Oh, and welcome to the show. I'm Martin Willisher, host and I'm
excited about tonight's show. Our guest this evening is Tom Conwell, he'll be
talking UFOs. Of course, before that, I have invited by good friend
Lee Spiegel to swing by, so he will be dropping in first. And
I wanted to say last week, I hope you enjoyed our guest Linda Zimmerman.
I thought she was fantastic, and you know, I got to thinking
about one night when I couldn't sleep, I got to thinking about she would
be great on the SCU team, that's the scientific Coalition for UAP Studies.
So I contacted Robert Powell over there and I said, you ought to check
out this podcast, and he did, and he thought she was fantastic.
And Linda just sent me an email just a couple of minutes ago saying that
it's official. She is now on the SCU team. And I love when
things like that happened. She totally deserves it. I'm very excited for her.
And if you miss that show, I would say go back and check
it out because it's a it's a real good one. Don't forget to check
our website. That's podcast ufo dot com and this week's blog by Charles Lear
is called UFOs Versus Flying Saucers in nineteen fifty seven and excellent read. And
by the way, if you are listening to our podcast in our podcast feed
now, Charles every week is doing an audio blog and that'll be dropping in
the podcast feed about midweek every week. So we always encourage people to read
the blog, but because he has links to a lot of what he's talking
about in the blog itself. But if you want to listen to the audio
blog, and if you're driving whatever, you can check that out. A
couple of other things before we get started here, I wanted to talk about
the net Flix Unsolved Mysteries episode Burke Shares UFO. I don't know if anyone
has out there has missed that, or if you get a chance, please
watch it. I got to tell you it is really, really a good
episode. That whole case is just amazing to me. And you know,
before I knew it as the read UFO and it's so much more and it's
just fascinating. And if you have watched that, you'll be familiar with Tom
Warner. He's the artist in the show that was actually I guess the only
person that's ever someone has ever witness that was in a beam that came down
by UFO and vanished right in front of this woman's eyes. And then he
re revanished a while later, you know, and dropped to the ground.
It's just an amazing story. Anyway, Tom is coming up. Tom Warner
is coming up on the anniversary the September first, which is a Tuesday night.
It's fifty fifty first anniversary of the incident that happened back in nineteen sixty
nine. So I'm really looking forward to that. I talk I talked to
Tom for maybe an hour and a half or maybe even longer today. Really
nice guy. We have a lot of things in common, and uh,
it's it's really it's going to be a great show. I can't wait for
that one to happen. Also, has anyone out there if you haven't watched
these, uh these videos on YouTube called the Body Language Panel. They are
just amazing. They've actually tackled a few people in the UFO field and what
their thoughts were and you know, the signs of either deceit or not deceit.
And so they will actually be coming up on the show too within a
couple of weeks, all four of them, so that ought to be a
lot of fun. And getting back to the website podcast ufo, you can
see our Patreon link. Anyone can support the show. Thank you for all
that do. If you don't, you can't, that's fine. Thank you
for listening. We appreciate every single one of you. And just one more
thing, there is an anonymous UFO siting form on podcast ufo dot com.
There's a little little menu to that and anyone can fill out. If they
don't want to go public, they can fill out the form there and I
will look at it and post it. And we have a lot of really
interesting sightings that you'll never see anywhere else. So check that out on podcast
ufo dot com and my art just real quickly, I did say that was
a last thing, but I did want to say I am painting, and
out in front of my house is uh. I saw a really cute puppy
they're called pup seals or baby Seal sea lion, and so I decided I
was going to paint paint a picture of him. Here he is here,
So check out my art website if you will. That's not even on there
yet. I just finished it this morning. And that's Martin Willis art dot
com. And you know that's enough of me blabbing away right here, and
I'm gonna bring in my good friend Lee Spiegel. Welcome to the show.
Lee, Well, it's so nice to be here. I love your art.
And oh what happened to you? Lee thing? I'm right sorry?
There you are, Okay, I think I think the lights about me.
It's strange lights that are Yeah, it's the men in black again. Yeah,
I was, I was. God. I was trying to pay you
a nice compliment. I can't take compliments. That's why I cut you off.
That's good. Well, I was gonna say something nice about your artwork
because I'm honored to be one of the lucky rescipients of one of your UFO
pieces of art. Oh really, don't you remember? Uh? Yeah,
but I thought that was Dave Marler. Well, no, you had sent
me something as well, and and and then and then, I believe I
forget how it turned out. But then because it was a unique piece of
art, uh, And knowing that David Marler is the mister triangular UFOs guys,
you actually suggested that that we we give that piece of art to David
Marler, and I believe it's up now in his research facility. It is.
I actually saw it. He was on unidentified episode and I actually saw
my painting in the background there. It was awesome. Yeah, yeah,
it was great because I saw the same episode and when he was sitting at
the table there with Chris mellon UFOs, I could see my UFO album on
the wall there. So we're both Yeah, we're memorialized. As they say.
That's awesome. So Lee, you're looking great and you're hanging in okay
down there. Um, yeah, we are in the island, Long Island.
We've got our power back, and in fact, I will let you
be the first person online to wish me a happy anniversary. Happy anniversary,
and one that you actually missed last week unfortunately, Free down, power out,
the whole works, right. Yeah, yeah, I was. I
was getting ready to celebrate my first year anniversary doing my show Edge of Reality
Radio, and um, what I thought was going to be a very nice
thing to do was to have doctor Jacques Valle make a return appearance because he
was my very first guest a year ago. Right, tree down, no
power, no show, and so what we decided to do instead was to
we reran. We rebroadcast that very first show with doctor Vale. So but
he's going to be again in another few weeks. He's got lots to talk
about and then we'll be live, so it'll be very but it's fun.
It's sometimes it's a little odd to go to go onto the website KGRA on
a show that's being rebroadcast and to hear yourself talking, and to hear yourself
talking to someone else. I sit here and I think that can't be me.
There's another least bagel out there. It can't possibly make Will someone explain
this to me? Yeah? You can always default to it's one of your
personalities. Yeah, yeah, from the darker side of me. Yeah,
yeah, that's right. So, just so everyone knows, your show is
on Thursdays, and it's eight to ten pm Eastern Standard time, right,
And I'm I'm a listener, you know, I don't listen to a lot
of I've listened to very few shows, but I've listened to as many of
your shows as I can. You always get great guests, and you have,
you know, your background. For those of you who don't know,
can you tell him you were on NBC radio. I was on NBC Radio
for eight years between nineteen seventy eight to nineteen eighty six, and that that
span of eight years had me on NBC local and national radio doing UFO and
paranormal radio broadcasts. It was an amazing time, yeah, to do that
back then. And the reason that NBC even hired me was they'd heard that
I was At the end of nineteen seventy eight, I was preparing presentation for
the United Nations and they thought, well, maybe we should talk to this
guy and see if he wants to come on the air and do UFO reports.
And that's that's how it all evolved. But it was just that whole
time doing the United Nations, getting hired by NBC, getting hired to be
a feature writer for Omni magazine. That all came together at the same time.
At the end of nineteen seventy eight. It was like I kept going
around saying to France, please pinch me. I can't believe this is going
on. It's like, I mean, you and I know we're are radio
kind of personalities, and in the radio business, people work for decades to
try and get up to the bigger markets. In the country like New York,
being in market Los Angeles, Chicago, and my very first attempt at
being on radio was in the number one market in the in the country or
New York, and I was there for eight years. I couldn't believe my
luck that that kind of thing would happen. And look at what I was
talking about, UFOs, Poltergeist, living dinosaurs, Bigfoot. I mean I
was all over the place. That's amazing. Now, look, I'm going
to ask you this because I can say it's happened to me, and just
wondered if you if it's happened to you. Have people shared things with you
and say, hey, look, you know I'm telling you this off the
record, but you can't tell anyone about it. Yes, some pretty wild
stuff. Yes it does happen. And I'm okay with that because if they
come across in a really credible, legitimate way, then I'm fascinated to hear
the story. And I understand why people don't want to share a lot of
stories, because there is still that stigma in the world where people are afraid.
Not only are they afraid to tell their stories, but they're afraid to
report even the most minor and smallest of reports of some strange lights in the
sky. People are afraid of ridicule. Duh, who isn't afraid of being
ridiculed. It's not as bad as it used to be, but it's still
there. But the people that mostly will come up to you or me or
people in our business and say, I've got something to tell you, but
you can't really mention it to anyone else because I'm still sworn to secrecy.
Are the military eyewitnesses or the airline pilots? I mean, I don't know,
Martin. If you happen to see the most recent episode of Unidentified on
the History Channel on Saturday, it was really good. It was all about
airline encounters. And I haven't seen that one yet. I'm a week or
two behind, and but I've I've really enjoyed. You know, there's it's
typical, but there are people out there bashing the episodes. I saw a
little bit here and there, but I so far, I think it's a
great season. It's so much different and better than last year. If you
have, in my opinion, well, they've got some really good people that
have come forward, and especially with the airline encounters. I've known for decades
that airline pilots are reluctant because they're even under orders not to describe, not
to go public with reports of things that they saw while they were doing a
regular flight from here to there with a cargo of like two hundred passengers whose
lives depend on the skills and the safety of the airline and these things.
When I say these things, UFOs flying saucers, UAPs that people are reporting
them. Now, these things do play games with a lot of airline pilots.
And it doesn't matter that the UFOs they don't discriminate from one airline to
another. They but they do like to be seen. They do like to
get sometimes very close to airliners, and the pilots, you know, they're
not trained to avoid these kinds of things like military jet fighter pilots are.
They are trained, and they're flying things. The military pilots, they're flying
pieces of equipment that can out maneuver a lot of our well not a lot
of but all of our commercial airline vehicles. But regular commercial pilots in their
airlines they can't get out of the way very quickly. They can't do incredible
maneuvers and go up and down. They sometimes they just kind of have to
sit there and report on the radio that there's something out there and right in
front of us, and there's anybody else seeing it, anyone else reporting it.
In time after time, all these reports where the ground, the ground
radar controls are saying, now, we're not painting anything on our radar right
now in your vicinity. And you know, I'm always amazed. I don't
understand why is that such a big mystery If we're talking about when it comes
to UAPs, for talking about a technology that's far in advance of what our
technology is, well, then why can't they somehow cloak themselves from our little,
our little twenty first century radar scopes. It doesn't seem like a big
deal to me, but people go, oh, if it's not on radar,
you must not have seen anything. It must have been Oh, venus
was out pretty bright tonight. Yeah. No, I want to continue on
that because I never never thought another thought on that as well. But Stephen
is asking if you believe there will ever be any congressional hearing on UFOs.
Yes, and there have been before and there in recent years there have been
people on the hill in Washington that have been talking about UFOs. They've had
meetings with some of the Navy pilots who had encounters with UFOs over the last
ten years, and there is great interest on the Hill. There's a there's
a bill that's going through now that was put I think it was put together
by or promoted by Florida Senator Marco Rubio. They're trying to get to the
bottom of what's what's out there? What are these vehicles, who do they
belong to and if they're not belonging to any nation on Earth, well,
we can't really speculate on who they are where they come from, because we
don't know. All that we know for sure is that there are things out
there flying in our skies with impunity. They can go wherever they want,
whenever they want, and they can show themselves whenever they want. They're in
control of what they do. But because we can't get close enough to them
to pin them down doesn't mean that the bunkers have the right to ridicule the
reports. I have a real craw on my neck about that, that kind
of attitude. I mean, just recently, I think within the last couple
of weeks, I read something I believe NBC Dot Com had a story written
by lead scientists set Shawstack from the SETI Institute in which you saw that talk
talking about UFOs and and I like Seth, he's a very nice he's a
very smart guy. But but but I believe that the scientific board of the
SETI Institute, the Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence, they're all very nice people,
and they're doing a good job using radio telescopes to look for that cosmic radio
signal in in the universe somewhere that says high. But but they will not
consider the decades worth of lots of evidence, of different kinds of evidence that
something is visiting Earth right now, right here, and some people are saying
that they're landing in their backyards. We can't just throw all of that testimony
out the window. Yeah, yeah, that's absolutely right. And and and
I agree with you. I did read that article and yeah, it's frustrating.
Yeah. Now, now the thing you mentioned before, you know,
like they can they come in and out, and they they want to be
seen. I think so, and they have to, you know, because
someone brought up a really good point on this show one time, and that
is, if you know, why do they have lights? Why would they
have lights. Yeah, and that's kind of a that's a good point right
there. I may I may have even mentioned it on your show before too,
because I've talked about this even on my show. A few years ago,
my brother, my younger brother, Jim, was driving up in a
rural New Hampshire where I grew up, and one of his sons, Zachary,
my nephew, said, look, Daddy, this, what's that strange
light in this guy? Maybe it's a UFO And they pulled off the side
of the road and get out of the car and look, and they realized
very quickly it was probably a small plane that was on its final approach to
a local airport. So they got back into the car and they're driving along
and Zachary says, Daddy, why do UFOs have lights? And my brother
said, that's a really good question, zach I'll tell you what. When
we get home. Why don't you call Uncle Lee in New York and ask
him because he might have a good answer for that. And so that's great
what they did. Zachary called me Uncle Lee. We saw this thing,
and I want to know, why do you think UFOs have lights? And
I said, well, Zachary, the first thing that comes to mind is
they they obviously don't need their lights the way we need lights in all of
our vehicles, whether it's planes, trains, automobiles. We need to be
able to see each other, either people behind us or you know, in
front of us, so we don't crash into them. But the UFOs can
do so many incredible maneuvers, they don't seem to need that kind of thing
to keep them from hitting each other. So the only other thing I can
think of, Zach is I think they just want to be seen. They
show themselves when they want to be seen. If they don't want to be
seen, they know how to hide themselves. You know. I like to
keep it simple, Martin. Let's keep it in and they've got lots of
lights. As we know so many reports. They don't want to be seen.
They have other stuff to do. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Someone
just someone sending me Howard Stern. Oh, anyway, that's Bill. Bill
Skywatcher said, there's some clip did you have? You had Howard Stern on
right on your show. No, you were on his show that I used
to be on his show. We were on a w NBC radio at the
same time in the mid to late nineteen eighties in New York. Yeah,
yeah, and so he used to he used to go on and he would
he would promote my Sunday evening broadcast, and he would sometimes have me come
into the studio and sit with him, and then he would just he would
just pull me apart and pull my audience apart, and and do satires about
me. And he would go on the air and he would he would pretend
to be me, and then he would pretend to be my listeners calling me.
He was like, so totally totally crazy. Um but it raised it
raised the level of my audience because of the curiosity factor that he brought to
his audience. Who's this guy? Least peakle that he's promoting U? And
so my audience numbers went up. Actually yeah, uh yeah, he was.
Bill was going to try to send me a clip, but I won't
be able to play it with Howard Stern. But anyway, so your show,
I know you've got to get going. Your show is on Thursday nights,
Thursday nights kg R A radio. And is there a couple of things,
um Lee, Is there is there a way that people can find out
when and who's on your shows? During the week. Um, it's Twitter,
right, use Twitter? Yes, what I usually do, Um,
either like Monday or Tuesday. I will always post something to to me on
Twitter or on my Facebook Facebook least pegal. I'll always have a few sentences
about what's coming up on Thursday show, and I'll have a nice banner that
shows who my guest is going to be this coming show, This coming Thursday.
I've got got a great guest, Caroline Corey, who's been on before.
She's an amazing writer, author, director, producer of documentaries. She
has a brand new film out called Superhuman, The Invisible Made Visible, and
it's got She's so connected to scientists around the world who are doing amazing work
with individuals, normal people, not magical people, not llamas from Tibet,
people who have experiences with extrasensory perception, the powers of the mind and consciousness,
mind over matter experiments. And when you see this film that she's put
together. I saw her last night, it's it's incredible what people can do
when they're guided under controlled conditions by scientists, real PhD University scientists who have
flabbergacied and what people can do and they're filming these people. It's it's amazing.
It's going to change how we feel about these things, what the mind
can do and that word consciousness. And on the screen, there's Caroline right
now on your on your screen. Uh. She does she does great work.
And I met her last year. Yeah, yeah, yeah, excellently
well as always, it's always fun having you on. I never have to
I never have to worry about being being any different than that, Thank you,
sir. Yeah, and uh, I encourage everyone to check out his
show. Now, just one quick question. Archives. Uh. Can people
listen to archives of your show? Yes, they can, and in fact,
as I understand it right now, they can hear archives of the show.
Uh. And and Bill Skywatcher, our wonderful studio producer, can also
give you the exact address, and I can. I can send it to
where people can just go to and click on it. It's it's at a
site called spreaker. I believe that they can go there and when they get
to the site, they can hear my show, I think your show as
well any of the shows that are on KGRA, and they can they can
click on whichever show in the archive they want to hear. They just click
on it. It's a quick download and they can play them to their hearts
content. Awesome. All right, Lee, Well keep up the great work
and I'll talk to you soon. A pleasure, all right, take care
bye bye. All right, our guests. Our guest tonight, Tom Conwell,
Uh he has written a number of books. Um, they are here,
and he's also uh I know that he's in the works of working on
a book about messages from encounters, and that is a subject that um we
have I have brought up many times on this show. So anyway, uh,
with no further ado, welcome to the show. Tom, Thank you
very for having me. Yeah. Okay, for a second there, I
thought you were still muted. I took it off. Yeah yeah, uh
yeah. So uh, let's start at the beginning. You're you're when did
you first get an interest in the UFO topic. Well, first of all,
you have you have a background in electronics, right, yes, I
do, yeah, UM a lot of years. Um. I first went
into electronics when I was in the Navy, and I got my training and
UM metrology, which is a science of measurement, and UM I went to
Honeywell and I worked for Honeywell for about thirty six and a half years.
UM, and then I retired, and right after retirement, I got into
the paranormal field. Um, but your original question related to when was I
first interested? When I was first interested in in this subject? When I
was when I was about ten. My uh, my aunt uh as A
was an astronomer, and she was the secretary of the Astronomical Association of America,
and I got an opportunity to go with her on quite a few different
conferences, and I was hooked. I wanted to know what was out there
and what was going on, and so did she Actually did you get into
a lot of conversations with her about astronomy in general, you know, like
the distances and stars and all that about her. Yes, we had quite
a few long discussions concerning that, and it was very interesting because I was
wondering when she talked about the distances and stuff, I was wondering, well,
then, how did the UFOs get here? Because I just assumed that
they always were here. So I had to rethink everything. And uh,
I wonder to myself how they would put together there their ships to go that
kind of distance, because I knew that it was a big deal for us
at that time to just get to the moon. Well, how did they
get here? You know? So it was it was very interesting. We
had some very long discussions in our in our trips to the conferences. Yeah
yeah, how about that? Wow? And uh so you actually wrote your
first Well how did you actually, in adulthood get into the UFO topic?
Okay? Um? Well, Um, I was UM actually retired. I
uh um was looking for something to do, and I always was interested in
UM, UFOs and the paranormal. So I got I didn't win the paranormal
team, and the paranormal team wanted me to to um also look into the
UFOs subject. So I did a little of both. I was paranormal investigating
and I was writing into the paranormal and into the UFO field. And what
I did in order to write in the paranormal field was I started writing blogs
about UFOs and I put those blogs together after a while and assembled them and
realized it was it was book links. I never realized that I did that,
so I um um put that together into a book and I actually published
that one after I had written my third book about UFOs and um where they
were, if they were collecting anywhere, and what else was going on?
So it was pretty interesting. Uh huh uh. And so when did you
actually put together your very first I'm sorry about that. When did you actually
put together your very first book? My very first book was about four years
into paranormal investigating And the reason it took me so long was that, um
um upside I didn't want to do that was um uh. I didn't set
out to write a book. I didn't want to write a book. It
had no interest for me. So um, what I decided to do was
just to try to put together a bunch of maps. And I realized that
these maps would probably give me something to talk about. And I'm going to
share the screen here and uh, all right, go ahead and I'll bring
it in. Just go ahead and click share the screen, share screen,
okay. And so these are maps related to UFO sightings. Yes, these
were all UFO sightings. So um the UFO sightings were um um. I
looked at every single state through the sightings that were assembled in the National UFO
Reporting Center. Oh yes, before yeah, yeah. Now the map that
you see there, I don't see the map you have. You haven't shared
the screen yet. I thought I did that several times, all right,
so I'm not seeing it up. I'm supposed to be able to uh see
it down here, I'm not seeing anything and but that's okay, we can
just move on. Okay, UM, well it's supposed to pop up in
my see oh I can see something now, yes, okay, yeah,
yeah. This is my UFO sighting map and UM, this is all from
the National UFO Reporting Center. I realized the quantity of sightings that were here.
It was just voluminous, the amount of sightings that were there. There's
probably gonna an area seventy five thousand sightings. That looks like a lot of
work. Now for the for the person that it's just a listener to the
audio, um this, Um, I'm going to ask you to send me
that map and I can put this in the show notes. So yeah,
but there is just a clusters just uh it looks like the coronavirus. Man.
It literally does it really does. Um. And when I first started
doing this map, I started with New York State because that's where I live.
And when I did that, there were so many pins in the New
York State map that I realized that I wasn't going to be able to include
every single sighting. It was just impossible So what I did was I broke
it down into the three sightings, three types of sightings, fireball, spheres,
and triangles. And that's all this pictured. That's not all of the
sightings. Okay, that's just those three. And if you look closely,
you're going to see a lot, whole lot of little pins. If you
also look in areas where cities are, you're gonna see bigger pins with the
big pins equal twenty little pins. There's just with so many, so many
little little pins that I would have used, that it was just impossible to
put them all on this map. And when I got to the West Coast,
it was the even worse situation because there was so many out there that
um, I had a note only um, try to find another key.
I had to change colors and make them go a hundred sightings. Wow.
Yeah, it was just craziness just in this while you were looking for something
to do. Oh, that really gave you something to do. And this
took me a year to do this. Yeah, I'm not surprised at all.
Yeah, yeah, wow, that's great. And if there's any other
graphics you wanted to show up on the screen or you'd have to do,
is you know, put it up on your screen and we can swamp it
and and uh get it back in there if you wanted to. But um,
um so New Fork, So did you Is that the only place that
you looked at sightings? Did you go into any other database? Um?
No, I didn't, um, because there was so many that I realized
that I wasn't going to be able to put them all on even if I
found another database. Yeah. Well, beside that, there's there could be
some repetitive too. That's definitely repetitive. Yeah. Yeah. One thing on
move On is also on New Fork as well. Yes, and and probably
about fifty percent of the instances in both places. Yeah, yeah right.
Um so all right, And one of the things I had written in the
description that to this show is, um, you do you now have a
book out on earthquakes and UFOs? Yes, that is my latest book,
and I just today sent the information up and it's um not exactly available yet
on Amazon, but probably within about two or three days it will be.
So it's a brand new book. Oh oh good. Well, let's talk
a little bit about that, because you do hear a lot about that type
of situation, and I've often wondered if it's something a natural phenomenon. But
what did what did you fine when you're looking into this topic? Okay,
um, well I also have some maps to show show you here. You
can bring that up any time. Yeah, okay, And um well what
I what I did was I had to find out where the big earthquakes were,
right, So I went to the the earth earthquake page and look and
put a map in for all where all of the big earthquakes were. Then
I had to go into each particular one and map where the sightings were,
and then I was going to be able to see whether there was any correlation
between the big earthquakes and whether there were UFO sightings at the time. Well,
um, I found minimal overlap. Just I'm not going to tell you
I found no overlap, but there was a minimal overlap. So I was
wondering why the sightings were somewhere other than where the earthquakes were. If if
they if in some cases they were right on top of the earthquake, why
were they maybe one hundred and fifty miles away and there's a big collection of
them, Why the heck are they there? Then I thought that would be
either like around the earthquake or sort of nearer the earthquake or along the fault
of the earthquake or something like that. But when I found very little overlap,
there was another reason why they were there. Well, I went back
to my first three books that I wrote they are here, and that's when
I try to identify and say why why UFO sightings were there to begin with?
So I looked at all kinds of things such as UM pollution. I
looked at geology. I looked at um um um, the uh the um
nuclear plants. I looked at um rivers and streams, lakes. I basically
looked at every possible reason why there should why there's collections of earthquakes, especially
based on the UFO map that I showed you UM and I had very little
reason to put two and two together and say, oh, this is the
reason why the earthquakes are there. It just wasn't there. M So with
the UFO U and an earthquake book, and I found almost no correlation between
earthquakes and UFOs. What was the reason that they were there? Were they
there for hum for the pollution, No, they weren't. They weren't there
for any of the other reasons. That I stated before, then I had
to look at UFOs. Let's assume now that UFOs are indeed from another planet,
Okay, that they're extraterrestrial. In order to get to hear, they
had to have um They had to have traversed the tremendous area, tremendous distance.
Have UM have computers that make our stuff look like Mattel toys. Also,
at the same time, would have to have sting excuse me, um
A storage capabilities that are far beyond ours. So when I did when I
when I put together the the UFL sighting maps and the earthquakes, as I
noticed collections in other places, it brings me to another map here. Let
me let me go to um another map. UM. Yeah, sure,
just remember to share the screen. Okay, you know, I'll put it
up. But uh, I was just saying if we had anything up.
I guess there was not it now I saw something, but yeah, I
had something else up. Someone just said there was an earthquake in let's see
northern the northern part of North Carolina, Tennessee and Virginia. That's unusual.
We had a earthquake in Maine, which was because I was in California for
a number of years, i'd know. I know what an earthquake is.
And I've heard this rumbling first and then the whole house shook in the state
of Maine. So they do happen in odd places, but we're very rarely,
you know, in this state? Does it happen? Okay? So,
um, I have a picture up now? Okay, and did you
click on share screen? I'm not sure how to do that down at the
bottom. You did it once. Yeah, oh that's share screen. Okay,
yeah, yeah, you just do that and then then share again.
Go ahead, and then I should see a picture of the map. I
don't see anything up there yet, and you did it once, so I
thought you might be able to figure out again now. So now it's there,
right, I see it now and we are adding it. Okay,
very good, All right, so what are we looking at? And again
for the listener, I will get these images and put them in the show
notes so you can check it out. They're also in my book. So
huh. What I did was I created the map of the earthquakes, like
I mentioned initially, and then in order to track if the earthquakes were indeed
around excuse me, if the UFOs were indeed around the earthquakes. I put
a map on with the UFO sightings at the same time as the earthquake,
and if you look at the bottom, you'll see the legend two days before,
five days before, two days after, five days after, all the
various colors. I picked this particular map because it had two different elements.
Number one, it looked to me like there may have been some activity around
the initial earthquake. If you look out on the West coast, in the
area north of San Francisco, you'll see the earthquake, which is the concentric
circles of the of the rig. And yeah, you'll see the other the
other UFO sightings. That was the one thing that I saw in some of
the maps. Only only only some, But I also saw huge quantities of
sightings elsewhere in the US. Now why are they there? Are you saying?
Just so I'm clear, Uh, Tom, are you saying that the
UFO sightings happened in the same time the earthquake did? But north there?
Correct? I get it, okay, correct, And they're all over the
United States, but not around the earthquake. So I'm thinking, no,
why why did that happen? That's not what I expected, Okay, I
expected down the down California and around there, but not what I saw,
which is what you're looking at. And this was a five day picture.
Okay, this was a five day picture. Excuse me, an eleven day
picture of UFO sightings. So we're gonna see a whole lot of sightings before
and after and the day of the quake. But again I couldn't put my
finger on why they were there until until I have to show you another picture.
Now I hope this is yeah, okay, you could have swapped the
picture while you were sharing screen, but that's fine. Oh no, I
don't know, all right. And the other one was thirteen b um thirteen
to come up with another number? Here, thirteen b there's this picture,
and how do I, okay do whatever you did before? Yeah, oh,
I say, wait a minute, there's something intervening here. Um.
I got to close that and and we can we can, we can,
we can move on because we you know, we got to move on if
it's gonna be too difficult to do that. Yeah, okay. Well what
I saw with with another screen that I had is when I had just a
five day window around the earthquake, two days before two days after in the
day of the quake. What I saw with that was straight lines from the
east coast pretty much to the Mississippi River. Why were there straight lines across
across the screen with what was going on straight line sightings? I couldn't put
my finger on it. Um. It was as if they were scanning us
back and forth across somewhat the same areas and it would change every several days.
So why were they scanning us? If they have these tremendous uh tremendous
computers and um great storage systems, they don't need to scan us over and
over. They just go back into their storage areas and look at what they're
going to look at. There has to be some reason why they're doing this
that requires them to do it continuously. It certainly wasn't geography, because the
as far as the geography goes, the geography would would um not change.
So we're looking at the yeah, yeah, Just just so I can be
really clear about this, So you're you're saying that, um, these say
an earthquake happened in California, UM, and there's a direct line or a
parallel line or whatever over to a UFO sighting that happened in the same night,
and this happened repeatedly on these lines you're talking about. Or I'm just
I think I've kind of lost where you're going with this. Okay, um,
let me see the Uh there were straight lines across that sighting map,
and the only thing I could figure was the straight lines were because they're going
back and forth over the same areas. Oh okay, all right, Um,
I had no reason to think that it wasn't for any other reason.
They had to be looking at the same areas over and over and over.
There's no reason for them to look at the same areas if it's geology or
geography, there's just no reason to look at them. So I'm still trying
to figure out. I think I just did it. Yeah, I see
it, now, you see it, Okay, Okay, I mean that's
how they click about ten different things. Okay. Now, the green dots
on this screen are all the day of the quake on the day of the
quake, and the name and those are the green dots are UFO sightings,
Yes they are. Now this is not the same UFO mapp as before.
This is because there were two quakes in Nevada that were pretty large. But
I showed this because if you look from let's say Iowa, and then go
your eyes go to Iowa and then look across the Illinois, Indiana, Ohio,
northern Pennsylvania, and New Jersey, that's almost a straight line across them.
And I came across a whole bunch of these. As a matter of
fact, there may have been about seventeen out of twenty maps that I did
straight Let me just ask you this, could these also be the same UFO
people are siting in different states like it's traveling. It could be. I
don't know that it could be. It could be different UFO sightings. I
have no idea why, but there are straight lines across and there's multiple straight
lines. We have Arkansas through Tennessee. In North Carolina, we have Mississippi,
Alabama, Georgia, South Carolina, we have Texas, Louisiana. Okay,
I don't know what's causing these sightings, just that there are straight lines.
So I had to come up with a reason why they're straight lines.
I didn't know what the reasons were. So what could continuously be changing that
would require them to keep going back and forth over the same area. They
don't need to do that to look at geology or geography because they already have
it in their computer. Can't be pollution, that doesn't change that rapidly.
Why are they having to go over the same areas. The only thing that's
changing are the people. The people are changing because the people are awakening.
They're starting to realize that they're being they are seeing things in the sky,
they are recognizing that they have paranormal experiences. They are seeing Bigfoot and I'm
not a big Foot fan, but all these reasons. People are awakening,
and this is the reason why they are seeing the things in the sky.
And this is also the reason why the UFOs are going back and forth over
the same areas maybe every three or four weeks, because the people are changing,
the people are awakening, and where it's just this is just something you're
you've come up with. It's the only thing that I had that I could
put my finger on that would account for the fact that the UFOs need to
go back and forth over the same areas. There's no reason I've come up,
I've thought of everything. There's just no reason why they have to go
back and forth over the same areas unless something's changing weekly bi weekly and again,
so are you looking at you said on weeks or on several weeks?
Are these like? Um? A lot of times you'll hear about a hot
spot where UFOs will show up, you know, like one week after another.
Um are you Are you taking that type of thing into account as well?
I mean, yes, oh yeah, UM and UM. In one
of the maps that I put in my latest book, I circled about a
hundred different locations on my initial UFO sighting map that I showed to the big
map of the US with the pins in it, a hundred different locations whether
there was anomalise where there was more sightings than I would have expected to be
in that particular area based on population actions of UFOs. Yeah, about they
are all over the place, all over the place. And I wish that
I could like open my book and show you one page after I think I
can't do that, But UM, the only reason that I could come up
with is the the people are changing very rapidly on our planet, and there's
a very very short period of time where we are going to have, um,
a bunch of people who who start claiming to see UFOs in the sky
way more than what are claimed now because they're going to be able to see
them where they couldn't see them before, and this is how we're getting ready
for them to finally be announced. I think, yeah, that's that's my
theory at this point, because there's nothing physical that I can see that would
account for anything other than something non physical that's changing. Well, it's all
interesting, and I do realize. I mean, I'm sure this is all
you know, just theory of course, sure, yeah, um, but
anyway, well it's all it's all interesting, and we are, um,
we are ready to actually to go into the break, and we got a
we got about a three minute break coming up here, so um, everyone
hanging there. We will be right back right after these messages. All right,
everyone, welcome back. This is Martin willis your host, and we
are back. And I'm going to tom back in here and here you go.
Oh yes, so we're back. And uh, let's see. Now
there are a lot of people. You must have heard of the term earthquake
lights right, Oh yes, yeah, so that's a whole different thing.
That's probably a natural phenomenon. It is, and it's almost it's kind of
one of those strange things like ball lightning. You know, but also,
uh, you know, it must have to do with weird enough. Yeah,
yeah, you're breaking up. It's weird enough that people think that they're
looking at UFOs when they're just looking at a energy discharge. Yeah, I
mean there's so much pressure and pressure released, you know when an earthquake.
You can't even fathom the amount of pressure that happens that makes an earthquake happen.
And and another thing, you know, you look when you look at
mountains, anytime you look at mountains, there had to be a heck of
a lot of earthquakes to get that mountain to be there, you know.
But yeah, so uh you know, I mean they're the whole in the
Pacific, rim um, the whole the fault lines along the west coast,
the North Pacific. Um. There there's all kinds of Harris where there's a
lot of earthquakes and a lot of danger for earthquakes. Um. And but
but you're you're saying you think they're the correlation between UFOs and earthquakes is there
isn't one. That they're far away, has nothing to do with real UFOs.
I meant people people can't identify right, um Um, I could not
say that UFOs are um directly linked to earthquakes. I can't say that,
use just they aren't. Yeah, and uh, maybe you can do your
next book on volcanoes and UFOs because I don't know if you've ever seen that,
but there's a lot of people claiming they see, you know, uh,
a UFOs around volcano or even dormant volcanoes entering volcanoes in in Washington.
Mat fact that one of the maps that I have is it shows active and
inactive volcanoes, and there's I think thirteen active ones in Washington State and two
inactive ones. And in Oregon there's forty three inactive volcanoes and about three or
four active ones. And there's a couple of active ones and maybe one inactive
one in California. And all of those were created not because of the Saint
Andreas fault, but because of something directly above the Saint Andreas fault, which
is the one to Fuca plate. It's a seduction plate that's going in under
the earth and um uh some some way inland. Uh it pushes up mountains
and that's what is responsible for the Sierra Nevada and the Cascade Mountain ranges out
there. And um, Washington and Oregon, and what's directly responsible for all
of the ancient earthquakes that reek havoc with the planet? Right? Yeah,
the moving moving of tectonic plates and all that. Yeah, it's uh yeah,
um there's some things about that. I totally will never understand how how
all that works. Um, But we're not doing a geography show, so
we'll have to move on with this. But the as far as the book,
so do you actually come to any type of your conclusion is that you
think it has to do with the human population. It sounds like, yeah,
yes, because I could come up with nothing else. I couldn't come
up with anything physical. Um yeah, And that it must be part of
a bigger plan, and that uh, them constancy of having to go back
over the same areas is because there's some rapid change going on, and the
rapid change is not happening on the earth must be happening with the people.
Interesting. There are some people that say something along the lines that you know,
I had someone on he was basically a skeptic. I don't know,
maybe a couple of months ago. He wasn't too popular on this show,
but people were I mean, he was saying that, you know, people
manifest UFOs, it's something we manifest inside of us. He was totally convinced
in that, even when it came down to you know, mass mass sightings
and witnesses, and he had a he had an answer for everything on that.
Um, well that's pretty well made up. But um, I saw
UFOs four different times, and each one was drastically different from the other.
And under no circumstances was I hoping for UFO sighting. When I saw it,
I was totally and completely surprised. Yeah, yeah, you know,
it's it's that's that's why they can't be studied so easily. It's exactly know,
there's something you can never predict in and they're fleeting. So let's hear
about Let's hear about your UFO sightings. It's always interesting to hear them.
Oh, some of them were weird. Okay. The first one, Um,
I was in the back room, um and watching the tube as I
usually do in the in the summer, probably watching baseball at the time.
I'm a bit of a Yankee fan, and um my wife called me on
the intercom. She was out in the front room doing something or other.
She called me on the intercom and said, go out back real quick,
look look up, um towards the west. So I went running out the
door, looked up towards the west, and I saw this, well,
how do I describe it? It was a bright orange ball of fire.
That's exactly what I saw, A bright orange ball of fire and it was
in my field of vision for about three seconds and then it went behind the
cloud. So was it Is it possible that it was a fireball a noe
um? Yeah, it was. It was dawdling along um a fireball from
from a meteor. Um moves uh and at great speed. They entered the
earth atmosphere between thirty and sixty thousand miles an hour. And by the time
that we see in the lower atmosphere, they're still moving along at a tremendous
clip. And this thing was just and then went out behind the cloud.
It was it was moving slow, let me tell you, probably slower than
an airplane. Yeah. And then my wife called me an intercom against quick,
come out front. There's more of them. So I went running out
front and looked up and there were two more coming in and they were moving
very slowly and right at some particular point in the sky. They changed direction
somewhat and started angling upward. And again these were balls of fire, and
that's what it looked like. It looked like a repetitive fire that was twice
as bright as the moon, and again moving on the slow end of what
I would expect an airplane to move. We're on the landing pattern for Albany
Airport and I see them all in the sky all the time. So these
were moving at I guess about one hundred knots, very slow. And this
one changed these two at the same instant in time, changed direction and angled
upward. Well, now that was a total of four that went by,
even though I only saw one. When I went out back, my wife
said there was two of them. Okay, So that was a total of
four that went by. And so I just stood there watching and lo and
behold, one more came through, just one this time, not two.
And this moved across the sky slowly at the same point in the sky.
It changed direction, angled upward, and eventually disappeared behind some clouds as it
was moving south. So that's a total of five. And so I said,
well, why do I have to lose I might as well sit here
and watch and see if they come again. Lo and behold, two more
came through, and I was trying to figure out where they were coming from.
I didn't see them come on or anything, so I watched them through
the sky. They went to the same point in the sky, angled upward,
chains direction in the same way, and did exactly the same maneuver and
disappeared behind clouds. So I said, haha, I'm going to watch where
these things are coming from, and I'm going to see what's happening. So
I stared right at where they were approximately coming from because I was sort of
honing in on it, you know, as I was watching, and two
of them popped on, and by popped on, I meant go from black
sky to super bright orange in the same portion of the sky, And they
came through and again at at the same area as before, they changed direction
and went angled upward at about a forty five degree angle. I was starting
to pay attention to the ball of fire and what that looked like that was
sort of resembling was resembling I guess the only way I could describe it as
a digital fire, as if it were done digitally, and it showed a
fire, and it was really bright orange. Yeah, did you think to
get a camera? No, I can you believe I couldn't think that burning
the camera because I was in shock. I could not believe my eyes.
You know, you're not alone. You know. Someone mentioned in the something
about that in the in the chat and it I've heard a number of people
say that was like the last thing on their mind because they just were so
involved in what they were seeing. I didn't want to miss a thing.
Yeah. And then as I thought about these sightings, it's the fact that
they popped on, the fact that they all changed in the same spot.
Um, they all disappeared in the same area of the sky. I had
to draw some conclusions from that. Number One, it was if they were
digitally created because of the fire. Number two, they were extremely bright.
So I'm almost theorizing that they were probably drones, not UFOs, excuse me,
not not the kind of drones that you'd you'd buy on Amazon. These
were super duper drones. But they were Um, they were there to do
one thing, that's to show themselves. There was no other reason for them
to do what they did. None. So I believe that they that they
popped on in that area of the sky to show themselves of the people in
this area. Now, did anyone that you're aware of, anyone else see
them? One other person saw them, but nobody was looking up because nobody
ever looks up. Yeah. Yeah, that's that's the I always end the
show. Keep your eyes to the sky because, um, you know you're
right. That does that is you know, there's no reason for a lot
of people to look up. I've always had a curiosity of I love looking
at the stars and you know, watch satellites go over things like that.
Always have, um, but not everyone's like that. Yeah. When I
when I took the garbage out previously, UM, I always was had my
head down. I head down, I take the garbage out, and my
head was still down as I came back up. Not anymore. My eyes
are up and I'm looking at everything. Yeah. Well, anyhow, that
that was the first group that I saw, and there were nine of them
total. Wow, that's amazing. Yeah. The second thing that I saw
I saw one the following night that was moving perpendicular to this other one.
This one was not a fireball. This was an orange sphere and it was
big, um, and it was moving west to east. And then I
thought that was pretty unusual. And that's a that's a different path than the
other one. The other one was north to south, and the north to
south one traveled right along the Hudson River. M very interesting. Well,
I'm sure you heard of the Hudson River Valley sightings. Oh yeah, they
were about seventy miles south of here. HM. One thing I want to
ask you before you move on. Was there any sound? Nothing? Not
a peep? Yeah, not a peep. Not unusual. Uh and uh
believe me, I was watching and listening and doing everything I could possibly do
to try to um categorize these things in my mind. As a matter of
fact, that would that's what made me right. Um what I wrote in
my first book about um UFO fireballs, and I was able to track the
differences of what people were seeing and um uh put it into one great,
big matrix. And this about forty different different things about UFO fireballs that are
different from spears. And it's all pretty interesting, it really, it's interesting.
So anyhow, the third sighting that I saw was in I was on
vacation in New Hampshire and I was watching the sky again like I normally do.
It was very dark, and I was looking up at the sky,
and I remember saying to myself, Oh, so it would be cool if
I saw UFO. About three or four minutes later, I saw this enormous
red flash in the sky, red, not white, a red flash.
And out of the middle of this flash came this white streak that moved across
the sky faster than anything I've ever seen. And this was not a meteor,
because meteor seemed to trail off as they go across the sky. This
one stayed the same brightness all the way out, and it also did not
trail off in a downward direction. Right. This went straight out until I
couldn't see it anymore. Wow, that almost to me looked like what someone,
uh, well more some ones, I should say, described in the
National UFO Reporting Center that they saw a portal open and something come flying out
of it. And that's what it looked like to me. This red flash
was an opening of some sort, and this thing came right out of the
middle of it. It was really extraordinary. Yeah, all right, Well,
let's let's just shift gears just a little bit here, because I understand
that you were writing a book that I've actually had some interest in. Um,
and that is UM the I want to say, I hate to use
the term, but telepathy that people have gotten in encounters UM, that something
comes into the mind. Now, there's many cases of this, and I
want to see if I can pull up I had a video of UM,
a guy actually talking about that. I don't think I'll be able to do
this on the fly, but but there's actually UM you're you're you're thinking or
you're starting to write a book about that, that that situation. Yeah,
I'm already doing the research on it. UM. What The first thing that
I did UM when I became a uthologist was I was kind of curious about
the abduction phenomenon. UM. I heard a lot of people mentioning it and
talking about it in UFO forums and stuff like that, and I wanted to
know about it for myself. So I pretty much announced that I was a
ufologist and people started coming to me. Can I tell you my story?
Yeah? You know, so I said sure, and I made a time
to sit down and talk with them. We use Skype and if people would
tell me what was going on, but UM, I wrote up a long
list of questions that I was going to ask them. But the very first
thing. The very first question that I asked them, and I asked everyone
the same first question, and that was did you get a message to bring
back? Because I was curious, you know, if if these people are
abducting us, they're abducting us for probably a whole reason of reasons, but
this would be a tremendous opportunity for them to plant in our minds, UM,
something that they want us to do, so that I guess that's what
was the nature of the question. Did you get a message? And the
message? Um? Well from oh. I interviewed about thirty five people,
and each interview lasted two to four hours, and many people dropped out after
the first hour because they knew I was getting real and they didn't want to
want to come up with their deepest thoughts because they knew that's where I was
going. So UM. But in the people that hung with me, UM,
I asked them what was the message, and they all gave me one
message, one coherent message, not twenty like I sort of was hoping for
just one message, and that message was take care of your planet. That
was the message. UM. Obviously, times on this show actually UM in
different ways. The Ariel School encounter and I was just trying to pull up
one of the witnesses in that to see if I can get get the time
when he talked about it. UM, well, that the message of take
care of your planet um rung true with me and was always in the back
of my mind. And I tried to work through the databases of the National
UFO Reporting Center and state all of the things that the database was telling me.
And I always wanted to write about take care of your planet. So
UM, I started doing research on what does that mean? Take care of
your planet? Well, it must mean something to do with perhaps the global
warming question, the pollution question. Are they all related or they interrelated?
You know? Are we overpopulating? Are we over garbaging the planet? Should
we be recycling? All of these things enter into one great big question,
and that great big question is for us to take care of our planet and
how we should be doing it. So I've been researching that for about the
last four weeks. And that one is going to be a nightmare toor right
because I wrote an outline for it, and the outline took me three pages.
So how long is this book going to be? Oh, my goodness,
it's going to be awesome them, um and awful at the same time.
So, UM, when do you do you know when the earliest encounter
was, you know, as far as years ago where that message, uh,
what was said to have happened with the person that I interviewed, you
mean, with anyone I interviewed, uh, in particular that message of um,
you know, I know that you're you're in the midst of your research,
but I'm curious to know when people first started hearing that. Boy,
I don't know. The first time that I heard it was from one of
the peas who talked about it, and uh, she was about well,
it was probably the mid eighties when she was first understand of what they were
trying to tell her. She was abducted about every five to seven years from
the time that she was maybe seven years old up until the recent and and
she's about fifty now, so she's been abducted quite a few times. And
only in the nineteen eighties when she was an adult was did you hear that
message? And the other two people that said that exact same message to me,
it was about the same time frame, the eighties or nineties when they
heard it. That's the only information I have on it at this point.
Okay, all right, I'm just putting in the chat room. If anyone
has questions, please put your please put your question in all caps so I
can catch it. And also we're going to be taking halls here in just
uh, you know, about ten minutes or so. And so that number
just to let people know ahead of time if you want to write it down.
If your people listen to the show in three different ways, so it's
not always available, but to see, but that number is eight five five
here I am forgetting the number. It's eight five five four seven two five
four eight three, So write that number down. We'll put that number up
in just a minute. And but where where we so? Oh oh,
by the way, there's a media shower tonight in North America. If you're
listening and you happen to catch the show live, you want to get out
between eleven on the East Coast, you want to get out between eleven PM
and right through the dawn. It is going to be a great media shower.
So check that out. I love that stuff unless you live an Upstate
and York and it's perpetually cloudy. Oh yes, well, with Sonny here
on the East coast. We have a question in chat that just came up
from Bobby. Bobby I've known for years actually, Madam, years ago.
Ken you talk about the strangest case that you interviewed. Yeah, Unfortunately,
I can't give any specifics because I've told people I won't won't release details of
the of the private stories that they told me. But the stream. Actually
there were two of them. The one case, it was very interesting is
that after being abducted, like every six or seven years, she's in constant
contact with the people with her abductors. As a matter of fact, all
she has to do is think of a question, and she can think of
the question and they'll respond to her. I thought that was pretty interesting.
That's like, oh my goodness, okay. And uh uh. The other
one was um uh also a young lady who um was abducted and um had
four different um races of people at the same time in her home. Um
they all came for her and uh she had a short gray, a tall
gray um um ah um uh praying mantis looking type being. And one other
one that I've that I've forgotten. And um, I think the one you're
missing is the tall Nordic. I don't. Yeah, I'm I don't think
she mentioned that one. UM. But anyhow, there were like four different
races um at least I think there were four different races um that were represented.
And she has uh she started out as a as a a shaman and
uh she's extremely powerful, uh even even to this date, and they always
give her messages. Also, I thought it was interesting that that both of
these people are in constant contact with their abductors. I just found that fascinating
because I would have thought, Jesus, if you're taken and scared to death,
the people you figured, the people who abducted would hate you. But
not not the case. Not the case. Interesting, very interesting. A
person wants to know where you'll be selling the book. Where you'll be offering
the book, um, probably where you offer all your books, and this
book in particular is take care of Your Planet. UM. Probably it's probably
not the working title, but anyway, where could someone find that work in
some according your books while we're here? Okay, actually it will be the
working title, UM, but take okay, take care of your Planet UM
won't be out. That's going to take me a year to a year and
a quarter to write that because that one's going to be involved. Um.
The other four books I have out are they are here Volume one East Coast
UFOs, Volume two, Central us UFOs, Volume three, m West Coast
UFOs, and volume four, which is the collection of blogs that describe might
take on the physics involved of how how these um, how these craft do
what they're doing. And that one's entitled Going Interstellar And they're all available on
Amazon right now to search my name Thomas W. Conwell, CEO n W
E L L on Amazon and search for my books. Yeah. Yeah,
UM, someone just had, uh this question you've already answered basically about the
quake sightings caused by seismic activity. We did, we did talk about that.
Um that a lot of that seems to be like a natural phenomenon.
And when the sightings are seen, you know, the earthquake lights, so
to speak. And this question has come up. Have you ever looked into
embedded chip or strange object? In other words, people talking about implants anyone
that you you interviewed, Um, there were two people in particular who talked
about implants. I believe that everyone's who has abducted has an implant. That's
how they find you. Um. But Um, there's two people that talked
about implants and they said that they know where they were implanted, and I
did. I didn't want to get involved with uh, with doctors or anything
like that because this was already done um by UM. I can't remember the
guy's name now, doctor crap. I can see his face a leer,
yeah, leer, yep. And I didn't want to try to reinvent the
wheel. He already did such a wonderful job with it. Um. If
if anyone wanted to try to get their implant out, um, at the
time, I referred him to them. UM. I don't think I was
taken over. Since he's passed away, I don't think anyone has taken over
for him. I don't think so either. Yeah, since he died,
I was out of luck at that point. Yeah. Yeah, all right,
So the lines are open and Bill will be standing by to screen your
call. And that number again is eight five five four seven two five four
eight three, and I'll still I'll say, we have another question that just
came up here in chat, and what are the most commonly described smells from
these experiences? I know that might sound like a strange question, but it
is not that's actually what an interrogator will ask, you know, when someone
has any type of experiences, that's part of our senses. Yep. The
only smell that anybody ever described to me was cinnamon. Huh how about that.
I don't understand the nature of that, but I think it has something
to do with the gray aliens themselves, and uh, perhaps it may have
something to do with how they in just food. Um, they put something
on their bodies and absorb it in through the skin. Brett just put a
comment up there. Sometimes people in an encounter have a smell of rain,
and uh, okay, that's that's the possibility. I don't know if anyone's
ever been around lightning a lightning strike, but it uh that the smell is
pretty amazing. I mean it's uh, it's the air never smelled cleaner.
I can't remember exactly what they call it. One other, one other comment
on that is someone described to me, m a smell of ozone, but
it was fleeting. That's it, right, That's what I was trying to
think of. Okay, Okay, here's Joe in the chat room. Wanted
to know, how do you control uh for people lying during or abduction interviews?
That's a tough one. I've asked. I've asked people like Kathy Marden,
who's interviewed hundreds and hundreds of people. Um, you know, there's
some telltale signs. And actually, if you're going to be watching the show
in a couple of weeks, we're going to have a panel on that talks
about body language and deceit um and uh, who can all pick up some
tips from these guys? I heard you describing that. Um. The only
thing that I had going for me is that I would ask the questions posed
as m posed as different questions throughout the interview, and I'd look for consistency.
That's about the only thing that I had. Because the people were on
a on a skype thing and they can show me their face, but they
could be you know, bouncing their legs or something like that, Ryan trying
to control their emotions. I would ever be able to see that. But
if if they were inconsistent with their answers or they said something that I'd never
heard before, then I try to get into it a little bit. And
if it was like really different than anything I've ever heard before, then I'd
say they're maybe making it up. Yeah, it's awful hard to tell because
so many of the stories are just so darn weird to begin with. And
you know, I've said on the show sometimes I like the extra weird ones.
They almost seem more credible in a way. Sometimes I heard a couple
of really weird ones, but then when I heard the weird thing repeated again
to me by somebody different, then I thought, well, maybe this isn't
so weird, you know. So yeah, question here again. Try to
put your EANs in caps if you can, so I catch them. And
also the line is open, and that number is right up on the screen.
It's eight five five four seven two five four eight three. Have you
worked with any other abduction investigators? That was a question from someone in the
chat. Okay, no, and I have not done that because I didn't
know anyone doing it, and I did not want to start out doing abduction
interviews. It was never my intent. What I really wanted to do was
right about the physics of UFOs and how they might be doing things. That's
all I ever wanted. And then people started coming to me, and it
lasted for approximately a year and a half where I did my last interview because
what was happening was I started having dreams um and being awakened at three am,
four am with these weird stories that people were telling me that almost as
if it was happening to me. But I realized that what I was doing
was was reliving them through the people telling me the stories. Um, I
didn't want to do it anymore. Yeah, wow, So I mean I
know I had I had had enough. Yeah, all right, we have
a caller. Uh, we have Ronald calling from is it Montana? Ronald?
Minnesota? Okay, Minnesota? A man, I can. I can
never remember the initial i'n't going in for a little while, so I know
this what this time? You forget what day it is? And I'm really
you don't know what we're doing after time? Yeah, at least you know
you're in Minnesota. Yeah yeah, um show, I had a question for
you. I know Martin has had experience, but now for you, as
a researcher, have you had your own experience? And do you compare your
experience with your answers on your research? Do you mixed the two or do
you Can you separate your experience from your research or do you compare your experience
or your research? And one Ronald, did you just tune into the show
because he did talk about his his UFO sighting. Yeah. I think I
was a little bit late getting here, so okay, apologize. No,
that's that's that's okay, um uh, Ronald, it is I think,
um yeah, UM. Now, I had an experienced myself of seeing things
in the sky until I had a waking dream where um, I was like
um, walking down a pathway and there was a U Foe parked along the
pathway, and I knew it was real because I could feel the leaves under
my feet, and UM, I had a discussion with the person who apparently
was flying the ship and they told me they invited me into the ship and
they wanted to borrow my energy so they could help one of their one of
their shipmates. And then they said thank you very much and let me go,
and I woke up immediately afterwards. Now was it a dream? I
don't know. It sure was real. It's I felt scratches on my feet
from walking out in the in the woods barefoot. Did I actually see them?
I can't be certain, but m to answer the one specifics of your
question, Um, this was unlike any other story that anybody told me,
Oh, that's the way I knew. It was like off off the wall.
I mean, it wasn't like anything else that that I had ever heard
before. I like that. Okay, interesting, h yeah, very interesting.
So do you have trouble um comparing uh stories of experiencers for people that
you know you find to be pactual, do you have um difficulty, not
really trouble, but difficulty maybe? Um, Okay, well this happened and
this one, but it didn't happen this one. What's going on? You're
like you were mentioning your earthquakes and things like that, you know, Um,
and then we're just I heard somebody say volcano, if you gotta do
one for volcanoes. Now do you know Hawaii has a lot of volcanoes,
California had might have a volcano, you know, and tot of your mid
I can't anywhere else, but anyway, there are lots of lots of places
to have volcanoes here on planet Earth, you know, And so that could
be some kind of energy disturbance and causes that to happen. But um,
you know, we're talking about old baseball. You know that's gonna go someday,
you know, And that's gonna be big. Is there anything can spark
that like that in that situation. But with with that, um the finding
thing that that I guess like a cross reference in these different stories. Okay,
um yeah, now there there are similarities in the stories um um.
And that's one of the things that I look for, something uh, something
remotely similar um like either describing the people or describing what it was like just
prior to them being taken um u or um what they felt the next morning.
Those kinds of things I look for in the particular stories I heard,
so that I can probably judge that it's it's possible that they're telling me the
right thing. However, however, I also have the same difficulty with that
kind of a thing that if anybody read about um um about abductions, they
would know to say those particular things. And that's where it gets tricky.
Yeah, oh yeah, it really does. That's why I have to ask
them multiple times a different questions but relating to the same thing that hopefully if
they're giving me some kind of nonsense that they would forget their answer previously or
something that's what I was looking You gotta fish about it, all right,
Ronald thank you for Thank you Martin. Thanks well, thank you Bill.
All right, all right, so we have we also have Steve calling from
California. Welcome to the show, Steve. Thank you, Martin, Hi
Tom, Hi Steve. I'm fine, Thank you. I've been researching UFO
for many years now, and one thing I've been contemplating. We have a
lot of footage of lights going into the mountains such as Mountain jat stuff as
STATI investigates that and have caught a lot of good footage. And Steve Burren
out of Las Vegas have caught lights going into these mountains and coming out of
these mountains. Um, I wonder if you give me your opinion on what
you think could be going on there is there a base in these mountains?
Um? Well, several things. First of all, um, let me
let me change the subject on you, but I'll get back to the back
to the subject at hand. Well, we see craft all the time going
in and out of the water all over the place, in lakes and oceans
and whatever else. And I think they go into the water for a reason.
I think that they probably have some difficulties with heat dissipation, and they
go under the water in order to cool down. I think that. Okay,
Now, why are they going up into the mountains, which was your
original question. I think they're doing a lot of the same kind of thing.
They're going into the mountain, they're shutting off their lights, they're sitting
there to cool down, and then they continue on flying. That's the one
thing I think that's happening with mountains now. So they have bases there.
How many bases is the reasonable for a civilization to move to another planet to
create? Well, you have multiple mountain ranges, and you are mountains all
over the world. You have mountains along the East coast, mountains on the
West coast, three separate mountain ranges on the West coast. How many bases
does extraterrestrial civilization really need. I don't think they need any more than one.
Because they fly at such enormous speeds, they don't need any more than
one. So I don't think this is a personal opinion. I don't think
when they go into mountains that they're all going into bases. I think that
there's one base somewhere, and I don't know where that base happens to be,
by the way, but there's one base somewhere that they that they fly
into and stay, but they most likely are looking for I don't want to
say hiding spots, but areas where they can cool down their craft or sit
and do research or whatever it is that they do. Uh maybe they do
major uploads to to satellites or something like that. But they all are doing
various things when they go up in the mountains and it's not all to basis
not just my opinion. Very that's very interesting what he said. But one
more question, if I mate, six percent of the sidings that will catching
on video on footage or orbs. And there's been different theories about these orbs
as they are possibly some kind of light beings that can transform into light and
travel, and I was only to give me your thoughts on these orbs and
what are they. They seem to be intelligent or a light or an energy.
There's been a report that these from contact. She said, Uh,
the visitors has come out of an orb and grounds qorter back into light.
Hmm. Okay, Um, I apologize my dog he just took off.
Okay. Um. Uh let's say, um, we're a pet friendly show.
Yeah, yeah, that's good. Um he's been she's been good.
Really Uh so um orbs. I believe the orbs are fair form of ship,
and I also believe that their uh ships are um multifaceted in that they
can transform into other shapes dynamically just while you're looking at them. This is
moving too something different um uh um, that's part of their technology. UM.
I think though, that the orbs, the spheres um whatever they're they're
called by are are the basic form of their ship, and they show themselves
to us in multiple ways. Interesting. Well, Steve, Hey, thank
you for the call. I agree, Thank you so much. Nice talcling
the state. All right, so you know we have a couple of questions
in chat as well. I'll just pull these up. Have you ever done
any investigation regarding crashes or any earlier cases? Uh no, I'm only a
data based guy. Okay. I see, okay, so you don't do
you don't actually do regular uhots on the ground, as they say, No,
I do not. No. Um. I'm I'm not thirty anymore.
I have had a heart attack and I have to really be careful what I
do with myself and walking through the woods I don't want to be doing so
Yeah. Sure, okay, let's see we have this question too, what
are hi, Mary? Always nice to see you in here. What are
the shapes of the crafts that people saw? Isn't it? Isn't it a
variance of them? Before we get into that, I just wanted to answer
something that came up in the chat room because I'm getting firsthand witness, witness,
firsthand in regards to James Fox movie called The Phenomenon. I saw someone
posted in chat earlier that it was coming out within one month, and I
just wanted to clear that up. So this is directly from one of the
producers. Just came to me right now and he says all that we're saying
at this point is that the movie is supposed to be released next month.
Supposed to be released. I have no actual day yet, I'll due to
scheduling issues because of the coronavirus. This is more news to come. So
there is some truth to what was posted earlier. You know, it's supposed
to come out next month, and I believe you me you will know about
it because I'm gonna be pumping that movie up and hopefully I'll get James on
along with maybe someone else as well. So anyway, here's the question again,
what are the shapes sorry for that, Jack. Okay, this brings
up an interesting story. The shapes there are. If you look at the
National UFO Reporting Center and start categorizing and write down the name of each each
particular shape that somebody sees, you're gonna come up with about forty eight of
them. Yeah. Now, does that mean that they're all different, all
from different civilizations and all. No, it doesn't mean that at all.
I believe that when you put a shape of something up in the sky and
you look at it with the acception of a sphere, if you look at
it from different directions, it looks different to you. And a lot of
what people are seeing are the same kind of thing looked at from four or
five or fifteen different angles that get reported differently. And I think that's a
lot of what the shapes are. I think it's probably about seven different shapes.
And what I did in my first three books is I took the fifty
different shapes from the National the UFO Reporting Center, and I took them and
combined them into seven shapes. And the reason I did that is so that
I can compare the shapes on one graph, so that I could see what
was changing from the nineteen fifties to the present. So I could put all
seven kind of categories on one graph, and I think that was probably a
pretty good thing to do. Um. But uh, there are a lot
of different things that people are seeing, and some of them are really weird
and I had to combine them into something else that may not have made sense,
but I had to. I had to. I had to compress them
so that I could get good, good data on it. But yeah,
the people describe up the fifty different things. Uh, and yeah, because
some crazy stuff. Yeah, I know, I've heard some crazy stories of
Um. You know, a friend of mine saw something look like a perfectly
square box, you know, with lights on it, and it was floating,
you know. I mean it's such a weird thing. Yeah, but
you know a lot of you just made a really good point and uh,
thank you for that. And that is basically that the the times that people
are reporting. Sometimes the cigar shape UFO could actually be a disc you know
at an angle. Yeah. Oh yes, Uh, you know there are
different ways that you can see things just by you know, their distance an
angle. Yeah, it's totally different. Um. I had firsthand, um
experience with that. Um. Like I said, we live on the landing
pattern of Albany Airport, and they come in from the window just to my
left. And if I look out and see them, um in their in
their landing thing, they turn just before they get to like above the window,
and I see the planes from all these different angles. At one time
I went running out the door thinking, oh my god, this is this
is the big one, you know, and it was an airplane. Yeah.
Well yeah, look a lot of times when they have their landing lights,
their landing lights up, you know, from far away, sometimes that's
all you see and that looks pretty mysterious. I've also seen, you know,
a helicopter that looked really strange one time. Ye. But yeah,
so I can understand why, you know, people can you think they actually
see something when it's something very explainable that does happen, you know, in
a majority of the cases. Yeah, the ones that you can explain,
those are the ones that I'm that keeps me doing this show. Yeah.
Um, what I did with the National UFO Reporting Center database is I read
every single long report, seventy five thousand reports here, and I read every
single one of them. And the reason I did is because when the new
folk would describe a siting. They may say this, this sighting is a
disc and then you the report and it's really a sphere. So what do
you do with that? You know? Um? Uh, do you re
relabel it? Do you delete it? Because they're not sure what they're talking
about, you know. So I went through a whole lot of that.
Um. When I went through the database the first time with all fifty states,
it was a nightmare. That's why it took me a year. By
the way, Wow, yeah, yeah, well it looks like you're really
kind of getting your work cut out for you. It's a nightmare. It's
a nightmare. Yeah, but you must you must enjoy it. It kept
me occupied, believe me. Yeah. Yeah. And and this next one
you're doing to me, it sounds really intense and uh, you know,
it wouldn't hurt for you to check out I mentioned earlier, the Ariel School.
I don't know if you've looked into that. Yeah, I've read about
that. Yeah, there's there's some great footage on that too, with a
lot of people describing what they've seen. So we just have a minute or
two left here. Um. So you can find your book and upcoming books
on Amazon and just search your name and that's Tom Conwell, no, no,
it's under Thomas I write. I'm sure, yeah, Thomas W.
Conwell yeah okay. And also, um again I'm gonna expect to in the
email if I could those maps for anyone that's listening to this show audio that
didn't get a chance to see it on YouTube. Um, all you have
to do is go into the show notes and I'll post those maps up for
you. So thank you so much. Tom. It's been a real pleasure.
Uh there's a pleasure for me too. And um, I especially love
the call ins. There're a lot of fun. You really don't know what
you're gonna get. That's right. Well we have a good screener too,
so yeah, all right, we'll stay healthy. Okay, thank you too,
all right, take care, okay, bye bye. All right,
everyone, So next week, let's see, we have we have a career
on the show, but not Stephen. We have John Michael Greer and he's
going to be talking about a book that he has called The UFO Chronicles,
so stay tuned for that. And as I mentioned before, we have all
kinds of really interesting guests coming up, and I think I'm pretty excited about
quite a few of them. So let's see. Let me just get into
the right place here and that is going to do it for us tonight.
Thank you all for listening, and thank you all for working behind the scenes.
Bill over there at KGr A Radio. And if you're on KGr A
Radio tonight, there's a new show. And I'm sorry I don't I was
told quickly what it was, but there's a show so hanging there for that,
a new show and there's a lot of hosts on that show. All
right, everyone, thanks so much, and see you next week. Remember
to keep your eyes to the sky.