Gary Jeff back in the Saddle on seven hundred WLW and joining us a former
Cincinnati kid kinda and yeah, obviously left an indelible impression on Keith O'Brien.
He went to school at Northwestern University and now lives in New Hampshire. He
went on to become a New York Times best selling author. Keith O'Brien,
how you doing, I'm great, Gary, Thanks for having me so tell
me a little bit about the reason Keith is on and it's no secret here.
His brand new book, Charlie Hustle, The Rise and Fall of Pete
Rose, is out today an opening day week in Cincinnati, which I'm sure
Keith you know how important that is to this community and this area and fans
of the Cincinnati Reds and fans of Pete Rose. But I wanted to get
first to your history in Cincinnati. When did you live here and how old
were you and how did that influence your writing and obviously your love of baseball
and other things sports wise? Well, right, yeah, I mean,
I am a Cincinnati kid, even though of course I don't live there anymore.
I was born and raised in Cincinnati. I was born on the West
Side and my family ultimately moved to the East Side. My whole childhood in
Cincinnati, you know. And I'm too young to remember the big Red Machine
years of seventy five seventy six, But I'm in the wheelhouse for my boyhood
love for baseball. When Pete Rose is traded back to the Reds in August
nineteen eighty four, I remember exactly where I was standing in September nineteen eighty
five, as most Cincinnatians do, when Pete Rose set the all time head
record. And I also remember Gary, you know what it was like to
live through the scandal in nineteen eighty nine, those long months of scandal.
And you know, I want to be clear, like in my book Charlie
Hustle, I I'm not part of the story. I'm writing this in the
way I've written all my books. It's narrative, non fiction history, you
know, told you know through reporting and research and at times you know,
unprecedented access, unprecedented interviews, unprecedented use of thousands of pages of federal court
documents. But but but I am a part of this story in the sense
that I know Cincinnati, you know, I know the part of town where
Pete grew up. I I grew up and went to school with guys just
like him, and and I know what it felt like to live there both
during the glory days and and during and during the fall. And and that
is you know what I've tried to capture here in the book, the story
of the of the rise and fall of this of this person who who you
know, meant so much to us. And again, regardless of how you
feel about him today, you know, whether you like p Rose or dislike
him, whether you cheer for him or you don't, Undeniably, he is
one of the most fascinating, controversial, and important athletes of the twentieth century.
Let's back up just a second and talk about your time growing up here.
You said you were born on the west side, your family moved to
the east side. How did you justify that with that incredible divide that's in
this city When I moved here in nineteen ninety four, and the west side
is the best side, nah na the east side, and this whole thing
was going on. It was strange, It was foreign to me. But
it's so Cincinnati, Cincinnati centric to have that divide between east and west side.
And I guess you experienced that firsthand. Right, Well, yeah,
I mean, you know, my mother is a Cincinnati native. My father
was from Columbus. You know. They when they were a young couple and
I was born, they had an apartment in Price Hill, you know,
but as you know, they their family was growing, you know, they
ended up moving out to Anderson Township, where I was primarily raised. So
I guess you know, I am one of one of the few who have
crossed over the line in either direction as a best selling author and an award
winning journalist. Talking to Keith O'Brien on The Nightcap about his new book,
Charlie Hustle, The Rise and Fall of Pete Rose on Opening Day week,
So, I mean, you were here for some a lot of great Reds
opening days, and as we approached that on Thursday, any memories or thoughts
to share about Opening Day in Cincinnati because it's so different than anywhere else in
Major League Baseball. Well, and that's another thing I wanted to capture in
the book, you know, that the importance of baseball not just in Cincinnati,
although you're right, you know it was, you know, quintessential to
the culture of Cincinnati, but in the broader culture of America. You know,
it's uh, there's a reason why why Pete Rose became so iconic,
and one reason was because people in Cincinnati and people across the country, uh,
cared so much about baseball. You know, it's obviously, you know,
the national pastime. But you know, in the time that Pete is
in baseball, this whole sport changes in ways that are good, in ways
that are troubling. The bottom line that the sport changes, uh, you
know, from a sort of a rough and tumble, unpolished sport filled with
lots of characters who did and said things you simply couldn't get away with today,
to you know, a much more diverse corp for it's sport. You
know, covered twenty four to seven by you know, cable news networks like
CNN and ESPN, And you know, I think one critical thing that you
know, I learned in the reporting of the book is that you know,
the world changes, Baseball changes the pros doesn't you know, he still thinks
in nineteen eighty nine and in the mid nineteen eighties when he when he gets
himself in trouble, that he can behave in ways that he did years earlier,
and he simply cannot. And you know, misdeeds in the shadows that
you know had been tolerated before, you know would be not tolerated this time.
And it kind of as we're looking into this twenty twenty four baseball season,
Keith, we're looking at a possible scandal involving the biggest player in the
game right now, oh Tani. And you look at some of the parallels
with with what happened with Pete and the gambling on baseball, and you wonder
if this is going to repeat itself again all these years later. We'll talk
about Bargie Imadi, and we'll talk about just more about the book, Charlie
Hustle in just a moment after a break, if you'll be willing to indulge
me and let me take one real quick. Absolutely all right, Well find
out more about Keith O'Brien's other. This is your fourth book, right,
It is oh man to me to have the patience and the diligence to write
a book. People always say, I've had like a forty four year radio
career, Oh, you ought to write a book. I'm like, Okay,
who's got the time for that? Keith O'Brien does and we'll talk to
him more about Charlie Hussele in just a moment as we continue this nightcap late
night on seven hundred WLW, Paddy here with two life