WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.440 --> 00:00:07.000 You're listening to Redefining Energy. Your co hosts from Berlin, Gerard Raid and 2 00:00:07.160 --> 00:00:12.519 from London Lawrence Sagalam. Today on Redefining Energy, we're going to talk about 3 00:00:12.839 --> 00:00:17.719 optimizing solar fleets. And what is great is we're not going to have a 4 00:00:17.879 --> 00:00:21.960 white old dudes as usual. We're going to have a young and intelligent woman. 5 00:00:22.079 --> 00:00:24.800 And we need more women on the show. So if you have any 6 00:00:24.800 --> 00:00:28.160 great women, please let us know. But first let's talk a bit about 7 00:00:28.199 --> 00:00:33.000 our special partner for the episode. And our partner is a company we have 8 00:00:33.159 --> 00:00:38.320 invested in called feb Febesol is one of the fastest growing solar company in Germany. 9 00:00:38.600 --> 00:00:45.359 Febol delivers residential pvcy stems with outstanding quality and also batteries, IV charging 10 00:00:45.479 --> 00:00:48.880 and heat bumps. They're on what's amazing about this company, that's with the 11 00:00:48.880 --> 00:00:53.039 culture because when we met them firstly it was how many people? Ten people? 12 00:00:53.119 --> 00:00:56.000 What are they now twenty? I mean to do that in such a 13 00:00:56.039 --> 00:01:00.479 short period of time and keep the quality up, it's all to do with 14 00:01:00.520 --> 00:01:04.359 the cultural business and that's down to leadership and they've been really really focused on 15 00:01:04.359 --> 00:01:08.879 that and it's pretty amazing. Yeah, let's talk about our guests at the 16 00:01:10.159 --> 00:01:15.680 ARA. Atle is head of Global business operation at LIGHTSOURCEVP, where she has 17 00:01:15.719 --> 00:01:19.079 worked for the past nine years. And actually, the funny thing is it's 18 00:01:19.079 --> 00:01:22.200 great to have her on the show because when I set up Alexa Capital ten 19 00:01:22.280 --> 00:01:26.400 years ago, our first client was light Source, right, and it's amazing 20 00:01:26.400 --> 00:01:29.159 to see what light Source has done over the last decade. It really is 21 00:01:29.159 --> 00:01:32.560 incredible the growth of this company, you know, and it's the largest developer 22 00:01:32.599 --> 00:01:36.439 in your hab the third largest in the world outside China. Think about it. 23 00:01:36.480 --> 00:01:42.040 They operate three hundred installations in nineteen countries. It's portfolio of almost nine 24 00:01:42.079 --> 00:01:46.640 gigawa and they plan to reach twenty five gigs into a twenty five. But 25 00:01:46.799 --> 00:01:51.760 that brings a lot of questions because with such a diverse fleet from size to 26 00:01:51.879 --> 00:01:56.319 geography, is how do you manage and optimize all those assets? And the 27 00:01:56.359 --> 00:02:00.840 answer is not very easily. That's why we brought Aden on the show, 28 00:02:01.400 --> 00:02:07.479 is to try to understand how she managed to optimize such a global fleet. 29 00:02:07.800 --> 00:02:13.080 Speaking on the show, Welcome to the show, Good morning, Thank you 30 00:02:13.159 --> 00:02:16.680 very much for having me Adele. You've been nine years at Lightsos VP, 31 00:02:17.240 --> 00:02:21.159 and I guess the company has changed a lot and your role has changed a 32 00:02:21.199 --> 00:02:24.199 lot. So how I've been your first nine years? My first nine years 33 00:02:24.400 --> 00:02:30.120 have been our roller coaster as much as the solar industry has been so. 34 00:02:30.199 --> 00:02:34.719 I started in lyse Pp in twenty fourteen. At the time it was still 35 00:02:34.960 --> 00:02:39.560 Lightser's only two one hundred employees and a company very much focused on the UK 36 00:02:39.719 --> 00:02:44.680 market. Through the course of the past nine years, the company has reached 37 00:02:44.719 --> 00:02:47.759 now one thousand employees and we are operating in nineteen different country. We are 38 00:02:47.800 --> 00:02:53.319 still very much a solar focused developer, so there is our technology and we 39 00:02:53.400 --> 00:02:58.719 are still very much applying the same approach to different markets. But of course 40 00:02:58.719 --> 00:03:05.159 the complexity of operating in such a geographically dispersed environment and with a thousand people 41 00:03:05.400 --> 00:03:08.120 you know, co easibly working towards our purpose of bringing solar to this word 42 00:03:08.520 --> 00:03:15.199 has brought quite a number of different challenges that we are happily facing every day. 43 00:03:15.360 --> 00:03:20.120 My role specifically has changed from being the leader of the asset management team 44 00:03:20.199 --> 00:03:24.639 that looks after the operation technically, commercially and financially of our sites to today 45 00:03:24.840 --> 00:03:32.080 leading our global business operation which EBBS very much responsible for delivering our business transformation 46 00:03:32.120 --> 00:03:37.439 and digitalization strategy. So I'm kind of at the core of our ways of 47 00:03:37.520 --> 00:03:42.360 working during this changing and growth pattern. Can I ask, just as you 48 00:03:42.400 --> 00:03:45.479 talk about business transformation, I mean, you've been doing this since the business 49 00:03:45.599 --> 00:03:49.719 is set up, right, So as an analysts sort of looking in and 50 00:03:49.759 --> 00:03:53.280 the industry, there's a lot of solar companies that have failed along the way 51 00:03:53.360 --> 00:03:55.759 and at that have succeeded, including light Source. Of course, you know, 52 00:03:55.759 --> 00:03:59.759 I ask the question, what's the secret source? Because you to succeed. 53 00:04:00.319 --> 00:04:02.680 I think it's very much down to our DNA. We are very truth 54 00:04:02.719 --> 00:04:10.080 to ourselves, and our leadership has always been very clear around what lisers and 55 00:04:10.199 --> 00:04:14.919 lisus VP now is about. We have a very clear and simple purpose and 56 00:04:15.199 --> 00:04:19.839 a very clear set of values that actually have been determined by asking the employees 57 00:04:20.040 --> 00:04:25.360 to determine what our company venues were. So I think we have a community 58 00:04:25.439 --> 00:04:30.319 of people that is very much pointing in the same North style direction. What 59 00:04:30.519 --> 00:04:33.920 is interesting though, is that we haven't never been dogmatic the how we get 60 00:04:34.000 --> 00:04:38.800 there, the how we can adapt our ways of working, how we can 61 00:04:39.120 --> 00:04:43.439 shift our operation to meet the requirement of a specific market or specific challenge. 62 00:04:43.600 --> 00:04:48.319 Because underpin our ability of being successful in different markets and grower speed. Ultimately, 63 00:04:48.319 --> 00:04:51.360 as an industry, we are very adaptable and that is one of the 64 00:04:51.399 --> 00:04:57.040 key of success that has allowed us to be where we are today. Where 65 00:04:57.040 --> 00:05:01.279 you are today, you have nine gigots asset on the operation and you tag 66 00:05:01.360 --> 00:05:05.240 at twenty five in the next few years, So I mean really amazing growth. 67 00:05:05.600 --> 00:05:09.759 And I see all the type of assets you have and five mayga what 68 00:05:10.079 --> 00:05:15.120 somewhere in England and almost five hundred in Australia. So when you see all 69 00:05:15.160 --> 00:05:18.759 those assets like different size all over the place, what would you say is 70 00:05:18.800 --> 00:05:24.279 the same and what would you say is different? Managing all those countries and 71 00:05:24.319 --> 00:05:30.319 different type of assets. The complexity of managing smaller and bigger side is really 72 00:05:30.319 --> 00:05:34.519 in volume. So the main principle and the main approach is to work of 73 00:05:34.600 --> 00:05:39.079 an asset manager for example, which is you know, my old self is 74 00:05:39.240 --> 00:05:43.160 very much consistent and very similar. The level of diligence, the type of 75 00:05:43.199 --> 00:05:46.600 processes that you need to deploy to make sure you're overseeing the technical performance of 76 00:05:46.600 --> 00:05:51.920 aside appropriately, the type of contractoral arrangement and the dynamics with your subcontractors are 77 00:05:53.079 --> 00:05:59.319 very very similar. Now the real complexity comes around how do you get control 78 00:05:59.560 --> 00:06:01.600 of your at a point and how do you get control of the volume, 79 00:06:01.839 --> 00:06:05.759 and how do you keep that diligence when the number of contract you manage is 80 00:06:05.839 --> 00:06:13.000 multiplying. Part of it is training, because when you actually grow a team, 81 00:06:13.040 --> 00:06:15.480 the fundamental aspect of that is how do you bring up new talent and 82 00:06:15.560 --> 00:06:18.759 how do you walk with them through the journey of learning and being at the 83 00:06:18.839 --> 00:06:23.560 level of professionality you require. And part of it is how you can leverage 84 00:06:23.600 --> 00:06:29.639 technology to help you get control and get value out of the information that comes 85 00:06:29.639 --> 00:06:33.519 from the site that can educate then your decisions as an asset manager. So 86 00:06:33.560 --> 00:06:40.319 really, the principles and the risks surrounding a five megawab side or a five 87 00:06:40.399 --> 00:06:44.639 hundred megawat sides tend to be substantially the same, more than the size. 88 00:06:44.839 --> 00:06:48.240 What has been very interesting for us during the year is the complexity of your 89 00:06:48.279 --> 00:06:55.040 interaction with the market. Moving from a market where you are generating your electricity 90 00:06:55.160 --> 00:07:00.680 and your level your nine comes from subsidies is a very different operational proposition that 91 00:07:00.879 --> 00:07:04.720 operating in a market where you have even a suitable merchant exposure, where you 92 00:07:04.800 --> 00:07:12.040 have a ppa with a corporate that relies on your continuous generational energy for them 93 00:07:12.079 --> 00:07:15.879 to be able to power their factories. Your mentality shifts a bit from being 94 00:07:16.000 --> 00:07:20.560 just a generator that inject energy to the grid, to a service provider to 95 00:07:20.600 --> 00:07:24.879 someone else's whether it's a market or whether it's a corporate. So more than 96 00:07:24.959 --> 00:07:29.639 the size of the sites, the complexity of the market we're operating in is 97 00:07:29.680 --> 00:07:31.920 the one that has driven some of the changes in mindset and some of the 98 00:07:32.000 --> 00:07:38.439 changes in business operations processes that we have applied from an asset management and general 99 00:07:38.480 --> 00:07:42.399 ownership perspective. Can I ask you a little bit about the JV that you 100 00:07:42.439 --> 00:07:46.199 did with PPA, because I can say this is the old world meeting the 101 00:07:46.240 --> 00:07:53.000 new world, but it's also big bureaucracy meeting innovative startup. How's that worked 102 00:07:53.000 --> 00:07:57.000 out? Maybe a bit of history so that I can frame what happened when 103 00:07:57.079 --> 00:08:01.079 we entered into the JV. Of course, Less was funded in twenty ten, 104 00:08:01.399 --> 00:08:05.560 and when we completed the transaction with UP and entered into the Inventor it 105 00:08:05.639 --> 00:08:09.519 was the end of twenty seventeen. So during those seven years we had already 106 00:08:09.560 --> 00:08:13.160 started expanding slightly outside of the UK in a couple of different countries. I 107 00:08:13.199 --> 00:08:18.279 suppose we were in a part of our journey where we felt that there was 108 00:08:18.399 --> 00:08:20.800 more we could achieve, more, we could get more value we could generate 109 00:08:20.879 --> 00:08:26.000 by deploying our ways of working in even multiple countries, and we needed a 110 00:08:26.040 --> 00:08:30.279 partner to make sure that that was enabled. And there was the overall ethos 111 00:08:30.319 --> 00:08:33.639 of the V. When you enter into the type of GV, the concern 112 00:08:33.759 --> 00:08:37.000 or the question around what is going to happen to my day to day? 113 00:08:37.159 --> 00:08:41.519 Am I going to receive impositions around how I have to work? Or expectation 114 00:08:41.840 --> 00:08:48.200 around how my internal checking balances and bureaucracy should work. VP has been very, 115 00:08:48.279 --> 00:08:52.759 very respectful of our culture. We have not been asked to fundamentally change 116 00:08:52.799 --> 00:08:56.639 the way we work. We have not been asked to fundamentally increase our level 117 00:08:56.679 --> 00:09:03.960 of bureaucracy or checking balances. They have helped us raise the bar on certain 118 00:09:03.159 --> 00:09:09.639 aspects of corporate functions. Our ass in safety performance has improved very significantly. 119 00:09:09.919 --> 00:09:13.960 We have mated that our compliance functions. There are a number of expectations they 120 00:09:15.039 --> 00:09:18.960 set to us around what good would look like, but thee how to get 121 00:09:20.000 --> 00:09:24.159 there has been very much down to us. Of course, we also had 122 00:09:24.159 --> 00:09:28.320 the opportunity of having secconments between the two organization. So my boss is a 123 00:09:28.360 --> 00:09:31.799 secondly from VP, our group chief operating officer, and I think that type 124 00:09:31.799 --> 00:09:37.960 of cross contamination has been very helpful as well. The beauty of having a 125 00:09:37.039 --> 00:09:43.600 partner like VP and having VP employees coming and working alongside us is having access 126 00:09:43.679 --> 00:09:48.919 to an enormous amount of learning that can really help us further accelerate our growth 127 00:09:48.000 --> 00:09:54.519 trajectory. We can avoid pitfalls that other companies have gone through ten years ago. 128 00:09:54.639 --> 00:09:56.480 We don't need to reinvent the wheel. There are quite a lot of 129 00:09:56.559 --> 00:10:01.320 interesting learning points we can take from them. So I think if you embrace 130 00:10:01.679 --> 00:10:03.960 a GV of this type in this way, and if you have a partner 131 00:10:03.960 --> 00:10:07.480 that actually allows you to decide how you go from A to B, it 132 00:10:07.519 --> 00:10:11.960 can be a very very successful relationship. You talked about digital, and I 133 00:10:13.000 --> 00:10:18.039 think now we all agree that the energy transition is also a digital revolution. 134 00:10:18.440 --> 00:10:22.399 So how has digital change within the management of your operation in the past year? 135 00:10:22.519 --> 00:10:28.720 So what is different? We have taken quite an interesting view on digital. 136 00:10:28.759 --> 00:10:31.559 So, first of all, the role that I'm covering now was specifically 137 00:10:31.600 --> 00:10:37.480 designed to lead our digital transformation. And our business transformation. When we had 138 00:10:37.519 --> 00:10:41.919 that conversation at the end of twenty twenty, there was quite pioneering from our 139 00:10:41.159 --> 00:10:46.080 executives. So our day to day is looking at the way we work and 140 00:10:46.159 --> 00:10:52.120 see how we can deliver digital tools to improve people life. Our very first 141 00:10:52.120 --> 00:10:56.919 focus was on why don't we look at the data that comes from our side 142 00:10:56.200 --> 00:11:01.960 as an asset, as an additional source of value and how can we harvest 143 00:11:01.960 --> 00:11:05.639 additional value out of the data. Of course, we're not a technology company, 144 00:11:05.759 --> 00:11:09.399 so we don't have the pretense of going out and designing our own software. 145 00:11:09.440 --> 00:11:15.200 But what we can do is actually investing in our data, making sure 146 00:11:15.320 --> 00:11:20.559 that is store used for computing, curated and transformed by us according to our 147 00:11:20.639 --> 00:11:26.039 own internal rules. We decide the math, we control it, and that 148 00:11:26.240 --> 00:11:30.320 is a slightly different approach that we have taken from very many other suppliers. 149 00:11:30.360 --> 00:11:35.559 So we use a number of technology providers, but our data sets in our 150 00:11:35.639 --> 00:11:39.600 own data lake. We do not accept black boxes that we have no control 151 00:11:39.720 --> 00:11:43.759 upon in so far our data is concern. We use black boxes to be 152 00:11:43.840 --> 00:11:50.320 able to do some extraction and automated calculation of KPIs one of the things that 153 00:11:50.360 --> 00:11:54.840 we have done for our operating team as been allowing them to use advanced analytic 154 00:11:54.919 --> 00:12:03.320 systems for them to accelerate both the normal reporting obligation and requirement, but also 155 00:12:03.360 --> 00:12:09.519 accelerates their ability of doing site behavior and side performance comparison and understand the root 156 00:12:09.559 --> 00:12:15.519 cause of underperformance as quickly as possible, minimizing the site visits. This allows 157 00:12:15.600 --> 00:12:18.399 us to be faster in taking decision, but also to be fair, the 158 00:12:18.480 --> 00:12:22.519 less you have to be on side, the less you have service spit engineer 159 00:12:22.559 --> 00:12:24.879 in a car going and troubleshooting to site, The less you have risk of 160 00:12:24.960 --> 00:12:28.759 vehicle accident, the less you have the risk of people working alone on a 161 00:12:28.840 --> 00:12:33.960 side. So it actually has a cascade effect on quite a number of different 162 00:12:33.240 --> 00:12:39.200 risk profiles across the organization. But actually what we have realized starting delivering this 163 00:12:39.320 --> 00:12:43.519 type of products to the business is that there is quite a lot that we 164 00:12:43.519 --> 00:12:46.879 can do for our engineering teams and our front and teams in development. So 165 00:12:46.919 --> 00:12:52.960 the company has invested quite significantly in gis SO geographical and spatial systems so that 166 00:12:54.039 --> 00:12:58.440 we can support our developer in identifying sites that are suitable for sort of development 167 00:12:58.440 --> 00:13:03.759 with all of the potential restriction, much much quicker. What is very interesting 168 00:13:03.919 --> 00:13:09.440 is after a while you realize that whilst all of these ways to extract value 169 00:13:09.480 --> 00:13:13.960 from the data are amazing results, they are actually not the objective of a 170 00:13:13.960 --> 00:13:20.679 business transformation or a digitalization journey. The real objective that you are achieving is 171 00:13:20.720 --> 00:13:26.360 really fundamentally changing and shifting the employment experience of your colleagues. I have actually 172 00:13:26.399 --> 00:13:31.240 stopped thinking my objective is giving a tool that can increase the availability of the 173 00:13:31.320 --> 00:13:37.360 side, and I'm starting thinking that my objective as leader of this transformation is 174 00:13:37.600 --> 00:13:41.639 fundamentally changing the way it feels for My calling to work for LISPP is having 175 00:13:41.639 --> 00:13:46.320 the guys coming to the office and thinking I am in the twenty first century. 176 00:13:46.759 --> 00:13:50.919 I'm not copy pasting in Excel anymore. I am doing something different. 177 00:13:50.080 --> 00:13:54.200 I am doing something funkier. A computer is doing the hard work, and 178 00:13:54.279 --> 00:13:58.159 I can actually deliver more value with my creativity, but it requires a lot 179 00:13:58.159 --> 00:14:03.799 of investments on special skills, and they are very expensive skills. Because data 180 00:14:03.840 --> 00:14:09.159 engineer, data scientists, data governance specialists can work for renewables, can work 181 00:14:09.200 --> 00:14:13.720 for all and us can work for banks, can go for a variety of 182 00:14:13.759 --> 00:14:18.759 different industries, and so they are very difficult to find and very difficult to 183 00:14:18.840 --> 00:14:22.879 keep motivated and to keep working for us, and also requires a lot of 184 00:14:22.919 --> 00:14:28.519 diligence from everyone across the organization because we are all used to download and fancy 185 00:14:28.600 --> 00:14:33.240 up in our iPhone and sometimes we think that the apps and the systems we 186 00:14:33.279 --> 00:14:37.320 within the office are the same thing, but actually the backbone, the data 187 00:14:37.360 --> 00:14:43.159 structor the data organization behind it. Maintaining that, curating that continuously asking what 188 00:14:43.200 --> 00:14:46.879 goods look like and applying the math to it requires a lot of effort, 189 00:14:48.320 --> 00:14:52.080 a lot of time, and a lot of discipline, and the discipline for 190 00:14:52.200 --> 00:14:58.039 a startuppy mentality company sometimes it's difficult to nail down. So where I'm seeing 191 00:14:58.240 --> 00:15:01.720 digital going, can I ask you about the sort of optimization of the assets? 192 00:15:01.799 --> 00:15:05.440 What do you do in that area? So there are a number of 193 00:15:05.440 --> 00:15:11.759 different things that you can do. Optimization might be both acceleration in resolving a 194 00:15:11.799 --> 00:15:16.919 specific problem. You have a failure, you understand quicker what that failures is 195 00:15:16.960 --> 00:15:22.480 caused by, and the device a plan for fixing that particular problem faster. 196 00:15:22.039 --> 00:15:28.000 You optimize your response, understanding and resolution time fundamentally, so you increase your 197 00:15:28.080 --> 00:15:33.159 uptime. The other element of it is actually started looking at the sites not 198 00:15:33.639 --> 00:15:37.440 in a vacuum and in a silos, but in comparison mode, so you 199 00:15:37.480 --> 00:15:41.879 can actually try to see which sites are performing very well and why, and 200 00:15:41.919 --> 00:15:46.600 then you can try to bring other size that they have similar characteristic up the 201 00:15:46.679 --> 00:15:50.960 curve. You can start comparing the performance in different technology, in different environments, 202 00:15:52.200 --> 00:15:56.600 on in different type of design of the sites and see in which type 203 00:15:56.639 --> 00:16:00.000 of environmental condition and which type of design a certain component and it works better 204 00:16:00.039 --> 00:16:07.600 than others. And then this educates your next procurement strategy or your next development 205 00:16:07.639 --> 00:16:11.639 design of a site. All of that is instead of reserving an issue, 206 00:16:11.759 --> 00:16:17.639 preempting potentialation to happening, and try to ensure that you actually start your base 207 00:16:17.720 --> 00:16:21.679 case from an even higher position than what you had before. We always talk 208 00:16:21.720 --> 00:16:26.399 about optimization though without realizing that optimization is just the tip of the iceberg is 209 00:16:26.399 --> 00:16:30.399 what generally people can see outside of the water, but the large majority of 210 00:16:30.440 --> 00:16:34.759 the work that assets services team do on the ground and back in the offices 211 00:16:34.840 --> 00:16:40.519 if they are on the asset manager on monitoring side of things, just to 212 00:16:40.559 --> 00:16:44.639 reach your base case, which is the water level of the iceberg. Is 213 00:16:44.879 --> 00:16:49.639 a mountain, is a huge amount of work that generally get not seen or 214 00:16:49.679 --> 00:16:56.720 appreciated. So fundamentally, we have as an industry grew up with this myth 215 00:16:56.840 --> 00:17:00.320 that as long as you stick the panels to the ground, the fun is 216 00:17:00.360 --> 00:17:06.599 shining and the base case just happens. I'm always asked what optimization means and 217 00:17:06.680 --> 00:17:08.599 what we can do to optimize, And there are a number of other examples 218 00:17:08.599 --> 00:17:12.039 that I can give you on how we are optimizing, how often or how 219 00:17:12.119 --> 00:17:15.200 quickly we clean panels, whether we clean or we clean knot panels, for 220 00:17:15.279 --> 00:17:21.759 instance. But really what for me as a digital provider is more important is 221 00:17:22.000 --> 00:17:25.640 how do I make the day to day of the guys that are actually working 222 00:17:25.759 --> 00:17:29.599 to make sure that the base case is realized better? How do I help 223 00:17:29.680 --> 00:17:34.079 them make that experience more enjoyable, Because then the optimization is the funky part 224 00:17:34.119 --> 00:17:38.359 of the job, but it's very very small if compared to the overall efforts 225 00:17:38.440 --> 00:17:42.640 that an asset management and one MPT needs to put on the ground. You 226 00:17:42.720 --> 00:17:48.960 are in continentally hope you're in Brazil, You're in Texas or in Australia. 227 00:17:48.200 --> 00:17:53.160 The digital part here in relation to grids, which are extremely different. What 228 00:17:53.400 --> 00:17:57.119 would you see your role would be in relation to Okay, the assets look 229 00:17:57.160 --> 00:18:02.480 the same, but they're outside environment is very different, So how do you 230 00:18:02.519 --> 00:18:07.480 manage that? This question is actually very interesting because you think about the gride, 231 00:18:07.480 --> 00:18:11.680 which is an external counterpart. We have to deal with an important stakeholder. 232 00:18:11.000 --> 00:18:15.279 But actually you will find that even if you're working on internal, inward 233 00:18:15.319 --> 00:18:21.640 looking ways of working, there might be fundamental differences sometimes between how a certain 234 00:18:21.680 --> 00:18:26.160 business processes run in the UK, or in Brazil or in Australia. So 235 00:18:26.240 --> 00:18:30.519 even if you look inward for tools that are just supporting the day to day 236 00:18:30.559 --> 00:18:34.640 operation of the teams, you actually find yourself in having to design an architect 237 00:18:34.640 --> 00:18:41.599 it solutions that do support a degree of variety on the grid integration side of 238 00:18:41.640 --> 00:18:45.440 things or the market interaction side of things. Lovely that you mentioned Texas because 239 00:18:45.480 --> 00:18:49.200 the market there is rather complex. The way the data scientists work when they 240 00:18:49.319 --> 00:18:55.880 operationalize a product is very much around starting from one market, testing making sure 241 00:18:55.920 --> 00:18:59.920 that it works, and then they tackle the second market. They understand why 242 00:19:00.000 --> 00:19:03.079 this is the minimum standard common denominator that they can deploy, and then that 243 00:19:03.279 --> 00:19:07.640 minimum standard is the one that they deploy globally, and then you have to 244 00:19:07.680 --> 00:19:11.559 go and understand exactly the mechanics and the markets for each and every one of 245 00:19:11.599 --> 00:19:15.799 the market you operate with, and see how you have to flex an up 246 00:19:15.839 --> 00:19:19.599 on top to make sure that you are reflecting specifically the requirement of that market 247 00:19:19.880 --> 00:19:25.599 or that particularity is or the particular grid. What's white fascinating about the way 248 00:19:25.599 --> 00:19:30.279 they work is that progressively they tend to expand the minimum common denominator as much 249 00:19:30.319 --> 00:19:33.319 as they possibly can, so that when you have a new digital product, 250 00:19:33.720 --> 00:19:38.400 you make sure that that digital product is applicable as widely as possible. This 251 00:19:38.680 --> 00:19:45.920 requires actually quite a substantial understanding of what are the market regulation like, what 252 00:19:45.000 --> 00:19:49.920 are the dynamic of the market, what are technical requirement of every grade operator? 253 00:19:51.160 --> 00:19:55.039 And while it is challenging, I think is also the most interesting part 254 00:19:55.079 --> 00:19:57.880 of the job for a data scientist because it is when they are really sitting 255 00:19:59.279 --> 00:20:03.599 with the BIS, with the frontline users on a day to day basis to 256 00:20:03.799 --> 00:20:07.799 understand a job and make the sure that that job is correctly reflecting in the 257 00:20:07.880 --> 00:20:14.599 digital tool. There is no civil bullet to have one tool that covers everything, 258 00:20:15.079 --> 00:20:19.759 but the silver bullet is how do you work with your frontline We are 259 00:20:21.079 --> 00:20:26.559 always used to imagine the IT and data people sitting in a dark room coding 260 00:20:26.559 --> 00:20:30.680 their life away day in day out, And actually I put the leg about 261 00:20:30.720 --> 00:20:33.480 it. Every day they love to work all nighters for some reason. They 262 00:20:33.519 --> 00:20:38.799 sleep in the morning and work overnight, a very interesting pattern. But actually 263 00:20:40.079 --> 00:20:45.039 the strength of a digital transformation is when the coders and the scientists are sitting 264 00:20:45.119 --> 00:20:49.640 with the frontline business because they need to be able to understand what the markets 265 00:20:49.640 --> 00:20:53.160 requirements are. They need to understand what it is that it is the daily 266 00:20:53.240 --> 00:20:56.960 experience of working of their colleagues to be able to put them in a digital 267 00:20:57.000 --> 00:21:02.319 tool. And this is very interesting because us require a shift of skills on 268 00:21:02.480 --> 00:21:06.920 people on the front line too, because they need to learn how to make 269 00:21:07.559 --> 00:21:11.839 very simple, very complex concept, how to explain their work in a very 270 00:21:11.960 --> 00:21:15.759 very simple way so that it can be synthetized in a digital tool. I 271 00:21:15.920 --> 00:21:18.960 jell you can I ask you to talk a little bit about the future, 272 00:21:19.000 --> 00:21:23.160 because when I'm coming from and all of this is we've got artificial intelligence coming 273 00:21:23.200 --> 00:21:26.720 at us left, right in center, and you're at the forefront. So 274 00:21:26.759 --> 00:21:30.799 how do you see it and how does it impact your business? And renewables 275 00:21:30.799 --> 00:21:36.200 going forward. How do I see the future. I always say that the 276 00:21:36.440 --> 00:21:41.640 purpose of my team is to future prove our operation. I don't see a 277 00:21:41.720 --> 00:21:48.039 fundamental difference between today and the future in the sense that what I have learned 278 00:21:48.039 --> 00:21:53.440 by working with digital specialists is that the future is just yet another ititeration of 279 00:21:53.480 --> 00:21:59.039 the presence. The way they work is very much around trial and error, 280 00:21:59.440 --> 00:22:03.079 trial and keep on going. And so what I find it very interesting is 281 00:22:03.079 --> 00:22:07.640 then it becomes a continuum. You don't really have a breakthrough. You keep 282 00:22:07.759 --> 00:22:10.880 going. It might be a breakthrough for people that are not in the day 283 00:22:10.920 --> 00:22:15.359 to day. What I'm thinking about when I think about the future is a 284 00:22:15.480 --> 00:22:22.079 continuous evolution. Is more, is faster, is deeper reach. The way 285 00:22:22.440 --> 00:22:30.759 I am envisaging our organization to work is an organization where we've really breakdown silos 286 00:22:30.839 --> 00:22:33.240 and I'm really hoping that the thing that Renewable will be able to do, 287 00:22:33.279 --> 00:22:40.079 and renewable companies because they tend to be quite entrepreneurial and not young from an 288 00:22:40.160 --> 00:22:45.640 agraphic perspective, but from a mentality perspective, is bringing in a bit more 289 00:22:45.640 --> 00:22:49.359 diversity and keep on right rating and keep on adapting and keep on learning. 290 00:22:51.279 --> 00:22:56.160 We are going to have to answer ethical questions around our use of digital tools. 291 00:22:56.559 --> 00:23:00.880 We're going to have to answer an ethical question around what do we use 292 00:23:00.920 --> 00:23:03.920 this tool for. Let alone the cybersecurity part of it, which I'm not 293 00:23:03.960 --> 00:23:08.160 even touching upon, but that type of security will actually be a very, 294 00:23:08.319 --> 00:23:14.319 very very important future skills for us to build as an industry, both for 295 00:23:14.400 --> 00:23:18.480 the security of our operating sites but also for the security of our own empoy 296 00:23:18.519 --> 00:23:23.160 and our companies. But fundamentally, the ethical questions will be around how do 297 00:23:23.200 --> 00:23:30.079 we make sure that we embed this technology still respecting the individual talent and capability 298 00:23:30.079 --> 00:23:33.720 of the people we have, and still making sure that we have opportunity to 299 00:23:33.839 --> 00:23:38.039 expand our organization, get new talent in, and get new people to work. 300 00:23:38.440 --> 00:23:41.880 So I'm forcing my kids to do coding training, not because I think 301 00:23:41.880 --> 00:23:47.359 they're going to become coders in the future, but because it's going to become 302 00:23:47.519 --> 00:23:52.640 second nature. The way today we use Excel in three days sign is going 303 00:23:52.640 --> 00:23:56.279 to be the way we use power bi. At the beginning of this year, 304 00:23:56.279 --> 00:24:00.000 we did an entire roadshow to teach more than three hundred of our college 305 00:24:00.799 --> 00:24:04.880 how to use powerbi, out of which the Powerbi becomes the new Excel and 306 00:24:06.039 --> 00:24:10.119 in two years time it's going to be the next evolution of visual tools. 307 00:24:10.160 --> 00:24:15.640 It's really about making sure that we prepare people with the right skills because these 308 00:24:15.680 --> 00:24:18.160 iteration is not going to stop, and the right skill of both from a 309 00:24:18.279 --> 00:24:23.400 user side but also from an understanding of what is behind the cold. So 310 00:24:23.440 --> 00:24:30.200 I'm thinking that we will have to relearn some skills as leaders to speak the 311 00:24:30.240 --> 00:24:34.759 same language of new talent that is coming into the organizations. We will have 312 00:24:34.880 --> 00:24:41.480 to become very very well versed on what cybersecurity means, because we cannot be 313 00:24:41.920 --> 00:24:47.920 such an important integral part of the generation of electricity in any country we operate 314 00:24:48.519 --> 00:24:53.200 and not taking the security and the protection of our infrastructure extremely seriously, and 315 00:24:53.240 --> 00:24:59.920 that requires a very high level of specialism and sophistication. Learning these new skills 316 00:25:00.319 --> 00:25:04.200 will become more more important. I don't think we will be able to look 317 00:25:04.240 --> 00:25:11.519 at people's CV without also asking ourselves or asking them how much data literacy is 318 00:25:11.559 --> 00:25:17.720 part of their experience, what type of digital skills they have. This will 319 00:25:17.799 --> 00:25:22.640 definitely be part of our future, but ultimately we are still in a position 320 00:25:22.680 --> 00:25:26.839 where technology can help us do our well work better as opposed to take jobs 321 00:25:26.839 --> 00:25:30.039 away, and we absolutely need to embrace that because there is no way back. 322 00:25:30.759 --> 00:25:37.279 Well, Adele, it's a wonderful way to conclude our conversation. Very 323 00:25:37.279 --> 00:25:41.039 hopeful, very thoughtful as well. Oh I love us, I love us. 324 00:25:41.119 --> 00:25:45.920 I think it's a great way and really brilliantient and I especially love the 325 00:25:45.920 --> 00:25:48.000 fact that you're getting your kids to code. How old are they may ask? 326 00:25:49.039 --> 00:25:53.039 So my eldest is about to turn thirteen and my youngest is then, 327 00:25:53.599 --> 00:25:57.799 and it's wonderful. Yesterday, for the first time, I couldn't make my 328 00:25:57.880 --> 00:26:02.400 outpad work, and my son managed to fix it for me. So there 329 00:26:02.440 --> 00:26:07.000 you go. I have in house it support excellent. Thank you very much 330 00:26:07.000 --> 00:26:11.200 for coming and I wish you the best and light SOURSEVP as well, thank 331 00:26:11.200 --> 00:26:15.480 you very much for having me brilliant. Oh job, I'm so old. 332 00:26:15.599 --> 00:26:19.519 I'm so old. Why Because she's teaching her kids programming languages and you can 333 00:26:19.599 --> 00:26:26.799 barely use Excel. They are using a software I didn't even know existed. 334 00:26:30.240 --> 00:26:36.079 That's pretty crazyness. Before we comment on what Ather is doing, generally speaking, 335 00:26:36.200 --> 00:26:40.960 I would say BP has been very lucky or very smart because the way 336 00:26:41.000 --> 00:26:45.599 they are managing their gvs seems to be in what I would call the goldilog 337 00:26:45.720 --> 00:26:49.759 zone, which has allowed license BP to grow that fast. So they benefit 338 00:26:49.960 --> 00:26:56.240 from teaming with a great, big energy company without having the downside of bureaucracy 339 00:26:56.279 --> 00:27:00.079 and everything. Can I tell you a funny story. The story is that 340 00:27:00.319 --> 00:27:03.920 another solo company which I won't name, but I remember calling up the CEO 341 00:27:04.200 --> 00:27:08.079 after he'd been acquired by a particular oil company, and he said to me, 342 00:27:08.440 --> 00:27:11.720 Jared, I'm really sorry, but I have to hang up the call 343 00:27:11.759 --> 00:27:14.000 now. And I said, what I says? You called me? I 344 00:27:14.039 --> 00:27:15.559 was just calling you back, and he broke out laughing. He says, 345 00:27:15.759 --> 00:27:19.319 yeah, he says, that's the regulations in this oil company. He says, 346 00:27:19.319 --> 00:27:22.039 I'm not allowed telephone in the car. I said, put your telephone. 347 00:27:22.079 --> 00:27:26.759 He says, I'm using my private phone. And why I say that 348 00:27:27.200 --> 00:27:30.319 is that, you know? He basically said to me listening, I'm not 349 00:27:30.359 --> 00:27:33.960 going to stay here. The cultures ridiculous. And then I called Nick Boyle, 350 00:27:33.079 --> 00:27:36.759 who's the CEO of Light Source, and I said, so, Nick, 351 00:27:36.839 --> 00:27:38.640 how's it gone? And he said amazing? He said, really, 352 00:27:38.720 --> 00:27:42.720 Jared win win situation. He says, these guys are allowing me the freedom 353 00:27:42.759 --> 00:27:47.160 to succeed. But are they're giving me what I need, which is the 354 00:27:47.200 --> 00:27:52.839 balance sheet, which is their access to industrial customers and an and and I 355 00:27:52.880 --> 00:27:56.720 thought brilliant. So BP have done a great job with light Source. They 356 00:27:56.759 --> 00:28:00.079 really have, you know. So when I really listened to our conversation while 357 00:28:00.079 --> 00:28:03.720 I was editing, there are a few points which are absolutely remarkable, and 358 00:28:03.960 --> 00:28:08.079 we can discuss a bit about them. She said, investing in our data 359 00:28:08.319 --> 00:28:12.359 is investing in our people. It's a very very interesting statement. You're absolutely 360 00:28:12.400 --> 00:28:15.079 right. I'm thank you for bringing that back to me, because what she 361 00:28:15.240 --> 00:28:18.720 was saying was people get bored, right, and we need to keep them 362 00:28:18.839 --> 00:28:22.079 interested. Especially I've got a whole pile of people who are sitting at a 363 00:28:22.119 --> 00:28:26.359 desk all day. If they're doing the same task again and again and again, 364 00:28:26.400 --> 00:28:27.680 it's pretty monotonous, and you get bored, you move on. That's 365 00:28:27.680 --> 00:28:30.400 what I took out of it. What did you take out of it? 366 00:28:30.519 --> 00:28:34.559 She said, There's another quote which I found remarkable. The future is just 367 00:28:34.759 --> 00:28:40.680 another iteration of the present. Yeah, and again it's coming from her digital 368 00:28:40.759 --> 00:28:45.799 view of the world. It's lovely. It's lovely my overall conclusion, And 369 00:28:45.960 --> 00:28:49.359 of course we were wondering what was the secret source of the success of such 370 00:28:49.519 --> 00:28:55.640 organization. The secret source is a humanity. Very good. I would just 371 00:28:55.759 --> 00:29:00.640 use a different word. I'd actually use it's a growth culture within that business. 372 00:29:00.799 --> 00:29:03.839 And she did talk about that and how it's not a top down thing. 373 00:29:03.319 --> 00:29:07.960 This is a thing that came from the team itself, and I thought 374 00:29:07.000 --> 00:29:11.319 that's really, really, really really interesting. Right, Okay, Chad, 375 00:29:11.640 --> 00:29:15.680 We really thank Adele for coming onto the show. We thank Phoebe sl for 376 00:29:15.799 --> 00:29:19.880 being partner of this episode, and I took to you in two Weekstein look 377 00:29:19.920 --> 00:29:25.319 forward to it. Thank you for listening to Redefining Energy. Don't forget to 378 00:29:25.400 --> 00:29:30.759 rate the show and subscribe on Apple, Podcast, Spotify, or the platform 379 00:29:30.839 --> 00:29:32.279 of your choice.