Big Food and Beyond with Cliff and Bobo. These guys, are you fav
It's so like, say subscribe and rade it. I'm stuck and me gratious.
One wish today and listening watching limb always keep it Squatching And now you're
hosts Cliff Berrickman and James Bobo Fay, Hey, Squatch getears. This is
Cliff. You're listening to Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and usually Bobo, but
this is one of those usual or unusual times where he's not here. We're
recording this in the morning, and Bobo's not a morning person, and even
if he is, apparently he has plans. He's got some firewood issues that
he already had pre planned. So it's kind of my fault in a way
that Bobo's not here because it was last night that I arranged this witness and
uh, you know, last minute stuff isn't easy for anybody, and Bob
already had had plans to get some firewood because that's how he heats his house
and all that sort of stuff. So it's just me today, Well it's
not just me. We have a guest, but I'll get to her in
just a few moments. It's kind of a great week and Bigfoot right now.
Lots of cool things are happening. New footprints were discovered. I just
got emails yesterday from a person who found some footprints south of Timothy Lake out
here in Manhood National Forests. They look fantastic in the photographs. I'll be
sharing that with some of the members here at an ABC. I guess I
can throw that the pru it too. You can put it on the Bigfoot
of Beyond podcast stuff, great photographs. I wish I could have been out
there, but it is now under a foot or two of snow. They
were discovered on November twenty seventh, so that's the kind of thing that makes
my heart ache, like, oh, man, had you told me or
that day or the day after, heck, the day after was my birthday.
What a cool birthday present that would have been to go open cast footprints
south of Timothy Lake up here in the Mountain National Forest. But alas did
not happen. But at least the witness did send them to me, So
that was really cool. But of course, right now most people are talking
about a piece of footage that was obtained last week that just might show a
Sasquatch. And of course if you go online and look at Facebook, which
is probably just about the last place you should ever look for good information,
I might add, because not only is a lot of this stuff put out
just nonsense, but also the people who chime in, you know, they
all act like they know what they're talking about, or have some sort of
authority, or like their opinion counts. Now, mind you, mind you.
I'm under no illusion that my opinion counts at all, you know,
and therefore you don't see me give a lot of opinions out there on social
media. But there's an interesting piece of footage that just surfaced. It was
obtained last Thursday when we're recording this so a we could go today. It's
recording on Thursday from the Walla Walla River, the south fork of the Walla
Walla River, and today we have or I have the videographer, the one
of the only two witnesses to this thing, and the other witness was her
daughter. But so, Kelly, thanks for taking a little bit of time
this morning to come on Bigfoot and Beyond and tell us the story behind this
video. Because if you go online, there's all sorts of crazy misinformation and
nonsense out there, and I figured, you know what, I have spoken
to you directly. I have been to the site with you. Let's talk
about the piece of footage. Kelly, Welcome to Bigfoot and Beyond. Hi,
thank you so much for having me. Oh, it is a pleasure.
It is a pleasure. And again a big thank you for all the
help you've been given me this past week. I'll give a little bit of
background how this video came on my radar, and then we can go into
what occurred as you took it. Okay, it's what a weird, twisted
tale this has become too. Basically, the other day, I can remember
what day, I can check my emails, but I got an email from
a person this is hey Cliff, this is out there, and it was
a screenshot from this person's phone. It was actually a video screenshot from this
person's phone saying yeah, there's a new video and you should check it out.
And I went, oh, well, okay, okay. I took
a look at it and it's like, okay, yeah, maybe yeah,
it's kind of at a distance, you don't really know that much about it.
So I wrote the person back, I said, is this your video
or you just telling me about it, and I pushed send, and then
a moment later, another person emailed me about the same video, and so
I said, well, all right, is this your video or are you
just telling me about it? And it turns out that the second person was
Kelly. Kelly is the videographer, and she emailed the video to me to
look over or whatever, and then of course she said, oh, it's
my video, and so I got her phone number and we arranged a time
for a phone meeting. I have two pages of notes that were taken during
that phone meeting that we'll get into today. And then I arranged the time
to go out and visit with her, but we'll get to that in a
minute. So that's how the footage crossed my desk. And by the way,
the other person, the first person to share with me, apparently got
it from the Facebook page where Kelly posted it. So that's how that came
on. Kelly. Let's start, I guess with the day itself, like
how the video came about, and then we'll go into where you posted it
and the aftermath of all this sort of stuff in your thoughts. Okay,
So let's start with the day of the video and just tell us what happened.
Okay, So the day of the video was last Thursday, and my
daughter and I were heading out to what is known as Harris Park to go
hike around and walk up the river like we normally do. And so we
were driving in getting ready to go to where we normally park, and a
little bit before we got there, I noticed out of kind of like my
peripheral vision that there was something black, very black, sticking out from the
hillside. Okay, And just to be clear, when you say before we
got there, you don't mean getting to the park, right, You mean
getting to the place where you had to turn around, right. It was
right before it was coming up the hill, the little hill there, right
before you go to turn around your car. Okay, Okay, Just to
set thee here, this is last Thursday, which was December seventh, twenty
twenty three, and Harris Park is a park along the south fork of the
Walla Walla River. It's kind of a big park only that is very very
long. I think the whole park is probably a half mile or maybe three
quarters of a mile long. I'm just eyeballing it, guessing having been there.
And it's basically a road and facilities like you know, there's places where
the grounds keeper keep their gear, there's a playground, there's a campground there,
and then at the very end of the park would be the Walla Walla
River trailhead that but unfortunately the road's been washed out, so there's a gate
that prohibits people from driving that far, and that is right at the gate
there. That's where the video is obtained. So when you say just before
we got there, I think what you're talking about is the turnaround place before
the gate. And if I'm incorrect, please correct me. That's why we're
talking about it now. No, that's absolutely correct. Right before we get
to the park where we would park, which would be right now side those
two gates. Very good. So as you're approaching that area, you see
what It just stuck out of my privial vision of like just a black figure
and I just kind of looked up there and didn't think too much of it.
It just kind of struck me as out of place. So then when
you get to the top, you flip a U turn right next to those
gates to turn around. And as I was mid U turn, I turned
my car in and then now the car is like facing that mountain side in
you know, half midu turn, and so I see it up on the
mountain side. It was just big and black, and I was just kind
of like what is that? And I'm thinking out loud, like what is
that? And my ten year old daughter was next to me and she was
like what's what? And so I was like, Oh, you don't see
that, and she was like, no, what are you looking at?
Because there's a whole bunch of trees that we have to look through as well
to see that mountain side. And so I pulled out my phone and I
zoomed it all the way in, and then somewhere in there I ended up
hitting record, and so I zoomed all the way in so I could show
my daughter where I was looking, and so you could kind of hear that
in the video, like I'm like, look right here next to my thumb
as I was pointing it on the phone screen so that way she can look
and see. And then she did end up seeing it, and she was
just what is that? And my first initial reaction was like, oh,
that's just a human, which you would hear in the footage as well.
Is I was like, oh, it's just a human. But it's weird.
It's staring at us. And as it was my initial thought that it
was a person, I didn't want to be creepy sitting in my car filming
them on the mountain, so I you know, stopped filming and we go
to finish parking the car, and we get out of the car to go
ahead, you know, and walk down to the river. This is past
the gate where the direction you were traveling, like the walking to the walking
right right. We were going to go walking past that gate to head up
to the where the river is back there. And so we get out of
the car and I could still see the figure on the wall at the the
mountain side. At the end of the clip, you could see it just
standing perfectly still. So when we get out of the car, you know,
I was waiting for my daughter to get out of her side and come
with me. I could still see it standing there, but still perfectly still,
like it just wasn't moving. So we just started heading over towards the
towards the gates to go back towards the river. And it was it was
a very short distance of walking there, you know, there wasn't very much
for where you park to where those gates actually hit. And right about the
time we reached the gates, I looked back up and it was completely gone.
I could see absolutely nothing on that mountain side anymore. And I was
like, oh, it's gone. And my daughter looked up as well and
she was like, oh, I don't see it either. And so we
stood there, you know, looking around, wait for a minute, just
in case it kind of went behind something or you know, maybe there was
a hill in the mountain we couldn't quite see that. It kind of dipped
underneath and it just never reappeared. And then that's when I started feeling like
the atmosphere around me. It was very thick feeling. It was as if
you're being watched, like a heavy feeling of just being watched. And then
it was also kind of like a foreboding, ominous type of feeling. And
so we were still standing there and I was like, I think we should
go. I don't you know, this feels very off. I feel like
we're being watched. And my daughter's like, no, it's okay, come
on, mom, we're right here. Let's just go to the river,
because we weren't too far from it. So I was like, okay,
you know, we walked just a couple extra steps and then I was like,
no, this is feeling very off. We are definitely feeling or I'm
feeling like we're being watched. So we're going to go ahead and go.
And she just said okay, and we got in the car and drove off
from there. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo.
We'll be right back after these messages. Did you probably not, Probably didn't
smell anything. Did you hear anything, or did you see anything else unusual?
No? I didn't smell anything. It was starting to rain, and
you know, it was quite a distance away from where we were, so
there was no like unusual type smells or sounds, not that I remember of.
At least, did your daughter hear or see anything? Yes, We
drove down back towards the campgrounds that you initially passed when you first come in.
There's like a little waterfall there that she wanted to get out and go
see, and so we drove back down there. We got out, we'd
go to see it, and I was talking to her and in the middle
of my sentence to her, she stopped me and she goes, Mom,
I don't want to freak you out. But I heard like a really or
a manly scream, and I was like, you heard what? And she
goes a manly scream and I said, well, where did you hear that?
And she kind of pointed over towards the direction that we just were where
we had saw it. Okay, so she heard something, she heard a
noise coming from that area. Manly scream, that's how she described it.
Yes, I love it. I have a couple of manly screams inside me
sometimes too. So okay. So no other cars in the park or anything
that you said. There was a cherokee that one was just coming down as
we were coming up. We passed it. Oh, I see, I
see. Oh so they were leaving the park as you were coming in,
right, I see, I see. Okay. So, as far as
you can tell that, there was really nobody else in the park. And
there's a there's a there's a playground there. There were no there are no
kids there, I guess because it's a Thursday to you know, kind of
lousy weather and so nobody. You didn't see anybody else in the park at
all. Nope, there was nobody near the campgrounds. The park, and
to my understanding that day, the campgrounds have already been closed too. Yeah,
okay, they were closed when I was there as well. Now you
thought it was a person. We talked about that when I did the interview
with you thought it was just a person up there? When did you When
did it start dawning on you that maybe it wasn't a person. It was
like right before I started recording. It was just the way that it was
moving, how black it was. It was just like a feeling that I
don't know how to describe it, but just kind of like a what is
that? Like? You know, when there's like a person standing on there's
a person, you can you could distinguish their features, you can more or
less see like their clothing or something. This one was just in the far
distance, but it was just black, like head to toe. You couldn't
distinguish any type of like if there was pants were anything. With the way
that it was moving, and it just kind of started making me second guess
myself, like what am I looking at? Like what is it doing?
Because I couldn't it was moving, and so with the movements, that's why
I was like, what is it doing? And then you know, that's
when we Also I had the conversation with my daughter because she couldn't see it,
and then we pulled out the phone. What did your daughter think about
this whole thing? Did she have anything to say about all this? At
the time, she thought it was just kind of weird, you know.
She was just like, what are they doing? What is that? And
then when we got out of the car to you know, walk up to
the trailheads and I had like that over overcoming, overwhelming sensation. She didn't
feel anything at that time, and so to her it was just like,
oh, come on, mom, let's just go. But now looking back
and like looking at the video and like seeing it zoomed in and and learning
a bit more about everything, she's starting to be like, yeah, mom,
I think we really did see one. Okay, So when you got
home that day, how did you what did you do with the video?
Because it eventually came to me, of course, and a lot of things
have happened since then, But what were some of the first things you did
or thought with the video as you proceeded throughout your day? Right, So
we get home and of course I'm going through the pictures that we took that
day, and I came across to where the video was and I was like,
oh yeah, let me, let me look at this video. So
I pressed play just to watch it, and I was like, that is
kind of weird. So I zoomed in on it and I pressed play again,
and I was getting as close as I could, because you know,
the closer you get, the more pixelated it looks. Yeah. And then
for the record, by the way, you have an iPhone fifteen. That's
correct, Yes, I do, okay, I just want to make sure
to put that out there for people. Oh yeah. And so I the
video itself was already zoomed in, but on the screen, I zoomed it
in even more as it was playing, and that's when I realized, like,
this does not look like a human to me whatsoever. Just as you
see in the video, the movements are a little bit weird to me.
It felt like it looked like it had like longer arms and it was just
black from head to toe. So I saw the video and I was like,
what is this? And I kind of pieced it together to where it
shows like the original video and then like screen recorded with the video zoomed in
more so you know, people could see the regular one and then right after
that it would play the zoomed in one. I was like, let me,
I'm going to post this and see like what other people think. So
I'm in Walla Walla group here and I posted there, and I believe that's
the only place I posted, and no, I'm sorry. I posted in
a few groups. There was the Walla Walla group, and then I went
and I found some bigfoot groups just to kind of get their opinions because I'm
not very knowledgeable in this area. So I was like, well, let
me, you know, be you know, join these groups and post in
there and get like their their opinions of everything. Because that was once I
saw that video and it started clicking with me, the word bigfoot just comes
to mind. So that's where it kind of gives me like the inkling to
go to like bigfoot pages and post there to see and yeah, it went
a little bit more crazy than I thought it was going to go. Well
that's something that can be said about the community. I mean, people think
we're crazy, but we're actually a little bit more crazy than they think.
Yes, now you mentioned the Walla Walla group. We're not going to mention
anybody else's name in there because I think you got more or less treated well
by the Walla Walla group, But I know some other groups did not treat
you well. Some other individual sites did not treat you well as well.
So we're not going to talk about them or put them out or anything like
that. That's not what this podcast is about. But we will give kudos
to the Walla Walla group for being kind listeners, I guess. And I
think that's also where the person who initially pointed the video out to me got
it from. I think that that person is also on that Facebook group.
So so what were some of the comments that came out about the video initially,
like good or bad or ugly or anything like that? What kind of
things were they saying? Right, Well, the Wallawaller group was actually very
helpful. That is where the gentleman who sent you that video beforehand, he's
the one who gave me your name and the email that I originally sent it
in. He's like, send this in, let's see what he thinks.
There's some more people, you know, trying to give I think I got
your name a few times with emails and everything to send to you, and
then a lot of them were just like this is you know, this is
great footage, good catch, and so they were just already on the lines
like this is absolutely a big foot. Okay, So you got some really
encouraging remarks and good excellent because you could go either way with the bigfoot community,
you know, right. Yeah. And of course, when when I
first saw the video, I say, oh, this is interesting. I
mean, and you know, I mean even to this day, I don't
know if it's a person. I don't know if it's a bigfoot. But
we'll get into my investigation in a minute. But I will say, as
a you know, just to kind of put this out there right now,
that I see no reason at all that this could not be a sasquatch,
you know, no reason at all some of the some of the comments that
I saw. Mind you, I'm in a lucky position right now, where
like Facebook isn't even installed on my phone, Like I don't I use it
so little, It's not even onto my phone right now. So I'm blessed
to be ignorance of all the nonsense that goes out there. But other people
who I had spoken to says, oh, it moves clumsily, and I
don't think that's the case at all. I think that takes really really big
steps as it walks up the hill. I don't think it's falling or anything
like that. And there's a lot of things about it that people were saying,
Oh, well, what's that in its hand? And you know,
maybe there is something in its hand and it's left hand specifically. It does
kind of look like that to me, but I can't make out what that
thing is. But then again, I also know from having been to the
scene that we probably should just get into that before I talk about it too
much. That there was a lot of brush in the foreground of the video
that you just can't see because you did your best to focus on the figure
itself, and therefore the stuff in the foreground turns out to be noise in
the video a lot of times. So okay, So anyway, let's to
get into the investigation part of things, and we can talk about the footage
little bit more afterwards. So you eventually reach out to me, and then
I write to you and say, Hey, is this your footage? And
you say yes. We do that interview the next morning. I guess because
you had the day off that day. I didn't want to bother you at
work, of course, and then the more I hear about this video,
it's like, yeah, you know, everything's kind of making sense. Everything's
kind of making sense. And you know, we have a piece of footage
here in the North American Bigfoot Center called the Roseberg Footage that is of similar
quality. And actually it's from a similar distance too, I might add,
which is really interesting. And so I thinking, you know, this reminds
me of the Roseberg footage. That's really interesting. And I know from my
first hand investigation of the Roseburg footage that about that distance you should be able
to see clothing. And that's something that you told me right away. It's
like, no, I didn't see any clothing. It was black from head
to toe, and that when I went out to the site. And I'll
get to this in a minute, but I asked your daughter, who's the
other witness of course, to this, was the figure on the hill wearing
clothes? And she said no, straight out, no, who was not
wearing clothes. I think that you'd be able to see clothing. I really
do think you'd be able to see clothing at that distance. Okay, so
we do our interview, and then you were kind enough to meet me out
there at the scene on this past Monday. I don't know what day.
Monday was, probably like the eleventh or something like that. I'll take a
look at that really fast to So, yeah, the eleventh. So I
woke up at five am. I drove five hundred and nine miles that one
day. I went and picked up my colleague Keith, and we drove out
there. We got there about nine thirty. You were kind enough to meet
us out there, So what are your thoughts on the investigative process? That's
because that's something that I don't think much of because you know, I'm neck
deep in bigfoot stuff all the time, but you're kind of an outsider in
some ways. This is probably your first dip into the pool. So what
are your thoughts on the investigative process that you saw unfolding that day? Ah?
Yes, I am absolutely new to all of this, so it was
very interesting and intriguing to me. I was a little frustrated because the fog
that day was just so thick, and I was really looking forward to us
getting like the comparison shots and to being able to zoom in and kind of
recreate, you know, the way that it looked in the video with you
know, a human versus whatever it was that I had originally filmed, so
we could you know, piece that together and really take a look into that.
But the investigation process of it was awesome. You guys were such good
troopers to you know, hike that mount and you guys had to go through
a little bit of that river just to get through, and it was cold,
and I'm just so appreciative of you guys for doing all of that and
to travel the whole way that you did, you know, And it's my
opinion that every lead should be followed, every lead should be followed. There's
been several times in my big footing career that everybody else was telling me,
now, don't worry about that, there's nothing to see there that's fake or
that person blah blah blah, this and that, and I find that,
generally speaking, very often these people are incorrect incorrect about that stuff. I
was told to completely ignore the Bossburg incident, for example, for our listeners,
don't worry about that, there's nothing there, and I completely found that
that was inaccurate. That was inaccurate. That was just you know, sour
grapes from one investigator to the whole situation. I remember I'm finding Bigfoot.
There was a photograph that was taken in Vermont. I think it was during
our White Hall, New York episode that was brought to our town hall meeting.
This young gentleman named Ian got this video or got this photograph rather,
and Matt and Bobo and Renee were all kind of just saying, no,
that's fake, don't worry about that. But when I went out there,
I said, well, if it's fake, the guy's seven feet tall.
So again, every lead should be followed, so even and you know what,
if this was in Virginia, I wouldn't have flown out there. But
this was an organ you know, And I see this as my responsibility.
I'm in a very blessed position where Bigfoot is my is my life, you
know, it's my existence, It's it's the way I make make a living
with the museum, et cetera. And this is my obligation to the subject
to follow up on every scenario that I can like this. And you know
what, it was cold, it sucked. It was cold and wet all
day long, and it was a really interesting investigation. And unfortunately, as
Kelly mentioned, we could not get the comparison shot because we couldn't see the
other side of the valley unfortunately. And I had everything lined up, you
know, I all those all the branches in the trees. They kind of
act like gun sights in a way, like when this crosses this and you
know you're in the right area. I found pretty much exactly within like an
inch or two of where the camera needed to be to get the same shot,
and the fog never lifted. It was so aggravating. Stay tuned for
more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo will be right back after these messages.
Early in the day, when the fog did lift just enough to see
across. Even in that foggy condition, I could see that Keith, my
partner there, was wearing clothing. I could see his face, I could
see his hands. I could see that his pants were a different color than
his jacket. I could see all those things quite easily. But yet you're
telling me, and your daughter told me, I believe that the thing was
one color. Had the toe absolutely now see. And I did get a
chance to see Keith across on the mountain side just a little bit before he
had it up, and I could clearly see him, like his head,
I could see his arms, his jacket, I could make his pants out.
It looked, you know, just like a clothed human. And another
thing that stuck out to me is he had a black coat on. But
the black coat that he was wearing, you know, pure black. It
felt like it it kind of like blended in just a little bit with like
the backside of it. It didn't like pop out like the figure did in
my footage. The black was so prominent in eye catching, and then with
Keith up there with his black on, it just wasn't the same. Interesting,
Now, with one of the things you mentioned to me, and I'd
like you to speak to if you could, are the proportions of the figure.
Okay, Now again I'm not convinced it's a sasquatch, but I'm not
certainly not convinced it's a human either. I lean a little bit more heavily
towards the sasquatch side of this argument, honestly, especially after having been there.
But what were the differences in your mind, in your eye because you
got to see the thing in person, and that's a huge difference. Cameras
are only so good and they're great nowadays, but they're not nearly as good
as what you can see with your naked eye. I know you briefly mentioned
some things earlier, but can you really go deep into the things that you
saw with your naked eye about the shape of the figure, maybe the proportions,
the way it moved, any of that sort of stuff to give us
the best painting you can with words of what you personally observed with your eye
outside of the video. Right. Yeah, Like I had previously mentioned,
it was completely black, just like head to toe. Couldn't really make out
clothing typestyle, you know, it was just pure black. The arms seemed
very long. That was one of the things that I had noticed, because
before I started recording it, it was moving and I could see the arms
and they just they felt long, like almost to like your knees, if
you will, And they swayed like as you can also see in the video
when they turn, they kind of have like a sway motion, and so
that stuck out to me as well. But yeah, so I also had
noticed, like with the long arms, the word that came to my mind
was more beastly. It was more beastly than it was human, and meaning
like the chest portions, like where the shoulder, like between the shoulders was
just super wide. I remember that one just being very wide and again beastly
looking. The head did seem a bit smaller. It was harder to see
compared to like the body. The body to me just felt like it was
massive, and looking back or when I was thinking about it, I'm like,
it had to have been very huge for it to stick out the way
that it was sticking out to me that day to see it at you know,
the distance that it actually was. So the body was just beastly,
very wide. The leg portions didn't seem as long as like the body portions
did, like like the upper torso part seemed longer than what the leg length
would have been as well. Now, what about the way it moved,
because we only get to see a few seconds of it moving and it's kind
of moving its way uphill and by the way having been like again, we
couldn't find the exact spot it was, so we didn't find footprints. And
you know what, it had rained too, right since that Thursday, between
Thursday and Monday when I got there, right, it was raining a lot,
and at one point it did snow oh gee, yeah, So any
footprints that were there were probably kind of washed out because that hillside. I
know that, you know you took pictures of the ground there saying that the
ground's too hard for footprints, But that hillside was made out of different stuff
that there were amp There were ample opportunities for footprints up on the hill.
But again if it was raining and even some snow, then they would have
been washed out. Although Keith did find two large impressions next to each other
that seemed to be about the right shape and size. We can I can
certainly put those out for our members. Remind me, Matt, and I'll
send you those the pictures to put out, not saying that they're footprints,
but I can't say that they're not. There's their space. Appropriately. They
had the right shape, the right size, especially on this that slope,
because that slope, I'll tell you is no joke. Having been up there,
it is a different world up on top of that hill from where this
thing was walking. Now, I couldn't find the exact spot within like two
or ten feet or something like that, but I was up there, and
then Keith went up there after me, because I better picture on my phone
I could place him better had I been able to see him. But Keith
got much closer to the location than I did. I think I was about
fifty yards away from where it was eventually ended up being, and that that's
based on me being up there figuring where the hell could this have been,
you know, and then going down later and seeing where I was based on
the landmarks I could see compared to where it should have been, you know,
framed in the trees there, because again I found exactly pretty much where
the camera needed to be to place the person correctly had we been able to
see them at the place. So I think I was probably about fifty yards
away, but Keith, I think was quite close. I think he was
much closer than that, probably twenty five yards or more or something like that,
which is maybe why he found those impressions. I don't know. But
it is no joke up there. It is very steep. It's it's a
legit forty five degree angle for most of it, and some of it is
steeper and some of it is less steep, but it's like legit fifty percent
slope a forty five degree angle, and it's muddy, not super deep mud,
but it's plenty of mud that you can slip on, and the rocks
up there are quite slippery as well because they're very very wet and moss covered,
Which is why I go back to, I don't feel that the subject
was moving in a clumsy manner. I think that it was just navigating a
very tricky hillside. Now, Kelly, you got to see this thing move
a lot more than any of us did, because we only have what's in
the video. How did it move maybe compared to the way human moves,
or how did it move in general, and I even compared to anything,
how did it move? What I saw before started filming is almost about the
same thing. The drides of it were very long. That is one thing
that did catch my attention when it goes to like take a step like I
don't know if you could see it in the video, but what I could
see personally, the step up that it took was actually quite huge. So
that was another thing that you know, stuck out of weirdly moving because as
to me, humans, you know, you don't take that big of a
stride, even when we're hiking or climbing, and so it was kind of
just doing what was already in the video, it would it was down just
a little bit further before I started recording it. It took its step up,
but then it would freeze in between, like it would move and then
it would freeze. And when I say freeze, like it just stops and
it kind of you can slowly see it just straighten itself to where it's like
completely straight, and it sits like that for a minute, and then it'll
go again and kind of, you know, take another step up because it's
in the video, and before that looked like it's like climbing the mountain,
like it's trying to make its way out of there. Could you tell if
it ever turned and faced you or was it always just cruising away from you?
So when I said it was just looking at us, in the footage,
you can hear me say, like, it's just looking at us,
like it's weird. I could see like the body stayed, but it's almost
like the shoulders and like the head like turned and went like towards me.
And when it did that, it was just like an immediate feeling like I
know it's looking at me. And then again during that footage, I thought
it was a person, but I had that sensation that they were, you
know, looking at me. So I didn't want to be, you know,
weird filming them, so I just stopped filming. But I did feel
like it would the upper half would like turn and it would look at me
like I knew it knew that I was there. When it did that,
you specifically mentioned it turned its shoulders and head towards you. Yes, Now
in the video it kind of looks like something was in its hand. Did
you notice carrying anything? No, So that's the thing that I was trying
to figure out as well, because looking with you know, when I was
looking at it, it did not look as if it was holding anything whatsoever.
So then when I was breaking down the footage a little bit more,
I noticed, like when it climbs up and it kind of turns, it
does look like there's something being held in the left hand side. And so
I'm breaking down the video more and more because looking at it, you know,
like with the naked eye there, it wasn't holding anything. And so
breaking down the video I got it to where like right before it climbs up,
you can see both of its arms and there's nothing there. The next
step is like the next frame over is you know when it kind of turns
and then you can see like that weird almost like round shape coming from the
left hand side. I have no idea what that could have been or you
know what could have made that type of shape. Yeah, it's interesting.
So it almost like a like there's an extension of the hand it's holding something
that's holding. But at the same time, I don't see it in every
frame. It makes me wonder if that's just some sort of pixelated noise,
or if that's some sort of artifact perhaps in the foreground, because getting to
the scene and locating the trees and specifically that little window, that rectangular window
that you captured the figure through between all the branches, was pretty difficult.
And the reason it was difficult is because in your footage you did a good
job focusing pretty much on the animal or the figure at least it washes out
to all the four ground branches and noise. There were quite a few smaller
branches in between you and the figure that just you don't see very well in
the footage because it's focused at such a distance. And I'm wondering if maybe
some of the abnormalities, some of the noise that we see on the figure
is just an artifact from these fore ground obstructions. But I don't know that.
Unfortunately, there's a lot I don't know about this video. This was
taken at Harris Park, of course, and even though I couldn't find we
couldn't place somebody in the exact position because of the fog. I do I
know generally where it is. You can see in the upper left hand corner
there's a kind of a bushy shaped tree. That tree is actually rather large,
just at least twenty feet tall, by the way, but it's to
the left of the figure. There's another darker patch that's a rose patch.
There's a bunch of wild roses out there with a lot of rose hips on
them, I might add that's one of the things I noticed while I was
walking around. Rose Hips are a food item, and they are rich in
vitamin C, and they are there, and most of them are pretty old,
but there's certainly enough you can be snacking on. So I thought that
was interesting as well. So you can see those two features in the video
itself. So we know very approximately where the figure was walking, and using
Google Earth Google Maps specifically, that distance is somewhere between eight hundred and one
thousand feet horizontally from where you were now. Of course, is also quite
a bit higher than where you were as well, so there's some trigonometry going
on here. But I think it's pretty safe to say that is, you
know, three football fields approximately away nine hundre feed or so, give or
take a little bit. It's not that not really that far. And oddly
enough, the Roseberg footage was three hundred and three yards, which is pretty
much exactly the exactly the same distance, oddly enough, so I've got a
couple of things to compare to here. But the direction it was traveling,
there's nothing. Have you looked at the map, Kelly, Have you seen
what's out there? I actually have not a whole lot of nothing. That's
what I was assuming. I just figured after the initial mountains you see right,
there is just more and more and more mountains pretty much, you have
quite a ways to go, even before you run across a two track road.
Actually, I don't know if it was a person, and again maybe
it is. Maybe it is a person, but I don't know if it
was a person, what in the world were they doing, I wonder,
And where did they come from. That's exactly my thoughts. I have no
idea where they would have came from, because there was nobody below. There
was no other cars there. It was just my daughter and I that I
could see, and year round there was no anybody else like back on the
river side. It was literally just my daughter and I and the figure on
the mountain side. And I really don't know what they would be doing there,
you know, as like a human like, what their intentions would be
just standing there on that hillside that day, Yeah, or actually walking away
on the hillside, like walking away from the park, away from the river
to where there's nothing. I guess the only thing that I would even can
make sense to me at all is and all I'm going to get on the
top of this ridge. But why there? I don't get it. I
just don't get it. And they put it in some context here. We
mentioned that where Kelly got this footage was at the end of the road.
That's kind of true. It's the end of the road because there's a gate
there, But the road does go past the gate. It goes another maybe
one hundred and fifty two hundred yards past the gate and then goes into the
river. Because the road was washed out by the south fork the walla walla
river. The road does not exist there. It continues on the other side
of the wash out, though, So to get there, I don't think
you came down, but Keith came down. He actually filmed me trying to
navigate this. The road goes into the river and at that point there's like
a rock wall on the right hand side, and the river's on the left
here, and the river is pushing against that rock wall. I had to
climb that rock wall and kind of hug it with a camera in my hand.
On my addicts, I filmed all this. I had to hug that
rock wall and kind of shimmy along above the river. The rock wall's probably
twenty five thirty feet, maybe maybe a little bit more, but something like
that, maybe forty feet, And so I had to go on the slippery
rock wall above the river and then go to the road on the other side.
And actually I couldn't even make it that far. At some point,
about ten feet shy of the road, I had to drop down off the
rock wall and walk through the river. And mind you, I saw my
car thermometer. It was thirty four degrees at that time. You know,
it probably wasn't that same that you know the previous Thursday when you were there,
But that's what I had to go through to get to the other side
of this road wash out. From there, I continued further up and there's
a bridge, luckily, that crosses the south fork of the Walla Walla River
just before the Walla Walla River trailhead. There's a there's a bathroom facility there,
there's a trailhead facility, there's parking and all that stuff. Nobody was
there when I was there, but okay, so people out there going,
okay, well there's a trail. Could it be a person? Absolutely could
be a person, just seems unlikely. There the trail does go back.
Most of the Walla Walla River trail is actually further upstream because as you're looking
at the figure, the creek is flow or the river is flowing from right
to left, so all this stuff is way to the right basically, So
the trail goes upstream, mostly from the trailhead, but there is a small
section of the trail that goes downstream, and that is what I took to
get down to the area to start trying to locate where this thing may have
been standing. Even from and when I was on that trail by the way,
I found a human bootmark. I found a couple of bootmarks, but
they were old, they were washed out, relatively speaking, so it could
have been the last couple of days, maybe even the previous Thursday. I
don't know. I don't think that it goes that far back, but it's
possible at least. But where I found them, it turns out, was
past where the figure was, probably another two or three hundred yards or more
past for the figure, because I overshot the entire area, because I don't
know how many people in our listening audience have ever done an on site recreation,
but it is very difficult. It's actually a lot more difficult than I
ever thought before I started doing this on a regular basis. To find where
the figure was is very difficult from the position of the videographer, let alone
from the position of the figure itself. So I way overshot it, and
that's where I found the boot marks heading further downstreams so I don't know.
I guess it could have been a person. Maybe that was the bootmarks of
the person in the I don't know, But from there I had to go
upwards. I had to go uphill on this crazy slope that varied between like
you know, well, forty five degree you give or take fifteen degrees all
the way up, and it had to be at least another two hundred or
three hundred feet above the trail itself to get where the figure is. When
I was up in that area, I didn't see any boot marks. I
didn't see any sign of humans tromping around. I found a lot of deer
marks, deer in elk prints were abundant, deer scat I found their bedding
sites. And one of the things that struck me being up on that hillside
that is hard to appreciate where you were Kelly down on the roadway is the
variety of markings and features on the hillside, because when you look at the
video, you say, oh, there's some dark marks and it looks like
a big open hillside, It absolutely isn't. There are rocky outcropping all over
the place up there. It looks like there's hardly any trees on the hillside,
which also isn't true. There are quite a few small trees and some
pretty big groves of trees to the right of where you see the figure in
the video, there's actually a really big tree grove that probably had fifty or
more trees in it, some of which are like forty fifty sixty feet tall,
and there's bushes down and there. So when you told me that the
figure disappeared, I said, I wonder what it's like up there. And
sure enough, there is more than ample opportunity for any a person, let
alone a sasquatch, to hide themselves and never be seen by you down there.
I thought that was a very very interesting feature. I guess to the
video that you added, it's like it just totally disappeared. How could that
be true? And I'm sure the paranormal people say, you know why,
Cliff, because they jumped into their inter dimensional UFO writing portals and disappeared.
So well, I guess you could say that or just hid among the stuff
that was on the hillside, because there was a whole lot of that up
there that you just can't really make out in the video. Stay tuned for
more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo. We'll be right back after these
messages. So that the investigation I think was fruitful. I learned a lot
about the video itself. I couldn't do the comparison photographs as I intended.
Maybe I can get up there again and before the leaves come on the tree
and try it again. But it was a long day. I mean,
it was nine hours in the car after all, and gas isn't cheap,
as we all know. But still, I mean, maybe I can get
up there again for some other reason and drop by and do that comparison shot.
I'd love to do it. But you know, Kelly, I didn't
tell you this. I don't think I had a chance to speak to you
until now. Since then, when I got back to work on Tuesday,
I was told that somebody called the museum to warn me about your footage.
Now I don't know who this person is and if they left the name,
my employees didn't give it to me, etc. But somebody called the museum.
I want to warncliffe about that footage. I saw that footage years ago,
and it's a hoax and all this other stuff. And I say,
well, that's odd because the time stamp on this woman's phone says it was
last Thursday at like twelve eighteen or something like that. And nothing personal,
Kelly. But I don't know if you're savvy enough to manipulate the time stamp
on your video and your iPhone fifteen. So it's kind of a weird thing,
you know. Did you get any blowback like that from the Bigfoot community.
I absolutely did. I heard quite a bit of things. That is.
One of the things that I did here too, is I've seen this
footage before from I think they said it was from like Call. The footage
was out of Colorado, and there was so many going on about, Oh,
it's just the girlfriend's boyfriend that's up there, this is just a hoax.
I could clearly see blonde hair and overalls and like you name it.
It was probably said. There was a lot of pushback by that. But
at the same time, you know, I just blew it off because I
know as I was there, I know when it was filmed. As you
said, it is time stamped on my phone, and with those you can
see the exact location that I was standing in too. A lot of that
was just a little bit lappable, but there was a lot of pushback with
it. Yeah, you'll find no shortage of that unfortunately, in and amongst
the Sasquatch community, you know, and as a good example, Very often
people will analyze the Patterson Gimlin film and say, oh, well, there
seems to be the suggestion of muscle movement. And people will say, oh,
you can't possibly see that. There's not enough clarity. It's impossible to
know. And then in a video that's digital as yours is where it gets
pixelated, those same skeptics, oh, I can clearly see blonde hair,
or can clearly It's like, no, you can't. You can't clearly see
any of those things. Et Sol, I'm sorry to hear that you had
to deal with that, but you're in good company. I imagine a lot
of people are coming off as experts about your footage. I don't know if
you have you been paying attention at all. I have not, because I'm,
as far as I know, I'm the only person who's been to the
site and spoken to you. I'm certainly Keith and I are the only people
who have been to the site with you. So it seems to me that
most of everybody else's opinion doesn't really matter at this point. But it seems
like a lot of people are coming off as experts. Is that true?
Yes, absolutely, you guys are the only ones that I have gone to
the site with there are a lot out there that I would hear given my
experience that when I've seen these a few times in my life. The arms
aren't long. This isn't you know, the strides aren't this. You could
clearly see that they're wearing a coat, and they would go on about like
how their experience played into my experience and why my experience wasn't legitimate because of
their experience. If that makes sense, your sentence makes sense, but their
idea of that makes no sense to me at all, you know what I
mean. Yeah. One of the things Cliff and I talked about that I've
just seen over and over again from investigating pieces of multimedia evidence like this is
that the more you can see, actually, the more sort of pushback that
you'll get. People tend to favor, especially like certain sasquatch proponents, less
informational bits of evidence, because then it has more blank space for them to
fill in the blanks with the contents of their imagination or the things that they
want to see. And so very often as you see more detail, like
the way something moves, it doesn't comport with their sort of fantasy, and
so they'll go, oh, well, that's not how I think it should
move, and therefore it can't be real when none of us know exactly how
a sasquatch can or would or should move. So again, sorry to hear
that you've experienced that, But once again you're in good company because everyone who's
managed to get some sort of evidence it has to deal with these same pushbacks
if like that doesn't comport with my fantasy of what a sasquat should do,
and therefore it can't be real. Yeah, yeah, And then of course
everybody has witnesses are a weird mix here because you mentioned like that didn't move
or appear or have this like the one I saw did their four years isn't
real to me. That's just everybody that says somebody saying look at me,
look at me, look at me. And then that's the problem with the
big cook community today. And in my opinion, everybody is out there saying
look at me, instead of saying, let's look at the animals. That's
where the attention should be. In my opinion, it's not about you.
It's not about I mean, I hate to say it. Your video is
not about you, Kelly. You know, like my museum isn't about me,
Cliff, It's about the animals, and that's where the focus should be.
And they there's a wide variety of animals and not all everyone's going to
look the same or have the same you know, features, and they shouldn't
be expected to. Because that's the big takeaway. And I've said I've said
this one hundred times at least, that the big takeaway from my experience on
the show Finding Bigfoot, which ran for eight what nine years? Eight nine
years, I've been to all over the world looking for these things. My
number one takeaway is that bigfoots don't give a damn about your expectations. They
just do what they do and they're not going to conform to what you think
or anybody thinks. And I think to come out and say, well,
your video doesn't match what I expect, therefore it's wrong, that's just a
weird that's a very weird form of arrogance. Yeah, I think it'd be
worth saying that, you know, if someone were truly skeptical, if you
know people who want to dismiss bits of video or even cynical about it,
where they just have like an arbitrary commitment to saying that something can't be real.
It's like, well, if you were truly skeptical, then you'd be
skeptical of your own certainty, Like what makes you so sure that your hypothetical
model of what a sasquat should be like is correct? But people very often
don't take those steps. So it is again unfortunate to hear that you had
to deal with those sorts of they're not even rebuttals, they're just noise.
So sorry you were bombarded by that kind of noise. No, it's so
good. It's to me almost to be expected in a way. I just
kind of compare this to like the paranormal, where you know you're going to
have those people who absolutely believe, and if you even if you catch it
on footage, you know there's going to be those ones that believe, there's
going to be those ones that absolutely do not, and you know, try
to think of every logical reason of why this isn't the way that it really
is. So it was easy for me just to ignore those, you know,
all the negative that came with it. Yeah, then you start to
make sense of how could it be that these animals are real and haven't been
recognized? And then you have to deal with the people who are quote unquote
trying to discover them, and you see the way they conduct themselves and you
go, oh, it's no wonder these people haven't figured it out yet.
Yeah. Well, Kelly, first of all, congratulations on getting a really
interesting clip. Is it a bigfoot? Is it a human? I mean,
honestly, we don't know. We don't know. I think even at
this point you don't know either. But I'll tell you I am much much
more strongly leaning towards a sasquatch now that I have spoken at length to you,
this is our third lengthy conversation, and also been to the site not
only where you took the shots, but also where the figure was approximately.
I've been up in that general area, and I am much more inclined to
be very open to this being a sasquatch. In fact, I kind of
think it probably is at this point, but you know, it's hard to
come down. Then. This isn't TV where the producers are going to say,
clip, come on, be more firm. So no, no,
this is the truth. I think it very well could be a sasquatch.
Is it? I don't know, never, probably never will know. I
was hoping to get up to the exact location and find footprints, but we
couldn't get to the spot. We couldn't because of the fog, We couldn't
nail down exactly where that was. I didn't and across any impressions of sasquatch
or human up there, although Keith did find something interesting and we'll share that
with our members. But yeah, congratulations on an interesting piece of footage.
And also, thank you so much. I cannot say this enough. Thank
you so much for sparing so much time out of your busy schedule. I
mean, you have a job, you have children, you have to contend
with, you have a life, and but yet you've taken several hours of
your life not only to speak to me on the phone and to speak me
on the podcast, but also to meet me at the location itself, to
walk me through and point things out and share your insights at the site itself.
I cannot thank you enough for that. I really really do appreciate it.
You've done everything above and beyond your call of duty, the call of
duty to shed light on this situation. So thank you, thank you,
thank you. Yeah, well, thank you guys so much. I really
appreciate you guys taking the time out and you know, listening to me,
and you making those phone calls with me as well, and taking your time
to drive over here. And it's been a really great experience with you guys,
and I truly appreciate everything of it. So thank you very much.
Hey, Kelly, I'm gonna give you a really fun opportunity here. I
don't think when I talk to you at the site, you mentioned you had
never heard the podcast before. But at the end of every episode, Bobo,
who have you seen the Finding Bigfoot show or not? I don't,
I don't remember. I've seen a few episodes. Yes, okay, Well,
Bobo's the big guy, right, that guy. At the end of
every single episode, he tells our listeners, he thanks everybody, so thank
you for listening, and he says, keep it squatchy. Would you like
to do that in the in your best Bobo imitation? Okay, I'll give
that a shot. Thank you guys for tuning in with us this week.
Keep it Squatchy very nice, It was uncanny. Thanks for listening to this
week's episode of Bigfoot NB. If you liked what you heard, please rate
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