. Three time All Defensive in the Big Ten,
two time Defensive Player of the Year in the Big Ten when undrafted in
twenty ten, played for the Fort Wayne and mad Ants and the then D
League and has played for a bunch of different teams in Europe, never actually
made it in the NBA, but just an absolutely hounding on ball defender who
could stay in front of any guard. He's developed an offensive game overseas,
but he didn't really have much of one with the Boilermakers. But he was
so ridiculously suffocating that he created so many loose ball opportunities. He threw so
many high level future NBA players off their game. I think there's more of
a role for a guy like that in the league now, where you can
buy yourself more specialty bandwidth because you have shooting from every other spot in the
lineup that you know Steph's torturing, torturing you and torturing you. Either one
works, Let's put in that guy and throw him off his rhythm as best
we can. It's like a souped up version of Patrick Beverley. You know,
a guy who's just going to go in there and not necessarily be an
instigator, but throw a guy off his game so much with the constant pressure
that he can have that singular focus and not even need to contribute elsewhere except
for being thrown in the dunker's spot. And if they forget about him.
He can finish a player on the basket. That's fair. I don't know
how much that helps teams in the now though, being able to reflect upon
guys from the past that could have worked. What about I'm just I'm going
with thinking big picture. What about like an Esac Bonga? Would that be
someone who could work there? Or sure? Maybe he shot the three ball
away to all at East for stretches in his career, and I guess he's
played this role sometimes, but give it off about sneaking of an offensive reboundaries
a Tory Craig. Is he someone who has more valuable, more value if
you use him that way? A ton I think he's good enough on the
offensive ends as a floor space or that you don't need to but he could
work there. That's interesting oral I wonder i've and i've if they've used him
like this at all? I apologize everyone was like, does that change like
josh a Kogie at all? A value like his where someone we just know
can't shoot it? Should I don't know if he could fit in that role.
Maybe they've used him in that. If tim Rules fans are listening,
feel free to scold me. I mean lou Dort. You know, he's
shown some shooting growth, but how much more valuable is he if you pigeonhole
him into a smaller offensive role where he can use his athleticism even more.
Russell Westbrook, what about the what about the defense part? Oh yeah,
that was a good point. But put Russell Westbrook in the Gary pay in
the second role on offense where he's just screening and cutting and doing some stuff
in the dunker spot, and that might be the most optimized version of Russell
Westbrook on offense this show. I'm not even trying to be an asshole with
that. I swear that was actually think the most optimized version of Russell Westbrook
might just be like on the bench, moving on Mark who his Twitter handle
was Yokich for show kitch, I appreciate that which MVP candidate has the best
marquee performance of the year so far? I think it's Yokich. The specific
game is the one against the Clippers that went to overtime where he and Zubots
were just trading buckets at the end. Just the clinic that he put on
not just as a scorer, but the past that he made out of a
double team across the court to Aaron Gordon just to force overtime. It was.
It was a masterpiece that showed every element of his game. He made
big defensive plays on the interior, even while operating with foul trouble. He
was unstoppable on the interior. He made some big threes down the stretch.
He kept the Nuggets alive with this passing. So as much as every other
candidate has had signature performances that really stand out, that to me was the
game of the year in the NBA, as well as the performance of the
year that might have been like the play of the year too that past specifically
Aaron Gordon. And there's I think it's that one because that was the Aaron
Gordon pass game that's he has. That's one of his game saving blocks this
year too, right because Raptors and Warriors. I think the other two game
against if you went by that would be my pick. By the way,
is that Clippers game regardless if you went just by game score on stathead,
I was curious to see what came up the ends to really isn't that bad.
It's his most recent explosion against the Pelicans is the highest game score among
all his perform and he had thirty points in the fourth quarter in overtime there
with three steals four blocks as well. It's just he finished with forty six
points, twelve rebounds, eleven assists, three steals, four blocks, shot
over shot thirteen of seventeen on I think it was it was a sixty five
point five tree shooting percentage if I remember correctly. Uh, it was No,
it had to be what did you say, sixty five point sixty five
point five. I think it had to be way higher than that. He
shot ninety one point seven percent at the foul line, sixty percent from three,
and seventy six point five percent. It was not a sixty five point
five. I don't know where I'm getting that number from anyway. My whole
point is so they win that game, and like, it just feels very
I saw it, we talked, there were people that we are, people
that talked about it on Twitter. I didn't see the game personally, but
it just feels like, oh, okay, Yokis did this. That's just
how it feels that this has just become the norm for him. So I
don't know, can you think of a second player, because I feel like
all the answers kind of belong to Yoki is there. I feel the same
way. I think Imbid's tough because he has some massive scoring performances, but
I think the constant parade to the free throw line lessons the memorability of them.
And I'm not even criticizing that, because, if anything, I actually
think him Bid doesn't shoot enough free throws given how he plays. It's a
little bit of that shock effect where officials just can't call every foul against him.
So I'm in no way trying to downplay his skill in getting the free
throw line, but just because so many of his points are coming at stoppages
in the live action, it's hard for those to stand out quite as much.
I think. I don't know if people still consider Steph one of the
top five MVP candidates. I think there's still a case for him. He
had that game. I think it was like within the first two or three
weeks of the season against the Hawks, where he just went absolutely nuclear.
That could be a candidate. Jannie Janis has like most point game. He
has the fifty point game. He has like more the fifty point game by
the way, he came against the Pacers, which is like how like,
how do we describe Also the fact that you couldn't remember who it was against
I think speaks to I think being a reasonable answer. He's beat up on
the Lakers a couple of times this season, so there's that. But I
think the answer for me would definitely be Yokich, who's just had in part
because they've needed him to have these moments, Otherwise they would have lost these
games where some of these other players are coming from better situations to where maybe
they're not in those even moments or just positions as often. I actual think
there's a great segue to a question we had from random bystander how much should
team record impact the MVP race? That could also be sort of extrapolated to
how much should supporting cast impact the MVP race? Is it here? My
argument here be is it like who would be a good example? Like?
Is it they honest's fault that, even as shallow as the Bucks are,
he's had a better supporting cast than Yokich in Denver, just as I think
you could argue at this point Denver is deeper, especially given the player of
their bench of late, then Milwaukee. It's just that Milwaukee has two All
Star caliber talents that are healthy on the roster in Denver does not. Historically,
it matters a lot. You don't tend to see m vps outside of
the top three of their conference, with a few notable exceptions, all of
which have come in recent years. Personally, I don't think it should matter
what's soever, because to me, you're judging who the most valuable player is
to their team, and maybe that's a player who pushes their team from good
to great, from great to best in the league, but it could also
be someone who pushes their team from terrible to factoring into the play and race
in one of the two conferences. I just I don't think it should matter
because if it does, even at the smallest level, fundamentally, you're arguing
that a player is more valuable because his teammates are better. There's no way
around that. You know, if you if you had Yokich put together the
exact same season while playing with utter garbage around him. I'm not talking about
like this diminished supporting cast that still has a number of high quality players,
but like if you put him on you know, the kid cunninghamless Detroit Pistons,
They're not going to be winning that many games. That doesn't change how
valuable he is. It changes the perception of how valuable he is because he
has worst teammates. So I don't like the idea of saying that somebody has
a better MVP case most valuable player, And I just don't think that V
is interpreted correctly on ninety percent of ballots. If teammates are better, how
does that make them more valuable? Like you could you the only the only
reasonable argument there is there's there's higher leverage opportunities that ultimately a game played by
a bottom feeder is inherently less important than a game by a team fighting for
positioning near the top of the conference. So there's something to that, like
performing when stakes are higher. That argument isn't made though. It's just like
here, look at the record. Here, look at where they are in
the conference, and that to me just means like, hey, let's reward
this player for having, you know, lucked into being in a good situation.
And also when you use the conference specifically, this is where it gets
flawed. With the record of the conference. Oh, the Nuggets are only
six in the West. They are one loss behind the Milwaukee Bucks in the
records calm for the league and two losses behind the Sixers, and those two
are the two of the top three teams in the East. That's that's splitting
already thrice split hairs there. If you're ascribing that ascribing so much value to
the team record, which is also eyes flo I think I don't. I
don't think you could set ever baseline criteria for the MVP award. If you
want to create a minute threshold or something, fine, because it is inherently
subjective. But we need to do a better job of and I think we
probably have, like you alluded moving towards years, Yeah, just to do
a better job of because if we're gonna just best player from the best team,
then like, yeah, let's okay, who from the Suns do you
want to pick? Devin Book or Chris Paul That would be with this award
would become Yeah. I think that there there are some outlier seasons, like
I'm thinking like twenty eleven Kevin Love, where a guy is so obviously one
of the best players in the league and shouldn't just be disqualified from the conversation
because he has dog shit around him like that. That's one of those seasons
and wind shares are an inherently flawed metric, But I really like looking at
wind shares relative to team wins because there are some seasons I don't remember exactly
where Loves twenty eleven season where the Timberwolves fell, like, there are some
like Neil Johnston's seasons back in the nineteen forties and fifties where he had more
wind shares than his team had wins. That's value just because he didn't win
games. That's value. That would be like a Trey Young this season,
not like I'm equating it to let's say, too fourteen Kevin Love was my
years were off? No, my years off? Then, I'm just saying
that Love season in Minnesota where he like broke every single I think it was
twenty eleven twelve, But okay, that's fine. Might not remember exactly he
was he in Cleveland by twenty thirteen twenty four No, he wasn't in Cleveland
by them, was he? All right, I'm looking it up. I'm
getting old. Twenty twelve was his ridunculous season. Actually twenty thirteen twenty fourteen
two? Oh good, so at least that was right on one of the
years. We're getting old. The next question comes from Jackalmore. This one
was an interesting question. If you could only shoot three pointers for an entire
game, one, who would be your current starting five current NBA players only
two? Who would be the opposing team starting five all NBA players available?
Oh? I guess he meant all time there, I did. I built
this as which Oh we did current? Yeah, we did current, and
I built it. We built it as they have to defend this other team.
Yes, So the way I interpreted this is when I'm building my offensive
lineup, I still have to consider what they're doing on the defensive end,
But then my defensive roster the sole purpose is to defend the offensive roster.
Correct. So my my offensive lineup is Steph Curry, Fred VanVleet, Desmond
Bane, Cam Johnson and Joel Embiid. And Bead's not the most accurate three
point shooter, but just the fact that he can reasonably shoot those from the
five, and then I get his defense on the other ends, which is
also the case for Van Fleet and Baine. You know that that gives me
a lot of defensive juice to work with. Cam Johnson fills in a lot
of gaps on both ends. But all five of those guys can rein it
in from the outside. We had two overlaps. I had Steph Tyrese Haliburton,
Harrison Barnes, Cam Johnson, and PJ Tucker. And that was sort
of the way you were thinking with Embiad. I was thinking with Tucker.
He actually is second in the NBA in three point percentage this year too.
I was hitting forty eight percent a few weeks ago. Right, He's not
hitting them off the dribble, obviously, but he can hit. He could
just sprinkle those in from the corner and it allows you know where Harrison Barnes
or Kim Johnson is technically year three, but they're not because PJ. Tucker
exists. So that was my thought. The defensive one was more challenging.
Ours ended up being similar. When we built the lineups, you did not
you did not build a lineup at first, or you misinterpreted it correct But
I have one now and a huge caveat here that I'm assuming health and you'll
know you'll know why that exists in a minute, because I have Matisse Tybel
who's like the most obvious inclusion imaginable on this team. I owed a sum
Jimmy Butler, Draymond Green, and a healthy version of Anthony Davis. Just
for the record, I did build my lineup first, and you just stole
to soume move from me because he was on Oh he would have been on
there anyway. Matisse Tibo was also online. I had Draymond Green as well.
Where the Tury differentiated, I had Evan Mowgwi and Dylan Brooks. You
claim I hate Dylan Brooks, but I need someone who's getting to you don't
have If him on your offensive roster, you're limiting him to one end of
the court when he can do so much more. Why do you hate Dylan
Brooks so much? I love his defense. I feel like there's a he's
like he defends with the subtle fuck you is how I would sort of describe
his I don't think it's that subtle. To me. It's well, it's
not like a violent fuck you, is my point. So we're like we're
ferocious. I don't want to use the word violent there, but like a
Patrick Beverley, who's clearly not as good, there's like a ferocious f you.
Dylan Brooks is more like an even keeled fuck you behind that uses equilibrium
I can get behind that. As a point of clarification from the previous question.
By the way, Kevin Love sixth in the MVP voting in twenty eleven,
twelve eleventh, and twenty thirteen fourteen, that should have been a lot
higher. Yeah. The final part of this past question from Jackelmore, though,
was what would the final score be? I don't even know how to,
Like, I have no idea. Would they if we set the over
under at one ninety so each team scoring eighty points? Or wow, we
set the over under at one ninety each team scoring ninety five points? Would
that be too high? Too low because they only have one shot they can
take? But it's just worth inherently more, I don't think the defensive team
would score at all? Is the issue? Like if if we're putting the
I mean, like my team, Matisse Table, Dessum, Jimmy Butler,
Draymond Green, and Anthony Davis. Some of those guys can shoot threes,
most of them shouldn't, and we still have a good defenders from the first
team, So like, what do you can literally just leave matiss Table alone
because he's not allowed to shoot except for three. So I don't think that
team's scoring. But I do think the good offense just inherently beats bad defense,
beats good defense. So I think it's like one twenty to like forty,
So you're taking under one ninety. Yeah, I think so I'll take
the over because I think offense beats good defense. But I have no idea
how we're going to test this. None of the lineups we beat. If
anyone has two K and wants to run this go ahead, but they can
only shoot threes? How do you How do you do that? If anyone
has two K and is also a wizard like programmer or something, but also
the other the defensive team doesn't only have to shoot threes, right, So
I think it does. Even then I'm gonna take over. You don't have
enough trust in Io, and look, you want me to trust Ilan Brooks's
offensive game? Here it is baby. Taking that question was interesting though.
Last couple here Chris asked, I'm not sure how to categorize it, but
the Pacers have to be having one of the worst records in close games by
any NBA team in history. Would would you do a data dig on any
of this? This took way too long, but I did it anyway.
And I just looked at clutch performances. The Pacers have been involved in more
close games, but I wanted to just make sure that there were plenty of
meaningful minutes played. So in clutch games this season and I just used traditional
crunch time where you're within five points in the final five minutes or the differential
there's no more than five points on either side in the final five minutes.
The Pacers are ten and twenty eight this season. That's a twenty six point
three winning percentage. The fact that eight of their games have gone to crunch
time is probably encouraging, but if you go back ten years, there are
these are the only teams that have had a lower winning percentage in crunch time
than the Pacers this season. The twenty seventeen twenty eighteen MAVs were twelve and
thirty eight, so they won twenty four percent. Of the Carlisle team.
What are you trying to insinuate there that my perception of him is apparently flawed.
The twenty twenty two twenty one Pistons, they were seven and twenty five
twenty one point nine because they were better in the clutch than this Pacers team.
Though, oh they were better overall in the clutch Yes, it's correct.
And also they played fewer games than the Pacers in the crunch times,
I mean relative to their their typical standard of performance. That's what That's what
I caught on to you. If you said that, you could argue that
the Pacers are having a more unlucky or worst season because they've played in so
many more games. There was also the twenty fifteen twenty sixteen six Ers were
five and thirty, so they won fourteen point three percent of their crunch time
games. Again, I'm sorry, five and thirty year was that though,
twenty fifteen, twenty sixteen, So that's process era. Yeah, I mean
you had to know one of those teams was showing up in here. And
then the final team in the last decade to have the lower winning percentage than
the Pacers this season was the twenty thirteen twenty fourteen Bucks ten and thirty.
They won twenty five percent. So when you're looking at the number of games
played that went into crunch time, the Pacers are having whether you want to
call it the worst unluckiest one of the two or three worst slashed unluckiest crunch
time seasons over the past decade, when again, when you're looking at total
minutes played slash games entering crunch time, not great, not great at all.
To be fair, they might get a top tip pick and have Tyr's
Haliburton and they're still Miles Turner, Malcolm Brows and Chris war Day there and
O shaper Sette one of my favorites to watch. Cooper asked, how does
herb Jones' defense stack up with the rest of the league. I do appreciate
these questions that want to try and five where people stand on defense. I
just think it's inherently difficult. There are a bunch of different stats you could
look at. My favorite one, though, is when you look at how
often he is defended. And I'm just taking this answer because I assume you
didn't You obviously didn't have time to like an answer. Oh what's your answer?
Go ahead. My answer is that if he is not part of the
conversation for one of your all defensive slots, that you're doing it wrong.
It's fair enough to frame it that way as well. He has spent over
thirty three percent of his time guarding the number one option on the other team.
There are only two players in the league who have played at least a
thousand minutes and spent more time guarding number one options than Herb Jones. Would
you care to even venture guesses as to who they are? Not at all.
I think you'd probably get at least one, but it's Matisse Tyble and
DeAndre Hunter who just barely cracks the minutes. I was going to guess Matisse
Tyble and DeAndre Hunter, so I would have guessed Dorian Phinney Smith. I
would have been wrong, but he is number four. If that's any consolation,
it's not because I wouldn't have been close. My favorite stat for Herb
Jones' defense is the suffocation rate, which is just infinity, So that's that's
pretty impressive. These will be the my My follow up question is which sounds
like a better defender, Herb Jones or Herbert Jones, because I kind of
waffle her Herb Jones sounds more like intimidating to me. Herbert Jones sounds more
like he's gonna try and sell you something while he's defending you. Herb Jones
feels like he's really gonna like screw like screw you over. I like Herb
Jones. I feel like Herb Jones sounds more like a shooter. Shooters can
defend like Dylan Brooks. Actually I'm a shooter maybe between the ears, but
uh ribo flavan ass. What is the difference between a slam and a dunk?
Our A dunk is like contact with with fingers at rim, but a
slam is like there's a defender involved, there's ferocity in the play there,
and a dunk can so all all is it all slams or dunks? But
not all dunks are slams. That's absolutely So you're saying that you're you need
to touch the rim for both of these. A slam what DeAndre like,
you know, like the classic Like my dad claims that he's dunked once in
his life and you know it was one of those like putbacks where you like
happened to graze the rim as you're putting the ball back through the hoop.
That's a dunk. That's not a slam. But I'm saying so a slam
couldn't be. It feels like there's more room for interpretation with a slam where
it's like who what's the most famous? Like non dunk dunk where it's like
they just ruined like the Blake Griffin one, right, Griffin over Hendrick Perkins?
Right? Right? Was there a DeAndre Jordan over Brandon Knight. But
that's that's a slam. That's a sl i am even if you don't touch
the rim, that's a slam layup. So not all, not all,
not all slams or dunks then, because I guess you just just proved that.
Yeah, that's why. To me, let's if we need an official
definition, a slam is when the ball travels through the hoop in a downward
trajectory with ferocity and likely a defender involved. That's why we're under the NBA
math umbrella, folks, because we use the super technical, scientific logic to
get things done. Here. These are these are the last two. These
are going to be our last two questions. Apologize for the people we didn't
get to. Adam has the answer to this one. Who was the most
average player in the league, either overall or relative to their position? That
one comes from Day. Yeah, I wanted to take a purely numbers based
look at this, so I'm going to use NBA maths TPA metric because by
definition, zero is perfectly average. Because unlike vorp Unlike a lot of other
metrics, we are having the baseline set not at a replacement level player,
but at the league average. And there's obviously room for flaws in this because
BPM and then therefore TPA are by no means perfect stats. But there are
seven players this season who have exactly zero TPA on the year, so I'll
go through those in ascending minutes. Isaiah Jackson is number seven with two hundred
and seventy seven minutes. And actually these are since I'm just getting back from
vacation, I'm realizing that these are a little bit outdated because I have not
done an update since Friday afternoon, so apologies if this has changed significantly.
Nerland's Noel number six, Dwight Howard number five, Javonte Green number four,
Joe Ingles number three, PJ. Washington number two, and Mo Bamba number
one. I would also say that if you include the offense defense breakdown,
just not looking at guys who are really good on offense and really bad on
defense or vice versa, but the guys who are at zero and are also
just really close to the origin because they don't differentiate themselves on either ends.
On either end of the floor. The objective answer here is PJ. Washington,
which I feel like that could also anecdotally be the answer. It definitely
could. And if you remove, if you remove like it having to be
exactly at zero from the equation, then I think you allow for you know,
some other interesting answers. You know I'm looking at like Quentin Grimes has
been almost perfectly average according to our statu. PJ. Washington's shown up again
here. So can I tell you the name that's spreading to my mind?
First, I was trying to figure out if who would be the closest average
on both sides of the floor. Sure, Marcus Morris, that's a valid
one. I thought you were going to check it against t PA. I
guess that's yeah. No, I absolutely can that. I would that would
have been my anecdotal answer when I saw PJ. Washington, because I ran
the numbers like you did that very close to very close to the origin on
both ends. So yeah, that But when I saw PJ. Washington,
I was like that that sounds thinking about poo watching him, that sounds most
correct. I think like Jenny Osmond's another fun answer here, did you have
an anecdotal name that's bringing to mind. When you first saw the question,
the first one that came to mind was Dwight Howard. That is interesting where
I think that like he's he's so obviously regressed from his superstardom in Orlando,
where he's like a perfectly functional role player who isn't a defensive stopper, isn't
really much of an offensive threat. But because his role is limited in both
of those areas, he doesn't really stand out negatively or positively. I almost
feel like that's giving him too much credit on offense. But I totally get
what you're saying there, and the numbers back it up. So if he's
spreading to mind, yeah, I don't know that he's like a super It's
tough because the numbers aren't aren't really accounting for his lack of ability to do
things. It's more when he does get touches, he's been pretty average.
Final question comes from hash what's the chance of Lebron getting the scoring title?
For context as we record this, Kevin Durant, who I still think we'll
qualify for it, and Joel Embiid are tied at twenty nine point five points
per game. Lebron is just behind them at twenty nine point four points per
game. Yeah, it's all about opportunity, right, So I think you
can pretty reasonably take a stab at embe it eventually we haven't seen it yet,
eventually being able to see a little bit more offensive responsibility to James Harden
and in turn give Tobias Harris more touches to at him find a rhythm,
which means that his scoring numbers might not be there. I think he's also
motivated to win the scoring title, so I don't know how much of that
we're going to see. Lebron feels like he could swing either way. Because
the Lakers could just accept that they're going to be a play in team and
rest him a lot and not let him put up these fifty six point performances
on the flip side because no one else could do anything, he might have
more of them, so I would. I would say that there are three
or four people who have a legitimate shot. Lebron is in it, and
it feels fair to put it around like twenty five. He has won one
scoring title, right, it was earlier on in his career, so he
doesn't have the whole I guess he wants to be a multi time scoring title
winner. But I also do think he cares about just getting the regular season
scoring record as quickly as possible. I would probably put it at like a
I just feel like it'll be I'm with you on it, Bead. Just
having Harden could drop him from the leader spot. The Nets kind to need
Kevin Duranto lead the league in scoring, which is a little terrifying because they
have Kyrie Irving, or they're supposed to have him on a regular basis.
Who knows how that looks when Ben Simmons comes back. Lebron isn't gonna have
Anthony Damis for the foreseeable future, and he's just all everything Lakers. I
feel like I'm gonna eat a thirty percent chance. Do you think who is
so who you have embed as your pick to win a scoring title? I
think so. I think so, And I think what makes Lebron scoring so
amazing, it's just the consistency year over year. Like, he only has
one scoring title and it came in two thousand and seven, two thousand and
eight, when he averaged thirty points per game for the Cleveland Cavaliers. But
the fact that we had to say only is telling in and of itself,
and if you look at his ranks through the years after his rookie season,
when he's still finished thirteenth in the scoring race, third third, fourth,
first, second, second, second, third, fourth, third, third,
fifth, eight third, twelfth, second, it doesn't make sense.
That's that's wild. Who's who's more likely than win the scoring title? Kevin
Duranna Lebron, Lebron. I think I'm with you there. I might.
I might even have Lebron is my most likely choice here. That's an instrg.
But I think it's better than I would say it's better than a twenty
percent said twenty five percent. I think it's better than a twenty percent chance
that he wins the scoring title, which is I don't know that I would
have ever thought to have protected that at the beginning of the season. The
stat that he is the only player in NBA history who has a fifty point
game before twenty one and after thirty six ridiculous. This is also only the
fourth time in his career that he has averaged twenty nine or more points per
game, and it's happening at age fucking I. Look, I know threes
are like a I think there's a conversation to be had about how impactful his
numbers have been this year. Oh so you're saying the Lakers have been in
so many like meaningless games, does it actually matter? Yeah? I think,
Like, you know, that's one of the common criticisms of James is
that he has chased some of these stats, like in meetingless situations and games
that are already won, He's stayed in longer than some players would. I
think there's some validity to that this year, Like, the Lakers obviously are
just even more of a fiasco than they already are if he's not putting up
his numbers. But like, the defense hasn't been great this year. You've
seen the videos of him just like not even participating, and you know a
lot of these big performances have common games that were pretty hopeless from the start.
That's not to say, like, but Lebron doesn't even deserve to be
like on the back end of an MVP ballot, because by my definition,
even despite the Lakers struggles, like he's done a lot to keep this team
afloat. But I do think that there's there's some validity to the overall stat
line not necessarily being totally indicative of how he's actually played this year. Something
that I do find incredible, and I looked it up while you were talking,
is I don't think we're talking enough about how he is shooting sixty two
point one percent inside the arc this year. That is the set highest two
point conversion rate he has ever had as of right now. He just doesn't
make sense. He doesn't and because it's like I don't know, I will
check this as i'm talking. But when you look at his game, there
are people don't I don't think anyone was actually calling him the washed King,
but there are people that talk. He just doesn't look as explosive. And
no, this isn't a version of Lebron. That's just getting to the rim
at an absurd rate. And then I look and forty three percent of his
shots are coming at the at the rim this season. That's it's in a
lower percentile than he's used to because his position is different this year. That
is, it's higher than last season. It's not the highest of his career,
but it's not like insignificant. Still, he's shooting all these turnarounds and
fadeaways. So I looked he is shooting on turnaround, fade away jump shots,
specifically forty eight point four percent, and we're talking like a not insignificant
number of total attempts here. He has over the still level is just unreal.
He's just it's just absolutely wild that we can say that. So he
is shooting on turnaround fade away jump shots, and I included the ones that
were banked in so not turnaround jump shots. He also needs to be fading
away. NBA Playtype data breaks this down. He is shooting thirty of sixty
two. That is that's sucking, unreal, ridiculous. It feels like a
great place to end this podcast. Well, not not quite yet, because
I do want to keep talking about this. Sorry. I think, like,
you know, I'm thinking back to the conversation that we had one of
our more heated discussions, you know, on the heels of or maybe it
was midway through the first round loss to the Sun's last last postseason, where
I said that it felt like the decline was coming because it didn't seem like
he had that next level where he could ascend and lift his team to victories.
We no longer had that feeling of inevitability. And on the surface level,
I think it looks like that was just fucking stupid at this point.
But I still want to stand by that, and I'm curious how you feel
because to me, like Lebron every year until this year, he's so good
at not just getting his numbers, but doing so in a way that elevates
whoever's around him. And he's had a lot of garbage lineups around him over
the years. I'm not seeing that this year. So like he's getting to
the rim frequently, he's finishing around the rim frequently, and I wonder how
much of that is because there's no longer a need to devote quite as much
defensive attention to him, and as a result of that, he's not really
elevating those around him like we've typically come to see, and that's what's typically
made his teams so good. The numbers here, you know, the net
rating swing, as valid as that can be and as invalid as it can
be in certain situation, and it's all sorts of wonky because the Lakers have
had such a topsy turvy season and have so little depth. But plus one
point seven net rating swing this year, it's the worst mark of his career,
and it's coming on the heels of plus ten point six last year plus
nine point nine the year before that. So I feel like, even if
he could win the scoring title, if he could put these jaw dropping per
game statistics together, I have that same feeling that I had in the playoffs
last year. Where as good as he is individually, there's still not that
feeling of inevitability that we came to associate with him during his ridiculously extended prime.
Not trying to hate here, like what he's doing is ridiculous and he's
trying to make the most of a bad situation. It just doesn't feel the
same way that Lebron's dominance has felt in years past. I think that's fair.
There's also the Lakers status quo is working from like just a horrific baseline,
and I'm wondering how that impacts it. I guess having Anthy Davis is
your second best player, he's had worst teams, then in a nutshell,
Anthony Davis hasn't been available, and when you start to look at the lineups,
his most used lineups, and even if let's just assume that Russell Westbrook
has didn't been detrimental to this team, which is fair, the most used
lineup that the Lakers have played with Lebron and no Westbrook is Malik Munk,
Austin Reeves, Town Horton Tucker, and Carmelo Anthony. So why isn't why
isn't that swing larger? I'm saying, because that lineup he's not gonna uplift
if the Lakers are bad on a baseline and then they're just getting worse.
That's the most frequent he's played with. Yes, okay, got it so,
and that he doesn't have much to work with. That that is indisputable,
But it's also I'm not I think you're right overall though, because it's
I'm not gonna sit here and say if Lebron was how many years younger would
he, would this team have a better record? It probably would. I
don't know. I haven't dug into this or thought about this. I don't
know where this ranks on the scale of like the worst supporting cast that he's
had. And it's muddied just by the fact that Anthony Davis exists, and
I know he hasn't been super healthy, but he's played in what what what
is he at? Twenty something games? How many games Anthy Davis played in
this season? I just have no idea like negative three. So I don't
know, we're not honestly ranks, but I don't. I don't view him
as responsible though, But it's definitely not, definitely not. I'm not I'm
not trying to blame Lebron playing thirty seven games that is that is wow.
I was shocked it's that high. I'll also say the Lakers have lost the
minutes this season that he and Anthony Davis played without Russell Westbrook. I believe.
Let me see double checking, Yes, they're minus four point eight per
one hundred possessions, so see. I just I think if you went back
and you found some of the lineup data, even on like Lakers teams from
two years ago, that there are similar lineups that he's floated to a lot
more success than he has with the makeshift ones I've used this year. I
just there's been more of who's the second best player on this team in Lions
with Lebron and who's the second best player in this lineup with Linumps with Lebron
than we've ever had during his Lakers tenure, whether it was the year that
he was there, like when you had Ingram Kuzma was there for a while,
you've Lonzo whatever, then you've had Davis this season, It's like,
oh, he's playing in line ups with Trevor Ariza. Malik Monk might be
a valid answer to that some nights. Who's the Laker who has been the
Lakers third best player this season? The final buzzer? Probably that's a great
question. I'm not even is it Malik Monk? Is is it Carmelo Anthony.
I think it's Carmelo Anthony. I'm on this is an honest question because
I don't know the answer to it. I don't have a strong opinion.
I think the answers I assume we're saying Anthony Davis is the second best player
availability at all. I think it's either mellow Malik Monk or Dwight Howard.
It can't be Dwight Howard. They don't even want to play Dwight Howard anymore
because because we should definitely base our evaluations on their decision making. It's fair
enough that look the Rambi, that would be the plural of Rambis, right,
it is Ramby. The Rambi wanted to play Dwight Howard and DeAndre Jordan
together. So we're never going to know how good this Lakers team could have
been because we never saw what the Rambai wanted. Is Austin Reeves a vellent
answer? It a season he might be and it hasn't been rushed. Let's
just make that clear. That wasn't a joke. By the way, And
if you want to even make it value, because can you say, is
it has Ampthy has been the second most valuable player the Laker thirty seven games,
I'd probably say yes. And look, even if you want to say
it's been Russ, it hasn't been Russ. You start to run into pecking
order questions with this team very quickly. It's it's Malik, Monk or mellow
a like think let's see wind Shares Lebron six point six, Davis four point
six, Melow three point five, Monk two point eight, Dwight Howard two
point four, Austin Greaves one point eight, DeAndre Jordan one point four,
Russ and Stanley Johnson one point two. Well, now we have to end
the podcast on a sad note. I was gonna end on a high note,
but you had to keep going. If you've made it this far,
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one the only should be playing more in the dunker spot. Frank, He'll kid