WEBVTT 1 00:00:02.960 --> 00:00:10.119 Big Food and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo. These guys, are you fav 2 00:00:10.320 --> 00:00:18.600 It's so like, say subscribe and rade it. I'm stuck and me gratious. 3 00:00:18.960 --> 00:00:27.280 One wish today and listening watching limb always keep it Squatching And now you're 4 00:00:27.399 --> 00:00:32.520 hosts Cliff Berrickman and James Bobo Fay, Hey, Squatch getears. This is 5 00:00:32.600 --> 00:00:37.000 Cliff. You're listening to Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and usually Bobo, but 6 00:00:37.079 --> 00:00:40.479 this is one of those usual or unusual times where he's not here. We're 7 00:00:40.520 --> 00:00:43.719 recording this in the morning, and Bobo's not a morning person, and even 8 00:00:43.759 --> 00:00:46.759 if he is, apparently he has plans. He's got some firewood issues that 9 00:00:46.799 --> 00:00:50.320 he already had pre planned. So it's kind of my fault in a way 10 00:00:50.399 --> 00:00:56.119 that Bobo's not here because it was last night that I arranged this witness and 11 00:00:56.240 --> 00:00:59.600 uh, you know, last minute stuff isn't easy for anybody, and Bob 12 00:00:59.640 --> 00:01:02.960 already had had plans to get some firewood because that's how he heats his house 13 00:01:03.000 --> 00:01:07.480 and all that sort of stuff. So it's just me today, Well it's 14 00:01:07.480 --> 00:01:08.439 not just me. We have a guest, but I'll get to her in 15 00:01:08.560 --> 00:01:11.560 just a few moments. It's kind of a great week and Bigfoot right now. 16 00:01:11.680 --> 00:01:15.000 Lots of cool things are happening. New footprints were discovered. I just 17 00:01:15.000 --> 00:01:19.799 got emails yesterday from a person who found some footprints south of Timothy Lake out 18 00:01:19.799 --> 00:01:25.120 here in Manhood National Forests. They look fantastic in the photographs. I'll be 19 00:01:25.159 --> 00:01:29.680 sharing that with some of the members here at an ABC. I guess I 20 00:01:29.680 --> 00:01:30.680 can throw that the pru it too. You can put it on the Bigfoot 21 00:01:30.719 --> 00:01:34.280 of Beyond podcast stuff, great photographs. I wish I could have been out 22 00:01:34.319 --> 00:01:38.560 there, but it is now under a foot or two of snow. They 23 00:01:38.560 --> 00:01:42.079 were discovered on November twenty seventh, so that's the kind of thing that makes 24 00:01:42.079 --> 00:01:46.120 my heart ache, like, oh, man, had you told me or 25 00:01:46.920 --> 00:01:49.799 that day or the day after, heck, the day after was my birthday. 26 00:01:49.840 --> 00:01:52.519 What a cool birthday present that would have been to go open cast footprints 27 00:01:52.959 --> 00:01:57.159 south of Timothy Lake up here in the Mountain National Forest. But alas did 28 00:01:57.159 --> 00:02:00.079 not happen. But at least the witness did send them to me, So 29 00:02:00.159 --> 00:02:05.040 that was really cool. But of course, right now most people are talking 30 00:02:05.239 --> 00:02:08.840 about a piece of footage that was obtained last week that just might show a 31 00:02:08.879 --> 00:02:13.439 Sasquatch. And of course if you go online and look at Facebook, which 32 00:02:13.479 --> 00:02:16.719 is probably just about the last place you should ever look for good information, 33 00:02:16.800 --> 00:02:21.240 I might add, because not only is a lot of this stuff put out 34 00:02:21.280 --> 00:02:23.000 just nonsense, but also the people who chime in, you know, they 35 00:02:23.000 --> 00:02:25.319 all act like they know what they're talking about, or have some sort of 36 00:02:25.360 --> 00:02:30.000 authority, or like their opinion counts. Now, mind you, mind you. 37 00:02:30.319 --> 00:02:31.840 I'm under no illusion that my opinion counts at all, you know, 38 00:02:32.400 --> 00:02:36.080 and therefore you don't see me give a lot of opinions out there on social 39 00:02:36.159 --> 00:02:38.599 media. But there's an interesting piece of footage that just surfaced. It was 40 00:02:38.599 --> 00:02:43.759 obtained last Thursday when we're recording this so a we could go today. It's 41 00:02:43.879 --> 00:02:46.800 recording on Thursday from the Walla Walla River, the south fork of the Walla 42 00:02:46.879 --> 00:02:53.120 Walla River, and today we have or I have the videographer, the one 43 00:02:53.120 --> 00:02:57.280 of the only two witnesses to this thing, and the other witness was her 44 00:02:57.360 --> 00:03:00.039 daughter. But so, Kelly, thanks for taking a little bit of time 45 00:03:00.039 --> 00:03:04.240 this morning to come on Bigfoot and Beyond and tell us the story behind this 46 00:03:04.319 --> 00:03:07.719 video. Because if you go online, there's all sorts of crazy misinformation and 47 00:03:07.800 --> 00:03:12.000 nonsense out there, and I figured, you know what, I have spoken 48 00:03:12.000 --> 00:03:15.080 to you directly. I have been to the site with you. Let's talk 49 00:03:15.120 --> 00:03:19.439 about the piece of footage. Kelly, Welcome to Bigfoot and Beyond. Hi, 50 00:03:19.479 --> 00:03:22.599 thank you so much for having me. Oh, it is a pleasure. 51 00:03:22.639 --> 00:03:25.080 It is a pleasure. And again a big thank you for all the 52 00:03:25.120 --> 00:03:29.360 help you've been given me this past week. I'll give a little bit of 53 00:03:29.400 --> 00:03:34.599 background how this video came on my radar, and then we can go into 54 00:03:34.759 --> 00:03:38.960 what occurred as you took it. Okay, it's what a weird, twisted 55 00:03:39.000 --> 00:03:43.280 tale this has become too. Basically, the other day, I can remember 56 00:03:43.319 --> 00:03:46.039 what day, I can check my emails, but I got an email from 57 00:03:46.039 --> 00:03:47.919 a person this is hey Cliff, this is out there, and it was 58 00:03:47.960 --> 00:03:52.560 a screenshot from this person's phone. It was actually a video screenshot from this 59 00:03:52.560 --> 00:03:57.120 person's phone saying yeah, there's a new video and you should check it out. 60 00:03:57.479 --> 00:03:59.439 And I went, oh, well, okay, okay. I took 61 00:03:59.479 --> 00:04:01.240 a look at it and it's like, okay, yeah, maybe yeah, 62 00:04:01.240 --> 00:04:03.319 it's kind of at a distance, you don't really know that much about it. 63 00:04:03.360 --> 00:04:05.400 So I wrote the person back, I said, is this your video 64 00:04:05.560 --> 00:04:09.960 or you just telling me about it, and I pushed send, and then 65 00:04:10.000 --> 00:04:15.480 a moment later, another person emailed me about the same video, and so 66 00:04:15.560 --> 00:04:18.439 I said, well, all right, is this your video or are you 67 00:04:18.560 --> 00:04:21.399 just telling me about it? And it turns out that the second person was 68 00:04:21.560 --> 00:04:28.680 Kelly. Kelly is the videographer, and she emailed the video to me to 69 00:04:30.319 --> 00:04:32.920 look over or whatever, and then of course she said, oh, it's 70 00:04:32.920 --> 00:04:35.959 my video, and so I got her phone number and we arranged a time 71 00:04:36.040 --> 00:04:41.680 for a phone meeting. I have two pages of notes that were taken during 72 00:04:41.720 --> 00:04:45.959 that phone meeting that we'll get into today. And then I arranged the time 73 00:04:46.000 --> 00:04:47.240 to go out and visit with her, but we'll get to that in a 74 00:04:47.279 --> 00:04:53.439 minute. So that's how the footage crossed my desk. And by the way, 75 00:04:53.480 --> 00:04:56.240 the other person, the first person to share with me, apparently got 76 00:04:56.279 --> 00:04:59.639 it from the Facebook page where Kelly posted it. So that's how that came 77 00:04:59.680 --> 00:05:04.319 on. Kelly. Let's start, I guess with the day itself, like 78 00:05:04.360 --> 00:05:08.959 how the video came about, and then we'll go into where you posted it 79 00:05:09.319 --> 00:05:12.120 and the aftermath of all this sort of stuff in your thoughts. Okay, 80 00:05:12.439 --> 00:05:15.600 So let's start with the day of the video and just tell us what happened. 81 00:05:15.959 --> 00:05:19.959 Okay, So the day of the video was last Thursday, and my 82 00:05:20.040 --> 00:05:26.480 daughter and I were heading out to what is known as Harris Park to go 83 00:05:26.720 --> 00:05:30.240 hike around and walk up the river like we normally do. And so we 84 00:05:30.319 --> 00:05:33.680 were driving in getting ready to go to where we normally park, and a 85 00:05:33.680 --> 00:05:36.879 little bit before we got there, I noticed out of kind of like my 86 00:05:36.920 --> 00:05:42.720 peripheral vision that there was something black, very black, sticking out from the 87 00:05:42.759 --> 00:05:45.879 hillside. Okay, And just to be clear, when you say before we 88 00:05:45.920 --> 00:05:46.920 got there, you don't mean getting to the park, right, You mean 89 00:05:46.959 --> 00:05:50.639 getting to the place where you had to turn around, right. It was 90 00:05:50.800 --> 00:05:56.639 right before it was coming up the hill, the little hill there, right 91 00:05:56.639 --> 00:05:59.639 before you go to turn around your car. Okay, Okay, Just to 92 00:05:59.639 --> 00:06:02.720 set thee here, this is last Thursday, which was December seventh, twenty 93 00:06:02.759 --> 00:06:08.639 twenty three, and Harris Park is a park along the south fork of the 94 00:06:08.680 --> 00:06:13.040 Walla Walla River. It's kind of a big park only that is very very 95 00:06:13.079 --> 00:06:15.079 long. I think the whole park is probably a half mile or maybe three 96 00:06:15.160 --> 00:06:18.519 quarters of a mile long. I'm just eyeballing it, guessing having been there. 97 00:06:19.279 --> 00:06:25.519 And it's basically a road and facilities like you know, there's places where 98 00:06:25.519 --> 00:06:29.399 the grounds keeper keep their gear, there's a playground, there's a campground there, 99 00:06:30.439 --> 00:06:32.480 and then at the very end of the park would be the Walla Walla 100 00:06:32.560 --> 00:06:39.120 River trailhead that but unfortunately the road's been washed out, so there's a gate 101 00:06:39.399 --> 00:06:43.240 that prohibits people from driving that far, and that is right at the gate 102 00:06:43.279 --> 00:06:46.800 there. That's where the video is obtained. So when you say just before 103 00:06:46.800 --> 00:06:50.120 we got there, I think what you're talking about is the turnaround place before 104 00:06:50.120 --> 00:06:53.680 the gate. And if I'm incorrect, please correct me. That's why we're 105 00:06:53.680 --> 00:06:57.800 talking about it now. No, that's absolutely correct. Right before we get 106 00:06:57.800 --> 00:07:00.480 to the park where we would park, which would be right now side those 107 00:07:00.480 --> 00:07:02.959 two gates. Very good. So as you're approaching that area, you see 108 00:07:02.959 --> 00:07:08.600 what It just stuck out of my privial vision of like just a black figure 109 00:07:09.199 --> 00:07:12.399 and I just kind of looked up there and didn't think too much of it. 110 00:07:12.399 --> 00:07:16.120 It just kind of struck me as out of place. So then when 111 00:07:16.160 --> 00:07:19.480 you get to the top, you flip a U turn right next to those 112 00:07:19.519 --> 00:07:25.480 gates to turn around. And as I was mid U turn, I turned 113 00:07:25.519 --> 00:07:29.680 my car in and then now the car is like facing that mountain side in 114 00:07:29.879 --> 00:07:33.959 you know, half midu turn, and so I see it up on the 115 00:07:34.839 --> 00:07:39.199 mountain side. It was just big and black, and I was just kind 116 00:07:39.199 --> 00:07:42.680 of like what is that? And I'm thinking out loud, like what is 117 00:07:42.759 --> 00:07:45.959 that? And my ten year old daughter was next to me and she was 118 00:07:46.000 --> 00:07:47.720 like what's what? And so I was like, Oh, you don't see 119 00:07:47.720 --> 00:07:49.759 that, and she was like, no, what are you looking at? 120 00:07:49.800 --> 00:07:53.639 Because there's a whole bunch of trees that we have to look through as well 121 00:07:53.680 --> 00:07:58.160 to see that mountain side. And so I pulled out my phone and I 122 00:07:58.279 --> 00:08:01.959 zoomed it all the way in, and then somewhere in there I ended up 123 00:08:01.000 --> 00:08:05.560 hitting record, and so I zoomed all the way in so I could show 124 00:08:05.600 --> 00:08:09.759 my daughter where I was looking, and so you could kind of hear that 125 00:08:09.800 --> 00:08:11.199 in the video, like I'm like, look right here next to my thumb 126 00:08:11.240 --> 00:08:15.879 as I was pointing it on the phone screen so that way she can look 127 00:08:15.959 --> 00:08:18.680 and see. And then she did end up seeing it, and she was 128 00:08:18.759 --> 00:08:22.759 just what is that? And my first initial reaction was like, oh, 129 00:08:22.800 --> 00:08:26.839 that's just a human, which you would hear in the footage as well. 130 00:08:26.959 --> 00:08:30.120 Is I was like, oh, it's just a human. But it's weird. 131 00:08:30.160 --> 00:08:33.759 It's staring at us. And as it was my initial thought that it 132 00:08:33.879 --> 00:08:39.759 was a person, I didn't want to be creepy sitting in my car filming 133 00:08:39.759 --> 00:08:43.919 them on the mountain, so I you know, stopped filming and we go 134 00:08:45.080 --> 00:08:50.000 to finish parking the car, and we get out of the car to go 135 00:08:50.200 --> 00:08:54.000 ahead, you know, and walk down to the river. This is past 136 00:08:54.080 --> 00:08:56.639 the gate where the direction you were traveling, like the walking to the walking 137 00:08:58.159 --> 00:09:01.399 right right. We were going to go walking past that gate to head up 138 00:09:01.440 --> 00:09:05.480 to the where the river is back there. And so we get out of 139 00:09:05.519 --> 00:09:09.840 the car and I could still see the figure on the wall at the the 140 00:09:09.879 --> 00:09:11.600 mountain side. At the end of the clip, you could see it just 141 00:09:11.639 --> 00:09:16.120 standing perfectly still. So when we get out of the car, you know, 142 00:09:16.159 --> 00:09:18.519 I was waiting for my daughter to get out of her side and come 143 00:09:18.559 --> 00:09:22.879 with me. I could still see it standing there, but still perfectly still, 144 00:09:24.000 --> 00:09:28.279 like it just wasn't moving. So we just started heading over towards the 145 00:09:30.320 --> 00:09:33.840 towards the gates to go back towards the river. And it was it was 146 00:09:33.879 --> 00:09:37.200 a very short distance of walking there, you know, there wasn't very much 147 00:09:37.200 --> 00:09:41.879 for where you park to where those gates actually hit. And right about the 148 00:09:41.919 --> 00:09:46.399 time we reached the gates, I looked back up and it was completely gone. 149 00:09:46.559 --> 00:09:50.840 I could see absolutely nothing on that mountain side anymore. And I was 150 00:09:50.879 --> 00:09:52.639 like, oh, it's gone. And my daughter looked up as well and 151 00:09:52.679 --> 00:09:56.279 she was like, oh, I don't see it either. And so we 152 00:09:56.360 --> 00:10:00.679 stood there, you know, looking around, wait for a minute, just 153 00:10:00.720 --> 00:10:03.039 in case it kind of went behind something or you know, maybe there was 154 00:10:03.080 --> 00:10:05.919 a hill in the mountain we couldn't quite see that. It kind of dipped 155 00:10:07.000 --> 00:10:13.679 underneath and it just never reappeared. And then that's when I started feeling like 156 00:10:13.159 --> 00:10:20.320 the atmosphere around me. It was very thick feeling. It was as if 157 00:10:20.320 --> 00:10:26.120 you're being watched, like a heavy feeling of just being watched. And then 158 00:10:26.360 --> 00:10:31.039 it was also kind of like a foreboding, ominous type of feeling. And 159 00:10:31.120 --> 00:10:35.320 so we were still standing there and I was like, I think we should 160 00:10:35.320 --> 00:10:37.799 go. I don't you know, this feels very off. I feel like 161 00:10:37.840 --> 00:10:39.960 we're being watched. And my daughter's like, no, it's okay, come 162 00:10:41.000 --> 00:10:43.679 on, mom, we're right here. Let's just go to the river, 163 00:10:43.200 --> 00:10:46.240 because we weren't too far from it. So I was like, okay, 164 00:10:46.360 --> 00:10:50.840 you know, we walked just a couple extra steps and then I was like, 165 00:10:50.919 --> 00:10:54.480 no, this is feeling very off. We are definitely feeling or I'm 166 00:10:54.480 --> 00:10:58.039 feeling like we're being watched. So we're going to go ahead and go. 167 00:10:58.080 --> 00:11:03.639 And she just said okay, and we got in the car and drove off 168 00:11:03.679 --> 00:11:09.279 from there. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo. 169 00:11:09.480 --> 00:11:20.279 We'll be right back after these messages. Did you probably not, Probably didn't 170 00:11:20.279 --> 00:11:22.480 smell anything. Did you hear anything, or did you see anything else unusual? 171 00:11:24.440 --> 00:11:28.240 No? I didn't smell anything. It was starting to rain, and 172 00:11:28.519 --> 00:11:31.559 you know, it was quite a distance away from where we were, so 173 00:11:31.639 --> 00:11:35.679 there was no like unusual type smells or sounds, not that I remember of. 174 00:11:37.120 --> 00:11:41.240 At least, did your daughter hear or see anything? Yes, We 175 00:11:41.480 --> 00:11:46.240 drove down back towards the campgrounds that you initially passed when you first come in. 176 00:11:48.039 --> 00:11:50.759 There's like a little waterfall there that she wanted to get out and go 177 00:11:50.799 --> 00:11:54.600 see, and so we drove back down there. We got out, we'd 178 00:11:54.639 --> 00:11:58.960 go to see it, and I was talking to her and in the middle 179 00:12:00.159 --> 00:12:03.440 of my sentence to her, she stopped me and she goes, Mom, 180 00:12:03.879 --> 00:12:07.600 I don't want to freak you out. But I heard like a really or 181 00:12:07.840 --> 00:12:11.240 a manly scream, and I was like, you heard what? And she 182 00:12:11.320 --> 00:12:15.320 goes a manly scream and I said, well, where did you hear that? 183 00:12:16.000 --> 00:12:20.240 And she kind of pointed over towards the direction that we just were where 184 00:12:20.240 --> 00:12:22.960 we had saw it. Okay, so she heard something, she heard a 185 00:12:24.080 --> 00:12:28.840 noise coming from that area. Manly scream, that's how she described it. 186 00:12:28.000 --> 00:12:31.960 Yes, I love it. I have a couple of manly screams inside me 187 00:12:33.039 --> 00:12:35.879 sometimes too. So okay. So no other cars in the park or anything 188 00:12:37.039 --> 00:12:39.399 that you said. There was a cherokee that one was just coming down as 189 00:12:39.399 --> 00:12:43.279 we were coming up. We passed it. Oh, I see, I 190 00:12:43.279 --> 00:12:45.559 see. Oh so they were leaving the park as you were coming in, 191 00:12:46.039 --> 00:12:48.200 right, I see, I see. Okay. So, as far as 192 00:12:48.240 --> 00:12:50.360 you can tell that, there was really nobody else in the park. And 193 00:12:50.360 --> 00:12:52.919 there's a there's a there's a playground there. There were no there are no 194 00:12:54.000 --> 00:12:56.360 kids there, I guess because it's a Thursday to you know, kind of 195 00:12:56.360 --> 00:12:58.919 lousy weather and so nobody. You didn't see anybody else in the park at 196 00:12:58.960 --> 00:13:01.440 all. Nope, there was nobody near the campgrounds. The park, and 197 00:13:01.639 --> 00:13:07.559 to my understanding that day, the campgrounds have already been closed too. Yeah, 198 00:13:07.559 --> 00:13:09.759 okay, they were closed when I was there as well. Now you 199 00:13:09.840 --> 00:13:13.679 thought it was a person. We talked about that when I did the interview 200 00:13:13.679 --> 00:13:16.320 with you thought it was just a person up there? When did you When 201 00:13:16.320 --> 00:13:20.200 did it start dawning on you that maybe it wasn't a person. It was 202 00:13:22.000 --> 00:13:26.159 like right before I started recording. It was just the way that it was 203 00:13:26.240 --> 00:13:31.639 moving, how black it was. It was just like a feeling that I 204 00:13:31.639 --> 00:13:35.240 don't know how to describe it, but just kind of like a what is 205 00:13:35.320 --> 00:13:41.039 that? Like? You know, when there's like a person standing on there's 206 00:13:41.080 --> 00:13:46.080 a person, you can you could distinguish their features, you can more or 207 00:13:46.159 --> 00:13:52.080 less see like their clothing or something. This one was just in the far 208 00:13:52.200 --> 00:13:56.639 distance, but it was just black, like head to toe. You couldn't 209 00:13:56.639 --> 00:14:01.320 distinguish any type of like if there was pants were anything. With the way 210 00:14:01.360 --> 00:14:05.480 that it was moving, and it just kind of started making me second guess 211 00:14:05.519 --> 00:14:07.639 myself, like what am I looking at? Like what is it doing? 212 00:14:07.679 --> 00:14:13.159 Because I couldn't it was moving, and so with the movements, that's why 213 00:14:13.159 --> 00:14:16.960 I was like, what is it doing? And then you know, that's 214 00:14:16.000 --> 00:14:20.639 when we Also I had the conversation with my daughter because she couldn't see it, 215 00:14:20.679 --> 00:14:22.240 and then we pulled out the phone. What did your daughter think about 216 00:14:22.240 --> 00:14:26.720 this whole thing? Did she have anything to say about all this? At 217 00:14:26.759 --> 00:14:28.360 the time, she thought it was just kind of weird, you know. 218 00:14:28.600 --> 00:14:33.240 She was just like, what are they doing? What is that? And 219 00:14:33.279 --> 00:14:37.600 then when we got out of the car to you know, walk up to 220 00:14:37.840 --> 00:14:46.399 the trailheads and I had like that over overcoming, overwhelming sensation. She didn't 221 00:14:46.440 --> 00:14:52.320 feel anything at that time, and so to her it was just like, 222 00:14:52.360 --> 00:14:54.960 oh, come on, mom, let's just go. But now looking back 223 00:14:56.039 --> 00:15:00.960 and like looking at the video and like seeing it zoomed in and and learning 224 00:15:01.000 --> 00:15:07.279 a bit more about everything, she's starting to be like, yeah, mom, 225 00:15:07.360 --> 00:15:11.080 I think we really did see one. Okay, So when you got 226 00:15:11.080 --> 00:15:13.960 home that day, how did you what did you do with the video? 227 00:15:15.120 --> 00:15:16.399 Because it eventually came to me, of course, and a lot of things 228 00:15:16.440 --> 00:15:20.679 have happened since then, But what were some of the first things you did 229 00:15:20.759 --> 00:15:24.519 or thought with the video as you proceeded throughout your day? Right, So 230 00:15:24.639 --> 00:15:26.919 we get home and of course I'm going through the pictures that we took that 231 00:15:28.000 --> 00:15:31.360 day, and I came across to where the video was and I was like, 232 00:15:31.360 --> 00:15:33.720 oh yeah, let me, let me look at this video. So 233 00:15:35.159 --> 00:15:39.000 I pressed play just to watch it, and I was like, that is 234 00:15:39.480 --> 00:15:43.200 kind of weird. So I zoomed in on it and I pressed play again, 235 00:15:43.240 --> 00:15:45.399 and I was getting as close as I could, because you know, 236 00:15:45.440 --> 00:15:48.840 the closer you get, the more pixelated it looks. Yeah. And then 237 00:15:48.879 --> 00:15:50.480 for the record, by the way, you have an iPhone fifteen. That's 238 00:15:50.480 --> 00:15:54.320 correct, Yes, I do, okay, I just want to make sure 239 00:15:54.320 --> 00:15:58.200 to put that out there for people. Oh yeah. And so I the 240 00:15:58.320 --> 00:16:02.559 video itself was already zoomed in, but on the screen, I zoomed it 241 00:16:02.600 --> 00:16:07.120 in even more as it was playing, and that's when I realized, like, 242 00:16:07.200 --> 00:16:11.080 this does not look like a human to me whatsoever. Just as you 243 00:16:11.120 --> 00:16:15.519 see in the video, the movements are a little bit weird to me. 244 00:16:15.799 --> 00:16:19.519 It felt like it looked like it had like longer arms and it was just 245 00:16:19.600 --> 00:16:25.919 black from head to toe. So I saw the video and I was like, 246 00:16:26.360 --> 00:16:29.279 what is this? And I kind of pieced it together to where it 247 00:16:29.320 --> 00:16:36.840 shows like the original video and then like screen recorded with the video zoomed in 248 00:16:36.960 --> 00:16:40.919 more so you know, people could see the regular one and then right after 249 00:16:40.960 --> 00:16:42.799 that it would play the zoomed in one. I was like, let me, 250 00:16:44.039 --> 00:16:47.039 I'm going to post this and see like what other people think. So 251 00:16:47.480 --> 00:16:53.240 I'm in Walla Walla group here and I posted there, and I believe that's 252 00:16:53.279 --> 00:16:57.960 the only place I posted, and no, I'm sorry. I posted in 253 00:16:59.000 --> 00:17:00.440 a few groups. There was the Walla Walla group, and then I went 254 00:17:00.480 --> 00:17:06.319 and I found some bigfoot groups just to kind of get their opinions because I'm 255 00:17:06.359 --> 00:17:08.640 not very knowledgeable in this area. So I was like, well, let 256 00:17:08.680 --> 00:17:12.279 me, you know, be you know, join these groups and post in 257 00:17:12.319 --> 00:17:18.599 there and get like their their opinions of everything. Because that was once I 258 00:17:18.640 --> 00:17:22.880 saw that video and it started clicking with me, the word bigfoot just comes 259 00:17:22.920 --> 00:17:26.279 to mind. So that's where it kind of gives me like the inkling to 260 00:17:26.319 --> 00:17:32.720 go to like bigfoot pages and post there to see and yeah, it went 261 00:17:33.720 --> 00:17:37.640 a little bit more crazy than I thought it was going to go. Well 262 00:17:37.839 --> 00:17:40.279 that's something that can be said about the community. I mean, people think 263 00:17:40.319 --> 00:17:41.960 we're crazy, but we're actually a little bit more crazy than they think. 264 00:17:45.039 --> 00:17:47.759 Yes, now you mentioned the Walla Walla group. We're not going to mention 265 00:17:47.799 --> 00:17:49.839 anybody else's name in there because I think you got more or less treated well 266 00:17:49.839 --> 00:17:52.279 by the Walla Walla group, But I know some other groups did not treat 267 00:17:52.319 --> 00:17:56.519 you well. Some other individual sites did not treat you well as well. 268 00:17:56.559 --> 00:17:59.839 So we're not going to talk about them or put them out or anything like 269 00:17:59.839 --> 00:18:03.240 that. That's not what this podcast is about. But we will give kudos 270 00:18:03.240 --> 00:18:04.839 to the Walla Walla group for being kind listeners, I guess. And I 271 00:18:04.839 --> 00:18:11.039 think that's also where the person who initially pointed the video out to me got 272 00:18:11.119 --> 00:18:15.039 it from. I think that that person is also on that Facebook group. 273 00:18:15.519 --> 00:18:19.000 So so what were some of the comments that came out about the video initially, 274 00:18:19.079 --> 00:18:22.880 like good or bad or ugly or anything like that? What kind of 275 00:18:22.880 --> 00:18:26.359 things were they saying? Right, Well, the Wallawaller group was actually very 276 00:18:26.359 --> 00:18:33.480 helpful. That is where the gentleman who sent you that video beforehand, he's 277 00:18:33.519 --> 00:18:37.559 the one who gave me your name and the email that I originally sent it 278 00:18:37.599 --> 00:18:41.039 in. He's like, send this in, let's see what he thinks. 279 00:18:41.640 --> 00:18:44.559 There's some more people, you know, trying to give I think I got 280 00:18:44.599 --> 00:18:48.680 your name a few times with emails and everything to send to you, and 281 00:18:48.720 --> 00:18:52.440 then a lot of them were just like this is you know, this is 282 00:18:52.519 --> 00:18:57.240 great footage, good catch, and so they were just already on the lines 283 00:18:57.319 --> 00:19:00.799 like this is absolutely a big foot. Okay, So you got some really 284 00:19:02.799 --> 00:19:07.799 encouraging remarks and good excellent because you could go either way with the bigfoot community, 285 00:19:07.799 --> 00:19:11.000 you know, right. Yeah. And of course, when when I 286 00:19:11.000 --> 00:19:12.400 first saw the video, I say, oh, this is interesting. I 287 00:19:12.440 --> 00:19:15.000 mean, and you know, I mean even to this day, I don't 288 00:19:15.000 --> 00:19:18.640 know if it's a person. I don't know if it's a bigfoot. But 289 00:19:18.680 --> 00:19:21.680 we'll get into my investigation in a minute. But I will say, as 290 00:19:21.720 --> 00:19:23.480 a you know, just to kind of put this out there right now, 291 00:19:23.519 --> 00:19:29.000 that I see no reason at all that this could not be a sasquatch, 292 00:19:29.440 --> 00:19:33.880 you know, no reason at all some of the some of the comments that 293 00:19:33.160 --> 00:19:37.799 I saw. Mind you, I'm in a lucky position right now, where 294 00:19:37.799 --> 00:19:40.880 like Facebook isn't even installed on my phone, Like I don't I use it 295 00:19:40.920 --> 00:19:44.160 so little, It's not even onto my phone right now. So I'm blessed 296 00:19:44.200 --> 00:19:48.119 to be ignorance of all the nonsense that goes out there. But other people 297 00:19:48.680 --> 00:19:51.839 who I had spoken to says, oh, it moves clumsily, and I 298 00:19:51.880 --> 00:19:53.480 don't think that's the case at all. I think that takes really really big 299 00:19:53.519 --> 00:19:56.440 steps as it walks up the hill. I don't think it's falling or anything 300 00:19:56.559 --> 00:20:00.720 like that. And there's a lot of things about it that people were saying, 301 00:20:00.759 --> 00:20:03.160 Oh, well, what's that in its hand? And you know, 302 00:20:03.200 --> 00:20:07.119 maybe there is something in its hand and it's left hand specifically. It does 303 00:20:07.279 --> 00:20:10.000 kind of look like that to me, but I can't make out what that 304 00:20:10.039 --> 00:20:12.759 thing is. But then again, I also know from having been to the 305 00:20:12.759 --> 00:20:15.759 scene that we probably should just get into that before I talk about it too 306 00:20:15.799 --> 00:20:21.759 much. That there was a lot of brush in the foreground of the video 307 00:20:21.960 --> 00:20:25.279 that you just can't see because you did your best to focus on the figure 308 00:20:25.319 --> 00:20:30.559 itself, and therefore the stuff in the foreground turns out to be noise in 309 00:20:30.599 --> 00:20:34.200 the video a lot of times. So okay, So anyway, let's to 310 00:20:34.279 --> 00:20:37.599 get into the investigation part of things, and we can talk about the footage 311 00:20:37.640 --> 00:20:42.640 little bit more afterwards. So you eventually reach out to me, and then 312 00:20:42.759 --> 00:20:45.519 I write to you and say, Hey, is this your footage? And 313 00:20:45.559 --> 00:20:49.799 you say yes. We do that interview the next morning. I guess because 314 00:20:49.799 --> 00:20:52.720 you had the day off that day. I didn't want to bother you at 315 00:20:52.759 --> 00:20:55.480 work, of course, and then the more I hear about this video, 316 00:20:55.519 --> 00:20:57.799 it's like, yeah, you know, everything's kind of making sense. Everything's 317 00:20:57.839 --> 00:21:00.960 kind of making sense. And you know, we have a piece of footage 318 00:21:00.960 --> 00:21:04.640 here in the North American Bigfoot Center called the Roseberg Footage that is of similar 319 00:21:04.759 --> 00:21:08.960 quality. And actually it's from a similar distance too, I might add, 320 00:21:10.000 --> 00:21:12.119 which is really interesting. And so I thinking, you know, this reminds 321 00:21:12.119 --> 00:21:15.960 me of the Roseberg footage. That's really interesting. And I know from my 322 00:21:17.200 --> 00:21:21.480 first hand investigation of the Roseburg footage that about that distance you should be able 323 00:21:21.480 --> 00:21:23.799 to see clothing. And that's something that you told me right away. It's 324 00:21:23.799 --> 00:21:26.119 like, no, I didn't see any clothing. It was black from head 325 00:21:26.160 --> 00:21:30.200 to toe, and that when I went out to the site. And I'll 326 00:21:30.200 --> 00:21:34.240 get to this in a minute, but I asked your daughter, who's the 327 00:21:34.279 --> 00:21:40.079 other witness of course, to this, was the figure on the hill wearing 328 00:21:40.160 --> 00:21:42.839 clothes? And she said no, straight out, no, who was not 329 00:21:42.880 --> 00:21:47.079 wearing clothes. I think that you'd be able to see clothing. I really 330 00:21:47.160 --> 00:21:49.200 do think you'd be able to see clothing at that distance. Okay, so 331 00:21:49.240 --> 00:21:53.480 we do our interview, and then you were kind enough to meet me out 332 00:21:53.519 --> 00:21:57.400 there at the scene on this past Monday. I don't know what day. 333 00:21:57.480 --> 00:22:00.400 Monday was, probably like the eleventh or something like that. I'll take a 334 00:22:00.400 --> 00:22:04.079 look at that really fast to So, yeah, the eleventh. So I 335 00:22:04.119 --> 00:22:11.079 woke up at five am. I drove five hundred and nine miles that one 336 00:22:11.160 --> 00:22:15.640 day. I went and picked up my colleague Keith, and we drove out 337 00:22:15.640 --> 00:22:18.079 there. We got there about nine thirty. You were kind enough to meet 338 00:22:18.119 --> 00:22:23.480 us out there, So what are your thoughts on the investigative process? That's 339 00:22:23.519 --> 00:22:27.319 because that's something that I don't think much of because you know, I'm neck 340 00:22:27.400 --> 00:22:30.519 deep in bigfoot stuff all the time, but you're kind of an outsider in 341 00:22:30.559 --> 00:22:33.480 some ways. This is probably your first dip into the pool. So what 342 00:22:33.519 --> 00:22:37.720 are your thoughts on the investigative process that you saw unfolding that day? Ah? 343 00:22:37.839 --> 00:22:42.160 Yes, I am absolutely new to all of this, so it was 344 00:22:42.279 --> 00:22:48.839 very interesting and intriguing to me. I was a little frustrated because the fog 345 00:22:48.880 --> 00:22:52.200 that day was just so thick, and I was really looking forward to us 346 00:22:52.279 --> 00:22:56.000 getting like the comparison shots and to being able to zoom in and kind of 347 00:22:56.039 --> 00:23:02.200 recreate, you know, the way that it looked in the video with you 348 00:23:02.200 --> 00:23:07.039 know, a human versus whatever it was that I had originally filmed, so 349 00:23:07.119 --> 00:23:11.759 we could you know, piece that together and really take a look into that. 350 00:23:12.400 --> 00:23:18.279 But the investigation process of it was awesome. You guys were such good 351 00:23:18.359 --> 00:23:22.359 troopers to you know, hike that mount and you guys had to go through 352 00:23:22.519 --> 00:23:25.799 a little bit of that river just to get through, and it was cold, 353 00:23:26.079 --> 00:23:30.359 and I'm just so appreciative of you guys for doing all of that and 354 00:23:30.440 --> 00:23:33.640 to travel the whole way that you did, you know, And it's my 355 00:23:33.680 --> 00:23:37.000 opinion that every lead should be followed, every lead should be followed. There's 356 00:23:37.000 --> 00:23:41.160 been several times in my big footing career that everybody else was telling me, 357 00:23:41.279 --> 00:23:45.759 now, don't worry about that, there's nothing to see there that's fake or 358 00:23:45.759 --> 00:23:48.440 that person blah blah blah, this and that, and I find that, 359 00:23:48.519 --> 00:23:52.920 generally speaking, very often these people are incorrect incorrect about that stuff. I 360 00:23:52.960 --> 00:23:57.599 was told to completely ignore the Bossburg incident, for example, for our listeners, 361 00:23:59.160 --> 00:24:02.559 don't worry about that, there's nothing there, and I completely found that 362 00:24:02.559 --> 00:24:04.839 that was inaccurate. That was inaccurate. That was just you know, sour 363 00:24:04.920 --> 00:24:10.400 grapes from one investigator to the whole situation. I remember I'm finding Bigfoot. 364 00:24:10.480 --> 00:24:12.720 There was a photograph that was taken in Vermont. I think it was during 365 00:24:12.720 --> 00:24:17.480 our White Hall, New York episode that was brought to our town hall meeting. 366 00:24:17.559 --> 00:24:21.880 This young gentleman named Ian got this video or got this photograph rather, 367 00:24:22.319 --> 00:24:25.880 and Matt and Bobo and Renee were all kind of just saying, no, 368 00:24:26.000 --> 00:24:27.279 that's fake, don't worry about that. But when I went out there, 369 00:24:27.279 --> 00:24:30.160 I said, well, if it's fake, the guy's seven feet tall. 370 00:24:30.599 --> 00:24:34.119 So again, every lead should be followed, so even and you know what, 371 00:24:34.200 --> 00:24:37.000 if this was in Virginia, I wouldn't have flown out there. But 372 00:24:37.119 --> 00:24:41.920 this was an organ you know, And I see this as my responsibility. 373 00:24:41.440 --> 00:24:45.160 I'm in a very blessed position where Bigfoot is my is my life, you 374 00:24:45.200 --> 00:24:48.000 know, it's my existence, It's it's the way I make make a living 375 00:24:48.039 --> 00:24:52.039 with the museum, et cetera. And this is my obligation to the subject 376 00:24:52.119 --> 00:24:56.680 to follow up on every scenario that I can like this. And you know 377 00:24:56.720 --> 00:25:02.599 what, it was cold, it sucked. It was cold and wet all 378 00:25:02.680 --> 00:25:07.160 day long, and it was a really interesting investigation. And unfortunately, as 379 00:25:07.240 --> 00:25:11.519 Kelly mentioned, we could not get the comparison shot because we couldn't see the 380 00:25:11.599 --> 00:25:17.119 other side of the valley unfortunately. And I had everything lined up, you 381 00:25:17.160 --> 00:25:21.799 know, I all those all the branches in the trees. They kind of 382 00:25:21.799 --> 00:25:25.000 act like gun sights in a way, like when this crosses this and you 383 00:25:25.000 --> 00:25:29.400 know you're in the right area. I found pretty much exactly within like an 384 00:25:29.440 --> 00:25:32.559 inch or two of where the camera needed to be to get the same shot, 385 00:25:33.240 --> 00:25:37.880 and the fog never lifted. It was so aggravating. Stay tuned for 386 00:25:38.000 --> 00:25:42.480 more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo will be right back after these messages. 387 00:25:48.720 --> 00:25:52.319 Early in the day, when the fog did lift just enough to see 388 00:25:52.359 --> 00:25:56.920 across. Even in that foggy condition, I could see that Keith, my 389 00:25:57.000 --> 00:26:00.839 partner there, was wearing clothing. I could see his face, I could 390 00:26:00.880 --> 00:26:03.920 see his hands. I could see that his pants were a different color than 391 00:26:03.920 --> 00:26:10.119 his jacket. I could see all those things quite easily. But yet you're 392 00:26:10.160 --> 00:26:11.759 telling me, and your daughter told me, I believe that the thing was 393 00:26:11.799 --> 00:26:15.680 one color. Had the toe absolutely now see. And I did get a 394 00:26:15.759 --> 00:26:19.400 chance to see Keith across on the mountain side just a little bit before he 395 00:26:19.400 --> 00:26:26.319 had it up, and I could clearly see him, like his head, 396 00:26:26.400 --> 00:26:29.839 I could see his arms, his jacket, I could make his pants out. 397 00:26:30.720 --> 00:26:33.839 It looked, you know, just like a clothed human. And another 398 00:26:33.880 --> 00:26:37.880 thing that stuck out to me is he had a black coat on. But 399 00:26:37.000 --> 00:26:41.839 the black coat that he was wearing, you know, pure black. It 400 00:26:41.880 --> 00:26:45.839 felt like it it kind of like blended in just a little bit with like 401 00:26:45.039 --> 00:26:49.960 the backside of it. It didn't like pop out like the figure did in 402 00:26:51.200 --> 00:26:56.200 my footage. The black was so prominent in eye catching, and then with 403 00:26:56.359 --> 00:27:00.000 Keith up there with his black on, it just wasn't the same. Interesting, 404 00:27:00.240 --> 00:27:03.119 Now, with one of the things you mentioned to me, and I'd 405 00:27:03.160 --> 00:27:07.519 like you to speak to if you could, are the proportions of the figure. 406 00:27:07.640 --> 00:27:12.319 Okay, Now again I'm not convinced it's a sasquatch, but I'm not 407 00:27:12.480 --> 00:27:15.680 certainly not convinced it's a human either. I lean a little bit more heavily 408 00:27:15.720 --> 00:27:19.559 towards the sasquatch side of this argument, honestly, especially after having been there. 409 00:27:21.759 --> 00:27:25.799 But what were the differences in your mind, in your eye because you 410 00:27:25.839 --> 00:27:29.599 got to see the thing in person, and that's a huge difference. Cameras 411 00:27:29.599 --> 00:27:33.839 are only so good and they're great nowadays, but they're not nearly as good 412 00:27:33.079 --> 00:27:37.839 as what you can see with your naked eye. I know you briefly mentioned 413 00:27:37.839 --> 00:27:40.559 some things earlier, but can you really go deep into the things that you 414 00:27:40.640 --> 00:27:44.119 saw with your naked eye about the shape of the figure, maybe the proportions, 415 00:27:44.319 --> 00:27:45.960 the way it moved, any of that sort of stuff to give us 416 00:27:47.000 --> 00:27:52.599 the best painting you can with words of what you personally observed with your eye 417 00:27:52.680 --> 00:27:56.440 outside of the video. Right. Yeah, Like I had previously mentioned, 418 00:27:56.480 --> 00:28:00.319 it was completely black, just like head to toe. Couldn't really make out 419 00:28:00.799 --> 00:28:06.000 clothing typestyle, you know, it was just pure black. The arms seemed 420 00:28:06.240 --> 00:28:10.039 very long. That was one of the things that I had noticed, because 421 00:28:10.079 --> 00:28:15.920 before I started recording it, it was moving and I could see the arms 422 00:28:15.319 --> 00:28:19.319 and they just they felt long, like almost to like your knees, if 423 00:28:19.319 --> 00:28:25.880 you will, And they swayed like as you can also see in the video 424 00:28:25.920 --> 00:28:29.960 when they turn, they kind of have like a sway motion, and so 425 00:28:30.039 --> 00:28:33.240 that stuck out to me as well. But yeah, so I also had 426 00:28:33.279 --> 00:28:38.039 noticed, like with the long arms, the word that came to my mind 427 00:28:38.160 --> 00:28:42.440 was more beastly. It was more beastly than it was human, and meaning 428 00:28:42.720 --> 00:28:48.160 like the chest portions, like where the shoulder, like between the shoulders was 429 00:28:48.200 --> 00:28:53.480 just super wide. I remember that one just being very wide and again beastly 430 00:28:53.559 --> 00:28:59.960 looking. The head did seem a bit smaller. It was harder to see 431 00:29:00.240 --> 00:29:03.119 compared to like the body. The body to me just felt like it was 432 00:29:04.119 --> 00:29:07.960 massive, and looking back or when I was thinking about it, I'm like, 433 00:29:08.000 --> 00:29:12.160 it had to have been very huge for it to stick out the way 434 00:29:12.160 --> 00:29:15.640 that it was sticking out to me that day to see it at you know, 435 00:29:15.720 --> 00:29:22.880 the distance that it actually was. So the body was just beastly, 436 00:29:22.720 --> 00:29:30.440 very wide. The leg portions didn't seem as long as like the body portions 437 00:29:30.480 --> 00:29:36.960 did, like like the upper torso part seemed longer than what the leg length 438 00:29:37.039 --> 00:29:40.119 would have been as well. Now, what about the way it moved, 439 00:29:40.160 --> 00:29:44.319 because we only get to see a few seconds of it moving and it's kind 440 00:29:44.359 --> 00:29:47.759 of moving its way uphill and by the way having been like again, we 441 00:29:47.759 --> 00:29:51.799 couldn't find the exact spot it was, so we didn't find footprints. And 442 00:29:51.799 --> 00:29:55.039 you know what, it had rained too, right since that Thursday, between 443 00:29:55.079 --> 00:29:56.920 Thursday and Monday when I got there, right, it was raining a lot, 444 00:29:57.000 --> 00:30:02.240 and at one point it did snow oh gee, yeah, So any 445 00:30:02.240 --> 00:30:06.720 footprints that were there were probably kind of washed out because that hillside. I 446 00:30:06.759 --> 00:30:08.119 know that, you know you took pictures of the ground there saying that the 447 00:30:08.160 --> 00:30:11.519 ground's too hard for footprints, But that hillside was made out of different stuff 448 00:30:11.559 --> 00:30:15.400 that there were amp There were ample opportunities for footprints up on the hill. 449 00:30:15.839 --> 00:30:18.759 But again if it was raining and even some snow, then they would have 450 00:30:18.799 --> 00:30:23.759 been washed out. Although Keith did find two large impressions next to each other 451 00:30:23.799 --> 00:30:29.319 that seemed to be about the right shape and size. We can I can 452 00:30:29.359 --> 00:30:30.960 certainly put those out for our members. Remind me, Matt, and I'll 453 00:30:30.960 --> 00:30:34.720 send you those the pictures to put out, not saying that they're footprints, 454 00:30:34.759 --> 00:30:38.480 but I can't say that they're not. There's their space. Appropriately. They 455 00:30:38.640 --> 00:30:41.680 had the right shape, the right size, especially on this that slope, 456 00:30:41.680 --> 00:30:45.880 because that slope, I'll tell you is no joke. Having been up there, 457 00:30:45.920 --> 00:30:49.079 it is a different world up on top of that hill from where this 458 00:30:49.079 --> 00:30:52.400 thing was walking. Now, I couldn't find the exact spot within like two 459 00:30:52.680 --> 00:30:56.720 or ten feet or something like that, but I was up there, and 460 00:30:56.720 --> 00:31:00.079 then Keith went up there after me, because I better picture on my phone 461 00:31:00.079 --> 00:31:03.960 I could place him better had I been able to see him. But Keith 462 00:31:04.000 --> 00:31:07.880 got much closer to the location than I did. I think I was about 463 00:31:08.079 --> 00:31:12.519 fifty yards away from where it was eventually ended up being, and that that's 464 00:31:12.559 --> 00:31:17.319 based on me being up there figuring where the hell could this have been, 465 00:31:17.359 --> 00:31:19.599 you know, and then going down later and seeing where I was based on 466 00:31:19.640 --> 00:31:23.640 the landmarks I could see compared to where it should have been, you know, 467 00:31:25.319 --> 00:31:29.119 framed in the trees there, because again I found exactly pretty much where 468 00:31:29.160 --> 00:31:33.319 the camera needed to be to place the person correctly had we been able to 469 00:31:33.359 --> 00:31:36.880 see them at the place. So I think I was probably about fifty yards 470 00:31:36.920 --> 00:31:38.880 away, but Keith, I think was quite close. I think he was 471 00:31:40.640 --> 00:31:42.680 much closer than that, probably twenty five yards or more or something like that, 472 00:31:44.119 --> 00:31:47.240 which is maybe why he found those impressions. I don't know. But 473 00:31:47.359 --> 00:31:49.640 it is no joke up there. It is very steep. It's it's a 474 00:31:49.799 --> 00:31:53.119 legit forty five degree angle for most of it, and some of it is 475 00:31:53.119 --> 00:31:56.680 steeper and some of it is less steep, but it's like legit fifty percent 476 00:31:56.720 --> 00:32:02.079 slope a forty five degree angle, and it's muddy, not super deep mud, 477 00:32:02.079 --> 00:32:05.200 but it's plenty of mud that you can slip on, and the rocks 478 00:32:05.279 --> 00:32:07.720 up there are quite slippery as well because they're very very wet and moss covered, 479 00:32:08.960 --> 00:32:13.119 Which is why I go back to, I don't feel that the subject 480 00:32:13.240 --> 00:32:16.119 was moving in a clumsy manner. I think that it was just navigating a 481 00:32:16.279 --> 00:32:21.240 very tricky hillside. Now, Kelly, you got to see this thing move 482 00:32:21.279 --> 00:32:23.160 a lot more than any of us did, because we only have what's in 483 00:32:23.160 --> 00:32:28.599 the video. How did it move maybe compared to the way human moves, 484 00:32:29.000 --> 00:32:30.519 or how did it move in general, and I even compared to anything, 485 00:32:30.559 --> 00:32:36.440 how did it move? What I saw before started filming is almost about the 486 00:32:36.480 --> 00:32:42.160 same thing. The drides of it were very long. That is one thing 487 00:32:42.200 --> 00:32:45.279 that did catch my attention when it goes to like take a step like I 488 00:32:45.319 --> 00:32:49.000 don't know if you could see it in the video, but what I could 489 00:32:49.039 --> 00:32:55.480 see personally, the step up that it took was actually quite huge. So 490 00:32:55.519 --> 00:33:00.200 that was another thing that you know, stuck out of weirdly moving because as 491 00:33:00.599 --> 00:33:01.640 to me, humans, you know, you don't take that big of a 492 00:33:01.680 --> 00:33:07.079 stride, even when we're hiking or climbing, and so it was kind of 493 00:33:07.119 --> 00:33:10.960 just doing what was already in the video, it would it was down just 494 00:33:12.000 --> 00:33:15.400 a little bit further before I started recording it. It took its step up, 495 00:33:15.880 --> 00:33:20.240 but then it would freeze in between, like it would move and then 496 00:33:20.279 --> 00:33:22.880 it would freeze. And when I say freeze, like it just stops and 497 00:33:22.920 --> 00:33:28.759 it kind of you can slowly see it just straighten itself to where it's like 498 00:33:28.920 --> 00:33:31.759 completely straight, and it sits like that for a minute, and then it'll 499 00:33:31.759 --> 00:33:36.720 go again and kind of, you know, take another step up because it's 500 00:33:36.759 --> 00:33:38.839 in the video, and before that looked like it's like climbing the mountain, 501 00:33:38.880 --> 00:33:43.400 like it's trying to make its way out of there. Could you tell if 502 00:33:43.400 --> 00:33:45.920 it ever turned and faced you or was it always just cruising away from you? 503 00:33:46.519 --> 00:33:51.359 So when I said it was just looking at us, in the footage, 504 00:33:51.400 --> 00:33:52.440 you can hear me say, like, it's just looking at us, 505 00:33:52.440 --> 00:34:00.440 like it's weird. I could see like the body stayed, but it's almost 506 00:34:00.680 --> 00:34:06.319 like the shoulders and like the head like turned and went like towards me. 507 00:34:06.480 --> 00:34:08.920 And when it did that, it was just like an immediate feeling like I 508 00:34:08.960 --> 00:34:14.880 know it's looking at me. And then again during that footage, I thought 509 00:34:14.920 --> 00:34:16.760 it was a person, but I had that sensation that they were, you 510 00:34:16.760 --> 00:34:20.280 know, looking at me. So I didn't want to be, you know, 511 00:34:20.880 --> 00:34:25.000 weird filming them, so I just stopped filming. But I did feel 512 00:34:25.000 --> 00:34:29.360 like it would the upper half would like turn and it would look at me 513 00:34:29.480 --> 00:34:31.880 like I knew it knew that I was there. When it did that, 514 00:34:31.920 --> 00:34:37.960 you specifically mentioned it turned its shoulders and head towards you. Yes, Now 515 00:34:38.440 --> 00:34:40.800 in the video it kind of looks like something was in its hand. Did 516 00:34:40.800 --> 00:34:45.760 you notice carrying anything? No, So that's the thing that I was trying 517 00:34:45.760 --> 00:34:51.719 to figure out as well, because looking with you know, when I was 518 00:34:51.760 --> 00:34:55.119 looking at it, it did not look as if it was holding anything whatsoever. 519 00:34:55.920 --> 00:35:00.480 So then when I was breaking down the footage a little bit more, 520 00:35:00.519 --> 00:35:04.079 I noticed, like when it climbs up and it kind of turns, it 521 00:35:04.119 --> 00:35:07.159 does look like there's something being held in the left hand side. And so 522 00:35:07.639 --> 00:35:14.239 I'm breaking down the video more and more because looking at it, you know, 523 00:35:14.360 --> 00:35:17.440 like with the naked eye there, it wasn't holding anything. And so 524 00:35:19.199 --> 00:35:22.960 breaking down the video I got it to where like right before it climbs up, 525 00:35:22.000 --> 00:35:25.400 you can see both of its arms and there's nothing there. The next 526 00:35:25.400 --> 00:35:30.960 step is like the next frame over is you know when it kind of turns 527 00:35:30.280 --> 00:35:36.400 and then you can see like that weird almost like round shape coming from the 528 00:35:36.519 --> 00:35:40.960 left hand side. I have no idea what that could have been or you 529 00:35:42.000 --> 00:35:45.000 know what could have made that type of shape. Yeah, it's interesting. 530 00:35:45.199 --> 00:35:47.760 So it almost like a like there's an extension of the hand it's holding something 531 00:35:47.800 --> 00:35:51.000 that's holding. But at the same time, I don't see it in every 532 00:35:51.039 --> 00:35:54.559 frame. It makes me wonder if that's just some sort of pixelated noise, 533 00:35:55.440 --> 00:36:00.360 or if that's some sort of artifact perhaps in the foreground, because getting to 534 00:36:00.400 --> 00:36:07.159 the scene and locating the trees and specifically that little window, that rectangular window 535 00:36:07.440 --> 00:36:12.000 that you captured the figure through between all the branches, was pretty difficult. 536 00:36:12.039 --> 00:36:15.039 And the reason it was difficult is because in your footage you did a good 537 00:36:15.119 --> 00:36:20.440 job focusing pretty much on the animal or the figure at least it washes out 538 00:36:20.480 --> 00:36:24.760 to all the four ground branches and noise. There were quite a few smaller 539 00:36:24.880 --> 00:36:30.159 branches in between you and the figure that just you don't see very well in 540 00:36:30.239 --> 00:36:35.360 the footage because it's focused at such a distance. And I'm wondering if maybe 541 00:36:35.400 --> 00:36:40.440 some of the abnormalities, some of the noise that we see on the figure 542 00:36:40.920 --> 00:36:49.119 is just an artifact from these fore ground obstructions. But I don't know that. 543 00:36:49.239 --> 00:36:52.119 Unfortunately, there's a lot I don't know about this video. This was 544 00:36:52.119 --> 00:36:55.280 taken at Harris Park, of course, and even though I couldn't find we 545 00:36:55.280 --> 00:37:00.119 couldn't place somebody in the exact position because of the fog. I do I 546 00:37:00.159 --> 00:37:01.800 know generally where it is. You can see in the upper left hand corner 547 00:37:01.800 --> 00:37:06.719 there's a kind of a bushy shaped tree. That tree is actually rather large, 548 00:37:06.719 --> 00:37:08.039 just at least twenty feet tall, by the way, but it's to 549 00:37:08.079 --> 00:37:14.400 the left of the figure. There's another darker patch that's a rose patch. 550 00:37:14.400 --> 00:37:16.440 There's a bunch of wild roses out there with a lot of rose hips on 551 00:37:16.480 --> 00:37:19.719 them, I might add that's one of the things I noticed while I was 552 00:37:19.760 --> 00:37:22.760 walking around. Rose Hips are a food item, and they are rich in 553 00:37:22.800 --> 00:37:27.480 vitamin C, and they are there, and most of them are pretty old, 554 00:37:27.519 --> 00:37:30.760 but there's certainly enough you can be snacking on. So I thought that 555 00:37:30.840 --> 00:37:34.159 was interesting as well. So you can see those two features in the video 556 00:37:34.199 --> 00:37:39.760 itself. So we know very approximately where the figure was walking, and using 557 00:37:39.840 --> 00:37:45.519 Google Earth Google Maps specifically, that distance is somewhere between eight hundred and one 558 00:37:45.519 --> 00:37:50.920 thousand feet horizontally from where you were now. Of course, is also quite 559 00:37:50.920 --> 00:37:53.360 a bit higher than where you were as well, so there's some trigonometry going 560 00:37:53.360 --> 00:37:55.800 on here. But I think it's pretty safe to say that is, you 561 00:37:55.800 --> 00:38:00.400 know, three football fields approximately away nine hundre feed or so, give or 562 00:38:00.440 --> 00:38:05.519 take a little bit. It's not that not really that far. And oddly 563 00:38:05.599 --> 00:38:07.800 enough, the Roseberg footage was three hundred and three yards, which is pretty 564 00:38:07.880 --> 00:38:12.519 much exactly the exactly the same distance, oddly enough, so I've got a 565 00:38:12.559 --> 00:38:15.320 couple of things to compare to here. But the direction it was traveling, 566 00:38:15.880 --> 00:38:19.239 there's nothing. Have you looked at the map, Kelly, Have you seen 567 00:38:19.239 --> 00:38:23.599 what's out there? I actually have not a whole lot of nothing. That's 568 00:38:23.599 --> 00:38:29.760 what I was assuming. I just figured after the initial mountains you see right, 569 00:38:29.760 --> 00:38:31.920 there is just more and more and more mountains pretty much, you have 570 00:38:32.039 --> 00:38:36.039 quite a ways to go, even before you run across a two track road. 571 00:38:36.119 --> 00:38:39.400 Actually, I don't know if it was a person, and again maybe 572 00:38:39.400 --> 00:38:43.559 it is. Maybe it is a person, but I don't know if it 573 00:38:43.639 --> 00:38:45.559 was a person, what in the world were they doing, I wonder, 574 00:38:46.079 --> 00:38:51.199 And where did they come from. That's exactly my thoughts. I have no 575 00:38:51.280 --> 00:38:54.079 idea where they would have came from, because there was nobody below. There 576 00:38:54.159 --> 00:38:58.840 was no other cars there. It was just my daughter and I that I 577 00:38:58.880 --> 00:39:04.079 could see, and year round there was no anybody else like back on the 578 00:39:04.159 --> 00:39:09.119 river side. It was literally just my daughter and I and the figure on 579 00:39:09.159 --> 00:39:14.480 the mountain side. And I really don't know what they would be doing there, 580 00:39:14.719 --> 00:39:17.880 you know, as like a human like, what their intentions would be 581 00:39:19.000 --> 00:39:22.960 just standing there on that hillside that day, Yeah, or actually walking away 582 00:39:22.119 --> 00:39:25.360 on the hillside, like walking away from the park, away from the river 583 00:39:25.880 --> 00:39:30.719 to where there's nothing. I guess the only thing that I would even can 584 00:39:30.440 --> 00:39:32.440 make sense to me at all is and all I'm going to get on the 585 00:39:32.440 --> 00:39:37.320 top of this ridge. But why there? I don't get it. I 586 00:39:37.440 --> 00:39:39.679 just don't get it. And they put it in some context here. We 587 00:39:39.760 --> 00:39:44.960 mentioned that where Kelly got this footage was at the end of the road. 588 00:39:45.840 --> 00:39:49.599 That's kind of true. It's the end of the road because there's a gate 589 00:39:49.679 --> 00:39:52.280 there, But the road does go past the gate. It goes another maybe 590 00:39:52.280 --> 00:39:57.159 one hundred and fifty two hundred yards past the gate and then goes into the 591 00:39:57.239 --> 00:40:00.679 river. Because the road was washed out by the south fork the walla walla 592 00:40:00.760 --> 00:40:04.280 river. The road does not exist there. It continues on the other side 593 00:40:04.280 --> 00:40:07.119 of the wash out, though, So to get there, I don't think 594 00:40:07.159 --> 00:40:09.800 you came down, but Keith came down. He actually filmed me trying to 595 00:40:09.880 --> 00:40:15.400 navigate this. The road goes into the river and at that point there's like 596 00:40:15.639 --> 00:40:17.639 a rock wall on the right hand side, and the river's on the left 597 00:40:17.639 --> 00:40:22.440 here, and the river is pushing against that rock wall. I had to 598 00:40:22.639 --> 00:40:25.320 climb that rock wall and kind of hug it with a camera in my hand. 599 00:40:25.320 --> 00:40:29.960 On my addicts, I filmed all this. I had to hug that 600 00:40:30.079 --> 00:40:35.920 rock wall and kind of shimmy along above the river. The rock wall's probably 601 00:40:36.320 --> 00:40:38.800 twenty five thirty feet, maybe maybe a little bit more, but something like 602 00:40:38.840 --> 00:40:43.719 that, maybe forty feet, And so I had to go on the slippery 603 00:40:43.840 --> 00:40:46.119 rock wall above the river and then go to the road on the other side. 604 00:40:46.159 --> 00:40:49.639 And actually I couldn't even make it that far. At some point, 605 00:40:49.719 --> 00:40:52.599 about ten feet shy of the road, I had to drop down off the 606 00:40:52.679 --> 00:40:57.840 rock wall and walk through the river. And mind you, I saw my 607 00:40:57.920 --> 00:41:00.159 car thermometer. It was thirty four degrees at that time. You know, 608 00:41:00.159 --> 00:41:04.360 it probably wasn't that same that you know the previous Thursday when you were there, 609 00:41:04.400 --> 00:41:07.519 But that's what I had to go through to get to the other side 610 00:41:07.679 --> 00:41:12.360 of this road wash out. From there, I continued further up and there's 611 00:41:12.400 --> 00:41:15.079 a bridge, luckily, that crosses the south fork of the Walla Walla River 612 00:41:15.679 --> 00:41:21.880 just before the Walla Walla River trailhead. There's a there's a bathroom facility there, 613 00:41:21.880 --> 00:41:24.119 there's a trailhead facility, there's parking and all that stuff. Nobody was 614 00:41:24.119 --> 00:41:27.880 there when I was there, but okay, so people out there going, 615 00:41:27.880 --> 00:41:30.159 okay, well there's a trail. Could it be a person? Absolutely could 616 00:41:30.159 --> 00:41:35.199 be a person, just seems unlikely. There the trail does go back. 617 00:41:35.519 --> 00:41:39.119 Most of the Walla Walla River trail is actually further upstream because as you're looking 618 00:41:39.119 --> 00:41:43.199 at the figure, the creek is flow or the river is flowing from right 619 00:41:43.239 --> 00:41:46.000 to left, so all this stuff is way to the right basically, So 620 00:41:46.519 --> 00:41:53.280 the trail goes upstream, mostly from the trailhead, but there is a small 621 00:41:53.320 --> 00:41:57.320 section of the trail that goes downstream, and that is what I took to 622 00:41:57.400 --> 00:42:00.840 get down to the area to start trying to locate where this thing may have 623 00:42:00.840 --> 00:42:04.400 been standing. Even from and when I was on that trail by the way, 624 00:42:04.480 --> 00:42:07.880 I found a human bootmark. I found a couple of bootmarks, but 625 00:42:07.960 --> 00:42:12.119 they were old, they were washed out, relatively speaking, so it could 626 00:42:12.119 --> 00:42:14.400 have been the last couple of days, maybe even the previous Thursday. I 627 00:42:14.440 --> 00:42:17.400 don't know. I don't think that it goes that far back, but it's 628 00:42:17.400 --> 00:42:21.119 possible at least. But where I found them, it turns out, was 629 00:42:21.239 --> 00:42:24.199 past where the figure was, probably another two or three hundred yards or more 630 00:42:24.480 --> 00:42:30.199 past for the figure, because I overshot the entire area, because I don't 631 00:42:30.239 --> 00:42:32.559 know how many people in our listening audience have ever done an on site recreation, 632 00:42:34.159 --> 00:42:37.239 but it is very difficult. It's actually a lot more difficult than I 633 00:42:37.280 --> 00:42:42.159 ever thought before I started doing this on a regular basis. To find where 634 00:42:42.199 --> 00:42:45.920 the figure was is very difficult from the position of the videographer, let alone 635 00:42:46.079 --> 00:42:52.239 from the position of the figure itself. So I way overshot it, and 636 00:42:52.280 --> 00:42:55.559 that's where I found the boot marks heading further downstreams so I don't know. 637 00:42:55.800 --> 00:42:59.480 I guess it could have been a person. Maybe that was the bootmarks of 638 00:42:59.519 --> 00:43:02.639 the person in the I don't know, But from there I had to go 639 00:43:02.880 --> 00:43:09.280 upwards. I had to go uphill on this crazy slope that varied between like 640 00:43:09.639 --> 00:43:13.559 you know, well, forty five degree you give or take fifteen degrees all 641 00:43:13.599 --> 00:43:16.800 the way up, and it had to be at least another two hundred or 642 00:43:16.800 --> 00:43:22.199 three hundred feet above the trail itself to get where the figure is. When 643 00:43:22.199 --> 00:43:25.199 I was up in that area, I didn't see any boot marks. I 644 00:43:25.199 --> 00:43:29.920 didn't see any sign of humans tromping around. I found a lot of deer 645 00:43:29.960 --> 00:43:35.320 marks, deer in elk prints were abundant, deer scat I found their bedding 646 00:43:35.400 --> 00:43:38.960 sites. And one of the things that struck me being up on that hillside 647 00:43:39.519 --> 00:43:46.039 that is hard to appreciate where you were Kelly down on the roadway is the 648 00:43:46.639 --> 00:43:52.880 variety of markings and features on the hillside, because when you look at the 649 00:43:52.960 --> 00:43:54.079 video, you say, oh, there's some dark marks and it looks like 650 00:43:54.079 --> 00:44:00.559 a big open hillside, It absolutely isn't. There are rocky outcropping all over 651 00:44:00.559 --> 00:44:06.360 the place up there. It looks like there's hardly any trees on the hillside, 652 00:44:06.360 --> 00:44:09.599 which also isn't true. There are quite a few small trees and some 653 00:44:09.679 --> 00:44:15.320 pretty big groves of trees to the right of where you see the figure in 654 00:44:15.360 --> 00:44:19.360 the video, there's actually a really big tree grove that probably had fifty or 655 00:44:19.400 --> 00:44:22.400 more trees in it, some of which are like forty fifty sixty feet tall, 656 00:44:24.039 --> 00:44:28.039 and there's bushes down and there. So when you told me that the 657 00:44:28.039 --> 00:44:30.840 figure disappeared, I said, I wonder what it's like up there. And 658 00:44:30.920 --> 00:44:36.840 sure enough, there is more than ample opportunity for any a person, let 659 00:44:36.840 --> 00:44:40.079 alone a sasquatch, to hide themselves and never be seen by you down there. 660 00:44:40.280 --> 00:44:44.719 I thought that was a very very interesting feature. I guess to the 661 00:44:44.800 --> 00:44:47.440 video that you added, it's like it just totally disappeared. How could that 662 00:44:47.480 --> 00:44:50.760 be true? And I'm sure the paranormal people say, you know why, 663 00:44:50.760 --> 00:44:53.760 Cliff, because they jumped into their inter dimensional UFO writing portals and disappeared. 664 00:44:54.519 --> 00:45:00.400 So well, I guess you could say that or just hid among the stuff 665 00:45:00.400 --> 00:45:01.960 that was on the hillside, because there was a whole lot of that up 666 00:45:02.000 --> 00:45:07.159 there that you just can't really make out in the video. Stay tuned for 667 00:45:07.280 --> 00:45:10.239 more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo. We'll be right back after these 668 00:45:10.280 --> 00:45:21.039 messages. So that the investigation I think was fruitful. I learned a lot 669 00:45:21.119 --> 00:45:25.159 about the video itself. I couldn't do the comparison photographs as I intended. 670 00:45:25.719 --> 00:45:30.480 Maybe I can get up there again and before the leaves come on the tree 671 00:45:30.519 --> 00:45:31.760 and try it again. But it was a long day. I mean, 672 00:45:31.760 --> 00:45:36.039 it was nine hours in the car after all, and gas isn't cheap, 673 00:45:36.079 --> 00:45:37.360 as we all know. But still, I mean, maybe I can get 674 00:45:37.400 --> 00:45:42.079 up there again for some other reason and drop by and do that comparison shot. 675 00:45:42.079 --> 00:45:44.480 I'd love to do it. But you know, Kelly, I didn't 676 00:45:44.480 --> 00:45:45.239 tell you this. I don't think I had a chance to speak to you 677 00:45:45.639 --> 00:45:51.400 until now. Since then, when I got back to work on Tuesday, 678 00:45:52.239 --> 00:45:58.400 I was told that somebody called the museum to warn me about your footage. 679 00:45:59.119 --> 00:46:00.639 Now I don't know who this person is and if they left the name, 680 00:46:00.880 --> 00:46:06.920 my employees didn't give it to me, etc. But somebody called the museum. 681 00:46:07.199 --> 00:46:10.320 I want to warncliffe about that footage. I saw that footage years ago, 682 00:46:10.760 --> 00:46:15.000 and it's a hoax and all this other stuff. And I say, 683 00:46:15.039 --> 00:46:17.440 well, that's odd because the time stamp on this woman's phone says it was 684 00:46:17.519 --> 00:46:22.840 last Thursday at like twelve eighteen or something like that. And nothing personal, 685 00:46:22.960 --> 00:46:28.599 Kelly. But I don't know if you're savvy enough to manipulate the time stamp 686 00:46:28.679 --> 00:46:31.039 on your video and your iPhone fifteen. So it's kind of a weird thing, 687 00:46:31.079 --> 00:46:35.599 you know. Did you get any blowback like that from the Bigfoot community. 688 00:46:36.000 --> 00:46:40.440 I absolutely did. I heard quite a bit of things. That is. 689 00:46:40.519 --> 00:46:44.360 One of the things that I did here too, is I've seen this 690 00:46:44.400 --> 00:46:49.639 footage before from I think they said it was from like Call. The footage 691 00:46:49.800 --> 00:46:53.000 was out of Colorado, and there was so many going on about, Oh, 692 00:46:53.039 --> 00:46:58.079 it's just the girlfriend's boyfriend that's up there, this is just a hoax. 693 00:46:58.119 --> 00:47:02.480 I could clearly see blonde hair and overalls and like you name it. 694 00:47:02.480 --> 00:47:07.119 It was probably said. There was a lot of pushback by that. But 695 00:47:07.199 --> 00:47:10.559 at the same time, you know, I just blew it off because I 696 00:47:10.639 --> 00:47:15.320 know as I was there, I know when it was filmed. As you 697 00:47:15.360 --> 00:47:19.320 said, it is time stamped on my phone, and with those you can 698 00:47:19.360 --> 00:47:22.679 see the exact location that I was standing in too. A lot of that 699 00:47:22.840 --> 00:47:27.320 was just a little bit lappable, but there was a lot of pushback with 700 00:47:27.360 --> 00:47:30.840 it. Yeah, you'll find no shortage of that unfortunately, in and amongst 701 00:47:30.880 --> 00:47:36.880 the Sasquatch community, you know, and as a good example, Very often 702 00:47:36.920 --> 00:47:39.039 people will analyze the Patterson Gimlin film and say, oh, well, there 703 00:47:39.079 --> 00:47:43.880 seems to be the suggestion of muscle movement. And people will say, oh, 704 00:47:43.920 --> 00:47:47.360 you can't possibly see that. There's not enough clarity. It's impossible to 705 00:47:47.480 --> 00:47:52.039 know. And then in a video that's digital as yours is where it gets 706 00:47:52.039 --> 00:47:55.760 pixelated, those same skeptics, oh, I can clearly see blonde hair, 707 00:47:55.840 --> 00:47:59.639 or can clearly It's like, no, you can't. You can't clearly see 708 00:47:59.679 --> 00:48:01.960 any of those things. Et Sol, I'm sorry to hear that you had 709 00:48:02.000 --> 00:48:08.199 to deal with that, but you're in good company. I imagine a lot 710 00:48:08.199 --> 00:48:12.599 of people are coming off as experts about your footage. I don't know if 711 00:48:12.599 --> 00:48:15.840 you have you been paying attention at all. I have not, because I'm, 712 00:48:15.199 --> 00:48:17.760 as far as I know, I'm the only person who's been to the 713 00:48:17.760 --> 00:48:22.000 site and spoken to you. I'm certainly Keith and I are the only people 714 00:48:22.000 --> 00:48:23.920 who have been to the site with you. So it seems to me that 715 00:48:23.960 --> 00:48:27.920 most of everybody else's opinion doesn't really matter at this point. But it seems 716 00:48:27.920 --> 00:48:30.519 like a lot of people are coming off as experts. Is that true? 717 00:48:30.840 --> 00:48:34.239 Yes, absolutely, you guys are the only ones that I have gone to 718 00:48:34.280 --> 00:48:37.960 the site with there are a lot out there that I would hear given my 719 00:48:38.039 --> 00:48:43.480 experience that when I've seen these a few times in my life. The arms 720 00:48:43.480 --> 00:48:46.519 aren't long. This isn't you know, the strides aren't this. You could 721 00:48:46.519 --> 00:48:51.800 clearly see that they're wearing a coat, and they would go on about like 722 00:48:51.880 --> 00:48:59.119 how their experience played into my experience and why my experience wasn't legitimate because of 723 00:48:59.199 --> 00:49:02.440 their experience. If that makes sense, your sentence makes sense, but their 724 00:49:02.519 --> 00:49:07.199 idea of that makes no sense to me at all, you know what I 725 00:49:07.199 --> 00:49:10.039 mean. Yeah. One of the things Cliff and I talked about that I've 726 00:49:10.079 --> 00:49:15.800 just seen over and over again from investigating pieces of multimedia evidence like this is 727 00:49:15.840 --> 00:49:20.000 that the more you can see, actually, the more sort of pushback that 728 00:49:20.039 --> 00:49:24.079 you'll get. People tend to favor, especially like certain sasquatch proponents, less 729 00:49:24.199 --> 00:49:29.960 informational bits of evidence, because then it has more blank space for them to 730 00:49:30.039 --> 00:49:34.159 fill in the blanks with the contents of their imagination or the things that they 731 00:49:34.320 --> 00:49:37.400 want to see. And so very often as you see more detail, like 732 00:49:37.480 --> 00:49:43.599 the way something moves, it doesn't comport with their sort of fantasy, and 733 00:49:43.679 --> 00:49:46.199 so they'll go, oh, well, that's not how I think it should 734 00:49:46.239 --> 00:49:50.159 move, and therefore it can't be real when none of us know exactly how 735 00:49:50.159 --> 00:49:54.000 a sasquatch can or would or should move. So again, sorry to hear 736 00:49:54.039 --> 00:49:58.519 that you've experienced that, But once again you're in good company because everyone who's 737 00:49:58.559 --> 00:50:00.920 managed to get some sort of evidence it has to deal with these same pushbacks 738 00:50:00.920 --> 00:50:05.800 if like that doesn't comport with my fantasy of what a sasquat should do, 739 00:50:05.920 --> 00:50:09.719 and therefore it can't be real. Yeah, yeah, And then of course 740 00:50:09.760 --> 00:50:16.599 everybody has witnesses are a weird mix here because you mentioned like that didn't move 741 00:50:16.719 --> 00:50:22.679 or appear or have this like the one I saw did their four years isn't 742 00:50:22.679 --> 00:50:25.559 real to me. That's just everybody that says somebody saying look at me, 743 00:50:27.159 --> 00:50:29.880 look at me, look at me. And then that's the problem with the 744 00:50:29.880 --> 00:50:32.079 big cook community today. And in my opinion, everybody is out there saying 745 00:50:32.159 --> 00:50:36.039 look at me, instead of saying, let's look at the animals. That's 746 00:50:36.039 --> 00:50:39.599 where the attention should be. In my opinion, it's not about you. 747 00:50:39.719 --> 00:50:42.679 It's not about I mean, I hate to say it. Your video is 748 00:50:42.679 --> 00:50:45.239 not about you, Kelly. You know, like my museum isn't about me, 749 00:50:45.360 --> 00:50:49.599 Cliff, It's about the animals, and that's where the focus should be. 750 00:50:50.199 --> 00:50:52.639 And they there's a wide variety of animals and not all everyone's going to 751 00:50:52.679 --> 00:50:57.599 look the same or have the same you know, features, and they shouldn't 752 00:50:57.599 --> 00:51:00.440 be expected to. Because that's the big takeaway. And I've said I've said 753 00:51:00.440 --> 00:51:05.440 this one hundred times at least, that the big takeaway from my experience on 754 00:51:05.519 --> 00:51:07.800 the show Finding Bigfoot, which ran for eight what nine years? Eight nine 755 00:51:07.840 --> 00:51:12.280 years, I've been to all over the world looking for these things. My 756 00:51:12.440 --> 00:51:16.280 number one takeaway is that bigfoots don't give a damn about your expectations. They 757 00:51:16.360 --> 00:51:20.960 just do what they do and they're not going to conform to what you think 758 00:51:21.400 --> 00:51:24.360 or anybody thinks. And I think to come out and say, well, 759 00:51:24.400 --> 00:51:30.559 your video doesn't match what I expect, therefore it's wrong, that's just a 760 00:51:30.639 --> 00:51:34.320 weird that's a very weird form of arrogance. Yeah, I think it'd be 761 00:51:34.360 --> 00:51:37.559 worth saying that, you know, if someone were truly skeptical, if you 762 00:51:37.599 --> 00:51:42.239 know people who want to dismiss bits of video or even cynical about it, 763 00:51:42.239 --> 00:51:45.880 where they just have like an arbitrary commitment to saying that something can't be real. 764 00:51:45.920 --> 00:51:47.400 It's like, well, if you were truly skeptical, then you'd be 765 00:51:47.400 --> 00:51:52.400 skeptical of your own certainty, Like what makes you so sure that your hypothetical 766 00:51:52.440 --> 00:51:55.760 model of what a sasquat should be like is correct? But people very often 767 00:51:55.800 --> 00:52:00.440 don't take those steps. So it is again unfortunate to hear that you had 768 00:52:00.440 --> 00:52:05.079 to deal with those sorts of they're not even rebuttals, they're just noise. 769 00:52:05.199 --> 00:52:07.920 So sorry you were bombarded by that kind of noise. No, it's so 770 00:52:08.079 --> 00:52:14.400 good. It's to me almost to be expected in a way. I just 771 00:52:14.559 --> 00:52:17.360 kind of compare this to like the paranormal, where you know you're going to 772 00:52:17.440 --> 00:52:22.239 have those people who absolutely believe, and if you even if you catch it 773 00:52:22.280 --> 00:52:24.000 on footage, you know there's going to be those ones that believe, there's 774 00:52:24.039 --> 00:52:28.719 going to be those ones that absolutely do not, and you know, try 775 00:52:28.760 --> 00:52:31.320 to think of every logical reason of why this isn't the way that it really 776 00:52:31.519 --> 00:52:37.599 is. So it was easy for me just to ignore those, you know, 777 00:52:37.679 --> 00:52:42.679 all the negative that came with it. Yeah, then you start to 778 00:52:42.800 --> 00:52:46.159 make sense of how could it be that these animals are real and haven't been 779 00:52:46.239 --> 00:52:50.800 recognized? And then you have to deal with the people who are quote unquote 780 00:52:50.840 --> 00:52:53.599 trying to discover them, and you see the way they conduct themselves and you 781 00:52:53.639 --> 00:52:57.159 go, oh, it's no wonder these people haven't figured it out yet. 782 00:52:58.639 --> 00:53:02.000 Yeah. Well, Kelly, first of all, congratulations on getting a really 783 00:53:02.079 --> 00:53:06.400 interesting clip. Is it a bigfoot? Is it a human? I mean, 784 00:53:06.440 --> 00:53:08.400 honestly, we don't know. We don't know. I think even at 785 00:53:08.400 --> 00:53:15.599 this point you don't know either. But I'll tell you I am much much 786 00:53:15.639 --> 00:53:20.639 more strongly leaning towards a sasquatch now that I have spoken at length to you, 787 00:53:20.719 --> 00:53:24.000 this is our third lengthy conversation, and also been to the site not 788 00:53:24.039 --> 00:53:29.159 only where you took the shots, but also where the figure was approximately. 789 00:53:29.280 --> 00:53:32.360 I've been up in that general area, and I am much more inclined to 790 00:53:32.400 --> 00:53:36.000 be very open to this being a sasquatch. In fact, I kind of 791 00:53:36.039 --> 00:53:38.559 think it probably is at this point, but you know, it's hard to 792 00:53:38.559 --> 00:53:42.320 come down. Then. This isn't TV where the producers are going to say, 793 00:53:42.320 --> 00:53:43.960 clip, come on, be more firm. So no, no, 794 00:53:44.400 --> 00:53:46.800 this is the truth. I think it very well could be a sasquatch. 795 00:53:47.119 --> 00:53:50.400 Is it? I don't know, never, probably never will know. I 796 00:53:50.440 --> 00:53:53.639 was hoping to get up to the exact location and find footprints, but we 797 00:53:53.679 --> 00:53:57.920 couldn't get to the spot. We couldn't because of the fog, We couldn't 798 00:53:58.039 --> 00:54:01.800 nail down exactly where that was. I didn't and across any impressions of sasquatch 799 00:54:01.920 --> 00:54:06.480 or human up there, although Keith did find something interesting and we'll share that 800 00:54:06.480 --> 00:54:10.679 with our members. But yeah, congratulations on an interesting piece of footage. 801 00:54:12.000 --> 00:54:14.960 And also, thank you so much. I cannot say this enough. Thank 802 00:54:15.000 --> 00:54:19.199 you so much for sparing so much time out of your busy schedule. I 803 00:54:19.199 --> 00:54:21.960 mean, you have a job, you have children, you have to contend 804 00:54:22.000 --> 00:54:24.400 with, you have a life, and but yet you've taken several hours of 805 00:54:24.440 --> 00:54:28.280 your life not only to speak to me on the phone and to speak me 806 00:54:28.320 --> 00:54:31.039 on the podcast, but also to meet me at the location itself, to 807 00:54:31.159 --> 00:54:36.559 walk me through and point things out and share your insights at the site itself. 808 00:54:36.800 --> 00:54:38.920 I cannot thank you enough for that. I really really do appreciate it. 809 00:54:38.920 --> 00:54:43.159 You've done everything above and beyond your call of duty, the call of 810 00:54:43.199 --> 00:54:46.159 duty to shed light on this situation. So thank you, thank you, 811 00:54:46.320 --> 00:54:50.199 thank you. Yeah, well, thank you guys so much. I really 812 00:54:50.280 --> 00:54:53.480 appreciate you guys taking the time out and you know, listening to me, 813 00:54:53.719 --> 00:54:58.199 and you making those phone calls with me as well, and taking your time 814 00:54:58.239 --> 00:55:02.159 to drive over here. And it's been a really great experience with you guys, 815 00:55:02.280 --> 00:55:07.159 and I truly appreciate everything of it. So thank you very much. 816 00:55:07.800 --> 00:55:10.880 Hey, Kelly, I'm gonna give you a really fun opportunity here. I 817 00:55:10.880 --> 00:55:14.639 don't think when I talk to you at the site, you mentioned you had 818 00:55:14.679 --> 00:55:19.880 never heard the podcast before. But at the end of every episode, Bobo, 819 00:55:19.960 --> 00:55:22.960 who have you seen the Finding Bigfoot show or not? I don't, 820 00:55:22.960 --> 00:55:24.960 I don't remember. I've seen a few episodes. Yes, okay, Well, 821 00:55:24.960 --> 00:55:29.519 Bobo's the big guy, right, that guy. At the end of 822 00:55:29.559 --> 00:55:34.440 every single episode, he tells our listeners, he thanks everybody, so thank 823 00:55:34.440 --> 00:55:37.880 you for listening, and he says, keep it squatchy. Would you like 824 00:55:37.960 --> 00:55:43.280 to do that in the in your best Bobo imitation? Okay, I'll give 825 00:55:43.320 --> 00:55:46.840 that a shot. Thank you guys for tuning in with us this week. 826 00:55:47.159 --> 00:55:58.079 Keep it Squatchy very nice, It was uncanny. Thanks for listening to this 827 00:55:58.119 --> 00:56:01.280 week's episode of Bigfoot NB. If you liked what you heard, please rate 828 00:56:01.360 --> 00:56:06.639 and review us on iTunes. Subscribe to Bigfoot and Beyond wherever you get your 829 00:56:06.679 --> 00:56:10.840 podcasts, and follow us on Facebook and Instagram at Bigfoot and Beyond podcast. 830 00:56:12.320 --> 00:56:15.519 You can find us on Twitter at Bigfoot and Beyond that's an N in the 831 00:56:15.519 --> 00:56:22.239 middle, and tweet us your thoughts and questions with the hashtag Bigfoot and Beyond