Hello, and welcome to the show. I'm Martin Willish, your host.
Just a little bit of housekeeping here. Last week we had a lot of
callings and with Robert Powell, and because of that, I've got a lot
of email and I have to listen to my listeners. Basically what it boils
down to, So we're going to push the phone calls to the last half
hour of the show, and I'm sorry, we're just gonna for the people
I want to call in earlier. We're just going to have to leave it
at that and see how that goes. As far as getting a really good
question question for our guest. If you want to know who our upcoming guests
are, there's a couple different ways you can do that. You can subscribe
on our YouTube channel and click the little bell that'll give you notices. When
you're subscribing on you'll get an email that'll have that information and the stream up
there for anyone else. You can go to our website podcast ufo dot com
and enter your email into our sign up weekly guest notices and announcements, and
on Monday Monday mornings you will have the information for upcoming guests. Then for
that Tuesday and also I do post our upcoming guests on the website. And
I'd like to make an announcement to our wonderful repeat guest, Linda Zimmerman.
She is starting her own radio show on UFOs. It's called UFO Headquarters.
The first show will be on Monday, feverywhere eleventh at seven pm Eastern time,
and that's on the Hudson River Radio and you can listen on you can
listen live to the live stream over at Hudson River Radio dot com. So
check that. Outland has always been a great guest and she I'm sure it's
going to run a wonderful show, so you may want to check that out.
I do want to thank everyone that helps out with the show. It
really means a lot. It's the only way we can do that. And
if you'd like to become a subscriber and listen to the full shows on your
your podcast player, all you have to do is go to podcastufo dot com
and all that informations there. And again I thank all the people who have
already done that, and I do thank every listener and great people over at
YouTube and KGr Radio and the Dark Matter Digital Network, all of you.
Thank you all and we are ready to bring in Allaha, did I talk
about our guest? I don't think I did. Oh my goodness, Sam
Moronto. Repeat guests. Sam Moronto will be on and just a bit right
after, Alajundro and Alahundro, welcome to the show. Thank you very much.
It's great to be here. I'm glad to hear it. I'm glad
you made it. Boy, it was a tough one tonight. Yeah,
it gets complicated and sometimes these services we use do not participate with us.
Well, So anyway, how's everything going. Everything is going good. So
a lot of stuff going on. I'm just right now writing up my review
for the tonight's episode of Project blue Book. I know you've already seen it,
so we won't talk about that episode today, but maybe say that in
the future, so we don't do any spoilers. But it's an exciting and
interesting one, that's for sure. However, you know, just like we
talked about this last week, the last Project Blue Book show was really diverging
from reality. But what they did do was kind of incorporated these mythologies around
UFOs last times. The episode is about, you know, kind of the
Nazis and Nazi technology type of stuff that may have been brought over here by
German scientists when they were essentially brought here from Germany as part of Project paper
Clip, which was the name of the show. So they do at least
touch upon those things. However, Yeah, it does diverge greatly from reality.
And I guess I'll say, even though the title of this this tonight's
episode is food Fighters. You may agree, and I'd like to hear your
opinion, they don't come any closer back to reality in this next episode.
They get pretty pretty far out there. Yeah, I do remember that,
I do remember, but they I think as a show moves on, I
don't think they're all going to be out there, you know, And I
hope. I hope people don't the hardcore people don't leave, and because it
is really a great show overall, you know, so I hope they come
back. Yeah, you know, I think it's it's it's sighting, it's
getting I guess more. X File is show though it's getting kind of dark.
And yeah, you know, Karen had had said something. She just
said, I hope that, you know, people just don't blow it off
as oh, you know, I thought the show would reveal something that there
was some kind of real mystery the UFOs, but it's actually just all make
believe, just like UFOs are. And hopefully it doesn't reflect bad on that,
but I'm not so sure it is, because we are seeing, certainly
in the media a lot more stories on UFOs, and Sam could speak to
this. I know, i'd someone in the Illinois Chicago area, but they're
all writing about these and we've talked about it before sightings in their local areas,
and we're seeing a lot of these stories. So it's definitely created an
interest in the topic, I believe. I think that that, along with,
of course the New York Times article from a year or so ago and
some of those developments, are really pushing kind of this new found, interesting,
credible information regarding UFOs, in that at least the History Channel it's writing
some good stories regarding all of this. In fact, they've got a great
story on food fighters that you can find on the History Channel website right now
and to support, you know, tonight show, So check that out.
But actually there's a different story that I'm finding extremely interesting that I wanted to
talk about today. Great, Oh right ready, so you probably saw this
one. In fact, I think we talked about it, but it's this
astronomer, Harvard astronomer that says that the Washington Post title is and then the
story is getting all over the place. Harvard's top astronomer says, an alien
ship maybe among us, and he doesn't care what his colleagues think. And
it's an interesting story. So this astronomy professor's name is Abby Loebe, and
he has I guess his calculation he calls cosmic modesty, or this is what
he calls cosmicmodesty, And what he says is that the idea that it's arrogant
to assume we are alone in the universe, that's what his cosmicmodesty is,
or even a particularly special species, and which I think it's really interesting.
And I love this idea to begin with, because in nature we see that
there isn't one of something, there's many, many, many, many many
many of something. In fact, when it comes to planets, we're finding
out that there's tons of planets out there, perhaps even more planets than suns,
which would then equal kind of like his his equation goes into that we're
not so special and unique. I think what's interesting about that is if you
take that even further than this whole level of technology that we have gotten to,
or even our social economical kind of makeup probably also isn't unique, or
even a speed she's that is beginning to become space faring isn't necessarily unique.
So he really pushes his forward. However, he is a guy that was
really pushing the idea that isn't that it's mysterious. Is by its movement they're
able to determine, you know, kind of the makeup of the object.
In this case, the object move in a manner that they could not explain
it the way that it would. The gravity affected it. It seemed lighter
than a typical rock, so it was made of a lighter material. Also,
it seemed I guess it's sped up at some point. So the idea
is that perhaps the way that the Sun hit it, you know, was
able to propel it at that time faster than it could be. That's kind
of the leading theory. But this guy saying, no, that doesn't seem
right either, So it's got to be extraterrestrial. He's suggesting, you know,
it's like an extraterrestrial technology that was sent into our solar system to come
take a look, and then keep going. Like I said, some of
his colleagues are like, well, he doesn't mean it, and that's essentially
what they're saying. That someone suggested, well, he could be putting this
for us as kind of an exercise, because that's all been what professors do
to teach, you know, how you theorize and how you prove or disproved
theories. Other people are saying, perhaps he's joking or it's just kind of
funny because of a lot of it he's got. This guy is super credible.
He's very well known, he's written a lot of papers, and so
he can't hit he's so credible they can't really call him a nut. So
they're just kind of trying to come up with excuses as to why he's doing
this. But it's really interesting. It does seem, at least right now,
he is very at least adamant that there's got to be extraterrestrial civilizations.
There's got to be other species like us, more advanced than us out there,
and that's one of the reasons he loves this idea that this could have
been evidence of that. But what's great is we're seeing a lot of this
There's another story out there recently with another scientist saying that we need to take,
you know, the idea that we might be being visited seriously. There
is a paper written by this Colombo scientist who gotten the news also where he
was essentially saying the same thing that, Okay, maybe we're not being visited
right now, but if there is a potential for that, if we find
something odd, we can't discount that offhand. We have to leave that in
the potential possibilities out there before we just say, you know, it can't
be this, because that's not scientific science. You have to disprove it before
you can not include it definitively. So right, well, hey, I
really appreciate you picking up the mantle here. Uh well, I had the
strange thing happened as my computer screen went black and then it just was gone.
I've never had that happen before. It's a late model marriage of that,
and I think it's the government after tonight, it's Sam. It's Sam.
I think Sam's gone. So before you leave, why don't you hang
in there make sure I get him back. This is just a really exciting
time when we have this government program that to come out. You know,
there was a behind the scene's evolution that that happened here. When Louel Azando
first came out that he had worked for this, this government program investigating UFOs,
his colleagues weren't happy about it. And we know this at least through
through George Nappa, who hasn't been investigating all of this. Many of his
colleagues weren't happy about it, and they weren't necessarily on board with, you
know, these revelations. However, that's changed where his colleagues eventually have kind
of accepted it. They were just, you know, like Harry Reida said,
the whole reason that this program was kept secret is it the scrutiny.
They didn't want people to say, hey, what the hell are you guys
doing, you know, looking for UFOs or aliens and stuff like that.
But that's changed. We have seen through Nick Pope's articles or through other people
that we've interviewed close to this, that the Congress has had part of their
subcommittees have been interviewing UFO witnesses and interviewing Lou and others related to you know,
what's been going on with this phenomena. Let Alone, we've had a
lot more media stories, and then on top of that we have these scientists
being more acceptive of the extraterrestrial hypotheses. And I think one thing we have
to remember, and it is part of this evolution, is that the search
for extraterrestrial institute kind of as it was represented in Contact. They were just
going to listen for signals of aliens possibly being out there, and that used
to be considered fringe. It was really strange and weird, like in the
eighties or in the nineties, And as time went on, because that our
organization is so full of scientists, it began to be taken very, very
seriously, until we've reached this point where NASA essentially is like a Setti institute.
They're all about looking for aliens. Many of their projects have been looking
for life, so that idea that they're out there has been adopted and become,
you know, not weird or funny or worth than giggling about. UFOs
have had a harder time of it. But now we're starting to get to
a point where even the idea that extra coressials could be visiting us, or
we could be having observing evidence of advanced civilization just now starting to become more
accepted. It could be not that only that we have more credible information coming
forth. That's why I think it's important that people like you know, Martin
and Martin's guests share credible information. But it's also I think that, you
know, a lot of these grad students who work on these papers are younger
people, and the statistics show that younger people are really into this topic.
They are more into UFOs and more accepting of the possibility or even have taken
it as fact that there's got to be others out there, And so that
could be part of why this is happening. But we're writing this crest of
where public opinion about something that we've worked on is changing, and I think
it's interesting, and you know, with people like Sam Moranto who's been doing
these sorts of investigations for decades, the landscape has changed so much. And
personally, I think for the positive, you know there there doesn't seem to
be a lot of UFO incidents happening lately. Besides you know, you mentioned
one, but I have noticed it seems quiet, Am I not? Am
I just not seeing them as much? I agree with you there, I
totally agree, which it is interesting that we haven't had a lot of stories
about UFO sightings recently. We've had stories about recent sightings. We've seen a
lot of stories in the media about UFOs and UFO sightings, but typically they're
talking about well, for instance, a lot of them are talking about twenty
eighteen since it's January, or now it's February. But I think because it's
January, a lot of people review the previous year. So we had a
lot of twenty eighteen sighting report stories, but not about necessarily individual sightings.
When it comes to individual sightings, we've had a few, but nothing of
note. And I know some people will argue that they disagree, but really
a lot of what we've seen has been the type of you know, birds
and bees and solar balloons and balloons and nothing really strong or interesting. Unfortunately.
In fact, even this case in Utah, do you remember that one
where this drone captured something zip by very quickly and a lot of people have
analyzed that and I think proven pretty handedly, including you know, our go
to guy, Mark the Antonio who's the move on video and photo expert,
that it was a bird swooping in on the drone, which makes sense.
Movements fit. They even got some steals that that seemed like that seems to
be the answer for that one. So yeah, no, mysterious really great
sightings recently that I'm aware of, and that you know, I've been thinking
about that a lot lately. It's interesting that we have this kind of resurgence,
and I was asked recently on Brian Eno his show. Yeah, Paul
and Bennett their show, and you know, there haven't been recently some really
great sightings even though we have this kind of bigger interest in the topic.
So I think that's that's odd. Yeah, Alejandro, I don't know if
there's another subject you can speak of, but I'm going to try to dial
through to Sam. It's just going to take a few minutes. So let's
see. Can you go ahead and talk about your Thursday night live stream show.
I really enjoy that. Okay, Well, I talked a lot about
news, so my Thursday livestream show of course here. Well, I guess
we're probably not broadcasting on YouTube right now. No, no, yeah,
oh we are. Okay, So it's here on YouTube, kind of like
this show where I do a live show. It's every Thursday evening, six
pm, Arizona time. And I say Arizona time because we don't change with
daylight saving, so right now we're aligned with Mountain. Otherwise in the summer
where aligned with Pacific. But essentially I covered the news in more depth and
some of the stories that I write so kind of like these reviews I've been
doing on Project Bluebook, I go into the tale about some of the stories
that are related to these episodes that I include in the links, and also
the actual Blue Book files. What I think is interesting is I've read other
reviews, and I haven't seen any other reviews except for mine actually where that
referenced the actual Blue Book stories and give you links to them to see the
files themselves, because it's hard to tell from the television show certainly what's real
and what's not. And some of the more interesting points are aspects, especially
of those sightings that we're covered in the first few episodes, are really fascinating
and you can find pictures for details in the Project blue Book files. Another
really important and I think this is the number one most important book in uphology,
is Captain Rupelt's book, So Edward Rupelt essentially, and I think this
is an interesting part of history, and he documents. This in his book,
The Air Force in the early fifties was not when it came to UFOs,
was not seen in a positive light. That's because in nineteen forty eight,
the very first UFO investigation that went on projects signed, there was a
paper written estimate of a situation that concluded UFOs could be extraterrestural in nature.
Of course, they outlined a few things these could be, but they said
some are genuine mysteries and this could be a possibility. General Vandenburgh didn't like
that idea. He said, try again, ripped up the report and essentially
wanted to take that part out because he didn't feel that that was there was
enough evidence to support that. So then became Project Grudge. What's interesting is
that project names are supposed to be chosen randomly, and supposedly they are,
but Grudge seemed to fit because by this time the Air Force really seemed to
have a grudge against the whole phenomena, and they really worked hard to debunk
everything, older cases, current cases, and so and scientists began to not
want to deal with the Air Force, or even people in the Air Force
didn't want to send cases to Bluebook because they knew even if they had an
interesting case that blue Book would say, oh, it's not this or it's
not that. In fact, Project blue Book covered one of the cases,
and I think it was a Gorman case in the first episode. They can't
remember for sure, but essentially what had happened was that the object was caught
on radar, and the radar guys sent into Bluebook, Hey, this is
not whether phenomenon. Was not some sort of weather messing with our radar.
This was an object that we saw moving in a strange manner. They send
this into blue Book being very clear, and Rupelt says he saw this report
and it was obvious that they were afraid that Blue Book would explain it away,
and sure enough they still explained it. Wayne say, nope, this
has to be whether even though those radar people splicitly said they checked, that
was not the issue. But it demonstrated why this ankst and frustration was having
with Blue Books. So they wanted Rupelt to come take a look and say,
well, what shall we do at this point? And Rupelt said,
we've got a bad reputation. This is not good for us. We really
need to genuinely investigate these things, and they said, okay, thanks,
go for it, and they put him in charge. He only did us
for about a year or so and then he retired and he wrote a book
about his experience in Project Blue Book. And it's a great book. It's
got some very very credible cases, and I really feel it's the most important
book in this field. And you can find that book for free on the
Nightcap website. But just google rupelt estimate of a situation of this situation and
you can find it and read that book. Several super fascinating cases in there.
And that book is really what's being used largely by the Project Bluebook creator
and writers to put together these episodes. So really that book, you're going
to read the truth of all of the background of all of this. So
that's something really interesting to look into. And so a lot of my stories
the roots are from there. You know. My you and I had a
conversation once about that book and I mentioned that that I said that I didn't
have that book. Well, someone was went into a library, one of
my listeners went into a library actually in Phoenix, and they found the book
and sent it to me a wonderful hard copy. Yeah, but they check
it out of the library and then send it to you. I mean,
I'm sorry, bookstore, Oh I say library, Oh boy. Yeah,
there are several outlets. I'm reprinting it so you can't find it on Amazon.
And in fact, in all of my videos I put a link to
it on the bottom because I have some of my favorite books linked there,
so you can go buy them, but I would recommend them all. But
that one's really important, I think, because it establishes from the get go,
and this is something I've been saying, and it's certainly borne out in
recent revelations, especially related to you know, Alesando and his group at the
DoD in investigating UFOs, that it's never been that there's been a consensus.
I mean, I think the US Air Force PR Department has worked very hard
to say, oh, yeah, we looked at UFOs, there's nothing to
it, and we and it's kind of a unanimous decision. But that's never
been the case. There's always been arguing within the Air Force as to the
nature of the phenomena. And I think we see that, especially with the
revelation surrounding the Nimitz case, which you've covered in depth. In that these
people, of course since two thousand and four have felt that they really experienced
something anomalous, and now that they're able to come out about it, they're
talking about it. So that proves, you know, and demonstrates there has
been these conversations within the Air Force despite you know, us not knowing that
and none of that, really very little of it, I should say,
coming to light. I shouldn't say none, because there are researchers who have
been able to interview military witnesses in the last few decades, even during really
all of this really hard secrecy. I don't know if Sam has that would
be interesting. He's done so much work. I'm sure he has. But
one example of that would be, you know, the Scientific Coalition for Ufology
and their investigation of the Homeland Security video from two thousand and nine over Puerto
Rico, where these guys you know, saw something and mysterious and they sought
the group of these UFO researchers to investigate it. Right again, I really
appreciate you really helped out a lot tonight, No problem, my pleasure.
All right, all right, I'll talk to you next week, all right,
talk to you later, all right, bye, bye, all right
everyone. Our guest is Sam Moronto. He has been on the show a
number of times. He's always he actually helped me out with the show at
one time, did a couple of UFO news segments. And it's always great
talking to him. I consider him a good friend. And he's back.
And just what we're speaking of earlier, just a minute ago about the Nimits
case, just one more thing I wanted to add about that. On March
nineteenth, I will have Kevin Day. He was the radar, the chief
officer and the overlooking the radar that saw all those objects on the Nimit case,
Nimitz case, And he and I had a conversation last night. He
said he was going to try to get a couple more tic Tac witnesses to
join the show again. That's March nineteenth. I'm not saying that's going to
happen. I'm gonna say I'm hopeful that's going to happen, and we'll see
if it indeed does. All right, So our guest VFO, we had
all kinds of trouble and every which way possible, little skype, you name
it, but I got him here on the phone. Is Sam Ranta.
Welcome to the show. Boy, have we've gone through quite a few kirdles
today. Huh was something else? I think we started half an hour before
the show too, and still yees, trouble left to trouble. But anyway
we're heredro covered. Oh yeah, oh my god, Halahandro and you've covered
tons of ground and I was wishing you would actually stay on, but that'd
be kind of impossible for us to all talk. But maybe I don't know.
This whole blue Book phenomena is really getting people interested that were neither on
the fence or even in the arena anyway whatsoever. They were watching other things
and all of a sudden they're watching this. So we've discussed this many times
over and you always took the position and they applaud you for it, saying
that they're no something good will come out of it. As far as getting
people interested, yea, yeah, I do. I do think so.
Um, you know, I mean a lot of there's been a lot of
critics, as you know, for Project Bluebook, the series, and that
is almost to be expected. But anyway, you know, there is some
good coming out of it as well, as you say full of the listener
that we have a lot of first time listeners can you give them your background
and and what got you? I know you had a sighting when you were
young, but can you give the new listen just a nutshell of who Sam
Moronto is. Well, I'm just a regular guy. I don't have any
acronyms and back of my names. If they're they're they're typos. It's just
experience, and you know it's I've I've had personal experience with these things.
And again, because of that, I have to probably be more objective when
it comes to analyzing a case, and that may play out to sound it
sometimes far more skeptical, but never cynical. And I think that plays out
well across the board if we're to be taken seriously. So my first experience,
I was a little guy up at my uncle's cottage and being a little
kid, running all over the place. He had just put a new well
in and I had to find out how deep it was. So I'm dropping
stuff down there and he's yelling at man, and I'm like, oh,
well, I gotta go hide some ers and do something else. Going to
backyard and I'm standing there pitching some rocks across the water. They were by
the lake, and this was just a little inlet, and all of a
sudden, its bright object comes flying past my shoulder. I was very warm
after that, I remember that. And it went up behind a tree,
a willow tree, and disappeared. My aunt was calling me. She said
for some time she couldn't find me, and it was dark out. When
all this came together, it scared the heck out of me. Didn't know
what was going on. So that was my first experience with something that was
truly anomalous in the sky, and it could be called a uap ufo or
whatever. But as a kid, one day I woke up again all this
I was young. I heard my father talking about something, all excited in
the kitchen. I walked into the kitchen and there he is. He's telling
the story about going by one of his students. He was a music teacher
and he actually made house calls and he went to the house. The wife
said, come on in, Sam, you got to go in the backyard.
The boys are looking at something in the sky. So they get out
there, and they were amateur astronomers, and they said, Sam, you
know what, we've seen some UFOs. My dad goes, what are UFOs?
And they end up giving him a magazine, a couple of books,
and they gave me the adventure of a lifetime. So that's all it started
out for me. Now, my first involved as far as doing investigative work
was in the eighties. I was doing it by myself, and then there
was a case in nineteen ninety seven. Funny thing is it was the same
year, of course, as to the May thirteenth sighting in Phoenix, which
was nineteen that we had March, yes, March thirteenth, and there was
this one was earlier that year, and it was in New Lennox, all
the way north through Orland Park that this object was seen. It was seen
by a lot of people, but the one individual that really really made the
news was a pilot and I heard about him when I was coming home from
Cristo Lake. I turned on the radio and he was talking about this sighting
was all over the news. So I made it a point to see him.
And then after that I met up with a gentleman from Luffan and so
we all got involved in working on things. And after that it was one
thing after another, you know. So I don't know how many years.
It's been a long time, right right, And and you actually were the
go to for a couple of cases people really looking into, and we can
talk about them and a little bit here, but one of them that you
were really involved in I remember for quite a while it was the Tinley Park
mass sightings. You remember, you're telling me you love mass sightings because of
all the war mass sightings. Yes, mass sightings. Really, when you
lay out the weight of a case, the more people you have, especially
if it's a cut across the demographic of a community and from various vantage points,
it really adds value to a case because you could be looking at the
same object at the same time, but from your vantage point you're seeing something
entirely different. And so when you get a well rounded view of what's going
on, you get a better idea. And that was a perfect example with
the Tinley Park case. The Tiley Park case, you have the three lights
in the sky and that's all they're seeing is these three points of light.
And three points of light could be anything, but these were so brilliant and
so unusual. They hovered, they rotated counterclockwise and actually at times even moved
very quick, almost hyper leaping from one point to another then going straight up.
This was strange because they never broke the signature of being like an Isosceles.
All that it was is just a matter of your perspective, and we
knew that by looking at the footage. And here's a perfect scenario. We
have thousands of witnesses, hundreds of the absolute very least, and then we
have multiple sets of footage from different vantage points. I personally reviewed over or
teen videos and I know there's at least twenty five out there, and I'm
sure there's more than that. And when you analyze it, and not only
I that analyze it, multiple people analyzed it. That was part of the
second series of UFO Hunters, so that was analyzed very well, and they
played it back and forth. And the bottom line is they are a fix
in time space. So if they're not on an object, there is something
in there holding it in time place. Though we know people have seen an
actual object when they were directly underneath it, very cloaked into the sky and
actually displaying when you got directly underneath, almost like the canopy of stars above.
So it was whatever technology is it is, it's pretty cool and I
would like to think it's ours. I don't know, because the darn thing
was massive, could well have been quarter of a mile, even bigger than
that, Who knows it was big. So where do you house something like
that? The other thing is that object has been seen in multiple locations,
not just Tinley Park. And during that period of time, on the August
nineteenth, we had in Minneapolis Saint Paul a sighting of an object stationary in
the sky for at least nine hours or more and it sat there at about
thirty thousand feet in the air, and it just sat there all day and
to the points that people coming in from Wisconsin were seeing a turn red at
night, and then it disappeared. Now, now that wasn't a weather balloon.
In fact, Peter Davenport received that report, and he was the one
who received the Tinley Park reports, the O'Hare reports. Peter Davenport is the
unsung hero eyes and uthology for many great cases, and I applaud demand.
But he had he had these these these these people calling in about Minneapolis,
and rarely do you hear about it? Did you ever hear about the Minneapolis
sighting on the nineteenth precursor? Yeah? And then that night in Arizona there
was a there were multiple sightings, and there are two sets of footage from
one being north and one being south in the Phoenix area of an object,
a very large object, very unusual, sitting still in the sky at a
thirty mile an hour wind. Further south, the wind wasn't as bad,
but still it was pretty bad. And there's a triangular object sitting in the
skyders. There's video of that, the configuration of the eliminations moving in a
uniform pattern, you know motion. So that was on the nineteenth. Our
for sighting here was on the twenty first of August, but there were sightings
all around the world within that period of time. In August. August was
a very strange month. It was also the month that we first got the
first landfall of one of thirteen hurricanes in the Caribbean, So that was a
strange year. We never had that many hurricanes that were that powerful in that
area. The other thing is two four we end up at the Sumatran earthquake
tsunami that was on Christmas. So I mean a lot of weird things were
happening in two thousand and four. The other thing about the Tinley Park case,
and this is something I keep on forgetting about telling you is the nimits
tik Tak sighting was the tenth of the fourteenth. They were seeing him,
though it has mentioned that the month prior, within that period of time they
were also getting incursions and other reports and other things picked up on a radar.
So it wasn't just then, but that was when it seemed to have
peaked, and that would have been November the tenth of the fourteenth. And
here our last mass sighting at Tinley Park and in other places was October thirty
first to Halloween, ten days afterwards all this excitement around the minute sleep Sam,
you mentioned that there are some videos of the Tinley Park incident. Is
that actually available? Someone can actually find those videos online or where they are?
They available anywhere to look? Okay? You could, yes, look
up. It would be UFO Hunters. It would be episode two oh one
and it's called Invasion Illinois. You could see them analyzing footage. I'm sitting
there talking about it whatever. Then there's also the I don't know if you
could still find it anymore. MSNBC Dateline. We did a I got a
call from them. They wanted to do something on you with POS but they
wanted at ten best Cases, and they really wanted it something with photographic evidence
of video evidence. So I had mentioned X number of cases, and I
pointed them to some individuals, and then of course I said Tinley Park,
which they knew. They knew nothing about Stevensville at that time when that came
out. They knew about Stevensville to some degree. Yet there was really no
video for Stevensville. For Tinley Park as video multiple sets of video. So
the thing is that too could be out there somewhere. As it was called,
I think it was ten Best Encounters. It was MSNBC. Yeah,
yeah, and they did. They did a real interesting job cutting it up.
And even the funny thing was it was shot by by some folks that
are doing some doing some big things right now as far as some of the
production. But it was done for in the CENTC. And I sat there
in the hot seat until I said the word exterrestrial because I usually don't say
the E word. And I sat there and I thought I was going to
melt until all these questions and what is he going to say? The E
word is what it comes down to, and I said, I said,
this long sentence qualifying what I thought, this could be a long sentence,
and in there was exterrestrial. And when you hear it, that's all you
hear is me saying something about exterrestrial. I do mean on the cutting floor
they edited it out. You're saying, they added out the rest of the
sentence. Oh yeah. And then the other thing is they kept on they
kept they didn't. We always started out. I had one of the witnesses
mute with me, in fact, one of the key witnesses, and had
some great footage, and every time we would start a sentence, we'd always
say the red lights. We'd qualify what it was, the color and everything.
Never never did they do that. They only showed the very burnt out
images where you couldn't even see that there is anything red and there. And
I remember one of the so called skeptics making the statement that they even thought
it was a it was a celestial it was a constellation, which would have
been, you know, in the summer triangle dan ed Altar and Vega.
And this cracks me up because if it was, the Earth would have been
spinning because this thing's moving around and we'd be dead. So thank god it
was it, you know, But no, they didn't. They didn't even
probably get to see the footage better or have at least some explanation to what
they're saying. These things were read but so intense that we need what the
camera picked up, did no no justification whatsoever to what they were actually saying.
None. Wow, we have just about a minute or so and we're
going to be going into a break. I just wanted to bring up that.
Speaking with both James Fox and Travis Walton. He did an episode of
UFO Chasing UFOs that James Fox, who was a short lived series, and
they both but mostly Travis Walton was very upset at what they did with the
cutting the editing. Um, you know, he said, the whole story
completely changed with what they did with the editing and he was really really upset
about it, and us very up Yeah. And James when he was going
to come on my show the last time, he said, we really don't
have to bring that up if you don't want to. Other words, we
don't have to talk about chasing UFOs. So we're ready to go into break.
Sam, Um, so hang in there. Everyone will be right back
right after these messages. Okay, we are clear for a few minutes,
and Sam we're still we're still alive on YouTube and god so so we'll pick
up you know where we were talking then, but let's talk about um something
different. Have you lived in other places in the country. You mostly have
lived in the Chicago area, right, Yes, yeah, well I lived
anywhere as I went as long as I wasn't dead. Yeah, but I
mean, yeah, yeah that I'm just born on the South side of Chicago
and that's it. Yeah. Yeah, you know, I don't do much
traveling anyways. You know, that's why I get it, fight it anywheres
to speak to a tough work group in the Kidnessey I don't care if they're
paying the airfare. I go and I talk and they don't even have to
pay me. Just give me a sandwich or whatever. I do it and
we just we just uh. Today we have fifty five degrees here and me
up here on the coast, but we had cold You really got cold weather.
How cold was it? Oh? Yeah, you were there? Yeah,
I wanted to said, I don't know if I had up sending you
that. I was taking pictures in the morning. It was negative twenty two,
that's without the wind chill. But then my sister called me up,
which was up in Galina, and I think it was negative thirty six without
the wind chill. And then a buddy of mine up in Wisconsin is was
He said it was close to forty without the wind ship. So I'm like,
my gosh. Yeah. And we were down in Springfield. I told
you we went to spoke at that paranormal thing. It was very nice.
But the hotel we get there, they had busted pipes, and then the
hotel next storehead busted pipes. I'm like, oh my gosh. They go,
oh, it was horrific. Down here. They're not they're not used
to this, you know, further south they're not used to it, and
neither are week. Yeah, the plumbers will be busy for a long time
in the whole midnight. Yeah. Oh yeah, yeah, No, that
I just I don't know. Fifty five degrees for you guys, that's that's
wow. Yeah. And speaking of warm weather, I'm going to be I'm
going to be on the road the next couple of weeks. This is for
the listeners, So I will be doing the show from hotel rooms for the
next couple of weeks, and I won't have all my audio and up to
snuff. It'll be it'll be pretty good. So so Sam, we we
get about well, we're closing in on like thirty forty seconds here, and
uh so good. Um, this is the only break that we're going to
be taking. Um yeah, we got about a minute and left. And
so we actually met in person a couple of times this last summer when I
was in Chicago, which I do go to Chicago quite a bit. But
it was great when we were out in the warm weather out in Phoenix,
and that was lovely to be out there in February a few years ago when
you were there. We had a blast. It wasn't it fun? A
great time, great time, all right. I think we are just about
ready to go back here in a minute. Oh we still got forty seconds
left. And so as far as the area out there, when you are
working with Mouffon, are you are you still taking cases to this day?
Oh yeah, I mean, as a general rule of state direct if it's
not supposed to take any sort of cases, but I end up taking some
the other highly sensitive ones that you know, you really got to watch what
you're saying and doing. I handle those or work and can junction with my
assistant director usually it's it's usually the two of us, and we've had some
great cases. I'll talk about one in particular when I get a chance and
give you a little more detail about it. I think I mentioned it.
Then we had two more interesting ones. Did type things. We're gonna have
to roll right back into the show. Yeah, we're ready, Sure you
can count down. All right, Okay, welcome back to the show.
My guest is Sam Moronto, and we are talking UFOs out in the Chicago
area. We took a jag and we're talking about what happens on the editing
floor when when people talk about UFOs, I think that's pretty funny. They
left the extraterresto word in there, and uh uh yeah, and I understand
it. It's one you want to avoid at all costs because you know,
it is what a lot of people assume. But you know, and I
know, no one really really knows. It's it's just a guess, one
of the guesses. That's all. Yeah, And that's fine because that's what
science wants. We're not looking for proof and science proof is in law and
alcohol and math. What we're looking for is a decent set of hypotheses that
could probably move up to a theory and then you know that's good, you
know, and they could take it from there. And to do that you
need evidence, and most of what we get are anecdotal accounts. That's why
my math sightings are so wonderful. It's not just one person's word, it's
another person, hopefully independent and from another perspective, saying the same thing simultaneously,
relatively close in time, and we get tie all together and get you
get some supportive evidence. Now when you have a photograph, a video,
or if you're bless but something is wonderful physical trace evidence and this is something
a lot of people don't understand. There are thousands of cases of physical trace
evidence. We had a case in southern Illinois that we did collect. Hopefully
something turns out of it, you know, turns up good, but there
are samples taken and we may have may have physical trace evidence. So these
things do take place. The notion that you know, we need the ashtray
that Nels always looking for. You don't need an astray maybe if you know,
if that's what he wants, but that's not scientific. What we need
is evidence, and we need to evolve the anecdote by using non a better
way of assessing, and a better metrics and less arbitrary and an ambiguous evaluation
and terminology so people can understand regardless who it is that's looking at the information
to take the data points, take all that, put it together and guess
what you have something of value. But you know, we're getting there,
and it's slow, but it takes with that first step, even if it's
been fifty years, it doesn't matter or seventy years. We're trying and being
the always referred to as you know, pseudo scientific. It all starts at
pseudo before it becomes legitimized. And it's all the way. It's actually you
know, everything stands with an idea. You know, it's always hypocrisy.
Yes, And then they're saying, oh, speculation, Speculation is the first
step in science. You have to speculate and you try to go outside your
comfort zone. You test that all of theirs so many failures. Yes,
you're going to have the failures. You learn from the failures. And so
many of these things the so called skeptics bring up and they're not being skeptical
or not being scientific. Some of them are very good. And the other
thing is you should listen to them regardless, because there's always something, a
nugget of something in there that you can learn from. I don't discount these
people at all, as you know, but in the same token, you
really want to give people a pet on the back that are at least trying
to bring this information forward. It's never going to be perfect, eckwardous human,
but we're trying, you know what I mean, We're trying. Yeah,
yeah, that's right, that's right. I'm promised to everyone that we
would talk about the O'Hair case. I know you and I have spoken briefly
in the past about it, but I still think it's a it's an interesting
case, and I don't think it's what you would call a closed case,
because eventually people may start talking, we may get more information about that.
You're a hundred percent correct, especially people retire or they leave the airline business.
But why don't you for the person that's not familiar with that. I
know it was I think it was two thousand and six, same year I
had sighting. Yeah, that was November the seven, two thousand and six,
after four o'clock from or fifteen by Gate C seventeen. It was right
above gates seventeen and a couple of individuals were loading up a planet was going
to be pushed back and going out too. It was going to North Carolina.
At that time, they seen something below the ceiling clouds and it was
sitting there and nothing should be sitting there. It was odd, you know,
here's this strange object just sitting there. It's class beers. Nothing should
be in there without a transponder. So mind you, this is just a
X number of years. But five years after nine to eleven, people are
very concerned about anything like that, any violation of infringement on uh, you
know, on airspace or something like that. So they called their manager because
they wanted to file a safety report. Naron, You're like, what is
this? They wanted to take a look at it, Pilot, Copilot,
we're also taking a peek at it. They saw it, The manager came
down, sure enough, comes out there and there it was well before you
know it, it's it's being talked about on the radio throughout the airport,
and personnel regardless of their taxing you know, seven forty sevens or whatever,
they're seeing it. And there was one there was a group of people,
two guys taxing seven seven seven, a trip to seven and they saw it,
and they listened to other people talking and in fact, this guy you
could hear his If you go to YouTube, you get a bunch of stuff
on the O'Hair sighting. And the thing about the O'Hair case is why they
had to keep it quiet. So many people this is a mass sighting too,
but they had to keep it quiet because February of that year they had
America UL just came out of bankruptcy that here, So they may not want
to have been known as being the extraterrestful airlines. That's a possibility. Wow.
The other thing is, isn't that crazy? It was the largest bankruptcy
at that time. You had mentioned that. Well, now that people are
starting to retire, they may be coming forward. Had that happened. I
was giving a talk at some group up north and guy says, you know,
I want to talk to you afterwards. Okay, So he goes.
I used to work as a manager. He had a very good position and
he was working that day, but where he was working at would not allow
him to see what was going on. But he heard all the chatter and
the radio and the end result is he goes and he goes and tells me
that he was talking to his friend who was in the be concourse, and
he was telling him what was going on, describing exactly what he's seeing,
and without so much as a doubt this was there. It was an object.
It was below the ceiling of cloud, which was about nineteen hundred feet
at that time, and it was at about fifteen fourteen, fifteen hundred feet.
It was summers between no less than thirty feet to as big as eighty
eight feet is what they're figuring out as far as the the NARCAP report,
and that is a good read if you want to get some information no more
about the case, good to NARCAP dot org. Look up the technical paper
number ten and read through it and you'll hear the data in there. You
get this nonsense people saying it's a lenticular cloud, and lenticular clouds only form
on the leeward side of a mountain of a mountain. Yes, you've seen
them, and they're beautiful and nothing like that whatsoever was going on. The
Other thing is the weather to support something like that. Wichita, Kansas would
have been the closest place have anything resembling the type of winds that you would
have to have to have lenticular clouds, because you can get them at times
in the Midwest. Here we get them, but they're very rare better it's
usually at the leeward side of a mountain. So that was a bunch of
malarchity. Other thing is the object shoots while they're watching it, and they're
watching it for about twenty minutes. This thing just goes straight up in the
air real fast, in a blink, leaves a gaping blue hole all the
way through the approximately six thousand feet of cloud ceiling boom instantly. Well,
it can't do that instantly with a lenticular cloud. They don't do that.
I never heard of anything like that. Then you have people saying, well,
it's just ice crystals that formulate and drop down. And I've seen that
at least twice. One time was on fifty five. I'm driving along and
here you see this burst of obviously something coming out of the clouds, and
you see this round blue hole. Well, first of all, you see
this falling out. You'll see it looking like, oh, looking like very
feathery looking fan out crystals of ice almost like snow that heavier, and it'll
punch a hole and that's what You have a vortex of cold air spinning above
and that area just gets the humidity up there, becomes crystals, it falls,
you can't hold itself no longer and it falls straight through. And that
makes sense. But the bottom line, that wasn't what happened. We had
the top of this or the coldest area was that could formulate that was about
ten thousand feet. These aren't about the highest level of those. That ceiling
was about six thousand feet, maybe even less. So none of this took
place. And they were saying, well, it's the lights reflecting up now
it was, and I believe it was civilian it was, Yeah, it
was civilian twilight, So I mean, no, no, it wasn't it.
Some lights were on, but not everything and they weren't reflecting up that
heavily. So that's all nonsense. Now did they they? Something? I
think I heard it described as it was almost like a black in color who
was very dark? Am I getting that right? And in perfectly circular?
It was okay, picture this. The ratio was two point seven to one
as far as the width see the length they were used in a ratio of
two point seven to one, so it was, you know, like the
tic tac concept of a fat football, something along that line, but it
was more eliptical and round as far as in the center. So it was,
and it was moving in a counterclockwise direction. My first witness that I
spoke to was a military brat who grew up on the East Coast. Her
father was a commander of a it's captain of a air wing for the Navy.
She knew every proper term to describe things, so when she was analyzing
it, she was analyzing it with a really high degree of scrutiny. And
the other thing was she was also an ex reporter, so she knew how
to compile this information and explain it to us. Now, which is great.
Where where did she actually view the object? From two vantage points?
Coming in on Mannheim Road towards the airport, she was able to discern it
below the clouds with her as a passenger was in front of hers was a
doctor from Bulk area and they're in the process of meeting a friend who was
a airline pilot from another airline's coming in at the international concourse. So they're
driving in. Both of them see this and they're like, what on earth
is that that's not supposed to be there. So they pulled up to the
International Concourse. She got out and took her reading glasses bentimta angle so she
could see it better, trying to get her view as best as possible.
And she said, while she was pulling up, other people were out there,
and then they were starting to congregate, pointing at it, and people
were taking photographs definitely and possibly even video definitely. So she was there.
And then she says, when this thing shot through the sky or through clouds,
excuse me that that you could have heard them, heard the noise that
they had, like squealed, they gasped, they were alarmed at it.
At the motion that it was was so instantaneous. All right, everyone,
That is it for the free part of the show. Thank you so much
for listening, and if you'd like to support the show. In here our
two. It gets really interesting when he talks about a recent sighting where witnesses
more than one to see a craft with actually what appeared to be windows and
appeared to be some type of energy's inside that we're seen again by multiple witnesses.
And by the way, if you can't help out and support the show
and you want to listen to the full show, you can listen live that's
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So I want to thank everyone, as I said, for listening, and
I also want to thank for Alejandro for picking things up when actually my computer
crashed during this live show and he helped out a lot, and everyone else
helps out with the show. And we'll be back next week with Chad Lewis,
UFO and Instigator should be in another interesting one. And remember everyone to
keep your eyes to the sky.