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Hello, Radio Land, Welcome back
to Desks and Dork's, your favorite game

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design and creation podcast. As always
get shaped by you. We bring you

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the best indie tabletop gaming. I
am your dastardly dazzling DJ Graham against to

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Kyle's Dork, Kyle Kyle? Are
you Kyle's busy Dying? I was not

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prepared for like the ASMR smooth talk
opening, and I loved it. I'm

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doing great, Graham. Um yeah, Desks and Dorks, that's right,

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that's right, hey baby, Yeah, what kind of gaming have you been

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doing this week? That is a
great I actually have done a lot of

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gaming. Um. One of the
things that we have wanted to do this

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summer is that I have a massive
shelf of shame. Um like at this

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point, who doesn't well at this
point, it's like three calaxes of shame.

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So yeah, it's a problem and
a lot of it's a lot of

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shame. That's like a that's like
a Puritan migration to America's worth her shame

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right there. Um. Any case, so I got out to Puritans.

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Shout out to the Puritans. Man, you guys you were something you existed,

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um and uh yeah, So I
met with a bunch of my friends

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last week at our local game store, and I I we crushed like a

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bunch of different games that some of
which I've heard of, some of which

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I had never heard of, and
I picked up at like thrift stores like

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swat meets for like dirt cheap,
and I was like, I want to

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try this. Um So, I
introduced Isaac Kristin, friend of the show,

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to battle Ball, which is just
Chef's kiss of a game. Uh,

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it's like the It's like Blood Bowls, much simpler, Baby Cousin that

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was produced in Hasbro in the early
two thousands. For those of you who

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have not bl I know you knew
at Grahams. I mean, we love

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Hasbro here on desks and you know, here's the thing. We do love

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their stuff. I just wish they'd
made some less Prinkerton involved decisions. I

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think they should bring in Pinkerton's to
all their major decisions. Honestly, I

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don't think they've gone far enough.
What would the Pinkerton run game company look

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like? That would be? That's
an interesting thing. Um So, Yeah,

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we played battle Ball. Though absolutely
love Battleball still slaps, It's still

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incredible. It's as fast paced easy
to learn, streamlined as I thought it

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was going to be when I was
a kid. M We played No,

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which is like a Ravensburger trivia game, which was pretty decent. It uses

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a Google Assistant to like help you
out. I played Stranger Things Attack of

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the mind Flare, which may be
the worst licensed tie in game since to

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Dragon Society. Whoa, whoa.
It was awful, um and like,

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I'm okay to write it briefly in
like three sentences. I think I've seen

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the ads for it around, But
the licensed is it? Is it in

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the same It's a social deduction game, so it's a social one player is

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working for the mindful and trying to
knock out or convert the other players.

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But if I can tell you why
it's bad in one sentence, they screwed

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up the rules. It's impossible to
win if you're the Mindflare player. Why

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so in the player count that we
played at, it is impossible to win

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the rules because you need to give
the mind Flare card to another player as

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long as there's not a memory card
in their hand when you do so.

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There is two mind Flare cards in
the deck. One of them is given

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to you. The mind is given
to the mind Flare player at the start

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of the game, and the other
one is shuffled in. So in your

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twelve card deck there is one mind
Flare card and three Memory cards. And

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the way the rules are written,
if you get the memory card, it

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wipes out the mind Flare card if
you're not the original Mindflare, So the

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odds of you getting the mind Flare
card are ad and the odds of you

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getting it with a memory are really
high. And then the way the rules

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are written, if it was so, you can also knock out other players

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by like you just pass these cards, so there's like an accident card that

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like knocks the people out, which
so the game ends when you get to

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two players. So if there's one
mind Flare and one regular person left,

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you might think, oh, well, then that means the mind Flair wins

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because they've done a really good job
and they've knocked at it. Nope,

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they just lose if there's even one
person remained. Yeah, so they literally

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didn't test the rules. I fully
think that this was probably some social deduction

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game that no one liked and it
was just in like their slush pile,

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Like I have a shadow rum folder
on my computer of like game prototypes,

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they are never going to go anywhere, and I think that they were just

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like, we need to get this
project done. Graphic design had must have

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had the project finished in a day, because it's mostly just PNGs from the

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show and they just stapled the fast
this design they could do it so they

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could get it out to publication in
print. I love social deduction games.

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I even I like Scuffed social deduction
games too, like I, but this

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game was it was abysmal. What
else did we try? The Boss weird

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little bluffing game from Blue Orange Games
about being a mob hidden information, surprisingly

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decent, played Wanted Richard Dead,
which was this like little light asymmetric wild

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West game kind of fun. And
then I played Scotland Yard, which that

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was my first time ever playing Scotland
Yard. Will you enjoyed it? Um?

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Really enjoyed it. And then we
played Tobago, which was a world

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Rio grand game about being archaeologists looking
for treasure on the islands of Trinidad and

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Tobago. How would you think of
that one? It good? Was surprisingly

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good? Like it was it was. I don't know if you've played that

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one or not, but you like
I don't think though you people so like

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it's weird to describe to people.
But you have these treasure cards. So

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you're of these cubes, these wooden
cubes that you place on the board.

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Cubes, got it so far on
board, right, But there are four

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treasures on the board at all times, and rather than have a predetermined location

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for them, the entire game is
driven by these condition cards. And so

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on your turn, you can either
move your RV around or you can play

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a condition card on any of the
four treasures and that condition card. So

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like, let's say, like the
first condition card you play is this must

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be next to the largest river on
the board. Sure, yeah, right,

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so you put all of the cubes
of that treasure color next to the

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largest river on the board, and
then somebody could add to that condition later

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on. Okay, so it has
to be next to large river. It

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can't be in a forest tile.
You pull all the cubes out of the

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forest tile, and you're basically whittling
down where that treasure can be. And

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if you're the one that digs up
the treasure, you automatically get a free

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you pull from the treasure deck.
But everyone that has contributed a condition card

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to that treasure will also get a
card from the treasure deck for each condition

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they've added, regardless of whether or
not they were the ones to dig it

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up. It's a really intriguing design. I've never played anything quite like it.

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Yeah, yeah, I'm into it. I really like that in this

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sort of you know, generative way
to do mind sweeper essentially, how do

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you take that out? It also
reminds me of in an RP setting,

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how you create intrigue in a no
prep prep is deathway. You start without

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the answer, but each step creates
more and more, takes away the fog

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of war, the fog of war
that is hiding actually nothing. But once

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you have the information, you can
then create the thing, which is it's

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a way to listen and do.
If you have sort of your mind sweeper,

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you need to somehow randomly generate it, or you need only a limited

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number of scenarios that you can you
can burn through. So the idea that

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it's a play applied through play that's
really really fun. That and the way

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that you I was pumping my arm
because I was like, the way you

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described it is so perfect, right. It's it's mind sweeper that iterates as

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you play is a really interesting way
to talk about Taraego. So it might

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not have been the most fun that
I had that day, but it was

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just so intriguing. I like,
it was like, I don't know,

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this is why I go to thrift
stores and just buy random games that I've

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ever tried, because I never know
what I'm gonna find, and like every

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so often I hit something like Tobago
and I'm like, oh my god,

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this is why I do what I
do. So super cool. Grham,

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what kind of gaming have you been
doing before before we jump into today's topic,

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Well, I have a be in
my bonnet excited about something I've ever

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done before because I avoided miniatures war
game in my entire life because I would

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look at it from afar and be
like, that's insane. It's a lot

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slowly walk out of the room,
right um. And I've been following a

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little YouTube channel called desksy Dorkey's and
they're talking about kit bashing, and the

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idea was so fascinated to me that
I went and got myself little pliers and

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a little superglue and got copies of
games from my own local thrift stories include

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it. I'm limited to Risk,
Lord of the Rings Risk, which I'm

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gonna rip apart teeny little orc stuff. I'm gonna put like rifles on them.

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So I've never done this before.
I'm really stoked because i want something

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to do with my hands and mess
around with, particularly in a space that

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is so open source as it were, in that I've never really done before,

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and that's I have the bare minimum
tools and I'm ready to go.

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So UM, our Monday Update episode, by the way, for our scripmash

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game is coming out, and I'm
very excited because there's some changes. I

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did another one of my live records
where we worked on some of the rules,

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so that is going to be coming
um as well as by the way,

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Graham's incredible logo behind him will be
on that. We'll be on that

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document as well. So we changed
the name to Cyclopean for some reasons that

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I actually get into in the Monday
one. I don't want to get into

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it here. You'll have to watch
the Monday video, but if you're interested

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in seeing, I was gonna go
run and get them, but I was

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like, no, we're having in
the middle of the podcast is a podcast,

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and it is an audio format.
I know, I know I wanted

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to. That's why I didn't.
I restraining myself. I'll get the free

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you after the show. But we
finished kit bashing our squads. Um awesome,

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and so uh, Gunnery Sergeant Gunther
is officially Gunther. Gunnery Sergeant Gunther,

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the man with a cannon for head
is officially It's officially you're ready to

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go. Um. So I'm excited. I'm excited to see what you you've

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got. I'm excited to play this
game too. Whether or not it's good.

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Who cares? That being good is
not the point of this game?

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Right? Exactly? Be a fun
I thinking of is it good? Who

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cares? What is our topic of
the podcast today? So our topic of

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the podcast today is a really cool
one born of a conversation that you and

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I had a couple episodes ago about
the house rules that we add. So

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we call this game breaking. This
is when there is something in an existing

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title, whether that's a rule,
a concept, an additional thing that you

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either add, change, tweak to
make the game more enjoyable or to make

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the game better fit the group that
you're playing with. So, for example,

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a couple like I have a couple
of really interesting house rules that we

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have done beforehand, but like Monopoly
is probably the most house ruled game of

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all time because nobody plays the way
that it's supposed to be played right,

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Like you don't you're not supposed to
collect the money from the free parking spot

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in Monopoly. That's a house rule
that has just been adopted widely by everybody.

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Or like people forget that you should
oppost to auction off a business if

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nobody wants to buy it, it's
available to all the players. That's also

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when the rules is written a Monopoly, but people don't do that. But

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essentially, game breaking is when we
add, change, tweak, subtract a

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rule, a concept, something from
the game's rules as written to make it

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better and more enjoyable for us.
So we're gonna be talking about some of

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the cool rules, tweaks, games, stuff that we do to make our

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games more enjoyable. And maybe some
of you will have some of these things,

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will have some new ideas, and
if you'd like to know, shout

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us out in the comments or whatever
and tell us what your favorite game breaking

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is. That would be awesome.
Because I love hearing house rules. House

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rules I think are like it's like
part of the reason I love games so

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much. So well, the Monopoly
two examples are really interesting because that is

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essentially game designed that people have done
and have taken a folk game level.

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It has spread to universality for two
very simple reasons. The free parking thing

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is because free parking doesn't do anything, and so at some point people are

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like, that doesn't sound right,
and it got adjusted and then unanimously everyone

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who played it with lack of core
that makes perfect sense, right, Um,

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it's not even a tweak. It
just it should have always been there

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because people it didn't. It didn't
clock in people's brains. They were already

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thinking like designers. And the auction
thing like that prevents the game from taking

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that eight hours that it like normally
does right. And but it's also gamy.

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It's kind of complicated, so it
makes sense that it's even though like

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as a quote unquote design choice,
it's the right one, it's the first

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thing to leave because nobody actually wants
to do it right, and because it's

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complicated and you have to remember specific
rules, whereas Monopoly in its like core

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form is roll a dye, trade
money, get things, and then repeat

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for eight to twelve hours. You
know, Um, so these these things

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hold no mystery to me, but
it very much has a path to least

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resist is kind of designed. Yeah, it makes perfect sense to me that

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there is no that people don't do
that, and that free parking has been

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transformed into an exciting thing because it
would be nothing as a result, which

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is very very funny. And so
here's the thing though, like I know,

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it just holds no mystery for you. That is the most eloquent way

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I've ever heard anyone explain those two
rules changes of monopoly, Like I don't

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think any other human being could have
done that better. Like you're just saying

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whatever, it makes sense to me. I'm like, I'm sitting You're going

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those a great way to describe that. I mean, you know, I

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am dastardly and dazzling and That's what
I'm here for. But yeah, this

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is gonna be just again, these
are by no means things you absolutely have

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to have in your games. But
these are just things that, like we

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have found have made games more enjoyable. And I really like that. And

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so yeah, I do a variety
of things on a list which go from

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like very very minor. So we
could like the lightning rounds in the middle.

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We could stop and discuss as we
go, because the more I thought

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about these, I was like,
I wanted to have big things, but

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I was trying to brainstorm. So
some of these are like these just little

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micro decisions. So why you want
to go first? I have a couple

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Like, so all of mine are
like maybe not major tweaks, but they

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are major in how they affect the
rules of certain games. And so I

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don't have a lighting round, I
just have a light um. And I

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also included, by the way,
some things that I found, So these

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are some of these are not rules
that I have done, but there are

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rules that I know other players and
other people I have talked to have done

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that I thought were interesting enough that
I wanted to mention. Um Like,

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there's one in here that I think
is absolutely freaking brilliant and I love it.

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Um So, so I guess I'll
start, because we started off to

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talking about Monopoly, I'm gonna go
from kind of that world. Um So,

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the like mass market games, games
that everyone grew up with it in

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the twentieth century. That kind of
has led to that that predisposition that board

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games are boring before our like designer
board game world that we now find ourselves

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completely immersed in. Um. Uh, So the way to fix something that

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pretty much everybody's in their life is
Guess who. Guess who is is pretty

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boring. Um. It's this like
simple logic puzzle. Um. And the

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way that you make Guess who good
is by not following the rules in a

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traditional logic puzzle way. It's uh, it's not who has a mustache?

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Who's wearing glasses? It's um who
looks like Definitely, you wouldn't show up

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to a second date with um who
who looks like? Um? They um

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are way too into serial killers?
UM? Who does does your does your

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00:16:33.559 --> 00:16:38.639
person? Uh look like? Uh? They will never not wear a hat

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no matter the social occasion. Um. This is this is how you play

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Guess who ye Because again, my
general point about most of my board games

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that I enjoy from a design standpoint
is ones that are good because of the

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players. UM, and Guess Who
has nothing to do with that. But

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once you start laughing and trading jokes
and descriptions with your friends, the game

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itself is now secondary of the experience, which is again something you enjoyed by

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our people. So, which is
amazing. Yeah, I love that change.

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My first change is also for a
mass market game. I detest the

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game Sorry, but it is one
that my really good friend, her name

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is Anna, who she lives in
Chicago now, but she and I have

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been friends since we were fourteen,
and so whenever we go and whenever she

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comes back to visit her family,
we always have a game night. She

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usually brings Sorry. It's something that
she enjoys. So for those of you

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who've never played the mass market game
Sorry, good work. You're living a

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good life. But also, the
game can only start when one player has

250
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a one or a two in order
to actually get moving, And so what

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happens is in the very beginning you
have this really long, monotonous play pattern

252
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of people just go and draw,
Go, draw, Go, draw go,

253
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And I've had that last as long
as twenty minutes. And then when

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you get into the late game,
part of the enjoyment of Sorry is that

255
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you can um land on another person's
piece and go sorry and knock them off,

256
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which is kind of part of the
fun, but it's really hard to

257
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do when you only only thing,
that's the only thing. Yeah, basic,

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people who love Sorry, don't they
just love snotily saying sorry when they

259
00:18:22.200 --> 00:18:25.440
get to do something mean, Yes, isn't that the beginning and the end

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00:18:25.640 --> 00:18:30.799
of precisely and so yes, yes, you are correct. So here's way

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00:18:30.920 --> 00:18:34.240
right, here's the change that we
used, um because I wanted to start

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the game off sooner, and I
wanted to make it so that you had

263
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more options, so that you could
land on other people's pieces with more ease,

264
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and you can kind of not strategize
too too much, because I think

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00:18:48.799 --> 00:18:52.839
what you said with the monopoly about
the auction thing is one hundred percent correct.

266
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I think it's just too much of
a game change. So all I

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did was I incorporated the bank of
cards from Ticket to Ride as sorry,

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so rather then so you can blind
draw from the top of the deck if

269
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you would like, but we usually
flip the top three or four cards in

270
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the deck and you can choose any
one of those available three cards to draw

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into your hand. Instead, I
did that, which honestly has made the

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game infinitely more enjoyable because now it's
like, oh cool, I don't have

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to wait twenty minutes to get started, or it's like, oh, I

274
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need this card so I can land
exactly on your piece and so someone else

275
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is like, well, I wasn't
going to move that piece, but now

276
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I know that you're going to land
on my piece next turn because you took

277
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the card that nails me next turn. So I'm gonna move a different piece

278
00:19:30.119 --> 00:19:33.640
so it doesn't add too much strategy
or too much difficulty. We've done nothing

279
00:19:33.680 --> 00:19:36.640
to the rules as written. All
we've done is we've said, hey,

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I just want a lettle more options
about how I interact with you, and

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it has made the game really enjoyable. I'll be honest, it's surprising how

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fast the game plays now and how
much more depth there is to the experience

283
00:19:48.039 --> 00:19:52.240
without making it more complicated. So
have you named your variant? Sorry?

284
00:19:52.279 --> 00:19:56.880
Not sorry. Oh that's so much
better. I was gonna call it.

285
00:19:57.039 --> 00:20:00.200
I'm really sorry, but sorry,
not sorry. I don't know. I

286
00:20:00.200 --> 00:20:03.799
think you should go with your first
instance. Oh no, sorry, not

287
00:20:03.880 --> 00:20:07.599
sorry, he's better. Sorry,
not sorry, He's definitely better. Um.

288
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Um, so my I mentioned mine
on the previous podcast, but I'm

289
00:20:14.799 --> 00:20:18.000
just gonna bring it up very quickly
again. Which because of its popularity,

290
00:20:18.039 --> 00:20:22.000
the amount of people I know who
own this game, which is super fight.

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Um, it's in the same sort
of cards are era where you have

292
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a hand of cards you play them
down to do stuff. But you have

293
00:20:30.680 --> 00:20:34.559
um noun cards and power cards,
and essentially it's who could fight and you

294
00:20:34.599 --> 00:20:37.079
pare them in your hands and you
put them down. That's that's the whole

295
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game. Um. But because of
course the game is called super fight,

296
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the goal is who will win in
this fight? Which immediately it sucks all

297
00:20:45.319 --> 00:20:49.200
the air out of the room.
So in the kind of guess who fashion

298
00:20:49.720 --> 00:20:55.039
each round, it's coming up with
whatever the scenario is, what are what

299
00:20:55.039 --> 00:20:57.319
are we looking to do? Who? Who could bake the best pie?

300
00:20:57.839 --> 00:21:02.400
All of a sudden, it's not
you know lot rockets and lasers and can

301
00:21:02.440 --> 00:21:06.759
turn invisible, being like, oh
that can beat these things? Much more

302
00:21:06.799 --> 00:21:10.920
boring conversation. Who's the best at
finding blueberries? Oh? Dang? And

303
00:21:10.960 --> 00:21:15.759
then I'm doing these you know?
Um? Who who would survive as the

304
00:21:15.839 --> 00:21:22.079
longest as the only person alive on
mars um. Creating new scenarios means that

305
00:21:22.160 --> 00:21:26.559
the game is interesting every round.
It's funny every round, and also recontextualizing

306
00:21:26.759 --> 00:21:32.119
powers again in this like black and
white board game space, which I find

307
00:21:32.400 --> 00:21:36.880
so so exhausting, is the worst
thing ever, the best thing ever things,

308
00:21:36.960 --> 00:21:40.559
you know, like the obsession with
tier lists, like why why would

309
00:21:40.599 --> 00:21:45.480
we why would we have that?
For everything? You're right right, we

310
00:21:45.480 --> 00:21:48.400
gotta keep it. We gotta keep
it for the brand, for the brand,

311
00:21:47.839 --> 00:21:56.000
for the brand um having something that
might traditionally be f t ar dtier

312
00:21:56.720 --> 00:22:00.759
bad and something that's traditionally s t
r A T year. It's all about

313
00:22:00.839 --> 00:22:06.440
context. So finding ways to flip
that context is the reason why I like,

314
00:22:06.599 --> 00:22:10.079
you know, limited formats, which
is why draft is exciting, and

315
00:22:10.119 --> 00:22:14.960
why you can take a party game
like super Fight and then completely changed the

316
00:22:14.960 --> 00:22:18.160
way that it is because you're changing
that context every single time. Yes,

317
00:22:18.559 --> 00:22:22.079
I'd love it, I love and
I love see I've heard of the guests

318
00:22:22.079 --> 00:22:25.759
who won before, and you have
talked to me out of the podcast about

319
00:22:25.799 --> 00:22:27.519
your super Fight change. But I
like, I have played super Fight once

320
00:22:27.559 --> 00:22:30.000
in my life. I was like, I don't I don't every want to

321
00:22:30.000 --> 00:22:33.160
play this again because all we did
was bigger about who was actually gonna win.

322
00:22:33.279 --> 00:22:37.279
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's
the equivalent of fighting with your friends

323
00:22:37.319 --> 00:22:40.440
about comic book characters, which again
is all about who the writer is.

324
00:22:40.799 --> 00:22:44.799
But isn't it more fun to talk
about something that, again you've made up,

325
00:22:44.960 --> 00:22:48.519
and then you get to argue for
why your rockets make it easier for

326
00:22:48.599 --> 00:22:51.799
your guy to go to the bottom
of the ocean and fight Atlantis. Yes,

327
00:22:52.000 --> 00:22:55.920
uh, like that's more fun than
Superman could easily be Batman. No,

328
00:22:56.000 --> 00:22:59.960
Batman could outplan him, right,
Like, I that that happened.

329
00:23:00.000 --> 00:23:02.680
Do you trip into those arguments just
being a nerd? I don't even a

330
00:23:02.720 --> 00:23:07.319
game to give me the structure to
do that anyway. Exactly. I have

331
00:23:07.359 --> 00:23:10.480
another mass market one that I really
like, and this is not a change

332
00:23:10.480 --> 00:23:12.119
that I have done, but it
is a change that I've heard multiple people

333
00:23:12.119 --> 00:23:15.640
play, and I want to highlight
on the channel because I think it's amazing.

334
00:23:15.400 --> 00:23:22.559
There is a variant of Clue called
Sherlock, and it's one of the

335
00:23:22.599 --> 00:23:25.119
things that I want to try as
part of the content that we do here

336
00:23:25.160 --> 00:23:27.559
on desks and doors. But essentially, you play a game of Clue and

337
00:23:27.960 --> 00:23:32.559
next to the clue board you set
up a Jenga tower, and on top

338
00:23:32.599 --> 00:23:36.039
of the Jenga tower is a little
lego figure who is your Sherlock, and

339
00:23:36.240 --> 00:23:41.680
anytime someone guesses something wrong, you
take x amount of blocks away from the

340
00:23:41.759 --> 00:23:47.839
Jenga tower and everyone loses and the
killer escapes. If the lego figure ever

341
00:23:47.880 --> 00:23:52.000
falls off the Jenga tower, Sherlock
has been killed. It is a weird

342
00:23:52.200 --> 00:23:57.319
variant rule, but it's one that
I've I've watched some people play and the

343
00:23:57.599 --> 00:24:03.359
tension, the excitement elevates Clue,
which is already a fine mass market game.

344
00:24:03.400 --> 00:24:07.720
Like I don't actually I don't dislike
Clue. Um. Had a conversation

345
00:24:07.720 --> 00:24:10.079
but this was some people the other
day and they like people were like weirdly

346
00:24:10.119 --> 00:24:11.799
hating on it. I was like, I don't think it's that bad.

347
00:24:11.359 --> 00:24:17.200
But the excitement that you get from
having that risk of do I make this

348
00:24:17.319 --> 00:24:21.079
guess? Um, it was really
interesting. So that's just one I wanted

349
00:24:21.119 --> 00:24:25.200
to highlight because I thought super cool. Um. So I have a couple

350
00:24:25.200 --> 00:24:27.720
of questions. Sure, so in
in Django, when you pull a brick,

351
00:24:27.759 --> 00:24:30.559
you have to place it back off
top of the tower. So how

352
00:24:30.599 --> 00:24:36.279
do you move Surelock, you don't, So you don't. You don't take

353
00:24:36.319 --> 00:24:38.119
the bricks and put them on top
of the tower. You were only removing

354
00:24:38.160 --> 00:24:44.119
bricks um from the tower. Yep. Yeah, it is a strict a

355
00:24:44.279 --> 00:24:48.359
strict subtraction. Yeah. Um again
I think it's cool. Also, I

356
00:24:48.400 --> 00:24:52.880
love Yeah, that's interesting because sure, of course one of my all time

357
00:24:52.920 --> 00:25:00.960
favorite RPGs, um the It's been
a while i've played Clue, but my

358
00:25:02.039 --> 00:25:06.119
memory is that you make quote unquote
wrong guesses all the time because then somebody

359
00:25:06.359 --> 00:25:08.799
secretly shows you a card and you
write something down on your little paper.

360
00:25:10.000 --> 00:25:12.440
Yes, so you know, they're
not really guesses. They're more like,

361
00:25:12.799 --> 00:25:18.079
uh, it's it's like go fish, yes, which it's built into it.

362
00:25:18.319 --> 00:25:21.400
And unless somebody says, go fish, you pull a brick, right,

363
00:25:21.960 --> 00:25:26.079
yeah, I'd play it. Yeah, exactly. I have no idea.

364
00:25:27.000 --> 00:25:33.480
I have no concept of how many
guesses occur within a normal game of

365
00:25:33.519 --> 00:25:34.440
Clue, because the last time I
played it, I was probably like nine

366
00:25:34.519 --> 00:25:37.200
or something, you know, And
that's the thing I don't remember either,

367
00:25:37.960 --> 00:25:41.559
And I'm sitting here and going,
oh man, I kind of like that

368
00:25:41.519 --> 00:25:45.160
because because of the amount of Dread
I played, not Jana, but the

369
00:25:45.160 --> 00:25:52.119
amount of Dread that I played.
I'm really good at Jenga. Same weirdly

370
00:25:52.160 --> 00:25:56.319
good survivor. I'm a survivor.
You're not going to give up, You're

371
00:25:56.319 --> 00:26:03.839
gone, that's right. My next
edition is again, so my list is

372
00:26:03.839 --> 00:26:06.519
so long because some of these don't
really seem like hacks, but some of

373
00:26:06.480 --> 00:26:10.200
them are almost like lessons that I've
learned over, you know, for for

374
00:26:10.319 --> 00:26:15.400
fixing games difffferent things, um,
particularly if you're playing with like a mixed

375
00:26:15.400 --> 00:26:19.960
group or other things. Uh.
You know, not every game is this

376
00:26:21.079 --> 00:26:26.319
hyper competitive game store experience. UM. Don't be afraid to just rip out

377
00:26:26.319 --> 00:26:32.039
the points and not have a winner
in a game. Uh. Growing up

378
00:26:32.039 --> 00:26:37.319
with my family, we did one
of the the the uh bonding experiences we

379
00:26:37.359 --> 00:26:41.079
did was mini golf, and we
like never kept score, which is just

380
00:26:41.160 --> 00:26:45.279
something that I've stuck with my entire
life. I think mini golf is lightful.

381
00:26:45.440 --> 00:26:49.640
I loathe real golf, but I
love mini golf. And there's nothing

382
00:26:49.680 --> 00:26:56.480
that really takes the the joy out
of knocking the ball around and trying to

383
00:26:56.559 --> 00:27:00.480
hit a windmill and doing a loop
de loop with oh no, i got

384
00:27:00.480 --> 00:27:03.799
one extra point and now I'm two
steps behind. To ruin your experience,

385
00:27:04.200 --> 00:27:07.519
Like if the game is so low
stakes anyways, if it's a party game,

386
00:27:08.039 --> 00:27:11.960
and if people are mad because you
win or lose a party game,

387
00:27:12.319 --> 00:27:15.960
just lose it. No, experience
is not about the points are winning,

388
00:27:17.000 --> 00:27:21.839
even though there is an arbitrary winner. If if it's an experience you're having.

389
00:27:22.319 --> 00:27:26.079
If it's something that you're sharing with
people, just take out the points

390
00:27:26.240 --> 00:27:30.559
and don't actually have it at all. No Winner games. It's like the

391
00:27:30.200 --> 00:27:34.799
little brother of a co op experience, and it's it's still giving you everything

392
00:27:34.799 --> 00:27:37.559
that you want from the from what
you're doing with the game. That is

393
00:27:37.599 --> 00:27:41.680
a really good rules change to just
in general, and it's part of the

394
00:27:41.720 --> 00:27:45.720
reason I don't like semi cooperative games. I'm like, either have us all

395
00:27:45.720 --> 00:27:48.519
win or have us have there be
a winner, Like I hate that,

396
00:27:48.559 --> 00:27:49.440
like, oh, but you're kind
of working together, but you're kind of

397
00:27:49.440 --> 00:27:52.640
not, because that makes the experience
less good for me. I want to

398
00:27:52.680 --> 00:27:56.119
know going in that I'm either we
either all trying to win or we're all

399
00:27:56.119 --> 00:28:00.519
just trying to have a great time. And I love the idea just stripping

400
00:28:00.519 --> 00:28:03.519
an experience like semi coops off the
top of your head, do you not

401
00:28:03.680 --> 00:28:06.920
like because I'm trying to think,
like I liked Dead of Winner when it

402
00:28:06.960 --> 00:28:08.400
came out. There was a lot
of debt a Winner back in the day.

403
00:28:08.359 --> 00:28:11.640
Yeah, And I think that's thematic. It's the idea that like,

404
00:28:11.160 --> 00:28:15.720
maybe I'm a trader, but everyone
else has private goals, so they're just

405
00:28:15.759 --> 00:28:19.160
like weirdos, which I think plays
into that like zombie apocalypse theme, like

406
00:28:19.559 --> 00:28:22.799
I don't know if you're being a
weirdo because you're going to betray me,

407
00:28:22.319 --> 00:28:26.640
or if because your private goal is
like I just really need to build fences,

408
00:28:26.799 --> 00:28:29.440
or if you're just a weirdo yeah, or if you're just a weirdo

409
00:28:30.160 --> 00:28:33.279
cool. I didn't love Debta Winner, I'll be honest. If we played

410
00:28:33.279 --> 00:28:36.200
it like once or twice and I
was like, I really don't I didn't

411
00:28:36.240 --> 00:28:38.839
enjoy it. That was one of
the semi cooperative ones that I didn't like.

412
00:28:40.960 --> 00:28:44.119
I'll be honest, I'm blanking on
like semi cooperative ones that I haven't

413
00:28:44.200 --> 00:28:48.119
enjoyed because I I literally they don't
stay in my collection for longer than like

414
00:28:48.160 --> 00:28:49.759
a minute, and I sure,
and I keep trying them, hoping that

415
00:28:49.839 --> 00:28:52.680
it'll work. But it's it's exactly
what you talked about, right, It's

416
00:28:52.720 --> 00:28:56.240
that I'm going in. I want
to know what my experience is about and

417
00:28:56.319 --> 00:29:00.359
being able to strip the rules and
say this is just for the this is

418
00:29:00.400 --> 00:29:03.000
fun, This is for the boys, right, your metaphorical boys, That's

419
00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:07.200
what this is for. And I
need that I think in some of my

420
00:29:07.279 --> 00:29:11.920
games because it makes the enjoyment of
those games more for me. Um.

421
00:29:12.000 --> 00:29:18.279
I will say Shadows over Camelot is
probably the one semi cooperative game that I

422
00:29:18.319 --> 00:29:22.440
have played that I have enjoyed.
That's that's funny because I don't like Shadows.

423
00:29:23.039 --> 00:29:26.920
I had the best experience of that, and that's probably that's probably for

424
00:29:26.960 --> 00:29:30.039
the War Stories, that's that's a
table that's a table experience. I think

425
00:29:30.039 --> 00:29:32.680
specifically, you know, yes,
I think that's one of the ones where

426
00:29:32.720 --> 00:29:37.799
I think the trader mechanic doesn't work
at all, Like this is written interesting.

427
00:29:37.079 --> 00:29:40.559
We'll have to we'll have to talk
about that for the War Stories episode

428
00:29:40.559 --> 00:29:44.480
because like, that's that's that's it. One of my favorite stories in gaming

429
00:29:44.559 --> 00:29:47.119
that I've ever experienced was the game
was the was the one time that I

430
00:29:47.119 --> 00:29:51.559
played Shadows over Camelot. Um,
So were you the trader in did you

431
00:29:51.599 --> 00:29:55.039
win? I was not the trader. I did not win. Um.

432
00:29:55.079 --> 00:30:00.720
I had a blast playing anyway.
So um, but but we'll go over

433
00:30:00.799 --> 00:30:02.920
that. Like I said, that's
what I want, that's what I want

434
00:30:02.920 --> 00:30:04.000
to vote, like, I want
to devote a whole episode to just like

435
00:30:04.759 --> 00:30:10.759
our best stories in gaming. I
think would be so much fun. UM.

436
00:30:10.799 --> 00:30:12.759
In any case, my last not
my last one. My next one

437
00:30:14.440 --> 00:30:15.920
is one that was born from this
past week. I'm glad you asked me

438
00:30:15.960 --> 00:30:19.880
what I was gaming because we played
Scotland Yard for the first time, and

439
00:30:19.960 --> 00:30:22.799
yeah, heck yeah, I really
liked it. I'm gonna be completely honest.

440
00:30:22.839 --> 00:30:29.240
I like being mister X. I
like the um the where is he

441
00:30:29.279 --> 00:30:34.160
going? What does he know?
Uh? Of the experience. But one

442
00:30:34.160 --> 00:30:38.880
of the things I think was really
interesting for me was that so the game,

443
00:30:40.000 --> 00:30:41.599
the version of this that I bought
is older, it's an older copy,

444
00:30:42.000 --> 00:30:45.200
UM, and so the rules have
not been tweaked yet. So at

445
00:30:45.240 --> 00:30:48.880
three players, I was just dunking
on everyone because there's only two other investigators,

446
00:30:49.000 --> 00:30:53.000
which they amended later on like for
the future editions. UM. If

447
00:30:53.000 --> 00:30:56.480
you play with three players, I
think I forget how many Like I think

448
00:30:56.519 --> 00:31:02.319
each player in the three player account
can tweel controls like an extra investigator,

449
00:31:03.000 --> 00:31:07.519
so there's four rather than two people
looking. But because we had played the

450
00:31:07.559 --> 00:31:14.359
first eight rounds without without those extra
pieces, we added a fifth one.

451
00:31:14.880 --> 00:31:18.400
And I don't know how good it
is in terms of like the rules,

452
00:31:18.519 --> 00:31:22.880
but in terms of the experience.
It was interesting. We called this fifth

453
00:31:22.720 --> 00:31:29.319
character the True Crime Podcaster, and
so rather than have the two other people

454
00:31:29.359 --> 00:31:33.359
I was playing with control this character, their moves were randomly generated because it's

455
00:31:33.400 --> 00:31:37.839
not they're not a detective, it's
a civilian who is interested in the mister

456
00:31:38.000 --> 00:31:41.880
X story and is trying to follow
along and catch them on their own,

457
00:31:42.799 --> 00:31:47.599
so they don't use the tiles.
So in the game, you spend a

458
00:31:47.640 --> 00:31:52.039
tile to move either on the subway, the buses, or taxi, and

459
00:31:52.319 --> 00:31:56.079
whenever an investigator spends one of those
tiles, it goes to mister X so

460
00:31:56.119 --> 00:31:57.599
that they can use it on their
turns. And when mister X use a

461
00:31:57.599 --> 00:32:01.640
tile, it's removed from the game. The True Crime Podcaster does not contribute

462
00:32:01.640 --> 00:32:06.559
their tiles to mister X because he
doesn't have an informant in the in the

463
00:32:06.559 --> 00:32:09.240
True Crime Podcaster's apartment, he has
won in the police department, and so

464
00:32:10.000 --> 00:32:15.559
it created this like and it actually
lost me the game as mister X because

465
00:32:15.599 --> 00:32:19.680
there was one move I could make
really early on that I was like,

466
00:32:19.720 --> 00:32:22.079
oh man, this is great.
Once I do this, I can just

467
00:32:22.200 --> 00:32:25.559
slip around them and just skirt along
the outskirts of London. And never get

468
00:32:25.640 --> 00:32:31.680
caught. And the true crime podcaster
barked himself right in the subway station where

469
00:32:31.720 --> 00:32:36.359
I needed to go, and I
was like, son of a gun And

470
00:32:36.880 --> 00:32:39.799
it didn't. I didn't think it
was gonna be like momentous at the time,

471
00:32:39.960 --> 00:32:43.640
But looking back at that game,
like if I had done that,

472
00:32:43.720 --> 00:32:46.720
I could have won. And that
loser, that idiot who literally spent three

473
00:32:46.839 --> 00:32:52.640
turns going back and forth between two
locations, wound up costs to be the

474
00:32:52.640 --> 00:32:54.279
game. And I think, again, I think it was just like it's

475
00:32:54.279 --> 00:32:58.640
just a nice little inclusion, just
yeah, yeah, I just put it

476
00:32:58.640 --> 00:33:00.839
in there. Try it one of
these days, and to think give you

477
00:33:00.839 --> 00:33:06.039
like Scotland yard. Um. You
know, I I think I think I'm

478
00:33:06.079 --> 00:33:08.559
gonna jump off that one. To
to choose my next as a follow up,

479
00:33:08.880 --> 00:33:16.400
which is um as. As a
a role playing a game designer,

480
00:33:16.519 --> 00:33:20.519
this is my default, but I
encourage people of with this. This is

481
00:33:20.559 --> 00:33:24.480
your not your instinct to role play
when you play your board game, to

482
00:33:24.559 --> 00:33:30.160
ask questions about the things, to
tell little stories. Um. In legacy

483
00:33:30.240 --> 00:33:35.839
games especially, it's like really really
asking for it because you you want to

484
00:33:35.880 --> 00:33:38.720
like write the person's name on it. Um. You know, every single

485
00:33:38.759 --> 00:33:43.960
game of pandemic I've ever played.
People always name the diseases. UM.

486
00:33:44.599 --> 00:33:50.279
Whenever you play something that has characters
that has things like feel free to be,

487
00:33:50.359 --> 00:33:52.240
like what's their home life? Like, you know, you'll immediately get

488
00:33:52.279 --> 00:33:57.599
more infested. You'll be laughing with
your friends, You'll be creating the inside

489
00:33:57.640 --> 00:34:00.599
jokes of the experience. And then
when you have a podcast, you can

490
00:34:00.640 --> 00:34:05.000
then tell that war story to somebody
about like, oh my god, this

491
00:34:05.039 --> 00:34:08.280
person was a true crime podcaster and
they loved bananas, but they still lived

492
00:34:08.280 --> 00:34:14.599
at home. And you know,
I'll smile and nod like I know what

493
00:34:14.639 --> 00:34:16.920
you're talking about. But you will
have had a great time at the table,

494
00:34:16.960 --> 00:34:20.360
and everyone you were there will be
like, oh, man, banana

495
00:34:20.440 --> 00:34:27.119
guy, he was awesome. I'll
always role play in your board games.

496
00:34:27.159 --> 00:34:31.000
Ask questions, invent people, give
them personalities like this is your chance to

497
00:34:31.119 --> 00:34:37.400
play and whatever makes sense, and
like really really luxuriate in what you're doing.

498
00:34:37.079 --> 00:34:39.960
So did I did I ever tell
you? That's how I figured out

499
00:34:40.000 --> 00:34:44.199
who I wanted to bring into role
playing games. When I first started playing,

500
00:34:44.679 --> 00:34:50.519
UM was Yeah. So I had
a pretty big game group. A

501
00:34:50.559 --> 00:34:52.199
lot of most of them have moved
and gotten married and gone on with their

502
00:34:52.199 --> 00:34:55.480
lives and a couple the core of
us have stuck around here. Um.

503
00:34:55.719 --> 00:35:00.679
But like, one of the things
that we did was everyone's like, oh,

504
00:35:00.719 --> 00:35:02.320
I want to play an RPG.
I want to do June Dragons,

505
00:35:02.320 --> 00:35:06.000
I want to do and you know, these are people that I like and

506
00:35:06.039 --> 00:35:12.239
I know, but I wanted people
who would be getting into the experience of

507
00:35:12.239 --> 00:35:14.559
of an RPG, and I wanted
to know that they were like that they

508
00:35:14.599 --> 00:35:16.679
could hang right. Um. And
so you know what we did. We

509
00:35:16.719 --> 00:35:22.880
played Life. Oh man, we
played the Game of Life. And everyone

510
00:35:22.000 --> 00:35:28.440
that made fake names for their fake
children and complained about their fake boss at

511
00:35:28.480 --> 00:35:30.639
their fake job in the Game of
Life. I was like, okay,

512
00:35:31.000 --> 00:35:34.519
you're I'm gonna I'm gonna see if
you want to do some some r some

513
00:35:34.679 --> 00:35:37.320
rpging because I wanted them to enjoy
the experience. But I think they can

514
00:35:37.400 --> 00:35:40.000
look for those role players in regular
games. I think it's just it's just

515
00:35:40.039 --> 00:35:45.719
awesome. This is a good idea. You you chose to play the Game

516
00:35:45.760 --> 00:35:47.199
of Life. I did. It's
one of the mass market titles, so

517
00:35:47.280 --> 00:35:51.880
they actually don't detest I actually kind
of enjoy it. I think for a

518
00:35:51.880 --> 00:35:52.719
lot of the same reasons you like
to Kaido, it's not gonna have a

519
00:35:52.800 --> 00:35:55.679
chill experience. I don't ever take
it really seriously. I mostly just complained

520
00:35:55.679 --> 00:36:00.280
about my fake boss. I talk
about my my little plastic wife and lasting

521
00:36:00.360 --> 00:36:06.280
children that live in the plastic car
like it's fun. You know, it's

522
00:36:06.320 --> 00:36:09.000
a it's a phenomenal point. I've
never thought of Life as to Kaido.

523
00:36:09.400 --> 00:36:13.039
I mean, I understand that it
is all about the role play, and

524
00:36:13.079 --> 00:36:15.760
that the game itself is is like
barely there. But you know what,

525
00:36:15.239 --> 00:36:19.320
that's the same thing with the Kaido, except it doesn't have a weird spinner.

526
00:36:19.719 --> 00:36:23.000
Um, life, life is Life
is the mass market to Kaido.

527
00:36:23.039 --> 00:36:28.719
You're totally right, kind of like
I know, I made that connection until

528
00:36:28.719 --> 00:36:30.719
we talked about to Kaido earlier,
like before we even started recording, and

529
00:36:30.760 --> 00:36:34.000
I was like, wait a second, I like this game for the same

530
00:36:34.000 --> 00:36:37.760
reason I kind of like to Kaido. So yeah, I like. I

531
00:36:37.840 --> 00:36:42.000
like the idea of the role playing
though with other people. Um, did

532
00:36:42.000 --> 00:36:44.440
I did I say mine? I
did say my mom was Scotland Yard.

533
00:36:44.480 --> 00:36:46.599
That's right, I got I got
side. I got sidetracked. It happens.

534
00:36:46.840 --> 00:36:49.239
No, you were you were in
the role plan. You wanted to

535
00:36:49.239 --> 00:36:52.679
talk about how much you love life
the best board game ever made? You

536
00:36:52.719 --> 00:36:55.960
know it is not the best board
game. It might be my favorite mass

537
00:36:57.000 --> 00:36:59.559
market title. Actually, now that
I think about that, I get,

538
00:37:00.039 --> 00:37:05.079
oh, Connect four kind of slaps. I love Connect four. As as

539
00:37:05.119 --> 00:37:13.239
part of my kit bashing adventures,
I found this Connect four cannon. It

540
00:37:13.280 --> 00:37:15.559
was one of the pictures I didn't
send you because it wasn't heinous enough.

541
00:37:16.480 --> 00:37:22.920
But essentially it's you have these these
little launchers and it's a Connect four tube

542
00:37:23.280 --> 00:37:29.320
with a mouth at the top,
and whoever gets four in a row wins.

543
00:37:29.400 --> 00:37:32.280
I guess I just looked at the
box because you launch your your your

544
00:37:32.360 --> 00:37:36.639
colored disk up into the mouth and
it falls down. It's just one tube.

545
00:37:37.239 --> 00:37:40.159
It's not a range, but it
appears as though you both take turns

546
00:37:40.239 --> 00:37:44.559
firing your Connect four. It's called
I don't remember what it was called.

547
00:37:44.559 --> 00:37:45.960
I have to look at the picture
I took of it. That it's like,

548
00:37:46.679 --> 00:37:52.320
I don't know, uh, Connect
four extreme or Connect four cannon.

549
00:37:52.719 --> 00:37:58.920
That's incredible, that's so good.
But it looks like coconuts if you played

550
00:37:58.960 --> 00:38:01.840
coconuts. No, I'm think I
played coconuts. No. Yeah, that's

551
00:38:01.920 --> 00:38:07.519
that's that's a classic like game for
three rolds that I've gotten huge groups of

552
00:38:07.559 --> 00:38:10.440
adults to enjoy. You have these
little monkeys and you shoot coconuts with their

553
00:38:10.440 --> 00:38:15.840
spring load on arms and try and
land them in people's cups. Is basically

554
00:38:15.039 --> 00:38:19.800
it's awesome. I'm incredible game.
Yeah yeah, I mean it's everything I

555
00:38:19.840 --> 00:38:23.159
love give. I'm there. So
what's your what's your next hack, mister

556
00:38:23.239 --> 00:38:29.639
friend? My next hack is,
um, well is it's a It's gonna

557
00:38:29.679 --> 00:38:31.119
be feel like a small hack,
but it winds up impacting the rules of

558
00:38:31.199 --> 00:38:35.639
this a lot. I love Resarcana. Resarcona might be in my top five

559
00:38:35.639 --> 00:38:37.559
games of all time top ten,
It's definitely my top ten because I feel

560
00:38:37.559 --> 00:38:40.880
like the list changes a lot um. One of the ways that you can

561
00:38:40.920 --> 00:38:45.760
play Resarcana is you can draft your
deck, which is what we do every

562
00:38:45.760 --> 00:38:51.960
time. But the rules is written
of Resarcana has you pick your wizard after

563
00:38:52.079 --> 00:38:54.039
you draft the deck. Um,
you get a pick of two wizards.

564
00:38:54.480 --> 00:38:59.440
We have always played that you get
the wizard beforehand. Um. And that

565
00:38:59.559 --> 00:39:01.400
might not seem like a big change
to those of you who have not played

566
00:39:01.440 --> 00:39:06.719
it, but if you like res
Arcana a lot, and I I love

567
00:39:06.800 --> 00:39:12.880
Resarcana. It actually in my group's
playing of this version of the rules,

568
00:39:13.199 --> 00:39:15.840
and I've played it both ways,
so I want to make it sure that

569
00:39:15.840 --> 00:39:17.760
everyone knows I have played at rules
is written. I feel like I have

570
00:39:17.880 --> 00:39:22.320
more control over what my strategy is
going to be when I know who I

571
00:39:22.360 --> 00:39:28.000
am going into it because those wizards
generate different resources, they have different powers,

572
00:39:28.719 --> 00:39:32.000
and that changes the value of some
cards in the deck that I would

573
00:39:32.039 --> 00:39:37.199
otherwise overlook because I don't know what
kind of powers I'm going to have.

574
00:39:37.239 --> 00:39:42.159
But like, for example, there's
a character in Reserkona called the Witch.

575
00:39:42.159 --> 00:39:44.840
For those of you who have not
listened. Her ability is that she can

576
00:39:44.880 --> 00:39:47.079
spend a little bit of resources to
activate an item twice, which is very

577
00:39:47.119 --> 00:39:52.159
powerful. And there are some items
in the game that you will overlook because

578
00:39:52.159 --> 00:39:54.800
you're like, this is bad.
I can only activate this one's a turn.

579
00:39:55.400 --> 00:39:58.679
But knowing that I have the Witch, I'm like, wow, I

580
00:39:58.679 --> 00:40:02.159
could activate this twice. Suddenly a
really garbage card becomes a really good card

581
00:40:02.320 --> 00:40:07.320
in this particular deck. Um and
so that's It's It feels like a very

582
00:40:07.320 --> 00:40:10.320
small change, but it winds up
having some big ramifications on overall strategy of

583
00:40:10.320 --> 00:40:15.079
the game, and we have really
enjoyed it. So, I mean it

584
00:40:15.119 --> 00:40:20.039
makes sense because you're you're drafting,
so like, why wouldn't you then have

585
00:40:20.559 --> 00:40:23.559
a direction to go and then you're
not just drafting at random. You know,

586
00:40:23.599 --> 00:40:27.880
you're not falling into your normal lanes. It's it's the equivalent of forcing

587
00:40:27.880 --> 00:40:32.559
a color and a draft, right
if you start with your your your hero

588
00:40:34.079 --> 00:40:37.159
yeah or whatever. Yeah, then
then you know, okay, great,

589
00:40:37.519 --> 00:40:39.320
now I need items so I can
tap them twice, right, yeah,

590
00:40:39.320 --> 00:40:43.760
exactly. Um, And I can
see why they did it, like from

591
00:40:43.800 --> 00:40:46.239
a design choice, because like,
oh, you know, you know what's

592
00:40:46.239 --> 00:40:50.519
in your deck, so maybe you
can choose something that helps you make the

593
00:40:50.559 --> 00:40:53.960
stuff that you've drafted better. But
my argument is I think it's more strategic

594
00:40:54.000 --> 00:40:58.719
in the inverse. So true.
Yeah, that's that's my resure counter change,

595
00:40:58.719 --> 00:41:00.360
which I know you would appre because
you like reser Kona too, So

596
00:41:01.039 --> 00:41:05.320
I like it a lot. Yeah. I hadn't played it before you turned

597
00:41:05.360 --> 00:41:09.119
me onto it because honestly, it
looked like everything else and I zipped right

598
00:41:09.119 --> 00:41:12.760
past it. And the fact that
you spoke so highly of it, I

599
00:41:12.800 --> 00:41:17.239
specifically went out found myself a very
cheap copy played it. Think it's great.

600
00:41:17.440 --> 00:41:22.119
Yeah, because I'm always looking for
something to fill in the sort of

601
00:41:22.159 --> 00:41:25.199
the draft part, like, oh, I want to get a draft in.

602
00:41:25.320 --> 00:41:29.920
Getting that part of the brain,
the replayability, the learning the systems

603
00:41:29.960 --> 00:41:32.519
mastery part, particularly when it comes
to like a really well constructed card game

604
00:41:32.599 --> 00:41:37.719
and so and being able to seek
that out was something I was glad to

605
00:41:37.719 --> 00:41:39.280
go do. That's one that I've
actually played with a bunch of other Magic

606
00:41:39.280 --> 00:41:43.079
players because they're like, man,
like, I don't like drafting this set,

607
00:41:43.320 --> 00:41:45.880
and like I have told people this
before, I think RESK is the

608
00:41:45.920 --> 00:41:50.159
best Magic the Gathering draft set in
a month. Like, I just think

609
00:41:50.159 --> 00:41:52.519
it's a great That's just a good
one. All right, what's your next

610
00:41:52.559 --> 00:41:54.559
rules change game? I'm excited.
Yeah, I'm gonna pair a couple of

611
00:41:54.559 --> 00:42:00.840
these up because they have a similar
theme, which is the idea of putting

612
00:42:00.960 --> 00:42:05.679
more limitations on you, particularly in
a game about communication, to make things

613
00:42:05.719 --> 00:42:08.599
more fun. Also because these games
are both very very similar and I have

614
00:42:08.719 --> 00:42:13.440
hacks for both of them that I
like using, and I've talked about these

615
00:42:13.480 --> 00:42:16.800
games previously on the podcast, which
is the Dixit to Mysterium sort of like

616
00:42:16.840 --> 00:42:22.920
Pipeline of Design. In Mysterium,
you have your clue like theme of having

617
00:42:22.960 --> 00:42:27.920
a ghost and trying to find a
murderer, and Dixit is themeless, but

618
00:42:27.960 --> 00:42:30.239
you still have these, like you
know, fantasmagorical cards that you're trying to

619
00:42:30.239 --> 00:42:37.840
communicate. Both essentially are clues.
In Dixit, you hand a card and

620
00:42:37.119 --> 00:42:39.840
you give a clue, and it's
usually a word or a phrase, and

621
00:42:39.840 --> 00:42:43.599
then everyone else plays down a card
and then you try to hide amongst it.

622
00:42:43.719 --> 00:42:47.519
Everyone's trying to get you to get
their card instead. And so my

623
00:42:47.719 --> 00:42:52.199
hack for Dixit is to use no
words and to play an entire game using

624
00:42:52.239 --> 00:42:58.639
nonverbal sounds instead of trying to think
of this clever in joke where like oh

625
00:42:58.760 --> 00:43:00.920
you know and I know because we
went on a trip together, or oh

626
00:43:01.000 --> 00:43:05.920
I know that specifically, you know, this friend of mine is a big

627
00:43:06.000 --> 00:43:08.039
jazz fan, so I'm gonna say, Miles Davis is like a clue or

628
00:43:08.079 --> 00:43:12.800
something. To try and do that
instead, it's like people grunting and then

629
00:43:12.920 --> 00:43:15.880
laughing at each other and going and
then putting out a card and then all

630
00:43:15.880 --> 00:43:20.239
of a sudden people's like, oh
man, which one is more in my

631
00:43:20.320 --> 00:43:22.440
hand right because you're trying to like
puzzle this out. It keeps it fresh,

632
00:43:22.480 --> 00:43:27.760
it keeps it cool and weird.
And the arguments, which again is

633
00:43:27.760 --> 00:43:30.599
my favorite parts of these kinds of
games, is how could you've done this?

634
00:43:30.920 --> 00:43:35.440
Why do you do this? This
is way more or the idea of

635
00:43:35.519 --> 00:43:37.679
the the serendipity in these games where
people are like, oh my god,

636
00:43:37.719 --> 00:43:43.079
that was the perfect card for the
clue you gave. It's extra funny when

637
00:43:43.119 --> 00:43:45.719
that comes up for this like noise. That's the other The other half of

638
00:43:45.719 --> 00:43:52.920
this from mysterium is that it's cooperative, so the ghost is giving dreams and

639
00:43:52.960 --> 00:43:57.480
then the each person gets their own
card each round and they're trying to interpret

640
00:43:57.519 --> 00:44:00.039
what the ghost is telling them.
And a mysteria, particularly if it's like

641
00:44:00.079 --> 00:44:04.280
a very good group or a gamy
things, I will have a rule where

642
00:44:04.280 --> 00:44:07.559
you can't actually show your card to
the other psychics, and so you're all

643
00:44:07.599 --> 00:44:10.800
holding your card because the idea is
it can kind of fall into this sort

644
00:44:10.840 --> 00:44:15.400
of muddy place where everyone places down
their dreams and everyone looks at everyone else's

645
00:44:15.400 --> 00:44:17.440
cards and then talk about it.
But if that's a space that you've already

646
00:44:17.480 --> 00:44:21.760
done and gotten to. Some people
can kind of feel left behind. If

647
00:44:21.800 --> 00:44:24.199
you have a very active group,
a very talkie group, you're having people

648
00:44:24.239 --> 00:44:27.559
say like, okay, what's your
dream and you're holding it up to your

649
00:44:27.639 --> 00:44:30.480
chest being like, I don't know, man, it's like a sewer and

650
00:44:30.719 --> 00:44:32.639
what color is it? It's like
green, but like not too green,

651
00:44:34.119 --> 00:44:37.760
and that gets the talking cart.
I think cooperaly really works. The best

652
00:44:37.840 --> 00:44:43.119
co op games are ones where people
are talking a lot and not just saying

653
00:44:43.199 --> 00:44:45.320
you just look at my cards.
Like depending on the group, pandemic is

654
00:44:45.679 --> 00:44:49.960
you have an open hand or you
don't do it because you're like, what

655
00:44:50.039 --> 00:44:52.159
did you have again? Sometimes that's
good, sometimes it's bad. But from

656
00:44:52.159 --> 00:44:57.599
mysterium, it's this emotional experience and
so that not showing your cards to their

657
00:44:57.599 --> 00:45:00.119
psychics. I think it's a really
good way to get that done. And

658
00:45:00.199 --> 00:45:06.840
it resolves the um quarterbacking problem too
that happens in a rise sometimes in cooperative

659
00:45:06.840 --> 00:45:10.679
games because you can't quarterback what someone
else's weird abstract dream is. And if

660
00:45:10.719 --> 00:45:15.639
it's the theme too, that's awesome. That's like exactly the perfect Yeah,

661
00:45:16.000 --> 00:45:19.440
oh man, all right, I
love it. Okay, Graham, are

662
00:45:19.440 --> 00:45:22.679
you ready what's this do? Let's
do one more and then we'll we'll we'll

663
00:45:22.679 --> 00:45:25.519
give the people one more more more
and an honorable mention? How about that?

664
00:45:25.599 --> 00:45:30.360
Yeah? Okay, UM tell you
what, why don't you give your

665
00:45:30.400 --> 00:45:36.079
honorable mention first? But when it
falls, you have to catch as many

666
00:45:36.079 --> 00:45:38.519
pieces in your mouth as possible.
Uh, And whoever gets the most pieces

667
00:45:38.519 --> 00:45:45.599
in your mouth actually wins the game. No, I just made that up.

668
00:45:45.559 --> 00:45:50.480
Yeah, I kind of love that, though the mouth we worried I

669
00:45:50.480 --> 00:45:54.599
would swallow one accidentally. But like
uh, in a game with vehicles,

670
00:45:54.880 --> 00:46:01.920
it is mandatory to use noises whenever
moving peace. Um. Planes need plane

671
00:46:01.920 --> 00:46:07.599
sounds, cars need car sounds.
And if you don't do it, um,

672
00:46:07.840 --> 00:46:10.639
don't lose a turn. It's give
your your other players and benefit if

673
00:46:10.639 --> 00:46:14.039
you fail to do it. Yeah. If it's a drinking game, you

674
00:46:14.079 --> 00:46:17.280
take a drink, your your your
friends get a free resource if you don't

675
00:46:17.280 --> 00:46:22.320
go whenever you hit the plane.
So all I've heard is that when we

676
00:46:22.320 --> 00:46:24.519
play thunder Road, when all of
us meet up, yeah, we're all

677
00:46:24.519 --> 00:46:29.159
gonna because I have my vintage copy
of thunder Road. We're all so good

678
00:46:29.320 --> 00:46:34.039
vehicle sounds. Love it. U
my auno mention is just getting rid of

679
00:46:34.039 --> 00:46:37.880
skills um in Dungeons and Dragons.
This is something I learned when I started

680
00:46:37.880 --> 00:46:42.800
playing with kids, um, because
kids are natural storytellers and they like it.

681
00:46:43.119 --> 00:46:44.840
So I have them make a character, and a lot of them,

682
00:46:44.880 --> 00:46:46.880
particularly when I played with seven and
eight year olds, don't read the skill

683
00:46:47.000 --> 00:46:52.400
sheet anyway, um, and so
I make them justify to me why their

684
00:46:52.519 --> 00:46:55.519
character should be able to use a
certain skill, which gets their creativity flowing

685
00:46:55.559 --> 00:46:58.920
a little bit and makes them think
and problem solved. They're like, oh,

686
00:46:58.920 --> 00:47:02.719
well, of course my bar would
have the ability to diplomacy somebody,

687
00:47:04.960 --> 00:47:08.960
but like great case in point,
somebody made a character named ax Ax as

688
00:47:09.000 --> 00:47:14.360
a moron, and I love ax
Ax does not know anything, and they

689
00:47:14.519 --> 00:47:17.760
role played in character an entire scene
where they taught Ax math and a math

690
00:47:17.880 --> 00:47:22.840
check came up later in the adventure
and the player of Ax goes, I

691
00:47:22.159 --> 00:47:24.199
would like to make a role for
this, and I would like to get

692
00:47:24.320 --> 00:47:28.000
some benefit for it. And I
was like, you're gonna tell me that

693
00:47:28.119 --> 00:47:32.480
your barbarian nos math, and she
goes yes. Because remember three sessions ago

694
00:47:34.039 --> 00:47:39.880
are Druid spent fifteen in real world
minutes in character. They did this in

695
00:47:40.000 --> 00:47:45.480
character the entire time. The whole
table spent fifteen minutes trying to teach the

696
00:47:45.480 --> 00:47:50.119
other girl in character what two plus
two was. So I think that's a

697
00:47:50.159 --> 00:47:55.119
great house role. So you're really
opening up a giant can of worms that

698
00:47:55.320 --> 00:48:01.400
unfortunately we can't talk about now because
you're you're just cracking open the door of

699
00:48:01.440 --> 00:48:07.360
what frustrates me about RPG philosophy and
design, Yes, which is the idea

700
00:48:07.480 --> 00:48:12.880
of rolling for confirmation, rolling for
success or failure is a complete dead end.

701
00:48:13.199 --> 00:48:16.440
There's nothing I hate more than rolling
to unlock a chest or unlock a

702
00:48:16.480 --> 00:48:21.199
door, because only one of two
things happens. Either you do it and

703
00:48:21.280 --> 00:48:23.239
you keep going, or you fail
to do it and you're now in a

704
00:48:23.320 --> 00:48:28.440
cul de sac. There's you're stuck
there. And so that's why you have

705
00:48:29.239 --> 00:48:34.679
ridiculous things like taking twenty, which
again get around the idea of okay,

706
00:48:34.719 --> 00:48:39.599
well we need quote unquote these dice. So the real answer is can you

707
00:48:39.679 --> 00:48:43.679
do it or can you not?
Yeah? You not? Just need is

708
00:48:43.880 --> 00:48:47.480
failure exciting, but success needs to
be exciting as well. If neither one

709
00:48:47.599 --> 00:48:52.639
is true, don't roll things,
Yeah, especially for like a rogue,

710
00:48:52.760 --> 00:48:55.840
like if your rogue rolls and fails
to unlock the chest. That doesn't make

711
00:48:55.840 --> 00:49:00.000
any sense within the fiction. Of
course, your rogue should be able to

712
00:49:00.000 --> 00:49:04.679
do roguey things. Of Course the
barbarian should be able to do barbarian things.

713
00:49:04.840 --> 00:49:07.360
That's why you chose this character,
because then you can function within the

714
00:49:07.400 --> 00:49:10.800
fiction. In that case, the
rules are not doing their job at all.

715
00:49:10.920 --> 00:49:15.639
Right, I have minimized my rant
to thirty seconds. That was impressive,

716
00:49:15.679 --> 00:49:19.239
because I can see the fire in
your eyes. That was impressive.

717
00:49:21.039 --> 00:49:22.480
We'll have to do an RPG philosophy
episode two. That's all this means,

718
00:49:22.519 --> 00:49:24.719
all right, what is your what
is your last one? What does your

719
00:49:24.760 --> 00:49:29.840
last rules pick? Well, just
I'll just go even further, which is

720
00:49:29.920 --> 00:49:32.679
dropped the GM screen. Not only
should you drop skills, but you should

721
00:49:32.719 --> 00:49:37.599
never use a GM screen ever.
Again. Uh, this applies to a

722
00:49:37.639 --> 00:49:42.920
lot of things. One reminding people
that that the hierarchy should be as thin

723
00:49:43.000 --> 00:49:45.960
as possible. You're not in some
guy Gaxian tower. The players are not

724
00:49:46.039 --> 00:49:53.119
empty vessels under which the story is
being poured into them. Everyone is collaborating

725
00:49:53.199 --> 00:50:00.840
in this way. You can have
a more antagonistic format, but the idea

726
00:50:00.960 --> 00:50:05.800
of players being there it really fosters
a lot of really bad culture and a

727
00:50:05.800 --> 00:50:08.599
lot of bad rules philosophy. Do
you really need to hide hit points behind

728
00:50:08.679 --> 00:50:13.239
things? Do you really need all
these rules? The idea is like,

729
00:50:13.239 --> 00:50:15.760
why don't you just make your chair
a little higher? Why shouldn't just the

730
00:50:15.800 --> 00:50:20.000
GM sit in a hide chair.
I say this knowing that there's a lot

731
00:50:20.000 --> 00:50:22.119
of people out there being like,
Oh, that's a really great idea.

732
00:50:22.119 --> 00:50:25.079
I should do that. The gym
should have the biggest chair. You need

733
00:50:25.079 --> 00:50:28.360
to be down there with the people
playing the game. You need to be

734
00:50:28.400 --> 00:50:30.320
listening, You need to be reactive. It makes the game better, and

735
00:50:30.400 --> 00:50:34.920
not just so to give the players
what they want. Since but the idea

736
00:50:35.159 --> 00:50:38.440
that it's a tennis match. It's
a tennis match of narrative. It's a

737
00:50:38.440 --> 00:50:43.960
tennis match of rules and interactions.
And if you are separating yourself from the

738
00:50:43.960 --> 00:50:47.920
players, then you get stagnation,
which is never gonna be fun. So

739
00:50:49.000 --> 00:50:51.639
get rid of that GM screen,
never go back. I love it.

740
00:50:52.679 --> 00:50:57.280
Here is mine. This one comes
courtesy of the fourth graders that I teach.

741
00:50:57.559 --> 00:51:01.400
This is the best rules hack I
this is I'm not even gonna lie

742
00:51:01.440 --> 00:51:07.400
to you this this game might be
in contention for the Duskis for this coming

743
00:51:07.480 --> 00:51:09.840
year because I loved it that much. Um, that's not a joke,

744
00:51:09.880 --> 00:51:14.760
I really, it really is not. This is the concept of the desks

745
00:51:14.960 --> 00:51:16.800
well, the Dusky's man, this
is this will be our our fourth annual

746
00:51:16.840 --> 00:51:21.199
deskis coming up. We've done the
deskis for for three years now. But

747
00:51:21.360 --> 00:51:25.840
what about the door keys. You're
just You're just let Riley run run ship

748
00:51:25.880 --> 00:51:29.760
on you again. Well, hey, listen, the best part about the

749
00:51:29.800 --> 00:51:34.079
Duskies is they may have had Riley's
name attached, but for the first two

750
00:51:34.159 --> 00:51:38.360
years Riley couldn't make the recording session
and I did a bad robot voice and

751
00:51:38.400 --> 00:51:44.360
pretended to be robo Riley. Nice. It was great, a little unhinged,

752
00:51:44.360 --> 00:51:47.320
but that sounds after the after dark. And I'll call it the Duskies.

753
00:51:47.599 --> 00:51:52.159
Oh, the Duskies. I like
that. Well, what are what

754
00:51:52.239 --> 00:52:00.840
are our favorite our favorite solar based
patterns? Um? So this is a

755
00:52:00.880 --> 00:52:04.519
game. This again just speaks to
the creativity of kids. They have managed

756
00:52:04.559 --> 00:52:07.679
to break a game in a way
that has made it something completely new.

757
00:52:07.920 --> 00:52:10.760
So I'm cheating a little bit,
um, But when we talk about game

758
00:52:10.800 --> 00:52:15.760
breaking, I think this is it's
game design, right and these kids have

759
00:52:15.800 --> 00:52:20.679
stumbled onto my favorite version of Connect
four it ever and one of my favorite

760
00:52:20.719 --> 00:52:23.440
two player abstract strategy games ever.
Does it have a cannon? It does?

761
00:52:23.559 --> 00:52:27.840
It kind of does actually, And
I'm glad we kind of you.

762
00:52:27.840 --> 00:52:30.320
You helped set this up for me
without realizing it. So there is a

763
00:52:30.440 --> 00:52:37.320
version of Connect four. That's why
we love your um. There's a version

764
00:52:37.320 --> 00:52:39.239
of Connect four. It's like a
teacher stem kit. It's really lame,

765
00:52:39.800 --> 00:52:44.400
but it's essentially you build it with
legos. It's lame. It is because

766
00:52:44.760 --> 00:52:47.639
it's it's dark, strong, it
is right. It's it is a slanted

767
00:52:47.679 --> 00:52:52.280
piece of cardboard with the little nubs
built into it, and the kids go

768
00:52:52.760 --> 00:52:58.000
they put the bricks in the rows
to make a Connect four board, and

769
00:52:58.119 --> 00:53:00.519
it's slanted so that they don't need
to hey for the lattice. Is it

770
00:53:00.599 --> 00:53:04.599
like cornhole? It's not a corn
holl. It's like it's like it's like

771
00:53:04.800 --> 00:53:07.639
it's literally a slope with the nubs
attached and you just put the bricks in

772
00:53:07.719 --> 00:53:14.480
the like in the nubs to make
them vertical pillars of the Connect fourboard.

773
00:53:14.639 --> 00:53:17.559
But there's no horizontal ones because that
would cost extra money. And it just

774
00:53:17.559 --> 00:53:23.320
sits on a slope, so that
gravity does the work. Lame, right.

775
00:53:24.079 --> 00:53:30.440
Um. You compound this with the
fact that the kit that these kids

776
00:53:30.480 --> 00:53:32.159
have, because it's not in my
classrooms in a different one, does not

777
00:53:32.280 --> 00:53:37.719
have enough Connect four pieces for everybody. It has an off color piece,

778
00:53:38.159 --> 00:53:43.639
so like there's one piece missing for
both teams. So they have like a

779
00:53:43.760 --> 00:53:46.239
full yellow set, a full red
set, both missing one piece and they

780
00:53:46.280 --> 00:53:50.679
have one off yellow set from a
different game, off yellow checker from a

781
00:53:50.679 --> 00:53:52.920
different game. It's about the same
size as a Connect four piece. So

782
00:53:53.159 --> 00:53:57.679
here's what the kids did, and
this is this is my favorite version to

783
00:53:57.679 --> 00:54:02.039
Connect four. They've turned Connect four
into a dexterity game and an abstract strategy

784
00:54:02.039 --> 00:54:06.840
game. So you have to take
two steps away from the table that the

785
00:54:06.840 --> 00:54:12.599
slope is on and you throw the
little Connect four disc. It is corn

786
00:54:12.639 --> 00:54:16.360
Hall, it is It's corn Hall
Connect four. But here's here's where the

787
00:54:16.519 --> 00:54:21.639
ingenuity of it lies. And this
is my favorite little rules tweak. Both

788
00:54:21.639 --> 00:54:23.920
sides are missing a piece, so
we have one piece that is clearly not

789
00:54:24.000 --> 00:54:28.079
yellow and clearly not read. And
I asked them, I was like,

790
00:54:28.119 --> 00:54:30.480
what is this piece? And they
go, well, here's the rules mister

791
00:54:30.559 --> 00:54:37.199
Ott, the first player has to
throw that piece, the off color one,

792
00:54:37.480 --> 00:54:40.840
and I'll go, okay, explain, elaborate more, and they go,

793
00:54:40.920 --> 00:54:45.719
well, it's simple, really,
that piece counts for both players,

794
00:54:46.360 --> 00:54:50.559
and I was like, oh my
god. So they took the first player

795
00:54:50.559 --> 00:54:53.840
advantage of Connect four without realizing it
and eliminated the first player advantage. They

796
00:54:53.840 --> 00:54:59.360
turned their lack of a piece into
an incredibly interesting thing because now there's a

797
00:54:59.360 --> 00:55:02.360
piece that counts both players, which
makes blocking harder, and they have made

798
00:55:02.880 --> 00:55:07.519
the oh I'm guaranteed to win mathematical. This game has already been mapped out

799
00:55:07.639 --> 00:55:12.039
kind of thing of Connect four harder
because now it's a dexterity game that you

800
00:55:12.159 --> 00:55:15.000
sort of throw and hope that your
stuff slides down on it is. I

801
00:55:15.119 --> 00:55:17.960
sat there, I was flabbergasted.
I was like, this is the coolest

802
00:55:19.679 --> 00:55:22.119
alternate version of a game that I've
ever played. It was. It was

803
00:55:22.159 --> 00:55:24.559
awesome, and they'd come up with
it off rid like it took them a

804
00:55:24.639 --> 00:55:27.119
day, I think, to come
up with that. And I was like,

805
00:55:27.480 --> 00:55:31.039
kids, man, kids are great. The best part is absolutely the

806
00:55:31.119 --> 00:55:35.760
limitation. There's you've already pointed out, like all the things that you love

807
00:55:35.800 --> 00:55:39.440
about it. The number one is
of course the missing piece, because it's

808
00:55:39.840 --> 00:55:45.320
creativity through limitation, through the idea
that we don't have the same pieces,

809
00:55:45.320 --> 00:55:51.239
and now we've introduced accidentally another element
and then ask you these questions, Okay,

810
00:55:51.280 --> 00:55:52.199
what is it? What can it
do? Why is it here?

811
00:55:52.519 --> 00:55:55.440
It's not just oh, I have
to play with this, and remember that

812
00:55:55.480 --> 00:56:00.480
the off color is my piece.
It's an opportunity to further design, which

813
00:56:00.519 --> 00:56:02.239
is wonderful. Yeah, at every
step of the way, they crushed it

814
00:56:02.280 --> 00:56:06.559
and I was just so impressed.
So all right, this is that's hardly

815
00:56:06.599 --> 00:56:08.119
a hack. If it's they just
like invented a new game. Yeah,

816
00:56:08.119 --> 00:56:13.000
it's absolutely like a brand new game. Yeah, it's it's a it's a

817
00:56:13.000 --> 00:56:15.559
hack in that like in that Doda
was a hack of like Warcraft thereesmap editor.

818
00:56:17.119 --> 00:56:21.000
It's it's its own game. It
is all right, my friend,

819
00:56:21.360 --> 00:56:23.960
UM, I have a weird question
for you. UM, really quick,

820
00:56:24.000 --> 00:56:25.960
I have a weird question for you, right never line, you do your

821
00:56:27.000 --> 00:56:30.559
weird question really quick. Before we
do that, UM, please make sure

822
00:56:30.559 --> 00:56:32.599
you go get a copy of After
the Rain over IPR check back at Duskin's

823
00:56:32.639 --> 00:56:36.599
Doors dot org. At this point, By the way, folks. Exciting

824
00:56:36.599 --> 00:56:40.960
announcement. Fear Within is being printed
um as um so like the printer is

825
00:56:42.199 --> 00:56:45.960
literally going like it started last Friday, um Riley's printing everything out. And

826
00:56:46.000 --> 00:56:49.039
then we're going to have a party
where the two of us just meet and

827
00:56:49.039 --> 00:56:53.039
hang out and staple hand stable your
copies together. So those will be shipping

828
00:56:53.039 --> 00:56:55.639
out soon. Once those are shipped
out, and dust and doors dot org

829
00:56:55.639 --> 00:57:00.760
has been um a little bit retoled. We're gonna be on those online.

830
00:57:00.840 --> 00:57:06.679
So uh and if you haven't yet
check out Cyclopean are open source community driven

831
00:57:06.719 --> 00:57:10.000
ministers game. Um, we must
have a wonderful logo from Graham. All

832
00:57:10.039 --> 00:57:15.840
right, Graham far away my friend
question as as a lead up into the

833
00:57:15.880 --> 00:57:21.400
weird question, I thought of another
Jenga alternative. Okay, so it's Jenga

834
00:57:21.519 --> 00:57:25.199
except instead of bricks, you use
kitcat bars and then you eat the kitcat

835
00:57:25.199 --> 00:57:30.119
bars when you pull them. I
love it. Yeah. H So my

836
00:57:30.239 --> 00:57:35.599
weird question to you, sir as
if you could eat any board game in

837
00:57:35.639 --> 00:57:37.880
existence, maybe like, if you
have to eat any board game in existence,

838
00:57:37.960 --> 00:57:45.000
what would it be? Azul answer? I straight up, just of

839
00:57:45.159 --> 00:57:52.920
the most special little little starbursts.
I have literally said this multiple times to

840
00:57:52.039 --> 00:57:57.239
people. I was like, these
look like bougie starburst. Yeah they do.

841
00:57:57.559 --> 00:58:00.199
I'm like, make these into candy. I'm like, I never understood

842
00:58:00.199 --> 00:58:02.440
the Tide Pod kids until I played
his bowl. I was like, I

843
00:58:02.519 --> 00:58:06.840
get it. That's like, I
get it. I understand. It was

844
00:58:06.880 --> 00:58:09.719
like, this looks like boogie starbursts. Please make these into bougie starbursts.

845
00:58:09.760 --> 00:58:13.480
I would like to eat. That's
it, that's my pick. What's the

846
00:58:13.519 --> 00:58:16.920
game you would most like to eat? Uh? You know, I didn't

847
00:58:16.920 --> 00:58:22.440
think about it. Let's go banana
Grams. That's fair. And then I

848
00:58:22.719 --> 00:58:25.079
you rip it open and it's full
of like, you know, more delicious

849
00:58:25.199 --> 00:58:30.199
letters, and then I'm gonna eat
the peel afterwards. I'm like, you

850
00:58:30.239 --> 00:58:35.800
know, i'd like bananas. I
love it. Um. Thank you all

851
00:58:35.800 --> 00:58:38.400
so much for tuning again. Be
sure to check out all the stuff we

852
00:58:38.440 --> 00:58:42.000
talked about. Be sure to follow
gram Against on all the socials. It's

853
00:58:42.000 --> 00:58:45.280
a cool dude, we like him. But any case, how it going,

854
00:58:45.320 --> 00:58:47.679
folks, and we'll see you the
next one. Bye everybody, and

855
00:58:47.800 --> 00:58:52.360
remember to stay boggy my friends.
Zippity zap z out