WEBVTT

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I played in the Australian Open.
I think it was nineteen eighty nine at

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Royal Melbourne and Greg Norman was leading
the tournament by I don't know six shots.

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On Sunday, the wind blew so
hard and the greens are so fast.

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It was blowing the balls off the
greens. So Greg Norman comes as

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a third hole, he hits a
pot from below the hole. It goes

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up this is the hole and then
turns and comes back farther away than he

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had originally putt it. And you
know what he did. He picked the

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ball up and he just walked off
the course. He just quick he said,

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I'm not doing this. He's leading
the Australian Open and he just picked

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it up and he just left.
He said, yeah, this is so

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I'm not doing this. Hi Fred. This is Blaine quarter from Quarterlane,

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Idaho, and I played the Highland's
Golf Course. This is Golf Smarter number

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nine oh four. We don't need
to grow the game, just sustain it.

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With former PGA Tour pro John Ericson, this is golf Smarter, sharing

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stories, tips and insights from great
golf minds to if you lower your score

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and raise your golf IQ. Here's
your host, Fred Green. Welcome back

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to the Golf s'mortar Podcast. John, Great to be back. Fred,

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It's great to have you back.
You're always a source of fun. Well,

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it's it's you. You fascinate me. You have such a phenomenally interesting

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perspective on golf and the way it
should be played and on all levels,

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especially on the professional level. And
we'll we'll bounce into that. But you

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you did get to play professionally with
some success, correct, Yeah, Yeah,

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I won on the PGA to Canada
nineteen ninety one. I shot seventeen

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under up at Windsor and broke No. Mo Norman's tournament record there. So

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that was probably the pinnacle of my
professional accomplishments, i'd say. But yeah,

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I played in four Australian Opens,
played the Tours down there, you

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know, one few other smaller events
and that sort of thing. So you

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know a little bit of I guess
talking about the Windsor golf course in northern

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California. No, no Canada,
So Windsor, Canada. So yeah,

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it was at roseland it was a
Donald Ross course up there that they used

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had It was a traditional stop on
the Canadian Tour, so one of the

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you know, nice tournaments up there. I always really look forward to that

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week a lot. And you grew
up around golf. Yeah, My dad

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was a eight time club champion,
um, you know, a great,

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great amateur player and just had me. Apparently there were clubs in my crib

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when I was born. You know, it's not like I had a choice

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really, just this is what you're
gonna do. You know, some people

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are going to be doctors or lawyers. It's like he's going to be a

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golfer. Yeah. I think it
kind of kept kept me out of trouble

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a little bit, probably in high
school. You know, being on the

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golf team, you know it sort
of grounded you a little bit. Maybe.

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Yeah. Sports will do that,
yeah, high school sports hopefully.

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Yeah. Yeah, because you got
to play. You know, it's the

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etiquette and the presentation and especially probably
when you were in high school, it's

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a lot different. You had to
have a look in an attitude. Yeah.

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I mean golf, you know when
I was growing up in the nineteen

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seventies in high school, um,
you know, it was a different kind

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of a sport, right, I
mean, you know, the pros were

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wearing like checkered slacks and stuff or
whatever. You know, it wasn't like

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you're putting on a baseball you know, it wasn't really you know, this

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is long before Tiger, right,
so it wasn't really a cool sport.

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You know, you weren't cool.
You didn't walk around high school with a

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I'm on the golf team. Yeah, you know, it was like,

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you know, it was really like
you kind of not want people to know.

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Really really was you know, baseball, football, basketball, those are

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kind of the you know, the
sports that would kind of get the girls

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or whatever. And nobody was like, oh, I'm gonna go follow the

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golf team, imagine or something.
It wasn't like that, you know.

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So I don't know if they're doing
it today either. Yeah. So why

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don't you, uh, what did
you're feeling about the state of the game

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today, on the on the on
the pro level. We'll get to the

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you know, the the amateur level
later. Well, the state or the

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game to me hasn't changed in my
mind. Um, I still believe the

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golf should be more of a game
than a sport, if that makes sense.

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I think I think it's I think
it's turned into I think golf's turned

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into a sport. And if you
look at the the golfers now, they

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you know, they all look like
linebackers or whatever, and they're super fit

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and every I mean, when I
was growing up, golf was more of

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a game, so and to to
to play the game. You if you

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could hit the ball two hundred and
thirty five yards off the two you were,

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you were in the game. You
could now be in the game.

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So you could look at the at
the pro tour and you would have all

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kinds of short hitters like you know, Chee Chee Rodriguez or you know,

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even Lee Trevino wasn't a real long
hitter. You know, you had a

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lot of guys that, uh,
if you could if you could knock the

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ball out there two hundred and thirty
five yards, you're in the game.

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The average tour player was hitting it
two fifty, you know, and the

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longest hitters were hitting at two seventy. But with the high spinning ball,

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the high spinning rubber wound ball,
it spuns so much more so the longer

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you hit it, the more just
went off line on a miss. So

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a guy that was hitting it to
seventy was hitting it wild a few times

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around and causing him to you know, he he or she really women's two

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or two to have bogies very hard
to hit it long and straight. So

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it's almost better to be kind of
in that mid mid range a guy that

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hit a two forty two fifty off
the tea. But now, you know,

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I'm hearing things like college coaches they're
saying they won't even recruit a kid

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unless you can hit a three hundred. I mean, if unless he's hitting

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at three hundred yards, it's not
even won't even you know, get the

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nod to get recruited. So so
it's more of a I think the sport

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element. You know, people swinging
it at you know, one hundred and

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twenty one hundred, twenty five mile
hour swing speeds and this sort of thing.

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You know, it takes a certain
amount of you know, athleticism to

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do that. Um. So I
think I think I think of golf more

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as as a game and as as
a great game, a really great game.

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Um. When growing up, you
would see all types of body shapes,

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right, you would have let's say
a short and petite someone like chi

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Rodriguez. I mean he was what
five five maybe waited one hundred and twenty

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pounds, right, you know.
And then you would have someone like George

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Archer that was six six or something, and you know, I mean you

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would have a guy like Bob Murphy
who was just you know, had a

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big beer gut, you know,
Roger Maltby, Bob Murphy. You know,

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there were these kind of guys that
you Craig Stadler, you know,

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just guys that didn't you know,
they didn't look like they were in great

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shape. You know, they could
get around a walk. You know,

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if you could walk around a golf
course, you're in the game. You

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could get it out there two hundred
and thirty five yards, you're in the

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game. From there, it was
all about positioning angles. It playing the

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game of golf. You know,
I'm gonna hit it down the left side,

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and we hit it down the right
side. I'm gonna you know,

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and all that sort of thing.
So if you look at the golf courses

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that were made, most of the
great classic tracks, there was a great

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run of courses made from the nineteen
twenties into the forties. You know,

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I think to the great historic tracks
in the United States would have been probably

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Australia, as well. I mean
in UK you've got the old courses over

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there. But I think you know, just let's just take the Montery Peninsula

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for instance, right, if you
look at those courses, you could not

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do that now, I mean you
could not. No, there's no way

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that in this age you'd be able
to get the funding to buy the Montery

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Peninsula and build all those courses on
the ocean yet a loan, the environmental

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hurdles and getting permits to build courses
on the water and over the cliffs,

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which just just wouldn't happen. If
you look at a city like Los Angeles,

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okay, you know, one of
the most dense metropolitan areas in the

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world, and you've got Riviera Country
Club, Brentwood Country Club, Beller Country

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Club, Los Angeles Country Club North, the Los Angeles Country Club South,

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Hillcrest will share Lakeside Rancho Park.
I don't know if I'm forgetting something,

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but there's nine golf courses that are
taking up what two hundred acres apiece?

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And of those nine that you mentioned, only one of them is public,

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right, that's right, that's right. Um, So you know, think

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of the real estate, the valuation
of that real estate you know, and

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and how little they're paying in taxes. Yeah all, I mean, it

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just couldn't. It just couldn't happen. It just couldn't happen, right,

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So golf became. They started pushing
these courses out to the rural, suburban

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or rural areas and we'll build a
course out in the desert. We'll bring

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him a bunch of bulldozers and make
some ski slopes down both sides of whatever

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and call it a golf course.
Maybe throw some houses around it. It's

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just it's just really different, I
think in my mind, golf. All

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right, let's let's think this way. Let's think about golf is a sticking

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ball game, right, A stick
in a ball Okay, Baseball, there's

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a stick in a ball game.
Um, Cricket, Tennis? Really,

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um yeah, Polo. I mean
we could, we could go on and

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on. There's there's a lot of
stick and ball games. No sticking ball

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game takes up as much real estate
as golf, not even close, right,

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I mean not even I'm pretty sure
that no stick and ball game other

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than golf, the ball is moving
on all the other sports. Yeah right,

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right. But my point is that
do we really need to make the

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courses bigger. I mean, we're
already golf is already taking up I think

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it's a minimum one hundred and fifty
acres to make a golf course, you

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know, and that's that was a
classic, you know, sixty six sixty

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eight hundred yard golf course. Do
we really need these golf courses to be

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seventy four hundred yards seventy six hundred
yards to make them longer and bigger and

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bigger. And we're already taking up
so much space in this age of environmentalism

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that people and we needed to do
this right to think about things being more

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green and sustainable. I just don't
see how golf fits into that by trying

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to say, okay, now the
ball is going fifteen percent farther, we

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need to make the courses bigger.
It just doesn't make sense. If you

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looked at baseball, they're still using
the wood bat, right, nobody's screaming

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about that, you know, why
aren't people upset about that? But they

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could have an aluminum or titanium bat. The bats to this big around.

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But what if they made the bat
this bigger round, and they made it

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out of titanium and they made it
bigger, and then they changed the ball,

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the baseball, and they made it
out of rubber or whatever, and

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then shortstops or hitting two hundred home
runs a year and they're like, oh,

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that's not good. And you know, we have to make the stadiums

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bigger. Now, I mean,
that's what's happened with golf. It It

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just doesn't make any sense. I
mean, you have to think, was

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there anything wrong with golf playing?
You know, the classic great courses.

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Let's just take you know, Pebble
Beach, you know, sixty or sixteen

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hundred yards, you know, on
hosting US Open in seventy two or whatever.

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Does it really need to be longer? And then you have to look

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at the way that the course was
designed, the bunkering, the shapes of

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the greens. It's all based upon
the trajectory of the shots, the angles

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into different pin placements where the bunkers
are off the off the tees and this

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sort of thing. To sit there
and say, okay, well, now

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the ball is going to go fifty
yards farther and everyone's just going to fly

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it over these bunkers into some part
of the course that would never would have

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been designed for that. It doesn't
make any sense from a design standpoint or

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from the standpoint of a game.
But you know, I think this idea

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that that golf is very hard,
and I feel like people are angry at

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it, like it's just, you
know, anyway they can beat up this

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game or make you know, if
we can figure out how to hit it

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farther and take the spin off the
ball, we can just beat up these

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courses and stuff. It's it's it's
almost like I feel like there's some kind

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of like a resentment or something of
that the game is just hard, and

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we're gonna do everything technology. We're
just gonna If humans can't do it,

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we'll have technology do it. You
know, we're gonna we're gonna beat up

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this game somehow. And I think
people are missing the point. I have

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the beauty of golf and the design. I just played. I don't.

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I don't play that much anymore.
I've only played two rounds this year.

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I played Cyprus Point in January and
this last weekend I just played Richmond Country

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Club. And I have a friend
at Richmond, so I get to play

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it. Okay, So you know
the golf course a little bit, Yeah

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I do, Yeah, I do. Okay, so it's I'm not a

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huge fan, but well, I'm
a huge fan of Richmond Country Club.

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And I say this because of the
positioning of the bunkering and the shapes of

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the greens. Let me give you
an example, the seventeenth toll, the

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par four Okay, okay, okay. If there's a bunker on the left

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off the tea and a bunker off
the right off the tea, the bunker

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off the right is shorter and distance
than the bunker on the left. Okay,

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So that weak right fade goes into
that bunker, and if you try

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and hit a hard draw, it
goes into the left bunker, because the

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draws typically go farther than the fades
right. So if let's say you're trying

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to win your club championship and you
got one shot lead, two holes to

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play, you just parted the last
two. You think you know. Let's

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say, yeah, you have two
shot lead, two shot lead with two

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holes to play, you just part
in and you're gonna win. So what

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do you do when you come to
seventeen? You could lay up short of

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those bunkers and hit a six iron
into the green, Okay, Or I

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could I could lay up, stay
with a one iron or two iron short

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of the bunkers, or I could
try and hit a driver through the bunkers.

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I'm gonna have to hit a good
drive to keep it in between those

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bunkers, and then I can come
in there with maybe an eight or nine

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iron. See you see the risk
and reward there. It's just perfect,

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It's perfect, It's beautiful. I
loved how the bunkers were staggered. I

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mean and and I love the risk
and reward. Like I could just hit

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one iron off the two and take
the bunkers completely out of play. I

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can't reach them, but I can
still. I can still get it on

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the green easy enough. But I'm
going to come in with a six iron,

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not an eight iron or a nine
iron, see what I'm saying.

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Yeah, And to me, whole
number three at Richmond is a part of

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three uphill and is the hardest part
of five I've ever played. Yeah,

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right, it drives me. No
this, We're gonna take a time out.

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We'll be back right after this.
Yeah. They're doing a lot of

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work or Richmond right now, and
they're doing great work. And but for

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me, it feels like so many
of the holes have different types of grass

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that it makes it harder to play. To me, it's a real thinker's

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course, you know. Eating Yeah, yeah, I can see I'm hitting

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it. I'm hitting it. I'm
playing per simmon, I'm hitting it,

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you know, two fifty two sixty
off the tea. So I'm playing the

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course as it was designed originally.
It feels fairly unmolested out there, m

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hm, as compared with some of
these courses where they've tried to redo them

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and make it more modern and that
sort of thing. Yeah. One thing

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my friend noted, he's a pro
from Georgia. He came out to visit

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me and we played there. He
said, every hole there's a there's a

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run up option on the whole m. There's no force carries, which I

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think is great for member golf.
And you know, remember golf is different,

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right. You want to make it
more challenging because this is the only

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course these people are playing, so
you gotta make it tougher. I would

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think you can always there's always a
way to run it onto the green.

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Yeah, you know, you don't. A lot of these courses were just

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completely bunkered all the way around,
and that sort of thing, and and

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even if you have a bunker that
sneaks in half the green or side,

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but you can always kind of feather
something in there. You know, you

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could always run one up. And
I think that's really that's a good thing.

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Alistair McKenzie was pretty good about that, always usually always having a run

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up option somewhere. Yeah. Well, during our break, we um I

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got news. Okay, this is
totally facetious. I got news that jame

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Onahan, because of health issues and
the board kind of revolting, he's gonna

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step down from being commissioner of the
PGA Tour and your name is on the

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short list to take his job.
Yeah. Right, So if now that

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you're commissioner of the PGA Tour,
what's the first thing you're going to change

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everything? Okay, you're hired.
Now what's the first thing you're gonna do?

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Where are you going to start?
Just gonna fire everybody and just bring

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in people that I think would be
good too. No, I mean I

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would. I would just try and
get the game. I would. I

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think what I would do is,
uh is, do everything I could to

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start a satellite tour of a classic
classic game. I mean, how many

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how many different versions? Of football
are there? Um, actually, there

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are a couple Canadian Canadian rules,
Yeah, XFL w our arena football,

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right yeah, right right, They
all exist, right right. None of

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them are going to be bigger than
the NFL, which is fine, but

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they exist. So I think that
like a Percimonum Blade Tour would be great

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to just exist, you know.
I mean, if professional women's softball can

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exist, I don't see any reason
why. No, I mean, I'm

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not putting that down. I'm just
saying it exists. You know. I

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don't see any reason why you couldn't
just have a tour that plays the game

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as it was relatively intended to be
played. I mean, these courses were

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designed for two hundred and fifty yard
drives, and a lot of these courses

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are great courses if you look at
them from a two hundred fifty yard drive

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standpoint. I mean, you could
take a kid that hits it three hundred

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and fifty yards and I give him
a set of persimonent blades and we go

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out and play. He might hit
a little farther than I do, but

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not not not as much as he
thinks. And if they're having to play

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these courses place like Richmond Country Club. I don't think people are just going

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to go out there and shoot sixty
two or three out there. You know,

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you're you're younger than I am,
except you're an old timer, right,

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And as far as golf was concerned, you're an old timer. You're

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looking at it like it was great. The way we had it. It

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was challenging, it was hard.
We didn't need that much space. But

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all these things that you've listed,
are they going to grow the game?

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Is there a need to grow the
game to get more people interested in,

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more people wanting to play than going
this is too damn hard. I can't

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do this. I don't. I
guess I don't really feel there's a need

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to grow the game. Ah Okay, I guess. I guess that's maybe

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the difference I grow the game.
It's kind of like grow the economy,

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you know, do we need to
do? How about just it's sustainable?

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Like how about I can just go
down and buy a loaf of bread for

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two bucks? I mean, you
know, what does it have to everything

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have to be growing all the time. I feel like growth is just unsustainable.

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You know, the fishing industry,
I'm a fisherman, you know,

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so I brought in kayak fish,
I catch salmon, hallibut in the bay

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or whatever. I mean, do
we have to grow the fishing industry?

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It just depletes the bay of all
the fish. And you know, do

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we need more and more party boats, more commercial fishermen raping the oceans or

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whatever? I don't I mean,
is it is that the goal? Or

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is it better just have it sustainable? Like why not? Hey, we've

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got a lot of golf courses.
I mean, growing the game to me

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sounds like longer rounds of golf,
more more beginners playing, more people hitting

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it all over the place, slower
rounds, hard to get tea times,

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increasing the price of the rounds because
you know, golf's getting more and more

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expensive because you know, you create
more and more demand and there's less resources,

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which means that you just just economics, right, I mean, the

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prices just go up on stuff.
I don't know. Growing the game does

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it need to grow? Maybe people
that are just interested in golf play golf,

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and people that aren't interested in golf
don't play golf. I mean,

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well, you know, as many
times as I've had a chance to talk

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to Barney Adams, he always reminds
us that the PGA Tour is a television

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show, it's not golf, And
they're there to get the advertisers to let

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them get their brand messages out there, to get the logos on the most

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famous players in the world so that
they can, you know, increase their

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brand recognition. And you know that
it seems like the USGA growing the game

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for amateur golfers and getting more people
to play the game, and then the

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PGA Tour to grow the TV show. Are those in conflict with one another?

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Do they can they both survive?
Can they both be sustainable? The

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word you use? And should they? I think? I just think golf

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is a game. So let's say
that you and I go and play chess.

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We meet down at the coffeehouse and
we're gonna play You know, I

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used to do that at a guy. We'd play chess every week and we'd

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meet on Sunday afternoons at two o'clock
and we play chess. I mean,

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is it important to grow the game
of chess? You know, it's like,

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00:23:04.720 --> 00:23:07.920
come on, everybody, what are
you What are you guys doing out

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00:23:07.920 --> 00:23:08.880
there? Come out and play some
chess with us. Come on here,

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we got some extra boards it's really
important that we make it. I mean,

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I don't know, it's just a
game. I mean, do you

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enjoy I mean, is it important
we saw more monopoly boards or whatever,

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or part cheese or whatever games people
grew up with. I don't know,

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battleship or whatever. It's just a
game in that sense. The USG,

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the purpose of the USG is to
protect the integrity of the game. They're

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supposed to be the stewarts of the
game. That's what they're at. That's

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that's their job. And if you
look back at I've got some you know,

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some old like ads from television and
the seventies or eighties, there was

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a big controversy about the ball going
too far. But like in nineteen eighty

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three when the Titlist came out with
a new ball, I don't know it

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was the three eighty four or something
that came out and they said, you

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know, and they they did studies
and they said that this ball is going

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00:24:07.960 --> 00:24:14.079
two to three yards farther than the
old ball. And it was a big

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00:24:14.160 --> 00:24:17.880
uproar about it, and they were
saying, you don't stop this right now.

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This is going to be very bad
for the game. But now,

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if you look in hindsight. So
the longest hitter on the PGA Tour in

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00:24:30.079 --> 00:24:33.880
the early eighties was a guy named
John mccomis who was from Santa Maria,

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and he averaged two hundred and seventy
six yards two seventy six and he was

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the longest hitter on the PGA Tour. And that statistic. Now, if

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00:24:45.680 --> 00:24:49.000
if you average two seventy six on
the PJA Tour, you would be the

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00:24:49.160 --> 00:24:55.759
shortest hitter on the PGA Tour,
the shortest hitter. So something has really

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really changed. And if the goal
is to protect the integrity the game,

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meaning that the game, the parameters
of the game. Every game has parameters.

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Chess has parameters. The king gets
to do the only can move one

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space, you know, the ponds
can go out to and then one and

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you know rooks and bishops go diagonal
or whatever. You have these parameters that

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that make the game. Just like
basketball, you know, the court is

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so many feet by so many feet, and the hoop is so high and

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it's so big or whatever, and
that that's what makes it interesting, you

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know, it's it's the limitations that
make a game interesting. I mean,

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if if basketball, if the hoop
was four times as big, and guys

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it was just anyone that would just
shoot from half court and it's just you

355
00:25:38.759 --> 00:25:41.599
know or whatever. I mean,
would it be that interesting? I mean,

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00:25:41.720 --> 00:25:45.480
that's that's could be making a four
point line in the NBA or whatever

357
00:25:45.720 --> 00:25:52.440
I mean farther and farther away,
and maybe maybe that would be interesting to

358
00:25:52.480 --> 00:25:56.440
make the hoop bigger, make it
so, you know, maybe a guy

359
00:25:56.680 --> 00:25:59.920
my height could dunk it if it
was half as high and I could go

360
00:26:00.039 --> 00:26:02.359
up and duck. I don't know. Maybe there's a league for that.

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Maybe there's a maybe there are leagues
for that. I don't know, But

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I just think that golf is a
game. I think that they had the

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parameters right if you think about baseball, right, I mean when they when

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they invented baseball, at some some
point they had to arbitrarily set where these

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bases were going to be, right, I don't know how how many feet

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is it to the first base,
do you know? Okay? Ninety feet?

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All right? Where did they come
up with that number? But but

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the bottom line is when a guy
hits a hits a hard line drive to

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the third baseman right any any grounds, it picks the ground er up and

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just throws it to first base.
I mean it's just a split second,

371
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right, well, if he babbles
the ball, if he babbles the ball

372
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one time, I mean, but
between the foot hitting the bag the right

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right right out safe, right.
So it's there's parameters that people figured out

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back then to be if the if
it was ninety five feet, it would

375
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totally change, right, I mean, it would just be they'd never get

376
00:27:10.039 --> 00:27:11.839
them out, or they you know, or whatever. It's just I mean,

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they've got these things just right.
And I think that they had golf

378
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just right with two hundred and fifty
yard drives and all the angles and all

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right. Take let's take a Gusta
for instance, because people people are familiar

380
00:27:26.519 --> 00:27:33.240
with that. The tenth and the
eleventh hole, the greens are are narrow,

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but they're deep, okay, so
they're meant to accept a low trajectory

382
00:27:40.319 --> 00:27:45.079
shot that would skip into those greens. But if you take thirteen and fifteen,

383
00:27:45.079 --> 00:27:48.519
which are part fives, which are
almost the same length, really those

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00:27:48.559 --> 00:27:52.640
holes, okay, they're protected in
the front. The greens are wide,

385
00:27:52.680 --> 00:27:56.240
but they're shallow, so it's very
risky to come in with a low trajectory

386
00:27:56.279 --> 00:28:02.000
shot over water to a green that
isn't that deep, but it's why.

387
00:28:02.240 --> 00:28:06.880
So the shapes of the greens are
designed for the trajectory of the shots coming

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00:28:06.920 --> 00:28:11.279
in or you have a great risk
and reward element when you have protected in

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00:28:11.319 --> 00:28:14.880
a shallow green. Am I going
to go for it? I mean I

390
00:28:14.920 --> 00:28:18.440
would get kind of almost a nervous
feeling. I remember watching like Sevy,

391
00:28:18.480 --> 00:28:22.119
you know, back there hitting a
one iron, you know, into fifteen,

392
00:28:22.200 --> 00:28:22.880
you know, and he's got a
one ear. He's going to come

393
00:28:22.920 --> 00:28:27.720
in with this low trajectory shot.
He's got to hit that thing absolutely perfect

394
00:28:29.119 --> 00:28:33.400
right to get that thing up in
the air and have it come into where

395
00:28:33.400 --> 00:28:36.799
it doesn't too hot, where it's
skipping over the green and that sort of

396
00:28:36.799 --> 00:28:38.759
thing. But on the tenth and
eleventh holes that you come in, guys

397
00:28:38.759 --> 00:28:44.839
are coming in with long iron,
sometimes even a forward coming in a low

398
00:28:44.920 --> 00:28:48.319
trajectory shot. But the green is
meant to accept that shot. There's plenty

399
00:28:48.359 --> 00:28:52.240
of depth to it to come in
with a low trajectory. So right,

400
00:28:52.160 --> 00:28:56.720
I don't hear announcers talking about this
stuff. They should, but maybe they're

401
00:28:56.759 --> 00:29:00.519
told not to. I don't know, but that would be just an example

402
00:29:00.559 --> 00:29:03.440
that I think people should be able
to relate to just the design element,

403
00:29:03.480 --> 00:29:07.880
the parameters of the game, so
that the player has to, you know,

404
00:29:07.920 --> 00:29:11.440
make decisions about things and are they
going to go far it? Are

405
00:29:11.480 --> 00:29:14.039
they not? What are they risking
the rewards? Or But if a guy's

406
00:29:14.119 --> 00:29:18.759
hit chipping an eight iron into thirteen
or fifteen, I mean, it's not

407
00:29:18.799 --> 00:29:22.559
really that exciting. I mean they're
coming in with a with a short iron

408
00:29:22.559 --> 00:29:26.880
and a high shot. It's like, who cares? I does? It

409
00:29:26.920 --> 00:29:30.319
just does nothing for me to watch
that. But if I see a guy

410
00:29:30.359 --> 00:29:33.519
with a two iron back there and
he's got sweat coming up as brown,

411
00:29:33.559 --> 00:29:36.920
he's trying to win a major championship, that's quite exciting, you know,

412
00:29:36.920 --> 00:29:45.759
it's really quite Yeah, we're gonna
take another time out. Do you like

413
00:29:45.880 --> 00:29:49.759
watching golf on television? I don't
watch golf on television. No, you

414
00:29:49.799 --> 00:29:55.720
can't do it? Well, I
mean even the majors. I No,

415
00:29:56.200 --> 00:29:59.279
I don't. I can't watch the
Masters anymore. I can't watch it.

416
00:30:00.279 --> 00:30:04.960
Why it just does nothing for me. I mean I when I when I

417
00:30:06.000 --> 00:30:07.880
look at the way those holes are
designed and how they're supposed to be played

418
00:30:07.880 --> 00:30:11.559
and this sort of thing, it
just doesn't create the tension. When I

419
00:30:11.559 --> 00:30:15.000
see guys hitting, like I just
said, short irons into thirteen and fifteen,

420
00:30:15.039 --> 00:30:18.759
It's like, what do is it
really? I mean, how is

421
00:30:18.799 --> 00:30:26.240
that? Or I'll give you another
example. Um, let's take the sixteen

422
00:30:26.240 --> 00:30:30.880
that Augusta right, that that Sunday
pin on the back left right. Okay,

423
00:30:32.559 --> 00:30:37.799
So the Greens in the old days
weren't that fast. I don't know

424
00:30:37.799 --> 00:30:42.079
if you've ever watched any of the
old vintage footage of the Masters. Okay,

425
00:30:42.480 --> 00:30:48.759
but the Greens used to put like
t boxes now. Okay, So

426
00:30:48.640 --> 00:30:52.480
think of that back left pin on
sixteen. What do we what do we

427
00:30:52.519 --> 00:30:56.200
see nowadays? Well, if they
hit it up to the right, it

428
00:30:56.279 --> 00:31:00.079
hits the slope and it rolls down
and ends up, you know, six

429
00:31:00.119 --> 00:31:04.039
feet from the hole right. I
mean, that's common. But where's the

430
00:31:04.160 --> 00:31:08.279
risk and reward there? In the
old days, when that slope was slow,

431
00:31:08.400 --> 00:31:15.039
the ball would not roll down the
slope, okay. So in other

432
00:31:15.079 --> 00:31:17.400
words, if you wanted to get
it close, you had to shoot it

433
00:31:17.440 --> 00:31:22.480
at the pin with the water right
there, and if you bailed out to

434
00:31:22.519 --> 00:31:27.039
the right, you had a tough
downhill pot from up there. It did

435
00:31:27.039 --> 00:31:30.200
the ball didn't just funnel down to
the hole that That to me just makes

436
00:31:30.240 --> 00:31:33.559
no sense. It takes the risk
and reward out of it. I want

437
00:31:33.559 --> 00:31:37.880
to see the guy have to shoot
at the pin, not aimed to the

438
00:31:37.000 --> 00:31:40.920
right, and have it come down. I think it's absolutely ridiculous. But

439
00:31:41.359 --> 00:31:44.160
I don't. I don't think it's
a matter of me being a purist or

440
00:31:44.200 --> 00:31:47.880
some kind of old time or whatever. It's just common sense. It's much

441
00:31:47.920 --> 00:31:49.720
more exciting if you forced the issue. You want to get it close.

442
00:31:49.880 --> 00:31:52.119
You got to go at that pin. If you're going to bail out to

443
00:31:52.160 --> 00:31:55.799
the right, you're gonna have a
tricky downhill pot coming down that hill?

444
00:31:56.119 --> 00:32:01.480
Makes sense? Would you slow the
greens? Of course? Yeah, okay,

445
00:32:01.480 --> 00:32:06.279
these old well I just played Richmond
Countrical again. The greens were like

446
00:32:06.400 --> 00:32:07.759
us open fast out there the other
day. I mean it was they were

447
00:32:07.839 --> 00:32:14.200
so fast it was absolutely ridiculous.
Yeah, And as sloping as those greens

448
00:32:14.240 --> 00:32:20.359
are, they never had any designs
on greens ever being that fast green.

449
00:32:20.480 --> 00:32:24.480
This whole idea of super super fast
greens is I think just really kind of

450
00:32:24.519 --> 00:32:30.480
against the design of these courses.
They would never be but with everybody hitting,

451
00:32:30.960 --> 00:32:37.319
everybody hitting farther and getting farther where
where the challenge is your short game

452
00:32:37.440 --> 00:32:42.000
and the putting that's gonna that's where
you're gonna be losing strokes if the ball

453
00:32:42.039 --> 00:32:47.400
and the equipment's going to let you
go farther and be more accurate than the

454
00:32:47.599 --> 00:32:52.119
risk reward is going to come in
your short game getting it close or putting

455
00:32:52.119 --> 00:32:57.960
on these very hard greens, difficult
greens. If the greens, if you

456
00:32:58.000 --> 00:33:01.640
were to design greens and you knew
that they were going to be super super

457
00:33:01.680 --> 00:33:06.400
fast, and I think the design
of the greens would be different. They

458
00:33:06.400 --> 00:33:08.960
wouldn't be you wouldn't have these big
severe undulations or whatever. You'd keep more

459
00:33:08.960 --> 00:33:15.079
flat type services with little, you
know, subtle undulations and that sort of

460
00:33:15.079 --> 00:33:17.880
thing. But these old classic courses, the reason that they had these big

461
00:33:19.079 --> 00:33:22.079
undulations because the greens weren't that fast. So if you hit it up here

462
00:33:22.119 --> 00:33:28.079
on a shelf, it was a
downhill put coming down. This whole idea

463
00:33:28.119 --> 00:33:30.960
of just putting terror into people on
a five foot put or something, and

464
00:33:31.160 --> 00:33:37.119
you know, if I missed this
put. There was a one of the

465
00:33:37.119 --> 00:33:40.599
holes at Richmond, I think it
was it was the eighth the eighth hole

466
00:33:42.039 --> 00:33:46.480
at Richmond Country Club where the first
half of the green was unusable. The

467
00:33:46.519 --> 00:33:50.680
ball would literally just roll up and
they just roll back off the green.

468
00:33:50.799 --> 00:33:57.279
It would literally my friend chip the
ball up to the hole and it didn't

469
00:33:57.319 --> 00:33:59.200
get to the hole, and it
came all the way back and went off

470
00:33:59.240 --> 00:34:01.920
the green. I mean, what's
the point of that? Yeah? Why

471
00:34:02.519 --> 00:34:07.960
And we've seen that a lot this
year in Majors and whatnot, where the

472
00:34:08.000 --> 00:34:15.400
ball just yeah, it falls right
back off and rolls forty yards away.

473
00:34:15.639 --> 00:34:19.079
You know, I played, I
played in the Australian Open. I'm thinking

474
00:34:19.159 --> 00:34:22.719
I'm just gonna I think it was
nineteen eighty nine at Royal Melbourne and Greg

475
00:34:22.760 --> 00:34:28.840
Norman was leading the tournament by I
don't know six shots on Sunday and the

476
00:34:28.920 --> 00:34:31.519
wind blew so hard it was it
was, and the greens are so fast,

477
00:34:31.519 --> 00:34:36.079
it was blowing the balls off the
greens. Oh, it's just get

478
00:34:36.079 --> 00:34:38.159
blown up. So Greg Norman comes
to the third hole, he hits a

479
00:34:38.239 --> 00:34:43.519
put from below the hole. It
goes, it goes up, miss is

480
00:34:43.559 --> 00:34:49.360
the hole and then turns and comes
back farther away than he had originally putted.

481
00:34:50.239 --> 00:34:53.199
And you know what he did,
No, he picked the ball up

482
00:34:53.519 --> 00:34:58.719
and he just walked off the course. Off the course. You just quit.

483
00:34:58.840 --> 00:35:00.360
You just said, I'm I'm not
there in this. He was leading,

484
00:35:00.760 --> 00:35:04.599
he's leading the Australian Open, and
he just picked it up and he

485
00:35:04.639 --> 00:35:06.519
just left. He said, this
is just so I'm not doing this.

486
00:35:07.360 --> 00:35:09.159
And what did they do? They
said, Greg, what are you doing?

487
00:35:09.360 --> 00:35:12.599
He said, this is ridiculous and
there and then they're like, oh,

488
00:35:12.679 --> 00:35:15.639
yeah, I guess you're right.
It is ridiculous. So then they

489
00:35:15.760 --> 00:35:20.440
canceled around and everybody played again on
Monday. Oh and what do they do

490
00:35:20.480 --> 00:35:22.559
with the greens? What did they
do with the people? Probably watered him,

491
00:35:22.800 --> 00:35:25.480
you know, trying to slow them
down a little bit, but a

492
00:35:25.480 --> 00:35:29.679
lot of it was the wind.
But the fact is it just became ridiculous.

493
00:35:30.440 --> 00:35:34.360
I don't think golf needs to be
ridiculous, you know, especially if

494
00:35:34.400 --> 00:35:36.880
you're you know, you hit a
good iron shot into a green, if

495
00:35:36.880 --> 00:35:38.559
you're back there with a fore iron
or something, you hit a shot into

496
00:35:38.559 --> 00:35:42.519
the back of the green and you're
you know, you hit a ten feet

497
00:35:42.519 --> 00:35:45.079
from the hole, but you know, if you don't make this put,

498
00:35:45.119 --> 00:35:47.760
this thing's just going to roll twenty
feet past the whole. I just think

499
00:35:47.800 --> 00:35:52.719
stuff like that's just ridiculous. Nobody's
that good that they're going to sit there

500
00:35:52.760 --> 00:35:55.760
from two hundred yards out with a
fore iron and say, I've got to

501
00:35:55.800 --> 00:36:00.639
position this thing ten and a half
feet short right of the hole. I

502
00:36:00.679 --> 00:36:04.320
mean, you know, if you
hit it a little past the hole from

503
00:36:04.360 --> 00:36:07.119
two hundred yards or whatever, you
shouldn't be looking at some death trap put

504
00:36:07.159 --> 00:36:10.039
that you know you're gonna just five
put or something. You know, you

505
00:36:10.719 --> 00:36:14.920
hit the green, you know what
I mean, you shouldn't. You might

506
00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:17.119
have a difficult put. Yes,
it's a downhill left or right put,

507
00:36:17.159 --> 00:36:21.159
it's gonna be tough to make it, but you shouldn't have to worry about

508
00:36:21.239 --> 00:36:24.719
walking off with a bogie or a
double. I think that kind of thing

509
00:36:25.159 --> 00:36:28.880
has so that would be one of
the things I would change. I'd get

510
00:36:28.960 --> 00:36:31.039
rid of all the nonsense out of
golf, stuff like that. Just get

511
00:36:31.159 --> 00:36:37.280
rid of it. Tighten tighten up
the ferrways, make driving more. You

512
00:36:37.320 --> 00:36:37.960
know, have to hit it in
the ferry, or if you don't hit

513
00:36:37.960 --> 00:36:43.800
in the ferway, you're you know. I mean, I played in three

514
00:36:43.920 --> 00:36:47.960
US Amateurs, made the quarterfinals,
and it was nineteen eighty three Chicago.

515
00:36:49.800 --> 00:36:52.679
But I remember the grass was like
this deep. You know you hit it

516
00:36:52.719 --> 00:36:55.440
in there. Yeah, it was
like a foot deep. I mean you

517
00:36:55.519 --> 00:37:00.159
hit it in the grass. If
you could, you know this, the

518
00:37:00.280 --> 00:37:02.320
spotter would find the ball down there, put the flag down, you get

519
00:37:02.320 --> 00:37:06.840
there. I mean, you just
the first thing i'd you know, look

520
00:37:07.000 --> 00:37:09.079
my catt am, I hitting one
am I hitting wedge out of here sandwich.

521
00:37:09.360 --> 00:37:12.239
You know, maybe a nine iron, I don't know. I mean

522
00:37:12.280 --> 00:37:15.920
I wasn't like pulling out a six
iron, think I'm gonna get it on

523
00:37:15.920 --> 00:37:22.400
the green or anything. You know. Accuracy, I think it's harder to

524
00:37:22.599 --> 00:37:25.559
have to hit the ball straight.
So I don't understand why they're putting so

525
00:37:25.679 --> 00:37:30.159
much emphasis on hitting the ball far
and not having a penalty for arrant t

526
00:37:30.280 --> 00:37:32.960
shots. I think you should have
to drive the ball straight in a major,

527
00:37:34.360 --> 00:37:37.800
major tournament. In a major tournament, yes, but not in recreational,

528
00:37:37.880 --> 00:37:43.079
not an amateur golf because there are
no spotters, right. You can't

529
00:37:43.239 --> 00:37:46.599
have you can't have tall grass and
then complain about pace of play. If

530
00:37:46.599 --> 00:37:52.719
there's nobody going, here's your ball, Marshalls drive me nuts. So you've

531
00:37:52.880 --> 00:37:58.599
played obviously, you played you know, amateur golf, you played college golf.

532
00:37:58.639 --> 00:38:04.159
You did well and then you made
it to the tour PGA Tour.

533
00:38:04.760 --> 00:38:14.519
I'm curious, what did you learn
playing on the professional level that you didn't

534
00:38:14.519 --> 00:38:17.840
know before you got there playing in
all those amateur levels successfully in the other

535
00:38:17.880 --> 00:38:22.280
amateur levels. Well, the first
thing I learned was there were guys that

536
00:38:22.360 --> 00:38:27.440
I'd never heard of that could just
go out and shoot sixty four on a

537
00:38:27.559 --> 00:38:31.719
course that was impossible. I mean, I couldn't believe the guys coming out

538
00:38:31.719 --> 00:38:37.400
of the woodwork. You know,
you had when I turned pro. This

539
00:38:37.400 --> 00:38:45.360
would have been nineteen eighty seven,
so all the top players from my class.

540
00:38:45.480 --> 00:38:47.519
You know, we're turning pro coming
out of college, so you had.

541
00:38:47.840 --> 00:38:52.599
I still had to beat those guys
that I was playing against in college,

542
00:38:52.840 --> 00:38:55.679
right, But now I've got to
beat some guy who's been out there

543
00:38:55.719 --> 00:39:00.400
for twenty years, who's played this
golf course. You know, if I'm

544
00:39:00.400 --> 00:39:06.840
playing in the BC Open in Canada
and it's my first year looking at Point

545
00:39:06.880 --> 00:39:09.000
Gray country Club or whatever, trying
to figure out how I'm gonna play this

546
00:39:09.039 --> 00:39:14.039
course, and here's a guy who's
been playing this same tournament for twenty years,

547
00:39:14.679 --> 00:39:19.920
tis played at five times. You
know, he's playing the five rounds

548
00:39:20.440 --> 00:39:22.840
on that golf course every year,
right. I mean, so this guy's

549
00:39:22.840 --> 00:39:29.159
played this course, you know,
over a hundred times, and I've and

550
00:39:29.199 --> 00:39:32.519
it's like his home course right right, and I'm looking at it for the

551
00:39:32.559 --> 00:39:38.039
first time. I couldn't believe how
good players were that I'd never heard of.

552
00:39:38.760 --> 00:39:42.960
Wow. So you know, there
was an old saying that if you're

553
00:39:42.960 --> 00:39:46.079
gonna be a pro golfer, you
have to be the best player within two

554
00:39:46.159 --> 00:39:52.880
hundred miles of where you live for
sure. Okay, so you learned a

555
00:39:52.880 --> 00:39:55.800
lot about the competition when you got
up to that level. You learn about

556
00:39:55.920 --> 00:40:02.480
your game. I wasn't good enough, you know. So you know that's

557
00:40:02.519 --> 00:40:06.920
when. And then in my big
moment, you know, I know we

558
00:40:06.960 --> 00:40:09.719
don't we talk more golf here,
you know, on my site and stuff,

559
00:40:09.760 --> 00:40:13.760
I'm talking more swing theory and all
that stuff. And you know how

560
00:40:14.320 --> 00:40:19.199
I knew that I was playing Australian
Open. I'm on the driving range at

561
00:40:19.280 --> 00:40:22.199
Royal Melbourne. This would have been, you know, in nineteen eighties seven.

562
00:40:22.320 --> 00:40:30.039
I think I'm hitting balls between Greg
Norman and Sandy Lyle. Sandy Lyle

563
00:40:30.079 --> 00:40:34.719
had just won either won the Masters
of the British Open or whatever. Greg

564
00:40:34.719 --> 00:40:38.920
Norman was number one in the world. And it sounded like gunfire going off,

565
00:40:39.079 --> 00:40:42.400
you know, I mean the way
they were striking the ball. I

566
00:40:42.400 --> 00:40:45.480
mean, it had a different sound
to it. I mean they were these

567
00:40:45.480 --> 00:40:49.639
guys were really accelerating the club and
compressing the ball in a way that I

568
00:40:49.679 --> 00:40:53.039
had. I didn't know anything about
that. So when I came back home

569
00:40:53.079 --> 00:40:55.639
and worked with my teacher, I
just kind of thought, you know,

570
00:40:57.159 --> 00:41:01.559
this isn't working. I'm gonna have
to change my technique here and become more

571
00:41:01.559 --> 00:41:05.440
of a hitter, you know,
than a swinger. I was kind of

572
00:41:05.440 --> 00:41:07.760
more of a dainty sort of you
know, swinging the club really relaxed and

573
00:41:07.840 --> 00:41:12.079
sort of you know, had a
real pretty, pretty flowing swing, and

574
00:41:12.119 --> 00:41:17.039
that no good. That wasn't gonna
work. So I had to change and

575
00:41:17.079 --> 00:41:20.119
then I did, you know,
So I committed to doing that. I

576
00:41:20.119 --> 00:41:23.519
worked my butt off and then worked
out, got stronger, you know,

577
00:41:23.719 --> 00:41:27.199
just committed to it, and then
I became a much better player. So

578
00:41:27.559 --> 00:41:31.079
I think professional golf it made me
better because I realized I had to be

579
00:41:31.079 --> 00:41:35.400
better, and I realized the competition
was better. And it's the best thing

580
00:41:35.440 --> 00:41:38.000
you could possibly do for your golf
if you want to become as good as

581
00:41:38.000 --> 00:41:42.159
you can possibly be, and if
you have the fortune to get out on

582
00:41:42.159 --> 00:41:45.559
the pro tour and see how good
those other players are and then commit to,

583
00:41:46.119 --> 00:41:50.280
you know, trying to raise the
bar for yourself. And I think

584
00:41:50.320 --> 00:41:53.320
that's, you know, why I
became as good as I did, and

585
00:41:53.760 --> 00:42:00.719
why I'm even someone like he's even
interested in talking to me. When you

586
00:42:00.760 --> 00:42:07.079
said a moment ago, you talked
about how accelerating the club. Now explain

587
00:42:07.199 --> 00:42:14.119
the difference between accelerating the club through
impact versus swinging hard. Okay, So

588
00:42:14.159 --> 00:42:16.599
there's there's there's two ways to hit
a golf ball, either what I would

589
00:42:16.599 --> 00:42:22.079
call swinging or hitting Okay, okay, from a physics stamp, I just

590
00:42:22.159 --> 00:42:30.039
make it as simple as possible.
You would have there's a difference between a

591
00:42:30.159 --> 00:42:37.280
momentum strike and a force strike.
Okay, So one you would have a

592
00:42:37.320 --> 00:42:39.159
momentum would be, all right,
let's say that you're going to be hitting

593
00:42:39.199 --> 00:42:44.320
the ball at one hundred and ten
miles an hour clubs. Okay, So

594
00:42:44.400 --> 00:42:46.559
here's the ball, here's the club, Okay, momentum would be I'm already

595
00:42:46.599 --> 00:42:52.440
at one hundred and ten miles an
hour right here, okay. In other

596
00:42:52.480 --> 00:42:55.760
words, I'm gliding the thing in. I've reached maximum acceleration on the way

597
00:42:55.760 --> 00:43:00.360
down. I went from zero to
twenty thirty, forty fifty sixty, seventy

598
00:43:00.360 --> 00:43:02.800
eighty nine, I get I get
to one hundred hundred and ten hundred,

599
00:43:02.880 --> 00:43:07.679
ten hundred, ten hundred and ten. Okay, So you were for these

600
00:43:07.719 --> 00:43:13.000
people who are just listening when you
you're talking about that, you're about twelve

601
00:43:13.079 --> 00:43:16.880
thirteen inches behind the ball and you've
already reached your maximum clubhead speed. Yeah.

602
00:43:17.000 --> 00:43:22.000
Most people reach maximum clubhead speed,
you know, somewhere on the down

603
00:43:22.000 --> 00:43:25.159
swing. You know, they reach
their maximum speed and then they're gliding the

604
00:43:25.199 --> 00:43:31.639
club in to the strife. Okay. So that's basically what what those people

605
00:43:31.639 --> 00:43:36.000
are doing. You're gonna you're gonna
flex the shaft at the top of the

606
00:43:36.039 --> 00:43:38.559
swing. You're gonna flex it,
okay, and then and then that shaft

607
00:43:38.679 --> 00:43:44.679
is going to unflex into the ball. Okay. In other words, you

608
00:43:44.719 --> 00:43:47.320
load the shaft and then that shaft
is gonna kick and it's gonna flex into

609
00:43:47.320 --> 00:43:52.960
the ball. Does that make sense. M Okay, that's swinger. Now

610
00:43:52.960 --> 00:43:57.119
they hit her would be saying,
Okay, I'm gonna load the shaft,

611
00:43:57.280 --> 00:44:00.079
but I'm gonna keep accelerating, keep
accelerating, and I'm going to be holding

612
00:44:00.119 --> 00:44:05.039
that shaft flex into all the way
to the strikes. In other words,

613
00:44:05.280 --> 00:44:07.719
you're gonna be picking up speed.
So at one hundred and ten, that

614
00:44:07.880 --> 00:44:15.719
same golfer would be one hundred and
six seven, eight, nine, ten

615
00:44:15.760 --> 00:44:22.079
to one hundred and ten at contact
right trot striving for one hundred and eleven

616
00:44:22.440 --> 00:44:27.920
twelve right. The ball is going
to obviously the forces of impact is going

617
00:44:28.000 --> 00:44:30.239
to slow the club down a little
bit, but the intention of the golfer

618
00:44:30.280 --> 00:44:37.119
is to continue to accelerate that club
beyond the strike, which which you could

619
00:44:37.159 --> 00:44:39.239
do if you didn't have a ball
there, if you just took a swing

620
00:44:39.239 --> 00:44:43.079
and you didn't hit the ground like
like, I can swing the club to

621
00:44:43.119 --> 00:44:49.000
where the club is moving actually faster
after the low point. So in other

622
00:44:49.000 --> 00:44:52.199
words, I'm holding So when I
when I flex the shaft, I come

623
00:44:52.239 --> 00:44:55.920
down and I'm holding the flex of
the shaft all the way to the strike,

624
00:44:57.599 --> 00:45:01.239
if not beyond now. So you
would say, well, why why

625
00:45:01.280 --> 00:45:04.800
does that matter? A lot of
people would say, if you're hitting the

626
00:45:04.800 --> 00:45:07.519
ball at one hundred and ten miles
an hour, who cares whether you're accelerating

627
00:45:07.639 --> 00:45:09.639
or not because it's say the club's
hitting it at one hundred and ten.

628
00:45:09.960 --> 00:45:14.920
But here, here's where where people
where people are missing the point. Let

629
00:45:14.920 --> 00:45:21.039
me grab a pen here, okay
please, So the audio audience use your

630
00:45:21.039 --> 00:45:23.119
words, yeah, because I'm watching
you, but no one else is.

631
00:45:23.519 --> 00:45:30.840
Yeah, yeah, okay. So
if I'm if I'm accelerating the club in

632
00:45:30.880 --> 00:45:34.719
other words, there's a resistance in
the head. You've got the head on

633
00:45:34.800 --> 00:45:37.320
one end and you have your hands
on the other at the shaft. Right,

634
00:45:37.400 --> 00:45:39.119
So I got the club the club
head is on one end of the

635
00:45:39.119 --> 00:45:44.559
shaft and my hands are on the
other. Okay. If i am pressuring

636
00:45:44.599 --> 00:45:46.639
the shaft through the use of my
hands and my body and everything, and

637
00:45:46.679 --> 00:45:52.880
I'm pressuring that shaft and I'm holding
the flex of the shaft back, what

638
00:45:52.920 --> 00:45:57.840
that does is that puts feel and
pressure in my hands. Here I can

639
00:45:58.000 --> 00:46:02.440
feel the shaft in a tangential way. In other words, a tangential way.

640
00:46:02.599 --> 00:46:07.559
I'm pressuring the grip and I feel
it in my hands. That allows

641
00:46:07.559 --> 00:46:09.159
me to feel where the club faces
at. I had now have control of

642
00:46:09.199 --> 00:46:12.880
the club face. I can feel
where it is. As soon as I

643
00:46:12.960 --> 00:46:16.480
lose that pressure, I lose shafflex, then I've lost the pressure in my

644
00:46:16.519 --> 00:46:20.039
hands and I can't really tell.
I don't have the accuracy to be able

645
00:46:20.039 --> 00:46:23.320
to tell where the club face is
at h That's a secret to golf.

646
00:46:23.360 --> 00:46:28.239
That's it. That's it secret.
Now that we have the secret, let's

647
00:46:28.239 --> 00:46:31.960
take another time out, all right. This week on Golf Smarter, Mulligan's

648
00:46:32.079 --> 00:46:37.239
is part two of our conversation with
John Novicel of Tour Tempo from twenty eleven.

649
00:46:37.639 --> 00:46:42.679
These are a great pair of episodes
to hear back to back because this

650
00:46:42.760 --> 00:46:47.280
information can really have an impact on
your performance. As we learned in the

651
00:46:47.360 --> 00:46:53.119
last episode, Yale University researchers confirmed
what John had been teaching for years,

652
00:46:53.559 --> 00:46:59.320
and that's a consistent rhythmic swing.
The guy had two bunker shots during the

653
00:46:59.400 --> 00:47:04.519
round after you worked with our stuff, and he hit them both six within

654
00:47:04.639 --> 00:47:07.000
six feet of the pen and they
just, you know, nice soft landing

655
00:47:07.039 --> 00:47:12.159
and everything. And he says is
playing partners remark on how pro like the

656
00:47:12.280 --> 00:47:16.440
swing looked. And so that's the
other thing that we found out for the

657
00:47:16.480 --> 00:47:22.679
long game, that amateurs don't swing
tempo wise as fast as the pros.

658
00:47:22.199 --> 00:47:25.840
And then on the shore game.
They swing too fast compared to the pros.

659
00:47:27.119 --> 00:47:31.159
That's Golf Smarter Mulligan's episode two hundred
and twenty featuring John Novicel of Tour

660
00:47:31.280 --> 00:47:37.039
Tempo in an episode we called when
was the last time someone said to you?

661
00:47:37.840 --> 00:47:42.679
Nice swing? Please subscribe for free
to both of our golf podcasts,

662
00:47:42.679 --> 00:47:46.199
Golf Smarter, published every Tuesday since
two thousand and five, and our sister

663
00:47:46.320 --> 00:47:52.199
podcast that revisits the best of the
Golf Smarter podcast called Golf Smarter Mulligans,

664
00:47:52.239 --> 00:48:00.880
being released every Friday from wherever you're
listening right now. So with that last

665
00:48:00.880 --> 00:48:06.280
description, is that where your nickname
lag came from? Yeah, Lag Lag

666
00:48:06.440 --> 00:48:12.000
Ericsson. Is it you're putting or
is it you're the swing? Yeah?

667
00:48:12.039 --> 00:48:17.360
Pressure, lag pressure is my email
address, lag Pressure at GMx dot com.

668
00:48:17.599 --> 00:48:22.679
Anyone wants to email, Okay,
thank you, we will. Yeah.

669
00:48:22.679 --> 00:48:27.920
So, but lag pressure is a
pressure on the shaft. So in

670
00:48:27.960 --> 00:48:30.440
other words, just think of it
if you're, you know, in a

671
00:48:30.480 --> 00:48:35.440
fast car, I mean, and
somebody hits the gas and you feel pinned

672
00:48:35.440 --> 00:48:37.599
to the back of your seat,
right, Yeah, that's what you want

673
00:48:37.599 --> 00:48:39.880
to feel in your hands. You
want to be able to be because if

674
00:48:39.880 --> 00:48:44.239
you're if your hand is pinned on
the back of the club because you're accelerating,

675
00:48:44.280 --> 00:48:51.239
you can feel the club okay,
if you're the whole idea of weightlessness

676
00:48:51.480 --> 00:48:55.280
is that you can't feel anything.
You jump up a diving board, you're

677
00:48:55.280 --> 00:49:00.000
free falling, you don't feel anything
until you hit the water right right.

678
00:49:00.519 --> 00:49:02.960
But if you're accelerating in a car, you know you're pin to the back

679
00:49:02.960 --> 00:49:07.440
of your seat, you know you
feel everything. So you want to be

680
00:49:07.480 --> 00:49:10.079
able to feel because golf is a
game of feel. You have to be

681
00:49:10.079 --> 00:49:15.719
able to feel where the club face
is in relation to space and time.

682
00:49:15.519 --> 00:49:21.360
And if you if you accelerate too
soon, you lose the pressure in the

683
00:49:21.440 --> 00:49:24.280
right hand and you lose a sensation
of where the club face is, and

684
00:49:24.320 --> 00:49:28.920
that's why people hit the ball all
over the place. This is a problem

685
00:49:28.920 --> 00:49:31.599
with the PGA tour players on tour. Why they're you know, how can

686
00:49:31.639 --> 00:49:36.599
these guys that are out there,
you know, playing every day and they're

687
00:49:36.599 --> 00:49:37.760
pros and the best in the world. How can they be hitting a driver

688
00:49:37.880 --> 00:49:43.559
fifty yards offline? How can that
happen? And it's very simple because they

689
00:49:43.599 --> 00:49:47.039
have reached acceleration too early on the
downcing because the clubs are too long and

690
00:49:47.079 --> 00:49:51.960
they're too light, and they and
they lose pressure on the shap and when

691
00:49:51.960 --> 00:49:53.320
they get down to impact, they
can't feel where the club face is and

692
00:49:53.119 --> 00:49:59.639
the ball just goes, you know, fifty yards offline where in the in

693
00:49:59.679 --> 00:50:05.280
the old game, when the heads
were heavier. Then if something is heavier,

694
00:50:05.280 --> 00:50:07.760
it's harder to accelerate it quickly,
right, I mean, something's heavy,

695
00:50:08.480 --> 00:50:13.199
you know. It's just like if
I were held a bowling ball and

696
00:50:13.239 --> 00:50:15.039
I had it against my chest and
I was going to toss it over to

697
00:50:15.039 --> 00:50:17.119
you, I've got to kind of
push on that thing. Push, push,

698
00:50:17.159 --> 00:50:22.119
push, and it's a slower acceleration, right, But if I had

699
00:50:22.119 --> 00:50:23.159
a beach ball, I could just
tap it with my other hand and it

700
00:50:23.199 --> 00:50:27.800
would quickly accelerate over to you,
just right, excelry, very quickly.

701
00:50:28.480 --> 00:50:32.960
So the idea of the heavier clubs
was to help players feel the club and

702
00:50:34.000 --> 00:50:38.039
create pressure on the shaft and acceleration. Slow the acceleration rate so that you

703
00:50:38.039 --> 00:50:40.599
can bring it down to impact.
You can actually feel or the club hit

704
00:50:40.599 --> 00:50:44.760
as an impact. That's why the
old time game guys used to hit it

705
00:50:44.800 --> 00:50:50.199
straighter than they do now. But
that doesn't work. A two and or

706
00:50:50.239 --> 00:50:52.239
fifty yard drive doesn't work on a
seventy five hundred yard golf course, right,

707
00:50:52.519 --> 00:50:57.519
So the young players are doing the
correct thing by hitting it three hundred

708
00:50:57.519 --> 00:50:59.960
and fifty yards because that's what you
have to do in the courses of the

709
00:51:00.199 --> 00:51:01.960
long and they've cut down a lot
of the trees on the courses and the

710
00:51:02.039 --> 00:51:06.679
rough's not that high, and they're
not really penalized for hitting it fifty yards

711
00:51:06.679 --> 00:51:08.000
offline. Didn't we just watch us
when the guy who was gonna get in

712
00:51:08.039 --> 00:51:10.880
the other fairway or whatever. It's
no big, no problem, right,

713
00:51:12.280 --> 00:51:15.360
yeah, right in the middle of
the trees. So it's just a different

714
00:51:15.400 --> 00:51:19.280
it's a different game. And you
know, I'm an advocate for the old

715
00:51:19.320 --> 00:51:22.079
game because I think it's it's a
better game. It's more more articulations,

716
00:51:22.400 --> 00:51:27.039
it's a little more of an intellectual
game, I think, and it's it's

717
00:51:27.039 --> 00:51:32.199
a more equal opportunity game because if
you're five five and you weigh one hundred

718
00:51:32.199 --> 00:51:36.800
and thirty pounds, you can play
against somebody six six the way it's two

719
00:51:36.880 --> 00:51:39.800
hundred and fifty pounds or turned seventy
five pounds, and you could everyone's in

720
00:51:39.840 --> 00:51:45.519
the game. Short people, tall
people, fat people. Everybody's included,

721
00:51:46.280 --> 00:51:55.320
even ugly people, even ugly people. Good, I'm glad. All right.

722
00:51:55.400 --> 00:52:00.159
Let me ask you this as a
golfer, not a golf instruct but

723
00:52:00.239 --> 00:52:07.400
as a golfer, which what is
your superpower? What's my strength as a

724
00:52:07.400 --> 00:52:12.920
golfer? Yeah, accuracy, hitting
the ball, hitting the ball straight,

725
00:52:15.119 --> 00:52:20.880
and shape you can you shape your
shots as you need or you're always just

726
00:52:21.000 --> 00:52:25.360
straight? No? I never rarely
ever hit a straight shot. I'm always

727
00:52:25.360 --> 00:52:28.800
working at one way or the other, left or right, right to left.

728
00:52:29.800 --> 00:52:34.639
Um, my strength is it.
I have very very very good technique

729
00:52:34.679 --> 00:52:38.079
that I've worked very very very hard
to master, technique which allows me to

730
00:52:38.159 --> 00:52:43.280
hit the ball straight, accurate,
move the ball left or right, right

731
00:52:43.280 --> 00:52:50.519
to left, keep the ball in
play. I played Cyprus Point in January

732
00:52:50.559 --> 00:52:53.440
of this year and I hadn't It
was only the second round i'd played in

733
00:52:53.480 --> 00:52:58.320
two years. And I went out
and in twenty mile an hour wind,

734
00:52:58.360 --> 00:53:01.920
I hit fourteen greens out there,
Gee's and the and the four greens that

735
00:53:01.960 --> 00:53:07.000
I missed, I could have easily
have hit all those four greens. One

736
00:53:07.039 --> 00:53:08.199
of them I actually hit the green, spun the ball off the green.

737
00:53:08.639 --> 00:53:12.360
Oh, well, another one,
I was drawing the ball in from the

738
00:53:12.440 --> 00:53:15.599
right side and it hit just right
to the green and it hit a soft

739
00:53:15.639 --> 00:53:17.400
spot and stuck. If it just
bounces at all, it kicked, it

740
00:53:17.400 --> 00:53:21.280
would have kicked down perfect to a
back left hand placements. It wasn't a

741
00:53:21.280 --> 00:53:22.079
bad shot. Could have that one, could. You know. There's a

742
00:53:22.119 --> 00:53:25.679
lot of wood as shitos in golf, but I'm just giving the yeah.

743
00:53:25.960 --> 00:53:31.280
But these were these weren't like I
really hit bad shots. Um I missed

744
00:53:31.280 --> 00:53:36.159
the green on a part five because
my my right foot slipped off the tee

745
00:53:36.639 --> 00:53:39.320
because I wasn't able to wear steel
spikes, which you know is another topic,

746
00:53:39.400 --> 00:53:45.079
but um my ball went into one
of those bunkers off the in the

747
00:53:45.079 --> 00:53:47.000
faraway that you know. I had
to wedge out and hit sideways, which

748
00:53:47.079 --> 00:53:52.119
so I usually don't miss the greens
on par five's usually yeah, but I

749
00:53:52.159 --> 00:53:54.480
did in that case. And then
the only other green I missed was on

750
00:53:54.559 --> 00:54:00.079
the eighteenth. I hit it about
four yards through the faraway and I'm down

751
00:54:00.079 --> 00:54:04.360
in the little swale down They're trying
to hit a shot up and over the

752
00:54:04.360 --> 00:54:07.079
cypress tree to the green. I
hit a nice shot over the tree right

753
00:54:07.119 --> 00:54:09.360
at the green, and the wind
was blowing so hard off the coast,

754
00:54:09.400 --> 00:54:13.320
I couldn't feel it from down where
I was at. I just miscalculated.

755
00:54:13.760 --> 00:54:15.840
And the Cypress trees are kind of
stiff, you know, they don't really

756
00:54:15.880 --> 00:54:17.719
move a lot, so I didn't
really see couldn't really see the branches moving

757
00:54:17.719 --> 00:54:21.880
and realize there was that much winded. The ball just took it right to

758
00:54:21.960 --> 00:54:23.800
the green. So those are the
four greens I missed. And you know,

759
00:54:23.840 --> 00:54:27.000
I walked off thinking, well,
I mean, I don't even play

760
00:54:27.360 --> 00:54:30.039
golf much anymore, but yet I
could go out to Cypress Point and hit

761
00:54:30.079 --> 00:54:32.760
the ball this well, you know
wind, And I mean the eleventh hole,

762
00:54:32.800 --> 00:54:36.760
I had driver one iron into the
green onto the green. Next hole,

763
00:54:36.840 --> 00:54:38.760
driver two iron on the green,
next all driver four iron on the

764
00:54:38.760 --> 00:54:43.079
green. When you come straight into
the teeth of the wind at Cypress,

765
00:54:43.119 --> 00:54:45.440
you'd turn the tenth hole, he
come eleven, twelve, thirteen, fourteen,

766
00:54:45.480 --> 00:54:51.360
fifteen, sixteen, you're just dead
into the wind on the famous sixteenth

767
00:54:51.400 --> 00:54:53.800
too, wood boom right over the
right over the bay, you know,

768
00:54:53.800 --> 00:54:58.320
the water put on the left side
of the green. So I hit the

769
00:54:58.320 --> 00:55:00.159
ball beautifully out there, but it's
that's a strength in my game is just

770
00:55:00.239 --> 00:55:04.719
good technique. Now I need to
talk about equipment for just a second.

771
00:55:04.760 --> 00:55:07.079
Here, becausetta O the questions I
wanted to ask, but you said a

772
00:55:07.119 --> 00:55:09.239
couple of things that made me want
to ask. What's in your back?

773
00:55:09.400 --> 00:55:13.280
What clubs do you carry in your
back? And Mike? Right now I'm

774
00:55:13.320 --> 00:55:20.239
hitting nineteen fifty one Tommy Armor,
Silver Scott Irons for irons. The reason

775
00:55:20.440 --> 00:55:22.440
one, two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight

776
00:55:22.559 --> 00:55:25.480
nine. Yes, one carry a
hybrid? No, no, no,

777
00:55:25.559 --> 00:55:30.840
no no. I care fairway woods, fairway nettles, a driver. I

778
00:55:30.960 --> 00:55:36.960
carry a driver. I carry a
two wood and a forwood and these are

779
00:55:36.960 --> 00:55:43.199
Percimmon wood. So my driver is
a nineteen fifty six Folding Model twenty eight.

780
00:55:44.519 --> 00:55:50.719
My two wood is a McGregor Attorney
M eighty five, and my forward

781
00:55:50.880 --> 00:55:57.079
as a superiomatic. I know,
I'm sorry McGregor velocitized for seven forwards.

782
00:55:57.400 --> 00:56:00.880
How many wedges do you carry?
Just just a wedge in a sand pitching

783
00:56:00.880 --> 00:56:06.199
wedge in a sandwich? Wow?
Incredible. Okay, Now the other question

784
00:56:06.199 --> 00:56:09.920
about your equipment is you mentioned that
you slip because you weren't wearing spikes.

785
00:56:10.519 --> 00:56:15.880
You don't wear spike lest shoes,
do you, well, no, I

786
00:56:15.119 --> 00:56:19.840
have the removable spike. Yeah.
Just the plastic spikes are no good.

787
00:56:20.079 --> 00:56:22.960
I mean not for a proper golf
They don't give enough traction. I mean

788
00:56:23.079 --> 00:56:27.000
they get some, but not not
as much. I mean, if you're

789
00:56:27.039 --> 00:56:29.960
on something a little bit of a
sandy kind of teen area or something like

790
00:56:30.000 --> 00:56:34.519
that, my right foot can slip
out. With the steel spikes, for

791
00:56:34.760 --> 00:56:37.920
you know, long steel spikes that
really just grip into the ground. It

792
00:56:37.960 --> 00:56:44.079
allows you to swing more in a
rotational way. The golf swings have evolved

793
00:56:44.480 --> 00:56:49.679
a lot based upon the golf shoes. And as the golf shoes were steel

794
00:56:49.719 --> 00:56:52.480
spikes and people were really rooted in
the ground, you saw a lot more

795
00:56:52.559 --> 00:56:58.760
rotary kind of golf swings, moving
more more level as spikes became plastic and

796
00:56:58.880 --> 00:57:00.840
not as good traction, and the
golf swings have got more up and down,

797
00:57:01.079 --> 00:57:05.960
more upright because with the rotational swings, it's it's harder to grip into

798
00:57:05.960 --> 00:57:10.440
the ground. I think those shoes
are something that I think about it this

799
00:57:10.480 --> 00:57:15.639
way. It's very strange because steel
spikes are legal with the us GA.

800
00:57:16.119 --> 00:57:21.639
They're not illegal, they're legal,
okay, okay, but I can some

801
00:57:21.719 --> 00:57:23.679
courses are now asking you not to
wear them. Well, I mean for

802
00:57:23.719 --> 00:57:28.199
the last thirty years. I mean, you can't show up with steel spikes,

803
00:57:28.679 --> 00:57:31.800
right, So that's that's to me, the same as if I went

804
00:57:31.840 --> 00:57:36.960
to the bowling alley and I bring
my bowling shoes and they say you can't

805
00:57:36.960 --> 00:57:39.880
really wear bowling shoes here. You
got to go new socks, you know.

806
00:57:39.960 --> 00:57:43.239
But it's like, hey, but
these are bowling shoes. They're legal

807
00:57:43.280 --> 00:57:47.039
with the United States Bowling Association.
Yeah, but we don't really allow those

808
00:57:47.079 --> 00:57:52.159
here on our on our lanes because
yeah, you know, they just don't

809
00:57:52.199 --> 00:57:54.119
you know, they kind of they
put they scuff up the lanes and stuff.

810
00:57:55.480 --> 00:57:59.079
I mean, that's how that's how
ridiculous it is to me that I

811
00:57:59.119 --> 00:58:04.639
can't go out play around to golf
with with steel spikes and my golf shoes

812
00:58:05.239 --> 00:58:09.480
because because they're legal not did the
USG make them illegal? No, So

813
00:58:09.639 --> 00:58:13.920
why can't I use them because some
local world every course has a local rule

814
00:58:14.000 --> 00:58:20.239
that says you can't use them,
I mean their rugs. It doesn't it

815
00:58:20.280 --> 00:58:23.320
doesn't really make much sense. I
mean that you okay, the footing in

816
00:58:23.440 --> 00:58:29.079
any sport is important, you know, whether it's basketball, football, So

817
00:58:29.440 --> 00:58:34.360
you need traction, and especially now
because they allow the players to tap down

818
00:58:34.400 --> 00:58:37.440
the spike marks. So what's the
problem now, See that was the original

819
00:58:37.519 --> 00:58:40.400
argument against steel spikes. Oh they
make spike marks. Oh okay, we

820
00:58:40.440 --> 00:58:44.360
don't want that. But now you
can tap down the spike marks. But

821
00:58:44.440 --> 00:58:46.119
they're still so yeah. I don't
I don't think real highly. It's a

822
00:58:46.159 --> 00:58:50.800
lot of these organizations that are in
charge of stuff. All right, let

823
00:58:50.880 --> 00:58:54.119
me go back to this this line
of questioning as an instructor, what is

824
00:58:54.159 --> 00:59:00.400
your superpower? I think my ability
to take very call implicated concepts and just

825
00:59:00.440 --> 00:59:06.440
make them simple for people. I
don't. I don't believe much in these

826
00:59:06.480 --> 00:59:10.280
swing monitors and launch things and all
that stuff. And I think the ball

827
00:59:10.320 --> 00:59:15.800
tells you everything hit A golf ball
goes over here, goes over there.

828
00:59:15.119 --> 00:59:16.760
You know, I hit it?
Fat I hit it. Then I don't

829
00:59:16.760 --> 00:59:20.840
know what is the machine going to
say, oh, the club face was

830
00:59:20.880 --> 00:59:23.159
open? Was the ball told you
the club face was open? I mean,

831
00:59:23.199 --> 00:59:27.480
well, it just makes no sense
to me that I would need track

832
00:59:27.559 --> 00:59:30.559
man or any of these sort of
things to tell me what's happening in the

833
00:59:30.559 --> 00:59:31.800
golf ball. So I just get
rid of all that stuff. Let's just

834
00:59:31.840 --> 00:59:37.880
look at you know, what's happening
with your shot and what we need to

835
00:59:37.880 --> 00:59:39.480
do with your golf sing to fix
things. So I just try and keep

836
00:59:39.519 --> 00:59:44.679
things as simple as possible. And
I don't trying. I never want to

837
00:59:44.719 --> 00:59:47.400
talk over people or through people.
You know. I don't say, oh,

838
00:59:47.480 --> 00:59:53.119
you need to you know, contract
this thoratic muscle or you know what

839
00:59:53.119 --> 00:59:57.000
are people? People don't want to
be talking like they're in the doctor's office

840
00:59:57.079 --> 01:00:00.559
or whatever. You know it says
I talk, you know, knee hip,

841
01:00:00.639 --> 01:00:04.480
shoulders, had should you know,
arms risting. I just just common

842
01:00:04.920 --> 01:00:07.440
everyday language of people. I mean, I know a lot of that stuff,

843
01:00:07.480 --> 01:00:10.760
but the technical things, but people
don't want to hear that. Okay,

844
01:00:12.880 --> 01:00:17.000
um as a competitor, as somebody
who's won on the PGA Tour.

845
01:00:17.320 --> 01:00:22.559
As a competitor, what is your
superpower? My ability to win when when

846
01:00:22.599 --> 01:00:28.480
I'm playing good. I was always
very confident that I could win because I'm

847
01:00:28.480 --> 01:00:31.119
playing good. I was never really
much of a choker. I just thought,

848
01:00:31.119 --> 01:00:37.239
hey, I'm then I'm playing good. My problem was I didn't play

849
01:00:37.280 --> 01:00:44.440
good often enough m so I would
get more I would get more teeing off

850
01:00:44.519 --> 01:00:47.599
knowing that I wasn't playing well,
then I would if I if I was

851
01:00:47.639 --> 01:00:50.559
playing well, it's like, well, I'm hitting it good. I'm not

852
01:00:50.599 --> 01:00:53.079
worried about hitting this fairway or the
screen. I was. I was nervous

853
01:00:53.079 --> 01:00:59.519
when I wasn't playing well. Yeah, that's because you know what am I?

854
01:00:59.559 --> 01:01:01.039
How am I to? You know, pay my caddy in my hotel

855
01:01:01.119 --> 01:01:08.159
room and get to the next tournament? All right? Last one of these

856
01:01:08.199 --> 01:01:16.679
prepared questions. Um, when other
instructors are in a conversation and your name

857
01:01:16.719 --> 01:01:22.960
comes up between them, what is
it they're talking about? What is it

858
01:01:23.000 --> 01:01:27.119
they're talking about? Yeah, they're
talking about you. All of a sudden,

859
01:01:27.159 --> 01:01:29.199
you're not part of the conversation,
but it's like, oh yeah,

860
01:01:29.239 --> 01:01:35.000
John Ericson, Oh yeah, he's
what are they talking about? I don't

861
01:01:35.079 --> 01:01:37.119
know. I'm you know, I
just did. I was just on the

862
01:01:37.119 --> 01:01:42.920
PGA Tour podcast a couple of weeks
ago with Mark Engelman. You know what,

863
01:01:43.679 --> 01:01:47.480
Yeah, I don't have the exclusive
to John Ericson. I thought you

864
01:01:47.559 --> 01:01:52.360
did. I thought that I thought
I did too. I thought you negotiated

865
01:01:52.400 --> 01:02:00.639
this, didn't you? But I
was surprised and even knew who I was

866
01:02:00.760 --> 01:02:04.360
or whatever I mean, but he
said he listens to my podcast. Probably

867
01:02:06.280 --> 01:02:09.840
he said he'd been following Advanced ball
Striking, our website stuff going back to

868
01:02:09.920 --> 01:02:14.079
like, you know, two thousand
and ten or something like he was.

869
01:02:14.159 --> 01:02:17.480
He was, we were really inquisitive
about all these things a long, long

870
01:02:17.519 --> 01:02:21.599
time ago. So you just never
know really who's listening or what they're saying.

871
01:02:21.639 --> 01:02:25.239
I don't know. I don't know
if people people think I'm kind of

872
01:02:25.280 --> 01:02:28.880
crazy or not. I don't know. A lot of a lot of instructors

873
01:02:29.239 --> 01:02:32.239
are curious about, um, what
I'm doing. I see a lot of

874
01:02:32.239 --> 01:02:37.840
the ideas that I've had are out
on the PGA tour. Like you see

875
01:02:37.880 --> 01:02:40.960
these boards people are putting between their
feet and that sort of thing when they're

876
01:02:40.960 --> 01:02:45.199
out there on the range that that
I started that I'm the one to start

877
01:02:45.239 --> 01:02:47.239
that right on my deck out in
the back, this kind a piece of

878
01:02:47.239 --> 01:02:50.880
shelf board, and I was teaching, you know, the internal leg pressures

879
01:02:50.880 --> 01:02:53.000
and stuff. And you know,
now people are doing that out on the

880
01:02:53.000 --> 01:02:57.039
tour. So you know, Brad
Hughes, you know who I worked for

881
01:02:57.079 --> 01:03:00.119
three years, and he was bringing
that out to the tour with some the

882
01:03:00.119 --> 01:03:01.679
guys. Now they're they're on the
lp J to where they're using that thing

883
01:03:01.679 --> 01:03:07.920
too, so so I mean I
do see some of my teaching methodology is

884
01:03:07.000 --> 01:03:13.960
being influencing the modern game as well. So I guess that's good, you

885
01:03:14.000 --> 01:03:16.519
know. I mean obviously picking up
on some of these things, but it's

886
01:03:16.559 --> 01:03:21.599
just all common sense to me.
I don't I don't think I've really invented

887
01:03:21.639 --> 01:03:24.519
anything. I'm just basically like,
who invented Ben Hogan's golf swing? For

888
01:03:24.519 --> 01:03:30.840
instance, Ben Hogan did, right. If I'm trying to teach what he's

889
01:03:30.880 --> 01:03:32.920
doing, it's not that I invented
it. I'm just trying to interpret it

890
01:03:32.960 --> 01:03:37.480
in a way. And that's what
I've been actually working on. In the

891
01:03:37.519 --> 01:03:42.119
next few months, I'll be releasing
a course that'll teach like what I believe

892
01:03:42.280 --> 01:03:45.440
was Ben Hogan's methodology and how he
went about swinging the golf club. So

893
01:03:45.440 --> 01:03:51.559
it's quite fascinating, very very difficult
to quite a responsibility too to try and

894
01:03:51.800 --> 01:03:52.800
do that. But I just the
reason I did it is I just feel

895
01:03:52.840 --> 01:03:59.320
like the other instructors aren't doing it
interesting. I can't tell you how many

896
01:03:59.440 --> 01:04:03.039
times I've had instructors on the show
that said I've figured out Ben Hogan's secret

897
01:04:03.639 --> 01:04:10.639
and different interpretation. Oh yeah,
and I'm and as I've said, because

898
01:04:10.679 --> 01:04:15.480
I'm not a PGA professional, I'm
in no position to dispute what they're saying.

899
01:04:15.840 --> 01:04:18.880
So I let him go and if
the audience doesn't agree, then I

900
01:04:18.960 --> 01:04:23.760
advise you to stick around because next
week you can have a completely different interpretation.

901
01:04:24.280 --> 01:04:27.119
Well, there can't be a secret. There would have to be at

902
01:04:27.199 --> 01:04:30.880
least two secrets, because any if
you do one thing, it affects something

903
01:04:30.920 --> 01:04:33.679
else, right, So it can't
just be one thing. If you were

904
01:04:33.719 --> 01:04:36.119
to say, well, Ben Hogan's
secret is the way that he flattened the

905
01:04:36.159 --> 01:04:41.559
shaft a transition, It's like,
okay, he did that, but what

906
01:04:41.639 --> 01:04:44.880
does that do. Well, then
that opens a club face and shallows out

907
01:04:44.880 --> 01:04:47.559
the shaft, which means you're going
to have to then turn more level and

908
01:04:47.599 --> 01:04:50.840
accelerate going through the strike to get
the bike to then close the club face

909
01:04:50.960 --> 01:04:54.679
up so that you can be able
to hit the ball. So it has

910
01:04:54.719 --> 01:04:59.159
to be at least two things.
Yeah, Well, there's a there's a

911
01:04:59.239 --> 01:05:03.719
video that's going around on social media
these days from a number of years ago

912
01:05:03.760 --> 01:05:09.519
where Gary Player talks about when he
was a young man, Ben Hogan told

913
01:05:09.559 --> 01:05:14.239
him something that he says that he
never really understood until he turned seventy,

914
01:05:14.280 --> 01:05:20.000
and that was about keeping the left
bicep attached to your chest on your swing,

915
01:05:20.400 --> 01:05:25.840
not to have your left arm out
too far. And Tony Manzoni,

916
01:05:25.920 --> 01:05:30.400
who we had on for years,
he professed that as well. Oh,

917
01:05:30.440 --> 01:05:33.000
I would agree with that. I
teach that too. Yeah, keep especially,

918
01:05:33.000 --> 01:05:35.239
you know, working through this tricky
you got to keep all that stuff

919
01:05:35.239 --> 01:05:39.440
connected. But then it's got to
move all the way around and then and

920
01:05:39.480 --> 01:05:43.440
then move up to you're trying to
keep pressure on the shaft all the way

921
01:05:43.719 --> 01:05:45.440
it really you feel like you're trying
to pressure it all the way into your

922
01:05:45.440 --> 01:05:48.480
finish. So I think that's what
Gary Player would be talking about. But

923
01:05:48.639 --> 01:05:53.920
Gary Player had a great goal saying
very much like Ben Hogan, very similar,

924
01:05:55.119 --> 01:06:01.800
So I would say that he would
know Gary would Advanced ball Striking dot

925
01:06:01.800 --> 01:06:09.360
com and Advanced ball Striking is social
media to track you down, and uh

926
01:06:09.639 --> 01:06:15.800
yeah, so I'm John other ways, John Ericson on YouTube. That's We've

927
01:06:15.800 --> 01:06:19.199
got a pretty good channel, hundreds
of videos on there, interesting things and

928
01:06:19.280 --> 01:06:25.119
conversations, and then we have an
Instagram Advanced ball Striking on Instagram, there's

929
01:06:25.159 --> 01:06:30.239
things there. It all kind of
revolves around the Advanced Ball Striking website.

930
01:06:30.280 --> 01:06:33.559
There's a great forum on there with
you know, I don't know, hundreds

931
01:06:33.599 --> 01:06:39.559
of thousands of posts. It's just
a forever interesting, fascinating dive to go

932
01:06:39.679 --> 01:06:46.480
there. That would be forum dot
Advanced ball Striking dot com. And that's

933
01:06:46.480 --> 01:06:53.559
pretty much it's ask for the social
media. Yeah, well, Johnny,

934
01:06:53.599 --> 01:06:58.360
it's great to have you back on. I love our conversations because we don't

935
01:06:58.360 --> 01:07:01.760
know where they're gonna go or they're
going to end up right next to the

936
01:07:01.800 --> 01:07:06.000
flag. I like it all right, but we'll talk you again soon.

937
01:07:06.440 --> 01:07:14.199
Thank you, Fred for having me
on. So here's a crazy yet typical

938
01:07:14.280 --> 01:07:17.159
story that happened to me on the
course last week. On the fourth hole

939
01:07:17.199 --> 01:07:21.239
of one of our favorite courses,
Rooster Run with our regular group, Bill

940
01:07:21.320 --> 01:07:26.039
said to me, you know,
Fred, you've always hit the ball longer

941
01:07:26.079 --> 01:07:30.639
off the tee than any of us, but lately you've also been hitting the

942
01:07:30.679 --> 01:07:35.079
ball really straight. Well. After
saying thank you, I also reminded him

943
01:07:35.119 --> 01:07:40.760
that you never mentioned having lost a
ball before the end of the round,

944
01:07:40.880 --> 01:07:46.000
or that looking at your scorecard too
soon could mean trouble. And you never

945
01:07:46.159 --> 01:07:50.599
mentioned the no hitter before the end
of the game. Well, sure enough

946
01:07:51.000 --> 01:07:56.800
it got into my head because through
the next thirty two holes, yes that's

947
01:07:56.840 --> 01:08:00.840
the rest of that round, and
over the next one I hit a total

948
01:08:00.880 --> 01:08:06.920
of six fairways and shot eighty six
on both rounds. Now eighty six is

949
01:08:06.960 --> 01:08:12.239
nothing to complain about, I know, but when you're shooting below eighty five

950
01:08:12.320 --> 01:08:15.439
on a regular basis, there's a
couple of holes there that you know could

951
01:08:15.439 --> 01:08:20.720
be frustrating. But I was able
to focus on my tempo and an external

952
01:08:20.840 --> 01:08:27.199
target. And this past Sunday I
hit five of seven fairways on the front

953
01:08:27.279 --> 01:08:30.399
nine and four of seven on the
back and even the t shots that missed

954
01:08:30.399 --> 01:08:36.479
the fairway didn't really miss by much. So beware, don't let good compliments

955
01:08:38.520 --> 01:08:44.319
scare you away. Just say thank
you and move on. This week's Golf

956
01:08:44.359 --> 01:08:48.960
Smarter Ambassador blamed porter from court Aline, Idaho. Wow, that's two episodes

957
01:08:49.000 --> 01:08:55.159
in a row with ambassadors from Idaho. Thanks guys. Anyway, chose to

958
01:08:55.159 --> 01:09:00.119
receive Tony Manzoni's video of the Lost
Fundamental because he opened the show. Now,

959
01:09:00.199 --> 01:09:02.920
for more than a year and a
half, we've had golfers from all

960
01:09:02.960 --> 01:09:09.359
over the United States and around the
world, introduce each episode by sharing where

961
01:09:09.399 --> 01:09:13.640
they're from and where they play,
and each of them have received a gift

962
01:09:13.640 --> 01:09:17.119
for their effort, and you can
too, because there's two ways to choose

963
01:09:17.159 --> 01:09:21.439
one of three gifts that we have
to offer. First, you can write

964
01:09:21.479 --> 01:09:28.479
a review of our podcast from wherever
you subscribe, or introduce an upcoming episode,

965
01:09:28.840 --> 01:09:32.159
just like Blaine did. Blaine had
already received Tony Manzoni's video of the

966
01:09:32.239 --> 01:09:36.720
Lost Fundamental. But you can also
choose to receive a box of oden X

967
01:09:36.760 --> 01:09:41.960
one balls with a Golf Smarter logo. And your third choice is to receive

968
01:09:42.000 --> 01:09:46.000
a glove and glove storage compartment from
Red Rooster golf dot com. Let me

969
01:09:46.039 --> 01:09:49.880
say something about my Red Rooster subscription. You know, we don't get a

970
01:09:49.880 --> 01:09:55.399
lot of humidity here in California,
so I don't go through gloves that fast.

971
01:09:55.479 --> 01:09:59.840
But wow, I played around this
week and it was ninety six degrees

972
01:10:00.319 --> 01:10:03.359
and we did have humidity, and
I was walking and I went through a

973
01:10:03.399 --> 01:10:06.800
glove like I've never seen before.
I was sweating a lot. So I'm

974
01:10:06.880 --> 01:10:12.079
so glad that my next round I
got a fresh glove ready to go because

975
01:10:12.079 --> 01:10:15.920
of my subscription from Red Rooster golf
dot com. Now I'm going to leave

976
01:10:15.960 --> 01:10:18.920
a link in the show notes and
today's blog posts so you can learn more

977
01:10:19.000 --> 01:10:25.359
about these two fabulous partners. And
if you're interested and one something from us

978
01:10:25.359 --> 01:10:28.479
for free, send me an email
and I'll get back to you with some

979
01:10:28.520 --> 01:10:31.359
instructions of what to do and what
to say. Just write to golf Smarter

980
01:10:31.520 --> 01:10:36.159
podcast at gmail dot com, or
when you visit golfsmarter dot com, click

981
01:10:36.199 --> 01:10:43.239
on the Hey Fred button and please
follow at golf Smarter on YouTube, TikTok,

982
01:10:43.359 --> 01:10:48.199
Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, and
Twitter to see our new ongoing posts

983
01:10:48.199 --> 01:10:55.159
of videos and articles. We're now
putting up new content five times a week

984
01:10:56.000 --> 01:11:00.199
and I'm really excited about what kind
of response been getting, so thank you.

985
01:11:00.600 --> 01:11:04.560
If you have any questions, comments, or suggestions for upcoming episodes,

986
01:11:04.960 --> 01:11:10.479
please click on that Hey Fred button
when you visit golfsmarter dot com