WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.760 --> 00:00:11.519 Welcome to mind. Welcome to mind ed, Welcome to mind, well to 2 00:00:11.759 --> 00:00:22.239 minded. Welcome. Oh gee is bolts. It's showtime. People say, 3 00:00:22.320 --> 00:00:25.160 good money to see this movie. When they go out to a theater, 4 00:00:25.440 --> 00:00:29.839 they want cold sodas, pop, popcorn, and no monsters in the protection 5 00:00:29.960 --> 00:00:55.079 booth. Everyone pretend podcasting isn't boring. Got it off. Do you have 6 00:00:55.079 --> 00:00:57.920 any experience in motion truture saw? Yeah, quite a bit. Actually, 7 00:00:57.920 --> 00:01:02.159 I'm quite a bit of the experience. I'm uh active, uh the renter 8 00:01:03.320 --> 00:01:07.799 and I am attend to film the cinema. Uh, it's as much as 9 00:01:07.840 --> 00:01:14.719 possible. Weekly, bi weekly, enter week inter Would you be willing to 10 00:01:14.719 --> 00:01:19.640 cut your hair? Yes, but it's usually better if someone else does it. 11 00:01:21.599 --> 00:01:27.239 I've had a cheap accident. Would you be uh willing to show your 12 00:01:27.319 --> 00:01:46.840 naked ruin into the movie? Yeah? I guess so. Yeah. Welcome 13 00:01:46.879 --> 00:02:07.120 aboard. There's your wardrobe. O god, healy, God, we are 14 00:02:07.159 --> 00:02:12.199 finished. We are over. You had sex with Jeff. I never thought 15 00:02:12.240 --> 00:02:23.000 of it that way. I move off with him. They went pig keep 16 00:02:23.039 --> 00:02:25.039 it again, give it again, give it to gather, give it a 17 00:02:25.080 --> 00:02:47.719 gallow, give it to gather. So you're going to be a star Welcome 18 00:02:47.759 --> 00:02:51.360 to the projection booth. I'm your host. Mike White joined me once again 19 00:02:51.479 --> 00:02:54.879 is mister Rob Saint Mary. This film is only for Madagascar and Iran, 20 00:02:55.439 --> 00:03:01.000 which do not follow American copyright law. Also joining us as mister Kevin Laine. 21 00:03:01.560 --> 00:03:05.759 We're not doing anything traditional here. We're working in a new style. 22 00:03:06.039 --> 00:03:09.280 We're working in send him a new vool. We are kicking off a month 23 00:03:09.360 --> 00:03:15.759 discussing comedy films with Ay look at Frank Oza's Bowfinger, released in nineteen ninety 24 00:03:15.840 --> 00:03:19.759 nine. The film was written by En stars Steve Martin as the titular Bob 25 00:03:19.840 --> 00:03:24.080 Bofinger, a struggling filmmaker who, along with his group of misfit artists, 26 00:03:24.240 --> 00:03:30.360 makes a movie around the unknowing presence of unstable superstar Kit Ramsey played by Eddie 27 00:03:30.439 --> 00:03:34.840 Murphy. We will be spoiling this film as we go along, So if 28 00:03:34.840 --> 00:03:37.879 you don't want anything ruin, please turn off the podcast and go and watch 29 00:03:37.919 --> 00:03:39.840 the movie. You can thank us later. So, Rob, when was 30 00:03:39.840 --> 00:03:44.360 the first time you saw Bowfinger? And what did you think? I saw 31 00:03:44.360 --> 00:03:49.439 it in the theater when it came out nineteen ninety nine. And certain lines 32 00:03:49.479 --> 00:03:53.680 in this movie have become catchphrases between my friends and I, especially my friend 33 00:03:53.680 --> 00:03:55.400 Shane, who I've talked about several times on the film, who I used 34 00:03:55.439 --> 00:03:59.800 to work with at the main art theater. We used to go keep it 35 00:04:00.080 --> 00:04:03.159 gether, keep it together, and things like that. It was just lovely. 36 00:04:03.199 --> 00:04:06.680 I remember seeing it in theater and this was right at the time. 37 00:04:06.719 --> 00:04:10.560 In nineteen ninety nine was the year that I went to can with my silly, 38 00:04:10.560 --> 00:04:15.840 little low budget vampire movie. So movies like this, and there was 39 00:04:15.000 --> 00:04:18.519 a whole raft of them. We'll talk about this later in the mid to 40 00:04:18.560 --> 00:04:25.720 late nineties where Hollywood and some independent film started to look at kind of filmmakers 41 00:04:25.720 --> 00:04:29.959 but not good filmmakers, that we're looking at low budget filmmakers or bad filmmakers. 42 00:04:30.040 --> 00:04:32.000 And I don't know what the zeitgeist for that is. I think I 43 00:04:32.040 --> 00:04:35.600 have a small idea, but for me being a low budget filmmaker at that 44 00:04:35.639 --> 00:04:40.120 time, and that was still something that I was pursuing twenty five years ago. 45 00:04:40.240 --> 00:04:46.279 Hard to believe. It really resonated that there's this dream and it's the 46 00:04:46.360 --> 00:04:50.800 land of misfit Toys, and they're a weird little theater troupe that I'll get 47 00:04:50.839 --> 00:04:54.319 together and want to put on a show. It might be a bad show, 48 00:04:54.800 --> 00:04:59.360 what's for them? And they have fun and that's what's so beautiful about 49 00:04:59.399 --> 00:05:02.800 the film, I think, which really has been harked and Kevin, how 50 00:05:02.839 --> 00:05:05.920 about yourself? It came out a little later in the year, so I 51 00:05:06.079 --> 00:05:09.839 was already at college. I just I was in my first year of college 52 00:05:10.319 --> 00:05:13.720 where I was going to learn as much as I could about film and screenwriting. 53 00:05:14.120 --> 00:05:17.560 And I saw this on a rainy October and I just loved it, 54 00:05:17.600 --> 00:05:23.279 and like yourself, I came away referring to bad seats in the cinema from 55 00:05:23.279 --> 00:05:27.319 then on as the both finger seats, and yeah, I remember seeing Return 56 00:05:27.360 --> 00:05:30.120 of the King in the both finger seats and feeling like I may as be 57 00:05:30.120 --> 00:05:33.000 watching this film upside down. But yeah, it's a film that I loved. 58 00:05:33.600 --> 00:05:38.000 I loved from the moment I saw it, and yeah, it's just 59 00:05:38.000 --> 00:05:40.519 become a comfort watch for me. I just go back to it so many 60 00:05:40.519 --> 00:05:44.199 times, just for the mood that it has and the good nature that it 61 00:05:44.279 --> 00:05:48.360 has. It's a rare perfect comedy. Yeah. I also saw this theatrically 62 00:05:48.600 --> 00:05:56.040 and was very surprised by it because both Steve Martin has in this like introspective 63 00:05:56.160 --> 00:06:00.839 phase of his career with LA's Story and these movies that just didn't really appeal 64 00:06:00.920 --> 00:06:02.360 to me. And I'm sure now if I go back and watch La Story, 65 00:06:02.399 --> 00:06:06.319 I would absolutely love it. But at the time I was like, 66 00:06:06.680 --> 00:06:10.399 yeah, no, I'm good. I don't need this. Or what was 67 00:06:10.399 --> 00:06:14.879 the George Elliott adaptation that he started in. It was just like a simple 68 00:06:14.879 --> 00:06:15.879 twist of fade or something like that. I was like, yeah, no, 69 00:06:15.879 --> 00:06:19.000 no, I'm good. And then Eddie Murphy was just doing a string 70 00:06:19.240 --> 00:06:26.560 of bad films with like Holy Man and Life, and he was definitely already 71 00:06:26.639 --> 00:06:31.560 doing the multiple characters in the movie with the first nutty professor, and I 72 00:06:31.600 --> 00:06:34.240 was like, I don't need this. I don't need to Eddie Murphy's I 73 00:06:34.240 --> 00:06:39.199 don't need Steve Martin being introspective. I don't know why I went to see 74 00:06:39.199 --> 00:06:42.000 it, but I'm so glad that I did because I ended up loving it 75 00:06:42.120 --> 00:06:45.279 and I thought that this was a fantastic film. And I know Robbie suggested 76 00:06:45.360 --> 00:06:48.759 us doing this six seven years ago something like that, So I'm so glad 77 00:06:48.759 --> 00:06:53.319 we're finally doing this. I'm glad that we're finally here. I was trying 78 00:06:53.360 --> 00:06:58.399 to get Frank Oz or anybody related to the film to be on this episode. 79 00:06:58.759 --> 00:07:01.360 Unfortunately, no, because most of the people that are in this film 80 00:07:01.560 --> 00:07:09.360 are very talented and very big stars like Christine Baranski and Heather Graham and even 81 00:07:09.480 --> 00:07:14.959 freaking Jamie Kennedy. I mean, everybody is somebody except for what's the guy's 82 00:07:15.000 --> 00:07:20.680 name, Dave? Is it Jack? The one the star guy who drives 83 00:07:20.720 --> 00:07:25.000 the old car. Yeah, that's and I'm like, who is this guy? 84 00:07:25.040 --> 00:07:28.839 He's I know he's been in a ton of stuff, but he just 85 00:07:29.199 --> 00:07:32.519 reminded me of Chris Klein a little bit. But I'm like, he's not 86 00:07:32.920 --> 00:07:35.879 a big name, but everybody else in this movie is. It feels like 87 00:07:36.639 --> 00:07:41.399 it's interesting with him because when I was doing my research for this episode, 88 00:07:41.800 --> 00:07:45.399 the original star that they wanted for the Eddie Murphy pot was gonna be Keanu 89 00:07:45.480 --> 00:07:49.040 Reeves, and I feel like this guy almost fits that brief of what that 90 00:07:49.399 --> 00:07:53.800 character of Kit Romsey would have been. The I can't think of his name, 91 00:07:54.160 --> 00:07:59.040 Cole Sutteth. I think it is Yes Later, which, like I 92 00:07:59.120 --> 00:08:01.959 say, it feels more like a Keanu Reeves type. I hate to say, 93 00:08:03.000 --> 00:08:07.199 a Keanu Reeves in that era was the himbo type, not too bray 94 00:08:07.360 --> 00:08:11.360 good looking good with a letter jacket and a T shirt. And I think 95 00:08:11.439 --> 00:08:16.680 this is the same year that The Matrix comes out, So nineteen ninety nine 96 00:08:16.759 --> 00:08:20.160 really shot him to a different plane once that movie came out. An incredible 97 00:08:20.240 --> 00:08:24.759 year for film, but a very odd year for comedies. Like when you 98 00:08:24.800 --> 00:08:28.000 think of all the really successful comedies of nineteen ninety nine, like The Austin 99 00:08:28.040 --> 00:08:31.480 Powers and The Big Daddy and American Play and things like that, I'm surprised 100 00:08:31.559 --> 00:08:37.679 that Bollfinger was not as much of a hit as those films. But for 101 00:08:37.759 --> 00:08:41.279 me, it has certainly endured a lot longer than those. Part of it 102 00:08:41.360 --> 00:08:46.039 For me, I wonder, is it because it's about filmmaking and we obviously 103 00:08:46.080 --> 00:08:52.919 are so much film lovers and deconstructionists, which there's a series of characters they'll 104 00:08:52.919 --> 00:08:58.080 talk about later that I love in this movie that I wonder if it plays 105 00:08:58.120 --> 00:09:03.120 to a general audio that doesn't have background in caring about film, like a 106 00:09:03.159 --> 00:09:07.000 casual film watcher that watches bow Finger might be like, oh, it's about 107 00:09:07.000 --> 00:09:11.559 making movies, I guess, But if you've actually made a movie, or 108 00:09:11.600 --> 00:09:16.759 if you've read a lot about making movies or into film criticism. There's an 109 00:09:16.840 --> 00:09:20.039 extra layer in there for you that I don't know. If it plays to 110 00:09:20.039 --> 00:09:22.360 a general audience, I don't know. I can't take that part of my 111 00:09:22.399 --> 00:09:26.639 brain out and watch it without it. I think it's because as well, 112 00:09:26.679 --> 00:09:31.000 that Steve Martin was in a bit of a lull period in his career. 113 00:09:31.320 --> 00:09:35.120 Like I think he'd been off cinema screens for three years before he made this 114 00:09:35.759 --> 00:09:39.080 and the film. The big studio comedy before that was Sergeant Bilkole, which 115 00:09:39.600 --> 00:09:43.840 I remember seeing at Dennis Penis interview with him, or really a snapshot with 116 00:09:43.919 --> 00:09:46.879 him where he was walking the red carpra for that and Dennis Pennas said to 117 00:09:46.919 --> 00:09:50.039 him, Hey, Steve, how come you're not funny anymore? And he 118 00:09:50.120 --> 00:09:54.600 was devastated by that, totally devastated by it. And Dennis Penis, even 119 00:09:54.080 --> 00:09:58.159 Paul Kay, the guy that performed as that character, it says that's the 120 00:09:58.200 --> 00:10:01.399 one thing he regrets saying. He said, who am I to say? 121 00:10:01.440 --> 00:10:07.679 Thatshboards. I think that's probably part of the genesis of this film, which 122 00:10:07.720 --> 00:10:11.399 is Steve Martin retreating a little bit from screens, reporting back to his comedy 123 00:10:11.480 --> 00:10:16.399 roots. I'm writing what I can sod to be his best film. There's 124 00:10:16.440 --> 00:10:20.320 an extra that comes on the DVD, and he was saying that he had 125 00:10:20.360 --> 00:10:24.600 the idea for this probably about ten years before they actually made the movie, 126 00:10:24.600 --> 00:10:28.440 and that once he sat down and he said it was way more complicated than 127 00:10:28.480 --> 00:10:31.919 it was, and so once he took it down more to brass tacks that 128 00:10:31.000 --> 00:10:35.120 he was able to knock out the script. And I don't know, less 129 00:10:35.159 --> 00:10:39.000 than a month. It's nowhere near as good as a twelve day script called 130 00:10:39.080 --> 00:10:46.000 Chubby Rain. It's pretty good. Yeah, it's funny how they coded all 131 00:10:46.039 --> 00:10:48.159 of the really boring part of the filmmaking, which is the writing of the 132 00:10:48.200 --> 00:10:52.320 script. I'm appreciative of that as well, because so much of this movie 133 00:10:52.360 --> 00:10:58.320 relies on people being smart enough to realize that people are shot at different times 134 00:10:58.360 --> 00:11:01.919 when people are making movies. It's not just all a master shot and then 135 00:11:03.200 --> 00:11:05.519 three or four cameras like catching the close ups or something. This whole idea 136 00:11:05.559 --> 00:11:11.080 of the editing of having Kit Ramsey on one side and then Christine Baransky on 137 00:11:11.120 --> 00:11:13.919 the other side, and the way that they're able to marry those two things 138 00:11:13.960 --> 00:11:18.759 together, like in the parking lot scene, for example. I hope that 139 00:11:18.799 --> 00:11:22.440 people get it, and I know that Frank Oz. The audio commentary for 140 00:11:22.480 --> 00:11:26.679 this movie is fantastic. He's talking constantly. I don't know if people really 141 00:11:26.720 --> 00:11:30.440 got that. I hope that they did. There's the stuff happening in the 142 00:11:30.480 --> 00:11:35.720 background so much of this movie, Christine Baranski getting a mask put on and 143 00:11:35.759 --> 00:11:41.720 she's going to have her fake head created, or Afraim testing out the melting 144 00:11:41.840 --> 00:11:45.639 stuff that is going to happen to him. But they don't foreground that stuff. 145 00:11:45.639 --> 00:11:48.120 It's all backgrounded, and Oz himself is like, I don't know if 146 00:11:48.120 --> 00:11:54.159 that really worked, And just hearing him talk about how much stuff they shot 147 00:11:54.200 --> 00:11:58.480 and ended up cutting out and how he used test previews. I think he 148 00:11:58.519 --> 00:12:03.679 said they rew this eight times, and they went back and did a whole 149 00:12:03.759 --> 00:12:07.360 bunch of reshoots just to clarify. There's the deleted scenes on the disc as 150 00:12:07.360 --> 00:12:13.519 well, and you get to see the entire opening of the movie where both 151 00:12:13.600 --> 00:12:18.080 ingers talking about a from script and all of this stuff and trying to gather 152 00:12:18.159 --> 00:12:20.639 the troops and even does the whole thing with the FedEx truck, and then 153 00:12:20.679 --> 00:12:24.600 they went back and reshot that whole thing just to make a lot tighter. 154 00:12:24.279 --> 00:12:28.279 Really works very well. And he did that consistently. There's a one scene 155 00:12:28.279 --> 00:12:33.720 where both Ingers explaining to Jamie Kennedy how they're going to do this with Kit 156 00:12:33.879 --> 00:12:39.600 Ramsey, how they're going to make this fake movie quote unquote, and that 157 00:12:39.840 --> 00:12:43.799 is so clear in what he's saying, and that was all reshoots just because 158 00:12:43.840 --> 00:12:46.840 they're like, not really sure if the audience is going to follow this or 159 00:12:46.879 --> 00:12:50.000 not. I have to say, when I watched the deleted scenes to the 160 00:12:50.000 --> 00:12:54.639 opening, what I was struck by was how much they changed the tone of 161 00:12:54.720 --> 00:13:00.399 the opening. They softened it entirely, and I think that was because where 162 00:13:00.399 --> 00:13:03.519 they take the story and how it ends on such a sincere note. The 163 00:13:03.559 --> 00:13:07.080 things I love about this film is that it's so uncynical for a satire but 164 00:13:07.159 --> 00:13:09.960 Hollywood, and the way that it started. I think Frank god says in 165 00:13:11.000 --> 00:13:15.000 that audio commentary that it began with a helicopter shot over the rich part of 166 00:13:15.120 --> 00:13:18.080 La all the swimming pools, and you're just you're traveling further and further along 167 00:13:18.120 --> 00:13:22.039 to the poor part of Tone until you come to both fingers cottage and his 168 00:13:22.120 --> 00:13:24.279 first line, as in the deleted scene then, was him coming here and 169 00:13:24.360 --> 00:13:26.720 sharing it. The Skuy that I hate this tone, I hate rich people, 170 00:13:28.240 --> 00:13:33.480 and that I think would have pitched both finger in a place of bitterness 171 00:13:33.480 --> 00:13:35.440 and frustration, and you wouldn't have been rooting for him as much as you 172 00:13:35.480 --> 00:13:39.720 are with the reshot scenes, which are just there. They pitched him as 173 00:13:39.759 --> 00:13:45.600 this innocent underdog who is still against all the odds, striving, and you're 174 00:13:45.639 --> 00:13:48.919 immediately on the side from that point, Dan, You're like, I'm with 175 00:13:48.000 --> 00:13:52.200 this guy and these lovable band of rogues. And as you were saying Rob 176 00:13:52.480 --> 00:13:56.679 about this sort of this troop of performers that are trying to put on a 177 00:13:56.720 --> 00:14:01.639 show that's tapping into Frank Oz's history, the muppets, that these guys are 178 00:14:01.639 --> 00:14:05.960 almost like live action muppets, and the ethos of the Henson Company and stuff. 179 00:14:07.320 --> 00:14:09.600 It comes true, I think in spades in this film. Most definitely, 180 00:14:09.639 --> 00:14:15.879 I would say if there's any cynicism, it's not and the the plucky, 181 00:14:15.919 --> 00:14:20.080 low budget filmmakers. The cynicism is with the bigger system. So it's 182 00:14:20.159 --> 00:14:26.200 the Jerry Renfrow character and the agent because he plays the agent, and it's 183 00:14:26.240 --> 00:14:37.000 with the scientology satire of mindheld. Oh wait maybe, oh shit, oh 184 00:14:37.480 --> 00:14:41.840 oh, they're coming after me. Now and then also the disconnect between the 185 00:14:41.879 --> 00:14:46.840 sort of Hollywood stars and their little bubble that they live in and all of 186 00:14:46.840 --> 00:14:50.279 that stuff like that's where they pitch their cynicism as they pitch. If there 187 00:14:50.360 --> 00:14:54.840 is any in the film, I'd say it's slight, but it is with 188 00:14:54.000 --> 00:15:00.240 that kind of the machinery of the industry as opposed to the plucky folk who 189 00:15:00.279 --> 00:15:05.759 are trying to make it or to do something that they find valuable even if 190 00:15:05.519 --> 00:15:11.320 the system doesn't find it valuable. And I think that really is a beautiful 191 00:15:11.320 --> 00:15:13.919 place to be as opposed to pitching it from the other angle as you were 192 00:15:13.919 --> 00:15:18.000 saying, Kevin. And we can talk about a movie later that does that 193 00:15:18.679 --> 00:15:22.919 along similar lines, but just that opening. I really love the opening because 194 00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:28.519 it brings us in. It's such a just through little pieces of audio, 195 00:15:30.240 --> 00:15:37.279 just as very simple visuals, we learn real quick who Steve Martin's character is 196 00:15:37.440 --> 00:15:39.720 before we actually meet him. We get the idea of the oh, he 197 00:15:39.799 --> 00:15:43.840 was in the community theater and he was doing this, and he's doing that, 198 00:15:43.919 --> 00:15:46.639 and he lives in this kind of it's not a bad place, but 199 00:15:46.960 --> 00:15:52.759 it's full shabby and we get the idea, okay, that this is who 200 00:15:52.759 --> 00:15:58.120 we're dealing with it, and I think that's a much better opening than I 201 00:15:58.159 --> 00:16:03.320 didn't even know this other opening existed until I listened to the audio commentary, 202 00:16:03.519 --> 00:16:07.919 and I was just like, no, that would any But it's his performance 203 00:16:07.960 --> 00:16:12.039 as well. It's so much more harsh and cutting. He's angry when they 204 00:16:14.000 --> 00:16:17.559 pitch it in the first version of the scene, and they soften it so 205 00:16:17.679 --> 00:16:21.159 much, and I think that's so vital because he's such a there's a way 206 00:16:21.200 --> 00:16:26.120 that you can view his character as being ruthless and despicable. He's putting people's 207 00:16:26.159 --> 00:16:29.720 lives in danger in order to get the shot. And if you get that 208 00:16:29.840 --> 00:16:33.039 wrong, if you pitch it at the wrong tenor then you have a totally 209 00:16:33.080 --> 00:16:37.039 different reading on this film. It becomes about a con man rather than a 210 00:16:37.120 --> 00:16:41.480 dreamer. And I think that the heart of this story is what elevates it 211 00:16:41.519 --> 00:16:47.000 beyond just being a knock about comedy or a farce. It becomes a story 212 00:16:47.039 --> 00:16:49.600 we are rooting for underdogs to succeed. And that's the thing that's funny, 213 00:16:49.720 --> 00:16:55.759 is because the poster says the con is on and it's got him in this 214 00:16:55.960 --> 00:17:00.759 horrible suit code and he's standing next to Eddie Murphy. There really is this 215 00:17:00.919 --> 00:17:04.640 balance that they're trying to strike between being a dreamer and being a con man. 216 00:17:06.319 --> 00:17:10.000 And later in the film, of course, he developed the contos when 217 00:17:10.039 --> 00:17:14.200 he's talking with Dave, the Jamie Kennedy character, and he's just like, 218 00:17:14.240 --> 00:17:17.599 Oh, if this goes through, I will buy a new car and you 219 00:17:17.640 --> 00:17:22.160 can have my old car, and Jamie Kennedy's that is my car, which 220 00:17:22.599 --> 00:17:25.799 reading in the script I didn't necessarily get it, and then when I rewatched 221 00:17:25.799 --> 00:17:26.279 the movie, I was like, oh, yeah, that's right, that 222 00:17:26.440 --> 00:17:30.480 is his car. But he's not mad about it. He's not just like, 223 00:17:30.519 --> 00:17:36.599 oh, you're driving me crazy. Nobody is angry at Bowfinger for being 224 00:17:36.640 --> 00:17:40.119 the con man. He's the lovable con man, but in a lot of 225 00:17:40.160 --> 00:17:45.279 ways. And I have to think about sort of Steve Martin's history of characters. 226 00:17:45.759 --> 00:17:49.400 This seems to be an archetype that he likes to play in that he 227 00:17:49.640 --> 00:17:53.799 is a very endearing and kind person, but he's also a bit of a 228 00:17:53.920 --> 00:18:00.319 rope But he's not a mean one. He makes jokes and stuff. He's 229 00:18:00.359 --> 00:18:06.640 not trying to harm. He's not psychopathic in that way or socio. It's 230 00:18:06.720 --> 00:18:11.480 more like and clown to go back to what Kevin was saying, He's it's 231 00:18:11.519 --> 00:18:15.680 like the elevation of the Sergeant Bilco character who's trying to get ahead in the 232 00:18:15.720 --> 00:18:19.039 world and trying to pull the wool over everybody's eyes and things, trying to 233 00:18:19.079 --> 00:18:23.039 make a lot of money. It's that, but like the softer, gentler 234 00:18:23.599 --> 00:18:29.359 side of that. To your point, yes, the poster is misleading, 235 00:18:29.440 --> 00:18:34.440 especially with that like herb Tarlk jacket that he's wearing and pulling the who's Everybody's 236 00:18:34.480 --> 00:18:37.920 like, why is Eddie Murphy dressed that way? Why does he look the 237 00:18:37.960 --> 00:18:42.759 way that he looks? In this they luckily go the opposite direction, and 238 00:18:42.839 --> 00:18:47.559 yeah, make him that lovable scamp. And I love some of the dialogue 239 00:18:47.599 --> 00:18:49.519 that he has, like what you're talking about, as far as the softness 240 00:18:49.519 --> 00:18:56.759 of it. When he's auditioning actors and making them pay to audition and Heather 241 00:18:56.839 --> 00:19:00.599 Graham shows up, is this where it come to be? As Stars? 242 00:19:00.079 --> 00:19:03.599 And she goes to write him a check and he's like, you know, 243 00:19:03.799 --> 00:19:07.279 no checks And she starts to cry, I don't have any cash on me. 244 00:19:07.319 --> 00:19:08.480 I mean I have I have cash, but it's not on me. 245 00:19:08.519 --> 00:19:14.480 And and and the paints are open. There there there, there, there's 246 00:19:14.519 --> 00:19:17.200 the door. I'm sorry, we cannot you audition, but that's a your 247 00:19:17.319 --> 00:19:22.440 Steve Martin total Yes, his lies as well. They're all coming from a 248 00:19:22.480 --> 00:19:29.279 place of well intentioned, for good intentions. It's like when Slater says to 249 00:19:29.359 --> 00:19:32.359 him, do I have it? And he just gives him this look up 250 00:19:32.359 --> 00:19:36.160 and down and then goes, sorry, what I wasn't Do I have it? 251 00:19:36.839 --> 00:19:40.920 Yes, yes you do. He's lying, but it's just he's saving 252 00:19:40.920 --> 00:19:45.440 his ego. And it's as well when he's celebrating pretending that he's after getting 253 00:19:45.960 --> 00:19:48.400 Eddie Murphy's character kit to start in the film, and they're all jumping up 254 00:19:48.400 --> 00:19:52.480 and down and he's like yay, and he turns the camera and he's just 255 00:19:52.799 --> 00:19:55.960 terrified. He's like, how is he going to pull this off? You're 256 00:19:56.079 --> 00:20:00.799 rooting for a layer in that instance, because it's the spare making their hearts 257 00:20:00.839 --> 00:20:04.480 and they're such puppy dogs. All there's incredible ensemble, but there's such they 258 00:20:04.519 --> 00:20:10.279 add muppets to me. They're just they're just pure innocence and dreamers, and 259 00:20:11.000 --> 00:20:14.480 you cannot break their hearts. You have to pull this off because it's going 260 00:20:14.559 --> 00:20:17.759 to mean the world to them. Oh, yeah, you can see Scooter 261 00:20:18.160 --> 00:20:23.680 is Slater, Miss Piggy is the Carol Christine Baranski character. Yeah, totally. 262 00:20:25.319 --> 00:20:29.759 Afrom is probably Gonzo. Yeah, you could recast this with Muppets and 263 00:20:29.799 --> 00:20:33.519 no problem. It's funny that you bring up the Muppets because this is the 264 00:20:33.559 --> 00:20:36.319 first time I'd ever thought of it. Obviously, Frank Oz and things like 265 00:20:36.359 --> 00:20:37.759 that, and this might be I don't know, I'd have to go back 266 00:20:37.759 --> 00:20:44.000 over Frank Oz's films, live action movies. This might be the closest sort 267 00:20:44.000 --> 00:20:48.160 of thematically to the Muppets, because the Muppets, at least the TV show 268 00:20:48.200 --> 00:20:52.160 is always about we're putting on a show. It's always the Muppet It's always 269 00:20:52.160 --> 00:20:57.240 backstage. Yeah, it's always backstage performance piece and what goes up between the 270 00:20:57.279 --> 00:21:02.279 stage in backstage. Oh, it's the first time I'd ever really thought of 271 00:21:02.319 --> 00:21:04.680 that. No, totally. That a song that they end the Muppet Movie 272 00:21:04.759 --> 00:21:10.000 on Whards Here's to the Dreamers And all you need is one person to believe 273 00:21:10.000 --> 00:21:14.599 in you, and that's what these guys are. It's a troop of underdogs. 274 00:21:14.680 --> 00:21:18.680 But there's one thing that I want to call out about Steve Martin for 275 00:21:18.759 --> 00:21:22.200 his writing on this is that usually if you have a writer writing a vanity 276 00:21:22.200 --> 00:21:26.799 piece essentially what they're going to be the Star Wars, it's a very selfless 277 00:21:26.799 --> 00:21:30.839 script. He spreads the jokes around everywhere. So each of this ensemble they 278 00:21:30.880 --> 00:21:36.039 have like several stand up moments where they're just scene stealing and getting the biggest 279 00:21:36.079 --> 00:21:41.759 laughs in the scenes. And I just think that's very commendable and it strengthens 280 00:21:41.799 --> 00:21:45.000 the films. There's no superfluous characters in this which are just the straight man. 281 00:21:45.119 --> 00:21:52.039 Everybody is delivering big comedic set pieces. It's a fantastic ensemble comedy in 282 00:21:52.039 --> 00:21:56.000 that regard. Yeah, and we know that Terrence Stamp can do comedy. 283 00:21:56.039 --> 00:22:00.400 I'm a big fan of Priscilla, Queen of the Desert, but his lines 284 00:22:00.440 --> 00:22:03.079 and here where he's just like mister Weeney needs to stay in his pats. 285 00:22:04.759 --> 00:22:12.160 You can so good And yeah, you're right. There's that whole moment in 286 00:22:12.200 --> 00:22:15.200 the Muppet Movie where they go in front of Orson Wells and he green lights 287 00:22:15.240 --> 00:22:22.599 the picture. And I like that Bowfinger is clueless at times, especially in 288 00:22:22.640 --> 00:22:26.400 that meeting with Jerry Renfro how he's got the phone but you can see the 289 00:22:26.480 --> 00:22:32.279 cord and Robert Downey Jr. Obviously knows that he's not talking with anybody on 290 00:22:32.319 --> 00:22:34.880 the phone, and just that look that he gives at the end is fantastic. 291 00:22:36.440 --> 00:22:41.559 I really appreciate him being there and this being I think right around the 292 00:22:41.640 --> 00:22:44.759 time. I know he's not fully turned things around, but this is a 293 00:22:44.799 --> 00:22:48.119 really good Robert Downey Junior role barely in here, but he does a great 294 00:22:48.200 --> 00:22:52.799 job of it. And the other thing talking about Ego and Steve Martin the 295 00:22:52.839 --> 00:23:00.319 writer, that he's open to having ad libs being done, like Frank would 296 00:23:00.319 --> 00:23:03.160 be like, Okay, let's do one or two takes and then one for 297 00:23:03.279 --> 00:23:06.440 you guys, and you guys can add lib and just that they even set 298 00:23:06.519 --> 00:23:10.680 up that whole thing with Jeff and we'll talk about Jeff Moore, but having 299 00:23:10.759 --> 00:23:14.680 Jiff answering those questions and some of those were scripted and other things were just 300 00:23:14.759 --> 00:23:18.160 thrown out there, and that he was keeping the actors on their toes by 301 00:23:18.680 --> 00:23:23.680 throwing in ad libbing questions. And I don't know what was necessarily in the 302 00:23:23.680 --> 00:23:27.000 script versus not in the script that they were asking him, but it just 303 00:23:27.000 --> 00:23:30.599 feels very fresh the way that he's answering them, and some of that stuff 304 00:23:32.079 --> 00:23:34.599 about him cutting his hair. Would you be willing to cut your hair? 305 00:23:36.279 --> 00:23:44.799 Oh? Yes, but it's usually better if someone else does it. Whoever 306 00:23:44.880 --> 00:23:48.119 came up with it, whether it was Eddie Murphy or Steve Martin, it's 307 00:23:48.279 --> 00:23:52.200 just hilarious stuff. I think it's the scene when Steve Martin rocks up to 308 00:23:52.319 --> 00:23:56.039 Eddie Murphy's mansion and he's I got the script. It's jigg baby, it's 309 00:23:56.079 --> 00:24:02.880 but it's butter, It's butter. And that was all improvised. They were 310 00:24:02.920 --> 00:24:08.279 just riffing. But also that line or that that speech which has been regurgitated 311 00:24:08.359 --> 00:24:12.039 so many times over the years since white boys get all asked. It's it's 312 00:24:12.039 --> 00:24:15.480 a fact you know that luck Did that get nomination? No? And you 313 00:24:15.519 --> 00:24:18.279 know what because because I have played them slave bros, I get my head 314 00:24:18.279 --> 00:24:21.440 swiped. That's when you get the nomination, Kip, That's when I clude 315 00:24:21.440 --> 00:24:23.200 play a slave broke getting as you get nominated the white web player idiot, 316 00:24:23.279 --> 00:24:26.519 they get asked, they master give me a famil script is a retarded slave? 317 00:24:26.559 --> 00:24:32.759 Did I get as? That was all Riffin improv from Eddie Murphy And 318 00:24:32.799 --> 00:24:37.119 it's fantastic and it's become like it changed people's perspective on who gets awarded for 319 00:24:37.200 --> 00:24:41.079 what at the Academy all those years before Robert Downey Junior took it to the 320 00:24:41.119 --> 00:24:45.519 next level. Everybody knows you never go full retired. What do you mean? 321 00:24:47.319 --> 00:24:49.640 Check it out? It doesn't often. Ray Man look retarded. That 322 00:24:49.799 --> 00:24:55.920 retarded, not retarded. Cat too picks to your card autistic shop, not 323 00:24:56.039 --> 00:25:00.119 retired. Yeah, Tom hangs forrest gun so yes, retarded. Maybe he 324 00:25:00.160 --> 00:25:02.480 braced his owner's leg, but he trying to pay himself next to it. 325 00:25:02.559 --> 00:25:04.640 And they won a pin punk competition. They didn't retard it. He was 326 00:25:04.720 --> 00:25:08.680 goddamn war hero, you know, and he retired war heroes. You went 327 00:25:08.720 --> 00:25:14.960 full return man, never go full return. You don't buy that, Yeah, 328 00:25:15.000 --> 00:25:18.000 Sean Pan two thousand one. I am saying, never went full return. 329 00:25:21.279 --> 00:25:25.480 I love him That scene with Robert Dorny Jr. And Steve Martin when 330 00:25:25.519 --> 00:25:29.400 he's conning him and when he tells him you got a green light, and 331 00:25:29.880 --> 00:25:34.319 it's Steve Martin's reaction, he just goes, Okay, He's just he is 332 00:25:34.720 --> 00:25:41.160 like stunned beyond belief, and you immediately just love him. You just feel 333 00:25:41.200 --> 00:25:45.480 so I hope this works out for you because you're out of your debt here 334 00:25:45.480 --> 00:25:48.200 and you don't realize that. You think you're pulling the wool over everyone else's 335 00:25:48.200 --> 00:25:51.799 eyes and you're the one that's being calmed here. The thing that's also funny, 336 00:25:51.799 --> 00:25:55.599 and I know this after I made my feature, when I made my 337 00:25:55.880 --> 00:25:57.720 silly little feature, we started to go out and talk to people about the 338 00:25:57.720 --> 00:26:03.000 next project we want, and we get meetings not too far off from the 339 00:26:03.079 --> 00:26:07.440 Robert Downey Junior meeting, in which no one really wants to tell you because 340 00:26:07.440 --> 00:26:10.880 they don't know if you've got a fucking great idea that's going to make them 341 00:26:10.880 --> 00:26:15.000 tons of money. So they're like, Okay, the script's interesting, it's 342 00:26:15.319 --> 00:26:17.839 good idea. Why don't you go out and see who you can get, 343 00:26:17.880 --> 00:26:19.359 and if you can get that person, come back to me. I'd love 344 00:26:19.400 --> 00:26:23.039 to talk to you about it, because, like I said, it's the 345 00:26:23.039 --> 00:26:30.839 old William William Goldman line. Nobody knows anything but now, so it's gonna 346 00:26:30.359 --> 00:26:33.480 tell you a fuck off and get the hell out of here, because no 347 00:26:33.559 --> 00:26:37.119 one wants to be the guy who didn't sign the Beatles. There's that story. 348 00:26:37.200 --> 00:26:41.279 Oh I passed. I thought guitar bands were on the way out, 349 00:26:41.960 --> 00:26:45.039 So it's no one wants to be that guy. Yeah, they'll kill you 350 00:26:45.079 --> 00:26:48.279 a cleanness in Hollywood. I love if he looks at the script. Oh 351 00:26:48.400 --> 00:26:52.920 that's interesting. And then it flips to the last page, got you suckers. 352 00:26:52.000 --> 00:26:57.319 Oh there's a catchphrase, and then we cut to Eddie Murphy just a 353 00:26:57.319 --> 00:27:02.440 few seconds later, like, where's my catchphrase? Arnold's got astel leavista baby, 354 00:27:02.440 --> 00:27:06.359 where's my catchphrase? That's right, it's true. It's so good, 355 00:27:07.480 --> 00:27:11.680 especially in that era, because it seemed there were so many action movies. 356 00:27:11.720 --> 00:27:15.279 There were so many movies that it was just like people just repeat these lines 357 00:27:15.319 --> 00:27:18.839 to each other. It just became the cool thing. The thing that I 358 00:27:18.960 --> 00:27:22.200 noticed true working in the States, I'm working in the UK is not. 359 00:27:22.559 --> 00:27:26.680 In the UK, they'll treat you like shit because you're nobody. But in 360 00:27:26.720 --> 00:27:30.480 the US they'll treat you kindly because you might become somebody. It's a stark 361 00:27:30.519 --> 00:27:34.079 difference between the two industries, and it's different when I worked in radio. 362 00:27:34.160 --> 00:27:38.519 I remember in broadcast school they say they told us to be kind to everyone 363 00:27:38.640 --> 00:27:42.000 because you may work with them going up and you may work with them going 364 00:27:42.039 --> 00:27:47.359 down. So as your career does this, just keep in mind. But 365 00:27:47.440 --> 00:27:49.640 you don't want to rough somebody up because that person who was the intern may 366 00:27:49.680 --> 00:27:52.559 want to be in your boss, you know. I want to talk about 367 00:27:52.680 --> 00:27:57.440 Daisy, the Heather Graham character, because she's one of several characters that we 368 00:27:57.559 --> 00:28:02.880 see change throughout the film, and hers is probably the most notable, with 369 00:28:02.960 --> 00:28:06.759 the exception of some other folks that we'll talk about in a bit here, 370 00:28:06.799 --> 00:28:11.000 but her character, the way she dresses, the way her hair is done, 371 00:28:11.720 --> 00:28:15.279 who she's with, and just the way that she keeps asking questions as 372 00:28:15.279 --> 00:28:18.160 far as like how do I get more seen? Oh? That person takes 373 00:28:18.200 --> 00:28:22.759 care of that, and then she moves to another person who how can I 374 00:28:22.799 --> 00:28:25.799 do this? Oh? That person okay, Then she moves to another person 375 00:28:26.160 --> 00:28:33.079 and she is perfect for both finger. I love that she is as conniving 376 00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:38.920 but also sweet at the same time, doesn't really purposefully hurt people, doesn't 377 00:28:38.960 --> 00:28:41.960 go out of her way to hurt them, but you can see the look 378 00:28:42.039 --> 00:28:48.160 of she's up front disappointment. Oh yeah, but you see that look of 379 00:28:48.160 --> 00:28:52.720 disappointment, like when she moves from a freme to Bowfinger and he's just like, 380 00:28:52.799 --> 00:28:59.599 oh okay, But then there's another person behind him who she's already slept 381 00:28:59.640 --> 00:29:02.960 with the way she goes up and up, and that when she sleeps with 382 00:29:03.079 --> 00:29:08.160 Jeff and he's so excited. And then that argument unquote that she and Bowfinger 383 00:29:08.279 --> 00:29:15.200 have we are finished, we are over. You had sex with Jeff, 384 00:29:15.480 --> 00:29:18.880 So I never thought of it that way. See you tonight. Okay, 385 00:29:19.599 --> 00:29:25.440 that is again another wonderful Steve Martin moment. And that Yeah, at the 386 00:29:25.519 --> 00:29:29.920 end of the movie, she's there with Kit, but I'm so surprised that 387 00:29:29.960 --> 00:29:33.000 she's actually in the Kung Fu movie. At the very end of the film, 388 00:29:33.759 --> 00:29:37.799 did you know that she was modeled on an Hesh. That's where the 389 00:29:37.839 --> 00:29:41.440 inspiration came from. That she was like climbing all the way up until she 390 00:29:41.480 --> 00:29:47.119 became involved with the most powerful lesbian in Hollywood and generous. That's funny. 391 00:29:47.519 --> 00:29:52.839 That's funny. And hes she's also from Ohio, So that's one of the 392 00:29:52.920 --> 00:29:56.440 observations I think that Steve Martin made about an Hish. When Anhesh came out 393 00:29:56.480 --> 00:30:00.200 as bisexual, or she might have even gone full lesbian, it was just 394 00:30:00.240 --> 00:30:04.480 like, what more power tour. I'm not gonna question their sexuality, but 395 00:30:04.519 --> 00:30:07.640 there was like, is this a power move? What are you doing? 396 00:30:08.440 --> 00:30:15.720 All the characters have layers to them. Onions have layers, Ugers have layers, 397 00:30:15.759 --> 00:30:18.880 Onions have layers. You get it. But she's the woe, which 398 00:30:18.920 --> 00:30:22.160 is she's in on it, and she's aware of it, and she's not 399 00:30:22.240 --> 00:30:25.880 the dumb blonde that you think she is. Like the other characters that have 400 00:30:26.000 --> 00:30:30.559 that great transformation as well, they lose their wide eyed naive tand they become 401 00:30:30.640 --> 00:30:36.160 players within the system very quickly. Since we're talking about that arc of her 402 00:30:36.240 --> 00:30:38.000 character, do you want to talk about the other character, the other set 403 00:30:38.039 --> 00:30:42.240 of characters that have an arc there, who weren't even in the script. 404 00:30:42.359 --> 00:30:47.200 I was so surprised that the whole thing with We're going to get the best 405 00:30:47.240 --> 00:30:52.160 crew money can buy. That line and the payoff to that, it's one 406 00:30:52.200 --> 00:30:56.640 of the best laughs in the movie. And then to see the Mexican crew 407 00:30:56.680 --> 00:31:00.880 that he gets those four guys, and to see their transformation through the film, 408 00:31:00.000 --> 00:31:03.880 Holy cow, so good. I have to say, on this watch, 409 00:31:04.559 --> 00:31:07.200 I can't remember the last time I saw it, maybe at least a 410 00:31:07.240 --> 00:31:14.240 decade or so, but on this watch, the way that it's staged with 411 00:31:14.400 --> 00:31:21.119 the cliche Mexican music and they're in the middle of the desert and they're just 412 00:31:21.160 --> 00:31:25.880 shoving people into the van. I was like, h I cringed a little, 413 00:31:26.160 --> 00:31:29.519 like I was thinking of a similar And this is Robert Downey Junior again, 414 00:31:29.839 --> 00:31:34.480 where when you first hear Robert Downey Junior in Blackface Tropic Thunder, and 415 00:31:34.519 --> 00:31:38.920 then you see Robert Downey play that character and why you're like, Okay, 416 00:31:40.400 --> 00:31:45.400 that works. But the first reaction to it is we're not going where we 417 00:31:45.440 --> 00:31:48.839 need to go. But when we get to the end, and I love 418 00:31:48.920 --> 00:31:52.440 the fact that right before the end, they're sitting around they've been on the 419 00:31:52.480 --> 00:31:57.079 crew, they've been shooting and all this stuff, and they're debating great cinema, 420 00:31:57.119 --> 00:32:02.519 they're ring ty cinema. They've become film nerds like us basically, so 421 00:32:02.599 --> 00:32:08.160 you've got nothing but met respect. Yeah. It says that with hard work 422 00:32:08.240 --> 00:32:14.960 and tenacity you can become the most in demand film crew in Hollywood. You 423 00:32:15.039 --> 00:32:19.680 can work your way up. So's it's affirming and it's positive and yeah, 424 00:32:19.759 --> 00:32:23.960 again, it's just all the characters have their moments and it's just so good 425 00:32:24.160 --> 00:32:30.079 natured that it starts off from a place of desperation on Hippo Fingers part and 426 00:32:30.119 --> 00:32:35.039 then just in the background you just see them evolve to the point where they're 427 00:32:35.480 --> 00:32:39.920 talking about cube breaking lenses and they've got their mobile phones and they're dressed really 428 00:32:39.960 --> 00:32:44.759 slick, and it's lovely. You just love to see that, and that 429 00:32:45.039 --> 00:32:49.839 just is the undercurrent of the whole film, is that there's joy seeing these 430 00:32:49.839 --> 00:32:54.400 people rise up and pull it off. It's such a crowd pleaser in essence. 431 00:32:54.440 --> 00:32:59.079 They've surpassed both Finger by the end of the film, like they are 432 00:32:59.160 --> 00:33:02.240 the ones that their phones are ringing. Obviously gets the FedEx at the end 433 00:33:02.279 --> 00:33:06.680 of it, which is fantastic for him, and I love how it's all 434 00:33:06.720 --> 00:33:12.359 shot in slow mo and just presented like this magical moment and everything. But 435 00:33:13.119 --> 00:33:16.839 they're the ones that are going to be working steadily now for the next for 436 00:33:16.880 --> 00:33:20.720 the rest of their lives. They're the ones who in twenty years, I'll 437 00:33:20.759 --> 00:33:23.440 try to be contacting for interviews for the show. It's funny you say that, 438 00:33:23.519 --> 00:33:27.279 but when I was watching the film, I was thinking about how different 439 00:33:27.279 --> 00:33:30.400 Bullfinger would be if it was made today, and where a Bullfinger himself would 440 00:33:30.440 --> 00:33:35.720 have a podcast, what it would be his psch No, but the difficulty 441 00:33:35.799 --> 00:33:38.400 for him to pull off making this film, it would be a much easier. 442 00:33:38.480 --> 00:33:43.079 He'd be Neil Breen today. He'd be doing it himself with like green 443 00:33:43.160 --> 00:33:47.039 screen and starring is all the different parts. And you can do it now 444 00:33:47.200 --> 00:33:51.799 a lot easier. You can be that one man band. Because I don't 445 00:33:51.839 --> 00:33:55.119 hear about Neil Breen's crew very often, I'll have to tell you that Neil 446 00:33:55.119 --> 00:34:00.559 Breen is the crew chat GPT, which then comes true because he says in 447 00:34:00.599 --> 00:34:06.240 here he's got the line he goes every movie costs two and eighty four dollars, 448 00:34:06.319 --> 00:34:12.000 so it's after ten percent that deferred not or whatever. Yeah, one 449 00:34:12.039 --> 00:34:14.880 of my favorite movies we did on the show cost one hundred bucks to make. 450 00:34:15.719 --> 00:34:17.400 You've never seen Flooding with Love for the Kid, do yourself a favor. 451 00:34:19.039 --> 00:34:22.760 I was glad that one thing from the script got dropped, which was 452 00:34:22.840 --> 00:34:25.639 the counting of the money. And it's it's almost like a ticking clock for 453 00:34:25.719 --> 00:34:30.880 the movie because he's got all his money. It's rolled up in the springs 454 00:34:30.880 --> 00:34:36.280 of his bed, and it's this whole scene of him and Dave and they're 455 00:34:36.280 --> 00:34:38.000 getting the money and all this, and it just becomes much more of a 456 00:34:38.039 --> 00:34:43.239 big thing because that scene is still there, but it's the context is a 457 00:34:43.280 --> 00:34:47.000 little bit different. And then of course when he gets Daisy credit card and 458 00:34:47.159 --> 00:34:52.960 just starts buying all the real equipment, charging all the real equipment, and 459 00:34:52.039 --> 00:34:58.119 I was god to the stuff with the security guard who is a member of 460 00:34:59.280 --> 00:35:04.280 Mindhead. That is a much longer piece in the script as well, Like 461 00:35:04.360 --> 00:35:07.840 from the first time Dave takes one of those cameras, you have the guard 462 00:35:07.840 --> 00:35:12.280 who's watching him, and it becomes like this investigation. I was just like, 463 00:35:12.840 --> 00:35:15.199 I don't need that. I just need the one scene at the end 464 00:35:15.199 --> 00:35:19.320 where the guard notices and happens to be a member of Mindhead. And I 465 00:35:19.400 --> 00:35:24.679 love Mindhead. I love the all of the design around Mindhead, the pyramid 466 00:35:24.760 --> 00:35:30.679 stuff, the pyramid type building, the huge picture of Terrence Stamp with all 467 00:35:30.719 --> 00:35:37.000 of the people next to it, like all those faces almost Rupert pupkin esque, 468 00:35:37.239 --> 00:35:40.199 But it's just I love that, and the rules that they have for 469 00:35:40.440 --> 00:35:46.679 Kit and how he's like Kit's personal counselor. I always like those scenes between 470 00:35:46.679 --> 00:35:53.320 those two. Mindhead's building, which I guess is an actual design center in 471 00:35:53.800 --> 00:35:59.079 Los Angeles. I think it's actually nicer than I used to tell people. 472 00:35:59.079 --> 00:36:01.119 If you ever just want to have fun, you have no money. Just 473 00:36:01.159 --> 00:36:06.639 go to the Scientology Center and you're in La. Take their little test and 474 00:36:06.719 --> 00:36:10.960 take their little tour because it it's fun just to go. My god, 475 00:36:12.480 --> 00:36:16.679 but Terence stamp In here is if you want to talk about a straight man, 476 00:36:17.119 --> 00:36:22.239 it's the player. It's the street. But the whole thing with the 477 00:36:22.280 --> 00:36:25.639 auditing with him every time he says, go nance, Oh god, yes, 478 00:36:27.000 --> 00:36:32.079 buzzes. But the happy premises are they're just brilliant. It seems as 479 00:36:32.119 --> 00:36:38.880 though you were doing much better. Yes, yes, your paranoia is definitely 480 00:36:38.960 --> 00:36:45.320 under control since you came to understand. Happy Premise number one, Happy Premise 481 00:36:45.400 --> 00:36:51.840 number one. There are no aliens, Happy Premise number two, Happy Premise 482 00:36:51.920 --> 00:36:55.239 number two, There is no giant foot trying to squash me. Happy Premise 483 00:36:55.360 --> 00:37:00.639 number three, Happy Premise number three. Even though like I might ignite, 484 00:37:00.679 --> 00:37:08.480 I probably won't. So what do we do? Keep it together, keep 485 00:37:08.480 --> 00:37:10.119 it together, keep it together, keep it together, keep it together, 486 00:37:10.199 --> 00:37:15.800 keep it together. And what is it we don't do under any circumstances? 487 00:37:15.760 --> 00:37:20.800 Oh man, what is it? Look? I have to show it to 488 00:37:20.840 --> 00:37:25.159 the Laker girls. You cannot show it to the Laker girls. Keep mister 489 00:37:25.280 --> 00:37:30.840 Weeney in the pants, always in the pants. I know you want to 490 00:37:30.880 --> 00:37:35.000 show it to the Lago girls, but you must never show it to the 491 00:37:35.079 --> 00:37:40.000 Laker girls. At the same time, it is making fun of scientology. 492 00:37:40.039 --> 00:37:47.440 But I'd have to say even that is lighthearted. That's a cynical takedown of 493 00:37:47.559 --> 00:37:53.079 people who are into alternative ideas, who are part of the Hollywood establishment. 494 00:37:53.079 --> 00:38:00.519 It's just lightly pop. They could just be caaa under a different guys'tecting their 495 00:38:00.519 --> 00:38:04.119 client or their cash co It doesn't have a mean bone in its body this 496 00:38:04.159 --> 00:38:07.920 film, which is why that opening, the original opening was so surprising that 497 00:38:07.000 --> 00:38:12.840 they pitched it at the wrong tenor in the beginning. But it's so sweet 498 00:38:13.199 --> 00:38:16.000 and yeah, it's a very fleet film. There's no fat on this. 499 00:38:16.199 --> 00:38:22.480 Every single scene is pushing the story forward, and it's doing that without compromising 500 00:38:22.480 --> 00:38:27.119 the comedy. It's like sometimes for feel good films, they can just have 501 00:38:27.239 --> 00:38:30.840 this lull period where it just becomes about like the second act, where everything 502 00:38:30.880 --> 00:38:34.800 goes to shit and everybody's falling up with each other and they're all sad, 503 00:38:34.880 --> 00:38:37.159 and then somebody has to have a heart to heart moment. This doesn't have 504 00:38:37.199 --> 00:38:44.480 that. It manages to swerve all of the hacky tropes of someone calling cut 505 00:38:44.559 --> 00:38:46.400 and then you see that it's a scene and it's not an actual moment from 506 00:38:46.400 --> 00:38:50.880 the film, and you don't see any of Steve Martin's films up to this 507 00:38:50.960 --> 00:38:55.719 point. It manages to be really succinct and economical and very funny and still 508 00:38:55.760 --> 00:39:00.880 tell a cracking story. It's the writing of this film is he's the real 509 00:39:00.639 --> 00:39:05.159 starting to show for me. It's so well written, the arithmetic of this 510 00:39:05.239 --> 00:39:12.079 film that the moment that they find out that Jiff, the Kit Ramsey look 511 00:39:12.119 --> 00:39:16.320 alike that they've found and hired, that he's the brother of Kit Ramsey. 512 00:39:16.360 --> 00:39:22.360 When we find that out, and then suddenly it's like Bullfinger has this crisis 513 00:39:22.360 --> 00:39:25.320 of conscience and it's just, oh my god, I can't use this guy 514 00:39:25.360 --> 00:39:31.679 anymore. This is terrible. I'm an awful person. Next scene Jiff comes 515 00:39:31.719 --> 00:39:37.480 in is just like, guess who I slept with? And then that like 516 00:39:38.159 --> 00:39:42.719 suddenly takes that shift of power and balances it back out again. And so 517 00:39:42.880 --> 00:39:45.400 then next thing, both Fingers like, Okay, I need you to run 518 00:39:45.440 --> 00:39:49.119 an errand I want you to go to you know, Starbucks. I want 519 00:39:49.159 --> 00:39:51.880 you to do this. I want you to call your brother find out where 520 00:39:51.880 --> 00:39:54.159 he's going to be on Friday. I want you to go and grab a 521 00:39:53.840 --> 00:39:58.960 box of pencils, and I want them to be really sharp and just he 522 00:39:59.199 --> 00:40:01.760 is treating him a little bit differently, but at the same time, he 523 00:40:01.760 --> 00:40:05.960 doesn't care, and he's just gonna go on and he has to get this 524 00:40:06.039 --> 00:40:09.400 movie made, and he's he might treat Kipp or sorry, might treat Jeff 525 00:40:09.440 --> 00:40:14.480 a little nicer after that, but yeah, he still has to get this 526 00:40:14.559 --> 00:40:19.440 film completed. It gives us and it gives him permission to be really reckless 527 00:40:19.440 --> 00:40:22.559 and dangerous in the scene with him risking his life to cross the freeway. 528 00:40:22.679 --> 00:40:27.360 That's the other thing is that the comedic set pieces in this film are so 529 00:40:27.679 --> 00:40:31.679 laugh out load funny that you don't really need to understand much about filmmaking in 530 00:40:31.719 --> 00:40:37.079 general. Or I know Frank Oz was struggling to put that across teach people 531 00:40:37.159 --> 00:40:39.400 how her film has made. But if you can just buy into the fact 532 00:40:39.400 --> 00:40:44.480 that they're pranking Eddie Murphy's character, whether he's Kid or Jiff, it's just 533 00:40:44.639 --> 00:40:47.559 got bustingly hilarious. I remember watching the film on DVD with my mom and 534 00:40:47.599 --> 00:40:51.559 she wouldn't have a clue about any stuff. She's never read anything I've written 535 00:40:51.639 --> 00:40:55.199 she wouldn't even know like hor film has made. But just seeing Eddie Murphy 536 00:40:55.360 --> 00:41:00.360 walk through a parking garage and a dog is pursuing him in high he and 537 00:41:00.400 --> 00:41:04.280 he thinks he's being stalked, and he's losing his mind and he's wailing and 538 00:41:05.079 --> 00:41:07.840 trying to scare it off with these kung fun it's just hilarious. Like you, 539 00:41:09.039 --> 00:41:15.199 it's pure slapstick comedy. It's brilliant. That freeway scene always makes me 540 00:41:15.280 --> 00:41:20.599 laugh. And the thing that's interesting was I didn't realize that they staged it 541 00:41:20.639 --> 00:41:24.679 in two different manners, and now that I listened to the audio commentarium, 542 00:41:24.800 --> 00:41:29.199 oh okay, that's how they did it. I didn't realize that part of 543 00:41:29.239 --> 00:41:34.480 it was actual cars and with a really long lens so there was no danger, 544 00:41:34.519 --> 00:41:37.199 and then the other part was all digital. But given the fact that 545 00:41:37.239 --> 00:41:42.960 this is twenty five years old digital it doesn't look like digital, does not 546 00:41:43.320 --> 00:41:47.159 does not look like fake cars whatsoever. I think that's sorry to pull the 547 00:41:47.199 --> 00:41:52.639 Detroit card here, but I think that's one of the advantages of cars is 548 00:41:52.679 --> 00:41:58.239 that we've been using three D models of cars and commercials and things for so 549 00:41:58.480 --> 00:42:01.000 long that they look really good. And you can make them look really good 550 00:42:01.360 --> 00:42:06.840 film. So many of the cars that people see driving around in commercials today 551 00:42:07.280 --> 00:42:13.239 it's all three b it's all just CGI's creations. And also given the fact 552 00:42:13.280 --> 00:42:15.639 that they're going fast or blurred, so they don't have to be that good, 553 00:42:15.719 --> 00:42:19.119 you know what I mean. But still it's even to the eye, 554 00:42:19.159 --> 00:42:22.800 I'm like, this looks like traffic. And then the sound, especially with 555 00:42:22.840 --> 00:42:25.920 a freeway, if you live in a place with a freeway like that Wolf's, 556 00:42:27.400 --> 00:42:30.039 it has a certain sound and they totally captured it, and it just 557 00:42:30.119 --> 00:42:36.360 adds to the peril you feel for he's basically playing Frogger in the middle of 558 00:42:36.400 --> 00:42:39.119 the freeway. The sound of that, the sound of the high heel shoes, 559 00:42:39.159 --> 00:42:43.599 like Kevin was just talking about, that makes the scene. Is that 560 00:42:43.920 --> 00:42:46.320 the high heel shoes and when you get the reveal that it's Betsy the dog 561 00:42:46.480 --> 00:42:51.159 wearing the shoes. And that's one of the weird things about the movie. 562 00:42:51.199 --> 00:42:54.400 I do have to say is that before he tells them about Kit Ramsey being 563 00:42:54.440 --> 00:42:59.119 on board the film, he has to show that Daisy can do that come 564 00:42:59.159 --> 00:43:02.239 here and staying. But and then they're like and he's like, oh yeah, 565 00:43:02.320 --> 00:43:06.360 no, get to yes, and I'm like, we had to show 566 00:43:06.400 --> 00:43:09.760 that thing with Betsy. That was very odd, but she was a great 567 00:43:09.920 --> 00:43:15.760 canine actress and really just appreciate what she brings to it, especially just her 568 00:43:15.880 --> 00:43:20.679 laying on the couch with her legs spread wide open and such an unladylike powse. 569 00:43:21.559 --> 00:43:23.840 I'm constantly on my dogs, just like, what is yeah a little 570 00:43:23.840 --> 00:43:28.119 decorum place? Come on. I just like the rubber band he goes of 571 00:43:28.159 --> 00:43:30.880 her in rubber bands them together. But it's also a gorgeous looking for them. 572 00:43:30.920 --> 00:43:34.639 You're talking about the look of it there. I think if the other 573 00:43:35.280 --> 00:43:39.519 studio comedies of the era, this one just looks. It looks so Californian, 574 00:43:39.639 --> 00:43:45.320 like that golden hue that's basking the scenes and it's there's so many shadows 575 00:43:45.360 --> 00:43:50.960 and it's dynamically shot. It just looks sumptuous like that. They haven't scrimped 576 00:43:51.000 --> 00:43:52.800 on it. It's not shit shit, it's not shot like a sitcom. 577 00:43:53.280 --> 00:43:58.199 I appreciate it, and that they're doing all of that stuff in his office 578 00:43:58.280 --> 00:44:01.400 on a set, and that it looks like real sunlight coming in from outside. 579 00:44:01.920 --> 00:44:06.800 Really well done. That was amazing to me. I didn't realize that 580 00:44:06.960 --> 00:44:10.280 was a set. The lighting was so good. The architecture inside of the 581 00:44:10.320 --> 00:44:16.039 place looked realistic, It looked lived in. Kudos to set creator and set 582 00:44:16.039 --> 00:44:21.800 design and all of it on this film. It just looks lived in that 583 00:44:21.840 --> 00:44:25.280 way. All those little pieces of paper that you're talking about, the flyers 584 00:44:25.360 --> 00:44:30.760 for former Bowfinger productions, the posters on the wall, all of that stuff 585 00:44:30.800 --> 00:44:32.000 I thought was great. I love that he's got a touch of evil on 586 00:44:32.039 --> 00:44:38.000 the wall. Talking about another very frustrated filmmaker, Can we talk about Eddie 587 00:44:38.079 --> 00:44:42.719 Murphy double roll movies? Please? Can we just have a little moment to 588 00:44:43.039 --> 00:44:46.920 talk about when they work really well and when they don't. And obviously I 589 00:44:46.960 --> 00:44:52.599 would say this one is one of the better ones up there with Coming to 590 00:44:52.679 --> 00:44:55.960 America. Coming to America set the standard for you now. For a long 591 00:44:57.000 --> 00:45:00.960 time, as a kid, I didn't know where this kind of came from. 592 00:45:00.960 --> 00:45:05.400 I didn't know why Eddie Murphy was doing these double roles. Obviously, 593 00:45:05.400 --> 00:45:07.480 when I was young and I first saw Coming to America, I wasn't aware 594 00:45:07.480 --> 00:45:12.559 of things like The Nutty Professor, the original one with Jerry Lewis. I 595 00:45:12.559 --> 00:45:15.480 don't even think I had seen when Coming to America came out. I don't 596 00:45:15.480 --> 00:45:21.079 think i'd seen Doctor Strangelive yet, but I think it was. I read 597 00:45:21.079 --> 00:45:25.719 somewhere that Eddie Murphy was very influenced by Peter Sellers and doing these multiple roles 598 00:45:25.719 --> 00:45:30.800 in films, especially the Pink Panther series. To me, this one, 599 00:45:30.760 --> 00:45:34.480 I think, I don't know how many of their seven or eight movies that 600 00:45:34.519 --> 00:45:37.920 he's done double roles. I don't know. That's a good question for me. 601 00:45:37.000 --> 00:45:39.719 It all goes all the way back to when he was mister White on 602 00:45:39.800 --> 00:45:45.280 Saturday Night Live, and just that embracing of the prosthetics and the makeup and 603 00:45:45.400 --> 00:45:50.880 just to transform himself into a white guy. Probably one of the best looking 604 00:45:50.920 --> 00:45:58.920 transformations, way better than that bizarro Uncanny White Chicks movie that the Wayne Brothers 605 00:45:59.079 --> 00:46:07.199 are. Those blue contacts still haunt me to that White Like Me segment reminds 606 00:46:07.239 --> 00:46:09.000 me of, of course, the film we've done on the show many years 607 00:46:09.039 --> 00:46:13.880 ago, a Watermelon Man, and I thought, Godfrey Cambridge, that was 608 00:46:13.960 --> 00:46:19.000 a good ten plus years before Eddie Murphy did that White Like Me segment. 609 00:46:19.480 --> 00:46:22.320 Pulled that off really well. You gotta walk with him, but real tight. 610 00:46:22.960 --> 00:46:27.920 I was explaining this to a coworker recently who's younger than me, who 611 00:46:27.920 --> 00:46:30.719 had never seen this bit, and I was like, go look it up. 612 00:46:30.760 --> 00:46:35.599 It's so good. The Eddie Murphy White Like Me segment on Saturday Night 613 00:46:35.679 --> 00:46:39.760 Live. I think it probably speaks to Eddie's genius really as a performer, 614 00:46:39.880 --> 00:46:43.519 the fact that he can slip into these roles so easily, and he can 615 00:46:43.559 --> 00:46:47.440 mimic so many other different types of personalities that I think he would get very 616 00:46:47.440 --> 00:46:51.559 bored if he just had to play one type for whole film, because he's 617 00:46:51.559 --> 00:46:57.119 done it successfully before. So whenever I see these fantastic filmmakers who end up 618 00:46:57.159 --> 00:47:01.440 dismantling their process and just making terrible films, but it's a new way for 619 00:47:01.480 --> 00:47:06.239 them to see if they can make a film, I think that probably motivates 620 00:47:06.280 --> 00:47:10.599 a lot of the Eddie Muffy impulse to switch it up and try and play 621 00:47:10.599 --> 00:47:15.599 a woman or an old man or a fat chick or whatever. But in 622 00:47:15.639 --> 00:47:20.840 this one, he's so restrained. It's just his persona. It's his energy 623 00:47:21.400 --> 00:47:28.920 himself. It's not and effects driven sort of transformation. It's his essence. 624 00:47:28.960 --> 00:47:32.519 He's just entirely transformed in boat roles, and he manages to make both of 625 00:47:32.559 --> 00:47:40.239 the characters really endearing and sweet. They're not irritatingly stupid or aggressively obnoxious. 626 00:47:40.679 --> 00:47:45.480 There's just a nugget of humanity to vote them where you end up, even 627 00:47:45.679 --> 00:47:51.880 like rooting for them to I don't know, get through the predicament that they're 628 00:47:51.920 --> 00:47:54.519 in. It's like they one things that opposite ends of the spectrum. And 629 00:47:54.559 --> 00:48:00.159 that's the thing that's so funny about the two brothers is that Kit wants to 630 00:48:00.159 --> 00:48:01.639 be the biggest star. He wants to be bigger than Arnold, he wants 631 00:48:01.679 --> 00:48:05.239 to be all that. And then Jeff's just like, oh, man, 632 00:48:05.320 --> 00:48:07.440 I would just love to run errands. I just want to do something very 633 00:48:07.440 --> 00:48:10.880 simple. Oh that'd be great because I know when I go get the coffee, 634 00:48:12.000 --> 00:48:14.840 that's me. I went and got that for them. It's just very 635 00:48:14.880 --> 00:48:17.800 simple. It's when he's looking at Header Graham and she takes a top in 636 00:48:17.960 --> 00:48:23.599 front of him and he's like a little boy. He's guitting and he's like, 637 00:48:23.840 --> 00:48:31.079 assium you've got to be a small be a star, And I think, 638 00:48:31.119 --> 00:48:35.800 Hello Graham is the perfect foil for that, because she's just got this 639 00:48:35.960 --> 00:48:44.039 sort of magnetic like doid. It's like she's a playboy Bunny's she's just enchanting 640 00:48:44.079 --> 00:48:47.559 to watch. He just plays these global idiots so well. And yeah, 641 00:48:47.679 --> 00:48:52.599 it just makes that scene that they've cast this film so well, like across 642 00:48:52.639 --> 00:48:54.559 the board. And I was thinking around the same time, and this was 643 00:48:54.679 --> 00:49:00.840 I think maybe a year before the only other movie. And it's a movie 644 00:49:00.840 --> 00:49:06.840 where she plays someone making a movie, and it's similar but different is Boogie 645 00:49:06.920 --> 00:49:09.960 Knights, but in there she's much more realistic. And then it gets darker 646 00:49:10.000 --> 00:49:15.559 as it goes. And the fact that she basically plays Ingenu in two different 647 00:49:15.599 --> 00:49:19.000 films, it doesn't play the exact same character. In here, she's much 648 00:49:19.039 --> 00:49:22.800 more of a like he were saying, Uh, I'm just this. I 649 00:49:22.840 --> 00:49:24.800 love her lying in here where it's I may be from Ohio, but I'm 650 00:49:24.800 --> 00:49:31.280 not from Ohio. It's bad. It's I can be naive Midwestern, but 651 00:49:31.400 --> 00:49:35.880 I I have knowledge of my naive take quot. You can see the gears 652 00:49:35.880 --> 00:49:38.760 turning in her head in the scenes. She's always watching and observing and seeing 653 00:49:38.800 --> 00:49:44.880 where the angle is. And it's a fantastic performance. Definitely is And I 654 00:49:44.960 --> 00:49:52.000 love that. It's if Kit Ramsey wasn't as unstable as he is in real 655 00:49:52.039 --> 00:49:55.920 life. This whole thing wouldn't have worked nearly as well, but that they 656 00:49:57.199 --> 00:50:01.679 just happened to pick a person who thinks that he's being plagued by aliens, 657 00:50:01.800 --> 00:50:07.000 is receiving messages from the Laker girls that they want to see his penis just 658 00:50:07.360 --> 00:50:12.679 all of these things that make him unstable, and that they just play right 659 00:50:12.760 --> 00:50:16.119 into it with showing up talking to him, calling him this other name, 660 00:50:16.639 --> 00:50:22.360 leaving. It's like he's being tormented almost by ghosts in this movie, especially 661 00:50:22.440 --> 00:50:24.079 Christine Baranski. When she shows up, it's just like, Oh, I 662 00:50:24.119 --> 00:50:27.639 know I'm not supposed to do this, but I'm really looking forward to having 663 00:50:27.639 --> 00:50:34.840 sex with you later. And I'm really glad that paranoia is not known to 664 00:50:35.000 --> 00:50:40.559 anyone making the film, because a more obvious choice would be they decide they 665 00:50:40.639 --> 00:50:44.599 want to get him, so there may be is a scene where they go 666 00:50:45.000 --> 00:50:49.679 get all the supermarket tabloids or something about this person, and they're reading up 667 00:50:49.719 --> 00:50:52.280 on him, trying to figure him out, and there's maybe on a weekly 668 00:50:52.320 --> 00:50:55.559 World News or National Enquirer or something talking about, oh, he believes in 669 00:50:55.639 --> 00:51:00.679 aliens and all these things, and there's none of that. It's just he's 670 00:51:00.719 --> 00:51:06.519 an actor. We just want this actor and just by virtue of trying to 671 00:51:06.639 --> 00:51:14.559 sneak him into their film clandestinely, they just trigger all of this stuff that 672 00:51:14.679 --> 00:51:17.719 he deals with. Yeah, there's no shoeleader in the story. The other 673 00:51:17.800 --> 00:51:22.199 thing that I love about the script is they introduce characters when they have the 674 00:51:22.280 --> 00:51:25.920 maximum effect in the story. They don't fall into that trap of you have 675 00:51:25.960 --> 00:51:30.800 to introduce all the main players and Act one characters appear when they're going to 676 00:51:30.880 --> 00:51:36.239 change the trajectory of what's happening. So it's like Kit Ramsey when he gets 677 00:51:36.239 --> 00:51:39.480 introduced, or when Heater Graham's character comes into it. It's a very well 678 00:51:39.480 --> 00:51:45.519 written script. Again, to reiterate my point, there was another deleted scene 679 00:51:45.559 --> 00:51:50.480 which is both Inger trying to find the address of Kit Ramsey and he goes 680 00:51:50.519 --> 00:51:53.519 to all of these different dry cleaning places and keeps asking how much it costs 681 00:51:53.519 --> 00:51:58.679 to launder a shirt, And he finally gets to a place. He goes 682 00:51:58.800 --> 00:52:01.079 to one it's two fifth and other ones. I don't know, eight dollars. 683 00:52:01.360 --> 00:52:07.519 He goes to one and it's just this futuristic like empty white space with 684 00:52:07.639 --> 00:52:13.320 this Asian lady sitting behind a desk with a television monitor on one side, 685 00:52:13.320 --> 00:52:17.159 where you can see the plastic bags just rotating, and she has one button 686 00:52:17.280 --> 00:52:21.719 on the desk and he's like, how much do you charge the lundershirt twenty 687 00:52:21.719 --> 00:52:24.079 five dollars. I'm here to pick up kit Ramsey's dry cleaning, and she 688 00:52:24.199 --> 00:52:30.119 just hits that button and then just sits there, and it's so uncomfortable as 689 00:52:30.239 --> 00:52:34.360 we're waiting for the dry cleaning to come out, and finally he finds the 690 00:52:34.360 --> 00:52:37.159 address. We didn't need any of that stuff, and I was glad that 691 00:52:37.199 --> 00:52:39.320 they cut that out, But at the same time, it was a neat 692 00:52:39.920 --> 00:52:44.440 little scene that they kept in there for the deleted scene, so I was 693 00:52:44.480 --> 00:52:46.960 glad for that. But yeah, to your point, Kevin, this script 694 00:52:47.039 --> 00:52:52.840 just moves along so quickly, and they know exactly when to introduce those characters 695 00:52:52.840 --> 00:52:55.440 and when to get them going. I mean, when kit Ramsey shows up, 696 00:52:55.480 --> 00:53:00.239 we see a poster on a building at one point beforehand, and we 697 00:53:00.360 --> 00:53:02.400 hear his name a few times, but then we finally see him. And 698 00:53:02.440 --> 00:53:07.199 then when Jiff comes into the story later on again, it's at the perfect 699 00:53:07.239 --> 00:53:10.000 place, like we are right there for all of these beats. And to 700 00:53:10.039 --> 00:53:14.719 your point from earlier, there is no second act lull where We're just like, 701 00:53:15.400 --> 00:53:16.519 Okay, when are we going to get back here? When are we 702 00:53:16.559 --> 00:53:21.079 going to hit a band breakup? Yeah? Exactly, Yeah, everybody hates 703 00:53:21.119 --> 00:53:22.440 both finger all of a sudden, and now he has to go back and 704 00:53:22.440 --> 00:53:27.079 get them all back again. No, I'm glad that there is not that 705 00:53:27.239 --> 00:53:31.199 romantic comedy breakup moment. So you just missed that. Fleet comedies that were 706 00:53:31.280 --> 00:53:37.639 ninety minutes long rather than two ho's and twenty minutes. Let's see the old 707 00:53:37.719 --> 00:53:40.400 John Waters line. I remember him saying, no comedy should be over ninety 708 00:53:40.400 --> 00:53:45.480 minutes. He goes because no one ever says, do you want to hear 709 00:53:45.480 --> 00:53:49.320 a joke? And then it just goes on forever. I went and saw 710 00:53:49.360 --> 00:53:52.320 someone do a stand up set and it was they were still workshop wasn't ready 711 00:53:52.400 --> 00:53:55.559 yet, and it went on for two hours, and I just got so 712 00:53:55.679 --> 00:54:00.119 exhausted by it. And this is a rather well known coment who does specials, 713 00:54:00.119 --> 00:54:04.400 and I was just like, this isn't funny anymore. And I think 714 00:54:04.480 --> 00:54:08.360 part of it is is horror comedy has built and release and you just can't 715 00:54:08.440 --> 00:54:15.239 keep working that muscle so many times before you just wear out. Not I 716 00:54:15.239 --> 00:54:20.719 remember feeling that feeling watching the Austin Poe's film. I think it was the 717 00:54:20.760 --> 00:54:24.880 third one gold Member, and it was hilarious, but it just kept going 718 00:54:24.920 --> 00:54:30.039 and going, and after all it becomes unpleasant. We're just exhausted. You're 719 00:54:30.079 --> 00:54:34.519 exhausted by the amount of jokes which don't work, and they just keep going 720 00:54:34.559 --> 00:54:39.079 and keep going. But this is clockwork precision. It's they've cut out great 721 00:54:39.159 --> 00:54:45.280 jokes in order to make the whole the totality of the story support the jokes 722 00:54:45.280 --> 00:54:50.320 that it has, and it becomes just a pleasurable experience from beginning to end. 723 00:54:50.800 --> 00:54:54.599 It's the p word pacing. It's all out pacing. And that was 724 00:54:54.639 --> 00:54:58.000 the thing that was amazing to me. Like I said on that, you 725 00:54:58.079 --> 00:55:01.480 had mentioned on the audio commentary already that frank Os had eight test screenings and 726 00:55:01.519 --> 00:55:04.599 he took notes and he figured, Okay, this needs to be a longer, 727 00:55:04.639 --> 00:55:06.920 this would be a little shorter. This is the first time I've ever 728 00:55:06.960 --> 00:55:10.719 heard really a filmmaker talk about the test screening process and actually have good things 729 00:55:10.760 --> 00:55:13.440 to say about it. A lot of them are just like, oh, 730 00:55:13.519 --> 00:55:17.360 fucking test screenings are horrible. The fucking audience doesn't know anything, fuck them, 731 00:55:17.679 --> 00:55:23.119 and just really just rip the shit out of test audiences, but Oz 732 00:55:23.159 --> 00:55:27.320 obviously gets a lot. I don't know if he got a lot out of 733 00:55:27.920 --> 00:55:31.199 throughout his entire career, but definitely in this film in terms of taking into 734 00:55:31.239 --> 00:55:36.960 account how the audience was reacting. And I thought that was really interesting in 735 00:55:37.039 --> 00:55:40.159 terms of the process. It feels like comedies benefit a lot more from the 736 00:55:40.199 --> 00:55:45.599 test screenings than maybe an action film or drama or something where you're more internal. 737 00:55:45.920 --> 00:55:49.519 But with comedies, you have that external reaction, You have the laughter, 738 00:55:49.920 --> 00:55:52.719 and he's able to he being frank Os is able to hear that and 739 00:55:52.760 --> 00:55:55.760 to write down, Okay, yeah, this work, this didn't work. 740 00:55:55.760 --> 00:56:00.880 And really, just like you said, to find Hugh everything in the script 741 00:56:00.159 --> 00:56:05.480 in this film in order to maximize those laughs. It's very similar to the 742 00:56:05.599 --> 00:56:09.119 Zaz guys. They would do the same thing. I found it fascinating when 743 00:56:09.199 --> 00:56:14.119 he spoke about the beginning of the film on the other commentary and that the 744 00:56:14.159 --> 00:56:20.199 audience didn't know why they were seeing these scenes where he was going to find 745 00:56:20.920 --> 00:56:25.360 Robert Downey Junior's restaurant in order to dupe him into reading his script on what 746 00:56:25.360 --> 00:56:30.599 have You? And he felt the way to tell the audience that you can 747 00:56:30.639 --> 00:56:35.400 relax that the film knows it hasn't started yet, is to put music over 748 00:56:35.440 --> 00:56:37.679 that, and it changed the whole energy of the first act. It was 749 00:56:37.679 --> 00:56:42.599 fascinating to hear a film I could talk about practical applications of how you can 750 00:56:42.960 --> 00:56:45.639 manipulate or condition the audience and know that, yes, we were aware that 751 00:56:45.679 --> 00:56:50.159 the story hasn't kicked in yet. We're still in the setup stage, so 752 00:56:50.159 --> 00:56:52.039 we're going to have music play over this and make it into more of a 753 00:56:52.079 --> 00:56:57.440 montage, skillful direction. That was another thing I was glad that they dropped 754 00:56:57.440 --> 00:57:00.880 from the movie. Is that car, the one that Jerry Renfrow is talking 755 00:57:00.880 --> 00:57:06.079 about, Oh yeah, this is the only one in la and all this, 756 00:57:06.239 --> 00:57:09.840 And of course Dave ends up liberating it because he's a valet, and 757 00:57:10.079 --> 00:57:15.400 we have Sleader driving it later on in the film, and we see him 758 00:57:15.440 --> 00:57:19.000 drive it a few times, and then you see Jerry Renfrow in the theater 759 00:57:19.599 --> 00:57:22.920 looking up at that car and he gets this puzzled look on his face. 760 00:57:22.519 --> 00:57:28.079 In the script, he actually sees that car and it's like, I can't 761 00:57:28.119 --> 00:57:31.719 have another one of those around that I don't own, And he ends up 762 00:57:31.760 --> 00:57:37.159 buying his own car back from the movie people, and it's just like, 763 00:57:37.519 --> 00:57:40.400 Yeah, how quickly are you going to find out about that? And there's 764 00:57:40.440 --> 00:57:44.559 pink slips and all these kind of things. I'm just like, no, 765 00:57:44.760 --> 00:57:46.480 leave that alone. And I was glad that they did. They just needed 766 00:57:46.480 --> 00:57:51.639 that look on his face in the theater when they're having their huge moment of 767 00:57:51.679 --> 00:57:55.840 triumph. And that one shot where you get Kit and Jiff next to each 768 00:57:55.880 --> 00:57:59.719 other is the only time that we're doing that kind of double screen thing. 769 00:58:00.159 --> 00:58:05.440 Glad that we limit that so much because we don't need Jeff and Kip to 770 00:58:06.000 --> 00:58:08.960 ever talk in this movie. And I love the going back to what you're 771 00:58:08.960 --> 00:58:15.000 saying, Rob, As far as the doubling of stuff, it's so simple, 772 00:58:15.360 --> 00:58:20.599 the doubling of these characters, and it's much more that physicality of Jeff 773 00:58:20.760 --> 00:58:25.039 versus Kit that you have. Kit is so close to an Eddie Murphy regular 774 00:58:25.239 --> 00:58:30.119 role and then Jeff. Luckily, and I know Frank As even said, 775 00:58:30.239 --> 00:58:32.599 I don't want a lot of prosthetics. I don't want this to be completely 776 00:58:32.599 --> 00:58:37.800 different. He does have to look enough like Kit Ramsey to fake Kit Ramsey, 777 00:58:38.079 --> 00:58:43.079 but he pulls it off so well with just the ears sticking out a 778 00:58:43.119 --> 00:58:46.320 little bit. The braces the glasses, but just even the way that he 779 00:58:46.400 --> 00:58:51.800 holds his eyes when he's not wearing his glasses and when he's doing the fighting 780 00:58:51.840 --> 00:58:54.480 at the end in that Taiwanese kung fu film, just the way that he's 781 00:58:54.519 --> 00:59:00.639 moving his arms just like a spas he's getting it. It's so fun. 782 00:59:00.760 --> 00:59:05.639 And those stunt guys just go flying away when he just like moves his arm, 783 00:59:05.679 --> 00:59:08.360 waves it around a little bit, they fly off across the room so 784 00:59:08.559 --> 00:59:15.440 good. Which as I rewatched that now knowing that one of Eddie Murphy's more 785 00:59:15.480 --> 00:59:21.639 recent films that he did, Dolomite, it has this kind of chopshaki horrible 786 00:59:21.719 --> 00:59:25.719 low budget kung fu movies. But for me, what sets the film over 787 00:59:25.760 --> 00:59:30.199 the top is the premiere at the end, when they've pulled it all off 788 00:59:30.760 --> 00:59:36.400 and they're all sitting there and they're watching the film play out, and it's 789 00:59:36.480 --> 00:59:40.280 just the pushings on their faces and they've done it. It's so sincere and 790 00:59:40.360 --> 00:59:44.559 sweet, and I just love the fact that it went there, that it 791 00:59:44.639 --> 00:59:46.880 didn't try and layer it with so many levels of irony, or it didn't 792 00:59:46.880 --> 00:59:51.960 try and be glib or try and diffuse it. It just pushed in on 793 00:59:52.039 --> 00:59:55.840 Steve Martin's face and just allowed us to feel what he felt, which is 794 00:59:57.000 --> 01:00:00.840 just awe and joy and it's so I just love it for that. It 795 01:00:00.880 --> 01:00:06.280 always chokes me up because it's so sincere, because it's it's wearing its hat 796 01:00:06.320 --> 01:00:08.679 on its sleeve and can I also talk about in that scene, I love 797 01:00:08.719 --> 01:00:15.480 the fact that he doesn't go with Heather Graham's character. I feel actually that 798 01:00:15.559 --> 01:00:20.119 he belongs with Christine Baranski's character. I think that would have been an extra 799 01:00:20.199 --> 01:00:24.559 piece in the script where it's finally they realize that we're misfits and we should 800 01:00:24.559 --> 01:00:30.119 be together and they're more appropriate for each other in certainly. But I just 801 01:00:30.199 --> 01:00:32.239 love her and this she's so good. Like I say, she did a 802 01:00:32.280 --> 01:00:37.480 lot of TV sitcom work, but her work in here is great. I 803 01:00:37.480 --> 01:00:38.920 think the first time I ever saw her, I believe, was in the 804 01:00:38.960 --> 01:00:45.440 ref where she plays the mother great film in the family, and she's just 805 01:00:45.159 --> 01:00:52.000 perfect that It's one of my favorite holiday comedies. But I just always have 806 01:00:52.719 --> 01:00:55.159 thought she's just a great actress. I was trying to find out if this 807 01:00:55.320 --> 01:00:59.679 is true or not, but there was a moment where she's driving around and 808 01:00:59.719 --> 01:01:06.719 she's kit and she goes to stop. It's when he's basically shilling for clothes, 809 01:01:06.840 --> 01:01:10.239 like, but when he's got this one of his entourage wearing the suit, 810 01:01:10.519 --> 01:01:15.480 Okay, do the thing and he holds up the face of Kid Ramsay 811 01:01:15.559 --> 01:01:16.639 in front of his own face. Yeah, I'll look good in that. 812 01:01:19.920 --> 01:01:22.719 I like that. It's so good. But when she's driving around in that 813 01:01:22.760 --> 01:01:27.599 scene, there's music playing on her radio, I swear to sing singing, 814 01:01:27.760 --> 01:01:30.000 Yeah that's what I thought. Okay, yeah, I was looking for that 815 01:01:30.079 --> 01:01:35.199 in the credits and I was like, I'm not crazy, yeah, because 816 01:01:35.239 --> 01:01:38.079 she just seems so full of herself, but in a lovable way. Like 817 01:01:38.480 --> 01:01:43.800 she could be the most insufferable character in this movie because she's so much about 818 01:01:43.840 --> 01:01:47.159 the craft and all this, and she ends up being so super sweet. 819 01:01:47.239 --> 01:01:52.840 It's really nice. My biggest guffar that I got on a rewatch because I 820 01:01:52.920 --> 01:01:54.519 remember all the big moments, but it's the little ones that just catch you 821 01:01:54.559 --> 01:02:00.360 off. Guarreth And it's when both Finger is laying out the plan and it's 822 01:02:00.360 --> 01:02:05.840 you only get one take with Kit and she goes one take. It's the 823 01:02:05.920 --> 01:02:09.559 horror of what It's the way that she just delivers such a throwaway line, 824 01:02:09.639 --> 01:02:14.880 but I just go forward, because yeah, there's nothing funnier to me than 825 01:02:14.960 --> 01:02:19.199 somebody lying and trying to hold on to a lion and keep a secret and 826 01:02:19.320 --> 01:02:23.639 duping others, and yeah, she's hilarious. She's always criticizing other people where 827 01:02:23.679 --> 01:02:28.880 it's like Robert de Niro couldn't play this role. She's oh, he annoys 828 01:02:29.000 --> 01:02:32.119 me. Going back to that premiere, of course, I was reminded so 829 01:02:32.320 --> 01:02:37.199 much of ed Wood when I was watching that, And there are quite a 830 01:02:37.199 --> 01:02:40.719 few times throughout this movie where I was just like, this lovable band of 831 01:02:40.800 --> 01:02:45.400 losers making a movie despite all odds, and really in a very illegal way, 832 01:02:45.920 --> 01:02:51.480 like when the cop pulls up you get that that great I think frank 833 01:02:51.519 --> 01:02:54.920 As calls it the back of headline. Have you ever thought about being an 834 01:02:54.960 --> 01:03:00.400 actor? But yeah, that whole idea of these lovable losers who are doing 835 01:03:00.719 --> 01:03:06.599 this illegal filming so reminds me of Edwood, and I to your point, 836 01:03:06.840 --> 01:03:09.039 Rob, as far as like movies about movies, it feels like that really 837 01:03:09.239 --> 01:03:14.039 kicked off a movement in the nineties. I was thinking about this as I 838 01:03:14.119 --> 01:03:16.840 was watching this, because basically, between about nineteen ninety five and two thousand, 839 01:03:17.280 --> 01:03:24.719 there is at least a half dozen movies specifically about movie making and the 840 01:03:24.760 --> 01:03:30.639 backstage and front stage of movie making, and also not just movie making big 841 01:03:30.679 --> 01:03:37.480 budget movies, but low budget and bad movie making. And so I have 842 01:03:37.559 --> 01:03:42.199 to say it probably is Edwood that really kicked it off a little bit before 843 01:03:42.239 --> 01:03:45.639 that, but a little bit artier about the backstage process a little bit although 844 01:03:45.639 --> 01:03:51.000 it's not really on the set is the player, And I was thinking about 845 01:03:51.199 --> 01:03:57.480 maybe Altman opened up the whole thing about agents and the process kind of thing, 846 01:03:57.760 --> 01:04:00.320 but really I think it was Edwood that did it, and then for 847 01:04:00.440 --> 01:04:03.960 me following right after that, and I can't remember which one came out first. 848 01:04:03.960 --> 01:04:09.039 I have to look at release dates. Is Bofinger has a lot of 849 01:04:09.079 --> 01:04:15.559 similarities to get Shorty in that the Harry Zim character is Bowfinger. He's this 850 01:04:15.639 --> 01:04:18.440 low budget guy and he and he's got this little office and all that stuff. 851 01:04:18.960 --> 01:04:24.440 And then the movie that we've done on the show, and this is 852 01:04:24.480 --> 01:04:28.480 the cynical one. They're all cynical, though, I think all the films 853 01:04:28.480 --> 01:04:32.320 are boats the Hollywood and filmmaking, but this one is the really cynical one. 854 01:04:32.639 --> 01:04:38.239 Is my good friend Lloyd and Terror Firmer and when he made that one. 855 01:04:38.639 --> 01:04:42.559 You can obviously tell that Lloyd's fucking pissed. He's just I've been making 856 01:04:42.559 --> 01:04:45.800 these low budget movies for twenty years. I don't make any fucking money. 857 01:04:45.119 --> 01:04:50.000 Everything sucks. Hollywood's run by a bunch of fucking idiots, and I've got 858 01:04:50.000 --> 01:04:56.519 to make I'm playing a blind film director making a low budget movie. Terror 859 01:04:56.599 --> 01:05:00.360 Firmer, go watch that and listen to that. But I've it is also 860 01:05:00.480 --> 01:05:06.559 even thinking about documentary and how another really quotable film is American move and about 861 01:05:06.639 --> 01:05:11.400 the guys in Wisconsin trying to make this low budget horror movie. There must 862 01:05:11.440 --> 01:05:14.119 have just been something in the water in that period. I don't know what 863 01:05:14.199 --> 01:05:17.960 it was that, for some reason there was just a bunch of filmmakers that 864 01:05:18.000 --> 01:05:23.039 wanted to make movies about low budget filmmaker. I wonder if it was a 865 01:05:23.039 --> 01:05:27.760 reflection of the indie boom that was happening. I mean, starting in ninety 866 01:05:27.920 --> 01:05:32.199 two, I'm trying to think of So you have like Blood Simple, You've 867 01:05:32.199 --> 01:05:36.920 got your sexualized videotapes, you've got your reservoir dogs, and like those movies 868 01:05:38.039 --> 01:05:43.199 really start to re shape Hollywood and it becomes much more of the what was 869 01:05:43.239 --> 01:05:47.400 it called the slackers, Dikes, Mikes and Spikes of the world. I 870 01:05:47.440 --> 01:05:50.719 can't remember the name of the book, but you've got like the Robert rodriguezz 871 01:05:50.800 --> 01:05:54.719 and all of these folks that are coming up. I'm thinking that it's a 872 01:05:54.719 --> 01:05:59.599 reflection of that with look at how easy or difficult it is to make a 873 01:05:59.679 --> 01:06:03.800 movie and how you need all of the spirit to do it. Living in 874 01:06:03.880 --> 01:06:09.920 Oblivion. It's amazing to me that Living in Oblivion is ninety five, same 875 01:06:10.039 --> 01:06:15.679 year as ed Wood and Get Shorty. It's like that movie is already parroting 876 01:06:15.239 --> 01:06:19.320 making these independent films. There's even that line, you know, the only 877 01:06:19.320 --> 01:06:24.360 reason I took a part in this movie is because someone said that you were 878 01:06:24.440 --> 01:06:30.719 tight with Quentin Tarantino, which was allegedly based on I think Brad Pitt or 879 01:06:30.760 --> 01:06:32.719 something. Now that I think about it, Mike, I really do think 880 01:06:32.760 --> 01:06:36.519 that it probably was related to that, because that was when I was in 881 01:06:36.559 --> 01:06:41.239 high school, and I remember discussions about, oh, we like clerks. 882 01:06:41.280 --> 01:06:44.719 We made this on our credit card, or we snuck these shots. So 883 01:06:44.840 --> 01:06:49.079 it was much more of a move away from everything being studio bound, big 884 01:06:49.159 --> 01:06:55.840 budgets and all of these things, and I think took people into movie making 885 01:06:55.880 --> 01:07:00.599 in a way that whole kind of sun Dance raft basically from Sex Flies forward, 886 01:07:00.679 --> 01:07:06.360 so eighty nine forward really brought the scale of film down and made it 887 01:07:06.400 --> 01:07:10.679 more accessible. So I think probably you're right. I like to hear that 888 01:07:11.119 --> 01:07:14.079 that you're right. Absolutely, you're always right. What are you wrong? 889 01:07:14.360 --> 01:07:17.320 Living in Oblivion actually has probably the truest representation of what it's like to make 890 01:07:17.360 --> 01:07:25.519 a film where he has that moment where Katherine Keener gives this incredible performance and 891 01:07:25.559 --> 01:07:27.840 there's no film in the camera, and then when they have to do it 892 01:07:27.880 --> 01:07:30.039 again, she can't recapture it, and it's that moment it's just gone, 893 01:07:30.079 --> 01:07:33.519 and the heartache and heartbreak of that. But also you had lots of films 894 01:07:33.559 --> 01:07:39.920 at the time that were about very literate characters, like the screen films where 895 01:07:39.920 --> 01:07:45.159 they are film fans. You wouldn't really have films about characters who were aware 896 01:07:45.440 --> 01:07:47.920 of films in general. They almost used to just exist in this bubble. 897 01:07:48.599 --> 01:07:53.400 So yeah, it was just everyone was quite literate in the nineties and postmodernism, 898 01:07:53.480 --> 01:07:58.599 and I suppose peeling back the curtain and the charad and the facade of 899 01:07:58.639 --> 01:08:02.079 filmmaking in general I think was I'll be ripe for send them the whole thing 900 01:08:02.119 --> 01:08:05.199 with the screen films and that postmodernism. I think a lot of that has 901 01:08:05.280 --> 01:08:10.039 to do with the fact you and I Mike both worked in one video stores 902 01:08:10.679 --> 01:08:15.320 and because of everything shifted to oh, we can just watch tapes, so 903 01:08:15.360 --> 01:08:17.800 we can just rent tapes, we can get into backlogs of all this stuff 904 01:08:18.359 --> 01:08:24.199 and really become extremely film literate. And you can see where that leads leads 905 01:08:24.199 --> 01:08:30.239 only to madness, it leads to podcasts exactly. Especially in our current era, 906 01:08:30.720 --> 01:08:34.159 the audience was much hipper in that way, So I think it probably 907 01:08:34.199 --> 01:08:38.800 is that combination, as you guys were pointing out, was the Sundance indie 908 01:08:38.840 --> 01:08:44.239 boom, and then also just people were more film literate thanks to vhs and 909 01:08:44.439 --> 01:08:46.880 home videos. Send them a new vool, good way to take it right 910 01:08:46.920 --> 01:08:54.000 back to the beginning, moving beyond just riffing on low budget indie film in 911 01:08:54.000 --> 01:08:58.840 that period in late ninety two thousands, what other films about filmmaking do you 912 01:08:59.079 --> 01:09:02.000 like? Would you recommend to someone? It's there in the film. I 913 01:09:02.039 --> 01:09:09.119 don't particularly like watching films about filmmaking because it's so naf to me. It's 914 01:09:08.840 --> 01:09:14.680 that very recently there was that film by Jarappato, The Bubble, and it 915 01:09:14.760 --> 01:09:19.039 was just like it's such low hanging fruit. You've got the pretentious actor and 916 01:09:19.119 --> 01:09:27.399 the torture director and the conniving producer, and it's all about like how superficial 917 01:09:27.840 --> 01:09:31.439 and dumb it is to make a film. And it just feels like it's 918 01:09:31.439 --> 01:09:34.880 so obvious that it's not funny or it's not enlightening. There's nothing to really 919 01:09:34.880 --> 01:09:40.399 say about anything with that. It's snake eating its own tail. So for 920 01:09:40.520 --> 01:09:44.960 me, it's it's when they go so far outside the realm of making a 921 01:09:44.960 --> 01:09:47.680 film that it becomes about the characters that would inhabit that world, the types 922 01:09:47.720 --> 01:09:53.319 of people. It's like Tropic Thunder where you're pulling them out of making a 923 01:09:53.319 --> 01:09:57.960 film and seeing how they cope with the reality situation. Or Three Amigos or 924 01:09:58.600 --> 01:10:03.399 Galaxy Quest, where it's the archetypes in an unfamiliar situation and trying to continue 925 01:10:03.399 --> 01:10:10.319 with the delusions that they have. That's where I find those types of characters 926 01:10:10.560 --> 01:10:15.199 the most entertaining. Really, those are all really excellent choices. For me. 927 01:10:15.279 --> 01:10:19.560 I was thinking about contempt, like Guard's contempt, but really the other 928 01:10:19.600 --> 01:10:25.279 guy true Fau's Day for Night, so depressing those really good I like it 929 01:10:25.319 --> 01:10:28.880 though it's just me. But the one that has always stuck with me, 930 01:10:29.359 --> 01:10:31.880 and it's this I don't know if either of you have seen William Greeves's Symbio 931 01:10:31.960 --> 01:10:38.279 Psychotaxaplasm. It's the It's this layering of they're trying to make a film, 932 01:10:38.279 --> 01:10:41.279 and then there's a documentary about the film taking place at the same time, 933 01:10:41.319 --> 01:10:46.279 and then there's this third layer. It's a odd film. It is experimental 934 01:10:46.800 --> 01:10:49.560 in the best way that I can think of it. And this is nineteen 935 01:10:49.560 --> 01:10:54.199 sixty eight. What this movie with me? If you're interested in sort of 936 01:10:54.239 --> 01:11:00.359 these layers of kind of meta media discussion, I think Symbio Psycho Tax of 937 01:11:00.399 --> 01:11:03.720 Pleasure it's probably worth your time. And I'm not doing it justice by explaining 938 01:11:03.760 --> 01:11:06.159 it, because I don't think you can. I think it's a movie that 939 01:11:06.199 --> 01:11:11.640 you really have to see in its own slum. What's weird? I guess 940 01:11:11.680 --> 01:11:15.359 I like one that's more tangential to it because I always go back to Sunset 941 01:11:15.359 --> 01:11:19.720 Boulevard when it comes to movies about making movies, but so little of it 942 01:11:19.800 --> 01:11:24.319 takes place on a sound stage and they never get the movie made. But 943 01:11:24.800 --> 01:11:30.000 that whole quest to make this new version of Salame that Norma Desmond is going 944 01:11:30.079 --> 01:11:33.560 to star in and more of the old days and talking about that the whole 945 01:11:33.560 --> 01:11:42.119 wax works things with the silent actors who are cast aside Buster Keaton and whatnot. 946 01:11:43.159 --> 01:11:46.840 That's probably my favorite movie about making movies, even though like I said, 947 01:11:46.880 --> 01:11:51.279 it's more in the background of that my favorite movie. But making movies 948 01:11:51.319 --> 01:11:57.039 is Bullfinger ring us around again? Glad you're on this episode, No, 949 01:11:57.119 --> 01:12:01.720 but I genuinely I just find it disinteresting to me. It's like, the 950 01:12:01.760 --> 01:12:04.920 things that I love about this film is that it doesn't do the obvious. 951 01:12:05.199 --> 01:12:09.880 It doesn't have the tortured I've said it already on this episode, but like 952 01:12:10.640 --> 01:12:14.760 a more cleaner take if it would probably be you open with some chaos happening 953 01:12:14.760 --> 01:12:18.279 on screen and then someone yells cut and you're on a set and I've seen 954 01:12:18.319 --> 01:12:23.960 that hundreds of times. At this stage. It's never funny. And I'm 955 01:12:23.960 --> 01:12:28.640 glad that both Fingers doesn't fall into those traps. And speaking of and I 956 01:12:28.640 --> 01:12:30.640 think this might be part of the reason why when I saw this movie, 957 01:12:30.680 --> 01:12:35.439 I was like, it's good, but it feels didn't really was Hail Caesar 958 01:12:36.039 --> 01:12:43.039 Kale Caesar feels like that where it's I expected better of the Coen Brothers. 959 01:12:43.239 --> 01:12:45.520 In certain ways, it's good, but it's not great. It has this 960 01:12:46.239 --> 01:12:48.960 way, it does that kind of thing where there's a big scene and the 961 01:12:49.079 --> 01:12:53.039 cut, yeah, whistle, what's going on? Where I'm the set and 962 01:12:53.039 --> 01:12:57.840 then and then there's all these personalities that the Josh Browling character has to interact 963 01:12:57.840 --> 01:13:02.319 with and deal with in all their various and I just felt like it didn't 964 01:13:02.359 --> 01:13:06.039 elevate for me. And granted, I haven't seen it since it was in 965 01:13:06.079 --> 01:13:10.640 the theater, so I only saw it once, but I haven't gone back 966 01:13:10.720 --> 01:13:14.520 to it, which is rare because Collen Brothers Movies album what was that film? 967 01:13:14.600 --> 01:13:17.159 But the making of Hitchcock that was interesting. I think it was just 968 01:13:17.199 --> 01:13:21.000 called Hitchcock, wasn't it. So the making of the Birds was it? 969 01:13:21.000 --> 01:13:25.560 It was the one with Scout at your Hanson when she was playing John Lee 970 01:13:25.640 --> 01:13:28.760 and Helen Mirriam was Missus Hitchcock, and I think it was, you know, 971 01:13:29.199 --> 01:13:32.199 often because there were two Hitchcocks right around the same time. Yeah, 972 01:13:32.239 --> 01:13:35.439 because it was the one with Anthony Happen. There was Anthony Hopkins and there 973 01:13:35.840 --> 01:13:39.640 was it. Toby Jones was the other one. Yeah, he always tends 974 01:13:39.680 --> 01:13:45.119 to get the deep impact of the Armageddon role in those films Capote or whatever. 975 01:13:45.880 --> 01:13:48.039 Yeah, I can't remember which what the name of that one was. 976 01:13:48.159 --> 01:13:53.439 It's funny when you talked about movies at the very first episode of this podcast 977 01:13:53.479 --> 01:13:59.479 was The stunt Man, and feel might have You're right, that might have 978 01:13:59.560 --> 01:14:02.640 that, oh we're on a movie set moment, but it just works for 979 01:14:02.680 --> 01:14:05.880 me. That whole movie works really well. And going back to the Coen 980 01:14:05.960 --> 01:14:11.239 Brothers, I mean after they gave is Barton Fink, It's like that is 981 01:14:11.319 --> 01:14:15.079 so perfect. Talk about tortured artists, but an artist that you almost want 982 01:14:15.119 --> 01:14:18.560 to see tortured because I don't like Barton Fink as a person, and I 983 01:14:18.920 --> 01:14:23.119 like when he's being tortured, and it will show you the little life of 984 01:14:23.159 --> 01:14:30.319 the mind with fun footage even count because you've taken into the hands of like 985 01:14:30.640 --> 01:14:35.840 regular people making their own film. Perhaps No, I hate found footage movies 986 01:14:35.880 --> 01:14:40.560 so much of the time. Like there's some good ones, I will grant 987 01:14:40.600 --> 01:14:45.520 you that, but so much of the time the conceit of this actually being 988 01:14:45.560 --> 01:14:53.560 a found piece of media somehow, VHS film whatever, it loses. Are 989 01:14:53.600 --> 01:14:59.319 you seeing this? Yeah, he loses it so quickly, and just the 990 01:14:59.399 --> 01:15:01.880 VHS movies, I'm just like, first off, this doesn't look like VHS, 991 01:15:02.239 --> 01:15:05.880 And second off, who is editing all this stuff together? This is 992 01:15:06.119 --> 01:15:10.319 if this is shot on a VHS camera. You've got one camera. How 993 01:15:10.319 --> 01:15:13.800 are we doing all these multiple angles here? So yeah, there are a 994 01:15:13.800 --> 01:15:16.560 few good ones that are out there, definitely, but for the most part, 995 01:15:16.560 --> 01:15:18.920 I'm just like, oh, it just drives me crazy, Like when 996 01:15:18.920 --> 01:15:25.319 you what was that one that was supposed to be, oh, the Survival 997 01:15:25.359 --> 01:15:28.920 of the Dead, one of those George Romero later films where it was just 998 01:15:28.960 --> 01:15:31.880 like Diary Diary Dead. It's just like, who's setting up all these lights 999 01:15:31.920 --> 01:15:35.920 everywhere? Why we're out on this road at night? How come there's so 1000 01:15:36.000 --> 01:15:41.960 many lights everywhere? I haven't seen it in twenty years, but I always 1001 01:15:41.960 --> 01:15:45.439 felt that of the found footage, I always thought Blair Witch worked, but 1002 01:15:45.520 --> 01:15:49.319 it really worked when I always loved telling the story of working at the theater 1003 01:15:49.359 --> 01:15:53.359 where we had the two week exclusive and he had to go. It was 1004 01:15:53.399 --> 01:15:57.359 either Detroit or Toronto or Chicago and that was it. So it was like 1005 01:15:57.439 --> 01:16:00.920 five hour drive either way, and people would common to be like, oh, 1006 01:16:00.960 --> 01:16:02.880 it's real, and I go, come on, if you disappeared in 1007 01:16:02.880 --> 01:16:06.760 the woods and all they found was your footage, Are your parents really that 1008 01:16:06.880 --> 01:16:11.680 cynical to sign off to let filmmakers make a movie out of it? Of 1009 01:16:11.680 --> 01:16:15.359 course? Really, yeah, that's what you do these days. It would 1010 01:16:15.359 --> 01:16:19.840 open with World Star. I remember Blair Witch and that moment when he was 1011 01:16:19.880 --> 01:16:25.039 standing in the corner. I'd been conditioned for jump scars, for people to 1012 01:16:25.079 --> 01:16:29.119 scream, and instead there was just an inhale. It was like three hundred 1013 01:16:29.119 --> 01:16:32.680 people just inhaled, and you could feel the blood drained from people. It 1014 01:16:32.720 --> 01:16:38.000 was a chill rather than the scream, and just knew that you were watching 1015 01:16:38.159 --> 01:16:43.439 a film that was very it felt unsafe, more innocent times. Nineteen ninety 1016 01:16:43.520 --> 01:16:46.279 nine. Speaking of nineteen ninety nine, because this movie came out, it's 1017 01:16:46.319 --> 01:16:51.279 not mentioned in the book, but Best Movie Year Ever is the title of 1018 01:16:51.319 --> 01:16:55.039 the book, and it's a good survey of nineteen ninety nine in which they 1019 01:16:55.079 --> 01:16:58.920 say, basically, it was the last really interesting year of film, and 1020 01:16:58.960 --> 01:17:03.199 they go into a history of why these kind of different threads all came together 1021 01:17:03.720 --> 01:17:08.920 to make nineteen ninety nine probably one of the more interesting years in cinema history. 1022 01:17:09.319 --> 01:17:11.279 All right, guys, let's go ahead and take a break and play 1023 01:17:11.279 --> 01:17:16.239 a preview for next week's show right after these brief messages, Remember the stories 1024 01:17:16.239 --> 01:17:20.119 that kept you awake at night? They're living in that closet, Doctor Fenner, 1025 01:17:20.359 --> 01:17:25.319 Can you still hear the screams? I love having the children for dinner. 1026 01:17:25.680 --> 01:17:30.720 All from your television set in the Night Gallery A Dark Side Midnight Viewing, 1027 01:17:31.439 --> 01:17:38.279 the Horror Anthology Podcast join hosts fatherm Alone, Mike White, and Chris 1028 01:17:38.239 --> 01:17:42.720 Statue as they exhume some of the most infamous horror television of all time. 1029 01:17:43.479 --> 01:17:54.439 Midnight Viewing from weirding Way Media. I'll tell you one thing, whoever set 1030 01:17:54.520 --> 01:17:57.319 us up is freely connected. What are you doing? What are you doing? 1031 01:17:57.319 --> 01:18:02.920 What do you do? Black soap? And don't flatter yourself? Meet 1032 01:18:03.079 --> 01:18:08.880 Ray Tango. He likes money, he has to come, he should go, 1033 01:18:09.439 --> 01:18:15.000 but doesn't bother with cash. Meet Gay Cash. He won't dance around 1034 01:18:15.039 --> 01:18:20.600 trouble and doesn't mind her stepping on toes. Ate. Guys, two of 1035 01:18:20.800 --> 01:18:27.720 LA's top rival cops are having a t time staying in rhythm. You know, 1036 01:18:27.840 --> 01:18:30.079 man, Yeah, here, you're the second best cabin that's funny man. 1037 01:18:30.159 --> 01:18:36.239 The same thing about you. But they're going to have to work together 1038 01:18:36.960 --> 01:18:42.199 even if it kills them. Like now, we'll take it. No, 1039 01:18:42.720 --> 01:18:51.880 that's one of a kind. We won't put a scratch on you. Should 1040 01:18:51.880 --> 01:18:57.600 you sleep with my sister? I was so drunk, I honestly I don't 1041 01:18:57.640 --> 01:19:04.439 remember. Okay, So best stallone and Kurt Russell Tango and Cash, that's 1042 01:19:04.479 --> 01:19:09.319 right. Next week we're still in comedy Month, but we're looking at Tango 1043 01:19:09.359 --> 01:19:13.159 and Cash, which I guess is supposed to be funny. Until then, 1044 01:19:13.199 --> 01:19:15.880 I want to thank this week's co host Rob and Kevin. So, Rob, 1045 01:19:15.920 --> 01:19:17.039 what has been going on with you? Sir? Just living out in 1046 01:19:17.079 --> 01:19:21.640 the high desert. I'm enjoying it and doing some writing, trying to learn 1047 01:19:21.640 --> 01:19:26.640 some Espanol and so I don't sound too much like a gringo at times, 1048 01:19:26.720 --> 01:19:32.359 and enjoying life. See Kevin, how about yourself? Just writing away from 1049 01:19:32.359 --> 01:19:38.800 my sins and releasing episodes of my podcast with my more accomplished co host, 1050 01:19:39.119 --> 01:19:43.119 Will Collins. It's called The Best Bits and yeah, you can find this 1051 01:19:43.279 --> 01:19:46.800 wherever you listen to podcasts. Will's want a BAFTA and I've been nominated for 1052 01:19:46.800 --> 01:19:56.560 a Razzie and that the gist of talk about films. What I find really 1053 01:19:56.560 --> 01:20:00.880 irritating is that he records with the BAFTA behind him, have to keep oh 1054 01:20:01.239 --> 01:20:08.159 oh, and you didn't even work you No, I didn't know. I 1055 01:20:08.159 --> 01:20:12.199 don't know. Is that considered a good thing or desperately wanted to win a 1056 01:20:12.279 --> 01:20:15.640 Razzie. I've never won anything for writing, and to have won a Razzie 1057 01:20:15.720 --> 01:20:19.640 is the first thing I'd ever for anything I'd ever written. I would have 1058 01:20:19.640 --> 01:20:21.920 dined out in that for the rest of my life. So I'm got it. 1059 01:20:21.920 --> 01:20:26.560 It was that Diana film that won instead. That's just not fair. 1060 01:20:26.680 --> 01:20:30.640 I think that whole thing has fixed myself. That whole thing is bullshit, 1061 01:20:30.960 --> 01:20:35.560 I think myself. I don't know. Maybe you should have did one of 1062 01:20:35.560 --> 01:20:43.960 those big carpet bombing pr campaigns for your consideration, For your consideration, please 1063 01:20:44.039 --> 01:20:46.600 vote for me for the Razzie. Would have wanted that sit up with a 1064 01:20:46.640 --> 01:20:50.000 deck chair and a code vote for me. The thing is, I was 1065 01:20:50.039 --> 01:20:54.479 a co worder on that project with about seven other writers, and I think 1066 01:20:54.760 --> 01:20:58.960 the other six were mortified about being nominated, while I was just constantly telling 1067 01:20:59.000 --> 01:21:02.800 everyone that I was nominated. So I was drawing more attention to the fact 1068 01:21:02.800 --> 01:21:06.319 that the film that we will call writers on was nominated for a Razzie. 1069 01:21:06.319 --> 01:21:10.159 But I don't care about that stuff. It's good fun. Some of the 1070 01:21:10.199 --> 01:21:15.399 best movies that we've covered have been nominated for Razzie, so they have absolutely 1071 01:21:15.520 --> 01:21:18.880 zero taste exactly. Thank you so much guys for being on the show. 1072 01:21:18.920 --> 01:21:21.560 Thanks to everybody for listening. If you want to hear more of me shooting 1073 01:21:21.600 --> 01:21:25.199 off my mouth, please check out some of the other shows that I work 1074 01:21:25.199 --> 01:21:29.279 on. They are all available at Weirdingwaymedia dot com. Thanks especially to our 1075 01:21:29.319 --> 01:21:31.720 Patreon community. If you want to join the community, visit patreon dot com 1076 01:21:31.720 --> 01:21:36.079 slash Projection booth. Every donation we get helps the projection both take over the 1077 01:21:36.079 --> 01:21:43.159 world. Life's like a movie. Write your own ending, keep be leaving, 1078 01:21:43.520 --> 01:21:49.720 keep pretending we've done just what we've set up to do. Thanks to 1079 01:21:50.039 --> 01:22:40.359 the love the dream Chocolate rain. Some spell dry and others feel the pain 1080 01:22:40.520 --> 01:22:45.760 Chocolate rain. A baby born will die before this. In chocolate rain, 1081 01:22:47.279 --> 01:22:54.399 the school books say it can't be here again. Chocolate Rain. The prisons 1082 01:22:54.479 --> 01:23:00.680 make you wonder where it when Chocolate rain, and say the world to dry. 1083 01:23:00.800 --> 01:23:10.039 Chocolate rain. Zoom the camera out and see the chocolate rain. Both 1084 01:23:10.159 --> 01:23:15.960 has to be falling yesterday. Chocolate rain only in the past year, is 1085 01:23:15.960 --> 01:23:26.079 what they say. Chocolate rain wise your neighborhood insurance rage. Chocolate rain makes 1086 01:23:26.199 --> 01:23:32.279 us happy living in again. Chocolate rain made me cross the street the other 1087 01:23:32.439 --> 01:23:40.079 day. Chocolate rain made you turn your head the other way. Chocolate rain 1088 01:23:41.800 --> 01:23:47.479 it straight, quickly crashing through your venge. Chocolate rain using you to far 1089 01:23:47.640 --> 01:23:55.079 back down again. Chocolate rain, it's straight, quickly crashing through your venge. 1090 01:23:55.159 --> 01:24:02.680 Chocolate rain using you to far back down again. Chocolate rain tell them 1091 01:24:02.800 --> 01:24:11.000 mentioned on the radio. Chocolate rain, it's the here your leader's car control. 1092 01:24:11.119 --> 01:24:19.359 Chocolate rain worse than swearing Western cardling names. Chocolp rain said it publicly 1093 01:24:19.600 --> 01:24:26.920 and you're insane. Chocolate rain, No one wants to hear about it now. 1094 01:24:27.079 --> 01:24:32.439 Chocolate rain, which real hard, It goes away somehow. Chocolate rain 1095 01:24:34.079 --> 01:24:41.159 makes the best of friends begin to buy chocolate rain. But did they know 1096 01:24:41.399 --> 01:24:47.239 each other? In the light? Chocolate rain Every February we washed away. 1097 01:24:47.399 --> 01:24:56.359 Chocolate rain stays be high. This colors tell the bray. Chocolate rain the 1098 01:24:56.399 --> 01:25:02.199 same crime hell a high your price the page Chocolate rain the Georgian juries where 1099 01:25:02.279 --> 01:25:09.319 it is not the best. Chocolate rain is free, quickly crashing through your 1100 01:25:09.399 --> 01:25:16.920 venge. Chocolate rain, using you the far back down against Chocolate rain is 1101 01:25:17.039 --> 01:25:24.880 three, quickly crashing through your venge chocolate rain, using you the far back 1102 01:25:24.920 --> 01:25:33.840 down against chocolate ring, thirsty secrets of economy. Chocolate rain turns that body 1103 01:25:34.000 --> 01:25:42.680 into GDP chocolate rain. The bilker blames the baby's the and a chocolate ring, 1104 01:25:44.199 --> 01:25:50.239 but this scores out how much the parents make chocolate ring flipping cousin France. 1105 01:25:50.359 --> 01:25:58.239 The other night, chocolate rain cleans us so without beneath mumba, Chocolate 1106 01:25:58.439 --> 01:26:03.119 rain cross the world, and that gets all the same. Chocolate Rain. 1107 01:26:04.800 --> 01:26:12.760 Angels cry and shake their heads and shame. Chocolate rain, loose the chaparim 1108 01:26:12.880 --> 01:26:18.520 dicens and chocolate rain. Which part do you think you'll leave than in chocolate 1109 01:26:18.840 --> 01:26:27.920 rain, more than march and more than pasting Lord. Chocolate Rain remake how 1110 01:26:28.079 --> 01:26:33.039 we got to where we are? Chocolate rain, it's free, quickly crashing 1111 01:26:33.199 --> 01:26:40.239 through your venge, Chocolate rain, using you the bar back down again. 1112 01:26:40.439 --> 01:26:45.760 Chocolate Rain, it's free, quickly crashing through your venge, Chocolate rain, 1113 01:26:47.520 --> 01:27:10.760 using you the bar back down again. As act