WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.600 --> 00:00:06.120 Hello, skeptics. Nebraska preacher HAYK. Kunneman's latest fundraising twists involves an urgent 2 00:00:06.240 --> 00:00:10.560 plea to buy land for his ministry, claiming divine guidance. Initially seeking three 3 00:00:10.599 --> 00:00:14.919 million dollars within a week, Kunneman later back pedal, citing divine advice that 4 00:00:15.000 --> 00:00:19.359 the purchase wasn't necessary. The abrupt change left many wondering about his true intentions. 5 00:00:19.480 --> 00:00:23.320 While some may find this tale amusing, it's a concerning example of religious 6 00:00:23.320 --> 00:00:28.000 grifting, with Kunneman's congregation of potentially being taken advantage of for his financial gain. 7 00:00:28.160 --> 00:00:32.399 This articles untitled a preacher or urge his church to donate three million dollars, 8 00:00:32.560 --> 00:00:36.399 then he changed his story from the Friendly Atheists by Him and Meta Publish 9 00:00:36.399 --> 00:00:40.039 September eleven, twenty twenty three. Now, I'm sure you have a take 10 00:00:40.119 --> 00:00:43.200 on this, Jimmy, let's hear it. Yeah. I think this is 11 00:00:43.240 --> 00:00:48.719 just said and it's more of the same grifting from religious organizations and so called 12 00:00:48.799 --> 00:00:52.759 leaders that we've seen so many times before. First of all, my question 13 00:00:52.880 --> 00:00:57.159 is why do people accept this kind of thing from religious leaders? Would they 14 00:00:57.200 --> 00:01:00.640 accept it from their friends, or their sibling or their employer? I mean, 15 00:01:00.960 --> 00:01:04.879 all I would need is one eye opener in which I realized I had 16 00:01:06.280 --> 00:01:10.680 been conned or stolen from, and not only would I cease to ever trust 17 00:01:10.719 --> 00:01:15.280 that person again, but it would force me to further question all future endeavors 18 00:01:15.319 --> 00:01:19.640 that are even remotely similar to that one. We see this all the time 19 00:01:19.680 --> 00:01:23.640 too, in cases of child abuse. I mean, would not one child 20 00:01:23.680 --> 00:01:27.040 abuse at any of our kids or excuse me one one example of child abuse 21 00:01:27.079 --> 00:01:32.599 at any of our children's daycare forced the place to close most likely, but 22 00:01:32.680 --> 00:01:36.560 not at a church? Right? We keep giving these people money, and 23 00:01:36.640 --> 00:01:38.920 I honestly feel sorry for the kind of people that not only fall for this, 24 00:01:40.079 --> 00:01:42.840 but don't recognize that they've been taken advantage of. And when it comes 25 00:01:42.879 --> 00:01:48.959 to this guy asking for three million dollars and then all of a sudden, 26 00:01:49.200 --> 00:01:53.159 what God just changed his mind? Or was he wrong? One thing is 27 00:01:53.200 --> 00:01:57.799 for sure there are some very desperate and mentally abused people who have obviously suffered 28 00:01:57.840 --> 00:02:01.439 some harsh indoctrination or feel they have no other options, who just give a 29 00:02:01.480 --> 00:02:05.879 lot of money to a conn on it. I think that's where I want 30 00:02:05.920 --> 00:02:08.599 to stop now or for now, I want to see what Kelly's thoughts are 31 00:02:08.599 --> 00:02:13.439 on that. You know, you mentioned what kind of what kind was God 32 00:02:13.520 --> 00:02:15.639 wrong about the real estate deal? I get it made me wonder too. 33 00:02:15.639 --> 00:02:20.719 I started thinking about that, what kind of real estate deal would be so 34 00:02:20.800 --> 00:02:23.800 bad that even God couldn't fix it, that even God had to pull out 35 00:02:23.800 --> 00:02:27.719 of it. I mean, it's only three million dollars, what's that the 36 00:02:27.759 --> 00:02:30.960 God? That's just the pittance right to the Supreme Make look at Rome. 37 00:02:30.280 --> 00:02:34.719 Three million dollars is just a pittance. I think we can all see that, 38 00:02:34.879 --> 00:02:37.599 you know. So what was wrong with the property? Was there like 39 00:02:37.639 --> 00:02:40.439 an open gate to Hell? What was going on it was? Was there 40 00:02:40.520 --> 00:02:45.400 something? Was it full of rusty old iron chariots and God couldn't get rid 41 00:02:45.439 --> 00:02:47.400 of them? What was going on there? I just I have so many 42 00:02:47.479 --> 00:02:51.800 questions about it, and I think we all know what actually happened. Was 43 00:02:52.000 --> 00:02:54.479 he I think he was only able to raise one point two million, was 44 00:02:54.520 --> 00:02:58.759 what the deal was, and so, you know, because he didn't get 45 00:02:58.800 --> 00:03:00.319 the money he needed, it was really it turned out to be a bad 46 00:03:00.360 --> 00:03:04.680 deal. I think that's what it was more about than anything else. So 47 00:03:05.479 --> 00:03:09.280 I'm sure it's something that he'd like to say about this instead of just introducing 48 00:03:09.280 --> 00:03:12.680 the story. I can see the smoke coming out of his heres. What 49 00:03:12.719 --> 00:03:15.560 do you got for us, infidelp Well, you know, I have to 50 00:03:15.599 --> 00:03:20.439 say that Hank's messages appeared to be keep on believing, don't let your eyes 51 00:03:20.520 --> 00:03:23.479 and your brain deceive you. If it seems I'm wrong, God's testing you. 52 00:03:23.759 --> 00:03:28.479 Just keep on giving. And of course there might be a side of 53 00:03:28.680 --> 00:03:32.479 real estate laws complicated even for God. Well, I also had to wonder 54 00:03:32.520 --> 00:03:36.360 what he spikes the communion wine with. You know, I did watch the 55 00:03:36.439 --> 00:03:39.080 ninety minute video where they pimped out for their land offering, and I got 56 00:03:39.120 --> 00:03:43.840 to admit it, it was pretty painful. Even in two X it's a 57 00:03:43.840 --> 00:03:46.719 little more than a ninety minute infomercial in front of a live studio audience. 58 00:03:46.800 --> 00:03:51.039 I couldn't help but think people got up Sunday morning to go to church for 59 00:03:51.120 --> 00:03:55.400 that. But I do wonder if it's a little bit judgmental to notice the 60 00:03:55.439 --> 00:04:00.680 cost of the jewelry that they paraded around by the servants of God and you 61 00:04:00.719 --> 00:04:02.639 know, doing all they could for God. And you know, maybe it 62 00:04:02.719 --> 00:04:06.080 was a little judgmental, But I'm okay with that, you know. And 63 00:04:06.240 --> 00:04:12.120 you know, God giving his prophets, prophecies with right wing propaganda build into 64 00:04:12.199 --> 00:04:15.040 it. You know, beware the Chinese and their conniving ways being used by 65 00:04:15.079 --> 00:04:18.399 the devil to buy the land. Yeah, I think you're right, Kelly. 66 00:04:18.480 --> 00:04:21.319 I think it had more to do with not being able to raise the 67 00:04:21.399 --> 00:04:26.040 funds. But the truth is, you know, using an ACME product might 68 00:04:26.079 --> 00:04:30.000 have actually increased the believability of the act. It really was that bad. 69 00:04:30.120 --> 00:04:32.920 Now when it comes to prophecies, as you said, is his connection to 70 00:04:32.959 --> 00:04:36.360 God is more than a little faulties. He's flewing and screwing up in many 71 00:04:36.399 --> 00:04:41.160 areas. God, his God, says one thing, then Hank says he 72 00:04:41.240 --> 00:04:45.040 said something else. Entirely Oftentimes they're both wrong. You know, Hank's not 73 00:04:45.160 --> 00:04:48.279 new to the shifting con game. God routinely changes his mind and hank world. 74 00:04:48.360 --> 00:04:51.959 You know, Hank's rendition of the Christian God is more like Loki the 75 00:04:53.040 --> 00:04:56.560 Tricks. Maybe that's the cell you, Hanks. God is about as decisive 76 00:04:56.600 --> 00:04:59.720 as a three year old in a candy store who knew that God was the 77 00:05:00.000 --> 00:05:03.319 O gas lights is ridiculous, Jerry. Yeah, I'm so glad that you 78 00:05:03.439 --> 00:05:08.720 brought up God living in Hank's world because this is not the first time that 79 00:05:08.800 --> 00:05:11.759 God has changed his mind when it comes to Kuneman. By the way, 80 00:05:12.120 --> 00:05:15.720 in twenty twenty one, Kuneman claimed that after God told him that Donald Trump 81 00:05:15.720 --> 00:05:21.199 would win the twenty twenty election, God then changed his mind informing Kuneman in 82 00:05:20.600 --> 00:05:26.160 a November fourth dream this is twenty twenty, that Joe Biden, who was 83 00:05:26.199 --> 00:05:29.800 actually the devil, would win. God wanted people to think that the prophets 84 00:05:29.800 --> 00:05:32.720 were wrong and that God was off working out the issue on his own time. 85 00:05:32.839 --> 00:05:36.399 At June eleventh, twenty one, article by Newsweek by Jason Lemon, 86 00:05:36.600 --> 00:05:42.439 Christian prophet claims God didn't restore Trump yet to make people doubt prophecy. So 87 00:05:42.480 --> 00:05:45.720 why is God such a trickster? I thought he wanted people to believe in 88 00:05:45.800 --> 00:05:47.480 him and avoid going to Hell. Well, I don't believe in God and 89 00:05:47.519 --> 00:05:51.759 I don't believe Kuneman. The Vatican has three point nine billion dollars and a 90 00:05:51.759 --> 00:05:56.920 bulletproof popemobile. Maybe Ken is it Ken? I'm sorry? Did I get 91 00:05:56.959 --> 00:06:00.560 the name wrong? Hank Kuneman? Yeah, maybe Hanks should be asking for 92 00:06:00.600 --> 00:06:04.600 more since his meager seven hundred thousand dollars net worth that he can from his 93 00:06:04.680 --> 00:06:09.720 congregation is obviously not enough for him, particularly when it comes to Christian preachers. 94 00:06:09.759 --> 00:06:13.759 Compared to Kenneth Copeland's three hundred million dollar fortune and Joel Austin's one hundred 95 00:06:13.759 --> 00:06:16.920 million dollar fortune, this is honestly just sad, terribly unfortunate. It reflects 96 00:06:17.000 --> 00:06:20.839 the worst of us as people, and those of us who become predators that 97 00:06:20.920 --> 00:06:25.319 target the weak and vulnerable, which is how religion thrives. I mean, 98 00:06:25.399 --> 00:06:30.040 this whole thing is about this congregation wanting to give this guy money so that 99 00:06:30.120 --> 00:06:32.160 he can build a better church and use this land to do God's work. 100 00:06:32.279 --> 00:06:36.000 But if they're in such plight, why couldn't God just help them through that? 101 00:06:36.079 --> 00:06:40.399 Why did he have to hire a grifter to collect money then to change 102 00:06:40.439 --> 00:06:44.199 his mind? And I will say on a lighter note, I recently bought 103 00:06:44.199 --> 00:06:47.439 a house in New York and it was hell okay, it was the challenge 104 00:06:47.439 --> 00:06:51.360 of my lifetime. And I think maybe God was behind the sale because he 105 00:06:51.399 --> 00:06:56.800 would have to be with his bad real estate advice. Kelly, take it 106 00:06:56.839 --> 00:07:00.000 home, you know, yeah, there, you set a lot there, 107 00:07:00.120 --> 00:07:03.160 and I agree with most of it. One of the things that I noticed 108 00:07:03.199 --> 00:07:05.839 too in the speech, and I don't know if you guys picked up on 109 00:07:05.879 --> 00:07:10.480 it, But did anybody pick up on the racism in the speech? I'm 110 00:07:10.519 --> 00:07:15.079 talking about the reference to China. Somehow it was bad that. I mean, 111 00:07:15.560 --> 00:07:18.800 it was like he was using China as the villain because some Chinese company 112 00:07:18.879 --> 00:07:23.519 wanted to buy the property and he had to keep the Chinese from owning this 113 00:07:23.600 --> 00:07:28.360 part of America for the good of God or something. And I was it 114 00:07:28.680 --> 00:07:32.040 really really came off racist, And I was wondering if if Hank Kunaman's God 115 00:07:32.199 --> 00:07:36.360 is racist and he doesn't like the Chinese, or maybe he just doesn't like 116 00:07:36.600 --> 00:07:41.839 the Chinese financing real estate. I'm not sure what was going on there, 117 00:07:41.879 --> 00:07:46.079 but Hank win straight there the Chinese are bad and they shouldn't known property. 118 00:07:46.120 --> 00:07:50.279 And I don't really think God cares who buys real estate, does he? 119 00:07:50.399 --> 00:07:56.560 I mean? Should he? Does God hate the Chinese like Hank Kunaman apparently 120 00:07:56.639 --> 00:08:00.399 doesn't a lot of us right wing followers do. I've got there's so much 121 00:08:00.439 --> 00:08:03.279 to talk about there, and I don't know because I don't talk to God 122 00:08:03.360 --> 00:08:07.439 like Kaye Koneman does, or does he really talk to God. You're gonna 123 00:08:07.439 --> 00:08:11.319 say something, Jimmy, I do. I do? And forgive me for 124 00:08:11.360 --> 00:08:13.600 stepping over you. I didn't mean to. No, no, no, 125 00:08:16.040 --> 00:08:22.120 But there is uh in recent months or recent years really some reporting that China 126 00:08:22.240 --> 00:08:28.079 has been intentionally buying real estate to place itself close to government buildings and US 127 00:08:28.079 --> 00:08:33.200 military bases. So so that is a theory, uh, And I wonder 128 00:08:33.279 --> 00:08:37.360 if he was just trying to relate it there. I just don't see the 129 00:08:37.360 --> 00:08:41.679 connection though. When he says Chinese, it was probably referring to the Chinese 130 00:08:41.720 --> 00:08:45.919 government, if that was indeed he was talking about. But I do believe 131 00:08:46.000 --> 00:08:48.360 that yes, delivered that way, there is an element of racism, and 132 00:08:48.440 --> 00:08:54.440 I don't I honestly, I don't think that his congregation probably minded considering you 133 00:08:54.440 --> 00:09:01.159 know, if I will my own biases towards I guess right wing Christian nationalists. 134 00:09:01.320 --> 00:09:05.159 I just have them pegged automatically as somewhat bigoted people. And I think 135 00:09:05.159 --> 00:09:09.360 that that you're right there. I would even bet that not only did they 136 00:09:09.399 --> 00:09:11.679 agree with them, that they would also agree that thinking that way isn't even 137 00:09:11.759 --> 00:09:16.720 racist. How would right you know? So yeah, yeah, that's the 138 00:09:16.799 --> 00:09:20.919 sad part is that they don't even they don't even recognize the racism when it's 139 00:09:20.919 --> 00:09:26.440 happening and I've experienced that with other right wing evangelicals in the past. It's 140 00:09:26.519 --> 00:09:30.360 kind of weird and sad in a lot of ways. So infidelity, you 141 00:09:30.360 --> 00:09:31.840 have something else you wanted to end you look like you did. Yeah, 142 00:09:33.000 --> 00:09:37.240 well, I've got to say that I think you're both are dead right on 143 00:09:37.279 --> 00:09:41.600 the racist aspect of this whole Chinese angle. It's just an easy sell. 144 00:09:41.960 --> 00:09:45.879 It's another one of those things that I think they're preconditioned to think, Okay, 145 00:09:45.919 --> 00:09:48.840 they're the enemy because you know, you talked about you didn't think God 146 00:09:48.879 --> 00:09:52.320 cared about you know what nationality bought something? Well, you know, churches 147 00:09:52.720 --> 00:09:56.720 for decades. Now you know, God bless America, God Bless America, 148 00:09:56.759 --> 00:10:01.519 America's special, America's you know, this city, shining city on a hill. 149 00:10:01.679 --> 00:10:07.879 They're all all these different things and and and all this historical racism that 150 00:10:07.919 --> 00:10:11.120 goes along with it. It's kind of like a pre big message. I 151 00:10:11.120 --> 00:10:13.039 mean, why why mess with what works? You know, Jimmy, you 152 00:10:13.080 --> 00:10:16.960 mentioned that you you pretty much presume a certain level of bigotry when you deal 153 00:10:18.000 --> 00:10:20.960 with, you know, evangelicals, and it's hard not to coming from that 154 00:10:22.000 --> 00:10:26.799 background and knowing where I came from, it's difficult to presuppose you're getting through 155 00:10:28.080 --> 00:10:31.320 because there's so much that you don't even realize that you're being conditioned to. 156 00:10:31.639 --> 00:10:35.320 It's not like you go, damn, you know, I hate these people 157 00:10:35.440 --> 00:10:39.200 or I don't like these people, or I'm better than these No, it's 158 00:10:39.279 --> 00:10:43.360 not that. It's the same thing about they're they're fine, but they anytime 159 00:10:43.399 --> 00:10:48.639 you start labeling anyone, they you start digging big holes. You know, 160 00:10:48.720 --> 00:10:52.320 you start saying, there's someone else. They're other. They're not us, 161 00:10:52.360 --> 00:10:56.720 they're not we, they're them. There's somebody other. And that's that's that's 162 00:10:56.759 --> 00:11:01.399 what he's appealing to here and and and unfortunately it's far too common, and 163 00:11:01.480 --> 00:11:05.639 it's something we see because it's such an easy draw, and it works time 164 00:11:05.679 --> 00:11:09.960 and time again. Oh they're going to do this. The devil's going to 165 00:11:09.039 --> 00:11:13.639 take this away. It doesn't matter how many false prophecies, you just need 166 00:11:13.679 --> 00:11:16.799 one that's right. Throw yourself an easy one out there, and hey, 167 00:11:16.840 --> 00:11:18.759 we'll see. He told us this was going to happen. So here it 168 00:11:18.840 --> 00:11:22.080 is. So forget the next twenty that are wrong, because you know what, 169 00:11:22.320 --> 00:11:26.759 it sounded good. It tickled our ears right now, And that's what 170 00:11:26.799 --> 00:11:33.039 I'm going with what feels good, and Jimmy not well said, I have 171 00:11:33.159 --> 00:11:35.200 nothing more to add on this, So I think this was a really good 172 00:11:35.200 --> 00:11:39.919 discussion and I appreciate both of you guys. Kelly, you thank you muted. 173 00:11:39.080 --> 00:11:43.440 Yeah, if I pulled the Johnny Pangel there, I don't have much 174 00:11:43.480 --> 00:11:48.159 to add either except that I totally agree with you that I don't understand how 175 00:11:48.320 --> 00:11:52.879 when when you somebody like Kuneman has put up a whole long list of failures 176 00:11:54.039 --> 00:11:56.799 that his followers still follow him, they still believe the things that he says, 177 00:11:56.799 --> 00:12:01.360 that he was still able to get one point two million dollars when he 178 00:12:01.399 --> 00:12:03.399 wanted it, when he asked for three. It just blows me away. 179 00:12:03.519 --> 00:12:05.960 You know, I felt you have something. Yeah, we know. One 180 00:12:05.960 --> 00:12:09.240 thing I did want to point out is and it is puzzling I think in 181 00:12:09.279 --> 00:12:13.159 some ways, at least on an intellectual basis, for all of us to 182 00:12:13.440 --> 00:12:16.200 understand why did they keep falling for the same thing over and over again. 183 00:12:16.440 --> 00:12:20.759 But the truth is is that we're starting with the religion that goes starts out 184 00:12:20.799 --> 00:12:26.240 with Jesus saying surely I come quickly. That's been two thousand years. So 185 00:12:26.480 --> 00:12:30.879 if you want to talk about being able to buy a line of goods. 186 00:12:31.080 --> 00:12:33.679 You know, let's start there. Sorry, Kelly, I just wanted to 187 00:12:33.720 --> 00:12:35.519 think, no, no, that don't know. Don't be sorry for jumping 188 00:12:35.559 --> 00:12:39.279 with that. That was fine, But yeah, that's I mean, that's 189 00:12:39.320 --> 00:12:43.600 the one that gets me. And we see it, not just Kooneman, 190 00:12:43.720 --> 00:12:48.320 but so many people that in the evangelical world that I just keep pulling that 191 00:12:48.399 --> 00:12:52.200 wool over the eyes of their followers over and over and over and over again, 192 00:12:52.399 --> 00:12:54.159 still getting away with it. I don't get it. I just don't, 193 00:12:54.320 --> 00:13:00.159 honestly don't understand it. But that's what it is. And this was 194 00:13:00.159 --> 00:13:03.000 a great talk. I really appreciated you guys being here with me. If 195 00:13:03.080 --> 00:13:07.840 you'd like to see more from the nonprofits, you can catch it right here.