WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.240 --> 00:00:04.360 This is a commercial, free archive edition of our live radio show that airs 2 00:00:04.440 --> 00:00:13.519 every Friday at noon, Arizona time on openminds dot TV. Welcome to Open 3 00:00:13.560 --> 00:00:18.719 Minds Radio with your host Alejandro Rojas, former Director of Public Education and official 4 00:00:18.760 --> 00:00:24.280 spokesperson for the Mutual UFO Network. Alejandro has been a UFO paranormal researcher in 5 00:00:24.359 --> 00:00:29.320 journalist for nearly a decade and has logged hours in the field investigating the paranormal 6 00:00:29.440 --> 00:00:33.880 up close and personal. And now Open Minds Radio presents evidence and the latest 7 00:00:33.880 --> 00:00:40.240 news regarding the UFO phenomenon. Here's your host, Alejandro Rojas. Hello and 8 00:00:40.399 --> 00:00:45.039 welcome to Open Minds Radio, where we are bringing the UFO subject into the 9 00:00:45.119 --> 00:00:50.280 light of day. This is Alejandro Rojas and we have another great show today. 10 00:00:50.399 --> 00:00:55.799 I'm very excited to say our guest today is probably the number one ufologists 11 00:00:56.079 --> 00:01:00.960 in the world, and that is nuclear physicist Stanton Friedman. Believe it or 12 00:01:00.960 --> 00:01:06.239 not, I've never interviewed him before. I've met him several times. I've 13 00:01:06.239 --> 00:01:11.400 spent time with him at several different conferences. So I'm excited to talk to 14 00:01:11.480 --> 00:01:15.920 him today because he has been in this field for decades. He was one 15 00:01:15.920 --> 00:01:21.920 of the original people to break the Roswell story, so it's sort of his 16 00:01:22.040 --> 00:01:25.879 fault that we all know about Roswell and what that is and what that means 17 00:01:25.959 --> 00:01:30.799 to us today, which is very exciting. He also has been on Larry 18 00:01:30.879 --> 00:01:34.200 King quite a few times in the last couple of years, arguing with the 19 00:01:34.719 --> 00:01:41.359 setting people, with other scientists, debating UFOs and extraterrestrials. So I'm excited 20 00:01:41.439 --> 00:01:45.079 to talk to him today. It's going to be a great show. A 21 00:01:45.120 --> 00:01:49.760 couple of things to talk about before we get to Stanton. First, our 22 00:01:49.799 --> 00:01:53.120 magazine, of course, is in the stores. It's in Barnes and Noble. 23 00:01:53.200 --> 00:01:56.120 It's in Borders. You can go there and you can buy it if 24 00:01:56.159 --> 00:01:59.799 it's not sold out, so you better get there quick. If you do 25 00:02:00.239 --> 00:02:01.840 there and you don't see it, feel free to go up and say, 26 00:02:01.840 --> 00:02:07.280 hey man, where's your Open Minds magazines at the information counter and tell them 27 00:02:07.319 --> 00:02:09.919 to order them if they don't have them, but they should have at least 28 00:02:09.960 --> 00:02:14.639 a couple that you can buy there. And of course you can go to 29 00:02:14.680 --> 00:02:20.680 our website Openminds dot tv to subscribe as well. You can subscribe for like 30 00:02:20.719 --> 00:02:23.159 a full year for only thirty bucks, and there's some awesome stories in there, 31 00:02:23.560 --> 00:02:28.199 really excited. We just wrapped up the second issue, which is also 32 00:02:28.280 --> 00:02:32.560 exciting, a lot of cool stories in there for the people in the Phoenix 33 00:02:32.639 --> 00:02:38.960 metro area. You can also come out and meet the editors the editorial board 34 00:02:38.680 --> 00:02:45.400 of Open Minds Magazine at Vision Quest Metaphysical Bookstore. We're going to be there 35 00:02:45.479 --> 00:02:49.960 April thirtieth, so at the end of the month at seven pm. That's 36 00:02:49.960 --> 00:02:53.439 at two two two five North Scottsdale Road. You can read more about that 37 00:02:54.080 --> 00:02:58.800 on the website. It's a cool bookstore. They've got all kinds of stuff 38 00:02:58.800 --> 00:03:02.639 and you can even They've got people there who will read your palm and do 39 00:03:02.759 --> 00:03:07.000 tarot readings and other psychic readings there all the time, so you can go 40 00:03:07.080 --> 00:03:10.680 there for some updates on your love life or whatever you need some advice on. 41 00:03:12.240 --> 00:03:16.439 But Open Minds will be there April thirtieth at seven pm. Also, 42 00:03:16.800 --> 00:03:22.199 speaking of Roswell, the place that Stanton made famous, I'm going to be 43 00:03:22.280 --> 00:03:25.240 speaking there this summer at their festival, so that's going to be a lot 44 00:03:25.280 --> 00:03:30.280 of fun. You can read more on our website again, but they every 45 00:03:30.360 --> 00:03:35.599 year, at least for the last few years for the anniversary of the crash 46 00:03:35.639 --> 00:03:39.800 of the UFO and Roswell. They've been doing parades and different events and different 47 00:03:39.840 --> 00:03:43.639 speakers, so that's going to be a lot of fun. There's going to 48 00:03:43.639 --> 00:03:46.680 be a lot of speakers and we're all going to be speaking on some aspect 49 00:03:46.800 --> 00:03:50.759 of Roswell. We'll focus on that issue. But it's a lot of fun. 50 00:03:50.800 --> 00:03:54.080 It's over the July fourth weekend, so they also have their fireworks going 51 00:03:54.120 --> 00:03:59.680 on at the park, so I'm real excited about that. That's always cool. 52 00:04:00.680 --> 00:04:04.360 And finally, my last bit of information before we get to the news, 53 00:04:04.639 --> 00:04:10.759 we're having a giveaway. The Fourth Kind Movie was kind enough to send 54 00:04:10.840 --> 00:04:15.000 us some stuff, some cool stuff, including the DVD, but we're doing 55 00:04:15.079 --> 00:04:19.600 a giveaway, so we've got a package of stuff and we'll actually also include 56 00:04:19.639 --> 00:04:25.120 a magazine in there for you. But if you go to our website Openlinds 57 00:04:25.160 --> 00:04:30.120 dot tv, you'll see you can sign up for our newsletter and we send 58 00:04:30.199 --> 00:04:32.639 out news every couple of weeks to keep you up to date on what we're 59 00:04:32.639 --> 00:04:36.519 doing, all this stuff that I'm talking about here and more some of our 60 00:04:36.519 --> 00:04:41.360 cool stories on our website, So you can sign up for our newsletter. 61 00:04:41.399 --> 00:04:45.120 It's very cool. Keeps you up to date, and if you do that, 62 00:04:45.519 --> 00:04:50.279 then you will be entered into a raffle to win this DVD, and 63 00:04:50.360 --> 00:04:55.800 then next week we will be giving that away. So go sign up this 64 00:04:55.920 --> 00:04:59.600 week if you're not already signed up. If you are already signed up, 65 00:05:00.000 --> 00:05:03.680 no worries because your name is already in the raffle. So lots of cool 66 00:05:03.759 --> 00:05:10.800 stuff. Speaking of keeping up to date, before we get to our guess, 67 00:05:10.920 --> 00:05:15.879 let's talk about UFOs and the news. These are headlines from conventional media 68 00:05:15.439 --> 00:05:18.759 around the world. We keep a close eye on that. We update the 69 00:05:18.759 --> 00:05:26.160 headlines on our website on a pretty much daily basis. But today we have 70 00:05:26.360 --> 00:05:30.399 with us our news correspondent, Jason McClelland, who's gonna give us the lowdown 71 00:05:30.439 --> 00:05:35.360 on UFO headlines. Hello Jason, Good afternoon, Alejandro, Hello Phoenix, 72 00:05:35.399 --> 00:05:40.279 and hello world. This is your Open Minds news brief for Friday, April 73 00:05:40.399 --> 00:05:45.519 nine, twenty ten. The Associated Press reported a story this week about an 74 00:05:45.600 --> 00:05:50.079 article published in the Jordanian newspaper that caused widespread panic in April fool's joke. 75 00:05:50.560 --> 00:05:56.439 The paper printed a front page story about a ten foot about many ten feet 76 00:05:56.480 --> 00:06:00.920 tall aliens who landed their UFOs in a desert town one hundred and eighty five 77 00:06:00.959 --> 00:06:05.519 miles outside the country's capital. Many residents took the article seriously, and officials 78 00:06:05.560 --> 00:06:11.639 were close to calling for an emergency evacuation. The town's major even sent security 79 00:06:11.639 --> 00:06:15.839 authorities to search for the aliens. The mayor is angry about the joke and 80 00:06:15.920 --> 00:06:18.800 wants to sue the newspaper. The managing editor of the paper says that the 81 00:06:18.839 --> 00:06:23.639 whole thing has been blown out of proportion and the intent was merely to entertain. 82 00:06:24.160 --> 00:06:27.560 How very orson. Well, yeah, I think the mayor is a 83 00:06:27.600 --> 00:06:30.079 bit of a spoilsport. I think he's upset because he fell for their joke. 84 00:06:30.680 --> 00:06:33.879 I mean, he was freaking out he was about to have the army 85 00:06:33.920 --> 00:06:38.040 unleashed on these aliens. That's more than likely it. I mean he probably 86 00:06:38.040 --> 00:06:41.759 feels like he looks pretty foolish. Yeah, I think it sounds like great 87 00:06:41.759 --> 00:06:44.480 fun, a great story, and that story is getting all over the news. 88 00:06:44.600 --> 00:06:47.720 Yeah, in UK news. You may be familiar with the mysterious and 89 00:06:47.720 --> 00:06:51.959 disturbing cattle mutilations that happen around the world, and we've even talked about those 90 00:06:51.959 --> 00:06:56.319 on the show with Chucks Ukowski. But sheep seemed to be the target of 91 00:06:56.360 --> 00:07:00.040 these horrific mutilations in the UK farmers near Shrewsbury. He claims, you have 92 00:07:00.240 --> 00:07:05.920 witness sheep being lasered by lights being emitted from UFOs. These sheep have been 93 00:07:05.959 --> 00:07:11.879 found with their brains, eyes, and internal organs removed. Several witnesses claim 94 00:07:11.920 --> 00:07:15.240 to have watched the UFOs at work, including fifteen members of an animal pathology 95 00:07:15.319 --> 00:07:21.519 field unit at a Welsh Hill farm near Radnor Forest. One of the witnesses 96 00:07:21.519 --> 00:07:27.759 describes the technology he observed as not from here and frightening. Yeah. I 97 00:07:27.759 --> 00:07:30.720 mean some of the scientists out there are saying that they believe it's extraterrestrials and 98 00:07:30.839 --> 00:07:35.920 UFOs that are doing this to their sheep because of eyewitness testimony. It's fascinating 99 00:07:35.920 --> 00:07:40.480 with the sheep situation here because I think more people have come forward and so 100 00:07:40.560 --> 00:07:43.240 they actually have watched it happen. Yeah, And I think because of the 101 00:07:43.240 --> 00:07:46.240 scientists backing this. This is another story, both of these stories that are 102 00:07:46.240 --> 00:07:50.800 getting a lot of international press for sure. In other news, a new 103 00:07:50.839 --> 00:07:56.800 survey shows that one in five people believe that aliens walk among us. The 104 00:07:57.000 --> 00:08:01.560 IPSOS Global Survey found the twenty percent of people poll believe that aliens exist and 105 00:08:01.639 --> 00:08:07.560 are disguised as humans. It's interesting to note that more people in the most 106 00:08:07.600 --> 00:08:13.600 populated countries share this belief, and that probably makes sense because in less populated 107 00:08:13.600 --> 00:08:16.959 areas, people are more likely to know their neighbors. You know, when 108 00:08:16.000 --> 00:08:18.639 I lived in New York, when you walk in the seas of people, 109 00:08:18.720 --> 00:08:22.439 it's a little easier to think, well, maybe some of these people are 110 00:08:22.480 --> 00:08:28.120 actually aliens, especially in New York. Absolutely. It's also interesting to note 111 00:08:28.120 --> 00:08:31.800 that the most people who believe that aliens walk among us are male, which 112 00:08:31.839 --> 00:08:37.080 I don't find surprising, but also they're younger than thirty five years old, 113 00:08:37.320 --> 00:08:41.960 which I find completely surprising. Yeah, that is very surprising. Interesting. 114 00:08:41.600 --> 00:08:45.720 Well, that's it for the news, Alejandro. Back to you. Cool. 115 00:08:45.919 --> 00:08:50.559 Thanks Jason. So we have our exciting guest, Stanton Friedman coming up. 116 00:08:50.600 --> 00:08:54.159 I'm really excited to talk to him because I haven't been able to interview 117 00:08:54.240 --> 00:08:58.120 him before on the show, and I figure, you know, he's all 118 00:08:58.159 --> 00:09:03.159 over the place. He does interviews and talks all over the country all of 119 00:09:03.240 --> 00:09:09.200 the time. But I wanted to introduce him to the Phoenix metro area and 120 00:09:09.519 --> 00:09:13.279 have you have your chance to talk to him yourselves. You'll be able to 121 00:09:13.399 --> 00:09:16.960 call in later and I'll give you more details about that to talk to Stanton 122 00:09:18.039 --> 00:09:22.200 and ask your own questions. But the godfather of youthology, Stanton Friedman, 123 00:09:22.279 --> 00:09:26.720 will be coming up after our break. You're listening to Open Minds Radio on 124 00:09:26.960 --> 00:09:45.279 kfn X. Welcome back. You're listening to Open Minds Radio, and I 125 00:09:45.320 --> 00:09:50.519 want to remind you that you can go to Openminds dot tv to read all 126 00:09:50.559 --> 00:09:54.320 of those news stories that Jason and I had just talked about. But without 127 00:09:54.360 --> 00:10:01.919 further ado, let's bring on Stanton Friedman. Hello, are you there, 128 00:10:01.960 --> 00:10:05.440 sir? I am here in beautiful Friderton, New Brunswick, Canada. All 129 00:10:05.559 --> 00:10:11.279 right, time zones ahead of you. You're already in the late afternoon out 130 00:10:11.279 --> 00:10:16.600 there. You're right, you're right. So in what's the weather like out 131 00:10:16.600 --> 00:10:22.240 there? You asked me that it's not warm, but it's not bad. 132 00:10:22.360 --> 00:10:26.039 It's sunny. It might get up to fifty today. You're going to have 133 00:10:26.080 --> 00:10:30.879 to move out here to sunny Arizona. We've got eighties. We're in the 134 00:10:30.919 --> 00:10:35.200 eighties. Well, I'll tell you something. We're just pleased not to have 135 00:10:35.279 --> 00:10:39.799 snow on the lawn. Normally at this year we would, but I don't 136 00:10:39.799 --> 00:10:43.480 know. This has been a crazy year. I'm not complaining. You understand, 137 00:10:43.480 --> 00:10:46.519 I can do without the snow, but last year we had thirteen feet 138 00:10:46.600 --> 00:10:52.600 and we didn't get anywhere near. Wow, that's a lot of snow. 139 00:10:52.039 --> 00:10:56.240 But yeah, moving on, let's get into UFOs. And one of the 140 00:10:56.279 --> 00:11:01.519 first questions I wanted to ask you is in your career and the pass is 141 00:11:01.559 --> 00:11:07.159 a nuclear physicist. At what point did you begin to take UFO seriously? 142 00:11:09.360 --> 00:11:13.799 Well, it was totally inadverton. I read a book. I had ordered 143 00:11:13.799 --> 00:11:18.039 a book, The Report on Unidentified Flying Objects by Air Force Captain Edward Ruffeld, 144 00:11:18.039 --> 00:11:22.639 who'd been headed Project Blue Book for the Air Force in the early fifties. 145 00:11:22.679 --> 00:11:26.639 This was nineteen fifty eight. I was working as a quite young nuclear 146 00:11:26.720 --> 00:11:33.120 physicist for a General Electric Aircraft Nuclear Propultion department, one of the many canceled 147 00:11:33.159 --> 00:11:39.480 government sponsored research and development parks I worked on. Anyway, I got the 148 00:11:39.519 --> 00:11:43.919 book mainly because it was marked down from two ninety five to a dollar, 149 00:11:43.000 --> 00:11:48.039 which would have been what it cost to ship the whole order anyway, So 150 00:11:48.519 --> 00:11:50.840 whatn't cost to me? I think Air Force was co sponsor of our program. 151 00:11:52.519 --> 00:11:56.279 And incidentally, that wasn't just a little paper study. We employed thirty 152 00:11:56.279 --> 00:12:03.519 five hundred people in nineteen fifty eleven hundred of them more engineers and scientists, 153 00:12:03.120 --> 00:12:09.840 and we spent one hundred million dollars that year. So I mentioned that only 154 00:12:09.879 --> 00:12:15.039 because I have seen some crazy stuff about me, saying he only worked on 155 00:12:15.120 --> 00:12:20.919 paper studies. Well, I spent millions on the expensive materials on radiation shoeing 156 00:12:20.960 --> 00:12:26.000 experiments I was doing. It wasn't a paper study anyway. I read the 157 00:12:26.039 --> 00:12:30.399 book. It intrigued me, shared it with a neighbor ten years older than 158 00:12:30.440 --> 00:12:33.360 I was an engineer. He was more impressed than I was. Moved out 159 00:12:33.399 --> 00:12:41.000 to California and read fifteen more books at a good librarian who kept me supplied. 160 00:12:41.559 --> 00:12:46.799 And then the turning point, the point at which I really had to 161 00:12:46.840 --> 00:12:52.240 take the subject terribly seriously, was finding a copy a Project Blue Book, 162 00:12:52.279 --> 00:12:58.960 Special Report number fourteen at the University of California, Berkeley Library. And there 163 00:12:58.960 --> 00:13:01.080 were a couple of surprising things. One, it was used two hundred and 164 00:13:01.120 --> 00:13:05.320 forty charts, stables, graphs, and maps. I was in data heaven. 165 00:13:05.080 --> 00:13:09.639 Secondly, it hadn't been mentioned in any of those sixteen books that I 166 00:13:09.679 --> 00:13:16.159 had read. And Third, and this was the shocker, that Leon David's 167 00:13:16.200 --> 00:13:18.120 doctor, Leon Davidson, who had put this thing together, he had gotten 168 00:13:18.159 --> 00:13:20.639 I don't know how he got a copy of it. This before freedom of 169 00:13:20.679 --> 00:13:24.840 information. It wasn't classified, but it wasn't for wide distribution either. He 170 00:13:24.919 --> 00:13:28.840 got a copy of included a copy of the press release that was put out 171 00:13:28.840 --> 00:13:35.960 in nineteen fifty five October supposedly about this study. Although it didn't mention the 172 00:13:35.480 --> 00:13:37.960 story the study by title, surely some reporter would have said, hey, 173 00:13:39.039 --> 00:13:41.720 what do you mean fourteen? What happened one through thirteen? They were all 174 00:13:41.759 --> 00:13:48.799 classified, which they would not have wanted to say. Secondly, it didn't 175 00:13:48.840 --> 00:13:52.480 include the name of the people who did the study, which was not only 176 00:13:52.519 --> 00:13:56.360 their names, but even the company, which was Betel Memorial Institute in Columbus, 177 00:13:56.360 --> 00:14:03.519 Ohio, a very well respected research and developed infirm. And Third, 178 00:14:03.799 --> 00:14:07.200 he lied, He flat out lied in the press release, and that shook 179 00:14:07.240 --> 00:14:11.279 me up. Let me be specific now, I don't want people saying, 180 00:14:11.279 --> 00:14:13.440 oh, he just says everybody lies. Well, here's the Secretary of the 181 00:14:13.480 --> 00:14:18.480 Air Force, Donald quarrels saying, quote, on the basis of this report. 182 00:14:18.879 --> 00:14:26.519 We believe that no such objects as those publicly described as flying saucers have 183 00:14:26.679 --> 00:14:33.639 overflown the United States. Even the unknown three percent could have been identified as 184 00:14:33.720 --> 00:14:41.360 conventional phenomena or illusions if more complete observational data had been available. Well, 185 00:14:41.360 --> 00:14:45.080 that sounds pretty straightforward, and of course we've heard the same thing many times 186 00:14:45.120 --> 00:14:50.240 since. The only trouble is it's a flat out lie. The unknowns weren't 187 00:14:50.279 --> 00:14:54.840 three percent or three and a half or four or fifteen, they were twenty 188 00:14:54.879 --> 00:15:00.159 one and a half. Wow, that's a big stretch. Secondly, there 189 00:15:00.200 --> 00:15:05.519 was a separate category insufficient information. If there wasn't enough data about it available 190 00:15:05.519 --> 00:15:09.159 about a signing, it could not be listed as an unknown. Third it 191 00:15:09.240 --> 00:15:15.000 took agreement on the part of all four of the final report evaluators. There 192 00:15:15.000 --> 00:15:18.279 were thirty two hundred and one sightings in this study, so it's big. 193 00:15:18.000 --> 00:15:22.200 You know. It wasn't three guys sitting around for four days and sorting all 194 00:15:22.240 --> 00:15:26.799 this stuff. They had a rule you couldn't label the sighting is unknown, 195 00:15:26.879 --> 00:15:31.320 and that's the only ones we're interested in. Unless all four of the final 196 00:15:31.399 --> 00:15:37.120 report evaluators agreed it was an unknown, any two could label it anything else, 197 00:15:37.200 --> 00:15:39.279 you know, aircraft, balloon, economical, all this kind of stuff. 198 00:15:39.960 --> 00:15:45.679 And in addition, they did a quality evaluation of all the sightings and 199 00:15:45.799 --> 00:15:48.840 found the better the quality, you know, the quality of the observer, 200 00:15:50.039 --> 00:15:52.039 the duration of observation out close you were, all that sort of thing, 201 00:15:52.559 --> 00:16:00.080 the more likely to be unexplainable. Now it really shook me up. But 202 00:16:00.120 --> 00:16:03.279 I mean I was working under security. I did for a total of fourteen 203 00:16:03.360 --> 00:16:07.120 years, and I'm accustomed to sort of sometimes you tiptoe around the truth a 204 00:16:07.159 --> 00:16:11.279 little bit, but flat out line right well, and that would mean six 205 00:16:11.360 --> 00:16:15.960 hundred unknowns that all four of these guys are possibly more that they agreed on. 206 00:16:17.679 --> 00:16:22.960 You got it, And so you know, I was shook up, 207 00:16:22.960 --> 00:16:26.200 and I determined from that point we're gonna find out more, We're gonna do 208 00:16:26.279 --> 00:16:30.480 more. I joined APRO and NCAP, which don't exist anymore. Of course, 209 00:16:30.480 --> 00:16:36.360 I'm active in New Fon. Given more papers at mw FON annual symposia. 210 00:16:36.399 --> 00:16:41.480 There have been forty so far than anybody else, and you write there 211 00:16:41.519 --> 00:16:45.120 for every one of their journals at least. Now. Yeah, I've been 212 00:16:45.120 --> 00:16:48.039 doing a monthly column and it's kind of fun, and they give me pretty 213 00:16:48.080 --> 00:16:52.399 much a free reign, so I can talk about the nasty, noisy negativists, 214 00:16:53.039 --> 00:16:59.320 naysaying newsmen, and the SETI cultists. You know, my interpretation for 215 00:16:59.480 --> 00:17:07.039 cetis is silly effort to investigate because somebody has to point out the illogicality, 216 00:17:07.279 --> 00:17:14.200 unreality, unscientific approach that these guys are taking, and that it upsets some 217 00:17:14.359 --> 00:17:17.640 people. I don't care, you know, I'm on my own, on 218 00:17:17.759 --> 00:17:21.400 my own boss, which is kind of nice. Well, and I said, 219 00:17:21.440 --> 00:17:26.279 he people don't mind upsetting people themselves when they have clubs like a pseudo 220 00:17:26.400 --> 00:17:30.319 science club that I think, sess Josh Stack, is it part of well? 221 00:17:30.680 --> 00:17:34.799 You know, Seth and I debated on Coast to Coast radio. We 222 00:17:36.000 --> 00:17:40.200 had met on the Queen Elizabeth II on its last westward voyage. We each 223 00:17:40.240 --> 00:17:45.400 gave three lectures and attended the other stuff. And when I asked in my 224 00:17:45.519 --> 00:17:51.119 lecture, after talking about five large scale scientific studies, including the book Special 225 00:17:51.160 --> 00:17:53.720 Report fourteen, I asked how many people here read this? And of course 226 00:17:53.720 --> 00:17:56.200 he didn't raise his hand for any of them. Right now. He did 227 00:17:56.240 --> 00:18:02.279 say once this past year that my book Flying Saucers and Science was on his 228 00:18:02.400 --> 00:18:06.599 nightstand. Now, he didn't say he'd read it. You understand, right. 229 00:18:06.640 --> 00:18:10.119 But we did a debate on Coast to coast. I got fifty seven 230 00:18:10.200 --> 00:18:14.720 percent of the vote. He got thirty three percent and ten percent that I 231 00:18:14.720 --> 00:18:18.440 don't know. But there's a whole chapter in the book about the cult of 232 00:18:18.680 --> 00:18:23.000 SETI, and it's somebody has to tell it like it is now. One 233 00:18:23.039 --> 00:18:26.839 of the things I bring to the table, well, there are a couple 234 00:18:27.359 --> 00:18:30.880 that make me sort of an odd ball. I guess some people would agree 235 00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:34.640 with that. One is that I worked on a lot of classified programs. 236 00:18:36.279 --> 00:18:41.440 I've been to twenty archives. I can talk knowledgeably about the cosmic Watergate, 237 00:18:41.519 --> 00:18:45.480 the government cover up. I know how security works. I've written classified documents. 238 00:18:47.279 --> 00:18:51.640 Second, I worked on really far out propulsion systems, not only nuclear 239 00:18:51.680 --> 00:18:55.200 airplanes, and as I said, it was a large program, but I 240 00:18:55.240 --> 00:18:59.759 also worked on fish and nuclear rockets. We successfully tested some on the ground, 241 00:19:00.000 --> 00:19:04.440 but the nuclear test site, which is not too far from Area fifty 242 00:19:04.559 --> 00:19:15.759 one. I also worked on a particular significance nuclear fusion propulsion systems. And 243 00:19:15.319 --> 00:19:19.359 I mentioned that because a lot of places don't have a lot of uranium, 244 00:19:19.480 --> 00:19:26.519 but fusion is the most important source of energy production in the entire planet, 245 00:19:26.680 --> 00:19:32.119 in the entire universe. All the stars out there create their energy as a 246 00:19:32.319 --> 00:19:37.160 result of nuclear fusion. And so every advanced civilization they're going to know about 247 00:19:37.200 --> 00:19:40.480 fusion. Everybody's going to say, how does the star work? And you 248 00:19:40.519 --> 00:19:45.640 know, we haven't known very long. Nineteen thirty eight we finally figured out 249 00:19:45.680 --> 00:19:51.279 it's not a massive running gas up there. It's a fusion facility, if 250 00:19:51.319 --> 00:19:55.480 you will. And being the kind of Earthlings we are, we immediately went 251 00:19:55.519 --> 00:20:00.079 to work, and in nineteen fifty two we built rather die fusion device. 252 00:20:00.240 --> 00:20:04.720 They call it an H bomb. Even we humans figured it out. Yeah, 253 00:20:04.799 --> 00:20:08.599 and just a short time nine thirty eight to nineteen fifty two. Now 254 00:20:08.640 --> 00:20:15.400 this wasn't a little small H bomb. This released the energy equivalent to exploding 255 00:20:15.400 --> 00:20:22.400 ten million tons of TNT. That's a fireball. Yeah, that's a big 256 00:20:22.440 --> 00:20:26.839 thing, very big thing. The fireball was three miles wide. And so 257 00:20:27.519 --> 00:20:33.359 if we were able to do this, then presumably somebody who might have gotten 258 00:20:33.480 --> 00:20:37.119 started a little bit before we did, say a million, a billion, 259 00:20:37.200 --> 00:20:41.079 and ten thousand, doesn't matter, pick any number would have learned the same 260 00:20:41.200 --> 00:20:45.599 things. Right now, it's not just the question of being able to build 261 00:20:45.640 --> 00:20:49.799 bombs and the Russians exploded one that was We've got to hit a seventh and 262 00:20:49.839 --> 00:20:55.359 we're going to talk more about Flying Saucers and Science the name of your books. 263 00:20:55.759 --> 00:21:00.039 So we'll be back very shortly with Stanton Friedman talking UFO. So, 264 00:21:00.079 --> 00:21:15.759 as you're listening to Open Minds Radio on camp next, welcome back to Open 265 00:21:15.799 --> 00:21:19.400 Minds Radio. This is your host, Alejandro Rojas, and I want to 266 00:21:19.440 --> 00:21:26.119 remind you that you can watch the radio show live streaming on our website openminds 267 00:21:26.160 --> 00:21:30.200 dot tv, and we even have a live chat there where you can ask 268 00:21:30.240 --> 00:21:33.640 the questions. And we do have a question for Stanton in the chat, 269 00:21:33.640 --> 00:21:37.839 and I'll ask you in a minute. But Stanton has been referring to his 270 00:21:37.920 --> 00:21:42.799 book Flying Saucers and Science, and sat you were referring to earlier kind of 271 00:21:42.880 --> 00:21:49.680 SETI and some of their silly ideas are around physics and science. Their conclusion 272 00:21:49.799 --> 00:21:53.640 is extra trestrials can't be here because the distances are too far. Well, 273 00:21:53.799 --> 00:21:56.279 not only that there are too few of them. Yeah, you can't get 274 00:21:56.279 --> 00:22:00.599 here from there is one of them. And it's a crazy thing is they 275 00:22:00.079 --> 00:22:04.480 calculate, They think very generously and come up with there might be ten thousand 276 00:22:04.559 --> 00:22:11.960 civilizations in the galaxy. There's over one hundred million, hundred billion sorry stars 277 00:22:12.000 --> 00:22:15.440 in the galaxy. That means only one in ten million, and we're one 278 00:22:15.480 --> 00:22:19.559 of them. We're the top people. And if you figure that out, 279 00:22:19.599 --> 00:22:25.279 if you assume a relatively uniform distribution, you sprinkle a few throughout the huge 280 00:22:25.319 --> 00:22:29.880 galaxy, which is one hundred thousand light years across. That means you ought 281 00:22:29.880 --> 00:22:34.240 to be maybe two within a thousand light years. Not very exciting. Why 282 00:22:34.240 --> 00:22:37.519 would any of them send us a message? How would they know we were 283 00:22:37.599 --> 00:22:42.279 here? We've only been sending out radio waves, et cetera. Columbus didn't 284 00:22:42.319 --> 00:22:48.359 send a message to North America or Central America before he took off, you 285 00:22:48.400 --> 00:22:52.119 know. Furthermore, one of the key factors in the so called Drake equation 286 00:22:53.200 --> 00:22:57.240 is the life span of a civilization. The trouble is, we don't know 287 00:22:57.279 --> 00:23:03.279 the lifespan of any civilis not even our own. We are how long it's 288 00:23:03.279 --> 00:23:06.079 going to be around there and a lot of idiots around We only killed fifty 289 00:23:06.119 --> 00:23:10.279 million of our own kind in World War Two. That it's not a good 290 00:23:10.279 --> 00:23:15.759 start anyway. The kicker is they assume that there's no colonization and no migration. 291 00:23:17.799 --> 00:23:22.839 So a planet that has intelligent life able to send signals looms like a 292 00:23:22.960 --> 00:23:26.279 rose and then dies and that's the end of it. Rather than knowing, 293 00:23:26.359 --> 00:23:33.279 as every advanced civilization would, that there are reasons for checking out other places, 294 00:23:33.400 --> 00:23:37.359 just in case maybe an asteroid comes, we use up too much of 295 00:23:37.400 --> 00:23:42.839 the resources, maybe a supernova goes off. You know, every civilization is 296 00:23:42.880 --> 00:23:48.400 going to be looking around furthermore. We are, you know, we're sort 297 00:23:48.400 --> 00:23:51.599 of out in the boondocks of four point three light years of the next star 298 00:23:51.720 --> 00:23:56.240 over. But my favorite two stars Ata one and Zeta two Ticuli in the 299 00:23:56.319 --> 00:24:00.519 constellation of Ridiculum, which you can't see from here, and you guys can't 300 00:24:00.519 --> 00:24:03.319 see it. You got to go for the south anyway. Those two stars 301 00:24:03.319 --> 00:24:07.480 are only thirty nine point three light years away from us, and from each 302 00:24:07.480 --> 00:24:14.240 other only about an eighth of a light year, so you can directly observe 303 00:24:14.359 --> 00:24:18.519 planets around the other star no difficulty. You can directly determine whether there is 304 00:24:18.559 --> 00:24:23.559 some kind of biological life there, and you have plenty of time because those 305 00:24:23.599 --> 00:24:32.440 two stars are a billion years older than the Sun to develop appropriate interstellar travel 306 00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:37.240 technology and presumably if you've got a little more time than we've had, you'll 307 00:24:37.240 --> 00:24:40.400 do a little better than we have. When I worked on fusion proportion, 308 00:24:41.559 --> 00:24:44.359 it was clear that if you use the right stuff in the right way and 309 00:24:44.400 --> 00:24:48.759 want to spend a ton of money, you can kick articles particles out the 310 00:24:48.799 --> 00:24:53.000 back end of a fusion rocket that only have ten million times as much energy 311 00:24:53.119 --> 00:25:00.440 per particle as you can get in a dumb old chemical rocket. So it's 312 00:25:00.440 --> 00:25:04.119 because you're an entirely different perspective. And also the other important assumption is, 313 00:25:04.359 --> 00:25:11.000 ain't nobody coming here, guys? When there's far more data indicating aliens or 314 00:25:11.079 --> 00:25:15.839 visiting than that, somebody out there has nothing better to do than send messages 315 00:25:15.359 --> 00:25:21.799 using techniques about which we know nothing and without knowing what our capabilities would be 316 00:25:21.839 --> 00:25:25.720 to receive and interpret it. So there are a lot of wild guesses that 317 00:25:25.759 --> 00:25:30.799 these guys are taking with these unknown factors and totally ignoring. They'll tell you 318 00:25:30.839 --> 00:25:34.880 there is no UFO evidence, never referring to the large scale scientific studies. 319 00:25:36.240 --> 00:25:38.440 I mean, let's face it, if you want to get really right down 320 00:25:38.480 --> 00:25:45.519 to earth, if aliens are visiting, who needs to listen with radio telescopes? 321 00:25:45.720 --> 00:25:48.240 Right? You know? Learn sign language. Well, and that brings 322 00:25:48.279 --> 00:25:52.720 me to one of the other big questions. I wanted to ask you what 323 00:25:52.960 --> 00:25:59.799 brought you to subscribe to the extraterrestrial hypothesis. Well, because it's the only 324 00:25:59.839 --> 00:26:02.839 one that made sense, and I don't even consider it a hypothesis. I 325 00:26:02.839 --> 00:26:07.279 say, Remember, the question I'm asking is not what are UFOs or are 326 00:26:07.440 --> 00:26:14.039 all UFOs alien spacecraft? The question is are any Look we see high performance 327 00:26:14.119 --> 00:26:17.359 craft that had to be manufactured. I mean, we're not talking lights in 328 00:26:17.400 --> 00:26:21.400 the sky here. If we would have been able to manufacture these, say 329 00:26:21.480 --> 00:26:23.880 back in the forties, fifties, sixty seventies, eighties, nineties, we'd 330 00:26:23.880 --> 00:26:30.559 have been using them in warfare, high maneuverability, great speed, silent flight. 331 00:26:32.119 --> 00:26:36.039 Hey, everybody on the planet would love to have a few of those. 332 00:26:36.359 --> 00:26:41.039 They're good offensively and defensively. If it wasn't made here, and we 333 00:26:41.119 --> 00:26:45.319 certainly haven't used these in warfare. Remember we developed a stealth fighter. We 334 00:26:45.440 --> 00:26:48.680 used it, So if it wasn't made here, it was made someplace else. 335 00:26:48.720 --> 00:26:52.519 That's pretty straightforward. And then looking at the nuclear capabilities. I worked 336 00:26:52.519 --> 00:26:57.480 on fusion proportion nineteen sixty two, that's a long time ago. Then you 337 00:26:57.559 --> 00:27:03.880 realize, Hey, everybody's going to know about fusion. You know, maybe 338 00:27:03.880 --> 00:27:07.480 not everybody on this planet understands that that's what's going on in the sun. 339 00:27:08.000 --> 00:27:14.920 We're a very primitive society whose major activity is tribal warfare. We're just beginning, 340 00:27:15.640 --> 00:27:19.319 and some people would likely say, well, why the heck would anybody 341 00:27:19.319 --> 00:27:22.680 want to come here to keep us from going out there? Of course, 342 00:27:23.440 --> 00:27:26.720 but there's the whole chapter in the book about, you know, the why 343 00:27:26.880 --> 00:27:30.000 questions They land on the White House Law and why would they come here? 344 00:27:30.039 --> 00:27:34.960 Why doesn't the government tell us what it knows? And the point is not 345 00:27:36.119 --> 00:27:41.079 presuming they're alike, that they're like us, you know, but certain things. 346 00:27:41.319 --> 00:27:45.799 I make one major assumption about every advanced civilization, it seems to me 347 00:27:45.920 --> 00:27:51.680 reasonable, and that is that they're concerned about their own survival and security. 348 00:27:52.359 --> 00:27:56.599 Everybody we know that that's a major concern. We're spending hundreds of billions of 349 00:27:56.640 --> 00:28:00.759 dollars a year making sure nobody pulls a surprise attack us. They don't want 350 00:28:00.799 --> 00:28:07.279 these crazy monkeys flying over to Zetteraticulan and wreaking some havoc. Well, that's 351 00:28:07.359 --> 00:28:11.720 right, and so my presumption is that they'd want to keep tabs on the 352 00:28:11.759 --> 00:28:15.720 primitives in the neighborhood, but only close tabs and those primitives who show signs 353 00:28:15.720 --> 00:28:18.839 of being able to bother them. At the end of World War Two, 354 00:28:18.960 --> 00:28:25.200 there were three signs that soon these Earthlings would be bothering able to bother them 355 00:28:25.720 --> 00:28:30.920 Nuclear weapons, powerful V two rockets which were used for warfare, not for 356 00:28:30.000 --> 00:28:37.039 delivering mail. And powerful radar as a forerunner of sophisticated electronics. And you 357 00:28:37.039 --> 00:28:41.000 know what, in July nineteen forty seven, there was only one place on 358 00:28:41.079 --> 00:28:48.480 the entire planet where you could study all three of those technologies, Southeastern New 359 00:28:48.519 --> 00:28:53.119 Mexico. And first Adam Baum was tested at Trinity Site on the grounds of 360 00:28:53.119 --> 00:28:57.400 the White Sands Missile Range. That's where the capture German V twos were being 361 00:28:57.480 --> 00:29:00.319 tested. That's where we had our best great how to track the rockets, 362 00:29:00.359 --> 00:29:03.839 because you know what, sometimes they went the wrong way. Right. In 363 00:29:03.880 --> 00:29:07.799 a couple of weeks, we're going to have Robert Hastings on and to your 364 00:29:07.880 --> 00:29:11.599 point, you know, he talks a lot about UFOs checking out nuclear sites. 365 00:29:12.079 --> 00:29:15.640 Sure, and Bob has done a lot of work on that and collected 366 00:29:15.680 --> 00:29:21.920 a lot of information. And the kicker here is he's been able to talk 367 00:29:21.960 --> 00:29:26.119 to a lot of former military guys and who else knows about what's going on 368 00:29:26.279 --> 00:29:30.720 at the nuclear tip missile sites, you know, besides the military guys. 369 00:29:32.400 --> 00:29:37.119 So he's collected an awful lot of information. And what is interesting to me 370 00:29:37.319 --> 00:29:41.079 is that he's also found out that there is similar concern on the part of 371 00:29:41.079 --> 00:29:45.880 the Aliens with what's going on in the Soviet Union. Oh. Interesting, 372 00:29:45.960 --> 00:29:48.640 I didn't know about that part. But yeah, he's had some input from 373 00:29:48.720 --> 00:29:52.240 some people who say that just you know, Melstrom Air Force Base, we 374 00:29:52.279 --> 00:29:56.359 had the ten minute men missile go down, and of course we had Bill 375 00:29:56.440 --> 00:30:00.559 Ny the science guy. Oh it was just a power failure. Yeah, 376 00:30:00.960 --> 00:30:06.319 yeah, right, okayly redundant. He should stick to the kids shows. 377 00:30:06.359 --> 00:30:08.279 But we're going to take another break. This is our short segment, and 378 00:30:08.319 --> 00:30:15.440 we'll be back to talk more about UFOs with Stanton Friedman right after our short 379 00:30:15.480 --> 00:30:18.599 break, and we'll talk more about the science and then we do have a 380 00:30:18.680 --> 00:30:22.039 question from the chat that I'll ask you as well when we get back. 381 00:30:22.640 --> 00:30:41.240 You're listening to Open Minds Radio. Stay tuned, Welcome back. You are 382 00:30:41.359 --> 00:30:48.359 listening to Open Minds Radio on KF and X and we are talking UFOs with 383 00:30:48.519 --> 00:30:52.799 the guy to talk to the most popular upologists out there. He gets all 384 00:30:52.839 --> 00:30:56.599 over the place. We're talking to Stanton Friedman, and one thing I want 385 00:30:56.640 --> 00:31:00.839 to talk to you now, Stanton's kind of some current affair type of stuff. 386 00:31:00.400 --> 00:31:03.599 Although you have answered this question, there was a question from the chat 387 00:31:03.599 --> 00:31:07.920 and maybe you can answer Mark direct, but I guess they are talking about 388 00:31:08.519 --> 00:31:12.079 They're talking about not only alien agenda they're asking you about, but also the 389 00:31:12.119 --> 00:31:17.200 government's agenda when it comes to this topic. Well, yeah, I mean 390 00:31:17.240 --> 00:31:21.720 that's that's one of the why, the key why questions? What do the 391 00:31:21.759 --> 00:31:25.720 aliens want? Why doesn't the government tell us what's going on? Why would 392 00:31:25.720 --> 00:31:32.079 anybody come here anyway? You know, I think the government has every government. 393 00:31:32.359 --> 00:31:36.720 Remember, this isn't an American problem, It's an earthlink problem all over 394 00:31:36.759 --> 00:31:41.519 the planet. Ted Phillips has collected physical trace cases from eighty countries. You 395 00:31:41.559 --> 00:31:47.359 know, I've lectured in sixteen other countries besides fifty states and nine provinces. 396 00:31:47.359 --> 00:31:51.240 So there's a lot of interest out there all over the place. Every government 397 00:31:51.440 --> 00:31:53.640 wants to cover up number one reason. You want to figure out how the 398 00:31:53.720 --> 00:31:57.359 darn things work. They make wonderful weapons delivery and defense systems. That's where 399 00:31:57.359 --> 00:32:02.200 our money gets spent. You got wreckage from Roswow. Remember I'm the original 400 00:32:02.240 --> 00:32:07.960 civilian investigator the Roswell incident. The books are on my website TRIPLEW dot Stanton 401 00:32:08.039 --> 00:32:13.519 Friedman dot com. You got wreckage, you set up your secret project. 402 00:32:13.720 --> 00:32:17.960 Rule number one for security, you can't tell your friends without toning your enemies 403 00:32:19.319 --> 00:32:22.200 because they listen to the radio. Two second problems the other side of the 404 00:32:22.240 --> 00:32:25.480 same coin. What if the other guy figures out how they work before you 405 00:32:25.480 --> 00:32:30.440 tube, you don't know how to defend against them as they try to defend 406 00:32:30.480 --> 00:32:32.200 against you. You know, we've been playing this game a long time. 407 00:32:34.599 --> 00:32:38.000 The third problem is if you make an announcement. Let's say, my favorite 408 00:32:38.039 --> 00:32:43.640 couple of the Pope and the queen, how's that uncoupled? They're about the 409 00:32:43.680 --> 00:32:47.319 same age and the people, Yeah, well lone. Anyway, if they 410 00:32:47.319 --> 00:32:51.559 were to make an announcement saying, indeed, planet Earth is being visited by 411 00:32:51.599 --> 00:32:58.160 intelligently controlled extraterrestrial spacecraft, what would happen? Well, church attendance would go 412 00:32:58.240 --> 00:33:00.559 up, mental hospital admissions would go up, the stock market would go down. 413 00:33:00.599 --> 00:33:04.759 I suppose, and one of the big things that would happen this is 414 00:33:04.799 --> 00:33:08.480 based on over six hundred college lectures, is that the younger generation, which 415 00:33:08.599 --> 00:33:15.200 unlike me, wasn't around when there wasn't a space program, would push for 416 00:33:15.240 --> 00:33:20.119 a new view of ourselves instead of as Americans or Chinese, or Greeks or 417 00:33:20.119 --> 00:33:22.880 Peruvians as earthly. Let's face it, from an alien view, but we 418 00:33:22.920 --> 00:33:27.559 are all earth things, like it or not. It's like that very much. 419 00:33:28.000 --> 00:33:31.400 So to know these points, do you think disclosure will happen anytime soon? 420 00:33:32.200 --> 00:33:37.640 Not voluntarily and not soon, although a strange thing to be encouraged by. 421 00:33:37.880 --> 00:33:44.440 Last year the Pope, when he was asked and his big astronomer also 422 00:33:45.079 --> 00:33:47.480 had said, well, you know that God made us, he could have 423 00:33:47.559 --> 00:33:52.240 made them too, no big deal. And my first thought was, gee, 424 00:33:52.319 --> 00:33:54.759 what does he know that we don't remember? She getting ready to convince 425 00:33:54.799 --> 00:34:00.920 one point one billion Catholics. That's okay. I wanted to ask you about. 426 00:34:00.920 --> 00:34:04.759 We're going to have Paul Davies on next week. And he's a scientist 427 00:34:04.839 --> 00:34:09.400 out of ASU or a philosopher or largely, but he has been part of 428 00:34:09.599 --> 00:34:16.480 two very big astrobiological conferences lately, one held by the Vatican, and then 429 00:34:16.559 --> 00:34:21.760 one held by the Royal Academy of Sciences. Why do you think that's happening 430 00:34:21.800 --> 00:34:25.199 all of a sudden they're talking about extrasturals. I think. Remember they're not 431 00:34:25.320 --> 00:34:31.880 talking about UFOs and Davy's ranks. We should be looking for microbial life and 432 00:34:31.920 --> 00:34:35.400 stuff like that. As a matter of fact, I've done a column I 433 00:34:35.400 --> 00:34:39.760 guess it hasn't been published yet about the Royal Society meeting and there are a 434 00:34:39.840 --> 00:34:45.679 lot of stupid things said, Uh well, I'm serious. Yeah, they 435 00:34:45.760 --> 00:34:52.159 presume there's nobody coming here. The British astronomer Royal in a long history of 436 00:34:52.280 --> 00:34:58.679 silly things from those guys, remember one said space travelers utter bilge. That 437 00:34:58.800 --> 00:35:01.679 was a year before Spot Minkley and so forth. The current one says, 438 00:35:01.719 --> 00:35:07.000 oh, well there's nobody coming here. People think that there are, but 439 00:35:07.920 --> 00:35:13.199 you know they got lost in Roswell and blah blah blah, a whole bunch 440 00:35:13.199 --> 00:35:17.280 of stupid stuff, similar to the SETI responses, Oh yeah, very similar. 441 00:35:17.760 --> 00:35:21.840 I mean, and some of those people don't believe in looking for radio 442 00:35:21.880 --> 00:35:27.920 signals, but let's look for life that has arsenic in it, because it's 443 00:35:28.000 --> 00:35:30.960 very similar to phosphorus and so if we find life with arsenic it's not from 444 00:35:30.960 --> 00:35:36.400 here. I mean, you know, I see no evil, hear no 445 00:35:36.480 --> 00:35:39.599 evil. What's that old thing about the monkeys? You know, I wish 446 00:35:39.679 --> 00:35:46.519 I could hear I'll be traveling Davy's program because well, there's an art on 447 00:35:46.559 --> 00:35:52.559 the current issue of Astronomy magazine the same kind of business about SETI and stuff. 448 00:35:53.599 --> 00:35:57.159 Hey, I'm not a professor. I can get away with telling the 449 00:35:57.199 --> 00:36:00.440 truth. I don't just stick by a party law, right, So yeah, 450 00:36:00.440 --> 00:36:02.880 well you'll be able to listen to the archive. But what I think 451 00:36:02.960 --> 00:36:07.119 is interesting is they're talking about, I mean, the philosophical issues that the 452 00:36:07.320 --> 00:36:13.599 church has would be with intelligent life out there? Yes, of course, 453 00:36:13.920 --> 00:36:19.000 and you know, did Jesus die to save us? All the obvious question. 454 00:36:19.079 --> 00:36:22.239 But there are other religions who say that there's life all over the place. 455 00:36:22.239 --> 00:36:25.679 And the Moslims do, the Hindus do the Buddhists? Do? You 456 00:36:25.719 --> 00:36:31.440 know? Now, I'd admit pat Robertson says there ain't no intelligent life anywhere 457 00:36:31.599 --> 00:36:37.559 except here on Earth. What an insult to the notion of an all powerful 458 00:36:37.639 --> 00:36:40.360 God that he thinks this is the best she can do. I mean, 459 00:36:43.480 --> 00:36:46.559 they've got some more. Got to go back to the drawing board on that 460 00:36:46.599 --> 00:36:50.760 one. Well, let me give you another reason for the cover up, 461 00:36:50.800 --> 00:36:54.719 And it's just that that the fundamentalists have claimed that, and they were very 462 00:36:54.760 --> 00:37:00.880 powerful at one time politically, that we're the only life and intelligent life in 463 00:37:00.920 --> 00:37:02.880 the universe, and all this UFO stuffice the work of the devil, and 464 00:37:02.920 --> 00:37:07.199 they'd be up to creak without a religious battle. But let me give you 465 00:37:07.280 --> 00:37:14.280 one that some people find disturbing. I have seven times heard quietly of cases 466 00:37:14.320 --> 00:37:17.360 where planes went up to chase a UFO and never came back. And there's 467 00:37:17.400 --> 00:37:23.519 a book out by Frank Fashino called Shoot Them Down, which records I wrote 468 00:37:23.519 --> 00:37:27.920 the forward for it so I can talk about it, that there was an 469 00:37:28.039 --> 00:37:31.719 order given by the military in nineteen fifty two shoot down UFOs if they don't 470 00:37:31.840 --> 00:37:40.519 lend when instructed to do so. And he also documents two hundred fatal military 471 00:37:40.599 --> 00:37:45.320 crashes military plane crashes between fifty one and fifty six, and five of the 472 00:37:45.360 --> 00:37:50.000 pilots had over one hundred missions in Korea. These weren't neophytes, in other 473 00:37:50.039 --> 00:37:52.960 words, and there were MiGs over there, and presumably there weren't new makes 474 00:37:53.079 --> 00:37:58.519 here, and the government doesn't like to tell people, Oh, your son 475 00:37:58.639 --> 00:38:02.519 was killed in flying to avoid a saucer or for trying to attack a saucer, 476 00:38:02.559 --> 00:38:07.760 you know. And that's where there have been many things kept secret. 477 00:38:07.880 --> 00:38:14.519 There's a whole chapter in flung sauscers and science. We don't talk about it 478 00:38:14.559 --> 00:38:16.199 too much. You know. There's a new book coming out in June, 479 00:38:17.159 --> 00:38:22.000 Science was Wrong, And that's what we've been talking about here, right, 480 00:38:22.679 --> 00:38:27.679 And we're getting to the point that there'll have to be a Science Was Wrong 481 00:38:27.800 --> 00:38:31.519 Volume two. Right, Yeah, that's that. They'll be an endless volume. 482 00:38:31.639 --> 00:38:35.280 But you know, we've were renting out of time. But one thing 483 00:38:35.320 --> 00:38:37.599 I do want to ask you is, like you said, you've done lectures 484 00:38:37.599 --> 00:38:44.719 at a lot of universities. Do you see people's perceptions of this whole subject 485 00:38:44.800 --> 00:38:49.519 changing over time? Has it changed? I haven't seen a lot of that. 486 00:38:49.639 --> 00:38:52.320 I've over seven hundred lectures. I've only had eleven hecklers, and two 487 00:38:52.360 --> 00:38:57.559 of them were drunk, and I come on very strong, So I have 488 00:38:57.679 --> 00:39:00.079 found people will be receptive. The big problem is people are afraid that other 489 00:39:00.159 --> 00:39:05.119 people will think they're nuts if they go on the s side of the UFO 490 00:39:05.320 --> 00:39:08.960 vote these days, I think feel that way. Well, yeah, I've 491 00:39:09.000 --> 00:39:13.360 talked to a class of one hundred students. Eighty percent thought most people didn't 492 00:39:13.400 --> 00:39:17.559 believe any UFO Israelian spacecrafting, yet eighty percent of that group did. So 493 00:39:17.639 --> 00:39:22.239 your actions are determined by your perception, right or wrong, of how other 494 00:39:22.360 --> 00:39:25.840 people will respond. And so yeah, you get more hecklers than that if 495 00:39:25.880 --> 00:39:30.039 you talk about sports, or religion or politics. I'm told anyway, Yeah, 496 00:39:30.199 --> 00:39:35.559 especially with politics. Yeah, well, if people feel very strongly about 497 00:39:35.599 --> 00:39:39.800 that these days, that's for sure. There are a lot of questions about 498 00:39:39.840 --> 00:39:45.840 flying sauces. There have been some college courses taught. There have been about 499 00:39:45.880 --> 00:39:51.599 a dozen PhD DC's done. Those are listed in Top Secret Magic, my 500 00:39:51.639 --> 00:39:57.360 book about the Majestic twelve documents. There's a lot of information out there. 501 00:39:57.440 --> 00:40:00.760 It's not just tabloid stuff, which is what surprises some people. They think 502 00:40:00.800 --> 00:40:05.840 that's all there is, you know, tabloid anecdotes. I love when they 503 00:40:05.880 --> 00:40:09.639 say there's only anecdotal information. You got to study at thirty two hundred sightings, 504 00:40:09.679 --> 00:40:13.880 but it's just just anecdotes, you know. That's ridiculous. Well, 505 00:40:13.920 --> 00:40:16.920 and that's getting to you call them the nasty nay saying negativists. But the 506 00:40:16.920 --> 00:40:22.199 debunkers out there, and you touched on this before, it seems they refuse 507 00:40:22.320 --> 00:40:25.880 to actually do the research to look in depth in any of these cases, 508 00:40:27.199 --> 00:40:30.559 even when they're coming on Larry King to debate you about it. Well, 509 00:40:30.599 --> 00:40:32.880 there are four basic rules, and boy Bill and I the science guy, 510 00:40:34.280 --> 00:40:38.119 follows them religiously. Don't bother me with the facts. My mind's made up. 511 00:40:38.239 --> 00:40:42.119 But the public doesn't know. I'm not going to tell them. They 512 00:40:42.159 --> 00:40:45.039 can't attack the data, attack the people. It's easier, and do your 513 00:40:45.039 --> 00:40:51.039 research by proclamation. Investigation is much too much trouble. Well, that's a 514 00:40:51.079 --> 00:40:55.239 great I think note to end on with the noisy negatives there. We're pretty 515 00:40:55.320 --> 00:40:59.239 much out of time, but thank you so much for being on the show. 516 00:40:59.639 --> 00:41:02.519 As you usually you're just incredibly informative and a lot of fun to listen 517 00:41:02.559 --> 00:41:07.000 to. Remember too, you had mentioned at once, but I want to 518 00:41:07.039 --> 00:41:12.679 mention again you can go to Stanton Friedman dot com to get all of those 519 00:41:12.719 --> 00:41:15.639 books you had written that you've referred to, and there's many more books that 520 00:41:15.719 --> 00:41:17.880 you didn't get to talk about that you've written as well, so well in 521 00:41:17.960 --> 00:41:22.840 their articles too. Yeah, in fact, lots of facts, So thank 522 00:41:22.840 --> 00:41:25.239 you very much for being on the show. I want to tell the listeners 523 00:41:25.239 --> 00:41:29.840 about next week, where we have doctor Paul Davies on. He's a British 524 00:41:29.840 --> 00:41:36.159 born theoretical physicist, cosmologist, astrobiologists and best selling author. Mostly a philosopher 525 00:41:36.199 --> 00:41:40.000 around extraterrestrials, although as we talked about here today, he doesn't believe they're 526 00:41:40.000 --> 00:41:44.280 coming here, so we'll ask him about that and see if we can challenge 527 00:41:44.320 --> 00:41:49.679 him a bit there. But he is talking about extraterrestrials and astrobiology a lot, 528 00:41:50.000 --> 00:41:53.360 and he has been in major news all over the place in the last 529 00:41:53.440 --> 00:41:57.639 couple of weeks because of this, so it's going to be a great show 530 00:41:57.760 --> 00:42:00.679 next week. Be sure to join us. Thank you thanks for listening to 531 00:42:00.760 --> 00:42:05.280 Open Minds Radio where we're bringing the UFO subject into the light of day. 532 00:42:05.679 --> 00:42:12.960 Have a wonderful week. We'll see you next Friday. The pleasure I keep 533 00:42:13.119 --> 00:42:15.599 forgetting the smellsome much