WEBVTT

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The Chilly Effect is sponsored by Wall
Street, Window dot Com and listeners like

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you, Yeah, yeah, Kelly. And it is a moon day,

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Monday, the eighteenth day of September
twenty twenty three, allegedly according to that

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thing we call a calendar. And
this is a show you might have been

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looking for. Then again, you
might have stumbled across it accidentally. I

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don't know. But we are available
on most podcast platforms as it stands,

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and doing my best to retain all
of the positions we have everywhere but YouTube

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anymore, which I think is funny. Look, it's Monday, and it

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is approaching that day in November that
I always wind up talking about on my

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show. I always wind up bringing
people on. Oh no, I just

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covered a news story on this,
didn't I The jfk assassination. Now you're

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not gonna hear from me too much
about it tonight, hopefully. Why I

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have somebody who is uh, well, you know, you know when we

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talked about experts a couple of weeks
ago. All right, as far as

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I'm concerned, there are not that
many experts on the general case. I've

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said this before a lot of times. The overall case, there are specialty

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guys here and there. They might
have an expertise in an area, maybe,

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but we're talking about a handful of
people out there, and I've said

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it on this show, and a
lot of people don't like it, because

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there's people out there promoting themselves as
experts on the case. God knows why.

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I don't know what they really gain
at, but they're they're not.

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This guy though, I used to
call him up, and I used to

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call him up well during a certain
time period when he was working on a

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certain project. This massive chronology on
the case actually that well, you know,

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look, I keep explaining this thing
as a resource. You're gonna want

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it. If you're interested in the
case. You want to go into deep

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detail, you want a little bit
of comic relief, you want some detail

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that you don't find anywhere else.
You would get Walt Brown's chronology, okay,

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on the JFK assassination, on JFK
in general. Actually, at a

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certain point, he goes way back
in history on this thing. But hey,

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look, I'm not going to talk
about that tonight. I am going

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to talk about Walt though and his
expertise. Why, because he's one of

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the few people I do count as
an expert in general, I don't call

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myself an expert on the case.
Other people do that. Sometimes I always

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say no, I'm not. I'm
a student of it. I know more

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than the average person on the street, I think, but I don't go

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any further than that. I've got
a fair grasp on a couple of areas.

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But expert. No. Walt,
though, I used to call him

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up, and it was hilarious because
no matter what the date was, the

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conversation would usually start out with Hey, Walt, are you doing? And

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he'd go, oh yeah, and
then he'd tell me something about that particular

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day. Okay, it could be
anything like it would be Oswald's birthday.

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He'd tell me it was Oswald's birthday. I would call him up on another

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odd day he'd tell me that was
the day the first Kennedy came to America.

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Weird stuff. And I would say, okay, Ben, Well,

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anyway, how you doing. How's
things going with the chronology? And usually

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I did this because I didn't used
to go to conferences. Now this year

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I am. I'm going to the
Lancer conference. I am going to bring

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quite a few things with me.
One of them is going to be a

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book, and how many books am
I going to carry a couple of them

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with me? Just a couple,
but one of them is going to be

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a book, and it's called Judith
Verry Baker in her own words. Anyways,

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I would call him up on one
of these days, usually because it

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was approaching the time of November twenty
second, and he used to invite people

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that were deep politics quarterly subscribers that
come to his house. I did this

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quite a few times, and we
would sit there and talk all day,

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and in fact, I was probably
a big pain in the neck because I

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would get there as early as I
could, and I would be one of

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the last people to leave. Most
of the time, Walt met wife number

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two. I think Walt met the
the current missus. Oh okay, but

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Walt didn't meet everybody, but he
met me a bunch of times. Was

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actually surprised to see who I was
what he first met me face to face.

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It's an odd story. There's a
lot of them. But today we're

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gonna talk about Judith Erry Baker in
her own words, because I've had a

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couple of weird reactions from people who
didn't know about the book. Oh my

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god, you're selling a Judith Verry
Baker book. No, I am not

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selling a Judith Verry Baker book,
but I am selling one that might just

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compare I don't know, some of
her statements, some of her own words

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to evidence to reality, and you
might find there's a great contrast in that.

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And I'm perfectly willing to sell that
book. In fact, kind of

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was part of an article that Walt
put out Indie Politics Quarterly regarding the interesting

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statement Judith Verry Baker in the tremendous
waste of time she is as a false

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witness and all that kind of stuff. Oh wait, these are my words

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enough out of me. Uh,
Walt Brown, good evening. Would would

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you like to argue with anything I
just said? Wow, I'll try and

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buy my introduction back later on when
we're talking privately. Uh. Yeah,

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I recall vividly when you used to
come up. We had some wonderful,

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absolutely wonderful times together. We have
about I don't know, sometimes as many

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as a dozen people. As far
as meeting spouses, there's no current missus

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h and I never met any any
spouse or spice there No you met mine?

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I did that you did. There
were a couple that came with me

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that that you did meet you did
not have the unfortunate ye oh yeah,

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yeah, yeah, yeah you did. You were lucky enough. You were

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lucky enough to avoid my first wife. Though. I just want to say

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you you were much luckier than I
in that you avoided her. You never

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met her, Thank all the gods. So sorry, go ahead. Well,

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uh, you were talking about the
chronology, and he said, I

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went back in history. I was
thinking of Plenty the Elder and Herodotus,

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and there's a crazy story there,
and it was a very expensive story.

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I did an index of all of
the material from the Kennedy case. It's

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it's called the Global Index. It's
a CD rom right, And one of

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the names in there was Herodotus.
Another one was Bridget Bardow. Another one

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was Beetle Bailey, which was the
description of Oswald the way he wore his

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hat in the Marines from Kerry Thornley. So I sent the CD to get

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it reviewed so that the magazine that
gets to libraries for buying stuff would be

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aware of it. And the reviewer, some stringer from North Dakota, just

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beat the living hell out of it
because it included Herodotous, Bridget Bardot and

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beatle Bailey. Even though if the
name is in the book you have to

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include it. You can't say is
that important enough to index it. It's

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there, you use it. That
was that was me, and that just

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cost the whole The whole thing was
a fiasco, unfortunately. And speaking of

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fiasco's, we'll get to one tonight. As far as the chronology, going

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back in history, an interesting fact
that the first real event there comes along

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in eighteen twenty three, and it
was when the first Kennedy spelled very differently,

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left Ireland to come to the United
States. And the interesting thing of

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note is that that Kennedy, who
would have been JFK's great grandfather, he

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died in November twenty second, in
eighteen fifty eight. Wow, that's you

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know that, that's the kind of
stuff that that's in there everywhere. It's

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just it's unavoidable. Like you said, when you call me up at a

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certain date, there's there's always stuck, there's always stuffed, there's always good

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stuff. The history of the Secret
Service up until sixty three totally unknown.

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Another story. Another time. The
chronology was fun. There was a complaint

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or two that there was no conclusion, so I wrote a conclusion. It's

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called the Kennedy Execution, and it
was in my mind at least my final

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my final word, that's the way
that's titled on my computer, my final

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word on the JFKKSE. And then
I got phone calls from people that you

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would know that are experts in the
medical areas, as you noted that some

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people are experts in certain areas.
I heard from some of the medical experts,

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and their concern was that one of
the medical experts was constantly willing to

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lend his name to seminars hosted by
JVB. And I just said, well,

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you know, that's ridiculous. I
said, you know, she she's

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making this stuff up, or you
know, it's being drawn from stuff that

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can never be sourced. But trust
me, folks, you know, it's

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like being a magician on a radio. It was just crazy. And I

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put together a bunch of thoughts and
it took about, I don't know,

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I sp a couple of days on
it. It was, I don't know,

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close to three hundred pages long.
And I sent it to one of

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the researchers and he immediately circulated it, and all of them that got it

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said, you've got to put this
into print. People, people need to

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read this stuff. And I,
you know, I was, I don't

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know, you know, because I
thought kennedy execution was the last story.

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But I did. Matter of fact, the Wall Street window that you mentioned

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who had mentioned as one of your
sponsors, that's Mike Swanson and his company

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ultimately published it Campaignia Partners in Danville, Virginia, and it's got a story

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to tell. It's it's a little
bit of a challenge, but it's a

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fun challenge. You said earlier about
comparing it, and I'd say, hey,

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you know, compare it to reality. You know, it's a it's

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a good, good way to find
out if the common sense is still working

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for somebody, or it's a fact
check. The thing. I mean,

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if you go through but the book
of Hers that I read, not the

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five were the pages on David Ferry, but me and Late you go through

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that and you don't find anything to
question. You're not an expert, that's

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the damn sure. It's just I
don't know. It's as if as you're

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reading it you can see where material
is borrowed from that idea came from such

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and such, that's original, you
know, her her putting on Marina's clothing

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so she could pass as a Russian
woman. Anybody can pass as a Russian

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woman. He certainly don't have to
dress Russian. And of course she spoke

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Russian sort of. That was a
problem in my reading, because you at

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one point she wanted she wanted I
think she wanted to say okay to Oswald,

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but she couldn't remember how you say
it in Russian, and you would

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just say dah, meaning yes,
or to get fancy, you go to

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Malaudia. But if you can,
if you don't how to say yes in

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Russian, you don't know the language. I mean, there's certainly not a

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speaker. But that's neither here nor
there. I understand. At one point

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at a conference someone challenged her speak
speak to us in Russian a little bit.

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She couldn't. Not surprisingly, some
of the things that I took out

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of it, I think the craziest
thought in the whole book, And I

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hope enough people get copies from you
or me to find their craziest thought.

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We can do this again some night. But the craziest thought I found was

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that Oswald was tortured by the KGB. He withstood the torture, and when

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they were all done, they apologized
and gave him a classy apartment, you

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know, the one, the fancy
apartment that he got that was wired up

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in Minsk. That let me just
say, the KGB. You don't use

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the KGB and apology in the same
sentence. It doesn't happen unless you're talking

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about the KGB and the widow.
Because in its day, the KGB was

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one of the most efficient killing machines
that ever existed. You know, there

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are stories about the current ruling elite
in Moscow killing off enemies, and they're

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probably true. I used I used
that thought in one of my mysteries.

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But to KGB torturing somebody failing,
there's a problem. Apologizing, that's a

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second problem, and giving the person
an apartment because you're you're apologizing for making

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an egregious error, not a chance. That's just pure invention. And I

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don't know if it was at that
point or some earlier point when I sew

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my ends up what's going on here? Another classic I'm recalling is that Oswald

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was sought out by the Secret Service
to give them a clue to possible assassination

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sites along the motorcade route. You
know, on face it sounds shilly,

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you know, arguably preposterous when you
get to the fact that the person they're

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seeking out does not own or drive
a vehicle, except in this book,

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does not drive a vehicle. How
would they know? Did did Oswald ever

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travel the motorcade route? I don't
know. Yeah, between that and the

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service Secret Service advance needs to go
to him. That makes the Dallas police

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look even more foolish, because then
they actually look in nineteen sixty three,

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Yeah, no kidding, I mean
look for advice on the motorcade route.

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What you can't go to the Sheriff's
department, You can't go to the DPD.

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You can't go to any of the
military guys that were hanging around in

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Dallas. You can't go to the
businesspeople. Uh what what you got to

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go to Oswald who's got a part
time job. You can't use your own

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Secret Service training to make sense out
of things. No, not for nothing,

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But there were probably two hundred potential
ambush sites when they turned the corner

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onto the main drag there and a
number of authors point us up, you

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know, missus Connolly eventually said,
you can't say that Dallas doesn't love you,

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And based on the people that were
out on the street, that would

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be true. But the people that
didn't go out to the street, that

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were up in the windows in the
canyon, they're going down towards towards Houston

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Street, the hate that was projected
on their faces, and it's spoken of

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in some of the some of the
books that I've read mostly uh, not

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assassination strictly related, but you know
biographies Kennedy, you know in his final

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hours, what he went through,
and there were there were plenty of places

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from which you could have pulled an
assassination or at least gotten to him.

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And let's face it, the site
chosen was as bad as one could imagine.

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Yeah, that's kind of a tough
spot anyway. Look, strategically,

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if you're picking a spot, it's
kind of crappy for a couple of reasons.

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Well, it's even crappier if you're
gonna shoot after the car passes you.

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Let's see, that's the thing it. Look, if you take the

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00:17:22.240 --> 00:17:30.039
shot on Houston, you have just
increased the value of that perch, of

205
00:17:30.079 --> 00:17:34.920
the alleged perch right exponentially when the
car right below the window you could swallow

206
00:17:34.920 --> 00:17:38.039
a bullet and hurt somebody, right, I mean, look, I go

207
00:17:38.119 --> 00:17:42.480
to hit him with a brick out
of that window with him approaching the school

208
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book depository. I'm just saying,
okay, it's this is nothing. I

209
00:17:48.279 --> 00:17:51.319
could have tossed a baseball and hit
him in the head, all right,

210
00:17:51.359 --> 00:17:53.079
it wouldn't have been a problem.
And I don't see good you know this,

211
00:17:55.000 --> 00:17:59.000
Okay, I'm just saying, yeah, look, not a problem.

212
00:17:59.039 --> 00:18:00.599
Plus it when giving you more shots, just one of that. Yeah,

213
00:18:02.160 --> 00:18:11.079
you know. Oswald helped to fly
David Ferries plane. They met speaking Russian

214
00:18:11.200 --> 00:18:15.720
and the New Orleans Post Office in
New Orleans. The rest of the book

215
00:18:17.039 --> 00:18:22.960
makes the rest of her story makes
a point of saying New Orleans is just

216
00:18:22.079 --> 00:18:27.119
slightly to the right of Genghis Khan
as as a metropolis. You know,

217
00:18:27.200 --> 00:18:32.640
it's a right wing bastion. You
know, you've got Austin and all of

218
00:18:32.640 --> 00:18:36.880
his nonsense, you got Trvy and
whatever nonsense he was up to. Well,

219
00:18:36.920 --> 00:18:40.319
I love how they're working for a
place at a certain point that has

220
00:18:40.359 --> 00:18:45.279
a black business owner. The two
of them allegedly had a job together,

221
00:18:45.400 --> 00:18:49.359
right, all right, there's a
black business owner and look let's just get

222
00:18:49.359 --> 00:18:56.160
honest about the South. At that
time, you still had separated bathrooms and

223
00:18:56.200 --> 00:18:59.160
stuff, and there were laws in
place. If you had a business and

224
00:18:59.200 --> 00:19:03.079
you screwed around on would happen.
You know, you'd have to call Oswald

225
00:19:03.119 --> 00:19:07.279
and even her white people. I
mean, I don't think that's offensive.

226
00:19:07.480 --> 00:19:11.359
So you couldn't have them mixed with
what they would have called coloreds at the

227
00:19:11.400 --> 00:19:17.759
time in New Orleans, New Orleans. Yeah, you couldn't have them using

228
00:19:17.799 --> 00:19:19.720
the same bathroom. Now, this
guy has no evidence of having set up

229
00:19:19.720 --> 00:19:23.200
a second bathroom, but he's got
temp employees at work in his place.

230
00:19:26.000 --> 00:19:30.640
Yeah, no, something's wrong there. I mean, yeah, Lee could

231
00:19:30.640 --> 00:19:37.039
have went outside of people realized Brown
versus Board of Education was. There was

232
00:19:37.079 --> 00:19:41.960
a program done on that in two
thousand four. Fiftie Anniversary was a radio

233
00:19:41.960 --> 00:19:49.279
program. I wrote the script for
it, and that legally de segregated the

234
00:19:49.319 --> 00:19:56.799
South. And what happened was that
the public schools closed, they became private

235
00:19:56.839 --> 00:20:02.960
schools, and the tuition to attend
those private schools was the equivalent of what

236
00:20:03.039 --> 00:20:07.240
your tax bill for schools would have
been. So they were hanging on to

237
00:20:07.920 --> 00:20:11.160
segregation by their fingernails, and they
were not going to give it up.

238
00:20:12.119 --> 00:20:18.920
And part of and this does this
gets away a little bit slightly from from

239
00:20:18.960 --> 00:20:23.319
her book, But the FBI,
the Secret Service, the government, the

240
00:20:23.400 --> 00:20:30.799
people of power were generally racist in
nature. Not necessarily right wing, but

241
00:20:30.960 --> 00:20:37.039
racist, you know, the whole
Abraham Bolden nonsense, which I don't believe

242
00:20:37.119 --> 00:20:41.920
anyhow, Lisa, not some of
it. Is he still alive, by

243
00:20:41.960 --> 00:20:45.200
the way last I checked, he
is, And uh, you know,

244
00:20:45.279 --> 00:20:49.200
I think I might be more forgiving
of his story than you are. There's

245
00:20:49.279 --> 00:20:52.720
good, but look, it's still
you got to acknowledge it's part of the

246
00:20:52.759 --> 00:20:56.640
time period, and that would be
part of where they would be if they

247
00:20:56.640 --> 00:21:02.720
were indeed together in that place.
I don't know why it is that people

248
00:21:02.720 --> 00:21:07.680
can't recognize that, because it's just
a reality, okay, and it's an

249
00:21:07.720 --> 00:21:11.200
absolute, carved in stone reality.
Yeah, there's no way getting around it.

250
00:21:11.799 --> 00:21:15.599
It wasn't like it wasn't like,
well, the next block is different

251
00:21:15.640 --> 00:21:22.279
from this flock. No, it's
not. It's the same. And that's

252
00:21:22.319 --> 00:21:26.279
another wacky thing about them breaking into
Russian at the post office, too,

253
00:21:26.319 --> 00:21:29.200
which is always hilarious to me.
You know, I think you even pointed

254
00:21:29.240 --> 00:21:33.240
that out in that little article that
you put into a deep politics quarterly some

255
00:21:33.319 --> 00:21:37.319
years ago, where it was like
and the way you put it, I

256
00:21:37.400 --> 00:21:41.119
forget, but of course you you
always have this way of writing things that

257
00:21:41.119 --> 00:21:45.799
that kind of cracks me up because
there's always some some snark and some sarcasm

258
00:21:45.880 --> 00:21:51.039
built into things. And I loved
it. It was like breaking into Russian

259
00:21:51.240 --> 00:21:53.119
I don't know, I forget how
you put it, but it was sort

260
00:21:53.119 --> 00:21:56.319
of like as if we were going
to go into I don't know, breaking

261
00:21:56.359 --> 00:22:00.920
into Russian song and dance in the
World's post office with a stranger getting ready

262
00:22:00.920 --> 00:22:04.160
for your opening on Broadway, you
know, something like this. I'm like,

263
00:22:04.440 --> 00:22:07.839
uh, yeah, okay, that
is ridiculous. Oh I just happened

264
00:22:07.880 --> 00:22:11.880
to drop my uh you know,
my my ad. I was placing somewhere

265
00:22:12.000 --> 00:22:17.759
some letter or some crap, and
uh yeah, we just exchanged words in

266
00:22:17.839 --> 00:22:21.799
Russian because this is where the chemistry
sparks up. And oh, by the

267
00:22:21.799 --> 00:22:25.400
way, Clayshaw paid for our hotel
rooms. That's why we don't have any

268
00:22:25.440 --> 00:22:29.480
receipts there, because we used to
sneak away and do that. I also

269
00:22:29.519 --> 00:22:30.839
love the fact that you point out, well, gee, she's got a

270
00:22:30.839 --> 00:22:34.640
masquerade as Marina, but she's got
to wear her clothes. Well, that

271
00:22:34.680 --> 00:22:38.519
would be because everybody would know how
Marina dressed everywhere he went. Absolutely.

272
00:22:38.680 --> 00:22:42.440
Okay, let's play it. Let's
name the people who would know how Marina

273
00:22:42.599 --> 00:22:49.880
dressed. And Ruth Payne and maybe
maybe you know, because I mean that's

274
00:22:49.920 --> 00:22:52.799
a stretch, but we got to
say something there. Yeah, I mean

275
00:22:53.400 --> 00:23:00.400
maybe Michael Michael might have known.
He might have paid attention. Yeah,

276
00:23:00.440 --> 00:23:04.960
perhaps, And I listed, I
listed the stuff that she confessed to in

277
00:23:06.000 --> 00:23:10.680
that book. Well, that's another
thing. If you take, yeah,

278
00:23:10.759 --> 00:23:15.640
if you took a conspiracy to murder
a foreign head of state, Yes,

279
00:23:15.079 --> 00:23:22.480
Caro, she was accessory, an
accessory to the murder of a volunteer killed

280
00:23:22.200 --> 00:23:27.759
testing the so called cancer drug that
was carried around an affirmis and a baby

281
00:23:27.799 --> 00:23:33.400
buggy. She was an accessory to
gun smuggling into the United States. Yes,

282
00:23:34.400 --> 00:23:40.119
and then my favorite or least favorite, she was an accessory to thousands

283
00:23:40.240 --> 00:23:48.960
of acts of animal cruelty. True, and nobody nothing, Nobody said,

284
00:23:48.960 --> 00:23:52.279
hey, you know, covering,
let's let's see what the deal is.

285
00:23:52.799 --> 00:23:57.799
The government left it off too.
Oh yeah, oh yeah, we'll see.

286
00:23:57.799 --> 00:24:02.279
That's the thing is, when sick
feen minutes background checkers get in in

287
00:24:02.400 --> 00:24:07.359
on you and decide your story's not
worth running. Yeah, that's usually a

288
00:24:07.400 --> 00:24:11.319
bad sign. And it's not because
you know, the media is controlled by

289
00:24:11.319 --> 00:24:14.920
the CIA and they don't want the
real story to get out. Okay,

290
00:24:14.960 --> 00:24:18.079
it's about although you know that that
is a possibility sometimes, but not in

291
00:24:18.079 --> 00:24:23.359
this case. This story is ludicrous
enough that I'm almost surprised the CIA didn't

292
00:24:23.640 --> 00:24:29.200
encourage it. With CBS, Hey, look, produce this please anything?

293
00:24:29.480 --> 00:24:33.200
Uh yeah, yeah, get get
this on Save the Whales, I mean,

294
00:24:34.160 --> 00:24:38.839
and that's yeah. Yeah, highlight
how highlight how she met Jack Ruby.

295
00:24:40.079 --> 00:24:42.960
She was over hanging out with David
and the Rats and Ferry. Ruby

296
00:24:44.039 --> 00:24:51.119
came in and since she had been
a gymnast at one point, she decided

297
00:24:51.160 --> 00:24:53.799
to do some acrobatics, and Ruby, not to be Outcune also did some

298
00:24:53.880 --> 00:24:59.880
acrobatics and then the brass knuckles and
wads of money fell out of his pocket.

299
00:25:00.119 --> 00:25:06.000
He was doing it and it's just
silly and she and she also called

300
00:25:06.039 --> 00:25:10.039
him sparky to his face. Yeah, okay, I believe that, sure,

301
00:25:11.440 --> 00:25:15.880
And what was it, uncle uncle
Carlos Marcello right at one point there?

302
00:25:15.960 --> 00:25:21.160
Yeah, right, sure. See
I love when people talk about let's

303
00:25:21.160 --> 00:25:26.000
just call them Italian businessmen who have
never had any experience with them, their

304
00:25:26.119 --> 00:25:30.119
organizations, how things work. I
mean the type of people that literally think,

305
00:25:30.160 --> 00:25:33.440
Walt that the Dixie Mafia and the
Mafia Mafia are the same kind of

306
00:25:33.440 --> 00:25:40.480
thing. They're not. They share
a name, okay, but it is

307
00:25:40.519 --> 00:25:42.680
not the same kind of thing at
all. I happen to have. You

308
00:25:42.680 --> 00:25:47.160
know, look, I haven't known
many members of the Dixie Mafia full disclosure,

309
00:25:47.559 --> 00:25:52.480
but you know Italian businessmen in the
Northeast, I'm encountered and have known

310
00:25:52.559 --> 00:25:55.480
some of them. Maybe I'm related
to a couple of them. Are just

311
00:25:55.559 --> 00:26:00.160
saying, you know, I got
about the end of my name. It's

312
00:26:00.200 --> 00:26:04.200
possible from Jersey, all right,
I was thinking the same thing. Well,

313
00:26:04.240 --> 00:26:08.799
you know, it's true. The
thing is, uh yeah, the

314
00:26:08.839 --> 00:26:14.960
way that people describe these people,
it always cracks me up because it's either

315
00:26:15.039 --> 00:26:18.880
the Hollywood interpretation, you know,
like they think Joe Pesci is for real,

316
00:26:21.079 --> 00:26:25.359
like that guy bears any sort of
you know, any resemblance to the

317
00:26:25.359 --> 00:26:32.480
guy he's actually playing in casino in
reality. Okay, not really, you

318
00:26:32.519 --> 00:26:36.240
know, in a very vague sort
of way. Yeah, sure, But

319
00:26:36.640 --> 00:26:37.799
is he a clown. Is he
there to amuse you? Well, Joe

320
00:26:37.799 --> 00:26:41.920
Pesci is the real guy. Not
so much. They wouldn't be playing around.

321
00:26:44.000 --> 00:26:47.160
They wouldn't be playing around with these
people in New Orleans like this.

322
00:26:47.319 --> 00:26:51.599
Believe me, this is not what
you know Marcello is going to be interested

323
00:26:51.599 --> 00:26:53.480
in. Oh, uncle Marcello is
gonna watch you, and don't worry.

324
00:26:53.480 --> 00:26:56.960
We're gonna make sure that mister Tropa
Conti, you'll take care of you over

325
00:26:57.000 --> 00:27:02.240
there in Florida. You kill me. These are not the guys that would

326
00:27:02.279 --> 00:27:06.240
be concerned with somebody like you.
Even if your story was, you know,

327
00:27:06.559 --> 00:27:11.839
twenty percent reel, it would be
some no name guy, okay,

328
00:27:11.880 --> 00:27:15.079
that would be hanging around running I
don't know, numbers out of a bait

329
00:27:15.200 --> 00:27:18.839
store in you know, in the
glades, all right, something right,

330
00:27:19.200 --> 00:27:26.480
right exactly, some kind of business
front that's out there losing money every single

331
00:27:26.559 --> 00:27:30.039
year. Because it doesn't actually lose
money, it does something else, you

332
00:27:30.079 --> 00:27:33.839
know, just saying it's like,
yeah, they sell worms and that's the

333
00:27:33.839 --> 00:27:37.119
front of the store. Notice all
the worms are dead. Nobody buys the

334
00:27:37.200 --> 00:27:41.319
worms, but the store is still
there anyways. Uh, look, this

335
00:27:41.400 --> 00:27:45.000
is not the way things run good. She got in touch. She was

336
00:27:45.279 --> 00:27:52.720
close to every imaginable player that a
person could make a list of the New

337
00:27:52.880 --> 00:27:56.240
Orleans players. She was close to
all of them. Yeah, and that's

338
00:27:56.240 --> 00:28:00.920
going to happen. This is like, this is like the female, This

339
00:28:00.000 --> 00:28:06.119
is like the bizarro female Forrest Gump
universe. Of I just happened to be

340
00:28:06.240 --> 00:28:08.640
there. You know. I ran
into Jack Ruby, of course. Oh

341
00:28:08.680 --> 00:28:11.599
and I ran into that guy.
And you know what else I know?

342
00:28:11.160 --> 00:28:15.039
And the other thing that cracked me
up. This was the thing that you

343
00:28:15.079 --> 00:28:18.559
and I commiserated about on the phone
probably back in two thousand and eight.

344
00:28:18.279 --> 00:28:21.839
I mean, I tried for many
years to get people to listen to me

345
00:28:21.880 --> 00:28:26.799
about her as she was growing in
popularity, and most serious researchers, authors,

346
00:28:26.799 --> 00:28:29.240
etc. Just would go, look, I'm not going to even comment

347
00:28:29.279 --> 00:28:33.319
on that. It's not even worth
my time. That was usually what I

348
00:28:33.319 --> 00:28:36.559
would get, and I'd go,
Guys, I'm telling you that people are

349
00:28:36.599 --> 00:28:41.119
going to buy this. They're gonna
like this story because it's got this romantic

350
00:28:41.119 --> 00:28:45.920
angle, it's got this sympathetic angle. It's fetching. Absolutely, it's a

351
00:28:45.920 --> 00:28:49.000
fetching story, and it's going to
gain traction. And what's going to happen.

352
00:28:49.119 --> 00:28:52.559
Is legitimate work that you guys are
doing is going to get undermined by

353
00:28:52.559 --> 00:28:56.519
this in evidence now, the fact
that she runs her own conferences, and

354
00:28:56.680 --> 00:29:03.640
in evidence the fact that she's still
taking seriously by so many casual spectators that

355
00:29:03.799 --> 00:29:07.839
it is nauseating to me. But
anyway, I was commiserating with you about

356
00:29:07.839 --> 00:29:10.880
this over the phone back and I
want to say two thousand and eight,

357
00:29:10.960 --> 00:29:15.160
somewhere between O eight and twelve,
before the fiftieth for sure, and you

358
00:29:15.200 --> 00:29:18.519
know you were working on the chronology. And again I appreciate the fact that

359
00:29:18.559 --> 00:29:22.920
you even did this little article with
me, But I love this idea that

360
00:29:23.759 --> 00:29:29.920
she's crying on Q as per usual
during interviews during her Men Who Killed Kennedy

361
00:29:29.960 --> 00:29:32.640
bit? You know, Nigel Turner
went to see her all that, right,

362
00:29:33.279 --> 00:29:37.880
and she's crying about her last conversation
with Oswald. And this to me

363
00:29:37.960 --> 00:29:42.480
was the big tell don't don't forget
the name Bobby Baker. And you know

364
00:29:42.559 --> 00:29:47.680
you and I hear that, and
we have thoughts. We have thoughts that

365
00:29:47.680 --> 00:29:51.279
maybe the average person in the public
doesn't have, even though they should be

366
00:29:51.279 --> 00:29:55.079
able to put it together surface level, that something is very strange about that

367
00:29:55.119 --> 00:30:00.440
statement that her alleged you know what, what does the woman call her mistress

368
00:30:00.799 --> 00:30:03.920
because she's supposed to be his mistress
because he's married. I don't know.

369
00:30:04.039 --> 00:30:08.640
It doesn't matter because here's the thing. What was her husband's name, Walt,

370
00:30:11.119 --> 00:30:17.039
Oh, mister Baker. Yeah,
but wasn't it wasn't it Robert.

371
00:30:18.119 --> 00:30:22.640
So what you're telling me is you
got to tell this woman to not forget

372
00:30:22.680 --> 00:30:29.240
the name Bobby Baker because at that
time it was very popular to tie you

373
00:30:29.279 --> 00:30:32.960
know, and it's come and gone
in popularity about LBJ is the mastermind,

374
00:30:33.000 --> 00:30:37.119
he's the guy really responsible and indeed, look, you can make arguments about

375
00:30:37.119 --> 00:30:38.319
that. Matter of fact. You
were on The Men Who Killed Kennedy?

376
00:30:38.519 --> 00:30:42.920
Uh, you know, the one
that was I think the same episode might

377
00:30:44.000 --> 00:30:45.759
have been with her, No,
but I know it was one that was

378
00:30:45.799 --> 00:30:49.839
broadcast at the same time, broadcast
at the same time she was episode eight.

379
00:30:49.880 --> 00:30:53.240
You were episode nine, Okay,
I was not. Yeah, you

380
00:30:53.240 --> 00:30:59.359
were. You were the final straw
in that series. Oh yeah, he

381
00:30:59.519 --> 00:31:00.720
was one of the guys on there. You could see him right there.

382
00:31:00.720 --> 00:31:06.200
It's writing writing his living room right
at the you can see the mantle in

383
00:31:06.240 --> 00:31:08.559
the back, which uh, you
know, which I'm very familiar with in

384
00:31:08.559 --> 00:31:12.079
his living room. I know exactly
where he's sitting in his house while he's

385
00:31:12.119 --> 00:31:17.119
doing the interview. I'm surprised we
didn't see a white dog pop up on

386
00:31:17.160 --> 00:31:21.599
your on your lap. Actually,
uh, late at night when we find

387
00:31:22.119 --> 00:31:26.720
he started filming about one o'clock in
the afternoon, and he went told quarter

388
00:31:26.839 --> 00:31:30.640
to two in the morning, and
he just went through tape, if the

389
00:31:30.720 --> 00:31:36.839
tape after tape, I mean,
I must answer three hundred questions. And

390
00:31:37.000 --> 00:31:40.599
I said, listen, when you're
done putting us all together, what are

391
00:31:40.640 --> 00:31:41.480
you gonna do with those tapes?
Oh? We talked, I said,

392
00:31:41.480 --> 00:31:45.559
I'd like to happen. Oh,
sure, no problem. Never saw a

393
00:31:45.680 --> 00:31:51.440
thing. Yeah, well, and
you con punctuate the record. I didn't

394
00:31:51.480 --> 00:31:55.000
get paid a penny for that.
That was just something you did. Yeah.

395
00:31:55.079 --> 00:32:00.000
Yeah, he's spent a lot of
time Jay Harrison, Jay Harrison,

396
00:32:00.000 --> 00:32:06.119
and sent them to me. And
that was the amazing thing that came out

397
00:32:06.119 --> 00:32:13.039
of all that he left here.
He got here on the Rember thirtieth,

398
00:32:14.799 --> 00:32:21.200
in two and blah blah blah,
will make some movies tomorrow. Oh,

399
00:32:21.319 --> 00:32:27.240
I guess you stay in the night. We did all the shooting the next

400
00:32:27.319 --> 00:32:32.920
day without breaking for a meal,
and then he left on the second and

401
00:32:34.079 --> 00:32:37.319
when he drove it slowed, and
she's driving away. I walked into the

402
00:32:37.319 --> 00:32:42.680
house. The phone rang. It
was Ben Wicked inviting me to speak at

403
00:32:42.720 --> 00:32:51.960
the fiftieth out there at at Duquesne. And I said, oh, I'd

404
00:32:52.000 --> 00:32:54.640
love to, sure, absolutely'd be
glad to. They said, okay.

405
00:32:55.559 --> 00:33:00.680
They never got back to me anymore. Just you know, we're looking forward.

406
00:33:01.039 --> 00:33:04.599
I didn't know I was supposed to
submit an abstract. I thought,

407
00:33:04.640 --> 00:33:07.279
you know, he'll put me in
for half an hour or whatever, and

408
00:33:07.759 --> 00:33:10.440
you know, what are you gonna
talking about? Never asked, So it

409
00:33:10.599 --> 00:33:17.680
became a JFK one oh one.
And since I didn't have an abstract,

410
00:33:17.720 --> 00:33:21.920
I was just going to be,
you know, part of the opening introduction.

411
00:33:22.279 --> 00:33:24.720
It's okay, I don't care.
We were going to have fun the

412
00:33:24.759 --> 00:33:34.319
whole the whole time. And Tony
Somers walks over, Well, I'm talking

413
00:33:34.319 --> 00:33:37.279
to Ben ben Watt. He introduces
himself and says, what have you got

414
00:33:37.319 --> 00:33:43.000
me doing? He said, well, you're on assassination one on one.

415
00:33:43.119 --> 00:33:45.200
You're gonna be with Wolf here.
Oh how much time have I got?

416
00:33:45.440 --> 00:33:51.200
He said, oh about seven minutes. Well, Anthony Somers went batshit for

417
00:33:51.720 --> 00:33:58.960
having flown across the ocean for seven
minutes, and I don't know what happened.

418
00:34:00.079 --> 00:34:06.680
It was funny because they had a
the opening of the program, which

419
00:34:06.759 --> 00:34:08.440
was late afternoon, and then they
broke for dinner, and then we had

420
00:34:08.440 --> 00:34:14.079
the one on one. The opening
of a program was something about Duquanne University

421
00:34:14.159 --> 00:34:19.239
and its solemnity blah blah. Then
Cyril did his keynote, which is the

422
00:34:19.320 --> 00:34:25.360
same keynote he always does, and
then Ben announced local we're going to have

423
00:34:25.400 --> 00:34:29.760
a dinner break and after the break, we're gonna have JFK one on one

424
00:34:30.360 --> 00:34:32.719
and it's gonna be a panel discussion
and it's going to be great. We

425
00:34:32.880 --> 00:34:40.519
got Walt Brown and and he went
blank. He went totally blank. He

426
00:34:40.639 --> 00:34:44.159
took the thing out of his pocket
milked and said, oh yeah. And

427
00:34:44.400 --> 00:34:50.079
Anthony Summers and I said, going
to tell me I get I get billing,

428
00:34:50.079 --> 00:34:52.440
and they get right off the program. So that was it. That

429
00:34:52.559 --> 00:34:57.320
was my seven minutes, and it
was fine, But who cares. I

430
00:34:57.360 --> 00:35:04.159
had seven minutes at a tremendous event, and that was just about in the

431
00:35:04.239 --> 00:35:07.519
time frame of when I got to
know you know who. Because that's the

432
00:35:07.559 --> 00:35:15.280
week that the men who killed Kennedy
was on. Right, we watched reruns

433
00:35:15.159 --> 00:35:23.039
at Sarah wax House on Saturday night. So that was the beginning of the

434
00:35:23.079 --> 00:35:28.400
acquaintance, as it or before I
forget tell them. Just when I mentioned

435
00:35:28.480 --> 00:35:31.880
you could throw a bullet out,
have you have you seen any of the

436
00:35:31.920 --> 00:35:37.800
stuff with this Secret Service agent Paul
landis, Yes, I have. I

437
00:35:37.880 --> 00:35:39.320
was going to ask you about it, but I wasn't sure. Had you

438
00:35:39.360 --> 00:35:43.599
been paying attention to this, you
probably didn't have a choice because you're probably

439
00:35:43.639 --> 00:35:46.719
watching sports and caught some news.
But yeah, go ahead, quite by

440
00:35:46.760 --> 00:35:54.159
accident, right, he said he
found a bullet which would have been in

441
00:35:54.199 --> 00:36:01.559
the position behind where Jackie was.
Yeah, and you know, all right,

442
00:36:01.920 --> 00:36:07.199
except that I believe it was Sam
Kenny told that same story years ago.

443
00:36:07.199 --> 00:36:13.920
Yeah, because he did the same
thing. And then, you know,

444
00:36:14.320 --> 00:36:20.000
there's a time when when somebody says
something and it just credibility goes out

445
00:36:20.039 --> 00:36:22.880
the window. Lander says, I'll
never forget it. You know, you

446
00:36:22.920 --> 00:36:25.440
know, I had to leave the
Service because all I could see in front

447
00:36:25.440 --> 00:36:30.320
of my face with the President's head
exploding. That part. I understand,

448
00:36:30.639 --> 00:36:34.159
yes, But when he says,
but you know there was that bullet and

449
00:36:34.199 --> 00:36:38.719
that was about two inches long.
The bullets an inch form, yeah,

450
00:36:38.760 --> 00:36:45.519
yeah, about right, it's you
know, it's two point five four centimeters,

451
00:36:45.400 --> 00:36:52.760
so that approximately an inch? Yeah
yeah. Would you mistake one inch

452
00:36:52.840 --> 00:36:57.599
for two inches your daydreaming? Well, and then he said he never read

453
00:36:57.639 --> 00:37:01.920
the warn report. Good god,
he's the only secret serviceman on the North

454
00:37:01.960 --> 00:37:07.639
American continent that didn't read it.
Well, But he's not the only one

455
00:37:07.719 --> 00:37:10.800
to ever say that at a certain
point he had not read it until because

456
00:37:10.920 --> 00:37:15.119
a lot of them did that,
right, even the guy who put out

457
00:37:15.119 --> 00:37:20.159
the Kennedy Detailed books. I never
read anything on it, right, say

458
00:37:21.480 --> 00:37:24.320
that's what they say. And of
course Quinn Hill, who's mister official Verdict,

459
00:37:25.000 --> 00:37:29.719
read over landis this book and said
I can't recommend this. I'm sorry.

460
00:37:29.920 --> 00:37:31.760
I can't write it forward or an
introduction, and I can't do it

461
00:37:32.159 --> 00:37:37.000
right, which is not surprising,
you know. Clint Hill's argument is,

462
00:37:37.039 --> 00:37:40.760
hey, I was there, it
was three shots and Oswald fired them.

463
00:37:40.800 --> 00:37:45.519
Being there does not give you the
right to say that maybe you only heard

464
00:37:45.559 --> 00:37:52.199
three because he said he only heard
doing his testimony right, but landish left

465
00:37:52.400 --> 00:37:58.519
And if I'm not mistaken that was
the only or the first motorcade that Paul

466
00:37:58.599 --> 00:38:04.320
Anddis was ever in. Well,
I don't. He was Jackie's agent and

467
00:38:04.360 --> 00:38:07.480
that's the first time she went in
a motorcade. See, I was thinking

468
00:38:07.480 --> 00:38:12.400
that that he was actually supposed to
be attached to the kids. I think

469
00:38:12.480 --> 00:38:15.159
landis and maybe I'm wrong. Look, I'm not the expert on this,

470
00:38:15.239 --> 00:38:17.880
but I will tell you what I
know for a fact, and that is

471
00:38:19.320 --> 00:38:24.679
that his previous statements preclude him from
finding this bullet. According to his previous

472
00:38:24.719 --> 00:38:30.000
statements because and look, I realized, reporters, somebody could record something wrong,

473
00:38:30.079 --> 00:38:36.159
somebody could transcribe something wrong. I've
been misquoted in newspapers having nothing to

474
00:38:36.159 --> 00:38:38.119
do with the Kennedy assassination, having
to do with me as a musician,

475
00:38:38.559 --> 00:38:42.679
describing things to a reporter before.
And I read what's in the paper,

476
00:38:42.679 --> 00:38:44.960
and I go, what the hell? I never even said this. I've

477
00:38:45.000 --> 00:38:49.159
seen it. I get it.
But when somebody's recording in oral history on

478
00:38:49.199 --> 00:38:52.800
this guy and he tells the story
about you know, first of all,

479
00:38:53.079 --> 00:38:57.639
now his news story as he got
there and he sees Kennedy, Kennedy's head

480
00:38:57.719 --> 00:39:01.719
laying on Jackie's lap, Well maybe
a story didn't say that. His previous

481
00:39:01.760 --> 00:39:06.440
story was they had already hauled the
body away by the time he approaches.

482
00:39:06.719 --> 00:39:12.079
Okay, different story right there.
It's hard to imagine because he would have

483
00:39:12.119 --> 00:39:17.960
been uncompetent. Thing. It's hard
to imagine because the cars stops. Yeah,

484
00:39:19.360 --> 00:39:22.280
everybody runs to see the damage.
Then they decide, we got to

485
00:39:22.280 --> 00:39:23.960
get Connelly out of here. They
got to have a guarney to do that.

486
00:39:24.119 --> 00:39:27.239
He gets put on a guarney.
Then they got to have a second

487
00:39:27.239 --> 00:39:31.119
garney for Kennedy. If any secret
serviceman still attached to Kennada. I'm not

488
00:39:31.119 --> 00:39:36.599
talking about the ones that ran off
with Johnson's that's a different story, but

489
00:39:36.679 --> 00:39:40.320
the ones that were was Kennedy,
particularly since he was Missus Kennedy's agent.

490
00:39:40.679 --> 00:39:45.239
I don't know that he was ever
on the tidy detail, but with him

491
00:39:45.280 --> 00:39:51.719
as her agent, he would have
been right there, literally slowing his body

492
00:39:51.760 --> 00:39:55.119
in front of her immediately. And
I can never make sense of why he

493
00:39:55.199 --> 00:40:00.519
was on the wrong side because she's
on the left side of the amazine and

494
00:40:00.639 --> 00:40:04.360
he's on the right rear of the
follow up car. He should have been

495
00:40:04.440 --> 00:40:07.679
right behind Clint Hill, but he
wasn't, probably because he didn't know what

496
00:40:07.719 --> 00:40:12.199
the hell he was doing. He
was just along for the ride. One

497
00:40:12.239 --> 00:40:15.920
thing I give him credit for,
and fat fair, he was the person

498
00:40:15.960 --> 00:40:21.199
who drove Missus Kennedy like a bad
out of hell the night she went into

499
00:40:21.280 --> 00:40:25.239
labor prematurely and she was saying,
can't you go any faster? And this

500
00:40:25.320 --> 00:40:32.280
guy's going ninety miles an hour on
dirt roads in Hyannas And oh my god,

501
00:40:32.679 --> 00:40:37.119
you know he got he got into
the hospital right, and I'll get

502
00:40:37.159 --> 00:40:42.599
him that. But he was he
didn't even seem confident in what I saw

503
00:40:42.639 --> 00:40:45.599
on television. And that's the same. Well, that's the same. That's

504
00:40:45.639 --> 00:40:47.519
true. And even look back in
the days with the tours of the Kennedy

505
00:40:47.639 --> 00:40:51.559
detail, they did pull him out
there to have him give some of his

506
00:40:51.639 --> 00:40:57.840
story before none of this came up. Then I guarantee somebody presented him with

507
00:40:57.880 --> 00:41:00.440
the idea of the magic bullet.
At some point he was part of one

508
00:41:00.440 --> 00:41:02.840
of the big documentaries. I remember
Landis and I remember him talking about,

509
00:41:02.880 --> 00:41:07.039
you know, almost like cheering for
Clint. Go ahead, Clint, hurry

510
00:41:07.079 --> 00:41:09.679
up, hurry up, get to
the car. This kind of thing.

511
00:41:10.039 --> 00:41:15.760
Uh. Look, all I'm saying
is previous statements is which have been memorialized

512
00:41:15.800 --> 00:41:19.880
do not match this story. Now
the next thing, the only thing,

513
00:41:20.000 --> 00:41:25.679
Chuck, any previous statements would have
to include the bullet. Yeah, you

514
00:41:25.719 --> 00:41:32.639
would think if you can't get best
that, yeah, you happened, but

515
00:41:32.639 --> 00:41:37.960
I found the bullet. If you
don't include that when you do remember it,

516
00:41:38.000 --> 00:41:45.559
come on, that's fiction. Since
since that's tonight's topic. Well,

517
00:41:45.599 --> 00:41:47.239
there you go. And the the
other thing, but hold on, the

518
00:41:47.280 --> 00:41:52.000
other thing is you know they're saying
that this nurse now corroborates it because she

519
00:41:52.119 --> 00:41:55.440
saw a bullet near Kennedy's head.
Uh, you know, when he's in

520
00:41:55.480 --> 00:42:00.320
the trauma room. Okay, Now
he says he put this bullet down by

521
00:42:00.400 --> 00:42:05.159
Kennedy's feet when he's in the trauma
room while they're working on him. So

522
00:42:05.280 --> 00:42:08.199
interesting that this bullet makes it from
Kennedy's feet to Kennedy's head now to another

523
00:42:08.239 --> 00:42:14.400
stretcher somehow. Yep. Uh.
Look, he got a problem with the

524
00:42:14.440 --> 00:42:16.159
description of the bullet as well,
because it seemed to me as though he

525
00:42:16.199 --> 00:42:21.239
was describing, again as other people
have in the past, a point to

526
00:42:21.280 --> 00:42:24.559
tip bullet, which quite honestly,
the ammunition would not be something you would

527
00:42:24.559 --> 00:42:32.079
describe as having a point to tip
include the cartridge. Oh oh yeah,

528
00:42:32.159 --> 00:42:36.000
yeah, no, an unfired one. Sure, but we're talking about a

529
00:42:36.000 --> 00:42:38.519
bullet which is supposed to have been
fired, which means no cartridge. Then

530
00:42:38.880 --> 00:42:45.719
yeah, it's an inch where you
know again the two whatever centimeters two and

531
00:42:45.719 --> 00:42:51.679
a half about centimeters is an inch
approximately, you know, give or take.

532
00:42:52.039 --> 00:42:55.559
It's not two inches. But again, like you said, if it

533
00:42:55.719 --> 00:43:00.519
was an unfired round, maybe he
does get to two inches. I don't

534
00:43:00.519 --> 00:43:06.760
recall exactly, but something like that. Right, yeah, if it's unfired.

535
00:43:06.840 --> 00:43:09.280
But as as a guy carrying a
gun didn't know it was not fired,

536
00:43:09.679 --> 00:43:17.119
right, I mean, granted they
were they were scrounging for agents in

537
00:43:17.159 --> 00:43:22.639
that motorcade. The guy who was
behind Clint Hill I think it was Tim

538
00:43:22.719 --> 00:43:28.159
McIntyre. He was on loan from
the West Coast for that trick. Yep.

539
00:43:28.599 --> 00:43:31.760
The guy up on the seat with
George Hickey. The guy that next

540
00:43:31.800 --> 00:43:37.400
to him was from the Protective Research
to service where they had a million index

541
00:43:37.519 --> 00:43:42.559
cards with potential problems. When that
guy got told he was going to Texas

542
00:43:42.559 --> 00:43:45.320
to ride and motorcate, he probably
had to go looking for his revolver,

543
00:43:45.440 --> 00:43:50.920
right, because it wasn't something he
carried around with him to sort index cards

544
00:43:50.920 --> 00:43:54.159
in a private room in the basement
in a white house. But they,

545
00:43:54.360 --> 00:43:58.000
you know, they were desperate,
and there were guys and you can read

546
00:43:58.039 --> 00:44:01.679
this in some of the in some
of the accoun guys like Chuck's Barrel,

547
00:44:02.079 --> 00:44:08.840
who was always on Kennedy's motorcade.
He awakened in time to be told the

548
00:44:08.960 --> 00:44:15.800
president's been shot and he was home
in the suburbs of Washington. And of

549
00:44:15.800 --> 00:44:19.679
course, you know Caliman shouldn't have
been in the seat he was in.

550
00:44:20.199 --> 00:44:23.760
You know, that's Jerry Jerry Bain
seats and he's on vacation, right,

551
00:44:24.400 --> 00:44:29.599
what Kennedy is going to the worst
stop in the world. Well, one

552
00:44:29.719 --> 00:44:34.440
last thing too, is I would
say that somebody's memory could be questionable anyhow,

553
00:44:34.480 --> 00:44:37.440
considering if they had been part of
the contingent of Secret Service agents that

554
00:44:37.519 --> 00:44:42.239
might have been out drinking the night
before, because you know, that was

555
00:44:42.280 --> 00:44:46.480
going on until what seven am.
I o that it was that late,

556
00:44:46.519 --> 00:44:53.880
but I seemed to recall. It
seems to me I heard the time signature

557
00:44:53.920 --> 00:45:00.440
of five am and it was tied
to landis right. I'm not trying to

558
00:45:00.440 --> 00:45:05.320
tarde this guy but my recollection and
I at one time I had a print

559
00:45:05.320 --> 00:45:08.800
out. I had a print out
of the chronology, which was speed high

560
00:45:08.840 --> 00:45:14.800
when you stacked it up, and
it cost two hundred and seventy five dollars

561
00:45:14.840 --> 00:45:21.880
to ship. But it seems to
me he was out until five am.

562
00:45:21.960 --> 00:45:24.280
And you know, you can't say, well, look, I'm guarding your

563
00:45:24.280 --> 00:45:29.920
president's wife and nobody's gonna bother her. You know, clid Hill didn't know

564
00:45:29.960 --> 00:45:32.159
who he was guarding when he ran
to the car. There you go,

565
00:45:32.639 --> 00:45:37.639
and it was. Yeah. The
reason why I say seven am, because

566
00:45:37.639 --> 00:45:40.320
what time did they relieve the firefighters
that they left at the hotel in four

567
00:45:40.360 --> 00:45:46.159
works? Right, because they left
some firefighters behind the story about the firefighters.

568
00:45:46.519 --> 00:45:51.960
There were people there, but there
were Secret Service on duty at all

569
00:45:52.039 --> 00:45:59.280
times, okay, because if there
were not, I can assure you there

570
00:45:59.280 --> 00:46:04.159
would have been guy banished. They
would They would have been guarding the Emperor

571
00:46:04.159 --> 00:46:09.519
of Outer Mongolia. Yeah, but
using using some local guys, guys to

572
00:46:09.599 --> 00:46:15.000
add duty. The guys of go
off duty from the early shift, slew

573
00:46:15.639 --> 00:46:22.760
to the ranch and they were asleep. Jerry Baine was one of them.

574
00:46:22.840 --> 00:46:25.920
I think he might have been the
sack of that detail. Arthur Godfrey was

575
00:46:25.960 --> 00:46:30.880
another one. They got up and
they went right to Johnson's Ranch, which

576
00:46:30.960 --> 00:46:37.480
was the last stop on that Friday, the last projected stop, and they

577
00:46:37.480 --> 00:46:44.079
were all asleep when it happened,
because they would have gone on duty somewhere

578
00:46:44.119 --> 00:46:51.880
around late afternoon. Late afternoon.
They would have gone on duty long after

579
00:46:51.920 --> 00:46:54.960
the meeting at the Trademark and the
speech there and all that they would have

580
00:46:54.960 --> 00:47:00.400
been after all that went down.
From there, you're going back to Air

581
00:47:00.440 --> 00:47:07.559
Force one. And one of the
things I always pointed out, there's there's

582
00:47:07.679 --> 00:47:14.840
all kinds of documentation about which police
were on duty for the motorcaid where,

583
00:47:15.519 --> 00:47:19.599
you know, because they didn't have
enough cops to cover. So if you

584
00:47:19.880 --> 00:47:27.039
if you were a police motorcycle officer
and you're twelve miles out, you stopped

585
00:47:27.079 --> 00:47:34.079
traffick. When the motorcaid went by
at twelve miles an hour, you rowed

586
00:47:34.119 --> 00:47:37.920
like a bat out of help five
miles ahead and did it again, stopped

587
00:47:37.960 --> 00:47:42.280
traffick again. They were reproving they
didn't have enough. But there were assignments

588
00:47:42.320 --> 00:47:46.039
posted as to who was who and
where was where. There was no posting

589
00:47:46.280 --> 00:47:54.199
for the return motorcaid. There were
no duty assignments to get from the trademark

590
00:47:54.880 --> 00:48:01.679
to love Field. That's interesting.
Why not I'm not going to tell out

591
00:48:01.760 --> 00:48:05.599
something like that if we don't need
it. Well, there you go.

592
00:48:05.840 --> 00:48:08.719
Look, the one thing that any
cop is going to try and save on

593
00:48:08.880 --> 00:48:14.840
is having to do unnecessary paperwork,
right if they can avoid it. So

594
00:48:15.079 --> 00:48:20.199
oh anyway, but look, all
I'm trying to say is that this guy's

595
00:48:20.239 --> 00:48:24.440
statements don't match up with his previous
statements at all. Okay, And it

596
00:48:24.519 --> 00:48:29.400
seems really bizarre to me that he
never heard of C three ninety nine.

597
00:48:29.719 --> 00:48:32.519
You know, he never read the
warrant commit It sounds like, again,

598
00:48:34.440 --> 00:48:37.039
a lot of things that come together, which is funny, back to the

599
00:48:37.039 --> 00:48:43.079
fictional statements of someone else. Sounds
familiar because quite often over the years we

600
00:48:43.119 --> 00:48:49.320
have seen the development of the JVB
statements. Given that new information came out,

601
00:48:49.400 --> 00:48:51.800
and back to that thing I was
joking with you about, Oh,

602
00:48:51.920 --> 00:48:57.320
Bobby Baker, don't forget his name. Why is that popular? Because what

603
00:48:57.400 --> 00:49:00.519
was she doing? She was in
a situation where people were talking a lot

604
00:49:00.559 --> 00:49:07.360
about Johnson Bobby Baker being his bag
man. And that's true. These are

605
00:49:07.400 --> 00:49:10.320
true things. It's not as though
she uh, you know, cobbles together

606
00:49:10.559 --> 00:49:15.239
completely untrue. Yeah, go ahead. She didn't have to embroider that that

607
00:49:15.480 --> 00:49:20.280
was fact. No, that's a
fact. But it's a fact that's got

608
00:49:20.280 --> 00:49:22.880
nothing to do with her, That's
all I'm saying. You know, look,

609
00:49:22.920 --> 00:49:24.880
I could tell you that, you
know, Walt, I was somewhere

610
00:49:24.920 --> 00:49:29.559
near the events of nine to eleven
on nine to eleven. Uh, it

611
00:49:29.599 --> 00:49:34.000
doesn't mean I'm connected to the event, Okay, I mean I'm in proximity.

612
00:49:34.079 --> 00:49:37.199
So were you not too far from
where nine to eleven happened in New

613
00:49:37.280 --> 00:49:43.719
York? Yeah? You know we
well we were not. Yeah, so

614
00:49:44.400 --> 00:49:47.519
there you go. I mean I
literally tried to get on the island in

615
00:49:47.559 --> 00:49:51.199
Manhattan to go try and help people, because that was a call that went

616
00:49:51.239 --> 00:49:54.480
out locally and ended up just sending
in supplies because they had shut down the

617
00:49:54.599 --> 00:49:59.000
entire island. They had stopped the
tunnels, the bridges, everything, so

618
00:49:59.039 --> 00:50:01.519
I couldn't get from to New York. But you know, somebody could say

619
00:50:01.559 --> 00:50:06.719
that I was in proximity on that
day to those events in New York City.

620
00:50:06.840 --> 00:50:08.599
It doesn't mean it's got anything to
do with me. But I was

621
00:50:08.639 --> 00:50:14.840
in proximity. And here's the problem. The clearest day. I don't know

622
00:50:14.880 --> 00:50:19.320
if you remember it, but it
was the clearest day I could ever remember.

623
00:50:19.639 --> 00:50:22.440
Yeah, it wasn't big. If
the air had been any more clear,

624
00:50:22.519 --> 00:50:27.679
I could have recognized people that were
jumping out of windows. It was

625
00:50:28.800 --> 00:50:32.000
a nice day. I was at
work, and that was the first thing

626
00:50:32.039 --> 00:50:36.000
I took notice of being at work. The job I used to do.

627
00:50:36.039 --> 00:50:38.920
I used to work for ex On
Mobile and I worked in the retail end

628
00:50:38.960 --> 00:50:44.760
of that. And you know what, credit cards and stuff. Financial institutions

629
00:50:44.920 --> 00:50:50.719
all stopped working. There was a
malfunction in the communication immediately, and all

630
00:50:50.719 --> 00:50:52.320
of a sudden, we had stuff
that didn't work. I contacted our bank.

631
00:50:52.800 --> 00:50:57.719
Our bank said, all the systems
are down. This happened instantaneously.

632
00:50:57.800 --> 00:51:01.039
Well, this was my what in
the hell's going on? And then people

633
00:51:01.119 --> 00:51:05.079
came in Because I was in a
retail store at the time, literally my

634
00:51:05.079 --> 00:51:08.599
physical location right by. He wants
to talk proximity. I was right by

635
00:51:08.599 --> 00:51:13.639
where the Hindenberg went down, because
Lakehurst Naval Base was a stone's throw from

636
00:51:13.639 --> 00:51:16.960
one of the retail establishments. I
was at in a little town called Whiting,

637
00:51:17.199 --> 00:51:23.280
which is not far from lake Hurst. Okay, And what's that or

638
00:51:23.360 --> 00:51:28.400
Seaside Heights. Yeah, Seaside's not
far from there either, but Whiting is

639
00:51:28.440 --> 00:51:32.679
a little more inland, okay.
And yeah, lake Hurst is right there.

640
00:51:32.719 --> 00:51:37.960
Anyways, there are four there are
three military installments right there. There's

641
00:51:37.000 --> 00:51:42.639
McGuire for Dicks and lake Hurst Naval
Air Base, which is where the Hindenberg

642
00:51:42.719 --> 00:51:45.920
crashed. Okay, So that's where
I was, and yeah, I noticed

643
00:51:45.960 --> 00:51:50.679
the drop in communication and people started
coming in going a plane hit the World

644
00:51:50.719 --> 00:51:52.920
Trade Center, and I was like, okay, because it was a bunch

645
00:51:52.920 --> 00:51:57.079
of retirement villages, so there were
people at home during the day in my

646
00:51:57.199 --> 00:52:00.159
area, and a whole bunch of
senior citizens came in to tell me what

647
00:52:00.280 --> 00:52:05.280
was going on. So then I
turned on the radio to TV this and

648
00:52:05.320 --> 00:52:08.960
that, and I turned on Howard
Stern first, who was also reporting on

649
00:52:09.000 --> 00:52:12.679
it. And then I went to
New Jersey one on one point five,

650
00:52:12.760 --> 00:52:15.599
which is a fairly popular station throughout
the state of New Jersey. You're familiar,

651
00:52:15.679 --> 00:52:20.960
right, Yeah, okay, and
that's where I got my reporting from

652
00:52:20.960 --> 00:52:27.599
my initial reporting. Well, so
my birthday is the day before September ten,

653
00:52:29.360 --> 00:52:34.039
right, So that was watching Monday
Night football, the open night of

654
00:52:34.079 --> 00:52:39.599
Monday Night football with the Giants against
Oh I believe it was Denver. The

655
00:52:39.719 --> 00:52:43.679
Giants had been in the Super Bowl
year before and they had lost, but

656
00:52:43.800 --> 00:52:46.280
it was just you know, okay, So they them on Monday night and

657
00:52:46.320 --> 00:52:51.559
they were horrible. I could I
could not fall asleep. The Giants were

658
00:52:51.639 --> 00:52:53.840
so bad. So I was awake
until three four in the morning. Phone

659
00:52:53.920 --> 00:52:59.360
rings at eight thirty. It's Jay
Harrison from Texas and he says, we're

660
00:52:59.400 --> 00:53:02.840
at war. And I don't like
to say if that's impossible. My birthday

661
00:53:02.840 --> 00:53:07.079
was yesterday. Then I realized there
were people born in December sixth, nineteen

662
00:53:07.239 --> 00:53:14.239
forty one. Yeah, And then
I got I grabbed the whole of it.

663
00:53:14.239 --> 00:53:16.320
Would have been Tommy at the time, the big guy. We went

664
00:53:16.400 --> 00:53:22.679
up to Overlook Drive, which overlooks
everything, and there it was. It

665
00:53:22.719 --> 00:53:25.440
was unbelievable, and I was ready
to go down and take every dime I

666
00:53:25.480 --> 00:53:29.719
had in the bank and buy stock
in cell phones because I knew they were

667
00:53:29.800 --> 00:53:34.239
the next big thing. Suddenly,
communication well, and that was another thing

668
00:53:34.239 --> 00:53:36.920
that stopped working. By the way, in New York City, the cell

669
00:53:36.960 --> 00:53:39.880
phone stopped working. And it was
a big mess, big, huge mess.

670
00:53:40.719 --> 00:53:45.360
Well, there was all kinds of
mess in Dallas on November twenty second.

671
00:53:45.719 --> 00:53:51.639
Right, a lot of things just
suddenly shut down. But see,

672
00:53:51.679 --> 00:53:54.239
you and I are in proximity to
an event, right, You and I

673
00:53:54.239 --> 00:53:59.360
are in proximity to an event,
to a place of significance at a time.

674
00:53:59.559 --> 00:54:05.119
And that about all I can say
legitimately. I think about this character

675
00:54:05.280 --> 00:54:07.920
that you study in this book,
and why is it that I bring this

676
00:54:08.079 --> 00:54:14.199
up? Because I do believe that
she worked at Riley Coffee. I'm pretty

677
00:54:14.239 --> 00:54:20.920
sure she had a secretarial or some
sort of office clerk responsibilities to visit up

678
00:54:20.960 --> 00:54:27.039
here. You referred to her as
a brush with Yes, And I remember

679
00:54:27.079 --> 00:54:32.920
that phrase because she had a brush
with Lee Oswald somehow, Yes, And

680
00:54:35.000 --> 00:54:38.039
that phrase stuck with me. And
I mean, obviously, this is what

681
00:54:38.320 --> 00:54:43.239
ten fifteen years after the fact,
and I'm still remembering it. And I

682
00:54:43.280 --> 00:54:47.000
thought to myself one time, I
was thinking that phrase, and I thought,

683
00:54:47.639 --> 00:54:54.320
if everybody that had a brush with
Lee Oswald wrote a memoir, I

684
00:54:54.480 --> 00:55:01.519
need to expand my libraries. Yeah, yeah, because it would just be

685
00:55:01.559 --> 00:55:07.840
insane. But the thing is,
look, you might have encountered sorry some

686
00:55:08.119 --> 00:55:17.519
years ago, back back in the
nineties, Ron something wrote a memoir and

687
00:55:17.760 --> 00:55:22.400
he had a brush with it,
and he made it bigger than it was.

688
00:55:23.960 --> 00:55:28.800
And I remember he was selling copies
of his book at at some show

689
00:55:28.840 --> 00:55:32.360
one time, and I went over
asked him a few questions. Hopeless,

690
00:55:34.239 --> 00:55:38.519
hopeless. But there's the thing.
Look like I said, I'm satisfied.

691
00:55:38.599 --> 00:55:42.639
Legitimately, this is the legitimate part
of her story in my mind, is

692
00:55:42.679 --> 00:55:45.840
that she got a temp job at
Riley. So did he, and they

693
00:55:45.880 --> 00:55:52.239
were in the same company. They
might have again encountered one another somewhere.

694
00:55:52.440 --> 00:55:57.239
That might have happened, although not
necessarily during work hours, because she should

695
00:55:57.239 --> 00:56:00.440
have been in the office. He
was supposed to be what oiling machines?

696
00:56:00.159 --> 00:56:07.599
Uh you know, yeah, okay, greasing machines whatever, lubricating the machines,

697
00:56:07.000 --> 00:56:10.519
all right, Uh down in the
factory, sure, why not?

698
00:56:12.440 --> 00:56:16.000
Uh? They was there a lunch
nine and a look. She ran into

699
00:56:16.039 --> 00:56:19.800
him at some point. A lot
of people have run into a character in

700
00:56:19.880 --> 00:56:22.920
history. Do you know who I
met? We've heard these stories before,

701
00:56:22.239 --> 00:56:24.559
you know, I met one day
and they'll tell you they met a famous

702
00:56:24.559 --> 00:56:29.440
baseball player, they met an actor, they met a gangster. I happened

703
00:56:29.480 --> 00:56:31.880
to be at a store and the
quarterback of this certain team came in.

704
00:56:32.719 --> 00:56:37.639
They'll tell you stuff like that,
because yeah, sorry, I wrote up

705
00:56:37.639 --> 00:56:45.320
in an elevator with Joe Balacchi,
corner, Von Brown and Frank Field,

706
00:56:45.360 --> 00:56:47.320
who used to be a big time
when them in in New York City.

707
00:56:49.280 --> 00:56:52.039
That's you know, that's my I
mean I met Bobby Kennedy too, but

708
00:56:52.199 --> 00:56:59.880
a different story, another whole chapter. Right, Uh A lot easy to

709
00:57:00.039 --> 00:57:04.880
talk to somebody that's twelve feet tall
and he was, yeah, I think,

710
00:57:05.639 --> 00:57:08.199
yeah, I remember you describing that
to me, Like the first time

711
00:57:08.239 --> 00:57:13.079
I actually met you, you described
that to me, and it was funny

712
00:57:13.199 --> 00:57:15.039
because you were like you said something, you said, you know, I

713
00:57:15.079 --> 00:57:19.519
actually met him. I said,
okay, well I think the way you

714
00:57:19.519 --> 00:57:22.119
phrase it was I actually met Kennedy
and I went what and you went yeah,

715
00:57:22.199 --> 00:57:25.880
Bobby. I said, oh okay, and then you said, uh

716
00:57:27.000 --> 00:57:29.559
yeah, And I can tell you
that I forget what it was like beams

717
00:57:29.559 --> 00:57:31.960
of light came flowing over him and
he was, you know, twelve feet

718
00:57:32.000 --> 00:57:37.079
tall. Oh I was. I
was knocked over with the charisma. It

719
00:57:37.159 --> 00:57:43.880
was just waves. So but look, the thing is, though you encountered

720
00:57:43.920 --> 00:57:46.079
them, and people can have a
brush with somebody, and I think at

721
00:57:46.119 --> 00:57:51.880
some point, she was watching TV
somewhere or had you know, caught some

722
00:57:52.000 --> 00:57:54.239
documentary, or maybe she was watching
I don't know, Leonard Nimoy's in search

723
00:57:54.320 --> 00:57:59.599
of who Knows, and she saw
Oswald and went, wait a minute,

724
00:57:59.840 --> 00:58:05.119
I think I encountered that guy.
And I think this is where her what

725
00:58:05.239 --> 00:58:09.719
I call fan fiction began. And
I think she discovered a lot of books

726
00:58:09.719 --> 00:58:14.000
out there about the assassination. Then
they were all on the best seller list

727
00:58:14.039 --> 00:58:16.400
at one time or another, and
that would have been the case when she

728
00:58:16.440 --> 00:58:20.800
started working on it. Uh.
Not to mention, by the way,

729
00:58:20.800 --> 00:58:23.679
that there was a book out there
originally that had nothing to do with this

730
00:58:23.679 --> 00:58:29.559
whole cancer weapon plot and everything else. Uh you know that sort of described

731
00:58:29.599 --> 00:58:31.480
this romance. I think it was
nineteen ninety nine that might have came out

732
00:58:31.519 --> 00:58:43.000
about something like that anyway before me
and late hers with him. Yeah,

733
00:58:43.039 --> 00:58:49.119
okay, I'm I'm not picking up
on that one. But look, I'm

734
00:58:49.800 --> 00:58:53.000
after a while just fire well.
But but well, here's the thing.

735
00:58:53.480 --> 00:58:57.760
After a while, and I recall
the room just off your living room that

736
00:58:57.840 --> 00:59:00.320
was, you know, loaded from
Florida ceiling with books, and when you

737
00:59:00.360 --> 00:59:05.599
were done with the chronology, I
was there to year that you had everybody

738
00:59:05.599 --> 00:59:07.719
come in and you said, look, you guys want any of this stuff,

739
00:59:07.920 --> 00:59:10.239
take it off my hands. Uh, And you were, you know,

740
00:59:12.199 --> 00:59:15.519
just please let me empty this room
because you had floor to ceiling everything

741
00:59:15.519 --> 00:59:20.440
in there from the original three hundred
page report, you know, which was

742
00:59:20.519 --> 00:59:22.599
in five volumes, you know,
from the FBI. I think, uh,

743
00:59:22.840 --> 00:59:27.159
to god knows who's books on this
and that, I mean good ones,

744
00:59:27.199 --> 00:59:30.440
bad ones? You name it all
up and down in this one room.

745
00:59:30.719 --> 00:59:36.800
Who's who's report? The gambling report? Yeah, gambling I was referring

746
00:59:36.800 --> 00:59:39.440
to write. You had a printed
version of that on your shelf. That's

747
00:59:39.480 --> 00:59:49.800
another Your listeners may have no awareness
of the story. That was an absolute

748
00:59:49.920 --> 01:00:00.079
governmental fraud. Intended to sell the
story because you know the FBI DIA the

749
01:00:00.119 --> 01:00:05.880
gambling report, it's five volumes.
When somebody says five volumes, you think,

750
01:00:06.679 --> 01:00:15.880
you know the Encyclopedia Britannica and back
then and the five volumes back if

751
01:00:15.920 --> 01:00:21.519
you if you type them single space
on our normal word document, they would

752
01:00:21.519 --> 01:00:30.119
fill sixty pages and the end of
it, the last part would have been

753
01:00:30.119 --> 01:00:36.639
filled up with the I mean pages, page after page were taken up with

754
01:00:36.760 --> 01:00:39.679
statements that this case will be open
for all times, which it is.

755
01:00:44.239 --> 01:00:45.039
You know, we're going to get
to the bottom. I mean, there

756
01:00:45.119 --> 01:00:51.400
was there were disclaimers that again took
up space, you know, not unlike

757
01:00:51.519 --> 01:00:59.679
Larry Crayford's testimony why not you know, or roof Pain's nonsense. They never

758
01:00:59.719 --> 01:01:05.760
asked a half of the questions that
should have been asked. But I wasn't

759
01:01:05.880 --> 01:01:08.360
doing the question. Yeah, no, of course not. But look,

760
01:01:08.440 --> 01:01:13.239
we've been had this for almost an
hour and uh and and I and I

761
01:01:13.360 --> 01:01:17.519
really appreciate you taking this time,
especially because you've been over this a bunch

762
01:01:17.519 --> 01:01:22.599
of times. I'm just trying to
point out that, I mean, basically,

763
01:01:22.639 --> 01:01:24.239
at a certain point there you had
read everything there was to read,

764
01:01:24.320 --> 01:01:30.360
and you wrote something that again you
know, there there's two thousand pages of

765
01:01:30.440 --> 01:01:38.639
what uh index to your chronology.
That chronology itself is thirty thousand, right,

766
01:01:38.760 --> 01:01:43.920
so you know, two thousand pages
though, which is again the length

767
01:01:44.000 --> 01:01:47.079
of that ridiculous thing that Vince Bugliosi
put out, which I'm one of the

768
01:01:47.119 --> 01:01:50.559
few people that I know. It
took me a while though, because I

769
01:01:50.639 --> 01:01:52.960
kept falling asleep trying to read this
thing. Uh, you know, I

770
01:01:52.960 --> 01:01:58.360
actually went through the whole thing and
the disk. And I can't find anybody

771
01:01:58.400 --> 01:02:01.639
else who admits public lead that they
didn't read at all. But I can't

772
01:02:01.679 --> 01:02:07.280
find any why you said they read
it all? My story? He called

773
01:02:07.320 --> 01:02:15.960
me, Vince Boyosi called me,
and he wanted my address so he can

774
01:02:15.000 --> 01:02:19.480
send me a copy of the book. I don't know if I should do

775
01:02:19.519 --> 01:02:23.840
it, because I think you and
your your staff on the on your newsletter,

776
01:02:24.199 --> 01:02:29.800
I'm going to tear it apart,
I said staff. But he's talking

777
01:02:29.840 --> 01:02:35.800
about he thought he thought there were
fifteen thousand people getting the quarterly, when

778
01:02:35.840 --> 01:02:39.639
the never never more than three hundred, and that was this one little burst

779
01:02:39.960 --> 01:02:45.360
of three hundred. But he eventually
sent it to me and it showed up

780
01:02:45.400 --> 01:02:51.719
in this grimy mailing bag. And
when when ups product, what the heck

781
01:02:51.800 --> 01:02:54.440
is this? Oh, that's Boiosi's
book. I put it under the table

782
01:02:54.559 --> 01:02:59.400
on on my front deck. I
had a little TV table out there,

783
01:03:00.039 --> 01:03:01.199
and it's doing. It sat there, and it sat there and it got

784
01:03:01.239 --> 01:03:06.119
more grimy. Eventually I brought it
in the house, going the bag,

785
01:03:06.880 --> 01:03:12.920
I put it on eBay or Amazon. Grimy comes in the grimy bag I

786
01:03:13.000 --> 01:03:15.599
received in it. The book is
new. The bag is grimy, and

787
01:03:15.639 --> 01:03:20.920
it's all somebody paid dirty bucks for
it. I got to read it,

788
01:03:21.039 --> 01:03:27.480
but I did use it. I
was with Haraldo Rivera on the fiftieth anniversary

789
01:03:27.760 --> 01:03:32.119
in twenty thirteen for two hours,
and I knew he was going to come

790
01:03:32.159 --> 01:03:38.519
at me, you know, with
you know, all cylinders firing. And

791
01:03:38.559 --> 01:03:45.639
he said something like, all right, so I'm going to ask you what

792
01:03:46.039 --> 01:03:54.079
you got out of all of this. So he introduced me vaguely, and

793
01:03:54.119 --> 01:03:57.480
I said, I want to thank
you for having me, because you had

794
01:03:57.559 --> 01:04:00.239
the guy on that wrote the little
that little book. He said, what

795
01:04:00.440 --> 01:04:06.000
little book? I said, Boiosi. That book was two thousand pages.

796
01:04:08.159 --> 01:04:13.159
He said, yeah, and my
chronology was thirty two thousand. And he's

797
01:04:12.880 --> 01:04:17.800
that his producer is pointing to the
script that he's we're y're supposed to be

798
01:04:17.800 --> 01:04:25.760
reading from two. Oh my god. Well that's thing that changed the whole

799
01:04:25.880 --> 01:04:30.679
dynamic. And you know, actually
we found agreement on a lot of things.

800
01:04:33.559 --> 01:04:39.280
He didn't subscribe to the quarterly though, but that's okay, look on

801
01:04:39.320 --> 01:04:43.280
board. But I love that he
thinks you had a staff because it was

802
01:04:43.360 --> 01:04:46.519
hilarious. Won't used to print out
exactly the number because I've asked him several

803
01:04:46.519 --> 01:04:49.800
times. You got an extra one
laying around over the years. He doesn't

804
01:04:49.880 --> 01:04:56.400
because he printed out exactly as many
as he needed. Okay, I don't

805
01:04:56.400 --> 01:05:00.800
even have you don't even have copies, right, and the computers, some

806
01:05:00.840 --> 01:05:06.239
of them were printed on Wong gone. Yeah, that's just a memory.

807
01:05:06.320 --> 01:05:11.159
But they were fun to do and
the people. I got to say,

808
01:05:11.599 --> 01:05:18.400
the people were wonderful people. I
mean I made friendships through that quarterly Wow

809
01:05:20.639 --> 01:05:27.199
to this day, to this day, a decent number not enough, perhaps,

810
01:05:27.320 --> 01:05:32.039
but a decent number of them read
my mysteries now and it's just Walt.

811
01:05:32.039 --> 01:05:34.039
When the next one comes out,
nailed to me, I'll sign you

812
01:05:34.199 --> 01:05:40.480
check as the deal. Oh there
you go, you know. Oh,

813
01:05:40.679 --> 01:05:45.280
I hope you get to sell a
lot of the Judith Baker books when you're

814
01:05:45.320 --> 01:05:50.519
in Dallas. If you run out, please give give out my email I

815
01:05:50.519 --> 01:05:55.360
address. I also have twenty copies
of Warrant Emissions still sitting here. I

816
01:05:55.440 --> 01:06:01.199
sold one today, and of course
the chronology on CD it's here, right.

817
01:06:01.280 --> 01:06:03.840
I love the Warrant Omission. By
the way. That's that if you

818
01:06:04.320 --> 01:06:09.239
search online it's the red covered book. And you still have the hardcover books,

819
01:06:09.280 --> 01:06:14.079
right, yeah, yeah, yeah, right. So I just want

820
01:06:14.079 --> 01:06:16.199
to make sure you look. And
I would be more than happy if people

821
01:06:16.239 --> 01:06:20.239
bought that. I think it is
eye opening again. Uh, you know

822
01:06:20.679 --> 01:06:24.920
this is where I literally get the
phrase from. You know it should have

823
01:06:24.960 --> 01:06:30.559
called it the Dullest Commission because of
Walt's study of the Warrant Commission there.

824
01:06:30.079 --> 01:06:35.400
Uh in the Warrant Oh mission?
Okay, great book. Also the Kennedy

825
01:06:35.480 --> 01:06:41.320
Execution. Gotta say, you know, the opening part of the Kennedy Execution

826
01:06:42.119 --> 01:06:45.159
is one of those things that if
you do read it and you are paying

827
01:06:45.159 --> 01:06:48.760
attention and you don't fly right by
it, it tells you a lot in

828
01:06:48.800 --> 01:06:55.039
the opening of that book. I'm
not gonna say what. I'm not gonna

829
01:06:55.079 --> 01:06:58.119
say why, but I'm telling you
now it's one of those things that needed

830
01:06:58.119 --> 01:07:02.559
to be said and had not been
had previously. It will be a learning

831
01:07:02.599 --> 01:07:08.480
experience for readers, Yes, absolutely, And look, you want learning experience,

832
01:07:08.519 --> 01:07:11.199
You want to really delve into this, you want to get lost.

833
01:07:11.800 --> 01:07:15.480
I still have yet to read the
entire chronology. I have gone back to

834
01:07:15.519 --> 01:07:18.119
it and I've had to go back
over parts, and I've looked to it

835
01:07:18.159 --> 01:07:21.119
as a reference, and it is
a reference, but it's not just a

836
01:07:21.199 --> 01:07:26.440
reference. Okay, you do have
You probably still have some of those other

837
01:07:26.440 --> 01:07:30.519
CD ROMs too. A lot of
people not even using CDs anymore. Ball

838
01:07:30.639 --> 01:07:34.199
you know, I mean times keep
changing. Uh you know you talked about

839
01:07:34.239 --> 01:07:36.559
the computers. I'll tell you what
was really funny. It's for a while

840
01:07:36.599 --> 01:07:43.119
there he decided they wanted to write
the the chronology on one type of computer.

841
01:07:43.199 --> 01:07:45.800
He bought a couple of them and
stuck him in the closet, and

842
01:07:45.880 --> 01:07:47.440
that way, when he wore one
out, he could just transfer over to

843
01:07:47.480 --> 01:07:55.719
the next. Uh. That's a
true story. And yeah, I used

844
01:07:55.760 --> 01:07:58.039
to love it though. Any day
I would call you. I don't know

845
01:07:58.039 --> 01:08:00.880
if you realize this, but whatever
day it was, our conversations would always

846
01:08:00.880 --> 01:08:05.119
open with you telling me about what
happened that day, whatever the date was,

847
01:08:05.840 --> 01:08:11.039
uh years ago today, I was
a day I came home from the

848
01:08:11.119 --> 01:08:15.880
last vacation I took September eighteenth,
twenty eighteen. So it's been five years

849
01:08:15.880 --> 01:08:17.680
since I've been out of here,
thanks to you know who laying on the

850
01:08:17.720 --> 01:08:24.800
floor here. But I've always stayed
with dates, always always stayed with dates.

851
01:08:26.000 --> 01:08:30.560
Uh. They just I've done a
chronology. I did a chronology in

852
01:08:30.640 --> 01:08:34.479
World War Two on the Eastern Front. I mean that was that was a

853
01:08:34.560 --> 01:08:38.760
task. I did a chronology on
the Yankees from the day I was born

854
01:08:38.840 --> 01:08:44.600
for fifty years forward. It's fun
to do for me, right, And

855
01:08:44.680 --> 01:08:47.760
you've done a lot of a little
bit tedious, but I try to make

856
01:08:47.800 --> 01:08:54.439
it educational and fun, right,
So you you know, and and even

857
01:08:54.800 --> 01:08:58.159
look, you've read, you've written
a lot of things on a bunch of

858
01:08:58.199 --> 01:09:01.000
pieces of history. The Kennedy thing
is one thing that really took up your

859
01:09:01.039 --> 01:09:03.880
life for quite a while because every
day you were working on that chronology.

860
01:09:04.000 --> 01:09:09.840
But there's a variety of things you
can find under Walt Brown's name. Look,

861
01:09:09.880 --> 01:09:12.079
if you don't want to get into
the Kennedy thing, that's fine.

862
01:09:12.159 --> 01:09:15.640
How about mysteries and you know a
little bit of fiction that might have some

863
01:09:15.720 --> 01:09:18.720
interesting hints at stuff that he might
have spent some of his time on.

864
01:09:19.680 --> 01:09:24.960
In that fiction. What is the
Mickey Mantle Mystery was the one that stood

865
01:09:24.960 --> 01:09:28.479
out to me. It's got the
baseball card on the front cover. I

866
01:09:28.520 --> 01:09:34.159
think that was the second in the
series, and since then there's been eleven

867
01:09:34.640 --> 01:09:40.960
more published, and I'm working on
the last one that was published. The

868
01:09:41.199 --> 01:09:49.840
title was Pore Derbs r Pore Derbs
nice. It was about a high tech

869
01:09:51.680 --> 01:09:58.640
business establishment. But that's fun,
that makes sense, that makes sense.

870
01:09:58.680 --> 01:10:00.079
Look, and that's for fun.
But if you want to get into some

871
01:10:00.159 --> 01:10:04.159
other stuff where you want to again
the fact checking, the checking on reality

872
01:10:04.319 --> 01:10:08.640
versus somebody's story. And in her
own words, Judith Berry Baker, in

873
01:10:08.680 --> 01:10:12.119
her own words, I am gonna
have copies of it available when I go

874
01:10:12.159 --> 01:10:15.720
to Dallas, and I'll tell you
something. Even if you guys want one

875
01:10:15.760 --> 01:10:18.239
before then, contact me. I'll
figure out a way. If I got

876
01:10:18.239 --> 01:10:23.159
to send you my copy, I
will whatever. I'll get it to you

877
01:10:23.760 --> 01:10:28.960
and in Dallas tell you what I
might be able to I don't know.

878
01:10:29.079 --> 01:10:31.560
Include some other stuff along with that
book. Give you a present along with

879
01:10:31.600 --> 01:10:36.000
Walt's book. I want you to
read this book because if you're interested in

880
01:10:36.000 --> 01:10:41.000
this case and you see how people
are taking her seriously, you gotta know

881
01:10:41.159 --> 01:10:44.600
that they got to stop. It's
got to come to an end, because

882
01:10:44.600 --> 01:10:49.760
it's ridiculous. You know, we
got enough problems sorting through whatever happened to

883
01:10:50.000 --> 01:10:55.319
this secret service guy's memory. That
guy's memory. Who knows is it?

884
01:10:56.000 --> 01:10:59.000
You know? Is it malicious in
nature? When the guy's changing his statements.

885
01:10:59.039 --> 01:11:01.840
I'm not saying that, but it
doesn't help us, okay, And

886
01:11:01.920 --> 01:11:05.239
none of this stuff is going to
help us if we're concentrating on fan fiction.

887
01:11:05.319 --> 01:11:09.840
I mean, if you want to
read fiction about the Kennedy assassination,

888
01:11:09.880 --> 01:11:14.479
I'm not going to recommend Stephen King's
pilot garbage. I hated that, you

889
01:11:14.520 --> 01:11:18.039
know, but there are other fictional
things out there about Kennedy if you want,

890
01:11:18.119 --> 01:11:20.800
you want to get into that,
sure, how about virtual JFK.

891
01:11:20.960 --> 01:11:26.119
If Kennedy had lived, what would
have happened? Really? You know,

892
01:11:26.960 --> 01:11:30.479
you want to get into stuff like
that. Cool? Great, But you

893
01:11:30.520 --> 01:11:34.680
know, recognize the trial of Oswald. Well see, now there's where I

894
01:11:34.720 --> 01:11:38.399
was going to go next, because
that was actually your first That was your

895
01:11:38.399 --> 01:11:44.239
first work on this, wasn't it. Yep? Yeah, which good as

896
01:11:44.279 --> 01:11:47.600
it may seem. I did that
for closure. I just said, I'm

897
01:11:47.640 --> 01:11:51.439
gonna sit down, I'm gonna write
the trial, see how it plays out,

898
01:11:53.079 --> 01:11:56.800
and then I'm done. I can
stop reading. Okay. I read

899
01:11:58.439 --> 01:12:02.520
listens seven. I read that six
times. That's that's how bad it got.

900
01:12:04.920 --> 01:12:10.119
And people read was supposed to be
the last one. They're the only

901
01:12:10.119 --> 01:12:14.319
one closure, And I can do
something else. And you know you've mentioned

902
01:12:14.359 --> 01:12:17.560
about when you called and I was
working on a chronology that was seven and

903
01:12:17.640 --> 01:12:21.640
a half years of work, right, and during those seven and a half

904
01:12:21.720 --> 01:12:25.800
years, and he conclude a mass
when it's about twenty four hundred days.

905
01:12:25.800 --> 01:12:32.000
I suppose I took forty days off. That's it, because everything that was

906
01:12:32.079 --> 01:12:39.720
there had to be fresh. Was
when I read a statement by X that

907
01:12:39.720 --> 01:12:45.880
that might have corroborated something that WHY
said or contradicted something that Z said,

908
01:12:45.560 --> 01:12:49.680
and I had to I had to
go to both of those. I had

909
01:12:49.680 --> 01:12:56.399
to from X to Y and next
to Z. And it was challenging.

910
01:12:57.039 --> 01:13:02.079
And I had taken a day off, forty days off at seven and a

911
01:13:02.119 --> 01:13:06.960
half years, right, put in
hours on that computer. Ill, like

912
01:13:08.000 --> 01:13:10.960
you said, I worem out,
Yeah, And look, I wasn't even

913
01:13:11.039 --> 01:13:13.560
doing any of the work, Okay. I saw some of the work as

914
01:13:13.600 --> 01:13:15.479
you were working on and occasionally again
when I would stop by your house for

915
01:13:15.520 --> 01:13:19.199
whatever reason, and we didn't live
close, so it was not something I

916
01:13:19.199 --> 01:13:21.640
couldn't stop by there all the time. I would have if I could have,

917
01:13:21.760 --> 01:13:29.720
but usually around November, around the
assassination weekend in there somewhere I would

918
01:13:29.760 --> 01:13:32.560
stop by and a couple other times
maybe too, but either way, you

919
01:13:32.640 --> 01:13:38.600
show me some stuff. Whatever it
was, it felt like ten years to

920
01:13:38.640 --> 01:13:41.000
me and I wasn't even doing the
work. I mean, hell, that

921
01:13:41.079 --> 01:13:45.880
was a long piece of work you
did there. You know. I want

922
01:13:45.880 --> 01:13:48.319
to give out out to Brian Erney. He was the guys who would have

923
01:13:48.359 --> 01:13:56.039
met and does get together. Yeah. He was the one that said take

924
01:13:56.079 --> 01:13:58.800
a break and start indexing it.
An eight months later, I was done

925
01:13:58.840 --> 01:14:04.239
indexing. I had Brian died five
years ago and it was just a horrible

926
01:14:04.279 --> 01:14:10.239
moment when it happened. And I
miss him every day. You know.

927
01:14:10.359 --> 01:14:15.880
He's one of those people that you
know, like John Kennedy, Bobby Kennedy,

928
01:14:15.479 --> 01:14:19.560
Brian. You miss him every day. No, I remember Brian.

929
01:14:19.640 --> 01:14:25.319
I remember Dale. I remember you
know. There was this lady that was

930
01:14:25.359 --> 01:14:28.279
writing a piece for the New York
Times. I can't remember her name.

931
01:14:28.960 --> 01:14:31.199
Uh. You know, there were
different people that were there at different times.

932
01:14:31.920 --> 01:14:34.560
Dale was here last Sunday for my
birthday. Oh there you go.

933
01:14:35.479 --> 01:14:40.479
He still comes here four times.
He had Dale happen from the Albany area,

934
01:14:41.039 --> 01:14:47.000
who's a an excellent student of the
case and he's very generous. You

935
01:14:47.000 --> 01:14:50.560
know if he finds a book he
likes him by five of them, give

936
01:14:50.640 --> 01:14:53.600
him to his friends here, read
this, read this, read this.

937
01:14:54.600 --> 01:14:57.079
Uh yeah, he's a nice gay. You know. One time he offered

938
01:14:57.079 --> 01:14:59.840
to give me a computer. I
know I used to give. I gave

939
01:15:00.000 --> 01:15:01.279
books out when I would go to
your house. Sometimes I would drop a

940
01:15:01.279 --> 01:15:04.640
box of books on your table and
say, yeah, you know, you

941
01:15:04.680 --> 01:15:09.079
guys missing any of these? You
need one of these. I because I

942
01:15:09.079 --> 01:15:12.199
would have extras, you know,
I'd pick up stuff from a library,

943
01:15:12.279 --> 01:15:14.560
sales or whatever. I pick it
up cheap, and I'd say, well,

944
01:15:14.600 --> 01:15:16.119
look, you know, let's we
all know we're going to invest hundreds

945
01:15:16.159 --> 01:15:19.600
of dollars a year in books,
in whatever it is we can get our

946
01:15:19.600 --> 01:15:23.399
hands on. Let me try and
bring a few around, and I would

947
01:15:23.399 --> 01:15:26.720
just give them to people you know
that I knew would put them to use.

948
01:15:27.720 --> 01:15:30.439
I only gave you one book,
I think one time I had something.

949
01:15:30.439 --> 01:15:31.199
You were like, wait a minute, I don't have that one anymore,

950
01:15:31.720 --> 01:15:38.800
And but that was it, like
one books giving up what you were

951
01:15:38.840 --> 01:15:45.479
just talking about. Your listeners might
not realize, but the people who are

952
01:15:45.520 --> 01:15:50.960
at the core of getting to the
bottom of what happened have made massive sacrifices

953
01:15:51.960 --> 01:15:56.680
in terms of time, in terms
of family, in terms of cost.

954
01:15:58.279 --> 01:16:00.800
Yeah, the medical guys are making
tons of money to begin with. But

955
01:16:00.960 --> 01:16:09.680
still yeah, still, I you
know, people became known as Kennedy widows

956
01:16:09.680 --> 01:16:13.520
because you know, the wives just
couldn't take You're going to Dallas again,

957
01:16:13.560 --> 01:16:17.439
You're going here, going there?
But you know I went to I gave

958
01:16:17.520 --> 01:16:27.920
two keynotes in Europe wounder full events
but expensive, right, and you know

959
01:16:28.000 --> 01:16:32.199
you don't have two piles of vacation
money. You have one, and I'm

960
01:16:32.319 --> 01:16:38.279
using it to speak in Liverpool.
I'm not going to Disney or something like

961
01:16:38.319 --> 01:16:45.199
that. And the people that are
legit, not not the not the imitators

962
01:16:45.640 --> 01:16:50.439
or the phonies or the people to
see things and photographs that aren't there,

963
01:16:51.279 --> 01:16:56.039
but the real legitimate people who've been
at a long time. I mean I

964
01:16:56.119 --> 01:17:02.399
put in thirty years and that was
plenty. Uh. They may the sacrifice

965
01:17:02.479 --> 01:17:12.840
is massive, absolutely massive, and
they're still at it and some of them

966
01:17:12.880 --> 01:17:15.159
are are older than my seventy six
years and I don't know how they do

967
01:17:15.159 --> 01:17:20.319
it, but to do it,
there's a variety of people. And yeah,

968
01:17:20.359 --> 01:17:23.840
there is a great deal of sacrifice
that goes in. And it's not

969
01:17:23.920 --> 01:17:27.520
just in time and money, but
like you said, in relationships, who's

970
01:17:27.520 --> 01:17:31.079
gonna put up with you if they're
not mutually interested in this right on a

971
01:17:31.199 --> 01:17:38.439
daily basis? You know? Uh, and that's true. Look I mentioned

972
01:17:38.520 --> 01:17:40.680
and I was going to bring this
up. And since you kind of brought

973
01:17:40.720 --> 01:17:43.560
up the relationships angle of it,
you know, I brought Yeah, two

974
01:17:43.560 --> 01:17:45.159
women I brought with me to go
see Walt, and usually I would go

975
01:17:45.199 --> 01:17:49.119
by myself for a reason, uh, you know, because they would just

976
01:17:49.159 --> 01:17:53.600
sit there their head spinning. We
would sit there and have these discussions.

977
01:17:53.640 --> 01:17:57.159
We're having the discussions after the work. This isn't the work. This is

978
01:17:57.199 --> 01:18:00.439
just the Hey, let's commiserate over
what it is. As we had to

979
01:18:00.439 --> 01:18:03.000
suffer through. I had to read
this. Yeah, I was digging through

980
01:18:03.039 --> 01:18:06.319
that. Have you been through this
pile of photographs? Sure? Have you

981
01:18:06.399 --> 01:18:11.840
been through these documents? Yes?
I mean and and somebody who was not

982
01:18:12.000 --> 01:18:16.439
engaged in that, it's insufferable.
Oh, absolutely, you know we went

983
01:18:16.479 --> 01:18:23.079
on our right. No, this
wasn't a bunch event. This was from

984
01:18:23.119 --> 01:18:26.079
when you got there to when you
left. And nobody ever looked at their

985
01:18:26.119 --> 01:18:30.279
watch at seven at night. I
remember one time I got there at about

986
01:18:30.319 --> 01:18:32.960
noon, and I'm sure I didn't
leave there before nine, you know what

987
01:18:33.000 --> 01:18:40.159
I mean just talking to you the
whole time. Pretty much everybody else kind

988
01:18:40.159 --> 01:18:46.000
of it were it were just wonderful
people who gave the time, uh you

989
01:18:46.039 --> 01:18:50.319
know, you know, showed up, put into time, and and their

990
01:18:51.640 --> 01:18:58.960
their input was always sought right well. I you know, I always wanted

991
01:18:58.960 --> 01:19:01.720
to know what new question people had, especially oh you know when when you

992
01:19:01.840 --> 01:19:03.960
hear so. I always thought it
was great when it was like I only

993
01:19:04.000 --> 01:19:08.520
got into this last year, and
I'd go, oh great, what is

994
01:19:08.520 --> 01:19:12.119
it that that interests you? What
is it that's catching your attention? Already?

995
01:19:12.159 --> 01:19:15.319
You're fresh? You know, what
is the new thing for you?

996
01:19:16.319 --> 01:19:19.520
I used to love that, you
know. But uh, but the veteran

997
01:19:19.520 --> 01:19:21.560
guys, of course, like I
said, check this off your list.

998
01:19:21.640 --> 01:19:25.119
You have you been through these books? Have you been through that? Did

999
01:19:25.159 --> 01:19:27.760
you already go here? Did you
already go there? Have you been to

1000
01:19:27.800 --> 01:19:31.359
New Orleans yourself? You know,
I mean you're somebody who actually went to

1001
01:19:31.720 --> 01:19:39.800
Russia. But you know that's another
story, man. There is just so

1002
01:19:39.920 --> 01:19:42.800
much to it. But anyway,
I really want people to read this.

1003
01:19:42.880 --> 01:19:46.039
Judith very Baker book. There's a
lot more to Waltz writing his history everything.

1004
01:19:46.039 --> 01:19:48.560
Of course, obviously you get a
hint of it here. I mean

1005
01:19:48.640 --> 01:19:53.920
chronologies on World War Two, chronologies
on the Kennedy case, chronologies, yes,

1006
01:19:54.000 --> 01:19:58.039
indeed, hey, mysteries. Uh, and how many books? Actually,

1007
01:19:58.319 --> 01:20:00.840
I mean if we count the chronology
as one book, let's just say,

1008
01:20:00.880 --> 01:20:03.640
even though that's not fair and it's
uh, I got a CD rom

1009
01:20:03.680 --> 01:20:06.880
of it right behind me over here. Yeah, I'm doing that for you

1010
01:20:06.920 --> 01:20:13.319
guys listening at home because we're not
on video tonight. But anyway, I've

1011
01:20:13.359 --> 01:20:15.920
got one behind me. But if
we were to say, let's see,

1012
01:20:15.920 --> 01:20:17.319
how many books do you have?
You got the People v. Oswald,

1013
01:20:17.319 --> 01:20:20.600
which by the way, is much
better than the TV show they put out

1014
01:20:20.600 --> 01:20:26.520
a few years before that. Really, I did not like the TV show.

1015
01:20:26.760 --> 01:20:30.640
You ever see the TV thing?
Yes? Yeah, okay, but

1016
01:20:30.960 --> 01:20:34.520
Walt's book is better. Okay,
but it is of course fictionalized because Oswald

1017
01:20:34.600 --> 01:20:38.680
never got a trial. Okay.
Like I said, there's fiction on the

1018
01:20:38.760 --> 01:20:42.279
Kennedy case you should read. I
think it's pretty good. It's thought provoking.

1019
01:20:42.279 --> 01:20:45.760
It's interesting to imagine what would have
happened, what could have happened,

1020
01:20:45.760 --> 01:20:50.079
what should have happened. But let's
now go into the other fiction, because

1021
01:20:50.159 --> 01:20:54.000
unfortunately we got to clear a lot
of that stuff away. I mean,

1022
01:20:54.079 --> 01:20:58.000
Walt, it never ends with the
did the Secret Service agent shoot him from

1023
01:20:58.000 --> 01:21:01.279
the front seat Annie Oakley style?
You know, it never ends with the

1024
01:21:01.760 --> 01:21:06.119
hey, maybe he faked his death. You know, I'm I'm often curious

1025
01:21:06.199 --> 01:21:10.640
at how it is they're saying that, actually Kennedy became Jimmy Carter. Did

1026
01:21:10.640 --> 01:21:14.640
you know that one? I'm sure
you did. Okay, Yeah, JFK

1027
01:21:14.840 --> 01:21:16.960
went back into the presidency as Jimmy
Carter. Look you can see on the

1028
01:21:17.000 --> 01:21:23.000
pictures they kind of look the same. Yeah, this is the craziness that

1029
01:21:23.039 --> 01:21:26.920
we get, all right, And
yeah, cancer weapons and no, he

1030
01:21:26.960 --> 01:21:30.880
actually was going to disclose aliens.
They killed him because he smoked pot.

1031
01:21:30.920 --> 01:21:33.840
They killed him because he slept with
the wrong woman. Now that's almost plausible,

1032
01:21:34.000 --> 01:21:41.199
but not necessarily as plausible as they
like to make it, because man,

1033
01:21:41.239 --> 01:21:43.880
when did this guy have time to
run the country with all of his

1034
01:21:44.039 --> 01:21:48.079
escapades? All right, Look,
there's real information that can be gotten.

1035
01:21:48.199 --> 01:21:51.880
There's entertainment, of course, and
you can read the National Inquirer and sometimes

1036
01:21:53.439 --> 01:21:58.479
they publish interesting stuff, But for
the most part. Fan fiction is only

1037
01:21:58.520 --> 01:22:01.720
helpful if you understand and that it's
fan fiction. And Judith Berry Baker,

1038
01:22:01.800 --> 01:22:06.159
in her own words again, uh, provides you with a really quick way.

1039
01:22:06.239 --> 01:22:11.600
It's not even a thick book or
anything. It's it's not super challenging,

1040
01:22:11.680 --> 01:22:16.439
although you have to have familiarity unfortunately
with her story a bit. And

1041
01:22:16.640 --> 01:22:18.920
uh, you know, how about
some known realities. Yeah, go ahead,

1042
01:22:19.720 --> 01:22:25.560
it's footnote it all the way along. Yes, indeed, Batte,

1043
01:22:27.800 --> 01:22:30.760
Yeah, no footnotes all the way
through, but all your work is out

1044
01:22:30.760 --> 01:22:35.560
there. Yeah, challenge but anyway, well, i'll give you the final

1045
01:22:35.600 --> 01:22:39.439
word on this. We'll close it
out because now we're getting toward what we

1046
01:22:39.479 --> 01:22:42.600
had an hour and twenty minutes here, and I'm sorry I kept you so

1047
01:22:42.680 --> 01:22:45.279
long. But look, we can
sit back, we can reminisce and have

1048
01:22:45.359 --> 01:22:48.119
fun with a lot of stuff if
you want. But we'll get into other

1049
01:22:48.159 --> 01:22:54.960
discussions in the future. Yeah,
we're gonna have to do it, absolutely,

1050
01:22:55.119 --> 01:22:59.640
we'll do it again before November.
Maybe we'll focus on some more productive

1051
01:22:59.680 --> 01:23:02.159
things. And and look, I'm
not saying that Walt's book is not productive.

1052
01:23:02.199 --> 01:23:06.399
It is. It'll allow you to
clear something away again in the same

1053
01:23:06.520 --> 01:23:11.720
range as well. You know,
how about the cowboy that killed him?

1054
01:23:12.239 --> 01:23:15.760
How about you know James Files?
You know he got out of prison and

1055
01:23:15.880 --> 01:23:18.520
I haven't heard from him. Have
you heard from James Files anywhere? New

1056
01:23:19.119 --> 01:23:27.560
It's addition subtraction. Well, anyway, Judith Verry Baker, in her own

1057
01:23:27.600 --> 01:23:30.239
words, Walt Brown is the author
of that book, although Judy kind of

1058
01:23:30.279 --> 01:23:33.039
authors it two because he had to
include her words, right, he had

1059
01:23:33.039 --> 01:23:42.880
to quote her, so PhD edited
correct her thoughts. So what would you

1060
01:23:42.880 --> 01:23:49.000
like to say in closing here,
Walt bro I hope she doesn't take it

1061
01:23:49.079 --> 01:23:54.439
personally if she wants to read through
my stuff and be critical Maki. So

1062
01:23:55.600 --> 01:24:01.680
I'm sure she can find something.
But I've been on this trick since the

1063
01:24:01.760 --> 01:24:06.399
day it happened. She would claim
she has two two sides of every story,

1064
01:24:06.439 --> 01:24:10.720
and this side needs to be heard
because we've got to get back to

1065
01:24:10.840 --> 01:24:16.760
reality basics. The answers are there, but you're not going to get them

1066
01:24:16.760 --> 01:24:21.039
out of her book. There you
go. Couldn't have said it better myself,

1067
01:24:21.039 --> 01:24:24.199
So once again walk around. Oh
you know what, well, we

1068
01:24:24.199 --> 01:24:27.399
didn't give out your email address.
If people want to get a hold of

1069
01:24:27.399 --> 01:24:30.640
you, if they would like any
of the copies of let's say you said

1070
01:24:30.640 --> 01:24:33.439
you have some of the Kennedy execution, yes or no. I got a

1071
01:24:33.479 --> 01:24:36.520
few of those. I got two
d but you got them too, and

1072
01:24:36.560 --> 01:24:44.880
I got Warren omissioned, right,
And of course theology, Uh it's the

1073
01:24:45.680 --> 01:24:53.680
email address is k I A S
as in sam k I A S JFK

1074
01:24:54.439 --> 01:25:00.880
at aol dot com. So it's
k I A S which and know it

1075
01:25:00.960 --> 01:25:09.840
all JFK aol dot com. There
you go and at aol dot com.

1076
01:25:09.840 --> 01:25:12.199
You know what. I'm gonna put
a link to that in with the show

1077
01:25:12.239 --> 01:25:14.479
notes, so you'll be able to
go down and click on it and go

1078
01:25:14.479 --> 01:25:17.399
ahead and email Walt directly, get
in touch with him, and who knows,

1079
01:25:17.399 --> 01:25:19.880
maybe you'll even make you a deal
if you want to get a couple

1080
01:25:19.880 --> 01:25:24.760
of these things together. Uh,
definitely worth it. I advise, of

1081
01:25:24.760 --> 01:25:28.720
course, the Judith Ferry Baker book. I recommend the chronology. I recommend,

1082
01:25:29.079 --> 01:25:32.600
actually I recommend all of Walt's writing
on the case for sure. And

1083
01:25:33.159 --> 01:25:40.199
he's just an excellent resource and one
that Yeah, I think a few other

1084
01:25:40.199 --> 01:25:44.880
people are not bothering to check in
with him lately, but they should because

1085
01:25:44.920 --> 01:25:46.960
he had a lot of stuff already
set out for them that they could have

1086
01:25:47.000 --> 01:25:49.399
saved a lot of time on if
they had just gone to him first.

1087
01:25:50.399 --> 01:25:54.680
Anyways, let's leave it at that
again, Judith Ferry Baker in her own

1088
01:25:54.720 --> 01:25:59.800
words, Walt Brown, PhD.
Yes, indeed, but a guy from

1089
01:25:59.800 --> 01:26:03.720
New Jersey that that I also happen
to know. And there there you go,

1090
01:26:03.800 --> 01:26:08.880
double endorsement. Right anyway, guys, thank you, thanks, thank

1091
01:26:08.920 --> 01:26:14.000
you, especially to the listeners and
especially to the people that care about JFK,

1092
01:26:14.239 --> 01:26:18.279
because his memory right now, in
the divided state of our country,

1093
01:26:18.960 --> 01:26:24.319
his memory is more powerful than it
was in November twenty three, nineteen sixty

1094
01:26:24.319 --> 01:26:30.399
three. Absolutely true. There's there's
things that have to be done. Absolutely

1095
01:26:30.399 --> 01:26:33.520
true. And maybe next time we'll
even talk about RFK Junior's run. But

1096
01:26:33.760 --> 01:26:39.119
we'll get to that next time.
Wall Brown, everybody, thank you,

1097
01:27:00.279 --> 01:27:08.520
Wall Street, Street, Window dot
com, Gold, silver, the stock

1098
01:27:08.560 --> 01:27:15.560
market, Wall Street three, Window
dot dot Perhaps you're invested deeply, perhaps

1099
01:27:15.600 --> 01:27:18.880
you're not in deep enough. Maybe
you're thinking about getting started Wall Street,

1100
01:27:19.039 --> 01:27:24.520
Windows dot com, do dot com. Michael Swanson, the brilliant author of

1101
01:27:24.560 --> 01:27:29.319
the War State, understood these trends
professionally for many years, and now he

1102
01:27:29.359 --> 01:27:36.000
gives you the benefit of his knowledge. Wall Street Street Window dot do go

1103
01:27:36.119 --> 01:27:41.439
there, now go there, now
go there, now go ahead. Called

1104
01:27:41.520 --> 01:27:44.119
in the Truth about the Day of
a Assassination? Right, well, what

1105
01:27:44.159 --> 01:27:47.159
do you want to know Judie Baker's
wild claim Oswald girl rounds he knew Ruby

1106
01:27:47.159 --> 01:27:50.640
and Barry answer weapons? Really,
I imagine I could claim I have four

1107
01:27:50.640 --> 01:27:54.880
wheels. It doesn't make me a
wagon. But okay, Oswald was on

1108
01:27:55.000 --> 01:27:57.920
the joltan and trying to prevent the
murder of John Kennedy. Come on,

1109
01:27:58.000 --> 01:28:00.119
now, has it real effort on
the Day of a fascination? Go into

1110
01:28:00.159 --> 01:28:05.079
her claims. Go to Amazon dot
com, enter Judith Baker in her own

1111
01:28:05.119 --> 01:28:10.319
words. You'll get results for a
digital copy of a book where Walt Brown

1112
01:28:10.520 --> 01:28:15.439
utilizes her own words and the known
evidence in the case to get at well

1113
01:28:15.039 --> 01:28:19.119
a different perspective. Let's say you
can get Judith Arry Baker in her own

1114
01:28:19.199 --> 01:28:25.159
words from the author himself, signed
if you request it by contacting doctor Brown

1115
01:28:25.159 --> 01:28:30.279
at KIA s jfk at aol dot
com. It's a fun book and it

1116
01:28:30.359 --> 01:28:35.640
actually dissects the many, many fantastic
claims Judith Arry Baker in her own words.

1117
01:28:35.800 --> 01:28:41.640
Thank you for all the great information
Chili dot com Nuclear Holocaust. You

1118
01:28:41.680 --> 01:28:45.079
know what uranium is right, think
on nuclear weapons and other things like lots

1119
01:28:45.079 --> 01:28:49.800
of you know what uranium is right, Bad things things are done with uranium,

1120
01:28:49.800 --> 01:28:54.039
including some bad things nuclear holocaust,